Senate Republicans Cave on Fiscal Cliff

Progress
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For decades the Republican Party has been fighting tooth and nail to stop this day from ever coming: Senate Passes Tax Increases on Wealthy Americans.

WASHINGTON — The Senate, in a predawn vote two hours after the deadline passed to avert automatic tax increases, overwhelmingly approved legislation on Tuesday that would allow tax rates to rise only on affluent Americans while temporarily suspending sweeping, across-the-board spending cuts.

The deal, worked out in furious negotiations between Vice President Joseph R. Biden Jr. and the Republican Senate leader, Mitch McConnell, passed 89 to 8, with just three Democrats and five Republicans voting no. Although it lost the support of some of the Senate’s most conservative members, the broad coalition that pushed the accord across the finish line could portend swift House passage as early as New Year’s Day.

Many Democrats are unhappy about some of the provisions in the legislation (that’s why it’s called a “compromise”) but make no mistake — breaking the back of the anti-tax right wing is an historic achievement for the Obama administration.

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165 comments
1 FemNaziBitch  Tue, Jan 1, 2013 11:16:22am

the DRAMA!

2 Charles Johnson  Tue, Jan 1, 2013 11:16:36am
3 Vicious Babushka  Tue, Jan 1, 2013 11:18:42am
4 Vicious Babushka  Tue, Jan 1, 2013 11:20:10am

Wingnuts find this shadow very scary:

5 Targetpractice  Tue, Jan 1, 2013 11:20:31am

I'll come out and say I'm still not happy with the deal as is, but seeing that its causing all sorts of heart burn for the House GOP right now is a bit of a consolation prize. And I'm still holding Obama to his promise not to negotiate on the debt limit.

6 lawhawk  Tue, Jan 1, 2013 11:20:33am

The GOP will treat this two ways. One, they'll call it a massive and irresponsible tax hike on the rich. Second, they'll treat the tax cut on everyone else as an afterthought even as they attempt to take credit for pushing the top tax bracket to $400k from $250k.

Now, the House GOP will attempt to find a way to sabotage the bipartisan deal, even though any delay or obstruction will push a deal past the end of the lame duck into the new session - meaning the sides would have to start from scratch. Not insurmountable, but it means a few more days of dithering and Wall Street watching from the sidelines.

7 FemNaziBitch  Tue, Jan 1, 2013 11:21:38am

Do we have to go thru all this again as the House argues over it, or will they just vote on it as it is?

8 Targetpractice  Tue, Jan 1, 2013 11:21:52am

re: #6 lawhawk

The GOP will treat this two ways. One, they'll call it a massive and irresponsible tax hike on the rich. Second, they'll treat the tax cut on everyone else as an afterthought even as they attempt to take credit for pushing the top tax bracket to $400k from $250k.

Now, the House GOP will attempt to find a way to sabotage the bipartisan deal, even though any delay or obstruction will push a deal past the end of the lame duck into the new session - meaning the sides would have to start from scratch. Not insurmountable, but it means a few more days of dithering and Wall Street watching from the sidelines.

It also means that Obama can junk this "deal" and say "I tried $400K, but that wasn't good enough. So now you either agree to $250K or watch the voters tear you apart."

9 goddamnedfrank  Tue, Jan 1, 2013 11:21:59am

Is it really a donation if you're relying on the Government to subsidize it?

10 Dark_Falcon  Tue, Jan 1, 2013 11:22:27am

Your tone is very bad on this one, Charles. Spinning a deal as a defeat for the GOP is a way to get the House to vote the deal down. Compromise needs to be accompanied by a certain level of spoken and written generosity, even if you feel the other side does not deserve it.

11 FemNaziBitch  Tue, Jan 1, 2013 11:22:42am

Frank Says:

"Conducting" is when you draw "designs" in the nowhere -- with your stick, or with your hands -- which are interpreted as "instructional messages" by guys wearing bow ties who wish they were fishing.

I don't think this was meant as a metaphor for congress, but I can apply it as such.

12 FemNaziBitch  Tue, Jan 1, 2013 11:23:16am

re: #9 goddamnedfrank

Is it really a donation if you're relying on the Government to subsidize it?

Wait, now a tax deduction is a subsidy?

The semantics of this game boggle the mind.

13 Dark_Falcon  Tue, Jan 1, 2013 11:24:01am

re: #8 Targetpractice

It also means that Obama can junk this "deal" and say "I tried $400K, but that wasn't good enough. So now you either agree to $250K or watch the voters tear you apart."

My answer to that would be: "Then we'll see what the voters say."

14 Kronocide  Tue, Jan 1, 2013 11:24:16am

re: #9 goddamnedfrank

Is it really a donation if you're relying on the Government to subsidize it?

And therein lies the crux of this vacuous rhetorical point.

15 Targetpractice  Tue, Jan 1, 2013 11:24:49am

re: #13 Dark_Falcon

My answer to that would be: "Then we'll see what the voters say."

My guess is the voters will agree, considering polls to date. If the House GOP kills this deal, then on their heads it will be.

16 FemNaziBitch  Tue, Jan 1, 2013 11:25:10am

hubby just turned on Fox. O'Reilly is ranting about the "so-called War on Women"

This is how my New Year is beginning.

17 jaunte  Tue, Jan 1, 2013 11:25:56am

re: #9 goddamnedfrank

The very wealthy probably wouldn't give as much to art museums and operas if they didn't get a fabulous party, their name on the wall or a board seat out of it.

18 Charles Johnson  Tue, Jan 1, 2013 11:27:06am

re: #10 Dark_Falcon

Apparently you've mistaken me for someone who respects the Republican Party.

19 lawhawk  Tue, Jan 1, 2013 11:27:40am

re: #10 Dark_Falcon

The GOP have few options in the House. They can bitch and whine, but if they block the Senate deal it shows that they are obstructionists at their core and have no intention of accepting any kind of deal under any circumstances. If anything, if they block the Senate plan, it would only add ammo to the Senate and WH to push a deal that leaves the GOP in an even worse position - each successive deal that the House blocks would be met with one that gives the House GOP even less. That's not governance. That's insanity and the Senate GOP knows this. That's why they went with the current compromise deal.

The House GOP is so reactionary and anti-Obama, they're willing to take that chance.

20 Feline Fearless Leader  Tue, Jan 1, 2013 11:28:13am

re: #17 jaunte

The very wealthy probably wouldn't give as much to art museums and operas if they didn't get a fabulous party, their name on the wall or a board seat out of it.

Broad brush folks. Just tossing an entire group of people into a bucket due to what their income is. Some might be seeking attention, glory, and names on walls; others are simply trying to do good with their wealth and are not interested in the attention.

21 lawhawk  Tue, Jan 1, 2013 11:28:39am
22 Kronocide  Tue, Jan 1, 2013 11:28:40am

Fleischer's tweet will get thrown into the dustbin of cheap rhetorical shots that count for intellect.

Remove deductions for charity, we give less to charity.

Guns don't cause crime, people cause crime.

Gun laws don't work, criminals don't pay attention to laws anyway.

A bunch of cheap fast food intellectual sandwiches, all bread and no meat.

23 wrenchwench  Tue, Jan 1, 2013 11:29:28am

re: #10 Dark_Falcon

Your tone is very bad on this one, Charles. Spinning a deal as a defeat for the GOP is a way to get the House to vote the deal down. Compromise needs to be accompanied by a certain level of spoken and written generosity, even if you feel the other side does not deserve it.

Thanks for explaining your downding on the article. However, I detect little or no spin among the facts stated at the top.

24 Kronocide  Tue, Jan 1, 2013 11:29:51am

re: #18 Charles Johnson

Apparently you've mistaken me for someone who respects the Republican Party.

...and if the Republican party responds to you disrespecting them, then it's your fault.

Leadership Boehnernam-Style!

25 FemNaziBitch  Tue, Jan 1, 2013 11:29:53am

In one of the Logic (philosophy) courses I took in college, the prof would hand-out xerox copies of various newspaper articles and advertisements. We had to try to reduce the statements to logical equations.

I try to do that with the current tax rhetoric and I can't.

26 Charles Johnson  Tue, Jan 1, 2013 11:30:35am

The right wing whining over a tax hike that will have absolutely NO impact on the rich is typically disconnected from reality.

27 FemNaziBitch  Tue, Jan 1, 2013 11:31:55am

re: #26 Charles Johnson

The right wing whining over a tax hike that will have absolutely NO impact on the rich is typically disconnected from reality.

Don't you understand. Helping the 99% in any way, takes power over them away from the 1%. Therefore impacting them a great deal.

:0

28 Skip Intro  Tue, Jan 1, 2013 11:33:20am

re: #17 jaunte

The very wealthy probably wouldn't give as much to art museums and operas if they didn't get a fabulous party, their name on the wall or a board seat out of it.

The truly wealthy around the turn of the 20th century gave away huge sums of money and created endowments because they felt it was the right thing to do. Today they complain that if their taxes increase they won't be able to buy themselves another private island.

29 Charles Johnson  Tue, Jan 1, 2013 11:33:34am

The rate rises from 35% to 39.6%.

They might have to pass up buying new wiper blades for their Hummers this spring.

30 Gus  Tue, Jan 1, 2013 11:33:51am

It's already past 2:30 PM in DC. What in the world are they doing?

31 Vicious Babushka  Tue, Jan 1, 2013 11:34:11am

re: #29 Charles Johnson

The rate rises from 35% to 39.6%.

They might have to pass up buying new wiper blades for their Hummers this spring.

Who drives Hummers any more?

32 FemNaziBitch  Tue, Jan 1, 2013 11:34:17am

re: #30 Gus

It's already past 2:30 PM in DC. What in the world are they doing?

spending our money

33 Vicious Babushka  Tue, Jan 1, 2013 11:34:23am

re: #30 Gus

It's already past 2:30 PM in DC. What in the world are they doing?

Sleeping it off.

34 BongCrodny  Tue, Jan 1, 2013 11:34:37am

re: #2 Charles Johnson

[Embedded content]

It's just so hard to live on a seven-figure income these days.

35 jaunte  Tue, Jan 1, 2013 11:34:42am

Your name, 18" tall.
[Link: www.davewilsonphotography.com...]

36 FemNaziBitch  Tue, Jan 1, 2013 11:34:45am

re: #31 Vicious Babushka

Who drives Hummers any more?

Bentley's for the Conservatives . . .

37 Targetpractice  Tue, Jan 1, 2013 11:34:57am

re: #30 Gus

It's already past 2:30 PM in DC. What in the world are they doing?

My guess? Boehner's still trying to drum up a majority of the majority just to bring the bill to the floor.

38 lawhawk  Tue, Jan 1, 2013 11:36:27am

re: #29 Charles Johnson

That increase affects only dollars over the $400/$450k top bracket. Amounts under that amount are subject to the lower bracket rates.

Say you make $500k as a married couple. The first $450k is subject to the lower bracket rates and only the remaining $50k above $450 is subject to the new higher rate. It's a 4.6% hike on income above $450.

39 bratwurst  Tue, Jan 1, 2013 11:36:32am

re: #10 Dark_Falcon

Your tone is very bad on this one, Charles. Spinning a deal as a defeat for the GOP is a way to get the House to vote the deal down. Compromise needs to be accompanied by a certain level of spoken and written generosity, even if you feel the other side does not deserve it.

Ask the Romney campaign about how the whole "let's pretend we're winning when we're really losing" thing worked out for them.

40 Gus  Tue, Jan 1, 2013 11:36:57am

re: #36 Holidays are Family Fun Time

Bentley's for the Conservatives . . .

Conservative car ownership: Cadillac in public; Audi in private.

41 FemNaziBitch  Tue, Jan 1, 2013 11:37:58am

re: #40 Gus

Conservative car ownership: Cadillac in public; Audi in private.

In the 70's in Detroit, where and when I grew-up. Cadillacs were pimp cars. There weren't too many non-Detroit cars driven around.

42 Lidane  Tue, Jan 1, 2013 11:38:20am
43 Targetpractice  Tue, Jan 1, 2013 11:39:01am

re: #42 Lidane

[Embedded content]

Mass political seppuku to start the new year. How fitting for the modern GOP.

44 jaunte  Tue, Jan 1, 2013 11:39:19am

re: #40 Gus

If Cadillac would just produce their own hyper-ostentatious-consumption sportscar like the Bugatti Veyron, they could keep all that conservative money in the country.

45 stabby  Tue, Jan 1, 2013 11:39:28am

re: #38 lawhawk

That increase affects only dollars over the $400/$450k top bracket. Amounts under that amount are subject to the lower bracket rates.

Say you make $500k as a married couple. The first $450k is subject to the lower bracket rates and only the remaining $50k above $450 is subject to the new higher rate. It's a 4.6% hike on income above $450.

That's not much more than a symbolic hike.

Jesus

46 stabby  Tue, Jan 1, 2013 11:40:17am

re: #42 Lidane

It's not suicide unless they can lose their elections for it.

Bad for the party, but is it bad for the house?

47 FemNaziBitch  Tue, Jan 1, 2013 11:41:03am

VOCABULARY WORD FOR THE DAY:

Seppuku (切腹?, "stomach-cutting") is a form of Japanese ritual suicide by disembowelment. Seppuku was originally reserved only for samurai. Part of the samurai bushido honor code, seppuku was either used voluntarily by samurai to die with honor rather than fall into the hands of their enemies (and likely suffer torture), or as a form of capital punishment for samurai who had committed serious offenses, or performed for other reasons that had brought shame to them. The ceremonial disembowelment, which is usually part of a more elaborate ritual and performed in front of spectators, consists of plunging a short blade, traditionally a tantō, into the abdomen and moving the blade from left to right in a slicing motion.[1]

48 Kronocide  Tue, Jan 1, 2013 11:41:04am

re: #29 Charles Johnson

The rate rises from 35% to 39.6%.

They might have to pass up buying new wiper blades for their Hummers this spring.

That means their 3rd home in Hawaii that is 8,000 sf may have to reduce to 6,800 sf. Or they have to reduce the dedicated theater to a mere media room.

Hell hath no fury for an economy scorned by the job creators!

49 wrenchwench  Tue, Jan 1, 2013 11:41:19am
50 lawhawk  Tue, Jan 1, 2013 11:42:07am

re: #45 stabby

That's one of the reasons that Obama was pushing for the $250k top tax bracket, but he compromised on that point.

Not that it's going to matter though since it looks like the House is about to boot it back to the Senate. They're going to end up with a worse deal if this goes on. They're going to end up negotiating against themselves. A worse deal (by GOP standards) would hammer this home.

51 HappyWarrior  Tue, Jan 1, 2013 11:42:11am

re: #2 Charles Johnson

[Embedded content]

Dick is being charitable pun intended.

52 Charles Johnson  Tue, Jan 1, 2013 11:42:15am

The House Republicans are going to whine all the way down to the wire. What a pathetic display.

53 Gus  Tue, Jan 1, 2013 11:42:51am

re: #52 Charles Johnson

The House Republicans are going to whine all the way down to the wire. What a pathetic display.

54 Lidane  Tue, Jan 1, 2013 11:43:08am

Right on cue, #tcot is in an uproar.

55 bratwurst  Tue, Jan 1, 2013 11:43:41am
56 Targetpractice  Tue, Jan 1, 2013 11:44:32am

re: #53 Gus

[Embedded content]

Political move. See how much now they can squeeze out of Senate Dems, with any refusal used to brand them as killing the deal.

57 palomino  Tue, Jan 1, 2013 11:45:54am

re: #10 Dark_Falcon

Your tone is very bad on this one, Charles. Spinning a deal as a defeat for the GOP is a way to get the House to vote the deal down. Compromise needs to be accompanied by a certain level of spoken and written generosity, even if you feel the other side does not deserve it.

Did you even read the last paragraph of his post? The one where he acknowledges in a pragmatic and positive way that the deal is a compromise.

It's always a good day when rabid ideologues with their extremist mantra of "no new taxes on anyone ever under any circumstances" are forced to face reality and start governing.

58 Stanghazi  Tue, Jan 1, 2013 11:45:57am

Fleischer REALLY pissed me off. He summed up greed, lack of empathy and the epitomy of being an Ass Hole in one tweet.

59 Randall Gross  Tue, Jan 1, 2013 11:46:35am

re: #10 Dark_Falcon

Sorry but I think that the GOP really needs to see the public doing an end zone dance over the fallen Grover Norquist to regain their senses. It's only going to get worse from here if they do not. Politics is a game of inches and feet no matter what the drama queen hard partisans try to portray, but this was still a score no matter how few inches it moved the ball.

60 Lidane  Tue, Jan 1, 2013 11:46:59am
61 makeitstop  Tue, Jan 1, 2013 11:47:19am

re: #53 Gus

Rep. Spencer Bachus: "I'll be shocked if this isn't sent back to the Senate," amended w more spending cuts.

Senate Dems should find the harshest words they can muster under protocol that translate into 'Go fuck yourself, Bachus.'

I liked that Obama quote. What was it? 'You get nothing. I get that for free.'

62 Awea  Tue, Jan 1, 2013 11:47:30am

So if the taxes did go up, even for a small amount for the 400K+ group. How can Norquist say this is not a break of his pledge? If he says it ok, he pretty much lost most of his power of the pledge.

63 FemNaziBitch  Tue, Jan 1, 2013 11:47:32am

I am more and more equating the GOP with the Mullahs in Iran.

64 HappyWarrior  Tue, Jan 1, 2013 11:48:33am

re: #63 Holidays are Family Fun Time

I am more and more equating the GOP with the Mullahs in Iran.

I can't go that far but I have more and more of a desire to see them become an extinct party than ever.

65 Targetpractice  Tue, Jan 1, 2013 11:48:36am

re: #62 Awea

So if the taxes did go up, even for a small amount for the 400K+ group. How can Norquist say this is not a break of his pledge? If he says it ok, he pretty much lost most of his power of the pledge.

His reasoning, at least as I understood it last night, is he will not hold this against any GOP member, so long as they voted earlier this year to make all the rate cuts permanent. In other words, he's just created a loophole you could drive a Mack truck through.

66 FemNaziBitch  Tue, Jan 1, 2013 11:49:37am

re: #64 HappyWarrior

I can't go that far but I have more and more of a desire to see them become an extinct party than ever.

They definitely fall under the category of "theocrats".

67 Lidane  Tue, Jan 1, 2013 11:49:47am

What right wing racism?

68 FemNaziBitch  Tue, Jan 1, 2013 11:50:39am

Now, there is some show about J. Edgar on the TV in the other room. It's enough to make one vomit.

69 lawhawk  Tue, Jan 1, 2013 11:50:57am

re: #62 Awea

Here's how the Norquist logic would work.

Under the deal enacted by Congress in 2003 and then 2009 (extending the reduced rates until 12/31/2012), the rates resumed their prior rates. Now, we get a new tax rate cut that affects everyone but the people making over $400/450k. Not exactly tax cuts for everyone, but it's not hikes. And he can blame the higher rate on the earlier Congress.

70 Mattand  Tue, Jan 1, 2013 11:51:15am

re: #10 Dark_Falcon

Your tone is very bad on this one, Charles. Spinning a deal as a defeat for the GOP is a way to get the House to vote the deal down. Compromise needs to be accompanied by a certain level of spoken and written generosity, even if you feel the other side does not deserve it.

I really hate to start off 2013 this way, but, honestly, fuck that.

First off, there's no spin. It is a defeat for the GOP. The self-same GOP whose members have no compunctions about destroying the US economy if they don't get what they want.

The tax cuts DID NOT WORK. End of story. And the people who are getting the taxes raised can afford it, and can also afford the accountants necessary to soften the impact.

Second: a certain level of spoken and written generosity? Based on what? They were just kidding or it was "satire" when the GOP was questioning whether or not Obama was an American, or he was responsible for the Benghazi deaths?

Bullshit. The Republican party is a psychotic mess, putting their desire to party like it's 1499 over the well-being of our nation. They are being run by a horde of reactionary loons, and I'll be damned if Obama not hurting their precious widdle egos needs to be part of the equation.

As I said yesterday, Republicans alone are responsible for this whole friggin' mess. Deal with it.

71 HappyWarrior  Tue, Jan 1, 2013 11:51:30am

re: #66 Holidays are Family Fun Time

They definitely fall under the category of "theocrats".

Can't argue with that one.

72 jhrhv  Tue, Jan 1, 2013 11:51:30am

I donated a large sum to cancer research last year and I've already got $1,800 earmarked for that again this year.

I don't do it because of the deduction. That isn't even a consideration.

I do because I've been fortunate and can afford to. Well fortunate that the Mrs's I are doing well in our careers and are healthy enough to work.

I make that donation among others because it is the right thing to do. So Ari go efyourself you Prick. If I can afford to give because it is the right thing to do maybe you can too because you're fortunate and not because you get a tax break you HUGE DOUCHE!

73 Lidane  Tue, Jan 1, 2013 11:51:38am
74 FemNaziBitch  Tue, Jan 1, 2013 11:53:12am

re: #69 lawhawk

Here's how the Norquist logic would work.

Under the deal enacted by Congress in 2003 and then 2009 (extending the reduced rates until 12/31/2012), the rates resumed their prior rates. Now, we get a new tax rate cut that affects everyone but the people making over $400/450k. Not exactly tax cuts for everyone, but it's not hikes. And he can blame the higher rate on the earlier Congress.

I don't understand that either. I think I need visual aids.

75 Gus  Tue, Jan 1, 2013 11:53:44am
76 Lidane  Tue, Jan 1, 2013 11:53:48am

OUTRAGE!

Except the only news outlets reporting this are RWNJ sites like Freeper land, Breitbart and The Blaze. No mention anywhere else. I call bullshit.

77 Dark_Falcon  Tue, Jan 1, 2013 11:54:56am

re: #18 Charles Johnson

Apparently you've mistaken me for someone who respects the Republican Party.

No, I'm hoping you want a deal. A deal means not going after someone for striking that deal with you.

78 HappyWarrior  Tue, Jan 1, 2013 11:55:01am

re: #76 Lidane

OUTRAGE!

[Embedded content]

Except the only news outlets reporting this are RWNJ sites like Freeper land, Breitbart and The Blaze. No mention anywhere else. I call bullshit.

It's because they only know the truth! Oh and where was their outrage when their hero actually helped the Iranian regime in the 80's? Oh that's right. Blindly defending him.

79 FemNaziBitch  Tue, Jan 1, 2013 11:56:45am

re: #72 jhrhv

I donated a large sum to cancer research last year and I've already got $1,800 earmarked for that again this year.

I don't do it because of the deduction. That isn't even a consideration.

I do because I've been fortunate and can afford to. Well fortunate that the Mrs's I are doing well in our careers and are healthy enough to work.

I make that donation among others because it is the right thing to do. So Ari go efyourself you Prick. If I can afford to give because it is the right thing to do maybe you can too can give because you're fortunate and not because you get a tax break you HUGE DOUCHE!

I think the only thing the 501(c)3 designation means to me is that the organization is a legitimate charity. I don't want to give to an organization that isn't.

The tax deduction is (IMHO) a pain-in-the Paper Tiger's ass. Another file folder I have to keep and paperwork to sort. Perhaps because I don't think it makes a huge difference in the overall tax burden. Then, again, I don't pay much attention. I also don't write checks for thousands to charity. I don't have that much to give.

80 lawhawk  Tue, Jan 1, 2013 11:57:28am

re: #76 Lidane

Say that sale exists. Further posit that Obama then cuts the sale of the F-16s.

The ensuing outrage from the same folks complaining would be that Obama's killing jobs on the F-16 factory lines and that the sale must go through.

In other words, no matter what the President does, they'd complain about what the President is doing.

81 Mattand  Tue, Jan 1, 2013 11:58:17am

re: #77 Dark_Falcon

No, I'm hoping you want a deal. A deal means not going after someone for striking that deal with you.

You guys should have thought about that four years ago when the party was vowing their only goal was to drive Obama out of office, and looking the other way on shit like birtherism.

82 Lidane  Tue, Jan 1, 2013 11:58:29am

re: #19 lawhawk

The House GOP is so reactionary and anti-Obama, they're willing to take that chance.

Honestly? Let them. Let the House GOP vote it down. Let them obstruct everything, even at the expense of the deal the Senate GOP worked out. They're going to do it anyway.

If that's what it takes to get people to realize that the House GOP only exist to hate on Obama and not do anything else, then so be it.

83 FemNaziBitch  Tue, Jan 1, 2013 11:58:31am

re: #80 lawhawk

Say that sale exists. Further posit that Obama then cuts the sale of the F-16s.

The ensuing outrage from the same folks complaining would be that Obama's killing jobs on the F-16 factory lines and that the sale must go through.

In other words, no matter what the President does, they'd complain about what the President is doing.

And it doesn't seem to matter who is POTUS. We just alternate labels every 4-8 years.

84 Romantic Heretic  Tue, Jan 1, 2013 11:59:17am

re: #34 BongCrodny

It's just so hard to live on a seven-figure income these days.

I'd be happy with a five figure income.

85 lawhawk  Tue, Jan 1, 2013 12:00:30pm

re: #79 Holidays are Family Fun Time

Donations are easy enough to keep track of. Create a tax year 2013 folder today. Put all of your 2013 donations in the folder. Include a sheet of paper with a running tally of the donations. That way, when tax time comes around in early 2014, you have all your papers together and can add up donations easily and quickly. Makes the whole thing far less painful.

86 Gus  Tue, Jan 1, 2013 12:00:43pm

Press Conference!

[Link: www.c-span.org...]

Dems.

87 FemNaziBitch  Tue, Jan 1, 2013 12:01:08pm

What would it take to remove the 501(c)3 from mega churches and televangelists? Something like any church with revenues over $1M pay a tax on the amount over $1M.

$1M just being a arbitrary figure chosen from a top hat to keep from destrying small churches who really don't have a pot to pee in.

88 makeitstop  Tue, Jan 1, 2013 12:02:43pm

re: #76 Lidane

OUTRAGE!

[Embedded content]

Except the only news outlets reporting this are RWNJ sites like Freeper land, Breitbart and The Blaze. No mention anywhere else. I call bullshit.

I read about that somewhere. It's the tail end of a deal that was made years ago when the MB had nothing to do with anything. Just moar derp and faux outrage.

89 Dark_Falcon  Tue, Jan 1, 2013 12:02:59pm

re: #80 lawhawk

Say that sale exists. Further posit that Obama then cuts the sale of the F-16s.

The ensuing outrage from the same folks complaining would be that Obama's killing jobs on the F-16 factory lines and that the sale must go through.

In other words, no matter what the President does, they'd complain about what the President is doing.

Of course they do that. Both sides do that. If you give full praise or credit to an action by an office holder of the other party, you're also telling the voters why they should stick with the other party the next time that office has an election. It's a case of electoral politics over results.

90 FemNaziBitch  Tue, Jan 1, 2013 12:03:24pm

re: #85 lawhawk

Donations are easy enough to keep track of. Create a tax year 2013 folder today. Put all of your 2013 donations in the folder. Include a sheet of paper with a running tally of the donations. That way, when tax time comes around in early 2014, you have all your papers together and can add up donations easily and quickly. Makes the whole thing far less painful.

I do that. And I still think it's a PITA. I've worked so many jobs in which Paperwork was CYA. I'm sooo tired of it.

There was a time when our CPA actually called me and told me I kept excellent records and did most of their work for them. Now, I throw the file at them and hope the office doesn't burn down because I haven't made a copies.

91 Lidane  Tue, Jan 1, 2013 12:04:20pm

re: #81 Mattand

You guys should have thought about that four years ago when the party was vowing their only goal was to drive Obama out of office, and looking the other way on shit like birtherism.

THIS.

What we're seeing now from the House GOP is the direct result of a bunch of GOP voters deliberately looking the other way and/or downplaying the birthers and teabaggers and wingnuts and voting for them anway.

92 Dark_Falcon  Tue, Jan 1, 2013 12:04:34pm

re: #87 Holidays are Family Fun Time

What would it take to remove the 501(c)3 from mega churches and televangelists? Something like any church with revenues over $1M pay a tax on the amount over $1M.

$1M just being a arbitrary figure chosen from a top hat to keep from destrying small churches who really don't have a pot to pee in.

Not doable. The religious organization exemption is pretty all or nothing.

93 FemNaziBitch  Tue, Jan 1, 2013 12:04:36pm

While I don't agree with the GOP right now, I have to take a deep breathe and realize that, at the very least, the members suit-up and show-up for work every day.

I can't respect them for doing that, at the very least.

94 Gus  Tue, Jan 1, 2013 12:04:50pm
95 makeitstop  Tue, Jan 1, 2013 12:04:54pm

re: #89 Dark_Falcon

Both sides do that.

No. No, they do not.

96 FemNaziBitch  Tue, Jan 1, 2013 12:05:10pm

re: #92 Dark_Falcon

Not doable. The religious organization exemption is pretty all or nothing.

Why? We write out own rules for eveyrthing else.

97 Targetpractice  Tue, Jan 1, 2013 12:05:20pm

re: #94 Gus

[Embedded content]

Color me shocked.///

98 Lidane  Tue, Jan 1, 2013 12:06:01pm

re: #94 Gus

Looks like Cantor is angling to be Speaker. If his opposition works, he breaks Boehner's leadership and he wins over the knuckle-draggers and mouth-breathers on the far right who hate the Senate deal.

99 HappyWarrior  Tue, Jan 1, 2013 12:07:17pm

re: #94 Gus

[Embedded content]

Cantor's about as predictable as a rooster.

100 FemNaziBitch  Tue, Jan 1, 2013 12:07:20pm

re: #98 Lidane

Looks like Cantor is angling to be Speaker. If his opposition works, he breaks Boehner's leadership and he wins over the knuckle-draggers and mouth-breathers on the far right who hate the Senate deal.

Yes, it's about votes (power) not results.

Fuck the country when one's career could be boosted.

101 FemNaziBitch  Tue, Jan 1, 2013 12:07:41pm

re: #99 HappyWarrior

Cantor's about as predictable as a rooster.

He is a cock?

102 Stanghazi  Tue, Jan 1, 2013 12:08:30pm

re: #94 Gus

he wants boehners job and bad

103 HappyWarrior  Tue, Jan 1, 2013 12:08:34pm

re: #101 Holidays are Family Fun Time

He is a cock?

Hah now that you mention it.......

104 Mattand  Tue, Jan 1, 2013 12:08:46pm

re: #91 Lidane

THIS.

What we're seeing now from the House GOP is the direct result of a bunch of GOP voters deliberately looking the other way and/or downplaying the birthers and teabaggers and wingnuts and voting for them anway.

Yeah, the amount of denial from rank-and-file GOP, and quasi-No True Republican arguments ("Just because my candidate thinks Obama is a socialist Muslim atheist doesn't mean I believe it!") has been really sad.

105 HappyWarrior  Tue, Jan 1, 2013 12:10:09pm

In a way, I'd like to see Cantor get his little coup and then find out that being Speaker of the House is harder than it looks. It would be hilarious to see Cantor find out that actually doing the job rather than being a grandstanding prick and constant second guesser.

106 Onyx99  Tue, Jan 1, 2013 12:10:45pm

In surveys, less than 10% of high-net-worth individuals say that they would substantially reduce their charitable giving if the federal deduction were eliminated (not just limited). More than half say they would not change their donations. Looks like it's not just "math"... there's a spectrum, on the "dick" end of which we find Ari Fleischer. Also, Ari's saying that people have less to "donate and spend" suggests that that's what the wealthy are predominantly doing with their income: putting it back into the economy, as opposed to holding onto it. Does it need to be pointed out that if this were the case, we wouldn't be in a recession?

107 FemNaziBitch  Tue, Jan 1, 2013 12:10:56pm

re: #102 Stanghazi

he wants boehners job and bad

wait a minute.

the cock wants the boner's job?

108 Gus  Tue, Jan 1, 2013 12:10:57pm
109 palomino  Tue, Jan 1, 2013 12:11:22pm

re: #77 Dark_Falcon

No, I'm hoping you want a deal. A deal means not going after someone for striking that deal with you.

Obviously he wants a deal, as he praised the compromise that was part of the senate's bipartisan vote.

How is he "going after" anyone? By being happy that gridlock and the philosophical rigidity that leads thereto have been overcome, at least temporarily.

You sound like a very sore loser who feels that his party deserves cookies and blowjobs merely for making the kinds of concessions that have always been part of democratic governance.

110 Destro  Tue, Jan 1, 2013 12:11:22pm

I know the "no drama Obama" persona seems to get results but I want Obama to show drama and just bitch slap the Republicans for their kamikaze approach to the economy via the fiscal cliff debacle. The GOP has an inflexible non-reality based ideology and when confronted with reality their fantasy based ideology can not function and allow them to act. This makes the GOP a threat to the American and world economies.

111 Ming  Tue, Jan 1, 2013 12:11:56pm

re: #38 lawhawk

That increase affects only dollars over the $400/$450k top bracket. Amounts under that amount are subject to the lower bracket rates.

Say you make $500k as a married couple. The first $450k is subject to the lower bracket rates and only the remaining $50k above $450 is subject to the new higher rate. It's a 4.6% hike on income above $450.

Given the above, I suspect that raising the numbers from 200K/250K to 400K/450K may have been a major concession on the amount of tax revenues, since all that money between 200K/250K and 400K/450K will continue to be taxed at the Bush tax cut rates, no 4.6% hike. I'm not happy about that, and I'd like to know how much that concession really is. I hope this turns out to be a decent deal.

112 HappyWarrior  Tue, Jan 1, 2013 12:12:03pm

Does Ari think bragging about being a greedy douche makes him look good? Okay, Ari, it's nice that you give to charity but if you can't handle your taxes being at Clinton era levels then you were never that generous to begin with. You were just a prick.

113 Stanghazi  Tue, Jan 1, 2013 12:12:21pm

re: #106 Onyx99

Welcome Hatchling!

114 FemNaziBitch  Tue, Jan 1, 2013 12:12:57pm

The men in Congress have a great need to "save face."

A strange and very derided cultural meme when applied to other nationalities.

115 Stanghazi  Tue, Jan 1, 2013 12:12:58pm

re: #107 Holidays are Family Fun Time

wait a minute.

the cock wants the boner's job?

Of course!

116 Kronocide  Tue, Jan 1, 2013 12:13:24pm

Ari Fleischer's tweet is not about math or economics: it's about petty antagonism, pointing out that removing deductions will hurt charities, so removing deductions are bad.

To respond to this criticism by saying 'it's about economics, stupid' is dishonest.

117 HappyWarrior  Tue, Jan 1, 2013 12:13:32pm

re: #107 Holidays are Family Fun Time

wait a minute.

the cock wants the boner's job?

Yes, a dick wants another dick's job.

118 FemNaziBitch  Tue, Jan 1, 2013 12:14:14pm

re: #113 Stanghazi

Welcome Hatchling!

More like a toddler than a hatchling.

119 Romantic Heretic  Tue, Jan 1, 2013 12:14:25pm

re: #47 Holidays are Family Fun Time

VOCABULARY WORD FOR THE DAY:

The description is kind of incomplete.

There's supposed to be an upward slice after the cross slice. There was a lot of honour attached to someone who could do this.

It rarely got that far. The samurai's kaishakunin, or second usually beheaded them the instant the knife touched the suicider's stomach.

There's another form of seppuku not mentioned. A form where the samurai is admonishing his daimyo for foolishness or dishonourable behaviour. It's a way of saying, "I cannot carry your wishes for they are wrong. It is better for me to die than to dishonour you or myself"

120 Destro  Tue, Jan 1, 2013 12:14:42pm

re: #105 HappyWarrior

In a way, I'd like to see Cantor get his little coup and then find out that being Speaker of the House is harder than it looks. It would be hilarious to see Cantor find out that actually doing the job rather than being a grandstanding prick and constant second guesser.

I think the new generation of Republicans just wants to be grandstanding kooks. There is money to be made via right wing talk show appearances, book deals, etc and they will be re-elected on local gerrymandered districts by playing up the right wing kook-dom. Cantor and the kooks know they are no longer a national party but a regional party that wins by blocking the Democrats and maybe by sneaking into power on some national overseas foreign policy emergency where the GOP can play up the militarist angle.

121 Randall Gross  Tue, Jan 1, 2013 12:14:47pm

All GOP potentials for 2016 have to make their objections seen, whether it's Cantor, Rubio, or Rand Paul, they've all laid their pro forma markers out. Expect them to be no votes, but I would be surprised to see Cantor actually gather the peasants and torches.

122 FemNaziBitch  Tue, Jan 1, 2013 12:14:50pm

re: #117 HappyWarrior

Yes, a dick wants another dick's job.

Typical male behavior.

Not to be a femnazi bitch, but I am, what I am.

:0

123 kirkspencer  Tue, Jan 1, 2013 12:14:52pm

re: #98 Lidane

Looks like Cantor is angling to be Speaker. If his opposition works, he breaks Boehner's leadership and he wins over the knuckle-draggers and mouth-breathers on the far right who hate the Senate deal.

In isolation, this could be fun. For those who don't know, the Speaker is elected with a simple majority of all the voting representatives. If some reps don't vote, the number needed for a majority goes down. If no candidate gets a majority, the roll call vote is repeated - - as often as it takes.

So Dems (probably) split the vote for Pelosi and Hastert, and the Republicans do it for Boehner and Cantor. Over and over till someone says "enough" and changes their vote.

In some ways it's an excellent test for the position. If you can't bully/persuade/twist arms enough to get the position, how are you going to do it the rest of the year? But with this little civil war we could see all sorts of "enough already" reactions. All on the public stage, all showing exactly what the GOP has become.

124 William Barnett-Lewis  Tue, Jan 1, 2013 12:14:57pm

re: #92 Dark_Falcon

Not doable. The religious organization exemption is pretty all or nothing.

As a very active member of a very small church that might well be killed by it, I'd still like to see the religious organization exemption end. It is nothing but ill for our nation and for our churches.

125 jhrhv  Tue, Jan 1, 2013 12:15:14pm

re: #90 Holidays are Family Fun Time

re: #85 lawhawk

I'm lucky. My tax paper is super easy. The Mrs on the other hand yikes. So she takes care of the whole mess.

I just mainly try to remember how lucky I am in so many ways. I grew up with parents who taught me I was lucky to have food and a home. My dad lost family in WWII and he only made it out of Germany on his wits and luck. My mom's dad came to within inches of his life in a tank also in WWII.

So for me to be able to have luxuries/toys that I have and loads of do what I want time I always try to remember to stay humble and to give back.

I have been had by a couple of false charities. Police raising money for kids to go the circus. Actually when the wife did the paper work she found out they were fake. Made telling them to take a hike the next year easy.

I've found donating to people who ask for sponsorship online like in FB to be a solid way to make honest donations.

126 HappyWarrior  Tue, Jan 1, 2013 12:15:20pm

re: #120 Destro

I think the new generation of Republicans just wants to be grandstanding kooks. There is money to be made via right wing talk show appearances, book deals, etc and they will be re-elected on local gerrymandered districts by playing up the right wing kook-dom. Cantor and the kooks know they are no longer a national party but a regional party that wins by blocking the Democrats and maybe by sneaking into power on some national overseas foreign policy emergency where the GOP can play up the militarist angle.

I wouldn't really call Cantor the younger generation. I don't disagree though that they're rapidly becoming a regional party tho.

127 HoosierHoops  Tue, Jan 1, 2013 12:15:48pm

Vote in the Senate this morning was 89-8 in favor of the compromise. That is amazing. But what was the name of the GOP Rep that that says it's always the same 40-50 chuckle heads that blocks compromise in the house. ( Tea party )

128 Targetpractice  Tue, Jan 1, 2013 12:15:49pm

re: #110 Destro

I know the "no drama Obama" persona seems to get results but I want Obama to show drama and just bitch slap the Republicans for their kamikaze approach to the economy via the fiscal cliff debacle. The GOP has an inflexible non-reality based ideology and when confronted with reality their fantasy based ideology can not function and allow them to act. This makes the GOP a threat to the American and world economies.

From all appearances, the drama's set for February, when the GOP's gonna demand further blood sacrifices to raise the debt limit. If Obama holds true to his pledge not to negotiate, then we may be headed for a default.

129 Stanghazi  Tue, Jan 1, 2013 12:16:09pm

re: #118 Holidays are Family Fun Time

first comment kudos?

130 FemNaziBitch  Tue, Jan 1, 2013 12:16:27pm

re: #119 Romantic Heretic

The description is kind of incomplete.

There's supposed to be an upward slice after the cross slice. There was a lot of honour attached to someone who could do this.

It rarely got that far. The samurai's kaishakunin, or second usually beheaded them the instant the knife touched the suicider's stomach.

There's another form of seppuku not mentioned. A form where the samurai is admonishing his daimyo for foolishness or dishonourable behaviour. It's a way of saying, "I cannot carry your wishes for they are wrong. It is better for me to die than to dishonour you or myself"

Well, I thought the simple "stomach-cutting form of suicide" was enough of a description to illuminate your original statement.

Bt the whole "saving face" game of honor is most apropos.

:0

131 Destro  Tue, Jan 1, 2013 12:17:17pm

re: #126 HappyWarrior

I wouldn't really call Cantor the younger generation. I don't disagree though that they're rapidly becoming a regional party tho.

I meant the new generation rather than younger as in age generation - the new Tea Party guard - if you will (even though the tea party is more a BS astro turf movement - the name sticks).

132 jaunte  Tue, Jan 1, 2013 12:18:10pm

Fleischer's real concern may be that tax-deductible contributions to groups like "The National Right To Work Foundation" (Defending America's workers from the abuses of compulsory unionism since 1968) will also be diminished.
[Link: www.nrtw.org...]

133 Lidane  Tue, Jan 1, 2013 12:18:11pm
134 HappyWarrior  Tue, Jan 1, 2013 12:18:34pm

re: #131 Destro

I meant the new generation rather than younger as in age generation - the new Tea Party guard - if you will (even though the tea party is more a BS astro turf movement - the name sticks).

Ah gotcha. Yeah I understand.

135 FemNaziBitch  Tue, Jan 1, 2013 12:19:05pm

re: #124 William Barnett-Lewis

As a very active member of a very small church that might well be killed by it, I'd still like to see the religious organization exemption end. It is nothing but ill for our nation and for our churches.

This is why I think there needs to be a limit where taxing starts. There is a basic amount needed to run a small church. I'd like to give the benefit-of-the-doubt that people are really trying to do G-d's work. I do know a few people who benefit from churches. It does happen.

136 Destro  Tue, Jan 1, 2013 12:19:05pm

re: #128 Targetpractice

From all appearances, the drama's set for February, when the GOP's gonna demand further blood sacrifices to raise the debt limit. If Obama holds true to his pledge not to negotiate, then we may be headed for a default.

At that point I want Obama to say he will authorize the Treasury to pay the debts the Congress ran up as is required by the Constitution and dare the Congress to impeach him. I am kind of tired of Obama negotiating with the GOP. You can't argue with crazy people.

137 Romantic Heretic  Tue, Jan 1, 2013 12:19:11pm

re: #65 Targetpractice

His reasoning, at least as I understood it last night, is he will not hold this against any GOP member, so long as they voted earlier this year to make all the rate cuts permanent. In other words, he's just created a loophole you could drive a Mack truck through.

It beats having to admit that he's wrong, or powerless.

138 Interesting Times  Tue, Jan 1, 2013 12:19:14pm
139 Randall Gross  Tue, Jan 1, 2013 12:19:21pm

We are two days out from a congress with a slightly changed membership, some of the old Tea Party firebrands will be gone on the 4th when the new 113th Congress starts. The weasel shits don't have that much room to maneuver.

140 jaunte  Tue, Jan 1, 2013 12:19:37pm

re: #133 Lidane

Top Marginal Armageddon!

141 HappyWarrior  Tue, Jan 1, 2013 12:19:44pm

re: #133 Lidane

[Embedded content]

Yes, let's get rid of the Senate because they did something we don't like. Wingnut behavior ain't that different from toddler behavior and I apologize to any Lizards with toddler children or grandchildren.

142 EmmaAnne  Tue, Jan 1, 2013 12:19:50pm

This really illustrates how powerful gerrymandering is. Nearly all Senators (who are elected by an entire state) voted for this deal, but it is iffy whether it will even pass in the House (where members are elected by a carefully hand selected group of voters).

143 Vicious Babushka  Tue, Jan 1, 2013 12:21:29pm

Let the Godwinning begin!

144 Lidane  Tue, Jan 1, 2013 12:21:48pm
145 FemNaziBitch  Tue, Jan 1, 2013 12:22:21pm

re: #125 jhrhv

re: #85 lawhawk

I'm lucky. My tax paper is super easy. The Mrs on the other hand yikes. So she takes care of the whole mess.

I just mainly try to remember how lucky I am in so many ways. I grew up with parents who taught me I was lucky to have food and a home. My dad lost family in WWII and he only made it out of Germany on his wits and luck. My mom's dad came to within inches of his life in a tank also in WWII.

So for me to be able to have luxuries/toys that I have and loads of do what I want time I always try to remember to stay humble and to give back.

I have been had by a couple of false charities. Police raising money for kids to go the circus. Actually when the wife did the paper work she found out they were fake. Made telling them to take a hike the next year easy.

I've found donating to people who ask for sponsorship online like in FB to be a solid way to make honest donations.

I agree about giving back. It's a lot like giving the waiter at breakfast or lunch an extra dollar. Perhaps it's why I give so much in small amounts. I can easily give $1 a day, but writing a check for $365 hurts a bit.

About a year ago, I drove past the local homeless/food shelter which usually has a fairly empty parking lot. That day, the cars were lined-up down the block. One did not need a more blatant example of who bad things were for people.

I don't need another Starbucks, I can give the $4.95 to the food pantry. It's not going to put me in the poor house.

146 Lidane  Tue, Jan 1, 2013 12:22:43pm

re: #143 Vicious Babushka

Let the Godwinning begin!

[Embedded content]

So she's stupid as well as racist:

[Link: littlegreenfootballs.com...]

147 jaunte  Tue, Jan 1, 2013 12:22:49pm

re: #143 Vicious Babushka

Is she a new addition to your derp list?

148 Interesting Times  Tue, Jan 1, 2013 12:22:52pm
149 lawhawk  Tue, Jan 1, 2013 12:23:12pm

re: #142 EmmaAnne

Elected by voters in districts that are guided so as to maintain/extend the status quo. More and more safe districts, fewer swing districts, and reducing the chances that you see significant shifts in the House makeup. Hardens the battle lines - and voters will reinforce these lines.

150 Dark_Falcon  Tue, Jan 1, 2013 12:24:09pm

re: #142 EmmaAnne

This really illustrates how powerful gerrymandering is. Nearly all Senators (who are elected by an entire state) voted for this deal, but it is iffy whether it will even pass in the House (where members are elected by a carefully hand selected group of voters).

Quoted for Truth. Gerrymandering is something America would be far better off if we were rid of it. Politicians won't support getting rid of it without major pressure, so ways need to be found to apply that pressure from below.

151 PhillyPretzel  Tue, Jan 1, 2013 12:25:58pm

PBS will be getting money from me again this year. $50 is a good deal for all the shows I like to watch.

152 Destro  Tue, Jan 1, 2013 12:26:10pm

re: #149 lawhawk

Elected by voters in districts that are guided so as to maintain/extend the status quo. More and more safe districts, fewer swing districts, and reducing the chances that you see significant shifts in the House makeup. Hardens the battle lines - and voters will reinforce these lines.

Luckily, the GOP is composed of old people who, thanks to the natural order of things created by God himself, will die off. The sad part is Obamacare and Democrat support of SS and Medicare and Medicaid maybe will extend their lives despite themselves......

153 Lidane  Tue, Jan 1, 2013 12:26:23pm
154 HappyWarrior  Tue, Jan 1, 2013 12:27:52pm

re: #153 Lidane

[Embedded content]

Yeah because the ME was a peaceful place until Benghazi happened. And what's scary is the obsession with Saul Alinsky. A man who's been dead for over 40 years. Hell though, I remember some of the right wing organizations admitting that they used some of his tactics from Rules For Radicals. So I guess they're secret Alinskites too!

155 Randall Gross  Tue, Jan 1, 2013 12:29:43pm

If the GOP does a faceplant on this today, maybe there's a chance of a Democratically controlled House in 2014...

156 watching you tiny alien kittens are  Tue, Jan 1, 2013 12:30:05pm

re: #76 Lidane

OUTRAGE!

[Embedded content]

Except the only news outlets reporting this are RWNJ sites like Freeper land, Breitbart and The Blaze. No mention anywhere else. I call bullshit.

Will the N.Y.Times do?

[Link: www.nytimes.com...]

157 Feline Fearless Leader  Tue, Jan 1, 2013 12:30:06pm

re: #130 Holidays are Family Fun Time

Well, I thought the simple "stomach-cutting form of suicide" was enough of a description to illuminate your original statement.

Bt the whole "saving face" game of honor is most apropos.

:0

"saving face" leads to all sorts of stupid, illogical, and foolhardy decisions. And also victimizing others via things like "honor killings".

158 FemNaziBitch  Tue, Jan 1, 2013 12:31:14pm

re: #157 Feline Fearless Leader

"saving face" leads to all sorts of stupid, illogical, and foolhardy decisions. And also victimizing others via things like "honor killings".

tribal thinking.

159 watching you tiny alien kittens are  Tue, Jan 1, 2013 12:32:46pm

re: #143 Vicious Babushka

Let the Godwinning begin!

[Embedded content]

I replied to her earlier comment about the phones, pointed out that Obama had nothing to do with that. She came back with "he encouraged" the program to get bigger which is a pure lie. The FCC has cut back on the program and expects to spend $2 billion less now from the Universal service fund.

160 FemNaziBitch  Tue, Jan 1, 2013 12:33:00pm

Happy Thoughts, much needed.

161 Vicious Babushka  Tue, Jan 1, 2013 12:34:00pm

re: #147 jaunte

Is she a new addition to your derp list?

Yep.

162 Dark_Falcon  Tue, Jan 1, 2013 12:35:18pm

re: #155 Randall Gross

If the GOP does a faceplant on this today, maybe there's a chance of a Democratically controlled House in 2014...

From what I was told, Nate Silver says no on that score. The Dems would have to do a good deal better than they did in 2012 to take the House. It was gerrymandered that tightly and that thoroughly.

And why does this Republican hate gerrymandering so much? Because I live in Illinois, where its the Democrats who gerrymander and they're blatant about it. So I've learned the hard way just how bad gerrymandering is, and I've opposed it strongly for the last ten years.

163 Ojoe  Tue, Jan 1, 2013 12:36:02pm

No matter who "wins," this spectacle is ill governance on stilts.

164 BeenHereAwhile  Tue, Jan 1, 2013 12:43:04pm

re: #130 Holidays are Family Fun Time

There's another form of seppuku not mentioned. A form where the samurai is admonishing his daimyo for foolishness or dishonourable behaviour. It's a way of saying, "I cannot carry your wishes for they are wrong. It is better for me to die than to dishonour you or myself"

Well, I thought the simple "stomach-cutting form of suicide" was enough of a description to illuminate your original statement.

Bt the whole "saving face" game of honor is most apropos.

:0

There's another, should the Samuri committ a dishonorable act and wish to attone by Seppuku, the Samuri could be denied the right of Seppuku, as further punishment.

165 jhrhv  Tue, Jan 1, 2013 12:48:59pm

re: #145 Holidays are Family Fun Time

That is really cool. Good for you.

I used to help out at the local youth shelter with their computer setup. At first I admit it was a little tense/strange being around very violent looking kids 19-25. The local community gave them a very bad wrap.

Over time I got to know several of them and they were mainly very nice kids like you would expect. They even started a program to clean up graffiti from the area that most likely was put up by kids living in luxury at home with their folks.

I don't get as many calls for help as I used to. I did a good job with getting them setup :). My team at work one year all jumped in and donated time and money to get computers setup in the common area for this kids to use to surf the net with plus for look for jobs. It cost me nothing but made me feel great to help and getting to know the staff there was something great. Finding out those kids were really as nice as my own family was really eyeopening and an experience I couldn't have purchased for any money.


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