At Pat Robertson's Site, Herman Cain Pulls Out An Even More Extreme Abortion Position

At Pat Robertson’s Site, Herman Cain Pulls Out An Even More Extreme Abortion Position

A complete ban on all abortions, and on gay marriage

WingnutsOctober 2011 • Views: 31,774

Herman Cain posing with anti-Muslim hate monger Pamela GellerHerman Cain’s advisers have him going around to all the far right Christian outlets this weekend, desperately walking back his absurd self-contradictory statements on abortion. After trying to snow the cable news networks into believing he might be sort of “pro-choice,” Cain went to Pat Robertson’s CBN News and told religio-political correspondent David Brody that he’s now in favor of a complete ban on all abortion and on gay marriage, enforced with constitutional amendments.

David Brody: “Are you for some sort of pro-life amendment to the constitution that in essence would trump Roe v. Wade?”

Herman Cain:� “Yes. Yes I feel that strongly about it. If we can get the necessary support and it comes to my desk I’ll sign it. That’s all I can do. I will sign it.”

David Brody: (In your Faith and Freedom speech) “You mentioned marriage as well so you’re also, just so I understand, you’re for a constitutional marriage amendment as well?”

Herman Cain: “I think marriage should be protected at the federal level also. I used to believe that it could be just handled by the states but there’s a movement going on to basically take the teeth out of the 1996 Defense of Marriage Act and that could cause an unraveling, so we do need some protection at the federal level because of that and so yes I would support legislation that would say that it’s between a man and a woman.”

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126 comments

Holidays are Family Fun Time Sun, Oct 23, 2011 11:20:07am

So, he's pandering.

Did he realize cameras, cell phones were present. THE WHOLE WORLD would know what he said?

Four More Tears Sun, Oct 23, 2011 11:20:42am

Cain on abortion: Nein! Nein! Nein!

Mad Prophet Ludwig Sun, Oct 23, 2011 11:26:08am

Repost, but related. Some serious questions.

There are certain categories of people I simply do not understand. I can't understand them no matter how hard I try. I am not trying to be snarky in this post actually. I am genuinely befuddled.

Woman Republicans Do these women really think that the core of the white male power structure is going to help them as they push for reducing the ability of working mothers to have maternity benefits, maternity leave, reduced or eliminated access to birth control and would rather see women die than have a medically necessary abortion? How can mothers like to see education destroyed in this nation? How can mothers come out against the first lady telling kids to eat more vegetables?

I don't get it.

Black Republicans How can any black person who isn't utterly self hating, or at least full of contempt for other black people, be part of a party that paints black people as the enemies of America, a seething pool of communists, anarchists, Muslim extremists and scary new black panthers? How can any black person who isn't utterly self hating, or at least full of contempt for other black people, deny the terrible history of racism and slavery in this nation to the extent that they pretend that black people are playing on a level playing field, and then pretend it is all the fault of the black community that they do not have economic opportunity or are part of a system that requires great fortune or deeply uncommon human ability to overcome?

Gay Republicans Yeah... they disapprove of their own lifestyle? Sorry. Those ones I guess I do understand, they are simply stupid and have deluded themselves into thinking that they are somehow immune to what their party wants for them.

Orthodox Jewish Republicans Newsflash you pious hypocrites, Torah says you need to be kind to the poor. It is one of the few commandments that even explains why there will always be poor and what our duty is... And while we are at it, do you really think that people who want us in our own homeland, so that we can bring about their demented apocalypse and then convert or burn in hell are our friends? In what universe? I try to understand these ones, but they are so far from Torah and so hypocritical and stupid, that my Jewish pride is hurt by thinking about them too much.

Leftists who Hate Israel Yeah great, bash the one non- theocracy or brutal dictatorship or brutal military junta in the region. Bash the one government that is generally favourable to socialist ideas, gives rights to women and asylum to gay people (as in gay Arabs who would be murdered in their own nations) is pro education, strongly environmentalist and gives equal protection under the law to all of its citizens.

For all of these groups... I can only wonder, do they just not read? What makes them so utterly delusional and willing to act against their own beliefs and best interests?

SpaceJesus Sun, Oct 23, 2011 11:29:23am

"Herman Cain: “I think marriage should be protected at the federal level also. I used to believe that it could be just handled by the states but there’s a movement going on to basically take the teeth out of the 1996 Defense of Marriage Act and that could cause an unraveling, so we do need some protection at the federal level because of that and so yes I would support legislation that would say that it’s between a man and a woman."

DOMA is federal law, you fucking twit

windsagio Sun, Oct 23, 2011 11:29:32am

re: #3 LudwigVanQuixote

The trick with conservative christian and jewish republicans is actually pretty straightforward. Very strong fundamentalist religious folks are very easy to nab with wedge issues, like this whole Cain/abortion thing shows.

Add that to the general sense people have of a nation in moral decay, and there you are.

About your other points, I think it has to do with the Republican Wealth Fantasy (tm).

Those 2 things are the entire base of the republican party.

Lidane Sun, Oct 23, 2011 11:31:04am

re: #3 LudwigVanQuixote

What makes them so utterly delusional and willing to act against their own beliefs and best interests?

I've been asking that question about people who earn under $250k and vote Republican for decades. There's no reason for anyone who is blue collar or middle class to vote for the GOP. All of their policies are intended to screw them over. WTF.

Holidays are Family Fun Time Sun, Oct 23, 2011 11:31:25am

It seems that the Whacko Christians are the least likely to view a human being as a Person instead of a categeory.

windsagio Sun, Oct 23, 2011 11:31:57am

re: #6 Lidane

again, its that dream that some day they'll be the wealthy ones, and then once they're on top they don't want hte government taking all their hard earned cash...

Except they don't realize the system is designed to keep them from getting there :p

allegro Sun, Oct 23, 2011 11:33:25am

re: #7 ggt

It seems that the Whacko Christians are the least likely to view a human being as a Person instead of a categeory.

If they had the ability/desire to think for themselves and become educated in Reality they wouldn't be Whacko Christians looking to someone else to tell them how to live/feel/think.

freetoken Sun, Oct 23, 2011 11:33:50am

re: #3 LudwigVanQuixote

"Republican" is a label to which people attach themselves, and it becomes part of the self-identity. People usually don't give up their identities easily, as we've seen around here when somebody doggedly won't let go of calling themselves "conservative" or "Republican" even if they give assent to your critique of the idiocy of many of the positions held many who also label themselves by those terms.

Mad Prophet Ludwig Sun, Oct 23, 2011 11:34:08am

re: #6 Lidane

I've been asking that question about people who earn under $250k and vote Republican for decades. There's no reason for anyone who is blue collar or middle class to vote for the GOP. All of their policies are intended to screw them over. WTF.

A lot of those, I can understand as simply buying into the wealth fantasy and a bunch of economic drivel coupled with good old fashioned religious zealotry, racism, blind jingoism or some combination thereof. It doesn't make them less deluded or stupid. It simply is my working model.

Face it. The average GOP voter couldn't do basic math or pass a basic history test to save his little white ass. They are fearful, ignorant and easily lied to and hence easily led. The stupid sheep of the Red States are all too easy to get.

Mad Prophet Ludwig Sun, Oct 23, 2011 11:34:55am

re: #10 freetoken

"Republican" is a label to which people attach themselves, and it becomes part of the self-identity. People usually don't give up their identities easily, as we've seen around here when somebody doggedly won't let go of calling themselves "conservative" or "Republican" even if they give assent to your critique of the idiocy of many of the positions held many who also label themselves by those terms.

Even to the extent of self destruction... Remarkable for groups that have never before been traditionally Republican.

Holidays are Family Fun Time Sun, Oct 23, 2011 11:35:15am

I think I get it.

It's random chance, blind luck that I was born a white person in an educated middle class famly in the USA.

I'm not about to think that it is divine proof that I deserve anything I"m not able to acheive on my own.

others do?

Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton Sun, Oct 23, 2011 11:36:36am

Herman Cain is the most reliable random numbers generator these days.

windsagio Sun, Oct 23, 2011 11:36:54am

re: #13 ggt

The Curse of Ham thing definitely comes to mind.

allegro Sun, Oct 23, 2011 11:37:57am

re: #13 ggt

I think I get it.

It's random chance, blind luck that I was born a white person in an educated middle class famly in the USA.

I'm not about to think that it is divine proof that I deserve anything I"m not able to acheive on my own.

others do?

Some of us were born with red hair. We KNOW we're divine.

/// /// ///

windsagio Sun, Oct 23, 2011 11:38:19am

re: #16 allegro

Or, more likely without souls.

palomino Sun, Oct 23, 2011 11:38:47am

Cain is so politically illiterate that he doesn't even know that the prez has no formal role in the passage of const. amendments. There would be nothing for him to sign under any circumstances. It's all done by Congress and individual state legislatures.

If he thinks he can sign a Congressional act overturning Roe, he's once again misinformed. Congress doesn't have the power to overrule SC decisions, regardless of what Perry and Cain fantasize about.

Lidane Sun, Oct 23, 2011 11:38:57am

re: #13 ggt

Since I'm atheist, I leave the divine questions to other people. Heh.

That said, I guess my whole thing is that I vote my current circumstances, not what I'd like to see. Maybe that's the difference?

windsagio Sun, Oct 23, 2011 11:39:47am

re: #19 Lidane

the thing is, and maybe I'm prejudiced, but the GOP offers us Neither.

Mad Prophet Ludwig Sun, Oct 23, 2011 11:39:55am

re: #18 palomino

Cain is so politically illiterate that he doesn't even know that the prez has no formal role in the passage of const. amendments. There would be nothing for him to sign under any circumstances. It's all done by Congress and individual state legislatures.

If he thinks he can sign a Congressional act overturning Roe, he's once again misinformed. Congress doesn't have the power to overrule SC decisions, regardless of what Perry and Cain fantasize about.

Yes... However the drooling GOP base is that illiterate too, so it all makes sense to them.

ProMayaLiberal Sun, Oct 23, 2011 11:40:05am

Off topic, but out of curiosity, I looked up where US Bases in Turkey are, to see how quickly we could help if they need it (Which they may not. They are stronger than they were in 1999).

One, at Izmir, is on the Opposite side of the country. The other, just outside Adana, is halfway down the length of the nation on the Mediterranean Coast.

We can help out real fast. Also, those troops in Iraq are close too. At least the quake occured in a location where help can be gotten in a very quick time.

makeitstop Sun, Oct 23, 2011 11:41:21am

re: #18 palomino

Cain is so politically illiterate that he doesn't even know that the prez has no formal role in the passage of const. amendments. There would be nothing for him to sign under any circumstances. It's all done by Congress and individual state legislatures.

If he thinks he can sign a Congressional act overturning Roe, he's once again misinformed. Congress doesn't have the power to overrule SC decisions, regardless of what Perry and Cain fantasize about.

That's the most troubling thing about his candidacy. He seems to have zero idea how government in this country actually works, and zero desire to figure it out.

It's a good thing he's a wealthy man - it must have cost a lot of dough to get those motorized goalposts on wheels he keeps moving around.

Holidays are Family Fun Time Sun, Oct 23, 2011 11:42:39am

re: #16 allegro

Some of us were born with red hair. We KNOW we're divine.

/// /// ///

Don't let your Cat Overlord hear you say that!

Holidays are Family Fun Time Sun, Oct 23, 2011 11:43:14am

re: #19 Lidane

Since I'm atheist, I leave the divine questions to other people. Heh.

That said, I guess my whole thing is that I vote my current circumstances, not what I'd like to see. Maybe that's the difference?

Idealist vs Pragmatist?

ProMayaLiberal Sun, Oct 23, 2011 11:43:43am

Wikipedia is showing that the article on the Libyan Civil War will be renamed the "2011 Libyan Revolution."

I'll refer to it from now on as the Libyan Revolutionary War.

Holidays are Family Fun Time Sun, Oct 23, 2011 11:44:24am

Cain is a Salesman.

A good one, but not good enough.

Lidane Sun, Oct 23, 2011 11:44:30am

re: #25 ggt

Idealist vs Pragmatist?

Yeah, something like that. I'm a pragmatist. Idealism is nice and all, but real life doesn't work that way.

windsagio Sun, Oct 23, 2011 11:44:39am

re: #25 ggt

Freakin' awesome comparison btw. They've been telling us they're the practical ones (the grownups) so long its easy to drop the idea out of boredom/habit.

windsagio Sun, Oct 23, 2011 11:45:13am

re: #26 ProLifeLiberal

Wikipedia is so damn weird. It's like a bizarre little vortex of insideness

palomino Sun, Oct 23, 2011 11:45:27am

re: #21 LudwigVanQuixote

Yes... However the drooling GOP base is that illiterate too, so it all makes sense to them.

No question it's what they want to hear, factual accuracy be damned. But it's the kind of thing that makes me think Cain is another flash in the pan; he's so misinformed that even gop voters may come to the realization that he's too dumb and reckless to be a viable candidate. Which is why I'd love to see him get nominated--as unlikely as that is--since he's the one candidate I think would get destroyed by Obama.

Kronocide Sun, Oct 23, 2011 11:46:12am

re: #10 freetoken

"Republican" is a label to which people attach themselves, and it becomes part of the self-identity. People usually don't give up their identities easily, as we've seen around here when somebody doggedly won't let go of calling themselves "conservative" or "Republican" even if they give assent to your critique of the idiocy of many of the positions held many who also label themselves by those terms.

OK, OK. I'll quit calling myself conservative.

Holidays are Family Fun Time Sun, Oct 23, 2011 11:46:37am

re: #23 makeitstop

That's the most troubling thing about his candidacy. He seems to have zero idea how government in this country actually works, and zero desire to figure it out.

It's a good thing he's a wealthy man - it must have cost a lot of dough to get those motorized goalposts on wheels he keeps moving around.

He knows how it works in relation to money and business.

What the disconnect seems to be is exactly how intertwined business is with the rest of the issues. And the goal seems to be differnt.

Peace/happies thru a thriving economy

or a thriving economy thru peace/happiness.

It's a circle of enigmas.

Mad Prophet Ludwig Sun, Oct 23, 2011 11:46:55am

re: #28 Lidane

Yeah, something like that. I'm a pragmatist. Idealism is nice and all, but real life doesn't work that way.

A truly moral system is also pragmatic. However to have a truly moral system one must be willing to look at all the data and realize that moral tensions are real things and it is not always possible to meet all moral imperatives. Sometimes, the few must sacrifice for the many.

Killgore Trout Sun, Oct 23, 2011 11:47:10am

re: #3 LudwigVanQuixote

For all of these groups... I can only wonder, do they just not read? What makes them so utterly delusional and willing to act against their own beliefs and best interests?

I'm sure there are a lot of reasons depending on the individual. For a lot of people having a political identity acts as a short cut. They don't have to understand economics, research history, or ponder the diplomatic/political impact of legislation for themselves. That takes a lot of work. It's much easier to form an opinion from buzzwords and talking points from Fox news or MSNBC. This also serves a social function as well, people can easily identify each other's political affiliations just from a few sentences or catch phrases. Sarah Palin made an entire career out of this.
There's also a certain degree of self delusion. Facts that don't match a desired narrative can be ignored, explained away or just pretending reality is different.
I'm reminded of the famous "Downing Street Memo". Even smart lefties looked at that rather boring mundane memo and imagined a giant conspiracy. There's no real basis for it but even smart lefties would read it and all see the same imaginary narrative.
I guess it's just human nature.

palomino Sun, Oct 23, 2011 11:51:36am

re: #10 freetoken

"Republican" is a label to which people attach themselves, and it becomes part of the self-identity. People usually don't give up their identities easily, as we've seen around here when somebody doggedly won't let go of calling themselves "conservative" or "Republican" even if they give assent to your critique of the idiocy of many of the positions held many who also label themselves by those terms.

Well said. It's one reason our politics is more polarized than before. We didn't used to have one explicitly Christian party and one secular party. There used to be some overlap between Dems and the GOP. In the 1930's, the Dems had 80%+ majorities in both houses of Congress. There wasn't such a clearly defined culture war then, so the identity politics that keeps our parties roughly equal in numbers today didn't apply very much.

Holidays are Family Fun Time Sun, Oct 23, 2011 11:52:15am

re: #34 LudwigVanQuixote

A truly moral system is also pragmatic. However to have a truly moral system one must be willing to look at all the data and realize that moral tensions are real things and it is not always possible to meet all moral imperatives. Sometimes, the few must sacrifice for the many.

or the Many for an Ideal?

Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton Sun, Oct 23, 2011 11:52:23am

re: #36 palomino

Correction: one Christian party and one batshit crazy fanatic party.

Eclectic Infidel Sun, Oct 23, 2011 11:52:47am

No "land of the free" for Mr. Cain, eh?

ProMayaLiberal Sun, Oct 23, 2011 11:53:27am

re: #30 windsagio

But they are right. Most of the population was Anti-Qaddafi. This was a throwing off of a government. Arabs have another word for it, but that word brings up sore feelings, and also would serve as a massive understandment of the horrific violence, the likes of which the Middle East has not seen in a very long time. No single war between Israel and anyone else has been this devastating.

.38-1% of the population of Libya died in just 247 days. Just 8 months and 1 Week. And Misrata, Zawiyah, and Sirte heavily destroyed.

Mad Prophet Ludwig Sun, Oct 23, 2011 11:54:20am

re: #31 palomino

No question it's what they want to hear, factual accuracy be damned. But it's the kind of thing that makes me think Cain is another flash in the pan; he's so misinformed that even gop voters may come to the realization that he's too dumb and reckless to be a viable candidate. Which is why I'd love to see him get nominated--as unlikely as that is--since he's the one candidate I think would get destroyed by Obama.

I think the only one who is a credible threat to Obama (assuming the Dems don't use their mutant super power to snatch defeat from the jaws of victory, which is sadly a big assumption) is Romney. However, as Romney panders more and more to the crazy base and makes even the likes of McCain and Kerry look like rock solid men of conviction, he is going to have a much harder time in the general election.

Of course, in issue after issue, that the Dems should be out there screaming bloody murder over, like the GOP's refusal to address jobs and actions to kill jobs, or the GOP's insane anti-science lines, or the GOP's war on women, or education, or labor, or the middle class in general, the Dems have all the organization and vigor of a sick old man's fart.

Or how about that the Supercommitte will do nothing and all those insane cuts are going to hit in November? This will trash all sorts of things. The Dems could be out there arguing how the GOP made that all happen right now... but they aren't... they will actually do nothing and whine meekly while the GOP blames them for the fallout. It's pathetic.

We can hope though that the swing voting Americans have a sufficient memory to get that the GOP made that happen.

windsagio Sun, Oct 23, 2011 11:54:30am

re: #40 ProLifeLiberal

oh yeah sorry, not arguing with the change, rather grinning with the huge discussion that I'm sure ensued :p

palomino Sun, Oct 23, 2011 11:56:20am

re: #26 ProLifeLiberal

Wikipedia is showing that the article on the Libyan Civil War will be renamed the "2011 Libyan Revolution."

I'll refer to it from now on as the Libyan Revolutionary War.

Unbelievable that one Republican senator after another gave all the credit to Britain and France (since when do Republicans like the Frenchies?) in order to avoid giving it to Obama and Hillary. Rubio, Grassley, even McCain all read from the same talking points. These folks are congenitally unable to give Obama credit for anything. Further evidence that our nation is simply growing more divided. That brief moment of unity after 9/11 now seems like ancient history.

Gus Sun, Oct 23, 2011 11:56:40am

re: #18 palomino

Cain is so politically illiterate that he doesn't even know that the prez has no formal role in the passage of const. amendments. There would be nothing for him to sign under any circumstances. It's all done by Congress and individual state legislatures.

If he thinks he can sign a Congressional act overturning Roe, he's once again misinformed. Congress doesn't have the power to overrule SC decisions, regardless of what Perry and Cain fantasize about.

It's amazing how people like Cain throw about the notion of Constitutional Amendments as though it were an "easy" and "overnight" process.

The Constitution of the United States

* * * * * * * * * *

Article V

The Congress, whenever two thirds of both houses shall deem it necessary, shall propose amendments to this Constitution, or, on the application of the legislatures of two thirds of the several states, shall call a convention for proposing amendments, which, in either case, shall be valid to all intents and purposes, as part of this Constitution, when ratified by the legislatures of three fourths of the several states, or by conventions in three fourths thereof, as the one or the other mode of ratification may be proposed by the Congress; provided that no amendment which may be made prior to the year one thousand eight hundred and eight shall in any manner affect the first and fourth clauses in the ninth section of the first article; and that no state, without its consent, shall be deprived of its equal suffrage in the Senate.

ProMayaLiberal Sun, Oct 23, 2011 11:57:25am

One other point I forgot to say.

I've seen alot of people complain about how Qaddafi was ended. However, let's not forget that Mussolini met with the same fate when he was caught. This is not something that hasn't happened in the West.

I have no judgement on the Fighters who got him and may have killed him. Because it has happened in the West, whether we have forgotten or not.

Gus Sun, Oct 23, 2011 11:58:13am

The Constitutional Amendment Process

The Constitution provides that an amendment may be proposed either by the Congress with a two-thirds majority vote in both the House of Representatives and the Senate or by a constitutional convention called for by two-thirds of the State legislatures. None of the 27 amendments to the Constitution have been proposed by constitutional convention. The Congress proposes an amendment in the form of a joint resolution. Since the President does not have a constitutional role in the amendment process, the joint resolution does not go to the White House for signature or approval. The original document is forwarded directly to NARA's Office of the Federal Register (OFR) for processing and publication. The OFR adds legislative history notes to the joint resolution and publishes it in slip law format. The OFR also assembles an information package for the States which includes formal "red-line" copies of the joint resolution, copies of the joint resolution in slip law format, and the statutory procedure for ratification under 1 U.S.C. 106b.

Gus Sun, Oct 23, 2011 11:58:32am

Blowhards.

Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton Sun, Oct 23, 2011 11:58:59am

re: #45 ProLifeLiberal

His killer should still face punishment. Sorry, extrajudicial killings in captivity are a no-no, even tho morally Kaddafi deserved what he got.

palomino Sun, Oct 23, 2011 11:59:43am

re: #38 Sergey Romanov

Correction: one Christian party and one batshit crazy fanatic party.

I was trying to be a little diplomatic, but I certainly won't quibble with your description. I've been following the gop for 30 years, and they're now like nothing I've ever seen before.

Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton Sun, Oct 23, 2011 12:00:29pm

re: #49 palomino

I was trying to be a little diplomatic, but I certainly won't quibble with your description. I've been following the gop for 30 years, and they're now like nothing I've ever seen before.

Well yeah, since 2008 they've gotten a bit crazier than before. ;)

ProMayaLiberal Sun, Oct 23, 2011 12:00:34pm

re: #43 palomino

Credit for ending the War goes to (in my opinion)

The United Kingdom (Recon aircraft noticed convoy)
The United States (Predator fired on many of the vehicles)
The French Republic (Mirage came in to shoot the remaining vehicles)
And the NTC of Libya (Whose ground forces captured Qaddafi, and possibly killed him)

Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton Sun, Oct 23, 2011 12:00:44pm

re: #50 Sergey Romanov

Just a bit tho.

ProMayaLiberal Sun, Oct 23, 2011 12:01:09pm

re: #48 Sergey Romanov

Did they ever punish those who killed Mussolini? I don't think they did.

Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton Sun, Oct 23, 2011 12:01:30pm

re: #53 ProLifeLiberal

Did they ever punish those who killed Mussolini? I don't think they did.

Who cares? We're not in 1945.

palomino Sun, Oct 23, 2011 12:02:16pm

re: #44 Gus 802

It's amazing how people like Cain throw about the notion of Constitutional Amendments as though it were an "easy" and "overnight" process.

The Constitution of the United States

* * * *

Article V

The Congress, whenever two thirds of both houses shall deem it necessary, shall propose amendments to this Constitution, or, on the application of the legislatures of two thirds of the several states, shall call a convention for proposing amendments, which, in either case, shall be valid to all intents and purposes, as part of this Constitution, when ratified by the legislatures of three fourths of the several states, or by conventions in three fourths thereof, as the one or the other mode of ratification may be proposed by the Congress; provided that no amendment which may be made prior to the year one thousand eight hundred and eight shall in any manner affect the first and fourth clauses in the ninth section of the first article; and that no state, without its consent, shall be deprived of its equal suffrage in the Senate.

Precisely, if the amendment process were easy, we'd probably have passed more than 17 (after the initial Bill of Rights) over a 200+ year history.

Mad Prophet Ludwig Sun, Oct 23, 2011 12:03:22pm

re: #35 Killgore Trout

I'm sure there are a lot of reasons depending on the individual. For a lot of people having a political identity acts as a short cut. They don't have to understand economics, research history, or ponder the diplomatic/political impact of legislation for themselves. That takes a lot of work. It's much easier to form an opinion from buzzwords and talking points from Fox news or MSNBC. This also serves a social function as well, people can easily identify each other's political affiliations just from a few sentences or catch phrases. Sarah Palin made an entire career out of this.
There's also a certain degree of self delusion. Facts that don't match a desired narrative can be ignored, explained away or just pretending reality is different.
I'm reminded of the famous "Downing Street Memo". Even smart lefties looked at that rather boring mundane memo and imagined a giant conspiracy. There's no real basis for it but even smart lefties would read it and all see the same imaginary narrative.
I guess it's just human nature.

You just reminded me of a conversation I had with my fiancée very recently. A while back, A&E had a thing where the top most influential people of the last 1000 years were listed.

A&E had set up a committee of historical fuddy duddy Ph.D. types to compose the list, but, they also left average people vote on it via the web.

Elizabeth I, was near the bottom of the list. She was beat out by Lady Dianna and Elvis. Louis14, Catherine the Great, Queen Victoria, Kublai Khan, Pope Urban II, Tokugawa, Bismark, Timurlane, Cromwell, Saladin, Henry II, Benjamin Franklin, John Adams, Robespierre and Desrali, to name a few, of many who should have been there, were not even on the list.

The Beatles and Louis Armstrong were.

The people who watch A&E biography are already a pretty self selected bunch of Americans who are vastly better educated than average... and this still happened. It is simply not possible to have a functioning democracy when our educational and intellectual standards are so shockingly low.

Holidays are Family Fun Time Sun, Oct 23, 2011 12:03:24pm

re: #51 ProLifeLiberal

Credit for ending the War goes to (in my opinion)

The United Kingdom (Recon aircraft noticed convoy)
The United States (Predator fired on many of the vehicles)
The French Republic (Mirage came in to shoot the remaining vehicles)
And the NTC of Libya (Whose ground forces captured Qaddafi, and possibly killed him)

The Soldiers?

Holidays are Family Fun Time Sun, Oct 23, 2011 12:04:25pm

re: #56 LudwigVanQuixote

You just reminded me of a conversation I had with my fiancée very recently. A while back, A&E had a thing where the top most influential people of the last 1000 years were listed.

A&E had set up a committed of historical fuddy duddy Ph.D. types to compose the list, but, they also left average people vote on it via the web.

Elizabeth I, was near the bottom of the list. She was beat out by Lady Dianna and Elvis. Louis14, Catherine the Great, Queen Victoria, Kublai Khan, Pope Urban II, Tokugawa, Bismark, Timurlane, Saladin, Henry II, Benjamin Franklin, John Adams, Robespierre and Desrali to name a few of many who should have been there, were not even on the list.

The Beatles and Louis Armstrong were.

Now the people who watch A&E biography are already a pretty self selected bunch of Americans who are vastly better educated than average... and this still happened. It is simply not possible to have a functioning democracy when our educational and intellectual standards are so shockingly low.

Not enough people studying dead white man subjects . . .

ProMayaLiberal Sun, Oct 23, 2011 12:04:45pm

re: #54 Sergey Romanov

True, but the trial that Qaddafi would have gotten (more than plausibly) would have been a Ceausescu-Style one. I don't honestly feel bad about the way this turned out.

Although Berlesconi said this when the news was announced

Prime Minister Silvio Berlusconi reacted to reports of Gaddafi's death by saying "Sic transit gloria mundi" (thus passes the glory of the world) and that now "the war is over."

I think this bastard was mourning Qaddafi.

Holidays are Family Fun Time Sun, Oct 23, 2011 12:05:42pm

re: #58 ggt

Not enough people studying dead white man subjects . . .

Dead white man subjects do help people get jobs tho . . .

Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton Sun, Oct 23, 2011 12:07:19pm

re: #59 ProLifeLiberal

I don't feel bad about it on a personal level. But the law is the law, and no excuse for breaking the said law should be given by just "forgiving" the killer(s). Next time when an innocent person is killed in captivity, the killers with full justification will point to Kaddafi's killing and lack of aftermath. Because there are no "goodies" and "baddies" before the law.

ProMayaLiberal Sun, Oct 23, 2011 12:07:56pm

re: #57 ggt

The NTC ones. I count them as being in the NTC.

re: #56 LudwigVanQuixote

Speaking of Saladin, his rule was the last time, before the last 20 years, that what is today Yemen was under one rule.

Edit: I get the distinct feeling that Saladin would kick Assad's ass if he were alive today.

Whose for Zombie Saladin?

I personally think Saladin was pretty awesome. When Syria has thrown off Assad, I want to visit Saladin's Mausoleum.

Mad Prophet Ludwig Sun, Oct 23, 2011 12:08:05pm

re: #58 ggt

Not enough people studying dead white man subjects . . .

Yeah like Saladin, Tokugawa Ieyasu, Kublai Kahn and Timurlane?

And while they were white, Catherine the Great, Catherine De Medici and Queen Victoria were definitely not men.

A Man for all Seasons Sun, Oct 23, 2011 12:08:32pm

You can find Cain's position papers at Cain Republican America position..
Just type in C.R.A.P.Com in your browser..
Cain cracks me up.. First off..He is about an unpolished CEO that I have ever known...Lucky a crappy Pizza joint hired him.
He is so right wing that he only flies on planes with 2 right wings..
Some call him plain spoken...I have another word for it

Mad Prophet Ludwig Sun, Oct 23, 2011 12:08:38pm

re: #62 ProLifeLiberal

The NTC ones. I count them as being in the NTC.

re: #56 LudwigVanQuixote

Speaking of Saladin, his rule was the last time, before the last 20 years, that what is today Yemen was under one rule.

I personally think Saladin was pretty awesome. When Syria has thrown off Assad, I want to visit Saladin's Mausoleum.

I agree. He was a truly remarkable man.

Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton Sun, Oct 23, 2011 12:08:52pm

re: #59 ProLifeLiberal

Dunno, I wrote the same thing when the news reached me. Like any dictator, Kaddafi certainly had his share of "gloria" - built on violence, of course.

Holidays are Family Fun Time Sun, Oct 23, 2011 12:09:08pm

re: #63 LudwigVanQuixote

Yeah like Saladin, Tokugawa Ieyasu, Kublai Kahn and Timurlane?

And while they were white, Catherine the Great, Catherine De Medici and Queen Victoria were definitely not men.

Oh, I'd be happy with Logic and Rhetoric.

ProMayaLiberal Sun, Oct 23, 2011 12:09:44pm

re: #65 LudwigVanQuixote

You didn't catch my awesome edit.

Edit: I get the distinct feeling that Saladin would kick Assad's ass if he were alive today.

Whose for Zombie Saladin?

Kragar Sun, Oct 23, 2011 12:10:27pm

“I think marriage should be protected at the federal level also. I used to believe that it could be just handled by the states but there’s a movement going on to basically take the teeth out of the 1996 Defense of Marriage Act and that could cause an unraveling, so we do need some protection at the federal level because of that and so yes I would support legislation that would say that it’s between a man and a woman.”

STATES RIGHTS... except when we don't agree with the position!!!

freetoken Sun, Oct 23, 2011 12:10:56pm

Well, the next UNFCCC COP meeting is right around the corner (all of you have waited with bated breath, no doubt), and it looks like the local authorities are doing the usual:

Durban beggars ‘disappearing’

If you’ve noticed beggars disappearing from street corners [of Durban], it’s probably because authorities have begun a “clean-up” of Durban ahead of COP17, the UN climate change conference next month.

Durban beggars told the Tribune they had to run and hide this week as metro police intensified a campaign against them with the city preparing for thousands of delegates from around the world.

Beggars said they had been told to get lost or they would be dumped “in the middle of nowhere” or locked in a crowded cell for the duration of COP17.

“They’re coming for us,” said beachfront beggar Martin van der Westhuizen. “A few of my friends have already disappeared and I hear a lot of us are being locked up.”

He said it was common for authorities to crack down on beggars before big events. The beachfront and area around the International Convention Centre (ICC) were prime targets.

“They round us up and take us out of the city to Umlazi or Verulam and drop us in the middle of nowhere. Then we have to walk back,” he said.

“During the World Cup, they locked us up at C R Swart (Durban Central) police station and kept us there.”

He said beggars were often abused during the round-ups. “When they come for me, I try to run away. Then they chase me and spray me with pepper spray and hit me for making them run.”

Another beggar said that event banners going up around Durban’s ICC were usually a sign for beggars to get lost.

“When visitors are coming, the police clean up the beachfront and other places where the people go. They throw us in the truck and tell us to voetsek. They tell us we’re dirty and the tourists don’t want to see our ugly faces,” said a beggar called Enoch.

He said that he was jailed briefly during last year’s World Cup. “The police came, a lot of them, and started chasing all of us. They locked us up at the police station and warned us not to come back during the World Cup. They said that if we came back too soon they would moer us lekker.”

For beachfront beggar Mandla, COP17 means he will not be able to rummage through trash cans for food. [...]

Someone should just make the beggars a lot of "Occupy Durban" signs and see if that would get them more coverage.

dragonfire1981 Sun, Oct 23, 2011 12:11:59pm

One look at that photo and immediately I thought:

These people are not trustworthy.

Charleston Chew Sun, Oct 23, 2011 12:12:38pm

Cain: "Please, just tell me the crazy shit you need to hear me say to vote for me. If I have to keep guessing I'm probably gonna get it wrong."

Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton Sun, Oct 23, 2011 12:12:43pm

re: #59 ProLifeLiberal

IOW, I don't think the phrase is meant to convey any admiration, maybe quite the opposite in most cases.

Charleston Chew Sun, Oct 23, 2011 12:13:04pm

re: #69 Kragar (Proud to be Kafir)

STATES RIGHTS... except when we don't agree with the position!!!

Some states are righter than others.

palomino Sun, Oct 23, 2011 12:13:16pm

re: #64 HoosierHoops

You can find Cain's position papers at Cain Republican America position..
Just type in C.R.A.P.Com in your browser..
Cain cracks me up.. First off..He is about an unpolished CEO that I have ever known...Lucky a crappy Pizza joint hired him.
He is so right wing that he only flies on planes with 2 right wings..
Some call him plain spoken...I have another word for it

Insane? Mentally challenged? A total joke? All of the above plus others?

ProMayaLiberal Sun, Oct 23, 2011 12:13:22pm

re: #73 Sergey Romanov

I have a bit of trouble with subtext of a phrase sometimes.

Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton Sun, Oct 23, 2011 12:15:02pm

re: #76 ProLifeLiberal

Let's put it this way - when you have someone who's been in "high places" ending his life pitifully - like Mussolini or Kaddafi - the phrase is appropriate without conveying a positive message, just as a philosophical reflection. Also cf. Ozymandias.

Mad Prophet Ludwig Sun, Oct 23, 2011 12:15:05pm

re: #70 freetoken

Well, the next UNFCCC COP meeting is right around the corner (all of you have waited with bated breath, no doubt), and it looks like the local authorities are doing the usual:

Durban beggars ‘disappearing’

Someone should just make the beggars a lot of "Occupy Durban" signs and see if that would get them more coverage.

Well you know, the conference cares about human rights...

Charleston Chew Sun, Oct 23, 2011 12:15:08pm

re: #1 ggt

So, he's pandering.

Did he realize cameras, cell phones were present. THE WHOLE WORLD would know what he said?

Politicians' behavior is a trailing indicator of the current state of technology. They still need a few years to catch up.

Lidane Sun, Oct 23, 2011 12:15:52pm

The anti-abortion nutjobs aren't listening to Cain anymore:

Mysterious leaflets in Iowa take aim at Cain's abortion comments

Herman Cain was the target of a mysterious attack Saturday night when leaflets targeting the Republican presidential frontrunner were left on car windows outside the Iowa Faith and Freedom Coalition's fall banquet in Des Moines.

The leaflets, one of which was left on the car of a reporter, accuse Cain of being “pro-choice” and question his opposition to abortion.

“Herman Cain threw the babies under the bus,” blares the flier, which features a headshot of Cain next to a picture of a tiny aborted fetus.

The leaflet seizes on comments Cain made about abortion on Wednesday during an appearance on CNN.

There's a scan/photo of the leaflet at the article, BTW.

Holidays are Family Fun Time Sun, Oct 23, 2011 12:17:29pm

re: #80 Lidane

The anti-abortion nutjobs aren't listening to Cain anymore:

Mysterious leaflets in Iowa take aim at Cain's abortion comments

There's a scan/photo of the leaflet at the article, BTW.

he is so screwed

Gus Sun, Oct 23, 2011 12:17:50pm

OT - Breaking News - The Denver Broncos suck.

Carry on.

Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton Sun, Oct 23, 2011 12:18:35pm

re: #82 Gus 802

who? ok.

Mad Prophet Ludwig Sun, Oct 23, 2011 12:18:59pm

re: #70 freetoken

I just recommended that post to CJ.

freetoken Sun, Oct 23, 2011 12:19:09pm

re: #80 Lidane

Two groups named at the bottom of the flier take credit for the attack: “Iowans for Some Semblance of Christian Decency” and “Iowans For Truth and Honest Government.”

I'd go for even a hint of a semblance of decency of any sort coming from the GOP "debate" crowds.

A Man for all Seasons Sun, Oct 23, 2011 12:19:14pm

re: #75 palomino

Insane? Mentally challenged? A total joke? All of the above plus others?

I won't call him names..But you know..He has kind of got that Elmer Gantry Vibe going on...I could see him more as a Preacher than a President..
In fact..If he promises to become a TV preacher I promise to send him a cash donation..
/

Charleston Chew Sun, Oct 23, 2011 12:19:41pm

re: #3 LudwigVanQuixote

Woman Republicans Daddy was a Republican.

Black Republicans Gays are icky.

Gay Republicans We're not icky. We're Republicans.

Orthodox Jewish Republicans Yay! Arbitrary ancient religious customs for no reason!

Leftists who Hate Israel But a Frenchman made it look cool...

OhNoZombies! Sun, Oct 23, 2011 12:20:25pm

Cain reminds me of the Court Jesters in fairy stories, you know, clownish on the outside, but much more politically adept behind closed doors.
Everytime Cain pukes up one of his positions, whether it's 999, or electrified fences, or abortion, it seems like he falls just short of bat-shit crazy. Is he testing to see what works with the base? Or is he drawing out the crazy in his opponents, because that's the pattern; Cain draws a crazy line in the sand, puts a toe just over the line, then the rest of the candidates jump over said line with drums and tambourines.
I can't exactly figure out what he's trying to do, because he has to know he's not gonna get the nomination. But if I was a right leaning conspiracy person, I would think Cain was an Obama operative trying to destroy my party.

Then again, I might need to get more sleep...

Mad Prophet Ludwig Sun, Oct 23, 2011 12:22:39pm

re: #87 Charleston Chew

Woman Republicans Daddy was a Republican.

Black Republicans Gays are icky.

Gay Republicans We're not icky. We're Republicans.

Orthodox Jewish Republicans Yay! Arbitrary ancient religious customs for no reason!

Leftists who Hate Israel But a Frenchman made it look cool...

Except that actual Torah Judaism is vastly less arbitrary than you might think and utterly dedicated to things like educating the young, feeding the hungry, helping the poor, striving for justice for the downtrodden and reminding those with wealth and power that they are transient and still bound by a higher morality.

freetoken Sun, Oct 23, 2011 12:23:55pm

re: #84 LudwigVanQuixote

The sad reality is that humans, all humans, being tribal-bound apes, spend most of our time jockeying for position within the troop.

All this stuff we call "morality" and "decency" and "civilization" are just patinas gilded on top of egotistic monkey-tribe antics, all of us just wanting to run the troop to maximize the chance of reproductive opportunity and success.

_{_{_{ok... back to the sackcloth and ashes and eating locusts now...}}}

Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton Sun, Oct 23, 2011 12:23:56pm

Uh-oh. Turkey rejected Israel's help.

Gus Sun, Oct 23, 2011 12:24:06pm

OT - Since the topic came up. This is rather odd.

Viewing Qaddafi's Body
Hundreds of Libyans from all over the country traveled to get a look at the body of Col. Muammar el-Qaddafi.

They show his body so if you're queasy about that sort of thing don't watch this video.

Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton Sun, Oct 23, 2011 12:25:08pm

re: #92 Gus 802

You call that weird, try googling "Lenin, mausoleum" //

PhillyPretzel Sun, Oct 23, 2011 12:25:09pm

re: #91 Sergey Romanov
You expected something different?

Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton Sun, Oct 23, 2011 12:25:42pm

re: #94 PhillyPretzel

You expected something different?

Yeah.

Kragar Sun, Oct 23, 2011 12:26:51pm

I'm just waiting for this to blow up in his face.

Reports: Cain spends campaign cash to buy his book

Bloomberg and Talking Points Memo combed through the GOP presidential candidate's campaign-finance reports and found thousands of dollars being spent on Cain's memoir with the payments going to T.H.E. New Voice. The company is listed as being paid by the Cain presidential campaign for airfare, lodging, ground transportation and supplies, the reports say.

Cain is juggling the presidential campaign and promotion of his memoir, This is Herman Cain! My Journey to the White House. The book debuted this weekend at No. 4 on The New York Times best-seller list.

The Federal Election Commission has ruled in several cases involving politicians and their memoirs, most recently at the request of Sen. Scott Brown, R-Mass. In that case, the FEC said candidates can use campaign funds to buy their books at fair market value as long as the royalties are donated to charities.

Haven't heard a word about him making any donations, and I'd bet he would make sure to include them as a tax right off when he tries to cover his ass.

Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton Sun, Oct 23, 2011 12:27:17pm

re: #92 Gus 802

"... but when I see him now he is so weak".

No shit, Sherlock! He's dead.

Holidays are Family Fun Time Sun, Oct 23, 2011 12:27:34pm

re: #95 Sergey Romanov

Yeah.

That would cause them to "lose face". It's a fate worse than death.

Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton Sun, Oct 23, 2011 12:27:52pm

re: #94 PhillyPretzel

I actually thought Erdogan had a bit of common sense left.

100

Mad Prophet Ludwig Sun, Oct 23, 2011 12:28:01pm

re: #37 ggt

or the Many for an Ideal?

No. The simple fact that it is seemingly immoral to send someone on a risky mission where you are pretty sure they will get killed, yet in the larger scheme that is frequently the moral choice. This is an example of the tragic fact that there are frequently two conflicting moral standards and we must choose which takes precedence.

101

Holidays are Family Fun Time Sun, Oct 23, 2011 12:28:30pm

re: #97 Sergey Romanov

"... but when I see him now he is so weak".

No shit, Sherlock! He's dead.

It's not him, it's a corpse --shithead, he's dead.

102

Lidane Sun, Oct 23, 2011 12:28:50pm

re: #82 Gus 802

OT - Breaking News - The Denver Broncos suck.

Carry on.

On a related note, the Texans are currently steamrolling the Titans, 41-7.

103

Gus Sun, Oct 23, 2011 12:29:01pm

re: #97 Sergey Romanov

"... but when I see him now he is so weak".

No shit, Sherlock! He's dead.

Looks like it was only men doing the "viewing". One man was yelling at "him".

104

PhillyPretzel Sun, Oct 23, 2011 12:29:09pm

re: #99 Sergey Romanov
"Common sense is not so common." SGB (my late mom)

105

Holidays are Family Fun Time Sun, Oct 23, 2011 12:29:18pm

re: #100 LudwigVanQuixote

No. The simple fact that it is seemingly immoral to send someone on a risky mission where you are pretty sure they will get killed, yet in the larger scheme that is frequently the moral choice. This is an example of the tragic fact that there are frequently two conflicting moral standards and we must choose which takes precedence.

I think we are on the same page here.

106

Lidane Sun, Oct 23, 2011 12:30:39pm

re: #103 Gus 802

Looks like it was only men doing the "viewing". One man was yelling at "him".

Must be a cultural thing. Either way, seeing Qaddafi's body must have been cathartic for the people there. He was such a presence in their lives for what, 40 years? I'd yell at him too, I think.

107

Fat Bastard Vegetarian Sun, Oct 23, 2011 12:30:52pm

re: #92 Gus 802

Don't know exactly why I am thinking of this...

(Dinner is served, the clatter of dishes is heard)
{as Riff rolls out the dinner: "Is it hot?"}
(Riff opens the lid) {"It's hot"}
(The dinner is shown) {"What?!? Meat Loaf?!? Again!"}
(Frank slices it with the slicer)
{"Anyway you slice it, it still comes up meat loaf"}
(Riff and Magenta pour the wine)
{as they get to Dr Scott: "What kind of wine is it?"}
{as it spills: "Must be table wine"}
{as Riff "deals" the meat: "Hey Riff (Raff) deal me a slice",
Throw bologna now!}
The Rocky Horror Picture Show

108

A Man for all Seasons Sun, Oct 23, 2011 12:31:23pm

re: #100 LudwigVanQuixote

The Charge of the Light Brigade
The eternal Classic of following a leader on a doomed mission

109

A Man for all Seasons Sun, Oct 23, 2011 12:32:57pm

re: #102 Lidane

On a related note, the Texans are currently steamrolling the Titans, 41-7.

Well since the Colts are done.. I hope Houston wins the division and goes on the kick ass in the playoffs.. Represent the AFC South!

110

Fat Bastard Vegetarian Sun, Oct 23, 2011 12:33:53pm

re: #109 HoosierHoops

Hating the Redskins was more fun when they weren't pathetic.

111

Charleston Chew Sun, Oct 23, 2011 12:34:21pm

re: #96 Kragar (Proud to be Kafir)

I'm just waiting for this to blow up in his face.

Reports: Cain spends campaign cash to buy his book

Haven't heard a word about him making any donations, and I'd bet he would make sure to include them as a tax right off when he tries to cover his ass.

Someday archaeologists will be perplexed to find the massive underground warehouse conservatives used to hide all the copies of their own books they bought to pump up the numbers.

Also, Cain better not send any of those books to a forward operating base.

112

Mad Prophet Ludwig Sun, Oct 23, 2011 12:34:29pm

re: #88 OhNoZombies!

Cain reminds me of the Court Jesters in fairy stories, you know, clownish on the outside, but much more politically adept behind closed doors.
Everytime Cain pukes up one of his positions, whether it's 999, or electrified fences, or abortion, it seems like he falls just short of bat-shit crazy. Is he testing to see what works with the base? Or is he drawing out the crazy in his opponents, because that's the pattern; Cain draws a crazy line in the sand, puts a toe just over the line, then the rest of the candidates jump over said line with drums and tambourines.
I can't exactly figure out what he's trying to do, because he has to know he's not gonna get the nomination. But if I was a right leaning conspiracy person, I would think Cain was an Obama operative trying to destroy my party.

Then again, I might need to get more sleep...

I think you are on to something there in terms of a low sort of cunning. His fabulous ignorance though of world events and history marks him as not as bright as you are giving him credit for. OR perhaps, worse said, compared to the GOP base he is smart, being at slightly above average intellect, and a genius compared to the other candidates save Romney.

I still hold by my I can't understand the contempt that black republicans obviously have for other blacks stance of my earlier post.

113

PhillyPretzel Sun, Oct 23, 2011 12:34:41pm

re: #108 HoosierHoops
The Charge of the Light Brigade. [Link: encyclopedia.thefreedictionary.com...]

114

Mad Prophet Ludwig Sun, Oct 23, 2011 12:34:56pm

re: #108 HoosierHoops

The Charge of the Light Brigade
The eternal Classic of following a leader on a doomed mission

Good one! Great comment.

115

Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton Sun, Oct 23, 2011 12:35:53pm

re: #111 Charleston Chew

Someday archaeologists will be perplexed to find the massive underground warehouse conservatives used to hide all the copies of their own books they bought to pump up the numbers.

Also, Cain better not send any of those books to a forward operating base.

They're buried in a landfill next to the E.T. game.

116

Holidays are Family Fun Time Sun, Oct 23, 2011 12:36:12pm

I have to be productive (laundry)

bbl

117

A Man for all Seasons Sun, Oct 23, 2011 12:38:07pm

re: #110 Fat Bastard Vegetarian

Hating the Redskins was more fun when they weren't pathetic.

Cam is one of the most athletic Football players I have ever seen...
A star is born.. Did you just see that pass he threw? And he is 6'5" 255 lbs and runs a 4.3/40? That is sick...

118

William Barnett-Lewis Sun, Oct 23, 2011 12:39:40pm

re: #115 Sergey Romanov

They're buried in a landfill next to the E.T. game.

Worse though was when Apple destroyed all the old Lisa computers that way. :(

119

Fat Bastard Vegetarian Sun, Oct 23, 2011 12:46:44pm

re: #117 HoosierHoops

Wife and I have tickets for Dec. 11, in Charlotte.

She's an Auburn fan, so, she loves her some Cam.

120

sattv4u2 Sun, Oct 23, 2011 12:50:06pm

re: #119 Fat Bastard Vegetarian

Wife and I have tickets for Dec. 11, in Charlotte.

She's an Auburn fan, so, she loves her some Cam.

Maybe he'll bring her back something nice from London

121

sattv4u2 Sun, Oct 23, 2011 12:51:21pm

re: #120 sattv4u2

Maybe he'll bring her back something nice from London

dope,,, wrong game!!

((monitor overkill!!))

122

HappyWarrior Sun, Oct 23, 2011 12:57:17pm

Man he's such a champion of small government. //

123

OhNoZombies! Sun, Oct 23, 2011 2:11:33pm

re: #115 Sergey Romanov

Is that the same place they put the TI99-4a ?

124

JEA62 Sun, Oct 23, 2011 2:54:11pm

States' rights!! 10th amendment!! Wait, they're not doing what we want...screw 'em!

125

SidewaysQuark Sun, Oct 23, 2011 3:23:24pm

re: #46 Gus 802

The Constitutional Amendment Process

the President does not have a constitutional role in the amendment process, the joint resolution does not go to the White House for signature or approval.

Thanks - I was gonna say, that even more disturbing than his stance on 'small government' regulating the adhering of blastulae to uterine walls in 150 million women, is his - the man who wants to be "President" - his complete ignorance about the ratification of Constitutional Amendments.

God might want him to run for President, but God obviously didn't remind him to study basic civics.

126

TheSwedish Sun, Oct 23, 2011 7:42:26pm

Cain needs to get a clue. When they're done with Muslims, Geller and her crowd will just invent a reason to come after people who look like him, even if they're Christian.

Heck, Geller's dumbass war - whoop that President Obama is Malcolm X's kid is definitely driven by anti - black bigotry (specifically fear of the mythical "angry black guy.").

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