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Forum: The Rev. Wright Speech

Tue, Apr 29, 2008 at 11:53:27 am PDT

The previous thread about Barack Obama’s belated disavowal of Reverend Jeremiah Wright is approaching 500 comments, so here’s another thread to discuss.

I’ve been switching back and forth between Fox News and MSNBC, risking ideological whiplash as MSNBC gushes over the speech...

773 comments

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1 itellu3times  4/29/08 11:54:23 am reply quote

In your heart, you know he's Wright.

2 Ojoe  4/29/08 11:54:34 am reply quote

20 years too late Barry.

3 dmjboose  4/29/08 11:54:42 am reply quote

any good quotes?

4 Mazeman  4/29/08 11:54:50 am reply quote

Are their any members of THE Black Church here who wish to comment?

5 MandyManners  4/29/08 11:55:09 am reply quote

Is registration still open?

6 Occasional Reader  4/29/08 11:55:22 am reply quote

Obama's speech was the bravest, most eloquent statement on race relations on America we have seen in our lifetime.

GAAAAAAAAH

Okay, I managed to pry that chip out of my neck. What the hell was I saying?

7 saberry0530  4/29/08 11:55:55 am reply quote

Watch that whiplash! Its' bad for the Spine!

8 Mazeman  4/29/08 11:56:37 am reply quote

The Obama candidacy will set race relations bak 50 years.

9 Occasional Reader  4/29/08 11:56:42 am reply quote

re: #1 itellu3times

In your heart, you know he's Wright.

In your guts, you know he's nuts.

In your _______*, you know he's a bigot.


* What the hell rhymes with "bigot"? Diggit?

10 EC Marm  4/29/08 11:57:02 am reply quote

"Barry needs a bigger bus than that."
Jeremiah Wright

/ ok I made that up. It's a prediction...

11 Dirk Diggler  4/29/08 11:57:33 am reply quote

OR,

* What the hell rhymes with "bigot"? Diggit?

Spigot.

12 Ojoe  4/29/08 11:57:39 am reply quote

re: #8 Mazeman

He's 1/2 white

both groups can disavow him

maybe something will thereby be salvaged

13 doppelganglander  4/29/08 11:57:45 am reply quote

re: #5 MandyManners

Registration's open? I'll pop the popcorn, but it's too early for a beer.

14 kynna  4/29/08 11:58:05 am reply quote

I love Obama acting like he didn't know anything when he's been recorded giving Wright a glowing introduction. So he's admitting he lied when he said all those nice things about Wright because he couldn't possibly known the man well enough to know if they were true or untrue.

The fact it's taken him this long is telling. Not that I needed anymore evidence that Obama has no business even running for president, much less being elected.

15 kansas  4/29/08 11:58:24 am reply quote

Is it too much to ask for some degree of journalistic integrity from MSNBC?

16 Ojoe  4/29/08 11:58:25 am reply quote

re: #9 Occasional Reader

Spigot

17 galloping granny  4/29/08 11:58:39 am reply quote

re: #8 Mazeman

The Obama candidacy will set race relations bak 50 years.

It has already done that. When all is said and done I think we will find race relations to be worse than they have been at any time since the War Between the States.

18 vagabond trader  4/29/08 11:58:45 am reply quote

and the LLL call W slow? 20 years to figure out Wright's character? This guy thinks we the people are so dumbed down and mesmerized by his brilliance that we'll let him piss on our toes and tell us it's raining.Condescending little prick.

19 OldLineTexan  4/29/08 11:59:31 am reply quote

re: #9 Occasional Reader

In your guts, you know he's nuts.

In your _______*, you know he's a bigot.


* What the hell rhymes with "bigot"? Diggit?

Even if you Digg it, you know he's a bigot.

20 Citizen Duck  4/29/08 11:59:35 am reply quote

Now the government of the US creating/propagating the AIDS virus and all the other Wright invective is beyond the pale?

Too little, waaaaaay too late.

21 BabbaZee  4/29/08 11:59:35 am reply quote

wah
I did all my best shtick down there already
lol

22 nikis-knight  4/29/08 11:59:37 am reply quote
The previous thread about Barack Obama’s belated disavowal of Reverend Jeremiah Wright is approaching 500 comments, so here’s another thread to discuss.

Well, I'm late to the party today. Be back after I read the previous thread, heh...

23 MandyManners  4/29/08 11:59:55 am reply quote

re: #15 kansas

Is it too much to ask for some degree of journalistic integrity from MSNBC?

Yes.

24 Dirk Diggler  4/29/08 11:59:59 am reply quote

As a person of color I can safely say that Rev. Wright does not represent my views.

25 Kragar (Proud to be Kafir)  4/29/08 12:00:21 pm reply quote

re: #5 MandyManners

Is registration still open?

Crap, and with Obama in full spin mode too.

Man the trenches, fix bayonets and watch for trolls in the wire.

26 debutaunt  4/29/08 12:00:28 pm reply quote

re: #17 galloping granny

It has already done that. When all is said and done I think we will find race relations to be worse than they have been at any time since the War Between the States.

Very few people would benefit from that.

27 Honorary Yooper  4/29/08 12:00:53 pm reply quote

re: #14 kynna

Obama is having a Daley Moment. That happens when Da Mayor is caught in the middle of something and goes on air to deny it. For some odd reason, the gambit works since it provides a diversion.

Watch for more of these as the election season continues. It occurs in Illinois all the time. Both Daley and Blago do it!

28 eschew_obfuscation  4/29/08 12:00:59 pm reply quote

re: #18 vagabond trader

and the LLL call W slow? 20 years to figure out Wright's character? This guy thinks we the people are so dumbed down and mesmerized by his brilliance that we'll let him piss on our toes and tell us it's raining.Condescending little prick.

And the left tells us 'guilt by association' is a bad thing.......let's judge him not by the color of his skin, but by the content of his character........I've heard that before somewhere...

29 Ojoe  4/29/08 12:01:05 pm reply quote

re: #24 Dirk Diggler

I'm kind of pinkish and he doesn't represent mine either.

Color is not supposed to matter anymore.

30 BabbaZee  4/29/08 12:01:06 pm reply quote

re: #24 Dirk Diggler

As a person of color I can safely say that Rev. Wright does not represent my views.

Person of Color
is like
Climate Change

lol

applies to anything

31 paxnhymn  4/29/08 12:01:08 pm reply quote

re: #18 vagabond trader

and the LLL call W slow? 20 years to figure out Wright's character? This guy thinks we the people are so dumbed down and mesmerized by his brilliance that we'll let him piss on our toes and tell us it's raining.Condescending little prick.

yep. It's Ok to wait 20 years to call a racist out, but it's not ok to wait six minutes to not scare children before acting on the WTC attacks....

Hypocrits, thy name is DNC....

32 My 2 cents  4/29/08 12:01:30 pm reply quote

Jim Geraghty predicted this on 4/28/2008.

See [Link: campaignspot.nationalreview.com...]

"Is the Stage Being Set For the All-Time Sister Souljah Moment?"

33 Occasional Reader  4/29/08 12:01:36 pm reply quote

Video of Obama's indignant, outraged speech
(relevant portion is around 00:39 - 00:42)

34 BabbaZee  4/29/08 12:01:41 pm reply quote

I am a deep Mediterranean Beige

35 freedomplow  4/29/08 12:01:52 pm reply quote

Poll numbers must have been going down.

36 Dirk Diggler  4/29/08 12:02:17 pm reply quote

Ojoe,

I'm kind of pinkish and he doesn't represent mine either.

I'm a whiter shade of pale myself.

37 babes  4/29/08 12:02:23 pm reply quote

Thank you!

re: #33 Occasional Reader

38 chief long name  4/29/08 12:02:23 pm reply quote

re: #9 Occasional Reader

Spigot?

39 OldLineTexan  4/29/08 12:02:56 pm reply quote

re: #26 debutaunt

Very few people would benefit from that.

I agree, but those few are cashin' in.

Al Sharpton is already back in the spotlight, fresh from his survival gig at Fox.

Jeremiah Wright has been on TV more than Britney Spears of late.

I'm waiting to hear from Jesse Jackson.

And with all this HOT AIR, Algore stands to make a killing in carbon credits.

40 The Other Les  4/29/08 12:03:08 pm reply quote

Anyone attending a single Nuremberg Rally pretty much understands what's going on there. I simply cannot believe that someone could attend a church for twenty years and not know what the pastor really stands for.

41 jorline  4/29/08 12:03:36 pm reply quote

Obama's campaign is imploding before your very eyes!

42 The Other Les  4/29/08 12:03:40 pm reply quote

re: #34 BabbaZee

I am a deep Mediterranean Beige

Like Sophia Loren?

43 saberry0530  4/29/08 12:04:01 pm reply quote

re: #40 The Other Les

Anyone attending a single Nuremberg Rally pretty much understands what's going on there. I simply cannot believe that someone could attend a church for twenty years and not know what the pastor really stands for.

I can! It's called a SMF.

44 Ojoe  4/29/08 12:04:13 pm reply quote

re: #36 Dirk Diggler

"Nature does not present any monochrome surface"

—Antonio Gaudi, Architect.

(Who also said, "Originality is a return to the Origin".)

45 BabbaZee  4/29/08 12:04:29 pm reply quote

re: #36 Dirk Diggler

Ojoe,

I'm a whiter shade of pale myself.


the hamsters be strugglin, yo

46 BabbaZee  4/29/08 12:04:39 pm reply quote

re: #42 The Other Les

yes that color

47 Occasional Reader  4/29/08 12:04:42 pm reply quote

Obama may have started his campaign as a "person of color", but he's becoming increasingly transparent.

48 Ojoe  4/29/08 12:04:47 pm reply quote

re: #41 jorline

The democratic party I think also.

49 Mazeman  4/29/08 12:04:48 pm reply quote

re: #41 jorline

Obama's campaign is imploding before your very eyes!

True, except for the pesky delegate lead he will retain.

Denver's going to be fun!

50 Tumulus11  4/29/08 12:05:01 pm reply quote

. There's only one way to settle this thing: Wright vs. Obama in a 15-round preach-off at the National Convention.

51 ghengis was a wuss  4/29/08 12:05:30 pm reply quote

Wright is a Malcolm X wannabe; a Black Panther fist in Jesus sandals.

52 paxnhymn  4/29/08 12:05:44 pm reply quote

better run and hide Obamessiah...

The Shrillary can smell your wounds!

53 Charles  4/29/08 12:05:52 pm reply quote

Wow.

We have incoming links from Instapundit, Ace, Michelle, and lots of others, and now Fark.com put the DNC Ad post on their front page ... and there's no noticeable impact on the server!

Excuse me. I almost never do this, but ... YES!

Previously, a front page link from Fark would crash the server within minutes.

54 CyanSnowHawk  4/29/08 12:05:53 pm reply quote

re: #9 Occasional Reader

* What the hell rhymes with "bigot"? Diggit?

Barack.

55 Dianna  4/29/08 12:05:55 pm reply quote

re: #8 Mazeman

Not if it's firmly rejected. And to hell with anyone who screams that it's racism. I've watched all those videos of Wright in action, and listened to the cheers of his congregation; that's racism and self-pity in full cry.

57 Sabra412  4/29/08 12:06:43 pm reply quote

re: #53 Charles

Wow.

We have incoming links from Instapundit, Ace, Michelle, and lots of others, and now Fark.com put the DNC Ad post on their front page ... and there's no noticeable impact on the server!

Excuse me. I almost never do this, but ... YES!

Previously, a front page link from Fark would crash the server within minutes.

OK now we're jinxed.

58 BabbaZee  4/29/08 12:06:58 pm reply quote

re: #53 Charles

Mazel Tov

59 loppyd  4/29/08 12:07:21 pm reply quote

Charles' server rocks while mine is suffering a slow, painful death.

Have to re-boot.

BBL

60 Ojoe  4/29/08 12:07:27 pm reply quote

re: #53 Charles

OK everyone post your best comments

61 galloping granny  4/29/08 12:07:39 pm reply quote

Fox replaying, Obama spends an awful lot of time looking down and to the left.

62 Dianna  4/29/08 12:07:42 pm reply quote

re: #16 Ojoe

Maggot will also work; demagogue for a slant-rhyme...

63 rawmuse  4/29/08 12:07:46 pm reply quote

There are few vicarious pleasures I enjoy greater than watching a politician suddenly and thoroughly disavow a calculated political construct that they have nurtured for decades. This is precious!

64 The Other Les  4/29/08 12:07:51 pm reply quote

re: #50 Tumulus11

. There's only one way to settle this thing: Wright vs. Obama in a 15-round preach-off at the National Convention.

Unfortunately, Leni Riefenstahl is no longer around to film it.

65 vagabond trader  4/29/08 12:07:59 pm reply quote

Did you notice all the self references the Obama made? It's all about him being harmed,to hell with the offended bitter clingy American gun nut little folk he looks down his nose at.Narcissistic rubbish!

66 Honorary Yooper  4/29/08 12:08:04 pm reply quote

re: #41 jorline

Obama's campaign is imploding before your very eyes!

Don't be so certain. Obama is a snake like most of his Illinois Combine comrades. Saw a poll this morning on NBC-5 (WMAQ-TV) that showed over 50% of people claimed that the whole Wright episode would not affect Obama's candidacy.

What you are seeing now is what has been going on in Illinois for the better part of four decades, and in Chicago itself since the early 1930s. Obama is a product of this Machine, this Combine, and acts the part.

67 yma o hyd  4/29/08 12:08:07 pm reply quote

re: #60 Ojoe

'kay - have just dusted my keyboard and cleaned my hands :-)

68 coquimbojoe  4/29/08 12:08:17 pm reply quote

re: #9 Occasional Reader

In your guts, you know he's nuts.

In your _______*, you know he's a bigot.


* What the hell rhymes with "bigot"? Diggit?

Spigot

69 Lively  4/29/08 12:08:30 pm reply quote

Apologies if this has already been posted, but....

Another One Rides the Bus

70 Captkirk35  4/29/08 12:08:30 pm reply quote

Rev. Wright makes me ashamed to call him a fellow Marine.

We all have flaws.. countries have them too. Is this nation perfect? Of course not. Our flaws have been well documented. But America, which provides so much opportunity to all, and has given Wright such extraordinary blessings during his life.. for him to constantly pick at the scabs at the expense of all that is good is such a tragedy. If it was only about Wright and his coming book, and his million dollar palace out with Whitey, we could only shake our heads and mutter about his ignorance and hypocrisy. But the influence he has on younger generations of black people is so profoundly detrimental, he and others who spew his form of bile are just plain evil.

Rev. Wright... go F**ck yourself.

71 nyc redneck  4/29/08 12:08:42 pm reply quote

i'm looking forward to wright's rebuttal.

72 jorline  4/29/08 12:08:44 pm reply quote

re: #49 Mazeman

I agree...perhaps we need to redirect some of those National Guard troops currently on the Texas border to Denver.

My bad...what troops on the border.

73 Occasional Reader  4/29/08 12:09:03 pm reply quote

re: #53 Charles

and there's no noticeable impact on the server!

The new question: Can the server be stopped?!

How soon before the server decides that it doesn't want to serve US any more, but rather vice-versa?

74 Thanos  4/29/08 12:09:08 pm reply quote

re: #53 Charles

Wow.

We have incoming links from Instapundit, Ace, Michelle, and lots of others, and now Fark.com put the DNC Ad post on their front page ... and there's no noticeable impact on the server!

Excuse me. I almost never do this, but ... YES!

Previously, a front page link from Fark would crash the server within minutes.

Tis great news indeed, and you should heartily congratulate yourself, huge spikes in transacts per second are the hardest beast in the industry to fight.

75 Racer X  4/29/08 12:09:09 pm reply quote

re: #47 Occasional Reader

Obama may have started his campaign as a "person of color", but he's becoming increasingly transparent.

That should be at the top of the page listed as the "Quote Of The Day".

76 yma o hyd  4/29/08 12:09:25 pm reply quote

re: #64 The Other Les

Unfortunately, Leni Riefenstahl is no longer around to film it.

He'd not have dared umming and ahh-ing if she'd been running the show!

77 Honorary Yooper  4/29/08 12:09:29 pm reply quote

re: #65 vagabond trader

Did you notice all the self references the Obama made? It's all about him being harmed,to hell with the offended bitter clingy American gun nut little folk he looks down his nose at.Narcissistic rubbish!

That's typical for Chicago. Daley does this all the time to obfuscate the issue and take the heat off him.

78 Ghengis was a wuss  4/29/08 12:09:34 pm reply quote

#56 babazee

I know. the "sandals" are his way of putting on the "front" of Christianity when it is nothing of the kind. Just my analogy.......

79 BabbaZee  4/29/08 12:09:42 pm reply quote

rig it
zig it
wig it

80 BulgarWheat  4/29/08 12:10:04 pm reply quote

re: #69 Lively

Lively, no it hadn't. Good timing!

81 Psycotte  4/29/08 12:10:06 pm reply quote

Wow, this Obama guy is sharp. He just realized today what Jeremiah's world view was? I wonder if he'll fish Grandma out from under the bus before he throws Jeremiah there?

Likely not....

82 galloping granny  4/29/08 12:10:09 pm reply quote

re: #29 Ojoe

I'm kind of pinkish and he doesn't represent mine either.

Color is not supposed to matter anymore.

That is politically correct crap on a stick. Color matter just as much today and has every day for the last 30 years as it ever did. The difference is that pinkish is the wrong color.

83 BabbaZee  4/29/08 12:10:10 pm reply quote

re: #78 Ghengis was a wuss

Okeedokee

84 Lively  4/29/08 12:10:13 pm reply quote

re: #70 Captkirk35


Rev Wright refers to himself as an "ex" marine.

85 Dianna  4/29/08 12:10:19 pm reply quote

re: #34 BabbaZee

I'm a slightly sallow celt who doesn't tan.

86 babes  4/29/08 12:10:39 pm reply quote

Here is a video of Obama's performance. Watch and wretch.

[Link: en.sevenload.com...]

87 Occasional Reader  4/29/08 12:10:43 pm reply quote

re: #75 Racer X

That should be at the top of the page listed as the "Quote Of The Day".

Aw, shucks.

88 coquimbojoe  4/29/08 12:10:49 pm reply quote

I ate my paste now my mouth is stuck shut.

/Oh, up thread you wanted best comments....

89 Mazeman  4/29/08 12:11:01 pm reply quote

re: #85 Dianna

I'm a slightly sallow celt who doesn't tan.

I'm a pasty Pole.

90 MandyManners  4/29/08 12:11:09 pm reply quote

re: #79 BabbaZee

rig it
zig it
wig it

Gig it.

BHO has gigged Wright.

91 BabbaZee  4/29/08 12:11:15 pm reply quote

re: #85 Dianna

I'm a slightly sallow celt who doesn't tan.

When I am tan I am blacker than Obama.

92 eschew_obfuscation  4/29/08 12:11:24 pm reply quote

Does this mean Obama has disavowed the person he could no more disavow than his typical white grandmother?

93 galloping granny  4/29/08 12:11:24 pm reply quote

re: #70 Captkirk35

Rev. Wright makes me ashamed to call him a fellow Marine.

We all have flaws.. countries have them too. Is this nation perfect? Of course not. Our flaws have been well documented. But America, which provides so much opportunity to all, and has given Wright such extraordinary blessings during his life.. for him to constantly pick at the scabs at the expense of all that is good is such a tragedy. If it was only about Wright and his coming book, and his million dollar palace out with Whitey, we could only shake our heads and mutter about his ignorance and hypocrisy. But the influence he has on younger generations of black people is so profoundly detrimental, he and others who spew his form of bile are just plain evil.

Rev. Wright... go F**ck yourself.

Don't forget the Porsche he drives while telling his congregants to eschew "middleclassness."

94 paxnhymn  4/29/08 12:11:34 pm reply quote

re: #71 nyc redneck

i'm looking forward to wright's rebuttal.

it'll be in the form of a larger, more improved / orchestrated press conference...Preacher racist v.2.01...and I expect some vitriole this time with howling supporters of the pack, of course followed by his characteristic-yet-untrue , "It's in the Bible".....no one will even be able to get a question in....

95 Lively  4/29/08 12:12:01 pm reply quote

re: #71 nyc redneck

i'm looking forward to wright's rebuttal.


At this point, I think Wright will have a...just-who-does-he-think-he's-talking-to attitude.

96 yma o hyd  4/29/08 12:12:06 pm reply quote

re: #82 galloping granny

That is politically correct crap on a stick. Color matter just as much today and has every day for the last 30 years as it ever did. The difference is that pinkish is the wrong color.

Pinkish (politically) always was the wrong colour ...

97 Occasional Reader  4/29/08 12:12:10 pm reply quote

re: #85 Dianna

I'm a slightly sallow celt who doesn't tan.

As I once commented to a bunch of Irish tourists on the Costa Brava while admonishing them to use my SPF45 sunscreen, "there's a reason you've never heard the phrase, 'Savage Irish Tan'".

98 coquimbojoe  4/29/08 12:12:13 pm reply quote

re: #79 BabbaZee

rig it
zig it
wig it

fig it
pig it
zaftig it

99 snowcrash  4/29/08 12:12:34 pm reply quote

Hillary is on the OReilly show tomorrow night. She must be revising her talking points right now. I can't wait to see how she handles it.

101 itellu3times  4/29/08 12:13:10 pm reply quote

Obama, it's no good clinging bitterly to your faith like this, I suggest you get a gun.

/happiness is a warm, yes it is, guuuun

102 Occasional Reader  4/29/08 12:13:15 pm reply quote

re: #91 BabbaZee

When I am tan I am blacker than Obama.

[seething with envy... see SPF45 reference above]

Fortunately, my wife's genes means our kids will have a fighting chance at the beach...

103 maximoso  4/29/08 12:13:18 pm reply quote

Q - Why did you choose a church that preaches Black Liberation theology:

A - What's that. I just listened to sermons about Jesus. I'm not a theologan.

Rev Wright has never s poke that way around me

SHOCKING!

104 Lively  4/29/08 12:13:20 pm reply quote

re: #99 snowcrash

Hillary is on the OReilly show tomorrow night. She must be revising her talking points right now. I can't wait to see how she handles it.


You know O'Reilly will ask her about it.

/poor Obama

105 vagabond trader  4/29/08 12:13:36 pm reply quote

Heh, guess this means the Obama and the missus aren't going to partake of the rev's hospitality at the new digs.You know, the modest little cottage in the gated community, purchased for Wright by his church.

106 OldLineTexan  4/29/08 12:13:48 pm reply quote

re: #93 galloping granny

Don't forget the Porsche he drives while telling his congregants to eschew "middleclassness."

That's fair.

/Porsche ain't middle class!

107 ploome hineni  4/29/08 12:14:06 pm reply quote

re: #81 Psycotte

Wow, this Obama guy is sharp. He just realized today what Jeremiah's world view was? I wonder if he'll fish Grandma out from under the bus before he throws Jeremiah there?

Likely not....

he is performing

those thoughtful, pregnant pauses..trying to compose out what he is going to say

and his total naivete

he NEVER HAD A CLUE about the rev Wright

20 YEARS AND HE NEVER HAD A CLUE

108 cblesz  4/29/08 12:14:28 pm reply quote

re: #105 vagabond trader

Heh, guess this means the Obama and the missus aren't going to partake of the rev's hospitality at the new digs.You know, the modest little cottage in the gated community, purchased for Wright by his church.


The mostly "white rich" community...

109 paxnhymn  4/29/08 12:14:36 pm reply quote

re: #106 OldLineTexan

That's fair.

/Porsche ain't middle class!

well that depends...Boxter or Ruf?


:-D

110 Gordon Marock  4/29/08 12:14:51 pm reply quote

"I DID NOT HAVE SPIRITUAL RELATIONS WITH THAT PASTOR!"

B.H.O.

111 ggt  4/29/08 12:14:59 pm reply quote

re: #53 Charles

Congratulations Charles! D@mn fine job and I, for one, truly appreciate it.

/hates when LGF is off-line. Fruitcup is nice, but not the same.

112 BabbaZee  4/29/08 12:15:08 pm reply quote

re: #102 Occasional Reader

{My Melanin Challenged Atheist}

113 Racer X  4/29/08 12:15:23 pm reply quote

re: #110 Gordon Marock

"I DID NOT HAVE SPIRITUAL RELATIONS WITH THAT PASTOR!"

B.H.O.

LMAO!

114 Thanos  4/29/08 12:15:25 pm reply quote

Sudden reversals of field, did Obama break his ankles:

"This is not an attack on Jeremiah Wright," Wright told the Washington media Monday. "It has nothing to do with Senator Obama. It is an attack on the black church launched by people who know nothing about the African-American religious tradition."

115 BabbaZee  4/29/08 12:15:28 pm reply quote

re: #110 Gordon Marock

excellent

116 Lively  4/29/08 12:15:29 pm reply quote

re: #108 cblesz

The mostly "white rich" community...

It's gonna be awkward at that first block party.

117 macofromoc  4/29/08 12:15:37 pm