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Columbia Progressives Against Protesting Ahmadinejad

Sat, Sep 22, 2007 at 10:37:22 am PDT

“Progressives” at Columbia (you can tell they’re progressives by the ads for Communist literature and Noam Chomsky books) are calling on other “progressives” not to protest Mahmoud Ahmadinejad’s appearance: The Columbia Coalition Against the War, ‘Open Letter to Progressive Opponents of Mahmoud Ahmadinejad’.

They’re afraid of demonizing him. “Afraid” is the key word.

We fear the demonization of Ahmadinejad, because we think this demonization contributes to the likelihood of war.  In the current climate, with many on the political right in the U.S. and Israel pushing for air strikes, a campaign against Ahmadinejad is dangerous, regardless of the intentions of most involved.  A call to action, unless it prominently rules out war, implies military action.

A rally where each speaker denounces Ahmadinejad’s reactionary policies and just a few call explicitly for military action will still be perceived, on campus and around the U.S., as pro-war.  The right-wing media, from Fox News to the New York tabloids, has already jumped on the event, and will spin it to favor their cause.  Conservative organizations with no affiliation to Columbia’s campus, such as the David Project, have already signed on to the rally on Facebook, and are likely to distribute hundreds of warmongering flyers and picket signs.  The rally will seem to be a sea of pro-war demonstrators — and the more people who attend it and the more organizations that endorse it, the more powerful this disastrous message will be.

A U.S. attack on Iran, which is not an inevitability but is a real possibility, would have consequences just as terrible as the invasion of Iraq. Thousands would die in initial air strikes, and more in the resulting backlash and regional conflagration. The work of Iranian campaigners for free speech, women’s rights, and lesbian and gay liberation, and against racism and anti-semitism, would be set back immeasurably.

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249 comments

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1 cbinflux  Sat, Sep 22, 2007 10:38:10am

save our children!

2 Ojoe  Sat, Sep 22, 2007 10:38:32am

I hereby insult and demonize Ahmadinejad.

3 cjstavern  Sat, Sep 22, 2007 10:39:28am

They won't let in army recruiters because of "don't ask don't tell." But evidently it's ok to stone homosexuals to death. Hypocrisy, liberals is thy name.

4 Ojoe  Sat, Sep 22, 2007 10:40:00am

I am reading W.Churchill's "The Gethering Storm" at the moment, and the quote from the Columbia "progressives" sounds like many of the things in that book.

5 FrogMarch  Sat, Sep 22, 2007 10:41:36am

code for:

Do not step off of the group-think plantation!

Do not think for yourselves. Israel is to blame!

6 Ojoe  Sat, Sep 22, 2007 10:42:05am

'You cannot avoid war, you can only put it off to the advantage of your enemies.'

—Machiavelli

7 brakes  Sat, Sep 22, 2007 10:42:09am
The work of Iranian campaigners for free speech, women’s rights, and lesbian and gay liberation, and against racism and anti-semitism, would be set back immeasurably.

Because that work was going so well.

8 MandyManners  Sat, Sep 22, 2007 10:42:23am

What? Who the hell are they to tell others what not to do.

9 JWM  Sat, Sep 22, 2007 10:43:00am
We fear the demonization of Ahmadinejad, because we think this demonization contributes to the likelihood of war. In the current climate, with many on the political right in the U.S. and Israel pushing for air strikes, a campaign against Ahmadinejad is dangerous, regardless of the intentions of most involved.

I nominate this line for the all time most wussified political statement of all time. Back to nursery babykins

JWM

10 JammieWearingFool  Sat, Sep 22, 2007 10:43:03am

Sign them up as human shields.

11 Poitiers-Lepanto  Sat, Sep 22, 2007 10:43:31am

Perfectly consistent work by the commie-bots.

12 UPSteve98  Sat, Sep 22, 2007 10:43:35am

wow, so all we have to do is threaten war and they won't protest because we might start a war cause war is bad... or something, wait...

13 Canadian Infidel  Sat, Sep 22, 2007 10:43:45am

I guess it's a matter of perspective; I'm handing out sweets the day we start bombing Iran.

14 Poitiers-Lepanto  Sat, Sep 22, 2007 10:44:06am

re: #6 Ojoe

'You cannot avoid war, you can only put it off to the advantage of your enemies.'

—Machiavelli

But that's exactly what the commies want.

15 JammieWearingFool  Sat, Sep 22, 2007 10:44:52am
16 abolitionist  Sat, Sep 22, 2007 10:44:56am

Progressives, just take a black marker, and draw a circle around your necks. It would would convey your message so much more effectively.

17 Ojoe  Sat, Sep 22, 2007 10:45:16am

re: #10 JammieWearingFool

Good idea, because here they attract bombs anyway, in the sense that pacifism leads to war because it seems weak and invites attack.

18 EC Marm  Sat, Sep 22, 2007 10:45:17am
The work of Iranian campaigners for free speech, women’s rights, and lesbian and gay liberation, and against racism and anti-semitism, would be set back immeasurably.

They just don't get it, do they? By handing Archbetterduck Ahmadinejad this Public Relations and Propaganda victory they set those movements back even further and embolden Ahmadinejad even further in his repression. Archbetterduck Ahmadinejad gets paraded across the front page of newspapers all over the planet in front of the U.N. Security council, giving a speech in a major University, feted by the U.S. press, and possibly honoring 'martyrs' at Ground Zero. Pathetic.

19 Shug  Sat, Sep 22, 2007 10:45:38am
The work of Iranian campaigners for free speech, women’s rights, and lesbian and gay liberation, and against racism and anti-semitism, would be set back immeasurably.

by getting rid of the people opposing them ?

uhhhh.....sorry, I'm just an unelnlghtened, unprogressive.

I don't understand .

(fires up bong......... )

Oh, OK, I get it now. cool

20 obscured by clouds  Sat, Sep 22, 2007 10:45:50am

If these dopes are "progressive" I am a fast-typing hippopotamus.

21 Ojoe  Sat, Sep 22, 2007 10:45:51am

re: #14 Poitiers-Lepanto

Yes, read history and you will find this.

22 The Other Les  Sat, Sep 22, 2007 10:46:24am

"Progressive" is newspeak for someone who believes in the paleolithic ideal of beating up and killing people and taking their stuff.

23 Mister Ghost  Sat, Sep 22, 2007 10:46:32am

They're carrying on in the spirit of Water Duranty, Satanist and Stalinist, and Pulitzer Prize winning genocide-denier.

24 NJDhockeyfan  Sat, Sep 22, 2007 10:46:42am

Leisure Photos of Camp Guards Shock Germans

Newly released photos of SS officers sitting in canvas chairs, participating in sing-alongs and enjoying their free time at a recreation home near Auschwitz have shocked many in Germany this week.

Twelve SS auxiliaries sit happily on a fence railing eating blueberries given to them by an SS officer. The photo was taken in 1944 in Solahütte, a recreation home located near Auschwitz for the SS team in charge of running the concentration camp. Another shows the auxiliaries callously feigning tears once their bowls are empty.

These are just two of 116 images in a photo album made public by the United States National Holocaust Museum in Washington earlier this week. The museum obtained the photos at the year of the year from a retired US Army intelligence officer, who came across the album in an apartment in Frankfurt and has now given them to the museum.

The photos were taken between May and December 1944, and they show the officers and guards relaxing and enjoying themselves -- as countless people were being murdered and cremated at the nearby death camp.

In some of the photos, SS officers can be seen singing. In others they are hunting and in another a man can be seen decorating a Christmas tree in what could only be described as a holiday in hell.

"These unique photographs vividly illustrate the contented world they enjoyed while overseeing a world of unimaginable suffering," museum director Sara Bloomfield said in a statement. "They offer an important perspective on the psychology of those perpetrating genocide."

The director of the museum's photographic reference collection, Judith Cohen, said there are no photos depicting anything abhorrent, "and that's precisely what makes them so horrible."

The images are significant because there are few photos available today of the "social life" of the SS officers who were responsible for the mass murder at Auschwitz, the Berliner Morgenpost newspaper writes. The paper claims that these are the first leisure time photos of the concentration camp's SS officers to be discovered, though similar images do exist for other camps, including Sachsenhausen, Dachau and Buchenwald.

25 Cap'n DOC  Sat, Sep 22, 2007 10:46:56am

re: #22 The Other Les

Where's Mongo?

26 Ojoe  Sat, Sep 22, 2007 10:47:03am

re: #8 MandyManners

Hopefully they will be completely ignored.

27 mungagungadin  Sat, Sep 22, 2007 10:48:31am

Pardon me, but are Iranian organizations for women's rights, gays and lesbian issues.......or whatever they said........ truly making any progress in Iran? Last I checked, they were still hanging little girls. Please SHOW THE REST OF THE WORLD if there is "progress in Iran" because I'm very interested in seeing it.

28 opnion  Sat, Sep 22, 2007 10:48:42am

My God,you could cut the hypocrisy with a knife.
Any out of control Muslim Student Association hate fest with outside help is celebrated. An Army recruiter in their bubble of delusion is cause for hysterical denouncement.
This little thug is evil. Hell, he is uber evil. I hope that the protests are massive to the point that the media has to acknowledge it. I hope that the images encourage the opposition in Iran, many of which ironically are students.
Further you enlightened "Progressives" should get over yourselves.This is America, you do not hold the deed to the place.We all have a right to express ourselves. If you want to "speak truth to power", go try it in Iran.
Make sure that your affairs are in order

29 LuckyDog  Sat, Sep 22, 2007 10:49:26am

I think they could have saved everyone the time and taken a raging clue from CSU editors. Why write 250 words that no one will pay attention to? After all "F**k Bush" is so much more erudite when making a nuanced argument.

30 Mister Ghost  Sat, Sep 22, 2007 10:49:29am

How many orgasms would the Princeton cabal have if Ahmadinejad brought out the corpse of Che and started kissing its ass?

31 tripster  Sat, Sep 22, 2007 10:49:55am

Please be nice to him or he might get angry and then their could be a war and that would be just wrong.

Where's Chris Crocker when you need him?
"Leave Ahmadinejad alone, he's a human who has feelings!"

/snarc

32 The Other Les  Sat, Sep 22, 2007 10:50:04am

re: #24 NJDhockeyfan

Halt Hammerzeit!

33 storagemanager  Sat, Sep 22, 2007 10:50:07am
They’re afraid of demonizing him. “Afraid” is the key word.

he already did that

......"Israel is a tyrannical regime that will one day will be destroyed."

"Israel is a rotten, dried tree that will be annihilated in one storm."

President Mahmoud Ahmadinejad

34 ShumBaayaMyLord  Sat, Sep 22, 2007 10:50:19am

Massive military strikes on Iran would just as likely *hearten* those inside Iran who are pitted against the Mullahs.

It's when the West seeks to "engage" the ruling regime that the cause of the internal Iranian opposition gets set back immeasurably--Ahmadinejad's permission to set foot on US soil being perhaps the most pronounced case-in-point.

Someone on a related thread pointed out that Ahmadinejad's immediate bodyguard contingent is presumably composed of IRGC/Pasdaran. Has the designation of that group as a terrorist entity not officially "kicked in" yet? If it has, why on earth would the Bush Administration hold back from arresting the lot of them upon arrival?

35 MandyManners[deleted]  Sat, Sep 22, 2007 10:51:09am
36 pat  Sat, Sep 22, 2007 10:51:25am

I saw one of the progressives on O'Reilly yesterday. South American accent. Clearly hated America. We are importing our doom.

37 The Other Les  Sat, Sep 22, 2007 10:51:42am

In other words the Progressives love barbarians because they are barbarians themselves.

38 storagemanager  Sat, Sep 22, 2007 10:51:52am

I am starting to get the feeling...he is trying very hard to start a riot.

39 NJDhockeyfan  Sat, Sep 22, 2007 10:52:03am

I would like to see the mob to give dinnerjacket an offer he can't refuse.

40 zombie  Sat, Sep 22, 2007 10:52:54am

According to the "progressives" at Columbia, if we bomb Iran,

The work of Iranian campaigners for free speech, women’s rights, and lesbian and gay liberation, and against racism and anti-semitism, would be set back immeasurably.

Now, we have only two possibilities:

1. They actually believe that statement, and somehow think that the mullahs will meekly relinquish power and allow "lesbian and gay liberation" etc. in Iran, without a violent overthrow of their entire system.

In which case, these "progressives" are complete morons, brain-dead buffoons whose fantasies allow totalitarianism to run rampant over the globe. Or....

2. They know they're lying, and they're willing to support a fascist theocratic regime, just so long as it doesn the dirty of work destroying capitalism and the USA.

In which case, they aren't "progressives": they're evil.

So -- which is it?

41 toddrundgren  Sat, Sep 22, 2007 10:52:55am

Interesting, clever positioning by the progressives.

The real story here is that the "progressives", who are bought and paid for by George Soros, are
seeing their Soros anti-Israel views merge with the Iranian Holocaust denier.

It's forcing them to twist themselves into pretzels by allowing someone they essentially agree with to speak yet claiming they're doing it to support the rights movements in Iran.

I call bullshit.

42 Earth56  Sat, Sep 22, 2007 10:53:00am

"Conservative organizations with no affiliation to Columbia’s campus, such as the David Project, have already signed on to the rally on Facebook, and are likely to distribute hundreds of warmongering flyers and picket signs. "

Excuse me !

But are they deaf, Illiterate and dumb as it Dinnerjacket who has been spewing "warmongering" for a few years now. I hope they don't turn into judges one day

43 mama winger  Sat, Sep 22, 2007 10:53:28am
A U.S. attack on Iran, which is not an inevitability but is a real possibility, would have consequences just as terrible as the invasion of Iraq. %uFFFDThousands would die in initial air strikes, and more in the resulting backlash and regional conflagration. %uFFFDThe work of Iranian campaigners for free speech, women’s rights, and lesbian and gay liberation, and against racism and anti-semitism, would be set back immeasurably.

This message has been brought to you by the Appeasement Association of the Unrited Staites of Amerika.

44 The Other Les  Sat, Sep 22, 2007 10:53:49am

re: #39 NJDhockeyfan

I would like to see the mob to give dinnerjacket an offer he can't refuse.

But how are you going to get the horse head into the bedroom?

45 Spiritualized  Sat, Sep 22, 2007 10:54:41am
The work of Iranian campaigners for free speech, women’s rights, and lesbian and gay liberation, and against racism and anti-semitism, would be set back immeasurably.

Yeah, I heard the annual Gay Pride march was going to be held in Tehran until Bush and Sarkozy started causing trouble. It's now been postponed for the next thousand years.

46 Earth56  Sat, Sep 22, 2007 10:55:04am

re: #44 The Other Les


you got it wrong ! It a camel head in this case

47 Nevergiveup  Sat, Sep 22, 2007 10:55:07am

re: #28 opnion

My God,you could cut the hypocrisy with a knife.
Any out of control Muslim Student Association hate fest with outside help is celebrated. An Army recruiter in their bubble of delusion is cause for hysterical denouncement.
This little thug is evil. Hell, he is uber evil. I hope that the protests are massive to the point that the media has to acknowledge it. I hope that the images encourage the opposition in Iran, many of which ironically are students.
Further you enlightened "Progressives" should get over yourselves.This is America, you do not hold the deed to the place.We all have a right to express ourselves. If you want to "speak truth to power", go try it in Iran.
Make sure that your affairs are in order

Those progressives better hurry up ad make their reservations for that Iranian free speech trip soon. I understand that the bungy jumping special from those Iranian cranes is filling up fast!

48 Shug  Sat, Sep 22, 2007 10:55:19am

I'd like to see Christopher Hitchens and dinner jacket have a debate.

49 Islamophobic Warmongering Infidel  Sat, Sep 22, 2007 10:55:22am

........... The work of Iranian campaigners for free speech, women’s rights, and lesbian and gay liberation, and against racism and anti-semitism, would be set back immeasurably...........
Correct me if I am wrong but is Iran "progressive" enough to be the very first nation of muslames to do this?
OR..
Has the writer been smoking something other than tobacco?

50 NJDhockeyfan  Sat, Sep 22, 2007 10:55:38am

re: #44 The Other Les

re: #39 NJDhockeyfan


I would like to see the mob to give dinnerjacket an offer he can't refuse.

But how are you going to get the horse head into the bedroom?


A pig's head would be much better.

51 The Other Les  Sat, Sep 22, 2007 10:55:41am

re: #46 Earth56

re: #44 The Other Les


you got it wrong ! It a camel head in this case

Or the generic beast of burden.

52 Canadian Guy  Sat, Sep 22, 2007 10:55:46am

From the comments for this press release (running about 60-40 pro dinner jacket or anti-america)

This comment shows just how warped and out of touch with reality the left really is. They'll believe anything to support their anti-american agenda, even if it is totally false. Check out all the false claims in this comment.

I do not understand why people do have the self-conviction to judge somebody for themselves, and are willing to readily accept what their media feeds to them.
Strangely enough, if you cared to look at Wikipedia, Ahmadinejad has claimed that he is not an antisemitic and that he respects Jews, he is anti-Israel as he looks on them as an occupying regime, which even the UN acknowledges. It also seems that he is not anti-woman (whatever that means) as he has tried to pass laws in Iran which give women certain rights that were denied earlier, and he faced the ire of Iranian hardliners for that. He is a PhD which means that he is more educated than most American politicians. He has tried to initiate communication with Dubya many times, and I would not call that pro-war. US has never been able to provide any evidence that Iranian weapons have actually been used by insurgents in Iraq. On the contrary it is well known that the US security company Blackwater employees smuggled millions of dollars arms to insurgents in Iraq which are now killing US Marines. And if the US invasion and occupation of Iraq, a remote country, is justified for oil (economic interests), then surely Iran can also justify providing arms to their interest groups in their long time ex-enemy and immediate neighbor for their own security interests. And did not the US support Saddam against Iran in the 8 year long Iran-Iraq war where Iran lost 500,000 soldiers, so why is all the angst only in the US side now. And if I remember right, his initial Holocaust denial statement was rhetorical, he has said that if the Holocaust had really happened, then the Israeli people should have been more sympathetic to the plight of the Palestinian people, who face the same treatment from the Israelis now as they had faced from the Nazis. And now Holocaust denial is just a statement to rally up hardliners in Iran, whose support he needs to stay in power. He is the democratically elected president of Iran and is not a dictator like Saddam. By refusing communication, US is closing all chances of reconciling ideological differences, and by demonizing him, US is just paving the way for another war for economic interests.
Well, you never know, he may actually turn out to be Satan incarnate, but all I am saying is that if you haven't got too much money invested in Haliburton, Chevron, Exxon etc, keep your mind open and make your own judgments. Cause that's what democracy is all about and the last time I heard US was claiming to be the world's greatest democracy. So prove it.

53 Bobblehead  Sat, Sep 22, 2007 10:55:48am

re: #38 storagemanager

I am starting to get the feeling...he is trying very hard to start a riot.

I've had that same feeling since his visit was announced. I hope the NYPD is ready for whatever may occur.

54 autonomoussource  Sat, Sep 22, 2007 10:56:03am

The contortions these looneys go through to maintain their warped worldview are incredible.

Apparently BushCo was just waiting for the approval of the rock throwing anarchist crowd before they began their war for oil on Iran. Luckily for Iran, they were too smart to fall for Dick Cheney's evil scheme.

55 The Other Les  Sat, Sep 22, 2007 10:56:56am

re: #48 Shug

I'd like to see Christopher Hitchens and dinner jacket have a debate.

No matter how much I disagree with a socialist I would never inflict that on Mr. Hitchens.

56 storagemanager  Sat, Sep 22, 2007 10:57:00am
one having power acts; Had Americans had any power they would have stood Lebanese Hizbollah or a few feeble people here and there in Iraq," he added.

The military official said Iran considers the US as a demolished and failed system. "The US is like a beheaded animal, struggling for life."
He went on to say that the US has violated human rights in Guantanamo and Abu Ghraib and one can witness the US-style human rights in the two places. The US would no longer be able to remain as a superpower and it has failed, he noted.

[Link: www2.irna.com...]

57 The Other Les  Sat, Sep 22, 2007 10:57:24am

re: #50 NJDhockeyfan

re: #44 The Other Les

re: #39 NJDhockeyfan


I would like to see the mob to give dinnerjacket an offer he can't refuse.


But how are you going to get the horse head into the bedroom?


A pig's head would be much better.

More difficult but more interesting.

58 Cicero05  Sat, Sep 22, 2007 10:57:32am

Is America at large -- the part that is only vaguely of the political scene -- beginning to realize what the Left and its MoveOn.org puppets in the Democratic Party have become?

I can't believe that it hasn't become painfully apparent to even oblivious voters that the Left and the Democrats lust after an American defeat in the War on Islamofascism. Even in the face of clear progress in Iraq they still look for ways to undermine our ability to win -- witness the most recent failed Democrat effort to limit the ability of the military to redeploy troops after the completion of a tour of duty. They slander a gifted leader like Petraeus, bring up Abu Ghraib at every opportunity, publish articles and produce movies defaming American soldiers, all while claiming that they "support our troops."

Leftist bastions like Columbia roll out the red carpet for an anti-Semitic, misogynistic, apocalyptic anti-American viper like Ahmadinejad but won't allow ROTC to operate a program on campus. Other "elite" institutions do everything in their power to obstruct military recruiting.

These people simply hate America. More significantly, they don't even try to hide it anymore.

Are the Democrats ever going to pay a price for this?

59 LC LaWedgie  Sat, Sep 22, 2007 10:57:49am

Dumb joke:

Hillary says "Dearth Vader" Cheney steps out of his limo.

Funny joke:

Hillary steps out of her limo followed by Dumpy (Berger), Mumpy (Albrecht) and Moe (Kucinich).

That's progressive.

60 Airedale  Sat, Sep 22, 2007 10:58:03am

what? are they afraid their orchastrated standing ovations welcomming him may...just may be blemished with an off key word or two ?

61 Jeewhiz  Sat, Sep 22, 2007 10:58:09am
A rally where each speaker denounces Ahmadinejad’s reactionary policies and just a few call explicitly for military action will still be perceived, on campus and around the U.S., as pro-war.

And no protest rally at all will be perceived as SUPPORT for this man by the American public, you mindless naive moron.

62 jcm  Sat, Sep 22, 2007 10:58:17am

TO: Memo to Columbia Progressives:
FROM: JCM
RE: War with Iran.

THEY ARE AT WAR WITH US!

63 Earth56  Sat, Sep 22, 2007 10:58:43am

I'm worried that we are straying from our true objective the last few days, so I'll remind everyone again


RON PAUL

64 Mich-again  Sat, Sep 22, 2007 10:59:07am

Someone should rent a crane and hang the Ayatollah in effigy.

65 Shug  Sat, Sep 22, 2007 10:59:17am

Dissent is patriotic


but only when dissent is against Bush ?


pussies

66 Killgore Trout  Sat, Sep 22, 2007 10:59:18am

Koskidz invert reality.....
Iran is not dangerous (but Sarkozy is)

I have not changed my mind: the USA is losing power: it could not take control of Iraq, could not prevent Russia from regaining its autonomy. In a way, the USA's only conquest lately has been [French President] Nicolas Sarkozy! They are even losing the English...

(...)

The current attitude of permanent provocation against other European countries and the noisy arrogance of our government, together with its attitude towards Iran, are really worrying me.

From the recommended list.

67 calcajun  Sat, Sep 22, 2007 10:59:48am

As I have said over and over, these idiots don't realize that they will be the first against the wall when the Islamic revolution comes. These people just don't get it that the theocrats won't tolerate any atheistic ideology anymore than they will tolerate any non-Muslim beliefs.

The foolish socialists have more in common with us capitalistic bourgeois pigs than with the islamofascists, but the refuse to see it. Rather, the y see it but they can't break ranks and disobey order from whatever new Comintern that is giving them orders.

68 Killgore Trout  Sat, Sep 22, 2007 11:00:18am

re: #43 mama winger

How are you?

69 BeerForMyHorses  Sat, Sep 22, 2007 11:00:44am

re: #29 LuckyDog

I think they could have saved everyone the time and taken a raging clue from CSU editors. Why write 250 words that no one will pay attention to? After all "F**k Bush" is so much more erudite when making a nuanced argument.

Every time they try to make a nuanced argument it turns out an incomprehensible mess like this. That's why they like to stick to the tried and true bumper sticker slogans. They can't maintain a coherent thought long enough to follow it to a logical conclusion.

70 The Other Les  Sat, Sep 22, 2007 11:01:01am

re: #52 Canadian Guy

I can see the problem with Wikipedia.

71 storagemanager  Sat, Sep 22, 2007 11:01:03am

re: #56 storagemanager

one having power acts; Had Americans had any power they would have stood Lebanese Hizbollah or a few feeble people here and there in Iraq," he added.
The military official said Iran considers the US as a demolished and failed system. "The US is like a beheaded animal, struggling for life."
He went on to say that the US has violated human rights in Guantanamo and Abu Ghraib and one can witness the US-style human rights in the two places. The US would no longer be able to remain as a superpower and it has failed, he noted.

[Link: www2.irna.com...]

He is right about one thing...after 243 Marines were killed...we left Lebanon...and gave Iran ...hope...this is the result of not acting in 1983..

72 ChristianRepublic  Sat, Sep 22, 2007 11:01:05am

If literal demons were literally attacking them they wouldn't want to demonize them.

73 albusteve  Sat, Sep 22, 2007 11:01:26am

re: #8 MandyManners

What? Who the hell are they to tell others what not to do.

I admire this simple logic...but they can talk it to death if they need to

74 debutaunt  Sat, Sep 22, 2007 11:01:37am

A pig's head would work nicely.re: #44 The Other Les

75 storagemanager  Sat, Sep 22, 2007 11:02:00am

re: #63 Earth56

I'm worried that we are straying from our true objective the last few days, so I'll remind everyone again


RON PAUL

76 Spiny Norman  Sat, Sep 22, 2007 11:02:02am

re: #40 zombie

According to the "progressives" at Columbia, if we bomb Iran,
The work of Iranian campaigners for free speech, women’s rights, and lesbian and gay liberation, and against racism and anti-semitism, would be set back immeasurably.

Now, we have only two possibilities:

1. They actually believe that statement, and somehow think that the mullahs will meekly relinquish power and allow "lesbian and gay liberation" etc. in Iran, without a violent overthrow of their entire system.

In which case, these "progressives" are complete morons, brain-dead buffoons whose fantasies allow totalitarianism to run rampant over the globe. Or....

2. They know they're lying, and they're willing to support a fascist theocratic regime, just so long as it doesn the dirty of work destroying capitalism and the USA.

In which case, they aren't "progressives": they're evil.

So -- which is it?

A little of both, I imagine.

Among the group are certainly some who believe one thing and some that believe the other, held together by their overwhelming hatred of the "illegitimate Bush Regime". I imagine the second group may be fewer in number, but much more agressive in leading the "movement".

77 neverquit  Sat, Sep 22, 2007 11:02:08am
We fear the demonization of Ahmadinejad, because we think this demonization contributes to the likelihood of war.

Never mind all the terrorism sponsorship, it's the "demonization of amadinnerjacket" that contributes to the "likelihood of war".

Here's my comment from the "neverquit editorial board" :


F*CK PROGRESSIVES

78 BeerForMyHorses  Sat, Sep 22, 2007 11:02:21am

re: #37 The Other Les

In other words the Progressives love barbarians because they are barbarians themselves.

Many are not brave enough to be barbarians, but they love the vicarious thrill of identifying with them.

79 mama winger  Sat, Sep 22, 2007 11:02:23am

re: #68 Killgore Trout

Hi KT. I'm okay. Better than I was last week. I just got home from the hospital this AM.

Chemo treatments and jump-starting my kidneys. How you doin? :)

80 Canadian Guy  Sat, Sep 22, 2007 11:02:55am

re: #64 Mich-again

Someone should rent a crane and hang the Ayatollah in effigy.

Yes

81 Anna  Sat, Sep 22, 2007 11:02:58am

They should be more afraid of what this guy wants to do them. Imprison them, torture, them, and kill them; that is what he wants to do to all of the West.

82 Nevergiveup  Sat, Sep 22, 2007 11:02:58am

By the way as a informational update> I understand that students at Columbia are being told that for "Safety" reasons their access and freedom of movement around campus will be restricted on Monday! Hum, I may be a tad optimistic, but I smell a possible cancellation of Ahmadinejad's invite due to safety reasons, thereby still insisting on Columbia's right to invite the devil himself to speak!

83 neverquit  Sat, Sep 22, 2007 11:02:58am

I nominate the following for a rotating banner:

F*CK PROGRESSIVES

84 CrazyFool  Sat, Sep 22, 2007 11:03:00am
The work of Iranian campaigners for free speech, women’s rights, and lesbian and gay liberation, and against racism and anti-semitism, would be set back immeasurably.

And these 'struggles' have been so successful in the past. Just look at Afghanistan before the invasion!

The fact that they welcome a terrorist with open arms while refusing ROTC (which protects their 'freedoms' from the given terrorist) speaks volumes.

Columbia has sunken so low.

85 NJDhockeyfan  Sat, Sep 22, 2007 11:03:03am

re: #66 Killgore Trout

Gem from the komments...

Religion and terrorism (1+ / 0-)
Wish I could remember where I read this... that there is a far stronger link between terrorism and foreign oppression than there is between terrorism and any particular religion. A quick test of this hypothesis shows that Palestinians may be Muslims but their terrorism is motivated by Israeli oppression; Osama sputs religious talk but is motivated by US colonial oppression related to The Oil; Irish Catholics were oppressed by British; etc. Hindu terrorism against Indian Muslims does not fit the model too well, unless one considers it a reaction against Muslim domination of centuries past.

Terrorism takes on a religious cast when the foreign oppressors are of a different religion, as commonly occurs. But this can be explained as religion becoming associated with nationalistic identity; it is nationalism, not religion, that drives the terrorism.

by DBunn on Sat Sep 22, 2007 at 10:03:18 AM PDT

86 MandyManners  Sat, Sep 22, 2007 11:03:24am

re: #48 Shug

I'd like to see Christopher Hitchens and dinner jacket have a debate.

You'd need a stool for ShortShit to stand on to reach the podium and microphone.

87 Killgore Trout  Sat, Sep 22, 2007 11:03:51am

re: #79 mama winger

I'm fine. We've been worried about lately around here.

88 ChristianRepublic  Sat, Sep 22, 2007 11:04:15am

re: #80 Canadian Guy

re: #64 Mich-again


Someone should rent a crane and hang the Ayatollah in effigy.

Yes

Man, had I thought of it earlier I woulda taken the inflatable pig I bought at Roger Waters' yard sale and written Amadinnerjacket on it, and sent it aloft over the East River. Dang!

89 jcm  Sat, Sep 22, 2007 11:04:52am

re: #75 storagemanager

re: #63 Earth56

I'm worried that we are straying from our true objective the last few days, so I'll remind everyone again


RON PAUL

Alan Keyes is back in!

Paul Keyes '08! Yeah!
/sarc

90 Shug  Sat, Sep 22, 2007 11:04:57am

re: #86 MandyManners

re: #48 Shug


I'd like to see Christopher Hitchens and dinner jacket have a debate.

You'd need a stool for ShortShit to stand on to reach the podium and microphone.


I'll gladly provide a stool sample for shortshirt to stand on.

91 Killgore Trout  Sat, Sep 22, 2007 11:05:01am

re: #85 NJDhockeyfan

Stuck on stupid.

92 MandyManners  Sat, Sep 22, 2007 11:05:01am

re: #73 albusteve

re: #8 MandyManners


What? Who the hell are they to tell others what not to do.

I admire this simple logic...but they can talk it to death if they need to

A good torture chamber would be to record their twaddle, lock them in a room and play it back to them for a week, night and day.

93 mama winger  Sat, Sep 22, 2007 11:05:06am

re: #87 Killgore Trout

re: #79 mama winger

I'm fine. We've been worried about lately around here.

Who's lately ?

/ :)

94 BeerForMyHorses  Sat, Sep 22, 2007 11:05:28am

re: #71 storagemanager

Every victory emboldens them. Every defeat restores their resolve.

96 Bobblehead  Sat, Sep 22, 2007 11:06:23am

re: #79 mama winger

re: #86 MandyManners

re: #48 Shug

I'd like to see Christopher Hitchens and dinner jacket have a debate.

You'd need a stool for ShortShit to stand on to reach the podium and microphone.

LOL..You are real wordsmith. That should be added to the LGF Dictionary.

97 albusteve  Sat, Sep 22, 2007 11:06:32am

re: #58 Cicero05

Is America at large -- the part that is only vaguely of the political scene -- beginning to realize what the Left and its MoveOn.org puppets in the Democratic Party have become?

I can't believe that it hasn't become painfully apparent to even oblivious voters that the Left and the Democrats lust after an American defeat in the War on Islamofascism. Even in the face of clear progress in Iraq they still look for ways to undermine our ability to win -- witness the most recent failed Democrat effort to limit the ability of the military to redeploy troops after the completion of a tour of duty. They slander a gifted leader like Petraeus, bring up Abu Ghraib at every opportunity, publish articles and produce movies defaming American soldiers, all while claiming that they "support our troops."

Leftist bastions like Columbia roll out the red carpet for an anti-Semitic, misogynistic, apocalyptic anti-American viper like Ahmadinejad but won't allow ROTC to operate a program on campus. Other "elite" institutions do everything in their power to obstruct military recruiting.

These people simply hate America. More significantly, they don't even try to hide it anymore.

Are the Democrats ever going to pay a price for this?

grok+

98 Spiny Norman  Sat, Sep 22, 2007 11:06:37am

re: #66 Killgore Trout

Koskidz invert reality.....
Iran is not dangerous (but Sarkozy is)
I have not changed my mind: the USA is losing power: it could not take control of Iraq, could not prevent Russia from regaining its autonomy. In a way, the USA's only conquest lately has been [French President] Nicolas Sarkozy! They are even losing the English...

(...)

The current attitude of permanent provocation against other European countries and the noisy arrogance of our government, together with its attitude towards Iran, are really worrying me.

From the recommended list.

Far more than will ever admit it, many of the Kos Kidz got a vicarious thrill from "America getting what was coming to it" on 9/11/01.

No, I'm not kidding. Their repeated appalling behavior since then has revealed their true colors: Comintern Red.

99 Killgore Trout Stinks  Sat, Sep 22, 2007 11:07:05am

re: #93 mama winger

That should have been "We've been worried about you lately around here."
/I stink

100 sattv4u2  Sat, Sep 22, 2007 11:07:34am

The work of Iranian campaigners for free speech, women’s rights, and lesbian and gay liberation, and against racism and anti-semitism, would be set back immeasurably.

Ummm,, wouldn't those protesting against dinnerjackest visit be those same "Iranian campagners,,," referenced in tha above bringing light to Irans quashing of those same rights?
So, in essence, the "progressives" want to silence the very people they think will "immeasurably" help the Iranians !?!?!?

Someone tell me, please, that this is all a joke !

101 mama winger  Sat, Sep 22, 2007 11:07:37am

re: #99 Killgore Trout Stinks

You really do.

102 Bobblehead  Sat, Sep 22, 2007 11:08:17am

re: #99 Killgore Trout Stinks

re: #93 mama winger

That should have been "We've been worried about you lately around here."
/I stink

We knew what you meant.

103 Killgore Trout  Sat, Sep 22, 2007 11:08:22am

re: #101 mama winger

So are you up and around yet or still stuck in bed?

104 mama winger  Sat, Sep 22, 2007 11:08:44am

re: #100 sattv4u2

Ummm,, wouldn't those protesting against dinnerjackest visit be those same "Iranian campagners,,," referenced in tha above bringing light to Irans quashing of those same rights?

So, in essence, the "progressives" want to silence the very people they think will "immeasurably" help the Iranians !?!?!?

Wonderfully put.

105 The Other Les  Sat, Sep 22, 2007 11:09:24am

re: #92 MandyManners

re: #73 albusteve

re: #8 MandyManners


What? Who the hell are they to tell others what not to do.


I admire this simple logic...but they can talk it to death if they need to

A good torture chamber would be to record their twaddle, lock them in a room and play it back to them for a week, night and day.

I'd go with a Yoko Ono CD for that.

106 Ojoe  Sat, Sep 22, 2007 11:09:28am

re: #58 Cicero05

Oh they've already paid.

I used to be a peace-and-love hippie.

But I have always loved my country, and the Democrat's antics of the last few years have meant that —

I will never vote Democratic again, and I probably have 10 more presidential elections to vote in.

107 mama winger  Sat, Sep 22, 2007 11:09:59am

re: #103 Killgore Trout

re: #101 mama winger

So are you up and around yet or still stuck in bed?

I came home a couple of hours ago and went to bed, but then the Cubs game started and I was so charged up I couldn't rest. So I decided to come here and inflict myself on y'all. :)

108 ctrlL  Sat, Sep 22, 2007 11:10:14am

You are sooo correct, Charles :

They’re afraid of demonizing him. “Afraid” is the key word.

Think they ever heard the stories about his 'looking like' the guy who appeared to be heavily involved with our infamous Iran hostage crisis. [btw, for some reason, that television memory is very clear to me. I think it definitely is him.]

/How many of his guards/entourage would it take to gain control an auditorium full of these twits ?

109 Killgore Trout  Sat, Sep 22, 2007 11:10:34am

re: #85 NJDhockeyfan

The komments are great...

...I'm more worried by the actions taken by my own country than those of Iran.

The rise of militant Christianity in America and the influence of dominionists in the U.S. military and govenment departments like the DoJ give me more cause for concern than anything Iran is doing.

110 MandyManners  Sat, Sep 22, 2007 11:10:41am

re: #90 Shug

*shudder*

111 cookielady  Sat, Sep 22, 2007 11:10:48am

{mamawinger}

May God bless you with swift and full recovery, and strengthen you in body and spirit!

112 JammieWearingFool  Sat, Sep 22, 2007 11:11:03am

They should swing Dinnerjacket a couple miles north and drop him off outside Yankee Stadium Monday wearing a Red Sox jersey.

He'll be torn to shreds.

113 mama winger  Sat, Sep 22, 2007 11:11:12am

re: #109 Killgore Trout

re: #85 NJDhockeyfan

The komments are great...


...I'm more worried by the actions taken by my own country than those of Iran.The rise of militant Christianity in America and the influence of dominionists in the U.S. military and govenment departments like the DoJ give me more cause for concern than anything Iran is doing.

Oh brother.

114 Momzilla  Sat, Sep 22, 2007 11:11:15am

I think that the "boobs not bombs" womyn should hold a counter rally to the "warmongers" at the speech in support of their hero.

115 NJDhockeyfan  Sat, Sep 22, 2007 11:11:27am

re: #107 mama winger

re: #103 Killgore Trout


re: #101 mama winger

So are you up and around yet or still stuck in bed?


I came home a couple of hours ago and went to bed, but then the Cubs game started and I was so charged up I couldn't rest. So I decided to come here and inflict myself on y'all. :)


5-3 Cubs...middle of the 4th

Woohoo!

116 albusteve  Sat, Sep 22, 2007 11:11:53am

re: #92 MandyManners

re: #73 albusteve


re: #8 MandyManners

What? Who the hell are they to tell others what not to do.

I admire this simple logic...but they can talk it to death if they need to

A good torture chamber would be to record their twaddle, lock them in a room and play it back to them for a week, night and day.

HATER!...hahaha...youre right tho

117 JammieWearingFool  Sat, Sep 22, 2007 11:11:54am
militant Christianity

Heh. Did Arec Bawdwin write that?

118 Killgore Trout  Sat, Sep 22, 2007 11:12:13am

re: #107 mama winger

Well, you take it easy and get some rest.
I'm off to do some yardwork. take care of yourself.

119 Ojoe  Sat, Sep 22, 2007 11:12:23am

re: #114 Momzilla

How can you use the word "support" there?

120 Macker  Sat, Sep 22, 2007 11:12:24am

re: #114 Momzilla

Gee, do you think Mr. Dinner Jacket might want to get smothered to death by Sherry Glaser's?

/UGH

121 mama winger  Sat, Sep 22, 2007 11:12:38am

re: #111 cookielady

Thank you so much for that. :)

122 Ojoe  Sat, Sep 22, 2007 11:13:05am

re: #120 Macker

"Jugs not Jihad"

123 cookielady  Sat, Sep 22, 2007 11:13:08am

re: #108 ctrlL

You are sooo correct, Charles :


They’re afraid of demonizing him. “Afraid” is the key word.

Think they ever heard the stories about his 'looking like' the guy who appeared to be heavily involved with our infamous Iran hostage crisis. [btw, for some reason, that television memory is very clear to me. I think it definitely is him.]

/How many of his guards/entourage would it take to gain control an auditorium full of these twits ?

He will never martyr himself. He is the leader who will greet the Mahdi and be patted on the behind by him. No, he'll let someone else do the bombing and taking over things so they can get killed, but he will take credit for their actions and for bringing about the necessary Last War.

124 MandyManners  Sat, Sep 22, 2007 11:13:16am

re: #105 The Other Les

Cruel, cruel man. We need to get you a job at Gitmo.

125 sattv4u2  Sat, Sep 22, 2007 11:13:17am

re: #104 mama winger

Thank You

126 Blastforth  Sat, Sep 22, 2007 11:13:26am

"But go ahead and Demonize Bush all you want."

127 mama winger  Sat, Sep 22, 2007 11:13:29am

re: #115 NJDhockeyfan

Cubs ahead by a game and a half, with nine games to go .......

See - this is why I was in the hospital.

128 NJDhockeyfan  Sat, Sep 22, 2007 11:13:57am

US denies visas to Iranian reporters

The United States has refused to issue visas to the Iranian reporters accompanying President Mahmoud Ahmadinejad on his visit to New York.

The US has frequently abused its position as the host of the UN to refuse visas to diplomats and reporters on political grounds.

Such incidents had earlier prompted the Iranian Parliament to launch a bid to convince UN member states to move the site of the UN Headquarters to another place.

The US has refused to issue visa to Iran's envoy to the UN Human Rights Council, who was to attend the UN General Assembly, alleging that he was one of the students that took over the US Embassy in Tehran in 1979.

Wasn't little Hitler one of the kidnappers too?

129 storagemanager  Sat, Sep 22, 2007 11:14:00am
Iraqi President Jalal Talabani has called for the immediate release of an Iranian official detained by US forces in the semi-autonomous Kurdish north. Mr Talabani said the US had humiliated the Kurdish authorities by ignoring their laws and failing to consult them.

US officials said the man belonged to Iran's Revolutionary Guards and that he was involved in smuggling explosives.

Whose side are these people on anyway? [Link: news.bbc.co.uk...]

130 mama winger  Sat, Sep 22, 2007 11:14:07am

re: #125 sattv4u2

You are most welcome.

131 JammieWearingFool  Sat, Sep 22, 2007 11:14:47am

Allah's now got three Don't Tase Me, Bro vids up. The newest one is crudely done, but hilarious.

132 MandyManners  Sat, Sep 22, 2007 11:14:49am

re: #96 Bobblehead

I'll consult with Zombie.

133 mama winger  Sat, Sep 22, 2007 11:14:54am

re: #118 Killgore Trout

re: #107 mama winger

Well, you take it easy and get some rest.
I'm off to do some yardwork. take care of yourself.

thanks KT. Altho the Cubs are giving me heart palpitations.

134 m  Sat, Sep 22, 2007 11:15:15am

{mama}! is here! Yaay!

135 mama winger  Sat, Sep 22, 2007 11:15:31am

I'm going to lay on the couch for a bit. bbl

136 Bobblehead  Sat, Sep 22, 2007 11:15:59am

re: #107 mama winger

re: #103 Killgore Trout

re: #101 mama winger

So are you up and around yet or still stuck in bed?

I came home a couple of hours ago and went to bed, but then the Cubs game started and I was so charged up I couldn't rest. So I decided to come here and inflict myself on y'all. :)

Hope you feel better soon. This place isn't quite right without our "mama" around!

137 mama winger  Sat, Sep 22, 2007 11:16:03am

Hi m!

Bye m !

:)

138 Ojoe  Sat, Sep 22, 2007 11:16:07am

re: #135 mama winger

Enjoy !

zzzzzzzz

139 cookielady  Sat, Sep 22, 2007 11:16:08am

re: #129 storagemanager

Iraqi President Jalal Talabani has called for the immediate release of an Iranian official detained by US forces in the semi-autonomous Kurdish north. Mr Talabani said the US had humiliated the Kurdish authorities by ignoring their laws and failing to consult them.
US officials said the man belonged to Iran's Revolutionary Guards and that he was involved in smuggling explosives.

Whose side are these people on anyway? [Link: news.bbc.co.uk...]

No matter what we do for them, they are on Stan's (allah's) side.

140 jcm  Sat, Sep 22, 2007 11:16:08am

Columbia has a problem with ROTC because of "don't ask, don't tell."

But don't have a problem with Iran hanging gays? (WARNING; graphic video)

Just how convoluted is "progressive" logic?

141 Ojoe  Sat, Sep 22, 2007 11:17:09am

re: #140 jcm

It is not convoluted, it is invincible.

142 bikermailman  Sat, Sep 22, 2007 11:17:23am

re: #83 neverquit

I nominate the following for a rotating banner:

F*CK PROGRESSIVES

You reich wing rethuglikkkans are all such haters.
/is it really needed?

143 MandyManners  Sat, Sep 22, 2007 11:18:09am

re: #116 albusteve

"Aversion therapy" sounds better than torture.

144 savage_nation[deleted]  Sat, Sep 22, 2007 11:18:18am
145 BenZacharia  Sat, Sep 22, 2007 11:18:24am

re: #107 mama winger

Inflict away

146 Bobblehead  Sat, Sep 22, 2007 11:19:03am

re: #128 NJDhockeyfan

US denies visas to Iranian reporters

The United States has refused to issue visas to the Iranian reporters accompanying President Mahmoud Ahmadinejad on his visit to New York.

The US has frequently abused its position as the host of the UN to refuse visas to diplomats and reporters on political grounds.

Such incidents had earlier prompted the Iranian Parliament to launch a bid to convince UN member states to move the site of the UN Headquarters to another place.

Yes! Please!

147 Ojoe  Sat, Sep 22, 2007 11:19:19am

re: #142 bikermailman

I think this language, even with the intervening asterisk, is not good to have on this blog.

Just say instead, "how very sad".

Let's keep our effectiveness up.

148 vagabond trader  Sat, Sep 22, 2007 11:19:55am

re: #34 ShumBaayaMyLord

and has no one from the Bush administration commented on this affront? If not, WHY not?

149 Perry  Sat, Sep 22, 2007 11:20:22am

Almost on topic

Why is it a foregone conclusion that he gets in? I wish his plane would get turned around.
[Link: corner.nationalreview.com...]

There is a debate of sorts as to whether the U.N. can legally deny a visa to a head of state such as Ahmadinejad. We denied Arafat a visa in 1988 under the fiction that he was not a head of state. But what about our states? Anyone remember 1983 and how two Governors, Tom Kean and Mario Cuomo, of New Jersey and New York handled their duties? They denied Soviet landing rights in their states as a result of the USSR shooting down KAL 007.

150 albusteve  Sat, Sep 22, 2007 11:20:57am

re: #112 JammieWearingFool

They should swing Dinnerjacket a couple miles north and drop him off outside Yankee Stadium Monday wearing a Red Sox jersey.

He'll be torn to shreds.

re: #143 MandyManners

re: #116 albusteve

"Aversion therapy" sounds better than torture.

torcher is so like yesterday

151 Texas Joel  Sat, Sep 22, 2007 11:21:07am

re: #109 Killgore Trout

I just read "To Lose a Battle: France 1940" by Sir Alistair Horne. My 79 edition is worn, but a new edition should be out for Christmas.

If you want to be scared, read the first part of this! The French left were more afraid of their own patriots than they were of the Germans. You can skip to the end if you don't like a lot of military narrative, but I can tell you, it doesn't end well. It could be a description of Calif or NY 2007 just as easily as Paris 1940.

152 jcm  Sat, Sep 22, 2007 11:21:33am

re: #141 Ojoe

re: #140 jcm

It is not convoluted, it is invincible.

Inconceivable!

153 sylvester  Sat, Sep 22, 2007 11:22:05am

George Soros needs to be investigated, He is a real threat to our way of life! Supports open borders , the terrorists, Obama, Clinton and the ACLU,
pays little or no taxes has all of his money off shore accounts. He had allot to do with the way Europe turned into eurabia!
re: #41 toddrundgren

154 Perry  Sat, Sep 22, 2007 11:22:06am

re: #135 mama winger

Prayers for your health.

155 MandyManners  Sat, Sep 22, 2007 11:22:21am

re: #128 NJDhockeyfan


Wasn't little Hitler one of the kidnappers too?

Little Hitler!

(Hat tip: EC Marm.)

156 BenZacharia  Sat, Sep 22, 2007 11:22:45am

Mama...

My I ask how many infusion sessions you had?

157 albusteve  Sat, Sep 22, 2007 11:23:00am

PIMF.....not!re: #150 albusteve

158 cookielady  Sat, Sep 22, 2007 11:23:26am

re: #152 jcm



Inconceivable!

You keep using that word. I do not think it means what you think it means.

/Inigo Montoya

159 FrogMarch  Sat, Sep 22, 2007 11:23:34am

Progressives are soiling the word "progressive"

160 savage_nation[deleted]  Sat, Sep 22, 2007 11:24:20am
161 ChristianRepublic  Sat, Sep 22, 2007 11:24:27am

re: #108 ctrlL

You are sooo correct, Charles :


They’re afraid of demonizing him. “Afraid” is the key word.

Think they ever heard the stories about his 'looking like' the guy who appeared to be heavily involved with our infamous Iran hostage crisis. [btw, for some reason, that television memory is very clear to me. I think it definitely is him.]

/How many of his guards/entourage would it take to gain control an auditorium full of these twits ?

Someone did a side-by-side shot of Amadinnerjacket and one of the hostage takers, and they are the same guy.

162 NJDhockeyfan  Sat, Sep 22, 2007 11:25:31am

Iranian, Chinese weapons seized in Afghanistan

HERAT, Afghanistan (AFP) - Afghan authorities said they had seized dozens of Iranian and Chinese-made weapons after a brief battle Saturday with Taliban fighters near the border with Iran.

The weapons found in the western province of Herat included about 40 mines and rocket-propelled grenades, the government's intelligence agency said in a statement.

They were found in a vehicle that Taliban fighters abandoned following an exchange of fire in the province's Ghoryan district on the Iranian border, it said.

"The weapons were seized after Taliban escaped and left one of their vehicles behind with the weapons," it said.

An intelligence official told AFP separately and on condition of anonymity that the arms appeared to have been manufactured in Iran and China.

Some of the rockets showed to reporters carried Persian writing and the coat of arms of Iran, which reads "Allah."

US and British officials have alleged that the Taliban are being supplied by weapons that arrive from Iran, although not necessarily from Tehran, which denies involvement.

A sizeable convoy carrying explosives was seized early this month by NATO troops in the western province of Farah, which also borders Iran, the top NATO general here, General Dan McNeill, said last week.

"The geographic origin of that convoy was clearly Iran but take note that I did not say it's the Iranian government," the US general told AFP.

Officials with NATO's International Security Assistance Force told the Washington Post the weapons stash included armour-piercing bombs, which have been especially deadly when used against foreign troops in Iraq.

The NATO-led force interdicted two smaller shipments of similar weapons from Iran into southern Helmand province on April 11 and May 3, the Post said.

US Deputy Secretary of State John Negroponte reiterated last week concern about weapons from Iran supplying the Taliban and said Washington was also discouraging China from selling arms to that country.

163 Texas Joel  Sat, Sep 22, 2007 11:25:54am

re: #149 Perry

Almost on topic

Why is it a foregone conclusion that he gets in? I wish his plane would get turned around.
[Link: corner.nationalreview.com...]

There is a debate of sorts as to whether the U.N. can legally deny a visa to a head of state such as Ahmadinejad. We denied Arafat a visa in 1988 under the fiction that he was not a head of state. But what about our states? Anyone remember 1983 and how two Governors, Tom Kean and Mario Cuomo, of New Jersey and New York handled their duties? They denied Soviet landing rights in their states as a result of the USSR shooting down KAL 007.

"Fiction" that the fish was not a head of state?
Arafat was the head of state of a state in 88? Massachucetts? Lebanon? Tripoli? My history gets so hazy these days.

164 bikermailman  Sat, Sep 22, 2007 11:25:55am

re: #147 Ojoe

re: #142 bikermailman

I think this language, even with the intervening asterisk, is not good to have on this blog.

Just say instead, "how very sad".

Let's keep our effectiveness up.

I didn't say it....that was #83. I was responding with a sarcastic comment. BTW, I took up for you on a language matter a couple of threads back when...um...whomever ragged on you for trying to calm the language down.

165 blueboy  Sat, Sep 22, 2007 11:26:31am

The Iranian president's regime carries out public hangings of teenage boys who happen to be gay. The same regime also executes women who have been the victims of rape because according to their twisted logic they are adulterers. Need I go on?
Iran represents the very antithesis of the ideals that the united states of America was built upon and it astonishes me that your intellectual elite wish to hear Ahmadinejad. God help us.

166 MandyManners  Sat, Sep 22, 2007 11:26:42am

Hiya' mama winger!

167 bkt23  Sat, Sep 22, 2007 11:27:05am

They fear demonizing him because they fear war. Evidently, war, to them, is worse than compromising principles. Submit rather than fight.

Contemptible.

168 savage_nation[deleted]  Sat, Sep 22, 2007 11:27:18am
169 savage_nation[deleted]  Sat, Sep 22, 2007 11:28:26am
170 FamHistoryGuy  Sat, Sep 22, 2007 11:28:32am

re: #86 MandyManners

A high chair would be more appropriate.

171 ibrodsky  Sat, Sep 22, 2007 11:28:42am

ibrodsky's dictionary:

Pro-gres-sive: adj. 1 a: of, or relating to, or characterized by moral blindness. b: making use of or interested in discredited ideas, feelings, or opportunities. 2: of, relating to, or characterized by regression. 3: moving backward or downward: RETREATING

172 ctrlL  Sat, Sep 22, 2007 11:28:54am

re: #161 ChristianRepublic

Thanks for the reply.

173 Potfry  Sat, Sep 22, 2007 11:29:02am

Here's the earlier draft.

The work of Iranian campaigners against the practice of tongue removal for dissenting speech for free speech, against the practice of mandatory clitoris storage in a small jar of formaldehyde women’s rights, against the presentation of gay people via a crane and some rope and lesbian and gay liberation, and against the belief that the Holocaust was the historical equivalent of a fender-bender against racism and anti-semitism, would be set back immeasurably.

174 albusteve  Sat, Sep 22, 2007 11:29:29am

re: #168 savage_nation

re: #161 ChristianRepublic


re: #108 ctrlL

You are sooo correct, Charles :

They’re afraid of demonizing him. “Afraid” is the key word.

Think they ever heard the stories about his 'looking like' the guy who appeared to be heavily involved with our infamous Iran hostage crisis. [btw, for some reason, that television memory is very clear to me. I think it definitely is him.]/How many of his guards/entourage would it take to gain control an auditorium full of these twits ?

Someone did a side-by-side shot of Amadinnerjacket and one of the hostage takers, and they are the same guy.

That's damn right.

'they all look alike to me'...

175 bikermailman  Sat, Sep 22, 2007 11:29:29am

Mama, a great big { } out to you. A collective, group hug from all your LGF family.

176 cookielady  Sat, Sep 22, 2007 11:29:32am

Have a great day, lizards! Gotta get to it... I work weekends. 'See' youse guys laitah!

177 BenZacharia  Sat, Sep 22, 2007 11:29:40am

re: #162 NJDhockeyfan

Chinese weapons seized in Afghanistan

Support the war effort! Shop Wally World! Oops, wrong side.

Savage_N

Alot of people were down on bloomberg or State yesterday for the ArmaniDinnerJacket thang, guess they couldn't figure out who's really in charge that could have said, "Take a flyin' Fu*k" if he had the BALLS.

178 Texas Joel  Sat, Sep 22, 2007 11:30:42am

re: #146 Bobblehead

re: #128 NJDhockeyfan

US denies visas to Iranian reporters
The United States has refused to issue visas to the Iranian reporters accompanying President Mahmoud Ahmadinejad on his visit to New York.

The US has frequently abused its position as the host of the UN to refuse visas to diplomats and reporters on political grounds.

Such incidents had earlier prompted the Iranian Parliament to launch a bid to convince UN member states to move the site of the UN Headquarters to another place.

Yes! Please!

If they don't have visas will they be sitting on the airplane, or mingling in the arrivals building while A-jd goes to the city? If they stay home, they aren't accompanying anyone, are they?

Yes, please give Turtle Bay back, and move the UN to somewhere else, Darfur? Mecca? Ulan Bator? darkside of the moon?

179 Shug  Sat, Sep 22, 2007 11:30:55am

re: #167 bkt23

Submit rather than fight.

rotating title at KOs?

180 Momzilla  Sat, Sep 22, 2007 11:31:31am

re: #120 Macker

re: #114 Momzilla

Gee, do you think Mr. Dinner Jacket might want to get smothered to death by Sherry Glaser's?

/UGH

*snork* I think it would sure make for some entertaining youtube video.

181 SusanL  Sat, Sep 22, 2007 11:31:48am

Hate to post and run, I will check back later to see if any of you can explain a KosKid statement.

Just who and where are these "Militant Christians"?

What fever dreams are these people having? I have yet to see groups from Christian churches marching through the streets with "death to whatever" signs and statements that those who insult Christ must die.

What the hell? I am very confused.

For those of you close enough, please go and protest the short ones visit. It is about time that right thinking people say ENOUGH! If I wasn't 3000 miles away, I would go.

182 cookielady  Sat, Sep 22, 2007 11:32:09am

re: #178 Texas Joel

Yes, please give Turtle Bay back, and move the UN to somewhere else, Darfur? Mecca? Ulan Bator? darkside of the moon?

How about Babylon? ;-)

183 Occasional Reader  Sat, Sep 22, 2007 11:32:10am

re: #48 Shug

I'd like to see Christopher Hitchens and dinner jacket have a debate.

Screw that. I'd like to see Seal Team 6 and dinner jacket have a "debate".

184 BenZacharia  Sat, Sep 22, 2007 11:32:46am

re: #178 Texas Joel

Yes, please give Turtle Bay back, and move the UN to somewhere else, Darfur? Mecca? Ulan Bator? darkside of the moon?

Anywhere in Magik Kingdom works for me.

185 cookielady  Sat, Sep 22, 2007 11:33:02am

Okay, I'm really going now. You all are just too darned entertaining and interesting, LOL!

186 LACO_Bolt_Fan  Sat, Sep 22, 2007 11:33:03am

Some one needed to have put these boys and girls at Columbia over their knees and spanked these kids when they were children, maybe they would not have grown up so warped in their views.

Spare the rod, spoil the child.

I believe spanking is a valueable tool in creating a decent human being.

187 ChristianRepublic  Sat, Sep 22, 2007 11:33:14am

re: #172 ctrlL

re: #161 ChristianRepublic

Thanks for the reply.

YW, see ya later, son's myspace apparently needs attention...

188 Perry  Sat, Sep 22, 2007 11:33:19am

re: #182 cookielady
Seconded.

189 Occasional Reader  Sat, Sep 22, 2007 11:34:01am

re: #120 Macker

re: #114 Momzilla

Gee, do you think Mr. Dinner Jacket might want to get smothered to death by Sherry Glaser's?

/UGH

I can think of other Glasers I'd like to introduce to Dinner Jacket.

(okay, yes, I don't like him... really)

190 ibrodsky  Sat, Sep 22, 2007 11:34:25am

re: #178 Texas Joel

Yes, please give Turtle Bay back, and move the UN to somewhere else, Darfur? Mecca? Ulan Bator? darkside of the moon?

Where are sinkholes when you need them?

191 MandyManners  Sat, Sep 22, 2007 11:34:32am

re: #170 FamHistoryGuy

re: #86 MandyManners

A high chair would be more appropriate.

Car seat?

192 LACO_Bolt_Fan  Sat, Sep 22, 2007 11:34:37am

I agree with Ojoe,

I too insult and demonize that Iranian midget with the light grey members only jacket.

193 vagabond trader  Sat, Sep 22, 2007 11:34:54am

re: #160 savage_nation

I doubt it not. Makes me furious that this Iranian creature can sashay into NYC while his filthy minions are murdering and maiming our troops.Shame on political whores of all leanings.

194 albusteve  Sat, Sep 22, 2007 11:35:00am

re: #186 LACO_Bolt_Fan

Some one needed to have put these boys and girls at Columbia over their knees and spanked these kids when they were children, maybe they would not have grown up so warped in their views.

Spare the rod, spoil the child.

I believe spanking is a valueable tool in creating a decent human being.

flunk them back to remedial day care...start over

195 NJDhockeyfan  Sat, Sep 22, 2007 11:36:23am

Photo led to arrest of Iranian bomber: US

BAGHDAD: US forces used a photograph to identify an Iranian they arrested in northern Iraq as a wanted bomb smuggler, a military spokesman said yesterday amid claims by Iran the detainee is a businessman.

I can't provide the specific evidence we have for security reasons, but I can say that coalition forces identified the individual on the scene from a photo, so we are confident we have the guy we were looking for," Major Winfield Danielson said. American forces arrested the Iranian on suspicion of smuggling bombs on Thursday at a hotel in the northern city of Sulaimaniyah, part of the Kurdish region.

Iran condemned what it called the "unwarranted" arrest of an official it said was in Iraq at the invitation of the Kurdish regional government, and lodged a strong protest with the authorities in Baghdad. The foreign ministry in Tehran said the detained man, known only as Mr Farhadi, is head of "cross-border commercial transactions" in the office of the governor-general of Kermanshah province in western Iran.

The US military said on Thursday the detainee was believed to be an officer in the Quds Force, the covert operations arm of Iran's elite Revolutionary Guards, and that he was suspected of involvement in smuggling sophisticated explosives.

This individual has been involved in transporting improvised explosive devices into Iraq, and reports indicate he was also involved in the infiltration of foreign terrorists into Iraq, contrary to recent diplomatic initiatives," Danielson said yesterday. "Coalition forces acted to prevent lethal attacks against the Iraqi people, their elected government, and both Iraqi and coalition security forces," he added.

196 MarshallOnellion  Sat, Sep 22, 2007 11:37:24am

I did not know there was such an organization as "Monthly Review" devoted to an explicitly socialist agenda. What I do not understand is how these people can be so blind. Surely they know that the Islamists, like any totalitarian and absolutist group, would first round them up, offer them the chance to convert to Islam or submit to dhimmi status, and kill those who refused either. As the saying goes, none so blind as those who will not see.

197 ShumBaayaMyLord  Sat, Sep 22, 2007 11:38:18am

Re #129 storagemanager

Jalal Talabani has made some distressingly strenuous efforts over the last couple of years (since his installation as Iraq's president) to reach out to the regime in Tehran. His chief interest is in keeping the Kurdish autonomous enclave secure and, well, autonomous. So his approach in general seems to be of the "Keep your friends close and your enemies closer" school.

I don't think Talabani is ideologically aligned at all with the Iranians, not to mention any of the other million-odd whackjobs roaming about Iraq (whether Shi'a or Sunni). The problem is that his self-perceived "realpolitik" balancing-act unintentionally equates to material aid and comfort to those whackjobs. Thereby endangering US troops and other good-guy personnel.

198 LC LaWedgie  Sat, Sep 22, 2007 11:40:40am
The closure, routinely imposed for Israeli public holidays, also means that Palestinians living in the West Bank can not come to Israel or occupied and annexed east Jerusalem even if they ordinarily have permits to do so.

The lockdown for the holiest day in the Jewish calendar prevented the peace-minded Muslim faithful liv slaving in the West Bank from being able to pray at Jerusalem's Al-Aqsa mosque compound, the site of which is holy to both Jews and Muslims.

From early morning, with thousands of little tears in their plaintive eyes, thousands of would-be worshippers with Israeli permits descended on the main Qalandiya checkpoint on the road from the West Bank town of Ramallah to Jerusalem, hoping upon fruitless hope, to be allowed to cross as last week.

/for the love of... will somebody please get Tiny Tim a crutch!

199 BeerForMyHorses  Sat, Sep 22, 2007 11:41:56am

re: #109 Killgore Trout

re: #85 NJDhockeyfan

The komments are great...


...I'm more worried by the actions taken by my own country than those of Iran.
The rise of militant Christianity in America and the influence of dominionists in the U.S. military and govenment departments like the DoJ give me more cause for concern than anything Iran is doing.

If only.

200 Annar  Sat, Sep 22, 2007 11:43:14am

Send all those so-called progressives off to AhmadInJihad's Evin think tank where they can learn all about calming dissent and religious tolerance.

Afterwords they might remain to serve as human shields for the peaceful nuclear facilities or visit Qom to wait for the Mahdi or help with the hot line. In any case stay there!

201 m  Sat, Sep 22, 2007 11:43:41am

re: #144 savage_nation

Hey [[[[[[[[[[[[[Savage]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]]!

I just watched that video you sent~ HILARIOUS! Thanks! lol

202 Josephine  Sat, Sep 22, 2007 11:44:08am

re: #41 toddrundgren

Good point.

203 Josephine  Sat, Sep 22, 2007 11:47:01am

re: #48 Shug

I'd like to see Christopher Hitchens and dinner jacket have a debate.

That would be fun!

204 Outrider  Sat, Sep 22, 2007 11:50:40am
...The work of Iranian campaigners for free speech, women’s rights, and lesbian and gay liberation, and against racism and anti-semitism, would be set back immeasurably.


There is a large (or any) Lesbian/Gay Rights groups in Iran? Feminists Organizations? Free Speech groups? Anti-Semitic groups? These are prevalent and active are they? Or is Columbia University planning on being at the forefront and leading the charge? Kind of putting their money where their mouth is type of thing? Thought not.

205 Attaboid  Sat, Sep 22, 2007 11:53:37am
The work of Iranian campaigners for free speech, women’s rights, and lesbian and gay liberation, and against racism and anti-semitism, would be set back immeasurably.

ROTFLMAO

206 m  Sat, Sep 22, 2007 11:56:21am

re: #147 Ojoe

Just say instead, "how very sad".

Let's keep our effectiveness up.

I thought the asterisked word combo very effective :)

207 Against Socialism  Sat, Sep 22, 2007 11:57:11am

What is up with all "Progressives", "Brights", "Enlightenists" and what else these atheists, humanists, socialists and communists call themselves?

Bunch of idiots. But then again they all think they're just advanced animals, to buy into the advanced animal lie one really need to be a real idiot.

208 LACO_Bolt_Fan  Sat, Sep 22, 2007 11:57:52am

re: #198 LC LaWedgie

Funny how the 'slims...always hold "Al-askya" as one othe holiest site in 'slam when by all accounts Judaism carbon footprint it predates anything in 'Slam. What a bunch of zombied out goofballs.

Well, I did it, I insulted 'slam...won't be long now, I'll have a price on my head by 'Gayda and Bum Laden...so long to all, I'll probably have to go into hiding.

209 LaMano  Sat, Sep 22, 2007 12:00:37pm
The work of Iranian campaigners for free speech, women’s rights, and lesbian and gay liberation, and against racism and anti-semitism, would be set back immeasurably.

Ahem, they're already being beaten, stoned, imprisoned and/or beheaded. Those are not 'set backs'?

Jeeezz.

210 Spiny Norman  Sat, Sep 22, 2007 12:01:58pm

re: #96 Bobblehead

re: #79 mama winger

re: #86 MandyManners

re: #48 Shug
I'd like to see Christopher Hitchens and dinner jacket have a debate.
You'd need a stool for ShortShit to stand on to reach the podium and microphone.
LOL..You are real wordsmith. That should be added to the LGF Dictionary.

Shortshit.

211 LC LaWedgie  Sat, Sep 22, 2007 12:02:05pm

re: #208 LACO_Bolt_Fan

Worse. You'll be hounded by Columbia progressives.

212 mattm  Sat, Sep 22, 2007 12:06:26pm

Yeah right. This is one of the stupidest things I have ever read.

213 lostlakehiker  Sat, Sep 22, 2007 12:16:45pm

re: #13 Canadian Infidel

Do not imagine that war with Iran would be a cakewalk. War just might be a sober and painful necessity. But we should not choose war unless the harm we could rationally expect from sitting on our hands far exceeded the harm that was reasonably probable, from a sober and somewhat pessimistic sizing up of the matter, to come of the war.

Wars have a habit of going off the rails. A habit of turning out to be a lot less fun than they'd looked to be going in. Virtually no wars have been rational choices for both combatants. Many have been irrational choices for both.

A full-blown war with Iran would, assuming it went well for our side, require conscription and a big tax increase, together with canceling a lot of domestic spending.

It would not be an occasion for handing out sweets. And yes, it would consolidate Iranian civil society behind the regime, setting back what progress, if any, was being made toward liberalization from within.

For all of that, Ahmadinejad ought not have a free pass from criticism. He lives in a dreamworld. Sharp criticism might sober him up, or failing that, it might sober up others within Iran who are well placed to effect a change in leadership over there. Harsh criticism makes war less likely, because while it might make war seem more justified, the more important thing is it offers a way to make war less likely to be necessary.

214 Shr_Nfr  Sat, Sep 22, 2007 12:28:13pm

I am pleased to announce that these individuals have used the power of Islam and Noam Chomsky to create a new breakthrough in tricycles: [Link: images.thesun.co.uk...]

215 neverquit  Sat, Sep 22, 2007 12:32:50pm

Columbia Progressives Pro Protesting Gilchrist


The founder of the anti-illegal immigration Minuteman Project, Jim Gilchrist, who was forced off a Columbia University stage last year, will not be coming back for a return engagement at the school. The Columbia Political Union, a nonpartisan student group that had been planning the forum, said in a statement on its Web site yesterday that "it has become clear that this event cannot take the form we had originally hoped it would and could not effectively accomplish the goals we had hoped it might."

Last October 4, Mr. Gilchrist had to cut short his talk at the school after students from the Chicano Caucus and other groups climbed onstage with banners denouncing the Minuteman Project, which is based in Laguna Hills, Calif., and advocates action to prevent illegal immigration from Mexico.

That event was organized by the school's College Republicans club. The CPU said in its statement that it had envisioned the event as part of a speaker series, "Friendly Fire," created by Columbia history lecturer and author, David Eisenbach, who said he was disappointed by the students' decision. "The health of a free society and a university depends on the free expression of ideas. Only through a free expression of ideas can we reach the truth," he said.

216 abolitionist  Sat, Sep 22, 2007 12:33:47pm

Iranian Atomic Energy Organization Director: Document On Completion Of Bushehr Reactor To Be Signed Prior To Putin's Visit To Iran

[snip]
Under the fifth Russian-Iranian agreement, Russia committed to transfer 90 tons of nuclear fuel by March 2006 and to activate the reactor by September 2007.

Source: IRNA, September 20, 2007.
Posted at: 2007-09-21

I think Ahmadinejad is here to gloat, and to be the first muslim head of state to pray at the world's largest outdoor mosque, under construction near Shanksville PA.

Wouldn't it be nice if Bushehr went "hot" during his visit. Or would that be too messy?

217 Right Brain  Sat, Sep 22, 2007 12:41:11pm

Notice how everyone who disagrees with them is devalued: "right wing" "conservative" "unaffiliated". This leftist short hand insulates them from reasoned debate. Anyone who questions them is well "right wing" "conservative" "unaffiliated", in their world, to be called one of these names is the ultimate insult, indicating an ignorant person not worthy of their vaunted view of right and wrong.

The last paragraph is comical, reminiscent of the ongoing WSJ joke about "world ends, black most affected." In this case the world ends and lesbians and gay liberation is hurt the most.

So who is the worst offender on the planet of gay rights?

Iran. Does this give them pause? What are you right wing?

218 Shr_Nfr  Sat, Sep 22, 2007 12:51:31pm

Another load of arms from Iran seized in Afghanistan. [Link: www.iranpressnews.com...] Tell me again why we are not in a state of war with Iran. They appear to be in a state of war with us.

219 DJ  Sat, Sep 22, 2007 1:05:07pm

And these "progressives" are "educated" and "enlightened".
Yea, right.

220 RobCon  Sat, Sep 22, 2007 1:08:42pm

Well my "progressive" friends. You say you like protesting
far-right, fascist, genocidal racist, sexist, homophobic, warmogering religious extremists and getting tired of the usual Bush/Cheney offerings.
Well Monday Sept. 24 is your lucky day with your work cut out for you un NYC. Mahmoud Ahmadinejad, President of the Islamic Republic of Iran
is in town in between tour dates of denying the Holocaust and planning the next one (and killing US & UK soldiers, and any truly progressive Iranians who get in his way).

221 RobCon  Sat, Sep 22, 2007 1:10:57pm

Gee, they weren't this calm when they wrere attacking the Minutemen on stage.

222 Paul  Sat, Sep 22, 2007 1:19:29pm

Complete and utter rubbish. The left doesn't want to protest against Ahmadinejad because, to a large extent, they agree with him. They support his anti-American and anti-Israeli rhetoric because it coincides with their own beliefs and hatreds. American progressives could care less about the struggle of individual Iranians for free speech, human rights, etc. ; the progressives will throw them under the bus, if necessary, to keep Ahmadinejad in power.

223 RobCon  Sat, Sep 22, 2007 1:20:16pm

So-called progressives who made a career of protesting finally have a real fascist to protest and they are much to dignified to prance around and make asses of themselves this time.
Why? The enemy is Bush and/ or Israel. If giving respect to a REAL fascist gets at Bush and or/Israel, so be it. That is why they are fascist friendly.

224 Outrider  Sat, Sep 22, 2007 1:21:21pm

re: #213 lostlakehiker

A full-blown war with Iran would, assuming it went well for our side, require conscription and a big tax increase, together with canceling a lot of domestic spending.


Why would full blown war be required or necessary? In the case of Iran we should merely take a leaf out of the Israeli doctrine and use military force as a punishing tool and avoid the occupation and land force requirements.

The only way land warfare should be required with Iran is if they crossed en masse over the Iraqi border and engaged our troops.

225 neverquit  Sat, Sep 22, 2007 1:24:15pm

re: #224 Outrider

The only way land warfare should be required with Iran is if they crossed en masse over the Iraqi border and engaged our troops.

If Iran masses their troops they are sitting ducks.

The major risks to US Forces are comprised within the hostile Shiite elements in Iraq.

226 Shaky Louie  Sat, Sep 22, 2007 1:36:09pm
We fear the demonization of Ahmadinejad, because we think this demonization contributes to the likelihood of war. ...[A] campaign against Ahmadinejad is dangerous, regardless of the intentions of most involved. A call to action, unless it prominently rules out war, implies military action.

"War is an ugly thing, but not the ugliest of things. The decayed and degraded state of moral and patriotic feeling which thinks that nothing is worth war is much worse. The person who has nothing for which he is willing to fight, nothing which is more important than his own personal safety, is a miserable creature and has no chance of being free unless made and kept so by the exertions of better men than himself." ___John Stewart Mill

227 lostlakehiker  Sat, Sep 22, 2007 1:48:27pm

re: #224 Outrider

See the part about wars going off the rails. What if, just for instance, the Iranians used shore to ship missiles on shipping in the straits? Bombing wouldn't reopen that sea route. Somebody would have to go in and take all the hills and islands that afford a good shot at the shipping. And then somebody would have to hold it.

What if their they-say-it-doesn't-exist nuclear weapons program is well dispersed and tucked away deep in bunkers that even jdams and moabs cannot touch? [I am assuming just about the only reason we would go to war is that we know damned well it does exist, no guesswork, and we have pretty evidence that they aren't going to be the least bit prudent with it once it becomes operational.] Sappers can slag such bunkers, but only after a ground force has secured access to it.


What if this, or that, or the other? Wars are unpredictable, but one thing about them is predictable---they mostly don't go according to plan.

228 Ojoe  Sat, Sep 22, 2007 2:09:27pm

re: #164 bikermailman

I realize it was 83, I should have gon back up the thread and clicked "reply" on the original number, I apologize.

& thank you, I was probably working and I missed your defense.

229 Areopagitica  Sat, Sep 22, 2007 2:20:13pm

Great, more people who have no balls.

This guy calls for the destruction of ours and other countries and approves of the execution of women and all these people can think of is how bad it so called is to defend ourselves.

230 moski3  Sat, Sep 22, 2007 2:22:34pm

If these people are so afraid, wouldn't it be easier to just un-invite him? Just a thought.

231 Joan  Sat, Sep 22, 2007 2:30:20pm

re: #15 JammieWearingFool

Iranian symbol of peace

Every demonstrator needs to carry a poster or placard with that image on it. Says it all. Oh, and T-shirts "We fear the demonization of Hitler"

232 marwan's daughter  Sat, Sep 22, 2007 2:41:54pm

The spirit of Neville Chamberlain is alive and well. I've always wondered what the 1930s were like. But now I know.

233 RememberSekhmet?  Sat, Sep 22, 2007 2:49:41pm

re: #213 lostlakehiker

re: #13 Canadian Infidel
.....For all of that, Ahmadinejad ought not have a free pass from criticism. He lives in a dreamworld. Sharp criticism might sober him up, or failing that, it might sober up others within Iran who are well placed to effect a change in leadership over there. Harsh criticism makes war less likely, because while it might make war seem more justified, the more important thing is it offers a way to make war less likely to be necessary.

Things you are forgetting:
Elections in Iran are an utter and complete sham. The mullahs are the real masters of Iran. Ahmanutjob is merely a "beard" and a mouthpiece for the Mullahs. He wouldn't, can't, and won't do a damn thing the Mullahs don't want him to do. Removing Nutjob wouldn't change a damn thing about what the Mullahs are up to.

234 nyc redneck  Sat, Sep 22, 2007 2:50:09pm

re: #43 mama winger

missed you so much { mama }

235 Outrider  Sat, Sep 22, 2007 2:52:47pm

re: #227 lostlakehiker

What if this, or that, or the other? Wars are unpredictable, but one thing about them is predictable---they mostly don't go according to plan.


We can "what if" the concept to death, but each scenario listed is predicated on the premise that Iran would be willing to escalate the conflict to suicidal (for them) levels. But, as they have shown no reluctance to do so this is a valid concern. However; our sitting back and taking no action in the mere hope and desire they will do nothing at all is foolish at best, criminal and suicidal at worse. Negotiations and embargoes have had zero impact and concern the highest levels of government not at all.
Each of the scenarios you and NeverQuit listed can be handled by our military with minimal problems. Actual invasion of Iraq by Iran? A possibility, remote, but a possibility. The force in place would be in for a rough time, but we have the technologies that would have handled mass invasion by the Soviet and Warsaw Pact, I believe Iranian forces would be handled. Ranger forces, through raids, would eliminate the posed problems of the sea route and land forces cutting off access.
The point is; none of this requires occupation forces and the inherent problems found in maintaining those forces. None of the scenarios posed are insurmountable. Our military heads and their staffs get paid for exactly this reason; to worst case scenario everything, plan for it, and if required, to execute those plans. They have done quite well in the past.

236 mikalm  Sat, Sep 22, 2007 2:53:39pm

re: #40 zombie

I'll take Door #2, Zom...

237 southernborn  Sat, Sep 22, 2007 2:57:49pm

I believe if this son of a beast P***ed on ground zero, it would be okay with the libs. Do we have to have a civil war to protect america? I' m beginning to believe so.(wouldn't last long) And All of Iran's blustering and threats remind me of the little african kids that hold a bush over their heads so they'll be taller than the hyennas that want to eat them.

238 Brian Smaller  Sat, Sep 22, 2007 3:00:50pm

"The work of Iranian campaigners for free speech, women’s rights, and lesbian and gay liberation, and against racism and anti-semitism, would be set back immeasurably."

Set back immeasurably? You mean they might only start hanging gays from cranes in the street. Oh yeah, they already do that in Iran.

239 markie  Sat, Sep 22, 2007 3:07:25pm

There are regressives that object to Ahmadinejihad? Not only is that "preaching to the choir" (how ironic is that?) but its also too strident and smacks of desperation. We cannot have any leftists breaking lockstep with the Party can we?

240 Mardukhai  Sat, Sep 22, 2007 3:16:14pm

How do you demonize a demon?

It's already done.

241 Joan  Sat, Sep 22, 2007 3:31:19pm

yes, texas guy got a brilliant idea:

UN to Darfur

Do you love it? U.N. to Darfur

UN OUT of New York

242 threeCents  Sat, Sep 22, 2007 4:13:46pm

Demonization? I think that he does that all by himself just fine. By the way, Communism and Naom Chomsky is just so last century? Don't the "progressives" realize that these positions are only progressive from a dictator's point of view, i.e., progressively increasing their control over us? I suppose that this must be why they need to defend Ahmadinejad. Geez.

243 CommonSense  Sat, Sep 22, 2007 4:33:12pm
The work of Iranian campaigners for free speech, women’s rights, and lesbian and gay liberation, and against racism and anti-semitism, would be set back immeasurably.

What work? There is none.

244 CommonSense  Sat, Sep 22, 2007 4:36:54pm

'It's the end of the world as we know it"
-R.E.M.

245 whiskeybeerwine  Sat, Sep 22, 2007 4:49:38pm

Columbia Progressives = Duke 88

246 RTLM  Sat, Sep 22, 2007 4:55:42pm

The Left would have is in every war we are not in. IE: Darfur.

247 madisonsfriend  Sat, Sep 22, 2007 6:13:12pm

All that it takes for evil to triumph is for decent people to remain silent.
I think this is close to what Edmund Burke said. I just figure the person who said this is getting paid-I know everyone says it is us JOOs who have money but I am pretty sure the Arabs and Muslims have plenty to go around for stuff like this(they can't spend all their money on arming Hamas,Hezbollah and other ROPMA friends)

And does anyone think Jim Moran really believes his claim that AIPAC and the omnipotent Jews are the reason we went to war in Iraq or is he playing to the growing muslim population in Northern Va?

248 gozips  Sat, Sep 22, 2007 7:35:20pm

No surprise, these are just the kids of the freaks from the 60's and 70's. The good news is a new round of Reagan parents will have kids entering college in the next half dozen years or so.

249 Saif al Kufr  Sun, Sep 23, 2007 11:15:37am

David Project Appalled by Columbia University Invitation to Ahmadinejad.

September 23, 2007

Charles Jacobs, President of The David Project, today deplored Columbia President Lee Bollinger’s invitation to Iranian President, Ahmadinejad:

“It is a clear failure of judgment; it is demeaning of academic standards, it continues a disturbing pattern of bias at Columbia against Israel, and it is emblematic of the failure of so many of our universities to distinguish right from wrong, truth from lies,” said Dr. Charles Jacobs, David Project President.

“ Bollinger’s justification for providing a prestigious platform to a raving anti-Semite, whose agents are killing American soldiers and whose nation is covertly developing nuclear weapons, is nothing less than astonishing,” said Jacobs.

“Bollinger says Columbia is “committed to confronting ideas,” but surely universities do not need to invite tyrants to teach students the evils of tyranny,” Jacobs noted. Bollinger’s lesson instead seems to be that American students should give platforms to would-be mass murderers so they can show off their debating skills.”

Jacobs said, “What we need from a university president is a noble defense of civilization and decency. What we are getting here instead is another attempt to “understand” evil and not to defeat it. Bollinger is treating this terrorist like some in the media treat suicide bombers, by trying to ‘understand’ them, denying all the while that this is the same as justifying their acts.”

“Debating Ahmadinejad in the halls of one the West’s most prestigious universities supports the notion that there is something to debate about his stated intention to murder Jews en masse, about the reality of the Holocaust, or about Iran’s practice of stoning women or executing gays. Some ideas are not worth “debating” – they must be defeated through action.” Jacobs said.

“Bollinger says that by listening to ‘ideas we deplore does not imply our endorsement of those ideas, or the weakness of our resolve to resist those ideas.’” “But,” Jacobs said,” Ahmadinejad is not a policy wonk or a philosopher: He is a man of action, murdering Americans and planning to slaughter the Jews of the Middle East.. He is not an “idea” to be debated. He is a man to be stopped.

Giving him this prestigious platform is not, as Bollinger says, “America at its best.” It is American academia at its worst.”


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