Doctor Who: Dark Water Liveblog

Pages

Doctor Who: Dark Water Liveblog

What about Clara, the Doctor and Danny

By Ziggy_TARDIS

Entertainment • November 2014 • Views: 3,912

We have part one of the finale today.

This should prove interesting, and it does look like Clara’s dark side will become very, very obvious.

Recent Pages by ProLifeLiberal (Ziggy_TARDIS):
Hopelessness in the Age of Trump Hurricane Alex Forms Saudi threatens to sue those who compare them to DAESH "The Woman who Lived" Liveblog "The Girl Who Died" Liveblog

Jump to bottom

66 comments

The War TARDIS Nov 1, 2014 1:58:44pm

I have spoiled it for myself a little bit:

Let me say this: Clara has a damn good reason for going dark, and things will get sad in the first 2 minutes.

Missy’s identity, well, not sure but I will be very vague: It is a familiar species on the show.

The War TARDIS Nov 1, 2014 2:01:42pm

Hey, remember my theory?

I was right.

The War TARDIS Nov 1, 2014 5:50:23pm

10 minutes.

The War TARDIS Nov 1, 2014 5:57:49pm

3 minutes.

The War TARDIS Nov 1, 2014 5:59:21pm

1 minute.

The War TARDIS Nov 1, 2014 6:02:11pm

Clara’s Pregnant?

The War TARDIS Nov 1, 2014 6:02:34pm

Bye bye Danny.

The War TARDIS Nov 1, 2014 6:05:14pm

I love Clara’s grandma is awesome.

Clara’s start to darkness.

The War TARDIS Nov 1, 2014 6:06:00pm

Oh boy…..

The War TARDIS Nov 1, 2014 6:07:47pm

Holy shit. Clara has gone nuts.

The War TARDIS Nov 1, 2014 6:11:05pm

Love can warp someone hellishly.

The War TARDIS Nov 1, 2014 6:12:54pm

Going to hell. Literally.

The War TARDIS Nov 1, 2014 6:18:00pm

Courthey from Kill the Moon became President. Of what, I am not sure.

The War TARDIS Nov 1, 2014 6:24:20pm

And we have seen the otherside. Moffat seems to be from a Abrahamic side of beliefs.

Ebolangelus Nov 1, 2014 6:29:16pm

re: #13 The War TARDIS

Courthey from Kill the Moon became President. Of what, I am not sure.

It was implied of the United States, after marrying some American whose name I can’t recall or wasn’t properly mentioned…

The War TARDIS Nov 1, 2014 6:29:24pm

That is an interesting welcome.

The War TARDIS Nov 1, 2014 6:30:08pm

re: #15 Archangelus

Constitutional Amendment.

The War TARDIS Nov 1, 2014 6:30:48pm

What the hell is the song?

Ebolangelus Nov 1, 2014 6:31:04pm

* whispers * “Is it over now?!” LOL

Ebolangelus Nov 1, 2014 6:32:48pm

Interesting, one of clara’s notes had “Blinovitch” on it:
Wikipedia: Blinovitch_Limitation_Effect

The War TARDIS Nov 1, 2014 6:32:50pm

Can you guess who she is?

I already know.

The War TARDIS Nov 1, 2014 6:34:53pm

Afterlife has crime, Wi-Fi, iPads, Steve Jobs.

Ebolangelus Nov 1, 2014 6:35:18pm

re: #21 The War TARDIS

Can you guess who she is?

I already know.

I already know as well, and I still think that’s as much a trick as the one in the initial “reveal”, and one that will be shown as such in the second half of the finale (could be wrong, of course, but it seems so… predictable)

Ebolangelus Nov 1, 2014 6:36:38pm

re: #20 Archangelus

And from that page, which refers to past DW eps:
“In “Kill the Moon”, the Doctor mentions that in Courtney Woods’ future, before becoming the President of the United States, “she met this bloke called Blinovitch”.”

The War TARDIS Nov 1, 2014 6:39:40pm

re: #23 Archangelus

Danny was in Afghanistan or Iraq.

And killed a kid.

It could be because it was so obvious.

Also, thick of it reference.

Ebolangelus Nov 1, 2014 6:42:11pm

Yup, loved that small nod to Malcolm Tucker:
“Another government inspection so soon… why is there all this swearing?!”
“Oh, i’ve got a lot of internalized anger”

The War TARDIS Nov 1, 2014 6:42:33pm

re: #26 Archangelus

I liked it too.

Targetpractice Nov 1, 2014 6:43:45pm

The big reveals of this episode might have been better hidden had they not had trailers. Then the 3W logo would be a bit more of a surprise to those who don’t immediately recognize it.

Ebolangelus Nov 1, 2014 6:47:49pm

Even though i know it would never actually happen, I would pay good money to see a DW episode where 12 was channeling pure Malcolm Tucker, start to end…

The War TARDIS Nov 1, 2014 6:47:56pm

Monty Python Reference.

Ebolangelus Nov 1, 2014 6:49:30pm

re: #30 The War TARDIS

Really? where?

The War TARDIS Nov 1, 2014 6:50:13pm

re: #31 Archangelus

Bring out your dead.

Doctor is an idiot.

The War TARDIS Nov 1, 2014 6:50:53pm

Gallifreyan matrix is saving souls.

The War TARDIS Nov 1, 2014 6:51:58pm

2nd Time Lord confirmed.

Targetpractice Nov 1, 2014 6:53:52pm

If I didn’t know who “Missy” was already, I might have actually believed for a second she was someone else.

RadicalModerate Nov 1, 2014 6:55:58pm

Speculation time- (although I know who she is alreaady) - what timelady did he abandon? Not Romana - she stayed in e-space on her own accord. The Rani? Her fate was more at the hands of the Master than anyone. Not sure if Jenny counts either.

Ebolangelus Nov 1, 2014 6:57:04pm

re: #36 RadicalModerate

Jenny wouldn’t have access to Time Lord stuff, would she?

The War TARDIS Nov 1, 2014 6:57:58pm

re: #35 Targetpractice

Well, Danny gave up Clara. For her good.

The War TARDIS Nov 1, 2014 6:58:25pm

re: #37 Archangelus

Nope…

Time Lords can changet gender.

The War TARDIS Nov 1, 2014 6:59:13pm

Missy

Short for Mistress

The War TARDIS Nov 1, 2014 6:59:32pm

Female form of Master

Ebolangelus Nov 1, 2014 6:59:44pm

re: #39 The War TARDIS

I was referring to the tech (the matrix)…

The War TARDIS Nov 1, 2014 6:59:58pm

There is no trailer.

Ebolangelus Nov 1, 2014 6:59:59pm

“Doctor Skarosa” - anagram?

Ebolangelus Nov 1, 2014 7:00:24pm

re: #43 The War TARDIS

There is no trailer.

Last week’s trailer included scenes from both finale episodes…

The War TARDIS Nov 1, 2014 7:00:35pm

re: #42 Archangelus

But the Master, last seen on Gallifrey, would.

Targetpractice Nov 1, 2014 7:01:34pm

So, the wild-assed guess I made over two months ago was right…

DAMN YOU MOFFAT!!!

Ebolangelus Nov 1, 2014 7:03:19pm

re: #46 The War TARDIS

But the Master, last seen on Gallifrey, would.

Except that doesn’t really fit in with the line does it? “”The one you abandoned, the one you left for dead” - Ten didn’t abandon the Master…
Between that, the “robot” trick and the fact that it’s too damn obvious (and Moffat loves his twists), I’m thinking it’s not actually the Master but a lie by another Time Lady….

RadicalModerate Nov 1, 2014 7:05:16pm

re: #36 RadicalModerate

And now that the reveal has been made - when did the Doctor ever abandon the Master? It never happened in the new series out of all of his (now her) appearances. There’s times that he left him as the victim of his own devices in classic Who - but it was almost always implied back then that he had an escape plan in place.

Not to mention that he apparently found a way off of time-locked Gallifrey - something that the entire High Council couldn’t figure out how to do.

Ebolangelus Nov 1, 2014 7:05:36pm

Another point: who is “Seb” really? Unlike the late Dr. who got incinerated, who seemed to genuinely believe the 3W mission, Seb is clearly cooperating in full with Missy…

Targetpractice Nov 1, 2014 7:10:52pm

I do have to say, I loved the final scene. The part after the non-reveal, when you get the Cybers walking down the stairs. Does it seem familiar? It should to a long-time fan:

The Invasion

Targetpractice Nov 1, 2014 7:18:59pm

So, I guess now the big question is, what’s the Master’s angle this time? Is this a paying gig or just for kicks? We’re seen the Doctor’s enemies work together before, but generally it’s been with the understanding that they were both getting something out of the deal. And while an entire planet of spare parts no doubt appeals to the Cybers, I’m not sure what “Missy” is getting out of it all.

hartly Nov 1, 2014 7:19:59pm

re: #52 Targetpractice

So, I guess now the big question is, what’s the Master’s angle this time? Is this a paying gig or just for kicks? We’re seen the Doctor’s enemies work together before, but generally it’s been with the understanding that they were both getting something out of the deal. And while an entire planet of spare parts no doubt appeals to the Cybers, I’m not sure what “Missy” is getting out of it all.

He’s probably just being a dick.

Targetpractice Nov 1, 2014 7:31:13pm

re: #53 hartly

He’s probably just being a dick.

Nah, the Master’s usually been about big, grandiose plans that in some way empowered him. Turning all of humanity into Cybermen just to dick around isn’t his, or rather her, style. After her comment about Clara, I’m beginning to wonder if this whole thing is simply about exacting some sort of revenge on the Doctor. Perhaps destroying Clara, body and spirit, and thus leaving the Doctor all alone again.

hartly Nov 1, 2014 7:43:52pm

re: #11 The War TARDIS

Love can warp someone hellishly.

I suppose it can, but…One of the big problems I have with NuWho - and really with the old series in its last few years - is the way reactions people have to normal (albeit unpleasant) experiences were/are constantly blown out of proportion while the reactions they would have to truly bizarre, mind-blowing experiences are glossed over glibly. I have to agree with the Doctor that it was kind of weird in last week’s episode when Clara was more concerned about having a fight with her boyfriend than she was about the imminent end of the world, and while obviously his death is a much bigger and more upsetting occurrence, I still think it’s a little unlikely she would go so thoroughly crazy over something that basically happens to everybody at some point or another. Especially since they haven’t even really known each other all that long.

hartly Nov 1, 2014 8:03:41pm

On average this has been the best season of Doctor Who since the series came back in 2005. Maybe the best since the 1985 hiatus. Capaldi’s the best Doctor since Davison imo, and I’d probably be watching the show now even if I hadn’t been a fan of the original series, something that wasn’t even true when Eccleston was playing the Doctor. But there is something holding the show down. Take Clara - and all her relationship issues - out of the mix and we’d have something really special going on.

Yes, I know, there are a lot of people who think focusing on the companions’ emotional lives somehow makes the series more realistic and moving, but I think we can just take it as read that everyone who travels with the Doctor has a life outside of the TARDIS, and I find the longer an emotional scene takes, the less impact it has on me. And it eats up time we could be using for exposition. Maybe we would know why the Daleks were referring to the humans as “rebels” in Into the Dalek if we hadn’t cut to a pointless Clara and Danny scene after the teaser.

The War TARDIS Nov 1, 2014 8:14:27pm

re: #55 hartly

If something happened to me lady in Iran, I honestly couldn’t say what I would do.

You might think that way, however, when you are in your mid 20s, and something that catastrophic happens, You might lose it.

Good episode. Though, fuck Moffat for making me wait a week.

I do think that “Time Heist” should have been a 2 parter.

hartly Nov 1, 2014 8:16:02pm

re: #36 RadicalModerate

Speculation time- (although I know who she is alreaady) - what timelady did he abandon? Not Romana - she stayed in e-space on her own accord. The Rani? Her fate was more at the hands of the Master than anyone. Not sure if Jenny counts either.

I actually thought it was Romana right after he said Misi was short for Mistress, hearkening back to K-9’s name for her. I was disabused of that notion pretty quickly.

The War TARDIS Nov 1, 2014 8:19:18pm

re: #56 hartly

See, I like seeing the emotional aspect.

I don’t think Clara will be around after Christmas. And I think we are now looking at a Pertwee Mk2 with the 12th Doctor. Especially with the New Master.

I would be say the Master regenerated after getting trapped with the Gallifreyan High Council, which meant he escaped, or defeated Rassilon.

As for being left behind, I think he may have known about the Doctor’s interference in The Day of the Doctor. This would especially make sense because the General and his staff had already said the High Council’s plan had failed. He was like in the Capital, likely barely off-screen.

The War TARDIS Nov 1, 2014 8:20:05pm

Also, PSA

ALWAYS LOOK BEFORE CROSSING THE STREET!!!!!!

The War TARDIS Nov 1, 2014 8:21:52pm

Also, the Doctor as grumpy and nasty as he can be, will go to hell for a friend to make them happy.

Targetpractice Nov 1, 2014 8:42:52pm

Doctor’s demonstrated time and again that he’d got to any lengths to help a friend, even one who’d betrayed him. Despite Ten’s post-regeneration remark, the Doctor has always been a man who’d give anyone a second chance. He even forgave the Master when he killed millions of humans and enslaved the rest. So not only forgiving Clara for betraying his trust, but also helping her find her love, is very much him.

Plus I think, whether he wants to admit it or not, he’s still motivated by all those he couldn’t help, those he couldn’t save. One wonders how much the sudden departure of Amy is playing into his drive to help Clara.

The War TARDIS Nov 1, 2014 9:22:58pm

I do adore Danny for doing what he did at the end of the episode.

I will criticize the fact that Clara was considering something awful at the end. However, at the same time, I think she was bluffing when she said Clara Oswald never existed. I think she was trying to escape.

I don’t know if it will work. I still think the Master (Mistress? What do we call Missy Now?) was involved in giving Clara the Doctor’s phone number. But to what purpose. If anything, the Master has strengthened the Doctor with Clara. Saved his life literally countless times.

The Master is still undeniably evil, considering what she did to the Doctor she (what pronoun do I use for the Master now?) disintegrated.

The War TARDIS Nov 1, 2014 9:35:25pm

Ok, Tumblr people are saying we call her Missy, and identify her as a woman now.

This is earth-changing, though no one realizes it yet.

This means, depending on reaction, that the Doctor can regenerate as a woman. Maybe as soon as next time. What woman would you want to be the Doctor after this incarnation?

The War TARDIS Nov 1, 2014 9:58:26pm

Meanwhile, awful people have shown up.