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1 Eclectic Infidel  Sun, Dec 9, 2012 3:05:54pm

Good article.

I especially liked this part:

There are only three ways, which must be combined, to survive: to believe truthful things, do constructive things, and laugh at the absurdity of the situation.

2 Obdicut  Sun, Dec 9, 2012 3:29:08pm

I don't get it. What's the alternative?

3 goddamnedfrank  Sun, Dec 9, 2012 4:10:44pm

Woman: The Oslo Accords are a disaster.

Netanyahu: Yes. You know that and I knew that...The people [nation] has to know...

What were the Oslo Accords? The Oslo Accords, which the Knesset signed, I was asked, before the elections: "Will you act according to them?" and I answered: "yes, subject to mutuality and limiting the retreats." "But how do you intend to limit the retreats?" "I'll give such interpretation to the Accords that will make it possible for me to stop this galloping to the '67 [armistice] lines. How did we do it?

Narrator: The Oslo Accords stated at the time that Israel would gradually hand over territories to the Palestinians in three different pulses, unless the territories in question had settlements or military sites. This is where Netanyahu found a loophole.

Netanyahu: No one said what defined military sites. Defined military sites, I said, were security zones. As far as I'm concerned, the Jordan Valley is a defined military site.

Woman: Right [laughs]...The Beit She'an Valley.

Netanyahu: How can you tell. How can you tell? But then the question came up of just who would define what Defined Military Sites were. I received a letter -- to me and to Arafat, at the same time -- which said that Israel, and only Israel, would be the one to define what those are, the location of those military sites and their size. Now, they did not want to give me that letter, so I did not give the Hebron Agreement. I stopped the government meeting, I said: "I'm not signing." Only when the letter came, in the course of the meeting, to me and to Arafat, only then did I sign the Hebron Agreement. Or rather, ratify it, it had already been signed. Why does this matter? Because at that moment I actually stopped the Oslo Accord.

4 Buck  Sun, Dec 9, 2012 6:29:37pm

re: #3 goddamnedfrank

Do you see how the video cuts to multiple views while at the same time the audio seems continuous? As if this was a three or four camera shoot, switching from camera to camera... sometimes focusing on the food, sometime on the speaker, sometimes of the people in the room.

I doubt that this was some fancy multi camera shoot.

Editing and changing what was said is more likely.

5 Rochi613  Mon, Dec 10, 2012 6:41:46am

re: #1 Eclectic Infidel

I agree. That is the alternative: not to give in to the madness, but to live your truth, be a builder, not a destroyer and keep your sense of humor.

The author well captures the sense of cosmic wierdness we are living with here in Israel. The whole world is upside down and the lies have become The Truth and evildoers exalted. It doesn't matter what Israel does, she will always be blamed. After a hit or two, it is pretty funny.

6 Obdicut  Mon, Dec 10, 2012 6:51:53am

re: #5 Rochi613

The alternative to what?

7 Mad Prophet Ludwig  Tue, Dec 11, 2012 9:17:00am

re: #6 Obdicut

The alternative to what?

Odd you didn't see it. One expression of it from the article:

So which fate is preferable? To win the wars forced on you, to develop high living standards, to enjoy real democratic life, or to writhe under the torture of dictators, terrorists and totalitarian ideologies?

It's a pretty obvious short form.

1. The various Palestinian pseudo-governments do not want peace.

2. The Palestinian pseudo-governments break every peace agreement they have ever made, Oslo being the latest example.

3. Israel is expected to keep those agreements even though the Palestinian pseudo-governments are not.

4. The Palestinian pseudo-governments are rewarded by the UN and world in general for breaking agreements and starting wars.

Therefore. Fuck it. Two choices, go down a path towards a "peace" that will never be secure or good enough for the Palestinians with ever more concessions and less return that creates a more dangerous security situation.... or....

Live well, build a 21st century nation and kick the snot out of the bad guys when they start another war.

8 Mad Prophet Ludwig  Tue, Dec 11, 2012 1:01:00pm

Dear Rochi613,

I love the reference in your handle.

Do not let knee-jerk left-wing magical balance fairies dissuade you from stating the truth any more than right-wing magical balance fairies would.

Certain hot -button issues make certain people simply blind to any facts, truth, logic or evidence that does not fit their own internal narrative. The supposedly more educated and enlightened left, (and in general and certainly in America they are more enlightened and educated) is blind to the security realities of Israel, the deprivations of the Palestinian pseudo terrorist states, the larger Arab political game in which the Palestinians are pawns and the greater global power game in which both are pawns - not to mention the actual factual history.

They want to see the Palestinians as poor and oppressed folks who are simply victims. That is their narrative. We Jews are good proxies for a lot of Western guilt. They can not stomach the idea that the Palestinians never fail to fail at peace, do not want peace and brought much of the situation on themselves. There would be no walls and checkpoints if there were no suicide bombers. That is why the walls and checkpoints were made. Because of the walls they turned to rockets. There would be no military clean ups in Gaza if there were no rocket attacks. Of course, Gaza used to be Egypt and it used to be the West bank of Jordan. There would be no Gaza or West Bank if not for the larger Arab political game.

But such details are not relevant to the fervid left. Don't even try to tell them about the crushed Palestinian coup in Jordan - or the obvious implications of that for the region. Don't even try to tell them about the three no's. Don't bother reminding them that Hamas really was voted into power on a "we murder more Jews campaign" and that the Palestinians therefore voted for war and honestly have responsibility when Hamas starts wars.

Many thousands more Arabs died in Syria, and are still dying than in the recent unpleasantness. Our lefty pearl clutchers barely seem to notice that. That was because it was Arab on Arab.

Such details are not relevant.

The left is nothing if not a hypocrite on Israel and just as blind to the truths of the situation as the right is on issues of climate, women's rights and the age of the universe.

They are just as blind.

They are just as unwilling to listen to reason.

Just like righties, they will glance past these facts and move to other talking points.

However, it is worth it and necessary to keep telling the truth. Not everyone has drunk this particular cool-aid.

9 Vicious Michigan Union Thug  Tue, Dec 11, 2012 1:03:02pm

re: #8 Mad Prophet Ludwig

Ludwig, Rochi got the banstick. She linked to some crazy site run by fjordman.


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 Frank says:

The whole Universe is a large joke. Everything in the Universe is just subdivisions of this joke. So why take anything too seriously?