Thursday Night Music: Tom Petty and the Heartbreakers
Music • Views: 6,180
Tom Petty & the Heartbreakers rocking hard on “You Wreck Me,” from the under-appreciated album Wildflowers. (The iTunes Store has it too.)
725 comments
2 |
albusteve Thu, Feb 25, 2010 6:15:00pm |
Charles hits a homer...nice, and thanks for that
| 3 |
Kragar Thu, Feb 25, 2010 6:15:24pm |
Hey Charles, does this have any affect on you?
Amazon.com tax: California residents may soon have to pay sales taxes for most online purchases
The California State Senate has passed a bill that would force some online sites, even ones based out of state, to charge sales taxes. Right now, only online sites that have a physical presence in California have to charge sales taxes. But the tax-hungry and belt-tightening adverse state wants to put an end to that.
| 4 |
albusteve Thu, Feb 25, 2010 6:16:22pm |
simple, straight up rock and roll...just a good hook and fun to listen to
| 5 |
The Sanity Inspector Thu, Feb 25, 2010 6:16:38pm |
One of the classic rock stations here in Atlanta is all Tom Petty all the time. Don't think I've heard this one, though; thanks.
| 6 |
Racer X Thu, Feb 25, 2010 6:17:13pm |
re: #4 albusteve
simple, straight up rock and roll...just a good hook and fun to listen to
Sounds like everything Petty does.
| 7 |
brookly red Thu, Feb 25, 2010 6:17:21pm |
I don't know why women get all squisshy when he yells "breakdown, go ahead and give it to me" I am just glad they do...
| 8 |
albusteve Thu, Feb 25, 2010 6:18:04pm |
| 9 |
Darth Vader Gargoyle Thu, Feb 25, 2010 6:18:45pm |
So I got Chinese delivery yesterday...my fortune cookie read:
"You are an inspiration to those around you"
in bed.
| 10 |
Charles Johnson Thu, Feb 25, 2010 6:18:47pm |
re: #3 Kragar (Proud to be Kafir)
Hey Charles, does this have any affect on you?
Amazon.com tax: California residents may soon have to pay sales taxes for most online purchases
Not directly. But it's an incredibly bone-headed idea. Which is standard for the California state government.
Hey, let's make California even less friendly to businesses!
| 11 |
The Sanity Inspector Thu, Feb 25, 2010 6:18:59pm |
re: #6 Racer X
Sounds like everything Petty does.
A rewrite of Runnin' Down a Dream, somewhat. But then, how many acts would love to have an instantly recognizable sound, like he does.
| 12 |
The Sanity Inspector Thu, Feb 25, 2010 6:20:33pm |
re: #10 Charles
Not directly. But it's an incredibly bone-headed idea. Which is standard for the California state government.
Hey, let's make California even less friendly to businesses!
Drive more businesses away with new taxes, and use the brief inflow of $$ to pay more unemployment benefits. A disease masquerading as its own cure, that government is...
| 13 |
Darth Vader Gargoyle Thu, Feb 25, 2010 6:21:23pm |
re: #12 The Sanity Inspector
Drive more businesses away with new taxes, and use the brief inflow of $$ to pay more unemployment benefits. A disease masquerading as its own cure, that government is...
Don't forget unsustainable union pension plans. They need some fundage too!!
| 14 |
Kragar Thu, Feb 25, 2010 6:21:26pm |
re: #10 Charles
Not directly. But it's an incredibly bone-headed idea. Which is standard for the California state government.
Hey, let's make California even less friendly to businesses!
Everytime it seems like they can't do anything more to drive away business, they find another. Thank God for DoD contracts.
| 15 |
albusteve Thu, Feb 25, 2010 6:22:32pm |
re: #11 The Sanity Inspector
A rewrite of Runnin' Down a Dream, somewhat. But then, how many acts would love to have an instantly recognizable sound, like he does.
yea, I give these guys credit...they never went off searching for their sound or blew up from exposure etc....Petty knows what he wants, simple guitar/keyboard stuff with clever lyrics (thanks Bob!)....a smooth California thing...people love it and he's made a ton of money for it...that's all cool
| 16 |
albusteve Thu, Feb 25, 2010 6:23:17pm |
re: #12 The Sanity Inspector
Drive more businesses away with new taxes, and use the brief inflow of $$ to pay more unemployment benefits. A disease masquerading as its own cure, that government is...
grrrr...no comment
| 17 |
Stanghazi Thu, Feb 25, 2010 6:23:44pm |
re: #15 albusteve
yea, I give these guys credit...they never went off searching for their sound or blew up from exposure etc...Petty knows what he wants, simple guitar/keyboard stuff with clever lyrics (thanks Bob!)...a smooth California thing...people love it and he's made a ton of money for it...that's all cool
That originated in Gainesville Florida!
| 18 |
Daniel Ballard Thu, Feb 25, 2010 6:24:28pm |
I had this amazing conversation with Benmont Tench two summers ago He is friends with a neighbor of mine. My neighbor and Benmont and a few of us were just hanging out by the pool. The subject of Tom Petty comes up. I speak up in admiration of Tom's writing and then how I really can NOT take his voice. At the midpoint of the afternoon I find out he is Tom's keyboard guy. Talk about embarrassed! I just stuttered. "oh man blame the wine" I said. Ben was very cool about it, actually gave me respects for candor.
| 19 |
brookly red Thu, Feb 25, 2010 6:24:47pm |
re: #12 The Sanity Inspector
Drive more businesses away with new taxes, and use the brief inflow of $$ to pay more unemployment benefits. A disease masquerading as its own cure, that government is...
I got nothing to add... just wanted to re-post that.
| 20 |
Darth Vader Gargoyle Thu, Feb 25, 2010 6:25:45pm |
re: #12 The Sanity Inspector
Drive more businesses away with new taxes, and use the brief inflow of $$ to pay more unemployment benefits. A disease masquerading as its own cure, that government is...
The problem with socialism is that eventually you run out of other people's money...
Margaret Thatcher.
| 21 |
brookly red Thu, Feb 25, 2010 6:26:53pm |
re: #20 rwdflynavy
The problem with socialism is that eventually you run out of other people's money...
Margaret Thatcher.
eventually? eventually done happened.
| 22 |
jamesfirecat Thu, Feb 25, 2010 6:27:28pm |
re: #12 The Sanity Inspector
Drive more businesses away with new taxes, and use the brief inflow of $$ to pay more unemployment benefits. A disease masquerading as its own cure, that government is...
re: #19 brookly red
"Commerce is the life blood of the city. If we are not careful, government will become the cancer."
| 23 |
Walter L. Newton Thu, Feb 25, 2010 6:27:32pm |
re: #10 Charles
Not directly. But it's an incredibly bone-headed idea. Which is standard for the California state government.
Hey, let's make California even less friendly to businesses!
It's fixin' to happen here in Colorado too.
| 24 |
solomonpanting Thu, Feb 25, 2010 6:27:48pm |
With a 35 to 15 majority, I'm surprised the Dems haven't already passed this PoC.
| 25 |
Daniel Ballard Thu, Feb 25, 2010 6:28:18pm |
re: #10 Charles
Every time California does something dumb like this, I remind my co-workers who has been in the huge majority here for quite some time, and to remember these things in the voting booth. I think we will both be watching this election season carefully.
| 26 |
Walter L. Newton Thu, Feb 25, 2010 6:29:29pm |
re: #20 rwdflynavy
The problem with socialism is that eventually you run out of other people's money...
Margaret Thatcher.
That's not true. All you have to do is raise taxes. Our tax rate is nothing compared to... oh let's say France. We shouldn't be complaining about tax rates until they start going higher than most European countries. Before that, we should pay more.
| 27 |
brookly red Thu, Feb 25, 2010 6:29:35pm |
| 28 |
Darth Vader Gargoyle Thu, Feb 25, 2010 6:30:10pm |
re: #26 Walter L. Newton
That's not true. All you have to do is raise taxes. Our tax rate is nothing compared to... oh let's say France. We shouldn't be complaining about tax rates until they start going higher than most European countries. Before that, we should pay more.
Plus the feds can just print more money!!! Wheeeeeeee!!!!
| 29 |
MandyManners Thu, Feb 25, 2010 6:31:03pm |
re: #26 Walter L. Newton
That's not true. All you have to do is raise taxes. Our tax rate is nothing compared to... oh let's say France. We shouldn't be complaining about tax rates until they start going higher than most European countries. Before that, we should pay more.
What in the world?
| 30 |
Darth Vader Gargoyle Thu, Feb 25, 2010 6:31:21pm |
re: #26 Walter L. Newton
That's not true. All you have to do is raise taxes. Our tax rate is nothing compared to... oh let's say France. We shouldn't be complaining about tax rates until they start going higher than most European countries. Before that, we should pay more.
Plus with unemployment being a problem we can just make more govt jobs. Look at Greece, half their jobs are govt union jobs. You certainly don't hear about the Greeks having any problems!!!
//
| 31 |
brookly red Thu, Feb 25, 2010 6:31:39pm |
| 32 |
sattv4u2 Thu, Feb 25, 2010 6:31:49pm |
re: #10 Charles
re: #23 Walter L. Newton
Meanwhile ,, here in Georgia, they've been enticing companies to relocate here. National Cash Register is the latest
[Link: atlanta.bizjournals.com...]
2100 jobs leaving Ohio soon to be in Georgia
More jobs here means more homes sold means more property (and sales) taxes collected. THATS how to grow an economy
| 33 |
MandyManners Thu, Feb 25, 2010 6:31:54pm |
| 34 |
Walter L. Newton Thu, Feb 25, 2010 6:32:07pm |
| 35 |
Darth Vader Gargoyle Thu, Feb 25, 2010 6:32:07pm |
| 36 |
HAL2010 Thu, Feb 25, 2010 6:32:09pm |
Haven't written here for a while, and apologies.
OT:
Here is Sarah Barracuda's intelligent response to the Health Care Summit held today:
"Drag away from Obamacare mtg today2cheer Red,White&Blue:USA Women's Hockey w/AK's own#23 Weiland play Canada for Gold.Huge contest.Go U-S-A!"
America, read and weep. Then contemplate that she might one day be your President.
| 37 |
Walter L. Newton Thu, Feb 25, 2010 6:32:30pm |
| 38 |
MandyManners Thu, Feb 25, 2010 6:32:30pm |
| 39 |
brookly red Thu, Feb 25, 2010 6:32:54pm |
re: #30 rwdflynavy
Plus with unemployment being a problem we can just make more govt jobs. Look at Greece, half their jobs are govt union jobs. You certainly don't hear about the Greeks having any problems!!!
//
I heard that it's pretty baaaaaahhhhd in Greece...
| 40 |
brookly red Thu, Feb 25, 2010 6:33:14pm |
| 41 |
Darth Vader Gargoyle Thu, Feb 25, 2010 6:33:24pm |
re: #38 MandyManners
Tag?
sarc tag, but in this case I guess he is serious.
Walter, why are you in favor of a tax structure like Europe?
| 42 |
sattv4u2 Thu, Feb 25, 2010 6:34:45pm |
re: #36 HAL2010
Haven't written here for a while, and apologies.
OT:
Here is Sarah Barracuda's intelligent response to the Health Care Summit held today:
"Drag away from Obamacare mtg today2cheer Red,White&Blue:USA Women's Hockey w/AK's own#23 Weiland play Canada for Gold.Huge contest.Go U-S-A!"
America, read and weep. Then contemplate that she might one day be your President.
What a terrible woman. Imagine rooting for ones own countries team to win a medal.
{sigh}
| 43 |
HAL2010 Thu, Feb 25, 2010 6:35:26pm |
And the Greeks aren't exactly asking the Germans nicely for a bailout either.
"Greek rescue in danger as deputy prime minister attacks 'Nazi' Germany"
"Greece has greatly damaged its chances of an EU bail-out by lashing out at Germany over war-time atrocities and accusing Italy of cooking its books to hide public debt. "
| 44 |
WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.] Thu, Feb 25, 2010 6:36:15pm |
You CANNOT GO WRONG WITH TOM PETTY
Running Down a Dream is one f my favorite songs of all time. Don't Come Around Here No More is one of my favorite videos of all time :D
| 45 |
brookly red Thu, Feb 25, 2010 6:36:37pm |
re: #42 sattv4u2
What a terrible woman. Imagine rooting for ones own countries team to win a medal.
{sigh}
gosh... maybe an apology tour?
| 46 |
Walter L. Newton Thu, Feb 25, 2010 6:37:42pm |
re: #40 brookly red
re: #41 rwdflynavy
Because... it appears that we are going to get the government controlled health care no matter what. And my financial situation is still headed down, after 5 years of really honest and sincere attempts to find full time employment in my career as a programmer, nothing has come of it.
So, it should be more than a couple of years before I exhaust most of by ability to take care of myself, I am going to have to embrace government help.
If I am going to do that, I want as much as I can get. And if raising taxes on all Americans is part of making these things happen, I'm all for it.
The left is all for it, I'll have very good company.
| 47 |
brookly red Thu, Feb 25, 2010 6:37:57pm |
re: #36 HAL2010
Haven't written here for a while, and apologies.
OT:
Here is Sarah Barracuda's intelligent response to the Health Care Summit held today:
"Drag away from Obamacare mtg today2cheer Red,White&Blue:USA Women's Hockey w/AK's own#23 Weiland play Canada for Gold.Huge contest.Go U-S-A!"
America, read and weep. Then contemplate that she might one day be your President.
I am ready for the up grade :)
| 48 |
Charles Johnson Thu, Feb 25, 2010 6:38:20pm |
If you believe the spin on Fox News, by way of Frank Luntz, the Republicans like, totally won the health care summit!
I watched it. The Republicans didn't win. On balance, the GOP pols looked like obstructionist buffoons. The Democrats weren't a whole lot better, but this was definitely not the victory the reality-deprived right wing is claiming.
| 49 |
WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.] Thu, Feb 25, 2010 6:38:44pm |
re: #42 sattv4u2
What a terrible woman. Imagine rooting for ones own countries team to win a medal.
{sigh}
She's a terrible woman because of her septic lies about health care reform. The things she's said are unforgivable. I'd sooner vote for James Traficant for president.
| 50 |
Killgore Trout Thu, Feb 25, 2010 6:39:23pm |
re: #24 solomonpanting
With a 35 to 15 majority, I'm surprised the Dems haven't already passed this PoC.
That is curious. I still can't figure out why they just didn't reconcile the bills and get it done. Something spooked them.
| 51 |
sandbox Thu, Feb 25, 2010 6:40:01pm |
I think of buying on the internet as modern-day mail order. As I recall, when I used to do mail order, I would have to pay sales tax for my state of residence. So to be consistent, why shouldn't internet sales be subject to sales tax?
| 52 |
WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.] Thu, Feb 25, 2010 6:40:05pm |
re: #48 Charles
They won the health care summit the way Plushenko won a platinum medal: [Link: sports.yahoo.com...]
if you make up your own rules and victory conditions...you win!
| 53 |
Stanghazi Thu, Feb 25, 2010 6:40:56pm |
re: #52 WindUpBird
They won the health care summit the way Plushenko won a platinum medal: [Link: sports.yahoo.com...]
if you make up your own rules and victory conditions...you win!
I saw that Platinum medal! Rewriting history is all the rage these days.
| 54 |
sattv4u2 Thu, Feb 25, 2010 6:41:10pm |
re: #50 Killgore Trout
That is curious. I still can't figure out why they just didn't reconcile the bills and get it done. Something spooked them.
I think the word you're looking for is constituents!
| 55 |
brookly red Thu, Feb 25, 2010 6:41:25pm |
re: #46 Walter L. Newton
re: #41 rwdflynavy
Because... it appears that we are going to get the government controlled health care no matter what. And my financial situation is still headed down, after 5 years of really honest and sincere attempts to find full time employment in my career as a programmer, nothing has come of it.
So, it should be more than a couple of years before I exhaust most of by ability to take care of myself, I am going to have to embrace government help.
If I am going to do that, I want as much as I can get. And if raising taxes on all Americans is part of making these things happen, I'm all for it.
The left is all for it, I'll have very good company.
Because... it appears that we are going to get the government controlled health care no matter what.
No, I think that there are too many Americans ready to stand up for that to happen.
| 56 |
solomonpanting Thu, Feb 25, 2010 6:41:35pm |
re: #50 Killgore Trout
That is curious. I still can't figure out why they just didn't reconcile the bills and get it done. Something spooked them.
The state is broke.
"You never want a serious crisis to go to waste. And what I mean by that is an opportunity to do things you think you could not do before."
Lather. Rinse. Repeat.
| 57 |
Killgore Trout Thu, Feb 25, 2010 6:42:19pm |
re: #54 sattv4u2
I think the word you're looking for is constituents!
I don't think that's it. Everyone can point to a biased poll in their favor but support for healthcare reform is fairly evenly split.
| 58 |
brookly red Thu, Feb 25, 2010 6:42:33pm |
re: #50 Killgore Trout
That is curious. I still can't figure out why they just didn't reconcile the bills and get it done. Something spooked them.
pay back is a bitch.
| 59 |
WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.] Thu, Feb 25, 2010 6:42:43pm |
re: #54 sattv4u2
I think the word you're looking for is constituents!
If by constitutents you mean health insurers and their gravy train, then yes.
| 60 |
Darth Vader Gargoyle Thu, Feb 25, 2010 6:43:25pm |
re: #57 Killgore Trout
I don't think that's it. Everyone can point to a biased poll in their favor but support for healthcare reform is fairly evenly split.
Which biased poll tells you that?
| 61 |
albusteve Thu, Feb 25, 2010 6:43:25pm |
re: #50 Killgore Trout
That is curious. I still can't figure out why they just didn't reconcile the bills and get it done. Something spooked them.
their job security...you make too much of the whole thing...these guys have one thing in mind all the time 24/7...their seats
| 62 |
brookly red Thu, Feb 25, 2010 6:44:15pm |
re: #48 Charles
If you believe the spin on Fox News, by way of Frank Luntz, the Republicans like, totally won the health care summit!
I watched it. The Republicans didn't win. On balance, the GOP pols looked like obstructionist buffoons. The Democrats weren't a whole lot better, but this was definitely not the victory the reality-deprived right wing is claiming.
Sir, with all due respect I disagree.
| 63 |
solomonpanting Thu, Feb 25, 2010 6:44:27pm |
re: #24 solomonpanting
With a 35 to 15 majority, I'm surprised the Dems haven't already passed this PoC.
That should be a 25 to 15 majority.
| 64 |
mich-again Thu, Feb 25, 2010 6:44:47pm |
re: #10 Charles
Not directly. But it's an incredibly bone-headed idea. Which is standard for the California state government.
Hey, let's make California even less friendly to businesses!
Anti-science people get mocked, but the people who are willfully ignorant when it comes to economics get a free pass.
| 65 |
Walter L. Newton Thu, Feb 25, 2010 6:45:03pm |
re: #55 brookly red
Because... it appears that we are going to get the government controlled health care no matter what.
No, I think that there are too many Americans ready to stand up for that to happen.
No... the left has a straight shot to getting it... public opinion can't stop them if they don't let it... and I hope they don't let it effect them... I will be very satisfied when it passes... and I will have no compunctions in talking all I can get if I need it.
That's why they want it, so folks like me don't fall through the cracks. I don't intend to fall.... I'm talking care of myself, and I don't care what it will cost anyone else.
| 66 |
BARACK THE VOTE Thu, Feb 25, 2010 6:45:07pm |
Apologies if this has already been posted --
South Dakota legislators tell schools to teach ‘astrological’ explanation for global warming.
Last week, the South Dakota House of Representatives passed a resolution to “urge” public schools to teach astrology. By a 36-30 vote, the legislators passed House Concurrent Resolution 1009, “Calling for balanced teaching of global warming in the public schools of South Dakota.” After repeating long-debunked denier myths and calling carbon dioxide “the gas of life,” the resolution concludes that public schools should teach that “global warming is a scientific theory rather than a proven fact”:
Wow.
| 68 |
sattv4u2 Thu, Feb 25, 2010 6:46:19pm |
! re: #59 WindUpBird
If by constitutents you mean health insurers and their gravy train, then yes.
Got it ,,, BIG BIDNESS = BAD !
| 69 |
Darth Vader Gargoyle Thu, Feb 25, 2010 6:46:33pm |
re: #67 Walter L. Newton
BBIAB... mac and cheese supper...
Whoa there bub! If I'm paying for your health care you better choke down some fruits and veggies!!!!
| 70 |
WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.] Thu, Feb 25, 2010 6:47:05pm |
re: #55 brookly red
Because... it appears that we are going to get the government controlled health care no matter what.
No, I think that there are too many Americans ready to stand up for that to happen.
"ready to stand up" Are those the Americans who wave signs calling obama the N-word? Or maybe they're the Americans who scream about socialism even though they don't know the meaning of the word socialism. Or perhaps it's the Americans who want Sarah Palin to become president even though she knows less about world history than a 7th grader. The Americans who believe everythin that comes out of Glenn beck and Rush Limbaugh's mouth? The Americans that fell down the rabbit hole with Michele Bachmann, swallowing all of her bircher paranoia and freaking out about the census?
Yep, those Americans. There are many of them, that's true! But I don't think they'll win in the end.
| 71 |
Mostly sane, most of the time. Thu, Feb 25, 2010 6:47:22pm |
Just for the record, the Tom Petty song "You Tell Me" got me through a break up twenty years ago.
| 72 |
WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.] Thu, Feb 25, 2010 6:47:25pm |
| 73 |
albusteve Thu, Feb 25, 2010 6:47:57pm |
re: #58 brookly red
pay back is a bitch.
no shit...the best two jobs in the world...congressman and senator...once you have it your in and golden, you lose it, you'll never get it back...that simple fact defines all of American politics inside the Capitol...anybody that thinks otherwise need their head examined...pretending about these slight nuances and political maneuverings is a waste of time...thread worthy and worth hundreds of posts?....maybe for most, but not to me
| 74 |
mich-again Thu, Feb 25, 2010 6:48:17pm |
| 75 |
brookly red Thu, Feb 25, 2010 6:48:21pm |
re: #65 Walter L. Newton
No... the left has a straight shot to getting it... public opinion can't stop them if they don't let it... and I hope they don't let it effect them... I will be very satisfied when it passes... and I will have no compunctions in talking all I can get if I need it.
That's why they want it, so folks like me don't fall through the cracks. I don't intend to fall... I'm talking care of myself, and I don't care what it will cost anyone else.
always look out for number one, but the word on the street in NYC is "over my dead body"... I don't see this happening.
| 76 |
Darth Vader Gargoyle Thu, Feb 25, 2010 6:48:39pm |
re: #70 WindUpBird
"ready to stand up" Are those the Americans who wave signs calling obama the N-word? Or maybe they're the Americans who scream about socialism even though they don't know the meaning of the word socialism. Or perhaps it's the Americans who want Sarah Palin to become president even though she knows less about world history than a 7th grader. The Americans who believe everythin that comes out of Glenn beck and Rush Limbaugh's mouth? The Americans that fell down the rabbit hole with Michele Bachmann, swallowing all of her bircher paranoia and freaking out about the census?
Yep, those Americans. There are many of them, that's true! But I don't think they'll win in the end.
Yeah, I'm none of those folks and I don't want to see this plan pass either.
| 77 |
sattv4u2 Thu, Feb 25, 2010 6:49:10pm |
re: #57 Killgore Trout
I don't think that's it. Everyone can point to a biased poll in their favor but support for healthcare reform is fairly evenly split.
IF the support is "evenly split" (and I do not beleive it is) not many politicians will put their necks on the line until/ unless it's decisively "split" one way or another
This isn't a bill they can hide behind with the "well ,, it's good for MY state"
| 78 |
brookly red Thu, Feb 25, 2010 6:49:36pm |
| 79 |
Virginia Plain Thu, Feb 25, 2010 6:50:04pm |
re: #67 Walter L. Newton
BBIAB... mac and cheese supper...
Hopefully it's something like Annie's with the sauce in a pouch, and not Kraft, with the cheese powder.
| 80 |
albusteve Thu, Feb 25, 2010 6:50:22pm |
| 81 |
WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.] Thu, Feb 25, 2010 6:50:55pm |
re: #68 sattv4u2
!
Got it ,,, BIG BIDNESS = BAD !
Wow, man. I didn't know bumper stickers could type!
Hey, maybe next time you can just stencil your mindless mouth-breather taking points on a sandwich board and take a picture of it with your web camera. It'd be more authentic that way!
And then you can continue to deny that health insurers are incredibly wasteful and that our system gives us far less value for our dollar than other systems in other countries, you can continue to deny that Republicans and Democrats in Senate are heavily beholden to health insurers, and then you can claim the earth is flat and the sun revolves around us! Yay!
| 82 |
Darth Vader Gargoyle Thu, Feb 25, 2010 6:51:21pm |
| 83 |
goddamnedfrank Thu, Feb 25, 2010 6:51:34pm |
re: #66 iceweasel
Apologies if this has already been posted --
South Dakota legislators tell schools to teach ‘astrological’ explanation for global warming.
Wow.
The earth is getting warmer because Barack Obama is a Leo / Ox.
Run with it people.
| 84 |
Darth Vader Gargoyle Thu, Feb 25, 2010 6:51:59pm |
re: #81 WindUpBird
Wow, man. I didn't know bumper stickers could type!
Hey, maybe next time you can just stencil your mindless mouth-breather taking points on a sandwich board and take a picture of it with your web camera. It'd be more authentic that way!
And then you can continue to deny that health insurers are incredibly wasteful and that our system gives us far less value for our dollar than other systems in other countries, you can continue to deny that Republicans and Democrats in Senate are heavily beholden to health insurers, and then you can claim the earth is flat and the sun revolves around us! Yay!
Speaking of mouth breathers, what is a "taking point"?
| 85 |
sattv4u2 Thu, Feb 25, 2010 6:52:35pm |
re: #81 WindUpBird
your mindless mouth-breather taking points
MY "mindless mouth-breather taking (sic) points
health insurers and their gravy train
MMmmmmkkkaaaayyyy
| 86 |
albusteve Thu, Feb 25, 2010 6:52:50pm |
re: #83 goddamnedfrank
The earth is getting warmer because Barack Obama is a Leo / Ox.
Run with it people.
I'm a Gemini...I can go either way (and pick your pocket too!)
| 87 |
MandyManners Thu, Feb 25, 2010 6:52:54pm |
| 88 |
Stonemason Thu, Feb 25, 2010 6:52:56pm |
re: #70 WindUpBird
yup, the only people who do not want this passed are idiots. Oh, hang on, racist idiots. No, wait, gullible, racist idiots.
Got it now, thanks.
| 89 |
Killgore Trout Thu, Feb 25, 2010 6:53:12pm |
Gergen On CNN: Dems Didn't Get "Breakthrough" They Wanted; GOP "Had Their Best Day In Years"
Hooray for easily debunked talking points!
| 90 |
BARACK THE VOTE Thu, Feb 25, 2010 6:54:22pm |
re: #83 goddamnedfrank
The earth is getting warmer because Barack Obama is a Leo / Ox.
Run with it people.
Seems like a whole lot of crazy out there today...
Puppet cleavage too hot for the religious right in Colorado Springs.
Avenue Q is a Tony-winning musical about people and puppets trying to find their way in New York City. Though inspired by the style of Sesame Street, the show deals with “adult situations” like sex and drinking, and one of its most popular songs is “The Internet is for Porn.” The musical is now coming to conservative Colorado Springs, but a billboard executive in the city has banned a promotional poster showing puppet cleavage because the company wants to take a more “conservative approach.” Colorado Springs is home to right-wing organizations like Focus on the Family and has become “a base from which the evangelical movement launches initiatives that affect civic life across the nation.” Disgraced pastor Ted Haggard, for example, set up his megachurch there. The ad that will instead be running in Colorado Springs shows the face of a blue puppet named Rod — a Republican who is a closeted gay puppet in love with his best friend.
Update The site Momlogic writes, "Hold the phone people. If we're going to start censoring puppet's naughty pillows (ironically made out of some of the same materials as actual pillows), there is another culprit that's been appealing to our prurient interests since 1969. Kermit the Frog has been appearing sans clothes for decades. Hope he's not planning a vacation to Colorado Springs anytime soon, or they'll run his little green ass out of town!"
| 91 |
sandbox Thu, Feb 25, 2010 6:54:32pm |
The trial lawyers should give Dick Durban an award for the way he opposed tort reform today and no limits on punitive damages.
| 92 |
WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.] Thu, Feb 25, 2010 6:54:44pm |
re: #78 brookly red
Me & tens of millions of others... bitch.
Tens of millions of uninformed and myopic people, yes, I know. I've met many of them. They say they don't want the gubbermint's hands on their medicare, lol. Look, it'll likely pass, because it makes sense. And then you'll complain, and angry bearded gentlemen with sandwich boards will shout, and our health system will improve despite your complaints, and life will go on. You won't even notice a difference in your own health insurance, I bet. But I'm sure you'll still complain. Complain, complain complain.
| 93 |
sattv4u2 Thu, Feb 25, 2010 6:54:58pm |
Ah well ,,, second half of Celtics/ Cavaleirs and Olympics are on
GO TEAM USA!!!!
| 94 |
brookly red Thu, Feb 25, 2010 6:55:02pm |
Well it has come to inevitable point of bickering, so I have made my position clear, no retreat-no surrender. I will now withdraw and defer to the experts...
good night all.
| 95 |
WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.] Thu, Feb 25, 2010 6:55:18pm |
re: #82 rwdflynavy
Some might even call it...EVIL!!!
I love bumper stickers. They're fun to read at stoplights!
| 96 |
mich-again Thu, Feb 25, 2010 6:55:55pm |
re: #79 Virginia Plain
Hopefully it's something like Annie's with the sauce in a pouch, and not Kraft, with the cheese powder.
I personally like the Kraft M&C best of all.
| 97 |
Darth Vader Gargoyle Thu, Feb 25, 2010 6:56:07pm |
| 98 |
brookly red Thu, Feb 25, 2010 6:56:39pm |
re: #92 WindUpBird
Tens of millions of uninformed and myopic people, yes, I know. I've met many of them. They say they don't want the gubbermint's hands on their medicare, lol. Look, it'll likely pass, because it makes sense. And then you'll complain, and angry bearded gentlemen with sandwich boards will shout, and our health system will improve despite your complaints, and life will go on. You won't even notice a difference in your own health insurance, I bet. But I'm sure you'll still complain. Complain, complain complain.
oh, btw no disrespect meant by the bitch comment... just NY slang.
| 99 |
Stonemason Thu, Feb 25, 2010 6:56:46pm |
re: #90 iceweasel
Some people really have too much time on their hands. Puppets people, they are freaking puppets.
| 100 |
Darth Vader Gargoyle Thu, Feb 25, 2010 6:57:19pm |
re: #84 rwdflynavy
Speaking of mouth breathers, what is a "taking point"?
My apologies WindupBird, I should have said "beak-breathers".
//
| 101 |
Gus Thu, Feb 25, 2010 6:57:55pm |
| 102 |
Darth Vader Gargoyle Thu, Feb 25, 2010 6:58:55pm |
re: #90 iceweasel
It is an Outrageous Outrage and I find myself Outraged!
| 103 |
WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.] Thu, Feb 25, 2010 6:59:05pm |
re: #88 Stonemason
yup, the only people who do not want this passed are idiots. Oh, hang on, racist idiots. No, wait, gullible, racist idiots.
Got it now, thanks.
I guess if I actually saw a solution from you guys, I'd be a little more congenial. But I don't. I see blind ideology, bumper-sticker-play-book-rote-talking-point-heard-Limbaugh-say-it-so-it-has-to-be-true gibberish. Republicans have no solution. They simply do not. Democrats are trying to fix this thing, and they're not very good at it, but an attempt is better than the big goose egg that Reublicans have given us. The big zero, the big nothing. Mindless obstructionism, lies, and bullshit.
Still smarting from yesterday when I said that people who believe Obama is a secret muslim are actually racists? Or is this just general carping?
| 104 |
Darth Vader Gargoyle Thu, Feb 25, 2010 7:00:05pm |
re: #103 WindUpBird
I guess if I actually saw a solution from you guys, I'd be a little more congenial. But I don't. I see blind ideology, bumper-sticker-play-book-rote-talking-point-heard- Limbaugh-say-it-so-it-has-to-be-true gibberish. Republicans have no solution. They simply do not. Democrats are trying to fix this thing, and they're not very good at it, but an attempt is better than the big goose egg that Reublicans have given us. The big zero, the big nothing. Mindless obstructionism, lies, and bullshit.
Still smarting from yesterday when I said that people who believe Obama is a secret muslim are actually racists? Or is this just general carping?
So you've read the bill right?
| 105 |
albusteve Thu, Feb 25, 2010 7:00:13pm |
re: #89 Killgore Trout
Gergen On CNN: Dems Didn't Get "Breakthrough" They Wanted; GOP "Had Their Best Day In Years"
[Video]Hooray for easily debunked talking points!
this conference is not about solutions, it's a dog and pony competition between rivals....it's not about the truth, it's all about the talking points....it's about the PERCEPTION of the truth...it's AmIdol all the way....what was accomplished besides favorable perceptions to the voters that watched it?....the 'winners' are whoever comes across the best with their act, their ramblings, and of course cool hair counts for a lot these days....you are too honest, while they rip you off with their show
| 106 |
WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.] Thu, Feb 25, 2010 7:01:16pm |
re: #98 brookly red
oh, btw no disrespect meant by the bitch comment... just NY slang.
hahaha I've been called worse by good friends ;-) it's nothing personal, i just don't believe you guys know what you're talking about at all on health care. It's fine, for exmaple, i don't know what I'm talking about on the subject of Palestine. So I don't really weigh in on it. You don't have the facts on health care, the numbers, how much waste their is in our private system, how many lives are ruined because of recission and such, how our system discourages entrereneurship. And when you do have the facts, they're ignored. And the saaaame old talking points get very frustrating.
| 107 |
albusteve Thu, Feb 25, 2010 7:01:19pm |
re: #91 sandbox
The trial lawyers should give Dick Durban an award for the way he opposed tort reform today and no limits on punitive damages.
no shit...there you go...hid campaign coffers just got stuffed...wake up people!
| 108 |
WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.] Thu, Feb 25, 2010 7:01:47pm |
re: #104 rwdflynavy
So you've read the bill right?
Yep, the whole thing. Every single word! I'm in the matrix, babe.
| 109 |
albusteve Thu, Feb 25, 2010 7:02:18pm |
re: #103 WindUpBird
I guess if I actually saw a solution from you guys, I'd be a little more congenial. But I don't. I see blind ideology, bumper-sticker-play-book-rote-talking-point-heard- Limbaugh-say-it-so-it-has-to-be-true gibberish. Republicans have no solution. They simply do not. Democrats are trying to fix this thing, and they're not very good at it, but an attempt is better than the big goose egg that Reublicans have given us. The big zero, the big nothing. Mindless obstructionism, lies, and bullshit.
Still smarting from yesterday when I said that people who believe Obama is a secret muslim are actually racists? Or is this just general carping?
you see all that stuff because you want to...you have been trained
| 110 |
mich-again Thu, Feb 25, 2010 7:02:29pm |
re: #99 Stonemason
Some people really have too much time on their hands. Puppets people, they are freaking puppets.
Next thing you know there will be puppet strip bars. Gotta stop this madness now!
| 111 |
goddamnedfrank Thu, Feb 25, 2010 7:02:38pm |
re: #90 iceweasel
Seems like a whole lot of crazy out there today...
Puppet cleavage too hot for the religious right in Colorado Springs.
I saw that one yesterday, apparently repressed furry and billboard company executive aren't two conducive states of being. Tragic really.
| 112 |
BARACK THE VOTE Thu, Feb 25, 2010 7:02:53pm |
re: #101 Gus 802
Looks like it was another busy week for the hillbillies.
Hells yeah. I have something really hilarious to show you later. Might wait til this thread is a little longer.
For now, I'm just amazed at how that craziness over the missile defense logo is taking over:
Frank Gaffney Posits That Missile Defense Logo Is Evidence of Obama’s ‘Submission To Shariah’
This nutty conspiracy theory was escalated by Frank Gaffney, who sees it as explaining Obama’s rationale behind his cuts to missile defense. How so? Well because he is a secret Muslim of course, which since all Muslims are out to destroy America, means Obama is out to do the same:A just-unveiled symbolic action suggests, however, that something even more nefarious is afoot… Team Obama’s anti-anti-missile initiatives are not simply acts of unilateral disarmament of the sort to be expected from an Alinsky acolyte. They seem to fit an increasingly obvious and worrying pattern of official U.S. submission to Islam and the theo-political-legal program the latter’s authorities call Shariah… the new MDA shield appears ominously to reflect a morphing of the Islamic crescent and star with the Obama campaign logo… Watch this space as we identify and consider various, ominous and far more clear-cut acts of submission to Shariah by President Obama and his team.
So according to Gaffney, Obama hates missile defense so much that he wants to change the Missile Defense Agency’s logo to reflect his campaign symbol, as well as his secret Muslim identity? While this makes no sense, as Brendan Nyhan explains this is part of a strategy to spread fear-mongering “smears against Obama’s loyalty and false claims about Obama’s religion. As laughable as ‘Logo-gate’ may be, the underlying strategy is deeply disturbing.”
Much more at link, and here is MMFA running it down:
Right-wing media link new agency logo to Obama's, Pepsi's, Iran's, Islamic Crescent
You know, when this started popping up a couple of days ago I really didn't believe it would get any traction outside of some of the real fringe-y wankosphere. Unbelievably, it appears I've underestimated just how insane the right is right now. Peak Wingnut-- can it ever be reached?
| 113 |
Darth Vader Gargoyle Thu, Feb 25, 2010 7:03:34pm |
re: #108 WindUpBird
Yep, the whole thing. Every single word! I'm in the matrix, babe.
Cause the latest one just came out 3 days before the summit. Any Harry Reid is all about pushing it through without Republican support.
If you want it bad, you'll get it bad.
I agree we need to reform Health insurance. I'd love to see all insurers competing nation-wide for starters.
| 114 |
Decatur Deb Thu, Feb 25, 2010 7:03:34pm |
| 115 |
jaunte Thu, Feb 25, 2010 7:03:51pm |
re: #110 mich-again
Next thing you know there will be puppet strip bars. Gotta stop this madness now!
The marionettes have better legs, though.
| 116 |
reine.de.tout Thu, Feb 25, 2010 7:04:41pm |
re: #66 iceweasel
Apologies if this has already been posted --
South Dakota legislators tell schools to teach ‘astrological’ explanation for global warming.
Last week, the South Dakota House of Representatives passed a resolution to “urge” public schools to teach astrology. By a 36-30 vote, the legislators passed House Concurrent Resolution 1009, “Calling for balanced teaching of global warming in the public schools of South Dakota.” After repeating long-debunked denier myths and calling carbon dioxide “the gas of life,” the resolution concludes that public schools should teach that “global warming is a scientific theory rather than a proven fact”:
Wow.
That "theory vs fact" business is showing up here, just as it shows up in the arguments about creationism vs evolution.
| 117 |
BARACK THE VOTE Thu, Feb 25, 2010 7:04:48pm |
re: #111 goddamnedfrank
I saw that one yesterday, apparently repressed furry and billboard company executive aren't two conducive states of being. Tragic really.
I liked the comment about kermit and his lack of pants. :)
| 118 |
Stonemason Thu, Feb 25, 2010 7:04:53pm |
re: #103 WindUpBird
Nothing to do with something I did not read yesterday, all references to your post above, that I replied too.
I wasn't backing either side, by the way, I was ripping you for calling anyone who didn't agree with the proposed plan racist, gullible idiots.
I don't know the solution, I know I pay quite a bit for care. I also know that many proposals have been made from both sides of the aisle, you seem to think that one side's talking points are good and the other sides are bad.
Should every post here, or on other blogs contain every detail of a proposal? or can I say 'tort reform', 'public option', 'economy of scale', or any of the other points of both sides of this situation?
| 119 |
Varek Raith Thu, Feb 25, 2010 7:04:55pm |
re: #112 iceweasel
Frank Gaffney, Fucking Idiot™.
| 120 |
Gus Thu, Feb 25, 2010 7:05:15pm |
re: #112 iceweasel
Much more at link, and here is MMFA running it down:
Right-wing media link new agency logo to Obama's, Pepsi's, Iran's, Islamic Crescent
You know, when this started popping up a couple of days ago I really didn't believe it would get any traction outside of some of the real fringe-y wankosphere. Unbelievably, it appears I've underestimated just how insane the right is right now. Peak Wingnut-- can it ever be reached?
I never thought the wingnuts would get nuttier but apparently it comes easy. That whole missile defense logo thing is beyond the pale. It's almost like clinical behavior in the public realm.
| 121 |
Stonemason Thu, Feb 25, 2010 7:05:55pm |
re: #103 WindUpBird
Still smarting from yesterday when I said that people who believe Obama is a secret muslim are actually racists? Or is this just general carping?
people who say that Mr. Obama is a secret Muslim are surely uniformed.
| 122 |
Gus Thu, Feb 25, 2010 7:06:33pm |
re: #119 Varek Raith
Frank Gaffney, Fucking Idiot™.
Frank Gaffney gives fucking idiots a bad name.
/
| 123 |
albusteve Thu, Feb 25, 2010 7:07:09pm |
| 124 |
sandbox Thu, Feb 25, 2010 7:07:10pm |
re: #121 Stonemason
I don't believe Obama is a secret Muslim. But if Idid, why would that be racist?
| 125 |
WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.] Thu, Feb 25, 2010 7:07:13pm |
re: #76 rwdflynavy
Yeah, I'm none of those folks and I don't want to see this plan pass either.
well, it's going to pass. You're not crazy, you're just more of an ideologue who root root roots for your team regardless of the fact I found this out when you categorically denied the facts a while ago about racists and gang members being allowed into the military. You categorically denied that even though it was obviously true, lots of stories about it, the Pentagon doing their own investigations...
So yeah. Truth hurts.
| 126 |
Olsonist Thu, Feb 25, 2010 7:07:45pm |
re: #10 Charles
Not directly. But it's an incredibly bone-headed idea. Which is standard for the California state government.
Hey, let's make California even less friendly to businesses!
How is this being unfriendly to CA business? As a consumer, why should I pay taxes at Rasputin Records on a CD but not for one from Amazon? That's putting Rasputin out of business. I'd rather see businesses treated fairly and I don't see online businesses as being any sort of special.
| 127 |
solomonpanting Thu, Feb 25, 2010 7:07:47pm |
re: #110 mich-again
Next thing you know there will be puppet strip bars. Gotta stop this madness now!
Is that a ventriloquist in your pants, or did you just say you were happy to see me?
| 128 |
Darth Vader Gargoyle Thu, Feb 25, 2010 7:08:06pm |
re: #125 WindUpBird
well, it's going to pass. You're not crazy, you're just more of an ideologue who root root roots for your team regardless of the fact I found this out when you categorically denied the facts a while ago about racists and gang members being allowed into the military. You categorically denied that even though it was obviously true, lots of stories about it, the Pentagon doing their own investigations...
So yeah. Truth hurts.
We shall see....
| 129 |
BARACK THE VOTE Thu, Feb 25, 2010 7:08:28pm |
re: #119 Varek Raith
Frank Gaffney, Fucking Idiot™.
He really is a scumbag.
More from TPM:
Gaffney’s own past work strongly argues against taking him seriously as an analyst. As someone willing to cast deeply irresponsible and transparently bigoted accusations against the president, however, he should be taken very seriously.
Yet Gaffney is a prominent member of the right wing security establishment. He writes a regular column for the Washington Times, is a frequent commentator on cable television, and runs his own right-wing defense organization. Just this past October, at Gaffney’s Center for Security Policy “Keeper of the Flame” annual award dinner, Vice President Cheney was the featured speaker and recipient of the reward. Other guest speakers included Sen. Jon Kyl and former Defense Secretary Donald Rumsfeld.
By spreading this crazy paranoid conspiracy, Gaffney not only is defaming the President, he is also defaming the people who work and lead the Missile Defense Agency. The idea that the President would pay attention to an agency logo redesign or that the design in anyway reflected some secret Muslim agenda, as Richard Lehner of the Missile Defense Agency noted, “is ridiculous.” Lehner told Fox that “it isn’t a new logo to replace the official logo. It’s a logo developed for recruiting materials and for our public Web site. Also, it was used prior to the 2008 election and it has no link to any political campaign.”
Additionally, the one to approve the new logo is likely the head of the Missile Defense Agency, Lt. General Patrick O’Reilly, someone the right wing must now presumably believe is complicit with Obama’s secret plan to further the United States’ “submission to Islam.”
It's not like Gaffney is just some random lunatic with a blog that 50 people read. That's the kind of pplace where I thought this crap would be popular. Scary times.
| 130 |
albusteve Thu, Feb 25, 2010 7:08:44pm |
re: #110 mich-again
Next thing you know there will be puppet strip bars. Gotta stop this madness now!
puppet sex!...tax it!
| 131 |
Ayeless in Ghazi Thu, Feb 25, 2010 7:09:06pm |
How much is that Dalek in the window? (>£20,000, actually) :
Fans snap up Doctor Who costumes at auction
[Link: news.bbc.co.uk...]
| 133 |
albusteve Thu, Feb 25, 2010 7:10:15pm |
| 134 |
Stonemason Thu, Feb 25, 2010 7:10:58pm |
re: #124 sandbox
I don't believe Obama is a secret Muslim. But if Idid, why would that be racist?
I was quoting Windupbird with the bolded stuff, I don't call people I do not know personally racist.
| 135 |
Varek Raith Thu, Feb 25, 2010 7:11:12pm |
| 136 |
goddamnedfrank Thu, Feb 25, 2010 7:11:21pm |
re: #121 Stonemason
people who say that Mr. Obama is a secret Muslim are surely uniformed.
| 137 |
Mostly sane, most of the time. Thu, Feb 25, 2010 7:11:24pm |
re: #131 Jimmah
How much is that Dalek in the window? (>£20,000, actually) :
Fans snap up Doctor Who costumes at auction
[Link: news.bbc.co.uk...]
I still really, really want a weeping angel statue in my yard. The passers-by shall say, "What a sweet statue." Let's hope they don't blink.
| 138 |
BARACK THE VOTE Thu, Feb 25, 2010 7:11:27pm |
| 139 |
Darth Vader Gargoyle Thu, Feb 25, 2010 7:11:29pm |
re: #125 WindUpBird
well, it's going to pass. You're not crazy, you're just more of an ideologue who root root roots for your team regardless of the fact I found this out when you categorically denied the facts a while ago about racists and gang members being allowed into the military. You categorically denied that even though it was obviously true, lots of stories about it, the Pentagon doing their own investigations...
So yeah. Truth hurts.
IIRC you said the military was full of racists and gangbangers. I still think the numbers are incredibly low. I have served for 19 years and I say the numbers are very small.
Do you really want to go digging up old stuff?
| 140 |
albusteve Thu, Feb 25, 2010 7:11:33pm |
re: #127 solomonpanting
Is that a ventriloquist in your pants, or did you just say you were happy to see me?
ha!...how you doin?
| 141 |
Gus Thu, Feb 25, 2010 7:12:11pm |
re: #129 iceweasel
It's not like Gaffney is just some random lunatic with a blog that 50 people read. That's the kind of pplace where I thought this crap would be popular. Scary times.
Nope, he's not. Frank Gaffney is founder and president of Center for Security Policy. He's also one of the signers to the [bullshit] Project for a New American Century. He's basically a 5-Star Wingnut™.
| 142 |
reine.de.tout Thu, Feb 25, 2010 7:12:12pm |
re: #110 mich-again
Next thing you know there will be puppet strip bars. Gotta stop this madness now!
No, not "next thing you know".
It's here! Puppet stripper!
[Link: www.flickr.com...]
| 143 |
WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.] Thu, Feb 25, 2010 7:12:15pm |
re: #118 Stonemason
Nothing to do with something I did not read yesterday, all references to your post above, that I replied too.
I wasn't backing either side, by the way, I was ripping you for calling anyone who didn't agree with the proposed plan racist, gullible idiots.
I don't know the solution, I know I pay quite a bit for care. I also know that many proposals have been made from both sides of the aisle, you seem to think that one side's talking points are good and the other sides are bad.
Should every post here, or on other blogs contain every detail of a proposal? or can I say 'tort reform', 'public option', 'economy of scale', or any of the other points of both sides of this situation?
Where did I call everyone who opposes the plan racist? I merely believe they're gullible and foolish, and that some of the most vehement opposition are Birchers, racists, tea-partiers, people who oppose Obama for tribalist reasons.
Not everyone. But there are wide swaths of Republican America who o hate the man, and thus will hate every step he takes, every bill he signs, every stroke of his pen.
I hear tort reform a lot. It's false. it's not a solution, it's a bumper sticker talking point. Thing is, lawsuit settlements themselves, even if they were eliminated, are a drop in the bucket. Even if it were illegal to sue at all, it wouldn't lower your premiums. Could tort reform be part of comprehensive health care reform? Sure! As a solution by itself? it's dishonest and mindless gibberish pushed by people who are lying or who have no idea what they're talking about.
Republicans had control of the whole shebang for years, they had all this time to pass something, anything, that would combat the monstrosity HC has become in America. And they didn't. And that's the main reason I don't vote Republican. I'm not a one issue voter, but health care is my largest issue. i work in the field, many many of my friends work in the field, we see what's happening.
| 144 |
Darth Vader Gargoyle Thu, Feb 25, 2010 7:12:35pm |
| 145 |
albusteve Thu, Feb 25, 2010 7:13:12pm |
re: #134 Stonemason
I was quoting Windupbird with the bolded stuff, I don't call people I do not know personally racist.
good practice...people should take that advice
| 146 |
The Sanity Inspector Thu, Feb 25, 2010 7:13:32pm |
re: #20 rwdflynavy
The problem with socialism is that eventually you run out of other people's money...
Margaret Thatcher.
Socialism's boosters can't seem to shake the notion that there is an infinite number of competent, motivated government functionaries available to run everything, and an infinite amount of money to pay them to do it.
| 147 |
Darth Vader Gargoyle Thu, Feb 25, 2010 7:13:41pm |
re: #143 WindUpBird
Where did I call everyone who opposes the plan racist? I merely believe they're gullible and foolish, and that some of the most vehement opposition are Birchers, racists, tea-partiers, people who oppose Obama for tribalist reasons.
Not everyone. But there are wide swaths of Republican America who o hate the man, and thus will hate every step he takes, every bill he signs, every stroke of his pen.
I hear tort reform a lot. It's false. it's not a solution, it's a bumper sticker talking point. Thing is, lawsuit settlements themselves, even if they were eliminated, are a drop in the bucket. Even if it were illegal to sue at all, it wouldn't lower your premiums. Could tort reform be part of comprehensive health care reform? Sure! As a solution by itself? it's dishonest and mindless gibberish pushed by people who are lying or who have no idea what they're talking about.
Republicans had control of the whole shebang for years, they had all this time to pass something, anything, that would combat the monstrosity HC has become in America. And they didn't. And that's the main reason I don't vote Republican. I'm not a one issue voter, but health care is my largest issue. i work in the field, many many of my friends work in the field, we see what's happening.
Dude, You're like the LVQ of Health Care Reform! Except more of a stoner version...
//
| 149 |
sandbox Thu, Feb 25, 2010 7:13:47pm |
re: #143 WindUpBird
Thank you for your thoughtful analysis of tort reform.
| 150 |
solomonpanting Thu, Feb 25, 2010 7:14:16pm |
re: #126 Olsonist
How is this being unfriendly to CA business? As a consumer, why should I pay taxes at Rasputin Records on a CD but not for one from Amazon? That's putting Rasputin out of business. I'd rather see businesses treated fairly and I don't see online businesses as being any sort of special.
You do raise the issue of out-of-state purchases. Why should only online sites be taxed?
I've purchased many items from other non-tax states, before I started online purchases. I don't like the bill's intention, but why only online?
| 151 |
WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.] Thu, Feb 25, 2010 7:14:25pm |
re: #128 rwdflynavy
We shall see...
I'd about bet my car title that something will pass. How good it'll start out as? Who knows. Social Security excluded black people when it passed. SS was unrecognizable as what it is now. But either through reconciliation (which is constantly used for health care legislation, despite the whining and braying of Republicans in Senate with very short memories) or through an actual 60 vote, something's going through.
| 152 |
The Sanity Inspector Thu, Feb 25, 2010 7:14:59pm |
re: #134 Stonemason
I was quoting Windupbird with the bolded stuff, I don't call people I do not know personally racist.
Recommend using the quote button, to avoid confusion. You can still bold the quoted stuff if you want to.
| 153 |
Decatur Deb Thu, Feb 25, 2010 7:15:08pm |
| 154 |
WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.] Thu, Feb 25, 2010 7:15:17pm |
re: #147 rwdflynavy
Dude, You're like the LVQ of Health Care Reform! Except more of a stoner version...
//
Come to Oregon, see the greenery ;-)
| 155 |
The Shadow Do Thu, Feb 25, 2010 7:15:33pm |
Ethics panel finds Rep. Charles Rangel broke rules
The committee decided against issuing formal charges against Rangel that could lead to punishment such as a censure.
heh
| 156 |
solomonpanting Thu, Feb 25, 2010 7:16:18pm |
| 157 |
Gus Thu, Feb 25, 2010 7:16:22pm |
re: #129 iceweasel
It's not like Gaffney is just some random lunatic with a blog that 50 people read. That's the kind of pplace where I thought this crap would be popular. Scary times.
This one is pretty funny:
Obama's Missile Defense Logo Is Muslim!
Big Government's Frank Gaffney finally has it: artistic evidence that the Obama administration is up to no good. The evidence in question is a redesigned shield for the Missile Defense Agency, which he says "appears ominously to reflect a morphing of the Islamic crescent and star with the Obama campaign logo." ...
| 158 |
sandbox Thu, Feb 25, 2010 7:16:25pm |
re: #150 solomonpanting
I believe mail order is subject to sales tax.
| 159 |
Ayeless in Ghazi Thu, Feb 25, 2010 7:17:36pm |
re: #112 iceweasel
You know, when this started popping up a couple of days ago I really didn't believe it would get any traction outside of some of the real fringe-y wankosphere. Unbelievably, it appears I've underestimated just how insane the right is right now. Peak Wingnut-- can it ever be reached?
It's like the wingnuts are jealous of the illuminati-obsessed NWO freaks dominance of the outer fringes, and mean to occupy that territory themselves, and go even further. Crazy isn't the word for it.
| 160 |
The Sanity Inspector Thu, Feb 25, 2010 7:18:00pm |
re: #15 albusteve
yea, I give these guys credit...they never went off searching for their sound or blew up from exposure etc...Petty knows what he wants, simple guitar/keyboard stuff with clever lyrics (thanks Bob!)...a smooth California thing...people love it and he's made a ton of money for it...that's all cool
You can even forgive him his little foray into rap, so indelibly did he mark it with his own stamp:
| 161 |
albusteve Thu, Feb 25, 2010 7:18:13pm |
re: #151 WindUpBird
I'd about bet my car title that something will pass. How good it'll start out as? Who knows. Social Security excluded black people when it passed. SS was unrecognizable as what it is now. But either through reconciliation (which is constantly used for health care legislation, despite the whining and braying of Republicans in Senate with very short memories) or through an actual 60 vote, something's going through.
you got to know when to hold 'em, know when to fold 'em....besides KT I can't think of anybody that presumed no bill would pass...jus sayin that's hardly a profound notion
| 162 |
albusteve Thu, Feb 25, 2010 7:19:14pm |
re: #156 solomonpanting
OK, but underemployed at the moment.
hang in there amigo....the feds are coming!....flags waving, trumpets sounding!
| 164 |
Gus Thu, Feb 25, 2010 7:20:54pm |
re: #159 Jimmah
It's like the wingnuts are jealous of the illuminati-obsessed NWO freaks dominance of the outer fringes, and mean to occupy that territory themselves, and go even further. Crazy isn't the word for it.
They've been on the fringes ever since the birth of the religious right (i.e. Pat Robertson, Jerry Falwell, etc.).
| 165 |
Stonemason Thu, Feb 25, 2010 7:21:01pm |
re: #70 WindUpBird
"ready to stand up" Are those the Americans who wave signs calling obama the N-word? Or maybe they're the Americans who scream about socialism even though they don't know the meaning of the word socialism. Or perhaps it's the Americans who want Sarah Palin to become president even though she knows less about world history than a 7th grader. The Americans who believe everythin that comes out of Glenn beck and Rush Limbaugh's mouth? The Americans that fell down the rabbit hole with Michele Bachmann, swallowing all of her bircher paranoia and freaking out about the census?
Yep, those Americans. There are many of them, that's true! But I don't think they'll win in the end.
The bolded part is where I got the racist, the rest is in there too.
I notice the only bumper sticker you went after in my post was the right leaning one, you ignored the left leaning ones.
I know that tort reform is a small part, but it has been proposed for years. Also proposed is the ability to shop for insurance. Proposed is more competition.
And proposed is the public option. Buy in to medicare. Proposed are those big groups. Since you read the bill, (I didn't read all of Mr. Obama's proposal) are those groups national or state centered?
| 166 |
albusteve Thu, Feb 25, 2010 7:21:04pm |
re: #160 The Sanity Inspector
You can even forgive him his little foray into rap, so indelibly did he mark it with his own stamp:
[Video]
man, I love that drone of a song....when your filthy rich, you can rap hop all you want...the Stones did some killer disco
| 167 |
Surabaya Stew Thu, Feb 25, 2010 7:21:04pm |
re: #142 reine.de.tout
Thanks for fulfilling our request so quickly, Reine. Can't wait for HH to get back to me....
| 168 |
BARACK THE VOTE Thu, Feb 25, 2010 7:21:07pm |
Ok, since we're already talking about puppet strippers and such....
This is the craziest thing I've seen in the last 24 hours:
Vampyre for President Absconded with Child Bride After YouTube Proposal
Jonathon "The Impaler" Sharkey lives in New Jersey and usually limits his Luciferian powers to third-party runs for office. (Platform: "I WILL IMPALE THEM! [criminals]") Then a YouTube proposal to his 16-year-old girlfriend ignited a nationwide manhunt and internet flamewar.
Originally from the Garden State, the Impaler has run for office in New Jersey, Indiana, Florida, Minnesota, and for president. He's a self-proclaimed satanist, former pro-wrestler, (Rocky 'Hurricane' Flash's retired in 2004) and repeat legal offender. (Stalking and coercion are trouble spots.)
16-year-old Paige Brewer ran away from her mother's rural Minnesota home six months ago. According to Minneapolis' City Pages, Paige was living with her grandmother when she met the Impaler on a vampire comment board last month. After a whirlwind cyber romance, Sharkey proposed with a YouTube video in which he shows off his Wiccan tats in what appears to be a Valentine-themed corner of a daycare center, with the love ballad from Beauty and the Beast straining softly in the background.
(youtube is at link)
Paige said "YES!!!" and Jonathon flew to Minnesota to gather his child bride on Valentine's Day. Then they went into hiding—but continued to maintain avid correspondences with City Pages, MySpace fans, and vampire forums.
Classified an "endangered runaway," Paige rechristened herself "Paige Sharkey" and announced she would seek emancipation from her mother. "Screw off," she told City Pages in an interview. "I bit him first. Let me live my life." The Impaler said he was protecting his bride from those who would inflict "child abuse" upon her, like her mother. Here's a video where the Impaler accuses Jill Moen of being an abusive, drug-addicted stripper. He demonstrates how he will avenge his beloved: "I LIKE TO PUNCH."
The Impaler admits, "I prefer to sink my fangs into younger women," but claims he never had sex with Paige. As the pair's vampirical honeymoon wore on, however, law enforcement closed in. A child protection agent reached out to Paige on her favorite vampire forum, then lured the pair to a legal-brokering meeting in Minnesota. En route, Sharkey posted celebratory messages on City Pages' comment boards:
I am arriving in Minneapolis tomorrow. I would have stated to all women of Minnesota: Cover your necks with garlic. However, the only neck my fangs will be in is Paige's neck. Otherwise, she will make me a toothless vampyre! ;)
But at the meeting—which took place at a Faribault, MN community center—plainclothed cops swooped in to free Paige from her vampire lover's pointy-toothed grip. The middle-aged bloodsucker ended up on a Greyhound bus back to New Jersey. Paige remains with her mother, who says she is "working with Hennepin County children's health to get [Paige] a referral for a facility here. She's aware she will have to go somewhere for awhile and seems accepting of it so long as it's not where she was the last few days." We wish them luck—it's not every day you have to deprogram your child from an epic runaway romance with a tech-savvy vampire politician impaler.
| 169 |
WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.] Thu, Feb 25, 2010 7:21:34pm |
re: #139 rwdflynavy
IIRC you said the military was full of racists and gangbangers. I still think the numbers are incredibly low. I have served for 19 years and I say the numbers are very small.
Do you really want to go digging up old stuff?
Well, when you're misrepresenting what I said, it's tempting! You can have served for a million billion years, it doesn't change the facts. I said that the military will let people in with racist tattoos and gang affiliations. I never said the armed forces were FULL of them. i said precisely that the standards are lax with regard to whether someone with gang and racist affiliations that are clear and plain (tattoos are pretty clear) can enter the service. That we wig out about OH NO THE QUEER TROOP MORALE!! but suddenly troop morale as an argument evaporates into butterflies when it's brought up that some guy has swastika ink on his back and he serves with black people!
The argument was not about the military's makeup. The argument was about their standards, whether they'll let these people in. I said they did let those people in, knowing their affiliations, you claimed they didn't. I found articles, you tried to claim they were lying. I know plenty of guys in the armed forces, don't even worry about it. Nerds are in Kabul and Fallujah carrying rifles too. I am well aware the vast vast majority of our armed forced aren't Klansmen. That was never my position, and you know it.
| 170 |
Gus Thu, Feb 25, 2010 7:21:44pm |
re: #163 avanti
Funnier still:
Yeah. Do a search for the Apollo 14 patch. There's plenty of others out there.
| 171 |
Olsonist Thu, Feb 25, 2010 7:21:54pm |
re: #150 solomonpanting
You do raise the issue of out-of-state purchases. Why should only online sites be taxed?
I've purchased many items from other non-tax states, before I started online purchases. I don't like the bill's intention, but why only online?
If you buy something from a brick and mortar store you already pay sales tax. So new legislation is unnecessary. The proposed law means Amazon and Rasputin are on the same playing field.
I just bought a refrigerator from freaking NY. I got free shipping and paid no tax. I even qualified for a NY rebate. Economically, it was a no brainer. But General Appliance which is down the road got bupkis. They weren't even in the game.
In short I got a refrigerator, NY got some taxes and some cash, and the Saudis got some money. Since I live in CA, I wish the game wasn't fixed like this but it is.
| 173 |
Walter L. Newton Thu, Feb 25, 2010 7:23:00pm |
Ok... for all those who appeared to be worried up thread... the mac and cheese was homemade and it had a lot of veggie in it too, so I didn't Kraft myself to death tonight.
I'm still taking all I can get from the government.
| 174 |
Olsonist Thu, Feb 25, 2010 7:23:16pm |
re: #158 sandbox
I believe mail order is subject to sales tax.
I dunno about mail order, but online is not taxed in CA if the company doesn't do business in CA. So Amazon has a big logistics base in Reno, which is not in CA.
| 175 |
Varek Raith Thu, Feb 25, 2010 7:23:27pm |
Damn, not even The Onion could ever hope to compete with the utter hilarity or this logo bull shit!
| 176 |
Decatur Deb Thu, Feb 25, 2010 7:23:36pm |
re: #164 Gus 802
They've been on the fringes ever since the birth of the religious right (i.e. Pat Robertson, Jerry Falwell, etc.).
If I get some time, I'll research artifacts of 1930's FDRDS. They were pretty ripe.
| 178 |
Gus Thu, Feb 25, 2010 7:24:47pm |
re: #176 Decatur Deb
If I get some time, I'll research artifacts of 1930's FDRDS. They were pretty ripe.
FDRDS?
| 179 |
Surabaya Stew Thu, Feb 25, 2010 7:24:48pm |
re: #173 Walter L. Newton
Ok... for all those who appeared to be worried up thread... the mac and cheese was homemade and it had a lot of veggie in it too, so I didn't Kraft myself to death tonight.
I'm still taking all I can get from the government.
Government cheese is pretty tasty when melted over macaroni.
| 180 |
albusteve Thu, Feb 25, 2010 7:25:13pm |
re: #174 Olsonist
I dunno about mail order, but online is not taxed in CA if the company doesn't do business in CA. So Amazon has a big logistics base in Reno, which is not in CA.
where is Amazons home port?...what sort of facilities do they have, do they have massive warehouses all around?...in brief
| 181 |
solomonpanting Thu, Feb 25, 2010 7:25:17pm |
re: #171 Olsonist
If you buy something from a brick and mortar store you already pay sales tax. So new legislation is unnecessary. The proposed law means Amazon and Rasputin are on the same playing field.
I just bought a refrigerator from freaking NY. I got free shipping and paid no tax. I even qualified for a NY rebate. Economically, it was a no brainer. But General Appliance which is down the road got bupkis. They weren't even in the game.
In short I got a refrigerator, NY got some taxes and some cash, and the Saudis got some money. Since I live in CA, I wish the game wasn't fixed like this but it is.
A couple years ago I bought a range vent hood from New Jersey that was made in California, had it shipped to California, to my door and paid $150 less than the best deal I could find here.
| 182 |
Walter L. Newton Thu, Feb 25, 2010 7:25:19pm |
Our white Husky just came in... all clean... fur a white as snow... that's because it is snowing and he loves rolling in the snow... cleans him off better than anything you could do for him.
Neat.
| 183 |
WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.] Thu, Feb 25, 2010 7:26:00pm |
8 lobbyists for every member of congress about HCR: [Link: www.publicintegrity.org...]
A Center for Public Integrity analysis of Senate lobbying disclosure forms shows that more than 1,750 companies and organizations hired about 4,525 lobbyists — eight for each member of Congress — to influence health reform bills in 2009.
| 185 |
Walter L. Newton Thu, Feb 25, 2010 7:26:39pm |
| 187 |
albusteve Thu, Feb 25, 2010 7:27:11pm |
re: #177 Plato
I had a telecaster like that once.
I'm making a full sized replica out of wood for my first grandchild...more than I thought, it's getting pretty involved
| 190 |
The Sanity Inspector Thu, Feb 25, 2010 7:27:43pm |
| 191 |
Gus Thu, Feb 25, 2010 7:27:54pm |
| 193 |
NotForYou Thu, Feb 25, 2010 7:28:38pm |
re: #91 sandbox
The trial lawyers should give Dick Durban an award for the way he opposed tort reform today and no limits on punitive damages.
Say for a moment that frivolous lawsuits, fraud, and corruption were all eliminated from the health economy. What will the people that are employed or otherwise derive income from the $150B of fraud Sen. Coburn pointed out do? Or better, what do we do with them?
Look at the housing deflation. Financially illiterate, delusional, or at the very least gullible people (some who ATM'ed their house to the point of insolvency) are expected to find "real" jobs? You would think that's a huge pool of talent critical thinking or at least speaks of a discernable skill?
The real socialism we have is tacit consent of low hanging fraud fruit. How else do you expect of the hoards of the criminally mis-educated (more and worse every day) to remain socio-economically mobile?
Some people can ONLY fraud and sue for a living. They are more dangerous if they can’t. Crime moves.
| 194 |
mich-again Thu, Feb 25, 2010 7:29:01pm |
| 195 |
albusteve Thu, Feb 25, 2010 7:29:07pm |
| 196 |
Plato Thu, Feb 25, 2010 7:29:19pm |
albusteve
you'll be proud when he plays better than you
| 197 |
Varek Raith Thu, Feb 25, 2010 7:29:25pm |
re: #192 Plato
my oldest son traded it for an SG
If I may be so bold, 'reply' and 'quote' make following conversations less confusing.
:)
| 198 |
Decatur Deb Thu, Feb 25, 2010 7:29:34pm |
re: #191 Gus 802
Ah, OK. That lives on to this day.
Father Coughlin was a master. The stuff about then-FLOTUS was rank.
| 199 |
Stanghazi Thu, Feb 25, 2010 7:30:14pm |
| 200 |
Olsonist Thu, Feb 25, 2010 7:30:19pm |
re: #180 albusteve
322560-square-foot facility in Fernley, Nevada just outside of Reno. They can UPS to the SF Bay area in one day. And they pay no CA sales taxes on that. I'm not sure how much of the UPS shipping price is tax, if any.
| 201 |
Plato Thu, Feb 25, 2010 7:30:32pm |
I never really cared about electric guitars anyway, I'm an old acoustic guy.
| 202 |
albusteve Thu, Feb 25, 2010 7:30:40pm |
re: #192 Plato
my oldest son traded it for an SG
how old was the Telly?...an SG is no small thing really...but was the Fender a vintage guitar?
| 203 |
Darth Vader Gargoyle Thu, Feb 25, 2010 7:31:06pm |
re: #169 WindUpBird
Well, when you're misrepresenting what I said, it's tempting! You can have served for a million billion years, it doesn't change the facts. I said that the military will let people in with racist tattoos and gang affiliations. I never said the armed forces were FULL of them. i said precisely that the standards are lax with regard to whether someone with gang and racist affiliations that are clear and plain (tattoos are pretty clear) can enter the service. That we wig out about OH NO THE QUEER TROOP MORALE!! but suddenly troop morale as an argument evaporates into butterflies when it's brought up that some guy has swastika ink on his back and he serves with black people!
The argument was not about the military's makeup. The argument was about their standards, whether they'll let these people in. I said they did let those people in, knowing their affiliations, you claimed they didn't. I found articles, you tried to claim they were lying. I know plenty of guys in the armed forces, don't even worry about it. Nerds are in Kabul and Fallujah carrying rifles too. I am well aware the vast vast majority of our armed forced aren't Klansmen. That was never my position, and you know it.
What I know is that the Navy goes to great lengths to keep folks with these tattoos out. They are checked by the recruiters and again when they arrive at Great Lakes.
| 204 |
Olsonist Thu, Feb 25, 2010 7:31:36pm |
re: #181 solomonpanting
Damn the Saudis made a mint of that.
| 206 |
Plato Thu, Feb 25, 2010 7:31:53pm |
re: #202 albusteve
it was new at the time. The money wasnt' an issue
| 207 |
albusteve Thu, Feb 25, 2010 7:31:56pm |
re: #196 Plato
albusteve
you'll be proud when he plays better than you
who knows...I'm trying to make an heirloom type thing, and anybody plays better than me
| 208 |
Racer X Thu, Feb 25, 2010 7:33:01pm |
re: #173 Walter L. Newton
Ok... for all those who appeared to be worried up thread... the mac and cheese was homemade and it had a lot of veggie in it too, so I didn't Kraft myself to death tonight.
I'm still taking all I can get from the government.
That's nacho cheese! It doesn't belong to you!
| 209 |
albusteve Thu, Feb 25, 2010 7:33:31pm |
re: #200 Olsonist
322560-square-foot facility in Fernley, Nevada just outside of Reno. They can UPS to the SF Bay area in one day. And they pay no CA sales taxes on that. I'm not sure how much of the UPS shipping price is tax, if any.
that's gigantic, an amazing company, thanks
| 210 |
freetoken Thu, Feb 25, 2010 7:35:04pm |
This could prove awkward for the US:
Australia PM to probe Guantanamo man torture claim
Prime Minister Kevin Rudd said Friday he found it "very difficult to believe" Australian officials had been complicit in any torture of an ex-Guantanamo inmate but that he would investigate the claims.
Egyptian-born Mamdouh Habib on Thursday won the right to sue the government over interrogations in which he alleges he was tortured, beaten and shackled to the floor in the presence of Australian spies, diplomats and police officers.
Rudd said he would look into the claims, which centre on 12 interrogation sessions following Habib's arrest in Pakistan in the wake of the September 11, 2001 attacks on the United States.
"I will get into the detail of it," Rudd told local television. "I don't think it's right. But I'll test the argument that's been put."
| 211 |
mich-again Thu, Feb 25, 2010 7:36:01pm |
re: #183 WindUpBird
8 lobbyists for every member of congress about HCR:
Yeah but that means there is only 1 lobbyist for every 10 members on congressional staff.
| 212 |
freetoken Thu, Feb 25, 2010 7:37:33pm |
Get ready for the outrage:
Obama aides to meet with atheists on White House grounds
President Barack Obama has burnished his Christian credentials, courted Jewish support and preached outreach toward Muslims. On Friday, his administration will host a group that fits none of the above: America's nonbelievers.The president isn't expected to make an appearance at the meeting with the Secular Coalition for America or to unveil any new policy as a result of it.
Instead, several administration officials will sit down quietly for a morning meeting at the Eisenhower Executive Office Building on the White House campus with about 60 workhorses from the coalition's 10 member groups, including the American Atheists and the Council for Secular Humanism. Tina Tchen, the director of the White House Office of Public Engagement, and representatives from the Justice and Health and Human Services departments will participate.
| 213 |
Plato Thu, Feb 25, 2010 7:37:55pm |
re: #210 freetokenI didn't think Australia had a dog in this fight
| 214 |
solomonpanting Thu, Feb 25, 2010 7:38:37pm |
#162 albusteve
hang in there amigo...the feds are coming!...flags waving, trumpets sounding!
Here's a kitchen remodel I recently finished (the first seven or eight pics).
| 215 |
Varek Raith Thu, Feb 25, 2010 7:38:55pm |
| 216 |
freetoken Thu, Feb 25, 2010 7:39:01pm |
re: #213 Plato
Well, it appears they do now. Since the court ruled in favor of the former detainee the Australian gov't can't ignore his suit.
| 218 |
Olsonist Thu, Feb 25, 2010 7:40:20pm |
re: #211 mich-again
Yeah but that means there is only 1 lobbyist for every 10 members on congressional staff.
24000 / 535 = 45
45 / 8 = 5
Pretty darn close for an off the cuff remark. Hat tip.
| 219 |
Decatur Deb Thu, Feb 25, 2010 7:41:12pm |
| 220 |
PaxAmericana Thu, Feb 25, 2010 7:41:20pm |
I never under-appreciated this album. I was a teenager when "You Don't Know How It Feels" hit MTV. I love and own this album since the 1990s.
| 221 |
Plato Thu, Feb 25, 2010 7:41:40pm |
re: #216 freetoken
I know there is an outspoken Moslem presence in Melbourne...I hope the investigation remains peaceful.
| 222 |
freetoken Thu, Feb 25, 2010 7:41:41pm |
| 223 |
Stonemason Thu, Feb 25, 2010 7:41:45pm |
re: #212 freetoken
Get ready for the outrage:
Will Wright, Sharpton, and Jackson be a part of the protesters of this move?
| 224 |
jaunte Thu, Feb 25, 2010 7:41:45pm |
Australia in Afghanistan Briefing Book
[Link: www.globalcollab.org...]
| 225 |
Cato the Elder Thu, Feb 25, 2010 7:41:54pm |
Atheists at the White House, SpaceJesus with a positive karma - end times!
What's next, a certain someone gets rid of her avatar pissing on the Name of God?
| 226 |
Dark_Falcon Thu, Feb 25, 2010 7:42:04pm |
Great song. Tom Petty has long been a favorite of mine. Thanks Charles.
| 227 |
Gus Thu, Feb 25, 2010 7:42:08pm |
| 228 |
albusteve Thu, Feb 25, 2010 7:42:30pm |
re: #214 solomonpanting
#162 albusteve
Here's a kitchen remodel I recently finished (the first seven or eight pics).
log in page...bummer, I've seen your beautiful work...if you can get those pics online, I'd sure like to see them
| 229 |
goddamnedfrank Thu, Feb 25, 2010 7:42:55pm |
re: #78 brookly red
Me & tens of millions of others... bitch.
Stay classy, next time might I suggest you punch her right in the ovaries.
| 230 |
Ayeless in Ghazi Thu, Feb 25, 2010 7:43:04pm |
re: #168 iceweasel
Hilarious:) In Scotland though, this would probably not have triggered any action on the part of the law. Even vampires can get married at 16 here.
| 231 |
Cato the Elder Thu, Feb 25, 2010 7:43:13pm |
re: #227 Gus 802
Here's a USAF patch with the evil eye of Horus.
The clawed hand clutching the globe scares me more.
| 232 |
Obdicut Thu, Feb 25, 2010 7:43:14pm |
re: #168 iceweasel
You know, my life is kinda complicated right now, and I was feeling stressed out about dealing with it.
That story made me realize I ain't got no problems.
| 233 |
Gus Thu, Feb 25, 2010 7:43:58pm |
re: #231 Cato the Elder
The clawed hand clutching the globe scares me more.
Right. Looks like an alien hand.
| 234 |
Varek Raith Thu, Feb 25, 2010 7:44:14pm |
re: #227 Gus 802
Here's a USAF patch with the evil eye of Horus.
ZOMFG, King Midas is laying claim to the Earth!11!!11
| 235 |
SanFranciscoZionist Thu, Feb 25, 2010 7:44:45pm |
re: #20 rwdflynavy
The problem with socialism is that eventually you run out of other people's money...
Margaret Thatcher.
(Screams.)
//Sorry. Part of my new program is to scream whenever anyone uses that quote.
| 236 |
mich-again Thu, Feb 25, 2010 7:45:02pm |
re: #218 Olsonist
24000 / 535 = 45
45 / 8 = 5Pretty darn close for an off the cuff remark. Hat tip.
Ha. 5 lunches in a work week. 5 congressional staffers per lobbyist. Coincidence?
| 237 |
albusteve Thu, Feb 25, 2010 7:45:26pm |
re: #225 Cato the Elder
Atheists at the White House, SpaceJesus with a positive karma - end times!
What's next, a certain someone gets rid of her avatar pissing on the Name of God?
if it disturbs you, I hope not
| 238 |
cliffster Thu, Feb 25, 2010 7:45:30pm |
re: #232 Obdicut
Aren't you tying the knot? Or did I imagine that?
| 239 |
Cato the Elder Thu, Feb 25, 2010 7:45:32pm |
re: #234 Varek Raith
ZOMFG, King Midas is laying claim to the Earth!11!!11
Well then at last we can return to the gold standard.
| 240 |
solomonpanting Thu, Feb 25, 2010 7:45:47pm |
| 241 |
jaunte Thu, Feb 25, 2010 7:45:51pm |
re: #235 SanFranciscoZionist
The problem with Margaret Thatcher is that you soon run out of her quotes.
| 242 |
SanFranciscoZionist Thu, Feb 25, 2010 7:45:57pm |
re: #36 HAL2010
Haven't written here for a while, and apologies.
OT:
Here is Sarah Barracuda's intelligent response to the Health Care Summit held today:
"Drag away from Obamacare mtg today2cheer Red,White&Blue:USA Women's Hockey w/AK's own#23 Weiland play Canada for Gold.Huge contest.Go U-S-A!"
America, read and weep. Then contemplate that she might one day be your President.
No. She won't be. There is a special providence that watches over drunks, children and the United States of America.
| 243 |
Dark_Falcon Thu, Feb 25, 2010 7:45:59pm |
re: #168 iceweasel
Some people have seen Twilight too many times. Geeze...
| 244 |
Walter L. Newton Thu, Feb 25, 2010 7:46:11pm |
re: #218 Olsonist
24000 / 535 = 45
45 / 8 = 5Pretty darn close for an off the cuff remark. Hat tip.
Or... 4 8 15 16 23 42 = 108
| 245 |
The Sanity Inspector Thu, Feb 25, 2010 7:46:25pm |
re: #213 Plato
I didn't think Australia had a dog in this fight
Australia's been fighting alongside us in Afghanistan and Iraq since the beginning. Plus, one of their nationals, one David Hicks, was bagged on the battlefield while fighting for the Taliban. Yes, they're involved.
| 246 |
Stanghazi Thu, Feb 25, 2010 7:46:27pm |
re: #235 SanFranciscoZionist
(Screams.)
//Sorry. Part of my new program is to scream whenever anyone uses that quote.
I was waiting for you.
| 247 |
Dark_Falcon Thu, Feb 25, 2010 7:46:33pm |
| 248 |
albusteve Thu, Feb 25, 2010 7:46:45pm |
| 250 |
Plato Thu, Feb 25, 2010 7:46:55pm |
re: #237 albusteve
I wonder what athiests think about
vampires and crosses.
| 251 |
Racer X Thu, Feb 25, 2010 7:46:59pm |
Son
Of
A
Bitch.
United States Department of EnergyThe United States Department of Energy (DOE) is a Cabinet-level department of the United States government concerned with the United States' policies regarding energy and safety in handling nuclear material.
[snip]
The Department of Energy was formed after the oil crisis on August 4, 1977 in order to end the United States dependence on foreign oil by President Jimmy Carter's signing of legislation, The Department of Energy Organization Act of 1977.
[snip]
President Barack Obama unveiled on May 7 a $26.4 billion budget request for DOE for fiscal year (FY) 2010, including $2.3 billion for the DOE Office of Energy Efficiency and Renewable Energy (EERE). The budget aims to substantially expand the use of renewable energy sources while improving energy transmission infrastructure. It also makes significant investments in hybrids and plug-in hybrids, in smart grid technologies, and in scientific research and innovation. [8]As part of the recent $789 billion economic stimulus package, Congress has provided Energy with $38.3 billion for the next two years, adding about 75 percent to Energy's annual budgets. Most of the stimulus spending will be in the form of grants and contracts.
Yet, according to Robert Alvarez, "Even with additional stimulus money, spending for bombs and cleanup will still exceed those for actual energy-related functions. Spending for the weapons complex is currently comparable to that during the height of the nuclear arms race in the 1950s. The big difference now — half of that money is spent dealing with the Cold War's environmental legacy
[snip]
In 2009, the Wall St. Journal reported that the Department of Energy had failed its own energy audit.
No new nuclear power. Way more dependence on foreign oil. Totally inefficient.
Fail.
| 252 |
Olsonist Thu, Feb 25, 2010 7:47:17pm |
re: #236 mich-again
My Mom worked as a lawyer in the Senate Veterans Affairs Committee. Worked hard. The lobbyists don't take staff, especially lower level staff out to lunch. They might take the COS and the Member or Senator out.
| 253 |
cliffster Thu, Feb 25, 2010 7:47:41pm |
re: #240 solomonpanting
Does this work?
[Link: s6.photobucket.com...]
Nope. Go to Share and grab one of the URLs for, maybe, embedding in html or posting in a blog. Look for an "img" in the stuff you copy and paste.
| 254 |
Varek Raith Thu, Feb 25, 2010 7:47:47pm |
re: #250 Plato
I wonder what athiests think about
vampires and crosses.
I'm an atheist vampire. Crosses, meh, not my thing but, whatever floats your boat.
;)
| 255 |
SanFranciscoZionist Thu, Feb 25, 2010 7:47:54pm |
re: #66 iceweasel
Apologies if this has already been posted --
South Dakota legislators tell schools to teach ‘astrological’ explanation for global warming.
Wow.
I've always wanted to teach astrology.
| 256 |
Cato the Elder Thu, Feb 25, 2010 7:48:35pm |
re: #252 Olsonist
My Mom worked as a lawyer in the Senate Veterans Affairs Committee. Worked hard. The lobbyists don't take staff, especially lower level staff out to lunch. They might take the COS and the Member or Senator out.
Believe me, you don't want scumbag lobbyists taking your Mom out to lunch.
| 257 |
webevintage Thu, Feb 25, 2010 7:48:36pm |
re: #231 Cato the Elder
The clawed hand clutching the globe scares me more.
That patch is just all kinds of wrong....and seriously badass.
| 258 |
cliffster Thu, Feb 25, 2010 7:49:37pm |
re: #256 Cato the Elder
Believe me, you don't want scumbag lobbyists taking your Mom out to lunch.
You never know when "being taken out to lunch" might mean "being lunch"
| 259 |
SanFranciscoZionist Thu, Feb 25, 2010 7:50:09pm |
re: #96 mich-again
I personally like the Kraft M&C best of all.
I like Kraft, also the Stouffers frozen stuff. The Stouffers frozen stuff is what I demand when I'm sick.
| 260 |
Gus Thu, Feb 25, 2010 7:50:35pm |
re: #251 Racer X
Son
Of
A
Bitch.No new nuclear power. Way more dependence on foreign oil. Totally inefficient.
Fail.
I don't understand. How does one get "no nuclear power" out of that?
| 261 |
albusteve Thu, Feb 25, 2010 7:50:36pm |
re: #250 Plato
I wonder what athiests think about
vampires and crosses.
Cato probably knows the answer to that...or will otherwise dazzle you with some sort of historic lore
| 262 |
Decatur Deb Thu, Feb 25, 2010 7:50:53pm |
re: #251 Racer X
Son
Of
A
Bitch.No new nuclear power. Way more dependence on foreign oil. Totally inefficient.
Fail.
DOE oversees lots of nuclear power--mostly the instantaneous kind.
| 264 |
jaunte Thu, Feb 25, 2010 7:51:32pm |
re: #241 jaunte
The problem with Margaret Thatcher is that you soon run out of her quotes.
On the other hand, I like this one. It could be updated for the President.
"If my critics saw me walking over the Thames they would say it was because I couldn't swim."
| 265 |
Obdicut Thu, Feb 25, 2010 7:52:01pm |
re: #238 cliffster
Yes, tying the knot, potentially moving across the country and changing jobs as my wife-to-be enters a Md/PhD program, while attempting to get a startup financed with a friend who has brain cancer that affects his moods.
So yeah, a little complex. But no vampires, and everyone involved is of age.
| 266 |
cliffster Thu, Feb 25, 2010 7:53:32pm |
re: #263 Plato
vampires again eh?
My wife really wants me to read the Twilight series and so finally I broke down and am doing it. I read the first book, working on the second. Good Lord. But this is what love is all about. Learning to love what your lover loves...
| 267 |
SanFranciscoZionist Thu, Feb 25, 2010 7:53:37pm |
re: #112 iceweasel
Much more at link, and here is MMFA running it down:
Right-wing media link new agency logo to Obama's, Pepsi's, Iran's, Islamic Crescent
You know, when this started popping up a couple of days ago I really didn't believe it would get any traction outside of some of the real fringe-y wankosphere. Unbelievably, it appears I've underestimated just how insane the right is right now. Peak Wingnut-- can it ever be reached?
What I don't get is how you 'secretly signal' your 'submission' to sharia. Sharia, IIUC, is a system of religious and civil Muslim legal ruling, roughly analogous to halacha. You can't 'secretly' practice it like black magic in your basement, you either adhere to it or you don't.
Have they checked Obama's investments, say?
| 268 |
albusteve Thu, Feb 25, 2010 7:53:58pm |
re: #265 Obdicut
Yes, tying the knot, potentially moving across the country and changing jobs as my wife-to-be enters a Md/PhD program, while attempting to get a startup financed with a friend who has brain cancer that affects his moods.
So yeah, a little complex. But no vampires, and everyone involved is of age.
despite my contentious behavior, best of luck and may the Force be with you...cross country moves are never easy
| 269 |
mich-again Thu, Feb 25, 2010 7:54:18pm |
re: #251 Racer X Rule. Whenever a government program blows the mission its always because the program didn't go far enough and the fix is more of it. If the medicine aint working, take more of it.
| 270 |
The Sanity Inspector Thu, Feb 25, 2010 7:54:35pm |
re: #265 Obdicut
Yes, tying the knot, potentially moving across the country and changing jobs as my wife-to-be enters a Md/PhD program, while attempting to get a startup financed with a friend who has brain cancer that affects his moods.
So yeah, a little complex. But no vampires, and everyone involved is of age.
I hope you don't have to stay separated for long after you wed.
| 271 |
Racer X Thu, Feb 25, 2010 7:54:37pm |
| 272 |
Gus Thu, Feb 25, 2010 7:54:47pm |
re: #267 SanFranciscoZionist
What I don't get is how you 'secretly signal' your 'submission' to sharia. Sharia, IIUC, is a system of religious and civil Muslim legal ruling, roughly analogous to halacha. You can't 'secretly' practice it like black magic in your basement, you either adhere to it or you don't.
Have they checked Obama's investments, say?
Buy gold now before it's too late!!11!1 Stock up on canned foods, fresh water, and ammunition!1111!! Teh end of Americu is coming soon!111!!
/
| 273 |
BARACK THE VOTE Thu, Feb 25, 2010 7:55:14pm |
re: #243 Dark_Falcon
Some people have seen Twilight too many times. Geeze...
Here's the guy's myspace
[Link: www.myspace.com...]
Has his campaign videos.
"Current mood: betrayed"
lol
| 274 |
Varek Raith Thu, Feb 25, 2010 7:55:19pm |
re: #266 cliffster
My wife really wants me to read the Twilight series and so finally I broke down and am doing it. I read the first book, working on the second. Good Lord. But this is what love is all about. Learning to love what your lover loves...
Gah! That damnable series has just ruined the awesomeness of vampirism.
How Twilight Should Have Ended.
:)
| 275 |
Obdicut Thu, Feb 25, 2010 7:55:23pm |
re: #268 albusteve
Still a chance she'll get into Stanford and we won't have to move. A month until we know. Really has me up in the air.
But I'll be fine. If it's New York, I'll start getting excited about New York.
And mostly I'm really proud of her-- Md/PhD programs are not exactly easy to get into.
| 277 |
cliffster Thu, Feb 25, 2010 7:55:25pm |
"Maybe in order to understand mankind we have to look at that word itself. MANKIND. Basically, it's made up of two separate words 'mank' and 'ind.' What do these words mean? It's a mystery and that's why so is mankind."
| 278 |
Gus Thu, Feb 25, 2010 7:55:26pm |
re: #271 Racer X
"New"
Well, I still don't see how one gets "no new nuclear power" out of that entry.
| 279 |
Decatur Deb Thu, Feb 25, 2010 7:56:30pm |
re: #255 SanFranciscoZionist
I've always wanted to teach astrology.
To be fair, it's almost certainly a mistaken substitution for "astronomical". That means they're no less stupid, but sloppy with language as well.
| 280 |
Ayeless in Ghazi Thu, Feb 25, 2010 7:56:55pm |
re: #272 Gus 802
Buy gold now before it's too late!!11!1 Stock up on canned foods, fresh water, and ammunition!1111!! Teh end of Americu is coming soon!111!!
/
Don't forget the calming pants. Must have the calming pants...
| 281 |
Obdicut Thu, Feb 25, 2010 7:57:09pm |
re: #270 The Sanity Inspector
Heh. We won't be doing a JimmahIce thing. We'll move together. We already did the long-distance thing while she finished up a program, for two years, a long time ago, and that was enough for a lifetime.
| 282 |
Plato Thu, Feb 25, 2010 7:57:24pm |
re: #267 SanFranciscoZionist
there was something similar in a design commerating the plane that went down in Pennsylvania on 911. I wonder if that crescent theme was completed?
Might we see a pattern?
| 283 |
SanFranciscoZionist Thu, Feb 25, 2010 7:57:30pm |
re: #168 iceweasel
Ok, since we're already talking about puppet strippers and such...
This is the craziest thing I've seen in the last 24 hours:
Vampyre for President Absconded with Child Bride After YouTube Proposal
Jonathon "The Impaler" Sharkey lives in New Jersey and usually limits his Luciferian powers to third-party runs for office. (Platform: "I WILL IMPALE THEM! [criminals]") Then a YouTube proposal to his 16-year-old girlfriend ignited a nationwide manhunt and internet flamewar.
Originally from the Garden State, the Impaler has run for office in New Jersey, Indiana, Florida, Minnesota, and for president. He's a self-proclaimed satanist, former pro-wrestler, (Rocky 'Hurricane' Flash's retired in 2004) and repeat legal offender. (Stalking and coercion are trouble spots.)
16-year-old Paige Brewer ran away from her mother's rural Minnesota home six months ago. According to Minneapolis' City Pages, Paige was living with her grandmother when she met the Impaler on a vampire comment board last month. After a whirlwind cyber romance, Sharkey proposed with a YouTube video in which he shows off his Wiccan tats in what appears to be a Valentine-themed corner of a daycare center, with the love ballad from Beauty and the Beast straining softly in the background.
(youtube is at link)Paige said "YES!!!" and Jonathon flew to Minnesota to gather his child bride on Valentine's Day. Then they went into hiding—but continued to maintain avid correspondences with City Pages, MySpace fans, and vampire forums.
Classified an "endangered runaway," Paige rechristened herself "Paige Sharkey" and announced she would seek emancipation from her mother. "Screw off," she told City Pages in an interview. "I bit him first. Let me live my life." The Impaler said he was protecting his bride from those who would inflict "child abuse" upon her, like her mother. Here's a video where the Impaler accuses Jill Moen of being an abusive, drug-addicted stripper. He demonstrates how he will avenge his beloved: "I LIKE TO PUNCH."
[Video]
The Impaler admits, "I prefer to sink my fangs into younger women," but claims he never had sex with Paige. As the pair's vampirical honeymoon wore on, however, law enforcement closed in. A child protection agent reached out to Paige on her favorite vampire forum, then lured the pair to a legal-brokering meeting in Minnesota. En route, Sharkey posted celebratory messages on City Pages' comment boards:
I am arriving in Minneapolis tomorrow. I would have stated to all women of Minnesota: Cover your necks with garlic. However, the only neck my fangs will be in is Paige's neck. Otherwise, she will make me a toothless vampyre! ;)
But at the meeting—which took place at a Faribault, MN community center—plainclothed cops swooped in to free Paige from her vampire lover's pointy-toothed grip. The middle-aged bloodsucker ended up on a Greyhound bus back to New Jersey. Paige remains with her mother, who says she is "working with Hennepin County children's health to get [Paige] a referral for a facility here. She's aware she will have to go somewhere for awhile and seems accepting of it so long as it's not where she was the last few days." We wish them luck—it's not every day you have to deprogram your child from an epic runaway romance with a tech-savvy vampire politician impaler.
I already feel better about my life.
| 284 |
Kragar Thu, Feb 25, 2010 7:57:43pm |
re: #272 Gus 802
Buy gold now before it's too late!!11!1 Stock up on canned foods, fresh water, and ammunition!1111!! Teh end of Americu is coming soon!111!!
/
BEWARE THE OLIGARHY!
| 285 |
Stonemason Thu, Feb 25, 2010 7:57:49pm |
re: #274 Varek Raith
My vampire knowledge was Ann Rice and Dean Koontz...till a friend told me to read The Strain...interesting take by Guillermo Del Torro
| 286 |
Varek Raith Thu, Feb 25, 2010 7:58:00pm |
re: #280 Jimmah
Don't forget the calming pants. Must have the calming pants...
[Video]
"You can't see me! You can't see me! No one can see me!"
| 287 |
mich-again Thu, Feb 25, 2010 7:58:10pm |
re: #259 SanFranciscoZionist
I like Kraft, also the Stouffers frozen stuff. The Stouffers frozen stuff is what I demand when I'm sick.
Comfort food. I likes me some Ramen noodles when I'm sick.
| 288 |
goddamnedfrank Thu, Feb 25, 2010 7:58:10pm |
re: #267 SanFranciscoZionist
What I don't get is how you 'secretly signal' your 'submission' to sharia. Sharia, IIUC, is a system of religious and civil Muslim legal ruling, roughly analogous to halacha. You can't 'secretly' practice it like black magic in your basement, you either adhere to it or you don't.
Have they checked Obama's investments, say?
Think of it as the legacy of Dan Brown.
Wheels within wheels.
Symbols within symbols.
Turtles all the way down.
| 289 |
cliffster Thu, Feb 25, 2010 7:58:29pm |
re: #265 Obdicut
Yes, tying the knot, potentially moving across the country and changing jobs as my wife-to-be enters a Md/PhD program, while attempting to get a startup financed with a friend who has brain cancer that affects his moods.
So yeah, a little complex. But no vampires, and everyone involved is of age.
That's awesome. Embrace the adventures as you come. And kudos to your wife. Nice work.
| 290 |
Gus Thu, Feb 25, 2010 7:58:38pm |
re: #280 Jimmah
Don't forget the calming pants. Must have the calming pants...
[Video]
Calming pants? Sounds like a paraphilia.
Doh!
| 291 |
SanFranciscoZionist Thu, Feb 25, 2010 7:58:50pm |
re: #179 Surabaya Stew
Government cheese is pretty tasty when melted over macaroni.
Aiyah. Don't talk to me about government cheese. I have terrible memories of what happened in my childhood when the elderly ladies from the Soviet Union discovered that the U.S. government will give you free cheese. It involves string bags, and a lot of shouting in Russian.
| 292 |
cliffster Thu, Feb 25, 2010 7:59:12pm |
re: #289 cliffster
That's awesome. Embrace the adventures as
youthey come. And kudos to your wife. Nice work.
shit, I suck at motivational speaking
| 293 |
Racer X Thu, Feb 25, 2010 7:59:35pm |
re: #278 Gus 802
Well, I still don't see how one gets "no new nuclear power" out of that entry.
My angst is due to the fact that a government agency was specifically created to reduce our dependance on foreign oil. FAIL.
Another aspect of that agency is to (I assume) promote nuclear / alternative energy. Instead we got this:
In 2010, the Department of Energy gave Nissan $1.4 billion to build the Nissan Leaf car
| 294 |
Kragar Thu, Feb 25, 2010 7:59:38pm |
re: #285 Stonemason
My vampire knowledge was Ann Rice and Dean Koontz...till a friend told me to read The Strain...interesting take by Guillermo Del Torro
I like the Brian Lumley vampires.
| 295 |
Dark_Falcon Thu, Feb 25, 2010 7:59:48pm |
re: #274 Varek Raith
Gah! That damnable series has just ruined the awesomeness of vampirism.
How Twilight Should Have Ended.
:)
Oh, that's good. I'm looking forward to seeing Wesley Snipes in Brooklyn's Finest when it comes out next Friday. It promises to be a good movie.
| 297 |
albusteve Thu, Feb 25, 2010 8:00:38pm |
re: #275 Obdicut
Still a chance she'll get into Stanford and we won't have to move. A month until we know. Really has me up in the air.
But I'll be fine. If it's New York, I'll start getting excited about New York.
And mostly I'm really proud of her-- Md/PhD programs are not exactly easy to get into.
but then...cha ching!....my son almost took a seat in a dental progran in NYC...blew him out of his socks when he interviewed...as for the wife, good for her...very smart wives are something pretty special
| 298 |
SanFranciscoZionist Thu, Feb 25, 2010 8:01:08pm |
re: #212 freetoken
Get ready for the outrage:
I assume that Obama aides meet with atheists on the White House grounds every day...oh. Like, representative atheists?
| 299 |
Stonemason Thu, Feb 25, 2010 8:01:21pm |
re: #294 Kragar (Proud to be Kafir)
I like the Brian Lumley vampires.
This is why I like LGF...new things to read!
| 300 |
Gus Thu, Feb 25, 2010 8:01:26pm |
Armageddon Checklist:
[x] Fresh Water
[x] Canned Food
[x] Ammunition
[x] Fallout Shelter
[x] Jordache Jeans
| 301 |
Dark_Falcon Thu, Feb 25, 2010 8:01:33pm |
re: #284 Kragar (Proud to be Kafir)
BEWARE THE OLIGARHY!
WE'RE DOOOMMEDD!!111111111
[runs around screaming]
| 302 |
Olsonist Thu, Feb 25, 2010 8:02:34pm |
re: #291 SanFranciscoZionist
Reminds me of Tracy Morgan's joke,
I grew up on government cheese – in fact I prefer it!
| 303 |
watching you tiny alien kittens are Thu, Feb 25, 2010 8:03:28pm |
re: #267 SanFranciscoZionist
What I don't get is how you 'secretly signal' your 'submission' to sharia. Sharia, IIUC, is a system of religious and civil Muslim legal ruling, roughly analogous to halacha. You can't 'secretly' practice it like black magic in your basement, you either adhere to it or you don't.
Have they checked Obama's investments, say?
I secretly hold sharia court sessions on my back porch, now if I could just catch one of the squirrels I have sentenced to beheading for their anti-islamic transgressions.
/
| 304 |
Stanghazi Thu, Feb 25, 2010 8:03:39pm |
| 305 |
Walter L. Newton Thu, Feb 25, 2010 8:03:54pm |
re: #300 Gus 802
Armageddon Checklist:
[x] Fresh Water
[x] Canned Food
[x] Ammunition
[x] Fallout Shelter
[x] Jordache Jeans
There will be no such thing like Armageddon.
| 306 |
albusteve Thu, Feb 25, 2010 8:04:27pm |
re: #293 Racer X
I hear you...the feds giving monet to Nissan is like me giving money to Bill Gates....utter folly
| 307 |
Obdicut Thu, Feb 25, 2010 8:04:30pm |
re: #297 albusteve
Well, she'll be a research doctor, so no ca-ching, really. They make about a third of what practicing doctors make. But this way she gets to do the research she really loves-- leukemia, at the moment-- and the world gets the benefit of her discoveries. I wish they paid research scientists more, but it just goes to show you often the best and the brightest are not primarily motivated by money.
But yes, she's amazingly special. Never met anyone else like her.
| 308 |
Gus Thu, Feb 25, 2010 8:04:34pm |
re: #305 Walter L. Newton
There will be no such thing like Armageddon.
You mean Bruce Willis won't save the Earth?
| 309 |
Cato the Elder Thu, Feb 25, 2010 8:04:48pm |
re: #250 Plato
I wonder what athiests think about
vampires and crosses.
There are no atheists in vampire cellars.
| 311 |
The Sanity Inspector Thu, Feb 25, 2010 8:05:12pm |
re: #303 ausador
I secretly hold sharia court sessions on my back porch, now if I could just catch one of the squirrels I have sentenced to beheading for their anti-islamic transgressions.
/
We jest, but elsewhere in the world it's all grim reality.
| 312 |
Ayeless in Ghazi Thu, Feb 25, 2010 8:05:36pm |
re: #286 Varek Raith
"You can't see me! You can't see me! No one can see me!"
You must be wearing the Ring of Khajiit, no? ;-)
| 314 |
The Sanity Inspector Thu, Feb 25, 2010 8:07:17pm |
Good night. Here are some shimmering sustains, from one of the Great Lost Guitarists of the 70s.
| 315 |
Kragar Thu, Feb 25, 2010 8:07:22pm |
re: #286 Varek Raith
"You can't see me! You can't see me! No one can see me!"
"I am the air! I am the wind!"
| 316 |
Varek Raith Thu, Feb 25, 2010 8:07:52pm |
re: #308 Gus 802
You mean Bruce Willis won't save the Earth?
No, not unless he can deflect a 2.4×1032 W Superlaser blast.
| 317 |
Surabaya Stew Thu, Feb 25, 2010 8:08:07pm |
re: #291 SanFranciscoZionist
Aiyah. Don't talk to me about government cheese. I have terrible memories of what happened in my childhood when the elderly ladies from the Soviet Union discovered that the U.S. government will give you free cheese. It involves string bags, and a lot of shouting in Russian.
Goodness, sounds like a horror story! What did those Russian ladies do with it anyway? It was my brother who showed me what could be done with the stuff, as he received bricks of it for free from his lactose-intolerant MIL. Tasted no different from Kraft singles except that it came in a larger form. Velveta is still tastier over Macaroni, though.
| 318 |
Velvet Elvis Thu, Feb 25, 2010 8:08:52pm |
re: #212 freetoken
Get ready for the outrage:
I just hope it's not the idiotic kind who want to change our currency and shit like that.
| 319 |
freetoken Thu, Feb 25, 2010 8:08:56pm |
Looks like Hugo is upset at the OAS:
Venezuelan official disputes report on human rights abuses
Venezuela's top human rights official on Thursday disputed findings of a report issued by an Organization of American States commission, and accused the panel of unfairly distorting statistics to show a pattern of political repression and abuses by the government.
The report, released Wednesday by the Inter-American Commission on Human Rights, said Venezuela's government often intimidates or punishes citizens based on their political beliefs.
At a news conference in Caracas, Ombudswoman Gabriela Ramirez said the report "attempts, once again, to discredit and weaken the democratic institutions of the state," and accused the OAS of lacking impartiality, according to the official ABN news agency.
| 320 |
albusteve Thu, Feb 25, 2010 8:09:50pm |
re: #318 Conservative Moonbat
I just hope it's not the idiotic kind who want to change our currency and shit like that.
no, they just want to convince him that he's not a god....
| 321 |
Obdicut Thu, Feb 25, 2010 8:09:54pm |
re: #319 freetoken
My friend at Amnesty International sez:
"Dictators are growing faster than my budget."
| 322 |
cliffster Thu, Feb 25, 2010 8:10:13pm |
| 323 |
freetoken Thu, Feb 25, 2010 8:10:13pm |
re: #318 Conservative Moonbat
I just hope it's not the idiotic kind who want to change our currency and shit like that.
It would be more honest to change "In God We Trust" to "In Technology We Trust"...
| 324 |
The Sanity Inspector Thu, Feb 25, 2010 8:10:16pm |
And this:
| 325 |
Racer X Thu, Feb 25, 2010 8:10:26pm |
re: #306 albusteve
I hear you...the feds giving monet to Nissan is like me giving money to Bill Gates...utter folly
I'm just shaking my head (again). We create a new government agency specifically to reduce our dependance on foreign oil, yet here we are 40 years later - more dependent than ever.
They were specifically created to be in charge of dealing with nuclear energy and waste - yet here we are with no new nuclear plants in the past 40 years, and that prick Reid won't let them open Yucca mountain - so now we get to spend Billions dealing with nuclear waste like we did 40 years ago.
Total Fail.
| 326 |
freetoken Thu, Feb 25, 2010 8:11:43pm |
| 327 |
webevintage Thu, Feb 25, 2010 8:12:01pm |
re: #274 Varek Raith
Gah! That damnable series has just ruined the awesomeness of vampirism.
How Twilight Should Have Ended.
:)
On one of the gamer shows on G4 they did a little skit.
Edward and Bella are doing the talky stuff in the woods and Olivia Munn comes up and...well just watch it:
Blood and the F word...
You KILL vampires, you don't date them.
| 328 |
Cato the Elder Thu, Feb 25, 2010 8:12:03pm |
| 329 |
Varek Raith Thu, Feb 25, 2010 8:12:54pm |
re: #322 cliffster
Be careful, your unborn baby can get pregnant if you have sex while you're pregnant
MAH HAID HERTZ! MAH EYEZ BURN! MAH HAID EXPLODD!
...
| 330 |
jaunte Thu, Feb 25, 2010 8:13:00pm |
re: #319 freetoken
Oscar Arias of Costa Rica made a related speech recently:
...
Do not confuse the democratic origin of a system with a fully functioning democratic state. There are governments in our region that use election results to justify their desire to restrict individual freedoms and persecute their opponents. They use a democratic mechanism to subvert the foundations of democracy. A true democrat, if it has no opposition, must create it. Shows his success in the fruits of his labor, but not in the product of his retaliations.
...
[Link: devilsexcrement.com...]
| 331 |
freetoken Thu, Feb 25, 2010 8:13:03pm |
re: #328 Cato the Elder
Can I make money off it?
WRT dictatorships, definitely go long and sell puts...
| 332 |
Silvergirl Thu, Feb 25, 2010 8:14:15pm |
re: #70 WindUpBird
I read this thread from the top down, and I was thinking, "Man, WUB is snippy tonight." I wasn't going to post that opinion, just thinking you were really wound up (hence your name), but then a little more scrolling and I see you getting called a bitch! Even though it was later stated that it was a NY thing, I still felt like I wanted to give you a hot chocolate and a teddy bear.
| 333 |
albusteve Thu, Feb 25, 2010 8:15:38pm |
re: #325 Racer X
I'm just shaking my head (again). We create a new government agency specifically to reduce our dependance on foreign oil, yet here we are 40 years later - more dependent than ever.
They were specifically created to be in charge of dealing with nuclear energy and waste - yet here we are with no new nuclear plants in the past 40 years, and that prick Reid won't let them open Yucca mountain - so now we get to spend Billions dealing with nuclear waste like we did 40 years ago.
Total Fail.
then there's the Dept of Education....billions for nothing...the feds go through money like poop through a goose...that's why I just can't take this HC reform seriously....every little flare up, and nuance and spending....it all makes me just laugh...the feds are so inept they can't even keep the National Parks cleaned up and maintained...they are a farce
| 334 |
Gus Thu, Feb 25, 2010 8:16:45pm |
re: #325 Racer X
I'm just shaking my head (again). We create a new government agency specifically to reduce our dependance on foreign oil, yet here we are 40 years later - more dependent than ever.
They were specifically created to be in charge of dealing with nuclear energy and waste - yet here we are with no new nuclear plants in the past 40 years, and that prick Reid won't let them open Yucca mountain - so now we get to spend Billions dealing with nuclear waste like we did 40 years ago.
Total Fail.
PFI - US nuclear power project financing under way
NEW YORK, Feb 25 (Project Finance International) - Vogtle, the nuclear power plant co-sponsored by Municipal Electric Authority of Georgia (MEAG), has announced plans to launch a US$2.5bn bond financing to fund the bulk of its portion of the project within days of winning the first US loan government guarantee for a nuclear facility. With more loan guarantees to be announced soon, the long-awaited nuclear power revival looks to be on its way. Goldman Sachs and coleads will hold a roadshow next week for the bond package which will fund a portion of its investment in the proposed Vogtle 3&4 nuclear power plant expansion. Fitch Ratings have assigned some of the senior bonds A+ ratings, and others A-.
| 335 |
Digital Display Thu, Feb 25, 2010 8:16:55pm |
re: #332 Silvergirl
Chocolates from San Fran and a dozen roses for you...
It's the least we can do..*wink*
| 336 |
watching you tiny alien kittens are Thu, Feb 25, 2010 8:17:04pm |
re: #311 The Sanity Inspector
We jest, but elsewhere in the world it's all grim reality.
What? tell me how they catch the squirrels, they are fast, wily buggers, I'm not even sure how to behead one without being bitten...
| 337 |
SanFranciscoZionist Thu, Feb 25, 2010 8:17:06pm |
re: #279 Decatur Deb
To be fair, it's almost certainly a mistaken substitution for "astronomical". That means they're no less stupid, but sloppy with language as well.
I got that, I truly did--but good GRIEF. What are they, eight?
| 338 |
cliffster Thu, Feb 25, 2010 8:17:44pm |
re: #328 Cato the Elder
Can I make money off it?
You should consider repackaging them into risk-mitigating investment vehicles. You can bring all the big boys into it - Goldman Sachs, Lehmans... you'll make jillions!
| 339 |
SanFranciscoZionist Thu, Feb 25, 2010 8:17:48pm |
re: #282 Plato
there was something similar in a design commerating the plane that went down in Pennsylvania on 911. I wonder if that crescent theme was completed?
Might we see a pattern?
A pattern of what? Curved lines?
| 340 |
Varek Raith Thu, Feb 25, 2010 8:18:44pm |
re: #339 SanFranciscoZionist
A pattern of what? Curved lines?
I see a pattern of unintentional hilarity!
| 341 |
Silvergirl Thu, Feb 25, 2010 8:20:07pm |
Walter, was that homemade mac 'n cheese the kind made with white sauce with a touch of mustard? The only way.
On the subject of food, if Mandy's around I want to find out what brand of orange sorbet you get. I made sorbet once upon a time, but tonight could not find much of a selection at the store.
Hoopster! I made your RR dessert! I wasn't going to but ended up going for it. Five very happy dinner guests. Next time I make it I'll use more Cool Whip than called for. Also, the recipe didn't give the amount of pecans, so about 3/4 cup went in. Also I forgot the chocolate bar for the shavings but I had some mini chocolate chips and they still made it pretty. Perfect! Thank you!
| 342 |
Racer X Thu, Feb 25, 2010 8:20:20pm |
| 344 |
Decatur Deb Thu, Feb 25, 2010 8:20:42pm |
re: #337 SanFranciscoZionist
I got that, I truly did--but good GRIEF. What are they, eight?
Contemplate the layers of review and proofreading that document went through.
| 345 |
SanFranciscoZionist Thu, Feb 25, 2010 8:20:43pm |
| 346 |
Dark_Falcon Thu, Feb 25, 2010 8:20:58pm |
re: #334 Gus 802
Let's hope the plant gets built. It is desperately needed.
| 347 |
Varek Raith Thu, Feb 25, 2010 8:21:32pm |
re: #346 Dark_Falcon
Let's hope the plant gets built. It is desperately needed.
And doesn't leak tritium...
| 348 |
Racer X Thu, Feb 25, 2010 8:21:41pm |
re: #333 albusteve
then there's the Dept of Education...billions for nothing...the feds go through money like poop through a goose...that's why I just can't take this HC reform seriously...every little flare up, and nuance and spending...it all makes me just laugh...the feds are so inept they can't even keep the National Parks cleaned up and maintained...they are a farce
The federal government just needs someone to keep an eye on stuff, and shitcan things that are a waste of money. We need like a czar or something.
/
| 349 |
SanFranciscoZionist Thu, Feb 25, 2010 8:22:15pm |
re: #322 cliffster
Be careful, your unborn baby can get pregnant if you have sex while you're pregnant
This is why we need sex ed in the schools. Because Yahoo Answers is failing at it.
| 350 |
avanti Thu, Feb 25, 2010 8:22:32pm |
re: #306 albusteve
I hear you...the feds giving monet to Nissan is like me giving money to Bill Gates...utter folly
You do know that is not a fact ? No one was "given" money, it was a loan much as other companies got:
"The loan came from DOE's Advanced Technology Vehicles Manufacturing program, which establishes $25 billion worth of loans to help car makers produce vehicles that use less gasoline.
With the award, Nissan becomes the first foreign-owned automaker to win a major contract with the Obama administration.
Last fall, the program loaned Ford nearly $6 billion, and earlier this month, it loaned $465 million to California-based Tesla, a company that builds a premium electric car but wants to sell a cheaper version.
BTW, the loan was to upgrade a plant in the USA.
| 351 |
watching you tiny alien kittens are Thu, Feb 25, 2010 8:22:40pm |
re: #334 Gus 802
Progress Energy has already gotten a rate hike approved for most of it's customers in Florida to finance adding two more reactors at it's Crystal River plant. Still no Federal approval, but we are already paying for it just in case it gets approved I guess...
| 353 |
SanFranciscoZionist Thu, Feb 25, 2010 8:23:21pm |
re: #327 webevintage
On one of the gamer shows on G4 they did a little skit.
Edward and Bella are doing the talky stuff in the woods and Olivia Munn comes up and...well just watch it:
[Video]
Blood and the F word...You KILL vampires, you don't date them.
Well, that's what Anita Blake used to say--for like forty-five seconds, back at the beginning of the series.
I can no longer read the Anita Blake books, because Anita has turned into the biggest Mary Sue in the history of Maries Sue.
| 354 |
albusteve Thu, Feb 25, 2010 8:24:51pm |
re: #342 Racer X
Nice.
Can I have about 200 more please? It would create lots of jobs.
too little, too late...the energy problem will catch up with us when the economy picks up...it's gonna be ugly
| 357 |
MandyManners Thu, Feb 25, 2010 8:25:53pm |
re: #341 Silvergirl
I buy a local brand for orange but buy Haagen Dazs for raspberry or strawberry.
| 358 |
Walter L. Newton Thu, Feb 25, 2010 8:25:56pm |
re: #349 SanFranciscoZionist
This is why we need sex ed in the schools. Because Yahoo Answers is failing at it.
One of my step critters does some answer work for Cha-Cha... she says sex questions are most common... she tells me she the two answers she uses the most are...
1) That's not physically possible
and
2) No, you can't wash and reuse them.
| 359 |
Kragar Thu, Feb 25, 2010 8:26:11pm |
re: #329 Varek Raith
MAH HAID HERTZ! MAH EYEZ BURN! MAH HAID EXPLODD!
...
Yahoo answers is proof that maybe the people in the human extinction movement have the right answer after all.
/
| 360 |
Dark_Falcon Thu, Feb 25, 2010 8:26:15pm |
re: #347 Varek Raith
And doesn't leak tritium...
These new reactor designs are very safe. The level of risk is extremely low. Natural Gas fired plants are more dangerous than these reactors will be.
| 361 |
Stanghazi Thu, Feb 25, 2010 8:26:32pm |
re: #355 Irenicum
Just read it too.
One of these days Rush is.....
I've been saying this for years and nothing ever happens, he just gets louder.
| 362 |
Dark_Falcon Thu, Feb 25, 2010 8:27:06pm |
| 363 |
cliffster Thu, Feb 25, 2010 8:27:38pm |
re: #359 Kragar (Proud to be Kafir)
Yahoo answers is proof that maybe the people in the human extinction movement have the right answer after all.
/
Some species stick around for millions of years. Humans will not be one of those species
| 364 |
Walter L. Newton Thu, Feb 25, 2010 8:28:19pm |
re: #363 cliffster
Some species stick around for millions of years. Humans will not be one of those species
Not even 100 more years.
| 365 |
SanFranciscoZionist Thu, Feb 25, 2010 8:28:35pm |
re: #344 Decatur Deb
Contemplate the layers of review and proofreading that document went through.
When I worked for a place that did staffing for ERs, we had materials go out for a national conference in which the contact phone number had been screwed up. 800 for 888 or something similar.
When you called the number to register for the conference?
Bom-chicka--bow-bow...HOT CHICKS dig phone sex too!...Please stand by to give us your credit card number...
I had a very nice man call me from Texas to tell me about the screw-up--he'd tried to register--and could barely bear to tell a lady what had happened--and then I started working my way up the food chain in the office.
Problem was, no one believed me, so I had to make person after person call the number, and then they would go with me to the next person up the chain...until I stood in the office of the regional president who said "Oh, I'm sure you just dialed it wrong...don't be silly..." and put his phone on speaker and dialed the number.
Bom-chicka--bow-bow...HOT CHICKS dig phone sex too!...Please stand by to give us your credit card number...
I was so, so happy that I had had NOTHING to do with the proofreading for the conference materials.
| 366 |
Velvet Elvis Thu, Feb 25, 2010 8:28:53pm |
re: #351 ausador
Progress Energy has already gotten a rate hike approved for most of it's customers in Florida to finance adding two more reactors at it's Crystal River plant. Still no Federal approval, but we are already paying for it just in case it gets approved I guess...
The NRC approval process desperately needs to be modernized for many reasons. There are reactor types like the Toshiba and Hyperion micro-reactors that were inconceivable when the regulations were written.
| 367 |
goddamnedfrank Thu, Feb 25, 2010 8:29:05pm |
Follow up:
SeaWorld said its staff would continue to interact with the whale, named Tilikum, despite calls to release or destroy it.
I'm glad they're not going to kill the whale, but I'm not at all sure that continuing to treat gigantic thinking marine predators like show animals is a wise move.
| 368 |
Killgore Trout Thu, Feb 25, 2010 8:29:19pm |
re: #355 Irenicum
I don't know if anyone's seen this amazing piece from the New Yorker where they do a deconstruction of Rush Limbaugh's blatant racism. Needless to say Rush needs to be "axed" pronto. I found it through Andrew Sullivan's blog
Rush isn't going anywhere. This is what many conservatives consider serious political thought these days.
| 369 |
Kragar Thu, Feb 25, 2010 8:29:20pm |
re: #363 cliffster
Some species stick around for millions of years. Humans will not be one of those species
Especially not if the Master gets his way.
| 370 |
Dark_Falcon Thu, Feb 25, 2010 8:29:26pm |
| 371 |
Varek Raith Thu, Feb 25, 2010 8:29:52pm |
re: #360 Dark_Falcon
These new reactor designs are very safe. The level of risk is extremely low. Natural Gas fired plants are more dangerous than these reactors will be.
It's not the reactors, it's the coolant pipes.
A problem that must be addressed if the nuclear industry is going to lead the way for cleaner energy.
| 372 |
Slumbering Behemoth Stinks Thu, Feb 25, 2010 8:29:58pm |
Everything that is wrong with pop culture (music really) summed up in two photos.
| 374 |
cliffster Thu, Feb 25, 2010 8:30:19pm |
| 375 |
watching you tiny alien kittens are Thu, Feb 25, 2010 8:30:25pm |
re: #353 SanFranciscoZionist
Well, that's what Anita Blake used to say--for like forty-five seconds, back at the beginning of the series.
I can no longer read the Anita Blake books, because Anita has turned into the biggest Mary Sue in the history of Maries Sue.
I read a couple of those, but then again I'll read most anything, even James Patterson. (alex cross and the psycho murderers that kill everyone he partners with or even meets at work but never ever his two kids or his grandmother who all live at home with him...uhh...sure.)
| 376 |
Velvet Elvis Thu, Feb 25, 2010 8:30:47pm |
re: #342 Racer X
Nice.
Can I have about 200 more please? It would create lots of jobs.
Not as many as you think. We've fallen so far behind in reactor technology that we're going to have to pay Japan to make the parts and ship them over. We don't have the technology to build a reactor vessel and a lot of the surrounding hardware. It's pitiful.
| 377 |
freetoken Thu, Feb 25, 2010 8:31:14pm |
re: #367 goddamnedfrank
It could feed a whole lot of schoolchildren in Japan.
| 378 |
Cato the Elder Thu, Feb 25, 2010 8:31:23pm |
| 379 |
albusteve Thu, Feb 25, 2010 8:31:38pm |
re: #367 goddamnedfrank
Follow up:
I'm glad they're not going to kill the whale, but I'm not at all sure that continuing to treat gigantic thinking marine predators like show animals is a wise move.
that whole display of human superiority and animal subjection should be shut down...there is no excuse anymore for that barbarity
| 380 |
Kragar Thu, Feb 25, 2010 8:32:24pm |
Great, so I'm sitting here on a conference call and the guys I'm supposed to report to have stepped away and no one knows where the hell they are.
| 381 |
Dark_Falcon Thu, Feb 25, 2010 8:32:47pm |
re: #374 cliffster
The problem with kittens? They eventually become cats.
What's wrong with cats. I like cats. As long as you properly serve them, they're wonderful.
| 382 |
cliffster Thu, Feb 25, 2010 8:32:54pm |
re: #365 SanFranciscoZionist
I'm still having to apply a bit of an SFZ filter after the bi bit the other day. No need to bring phone sex into it
| 383 |
Varek Raith Thu, Feb 25, 2010 8:33:33pm |
re: #371 Varek Raith
Of course, I could be way off the reservation on this one.
:shrugs:
| 384 |
Gus Thu, Feb 25, 2010 8:33:42pm |
re: #376 Conservative Moonbat
Not as many as you think. We've fallen so far behind in reactor technology that we're going to have to pay Japan to make the parts and ship them over. We don't have the technology to build a reactor vessel and a lot of the surrounding hardware. It's pitiful.
Not true:
| 386 |
Dark_Falcon Thu, Feb 25, 2010 8:35:04pm |
| 387 |
albusteve Thu, Feb 25, 2010 8:35:05pm |
re: #370 Dark_Falcon
I'm a bit more optimistic than that.
why?... your a fan of what's his name right?...you sit there and suck that stuff up and now say you are optimistic?...all facts seem to point to the end do they not?...how in the hell are we supposed to turn around AGW in time to prevent disaster?...it cannot be done
| 388 |
Cato the Elder Thu, Feb 25, 2010 8:35:17pm |
re: #381 Dark_Falcon
What's wrong with cats. I like cats. As long as you properly serve them, they're wonderful.
Yes, they're picky about their dinnerware being spotless.
| 389 |
SanFranciscoZionist Thu, Feb 25, 2010 8:35:29pm |
BTW--great moments in work errors--
The African-American student group at my school designed a Black History Month t-shirt to sell as a fundraiser. It was nice, simple design, a square formed by hands in red and black clasping each other's wrists, black in the center of the square, and in the very middle, a red outline of Africa.
Apparently, when the teacher organizing the Black History Assembly event and one of the moms who was helping her went to pick up the t-shirts they noticed a problem. Africa was upside down.
The man behind the counter, when this was pointed out to him said "I'm Irish. How am I supposed to know what Africa looks like?"
In defense of the company, though, they did reprint the shirts, quickly. It was just one of those moments that reminds you of the importance of geography in our schools.
| 390 |
Slumbering Behemoth Stinks Thu, Feb 25, 2010 8:35:32pm |
re: #369 Kragar (Proud to be Kafir)
For a second I thought you were talking about Richard Grey.
| 391 |
Ojoe Thu, Feb 25, 2010 8:35:35pm |
re: #381 Dark_Falcon
When I play the bagpipe, my orange tomcat leaves the room.
| 392 |
cliffster Thu, Feb 25, 2010 8:36:12pm |
re: #381 Dark_Falcon
What's wrong with cats. I like cats. As long as you properly serve them, they're wonderful.
I have a cat. He loves to sleep with us. Problem is - I'm allergic. So every morning it's the same damn thing - I wake up, head exploding, takes 20-30 minutes to get normal.
We picked him up off the street 4 or so years ago. Long story short, we fed him in the garage, cracked the garage door. No way he's living inside. Took him to the vet, oops he has FIV. We either make him an indoor cat or put him down. Needless to say, I've had an indoor cat since then. Dammit. He's a cool cat though
| 393 |
Velvet Elvis Thu, Feb 25, 2010 8:36:20pm |
re: #384 Gus 802
Not true:
Neither of which can make the actual reactor vessel, nevermind the fact that the Westinghouse designs are just souped up versions of the same PWRs we've been using for 30 years. There's nothing particularly innovative about them.
| 395 |
albusteve Thu, Feb 25, 2010 8:36:34pm |
re: #376 Conservative Moonbat
Not as many as you think. We've fallen so far behind in reactor technology that we're going to have to pay Japan to make the parts and ship them over. We don't have the technology to build a reactor vessel and a lot of the surrounding hardware. It's pitiful.
what's wrong with the Hyperion besides the cost (because nobody can install one)
| 396 |
Dark_Falcon Thu, Feb 25, 2010 8:36:59pm |
re: #388 Cato the Elder
Yes, they're picky about their dinnerware being spotless.
That might be why one of my mother's cats is so thin. I'll make an extra effort to clean the cat food dishes the next time I'm over there.
| 397 |
jaunte Thu, Feb 25, 2010 8:37:12pm |
re: #389 SanFranciscoZionist
He might have just checked the map.
Image: mcarthur-large.jpg
| 398 |
Ojoe Thu, Feb 25, 2010 8:37:28pm |
| 399 |
Cato the Elder Thu, Feb 25, 2010 8:37:34pm |
re: #355 Irenicum
I don't know if anyone's seen this amazing piece from the New Yorker where they do a deconstruction of Rush Limbaugh's blatant racism. Needless to say Rush needs to be "axed" pronto. I found it through Andrew Sullivan's blog
Limbaugh is a racist from the surface of his fat oily face right down to the center of his evil heart.
| 400 |
Varek Raith Thu, Feb 25, 2010 8:37:35pm |
re: #396 Dark_Falcon
That might be why one of my mother's cats is so thin. I'll make an extra effort to clean the cat food dishes the next time I'm over there.
Cats got ya trained well, eh?
| 401 |
SanFranciscoZionist Thu, Feb 25, 2010 8:37:55pm |
re: #391 Ojoe
When I play the bagpipe, my orange tomcat leaves the room.
Friend of mine has a cat who, she believes, had a conversion experience. A friend of hers was over, and began to sing, in his rich, lovely baritone, "Blessed Assurance, Jesus is Mine". The cat ran over to him, lay down on his feet, and stared up at him in rapture.
My friend had promised the guy she got the cat from to continue to raise her as a Jew, but she feels that the cat became a Pentecostalist on her own, and there's nothing she can do about it.
| 402 |
albusteve Thu, Feb 25, 2010 8:38:06pm |
re: #394 Ojoe
Pessimism will get you nowhere.
do you understand the science?....we are fucked...cushioning the blow is no victory over AGW
| 403 |
Gus Thu, Feb 25, 2010 8:38:07pm |
re: #386 Dark_Falcon
Thanks for those links.
YW I know both Westinghouse and GE are doing a lot of work overseas. My uncle was a nuclear engineer for Westinghouse many years ago. The technology, know how, tools, and mind power are all there.
| 404 |
Ojoe Thu, Feb 25, 2010 8:38:56pm |
re: #401 SanFranciscoZionist
I think my cat is a pagan and that he is Finvarra when I am not looking.
| 405 |
SanFranciscoZionist Thu, Feb 25, 2010 8:39:05pm |
re: #397 jaunte
He might have just checked the map.
[Link: flourish.org...]
I think that featured on an episode of West Wing.
| 406 |
Velvet Elvis Thu, Feb 25, 2010 8:39:10pm |
| 407 |
Gus Thu, Feb 25, 2010 8:39:22pm |
re: #393 Conservative Moonbat
Neither of which can make the actual reactor vessel, nevermind the fact that the Westinghouse designs are just souped up versions of the same PWRs we've been using for 30 years. There's nothing particularly innovative about them.
Westinghouse is a leader in the design of advanced pressurized water (PWR) and advanced boiling water reactor (BWR) systems for worldwide application. Our new nuclear power plant design portfolio includes specific customer-driven designs including:
* The System 80® nuclear steam supply system, which forms the basis for the proven and highly successful Korea Standard Nuclear Power Plant (KSNP)
* The AP600/AP1000 family of advanced pressurized water reactors based on demonstrated, licensed technology with simplified safety systems that rely solely on natural forces
* BWR 90+, an advanced boiling water reactor, with improved safety and operability
A leader in technology transfer, Westinghouse has successfully transferred design and manufacturing capabilities to many countries, including France, Japan, and Korea. Its most recent efforts in technology transfer have allowed South Korea to become self-reliant in the design and construction of nuclear power plants, components and fuel. International cooperation continues with companies in Korea and Japan toward the development of the Korean Next Generation Reactor (KNGR) in South Korea and the Advanced Pressurized Water Reactor (APWR) in Japan. The technology basis for the KNGR is our 1350 MWe System 80+™ advanced plant design, the only large evolutionary PWR that has received design certification from the U.S. NRC under its one-step licensing process.
| 408 |
MandyManners Thu, Feb 25, 2010 8:39:25pm |
re: #381 Dark_Falcon
What's wrong with cats. I like cats. As long as you properly serve them, they're wonderful.
*whackwhackwhack*
| 409 |
Dark_Falcon Thu, Feb 25, 2010 8:39:34pm |
re: #387 albusteve
why?... your a fan of what's his name right?...you sit there and suck that stuff up and now say you are optimistic?...all facts seem to point to the end do they not?...how in the hell are we supposed to turn around AGW in time to prevent disaster?...it cannot be done
It can be done Steve. Reactors like those about to be built are a mojor part of the solution. So are better power grids and more efficient cars. There's a lot of good that can be done.
| 410 |
Ojoe Thu, Feb 25, 2010 8:39:37pm |
re: #402 albusteve
We humans will roll with the punches we've survived climate change before.
| 411 |
What, me worry? Thu, Feb 25, 2010 8:39:39pm |
re: #401 SanFranciscoZionist
Friend of mine has a cat who, she believes, had a conversion experience. A friend of hers was over, and began to sing, in his rich, lovely baritone, "Blessed Assurance, Jesus is Mine". The cat ran over to him, lay down on his feet, and stared up at him in rapture.
My friend had promised the guy she got the cat from to continue to raise her as a Jew, but she feels that the cat became a Pentecostalist on her own, and there's nothing she can do about it.
Hmmm does it meow in tongues?
| 412 |
albusteve Thu, Feb 25, 2010 8:40:14pm |
re: #403 Gus 802
YW I know both Westinghouse and GE are doing a lot of work overseas. My uncle was a nuclear engineer for Westinghouse many years ago. The technology, know how, tools, and mind power are all there.
politics trumps all that...even breaks down the spirit, the will...that's the point after all
| 413 |
Gus Thu, Feb 25, 2010 8:40:26pm |
re: #406 Conservative Moonbat
Here:
[Link: www.world-nuclear.org...]
OK, it's the end of the world. We'll never build a nuclear power plant again. It's too late. The sky is falling.
| 414 |
Cato the Elder Thu, Feb 25, 2010 8:40:28pm |
re: #396 Dark_Falcon
That might be why one of my mother's cats is so thin. I'll make an extra effort to clean the cat food dishes the next time I'm over there.
My old cat Pushkin was very finicky about his litter box. When I first got him, I thought I could get away with scooping it every other day.
So while I'm sitting at my desk in my studio apartment in Germany, circa 1988, he goes over and makes in my bed.
I learned fast with that cat.
| 415 |
jaunte Thu, Feb 25, 2010 8:40:42pm |
re: #405 SanFranciscoZionist
I think if I was teaching I'd keep one in the classroom just to keep things interesting.
| 416 |
SanFranciscoZionist Thu, Feb 25, 2010 8:40:43pm |
| 417 |
What, me worry? Thu, Feb 25, 2010 8:40:50pm |
re: #410 Ojoe
We humans will roll with the punches we've survived climate change before.
Well, what I want to know, if we all become subterranean mole people, can we bring the Tom Petty tapes?
| 419 |
MandyManners Thu, Feb 25, 2010 8:41:07pm |
re: #381 Dark_Falcon
What's wrong with cats. I like cats. As long as you properly serve them, they're wonderful.
You were talking about eating them, weren't you?
If not, ignore the playful whacking.
| 420 |
Dark_Falcon Thu, Feb 25, 2010 8:41:13pm |
re: #408 MandyManners
*whackwhackwhack*
Hello, Mandy. Sorry, but I lived with cats for many years and I'm used to them.
| 421 |
Velvet Elvis Thu, Feb 25, 2010 8:41:30pm |
re: #395 albusteve
what's wrong with the Hyperion besides the cost (because nobody can install one)
They are subject to the same NRC regulations as a full sized power plant, the same insurance requirements, etc.
Trying to get the installation of one approved would be the same as trying to get a new full sized nuclear power plant approved.
| 422 |
Varek Raith Thu, Feb 25, 2010 8:41:40pm |
re: #419 MandyManners
You were talking about eating them, weren't you?
If not, ignore the playful whacking.
Yeah, you don't own cats, they own you!
| 423 |
albusteve Thu, Feb 25, 2010 8:41:42pm |
re: #409 Dark_Falcon
It can be done Steve. Reactors like those about to be built are a mojor part of the solution. So are better power grids and more efficient cars. There's a lot of good that can be done.
not talking what can be done...sorry for the misinterpretation
| 424 |
Stanghazi Thu, Feb 25, 2010 8:41:46pm |
re: #392 cliffster
I have a cat. He loves to sleep with us. Problem is - I'm allergic. So every morning it's the same damn thing - I wake up, head exploding, takes 20-30 minutes to get normal.
We picked him up off the street 4 or so years ago. Long story short, we fed him in the garage, cracked the garage door. No way he's living inside. Took him to the vet, oops he has FIV. We either make him an indoor cat or put him down. Needless to say, I've had an indoor cat since then. Dammit. He's a cool cat though
I'm deathly allergic too. It's a bummer cause I love cats, but I would cease to breath if I had one in the bed.
| 425 |
Cato the Elder Thu, Feb 25, 2010 8:42:07pm |
re: #410 Ojoe
We humans will roll with the punches we've survived climate change before.
Yeah, like that time we went straight from the Cold War to the Peace Dividend inside of five weeks.
| 427 |
MandyManners Thu, Feb 25, 2010 8:42:42pm |
re: #420 Dark_Falcon
Hello, Mandy. Sorry, but I lived with cats for many years and I'm used to them.
I made an unfounded assumption.
| 428 |
Gus Thu, Feb 25, 2010 8:42:46pm |
re: #421 Conservative Moonbat
They are subject to the same NRC regulations as a full sized power plant, the same insurance requirements, etc.
Trying to get the installation of one approved would be the same as trying to get a new full sized nuclear power plant approved.
Yep, can't be done. No more approval of nuclear power plants.
Might as well give up. Yep, that's the ticket.
| 429 |
Dark_Falcon Thu, Feb 25, 2010 8:42:53pm |
re: #418 mikeysdca
On a thread this morning, I wondered about talk time at the Great Blair House Taffy Pull. Somebody kept track, as reported on FNC:
Bambi 119 minutes;
Dems 114 minutes;
GOP 110 minutes.
The Dem spin is that Bambi went to listen.
Why do you call the President 'Bambi'?
| 430 |
albusteve Thu, Feb 25, 2010 8:42:57pm |
re: #421 Conservative Moonbat
They are subject to the same NRC regulations as a full sized power plant, the same insurance requirements, etc.
Trying to get the installation of one approved would be the same as trying to get a new full sized nuclear power plant approved.
yes, that's my point
| 431 |
Varek Raith Thu, Feb 25, 2010 8:42:58pm |
| 432 |
MandyManners Thu, Feb 25, 2010 8:43:00pm |
| 433 |
cliffster Thu, Feb 25, 2010 8:43:02pm |
re: #420 Dark_Falcon
Hello, Mandy. Sorry, but I lived with cats for many years and I'm used to them.
I think that was a whacking for "properly serving" that cat, as in, To Serve Man, twilight zone style.
| 434 |
Velvet Elvis Thu, Feb 25, 2010 8:43:36pm |
re: #407 Gus 802
What I'm saying is there is a not a steel forge in the US with the ability to produce a modern reactor vessel.
| 435 |
albusteve Thu, Feb 25, 2010 8:43:50pm |
| 438 |
cliffster Thu, Feb 25, 2010 8:44:10pm |
| 439 |
MandyManners Thu, Feb 25, 2010 8:44:41pm |
re: #433 cliffster
I think that was a whacking for "properly serving" that cat, as in, To Serve Man, twilight zone style.
I had a vision of him serving one with an apricot in its mouth.
| 440 |
Gus Thu, Feb 25, 2010 8:44:51pm |
re: #418 mikeysdca
On a thread this morning, I wondered about talk time at the Great Blair House Taffy Pull. Somebody kept track, as reported on FNC:
Bambi 119 minutes;
Dems 114 minutes;
GOP 110 minutes.
The Dem spin is that Bambi went to listen.
Yep, all the time went to Obama. No more time allowed for the GOP. Too late, we must accept our "Socialist master media."
It's out of our hands now. Give up now while you can.
| 441 |
Dark_Falcon Thu, Feb 25, 2010 8:45:09pm |
re: #433 cliffster
I think that was a whacking for "properly serving" that cat, as in, To Serve Man, twilight zone style.
Understood. Thankfully, Mandy realized what I meant before sh'ed inflicted anything worse than a deep bruise.
/kidding about the last part.
| 442 |
Varek Raith Thu, Feb 25, 2010 8:45:13pm |
re: #440 Gus 802
Yep, all the time went to Obama. No more time allowed for the GOP. Too late, we must accept our "Socialist master media."
It's out of our hands now. Give up now while you can.
DOOMER!11!
/
| 443 |
Mad Prophet Ludwig Thu, Feb 25, 2010 8:46:02pm |
OK, serious question time.
I have taken to heart some of the requests from friends to tone down some of my anger at AGW trolls.
I wish to ask you all the following hypothetical question though first.
Suppose I came out with great anger and disgust at someone who were defending pedophilia.
Now suppose that there were other posters who were shocked that I could say such angry things to a pedophile.
Would I be wrong to be astonished at the behavior of those posters who thought I was "too harsh" to the child rapist? Would I be wrong to be shocked that there would be those who just didn't seem to get that pedophilia was really bad would argue the economics of not stopping the kiddie porn industry?
Now here is a point.
However horrifying pedophilia is, it is a small thing in comparison to the billions of children who will die as a result of AGW.
So for those who think I am too tightly wound, given that what is at stake is billions of lives, America and our civilization as we know it, why for G-d's sake are you not screaming at these fools with me?
| 444 |
Gus Thu, Feb 25, 2010 8:46:08pm |
re: #442 Varek Raith
DOOMER!11!
/
Sort of sounds like it doesn't it? Yeesh. That stuff gets old fast.
| 445 |
What, me worry? Thu, Feb 25, 2010 8:46:08pm |
re: #436 Cato the Elder
Downding for "Bambi".
I think it has something to do with this.
which I think is pretty cute actually lol
| 446 |
What, me worry? Thu, Feb 25, 2010 8:46:25pm |
I can't watch videos here tonight for some reason.
| 447 |
solomonpanting Thu, Feb 25, 2010 8:47:26pm |
re: #438 cliffster
It took awhile to find out the album was private, not public.
Guess I needed the public option.
| 448 |
Velvet Elvis Thu, Feb 25, 2010 8:47:54pm |
re: #413 Gus 802
OK, it's the end of the world. We'll never build a nuclear power plant again. It's too late. The sky is falling.
I never said that. I said we'd have to import the vessel from Japan.
| 450 |
Varek Raith Thu, Feb 25, 2010 8:48:38pm |
re: #448 Conservative Moonbat
I never said that. I said we'd have to import the vessel from Japan.
Well then, so be it.
| 451 |
albusteve Thu, Feb 25, 2010 8:49:05pm |
re: #447 solomonpanting
It took awhile to find out the album was private, not public.
Guess I needed the public option.
very nice...I'm impressed....something about working with and shaping wood into stuff
| 452 |
Mad Prophet Ludwig Thu, Feb 25, 2010 8:49:21pm |
re: #449 Racer X
You are starting to creep me out.
Why? I would posit that killing children is as least as bad as molesting them.
Do you disagree with that?
| 453 |
MandyManners Thu, Feb 25, 2010 8:49:22pm |
Comparing someone who doesn't buy AGW 100 per cent with a pedophile?
| 454 |
cliffster Thu, Feb 25, 2010 8:49:23pm |
re: #447 solomonpanting
It took awhile to find out the album was private, not public.
Guess I needed the public option.
I changed my mind. Keep your communist furniture away.
| 455 |
albusteve Thu, Feb 25, 2010 8:49:39pm |
| 456 |
Gus Thu, Feb 25, 2010 8:49:47pm |
re: #448 Conservative Moonbat
I never said that. I said we'd have to import the vessel from Japan.
OK. It sounded a little bit defeatist to me. So we'd get the vessel or the heavy forgings from Japan. I don't see a problem with that at all. It's good for trade. We buy their heavy forgings and they buy our Boeings. Win win.
| 457 |
Daniel Ballard Thu, Feb 25, 2010 8:49:50pm |
re: #419 MandyManners
Dogs have owners. Cats have staff.
| 458 |
Velvet Elvis Thu, Feb 25, 2010 8:50:23pm |
re: #428 Gus 802
Yep, can't be done. No more approval of nuclear power plants.
Might as well give up. Yep, that's the ticket.
What crawled up your ass and died?
NRC regulations need modernizing to accommodate new technologies. This is a problem that's been identified by the DOE and is going to be addressed. It's just going to take some time.
| 459 |
Cato the Elder Thu, Feb 25, 2010 8:51:16pm |
re: #443 ludwigvanquixote
Do you drive a car? Do you heat your house? Do you fly?
You're an AGW contributor.
That's the difference.
| 460 |
cliffster Thu, Feb 25, 2010 8:51:33pm |
re: #447 solomonpanting
It took awhile to find out the album was private, not public.
Guess I needed the public option.
seriously though, that's very cool. I've been wanting to get into woodworking for a couple of years now. I have tools, I have books, now all I need is time. Really, it's just a matter of sitting down and doing it. I agree with steve though - there's something about taking bunch of wood and making something beautiful...
| 461 |
MandyManners Thu, Feb 25, 2010 8:51:47pm |
re: #457 Rightwingconspirator
Dogs have owners. Cats have staff.
I wish I could get the dog to use a litter pan for something other than grocery shopping.
| 462 |
Cato the Elder Thu, Feb 25, 2010 8:52:29pm |
| 463 |
cliffster Thu, Feb 25, 2010 8:53:02pm |
re: #443 ludwigvanquixote
You asked a serious question, now I'll ask one. Do you seriously not see how insanely one might perceive the things you say?
| 464 |
Gus Thu, Feb 25, 2010 8:53:04pm |
re: #458 Conservative Moonbat
What crawled up your ass and died?
NRC regulations need modernizing to accommodate new technologies. This is a problem that's been identified by the DOE and is going to be addressed. It's just going to take some time.
Since you ask. Your doom and gloom outlook.
| 466 |
Dark_Falcon Thu, Feb 25, 2010 8:53:15pm |
re: #443 ludwigvanquixote
OK, serious question time.
I have taken to heart some of the requests from friends to tone down some of my anger at AGW trolls.
I wish to ask you all the following hypothetical question though first.
Suppose I came out with great anger and disgust at someone who were defending pedophilia.
Now suppose that there were other posters who were shocked that I could say such angry things to a pedophile.
Would I be wrong to be astonished at the behavior of those posters who thought I was "too harsh" to the child rapist? Would I be wrong to be shocked that there would be those who just didn't seem to get that pedophilia was really bad would argue the economics of not stopping the kiddie porn industry?
Now here is a point.
However horrifying pedophilia is, it is a small thing in comparison to the billions of children who will die as a result of AGW.
So for those who think I am too tightly wound, given that what is at stake is billions of lives, America and our civilization as we know it, why for G-d's sake are you not screaming at these fools with me?
I may not explain this right, but its the only way I know how to say it:
AGW poses the higher risk but it is cause by things we all do. Pedophila is a deviant behavior engaged in by very few people. Its much easier to get outraged about the actions of a small minority, since they can be effectively targeted (not defending pedophiles, just stating facts).
I reason I don't scream is that it causes skeptics and non-hardcore deniers who otherwise might be reached to go in defensive modes wherein they counterattack the screamer and malign him.
| 467 |
albusteve Thu, Feb 25, 2010 8:53:23pm |
| 468 |
Mad Prophet Ludwig Thu, Feb 25, 2010 8:53:35pm |
And Mandy who compulsively down dings me... Would you posit that killing children is not bad? What was untrue about that.
What is missing from the equation here?
If we do not act properly and soon, we condemn children to death - along with the collapse of our civilization.
I know that people really do not want to see that or think about it in those terms, but that really is the reality.
Why can't you face that?
Perhaps consumerism is more important than your children?
| 469 |
What, me worry? Thu, Feb 25, 2010 8:54:03pm |
re: #443 ludwigvanquixote
I guess because pedophilia hurts children in the here and now and not at some time in the future. That's the short answer :)
But you don't offend me. I know others don't agree! You're just uniquely you as others are uniquely them.
| 470 |
Racer X Thu, Feb 25, 2010 8:54:05pm |
re: #452 ludwigvanquixote
Dude.
Please consult with a spiritual advisor or a trusted friend. I'm starting to really worry about you, and I mean that sincerely.
| 471 |
freetoken Thu, Feb 25, 2010 8:54:12pm |
re: #443 ludwigvanquixote
The "billions are going to die" approach is not very effective.
First off, as humans, we are specialists at putting off the thought of our own impending deaths.
Second, those most likely to die from AGW related effects are in the third world, and won't be the folk reading your postings.
Third, anger at death is a universal human reaction, so the fact that you are angry at death isn't going to be surprising to anyone reading.
Fourth, as I've mentioned repeatedly here, the human thinking process is strongly, very strongly, hard wired (by evolution) to discount the future.
Given all of that, I tend to approach this issue (of AGW denialism) from either (1) concerns over our "heritage", so to speak, or (2) concern over the destruction of our society's high view of science, in the Western tradition (i.e., the "culture war" approach.)
| 473 |
Mad Prophet Ludwig Thu, Feb 25, 2010 8:54:23pm |
re: #459 Cato the Elder
Do you drive a car? Do you heat your house? Do you fly?
You're an AGW contributor.
That's the difference.
Do I do everything in my power to minimize my impact?
Would the real solutions of switching to nuclear, solar and wind along with a smart grid make your point moot?
| 474 |
watching you tiny alien kittens are Thu, Feb 25, 2010 8:54:29pm |
re: #376 Conservative Moonbat
Not as many as you think. We've fallen so far behind in reactor technology that we're going to have to pay Japan to make the parts and ship them over. We don't have the technology to build a reactor vessel and a lot of the surrounding hardware. It's pitiful.
Uhh...we are still selling reactors overseas, westinghouse is at least, and I think another company is..GE maybe? Whoever it is, we are building export reactors, so building domestic ones can't be all that damn hard.
| 476 |
Obdicut Thu, Feb 25, 2010 8:54:45pm |
| 479 |
Cato the Elder Thu, Feb 25, 2010 8:55:16pm |
re: #461 MandyManners
I wish I could get the dog to use a litter pan for something other than grocery shopping.
When I got my first dog, years ago, a friend warned me about that. Her exact words were, "If you think cat shit stinks, wait till it's been recycled through a dog."
Thankfully none of my canines have been into coprophagia.
| 480 |
Velvet Elvis Thu, Feb 25, 2010 8:55:18pm |
re: #430 albusteve
yes, that's my point
I don' t think Hyperion type reactors have really been designed for use in the US anyway. They are really better suited for off the grid use in very remove locations. Think antartica or remote African mining communities, polar oil drilling sites, that kind of thing.
| 481 |
Mad Prophet Ludwig Thu, Feb 25, 2010 8:55:31pm |
re: #471 freetoken
The "billions are going to die" approach is not very effective.
First off, as humans, we are specialists at putting off the thought of our own impending deaths.
Second, those most likely to die from AGW related effects are in the third world, and won't be the folk reading your postings.
Third, anger at death is a universal human reaction, so the fact that you are angry at death isn't going to be surprising to anyone reading.
Fourth, as I've mentioned repeatedly here, the human thinking process is strongly, very strongly, hard wired (by evolution) to discount the future.
Given all of that, I tend to approach this issue (of AGW denialism) from either (1) concerns over our "heritage", so to speak, or (2) concern over the destruction of our society's high view of science, in the Western tradition (i.e., the "culture war" approach.)
NO, you are missing the whole America and Western civilization collapses part. That matters too.
The fact that people don't seem to value that only is an argument that they have it coming when they piss it all away.
| 482 |
Varek Raith Thu, Feb 25, 2010 8:55:31pm |
re: #465 MikeySDCA
My respectful nickname for our Beloved Leader. Biden is Thumper.
Gee, wasn't there something about referring to Bush as some form of animal that was wailed about by the right? I didn't like it then and I don't like it now.
| 485 |
albusteve Thu, Feb 25, 2010 8:56:02pm |
re: #468 ludwigvanquixote
And Mandy who compulsively down dings me... Would you posit that killing children is not bad? What was untrue about that.
What is missing from the equation here?
If we do not act properly and soon, we condemn children to death - along with the collapse of our civilization.
I know that people really do not want to see that or think about it in those terms, but that really is the reality.
Why can't you face that?
Perhaps consumerism is more important than your children?
why would you bring such a repulsive subject here?...and you have the nerve to call me a troll...you are obsessed
| 486 |
jaunte Thu, Feb 25, 2010 8:56:21pm |
re: #443 ludwigvanquixote
So for those who think I am too tightly wound, given that what is at stake is billions of lives, America and our civilization as we know it, why for G-d's sake are you not screaming at these fools with me?
This piece from Nature has some good thoughts about the political end of the issue:
It would not be a gross simplification to say that science needs better marketing. Unlike commercial advertising, however, the goal of these techniques is not to induce public acceptance of any particular conclusion, but rather to create an environment for the public's open-minded, unbiased consideration of the best available scientific information.As straightforward as these recommendations might seem, however, science communicators routinely flout them. The prevailing approach is still simply to flood the public with as much sound data as possible on the assumption that the truth is bound, eventually, to drown out its competitors. If, however, the truth carries implications that threaten people's cultural values, then holding their heads underwater is likely to harden their resistance and increase their willingness to support alternative arguments, no matter how lacking in evidence.
[Link: www.nature.com...]
| 487 |
Mad Prophet Ludwig Thu, Feb 25, 2010 8:56:32pm |
re: #469 marjoriemoon
I guess because pedophilia hurts children in the here and now and not at some time in the future. That's the short answer :)
But you don't offend me. I know others don't agree! You're just uniquely you as others are uniquely them.
NO not so, there is a food crisis that is starving kids now. There is flooding now.
But I suppose that brown babies don't count as much to most Americans. At that point, I have to sadly agree.
| 488 |
Dark_Falcon Thu, Feb 25, 2010 8:56:39pm |
re: #465 MikeySDCA
My respectful nickname for our Beloved Leader. Biden is Thumper.
Upding for the Biden as Thumper line.
| 489 |
Cato the Elder Thu, Feb 25, 2010 8:57:03pm |
re: #473 ludwigvanquixote
Do I do everything in my power to minimize my impact?
Would the real solutions of switching to nuclear, solar and wind along with a smart grid make your point moot?
Killing AGW deniers or ignorers would be quicker and more effective.
| 490 |
cliffster Thu, Feb 25, 2010 8:57:20pm |
| 491 |
Mad Prophet Ludwig Thu, Feb 25, 2010 8:57:25pm |
re: #485 albusteve
AGW is worse than pedophilia in all ways. More lives will be ruined.
And of course you are a troll. You do nothing but snipe at any post I make. So GAZE.
| 492 |
Racer X Thu, Feb 25, 2010 8:57:27pm |
I'm out as well.
This is getting really creepy - like a train wreck that you just cannot stop no matter how hard you try.
| 494 |
albusteve Thu, Feb 25, 2010 8:57:51pm |
re: #476 Obdicut
Oh please.
Why does everyone on earth like to play interwebs psychiatrist?
it's a new phenom here
| 495 |
MandyManners Thu, Feb 25, 2010 8:58:04pm |
re: #479 Cato the Elder
When I got my first dog, years ago, a friend warned me about that. Her exact words were, "If you think cat shit stinks, wait till it's been recycled through a dog."
Thankfully none of my canines have been into coprophagia.
No matter how quickly I scoop, the dog sometimes gets there first.
| 496 |
Gus Thu, Feb 25, 2010 8:58:17pm |
re: #493 Varek Raith
Sigh... here it comes.
*Jumps in fox hole with Varek Raith.*
There. Two atheists in a fox hole.
/
| 498 |
cliffster Thu, Feb 25, 2010 8:58:40pm |
re: #481 ludwigvanquixote
NO, you are missing the whole America and Western civilization collapses part. That matters too.
The fact that people don't seem to value that only is an argument that they have it coming when they piss it all away.
| 499 |
Varek Raith Thu, Feb 25, 2010 8:59:24pm |
re: #497 MikeySDCA
Inspired by Molly Ivins, I called him Shrub. Still do.
Well, you're consistent, I'll give ya that.
:)
| 501 |
Obdicut Thu, Feb 25, 2010 9:00:02pm |
re: #487 ludwigvanquixote
Ludwig, Freetoken is posting exactly what I think as well. I know the soft sciences are, well, soft, but they do have things to say about effective communciation. Biology can teach us a lot about it, as well. Think of it in terms of Dennett's design space. People don't want to be told we have to crawl back down the mountain-- people resist that on an almost genetic level. Use all resources is burned into our DNA. People need to see a way farther up the mountain.
I respect you, I respect your science, and I respect your tenacity and commitment. I have no particular problem with you flying off the handle, though the insults are distracting, but I simply am saying that, especially as a memetic strategy you can pass to others, yours doesn't work. It doesn't fit most personality types.
Part of this is a meme war. Overly complex memes fail.
| 502 |
Stanghazi Thu, Feb 25, 2010 9:00:07pm |
From a newbie's view is so freaking predictable.
Ludwig you are totally outnumbered by the taunters in this thread. It's not going to end well. As usual.
I appreciate Ludwig's points, so what if he is "dramatic" about it? So so so many folks here have their own drama, day after day. Typically it's ok for some, but obviously not for others.
| 503 |
Dark_Falcon Thu, Feb 25, 2010 9:00:25pm |
re: #496 Gus 802
*Jumps in fox hole with Varek Raith.*
There. Two atheists in a fox hole.
/
I've got room in my bunker. It's rated to survive turbolaser bombardment.
/
| 504 |
albusteve Thu, Feb 25, 2010 9:00:33pm |
re: #491 ludwigvanquixote
AGW is worse than pedophilia in all ways. More lives will be ruined.
And of course you are a troll. You do nothing but snipe at any post I make. So GAZE.
I think it's appropriate to point out I think you are a thread whore and a crackpot...you can't leave it alone, thread to thread, you need to dominate the discussion....gaze does not work, as I've pointed out several time
| 505 |
Mad Prophet Ludwig Thu, Feb 25, 2010 9:00:50pm |
re: #489 Cato the Elder
Killing AGW deniers or ignorers would be quicker and more effective.
re: #466 Dark_Falcon
I may not explain this right, but its the only way I know how to say it:
AGW poses the higher risk but it is cause by things we all do. Pedophila is a deviant behavior engaged in by very few people. Its much easier to get outraged about the actions of a small minority, since they can be effectively targeted (not defending pedophiles, just stating facts).
I reason I don't scream is that it causes skeptics and non-hardcore deniers who otherwise might be reached to go in defensive modes wherein they counterattack the screamer and malign him.
It is true, because we do not adopt technology that we have to avert the catastrophe, we are all contributing to the problem. The point is we don't have to. We have a choice to employ other technologies but lack the will to do so.
In some ways that is worse than pedophilia, because not only can we change our ways, but we are too lazy too.
| 506 |
Obdicut Thu, Feb 25, 2010 9:01:31pm |
re: #501 Obdicut
Meh. I shouldn't have said 'yours doesn't work'. I mean only that as a meme, it doesn't work. It's not a copyable behavior, nor is it replicative.
Apologies. Obviously you've been able to communicate a lot of good science and educate a lot of LGFers on the subject. Didn't mean to imply otherwise.
| 507 |
MandyManners Thu, Feb 25, 2010 9:01:36pm |
My word. Using the rape of children to try to score political points.
It's best if I bid everyone a good night.
| 508 |
Dark_Falcon Thu, Feb 25, 2010 9:01:52pm |
re: #492 Racer X
I'm out as well.
This is getting really creepy - like a train wreck that you just cannot stop no matter how hard you try.
Good night, Racer. Wise decision to step back when you needed to.
| 509 |
Mad Prophet Ludwig Thu, Feb 25, 2010 9:01:59pm |
re: #487 ludwigvanquixote
Ahh Cato, Cliffster... Is it not true that there is a food crisis. Is it not true that there is flooding in places like Bangladesh. Is it not true that if those kids were white America would care more?
Sorry but I will speak the truth even if you hate it.
| 510 |
Obdicut Thu, Feb 25, 2010 9:02:19pm |
re: #507 MandyManners
AGW really isn't a political issue. Or it shouldn't be.
| 512 |
Gus Thu, Feb 25, 2010 9:02:47pm |
re: #503 Dark_Falcon
I've got room in my bunker. It's rated to survive turbolaser bombardment.
/
I'll be right over as soon as I put on my "calming pants."
/
| 513 |
Dark_Falcon Thu, Feb 25, 2010 9:02:49pm |
re: #507 MandyManners
My word. Using the rape of children to try to score political points.
It's best if I bid everyone a good night.
Goodnight, Mandy.
| 514 |
freetoken Thu, Feb 25, 2010 9:02:55pm |
re: #481 ludwigvanquixote
NO, you are missing the whole America and Western civilization collapses part
I think I've mentioned before that I don't really buy that idea.
Our contemporary American lifestyle... yes, that is at risk, high risk, of disappearing in a never ending series of wealth destrorying effects. However, Western Civilization, per se, is not built upon the luxuries of modernity, no matter how much the Ad Agencies like to sell Americans the idea that having the latest, and more and more, is the foundation of life.
There is a big difference between "lifestyles" and "civilization."
The Bangladeshis, the Thais, the small island nations... all of these are at total risk.
We, however, are not.
And that is the problem.
| 515 |
watching you tiny alien kittens are Thu, Feb 25, 2010 9:03:10pm |
re: #443 ludwigvanquixote
OK, serious question time.
I have taken to heart some of the requests from friends to tone down some of my anger at AGW trolls.
I wish to ask you all the following hypothetical question though first.
Suppose I came out with great anger and disgust at someone who were defending pedophilia.
Now suppose that there were other posters who were shocked that I could say such angry things to a pedophile.
Would I be wrong to be astonished at the behavior of those posters who thought I was "too harsh" to the child rapist? Would I be wrong to be shocked that there would be those who just didn't seem to get that pedophilia was really bad would argue the economics of not stopping the kiddie porn industry?
Now here is a point.
However horrifying pedophilia is, it is a small thing in comparison to the billions of children who will die as a result of AGW.
So for those who think I am too tightly wound, given that what is at stake is billions of lives, America and our civilization as we know it, why for G-d's sake are you not screaming at these fools with me?
Questions for you:
Do you think that anything you said to the pedophile would be enhanced or taken more seriously by calling him sick, idiot, or asshole?
Do you think that useing a profanity laced rant against him will register at all or just make you seem childish?
How do you equate people confused by all the massive amounts of misinformation being distributed by many various and sometimes seemingly reputable sources with pedophiles?
If I question a statement you make on AGW (not that I have) am I to be equated with and treated like a pedophile?
Are you entirely sure that you currently have all your marbles accounted for?
/
| 516 |
windhorse Thu, Feb 25, 2010 9:03:30pm |
It's a wonderful day in the neighborhood neighbor... and we love you just the way you are.....
| 517 |
Mad Prophet Ludwig Thu, Feb 25, 2010 9:03:36pm |
re: #501 Obdicut
Part of this is a meme war. Overly complex memes fail.
Babies dead. America gone. Your fault for being lazy. Little else matters.
I think that is a simple meme.
| 518 |
Cato the Elder Thu, Feb 25, 2010 9:03:37pm |
re: #509 ludwigvanquixote
Ahh Cato, Cliffster... Is it not true that there is a food crisis. Is it not true that there is flooding in places like Bangladesh. Is it not true that if those kids were white America would care more?
Sorry but I will speak the truth even if you hate it.
And I'm going to live my life and not worry too much about things I can't directly control. Even if you hate it.
You're starting to remind me of the Unabomber. And I say that as someone who actually likes you.
| 519 |
Dark_Falcon Thu, Feb 25, 2010 9:03:55pm |
| 521 |
Mad Prophet Ludwig Thu, Feb 25, 2010 9:04:23pm |
re: #514 freetoken
I think I've mentioned before that I don't really buy that idea.
Our contemporary American lifestyle... yes, that is at risk, high risk, of disappearing in a never ending series of wealth destrorying effects. However, Western Civilization, per se, is not built upon the luxuries of modernity, no matter how much the Ad Agencies like to sell Americans the idea that having the latest, and more and more, is the foundation of life.
There is a big difference between "lifestyles" and "civilization."
The Bangladeshis, the Thais, the small island nations... all of these are at total risk.
We, however, are not.
And that is the problem.
We are not at risk yet. By the time we really feel it here, it will be too late to stop the end catastrophe.
| 522 |
cliffster Thu, Feb 25, 2010 9:04:25pm |
| 524 |
SanFranciscoZionist Thu, Feb 25, 2010 9:04:47pm |
re: #496 Gus 802
*Jumps in fox hole with Varek Raith.*
There. Two atheists in a fox hole.
/
Can a theist come in? I'll pray very quietly.
| 525 |
Velvet Elvis Thu, Feb 25, 2010 9:04:51pm |
re: #443 ludwigvanquixote
OK, serious question time.
I have taken to heart some of the requests from friends to tone down some of my anger at AGW trolls.
I wish to ask you all the following hypothetical question though first.
Suppose I came out with great anger and disgust at someone who were defending pedophilia.
Now suppose that there were other posters who were shocked that I could say such angry things to a pedophile.
Would I be wrong to be astonished at the behavior of those posters who thought I was "too harsh" to the child rapist? Would I be wrong to be shocked that there would be those who just didn't seem to get that pedophilia was really bad would argue the economics of not stopping the kiddie porn industry?
Now here is a point.
However horrifying pedophilia is, it is a small thing in comparison to the billions of children who will die as a result of AGW.
So for those who think I am too tightly wound, given that what is at stake is billions of lives, America and our civilization as we know it, why for G-d's sake are you not screaming at these fools with me?
I'm totally on your side man but that's so over the top it's hilarious. Your attempt to equate the two classes of moral wrongs fails utterly. I don't even know where to start. I'm going to have to sit on this a bit.
In any case, I really don't give a shit if someone thinks pedophilia is OK so long as they don't touch any kids or encourage others to do so.
Likewise I don't give a shit if someone thinks AGW is a hoax as long as they don't vote, or something like that.
Fuck that, that sounds like I'm backing you up.
I"m going to have to let this brew for a bit.
| 526 |
Cato the Elder Thu, Feb 25, 2010 9:05:01pm |
re: #515 ausador
Seeming childish in the eyes of a pedophile is not a good idea.
| 527 |
windhorse Thu, Feb 25, 2010 9:05:01pm |
re: #521 ludwigvanquixote
look in the mirror and repeat that three times.
| 528 |
Varek Raith Thu, Feb 25, 2010 9:05:03pm |
| 529 |
albusteve Thu, Feb 25, 2010 9:05:13pm |
I'm abandoning this thread myself....too bizarre for me
I'm out like a polar bear
| 530 |
Gus Thu, Feb 25, 2010 9:05:28pm |
re: #524 SanFranciscoZionist
Can a theist come in? I'll pray very quietly.
If it gets really bad I'll join ya'. ;)
| 531 |
TheMatrix31 Thu, Feb 25, 2010 9:06:13pm |
Hope you guys are doing fine, D_F and Cliffy.
| 532 |
Dark_Falcon Thu, Feb 25, 2010 9:06:41pm |
| 533 |
Mad Prophet Ludwig Thu, Feb 25, 2010 9:06:45pm |
re: #518 Cato the Elder
And I'm going to live my life and not worry too much about things I can't directly control. Even if you hate it.
You're starting to remind me of the Unabomber. And I say that as someone who actually likes you.
Cato where is that coming from?
The Unabomber?
You have got to be kidding me.
Look the reality is the reality. Either we all do our part and convince our politicians to change things or we suffer the fatye that the science says we will suffer.
You have written many times how you don't think we can so why bother, and I have always responded that I bother because it is the only shot we have.
Better to try and fail than throw my hands up in surrender.
If you want to surrender than so be it, but please, we always have this particular side conversation. Let's not and say we did... ok?
| 534 |
Varek Raith Thu, Feb 25, 2010 9:06:51pm |
I must say, reading e-books on a laptop is...awkward...
re: #531 TheMatrix31
Hope you guys are doing fine, D_F and Cliffy.
'Sup?
| 535 |
cliffster Thu, Feb 25, 2010 9:06:58pm |
re: #509 ludwigvanquixote
Ahh Cato, Cliffster... Is it not true that there is a food crisis. Is it not true that there is flooding in places like Bangladesh. Is it not true that if those kids were white America would care more?
Sorry but I will speak the truth even if you hate it.
I guess you've gotten to the "Make an emotional appeal" part of the book you're reading about how to relate to people. I applaud the effort. But, as I've been saying, you come across as an insane person. This is the truth I speak even if you hate it.
| 536 |
Cato the Elder Thu, Feb 25, 2010 9:07:04pm |
re: #517 ludwigvanquixote
Babies dead. America gone. Your fault for being lazy. Little else matters.
I think that is a simple meme.
Do you ride the bus to avoid polluting with a personal car?
If so, do you rant at people who aren't wearing anti-AGW buttons about how they're worse than pedophiles? Or do you save that for blogs?
| 537 |
Dark_Falcon Thu, Feb 25, 2010 9:07:21pm |
re: #531 TheMatrix31
Hope you guys are doing fine, D_F and Cliffy.
I'm OK. I've got money troubles, but I've found some ways to cut spending.
| 538 |
Obdicut Thu, Feb 25, 2010 9:07:38pm |
re: #517 ludwigvanquixote
Well, sure, that's a simple meme, but it fails because it's unconvincing.
If you want to reject what I'm saying, that's fine, Ludwig.
But you asked the damn question, and I'm answering, so perhaps you could do me the respect of actually listening?
Reasons have been given to you, valid reasons, in this thread, for why your analogy is not workable. Responsibility for AGW is shared. The victims are everyone. People need to be able to see positive change, and aim towards it. If you keep asking this question, as you have, I'm going to keep answering the same way.
I'll keep arguing against anyone who's half-way a denier, and I'll keep spreading the good information, as well. But I'm saying that you're ignoring the data that says that people need more than these confrontations, and even if you have posted positive steps before, they need to be your main message.
You can reject that advice, if you want. But I'm answering a question you asked.
| 539 |
solomonpanting Thu, Feb 25, 2010 9:07:58pm |
re: #510 Obdicut
AGW really isn't a political issue. Or it shouldn't be.
Well, my antenna rise at catastrophic AGW.
| 540 |
TheMatrix31 Thu, Feb 25, 2010 9:08:02pm |
re: #537 Dark_Falcon
Maybe the government can take some cues from you.
| 541 |
windhorse Thu, Feb 25, 2010 9:08:12pm |
re: #532 Dark_Falcon
it means that ludwig should gain more of a sense of introspection on this subject and (probably) every other subject.
| 542 |
Daniel Ballard Thu, Feb 25, 2010 9:08:12pm |
I'm out for the evening. Catch ya all in the morning.
| 543 |
Mad Prophet Ludwig Thu, Feb 25, 2010 9:08:31pm |
re: #525 Conservative Moonbat
I'm totally on your side man but that's so over the top it's hilarious. Your attempt to equate the two classes of moral wrongs fails utterly. I don't even know where to start. I'm going to have to sit on this a bit.
In any case, I really don't give a shit if someone thinks pedophilia is OK so long as they don't touch any kids or encourage others to do so.
Likewise I don't give a shit if someone thinks AGW is a hoax as long as they don't vote, or something like that.
Fuck that, that sounds like I'm backing you up.
I"m going to have to let this brew for a bit.
Buddy, it is morally equivalent. That is the point. What everyone hates is that I am pointing a finger of guilt at them - validly.
What you don't like, and I do not blame you for not liking it, is that yes you do have a moral responsibility for AGW, while for you do not have one for pedophilia.
| 544 |
Obdicut Thu, Feb 25, 2010 9:08:54pm |
re: #539 solomonpanting
AGW is pretty much catastrophic by definition, in that it implies an ongoing forcing event.
| 545 |
cliffster Thu, Feb 25, 2010 9:09:36pm |
re: #531 TheMatrix31
Hope you guys are doing fine, D_F and Cliffy.
Cliffy's doing fine. I've been trying to lose weight. Exercise and eat right. I've got the exercise down - I run a ton and lift weights. But dammit, food just tastes so good.
| 546 |
Dark_Falcon Thu, Feb 25, 2010 9:09:46pm |
re: #540 TheMatrix31
Maybe the government can take some cues from you.
I'm not a model of spending restraint. All I've done is stuff I should have done long ago. Cut taxi rides and eating out, mostly. And it has helped.
| 547 |
Mad Prophet Ludwig Thu, Feb 25, 2010 9:10:19pm |
re: #535 cliffster
I guess you've gotten to the "Make an emotional appeal" part of the book you're reading about how to relate to people. I applaud the effort. But, as I've been saying, you come across as an insane person. This is the truth I speak even if you hate it.
Except that the food crisis and the flooding is real and the people dying are brown and you are not talking abut them or feeling sorry for them at all. The emissions patterns of the West are what killed them too.
The emotional part you don't like is realizing that yes you actually do have blood on your hands.
Evil has no messenger.
| 548 |
TheMatrix31 Thu, Feb 25, 2010 9:11:43pm |
re: #545 cliffster
I'm trying to diet myself. It's absolute hell. I've gained about 35 pounds since August of 2008!
re: #546 Dark_Falcon
I try to be as fiscally responsible as possible, but sometimes life gets in the way and I need to spend money. What can I do?
I'm out, gonna go take care of some stuff. Might join back later if the topic isnt pedophilia v. global warming.
| 549 |
Velvet Elvis Thu, Feb 25, 2010 9:12:36pm |
re: #456 Gus 802
OK. It sounded a little bit defeatist to me. So we'd get the vessel or the heavy forgings from Japan. I don't see a problem with that at all. It's good for trade. We buy their heavy forgings and they buy our Boeings. Win win.
The point is that nuclear power doesn't generate as many US jobs as some people would like to think.
| 550 |
Cato the Elder Thu, Feb 25, 2010 9:12:46pm |
re: #543 ludwigvanquixote
Buddy, it is morally equivalent. That is the point. What everyone hates is that I am pointing a finger of guilt at them - validly.
What you don't like, and I do not blame you for not liking it, is that yes you do have a moral responsibility for AGW, while for you do not have one for pedophilia.
Do you know how much energy your computer uses?
Turn it off, make a sandwich board, grow a long beard, buy a Gandhi robe, and take it to the streets, man.
| 551 |
solomonpanting Thu, Feb 25, 2010 9:13:20pm |
re: #544 Obdicut
AGW is pretty much catastrophic by definition, in that it implies an ongoing forcing event.
Well, then my antenna rise at irreversible catastrophic AGW. From here on to be designated as ICAGW.
| 552 |
Dark_Falcon Thu, Feb 25, 2010 9:13:34pm |
re: #548 TheMatrix31
I'm trying to diet myself. It's absolute hell. I've gained about 35 pounds since August of 2008!
re: #546 Dark_Falcon
I try to be as fiscally responsible as possible, but sometimes life gets in the way and I need to spend money. What can I do?
I'm out, gonna go take care of some stuff. Might join back later if the topic isnt pedophilia v. global warming.
Sometimes you have to spend, its true. I'm just trying to keep those times to a tolerably low level right now.
| 553 |
cliffster Thu, Feb 25, 2010 9:13:36pm |
re: #547 ludwigvanquixote
Except that the food crisis and the flooding is real and the people dying are brown and you are not talking abut them or feeling sorry for them at all. The emissions patterns of the West are what killed them too.
The emotional part you don't like is realizing that yes you actually do have blood on your hands.
Evil has no messenger.
Know what's funny about that? I AM a brown person. Ha! Or half-brown, anyways. So do half-breeds only get half of people's sympathy?
| 554 |
Velvet Elvis Thu, Feb 25, 2010 9:14:28pm |
re: #464 Gus 802
Since you ask. Your doom and gloom outlook.
It's called looking at the reality of the situation, stating the obstacles in the way of progress, and identifying what needs to be done to overcome them
| 555 |
Cato the Elder Thu, Feb 25, 2010 9:14:33pm |
re: #547 ludwigvanquixote
Except that the food crisis and the flooding is real and the people dying are brown and you are not talking abut them or feeling sorry for them at all. The emissions patterns of the West are what killed them too.
The emotional part you don't like is realizing that yes you actually do have blood on your hands.
Evil has no messenger.
There have been famines and floods for ten times as many years as the industrial West has existed.
You should really get a grip.
| 556 |
Dark_Falcon Thu, Feb 25, 2010 9:14:54pm |
re: #550 Cato the Elder
Do you know how much energy your computer uses?
Turn it off, make a sandwich board, grow a long beard, buy a Gandhi robe, and take it to the streets, man.
[facepalm] Not funny.
| 557 |
Varek Raith Thu, Feb 25, 2010 9:15:00pm |
re: #552 Dark_Falcon
Sometimes you have to spend, its true. I'm just trying to keep those times to a tolerably low level right now.
Yeah, my entertainment budget's been completely annihilated...
/ah, well.
| 558 |
Gus Thu, Feb 25, 2010 9:15:07pm |
re: #547 ludwigvanquixote
Except that the food crisis and the flooding is real and the people dying are brown and you are not talking abut them or feeling sorry for them at all. The emissions patterns of the West are what killed them too.
The emotional part you don't like is realizing that yes you actually do have blood on your hands.
Evil has no messenger.
Corollary to those emissions came cures for a variety of tropical diseases. The discovery and production of simple antibiotics. Drugs such as Mectizan which can prevent River Blindness. The perfection of agricultural methods that can now feed the world. While those emissions should be controlled they also provided humankind with a bounty never seen before in the history of mankind which includes the extension of life expectancies for those in poor countries.
| 559 |
Mad Prophet Ludwig Thu, Feb 25, 2010 9:15:21pm |
re: #538 Obdicut
Well, sure, that's a simple meme, but it fails because it's unconvincing.
If you want to reject what I'm saying, that's fine, Ludwig.
But you asked the damn question, and I'm answering, so perhaps you could do me the respect of actually listening?
Reasons have been given to you, valid reasons, in this thread, for why your analogy is not workable. Responsibility for AGW is shared. The victims are everyone. People need to be able to see positive change, and aim towards it. If you keep asking this question, as you have, I'm going to keep answering the same way.
I'll keep arguing against anyone who's half-way a denier, and I'll keep spreading the good information, as well. But I'm saying that you're ignoring the data that says that people need more than these confrontations, and even if you have posted positive steps before, they need to be your main message.
You can reject that advice, if you want. But I'm answering a question you asked.
No I here you.
I do I really do hear you. I also very much respect you and like you.
However, you are missing what I am saving.
The meme is exactly the truth of the science.
Our emissions are changing the earth in a way that will kill people by the billions the effects have already started and lives have already been lost.
That is reality.
What people hate is having their sins pointed out to them.
What I hate, on a moral level is that rather than seeing the consequences of our actions, we have to sugar coat and sell this to people in ways that make them think that they are acting in their own benefit.
In as much as they are saving their nation and their kids they are.
But from a moral view, the fact that people are already dying from this should be sufficient.
Morally we are saying that the sweatshop crap we buy and the car we drive is more important than the lives lost.
That is evil. The fact that peole do not care to stop being evil is frankly just another way of saying that they deserve the mass death they have coming to them. I would be ok with saying that if it didn't also mean losing the good folks along with everyone else.
| 560 |
Gus Thu, Feb 25, 2010 9:15:56pm |
re: #554 Conservative Moonbat
It's called looking at the reality of the situation, stating the obstacles in the way of progress, and identifying what needs to be done to overcome them
Roger. I'll drop it on my end.
| 561 |
Obdicut Thu, Feb 25, 2010 9:16:21pm |
re: #551 solomonpanting
Why? Name the number of ways we have of getting CO2 out of the atmosphere.
It's kinda hard. It'll be harder to do with all the food riots and crap going on, too.
And then will we really want to try to whack the scales back in the opposite direction? Probably not. It'd probably just make things worse. Slowing down the rate of change, stopping it, and slowing rolling it back is very different from the shift we'll have to make once it's runaway.
| 564 |
Varek Raith Thu, Feb 25, 2010 9:17:43pm |
Sigh, this thread is just rotten. I'm out for the night!
| 566 |
Velvet Elvis Thu, Feb 25, 2010 9:18:09pm |
re: #474 ausador
Uhh...we are still selling reactors overseas, westinghouse is at least, and I think another company is..GE maybe? Whoever it is, we are building export reactors, so building domestic ones can't be all that damn hard.
My point is that we can't forge the physical components. We can design 'em, have somebody else make the parts and then put them together but the state of US industry is such there there is no heavy forging ability such as is required for making high end reactor vessels.
| 567 |
Mad Prophet Ludwig Thu, Feb 25, 2010 9:18:16pm |
re: #550 Cato the Elder
Do you know how much energy your computer uses?
Turn it off, make a sandwich board, grow a long beard, buy a Gandhi robe, and take it to the streets, man.
Cato, why are you being like that? To what end?
You are a clear and sharp thinker.
You understand the notion of cause and effect.
What we are doing is a cause. It has a certain effect.
I am using my computer to ring the clue phone for people that yes, their actions matter and yes, thier actions are helping to kill people. So are yours and so are mine. I try to minimize mine and more importantly, as I keep saying, if we switch from fossil fuels, we can still run our computers and drive around and not kill people to do it.
So why are you not arguing for that with me?
If anyone deserves a comparison to the unabomber it is you. I am nowhere near the misanthrope you are.
| 570 |
Bagua Thu, Feb 25, 2010 9:19:50pm |
re: #514 freetoken
I think I've mentioned before that I don't really buy that idea.
Our contemporary American lifestyle... yes, that is at risk, high risk, of disappearing in a never ending series of wealth destrorying effects. However, Western Civilization, per se, is not built upon the luxuries of modernity, no matter how much the Ad Agencies like to sell Americans the idea that having the latest, and more and more, is the foundation of life.
There is a big difference between "lifestyles" and "civilization."
The Bangladeshis, the Thais, the small island nations... all of these are at total risk.
We, however, are not.
And that is the problem.
I think I see your mistake Freetoken, what you are talking about is based upon the actual science, and the realistic, though worst case scenarios.
You need to go with the hysteria and paranoia, see where it takes you. Make up entirely farcical doomsday scenarios in which Billions of as yet unborn people perish in some imaginary event - which appears nowhere in the science literature - but can be found in science fiction and the fevered ramblings of an AGW psychotic.
You will convince a lot more people that way.
| 571 |
Obdicut Thu, Feb 25, 2010 9:19:53pm |
re: #559 ludwigvanquixote
Morally we are saying that the sweatshop crap we buy and the car we drive is more important than the lives lost.
Lives are lost in everything. Lives are lost at far too high a rate making sweatshop crap, but lives are lost providing us with Olympic entertainment, as well. That's kind of insane as well.
Most moves that people make are forced moves in design space. An ordinary person with an ordinary job, ordinary willpower and ordinary intelligence, is not going to be able to take the facts of global warming and come up with a good plan of action. They'll be like my 'green' friends who think stainless steel is good to use because it's reusable.
To me, your insistence that people recognize the moral evil of their actions is the thing that's holding it back. Isn't it enough if people change without admitting that they engaged with evil?
And, fiancee home, goodnight. Stay well.
| 572 |
Dark_Falcon Thu, Feb 25, 2010 9:20:06pm |
OK, this thread looks on course for a trainwreck, and I just can't deal with one of those tonight. I'm out for the night. TTYT
| 574 |
Velvet Elvis Thu, Feb 25, 2010 9:20:42pm |
re: #481 ludwigvanquixote
NO, you are missing the whole America and Western civilization collapses part. That matters too.
The fact that people don't seem to value that only is an argument that they have it coming when they piss it all away.
Dude, it's not that you're wrong, it's that you say it with a handkerchief clasped to your heaving bosom.
| 575 |
Mad Prophet Ludwig Thu, Feb 25, 2010 9:21:27pm |
re: #558 Gus 802
Corollary to those emissions came cures for a variety of tropical diseases. The discovery and production of simple antibiotics. Drugs such as Mectizan which can prevent River Blindness. The perfection of agricultural methods that can now feed the world. While those emissions should be controlled they also provided humankind with a bounty never seen before in the history of mankind which includes the extension of life expectancies for those in poor countries.
Gus, since when have I taken a Luddite stance? You have to be kidding me. I am saying that given all you said is true, we also built a system not based on feeding everyone or being good to them. The oil industry has killed many more than it ever saved and we have technological alternatives.
| 576 |
Cato the Elder Thu, Feb 25, 2010 9:24:01pm |
re: #567 ludwigvanquixote
Cato, why are you being like that? To what end?
You are a clear and sharp thinker.
You understand the notion of cause and effect.
What we are doing is a cause. It has a certain effect.
I am using my computer to ring the clue phone for people that yes, their actions matter and yes, thier actions are helping to kill people. So are yours and so are mine. I try to minimize mine and more importantly, as I keep saying, if we switch from fossil fuels, we can still run our computers and drive around and not kill people to do it.
So why are you not arguing for that with me?
If anyone deserves a comparison to the unabomber it is you. I am nowhere near the misanthrope you are.
Telling people that living the life they live, which was handed to them by their parents and their society, makes them evil like child-rapers - that's gonna work. They'll gather round you, hoist you on their shoulders, and hail you as a savior for opening their blind, evil eyes.
Yep. And my dog is about to have kittens, even though he's male and neutered.
| 577 |
Mad Prophet Ludwig Thu, Feb 25, 2010 9:24:29pm |
re: #574 Conservative Moonbat
Dude, it's not that you're wrong, it's that you say it with a handkerchief clasped to your heaving bosom.
So again I re ask my main point.
I think that the effects of unchecked AGW are worse than those of pedophilia based on the simple idea that killing is bad.
If I were calling every name in the book at a pedophile, or being very concerned for the victims, I would not be accused of handkerchiefs clasped to my heaving bosom.
Yet with this, which is worse, I am.
Please explain that to me?
| 578 |
solomonpanting Thu, Feb 25, 2010 9:24:58pm |
The oil industry has killed many more than it ever saved and we have technological alternatives.
Now I'm outta here.
| 579 |
Bagua Thu, Feb 25, 2010 9:25:35pm |
re: #367 goddamnedfrank
Follow up:
I'm glad they're not going to kill the whale, but I'm not at all sure that continuing to treat gigantic thinking marine predators like show animals is a wise move.
Well said.
| 580 |
goddamnedfrank Thu, Feb 25, 2010 9:25:41pm |
Ludwig,
Consider that quite possibly the real reason that Troy fell is not that Cassandra didn't prophecy the truth, nor because Apollo cursed her, but because she sucked at marketing her ideas.
Just an idea.
| 581 |
Mad Prophet Ludwig Thu, Feb 25, 2010 9:26:27pm |
re: #576 Cato the Elder
Telling people that living the life they live, which was handed to them by their parents and their society, makes them evil like child-rapers - that's gonna work. They'll gather round you, hoist you on their shoulders, and hail you as a savior for opening their blind, evil eyes.
Yep. And my dog is about to have kittens, even though he's male and neutered.
And yet, it remains the truth that they are doing evil just the same. Only it is to brown babies now and their own in the future.
I am not a moral relativist Cato and neither are you.
People did indeed stop slavery in this nation when they were forced to open their eyes to the evils that their parents and society handed them.
It is the same.
| 582 |
Cato the Elder Thu, Feb 25, 2010 9:27:47pm |
With all due respect, I think someone needs a timeout.
It did me good, once.
| 583 |
Gus Thu, Feb 25, 2010 9:28:34pm |
re: #575 ludwigvanquixote
Gus, since when have I taken a Luddite stance? You have to be kidding me. I am saying that given all you said is true, we also built a system not based on feeding everyone or being good to them. The oil industry has killed many more than it ever saved and we have technological alternatives.
How does one measure or quantify "the oil industry has killed more than it ever saved?" Oil evolved into becoming a refined fuel, gasoline, which was used to power vehicles and other forms of transportation. Have you considered it's use in emergency vehicles for fire and rescue? How many millions of lives it saved over the year by transporting critically injured or diseased patients directly to trauma or hospital care within those first critical moments of shock and/or trauma? What about all of the lives it saved in providing aid to the Tsunami victims. The shipping of food and medical supplies around the world. The warmth (survival) it provides for people in the winter months. I would venture to guess that even though oil has caused a great deal of environmental and health damage over the years that overall it has saved more lives in the long run.
| 584 |
Bagua Thu, Feb 25, 2010 9:29:19pm |
re: #580 goddamnedfrank
Ludwig,
Consider that quite possibly the real reason that Troy fell is not that Cassandra didn't prophecy the truth, nor because Apollo cursed her, but because she sucked at marketing her ideas.
Just an idea.
People don't like to be lied to, period. All the exaggerations about 'reefer madness' did tremendous damage to the message about the real risks of drugs like cocaine and heroin.
| 585 |
cliffster Thu, Feb 25, 2010 9:29:34pm |
re: #581 ludwigvanquixote
And yet, it remains the truth that they are doing evil just the same. Only it is to brown babies now and their own in the future.
Yeah. People hating on brown babies. What's up with that?
| 586 |
Mad Prophet Ludwig Thu, Feb 25, 2010 9:29:54pm |
re: #580 goddamnedfrank
Ludwig,
Consider that quite possibly the real reason that Troy fell is not that Cassandra didn't prophecy the truth, nor because Apollo cursed her, but because she sucked at marketing her ideas.
Just an idea.
I am not currently trying to market my ideas Frank.
I have put all the dta out there for everyone to see. They can read it or deny it.
Right now I am talking about morality.
Right now I am talking about the stupid blind and rapacious evil that consumes our culture and thought to such an extent, coupled with the moral blindness and moral weakness that forces us to deny to ourselves the consequences of our own actions.
I know the science is correct.
I research it every damn day. That is my job.
In my public persona I am the model of a civil, well thought out scientific speaker, because that is how the politics is played.
But right here right now, I am speaking from my heart.
If we do not change because we are too damned lazy to care about all those we hurt, we will deserve the fate we bring on ourselves.
| 587 |
freetoken Thu, Feb 25, 2010 9:31:14pm |
For the record, I expect for the rest of my life (may it be long!) that there will be arguments not only over AGW but also over global resources.
Each milestone in human population (7 billion, 8 billion...) will bring with it a reflection on our global challenges.
At best, I hope that we will collectively find ways to avoid the worse possible paths, and try to maximize the most useful adaptation strategies.
Group actions are of course difficult human goals. Example: we still can't get the Law of the Sea Treaty through the Senate, even though everyone from oil companies to the US Navy has been lobbying for it. The anti-UN sentiment by a handful of Senators (e.g., Inhofe) is resolute, and it is harming us as a Nation. Yet it will remain till those people simply die off.
Regarding AGW, I am hoping that as a nation we will recognize that AGW mitigation efforts are concordant with our need to lessen our dependence upon oil imports, the destruction of habitat (and health) by coal mining, and the economic requirement to produce more with less costs.
There is a very, very large reservoir of low quality carbon fuels (carbon laced shales, brown coal/peat, tar, etc.) available to mankind, if we choose to exploit them. Doing so would truly return our atmosphere to at least the Cretaceous era, and maybe even to the hottest times of the Permian. I'm hoping we can avoid that, while at the same time recognizing that we will have to make do with some changes.
As a nation we have many issues, and finding political solutions to big problems these days is proving to be nearly impossible. Thus I think we have to fight a culture war, where we aim to convince our fellow Americans not yo turn their backs on knowledge and science, but rather to accept the truths (as we best know them.)
| 588 |
Girth Thu, Feb 25, 2010 9:32:59pm |
re: #587 freetoken
Just wait until fresh water becomes a major geopolitical issue. Then the real fun begins.
| 589 |
Mad Prophet Ludwig Thu, Feb 25, 2010 9:33:00pm |
re: #584 Bagua
People don't like to be lied to, period. All the exaggerations about 'reefer madness' did tremendous damage to the message about the real risks of drugs like cocaine and heroin.
Bagua, you are correct. People do not like to be lied to. That is why when you lie, and call the science an exaggeration, you do not help.
Remember when you wee arguing that IPCC's estimates were the actual science and that all I was saying about it not taking methane or non-linear melt rates into account was "hysterical hyperbole" and every other bit of dismissive phrase you could cook up.
You do know that the one and only important paper that seemed to back IPCC as not lowball, was just retracted and your buddy Walter was the one who brought the link?
The only one who habitually lies about AGW here is you. You are the worst liar about the topic on this whole thread.
Everyone knows it.
| 590 |
Mad Prophet Ludwig Thu, Feb 25, 2010 9:34:07pm |
re: #585 cliffster
Yeah. People hating on brown babies. What's up with that?
A good question. I personally hate racism, but it does seem the trend that if white babies are dying en masse, America is more quick to spring into action than if brown ones are.
| 591 |
Mad Prophet Ludwig Thu, Feb 25, 2010 9:34:34pm |
re: #588 Girth
Just wait until fresh water becomes a major geopolitical issue. Then the real fun begins.
It will, and that is a major part of the point.
| 592 |
Mad Prophet Ludwig Thu, Feb 25, 2010 9:37:04pm |
re: #582 Cato the Elder
With all due respect, I think someone needs a timeout.
It did me good, once.
Cato, are you serious?
I never thought you would get that cranky over losing a debate point. People can and do occasionally do things for the right and moral reasons. People really did at one point, in large numbers understand that slavery was evil.
| 593 |
Cato the Elder Thu, Feb 25, 2010 9:39:07pm |
re: #592 ludwigvanquixote
Cato, are you serious?
I never thought you would get that cranky over losing a debate point. People can and do occasionally do things for the right and moral reasons. People really did at one point, in large numbers understand that slavery was evil.
There has been no debate here. There has only been a rant, a particularly repulsive one, by you.
On a music thread, for Pete's sake.
You could at least have saved the crazee for when someone was dissing your creed.
| 594 |
cliffster Thu, Feb 25, 2010 9:39:41pm |
re: #590 ludwigvanquixote
A good question. I personally hate racism, but it does seem the trend that if white babies are dying en masse, America is more quick to spring into action than if brown ones are.
I don't see why you say you hate racism. You seem perfect willing to throw the word, "brown people" out there at completely inappropriate times. How willing are you to see how racist you yourself are?
| 595 |
Velvet Elvis Thu, Feb 25, 2010 9:40:20pm |
re: #559 ludwigvanquixote
No I here you.
I do I really do hear you. I also very much respect you and like you.
However, you are missing what I am saving.
The meme is exactly the truth of the science.
Our emissions are changing the earth in a way that will kill people by the billions the effects have already started and lives have already been lost.
That is reality.
What people hate is having their sins pointed out to them.
What I hate, on a moral level is that rather than seeing the consequences of our actions, we have to sugar coat and sell this to people in ways that make them think that they are acting in their own benefit.
In as much as they are saving their nation and their kids they are.
But from a moral view, the fact that people are already dying from this should be sufficient.
Morally we are saying that the sweatshop crap we buy and the car we drive is more important than the lives lost.
That is evil. The fact that peole do not care to stop being evil is frankly just another way of saying that they deserve the mass death they have coming to them. I would be ok with saying that if it didn't also mean losing the good folks along with everyone else.
The object here is not to force people to admit a moral failing. I could put up a pretty good Kantian argument for various climate preservation messages. It wouldn't mean bupkiss though because the argument here is not to convince people of their own moral failings. Attacking people on their morals is like attacking their mothers. It makes things way more personal than it needs to be.
State the simple facts
.1 fact
2. fact
3. fact
.: The human race will go extinct unless we do something
You don't need to explain to people why they need to preserve the human race. They have a pretty good idea of that on their own.
Drop the moral language and you're depersonalize the debate and things will go a lot better.
| 596 |
Bagua Thu, Feb 25, 2010 9:41:21pm |
re: #589 ludwigvanquixote
OK, Ludwig, cite me the paper which says "billions of children will die."
As far as the IPCC, yes, I previously held it up as the most accurate summation of the "consensus" on AGW and defended it as such. Recent revelations have proven my confidence to be in error. I now believe the IPCC AR4 should be withdrawn, and major changes made in the IPCC pending the AR5. Alternatively, they should close down the entire charade and stop politicising science.
So yes, I was wrong as I was unaware of the errors, Grey literature and sloppy procedures.
What we have seen is all of the most alarming short term predictions are false. We have more time than the IPCC AR4 was indicating.
The fact is, what remains is less alarming, not more. That is clear to all but you.
If you ever reach the point where you are willing to discuss the actual science with me, and not resort to vile insults, then I will be happy to do so with you Ludwig.
| 597 |
Girth Thu, Feb 25, 2010 9:42:04pm |
re: #593 Cato the Elder
You could at least have saved the crazee for when someone was dissing your creed.
Creed? I'll diss Creed. Nickelback too. They both suck ass.
| 598 |
Bagua Thu, Feb 25, 2010 9:43:35pm |
| 599 |
Mad Prophet Ludwig Thu, Feb 25, 2010 9:44:36pm |
re: #593 Cato the Elder
There has been no debate here. There has only been a rant, a particularly repulsive one, by you.
On a music thread, for Pete's sake.
You could at least have saved the crazee for when someone was dissing your creed.
My creed Cato? Why are you going there? On the AGW thread today it was established that America's food supply gets destroyed by AGW and that Americans - that means you buddy starve.
It is not a creed. It is a fact that what comes down the pike will collapse America.
Get it?
I am so very sorry you do not wish to hear it.
But, yes indeed what is happening is actually, in reality, repulsive. What repulses me is that you are not interested in caring.
If we do not stop AGW, something that our society contributes to more than any other, And don't bring up China and India, since we finance their industry to feed our consumerism, what happens will be worse than any of the world wars.
This is truth. Simple cold scientific fact.
It is also avoidable, but people refuse to act because they are too lazy, greedy, ignorant or stupid to do so.
It kills people, but no one is properly outraged even when the blood on their hands is pointed to them directly. Well too bad. I am sorry that repulses you. What is happening is vastly more repulsive.
| 600 |
Mad Prophet Ludwig Thu, Feb 25, 2010 9:46:53pm |
re: #595 Conservative Moonbat
The object here is not to force people to admit a moral failing. I could put up a pretty good Kantian argument for various climate preservation messages. It wouldn't mean bupkiss though because the argument here is not to convince people of their own moral failings. Attacking people on their morals is like attacking their mothers. It makes things way more personal than it needs to be.
State the simple facts
.1 fact
2. fact
3. fact
.: The human race will go extinct unless we do somethingYou don't need to explain to people why they need to preserve the human race. They have a pretty good idea of that on their own.
Drop the moral language and you're depersonalize the debate and things will go a lot better.
No. Morality is a great thing to talk about when it is someone else's failings being discussed.
We should have the maturity to look dispassionately at our own failings and then try to improve.
Also, you have been reading me for more than long enough to know that I always bring a dozen papers and journals with me. I do state the facts.
I always state the facts.
| 601 |
goddamnedfrank Thu, Feb 25, 2010 9:48:16pm |
re: #586 ludwigvanquixote
I am not currently trying to market my ideas Frank.
Are you trying to torpedo your own side? Because perception is reality and that's the course you're heading down.
I have put all the dta out there for everyone to see. They can read it or deny it.
Right now I am talking about morality.
Great, subjective and boring, but great. I'll take a snoozer and wait for you to get around to discussing pragmatics.
Right now I am talking about the stupid blind and rapacious evil that consumes our culture and thought to such an extent, coupled with the moral blindness and moral weakness that forces us to deny to ourselves the consequences of our own actions.
And you're selling it with all the finesse of a spastic colon.
I know the science is correct.
I research it every damn day. That is my job.
I know the psychology of human perception and consult for advertising agencies, sometimes less really is more.
In my public persona I am the model of a civil, well thought out scientific speaker, because that is how the politics is played.
But right here right now, I am speaking from my heart.
If we do not change because we are too damned lazy to care about all those we hurt, we will deserve the fate we bring on ourselves.
Yeah, but if that day comes will you be able to say you honestly did do all you could to change opinions, or that you vented your spleen whenever you felt like it?
It's not a trick question.
| 602 |
watching you tiny alien kittens are Thu, Feb 25, 2010 9:48:59pm |
re: #547 ludwigvanquixote
Except that the food crisis and the flooding is real and the people dying are brown and you are not talking abut them or feeling sorry for them at all. The emissions patterns of the West are what killed them too.
The emotional part you don't like is realizing that yes you actually do have blood on your hands.
Evil has no messenger.
Gahh...millions of people die every week, we all die, no one gets out of here alive.
Evil? Where does evil come into this?
People die, more people get born, we go on, that has been the story since we first evolved. Even if civilization fell (which it cannot do completely because of books/data storage) that would still be true, some will survive and continue.
This is not the apocalypse, this is not the end of mankind, this is not even the end of civilization. At worst it will spell massive upheavals and unrest, massive shifts in population and tens of millions of deaths, but it is not the end.
Apparently you don't seem to believe that anyone else gets that, many of us do and feel equally frustrated that some don't see the problem at all. However if you are going to have any effect in talking to those who do not believe you need to seem both knowledgeable and honest. I don't quite see where rants, profanity, and belittling others for their misinformed views fits into that.
You need to check your tone, because when I first came here a scant four months ago you talked about as a source for AGW info and held in some esteem. Now? well, not so much...
Your too driven, fine I could admire that if you were doing good with your obsession, but instead, well, your destroying the reputation you had. Argue, don't defame...
| 604 |
Slumbering Behemoth Stinks Thu, Feb 25, 2010 9:52:23pm |
re: #546 Dark_Falcon
I'm not a model of spending restraint. All I've done is stuff I should have done long ago. Cut taxi rides and eating out, mostly. And it has helped.
At one average paying job I had, I would eat breakfast and lunch off roach coach every day. When I eventually got smart enough to figure out how much I was spending each month on this alone, I started brown bagging it.
I went from having no money at the end of every month, to regularly having one or two uncashed paychecks at any given time because I still had plenty of money.
| 606 |
cliffster Thu, Feb 25, 2010 9:54:25pm |
re: #604 Slumbering Behemoth
At one average paying job I had, I would eat breakfast and lunch off roach coach every day. When I eventually got smart enough to figure out how much I was spending each month on this alone, I started brown bagging it.
I went from having no money at the end of every month, to regularly having one or two uncashed paychecks at any given time because I still had plenty of money.
Eating out will suck you dry, no doubt
| 607 |
Mad Prophet Ludwig Thu, Feb 25, 2010 9:55:28pm |
re: #596 Bagua
Ahh what a slimy way to discredit the science yet again.
IPCC was not all bad, it was not all grey literature and it was not faulty in its science. What it was was incomplete.
It did not take methane or non-linear ice melts into account.
That made it lowball.
Everything else it said was basically correct - in the science portion. The executive summary portion was of course the product of politcal wrangling over the language.
But you knew about all of this.
I pointed it out to you with a dozen papers to back me at the time.
Charles posted at least five threads on these points.
But still you had to twist it to make the science sound less complete than it is.
As I said you are the most dishonest poster on this topic on the entire blog.
Now as to the billions dying, well what is the result of a 1.5 to 2 meter sea level rise (that is what you get when you include the melts and the methane) coupled with a massive reduction in food and fresh water supply?
And on the thread downstairs were the papers about changing food production and loss of crops. America alone is looking at from temperature rise alone, and not taking rainfall loss into account a 60% drop in food production based on mid range projections.
Throw the rainfall loss in as well and it could easily get as high as 90% less food production in this nation by 2100.
What about disease vectors changing as bugs and vermin migrate?
I have posted many papers on that as well.
So what do billions of people world wide, without adequate food, fresh water or shelter, subject to disease migrations add up to?
Billions of deaths.
| 609 |
Cato the Elder Thu, Feb 25, 2010 9:58:32pm |
| 610 |
Mad Prophet Ludwig Thu, Feb 25, 2010 9:59:09pm |
re: #602 ausador
NO it is the apocalypse. It is the end of civilization as we know it.
Again what happens when over the entire world, there is not enough food or clean water for for everyone, there are hundreds of millions of refugees whose cities were lost and diseases spread like wild fire?
No we will not likely go extinct unless that all triggers a nuclear war as well.
However, it will be a new dark ages for mankind.
Why do you not see it? You are not comprehending the scope or the magnitude of the destruction involved.
Billions of deaths, hell millions die every week sounds exactly to my ears like ahh what are a few pedophiles... there are car accidents each week...
| 612 |
cliffster Thu, Feb 25, 2010 10:00:12pm |
re: #609 Cato the Elder
Dammit.
Ausador, that was meant for Ludwig, not you.
I think there was some dramatic effect lost in that bipost.
| 613 |
freetoken Thu, Feb 25, 2010 10:01:28pm |
Al Gore won this election!
Apple Shareholders Re-Elect All Board Members
Shareholders re-elected Apple Inc.'s (AAPL) board of directors on Thursday, insuring continuity as the company prepares for one of its biggest products releases in years.
Former Vice President Al Gore, Genentech Inc. (DNA) Chairman Arthur Levinson and Avon Products Inc. (AVP) Chairwoman and Chief Executive Andrea Jung were among the members of the seven-person board that was returned to its post. Apple Chief Executive Steve Jobs, who said the company had a "truly great" board, also was re-elected.
| 614 |
Mad Prophet Ludwig Thu, Feb 25, 2010 10:01:33pm |
re: #609 Cato the Elder
Believe me I get the irony. The sad thing is that it might well take Rousseau's enlightened despot to get us out of this mess.
| 615 |
Slumbering Behemoth Stinks Thu, Feb 25, 2010 10:02:08pm |
re: #606 cliffster
Eating out will suck you dry, no doubt
Callback to last night's oral innuendo discussion? Or just an accurate description of how wasteful dining out is?
All of the above?
| 616 |
Cato the Elder Thu, Feb 25, 2010 10:02:48pm |
re: #614 ludwigvanquixote
Believe me I get the irony. The sad thing is that it might well take Rousseau's enlightened despot to get us out of this mess.
Rousseau's enlightened despot, in practice, always turns into Robespierre.
| 618 |
cliffster Thu, Feb 25, 2010 10:03:53pm |
re: #615 Slumbering Behemoth
Callback to last night's oral innuendo discussion? Or just an accurate description of how wasteful dining out is?
All of the above?
All that and a box of ho-ho's
| 620 |
cliffster Thu, Feb 25, 2010 10:05:35pm |
When all else fails, talk about brown babies.
| 621 |
Mad Prophet Ludwig Thu, Feb 25, 2010 10:06:00pm |
re: #602 ausador
A source of info held in esteem...
Ahh yes so much esteem I was held in...
First off the science is in the data.
I know people hate looking at it, but that is beginning and end of my authority on the subject.
Did you notice that the deniers or people who shout hysteria never have any data to bring?
As to how I am viewed personally, I am not here to be popular.
I am here to bring the facts.
One of the facts that I am personally fed up with is that people are too self absorbed, fat, lazy and arrogant to change their ways and avoid catastrophe, even when they know that they are causing it and that it is already hurting others.
The fact is that people like Cato are likely correct. We will likely not act in time. And I hate each and every last one of you who did not try to act for murdering our future.
| 622 |
Cato the Elder Thu, Feb 25, 2010 10:08:20pm |
re: #621 ludwigvanquixote
You do a great Old Testament prophet. And I like you for that, believe me.
Unfortunately things have not changed from those days to these.
Assyria and Babylon will conquer, and we will go to exile or death, before we change our ways.
| 623 |
Mad Prophet Ludwig Thu, Feb 25, 2010 10:08:28pm |
re: #617 Bagua
Excuse me... You seemed to have missed the factual matters of that post. Let me repost them so you can't ignore them again. I will take out all reference to you or your style of "debate."
IPCC was not all bad, it was not all grey literature and it was not faulty in its science. What it was was incomplete.
It did not take methane or non-linear ice melts into account.
That made it lowball.
Everything else it said was basically correct - in the science portion. The executive summary portion was of course the product of politcal wrangling over the language.
I pointed it out with a dozen papers to back me at the time.
Charles posted at least five threads on these points.
Now as to the billions dying, well what is the result of a 1.5 to 2 meter sea level rise (that is what you get when you include the melts and the methane) coupled with a massive reduction in food and fresh water supply?
And on the thread downstairs were the papers about changing food production and loss of crops. America alone is looking at from temperature rise alone, and not taking rainfall loss into account a 60% drop in food production based on mid range projections.
Throw the rainfall loss in as well and it could easily get as high as 90% less food production in this nation by 2100.
What about disease vectors changing as bugs and vermin migrate?
I have posted many papers on that as well.
So what do billions of people world wide, without adequate food, fresh water or shelter, subject to disease migrations add up to?
Billions of deaths.
Those are the facts.
| 624 |
Slumbering Behemoth Stinks Thu, Feb 25, 2010 10:09:40pm |
re: #618 cliffster
I've been dirt broke so often, and a single guy for most of my life. I've learned to cook for myself, 'cuz I like to eat food that tastes better than the cat-ass garbage known as tv dinners.
At this point, I've gotten so good that I can make meals that taste better than most good restaurants. That ain't braggin', that's a fact.
| 626 |
Velvet Elvis Thu, Feb 25, 2010 10:11:31pm |
re: #577 ludwigvanquixote
So again I re ask my main point.
I think that the effects of unchecked AGW are worse than those of pedophilia based on the simple idea that killing is bad.
If I were calling every name in the book at a pedophile, or being very concerned for the victims, I would not be accused of handkerchiefs clasped to my heaving bosom.
Yet with this, which is worse, I am.
Please explain that to me?
OK, which is worse, unchecked global warming or nuclear devastation? Is every person who isn't working for complete and total nuclear disarmament worse than a pedophile?
Oh, hey, as long as I'm on your side on AGW can I date your 14 year old daughter?
| 627 |
Mad Prophet Ludwig Thu, Feb 25, 2010 10:11:44pm |
re: #617 Bagua
There were no exaggerations. Yes yes I know you like to call me not a scientist, so once again, here are all the facts, verifiable scientific facts that were in the post that you ignored.
IPCC was not all bad, it was not all grey literature and it was not faulty in its science. What it was was incomplete.
It did not take methane or non-linear ice melts into account.
That made it lowball.
Everything else it said was basically correct - in the science portion. The executive summary portion was of course the product of politcal wrangling over the language.
I pointed it out with a dozen papers to back me at the time.
Charles posted at least five threads on these points.
Now as to the billions dying, well what is the result of a 1.5 to 2 meter sea level rise (that is what you get when you include the melts and the methane) coupled with a massive reduction in food and fresh water supply?
And on the thread downstairs were the papers about changing food production and loss of crops. America alone is looking at from temperature rise alone, and not taking rainfall loss into account a 60% drop in food production based on mid range projections.
Throw the rainfall loss in as well and it could easily get as high as 90% less food production in this nation by 2100.
What about disease vectors changing as bugs and vermin migrate?
I have posted many papers on that as well.
So what do billions of people world wide, without adequate food, fresh water or shelter, subject to disease migrations add up to?
Billions of deaths.
Those are the facts.
| 628 |
cliffster Thu, Feb 25, 2010 10:13:34pm |
re: #624 Slumbering Behemoth
Brag away, man. I got to be pretty good myself, especially with the crock pot, before I got married and became inept at everything inside these four walls. Cook for yourself, you save money - eating out is expensive. You eat healthier - you know exactly what's in the food. You save time - you don't have to drive there, wait, get seated, etc.
| 629 |
Cato the Elder Thu, Feb 25, 2010 10:14:46pm |
| 630 |
Bagua Thu, Feb 25, 2010 10:17:17pm |
re: #623 ludwigvanquixote
re: #623 ludwigvanquixote
None of those papers say "Billions of Children Will Die". Those are all worst case scenarios which, if they happen at all, will be challenges facing unborn generations in the centuries to come. The ideal that millions of people will simply sit still and drown as the seas slowly rise is absurd, their childrens' children will move inland. Etc. etc.
Things that may happen in the future to unborn people are possibilities, not destiny. You must learn the difference if you want to be taken seriously.
All those worst case scenarios are challenges, not destiny, most of the worst affected, such as those in Bangladesh and parts of Africa are at great risk of starvation and death from famine, war and natural disasters even without a lick of warming. Their populations are already unsustainable and they keep increasing.
Again, insult me all you want, but fact are facts. My views and opinions rely on science, yours twist science into something unrecognizable.
| 631 |
Mad Prophet Ludwig Thu, Feb 25, 2010 10:17:32pm |
re: #626 Conservative Moonbat
OK, which is worse, unchecked global warming or nuclear devastation? Is every person who isn't working for complete and total nuclear disarmament worse than a pedophile?
Oh, hey, as long as I'm on your side on AGW can I date your 14 year old daughter?
Ohh man that was uncalled for.
So since we are taking that tone, please let me remind you of some basic morality.
1. If you pay another to do something harmful, you are contributing to the harm. Most people get the idea that buying stolen goods means encouraging crime. Do I really need to explain that concept or can we say that we get that?
2. If you see the commission of a crime but do not do everything in your power to help, you are contributing to the crime. Now everything in your power is to be taken reasonable. An old lady is not expected to tackle a man with a gun. She is expected to call the police if she can however.
Again, do we get this? Can we say this is a basic moral pricniple.
3. Going along with the way things are in regards to AGW without trying to change the way things are is a combination of violating case one and case two.
4. The effects of unchecked AGW are calamitous. If you are not trying to fix the problem and are contributing to it, then you are clearly part of the problem and you are clearly partially to blame for the calamity that follows.
This is cause and effect.
| 632 |
Bagua Thu, Feb 25, 2010 10:18:16pm |
| 633 |
Eclectic Infidel Thu, Feb 25, 2010 10:19:11pm |
re: #215 Varek Raith
Cue scaaarrryyy music!
/
Yes...the Evil Atheist Conspiracy is alive and well.
And it's more proof that Obama hates America.
/////
| 634 |
Walter L. Newton Thu, Feb 25, 2010 10:20:11pm |
re: #631 ludwigvanquixote
Is it wrong to commit a crime in order to save a righteous man's life?
| 635 |
cliffster Thu, Feb 25, 2010 10:20:49pm |
| 636 |
Velvet Elvis Thu, Feb 25, 2010 10:22:00pm |
re: #600 ludwigvanquixote
No. Morality is a great thing to talk about when it is someone else's failings being discussed.
We should have the maturity to look dispassionately at our own failings and then try to improve.
Also, you have been reading me for more than long enough to know that I always bring a dozen papers and journals with me. I do state the facts.
I always state the facts.
Well, I don't believe that climate change deniers suffer from any great moral failing. I think they spend their lives trying to do what's right and what's good as best they know how. They are just a little confused on the facts.
I was reading about a study just the other day talking about how people tend to discard information that's contrary to their worldview and declare it false and embrace information that supports their worldviews and accept it as true. What you need to do is understand the worldviews of the deniers. Know the other side of the issue well enough that you could debate it and win. You've got to approach people on their own terms if your goal is to do something as momentous as convincing them to change their worldview. Being confrontational is one of the worst ways of going about it.
I may not know the science as well as some people but I've been to my share of activist training sessions and I'm telling you that how you're going about this is 100% wrong.
| 638 |
Mad Prophet Ludwig Thu, Feb 25, 2010 10:26:18pm |
re: #630 Bagua
None of those papers say "Billions of Children Will Die".
Nonsense. Add up all the consequences and of course that is what they say.
Those are all worst case scenarios which, if they happen at all, will be challenges facing unborn generations in the centuries to come.
2100 is in 90 years not centuries. It will get really bad before then though. Deaths are starting to happen now from it.
The ideal that millions of people will simply sit still and drown as the seas slowly rise is absurd, their childrens' children will move inland.
Where they will be homeless, disease ridden and without sufficient food or clean water.
Things that may happen in the future to unborn people are possibilities, not destiny.
Really, the whole point of science is making predictions. We are really good at predicting eclipses for example. We get it right when we say the atomic pile will behave in thus and such a way or when we build a computer and it works. THis is exactly what the science says is coming and it is what will happen if we do not change things. This is a fact.
You must learn the difference if you want to be taken seriously.
No, nonsense, Bagua, you are a denier and you always have been. All of those papers I bring you ever read. All of the data, you never process, and you never miss a chance to distort the facts or lie about them.
Again, insult me all you want, but fact are facts.
That is true. You should try using them for once.
My views and opinions rely on science,
That is deluded.
Science is based on facts, data and evidence. While you repeat again and again that what I say is hysterical or wrong, you never bring a single true bit of data to back yourself up with. I bring paper after paper. My story is consistent. Yours is hogwash.
You routinely lie about the science and twist it to say something it does not. What the science says is that catastrophic events are coming.
| 646 |
windsagio Thu, Feb 25, 2010 10:33:53pm |
Walter when did you quit even pretending you weren't trolling LVQ? Enquiring minds wanna know.
| 647 |
Velvet Elvis Thu, Feb 25, 2010 10:33:57pm |
re: #610 ludwigvanquixote
NO it is the apocalypse. It is the end of civilization as we know it.
Again what happens when over the entire world, there is not enough food or clean water for for everyone, there are hundreds of millions of refugees whose cities were lost and diseases spread like wild fire?
No we will not likely go extinct unless that all triggers a nuclear war as well.
However, it will be a new dark ages for mankind.
Why do you not see it? You are not comprehending the scope or the magnitude of the destruction involved.
Billions of deaths, hell millions die every week sounds exactly to my ears like ahh what are a few pedophiles... there are car accidents each week...
There used to be a guy who posted at DailyKos, I think he went by the nick of RealityBias. Circumcision was his thing, male circumcision. He was very strongly opposed to it. He posted diary after diary about it. He engaged in worse and worse hyperbole on the subject until all responses were nothing but mocking and explicit photos of bananas being cut. He finally got himself banned, I forget how.
The thing is, I think the objection to male circumcision is a legitimate issue for activists so inclined to concern themselves with. They can't on Daily Kos. Because of this one guy's over the top behavior the topic is still a joke, years later. Nobody can talk about it.
That's what you're doing here with your representations of the eventual outcome of unchecked climate change. You're being so over the top that you're making a joke out of it. Despite the fact that I agree with you I'm more inclined to call you out on your manner of argumentation than I am to back you up because you make all people who are concerned about this issue and want to educate people about the fact that climate change will lead to human extinction look like buffoons.
Please just stick to the facts.
| 648 |
watching you tiny alien kittens are Thu, Feb 25, 2010 10:34:14pm |
re: #637 Walter L. Newton
Some would even suggest that Ludwig is working for the AGW deniers.
Does kinda seem like it recently, god forbid that your having a rational discussion about AGW and possibly getting somewhere with the doubters. Apparently that is heresy, we have to bludgeon them into acceptance with threats of doom, cursing them, and telling them that they are idiots.
I've yet to win anyone over by using that technique but LVQ insists that it is the only way to make converts, who am I to argue?
///
| 650 |
Silvergirl Thu, Feb 25, 2010 10:35:52pm |
re: #572 Dark_Falcon
OK, this thread looks on course for a trainwreck, and I just can't deal with one of those tonight. I'm out for the night. TTYT
I just got here. I know you're out, but who's here who isn't armed and dangerous? Help!
| 651 |
Mad Prophet Ludwig Thu, Feb 25, 2010 10:37:18pm |
re: #636 Conservative Moonbat
Well, I don't believe that climate change deniers suffer from any great moral failing. I think they spend their lives trying to do what's right and what's good as best they know how. They are just a little confused on the facts.
I was reading about a study just the other day talking about how people tend to discard information that's contrary to their worldview and declare it false and embrace information that supports their worldviews and accept it as true. What you need to do is understand the worldviews of the deniers. Know the other side of the issue well enough that you could debate it and win. You've got to approach people on their own terms if your goal is to do something as momentous as convincing them to change their worldview. Being confrontational is one of the worst ways of going about it.
I may not know the science as well as some people but I've been to my share of activist training sessions and I'm telling you that how you're going about this is 100% wrong.
Fine so you be good cop. That is your prerogative. I personally no longer care to coddle the stupid or the evil.
Do you really think anything you say will get through to someone like Bagua? Every paper in the world and every thread in the world can be thrown at him.
And yes I do get the world view of the deniers.
Some of them are simply repeating what they have been told by people they trust. If the GOP or Rush says it they believe it. Some are taken in by a religious world view that already hates science because of evolution. The two dove tail.
Some here actually get it, but the fact that their party, the GOP is the main political force behind stopping action causes them to have a conflict of loyalty.
Some are regular posters here, who have pathetic lives in the real wold. Without a satisfying job or lifestyle, they think that their words here make them experts and special snowflakes on the net. They think that this is their chance to be important by fighting against the science. Some really just hate my guts because of other stands I have taken. Things got really nasty for me here with a whole cadre when I refused to back down from saying that torture was evil and wrong.
All of it is petty, stupid and wrong.
None of it is science.
Someone has to point out that yes indeed this is stupid and it is evil. There are consequences to actions and it sucks if they are a part of it, but they really are.
| 653 |
goddamnedfrank Thu, Feb 25, 2010 10:37:58pm |
A new model, capable of assessing the rate at which the oceans are acidifying, suggests that changes in the carbonate chemistry of the deep ocean may exceed anything seen in the past 65 million years.The model also predicts much higher rates of environmental change at the ocean’s surface in the future than have occurred in the past, potentially exceeding the rate at which plankton can adapt.
That's bad, right? I mean, that seems unambiguously like a bad thing to me.
| 654 |
Mad Prophet Ludwig Thu, Feb 25, 2010 10:38:46pm |
re: #642 Bagua
Which dodges all the rebuttals to your misstatements of facts.
It is a predictive model that as soon as you are challenged on actual science, of which you never bring any, that you resort to insulting me Bagua.
Again, you fool no one.
| 655 |
Mad Prophet Ludwig Thu, Feb 25, 2010 10:39:21pm |
re: #652 Walter L. Newton
And please, I'm not so special. There has been a whole gaggle of people on this thread that are tired of Ludwigs screaming and nasty language and stomping and whining. I am not alone.
Yes the wingnut section mostly.
| 656 |
Velvet Elvis Thu, Feb 25, 2010 10:39:45pm |
Here's a DailyKos diary that does a better job of making the case than he does:
[Link: www.dailykos.com...]
Yes, I know you'll poo-poo the source but it's well written and cites its sources.
re: #630 Bagua
re: #623 ludwigvanquixote
None of those papers say "Billions of Children Will Die". Those are all worst case scenarios which, if they happen at all, will be challenges facing unborn generations in the centuries to come. The ideal that millions of people will simply sit still and drown as the seas slowly rise is absurd, their childrens' children will move inland. Etc. etc.
Things that may happen in the future to unborn people are possibilities, not destiny. You must learn the difference if you want to be taken seriously.
All those worst case scenarios are challenges, not destiny, most of the worst affected, such as those in Bangladesh and parts of Africa are at great risk of starvation and death from famine, war and natural disasters even without a lick of warming. Their populations are already unsustainable and they keep increasing.
Again, insult me all you want, but fact are facts. My views and opinions rely on science, yours twist science into something unrecognizable.
| 657 |
Cato the Elder Thu, Feb 25, 2010 10:41:31pm |
re: #655 ludwigvanquixote
Yes the wingnut section mostly.
I am not a wingnut.
I just think you have left the realm of science and embarked on the path of the doomcrying prophet.
And you and I both know what honor a prophet has.
| 658 |
Mad Prophet Ludwig Thu, Feb 25, 2010 10:41:57pm |
re: #647 Conservative Moonbat
Circumcision doesn't get people killed or collapse civilization.
Also there are plenty of legitimate medical arguments for it.
There is absolutely no parallel.
| 659 |
windsagio Thu, Feb 25, 2010 10:42:01pm |
re: #652 Walter L. Newton
so you try to make it worse? Please.
There are 2 differences between you and ludwig are:
1) He's right about agw.
2) You weasel and nitpick whereas he actually gets honestly angry.
It kind of works in your favor I guess, because when he freaks out, or pulls it into another thread he's the one that looks bad.
Still, its an awful tactic.
| 660 |
Mad Prophet Ludwig Thu, Feb 25, 2010 10:43:04pm |
re: #656 Conservative Moonbat
First of all good link.
Second of all,
DO you really think there is any information there that I have not posted here dozens of times?
| 661 |
watching you tiny alien kittens are Thu, Feb 25, 2010 10:43:44pm |
re: #650 Silvergirl
I just got here. I know you're out, but who's here who isn't armed and dangerous? Help!
Some of us are more amused (or is it bemused?) than serious. Honestly this isn't as bad as it looks, although now that Walter has reappeared?....
| 662 |
Mad Prophet Ludwig Thu, Feb 25, 2010 10:46:51pm |
re: #657 Cato the Elder
I am not a wingnut.
I just think you have left the realm of science and embarked on the path of the doomcrying prophet.
And you and I both know what honor a prophet has.
But what if the science is pointing to doom legitimately?
If I as a physicist were to explain the way that hydrogen weapons work, went through all of the physics of the nuclear reactions and the way that nuclear fusion works, went into the catastrophic effects of a nuclear detonation - and then said as a scientist, that given all of that, an all out nuclear exchange would be a doom of mid numbing proportions, would I b talking actual science and basic truth or would I be crossing the line away from science?
This is not different Cato.
| 664 |
Silvergirl Thu, Feb 25, 2010 10:53:08pm |
re: #661 ausador
Some of us are more amused (or is it bemused?) than serious. Honestly this isn't as bad as it looks, although now that Walter has reappeared?...
Truly? *dives for cover at the sound of another deafening explosion*
| 665 |
Velvet Elvis Thu, Feb 25, 2010 10:55:05pm |
re: #651 ludwigvanquixote
Fine so you be good cop. That is your prerogative. I personally no longer care to coddle the stupid or the evil.
Do you really think anything you say will get through to someone like Bagua? Every paper in the world and every thread in the world can be thrown at him.
Him? I don't know. Someone like him? Yeah, sooner or later. Law of averages. He's not stupid but he'd be stupid to listen to you the way you've been treating him.
I got a lot of conservative pro-life southern Democrats to vote for Obama. Plenty of independents and probably some Republicans too. How you say it matters a lot more than what you say.
| 666 |
Mad Prophet Ludwig Thu, Feb 25, 2010 10:55:19pm |
re: #663 Bagua
Again all lies and distortions from you without a single bit of data or science to back up your smears.
Consider the paper I re-linked today.
[Link: www.agcarbonmarkets.com...]
Abstract:
The United States produces 41% of the world’s corn and 38% of the world’s soybeans. These crops comprise two of the four largest
sources of caloric energy produced and are thus critical for world
food supply. We pair a panel of county-level yields for these two
crops, plus cotton (a warmer-weather crop), with a new fine-scale
weather dataset that incorporates the whole distribution of temperatures
within each day and across all days in the growing
season. We find that yields increase with temperature up to 29° C
for corn, 30° C for soybeans, and 32° C for cotton but that temperatures
above these thresholds are very harmful. The slope of
the decline above the optimum is significantly steeper than the
incline below it. The same nonlinear and asymmetric relationship
is found when we isolate either time-series or cross-sectional
variations in temperatures and yields. This suggests limited historical adaptation of seed varieties or management practices to
warmer temperatures because the cross-section includes farmers’
adaptations to warmer climates and the time-series does not.
Holding current growing regions fixed, area-weighted average
yields are predicted to decrease by 30–46% before the end of the
century under the slowest (B1) warming scenario and decrease by
63–82% under the most rapid warming scenario (A1FI) under the
Hadley III model.
So under the slowest models we are looking at 30-46% reduction in crops just from temperature - and that does not include the associated lack of rainfall.
The full blown worst case scenario - i.e. we pass a tipping point with the methane bogs in Siberia and Canada (which is possible and in any case we are currently marching towards) we are looking at up to 90% reduction in our food supply - in America.
So again, for those who are economically minded, what happens to the economy when things like bread eggs and milk cost much more than ten times what they do now and we have mass starvation and food riots in America?
Now that is just in America and it does not take many other factors into account that have been previously mentioned, how many would die from this alone? What happens when you add that to flooded cites, lack of fresh water and spread of contagion?
| 669 |
Velvet Elvis Thu, Feb 25, 2010 10:56:52pm |
re: #658 ludwigvanquixote
Circumcision doesn't get people killed or collapse civilization.
Also there are plenty of legitimate medical arguments for it.
There is absolutely no parallel.
You way missed the point. They guy could have been any kind of activist. The point is he spoiled the issue for that particular audience.
| 670 |
SanFranciscoZionist Thu, Feb 25, 2010 10:59:16pm |
re: #650 Silvergirl
I just got here. I know you're out, but who's here who isn't armed and dangerous? Help!
I'm sitting in a foxhole with some atheists, drinking Chardonnay. But I may be out in a minute--I'm tired, and it's late.
| 671 |
Silvergirl Thu, Feb 25, 2010 10:59:48pm |
re: #668 LudwigVanQuixote
Nah, when corned Bagua will call you a Kapo.
Trust me, he is the scumbag who made this personal.
I hate his guts very honestly and openly.
I imagine you mean cornered.
You have to be forgiven that typo because I'm astonished at your incredible typing speed.
| 673 |
Silvergirl Thu, Feb 25, 2010 11:01:04pm |
re: #670 SanFranciscoZionist
I'm sitting in a foxhole with some atheists, drinking Chardonnay. But I may be out in a minute--I'm tired, and it's late.
Love the imagery of the foxhole gathering.
The overnight thread opened.
| 674 |
Cato the Elder Thu, Feb 25, 2010 11:01:06pm |
re: #662 ludwigvanquixote
But what if the science is pointing to doom legitimately?
If I as a physicist were to explain the way that hydrogen weapons work, went through all of the physics of the nuclear reactions and the way that nuclear fusion works, went into the catastrophic effects of a nuclear detonation - and then said as a scientist, that given all of that, an all out nuclear exchange would be a doom of mid numbing proportions, would I b talking actual science and basic truth or would I be crossing the line away from science?
This is not different Cato.
I spent the first part of my life living in fear of the imminent nuclear holocaust. Which, although most people have forgotten about it, could still happen. Tomorrow. Or tonight.
I was made, along with my classmates, to huddle under my desk during "civil defense" exercises. There were bomb shelters everywhere. Not just the ones built by private citizens, but everywhere. Remember those black-and-yellow signs with the nuclear symbol on them, telling you where the shelters were? In the basements of schools, government buildings, public libraries? They wouldn't have done any good, but people were afraid - and the government had to look as though it was doing something.
In the Eighties I was an anti-nuclear activist. In Germany. I got myself arrested blockading the sites where the Pershing II missiles were due to be stationed. I went to court and gave impassioned speeches and was found guilty, which was the plan.
And when it was all over, I had to admit, in all intellectual honesty, that my bête noire, Ronald Wilson Reagan, the Insane Anglo Warlord, did more to avert the looming disaster than all the millions of peace marchers in the world.
What I learned was you can't beat sense into people with a stick. And that, in the words of Nietzsche, if you stare too hard into the abyss, you find the abyss staring back at you. At which point you have two choices: back away and live, or jump in and die. Nietzsche ended up choosing the latter. So much for Superman.
If, to live the rest of my life in reasonable sanity, I have to adopt the mask of an ancient Roman nobleman, feasting and laughing whilst the barbarians encircle the City, then so be it.
I will never be a screaming prophet of doom again. I will do what I can to mitigate suffering that I have direct control over.
And the world can live or die. It is not in my hands.
| 676 |
Velvet Elvis Thu, Feb 25, 2010 11:02:44pm |
re: #668 LudwigVanQuixote
Nah, when corned Bagua will call you a Kapo.
Trust me, he is the scumbag who made this personal.
I hate his guts very honestly and openly.
Skip the openly part and/or make it distinct from any agw discussions. It muddies the waters for everyone.
| 677 |
Bagua Thu, Feb 25, 2010 11:03:18pm |
re: #674 Cato the Elder
Marvelous. Favourited. Thank you for sharing that.
| 678 |
Silvergirl Thu, Feb 25, 2010 11:03:51pm |
| 679 |
Mad Prophet Ludwig Thu, Feb 25, 2010 11:05:42pm |
re: #669 Conservative Moonbat
You way missed the point. They guy could have been any kind of activist. The point is he spoiled the issue for that particular audience.
OK. I see your point. Again, you be good cop. I got tired of that ages ago.
For those who care to learn the science, I am always available and I have typed books of science explanations for anyone who asks even remotely nicely.
I am not habitually rude.
I am however way past caring about the feelings of idiots. And I know in some portion of my mind that you are right in just about everything that you say.
After a year of abuse, I no longer care.
After reading yet another paper on how bad, bad really is, I don't care about their feelings. I really just don't. I am angry and I am fed up with the bullshit.
I would prefer a little truth and the truth is an ugly one. In short I am saying I am tired and worn out from dealing with these jerks. I have been for a bit.
I do however enjoy giving them my spleen. They earned it.
| 681 |
goddamnedfrank Thu, Feb 25, 2010 11:07:29pm |
re: #663 Bagua
Those are possibilities, challenges, risks. With preparation and population control, almost anything is possible. And yes, it is possible that millions could die in some of the worst case scenarios assuming nothing is done, such as migration, population control, etc. etc.. Again, possible risks, not certain destiny. Millions may die from war, famine and over-population without even a bit of warming.
Okay, I'm going to say again that I think it's about more than just warming and that oceans in danger of becoming to acidic for plankton to adapt seems like an incredibly bad thing.
Now, I don't know how many would die under that scenario, but I'm guessing the number isn't trivial.
| 682 |
Mad Prophet Ludwig Thu, Feb 25, 2010 11:07:51pm |
re: #674 Cato the Elder
Well said but also not the point. The science really is pointing to a doom this time and unlike nuclear war, we are actively marching towards it every day in a real and measurable sense and not in a potential political sense.
Sometimes there really is a wolf when people cry wolf Cato.
This is such a case.
| 684 |
windsagio Thu, Feb 25, 2010 11:12:03pm |
re: #674 Cato the Elder
The problem is this, is 'what do you do once you let the bastards get to you?'
That's the problem here. Meaning no offense to ludwig, But thats what I've seen happening here. The base dishonesty and snarkiness of the concern-trolls has severely eroded his ability to function properly on this blog. Part of the natural response is stating his case in the strongest terms possible, instead of being subtle and low-key about it.
I mean he's right, and I don't blame him, but its just tricky to let go like that.
| 686 |
Mad Prophet Ludwig Thu, Feb 25, 2010 11:12:30pm |
re: #675 Bagua
Again lies and slanders of me. As I said earlier, whenever I challenge Bagua to bring facts and data, he will try to insult me.
Bagua, it is against policy here to post your real name. You know that.
Also, I have no desire to open my private life up to the wingnuts who would write me if I did post that. But you know that too.
So I am sorry Bagua, you will just have to deal with that fact that all those pdfs I post, which I have read of course, with all that data, that I keep pointing to in a consistent manner is the mark of well knowing the science - or for that matter all the explanations I have written about all manner of physics things from string theory to QM might indicate I know my stuff.
In the mean time, you still have nothing but lies and slanders.
And you are still scum.
| 687 |
Mad Prophet Ludwig Thu, Feb 25, 2010 11:13:04pm |
re: #685 ausador
Dude, that is just so uncalled for.
| 689 |
Bagua Thu, Feb 25, 2010 11:13:40pm |
re: #680 Conservative Moonbat
Those fields do tend to attract people with asperger's and high functioning autism, not that there's anything wrong with that. Half my family is on the autism spectrum.
Yes, I know of several examples myself. You are correct.
| 690 |
Mad Prophet Ludwig Thu, Feb 25, 2010 11:14:20pm |
re: #681 goddamnedfrank
Okay, I'm going to say again that I think it's about more than just warming and that oceans in danger of becoming to acidic for plankton to adapt seems like an incredibly bad thing.
Now, I don't know how many would die under that scenario, but I'm guessing the number isn't trivial.
Ohh Bagua has denied ocean anoxia for sometime.
Trust me it is something I have brought up here many times.
| 693 |
Mad Prophet Ludwig Thu, Feb 25, 2010 11:21:52pm |
re: #676 Conservative Moonbat
Skip the openly part and/or make it distinct from any agw discussions. It muddies the waters for everyone.
Ohh that's his thing.
He has four main moves.
Bagua dishonest move 1:
State a completely unsubstantiated claim about the science, like billions won't die, or there is no evidence of sea level rises etc...
Bagua dishonest move 2:
When challenged that his wild and false statement has no data or evidence to back himself up with, insult me and claim he is scientifically literate enough to know what science is. Again, never does he actually talk science, which involves things like math and data.
Bagua dishonest move 3:
Claim he will not debate me because he is reasonable and therefore ignore the actual facts and data brought. Notice he still has not acknowledged the food loss or ocean anoxia links or that the consequences of those things are indeed lethal.
Bagua dishonest move 4:
When really pressed to talk actual science, which he never does, he claims claims I am not a scientist or insults even more harshly. Then he claims he is not a denier and is perfectly reasonable.
All in all he is a liar with a predictable and pathetic pattern.
| 696 |
Cato the Elder Thu, Feb 25, 2010 11:23:34pm |
re: #682 LudwigVanQuixote
Well said but also not the point. The science really is pointing to a doom this time and unlike nuclear war, we are actively marching towards it every day in a real and measurable sense and not in a potential political sense.
Sometimes there really is a wolf when people cry wolf Cato.
This is such a case.
Emphasis on the word "we".
While you are telling people that they're worse than child-rapers, some people with skills and knowledge are working on solutions. There was that bit on "60 Minutes" the other day about the guy with a new type of fuel cell. Now being tested at Google, eBay, and other large corporations.
Yes, we are greedy, blind mammals with an attention span of minutes. Yes, in general we can't see past the end of our own noses. Yes, every time I eat something I destroy it so I can live. Yes, given the choice between comfort and prosperity now and the life of future generations, the future people will lose. Every time.
Welcome to the human race.
I have not given up hope, however. That dude with the fuel cells might have the big breakthrough. I'll invest, if I ever get enough money to invest in anything but groceries again. I'll buy a cleaner car next time, if I ever get to buy another car.
What I will not do is tell people what pigs they are, because so am I. It fails to impress, and hurts the cause.
If you will, it's like Mandy with her "piss on Allah" avatar. I don't know why it's there, but it fails to do anything but vent her spleen. It wins over no one. It alienates.
If merely living in the present makes people worse than pedophiles, then you are surrounded by an evil race - to which you belong - and you can go mad. The race will still be evil, but you'll be in a padded cell and nothing will have been accomplished.
Or you can accept it as it is and do what can be done.
And by the way, we were marching toward nuclear war in a real and measurable sense during the Cold War. We are still doing so today (viz. Iran). AGW, I often think, is not the biggest of our problems. We may yet spare future generations from global heat death by our actions tomorrow.
And now I'm going to go take a warm bath and contemplate my straight razor.
| 697 |
Mad Prophet Ludwig Thu, Feb 25, 2010 11:25:07pm |
re: #695 Bagua
Again lies and distortions from a denier.
Those things are happening. Would you care to see a paper on CO2 concentrations in the oceans?
Not that you would read it, but the science is there, and I have linked it here before.
| 698 |
Mad Prophet Ludwig Thu, Feb 25, 2010 11:27:02pm |
re: #696 Cato the Elder
So are you doing what can be done or are you more likely to write that it doesn't matter because nothing will be done or can be done?
I am sorry Cato, I genuinely like you, but this is the single most hypocritical post I have ever seen from you.
I am very disappointed in you.
| 699 |
Cato the Elder Thu, Feb 25, 2010 11:27:55pm |
re: #698 LudwigVanQuixote
So are you doing what can be done or are you more likely to write that it doesn't matter because nothing will be done or can be done?
I am sorry Cato, I genuinely like you, but this is the single most hypocritical post I have ever seen from you.
I am very disappointed in you.
And I in you.
| 700 |
Mad Prophet Ludwig Thu, Feb 25, 2010 11:29:13pm |
re: #699 Cato the Elder
And I in you.
Fair enough, but we both know the hypocrisy of that post however eloquent you were.
| 701 |
Velvet Elvis Thu, Feb 25, 2010 11:33:45pm |
re: #683 LudwigVanQuixote
Are you saying that I am autistic? Is there a reason you are being so abusive of me man?
It was intended as a possible defense.
| 702 |
windsagio Thu, Feb 25, 2010 11:36:47pm |
re: #701 Conservative Moonbat
'lol' at accusing others of developmental disabilities.
| 703 |
Mad Prophet Ludwig Thu, Feb 25, 2010 11:38:07pm |
re: #701 Conservative Moonbat
It was intended as a possible defense.
OK now I will politely tell you to go fuck yourself.
| 704 |
Cato the Elder Thu, Feb 25, 2010 11:38:23pm |
re: #700 LudwigVanQuixote
Fair enough, but we both know the hypocrisy of that post however eloquent you were.
You know what you know. I know something different.
And to answer your question: "So are you doing what can be done or are you more likely to write that it doesn't matter because nothing will be done or can be done?"
I waver between the two depending upon whether the hour is odd or even. And that's the truth.
| 705 |
Mad Prophet Ludwig Thu, Feb 25, 2010 11:39:38pm |
re: #704 Cato the Elder
You know what you know. I know something different.
And to answer your question: "So are you doing what can be done or are you more likely to write that it doesn't matter because nothing will be done or can be done?"
I waver between the two depending upon whether the hour is odd or even. And that's the truth.
And that is what many do. However, it is certainly not good enough.
| 706 |
Velvet Elvis Thu, Feb 25, 2010 11:40:36pm |
re: #702 windsagio
'lol' at accusing others of developmental disabilities.
They run in my family and there's a good chance I've got a touch of one myself.
| 707 |
Cato the Elder Thu, Feb 25, 2010 11:40:53pm |
re: #705 LudwigVanQuixote
And that is what many do. However, it is certainly not good enough.
I never claimed to be good enough.
Are you?
| 708 |
Mad Prophet Ludwig Thu, Feb 25, 2010 11:42:18pm |
re: #707 Cato the Elder
I never claimed to be good enough.
Are you?
No not at all.
But I am trying my heart out. Are you?
| 709 |
windsagio Thu, Feb 25, 2010 11:42:57pm |
re: #706 Conservative Moonbat
Me too, which is why I react badly to it :P
That being the case you should be able to read LVQ's post and know that's bullcrap.
Also you were, like it or not using it as an insult, which makes it worse.
| 710 |
windsagio Thu, Feb 25, 2010 11:44:33pm |
re: #709 windsagio
err 'read his posts and know your description is bullcrap'.
| 711 |
Mad Prophet Ludwig Thu, Feb 25, 2010 11:45:13pm |
re: #710 windsagio
err 'read his posts and know your description is bullcrap'.
By the way, thank you.
I should have thanked you earlier.
| 712 |
windsagio Thu, Feb 25, 2010 11:46:40pm |
re: #711 LudwigVanQuixote
haha, I'm the same way. I see what they're doing and the fact that so many people fall for it makes me crazy.
PS: I'd try to ask you to not let the bastards get to you, but its probably too late :P
| 713 |
Cato the Elder Thu, Feb 25, 2010 11:48:03pm |
re: #708 LudwigVanQuixote
No not at all.
But I am trying my heart out. Are you?
Certainly not in the way you're going about it.
| 714 |
Mad Prophet Ludwig Thu, Feb 25, 2010 11:56:13pm |
re: #712 windsagio
haha, I'm the same way. I see what they're doing and the fact that so many people fall for it makes me crazy.
PS: I'd try to ask you to not let the bastards get to you, but its probably too late :P
I have my ups and downs with it. I would point out that in this entire thread, I have been rather cool.
The only one whom I truly detest is Bagua.
but I think I dealt with him exceptionally well tonight. By the time he is accusing me of not being a scientist, that means he has seen way too many scientific facts to ignore.
People see that.
ON the deeper point though. I fully get that people hate to have the bad consequences of their actions pointed out to them and and hate the fact that yes, they really are responsible.
However, it will stick in their craws because they know on some level it is true.
It is like the blood gold discussion I had here the other day. IN fact it is exactly the same moral principle. If your actions contribute to the problem, then there is no escaping that they are part of the problem.
We really are the one's funding the expansion of China and India, their AGW contribution is quite literally made possible by the West. There is no escaping that fact.
We in the US, really are still the largest emitter of CO2. Again, there is no escape of that.
This is all driven by our consumerism even though there are viable alternatives that we lack the will to employ.
Again... part of the solution or part of the problem.
People hate to be in the wrong. People hate to be accused of the evils they bring. I get that. I do not want to hurt the average person's feelings, but all but the most deluded will see the obvious truth of what I am saying. And maybe, just maybe, people will feel enough shame to tip them over to changing their ways.
I have often thought that if we called things as they are more, and denied people the ability to rename and rationalize away from things they would behave differently.
How many people would watch what they ate and exercise for instance if the perfectly accurate words of fat and obese were used - not maliciously, but simply as the facts they are, so people could not deny their own conditions?
The difference with AGW of course, is that this is not just something that one chooses to do to themselves. It hurts others.
| 715 |
Cato the Elder Fri, Feb 26, 2010 12:16:22am |
Well the earth died screaming
While I lay dreaming
Well the earth died screaming
While I lay dreaming
Well the earth died screaming
While I lay dreaming
...dreaming of you.
--Tom Waits
[Link: www.youtube.com...]
| 716 |
windsagio Fri, Feb 26, 2010 12:33:02am |
re: #715 Cato the Elder
lol you just can't let go can ya :P
| 717 |
BARACK THE VOTE Fri, Feb 26, 2010 3:33:31am |
I know Ludwig, I know who he is, I know where he teaches, I know his academic pedigree and I've seen several of his papers.
I do not expect this to stop the various people here who would like to claim he 'isn't a real scientist', but yes, he is, and yes, he does know more than you.
| 718 |
BARACK THE VOTE Fri, Feb 26, 2010 3:39:41am |
By 'papers' here I am referring to peer reviewed research published in excellent academic journals, btw.
Demands that LVQ post his CV for you aren't going to get you anywhere. Especially as some people can't even be bothered to read the many, many science links he posts-- or if they do, they are incapable of understanding them.
| 719 |
ryannon Fri, Feb 26, 2010 4:25:29am |
re: #616 Cato the Elder
Rousseau's enlightened despot, in practice, always turns into Robespierre.
When you're alone and life is making you lonely
You can always go - Danton!
When you've got worries, all the noise and the hurry
Seems to help, I know - Danton!
Just listen to the music of the traffic in the city
Linger on the sidewalk where the neon signs are pretty
How can you lose?
The lights are much brighter there
You can forget all your troubles, forget all your cares
So go Danton! things'll be great when you're
Danton! - no finer place, for sure
Danton! - everything's waiting for you
Don't hang around and let your problems surround you
There are movie shows - Danton!
Maybe you know some little places to go to
Where they never close - Danton!
Just listen to the rhythm of a gentle bossa nova
You'll be dancing with him too before the night is over
Happy again, Danton!
| 720 |
ryannon Fri, Feb 26, 2010 4:39:49am |
re: #629 Cato the Elder
re: #623 ludwigvanquixoteBillions of deaths.
Those are the facts.
re: #627 ludwigvanquixote
Billions of deaths.
Those are the facts.
OVER MY DEAD BODY!
Uh, wait a minute....
| 721 |
sarabande Fri, Feb 26, 2010 5:13:59am |
Always a joy to see and hear Mike Campbell on the lead. He's one of those musicians who lifts any performance into something memorable.
| 723 |
Super-ego Fri, Feb 26, 2010 7:16:32am |
Tom Petty brings good music.
OT: Some folks on here need re-training. "Disagreement and debate are welcome, but insults and abuse are not, and may cause your account to be blocked."
Seems to be lots of childish comments on here. Just sayin'.
| 724 |
The Sanity Inspector Fri, Feb 26, 2010 8:07:42am |
re: #616 Cato the Elder
Rousseau's enlightened despot, in practice, always turns into Robespierre.
Not always. Sometimes we luck out and get a Frederick the Great. But yeah, Robespierre is the way to bet, in that scenario.
This article has been archived.
Comments are closed.
Comments are closed.
Create a PageThis is the LGF Pages posting bookmarklet. To use it, drag this button to your browser's bookmark bar, and title it 'LGF Pages' (or whatever you like). Then browse to a site you want to post, select some text on the page to use for a quote, click the bookmarklet, and the Pages posting window will appear with the title, text, and any embedded video or audio files already filled in, ready to go.
Or... you can just click this button to open the Pages posting window right away.
Last updated: 2023-04-04 11:11 am PDT LGF User's Guide RSS Feeds
Or... you can just click this button to open the Pages posting window right away.
Last updated: 2023-04-04 11:11 am PDT LGF User's Guide RSS Feeds
- Featured PagesClick to refresh
The Good Liars at The Libertarian Convention [VIDEO] The Good Liars visit the Libertarian Convention in Washington DC. They interview presidential candidates, talk to someone who thinks people should be allowed to own nuclear weapons, and Starchild. SUPPORT US: http://Herohero.co/thegoodliars SEE THE GOOD LIARS LIVE!NASHVILLE, TN JUNE ...
teleskiguy
Yesterday
Views: 194 • Comments: 0 • Rating: 0
Adam Conover - How Google RUINED the Internet [VIDEO] Google sucks now. Here's why. Get 20% off DeleteMe US consumer plans when you go to http://joindeleteme.com/Adam and use promo code ADAM at checkout. DeleteMe International Plans: https://international.joindeleteme.com/ You may have noticed that Google isn't what it used to ... teleskiguy
2 days ago
Views: 117 • Comments: 1 • Rating: 0
What Result Will There Be From the Trump Trial?I did my best to boil this down. What say you?
Rightwingconspirator
Yesterday
Views: 319 • Comments: 0 • Rating: 2
An Appeal to Heaven An ancient political phrase and a historic flag of the United States has entered the discourse as a flag of Christian Nationalism, insurrection, and the question of Supreme Court Associate Justice Samuel Alito's objectivity to rule on cases. So ...
Anymouse 🌹🏡😷
1 weeks ago
Views: 1,378 • Comments: 2 • Rating: 7
Grocers Are Finally Lowering Prices as Consumers Pull Back Consumers have been grumbling about the soaring cost of groceries for nearly two years. Now, some of the biggest names in retail appear to be listening. In recent weeks, Target and Aldi have broadcast price cuts on thousands of ...
Cheechako
2 weeks ago
Views: 326 • Comments: 0 • Rating: 2
A Water War Is Brewing Between the U.S. And Mexico. Here’s Why A water dispute between the United States and Mexico that goes back decades is turning increasingly urgent in Texas communities that rely on the Rio Grande. Their leaders are now demanding the Mexican government either share water or face ... Cheechako
2 weeks ago
Views: 392 • Comments: 0 • Rating: 4
Harper’s Magazine: Slippery Slope - How Private Equity Shapes a Ski Town …Big Sky stands apart for other reasons. The obvious distinction is the Yellowstone Club, a private resort hidden in the mountains above the community that Justin Farrell, a professor of sociology at Yale and the author of Billionaire Wilderness, ... teleskiguy
3 weeks ago
Views: 603 • Comments: 1 • Rating: 6
Hawaii’s Mauna Loa Observatory Just Captured Ominous Signals About the Planet’s Health Hawaii’s Mauna Loa Observatory just captured an ominous sign about the pace of global warming. Atmospheric levels of planet-warming carbon dioxide aren’t just on their way to yet another record high this year - they’re rising faster than ever, ... Cheechako
3 weeks ago
Views: 1,300 • Comments: 0 • Rating: 3
The Good Liars at the Schnecksville Trump Rally [VIDEO] New theories, great tunes and SHOCKING breaking news. SUPPORT US: http://Herohero.co/thegoodliars SEE THE GOOD LIARS LIVE!WASHINGTON D.C. MAY 23RD: https://www.unionstage.com/shows/good-liars-fix-america/NASHVILLE, TN JUNE 6TH: https://www.etix.com/ticket/p/42992972/the-good-liars-nashville-the-lab-at-zaniesSAN FRANCISCO, CA JUNE 25TH: https://www.livenation.com/event/G5vYZbavGvggG/the-good-liars SUBSCRIBE TO OUR AUDIO PODCAST:Apple Podcasts: https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/the-good-liars-tell-the-truth/id1731178442Spotify: https://open.spotify.com/show/7mgfiwzr32907N4y68eFOCJoin this channel ... teleskiguy
4 weeks ago
Views: 1,146 • Comments: 1 • Rating: 0
Trump’s “Stolen Election” Lie Based on Evidence From Pervy Bathroom Cam-Spy OK, this really takes the cake. If you have relatives that still cling to the “election was stolen, dadgum, I jes’ KNOW IT … This should be a slight remedy to the stubborn madness Thanks to online anonymity, the ...
Khal Wimpo (free internal organs upon request!)
4 weeks ago
Views: 611 • Comments: 0 • Rating: 3
- Recent PagesClick to refresh
Ranked-Choice Voting Has Challenged the Status Quo. Its Popularity Will Be Tested in November. JUNEAU — Alaska’s new election system — with open primaries and ranked voting — has been a model for those in other states who are frustrated by political polarization and a sense that voters lack real choice at the ... Cheechako
6 days ago
Views: 180 • Comments: 0 • Rating: 0
