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1 ThomasLite  Sat, Jan 19, 2013 7:50:35am

Ooh, thanks a lot for that hawkeye initiative link - I’d completely missed it so far (not into comics, so that would probably be why). That is going to be mighty useful - and funny! - next time this comes up in a TT wargaming context :)

2 Tigger2005  Sat, Jan 19, 2013 8:35:51am

Well, I certainly remember as a 15 year old buying Robert Heinlein’s “Friday” solely on the basis of the cover…LOL

3 PhillyPretzel  Sat, Jan 19, 2013 10:38:18am

I guess that can explain why there are two different covers for the Honor Harrington novel “At All Costs.” The hardbound cover has the title character reading a story to a baby and the paperback has Honor on the deck of a battleship.

4 Decatur Deb  Sat, Jan 19, 2013 10:42:44am

What is the opposite of “objectification” of women (or men)? “Etherialization”?

5 Locker  Sat, Jan 19, 2013 12:02:15pm

re: #2 Tigger2005

Well, I certainly remember as a 15 year old buying Robert Heinlein’s “Friday” solely on the basis of the cover…LOL

First Heinlein book I ever read and I grabbed it for the same unzipping reason. Opened up an entire world for me but I guess it’s all bad because it’s “sexist” and women are “objectified”.

I have a little reality for all of this “stuff”… no matter how hard you women try to push it out of the media, the work place, TV, commercials and magazines.. .men are still thinking it.

We’re still thinking it, we still want you, we still look at you, you are still sexual objects. The problem with this industry of the offended is the same problem I see with the nutzo gun owners… they pretend “gun control” means “gun confiscation” just like these women pretend men seeing a woman as a sexual object means they ONLY see them as sexual objects.

You can’t change biology ladies. You just make us talk about it when you aren’t listening. Yes… all of us… your man too.

6 EPR-radar  Sat, Jan 19, 2013 1:43:54pm

re: #5 Locker

There is value in not having this objectification mainstreamed everywhere you look. No reasonable person is attempting to change human nature here.

I suspect many men actually would be bothered if the culture were saturated with unrealistic and freakishly sexualized images of men that were intended to cater to people’s lust.

7 EPR-radar  Sat, Jan 19, 2013 1:57:22pm

re: #6 EPR-radar

There is value in not having this objectification mainstreamed everywhere you look. No reasonable person is attempting to change human nature here.

I suspect many men actually would be bothered if the culture were saturated with unrealistic and freakishly sexualized images of men that were intended to cater to people’s lust.

In fact, this last point is nearly proven by the amazing hardiness of the “OMG, gay people may see me in the shower” non-arguments that permeated the DADT repeal hysteria on the right.

8 FemNaziBitch  Sat, Jan 19, 2013 2:53:21pm

re: #5 Locker

We’re still thinking it, we still want you, we still look at you, you are still sexual objects.

I AM A HUMAN BEING, not an object.

My form and figure may be something you lust over, but you don’t know me, you can’t lust over me until you see and know me as a person.

And please remember, you can look all you want, but it is only I who will let you touch.

Enjoy the evening with your hand.

9 Locker  Sat, Jan 19, 2013 3:01:49pm

re: #8 FemNaziBitch

I AM A HUMAN BEING, not an object.

My form and figure may be something you lust over, but you don’t know me, you can’t lust over me until you see and know me as a person.

And please remember, you can look all you want, but it is only I who will let you touch.

Enjoy the evening with your hand.

Way to completely ignore my central point. You are an object AND a human being. Enjoy your evening with your static viewpoint.

10 FemNaziBitch  Sat, Jan 19, 2013 3:10:37pm

re: #9 Locker

Way to completely ignore my central point. You are an object AND a human being. Enjoy your evening with your static viewpoint.

Think about what you are saying.

Objects can be bought and sold.

11 EPR-radar  Sat, Jan 19, 2013 3:47:28pm

re: #9 Locker

Way to completely ignore my central point. You are an object AND a human being. Enjoy your evening with your static viewpoint.

But the question isn’t about the essential nature of people. Instead, the far simpler question on the table is whether objectivization of people should be accepted as normal in society.

BTW, arguments based on the essential nature of people are often used to support awful policies. E.g., radical Islamists point to the incorrigible rapey/stabby nature of men to justify isolation of women (and their control by men).


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