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Science: A Galactic Shockwave

Thu, Jul 3, 2008 at 3:58:46 pm PDT

The Hubble Space Telescope took this image of the outer edge of a shockwave generated in our galaxy by an exploding supernova, and witnessed on earth in the year 1006 AD. The entire diameter of this massive galactic ripple is about 60 light years, and it’s still expanding at a speed of 6 million miles per hour. From the NASA Image of the Day Gallery.

Around May 1, 1006 A.D., observers from Africa to Europe to the Far East witnessed and recorded the arrival of light from what is now called SN 1006, a tremendous supernova explosion caused by the final death throes of a white dwarf star nearly 7,000 light-years away. The supernova was probably the brightest star ever seen by humans, and surpassed Venus as the brightest object in the night time sky, only to be surpassed by the moon. It was visible even during the day for weeks, and remained visible to the naked eye for at least two and a half years before fading away.

It wasn’t until the mid-1960s that radio astronomers first detected a nearly circular ring of material at the recorded position of the supernova. The ring was almost 30 arcminutes across, the same angular diameter as the full moon. The size of the remnant implied that the blast wave from the supernova had expanded at nearly 20 million miles per hour over the nearly 1,000 years since the explosion occurred.

Today, SN 1006 has a diameter of nearly 60 light-years, and it is still expanding at roughly 6 million miles per hour. Even at this tremendous speed, however, it takes observations typically separated by years to see significant outward motion of the shock wave against the grid of background stars. In the Hubble image as displayed, the supernova would have occurred far off the lower right corner of the image, and the motion would be toward the upper left.

(Hat tip: Abu Lahab.)

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267 comments

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1 Mambo Bananapatch  Thu, Jul 3, 2008 3:59:44pm

It looks like that time ribbon in Star Trek TNG Generations.

2 JCM  Thu, Jul 3, 2008 4:00:14pm

WOW!

3 SasquatchOnSteroids  Thu, Jul 3, 2008 4:00:40pm

Awesome picture.

4 stevieray  Thu, Jul 3, 2008 4:01:27pm

Its all too vast to really comprehend.

5 Pullus Iulius  Thu, Jul 3, 2008 4:01:35pm

Saving the Hubble telescope service mission is, to my knowledge, the only worthwhile thing Babs Mikulski ever did.

6 rawmuse  Thu, Jul 3, 2008 4:01:40pm

How Great Thou Art

7 Killgore Trout  Thu, Jul 3, 2008 4:01:44pm
Today, SN 1006 has a diameter of nearly 60 light-years, and it is still expanding at roughly 6 million miles per hour.


Impressive.

8 goddessoftheclassroom  Thu, Jul 3, 2008 4:03:02pm

re: #4 stevieray

Its all too vast to really comprehend.

Numbers that big make my head hurt!

9 JCM  Thu, Jul 3, 2008 4:03:25pm

It's photoshopped, there are no turtles in the image.

10 pat  Thu, Jul 3, 2008 4:03:26pm

Remember the day well.

11 Hard Right  Thu, Jul 3, 2008 4:03:41pm

Ah ha! I knew I sensed a new thread about to be born. There was a disturbance in the force...or it was that burrito I had.

What a pic. Call me silly, but we should not cut back or kill our space exploration.

12 Lizard by the Bay  Thu, Jul 3, 2008 4:03:59pm

Space fireworks. Niiice!

13 Killgore Trout  Thu, Jul 3, 2008 4:04:23pm

For the astronomy geeks: Worldwide telescope
It's like google earth but for the cosmos.

14 directorblue  Thu, Jul 3, 2008 4:04:43pm

Holy crap, that's cool!

Now I've got to go dig up my Heinlein books...

15 Abu Lahab  Thu, Jul 3, 2008 4:05:18pm

Thank you Charles. It's an amazing image and I was just about to e-mail it to you. What a great card to send to someone to say Happy 4th of July.

16 Shiplord Kirel  Thu, Jul 3, 2008 4:05:44pm

"There are more things in heaven and earth, Horatio,
Than are dreamt of in your philosophy."

SHAKESPEARE / Hamlet Act 1. Scene V

17 JCM  Thu, Jul 3, 2008 4:06:02pm

6,000,000 Miles per Hour
8,800,000 Feet per Second

Coast to Coast in 0.5 milliseconds.

18 Egfrow  Thu, Jul 3, 2008 4:07:32pm

1006 AD? I believe that was the year the great, Messiah, Barrakus Obamanous was born.

19 SusanL  Thu, Jul 3, 2008 4:07:49pm

I love the Hubble. Smartest money ever spent.

20 HelloDare  Thu, Jul 3, 2008 4:07:50pm

Are you sure it's not just Obama's ego expanding?

21 brakes  Thu, Jul 3, 2008 4:07:54pm

But where are the globular clusters?

22 SasquatchOnSteroids  Thu, Jul 3, 2008 4:08:03pm

re: #4 stevieray

Its all too vast to really comprehend.

I remember reading a couple of years ago that if The United States was the Milky Way, our solar system equals about the size of a quarter. Sure puts perspective about me bitching over having to mow a puny acre every Friday.

23 Ringo the Gringo  Thu, Jul 3, 2008 4:08:34pm
a massive galactic ripple

Well that's something you don't see everyday.

24 Egfrow  Thu, Jul 3, 2008 4:08:46pm

re: #19 SusanL

I love the Hubble. Smartest money ever spent.

We didn't feel that way after it was first launched, It took pure genius and tenacity to fix that sucker.

25 Tarkus289  Thu, Jul 3, 2008 4:08:49pm

I believe Robert Byrd was celebrating his 70th birthday that year.

26 FrogMarch  Thu, Jul 3, 2008 4:08:54pm

Hubble rocks.

27 faraway  Thu, Jul 3, 2008 4:09:35pm

From a history timeline

1000 Scientists suspect that the sun was particularly bright for a period of time that is called the Medieval Optimum with global temperatures about 1 to 2 degrees higher than today.

28 pre-Boomer Marine brat  Thu, Jul 3, 2008 4:09:55pm

It's from the explosion of the Klingon moon Praxis

29 SusanL  Thu, Jul 3, 2008 4:10:10pm

re: #24 Egfrow

I know, I sure am glad our scientists and engineers are so clever.

30 MandyManners  Thu, Jul 3, 2008 4:10:11pm

It must've scared the snot out of people.

31 Racer X  Thu, Jul 3, 2008 4:10:21pm

Nice!

32 ted  Thu, Jul 3, 2008 4:10:34pm

"A mere bag of shells..."

Ralph Kramden

33 faraway  Thu, Jul 3, 2008 4:11:39pm

1006 May 1, A supernova was observed by Chinese and Egyptians in constellation Lupus.

34 JCM  Thu, Jul 3, 2008 4:11:54pm

A little Hubble History.

The testing error that led to Hubble mirror fiasco
18 August 1990

NASA has established how a mirror aboard its $1.5 billion Hubble Telescope came to be the wrong shape. The agency said last week that errors in a test instrument apparently led Perkin-Elmer, which fabricated the optics, to finish the 2.4-metre primary mirror of the Hubble Space Telescope incorrectly. Tests by NASA earlier this month showed that a lens in the test instrument, called the 'reflective null corrector', is about a millimetre askew. Preliminary analysis indicates that an error of this magnitude could cause the spherical aberration that prevents Hubble from focusing sharply.

The crucial error, the misalignment of a lens by a millimetre, is 'very large' by optical standards, says Daniel Schroeder, an astronomer at Beloit College in Wisconsin, and a codesigner of Hubble. In some optical instruments, positions are measured to a fraction of the wavelength of light, less than a thousandth of a millimetre.

35 Pyroskank  Thu, Jul 3, 2008 4:12:32pm

re: #1 Mambo Bananapatch

It looks like that time ribbon in Star Trek TNG Generations.

Hey, yeah it does.

I bet it tastes like raspberries or pomegranates going at millions of miles per hour. Also, that movie gets a bad rap.

I like potatoes.

36 BingoBunny  Thu, Jul 3, 2008 4:13:24pm

Whats the carbon footprint of that nova.. how much offset will it owe?

37 rawmuse  Thu, Jul 3, 2008 4:14:47pm

" It was visible even during the day for weeks, and remained visible to the naked eye for at least two and a half years before fading away."

Could you even begin to imagine the chaos that would initiate if it happened to us tomorrow?

38 SasquatchOnSteroids  Thu, Jul 3, 2008 4:14:52pm

re: #20 HelloDare

Are you sure it's not just Obama's ego expanding?

It's certainly the right color.

39 JCM  Thu, Jul 3, 2008 4:16:03pm

Edwin Hubble
1889 - 1953

Edwin Powell Hubble is renowned for determining that there are other galaxies in the Universe beyond the Milky Way, and for observing that the universe is expanding at a constant rate.
40 Bob in Breckenridge  Thu, Jul 3, 2008 4:16:35pm

re: #20 HelloDare

Are you sure it's not just Obama's ego expanding?

Or Michelle "My Belle"s waistline?

41 yochanan  Thu, Jul 3, 2008 4:17:19pm

is this were BOZO went when he left the building?

42 pre-Boomer Marine brat  Thu, Jul 3, 2008 4:17:50pm

Thanks VERY much for this one, Charles!

43 Sharmuta  Thu, Jul 3, 2008 4:17:57pm
Today, SN 1006 has a diameter of nearly 60 light-years, and it is still expanding at roughly 6 million miles per hour. Even at this tremendous speed, however, it takes observations typically separated by years to see significant outward motion of the shock wave against the grid of background stars

It's amazing Hubble was even able to get this picture.

44 faraway  Thu, Jul 3, 2008 4:18:15pm

When the light left in 1009, an army led by Caliph al-Hakim destroys the church of the Holy Sepulchre in Jerusalem. This desecration was a rallying point for the Crusades to come.

I thought I would tie ID, Islam, terrorism, science and the Middle East all into one comment.

45 Dr. Shalit  Thu, Jul 3, 2008 4:18:50pm

re: #13 Killgore Trout

For the astronomy geeks: Worldwide telescope
It's like google earth but for the cosmos.

"K-T" -

Looks like a good one to WWT!

-S-

46 researchok  Thu, Jul 3, 2008 4:19:03pm
47 Salem  Thu, Jul 3, 2008 4:19:08pm

I LOVE SCIENCE!

48 Milk Toast Intolerant  Thu, Jul 3, 2008 4:19:55pm

Absolutely beautiful. I love science (everything except macro evolution).

/ducks and runs

49 MandyManners  Thu, Jul 3, 2008 4:20:34pm

re: #33 faraway

1006 May 1, A supernova was observed by Chinese and Egyptians in constellation Lupus.

Reallu?

50 Killgore Trout  Thu, Jul 3, 2008 4:21:32pm

14 Science Questions the Next President Should Answer
The questions are pretty rudimentary but it's still a pretty good list.

51 drmark  Thu, Jul 3, 2008 4:22:08pm
52 sparrowlake  Thu, Jul 3, 2008 4:22:23pm

re: #44 faraway

When the light left in 1009, an army led by Caliph al-Hakim destroys the church of the Holy Sepulchre in Jerusalem. This desecration was a rallying point for the Crusades to come.

When will it reach Earth, destroy Iran and trigger Armageddon?

53 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Thu, Jul 3, 2008 4:22:33pm

6,000,000 miles per hour. What kind of fuel is it using? How much per gallon?

54 Killian Bundy  Thu, Jul 3, 2008 4:23:10pm

When will it hit us?

/what will it do?

55 SusanL  Thu, Jul 3, 2008 4:23:23pm

re: #53 Fat Bastard Vegetarian

6,000,000 miles per hour. What kind of fuel is it using? How much per gallon?

You for got the most important question.... What is it's carbon footprint?

:)

56 Blackacre  Thu, Jul 3, 2008 4:23:42pm

There has been a disturbance in the force.

57 rawmuse  Thu, Jul 3, 2008 4:24:01pm

re: #54 Killian Bundy

1000 years ago. It made people draw pictures of it.

58 Milk Toast Intolerant  Thu, Jul 3, 2008 4:24:36pm

My new wallpaper.

59 pre-Boomer Marine brat  Thu, Jul 3, 2008 4:24:40pm

re: #44 faraway

When the light left in 1009, an army led by Caliph al-Hakim destroys the church of the Holy Sepulchre in Jerusalem. This desecration was a rallying point for in the evolution of the Crusades to come.

I thought I would tie ID, Islam, terrorism, science and the Middle East all into one comment.

Forgive me. Just made it better.

60 BuddyG  Thu, Jul 3, 2008 4:25:08pm

re: #4 stevieray

Its all too vast to really comprehend.

Indeed

61 rsquare  Thu, Jul 3, 2008 4:25:24pm

Would even the mere mention of Obular-glay uster-clay invite a pummeling with the banning stick?

rsquare

62 Killian Bundy  Thu, Jul 3, 2008 4:26:17pm

re: #57 rawmuse

1000 years ago. It made people draw pictures of it.

/that's when the supernova exploded

63 HelloDare  Thu, Jul 3, 2008 4:26:33pm

I'm sorry but the shockwave has got to be traveling a lot faster than 6 million miles per hour if it's going to travel all that distance in 6,000 years. Either that or the universe is a lot older than some people think. /

64 Sharmuta  Thu, Jul 3, 2008 4:27:12pm

re: #44 faraway

I thought I would tie ID, Islam, terrorism, science and the Middle East all into one comment.

I can do it in two words- Harun Yahya.

65 WindHorse  Thu, Jul 3, 2008 4:27:37pm

re: #50 Killgore Trout

15. Will you provide a certified copy of your birth certificate?

66 Dahveed  Thu, Jul 3, 2008 4:27:49pm

That is so cool! Thanks for posting this!

67 WindHorse  Thu, Jul 3, 2008 4:28:20pm

(I know it is science exactly.... but.....)

68 WindHorse  Thu, Jul 3, 2008 4:28:41pm

oops.... NOT science (I'm leaving)

69 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Thu, Jul 3, 2008 4:28:54pm

re: #62 Killian Bundy

Actually, I am curious as to when it died. Let's see if this is right.

7,000 light years from earth, and they saw it in 1006. So, it happened 8,002 years ago?

70 ploome hineni[deleted]  Thu, Jul 3, 2008 4:30:16pm
71 rawmuse  Thu, Jul 3, 2008 4:30:17pm

re: #62 Killian Bundy

No, that is when the light from the explosion arrived on our planet.

72 JCM  Thu, Jul 3, 2008 4:30:37pm

re: #62 Killian Bundy

/that's when the supernova exploded

That's when the light from the explosion arrived at earth. It exploded 7000 years before that.

73 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Thu, Jul 3, 2008 4:30:37pm

Little Python spacey songie!

74 faraway  Thu, Jul 3, 2008 4:31:07pm

re: #65 WindHorse

15. Will you provide a certified copy of your birth certificate that is not counterfeit or forged?

Corrected.

75 Abu Lahab  Thu, Jul 3, 2008 4:31:16pm

Hubble Archive is amazing.
Here is another beautiful image
And they have a special gallery for wallpaper fans.
The info there is so interesting. It's a great site for a great American invention.

76 itellu3times  Thu, Jul 3, 2008 4:31:41pm

That's some contrail!

77 JCM  Thu, Jul 3, 2008 4:32:33pm

re: #76 itellu3times

That's some contrail!

It's an alien chemtrail!
They are controlling our thoughts!

78 MandyManners  Thu, Jul 3, 2008 4:32:47pm

re: #46 researchok

SN 1006 in cave art?

Great article, and great song on your blog.

79 Killian Bundy  Thu, Jul 3, 2008 4:33:20pm

re: #71 rawmuse

No, that is when the light from the explosion arrived on our planet.

Right, right.

/now when will the shockwave that travels much slower hit?

80 NY Nana  Thu, Jul 3, 2008 4:33:30pm

re: #50 Killgore Trout

Shouldn't Hussein at least learn how many states there are before he tackles that?

81 HelloDare  Thu, Jul 3, 2008 4:33:43pm

re: #76 itellu3times

That's some contrail chemtrail!

Run, hide.

82 SasquatchOnSteroids  Thu, Jul 3, 2008 4:34:00pm

It is indeed beautiful. Looks very tenuous and static, and belies the massive violence that created it.

83 faraway  Thu, Jul 3, 2008 4:34:07pm

Obama just announced that we must surrender now!

84 bill-tb  Thu, Jul 3, 2008 4:34:42pm

Makes your everyday lizard feel real small.

85 SasquatchOnSteroids  Thu, Jul 3, 2008 4:34:49pm

re: #80 NY Nana

Shouldn't Hussein at least learn how many states there are before he tackles that?

I was thinking you have to chop 6 off, Obama can't handle more than 8 at a time.

86 MandyManners  Thu, Jul 3, 2008 4:34:55pm

re: #77 JCM

It's an alien chemtrail!
They are controlling our thoughts!

Put your plastic collander on! The metal one will only intensify the transmission.

87 HelloDare  Thu, Jul 3, 2008 4:35:07pm

Obama just changed his position on Intergalactic Shockwaves.

88 pre-Boomer Marine brat  Thu, Jul 3, 2008 4:35:09pm

re: #54 Killian Bundy

When will it hit us?

/what will it do?

Part of it will wrap tightly around Earth like red Saran Wrap ....

/sleep well tonight

89 itellu3times  Thu, Jul 3, 2008 4:35:25pm

I think that's when the real estate bubble burst there.

90 rawmuse  Thu, Jul 3, 2008 4:35:35pm

re: #79 Killian Bundy

Right, right.

/now when will the shockwave that travels much slower hit?

Pull my finger ;)

91 HelloDare  Thu, Jul 3, 2008 4:35:50pm

Do they come in blue?

92 faraway  Thu, Jul 3, 2008 4:35:57pm

I wonder if this is when lizards turned green and became afraid of loud noises?

93 itellu3times  Thu, Jul 3, 2008 4:36:02pm

re: #89 itellu3times

I think that's when the real estate bubble burst there.

Yeah, that's it, must have hit us a few months ago!

94 Milk Toast Intolerant  Thu, Jul 3, 2008 4:36:33pm

The Big Red Ribbon in the sky.

95 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Thu, Jul 3, 2008 4:36:36pm

NOT BRINGING UP THE SUBJECT! But, Obama is stepped in this pile of dookie pretty hard here...

WASHINGTON (AP) - Democratic presidential candidate Barack Obama says "mental distress" should not qualify as a health exception for late term-abortions, a key distinction not embraced by many supporters of abortion rights.

In an interview this week with "Relevant," a Christian magazine, Obama said prohibitions on late-term abortions must contain "a strict, well defined exception for the health of the mother."

Obama then added: "Now, I don't think that 'mental distress' qualifies as the health of the mother. I think it has to be a serious physical issue that arises in pregnancy, where there are real, significant problems to the mother carrying that child to term."

His trip to the center is going to be a wild one!

96 HelloDare  Thu, Jul 3, 2008 4:36:47pm

Can you surf it?

97 HelloDare  Thu, Jul 3, 2008 4:37:06pm

So many questions.

98 missouri boy  Thu, Jul 3, 2008 4:37:14pm

OT
Happy Birthday America...everyone have a great 4th July!
Me and mine plan to shoot plenty of semi-auto ammo to celebrate!
Everyone be safe! ...... just saying

99 godfrey  Thu, Jul 3, 2008 4:37:17pm

Look, and be amazed. I love this damn universe.

100 pre-Boomer Marine brat  Thu, Jul 3, 2008 4:37:23pm

re: #77 JCM

Do you know anything about the impact force of that shockwave upon a planet? I figure it'd dissipate with distance.

/no, I'm NOT thinking about it hitting Earth -- this is theoretical

101 Milk Toast Intolerant  Thu, Jul 3, 2008 4:37:42pm

re: #96 HelloDare

Can you surf it?

You would need a star class spaceship.

102 NY Nana  Thu, Jul 3, 2008 4:37:48pm

re: #85 SasquatchOnSteroids

I was thinking you have to chop 6 off, Obama can't handle more than 8 at a time.

Good point!

/We should all chip in for a calculator and a map.....of Siberia.

103 itellu3times  Thu, Jul 3, 2008 4:38:05pm

re: #96 HelloDare

Can you surf it?

If you're Norrin Radd.

I mean, seriously radd!

104 bellamags  Thu, Jul 3, 2008 4:38:17pm

re: #95 Fat Bastard Vegetarian

you are absolutely correct my friend. this is going to be fun to watch.

105 NonNativeTexan  Thu, Jul 3, 2008 4:38:36pm

Looks like someone did not recycle the Chris,,, I mean
holiday ribbon.

106 Killian Bundy  Thu, Jul 3, 2008 4:38:52pm

Mile-high Obama? Invesco Field may be venue

Barack Obama's campaign is considering moving his nomination acceptance speech at the Democratic National Convention from the Pepsi Center convention hall to Invesco Field at Mile High to accommodate the uncredentialed masses, sources say.

The move would mark a major departure from tradition, but would be in keeping with the candidate's desire to build a large grass-roots campaign focused on "change."

/but is there enough room for his ego too?

107 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Thu, Jul 3, 2008 4:39:11pm

re: #104 bellamags

you are absolutely correct my friend. this is going to be fun to watch.

Well, he's making the Red Ribbon of Destruction look pretty damn slow!

108 bellamags  Thu, Jul 3, 2008 4:39:45pm

re: #106 Killian Bundy

What big name music artist will be performing before his speech?

109 pre-Boomer Marine brat  Thu, Jul 3, 2008 4:40:00pm

re: #87 HelloDare

Obama just changed his position on Intergalactic Shockwaves.

This was not the white dwarf I knew.

110 Sharmuta  Thu, Jul 3, 2008 4:40:02pm

Wow- this image is stunning:

This discovery supports Einstein's relativity theory that states black holes of all sizes have similar properties.

Huh- and here some people have been trying to tell me the relativity theory can't have the scientific method applied to it.

111 itellu3times  Thu, Jul 3, 2008 4:40:15pm

re: #100 pre-Boomer Marine brat

Do you know anything about the impact force of that shockwave upon a planet? I figure it'd dissipate with distance.

/no, I'm NOT thinking about it hitting Earth -- this is theoretical

You mean a planet in orbit around the star that blew? Fugetabodit.

You mean a planet like Earth, a zillion miles away? Don't worry about it, it would be a tiny fraction of what solar storms and flares do to us all the time. Say thank you to the Lord for the atmosphere and the Earth's magnetic field.

112 tubbyhubby  Thu, Jul 3, 2008 4:40:28pm

Heh. So that's what keeps happening to life on earth.

113 faraway  Thu, Jul 3, 2008 4:41:05pm

re: #108 bellamags

What big name music artist will be performing before his speech?

Rene Marie will be singing the Black Anthem. (Did you know the NAACP and Trinity play this)

114 bellamags  Thu, Jul 3, 2008 4:42:41pm

re: #113 faraway

is there a white national anthem? you know, i don't think i should have to pay for BET on my cable line-up.

115 sparrowlake  Thu, Jul 3, 2008 4:42:55pm

This is a fauxtograph.
Someone photoshopped a red scarf onto the opening scene from Star Trek.

116 pre-Boomer Marine brat  Thu, Jul 3, 2008 4:43:13pm

re: #111 itellu3times

You mean a planet in orbit around the star that blew? Fugetabodit.

You mean a planet like Earth, a zillion miles away? Don't worry about it, it would be a tiny fraction of what solar storms and flares do to us all the time. Say thank you to the Lord for the atmosphere and the Earth's magnetic field.

I guess I was wondering about a planet which was 100-or-so light years away.

117 neoconkat  Thu, Jul 3, 2008 4:44:05pm

Now that is something I'd want to have seen.

118 bellamags  Thu, Jul 3, 2008 4:44:30pm

re: #115 sparrowlake

fauxtograph-- i love it. hilarious.

119 faraway  Thu, Jul 3, 2008 4:45:37pm
120 lostlakehiker  Thu, Jul 3, 2008 4:46:06pm

If a supernova that was seen 1000 years ago is located 2000 lightyears away, and we see supernovas 1000000 light years away, how long ago did those supernovas pop off?

And how old is the universe?

121 Miss Molly  Thu, Jul 3, 2008 4:46:23pm

The vastness of space and the universe seems beyond human understanding.

122 HelloDare  Thu, Jul 3, 2008 4:46:52pm

re: #95 Fat Bastard Vegetarian

NOT BRINGING UP THE SUBJECT! But, Obama is stepped in this pile of dookie pretty hard here...


How is he going to explain his opposition to the Born Alive Infants Protection Act? How is a live baby that survived an attempted abortion a health risk to the mother?

123 Killian Bundy  Thu, Jul 3, 2008 4:47:28pm

re: #120 lostlakehiker

And how old is the universe?

/and if it's expanding, what's it expanding into?

124 faraway  Thu, Jul 3, 2008 4:47:36pm

The big bang must have had a big wave also, huh?

125 HelloDare  Thu, Jul 3, 2008 4:48:02pm

When is that shockwave expected to be here? I've got stuff to do.

126 reine.de.tout  Thu, Jul 3, 2008 4:48:10pm

re: #121 Miss Molly

The vastness of space and the universe seems beyond human understanding.

Yes. What's truly amazing to me is how much is known and can be photographed, like this shock wave. It's amazing, isn't it?

127 JCM  Thu, Jul 3, 2008 4:48:10pm

re: #54 Killian Bundy

When will it hit us?

/what will it do?

7000 light years
4.11494987 × 1016 miles.
at 60,000,000 mph

In about 71,000 more years.

128 LoFlyer  Thu, Jul 3, 2008 4:48:22pm

re: #34 JCM

A little Hubble History.

The testing error that led to Hubble mirror fiasco
18 August 1990

The was a fiasco beyond belief to amateur astronomers and amateur telescope makers who grind their own mirrors and build their scopes by hand. There are several easy and cheap tests to ensure the mirror has the right curvature for the focal point. This is not rocket science and a high school amateur astronomer could have produced a better mirror. The error is inexcusable.
NASA pulled a rabbit out of it hat with the amazing repair job and one of the finest EVA's in the history space flight. The repair bill was close to 500 million.
The Hubble is an amazing instrument, It could of been done for a lot cheaper if competent optical engineers and managers had run the project.

129 Milk Toast Intolerant  Thu, Jul 3, 2008 4:48:30pm

re: #121 Miss Molly

The vastness of space and the universe seems beyond human understanding.

And each of us only has one lifetime to understand it. Not enough time.

130 nyc redneck  Thu, Jul 3, 2008 4:48:32pm

i always loved laying on a blanket as a little kid and looking at the night sky.
everyone saw more shooting stars than i did.
i was watching for the black holes and getting ready to sound the alarm to run for our lives.
my brother always said they had a big appetite.

131 rawmuse  Thu, Jul 3, 2008 4:48:48pm

re: #127 JCM

7000 light years
4.11494987 × 1016 miles.
at 60,000,000 mph

In about 71,000 more years.

Damn, I had plans. Oh, well.

132 paint-right  Thu, Jul 3, 2008 4:48:51pm

re: #22 SasquatchOnSteroids

I remember reading a couple of years ago that if The United States was the Milky Way, our solar system equals about the size of a quarter. Sure puts perspective about me bitching over having to mow a puny acre every Friday.

could you 'splain that to me again? i don't get it.

133 Killgore Trout  Thu, Jul 3, 2008 4:51:04pm

re: #120 lostlakehiker

we see supernovas 1000000 light years away, how long ago did those supernovas pop off?

The light reaches is when we see it so when we observe a supernova 10 light years away then it exploded 10 years ago. According to Wiki the universe is 13.73 billion years old.

134 chris_l  Thu, Jul 3, 2008 4:51:07pm

re: #50 Killgore Trout

14 Science Questions the Next President Should Answer
The questions are pretty rudimentary but it's still a pretty good list.

Very interesting questionnaire.

I think more important than helping to gauge where the candidates stand on the issues - it really makes one question their own stances.

Thanks for posting it.

135 marge45b  Thu, Jul 3, 2008 4:51:23pm

re: #11 Hard Right

Ah ha! I knew I sensed a new thread about to be born. There was a disturbance in the force...or it was that burrito I had.

What a pic. Call me silly, but we should not cut back or kill our space exploration.

Obama will cut NASAs budget to fund pre-school programs

136 Abu Lahab  Thu, Jul 3, 2008 4:51:26pm

re: #110 Sharmuta

I have that one saved also. They have an interesting virtual journey to a blackhole. You could recommend some to take it))
See this one image as well

137 pre-Boomer Marine brat  Thu, Jul 3, 2008 4:52:51pm

I downloaded the full-size image to examine it more closely. What's fascinating is that it LOOKS like a ribbon -- basically a two-dimensional phenomena.

I assume it must be a sphere, and that we're seeing the edge (a radius 60 LY in diameter) which would be more visible than the tenuous face of the shockwave directly between us and the source.

The very large photo doesn't show any feathering. It looks just like a ribbon. I'll be damned if I know why I don't see any feathering.

138 MandyManners  Thu, Jul 3, 2008 4:52:59pm

re: #95 Fat Bastard Vegetarian

NOT BRINGING UP THE SUBJECT! But, Obama is stepped in this pile of dookie pretty hard here...


His trip to the center is going to be a wild one!

He's lying like a rug.

139 NY Nana  Thu, Jul 3, 2008 4:53:13pm
140 Charles  Thu, Jul 3, 2008 4:53:45pm

re: #50 Killgore Trout

14 Science Questions the Next President Should Answer
The questions are pretty rudimentary but it's still a pretty good list.

The evolution issue should be in there. Wonder why they shied away from it?

141 JCM  Thu, Jul 3, 2008 4:53:54pm

re: #133 Killgore Trout

The light reaches is when we see it so when we observe a supernova 10 light years away then it exploded 10 years ago. According to Wiki the universe is 13.73 billion years old.

Since this is a Hubble thread the age of the Universe is derived from the;
THE HUBBLE CONSTANT

Arguably the most important Cosmological discovery ever made is that our Universe is expanding. Its stands, along with the Copernican Principle --- that there is no preferred place in the Universe, and Olbers' paradox --- that the sky is dark at night, as one of the cornerstones of modern cosmology. It forced cosmologists to dynamic models of the Universe, and also implies the existence of a timescale or age for the Universe. It was made possible by in part by Vesto Slipher's measurements of the apparent radial velocities of nebulae, but primarily by Edwin Hubble's estimates of distances to nearby galaxies. Hubble deserves the credit for the discovery of the expansion, even though papers by Georges Lemaitre and H. P. Robertson using Hubble's data on the velocity-distance relation preceeded his 1929 landmark, because it was his systematic program of measuring galaxy distances and his 1924 discovery of Cepheid variable stars in M31 and his actual plot of the relation that finally convinced the community at large.
142 callahan23  Thu, Jul 3, 2008 4:54:06pm

Hi y'all
have you heard what kind of nuckin' futz crazy the british are again?

Sharia law SHOULD be used in Britain, says UK's top judge

Link

143 Killgore Trout  Thu, Jul 3, 2008 4:54:53pm

re: #140 Charles
Goog catch, I didn't even notice it was missing.

144 Abu Lahab  Thu, Jul 3, 2008 4:55:01pm

re: #115 sparrowlake

That could be true if Reuters was handling NASA images.

145 bellamags  Thu, Jul 3, 2008 4:55:08pm

Isn't it funny that most liberals (and some conservatives) believe in evolution and at the same time the liberals try to stop it? Global warming, cooling, extinctions and new discoveries all are part of this planets normal cycle and yet they want to preserve the "fragile" ecosystems and keep the planet from changing, keep all life in-tact, even if it is their time to "go". Some species are chosen to die because they can no longer adapt to the changing environment. Conservatives that believe in evolution understand this. Liberalism is just a huge hypocrisy.

146 SasquatchOnSteroids  Thu, Jul 3, 2008 4:55:41pm

re: #132 paint-right

could you 'splain that to me again? i don't get it.

Take a quarter and put it on your lawn.

The quarter represents the Solar System.

The United States represents The Milky Way.

It's that friggin' big.

And it's one of something with -illions on the backside.

147 rawmuse  Thu, Jul 3, 2008 4:55:53pm

re: #142 callahan23

I posted that link earlier. That judge should be sent off to his chambers with a shiny object to play with, but keep him away from courtrooms.

148 Fat Jolly Penguin  Thu, Jul 3, 2008 4:57:49pm

re: #146 SasquatchOnSteroids

Take a quarter and put it on your lawn.

The quarter represents the Solar System.

The United States represents The Milky Way.

It's that friggin' big.

And it's one of something with -illions on the backside.

For even more head-exploding fun, consider how that relates to the rest of the universe. For still more, consider the multiverse theory.

149 rawmuse  Thu, Jul 3, 2008 4:58:32pm

re: #148 Fat Jolly Penguin

For even more head-exploding fun, consider how that relates to the rest of the universe. For still more, consider the multiverse theory.

Linky?

150 pre-Boomer Marine brat  Thu, Jul 3, 2008 4:58:42pm

re: #147 rawmuse

I posted that link earlier. That judge should be sent off to his chambers with a shiny object to play with, but keep him away from courtrooms.

Preferably a VERY sharp knife.

151 DeathtotheSwiss  Thu, Jul 3, 2008 4:58:52pm

They mostly come at night, mostly.

152 MandyManners  Thu, Jul 3, 2008 4:59:02pm

re: #119 faraway

Trinity Black National Anthem page 5

Good find.

153 LoFlyer  Thu, Jul 3, 2008 4:59:50pm

re: #139 NY Nana

A long time ago, on a galaxy far, far away.....

Thanks NY Nana....

154 Killian Bundy  Thu, Jul 3, 2008 5:00:34pm

Blogger admits Hawaii birth certificate forgery, subverting Obama claims

Jay McKinnon, a self-described Department of Homeland Security-trained document specialist, has implicated himself in the production of fraudulent Hawaii birth certificate images similar to the one endorsed as genuine by the Barack Obama campaign, and appearing on the same blog entry where the supposedly authentic document appears.

The evidence of forgery and manipulation of images of official documents, triggered by Israel Insider's revelation of the collection of Hawaii birth certificate images on the Photobucket site and the detective work of independent investigative journalists and imaging professionals in the three weeks since the publication of the images, implicate the Daily Kos, an extreme left blog site, and the Obama campaign, in misleading the public with official-looking but manipulated document images of doubtful provenance.

/what the hell is this all about?

155 Killgore Trout  Thu, Jul 3, 2008 5:00:40pm

Repost from earlier: THE SOCIAL AND POLITICAL VIEWS OF AMERICAN PROFESSORS
Conservatives are very underrepresented in the sciences. And this graph shows that they used to be but now those scientists are over 65 and retiring. There are very few young political conservatives entering the field of science. This needs to be corrected.

156 pingjockey  Thu, Jul 3, 2008 5:02:00pm

"You don't get something for nothing"
"You don't get freedom for free"
"You won't get wise with the sleep still in your eyes"

For Gods sake if you are driving this weekend be careful!
I had to drive damn near 400 miles for work today and the ijits are out in force!

157 cavallino_rampante  Thu, Jul 3, 2008 5:02:08pm

Ya know . . . that supernova shockwave can't just keep expanding at 6 million miles per hour, traveling through space with impunity, heated to comfortable levels of hotness, and then just expect the rest of the universe to tolerate it . . .

158 Abu Lahab  Thu, Jul 3, 2008 5:02:39pm

re: #139 NY Nana

Thank you for this link.

159 Racer X  Thu, Jul 3, 2008 5:03:22pm
160 callahan23  Thu, Jul 3, 2008 5:03:25pm

re: # 147 rawmuse

sorry but I didn't notice. You are perfectly right about that judge.
But how many European judges, social workers, bishops and politicians would need to be dealt with in that manner?

Many to be sure!

161 nyc redneck  Thu, Jul 3, 2008 5:03:26pm

re: #154 Killian Bundy

Blogger admits Hawaii birth certificate forgery, subverting Obama claims

/what the hell is this all about?

wow, wouldn't it be great to knock him out on a fundamental technicality.
it would destroy his puppet masters. soros would jump off of a bridge.

162 rawmuse  Thu, Jul 3, 2008 5:03:47pm

re: #155 Killgore Trout

They keep getting flunked out. It is a crime, really.

163 JCM  Thu, Jul 3, 2008 5:04:14pm

re: #156 pingjockey

"You don't get something for nothing"
"You don't get freedom for free"
"You won't get wise with the sleep still in your eyes"

For Gods sake if you are driving this weekend be careful!
I had to drive damn near 400 miles for work today and the ijits are out in force!

Seattle had some rain over night....
The commute this morning resembled a demolition derby.

164 Egfrow  Thu, Jul 3, 2008 5:04:39pm

Branded Fuel Cost and Marigns Breakdown,.
California: June 23, 2008
This data is published but the State of California explaining costs for oil prices. Notice how they break it down to hide profits inside of Costs and expenses to bump up the numbers for the commercial enterprise vs the taxes. It also does not include the hidden costs within the Crude it's self. Such as transportation, extraction, and other hidden taxes, etc.
.
Distribution Costs, Marketing Costs and Profits $0.08
Crude Oil Cost $3.21
Refinery Cost and Profits $0.58
State Underground Storage Tank Fee $0.01
State and Local Sales Tax $0.34
State Excise Tax $0.18
Federal Excise Tax $0.18
Retail prices $4.59


Taxes break down to $0.70 per gallon. Which is approximately 3 times what Exxon's profits were for each gallon in this recent quarter.

165 Fat Jolly Penguin  Thu, Jul 3, 2008 5:05:17pm

re: #149 rawmuse

Linky?

BBIAW

166 MacGregor  Thu, Jul 3, 2008 5:05:19pm

That's gorgeous! Lots of great wallpapers there too. And another interesting tidbit I've picked up in the spinoffs is - our magnetic field is decreasing due to the outer earth's decreasing rotational velocity, decreasing friction with the inner core over time. (Am I sayin' that right?) So I hope it's still there in 70,000 years for the red ribbon of destruction!

Happy 4th everyone.

167 Cartman  Thu, Jul 3, 2008 5:05:30pm

re: #87 HelloDare

Obama just changed his position on Intergalactic Shockwaves.

He was for it, until it exploded. Now he's against it.

168 Racer X  Thu, Jul 3, 2008 5:05:47pm

re: #161 nyc redneck

wow, wouldn't it be great to knock him out on a fundamental technicality.
it would destroy his puppet masters. soros would jump off of a bridge.

The left would find a way to get around the rules.

169 JCM  Thu, Jul 3, 2008 5:06:03pm

re: #154 Killian Bundy

Blogger admits Hawaii birth certificate forgery, subverting Obama claims

/what the hell is this all about?

The BC claimed to prove BHO is false, is a forgery.

A very clever Soros operation to put to rest all questions on BHO birth.
/

170 Killgore Trout  Thu, Jul 3, 2008 5:06:03pm

re: #162 rawmuse

I don't think conservatives value science anymore and simply aren't entering the field.

171 itellu3times  Thu, Jul 3, 2008 5:06:03pm

re: #50 Killgore Trout

14 Science Questions the Next President Should Answer
The questions are pretty rudimentary but it's still a pretty good list.

I agree. A little didactic, but good.

I'm afraid McCain and Obama could be locked in a room for a week working on it together, and they still couldn't answer any of them coherently.

172 HelloDare  Thu, Jul 3, 2008 5:06:32pm

re: #159 Racer X

Nice Dynamic Ribbon™

We're all living in a giant bottle of Coke? Just when I was leaning toward turtles...

173 silversmith  Thu, Jul 3, 2008 5:06:59pm

186,000 miles per second...........it isn't just a good idea, it's the law.

174 Gordon Marock  Thu, Jul 3, 2008 5:07:37pm

That's Angel's Breath, you idiots!

175 rawmuse  Thu, Jul 3, 2008 5:08:08pm

re: #170 Killgore Trout

Much of science depends on grants, and those do favor Dems.
So, what are conservatives doing, if not science?

176 HelloDare  Thu, Jul 3, 2008 5:08:36pm

re: #159 Racer X

It's sorta the color of coke.

177 Killgore Trout  Thu, Jul 3, 2008 5:08:42pm

re: #169 JCM

Hmmmm....I wish they'd done a more concise writeup on that. I can't tell if they're on to something or not.

178 Beobachter  Thu, Jul 3, 2008 5:09:36pm

re: #175 rawmuse

Much of science depends on grants, and those do favor Dems.
So, what are conservatives doing, if not science?

You mean like the junk science of global warming?

179 pre-Boomer Marine brat  Thu, Jul 3, 2008 5:09:59pm

re: #154 Killian Bundy

I saw the earlier posts by Israel Insider. This is looking verrry interesting, but I ALSO have a nearly-full box of Morton's salt on the shelf. I think it would be wise to keep it handy for the time being.

180 mama winger  Thu, Jul 3, 2008 5:10:31pm

re: #175 rawmuse

Much of science depends on grants, and those do favor Dems.
So, what are conservatives doing, if not science?

Lots of them are defending our country.

181 Racer X  Thu, Jul 3, 2008 5:10:49pm

re: #176 HelloDare

It's sorta the color of coke.

I bet that thing is one giant marketing gimmick.

182 Killgore Trout  Thu, Jul 3, 2008 5:11:00pm

re: #175 rawmuse

So, what are conservatives doing, if not science?


I don't know but if you check out computer science on that graph they aren't entering that field either. Those are the two most important fields of study. It's not a good sign.

183 MandyManners  Thu, Jul 3, 2008 5:11:29pm

re: #154 Killian Bundy

Blogger admits Hawaii birth certificate forgery, subverting Obama claims


/what the hell is this all about?

WTF?

184 pre-Boomer Marine brat  Thu, Jul 3, 2008 5:11:47pm

re: #169 JCM

The BC claimed to prove BHO is false, is a forgery.

A very clever Soros operation to put to rest all questions on BHO birth.
/

I don't understand.
(And note my #179.)

185 yochanan  Thu, Jul 3, 2008 5:11:52pm

since sales tax is added to gas price here in chicago the city gets more and more as the price of gas goes up.

so the pols have no intrest in lowering the price of gas.

186 mama winger  Thu, Jul 3, 2008 5:12:12pm

Why would science be affected by whether or not a person was politically conservative?

187 howyadoin  Thu, Jul 3, 2008 5:13:01pm

"galactic ripple"

Ooooh! My favorite Ice Cream flavor!

I love getting news from that floating hunk!

188 rawmuse  Thu, Jul 3, 2008 5:13:08pm

re: #182 Killgore Trout

I don't know but if you check out computer science on that graph they aren't entering that field either. Those are the two most important fields of study. It's not a good sign.

This is from the NY Times. Need I say more?

189 WayDownSouthInBama  Thu, Jul 3, 2008 5:13:30pm

WOW! That things traveling faster than Ron Paul's blimp AND the Louis Farrakhan Mothership combined! I am a little surprised the Left hasn't yet blamed Bush for the death of the star.

190 justdanny  Thu, Jul 3, 2008 5:14:31pm

re: #156 pingjockey Something for nothing

191 Egfrow  Thu, Jul 3, 2008 5:14:42pm

At an average of 366 million gallons of Gas used per day nationwide seeing the government and states get near , 70 Cents per gallon of taxes is just staggering this averages between 200-275 million dollars per day of taxes paid or above 70 billion per year.

192 Pshawalaw  Thu, Jul 3, 2008 5:15:09pm

re: #37 rawmuse

" It was visible even during the day for weeks, and remained visible to the naked eye for at least two and a half years before fading away."

Could you even begin to imagine the chaos that would initiate if it happened to us tomorrow?

We are surrounded by morons, there would be worldwide panic no doubt.

193 Sharmuta  Thu, Jul 3, 2008 5:16:13pm

re: #155 Killgore Trout

But that's in academia, where most conservatives wouldn't stay. If that chart shows anything, it shows that we need more conservatives to stay on campus to teach. It's more like a conservative to go out into the real world and apply their education there.

194 Killgore Trout  Thu, Jul 3, 2008 5:16:39pm

re: #188 rawmuse

Here's a link to the complete study if you're interested.

195 Killgore Trout  Thu, Jul 3, 2008 5:16:59pm

re: #193 Sharmuta

Good point.

196 NY Nana  Thu, Jul 3, 2008 5:17:04pm

re: #153 LoFlyer

Enjoy! It is a bit unconventional, but I think it works well.

197 patrickafir  Thu, Jul 3, 2008 5:17:53pm

That is pretty frickin' humbling.

198 NonNativeTexan  Thu, Jul 3, 2008 5:18:14pm

re: #190 justdanny

Something for nothing

No, I think it is actually "money for Nothing-Chicks for free"

199 MacGregor  Thu, Jul 3, 2008 5:18:37pm

re: #193 Sharmuta

But that's in academia, where most conservatives wouldn't stay. If that chart shows anything, it shows that we need more conservatives to stay on campus to teach. It's more like a conservative to go out into the real world and apply their education there.

Thereby providing the economies to support science.

200 JCM  Thu, Jul 3, 2008 5:18:57pm

re: #184 pre-Boomer Marine brat

I don't understand.
(And note my #179.)

The way I read it is the BHO BC came out.
Then came the one, that was purported to be a valid HI BC.
The 2nd one had features BHO's did not.
They said the lack of these features showed the BHO BC was a fraud.

The 2nd one is now an admitted forgery.

The forger is a (D) operative.

It has the surface effect of discrediting anyone questioning the BHO BC.

A pretty good op. Put someone up to discredit BHO. That person is a red herring. The red herring gets exposed and discredited. Anyone raising the issue is tied a proven fraud.

201 Zoltan  Thu, Jul 3, 2008 5:20:34pm

Shockwave and awe on my part.

202 Cartman  Thu, Jul 3, 2008 5:22:18pm

re: #170 Killgore Trout

I don't think conservatives value science anymore and simply aren't entering the field.

I would strongly disagree with that statement. The problem is that there are no more conservatives matriculating from our institutions of higher learning, period. At least very few. By the time these people are ready to enter the science and related fields, their liberal indoctrination is complete. It's all part and parcel the political correctness that permeates academia, from kindergarten on up. JMO.

203 NY Nana  Thu, Jul 3, 2008 5:22:33pm

re: #158 Abu Lahab

You are most welcome.

204 justdanny  Thu, Jul 3, 2008 5:22:34pm

re: #198 NonNativeTexan Nope. Read the last lines.

I use to be a Rush freak. Untill the penicillin for some dental work cleared me up.

0% battery. Night ya'll

205 itellu3times  Thu, Jul 3, 2008 5:24:22pm

From Newsweak:
Who Was More Important: Lincoln or Darwin?

How's this for a coincidence? Charles Darwin and Abraham Lincoln were born in the same year, on the same day: Feb. 12, 1809.
...

Swell.

How is a raven like a writing desk?

206 rawmuse  Thu, Jul 3, 2008 5:24:29pm

re: #194 Killgore Trout

Bookmarked for later reading, thanks. And yes, interested.

207 infidelia  Thu, Jul 3, 2008 5:25:32pm

re: #2 JCM

WOW!

What s/he said!

The universe is not only stranger than we can imagine it is way more awesome.

208 NonNativeTexan  Thu, Jul 3, 2008 5:25:51pm

re: #204 justdanny

Maybe should have listened to the band RUSH more :)

209 pre-Boomer Marine brat  Thu, Jul 3, 2008 5:25:54pm

re: #200 JCM

The way I read it is the BHO BC came out.
Then came the one, that was purported to be a valid HI BC.
The 2nd one had features BHO's did not.
They said the lack of these features showed the BHO BC was a fraud.

The 2nd one is now an admitted forgery.

uh, that's not what I gather from this latest post.

The 2nd one showed the physical imprint of the seal, made upon the rear of the paper, and the marks of having been folded for mailing. The one posted on KOS (the 1st one) had neither of these.

Was there one BEFORE the one posted on KOS?

210 hermeneutics  Thu, Jul 3, 2008 5:26:09pm

re: #155 Killgore Trout

Repost from earlier: THE SOCIAL AND POLITICAL VIEWS OF AMERICAN PROFESSORS
Conservatives are very underrepresented in the sciences. And this graph shows that they used to be but now those scientists are over 65 and retiring. There are very few young political conservatives entering the field of science. This needs to be corrected.

It won't be corrected but will slowly get worse. Profs hire those who think like themselves. Their little hiring committees are completely politicized. Even in the "lofty" field of science. I can't imagine any way around the questioning of the hiring committees.

Conservatives need to find a few, amenable institutions and then, freely do first-rate science, history, literature, etc. It is either time to start over or take over -- but not incrementally join.

211 howyadoin  Thu, Jul 3, 2008 5:28:13pm

re: #182 Killgore Trout

Most of my kids from my Youth Group that graduated HS this year plan to enter the studies of sciences in one area or another this fall. Mostly Medical and food sciences. One is going for nuclear physics. One will be studying education in the sciences. They are all "conservative" youth.

212 Killgore Trout  Thu, Jul 3, 2008 5:28:50pm

re: #209 pre-Boomer Marine brat

Was there one BEFORE the one posted on KOS?

The claim is the blank birth cert was posted on the dudes Flikr account just about on hour before Kos posted Obama's cert.

213 nyc redneck  Thu, Jul 3, 2008 5:29:34pm

re: #168 Racer X

The left would find a way to get around the rules.

they'd try. i guess they would say we are racist for not wanting a non-citizen for potus. even tho that's the law, our ugly attitude is the basis for his exemption.

214 JCM  Thu, Jul 3, 2008 5:30:22pm

re: #209 pre-Boomer Marine brat

uh, that's not what I gather from this latest post.

The 2nd one showed the physical imprint of the seal, made upon the rear of the paper, and the marks of having been folded for mailing. The one posted on KOS (the 1st one) had neither of these.

Was there one BEFORE the one posted on KOS?

I may be reading it wrong.

But the one with the Seal is Haye I.B Aphorgerie BC. That one the guy admitted to faking.

He also posted a "blank" BC suggesting someone make one up for BHO.

The whole thing muddies the water, confuses the issue.

215 pre-Boomer Marine brat  Thu, Jul 3, 2008 5:31:12pm

re: #212 Killgore Trout

The claim is the blank birth cert was posted on the dudes Flikr account just about on hour before Kos posted Obama's cert.

Okay, I got that from a quick skim of Israel Insider's very wordy post.

What do YOU make of this latest II post?

/it sounds almost too good to be true

216 Perry  Thu, Jul 3, 2008 5:31:42pm

re: #75 Abu Lahab

Hubble Archive is amazing.
Here is another beautiful image
And they have a special gallery for wallpaper fans.
The info there is so interesting. It's a great site for a great American invention.

These are astoundingly beautiful. Thank you!
/wallpaper greed

217 Killgore Trout  Thu, Jul 3, 2008 5:32:03pm

re: #210 hermeneutics

If you check the NYT article I posted earlier they were focusing on the old lefties are now retiring. I just couldn't help noticing there's still a conservative void in some fields. In science there used to be conservatives but they are now over 65.

re: #211 howyadoin

Good news.

218 Killgore Trout  Thu, Jul 3, 2008 5:32:27pm

re: #215 pre-Boomer Marine brat

I can't tell yet.

219 JCM  Thu, Jul 3, 2008 5:32:55pm

SF stands by it's principals!

S.B. County slams San Francisco’ amid criminal dumping scandal

Top San Bernardino County leaders blasted San Francisco Thursday for dumping convicted drug dealers in group homes located across San Bernardino County.


District Attorney Mike Ramos interrupted his vacation to take aim at San Francisco’s policy to send convicts to unsecured group homes in San Bernardino County.


“For the city of San Francisco to dump those individuals in our county is outrageous,” Ramos said during a Thursday news conference.


Eight illegal aliens convicted of selling crack in San Francisco walked away from a San Bernardino County group home where they had been placed as part of San Francisco’s policy to create a safe haven for illegal aliens. San Francisco officials placed the drug dealers in Silverlake’s Douglas House in Yucaipa after federal officials demanded the city stop flying illegal aliens to their home countries to avoid U.S. immigration officials.

220 coquimbojoe  Thu, Jul 3, 2008 5:34:50pm

I know I am late to the game, but, Science!

221 IslandLibertarian  Thu, Jul 3, 2008 5:34:56pm

Blasphemy!
How can this "Galactic Shockwave Supernova" possibly happen in a universe that is only 6000 years old?
/////squared

222 pre-Boomer Marine brat  Thu, Jul 3, 2008 5:36:08pm

re: #214 JCM

I may be reading it wrong.

But the one with the Seal is Haye I.B Aphorgerie BC. That one the guy admitted to faking.

He also posted a "blank" BC suggesting someone make one up for BHO.

The whole thing muddies the water, confuses the issue.

Okay, I was thinking of II's earlier post, a day or two ago, where he showed a perfectly valid certificate -- which had the seal and fold marks. It was NOTHING like the Haye I.B Aphorgerie thingy.

223 pre-Boomer Marine brat  Thu, Jul 3, 2008 5:36:49pm

re: #218 Killgore Trout

I can't tell yet.

I'm with you.

224 JCM  Thu, Jul 3, 2008 5:37:42pm

re: #221 IslandLibertarian

Blasphemy!
How can this "Galactic Shockwave Supernova" possibly happen in a universe that is only 6000 years old?
/////squared

It's really a turtle fart.
Those astronomer dudes been smoking some good shit.

225 howyadoin  Thu, Jul 3, 2008 5:38:24pm

re: #217 Killgore Trout

Considering the 2 post HS educational institutions that I'm closest to, I see mostly "conservative" young adults entering into the science fields. Both Pittsburg State and Kansas State are wonderful for the Sciences and they are fed by all the "red" states around us. It's just, these are not the big fields of DNA studies or "Environmental Sciences" or all of the other big hot-button areas. It's bread and butter. Ceramics, Plastics, Food Sciences, Agrinomic Sciences, Medicine, things like that.

226 jorline  Thu, Jul 3, 2008 5:38:31pm

re: #146 SasquatchOnSteroids

Take a quarter and put it on your lawn.

The quarter represents the Solar System.

The United States represents The Milky Way.

It's that friggin' big.

And it's one of something with -illions on the backside.

This really blows my mind...much deeper than the 70's simple mind blowers while tripping on brownies.

227 pre-Boomer Marine brat  Thu, Jul 3, 2008 5:40:53pm

re: #221 IslandLibertarian

Blasphemy!
How can this "Galactic Shockwave Supernova" possibly happen in a universe that is only 6000 years old?
/////squared

I've been to Houston, and I've never EVER seen a NASA complex there. NASA doesn't exist! It's a conspiracy to fabricate all this phoney so-called "data".

(of course, I've never been southeast of the junction of I-45 and the Sam Houston Parkway either, but why should THAT matter?)

228 jorline  Thu, Jul 3, 2008 5:42:20pm

re: #197 patrickafir

That is pretty frickin' humbling.

My thoughts exactly...makes you feel rather minuet.

229 jorline  Thu, Jul 3, 2008 5:43:06pm

Excellent thread, Charles.

230 pre-Boomer Marine brat  Thu, Jul 3, 2008 5:44:33pm

re: #228 jorline

My thoughts exactly...makes you feel rather minuet.

You feel like dancing?

231 Catttt  Thu, Jul 3, 2008 5:45:48pm

Very cool.

Very Star Treky.

232 Sharmuta  Thu, Jul 3, 2008 5:48:23pm

re: #231 Catttt

Boy- it's really sad to hear Nimoy's voice aging like that.

233 jorline  Thu, Jul 3, 2008 5:48:25pm

re: #230 pre-Boomer Marine brat

You feel like dancing?

lead the way Boomer...just no disco

234 IslandLibertarian  Thu, Jul 3, 2008 5:49:36pm

re: #227 pre-Boomer Marine brat

(of course, I've never been southeast of the junction of I-45 and the Sam Houston Parkway either, but why should THAT matter?)

My mother used to tell of when her aunt took her and her cousin to the San Diego Zoo in the 1930's, and when they got to the Giraffe, her aunt told them "Don't look at that! There's no such thing."

There are none so blind as those that refuse to see.

.....and .....NObama!

235 pre-Boomer Marine brat  Thu, Jul 3, 2008 5:52:48pm

re: #233 jorline

(-:

minuet


I think you originally meant minute. Meaning very small. Correct?

The minuet is a 200/400 year-old dance.

236 pre-Boomer Marine brat  Thu, Jul 3, 2008 5:54:33pm

re: #234 IslandLibertarian

*chuckle*
A very interesting lady, she must have been!

237 Tigger2005  Thu, Jul 3, 2008 5:56:40pm

Beautiful pictures from space always bring to mind John Williams' gorgeous music from the final scene of "The Empire Strikes Back."

238 jorline  Thu, Jul 3, 2008 5:57:48pm

re: #235 pre-Boomer Marine brat

(-:

I think you originally meant minute. Meaning very small. Correct?

The minuet is a 200/400 year-old dance.

LOL...my bad...thanks I did mean minute, very long day at the restaurant

239 IslandLibertarian  Thu, Jul 3, 2008 6:00:09pm

re: #236 pre-Boomer Marine brat

A very interesting lady, she must have been!

She was........along with being removed by force from her home (which she tried to defend with a shotgun) in Chavez Ravine to make way for Dodger Stadium, she had many eccentric episodes.

240 pre-Boomer Marine brat  Thu, Jul 3, 2008 6:03:34pm

re: #238 jorline

LOL...my bad...thanks I did mean minute, very long day at the restaurant

As a kid, I learned pronounciation from reading, and made some rather hairbrained assumptions. One was to pronounce "encroach" as "enroach". Wasn't until I was 30 that I learned the correct way.

Actually, "en-ROACH" sounds okay -- to invade someone's space, as a roach might do.

Heh!

241 pre-Boomer Marine brat  Thu, Jul 3, 2008 6:03:59pm

re: #239 IslandLibertarian

HOLY COW!

242 pre-Boomer Marine brat  Thu, Jul 3, 2008 6:05:22pm

re: #239 IslandLibertarian

BTW, roughly where are you in the Islands?

(I went to 2 years of high school in Honolulu, and 1 in Kailua, back in the late 50's.)

243 jorline  Thu, Jul 3, 2008 6:17:53pm

re: #240 pre-Boomer Marine brat

As a kid, I learned pronounciation from reading, and made some rather hairbrained assumptions. One was to pronounce "encroach" as "enroach". Wasn't until I was 30 that I learned the correct way.

Actually, "en-ROACH" sounds okay -- to invade someone's space, as a roach might do.

Heh!

My wife and mother-in-law are the type who look to correct pronunciation and grammatical errors. I'm a daily project for them...lol
They raked me over the coals on irrelevant...it's ether relevant or it's not relevant. They both swear that there's no such word as irrelevant even though I show them that the origin was 1780-90.

244 Irving  Thu, Jul 3, 2008 6:20:41pm

Wow.

What startles me is that a quick reading of history says that none of the major religions went bananas in 1006. I was fully expecting apocalypse doom sayers a-plenty, but apparently they were too busy resting after 1000 came and went. Odd. Anyone find contrary stories?

245 winston06  Thu, Jul 3, 2008 6:21:33pm

Oh my goodness. Amazing!

246 pre-Boomer Marine brat  Thu, Jul 3, 2008 6:23:16pm

re: #243 jorline

My wife and mother-in-law are the type who look to correct pronunciation and grammatical errors. I'm a daily project for them...lol
They raked me over the coals on irrelevant...it's ether relevant or it's not relevant. They both swear that there's no such word as irrelevant even though I show them that the origin was 1780-90.

*grin*
It shows up in MY dictionaries!

247 jorline  Thu, Jul 3, 2008 6:25:36pm

re: #246 pre-Boomer Marine brat

*grin*
It shows up in MY dictionaries!

mine also...military brat here as well, father was a lifer

248 HoosierHoops  Thu, Jul 3, 2008 6:29:24pm

I believe this story is highlighted on the universetoday.com website.
Good choice charles

249 least  Thu, Jul 3, 2008 6:30:12pm

re: #155 Killgore Trout

It's just how our educational system has evolved

couldn't resist

250 pre-Boomer Marine brat  Thu, Jul 3, 2008 6:31:29pm

re: #247 jorline

Mine was USMC 1939-1964, but with 5 years broken service between WWII and Korea. Called back in for Korea. Stayed in.

He was one of the 50 given the first (meritorious) promotions to E-8 when the Corps established E-8 and E-9.

/bragging off

251 least  Thu, Jul 3, 2008 6:37:25pm

re: #140 Charles

'Scuze me Charles, but what the heck has triggered your evolution obsession?
I checked the LFG archives to see if there was any mention of the anniversary of Darwin's presentation (as there was a coupla days ago) . . . I couldn't find anything.
Did I miss a memo or sumpin'?

252 jorline  Thu, Jul 3, 2008 6:40:47pm

re: #250 pre-Boomer Marine brat

Mine was USMC 1939-1964, but with 5 years broken service between WWII and Korea. Called back in for Korea. Stayed in.

He was one of the 50 given the first (meritorious) promotions to E-8 when the Corps established E-8 and E-9.

/bragging off

not bragging...your proud and should be.

Mine was a high school drop-out and entered the Air Force as a one striper. He worked his was through the ranks, accepted to OCS and retired as a Colonel. During this time frame he received his GED, earned his college degree and went to get his masters. Didn't see a lot of him while I was growing up, but very proud.

253 pre-Boomer Marine brat  Thu, Jul 3, 2008 6:43:30pm

re: #252 jorline

not bragging...your proud and should be.

Mine was a high school drop-out and entered the Air Force as a one striper. He worked his was through the ranks, accepted to OCS and retired as a Colonel. During this time frame he received his GED, earned his college degree and went to get his masters. Didn't see a lot of him while I was growing up, but very proud.

I haven't the FOGGIEST why you would be.
*salute*

I've got to get outta here pretty quick, get some supper, and get stuff done.

254 jorline  Thu, Jul 3, 2008 6:47:56pm

re: #253 pre-Boomer Marine brat

I haven't the FOGGIEST why you would be.
*salute*

I've got to get outta here pretty quick, get some supper, and get stuff done.

Have a great 4th...later

255 IslandLibertarian  Thu, Jul 3, 2008 6:55:00pm

re: #242 pre-Boomer Marine brat

BTW, roughly where are you in the Islands?

(I went to 2 years of high school in Honolulu, and 1 in Kailua, back in the late 50's.)

'been here in Honolulu since 1988, Kauai before that.........

256 ErnieG  Thu, Jul 3, 2008 7:10:48pm

re: #9 JCM

It's photoshopped, there are no turtles in the image.

Ha! You're looking up. The turtles are down. It's turtles all the way down.

257 ErnieG  Thu, Jul 3, 2008 7:16:57pm

re: #147 rawmuse

I posted that link earlier. That judge should be sent off to his chambers with a shiny object to play with, but keep him away from courtrooms.

I was thinking more along the lines of sending him to his chambers with a bottle of whiskey and a revolver.

258 hermeneutics  Thu, Jul 3, 2008 7:41:09pm

re: #46 researchok

SN 1006 in cave art?

I've got hundreds of photos of petroglyphs taken in AZ and other states during hikes. Most are indescrible in the sense that they are abstract, not realistic. Occasionally I'll see a recognizable animal or insect, but for the most part the petroglyphs are spirals, odd lines and other shapes. For someone to single out one petroglyph out of hundreds that could conceivably be celestial is ridiculous. Just because the dating of the petroglyphs corresponds to the supernova does not in any way mean that this particular abstract image portrays this event.

Someone desperately wants to see something that just isn't there.

259 yitzy  Thu, Jul 3, 2008 8:37:40pm

FYI: that image is now my desktop, replacing a photo taken by the most recent Mars Lander.

Have a great July 4th Weekend y'all!

260 Weresheep  Thu, Jul 3, 2008 9:00:48pm

That is no shockwave. It's a double plasma layer, sometimes referred to as Birkeland current. IOW, interstellar wiring, or one can take it as a slo-mo lightning bolt--because of energies involved and the physics of electricity in near vacuum, it is closer in its character to aurora borealis rather than a lightning bolt, but the same basics are behind it.

261 astronmr20  Thu, Jul 3, 2008 10:08:43pm

...so when will Islam go supernova?

262 Militant Bibliophile  Thu, Jul 3, 2008 11:22:50pm

So. Damn. Cool.

263 least  Thu, Jul 3, 2008 11:42:57pm

Astronomy Picture of the Day is one of the sites I check out regularly.
So what do you s'poze the subject of today's picture is?

And a cool picture it is.

264 Carolyn  Fri, Jul 4, 2008 7:06:09am

The Earth is so tiny, we could be lost among the stars.

265 Carolyn  Fri, Jul 4, 2008 7:17:15am

Or the nucleus of a cell in the body of God.

266 Annar  Fri, Jul 4, 2008 11:00:07am

Remember that year well. Dueling was declared illegal in Iceland. Probably because of the population drain of farmers who left for Greenland (it was warm there then, a fact which Goracle likes to ignore).

267 grahamski  Sat, Jul 5, 2008 3:21:03pm

Oooh, Ahhh....Oh wait, that was last night...

Carry on.


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