Finally, the Right Wing Wants to Prosecute Someone for Violating Gun Laws

Idiocy of the day
Wingnuts • Views: 37,717

There are so many levels of moronic absurdity in this story it beggars the imagination, as the right wing screams in unison (they always scream in unison) for Meet the Press host David Gregory to be prosecuted and sent to jail for using an AR-15 magazine as a prop in his interview with NRA chief Wayne LaPierre: What if David Gregory Went to Jail Over His Gun Prop?

They’ve screamed loud enough that Washington DC police are investigating the incident, and David Gregory — who is actually one of the best friends the wingnuts have on mainstream TV, often giving his right wing guests incredibly easy treatment — may end up going to jail. The sense of weird, twisted glee in the right wing blogosphere is palpable; Gregory dared to criticize the insane policies of the NRA, and for that he must be destroyed.

Of course, these are the same bloggers and pundits who want no restrictions at all on ownership of these lethal magazines by people with real guns that kill.

It’s a first: the very first time right wingers have actually called for gun laws to be enforced. The mean-spirited, irrational wingnut GOTCHA! mentality writ large.

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265 comments
1 Political Atheist  Wed, Dec 26, 2012 10:58:08am

I'm just embarrassed for the rest of us. To restate what I Paged-If there is a conviction, pardon him for serving public safety.

2 Ian G.  Wed, Dec 26, 2012 10:58:11am

OT, but did Bryan Fischer have anything to say about the tornadoes that hit the south on Christmas? I mean, I know things like a school shooting are caused by God hating lib'ruls, but notice how it never works the other way?

I obviously don't subscribe to the revolting, sociopathic view that natural disasters are divine punishment, but does anyone else notice how natural disasters in the US seem to strike much worse in the GOP-leaning parts of the country? Even earthquakes, which hit godless Hollywood and San Francisco but not the Bible Belt*, also occur with even more power in Sarah Palin's Alaska.

*New Madrid, MO aside

3 Vicious Babushka  Wed, Dec 26, 2012 10:58:28am

DERP





4 nines09  Wed, Dec 26, 2012 10:58:47am

There obviously is no reality is there?

5 Ghost of Tom Joad  Wed, Dec 26, 2012 11:00:17am

How did Gregory come across it? I'm guessing somebody brought it in as a prop for him to use.

Not that I wouldn't mind seeing his pathetic ass go to jail.

Has nothing to do with him breaking any gun laws and everything to do with him saying something negative about the holy NRA/Gun-lobby.

6 Vicious Babushka  Wed, Dec 26, 2012 11:01:58am

re: #2 Ian G.

OT, but did Bryan Fischer have anything to say about the tornadoes that hit the south on Christmas? I mean, I know things like a school shooting are caused by God hating lib'ruls, but notice how it never works the other way?

I obviously don't subscribe to the revolting, sociopathic view that natural disasters are divine punishment, but does anyone else notice how natural disasters in the US seem to strike much worse in the GOP-leaning parts of the country? Even earthquakes, which hit godless Hollywood and San Francisco but not the Bible Belt*, also occur with even more power in Sarah Palin's Alaska.

Since you asked:


*New Madrid, MO aside

7 Mich-again  Wed, Dec 26, 2012 11:02:19am

Who is a bigger menace to public safety.. David Gregory for waving around gun parts or GOP Senator Mike Crapo for driving drunk and running red lights.

8 Ghost of Tom Joad  Wed, Dec 26, 2012 11:02:47am

re: #3 Vicious Michigan Union Thug

DERP

[Embedded content]

If those 2 had a child it would absolutely be the dumbest fucking creature in the universe. No competition.

9 lawhawk  Wed, Dec 26, 2012 11:03:29am

The same right wing, which claims that all we need to do is enforce the laws on the books, has had no problem blocking anyone from being nominated and confirmed to the post of the Director of the BATF. It's a post that has been empty for six years.

Then, there's the fact that the laws on the books are written with enough loopholes to drive fast and furiously past the graveyard of victims from all manner of firearms deaths.

For example, under current laws the bureau is prohibited from creating a federal registry of gun transactions. So while detectives on television tap a serial number into a computer and instantly identify the buyer of a firearm, the reality could not be more different.

When law enforcement officers recover a gun and serial number, workers at the bureau’s National Tracing Center here — a windowless warehouse-style building on a narrow road outside town — begin making their way through a series of phone calls, asking first the manufacturer, then the wholesaler and finally the dealer to search their files to identify the buyer of the firearm.

About a third of the time, the process involves digging through records sent in by companies that have closed, in many cases searching by hand through cardboard boxes filled with computer printouts, hand-scrawled index cards or even water-stained sheets of paper.

In an age when data is often available with a few keystrokes, the A.T.F. is forced to follow this manual routine because the idea of establishing a central database of gun transactions has been rejected by lawmakers in Congress, who have sided with the National Rifle Association, which argues that such a database poses a threat to the Second Amendment. In other countries, gun rights groups argue, governments have used gun registries to confiscate the firearms of law-abiding citizens.

Advocates for increased gun regulation, however, contend that in a country plagued by gun violence, a central registry could help keep firearms out of the hands of criminals and allow law enforcement officials to act more effectively to prevent gun crime.

As has been the case for decades, the A.T.F., the federal agency charged with enforcing gun laws and regulating the gun industry, is caught in the middle.

It all comes back to the fear of confiscation of weapons. Never mind that there are some weapons that should be strictly limited on use.

10 Vicious Babushka  Wed, Dec 26, 2012 11:04:04am

re: #8 Ghost of Tom Joad

If those 2 had a child it would absolutely be the dumbest fucking creature in the universe. No competition.

BRYAN: Dana my dear, we should get married! Imagine, a child with my brains and your good looks!

DANA: What if it had my brains and your looks?

11 Mich-again  Wed, Dec 26, 2012 11:04:56am

re: #6 Vicious Michigan Union Thug

He doesn't understand that warmer air can absorb a lot more water than cooler air.

12 b_sharp  Wed, Dec 26, 2012 11:06:41am

re: #8 Ghost of Tom Joad

If those 2 had a child it would absolutely be the dumbest fucking creature in the universe. No competition.

Why did you have to go there?

Yuch, ptooie, blech, hack, arrghlgrghl.

13 Brother Holy Cruise Missile of Mild Acceptance  Wed, Dec 26, 2012 11:06:42am

so did Gregory actually go after LaPierre? Or was it more of a fluffing on national TV? I can't stand him so I don't bother watching.

14 sean6886politik  Wed, Dec 26, 2012 11:07:22am

These are the same crazy people signing a petition to have Piers Morgan deported for using his free speech to question gun nuts on national television.
They say it's because he was rude to his guests.
They are crying that their 2nd Ammendment rights are being taken away all while trying to chastise someone because they used their 1st Ammendment rights.
Oh the irony and stupidity of these people.

15 Eventual Carrion  Wed, Dec 26, 2012 11:07:37am

re: #11 Mich-again

He doesn't understand that warmer air can absorb a lot more water than cooler air.

Yes, and he never will because he is a FUCKING IDIOT. I don't even think it is an act anymore, I think he is just a full blown mental midget. Nothing can get through the stupid (it can't be ignorance because he has been told).

16 lawhawk  Wed, Dec 26, 2012 11:08:14am

re: #6 Vicious Michigan Union Thug

The Charleston quake of 1886 was one of the strongest in the nation. And the DC quake actually hit just outside Lynchburg VA (home to Liberty University).

Not to mention all the hurricanes, tornadoes, and other severe weather that regularly pummels the South.

17 Kronocide  Wed, Dec 26, 2012 11:08:22am

re: #11 Mich-again

He doesn't understand that warmer air can absorb a lot more water than cooler air.

This is coming from a guy who thinks acceptance of homosexuality causes tornado and mass shootings of school children. What he lacks in intelligence and reason he makes up for with fervor.

18 Vicious Babushka  Wed, Dec 26, 2012 11:10:52am
19 Tigger2  Wed, Dec 26, 2012 11:10:59am

Maybe Gregory will change a little since he has been attacked by his own and quit giving the right such a free pass, but I wont hold my breath.

20 Ghost of Tom Joad  Wed, Dec 26, 2012 11:11:02am

re: #9 lawhawk

It all comes back to the fear of confiscation of weapons. Never mind that there are some weapons that should be strictly limited on use.

It's one of the most egregious lies being spread by the likes of the NRA. The NRA was selling that fear the moment Obama was elected, even when he didn't even mention guns. That fear has been perfectly marketed and sold to the rubes, and in turn it's resulted in huge boons to gun lobbyists and manufacturers.

Of course, the heart of the problem is the wealthy owners of said manufacturers (funny how rich people seem to be at the core of a lot of problems around here) who will push these ideas because it helps make them richer, dead sons/daughters/fathers/mothers/friends etc. watering that fucking liberty tree all the while.

21 Dark_Falcon  Wed, Dec 26, 2012 11:11:21am

re: #9 lawhawk

The same right wing, which claims that all we need to do is enforce the laws on the books, has had no problem blocking anyone from being nominated and confirmed to the post of the Director of the BATF. It's a post that has been empty for six years.

Then, there's the fact that the laws on the books are written with enough loopholes to drive fast and furiously past the graveyard of victims from all manner of firearms deaths.

It all comes back to the fear of confiscation of weapons. Never mind that there are some weapons that should be strictly limited on use.

I've thought about this and I've got an idea that would put the NRA on the spot:

Joe Biden should ask the NRA to put someone they'd accept as ATF director. Give them a guarantee of a hearing and committee vote and if they pass that vote no fillibuster. That would force the NRA to put someone forward and if they put forward some nut he could be attacked in the hearings and then simply voted down. If they somehow put forward a sane person, then the ATF has a director. Either way, it will force action.

22 jaunte  Wed, Dec 26, 2012 11:12:04am

re: #6 Vicious Michigan Union Thug

Fischer must have failed science in junior high.

23 Vicious Babushka  Wed, Dec 26, 2012 11:12:40am

re: #22 jaunte

[Embedded content]

Fischer must have failed science everything in junior high.

24 Mich-again  Wed, Dec 26, 2012 11:13:04am

Every special snowflake is more evidence that global warming is hooey.
//

25 Dark_Falcon  Wed, Dec 26, 2012 11:13:18am

re: #18 Vicious Michigan Union Thug

Please stop posting that asshole's tweets for a few hours. Right now I'm so pissed off after that last one I want to ram my fist there the screen.

26 Ghost of Tom Joad  Wed, Dec 26, 2012 11:13:44am

re: #11 Mich-again

He doesn't understand that warmer air can absorb a lot more water than cooler air.

Just add it to the list of simple shit he doesn't understand (and severely doesn't want to understand because if he actually spent a modicum of time trying to understand anything, the resulting paradox would cause his brain to reach critical mass and explode).

27 wrenchwench  Wed, Dec 26, 2012 11:14:16am

re: #21 Dark_Falcon

I've thought about this and I've got an idea that would put the NRA on the spot:

Joe Biden should ask the NRA to put someone they'd accept as ATF director. Give them a guarantee of a hearing and committee vote and if they pass that vote no fillibuster. That would force the NRA to put someone forward and if they put forward some nut he could be attacked in the hearings and then simply voted down. If they somehow put forward a sane person, then the ATF has a director. Either way, it will force action.

Nice strategic thinking, but the NRA doesn't deserve the consideration it would show them.

28 Kronocide  Wed, Dec 26, 2012 11:16:51am

re: #27 wrenchwench

Nice strategic thinking, but the NRA doesn't deserve the consideration it would show them.

The NRA, and it's 4m Mom/Dads/Kids, cannot be taken seriously as long as that fucking loon LaPierre is at the helm. They've shown a consistent record of irrationality.

29 wrenchwench  Wed, Dec 26, 2012 11:17:37am
NBC's David Gregory, the subject of a now-popular police investigation, is on vacation and will not host this Sunday's edition of "Meet The Press."

"David has long planned to be off on Sunday, December 30th. He will return the following Sunday," NBC News spokesperson Erika Masonhall told POLITICO.

[...]

More screaming in unison will ensue.

30 Vicious Babushka  Wed, Dec 26, 2012 11:17:38am

re: #25 Dark_Falcon

Please stop posting that asshole's tweets for a few hours. Right now I'm so pissed off after that last one I want to ram my fist there the screen.

31 watching you tiny alien kittens are  Wed, Dec 26, 2012 11:18:03am

Re-posted from the page on this...

If you look at the video of Gregory holding up the "magazine" the bottom as well as the top is open. There is no floor plate or spring or even a bottom plate to the "magazine," it is merely the sidewall shell of one. You can see the feed lips at the top of the "magazine" so he is holding it upright in the correct direction.

What he had could only be considered a prop since it could neither hold nor feed bullets, it is only a hollow rectangular shell of metal. Look closely, he is holding it up with his thumb inserted into the bottom opening where the bottom plate used to be. No bottom plate means no spring or floor plate either since they attach to the bottom plate and would fall out without one.

This is just another tempest in a teapot, instead of discussing what Gregory and LaPierre said on the show they now have people discussing whether Gregory broke the law.

Which by the way he didn't.

Video here...
[Link: politicalticker.blogs.cnn.com...]

Also the article there points out that someone from NBC called the police before the show and asked them if it would be legal to have one for the show.

The police told them NO!

You have to assume that after asking and being told that it would be a crime that they stripped the magazine to make it a legal prop. David Gregory has absolutely nothing to worry about, although whoever provided the prop for the show will surely have to answer some questions from the police. Such as was it ever intact in D.C. before it was stripped?

32 Ian G.  Wed, Dec 26, 2012 11:18:27am

re: #11 Mich-again

Not grasping the difference between weather and climate is really no less of an appalling ignorance than Bill O'Reilly not getting how the tides work. I'm not saying that it should be self-evident that climate and weather are different, but if you're going to take a strong stand on the issue, it might help to, you know, understand a thing or two about it.

33 erik_t  Wed, Dec 26, 2012 11:19:10am

I thought we were supposed to be against gotcha media :?

34 Charles Johnson  Wed, Dec 26, 2012 11:19:28am

re: #29 wrenchwench

More screaming in unison will ensue.

He's taking it on the lam!

35 Dark_Falcon  Wed, Dec 26, 2012 11:19:29am

re: #27 wrenchwench

Nice strategic thinking, but the NRA doesn't deserve the consideration it would show them.

As Joe Biden would tell you, its not about what they deserve, its about forcing them into activity. Forcing the other side to either back off or hold their views up to extended scrutiny. The idea is to resolve the problem by forcing the NRA to put forward someone who would satisfy their objections. If they refuse to do so, then they will have admitted they are full of shit.

36 Tigger2  Wed, Dec 26, 2012 11:20:02am

re: #30 Vicious Michigan Union Thug

[Embedded content]

Sorry Fisher but a majority of the American people polled said they would blame the Republicans and I doubt most of those people are on the 10th tee.

37 wrenchwench  Wed, Dec 26, 2012 11:24:48am

re: #35 Dark_Falcon

As Joe Biden would tell you, its not about what they deserve, its about forcing them into activity. Forcing the other side to either back off or hold their views up to extended scrutiny. The idea is to resolve the problem by forcing the NRA to put forward someone who would satisfy their objections. If they refuse to do so, then they will have admitted they are full of shit.

My hope is that LaPierre has already discredited the organization to the point that the process can proceed without regard for the NRA's position. Even NRA members in the Senate (one at least) are backing away from them.

38 Vicious Babushka  Wed, Dec 26, 2012 11:25:20am

GAAAHHHH!

39 Kronocide  Wed, Dec 26, 2012 11:25:50am

Blizzard = no global warming

is the intellectual equivalent of

mass shooting = gun laws don't work

40 Kronocide  Wed, Dec 26, 2012 11:26:44am

Who is Kevin Ether?

41 engineer cat  Wed, Dec 26, 2012 11:29:19am

re: #31 watching you tiny alien kittens are

anybody have any idea what the usual penalty would be for this if gregory were to be found guilty?

42 Targetpractice  Wed, Dec 26, 2012 11:30:52am

re: #41 engineer cat

anybody have any idea what the usual penalty would be for this if gregory were to be found guilty?

Low-end is $1000 fine, high-end is 1 year in jail.

43 Ghost of Tom Joad  Wed, Dec 26, 2012 11:32:59am

re: #41 engineer cat

anybody have any idea what the usual penalty would be for this if gregory were to be found guilty?

Do we even know if what he had was a functional mag or just a fake? Or a stripped-down real one as somebody posted above (which I think would technically make it nothing more than a stage-prop)?

Sorry, haven't seen the vid and can't watch it here, did he say he bought it and brought it into the studio or something, or did he just get it as a prop from someone in the studio?

44 Eventual Carrion  Wed, Dec 26, 2012 11:33:41am

re: #42 Targetpractice

Low-end is $1000 fine, high-end is 1 year in jail.

Good thing he didn't have a bong, that probably would have been a much stiffer penalty.

45 Kronocide  Wed, Dec 26, 2012 11:35:41am

re: #44 Eventual Carrion

Good thing he didn't have a bong, that probably would have been a much stiffer penalty.

Imagine if he held up a live fetus.

46 jaunte  Wed, Dec 26, 2012 11:35:52am

re: #40 Kronocide

Upding for 'ether.' He's a deep conservative thinker in the 'overcome by ether' sense.
[Link: www.therightsphere.com...]

47 Charles Johnson  Wed, Dec 26, 2012 11:37:27am

It's now an official OUTRAGEOUS OUTRAGE!

48 Ghost of Tom Joad  Wed, Dec 26, 2012 11:37:29am

re: #45 Kronocide

Imagine if he held up a live fetus.

Err....live?

49 Varek Raith  Wed, Dec 26, 2012 11:38:28am

Do we even know if it was a real mag?

50 Political Atheist  Wed, Dec 26, 2012 11:39:16am

re: #49 Varek Raith

Do we even know if it was a real mag?

Nope.

51 Dark_Falcon  Wed, Dec 26, 2012 11:40:08am

re: #37 wrenchwench

My hope is that LaPierre has already discredited the organization to the point that the process can proceed without regard for the NRA's position. Even NRA members in the Senate (one at least) are backing away from them.

Nope, not for a nomination. Senators can put anonymous holds on a nomination, blocking the Senate from taking action for 2 days. They can then rotate the hold between them, never revealing who is responsible for the hold.

52 Charles Johnson  Wed, Dec 26, 2012 11:40:11am

Look on the bright side, though - if Gregory is forced to step down from MTP, maybe they could hire someone who isn't a fluffy airhead for the job.

53 Ian G.  Wed, Dec 26, 2012 11:41:17am

re: #52 Charles Johnson

Look on the bright side, though - if Gregory is forced to step down from MTP, maybe they could hire someone who isn't a fluffy airhead for the job.

They'd probably just put Luke Russert in the spot.

54 Kronocide  Wed, Dec 26, 2012 11:41:33am

re: #48 Ghost of Tom Joad

Err....live?

Not meant to be a factual statement. I'm on the Sarcasm Ether this AM.

55 Targetpractice  Wed, Dec 26, 2012 11:41:41am

re: #52 Charles Johnson

Look on the bright side, though - if Gregory is forced to step down from MTP, maybe they could hire someone who isn't a fluffy airhead for the job.

Or they may go the other way and find somebody who's even less "confrontational." Though how you find somebody whose spine is less insubstantial than David Gregory, I've no clue.

56 wrenchwench  Wed, Dec 26, 2012 11:42:15am

re: #51 Dark_Falcon

Nope, not for a nomination. Senators can put anonymous holds on a nomination, blocking the Senate from taking action for 2 days. They can then rotate the hold between them, never revealing who is responsible for the hold.

That sounds like a rule ripe for change.

57 Holidays are Family Fun Time  Wed, Dec 26, 2012 11:42:35am

HOw is it today all?

58 Kronocide  Wed, Dec 26, 2012 11:44:51am

re: #46 jaunte

Upding for 'ether.' He's a deep conservative thinker in the 'overcome by ether' sense.
[Link: www.therightsphere.com...]

Oh, the taxes on rich won't cover the gap ploy. That destroys their zeal to defund entitlements then, as they are somewhat similar in scope.

59 Dark_Falcon  Wed, Dec 26, 2012 11:45:36am

re: #56 wrenchwench

That sounds like a rule ripe for change.

Nope. The current Senate leadership voted it in in 2011. The Senate likes the anonymous hold, as long as it requires more just 2-3 senators to work it.

60 DisturbedEma  Wed, Dec 26, 2012 11:45:52am

OT but it appears that The police have arrested the husband of the police officer in Wauwatosa :(

61 jaunte  Wed, Dec 26, 2012 11:46:13am

re: #58 Kronocide

"If we can't do it all at once, we must do nothing!"

62 DisturbedEma  Wed, Dec 26, 2012 11:46:51am

She was the first officer killed on duty in the history of the department

63 Kronocide  Wed, Dec 26, 2012 11:47:53am

It's weird how those most worried about the debt look to entitlements first for cuts. Entitlements are a fraction of the budget.

64 Ghost of Tom Joad  Wed, Dec 26, 2012 11:48:53am

re: #55 Targetpractice

Or they may go the other way and find somebody who's even less "confrontational." Though how you find somebody whose spine is less insubstantial than David Gregory, I've no clue.

Let Congress interview itself. Only way possible.

65 wrenchwench  Wed, Dec 26, 2012 11:50:32am

re: #59 Dark_Falcon

Nope. The current Senate leadership voted it in in 2011. The Senate likes the anonymous hold, as long as it requires more just 2-3 senators to work it.

Voters should tell their senators that the rule is stupid, obstructionist, cowardly (because of the anonymity part) and that it should be changed. Would you be in favor of that?

66 Holidays are Family Fun Time  Wed, Dec 26, 2012 11:51:13am

re: #63 Kronocide

It's weird how those most worried about the debt look to entitlements first for cuts. Entitlements are a fraction of the budget.

It's time to earmark the Defense Budget for Public Works to rebuild our infrastructure. I see it as a security issue.

67 Dark_Falcon  Wed, Dec 26, 2012 11:53:53am

re: #65 wrenchwench

Voters should tell their senators that the rule is stupid, obstructionist, cowardly (because of the anonymity part) and that it should be changed. Would you be in favor of that?

I don't think about it, since the voters' options are very limited. Only 1/3 of the Senate is up for reelection in any given cycle and even if that entire group was replaced most of their replacements would keep the rule. The Senate can almost always outlast an agitated public, and frankly it was designed to be able to do so.

68 Slap  Wed, Dec 26, 2012 11:55:23am

On the subject of: Outrageous Outrage!

A soothing balm:

Breathed Wisdom

Sometimes, it helps to laugh.....

69 Holidays are Family Fun Time  Wed, Dec 26, 2012 11:56:25am

Is it just me, or did this Christmas have a shadow hanging over it?

70 Dark_Falcon  Wed, Dec 26, 2012 11:57:25am

re: #64 Ghost of Tom Joad

Let Congress interview itself. Only way possible.

They'd just spout talking points while speaking past each other.

71 Kronocide  Wed, Dec 26, 2012 11:58:07am

I'm sick and tired of kicking the can down the road.

A rhetorical flourish worthy of AM radio ads selling survival goods.

72 Holidays are Family Fun Time  Wed, Dec 26, 2012 11:58:17am

re: #64 Ghost of Tom Joad

Let Congress interview itself. Only way possible.

Talk about a Kangaroo Court. . . .

73 Charles Johnson  Wed, Dec 26, 2012 11:58:27am

Another wingnut who apparently failed at reading comprehension, since I didn't say a single word about "separate laws" for David Gregory or anyone else.

74 wrenchwench  Wed, Dec 26, 2012 11:59:17am

re: #67 Dark_Falcon

I don't think about it, since the voters' options are very limited. Only 1/3 of the Senate is up for reelection in any given cycle and even if that entire group was replaced most of their replacements would keep the rule. The Senate can almost always outlast an agitated public, and frankly it was designed to be able to do so.

I appreciate the intended obstructionist aspect of the Senate, but the anonymous part of that rule is cowardly and stupid. They can keep the rest.

75 Dark_Falcon  Wed, Dec 26, 2012 11:59:52am

re: #74 wrenchwench

I appreciate the intended obstructionist aspect of the Senate, but the anonymous part of that rule is cowardly and stupid. They can keep the rest.

We'll need to finish this later, gotta go.

76 Holidays are Family Fun Time  Wed, Dec 26, 2012 12:00:06pm

A right wing friend sent me a piece of propaganda about prayer in schools and gun control. I wrote back that we need to look at facts and leave emotion out of the conversation if we are going to establish meaningful policy.

I haven't heard back from my friend.

77 Eventual Carrion  Wed, Dec 26, 2012 12:01:24pm

re: #69 Holidays are Family Fun Time

Is it just me, or did this Christmas have a shadow hanging over it?

Mine did, but I think it was more my personal situation than a shared thing. Plus I am a Grinch about xmas for the most part anyway.

78 Holidays are Family Fun Time  Wed, Dec 26, 2012 12:02:33pm

re: #77 Eventual Carrion

Mine did, but I think it was more my personal situation than a shared thing. Plus I am a Grinch about xmas for the most part anyway.

The Mother of all Sinus Infections and Warmer Weather didn't help, in my case.

79 lawhawk  Wed, Dec 26, 2012 12:02:33pm

re: #41 engineer cat


The law he may have violated is DC Code § 7-2506.01. The penalty is up to $1,000 or 1 year in jail or both (DC Code § 7-2507.06).

80 wrenchwench  Wed, Dec 26, 2012 12:03:20pm

re: #73 Charles Johnson

[Embedded content]

Another wingnut who apparently failed at reading comprehension

That probably applies to anyone who refers to you as a 'leftist hack'.

81 dragonfire1981  Wed, Dec 26, 2012 12:04:12pm

I actually heard a story the other day about a guy who, in the course of learning Christmas carols, had actually taught his kids to sing: "Don we now our straight apparel."

82 Holidays are Family Fun Time  Wed, Dec 26, 2012 12:04:14pm

re: #79 lawhawk

OMG! What is that symbol called?

DC Code § 7-2507.06

I hate getting old and forgetting things

83 lawhawk  Wed, Dec 26, 2012 12:04:48pm

re: #82 Holidays are Family Fun Time

It's a section symbol.

84 Ian G.  Wed, Dec 26, 2012 12:04:54pm

re: #81 dragonfire1981

I actually saw a story the other day about a guy who, in the course of learning Christmas carols, had actually taught his kids to sing: "Don we now our straight apparel."

You sure that wasn't The Onion?

85 dragonfire1981  Wed, Dec 26, 2012 12:04:58pm

Also, is it just me or does Bryan Fischer's Twitter avatar make him look like a smug bastard?

86 dragonfire1981  Wed, Dec 26, 2012 12:05:17pm

re: #84 Ian G.

You sure that wasn't The Onion?

Nope, I'm sure. *sigh*

87 Holidays are Family Fun Time  Wed, Dec 26, 2012 12:05:19pm

re: #81 dragonfire1981

I actually saw a story the other day about a guy who, in the course of learning Christmas carols, had actually taught his kids to sing: "Don we now our straight apparel."

I think that falls under the "Literacy + maturity + intelligence" category.

88 Holidays are Family Fun Time  Wed, Dec 26, 2012 12:06:07pm

re: #85 dragonfire1981

Also, is it just me or does Bryan Fischer's Twitter avatar make him look like a smug bastard?

I used to watch in horror as customers (mother's usually) lecture their boys on why they couldn't have pink toys.

correction: sb a response to:

re: #81 dragonfire1981


You sure that wasn't The Onion?

89 rwdflynavy  Wed, Dec 26, 2012 12:06:41pm
90 jaunte  Wed, Dec 26, 2012 12:06:49pm

re: #81 dragonfire1981

I actually saw a story the other day about a guy who, in the course of learning Christmas carols, had actually taught his kids to sing: "Don we now our straight apparel."

It’s called Christmas eve, not Christmas & Steve!

91 Tigger2  Wed, Dec 26, 2012 12:06:55pm

re: #84 Ian G.

You sure that wasn't The Onion?

It's so hard to tell the difference anymore if you're talking about something said by someone on the right or the whole right in general.
Sometime I think some of the stuff the right comes up with makes the onion seem more believable. lol

92 wrenchwench  Wed, Dec 26, 2012 12:07:04pm

re: #85 dragonfire1981

Also, is it just me or does Bryan Fischer's Twitter avatar make him look like a smug bastard?

No, it's his face that does that.

93 Big Steve  Wed, Dec 26, 2012 12:07:23pm

I had the opportunity to attend a Bat Mitzvah this past weekend. I am not one bit religious and this is my second time in my life in a synagogue but the following poem that was read really struck a cord with me on the on-going debate about guns, gun violence, and Sandy Hook.

DISTURB US, Adonai, ruffle us from our complacency
Make us dissatisfied. Dissatisfied with the peace of
ignorance, the quietude which arises from a shunning of the
horror, the defeat, the bitterness and the poverty, physical
.and spiritual, of humans.........

I believe this is from one of the poems about Shabbat.

94 Kronocide  Wed, Dec 26, 2012 12:08:50pm

re: #73 Charles Johnson

[Embedded content]

Another wingnut ...

You had me at Another wingnut....

95 Holidays are Family Fun Time  Wed, Dec 26, 2012 12:08:54pm

re: #93 Big Steve

I had the opportunity to attend a Bat Mitzvah this past weekend. I am not one bit religious and this is my second time in my life in a synagogue but the following poem that was read really struck a cord with me on the on-going debate about guns, gun violence, and Sandy Hook.

I believe this is from one of the poems about Shabbat.

Oh, I so want the whole reference! I may have to put that in photoshop frame.

96 erik_t  Wed, Dec 26, 2012 12:10:15pm

I'm choosing to be irrationally optimistic this afternoon. Perhaps wingers are banging on this particular pot lid because they hope to distract from an NRA proposal that even they recognize is stupid (or at least politically poisonous).

Maybe it's a Festivus miracle/

97 Holidays are Family Fun Time  Wed, Dec 26, 2012 12:10:29pm

Strangely, or not, enough, I think the changing weather in the Mid-West (well everywhere) is going to change more minds than all the science and pundits put together.

98 Mattand  Wed, Dec 26, 2012 12:11:05pm

re: #76 Holidays are Family Fun Time

A right wing friend sent me a piece of propaganda about prayer in schools and gun control. I wrote back that we need to look at facts and leave emotion out of the conversation if we are going to establish meaningful policy.

I haven't heard back from my friend.

Slightly OT: Few years back, I got the "New Orleans got $40 billion in Katrina relief" e-mail from a friend who has gone full metal wingnut. I patiently pointed out how it was 50 shades of barely masked racist bullshit.

His response to point out that we need watch what our government does. My response was that you don't bolster your argument with a blatant lie.

Surprisingly, he doesn't send me e-mail anymore.

99 jaunte  Wed, Dec 26, 2012 12:11:20pm

re: #95 Holidays are Family Fun Time

Here's one:
[Link: books.google.com...]

100 Big Steve  Wed, Dec 26, 2012 12:11:24pm

re: #95 Holidays are Family Fun Time

Shabbat Service see page 16. BTW...the whole poem is about Shabbat and I will admit freely to anyone who is Jewish that I am completely missing the meaning. But to an atheist like me who heard it the first time, it struck a cord, and I had to go look it up.

101 wrenchwench  Wed, Dec 26, 2012 12:11:45pm

re: #96 erik_t

I'm choosing to be irrationally optimistic this afternoon.

I think you have to change your avatar for that.

102 Holidays are Family Fun Time  Wed, Dec 26, 2012 12:14:29pm
DISTURB US, Adonai, ruffle us from our complacency
Make us dissatisfied. Dissatisfied with the peace of
ignorance, the quietude which arises from a shunning of the
horror, the defeat, the bitterness and the poverty, physical
.and spiritual, of humans
Shock us, Adonai, deny to us the false Shabbat which gives us
;the delusions of satisfaction amid a world of war and hatred
Wake us, O God, and shake us
from the sweet and sad poignancies rendered by half
;forgotten melodies and rubric prayers of yesteryears
Make us know that the border of the sanctuary is not the
border of living and the walls of Your temples are not
.shelters from the winds of truth, justice and reality
;Disturb us, O God, and vex us
;let not Your Shabbat be a day of torpor and slumber
.let it be a time to be stirred and spurred to action
Baruch atah, Adonai, m'kadeish HaShabbat
103 watching you tiny alien kittens are  Wed, Dec 26, 2012 12:15:07pm

re: #49 Varek Raith

Do we even know if it was a real mag?

It was a prop, it has no bottom, David Gregory was holding it up with his thumb inserted up into the bottom of the magazine shell. NBC asked the police if a real mag would be legal and was told that it would not be. Do you really think they sent him out there with a functional magazine after being told that it would be criminal?

Just watch the video, feed lips at the top of the magazine, David Gregory's thumb inserted in the bottom. Not a complete or functional magazine, therefore not illegal.

104 Holidays are Family Fun Time  Wed, Dec 26, 2012 12:15:30pm

re: #100 Big Steve

Shabbat Service see page 16. BTW...the whole poem is about Shabbat and I will admit freely to anyone who is Jewish that I am completely missing the meaning. But to an atheist like me who heard it the first time, it struck a cord, and I had to go look it up.

I found the same reference

105 Holidays are Family Fun Time  Wed, Dec 26, 2012 12:16:01pm

re: #99 jaunte

Thanks, it's a meaningful prayer. I will have to ponder.

106 Holidays are Family Fun Time  Wed, Dec 26, 2012 12:17:53pm

re: #103 watching you tiny alien kittens are

It was a prop, it has no bottom, David Gregory was holding it up with his thumb inserted up into the bottom of the magazine shell. NBC asked the police if a real mag would be legal and was told that it would not be. Do you really think they sent him out there with a functional magazine after being told that it would be criminal?

Just watch the video, feed lips at the top of the magazine, David Gregory's thumb inserted in the bottom. Not a complete or functional magazine, therefore not illegal.

It's like the pic of Feinstein with her finger on the trigger from years ago. There is so much ignorance out there. If the NRA would spend 1/2 the funds it earmarks for Lobbying on true community education and awareness I might be inclined to support them in the current situation.

Hell, even if they would hold seminars for Congress I'd be impressed.

107 rwdflynavy  Wed, Dec 26, 2012 12:19:26pm

Lawyer outs journalists who released gun permit holder data

(Hoisted on petard)

108 erik_t  Wed, Dec 26, 2012 12:20:43pm

re: #107 Fart Knocker

Lawyer outs journalists who released gun permit holder data

(Hoisted on petard)

Having trouble mustering a whole lot of sympathy.

109 rwdflynavy  Wed, Dec 26, 2012 12:20:56pm

re: #108 erik_t

Having trouble mustering a whole lot of sympathy.

Me too.

110 Big Steve  Wed, Dec 26, 2012 12:21:53pm

re: #104 Holidays are Family Fun Time

I found the same reference

Yes...it is a prayer for God to vex us! If we humans cannot figure out that guns are not simply an artifact but are the root cause of the violence we see....well then the writers of that prayer are asking God to rock the boat. This is my humble interpretation.

111 Holidays are Family Fun Time  Wed, Dec 26, 2012 12:23:06pm

re: #100 Big Steve

Shabbat Service see page 16. BTW...the whole poem is about Shabbat and I will admit freely to anyone who is Jewish that I am completely missing the meaning. But to an atheist like me who heard it the first time, it struck a cord, and I had to go look it up.

It seems to be a call to action.

As one who was raised RC, I can see it as a request to be active in life, not passive. Live one's faith, in otherwords.

I heard something else a long time ago that struck me as a similar idea:

Love is verb.

112 Holidays are Family Fun Time  Wed, Dec 26, 2012 12:26:19pm

re: #110 Big Steve

Yes...it is a prayer for God to vex us! If we humans cannot figure out that guns are not simply an artifact but are the root cause of the violence we see....well then the writers of that prayer are asking God to rock the boat. This is my humble interpretation.

I could get very philosophical on this this. The root cause is that humans use their free will to hate/do violence. The means is the artifact.

Society, here on Earth, probably has more control over the means, than the root.

113 Eventual Carrion  Wed, Dec 26, 2012 12:26:24pm

re: #107 Fart Knocker

Lawyer outs journalists who released gun permit holder data

(Hoisted on petard)

Now correct me if I am wrong, but isn't the whole deterrent thing supposed to be that 'others' know you are packing or at least have one in your home that you can get to so they should bypass your place? If that is the case, then why be pissed if it is let out that you own one. Isn't that the whole idea?

114 Holidays are Family Fun Time  Wed, Dec 26, 2012 12:26:53pm

re: #113 Eventual Carrion

Now correct me if I am wrong, but isn't the whole deterrent thing supposed to be that 'others' know you are packing or at least have one in your home that you can get to so they should bypass your place? If that is the case, then why be pissed if it is let out that you own one. Isn't that the whole idea?

Private data, is private data.

115 erik_t  Wed, Dec 26, 2012 12:28:14pm

re: #113 Eventual Carrion

Now correct me if I am wrong, but isn't the whole deterrent thing supposed to be that 'others' know you are packing or at least have one in your home that you can get to so they should bypass your place? If that is the case, then why be pissed if it is let out that you own one. Isn't that the whole idea?

That is a popular attitude. It's obviously not the only one, otherwise nobody would ever seek a concealed-carry permit. Ascribing a certain point of idiocy to every gun owner is unfair, and acting on such an assumption is incredibly inappropriate.

116 Holidays are Family Fun Time  Wed, Dec 26, 2012 12:28:19pm

Going to see Tarantino with my kid.

Have a great afternoon all!

117 Eventual Carrion  Wed, Dec 26, 2012 12:28:47pm

re: #114 Holidays are Family Fun Time

Private data, is private data.

True, the question I guess should be "Why is it private data?".

118 Holidays are Family Fun Time  Wed, Dec 26, 2012 12:29:21pm

I think deterrance works because the "bad guys" don't know which house has a gun in it, therefore making them bypass entire neighborhoods.

119 Charles Johnson  Wed, Dec 26, 2012 12:29:55pm

re: #114 Holidays are Family Fun Time

Private data, is private data.

But it's not private data - the names and addresses of gun permit holders are publicly available. The newspaper didn't expose any private data.

120 Vicious Babushka  Wed, Dec 26, 2012 12:30:11pm

re: #100 Big Steve

Shabbat Service see page 16. BTW...the whole poem is about Shabbat and I will admit freely to anyone who is Jewish that I am completely missing the meaning. But to an atheist like me who heard it the first time, it struck a cord, and I had to go look it up.

OK that is a very weird prayer which has nothing to do with the Hebrew text. Here is the literal translation of the Hebrew prayer that is opposite to it on p. 16.

You have sanctified the seventh day to Your Name. The ultimate act of of the creation of heaven and earth. Blessed above all days, and sanctified for all time. And so it is written in Your Torah:

Heaven and Earth and all their hosts were completed.
And G-D ceased on the seventh day from all his creation which he had created.
And G-D blessed the seventh day and sanctified it.
For on it He did cease from all the creation with which he created it.

Our G-D and G-D of our ancestors!
Please be accepting of our repose.
Sanctify us in your commandments and give us a portion of your Torah.
Satisfy us with your goodness and make us rejoice in your salvation.
Purify our hearts to worship you in truth.
Motivate us Lord our G-D with love and inspiration to keep your holy Sabbath.
For on that day shall rest all Israel who sanctify your name.
Blessed are you Lord, who sanctified the Sabbath!

Nothing in there about disturbance and dissatisfaction. That's kind of creepy. Why would they do that?

121 Holidays are Family Fun Time  Wed, Dec 26, 2012 12:30:46pm

re: #117 Eventual Carrion

True, the question I guess should be "Why is it private data?".

because what is in my house is no one's business. It's also a list of which houses to watch to wait until no one is home and then steal any guns that may be there.

It'd be like listing every house that had a woman who loved jewelry or every house that had a luxury vehicle.

122 Holidays are Family Fun Time  Wed, Dec 26, 2012 12:31:33pm

re: #119 Charles Johnson

But it's not private data - the names and addresses of gun permit holders are publicly available. The newspaper didn't expose any private data.

hmmm, in Illinois it is. Have to check with DF. There was a big bru-haha a while back about it.

I really have to go now.

123 Charles Johnson  Wed, Dec 26, 2012 12:31:58pm

re: #121 Holidays are Family Fun Time

I think lohud.com was irresponsible to post the maps, but they did not release any data that was not already publicly available.

124 Political Atheist  Wed, Dec 26, 2012 12:33:08pm

re: #118 Holidays are Family Fun Time

Or a little farther along, bad guy runs from gun in owners hand.


re: #117 Eventual Carrion

The risk of the guns getting burgled is why you want this private IMO. These days most homes are empty all through the working day. I think we need to do all we can to prevent legal guns getting into criminal hands.

125 Tigger2  Wed, Dec 26, 2012 12:33:40pm

re: #119 Charles Johnson

But it's not private data - the names and addresses of gun permit holders are publicly available. The newspaper didn't expose any private data.

That has been reported on the news today, that it was public records.

126 Eventual Carrion  Wed, Dec 26, 2012 12:34:10pm

re: #118 Holidays are Family Fun Time

I think deterrance works because the "bad guys" don't know which house has a gun in it, therefore making them bypass entire neighborhoods.

Could be, but from my experience here in NW PA small town. Just about everyone has a gun of some kind in their house (I would guess upwards of 85% in my immediate neighborhood). Now this has never been a high crime area but break-ins still do happen even with an overwhelming population of guns.

127 erik_t  Wed, Dec 26, 2012 12:34:22pm

re: #119 Charles Johnson

But it's not private data - the names and addresses of gun permit holders are publicly available. The newspaper didn't expose any private data.

It became publicly available through a FOIA request. What previously required explicit effort and cause now requires firing up Google Maps.

I consider this to be an important distinction. The promulgation of this information is a very meaningful act.

128 Tigger2  Wed, Dec 26, 2012 12:35:46pm

re: #127 erik_t

It became publicly available through a FOIA request. What previously required explicit effort and cause now requires firing up Google Maps.

I consider this to be an important distinction. The promulgation of this information is a very meaningful act.

I would kind of like to know if any of my crazy neighbors are gun owners.
Because I have a couple that are what I consider fucking nuts.

129 erik_t  Wed, Dec 26, 2012 12:37:59pm

re: #128 Tigger2

I would kind of like to know if any of my crazy neighbors are gun owners.

I suggest, then, that you ask them.

130 dragonfire1981  Wed, Dec 26, 2012 12:38:02pm

re: #128 Tigger2

I would kind of like to know if any of my crazy neighbors are gun owners.

Count up the Gadsden flags around. That should give you a pretty good estimate.

131 Tigger2  Wed, Dec 26, 2012 12:38:59pm

re: #129 erik_t

I suggest, then, that you ask them.

They're fucking crazy ass right wingers I'm not asking them anything.

132 engineer cat  Wed, Dec 26, 2012 12:39:05pm

re: #120 Vicious Michigan Union Thug

OK that is a very weird prayer which has nothing to do with the Hebrew text. Here is the literal translation of the Hebrew prayer that is opposite to it on p. 16.

Nothing in there about disturbance and dissatisfaction. That's kind of creepy. Why would they do that?

judaism has first and foremost the obligation for us to consider how we treat other people, rather than our own fate after death or before. the prayer calls on us to not be satisfied and complacent merely because our own life is going well, but rather to wake ourselves up and remind ourselves of how full of grief the world really is, and of our obligation to do something about it

when i attended communion every week at the episcopalian parochial school i went to high school at, the part of the mass that sounded most similar to the synagogue services i'd attended in childhood was the part where they remember "those who are heavy laden"

133 Tigger2  Wed, Dec 26, 2012 12:40:50pm

re: #130 dragonfire1981
LOL

134 watching you tiny alien kittens are  Wed, Dec 26, 2012 12:43:08pm

re: #128 Tigger2

I would kind of like to know if any of my crazy neighbors are gun owners.

If you live in one of the few states that require gun registration, and if that state also allows the registration information to be publicly available (most do not) then you can find out. You just have to go to the clerk of the courts office and ask, then pay a service fee for time/copies and they will give you the info.

Good Luck with that....

135 erik_t  Wed, Dec 26, 2012 12:43:16pm

For that matter, IANAL but I'm not entirely convinced that this information was properly FOIA-able anyway.

Relevant portions of 5 U.S.C. 552, which essentially is the FOIA in toto:

§ 552. Public information; agency rules, opinions, orders, records, and proceedings

(a) Each agency shall make available to the public information as follows:

(legalese)

(b) This section does not apply to matters that are--

(7) records or information compiled for law enforcement purposes, but only to the extent that the production of such law enforcement records or information (A) could reasonably be expected to interfere with enforcement proceedings, (B) would deprive a person of a right to a fair trial or an impartial adjudication, (C) could reasonably be expected to constitute an unwarranted invasion of personal privacy, (D) could reasonably be expected to disclose the identity of a confidential source, including a State, local, or foreign agency or authority or any private institution which furnished information on a confidential basis, and, in the case of a record or information compiled by a criminal law enforcement authority in the course of a criminal investigation or by an agency conducting a lawful national security intelligence investigation, information furnished by a confidential source, (E) would disclose techniques and procedures for law enforcement investigations or prosecutions, or would disclose guidelines for law enforcement investigations or prosecutions if such disclosure could reasonably be expected to risk circumvention of the law, or (F) could reasonably be expected to endanger the life or physical safety of any individual;

136 Mattand  Wed, Dec 26, 2012 12:45:06pm

re: #130 dragonfire1981

Count up the Gadsden flags around. That should give you a pretty good estimate.

I had no idea that was what the "Don't Tread on Me" flags were officially called. I've got two in my neighborhood, with one on the same street as me.

I was explaining to my neighbor that the people who usually fly them can be counted on to exhibit some form of Tea Party delusion. He thinks I'm being judgmental. I just chuckle.

137 Killgore Trout  Wed, Dec 26, 2012 12:45:36pm

re: #108 erik_t

Having trouble mustering a whole lot of sympathy.

Two wrongs don't make a right. I'm not surprised this happened but it's still a very dangerous thing to do.

138 erik_t  Wed, Dec 26, 2012 12:46:14pm

re: #136 Mattand

I had no idea that was the "Don't Tread on Me" flags were officially called. I've got two in my neighborhood, with one on the same street as me.

I was explaining to my neighbor that the people who usually fly them can be counted on to exhibit some form of Tea Party delusion. He thinks I'm being judgmental. I just chuckle.

Or they like the Navy but they're kind of confused.

139 rwdflynavy  Wed, Dec 26, 2012 12:47:23pm

re: #138 erik_t

Or they like the Navy but they're kind of confused.

Beat me to it...

140 Kragar  Wed, Dec 26, 2012 12:48:07pm

Syrian Military Police Chief Defects To Join Rebels

“I, General Abdel Aziz Jassem al-Shallal, commander of Syrian military police, announce that I am defecting from the regime army, to join the people’s revolution,” he said in a publicly broadcast video recording. Shallal attributed his defection to his view that the Syrian military had abdicated its duty to protect the Syrian people and devolved into “gangs of killing and destruction.” There are also reports that the former general has taken shelter in Turkey, joining other military defectors who have sided with opposition forces.

141 engineer cat  Wed, Dec 26, 2012 12:49:00pm

re: #108 erik_t

Having trouble mustering a whole lot of sympathy.

what kind of mustard are you using?

142 rwdflynavy  Wed, Dec 26, 2012 12:49:50pm

re: #141 engineer cat

what kind of mustard are you using?

Great, now I'm hungry...

143 erik_t  Wed, Dec 26, 2012 12:49:58pm

re: #141 engineer cat

what kind of mustard are you using?

French's, because the other dee-jon kind is un-American.

/

144 Vicious Babushka  Wed, Dec 26, 2012 12:50:25pm

re: #132 engineer cat

judaism has first and foremost the obligation for us to consider how we treat other people, rather than our own fate after death or before. the prayer calls on us to not be satisfied and complacent merely because our own life is going well, but rather to wake ourselves up and remind ourselves of how full of grief the world really is, and of our obligation to do something about it

Well, OK, but this is supposed to be a Sabbath prayer and it's an intrusion into the sanctity and rest of the Sabbath day, in addition to be totally NOT a translation of the prayer that it's placed opposite on the brochure. You would think they could be honest about a translation, or if it is an original prayer and not a translation, then put it separate and don't mislead people.

It's not appropriate for Sabbath to tell people they have to feel dissatisfied and uncomfortable. In fact that kind of sucks.

145 rwdflynavy  Wed, Dec 26, 2012 12:50:38pm

re: #143 erik_t

French's, because the other dee-jon kind is un-American.

/

I prefer Freedom Mustard to French's.
//

146 Mattand  Wed, Dec 26, 2012 12:51:29pm

re: #138 erik_t

re: #139 rwdflynavy

Amazing the stuff I learn on this blog. First time I've ever seen that particular flag.

147 Ojoe  Wed, Dec 26, 2012 12:51:40pm

The oldest commissioned ship in the navy gets to fly the navy jack. I believe at the present, that is the carrier Enterprise, which was a-building in the late 1950s.

148 erik_t  Wed, Dec 26, 2012 12:52:58pm

re: #146 Mattand

re: #139 rwdflynavy

Amazing the stuff I learn on this blog. First time I've ever seen that particular flag.

erik's Law of Internet Commentary: a sufficiently large internet commentator-base trends towards the possession of the sum of human knowledge.

Unfortunately it's not very profound when you actually write it out that way.

149 Charles Johnson  Wed, Dec 26, 2012 12:53:06pm

re: #127 erik_t

It became publicly available through a FOIA request. What previously required explicit effort and cause now requires firing up Google Maps.

I consider this to be an important distinction. The promulgation of this information is a very meaningful act.

I see your point, but if it was available through FOIA, then that does mean it was already available to anyone who filed a request, whether it was actually published somewhere or not.

150 engineer cat  Wed, Dec 26, 2012 12:53:11pm

re: #144 Vicious Michigan Union Thug

Well, OK, but this is supposed to be a Sabbath prayer and it's an intrusion into the sanctity and rest of the Sabbath day, in addition to be totally NOT a translation of the prayer that it's placed opposite on the brochure. You would think they could be honest about a translation, or if it is an original prayer and not a translation, then put it separate and don't mislead people.

It's not appropriate for Sabbath to tell people they have to feel dissatisfied and uncomfortable. In fact that kind of sucks.

hmmm i'd say that the sabbath is a good time for moral contemplation

on the sabbath you are supposed to refrain from working, not thinking or feeling

151 celticdragon  Wed, Dec 26, 2012 12:53:15pm

re: #69 Holidays are Family Fun Time

Is it just me, or did this Christmas have a shadow hanging over it?

Yes, it did. The last two weeks have taken a lot of the spirit out of this season.

152 Mattand  Wed, Dec 26, 2012 12:56:50pm

re: #148 erik_t

erik's Law of Internet Commentary: a sufficiently large internet commentator-base trends towards the possession of the sum of human knowledge.

Unfortunately it's not very profound when you actually write it out that way.

Still doesn't explain LOLcats.com.

153 Vicious Babushka  Wed, Dec 26, 2012 12:57:57pm

re: #150 engineer cat

hmmm i'd say that the sabbath is a good time for moral contemplation

on the sabbath you are supposed to refrain from working, not thinking or feeling

And what does that have to do with this very weird, non-scriptural prayer that demands people have to be all dissatisfied and angry?

I think it was written by somebody who would rather be ANYWHERE than at services on Saturday morning so everyone can feel that stupefying boredom.

154 erik_t  Wed, Dec 26, 2012 12:58:34pm

re: #149 Charles Johnson

I see your point, but if it was available through FOIA, then that does mean it was already available to anyone who filed a request, whether it was actually published somewhere or not.

That's not strictly true. It was privileged by default, and was evaluated against the FOIA guidelines by a worker and judged to be releasable according to those guidelines.

155 steve_davis  Wed, Dec 26, 2012 12:59:18pm

re: #11 Mich-again

He doesn't understand that warmer air can absorb a lot more water than cooler air.

Yep. Pointed out, by the way, in a library book from the late 60's I stumbled across once that dealt with global climate change.

156 engineer cat  Wed, Dec 26, 2012 1:02:24pm

re: #153 Vicious Michigan Union Thug

And what does that have to do with this very weird, non-scriptural prayer that demands people have to be all dissatisfied and angry?

I think it was written by somebody who would rather be ANYWHERE than at services on Saturday morning so everyone can feel that stupefying boredom.

shabbat services would be on friday night

let not Your Shabbat be a day of torpor and slumber
let it be a time to be stirred and spurred to action

i think it's a worthy prayer

157 Charles Johnson  Wed, Dec 26, 2012 1:03:50pm

re: #154 erik_t

That's not strictly true. It was privileged by default, and was evaluated against the FOIA guidelines by a worker and judged to be releasable according to those guidelines.

Well, this is what lohud.com wrote about it on the page with their maps:

To create the map, The Journal News submitted Freedom of Information requests for the names and addresses of all pistol permit holders in Westchester, Rockland and Putnam. By state law, the information is public record.

158 rwdflynavy  Wed, Dec 26, 2012 1:03:53pm

re: #146 Mattand

re: #139 rwdflynavy

Amazing the stuff I learn on this blog. First time I've ever seen that particular flag.

The Navy brought it back after 9/11. I think it is a pretty sharp flag, but I'm a little biased.

159 Ojoe  Wed, Dec 26, 2012 1:04:49pm

The Enterprise is inactive now; some other ship gets to fly the Navy Jack.

[Link: www.enterprise.navy.mil...]

BBL

160 erik_t  Wed, Dec 26, 2012 1:07:01pm

re: #157 Charles Johnson

Well, this is what lohud.com wrote about it on the page with their maps:

Well, I guess I'm back to IANAL'ing. I'm deeply surprised that the information is treated so, but here we are.

I still think publishing it was stupid and irresponsible.

161 jaunte  Wed, Dec 26, 2012 1:08:49pm

This is cool:

Amazing Glitter-Sized Photovoltaic Cells Look Like Golden Snowflakes

As snowstorms sweep the country, researchers at Sandia National Laboratories are warming up our winter blues with the creation of these gorgeous snowflake-shaped photovoltaic cells. The glitter-sized solar sequins are made from crystalline silicon and use 100 times less material to generate the same amount of electricity as standard solar cells made from 6-inch square solar wafers.

More at Phys.org:

Offering a run for their money to conventional large wafers of crystalline silicon, electricity presently can be harvested from the Sandia-created cells with 14.9 percent efficiency. Off-the-shelf commercial modules range from 13 to 20 percent efficient. A widely used commercial tool called a pick-and-place machine — the current standard for the mass assembly of electronics — can place up to 130,000 pieces of glitter per hour at electrical contact points preestablished on the substrate; the placement takes place at cooler temperatures. The cost is approximately one-tenth of a cent per piece with the number of cells per module determined by the level of optical concentration and the size of the die, likely to be in the 10,000 to 50,000 cell per square meter range. An alternate technology, still at the lab-bench stage, involves self-assembly of the parts at even lower costs.
[Link: phys.org...]

162 rwdflynavy  Wed, Dec 26, 2012 1:09:56pm

re: #160 erik_t

Well, I guess I'm back to IANAL'ing. I'm deeply surprised that the information is treated so, but here we are.

I still think publishing it was stupid and irresponsible.

Imagine a similar map showing homes of parents with kindergartners. I'm sure that info is publicly available....

163 Ojoe  Wed, Dec 26, 2012 1:10:11pm

re: #160 erik_t

Publishing that info just might make some people who have been identified by default as having no pistol, want to go get one.

BBL really, to the drafting board now.

164 Amory Blaine  Wed, Dec 26, 2012 1:11:39pm

They're his friends. He should learn how they really are.

165 Vicious Babushka  Wed, Dec 26, 2012 1:12:02pm

re: #156 engineer cat

shabbat services would be on friday night

let not Your Shabbat be a day of torpor and slumber
let it be a time to be stirred and spurred to action

i think it's a worthy prayer

Shabbat begins on Friday night and lasts until Saturday night.

My point being that it is not only NOT a translation of the words it was put opposite but by demanding ACTION! and CHANGE THE WORLD! RIGHT NOW! it is a negation of the spirit of Sabbath. You can have all the ACTION! and CHANGE THE WORLD! RIGHT NOW! at the conclusion of the Sabbath.

166 lawhawk  Wed, Dec 26, 2012 1:12:22pm

re: #157 Charles Johnson

Yes, it falls into the statistics and records that have to be considered for release in a FOIA request. (This is the Rockland County FOIA page - and you can do online requests for information maintained by the county).

The information is part of the public record but it's not in a form that is useful unless you're going to take the time to compile it as they did in the paper. This particular release could have been done without the need to map it out as they did and instead used for statistical purposes - like finding out numbers of permits by zip/town/municipality without drilling down to actual addresses where the permits were registered. It was the depth of the information and the method of presenting that information that creates a public safety issue and the paper is shifting blame by claiming that it's a public record ignores that it created a public safety issue.

Consider that we could have gotten a lot more information by that same FOIA request by taking the information they got and showed per capita licenses per town or by zip. You get useful information without exposing any one person to potential harm.

Lohud was misguided and wrong.

167 watching you tiny alien kittens are  Wed, Dec 26, 2012 1:13:57pm

re: #154 erik_t

That's not strictly true. It was privileged by default, and was evaluated against the FOIA guidelines by a worker and judged to be releasable according to those guidelines.

Well what the newspaper that did this has to say on the matter is different than what you claim.

Access to information provided on pistol-license applications — such as the permit type, models of guns purchased and number of weapons owned — changed in 1994 when the state Legislature rewrote sections of the penal law covering licensure.

Before the amendment, the law said “the application for any license, if granted, shall be a public record.” The law now reads “the name and address of any person to whom an application for any license has been granted shall be a public record.” Many counties have interpreted that to mean any information beyond names and addresses is barred from public release.

But Robert Freeman, executive director of the state Committee on Open Government, said all government records and data are presumed public unless a specific statute bars their release. While names and addresses are specifically deemed public records, Freeman said, disclosure of additional data is left to the discretion of the custodians of pistol-permit records.

“There’s nothing in the law that prohibits the disclosure of additional information,” he said. “There’s simply no right of access to it.”

Look on page 3 of the article for this section.
[Link: www.lohud.com...]

168 Amory Blaine  Wed, Dec 26, 2012 1:16:38pm

re: #52 Charles Johnson

Look on the bright side, though - if Gregory is forced to step down from MTP, maybe they could hire someone who isn't a fluffy airhead for the job.

One can dream.

169 erik_t  Wed, Dec 26, 2012 1:17:13pm

re: #167 watching you tiny alien kittens are

Well what the newspaper that did this has to say on the matter is different than what you claim.

Look on page 3 of the article for this section.
[Link: www.lohud.com...]

Fair enough; I'm working from federal guidelines. That'll teach me.

170 erik_t  Wed, Dec 26, 2012 1:18:50pm

re: #166 lawhawk

Consider that we could have gotten a lot more information by that same FOIA request by taking the information they got and showed per capita licenses per town or by zip. You get useful information without exposing any one person to potential harm.

Lohud was misguided and wrong.

But if they'd taken a more nuanced approach, we in the rest of the country wouldn't be talking about and driving pageviews on their presumably shambling dead-tree paper.

(mutters about for-profit news media)

171 Mich-again  Wed, Dec 26, 2012 1:19:58pm

re: #113 Eventual Carrion

Now correct me if I am wrong, but isn't the whole deterrent thing supposed to be that 'others' know you are packing or at least have one in your home that you can get to so they should bypass your place? If that is the case, then why be pissed if it is let out that you own one. Isn't that the whole idea?

No the whole idea is to prepare to wage war against the government when the NRA members determine that the slow creep of socialism into the government finally merits the label tyranny justifying their use of all those assault weapons they've been stockpiling. What could be more patriotic? /

172 A Man for all Seasons  Wed, Dec 26, 2012 1:22:29pm

re: #166 lawhawk

I doubt anybody would put together that map in Oklahoma.. I don't think there is anyone here that doesn't own a gun, plus we have concealed carry and open carry laws. So maybe a map of who doesn't own registered guns in Oklahoma. Sparse to say the least but those folks probably just own unregistered guns

173 Tigger2  Wed, Dec 26, 2012 1:22:49pm

re: #171 Mich-again

No the whole idea is to prepare to wage war against the government when the NRA members determine that the slow creep of socialism into the government finally merits the label tyranny justifying their use of all those assault weapons they've been stockpiling. What could be more patriotic? /

In other words "a pipe dream"

174 lawhawk  Wed, Dec 26, 2012 1:23:30pm

re: #166 lawhawk

And the county records officials have to make a determination whether to grant the FOIA request. They can and do deny requests on a regular basis. It depends on who's in charge of determining the requests - some counties don't release this information while others have. It's at the discretion of the counties, but courts also play a role here - both in getting records and requests fulfilled in a timely fashion as well as denying access to some records on public safety grounds or other grounds.

175 Mich-again  Wed, Dec 26, 2012 1:25:56pm

The NRA exists to fight tyranny. Tyranny is anything the NRA doesn't like.

176 watching you tiny alien kittens are  Wed, Dec 26, 2012 1:26:20pm

re: #160 erik_t

Well, I guess I'm back to IANAL'ing. I'm deeply surprised that the information is treated so, but here we are.

I still think publishing it was stupid and irresponsible.

I think it was counter-productive as well. The NRA and gun owners in general have long fought against local gun registration, not to mention a national database over fears of what might be done with it. Now this stupid editor comes along with a personal crusade to make everything knowable known...because!

They are still waiting for the information from the third county they submitted a FOIA to and say that will still publish that information once they receive it. Additional they still want the other information, how many guns of what type each person has registered. For what? I just don't see any legitimate reason for them to do this.

177 Amory Blaine  Wed, Dec 26, 2012 1:26:23pm

They do it to sex offenders. To the chagrin of innocent landlords and other property owners. Not every sex offender is a child rapist. Some of them probably lust after mushy middle age white guy butts like mine so I want to know where they are. I have a right to know where the guns are in my neighborhood. They could be in the possession of a crazed wingnut.

178 rwdflynavy  Wed, Dec 26, 2012 1:26:31pm
179 lawhawk  Wed, Dec 26, 2012 1:27:44pm

Heh.

Looks like potentially conflicting answers and/or requests from different sources. ATF versus DC police. One gave the okay. The other said not so fast. Biggest media kerfuffle since the last one ensues.

180 rwdflynavy  Wed, Dec 26, 2012 1:28:50pm

re: #179 lawhawk

Heh.

[Embedded content]

Well, he looked like he broke the law and the media is always telling us perception is reality!!!11
//

181 A Man for all Seasons  Wed, Dec 26, 2012 1:32:19pm

I have watched MTP for years..There isn't a Sunday go by that I don't want to smack David's smirk off his face at some point in the show.

182 erik_t  Wed, Dec 26, 2012 1:32:53pm

re: #179 lawhawk

Looks like potentially conflicting answers and/or requests from different sources. ATF versus DC police. One gave the okay. The other said not so fast. Biggest media kerfuffle since the last one ensues.

Which still presumes it's a complete actual magazine anyway (something I think is, at least, debatable).

183 watching you tiny alien kittens are  Wed, Dec 26, 2012 1:35:30pm

re: #177 Amory Blaine

That is kind of the point, the newspaper claims this whole desire to publish this information arose because of one old man who shot a neighbor in the head. But the two pistols the old man had were not registered, he was violating state law to have them.

Why punish the law abiding gun owners who have complied with the law and registered their handguns when many others have not? Why treat them with suspicion and public scrutiny? Why do something that discourages people from complying with a law that far too many already flaunt?

Exactly what is it that the paper hopes to accomplish with this? What is the purpose here that serves the common good?

184 lawhawk  Wed, Dec 26, 2012 1:36:43pm

re: #182 erik_t

I am working off the assumption that it was a full working magazine, and even if it was a portion (substantially all or part), it would likely have still been a violation of the DC Code because it prohibits ownership unless you meet one of the requirements. If someone else who was a lawful owner gave him a stripped out magazine, that might be a different story.

185 Amory Blaine  Wed, Dec 26, 2012 1:36:53pm

How is publishing permits punishment? If I have a bubble tub installed in my house it becomes public knowledge that I have a new tub in my house. Am I being punished?

186 watching you tiny alien kittens are  Wed, Dec 26, 2012 1:37:33pm

re: #182 erik_t

Which still presumes it's a complete actual magazine anyway (something I think is, at least, debatable).

I don't, I have no doubt at all that it was nothing but the shell of a magazine, a prop, not a functional unit.

187 Bubblehead II  Wed, Dec 26, 2012 1:43:00pm

re: #182 erik_t

Which still presumes it's a complete actual magazine anyway (something I think is, at least, debatable).

Download the picture at the top of the page and zoom in on the mag. You can clearly see that it has no base plate. No base plate means no spring and follower. It was just an empty/nonfunctional shell.

188 erik_t  Wed, Dec 26, 2012 1:43:08pm

re: #185 Amory Blaine

How is publishing permits punishment? If I have a bubble tub installed in my house it becomes public knowledge that I have a new tub in my house. Am I being punished?

Your tub is not easily transportable, and I suspect half a million bathtubs are not stolen each year.

This sort of feigned obtuseness does the cause of greater regulation no favors.


* anything from a reputable .edu meets my legit-source criteria; if anyone can find anything better from a .gov, please do share.

189 engineer cat  Wed, Dec 26, 2012 1:43:38pm

re: #171 Mich-again

No the whole idea is to prepare to wage war against the government when the NRA members determine that the slow creep of socialism into the government finally merits the label tyranny justifying their use of all those assault weapons they've been stockpiling. What could be more patriotic? /

is the NRA opposed to the limitations on our 4th amendment rights to privacy in our personal records and communications legislated by the so-called "patriot" act?

unless they are opposed to the government being allowed increased surveillance i don't see how they can object to private citizens being allowed to propagate publicly available information

consistency is not just something found in peanut butter

190 Amory Blaine  Wed, Dec 26, 2012 1:55:53pm

re: #189 engineer cat

Many of these same people want to drug test food stamp recipients without batting an eyelash.

191 The Ghost of a Flea  Wed, Dec 26, 2012 1:57:48pm

re: #189 engineer cat

is the NRA opposed to the limitations on our 4th amendment rights to privacy in our personal records and communications legislated by the so-called "patriot" act?

unless they are opposed to the government being allowed increased surveillance i don't see how they can object to private citizens being allowed to propagate publicly available information

consistency is not just something found in peanut butter

Databases of the mentally ill: acceptable.

Registration of gun ownership: unacceptable.

Drug testing of welfare recipients: acceptable.

Any evaluative standards on gun ownership: unacceptable.

192 austin_blue  Wed, Dec 26, 2012 1:59:53pm

re: #187 Bubblehead II

Download the picture at the top of the page and zoom in on the mag. You can clearly see that it has no base plate. No base plate means no spring and follower. It was just an empty/nonfunctional shell.

Good catch. I surmised last night that it might not have a spring in it. Yes, Mr. Gregory is holding the Evil Metal Box!

193 engineer cat  Wed, Dec 26, 2012 2:00:48pm

re: #190 Amory Blaine

Many of these same people want to drug test food stamp recipients without batting an eyelash.

are there any "small government" conservative initiatives that don't involve less taxes for wealthy people/corporations or less consumer protection from pollution and guns?

194 rwdflynavy  Wed, Dec 26, 2012 2:02:12pm

re: #192 austin_blue

Good catch. I surmised last night that it might not have a spring in it. Yes, Mr. Gregory is holding the Evil Metal Box!

But just like a semi-automatic weapon can be quickly modified to fire automatic, this (possibly) dismantled magazine can be "remantled" into a death dealing high capacity magazine OF DEATH!!!11

195 erik_t  Wed, Dec 26, 2012 2:04:25pm

re: #194 rwdflynavy

But just like a semi-automatic weapon can be quickly modified to fire automatic, this (possibly) dismantled magazine can be "remantled" into a death dealing high capacity magazine OF DEATH!!!11

I propose we ban iron ore.

196 Amory Blaine  Wed, Dec 26, 2012 2:04:46pm

Clearly the only solution.

197 watching you tiny alien kittens are  Wed, Dec 26, 2012 2:05:44pm

re: #188 erik_t

Your tub is not easily transportable, and I suspect half a million bathtubs are not stolen each year.

This sort of feigned obtuseness does the cause of greater regulation no favors.

* anything from a reputable .edu meets my legit-source criteria; if anyone can find anything better from a .gov, please do share.

This report from the Bureau of Justice Statistics says about 232,000 guns stolen from households and another 30,000 stolen or "lost" from gun shops each year between 2005 and 2010.

It also notes that most states do not legally require you to report a stolen gun (in other words the number is actually higher).

[Link: bjs.ojp.usdoj.gov...]

The Coalition of Mayors against illegal guns meanwhile claims that the number is more like 600,000.
[Link: www.mayorsagainstillegalguns.org...]

198 Amory Blaine  Wed, Dec 26, 2012 2:07:10pm

Bronzer for everyone!!

199 dragonath  Wed, Dec 26, 2012 2:08:27pm

Just for the record, I came across a legendary Wingnut in the flesh last night, full-on "Obama's gonna take our guns" and "start a race war".

Who would have ever predicted that they'd be so chickenshit.

200 Amory Blaine  Wed, Dec 26, 2012 2:10:28pm

re: #199 dragonath

Christmas and other big holidays bring us into direct contact with these strange beings.

201 engineer cat  Wed, Dec 26, 2012 2:10:53pm

re: #195 erik_t

I propose we ban iron ore.

that goes along with my proposal to ban any technology more advanced than the neolithic until such time as homo sapiens sapiens proves itself mature enough to handle it

202 Amory Blaine  Wed, Dec 26, 2012 2:11:49pm

I had a pet rock. I'll get by.

203 Gus  Wed, Dec 26, 2012 2:13:08pm

Dear gun nuts trying to make the post Newtown debate into something about David Gregory, DC law, and a 30 round magazine on MTP. Fuck you. Sincerely, Gus.

204 freetoken  Wed, Dec 26, 2012 2:16:19pm

The hourly gunshot news feed:

Man shot dead in Norristown on Christmas

Officials find 'person of interest' in shooting death of Wisconsin police officer

Man fatally shot in Yuma; Police look for suspect

No Break in Crime in Fresno for the Holidays

Newton Fire/EMS

No arrest yet in shooting death of Enid man

That's just a sample of what comes across the wire on an hourly basis, with references to gunshots in crimes in this nation.

205 erik_t  Wed, Dec 26, 2012 2:16:33pm

re: #203 Gus

Dear gun nuts trying to make the post Newtown debate into something about David Gregory, DC law, and a 30 round magazine on MTP. Fuck you. Sincerely, Gus.

They sent a poet.

206 watching you tiny alien kittens are  Wed, Dec 26, 2012 2:16:45pm

re: #202 Amory Blaine

I had a pet rock. I'll get by.

Real flesh and blood pets are superior, if only because they are made of meat and therefore edible if the SHTF.

///

207 Gus  Wed, Dec 26, 2012 2:18:13pm

re: #205 erik_t

They sent a poet.

Thanks. Seriously. They're trying to steer the conversation to a different place. Gregory might have helped in this but we shouldn't lose sight of the larger issue here and not play into the hands of gun HOBBYISTS.

208 freetoken  Wed, Dec 26, 2012 2:18:39pm

I think the answer is pretty clear: we need to post armed guards 24/7 at every home, dwelling, building, and street intersection.

209 Amory Blaine  Wed, Dec 26, 2012 2:19:42pm

re: #202 Amory Blaine

I had a pet rock. I'll get by.

I didn't have a permit for it however...

210 Gus  Wed, Dec 26, 2012 2:21:10pm

re: #209 Amory Blaine

I didn't have a permit for it however...

Pet rocks ain't a protected rite in the Constertushin!!

211 CuriousLurker  Wed, Dec 26, 2012 2:22:07pm

re: #199 dragonath

Just for the record, I came across a legendary Wingnut in the flesh last night, full-on "Obama's gonna take our guns" and "start a race war".

Who would have ever predicted that they'd be so chickenshit.

My son called me the other night from North Carolina. He says the wingnuts he knows down there are in peak freak-out mode right now.

He’s liberal and voted for Obama, but he's also a pretty easy going guy who's not really into politics, so he’s just taking the meltdowns in stride with a sort of mildly amused puzzlement.

212 goddamnedfrank  Wed, Dec 26, 2012 2:22:44pm

re: #185 Amory Blaine

How is publishing permits punishment?

Immediately after posting that "they do it to sex offenders," a more deliberately obtuse, fatuous question could not be posed.

Permit holders have complied with the law, you're equating them status wise with convicted felons and rapists, advocating that they be publicly identified and intimidated.

213 dragonath  Wed, Dec 26, 2012 2:22:52pm

This Scientist Wants Tomorrow’s Troops to Be Mutant-Powered

Bioengineering people so they're better at killing each other.

OK.

214 Amory Blaine  Wed, Dec 26, 2012 2:25:36pm

I'm off to the neighborhood middle east/south asian store. He has the most fantastic prices on nag champa and bags of rice. Almost talked me into a Bollywood rental club last time.

215 CuriousLurker  Wed, Dec 26, 2012 2:26:17pm

re: #214 Amory Blaine

I'm off to the neighborhood middle east/south asian store. He has the most fantastic prices on nag champa and bags of rice. Almost talked me into a Bollywood rental club last time.

Ahhh, I can smell the spices from here...

216 watching you tiny alien kittens are  Wed, Dec 26, 2012 2:26:58pm

re: #208 freetoken

I think the answer is pretty clear: we need to post armed guards 24/7 at every home, dwelling, building, and street intersection.

If we legally require everyone above the age of 9 to carry a gun with them at all times there wouldn't be anymore gun crime!!!

At least not very much, not after the first couple of years of massive bloodletting.

///

217 Amory Blaine  Wed, Dec 26, 2012 2:26:59pm

So publishing sex offender whereabouts is openly advocating intimidating them?

218 dragonfire1981  Wed, Dec 26, 2012 2:27:49pm

re: #213 dragonath

This Scientist Wants Tomorrow’s Troops to Be Mutant-Powered

Bioengineering people so they're better at killing each other.

OK.

So the X-men comics were a sign of things to come?

219 watching you tiny alien kittens are  Wed, Dec 26, 2012 2:29:11pm

re: #213 dragonath

This Scientist Wants Tomorrow’s Troops to Be Mutant-Powered

Bioengineering people so they're better at killing each other.

OK.

He must have seen the new Bourne movie...

220 goddamnedfrank  Wed, Dec 26, 2012 2:29:40pm

re: #217 Amory Blaine

So publishing sex offender whereabouts is openly advocating intimidating them?

It carries that rather obvious risk. We accept that risk and mitigation of their rights because they've broken the law.

221 SteveMcG  Wed, Dec 26, 2012 2:30:05pm

I would have thought the people with permits would appreciate that newspaper telling the bad guys which houses NOT to rob.

222 Dr Lizardo  Wed, Dec 26, 2012 2:30:26pm

re: #211 CuriousLurker

I'm detecting peak wingnut meltdown when I look at the various right wing sites. I've got a bad feeling about this. I'm thinking there's another Tim McVeigh on the horizon.

223 CuriousLurker  Wed, Dec 26, 2012 2:32:10pm

re: #222 Dr Lizardo

I'm detecting peak wingnut meltdown when I look at the various right wing sites. I've got a bad feeling about this. I'm thinking there's another Tim McVeigh on the horizon.

E gad, don't say that. Don't even think it. *shudder*

224 goddamnedfrank  Wed, Dec 26, 2012 2:32:56pm

re: #221 SteveMcG

I would have thought the people with permits would appreciate that newspaper telling the bad guys which houses NOT to rob.

More word play, it tells the bad guys which houses to burgle. Wait for the homeowners to leave and then hope the houses aren't alarmed and the guns aren't locked up in safes.

The benefit to society is what exactly?

225 Kragar  Wed, Dec 26, 2012 2:33:03pm

re: #213 dragonath

This Scientist Wants Tomorrow’s Troops to Be Mutant-Powered

Bioengineering people so they're better at killing each other.

OK.

Next stop, Astartes.

226 erik_t  Wed, Dec 26, 2012 2:34:25pm

re: #221 SteveMcG

I would have thought the people with permits would appreciate that newspaper telling the bad guys which houses NOT to rob.

I'm pretty sure I've seen signs posted to that effect on a number of different private residences. Curiously, these people were able to declare their gun ownership all by themselves; they didn't need the newspaper's help.

227 Gus  Wed, Dec 26, 2012 2:35:24pm

Thanks goodness that Tennessee or Oklahoma never tried to make abortion doctors or women who have had an abortion public information. Whew.

228 erik_t  Wed, Dec 26, 2012 2:36:30pm

re: #227 Gus

Thanks goodness that Tennessee or Oklahoma never tried to make abortion doctors or women who have had an abortion public information. Whew.

Nah, that's just good old fashioned shame. Not like VIOLATIN' THAT CONSTITUTION 'MENDMENT WHAT GRANTS ME THE RIGHTS TO OWN ALL THE GUNZ

229 CuriousLurker  Wed, Dec 26, 2012 2:37:54pm

re: #224 goddamnedfrank

More word play, it tells the bad guys which houses to burgle. Wait for the homeowners to leave and then hope the houses aren't alarmed and the guns aren't locked up in safes.

The benefit to society is what exactly?

Indeed. I looked up an ex-employer and the relative of my current employer. The former lives in a house in an upscale neighborhood and doesn't have a permit, but both neighbors to his right do. The latter lives in a nice apartment complex in which only one person has a permit, so that one might be a good target as the chances of getting shot would probably be minimal.

230 Gus  Wed, Dec 26, 2012 2:37:57pm

re: #228 erik_t

Nah, that's just good old fashioned shame. Not like VIOLATIN' THAT CONSTITUTION 'MENDMENT WHAT GRANTS ME THE RIGHTS TO OWN ALL THE GUNZ

Abortion ain't a protected rite in the Constertushin!!

231 Dr Lizardo  Wed, Dec 26, 2012 2:38:44pm

re: #223 CuriousLurker

E gad, don't say that. Don't even think it. *shudder*

I hate to, but it's the "vibe" I'm picking up from the RWNJ's lately. It's approaching critical mass. It's just a gut feeling, not really anything empirical, but it was the same feeling I had before the OKC bombing. I remember going to some of the gun shows about two or three months before that event, and you could feel something in the air, clearly not something good. Like a keg of dynamite searching for a spark.

232 freetoken  Wed, Dec 26, 2012 2:38:59pm

re: #213 dragonath

This Scientist Wants Tomorrow’s Troops to Be Mutant-Powered

Bioengineering people so they're better at killing each other.

OK.

Enhanced humans are the future of mankind.

We could even engineer gunsights right into the arms, along with the rest of the firing mechanism, and range finders into the eyes.

233 freetoken  Wed, Dec 26, 2012 2:39:38pm

re: #231 Dr Lizardo

They're continuing a multi-decadal meltdown. Many of them never got over 1965 anyway.

234 CuriousLurker  Wed, Dec 26, 2012 2:41:31pm

re: #231 Dr Lizardo

I hate to, but it's the "vibe" I'm picking up from the RWNJ's lately. It's approaching critical mass. It's just a gut feeling, not really anything empirical, but it was the same feeling I had before the OKC bombing. I remember going to some of the gun shows about two or three months before that event, and you could feel something in the air, clearly not something good. Like a keg of dynamite searching for a spark.

I hear you. Ugh. Times like these make me really glad I live in an urban area in a blue state. I'm sure if I was still back in TX the vibe would be totally different.

235 efuseakay  Wed, Dec 26, 2012 2:42:12pm

Non-functioning high-capacity assault rifle magazine props don't kill people. People kill people.

237 Gus  Wed, Dec 26, 2012 2:45:19pm
238 erik_t  Wed, Dec 26, 2012 2:45:54pm

re: #236 Gus

Multi-Angle: Grasshopper 12-Story Test Flight 12/17/12

It's cool, but logarithms are a harsh, harsh mistress. Powered landing is never, ever going to make sense with any sort of chemical rockets we understand to be possible. Unless you're refueling on the moon or something.

I suppose Musk is free to fritter away his money on whatever rocketry endeavor he chooses, but I wish he'd pick something with more obvious payoff.

239 Bubblehead II  Wed, Dec 26, 2012 2:48:19pm

re: #192 austin_blue

Good catch. I surmised last night that it might not have a spring in it. Yes, Mr. Gregory is holding the Evil Metal Box!

Thanks, but I wasn't the one who originally pointed this out. It was another Lizard on a previous page.

240 Dr Lizardo  Wed, Dec 26, 2012 2:48:43pm

re: #233 freetoken

They're continuing a multi-decadal meltdown. Many of them never got over 1965 anyway.

True enough.

241 Kragar  Wed, Dec 26, 2012 2:49:30pm

re: #237 Gus

[Embedded content]

Starting with Breitbart and Fox News?

242 Dr Lizardo  Wed, Dec 26, 2012 2:49:42pm

re: #234 CuriousLurker

I hear you. Ugh. Times like these make me really glad I live in an urban area in a blue state. I'm sure if I was still back in TX the vibe would be totally different.

Times like this make me glad I don't live in the USA. I can only imagine the vibe in Texas, outside of the big metro areas. Wingnut central.

243 dragonath  Wed, Dec 26, 2012 2:49:59pm

re: #218 dragonfire1981

So the X-men comics were a sign of things to come?

I was kind of thinking about the scientists in Akira.

244 freetoken  Wed, Dec 26, 2012 2:53:35pm

An original -

It Came Upon a Fiscal Cliff

1. It came upon the fiscal cliff,
That glorious song of old,
From lobbyists bending near the earth
To touch their Rands of gold;
"Peace on the earth, good will to men
From K Street's all-gracious 501C's" –
The nation in solemn stillness lay
To watch the Charlie's Angels sing.

2. Still through the boardrooms they come
With peaceful wallets unfurled,
And still their Nashville music floats
O'er all the weary world;
Above its sad and gun-shot plains
They bend on hovering Lears,
And ever o'er its Google-sounds
The blessed reality stars sing.

3. But with the woes of debt and credit
The world has suffered long;
Beneath the corporate-strain have rolled
Two Administrations of wrong;
And man, at war with man, hears not
The promise of moar guns which they bring; –
O hush the noise, ye men of strife,
And hear the Justin Bieber sing!

4. And ye, beneath BofA's crushing load,
Whose tax forms are bending low,
Who toil along the climbing corporate ladders
With painful steps and slow,
Look now! for glad and golden globes
Come swiftly on the wing; –
Oh, rest beside the weary NASCAR track
And hear the Katy Perry sing!

5. For lo! the days are hastening on
By TV hucksters foretold,
When, with the ever circling years
Shall come the age of GOLD!!;
When GUNS!! shall over all the earth,
Its ancient splendors fling,
And the whole world give back the song,
Which now the warmongers sing.

245 Gus  Wed, Dec 26, 2012 2:54:16pm
246 Gus  Wed, Dec 26, 2012 2:54:40pm
247 freetoken  Wed, Dec 26, 2012 2:56:26pm

Maybe I'll Page that.

248 erik_t  Wed, Dec 26, 2012 2:57:30pm

re: #245 Gus

OBVIOUSLY BECAUSE OF THE EXPIRATION OF THE ASSAULT WEAPONS BAN!!!1

249 CuriousLurker  Wed, Dec 26, 2012 2:58:39pm

re: #246 Gus

[Embedded content]

Yeah, 'cause everyone knows those guys over at Mother Jones blue dog democrats. //

250 SteveMcG  Wed, Dec 26, 2012 3:00:09pm

I'm not that hip about twitter, but that Dick Armey thing sure looks like it's more than 140 characters.

251 Gus  Wed, Dec 26, 2012 3:00:55pm

re: #249 CuriousLurker

Yeah, 'cause everyone knows those guys over at Mother Jones blue dog democrats. //

After all this Dick Armey is still clueless.

252 Kragar  Wed, Dec 26, 2012 3:01:20pm

re: #250 SteveMcG

I'm not that hip about twitter, but that Dick Armey thing sure looks like it's more than 140 characters.

Its an embeded screenshot of the text.

253 Gus  Wed, Dec 26, 2012 3:01:22pm

re: #250 SteveMcG

I'm not that hip about twitter, but that Dick Armey thing sure looks like it's more than 140 characters.

That's an image attachment.

254 Dark_Falcon  Wed, Dec 26, 2012 3:11:07pm

re: #107 rwdflynavy

Lawyer outs journalists who released gun permit holder data

(Hoisted on petard)

Turnabout is fair play.

255 Decatur Deb  Wed, Dec 26, 2012 3:13:41pm

re: #201 engineer cat

that goes along with my proposal to ban any technology more advanced than the neolithic until such time as homo sapiens sapiens proves itself mature enough to handle it

Do it, and I'll rule the town with my repeating atl-atl.

256 CuriousLurker  Wed, Dec 26, 2012 3:16:01pm

re: #245 Gus

[Embedded content]

I was looking at the requirements for handgun permits in NY the other day--they're really strict:

NY State Police - Firearms: Pistol Permit Bureau

Bureau responsibilities

All records of transaction and pistol permits issued in the state are forwarded to the Pistol Permit Bureau for entry into a master database maintained by NYSP. Documents are filed by county and type of transaction. A paper trail is established for each handgun lawfully possessed in NYS; thus, a handgun can be tracked from owner to owner. Current ownership of the weapon and the legality of a person's possession of the weapon can be quickly determined.

Instantly, Bureau personnel are able to provide police investigators from agencies across the country with information pertaining to handguns that may have been involved in the commission of a crime.

Pistol Permit Bureau personnel:

• Help answer questions pertaining to the pistol permit process for police agencies, elected representatives and the public.

• Provide documentation to law enforcement agencies regarding a person's right to possess a specific handgun, instantly giving information on gun ownership and licenses.

• Keep track of handguns personally owned and possessed by law enforcement personnel.

• Track inventory of weapons (machineguns, handguns, short-barreled rifles or shotguns) that are subject to regulations and independently stored by law enforcement agencies.

• Oversee, review and authorize the destruction of nuisance weapons by state law enforcement agencies.

Additionally, New York does not recognize concealed handgun permits from other states. Here are more details on how thoroughly they dig into your background (emphasis mine):

Here is where the states in which these shootings occurred differ from New York. Legal handgun ownership in New York requires a pistol permit — for either possession in the home or to carry concealed — that involves several steps. Beyond the minimum national background check standard followed by most states, applicants in New York are photographed and fingerprinted, and they must provide a reason for why they want the permit. They must provide four character references who must personally sign the application (and be "well acquainted" with the applicant), and who are then interviewed by the police, who also conduct secondary interviews. The applicant also must complete a gun training class and is personally interviewed by the police, who then make a recommendation to a judge for a final decision. In all, the process takes several months.

Source: Syracuse.com

257 Dark_Falcon  Wed, Dec 26, 2012 3:17:18pm

re: #244 freetoken

An original -

It Came Upon a Fiscal Cliff

Let me just post something for you while you're thinking those thoughts.

258 Gus  Wed, Dec 26, 2012 3:24:33pm

re: #257 Dark_Falcon

Let me just post something for you while you're thinking those thoughts.

Gross.

259 freetoken  Wed, Dec 26, 2012 3:26:08pm

re: #257 Dark_Falcon

The closest I would come to acknowledging the Kardashians in the songs was "reality stars" - I didn't want to give them any more props.

260 Dark_Falcon  Wed, Dec 26, 2012 3:29:46pm

re: #259 freetoken

The closest I would come to acknowledging the Kardashians in the songs was "reality stars" - I didn't want to give them any more props.

I know. I'm just messing with you.

261 CuriousLurker  Wed, Dec 26, 2012 3:41:20pm

re: #254 Dark_Falcon

Turnabout is fair play.

Did you read the article? In addition to addresses & phone numbers the lawyer also posted photos of one female reporter's family and car. That's not okay.

262 Dark_Falcon  Wed, Dec 26, 2012 3:50:41pm

re: #261 CuriousLurker

Did you read the article? In addition to addresses & phone numbers the lawyer also posted photos of one female reporter's family and car. That's not okay.

No, I didn't read that.

263 Shiplord Kirel  Wed, Dec 26, 2012 4:28:47pm

re: #242 Dr Lizardo

Times like this make me glad I don't live in the USA. I can only imagine the vibe in Texas, outside of the big metro areas. Wingnut central.

I am in Texas, and it is more than a vibe here. As we saw with Judge Head's UN occupation remarks, conspiracy theories and the federal government as enemy are taken for granted here. The nuts are truly in charge of the asylum and they are massively armed.
Conspiracy culture is quite a bit more elaborate now than it was in McVeigh's time. Any future terrorism could well target academic, corporate, or NGO interests as well as the government itself.

264 efuseakay  Wed, Dec 26, 2012 4:55:00pm

re: #246 Gus

[Embedded content]

Dick Armey. Is he head of the Dick Army?

265 Tigger2005  Wed, Dec 26, 2012 10:20:53pm

re: #263 Shiplord Kirel

I am in Texas, and it is more than a vibe here. As we saw with Judge Head's UN occupation remarks, conspiracy theories and the federal government as enemy are taken for granted here. The nuts are truly in charge of the asylum and they are massively armed.
Conspiracy culture is quite a bit more elaborate now than it was in McVeigh's time. Any future terrorism could well target academic, corporate, or NGO interests as well as the government itself.

It used to feel like this country naturally gravitated toward the center and away from extremism. Yes, we've had periods of extremism...the Civil War, the widespread popularity of the Klan in the 20's, the Red Scare, the small left-wing groups like the Weather Underground in the 60's, etc. But they always seemed to die out, lose their fire. This right-wing extremism just feels different and scarier. These people are so completely lost in their fake history, their fake political narrative. It's surreal. They're totally detached from reality. All their thought processes, such as they are, are based on false premises...it's garbage in, garbage out. Even their candidate for President was stunned he lost the election because he believed all the crap he was being fed.

I don't know if it's possible to reach them any more and pull them back into the real world. Their whole identity and sense of self-worth is now dependent on believing their own propaganda. The whole package--science bad, atheism bad, intellectualism bad, abortion murder, taxes bad, government evil, UN evil, guns good, white Christian culture good, everything else bad, Obama an atheist muslim anti-American foreigner, making the rich richer good, 47% are moochers who want free stuff, etc. etc. etc. Absolutely nothing is too crazy or beyond the pale for them now. The ignorance and insanity and paranoia just keeps feeding on itself and growing more and more extreme.


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