Pages

7 comments

Jump to bottom
2 Political Atheist  Thu, Feb 14, 2013 1:08:12pm

Uh huh. Well love to see how hitting speeds of 80 MPH effects range. Too bad acceleration is not shown.Look s like 2 companies pushing the truth out of shape-One media one car maker. Car reviewers did hit the accelerator hard and often, exploring performance as if it were a gas engine.

Argument 3: Musk writes that “Cruise control was never set to 54 mph as claimed in the article, nor did he limp along at 45 mph.” This refers to the second part of Broder’s sentence about turning down the heat, “I turned the climate control to low — the temperature was still in the 30s — and planted myself in the far right lane with the cruise control set at 54 miles per hour,” and then again when he was in Norwich: “The displayed range never reached the number of miles remaining to Milford, and as I limped along at about 45 miles per hour I saw increasingly dire dashboard warnings to recharge immediately.” Musk places that first part again at 182 miles in and the second part at around mile 410. We’ve blocked off both those sections.

Convincing? Yes, then no. The speeds look a bit higher for both parts, almost reaching 70 at some points on the leg to NY, which does not jibe with the 54 mph cruise control. But the section before he broke down it does look like he chugged along at a pretty low speed.

They talk 70 mph, yet the real high speed reached was 80. Check gas car efficiency at 80 vs 55. Massive difference in range.

80 mph is a “bit higher” than 54? Could I please get a salary raise that is a “bit higher” like that?

3 Political Atheist  Thu, Feb 14, 2013 1:17:45pm

Car And driver did not experience troubles like this guy did.

[Link: www.caranddriver.com…]
Those of us who like cars propelled by closely spaced, tiny explosions don’t easily warm up to electric power. It’s not just our troglodytic affection for an urgently revving engine, a crisp redline shift, and the earthy whiff of gasoline. The reality is that most electric cars simply haven’t been very good.

Optimized for high mileage ratings, current electric cars are small and slow. Even worse, none has sufficient range to be truly useful, unless your duty cycle consists of driving no farther than the nearest grocery store. It’s no surprise that electric cars are selling like stale cowpies.

Then along comes the Tesla Model S from Elon Musk, he of PayPal and SpaceX, to change our perceptions about cars powered by electrons. For example, in one day, our photographer drove the fully charged car for 30 to 40 miles—already half the range of a Nissan Leaf. Then I drove it 30 miles to dinner and to a friend’s home another 40 miles away before taking the long way back to Ann Arbor. After gallivanting all over Detroit’s sprawling metro area, I returned to Car and Driver headquarters to polish off the last few miles. Our measured range was 211 miles—not quite the EPA-predicted 265—but impressive, given our 75-to-80-mph highway speeds.

4 Mattand  Thu, Feb 14, 2013 1:36:52pm

Deleted for being off-topic by author. Apologies.

5 kirkspencer  Thu, Feb 14, 2013 2:58:43pm

re: #1 Charles Johnson

However:

Elon Musk’s Data Doesn’t Back Up His Claims of New York Times Fakery - Technology - the Atlantic Wire

That article looks a lot like some of the fact-check articles I’ve seen around. Parsing and interpretation for the win.

One thing - mentioned in comments - that I think isolates the whole issue. Broder charged to “32 miles remaining” for his last leg, which had a distance of 61 miles. That’s the one where he “broke down” (ran completely out) at the 54 mile point, the one at the end. His reason - he wanted to test against how “real world” drivers would use it, not wanting to stand around for a full charge.

OK, I get not wanting to stand around for a full charge - an hour and a half, slow station - for what’s only going to be another hour on the road. But nobody I know, looking at 60 miles to go, puts half that amount of fuel in the gas tank. And having done so, nobody I know would then blame the manufacturer for not having better fuel efficiency.

There are, indeed, some places where the aforementioned parsing and interpretation might apply. But this last bit is the one that clinches the decision for me. Broder can claim the car didn’t stand up to how he drove, but he’s wrong when he says, “I didn’t do anything wrong.”

6 Political Atheist  Thu, Feb 14, 2013 3:21:31pm

re: #5 kirkspencer

This got me looking further. It’s not hard to find tests where the car performed as expected or better. I think some automotive writers just do not understand the fundamental difference of an EV and gas. I think some of these guys approach an EV to test with gasoline car expectations from long habit.

==================
[Link: www.edmunds.com…]
We’re 120 miles from home base and our 2012 Tesla Model S sits quiet in a roadside turnout on the Pacific Coast Highway.

But this pure electric luxury sedan isn’t stranded with its battery perilously low on juice. No, we came to this remote stretch of unspoiled coastline on purpose, taking advantage of a lull in our schedule to go for a drive for the pure enjoyment of it.

With 265 miles of EPA-rated range on tap, we’re sitting here munching our lunch and admiring the view with a battery that’s still more than half full. We’ll make it home comfortably the same way we got here — at prevailing freeway speeds, with the A/C on and the stereo thumping.

Why so confident? Because yesterday we drove the Tesla 267 miles on a single charge, and it was on our suburban city test loop, which includes plenty of stop-and-go driving along the way.

==================
[Link: www.autoblog.com…]

First, the good news. Motor Trend ran a battery of tests on the Model S, and its independent measurements discovered the following ways that their independent testing beat the manufacturer’s official numbers:

0-60 time: 3.9 seconds (Tesla official number is 4.4 seconds)
Quarter mile: 12.5 seconds at 110.9 mph (12.6 seconds)
100.7 MPGe during a 200+ mile drive (EPA says 89 MPGe).

So, then, what’s the bad news? At roughly 65 mph with no A/C, MT “only” got 238 miles out of the battery. That’s less than advertised, but MT offers an important and reasonable take on this issue:

“But the range that matters is really a psychological/perceptual one, not a specific number. Think about it: We drove from Fontana on the eastern edge of the L.A. basin to San Diego and all the way back to L.A.’s Pacific edge on one charge. Five hours of continuous driving. This is a breakthrough accomplishment that ought to knock down the range anxiety barrier that’s substantially limited EV sales.”

Word.

7 goddamnedfrank  Fri, Feb 15, 2013 3:23:33pm

The power required to push through aerodynamic drag increases with the cube of the velocity. Any time Broder spent at 85 mph he was draining the batteries at 2.23 times the normal drain rate at 65 mph.

This whole argument about the velocities not being that different is rooted in a fundamental misunderstanding of the physical world. Every doubling of velocity relative to the air mass results in an eightfold increase in the power required just to maintain that velocity.


This page has been archived.
Comments are closed.

^ back to top ^

TwitterFacebook

Turn off all ads for a full year by subscribing!
For about 33 cents a day (per month) or 22 cents a day (per year), our subscription option turns off all advertisements at LGF!
Read more...

► LGF Headlines

  • Loading...

► Tweeted Articles

  • Loading...

► Tweeted Pages

  • Loading...

► Top 10 Comments

  • Loading...

► Bottom Comments

  • Loading...

► Recent Comments

  • Loading...

► Tools/Info

► Tag Cloud

► Contact

You must have Javascript enabled to use the contact form.
Your email:

Subject:

Message:


Messages may be published unless you request otherwise.
Tech Note:
Using the Contact Form
LGF Pages

This button leads to the main index of LGF Pages, our user-submitted articles. You can post your own LGF Pages simply by registering a free account with us.

Create a Page

This is the LGF Pages posting bookmarklet. To use it, drag this button to your browser's bookmark bar, and title it 'LGF Pages' (or whatever you like). Then browse to a site you want to post, select some text on the page to use for a quote, click the bookmarklet, and the Pages posting window will appear with the title, text, and any embedded video or audio files already filled in, ready to go.

Or... you can just click this button to open the Pages posting window right away.

Last updated: 2014-03-07 2:19 pm PST

LGF User's Guide
Recent Pages
Randall Gross
Galia Social - Warning Signs
facebook.comgaliasocial.bandcamp.comreverbnation.comOur previous In-Studio video:

2 hours, 58 minutes ago
Views: 56 • Comments: 0
Tweets: 0 • Rating: 0
The Vicious Fergushka
The Scientific Explanation of Why People Kill Each Other Over TVs on Black Friday
More: The Scientific Explanation of Why People Kill Each Other Over TVs on Black Friday What causes people to kick, shove and even stab each other on Black Friday? Each year there are reports of violence during the Black Friday ...

3 days, 10 hours ago
Views: 427 • Comments: 3
Tweets: 6 • Rating: 1
Skip Intro
Anti-Gay Hate Preacher Accidentally Tweets 4,000 Followers Cartoon Clip of Him ‘Confessing’ to Be a ‘Homosexual Sodomite’
Adam Reakes Promotes Truth That Starbucks Markets Semen Laced Lattes http://t.co/RY06dEEb0I— James David Manning (@DrJamesDManning) November 20, 2014

3 days, 12 hours ago
Views: 646 • Comments: 0
Tweets: 0 • Rating: 1
Lumberhead
One Man Should Not Dictate Immigration Policy
Well played. You know, the more I mull over the Republican complaint about how immigration reform is being implemented, the more I sympathize with them. Public policy, especially on big, hot button issues like immigration shouldn't be made by one ...

4 days, 5 hours ago
Views: 437 • Comments: 6
Tweets: 0 • Rating: 7
teleskiguy
“Chelsea Hotel” performed by Tal Wilkenfeld
I first saw Austrailian bass player Tal Wilkenfeld play with Jeff Beck (not live, mind you. On YouTube) and was amazed at her skills and chops. She was only 20 when she scored that gig. She's coming into her own ...

6 days, 2 hours ago
Views: 309 • Comments: 0
Tweets: 0 • Rating: 5
FemNaziBitch
History of Laws Concerning Immigration and Naturalization in the United States -WIKI
The United States Constitution was adopted on September 17, 1787. Article I, section 8, clause 4 of the Constitution expressly gives the United States Congress the power to establish a uniform rule of naturalization.[1] Pursuant to this power, Congress ...

6 days, 11 hours ago
Views: 426 • Comments: 1
Tweets: 1 • Rating: 3
MichaelJ
COMFORTABLY NUMB - Peahi Nov 12 on Vimeo
Channel angle of the Nov 12th swell at Peahi.

1 week, 3 days ago
Views: 571 • Comments: 0
Tweets: 1 • Rating: 2
Romantic Heretic
Money Makes Us Less Rational
Here's an interesting article on scientific studies that demonstrate how rationality and empathy break down is the presence of large amounts of money.

1 week, 5 days ago
Views: 779 • Comments: 2
Tweets: 0 • Rating: 2
 Frank says:

I'd like to know who's Plunkin' the monkeys? -- It was on the Tonight Show with Johnny Carson. I can't remember the year maybe 10 years ago? They were talking about AIDS and how AIDS all got started, he had 3 theory's. First Frank said something about AIDS being a government test gone wrong Then maybe it was an Alien (ET) test or mistake and finally they talked about the theory of AIDS coming from a monkey and then Frank said " I'd like to know who's plunkin' the monkey's?"