re: #17 EastSider

How can they be shown the light?

Actually, my previous comment was pure sarcasm (obviously - though there is much to be said for the curing powers of haggis and whisky, naturally).

But I feel that your question merits a real response because I see it asked a lot around me.

The answer is unpretty: there is no way to show them the light.

The fact is that these people are “true believers”. Many are creationists or deniers of various stripes and, put simply, you can’t argue them with reasoned debate and logic. Facts don’t enter into the equation either. The fact is that most of them openly say they will deny reality unless it fits their own version of the facts (a tactic we well understand from creationists by now).

If somebody is completely unwilling to change their minds on anything, no matter the facts presented to them, then there is no way that you, with words alone, can force them to re-think the issue.

The only actual way for them to change their minds is for them to have a revelation type of experience; an epiphany, if you will. I don’t use these words lightly. For them to undertake such a dramatic shift in their life view requires them to have an equally dramatic shift in their view on life. Nothing else will truly cut it.

The only route is for them to become so disillusioned with some sort of process or other that they will become bitter and slowly mellow with age, but never quite leave their prejudices behind, or to have an experience which forces them to renounce everything they fundamentally believe in.

Either of these experiences are, for the most part, far beyond the power of debate and words. I know - I’ve tried, and tried, and tried. It helps that I know some creationists and global warming deniers, etc…. It has given me a fascinating view into their mindset and, yes, they will openly admit that if facts get in the way that ignoring them is the solution because the facts must then be wrong.

I’m not suggesting that they have to be ignored, but I am suggesting never to believe that you will ever change their minds, no matter what you say.

You may get lucky - it has happened a few times. But, quite frankly, it is a rare thing. How many times have we pointed out the fallacies in their arguments here only to receive the same arguments again and again after they had been answered tens of thousands of times? How many times have famous debaters answered the same arguments only to hear them time and time again as if they had never been answered at all?

These are not the responses of sane and rational people.

It’s a good question you ask but I’m afraid the answer is just a very depressing one if you think about it too much.