Is it just the Jews that are forbidden from using that subway station or does it apply to the Muslims too?

Evacuate

would this be the appropriate time to declare my support of & solidarity w/ Israel? Why -- well, for no particular reason really, just that there's enough folks out there happy to pick on the Jews for no particularly defensible reason -- i figure it's about time someone stuck up for 'em for no particularly defensible reason*...

(* defensible by moonbat logic, that is...)

oh, and i guess this also makes me

FIRST!

A great darkness is settling over Europe. The full story of why all this is happening has not yet been told. But the great and fearless historian Bat Ye'or is working on a new book that will soon shed light on these incidents
-- and reveal information that will shock the world: Eurabia.

guess not -- we young lizards will just have to spend more time in the sun until we get faster on the draw!

#1 zulubaby

Of course they wouldn't ask the Muslims to behave themselves! That would be rascist!

Jews in Europe will have a defacto 'seperate but equal' regime in place very soon.

And he’s sure the situation will cool down soon.

Doubtful- unless someone decides to fight back.

He also said hatred against Jews was something temporarily, and that it wouldn't take long for the situation to cool down.

Right, 'cause the current enmity by Arabs towards Jews only dates back to, what, EARLIEST RECORDED HISTORY?!?!?!

"I hate mankind, for I think of myself as one of the best of them, and I know how bad I am."
-Samuel Johnson (1709-1784)

Better luck next time, Querent. You get the bronze.

This is by far the most disturbing story I've read today. Amazing how the jihad kidz arrive and manage to disrupt everything.

#4 Robert Spencer

Do you know when it will be published?

And he’s sure the situation will cool down soon.

At the subway station or between Israel and the Palestinians?

So ... clearing the area of the criminals is not in the cards?

#10

No, but I hope that we will be seeing it this fall sometime.

I tell you, I work in this line all day every day, and I didn't think I could be shocked anymore, but this book by Bat Ye'or contains material that shocks me.

Robert Spencer (#13)

Are you going to give us a hint or just leave us hanging ... :-)

And when they start attacking churches just close them down. I mean how can you have a church withing seeing distance of a Moslem. It must make them feel so uncomfortable. I feel so bad for them.

#15 jgold

I mean how can you have a church withing seeing distance of a Moslem.

Ahem. Seeing as this is LGF, that should read:

I mean how can you have a church withing seething distance of a Moslem.

There. Much better.

It was me bigel. You need my lawyer's number?

#16 bigel

who knows, maybe I'll even convince Reaganite and BPP that Europe is indeed a worthless, genocidal shithole, inhabited by incurable racist Jewkillers.

Not the slightest chance. Your hatred is reserved for your own twisted thoughts.

Come on guys, this is a cultural thing and we should not judge, nothing to see here, apparently the Belgians have it under control, move along.

Is it just the Jews that are forbidden from using that subway station or does it apply to the Muslims too?

I guess if there are any Muslims attending the school, they would "not be allowed" to use the metro either.

bigel, no, he's here in LA.

4 Robert Spencer

you are scaring me.

what do you mean?

#23 bigel
There's Jew hatred in North America, does that make us "a continent of Jew hating Nazi scum" as well?

#16 bigel

I am well convinced that Europe is

indeed a worthless, genocidal shithole, inhabited by incurable racist Jewkillers.

That seems beyond dispute. All out nuclear assault as the solution? No thank you.

Best of luck to your cousin in making his decision, BTW.

I wonder why the teacher thinks the situation will soon "cool down"?

Ok I am sure this is completely obvious to everyone here..but I am really bothered.

Does noone see something wrong with the teacher's comments?

Somehow (she/he/it) justifies the attacks on JEWS b/c of what happens in ISRAEL.

Sure, I understand that Israel is the Jewish state, but does that mean that if you don't like Israel it is open season on JEWS? How did all Jews become representatives of Israel?

Somehow the world & the media accept this kind of reasoning?

Think of it this way:

If a group of white nazi kids attacked black kids...would it be accepted if they claimed to be mad at an African Nation? Are all blacks to be held responsible for what an African nation does?

I DON'T THINK SO.

what would happen if the jewish kids attacked arabs.

the pali supporters and allied press vultures would be screaming racism, the french govt would send patrols into the area and muslims would have demonstrations
condemning the joos.

the joos should have squads of toughies to deal with this. force is the only language they understand

#30 russell

what would happen if the jewish kids attacked arabs.

The full might and power of the state would fall on them. We can't have Jews defending themselves, can we?

/dark, bitter sarcasm

8

"I hate mankind, for I think of myself as one of the best of them, and I know how bad I am."
-Samuel Johnson (1709-1784)

What is this, if it's not subjective, self-indulgence?

/go ahead look, and see!

I goggled "Eurabia" and found a link to a Bat Yeor article in the National Review, the link at: [Link: www.nationalreview.com...]

Maybe this provides some info on what will be in the book.

It is unfortunate that firearms and self-defense have been outlawed in most of Europe (and even some of America) - if punks of ANY ethnic background are attacking schoolkids on their way to school, and the authorities choose to take no action, the kids' families and friends should take up arms and kill the bastards.

#26 reaganite -

Come on, you know perfectly well that it's only Europe that's evil. We all want to exterminate Jews, don't you know? bigel found out my secret a long time ago

/

#30 Russell - More to the point: What if Jews occupied 22 countries and controlled an ocean of oil reserves. Could you see us strapping on bomb belts and trying to drive six million inhabitants of the only Arab country into the sea?

#35 Ginger Liz
What was I thinking? Of course you are correct! :-Þ

#35

Funny - but that starts to to look very similar to the situation for Jews in Germany just couple of years before the Kristalnacht.

It might be useful to email this article to a few bloggers and newspapers. We are preaching to our own chorus. This needs the strong light of national attention.

Robert Spencer: I have read Bat Ye'or's paper. Certainly the points the French agreed to appear damning, but I'm not able to confirm what the French actually did and did not implement, e.g., setting up schools to teach Arabic. Her paper is alarming, but it is not clear to me that the French did anything other than they usually do - lie. When I tried to do more research, based on her paper, I was badly hindered by the lack of English sources, as I speak neither French nor Arabic.

bigel: spouse and I also offered to help if your cousin needs any political help. offer is still open.

Here is what is bothering me about all this - well, one thing anyway. Why are the Jews not screaming at the top of their collective lungs about this? Crimeny, call an American news organization if you have to while you stage a mass protest at the frigging metro. I have visions of a silent march into the gas chambers
again. Man, I hate this.

I'm sorry. I realize now that those are a couple of really teasing posts. Unfortunately, I don't want to reveal too much; I don't think Bat Ye'or would want me to. But I will say this: what is happening in Europe today is no accident.

Watch for the book. If there is any justice in the world, and I know there ain't too much but I keep hoping, it will blow a few things sky high. Metaphorically, of course.

#40 bigel

Quite familiar with the Samson Option, thank you. Still think it is blithering madness.

I am having a very difficult time analyzing this concept with any sense of sanity and reasoning the perception these people are operating under.
It wouldn't do for me to be there, I would be carrying a nice heavy baseball bat for protection.

Its time to get out of Eurostan

Here’s some verrrrry eerie news that should have received far more attention in u.s. news. Anyone remember seeing this statement/story concerning one of Putin’s rivals in their upcoming election: Ms. Irina Khakamada:

Khakamada explained to Rice why she had chosen to enter a race in which Putin's landslide victory is preordained and in which her own place on the ballot - not to mention state-controlled television - is subject to the Kremlin's whim. One of her aims, she says, is to educate the outside world about what has happened to democracy in Russia. Another is familiar from Russia's totalitarian history: to offer a model of someone not afraid to speak up about a ruler's abuse of power.

That statement was repeated in both the St. PeteTimes(not florida) and arabnews.com(somebody slipped up)
WaPo buried any mention of the visit within the story, “Bomb Kills Dozens in Moscow Subway” in the second to the last paragraph with this blirp:

Irina Khakamada, a pro-market reformer who is challenging Putin in the election, said the bombing was aimed at undermining Putin's credibility. "We see once again that even though the security services are calling the fight against terrorism their number one goal, their work is ineffective," the Agence France-Presse news service quoted her as saying.

bigel, he did my papers for me while I was living in NY so that wasn't a problem for me. He's not part of a bigger firm with a branch in NY, we just used FedEx when there were papers that needed to be signed. I'm sure there are plenty of immigration lawyers in NY, you could find one easily enough. Just be careful who you use, that's all. I've heard enough horror stories in my time.

42 Robert Spencer

aaaaarghhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh

your killing me!!

bigel, all the best for your cousin. I hope he gets the best advice.

bigel, no problem.

#40 bigel

I know you agree with me. You've just invested too much emotional capital in attacking me to admit it now. :-)

I've spent over half my life saving lives. Killing people has never been on my agenda. Yes, I have shot at people, and probably will again. But I do it out of duty, not your irrational hatred. Don't ever dare to think that I would ever agree with your insanity.

#47 bigel

I assume from that assertion that you think another six million Jews (Israel) should just go to their extermination quietly and do nothing -- again?

Let me get this straight, I don't agree with you hook, line, and sinker, and therefore I am chomping at the bit in gleeful anticipation of Israel being destroyed?

Please child. You do not have a monopoly on support for Israel in this forum or in general. And I will not defer to you in espousing said support. How many disputes, on how many innumerable different issues have you seen in this forum? Whether it's the wisdom or lack thereof of the security fence, the wisdom or lack thereof of the prisoner exchange with Hizbollah, lot's of people here, 99.999999999999% (excluding the occasional DU troll) are solidly behind Israel, even when we disagree on tactics and strategy.

#25, 41, 42

Does the book state that Old Europe, but in particular France, deliberately invited immigration and a mingling of populations in order to form a Euro/arabic bloc to challenge US hegemony?
I read this somewhere.
Boy, have they taken a tiger by the tail. Have they never read a history book?

Dear Robert Spencer,

Quick digression, sorry, but do you know the latest on the religious vilification case in Victoria, I can't seem to find anything later than Nov/Dec.

Article on Religious Vilification Case, Victoria, Australia

#54 - Jaffar

He knows that, he just likes to argue! (I think. I hope.)

#55 Mozartus

link not working, please repair

(looks interesting)

bigel, my fiancee's father is an immigration lawyer on Long Island. He's very good at what he does.

#57, ploome

Sorry, I must have typed it in wrong and I don't know how to fix, first time trying to post.

pastornet.net.au/jmm/articles/11770.htm - I've just tried it again and this should be correct.

Thanks, Amadeus

ploome - LOL, Amadeus was Mozart's rival!

#55

Case adjourned until 12 February 2004.

The hearing of the complaint made against Catch the Fire Ministries by the Islamic Council of Victoria has been adjourned until Thursday 12th February 2004. As of the close of the hearing on Friday 19th December, the witnesses for the Islamic Council of Victoria have all been cross-examined.

When the hearing resumes at 10am on Thursday 12th February the witnesses for Catch the Fire Ministries will be cross-examined.

Tellarites do no argue for reasons; they simply argue.
... Sarek, "Journey to Babel," stardate 3842.4..

Doug, Amadeus was Mozart's name! (Wolfgang Amadeus)

ignore my last - I was thinking of Salieri - long day I guess.

Oops, ignore my last - I was thinking of Salieri - long day, I guess.

Here is the Bat Ye'or paper. It is 41 pages long and it is NOT beach reading.

Eurabia

Note, this is the paper itself, not a report about the paper. Tuck in, lizardoids.

#67 grayp

Many thanks!

3 am in the morning working lizzy.
we had the ,, errr pleasure of getting stuck in brussells for 14 hours, when we missed our flight back to israel, from manchester- brussells - tel aviv.
trying to make the most of the f-up, downtown belgium we went, excited about seeing the architecture, bookstores, museums etc.
apart from the grand plaza, and a few peripehral around it, i felt as if i was in the old city of jerusalem... filled of arab speakers, signs in arabic, felafel stands, ..... a very very hostile atmosphere..... in some little mall, filled with arab looking vendors, i found a public phone and called israel, to tell my best freind about our delay,and as i made this breif call in hebrew, i saw a few of the" locals" looking at me and muttering. so much for brussells.... a very very uncomfrotable feeling. poor belgium, almost destroyed in two world wars.. and nowneing totally taken over by its new muslim citizens.

I think we need to have another LGF poll regarding which E.U. country will be the first to introduce Sharia...

#41 grayp

I too wonder at the passivity of European Jews. Haven't they learned? Why are they so damn passive and quiet? Instead of advising their children not to use a subway station they should accompany them with bats and get in those bastards face at the first sidelong glance. But no, they cower (it seems) and retreat. Better, of course, for them to move here or Israel or Canada.

Of course, the Europeans in general are cowardly and passive, so perhaps they are just acting European.

#71 Seymour Paine

European Jews who did that would have a) much larger numbers of seething, armed Muslims to contend with, and b) the police forces of the state intervening against them to stop the 'hate crime'

If I were a European Jew, I would be checking to see that my passport is valid...

#69 - lizzy

Scary stuff. But apart from that, did you have a good time?

My knowledge of Europe's Islamic problem is limited to France, the UK and Germany. In spite of what the multi-culti chatterers try to push down the throats of the great unwashed, it is not successful. The Islamics are both hated and shunned. They are marginalized everywhere. Germany is the least troubled by the Islamic invasion because the majority are of Turkish origin, not Arabic and North African. The two latter groups are savage, stupid and barbaric and treated with disdain and contempt by the indigenous populations. I don't see this minority taking anything over but I do see them creating problems of criminality on a scale large enough to stop all the pc and multi-culti drivel which has sheltered them up to now. It's already happening in the Netherlands.

#74 Millie Woods

I don't see this minority taking anything over

They won't be a minority for much longer, if current demographic trends hold.

Way OT but I was thinking about zulubaby when I saw this article.

More Whites See No Future in South Africa

Back on topic - In 1999 when I stayed 4 nights in Brussels with a friend we stayed near the South Station. The whole neighborhood seemed creepyand my firned and I dubbed the area around Square de l'Aviaiton/Rue Stalingrad as "Little Damascus."

I remember watching a program on the Holocaust a few years ago, and in an interview with a survivor of the camps, the old man was asked what he had learned from the experience. He replied: "When somebody says, over and over, that they are going to kill you, believe them."

#75 bigel

If I were Israeli PM tomorrow (God forbid, it is the hardest job on the planet) I would do the following:

1. Immediately close every crossing in Gaza, and evacuate the settlers there, as Sharon has proposed.

2. Revoke every single work permit held by a Palestinian. Permanently.

3. Spare absolutely no expense in building the security fence. Most of the largest settlements, Ariel, Ma'ale Adummim, etc, can easily be incoporated on the Israeli side of the fence. Many of the smaller ones cannot, as Sharon has properly recognized (route of the fence is here) Build no gates in this fence.

3. Assassinate the following people and their immediate supporters: Yasir Arafat, Abdel Aziz Rantisi, Sheikh Yassin, Al Sayed Hassan Nassrallah.

As for post #72 -- basically, you are agreeing in that post that Europe is an incurable Nazi shithole, that has always thought the only good Jew is a dead one.

Yes, I do. I think Jew-hatred is an itch that Continental Europeans have not been able to scratch, and with Europe currently incorporating themselves into the House of Islam via demographics, I don't see that this is going to change any time soon. As I said in my post above, if I were a Jew living in Europe, I would make sure that I had a) valid passport b) enough money to buy a plane ticket in a heartbeat.

I just read the post. Lemonier was the metro stop that was near my hotel in Brussels when I was there in 1999! That was the neighborhood I referred to as "Little Damascus."

#81 bigel

Nukes? Sorry, I got so involved that I missed the first question.

No, I don't see that as being a viable option for Israel. The condemnation that would come down on her would simply be to much to bear. The U.S. (a fair-whether friend to Israel at best, IMHO) would withdraw any and all aid and support. Even if Damascus, Cairo, Riyad, etc went up in a mushroom cloud, the Arabs would still weild the most potent weapon they have: demographics and time.

Doug in VA

Wolfgang Amadeus Mozart (1756-1791)

:-)

#85 bigel

So you are indeed saying that Israel should let herself be exterminated by the Islamonazis, if they attack her.

Again, I refer to my previous post:

Let me get this straight, I don't agree with you hook, line, and sinker, and therefore I am chomping at the bit in gleeful anticipation of Israel being destroyed?

If it gets to the point where she is forced to nuke the world, why should she give a fuck what the world thinks?

Israel quite properly gives a fuck. Because it is led by intelligent people who care a great deal and know a great deal about her long term security.

You are saying, no matter what Israel does, it is worthless. Never mind the fact that the Arabs already have an insatiable, genocidal, psychotic hatred of Jews, you are afraid of making it worse. I got news for you -- their hate CAN't get worse!

Their hate can't get worse. But Israel's strategic position can get much, much, much worse. Popping off nukes like flashbulbs will do that.

the EU, the UN, the OIC -- they will only be happy with Israel when it is exterminated, and then once that happens, they will attempt to track down and exterminate Jews everywhere, and make a concerted effort to wipe out all traces of Judaism that ever existed on this planet. But you are afraid of their condemnations.

Don't recall mentioning those organizations, or Israel currying for favor with them. Those organizations have been condemning Israel since 1948, and it won't stop in my lifetime. But a reasonable estimate of Israel's position vis a vis the Arabs would lead an intelligent person to conclude that a close military and economic alliance with the U.S. is very much in Israel's interest. As you seem willing to sacrifice Israel's interest in order to indulge your apocalyptic fantasy, I am very glad that Israel is currently led by a battle-hardened, seasoned warrior, not hot-heads like yourself.

You are a moral coward and an idiot.

I would expect such preening nonsense from a DU poster, not at a quality establishment such as LGF. I pray often that G*d will continue to protect Israel. I will also pray that so-called 'friends' of Israel, such as yourself, are few and far between. You're not a bad person, methinks. Just one who has willingly allowed their passion to cloud their judgement. That is an impulsive luxury Israel can't afford.

I'm leaving for the evening now, but by all means, feel free to email me if you wish to continue this, ahem, conversation.

$85, bigel

Jaffar means well, but he still uses words like "reasonable" and "judgement" when looking for ways to respond to Arab and European Jew hatred. He scorns "passion," when passion is what it is (and always was) about: a passionate loathing for "the Jew," intensified by a botched genocide, which inflamed the passion by pouring of insencere guilt on it.
Another poster referred to European anti-Semitism as an "itch." That's the "reasonable" assessment. But it's a consuming obsession, a disease, the European response to all that Greek and Judeo-Christian "garbage they were made to swallow. Nietzsche was a great critic of his culture. Eyropeans are so uncomfortable in their "civilized" skin. But they don't want to pay the price. The Jew has, and does. To hell with that.

insincere

#87 observer

Really the last post of the evening.

The way to respond to EU Jew-Hatred, as I mentioned in my previous post, is for European Jews to be ready to leave, permanently. I think I made this pretty clear.
And my suggestion vis a vis Arab Jew hatred was 1) lock the Palis in a cage 2) kill the terrorists and their hangers on 3) have absolutely nothing to do with the Arabs, unless as target practice for the IDF. I think this is reasonable, and prudent, and I'm glad that Sharon thinks and acts along the same lines.

I used the phrase 'itch' above because that seems to me to be the best psychological description of it. A propensity to blame all the troubles on the Jews. I scorn 'passion' when it clouds judgement and puts Israel in danger.

bigel, I also think that you go to far and I will answer your questions.

I think that for Israel's own self-interest she can't use nuclear weapons unless a nuke is exploded in Israel first (or an incoming ICBM is detected) or Israel is being overrun by conventional armies and can't possibly win. In either scenario, nukes are a weapon of last resort when all is lost. (That's why they call it the "Samson" option.)

I think Israel should target the Arab nations around her. That is where the physical and imminent threat will be coming from. There are two reasons that I think Israel should not target Europe. 1) if the situation gets to this point, the Jews of Europe and the US are the last remaining Jews of the world. How can Israel wipe out much of the last remnants of their own race? 2) even in that horrible scenario, targeting Europe would be immoral. While many Europeans would rejoice at the destruction of Israel, not all would and since Europeans aren't going to be the folks directly attacking Israel, self-defense wouldn't be a valid reason to kill innocent European civilians. The generally accepted rules of self-defense allow you to kill the guy attacking you, they don't allow you to kill the little arsehole standing behind him cheering for him.

The Europeans will never be a legitimate target because they will never do their own dirty work.

I assume the situation will cool down soon because they will run out of Joooos (they're only outnumbered by a factor of, what, 2 billion to 14 million - on a worldwide basis).

I would walk all those kids to school and wup any of those Muslim youths that tried to touch those kids.

From Melanie Phillips Diary, February 8, 2004

"The EU and the axis of evil

"Absolutely riveting speech by a German Green MEP, Ilke Schroder, which lifts the lid on the attitude of the European Union towards Israel. Schroder goes far beyond the observation that the EU is both prejudiced against Israel and motivated by anti-Jewish feeling. She also makes the explosive claim that the EU is backing Palestinian terror in order to position itself as a rival power base to the US. Key passage:

"The primary goal of the EU is the internationalisation of the conflict in order to underline the need for its own mediating role. Here is the prevailing European view: The longer the conflict continues and the deeper it gets, the more evident is the incapability of the US to moderate a peace process. The EU thus concludes that both sides are in need of - ironically speaking - the good uncle from Europe to resolve this conflict with European democratic and ecological values, its welfare state and civil society. How good for both sides that there is Europe and how bad for the world that one side, and this is Israel, is affording a wild west type of policy in the style of the US.

"The need for a solution only exists as long as the war continues. This is why the EU does not want the conflict to end before it gains a major role. And this is why the EU does not wish the PA to give up too early and why the EU is strengthening the PA. The EU is getting up to the cynicism of stirring up a conflict that it supposedly wants to see resolved by financing one side. This is the inherently inhuman purpose of EU humanitarian aid in the region. The Palestinians are playing the ugly role of being the cannon fodder for Europe's hidden war against the US.'

"To such geopoliitcal cynicism is added -- of course -- the oldest hatred:

"A peace process of the sort that the European Union would like to create includes European soldiers stationed in Israel. Mr. Poettering, the chairman of the biggest political group in the European Parliament, the Conservatives, said on October 9th 2003 in Parliament "that we need an international peacekeeping force“ and he did not hesitate to stress that these forces should include European soldiers. He added: "We Europeans should start an initiative, especially now when our American friends are taken up by the presidential election campaign — and we all know how important the support from some groups is in order to get elected in America“. It is quite clear whom this gentleman means.This is just one of many examples how anti-Semitic stereotypes affect the perception of the Middle-East conflict by high-ranking EU politicians.'

"As she adds:

"'European policy in the Middle East is an important link of European anti-Zionism and Arab anti-Semitism which is as disastrous as it is effective; a coalition that is all the more effective because it is accompanied by an emancipation of the EU from the US. The relationship between foreign policy and mass consciousness is particularly important in the case of growing, openly expressed anti-Semitism...The greatest danger today is that the globalisation critique, anti-Americanism and anti-Zionism which exist in the heads of millions of people is amalgamated into a common sense that is supported and used by European policy. There is no difference in the consciousness of an average Member of the European Parliament and an average German peace demonstrator and I consider this to be a mixture of naivete, moralism, anti-Americanism, anti-Semitism and anti-Zionism and an altogether serious danger.'

"Schroder's devastating analysis surely needs the widest possible circulation. The evil nexus she describes is a major factor behind continuing terror and rising anti-Jewish hatred. The fact that a member of the European Parliament itself is blowing the whistle on it should be thrust in particular in the face of EU Commissioner Chris Patten, who has done so much to brush this under the carpet -- and who, if he becomes, as trailed, the next chairman of the BBC, will hardly use this position to expose such vileness to the light of day.

#92 Raider

The need to escort children has been around for a long time. I lived in Belgium (Antwerp) and ended up doing exactly that - walking kids to school. It was a really pleasant way to learn Flemish, until I began to understand some of the comments from the local muslims. One fine day, I encountered a Hassidim literally surrounded by 7 or 8 arab-looking teenagers, yelling and holding stones. Needless to say, the ensuing situation was not resolved via diplomacy. Not a hand was laid on the youngster.

I later learned that this type of harrassment was very common, expecially with respect to the Hassidic Jews. That's just about when my attitude towards Israel began to change.

#93 jabberwock

Just a link will do!

Bigel, in response to your query (post 77) - I thought I'd replied but maybe I sent the comment to another thread by mistake.
In any case there is indeed a large French speaking Jewish population in Montreal mostly consisting of the diaspora from North Africa. Since many of the English speaking population have either left and/or are leaving and that includes Quebec's original Jewish settlers who have a very long history in the province, probably now the francophone Jewish numbers are equal to or greater than the English.
However if I were Jewish from France, I would immigrate to La Belle Province which handles its own immigration favouring French speakers and once in Canada, quickly move on to English Canada because Quebec is going nowhere at best and backward at worst.
Montreal is a beautiful city and the stupidity of the separatist nonsense has had one positive result - it's kept Montreal from turning into the kind of megapolis Toronto has become.
Incidentally, those of you who worry about Islamic demographics should remember the zero times table. Nothing times an infinite number still equals nothing. The Arabs claim to have invented the concept of zero - well they should know.

FWIW

Jews have a very long and complicated history in QUebec.

The genes know.

The European Jews need a Guardian Angels style civil self protection militia. The JDL, before it radicalized, used to fill this role in the US.

Jews everywhere would be wise to begin setting up local Haganahs, absolutely loyal to the laws and constitutions of their native countries; absolutely committed to the Jewish right of self defense.

Israel on the otherhand, needs to begin seriously whacking Islamic extremists all over the world. Find them hunt them and kill them. If they want they can always use elctronic eavesdropping methods and drop the "take" at the relevant police agency.

This is a world war; the Jews and Israel have been FAR too complacent about where things are going.

I'm in support of bigel and believe the opponents of same are missing bigel's main point.

First, for civilized people, what is the purpose of nuclear weapons? Right, deterrence via MAD; use of strategic nuclear weapons means that they have failed their primary purpose.

Second, how can MAD possibly be effective against jihad? Observe remarks by Iranian mullahs to the effect that, once they get weapons, they can just go ahead and nuke Israel since the counter-strike cannot eliminate all Muslims. MAD is premised on decision-makers on both sides being "rational actors".

I believe Robert Spencer is alluding to the semi-covert collaboration between EU and Arabs to promote the elimination of Israel. The shame of the Holocaust has well worn off; it didn't last a generation.

Within the EU/Arab axis, the only rational actor is EU so the only possible object of MAD is EU. Therefore, as bigel has been saying, Israel needs to threaten to nuke EU in response to imminent existential threat. This is deterrence 101.

Please note that this differs only in immaterial geographical details from US MAD policy with respect to USSR. Nor were all residents of USSR "guilty", some were even Americans, but they would have been just as dead. Nuclear weapons are extremely crude; that's why strategic nuclear doctrine seeks first and foremost to avoid their use.

Given that EU is the primary enabler of jihad via weapons technology and is the only rational actor, I would suggest that Israel might want to consider targeting its nukes exclusively, or nearly so, at EU. It should then transmit the message to EU ambassadors quietly that it has nukes and where they are pointed. Another action that would help MAD vis a vis Arabs/Muslims would be for the US to include Israel under its nuclear umbrella. This would alter the idiotic jihad calculus of Iranian mullahs and like-minded Mohammedan savages.

If we have learned anything from history, we have learned that we must protect ourselves because no one will do it for us. The Jews of Belgium should immediately arm themselves and escort their children to and from school. If the Belgian civil authorities cannot or will not protect their Jewish citizens, then the Jews must protect themselves. If every rock wielding Arab thinks he may be shot if he attacks a Jew, attacks on Jews will soon stop. If the Belgian authorities will not allow the Jews to protect themselves, then the Jews should leave.
In fact, Jews in Europe in general shoud think seriously about leaving. The Muslims hate them and the Christians do not have the will to protect them, that seems clear.

Ploome, that was interesting. I didn't know that. I did know about francophone Quebec and the high incidence of cystic fibrosis and also about a few other rarer genetically transmitted diseases. It stems from the time Quebec was a very isolated society which is not quite the situation today. The same high incidence of certain genetically transmitted diseases also occurs amongst the Afrikaans - porphyra (the madness of George III) comes to mind.

bigel:

To summarize, I'm proposing a strategic model where both potential culprits and their enablers are deterred. Israel is better situated, IMHO, to deter enablers (EU) while the US is better situated (e.g., one or two Ohio class submarines) to deter potential culprits (Iran, Arabs, etc.)

Some strong and "unilateral" anti-proliferation steps are also in order presently.

#16
Bigel, I did not make the offer, but I know some immigration attorneys in Columbus, OH (he also teaches immigartion law at two law schools and is former Pres. of a national society of immigration lawyers), Chicago and (if he hasn't retired or moved to Israel) Minneapolis. If any of those would be helpful, email me off the board.

Yankev

#26, Reaganite

There's Jew hatred in North America, does that make us "a continent of Jew hating Nazi scum" as well?

Though I don't agree with Bigel completely, ask again when North America has nearly two millennia of de jure anti-semitism in nearly every country on the continent, centuries where individual anti-semitism is more common than not, Jews are commonly (and sometimes legally) deemed incapable of being true citizens, and (with the exception of a forty year period of dormancy after WWII) has demonstrated the inability to go a decade without desecration of Jewish holy sites, confiscation of Jewish property and officially sanctioned or ignored physical attacks on Jews and Jewish institutions.

Fortunately we do not have that histroy here in N. America, even in Canada. Europe is a bit different.

Yankev

#101 DarthMaulrulesok

What makes you think there are any Christians left in Europe? It is now a purely secular empire.

grayp and #72 Semour Paine:

--The fact that European Jewry does not speak out against what is happening, (Jews asked not use subways, wear Jewish stars, etc) gives you an idea of the precariousness of their situation and, really, for Jews worldwide.

--Simply put, the world is inured to Jews being killed, either in gas chambers or buses, and does not get too worked up about restrictions put on individual Jews. It's sort of business as usual. Plus there are far too Jews in Europe and the police seemed cowered by their massive Muslim populations.

--The situation in Europe is this. When Jews want to stage a rally in support of Israel, much larger pro Palestinian groups appear. In fact, one such rally was almost cancelled in London or Paris because police could not guarantee security. Thankfully, so far, in the US, it is almost the opposite case. An October rally by some pro Arab group brought out many more pro Israel supporters.

--My husband is considering pursuing a job opportunity in London, but frankly, I'm afraid of the Muslim support there and since my kids attend Jewish day school and I'd fear for their safety. And this is fucking London, not Paris or Brussels or Stockholm.

--OT, Did anyone catch Rumsfield's reply to the Palestinians' request to reign in Israel's nukes. He said something like, "Israel is a small country, a democracy, among many countries that want her pushed into the sea. Israel's weapons will make sure this doesn't happen." I could have kissed him and I'm a long-time Democrat!