Rule one of the left: all non-Western cultures are inherently superior to aall non-Western cultures.

I hear they make the best bacon in Islamic countries too. Who knew?

Where is NOW?

Daily Kos: Is Islam Really Stuck in the 12th Century on Women’s Rights?

Nope.

7th century

"No hard evidence"? Maybe that's because they tend to bury the evidence after its mutilated, tortured and murdered.

You can't fake cluelessness of that caliber.

sigh... this list is not good for our side, it's clearly slanted. How is Iraq a worse country for women to live in than, say, Sudan?

re: #6 Fenway_Nation

You can't fake cluelessness of that caliber.

Its a gift.

By J:

"I’ve just never seen any hard evidence to support that claim."

What are the chances that Joshua is about 16 or so?

His words sound like "not yet even a high school graduate" nonsense.

Vote Obama

Cha Cha Cha Changes.

Joshua, just look. The evidence is all around. You do not have to go through life stuck on stupid. Just look. Come over here to read. You don't have to join but we'd be glad to help guide you to enlightenment. We'd be nice.

Misogyny? That's reserved for Muslim countries in spades.

And let's not forget the stoning of women for trumped up charges of adultery. Heck, you can be a woman raped by men and still be convicted of the crime of being with a man not related to you. Get convicted with 100 lashes. Speak out about the inhumanity of the 100 lashes and watch the court double your sentence.

Then, there's the whole mess of honor killings that combines the worst of tribalism with sharia.

re: #11 MandyManners

Maybe I fudged the truth in my last sentence.

Hard evidence

*graphic

Willful stupidity. It takes effort to stay that dumb.

Josh Holland's Accu-Polling, Inc.
"If you ask average Americans how they came to their beliefs about how badly women suffer in Islamic societies, most will reply that "everyone knows it."

It's accurate because Josh says it's accurate!

So, Josh, by your reasoning, I can safely make that statement after knowing nothing else about you and not bothering to research it:

Hell, maybe there are people dumber than this kid. I've just never seen any hard evidence to support that claim.

I just got back from a JRC ( Jewish republican coalition ) brunch. The speaker was from VETS FOR FREEDOM, a Peter Hegseth. He is a Capt. in the National Guard now. He served in the 101st in Iraq. Very impressive person. More about that later. A young man asked him a question about the risk aversion attitude of many Officers in the upper echelon of the Armed Forces. It was a great question and of course so was the answer. After I went up to the person that asked the question and congratulated him. He said he only read about it in an article. I told him, but the point is you did read it and you also comprehended what you had read. I think that is more of a conservative treat than an liberal one. Liberals get a gut feeling about a subject and damn be the facts.

The desperate effort liberals engage in to deny the truth is revealing

Consider the difficulty you’d have studying the question empirically. First, you have to operationalize the question. How do you quantify women’s social status in a way that can be compared across cultures and national borders?

HA!

re: #12 lawhawk

Misogyny? That's reserved for Muslim countries in spades.

And let's not forget the stoning of women for trumped up charges of adultery. Heck, you can be a woman raped by men and still be convicted of the crime of being with a man not related to you. Get convicted with 100 lashes. Speak out about the inhumanity of the 100 lashes and watch the court double your sentence.

Then, there's the whole mess of honor killings that combines the worst of tribalism with sharia.

But..but that's not mistreatment of women! That's diversity in action! Their culture is as valid as any in the West!

/Kos Kid

What would he know about women, except for his mom, who doesn't live in the basement?

/need more cheetos, mom!

Ayaan Hirsi Ali, you liar!

Kosling Joshua showed you!

/

Ok, I gotta get goin'.
/Cheerio, y'all

Kind of like if the nation/culture is an adversary of the U.S., then the left in the west will support that country. See Cuba, Venezuela, or go back 25 years and see the support of communist USSR.

re: #9 Arbalest

By J:

"I’ve just never seen any hard evidence to support that claim."

What are the chances that Joshua is about 16 or so?

His words sound like "not yet even a high school graduate" nonsense.

Here's the problem with libs. They never lose that "brains of mush" mentality even if they graduate from high school or college.

re: #12 lawhawk

Misogyny? That's reserved for Muslim countries in spades.

And let's not forget the stoning of women for trumped up charges of adultery. Heck, you can be a woman raped by men and still be convicted of the crime of being with a man not related to you. Get convicted with 100 lashes. Speak out about the inhumanity of the 100 lashes and watch the court double your sentence.

Then, there's the whole mess of honor killings that combines the worst of tribalism with sharia.

The article took special note of gang rape being used to punish the man in Pakistan. Then the girl has to be killed. The man's honor is then restored.There is no hope for such a society.

The stupidity on display with these statements is amazing! I would bet he is a student of or graduate of a liberal arts/liberal school. No one else could be this brain dead. Oh, crap! Forgot about the NOW bunch. They supported billy jeff the serial rapist, so turning a blind eye to the abuse of women in islam is no big leap.

But I've seen no empirical data to suggest that an Islamic majority itself correlates with the subordination of women better than other co-variables like economic development, women's ability to serve in government, a political culture that values the rule of law or access to higher education.

Now that is Pretzel Logic in its purest form. Its like saying " I don't spread rumors, the people I tell them to do all the spreading"

For any Kos-droids, look here.

Scroll down the page for more pictures.

Click some of the links; it should not be too difficult to find pictures of the National Sport of the Taliban (as played in a stadium or two).

re: #9 Arbalest

By J:

"I’ve just never seen any hard evidence to support that claim."

What are the chances that Joshua is about 16 or so?

His words sound like "not yet even a high school graduate" nonsense.

But he would argue with you to defend them.

You can actually go and travel to these places.

They seem not to realize that.

Additionally, in Joshua's first comment:

First, you have to operationalize the question.

Operationalize.

I am conceptualizing some dubiosity as to the veritbalitable qualitativeness of such verbiosization.

Hell, maybe women do fare a lot worse in Islamic culture than they do in other faiths. I’ve just never seen any hard evidence to support that claim.

Yeah, the Saudi women just love covering themselves up. Why do you think they have Mutaween?!

Islam doesn't abuse women in Islamic nations. Muslims do.

And of course they have whole departments at US universities dedicated to the fundamentalist oppression of women throughout US history.

And! AND! Guys yell, "Show us your tits!" to women at Lake Havasu.

Charles has selected one of the mildest photos depicting abuse of women.

Here are "better" ones:

[Link: www.rawa.org...]

First of all, where was the U.S. on the top ten list? Shouda been first. Second: The safest place for women in the world, IMHO, is in the U.S., WHEN THEY'RE ARMED.

re: #38 Globular Cluster

Remember to scroll through the whole page.

I've read some more of his "diary" and have realized that there is little or no help for him.

Never argue with an idiot. He'll drag you down to his level and then beat you with experience.

The Islamo-fascism deniers provide us with a clear example of elective ignorance.

re: #39 tommygum

First of all, where was the U.S. on the top ten list? Shouda been first. Second: The safest place for women in the world, IMHO, is in the U.S., WHEN THEY'RE ARMED.

Kind of in that vein, I watched Wild Hogs last night, you know the comedy about mid-life crisis suburban motorcyclists...anyway, they stumble into this little town that's being terrorized by Ray Liotta and his biker gang.

SPOILERS FOLLOW (for those who care)
Anyway, at the end of the movie the townspeople decide to stand up against the gang, and come out weilding clubs and axes and shovels...and I'm just like, "wait a second, why don't any of these people have guns? If these townspeople were armed, they would have gotten rid of these jokers long ago..."

Why aren't the women wearing gloves?

In this brazen display of flesh, they may agitate those Islamics with a hand fetish.

Koran 4:34

SHAKIR: Men are the maintainers of women because Allah has made some of them to excel others and because they spend out of their property; the good women are therefore obedient, guarding the unseen as Allah has guarded; and (as to) those on whose part you fear desertion, admonish them, and leave them alone in the sleeping-places and beat them; then if they obey you, do not seek a way against them; surely Allah is High, Great.

[Link: www.usc.edu...]

re: #41 MandyManners

I've read some more of his "diary" and have realized that there is little or no help for him.

I gave you a +1 (as obviously others did) for going through that unpleasant experience. Unless you're a shrink and then it could be professionally deemed research.

Defining liberalism as a mental disorder will eventually become inescapable. Wait, that already happened.

I tried to research this subject, but there was a lot of yelling in Arabic...I didn't really understand what was going on.

/Joshua and the quote that keeps on giving

Something this guy said bothered me. He stated that Eastern Orthodox is the largest Christian denomination. It is not, it is second to Catholicism by far. Second he said that women were treated poorly. I do know Maronist and Copts treat women rather poorly, but way better than Islam. But I had never heard that allegation by Eastern Orthodox. In fact the Byzantine Empire was famous for the equality of women. And I am right.
First EO:
[Link: en.wikipedia.org...]

And there views on women. Note the stand on divorce and birth control And women were made in the image of god.
[Link: www.goarch.org...]

Charles, did you see this komment?

I understand the reluctance, especially in an era that includes LGF, to be critical of Islam. That does not mean, however, that we should be afraid to engage in criticism when that reflects our core values.

If it weren't for you, you vile hater, deep-thinking moonbats would be more critical of Islam.

You're actually helping to keep the bitches down.

LOL

There is none so blind as those who will not see.

Women in Islam do have it better then Joshua.

They have their heads up a face shielding burka...

Joshua has his head up his a$$.

Joshua wonders if Islamic culture or poverty or lack of education is the real culprit behind the subjugation of women. But he doesn't see the obvious connection between the three. They go together for a reason dummie.

re: #46 Captain Hate

I gave you a +1 (as obviously others did) for going through that unpleasant experience. Unless you're a shrink and then it could be professionally deemed research.

My brain hurts.

Thanos has been a busy bee this morning.lol

Never argue with an idiot. He'll drag you down to his level and then beat you with experience.

Does anyone know where I got that from? I have it written down on a PostIt but I cannot recall where I got it.

Smile for the camera.

I'm so glad that this has been cleared up. All this time I was holding Islam in disregard because I was given to understand that, only in Islam, were women allowed the honor of being killed by throwing stones that were not too big, (lest the fun end too soon), only in Islam were women punished for exposing their wrists, only in Islam were women subjected to absolutely ridiculous limitations on the prosecution of rape, only in Islam were women having high percentages of their inheritance taken away simply because they were women, only in Islam did women have no rights in public, unless accompanied by a man, only in Islam were women forced back into a burning building lest they arouse men by their dress, and in Islam were women killed for having the audacity to gain an education. ...But now, because of the Daily Kos, I have learned to reevaluate my previous assumptions, and examine the facts with a more open-minded, nuanced view. Thank you, Joshua Holland.

Maybe Josh would change his view if he had been forced to undergo a clitorectomy.

I guess to be a Kos kid is to be a moron.

re: #56 MandyManners

Does anyone know where I got that from? I have it written down on a PostIt but I cannot recall where I got it.

I don't know but I've seen it all over the innerwebz for quite a while.

re: #56 MandyManners

That was a message kiddo left for you when you wouldn't take him to the arcade.

re: #56 MandyManners

Does anyone know where I got that from? I have it written down on a PostIt but I cannot recall where I got it.

Obama said it whilst breeding prizewinning clams

This diary is a part of the great project to redefine all the problems of the world as economic 'injustice.'
The author suggests that women in the economically undeveloped world will have equal rights with men when they are one day magically lifted up by the coming Redistribution. All other social or religious aspects of the issue are just swept away, meaningless objections raised by ignorant anecdotal simpletons.

re: #56 MandyManners
That is like wrestling with a pig. The pig will like it, you won't win, and you'll end up all dirty.

re: #63 jaunte

I tried to ignore that silliness. In the 70's Saudi Arabia and Kuwait had the highest per capita GDP in the world. Case over.

re: #64 pingjockey

That is like wrestling with a pig. The pig will like it, you won't win, and you'll end up all dirty.

Was that saying supposed to have "pig" in it? I've been saying it for years with "Ted Kennedy."

Send him the pictures of the women in Iran being beaten and carted away to who-knows-what fate for not 'properly convering"!

How about getting your external genitalia sliced off and sewed back together, only to make enforced sex and child-birth extremely painful...a life of pain right there! (you either have the painful sex or you get beat for being disobedient because 'Allah' said you have to stop whatever you are doing if your husband wants sex or else you will be punished!)

How about always being someone's property, or being treated by your govt as a child who cannot travel, offer testimony in court, or do anything else that an adult should be able to do!

How about being a 'wife' to some old sicko when your 12 years old and he is in his 50's?

This Kos person is a REAL IDIOT!
(He probably secretly wishes he could treat women like they do in Islamic society, then he could get laid on demand no matter what kind of lame-ass, idiotic, loser he is!)

Don't have a problem with the burqas. If chosen by the woman. If required by fashion police?...real problem with that. But, to be fair, many women in the middle east choose to wear them.

I am more concerned about the rape, torture and murder of women in that part of the world.

re: #66 guitardalek
Yes. Don't remember the exact saying. Ted Kennedy is a good substitute for pig!

re: #66 guitardalek

heh

re: #65 pat

Yep; it's the agenda that's so important he can ignore the facts.

Be sure to tune in next week for Joshua's riveting follow-up: "Where's The Evidence That The Earth Is Round?"

Hey, women in islam don't have to worry if they get a zit. There's that...

It never ceases to amaze me how the left can unabashadly trot out the same tired excuse time and again. Wheter it's Islam or communism, the argument is always the same: "You can't blame Islam/Communism for the atrocities commited in its name; it just hasn't been implemented properly."

re: #56 MandyManners

Does anyone know where I got that from? I have it written down on a PostIt but I cannot recall where I got it.

I just wrote it down on a post-it. One of these days I'll transcribe them all down in a little notebook I bought just for the purpose. (Too busy lurking to do anything constructive).

oooh, need to jump over to the Pat Condell post. cya's

The Kos Kid should go see the treatment of these women in the various Islamic paradises across the world then get back to us about the treatment of women. Me? I'd like to see Carnival in Brazil.

OT: Looking at my calender, I've just realized yesterday was Internationl Women's Day. Where are you NOW?

I've never met anybody who died during the Depression.

Its kos-kids like Joshua Holland who will be the first to convert to Islam...Then perhaps Josh could put his Mom and Sister in a burka and sell them on the slave market for a few shekels...

Maximu§
3/11 ACR

Lets give Joshua Holland a quick education he will never forget:

Dress him up in a burka and have him drive a car in Saudi Arabia without a man relative escort, then he will know.

re: #64 pingjockey

That is like wrestling with a pig. The pig will like it, you won't win, and you'll end up all dirty.

Arguing with an engineer is like mud wrestling with a pig. Eventually you'll realize the pig is having fun.

Hell, maybe Joshua isn't a dhimmi coward terrorist-appeasing mouthpiece useful idiot. I’ve just never seen any hard evidence to support that claim.

The Toronto Star is our lefty newspaper in Canada. Scroll down their article to this:

Iraq: The U.S.-led invasion to "liberate" Iraq from Saddam Hussein has imprisoned women in an inferno of sectarian violence that targets women and girls. The literacy rate, once the highest in the Arab world, is now among the lowest as families fear risking kidnapping and rape by sending girls to school. Women who once went out to work stay home. Meanwhile, more than 1 million women have been displaced from their homes, and millions more are unable to earn enough to eat.

It's pathetic.

"In point of fact, until very recently, Islamic women were guaranteed far more rights than Western Christian women vy Sharia and the Q'oran"

I guess you don't need blinkers when your head is stuck that far up your own hole. Unbelievable.

re: #34 guitardalek

Additionally, in Joshua's first comment:

Operationalize.

I am conceptualizing some dubiosity as to the veritbalitable qualitativeness of such verbiosization.

I concur.

Anyone who would use the word "operationalize" in any serious context whatsoever is an abject ass, regardless of the content they wish to convey.

Such jargon-slinging tactics are the mainstay of postmodern anti-rationalism, where a whole lotta absolute nothing can be conveyed via convoluted verbiage.

re: #84 dermeister

And yet we've got 30,000 men over there who we're feeding and sheltering for free! Where is the justice?

/yeah, terrorists

re: #82 Mich-again

Arguing with an engineer is like mud wrestling with a pig. Eventually you'll realize the pig is having fun.

Don't waste your time trying to teach a pig to sing. It wastes your time and annoys the pig.

re: #74 rabidsquirrel

It never ceases to amaze me how the left can unabashedly trot out the same tired excuse time and again. Whiter it's Islam or communism, the argument is always the same: "You can't blame Islam/Communism for the atrocities committed in its name; it just hasn't been implemented properly."

Though they are real quick to blame Zionism, Christianity, and Capitalism for death and destruction around the world. Oh and Imperial Colonialism can't forget that as long as the participants are of European and American Heritage. Ignore everyone else.

re: #88 singingpig

Don't waste your time trying to teach a pig to sing. It wastes your time and annoys the pig.

One of my favorite quotes of all time-and good words to live by when living in heavily liberal areas.

Now, now. Joshua probably isn't trying to suggest that the way Islam is *good*. Just that the United States and Christianity are *bad*.

You should respect the man's sophistry. And also be glad that few women under sharia are allowed to and capable of reading blogs. I imagine if one of the poor hijabed chattel read one of those gems from the plush liberalism of the West, part of her soul would die.

there are the super sexy islomofembots

Joshua Hollands head is so far up his ass, that lump in his throat, is his nose.

Good talking to you, Lizards...I'll be back later...Madden time!

re: #84 dermeister

Ah, so I wasn't the only one to notice.

Hey, Olivia Ward, your bias is showing!

re: #32 coquimbojoe

Doubtless. Scanning through the Kos thread, the posts strike me as written by people whose intellectual development also tells them that inventing the concept of "Boots of Escaping" somehow makes them real.

American high schools: our tax dollars at work.

It is pointless to all out the Koslings as idiots or losers, that is a given. The real point to be made is the statistical ranking supplied in the Toronto Star article of the "10 best", note the absence of the USA. Gee, I thought the USA was a pretty good place for women, especially in terms of income gender gap. Certainly, better than Japan...then I noted this,

SOURCE: UNDP Gender-related development index

, plug this into google and viola..., a Norwegian study showing Norway in the #1 spot. Go figger data? It is interesting to see that the USA ranks #6 in "Gender Empowerment Measure (GEM)" (gals making decisions about stuff), but nowhere on the scale for "Gender-related Development Index (GDI)" (Huh?something like gals building things and stuff sorta by percentage?).

Well now, That's the real stat. The Toronto reporter also reaches the level of idiotarian status by claiming...

Iraq: The U.S.-led invasion to "liberate" Iraq from Saddam Hussein has imprisoned women in an inferno of sectarian violence that targets women and girls.

Now that's a piece of work. It just couldn't be that all the pent-up hostility that Saddam "Titofied" couldn't be the cause. No! the cause was the American "liberation", forget the rape rooms of the Saddam Fedayeen.
LOSER!
No shoes for Bad female Canadian reporters!
go watch some more DiGrassi:The Next Generation episodes for your sensitivity education!

Too bad you can't dress that clown up as a woman and send him to Iran or Afghanistan to experience it for himself.

And if he is discoverd to be a man, then he could be treated as a typical homosexual in Iran as well.

The biased Canadians who wrote this article say that women are better off in Canada than the US (which isn't a top country for women at all), and is obviously against the fact that the US invaded Iraq.

I searched in vain for 1 comment from the kozzies that might have said "What are you kidding me!" Not a one. Every comment was devoted to topics of relativism and cultural recognition. (As well as the typical Christianity/Judaism are no different.)

I guess being beaten while covered from head to toe isn't that bad when you're Muslim.

These morons can tell us how many angels dance on the head of pin, but can't objectively see real violations of real human rights.

The only way the left can operate is if they remain blind to the world's realities.
Remember - Bush and Cheney are the ONLY villains on planet earth.

Forget field research.
Forget interviewing anyone with first-hand knowledge.
Forget trying to read horrendously dull tomes in a dank library.
...
Get the pipes and brandy!
Set some chairs on the lawn!
It's armchair anthropology time:

Evil western imperialism vs. gentle noble savages!

re: #68 chubby vegan

Don't have a problem with the burqas. If chosen by the woman. If required by fashion police?...real problem with that. But, to be fair, many women in the middle east choose to wear them.

I am more concerned about the rape, torture and murder of women in that part of the world.

They "choose" to wear them to avoid "punishment" and abuse.

re: #100 ironbill

I found a guy who mentioned Ayaan Hirsi-Ali and incorrectly identified that she had been assassinated (confusing her with someone who had, apparently as they mentioned in a later comment). I guess tons of death threats can be dismissed until she is actually assassinated to the moronic idiots who went ballistic on him after that mistake.

Then some guy called Ayaan Hirsi-Ali and Wafa Sultan "hatemongers".

My tolerance of left wing liberals is an at an all time low. If I ever hear someone blab on politics in public, I say things that I know will incite them because those people are all the same. I used to just ignore them... Sadly, I'm rapidly approaching the ram-my-fist-into-their-face stage. Hell, if I'm going to be accused of being a "hateful" neocon, I may at least do the hateful part on their sorry ass.

re: #101 FrogMarch

The only way the left can operate is if they remain blind to the world's realities.
Remember - Bush and Cheney are the ONLY villains on planet earth.

There is BDS in every KOS post. This one has some clown say the typical "Bush set back women's rights in the middle east 50 years" or whatever...

Everything is Bush's fault from the price of oil down to the fact that I stubbed my toe on the television stand today.

I'm with you IronBill... searched and searched for some shred of sanity in the comments, and they were pitifully few and far between with only a scant sentence or two.

*sigh*

How very depressing to see so many so willfully clueless (as someone above so aptly worded it). It frightens me and makes me think we will never have the numbers to turn the tide and shine the light on this huge threat to us, that is, the mysoginistic political ideology of Islam dressed up to look like a religion.

re: #104 badsysop

The problem is language escapes us. Liberal academic elitists try and jump through hoops so that they don't offend someone. Academics/pin heads want desperately to find someway, somehow to describe why it's ok to hang a teenage girl for having sex outside her forced marriage, without offending the larger Muslim world. And ultimately it can't be done so don't attempt it. Talk around it.

If they had the courage to call it savagery, their logic would not appear so tortured.

(good post btw)

Typical liberal whistling past the graveyard. I think some of them know the truth, but the cognitive dissonance kicks in, or the talking point of the day says they have to believe different, so they talk this crap so their friends won't disown them.

re: #56 MandyManners

Never argue with an idiot. He'll drag you down to his level and then beat you with experience.

Does anyone know where I got that from? I have it written down on a PostIt but I cannot recall where I got it.

It is usually attributed to Mark Twain. I'm not sure if he actually said it, or someone was paraphrasing. It is very old, though.

RATED X for violence against women. I am NOT KIDDING! GRAPHIC! I could only make it through the first few minutes before crying. Haven't read all the comments but send Joshua this video.

re: #100 ironbill

I searched in vain for 1 comment from the kozzies that might have said "What are you kidding me!" Not a one.

Well, there was this response to the diarist's question, "Is Islam Really Stuck in the 12th Century on Women's Rights?": "No, The Sixth Century."

I think that counts. And is pretty accurate, to boot.

"The ignorance of one voter in a democracy impairs the security of all"
-= John F. Kennedy =-

These ignorant pos are being lead to the slaughter and are too blind to see it.

Creepiest burka picture ever.

I live in ''gay bastion'' Long Beach, CA.
I cannot believe the obliviousness of these liberals here.
They are "for" islam merely because it opposes Bush.
They will not read up on the dangers if islam to save their lives.
I did share one of my Bruce Bawer books with a ''couple.''
They finally read it.
Now they are apalled that they ever thought islam was the partner for peace they used to think it was.
It is a start.

re: #114 mean Gene

GREAT going. Great start. I am trying to do that as well.

re: #113 Alouette

I have seen that before and yes YIKES! It looks like something from a bad sci - fi movie. Zombie mutants taking over the world or something.

re: #114 mean Gene

re: #115 Crimsonfisted

That's all we really can do is to show the moonbats we know the light of truth. Most will run away screaming, but one or two will see the truth.

Ban the Veil (and public mask wearing)

re: #116 Crimsonfisted

I have seen that before and yes YIKES! It looks like something from a bad sci - fi movie. Zombie mutants taking over the world or something.

I was reminded of ghouls myself.

Politically, I'm a center-right Democrat. Normally I don't write anything in here of a bombastic nature; not my style. But hear this uber-left idiots and 7th century death-cultists alike:
If anyone tries to dress my grand-daughter like the poor, pathetic women in the above picture, even as an exercise in cultural sensitivity, you will not want to see me. Probably better for you if you just throw yourself out the window before I get to you.

Aside from that; it strikes me that this Kos moron and his troglodyte friends are using the same argument the KKK used back in the 1870's:

"You don' understan; we LOVE our black people down hyar. It's jus better for everone to, ya know, maintain th' natch'al orduh."

SHUT. THE. F___. UP.

That is all.

So many moonbats,
so little time...

Haven't seen any evidence? They keep it covered well.

re: #122 Manster

Haven't seen any evidence? They keep it covered well.

The hijab/niqab/burkha hides the bruises.

No no no Charles ... those outfits are just, like, Ninja outfits! Yep, they're studying the fine Japanese assassin's art.

re: #101 FrogMarch

The only way the left can operate is if they remain blind to the world's realities.
Remember - Bush and Cheney are the ONLY villains on planet earth.

Exactly right. L3s are mentally ill.

Perhaps Joshua should read up on the practice of female genital mutilation within Islamic countries. Not the only place where this scourge occurs, but it is prevalent.

Well...nowadays women rate lower on the Great Liberal Victimhood Index(TM). It's the best feature of leftist identity politics, having your value as a human being adjusted according to your usefulness to the Cause.

my wife is a christian that grew up in a "moderate" islamic country of Turkey. While the women in the major cities had it good, in the villages it was as bad as Saudi.

Actually, now that I think about it, Joshua souds like a closet sexist. Make sense, I think most Liberals have repressed feelings that they try to deny by overcompensating.

re: #113 Alouette

Creepiest burka picture ever.

It's horrifying.

re: #120 rakkasan

... it strikes me that this Kos moron and his troglodyte friends are using the same argument the KKK used back in the 1870's:

"You don' understan; we LOVE our black people down hyar. It's jus better for everone to, ya know, maintain th' natch'al orduh."

Things were so much more genteel when the nigras knew their place.

:^þ

this kind of willful ignorance is just plain evil.

Willful idiots with votes that count the same as yours and mine. Sad, really.

"It’s a constant source of amazement to me that self-defined 'liberals' like this will make excuses for the most illiberal societies, and look the other way as women are ruthlessly oppressed by a belief system from the Dark Ages."

Charles, why are you amazed? Remember that the American Left first and foremost hates America and everything that America stands for and therefore the Left must support all of America's enemies. Israel is allied with America, so the American Left must therefore hate Israel, thereby being not only anti-Semitic but opposing the only democracy in the Middle East as well, despite that fact that this is yet another complete betrayal of some of the American Left's basic principles. The weirdness of the Left's positions are due to their not being determined by principles or logic; the sole determinant of their support or oppostion is the relationship of the nation/group in question with America. If they hate America, then the American Left loves them; if they love America, then the American Left hates them.

Well, whenever you have to show somebody just how stupid, pathetic, ignorant, and badly-educated (if at all) the typical KosKid is (emphasis on KID)...

Josh Howard will be ready and waiting to educate them.

WOW
The girl in the middle is a TOTAL BABE.

I am going to give up goats immediately.

My rant on Zenboard

More antiAmerican BS from Amnesty International

Posted by Mav on 3/9/2008, 4:57 pm
68.63.108.242

AI has issued a Ten Best Countries and Ten Worst Countries for women to live in.

Despite America having a woman in serious contention for the Presidency, and despite the huge opportunity demonstrated by Oprah Winfrey and other wealthy women with upward social mobility that own and operate major businesses, AI lists their favorite Eurosocialist countries as better places for women to live. Even Japan makes the list, with their male dominated heirarchy and traditions. How many billionaires in Japan are women? Ireland makes the list but not Margaret Thatcher's and Queen Elizabeth's Britain.

On the downside, the list is headed by Afghanistan, where the Taliban is never once mentioned. Certainly things are bad there, but hardly as bad as they were under the Taliban, anecdotal handwringing not withstanding.

And of course making the list is Iraq, where part of the proof is the low literacy rate -- once the "highest in the Arab world". Apparently, after the US invasion, women forgot completely how to read or write! In fact, from Amnesty's account, it was a paradise on Earth until the US invasion. Forget all those claims about 500,000 infants starving to death a year under Saddam -- they are simply ignored.

Somehow the Amnesty International report manages to completely avoid evening mentioning Islam, at least in the article. Search the page for "Islam" and you get no hits at all, in spite the fact that most of the abuses in the worst countries can be traced directly to Islam.

Amnesty International is a misnomer. They should rename the organization "AntiAmerican International" and be done with it.

re: #136 400lb Gorilla

WOW
The girl in the middle is a TOTAL BABE.

I am going to give up goats immediately.

Cool! I really fancy the one on the right, myself! She has the certain 'je ne sais quois', if you know what I mean. And she really has that Sophia Loren look (I hope...).

well, I'm like a guy myself , not a muslim guy and like I mean, sort of, the Muslim girl in my school is kinda hot -well, maybe she is Muslim- like I 'm kinda not sure and she's like ok.

Joshua

@dmh0667
Admit it, you're just getting taken in because she's shamelessly flashing wrist.

How, for example, would you deal with the wildly different reporting rates among rape victims in different cultures? Those rape statistics that are kept by national police forces and independent researchers are very unreliable. And surely women’s status can’t be reduced to just political or economic participation, or just domestic legal rights, or just the violence they might encounter, but all of those things and many others. That doesn’t make a study impossible to set up, but it makes it very tough.

So, Joshua, you want to wait for some "objective" data before you get concerned.

Why do I have the strange feeling that the "objective"data you are looking for will never arrive no matter what the circumstances?

It sounds like instead of looking for answers you are using the "objective" data excuse as a means to keep yourself from thinking about the daily crises of these women. You feel that if you buy into the oppression of muslim women you will be caving into Bush's Global War on Terror.

But, then isn't that letting your subjective feelings get the best of you? I say forget about Bush and look at these women. Look at the pictures and the stories behind the pictures. Look at the data that is out there on honor killings "objectively," with as few preconceptions as possible, and let the suffering of these women sink in. Open up your heart and start thinking for yourself.

re: #14 Shug

Sickening

the leftist paradigm demands that the only evil in the world, the only thing worth criticizing - is Bush/Cheney. They reside in a very small world filled to overflowing with willful ignorance.

Around 1990 a co-worker told me how when he was in the military he was stationed in the middle east somewhere. He and his posse were walking down some street and there were women in veils, one of the women undid her veil and "flashed" the men a smile.
He thought that was the funniest thing, I guess the ultimate flirt in that area of the world.

I'm certain the one on the left is a she-male...it's the man hands.

Some vapid fool who believes "all cultures are wonderful in their own way and obviously serve the needs of the people who live within that culture -- or else they'd change it, right?"
---
He's never heard the Abraham Lincoln quote: "As I would not be a slave, so I would not be a master..." and has never strained his brain enough to wonder what it would be like if HE faced the same restrictions:

Could not drive a car
Could not be alone with an unrelated female
Could not leave the house without a chaperone
Severe restrictions on employment
Had to cover himself from head to toe except his eyes, even when it's 100 degrees out
Is expected to be agreeable and submissive to his spouse no matter what; the spouse has an absolute right to beat him for any reason
Must accept that his wife might have up to three other husbands
Can be divorced at the whim of the spouse, and never have access to his kids again
...and so on...

Do you suppose the K-Kid would object to living under those conditions?

re: #146 B_Dix

Do you suppose the K-Kid would object to living under those conditions?

He would love it, it so Euro-peon... ;)

Actually he would love it because it is so not American.

Never argue with an idiot. They drag you down to their level then beat you with experience.
--Andrew Welch

"Two things are infinite: the universe and human stupidity; and I'm not sure about the universe."
--Albert Einstein

re: #113 Alouette

Very disturbing.

re: #136 400lb Gorilla

She's showing her nose. The slut.

I'm a risque moslem. I love T and A. Toes and ankles.
?

That's alright our women CEO's can still whip their women CEO's.

These laides in the burkas are the contestants for the Miss Islamic-Universe contest. They are in the "full burka" part of the contest. re: #4 Shug

Nope.

7th century

I hope nobody takes Amnesty International seriously any more.re: #137 DaMav

re: #27 Bobblehead

Here's the problem with libs. They never lose that "brains of mush" mentality even if they graduate from high school or college.

He hasn't seen it yet - maybe we can transport "Joshua" to Saudi Arabia on a flying carpet and he can see firsthand how women are treated. Does this guy reside in a cave (where, come to think of it, many Islamists dwell).

re: #41 MandyManners
Mandymanners I listen to audio books on my drive to work and last week I had A Connecticut Yankee in King Arthur's court by Mark Twain. That's where I heard that one.

Here's the thing that really gets me. These liberal types at Kos tout themselves as being enlightened and modern, yet they are ignorant of everything in the world that does not directly mess with them. Then they turn around and call people here at LGF "racists."

I actually CARE about the women - and men, such as homosexuals, freethinkers, and guys who make the mistake of having long hair - in Arabia and Africa, SE Asia, and Euro enclaves, etc., who suffer at the hands of Islamist bullies. I care about women in Nigeria. I care about gay couples in Tehran. I actually know that the guy who delivered my groceries is from Ivory Coast and really hates France. I know where Ivory Coast is and can spell it in French but don't want to. I care about teen girls in the UK torn between school and boyfriends and their backwards, violent relatives. I KNOW about them.

I doubt most of the Kos kids can find those places on a map, nor would they cross the street to help someone who didn't look just like them.

These are the "liberal" people who are afraid of the city. Personal example - I had people I know freak out when they learned I took the subway home - at about midnight - from a Marilyn Manson concert downtown. You'd think the subway held nothing but Mafiosi with machine guns instead of African Americans getting off the late shift. So far from having problems, I had a nice chat with a bouncer from a bar.

As I suppose everyone’s noticed by now, Joshua Holland’s diary at Kos is simply the first third of his complete post at alternet.org . Check the “Read More” link at Kos.

I find it amusing how Kos is used this way: some snot pinches off a loaf, but realizes that it won’t get much attention at the original site, so a cross-post at Kos is necessary.

Skipping the pseudo-intellectual fencing in the comments section, one poster, “USArmyParatrooper” posts at 9:03:54AM PDT a rebuttal to Josh.

Josh’s rebuttal (at 09:11:24AM PDT):
“It's a collection of anecdotes. You have to have data to draw a comparison between cultures.
All you're doing is observing that . . . It doesn't however, demonstrate that there is a higher rate of very bad things occurring in one culture than another, and it also doesn't adjust for other co-variables that might be at play.
[remaining text not included for brevity, but it is assumed]

The best that Josh can do (last post, as of this writing) is evade and obfuscate.

No, the “anecdotes” are news reports, not hear-say, etc. The reported actions happened, and there are credible witnesses and photographs today. This makes them data points.

BUT, these actions (judicial floggings, stonings, etc.) don't happen here in the West today, nor have they for quite some time (more data points).

Notice that Josh leaves USArmyParatrooper’s post at 9:25:14AM PDT alone; it mentions Amnesty International’s data . . .

But to the important part of Josh’s writing:

“But I've seen no empirical data to suggest that an Islamic majority itself correlates with the subordination of women better than other co-variables like economic development, women's ability to serve in government, a political culture that values the rule of law or access to higher education.”

Might I suggest Jihad Watch’s “Blogging the Qu’ran” by Robert Spencer for exactly what the Quran says about women, their treatment, etc.?

“In other words, you can use a comparison of women's status in Saudi Arabia and Sweden to make an intellectually weak argument for Western superiority, but there's little support for the notion that women living in "traditional" Islamic cultures enjoy a lower social status than those in orthodox Christian, Jewish or Hindu communities, to name a few examples. Think of the perfectly backwards Eastern Orthodox Church, the largest Christian communion in the world.”

We know the approximate per-capita income of Swedes, and can divide the petro-dollars that flow into Saudi by the population to get a comparable number for the Saudis. The influence of religion in both countries is reasonably clear. So, who treats women better?

Speaking of Sweden, how are the immigrant Muslims treating the local Swedish women? Rest of Europe?

Speaking of the Eastern Orthodox Church, how, exactly, are the Copts treated in their native Egypt? I suppose we’ve all seen the videos.

Then Josh writes a paragraph or so later:

“There's quite a bit of research showing that in service and manufacturing economies -- those of wealthier states -- women enjoy a great deal of personal freedom and autonomy, civil and political rights and access to higher education.”

So, in all intellectual honesty, Josh knew this when he pinched off his loaf? He probably also knows that there’s a real absence of “manufacturing” in Islamic countries (but apparently still a lot of old-school “service”).

And, in all intellectual honesty, Josh probably knew that the general condition of women in Western countries is very much better than in Islamic countries.

And Kos is left hosting the loaf.

The comments to the "diary" are an even better light on the way far too many on the left think (if, indeed, what it is they are doing can be defined as thinking).

The pitiful attempts at justification are leaps in "logic" that no one, with half a mind, could even attempt to define.

Once the evidence is found it's ignored. Or maybe it just doesn't register that most people don't like getting flogged or stoned to death, where garments that distort the feminine physique, and basically be concubines to their husbands while having absolutely no power.

OMG. The hands. They are exposed. Who do these women think they are? They are just asking for it. And we all know what IT is.

Or go to Utah, where tens of thousands of Mormon fundamentalists believe that women are literally the property of their fathers or husbands. Of course, Mormon fundamentalists are the exception that proves the endless benevolence and equality of the West, while whatever despicable caricature of justice perpetrated on a woman by the House of Saud is breathlessly recounted as emblematic of Islamic culture as a whole.

If I ever need an example of the Left's use of moral relativism to confuse an issue, I now know where to find it.

These leftist idiots will still be signing the praises of Islamic culture as the knife is slicing through their throats. You can't cure stupid.

What an idiot!

BEST COUNTRIES TO BE A WOMAN

Measures of well-being include life expectancy, education, purchasing power and standard of living.

Iceland [Lutheran Church of Iceland 85.5%]

Norway [Church of Norway 85.7%]

Australia [Catholic 26.4%, Anglican 20.5%, other Christian 20.5%, Buddhist 1.9%, Muslim 1.5%]

Canada [Roman Catholic 42.6%, Protestant 23.3% (including United Church 9.5%, Anglican 6.8%, Baptist 2.4%, Lutheran 2%), other Christian 4.4%, Muslim 1.9%]

Ireland [Roman Catholic 80% 20% Protestant]

Sweden [Lutheran 87%]

Switzerland [Roman Catholic 41.8%, Protestant 35.3%, Muslim 4.3%]

Japan [Shinto and Buddhist 84%]

Netherlands [Roman Catholic 31%, Dutch Reformed 13%, Calvinist 7%, Muslim 5.5%]

France [Roman Catholic 83%-88%, Protestant 2%, Jewish 1%, Muslim 5%-10%]

I have added the religion numbers for each country, since The Star chose to ignore that.
Afghanistan: (officially Islamic Republic )The average Afghan girl will live to only 45 – After three decades of war and religion-based repression, an overwhelming number of women are illiterate. More than half of all brides are under 16, and one woman dies in childbirth every half hour. Domestic violence is so common that 87 per cent of women admit to experiencing it. But more than one million widows are on the streets, often forced into prostitution. Afghanistan is the only country in which the female suicide rate is higher than that of males.
%u2022 Democratic Republic of Congo:(Roman Catholic 50%, Protestant 20%, Kimbanguist 10%, Muslim 10%, other (includes syncretic sects and indigenous beliefs) 10%). It is among the poorest countries in the world. In the eastern DRC, a war that claimed more than 3 million lives has ignited again, with women on the front line. Rapes are so brutal and systematic that UN investigators have called them unprecedented. Many victims die; others are infected with HIV and left to look after children alone. Foraging for food and water exposes women to yet more violence. Without money, transport or connections, they have no way of escape.
%u2022 Iraq: [Muslim 97% (Shi'a 60%-65%, Sunni 32%-37%]. The literacy rate, once the highest in the Arab world, is now among the lowest as families fear risking kidnapping and rape by sending girls to school. Women who once went out to work stay home. Meanwhile, more than 1 million women have been displaced from their homes, and millions more are unable to earn enough to eat.
%u2022 Nepal: [Hindu 80.6%, Buddhist 10.7%, Muslim 4.2%]. Early marriage and childbirth exhaust the country's malnourished women, and one in 24 will die in pregnancy or childbirth. Daughters who aren't married off may be sold to traffickers before they reach their teens. Widows face extreme abuse and discrimination if they're labelled bokshi, meaning witches. A low-level civil war between government and Maoist rebels has forced rural women into guerrilla groups.
%u2022 Sudan:[Sunni Muslim 70%] While Sudanese women have made strides under reformed laws, the plight of those in Darfur, in western Sudan, has worsened. Abduction, rape or forced displacement have destroyed more than 1 million women's lives since 2003. The janjaweed militias have used systematic rape as a demographic weapon, but access to justice is almost impossible for the female victims of violence.
%u2022 Other countries in which women's lives are significantly worse than men's include Guatemala [Roman Catholic, Protestant, indigenous Mayan beliefs], where an impoverished female underclass faces domestic violence, rape and the second-highest rate of HIV/AIDS after sub-Saharan Africa. An epidemic of gruesome unsolved murders has left hundreds of women dead, some of their bodies left with hate messages.

In Mali [Muslim 90%], one of the world's poorest countries, few women escape the torture of genital mutilation, many are forced into early marriages, and one in 10 dies in pregnancy or childbirth.
In the tribal border areas of Pakistan [Muslim 97%], women are gang-raped as punishment for men's crimes. But honour killing is more widespread, and a renewed wave of religious extremism is targeting female politicians, human rights workers and lawyers.
In oil-rich Saudi Arabia [All Saudis are Muslims and most are Sunni], women are treated as lifelong dependents, under the guardianship of a male relative. Deprived of the right to drive a car or mix with men publicly, they are confined to strictly segregated lives on pain of severe punishment.
In the Somali [All Muslim since at least the 14th century] capital, Mogadishu, a vicious civil war has put women, who were the traditional mainstay of the family, under attack. In a society that has broken down, women are exposed daily to rape, dangerously poor health care for pregnancy, and attack by armed gangs.

I read part of that dribble and was impressed with "MBNYC"s destruction of "klizard" who couldn't hold together it's position whatsoever. You can always tell who has and who has not any actual knowledge of the koran and shar'ia law. Even when discussing with my friends (who don't really know anything about islam) they will constantly default to "oh, it can't be that bad". When you give them facts, they fold like a cheap suit on the pc brainwashing they've received. It never ceases to amaze me.

There is a great book for the readers out there, by Jean Sasson called 'Princess'. It is a biography of the life of a Saudi princess (there are over 21,000 members of the Saudi royal family). I could not believe some of the events chronicled within it. Fathers tying chains around their daughters ankles and tossing them into the family pool, while the family and friends watch, because she was making out with foreign men. The sad thing is that the princess always makes the disclaimer that 'these people are misunderstaning Islam and what Muhammad had told them.' I wish that were true. In an amazing feat of self-duplicity, when she realizes that someone is going to be stoned and it is "in the Koran", she still accepts that as legitimate.

How's this for logic?

The reason for covering up the head is so that all muslim women appear hot. It's islam's way of leveling the playing field.

And because we know that leveling the playing field is a liberal's holy creed, this is why they defend muslim countries.

High five!

Anyone?

Anyone?