re: #838 LudwigVanQuixote

Hello all…

I’m thinking of composing an AGW troll hammer, like the one I did for the Creationists a while back.

So here are some first ones:

What is the ideal temperature of the Earth?

First off, average temperatures are a limited way of understanding the problem. A planet with half of it at -100 degrees centigrade over half of its surface and 140 degrees centigrade over the other half has an average temperature of a comfortable 20 degrees. However either, -100 or 140 would kill you very quickly. The issue is that as the average temperature rises, there is a vast amount more heat in the Earth’s system and that weather and growing patterns shift to the detriment of people who need food and don’t wish to live underwater.

The climate is always changing!

Yes, so what? The point is the notion of a stable cycle in a dynamic equilibrium. In less scientific language, the idea is that the climate of the Earth has many systems in a balance that may wobble around a central mean, but never goes out of certain bounds. We are shifting that balance to a more hot and wet world. The consequences of that shift, if nothing changes, are catastrophic.

But the Sun surely is the cause of it!

This has been ruled out. The fact of the mater is that it takes a certain amount of energy to shift a system as large as the Earth. Solar variations simply do not have enough energy to account for the warming we are directly observing. This is not to say that solar variation has no effect, rather that the effects it does have are too small.

Cherry picked stuff from actual scientists coupled with the interpretations of cranks without the support of data or peer review are not science. The fact is that tens of thousands of actual scientists are very clear about the reality of the situation. Why not look at what their stuff, peer reviewed and supported by data - has to say.

Some links from reputable sources:

[Link: www.aip.org…]

[Link: scienceblogs.com…]

Simplistic questions deserve simplistic answers. You help raise the standards of both sides by such a response.

But one caution, all the appeals to the: there’s thousands of us we know better, do more to alienate than educate.