"40,000 to 50,000 women and children would form a “human chain” stretching the length of the Gaza Strip."

That may be a record-setting number of human shields.

Organisers said Hamas-controlled schools across Gaza would get time off to allow students to take part in the protest.

Considering the type of education we've seen coming out of their schools, I'd say this was less time off than it is a field trip.

/ The children of Gaza are merely trying to build bridges toward peace.

This is something that Israel has been worried about since the moment Hamas stormed the Egyptian border with Gaza and invaded that country. Israel's security is entrusted to those defending its border with Gaza, and they take that responsibility more seriously than the Egyptians did to theirs - with predictable consequences.

That isn't to say that Hamas couldn't try to overwhelm the Israelis with sheer numbers of unarmed women and children to storm the border, but they'd have to get through the defenses first - and that was accomplished along the Egyptian border by first undermining the fence and torching it, followed by blowing up sections.

But the Egyptians wouldn't shoot to kill .
Israel , do us all a favour ...

A pro-Hamas group said it would hold a peaceful protest on Monday in which it estimated that 40,000 to 50,000 women and children would form a “human chain” human shield stretching the length of the Gaza Strip.

Had to correct that.

Ma Duce. M-2 heavy machine gun.

Rake the crowds until they go away.

There is no reason that Hamas should be successful at storming the border. None whatsoever.

re: #3 Gordon Marock

/ The children of Gaza are merely trying to build bridges toward peace.

...like an army of ants build bridges across a small stream of water.

I dinged the Debka version of this story earlier but it seems other sources are reporting the same thing now.

To any Reuters personnel who may see this item -

Please accept my protest of the obvious bias in the piece. It is very one sided and unbalanced.

To wit:

The head of the Popular Anti-Siege Committee protest organisers, Jamal al-Khudary, said: “We do not have intentions of approaching the fence, either in the north or the south. We hope all the participants will abide by the instructions and we will try to prevent any violations.”

So where is the quote from the Unpopular Anti-Siege Committee?

re: #7 Iron Fist

They're herding kids ahead of them, which makes that impossible.

The disgusting thing is, this blatant piece of atrocity staging will be treated as an "over-reaction" by the Israelis.

re: #1 jaunte

I will take bets the Islamicnuts will be standing behind the women and children launching rockets and throwing grenades with their human shields getting killed.
And Israel will be the barbarians for killing the women and children while defending themselves.
AP Headline
IDF killing women and children for no reason !

Just put mine fields on the border between Israel and Gaza and problem solved.

re: #7 Iron Fist

Ma Duce. M-2 heavy machine gun.

Rake the crowds until they go away.

There is no reason that Hamas should be successful at storming the border. None whatsoever.

Can't used the M2 on personnel. But you can use it on their equipment.

Aim for their Official Hamas Headbands.

I think I saw this story at Debka earlier.......

re: #11 Dianna

The disgusting thing is, this blatant piece of atrocity staging will be treated as an "over-reaction" by the Israelis.

Which is exactly why hamas is doing it.

Hey Charles,

That's one big ol' ugly protest, sounds like. What are the signs they're preparing to attack, though?

I'm not saying it won't happen -- a breach is likely, I'd say -- but I'm just curious if there are concrete plans of an attack.

re: #13 justnobody

They'll give the kids copies of the koran and march them over the minefield. It's happened before.

re: #11 Dianna

Tear gas, rubber bullets, etc will handle the problem nicely.

re: #18 Dianna

They'll give the kids copies of the koran and march them over the minefield. It's happened before.

And what are the kids gonna do with all those virgins?

re: #16 Sharmuta

Yes.

But even the bloody Europeans should eventually figure out how this is being done. Though it may require many, many women and children shot in the back by Hamas to bring it to their attention.

...we are absolutely unwilling to countenance a situation where the fence is breached like it was at Rafah...

The leaders of Hamasistan have been warned, and if blood flows it will be on their hands. It's sickening to think so many Legacy Media ™ outlets and LLLs will blame the Israelis when the Paleos use children as shields.

re: #19 Killgore Trout

We can hope.

Bean-bags, btw, work better than rubber bullets - which can put out an eye.

re: #20 LeftJustAintRight

Think of it this way: the virgins will be glad of the rest.

re: #22 Jack Reacher

...we are absolutely unwilling to countenance a situation where the fence is breached like it was at Rafah...

The leaders of Hamasistan have been warned, and if blood flows it will be on their hands. It's sickening to think so many Legacy Media ™ outlets and LLLs will blame the Israelis when the Paleos use children as shields.

The stories are already written. All they are going to have to do is fill in the dates.

re: #20 LeftJustAintRight

re: #18 Dianna

They'll give the kids copies of the koran and march them over the minefield. It's happened before.

And what are the kids gonna do with all those virgins?

No, no, you've got it wrong; the kids are the virgins (For future splodeydopes).

re: #23 Dianna

You said "Hope"
Drink!

Hmmm Israel should line up their military on the border and do what the Egyptians claimed they were going to do, shoot to kill anyone who attempted to cross the border.

re: #17 Cognito
Carl has some links from reliable sources.....
IDF bracing for breach of Gaza 'fence'

They are going to play right into the moonbat rage when they force their own children to die for what essentially is a publicity stunt calculated for world outrage. Although I do pity the little ones caught up in this insanity that is the Pali/Islam marketing machine, we will be directly up against this kind of depravity soon enough. God Bless the IDF and what they are about to face.

Why don't the Israelis just erect huge posters/billboards of Rosie O'Donnell in a bikini? That outta repel any mass of people.

On second thought, that might just clear Gaza entirely. Hmm.....:thinking:.....

re: #19 Killgore Trout

re: #11 Dianna

Tear gas, rubber bullets, etc will handle the problem nicely.

Napalm would work so much better...

re: #26 Jack Reacher

re: #20 LeftJustAintRight

re: #18 Dianna

They'll give the kids copies of the koran and march them over the minefield. It's happened before.

And what are the kids gonna do with all those virgins?

No, no, you've got it wrong; the kids are the virgins (For future splodeydopes).
Why don't those Berkly nuts go stand in for the kids
I would admire them for that

re: #31 ornery elephant

Why don't the Israelis just erect huge posters/billboards of Rosie O'Donnell in a bikini? That outta repel any mass of people.

On second thought, that might just clear Gaza entirely. Hmm.....:thinking:.....

Not gonna happen. Contrary to MSM reporting, the Israelis will not commit war crimes.

Organisers said Hamas-controlled schools across Gaza would get time off to allow students to take part in the protest.

Their version of "take your child to work" day.

This looks like another no-win scenario for Israel. It will take massive amounts of tear gas and rubber bullets to knock down an assault like the Pali's are contemplating. I pray the Palis, or Hamas think about the results of such an assault. On second thought, I am sure the Hamas has thought everything through very carefully, and considering the Hamas's attitude towards propaganda and death of "innocent civilians" in their war against Israel, its a done deal. Even if Israel use the same tactics the US uses in Iraq, taking military casualties to minimize civilian casualties, Reuters and the western MSM will take Israel to the cleaners for any civilian casualties incurred in the assault. Even if Israel kills no one, you can almost be assured that the Pali's will kill a few civi's just to add to the "drama" of the event, and western media will broadcast every allegation by the Hamas as gospel, whilst doubting anything the Israelis report. I really detest western journalism, it is an occupation of liars and hypocrites.

re: #28 doriangrey

Hmmm Israel should line up their military on the border and do what the Egyptians claimed they were going to do, shoot to kill anyone who attempted to cross the border.

I think they will use smoke, water cannons, rubber bullets, and other less lethal methods and control the situation just fine. You will notice I said LESS LETHAL, since any mass movement of indisciplined peoples is inherently dangerous.

"40,000 to 50,000 women and children would form a “human chain” stretching the length of the Gaza Strip."

Could Islamists possibly be more cowardly?

re: #27 BulgarWheat

A sip of coffee will suffice, won't it? It's a stimulant, after all!

re: #34 Jack Reacher

re: #31 ornery elephant

Why don't the Israelis just erect huge posters/billboards of Rosie O'Donnell in a bikini? That outta repel any mass of people.

On second thought, that might just clear Gaza entirely. Hmm.....:thinking:.....

Not gonna happen. Contrary to MSM reporting, the Israelis will not commit war crimes.

hahaha Jack! Touche' !

re: #31 ornery elephant

Why don't the Israelis just erect huge posters/billboards of Rosie O'Donnell in a bikini? That outta repel any mass of people.

On second thought, that might just clear Gaza entirely. Hmm.....:thinking:.....

Damn OE you might have just solved the Palestinian problem...Now if anyone in Israel had the balls to do it...

This is not really a "peace protest". These are simply human shields for terrorists who will try to kidnap Israeli citizens and for potential suicide bombers.

re: #26 Jack Reacher

The kids are 90 feet tall; and have translucent alabaster skin/muscles so that you can see their skeletons moving? All identical per islamist's choice after death?

no, tear gas and bullets will not suffice
when this human wave comes in from the West/Gaza
the Hezbollassholes will start attacking from the north
just when the IDF is bogged down on the Gaza border
then Syria and Iran will join in

this could be something big

Israle may not only have to shoot the kids/women in Gaza
but send a nuclear message to Damascus and/or Tehran

re: #40 Dianna

What ever works best.

re: #35 solomonpanting

Organisers said Hamas-controlled schools across Gaza would get time off to allow students to take part in the protest.

Their version of "take your child to work" day.

I laughed and then wanted to cry. Really.

re: #23 Dianna

Bean-bags, btw, work better than rubber bullets - which can put out an eye.

They really need this.

re: #32 doriangrey

On children? And women with no choice?

I don't think so.

And remember: Napalm sticks to kids is not a motivational phrase.

I wonder if the Jew Eating Rabbit will show up to entertain the troops .. uh .. I mean kids.

The evil in the world via islam hasn't had its blood-lust slaked enough of late.

re: #45 Adrenalyn

no, tear gas and bullets will not suffice
when this human wave comes in from the West/Gaza
the Hezbollassholes will start attacking from the north
just when the IDF is bogged down on the Gaza border
then Syria and Iran will join in

this could be something big

Israle may not only have to shoot the kids/women in Gaza
but send a nuclear message to Damascus and/or Tehran

Crap you could very well be right... There have been indications that Syria has been planning a military assault against Israel every since Israel took out their clandestine nuclear weapons facility last year...

Threads such as this seem to bring out the kill 'em all attitudes that make lurking tough somedays.

y'all might want to tone it down a little

If Hamas is going to breach the border, at least they're prepared to be gentlemanly about it -- women and children first.

/s

re: #6 cookielady

A pro-Hamas group said it would hold a peaceful protest on Monday in which it estimated that 40,000 to 50,000 women and children would form a “human chain” human shield stretching the length of the Gaza Strip.

Had to correct that.

This is getting sickening. This pro-hamas group plans a peaceful protest by using unarmed women and children as a human chain, rather - shield? And then, when the brave leaders (otherwise known as the "steering committe") ,in back of the line force them forward, what then?
Yes, I know. Blame will then fall on Israel for the slaughter of peaceful civilians.
Israel, you're damned if you do, and damned if you don't.

re: #53 Stonemason

Threads such as this seem to bring out the kill 'em all attitudes that make lurking tough somedays.

y'all those so inclined might want to tone it down a little

re: #53 Stonemason

Threads such as this seem to bring out the kill 'em all attitudes that make lurking tough somedays.

y'all might want to tone it down a little

Point well taken.

re: #49 Dianna

re: #32 doriangrey

On children? And women with no choice?

I don't think so.

And remember: Napalm sticks to kids is not a motivational phrase.

Doesn't have to be on them, just as a barrier between them and the border. Napalm burns for quite a while, all Israel needs to do is napalm their side of the border, the Pali hordes are not charging through the flames.

re: #11 Dianna,

We have to harden our hearts. The enemy is willing to cause any level of atrocity.

We have to be willing to meet them with it. Certainly, we should kill the leaders first, wherever we can.

I have always advocated the extermination of Hamas. All of them. They are slime who would march children into M-2 fire.

Kill all of them, and we don't have to worry about what we would do about a human wave headed by children.

What would Israel do now if they hadn't built that wall that every lib complained was awful toward the palis. Good thing they did build it.
What mischief would they do if they do storm through? Every muslim country supports the palis making trouble but won't give them one acre of the damn desert they own. They don't want'em either.

re: #52 doriangrey

re: #45 Adrenalyn

no, tear gas and bullets will not suffice
when this human wave comes in from the West/Gaza
the Hezbollassholes will start attacking from the north
just when the IDF is bogged down on the Gaza border
then Syria and Iran will join in

this could be something big

Israle may not only have to shoot the kids/women in Gaza
but send a nuclear message to Damascus and/or Tehran

Crap you could very well be right... There have been indications that Syria has been planning a military assault against Israel every since Israel took out their clandestine nuclear weapons facility last year...

If this breach actually occurs, you bet it'll be a diversion for the actual Hizballah attack.

re: #47 Daisy

re: #35 solomonpanting

Organisers said Hamas-controlled schools across Gaza would get time off to allow students to take part in the protest.

Their version of "take your child to work" day.

I laughed and then wanted to cry. Really.

Beyond sad, huh?

"the Popular Anti-Siege Committee"

Also called the Rachel Corrie birgade.

I think I have the answer to this. When the hundreds of thousands are massed at the border fence, pushing at the wall...the Israelis bomb out some abandoned 1992 Dodge Aspen some tenth of a mile BEHIND the massed palis. This will instigate the inevitable scream of "Allahu AckbarCarSwarm" and the thousands will immediately turn and sprint back to the burning vehicle abandoning all plans for any push into Israel.

re: #39 Daisy,

No. Muslim "men" are ALL cowards. It is simply part of being a Mohammedan. You follow your "Prophet" who was the Supreme Coward.

In addition to being a pedophile, although those are perhaps synonymous.

re: #56 Stonemason

re: #53 Stonemason

Threads such as this seem to bring out the kill 'em all attitudes that make lurking tough somedays.

y'all those so inclined might want to tone it down a little

Should the Israeli's also tone down their concern regarding an emanate invasion by Palestinians lead by women and children while armed and murderous terrorists calmly carry their bombs and guns in the midst of the human shield?

Fill a ditch with pig carcasses. Build a fence just towards the Israeli side, and cover it with lard.

Car swarm lol

re: #64 ornery elephant

I take it some 1992 Dodge Aspen gave you headaches and sapped your cash...

re: #45 Adrenalyn

no, tear gas and bullets will not suffice
when this human wave comes in from the West/Gaza
the Hezbollassholes will start attacking from the north
just when the IDF is bogged down on the Gaza border
then Syria and Iran will join in

this could be something big

Israle may not only have to shoot the kids/women in Gaza
but send a nuclear message to Damascus and/or Tehran

I think you are over reacting with nuclear weapons. A cluster bomb will annihilate all life with a quarter mile. And the Israelis know how to use them. I believe this is going to be more of a rubber bullet, water cannon, tear gas response. I understand there are some new acoustic weapons that would be effective in repelling this type of assault. The Israeli military has never been afraid to "think outside the box" and apply innovative responses to attacks.

re: #68 buzzsawmonkey

Again: a minefield along the Gaza border--except at the checkpoints--will solve this problem.

The advantage of a minefield is that it endangers nobody unless they themselves decide to enter it.

Fortify the checkpoints and mine the rest. Problem over.

They'll do like the Iranians did in the Iran-Iraq war, and send the children through the minefields. No one criticized Iran or Iraq for that, but they'll still criticize Israel.

re: #67 Kosh's Shadow

Now, there's a thought.

re: #70 Roger

re: #64 ornery elephant

I take it some 1992 Dodge Aspen gave you headaches and sapped your cash...

Must have, he sure dont like 1992 Dodge Aspens, to quote Steve Martin from the Jerk...He hates 1992 Dodge Aspens....OK sort of quote...

re: #66 doriangrey

Israels reaction to anything Hamas does is up to Israel, calling for teh death of people on a blog is wrong, especially the innocents that will be in the line of fire

sorry, just my opinion and I will wait for the next thread.

re: #68 buzzsawmonkey,

Works for me. Perhaps a tripple layer minefield. Non-leathal at the outside, frag in the middle, and gas on the innermost side.

A real deterrant.

israel is must have the will to survive and do what it takes to insure that. otherwise, bad people who have bad plans for them will decide their future.

This is one of the biggest fundamental differences between them and us.
We would never allow our children to be put in such danger.
Where are the human rights activist now?
Oh wait, now I remember they're busy writing up the U.S for our racist treatment of Middle Easterners. It's put your child in danger day in palestine and thats a-okay in their book.

The Palestinians would love nothing more that to martyr 1000's of women and children. The Israelis won't give them the satisfaction. It's not going to happen.

re: #73 BulgarWheat

re: #67 Kosh's Shadow

Now, there's a thought.

Except the Jew's are almost as troubled by pork as the Muslims. So who exactly would do the work and where would the pork come from?

re: #56 Stonemason

re: #53 Stonemason

Threads such as this seem to bring out the kill 'em all attitudes that make lurking tough somedays.

y'all those so inclined might want to tone it down a little

And there is always the 'click the football'/ notify Charles option to employ towards those who choose not to practice reasonable impulse control.

It seems only America and Israel ever have to consider world opinion when defending themselves.

At this point, might as well get PETA totally pissed off and into the fray.
Shooting live pigs from cannons into the crowd would do that and be effective in so many other ways.
Just trying to think outside of the box.

I don't think Olmert will be able to make it in person if Hamas carries through with this. He'll be in Japan with the major American supporter of Hamas -Condi Rice:

"Prime Minister Ehud Olmert and US Secretary of State Condoleezza Rice will hold a surprise meeting during their two respective state visits to Japan next week, it was announced Friday, even though Rice is scheduled to travel to Israel the following week.

Government official estimated that the meeting, arranged at Rice's request, would focus on the crisis in the Gaza Strip and that the secretary of state would express her concern over the humanitarian situation in the territory."

[Link: www.jpost.com...]

It's expected Rice will demand that Israel move forward with "peace" talks with the Palestinians.

re: #79 Killgore Trout

The Palestinians would love nothing more that to martyr 1000's of women and children. The Israelis won't give them the satisfaction. It's not going to happen.

If anything does, I really fear it will be Hamas shooting their civilians in the back. And then the stringers will report that it was done by the Israelis.

Think the ambulance caper.

re: #80 doriangrey

I'm Christian, and I love pork. I'll volunteer. Bet there's a ton of Lizards here that would be willing to help too.

Lizards, doing jobs that Israeli's aren't willing to do...........

/utmost sarcasm tag

re: #62 solomonpanting

"Beyond sad, huh?"

Yes, it's a deliberately planned tragedy - in other words, an atrocity.

re: #79 Killgore Trout,

Which is why I advocate killing Hamas. All of them.

It doesn't make sense to say "This guy is a lower level Hamas Terrorist, so we won't kill him."

Non-lethal alternatives may be appropriate.
Free-roaming black dogs.
Bacon bits fired from cannons.
Porn dropped from planes.

The French had the Maginot line. Gaza can have the Pork Lard Line

re: #80 doriangrey

re: #73 BulgarWheat

re: #67 Kosh's Shadow

Now, there's a thought.

Except the Jew's are almost as troubled by pork as the Muslims. So who exactly would do the work and where would the pork come from?

Well if you haven't been in Israel lately, there is quite a bit of " white meat( white meat = pork) "available to secular Israelis than you would ever imagine!

re: #86 BulgarWheat

Shabbos goy!

re: #93 Killgore Trout

yeah, can't escape the goyism.

re: #75 Stonemason

re: #66 doriangrey

Israels reaction to anything Hamas does is up to Israel, calling for teh death of people on a blog is wrong, especially the innocents that will be in the line of fire

sorry, just my opinion and I will wait for the next thread.

Except that we all know that no matter what Israel does they will be crucified in the MSM. I suppose had blogs existed in 1939 and you read post where people were calling for the death of Hitler and the Nazi's you would also be offended. You need to understand something here. There are NO INNOCENT Palestinians. Even their children are willing subjects in this. They are indoctrinated from birth that to kill Israels and Jews is to please Allah.

Gaza is foreign territory, which is actually at war with Israel. Anyone who tries to cross the border from Gaza should be shot. Why endenger Israeli lives in the name of the enemy's supposed human rights?

re: #90 buzzsawmonkey

"...However, the up-close view of Hamassholes driving children into a minefield may just possibly wake some people up to just what Hamas actually is."

Not a chance that would happen.

I'm certain if the Leftists at the New York Times weren't too busy fantasizing about John McCain's imagined sex life, they would have time to find the answer to a question that puzzles the hell out of me.

On one side is Israel, with Jews who Hamas/"Palestinians" want to slaughter and eat. On the other side are their supporters and brethren, the Egyptians.

If the Jews close one door because they really don't want to be on the Hamas menu, why is it considered a siege when the other door leads to fellow Arabs- who love them and support them in every which way and should be happy to provide them with all their needs- even if only to prove that they not like those evil Zionists.

re: #52 doriangrey

re: #45 Adrenalyn

no, tear gas and bullets will not suffice
when this human wave comes in from the West/Gaza
the Hezbollassholes will start attacking from the north
just when the IDF is bogged down on the Gaza border
then Syria and Iran will join in

this could be something big

Israle may not only have to shoot the kids/women in Gaza
but send a nuclear message to Damascus and/or Tehran

Crap you could very well be right... There have been indications that Syria has been planning a military assault against Israel every since Israel took out their clandestine nuclear weapons facility last year...

that and stay off Europe bound/origin airplanes
eventually they're going to pull something off
if not now, look just before or after the November elections in the US

re: #85 Dianna

re: #79 Killgore Trout

The Palestinians would love nothing more that to martyr 1000's of women and children. The Israelis won't give them the satisfaction. It's not going to happen.

If anything does, I really fear it will be Hamas shooting their civilians in the back. And then the stringers will report that it was done by the Israelis.

Think the ambulance caper.

I'm thinking al Dura.

re: #92 Nevergiveup

re: #80 doriangrey

re: #73 BulgarWheat

re: #67 Kosh's Shadow

Now, there's a thought.

Except the Jew's are almost as troubled by pork as the Muslims. So who exactly would do the work and where would the pork come from?

Well if you haven't been in Israel lately, there is quite a bit of " white meat( white meat = pork) "available to secular Israelis than you would ever imagine!

I am surprised....

re: #98 opinionated

Because you've entered that strange place where logic and reasoning do not apply.

You cannot adjust the horizontal or the vertical.

You have entered.... Israeli double standard time (tm all rights reserved Meryl yourish).

re: #86 BulgarWheat

re: #80 doriangrey

I'm Christian, and I love pork. I'll volunteer. Bet there's a ton of Lizards here that would be willing to help too.

Me too! Me too! Me too!

re: #95 doriangrey

I must disagree. Emphatically, even.

Children may be indoctrinated, but they remain innocent. There is a line, and it's a bad idea to cross it.

Doesn't have to be on them, just as a barrier between them and the border. Napalm burns for quite a while, all Israel needs to do is napalm their side of the border, the Pali hordes are not charging through the flames.

The women and children haven't been taught to jump through the rings of fire yet.

re: #80 doriangrey

Except the Jew's are almost as troubled by pork as the Muslims. So who exactly would do the work and where would the pork come from?

The Jew is forbidden to eat pork, The muslim, IIRC, is forbidden to even touch it.

(And, if they needed someone to lock and load, I'd do it!)

_{Now, I'm going out to breakfast where, oddly enough, I'll be having...pork chops!}

re: #100 lawhawk

Also an excellent example.

re: #98 opinionated

the other door leads to fellow Arabs- who love them and support them in every which way and should be happy to provide them with all their needs

Was that intended as sarcasm?

MJ (#97),

re: #90 buzzsawmonkey

"...However, the up-close view of Hamassholes driving children into a minefield may just possibly wake some people up to just what Hamas actually is."

Not a chance that would happen.

Undoubtedly the headlines would read: Isreal Forces Hamas to Force Children into Minefield.

re: #80 doriangrey

re: #73 BulgarWheat

re: #67 Kosh's Shadow

Now, there's a thought.

Except the Jew's are almost as troubled by pork as the Muslims. So who exactly would do the work and where would the pork come from?

Send our illegal aliens there and have them lay down a line of tamales. That should take care of that.

re: #109 Geepers

MJ (#97),

re: #90 buzzsawmonkey

"...However, the up-close view of Hamassholes driving children into a minefield may just possibly wake some people up to just what Hamas actually is."

Not a chance that would happen.

Undoubtedly the headlines would read: Isreal Forces Hamas to Force Children into Minefield.

Yup, exactly. Every ill in the entire Middle East, let alone with the Palestinians, is easily traced back to the "occupation".

re: #104 Dianna

re: #95 doriangrey

I must disagree. Emphatically, even.

Children may be indoctrinated, but they remain innocent. There is a line, and it's a bad idea to cross it.

Indoctinated children are the lifeblood of the Palestinians, while the children may be innocent in the fact they are unwillingly and unknowingly being indoctrinated. Once indoctrinated and old enough to kill, they become the enemy and innocence is just another empty word for public consumption.

re: #104 Dianna

re: #95 doriangrey

I must disagree. Emphatically, even.

Children may be indoctrinated, but they remain innocent. There is a line, and it's a bad idea to cross it.

And you would be sadly and profoundly mistaken...

Oh and the second link translated into English...

Ten-year sister cuts back A ten-year one cut back its two years older sister erstochen in an Egyptian village and, because him its schoolmates had gehaenselt. How the Kairoer daily paper "Egyptian Gazette" reported on Friday, the other children had told him, his sister sleep with young men of the village. Rami, which up-played itself after the death of the father as a "man in the house", firstoh therefore its sister Samah in the sleep. In order to be safe that she was really dead, it separated it with a kitchen measurer the head. Subsequently, he washed the knife and put again to bed. The nut/mother found the corpse in the morning. Its sister "entehrt" the family, said the boy later with the verhoer. "I only did, what is correct."

re: #110 Gumby

re: #80 doriangrey

re: #73 BulgarWheat

re: #67 Kosh's Shadow
Now, there's a thought.

Except the Jew's are almost as troubled by pork as the Muslims. So who exactly would do the work and where would the pork come from?

Send our illegal aliens there and have them lay down a line of tamales. That should take care of that.

How about loudspeakers lining the Israeli side, broadcasting Arkansas football fans callin' th' hogs?

re: #108 pre-Boomer Marine brat

re: #98 opinionated

the other door leads to fellow Arabs- who love them and support them in every which way and should be happy to provide them with all their needs

Was that intended as sarcasm?

I'll get back to you.

I need to consult Bush and Rice and Tony Blair- and so many others- who tell me that all the Arabs and Islamics hate us and all the problems in the Mideast are the result of the pain and anguish and sympathy the Arabs feel for how their beloved 'Palestinians' are treated by Israel.

re: #111 MJ

re: #109 Geepers

MJ (#97),

re: #90 buzzsawmonkey

"...However, the up-close view of Hamassholes driving children into a minefield may just possibly wake some people up to just what Hamas actually is."

Not a chance that would happen.

Undoubtedly the headlines would read: Isreal Forces Hamas to Force Children into Minefield.

Yup, exactly. Every ill in the entire Middle East, let alone with the Palestinians, is easily traced back to the "occupation".

AS the whole lefty world ignores the larger picture that we are ALL considered "occupiers "of dar Islam and the global caliphate by the loving peeps following the cowardly Koran to the letter.

The Hamas/Islamist playbook operates as follows;

Use kids to prepare the battlespace. Whether it is agitprop like al Dura, or kids who are injured because they're sent out ahead of jihadis with guns to either play in the fields where kassams are launched or throw stones at Israelis as jihadis with guns lurk just behind, the Islamists see their children as nothing more than cannon fodder.

Women, elderly, and mentally deficient/ill are acceptable alternatives to children. Not nearly as good as children because children are seen as innocents, but Islamists will use women who are shaming their family/tribe by seen talking to men not related to them, or accused of adultery, etc., and told that the only way to reclaim honor is to die for the cause.

The possibility that Hamas will attempt to invade Israel takes all this in to account. Hamas will put women and children at the head of the line, knowing that Israelis are trained not to fire on women or children, even if there are terrorists in their midst. Israel's humanity and restraint will be taken advantage of by the Islamists. Again. And Again.

So, what is Israel to do. They will not open fire on the crowds or rake them. They will not mine or boobytrap the border (though the Hamas thugs may do that just to claim that Israel did so), because of the possibility of civilian injuries.

They could go after Hamas leadership, but Israel's own leadership is too concerned with making peace with Fatah thugs that they ignore the threats posed by making deals with terrorists generally.

Israel faces a no-win situation here, and it is due in part to Olmert's failures to secure Israel's borders, to stop the kassam attacks, and to maintain Israel's national security deterrent factors against jihadis.

Funds keep pouring money into this country and there is absolutely no accountability. The Pali's shut down the schools built with foreign aid money any time they want. Imagine if you made receiving aid money contingent upon certain criteria. What a mind- blowing concept. Imagine what would happen if aid money was withheld or at least decreased for each instance of financial impropriety.

This is just incomprehensible. The Kid is outside running with his dog, shouting for no good reason other than joyful abandon. I cannot wrap my mind around a mother allowing her child to be used as the Jordyptians are planning to use those children.

Moloch must be smiling in anticipation.

Fence Swarm!

re: #114 pre-Boomer Marine brat

re: #110 Gumby

re: #80 doriangrey

re: #73 BulgarWheat

re: #67 Kosh's Shadow
Now, there's a thought.

Except the Jew's are almost as troubled by pork as the Muslims. So who exactly would do the work and where would the pork come from?

Send our illegal aliens there and have them lay down a line of tamales. That should take care of that.

How about loudspeakers lining the Israeli side, broadcasting Arkansas football fans callin' th' hogs?

SOOOOO EEEEEEEEEEE PIG PIG! (Hook'em Horns, btw)

The problem with all this, as usual, it boils down to perception. The general perception in the EU and even a growing perception in the US State Department ( I personally disavow all relations with that part of our Gov. )is that Israel has been to harsh with Gaza. It seems they all want Israel to back off, open up all the crossings, and just smile as the missiles rain down on their towns and kibbutzim. It tends to put Israel between a rock and a hard place, which wiser leaders then presently in power in Israel have found it hard to navigate.

re: #115 opinionated

(-: NOWWW I get your drift!

The Arabs have used the "Palestinian" common people far worse than anyone else has, even the PA.

re: #121 Gumby

Bear Down!

re: #122 buzzsawmonkey

What some people say about Israel being blamed for minefield casualties is very likely true.

However, to the extent that a minefield would prevent the mass influx Hamas is planning, without endangering or traumatizing Israeli soldiers while at the same time reducing the hostile population works for me.

Would work for me as well, let the Palestinians kill themselves.

re: #80 doriangrey

re: #73 BulgarWheat

re: #67 Kosh's Shadow

Now, there's a thought.

Except the Jew's are almost as troubled by pork as the Muslims. So who exactly would do the work and where would the pork come from?

Jews are forbidden from eating pork, and contact with pig carcasses does make one ritually impure (to offer sacrifices), but no one is ritually pure today anyway, and since there is no Temple, this isn't much of a problem.

A few dozen F16's doing fly by's at around 200' ought to send the Pali's running home.

re: #90 buzzsawmonkey

re: #72 Kosh's Shadow

The Iran-Iraq war was "distant"; nobody in the West really gave much attention to "those countries" way back when.

Yes, Israel will be blamed, but Israel is always blamed. However, the up-close view of Hamassholes driving children into a minefield may just possibly wake some people up to just what Hamas actually is. More to the point, the Arabs who get to watch their children get blown to bits just over the next rise may lose a little of their support for Hamas.

Who's going to show those pictures on TV and newspapers? Maybe Fox, but certainly not the BBC, Al-Guardian, or the NY Slimes.

re: #118 gman

"Funds keep pouring money into this country ..."

Never was an independent country called Palestine...

re: #112 LoFlyer

How about we wait until they actually commit a crime?

I'm really not patient with that line of thinking.

Unfortunately, this will be a media disaster for Israel. for any other country, repulsion of this "invasion" by any means, including weapons fire, would be deemed appropriate. If the Israelis harm one child, the media will be up in arms about "war crimes", "excessive force", etc..
Despite this, I think that Israel should be prepared to use all, repeat all, necessary force to maintain their integrity. PS - Tell the IDF to switch to full automatic.

re: #117 lawhawk,

What you are really saying is that Israel will lose. Once Hamas successfully storms the border, it is all over with. The Jews migh as well flee to America, because at least we won't try to exterminate them.

And that is exactly what Hamas has in mind.

People cringe when I say exterminate Hamas, but all I am doing is echoing Hamas' rhetoric back at them.

Why has no one asked why I hate Hamas?

re: #29 Killgore Trout

re: #17 Cognito
Carl has some links from reliable sources.....
IDF bracing for breach of Gaza 'fence'

Interesting. I'm not quite seeing concrete plans of attack -- more the fear of attack -- but history gives us good reason not to expect Hamas to stage a peaceful hand-holding expression of discontent.

We'll see, I guess.

re: #71 LoFlyer

re: #45 Adrenalyn

no, tear gas and bullets will not suffice
when this human wave comes in from the West/Gaza
the Hezbollassholes will start attacking from the north
just when the IDF is bogged down on the Gaza border
then Syria and Iran will join in

this could be something big

Israle may not only have to shoot the kids/women in Gaza
but send a nuclear message to Damascus and/or Tehran

I think you are over reacting with nuclear weapons. A cluster bomb will annihilate all life with a quarter mile. And the Israelis know how to use them. I believe this is going to be more of a rubber bullet, water cannon, tear gas response. I understand there are some new acoustic weapons that would be effective in repelling this type of assault. The Israeli military has never been afraid to "think outside the box" and apply innovative responses to attacks.

well, I am not so sure
Iran has said many times they will annihilate Israel when they have the capability and that beside that, just plain often state that Israel should be wiped out
but if the Gaza wave happens, and is a diversion for an assault from Hezbollah and/or other states
then Israel may have to resort to some drastic measures
and I don't think cluster bombs will suffice
if it were just the Gaza and Lobabomb borders
Hamas and Hezbollah, you could maintain control with conventional weapons but not with other forces entering the fight

re: #125 pre-Boomer Marine brat

re: #121 Gumby

Bear Down!

Who shot 'im?

re: #131 Dianna

re: #112 LoFlyer

How about we wait until they actually commit a crime?

I'm really not patient with that line of thinking.

What do you mean wait until they have committed a crime? They have done nothing for the last 40 years but commit crime after crime. It's not a matter of if they are going to commit a crime only where and when.

re: #133 Iron Fist

re: #117 lawhawk,

"Why has no one asked why I hate Hamas?

"

Okay, why do you hate Hamass?

re: #136 Gumby

re: #125 pre-Boomer Marine brat

re: #121 Gumby

Bear Down!

Who shot 'im?

It's cryptic. University of Arizona. (I'm a Lute Olson fan.)

Iron Fist,

People cringe when I say exterminate Hamas...

Not me. I applaud.

What? The Islamic model country is not Paradise?

even if this is not a diversion for the all-out assault
you can bet it is at least a dry run for the eventual

re: #95 doriangrey

There are NO INNOCENT Palestinians. Even their children are willing subjects in this. They are indoctrinated from birth that to kill Israels and Jews is to please Allah.

So?

What are you advocating?

Take your time.

re: #142 Adrenalyn

even if this is not a diversion for the all-out assault
you can bet it is at least a dry run for the eventual

Yup, pretty much a guarantee there...

re: #75 Stonemason

re: #66 doriangrey

Israels reaction to anything Hamas does is up to Israel, calling for teh death of people on a blog is wrong, especially the innocents that will be in the line of fire

sorry, just my opinion and I will wait for the next thread.

I will call for the death of our enemies on blogs, on TV, on the radio, on the phone, and on my front lawn. All of our enemies. I want them all dead.

Too bad you have a problem with killing those that are out to kill you.

re: #143 Cognito

re: #95 doriangrey

There are NO INNOCENT Palestinians. Even their children are willing subjects in this. They are indoctrinated from birth that to kill Israels and Jews is to please Allah.

So?

What are you advocating?

Take your time.

I am not suggesting anything. I am making a solidly backed up statement. What are you suggesting. Until the Palestinians cease this behavior they all fully deserve whatever happens to them. Put a bomb on a five year old and send him near my family or friends and I'll shoot him dead on the spot, period.

But what is Israel to do in this situation?
What can Israel do to diminish the Hamas propaganda from this move?

re: #147 doriangrey

re: #143 Cognito

re: #95 doriangrey

There are NO INNOCENT Palestinians. Even their children are willing subjects in this. They are indoctrinated from birth that to kill Israels and Jews is to please Allah.

So?

What are you advocating?

Take your time.

I am not suggesting anything. I am making a solidly backed up statement. What are you suggesting. Until the Palestinians cease this behavior they all fully deserve whatever happens to them. Put a bomb on a five year old and send him near my family or friends and I'll shoot him dead on the spot, period.

Well that's fine. What about the five-year-old without a bomb?

He's a Palestinian, as you said, also. What does he deserve?

re: #119 MandyManners

This is just incomprehensible. The Kid is outside running with his dog, shouting for no good reason other than joyful abandon. I cannot wrap my mind around a mother allowing her child to be used as the Jordyptians are planning to use those children.

Moloch must be smiling in anticipation.

I know what you're saying. I wonder if comprehending the full extent of evil with our minds is even possible? Maybe it's more possible to accept the fact that human beings are fully capable of being caught in the grip of what they hate about themselves and therefore, cowardly project that self-hate onto others. We need to pay attention to the data (in this case, a willingness to murder one's own children in order to deny one's own failure to thrive) and act accordingly.

IMO, the Jews discovered a moral code like no other - which makes them targets of all peoples who would prefer to live by lower codes of behavior. Do you think this is a battle of good (or consciousness) vs (unconsciousness) evil or do you think that may be too simplistic?

The always-objective L.A. Times has an article today telling how the Israelis killed some Arab "picnickers" in Gaza with a missile strike:

Three Palestinian men picnicking in a field in the northern Gaza Strip were killed Saturday by an Israeli tank missile, said a Palestinian official and relatives of the dead.

Three male "picknickers", ages 23, 25 and 26, just enjoying their tea together when those nasty Israelis ended the idyll with missiles. I guess all-male "picnics" are a palestinian pastime I hadn't heard much about. We all know how those muslims love their downtime.

But read further...

Khalil Zaaneen, a cousin of the student, said the field is part of his family's farm and is near sites used by militants to fire rockets and mortar shells across Israel's border, about 500 yards away. He said the family does not condone the rocket fire.

Ah! The "picnickers" happened to choose a picnic site that someone was using at that very moment to fire rockets into Israel. Bad luck that! Did the Times' editors ever stop to think that maybe reporter "Rushdi abu Alouf" was maybe, shading the story a bit?

This is a perfect example of the reason I canceled my subscription to the Times years ago. They peddle bullshit as news.

israel's hope

[Link: www.stangoodenough.com...]

re: #149 Cognito

re: #147 doriangrey

re: #143 Cognito

re: #95 doriangrey

There are NO INNOCENT Palestinians. Even their children are willing subjects in this. They are indoctrinated from birth that to kill Israels and Jews is to please Allah.

So?

What are you advocating?

Take your time.

I am not suggesting anything. I am making a solidly backed up statement. What are you suggesting. Until the Palestinians cease this behavior they all fully deserve whatever happens to them. Put a bomb on a five year old and send him near my family or friends and I'll shoot him dead on the spot, period.

Well that's fine. What about the five-year-old without a bomb?

He's a Palestinian, as you said, also. What does he deserve?

He's a Palestinian, he's going to have a bomb. a Palestinian not brainwashed into wanting to kill Jews is like a democrat who wants America's to keep their money. It just isn't going to happen. Quit trying to play your pathetic moralist games with me. Their really is such a thing as evil, and little on this earth personifies it better than fanatical Muslims or Palestinians.

re: #133 Iron Fist

Why has no one asked why I hate Hamas?

Most of us know why and concur heartily with your hatred.

re: #153 doriangrey

He's a Palestinian, he's going to have a bomb.

Ah. I see we've moved from the realm of fact into the realm of fantasy.

No point in continuing.

The U.S. govt has spent mega$$ on this:
Active Denial - Wiki
Along with riot control tear gas, rubber bullets, etc., this situation could be a good proof-of-value for the Active Denial system. Deploy it in the south today; the Patriot system(s) deployed in the north creates a precedent for doing it.

re: #20 LeftJustAintRight

re: #18 Dianna

They'll give the kids copies of the koran and march them over the minefield. It's happened before.

And what are the kids gonna do with all those virgins?

They will get plastic keys, just as children were given during the Iraq/Iran wars. Also, remember, that's RAISINS.....72 RAISINS....kids just LOVE raisins.

re: #156 Sunlight

The U.S. govt has spent mega$$ on this:
Active Denial - Wiki
Along with riot control tear gas, rubber bullets, etc., this situation could be a good proof-of-value for the Active Denial system. Deploy it in the south today; the Patriot system(s) deployed in the north creates a precedent for doing it.

Any type of metallic foil will easily absorb and deflect the beam.

At last, a use for those tin-foil hats!

re: #149 Cognito

Disclaimer: I'm no no way defending dorian's position on this thread.

However, on a related topic; The Palestinians have really invented a new strategy. All through history leaders have surrendered when beaten. We had to nuke the Japanese twice but the leaders saw the witting on the wall and acted responsibly to protect their own citizens. The Palestinians have are trying to win by killing their own civilians. Even the Iraqi insurgency tried this tactic but the Iraqi citizens eventually got tired of it. The Palestinians have a seemingly endless capacity to suffer. As long as the citizens participate in this system, their own government will kill as many of them as possible. It's a fascinating process to watch.

re: #158 pre-Boomer Marine brat

PIMF -- the last sentence came from the Wiki article!

re: #161 buzzsawmonkey

re: #157 Jauhara al Kafirah

Also, remember, that's RAISINS.....72 RAISINS....kids just LOVE raisins.

Martyrdom is the Muslim's raisin d'etre.

BARF!
(LOL)

re: #155 Cognito

re: #153 doriangrey

He's a Palestinian, he's going to have a bomb.

Ah. I see we've moved from the realm of fact into the realm of fantasy.

No point in continuing.

No, we moved into that realm the second you pulled the moralist redirection card of what about the five year old without a bomb. You have never had a valid point so there was no point in this conversation to start with, just you and your moral relativism bullshit.

re: #1 jaunte

"40,000 to 50,000 women and children would form a “human chain” stretching the length of the Gaza Strip."

That may be a record-setting number of human shields.

Indeed, and it's just what Hamas needs to make Israel look like the monster it accuses Israel of being should the IDF be forced into a confrontation with mere women & children.

re: #159 Killgore Trout

re: #149 Cognito

Disclaimer: I'm no no way defending dorian's position on this thread.

However, on a related topic; The Palestinians have really invented a new strategy. All through history leaders have surrendered when beaten. We had to nuke the Japanese twice but the leaders saw the witting on the wall and acted responsibly to protect their own citizens. The Palestinians have are trying to win by killing their own civilians. Even the Iraqi insurgency tried this tactic but the Iraqi citizens eventually got tired of it. The Palestinians have a seemingly endless capacity to suffer. As long as the citizens participate in this system, their own government will kill as many of them as possible. It's a fascinating process to watch.

That's all true. And horrifying to watch.

re: #80 doriangrey

No, Jews are not comparable to Muslims on the subject of aversion to pigs.

In the laws on kosher food, the pig is only one of a number of animals that are not edible. That does not make it an object of superstition. The horse is also not edible, but there is no inhibition about riding a horse.

The reason that the pig has become particularly prominent as "not kosher" is that Judeophobes have historically tried to force Jews to eat pig meat as a way of renouncing their own lawa, or they have used refraining from pig-meat as a way of identifying Jews -- as done by the Spanish Inquisition.

Also, the pig is considered different from other domesticated animals in that it is of no use to mankind while it is alive. It does not give milk, eggs, wool, fleece, labor, or transportation. It is bred for no other purpose than to kill it, and that thought can cause some squeamishness about it.

re: #163 doriangrey

I have to admit I'm curious how you're using the phrase "moral relativism." What two things am I relating, precisely?

re: #160 pre-Boomer Marine brat

re: #158 pre-Boomer Marine brat

PIMF -- the last sentence came from the Wiki article!

Even if... you think they have enough foil to cover lots of people head to toe?

re: #101 doriangrey

re: #92 Nevergiveup

re: #80 doriangrey

re: #73 BulgarWheat

re: #67 Kosh's Shadow

Now, there's a thought.

Except the Jew's are almost as troubled by pork as the Muslims. So who exactly would do the work and where would the pork come from?

Well if you haven't been in Israel lately, there is quite a bit of " white meat( white meat = pork) "available to secular Israelis than you would ever imagine!

I am surprised....

Friends who have spent time in Israel tell me that all one needs to do to acquire pork is to shop at a Christian market.

re: #167 Cognito

re: #163 doriangrey

I have to admit I'm curious how you're using the phrase "moral relativism." What two things am I relating, precisely?

Actually, don't worry about it -- moving along.

- C

re: #138 Daisy,

Because they are scum. Because they kill children and call it good. Because they teach children to hate, and call it good.

Because they want to destroy Israel. I doubt America is more than a cypher to them. They hate us, but the same way a man hates mosquitoes. We don't do anything to them really, we just are.

And I hate them for that, too. Every time they have "Death to America" get togethers, I want us to bomb them.

Good enough?

re: #168 Sunlight

re: #160 pre-Boomer Marine brat

re: #158 pre-Boomer Marine brat

PIMF -- the last sentence came from the Wiki article!

Even if... you think they have enough foil to cover lots of people head to toe?

Oh, you're right. I was being cute with the tinfoil-hat reference.

re: #167 Cognito

re: #163 doriangrey

I have to admit I'm curious how you're using the phrase "moral relativism." What two things am I relating, precisely?

Oh please you are pathetic. Moral relativism isn't about comparing two moral situations, its a philosophy where morals are dictated by situations rather than absolutes. Teaching ones children that killing innocent people because Allah will be pleased is absolutly evil. When all polls ever taken show that 80 percent of Palestinians give active approval to efforts to commit genocide against Israel's Jews and the other 20 percent give passive support there is simply no possible way morally ethically or logically to suggest that any Palestinian is innocent of intent to to take action or support the killing of innocent Israeli citizens.

re: #173 doriangrey

Teaching ones children that killing innocent people because Allah will be pleased is absolutly evil.

Of course it is. I haven't said otherwise, and never would.

But this makes the parents evil, not the children.

What would a breach in the Gaza-Israel fence mean? Wouldn't it be sealed relatively quickly regardless?

re: #174 Cognito

It quickly makes the children evil. Doesn't take long.

re: #176 Roger

re: #174 Cognito

It quickly makes the children evil. Doesn't take long.

No, it doesn't. Evil is a choice. Someone incapable of making his or her own choices, then, can't be evil.

They can be the puppets of evil parents, but no more.

re: #174 Cognito

re: #173 doriangrey

Teaching ones children that killing innocent people because Allah will be pleased is absolutly evil.

Of course it is. I haven't said otherwise, and never would.

But this makes the parents evil, not the children.

Wrong answer clyde, It makes everyone involved, children included evil. Thats the problem with evil, it contaminate everything it comes into contact with. Those children would have to be completely removed from any contact with their parent and their parents society, completely re-programmed and even then the rate of successfully de-programming them from the evil that has been inflicted on them would be pitifully low.

re: #171 Iron Fist

re: #138 Daisy,

Because they are scum. Because they kill children and call it good. Because they teach children to hate, and call it good.

Because they want to destroy Israel. I doubt America is more than a cypher to them. They hate us, but the same way a man hates mosquitoes. We don't do anything to them really, we just are.

And I hate them for that, too. Every time they have "Death to America" get togethers, I want us to bomb them.

Good enough?

Yes. I understand completely.

re: #177 Cognito

How do you think they've kept this going for generations?

re: #161 buzzsawmonkey

Golden raisins are called Sultanas. Now I know why.

re: #7 Iron Fist

Ma Duce. M-2 heavy machine gun.

Rake the crowds until they go away.

There is no reason that Hamas should be successful at storming the border. None whatsoever.

Snipers. I'd like to see the IDF taking out the adult men attacking one by one, each one's head disappearing in a red mist. The sensible women and children would get the hell out.

If the "Palestinians" are going to try to invade Israel, Israel must be able to respond.

I was about to ask Iron Fist why he hated Hamas but the answer has been given and understood. Looks like there will have to be built a "no mans" zone to protect Israel on the Gaza boarder and to protect the Gaza children since the Muslims doen't seem to care all that much about protecting their own children.

Riot control police have a lot of options available. Ordinary tear gas (CN) is the least of the worries the Pali's have. Next step up is "vomiting gas" (CS) and microwave pain projectors. Mix the CS and CN together and you get real interesting results. I don't care how determined the Pali's are, they're not going to withstand what Israel can throw at them. I don't think there are enough gas masks in Gaza to make a difference.

Every Palestinian child is born as innocent as any other child. Of course, their sick society gets to work on them pretty quickly (with genocidal anthropomorphic bees on TV, etc.).

re: #180 Roger

re: #177 Cognito

How do you think they've kept this going for generations?

When the children become old enough to account for their own actions, they are choosing to become evil.

Their parents have left little room for diversion, at that point, but still everyone becomes accountable for his own actions when he is old enough to understand them.

re: #177 Cognito

re: #176 Roger

re: #174 Cognito

It quickly makes the children evil. Doesn't take long.

No, it doesn't. Evil is a choice. Someone incapable of making his or her own choices, then, can't be evil.

They can be the puppets of evil parents, but no more.

Again wrong answer clyde, once the programming as been started it feeds itself. One need look no further than the learned behaviors common to mankind to know this. Children of alcoholic have ten times the rate of alcoholism as those whose parents are not alcoholics, child of abusive parents have 10 times the rate of being abusive people as adults as those not raised by abusive parents, and it almost doesnt matter how young they are when they are separated from those parents.

re: #77 nyc redneck

israel is must have the will to survive and do what it takes to insure that. otherwise, bad people who have bad plans for them will decide their future.

This is the crux of the problem. Being "Mr. Nice Guy" can sometimes lead to more trouble rather than less trouble.

re: #2 Sharmuta

Organisers said Hamas-controlled schools across Gaza would get time off to allow students to take part in the protest.

Considering the type of education we've seen coming out of their schools, I'd say this was less time off than it is a field trip.

With an opportunity to receive extra credit for becoming a Martyr.

re: #186 Cognito

That's if they have the conceptual minds like the West. Bu for some of them they can be over 30 and still don't understand the evil of their actions. They are a deceived people.

re: #39 Daisy

"40,000 to 50,000 women and children would form a “human chain” stretching the length of the Gaza Strip."

Could Islamists possibly be more cowardly?

An doesn't it illustrate wonderfully that even the Islamists acknowledge the inherent righteousness of the Israelis? They KNOW the Israelis would never mow down women and children, which is why they are hiding behind them. Yet, all the while, the Islamists strive to kill Israeli women and children, rather than those who might fight back.

Strange how the world chooses not to see the obvious.

And the IDF will not, ever, open up on a line of schoolkids with M2's; ever. There has to be more creative thinking about this. The minefield idea is better; lay it, mark it clearly (like we do with ours in Korea), and then if Hamas shovels kids into it at gunpoint, even a creative Reuters cameraman will have trouble disguising who's responsible.

Another idea is for the IDF to disrupt the whole plan, by going on the offensive against Hamas targets beginning the day before the planned "protest". Make THEM hunker down.

re: #190 Roger

re: #186 Cognito

That's if they have the conceptual minds like the West. Bu for some of them they can be over 30 and still don't understand the evil of their actions. They are a deceived people.

But then, we weren't talking about 30-year-olds.

re: #185 Occasional Reader

Every Palestinian child is born as innocent as any other child. Of course, their sick society gets to work on them pretty quickly (with genocidal anthropomorphic bees on TV, etc.).

They may be born innocent, but by the age of five that innocence is long gone. The Palestinians haven't managed to keep their homicidal hatred of Israel going for the last 60 years because they allow any of their children to not be indoctrinated or infected with their genocidal hatred.

re: #166 Clio

Also, the pig is considered different from other domesticated animals in that it is of no use to mankind while it is alive. It does not give milk, eggs, wool, fleece, labor, or transportation.

Actually, pigs are the smartest and cleanest of domesticated animals, given the opportunity to be so. Unlike other livestock, they never 'go' where they eat. They are easily trained, and they can be used to pulls carts or find delicacies (truffles and mushrooms) with their excellent olfactory prowess; they have even been trained to sniff out drugs. Their problem is their physical deficiencies: they can't run fast or far, they can't jump worth a darn, and heat kills them too easily (the rolling in mud thing is to cool them and block biting bugs). We have bred most of their original ability to survive on their own out of them. Slow pigs with short legs are much easier to take care of, in other words.

And now, in these days of the Attack of Islam, pigs have come into their own as the most useful animal of all. Even their poo would be useful, if we had the sense to use it.

Thus endeth my defense of the Swine.

Israel should herd in 1000s of pigs and spread them out along the border with tons of pig food.

re: #194 doriangrey

And so, just to be clear; are you arguing in favor of the IDF gunning down Palestinian 5 year-olds?

re: #169 eclectic infidel

re: #101 doriangrey

re: #92 Nevergiveup

re: #80 doriangrey

re: #73 BulgarWheat

re: #67 Kosh's Shadow

Now, there's a thought.

Except the Jew's are almost as troubled by pork as the Muslims. So who exactly would do the work and where would the pork come from?

Well if you haven't been in Israel lately, there is quite a bit of " white meat( white meat = pork) "available to secular Israelis than you would ever imagine!

I am surprised....

Friends who have spent time in Israel tell me that all one needs to do to acquire pork is to shop at a Christian market.

Or a non kosher Jewish shop.

re: #193 Cognito

We're talking about future 30 year olds and how they get there. It doesn't take long. Accountability starts a lot younger than a coddled West would think.

"And they’re releasing children from school so they can be on the front line."

Such despicable people! They'll have their cameras ready hoping and praying for dead children. They may even have to do it themselves....

re: #199 Roger

re: #193 Cognito

We're talking about future 30 year olds and how they get there. It doesn't take long. Accountability starts a lot younger than a coddled West would think.

Perhaps. But I know children -- children -- are not accountable. In a land of loudly pretending victims, they are silently the real thing.

re: #200 Shay4l

"And they’re releasing children from school so they can be on the front line."

Such despicable people! They'll have their cameras ready hoping and praying for dead children. They may even have to do it themselves....

Their children are a resource, cannon fodder, and p.r. material. That is all. They hope and pray that their children will be killed or will kill themselves in an attempt to kill Jews. That is their highest dream for the child they bore and held in their arms.

These are a demonic people.

re: #201 Cognito

There are absolutes. There is right and wrong.

And

But I know children -- children -- are not accountable. In a land of loudly pretending victims, they are silently the real thing.

is absolutely right.

re: #201 Cognito

Your poetry lost me. Actually incomprehensible.

Cognito, I see you already covered the "what are you advocating" point. And apparently, all Palestinian children always have bombs with them. (So we're told by dorian.) So I withdraw my question in #197.

re: #205 Occasional Reader

Cognito, I see you already covered the "what are you advocating" point. And apparently, all Palestinian children always have bombs with them. (So we're told by dorian.) So I withdraw my question in #197.

Yeah. It's been weird.

They're teaching their children to hate and kill. We're emasculating our kids. How's that going to work out in a generation or two?

I read somewhere that the US had developed a new "heat gun". It emits microwaves or something (don't remeber exactly) that's heats up the skin's temperature to intolerable levels. No human can withstand it for more than a few seconds. The US should lend this newly (?) developed crowd control weapon to Israel just for the occasion being planned by Hamas.

re: #207 TimeQuake

They're teaching their children to hate and kill. We're emasculating our kids. How's that going to work out in a generation or two?

Actually, I think our kids will do just fine. We have 20 year olds in Iraq and Afghanistan working wonders, who were "kids" just a few sort years ago. And I think their kids will either have to pull out of this death spiral (somehow), or self-destruct.

By the way, it's non-lethal.

re: #208 So?

I read somewhere that the US had developed a new "heat gun". It emits microwaves or something (don't remeber exactly) that's heats up the skin's temperature to intolerable levels. No human can withstand it for more than a few seconds. The US should lend this newly (?) developed crowd control weapon to Israel just for the occasion being planned by Hamas.

Me, I think Israel should be prepared to display giant holographic images of Helen Thomas at the borderline. Geneva Conventions be damned.

re: #197 Occasional Reader

re: #194 doriangrey

And so, just to be clear; are you arguing in favor of the IDF gunning down Palestinian 5 year-olds?

It's a long standing tactic of the "Palestinians" to use children as fighters.

In the 12 year civil war in Lebanon, Arafat recruited eleven year olds to become what was described by the press as RPG kids. An RPG (Rocket-Propelled Grenade) is a shoulder fired missile, used against ground vehicles. An RPG doesn't know that the finger on its trigger is just 11 years old. Their eyesight is young and clear; the weapon fires and people are killed. What a lesson for kids! Arafat's motive was that Israeli soldiers would hesitate to shoot kids. It worked. Many Israelis became victims as they did, indeed, hesitate in defending themselves against armed kids. ([Link: www.teachkidspeace.com...]

And this is how they behave today
[Link: www.pmw.org.il...] > PA Television . Video Library > Children are combatants in PA Ideology

re: #207 TimeQuake

They're teaching their children to hate and kill. We're emasculating our kids. How's that going to work out in a generation or two?

I'm teaching my daughters to revere warriors and to be crack shots themselves. What are other Lizards doing to turn the tide? I'm interested in what we can do as a group of informed and determined people to disable the emasculators, if you know what I mean, to block the efficacy of what the socialist/liberal axis of evil has been attempting to complete before it is too late.

re: #209 Occasional Reader

"sort" = "short", gah

re: #209 Occasional Reader

their kids will either have to pull out of this death spiral (somehow), or self-destruct.

I hope you are right.

re: #197 Occasional Reader

re: #194 doriangrey

And so, just to be clear; are you arguing in favor of the IDF gunning down Palestinian 5 year-olds?

I'm advocating that the IDF shoot anyone, five year olds included, that attempt to cross their border during this planned invasion. Being a human shield for homicidal psychopaths is every bit the act of evil that the homicidal psychopaths intend to perpetrate on Israel. If Hamas want to use the Palestinian women and children as human shields then the life's of those human shields was forfeited by those who made the decision to use them for their evil enterprise, and any deaths that occur as a result are solely the responsibility of those who planned and executed the event.

Does that make my position clear enough. Am I being a stubborn hard ass about this, you bet your ass I am. One of my childhood best friends dads was killed in Vietnam when a five year old walked up to him as he was passing out food and candy, the five year old had a hand grenade, the pin had already been pulled. My friends dad and two other US Marines died. For me this is cut and dried, nothing to debate, nothing to moralize, nothing to rationalize.

The second that that hand grenade was put into that kids hand he was dead. The same is true of any Palestinian kid used as a human shield, they are already dead the only question is how many others will they take with them. More importantly is the fact that this is exactly the question that those responsible are asking themselves. How many lives can we trade for each of these human shields.

It is the zenith, the absolute apogee of evil to employ tactics such as this, and the only thing worse is to allow such tactic to be used against yourself.

re: #212 guftafs

In the 12 year civil war in Lebanon, Arafat recruited eleven year olds to become what was described by the press as RPG kids.

And of course Hitler did the same thing in the closing days of the War, with Hilter Youth and the Panzerfaust (from which the Soviet RPG line is a direct descendant, if I'm not mistaken).

Nobody is arguing that you can't fire at children who are actually shooting at you. The question is, if they're "all evil", are you advocating targeting them even if they're playing hopscotch.

re: #213 cookielady

I think that is wonderful (as I am a gun owner and practice as much as I can). But I believe you and others like you, are the exception to the rule. The public school system is making our kids weak and impotent. Especially boys. Girls, I shudder to think what they are doing to the girls.

This site changed my mind completely about feminism and I never even burned a bra but felt that the movement was a good idea. Now I don't think it worked out like it should have.

re: #217 Occasional Reader

Exactly.

re: #213 cookielady

I'm teaching my daughters to revere warriors and to be crack shots themselves.

That's good, as long as you're also teaching them to be politically active... on behalf of freedom. Our society is indestructible, as long as we keep a robust sense of self. With that in place, it won't matter whether your daughters are crack shot or not!

re: #217 Occasional Reader

Hilter Youth... stupid, stupid fingers, I hates you, hates you

Here it is...not ready till 2010? But we need it now!

re: #195 cookielady

Also, they're tasty. :)

Although the feral hogs are tearing up some of the good hiking spots in Missouri--especially Bell Mountain.

However, it's open season on 'em--you can shoot any feral hog at any time.

Tasty, and target practice. ;)

re: #222 So?

Here it is...not ready till 2010? But we need it now!

I love it... it looks like a weapon from an old Godzilla movie! (They had military vehicles with these parabolic antennae that shot lighting bolts at the Big G... they only pissed him off, of course, but they looked cool)

re: #217 Occasional Reader

re: #217 Occasional Reader

re: #212 guftafs

Nobody is arguing that you can't fire at children who are actually shooting at you. The question is, if they're "all evil", are you advocating targeting them even if they're playing hopscotch.

OK, I see what you mean. No, I think such indiscriminate killing would be pointless from any rational standpoint. What purpose would that serve?

re: #217 Occasional Reader,

No one said anything about targeting them if they are playing hopscotch.

It is another thing entirely to allow a human wave attack to succeed because the front of the wave is made up of children.

If you allow it to succeed, then you have given your enemy an invincible method of attack.

You can't survive that.

re: #223 Palandine

Also, they're tasty. :)

Homer: Are you saying you're never going to eat any animal again? What about bacon?
Lisa: No.
Homer: Ham?
Lisa: No.
Homer: Pork chops?
Lisa: Dad, those all come from the same animal!
Homer: Heh heh heh. Ooh, yeah, right, Lisa. A wonderful, magical animal.

I would like to take this opportunity to point out an important difference between our culture and that of our enemy. We argue passionately about the almost unimaginable horror of possibly being in the position of having to kill children in combat. Our enemy plots with casual cunning how to make the most efficient use of their childrens death. Just an observation.

Whatever happens, it WILL BE UGLY.
-S-

re: #226 Iron Fist

No one said anything about targeting them if they are playing hopscotch.

But the "they're all evil, even the toddlers" arguments (not you, others) head straight in that direction.

It is another thing entirely to allow a human wave attack to succeed because the front of the wave is made up of children.

And as I said above, I think Israel has other, better options for dealing with this.

re: #228 eastvillageinfidel

Our enemy plots with casual cunning how to make the most efficient use of their childrens death.

And of course they also indoctrinate their children into a death cult at an early age; and throw parties - literally - when they manage to murder Jewish children.

re: #226 Iron Fist

And if it works, it will be all the rage with militant Jihad worldwide.

re: #226 Iron Fist

re: #217 Occasional Reader,

No one said anything about targeting them if they are playing hopscotch.

It is another thing entirely to allow a human wave attack to succeed because the front of the wave is made up of children.

If you allow it to succeed, then you have given your enemy an invincible method of attack.

You can't survive that.

Yup, same kind of bullshit Cognito tried throwing into his argument. It's a moral relativist bait and switch.

(In any event, I don't know if the Ma Deuce would be my first choice against a human wave attack... rate of fire is a little too low. Give me something in the 800 - 1200 rounds/min range.)

re: #226 Iron Fist

I was just thinking about adding that. If Hamas goes through with what has been suggested here, then I'm all for that the IDF should target the masses of people allowing the incursion to proceed, including women and children. In a sane world that would be a sane choice. Maybe if Israel recorded in detail the whole unfolding of events and published it everywhere with their own explanations, so that the tactics of the Palestinians were clear for all to see people would understand why it would be necessary to mow them down.

/lost every shred of sympathy for the "Palestinians" when he saw them taking pleasure out of the mindless slaughter of Americans on 9/11

re: #233 doriangrey

Honestly, having read this, and your most recent post on the next thread, I'm coming to realize you simply don't understand the arguments at hand.

So that's that, I suppose.

re: #233 doriangrey

re: #233 doriangrey

bait and switch

Please tell me what was the "bait and switch". Specifically. Thanks.

re: #234 Occasional Reader

(In any event, I don't know if the Ma Deuce would be my first choice against a human wave attack... rate of fire is a little too low. Give me something in the 800 - 1200 rounds/min range.)

How about mortars?

re: #232 TimeQuake

re: #226 Iron Fist

And if it works, it will be all the rage with militant Jihad worldwide.

If it works, the swarms will come from all over the mid-east to invade Israel. I have a feeling while this so called march is going on rockets will be flying into Sedrot and Hizbullah will launch from Lebanon.

And wouldn't breaching this wall be considered an in INVASION into a soverign state who has ever right to defend themselves with any means necessary.

Imagine 100,000 Kurds marching into Turkey...guess what the response of the Turkish government would be? But Israel always has to have its hands tied.

re: #230 Occasional Reader

re: #226 Iron Fist

But the "they're all evil, even the toddlers" arguments (not you, others) head straight in that direction.

.

Wrong, you cannot fight an enemy you refuse to acknowledge is your enemy. You cannot solve a problem you refuse to grasp as a problem. Since there is no intervening in the Palestinian indoctrination of their children anyone who fails to grasp the nature of the situation is a self deluded fool.

Their children are already corrupt and evil, because their is absolutly zero chance of halting the indoctrination and infection of them by the evil that corrupts their parents. Like the five year old Vietnamese child that killed my friends dad, their fate has already been decided AND THERE IS NO CHANGING IT. To pretend otherwise is to indulge in a fantasy that will get countless innocent people killed.

re: #239 So?

Sovereignty only applies to Muslim nations these days. All other countries are up for grabs...including ours (USA).

re: #236 Cognito

re: #233 doriangrey

Honestly, having read this, and your most recent post on the next thread, I'm coming to realize you simply don't understand the arguments at hand.

So that's that, I suppose.

What ever you say KELLER...

re: #240 doriangrey

re: #230 Occasional Reader

re: #226 Iron Fist

But the "they're all evil, even the toddlers" arguments (not you, others) head straight in that direction.

.

Their children are already corrupt and evil, because their is absolutly zero chance of halting the indoctrination and infection of them by the evil that corrupts their parents. Like the five year old Vietnamese child that killed my friends dad, their fate has already been decided AND THERE IS NO CHANGING IT. To pretend otherwise is to indulge in a fantasy that will get countless innocent people killed.

That's disgusting, and gives LGF a bad name.

Stop. Seriously.

re: #59 Iron Fist

re: #11 Dianna,

We have to harden our hearts. The enemy is willing to cause any level of atrocity.

We have to be willing to meet them with it. Certainly, we should kill the leaders first, wherever we can.

I have always advocated the extermination of Hamas. All of them. They are slime who would march children into M-2 fire.

Kill all of them, and we don't have to worry about what we would do about a human wave headed by children.

"War is cruelty. There's no use trying to reform it, the crueler it is the sooner it will be over."
-- William Tecumseh Sherman --

I'll repeat this part of my last post:

Imagine 100,000 Kurds marching into Turkey...guess what the response of the Turkish government would be?

This puts another (yet another) nail in the coffin of the ''shiite won't work along with sunni'' garbage used to claim Saddam wouldn't help Osama.
Hamas and Iran, Syria and the lebanese land and hezb'allah, fatah in West Banok all will work together long enough to destroy Israel.
Only later will they turn on one another.
This is just round I-don't-know-what-round-it-is-anymore.
Round X.

re: #234 Occasional Reader,

I'm looking at depth of penetration. An M-2 round isn't stopped by what it first hits.
Have you ever been to the Knob Creek machine gun shoot? The main firing line is pretty much all M-2s. It is incredibly devastating. Nothing will make it through that.

Nothing.

They could certainly be backed up with M-249's, M-60's, hell, for that matter M-19's (WP really sucks). The point is to stop the human wave. That means massive casualties.

There is simply no way around that. Cause the most casualties in the shortest amount of time, and you probably minimize the total number of casualties.

It is the horrible calculus of such an action.

re: #240 doriangrey

Wrong, you cannot fight an enemy you refuse to acknowledge is your enemy.

Interesting that you declare me "wrong", and then in the very same sentence reinforce the point I'm making.

You keep dodging the question. If you think all Palestinian children - even 5 year olds (your example, not mine) - are irredeemably "corrupt and evil", would you support the IDF targeting them, anywhere any time? Yes, or no?

Israel needs a W.T. Sherman.

re: #14 karmic_inquisitor

re: #7 Iron Fist

Ma Duce. M-2 heavy machine gun.

Rake the crowds until they go away.

There is no reason that Hamas should be successful at storming the border. None whatsoever.

Can't used the M2 on personnel. But you can use it on their equipment.

Aim for their Official Hamas Headbands.

Actually, there is nothing against using the M2 against personnel. It is just one of those myths like not being able to shoot paratroopers out of the sky. I loved correcting the troopers from 82nd on that fact.

Straight Leg and proud of it.

re: #243 Cognito

re: #240 doriangrey

re: #230 Occasional Reader

re: #226 Iron Fist

But the "they're all evil, even the toddlers" arguments (not you, others) head straight in that direction.

.

Their children are already corrupt and evil, because their is absolutly zero chance of halting the indoctrination and infection of them by the evil that corrupts their parents. Like the five year old Vietnamese child that killed my friends dad, their fate has already been decided AND THERE IS NO CHANGING IT. To pretend otherwise is to indulge in a fantasy that will get countless innocent people killed.

That's disgusting, and gives LGF a bad name.

Stop. Seriously.

It is disgusting but it is a fact that must be recognized that you cannot treat the children reared in murderous regimes such as the Nazi or "Palestinian" as normal children. They aren't. This doesn't mean you kill them indiscriminately, but you acknowledge that they will participate in the fighting and you treat them accordingly. War is not nice.

re: #248 Occasional Reader

re: #240 doriangrey

Wrong, you cannot fight an enemy you refuse to acknowledge is your enemy.

Interesting that you declare me "wrong", and then in the very same sentence reinforce the point I'm making.

You keep dodging the question. If you think all Palestinian children - even 5 year olds (your example, not mine) - are irredeemably "corrupt and evil", would you support the IDF targeting them, anywhere any time? Yes, or no?