Watch Live as Deluded Liberals Join Hands With Far Right Loons

And yes, there are Obama=Hitler signs
Weird • Views: 24,930

[Live video concluded.]

Today, liberals whipped into a fear frenzy by Glenn Greenwald will march with groups dedicated to the utter destruction of liberal causes, at the #StopWatchingUs rally. Featuring some of the farthest right groups in America, all dressed up as sheep.

Crowd size estimated at 2,000 so far, so it looks like the privileged libertarian contingent hasn’t managed to fool very many people into joining this insane “coalition.”

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359 comments
1 Tim TeaBro  Sat, Oct 26, 2013 10:24:58am

TeaBros

2 Jay in Oregon  Sat, Oct 26, 2013 10:29:03am

The next time anyone on the left complains about why the far right is seen as having legitimacy in this country, remind them of this.

And this:
en.wikipedia.org

3 b.d.  Sat, Oct 26, 2013 10:30:02am

Man, they got puppets. Puppets trump everything.

I noticed that DailyKos is listed as a sponsor but they haven’t muttered one word about it in any of their front paged posts.

I can’t believe that the video with Ellsberg and clips of Walter Mondale didn’t get the youth out in droves!

//

4 b.d.  Sat, Oct 26, 2013 10:30:25am

re: #1 Tim TeaBro

TeaBros

DudeBaggers?

5 b.d.  Sat, Oct 26, 2013 10:33:56am

A drone puppet.

So, this is just a catch all demonstration for anyone who hates the administration. Can’t wait for the Code Pink folks to make themselves known.

6 b.d.  Sat, Oct 26, 2013 10:35:43am
Dude, where’s my privacy!!!

Hahahahahaha, you can’t make this stuff up.

7 Justanotherhuman  Sat, Oct 26, 2013 10:38:33am

I’ve seen better organized HS car washes…

8 Charles Johnson  Sat, Oct 26, 2013 10:39:30am

Speaker at the rally now demanding that the NSA be shut down.

9 ProTARDISLiberal  Sat, Oct 26, 2013 10:40:13am

Notice the Green sign:

Ban all weaponized and surveillance drones

These are a bunch of ill-informed dudebros.

10 Ming  Sat, Oct 26, 2013 10:42:50am

There are so many crazy people on both the left and the right. This is a big reason why I particularly appreciate President Obama: it seems like he’s one of the very few adults in the room. If you read The Audacity of Hope (which, notwithstanding what Fox News says, is a book about politics, not a personal memoir) it’s quite a voice of centrism and moderation.

I wonder what will happen when Obama leaves office, and isn’t there to hold things together for the rest of us. As we saw in 2008, when Sarah Palin got 46% of the vote, things can go horribly wrong.

Notwithstanding today’s comical Stop Watching Us rally, I remain more concerned about loonies on the right, compared with the left, simply because the right-wing crazies are in positions of real power, as we saw recently when they shut down the government.

11 Targetpractice  Sat, Oct 26, 2013 10:43:35am

re: #8 Charles Johnson

Speaker at the rally now demanding that the NSA be shut down.

And replaced with what? Oh right, nothing, because they seem to think that if we stop spying on the rest of the world, they’ll stop spying on us.

Morans.

12 Charles Johnson  Sat, Oct 26, 2013 10:44:26am
13 b.d.  Sat, Oct 26, 2013 10:44:29am

I’m looking forward to the speakers detailing how they have changed their daily behavior because of all of this intrusive privacy.

14 Political Atheist  Sat, Oct 26, 2013 10:44:59am

With opposition like this I think our great grand kids will be debating the ongoing provisions of the “temporary” Patriot Act. Rational opposition can’t get traction in this atmosphere.

May as well consider it permanent.

15 b.d.  Sat, Oct 26, 2013 10:45:36am

re: #12 Charles Johnson

[Embedded content]

Those kids are just neutral flag holding!

16 jhrhv  Sat, Oct 26, 2013 10:48:02am

If you spent your spare time for the last couple of weeks prepping drone puppets and what not for this event you really need to get a hobby.

17 Charles Johnson  Sat, Oct 26, 2013 10:48:46am
18 b.d.  Sat, Oct 26, 2013 10:49:32am

Lie by Gov. Johnson about a turned off phone can be used for a microphone and locator.

Oh well, it’s scary, that’s all that matters.

First they came for the Dudebros……

19 wrenchwench  Sat, Oct 26, 2013 10:49:36am

The Oathkeepers would love it if people would stop watching them. Thanks goodness for the SPLC and LGF.

20 jaunte  Sat, Oct 26, 2013 10:49:54am
21 jaunte  Sat, Oct 26, 2013 10:50:31am

re: #18 b.d.

Gov. Johnson is still trying to be found.

22 Killgore Trout  Sat, Oct 26, 2013 10:50:36am

re: #14 Political Atheist

With opposition like this I think our great grand kids will be debating the ongoing provisions of the “temporary” Patriot Act. Rational opposition can’t get traction in this atmosphere.

May as well consider it permanent.

Agreed. Which is the reason I think the libertarian connection here is unsurprising. “libertarianism” has bee a dumping ground for crackpots and bad ideas since the 40’s. They might as well be ranting about the military-industrial complex.

23 Killgore Trout  Sat, Oct 26, 2013 10:50:59am

Bongos and rap! they must be serious!

24 Justanotherhuman  Sat, Oct 26, 2013 10:51:40am

Your cell phone—turned off!—can be used to listen in on you!

(As a result of Edward Snowden’s revelations, doncha know.)

Was that Gary Johnson who GG endorsed?

Dude-bromance all over the place.

A poetry throw down…

25 Killgore Trout  Sat, Oct 26, 2013 10:52:07am

re: #20 jaunte

[Embedded content]

Meh, the hilter poster is from the Larouche nuts. They’ll do the same thing for the next president too.

26 Charles Johnson  Sat, Oct 26, 2013 10:52:28am
27 jaunte  Sat, Oct 26, 2013 10:52:46am

re: #25 Killgore Trout

“Hitlery!”

28 ProTARDISLiberal  Sat, Oct 26, 2013 10:52:55am

re: #18 b.d.

Wait a second, that was part of the plot for The Dark Knight.

Why is he having an issue differentiating real-life from movies.

29 b.d.  Sat, Oct 26, 2013 10:53:05am

Your cat is ratting you out to the NSA, don’t let them fool you people!

//

30 Targetpractice  Sat, Oct 26, 2013 10:53:41am

re: #29 b.d.

Your cat is ratting you out to the NSA, don’t let them fool you people!

//

Always knew the smallest one looked a little too shifty.

31 wrenchwench  Sat, Oct 26, 2013 10:53:58am

Gary Johnson, Super Dudebro.

He voted for Chuck Baldwin for president in 2008. Got the Constitution Party on the ballot in NM.

The Constitution Party is a fascist organization, IMHO.

32 jhrhv  Sat, Oct 26, 2013 10:57:02am

How many anti government rallies were there in Hitlers and the SS Berlin? Oh wait.

///

33 jaunte  Sat, Oct 26, 2013 10:58:44am
34 Political Atheist  Sat, Oct 26, 2013 10:59:55am

re: #22 Killgore Trout

What amazes me is how little effort there is to seize the agenda back from the extremists. The Tea Party/Libertarians, the far left unilateral disarmament faction (as shown by the shut down the NSA crowd) the people who think a forestry drone with a heat camera at a wildfire is some threat to privacy… Birthers, truthers, dudebros.

We see this with the budget, the economy, the NSA, the ACA, the Patriot Act. Nothing is getting done. We know the Patriot Act should have been sunsetted as promised. The middle meekly let the extremists & critics take away the terms conservative and liberal alike.

35 Gus  Sat, Oct 26, 2013 11:01:07am

That’s a lot of men.

36 Absalom, Absalom, Obdicut  Sat, Oct 26, 2013 11:01:39am

re: #22 Killgore Trout

Agreed. Which is the reason I think the libertarian connection here is unsurprising. “libertarianism” has bee a dumping ground for crackpots and bad ideas since the 40’s. They might as well be ranting about the military-industrial complex.

Wow. This is a classic Killgore post.

First of all, ‘libertarianism’ in the US emerged in the 1950s as a perfectly mainstream movement. Goldwater is credited as one of the main forces behind the vitalization of the ‘libertarian’ movement. Before then, it was mostly indistinguishable from ‘classical liberalism’, aside from the ‘left libertarians’. There were lots of non-interventionist libertarians in the 20’s, 30’s, and 40’s, but non-interventionism wasn’t a crackpot position. I’d call it a ‘bad idea’, but that’s a rather broad category. Mostly, ‘libertarians’ were trying to distinguish themselves as social liberals who were opposed to the New Deal.

The military-industrial complex ‘rant’, of course, was delivered by Eisenhower, not a libertarian at all, and is a perfectly sober analysis of something empirically demonstrable: the US spends staggering shitloads of money on weaponry, to the detriment of the nation, and this feeds a cyclical lobbyist-contractor-political roundabout.

I would broadly agree that classical liberalism and libertarianism are ‘bad ideas’, but what are you talking about when you say that libertarianism was the dumping ground of crackpots in the 40’s? Can you be specific? I know actually providing support for your arguments isn’t your style (normally because you’re asserting things which are completely untrue, like classical liberals being all about positive rights) but hey, maybe you have some evidence this time.

Do you?

37 Backwoods_Sleuth  Sat, Oct 26, 2013 11:01:56am

Thousands marching…
THOUSANDS!!11!!

38 jhrhv  Sat, Oct 26, 2013 11:02:12am

re: #33 jaunte

“NSA listening to everything YOU SAY”

I’d like a large with double pepperoni please.

39 jaunte  Sat, Oct 26, 2013 11:03:17am

re: #38 jhrhv

The NSA knows I just told my son to be careful with his money and have fun this weekend.

40 Gus  Sat, Oct 26, 2013 11:03:39am

Needs moar giant puppets.

41 Absalom, Absalom, Obdicut  Sat, Oct 26, 2013 11:03:57am

re: #34 Political Atheist


I don’t think the word ‘liberal’ has been taken by the extremists. Can you explain what you mean?

I think that ‘conservative’ has especially lost it’s meaning because, well, conservatives are supposed to be against rapid change, but modern conservatives do nothing but advocate rapid change.

42 Gus  Sat, Oct 26, 2013 11:05:00am

Saw Prudence at #StopWatchingUs .

43 Killgore Trout  Sat, Oct 26, 2013 11:06:22am

re: #34 Political Atheist

What amazes me is how little effort there is to seize the agenda back from the extremists. The Tea Party/Libertarians, the far left unilateral disarmament faction (as shown by the shut down the NSA crowd) the people who think a forestry drone with a heat camera at a wildfire is some threat to privacy… Birthers, truthers, dudebros.

We see this with the budget, the economy, the NSA, the ACA, the Patriot Act. >Nothing is getting done. We know the Patriot Act should have been sunsetted as promised. The middle meekly let the extremists & critics take away the terms conservative and liberal alike.

I think the establishment is very happy with the situation. These protest movement and dumb partisan activist culture keeps people pointing fingers in the wrong directions, keeps them busy and preoccupied.

44 Dr Lizardo  Sat, Oct 26, 2013 11:07:11am

If Lizards would like to see what adult politicians look like - and this is a livestream appearance with all the leaders of the political parties- left to right - it’s here.

ceskatelevize.cz

It’s in Czech, so most likely, you won’t understand.

45 CriticalDragon1177  Sat, Oct 26, 2013 11:07:19am

Charles Johnson,

I hope that having crazy people like this there is turning people away, who were originally going to be part of the protest.

46 Killgore Trout  Sat, Oct 26, 2013 11:08:02am

Ranting about Masonic symbolism now

47 Gus  Sat, Oct 26, 2013 11:08:52am

re: #46 Killgore Trout

Ranting about Masonic symbolism now

When do they get to the JUICE?

48 Backwoods_Sleuth  Sat, Oct 26, 2013 11:09:27am

re: #46 Killgore Trout

Ranting about Masonic symbolism now

must be that ebay guy we discussed yesterday…

49 jaunte  Sat, Oct 26, 2013 11:09:33am

re: #46 Killgore Trout

Ranting about Masonic symbolism now

We’re being watched from inside our wallets.

50 b.d.  Sat, Oct 26, 2013 11:10:11am

re: #40 Gus

Needs moar giant puppets.

Puppets change the narrative.

Kukla, Fran and Ollie stopped Joseph McCarthy.

CONFIRMED FACT!

51 Gus  Sat, Oct 26, 2013 11:10:16am

re: #49 jaunte

We’re being watched from inside our wallets.

I knew it!

52 Political Atheist  Sat, Oct 26, 2013 11:10:38am

re: #41 Absalom, Absalom, Obdicut

I don’t think the word ‘liberal’ has been taken by the extremists. Can you explain what you mean?

I think that ‘conservative’ has especially lost it’s meaning because, well, conservatives are supposed to be against rapid change, but modern conservatives do nothing but advocate rapid change.

Liberal sadly has been turned into a perjorative by far right critics. And vice versa. It’s the modern bigotry. Hang a hated label on the other side, and end the discussion. Results? As above in the protest live feed.

53 Killgore Trout  Sat, Oct 26, 2013 11:11:56am

re: #49 jaunte

We’re being watched from inside our wallets.

That eyeball is creepy.

54 Political Atheist  Sat, Oct 26, 2013 11:11:57am

re: #43 Killgore Trout

Disagree, because this atmosphere has also hamstrung programs the admin wants and needs to do well.

55 CarolJ  Sat, Oct 26, 2013 11:12:26am

re: #43 Killgore Trout Meanwhile, some black kid a few blocks away worries that if he goes in the wrong store or neighborhood he gets followed or profiled. Compared to that, the NSA doesn’t even register.

Also, the vast majority of surveillance happens to be due to the drug war and the effects of the drug war. Legalize, and at least the problem becomes a bit more manageable.

Not only that, but what proposals do they have to keep private entities-companies or individuals from surveillance? I mean, folks could do their own surveillance and simply turn over the info to the NSA if asked. At least there’s some accountability with the NSA-courts, a member of congress, whatever.

56 jhrhv  Sat, Oct 26, 2013 11:12:30am

re: #50 b.d.

Kukla, Fran and Ollie

Always worth an upding.

57 b.d.  Sat, Oct 26, 2013 11:13:51am

From the freaking stage:

If you have a late model car with a computer chip in it you can find yourself in the same situation as Mr. Michael Hastings

58 compound_Idaho  Sat, Oct 26, 2013 11:14:13am

re: #18 b.d.

Lie by Gov. Johnson about a turned off phone can be used for a microphone and locator.

Oh well, it’s scary, that’s all that matters.

First they came for the Dudebros……

Unless you remove the battery, yes they can.

abcnews.go.com

59 jhrhv  Sat, Oct 26, 2013 11:14:24am

If I knew there was going to be a band too I would have brought my bong.

60 jaunte  Sat, Oct 26, 2013 11:14:26am

The Belorussians are in on it.
en.wikipedia.org

61 Dr Lizardo  Sat, Oct 26, 2013 11:15:08am

Kadir Nurman, the ‘inventor’ of the Döner Kebab, has passed away in Berlin at the age of 80.

independent.co.uk

I hereby declare three days of global mourning. That is all.

62 Amory Blaine  Sat, Oct 26, 2013 11:15:16am

None of these guys met a EULA they didn’t agree to.

63 Tim TeaBro  Sat, Oct 26, 2013 11:15:35am

re: #4 b.d.

DudeBaggers?

Me likey.

64 b.d.  Sat, Oct 26, 2013 11:16:05am

re: #58 compound_Idaho

I stand corrected, thanks

65 Gus  Sat, Oct 26, 2013 11:16:25am

Stop Watching Us Obama Derangement Rally

66 ericblair  Sat, Oct 26, 2013 11:16:58am

re: #57 b.d.

From the freaking stage: If you have a late model car with a computer chip in it you can find yourself in the same situation as Mr. Michael Hastings

Aaaand this is what happened with OWS. If you don’t have a way to keep out the looney conspiracy theorists (which may be difficult when most of the people involved are looney conspiracy theorists themselves) you get upstaged by increasing levels of crayzee. Then it’s really hard to get taken seriously when there’s bug-eyed freaks ranting about the Freemasons poisoning the well on the stage behind you.

67 Absalom, Absalom, Obdicut  Sat, Oct 26, 2013 11:17:08am

re: #52 Political Atheist

Liberal sadly has been turned into a perjorative by far right critics. And vice versa. It’s the modern bigotry. Hang a hated label on the other side, and end the discussion. Results? As above in the protest live feed.

I’m really not following you at all. What discussion ends when you hang a label on the other side? This protest, representing a far fringe, how does this fit into what you’re saying?

68 jhrhv  Sat, Oct 26, 2013 11:17:10am

re: #58 compound_Idaho

Turning on the mic in my phone while it is off would give you the ability to listen to me sleeping.

69 RinaX  Sat, Oct 26, 2013 11:18:15am

I can only pray that the Democratic party, despite it’s many flaws, continue to be smart enough to at least not let extremists hijack it and gain any significant power. It baffles me when I see so-called liberals trying to argue that it’s beneficial to join up with lunatics even if you don’t “agree with all of their positions”, and being unable to see the parallel to what’s happening now to the Republican party. Idiots, all of them.

70 Amory Blaine  Sat, Oct 26, 2013 11:18:35am

Give up all pretenses of privacy to play candy crush? No prob. Gather info in parts of the world that could save lives. GHHAAAAA

71 ericblair  Sat, Oct 26, 2013 11:19:35am

re: #58 compound_Idaho

Unless you remove the battery, yes they can.

abcnews.go.com

On a dumbphone, yes, but probably not on a smartphone. If you were going out to bury some bodies in the desert, though, you might want to err on the side of caution. HTH HAND.

Of course, at the end of the article they do mention that the Feds get, like, those warrant things for this stuff.

72 CarolJ  Sat, Oct 26, 2013 11:20:14am

Personally, I think the genie is out of the bag on this one. In a world of smart everything, somebody is watching you at least online. The real battle is over accountability and transparency. In other words, the right to know who is watching you and the ability to hold them to account for abuses or negligence. But that’s something that requires actually buttonholing members of Congress and coming up with something that resembles a proposal.

Dudebros don’t want to create the necessary coalition for real changes on privacy issues. It means talking about racial profiling, stalking and domestic violence issues, corporate accountability for stored data, and other such measures. That means talking to the Obama coalition who has deeper worries than cell phone batteries and drones.

73 jaunte  Sat, Oct 26, 2013 11:20:15am
74 Killgore Trout  Sat, Oct 26, 2013 11:21:42am

the lovely folks from code pink are there

75 jaunte  Sat, Oct 26, 2013 11:21:53am

Amazon might be able to access my credit rating!!!

76 Charles Johnson  Sat, Oct 26, 2013 11:23:22am

The speaker who’s on now… wow.

77 jaunte  Sat, Oct 26, 2013 11:23:38am
78 b.d.  Sat, Oct 26, 2013 11:23:39am

Monsanto is engineering corn with bigger ears so it can listen to you.

79 Political Atheist  Sat, Oct 26, 2013 11:24:28am

re: #67 Absalom, Absalom, Obdicut

I’m really not following you at all. What discussion ends when you hang a label on the other side? This protest, representing a far fringe, how does this fit into what you’re saying?

The mutual rational discussion from opposite sides of the issue at hand ends. When you dismiss the other side with a perjorative, obviously the mind is closed to open consideration of the other side.

Instead of attention on this (LINK EDIT!) for example we have a silly season spectacle.

How about a recent development on the national budget. A very recent headline read that the two sides have agreed on only one thing. There will be no “grand bargain” on taxes, entitlements and spending. There needs to be one.

Reid, Ryan agree: There will be no ‘grand bargain’

By Aaron Blake
October 24 at 4:10 pm

The new House-Senate panel charged with crafting a long-term budget compromise is apparently aiming low, with leaders on both sides of the Capitol saying Thursday that there will be no so-called “grand bargain.”

80 Gus  Sat, Oct 26, 2013 11:24:43am

re: #76 Charles Johnson

The speaker who’s on now… wow.

David Duke or Ralph Nader?

81 jaunte  Sat, Oct 26, 2013 11:25:20am

The successful “Stop Listening To Me” song hasn’t been written yet.

82 b.d.  Sat, Oct 26, 2013 11:25:20am

Bring back the America that never was!!1!

83 HappyWarrior  Sat, Oct 26, 2013 11:26:31am

re: #61 Dr Lizardo

Kadir Nurman, the ‘inventor’ of the Döner Kebab, has passed away in Berlin at the age of 80.

independent.co.uk

I hereby declare three days of global mourning. That is all.

Damn. RIP and thanks for an awesome sandwich.

84 HappyWarrior  Sat, Oct 26, 2013 11:26:59am

re: #77 jaunte

[Embedded content]

Because Vladimir Putin cares so much about people’s privacy. Just ask any Russian dissident.

85 Kragar  Sat, Oct 26, 2013 11:27:33am

re: #81 jaunte

The successful “Stop Listening To Me” song hasn’t been written yet.

Well, it has actually. Its so successful you just turn it off whenever you hear it come on.

86 ericblair  Sat, Oct 26, 2013 11:27:56am

re: #72 CarolJ

Dudebros don’t want to create the necessary coalition for real changes on privacy issues.

From seeing what these guys are up to, my read is that they want the pigs out of the way so they can be free to stalk and take advantage of the stupid masses as they see fit without interference. The Internet is their world, ya see, they are the masters, and you’re just a bunch of sheep to be exploited.

87 Dr Lizardo  Sat, Oct 26, 2013 11:28:01am

re: #83 HappyWarrior

Damn. RIP and thanks for an awesome sandwich.

Indeed. The Döner Kebab is one of my all-time favorites. Fortunately for me, there’s a small kebab stand about 10 minutes away from me on foot, so when I don’t feel like cooking, I head down thataway.

88 Kragar  Sat, Oct 26, 2013 11:28:04am

Meanwhile…

Youtube Video

89 RinaX  Sat, Oct 26, 2013 11:28:51am

re: #10 Ming

I wonder what will happen when Obama leaves office, and isn’t there to hold things together for the rest of us. As we saw in 2008, when Sarah Palin got 46% of the vote, things can go horribly wrong.

This scares the crap out of me. I know that until President Obama came along, I was completely disillusioned with most mainstream Democrats. However, that wasn’t enough to stop me from voting as I have never not recognized that Republicans were by far the bigger threat to government. Too many other Dems dont’ do that, though.

90 jaunte  Sat, Oct 26, 2013 11:29:06am

re: #85 Kragar

“These are not the tunes you’re looking for.”

91 Kragar  Sat, Oct 26, 2013 11:29:27am

Youtube Video

92 b.d.  Sat, Oct 26, 2013 11:29:35am

Now comes Dan Choi who never wanted anything to be private ever as far as I can tell.

93 Political Atheist  Sat, Oct 26, 2013 11:30:31am

re: #58 compound_Idaho

Unless you remove the battery, yes they can.

abcnews.go.com

Or just put the phone in an enclosed copper or stainless container. Little Faraday cage.

94 DisturbedEma  Sat, Oct 26, 2013 11:30:34am

re: #81 jaunte

The successful “Stop Listening To Me” song hasn’t been written yet.

The 80s knows all

95 jhrhv  Sat, Oct 26, 2013 11:31:18am

This rally is the kind of thing that makes you miss info-mmercials.

96 b.d.  Sat, Oct 26, 2013 11:31:23am

Dan Choi - I want to let the police that are here today know that you are not my enemy.

Silence from the crowd. Deafening silence.

97 HappyWarrior  Sat, Oct 26, 2013 11:31:24am

re: #87 Dr Lizardo

Indeed. The Döner Kebab is one of my all-time favorites. Fortunately for me, there’s a small kebab stand about 10 minutes away from me on foot, so when I don’t feel like cooking, I head down thataway.

We have a German place a few towns over. I swear. It’s like a little corner of Germany in my backyard. It’s great. Döner Kebab>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>Gyro. I wish I had gotten one while I was in Germany itself but there’ll be a tiem and place for that.

98 Absalom, Absalom, Obdicut  Sat, Oct 26, 2013 11:31:35am

re: #79 Political Atheist

The mutual rational discussion from opposite sides of the issue at hand ends. When you dismiss the other side with a perjorative, obviously the mind is closed to open consideration of the other side.

I’m sorry, are you saying people who say ‘conservative’ these days has come to mean ‘reactionary’ are not openly considering ‘the other side’?

How about a recent development on the national budget. A very recent headline read that the two sides have agreed on only one thing. There will be no “grand bargain” on taxes, entitlements and spending. There needs to be one.

We need to increase taxes and increase spending, yeah, but the GOP isn’t going to let that happen while they hold the house.

Still not really following you here.

99 Kragar  Sat, Oct 26, 2013 11:32:07am

re: #94 DisturbedEma

The 80s knows all

Youtube Video

100 jhrhv  Sat, Oct 26, 2013 11:32:44am

There really is a conversation that needs to be had about the NSA, what they collect and what should be done with that information.

No one at this rally looks like they should be there for that conversation.

101 HappyWarrior  Sat, Oct 26, 2013 11:32:51am

You know this is a legit issue IMO but hysteria isn’t going to address it.

102 DisturbedEma  Sat, Oct 26, 2013 11:33:06am

re: #99 Kragar


EXCELLENT!!!!!

103 Amory Blaine  Sat, Oct 26, 2013 11:33:46am

I’d like to see a protest against those 14 page psychology exams grocery baggers have to take to get a job.

104 HappyWarrior  Sat, Oct 26, 2013 11:33:46am

re: #100 jhrhv

There really is a conversation that needs to be had about the NSA, what they collect and what should be done with that information.

No one at this rally looks like they should be there for that conversation.

I’d be more sympathetic if some people *cough* Greenwald, Snowden, etc weren’t chummy with people who do things that make the NSA look like Harriet the Spy gathering secrets on her classmates and neighbors.

105 DisturbedEma  Sat, Oct 26, 2013 11:34:47am

re: #101 HappyWarrior

You know this is a legit issue IMO but hysteria isn’t going to address it.

Remember the story awhile back about a couple who had googled backpacks and pressure cookers and were visited by law enforcement? Was that story ever verified? I can’t recall…

106 HappyWarrior  Sat, Oct 26, 2013 11:34:52am

re: #103 Amory Blaine

I’d like to see a protest against those 14 page psychology exams grocery baggers have to take to get a job.

Agh. Before I got my current job, I did some applications like that. Those are the worst. I mean I get that they don’t want drug users on the job but I hate how they basically want you to say that you’d shame someone who was smoking pot and it not impacting their work.

107 HappyWarrior  Sat, Oct 26, 2013 11:35:12am

re: #105 DisturbedEma

Remember the story awhile back about a couple who had googled backpacks and pressure cookers and were visited by law enforcement? Was that story ever verified? I can’t recall…

Hadn’t heard that one so I dunno.

108 simoom  Sat, Oct 26, 2013 11:36:54am

Oathkeepers next to NWO / End The FED guy surrounded by a sea of pre-made banners:

109 DisturbedEma  Sat, Oct 26, 2013 11:37:34am

re: #107 HappyWarrior

Hadn’t heard that one so I dunno.

ahhh here’s why

110 jaunte  Sat, Oct 26, 2013 11:37:46am

re: #105 DisturbedEma

Apparently the search was done from a work computer, and the company reported the searches to the police.
theatlanticwire.com

111 DisturbedEma  Sat, Oct 26, 2013 11:38:17am

re: #107 HappyWarrior

I tried using the name of the woman, since it’s the same as mine, even spelled the same:)

112 HappyWarrior  Sat, Oct 26, 2013 11:38:23am

The thing that bugs me from a practical pov about DontSpyOnMeBro types is they don’t offer any solutions. Whether they want to admit it or not. Terrorism is a legitimate issue and despite what that mental midget Alex Jones believes, they’re not false flags either.

113 DisturbedEma  Sat, Oct 26, 2013 11:39:09am

re: #110 jaunte

Apparently the search was done from a work computer, and the company reported the searches to the police.
theatlanticwire.com

I remember the first story and always meant to look into it more, but got distracted by the lunacy de jour…

114 jaunte  Sat, Oct 26, 2013 11:39:16am
115 Amory Blaine  Sat, Oct 26, 2013 11:39:52am

re: #112 HappyWarrior

Impotent rage.

116 simoom  Sat, Oct 26, 2013 11:39:52am

The StopWatchingUs twitter feed weirdly RT’ed this:

117 b.d.  Sat, Oct 26, 2013 11:39:56am

re: #105 DisturbedEma

Remember the story awhile back about a couple who had googled backpacks and pressure cookers and were visited by law enforcement? Was that story ever verified? I can’t recall…

Debunked.

The husband Googled: Bombs, Pressure Cookers on a WORK computer and he was released from their employment. The employer, owner of the machine, looked to see what he was doing, saw the searches, got concerned and called the cops.

The wife who wrote the article omitted a bunch of stuff and mislead in her article and ended up looking quite the fool. Especially one of her updates that read: THANKS OBAMA

118 Political Atheist  Sat, Oct 26, 2013 11:41:19am

re: #98 Absalom, Absalom, Obdicut

Still not really following you here.

Perhaps I should simplify. As shown at the rally above, when the extreme views run the agenda no good comes out of it. Nothing changes. The media gets ratings, blogs get hits, ads get clicks. The policy remains the same.

119 Kragar  Sat, Oct 26, 2013 11:41:21am

re: #116 simoom

The StopWatchingUs twitter feed weirdly RT’ed this:

[Embedded content]

The irony being most Oathkreepers would probably say the kids should be deported for looking to Hispanic.

120 Amory Blaine  Sat, Oct 26, 2013 11:41:46am

Stay off your work computer people!!!

121 jaunte  Sat, Oct 26, 2013 11:41:52am

Loons.

122 HappyWarrior  Sat, Oct 26, 2013 11:42:06am

Damn speaking of deaths, Marcia Wallace better known as the voice of Edna Krappapel on the Simpsons died at 70. I wonder if they’ll retire the character or just replace the voice actress. She also played the wisecracking maid on That’s My Bush.

123 DisturbedEma  Sat, Oct 26, 2013 11:42:57am

re: #117 b.d.

Debunked.

The husband Googled: Bombs, Pressure Cookers on a WORK computer and he was released from their employment. The employer, owner of the machine, looked to see what he was doing, saw the searches, got concerned and called the cops.

The wife who wrote the article omitted a bunch of stuff and mislead in her article and ended up looking quite the fool. Especially one of her updates that read: THANKS OBAMA

Thanks very much for that update…it really does matter in light of the thread…

124 HappyWarrior  Sat, Oct 26, 2013 11:43:02am

re: #121 jaunte

[Embedded content]

Loons.

So the technology would be fine if it was in the hands of Mitt Romney or whoever this person would have preferred to be president over Obama. As I said, these people just bitch. They offer no solutions.

125 simoom  Sat, Oct 26, 2013 11:43:03am

Heh. Thomas Drake with someone wearing a “Free Beiber” T-shirt behind him:

126 Absalom, Absalom, Obdicut  Sat, Oct 26, 2013 11:43:35am

re: #118 Political Atheist

Perhaps I should simplify. As shown at the rally above, when the extreme views run the agenda no good comes out of it. Nothing changes. The media gets ratings, blogs get hits, ads get clicks. The policy remains the same.

But the extreme view on the ‘liberal’ side doesn’t run the agenda. The extreme view on the ‘conservative’ side, does.

The way that the 4th amendment stuff will change is via the courts, and Sotomayor and Kagan’s appointments are the two biggest things that can help to change 4th amendment law. They got onto the Supreme Court not thanks to the extreme views of anyone, but due to the ‘middle’.

127 DisturbedEma  Sat, Oct 26, 2013 11:43:40am

re: #122 HappyWarrior

Damn speaking of deaths, Marcia Wallace better known as the voice of Edna Krappapel on the Simpsons died at 70. I wonder if they’ll retire the character or just replace the voice actress. She also played the wisecracking maid on That’s My Bush.

And Newhart’s secretary…my mom was a huge fan of the original series

128 jhrhv  Sat, Oct 26, 2013 11:43:46am

re: #121 jaunte

[Embedded content]

Loons.

They left out from Kenya.

129 jaunte  Sat, Oct 26, 2013 11:43:58am

re: #124 HappyWarrior

I wonder how many of them have given PayPal their banking info.

130 HappyWarrior  Sat, Oct 26, 2013 11:44:45am

re: #129 jaunte

I wonder how many of them have given PayPal their banking info.

Or tweet every last detail about themselves.

131 jaunte  Sat, Oct 26, 2013 11:44:49am

re: #128 jhrhv

I think that may be implied in “Chicago.”

132 DisturbedEma  Sat, Oct 26, 2013 11:44:50am

re: #129 jaunte

I wonder how many of them have given PayPal their banking info.

Or their mother’s maiden name to ancestry dot com

133 CarolJ  Sat, Oct 26, 2013 11:45:12am

re: #106 HappyWarrior

And how many of those are really necessary and closer to profiling than we care to admit? It’s worth noticing that these are entry-level positions with no power. Nobody is drug-testing the tax accountant who could steal far more in a day than a maid could do in a lifetime.

And what I mean by profiling, is that a drug conviction keeps you out of a lot of jobs where the closest you get to anything critical is when you pass the safe on the way out of the store. Do we really need sober grocery baggers? Is it necessary to drug test secretaries? But given the racial disparities, it’s a good way to keep some people out of paying employment and even in some states out of voting.

134 b.d.  Sat, Oct 26, 2013 11:45:19am

re: #125 simoom

Eheh.. Thomas Drake with someone wearing a “Free Beiber” T-shirt behind him:

[Embedded content]

lol, Free Beiber?

135 Political Atheist  Sat, Oct 26, 2013 11:45:47am

re: #126 Absalom, Absalom, Obdicut

You don’t see any extreme except the right at that rally? Okaaay.

136 BongCrodny  Sat, Oct 26, 2013 11:46:19am

re: #121 jaunte

This technology is now in the hands of a Chicago thug, fascist wannabe dictator.

Wait a minute — Obama’s a fascist now?

I’m gonna need a program to keep up.

137 jaunte  Sat, Oct 26, 2013 11:46:35am

Russia Accelerates Its Own Internet Spying, Thanks to Snowden

138 b.d.  Sat, Oct 26, 2013 11:47:12am

Oh Joy, FoxNews’ Dennis Kucinich is up

139 jhrhv  Sat, Oct 26, 2013 11:47:13am

re: #131 jaunte

I tripped over the crazy. A Chicago thug from Kenya that’s a Hitler fascist spying oh …I give up.

140 HappyWarrior  Sat, Oct 26, 2013 11:47:33am

re: #136 BongCrodny

Wait a minute — Obama’s a fascist now?

I’m gonna need a program to keep up.

That one isn’t new. These idiots believe that commie and fascist are interchangeable because things I dislike are all the same and there’s no room for nuance.

141 Absalom, Absalom, Obdicut  Sat, Oct 26, 2013 11:49:01am

re: #135 Political Atheist

You don’t see any extreme except the right at that rally? Okaaay.

No, that’s not at all what I said. In the least. I’m not sure how you created it out of what I said.

This rally, on the fringe, has both ‘right’ and ‘left’ people. But you’ve been asserting that when the extremists ‘run the agenda’ nothing comes of it. I’m pointing out that the actual path to 4th amendment problems exists, it’s the Supreme Court, and with the appointment of Sotomayor and Kagan we’ve made great strides towards changing the long history of more and more permissive 4th amendment law.

142 Gus  Sat, Oct 26, 2013 11:49:53am

Stuffed. Too many snacks.

143 jhrhv  Sat, Oct 26, 2013 11:49:55am

I see the no solutions people as the real stumbling block to getting anything done anywhere these days. Everyone has loads of anger and crazy but no one wants to offer up what they see as solutions unless you include the crazys that go for shut it down.

That isn’t a solution that’s a train wreck.

144 Political Atheist  Sat, Oct 26, 2013 11:50:18am

re: #141 Absalom, Absalom, Obdicut

Dude I was talking about the rally. Of course it’s agenda is reflected elsewhere too but if you think I meant inside the West Wing we have had a misunderstanding.

145 Absalom, Absalom, Obdicut  Sat, Oct 26, 2013 11:51:19am

re: #144 Political Atheist

Dude I was talking about the rally. Of course it’s agenda is reflected elsewhere too but if you think I meant inside the West Wing we have had a misunderstanding.

Yeah, I really have no clue what you’re talking about. You said, in bold ‘nothing is getting done’. That’s wrong: Kagan and Sotomayor have been appointed to the Supreme Court. That is ‘something getting done’.

To put it another way: What is it that you would like to have happen, that is not currently happening?

146 Political Atheist  Sat, Oct 26, 2013 11:52:07am

re: #141 Absalom, Absalom, Obdicut

The rally as you note has both extremes. Perhaps we agree it’s a shame the rally is holding peoples attention rather than the more sane and substantive facets of the P.A. and the NSA?

147 jhrhv  Sat, Oct 26, 2013 11:52:18am

I’m out for a while have a nice afternoon lizards.

148 simoom  Sat, Oct 26, 2013 11:53:04am

Sign:

“The Answer to 1984 is 1776”

149 jaunte  Sat, Oct 26, 2013 11:53:21am

Cruz is such a throwback. It’s like seeing a replay of 1956.

150 Absalom, Absalom, Obdicut  Sat, Oct 26, 2013 11:53:25am

re: #146 Political Atheist

The rally as you note has both extremes. Perhaps we agree it’s a shame the rally is holding peoples attention rather than the more sane and substantive facets of the P.A. and the NSA?

I don’t think the rally is holding people’s attention. It’ll happen today, be mocked briefly, and disappear. Meanwhile, Kagan and Sotmoyor will continue to rule on stuff for a long time.

151 HappyWarrior  Sat, Oct 26, 2013 11:53:30am

re: #143 jhrhv

I see the no solutions people as the real stumbling block to getting anything done anywhere these days. Everyone has loads of anger and crazy but no one wants to offer up what they see as solutions unless you include the crazys that go for shut it down.

That isn’t a solution that’s a train wreck.

Right, the only solutions I see from them are things that are totally unreasonable like SHUT DOWN THE NSA!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! You want better oversight of the NSA? Then I’m right on board with you but that’s actually something despite what the hysterics believe has improved with this administration. The problem though is equally hysterical politicians who want to convince the public that the NSA is something that Barack Obama personally invented while cackling evilly while holding a cat.

152 b.d.  Sat, Oct 26, 2013 11:53:47am

Viewing ESPN and noted that there are FAR more people at the Houston Cougars vs. Rutgers game than are at that rally and the visiting Cougars are up 49-14.

153 HappyWarrior  Sat, Oct 26, 2013 11:54:32am

re: #148 simoom

Sign:

[Embedded content]

I get what they mean but this fantasy that everything was swell under the founders is bs. Idiots ever heard of the Alien and Sedition Acts? That stuff makes the NSA stuff look like child’s play.

154 b.d.  Sat, Oct 26, 2013 11:54:47am

re: #142 Gus

Stuffed. Too many snacks.

Appetite is a good thing. Your stomach is a muscle and needs to be exercised.

155 HappyWarrior  Sat, Oct 26, 2013 11:55:12am

re: #152 b.d.

Viewing ESPN and noted that there are FAR more people at the Houston Cougars vs. Rutgers game than are at that rally and the visiting Cougars are up 49-14.

It’s cold here today. But they probably did a shitty job organizing it too.

156 b_sharp  Sat, Oct 26, 2013 11:56:23am

re: #135 Political Atheist

You don’t see any extreme except the right at that rally? Okaaay.

I think the point being made is that the extreme left, which exists and shows up at rallies does not include a subset of lawmakers.

157 jaunte  Sat, Oct 26, 2013 11:57:18am

Russia Today is very enthusiastic about the protest.

158 jaunte  Sat, Oct 26, 2013 11:57:45am
159 William Barnett-Lewis  Sat, Oct 26, 2013 11:58:46am

Putin has to be laughing his ass off at these, dare I say, “useful idiots”.

160 HappyWarrior  Sat, Oct 26, 2013 11:58:49am

re: #157 jaunte

Russia Today is very enthusiastic about the protest.

[Embedded content]

I wish Sergei was still here on LGF. I bet he’s getting a big kick out of the Russia government and media acting like they somehow value privacy.

161 b.d.  Sat, Oct 26, 2013 12:00:05pm

re: #157 jaunte

Russia Today is very enthusiastic about the protest.

[Embedded content]

Russia Today is an amusing concern troll, the DudeBaggers lap up their stuff.

162 Political Atheist  Sat, Oct 26, 2013 12:00:27pm

re: #150 Absalom, Absalom, Obdicut

I don’t think the rally is holding people’s attention. It’ll happen today, be mocked briefly, and disappear. Meanwhile, Kagan and Sotmoyor will continue to rule on stuff for a long time.

Today it is holding our attention. Topic of the morning, 150 plus posts mostly on topic, media coverage etc.

When will the court address “relevance” in the context of the P.A. and NSA metadata logging? That’s still just as assertion, unproven in open court. When that happens I will be more impressed than I am today. Sure the judiciary may save us but that’s supposed to be more of a last resort.

Lot’s of attention to bigotry and insulting signs at the rally. Very little attention to reasonable efforts to assess the legalities and return to our previous civil protections. Like the legislative proposal efforts of the ACLU.for instance.

163 b.d.  Sat, Oct 26, 2013 12:03:12pm

Amash getting heckled by folks demanding he do more.

164 jaunte  Sat, Oct 26, 2013 12:06:19pm
165 Charles Johnson  Sat, Oct 26, 2013 12:06:57pm
166 Tim TeaBro  Sat, Oct 26, 2013 12:08:34pm

We’re Ultra for Ultrasound!

167 jaunte  Sat, Oct 26, 2013 12:11:43pm
168 thedopefishlives  Sat, Oct 26, 2013 12:14:49pm

Afternoon Lizardim from the beautifully clear and mild wild north country. The fishfolk visit has been going well; this morning’s task was some more repairs to the Mafiamobile, some of which were successful and some less so. This afternoon, we’re carving pumpkins with the fishspawn and I will do my best impression of beer-battered fried chicken for dinner. How go things among the lizardfolk?

169 Absalom, Absalom, Obdicut  Sat, Oct 26, 2013 12:15:37pm

re: #162 Political Atheist

Today it is holding our attention. Topic of the morning, 150 plus posts mostly on topic, media coverage etc.

When will the court address “relevance” in the context of the P.A. and NSA metadata logging?

When a court case comes before them that addresses it.

That’s still just as assertion, unproven in open court. When that happens I will be more impressed than I am today. Sure the judiciary may save us but that’s supposed to be more of a last resort.

The judiciary isn’t supposed to be a ‘last resort’. They’re supposed to rule on stuff. And there has been plenty of rulings on 4th amendment issues by Kagan and Sotomayor already.

Lot’s of attention to bigotry and insulting signs at the rally. Very little attention to reasonable efforts to assess the legalities and return to our previous civil protections. Like the legislative proposal efforts of the ACLU.for instance.

What ‘previous’ civil protections are you talking about? Pen registers have been the law of the land for a long, long time, the FBI has infiltrated group for a long, long time, etc. What period of time do you see a right to privacy being established in the US?

170 Political Atheist  Sat, Oct 26, 2013 12:16:05pm

re: #156 b_sharp

I think the point being made is that the extreme left, which exists and shows up at rallies does not include a subset of lawmakers.

Sure, I was talking about the rally, not the congress. As said above a spectacle that fails to include the real substance. Too full of “Obama is a (fill in as per whatever sign)” and ban the NSA. Too much derp, too little reason.

171 b.d.  Sat, Oct 26, 2013 12:17:25pm

The emcee says that he especially wants to thank Eric Snowden for standing up.

172 simoom  Sat, Oct 26, 2013 12:19:07pm

Looks like little attendance at the Chicago rally:

Image: 993693_691133537565383_1444084898_n.jpg

173 HappyWarrior  Sat, Oct 26, 2013 12:19:13pm

re: #171 b.d.

The emcee says that he especially wants to thank Eric Snowden for standing up.

I didn’t know Ed had a twin brother who helped him.

174 wrenchwench  Sat, Oct 26, 2013 12:19:16pm

re: #171 b.d.

The emcee says that he especially wants to thank Eric Snowden for standing up.

Did he say Eric? ‘Cause it’s Edward.

175 Tim TeaBro  Sat, Oct 26, 2013 12:19:54pm

Was Jerry Assange at the rally?

176 wrenchwench  Sat, Oct 26, 2013 12:20:12pm

re: #172 simoom

Looks like little attendance at the Chicago rally:

Image: 993693_691133537565383_1444084898_n.jpg

I think more people would show up if they thought somebody would be watching them.


/

177 b.d.  Sat, Oct 26, 2013 12:20:37pm

re: #174 wrenchwench

Did he say Eric? ‘Cause it’s Edward.

He said Eric.

A name that shall live in infamy.

178 wrenchwench  Sat, Oct 26, 2013 12:21:07pm

re: #177 b.d.

He said Eric.

A name that shall live in infamy.

Or maybe next door to infamy.

179 HappyWarrior  Sat, Oct 26, 2013 12:21:07pm

re: #175 Tim TeaBro

Was Jerry Assange at the rally?

Or George Greenwald.

180 Charles Johnson  Sat, Oct 26, 2013 12:22:36pm
181 Tim TeaBro  Sat, Oct 26, 2013 12:22:50pm

I can’t wait to read Geoff Greenwald’s reportage of these great rallies, especially Jorge Amash’s magnificent speech on NSA and ultrasounds.

182 Charles Johnson  Sat, Oct 26, 2013 12:23:57pm
183 Tim TeaBro  Sat, Oct 26, 2013 12:24:31pm

You proggy tribalist neocon warmongerer!

184 Political Atheist  Sat, Oct 26, 2013 12:24:36pm

re: #169 Absalom, Absalom, Obdicut

When a court case comes before them that addresses it.

The judiciary isn’t supposed to be a ‘last resort’. They’re supposed to rule on stuff. And there has been plenty of rulings on 4th amendment issues by Kagan and Sotomayor already.

What ‘previous’ civil protections are you talking about? Pen registers have been the law of the land for a long, long time, the FBI has infiltrated group for a long, long time, etc. What period of time do you see a right to privacy being established in the US?

You say that as if the changes the P.A. made don’t matter. They do.
There is broad agreement on this point here right?

For your understanding given your thrice expressed inability to understand my posts- I was talking about the rally, not congress, today not years, and the Patriot Act not some imaginary perfect day from the past for privacy.

The judiciary has been the last resort to end some really bad legislation. Court challenges come after passage not during the shaping of the law. The courts don’t preempt laws, they uphold or end them after a proper legal challenge. Hence the term last resort. It’s about timing, not the level of desperation.

185 b.d.  Sat, Oct 26, 2013 12:24:49pm

re: #182 Charles Johnson

[Embedded content]

Clap, clap, clap.

186 Gus  Sat, Oct 26, 2013 12:25:01pm

re: #180 Charles Johnson

[Embedded content]

Hahahaha!

187 thedopefishlives  Sat, Oct 26, 2013 12:25:31pm

re: #182 Charles Johnson

His question is conditional on the R’s actually winning the White House. Which, considering the absolute torpedoing of their own credibility that they’ve been doing, is not likely to happen any time in the next, oh, half-century.

188 Tim TeaBro  Sat, Oct 26, 2013 12:25:41pm

proggy

189 jaunte  Sat, Oct 26, 2013 12:27:35pm

re: #188 Tim TeaBro

“Full-time libertarian”

He creates his own reality.

190 ObserverArt  Sat, Oct 26, 2013 12:29:27pm

re: #52 Political Atheist

Liberal sadly has been turned into a perjorative by far right critics. And vice versa. It’s the modern bigotry. Hang a hated label on the other side, and end the discussion. Results? As above in the protest live feed.

The classic Ronny Reagan “L-word” all growed up.

By the way, with a handle like Political Atheist, aren’t you by default in the middle yourself?

The middle is a big area in today’s politics…inhabited by a whole hell of a lot of people that do care and also becomes the area for those that are not keen on either party. I think it is a direct result of what some of you are talking about, things like the bastardization of terms like liberal and conservative. Nobody realistic wants to be on those fringes…so hello middle.

And, never underestimate the amount of attention that is given by the media to the crazies because they make quick easy stories and take nothing to explain as far as why someone ends up in the middle. Good TV, not good for politics. Chuck Todd-like mush-headed “it’s not up to us” does nothing for the middle except put and keep more there.

191 Tim TeaBro  Sat, Oct 26, 2013 12:30:09pm

Is it possible that people actually think in ALL CAPS?
Would explain a lot.

192 Absalom, Absalom, Obdicut  Sat, Oct 26, 2013 12:31:37pm

re: #184 Political Atheist

You say that as if the changes the P.A. made don’t matter.

No, I don’t. I have no idea why you keep asserting these things. Nothing I said can be reasonably interpreted as ‘the changes the PA made don’t matter’.

For your understanding given your thrice expressed inability to understand my posts- I was talking about the rally, not congress, today not years, and the Patriot Act not some imaginary perfect day from the past for privacy.

You said ” Very little attention to reasonable efforts to assess the legalities and return to our previous civil protections. ” I’m asking what those previous civil protections are/were. I’m also unclear as to how this relates to this rally.

The judiciary has been the last resort to end some really bad legislation. Court challenges come after passage not during the shaping of the law. The courts don’t preempt laws, they uphold or end them after a proper legal challenge. Hence the term last resort. It’s about timing, not the level of desperation.

Okay, well, last resort is a pretty inaccurate term, then. “Last resort” carries the meaning of desperation. You should probably use a term that doesn’t have the meaning of ‘desperation’ if you don’t mean desperation.

193 Bulworth  Sat, Oct 26, 2013 12:32:15pm

Ah well, this Liberal was not at the Teabag-ANSWER rally today. Instead, I went to Home Depot to buy a new washer and dryer and to arrange to have my basement carpeted. I’m such a sellout.

194 Feline Fearless Leader  Sat, Oct 26, 2013 12:35:02pm

re: #168 thedopefishlives

Afternoon Lizardim from the beautifully clear and mild wild north country. The fishfolk visit has been going well; this morning’s task was some more repairs to the Mafiamobile, some of which were successful and some less so. This afternoon, we’re carving pumpkins with the fishspawn and I will do my best impression of beer-battered fried chicken for dinner. How go things among the lizardfolk?

Ran errands and opted to pick up a turquoise Ikea shelf unit. Cats supervised assembly and also approve of the packing materials*. Now tastefully arranged below the counter between the kitchen and living room and serving as storage and cat cubby hole.

* - Box to hide in. Cardboard spacers to claw. This plastic fabric to claw and haul about. And pieces edged with protective tape that the cats are “fighting” with — including an 8” long piece getting stuck to a cat’s underbelly and triggering her running about the apartment in panic doing the cat equivalent of yelling “Get it off! GET IT OFF!”

195 BongCrodny  Sat, Oct 26, 2013 12:35:45pm

re: #183 Tim TeaBro

You proggy tribalist neocon warmongerer!

That would be an awesome tag.

196 Lidane  Sat, Oct 26, 2013 12:35:59pm

re: #8 Charles Johnson

Speaker at the rally now demanding that the NSA be shut down.

Because we all know the US is the first country to ever spy on anyone. Ever.

Delusional morans.

197 thedopefishlives  Sat, Oct 26, 2013 12:37:32pm

re: #194 Feline Fearless Leader

Yeah. I have been trying to conquer the ABS system on the car, without success. I’ve been working through all the cheap and easy options, and it’s starting to get into the “spend more money” territory, so I’m pretty much done with it for the present. The repairs that did go well were installing new front brake pads and rotors; I hadn’t intended on changing the rotors, but the shop said they were too thin for the spec. The look on his face when I took one of their brand-new rotors out, measured it, and found it wasn’t in spec, was priceless. But I bought them anyway.

198 prairiefire  Sat, Oct 26, 2013 12:37:33pm

Twitter fight ~ go, Charles!

199 Feline Fearless Leader  Sat, Oct 26, 2013 12:38:26pm

Privacy in the USN

Courtesy of the USS North Carolina (retired).

200 Political Atheist  Sat, Oct 26, 2013 12:42:59pm

re: #190 ObserverArt

The classic Ronny Reagan “L-word” all growed up.

By the way, with a handle like Political Atheist, aren’t you by default in the middle yourself?

The middle is a big area in today’s politics…inhabited by a whole hell of a lot of people that do care and also becomes the area for those that are not keen on either party. I think it is a direct result of what some of you are talking about, things like the bastardization of terms like liberal and conservative. Nobody realistic wants to be on those fringes…so hello middle.

And, never underestimate the amount of attention that is given by the media to the crazies because they make quick easy stories and take nothing to explain as far as why someone ends up in the middle. Good TV, not good for politics. Chuck Todd-like mush-headed “it’s not up to us” does nothing for the middle except put and keep more there.

Thank you for that post. I almost went with party atheist but hey I like to party with my friends by the pool. :-) So yeah in general terms I am in the middle somewhere far from the extremes. In personal conduct I’m pretty conservative in big ways. How I run our finances, how I treat my long marriage. Pro Second Amendment as an individual right. I’m liberal in social policy. Gay marriage, marijuana use, how to regard other cultures.

Yup, as I tried to point out above, this is spectacle not substance. Frankly I’m sick of msm spectacle and starved for msm substance. I’m fed up with having to swim hyperbole muddied waters to point out the P.A. needs to be ended. Sunsetted as promised. Show the world this is not our Forever war.

At some point we will regain the confidence that we can thrive despite terrorists. Remember that we are in fact able to counter terror without the temporary and extraordinary measures adopted when we reared a weekly 9/11. Start to turn away from using Patriot Act provisos for the ill advised and run war on drugs. Start to think real warrants in open court can get the job done. Secret courts are a bad thing for democracies.

All that having been said, that rally is a freak show and a disgrace to sensible policy discussion.

201 Charles Johnson  Sat, Oct 26, 2013 12:43:56pm
202 Absalom, Absalom, Obdicut  Sat, Oct 26, 2013 12:45:07pm

re: #200 Political Atheist

You don’t have to swim anything to point out that the PA should be sunsetted, though. That’s a perfectly mainstream position.

203 PhillyPretzel  Sat, Oct 26, 2013 12:47:10pm

OT I am still downloading Mavericks. 3.75 GB of 5.29 GB. I hope this is worth it.

204 Backwoods_Sleuth  Sat, Oct 26, 2013 12:51:12pm

re: #180 Charles Johnson

“proggy smear jobs”…
yep, that’s real grownup talk…

/*spit*

205 wrenchwench  Sat, Oct 26, 2013 12:53:15pm

re: #204 Backwoods_Sleuth

“proggy smear jobs”…
yep, that’s real grownup talk…

/*spit*

He forgot ‘croc-wearing’ **Gasp** Maybe he also wears crocs!!1!

206 ObserverArt  Sat, Oct 26, 2013 12:54:39pm

re: #170 Political Atheist

Sure, I was talking about the rally, not the congress. As said above a spectacle that fails to include the real substance. Too full of “Obama is a (fill in as per whatever sign)” and ban the NSA. Too much derp, too little reason.

Reason. Hell, so many people have been scared that everyone in Washington is reading their lame internet crap and no one has had time to read and try to understand how the whole NSA spying system actually works. How do you expect substance when no one really knows the first detail? All they have is emotion. All this rally and most rallies are just that…emotion.

And as far as the puppets, and all that. It is nearing Halloween. Who knows, that drone might make it out to a drunken apartment complex mash up tonight and get used next weekend too.

207 Ming  Sat, Oct 26, 2013 12:54:58pm

re: #187 thedopefishlives

His question is conditional on the R’s actually winning the White House. Which, considering the absolute torpedoing of their own credibility that they’ve been doing, is not likely to happen any time in the next, oh, half-century.

I wish I could share your confidence, but I’m cautious about 2016. If you look at who’s been President since Truman, it’s interesting how regular the oscillation is, back and forth between Democrat and Republicans. Starting with Eisenhower: 8R - 8D - 8R - 4D - 12R - 8D - 8R - 8D (so far for Obama). Seems like many voters just kinda feel that one party has been in power for a long time, and it’s time for a change.

I know the Republicans have alienated many people who aren’t white, male, well-to-do, and batshit insane. But they also have lots of control in some state legislatures and state houses, and in 2016 they will fight for every electoral vote.

So I’m afraid the 2016 presidential election may be a nail-biter. But believe me, I hope you’re right and I’m wrong.

208 LGF Subscription: Breathes Like Egyptian Cotton  Sat, Oct 26, 2013 12:55:34pm

Do they really think some middle aged guy named ‘Bob’, who works at the NSA, really gives a $#*^ what porn sites they subscribe to or what level they’re on with Candy Crush?

209 Charles Johnson  Sat, Oct 26, 2013 12:55:55pm

re: #205 wrenchwench

He forgot ‘croc-wearing’ **Gasp** Maybe he also wears crocs!!1!

I’m actually wearing Crocs RIGHT NOW.

210 thedopefishlives  Sat, Oct 26, 2013 12:56:16pm

re: #209 Charles Johnson

I’m actually wearing Crocs RIGHT NOW.

Of course you are, you hippie.///

211 Political Atheist  Sat, Oct 26, 2013 12:56:53pm

re: #192 Absalom, Absalom, Obdicut

No, I don’t. I have no idea why you keep asserting these things. Nothing I said can be reasonably interpreted as ‘the changes the PA made don’t matter’.

You said ” Very little attention to reasonable efforts to assess the legalities and return to our previous civil protections. ” I’m asking what those previous civil protections are/were. I’m also unclear as to how this relates to this rally.

Okay, well, last resort is a pretty inaccurate term, then. “Last resort” carries the meaning of desperation. You should probably use a term that doesn’t have the meaning of ‘desperation’ if you don’t mean desperation.

My apologies. I have been unable to make my point clearly to you.

I have answered you about previous civil protections. That would be the law as it stood before the P.A. The rally is a very visible example of spectacle over substance. A minute for the ACLU, hours of derp and dudebro crap.

And last resort is a reasonable term to use the way I used it. I stand by it. Methinks you try too hard to find points of disagreement with somewhat novel or highly skeptical interpretations of my words. I wrote about the rally you seemed to take my meaning as congress. I object to reduced civil protections as per the P,A. and you seemed to take it as a complaint about decades of FBI policy. I said last resort because court’s are the last stop in a challenge to a law of the land. Like that DC gun law that fell.

Well we each have our views. They differ.

212 Absalom, Absalom, Obdicut  Sat, Oct 26, 2013 12:57:03pm

re: #209 Charles Johnson

I’m actually wearing Crocs RIGHT NOW.

Dude, not cool.

213 thedopefishlives  Sat, Oct 26, 2013 12:58:13pm

re: #207 Ming

I’m sure you’re probably more right than I am. I’m not expecting a major Democratic landslide or anything. But if the winds of political fortune continue to blow against the Republicans, it just might be. The problem is that it’s more dependent on who has the bigger downfall during the election year, rather than the 3 years preceding. One bad incident in 2016 could doom the Democrats, no matter how much political terrorism has gone on in the interim.

214 Aqua Obama  Sat, Oct 26, 2013 12:58:23pm

re: #3 b.d.

I noticed that DailyKos is listed as a sponsor but they haven’t muttered one word about it in any of their front paged posts.

Nach Hitler Obama, uns!

215 Absalom, Absalom, Obdicut  Sat, Oct 26, 2013 12:59:15pm

re: #211 Political Atheist

My apologies. I have been unable to make my point clearly to you.

I have answered you about previous civil protections. That would be the law as it stood before the P.A.

The way that the P.A. affected the 4th amendment was not mostly in the passage of the law, but the unpholding of provisions in the Supreme Court.

And last resort is a reasonable term to use the way I used it.

It’s not. “last resort” always carries the meaning of desperation. This is a dumb place to make a stand. Just look it up.

I wrote about the rally you seemed to take my meaning as congress.

That was someone else.

I object to reduced civil protections as per the P,A. and you seemed to take it as a complaint about decades of FBI policy.

No, I didn’t. I asked what were the protections that existed prior, since the court has regularly upheld things such as FBI infiltration. I never in any way said you were complaining about FBI policy, in the least.

216 Political Atheist  Sat, Oct 26, 2013 12:59:28pm

re: #202 Absalom, Absalom, Obdicut

You don’t have to swim anything to point out that the PA should be sunsetted, though. That’s a perfectly mainstream position.

You realize that would probably remove or at least seriously undermine the legal underpinning for the NSA domestic meta data logging right? Not sure but that seems to be the case.

217 Absalom, Absalom, Obdicut  Sat, Oct 26, 2013 12:59:50pm

re: #216 Political Atheist

You realize that would probably remove or at least seriously undermine the legal underpinning for the NSA domestic meta data logging right? Not sure but that seems to be the case.

No, the legal underpinning for the NSA domestic metadata logging comes from pen registers.

218 wrenchwench  Sat, Oct 26, 2013 1:00:04pm

re: #209 Charles Johnson

I’m actually wearing Crocs RIGHT NOW.

AIEEEEEEE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

***Flounce***

this has been a test of the emergency flounce system. If this had been an actual flounce it would have been deleted by now. We return you to our regular programming…..

219 PhillyPretzel  Sat, Oct 26, 2013 1:01:00pm

re: #218 wrenchwench

lol. Thanks I needed a good laugh. :)

220 Tim TeaBro  Sat, Oct 26, 2013 1:01:22pm

Infidel Defilers Croc wearers. They shall all drown get wet toes in lakes of blood bong water.

221 thedopefishlives  Sat, Oct 26, 2013 1:01:25pm

re: #218 wrenchwench

AIEEEEEEE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

***Flounce***

this has been a test of the emergency flounce system. If this had been an actual flounce it would have been deleted by now. We return you to our regular programming…..

Your flounce was not emo-dramatic enough. Needs more eleventy.

222 Charles Johnson  Sat, Oct 26, 2013 1:02:08pm

I like Crocs. What’s wrong with Crocs? Now my feelings are hurt.

223 ObserverArt  Sat, Oct 26, 2013 1:02:36pm

re: #209 Charles Johnson

I’m actually wearing Crocs RIGHT NOW.

Ex neocons wear Crocs?

224 Political Atheist  Sat, Oct 26, 2013 1:02:40pm

re: #215 Absalom, Absalom, Obdicut

It’s not. “last resort” always carries the meaning of desperation. This is a dumb place to make a stand. Just look it up.

Okay I looked it up.

Last Resort

A court, such as the U.S. Supreme Court, from which there is no further appeal of a judgment rendered by it in review of a decision in a civil or criminal action by a lower court.

In most jurisdictions, the state’s court of last resort is called the supreme court. This name differs in some jurisdictions, however. For example, the court of last resort in New York is the New York Court of Appeals, while the trial-level court is called the Supreme Court. In Texas, the court of last resort for civil trials is the Texas Supreme Court, but the highest court for criminal appeals is the Texas Court of Criminal Appeals. The state of Texas is rather unusual because it employs two courts of last resort to hear appeals.
West’s Encyclopedia of American Law, edition 2. Copyright 2008 The Gale Group, Inc. All rights reserved.

Looks reasonable to me.

225 Tim TeaBro  Sat, Oct 26, 2013 1:03:37pm

re: #222 Charles Johnson

You’re asking a dude who wears flops 98% of the time.

226 wrenchwench  Sat, Oct 26, 2013 1:04:11pm

re: #221 thedopefishlives

Your flounce was not emo-dramatic enough. Needs more eleventy.

How’s this:

¡1¡11¡¡¡¡¡AyayayayEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!1!11!!!!!!!!11!!!!!!!!

************FLOUNCE************

227 Romantic Heretic  Sat, Oct 26, 2013 1:04:18pm

re: #106 HappyWarrior

Agh. Before I got my current job, I did some applications like that. Those are the worst. I mean I get that they don’t want drug users on the job but I hate how they basically want you to say that you’d shame someone who was smoking pot and it not impacting their work.

I once applied for a job that asked, “Are you now or have you ever been a member of the Communist Party or other political group that advocates the overthrow of the Canadian government by violence?”

My answer? “None of your fucking business!”

I didn’t get the job for some strange reason.

228 wrenchwench  Sat, Oct 26, 2013 1:04:50pm

re: #225 Tim TeaBro

You’re asking a dude who wears flops 98% of the time.

Must be a Hawaiian thing.

229 thedopefishlives  Sat, Oct 26, 2013 1:05:07pm

re: #226 wrenchwench

How’s this:

¡1¡11¡¡¡¡¡AyayayayEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!1!11!!!!!!!!11!!!!!!!!

************FLOUNCE************

Now we’re getting somewhere.

230 Absalom, Absalom, Obdicut  Sat, Oct 26, 2013 1:05:49pm

re: #224 Political Atheist

That’s the ‘last resort’ in terms of courts, though, not in terms of the way that the court interacts with the other branches. It’s not the last resort compared to congress, it’s the last resort because there’s no court higher than it.

In other words, if the Supreme Court rules against you, you don’t have any other resort of appeal. It doesn’t mean that you can’t, say, pass another law with substantially the same effect but modified to fit constitutionality.

231 Tim TeaBro  Sat, Oct 26, 2013 1:05:54pm

I think Crocs are for people who are afraid to go ALL THE WAY to flops.

232 Tim TeaBro  Sat, Oct 26, 2013 1:06:27pm

re: #228 wrenchwench

Must be a Hawaiian thing.

Should call them slippahs but you mainlanders wouldn’t likely get it.

233 HappyWarrior  Sat, Oct 26, 2013 1:06:51pm

Boat shoes ftw.

234 Political Atheist  Sat, Oct 26, 2013 1:07:34pm

re: #217 Absalom, Absalom, Obdicut

No, the legal underpinning for the NSA domestic metadata logging comes from pen registers.

The ACLU has come to a different conclusion, and I agree with them.

The government’s new surveillance programs have infiltrated most of the communications technologies we have come to rely on. They are largely enabled by two problematic laws passed by Congress under a national security premise: the Patriot Act and the FISA Amendments Act (FAA). While the Foreign Intelligence Surveillance Court (FISC) is supposed to oversee the government’s surveillance activities, it operates in near-total secrecy through one-sided procedures that heavily favor the government.

235 wrenchwench  Sat, Oct 26, 2013 1:08:26pm

re: #233 HappyWarrior

Boat shoes ftw.

Yuppie.

If it were still 1986, anyway.

236 Political Atheist  Sat, Oct 26, 2013 1:09:11pm

re: #230 Absalom, Absalom, Obdicut

So now you understand what I meant, or not?

237 wrenchwench  Sat, Oct 26, 2013 1:09:41pm

re: #232 Tim TeaBro

Should call them slippahs but you mainlanders wouldn’t likely get it.

I would expect bunnies if you said that.

238 Absalom, Absalom, Obdicut  Sat, Oct 26, 2013 1:10:22pm

re: #234 Political Atheist

The ACLU has come to a different conclusion, and I agree with them.

Do you know what the history of the pen registers are, and how they relate to metadata collection?

239 Tim TeaBro  Sat, Oct 26, 2013 1:11:01pm

re: #237 wrenchwench

I would expect bunnies if you said that.

RALPHIE!

240 Absalom, Absalom, Obdicut  Sat, Oct 26, 2013 1:11:51pm

re: #236 Political Atheist

So now you understand what I meant, or not?

Not really, no.

My point is: The state of the 4th amendment is determined much more by court decisions than it is by the passage of laws. Your point, in so far as I understand it, seems to be disagreeing with that, saying that the P.A. isn’t been repealed because whackjobs like the people holding the rally are sapping the will to repeal it. I’m not sure, though, that that’s your actual argument.

241 Tim TeaBro  Sat, Oct 26, 2013 1:12:52pm

re: #220 Tim TeaBro

Infidel Defilers Croc wearers. They shall all drown get wet toes in lakes of blood bong water.

I wan’t rippin you for smoking weed. There was a potential Conan The Barbarian quote/proggy Croc wearing stereotype vine in there and I did my best.

242 Charles Johnson  Sat, Oct 26, 2013 1:13:51pm

re: #240 Absalom, Absalom, Obdicut

I notice the CEI mouthpiece on Twitter is now falling back on personal insults. Good work.

243 Charles Johnson  Sat, Oct 26, 2013 1:15:36pm

I also notice he doesn’t seem to want to engage with me any more. Woe is me.

244 Political Atheist  Sat, Oct 26, 2013 1:16:14pm

re: #238 Absalom, Absalom, Obdicut

Somewhat, not exhaustive. I found this though. I confess I am leaning on the work of the legal people at the ACLU.

USA PATRIOT Act

Section 216 of the 2001 USA PATRIOT Act expanded the definition of a pen register to include devices or programs that provide an analogous function with internet communications. Prior to the Patriot Act, it was unclear whether or not the definition of a pen register, which included very specific telephone terminology, could apply to internet communications. Most courts and law enforcement personnel operated under the assumption that it did, however the Clinton administration had begun to work on legislation to make that clear, and one magistrate judge in California did rule that the language was too telephone-specific to apply to Internet surveillance.

245 Tim TeaBro  Sat, Oct 26, 2013 1:17:43pm

I would not want to get tag teamed by CJ and Obdicut.

246 Absalom, Absalom, Obdicut  Sat, Oct 26, 2013 1:17:44pm

re: #244 Political Atheist

Right. So, the law expanded it and the court ruled and found that constitutional. So even if the law was repealed, the constitutionality of metadata collection would remain, correct?

247 wrenchwench  Sat, Oct 26, 2013 1:18:16pm


It moves in Tweetdeck. You’ll have to click the link to see it.

248 goddamnedfrank  Sat, Oct 26, 2013 1:18:42pm

re: #234 Political Atheist

The ACLU has come to a different conclusion, and I agree with them.

That statement is so overbroad and full of knowns flaws as to be useless. There’s no actual confirmation that they’re including the metadata program or even talking about it. They say the NSA is regularly tracking all calls made by and to Americans, when the difference is they’ve been made trackable, putting the metadata in a database that requires a separate warrant to access. The word metadata isn’t even mentioned in that ACLU writeup. Lastly and most obviously, ignoring everything else “largely enabled” doesn’t mean entirely made possible by.

I love the ACLU, but if you’re on their list, getting their Facebook feeds, etc. then you know that they’re playing very fast and loose with the facts of the NSA spying program, and fundraising furiously off of it.

249 thedopefishlives  Sat, Oct 26, 2013 1:19:22pm

re: #243 Charles Johnson

I also notice he doesn’t seem to want to engage with me any more. Woe is me.

Aww. Does the little wingnut not like getting beaten in a battle of wits?

250 Political Atheist  Sat, Oct 26, 2013 1:19:26pm

re: #240 Absalom, Absalom, Obdicut

Not really, no.

My point is: The state of the 4th amendment is determined much more by court decisions than it is by the passage of laws. Your point, in so far as I understand it, seems to be disagreeing with that, saying that the P.A. isn’t been repealed because whackjobs like the people holding the rally are sapping the will to repeal it. I’m not sure, though, that that’s your actual argument.

I understand that view. I am saying the energy expended in and for the rally is a waste. The rhetoric makes it harder not easier to lobby or argue for rational change. Spectacle instead of substance. Seems a shame to me.

251 Tim TeaBro  Sat, Oct 26, 2013 1:19:50pm

re: #247 wrenchwench

Mandvi’s slow eye roll to the camera was comic gold. Still makes me LOL and I’ve seen it ten times.

252 Political Atheist  Sat, Oct 26, 2013 1:21:14pm

re: #248 goddamnedfrank

If you dig into the detail, the legal arguments come out. I don’t get their FB feed. I go digging for myself in their site.

BRB folks

253 Amory Blaine  Sat, Oct 26, 2013 1:21:16pm

re: #193 Bulworth

Ah well, this Liberal was not at the Teabag-ANSWER rally today. Instead, I went to Home Depot to buy a new washer and dryer and to arrange to have my basement carpeted. I’m such a sellout.

Turn in your sickle at processing center #428.

254 Absalom, Absalom, Obdicut  Sat, Oct 26, 2013 1:22:19pm

re: #250 Political Atheist

Well yeah, the lobby is a waste. But it’s not stopping actual reform, like the appointments of Kagan and Sotomayor.

255 Charles Johnson  Sat, Oct 26, 2013 1:22:51pm

My Tweetdeck global filter’s getting a real work-out today. I’ve got the dudebros all worked up and now that chowderhead at “Weasel Zippers” has posted some kind of stupid attack.

256 wrenchwench  Sat, Oct 26, 2013 1:23:06pm

This could serve as a metaphor for everything.

Youtube Video

257 b_sharp  Sat, Oct 26, 2013 1:26:39pm

re: #209 Charles Johnson

I’m actually wearing Crocs RIGHT NOW.

I am terribly disturbed.

258 Tim TeaBro  Sat, Oct 26, 2013 1:28:14pm

Croc’er; (crock - er) ;
a person who is wearing Crocs

259 wrenchwench  Sat, Oct 26, 2013 1:28:46pm

re: #257 b_sharp

I am terribly disturbed.

He didn’t say JUST Crocs…..

260 Amory Blaine  Sat, Oct 26, 2013 1:29:11pm

Crocs on my feet would breed a strain of bacteria so heinous it would bring the end times.

261 Charles Johnson  Sat, Oct 26, 2013 1:32:48pm
262 PhillyPretzel  Sat, Oct 26, 2013 1:32:53pm

Finally, one more GB to download. This has been a long day. It is a good thing that I do not do too much downloading.

263 b_sharp  Sat, Oct 26, 2013 1:33:21pm

re: #259 wrenchwench

He didn’t say JUST Crocs…..

Oh, then I am mostly, but not totally disturbed.

264 Gus  Sat, Oct 26, 2013 1:33:41pm

Hey. Thanks to #StopWatchingUs look who I got to meet!


How fitting. Bad craziness brings out the crazies.

265 Political Atheist  Sat, Oct 26, 2013 1:34:32pm

re: #246 Absalom, Absalom, Obdicut

Right. So, the law expanded it and the court ruled and found that constitutional. So even if the law was repealed, the constitutionality of metadata collection would remain, correct?

I would only agree it could go either way after several hearings at higher courts. What investigation is the logging of any individuals data relevant to?

266 Gus  Sat, Oct 26, 2013 1:35:36pm

#StopWatchingUs = clusterfuck of rat fucking fringe element lunatics.

267 Absalom, Absalom, Obdicut  Sat, Oct 26, 2013 1:36:03pm

re: #265 Political Atheist

I would only agree it could go either way after several hearings at higher courts.

I do not understand. The court has ruled on the metadata collection already, and said that it’s a-ok. How could it go either way?

What investigation is the logging of any individuals data relevant to?

Did you mean metadata or data? Either way, I still don’t know what you’re asking.

268 b_sharp  Sat, Oct 26, 2013 1:37:13pm

re: #262 PhillyPretzel

Finally, one more GB to download. This has been a long day. It is a good thing that I do not do too much downloading.

Time to download some Scotch.

269 simoom  Sat, Oct 26, 2013 1:37:57pm

Another photo of the CodePink contingent:

KimDotCom financed transportation:

270 PhillyPretzel  Sat, Oct 26, 2013 1:38:08pm

re: #268 b_sharp

I have a frosty seltzer waiting for me when I get done.

271 Tim TeaBro  Sat, Oct 26, 2013 1:39:58pm

Does a bear shit in the woods conservative Twitter blogger whine about the media not paying attention to some BS story?

272 b_sharp  Sat, Oct 26, 2013 1:41:13pm

re: #269 simoom

Another photo of the CodePink contingent:

[Embedded content]

Doesn’t spying imply the collection and analysis of specific data, not the mass collection of meta data.

273 jvic  Sat, Oct 26, 2013 1:42:42pm

Crocs are good. Garlic is good.

I do not recommend rubbing your feet with garlic before putting on Crocs(*). I do not recommend dicing your Crocs and adding them to your food.

To everything there is a season(ing).

(*) There are a misguided few for whose feet this would be an improvement, but none such, I’m sure, among the readers here.

274 Lago  Sat, Oct 26, 2013 1:43:00pm

re: #18 b.d.

Actually, that’s true. But only certain kinds of cell phones. There are hacks that allow them to be turned on remotely. This is why they aren’t allowed in classified facilities, even if they are turned off.

275 Backwoods_Sleuth  Sat, Oct 26, 2013 1:44:21pm

re: #242 Charles Johnson

I notice the CEI mouthpiece on Twitter is now falling back on personal insults. Good work.

I bet he’s related to Prudence…

276 Charles Johnson  Sat, Oct 26, 2013 1:45:38pm
277 blueraven  Sat, Oct 26, 2013 1:45:53pm

re: #266 Gus

#StopWatchingUs = clusterfuck of rat fucking fringe element lunatics.

BroBaggers are Bigots

278 Political Atheist  Sat, Oct 26, 2013 1:47:38pm

re: #267 Absalom, Absalom, Obdicut

I do not understand. The court has ruled on the metadata collection already, and said that it’s a-ok. How could it go either way?

Did you mean metadata or data? Either way, I still don’t know what you’re asking.

Do you mean the FISA court ruling? They can hide in secrecy but that is hardly the last word on the matter.

You might want to look at the ACLU lawsuit challenge. Oh and I mean metadata, the stuff we all agree the NSA does keep from domestic calls.

279 Charles Johnson  Sat, Oct 26, 2013 1:50:01pm
280 Lago  Sat, Oct 26, 2013 1:50:17pm

So, here’s one subtlety to all this. There are people who work for the Intelligence Community who are okay with protests like this because it perpetuates the myth that the IC can do a whole lot more than it can.

281 Political Atheist  Sat, Oct 26, 2013 1:52:06pm

Well Obdi, we might have exchanged more useful info today right here than that whole freakshow rally. At least we don’t hide behind rhetoric and stupid signs. 23,17 views as I type this. More views than people at the rally?

282 goddamnedfrank  Sat, Oct 26, 2013 1:52:38pm

re: #265 Political Atheist

I would only agree it could go either way after several hearings at higher courts. What investigation is the logging of any individuals data relevant to?

This is one of those questions that can only be examined in hindsight. I imagine that after the Boston Marathon bombing most people were glad that the Tsarnaev brothers’ cell phone contacts were in the database, and their contacts’ contacts, recursively.

283 Absalom, Absalom, Obdicut  Sat, Oct 26, 2013 1:53:08pm

re: #278 Political Atheist

Do you mean the FISA court ruling?

I mean the Supreme Court’s rulings on FISA, pen registers, the Stored Communications Act, and other 3rd party doctrine stuff.

My point is that even if you repealed the P.A., the constituionality of metadata collection has already been ruled on and it’s been ruled to be okay. To reverse that would take judicial rulings, not a change to the law.

You might want to look at the ACLU lawsuit challenge. Oh and I mean metadata, the stuff we all agree the NSA does keep from domestic calls.

Okay. Still don’t know what you’re asking. Can you rephrase it?

284 Charles Johnson  Sat, Oct 26, 2013 1:55:31pm
285 ObserverArt  Sat, Oct 26, 2013 1:55:45pm

re: #281 Political Atheist

Well Obdi, we might have exchanged more useful info today right here than that whole freakshow rally. At least we don’t hide behind rhetoric and stupid signs. 23,17 views as I type this. More views than people at the rally?

Heh, I was just going to comment that you two are having a good debate and I wonder if any at that protest rally have even come close to that level of digging and discussing.

286 AlexRogan  Sat, Oct 26, 2013 1:56:58pm

re: #284 Charles Johnson

And LGF is the magnifying glass.

287 ObserverArt  Sat, Oct 26, 2013 1:58:19pm

re: #282 goddamnedfrank

This is one of those questions that can only be examined in hindsight. I imagine that after the Boston Marathon bombing most people were glad that the Tsarnaev brothers’ cell phone contacts were in the database, and their contacts’ contacts, recursively.

I would hope you are right about that. Sadly I have a feeling too many have never even put something like that together. Again. Emotion gets in the way of reason. And emotion is easy. Lash out…feel good. If you have to think this all through you end up running out of emotion and you miss the rally.

288 b_sharp  Sat, Oct 26, 2013 2:00:24pm

re: #285 ObserverArt

Heh, I was just going to comment that you two are having a good debate and I wonder if any at that protest rally have even come close to that level of digging and discussing.

Meh. Where’s the blood, the hand to hand and the car chase?

289 goddamnedfrank  Sat, Oct 26, 2013 2:00:57pm

re: #283 Absalom, Absalom, Obdicut

To reverse that would take judicial rulings, not a change to the law.

The legislature can make legal, constitutional tools inaccessible to law enforcement, independent of the courts. So the question then becomes is the language in the P.A. the only law that authorizes the metadata program. Or alternatively, can the metadata program continue to operate absent any specific law authorizing it, relying solely on past court rulings that were themselves predicated on the existence of such laws to some degree.

290 thedopefishlives  Sat, Oct 26, 2013 2:01:52pm

re: #285 ObserverArt

Heh, I was just going to comment that you two are having a good debate and I wonder if any at that protest rally have even come close to that level of digging and discussing.

Highly unlikely. Wingnuts and dudebros operate entirely from emotion, logic need not apply.

291 jvic  Sat, Oct 26, 2013 2:03:27pm

re: #79 Political Atheist

…When you dismiss the other side with a perjorative, obviously the mind is closed to open consideration of the other side.

A finesse on that is to combine your reply to the other side with an insult, perhaps a borderline one.

This is one mechanism whereby groupthink emerges in online communities.

292 Political Atheist  Sat, Oct 26, 2013 2:04:28pm

re: #283 Absalom, Absalom, Obdicut

Well first things first. Let’s watch the ACLU lawsuit and how that goes. It’s underway. Their legal people argue well for a P.A. underpinning of the NSA logging. Good people obviously differ.

I don’t see any major or executive legislative inclination to keep the promise of the sunset. So that may have to come way later, and then we’ll have to see how it goes all over again vis a vis the NSA.

I’d like to see some open court hearings on relevance as used, or abused depending on who you ask. That alone could curtail domestic metadata logging absent a specific relevance to an investigation. It’s going to be all about the courts, open ones I hope not secret ones.

And a new yet related subject-The no fly list. Might not survive and end to the PA. Might not survive a constitutional challenge based on punishment without trial. Certainly deserves a bigger better hearing.

293 Absalom, Absalom, Obdicut  Sat, Oct 26, 2013 2:04:39pm

re: #289 goddamnedfrank

The legislature can make legal, constitutional tools inaccessible to law enforcement, independent of the courts.

Yeah, but my point is that the legislature can Just switch that right back again, if they want to.

So the question then becomes is the language in the P.A. the only law that authorizes the metadata program. Or alternatively, can the metadata program continue to operate absent any specific law authorizing it, relying solely on past court rulings that were themselves predicated on the existence of such laws to some degree.

This is where this all flies completely outside of my realm of knowledge. To what extent are the activities of the FBI, the DOJ, etc. established by legislation and to what extent are they executivized? I figure it’s broad legislative strokes and most of the interpretation is done on the executive side, but I don’t really know.

294 Gus  Sat, Oct 26, 2013 2:09:37pm
295 Lidane  Sat, Oct 26, 2013 2:17:17pm

re: #294 Gus

A Tea Party protest with extra dudebro added. Fun times.

////

296 dog philosopher  Sat, Oct 26, 2013 2:25:49pm

my firebagger buddies don’t even seem to be aware of the demonstration

297 Charles Johnson  Sat, Oct 26, 2013 2:28:58pm
298 Lidane  Sat, Oct 26, 2013 2:29:54pm

Laser like focus on the real issues:

299 Charles Johnson  Sat, Oct 26, 2013 2:30:59pm

re: #298 Lidane

More importantly - what color are her countertops?

300 Gus  Sat, Oct 26, 2013 2:31:38pm

Don’t call us! Coit-us!

301 Lidane  Sat, Oct 26, 2013 2:31:48pm

re: #298 Lidane

Also, for the musically inclined among us, Jim Roberts is currently debating the best live album on his Twitter TL. Some interesting choices being thrown around over there.

302 Tim TeaBro  Sat, Oct 26, 2013 2:31:56pm

You know that we can hear you, right?

Assif Mandvi

303 jaunte  Sat, Oct 26, 2013 2:32:12pm

re: #298 Lidane

Scandal! She’s smiling, but not even American!!!

304 Interesting Times  Sat, Oct 26, 2013 2:33:12pm

re: #293 Absalom, Absalom, Obdicut

You might consider weighing in on this thread. I know in the past you’ve addressed the types of points made in the most recent comment, but I can’t remember exactly how your argument went.

305 Political Atheist  Sat, Oct 26, 2013 2:40:51pm

re: #248 goddamnedfrank

That statement is so overbroad and full of knowns flaws as to be useless. There’s no actual confirmation that they’re including the metadata program or even talking about it. They say the NSA is regularly tracking all calls made by and to Americans, when the difference is they’ve been made trackable, putting the metadata in a database that requires a separate warrant to access. The word metadata isn’t even mentioned in that ACLU writeup. Lastly and most obviously, ignoring everything else “largely enabled” doesn’t mean entirely made possible by.

I love the ACLU, but if you’re on their list, getting their Facebook feeds, etc. then you know that they’re playing very fast and loose with the facts of the NSA spying program, and fundraising furiously off of it.

Here is the link for a detailed review of their position.

The ACLU has filed a lawsuit challenging the constitutionality of the National Security Agency’s mass collection of Americans’ phone records. The complaint argues that the dragnet, justified by the Patriot Act’s Section 215, violates the right of privacy protected by the Fourth Amendment as well as the First Amendment rights of free speech and association. The complaint also charges that the program exceeds the authority that Congress provided through the Patriot Act. The lawsuit seeks to end the mass domestic spying and have all of the collected data deleted. Oral argument on the ACLU’s motion for a preliminary injunction and the government’s motion to dismiss is scheduled for November 22 in New York.
View all of the documents filed in the case>>

306 dog philosopher  Sat, Oct 26, 2013 2:42:00pm

re: #264 Gus

Instead of waffling, prove that they are not progs/commies!

easy

progs eat granola, not waffles

307 Dark_Falcon  Sat, Oct 26, 2013 2:43:21pm

re: #28 ProTARDISLiberal

Wait a second, that was part of the plot for The Dark Knight.

Why is he having an issue differentiating real-life from movies.

Because he thinks he can get away with the lie and earn some cheap political points. For many politicians that’s reason enough.

308 Gus  Sat, Oct 26, 2013 2:43:34pm

re: #306 dog philosopher

easy

progs eat granola, not waffles

Cracked me up. Yeah, I’m spoiled. Hahahaha! I wish. Tantrum? I was passing out from my snack binge. :D

309 jaunte  Sat, Oct 26, 2013 2:44:16pm

re: #264 Gus

Hey. Thanks to #StopWatchingUs look who I got to meet!

[Embedded content]


How fitting. Bad craziness brings out the crazies.

X is true because there is no proof that X is false!!!

310 Interesting Times  Sat, Oct 26, 2013 2:44:49pm

re: #303 jaunte

Scandal! She’s smiling, but not even American!!!

Isn’t it just a stock photo anyway?

311 Dark_Falcon  Sat, Oct 26, 2013 2:45:11pm

re: #306 dog philosopher

easy

progs eat granola, not waffles

That’s too bad, because bacon waffles are tasty. ;)

312 dog philosopher  Sat, Oct 26, 2013 2:45:14pm

re: #298 Lidane

Laser like focus on the real issues:

Media can’t ID Obamacare girl

most likely it will turn out to be a generic photo available from a commercial source

313 jaunte  Sat, Oct 26, 2013 2:45:33pm

re: #310 Interesting Times

It might have been shot just for the site, and that’s why they can’t find the stock image.

314 jaunte  Sat, Oct 26, 2013 2:46:32pm

An original photograph? Unprecedented!

315 piratedan  Sat, Oct 26, 2013 2:48:08pm

so essentially this protest is a The Warriors like congregation of all the fringe groups that share anti-government sentiments…. which group has to bop their way back to Coney Island”?

316 Dark_Falcon  Sat, Oct 26, 2013 2:50:26pm

re: #315 piratedan

so essentially this protest is a The Warriors like congregation of all the fringe groups that are ant-government sentiments…. which group has to bop their way back to Coney Island”?

None of these loons could fight their way out of a wet paper bag.

317 Charles Johnson  Sat, Oct 26, 2013 2:51:56pm
318 Gus  Sat, Oct 26, 2013 2:55:15pm

re: #317 Charles Johnson

[Embedded content]

Hmm. Not sure but that looks like a plastic baby.

319 wrenchwench  Sat, Oct 26, 2013 2:55:23pm

re: #317 Charles Johnson

[Embedded content]

No steering, no brakes, no safety leash, no helmet on the kid, and that harness looks pretty loose.

320 Gus  Sat, Oct 26, 2013 2:55:43pm

Although it could be rubberized plastic.

321 wrenchwench  Sat, Oct 26, 2013 2:56:59pm

re: #320 Gus

Although it could be rubberized plastic.

So it doesn’t injure the person it hits.

322 Romantic Heretic  Sat, Oct 26, 2013 2:57:52pm

re: #203 PhillyPretzel

OT I am still downloading Mavericks. 3.75 GB of 5.29 GB. I hope this is worth it.

I’m finding it that way. Once it’s downloaded it will take about another hour to install though.

But it’s been very stable, and I’m liking a lot of the changes. Especially the way you can now create tabs in the Finder window the same way you can in Safari. Displaying by file tags is nice also.

323 dog philosopher  Sat, Oct 26, 2013 2:58:06pm

re: #317 Charles Johnson

What could possibly go wrong?

much too easy for it to turn into a baby trebuchet

324 Gus  Sat, Oct 26, 2013 2:58:34pm

re: #321 wrenchwench

So it doesn’t injure the person it hits.

At least mom had the foresight to cut the umbilical cord after all this time. //

325 b.d.  Sat, Oct 26, 2013 2:58:43pm

[dudebagger] Have they quit watching us yet? Don’t make us break out those puppets again!! [/dudebagger]

326 wrenchwench  Sat, Oct 26, 2013 3:00:03pm

re: #324 Gus

At least mom had the foresight to cut the umbilical cord after all this time. //

Did she eat the plastic placenta?

327 Charles Johnson  Sat, Oct 26, 2013 3:02:23pm

Several speakers at the Moronic Convergence rally actually demanded that the NSA be shut down, including Dennis Kucinich.

Shut down? Really?

Are these people truly this self-absorbed and naive that they think you could completely shut down America’s foreign intelligence network and suffer no ill effects? Or that things would be better in any way?

Shit like this can make you despair for the future of the human race.

328 Charles Johnson  Sat, Oct 26, 2013 3:04:11pm
329 wrenchwench  Sat, Oct 26, 2013 3:04:48pm

re: #327 Charles Johnson

Several speakers at the Moronic Convergence rally actually demanded that the NSA be shut down, including Dennis Kucinich.

Shut down? Really?

Are these people truly this self-absorbed and naive that they think you could completely shut down America’s foreign intelligence network and suffer no ill effects? Or that things would be better in any way?

Shit like this can make you despair for the future of the human race.

I still have hope, because the Kucinich bumper sticker in the neighborhood has FINALLY been removed from the Datsun.

330 b.d.  Sat, Oct 26, 2013 3:05:03pm

re: #327 Charles Johnson

Several speakers at the Moronic Convergence rally actually demanded that the NSA be shut down, including Dennis Kucinich.

Shut down? Really?

Are these people truly this self-absorbed and naive that they think you could completely shut down America’s foreign intelligence network and suffer no ill effects? Or that things would be better in any way?

Shit like this can make you despair for the future of the human race.

Shut down the IRS, End the Fed!!

Morons, the lot of them.

331 wrenchwench  Sat, Oct 26, 2013 3:05:41pm
332 Lidane  Sat, Oct 26, 2013 3:09:35pm

re: #327 Charles Johnson

Are these people truly this self-absorbed and naive that they think you could completely shut down America’s foreign intelligence network and suffer no ill effects? Or that things would be better in any way?

Yes.

Over-privileged, overly white dudebros need to be free, man. All that intel gathering just gets in the way.

////

333 Lidane  Sat, Oct 26, 2013 3:12:02pm

re: #330 b.d.

Shut down the IRS, End the Fed!!

Morons, the lot of them.

Everything would be so much better if government got out of the way and let the free market control the world!

Also, the United States is the only nation in the world that spies on people. Ever.

334 Dark_Falcon  Sat, Oct 26, 2013 3:14:33pm

re: #327 Charles Johnson

Several speakers at the Moronic Convergence rally actually demanded that the NSA be shut down, including Dennis Kucinich.

Shut down? Really?

Are these people truly this self-absorbed and naive that they think you could completely shut down America’s foreign intelligence network and suffer no ill effects? Or that things would be better in any way?

Shit like this can make you despair for the future of the human race.

“Let my whim be satisfied, cost be damned!” - The Battle Cry of the Dudbro

335 dog philosopher  Sat, Oct 26, 2013 3:14:45pm

“welcome to this important StopWatchingUs demonstration! we have gathered here to prove yet again that everything government does is bad, because government is essentially communist, especially obama, and leads inevitably to prison camps and bad food from east germany - and who wants to eat saurbraten for breakfast every day i ask you my fellow americans!!!

(cheers and applause)

now i see that there are a number of communist progressive hippies and elitists here, and i welcome them since their presence must mean that they are finally discarding their belief that gummint will solve all problems and that the fascist state should be used to insure equality of outcomes between white people and lazy welfare queens…”

336 Gus  Sat, Oct 26, 2013 3:15:11pm
337 First As Tragedy, Then As Farce  Sat, Oct 26, 2013 3:15:17pm

re: #333 Lidane

Everything would be so much better if government got out of the way and let the free market control the world!

Also, the United States is the only nation in the world that spies on people. Ever.

Along those lines, why not privatize the NSA? I can’t envision any problems with that.

338 PhillyPretzel  Sat, Oct 26, 2013 3:16:50pm

re: #336 Gus

lol.

339 jaunte  Sat, Oct 26, 2013 3:16:51pm

re: #336 Gus

Once all the Germans were warlike and mean,
But that couldn’t happen again.
We taught them a lesson in nineteen eighteen,
And they’ve hardly bothered us since then.
— Tom Lehrer, The MLF Lullaby

340 Lidane  Sat, Oct 26, 2013 3:20:23pm

re: #337 First As Tragedy, Then As Farce

Along those lines, why not privatize the NSA? I can’t envision any problems with that.

Heh.

Let’s just follow the dudebro/wingnut ideal and privatize everything — the NSA, the FBI, immigration, defense, the borders, the courts, the police, all emergency services and disaster relief, etc. Absolutely nothing could go wrong. Let everyone be free and let the almighty dudebros that can afford these things prosper. It’s their birthright, after all.

///

341 Charles Johnson  Sat, Oct 26, 2013 3:23:25pm

re: #203 PhillyPretzel

OT I am still downloading Mavericks. 3.75 GB of 5.29 GB. I hope this is worth it.

I love this upgrade for many reasons. There are some very noticeable performance improvements in things I use a lot, like Safari. Safari and Mail both launch a LOT faster the first time after a restart, which was getting incredibly bogged down (Safari would take several minutes to launch). And Safari’s Javascript engine has also taken another big leap in terms of speed and stability. I haven’t had a single crash with Safari 7 yet, and it was a fairly common occurrence with version 6.

(I know it won’t matter to most people, but the new Safari Web Inspector is just insanely awesome, too.)

The OS support for multiple monitors (I use 2) has finally been fixed, too, and really polished up so that it’s much more useable.

This isn’t a revolutionary new version, but it definitely is a step up.

342 b.d.  Sat, Oct 26, 2013 3:23:53pm

Next up we’re going to demand the Colonel Sanders’ divulge which 11 herbs and spices he uses and make McDonald’s release the recipe for the special sauce.

343 ObserverArt  Sat, Oct 26, 2013 3:24:27pm

re: #298 Lidane

Laser like focus on the real issues:

[ Jim Roberts ✔ @nycjim

Why does this matter? RT @theblaze: Media can’t ID Obamacare girl on front page of website bit.ly bit.ly
1:27 PM - 26 Oct 2013 ]

Anyone take a look at iStock photo?

344 Charles Johnson  Sat, Oct 26, 2013 3:24:44pm
345 b.d.  Sat, Oct 26, 2013 3:25:44pm

re: #343 ObserverArt

Anyone take a look at iStock photo?

Everything to do with that website has to do with Canada, they should start their search for her there.

346 Interesting Times  Sat, Oct 26, 2013 3:27:58pm

re: #345 b.d.

Everything to do with that website has to do with Canada, they should start their search for her there.

They’d better hurry…

347 Dark_Falcon  Sat, Oct 26, 2013 3:28:54pm

re: #343 ObserverArt

Anyone take a look at iStock photo?

The media isn’t going to try to ID the young lady because if her identity became known she’d be subject to a torrent of online and possible real-life abuse ranging from slut-shaming to threats of murder, to actual real-life assaults.

348 wrenchwench  Sat, Oct 26, 2013 3:31:00pm

re: #347 Dark_Falcon

The media isn’t going to try to ID the young lady because if her identity became known she’d be subject to a torrent of online and possible real-life abuse ranging from slut-shaming to threats of murder, to actual real-life assaults.

A threat of murder is an assault. If someone laid a hand on her (unwanted), that’s battery.

349 dog philosopher  Sat, Oct 26, 2013 3:34:09pm

re: #347 Dark_Falcon

The media isn’t going to try to ID the young lady because if her identity became known she’d be subject to a torrent of online and possible real-life abuse ranging from slut-shaming to threats of murder, to actual real-life assaults.

I Posed For Communists - The True Story!!!

reveals how government photographers forced to get on her knees and compare health plan coverages and deductables

350 Dark_Falcon  Sat, Oct 26, 2013 3:36:47pm

re: #348 wrenchwench

A threat of murder is an assault. If someone laid a hand on her (unwanted), that’s battery.

Understood. I was not trying to minimize the conduct of the haters or the harm that they do. I was only trying to reveal that the Onion headline PS posted in #346 may well not end up being a joke. The level of hate felt by some people towards Barack Obama and his health care law is so great that they may well decide to viciously harass or attack anyone they see as associated with it. There’s also the usual issue with men who get a major charge from forcing a woman into submission. This last can be properly described as being the same sort of mentality as that of a rapist.

351 ObserverArt  Sat, Oct 26, 2013 3:37:17pm

If her image was at iStock, she’d have signed a release so the photo would be totally iStock’s and I doubt they’d ever release the name and info on a model. Heck, that photo could be 10 or more years old. She may not even look the same.

352 b.d.  Sat, Oct 26, 2013 3:41:25pm

re: #347 Dark_Falcon

The media isn’t going to try to ID the young lady because if her identity became known she’d be subject to a torrent of online and possible real-life abuse ranging from slut-shaming to threats of murder, to actual real-life assaults.

The media would love to ID her to broadcast to the world what type of medical insurance she really does have. How Obamacare and the Obama administration has really is screwed her over in the job market, personal life, not helping her, etc……

It’s what they do.

353 wrenchwench  Sat, Oct 26, 2013 3:43:23pm

re: #350 Dark_Falcon

I was just clarifying the terminology because my mom went to law school while I was going to high school, so I’m practically a lawyer myself.

///////////////

354 Dark_Falcon  Sat, Oct 26, 2013 3:45:19pm

re: #353 wrenchwench

I was just clarifying the terminology because my mom went to law school while I was going to high school, so I’m practically a lawyer myself.

///////////////

I hear you sister. I grew up around a so many sticklers for terminology that it was inevitable that I became one myself.

355 Amory Blaine  Sat, Oct 26, 2013 3:45:51pm

re: #319 wrenchwench

No steering, no brakes, no safety leash, no helmet on the kid, and that harness looks pretty loose.

Freedumb!!!!!

356 Amory Blaine  Sat, Oct 26, 2013 3:48:08pm

The tea parties were missing fife players. Circle complete.

357 First As Tragedy, Then As Farce  Sat, Oct 26, 2013 3:49:23pm

re: #344 Charles Johnson

It’s amazing to think that if you could swap vision with that animal, it would be like going from VHS to 4K Blu-Ray.

358 Dark_Falcon  Sat, Oct 26, 2013 3:59:00pm

re: #356 Amory Blaine

The tea parties were missing fife players. Circle complete.

Fifes were used by the British and therefore are evil:

Youtube Video

359 Decatur Deb  Sat, Oct 26, 2013 4:02:43pm

The girl was an undiscovered beauty tallying the people’s turnips and rutabagas on our collective when a socially-aware pheminist photographer needed a face for the agitprop initiative. After the shoot she went back to the fields, and will bear a New Socialist Child there on Fidel’s birthday. One of the great rags-to-rags stories. A committee of Chinese composers is going to turn it into a rock opera.


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