I am not entirely sure words will suffice...people wonder why Shame cultures are abject failures of every sort---here is one of the symptons that shows the magnitude of the disease.

I think it's time to realize that vast swaths of the world are suffering from mental illness brought on by state- and Islam-sponsored brainwashing. I actually don't hate people like this as much as I pity them. I pity that an organism that once apparently had all the goods to become a normal, loving human being has devolved into an illogical psychopath. Pathetic.

So much for that "it's not Islam, it's cultural" thing people like Queen Rania of Jordan try to push on us.

Unless, of course, it's just coincidence that Islamic countries of many different cultures happen to manifest this particular culturual phenomenon.

Maybe, as the father of the victim, he'll do the right thing, and ask for the death sentence.

Nah, lots more wivces and kiddies where that dishonourable little tramp came from.

C'mon Charles...it just what we call the "different". This is what they do. We have no right to judge, remember?

Maybe, as the father of the victim, he'll do the right thing, and ask for the death sentence.

For himself, you mean?

muslims at their best.

Now I see why europe can't wait to have this there as well.

As a woman I will never understand how the females of the left wing can possibly defend not going in and taking down any Muslim country we have reason to.

I truly believe that this is sexual aparthide. I hope that the failure of the mulim nations in taking advantage of the talents of the female half of their population means that they will never succeed.

They disgust me.

James,

Yup.

By his standards, his intentions were correct, but he erred in that the little girl had not been a victim of rape.

Even by his standards, there should be some remorse.

If ti was you or I, and we'd accidentally killed a child of ours . . .

Fat chance, though.

Either Islam as a religion needs to fundamentally change, or it needs to be eradicated from the face of the Earth, period. The longer we wait to underestand this, the more people will die. As for the posters here on LGF who don't think Islam is the problem like I have been reading the past few days, open your eyes so you too may see.

This is about as sick as it gets.

Things like this make me wonder if people are being overly enthusiastic about Iranians harboring pro-U.S. sentiments or secretly wanting to be liberated. If there were people out in the street demonstrating that this man be brought to justice despite their Islamic rule (like the Saudis did in print media over the girls' school fire deaths), I would be more encouraged.

I know theirs is a repressive society, but this is disgusting. I don't know how any people or government could not want this man tried. Whenever there is an injustice of this type in the U.S., someone speaks out whether it's racism or homophobia or whatever. I really hope their society doesn't roll over and play dead on this one.

Mapgirl,

I don't know if you meant to allude to Kemal Ataturk, founder of modern Turkey but your observation about the talents of fifty percent of the population going to waste was made by him. Unfortunately I cannot presently find the exact quote, but here's another:

"The reason for failure in society is arising from the negligence and deficiency that we are showing to our women. 1923"

Point of information:

Honour killing of women is rife among the palestinians.

Mainstream media doesn't touch the subject.

Lots of info readily available, though.

I have three children including one daughter. How could any father do this? God have mercy on her soul. None for him. FASTER PLEASE

Oh Allah, give me the power to behead my own child. May Your will be shown in her brutal slaying at my hands, and may all infidels and the usurper-Jews die in such a fashion, as well.

If you have any doubts whatsoever about the cruel nature of Islamic society and Islamic law, this story should dispel them. This is not an isolated incident. This kind of atrocity against women happens frequently in Islamic societies, not just in Arab countries but also in Iran, in Pakistan, etc. It's not just the Arabs as a people, but the Islamic culture that is the problem.

This man MURDERED HIS OWN 7-YEAR-OLD DAUGHTER to defend his alleged "honor, fame and dignity." Khazir, you fecal worm, you have none of any of those. You have DIShonor, INfamy and INdignity. May you burn in Hell for all eternity.

You know what is really sad.... This father had no love for his daughter expressed in this article. He didn't take a chance and take her to a hospitle to verify the rape charge. It is a tragity that things like this are encouraged throughout the muslim world. Over 1 billion people have the potential to be subjected to this either as a victom, or a killer. I wonder what the mother of this child had to say about his actions.... though she can't express them.

How digsusting! Savages!

Here in America, we are civilized. We let the archbishop move the priest involved to a new city.

Maine's Michael -

Do you have information about honor killings? I would love to be able to showcase them when discussing Palestinian human rights abuses by Palestinians.

What a sick, twisted society and religion. As a Chrsitian, my religion teaches me to forgive. However, if my child had been raped by an uncle......there WOULD be a death involved, and it wouldn't be my innocent child. It would be the uncle. I would hopefully have the presence of mind to at least confirm the rape before going to the extreme of killing someone.

Laurence:
Please, find me references to an archbishop relocating a priest after he brutally beheads one of his young parishoners.

Moral equivalency makes me sick.

What scares me most about these kind of stories, is why aren't they represented in the press? Why isn't this in our local papers? I saw this story first listed under "Oddly Enough" on Yahoo news. That is the same section where they list funny things celebraties have said and strange stories of hamsters driving miniature cars.

I can't understand how this disgusting type of story gets a small mention and we're all supposed to say "hey, isn't that weird?" when stories about Arafat condemning violence (yeah, right) get top billing. That's the scariest thing of all.

Two things I don't understand about this article:

1) How could any human being do that.
2) How could Reuters report that "A post-mortem, however, showed the girl was still a virgin" indicating that if she weren't, this would be acceptable conduct? That a seven year old rape victim should be beheaded?

Can someone explain the difference between this "Religion of Peace", and the Charles Manson cult of a few decades back?

Ariel,

DO a google search, keywords palestinian, honor killing. Lots of stuff there. From reputable sources, to boot.

I can see killing the uncle in a rage after such an accusation, but a child?

How does this make any sense?

Westoner:
Up to and including 1 billion people.

Also, their creed is written down.

And the birthplace of their religion has oil.

I seriously can't add much. I mean, how many ways can you say, "that is the most disgusting thing I've ever heard of?"
Makes me wish there was a god and that he would spend eternity torturing that asshole.
Does it show how biased I am that I can't possibly conceive how being raped somehow brings shame on the woman and her family but apparently not the rapist?

People in Iran are protesting and condemning this man, right?

Right?

MikeC:
From the article:

Local people have called for the man, who has been arrested, to be hanged, but under Iran's Islamic law only the father of the victim has the right to demand the death sentence.

See the perversity of this situation?

#31 - Ugh. Hopefully a court will have the power to bring this man to justice.

MikeC said:

"People in Iran are protesting and condemning this man, right?"

"Right? "

Considering that the quoted text itself said that his neighbors wanted this guy hanged, and the dateline was Tehran, then yes, I'd say so. Not too surprising, really: that country is ripe for regime change...

Moe

waiting for the trolls to come over and justify this....

perhaps with "Well, Jews use the blood of muslim children to make matzah on passover"

As logical as any other apology they manage to throw up about multiculturalism and the "righteousness" of the "arab" cause.

What kind of human being could do this?

That was rhetorical right? For it seems obvious that no human would do or even countenence such a thing.

You want to find the last vestige of chattel slavery? It's called Islam, the slaves are women and non-muslims, and they've had some extra time to make it even more monstrous than ever before.

Evening all readers!

In Australia the armchair socialists about 30 years ago decided to make Australia a more interesting place and allowed the immigration of islamic people into what was a nearly homogenous society based on the british rule of law and democracy. As a result these people settled in a few areas of western Sydney they now call their own. These days their children are raping and robbing australians. However they don't just inflict their pain upon innocent Australians - they seek to maintain their families honour where their daughters become to "australian" - this has led to arabic daughters go into hiding after daddy has decided that the family name must not be brought into disrepute - what would the neighbours think?? There was a big show on tv in Australia a few years ago where some imported Syrian Allahbot was going to kill his daughter and she went into police protection then there was a girl who moved in with her christian boyfriend - she was killed because her family were suspicious that she was no longer a virigin - who was going to marry the other sisters if they are nothing but sluts???? Something had to be done!! Unfortunately she was still a virgin so now someone is doing time for a pointless act. Of course you mention these things and you are declared a racist. However I believe that the western way of life is superior and I think its time people became a bit more vocal about it - start talking to taxi drivers and tell them what you think.

Actually, Jim, it's wider than just women. Saudi Arabia officially ended slavery in the 1960's, but their treatment of foreign workers comes real close. There are, of course, constant rumors that they still buy slaves from their good pals in the Sudan.

This is a pretty disgusting story. But unfortunately incest and cruel behaviour happen all over the world.
Pathetic justifying of it by some flimsy religious pretext is really not the point.
It is worth saying that it is not the religion, or the race which is responsible.
It's the individual...

As a woman I will never understand how the females of the left wing can possibly defend not going in and taking down any Muslim country we have reason to.

Mapgirl, hardcore leftist feminists (or FemiNazis as Rush Limbaugh puts it) will not openly condemn this behavior or publically call upon the US to use it's military might to stop this because it would kill them to be on America's side on ANY matter. This is the same group that had no problem with the violence that ensued in communist "revolutions" around the world, but God forbid America try to use violence to right some wrongs around the world. I've had this conversation several times with a female friend of mine who can't understand why I loathe modern feminism and why I refuse to call myself a feminist. Of course I support men and women having equal rights before the law, but feminists like Catherine Mackinnon, Gloria Steinem, etc, go far beyond that. It is my opinion that what is called feminism today (at least the highly concentrated kind you find in universities) is really just fascism with a feminine face. Hardcore leftist feminists have been steadily working to undermine and corrode the basic foundations of this society. Now you expect them to be on this society's side? You saw real feminism up close and personal during the Monica Lewinsky mess. Why didn't they publically condemn Clinton for his shenanigans? Just a few years earlier, they had just banned together to run some Republican out of Congress for the same foolishness (I forget his name), but for Clinton, we hear silence. They screamed and howled over the Anita Hill/Clarence Thomas debacle, but they ran for cover when allegations of Clinton possibly having raped Kathleen Willey surfaced. They joined in on the character lynchings of Paula Jones and Linda Tripp. I'm not saying that Clinton did rape Kathleen Willey or that Linda Tripp was a total saint. I am saying however, that the leaders of today's feminist movement are a bunch of hypocrites of the first order. Consequently, I don't expect any expression of solidarity with the Bush Administration's war against Islamofascists. Frankly, I'm just glad that the only thing they can think of to do these days is launch a boycott of Augusta National Golf Course because it's a private course for men only. Yeah, that's all that's going on in the world of international women's rights. That, and yet another successful takedown of a Bush judicial nominee because she had the crazy notion of enforcing the law concerning parental notifications for teenage abortions.

That something like this could happen is a perversion. That it is not only allowed, but sanctioned by religion, tradition and culture is something for which I can find no words. It is evil incarnate.

Someone who's "honor" depends on the death of a seven year old child has no honor to begin with.

Hey Rob - I can second that - I know for a fact that Brazilian nannies in the UK are turned into slaves who are made to sleep on the floor with no right to leave the house and do more than just nannying for the Saudi families in the land of the infidel.

What a crime it would be to rain down freedom and democracy on such wonderfully diverse (and by implication, superior) cultures as this one (see Crackpot of the Month).

The good news is that, after a few decades of oppression that cannot possibly be blamed on America, the Iranians are starting to wake up. Perhaps justice will still be served. We can hope.

An Iranian man cut off his seven- year-old daughter's head after suspecting she had been raped by her uncle, the Jomhuri-ye Eslami newspaper said on Sunday.

A post-mortem, however, showed the girl was still a virgin.

"The motive behind the killing was to defend my honor, fame, and dignity," the paper quoted the father as saying.

Let us contrast this with the recent story of the two California teen girls who were kidnapped from their boyfriends' cars. Their kidnapper sexually assaulted both girls, but they continued to fight him. Finally, due to the Amber Alert system, the police were able to find the van they were traveling in and shoot and kill the kidnapper before he was able to find a spot to kill and dump the girls. Now what happened when the families of these girls finally got their little girls back? Did they beat them? Did they attempt to kill them? No, they hugged and kissed them and thanked God that they were alive. The families of those girls readily got on television to share their stories, and the girls proudly showed their lovely faces on the cover of People magazine. And this is just one more example of why we are right to wage war against Islamofascism, and why we will win, and they will lose. And when they lose, perhaps then there will be a chance to salvage something of their civilization.

Can anyone say SATANIC VERSES

Perhaps with GHADAFFI heading the UN human Rights commision these sadistic misogynistic practises will finaly cease. Oh wait, no they won't.

this is, of course, the fault of the usurper jew zionist...somehow...

#36 and #41:

I entirely share your sentiments, but allow me to take issue with your screen name. While your choice is obviously motivated by the justified and commendable desire to stick it to the muslims, it's necessary to remember what historical crusades actually were.

Despite all the present attepmts to put a spin on them as "defensive wars" (which they were, to some extent), crusades were much more of an "equal opportunity" slaughter then it's commonly thought.
Crusaders slaughtered every Jew that they could get their itchy hands on, both in Europe and in the Holy Land. The 4th crusade never even got to the Holy Land: prodded by the Venetian Doge, the Christ-loving warriors captured Constantinople instead, plundered and burned it and slaughtered its citizens. (Many think that the rift between Western and Eastern Christianity became irreparable after this final atrocity).

So, you see, islamists have to be ruthlessly crushed, but not under the dubious banners of mass psychosis and horrible atrocities that Christianity itself long since (hopefully) outgrew.

#39 (B in AZ)

"…Hardcore leftist feminists (or FemiNazis as Rush Limbaugh puts it) will not openly condemn this behavior or publically call upon the US to use it's military might to stop this because it would kill them to be on America's side on ANY matter."

"…

I have my differences with the feminist establishment, but what you say simply isn't true. NOW and the Feminist Majority Foundation, both frequent targets of Limbaugh's blowhard rhetoric, were trying to alert the world to the plight of women under the Taliban way before 9/11. Go to their sites right now and you'll see that they're trying to bring worldwide attention to victims of radical Islam, like the case of the Nigerian woman who was sentenced to death by stoning for adultery. They have long decried the treatment of women in Saudia Arabia, which is our "eternal friend" according to Mr. Bush.

As I said, I get sick of the reflexive anti-Americanism on the part of SOME, but to tar all leftists and/or all feminists with the same brush as some folks seem so eager to do is inaccurate, divisive and just plain wrong.

Animals! Filthy, disgusting savages! I have said it before, and I will say it again. Islam and civilization are not compatible. No philosophy that advocates, or even tolerates such barbarism can possibly coexist with a civilized society.

Riyadh delenda est!

#47 - Lots of passion in your post, but fundamentally incorrect. If you read up history of the beginnings of Islam, one of the first things that it had accomplished was emancipation of women in the region, so far as civil rights, ownership of property, etc, are concerned. As applies to children, it at the time ended the practice of killing infant daughters by burying them alive (as sons were more desirable).

Using this, and Arab treatment of women in general as examples, things have gone many many steps backwards in regards to treatment of women in Islamic culture. I know that what hapenned is a result of the actions of one sick individual (and people there must be outraged), but the fact that he may never be brought to justice is beyond wrong, and is indicative of something very wrong in the present culture.

I wonder of people in the region even realize this. Yet another reason why all the smart people left that area decades ago.

Was Laurence Simon trying to make a joke, or was it an attempt to draw moral equivalency between child molestation (a horrific crime that deserves draconian punishment) and the actual beheading of a young girl by her father? In the former crime, the child at least survives.

The saving grace of some people is that you don't have to wonder if they're dumb. Their words give them away.

Brandi # 39,
The senator was Robert Packwood of Oregon. For twenty years he had been doing the same vile things but the feminists gave him a free ride because he was always a reliable vote in their favor in the Senate. After Clinton got in I guess they figured he was now expendable.

The Muslims are not alone in the honor killing business. Sikhs have been known to do it too.

Andrew (#38), unfortunately it's not the individual -- it's a culture that treats this type of behavior as a legitimate cultural norm. Had this man done this in the U.S., he'd be sentenced to death, and it wouldn't happen too often after that. In Iran, he's considered to have acted appropriately. When that attitude permeates a culture, it teaches people that there's nothing wrong with such actions. Do you really think that this would happen as frequently if people were punished rather htan feted for it?

That type of thinking is what led us to 9/11. We refused to admit that terrorism and murder were part of a wide Islamist culture, funneling massive amounts of cash to an incredibly well-organized infrastructure. Instead, we told ourselves that the threats emanated from a few deranged individuals -- after all, no culture can santion murder, right?

Terorrism will stop when, as a nation, we're ready to acknowledge that there's a cesspool in the Middle East that need to be drained and brought up to code. We need to fundamentally modernize Islamic culture, not tell ourselves that there's a few bad apples everywhere.

Robert Crawford - #37

Isn't it interesting how the black community - whose most ardent supporters have been Jews - is becoming more and more Jew-hating and more and more supportive of the very people who sold their ancestors into slavery?

Turncoats!!! Shame on them.

Read this scorching attack on Bill O'Reilly's apparent collusion with the Saudis to deflect attention from the kidnapping of 2 US girls:

"The Blowhard Zone"

[Link: www.opinionjournal.com...]

"Honour killings" are obviously nothing more than ego-stroking. Given that the object of religion is to negate the ego in favour of God, the fact that religion is used to JUSTIFY such killings is doubly disgusting.

#52 -- It's not the "black community", it the "black activist community". Not the same groups of people. Unfortunately, only the activists get press.

McKinney was voted out in the supposedly "safe" precincts by a majority of the black voters. The antisemitic noises you hear are from the Nation of Islam types (who aren't -- or at least until recently weren't -- really Muslim) and the idiots who have bought into racist fantasies.

Re: Google"Palestinian honour killing"

6,810 hits.

"palestinian honor killing"

19,600 hits.

"islam honor killing"

23,500 hits.

I feel like the mosquito in the nudist colony - I don't know where to begin.

Robert - you're right. I shouldn't have been so general.
However, these folks appear to be having quite an influence on the non-radicals to the extent (as far as I've seen) that relations between blacks and Jews are as low as they have ever been, and are continuing to spiral downward.

Robert Crawford #55.....

watch CSPAN any morning when they go over the days newspapers....

every time an African American calls in they are very critical and unsympathetic towards Jews

Wouldn't it be wonderful if you could find you were surprised when you read this stuff? (Just daydreaming.)

Notice, of course, that it is a "conservative" society. Is there anything Reuters won't do to smear Republicans?

It also struck me that the father said that "The motive behind the killing was to defend MY honor, fame, and dignity." It was not even to do anything for his family, to save his daughter's soul, to fulfill some perverted sense of justice, etc. It was just selfishness, pure and simple. His daughter's life was obviously worth less than his fame. Selfishness and ego triumphs over all. This seems to apply to the whole region.

This is one of the main reasons that I shudder when I hear about this great "religion of peace".

I imagine that you'd find similar evil in most of these lovely theocracies, such as the absolutely horrific female circumcisions that are practiced rather rampantly in many parts of Africa.

There's simply nothing like a religion which has actually gone backwards in time over the past 13 centuries... first they were a few steps forward, then slammed right back to the time of Mohammed.

Aaron #61

This is one of the major defects of cultures based on "honor". Not to say that the concept of honor isn't wonderful, but societies where personal honor is paramount, and takes precedence over justice, loyalty, goodnesss, and compassion are a perversion of the highest order.

I have my differences with the feminist establishment, but what you say simply isn't true. NOW and the Feminist Majority Foundation, both frequent targets of Limbaugh's blowhard rhetoric, were trying to alert the world to the plight of women under the Taliban way before 9/11. Go to their sites right now and you'll see that they're trying to bring worldwide attention to victims of radical Islam, like the case of the Nigerian woman who was sentenced to death by stoning for adultery. They have long decried the treatment of women in Saudia Arabia, which is our "eternal friend" according to Mr. Bush.

I have not heard any of them say "Thank you" to US military for taking action against the Taliban. We all know that we didn't go into Afghanistan to set the women in burkas free, but it was a rather happy side effect. While we remain in the region to stabilize it, we hold back the darker side of the Northern Alliance/new Afghan government, giving them a chance to choose a different path. Little girls are going to school again, and that wouldn't have happened without American military might. It would have been nice to hear some of the groups who have denigrated the military for being misogynistic say "good job." I won't hold my breath.

SARCASM ALERT -

For those that missed it, or aren't familiar with his absolutely irreverant view of life - yes Laurence Simon was just doing what earned him a listing under "Cyanide Laced Cool Aid" on the Vodka Pundit blogroll.

END SARCASM ALERT -

For my own comment, I'd say that the sicko bonehead at least accomplished his goal of defending his fame...or infamy.

Since hanging, shooting, electrocuting, and cyanide gassing are oft denounced as cruel and inhumane, might I suggest he be strapped into a chamber that is slowly filled with pure Nitrogen. With his daughter's head in his lap, looking at him.

Brandi in AZ:

Not only did the feminists not say "Thank you" to the military, Gloria Steinem signed the "Not in Our Name" anti-war petition. Cate, I agree that feminists drew attention to the plight of women under the Taliban, but how, exactly, did they expect things to change over there? My gripe with those feminists who overlap with the lala left is this: they seem to think that lighting candles, holding rallies, and wearing ribbons is sufficient action in and of itself. I always felt rather cynical about those "Take Back the Night" marches, because the only people who are pro-rape are rapists and they don't give a damn about marches. No other moral adult, male or female, needs to be told rape is bad. Instead of holding candles, women need to be walking around carrying pepper spray (I averted a mugging in DC with the stuff) or taking self-defense classes. (Or carrying a handgun, if you live in a state where that's legal. I don't and I don't want to get involved in a gun control debate in this forum. I'm just mentioning an option some women have).

The decline of feminism is one reflection of the decline of the left in general. Activists are more interested in attacking easy targets and making themselves feel good than in dealing reasonably and pragmatically with tough issues.

#66 (Donna)

Cate, I agree that feminists drew attention to the plight of women under the Taliban, but how, exactly, did they expect things to change over there? My gripe with those feminists who overlap with the lala left is this: they seem to think that lighting candles, holding rallies, and wearing ribbons is sufficient action in and of itself.

Oh, I agree that their tactics are ineffective. I won't hold my breath waiting for them to praise the military for stepping in either. But Brandi is dead wrong about them not openly condemning Islamist oppression of women; they were among the first to do so, and they're still doing it.

Somewhat off topic but related: I find this rush to paint the conflict in left-right terms very disheartening. Like many misleading stereotypes, there's a grain of truth in it. There ARE people who reflexively blame the US for all the worlds ills, and they are as poisonous to any real discussion of the issues as the xenophobic, bigoted reactionaries who stifle debate from the other end of the spectrum.

But from where I sit, one of the most striking political legacies of 9/11 is the schism it created across traditional ideological boundaries. There are very brave people on the left taking on old allies and standing up for what used to be called traditional liberal values -- tolerance, secularism and freedom. I don't think they get enough credit around here.

I think in many ways, the old political labels are obsolete. But they certainly make a handy club and, more importantly, a substitute for more detailed analysis. I think it's a shame, that's all.

Cate re #67:

The fact is that idiotarian community consists primarily of leftists. This is not to say that all leftists are anti-American, nor that there are not nutty right-wingers out there of the racist variety, or the occasional unprincipled businessmen. However, the condemnations of America that you see in the media today are coming mainly from the left. How many conservative commentators are saying that America deserved what it got, or that patriotism is bad, or that we should examine our own faults before we condemn other cultures?

I personally prefer to divide the political spectrum up into freedom vs. statism, rather than the traditional liberal vs. conservative.

How many conservative commentators are saying that America deserved what it got

Not many, you're right. However, Pat "Cocksuckers and Rug-Munchers Brought This On Us" Robertson comes to mind. (If that asylum escapee can be called "conservative", of course.)

#68 (Steve)

Well, there was that incredibly stupid statement by Jerry Falwell and Pat Robertson about God allowing the terrorists to attack the US because of the ACLU, NOW, gays in the military, etc. As a resident of the Deep South, I can vouch for the fact that it's a sentiment that's fairly widely shared, though most people aren't dumb enough to say it in front of a camera or in print.

Anyway, I understand that there's a lot of blame-America-first crap coming from a certain segment of the left, and it is infuriating and deserves to be refuted at every opportunity. But like you said, not all leftists are anti-American. In fact, most of them are not, and many are speaking out against the ones who are. But you'd never know it from reading some of the comments around here.

This incident and the culture/religion that supports it must be erradicated in the full.

I've already e-mailed the Pej. I think we need to send him back to Iran to kick some ass and then install him as Shah

HappyDay (#48) - Islam is as Islam does. Your comments, although well-meaning, are analogous to saying that Torquemada wasn't a very good Christian. That may well be right. Scant comfort to the myriad innocents he tortured to death, I fear.

So Islam outlawed infanticide. Well mercy me. Mohammed consummated one of his marriages when his bride was nine. So you're not allowed to bury little girls alive, but you're allowed to rape them. What, are these guys gunning for a sensitivity awareness award or something?

Islam, in the sense in which it exists in a very large portion of the world, is simply incompatible with our way of life. The Koran is a book detailing the teachings of an illiterate merchant. A goodly portion of it is incomprehensible gibberish. We have a term these days for people who claim to be talking to God (hint: it's not 'prophet').

It's also disingenuous to say, as I've seen in may places, that fundamentalist Christians are just as bad as fundamentalist Islamists. Although Creationists and other evolution-deniers might be moronic wackoes, at least they don't really believe their Bible. I mean, it's not like Creationists actually go around executing people who break the Sabbath (Exodus 31:13-14). The problem is, there's a lot of people in the Muslim world who really do try to do what the Koran says.

Cate:

That's why I said "those feminists who overlap with the lalaleft." I don't think you're a member of the "lala" left, any more than I think my siblings and some of my good friends who are sensible liberals are loons (although we have heated arguments, they're always civilized.) That's why I try to remember to use "loony" or "lala" or "wingnut" to describe the lefties I have in mind. It's people like Chomsky, Alec Baldwin, Fisk, Andrea Dworkin and theDem.Underground/Wetlog/Warbloggerwatch crowd I'm thinking of, not everyone who voted for Gore in 2000.

And...this isn't the place to diss the feminazis no matter how much I despise them.

The topic should be the islamic women who are 100% complicit in the honor killings of their daughters.

Sorry but I stopped having sympathy for the chadored/abayaded/hijabed women of the middle east long ago.

They are ignorant swine who not only buy into the whole debasement of women including female genital mutilation, honor killing and selling their prepubescent daughters into marriage but they readily perpetrate these horrors.

P.S. to Cate:

There are very brave people on the left taking on old allies and standing up for what used to be called traditional liberal values -- tolerance, secularism and freedom. I don't think they get enough credit around here.

Well, Charles is a self-described liberal and I give him oodles of credit. And I also give you and Riverman credit too, although I don't always agree with you:-)

#75 (Donna)

Thanks for making the distinction. It is appreciated.

"What kind of human being could do this?" The problem is moslems are not humans. They remind me humanoid aliens from some science fiction movies. They only look like us.

Cate 'n Q:

That awful Falwell/Robertson thing was the only such statement I could think of off the top of my head, while at the same time I could easily bring to mind many disgusting statements from prominent liberals.

In very general terms, I think that the left is more prone to be anti-American than the right by virtue of their basic ideology. Lefties are more likely to subscribe to the relativist/multiculturalist set of ideas, and see shades of gray everywhere; while righties are more likely to be religionists, with an absolutist sense of morality. That makes it harder for the left, and easier for the right, to condemn what has happened, and to feel a strong sense of conviction that America is good and the Islamists are evil. Of course, this is just a generalization. Your mileage may vary.

As a disclaimer, I am not a leftie or a rightie. I am happy to pick on stupidity wherever I find it.

"'The motive behind the killing was to defend my honor, fame, and dignity,' the paper quoted the father as saying."

Listen up, America: this man's honor and dignity were more important to him than HIS DAUGHTER'S LIFE.

Just imagine how highly YOU rate on his list of values.

Faster, faster.

Laurence Simon (#19)

LOL!

So now I've read past post #19, and it seems I'm the only one who thinks Laurence Simon's comment was funny.

Maybe 'cos I know he doesn't do the 'moral equivalency' thang?

I can't find the words to express how I feel about this story.

Just that if it were my husband who did that to my daughter, he'd be long dead.

What's also interesting is that now the neighbors are clamoring for the uncle's death... even though a medical examination shows the girl was never raped.

And then the esteemed Mr. Chomsky declares that the US is the only nation in the world where people regularly seek vengeance against the innocent.

Riiiiiiiiiiiiiiight.

Betcha the father demands the death sentence for the uncle anyhow. Gotta defend the old honor, and to hell with any of those damn facts that get in the way.

To poster #82: I think if you reread the excerpt quoted, it seems most probable that the man whose death the neighbors are clamoring for is the murderous FATHER, not the uncle. I agree that the way it's written is somewhat confusing, though.

In Iran, he's considered to have acted appropriately.

Are so sure of that? The story I read said people were clamoring for this... no, I can't say he deserves the name of "father"... this murderer to be brought to justice. That doesn't sound like they think he acted appropriately.

HappyDay #48,

If you read up history of the beginnings of Islam, one of the first things that it had accomplished was emancipation of women in the region, so far as civil rights, ownership of property, etc, are concerned.

I don't know what history books your reading. Islam brought the Arabs from the 6th Century to the 7th Century. I suppose that was a big step in the context of the times. Of course being frozen in the 7th century for the last 1500 years isn't something to brag about.

The Islamic world is a cess pool today because that is the inevitable outcome of their culture and values which are stuck in the 7th century.

Quick historical question: Why do you suppose Spain, the Balkans and Russia are the most backward parts of Europe? Could it be that they were once under the "Islamic yoke"?

It is worth saying that it is not the religion, or the race which is responsible. It's the individual...

true that it's the individual who's responsible for the act, but when the religion and the religiously based legal system turns a blind eye to, or tacitly encourages, such acts, it bears a share of the responsibility - as do its Western apologists. nobody attempted to justify or excuse what Andrea Yates did out of "respect" for "Texan Christian culture", least of all the Texas criminal justice system...

Islam is a primitive religion.

Now that I've got your attention, let me try out this wacky theory I've been mulling recently.

It seems that religions go through recognizable growth stages, somewhat in line with societal movements of the time, but to sum it up: the younger a religion is, the more reactionary, xenophobic and violent it is.

Look at the oldest recognized world religions... Hinduism, Daosim, Judaism, etc. All well established, and no recent (past few hundred years) history of major violent incursions.

Chrisitianity, which is nearing the 2000 mark (didn't really become established until 66 AD) is relatively calm right now, but it was behind some fairly nasty stuff until just a couple hundred years back. And history is laced with monstrous crimes committed by the Catholic church. With the exception of crazed militia types, the Klan and the Christian Identity movement, the worst most Chrisitian's will offer is "If you're not just like me, you'll go to Hell", and that's all.

Islam, which is around 1300 years old, is currently steeped in bloodshed all around the world. And they seem to be the major component of just about all the theocractic nations, as well as the inspiration for a majority of the worlds major terrorist organizations. With few exceptions, just about every Arab majority country is intolerantly Moslem, and seems to have a burning desire to convert (by fire and sword) or kill the heathens in their region. In fact, the only exceptions that come to mind are Tunisia and Turkey, but neither is a church state.

Even stranger is that it seems that these newer religions are less creative than those of old, borrowing much of their collective reading material from their predecessors.

How can any Father (whose sole purpose as a father is to protect, defend and teach love to his children) perform such a inhuman act?

I have a 2 year old daughter. The day I read this news I thought about her at work all day.
When I see even a scrtach she incurred from the playground at the daycare, I hug her, coddle her and feel guilty for leaving her there. That night I held her on my chest and found myself teary eyed everytime I thought of the cowardly act that happened in the world that day.

This kind of torture is being unleashed on girls and women in the Mid. and far East. There are so called "honor killings", "beatings", "rapes" and in China newborn girls are thrown into wells because "they wanted a boy"......I thought that as a society we were progressing and becoming "civilized".

"How a man is allowed to treat or dismiss his women (daughters, mothers, wives) is a KEY INDICATOR of how he WILL treat others."

l simon#19.......... you would be foolish to think that only priests molest children. what does "digsusting" mean? any thing to do with "civilized"?

Hear Hear Judy !!! # 89