Hard to keep up with you this afternoon, Charles!

I don't know, but it's almost an encouraging sign that Al-Queda and co. are only able to launch rather limited operations against targets in their own countries--- makes me Bush really has made a major dent in global terrorism.

The vultures have come home to the Saudi nest to roost.

Hey, remember the explosion of terrorism that was going to follow war in Iraq (and was going to follow war in Afghanistan too, for that matter)?

Well, there it is. A few car bombs in Saudi Arabia, no reported fatalities. Tragic whatever the damage was, but I can't help noticing the continued failure of al-Qaeda to touch the US.

Heard on the radio that the asswipes purposefully targetted a neighborhood recreation center.

Brave, brave, Islamofascist "men". Their balls are soooo big, they have to attack nurseries, night clubs, and rec centers. I guess after Afghanistan and Iraq they're too yellow to attack armed Americans.

Although, I have no doubt the Saudis will eventually explain all this away as another alcohol smuggler fight.

They've been asking us to leave and when we announce that we are leaving they pull this crap. Still more proof that these people can't be negotiated with: you give them what they want and they try to kill you anyway.

Remember we americans are the "inhuman pigs", "with no respect for human life." and are the "evil white devils" and have "no morals" and are "racist" cause we think "legitamate armed struggle" such as suicide bombing is not the most nobel act a human can do. And are "facsist" cause we take peoples death threats on their honor. This is the lefts war. They wanted it, its our defensive arms against them all.

Fuck these fucking arrrahhh! The first leftist I see in the act of making foam and shit come out of their mouth in person is going to taste my fist, repeatedy, unleash the bulldozers!

I hope to G-d that Paul of Arabia is safe.

#8

Oh yeah.

Does anyone know where he resides in SA?

#6

You are exactly right. These people can never run out of "reasons" to kill us. They hate the U.S. and the Jews, and it is obvious that diplomacy will never change that.

There also was a bombing in Chechnya that killed 41 people. "It looks like it was a suicide bomber," an official said. Chechnya Bomb Kills at Least 41

Paul of Arabia is not in Saudi Arabia; I'm sure he's fine.

CNN was reporting that the authorities were looking for "19 men, most of whom are believed to be Saudi Arabian".

Now why does that sound so familiar?

#12

Cool.

I thought I recalled him talking about his job teaching Saudi kids or something like that......

Anywho,

#6 and #10

So very true. You could give them the key to the candy store and they would bitch that they had to unlock the door.

Personally, I am going to sit back and wait for the Saudi "mainstream" muslims to denounce this act. I will post when my beard reaches record lengths.

Nice to know these fine young men paid attention to what the imams said in their mosques over the weekend.

So is it too absurd to talk about encouraging Americans - and other westerners - to leave SA? I mean, leave, go, pull up stakes and split. I'm sure there are a few "Lawrence" types who'll want to stay on, but I'm talking about all the administrators and embassy staff and military advisers and Brit oil workers and the Germans who build their highways and the like. Gone, left, wind and tumbleweed whistling down the streets.

Since they can't run a successful modern society without outside help, let's see them try to keep up with the early 20th (never mind early 21st) century without our help.

I'm actually serious about this.

I would flatten medina...
then evaluate further

these bastards need to be sobered up,
and I think, sooner or later, this will need to be done

remember, in america, when someone kills someone and claims that god told them to do it, - so far, we call them crazy and charge them with murder

what to do when a culture claims god is telling them to murder...what to do, what to do??

The Saudi Princes are no better than the Al Quaeda scum. We will leave then they can go at each other. Have fun killing each other boys. I could care less. Come after us though and get crushed.

#16 we shouldn't leave without giving them a nice fruit basket of appreciation for letting us stay awhile however. We should also deliver a kind and worthy fruit basket to iran, after all they are so lovely.

I wonder how John Bradley at Arab News will spin this to be the fault of the west, that is if he wasn't nailed by by the blasts.

I wonder what's going through his mind right now.

He could always go on to edit Better Compounds and Security Perimeters.

Ya gotta wonder if Powell is like the Star Trek landing party "red-shirts..."

the saudis are threatening powell
powell is the number three man in the US

the US must respond to them in a way that THEY will understand

it is futile to talk to them,

it must be violent, and it must be big!

From Fox News:

A Saudi hospital official told Reuters that an unspecified number of Westerners and Saudis were killed.

A small consolation:

A U.S. official traveling with Powell said they had been told that there were no American casualties in the explosions.

Here's my two cents.

If the Islamic freaks want to live with their heads in the sand, let's pull all Western talent and brains out of these countries and let's slowly watch their infrastructure disappear...wither away.

And they would call that paradise.

Freaks.

On Wednesday, authorities said they foiled plans by at least 19 suspected terrorists to carry out strikes and seized a large cache of weapons and explosives in the capital.

All escaped after a gunfight with police.

FOX

Well now, isn't that convenient.

all we in the west need to do,
is take them seriously...

when they yell, jihad, war
respond to them with war

respond to them seriously on OUR terms not theirs

Wherever Powell goes, these sorts of attacks follow. It seems as though they are trying to warn him. Many of us recall that the last time he went to visit Arafat, there was an assassination attempt on him which was absolutely underpublicized. I wonder if our 'allies' the Saudis made an assassination attempt - would it get underpublicized? After all, the Saudis, unlike the palestinians, don't have their primary raison d'etre as Jew-killing, so many otherwise sympathetic media organs would have to hold them to some sort of standard.

OT (but not too far away from the topic):
Rights group: hatred of Jews at highest level since WWII
from Haaretz

For Bradley of Arabia

Ask Not For Whom the Bombs Blasted, John

They blew for thee.

They blew for thee.

Timed to coincide with the Chechen and Moscow bombs.

UPDATE: Is it just me, or is the media being incredibly blasé about this story? Shouldn’t this be major news? Why are the networks still dwelling on the Laci Peterson case?

What's the news value of murder by Islamofascists? It's not like it's a new or unusual occurance.

Besides, they probably don't have any reporters in Saudi Arabia. If they did, none of them would be able to get near the scene. The Saudis need to plant beer bottles and crosses to make it obvious it was the act of alcohol smugglers.

charles-- you know what people like to watch on tv....

laci peterson happened here and involved sex and murder and an attractive young couple.

the terrorist attack was there: foreigners. thousands of miles away.

nobody identifies. nobody cares.....

welcome to our world!

After all, the Saudis, unlike the palestinians, don't have their primary raison d'etre as Jew-killing

Huh? Are you sure about that?

Here's an idea: Let's end the embargo on Cuba -- flood the zone with US tourists and culture, Castro won't last a month -- and stick the embargo on the Saudis. I'm sure the Iraqis will be happy to get the dollars. Oh, and no Saudi students here either.

As to the media coverage, Fox is on top of it, although there appears to be little aside from speculation now.

CNN is running the Major League Softball Pitching Team Captain, Larry King interviewing the buffoon Russel Yates.

you have to remember,
the west is absolutely no threat to these bastards

they could eat goats and fuck their daughters forever

but the minute they claim god has directed them to kill us,
or declare eternal war, jihad, against us...
and they act upon this

they become a threat, and deserve to be utterly destroyed

the sooner the better

Give them one week to round up the Islamofascists, then raise the temperature of Mecca, Medina and Rihyad to 3000 degrees.

First you have to get their attention!

This is all part of the grand scheme to first eliminate Jews from the planet; then whatever other group suits the fancy of the Islamists, and then the United States.

If things get really gritty for Israel, if this tidal wave of hatred grows to unbearable proportions...

Then I will quit my comfy job here in the good old U.S.A., and I will take all of my funds and my beliefs and wisdom of life, and will land in Israel. I will explain to the Israelis that I come not as a Jew, but a defender of the rights of mankind, and as a person willing to do whatever is necessary to defend Israel from extinction, because I believe that the cause is just.

I may be just another tired old windbag here in my country, but I have been trained as a fighter. While much of my physical prowess has eroded, 99% of war is not physical, but mental. I will take that edge to our friends, and if I die, I know that I will die with honor.

I won't just sit back and watch the world kill off the Jews, because to do so would surely condemn me to eternal damnation.

Really, what the Arab world needs is to be colonized from one end to the other.

Oh for the good old days, when Western countries weren't afraid to colonize backward societies and teach them how to act civilized!

We should have gone straight on to Syria, but instead we assured them they would not be attacked and could continue to support terrorists with relative impunity.

I am increasingly convinced the only solution is to forcibly transfer all of the "Palestinians" back to Arabia. Westerners will soon figure out that living in Arabia is like camping out at the zoo on the wrong side of the fence in "cat country."

Then we can leave them to blow up each other to their barbaric hearts' content.

What would they do if they had no idols to worship anymore?

I am all for leaving these people to their own devices...and sit back and watch them self destruct.

Arrrrgggg....

I'm waiting for KSA to claim Mossad responsibility, but not because of bin Laden or the pull-out. I expect it to be construed as a vile Zionist plot to blow up the Powell peace talks right before he arrives, and derail the "Road Map". Thereby enabling Israel to keep on being mean to the pathetic Palestinians.

Yep, undoubtedly Mossad, because everyone knows Islam is a Religion of Peace. And besides, the Saudi's have gone to a lot of expense to buy off terrorists and be left in Peace.

OT: US Troops find what they think is the largest mass grave yet:

[Link: www.msnbc.com...]

I am increasingly convinced the only solution is to forcibly transfer all of the "Palestinians" back to Arabia

Plenty of room for them in the Rub al-Khali.

Robert Crawford #33,

After all, the Saudis, unlike the palestinians, don't have their primary raison d'etre as Jew-killing

Huh? Are you sure about that?

Sure? No. But I think it's safe to say that the Saudis primary raison d'etre is the export of Wahhabism and the Jew-killing is only one part of the program. OTOH, the palestinians feature Jew-killing as the centerpiece of their program and the Islamification of the world as a secondary goal.

As Q says, "Somebody who hates Jews can't be all that bad". And to the extent that the Saudis kill fewer Jews then the palestinians, more interest will be shown in their murderous behavior. Thinking back in the last two years, I can't think of a profile in a major news outlet of any of the Rachel Litle's of the world (since she was an American Baptist killed in Israel) but there have been more discussions of Americans killed by other terrorists, IIRC.

[Link: www.washingtonpost.com...]

First of all, I want to make clear that I am horrified by this attack.

But - I remember listening to the Beeb interviewing Brit expatriates in SA a few days after 9/11 and hearing an English employee of one of the oil companies gloating that the Yanks had it coming. Other anti-American Brits in SA were interviewed who said much the same thing and damned us for not understanding the Arab world. Coming a few days after 9/11, it felt like a punch in the stomach.

I don't wish death on any of those America-haters or on their loved ones. But I rather doubt that that English oil exec is gloating at this moment; or that his friends are saying this attack occurred because they didn't sufficiently understand the Arabs. Many Westerners working in SA seem to have developed the Stockholm Syndrome to a high degree - maybe this terrible incident will serve to open their eyes.

Майк О (#28):

From your linked article:

But protesters outside, including many Jews and members of the Americans Against the War coalition, said Cooper had deliberately excluded radical Zionist groups from the list.

Y'know, in cases like these, no obscenity in any language I know seems to suffice. Makes me wish I knew those ancient Hebrew curses - with "unborn children decomposing in wombs" etc.

Kapos, one might say - but kapos in camps faced the choice between living (in slightly better conditions) another day, or dying right away. Unlike kapos, the Jews for a Second Holocaust of our day have no excuse and no forgiveness.

May they get what they deserve.

Today's indymedia Hot Word Salad on the bombings:

"The obedience of the Saudi monarchy are a bit of a concern to the US regime, as well as anti-American sentiments on the Saudi street. To maintain US / Zionist state terrorist control of compliant Middle East client states, the CIA and Mossad are instructed to stage "terrorist" bombings to show the Saudi monarchy the absolute ruthlessness of the Bush fascist regime, and to confuse the Saudi populace."
"These fake Muslim terrorist bombings are timed to synchronise with US state department visits, in order to capitalise on global press attention to the appropriate country being disciplined into compliance."

Full declaration of evil zionist's fault pending

We can talk till we're blue in the face about pulling up stakes and leaving Saudi Arabia, but there will always be some opportunistic bastards, whether European or American, who will want to come along and make a buck.

Don't get me wrong -- I'm all for making a buck, but westerners are not going to leave there until it's a radioactive wasteland.

Well, well, well - it looks like the flies are finally starting to return to the dung heap. I hope the Saudi Royals have fun trying to contain their homegrown Islamofascist crazies. The blood money the ruling classes have paid to the Imams and mahdrassas helped to recruit the terrorists, indoctrinate them, train them, equip them, etc. They deserve each other!

If I were a Westerner living in SA, I would be on the first plane or boat out of there. If they will let you leave, of course.

Charles has two good cracks with this.

#1...I am sick to fucking death of anything having to do with Chandra Levy, Jon Bonet Ramsey, Baby Jessica, Andrea the postpartum 5-kid killer, now Laci and her "fetus co-victim sidekick Connor". But it is great media business...feed the proles damsel in distress stories...they fill up dead spots in news coverage, are infinitely cheaper than sending journalists for international stories or to dig up new news domestically.....and each channel has it's resident shysters serving as retainer Damsel--pro or con mouth pieces.

Fox, CNN, and particularly -the "Laci Peterson Channel" - MSNBC - with shyster Dan Abrams stuck in a well paying purgatory of hawking "Laci leads" thinking he would be better off professionally giving BJ's to Saudis or putting a gun barrel in his mouth and getting it over with.

I just flip the channel these days when any cheap tabloid journalism crops up.

Chris Hitchens justly ridiculed American Media's obsession with "The Laci Story" to the detriment of other far more riveting and relevant news..

Drag is that with the death penalty....two whole fucking years of "Laci" await us. Just keep flipping the channels anytime the subject comes up...particularly with that exceptionally odious CNN Harpy Avenger Nancy Grace.

#2 - Sure looks like Al Qaeda with the hallmark multiple, synchronized attacks.

I do note that it will give the Saudi monarchy a "WTF?" moment. All those 100's of millions in tribute...and the radical Islamists are out to kill them? Holy jamoley!! Maybe Wahabbism does suck a wet one and it's time to pull the petrodollars back in the Ummah and in spreading that cancer to the West. To whick Princelings will say "Naaaah", and wiser voices may rejoinder...wake up! It is time to reform....the Mujuhadeen are not after the Americans..they are after any Saudi that opposes them 1st.

And, hidden in this is a huge attaboy that should be said. The Saudi guards on the ExPat compounds acted as courageous hero warriors..engaged Al Qaeda in combat...did their duty...and saved thousands of lives - maybe - by preventing the carbombs from getting closer.

Hopefully when Powell comes in tomorrow, he will praise the Saudi forces that blunted the Al Qaeda attack while at the same time telling the officials there that Radical Islam is a true cancer not just on the West, but on the Ummah, and it is time to end it....while still having US blessings to be as medieval as Saudi Arabia wants to be....just as long as the Saudis don't threaten anyone outside its borders....while dropping a sweet little whisper in their ears....."Heeeey....you Sauds have been faithful American allies for 55 years....but if you don't reform Islam......(motioning to throat) - you are a surplus goat in Ramadan (make noisy knife slitting noises)

I just saw a reporter from the Arab News interviewed on CNN. He breathlessly described scenes of horror; tens of civilians badly wounded.

I wonder if his publication will describe this dispicable act of murder as a "martyrdom operation". I'm just guessing here, and probably going way out on a limb, but "martyrdom operation" is a description likely reserved by his publication solely for those acts that take the lives of innocent Jews.

Hey, guys, you think CNN is bad? An hour after this story first broke, CBC Newsworld - "Canada's News Channel", heavily subsidized by my tax dollars, ready to sneer at shallow Amurrican television at the drop of a hat - was showing "Fashion File".

They always seem to be showing "Fashion File". Or "Antiques Roadshow". (If you can figure out what "Antiques Roadshow" is doing on a news channel, you're all set for a long career at the CBC.)

#53 Gershom

but "martyrdom operation" is a description likely reserved by his publication solely for those acts that take the lives of innocent Jews.

Of this you can be sure.
I'm wondering what they are going to call it when UBL's crew starts bombing the Suad palaces once we are gone? Or better yet, how are they going to blame it on Israel? The old phrase "what goes around, comes around" must be weighing heavily on the house of suad right about now.

Just waiting for the Saudi's to blame outsiders.

When I see fuel-cell cars, alternative energy projects, fusion power research...I wish it would come around faster. If we could just starve the Islamic world of Petrodollars they'd freak and that would be the end of them.

The dominance of oil in the energy market will end. It's already on the horizon. I believe that's why they're all going beserk. If there was no wahabbi movement to distact the commoners then the House of Saud would already be gone.

All that money for all these decades flowed into the region and those people did jack for the constituents of the Kingdom. That was dumb. Feudalism is a discredited form of gov't and they had to keep using it anyway.

#57 Sean

When I see fuel-cell cars, alternative energy projects, fusion power research...I wish it would come around faster. If we could just starve the Islamic world of Petrodollars they'd freak and that would be the end of them.

It's coming, but it won't be soon. You just can't switch tracks so easily. Virtually the whole world is based on dinosaur juice. To change the entire system is a gargantuan task. Just to change the infrastructure is going to cost trillions and trillions. The whole system, I wouldn't even want to guess at the cost of weaning us off the oil teat.

Article in the ArabNews re:
[Link: www.arabnews.com...]

Agreed Reaganite. I just feel it has to happen and not for environmental reasons. We have to get rid of Islam's $$$ forever.

#60 Sean
You are 100% correct.

From a ArabNews editorial:

A letter to Mr. Powell

'Americans often wonder why others hate them. Did you do anything today to make us like you?'

[Link: www.arabnews.com...]

There is even more in the editorial.

LOL - tragic but LOL non the less.

#62 gb

At the same time, we don’t like Washington treating us as an enemy.

From your link. Pot, hello, it's kettle calling!

UPDATE: Is it just me, or is the media being incredibly blasé about this story? Shouldn’t this be major news? Why are the networks still dwelling on the Laci Peterson case?

Charles, Arab terrorism is sooo 2001. Like, the world community wants Killer Jews™ and Cowboy Unilateralist Americans™.

Reaganite, Thanks!

Have you guys come up with the Premature Splodeydope Raygun yet? What's the hold-up? ;)

just a little question, did this happen because the arabs had it coming and they dont understand the arab mentality? oh, it was westerners that were killed? carry on...

And there is also this:

A Source of Eternal Inspiration and Guidance

'The Prophet Muhammad is the role model for every Muslim. We should follow his guidance in all things, large and small. Almighty Allah has blessed this Ummah by preserving the Sunnah and Sirah of His messenger. Despite the passage of time, both remain as though you were seeing and hearing them today. They provide a living example of the life of the Prophet. They also instill love and respect for him in the hearts
of Muslims. Allah says in the Qur’an: “Indeed in the Messenger of Allah, you have a
good example to follow.” (Surat Al-Ahzab: 33:21).'

[Link: www.arabnews.com...]

WTF...

reganite,

The Kingdom of Saudi Arabia has a new holiday now, its called 'Irony Day'.

I wonder about the world I'm living in.

We have all of our news networks obsessed with the Laci Peterson murder case, with high school hazings, with the NYT journalistic integrity incident.

Where is the one true voice of the news that is concerned about the matters that may change our lives forever.

Where are those in the media whose first concern is on the murder of innocents in the KSA, in the question of governance of the 27 million people in Iraq?

Where is the moral equivalence reporting that focuses on what is really important - the killings of innocent Israelis by the hundreds, the rise of the Islamist mandate, the hatred of Al Qaeda?

Why am I living in the world of the living tabloid. Who determined that this was what I was supposed to expect and accept? Why does the media so hate righteousness that they subvert it at every turn?

I hate the media. No matter what spin they project, left or right, they are all the enemies of morality by their choice to ensure that they maintain equivalence in the ratings race.

The blogs, in particular this one, are all I have left. I feel very alone in this world, because most of the world is working on the 10 minute clock. What might have been news an hour ago is old hat unless the news meets the journalistic jihadist's standards of sensationalism.

Standards my ass.

Grumpy, I'd offer you a beer if it'd make you feel better. Remember we used to have to depend on print and 3 networks for news. It was worse then. We will win. I have daughters. We HAVE to win.

If this is the best al-Qaeda can muster, then we are witnessing the endgame. Saudi Arabia was a particularly soft target. What's next, Switzerland? Tuvalu? The ruling princes believed that at the very least they had bought off al-Qaeda or co-opted their radical Islamist agenda. They thought wrong. The Saudis will not take this one lying down. Heads are gonna roll over there and I am speaking literally. This was as much a real strike at their economic jugular as it was a symbolic strike at the devilish "infidels" and their corrupting influences.

Is it just me, or is the media being incredibly blasé about this story?

I just looked at FOX's site after I woke up, and it's the lead story there. For TV, the only thing I get in English is CNN Int'l, where the newscasters are probably being drowned out by popping champagne corks (that's how anti U.S. and anti-Israel they are).

Sean & Reaganite: Roger. Also, as I was explaining to my wife why we don't go to fuel-cell or oil from poop, or whatever alternate technology, throwing lots of people out of work at once doesn't seem humane. The vast majority of them aren't corporate suits who are too rich to be harmed by a sudden change on that scale. My mom, though she didn't work for an oil company, carried a union card for over 30 years, and those people have kids to feed and bills to pay.

really grumpy (#69):

Reminds me of the Onion story in the post-9/11 issue that went something like "Americans Long to Care About Stupid Shit Again"

For major stuff like this, yeah, you're right; time to cut away from the interview with the latest "Survivor" reject and get to the real news.

OTOH, when some kinds of information revs up the fight/flight instinct too much without giving people the chance to do one or the other (wouldn't it great to be Commander-in-Chief in those moments?), then it becomes unbearable.

Which is why, when it makes the least sense, we demand news about trivial stuff and TV gives it to us?

Am I off base here, or does that make sense?

Today the downhill slide to oblivion of Saudi Arabia just got a lot steeper and a lot slicker. Lets see if the Saudi security forces take a trip out to Buraida to find out whats going on in Bin Laden country. Since there is no western media presence in the Kingdom the story will have to come from the first westerners off the planes tomorrow. Those directly involved will most likely have to wait for exit visas or take a chance on phoning out on a monitered phoneline.

#52 Ranbutan: That's the funniest post I've read in a long while--you get right into the scenario, don't you--and dream along with the stream of consciousness. Hilarious. [Horrible sucking gurgling noises from cut throat!!]

ANYWAY...as I meant to say...regardless of whomever Al-Qaeda was after this time, they've certainly had to make a local job of it (no going overseas to NYC this time) and settle for those few westerners that happened to wander by at the wrong time and the rest were Arabs in the neighbourhood.

But as a number of people have observed here, that's fitting and probably as it should be. Let's all get out and leave them to fight it out.

Now Al-Qaeda will have to be content with blowing up Saudi princes and they can rationalize to each other to their hearts' content about why--but the rest of us won't be losing any sleep over it. Let the Princes sort it out.

Sean, thanks.

If all the people in the blogosphere got together we could easily support our own network, where the focus would be on what really matters. We could forsake the sensationlist murder stories and the travails of yet another liar at the NYT.

There have to be many other people out there who aren't anxious to adopt the "move on, people - there's nothing to see here" attitude of the mainstream press. I'm tired of seeing these cowboy liberaces hijack our moral fiber in defense of their ever-changing positions on morality. They only adopt the popular norm on the basis of their latest Nielsons.

The cheese-eating vaporheads of our society don't give a damn about anything. They think that abortion is a matter of personal liberty, and they think that war is a little thing that affects our lives for a little while, then goes away. They may not know it yet, but they will be the first Americans in the ovens of hatred when the time comes to decide to fight or die.

They just don't get it. Life is such a game. Do I get the Audi A6 or the Volkswagen Passat? Why does my acupuncturist cancel every third visit?

Not "Why doesn't my country stand for anything anymore?"

I'm indeed ill about it, but there are strong people here, and we will prevail.

#76 really grumpy
Do me a favor please? Stick around LGF. I love your posts.
So, should the blogosphere network be called LGF? It's an alphabet channel but I think it could work!

Reaganite,

Just because I discovered the world of blog only recently doesn't mean that I will be leaving anytime soon - or at all, for that matter.

If you stop hearing from me it will mean one of only a few things:

1. I kicked the bucket.
2. The Islamists got me before I got them.
3. I'm now an Israeli undercover resource.
4. You do the math.

Take care, my friend. We are in for some stormy times ahead.

er....prince naif, this is crown prince abdullah--you got some 'splanin' to do--fer allah's sake how could you let this happen--couldn't you infiltrate this cell--we look like them--we even talk like them--one of them's got to be somebody's cousin--i got the brother powell on the way and now it looks like i can't even keep my own tent in order in the war on terrorism to which i am a shadow contributor--otoh i'll spin it--we're all in this together--blah blah blah--i need a good taquiyyah thing goin' on or i look stupid--maybe i'll have the ministry of properg...information put out one of those 4 page infomercials on the great prospects for doing business in the kingdom in the new york times--oh, i forgot-- after the lying of the affirmative action dickhead nobody will believe it.

#78 really grumpy

Just because I discovered the world of blog only recently

I myself only found out about blogs about 8-9 months ago thanks to Fox's site. I read Joanne Jacob's stuff and linked to here from it. I've since found many others thanks to Charles. I try every day to show people blogs so they too can see the news that the mainstream ignores.
One disagreement, we've been in stormy times, I gave my first terrorism briefing well over 15 years ago. The people we gave it to laughed...

#79 HULUGU, one things for certain, if somthings happening, the Naif knows. Doing something about it is another matter, one of his own self interest.

Really Grumpy #76. I'm with you. I'm a baby-boomer. I remember when it was considered a good thing to be patriotic. I remember when we had morals. I remember when decency and integrity mattered. I still think most Americans are decent and compassionate people and we will prevail. We must prevail.

Strange how Westerners aren't allowed in Saudi Arabia but they demand to be allowed here.

Ever heard of a world called mutual?

That should be "word".

#82 kathyn
Well said!

Is it just me or is Colin Powell like the angel of death? If he comes on a tour of your country, someone is gonna die. Dude - videoconference, save some lives.

Seriously, can't he figure out that the Islamofreakazoids just love to put on a show for him?

#83 AB

The word you're looking for is reciprocity.

#86 Mikey

Seriously, can't he figure out that the Islamofreakazoids just love to put on a show for him?

It's not him, it's him as a symbol. The islaminazis want to show their "power" so they can spin the WoT into a win. They don't understand that there's a new sheriff in town, the rules have changed. We're not running nor shooting "monica" missiles anymore. This is the last hand at the world championship poker game.

kathryn,

Then we both must love Elvis, as tortured as his soul may have been.

I remember when, as a youth I listened at a very young age to "Davey Crockett" on the 45, and not much later to "The Three Bells".

There was a time in America when there wasn't so much moral relativism. We loved our parents, who were heroes of the free world, and we thought that they could do no wrong.

Then came the Beatles and acid rock and Jimi Hendrix and The Doors and...

Somewhere along the way, most of us became lost. Some of us have found our way to the firm land on the far shore. Others have not.

We will always live in the legacy of the choices we have all made in our lives, and some of us will find enough contentment to be happy. Others will be unhappy and unfulfilled for the rest of their lives..

I can't help those people, because they refuse to accept my help. I love my brethren, but I am only the keeper of a few, and that is of their own choosings.

I'll never be a leader, but I still think that I can fight.

#87 Caton

I couldn't think of the word, so I put what I put.

#89 grumpy

I'll never be a leader

A leader is someone who displays wisdom, displays integrity, and displays knowledge. You want to be "really grumpy" but I think you're not. If I take your posts correctly, your grand kids are in for a great lesson in life. A leader indeed.

#73 someguy

Sorry about the late response, but I've been busy.

You sound like you know fight or flight better than some theoretician. Which instinct do you trust more?

I've always felt that my flight instinct was more true, although I've used the fight one once or twice.

Have to say, however, that every time I've been threatened with truly lethal force, which is less than a half dozen times in my life, my fight instinct hasn't done a damn thing for me. I have used the flight instinct on more than one occasion, however.

More often, I've resorted to the "beg for my life" instinct.

So far, I'm batting 1000% on that one. Whether or not I use that strategy the next time is hard to say, however.

Flight-Fight-Mercy. Sooner or later I may have to use the middle option. If I do, however, I'll definitely be as sure as I can be - given the circumstances - that the option is the right one for me.

It's the best that I can do.

On Fuel Cells

Guys, I did a lot of research on this a few months back. While I am a natural born cynic, these things are happening.

The transfer will not be as bad as you think. And as for the millions out of work... fergetabout it. It ain't gonna happen. Imagine a factory that pays 1/10 for its energy. It will boom!

My "light bill" (as we call it down here) is about 300 a month. Imagine if I could cut that to 30 bucks a month???? NEW TOYS! (and savings of course.. honest ;-)

The economic benifts of "free" energy will blow away any loss of oil jobs.

Remember this prediction: Fuel cells will change the world more than anything else within 2 centuries of it INCLUDING the computer.

And they are not that far away. You will own one in 5 - 10 years. Cars... 15 years max. A blip away in history.

Paul

THEN the arabs are screwed.

#93 Paul

The transfer will not be as bad as you think.

It won't be as bad as we think? Okay, in my view, it will. Simple logic, just for the sake of argument we'll assume gas stations alone. Imagine the dollar value of changing a gas station to a hydrogen station. Okay, make it even simpler, imagine the cost of just digging up the underground fuel tanks. When the slick willy rules about underground fuel tanks came into effect, how many mom & pop gas stations went under? This conversion is not going to be cheap but it will happen.

OT: Saudi Religious Police Launch Website

'The Al-Madina regional branch of the Saudi religious and morality police, formally known as "The Authority for the Promotion of Virtue and Prevention of Vices," recently launched its new website.[1] The site posts news items, citizens' violations, and includes a section that allows citizens to inform anonymously on persons they suspect of violating religious and moral laws. The following is a summary of the website's recent content:'

[Link: www.memri.org...]

really grumpy (#92):

No worries. I just got into work, so I've been away from the CRT myself for a while.

I hear what you're saying, but I was referring to information in the form of bad news. I share your feelings about physical danger, but what do you do when the scumbags who did this are for far away? That's why I said what I did about being Commander-in-Chief. You know, having your finger on the big red button.

If your third option is "mercy," you're a better man than I am. Me, I'll take "whiskey." ;)

#8 - zulubaby
Thank you for your concern. As Charles said, I am no longer in Saudi - I left 3 years ago to move to a more liberal neighboring country (and let's face it, they are all more liberal!). However, I've just spent all morning trying to get in contact with friends still in Riyadh. Phones are really busy but I just got the following in an e-mail from a British friend there:

I heard two of the bombs last night as they were just across an empty patch from Fal at Al Hamra and Arizona compounds. Never heard bombs before, jolly loud they are. Police and ambulance sirens for a bit and lots of people crowding to the entrance of our compound trying to get a look. At the time no one knew what was going on, so i switched on the news this morning not really expecting to see anything, but there we were. We got a phone call saying don't come in to work, then an hour later we were told to come in. Not sure about that decision at all. It sounds like one of our illustrious heads of security has done one of their after the event statistical analyses and concluded that the office has never been bombed and therefore we are safer here than in the compound. As I write new word arrives that we can go home if we wish. Decisive decision-making. I suspect that the good old director has protested about the "business as usual" idea. Well, I'm here now. Haven't heard from the new job yet but I can't wait to get out of here! As I write the boss has come in and says that we left two minutes before the come to work order was chucked. Interesting times. Hope to be seeing the two of you real soon.

Expats in Saudi can't just rush to the airport and get on the next plane, however, as under the local laws you must surrender your passport to your Saudi sponsor and you can't leave the country unless he agrees to get you an exit visa.

Spooky thing is we used to stay with friends at the Granada complex whenever we were in Riyadh. There were big concrete blocks you had to slowly zigzag around and two security guard checkposts before you got to the front entrance, but I guess if the terrorists had guns and were determined enough they could of gotten through.

Paul of Arabia (#97)

You were my first thought when I read about this. Forgive me but I didn't realize that you'd left Saudi Arabia. I'm glad that you have though. It got me thinking today that if G-d forbid something did happen to one of the regulars here, how would any of us know? People come and go and come back again on LGF. Morbid, I know, but there it is. Anyway, it's a relief to know that you weren't in any danger to begin with.

Expats in Saudi can't just rush to the airport and get on the next plane, however, as under the local laws you must surrender your passport to your Saudi sponsor and you can't leave the country unless he agrees to get you an exit visa.

Bloody control freaks. Ugh.

I'm sending you a hug anyway :-)

#93 Paul - On Fuel Cells

Fuel Cells are coming down the road but the cost will not be as cheap as you are saying. The issue here is that a lot of the 'alternate energy' technologies do not scale up well so what works for providing a house will not work as well for providing a town.

What I think will happen is that we will see a distribution of appropriate technologies for their appropriate tasks. Gasoline is still very much far and ahead the winner when it comes to energy density per volume and per weight. There are more H atoms in a gallon of gas then there are in a gallon of liquid H2.

Fuel Cells will be awesome for portable electronics, small houses, etc... Imagine a laptop with 15-hour 'cell' life and you can refuel on the fly in a few seconds with a disposable cartridge. More than a couple tens of KW and you start getting into some serious issues though.

You might want to check out this page (PDF file):
Energy info...

The site root is here:
Don Lancaster
and is well worth spending some time with - Don explains stuff really well and he has seen his share of excellent stuff as well as 'oink-flap-oink-flap-oin...'

I agree that we should be doing all that we can do to rid ourselves of our dependence on their oil but we should be careful to not throw the baby out with the baathwater.

Take care
Dave

#98

It got me thinking today that if G-d forbid something did happen to one of the regulars here, how would any of us know?

How about Dead man's switch?
(that is pretty much the very definition of "morbid")

Outsider! I'm feeling morbid enough as it is. Creepy.

#98 - zulubaby - Thanks for the hug :)

Now, as Charles said

Is it just me, or is the media being incredibly blasé about this story?

I've just logged on to the Drudge Report and they do not have a single word about this story. They do have the following stories, though:

TED TURNER DOWN TO HIS LAST BILLION...
MICROSOFT: Internet-ready toilet a hoax...
BATTLE FOR FIRST HILLARY INTERVIEW...
Martha Stewart in talks with prosecutors...
Cannes bans swimming as oil slicks pollute beaches...

But not a word about a terrorist attack against Americans.

gb......from the Memri you linked .

"The Religious and Morality Police and Personal Freedom

The Authority's website posted the text of a book written by Dr. Fadhel Alha of the Department of Islamic Preaching and Communications at the University of Riyadh, which discusses the Authority's activities. Dr. Alha wrote:

"There are those who say that we must leave people alone and not interfere in personal matters of virtue from which they refrain, because this conflicts with their individual freedom which is set out in Islam. Those preaching this approach quote the words of Allah in the Koran: 'There is no coercion in religion…'"

"First of all, there is no such thing as 'personal freedom.' It is a lie. We would like to ask those who argue in this matter: Have you found personal freedom in the east of the land or in its west? In Eastern or Western regimes? None whatsoever, neither here nor there. Man is required to obey rules and regulations against his will everywhere. Is a man permitted, in the East or the West, to cross the street at a red light? In the West, is a man permitted to build a house with his own money… without observing the municipality's regulations? In the East, the situation is even more clear, and he has no right to own a house at all."

"Second, the personal freedom granted by Islam to the Muslims lies in [Allah's] liberating them from enslavement to men. This does not mean that man is liberated from enslavement to the God of these men…"

"Third, the verse 'There is no coercion in religion' does not mean that everyone can do what they want and refrain from doing what they don't want, or that no one is entitled to require them to do the good that they have abandoned or to refrain from the evil that they do. The meaning of the verse… is that a person must not be forced to convert to Islam – and this too does not concern all non-Muslims, but only the People of the Book [i.e. Jews and Christians], [regarding] the Bedouin polytheist idol worshippers, you must either force them to convert to Islam, or fight them."

..............aaaaaaarghhhhhhhhhhh

75 Elizabeth

I agree, lets get out of Saudi, and let the arabs deal with alQaeda..

wonder if Amnesty and the ICRC will complain about arab treatment of AlQaeda.?

they will behead every single one of them...save us mucho dinero..

Hell, Sherlock, what's the gain?

Well, it's the media. Terrorists maim and kill, and the media stations come alive with revenue. In exchange for their propaganda the cash comes in.

But why?

Because Hitler did the same thing. Losing didn't stop the German atrocities. Actually, made them worse.

Did so, too, in Iraq. As Saddam's days shortened, he had his killing machines going full strength.

So?

So, his troops disappeared.

By the way, he's probably alive. Maybe, he gets his own roach motel courtesy of Putin? If he's in Iraq he's the one guy who needs a shovel to keep digging himself in.

What changes? Not much. Blair's ass is exposed as an idiot who brought this down, diplomatically. What was he trying to prove? That Bush would be his poodle?

Powell? Powell is quite used to this stuff. He carries money in his diplomatic bag.

Sharon? Just waits. Everyone thinks Sharon will pull the plug on Arafat. Now, that's a stupid bet.

So, who goes first, Abbott? I dunno, Costello. Maybe, it's time we get kind'a keystone with Assad. Shake more than words at him. (Boy, I bet the guys in the 4th ID are itching to have a turn at Mideast peace making, and regime changing.)

I'm not worried. Bush is so far ahead planning the future moves that all we have to do is wait. (Just as we had to wait from last August to the middle of this March.) HIGH MOON. Doesn't matter. We're a machine designed to win.

And, the Arabs? They'll keep throwing money on the table to buy terror. Built out of the same material as those old Pharoahs in Egypt. But what do I know?

Did you know Barbie was Jewish.?

[Link: www.memri.org...]

Another section of the website, the "Exhibit of Violations," displays confiscated items from the "permanent collection of violations of Islamic law at Authority headquarters in Al-Madina."

The section shows photos of perfume bottles shaped like a woman's torso, with text reading: "Perfume, but…! Examples of perfumes with good fragrances for women and evil bottles that harm the honor of the woman and undermine her morality. We must beware. The Prophet Muhammad said, 'Any woman who wears perfume and passes by people so they can smell it is a whore…'

" Also shown is a photo of several Barbie dolls, along with the text: "The enemies of Islam want to invade us with all possible means, and therefore they have circulated among us this doll, which spreads deterioration of values and moral degeneracy among our girls." On the photo, under the heading "The Jewish Doll," is a story titled "The Strange Request." The story reads: "One girl said to her mother: 'Mother, I want jeans and a shirt open at the top, like Barbie's!!' The dolls of the Jewish Barbie in her naked garb [sic], their disgraceful appearance, and their various accessories are a symbol of the dissolution of values in the West. We must fully comprehend the danger in them."

....you cant make this up!!!!

Paul of Arabia (#102)

:-)

Off topic: A 40-kilo explosive device was found near a Jewish settlement, yet Colin Powell is trying to smooth the ruffled feathers of the Arabs because they are worried about Israel's intentions. Cute. Israel of course does not have the same concerns since they know exactly what the Arabs intentions are. (Hint: See link #1).

Powell then goes to Saudi Arabia for talks with leaders of the oil-rich kingdom. He is asking the Saudis for their help in harnessing militant groups and in promoting Palestinian reform.

You have got to be kidding me! Powell will ask for the Saudis help in reigning in terrorists groups? And he plans on doing this with a straight face!? I know I couldn't, but then I'm not a diplomat.

In a perfect world we would dismantle every last thing..oil related or not that the UK and US built for the ungrateful savages and ship them back home for renovation and resale...anything we couldn't ship that we built or supplied should be demolished.

If they want us out then we should get out and take everything Britiain and America have given these medievalist animals over the last 80 years.

Sadly it won't happen..but it certainly should...leave them starving and broke just like when we found them and see how they like trying to teach their camels to dig for oil.

I may be on the other side of the aisle, but I too have always been revolted by the tabloid crap that passes for "news" these days. But then, even the mildest suggestion that the news media should cover, you know, news, is automatically met with shrieks of "government interference!" and "first amendment!" by so-called libertarians and the money-grubbing corporations they love.

It goes like this: We (the networks) think people want nothing but Laci, so we'll show them nothing but Laci, and naturally this will create a viewing audience that is content to watch nothing but Laci. And if you (the people who actually care about political issues and boring stuff like that) object, you're just a bunch of pointy-headed statists.

For those expressing a mixture of pessimism amd skeptcism over the near term prospects for alternative energy to rid us of dependence upon Muslim oil I would only say that the effect on oil prices of alternative energy will arrive long before the actual switch to alternative energy.

We should remember that simply the efficiency gains that have occured since the first Oil shock have steadily lowered the ceiling on Oil prices. The chronic instability of Opec nations are in large measure to blame for the pressure that has accelerated the move away from Oil, or the drive to find and exploit non arab or muclim sources.

Whilst really widespread adoption of Fuel Cells that might be recharged from power sources as varied as Solar, Wind, Nuclear, Coal, Hydro & etc may be 20 years or more away there is already an important consensus that this development is inevitable. Once this percepetion takes hold in the marketplace (and it would probably only take a 5% switch for such a percpetion to take hold) the Saudi's and most other Oil Producers will face a very soft market. The Saudi's can pump oil cheaper than almost anyone else - but the fact is that their economy will have real difficulties coping with oil prices below 15 dollars a barrel - for whilst they can still make a helathy profit at that price - their economy is so lacking in diversity (and in debt) - and their demographic situation so dire (SA has one of the worlds fastest growing populations) that they wil be seriously screwed.

Of course there are going to be many other victims of the coming Oil Price collapse - Nigeria, Venezuala - and Iraq's future looks very cloudy. Some of the other Gulf States have at least made some prudent provisions by way of investments away from Oil, but even they face some very painful adjustments.

Ultimately the Opec cartel will get it's just deserts - it held it's custumers to ransom - adn it will scream when thsoe customers' find other sources of energy - but what did they expect? One thing is certain though - nowhere else on Earth will an Oil price collapse hurt more than Saudi Arabia - and the disaster they face was entirely forseeable and avoidable.

Just received another e-mail from a friend in Riyadh whose boss has just come back from a security meeting. He says

The news media are reporting up to 10 dead. According to sources at the meeting the actual figure so far is 80, and still counting.

I hope to G-d he's wrong.

#110 Johan.you say

their economy is so lacking in diversity (and in debt) - and their demographic situation so dire (SA has one of the worlds fastest growing populations) that they wil be seriously screwed.

they just export their problems...

a tsunami of economic migrants and asylum seekers....

where will they go.?

they are a breeding ground for islamobit fascists with a delusional mandate to enslave the world under the rule of allah

#111...Geez paul...I hope to God you're wrong too.

Is your friends company likely to have solid information or are they a small place?

[Link: www.arabnews.com...]

BEIRUT, 11 May 2003 — Lebanese Interior Minister Elias Murr has announced plans to strip thousands of mainly Palestinians of the Lebanese citizenship which he said they obtained fraudulently, media reports said yesterday.

“We will annul the citizenships of all the Palestinians who do not deserve it ... and who falsified documents and submitted thousands of applications in order to obtain it,” Murr said on television late Friday in remarks carried by local press reports.

................guess where these people will go.?

bet you it will not be to a muslim country....

#113 OverWatch

I fear the 80 deads figure is correct. The last reports are ten Americans dead and "large loss of life of others".

#115 Caton

Yes I just saw those reports too :-(

It's well overdue time to make targetted killing of all terrorists and terrorist funders worldwide British and US official policy. We're spending too much timeworrying about legal niceities...if we overhear someone talk about jiah in glwoing terms our governments should be straight there removing that threat permenantly.

If the UN wails about "human rights" then just reclass terrorists from "human" to what they actually are "inhuman".

Grrrrrr.

I am happy that I a few days ago turned down a project for our company in Saudi Arabia.

I appreciate common sense and our Western liberties sufficiently not to waste my time in that hellhole.

interesting link

#93 - Paul - don't know if anyone is still reading this thread, but I thought I'd mention that in my (engineering) opinion, fuel cells are not necessarily the answer. Why? Because they function on hydrogen and hydrogen requires energy to generate and compress. Nobody I've met seems to consider this factor.

My experience has shown that the best way to fuel cars is with ethanol generated from waste cellulose (or of course sugar- and starch-based crops like corn). Sunoco blends up to 10% into their gasoline. Ford has an engine (I've seen it) that can accommodate up to 85% ethanol - and it's less expensive to produce than regular engines.

And then there's biodiesel, which would not only soak up our excess agricultural capacity, but also cut off the flow of petrodollars. I don't know much about it, but it sure seems like a win-win to me. Well, except for the fact that virtually no one in the US has a diesel car...

#118: Not an interesting link, unless you want a dose of perverse Russian anti-American paranoia and anti-semitism. I'm really disappointed that free market economics and democracy don't seem to be catching on in Russia.

Saudi Arabia stands for everything western leftists dislike. Yet why don't they speak up about the abuses in "the kingdom". For example,we have a society here in which it is forbidden for women to even hold a drivers license, yet NO western feminist group has ever denounced that. It is a country without democracy, without basic human rights, and it is a country in which certain elements slyly finance terrorist activties, yet we do business.

I say we pull out. Saudi Arabia is utterly useless, devoid of any initiative or sense of responsability and totally dependant on the West. We can find oil resources and other sources of energy elsewhere. In any case, prince Bandar would cut a stunning figure seated on an old mule....would accurately reflect the century he inhabits.

Another Australian killed....the TV news say it is in retaliation for Iraq. We must keep fighting these barbarians. Thank God for America...noone else has the balls for what must be done...The hope for the western world..again..

Leaving Saudi Arabia is not the answer. Stopping the Saudi's from pumping millions upon millions into madrassah's around the world should be the first step.

#62 gb

Great link. This is my favouite -

"Arabs are a weak people who need strong but clean and just governments. I underline the words clean and just."

Hard to argue with. Although, to be fair, I would have substituted "muslims" for "arabs" but then it wouldn't be rascist.

And this man is a "muslim intellectual". Yes, it's an oxymoron.

Only just home from work (10.25pm) and took me quite a while to read the thread.

#121 kid charlemagne:

I spoke with a "consultant" who was asked to lecture on the effect of the Russian mob on international business with Russia. This was some 6-7 years ago...his thoughts at the time were that the Russian mob fairly well comtrolled the happenings on that country.

They have "free market economics and democracy" but guess where the money is going. That was his opinion anyway and I thought it worthy of consideration.

Powell almost gets it:

Powell, speaking at a news conference in Jordan, rejected suggestions that the bombings were tied to the Israeli-Palestinian conflict. "I don't attribute it to the Israeli-Palestinian conflict. I attribute it to terrorism," Powell said, decrying efforts to "cloak" terror attacks in the "trappings" of political or diplomatic conflicts.

Link

Which claim will Indymedia use first, this is the result of:

a) the war.
b) Israel.
c) Bush
d) all of the above.

The following is from Bernard Lewis's latest book, The Crisis of Islam

For the fundamentalists ... no peace or compromise with Israel is possible, and any concession is only a step toward the true final solution - the dissolution of the State of Israel, the return of the land of Palestine to its true owners, the Muslim Palestinians, and the departure of the intruders. Yet this would by no means satisfy the fundamentalists' demands, which extend to all the other disputed territories [once controlled by Muslims] - and even their acquisition would only be a step toward the longer, final struggle [to acheive total world domination].

So, what do they want? As Freddie Mercury once sang "I want it all and I want it now."

Our response involves far more than instant retaliation and isolated strikes. Americans should not expect one battle, but a lengthy campaign, unlike any other we have ever seen. It may include dramatic strikes, visible on TV, and covert operations, secret even in success. We will starve terrorists of funding, turn them one against another, drive them from place to place, until there is no refuge or no rest. And we will pursue nations that provide aid or safe haven to terrorism. Every nation, in every region, now has a decision to make. Either you are with us, or you are with the terrorists. (Applause.) From this day forward, any nation that continues to harbor or support terrorism will be regarded by the United States as a hostile regime.

-- GWB September 20, 2001

I continue to have faith in GWB because he has delivered on much of the above. However, notwithstanding his decision to move US forces out of SA, we are ultimately going to have to go much further in confronting the Saudis and their Wahhabi "investments" if we are going to win the WoT.

I don't want to push the Michael Moore dual loyalty conspiracy theory too far but IMHO, GWB is ultimately going to have to choose between the Bush Inc./House of Saud alliance on the one hand and long-term American security interests on the other.

Charles,

The media can't be bothered to move their resources back to the ME after the war drawdown. They're more focused on the Laci case or on nonexistent widespread looting in Baghdad. Besides, the attacks happened over there, and outside the usual media cycle (6pm or 11pm news, so it got less press than it should).

It is precisely this kind of attitude among the media folks that gets the US in trouble. We can't be bothered with genuine threats to national security via terrorist attacks, but can spend all kinds of time on trivial local murder cases. The media's priorities are all screwed up, and it's no wonder that the politics follows.

For what it's worth, Haganah b'Internet is 100% certain that this bombing was al Qaida. Among other things, known al Qaida spokesthing was the first to post a brag on the bombing, on the al Qaida-affiliated, Arabic-language forum sadaaljihad.net As for the attack being coordinated with the Chechens, that's certainly plausible, but we have no insight regarding that matter.

Oh, and that must of been quite some gunfight, where all 20 suspects got away clean. I have visions of something like the Keystone Cops, all done up in white robes, guns a-blazing...

Relax. The Plan is solid and it is on track.

The first step was whacking Afganistan to remove the immediate threat.

The second step was getting control of Iraq.

The next step is to get Iraq's oil online in about two years and flood the market with cheap Iraq oil. SA and Iran will have to cut off funding to Madrassahs, terrorists, etc. because they will be hurting for money to feed their people. They don't want to piss off their own people, they're liable to end up like Mussolini. We will keep up the pressure until they stop ALL funding for terrorism, from whatever sources.

At the same time, most of the money Iraq gets from oil sales will be spent buying American goods, equipment, expertise, etc. as Iraq is rebuilt, modernized and diversified, and imparting a nice bounce to the American economy (a twofer!). They will become prosperous and stable as western consumerism kicks the ass of Islam. Satellite TV is far more interesting to the young than praying five times a day.

Economic pressure will bring Syria down about the same time, since they won't be getting money from the Iranians anymore (the Iranians won't have money to spare for Syria, since oil prices will be depressed).

The last step will be to use Iraq as a base to subvert Islam throughout the Middle East. Iran will be the first target, SA next, others will follow....

It's a 10 year plan, but it will get the job done (ending Islamic terrorism and fascism) without nuking Mecca and killing millions around the Arab world.

As for widescale use of Hydrogen, biofuels? Fuhgeddaboutit. Oil will continue to be discovered worldwide (Siberia is virtually untouched, ditto interior Africa, and the Caspian region is going to be the next big player after the middle east)

Also, methane hydrates wil be sea-mined worldwide, and become the preferred "eco-fuel" Ain't as clean as hydrogen, but a damm sight cheaper. And it's renewable! (extra CO2 in the atmosphere gets eaten by sea algae, algae dies and sinks to the bottom, bacteria eat dead algae and make more methane hydrates!)

More messages today from the Supreme leader of Shia Islam Ayatollah Ali Khamenei today in Tehran:
"To question the effectiveness of Iran's system, as well as our values and revolutionary beliefs, serves the American interests. "
"Unfortunately certain elements, consciously and unconsciously, are helping the enemy to create the conditions for a (US) military or partial military action."

BBC: Iranian leader angry at US talks

MikeO,

The squeaks of someone with an 800-pound gorilla breathing down his neck.

# 17:

I would flatten medina...

Actually, was thinking of what was the worst thing that could happen to an Islamofascist? Kill them? They want to do that to themselves already. But in destroying the M & M cities, that solution wouldn't be bad enough. It would be rubble that would eventually get rebuilt, probably better than before with all those petrodollars. No, I'm thinking the US has to warn the Islamofascists that if they do not stop their idiocy and murderous bent, their worst nightmare will come true: We create a delivery system for pig's blood, and spray it over the M & M cities! No longer will the cities be usuable, or rebuildable, and we can say the Islamofascists were warned. These brave "men" want to attack/kill woman and children? We drop a non-lethal bomb they hadn't planned on. Talk about seething.

Such a fantasy.

I'm curious as to whether the Arab media would characterize this as a bombing or a "martyrdom operation".

MikeO (#134),

From your link:

The Americans know very well that any adventures in Iran will fail

Yes. We can only hope that they fail as miserably as our adventures in Afghanistan and Iraq failed.

#118 keyene

I read about that in some of the European papers over the weekend, but every one of them forgot to mention something:
[Link: news.ninemsn.com.au...]

I miss quoted this weekend, the crew was not trying to save a drowning child, but was there to assist in the medivac of an Iraqi child with head wounds. I apologize for the misquote.

More quotes from Tehran:
"Those who say do not give a pretext to America and for example want Iran to abandon its pursuit of nuclear knowledge, are not aware that America is seeking to prepare the ground and weaken the system from the inside," Khamenei said.

Reuters: Iran's Khamenei Rules Out Restoring Ties with U.S.

hmmm - I know of a French guy who is/was being sent to Saudi Arabia by his company. I wonder if he is there?

#136 Rick Z -

Also, we could put flashing neon dancing pig signs, like what they have outside a southern BBQ joint, and put them on those mosques.

Kinda like this one...

The Dixie Pig

Sobering example of moral equivalency about this horror from our friends the French. On Le Figaro website, the headline reads (my translation) "Attacks in Ryad- Twenty-nine people killed." The article itself then says, "Twenty-nine people, among them seven Americans and nine kamikazes, died in three suicide attacks..." The fact that the kamikazes made that choice and the Americans did not makes no difference. No moral distinctions to be made, they're just all equivalently dead.

I know I shouldn't have, but I made the mistake of looking at some of the comments on the paper's message boards. The gloating has already begun. I won't go back.

I think Arab News is right. What HAVE we done lately to help muslims love us? Well, let's fix that. The United States of America should fund muslims fulfilling their Holy Duty of going on the Hajj. Let's make sure they can ALL go. Just make sure it's a one-way ticket.

Does this sound extreme? Sure. I have a hard time swallowing it myself. As a Jew I know that there are good people and there are bad people in every relgion. If we judged all Christians by the World Church of the Creator or all Jews by the Kahane Chai we'd all deserve to be tarred and feathered... BUT: The World Church of the Creator and the Kahane Chai are VIOLATING the basic tenets of their respective religions. Usama bin Laden and Al Qaeda, Fatah, Hamas, Islamic Jihad, et al are FOLLOWING the basic tenets of their relgion. It's one thing to be an extremist and throw the Torah or the New Testament out the window and start killing people because of some wacky idea you got in your head. It's another to read the book upon which your religion is based, apply its teachings as Holy Writ and BECAUSE of that Holy Writ start murdering people.

Islam is the enemy of everything that is good. It is the enemy of the G-d of Abraham, Isaac and Jacob. It is the enemy of a brilliant Jewish thinker named Jesus of Nazareth (whether you believe he was the Moshiach or not.) It is the enemy of Siddartha Buddha. It is the enemy of Vishnu. It is the enemy of Kung FuTze. Sure it's got 1.2 billion adherents worldwide but by my calculations it's outnumbered 5 to 1.

#124 - Geepers

Leaving Saudi-Arabia is NOT the problem

But why should the US stay?
It appears to me that US administration was already planning that long ago. SA is a lost case.

Now that Iraq is in the hands of the coalition,
the US will quickly build bases there to accommodate american forces (not to mention the huge bases in small gulf states). American deterence will not be affected by such a withdrawl, as there will be more american soldiers on arab soil, not less.

Should the US bleed in order to defend a corrupt doublecrossing monarchy?
If it is Sharia that they want, let them have it.
What could they possibly do against the US?
They can't stop the flow of oil because they are as dependant on petrodollars as the world is dependant on oil.
They can't fund terrorism any more than they already do... as a matter of fact, this will be the golden opportunity to sieze Saudi bank accounts & assets abroad. All funds from SA will be blocked, hence no sponsoring for Jihad on american soil.
Not to mention the royal family will soon flee the country, taking as much fortune as it can with it. Some will go to the US along with their billions.

At times I believe the only hope for democracy in the arab world is a decade or two under Sharia dictatorship, just like Iran has. I don't know about other arabs, but Saudies are far too brainwashed to learn any way but the hard way.

Is it true that the casualty count is currently more than 90?

Are the guards of the area there Saudies or Americans?
if they are Saudies I'd say somebody bought them off (either by money or by potential virgins)

the Telegraph is saying 90 dead:

90 feared dead in Riyadh blasts
(Filed: 13/05/2003)

More than 90 people are feared to have been killed in last night's suspected al-Qa'eda suicide car bomb attacks in Riyadh, according to American officials.

Police survey the damage at one of three residential compounds attacked

The dead included up to a dozen Americans, state department officials said.

The claims came after the Saudi Arabian interior ministry said 29 people had been killed in the attacks at three residential compounds and the headquarters of a jointly owned US-Saudi firm.

It said seven Americans had died as well as seven Saudis, two Jordanian children, two Filipinos, a Lebanese man and one Swiss.

The charred bodies of nine bombers believed to have carried out the attacks have also been found, the ministry added.

Australian authorities said a 39-year-old man from Sydney was killed. At least five Britons are believed to have been among the 194 injured.

Colin Powell, the American secretary of state who arrived in the Saudi capital hours after the blasts, said at least 10 Americans had been killed and "many other lives were lost from many other nationalities".

Mr Powell, who visited one of the residential compounds this afternoon, said: "Terrorism strikes everywhere. It is a threat to the civilised world."

The bombers drove cars packed with explosives into the compounds at around midnight after using machineguns to fight their way through heavy security.

The force of the blasts destroyed balconies, collapsed roofs and gouged large holes in walls. The attack at the company headquarters happened shortly afterwards.

Last night's killings followed warnings from America, Britain and Australia over the past fortnight that Islamic terrorists were planning an attack on western targets in Saudi Arabia.

Turki al-Faisal, the Saudi ambassador to London, said some of the bombers were among 19 al-Qa'eda members who escaped from a raid on their hide-out in Riyadh on May 6.

An email sent to the Al-Majallah Arabic newspaper based in London purporting to be from an al-Qa'eda commander also claimed responsibility for the killings.

The attacks came on the eve of Mr Powell's visit to Saudi Arabia as part of his diplomatic tour to promote the American-backed "roadmap" for Middle East peace.

Prince Saud al-Faisal, who greeted Mr Powell in Riyadh, said his government would help America find the attackers. He said: "These things happen everywhere."

Screw hydrogen You can make oil out of garbage. Check it out. This is the real nail in the coffin for the Arab oligarchy.

#146 Outsider

I believe the only hope for democracy in the arab world is a decade or two under Sharia dictatorship, just like Iran has. I don't know about other arabs, but Saudies are far too brainwashed to learn any way but the hard way.

Saudi pretty much already lives under Sharia but I agree with your point. The more the West butts out, the quicker the Arabs will be forced to realize they are responsible for their own actions and their own failed systems. The US was not involved in internal Iranian affairs over the past couple of decades - and now most Iranians know who and what is to blame for their lot.

Had the Saudi minister of interior (Mack the Naif) been taking care of business rather than playing interfamily politics this might have been prevented. Any idiot standing by the side of the road after the first gulf war could have seen for themself the amount of looted Iraqi munitions going back into the Kingdom. Lets see if the Saudis start flying night C130 missions over the Rub Al Kaali to get rid of some of their trash before it gets rid of them.

Yeah, I see at least 91 reported dead on Bloomberg.

That is big. I hope Powell gets his head out of his ass.

Oh, I will not own a fuel cell car in 10 - 15 years. We will still be pumping oil 50 years from now. Don't delude yourselves.

Prince Saud al-Faisal, who greeted Mr Powell in Riyadh, said his government would help America find the attackers. He said: "These things happen everywhere."

someone should tell that lothesome espece du merde, that "These things happen everywhere" because he and his lothesome people have been supporing and exporting slaafi/wahabism hatred all over the world...

feh

If this is true, then we can make our own oil and tell the Islamathugs to f*ck off:

[Link: forums.biodieselnow.com...]

Re:casualtie figures

I think most of the networks are counting the bombers in the reported numbers dead so you need to subtract 9 from the figures to get the number of humans who been killed.

[Link: www.nypost.com...]

SAUDI BIG MUM ON
BLOOD-MONEY TRAIL

By DEBORAH ORIN
-------------------------------------------------- ------------------------------

April 29, 2002 -- Saudi Arabia’s foreign-policy spokesman yesterday refused to discuss an Israeli-provided Arabic document that indicates the Saudis paid more than $5,000 each to families of homicide bombers.
Adel al-Jubeir insisted that such payments are not Saudi policy, but stonewalled when asked point-blank if he is charging that the Israeli-produced document is a forgery.

"I haven’t seen it - I’ve heard about it," was all he would say on "Fox News Sunday."

The Saudis have refused to discuss the document since the Israelis produced it Friday, claiming they’d found it in searches of Palestinian offices.

It lists 102 names of Palestinian homicide bombers and troops who died in military operations against Israeli targets and reveals that each family got 20,000 Saudi riyals, or $5,340, from the Saudi interior ministry.

If genuine, the document would give the lie to Saudi claims that they in way no subsidize the violence committed by homicide bombers.

Aussie Joe (#123):

No, thank God for YOU and your people who have been among our few faithful friends in this crisis. May your tribe increase! :)

It's just too bad that no matter what happens to Suadi Arabia (and it ain't gonna be good), the Saudi royals will get off with their bank accounts and favourite body parts largely intact.