GOP Rep. Bachus: 'Palin Cost Us the Senate'

GOP Rep. Bachus: ‘Palin Cost Us the Senate’

PoliticsNovember 2010 • Views: 23,517

Alabama Republican Rep. Spencer Bachus states the obvious: ‘Palin cost us control of the Senate’.

“The Senate would be Republican today except for states (in which Palin endorsed candidates) like Christine O’Donnell in Delaware,” Bachus said, according to the Shelby County Reporter. “Sarah Palin cost us control of the Senate.”

Sarah Palin endorsed the farthest right, most socially conservative candidates the GOP had to offer. Some of them seemed certifiably insane. Bachus is on target with this comment; it’s the simple truth.

So, of course, he was forced to walk back his criticism, because it’s the Tea Party’s world and truth is out of style.

But on Monday, a Bachus spokesman seemed to walk back the Alabama Republican’s comments.

“Congressman Bachus, like other political observers, said that seats in states like Delaware and Nevada could have been won by stronger candidates and that’s a lesson going forward,” said Bachus spokesman Tim Johnson.

“As the article noted, he was extremely complimentary of the Tea Party movement and Governor Palin in crediting them with the great turnout of conservatives that led to many of the successes on Tuesday,” Johnson said.

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99 comments

theheat Tue, Nov 9, 2010 9:53:25am

Impotent Republican is impotent. Sarah Palin is still an idiot. In other news, the sky is blue.

Feline Fearless Leader Tue, Nov 9, 2010 9:57:39am

Trial balloon #2 as the GOP old guard establishment tries to chip away at the Tea Party and their figurehead leader Palin. Or, more likely, just trying to bring down Palin since they need the Tea Party support.

Brother Holy Cruise Missile of Mild Acceptance Tue, Nov 9, 2010 10:00:04am

re: #2 oaktree

There's no way to divide and conquer, the tea partiers are palinites to the core.

Surabaya Stew Tue, Nov 9, 2010 10:00:45am

Toeing the TP line....what a shameful backtrack by Bachus. I don't know much about him, but would imagine he's pretty far to the right already, being a Senator from Alabama. This shows that nobody in the GOP is safe from the insane PC-style meme about anything re:the quitter from Alaska.

Feline Fearless Leader Tue, Nov 9, 2010 10:02:13am

re: #3 Dreggas

There's no way to divide and conquer, the tea partiers are palinites to the core.

I think they're going to try since otherwise the indications are a Palin run for the GOP nomination in 2012, which if it succeeds is widely believed to lead to a landslide reelection of Obama. And I guess the follow-up question is what sort of coat-tails that might bring in terms of Congressional representation.

albusteve Tue, Nov 9, 2010 10:02:16am

I'll throw her under the bus myself

lawhawk Tue, Nov 9, 2010 10:03:08am

The spin cycle is on turbo mode regarding Palin's effect on the races, but ultimately it comes down to who voted for the O'Donnells and Angles in DE and NV - and it was the GOP primary voters. They went for the extreme candidates in droves, and they lost those seats for the GOP by pushing candidates who had no business running for anything higher than dog catcher.

The GOP picked up six seats, which is still a huge number historically speaking. We normally don't see these kinds of swings - and it looks even better proportionally speaking than the House pickup where the GOP assumed control.

What Bachus is speaking to is trying to gain control of the message for the next two years and how to push Palin to the sidelines (if that's even possible). Moreover, even if DE and NV picked less extreme candidates, that would have still given the Democrats a one seat advantage. The GOP would have needed a clean sweep, and losing in WA and CT denied that from happening. Nate Silver went through the numbers and found that the odds of a GOP takeover were always slight. They would have improved slightly with more credible candidates in DE and NV, but the odds were against a takeover.

And this ignores Palin's ability to get seats in the House. Her effect there appears to have been more pronounced in aiding candidates than in the Senate.

Former NY Gov. Pataki is sounding a similar theme as he raises a trial balloon for a possible run for President (which I think is a huge mistake on his part since he did such an awful job for NY and left the GOP in shambles in the state).

Brother Holy Cruise Missile of Mild Acceptance Tue, Nov 9, 2010 10:04:15am

re: #5 oaktree

they may try but I am sure it's gonna backfire. The tea-partiers will latch on even tighter. Remember, they LIKE feeling victimized, it justifies them. If they see the establishment trying to go after Palin it will be a new Us vs. Them only it won't be REAL AMERICANS vs everyone else it will be REAL CONSERVATIVES vs RINOS on a larger scale than we've seen.

[deleted] Tue, Nov 9, 2010 10:04:18am

What, me worry? Tue, Nov 9, 2010 10:05:09am

But how do you explain Michelle Bachman, Jan Brewer and Marco Rubio? She campaigned for all of them or at least attended their rallies.

The senator can throw her under the bus if he wants, but I think he's looking for answers that somehow lie outside of the voters.

insanity police Tue, Nov 9, 2010 10:06:52am

An idiot half-term governor who never reads the newspaper in charge of the Republican party. What could go wrong?

theheat Tue, Nov 9, 2010 10:07:44am

re: #7 lawhawk

trying to gain control of the message for the next two years and how to push Palin to the sidelines (if that's even possible).

Cockroaches can't outlast Palin. She craves the attention that much.

MarkAM Tue, Nov 9, 2010 10:11:43am

re: #7 lawhawk

Pataki is also among the most boring public speakers I've ever heard. He'd be a very weak candidate.

More generally, this infighting will be nothing if not entertaining. Doesn't entirely take the sting out of Republican gains, but it does suggest they may be temporary.

What, me worry? Tue, Nov 9, 2010 10:11:55am

re: #7 lawhawk

Absolutely right. It's indicative of how a lot of politicians view the voters, particularly how they can be manipulated. But Teabaggers made it through anyway, even if not to the Senate.

I rarely watch TV, but on election night I flipped between local and CNN. CNN ran the Palin reality show commercial at almost every break. There she was, out in the wilderness camping, shooting moose, whatever the hell she's doing and in that sickly sweet voice of hers, says something about how "this is all I've ever wanted to do" and "It doesn't get any better than this." WHAT THE HELL? The people of Alaska voted you governor and you QUIT THEM to go camping? And get paid big bucks to boot?? You don't get much lower than that.

elizajane Tue, Nov 9, 2010 10:13:30am

re: #11 insanity police

An idiot half-term governor who never reads the newspaper in charge of the Republican party. What could go wrong?

Well, according to the Wall Street Journal today, she sure understands monetary policy. Better than a flake-o nobel prize winner like Paul Krugman.

[Link: online.wsj.com...]

Seriously. A once respectable newspaper has come to this.

Killgore Trout Tue, Nov 9, 2010 10:13:33am

re: #9 MikeySDCA

Breaking

Missile Shot Off Los Angeles Still a Mystery for Pentagon Officials

I can't for for Beck's chalkboard to connect it to George Soros and ACORN.

Feline Fearless Leader Tue, Nov 9, 2010 10:14:30am

re: #14 marjoriemoon

Absolutely right. It's indicative of how a lot of politicians view the voters, particularly how they can be manipulated. But Teabaggers made it through anyway, even if not to the Senate.

I rarely watch TV, but on election night I flipped between local and CNN. CNN ran the Palin reality show commercial at almost every break. There she was, out in the wilderness camping, shooting moose, whatever the hell she's doing and in that sickly sweet voice of hers, says something about how "this is all I've ever wanted to do" and "It doesn't get any better than this." WHAT THE HELL? The people of Alaska voted you governor and you QUIT THEM to go camping? And get paid big bucks to boot?? You don't get much lower than that.

Someone had to go forth and deal with the Moose-lim threat to America.

Oh, it's Muslims...

Never mind.

;)

JeffFX Tue, Nov 9, 2010 10:14:45am

re: #6 albusteve

I'll throw her under the bus myself

Throw Fox and the hate-radio scumbags under too, and the Republican party might someday be worth voting for again.

Mad Prophet Ludwig Tue, Nov 9, 2010 10:14:48am

OT but WOW WOW WOW,

Have you seen Lawhawk's unidentified missile launch from off the coast of LA thread?

[Link: littlegreenfootballs.com...]

The Dod denies it was one of ours. From the footage - it was a big one. It clearly landed in the ocean.

If it is one of ours, and the goal was to show muscle, the military would be the first to confirm the launch. If it was a completely classified launch, they would not do it in the plain sight of a major American city.

If it was an unintentional launch, the prospect is terrifying. I can't rule that out.

It is very important to find out is whose missile it was and what was on it.

If we assume the launch was intentional though, it is not very reassuring either.

The other obvious thing to note is that whomever launched it obviously could have hit LA if they wanted, but that missile was big. If the goal was to hit LA, then they could have launched it much further out to sea.

NO, this was clearly something designed to show us that someone can hit LA if they wanted. They wanted this to be seen. The question is who?

lawhawk Tue, Nov 9, 2010 10:15:31am

re: #13 MarkAM

I've met Pataki on several occasions, including following several of his budget addresses. As bad as his public speaking is, his policies didn't help NY and I fault him greatly for the mess at Ground Zero where he pushed an architectural neophyte (Libeskind) to design the master plan and then had to spend several years backtracking to work around his design. Pataki contributed greatly to the delays in rebuilding.

albusteve Tue, Nov 9, 2010 10:16:19am

re: #11 insanity police

An idiot half-term governor who never reads the newspaper in charge of the Republican party. What could go wrong?

I thinks there may be some clues if you examine the BO admin to date...inexperience across the spectrum

William Barnett-Lewis Tue, Nov 9, 2010 10:16:33am

re: #9 MikeySDCA

Breaking

Missile Shot Off Los Angeles Still a Mystery for Pentagon Officials

I'm reminded of the running gag in Kim Possible about her father the rocket scientist leaning on the launch button by mistake... :O

abbyadams Tue, Nov 9, 2010 10:16:46am

And they say the Dems are the party of no spine or lower intestinal fortitude. Don't see much of that, either here, or from those who insult Boss Limbaugh.

insanity police Tue, Nov 9, 2010 10:16:53am

re: #15 elizajane

Well, according to the Wall Street Journal today, she sure understands monetary policy. Better than a flake-o nobel prize winner like Paul Krugman.

[Link: online.wsj.com...]

Seriously. A once respectable newspaper has come to this.

If Sarah Palin actually analyzed monetary policy, instead of some advisor spoon feeding her the lines, I will eat all my Glenn Beck endorsed gold stock.

Mad Prophet Ludwig Tue, Nov 9, 2010 10:17:08am

re: #15 elizajane

Well, according to the Wall Street Journal today, she sure understands monetary policy. Better than a flake-o nobel prize winner like Paul Krugman.

[Link: online.wsj.com...]

Seriously. A once respectable newspaper has come to this.

Wsj has been the high end of the conservative media bubble for some time.

Kragar Tue, Nov 9, 2010 10:19:07am

re: #19 LudwigVanQuixote

OT but WOW WOW WOW,

Have you seen Lawhawk's unidentified missile launch from off the coast of LA thread?

[Link: littlegreenfootballs.com...]

The Dod denies it was one of ours. From the footage - it was a big one. It clearly landed in the ocean.

If it is one of ours, and the goal was to show muscle, the military would be the first to confirm the launch. If it was a completely classified launch, they would not do it in the plain sight of a major American city.

If it was an unintentional launch, the prospect is terrifying. I can't rule that out.

It is very important to find out is whose missile it was and what was on it.

If we assume the launch was intentional though, it is not very reassuring either.

The other obvious thing to note is that whomever launched it obviously could have hit LA if they wanted, but that missile was big. If the goal was to hit LA, then they could have launched it much further out to sea.

NO, this was clearly something designed to show us that someone can hit LA if they wanted. They wanted this to be seen. The question is who?

If it was accidental, the DoD would have claimed it and trotted out a culprit by now.

MarkAM Tue, Nov 9, 2010 10:19:16am

re: #20 lawhawk

He was an ineffective governor, and it's surprising he held on as long as he did. And as a New Yorker he's probably presumptively too liberal for the Tea Party people.

Kragar Tue, Nov 9, 2010 10:20:05am

re: #24 insanity police

If Sarah Palin actually analyzed monetary policy, instead of some advisor spoon feeding her the lines, I will eat all my Glenn Beck endorsed gold stock.

Sarah Palin's response to your statement:
"You said anal-yzed. tee-hee"

theheat Tue, Nov 9, 2010 10:20:14am

re: #14 marjoriemoon

She's out there, bein' all free an' stuff, because that's what it is to be American, bein' free. An' stuff. Not bein' stuffed in a stuffy ole office, an' stuff, dadgummit. Because she's all about freedom, an' keepin' us free. And oil. And baby Jesus. "God bless our troops!"

Her unfailing stupid and shameless counterfeit-ness gives me a headache in my eye.

engineer cat Tue, Nov 9, 2010 10:21:00am

Palin Cost Us the Senate

some of us have been predicting the split up of the republican party for years, and to see it actually happen via the teabag party is fascinating

republicans feel fat and happy since they gained a lot of seats - what did you expect would happen in the pit of the most gigantic recession since the great depression? - but their fundamental problems have only been masked by the good luck of circumstances that were unbelievably favorable for them

the next question is how much sarah palin will damage the eventual nominee of the republican party in 2012

Mad Prophet Ludwig Tue, Nov 9, 2010 10:21:10am

re: #26 Kragar (Proud to be Kafir)

If it was accidental, the DoD would have claimed it and trotted out a culprit by now.

The only other thing to hope is that this was a private rocket test that was not properly communicated up the chain of command.

albusteve Tue, Nov 9, 2010 10:21:25am

re: #26 Kragar (Proud to be Kafir)

If it was accidental, the DoD would have claimed it and trotted out a culprit by now.

a job for Bond, James Bond

insanity police Tue, Nov 9, 2010 10:22:16am

Palin Lashes Out At WSJ Reporter, Misquotes Story

Killgore Trout Tue, Nov 9, 2010 10:23:16am

re: #26 Kragar (Proud to be Kafir)

Theres been recent rocket testing at Vandenberg Air Force Base northwest of LA....
Aerojet's Engine Powers Delta II Second Stage for the COSMO-SkyMed Constellation

What, me worry? Tue, Nov 9, 2010 10:23:28am

re: #29 theheat

She's out there, bein' all free an' stuff, because that's what it is to be American, bein' free. An' stuff. Not bein' stuffed in a stuffy ole office, an' stuff, dadgummit. Because she's all about freedom, an' keepin' us free. And oil. And baby Jesus. "God bless our troops!"

Her unfailing stupid and shameless counterfeit-ness gives me a headache in my eye.

LOL Headache My Eye was a Cheech and Chong skit, you know that don't you! Oh wait, that was Earache My Eye (close enough).

I was gnashing my teeth, I was.

...grrrr...

Kragar Tue, Nov 9, 2010 10:23:33am

Have they located the wreckage yet? That would be able to tell them a lot.

Mad Prophet Ludwig Tue, Nov 9, 2010 10:23:39am

As to the missile.

Actually, the more I think of it, now that I am over the initial shock, it is most likely, that a private launch was set up by a university or industry somewhere, that they communicated to all the appropriate channels and that those channels didn't properly inform the military.

This is at least what I am hoping.

All other possibilities that seem likely are really bad.

insanity police Tue, Nov 9, 2010 10:24:21am

re: #33 insanity police

Palin Lashes Out At WSJ Reporter, Misquotes Story

"Reddy has responded to Palin on Twitter, pointing out that she has actually misread the WSJ article she refers to. As Reddy notes, the article's first sentence discusses "the tamest year of food pricing in nearly two decades."

The source of confusion comes in the next paragraph. The article says the cost of goods has risen, a burden that food sellers must decide whether to pass on to customers via prices. The rise in prices hasn't actually happened yet. Palin omits this key fact."

engineer cat Tue, Nov 9, 2010 10:25:01am

Volcker Says No Quick Way to Cut US Unemployment

Paul Volcker, a top economic adviser to President Barack Obama, said Tuesday he sees no short-term way to reduce high U.S. unemployment and expects slow growth for the next year or more.

Volcker's comments come after the U.S. Federal Reserve said last week it would purchase $600 billion in Treasurys in an effort to boost growth and create jobs, cutting unemployment that stands at 9.6 percent.

"I have no answer to it at the moment, and I think that is the basic problem," said Volcker when asked about unemployment at a financial forum.

"I suspect that it will gradually decline. But the basic fact of the matter is that the economic outlook is for continuing but limited increases in economic activity for the next year or more," he said.

remember that we generally need to add 150,000 jobs per month just to stay even. working this number, people have come up with 5 - 10 years before we get back to 5% unemployment

i wonder what the republican story will be if there is no substantial reduction in unemployment by summer 2012?

agentx73 Tue, Nov 9, 2010 10:25:12am

I rarely (read: never) comment, but I find something about this situation very interesting.

This illustrates who has control of the GOP. It's "entertainers" and Fox News "Commentators." I cannot think of a single person in the Republican party that can speak against the wishes of Sarah Palin, Rush Limbaugh, Glenn Beck, etc. These people are not elected, yet they control the GOP far more than any elected Republican. This seems troublesome to me. I can't think of anyone, other than elected officials, that control the narrative of the Democratic party like these people do.

Sarah Palin is a former half term governor of the smallest population state in the US, and current reality TV star and sometime Fox News commentator, yet her word is gospel for base republicans (tea partiers). It is already costing them Senate seats, and as a liberal I can't wait to see what else it costs them. Soldier on sister Sarah!

JeffFX Tue, Nov 9, 2010 10:25:43am

re: #35 marjoriemoon

LOL Headache My Eye was a Cheech and Chong skit, you know that don't you! Oh wait, that was Earache My Eye (close enough).

I was gnashing my teeth, I was.

...grrr...

and now the song from the skit is stuck in my head...

Kragar Tue, Nov 9, 2010 10:25:55am

re: #35 marjoriemoon

LOL Headache My Eye was a Cheech and Chong skit, you know that don't you! Oh wait, that was Earache My Eye (close enough).

I was gnashing my teeth, I was.

...grrr...

One of the greatest comic bits ever.

"Are you going to do what I tell you?"

"YEAH YEAH!"

"And are you going to talk back to me?"

"YEAH YEAH!"

"WHAT!?"

"NO NO!"

Mad Prophet Ludwig Tue, Nov 9, 2010 10:26:01am

re: #39 engineer dog

Volcker Says No Quick Way to Cut US Unemployment

Paul Volcker, a top economic adviser to President Barack Obama, said Tuesday he sees no short-term way to reduce high U.S. unemployment and expects slow growth for the next year or more.

Volcker's comments come after the U.S. Federal Reserve said last week it would purchase $600 billion in Treasurys in an effort to boost growth and create jobs, cutting unemployment that stands at 9.6 percent.

"I have no answer to it at the moment, and I think that is the basic problem," said Volcker when asked about unemployment at a financial forum.

"I suspect that it will gradually decline. But the basic fact of the matter is that the economic outlook is for continuing but limited increases in economic activity for the next year or more," he said.

remember that we generally need to add 150,000 jobs per month just to stay even. working this number, people have come up with 5 - 10 years before we get back to 5% unemployment

i wonder what the republican story will be if there is no substantial reduction in unemployment by summer 2012?

Or we could create huge a huge sector of green jobs by updating the grid...

albusteve Tue, Nov 9, 2010 10:27:25am

re: #40 agentx73

I rarely (read: never) comment, but I find something about this situation very interesting.

This illustrates who has control of the GOP. It's "entertainers" and Fox News "Commentators." I cannot think of a single person in the Republican party that can speak against the wishes of Sarah Palin, Rush Limbaugh, Glenn Beck, etc. These people are not elected, yet they control the GOP far more than any elected Republican. This seems troublesome to me. I can't think of anyone, other than elected officials, that control the narrative of the Democratic party like these people do.

Sarah Palin is a former half term governor of the smallest population state in the US, and current reality TV star and sometime Fox News commentator, yet her word is gospel for base republicans (tea partiers). It is already costing them Senate seats, and as a liberal I can't wait to see what else it costs them. Soldier on sister Sarah!

bottom line, the voters control the parties....and they get out of it what they put into it...if you sit on your ass and play stupid, people like Palin will rise to the top

abbyadams Tue, Nov 9, 2010 10:27:31am

re: #42 Kragar (Proud to be Kafir)

YOU RUINED MY RECORD, MAN!!! I JUST BOUGHT IT!!!

lawhawk Tue, Nov 9, 2010 10:28:29am

re: #31 LudwigVanQuixote

The FAA is supposedly checking up on that possibility, but I haven't seen any reports of test launches from private firms, particularly off the CA coast. So far, no private entities have come forward to take credit for the launch.

They'll have to sort through the known positions of shipping in the area.

theheat Tue, Nov 9, 2010 10:29:29am

re: #37 LudwigVanQuixote

Like, maybe they don't know what it was, had no time to stop it (if it was possibly a threat), and now have no idea where it may be despite having some of the best technology in the world? Yeah, it's a little unsettling.

Charles Johnson Tue, Nov 9, 2010 10:29:34am

Just checked through the clips from Glenn Beck's radio show at MM - man, that guy is really going out there now. I might have to start watching his show again because he sounds like he's about to have a 'Network' style meltdown.

elizajane Tue, Nov 9, 2010 10:30:06am

re: #33 insanity police

Palin Lashes Out At WSJ Reporter, Misquotes Story

You know, in another article the WSJ says of "Governor" Palin:

Mrs. Palin is way ahead of her potential Presidential competitors on this policy point, and she shows a talent for putting a technical subject in language that average Americans can understand.

and

Mrs. Palin also exhibited a more sophisticated knowledge of monetary policy than any major Republican this side of Wisconsin Representative Paul Ryan.

But instead of foregrounding this ludicrously extravagant praise, she's flipping out about somebody criticizing her grocery budget?
Golly, maybe she doesn't have the right temperament to govern. Ya think?

lawhawk Tue, Nov 9, 2010 10:30:57am

re: #43 LudwigVanQuixote

That wont quickly create jobs because upgrading the grid would require building new transmission lines and each one is subject to EIS. That means NIMBY gets to stop and/or delay upgrades and new lines - no matter how necessary or critical to upgrading the grid. The process to certify a new transmission line is far too long to have an immediate impact on unemployment since it is usually a several year process under the best circumstances.

theheat Tue, Nov 9, 2010 10:31:31am

re: #49 elizajane

Golly, maybe she doesn't have the right temperament to govern. Ya think?

She made that abundantly clear when she quit her governor's gig in Alass-kah.

Killgore Trout Tue, Nov 9, 2010 10:33:50am

re: #48 Charles

Just checked through the clips from Glenn Beck's radio show at MM - man, that guy is really going out there now. I might have to start watching his show again because he sounds like he's about to have a 'Network' style meltdown.

I'm surious if he's going to start branching out. So far he's still stuck on Sorors and Tides. I wonder if he's going to start exposing other dark forces. He's certainly stepping up the crazy.

Mad Prophet Ludwig Tue, Nov 9, 2010 10:34:55am

re: #46 lawhawk

Yeah the LA Times is not giving any real clue as to who did it, but the local military bases say they had no launches.

[Link: latimesblogs.latimes.com...]

The pics and video are pretty stunning.

What, me worry? Tue, Nov 9, 2010 10:35:23am

re: #30 engineer dog

Palin Cost Us the Senate

some of us have been predicting the split up of the republican party for years, and to see it actually happen via the teabag party is fascinating

republicans feel fat and happy since they gained a lot of seats - what did you expect would happen in the pit of the most gigantic recession since the great depression? - but their fundamental problems have only been masked by the good luck of circumstances that were unbelievably favorable for them

the next question is how much sarah palin will damage the eventual nominee of the republican party in 2012

The Republican party is imploding and they better enjoy their wins while they can. By the next 1 or 2 generations, they'll be a sad memory.

Lawhawk posted an awesome vid of civil rights activist Tim Wise who is an outspoken fellow but couldn't be more right on. The majority of Blacks, Hispanics and minorities (including women) vote Democrat. None of these people, particularly Blacks and Hispanics, want to go BACK - as in wind the clock back to the "good ole days of the 1950s." And young people, by their very nature, are forward thinking.

If the Republican party doesn't stop stepping on minorities (Blacks, Hispanics, the elderly, women), they aren't going to win any votes in future generations. Particularly as the older Republicans (which most of them are now anyway) start to die and those that remember the pre-civil rights era with fondness are all dead. My only regret is that I won't be around to see it.

Feline Fearless Leader Tue, Nov 9, 2010 10:36:38am

re: #51 theheat

She made that abundantly clear when she quit her governor's gig in Alass-kah.

I actually think to some degree that the GOP establishment would want someone like her -- except that they think she is a loose cannon in a few too many ways. Otherwise I think they'd be happy with a lazy, disinterested figurehead that they could pair with an otherwise unelectable VP and a group of senior advisors that will do the work while she makes all the necessary public appearances and statements based on their briefs.

Though I must admit that I thought the younger Bush was being used for that purpose initially. At this later date I'm actually unsure exactly how the Bush Administration worked internally, though Cheney definitely carried around more influence than a lot of previous VPs have.

DaddyG Tue, Nov 9, 2010 10:37:08am

re: #22 wlewisiii

I'm reminded of the running gag in Kim Possible about her father the rocket scientist leaning on the launch button by mistake... :O

Overheard at Vandenburg AF Base: "I said go out to lunch... L-U-N-C-H!... idiot."

Feline Fearless Leader Tue, Nov 9, 2010 10:37:48am

re: #56 DaddyG

Overheard at Vandenburg AF Base: "I said go out to lunch... L-U-N-C-H!... idiot."

Shades of a somewhat similar bit that occurs in _The Bedford Incident_.

albusteve Tue, Nov 9, 2010 10:38:05am

re: #53 LudwigVanQuixote

Yeah the LA Times is not giving any real clue as to who did it, but the local military bases say they had no launches.

[Link: latimesblogs.latimes.com...]

The pics and video are pretty stunning.

there will be a shitstorm when the Norks claim responsibility

Mad Prophet Ludwig Tue, Nov 9, 2010 10:39:10am

re: #50 lawhawk

That wont quickly create jobs because upgrading the grid would require building new transmission lines and each one is subject to EIS. That means NIMBY gets to stop and/or delay upgrades and new lines - no matter how necessary or critical to upgrading the grid. The process to certify a new transmission line is far too long to have an immediate impact on unemployment since it is usually a several year process under the best circumstances.

It is stuff like this where the power of the government to cut through red tape would be wonderful. It is amazing what can be done when the Fed says that something is in the national interest.

Of course, that would require the Fed having the togetherness to do it and it is likely it could only have been pushed through the last congress - if the Dems had their heads out of their asses.

I am so frustrated by this, because this is one of the most important low hanging fruits out there for fighting climate change, and the scientific community has been advising presidents since W. to start there first.

It is also something that really would create many jobs and in terms of savings to company power costs be a shot in the economy that way as well.

Mad Prophet Ludwig Tue, Nov 9, 2010 10:40:40am

re: #59 LudwigVanQuixote

By Fed, I meant the federal government. I didn't mean the federal reserve.

engineer cat Tue, Nov 9, 2010 10:41:23am

re: #43 LudwigVanQuixote

Or we could create huge a huge sector of green jobs by updating the grid...

i suspect we might see 9 - 10% unemployment for a number of years to come

i am just paranoid enough to think that when republicans talk about 'business friendly' policies, one of the things they have in mind is to hold down employment in this country until american workers are not 'so expensive' anymore - remember alan greenspan talking about "wage pressures"?

Mad Prophet Ludwig Tue, Nov 9, 2010 10:41:29am

re: #58 albusteve

there will be a shitstorm when the Norks claim responsibility

You might be right.

theheat Tue, Nov 9, 2010 10:41:47am

re: #58 albusteve

No worries, even though they say it wasn't theirs, weren't aware of it, don't know whose it was, or where it went, it was not a threat.
//

Killgore Trout Tue, Nov 9, 2010 10:42:10am

KZLA LOS ANGELES A2832/10

– THE FOLLOWING RESTRICTIONS ARE REQUIRED DUE TO NAVAL AIR WARFARE CENTER WEAPONS DIVISION ACTIVATION OF W537. IN THE INTEREST OF SAFETY, ALL NON-PARTICIPATING PILOTS ARE ADVISED TO AVOID W537. IFR TRAFFIC UNDER ATC JURISDICTION SHOULD ANTICIPATE CLEARANCE AROUND W537 AND CAE 1176. CAE 1155 WILL NOT BE AVAILABLE FOR OCEANIC TRANSITION. CAE 1316 & CAE 1318 WILL NOT BE AVAILABLE FOR OCEANIC TRANSITION. CAE 1177 WILL BE AVAILABLE FOR OCEANIC TRANSITION. W537 ACTIVE, CAE 1176 CLOSED. SURFACE – FL390, 09 NOV 20:00 2010 UNTIL 10 NOV 01:00 2010. CREATED: 08 NOV 20:52 2010
from pilotweb.nas.faa.gov

The website is down but it was a pre announced launch.

Mad Prophet Ludwig Tue, Nov 9, 2010 10:42:12am

re: #61 engineer dog

i suspect we might see 9 - 10% unemployment for a number of years to come

i am just paranoid enough to think that when republicans talk about 'business friendly' policies, one of the things they have in mind is to hold down employment in this country until american workers are not 'so expensive' anymore - remember alan greenspan talking about "wage pressures"?

Wow. That might have some truth to it. I certainly would not put it past them.

albusteve Tue, Nov 9, 2010 10:46:03am

re: #65 LudwigVanQuixote

Wow. That might have some truth to it. I certainly would not put it past them.

can't you reverse calculate the launch site?...whether it was water or land seems significant

Mad Prophet Ludwig Tue, Nov 9, 2010 10:46:16am

re: #64 Killgore Trout

KZLA LOS ANGELES A2832/10

The website is down but it was a pre announced launch.

God Damn it!

First off this is the best case scenario.

BUT DAMN IT!

Silly me for thinking that the military would know if they launched a missile or not. Telling NORAD before so they knew about it too might be a good idea! Silly silly me for thinking the Military would have a clue about this!

Mad Prophet Ludwig Tue, Nov 9, 2010 10:47:26am

re: #66 albusteve

can't you reverse calculate the launch site?...whether it was water or land seems significant

Yes of course. The reason Norad didn't go apeshit is that you can calculate and track those things really quickly with a ballistic trajectory.

Killgore Trout Tue, Nov 9, 2010 10:48:55am

re: #67 LudwigVanQuixote

God Damn it!

First off this is the best case scenario.

BUT DAMN IT!

Silly me for thinking that the military would know if they launched a missile or not. Telling NORAD before so they knew about it too might be a good idea! Silly silly me for thinking the Military would have a clue about this!

My guess is that whoever is talking to the press isn't authorized to talk about the launch. It seems entirely possible that they announced the launch ahead of time and didn't think they'd have to answer any more questions about it.

Gus Tue, Nov 9, 2010 10:50:12am

re: #64 Killgore Trout

KZLA LOS ANGELES A2832/10

The website is down but it was a pre announced launch.

I saw that. Wrong time frame. This happened yesterday. Time below is UTC. Missile was observed around 5 PM PST.

FL390, 09 NOV 20:00 2010 UNTIL 10 NOV 01:00 2010. CREATED: 08 NOV 20:52 2010

Mad Prophet Ludwig Tue, Nov 9, 2010 10:50:47am

re: #70 Gus 802

I saw that. Wrong time frame. This happened yesterday. Time below is UTC. Missile was observed around 5 PM PST.

FL390, 09 NOV 20:00 2010 UNTIL 10 NOV 01:00 2010. CREATED: 08 NOV 20:52 2010

OHH good point. We are back to WTF happened then.

lawhawk Tue, Nov 9, 2010 10:51:54am

re: #64 Killgore Trout

The location seems to match, but the date doesn't. That warning is for today into tomorrow (09 NOV 20:00 2010 UNTIL 10 NOV 01:00 2010. ). The mysterious launch took place Monday night (8 NOV 2010). That particular warning would seem to indicate further tests in the area, or other military actions (perhaps recovering whatever was fired).

Gus Tue, Nov 9, 2010 10:52:27am

re: #71 LudwigVanQuixote

OHH good point. We are back to WTF happened then.

Got me. Other than something classified it could have been the Russians, Chinese, or the French?

Mad Prophet Ludwig Tue, Nov 9, 2010 10:53:04am

re: #72 lawhawk

The location seems to match, but the date doesn't. That warning is for today into tomorrow (09 NOV 20:00 2010 UNTIL 10 NOV 01:00 2010. ). The mysterious launch took place Monday night (8 NOV 2010). That particular warning would seem to indicate further tests in the area, or other military actions (perhaps recovering whatever was fired).

Yeah OK... We are back to no clue - and someone launched a mystery missile that was rather large in plain sight of a major American city.

albusteve Tue, Nov 9, 2010 10:54:59am

re: #73 Gus 802

Got me. Other than something classified it could have been the Russians, Chinese, or the French?

classified?...in front of that large an audience?

Feline Fearless Leader Tue, Nov 9, 2010 10:55:05am

Back into "don't hit that button...!!!" mode.

Gus Tue, Nov 9, 2010 10:55:58am

re: #75 albusteve

classified?...in front of that large an audience?

Sure, why not? They'll just bluff there way through it if they wanted to.

Killgore Trout Tue, Nov 9, 2010 10:56:02am

Another theory...
Mysterious "missile" launch seen off Los Angeles coast a "problem of perspective"

A suspected missile launch was seen on Monday afternoon over California's southwestern Pacific coast, and after government officials have remained uncertain about its origin, a group of scientists on Tuesday explained that it is a simple a problem of perspective.
....
According to contrailscience.com, the idea that it is a missile launch originates from three misconceptions: "firstly that the trail is vertical – it's not, it's a horizontal trail, at around 32,000 feet (about six miles); secondly, the misconception of direction, that it's flying away from the viewer, when it's actually flying towards the viewer; and thirdly, the idea that it goes all the way down to the ground."

Just as we view completely "straight" roads while driving, in reality, it is just the angle we view it from. A snapshot of the roads from an airplane would reveal that they are not straight lines. The contrail is no more vertical than the road is, the website states.

While the "base" of the contrail seems wider than the tip, which tells the brain that this means the base is closer and the object is flying away, in reality, it has simply been spread by the wind.

Swamp Gas!

Kragar Tue, Nov 9, 2010 10:57:08am

re: #78 Killgore Trout

Another theory...
Mysterious "missile" launch seen off Los Angeles coast a "problem of perspective"

Swamp Gas!

Weather balloons.

DaddyG Tue, Nov 9, 2010 10:57:41am

Balloon Boy goes high tech!

Mad Prophet Ludwig Tue, Nov 9, 2010 10:59:08am

re: #73 Gus 802

Got me. Other than something classified it could have been the Russians, Chinese, or the French?

There are a lot of people it could be, and it could be a could still be a launch that was ours (military or private), but was not properly communicated up the food chain.

If it was a private launch though, you wold expect that someone from that launch would be squawking by now talking about their instrument package for university x or company y by now.

Everyone in LA could see the missile launch if they were looking at the right time.

If it was a national lab sort of launch you would think they would be talking about it.

In all cases, you would think that the military would have been informed.

I hope that it was still university x or company y that launched a commercial or scientific package and the people they told about it somehow failed to tell the food chain above them.

I hope next that it was a misfire of one of our own (conventional) birds.

The other options were that someone wanted to show us they could hit us and they just proved they could.

Vicious Michigan Union Thug Tue, Nov 9, 2010 10:59:20am

re: #61 engineer dog

i suspect we might see 9 - 10% unemployment for a number of years to come

i am just paranoid enough to think that when republicans talk about 'business friendly' policies, one of the things they have in mind is to hold down employment in this country until american workers are not 'so expensive' anymore - remember alan greenspan talking about "wage pressures"?

It is true that the job I just accepted pays about 20% less then other jobs I have had in the past.

darthstar Tue, Nov 9, 2010 11:00:37am

Peggy Noonan took Palin down a peg herself (pun intended)...

Conservatives talked a lot about Ronald Reagan this year, but they have to take him more to heart, because his example here is a guide. All this seemed lost last week on Sarah Palin, who called him, on Fox, "an actor." She was defending her form of political celebrity—reality show, "Dancing With the Stars," etc. This is how she did it: "Wasn't Ronald Reagan an actor? Wasn't he in 'Bedtime for Bonzo,' Bozo, something? Ronald Reagan was an actor."

Excuse me, but this was ignorant even for Mrs. Palin. Reagan people quietly flipped their lids, but I'll voice their consternation to make a larger point. Ronald Reagan was an artist who willed himself into leadership as president of a major American labor union (Screen Actors Guild, seven terms, 1947-59.) He led that union successfully through major upheavals (the Hollywood communist wars, labor-management struggles); discovered and honed his ability to speak persuasively by talking to workers on the line at General Electric for eight years; was elected to and completed two full terms as governor of California; challenged and almost unseated an incumbent president of his own party; and went on to popularize modern conservative political philosophy without the help of a conservative infrastructure. Then he was elected president.

The point is not "He was a great man and you are a nincompoop," though that is true. The point is that Reagan's career is a guide, not only for the tea party but for all in politics. He brought his fully mature, fully seasoned self into politics with him. He wasn't in search of a life when he ran for office, and he wasn't in search of fame; he'd already lived a life, he was already well known, he'd accomplished things in the world.

[Link: online.wsj.com...]

DaddyG Tue, Nov 9, 2010 11:00:43am

re: #82 Alouette

It is true that the job I just accepted pays about 20% less then other jobs I have had in the past.

I'm at 60% of my former salary - and just as my kids reach college age. Although I thought that was mostly because I moved to state level civil service.

Gus Tue, Nov 9, 2010 11:03:10am

re: #81 LudwigVanQuixote

There are a lot of people it could be, and it could be a could still be a launch that was ours (military or private), but was not properly communicated up the food chain.

If it was a private launch though, you wold expect that someone from that launch would be squawking by now talking about their instrument package for university x or company y by now.

Everyone in LA could see the missile launch if they were looking at the right time.

If it was a national lab sort of launch you would think they would be talking about it.

In all cases, you would think that the military would have been informed.

I hope that it was still university x or company y that launched a commercial or scientific package and the people they told about it somehow failed to tell the food chain above them.

I hope next that it was a misfire of one of our own (conventional) birds.

The other options were that someone wanted to show us they could hit us and they just proved they could.

I thought it might be private too. As far as anything rogue I highly doubt it. Although I'm sure the usual suspects are all abuzz about that.

Mad Prophet Ludwig Tue, Nov 9, 2010 11:06:09am

re: #78 Killgore Trout

Another theory...
Mysterious "missile" launch seen off Los Angeles coast a "problem of perspective"

Swamp Gas!

This is crap!

1. The shots in the video footage were taken by a helicopter, that was some 30 miles from the launch, at constant altitude. You can clearly see the arc of the trajectory. While it is possible from up close to make a curved thing look straight, it is very hard to make a horizontal thing look like vertical curved thing from far away. Garbage!

2. If it was coming towards us, we would not see the glowing ass of the bird as clearly.

lawhawk Tue, Nov 9, 2010 11:06:33am

US Northern Command says that they don't know what it was, but it wasn't a threat to the US.

U.S. Northern Command says it’s “unable to provide specific details … [but] can confirm that there is no threat to our nation, and from all indications this was not a launch by a foreign military.”

Ummm... so it was a not-nearly-as-secret secret US program and even NOCOM hasn't been read into the program to comment?

theheat Tue, Nov 9, 2010 11:07:01am

re: #83 darthstar

Do you think Peggy Noonan will apologize and thank Sarah for mobilizing the Republicans?
//

jaunte Tue, Nov 9, 2010 11:07:02am

re: #78 Killgore Trout

Another theory...
Mysterious "missile" launch seen off Los Angeles coast a "problem of perspective"

Swamp Gas!

"This is called a neuralizer. It's a gift from some friends from out of town."

researchok Tue, Nov 9, 2010 11:08:48am

re: #81 LudwigVanQuixote

There are a lot of people it could be, and it could be a could still be a launch that was ours (military or private), but was not properly communicated up the food chain.

If it was a private launch though, you wold expect that someone from that launch would be squawking by now talking about their instrument package for university x or company y by now.

Everyone in LA could see the missile launch if they were looking at the right time.

If it was a national lab sort of launch you would think they would be talking about it.

In all cases, you would think that the military would have been informed.

I hope that it was still university x or company y that launched a commercial or scientific package and the people they told about it somehow failed to tell the food chain above them.

I hope next that it was a misfire of one of our own (conventional) birds.

The other options were that someone wanted to show us they could hit us and they just proved they could.

My votes are for scientific package, new tech test, test on behalf of foreign government, test for foreign government (as in sales pitch) and so on.

researchok Tue, Nov 9, 2010 11:10:15am

re: #86 LudwigVanQuixote

This is crap!

1. The shots in the video footage were taken by a helicopter, that was some 30 miles from the launch, at constant altitude. You can clearly see the arc of the trajectory. While it is possible from up close to make a curved thing look straight, it is very hard to make a horizontal thing look like vertical curved thing from far away. Garbage!

2. If it was coming towards us, we would not see the glowing ass of the bird as clearly.

Otherwise known in the military as the glowass effect.
/

What, me worry? Tue, Nov 9, 2010 11:10:26am

re: #83 darthstar

Peggy Noonan took Palin down a peg herself (pun intended)...

[Link: online.wsj.com...]

So all the conservatives are throwing her under the bus? LOL Aint that rich. Whatever will she do without the liberal media to blame.

sagehen Tue, Nov 9, 2010 11:19:05am

those soldiers that were arrested for sport-hunting Afghans? I noted that one of them was from Wasilla and someone pointed out that didn't necessarily reflect on Sarah, they might not even know each other? (it was a late-night thread, probably only 3 or 4 people even took part in that discussion)

Hey. Turns out, the families are close.
[Link: palingates.blogspot.com...]

yasharki Tue, Nov 9, 2010 11:26:52am

Please do not be offended, but I'd like to make a rather technical suggestion how comments section may be improved. Wouldn't it be cool to anchor replies within current page instead of linking them externally to showc applet? It should be easy to replace <a href="/showc/foo/bar"> with <a id="bar">, and then replacing "re: <a href="/showc/foo/bar"> with <a href="#bar">. This would eliminate network traffic required to fetch a single comment completely, reduce server load, and improve user experience because clicking on a "re: #" would just cause one's browser rewind to an anchor instead of making a remote http get request.

S'latch Tue, Nov 9, 2010 11:44:05am

I made a comment in a previous thread noting that since 1914, after the 17th Amendment mandated the direct election of Senators, the Senate has always switched with or before the House. Since Senators have been elected by popular vote, and until this year, the House never switched first.

The Tea Party actually is responsible for changing a 94-year-old historical fact that when the House switches, the Senate switches, too. The Tea Party influence put an end to that trend by forcing unelectable Senatorial candidates on the GOP.

Sol Berdinowitz Tue, Nov 9, 2010 12:00:50pm

I don't believe the Tea Party candidates will tone down the rhetoric once they sit down and start governing, either. In fact, I rather suspect that they will notch it up and be rather deaf to the admonitions of their "business-as-usual" establishment colleagues to tone it down and get some business done (as usual).

atstr Tue, Nov 9, 2010 3:17:38pm

"Bachus is on target with this comment; it’s the simple truth."

The simple truth is for simpletons.

Sarah Palin is indeed a lightning rod and will surely divide the room, even a room full of GOP's. But anyone who thinks she cost the Rep party the senate didn't follow the election, doesn't understand politics (or the TEA Party), and can't count!

Ming Tue, Nov 9, 2010 3:53:06pm

That's the problem with Sarah Palin. Yes, she may well have cost the Republicans one or more Senate seats. And there's the rub. No one, Republican or Democrat, can know what Sarah Palin is going to do next. No one, Republican or Democrat, can be confident that Sarah Palin will be in favor of what they're in favor of. If Sarah Palin becomes Vice President or President in 2013, will she be in favor of Israel on a particular issue? Who knows? Will she be in favor of a piece of legislation about national waterways? Who knows? Will she be in favor of Big Oil? Who knows? Even Republican cynics who like her right now have to wonder what things would be like if Palin got real political power in the future. Her mental illness is not going to go away by itself.

tradewind Tue, Nov 9, 2010 5:15:41pm

There's a good argument to be made that control of the Senate would have been less than helpful to republicans in the next two years, since Democrats no longer have a ' functional ' majority there, but are still available to be equally blamed for any anger at Congress.
Then there are the governors who rode in on Palin's endorsement , such as Haley....and controlling
governors' mansions and state legislatures ( 678 new Republican state representatives and senators take office across the 50 states ) will help immensely due to redistricting issues before 2012.
FL, OH, and PA......going to be tough for the Democrats to repeat the '08 story there.

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