President Obama: Putin Is ‘On the Wrong Side of History’

World • Views: 21,754

Here’s the latest statement from the White House on the tense situation in Ukraine and Crimea: President Barack Obama Says Putin Is on ‘Wrong Side of History’.

President Barack Obama said Monday that if Russia continues an incursion into the Ukrainian peninsula of Crimea, the United States would take diplomatic and economic steps to “isolate” the country.

Speaking to reporters in a meeting with Israeli Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu, Obama said that invading the Ukrainian territory was a “violation of international law” that puts Russian President Vladimir Putin “on the wrong side of history.”

“What cannot be done is for Russia with impunity to put its soldiers on the ground and violate basic principles that are recognized around the world,” Obama said. Qualifying his threat on Friday that “there will be costs” for a Russian invasion, Obama added, “Over time this will be a costly proposition for Russia.”

The State Department also made a statement today that economic sanctions against Russia are “likely.”

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280 comments
1 Pie-onist Overlord  Mon, Mar 3, 2014 2:17:39pm

Wingnuts still getting on their Obama hate / Putie Luv

2 BigBadDemocrat  Mon, Mar 3, 2014 2:18:17pm

History is a record of wars and rumors of war.

3 Pie-onist Overlord  Mon, Mar 3, 2014 2:18:37pm

MOAR PUTIE LUV

4 Testy Toad T  Mon, Mar 3, 2014 2:19:26pm

Sure, the fucker is an ex-KGB autocrat who’s going around invading our allies, but at least he’s not blahhhh!

5 Charles Johnson  Mon, Mar 3, 2014 2:20:09pm
6 CriticalDragon1177  Mon, Mar 3, 2014 2:21:34pm

Charles Johnson,

So much for Obama not being tough

7 Gus  Mon, Mar 3, 2014 2:21:45pm
8 Gus  Mon, Mar 3, 2014 2:23:23pm
9 Gus  Mon, Mar 3, 2014 2:23:54pm
10 CriticalDragon1177  Mon, Mar 3, 2014 2:24:04pm

re: #1 Pie-onist Overlord

Wingnuts still getting on their Obama hate / Putie Luv


Putin Riding Obama? That will never happen. Obama’s a wild stallion!

11 b.d.  Mon, Mar 3, 2014 2:24:24pm

We have no moral authority speak up after

The Bay of Pigs
Vietnam
The Spanish American War
The Trail of Tears
Tripoli
Iraq!


//

12 CriticalDragon1177  Mon, Mar 3, 2014 2:25:36pm

re: #9 Gus


hmm a feminist fairy tale.

13 Gus  Mon, Mar 3, 2014 2:26:04pm

re: #11 b.d.

We have no moral authority speak up after

The Bay of Pigs
Vietnam
The Spanish American War
The Trail of Tears
Tripoli
Iraq!

//

en.wikipedia.org

14 Testy Toad T  Mon, Mar 3, 2014 2:26:13pm

re: #12 CriticalDragon1177

hmm a feminist fairy hairy tale.

There. That’s better.

15 jonhendry  Mon, Mar 3, 2014 2:27:43pm

Somebody please photoshop Putin’s face onto a 1970s Fonzie poster, please.

Cause the right is acting like the girls in Happy Days.

Or, maybe, a Chachi poster.

16 b.d.  Mon, Mar 3, 2014 2:27:44pm

re: #13 Gus

en.wikipedia.org

You mean that our presidents didn’t stop the Russians then!?!?!?!

17 RadicalModerate  Mon, Mar 3, 2014 2:28:07pm

Today we learn that #tcot wingnuts might not like even a suggestion of a social contract, but dictators who lean toward fascism make them all dreamy-like.

18 jonhendry  Mon, Mar 3, 2014 2:29:27pm

re: #13 Gus

America dropped the ball during the last Crimean War. We shall not fail you again, Sevastopol!

19 Killgore Trout  Mon, Mar 3, 2014 2:31:00pm

re: #8 Gus

[Embedded content]

I love those polls. I had a computer break down and was stuck with cable news for a week or two. Ed Schultz’s awesome poll question was “Do Republicans hate poor people?”

20 BigBadDemocrat  Mon, Mar 3, 2014 2:31:19pm

Thing is seems to me provided that China is on Putin’s side and we borrow so much money from China, why would China loan the US any more money to go fight Russians?

21 Charles Johnson  Mon, Mar 3, 2014 2:31:55pm

If a nation’s supply of moral authority were somehow linked to its history, no country in the world would qualify.

22 Charles Johnson  Mon, Mar 3, 2014 2:32:45pm

My point is that it’s a basically meaningless concept except as an academic argument, and an excuse for not doing anything.

23 Testy Toad T  Mon, Mar 3, 2014 2:33:39pm

re: #20 BigBadDemocrat

Thing is seems to me provided that China is on Putin’s side and we borrow so much money from China, why would China loan the US any more money to go fight Russians?

1) China’s not particularly on Putin’s side
2) China is interested in a stable world economy, because they’re mostly-rational actors
3) China lends us money because they know we’re a very safe borrower and they like collecting our interest
4) We’re rather unlikely to fight any Russians
5) China likes making money

This isn’t Clancyland.

24 dog philosopher  Mon, Mar 3, 2014 2:33:52pm

the United States would take diplomatic and economic steps to “isolate” the country

a nice civilized economic conflict involving things like Oh Did You Think There Was No Other Place To Get Natural Gas From?

25 Killgore Trout  Mon, Mar 3, 2014 2:34:25pm

The whole Russian business plan is on the wrong side of history. It’s an essembly of pariah states and petty dictators. Assad isn’t going to last forever, and I have a hard time imagining the Mullahs still running Iran in 50 years. Maduro probably won’t last more than a year or two, probably much less. Historically it’s a dead end but they can milk their friends and puppets in the mean time.

26 RadicalModerate  Mon, Mar 3, 2014 2:34:36pm

re: #21 Charles Johnson

If a nation’s supply of moral authority were somehow linked to its history, no country in the world would qualify.

No modern nation, at least. There are a few in history (albeit mostly tribal groups) who were pretty good at this sort of thing.

27 Justanotherhuman  Mon, Mar 3, 2014 2:34:49pm
28 Backwoods_Sleuth  Mon, Mar 3, 2014 2:34:51pm

re: #8 Gus

[Embedded content]

29 BigBadDemocrat  Mon, Mar 3, 2014 2:34:55pm

The countries that Russia has mistreated the most need to be the ones who call out Russia the most now.

30 Killgore Trout  Mon, Mar 3, 2014 2:36:02pm

re: #20 BigBadDemocrat

Thing is seems to me provided that China is on Putin’s side and we borrow so much money from China, why would China loan the US any more money to go fight Russians?

Are you talking about Treasury notes? It’s not really a loan. They buy them because it’s a good, safe and reliable financial investment.

31 Testy Toad T  Mon, Mar 3, 2014 2:36:27pm

re: #25 Killgore Trout

The whole Russian business plan is on the wrong side of history. It’s an essembly of pariah states and petty dictators. Assad isn’t going to last forever, and I have a hard time imagining the Mullahs still running Iran in 50 years. Maduro probably won’t last more than a year or two, probably much less. Historically it’s a dead end but they can milk their friends and puppets in the mean time.

Well, the Russian leaders are in this for the Russian leaders, not for the future of Russia. I don’t think Putin cares incredibly deeply about what happens in fifty years; he’ll be worm food.

They’re maximizing short-term personal profits at the expense of a healthy long-term corporate future. They learned capitalism quickly.

32 Killgore Trout  Mon, Mar 3, 2014 2:36:46pm

re: #27 Justanotherhuman

[Embedded content]

The has got to be a lot of nervous people in Ukraine right now.

33 Killgore Trout  Mon, Mar 3, 2014 2:37:22pm

re: #31 Testy Toad T

Well, the Russian leaders are in this for the Russian leaders, not for the future of Russia. I don’t think Putin cares incredibly deeply about what happens in fifty years; he’ll be worm food.

They’re maximizing short-term personal profits at the expense of a healthy long-term corporate future. They learned capitalism quickly.

Agreed.

34 Charles Johnson  Mon, Mar 3, 2014 2:37:56pm

Also, I seriously doubt that any international deals are made or broken based on moral authority. It’s just not a factor in anyone’s real world politics.

35 BigBadDemocrat  Mon, Mar 3, 2014 2:37:58pm

re: #30 Killgore Trout

Well if the US goes and starts a war when we are broke to start with seems that action would be bad for their current of other investments in the U.S. Treasury’s.

36 GeneJockey  Mon, Mar 3, 2014 2:38:45pm

re: #23 Testy Toad T

1) China’s not particularly on Putin’s side
2) China is interested in a stable world economy, because they’re mostly-rational actors
3) China lends us money because they know we’re a very safe borrower and they like collecting our interest
4) We’re rather unlikely to fight any Russians
5) China likes making money

This isn’t Clancyland.

China lends us money because it keeps their currency artificially low relative to ours, which makes their goods artificially cheap in America.

37 Gus  Mon, Mar 3, 2014 2:38:47pm
38 Testy Toad T  Mon, Mar 3, 2014 2:39:21pm

As usual, freakouts over OMG THE US WILL RUN OUT OF TEH CASH ignore the fact that if the US economy tanks, a great many other things will have tanked worse and harder.

39 dog philosopher  Mon, Mar 3, 2014 2:39:50pm

re: #38 Testy Toad T

As usual, freakouts over OMG THE US WILL RUN OUT OF TEH CASH ignore the fact that if the US economy tanks, a great many other things will have tanked worser and harder.

fyt

40 Charles Johnson  Mon, Mar 3, 2014 2:40:44pm

Kremlin Issues Ultimatums to Ukrainian Forces

Russia has issued a series of ultimatums for Ukrainian forces in Crimea to surrender and disarm by this morning or risk coming under attack, the new government in Kiev said last night.

41 CriticalDragon1177  Mon, Mar 3, 2014 2:40:48pm

LOL! Joseph McCarthy finally took on Jesus, the original commie.

I knew Jesus was a commie. ;)

42 Justanotherhuman  Mon, Mar 3, 2014 2:41:41pm
43 Testy Toad T  Mon, Mar 3, 2014 2:42:11pm

re: #40 Charles Johnson

Kremlin Issues Ultimatums to Ukrainian Forces

With every passed ignored ultimatum, the Russians look more feeble and unjustified, and will look worse when and if they finally decide to open fire on Ukrainian forces on Ukrainian soil.

44 Backwoods_Sleuth  Mon, Mar 3, 2014 2:43:36pm
45 Testy Toad T  Mon, Mar 3, 2014 2:44:36pm

re: #44 Backwoods_Sleuth

Fake Global Warming is clearly in cahoots with Vladimir Putin!!!1

46 GeneJockey  Mon, Mar 3, 2014 2:45:02pm

re: #35 BigBadDemocrat

Well if the US goes and starts a war when we are broke to start with seems that action would be bad for their current of other investments in the U.S. Treasury’s.

Where do you get the idea that we’re broke?

47 BigBadDemocrat  Mon, Mar 3, 2014 2:45:24pm

U.S.A. and Russia in a race to the settle which is the worlds biggest fool. I can war more than you. No, I can war more than you. I can draft more kids than you. No I can conscript more kids than you.

48 wrenchwench  Mon, Mar 3, 2014 2:45:29pm

re: #38 Testy Toad T

As usual, freakouts over OMG THE US WILL RUN OUT OF TEH CASH ignore the fact that if the US economy tanks, a great many other things will have tanked worse and harder.

Including, much earlier, in fact starting today, the Russian economy.

49 Testy Toad T  Mon, Mar 3, 2014 2:46:32pm

re: #47 BigBadDemocrat

U.S.A. and Russia in a race to the settle which is the worlds biggest fool. I can war more than you. No, I can war more than you. I can draft more kids than you. No I can conscript more kids than you.

Breathe. Breathe.

WTFITS?

50 Backwoods_Sleuth  Mon, Mar 3, 2014 2:46:38pm

There was discussion of owls downstairs…

51 CriticalDragon1177  Mon, Mar 3, 2014 2:46:44pm

The stupid is strong with Paul Broun.

52 BigBadDemocrat  Mon, Mar 3, 2014 2:47:27pm

re: #46 GeneJockey

We borrow money. We print money. The wingnuts say no new taxes. The big business guys will not pay taxes and leave the profits overseas. Big Oil runs the show and will not pay their share.

53 Killgore Trout  Mon, Mar 3, 2014 2:48:30pm

re: #43 Testy Toad T

With every passed ignored ultimatum, the Russians look more feeble and unjustified, and will look worse when and if they finally decide to open fire on Ukrainian forces on Ukrainian soil.

We’ll see soon enough. I think the Russians are serious and will likely follow through on their threats. I’m more doubtful about our threats about responses which may not materialize. There are plenty of possibilities here but I have a had time envisioning a great US-EU victory out of this.

54 Testy Toad T  Mon, Mar 3, 2014 2:48:32pm

It’s feeling very Firedoglake in here. Makes it an excellent time to head home from work. I’ll catch y’all later.

55 GeneJockey  Mon, Mar 3, 2014 2:49:22pm

re: #52 BigBadDemocrat

We borrow money. We print money. The wingnuts say no new taxes. The big business guys will not pay taxes and leave the profits overseas. Big Oil runs the show and will not pay their share.

You describe a series of choices which can be undone. We have a low tax rate, and a fairly low level of service.

Broke is when you have no place to get more money. Are you under the impression that a really big war wouldn’t lead to a change in the tax rates? You should read history, then.

56 BigBadDemocrat  Mon, Mar 3, 2014 2:49:49pm

oops, Me too DART will not wait.

57 Justanotherhuman  Mon, Mar 3, 2014 2:50:02pm

re: #51 CriticalDragon1177

The stupid is strong with Paul Broun.

[Embedded content]

Can’t he be declared mentally incompetent by somebody?

58 Lidane  Mon, Mar 3, 2014 2:50:39pm

re: #47 BigBadDemocrat

59 Testy Toad T  Mon, Mar 3, 2014 2:51:19pm

re: #53 Killgore Trout

We’ll see soon enough. I think the Russians are serious and will likely follow through on their threats. I’m more doubtful about our threats about responses which may not materialize. There are plenty of possibilities here but I have a had time envisioning a great US-EU victory out of this.

I’m not sure the goal wasn’t to provoke a reaction that won’t come, and that Putin has overstepped his good sense. Their position certainly gets militarily stronger with each passing day, but perhaps weaker in terms of secondary and tertiary damage. Frankly, I agree with someone downstairs. Their best case is a free-ish lease on Sevastapol for time immemorial. They need some good PR of saving helpless babushkas from the big bad scary Ukranians so they can patter around the Crimea until elections, then wander home without a shot being fired.

60 Pie-onist Overlord  Mon, Mar 3, 2014 2:51:58pm

LOL

61 wrenchwench  Mon, Mar 3, 2014 2:52:00pm

re: #54 Testy Toad T

It’s feeling very Firedoglake in here. Makes it an excellent time to head home from work. I’ll catch y’all later.

Don’t come unglued!

62 CriticalDragon1177  Mon, Mar 3, 2014 2:52:24pm

re: #57 Justanotherhuman

Can’t he be declared mentally incompetent by somebody?

In a better world it wouldn’t even be possible for people like him to get elected in the first place, but we have a huge problem with education in this country.

63 GeneJockey  Mon, Mar 3, 2014 2:52:31pm

re: #57 Justanotherhuman

Can’t he be declared mentally incompetent by somebody?

I’ll do it - That guy is mentally incompetent!

There. Done.
//

Seriously, the fact that he made it through Med School gives me an even lower opinion of Med School. To paraphrase The Dread Pirate Roberts Westley, I’ve known too many Spaniards MDs.

64 ObserverArt  Mon, Mar 3, 2014 2:53:23pm

re: #23 Testy Toad T

1) China’s not particularly on Putin’s side
2) China is interested in a stable world economy, because they’re mostly-rational actors
3) China lends us money because they know we’re a very safe borrower and they like collecting our interest
4) We’re rather unlikely to fight any Russians
5) China likes making money

This isn’t Clancyland.

I’ve been hoping China lends some needed weight in this whole thing. They don’t need Putin’s act…and I can’t remember the last time Russia told China to go fuck themselves.

65 Gus  Mon, Mar 3, 2014 2:53:24pm
66 Justanotherhuman  Mon, Mar 3, 2014 2:53:30pm

US Ambassador To The UN Samantha Power Just Ripped Into Russia At A Security Council Meeting

Read more: businessinsider.com

“Power accused Russia of an act of aggression, not a humanitarian mission.. She said there was nothing to justify its conduct in escalating military operations in the Crimea region of Ukraine after the ouster of former Ukrainian President Viktor Yanukovych, an ally of the Russian government of President Vladimir Putin.

“Russia has every right to wish events had turned out differently. It doesn’t have the right to express that using military force,” Power said.”

67 GeneJockey  Mon, Mar 3, 2014 2:54:45pm

re: #60 Pie-onist Overlord

LOL

[Embedded content]

Cue the exploding heads.

68 Justanotherhuman  Mon, Mar 3, 2014 2:54:57pm

re: #62 CriticalDragon1177

In a better world it wouldn’t even be possible for people like him to get elected in the first place, but we have a huge problem with education in this country.

People can’t recognize pathologies anymore?

That’s fucking depressing.

69 Dr Lizardo  Mon, Mar 3, 2014 2:55:08pm

re: #53 Killgore Trout

We’ll see soon enough. I think the Russians are serious and will likely follow through on their threats. I’m more doubtful about our threats about responses which may not materialize. There are plenty of possibilities here but I have a had time envisioning a great US-EU victory out of this.

Yep, we’ll see. It could be that the Russians may not have some “grand strategy” up their sleeve, and sort of impetuously rushed into this without thinking it all the way through to a conclusion.

As for the wingnuts, I’d be willing to bet money that if Obama suddenly went to DEFCON 2, told NATO, “We’re rolling into Ukraine, and we ain’t stoppin’ till we reach the Kremlin” and then began airstrikes against Russian positions in Crimea, that squishy-squelchy-farty sound you would hear would be the wingnuts simultaneously filling their underwear, and once they’d regained control of their bowels, the next thing you’d hear is OH MY GOD OBAMA’S GONNA GET US ALL KILLED!.

70 Charles Johnson  Mon, Mar 3, 2014 2:55:23pm

Someone gets the bright idea to do this every 6 months or so. I suddenly get a bunch of mailing list confirmation notices, or just start getting their emails without confirming if they’re really cheesy.

71 jonhendry  Mon, Mar 3, 2014 2:55:51pm

re: #57 Justanotherhuman

Can’t he be declared mentally incompetent by somebody?

Well, he is a doctor. So he could probably declare himself

72 GeneJockey  Mon, Mar 3, 2014 2:56:34pm

re: #68 Justanotherhuman

People can’t recognize pathologies anymore?

That’s fucking depressing.

Where he’s from, it’s not a recognized pathology. It’s a successful campaign strategy. In that sense, he truly represents his constituency.

73 Killgore Trout  Mon, Mar 3, 2014 2:56:41pm

re: #59 Testy Toad T

I’m not sure the goal wasn’t to provoke a reaction that won’t come, and that Putin has overstepped his good sense. Their position certainly gets militarily stronger with each passing day, but perhaps weaker in terms of secondary and tertiary damage. Frankly, I agree with someone downstairs. Their best case is a free-ish lease on Sevastapol for time immemorial. They need some good PR of saving helpless babushkas from the big bad scary Ukranians so they can patter around the Crimea until elections, then wander home without a shot being fired.

I seem to recall that one of the first thing the new Ukrainian government did was to reaffirm Russia’s claim to the Naval base so I don’t think that’s a motivating factor. I think it was even very likely that upcoming election would create semi-autonomous regions in areas with Russian heritage. This makes me think Russia may be moving to take the whole country, Their regional interests were already pretty safe.

74 Gus  Mon, Mar 3, 2014 2:56:44pm

russianplanes.net

75 Lidane  Mon, Mar 3, 2014 2:57:05pm

re: #69 Dr Lizardo

It’s all fun and games until the draft gets reintroduced to up the manpower needed for a Russian ground war.

76 NJDhockeyfan  Mon, Mar 3, 2014 2:57:36pm

re: #66 Justanotherhuman

US Ambassador To The UN Samantha Power Just Ripped Into Russia At A Security Council Meeting

Read more: businessinsider.com

“Power accused Russia of an act of aggression, not a humanitarian mission.. She said there was nothing to justify its conduct in escalating military operations in the Crimea region of Ukraine after the ouster of former Ukrainian President Viktor Yanukovych, an ally of the Russian government of President Vladimir Putin.

“Russia has every right to wish events had turned out differently. It doesn’t have the right to express that using military force,” Power said.”

77 Killgore Trout  Mon, Mar 3, 2014 2:59:00pm

re: #65 Gus

[Embedded content]

What do the folks at Aviationist have to say about Ukrainian capabilities? I’m assuming the Russians will fuck them up quickly but I’m just guessing.

78 Fairly Sure I'm Still Obdicut  Mon, Mar 3, 2014 2:59:24pm

re: #73 Killgore Trout

This makes me think Russia may be moving to take the whole country, Their regional interests were already pretty safe.

re: #133 Killgore Trout

I think they’re safe for now, I doubt Putin is going to go beyond Ukrainian borders. He might not even take the whole country.

Great commentary you’ve been giving Killgore, really insightful stuff.

Glad I know that you think Putin might be moving to take the whole country, then again, he might not.

79 Justanotherhuman  Mon, Mar 3, 2014 2:59:48pm

re: #70 Charles Johnson

[Embedded content]

Someone gets the bright idea to do this every 6 months or so. I suddenly get a bunch of mailing list confirmation notices, or just start getting their emails without confirming if they’re really cheesy.

I just got a chain letter from someone named “Dave” and I never get that shit.

80 Gus  Mon, Mar 3, 2014 3:01:02pm

re: #77 Killgore Trout

What do the folks at Aviationist have to say about Ukrainian capabilities? I’m assuming the Russians will fuck them up quickly but I’m just guessing.

Not much.

First image of Su-27 Flanker fighter jet “armed to the teeth” to perform Combat Air Patrol following the Russian invasion of Crimea.

An interesting image, showing a fully armed Ukrainian Air Force Su-27 has been published on Russianplanes.net.

Taken, on Mar. 1 by Andrey Rakul, at an undisclosed location (possibly, Mirgorod Air Base, the airbase hosting the only Ukrainian Air Force Flanker Squadron), it shows Su-27 “45 Blue” armed with 6 Vympel R-27 missiles (NATO reporting name AA-10 Alamo-C) semi-active-radar homing extended-range air-to-air missiles and 4 Vympel R-73 (AA-11 Archer), a configuration adopted for Combat Air Patrols (CAPs) established by Kiev after the Russian invasion of Crimea.

81 TedStriker  Mon, Mar 3, 2014 3:01:02pm

re: #79 Justanotherhuman

I just got a chain letter from someone named “Dave” and I never get that shit.

Dave’s not here, man.

/

82 Fairly Sure I'm Still Obdicut  Mon, Mar 3, 2014 3:03:00pm

re: #80 Gus

The main weirdness would be that Ukraine and Russia did a lot of interoperability training together. That’s not a normal situation.

83 Gus  Mon, Mar 3, 2014 3:03:44pm

50 Su-27s in inventory as of January 2013.
“World Military Aircraft Inventory”. 2013 Aerospace: Aviation Week and Space Technology, January 2013.

84 Killgore Trout  Mon, Mar 3, 2014 3:03:53pm

re: #80 Gus

Not much.

First image of Su-27 Flanker fighter jet “armed to the teeth” to perform Combat Air Patrol following the Russian invasion of Crimea.

I would not want to be in the Ukrainian military right now.

85 Dr Lizardo  Mon, Mar 3, 2014 3:04:00pm

OK….time for a humor break.

A local pastor has ordered all women who attend service at Lord’s Propeller Redemption Church to refrain from wearing undergarments while attending so that they can more easily receive the spirit of Jesus Christ.

The Kenyan Daily Post is reporting that a pastor identified only as “Reverend Njohi” claimed bras and underwear are not godly. Additionally, the paper says Njohi wants women who attend service at the church to be “free,” and that there would be consequences for those who do not comply.

According to the UK Metro, most women did, in fact, show up at the church, located in the eastern suburb of Dandora, the following Sunday without any undergarments on under their clothing.

Am I the only person on the planet who has a sneaking suspicion that the “spirit of Jesus” Rev. Njohi is referring to is a rather intimate part of his anatomy?

Perhaps the Reverend fancies himself the Kenyan Rasputin.

washington.cbslocal.com

86 ObserverArt  Mon, Mar 3, 2014 3:04:03pm

re: #65 Gus

Ukrainian Air Force Su-27 March 1, 2014. by Andrey Rakul “possibly, Mirgorod Air Base”

Damn thing looks sorta familiar.

///

87 wrenchwench  Mon, Mar 3, 2014 3:07:09pm

One of those rare moments I wish I had a TV:

88 Gus  Mon, Mar 3, 2014 3:07:34pm

re: #84 Killgore Trout

I would not want to be in the Ukrainian military right now.

I think that would depend on several things.

89 wrenchwench  Mon, Mar 3, 2014 3:09:48pm
90 uncah91  Mon, Mar 3, 2014 3:10:42pm

re: #30 Killgore Trout

Are you talking about Treasury notes? It’s not really a loan. They buy them because it’s a good, safe and reliable financial investment.

Well, yes, but that isn’t even the real reason. My understanding is that it all comes down to trade imbalance.

We run a trade deficit with China. That means China has a ton of suprlus American dollars. They could hold on to those dollars, for no return, or they can give them back to the US Gov’t with a promise of getting them back plus some interest later. There is essentially zero extra risk in buying the bond vs. holding the dollar. So it’s basically free money.

91 Kragar  Mon, Mar 3, 2014 3:11:21pm

My shitty neighbors from hell just got eviction papers filed against them.

YAY!

92 Gus  Mon, Mar 3, 2014 3:11:37pm

We shot close spetspryznachentsiv who shot the highest number of people in the square. Dear heavenly angels hundreds, sorry, that was on the other side

93 Dark_Falcon  Mon, Mar 3, 2014 3:15:24pm

re: #60 Pie-onist Overlord

LOL

[Embedded content]

Do gay rattlesnakes have rainbow colored rattles? Because that would be fabulous!

94 GlutenFreeJesus  Mon, Mar 3, 2014 3:16:33pm

Or a Liberace scarf, and Elton glasses.

95 Gus  Mon, Mar 3, 2014 3:18:54pm

96 Dark_Falcon  Mon, Mar 3, 2014 3:19:10pm

re: #92 Gus

We shot close spetspryznachentsiv who shot the highest number of people in the square. Dear heavenly angels hundreds, sorry, that was on the other side

[Embedded image]

Where did you get that pic from?

97 Gus  Mon, Mar 3, 2014 3:20:58pm

re: #96 Dark_Falcon

Where did you get that pic from?

mil.in.ua

98 Charles Johnson  Mon, Mar 3, 2014 3:21:32pm

I was going to write a post about this, but sometimes it starts to feel like I’m yelling into a vacuum chamber.

99 Fairly Sure I'm Still Obdicut  Mon, Mar 3, 2014 3:24:24pm

Wow, Belarus recognized the Ukrainian government. I didn’t know that.

world.time.com

100 Gus  Mon, Mar 3, 2014 3:28:58pm
101 b.d.  Mon, Mar 3, 2014 3:29:43pm

re: #99 Fairly Sure I’m Still Obdicut

Wow, Belarus recognized the Ukrainian government. I didn’t know that.

world.time.com

Belarus is looking over their shoulder. Belarus & Ukraine are what a lot of Russians consider Russia, The stans they don’t care about, also notice that Latvia and Lithuania are speaking up pretty loudly about this.

102 Pie-onist Overlord  Mon, Mar 3, 2014 3:31:00pm

re: #95 Gus

[Embedded image]

Those look like Canadian Mountie hats.

103 Fairly Sure I'm Still Obdicut  Mon, Mar 3, 2014 3:32:51pm

re: #101 b.d.

Belarus is looking over their shoulder. Belarus & Ukraine are what a lot of Russians consider Russia, The stans they don’t care about, also notice that Latvia and Lithuania are speaking up pretty loudly about this.

Belarus has been staunchly pro-Russia for years and years, that’s why it’s weird right now. If Russia doesn’t have Belarus, they’re really isolated.

104 Gus  Mon, Mar 3, 2014 3:34:08pm

105 A Mom Anon  Mon, Mar 3, 2014 3:34:27pm

re: #98 Charles Johnson

But they’re totally not racist, nope. Only liberals are racist. What. The. Fuck?

106 A Mom Anon  Mon, Mar 3, 2014 3:35:41pm

re: #104 Gus

Aww, it’s tiny bacon!!!

107 NJDhockeyfan  Mon, Mar 3, 2014 3:36:40pm
108 Justanotherhuman  Mon, Mar 3, 2014 3:37:45pm

This is Ukraine’s new foreign minister.

109 Dark_Falcon  Mon, Mar 3, 2014 3:38:33pm

re: #107 NJDhockeyfan

[Embedded content]

Flawless Victory! Fatality.

110 jaunte  Mon, Mar 3, 2014 3:38:50pm

Article 4
The Parties will consult together whenever, in the opinion of any of them, the territorial integrity, political independence or security of any of the Parties is threatened.
nato.int

111 Pie-onist Overlord  Mon, Mar 3, 2014 3:39:21pm

re: #98 Charles Johnson

I was going to write a post about this, but sometimes it starts to feel like I’m yelling into a vacuum chamber.

[Embedded content]

There is no comment on this Breitbart thread that is not racist.

The moderators must have deleted all the non-racist comments.

112 Gus  Mon, Mar 3, 2014 3:39:23pm

re: #106 A Mom Anon

Aww, it’s tiny bacon!!!

113 klys  Mon, Mar 3, 2014 3:39:38pm

You stand at the gateway.

114 Gus  Mon, Mar 3, 2014 3:41:52pm
115 A Mom Anon  Mon, Mar 3, 2014 3:42:11pm

re: #112 Gus

And that would be mega bacon. With a side order of gun?

116 Lidane  Mon, Mar 3, 2014 3:42:50pm

OT, but what’s the rule about following up on job interviews? I did an online interview last Tuesday and have a thank you note for the manager that sent me the invite to interview in the first place, but I’m not sure if I should send it.

The interview notice said that I had 72 hours to do the interview and that I’d hear back 2-3 days after they got my interview back. By that timetable, I should have heard back last Friday. Would I be out of line just sending a generic “thanks for the opportunity, looking forward to hearing back” note?

117 Gus  Mon, Mar 3, 2014 3:42:50pm

re: #115 A Mom Anon

And that would be mega bacon. With a side order of gun?

Ayep.

118 Lidane  Mon, Mar 3, 2014 3:43:33pm

re: #112 Gus

Needs moar bacon. And a larger cup of coffee.

119 klys  Mon, Mar 3, 2014 3:44:02pm

re: #116 Lidane

OT, but what’s the rule about following up on job interviews? I did an online interview last Tuesday and have a thank you note for the manager that sent me the invite to interview in the first place, but I’m not sure if I should send it.

The interview notice said that I had 72 hours to do the interview and that I’d hear back 2-3 days after they got my interview back. By that timetable, I should have heard back last Friday. Would I be out of line just sending a generic “thanks for the opportunity, looking forward to hearing back” note?

My vote is you definitely should send the note and it wouldn’t be out of line.

120 Gus  Mon, Mar 3, 2014 3:44:13pm

re: #118 Lidane

Needs moar bacon. And a larger cup of coffee.

I was thinking need moar PETA eggs!

121 Justanotherhuman  Mon, Mar 3, 2014 3:44:37pm

re: #112 Gus

[Embedded content]

Yuck on all of it.

122 William Barnett-Lewis  Mon, Mar 3, 2014 3:44:52pm

re: #115 A Mom Anon

And that would be mega bacon. With a side order of gun?

German gun (SIG-Sauer) but it’s the thought that counts… ////

123 makeitstop  Mon, Mar 3, 2014 3:45:26pm

re: #119 klys

My vote is you definitely should send the note and it wouldn’t be out of line.

+1 on that. Stay on their radar, so to speak.

124 A Mom Anon  Mon, Mar 3, 2014 3:45:30pm

re: #119 klys

Yeah, I don’t see how a thank you note is a bad thing. Especially in a time where hardly anyone does that sort of thing anymore. It makes you stand out. Which I guess could be good or bad, lol, depending…

125 Gus  Mon, Mar 3, 2014 3:45:47pm

re: #121 Justanotherhuman

Yuck on all of it.

126 Dark_Falcon  Mon, Mar 3, 2014 3:45:48pm

re: #116 Lidane

OT, but what’s the rule about following up on job interviews? I did an online interview last Tuesday and have a thank you note for the manager that sent me the invite to interview in the first place, but I’m not sure if I should send it.

The interview notice said that I had 72 hours to do the interview and that I’d hear back 2-3 days after they got my interview back. By that timetable, I should have heard back last Friday. Would I be out of line just sending a generic “thanks for the opportunity, looking forward to hearing back” note?

A follow-up email such as you propose would be appropriate and wise.

127 CuriousLurker  Mon, Mar 3, 2014 3:45:48pm

re: #87 wrenchwench

One of those rare moments I wish I had a TV:

[Embedded content]

Twitter just delivered:

Wait. *blinks* lolwut—I stopped watching the Spy for an hour or two and suddenly LGF turned into FDL? Still looks the same to me…

128 jaunte  Mon, Mar 3, 2014 3:46:20pm

re: #112 Gus

[Embedded content]

“An armed solitary breakfast is a polite solitary breakfast.”

129 b.d.  Mon, Mar 3, 2014 3:46:23pm

re: #112 Gus

[Embedded content]

Gross! It looks like there is cream in that coffee!

130 Gus  Mon, Mar 3, 2014 3:47:39pm

re: #128 jaunte

“An armed solitary breakfast is a polite solitary breakfast.”

The only thing that can stop a bad guy with breakfast is a good guy with breakfast.

131 Charles Johnson  Mon, Mar 3, 2014 3:47:50pm

132 A Mom Anon  Mon, Mar 3, 2014 3:47:53pm

re: #127 CuriousLurker

I know, I lol’d . I used to be a member of FDL, back when it was on Blogger and then after they made a name with the Plame thing. And then it turned into a freak farm and they lost some good people.

This place is not that. Not even close.

133 Justanotherhuman  Mon, Mar 3, 2014 3:48:45pm

re: #127 CuriousLurker

Twitter just delivered:

[Embedded content]

Wait. *blinks* lolwut—I stopped watching the Spy for an hour or two and suddenly LGF turned into FDL? Still looks the same to me…

Oh fuck, is that Steve Cohen, the Russian apologist from NYU?

134 Weet  Mon, Mar 3, 2014 3:48:50pm

In case you did not see Samantha Powers’s speech at the UN today, the transcript is included in this article. I think it’s great.

Samantha Powers at UN Today

135 Fairly Sure I'm Still Obdicut  Mon, Mar 3, 2014 3:49:57pm

Image: rznUEtW.png

136 Killgore Trout  Mon, Mar 3, 2014 3:52:25pm

re: #133 Justanotherhuman

Oh fuck, is that Steve Cohen, the Russian apologist from NYU?

Ok, that might explain her objections in context. From the clip it looks like she’s just bitching about Blitzer repeating a quote from a Russian official.

137 CuriousLurker  Mon, Mar 3, 2014 3:53:34pm

re: #133 Justanotherhuman

Oh fuck, is that Steve Cohen, the Russian apologist from NYU?

I dunno, never heard of him till 5 minutes ago.

138 Pie-onist Overlord  Mon, Mar 3, 2014 3:53:35pm

re: #116 Lidane

OT, but what’s the rule about following up on job interviews? I did an online interview last Tuesday and have a thank you note for the manager that sent me the invite to interview in the first place, but I’m not sure if I should send it.

The interview notice said that I had 72 hours to do the interview and that I’d hear back 2-3 days after they got my interview back. By that timetable, I should have heard back last Friday. Would I be out of line just sending a generic “thanks for the opportunity, looking forward to hearing back” note?

When you have an interview, get the names of each person you spoke to (get their business cards if they have one) and send a thank-you to each one. You can write one email and send it to all of them. The sooner after the interview, the better.

Mention some things that you talked about and why you are excited to have this opportunity.

139 NJDhockeyfan  Mon, Mar 3, 2014 3:53:51pm

Heh.

140 Justanotherhuman  Mon, Mar 3, 2014 3:55:14pm

re: #137 CuriousLurker

I dunno, never heard of him till 5 minutes ago.

I think I linked something he wrote a few threads ago. He was defending Russia, of course.

141 Charles Johnson  Mon, Mar 3, 2014 3:56:01pm

142 jonhendry  Mon, Mar 3, 2014 3:56:20pm

re: #138 Pie-onist Overlord

“When you have an interview, get the names of each person you spoke to”

Sometimes, at least with phone interviews, I only get a first name. And no email. At least, it’s been like that with multiple interviews with Apple.

143 wrenchwench  Mon, Mar 3, 2014 3:57:30pm

re: #127 CuriousLurker

Twitter just delivered:

[Embedded content]

Wait. *blinks* lolwut—I stopped watching the Spy for an hour or two and suddenly LGF turned into FDL? Still looks the same to me…

Thanks for the vid! Christiane comported herself better than I expected.

(My comment about coming unglued was in reference to this:)

144 Charles Johnson  Mon, Mar 3, 2014 3:58:21pm
145 Justanotherhuman  Mon, Mar 3, 2014 3:59:31pm

re: #143 wrenchwench

Thanks for the vid! Christiane comported herself better than I expected.

(My comment about coming unglued was in reference to this:)

[Embedded content]

Look at those scowls! Can’t be much fun…

146 dog philosopher  Mon, Mar 3, 2014 3:59:57pm

The Hilarious Way Russia’s Official Propaganda Network Covers The Situation In Ukraine

Want a different perspective on the crisis in Ukraine?

Check out RT.com, the state Russian broadcaster that’s tasked with improving Russia’s image abroad (AKA: propaganda).

The top stories currently are about how Crimea doesn’t need governance from Kiev, and how thousands of Ukrainians are fleeing to live in Russia

147 CuriousLurker  Mon, Mar 3, 2014 4:00:37pm

re: #143 wrenchwench

Thanks for the vid! Christiane comported herself better than I expected.

(My comment about coming unglued was in reference to this:)

[Embedded content]

Ah, I saw those earlier. Even Googled ‘em, poor fugly little things.

148 Justanotherhuman  Mon, Mar 3, 2014 4:01:08pm

re: #137 CuriousLurker

I dunno, never heard of him till 5 minutes ago.

Here’s the article, BTW.

thenation.com

149 Gus  Mon, Mar 3, 2014 4:01:29pm
150 wrenchwench  Mon, Mar 3, 2014 4:01:30pm

re: #145 Justanotherhuman

Look at those scowls! Can’t be much fun…

re: #147 CuriousLurker

Ah, I saw those earlier. Even Googled ‘em, poor fugly little things.

Now now, beauty is in the slimy eye of the beholder….

151 CuriousLurker  Mon, Mar 3, 2014 4:02:39pm

re: #148 Justanotherhuman

Here’s the article, BTW.

thenation.com

Ah, okay. Thanks.

152 makeitstop  Mon, Mar 3, 2014 4:02:41pm

re: #149 Gus

The world must be ending! Kudlow just said his own clown conservatives “should back Obama.” That Putin is the enemy.

Between that and the cat & dog getting stuck in the tree, I’m starting to think it’s a wrap.

153 Dark_Falcon  Mon, Mar 3, 2014 4:03:33pm

re: #146 dog philosopher

The Hilarious Way Russia’s Official Propaganda Network Covers The Situation In Ukraine

Want a different perspective on the crisis in Ukraine?

Check out RT.com, the state Russian broadcaster that’s tasked with improving Russia’s image abroad (AKA: propaganda).

The top stories currently are about how Crimea doesn’t need governance from Kiev, and how thousands of Ukrainians are fleeing to live in Russia

Is Baghdad Bob part of the editorial staff?

154 Gus  Mon, Mar 3, 2014 4:03:39pm
155 wrenchwench  Mon, Mar 3, 2014 4:04:39pm

re: #144 Charles Johnson

re: #154 Gus


40 or 50 more of those might make up for the image in #98. I’m thinking of brain bleach, though. That is just the most hideous thing I’ve seen short of actual human dismemberment.

156 Dark_Falcon  Mon, Mar 3, 2014 4:05:24pm

re: #154 Gus

[Embedded content]

Cute, but it chews the woodwork and spreads disease.

157 Aqua Obama  Mon, Mar 3, 2014 4:05:54pm
Steve Rosenberg BBC News, Moscow says many of the Russian tabloids are packed with patriotic fervour and pro-Kremlin columns. One of the country’s most popular papers, Komsomolskaya Pravda, claimed that Vladimir Putin was “one step away from becoming the leader of the world, the chief figure embodying independence from American hegemony”.

look out lil kim

158 Lidane  Mon, Mar 3, 2014 4:07:39pm

re: #138 Pie-onist Overlord

When you have an interview, get the names of each person you spoke to (get their business cards if they have one) and send a thank-you to each one. You can write one email and send it to all of them. The sooner after the interview, the better.

I’ve only gone through one person at the company and he happens to be the hiring manager for the team I’m looking to join. That helps make things a lot easier.

Mention some things that you talked about and why you are excited to have this opportunity.

FYI — I just used this suggestion to edit the note before I sent it to him.

There was one question in the interview that really stood out to me since it basically amounted to me having to consider the future applications of their product. I’d never been asked that in an interview before, and it’s stuck with me the last few days. I’ve actually gone back to that question and thought about other ways their product could be used that go beyond just mobile devices and computers. I told him all of that, and let him know I thought that question in particular was great because it really made me think.

We’ll see what happens. I’m hopeful until they tell me otherwise. :)

159 Charles Johnson  Mon, Mar 3, 2014 4:08:08pm

re: #155 wrenchwench

Agreed - there’s something seriously wrong with any person who looks at that and thinks it’s funny.

160 CuriousLurker  Mon, Mar 3, 2014 4:09:24pm

re: #156 Dark_Falcon

Cute, but it chews the woodwork and spreads disease.

No it doesn’t—not that one anyway. It’s a cute pet. Leave it alone.
*gives D_F the stink-eye*

161 Gus  Mon, Mar 3, 2014 4:10:04pm

re: #155 wrenchwench

40 or 50 more of those might make up for the image in #98. I’m thinking of brain bleach, though. That is just the most hideous thing I’ve seen short of actual human dismemberment.

162 Backwoods_Sleuth  Mon, Mar 3, 2014 4:10:19pm

re: #156 Dark_Falcon

Cute, but it chews the woodwork and spreads disease.

Apparently chews the blankie as well…

163 Gus  Mon, Mar 3, 2014 4:10:29pm

re: #160 CuriousLurker

No it doesn’t—not that one anyway. It’s a cute pet. Leave it alone.
*gives D_F the stink-eye*

Exactly. :D

164 Dr Lizardo  Mon, Mar 3, 2014 4:11:19pm

re: #157 Aqua Obama

Steve Rosenberg BBC News, Moscow says many of the Russian tabloids are packed with patriotic fervour and pro-Kremlin columns. One of the country’s most popular papers, Komsomolskaya Pravda, claimed that Vladimir Putin was “one step away from becoming the leader of the world, the chief figure embodying independence from American hegemony”.

look out lil kim

Komsomolskaya Pravda? Interesting name for a paper. Especially the Komsomol part.

Komsomol was better known as the “All-Union Leninist Young Communist League”.

Heh…..I guess they never got around to changing the name.

165 Gus  Mon, Mar 3, 2014 4:14:47pm
166 Dark_Falcon  Mon, Mar 3, 2014 4:15:46pm

re: #160 CuriousLurker

No it doesn’t—not that one anyway. It’s a cute pet. Leave it alone.
*gives D_F the stink-eye*

I’d rather hand it over to a cat for killing and consumption. >:D

167 Gus  Mon, Mar 3, 2014 4:17:04pm

re: #166 Dark_Falcon

I’d rather hand it over to a cat for killing and consumption. >:D

That’s the spirit!

168 wrenchwench  Mon, Mar 3, 2014 4:18:02pm

re: #166 Dark_Falcon

I’d rather hand it over to a cat for killing and consumption. >:D

169 CuriousLurker  Mon, Mar 3, 2014 4:18:24pm

re: #148 Justanotherhuman

Here’s the article, BTW.

thenation.com

Just read it. Wow, what a tool. I’m sure the Russian media never ever misrepresents President Obama or the U.S. //

170 Killgore Trout  Mon, Mar 3, 2014 4:18:31pm

CIA reportedly says Russia sees treaty as justifying Ukraine moves

CIA Director John Brennan told key lawmakers Monday that Russia believes its military incursion in Ukraine is permitted under a 1997 treaty between the two neighbors that allows as many as 25,000 Russian troops in the vital Crimean region.
…
Brennan urged caution and appeared to be taking a softer line than Secretary of State John F. Kerry, the officials said. Administration officials have said Russia violated the treaty because it requires the Russian navy, which bases its Black Sea fleet in the Crimean port of Sevastopol, to coordinate all military movements on the peninsula with Ukraine.

U.S. intelligence officials also denied that they had made a mistake Thursday when they advised Congress in classified briefings that they did not expect Russian President Vladimir Putin to send troops into Crimea, although they acknowledged it was possible.

171 Dark_Falcon  Mon, Mar 3, 2014 4:19:02pm

re: #167 Gus

That’s the spirit!

Well, it looks we’ve got a war about to happen. So I gotta get myself into a properly blood-thirsty mood, don’t I?

172 CuriousLurker  Mon, Mar 3, 2014 4:20:27pm

re: #166 Dark_Falcon

I’d rather hand it over to a cat for killing and consumption. >:D

That’s it—say your prayers, infidel!

*unsheathes scimitar, advances on D_F…*

//

173 wrenchwench  Mon, Mar 3, 2014 4:21:21pm

Human/animal cooperation: Raven has porcupine quills stuck in its head. Looks to human for help:

Youtube Video

174 Dr Lizardo  Mon, Mar 3, 2014 4:21:28pm

re: #166 Dark_Falcon

I’d rather hand it over to a cat for killing and consumption. >:D

:)

175 Justanotherhuman  Mon, Mar 3, 2014 4:22:05pm

Rodriguez is a producer on Morning Blow.

176 Aqua Obama  Mon, Mar 3, 2014 4:22:33pm

Canada missed the plot. Washington was ripe, ripe for the picking after Vancouver 2010.

177 Dark_Falcon  Mon, Mar 3, 2014 4:22:57pm

re: #172 CuriousLurker

That’s it—say your prayers, infidel!

*unsheathes scimitar, advances on D_F…*

//

You picked the wrong ‘Murican to victimize, Muslim!!1 Say hello to Satan for me!!!11

[DF draws an M1911A1 and opens fires]

178 Killgore Trout  Mon, Mar 3, 2014 4:23:17pm
“This was not predicted,” said a U.S. official, who asked not to be named in discussing the classified briefings.

The intelligence officials defended their analysis, however, saying Putin may have made a spur of the moment decision to take military action.

It might have been a spur of the moment decision but I doubt it. I suspect this was well planned and thought out, we just didn’t pick up on it.

179 Eclectic Cyborg  Mon, Mar 3, 2014 4:24:08pm

re: #146 dog philosopher

Seems like it’s only a matter of time until we get a Russian version of Baghdad Bob. Moscow Mike perhaps?

180 CuriousLurker  Mon, Mar 3, 2014 4:24:10pm

re: #167 Gus

That’s the spirit!

Oh, now you too, Peronist progressive?

181 Backwoods_Sleuth  Mon, Mar 3, 2014 4:24:16pm

re: #177 Dark_Falcon

You picked the wrong ‘Murican to victimize, Muslim!!1 Say hello to Satan for me!!!11

[DF draws an M1911A1 and opens fires]

Actually, you could have just politely handed over some delicious chocolates and all would be good.

182 Pie-onist Overlord  Mon, Mar 3, 2014 4:25:20pm

Wingnuts posting a bunch of lame photos of Obama so I shared this.

183 Pie-onist Overlord  Mon, Mar 3, 2014 4:25:59pm

OOH

184 Dark_Falcon  Mon, Mar 3, 2014 4:26:04pm

re: #181 Backwoods_Sleuth

Actually, you could have just politely handed over some delicious chocolates and all would be good.

That’s what Eurosocialists do! Real Americans open fire with a gun!!1

185 Gus  Mon, Mar 3, 2014 4:26:11pm

re: #180 CuriousLurker

Oh, now you too, Peronist progressive?

That was an Alan Colmes style, “that’s the spirit!”

186 Aqua Obama  Mon, Mar 3, 2014 4:26:15pm

re: #179 Eclectic Cyborg

Seems like it’s only a matter of time until we get a Russian version of Baghdad Bob. Moscow Mike perhaps?

That Russian diplomat was like John Bolton on steroids. Saying the Ukrainian ambassador should speak more Russian, making snide remarks at Samantha Power, and generally eliciting angry stares from the French.

187 Romantic Heretic  Mon, Mar 3, 2014 4:26:52pm

re: #31 Testy Toad T

Well, the Russian leaders are in this for the Russian leaders, not for the future of Russia. I don’t think Putin cares incredibly deeply about what happens in fifty years; he’ll be worm food.

They’re maximizing short-term personal profits at the expense of a healthy long-term corporate future. They learned capitalism quickly.

Not difficult as the current reigning capitalist theory is Marxist in nature.

Marx’s analysis said that capitalism will chase profits and power no matter who it hurts, and that’s pretty much what most people claiming the label of ‘capitalist’ believe these days. There also seems to be a nearly perfect overlap of these ‘capitalists’ and those also claim the title of ‘conservative’.

Strange, isn’t it?

188 Killgore Trout  Mon, Mar 3, 2014 4:26:55pm
A former CIA case officer, who also declined to be named in discussing sensitive issues, said that the agency’s focus on counter-terrorism over the last 13 years has undermined its ability to conduct traditional espionage against key adversaries, including Russia.

The CIA station in Kiev, Ukraine, “cannot be larger than two or three case officers,” the former official said. “Did they have sources that could have forecast Russian intentions? Almost certainly not.”

I seem to recall the talk of Russia being an adversary in the past election was widely mocked. I’m as guilty as anyone else on that one.

189 Gus  Mon, Mar 3, 2014 4:27:40pm

re: #183 Pie-onist Overlord

OOH

[Embedded content]

190 Pie-onist Overlord  Mon, Mar 3, 2014 4:27:56pm

And TroofDoofus luvs him some Putie! My surprise, let me show you it.

191 jonhendry  Mon, Mar 3, 2014 4:27:57pm

re: #178 Killgore Trout

For instance, how long would it take to remove insignia and other marks from military vehicles, before sending them into Ukraine?

192 Backwoods_Sleuth  Mon, Mar 3, 2014 4:28:12pm

bwahahahaaaa
*wipes eyes*
bwahahaaaaaa…….


193 Romantic Heretic  Mon, Mar 3, 2014 4:28:50pm

A friend of mine linked to the perfect theme song for Putin.

Youtube Video

194 CuriousLurker  Mon, Mar 3, 2014 4:29:48pm

re: #177 Dark_Falcon

You picked the wrong ‘Murican to victimize, Muslim!!1 Say hello to Satan for me!!!11

[DF draws an M1911A1 and opens fires]

*whistles to summon magic carpet, jumps on board just in time, shakes fist*

I’ll be back!

~~~WHOOSH~~~

195 EPR-radar  Mon, Mar 3, 2014 4:30:11pm

re: #192 Backwoods_Sleuth

If they took audience questions on that show, I’d love to see what Hannity/Palin would do with something trivial like “Is the Ukraine in the Northern Hemisphere or the Southern Hemisphere?”

196 ObserverArt  Mon, Mar 3, 2014 4:30:20pm

re: #171 Dark_Falcon

Well, it looks we’ve got a war about to happen. So I gotta get myself into a properly blood-thirsty mood, don’t I?

So, if we photoshopped a little pistol strapped to the rat it would maybe be more cute and lovable for you?

/ : )

197 Killgore Trout  Mon, Mar 3, 2014 4:30:25pm

re: #191 jonhendry

For instance, how long would it take to remove insignia and other marks from military vehicles, before sending them into Ukraine?

Just the troop mobilizations alone would have created a lot of correspondence and phone calls. I suspect this this was planned weeks ago but was delayed because Putin didn’t want the bad publicity to tarnish the Olympics.

198 darthstar  Mon, Mar 3, 2014 4:30:32pm

Putin’s move on the Ukraine has been as expensive as the Sochi Olympics were, only in a much shorter time. Granted, much of that market value can bounce back, but if enough of the money flees, it’ll take more than a savvy bitcoin investor to bring it back.

199 darthstar  Mon, Mar 3, 2014 4:31:21pm

Fuck you Rudy.

200 jhrhv  Mon, Mar 3, 2014 4:32:15pm

re: #127 CuriousLurker

Amanpour and Blitzer two reasons to drag your TV out to the sidewalk.

201 Dr Lizardo  Mon, Mar 3, 2014 4:32:55pm

re: #197 Killgore Trout

Just the troop mobilizations alone would have created a lot of correspondence and phone calls. I suspect this this was planned weeks ago but was delayed because Putin didn’t want the bad publicity to tarnish the Olympics.

You would think so; and in that case, wouldn’t our SIGINT have noted something like that?

I can’t rule out the possibility this was a spur of the moment decision.

202 Gus  Mon, Mar 3, 2014 4:32:57pm
203 darthstar  Mon, Mar 3, 2014 4:33:26pm

You’re doing a heckuva job, Pootie-poot.

204 Bubblehead II  Mon, Mar 3, 2014 4:33:34pm

Night Lizards.

Sleep well. May your nest be warm and secure .

205 Dark_Falcon  Mon, Mar 3, 2014 4:33:39pm

re: #192 Backwoods_Sleuth

bwahahahaaaa
*wipes eyes*
bwahahaaaaaa…….

[Embedded content]

Bring on the word salads and jaw-droppingly stupid DERPS.

206 Romantic Heretic  Mon, Mar 3, 2014 4:33:52pm

re: #37 Gus

[Embedded content]

Missing the Polish-Soviet War from 1919-1921.

207 Lidane  Mon, Mar 3, 2014 4:33:56pm

re: #192 Backwoods_Sleuth

Oh joy. More word salad.

208 darthstar  Mon, Mar 3, 2014 4:34:11pm

re: #202 Gus

[Embedded content]

If I didn’t have to work for a living I’d keep up with you on the twitter-fu.

209 Dark_Falcon  Mon, Mar 3, 2014 4:34:25pm

re: #202 Gus

[Embedded content]

OK, that’s a bit too nasty for my taste.

210 wrenchwench  Mon, Mar 3, 2014 4:34:30pm

re: #196 ObserverArt

So, if we photoshopped a little pistol strapped to the rat it would maybe be more cute and lovable for you?

/ : )

D_F’s had it out for rats since his bear got taken.

211 Gus  Mon, Mar 3, 2014 4:34:44pm

re: #206 Romantic Heretic

Missing the Polish-Soviet War from 1919-1921.

That one is from 1922…

212 darthstar  Mon, Mar 3, 2014 4:34:57pm

re: #209 Dark_Falcon

OK, that’s a bit too nasty for my taste.

It’s just a bare breast.

213 Killgore Trout  Mon, Mar 3, 2014 4:35:34pm

Mediaite has a longer video of the CNN discussion for added context.
CNN’s Amanpour Battles with Blitzer and Guest over Allegations of Anti-Semitism in Ukraine

CNN International Correspondent Christiane Amanpour became caught up in a heated exchange with New York University professor Stephen F. Cohen on Monday after he insisted that Russia was provoked by the Ukrainian opposition to invade Ukrainian Crimea.

Amanpour tore into Cohen for insisting that Russian President Vladimir Putin views himself as fulfilling Russia’s historic destiny and was provoked into attacking Ukraine. She insisted that Cohen explain why Russia “trumped up” a crisis regarding the threat posed by the new opposition government or that ethnic Russians were under threat in Crimea.

214 Gus  Mon, Mar 3, 2014 4:35:38pm

215 CuriousLurker  Mon, Mar 3, 2014 4:35:39pm

re: #192 Backwoods_Sleuth

bwahahahaaaa
*wipes eyes*
bwahahaaaaaa…….

[Embedded content]

re: #195 EPR-radar

If they took audience questions on that show, I’d love to see what Hannity/Palin would do with something trivial like “Is the Ukraine in the Northern Hemisphere or the Southern Hemisphere?”

When this whole thing started with her the other day I remember being fairly certain that if given an unlabeled map of Eastern Europe, there’s no way in hell she’d be able to point out Ukraine.

216 Dark_Falcon  Mon, Mar 3, 2014 4:35:42pm

re: #206 Romantic Heretic

Missing the Polish-Soviet War from 1919-1921.

Unfortunately, Russia has greatly upped its game since then. Plus they still have the nukes.

217 ObserverArt  Mon, Mar 3, 2014 4:35:59pm

re: #178 Killgore Trout

It might have been a spur of the moment decision but I doubt it. I suspect this was well planned and thought out, we just didn’t pick up on it.

I call BS. There were people here that were talking about Russia doing something about the Ukraine before the Olympic games began. If intelligent people on a political blog were considering it, I think it can be said that it was being discussed in Washington on several levels.

But then, if you can’t find a direct link to all that is being discussed by Obama and Kerry and all their staffs…well, then it may not have happened.

218 GeneJockey  Mon, Mar 3, 2014 4:36:59pm

re: #215 CuriousLurker

When this whole thing started with her the other day I remember being fairly certain that if given an unlabeled map of Eastern Europe, there’s no way in hell she’d be able to point out Ukraine.

Besides, I thought when Putin started rearing his head it’d be Alaska first.

219 Gus  Mon, Mar 3, 2014 4:37:14pm

220 Dark_Falcon  Mon, Mar 3, 2014 4:37:22pm

re: #212 darthstar

It’s just a bare breast.

I wouldn’t call a bare breast ‘nasty’, but I would use that phrase for the idea of cutting someone’s head off with a chainsaw.

221 Killgore Trout  Mon, Mar 3, 2014 4:38:07pm

re: #201 Dr Lizardo

You would think so; and in that case, wouldn’t our SIGINT have noted something like that?

I can’t rule out the possibility this was a spur of the moment decision.

The excuse given was troop mobilizations may not a raised concerns because of the Russian Naval bases regularly move troops around. Maybe but I think we just missed the clues and the Russians did a good job keeping us in the dark. Nobody, especially in Washington, likes to get the blame or acknowledge a mistake. These things happen, you can’t win them all.

222 Gus  Mon, Mar 3, 2014 4:38:20pm

re: #212 darthstar

It’s just a bare breast.

Hawt baby.

223 EPR-radar  Mon, Mar 3, 2014 4:39:04pm

re: #215 CuriousLurker

When this whole thing started with her the other day I remember being fairly certain that if given an unlabeled map of Eastern Europe, there’s no way in hell she’d be able to point out Ukraine.

That’s pretty much certain. What I’d love to see is the results of giving an unlabeled globe to everyone in Congress and asking them to point out Russia, China, Great Britain, France, Germany, India and Brazil.

224 GeneJockey  Mon, Mar 3, 2014 4:39:17pm

re: #210 wrenchwench

D_F’s had it out for rats since his bear got taken.

[Embedded image]

Every time I see that picture, I picture Uriah Heep - “I’m so ‘umble, Mr. Copperfield. So very ‘umble!”

It’s a pity the rat doesn’t have fingerless gloves…

225 Gus  Mon, Mar 3, 2014 4:39:28pm

re: #210 wrenchwench

D_F’s had it out for rats since his bear got taken.

[Embedded image]

Teh cute!

226 Lidane  Mon, Mar 3, 2014 4:39:53pm

Oh, this is too much fun:


I love that even the teabaggers here are getting tired of Stockman’s shit. It’s fun watching them attack each other.

227 ObserverArt  Mon, Mar 3, 2014 4:40:24pm

re: #199 darthstar

Fuck you Rudy.

[Embedded content]

Rudy is what I call an asshole. I think his photo is even in Webster’s next to the word and definition.

228 Gus  Mon, Mar 3, 2014 4:40:57pm

If you’re criticizing the president while saying nice things about Putin perhaps you should move to Russia.

229 Killgore Trout  Mon, Mar 3, 2014 4:41:03pm

re: #217 ObserverArt

I call BS. There were people here that were talking about Russia doing something about the Ukraine before the Olympic games began. If intelligent people on a political blog were considering it, I think it can be said that it was being discussed in Washington on several levels.

But then, if you can’t find a direct link to all that is being discussed by Obama and Kerry and all their staffs…well, then it may not have happened.

I’m sure congressional Republicans are preparing an investigation as we speak. I suspect we’ll also see a Crimea Truth movement of nuts who think Obama was in on the planning of the Russian invasion.

230 Dr Lizardo  Mon, Mar 3, 2014 4:41:53pm

re: #221 Killgore Trout

The excuse given was troop mobilizations may not a raised concerns because of the Russian Naval bases regularly move troops around. Maybe but I think we just missed the clues and the Russians did a good job keeping us in the dark. Nobody, especially in Washington, likes to get the blame or acknowledge a mistake. These things happen, you can’t win them all.

Good point. It might have been considered a troop rotation or something like that, and no one put two and two together. It happens.

231 Pie-onist Overlord  Mon, Mar 3, 2014 4:42:38pm
232 GeneJockey  Mon, Mar 3, 2014 4:43:07pm

re: #229 Killgore Trout

I’m sure congressional Republicans are preparing an investigation as we speak. I suspect we’ll also see a Crimea Truth movement of nuts who think Obama was in on the planning of the Russian invasion.

Of course they’ll simultaneously believe he doesn’t know about the invasion EVEN NOW, because he’s simultaneously a brilliant mastermind plotting to silently overthrow our sovereignty and impose SHARIA!!!! by allowing gay marriage AND too stupid to speak coherently without a teleprompter.

233 Dark_Falcon  Mon, Mar 3, 2014 4:47:31pm

It’s an election year, so the party out of power is naturally going to use any crisis to attack. That’s just The Way It Is.

BBL

234 Gus  Mon, Mar 3, 2014 4:49:40pm
235 jaunte  Mon, Mar 3, 2014 4:50:06pm
On Fox, Giuliani praises Putin: He’s “what you call a leader,” in contrast to Obama.

Of course, if the armed men were taking over Rudy’s living room, he’d call them criminals.

236 ObserverArt  Mon, Mar 3, 2014 4:50:14pm

re: #233 Dark_Falcon

It’s an election year, so the party out of power is naturally going to use any crisis to attack. That’s just The Way It Is.

BBL

But not the Way it Should Be.

I’m willing to bet you didn’t think that way after 9/11 and all through GW Bush’s admin. Fess up…

237 CuriousLurker  Mon, Mar 3, 2014 4:50:45pm

re: #232 GeneJockey

Of course they’ll simultaneously believe he doesn’t know about the invasion EVEN NOW, because he’s simultaneously a brilliant mastermind plotting to silently overthrow our sovereignty and impose SHARIA!!!! by allowing gay marriage AND too stupid to speak coherently without a teleprompter.

Heh, yeah, I’m still trying to figure out how he pulls that off. It can’t be easy to simultaneously be a thuggish, evil genius and an effeminate, bumbling idiot.

238 Fairly Sure I'm Still Obdicut  Mon, Mar 3, 2014 4:51:11pm

re: #233 Dark_Falcon

It’s an election year, so the party out of power is naturally going to use any crisis to attack. That’s just The Way It Is.

BBL

Nope. Not actually true, as easily proven by a cursory look at history.

239 austin_blue  Mon, Mar 3, 2014 4:51:22pm

Excellent OpEd by (gasp!) an expert on the Ukraine:

nytimes.com

240 Gus  Mon, Mar 3, 2014 4:53:04pm

241 Gus  Mon, Mar 3, 2014 4:54:02pm

Benito Giuliani

242 CuriousLurker  Mon, Mar 3, 2014 4:55:59pm

re: #235 jaunte

Of course, if the armed men were taking over Rudy’s living room, he’d call them criminals.

Oh man, I so wish Gus would do a Photoshop putting together bare-chested Putin & Giuliani in drag.

243 dog philosopher  Mon, Mar 3, 2014 4:56:34pm

re: #206 Romantic Heretic

Missing the Polish-Soviet War from 1919-1921.

the story of marshal pilsudski kind of gets lost in the shuffle what with all the other things that happened in europe in that era, which is a shame since he is an important and interesting character and yet another example of the authoritarianism of the time

244 MagnaniomousCoward  Mon, Mar 3, 2014 4:57:43pm

De-lurking after a long time for this.
re: #108 Justanotherhuman

This is Ukraine’s new foreign minister.

[Embedded content]

Poland calling a meeting makes a lot of sense in my view. Russia’s initial “casus belli” was related to “protecting its citizens” or “interests” in the Crimea. Every country with Russian citizens in it should notice this and make sure it doesn’t become a precedent.

It simply can’t be allowed to stand. Sending special forces into a failed state to evactuate ones own citizens is understandable and has precedent with many powers. Invading a country to protect ones own citizens there is something that I can’t remember happening since Hitler invaded Sudetenland - though it could be said to have a less Godwin-infested precedent in the Crimean war when Russia invaded Moldova and Romania to protect Orthodox Christians; and of course the 2008 Georgian war.

A somewhat tit-for-tat reaction from the rest of the world should have been to revoke all visas for Russian passport holders, except diplomats, asylum seekers and those willing to renounce their Russian citizenship, with reference to the Russian invasion in the Crimea, and explicitly saying that if Russia takes the presence of its citizens as to carry with it the right of military intervention - as if each citizen was some sort of extraterritorial area on its own right - then we don’t want Russian “interests” to walk around in our countries.

This might mean massive deportations from countries like Poland, Estonia, Lithuania, Latvia, etc., unless the people involved renounce Russian citizenship.

Rich Russian oligarchs losing their playgrounds in the West would not actually contribute to Putin’s popularity.

On the bad side, this would of course not endear those Russians to their erstwhile host countries, and it would play into the “us-vs-them” narrative in Russian media. It would be hard for Russia to criticize with a straight face though, because as far as I know there are already cases pending against Russia for its own mass deportations of Georgians and other groups.

On the positive side, perhaps this might force a positive solution for many poor stateless Russians who neither Russia nor Estonia want to recognize?

245 goddamnedfrank  Mon, Mar 3, 2014 4:59:54pm

re: #178 Killgore Trout

It might have been a spur of the moment decision but I doubt it. I suspect this was well planned and thought out, we just didn’t pick up on it.

You really think Yanukovych’s flight from office was anticipated? It all went down very quickly after the ill advised Berkut sniper assault enraged everyone. That caused mass defections within Yanu’s Party of Regions and the tide turned so swiftly against him that his bodyguards / security detail fled into the night. Then the entire administration falls, leaving in a blind panic after a half assed and ultimately failed attempt to destroy documents results in scattered dumps being found that incriminate them in all kinds of ratfuckery.

This is kind of a bizarrely improbable turn of events, it’s doubtful that Putin lays out his long term strategy counting on his puppet leaders being massively incompetent chickenshit little bitches.

246 austin_blue  Mon, Mar 3, 2014 5:00:16pm

re: #226 Lidane

Oh, this is too much fun:

[Embedded content]


I love that even the teabaggers here are getting tired of Stockman’s shit. It’s fun watching them attack each other.

The race for the Light Guv runoff is revealing, isn’t? For those of you who don’t know, the Lt. Guv in Texas is the real powerhouse of the State in Texas. The four candidates are fighting like cats, grabbing onto each other and trying to claw each other’s guts out over who is Most Conservative and Pure. They are now all to the right Attila the Hun (aka The Scourge of God). We’ll see who goes through tomorrow to the inevitable runoff. They are spending money like it’s water.

Well, water in other States.

247 jaunte  Mon, Mar 3, 2014 5:04:20pm

re: #246 austin_blue

who is Most Conservative and Pure

The candidates should do an all night prayer vigil, standing neck-deep in Lake Travis.

248 MagnaniomousCoward  Mon, Mar 3, 2014 5:05:03pm

re: #245 goddamnedfrank

Yes, the Russian reaction seems to be a bit of a panic move. Like some crisis plan they’ve made but which doesn’t actually fit with the reality that they were presented with. The plan probably called for weeks of trumping up anti-Russian abuses before sending in the troops.

I think Putin was simply caught off-guard, and worried just as much for the same thing happening in Russia as of losing the convenient basing for the Black Sea Fleet. In other words, maybe the internal situation in Russia has more to say than geopolitical concerns.

249 austin_blue  Mon, Mar 3, 2014 5:06:01pm

re: #245 goddamnedfrank

You really think Yanukovych’s flight from office was anticipated? It all went down very quickly after the ill advised Berkut sniper assault enraged everyone. That caused mass defections within Yanu’s Party of Regions and the tide turned so swiftly against him that his bodyguards / security detail fled into the night. The the entire administration falls, leaving in a blind panic after a half assed and ultimately failed attempt to destroy documents results in scattered dumps being found that incriminate them in all kinds of ratfuckery.

This is kind of a bizarrely improbable turn of events, it’s doubtful that Putin lays out his long term strategy counting on his puppet leaders being massively incompetent chickenshit little bitches.

Well, massively rich little bitches, anyway. There was an NPR report the other day that estimated that the Kleptocrats rifled over $40 billion from the country in the last 5 years.

Now, that’s an impressive little bank robbery.

250 Justanotherhuman  Mon, Mar 3, 2014 5:09:28pm

United States suspends all military engagements with Russia - including joint exercises, talks and conferences - over Ukraine incursion - @Reuters

end of alert

251 Lidane  Mon, Mar 3, 2014 5:11:17pm

re: #246 austin_blue

The race for the Light Guv runoff is revealing, isn’t? For those of you who don’t know, the Lt. Guv in Texas is the real powerhouse of the State in Texas. The four candidates are fighting like cats, grabbing onto each other and trying to claw each other’s guts out over who is Most Conservative and Pure. They are now all to the right Attila the Hun (aka The Scourge of God). We’ll see who goes through tomorrow to the inevitable runoff. They are spending money like it’s water.

Well, water in other States.

The Lite Guv race makes me want to throw things, especially every time Dewhurst opens his pie hole. God he irritates me. Blah.

I wonder what Molly Ivins would have made of all this garbage. She would’ve had a field day, especially with Ted Cruz.

252 dr. luba  Mon, Mar 3, 2014 5:12:00pm

re: #195 EPR-radar

If they took audience questions on that show, I’d love to see what Hannity/Palin would do with something trivial like “Is the Ukraine in the Northern Hemisphere or the Southern Hemisphere?”

“All of them, Katie.”

253 Killgore Trout  Mon, Mar 3, 2014 5:12:26pm

MSNBC’s Most Embarrassing Mockery of Romney’s Russia Warnings
They’re all pretty good but the Maddow/O’Donnell segment is my favorite. c’mon, ya gotta laugh.

254 Gus  Mon, Mar 3, 2014 5:12:27pm
255 Gus  Mon, Mar 3, 2014 5:13:30pm

re: #253 Killgore Trout

MSNBC’s Most Embarrassing Mockery of Romney’s Russia Warnings
They’re all pretty good but the Maddow/O’Donnell segment is my favorite. c’mon, ya gotta laugh.

Bush and Georgia
Updated Aug. 13, 2008 12:01 a.m. ET

On June 13, 1948, the day after the Soviet Union took the first step in its blockade of Berlin, U.S. General Lucius Clay sent a cable to Washington making the case for standing up to the Soviets. “We are convinced that our remaining in Berlin is essential to our prestige in Germany and in Europe. Whether for good or bad, it has become a symbol of the American intent.” The Berlin Airlift began 13 days later.

Sixty years on, U.S. credibility is again on the line as the Bush Administration stumbles to respond to the Russian invasion of Georgia. So far the Administration has been missing in action, to put it mildly. The strategic objective is twofold: to prevent Moscow from going further to topple Georgia’s democratic government in the coming days, and to deter future Russian aggression.
* * *

President Bush finally condemned Russia’s actions on Monday after a weekend of Olympics tourism in Beijing while Georgia burned. Meanwhile, the State Department dispatched a mid-level official to Tbilisi, and unnamed Administration officials carped to the press that Washington had warned Georgia not to provoke Moscow. That’s hardly a show of solidarity with a Eurasian democracy that has supported the U.S. in Iraq with 2,000 troops.

Compared to this August U.S. lethargy, the French look like Winston Churchill. In Moscow yesterday, French President Nicolas Sarkozy, acting as president of the European Union, got Russia to agree to a provisional cease-fire that could return both parties’ troops to their positions before the conflict started. His next stop was Tbilisi, on the heels of a visit from Foreign Minister Bernard Kouchner.

If both sides agree to a cease-fire, Mr. Sarkozy promises that Europe will consider sending peacekeepers to enforce it. We trust he will find volunteers from the former Soviet republics, which see the writing on the wall if Russian aggression in Georgia is left unchallenged. The leaders of Poland, Ukraine, Latvia, Lithuania and Estonia flew to Tbilisi this week in a show of solidarity.

NATO also met yesterday and denounced the invasion, while stopping short of promising military aid to Georgia. Secretary General Jaap de Hoop Scheffer said the allies “condemned and deplored [Russia’s] excessive, disproportionate use of force,” and demanded a return to the status quo ante.

The NATO leader also said Georgia’s potential membership remains “very much alive” and that it would be a member of NATO one day. Georgia and Ukraine’s applications come up again in December, and perhaps even Germany, which blocked their membership bids earlier this year, will now rethink its objections given that its refusal may have encouraged Russia to assume it could reassert control over its “near abroad.”

Much as it respects and owes Georgia, the U.S. is not going to war with Russia over a non-NATO ally. But there are forceful diplomatic and economic responses at its disposal. Expelling Russia from the G-8 group of democracies, as John McCain has suggested, is one. Barring Russia’s long desired entry into the World Trade Organization is another. Russian leaders should also be told that their financial assets held abroad aren’t off limits to sanction. And Moscow should know that the 2014 Winter Olympics in Sochi on the Black Sea are in jeopardy. A country that starts a war on the weekend the Beijing Olympics began doesn’t deserve such an honor.

The Georgian people also deserve U.S. support. One way to demonstrate that would be a “Tbilisi airlift,” ferrying military and humanitarian supplies to the Georgian capital, which is currently cut off by Russian troops from its Black Sea port. Secretary of State Rice or Defense Secretary Robert Gates should be in one of the first planes. After the fighting ends, the U.S. can lead the recovery effort. And since the Russians are demanding his ouster, Georgian President Mikheil Saakashvili deserves U.S. support too. Moscow wants a puppet leader in Tbilisi, and U.S. officials are playing into Valdimir Putin’s hands with their media whispers that this is all Mr. Saakashvili’s fault.

Reshaping U.S. policy toward Russia will take longer than the months between now and January 20, when a new President takes office. But Mr. Bush can at least atone for his earlier misjudgments about Mr. Putin and steer policy in a new direction that his successor would have to deal with. If that successor is Barack Obama, this is an opportunity to shape a crucial foreign policy issue for a novice who could very well go in the wrong direction.
* * *

The alternative is ending Mr. Bush’s tenure on a Carter-esque note of weakness. To paraphrase General Clay: Whether for good or bad, how the U.S. responds to Russia’s aggression in Georgia has become a symbol of American credibility. By trying to Finlandize if not destroy Georgia, Moscow is sending a message that, in its part of the world, being close to Washington can be fatal. If Mr. Bush doesn’t revisit his Russian failures, the rout of Georgia will stand as the embarrassing coda to his Presidency.

256 Killgore Trout  Mon, Mar 3, 2014 5:14:02pm

Ok, I just made it to the end of the Chris Mathews segment. I think that one has to be the dumbest.

257 Killgore Trout  Mon, Mar 3, 2014 5:15:46pm

re: #255 Gus

>Bush and Georgia
Updated Aug. 13, 2008 12:01 a.m. ET

Yup, there’s not much we can do again. I have plenty of problems with Obama’s foreign policy lately but I don’t think Ukraine is his fault.

258 Gus  Mon, Mar 3, 2014 5:16:23pm



259 dr. luba  Mon, Mar 3, 2014 5:17:05pm

re: #244 MagnaniomousCoward

De-lurking after a long time for this.


Poland calling a meeting makes a lot of sense in my view. Russia’s initial “casus belli” was related to “protecting its citizens” or “interests” in the Crimea. Every country with Russian citizens in it should notice this and make sure it doesn’t become a precedent.

I was under the impression that he was protecting not just Russian citizens, but Russian SPEAKERS. Because few Ukrainians are Russian citizens, but 99% of them speak Russian.

This definitely worries even Kazakhstan and Belarus; the Baltic states are a given.

260 Killgore Trout  Mon, Mar 3, 2014 5:17:15pm

re: #254 Gus

[Embedded content]

A lot of 80’s stuff doesn’t hold up well but she’s got a great voice. The days before auto-tune too.

261 Charles Johnson  Mon, Mar 3, 2014 5:17:23pm

re: #258 Gus

Vladimir “Poutine?” lol

262 Justanotherhuman  Mon, Mar 3, 2014 5:17:34pm

Ukrainian experts say Russian invasion was years in making

kyivpost.com

“The Russian military invasion of Ukraine has been in the works for years, but still left Ukrainian officials unprepared while other former officials appeared to be working in cahoots with the Kremlin, according to experts who spoke at a news conference in Kyiv today.

(snip)

“Vitaly Portnikov, a journalist, said there were signs that defense officials in the government of ousted President Viktor Yanukovych were acting in Russian interests.

“Who were these people - (Pavlo) Lebedev (former defense minister) or (Oleksandr) Yakymenko (former Security Services of Ukraine chief)?” Portnikov asked. “Both officials were Russian-born and served for years in Russia. And another defense minister, Dmytro Salamatin, was a relative (son-in-law) of former Russian Prime Minister Oleg Soskovets!” Portnikov said. “These people were working for the destruction of Ukraine’s armed forces for years.”

263 Fairly Sure I'm Still Obdicut  Mon, Mar 3, 2014 5:19:39pm

re: #262 Justanotherhuman

It would make a lot of sense if this was supposed to happen while the old Ukranian government was still in charge.

264 austin_blue  Mon, Mar 3, 2014 5:21:38pm

re: #251 Lidane

The Lite Guv race makes me want to throw things, especially every time Dewhurst opens his pie hole. God he irritates me. Blah.

I wonder what Molly Ivins would have made of all this garbage. She would’ve had a field day, especially with Ted Cruz.

You know, before her cancer came back for the last time, Molly used to have a Final Friday at her house every month in Travis Heights. Everyone would go over with food and booze, and we’d sit outside smoking’ and drinkin’ and gab about politics, the State of the World, and, especially, Texas politics. Molly was an absolute hoot. I miss her dearly.

But, ooh!!! We are under a Winter Storm Warning tonight with the possibility of THUNDERSLEET!!

I’ve been in a ThunderBlizzard, but I’ve never seen THUNDERSLEET!!

That would be an excellent name for a rock band.

265 Killgore Trout  Mon, Mar 3, 2014 5:21:48pm

re: #261 Charles Johnson

Vladimir “Poutine?” lol

It gets funnier. The protesters are French, they had to change the spelling
The funny thing about Putin, is that it means “whore” in French

266 jaunte  Mon, Mar 3, 2014 5:22:12pm
267 Gus  Mon, Mar 3, 2014 5:23:08pm

Frankly, I think the hawks are hyping this up way out of proportion. Nothing new.

268 Dr Lizardo  Mon, Mar 3, 2014 5:24:10pm

re: #263 Fairly Sure I’m Still Obdicut

It would make a lot of sense if this was supposed to happen while the old Ukranian government was still in charge.

Yanukovych’s abrupt departure must have upset matters; perhaps the idea was to roll in while Yanuk was still in charge in Kyiv in order to “restore order”, at Yanukovych’s ‘request’, of course.

When he skedaddled, it altered plans to an extent. Perhaps there was an original idea to invade all of Ukraine, but with Yanuk gone, they decided to settle on Crimea and consolidate matters there. They’ve already ginned up a secessionist movement and a March 30th referendum.

269 Killgore Trout  Mon, Mar 3, 2014 5:24:29pm
It can also mean “f*ck” and lots of other nasty things.

It’s not the first time I’ve had a bit of a blip with my French. I remember the first time I went into a grocery story to buy some duck pâté, which I discovered here when I was 19, and adore to this day. I went up to the butcher and instead of asking for “pâté de canard,” I asked if he had any “pâté de connard.” The man laughed heartily because the adorable foreigner had just asked for some “asshole pâté.”

lol

270 Justanotherhuman  Mon, Mar 3, 2014 5:24:40pm

re: #263 Fairly Sure I’m Still Obdicut

It would make a lot of sense if this was supposed to happen while the old Ukranian government was still in charge.

Russia might not have thought Euromaidan could pull anything off during those months they were on the ground in Kiev. Surprise! Yanuk didn’t hold up, either, and fled when he finally got the message he would be impeached.

There were a number of former Russian apparatchiks (prior to Ukr’s independence) who were in the Rada over the last 20 yrs.

271 dog philosopher  Mon, Mar 3, 2014 5:27:20pm

re: #253 Killgore Trout

MSNBC’s Most Embarrassing Mockery of Romney’s Russia Warnings
They’re all pretty good but the Maddow/O’Donnell segment is my favorite. c’mon, ya gotta laugh.

were any of them as bad as bush’s cozying up to putin?

Bush talked with Hewitt about his book, “Decision Points,” in which he relates for the first time the particular exchange with Putin that led him to make his famous comment at a press conference in Slovenia in June 2001.

“The reason why I said that is because I remembered him talking movingly about his mother and the cross that she gave him that she had blessed in Jerusalem,” Bush told Hewitt. “Nobody knows that, and I never tried to make an explanation of why I said what I said until the book.”

In the book, Bush writes that he interrupted Putin as the then-Russian President spoke from note cards and “seemed a little tense.” Bush asked whether the story of his mother giving him a cross was true, and writes that “a look of shock washed over Putin’s face.”

Putin then told the story of recovering the cross from a house fire and said that when a worker found the piece of jewelry it was as if it was meant to be. Bush writes that he remarked, “Vladimir, that is the story of the cross. Things are meant to be.”

272 CuriousLurker  Mon, Mar 3, 2014 5:28:29pm

re: #259 dr. luba

I was under the impression that he was protecting not just Russian citizens, but Russian SPEAKERS. Because few Ukrainians are Russian citizens, but 99% of them speak Russian.

This definitely worries even Kazakhstan and Belarus; the Baltic states are a given.

My understanding was that he was protecting ethnic Russians, not necessarily Russian citizens or people who speak Russian.

273 goddamnedfrank  Mon, Mar 3, 2014 5:30:07pm

re: #266 jaunte

[Embedded content]

Russia calling Ukraine corrupt is like this:

Youtube Video

274 jonhendry  Mon, Mar 3, 2014 5:31:50pm

re: #213 Killgore Trout

FYI Stephen F. Cohen of NYU is married to Katrina vanden Heuvel of The Nation.

275 jonhendry  Mon, Mar 3, 2014 5:45:02pm

re: #233 Dark_Falcon

They don’t usually do so while simultaneously applauding the foreign leader causing the crisis.

276 jonhendry  Mon, Mar 3, 2014 5:45:49pm

re: #271 dog philosopher

“Things are meant to be”

Sounds like Bush’s attitude about Iraq.

277 MagnaniomousCoward  Mon, Mar 3, 2014 5:53:06pm

re: #259 dr. luba

I think Russia has been liberal with giving Russian passports to Ukrainian Russian speakers who want it. There are hundreds of thousands with dual Ukraininan and Russian citizenship. Ukraina has just ignored dual citizenship until now, but after Maidan Ukraina is considering outlawing dual citizenship precisely for this reason.

This in contrast to stateless Russians in the Baltic countries which neither their country of residence, nor Russia, wants to deal with - they’re stuck in a sort of limbo. (I know somebody who runs a charity that helps, among others, stateless Russians in the Baltics.)

278 MagnaniomousCoward  Mon, Mar 3, 2014 5:55:16pm

By the way I enjoyed the fact that the Ukrainian UN ambassador is a Russian speaking Ukraininan, and said in the Security Council meeting he didn’t need Russia to rescue him. In Russian no less.

279 dr. luba  Mon, Mar 3, 2014 6:10:08pm

re: #272 CuriousLurker

My understanding was that he was protecting ethnic Russians, not necessarily Russian citizens or people who speak Russian.

Reuters: “Russian President Vladimir Putin told U.S. President Barack Obama that Moscow reserved the right to protect its interests and those of Russian speakers in Ukraine if they come under threat, the Kremlin said.”

280 MagnaniomousCoward  Mon, Mar 3, 2014 6:16:24pm

I’d better throw away my Russian dictionary then.

It’s like the “Dark one” in Wheel of time, or a certain troll here on LFG. If you speak his name, the evil one appears. Except here if you speak Russian, a humanitarian intervention of anonymous armed dudes in unmarked uniforms appear.


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