But, it could have been so epic! Such a poignant exercise in moral equivocation! And that's more important than mere facts, isn't it?

They've got a war to sabotage, people. Cut them some truthiness slack!

You can give an editor a shovel, but you can't make him dig his own grave.

but they are digging

Of course. Attack those who accuse you of wrongdoing. It's the leftist way.

It's almost like Beauchamp hates The New Republic. Are they really that easy to play for fools? Will they believe whatever he says to them regardless of what he says elsewhere?

If the model of liberalism holds, TNR will go on to be a great news organ, with its own reporters getting Pulitzer Prizes for helping to prop up dictators and tyrants.

re: #6 jehu

If the model of liberalism holds, TNR will go on to be a great news organ, with its own reporters getting Pulitzer Prizes for helping to prop up dictators and tyrants.

All while losing circulation. Kind of like that Gray Old Lady from New York.

But if we know that Beauchamp has recanted his charges -- and we do -- then he can't stand by his articles in TNR, because they contradict the recantation, so he either lied to the Army or lied to TNR, and WTF? Just, WTF?

When you find yourself in a hole, the first thing to do is to stop digging.

They are preparing to blame Army stonewalling for their "confusion." They are setting it up so that they can say they were searching for the truth but just couldn't get through the smokescreen.

Nice try.

The best defense is a good offense

expect the following soon :

squaaaaaawwk
“chickenhawks.”
Selected not elected
Where's osama
40 million uninsured
squaaaaaawwk
AWOL
abu ghiraib
quagmire
squaaaaaawwk

taxfreekiller: since you're here, please note -- I'm tired of warning you not to post phone numbers and deleting your posts when you do. You're wasting my time. It's against the rules, and you know it. Once more and your account will be blocked.

TNR/Beauchamp haiku

Scott Thomas Beauchamp
Sold a bill of goods that was
Fake, but accurate.

Bloggers attack us,
But they can't shake our faith in
Our own private truth.

Didn't Beauchump realize that his strongest detractors were both former and active military from the Mil-Blogs?

It never occurred to him that one cannot call Blackfive or Badger Six chickenhawks?

Even dumber than he writes...

NOTHING
GOOD
TO SAY?,
R

I say Murtha should retire from congress and work for TNR as an investigative reporter.

re: #16 meMarc

I say Murtha should retire from congress and work for TNR as an investigative reporter.

Beautiful!

Quit while you're behind, I always say.

But they never listen.

The Media's line of thinking: Print anything you want, whether it's true or not and then make a correction/apology at a later date. Half of the people will never know you pulled a fast one.

re: #19 taxfreekiller

oops, sorry,
Murtha gets me riled,
sorry,

firstgov.com is ok?

I certainly hope that anybody with enough brains to log onto the web and find this site, could figure out how to contact a member of congress.

I snagged this post from the open thread and brought it up here because Arbalest makes some great points.

#295 Arbalest 8/10/2007 1:22:34 pm PDT reply quote
I stand corrected about the TNR status:

From their website:

“While many of these questions have been formulated by people with ideological agendas, we recognize that there are legitimate concerns about journalistic accuracy”

If the editors at TNR “recognize that there are legitimate concerns about journalistic accuracy” why then does TNR mention that “. . . many of these questions have been formulated by people with ideological agendas . . .”?

Are the “legitimate concerns” somehow less legitimate if the questioners have an ideological agenda?

If so, how?

(Personal note: “people with ideological agendas” describes Leftists, verbatim)

But then there’s this:

“Part of our integrity as journalists includes standing by a writer who has been accused of wrongdoing and who is not able to defend himself.”

It is known that Service Member Beauchamp has been provided with a lawyer (at no cost to him) who is tasked to protect Service Member Beauchamp’s rights.

Who is providing a better defense for Service Member Beauchamp, the editors at TNR or the U.S. Army?

In the interests of protecting Service Member Beauchamp's rights, whom they've known "for the past 15 days has been prevented by the military from communicating with the outside world, aside from three brief and closely monitored phone calls . . .", should they not print an announcement of their provision of counsel (and the name of said counsel)?

TNR has yet to print such an offer. When will they do so? Time is running out.

But TNR’s very next sentence is this:

“But we also want to reassure our readers that our obligations to our writer would never trump our commitment to the truth.”

Who will provide a better defense for Mr. (i.e., ex-Service Member) Beauchamp, the editors at TNR or _ _ _ _?

We should be clear on this point before rushing to judgement.

TNR, Murtha, Ra^ther, Nifong -- why can't some people just admit they're wrong and say they're sorry?

Old media never dies, it just rathers away....

re: #24 doppelganglander

TNR, Murtha, Ra^ther, Nifong -- why can't some people just admit they're wrong and say they're sorry?

Because liberalism means never having to say you're sorry.

Our investigation has not thus far uncovered factual evidence (aside from one key detail) to discount his personal dispatches.

And that key detail that only deserves a parenthetical in this sad display of stickin' to your guns is? I'll answer for ya, the fact that he was in Kuwait when this "happened" and could not have been driven to this barbaric mentality by the war in Iraq and "Bush's lies".
Dennis Prager thrashed Beauchamp this morning, it was thrilling.

For those of you who have AKO whitepages, my initial report has been confirmed: BEAUCHAMP WAS DEMOTED EFF 01 AUG 07 FROM PV2/E2 to PVT/E1. You can verify this on AKO.

The statement kind of reminds me of the denials of the terrorists.

"We didn't do it! And besides, it is your fault we did it."

he signed several statements under what he described as pressure from the Army. He told us that these statements did not contradict his articles.

He confessed "under pressure", but he didn't confess to anything.

The amount of just outright stupidity in the msm never ceases to amaze me. They must think all their readers are fools or will believe any vile crap about the armed forces. Do they teach any kind of critical thinking in school(college) anymore? I have a BS in electronics, picked up at about 6 different schools over 20 years and I don't remember the younger generation being this ignorant.

Ty TFK.

I didn't wanna lose you and (your commas) as point man. You do good work when pointed in the right direction.

Ty Charles for the reprieve.

FORWARDING,
R

re: #24 doppelganglander

TNR, Murtha, Ra^ther, Nifong -- why can't some people just admit they're wrong and say they're sorry?

I admit that I liked Dan Rather when I was young and stupid. I'm very sorry about that.

re: #25 Thanos

Old media never dies, it just rathers away....

*zing*

OT: I am thinking of inviting CAIR to join LGF with a few spare email addy's I have.

We should hear them out, no?

No?

No. I agree. That was a dumb idea! How did I ever think of that?

Ban me !

/please don't

I'm just going through a hard time thinking about the 'unfairness of the universe' and so forth.

OT

NYC Principal at Center of 'Intifada' T-Shirt Controversy Resigns

Almontaser told the Post that "intifada" meant "shaking off" and the shirts represented women "shaking off" oppression.

Yeah....that's what Intifada means. Riiiiiight.

What do a horse, a pit bull and a goat have in common?

Well, nothing except for the fact people in Washington are having sex with them.

Accused says he was just milking goat

Seriously. WTF?

re: #34 me

but the pot down and walk away.

re: #32 meMarc

We were all young and stupid once. Most of us grew up and got smart. Heck, I voted for John Anderson in 1980.

has not thus far uncovered factual evidence (aside from one key detail) to discount his personal dispatches.

Pssst, TNR, uh guys, you're supposed to be finding evidence that supports what you write. Not just look for the absence of evidence that discounts it.

And you're supposed to do it before you publish.

PIMF

but = put

re: #18 JammieWearingFool

Hey Jammie, did you get my emails today?

I'm starting to wonder if my emails are getting through to you.

Let's see perjury for one statement, media kudos for the other.

re: #28 sireverlast

For those of you who have AKO whitepages, my initial report has been confirmed: BEAUCHAMP WAS DEMOTED EFF 01 AUG 07 FROM PV2/E2 to PVT/E1. You can verify this on AKO.

Busted.... probably how beachamp is looking at himself now, and how the left will try to portray him.

Look, the left, never, ever, under any circumstances admits it's dishonesty.

The left, when caught in one of their endless, never ending lies, tries to spin it, blame others, cover it up, but they never, ever, under any circumstances, admit they lied.

And, the majority of Americans have really awoken to the fact that the msm is dishonest and biased, so, as far as the msm goes,

How very sad!

re: #32 meMarc
I liked Dan Rather until he walked off air while interviewing Bush. I was so dumb then. I thought to myself.....what's his problem?

re: #28 sireverlast

Instead of demoting him they should promote him to the head of the IED search line ...

IMHO

re: #36 JammieWearingFool

What do a horse, a pit bull and a goat have in common?

Well, nothing except for the fact people in Washington are having sex with them.

Accused says he was just milking goat

Seriously. WTF?

ICK. EW. *shudder*

If the statements that Fauxchamp signed didn't contradict his articles then why did he need to be "pressured" to sign them?

The implication of this is that TNR believes that Fauxchamp lied to the people who could (gladly) send him to prison, but told them the truth.

re: #25 Thanos

Old media never dies, it just rathers away....

Good one.

TNR was founded in 1914. They were liberal from the beginning but the scandals started rolling in in the 1990's.

Sullivan editorship, 1991-1996
In 1990, Andrew Sullivan, a 28-year-old gay Catholic from Britain, became editor and took the magazine in a somewhat more conservative direction, though the majority of writers remained liberal or neoliberal. Hertzberg soon left the magazine to return to The New Yorker. Kinsley left the magazine in 1996 to found the online magazine Slate.[5]
Sullivan invited Charles Murray to contribute a controversial 10,000-word article that contended blacks may be, as a whole, less intelligent than whites due to genetics. The magazine also published a very critical article about Hillary Clinton's health care plan by Elizabeth McCaughey, an article that Alterman called "the single most influential article published in the magazine during the entire Clinton presidency". Sullivan also published a number of pieces by Camille Paglia.[5]
Ruth Shalit, a young writer for the magazine in the Sullivan years, was repeatedly criticized for plaigarism. To fact-check her stories, Sullivan called on Stephen Glass, who later was found to have made up quotes, anecdotes and facts in his articles

[Link: en.wikipedia.org...]

re: #29 Silhouette

What I don't understand about that statement, is that prior to him "outing" himself via TNR, no one knew who he was? So how could the Army being conducting an investigation into his activities until he stated publicly who he was?

TNR is lying. Don't forget that Beauchamp had a previous article 15 in May of last year, and his latest one took him, eff 01 AUg 07, from E2 to E1.

re: #28 sireverlast

That probably means Article 15 and not courtmartial. What a shame! Hadn't though to look there! My offer to take charge of his rehab for a year still stands. DOD are you listening?

Top

re: #36 JammieWearingFool

What do a horse, a pit bull and a goat have in common?

Well, nothing except for the fact people in Washington are having sex with them.

Accused says he was just milking goat

Seriously. WTF?

Reminds me of a more disturbing story I heard today on the radio today.
Molestation suspect says he was teaching girls sex (11 year olds)

re: #34 me

OT: I am thinking of inviting CAIR to join LGF with a few spare email addy's I have.

We should hear them out, no?

No?

No. I agree. That was a dumb idea! How did I ever think of that?

Ban me !

/please don't

I'm just going through a hard time thinking about the 'unfairness of the universe' and so forth.

What are you talking about? Anyone, even members of CAIR can register here.

#28 sireverlast 8/10/2007 2:25:39 pm PDT reply quote

For those of you who have AKO whitepages, my initial report has been confirmed: BEAUCHAMP WAS DEMOTED EFF 01 AUG 07 FROM PV2/E2 to PVT/E1. You can verify this on AKO.

Ye gods! Makes you wonder what he did. . . . . . . NOBODY is an E2 much past basic -

re: #38 doppelganglander

Nostalgia.

Important Action Alert!

The only man who can save America is going to be on CNBC to talk about how bush brought down the towers the economy.

TO: Charles Johnson, et al.
RE: And.....

"So The New Republic was aware that Beauchamp had signed statements for Army investigators, and must have suspected that the statements didn’t back up his articles ... but TNR’s editors, for some reason, didn’t think it was important enough to mention any of this in any of their statements about the controversy. Until now." -- Charles Johnson

....I thought al Rueters was 'low'.

Regards,

Chuck(le)

re: #24 doppelganglander

TNR, Murtha, Ra^ther, Nifong -- why can't some people just admit they're wrong and say they're sorry?

It comes from years of listening to the one anti perspirant commercial slogan: Never let them see you sweat!

hehe.

re: #34 me

OT: I am thinking of inviting CAIR to join LGF with a few spare email addy's I have.

We should hear them out, no?

No?

No. I agree. That was a dumb idea! How did I ever think of that?

Ban me !

/please don't

I'm just going through a hard time thinking about the 'unfairness of the universe' and so forth.

Hehe..well let's remember that:

a) they can sign up using their own email addy's any time registration has opened up

and

b) don't be too sure that they don't post here already. There are a few that toe the same phrase jargon that couldn't take the heat and got out of the kitchen

re: #52 bosforus

Accused says he was just milking goat

"........and it backed right up to me, it wanted it I tell ya!"

re: #38 doppelganglander
John Anderson also had the #1 country song of 1980 (Swingin') (I think).

No, it wasn't the same guy who ran for President.

How about an Angelina Jolie update? Seems she's given up chicks, S&M and knives during sex--all for Brad.

Bucking for sainthood, I'd say.

I'll give these liars at TNR some good advice.

When you get caught with your pants down like a fibbing politician, the best thing you can do is take your lumps, admit your mistake and move on.

About six months from now TNR, you're going to be saying, "indeed I did have sex with that dog."

OT OT re: #40 Shug

Put bot pot but...

etc.

WTF !

We're talking about CAIR here

They are *THE* voice of the 9M(?) mainstream! muslimes in the US.

You have to pay attention or JiziA, YOU INFIDEL!

/caps off, now!

“Part of our integrity as journalists includes standing by a writer who has been accused of wrongdoing and who is not able to defend himself.” TNR from post 22, above.

That sounds like Norman Mailer endorsing Jack Abbott.

Never ever interrupt the enemy when they are making mistakes.

re: #35 Lively

OT

NYC Principal at Center of 'Intifada' T-Shirt Controversy Resigns

Almontaser told the Post that "intifada" meant "shaking off" and the shirts represented women "shaking off" oppression.

Yeah....that's what Intifada means. Riiiiiight.

YES!

Now all they need to do is block that school from being funded with public funds..and they'll really have done the right thing :) .

That pathetic muslim principal also gave a speech at some area and was asked by the audience was she going to include sharia studies in with her muslim/arabic studies (they downplay the muslim aspect but since they are hiding what the course subject is and who they have as teachers unlike what a REAL public school can do..this stinks to high heavens). Her answer? She didn't know what sharia was! BULLCRAP!

Yes, NY, you should be very pissed!

[Link: stopthemadrassa.wordpress.com...]
[Link: atlasshrugs2000.typepad.com...]

re: #62 scaramouche

How about an Angelina Jolie update? Seems she's given up chicks, S&M and knives during sex--all for Brad.

Bucking for sainthood, I'd say.

asp net link error -- you have to reverse the date slashes for the link to work... Gates Warez are grate.

Its OK, Scotty Boy. Its expected as a Leftist that you would be a lying, seething bag of putrid pus. After all, the truth is whatever it needs to be to push the agenda forward.

You are in good company. Gobbles, Stalin, Lenin, Hitler, Mussolini, Baghdad Bob, Saddam, and the Japanese Imperial Command.

It seems your kind of blight on mankind is endemic, like all other scourges of man, and requires millions of gallons of blood to effect a cure, until the next time. Too bad your kind lacks the intestinal fortitude to do more than lie and sneer, blame it on your lack of manhood.

re: #69 maddogg

{MADDOG!}

Greetings.

re: #41 3 wood

Yes, just saw them. Hadn't checked the mail for awhile.

re: #66 Mike in Georgia

Never ever interrupt the enemy when they are making mistakes.

:D

re: #65 Onslow

“Part of our integrity as journalists includes standing by a writer who has been accused of wrongdoing and who is not able to defend himself.” TNR from post 22, above.

That sounds like Norman Mailer endorsing Jack Abbott.

Wow~ It does!

re: #70 BabbaZee

Afternoon Miss Babbazee!

re: #44 republic

You are right, it is sad. They get rewarded is why they keep doing it over and over and over. We got someone who took documents stuffed in his socks and down his pants and hidden outside with intent to do so...and he got a slap on the wrist..yet scooter libby can't remember a detail for crime that was never a crime and he gets more than a child molester does.

Oy vey!

The left will discount any admissions Tom makes to the military as something forced under duress. And even if it's false, it's true. There will be nothing anyone can say to change their belief. Unfortunately. I know many of these people, as I'm sure we all do.

I'd like to know where he grew up and who his ethical mentors were.

re: #74 Ginn

Shabbat Shalom!

Sorry, I meant Scott. Not Tom.

Is this what's going on?
TNR is caught and they know it. They have no credibility in the conservative and middle any more - and had little for some time from that side of the political spectrum anyway, so the people they really need to hold on to are their liberal Left subscribers. Even amongst those people, of course outright fraud is damaging to the trust the TNR needs to maintain. So, they issue several statements coached in innuendo and suggestions that the "Right Wing" is exaggerating or doesn't want the truth out and is hostile - because they don't want "truths" exposed. Those wanting the " Military Bad, TNR Courageously Good" thus have material they can use to buttress the idea that Beauchamp might be "muzzled" or "crushed." With this, anything the military says is going to be looked at by the Hard Left thru the lens the TNR has provided. Pre-emptive. It looks odd to normal people, but TNR has already given up on them. They aren't the ones TNR needs for revenue-purposes.
So, this statement is an expansion on that idea, maybe a hint of "conspiracy to silence." All the hot buttons for the anti-war Left. TNR panders to the nutroot subscribers and survives. It's a gamble. Might work - guess it depends on how many Hardcore Left Nutroots bother to shell out their cash for subscriptions.

re: #76 ploome hineni

re: #68 Thanos

I heard they were not so 'connected' recently

is that true?

mongo not know, mongo think Angela's butt too big so he no pay attention - ask the Scaramouche

IT's FRIIIIIIIIIII DDDDDDAAAAAYYYY! That means, date night, see you all a bit later on folks.

#80 wanumba 8/10/2007 2:51:27 pm PDT reply quote
Is this what's going on?
TNR is caught and they know it. They have no credibility in the conservative and middle any more - and had little for some time from that side of the political spectrum anyway, so the people they really need to hold on to are their liberal Left subscribers

They were created in 1914 as a Liberal "Progressive" News Opinion magazine and pretty much stayed on this course. They were embraced by the MSM when the MSM went liberal in the Sixties giving them "credibility."

When did they have credibility with the conservatives?

re: #52 bosforus

re: #36 JammieWearingFool

What do a horse, a pit bull and a goat have in common?

Well, nothing except for the fact people in Washington are having sex with them.

Accused says he was just milking goat

Seriously. WTF?

Reminds me of a more disturbing story I heard today on the radio today.
Molestation suspect says he was teaching girls sex (11 year olds)

The goat told me it was 18!

The big bad army pressured truth-teller Beauchamp into signing false statements under oath?

Following the script nicely. Another progressive martyr speaking truth to power...

/threw up in my mouth, and not a little

re: #83 Ginn

They were created in 1914 as a Liberal "Progressive" Communist News Opinion magazine and pretty much stayed on this course. They were embraced by the MSM when the MSM went liberal in the Sixties giving them "credibility."

fixed

(inasmuch as the Reds were called "Commies" back then - I think they were just "Socialists" at that point)

They printed an article. There is strong evidence it is bunk. There is no evidence it isn't bunk. They claim that integrity requires they stand by the potentially false story? Odd view of integrity ya got there.

re: #84 Pawn of the Oppressor

The goat told me it was 18!

Baaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaad.

re: #28 sireverlast

For those of you who have AKO whitepages, my initial report has been confirmed: BEAUCHAMP WAS DEMOTED EFF 01 AUG 07 FROM PV2/E2 to PVT/E1. You can verify this on AKO.

Sounds like an Article 15 NJP(Non-Judicial Punishment). Probably lost half a months pay as well. For you Sailors out there, the Navy usually calls it a Captain's Mast.

Off to grill some pork. Later, Lizards.

Yep, tell you signed under pressure. That'll make the superiors
really happy.

re: #91 Mike in Georgia

Yep, tell you signed under pressure. That'll make the superiors
really happy.

Happy enough to reopen the investigation I presume. Beauchamp is a pathological liar and is angling to come out of this with spotless progressive credentials. I think there's a moral in there somewhere.

re: #70 BabbaZee

BabbaZee! (I guess I underestimated the depth of my addiction:) )

re: #92 Beagle
I don't think the idiot realizes how deep he is digging this hole.

re: #93 maddogg

It happens!

re: #95 Mike in Georgia

re: #92 Beagle
I don't think the idiot realizes how deep he is digging this hole.

Keep in mind, this is the idiot that thought making up stories about atrocities would advance his career. Well, as a writer anyway.

Signing the recantation the same day he was telling the TNR that he didn't mean it, it doesn't recant, etc. sound like an adulterer getting caught by his mistress sending a love message to his wife. "Yes, I said that to her, baby, but I didn't mean it. I love only you. I had to tell her those things. You know how crazy she gets. She'll divorce me and I just can't do that right now. But soon, sweetheart. We'll be together soon."

re: #98 Silhouette
Good analogy!

Off topic, I know this progressive guy I check in with from time to time to see what the latest leftist marching orders are. My latest question was: "What happens if the liberals win the upcoming elections, White House, Congress, the whole bit, and the inevitable happens, namely, we get the living crap beat out of us by the islamofascist, not only in the middle east, but at home?" His answer was very telling. He was honest enough to not pretend that the coming to power of the liberals wouldn't result in massive American deaths due to terrorism, military defeats over seas etc., but he had the leftist cover story all ready. "There's going to be lots more terrorist attacks against us because Bush made them mad and there's very little the liberals can do about it. We'll just have to take our medicine."

They understand that with them in power we're all gonna die, but they're already blaming Bush for any screw-ups that happen on their watch.

Anyway, just so you know.

BabbaZee
Ginn

Will the real Mr Beauchamp step forward.
[Link: www.samuelsdesign.com...]

re: #98 Silhouette

And sometimes it is just amazing how they get caught.

[Link: www.foxnews.com...]

re: #89 CyanSnowHawk

According to my sources, he was docked a month's pay as well.

TNR just keeps digging that hole!

They claim Beauchamp lied to the army under oath, therefore he must be telling TNR the truth! That's weird logic, but you gotta admire that kind of faith.

Dig, stupid lefty, dig!

Jewel, Hands:

re: #103 SirEverlast

re: #89 CyanSnowHawk

According to my sources, he was docked a month's pay as well.

I forgot they could take the whole month, saw more than a few get NJP when I was in. Typically it was one pay grade down, half a months pay, and 30-45 days restriction to the Company area. I wonder what sort of restrictions they put him under? Seems like a basic restriction to the Company area would hardly be noticed over there.

re: #104 Kenneth

Seems the little Beuachamp dude has the same problem as TNR. Digging himeself into a deeper hole that is.

Have I call Murtha a traitorous POS today? If not, HE IS!

Top

ME #107 call=called

Boy when these guys shove shit they use both hands.

re: #106 CyanSnowHawk

They can only take 2/3 of base pay a month, but IIRC that unit he is in is a high priority unit and so he likely receives some sort of AIP, in addition to all of his in country entitlements, so it isn't too big of a hit on him.

re: #108 1SG(ret)

It's a good day when all these lying POS's are exposed for what they are. It's even better when they ignore reeality and deep digging. I new Beauchamp (did I mention, that's a French name?) was a liar the minute I saw his weblog. Sick little twerp.

With the integrity that Beauchamp has demonstrated so far, there is no way he would not have named names and places in an effort to take down anyone involved along with him. Especially his superiors.

re: #101 pat

I got knocked offline!

BBL

re: #110 SirEverlast

re: #106 CyanSnowHawk

They can only take 2/3 of base pay a month, but IIRC that unit he is in is a high priority unit and so he likely receives some sort of AIP, in addition to all of his in country entitlements, so it isn't too big of a hit on him.

Been a while since I had any reason to read up on the UCMJ, but if I recall, when I was making E-2 pay, 2/3 of it, even just the base part, missing would really get my attention. I hope it gets his. Doesn't seem too likely though, just be something else he could whine about.

re: #62 scaramouche

How about an Angelina Jolie update? Seems she's given up chicks, S&M and knives during sex--all for Brad.

Bucking for sainthood, I'd say.

Sorry to break the news to you scaramouche, but I was just at the grocery store and......Brad and Ang are breaking up. :*(

Well back in the day, 1997, max at captains mast was half months pay for 2 months, reduction to the next inferior paygrade, 45 days extra duty, and 45 days restriction to the limits of the ship.

re: #26 BeerForMyHorses

re: #24 doppelganglander

TNR, Murtha, Ra^ther, Nifong -- why can't some people just admit they're wrong and say they're sorry?

Because liberalism means never having to say you're sorry.

there is a club forming, a fraternity ( where girls are allowed) the list is getting longer and longer, fauxtographers, 'journalists" etc etc

is there a listing somehwere?
/and i would include the plame/ wilson gang as well

re: #117 Lively

long line?

re: #118 pingjockey

You are correct, he got fined one month's pay or 1/2 of one month's pay for two months. You say potato, I say potatoe.

No matter how much the situation calls for owning up and admitting they were wrong, the editors at TNR cannot escape what they really are and stop behaving like wriggling, weaving, bobbing, weasels.

re: #121 SirEverlast Got it. Whatever this pos got its not enough. Then again there may be a blanket party in his future.

Is there any penalty for Beauchamp lying about his recantation?

lIke being held in contempt because he is so contemtuous and also because he is lying to them?

re: #120 paint-right

re: #117 Lively

long line?

No. The line was not long at all....that's why I don't have any details of the break-up. (Full disclosure: another rag said rumors of break-up are not true. At this point, I don't know who to believe.)

re: #118 pingjockey

Well back in the day, 1997, max at captains mast was half months pay for 2 months, reduction to the next inferior paygrade, 45 days extra duty, and 45 days restriction to the limits of the ship.

Okay. That's the way I knew it. The total was up to a whole month's pay, but not all at once. Forgot about the extra duty part as well. Thanks pingjockey.

I suppose I could have looked it up. I bet "UCMJ" in Google would have turned it up quickly.

re: #125 Lively

well, i'm on the edge of my chair til we know what's up!

re: #126 CyanSnowHawk There's enough former military lizards around to answer basic stuff but when we get into the legal issues of this mess we do have a couple of experts here i believe.

Maybe somebody with some more recent service can correct me, but I seem to recall (from the 70's) that you only received an article 15 if you accepted it -- i.e., you had to "plead guilty" to the charges and agree to accept whatever the punishment was.

If you didn't agree to an article 15, the implication was you would face a court martial with possibly much stiffer penalities.

In other words, an article 15 was a "plea bargain" and necessitated the admission of guilt.

It wasn't just an arbitrary punishment the military could dish out.

re: #125 Lively

re: #120 paint-right

re: #117 Lively

long line?

No. The line was not long at all....that's why I don't have any details of the break-up. (Full disclosure: another rag said rumors of break-up are not true. At this point, I don't know who to believe.)

Listen to their publicists. If they say that "there is no truth the rumors", then they will file for divorce before the end of the month. If they say that "demands of their work schedules are keeping them apart", then one of them is having an affair. If they say that "they are going through a rough patch", then they are going through a rough patch.

These interpretations carry more weight if the stars themselves start saying these phrases on talk shows.

re: #125 Lively

re: #120 paint-right

re: #117 Lively

long line?

No. The line was not long at all....that's why I don't have any details of the break-up. (Full disclosure: another rag said rumors of break-up are not true. At this point, I don't know who to believe.)

What does TNR say? They're the most credible source for all info.
/

re: #131 zmdavid

lol and you are on topic!

re: #128 pingjockey

re: #126 CyanSnowHawk There's enough former military lizards around to answer basic stuff but when we get into the legal issues of this mess we do have a couple of experts here i believe.

Yet another reason I love this place.

If you read that goat sex news story, you will note that the previous person charged under Washington's bestiality law was alleged to have been getting it on with a pit bull. I hope he wasn't into oral.

re: #101 pat

BabbaZee
Ginn

Will the real Mr Beauchamp step forward.
[Link: www.samuelsdesign.com...]

Cool!

re: #135 Ginn I don't think his shriveled souless other half would even look that good.

re: #118 pingjockey

The amount of money and number of pay grades that can be taken under an article 15 depends on the type (ie; Company, field, or general). If the report is true, I would say this is a field grade article 15 under UCMJ non-judicial punishment.

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re: #129 Narniaman

An article 15 can be appealed! charge or punishment.

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re: #129 Narniaman

Should clarify my 138 with: If you appeal or don't accept the charge you go to court martial.

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re: #137 1SG(ret)Thanks. were you army or marines? The reason i ask if its army did y'all do blanket parties for pissants?

To TNR -

Oh magazine of my youth, your 15 minutes are O-VER!

-S-

re: #140 pingjockey

Army, and I take the 5^th.

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re: #142 1SG(ret) I can neither confirm or deny the existence of any blanket parties!

re: #143 pingjockey

YUP! LOL

re: #144 1SG(ret)The sun is way over the yardarm so its time for a cold one or more! You good people have a fine weekend.

re: #145 pingjockey

This has to be a good weekend. Heading into the devils den on Monday, Bay area Ca. for 2 weeks. Work! Shit! Chugging one with you Bro.

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If Beauchamp was telling the truth (he wasn't, but TNR is hoping their readers keep the faith) then he should refuse administrative punishment and demand a court-martial.

That's what an honorable and courageous soldier would do.

re: #147 Glen Wishard

Agree, but honor doesn't seem to be one of his virtue's.

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And this is what TNR should do (from the film Shattered Glass).

TNR editor Charles Lane, who has just fired Stephen Glass for fabricating stories, confronts another TNR editor:

LANE: Caitlin, When this thing blows, there isn't going to be a magazine anymore. If you want to make this about Mike, make it about Mike. I don't give a sh-t. You can resent me, you can hate me, but come Monday morning, we're all going to have to answer for what we let happen here. We're all going to have an apology to make! Jesus Christ! Don't you have any idea how much sh-t we're about to eat? Every competitor we ever took a shot at, they're going to pounce. And they should. Because we blew it, Caitlin. He handed us fiction after fiction and we printed them all as fact. Just because... we found him entertaining. It's indefensible. Don't you know that?

re: #83 Ginn

#80 wanumba 8/10/2007 2:51:27 pm PDT reply quote
TNR is caught and they know it. They have no credibility in the conservative and middle any more - and had little for some time from that side of the political spectrum anyway,
When did they have credibility with the conservatives?

I should have written that better, no credibility in the conservative and little for some time from the middle (just as you said, the MSM has included TNR as part of the "established" reasoned commentary (at least as defined as the Left : "our world view is the correct norm, everything else is right-wing opinion").
So, TNR's excuses make no sense logically to its now wide range of critics, but perhaps that's really not the audience they want/need to convince.

Re: "chickenhawk"

When left-wingers use the word "chickenhawk," I respond this way:

Sounds like you think that only a combat veteran can be commander-in-chief. Fine with me. That lets out Hillary, Edwards, Obama, and all the rest of your candidates.

Robert A. Heinlein's Starship Troopers describes a society where only veterans have the right to vote, since only veterans care enough to have put their lives on the line for that society.

Want to try that? If not, your use of "chickenhawk" is nothing but hypocrisy.

I commented on their whole litany of lame excuses earlier, but I just love this line.

Our investigation has not thus far uncovered factual evidence (aside from one key detail) to discount his personal dispatches.

Defendant: "No your honor, my investigation hasn't turned up anything that proves I'm guilty."

And "personal dispatches"? Honestly? You're characterizing stories he wrote for publication in your magazine as "personal dispatches"? Sure, just keep right on with the bullshit, it will really help in making us believe you.

TNR should look up the punishment for an Article 15. If the Commanding officer gave him 60 days restriction with his Reduction in grade, he may not have phone or internet privileges. And I would think he is not going to be making phone calls to his accomplice in the crime if he did get a phone call home.

re: #153 Libs are Dental

...and the whole house of cards, stacked lie upon lie, comes tumbling down!

Beauchamp is a soldier in a war zone. TNR is not entitled to have access to him, whether he's restricted or not. They certainly aren't entitled to demand that the Army clean up their damn mess for them.

TNR has all the information they need to start doing the right thing, right now. If they had an ounce of integrity they would stop playing the victim, stop trying to point fingers at the Army, and stop counting on the left blogosphere to protect them. They would take responsibility for the crap they published.

After which we can all go to Fairy Land and party with the Magic Princess ...

This latest TNR controversy is just another example of the crisis in journalism: From the doctored photos published during last summers Lebanon war; the use of local stringers who clearly have strong bias; to a
general leftist editorial bias found in the major influential news organizations- has so thoroughly destroyed the semblance of objectivity that is so essential for its credibility. Journalism schools and Editors are largely to blame.

Here’s what we know: On July 26, Beauchamp told us that he signed several statements under what he described as pressure from the Army.

As documented by evariste on Discarded Lies, TNR knew by the afternoon of 25 July that the marital connection between "Scott Thomas" and a magazine staffer had already been leaked to the blog-public -- meaning that patient Googlers had an excellent chance of deducing Beauchamp's identity within a matter of days even had he not "outed himself" on the 26th.

#28 sireverlast 8/10/2007 2:25:39 pm PDT reply quoteFor those of you who have AKO whitepages, my initial report has been confirmed: BEAUCHAMP WAS DEMOTED EFF 01 AUG 07 FROM PV2/E2 to PVT/E1. You can verify this on AKO.

re: #54 galloping granny

Ye gods! Makes you wonder what he did. . . . . . . NOBODY is an E2 much past basic -

Perhaps someone who knows more about this than I can clarify, but isn't PVT/EI the absolute lowest rank there is? IE, no stripe, "buck private", what you are when you enter boot camp?

If Beauchamp had been serving for a year already, shouldn't he at least be a corporal already?

re: #153 Libs are Mental

TNR should look up the punishment for an Article 15. If the
Commanding officer gave him 60 days restriction with his Reduction in
grade, he may not have phone or internet privileges. And I would think
he is not going to be making phone calls to his accomplice in the crime
if he did get a phone call home.

Well, TNR is doing an interesting "dance." Since they write in their current editorial, that Beauchamp (pronouned Buttchump), was allowed phone calls to relatives. But they were SHORT, and they were MONITORED.

I'll also guess that Buttchump doesn't want to speak to Foer. Or any of his representatives at TNR.

Of course, the screwiest disclosure in the TNR article is that they admit KNOWING that their author "signed Army documents." They're just claiming, that without seeing this private stuff, they can't determine the "truth."

Meanwhile, the New Yuk Times and the WaPo, both have written that Beauchamp (pronounced ... ) "recanted." And, that the Army has said the author has acknowledged that the articles are false.

It's interesting, too, that the topic continues; but the passions are dying down. My guess is that TRN publishes in the last week of August, again; and completely avoids this topic. (Heck, they'll claim there's no real proof that the articles they printed are lies.) It's an interesting tactic.

I read someplace that it's basically "over-lawyered."

re: #114 CyanSnowHawk

re: #110 SirEverlast

re: #106 CyanSnowHawk

They can only take 2/3 of base pay a month, but IIRC that unit he is in is a high priority unit and so he likely receives some sort of AIP, in addition to all of his in country entitlements, so it isn't too big of a hit on him.

Been a while since I had any reason to read up on the UCMJ, but if I recall, when I was making E-2 pay, 2/3 of it, even just the base part, missing would really get my attention. I hope it gets his. Doesn't seem too likely though, just be something else he could whine about.

Out of curiousity, does anyone know just how an E2 gets paid right now? An E1?

What extra would he get for being "in country"/ assignment incentive?

re: #160 looking closely

OK, I got part of the answer right here:

[Link: usmilitary.about.com...]

Actually, the pay is better than I thought, and apparently being a buck private is still economically better than flipping burgers, or some such.

re: #159 Carol Herman

"Over-lawyered" indeed.
Like the defense counsel who argues, " My client was never in the house where the murder occurred, and even if he was in that house it wasn't when the murder occurred, and even if he was in the house when the murder occurred he never killed deceased, and even if he was found with a gun in his hand he never shot the deceased, and even if he did shoot the deceased it was clearly self defense, and even if it wasn't self defense you must acquit because the deceased was a lousy lying &*%#$@&".

I am beginning to suspect the reason for The New Republic’s continued stonewalling is because BeauchampGate will lead to some leftists’ politician or a radical Islamic group.

I can just imagine Jack Murtha pulling the strings of TNR just to further his political agenda.

The useful idiots of the left believe what they want to believe despite the overwhelming evidence to their wishful perceptions.

Where's ChenZhen tinite? Last night all he could do was deflect attention from this story with red herrings, tonite, perhaps, he's not so brave.

Here, Chen, Chen, Chen

Wow -- That web page lists E1 with 10 years service. How bad a screwup do you have to be to be an E1 after 10 years?

re: #166 mikevp

I dunno Mike. When I was in the AF in the early '90s we had a guy who was a Senior Master Sergeant (E-8) in finance with over ten years of service get busted down to E-2 for cooking the books. It's a wonder he did'nt get the boot or get prison time. Anyhow, it was quite amusing to see him in line at the dining facility and greet him with a hearty "Hey Airman" after he'd made life miserable for some other people.

Hey, we already know that Pvt buttmunch is a liar. What makes anyone beleive that buttmunch has changed his character even one iota? Pathological liars lie even when telling the truth would be easier.

re: #167 baconeatingkaffir

Hehehehe, and when he retired all he got was an E-2's retirement pay. Sometimes the military does have a sense of humor when sentencing goobers.

re: #158 looking closely

Up to E-4 it is pretty much a given. After E-4 you've got to have some leadership potential.

re: #158 looking closely

Yes, he should have been at least an E4, considering he came in the Army around November of 2005 as a PFC, but he was busted down to E2 in May of 2006, and then down to E1 on 01 August.

This guy is a turd of a soldier.

Bringing disrepute to the armed forces, evening just by writing tall tales, should be enough to get him a bad conduct discharge.

Registered at last, thank you baby Jesus!