Baghdad Sean Spicer: Trump Won’t Withdraw His Spurious “Wiretap” Charge Until It’s Disproved

Trump is sticking to his story until it’s proven false
Politics • Views: 43,937

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Another ridiculous moment from the Trump administration today, as press secretary Sean Spicer completely inverts the normal rules of evidence and logic, and says Trump won’t withdraw his conspiracy theory that President Obama “wiretapped” him during the campaign until it’s investigated by the Senate Intelligence Committee.

So Spicer is saying we have to find out whether it’s true or not. Oddly enough, that’s something Trump didn’t bother to do himself before blasting this accusation to the world, based on right wing blog posts and talk radio.

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210 comments
1
Ace Rothstein  Mar 7, 2017 • 11:55:06am

2
Major Tom  Mar 7, 2017 • 11:56:20am

Still under audit says the man.

3
GlutenFreeJesus  Mar 7, 2017 • 11:56:30am

That’s not how it works, Spicy.

4
Major Tom  Mar 7, 2017 • 11:58:20am

“Audits are typically scheduled for three months from beginning to end, which includes four weeks of planning, four weeks of fieldwork and four weeks of compiling the audit report. The auditors are generally working on multiple projects in addition to your audit. The auditors’ time will be divided among all of their projects, with some weeks heavily focused on your audit and other weeks less focused on your audit.”
rmas.fad.harvard.edu

Am I missing something?

5
Backwoods_Sleuth  Mar 7, 2017 • 11:58:40am
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6
calochortus  Mar 7, 2017 • 11:59:52am

re: #4 Major Tom

“Audits are typically scheduled for three months from beginning to end, which includes four weeks of planning, four weeks of fieldwork and four weeks of compiling the audit report. The auditors are generally working on multiple projects in addition to your audit. The auditors’ time will be divided among all of their projects, with some weeks heavily focused on your audit and other weeks less focused on your audit.”
rmas.fad.harvard.edu

Am I missing something?

Trump is lying?

7
Ace Rothstein  Mar 7, 2017 • 11:59:55am

re: #4 Major Tom

Am I missing something?

Nyet.

8
Charles Johnson  Mar 7, 2017 • 12:00:10pm

lolwut?

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9
Wendell Zurkowitz ((slave to the waffle light))  Mar 7, 2017 • 12:00:25pm

re: #3 GlutenFreeJesus

That’s not how it works, Spicy.

That’s not how it worked.

But Trump has turned all the rules and conventions of campaigning, governing and reporting upside down. And he will continue to get away with it as long as the Press goes along with him.

10
Backwoods_Sleuth  Mar 7, 2017 • 12:01:17pm

Should Trump’s tweet about alleged wire taps be taken at face value? “Sure it should, of course it — I mean, why wouldn’t — no”

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11
Backwoods_Sleuth  Mar 7, 2017 • 12:01:50pm
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12
Major Tom  Mar 7, 2017 • 12:02:14pm

forbes.com

“The IRS Wealth Squad. The IRS maintains a specialized, experienced group of examiners solely focused on conducting audits of high-income/high-wealth taxpayers - the Global High Wealth Industry Group of the IRS Large Business and International division (commonly referred to as the IRS “Wealth Squad”).”

…

“These examinations often take years to complete and as current tax returns are filed, the examiner often seeks to at least review reportable positions within the currently filed returns as part of the ongoing examination process.”

13
Targetpractice  Mar 7, 2017 • 12:02:40pm

re: #11 Backwoods_Sleuth

[Embedded content]

Translation: “He’s got jack shit and he’s wanting to send Congress on a fishing expedition.”

14
I Would Prefer Not To  Mar 7, 2017 • 12:04:46pm

1) I really hate Spicer.

AND.

2) He has the worst job in the world.

15
Sir John Barron  Mar 7, 2017 • 12:05:07pm

re: #11 Backwoods_Sleuth

These people are so breathtakingly dumb it’s a miracle the country is still standing after less than two months of their “leadership”.

16
Clearly a Country For Sick Old Haters  Mar 7, 2017 • 12:07:45pm

re: #14 I Would Prefer Not To

1) I really hate Spicer.

AND.

2) He has the worst job in the world.

So it’s working out pretty well for you then. Spicer is caught in a hell he helped make.

17
Major Tom  Mar 7, 2017 • 12:07:56pm

cnn.com

donaldjtrump.com

Has been under continuous IRS Audit since 2002, however years 2002 - 2008 are completed.

18
Kragar  Mar 7, 2017 • 12:08:59pm
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19
I Would Prefer Not To  Mar 7, 2017 • 12:09:03pm

re: #16 Clearly a Country For Sick Old Haters

So it’s working out pretty well for you then. Spicer is caught in a hell he helped make.

Didn’t think of it this way. But yes, the entire Trump team designed their own circle of hell. They may not know it yet, but they will learn.

20
I Would Prefer Not To  Mar 7, 2017 • 12:11:13pm

Uncle Ben

Love the Facebooks

21
Major Tom  Mar 7, 2017 • 12:12:00pm

re: #17 Major Tom

cnn.com

donaldjtrump.com

Has been under continuous IRS Audit since 2002, however years 2002 - 2008 are completed.

“Your returns report items that are attributable to continuous transactions or activities that were also reported on returns for 2008 and earlier. In this sense, (Emphasis mine) the pending examinations are continuations of prior, closed examinations.”

That’s his argument. Cause and effect exists, all actions being related somewhat, I can’t comment on items that were subject to past investigations because they are tangentially related, in my own logic, to anything occurring in the last few years, as those years are being investigated.

22
Ace Rothstein  Mar 7, 2017 • 12:13:02pm

re: #17 Major Tom

I don’t believe either one of those letters are legitimate.

23
goddamnedfrank  Mar 7, 2017 • 12:13:54pm

When you’ve lost The Coultergeist …

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24
Kragar  Mar 7, 2017 • 12:14:50pm
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25
gocart mozart  Mar 7, 2017 • 12:15:51pm
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26
Clearly a Country For Sick Old Haters  Mar 7, 2017 • 12:17:15pm

re: #23 goddamnedfrank

When you’ve lost The Coultergeist …

[Embedded content]

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Blind Frog Belly White  Mar 7, 2017 • 12:18:19pm

re: #25 gocart mozart

[Embedded content]

My favorite take on Trumpcare, from Paul Krugman:

“We must propose something to replace Obamacare. This is something. Therefore we must propose it.”

28
Targetpractice  Mar 7, 2017 • 12:20:51pm

re: #26 Clearly a Country For Sick Old Haters

[Embedded content]

The wingnuts wanted full repeal, so that we could then spend months debating a replacement that would never find the votes to become law. They live in a fantasy world where the GOP is in a position to dictate terms, that if they can’t get Democrats to support the final bill, they can just use the nuclear option to end the filibuster and pass it over their opposition.

Or, for those playing the home game, the wingnuts want the GOP to do exactly what they’ve spent years insisting the DNC did to make Obamacare a reality.

29
Blind Frog Belly White  Mar 7, 2017 • 12:21:14pm
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When your party is comprised of idiots on the one hand, and fiends on the other, policymaking is difficult.

30
darthstar  Mar 7, 2017 • 12:24:40pm
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31
lawhawk  Mar 7, 2017 • 12:25:45pm

re: #12 Major Tom

Given that Trump’s got a ton of privately held businesses that are often pass-through entities or sole proprietorships, he’s got a ton of individual entities that have to be reviewed. That’s all to hide/obfuscate his wealth, income, and shield him from taxes. It can be done legally, as with a NOL that can reduce tax due to losses from prior years carried forward. He had one of those billion dollar NOLs that may still be affecting his returns, meaning that he’s still not paying income tax. The circumstances of that NOL is still weird, given that other casinos were doing well when his went crap up.

32
darthstar  Mar 7, 2017 • 12:25:46pm

re: #10 Backwoods_Sleuth

Damnit…Spicey was on live TV and I missed the shitshow?

33
Blind Frog Belly White  Mar 7, 2017 • 12:26:05pm

re: #26 Clearly a Country For Sick Old Haters

Coulter’s problem - indeed, most of the Right’s problem with the bill is it doesn’t fuck poor and working people hard enough. Meanwhile, the working people who voted for Trump and thought they’d get ‘something fantastic’ will get REAMED. And none of the GOP Governors who have benefited from the ACA are going to like this.

Oh, and it empties the Medicare Trust Fund by 2024.

All so that the richest rich people in the history of rich people can be a little richer.

34
Big Beautiful Door  Mar 7, 2017 • 12:26:21pm

According to Jason Chaffetz, all we need to do to make healthcare affordable is to quit buying iPhones. Down with Apple!

slate.com

35
Targetpractice  Mar 7, 2017 • 12:27:14pm

See, the difference between the wingnuts and Bros is that, if the GOP loses either house next year during the midterms, the former won’t bitch that Trump had total control over Congress and could have passed whatever he wanted. They’ll find a way to blame Democrats or they’ll blame “cucks” like Ryan as an excuse to primary them come reelection.

36
Kragar  Mar 7, 2017 • 12:27:30pm
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37
Major Tom  Mar 7, 2017 • 12:27:53pm
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Homer Jumps Springfield Gorge

38
Blind Frog Belly White  Mar 7, 2017 • 12:28:27pm

re: #32 darthstar

Damnit…Spicey was on live TV and I missed the shitshow?

The best part was him trying to answer a reporter who asked why, if the President has the proof that Obama wiretapped him, is he asking for Congress to investigate, when he could just RELEASE THE PROOF?

Spicey danced around “there’s a Separation Of Powers issue”.

39
darthstar  Mar 7, 2017 • 12:28:39pm
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40
Targetpractice  Mar 7, 2017 • 12:29:14pm

And let’s bear in mind that this bill isn’t the totality of the GOP’s intentions, it’s just Step One. What this bill is is everything they can get passed through reconciliation, which is why it deals almost exclusively with taxation and budgeting. Further deregulation and fucking of the poor will take a separate bill, one that they will have to find a minimum of 8 Democrats to support.

41
darthstar  Mar 7, 2017 • 12:29:58pm

re: #37 Major Tom

Wait…that’s illegal? Why? He didn’t touch anything on the road.

42
Clearly a Country For Sick Old Haters  Mar 7, 2017 • 12:30:33pm

re: #41 darthstar

Wait…that’s illegal? Why? He didn’t touch anything on the road.

He could have if anything came off the bike.

43
KGxvi  Mar 7, 2017 • 12:32:27pm

re: #13 Targetpractice

Translation: “He’s got jack shit and he’s wanting to send Congress on a fishing expedition.”

Yes, because the executive branch asking the legislature to investigate the executive branch always works out for the executive branch…

Seriously, do they not realize that these are the kinds of investigations always end up biting you in the ass?

THEY WIRETAPPED US! INVESTIGATE THEM!!!

We looked into it, um, are you suuuuuure you want this made public?

YES!! WE’RE GONNA GET THAT UPPITY NI…

Um, so, yeah, turns out y’all did a whole bunch of illegal shit.

Dems: so, you want us to draft the Articles, or will you?

44
Blind Frog Belly White  Mar 7, 2017 • 12:32:55pm

re: #40 Targetpractice

And let’s bear in mind that this bill isn’t the totality of the GOP’s intentions, it’s just Step One. What this bill is is everything they can get passed through reconciliation, which is why it deals almost exclusively with taxation and budgeting. Further deregulation and fucking of the poor will take a separate bill, one that they will have to find a minimum of 8 Democrats to support.

Right, they have to ignite the Race To The Bottom, aka “selling insurance across state lines”. They like to say it’ll be like car insurance, but each state still regulates its own car insurance.

I think this bill might get rid of minimal coverage standards, so you can once more buy insurance for less money that does absolutely nothing you need it to.

45
Joe Bacon  Mar 7, 2017 • 12:34:08pm
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46
Targetpractice  Mar 7, 2017 • 12:34:20pm

re: #43 KGxvi

Yes, because the executive branch asking the legislature to investigate the executive branch always works out for the executive branch…

Seriously, do they not realize that these are the kinds of investigations always end up biting you in the ass?

THEY WIRETAPPED US! INVESTIGATE THEM!!!

We looked into it, um, are you suuuuuure you want this made public?

YES!! WE’RE GONNA GET THAT UPPITY NI…

Um, so, yeah, turns out y’all did a whole bunch of illegal shit.

Dems: so, you want us to draft the Articles, or will you?

That’s rather the point, get Congressional Repubs to do it for the purposes of burying anything inconvenient to the administration. If they had any real intention of finding out the truth, they’d appoint a special prosecutor. Problem is a special prosecutor, once appointed, can’t easily be kept on a leash without making the whole thing into a joke.

47
Major Tom  Mar 7, 2017 • 12:34:53pm

Strangely intimidating, if real… ;)

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48
Targetpractice  Mar 7, 2017 • 12:35:29pm

re: #45 Joe Bacon

[Embedded content]

A rich white asshole who will never have to worry about going bankrupt from a medical emergency supports stripping access to healthcare from the poor.

Raise your hand if you’re surprised…yeah, that’s what I thought.

49
Blind Frog Belly White  Mar 7, 2017 • 12:36:29pm

David Frum is suggesting that folks like Rand Paul, whose constituents are HIGHLY dependent on the ACA, will adopt a ‘Denounce And Preserve’ strategy whereby they get to bitch and moan endlessly about how bad Obamacare is, while not having to tell their working poor folks to go fuck off and die quietly take responsibility for taking away their health coverage.

50
Clearly a Country For Sick Old Haters  Mar 7, 2017 • 12:37:01pm

re: #45 Joe Bacon

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Prick.

51
HappyWarrior  Mar 7, 2017 • 12:38:24pm

re: #45 Joe Bacon

[Embedded content]

I like not being able to be denied health care because of my heart condition you greedy chode.

52
Clearly a Country For Sick Old Haters  Mar 7, 2017 • 12:38:35pm
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53
HappyWarrior  Mar 7, 2017 • 12:39:22pm

Tax Cuts Uber Alles: The Grover Norquist Story.

54
Clearly a Country For Sick Old Haters  Mar 7, 2017 • 12:39:50pm

re: #51 HappyWarrior

I like not being able to be denied health care because of my heart condition you greedy chode.

They might keep that part, because it impacts people who have money. Screwing the poor is the priority.

55
allegro  Mar 7, 2017 • 12:40:06pm

This is stripping many more than the poor and elderly of affordable health coverage. Middle and even upper middle class are going to get taken out as well. Just one catastrophic health occurrence and there goes the savings, house, everything if the affected is the main breadwinner.

56
HappyWarrior  Mar 7, 2017 • 12:40:22pm

re: #54 Clearly a Country For Sick Old Haters

They might keep that part, because it impacts people who have money. Screwing the poor is the priority.

Ayn Rand would be proud.

57
Clearly a Country For Sick Old Haters  Mar 7, 2017 • 12:40:46pm

re: #55 allegro

This is stripping many more than the poor and elderly of affordable health coverage. Middle and even upper middle class are going to get taken out as well. Just one catastrophic health occurrence and there goes the savings, house, everything if the affected is the main breadwinner.

Jokes on them. I already lost my house in the 2009 downturn.

58
KGxvi  Mar 7, 2017 • 12:42:27pm

re: #46 Targetpractice

That’s rather the point, get Congressional Repubs to do it for the purposes of burying anything inconvenient to the administration. If they had any real intention of finding out the truth, they’d appoint a special prosecutor. Problem is a special prosecutor, once appointed, can’t easily be kept on a leash without making the whole thing into a joke.

Perhaps, but Trump is not exactly a strategic thinker, he’s going to demand that the Congressional investigation be made public, and once that happens, if the GOP is playing fast and loose with the facts, the Dems will be able to dump additional information.

Plus, let’s keep in mind, if it turns out there was a warrant (which there probably was), that means a court agreed with whoever was investigating that there was substantial evidence to support additional surveillance. If there’s something there, Trump is screwed. If there’s nothing there, he loses what little credibility he has. The only way that Trump “wins” on this, is if there is actual proof that the Obama Administration acted illegally; which is highly unlikely.

59
Clearly a Country For Sick Old Haters  Mar 7, 2017 • 12:44:10pm

re: #58 KGxvi

>Plus, let’s keep in mind, if it turns out there was a warrant (which there probably was)

We don’t know if the whole thing was a right-wing hallucination, do we?
The Dems response that Obama didn’t call for the tap may have been just to mess with the Trumpkins by reinforcing their belief that there was a tap.

60
Targetpractice  Mar 7, 2017 • 12:44:42pm

re: #55 allegro

This is stripping many more than the poor and elderly of affordable health coverage. Middle and even upper middle class are going to get taken out as well. Just one catastrophic health occurrence and there goes the savings, house, everything if the affected is the main breadwinner.

That’s a feature, not a bug. For all their talk about wanting to help out people be successful and prosperous, the GOP’s donor class see such things as a threat. Because if the wealth is being spread around and all boats truly are rising, then it’s money that’s not being funneled upwards. Their dream is to effectively undo the 20th century and return to the Gilded Age, when the titans of industry were free to amass ever-greater wealth and power free of government regulation.

61
KGxvi  Mar 7, 2017 • 12:45:23pm

re: #49 Blind Frog Belly White

David Frum is suggesting that folks like Rand Paul, whose constituents are HIGHLY dependent on the ACA, will adopt a ‘Denounce And Preserve’ strategy whereby they get to bitch and moan endlessly about how bad Obamacare is, while not having to tell their working poor folks to go fuck off and die quietly take responsibility for taking away their health coverage.

Isn’t that basically what they did with Social Security and Medicare? Twenty or thirty years of screaming that it’s socialism run amok and the first step down the road to a distopian future where the government controls everything until they change their tune to “we will protect the ACA, we will not let Democrats cut it!”

62
Jebediah, RBG  Mar 7, 2017 • 12:46:32pm

re: #56 HappyWarrior

Ayn Rand would be proud.

As long as she would still be able to get the gubmint handouts SHE relied on at the end of her life.

63
Targetpractice  Mar 7, 2017 • 12:47:33pm

re: #58 KGxvi

Perhaps, but Trump is not exactly a strategic thinker, he’s going to demand that the Congressional investigation be made public, and once that happens, if the GOP is playing fast and loose with the facts, the Dems will be able to dump additional information.

Plus, let’s keep in mind, if it turns out there was a warrant (which there probably was), that means a court agreed with whoever was investigating that there was substantial evidence to support additional surveillance. If there’s something there, Trump is screwed. If there’s nothing there, he loses what little credibility he has. The only way that Trump “wins” on this, is if there is actual proof that the Obama Administration acted illegally; which is highly unlikely.

Think the 9/11 Commission, that farce of an investigation that the GOP ultimately used to absolve themselves of any guilt. You call for an investigation, then use and abuse the powers of your office to avoid as much actual investigation as possible. Remember that, during said commission, the GOP spent more time blaming the Clinton administration for the rise of Al-Q than it did looking into whether or not the Bush admin had dropped the ball.

64
Sir John Barron  Mar 7, 2017 • 12:48:26pm

re: #38 Blind Frog Belly White

Spicey danced around “there’s a Separation Of Powers issue”.

Translation: Our only proof is the Breitbart article, but we’re hoping that by punting to congress you guys will forget all about it.

65
KGxvi  Mar 7, 2017 • 12:48:30pm

re: #59 Clearly a Country For Sick Old Haters

>Plus, let’s keep in mind, if it turns out there was a warrant (which there probably was)

We don’t know if the whole thing was a right-wing hallucination, do we?
The Dems response that Obama didn’t call for the tap may have been just to mess with the Trumpkins by reinforcing their belief that there was a tap.

Given that this apparently started with a Mark Levin paint huffing sessioncolumn, it’s entirely plausible that this is just the first signs of a neurotic breakdown among the Trumpistas because of his failure to be so magically great like he promised.

66
wrenchwench  Mar 7, 2017 • 12:49:36pm

re: #61 KGxvi

Isn’t that basically what they did with Social Security and Medicare? Twenty or thirty years of screaming that it’s socialism run amok and the first step down the road to a distopian future where the government controls everything until they change their tune to “we will protect the ACA, we will not let Democrats cut it!”

I think the screaming was a bit louder in Orange County, CA. It may still be part of the noise.

67
darthstar  Mar 7, 2017 • 12:51:34pm

re: #45 Joe Bacon

Retweeted

68
allegro  Mar 7, 2017 • 12:51:45pm

I think it’s quite probable that conversations from Trump tower with Russians during the campaign and since have been recorded due to taps on the Russians.

69
Kragar  Mar 7, 2017 • 12:52:22pm
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70
HappyWarrior  Mar 7, 2017 • 12:52:38pm

re: #68 allegro

I think it’s quite probable that conversations from Trump tower with Russians during the campaign and since have been recorded due to taps on the Russians.

That’s my thought too.

71
Sir John Barron  Mar 7, 2017 • 12:54:15pm

re: #38 Blind Frog Belly White

Spicey danced around “there’s a Separation Of Powers issue”.

Translation: We don’t have any proof but if we keep stalling and accusing our base will keep loving us.

72
KGxvi  Mar 7, 2017 • 12:55:16pm

re: #63 Targetpractice

Think the 9/11 Commission, that farce of an investigation that the GOP ultimately used to absolve themselves of any guilt. You call for an investigation, then use and abuse the powers of your office to avoid as much actual investigation as possible. Remember that, during said commission, the GOP spent more time blaming the Clinton administration for the rise of Al-Q than it did looking into whether or not the Bush admin had dropped the ball.

Appointing a commission is always the most bullshit approach of all the approaches. A special prosecutor* definitely has the greatest chance of finding wrongdoing (it also has the greatest chance of going sideways in the quest for wrongdoing).

*I was under the impression that they let the special prosecutor law expire during the Bush Administration. Sort of a bipartisan acknowledgement that the Starr investigation turned into way too much of a shit show.

73
Sir John Barron  Mar 7, 2017 • 12:55:20pm

re: #69 Kragar

The dick can be sewed back on when the tax cuts kick in.

74
Clearly a Country For Sick Old Haters  Mar 7, 2017 • 12:56:42pm

re: #71 Sir John Barron

Translation: We don’t have any proof but if we keep stalling and accusing our base will keep loving us.

The interesting thing is that their base is supposed to be rubes who are enraged at other Republicans constantly lying to them, so picked the guy they imagined was telling them the truth, just because he’s openly bigoted like they are.

Their truth-teller lies more than any other politician in my lifetime.

75
HappyWarrior  Mar 7, 2017 • 12:57:14pm

re: #74 Clearly a Country For Sick Old Haters

The interesting thing is that their base is supposed to be rubes who are enraged at other Republicans constantly lying to them, so picked the guy they imagined was telling them the truth, just because he’s openly bigoted like they are.

Their truth-teller lies more than any other politician in my lifetime.

Their base just wanted a bigot.

76
KGxvi  Mar 7, 2017 • 12:57:50pm

re: #75 HappyWarrior

Their base just wanted a bigot.

Or at least someone who would tell them what they wanted to hear.

77
mmmirele  Mar 7, 2017 • 12:59:51pm

This is not how this works. Trump doesn’t get the right to throw shit out and see what sticks to the wall. He needs to prove his statements or shut right up.

78
HappyWarrior  Mar 7, 2017 • 1:00:47pm

re: #76 KGxvi

Or at least someone who would tell them what they wanted to hear.

Yeah that too. I was wrong. I thought Christie would be too “urban” for them. Where Trump succeeded was that he was able to speak to the bigotry and what GOP voters have long wanted their elected officials to say. It’s going to fuck them long term especially since he’s won. If he had lost, they probably would have just gone back to playing it safe with the Romneys of the party as nominees.

79
lawhawk  Mar 7, 2017 • 1:00:49pm

re: #32 darthstar

Damnit…Spicey was on live TV and I missed the shitshow?

You missed the shitshow, but did you really miss the shit show?

80
Clearly a Country For Sick Old Haters  Mar 7, 2017 • 1:01:13pm

re: #76 KGxvi

Or at least someone who would tell them what they wanted to hear.

What they want to hear is that bigotry is good.
So many Conservatives want to pretend to be good people while being complete assholes. It’s a cultural problem, probably tied in to their dark version of Christianity. They insist on being the good guys as they harm people.

81
Kragar  Mar 7, 2017 • 1:01:21pm
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darthstar  Mar 7, 2017 • 1:01:35pm

re: #79 lawhawk

You missed the shitshow, but did you really miss the shit show?

I didn’t get to see it, but I also didn’t have to sit through it. So yes and no.

83
HappyWarrior  Mar 7, 2017 • 1:02:00pm

re: #81 Kragar

[Embedded content]

No more giant big gulps for you Sarah.

84
Clearly a Country For Sick Old Haters  Mar 7, 2017 • 1:02:03pm

re: #77 mmmirele

This is not how this works. Trump doesn’t get the right to throw shit out and see what sticks to the wall. He needs to prove his statements or shut right up.

That’s why some pundits are saying that Trump forgot that he’s President. We’re still dealing with birther citizen Trump.

85
Targetpractice  Mar 7, 2017 • 1:02:14pm

re: #72 KGxvi

Appointing a commission is always the most bullshit approach of all the approaches. A special prosecutor* definitely has the greatest chance of finding wrongdoing (it also has the greatest chance of going sideways in the quest for wrongdoing).

*I was under the impression that they let the special prosecutor law expire during the Bush Administration. Sort of a bipartisan acknowledgement that the Starr investigation turned into way too much of a shit show.

No, you’re thinking the Office of Independent Counsel, which relied upon a federal mandate that expired in 1999 after the GOP decided that Monicagate had been a very humiliating bust. The AG possesses the power to appoint a special prosecutor who’s independent of the DOJ chain-of-command. Thing is, once appointed, a special prosecutor generally follows where the evidence leads him. That’s the worry of the White House, that setting one loose on a fishing expedition into the “crimes” of Obama might instead turn up evidence of crimes by one or more highly-placed Trumpers.

86
lawhawk  Mar 7, 2017 • 1:03:14pm

re: #81 Kragar

So, this means…. food costs go up because Trump doesn’t have anyone at Commerce to approve the deals? Or domestic HFCS producers get to horn in on the action. Or both.

Awesome.

87
KGxvi  Mar 7, 2017 • 1:04:41pm

re: #85 Targetpractice

No, you’re thinking the Office of Independent Counsel, which relied upon a federal mandate that expired in 1999 after the GOP decided that Monicagate had been a very humiliating bust. The AG possesses the power to appoint a special prosecutor who’s independent of the DOJ chain-of-command. Thing is, once appointed, a special prosecutor generally follows where the evidence leads him. That’s the worry of the White House, that setting one loose on a fishing expedition into the “crimes” of Obama might instead turn up evidence of crimes by one or more highly-placed Trumpers.

Ah, thanks. It was confusing me why everyone was saying we should have a special prosecutor, but not nearly enough to the point of actually looking into it.

88
InfidelOfFreedom  Mar 7, 2017 • 1:05:41pm

Remember when Republicans thought they would be cute and require Congress to have Obamacare plans? I want these disingenuous cretins to make the same pledge to their disgrace of a “plan” that will almost certainly cost me, my retired father, and my co-workers our health insurance.

I cannot express how angry I am right now, I’m frankly near tears. I love my job. However, it does not provide health insurance because it is too expensive for our small firm to provide. I purchase my health insurance on the marketplace, but without subsidy because I just barely make too much to qualify, since I am a single woman without children (2x poverty rate). However, if costs rise even a little, I will not be able to afford or obtain health insurance and I will be forced to find a job that can provide it. Any lawyers that work for the little guy around here have been all but run out of business by tort reform, so there’s a good chance I’ll end up at a soulless corporate firm that doesn’t represent my values or find a new career altogether.

How many people are making that decision right now? LIFE AND CAREER CHOICES we don’t want to have to make. I am watching republicans fucking LIE unrepentantly over and over on TV right now. No one better ever tell me again to respect republican views because they don’t even respect our right to live and prosper.

89
Blind Frog Belly White  Mar 7, 2017 • 1:06:37pm

re: #84 Clearly a Country For Sick Old Haters

That’s why some pundits are saying that Trump forgot that he’s President. We’re still dealing with birther citizen Trump.

To be fair, though, being President didn’t stop him from claiming that 3-5 Million people voted illegally, with no evidence. The GOP were happy to split up in teams to either say, “There’s no evidence” or “We should investigate”, and a couple weeks later, nobody’s talking about it anymore.

90
Targetpractice  Mar 7, 2017 • 1:07:16pm

re: #86 lawhawk

So, this means…. food costs go up because Trump doesn’t have anyone at Commerce to approve the deals? Or domestic HFCS producers get to horn in on the action. Or both.

Awesome.

Nah, it’ll be spun as Mexico purposefully screwing us over their anger about the wall, because it can’t be that the guy who makes the best deals and has been talking about there being no need for so many appointees dropped the ball in a very humiliating fashion.

91
Targetpractice  Mar 7, 2017 • 1:08:33pm

re: #84 Clearly a Country For Sick Old Haters

That’s why some pundits are saying that Trump forgot that he’s President. We’re still dealing with birther citizen Trump.

Like I said last night, Trump doesn’t think his job title is President of the United States, he thinks he’s CEO of United States Inc.

92
b.d.  Mar 7, 2017 • 1:08:55pm

re: #86 lawhawk

So, this means…. food costs go up because Trump doesn’t have anyone at Commerce to approve the deals? Or domestic HFCS producers get to horn in on the action. Or both.

Awesome.

I guess the Oreo folks can now say that they had to move to Mexico because Trump wouldn’t let them have any sugar.

//

93
allegro  Mar 7, 2017 • 1:09:08pm

re: #91 Targetpractice

Like I said last night, Trump doesn’t think his job title is President of the United States, he thinks he’s CEO of United States Inc. King of the World!

94
Blind Frog Belly White  Mar 7, 2017 • 1:10:22pm

re: #93 allegro

YouTube

95
lawhawk  Mar 7, 2017 • 1:10:24pm

UNFU…

Nope. Totally fucking believable.

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People haven’t learned a goddamned thing. November didn’t teach anyone a damn thing about the need to vote in all elections. Instead, we see turnout in a trickle.

Next year are midterms, and that’s perhaps a last gasp to protect much of what remains of the safety net (the bits the GOP hasn’t destroyed by then, to say nothing of investigating Trump and his Russia connections, Sessions’ perjury, and all the scandals to come, etc.)

96
Skip Intro  Mar 7, 2017 • 1:10:57pm

re: #3 GlutenFreeJesus

That’s not how it works, Spicy.

It is in Trumpworld. Trump has to prove nothing. Everybody else has to prove him wrong.

We’re living in Crazytown.

97
Kragar  Mar 7, 2017 • 1:11:21pm
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Blind Frog Belly White  Mar 7, 2017 • 1:12:22pm

re: #96 Skip Intro

It is in Trumpworld. Trump has to prove nothing. Everybody else has to prove him wrong.

We’re living in Crazytown.

You can’t prove Trump DOESN’T blow goats, so….

99
Clearly a Country For Sick Old Haters  Mar 7, 2017 • 1:15:48pm

re: #98 Blind Frog Belly White

You can’t prove Trump DOESN’T blow goats, so….

I’m OK with Trump’s goat-blowing. The goats seem to like it, and it reduces his time on Twitter.

100
Jebediah, RBG  Mar 7, 2017 • 1:16:05pm

re: #98 Blind Frog Belly White

You can’t prove Trump DOESN’T blow goats, so….

But to save their dignity, the goats deny it vigorously. “Let that nasty mouth near my goatwang? No waaaaaay!”

101
InfidelOfFreedom  Mar 7, 2017 • 1:16:24pm

re: #95 lawhawk

We have not learned… we have become a deeply un-serious country. I fear it is our downfall, and I am afraid the downfall has already begun.

102
Shiplord Kirel  Mar 7, 2017 • 1:16:45pm

Has Sean disproven the charge that he is involved in a sexual relationship with an orangutang?
What?
That charge hasn’t been made?
Well, consider it made.

103
Skip Intro  Mar 7, 2017 • 1:18:11pm

re: #95 lawhawk

I guess the people of this country really do want a dictatorial form of government because voting is just so boring.

104
Kragar  Mar 7, 2017 • 1:19:15pm
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Blind Frog Belly White  Mar 7, 2017 • 1:21:52pm

re: #104 Kragar

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Note that these are the same people who argue that raising minimum wage does nothing to help anyone because prices rise to adjust. But if you cut taxes, everyone gets a raise!!

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Clearly a Country For Sick Old Haters  Mar 7, 2017 • 1:22:57pm

re: #104 Kragar

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He meant pay increases for the wealthy, not people who have to work for a living.

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Targetpractice  Mar 7, 2017 • 1:23:24pm

re: #104 Kragar

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Tax cuts are the exact opposite, Grover, they’re excuses by your boss to pocket even more of the profits. After all, he doesn’t need to give you a raise, Uncle Sam just did that.

108
Barefoot Grin  Mar 7, 2017 • 1:23:25pm

re: #104 Kragar

[Embedded content]

This guy has made a career out of this horseshit.

109
Weaselone  Mar 7, 2017 • 1:27:07pm

re: #95 lawhawk

Not seeing a link to any support for this statement.

110
Romantic Heretic  Mar 7, 2017 • 1:27:09pm

re: #75 HappyWarrior

Their base just wanted a permission to be bigots.

Trump, by getting elected, gave it to them too.

111
fern01  Mar 7, 2017 • 1:29:06pm

re: #77 mmmirele

This is not how this works. Trump doesn’t get the right to throw shit out and see what sticks to the wall. He needs to prove his statements or shut right up.

This is how trump works - he takes any right he wants & it seems not even his closest allies can get him to shut up

112
Targetpractice  Mar 7, 2017 • 1:31:03pm

As we saw with the Bush Tax Cuts, the “raise” that chucklefucks like Grover support is a few cents for me and thee, a few hundred million for him and his buddies. But he says that out loud, then he gives the whole game away. So he has to keep bullshitting up that we’re all gonna get fat paychecks because of the generosity of the rich and powerful. “Trickle down” meaning “Pissing in our ear and telling us its raining.”

113
lawhawk  Mar 7, 2017 • 1:32:08pm

re: #109 Weaselone

Hope you’re right, and that assessment was wrong.

114
Patricia Kayden  Mar 7, 2017 • 1:35:44pm

re: #3 GlutenFreeJesus

That’s not how it works, Spicy.

Strange that the Leader of the Free World doesn’t have anyone whispering in his ears that when one makes a claim, the burden is on him/her to provide evidence to substantiate that claim. The burden is not on the world at large to disprove nonsensical allegations. LOL.

115
ObserverArt  Mar 7, 2017 • 1:36:29pm

re: #14 I Would Prefer Not To

1) I really hate Spicer.

AND.

2) He has the worst job in the world.

The worst guy for the worst job. Win. Win.

116
Kragar  Mar 7, 2017 • 1:37:06pm
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Patricia Kayden  Mar 7, 2017 • 1:37:39pm

re: #104 Kragar

Plus, it is the wealthier folks who get the benefits of the so-called tax cuts. The poor end up paying more in taxes on every day goods like gas, groceries, etc.

118
ObserverArt  Mar 7, 2017 • 1:37:47pm

re: #17 Major Tom

cnn.com

donaldjtrump.com

Has been under continuous IRS Audit since 2002, however years 2002 - 2008 are completed.

Hmmm. Under audit from about the same time he couldn’t get loans from American banks. Yeah…that isn’t concerning.

119
lawhawk  Mar 7, 2017 • 1:40:43pm
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AARP enters the fray… and lays down the age card.

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Targetpractice  Mar 7, 2017 • 1:45:26pm

re: #119 lawhawk

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AARP enters the fray… and lays down the age card.

That’s absolutely perfect, “Age Tax.” Ryan’s worst nightmare is unfolding before his very eyes.

121
Wendell Zurkowitz ((slave to the waffle light))  Mar 7, 2017 • 1:45:31pm

re: #111 fern01

This is how trump works - he takes any right he wants & it seems not even his closest allies can get him to shut up

He managed to sell him self as the “anti-politician” and then go on to ignore or violate almost every rule and precedent of campaigning, governing and dealing with the Press…and he has succeeded every time.

I really do not know what it will take to put an end to it.

122
Weaselone  Mar 7, 2017 • 1:46:14pm

re: #113 lawhawk

Hope you’re right, and that assessment was wrong.

It may not be. I did find a newspaper article on voter apathy going into this election which indicated some reasons why turnout could reach a record low. I’m not certain the result could be considered a belweather for the entire nation.

123
Charles Johnson  Mar 7, 2017 • 1:48:32pm

re: #102 Shiplord Kirel

Has Sean disproven the charge that he is involved in a sexual relationship with an orangutang?
What?
That charge hasn’t been made?
Well, consider it made.

We need a special prosecutor and a select congressional panel to investigate this immediately. If true, we have cross-species cohabitation going on in the White House. This is unacceptable.

124
thedopefishlives  Mar 7, 2017 • 1:49:25pm

re: #123 Charles Johnson

We need a special prosecutor and a select congressional panel to investigate this immediately. If true, we have cross-species cohabitation going on in the White House. This is unacceptable.

GORILLAGATE!!!!

125
Backwoods_Sleuth  Mar 7, 2017 • 1:50:14pm

re: #123 Charles Johnson

We need a special prosecutor and a select congressional panel to investigate this immediately. If true, we have cross-species cohabitation going on in the White House. This is unacceptable.

we already have that with the yam and the non-human lifeform living on his head…

126
Wendell Zurkowitz ((slave to the waffle light))  Mar 7, 2017 • 1:50:35pm

re: #123 Charles Johnson

We need a special prosecutor and a select congressional panel to investigate this immediately. If true, we have cross-species cohabitation going on in the White House. This is unacceptable.

Not to mention the fact that he is spreading orangutan Ebola all over Washington, New York and Florida…

127
ObserverArt  Mar 7, 2017 • 1:50:41pm

re: #41 darthstar

Wait…that’s illegal? Why? He didn’t touch anything on the road.

I hope you are kidding.

What if someone driving by slowed up to watch and started a bad accident sequence? Or they got freaked and didn’t keep in their lane and caused a crash. Stunt wouldn’t be so cool then.

128
goddamnedfrank  Mar 7, 2017 • 1:51:17pm
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thedopefishlives  Mar 7, 2017 • 1:53:12pm

re: #128 goddamnedfrank

Because Comrade Putin would never, ever dare to perpetrate such a heinous crime against privacy.

130
InfidelOfFreedom  Mar 7, 2017 • 1:54:23pm

Paul Ryan just called this an act of mercy. My hatred burns with the heat of a million suns.

131
Ace Rothstein  Mar 7, 2017 • 1:54:56pm
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Blind Frog Belly White  Mar 7, 2017 • 1:54:57pm

re: #116 Kragar

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What would the American Hospital Association know about healthcare, anyway?
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133
Barefoot Grin  Mar 7, 2017 • 1:55:06pm

Imagine if every time you did a search ads for related products popped up on your Facebook page and in emails from amazon.

134
Sir John Barron  Mar 7, 2017 • 1:55:28pm

re: #104 Kragar

Why do politicians always ask how “we” are going to pay for tax cuts.
Americans pay for tax hikes.
Tax cuts are pay increases for Americans.

— Grover Norquist

Grover is so dumb I’m surprised he’s not a DT cabinet secretary.

135
Targetpractice  Mar 7, 2017 • 1:55:40pm

re: #128 goddamnedfrank

[Embedded content]

Imagine a world where every spy agency in the world is doing the exact same thing. Oh wait, that’s the world now. The difference, Eddie, is most of those nations don’t have pricks like you browbeating them for it.

136
Patricia Kayden  Mar 7, 2017 • 1:56:08pm

re: #33 Blind Frog Belly White

Your comment needs to be repeated 1 million times so that everyone understands exactly what Republicans have done with their repeal and “replace” nonsense. They’re hurting poorer people and the much vaunted White working class that everyone has been so obsessed with since the election. Trump promised them something better than the ACA and Republicans just gave them the shaft.

137
jaunte  Mar 7, 2017 • 1:56:14pm

re: #131 Ace Rothstein

Maybe we can ask the Pope to excommunicate him for extreme bearing-of-false-witness.

138
Targetpractice  Mar 7, 2017 • 1:56:21pm

re: #130 InfidelOfFreedom

Paul Ryan just called this an act of mercy. My hatred burns with the heat of a million suns.

Sure it is, it’s the GOP finally shooting dead the “repeal and replace” meme like Ol’ Yeller.

139
thedopefishlives  Mar 7, 2017 • 1:56:57pm

re: #138 Targetpractice

Sure it is, it’s the GOP finally shooting dead the “repeal and replace” meme like Ol’ Yeller.

I was trying to think of how to work in the “mercy killing” idea, but you got it done.

140
Blind Frog Belly White  Mar 7, 2017 • 1:57:29pm

re: #134 Sir John Barron

Grover is so dumb I’m surprised he’s not a DT cabinet secretary.

There’s that whole ‘Grover Norquist is a seekrit MOOZLIM!!’ thing.

141
jeffreyw  Mar 7, 2017 • 1:58:43pm

Imgur
Thread needz moar kittehs. In tubs.

142
Skip Intro  Mar 7, 2017 • 1:58:49pm

re: #134 Sir John Barron

He would be but he married a Muslim.

143
Major Tom  Mar 7, 2017 • 1:58:51pm

New Bob Cesca Show today?

144
goddamnedfrank  Mar 7, 2017 • 1:58:59pm
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Wendell Zurkowitz ((slave to the waffle light))  Mar 7, 2017 • 1:59:04pm

re: #140 Blind Frog Belly White

There’s that whole ‘Grover Norquist is a seekrit MOOZLIM!!’ thing.

Yes, he fell out of favor with the Deep Base for having a Muslim wife.

146
Backwoods_Sleuth  Mar 7, 2017 • 2:00:46pm

re: #142 Skip Intro

He would be but he married a Muslim.

and he has a beard

147
Patricia Kayden  Mar 7, 2017 • 2:01:23pm

re: #34 Big Beautiful Door

According to Jason Chaffetz, all we need to do to make healthcare affordable is to quit buying iPhones. Down with Apple!

slate.com

Or fix the ACA instead of destroying it and replacing it with nonsense so that we can have both healthcare and iphones. I don’t see people in Canada or England having to choose between healthcare and communication devices. Why should we?

148
EPR-radar  Mar 7, 2017 • 2:01:52pm

re: #130 InfidelOfFreedom

Paul Ryan just called this an act of mercy. My hatred burns with the heat of a million suns.

The campfire tales of US conservatives tell of a three-legged stool: fiscal conservatism, social conservatism and defense conservatism.

Fiscal conservatism is fuck everyone, especially the poor, so that the wealthiest plutocracy in the history of the world can get their tax cuts.

Social conservatism is ginning up fake god-bothering outrage to foster hate, resentment and bigotry, all to deflect attention from the tax cuts.

Defense conservatism is starting wars of choice, to directly funnel money to the plutocracy and to deflect attention from the tax cuts.

This is a perfect trinity of hateful garbage — I can never decide which group is most odious.

149
Patricia Kayden  Mar 7, 2017 • 2:02:40pm

re: #144 goddamnedfrank

No because then everyone would see what a bust any GOP replacement actually is for the American people (except for those who are rich).

150
InfidelOfFreedom  Mar 7, 2017 • 2:03:15pm

re: #147 Patricia Kayden

Or fix the ACA instead of destroying it and replacing it with nonsense so that we can have both healthcare and iphones. I don’t see people in Canada or England having to choose between healthcare and communication devices. Why should we?

American exceptionalism!

151
Targetpractice  Mar 7, 2017 • 2:03:29pm

re: #147 Patricia Kayden

Or fix the ACA instead of destroying it and replacing it with nonsense so that we can have both healthcare and iphones. I don’t see people in Canada or England having to choose between healthcare and communication devices. Why should we?

Because Canada didn’t spend much of the last century listening to one of its major political parties deem anything that promoted the general welfare as “socialism.”

152
The Vicious Babushka  Mar 7, 2017 • 2:03:36pm
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BigPapa  Mar 7, 2017 • 2:09:38pm
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This is what big government does. It makes fat stacks.

154
freetoken  Mar 7, 2017 • 2:11:44pm

re: #153 BigPapa

It’s what it is. We’re turning into the Idiocracy.

155
Backwoods_Sleuth  Mar 7, 2017 • 2:12:41pm

Flag—Trump just now re: GOP health plan: “You can choose your doctor…You can choose your plan…It’s called good healthcare.” via @MSNBC

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Charles Johnson  Mar 7, 2017 • 2:13:47pm
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Blind Frog Belly White  Mar 7, 2017 • 2:14:41pm

re: #155 Backwoods_Sleuth

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It does neither of those.

BTW, ‘You can choose your doctor’ is something that only applies to people who pay for all their healthcare out-of-pocket. Pretty much every health insurance plan reams you for out-of-network doctor visits.

158
Wendell Zurkowitz ((slave to the waffle light))  Mar 7, 2017 • 2:14:59pm

re: #154 freetoken

It’s what it is. We’re turning into the Idiocracy.

yes, and they are appealing to that very sentiment.

And you know that Trump has read no more than one page with nine bullet points on the bill…

159
KGxvi  Mar 7, 2017 • 2:16:32pm

re: #95 lawhawk

UNFU…

Nope. Totally fucking believable.

[Embedded content]

People haven’t learned a goddamned thing. November didn’t teach anyone a damn thing about the need to vote in all elections. Instead, we see turnout in a trickle.

Next year are midterms, and that’s perhaps a last gasp to protect much of what remains of the safety net (the bits the GOP hasn’t destroyed by then, to say nothing of investigating Trump and his Russia connections, Sessions’ perjury, and all the scandals to come, etc.)

Our local elections are a mess. I live in Long Beach, so the only thing on my ballot is a sales tax measure (which, honestly means I’m probably not going to bother going to vote on). The next city council/mayoral election will be in April 2018, separate from the June 2018 statewide primary. Having random local elections that most people don’t have the time to research in cities/counties far too large for many voters to even know the candidates is a perfect recipe for low voter turnout.

160
Targetpractice  Mar 7, 2017 • 2:16:41pm

re: #155 Backwoods_Sleuth

[Embedded content]

The gaslighting of America continues, as we’re sold dog food as fine dining because the money saved on serving us dog food is money that goes into the pockets of the rich.

161
Blind Frog Belly White  Mar 7, 2017 • 2:17:05pm

re: #158 Wendell Zurkowitz ((slave to the waffle light))

yes, and they are appealing to that very sentiment.

And you know that Trump has read no more than one page with nine bullet points on the bill…

I’m almost certain he’s read nothing on it. He just spouts the ‘You can choose your doctor’ shit because it works with his idiot voters.

162
ObserverArt  Mar 7, 2017 • 2:17:25pm

re: #77 mmmirele

This is not how this works. Trump doesn’t get the right to throw shit out and see what sticks to the wall. He needs to prove his statements or shut right up.

It’s just more covering Trump’s exposed ass. It’s been almost two months of the GOP excusing and figuring out ways to cover his stupidity every single day.

They don’t want him gone because he is their wrecking ball.

Hopefully that wrecking ball is swinging wildly enough it takes out the GOP congress in 2018 and 2020.

163
Targetpractice  Mar 7, 2017 • 2:19:27pm

re: #161 Blind Frog Belly White

I’m almost certain he’s read nothing on it. He just spouts the ‘You can choose your doctor’ shit because it works with his idiot voters.

He spouts it because he’s never stopped campaigning. He’s already filed for reelection, when traditionally presidents who wished to run for a second term didn’t start doing so until at least a year before. He’s just rolled his 2016 run over into his 2020 run.

164
KGxvi  Mar 7, 2017 • 2:19:58pm

re: #104 Kragar

[Embedded content]

He’s got the wrong side of the “government as a business” metaphor. A wise man (who I’m not going to look up) once said, “taxes are the price we pay to live in a civilized society.” So tax cuts are cutting the price of services, tax increases are raising the price of services. A good business, if it was running a deficit like the government does, would raise prices, especially when its own costs go up.

165
Anymouse  Mar 7, 2017 • 2:20:59pm

re: #88 InfidelOfFreedom

My wife called up our representative (Adrian Smith, the guy who says he only represents Republicans and whose staff hangs up on me) to put him on blast about this vapourware of a health care plan.

The office person kept trying to change the subject; once again my wife went into “domina” voice to keep her on track. She spent fifteen minutes tearing apart this craptastic GOP plan.

166
Blind Frog Belly White  Mar 7, 2017 • 2:23:29pm

re: #164 KGxvi

He’s got the wrong side of the “government as a business” metaphor. A wise man (who I’m not going to look up) once said, “taxes are the price we pay to live in a civilized society.” So tax cuts are cutting the price of services, tax increases are raising the price of services. A good business, if it was running a deficit like the government does, would raise prices, especially when its own costs go up.

Tax cuts, and the resulting cuts in services, are the price we pay for sharing our society with a lot of stupid people.

167
KGxvi  Mar 7, 2017 • 2:23:59pm

Huh, so apparently Rosey Grier (yes, the football player) has announced he’s running for governor of California next year as a Republican. He’s 84, which would make him the oldest person to assume the office.

168
Sir John Barron  Mar 7, 2017 • 2:24:54pm

re: #155 Backwoods_Sleuth

Yeah nobody can do that now. Nice going, DT.

////

169
ObserverArt  Mar 7, 2017 • 2:25:59pm

re: #104 Kragar

Kragar @Kragar_LGF
This is utter and complete horseshit. Zero evidence that companies increase wages for employees b/c of “tax cuts”

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…
4:17 PM - 7 Mar 2017

You’re forgetting Grover’s definition of Americans.

It would be the top 4% of income earners. They get the increase everyone else gets fucked.

And, I think it can be proven with ample evidence.

170
Backwoods_Sleuth  Mar 7, 2017 • 2:26:07pm
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“unfortunate”

O_o

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The Vicious Babushka  Mar 7, 2017 • 2:26:52pm
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thedopefishlives  Mar 7, 2017 • 2:29:19pm

re: #156 Charles Johnson

Geert Wilders was one of the favorites back in the day when you broke with the Right, if I recall correctly.

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Blind Frog Belly White  Mar 7, 2017 • 2:29:31pm

re: #171 The Vicious Babushka

[Embedded content]

They have no actual clue how anything works. If we survive Trump without a pandemic event, or a major war, or such, it will be shear stupid luck.

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Wendell Zurkowitz ((slave to the waffle light))  Mar 7, 2017 • 2:29:32pm

re: #171 The Vicious Babushka

Obamacare repeal and Trump’s spending plan put CDC budget in peril

But Free-Market disease control offers so many more choices!!!

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EmmaAnne  Mar 7, 2017 • 2:29:33pm

re: #128 goddamnedfrank

[Embedded content]

And Russia would NEVER

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FormerDirtDart  Mar 7, 2017 • 2:35:23pm
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thedopefishlives  Mar 7, 2017 • 2:36:04pm

re: #176 FormerDirtDart

What matters is that it isn’t Obama’s name on the label.

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InfidelOfFreedom  Mar 7, 2017 • 2:36:34pm

re: #165 Anymouse

Thanks for the reminder on this! I found out after a recent move I am no longer in Dem Lloyd Doggett’s district, but now a constituent of this overstuffed haircut with teeth (aka John Carter):

I’ll be calling his office to tell them they can expect to start receiving my medical bills next year.

179
Blind Frog Belly White  Mar 7, 2017 • 2:38:35pm

re: #177 thedopefishlives

What matters is that it isn’t Obama’s name on the label.

Of course, Obama’s name isn’t on the ACA either. The GOP put it there.

Well, okay, his name IS on it, on the signature page. Shut up. Nobody likes a pedant.

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ObserverArt  Mar 7, 2017 • 2:39:03pm

re: #176 FormerDirtDart

Judd Legum ✔ @JuddLegum
[whispers]

they aren’t lowering costs

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5:29 PM - 7 Mar 2017
139 139 Retweets 213 213 likes

Sure they are. In Republican world cutting a tax IS lowering costs.

More money for them.

181
FormerDirtDart  Mar 7, 2017 • 2:39:05pm

TryanCare Doesn’t

182
freetoken  Mar 7, 2017 • 2:40:04pm

re: #181 FormerDirtDart

TryanCare Doesn’t

PumpCare ???

183
thedopefishlives  Mar 7, 2017 • 2:40:06pm

re: #179 Blind Frog Belly White

Of course, Obama’s name isn’t on the ACA either. The GOP put it there.

Well, okay, his name IS on it, on the signature page. Shut up. Nobody likes a pedant.

Stupid libruls, Obummer signed it into law, now we have to make it go away or else we will be FAILURES and WEAKLINGS!

184
Blind Frog Belly White  Mar 7, 2017 • 2:42:45pm

re: #183 thedopefishlives

Stupid libruls, Obummer signed it into law, now we have to make it go away or else we will be FAILURES and WEAKLINGS!

I think, in his heart-of-hearts, Ryan is hoping he can’t pass this thing. If he does, he owns the 10 Million who lose care, and all the people who die when they hit their lifetime caps, and every single jacked-up premium. If it doesn’t pass? He gets a free past to say he tried, but those darn Democrats stopped him!

185
Anymouse  Mar 7, 2017 • 2:45:04pm

Declared Democratic candidate for the Arizona gubernatorial election sure has a way to throw those off any potential sex scandals they might try to raise.
(Goes to Noah Dyer’s Scandal and controversy page)

Hidden for NSFW, though it is out in the open on his campaign site:

Click to Reveal

Sex

Noah has had both deep and casual sexual experiences with all kinds of women. He is an advocate of open relationships. He’s had group sex and sex with married women. He has sent and received intimate texts and pictures, and occasionally recorded video during sex. Noah has always been forthright with his partners. All of his relationships have been legal and consensual, never coercive, or abusive, and he condemns such behavior. Noah is unapologetic about his sexual choices, and wishes others the same safety and confidence as they express themselves.

Also this from the same page:

Religion

Noah believes religion is beautiful when it inspires people to serve others and persevere despite adversity. Alternatively, he has spoken out very harshly when religion is used to defend intolerance and bully with mysticism. Such harsh words are rare these days, but if you’d like to read some of his past tirades, feel free to scroll through his old Facebook posts, all of which are set to public.

186
Backwoods_Sleuth  Mar 7, 2017 • 2:45:14pm

re: #180 ObserverArt

Sure they are. In Republican world cutting a tax IS lowering costs.

More money for them.

The GOP plan lowers costs for insurance companies.

For actual consumers, not at all.

187
Targetpractice  Mar 7, 2017 • 2:45:28pm

re: #176 FormerDirtDart

[Embedded content]

The wrong question is being asked. In the minds of Republicans, cutting spending is “cutting costs.” It’s a cost to their buddies on Wall St to fund healthcare for me and thee.

188
Blind Frog Belly White  Mar 7, 2017 • 2:46:21pm

BTW, just so we’re all clear on this: this plan is all about making healthcare more expensive for all the folks represented by the lines down there at the bottom, so that the folks represented by the dashed line can have more money.

189
gocart mozart  Mar 7, 2017 • 2:49:09pm
ReplyReply w/ Quote
190
Targetpractice  Mar 7, 2017 • 2:50:00pm

We have to remember that the people selling us this as “cutting costs” either get their healthcare covered at no cost by the taxpayer for life or so independently wealthy that they can afford to pay out of pocket. They’ll never have to worry that their insurance premiums are going up or something is not covered by their “bargain” plan.

191
Anymouse  Mar 7, 2017 • 2:50:09pm

noahdyer.com

More of his controversies:

Personal Finances

Noah has a negative net worth, given that he has nearly $100,000 in student loan debt. His income based loan repayment plan is actually insufficient to cover the interest, and his balance grows every year.

During the recession, Noah used credit card cash advances to pay tens of thousands of dollars in child support. He paid some of those debts in full, but ended up settling some those debts individually for anywhere from $0.25 to $0.75 to the dollar. He also sold his home in a short sale.

Noah has technically been homeless, and has enjoyed extended periods of couch surfing, living in offices, and other uncommon living arrangements. Thankfully, he has not known homelessness like that experienced by many people on the streets, with whom he sympathizes.

192
Major Tom  Mar 7, 2017 • 2:51:18pm

re: #143 Major Tom

New Bob Cesca Show today?

bobcesca.com

Yay! a new one!

193
Blind Frog Belly White  Mar 7, 2017 • 2:51:23pm

re: #189 gocart mozart

[Embedded content]

No deductibles, either. And you don’t have the Government telling you which doctor to go to, because you can’t go to ANY!!

194
KGxvi  Mar 7, 2017 • 2:53:48pm

re: #185 Anymouse

Declared Democratic candidate for the Arizona gubernatorial election sure has a way to throw those off any potential sex scandals they might try to raise.
(Goes to Noah Dyer’s Scandal and controversy page)

Hidden for NSFW, though it is out in the open on his campaign site:

[Embedded content]

Also this from the same page:

That’s probably not what will kill him, but this part might:

Noah believes individuals earning over $150,000 per year and households earning over $400,000 per year should spend time relaxing and financially enriching others, and should stop activities designed to further increase their personal incomes. Noah does not support legislation mandating maximum incomes, but he will use the above figures as a guide when approving legislation with financial consequences.

A lot of people earning that much also have a lot of debt. An associate at a major firm in Phoenix is probably making about $160k, and likely has a metric shitton of student loan debt (especially if they went to a private law school), in addition to a mortgage.

As Patrick Ewing once said: Sure NBA players make a lot of money, but we spend a lot too

195
ObserverArt  Mar 7, 2017 • 2:57:22pm

Well, I gritted my teeth and listened to Meat The Chuck Daily and surprise he has Hugh Hewitt on his all-star panel. Funny Hugh was all about polls showing Trump is just fine with GOP politicians and his and the GOP base because polls show he has good ratings with the base.

Same polls they didn’t trust just a few months ago.

Why am I not surprised?

As far as the rest of the show…I think my anger with it all cut my ability to actually listen.

196
Targetpractice  Mar 7, 2017 • 2:59:00pm

It helps to understand the purpose of this bill and the GOP’s logic if you see it not as what it’s being sold to the rubes as (a “replacement”), but as what it really is: The mother of all poison pills. This bill isn’t about replacing a damned thing, it’s about slitting the ACA’s wrists and bleeding it white so that they can point to the corpse next year and go “See, we told you it was a failure! Now give us 60 votes and we’ll give you something better!” The only flaw in their logic is that they’ve spent so many years pushing full repeal that the base is now holding them to it.

197
Anymouse  Mar 7, 2017 • 3:00:15pm

re: #194 KGxvi

Well, I don’t know how much it costs to live in Arizona (probably more in cities than in rural areas like everywhere else).

As for his homeless issue, I can certainly relate.

My wife’s college debt was $15,000 at its highest point, and due to the way interest was compounded it took over a decade to pay it off.

198
Targetpractice  Mar 7, 2017 • 3:01:07pm

re: #195 ObserverArt

Well, I gritted my teeth and listened to Meat The Chuck Daily and surprise he has Hugh Hewitt on his all-star panel. Funny Hugh was all about polls showing Trump is just fine with GOP politicians and his and the GOP base because polls show he has good ratings with the base.

Same polls they didn’t trust just a few months ago.

Why am I not surprised?

As far as the rest of the show…I think my anger with it all cut my ability to actually listen.

In moving the goalposts, they’re getting closer to saying what they really mean. They’ve stopped bothering to try to bullshit us that he’s popular with the majority of Americans and now are playing up that he remains popular with the GOP base. That’s just one step from saying “He’s popular with the people that we feel matter.”

199
thedopefishlives  Mar 7, 2017 • 3:02:28pm

re: #198 Targetpractice

In moving the goalposts, they’re getting closer to saying what they really mean. They’ve stopped bothering to try to bullshit us that he’s popular with the majority of Americans and now are playing up that he remains popular with the GOP base. That’s just one step from saying “He’s popular with the people that we feel matter.”

WHITE FOLKS LIKE HIM, THAT’S WHAT MATTERS!

Just come out and say it already, folks. We all know what you really mean.

200
Anymouse  Mar 7, 2017 • 3:02:34pm

I need to go into town before the stores close, so I’ll catch y’all later.

201
KGxvi  Mar 7, 2017 • 3:08:00pm

re: #197 Anymouse

Well, I don’t know how much it costs to live in Arizona (probably more in cities than in rural areas like everywhere else).

As for his homeless issue, I can certainly relate.

My wife’s college debt was $15,000 at its highest point, and due to the way interest was compounded it took over a decade to pay it off.

I lucked out a bit in that I went to a public school for undergrad in the late 90s, they were cutting tuition pretty much every year, so I graduated with no debt. I went to a private school for law school and ended up with about $60k in student loan debt - which was lower than many of my classmates. My payments are reasonable, but I’m likely going to be paying for another 20 years or so… and I’ve already been paying for 10.

I think it’s just a lot more complicated than this guy might think.

And, yeah, I am sympathetic to his homelessness issue. But I’m also fairly sure this guy isn’t going to be a serious candidate for the nomination.

202
Joe Bacon  Mar 7, 2017 • 3:08:44pm

re: #167 KGxvi

Huh, so apparently Rosey Grier (yes, the football player) has announced he’s running for governor of California next year as a Republican. He’s 84, which would make him the oldest person to assume the office.

Like we really need a Jesus Freak running California…

203
Eclectic Cyborg  Mar 7, 2017 • 3:10:02pm

God I hope this isn’t a new norm.

Party A passes healthcare law, gets vilified by Party B.

Party B gets elected, seeks to dismantle law to score political points, is vilified by party A.

Party A gets elected and passes a new healthcare law…

This could be a very long and vicious cycle.

204
Targetpractice  Mar 7, 2017 • 3:13:08pm

And as one Fark headline points out, Chaffetz’s iPhone remark makes total sense from a party that thinks young bucks drive to the store in their Cadillac and buy lobster and steak with foodstamps. They see the problem not as millions of Americans simply having no money to afford healthcare, but that millions of Americans are “wasting” money on frivolous things like smartphones when their entire disposable income should go to paying health insurance premiums. If you’ve got money to buy even a second-hand iPhone, then you’ve got money to pay their buddies at Anthem.

205
ObserverArt  Mar 7, 2017 • 3:15:43pm

re: #204 Targetpractice

And as one Fark headline points out, Chaffetz’s iPhone remark makes total sense from a party that thinks young bucks drive to the store in their Cadillac and buy lobster and steak with foodstamps. They see the problem not as millions of Americans simply having no money to afford healthcare, but that millions of Americans are “wasting” money on frivolous things like smartphones when their entire disposable income should go to paying health insurance premiums. If you’ve got money to buy even a second-hand iPhone, then you’ve got money to pay their buddies at Anthem.

They need to get out more.

Which will never happen. It’s much easier not knowing reality than living in a protected bubble and thinking everyone is out to take from you.

206
Blind Frog Belly White  Mar 7, 2017 • 3:16:20pm

re: #204 Targetpractice

And as one Fark headline points out, Chaffetz’s iPhone remark makes total sense from a party that thinks young bucks drive to the store in their Cadillac and buy lobster and steak with foodstamps. They see the problem not as millions of Americans simply having no money to afford healthcare, but that millions of Americans are “wasting” money on frivolous things like smartphones when their entire disposable income should go to paying health insurance premiums. If you’ve got money to buy even a second-hand iPhone, then you’ve got money to pay their buddies at Anthem.

It really suggests they see America as very much two-tiered. Either you’re well enough off that health insurance isn’t a problem, or you’re poor and sucking on the government teat. If you’re the latter, there’s no limit to the degradation that should be visited on you, because you’re not a good person - otherwise you’d be rich.

207
while(1) worries++;  Mar 7, 2017 • 3:20:15pm

re: #203 Eclectic Cyborg

God I hope this isn’t a new norm.

Party A passes healthcare law, gets vilified by Party B.

Party B gets elected, seeks to dismantle law to score political points, is vilified by party A.

Party A gets elected and passes a new healthcare law…

This could be a very long and vicious cycle.

Living with a political system like that does suck. It’s one of the contributing factors to Puerto Rico’s financial woes.

208
ObserverArt  Mar 7, 2017 • 3:24:28pm

re: #206 Blind Frog Belly White

It really suggests they see America as very much two-tiered. Either you’re well enough off that health insurance isn’t a problem, or you’re poor and sucking on the government teat. If you’re the latter, there’s no limit to the degradation that should be visited on you, because you’re not a good person - otherwise you’d be rich.

Bolstered by the Prosperity Gospel. Not just a bad person…a sinner in the eyes of their God.

209
The Dude Abides  Mar 7, 2017 • 3:31:02pm

re: #127 ObserverArt

I hope you are kidding.

What if someone driving by slowed up to watch and started a bad accident sequence? Or they got freaked and didn’t keep in their lane and caused a crash. Stunt wouldn’t be so cool then.

That stretch of California Highway 60 is probably the one between Moreno Valley and Interstate 10, which is the lowest traveled portion of that highway but goes through the “badlands.” Every so often a car goes off the road in that stretch and plunges down a cliff, and the motorist goes missing for days (even with an aerial search of the area). So if someone had become distracted by that jump and gone off the road, that motorcyclist would have been at fault.
en.wikipedia.org

210
gocart mozart  Mar 7, 2017 • 3:36:17pm
ReplyReply w/ QuoteImage

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