Wash. Times Editor: Obama’s Mother Was ‘Attracted to Men of the Third World’

US News • Views: 4,628

Washington Times editor Wesley Pruden sums up Barack Obama in racially charged language, saying Obama has no “blood impulse” to be an American.

This kind of stuff is becoming more and more open in “conservative” media.

It’s no fault of the president that he has no natural instinct or blood impulse for what the America of “the 57 states” is about. He was sired by a Kenyan father, born to a mother attracted to men of the Third World and reared by grandparents in Hawaii, a paradise far from the American mainstream.

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373 comments
1 Ojoe  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 12:39:10pm

Leave mom out of it.

2 rollwave87  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 12:40:04pm

re: #1 Ojoe

Leave mom out of it.

just leave race out of it.

3 albusteve  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 12:40:22pm

sired?...good grief

4 Mostly sane, most of the time.  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 12:41:09pm

Serious question here:

It's Old World, New World, and Third World? (I've always wondered what the first two were.)

But...Africa was known about WAY before the New World, so that means that...ow...ow...head hurts.

5 Ojoe  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 12:41:09pm
blood impulse

What kind of racial purity bullshit is this anyway ?

6 AK-47%  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 12:41:15pm

STFU, WT. Obama is the very personification of the American dream: coming from humble origins and rising up on his own initiative and hard work.

Nothing could be more American, and I believe that an awful lot of people, even many of those who do not support his policies see that in him.

7 Kragar  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 12:41:41pm

So fucking what?

8 rollwave87  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 12:41:58pm

re: #3 albusteve

sired?...good grief

haha. I thought the same thing. Id accuse him of trying to insinuate that the President is some sort of animal, but I doubt someone that bigoted could get to the top of a major American newspaper. although...

9 Mostly sane, most of the time.  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 12:42:05pm

re: #3 albusteve

sired?...good grief

How about begat?

10 Dynomite  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 12:42:46pm

And that, my friends, is the Hard Right in a nutshell.

11 MandyManners  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 12:42:53pm

re: #5 Ojoe

What kind of racial purity bullshit is this anyway ?

Yeah, that leapt right out at me, too.

12 Mostly sane, most of the time.  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 12:43:22pm

Yeah, and you can't trust the son of an immigrant anyway. Kick that Benjamin Franklin back to England right now!

13 Guanxi88  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 12:43:32pm

Sired - one usually encounters that word in connection with horses, not people.

14 Charles Johnson  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 12:43:58pm

Now you know how Robert Stacy McCain got a job at the Washington Times.

15 Ojoe  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 12:44:03pm

re: #2 rollwave87

just leave race out of it.

As well.

Here is what we paid to leave it behind.

Let's not go back.

(that's Gettysburg)

16 Irenicum  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 12:44:50pm

Pardon my French, but what the fuck is the matter with these people?! Blood instinct?!?!

17 _RememberTonyC  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 12:45:25pm

Shakira is from the Third World and I am VERY attracted to her.

[Link: www.maxim.com...]

You got a problem with that Wash Times?

18 albusteve  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 12:45:38pm

well I'm not even Japanese and I saw nothing special about MacArthur...his reputation was greater tan his deeds

19 Guanxi88  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 12:45:40pm

re: #16 Irenicum

Pardon my French, but what the fuck is the matter with these people?! Blood instinct?!?!

Land and Blood - the eternal cry of nationalism.

20 MandyManners  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 12:46:14pm

re: #17 _RememberTonyC

Shakira is from the Third World and I am VERY attracted to her.

[Link: www.maxim.com...]

You got a problem with that Wash Times?

Nice tummy.

21 Guanxi88  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 12:47:01pm

re: #20 MandyManners

Nice tummy.

The rest of her ain't too shabby, either.

22 AK-47%  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 12:47:04pm

Blut und Boden!

23 lawhawk  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 12:47:24pm

Blood instinct? Well, it looks like Pruden's blood instinct is to be a bloody racist. Nice.

I hope that whatever problems are facing the Washington Times come to a just conclusion; this paper deserves to be put out to pasture for this as its content is little more than manure.

24 Irenicum  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 12:47:33pm

re: #19 Guanxi88

And fascism par excremence

25 Guanxi88  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 12:47:44pm

re: #22 ralphieboy

Blut und Boden!

re: #19 Guanxi88

Land and Blood - the eternal cry of nationalism.

GMTA

26 HappyWarrior  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 12:48:15pm

This is why the Washington Times is the minority newspaper here in the DC area. Who cares that his mother may have been attracted to guys from the third world. It doesn't make Obama any less American that his father was from Kenya or that his stepfather was Indonesian. Very lame to go after Obama's mother like this by the author.

27 albusteve  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 12:48:17pm

re: #17 _RememberTonyC

Shakira is from the Third World and I am VERY attracted to her.

[Link: www.maxim.com...]

You got a problem with that Wash Times?

depends on who sired you, I guess...woof!

28 SixDegrees  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 12:48:17pm

re: #5 Ojoe

What kind of racial purity bullshit is this anyway ?

I'm pretty certain it's the kind of bullshit that involves invocations of racial purity, or the lack of it.

29 Sharmuta  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 12:48:36pm
This kind of stuff is becoming more and more open in “conservative” media.

Thank you for putting "conservative" in quotes, Charles. For those of us who know that conservatism isn't about religion and/or race- it means a lot to us.

30 SanFranciscoZionist  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 12:49:04pm

Briefly:

1. So he gets no 'blood impulse' from the hundreds of years of Kansan farmers he's descended from?

2. Yes, I suspect Obama's mother tended to like interesting exotic men from far-away places. She married two of them. BFD. This isn't illegal, or immoral, or even mildly inappropriate. It's also irrelevent. She's not the president.

3. This is a nation of immigrants. Get used to it. Everyone else has.

4. Hawaii is a lovely place, but it's been part of the United States since my mother was born. And my husband grew up there. It's a pretty ordinary place to live, in real life.

5. What racist crap!

31 Irenicum  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 12:49:33pm

Well at least we now have our first official fascist newspaper, courtesy of the crazy cult leader Moon. That's the Washington Times in a nut shell, emphasis on the nut.

32 webevintage  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 12:49:36pm

I...but...ummm wow...seriously?...
I got nothin'.

33 SanFranciscoZionist  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 12:49:39pm

re: #10 Dynomite

And that, my friends, is the Hard Right in a nutshell.

Not so much hard, as squishy in the brain.

34 SixDegrees  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 12:49:55pm

re: #29 Sharmuta

Thank you for putting "conservative" in quotes, Charles. For those of us who know that conservatism isn't about religion and/or race- it means a lot to us.

I'll second that. Thanks.

35 Ojoe  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 12:50:05pm

re: #28 SixDegrees

It smacks of the 1930s in a certain northern european country if you ask me.

36 _RememberTonyC  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 12:50:18pm

re: #27 albusteve

depends on who sired you, I guess...woof!

well, parts of me have been compared to Secretariat

37 Liberally Conservative  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 12:50:28pm

1910 called, they want their editorial back.

38 albusteve  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 12:50:43pm

re: #30 SanFranciscoZionist

Briefly:

1. So he gets no 'blood impulse' from the hundreds of years of Kansan farmers he's descended from?

2. Yes, I suspect Obama's mother tended to like interesting exotic men from far-away places. She married two of them. BFD. This isn't illegal, or immoral, or even mildly inappropriate. It's also irrelevent. She's not the president.

3. This is a nation of immigrants. Get used to it. Everyone else has.

4. Hawaii is a lovely place, but it's been part of the United States since my mother was born. And my husband grew up there. It's a pretty ordinary place to live, in real life.

5. What racist crap!

hundreds of years of Kansas farmers?...maybe 150 at most

39 Obdicut  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 12:50:46pm

This reads like an Onion article.

40 Guanxi88  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 12:50:50pm

re: #29 Sharmuta

Thank you for putting "conservative" in quotes, Charles. For those of us who know that conservatism isn't about religion and/or race- it means a lot to us.

I apprecaite it, too, but it won't make any difference. We're smeared with this filth all the same.

41 SanFranciscoZionist  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 12:51:08pm

re: #14 Charles

Now you know how Robert Stacy McCain got a job at the Washington Times.

So far he's shown great restraint. He hasn't yet referred to the President as a 'fine young buck'.

///feh

42 _RememberTonyC  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 12:51:11pm

re: #20 MandyManners

Nice tummy.

and she can sing

43 DaddyG  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 12:51:16pm

re: #35 Ojoe

It smacks of the 1930s in a certain northern european country if you ask me.

Next weeks article is about analyzing the bumps on Obamas head to determine his foreign policy IQ. /

44 MandyManners  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 12:51:19pm

Would it be safe to say that Moon is a racist?

45 The Sanity Inspector  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 12:51:28pm

re: #3 albusteve

sired?...good grief

And they probably blue-penciled "whelped".

46 Sharmuta  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 12:51:32pm

re: #12 EmmmieG

Yeah, and you can't trust the son of an immigrant anyway. Kick that Benjamin Franklin back to England right now!

That Washington guy wasn't even born American!

47 _RememberTonyC  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 12:51:55pm

re: #21 Guanxi88

The rest of her ain't too shabby, either.


photo #3 of 12 in that link proves your point.

48 albusteve  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 12:51:56pm

re: #36 _RememberTonyC

well, parts of me have been compared to Secretariat

you wear horseshoes?

49 The Sanity Inspector  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 12:52:50pm

re: #6 ralphieboy

STFU, WT. Obama is the very personification of the American dream: coming from humble origins and rising up on his own initiative and hard work.

Nothing could be more American, and I believe that an awful lot of people, even many of those who do not support his policies see that in him.

Concur. Politics aside, his rise to the Presidency is a modern success story straight out of Central Casting.

50 MandyManners  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 12:52:52pm

re: #36 _RememberTonyC

well, parts of me have been compared to Secretariat

I ain't touching that one.

51 MandyManners  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 12:53:31pm

re: #42 _RememberTonyC

and she can sing

Who needs to sing with a tummy like that?

52 webevintage  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 12:53:38pm

re: #41 SanFranciscoZionist

So far he's shown great restraint. He hasn't yet referred to the President as a 'fine young buck'.

///feh

Has he used the words uppity or ungrateful yet?

53 Guanxi88  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 12:53:52pm

re: #49 The Sanity Inspector

Concur. Politics aside, his rise to the Presidency is a modern success story straight out of Central Casting.


"Central Casting" is dead-on right.

54 Irenicum  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 12:53:52pm

re: #44 MandyManners

Absolutely. A long a disgusting history.

55 Obdicut  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 12:54:09pm

re: #44 MandyManners

Would it be safe to say that Moon is a racist?

I think Moon thinks that everyone who isn't Moon is inferior to Moon.

56 _RememberTonyC  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 12:54:20pm

re: #48 albusteve

you wear horseshoes?

LOL ... i toss em occasionally ...

57 SanFranciscoZionist  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 12:54:31pm

re: #38 albusteve

hundreds of years of Kansas farmers?...maybe 150 at most

OK, more than a hundred years of Kansas farmers! ;)

58 SanFranciscoZionist  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 12:54:54pm

re: #39 Obdicut

This reads like an Onion article.

It does, doesn't it?

59 Irenicum  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 12:54:57pm

re: #50 MandyManners

And I'm sure he's deeply disappointed about that!

60 Guanxi88  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 12:54:59pm

re: #51 MandyManners

Who needs to sing with a tummy like that?

She sings? Who knew?

61 _RememberTonyC  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 12:55:01pm

re: #50 MandyManners

I ain't touching that one.

:)

62 albusteve  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 12:55:03pm

re: #49 The Sanity Inspector

Concur. Politics aside, his rise to the Presidency is a modern success story straight out of Central Casting.

MSM Studios has the rights to the movie I believe

63 MrSilverDragon  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 12:55:31pm
Obama's Mother Was 'Attracted to Men of the Third World'

So? I'm attracted to illusions of the 5th dimension. What's the big deal?

Ooooh, something shiny.

64 Obdicut  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 12:55:36pm

re: #58 SanFranciscoZionist

It does, doesn't it?

One of those "From the Desk of Herman T. Zwiebel" rants.

65 MandyManners  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 12:55:55pm

Gotta' git.

66 SanFranciscoZionist  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 12:56:05pm

re: #46 Sharmuta

That Washington guy wasn't even born American!

Fun fact: Martin Van Buren was the first president to be born a U.S. citizen.

67 albusteve  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 12:56:47pm

re: #60 Guanxi88

She sings? Who knew?

pretty forgettable...she's no Susan Tedeschi

68 Mostly sane, most of the time.  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 12:56:50pm

Gotta go, got kids showing up here soon, but there is one thing bothering me.

Leaving aside the blatant racism of the piece, I've always thought we needed another word for men who create a pregnancy and then fail to do anything for their offspring.

I know so many men who give everything they have for their children, both biological and adopted. They provide, protect, love, and occasionally provide the critical nose-to-nose talk that children sometimes need. (And, of course, the Monster-in-the-middle, Tickle-monster, Daddy-gonna-get-you game that psychologists have actually proven plays an important role for kids.)

To use the same name for them and for men who abandon their children is an insult. We need another word. Not sire; that belongs to animals.

69 Guanxi88  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 12:56:54pm

re: #62 albusteve

MSM Studios has the rights to the movie I believe

It's being filmed right now, with production expected through at least the end of 2012, with a possible renewal and sequel deal in the works.

70 DaddyG  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 12:57:43pm

re: #57 SanFranciscoZionist

OK, more than a hundred years of Kansas farmers! ;)


Oh, the farmer and the cowman should be friends.
Oh, the farmer and the cowman should be friends.
One man likes to push a plough,
The other likes to chase a cow,
But that's no reason why they cain't be friends.

71 SanFranciscoZionist  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 12:57:46pm

re: #66 SanFranciscoZionist

Fun fact: Martin Van Buren was the first president to be born a U.S. citizen.

He was also the first president not of English descent. A ground-breaker was Mr. Van Buren.

72 albusteve  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 12:58:10pm

there is
a house
in New Olrleans

73 HappyWarrior  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 12:58:18pm

re: #66 SanFranciscoZionist

Fun fact: Martin Van Buren was the first president to be born a U.S. citizen.

Probably one of the only presidents who grew up speaking a language other than English too. That Dutch speaking pot smoking hippie.

74 _RememberTonyC  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 12:58:34pm

re: #60 Guanxi88

She sings? Who knew?


yup ...

Youtube Video
75 AK-47%  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 12:58:40pm

re: #49 The Sanity Inspector

Concur. Politics aside, his rise to the Presidency is a modern success story straight out of Central Casting.


i.e., if you have a problem with Obama, you have a problem with the American Dream.

76 Guanxi88  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 12:58:42pm

re: #73 HappyWarrior

Probably one of the only presidents who grew up speaking a language other than English too. That Dutch speaking pot smoking hippie.

Downhill ever since.

77 DaddyG  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 12:58:52pm

re: #68 EmmmieG

I've always thought we needed another word for men who create a pregnancy and then fail to do anything for their offspring.

Sperm Donor.

78 Sharmuta  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 12:58:52pm

re: #68 EmmmieG

Gotta go, got kids showing up here soon, but there is one thing bothering me.

Leaving aside the blatant racism of the piece, I've always thought we needed another word for men who create a pregnancy and then fail to do anything for their offspring.

I know so many men who give everything they have for their children, both biological and adopted. They provide, protect, love, and occasionally provide the critical nose-to-nose talk that children sometimes need. (And, of course, the Monster-in-the-middle, Tickle-monster, Daddy-gonna-get-you game that psychologists have actually proven plays an important role for kids.)

To use the same name for them and for men who abandon their children is an insult. We need another word. Not sire; that belongs to animals.

Is "sperm bank" too harsh for these men?

79 Dancing along the light of day  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 12:59:07pm

YUCK! I wonder what kind of DS we'd be seeing, if Hillary had won?

80 Sharmuta  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 12:59:12pm

re: #77 DaddyG

GMTA!

81 Sharmuta  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 12:59:27pm

re: #79 Floral Giraffe

YUCK! I wonder what kind of DS we'd be seeing, if Hillary had won?

Lots and lots of misogyny.

82 Guanxi88  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 12:59:57pm

re: #74 _RememberTonyC

yup ...

Funny thing is, she's so very distracting that it's easy, and even pleasant, to miss the singing.

83 Irenicum  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 1:00:15pm

re: #63 MrSilverDragon

Fifth Element? That's what I'm attracted to!

84 webevintage  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 1:00:45pm

re: #68 EmmmieG

To use the same name for them and for men who abandon their children is an insult. We need another word. Not sire; that belongs to animals.


Douchebag?

85 albusteve  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 1:00:59pm

re: #75 ralphieboy

i.e., if you have a problem with Obama, you have a problem with the American Dream.

gimme a break...that's just ridiculous, nice sounding cliche tho

86 Obdicut  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 1:01:01pm

re: #78 Sharmuta

Is "sperm bank" too harsh for these men?

Unfair to sperm banks, which serve a useful purpose.

I'd call such men "Failures".

Hm.

Faildads?

87 _RememberTonyC  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 1:01:43pm

re: #82 Guanxi88

Funny thing is, she's so very distracting that it's easy, and even pleasant, to miss the singing.

yes ... but that's entertainment!

88 Guanxi88  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 1:01:48pm

re: #86 Obdicut

Unfair to sperm banks, which serve a useful purpose.

I'd call such men "Failures".

Hm.

Faildads?

"duddies?"

89 albusteve  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 1:02:17pm

re: #88 Guanxi88

"duddies?"

shoot and scoot

90 _RememberTonyC  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 1:02:27pm

re: #88 Guanxi88

"duddies?"


Dildads?

91 The Sanity Inspector  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 1:02:36pm

re: #32 webevintage

I...but...ummm wow...seriously?...
I got nothin'.

When real life starts becoming unsatirizable, time to dive for the long grass.

92 ArchangelMichael  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 1:02:36pm

re: #79 Floral Giraffe

YUCK! I wonder what kind of DS we'd be seeing, if Hillary had won?

Type "Hitlery" or "Shillary" in Google... HDS already exists. It would just return an order of magnitude more hits on Google if she won.

93 Guanxi88  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 1:02:38pm

re: #89 albusteve

shoot and scoot

rabbit-men, as I've heard them called.

94 albusteve  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 1:02:52pm

re: #87 _RememberTonyC

yes ... but that's entertainment!

if she sang naked, I'd listen to her

95 tokyobk  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 1:02:55pm

Isn't the Wash Times owned by a Fore-einer?


/

96 DaddyG  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 1:02:56pm

Basters.

97 Guanxi88  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 1:03:42pm

re: #94 albusteve

if she sang naked, I'd listen to her

I wouldn't hear a word she said if she had the entire sound-system for the last Ozz-fest hooked up to ear-buds. Too distracting.

98 _RememberTonyC  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 1:03:51pm

re: #94 albusteve

if she sang naked, I'd listen to her

alrighty then ... in parts of that video, she's close

99 Sharmuta  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 1:04:09pm

re: #95 tokyobk

Isn't the Wash Times owned by a Fore-einer?

/

Yes, but they're all about theocracies, and nativists don't bother them, so it all works out ok in the end.

100 albusteve  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 1:04:32pm

re: #98 _RememberTonyC

alrighty then ... in parts of that video, she's close

well, close counts in horseshoes eh?

101 DaddyG  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 1:04:33pm

Shakira has a healthy spine. Nuff said.

102 AK-47%  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 1:05:06pm

re: #85 albusteve

gimme a break...that's just ridiculous, nice sounding cliche tho

So now when those ghetto kids complain about not having a chance in "White man's America" we can really tell them to shut the f*ck up and knuckle down, it *is* possible.

Shouldn't the Right Wing be pleased with that?

103 The Sanity Inspector  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 1:05:29pm

re: #52 webevintage

Has he used the words uppity or ungrateful yet?

We've already had a brush with this, last year.

104 albusteve  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 1:05:41pm

re: #101 DaddyG

Shakira has a healthy spine. Nuff said.

you're a radiologist!...cool!

105 _RememberTonyC  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 1:06:09pm

re: #100 albusteve

well, close counts in horseshoes eh?

and hand grenades ...

106 ArchangelMichael  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 1:06:10pm

re: #95 tokyobk

Isn't the Wash Times owned by a Fore-einer?

/

The RSM clique at WT told the Moonies: "When my people come to rule your world, your names will be on the protected rolls, and you will come to no harm."

/

107 albusteve  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 1:07:02pm

re: #105 _RememberTonyC

and hand grenades ...

well she's da bomb alright

108 avanti  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 1:07:09pm

Wow, my father came from Greece, my mother was Serbian, so I guess I'm not a "real" American either./

109 DaddyG  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 1:07:27pm

re: #104 albusteve

you're a radiologist!...cool!

No- just a middle aged man who sees what his kids watch on the music video channel and thinks to himself. "Dang if I tried that move my backbone would fly out my rear!"

Now you may say why would a man be thinking about that while watching a nubile young pop singer gyrate?

Did I mention I was middle aged?

110 _RememberTonyC  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 1:07:41pm

re: #107 albusteve

well she's da bomb alright

you're "en fuego" today

111 AK-47%  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 1:07:59pm

re: #108 avanti

Wow, my father came from Greece, my mother was Serbian, so I guess I'm not a "real" American either./

...yes, but they're still white. You have the "blood instinct" that Obama seems to lack

/

112 The Sanity Inspector  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 1:09:17pm

re: #75 ralphieboy

i.e., if you have a problem with Obama, you have a problem with the American Dream.

Well, no. I've got plenty of problems with Obama. But I accept him as an American, and not some kind of Manchurian pod person. I'd no more try to de-legitimize him than I would any other President I didn't vote for.

113 DaddyG  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 1:09:34pm

I am a real American descended from Plymouth and the battlefields of Lexington and Concord. My blood instinct tells me this reported needs his ass kicked hard enough to dislodge his cranium from his colon.

114 tokyobk  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 1:09:41pm

Its so sad if they are trying to claim being a mutt is Un-american since Americans are, even from the time Toqueville described us, is by definition mixed.

Even among whites, it took a few years before Scotts and Irish and Welsh did not seem like mixture, but that was still mixture as certainly Spanish and French was.
Then later Italian and Jewish and eastern European became "white," but those at first seemed unassimilable to some.

In short. F the Washington Times.

115 albusteve  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 1:09:50pm

re: #109 DaddyG

No- just a middle aged man who sees what his kids watch on the music video channel and thinks to himself. "Dang if I tried that move my backbone would fly out my rear!"

Now you may say why would a man be thinking about that while watching a nubile young pop singer gyrate?

Did I mention I was middle aged?

I didn't see her gyrate, I was in church, where you should be

116 DaddyG  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 1:10:59pm

re: #115 albusteve

I didn't see her gyrate, I was in church, where you should be


Sorry Bishop, I'll get up in time for services next Sunday.

117 doubter4444  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 1:11:21pm

re: #3 albusteve

sired?...good grief

I know, crazy.
"Sired" is very much a racist comment, and absolutely demeaning.
It's a slave-owners way of talking, siring new stock.
It's disgusting and vile.
That it is printed is appalling, and there can be no doubt of his intention or meaning.
Watch for the spiners to say it's "just an expression", or some other bullshit.

118 [deleted]  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 1:11:27pm
119 HappyWarrior  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 1:11:54pm

What I wonder is how Moon gained credibility in the first place. My dad has told me that in the 70's when Moon first arrived here in the US that Moon really got a lot of people upset by saying that we as Americans were lacking faith.

120 albusteve  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 1:11:56pm

re: #108 avanti

Wow, my father came from Greece, my mother was Serbian, so I guess I'm not a "real" American either./

considering your sire and dame, I'd say you were a mutt of some sort, therefore you qualify

121 brookly red  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 1:12:15pm

re: #118 MikeySDCA

Excuse me, but this "blood instinct" stuff has a slight sound Goebbels.

yah think?

122 albusteve  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 1:13:00pm

re: #116 DaddyG

Sorry Bishop, I'll get up in time for services next Sunday.

it could be worse...like Pawn

123 AK-47%  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 1:13:42pm

re: #112 The Sanity Inspector

Well, no. I've got plenty of problems with Obama. But I accept him as an American, and not some kind of Manchurian pod person. I'd no more try to de-legitimize him than I would any other President I didn't vote for.


I mean in this Washington Post "blood instinct" sense. You may criticize and dislike his policies and his administration all you like. Just keep it civil.

124 albusteve  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 1:13:49pm

re: #117 doubter4444

I know, crazy.
"Sired" is very much a racist comment, and absolutely demeaning.
It's a slave-owners way of talking, siring new stock.
It's disgusting and vile.
That it is printed is appalling, and there can be no doubt of his intention or meaning.
Watch for the spiners to say it's "just an expression", or some other bullshit.

sarcasm...get hep and move along

125 brookly red  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 1:14:02pm

re: #119 HappyWarrior

What I wonder is how Moon gained credibility in the first place. My dad has told me that in the 70's when Moon first arrived here in the US that Moon really got a lot of people upset by saying that we as Americans were lacking faith.

yeah but I love their salad bars...

126 doubter4444  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 1:14:29pm

re: #23 lawhawk

Blood instinct? Well, it looks like Pruden's blood instinct is to be a bloody racist. Nice.

I hope that whatever problems are facing the Washington Times come to a just conclusion; this paper deserves to be put out to pasture for this as its content is little more than manure.

Very true.
Why can't a Conservative newspaper be straight up and honest?
News, with a Conservative opinion?
I miss the old WJS. And I've always despised the WT.

127 avanti  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 1:14:53pm

re: #111 ralphieboy

...yes, but they're still white. You have the "blood instinct" that Obama seems to lack

/

Oh, thanks for clearing that up. I guess the Moonie's accept white and yellow, but brown and black still don't have the right blood.

128 albusteve  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 1:15:04pm

re: #125 brookly red

yeah but I love their salad bars...

big money behind those guys...Moonies Inc.

129 DaddyG  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 1:15:06pm

re: #119 HappyWarrior

...when Moon first arrived here in the US that Moon really got a lot of people upset by saying that we as Americans were lacking faith.

...and then he proceeded to prove their scepticism correct.

130 DaddyG  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 1:16:01pm

re: #127 avanti

Oh, thanks for clearing that up. I guess the Moonie's accept white and yellow, but brown and black still don't have the right blood.


At their core I doubt they even think much of white.

131 Sharmuta  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 1:16:36pm

I said earlier on the Huntsman thread that politics isn't a blood sport.

I guess the Washington Times thinks politics is all about the blood. Blood and soil politics belongs in Europe (and elsewhere, I suppose) but has no place in this country. It's shameful that any major news outlet would promote such un-American thinking while trying to wrap themselves in the flag. Disgusting.

132 tokyobk  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 1:17:15pm

re: #131 Sharmuta

Yes. Shameful. Really. The exact right word.

133 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 1:17:45pm

hah! The dude has got has some nerve tossing that language around with their creepazoid Moonies at the helm of their ship.

Forced Mass Marriage! I've been following the implosion of the Washington Times on TPM. It is quality entertainment in these troubled times.

134 Ojoe  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 1:17:51pm

re: #118 MikeySDCA

Excuse me, but this "blood instinct" stuff has a slight sound Goebbels.

More than a little.

It is quite chilling if you ask me.

135 avanti  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 1:18:41pm

Salon comments on the

issue.

136 Bob Dillon  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 1:18:48pm

re: #18 albusteve

well I'm not even Japanese and I saw nothing special about MacArthur...his reputation was greater tan his deeds

Really? I respectfully disagree.

[Link: en.wikipedia.org...]

137 brookly red  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 1:18:54pm

re: #128 albusteve

big money behind those guys...Moonies Inc.

I don't hold that against them they earned it by producing a quality product (& hey it's salad not crack)... some of the other things not so much. I went to school years back with a Korean girl who had one of the arranged marragies...

138 webevintage  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 1:19:07pm

WTH? does "blood instinct" even mean?

So being born in the US and raised in the US is not enough to make one love our country if one has a parent who is from another country?
Does that count if Dad is a Canadian?

Does this moron also believe that "humors" in the blood and a balance of them helps maintain a healthy body? Maybe a bit of bloodletting for H1N1?

139 albusteve  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 1:19:10pm

re: #131 Sharmuta

I said earlier on the Huntsman thread that politics isn't a blood sport.

I guess the Washington Times thinks politics is all about the blood. Blood and soil politics belongs in Europe (and elsewhere, I suppose) but has no place in this country. It's shameful that any major news outlet would promote such un-American thinking while trying to wrap themselves in the flag. Disgusting.

it's a least a 16th century thing...purity of Spanish blood played a huge role in carving up the New World...and remnants of this racism/bigotry is alive to this very day in Espanola, New Mexico, for example

140 Sharmuta  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 1:19:57pm

re: #118 MikeySDCA

Excuse me, but this "blood instinct" stuff has a slight sound Goebbels.

It's exactly how fascists talk. Look at the euro-fascists and their talking points for clues. And remember that the vlaams belang has been sending their people over to the US to rub elbows with their American counterparts for years. Those who didn't pay attention to the VB issue here at LGF really missed the larger picture.

141 SanFranciscoZionist  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 1:20:00pm

re: #111 ralphieboy

...yes, but they're still white. You have the "blood instinct" that Obama seems to lack

/

Is there an online quiz you can take to find out if you have 'blood instinct' or not?

142 SanFranciscoZionist  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 1:20:40pm

re: #113 DaddyG

I am a real American descended from Plymouth and the battlefields of Lexington and Concord. My blood instinct tells me this reported needs his ass kicked hard enough to dislodge his cranium from his colon.


I trust your blood instinct!

143 Sharmuta  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 1:20:59pm

re: #138 webevintage

WTH? does "blood instinct" even mean?

It's fascist code speak.

144 Semper Fi  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 1:21:09pm

re: #114 tokyobk

Its so sad if they are trying to claim being a mutt is Un-american since Americans are, even from the time Toqueville described us, is by definition mixed.

I'm with ya'. That's us:

United Mutts of America and damn proud of it.

145 Ojoe  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 1:21:13pm

re: #138 webevintage

WTH? does "blood instinct" even mean?

It means "I'm superior and you are an unter being."

146 DaddyG  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 1:21:36pm

This really does sound like some artifact of a bygone era. The fact that this article was published in the 21st century is really frightening. The fact that it isn't getting pilloried in the public eye speaks to our collective ignorance of history. Frightening.

147 HappyWarrior  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 1:22:18pm

I have a feeling that if Obama were raised say in the middle of Kansas and not Hawaii that writers like this one would find something else to nitpick at. They rant and rail against "elitism" yet practice their own counter-elitism.

148 Sharmuta  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 1:22:55pm

re: #146 DaddyG

Fascism is making a comeback, unfortunately.

149 tokyobk  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 1:23:05pm

Actually I think I remember reading that Obama is a distant cousin of Truman and I think Cheney, by blood.

And the slaves that built the capital were perhaps those -owned- by his family since his ancestors were the largest slave owners in Anne Arundel County.

So Obama probably beats the writer in terms of the silly blood feud which does not matter anyway.

150 _RememberTonyC  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 1:23:57pm

re: #143 Sharmuta

It's fascist code speak.

and it's a bad movie too ... [Link: vids.myspace.com...]

151 albusteve  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 1:24:46pm

re: #136 Bobibutu

Really? I respectfully disagree.

[Link: en.wikipedia.org...]

his claim to fame is Dictator of post war Japan and he did a super job...any other achievements are blown out of proportion or flat out contrived...there is a legitimate argument that he lengthened the war in the pacific with his blustery insistence on liberating the Philippines...Korea was a set piece fight that any private could have figured out

152 DaddyG  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 1:25:10pm

I have some Pruden (Prudden) ancestry. After reading this artcle I'm beginning to wonder if I'm not from inferior stock.

153 albusteve  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 1:25:38pm

re: #137 brookly red

I don't hold that against them they earned it by producing a quality product (& hey it's salad not crack)... some of the other things not so much. I went to school years back with a Korean girl who had one of the arranged marragies...

I have no beef at all with them...they add spice to the American experience

154 tokyobk  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 1:26:28pm

Dumbasses

BOSTON - This could make for one odd family reunion: Barack Obama is a distant cousin of actor Brad Pitt, and Hillary Rodham Clinton is related to Pitt's girlfriend, Angelina Jolie...

Obama, the son of a white woman from Kansas and a black man from Kenya, can call six U.S. presidents, including George W. Bush, his cousins...

Obama has a prolific presidential lineage that features Democrats and Republicans. His distant cousins include President George W. Bush and his father, George H.W. Bush, Gerald Ford, Lyndon Johnson, Harry S. Truman and James Madison. Other Obama cousins include Vice President Dick Cheney, British Prime Minister Sir Winston Churchill and Civil War General Robert E. Lee.

Obama and President Bush are 10th cousins, once removed, linked by Samuel Hinkley of Cape Cod, who died in 1662.

Pitt and Obama are ninth cousins, linked by Edwin Hickman, who died in Virginia in 1769.

Your text to link...

155 Ojoe  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 1:27:24pm

re: #138 webevintage

"What we must fight for is to safeguard the existence and reproduction of our race and our people, the sustenance of our children and the purity of our blood,"

That's from Mein Kampf, chapter 8.

These are terribly dangerous times now.

156 wrenchwench  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 1:27:34pm

re: #133 WindUpBird

hah! The dude has got has some nerve tossing that language around with their creepazoid Moonies at the helm of their ship.

Forced Mass Marriage! I've been following the implosion of the Washington Times on TPM. It is quality entertainment in these troubled times.

So now the rats [Richard Miniter] get lawyers as they jump from the sinking ship, and try to sue the ship. Heh.

157 doubter4444  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 1:27:48pm

re: #124 albusteve

sarcasm...get hep and move along

I think you are right.
That'll be the call... "Hey he was being sarcastic!"
"Why is everyone to touchy?"

Weird that just as they were getting some traction on the "every complaint about Obama is racist" argument, someone on the far right does this.
As Charles mentioned, it's becoming more and more blatant.
And this kind of thing gives more air cover for the left to use it as an excuse.

Worst of all though is that this is the real thing, in print: bigotry in a major newspaper, not from some wank blogger, but the "Editor Emeritus" for crying out loud.
This is really reveling. And it ain't pretty.

158 albusteve  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 1:28:23pm

re: #155 Ojoe

That's from Mein Kampf, chapter 8.

These are terribly dangerous times now.

we need another Jesse Owens

159 webevintage  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 1:29:45pm

Of course crazy stuff like "blood instinct" makes one thing of how important it is to protect ones sacred bodily fluids.

160 Sharmuta  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 1:30:07pm

This is the sort of thing that reignites my anger at people like Jonah Goldberg for the historical revisionism of fascism as some sort of left wing ideology. Now we don't even know what fascism is when it's staring us in the face.

161 Ojoe  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 1:30:17pm

re: #158 albusteve

Yes, and

Paul Robeson, Frederick Douglass, Martin Luther King, Abraham Lincoln ...

and many more.

162 CommonCents  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 1:30:18pm

re: #155 Ojoe

That's from Mein Kampf, chapter 8.

These are terribly dangerous times now.

I wouldn't say these are terribly dangerous times as it appears that EVERYONE here is in agreement that the guy is a moron. It would be different if there were some debate that his article isn't a racist piece that will soon line the cages for bird droppings.

163 albusteve  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 1:31:02pm

my problem with BO is boots on the ground...how he plays the game, the rest I don't care about...maybe I'm only one guy but this sort of stuff really turns me off to the right, and there must be others that feel the same way...he's a man, not a dog

164 DaddyG  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 1:31:05pm

...and what is this nonsense about American Presidents not bowing? Our flag does not bow to foreign leaders but the President is a citizen and as such is right to show respect to foreign dignitaries as they show it to us.

It may be uncomfortable seeing him bow to a Saudi prince but I'd rather he saved the arguments for civil rights and religious freedom and not get into a peeing contest over minor protocal.

165 duck of peace  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 1:31:24pm

Wow, this guy should just get it over with and call Obama a Mudblood. Whats next? "Obama was in Hufflepuff at Hogswarts!"

166 Ojoe  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 1:31:26pm

re: #162 CommonCents

hitl** was a moron too.

BBL

167 Guanxi88  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 1:31:35pm

re: #148 Sharmuta

Fascism is making a comeback, unfortunately.

Meh, I'm not that concernedre: #153 albusteve

I have no beef (bulgoki) at all with them...they add spice (kimchee) to the American experience

168 albusteve  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 1:31:49pm

re: #160 Sharmuta

This is the sort of thing that reignites my anger at people like Jonah Goldberg for the historical revisionism of fascism as some sort of left wing ideology. Now we don't even know what fascism is when it's staring us in the face.

reverse doubleblab

169 Sharmuta  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 1:32:15pm

re: #154 tokyobk

IIRC, both Bob Dole and Bubba Clinton we both related to Princess Diana.

170 Sharmuta  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 1:32:41pm

re: #165 duck of peace

Wow, this guy should just get it over with and call Obama a Mudblood. Whats next? "Obama was in Hufflepuff at Hogswarts!"

Slitherin. ;D

171 avanti  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 1:33:21pm

Here's a interesting picture of Wesley Pruten

confederate.org.

172 albusteve  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 1:33:43pm

re: #169 Sharmuta

IIRC, both Bob Dole and Bubba Clinton we both related to Princess Diana.

I'm related to Daniel Boone!
(not really, but I can wish)

173 Sharmuta  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 1:34:48pm

re: #167 Guanxi88

Meh, I'm not that concerned

I don't think they'll ever achieve political power in this country, but that doesn't mean I'm not concerned about their influence.

174 Sharmuta  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 1:35:52pm

re: #172 albusteve

I'm related to Daniel Boone!
(not really, but I can wish)

I'm distantly related to the Grimaldis.

175 DaddyG  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 1:36:49pm

Many people would be surprised at their ancestry. If your family was in the US prior to 1850 there is a better than even chance you have revolutionary ancestry (on either side).

Once you go there you are probably descended from English gentry and they are related to everyone - even their own cousins. Which explains a lot about the Royals... but I digress.

176 Guanxi88  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 1:37:16pm

re: #173 Sharmuta

I don't think they'll ever achieve political power in this country, but that doesn't mean I'm not concerned about their influence.

As others have noted, the shadow of fascism and totalitarianism always haunt this land, but have only possessed Europeans, present European Lizards excluded, of course.

177 sattv4u2  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 1:38:47pm

re: #175 DaddyG

Many people would be surprised at their ancestry. If your family was in the US prior to 1850 there is a better than even chance you have revolutionary ancestry (on either side).

Once you go there you are probably descended from English gentry and they are related to everyone - even their own cousins. Which explains a lot about the Royals... but I digress.

What the hell does the Kansas City pro baseball team have to do with this ??!?!?!
/

178 CommonCents  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 1:38:57pm

re: #166 Ojoe

hitl** was a moron too.

BBL

But people listened and agreed. That's the difference. Not the messenger but the folks on the other end.

179 ArchangelMichael  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 1:39:10pm

re: #143 Sharmuta

It's fascist code speak.

It sounds like the title of a really bad Steven Seagal or Jean Claude Van Damme flick from the late 80s/early 90s.

180 Cannadian Club Akbar  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 1:39:35pm

re: #177 sattv4u2

What the hell does the Kansas City pro baseball team have to do with this ??!?!?!
/

When did they become a pro team?
//

181 HappyWarrior  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 1:39:55pm

I would love to get a family tree done and see if I am related to anyone famous. All of my family came to the US though after or just before the Civil War though and my mom's side of the family immigrated in the early 1900's. I have a suspicion that on my Irish side of the family that I am related to William Joyce, Lord Haw Haw since he was born in Galway and I have the Joyce surname in my ancestry and they were from Galway but they came to the US in the 1870's. As I tell people I'd rather be related to James Joyce than that jerk(referring to William here obviously).

182 sattv4u2  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 1:40:04pm

re: #174 Sharmuta

I'm distantly related to the Grimaldis.

I'm closer to the Griswolds
[Link: www.imdb.com...]

183 Guanxi88  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 1:40:09pm

re: #179 ArchangelMichael

It sounds like the title of a really bad Steven Seagal or Jean Claude Van Damme flick from the late 80s/early 90s.

And I tire of reminding you that there are not other types of Steven Seagal or Jean Claude Van Damme films.

184 Jeff In Ohio  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 1:40:10pm

re: #119 HappyWarrior

What I wonder is how Moon gained credibility in the first place. My dad has told me that in the 70's when Moon first arrived here in the US that Moon really got a lot of people upset by saying that we as Americans were lacking faith.

Dunno, but when I worked on the front lines for MFS in the late 70's early 80's, they were at every DC protest, rushing security and spitting on people. At that time, in my estimation, they were a nod behind the LaRouche crowd and a step ahead of the WWP in crazy.

185 sattv4u2  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 1:40:27pm

re: #180 Cannadian Club Akbar

When did they become a pro team?
//

Same year the Lions became a pro football one!

186 Sharmuta  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 1:40:28pm

re: #182 sattv4u2

LOL

187 Kragar  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 1:40:33pm

re: #174 Sharmuta

I'm distantly related to the Grimaldis.

My family has a town in Italy named after it and can trace back our name to the late Roman Empire.

188 doubter4444  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 1:40:58pm

re: #163 albusteve

my problem with BO is boots on the ground...how he plays the game, the rest I don't care about...maybe I'm only one guy but this sort of stuff really turns me off to the right, and there must be others that feel the same way...he's a man, not a dog

Exactly. Talk about teachable moments:
If a senior Republican leader came out and said "we don't stand for this crap by anyone against anyone, knock it off!"
I'd be proud, I'd listen, and I'd respect him/her.

189 ArchangelMichael  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 1:41:10pm

re: #183 Guanxi88

And I tire of reminding you that there are not other types of Steven Seagal or Jean Claude Van Damme films.

Wham Bam Thank You Van Damme!

190 Guanxi88  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 1:41:14pm

re: #182 sattv4u2

I'm closer to the Griswolds
[Link: www.imdb.com...]

Apropos of the upcoming holidays, coworker asked me about what I did with my family when I was a kid.

I asked her "you ever see that show 'intervention'?"

"yeah"

Well it was like that, only we had a dead bird on the table in front of us.

191 MittDoesNotCompute  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 1:41:55pm

re: #68 EmmmieG

Gotta go, got kids showing up here soon, but there is one thing bothering me.

Leaving aside the blatant racism of the piece, I've always thought we needed another word for men who create a pregnancy and then fail to do anything for their offspring.

I know so many men who give everything they have for their children, both biological and adopted. They provide, protect, love, and occasionally provide the critical nose-to-nose talk that children sometimes need. (And, of course, the Monster-in-the-middle, Tickle-monster, Daddy-gonna-get-you game that psychologists have actually proven plays an important role for kids.)

To use the same name for them and for men who abandon their children is an insult. We need another word. Not sire; that belongs to animals.

Sperm Donor...

192 Guanxi88  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 1:42:15pm

re: #191 talon_262

Defendant.

193 sattv4u2  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 1:42:38pm

re: #188 doubter4444

Exactly. Talk about teachable moments:
If a senior Republican leader came out and said "we don't stand for this crap by anyone against anyone, knock it off!"
I'd be proud, I'd listen, and I'd respect him/her.

McCain did just that when he admonished that lady who questioned Obamas heritage

194 albusteve  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 1:43:00pm

re: #174 Sharmuta

I'm distantly related to the Grimaldis.

I knew it!...you are probably related to Vito Genovese too!

195 nanook37  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 1:43:09pm

re: #183 Guanxi88

Under Siege wasn't that bad and Bloodsport is awesome is a terrible, terrible way...

196 sattv4u2  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 1:44:17pm

re: #187 Kragar (Proud to be Kafir)

My family has a town in Italy named after it and can trace back our name to the late Roman Empire.

Big deal. Theres a prison wing in a Sicilian town named after my family, only because thats where most of them ended up ,, ummm,,, living!

197 Cannadian Club Akbar  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 1:44:34pm

re: #195 nanook37

Under Siege wasn't that bad and Bloodsport is awesome is a terrible, terrible way...

I had a red neck woman cut my hair once who asked how it was that Segal had never won an Oscar. I wish I were kidding.

198 MittDoesNotCompute  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 1:44:35pm

re: #77 DaddyG

Sperm Donor.

GMTA...

199 Jeff In Ohio  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 1:45:01pm

re: #175 DaddyG

Many people would be surprised at their ancestry. If your family was in the US prior to 1850 there is a better than even chance you have revolutionary ancestry (on either side).

Once you go there you are probably descended from English gentry and they are related to everyone - even their own cousins. Which explains a lot about the Royals... but I digress.

Well, my folks have been here since the French and Indian Wars, and we've traced my relatives back to 14th Century Scotland and I can guarantee you there's no English Gentry in my blood lines. Dirt farming Welsh and Scotts, yup, land owning gentry, nope.

And that has nothing to do with KC.

200 Sharmuta  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 1:45:13pm

re: #187 Kragar (Proud to be Kafir)

My family has a town in Italy named after it and can trace back our name to the late Roman Empire.

That's pretty cool.

201 nanook37  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 1:45:50pm

re: #188 doubter4444

All the nuts that have taken over the party would call him/her a RINO of course...

202 Sharmuta  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 1:46:03pm

re: #194 albusteve

I knew it!...you are probably related to Vito Genovese too!

Would you believe I'm distantly related to a Saint?

203 MajorTom  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 1:46:30pm

Whiskey Tango Foxtrot, over?

I agree, the GOP leadership has got to stand up and scream from the mountaintops that this is not acceptable language or train of thought. All I hear is crickets...

204 CommonCents  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 1:46:41pm

re: #188 doubter4444

re: #163 albusteve

my problem with BO is boots on the ground...how he plays the game, the rest I don't care about...maybe I'm only one guy but this sort of stuff really turns me off to the right, and there must be others that feel the same way...he's a man, not a dog

Exactly. Talk about teachable moments:
If a senior Republican leader came out and said "we don't stand for this crap by anyone against anyone, knock it off!"
I'd be proud, I'd listen, and I'd respect him/her.


I still consider myself to the right on the political spectrum because of my opinions on self-determination, limited government, and national defense. The fact that Mr. Potato Head is a racist and comes from the right doesn't make me racist and it doesn't mean there aren't racists on the left.

205 albusteve  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 1:47:13pm

re: #202 Sharmuta

Would you believe I'm distantly related to a Saint?

yes, I'll believe anything...maybe you are a saint waiting to happen

206 doubter4444  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 1:47:33pm

re: #187 Kragar (Proud to be Kafir)

My family has a town in Italy named after it and can trace back our name to the late Roman Empire.

Very cool.
My father's side of the family is from Germany where they have a winery (with our last name!) that's been family owned and in operation since 1460.
There's even a coat of arms with a grape vine in it.

207 sattv4u2  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 1:47:52pm

re: #202 Sharmuta

Would you believe I'm distantly related to a Saint?

If it's Susan SAINT James, can I have her number???

208 Sheila Broflovski  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 1:47:56pm

re: #174 Sharmuta

I'm distantly related to the Grimaldis.

My sons did a family tree and found out that they are direct descendants of Rabbi Shabse Cohen, a famous sage of the 17th century.

209 CommonCents  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 1:48:04pm

re: #203 MajorTom

Whiskey Tango Foxtrot, over?

I agree, the GOP leadership has got to stand up and scream from the mountaintops that this is not acceptable language or train of thought. All I hear is crickets...

It's a little early to call crickets. The article just came out today.

210 Sharmuta  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 1:48:58pm

re: #205 albusteve

yes, I'll believe anything...maybe you are a saint waiting to happen

LOL! Hardly, but it is true my family is distantly related to a French Saint. Don't hold that French part against me, though.

211 albusteve  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 1:49:20pm

my real name is Albusteve Miamiola

212 RogueOne  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 1:49:22pm

I'm a little confused about the arguments on this thread so let me ask this, do all the US citizens on this site understand why it is in poor form for our president to bow to royalty?

213 sattv4u2  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 1:50:04pm

SPEAKING OF GENEOLGY

Why when someone says they're reincarnated, in a past life they were always nobility or some famous hero

You never hear someone say

"Yup, last night I was hynotized and found out that back in 1548 I was Joe The Street Sweeper in charge of picking up horse shit"?

214 doubter4444  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 1:50:09pm

re: #193 sattv4u2

McCain did just that when he admonished that lady who questioned Obamas heritage

I remember, which is one of the reasons I've always respected him.
He must be pissed though, now I think that he'll forever be remembered for giving Sarah Palin a stage, what he's done and who he was will always be second.

215 Tiny Alien Kitties are Watching You  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 1:50:16pm

Ja sehr gute Sprache! Heil Hitle...

Oh wait. What?

216 albusteve  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 1:50:25pm

re: #210 Sharmuta

LOL! Hardly, but it is true my family is distantly related to a French Saint. Don't hold that French part against me, though.

Sainted Frwench are okay...those commoners are another story tho

217 Dreader1962  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 1:50:32pm

I dunno - I was reminded of this when I read it (at about 1:10 in the video). Pruden needs the same treatment.

'You's miscegenated!'

218 Guanxi88  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 1:50:32pm

re: #213 sattv4u2

SPEAKING OF GENEOLGY

Why when someone says they're reincarnated, in a past life they were always nobility or some famous hero

You never hear someone say

"Yup, last night I was hynotized and found out that back in 1548 I was Joe The Street Sweeper in charge of picking up horse shit"?

Peasants don't reincarnate, silly.

219 wrenchwench  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 1:51:01pm

re: #209 CommonCents

It's a little early to call crickets. The article just came out today.

Unfortunately, this article was not the first symptom. The crickets are getting louder to cover the sound of the whining racists. See: RSM. Not that he was necessarily first, either.

220 Cannadian Club Akbar  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 1:51:24pm

re: #213 sattv4u2

SPEAKING OF GENEOLGY

Why when someone says they're reincarnated, in a past life they were always nobility or some famous hero

You never hear someone say

"Yup, last night I was hynotized and found out that back in 1548 I was Joe The Street Sweeper in charge of picking up horse shit"?


Or Piss Boy. (History of the World, Part I)

221 HC4BO  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 1:51:40pm

and reared by grandparents in Hawaii ..

===


REARED ?? Really ?

That sounds more like him talking about Animals rather than Humans ...

222 albusteve  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 1:51:45pm

re: #212 RogueOne

I'm a little confused about the arguments on this thread so let me ask this, do all the US citizens on this site understand why it is in poor form for our president to bow to royalty?

no, not really...I think it's a personal issue...I'm way more concerned about the presidents behavior toward Iran for example

223 Kragar  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 1:51:49pm

re: #213 sattv4u2

SPEAKING OF GENEOLGY

Why when someone says they're reincarnated, in a past life they were always nobility or some famous hero

You never hear someone say

"Yup, last night I was hynotized and found out that back in 1548 I was Joe The Street Sweeper in charge of picking up horse shit"?

I was a shrubber, Roger the shrubber.

224 Sharmuta  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 1:51:56pm

re: #213 sattv4u2

SPEAKING OF GENEOLGY

Why when someone says they're reincarnated, in a past life they were always nobility or some famous hero

You never hear someone say

"Yup, last night I was hynotized and found out that back in 1548 I was Joe The Street Sweeper in charge of picking up horse shit"?

I was a lemur in a past life. Here's a picture.

225 CommonCents  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 1:52:25pm

re: #154 tokyobk

This bit is astonishing...

His distant cousins include President George W. Bush and his father, George H.W. Bush

He's related to BOTH of them!

226 Guanxi88  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 1:52:39pm

re: #223 Kragar (Proud to be Kafir)

I was a shrubber, Roger the shrubber.

I always imagined that in a previous incarnation I was an unsuccessful push-cart vendor.

227 Cannadian Club Akbar  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 1:52:46pm

re: #221 HC4BO

and reared by grandparents in Hawaii ..

===


REARED ?? Really ?

That sounds more like him talking about Animals rather than Humans ...

You rear children and raise cows.

228 wrenchwench  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 1:53:10pm

re: #212 RogueOne

I'm a little confused about the arguments on this thread so let me ask this, do all the US citizens on this site understand why it is in poor form for our president to bow to royalty?

No. Not just "why", I don't understand "that" it is. Are you making an argument for a position, or assuming that it is bad form?

229 Sharmuta  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 1:53:11pm

re: #225 CommonCents

This bit is astonishing...

His distant cousins include President George W. Bush and his father, George H.W. Bush

He's related to BOTH of them!

What are the odds?! ;)

230 Killgore Trout  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 1:54:03pm

Good News...
Conviction of disbarred lawyer Lynne Stewart upheld for smuggling messages to jailed terrorist

Disbarred radical lawyer Lynne Stewart is going to jail - maybe for a lot longer than she thought.

A federal appeals court Tuesday upheld her conviction for smuggling messages to her jailed terrorist client, and said she deserves more than the 28 months she got because she may have lied at her trial.

Stewart, 70, is to surrender to U.S. Marshals immediately.

231 Guanxi88  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 1:54:12pm

re: #224 Sharmuta

I was a lemur in a past life. Here's a picture.

And here's the picture of the lemur I hope to be in the next go-around.

232 doubter4444  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 1:55:20pm

re: #204 CommonCents

I still consider myself to the right on the political spectrum because of my opinions on self-determination, limited government, and national defense. The fact that Mr. Potato Head is a racist and comes from the right doesn't make me racist and it doesn't mean there aren't racists on the left.

That's what I mean though.
Regardless of politics this is wrong, and needs to be stood up to.
The Dem's can't do it (more than they are) as it'll just be seen as tit for tat.

Someone on the right needs to speak out and say this and the gas chamber pictures and all the rest are over the line.
That's the teachable moment.
And yes, they'll be called a RINO and reviled, which is why it won't happen, to take a stand takes guts, and they are in short supply in Washington, on both sides of the aisle.

233 avanti  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 1:56:17pm

re: #212 RogueOne

I'm a little confused about the arguments on this thread so let me ask this, do all the US citizens on this site understand why it is in poor form for our president to bow to royalty?

I'm not sure of the protocol, but I recall being bowed to in Japanese department stores, and returned a few to the factory reps from Japanese electronic companies.
I did learn not to reply with a nicer gift than one given.

234 albusteve  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 1:56:53pm

re: #230 Killgore Trout

Good News...
Conviction of disbarred lawyer Lynne Stewart upheld for smuggling messages to jailed terrorist

justice served...a good thing, bigshots are not above the law

235 ArchangelMichael  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 1:57:38pm

re: #234 albusteve

justice served...a good thing, bigshots are not above the law

Guess she wont be available as Counsel for KSM.

236 Guanxi88  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 1:57:52pm

re: #233 avanti


I did learn not to reply with a nicer gift than one given.

Goes solidly against Western culture and traditions, but we gotta comply.

237 tokyobk  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 1:58:00pm

re: #169 Sharmuta

IIRC, both Bob Dole and Bubba Clinton we both related to Princess Diana.

Yes and Clinton both to Bush and to an obscure warlord who was defeated by an obscure relative of Bush's and Clinton also to the current wife of Prince Charles.

And, all of us to all of us from Lucy in East Africa.

238 sattv4u2  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 1:59:02pm

re: #221 HC4BO

and reared by grandparents in Hawaii ..

===


REARED ?? Really ?

That sounds more like him talking about Animals rather than Humans ...


It's actually the correct usage of the word

239 tokyobk  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 1:59:02pm

===> distant cousin of the black guy on Miami Vice.

Pedigree.

240 albusteve  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 1:59:39pm

Bowzer Obama does what he thinks is right...it has no effect on me as an American...he's an elected official, not America itself...we showed Japan what's up back then...no blood, no foul

241 Sharmuta  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 2:00:04pm

re: #237 tokyobk

And, all of us to all of us from Lucy in East Africa.

We might have a hard time with logistics for a Lucy family reunion.

242 sattv4u2  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 2:00:09pm

re: #224 Sharmuta

I was a lemur in a past life. Here's a picture.

Wow ,,, you didn't get to eat much, I guess

243 checked08  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 2:00:12pm

This is Barack Obama's America!
/

244 windhorse  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 2:02:18pm

...anyone who rears animals... well - I guess I won't go there...

245 Cannadian Club Akbar  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 2:02:29pm

re: #238 sattv4u2

See my #227.

246 doubter4444  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 2:02:33pm

re: #212 RogueOne

I'm a little confused about the arguments on this thread so let me ask this, do all the US citizens on this site understand why it is in poor form for our president to bow to royalty?

I'll bite.
Why is it poor form?

247 sattv4u2  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 2:02:42pm

re: #244 windhorse

...anyone who rears animals... well - I guess I won't go there...

Go where, Alabama !?!?!?

/

248 sattv4u2  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 2:03:25pm

re: #245 Cannadian Club Akbar

See my #227.

Yeah ,,,saw that after the fact. Thanks

249 Killgore Trout  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 2:04:02pm

More fearful Republicans...
Rep. Shadegg Suggests Mayor Bloomberg's Daughter Will Be "Kidnapped" By A Terrorist

Youtube Video

What ever happened to "bring it on?"

250 avanti  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 2:04:06pm

re: #236 Guanxi88

Goes solidly against Western culture and traditions, but we gotta comply.

I wonder how anyone can learn the bowing rules, here's a primer:

"Main article: Bowing (social)

Bowing (o)jigi (お辞儀, おじぎ), (o-)rei (お礼), is probably the feature of Japanese etiquette that is best-known outside Japan. Bowing is considered extremely important in Japan, so much so that, although children normally begin learning how to bow from a very young age, companies commonly provide training to their employees in how to execute bows correctly.

Basic bows are performed with the back straight and the hands at the sides (boys and men) or clasped in the lap (girls and women), and with the eyes down. Bows originate at the waist. Generally, the longer and deeper the bow, the stronger the emotion and the respect expressed.

Bows can be generally divided into three main types: informal, formal, and very formal. Informal bows are made at about a fifteen degree angle　or just tilt over one's head to the front, and more formal bows at about thirty degrees. Very formal bows are deeper.

The etiquette surrounding bowing, including the length and depth of bow, and the appropriate response, is exceedingly complex. For example, if the other person maintains his or her bow for longer than expected (generally about two or three seconds), it is polite to bow again, upon which one may receive another bow in return. This often leads to a long exchange of progressively lighter bows."

251 sattv4u2  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 2:04:36pm

re: #249 Killgore Trout

More fearful Republicans...
Rep. Shadegg Suggests Mayor Bloomberg's Daughter Will Be "Kidnapped" By A Terrorist

[Video]

What ever happened to "bring it on?"

They're (Rudy and GWB) aren't in charge anymore !

252 Sharmuta  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 2:05:55pm

Speaking of Lucy and evolution:

Birth of New Species Witnessed by Scientists

On one of the Galapagos islands whose finches shaped the theories of a young Charles Darwin, biologists have witnessed that elusive moment when a single species splits in two.

In many ways, the split followed predictable patterns, requiring a hybrid newcomer who’d already taken baby steps down a new evolutionary path. But playing an unexpected part was chance, and the newcomer singing his own special song.

This miniature evolutionary saga is described in a paper published Monday in the Proceedings of the National Academy of Sciences. It’s authored by Peter and Rosemary Grant, a husband-and-wife team who have spent much of the last 36 years studying a group of bird species known collectively as Darwin’s finches.

253 albusteve  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 2:06:14pm

re: #249 Killgore Trout

More fearful Republicans...
Rep. Shadegg Suggests Mayor Bloomberg's Daughter Will Be "Kidnapped" By A Terrorist


[Video]What ever happened to "bring it on?"

it's still there...you approve of the trials held in NYC civil court?

254 _RememberTonyC  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 2:06:29pm

re: #177 sattv4u2

What the hell does the Kansas City pro baseball team have to do with this ??!?!?!
/

Zack Greinke of the Royals won the Cy Young Award today ...

255 webevintage  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 2:06:33pm

re: #212 RogueOne

I'm a little confused about the arguments on this thread so let me ask this, do all the US citizens on this site understand why it is in poor form for our president to bow to royalty?

Meh.
Who cares...it is a silly faux!outrage to get into when you consider other Presidents have done it too, both Rs and Ds.
If that's all someone has to go after such a radical leftist commie President with then he must be doing something right.

256 windhorse  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 2:06:51pm

re: #252 Sharmuta

I thought that was in Australia, and it took 26-hours!?

257 Killgore Trout  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 2:07:35pm

re: #251 sattv4u2

Rudy was saying the same fearful crap yesterday too. I'm not in favor of the civilian trials but to oppose them out of fear that it might anger terrorists is crybaby bullshit.

258 windhorse  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 2:07:35pm

[Link: www.examiner.com...]

259 J.S.  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 2:07:44pm

re: #253 albusteve

Well, c'mon, why should anyone be concerned with show trials? The outcome is in the bag...they're all slated for death sentences...done deal.

260 Killgore Trout  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 2:07:55pm

re: #253 albusteve

it's still there...you approve of the trials held in NYC civil court?


Nope.

261 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 2:07:59pm

re: #32 webevintage

Yup.

262 bratwurst  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 2:08:45pm

re: #254 _RememberTonyC

Zack Greinke of the Royals won the Cy Young Award today ...

And well deserved! Was really afraid he was going to be penalized for only 16 wins...but his ERA in his losses was lower than Sabathia's overall ERA.

263 psyop  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 2:09:27pm

What the hell is wrong with people??

no "Blood impulse"??? You may argue (though I won't) that his upbringing and the environment his mother put him in made him less likely to identify with being American.

But to claim that blood has anything to do with it is idiot at the least, and purposefully racist at the worst.

Or to put it anther way, Osama bin Laden and Tokyo Rose could have a child, give the child immediately after birth to some stable, patriotic, apple pie and baseball family in America, and that child will be no more or less inclined to be anti-American than a native born citizen.

People make me mad sometimes...

264 tradewind  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 2:09:35pm

re: #259 J.S.
Because they're gonna use those show trials as world forums for recruiting terrorists world wide. Remember, death is not a problem for the true jihadi.

265 J.S.  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 2:09:52pm

re: #260 Killgore Trout

WHAT? (you're opposed to the ACLU's contention which states that this is one of the greatest days ever in terms of civil liberties in the United States?) just teasing you...

266 wrenchwench  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 2:10:55pm

re: #246 doubter4444

I'll bite.
Why is it poor form?

The RogueOne must have gotten busy...I wonder if he or she is also a MaverickyOne?

267 Cato the Elder  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 2:10:56pm

Blut und Boden, jawohl!

268 tradewind  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 2:11:07pm

re: #257 Killgore Trout

Anger them?
Au contraire. It's just going to get them ... to coin a phrase... Fired Up, Ready to Go...

269 J.S.  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 2:11:28pm

re: #264 tradewind

yeah, I read the memo...they're gonna demonstrate the greatest of the American jusitce system through the use of show trials...

270 Guanxi88  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 2:11:35pm

re: #250 avanti

At a funeral for a colleague's father, I saw three solid generations of a family kowtow toward the man's casket. Beautiful, in its way. Even more beautiful was at the memorial banquet (yeah, I know...) all the children, starting with the oldest, took turns feeding their widowed mother rice from a jade bowl with silver chopsticks. Very symbolic and moving.

271 hickph  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 2:12:13pm

Just when I think the hard right has exhausted itself of bile, something else appears. These folks are freaking insane.

272 tradewind  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 2:14:41pm

re: #269 J.S.
There's this little problem we have of letting the accused confront the evidence against him and rip it a new one. While I am not worried that the verdict will change, the process will be damaging. With cameras in the courtroom and Al Jazeera with press passes, it's one big job fair for terrorists.

273 SanFranciscoZionist  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 2:16:07pm

re: #158 albusteve

we need another Jesse Owens

Anyone have a good suggestion for a short film or something similar on Jesse Owens? He's mentioned in a novel my students read, and I really want them to understand the role he plays in the story. (One of the main characters is a child growing up in Nazi Germany. He runs track, and absolutely adores Jesse Owens, to the point of rubbing soot on himself to look more like his hero. All the adults around him, of course, are trying to explain why this is bad, bad idea.)

274 SixDegrees  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 2:16:51pm

re: #230 Killgore Trout

Good News...
Conviction of disbarred lawyer Lynne Stewart upheld for smuggling messages to jailed terrorist

Good news, indeed. I hope this conviction stands, and that the sentence is modified to something closer to the 30 years prosecutors had originally asked for.

Lying on the stand is a serious offense that should bear heavily on sentencing. For a lawyer to do it - someone trained in the law and sworn to uphold it - multiplies the offense many times over. These are the gatekeepers of the legal system, and allowing them to undermine the system undermines public faith in it.

275 bratwurst  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 2:17:10pm

re: #273 SanFranciscoZionist

Anyone have a good suggestion for a short film or something similar on Jesse Owens? He's mentioned in a novel my students read, and I really want them to understand the role he plays in the story. (One of the main characters is a child growing up in Nazi Germany. He runs track, and absolutely adores Jesse Owens, to the point of rubbing soot on himself to look more like his hero. All the adults around him, of course, are trying to explain why this is bad, bad idea.)

I loved The Book Thief!

276 doubter4444  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 2:17:30pm

re: #233 avanti

I'm not sure of the protocol, but I recall being bowed to in Japanese department stores, and returned a few to the factory reps from Japanese electronic companies.
I did learn not to reply with a nicer gift than one given.

I worked for the Japanese for a while, it is a bit difficult to master, but they get the fact that one doesn't know the ins and outs and cut them slack. I was always told that even trying was a form of respect and was appreciated, even if slightly off.
I have no problem with the bow. I do know it was too deep, as you convey rank that way, but I think it's nothing. My only gripe is that the protocol people should have coached him on it, and that they did not means someone should get the boot.
All the bull about never bowing to royalty or showing weakness is god-awfully stupid. Are we that insecure?
I just don't get it.
I go back to Louie L'Amour in these situations.
Politeness, restraint, and respect showed the true measure of a man.
Strength meant respect for others and learning their ways.
He had nothing but contempt for fools who thought they were better because of their skin, or upbringing.

277 SanFranciscoZionist  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 2:17:54pm

re: #165 duck of peace

Wow, this guy should just get it over with and call Obama a Mudblood. Whats next? "Obama was in Hufflepuff at Hogswarts!"

Obama is a total Ravenclaw/Slytherin type.

Biden is Hufflepuff personality.

Why do I know these things?

278 tradewind  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 2:18:02pm

re: #249 Killgore Trout
It's been replaced by ' Bending Over'.
[Link: www.politico.com...]
For the record, the bow doesn't bother me. It's the bending over.

279 tradewind  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 2:18:53pm

re: #274 SixDegrees
Stewart's a freaking home-grown terrorist. She collaborated with the bombers, slipping them notes in prison.

280 tradewind  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 2:19:38pm

re: #277 SanFranciscoZionist
You've been into the butterbeer again...///

281 Dreader1962  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 2:20:25pm

re: #267 Cato the Elder

Blut und Boden, jawohl!

Since the thread is mixing in Obama's bowing, it's interesting to note the Japanese obsession with blood type as dervied from their theories of 'scientific racism'. For those who have played video games from Japan and wondered about their inclusion of blood types in character descriptions, this is the explanation.

When I was stationed in Okinawa, I heard from the people there how mainland Japanese looked down on the Okinawans because of their darker skin.

Americans don't have an exclusive lock on racism. What is weird about Pruden's comments is that I don't surround myself with people who think this way, but apparently the editors of this newspaper didn't blink at this column.

282 SanFranciscoZionist  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 2:20:43pm

re: #175 DaddyG

Many people would be surprised at their ancestry. If your family was in the US prior to 1850 there is a better than even chance you have revolutionary ancestry (on either side).

Once you go there you are probably descended from English gentry and they are related to everyone - even their own cousins. Which explains a lot about the Royals... but I digress.

I only found out last year that one branch of the family goes back to the 1500s in America. I had no idea.

283 SixDegrees  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 2:21:53pm

re: #212 RogueOne

I'm a little confused about the arguments on this thread so let me ask this, do all the US citizens on this site understand why it is in poor form for our president to bow to royalty?

It isn't.

Just as it isn't poor form for the Japanese Emperor to shake hands with the President of the United States, which also happened.

284 SanFranciscoZionist  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 2:22:40pm

re: #193 sattv4u2

McCain did just that when he admonished that lady who questioned Obamas heritage

I was very pleased by that. It was a good, strong, unambiguous response.

285 SixDegrees  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 2:22:46pm

re: #279 tradewind

Stewart's a freaking home-grown terrorist. She collaborated with the bombers, slipping them notes in prison.

Completely agree. Her original sentence was pathetically light, and I'm glad to see that the prosecution has prevailed in appealing it.

286 RogueOne  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 2:23:08pm

re: #246 doubter4444

I'll bite.
Why is it poor form?

Thanks man. Let me get on my "USA! USA!" soapbox for a second.

We are a nation of immigrants who literally shed their blood to break the chains of a monarchy. Almost our entire population is made up of immigrants (like my family) who came here over the last few hundred years who shed blood, sweat, and tears to make this the most free, open, and successful society on the planet. A majority of our ancestors came from nations ruled by a variety of aristocracies and totalitarian governments and millions of those immigrants have been killed/wounded fighting against those same types of governments, all the while carrying OUR flag. To have our leader, the most powerful free man on the planet, the head of the largest collection of "individuals", bow to any "royalty" is an affront to the decency, hard work, and beliefs of those immigrants. Americans don't bow to anyone.

//rant off. That being said, I don't think he should be impeached or excoriated over it, but someone should take him aside and explain why it annoys a lot of us.

287 SanFranciscoZionist  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 2:23:45pm

re: #197 Cannadian Club Akbar

I had a red neck woman cut my hair once who asked how it was that Segal had never won an Oscar. I wish I were kidding.

I hope you did not laugh at her. That would be unkind, also imprudent if she had sharp scissors.

288 SanFranciscoZionist  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 2:25:04pm

re: #203 MajorTom

Whiskey Tango Foxtrot, over?

I agree, the GOP leadership has got to stand up and scream from the mountaintops that this is not acceptable language or train of thought. All I hear is crickets...

How important is the WashTimes? I honestly have never seen them mentioned except on this site.

289 Dreader1962  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 2:25:10pm

re: #276 doubter4444

I worked for the Japanese for a while, it is a bit difficult to master, but they get the fact that one doesn't know the ins and outs and cut them slack. I was always told that even trying was a form of respect and was appreciated, even if slightly off.
I have no problem with the bow. I do know it was too deep, as you convey rank that way, but I think it's nothing. My only gripe is that the protocol people should have coached him on it, and that they did not means someone should get the boot.
All the bull about never bowing to royalty or showing weakness is god-awfully stupid. Are we that insecure?
I just don't get it.
I go back to Louie L'Amour in these situations.
Politeness, restraint, and respect showed the true measure of a man.
Strength meant respect for others and learning their ways.
He had nothing but contempt for fools who thought they were better because of their skin, or upbringing.

Spot on! That was my thought - that Obama is not well served by his advisers regarding protocol. This has been evident in many other diplomatic situations. A bow in this situation should have been a slight inclination expressing the idea that two equals are meeting. The emperor would have appreciated the acknowledgment of the cultural difference and it would not have communicated the idea of a subject greeting his lord. They didn't show the emperor's return bow in what I saw - was it a deep bow as well?

290 SanFranciscoZionist  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 2:26:59pm

re: #208 Alouette

My sons did a family tree and found out that they are direct descendants of Rabbi Shabse Cohen, a famous sage of the 17th century.

A woman once contacted my rabbi because she had commissioned a family tree, and discovered she had some Jewish ancestors--one in particular was apparently a well-known French rabbi--she had his name, but apparently he was also called...Rashi?

My rabbi agreed that Rashi was a well-known French rabbi.

291 SixDegrees  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 2:27:11pm

re: #288 SanFranciscoZionist

How important is the WashTimes? I honestly have never seen them mentioned except on this site.

They're frequently cited in rightward blogs and other venues, although not so much recently as the depth of their bias has become apparent.

292 Obdicut  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 2:28:03pm

re: #286 RogueOne

Americans don't bow to anyone.

I do. I bow to my Japanese friends, and my Thai friends. Because it's polite.

I also don't tell my Thai friends they suck for having a king as a head of their government.

A majority of our ancestors came from nations ruled by a variety of aristocracies and totalitarian governments and millions of those immigrants have been killed/wounded fighting against those same types of governments, all the while carrying OUR flag.

You'll also find that many Americans of, say, Swedish or Danish descent manage to be proud of their royalty. Not too many Americans have been killed or wounded fighting the Danish.

For you to mix aristocracies-- which are, except for Thailand and a few other places-- figureheads bereft of real power, with totalitarian governments, that's just wrong.

293 SanFranciscoZionist  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 2:28:27pm

re: #212 RogueOne

I'm a little confused about the arguments on this thread so let me ask this, do all the US citizens on this site understand why it is in poor form for our president to bow to royalty?

I understand that American citizens by long custom do not bow to British royalty. I am not sure I'm entirely on the same page with you, however.

294 wrenchwench  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 2:28:42pm

re: #286 RogueOne

And some of us offspring of immigrants are totally unthreatened and unoffended by our President's bow. It showed a graciousness that can be afforded by a proud, independent, confident people.

295 SanFranciscoZionist  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 2:29:06pm

re: #213 sattv4u2

SPEAKING OF GENEOLGY

Why when someone says they're reincarnated, in a past life they were always nobility or some famous hero

You never hear someone say

"Yup, last night I was hynotized and found out that back in 1548 I was Joe The Street Sweeper in charge of picking up horse shit"?

Repressed memories.

296 SanFranciscoZionist  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 2:31:25pm

re: #229 Sharmuta

What are the odds?! ;)

Well, if the connection was through Barbara's family, Mr. Bush Sr. wouldn't have been included, so about 50%.

297 SixDegrees  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 2:33:07pm

re: #286 RogueOne

Thanks man. Let me get on my "USA! USA!" soapbox for a second.

We are a nation of immigrants who literally shed their blood to break the chains of a monarchy. Almost our entire population is made up of immigrants (like my family) who came here over the last few hundred years who shed blood, sweat, and tears to make this the most free, open, and successful society on the planet. A majority of our ancestors came from nations ruled by a variety of aristocracies and totalitarian governments and millions of those immigrants have been killed/wounded fighting against those same types of governments, all the while carrying OUR flag. To have our leader, the most powerful free man on the planet, the head of the largest collection of "individuals", bow to any "royalty" is an affront to the decency, hard work, and beliefs of those immigrants. Americans don't bow to anyone.

//rant off. That being said, I don't think he should be impeached or excoriated over it, but someone should take him aside and explain why it annoys a lot of us.

There is no such precedent cited anywhere. It is pure jingoism spread far and wide by the right side of the blogosphere in just the last few months.

See several references posted on this blog to photos of all manner of American dignitaries, including Presidents at least as far back as Eisenhower, bowing to all manner of foreign officials, including heads of state.

Charles and I have both searched extensively for a reference to refusal to bow being some sort of protocol or tradition or long-established custom, and have found nothing. Please provide an official source stating this as established custom - like the State Department, for example, and not simply some blogger spew - because I, for one, would very much like to see it.

298 MittDoesNotCompute  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 2:33:08pm

re: #230 Killgore Trout

Good News...
Conviction of disbarred lawyer Lynne Stewart upheld for smuggling messages to jailed terrorist

To Lynne Stewart:

I hope playing terrorist messenger for the Blind Sheik was worth spending possibly the rest of your life in a lousy prison cell, because I think even that's too good for you. You know, they used to hang traitors...

/say hello to Benedict Arnold, b**ch

299 Semper Fi  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 2:33:12pm

re: #286 RogueOne

Thanks man. Let me get on my "USA! USA!" soapbox for a second.

We are a nation of immigrants who literally shed their blood to break the chains of a monarchy. Almost our entire population is made up of immigrants (like my family) who came here over the last few hundred years who shed blood, sweat, and tears to make this the most free, open, and successful society on the planet. A majority of our ancestors came from nations ruled by a variety of aristocracies and totalitarian governments and millions of those immigrants have been killed/wounded fighting against those same types of governments, all the while carrying OUR flag. To have our leader, the most powerful free man on the planet, the head of the largest collection of "individuals", bow to any "royalty" is an affront to the decency, hard work, and beliefs of those immigrants. Americans don't bow to anyone.

//rant off. That being said, I don't think he should be impeached or excoriated over it, but someone should take him aside and explain why it annoys a lot of us.

I respect your opinion but, if I was the Pres I would do just as BO did. I like Strong and Proud and give 25% for each but, Humble will always garner the remaining 50%.

300 DaddyG  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 2:33:34pm

re: #213 sattv4u2

SPEAKING OF GENEOLGY

Why when someone says they're reincarnated, in a past life they were always nobility or some famous hero

You never hear someone say

"Yup, last night I was hynotized and found out that back in 1548 I was Joe The Street Sweeper in charge of picking up horse shit"?

That was a cushy public service job in 1548.

301 SanFranciscoZionist  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 2:34:46pm

re: #263 psyop

What the hell is wrong with people??

no "Blood impulse"??? You may argue (though I won't) that his upbringing and the environment his mother put him in made him less likely to identify with being American.

But to claim that blood has anything to do with it is idiot at the least, and purposefully racist at the worst.

Or to put it anther way, Osama bin Laden and Tokyo Rose could have a child, give the child immediately after birth to some stable, patriotic, apple pie and baseball family in America, and that child will be no more or less inclined to be anti-American than a native born citizen.

People make me mad sometimes...

I'm trying to imagine what Rose bin Laden would look like.

302 Merryweather  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 2:35:43pm

This is wrong on so many levels, and if the Washington Times is going to publish disgusting, shameful tripe, I hope that the rumours of its impending demise have not been greatly exaggerated. The use of 'sired' made me throw up in my mouth a little - I've only ever seen that term used when discussing animals (usually racehorses).

303 RogueOne  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 2:36:29pm

re: #294 wrenchwench

And some of us offspring of immigrants are totally unthreatened and unoffended by our President's bow. It showed a graciousness that can be afforded by a proud, independent, confident people.

It's not a matter of being threatened. We owe our respect to our ancestors, not royalty of any type.

re: #292 Obdicut

I do. I bow to my Japanese friends, and my Thai friends. Because it's polite.

On his own he can bow to whoever he chooses and however he chooses, but he wasn't acting as an individual, he was acting as the head of our nation. A nation started and grown by people with a "down with the man" kind of attitude. A nation of individuals all based on the premise that we are created equal, an idea a monarchy strictly rejects. Our representative should never bow to anyone.

304 SanFranciscoZionist  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 2:37:06pm

re: #286 RogueOne

Thanks man. Let me get on my "USA! USA!" soapbox for a second.

We are a nation of immigrants who literally shed their blood to break the chains of a monarchy. Almost our entire population is made up of immigrants (like my family) who came here over the last few hundred years who shed blood, sweat, and tears to make this the most free, open, and successful society on the planet. A majority of our ancestors came from nations ruled by a variety of aristocracies and totalitarian governments and millions of those immigrants have been killed/wounded fighting against those same types of governments, all the while carrying OUR flag. To have our leader, the most powerful free man on the planet, the head of the largest collection of "individuals", bow to any "royalty" is an affront to the decency, hard work, and beliefs of those immigrants. Americans don't bow to anyone.

//rant off. That being said, I don't think he should be impeached or excoriated over it, but someone should take him aside and explain why it annoys a lot of us.

He can't be impeached over it.

Do you have any actual evidence that this is improper protocol, or do you just believe it ought to be?

305 SanFranciscoZionist  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 2:38:24pm

re: #291 SixDegrees

They're frequently cited in rightward blogs and other venues, although not so much recently as the depth of their bias has become apparent.

I'm just wondering if they're important enough for the Republican leadership to bother with responding to this drivel.

306 JoyousMN  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 2:39:03pm

re: #36 _RememberTonyC

I hate to break the news to you, but Secretariat was impotent.

Perhaps that wasn't the part you were referring to...

307 RogueOne  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 2:39:28pm

re: #297 SixDegrees

There is no such precedent cited anywhere. It is pure jingoism spread far and wide by the right side of the blogosphere in just the last few months.

See several references posted on this blog to photos of all manner of American dignitaries, including Presidents at least as far back as Eisenhower, bowing to all manner of foreign officials, including heads of state.

Charles and I have both searched extensively for a reference to refusal to bow being some sort of protocol or tradition or long-established custom, and have found nothing. Please provide an official source stating this as established custom - like the State Department, for example, and not simply some blogger spew - because I, for one, would very much like to see it.


It isn't about protocol. It's about our tradition. If 1/2 the immigrants who made this nation didn't care about bowing to their betters then this would be a much less populace place.

308 Obdicut  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 2:40:33pm

re: #303 RogueOne

On his own he can bow to whoever he chooses and however he chooses, but he wasn't acting as an individual, he was acting as the head of our nation.

You said Americans don't bow. You were wrong. Not to mention kind of insulting to Japanese Americans.


A nation started and grown by people with a "down with the man" kind of attitude.

That is the silliest portrayal of the American Revolution that I have ever seen. Perhaps you were thinking of the French Revolution?

309 SixDegrees  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 2:40:50pm

re: #305 SanFranciscoZionist

I'm just wondering if they're important enough for the Republican leadership to bother with responding to this drivel.

Probably not on it's own. If someone more prominent should pick it up and run with it - say, for example, Michele Bachmann - then the party leadership ought to pound it into the ground with everything they've got.

But the paper has never been known as a mouthpiece for the party - or vice versa. So a response to an editorial, no matter how odious, is probably out of proportion.

310 SixDegrees  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 2:41:17pm

re: #307 RogueOne

It isn't about protocol. It's about our tradition. If 1/2 the immigrants who made this nation didn't care about bowing to their betters then this would be a much less populace place.

There is no such tradition. It's pure fiction.

311 SanFranciscoZionist  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 2:41:29pm

re: #303 RogueOne

On his own he can bow to whoever he chooses and however he chooses, but he wasn't acting as an individual, he was acting as the head of our nation. A nation started and grown by people with a "down with the man" kind of attitude. A nation of individuals all based on the premise that we are created equal, an idea a monarchy strictly rejects. Our representative should never bow to anyone.

Someone rerun the Dwight D. Eisenhower Bowing Hour of Power!

312 Obdicut  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 2:43:13pm

re: #311 SanFranciscoZionist

Someone rerun the Dwight D. Eisenhower Bowing Hour of Power!

Not to mention Franklin's sweeping bows.

that's the King of France Franklin is bowing to

Of course, we needed their help, so you could say that Franklin was only bowing cynically, if you want.

313 SanFranciscoZionist  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 2:43:39pm

re: #307 RogueOne

It isn't about protocol. It's about our tradition. If 1/2 the immigrants who made this nation didn't care about bowing to their betters then this would be a much less populace place.

Tradition establishes protocol. If we actually have a 'tradition', there should be some evidence of it. If we don't have evidence, we don't have a tradition, instead we have 'some stuff we made up'.

314 DaddyG  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 2:43:54pm

I for one am happy that our President (as those before him) know how to be respectful and in touch with the customs of other nations.

Our tradition is that our flag is not bowed to national leaders becuase it symbolizes a free people. That does not mean our President has to act the "ugly American".

Yes he does represent me and I would bow to a respected Japanese dignitary.

315 wrenchwench  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 2:44:51pm

re: #307 RogueOne

It isn't about protocol. It's about our tradition. If 1/2 the immigrants who made this nation didn't care about bowing to their betters then this would be a much less populace place.

I think you meant "populous". And I think your sentiment about bowing is misplaced. The important thing is that none of us has to bow to our president. Our president bowing to other world leaders is just manners and politics. Doesn't say anything about them being anyone's betters.

316 Gus  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 2:45:50pm

I can't think of anything else to say but what a load of crap.

317 SanFranciscoZionist  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 2:46:17pm

re: #312 Obdicut

Not to mention Franklin's sweeping bows.

that's the King of France Franklin is bowing to

Of course, we needed their help, so you could say that Franklin was only bowing cynically, if you want.

The revolutionary generation followed the custom of the day, and bowed to royalty. Custom later changed, in regards to British royals, but it would never have occurred to men like Franklin and Adams not to bow to royal personages. Even royal personages whose army's ass they had recently kicked.

318 demzee  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 2:47:19pm

Oh man. This is truly disgusting. Spot the dog whistle. The crazies will be yapping madly after reading this.

319 SanFranciscoZionist  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 2:48:17pm

re: #314 DaddyG

I for one am happy that our President (as those before him) know how to be respectful and in touch with the customs of other nations.

Our tradition is that our flag is not bowed to national leaders becuase it symbolizes a free people. That does not mean our President has to act the "ugly American".

Yes he does represent me and I would bow to a respected Japanese dignitary.

Heck, I bow to the lady at the Japantown grocery store when she bags my groceries. It's polite.

I love Christmas shopping at the SF Japantown, because the Salvation Army bellringers bow, rather than screaming "Merry Christmas" when you put something in the kettle.

320 RogueOne  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 2:49:48pm

I'm amazed. I think a lot of you have your political philosophies reversed. The idea that we are all created equal is a very liberal philosophy, not a right wing one. The president didn't bow to the emperor because they're buddies but because of the mans station. Do our presidents bow to the french president? Do we as citizens bow in front of our representatives? We were founded as a nation of individuals, this is who we are.

321 Obdicut  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 2:50:01pm

re: #319 SanFranciscoZionist

Heck, I bow to the lady at the Japantown grocery store when she bags my groceries. It's polite.

I love Christmas shopping at the SF Japantown, because the Salvation Army bellringers bow, rather than screaming "Merry Christmas" when you put something in the kettle.

I live right at O'Farrell and Divasadero, and I love popping over to Japantown for strange Japanese treats and karaoke.

Sadly, the only Karaoke song I can do is "Du Hast" by Rammstein. And I don't do it that well.

322 Gus  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 2:50:38pm

re: #319 SanFranciscoZionist

Heck, I bow to the lady at the Japantown grocery store when she bags my groceries. It's polite.

I love Christmas shopping at the SF Japantown, because the Salvation Army bellringers bow, rather than screaming "Merry Christmas" when you put something in the kettle.

I remember the "mall" in Japantown and going there a few times. Lots of golf shops.

323 RogueOne  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 2:51:42pm

re: #317 SanFranciscoZionist

The revolutionary generation followed the custom of the day, and bowed to royalty. Custom later changed, in regards to British royals, but it would never have occurred to men like Franklin and Adams not to bow to royal personages. Even royal personages whose army's ass they had recently kicked.

Franklin went hat in hand begging for help. I'm glad he did, but to suggest that somehow we owe any monarchy the respect to bow, to show subservience to our betters, is a completely foreign concept to me.

324 Obdicut  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 2:51:48pm

re: #320 RogueOne

I'm amazed. I think a lot of you have your political philosophies reversed. The idea that we are all created equal is a very liberal philosophy, not a right wing one. The president didn't bow to the emperor because they're buddies but because of the mans station. Do our presidents bow to the french president? Do we as citizens bow in front of our representatives? We were founded as a nation of individuals, this is who we are.

What are you even talking about any more? Yes, the head of the US government gave respect to the titular head of the Japanese people. What exactly is wrong with that?

Can you admit you were wrong to say that Americans don't bow, and that it's presumptuous of you to attempt to speak on what Americans do or do not do? Or are you comfortable, as this author's article is, in defining what values make you American?

325 Gus  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 2:53:13pm

re: #311 SanFranciscoZionist

Someone rerun the Dwight D. Eisenhower Bowing Hour of Power!

Here it is.

Mind you I'm a bit of a fan of Eisenhower especially when he was the "supreme allied commander" at SHAEF.

326 MittDoesNotCompute  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 2:57:05pm

re: #320 RogueOne

I'm amazed. I think a lot of you have your political philosophies reversed. The idea that we are all created equal is a very liberal philosophy, not a right wing one. The president didn't bow to the emperor because they're buddies but because of the mans station. Do our presidents bow to the french president? Do we as citizens bow in front of our representatives? We were founded as a nation of individuals, this is who we are.

Man, are you dense! This was a diplomatic function, with all of the arcane vagaries and protocols that entails...the bow is part of Japanese custom, something that a respectful guest gives to their host and vice versa. If you think that President Obama's bow to the Japanese Emperor was meant to show his subservience to the Emporer, I'll say that you're f**ked in the head...

327 wrenchwench  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 2:59:53pm

re: #318 demzee

Oh man. This is truly disgusting. Spot the dog whistle. The crazies will be yapping madly after reading this.

Welcome, hatchling.

328 RogueOne  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 3:00:18pm

re: #326 talon_262

That's what bowing before royalty is, subservience. I can't believe I'm having to argue about this.

329 wrenchwench  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 3:01:33pm

re: #320 RogueOne

We were founded as a nation of individuals, this is who we are.

As individuals, I guess we can make our own decisions about whether to bow.

330 Obdicut  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 3:03:49pm

re: #328 RogueOne

That's what bowing before royalty is, subservience. I can't believe I'm having to argue about this.

Does it mean anything to you that you resorted to lying in order to make your argument, claiming that Americans don't bow?

331 Obdicut  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 3:04:16pm

I just bowed to my cat. Damn it, now I'm subservient to him! Oh wait, I was already.

332 Gus  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 3:07:02pm

SPLC Report:

Defending Dixie

Excerpts:

After singling out the Southern culture warrior, Sen. Jesse Helms, as a political hero, Pruden bragged about his great-grandmother shooting a Union cavalryman and boasted that the Times was the most "in-your-face" conservative newspaper in America. When Robert E. Lee's birthday rolls around every year, he said, "I make sure we have a story" — especially because the occasion "falls around Martin Luther King's birthday."

Born and raised in Arkansas, Pruden has a deep-rooted affection for Dixie. His father, the Rev. Wesley Pruden Sr., was a leading spokesperson for Little Rock's racist Capital Citizens Council, which fought bitterly against school desegregation in the 1950s and 1960s. During the landmark confrontations at Little Rock High School in 1957, when President Dwight Eisenhower sent National Guard troops to protect nine black teenagers as they entered the white school, Pruden Sr. reportedly told the assembled mob: "That's what we've got to fight! N*ggers, Communists, and cops!"

In 1998, Pruden, whose newspaper is the only major daily in America that runs a weekly page about a war that ended 138 years ago, spoke to the United Daughters of the Confederacy at the Manassas Battlefield Park. He began by making the kind of promise most editors avoid at any cost: "I will never fail to respond to you when you call on me for help, because I believe in what you are doing to cherish and protect and preserve the heritage of our great Southern people."

Concluding with a flourish, Pruden said "Southerners ... hold loyalty to two countries in our hearts." The second country is one "baptized 137 years ago on this very field in the blood of First Manassas, a country no longer at the mercy of the vicissitudes in the tangled affairs of men, a country that lives within us, a country that will endure for as long as men and women know love. ... God bless America, God bless the Confederate States of America, and God bless you all."

Another neo-Confederate. Ironically it looks like he got his racist inclinations from his father blood.

333 Sharmuta  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 3:08:12pm

re: #331 Obdicut

I just bowed to my cat. Damn it, now I'm subservient to him! Oh wait, I was already.

Hahahaha!

334 SixDegrees  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 3:10:12pm

re: #326 talon_262

Man, are you dense! This was a diplomatic function, with all of the arcane vagaries and protocols that entails...the bow is part of Japanese custom, something that a respectful guest gives to their host and vice versa. If you think that President Obama's bow to the Japanese Emperor was meant to show his subservience to the Emporer, I'll say that you're f**ked in the head...

The Emperor and President also shook hands. I'm not sure if this portends the collapse of Japan or not.

335 Gus  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 3:13:24pm

Moon's Washington Times Searching for a Replacement for Controversial Editor

From The Washingtonian: controversial white supremacist editor in chief of the Washington Times, Wesley Pruden is retiring. The Times is looking for a "visionary" to replace him.

Pruden pledging allegiance to Confederate battle flag.

336 doubter4444  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 3:13:32pm

re: #286 RogueOne

Thanks man. Let me get on my "USA! USA!" soapbox for a second.

We are a nation of immigrants who literally shed their blood to break the chains of a monarchy. Almost our entire population is made up of immigrants (like my family) who came here over the last few hundred years who shed blood, sweat, and tears to make this the most free, open, and successful society on the planet. A majority of our ancestors came from nations ruled by a variety of aristocracies and totalitarian governments and millions of those immigrants have been killed/wounded fighting against those same types of governments, all the while carrying OUR flag. To have our leader, the most powerful free man on the planet, the head of the largest collection of "individuals", bow to any "royalty" is an affront to the decency, hard work, and beliefs of those immigrants. Americans don't bow to anyone.

//rant off. That being said, I don't think he should be impeached or excoriated over it, but someone should take him aside and explain why it annoys a lot of us.

Nice rant. And I buy most of it.
Where we differ is the feeling you have that bowing means kowtowing.
Or genuflecting.
Showing respect to other cultures and other head of states is not an affront to anyone's individually or the concept of the United States.
This is not 1600.
It's 2009, and the entire idea of kingdoms and ultimate authority vested in a human over millions has morphed into something entirely different.
To think (or to not acknowledge) that bowing to a King or Emperor today is the same as it was several hundred years ago is a bit strange, IMO.
Today it conveys a respect of cultures, whereas 200 years ago it meant deference.

For me, it's ideologies that we can not bow down to, not figureheads of states, so I do not think that bowing to the Japanese Emperor proves our weakness to Al Queda.
That's got to be one of the lamest arguments around, to really think that Bin Laden is looking at Obama bowing and cackling to himself with glee.

No, rather he's cackling to himself because of the strife that is happening in America now, with the out of control vitriol directed by both sides to both sides, and by the constant under-minding of America by people who pretend to love her.

That's the real weakness: that the party out of power is more interested in scoring political points and tearing down the other that meanwhile, the real people who want to kill us have all the time to plot and scheme. We take our eye off what is vital with nonsense like this and it's going to bite us in the ass.

Additionally, we are and have been a superpower for decades and have literally saved the world from the darkness that losing WWII would have caused.
I think our sense of self worth is strong enough to not have to continually parade it around, or to continuously slap ourselves on the back.
Those who claim that we should never bow (not you personally!) continue to need the validation that we are "The Man".
Why sweat the small stuff when you know you can handle the real badness.
My hope is that even with all going on, we are still the beacon of hope and freedom and that needs no trumpet going before us.

337 RogueOne  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 3:16:13pm

NY Times, Right Wing Mouthpiece:

[Link: www.nytimes.com...]

With the imperial visit last week, official Washington was clearly determined to show that it knew well what courtesies should be showered on the 175th inheritor of the most formal throne on earth.

Guests invited to a white-tie state dinner at the White House (a Clinton Administration first) were instructed to address the Emperor as "Your Majesty," not "Your Highness" or, worse, "King." And in what one Administration aide called "some emperor thing," an Army general was cautioned that he should not address the Emperor Akihito at all as he escorted him to the Tomb of the Unknowns at Arlington National Cemetery.

But the "thou need not bow" commandment from the State Department's protocol office maintained a constancy of more than 200 years. Administration officials scurried to insist that the eager-to-please President had not really done the unthinkable.

I'll say it again, I don't think this presidents mistake in bowing to the japanese emperor should get him tossed out of office nor should it be used to beat him about the head and shoulders with. The bigger problem is the one I'm having here, that so many people don't understand why having the president of the united states bow to royalty is insulting to our ancestry.

338 Gus  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 3:17:10pm

re: #337 RogueOne

Ancestry?

339 Obdicut  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 3:19:03pm

re: #337 RogueOne

The bigger problem is the one I'm having here, that so many people don't understand why having the president of the united states bow to royalty is insulting to our ancestry.

Quit speaking for me, and for Americans. You don't have the right to.

340 RogueOne  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 3:22:09pm

re: #339 Obdicut

Quit speaking for me, and for Americans. You don't have the right to.

But the "thou need not bow" commandment from the State Department's protocol office maintained a constancy of more than 200 years.

Did you miss that whole 200 years part?

341 Obdicut  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 3:23:21pm

re: #340 RogueOne

Did you miss that whole 200 years part?

Did you miss the whole 'Lots of Presidents have bowed' part?

Americans bow. You lied. That's not a good thing.

And do you understand that "you need not" doesn't mean "You cannot"?

342 doubter4444  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 3:25:11pm

re: #337 RogueOne

NY Times, Right Wing Mouthpiece:

[Link: www.nytimes.com...]

I'll say it again, I don't think this presidents mistake in bowing to the Japanese emperor should get him tossed out of office nor should it be used to beat him about the head and shoulders with. The bigger problem is the one I'm having here, that so many people don't understand why having the president of the united states bow to royalty is insulting to our ancestry.

I know what you are saying and I think it's partly valid.
I feel a respectful bow does not connote anything other tan respect.
I'm not that sensitive to slights, I guess.

And no personal snark to you but these days the right seems very, very sensitive to imagining slights from everywhere, or mistaking posturing for strength.

343 RogueOne  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 3:34:24pm

re: #342 doubter4444

I get that and really I hadn't planned on having a long drawn out explanation of why it's not appropriate for our president to bow to royalty. I really don't think it's that big of an issue. It's like letting the flag touch the ground, it's just not done. I don't know if people are just trying to stick up for their president or if they just don't really understand our history or even the histories of their own families and how they came to be here.

344 Obdicut  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 3:36:05pm

re: #343 RogueOne

I get that and really I hadn't planned on having a long drawn out explanation of why it's not appropriate for our president to bow to royalty. I really don't think it's that big of an issue. It's like letting the flag touch the ground, it's just not done.

But it is done. Why do you cling to the fantasy that it isn't? Are you just ignoring the Eisenhower pictures?

345 doubter4444  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 3:41:45pm

re: #343 RogueOne

re: #344 Obdicut

But it is done. Why do you cling to the fantasy that it isn't? Are you just ignoring the Eisenhower pictures?

I think it may have to something to do with the depth of the bow.
Which some see as deference, not a respect.
Which still makes it a non issue, but I can see where some could be put off by it.
Any more than that however, is just silliness. The whining from the right, all the way to the EX VP is ludicrous, and as I stated above, is the real weakness that is being exposed by this situation.

346 doubter4444  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 3:44:14pm

re: #289 Dreader1962

Spot on! That was my thought - that Obama is not well served by his advisers regarding protocol. This has been evident in many other diplomatic situations. A bow in this situation should have been a slight inclination expressing the idea that two equals are meeting. The emperor would have appreciated the acknowledgment of the cultural difference and it would not have communicated the idea of a subject greeting his lord. They didn't show the emperor's return bow in what I saw - was it a deep bow as well?

No, he just nodded his head.

347 SixDegrees  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 3:44:29pm

re: #340 RogueOne

Did you miss that whole 200 years part?

There's an enormous difference between "need not" and "does not."

Assuming this is even correct. I don't see anything on the State Department website to this effect, although it's certainly possible I missed it. Feel free to provide a reference, as I'm sure there will be all sorts of other useful information regarding this topic to be found at the same location.

As for the ancestry and tradition thing, I'll say it again: it's bullshit.

I grew up in Detroit - Highland Park, actually, just blocks away from the original Ford assembly line and the Chrysler Manufacturing Facility and world headquarters at the time. The neighborhood was absolutely packed with immigrants - from Poland, Romania, Czechoslovakia, Italy, Germany, Ireland, Scotland and just about every other European country you could name. My own great-grandparents arrived from Germany, Ireland and Scotland. During my lifetime, I've lived closely with Jews from many points of origin, Arabs, Mexicans, people from various points of Central and South America, and I've also managed to brush up against people from all the other countries not already listed long enough to chat them up and get a feel for.

In all that time and experience, I have never even once heard anyone suggest that bowing is out of order or subservient, whether done by the President or by anyone else. Not on a single occasion.

This is a fiction invented just months ago in order to manufacture outrage directed at 0bama during his visit to the Middle East. It has absolutely no basis in fact that I can find, anywhere, and my own experience is substantial enough to convince me that few - if any - people hold it as a result of long-standing tradition or custom or protocol.

In fact, it is perhaps the most jingoistic statement I've run across at this site, and to be blunt, I find it offensive in the extreme.

348 SixDegrees  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 3:45:40pm

re: #346 doubter4444

No, he just nodded his head.

Both the Emperor and the Empress bowed in return, in distinct fashion.

349 Obdicut  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 3:47:12pm

re: #345 doubter4444

re: #344 Obdicut

I think it may have to something to do with the depth of the bow.
Which some see as deference.

I also have no problem with a guest showing deference to his host.

350 Gus  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 4:04:38pm

OK, just finished designing a new banner for the Washington Times.

Check it out.

Image: washingtontimes.jpg

I think it fits.

351 Gus  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 4:05:38pm

re: #350 Gus 802

Oops, messed up. BRB

352 Gus  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 4:12:37pm

re: #351 Gus 802

Oops, messed up. BRB

OK, all fixed. Two sizes.

"New" Washington times banner reflecting their true selves:

Large

Medium

Image: washingtontimes.jpg

Image: washingtontimes2.jpg

353 SanFranciscoZionist  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 5:04:40pm

re: #320 RogueOne

I'm amazed. I think a lot of you have your political philosophies reversed. The idea that we are all created equal is a very liberal philosophy, not a right wing one. The president didn't bow to the emperor because they're buddies but because of the mans station. Do our presidents bow to the french president? Do we as citizens bow in front of our representatives? We were founded as a nation of individuals, this is who we are.

I have no idea what it would mean to have my political philosophy reversed.

In Japan, bowing is an almost universal sign of respect. I am told that Obama did it badly, and overdid it, and there appears to be some confusion as to whether it was entirely correct protocol or not.

The elected officials of France and the United States shake hands, as is customary between Western men.

We do not bow to our representatives.

Being a 'nation of individuals' has almost nothing to do with formal etiquette on such occasions.

354 RogueOne  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 5:06:39pm

re: #347 SixDegrees

We've talked about detroit a bit, I was born in hamtramck (grandparents on my fathers side are polish immigrants) remember? How about this, I believe a bow to royalty is always done out of subservience but you're within your rights to disagree. The bowing=subservience meme is not new to humanity. It's been around since dating involved real clubbing, with clubs not "in" clubs. For crying-out-loud even animals do it. The fact that it's evolved into a sign of respect in some cultures doesn't change its origin as a sign of subservience/submission in order to keep yourself alive and healthy.

BTW, I'm sure you noticed the NYT article was 15 years old and people reacted the same way to Clinton just bowing his shoulders? Obama didn't just bow his head here. Go back and look at the picture again and see where he's looking.
Image: article-1227822-0735C641000005DC-911_468x367.jpg

None of this is new and personally it's not even about Obama. This is about a 200yr old American tradition (americans do not genuflect to royalty) and mindset (that all men are created equal). This isn't a right/left wing issue, it's about what deserves the most respect, Is it 200 years of our heritage or some royal's family lineage?

355 SanFranciscoZionist  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 5:07:35pm

re: #328 RogueOne

That's what bowing before royalty is, subservience. I can't believe I'm having to argue about this.

You really don't understand Japanese etiquette, do ya?

356 SanFranciscoZionist  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 5:09:43pm

re: #332 Gus 802

SPLC Report:

Defending Dixie

Excerpts:


Another neo-Confederate. Ironically it looks like he got his racist inclinations from his father blood.

Oh, so scum.

357 Obdicut  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 5:10:27pm

re: #354 RogueOne

None of this is new and personally it's not even about Obama. This is about a 200yr old American tradition (americans do not genuflect to royalty) and mindset (that all men are created equal). This isn't a right/left wing issue, it's about what deserves the most respect, Is it 200 years of our heritage or some royal's family lineage?

What 200 years of heritage? Why are you ignoring the pictures of Eisenhower bowing?

Why characterize a bow as a genuflection?

Why claim that you can say what is an American tradition?

358 SanFranciscoZionist  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 5:14:36pm

re: #343 RogueOne

I get that and really I hadn't planned on having a long drawn out explanation of why it's not appropriate for our president to bow to royalty. I really don't think it's that big of an issue. It's like letting the flag touch the ground, it's just not done. I don't know if people are just trying to stick up for their president or if they just don't really understand our history or even the histories of their own families and how they came to be here.

1. I have no stake in Obama having done the correct thing. This does not seem to be an entirely clear point.

2. People here understand 'our history' and their family's histories perfectly well. They are just able to understand the distinction between 'deferring to one's betters' and diplomatic courtesy toward the symbolic head of an allied nation.

359 SanFranciscoZionist  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 5:17:02pm

re: #349 Obdicut

I also have no problem with a guest showing deference to his host.

Who is also an older man, which I believe also influences the depth of one's bow.

360 hokiepride  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 5:18:42pm

Typical for WashTimes, what can you expect? If they can employ RS McCain, heck why not drop the "conservative" pretense and go whole hog and support AmRen and TakiMag?

361 Kruk  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 5:23:15pm

re: #4 EmmmieG

Serious question here:

It's Old World, New World, and Third World? (I've always wondered what the first two were.)

But...Africa was known about WAY before the New World, so that means that...ow...ow...head hurts.

I always thought it was a Cold War thing. You had the First World was the developed and democratic world, the Commie countries, and then the Third World coluntries which were poor and could be pulled into either camp.

On the article, it's great that people are actually calling this BS for what it is. The whole point of dog-whistling is to be able to get your jabs in while maintaining plausible deniability. It's of course political suicide to be outright racist, so code words like "reared", "sired", "outsider" are used. What they don't realise is that their opponents can read between the lines just as well as their supporters can, and they remember it when they vote next. Given the way America's demographics are changing, this kind of baiting is a sure ticket to long term electoral failure.

362 Ian MacGregor  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 5:41:57pm

re: #2 rollwave87

I must be clueless as I don't see these remarks as racist. The common thread is one of nativism. It's not that Obama's father was black, but that he was Kenyan. Obama's mother was attracted to foreign men, and Hawaii does not really count as a part of the United States.

The assertion that Obama is not really an American no matter where he was born due to his upbringing by foreigners and xenophiles as well as where he lived. What is being implied is that our president is treacherous and will not have the country's best interests at heart in any dealings with other heads-of-state. It is a claim which is grotesque, but is it racially-based? I'm not sure

363 Achilles Tang  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 6:15:30pm

This is to Birther as ID is to YEC.

364 doubter4444  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 6:38:58pm

re: #362 Ian MacGregor

I must be clueless as I don't see these remarks as racist. The common thread is one of nativism. It's not that Obama's father was black, but that he was Kenyan. Obama's mother was attracted to foreign men, and Hawaii does not really count as a part of the United States.

The assertion that Obama is not really an American no matter where he was born due to his upbringing by foreigners and xenophiles as well as where he lived. What is being implied is that our president is treacherous and will not have the country's best interests at heart in any dealings with other heads-of-state. It is a claim which is grotesque, but is it racially-based? I'm not sure

Are you from the States?
No snark, really.
I don't see how the remarks can be seen anything other than racist.
Honestly.
Earlier I said the language used was "slave owner" terminology, i.e. a stud sireing a mare, which was common language and mentality back then.
If you really can't see the inherent racism, you need to think again, honestly.
I am not one to see it in every utterance, and usually err on the side of thinking it's a mistake or out of context.
This is neither.
This is as straight forward as it gets, not even a dog whistle.

365 Ian MacGregor  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 8:10:15pm

re: #364 doubter4444

Sire is to father or beget not to copulate. I agree that use of the term, which is usually reserved for breeding stock is meant to imply Obama's father as less than human. I saw that as an attack on his father's nationality. But upon further reflection I agree it is racist.

I doubt the term would not be used if his father were a black man from Chicago or London, or Montreal. I doubt it would have been used if his father was a white man from Nairobi, or Addis Ababa, or Lagos. However as his father was both black and from Kenya the term got used. I concentrated too much on the foreign aspects to see the racism. I still believe the remarks in total have much more to do with where Obama's was raised than his race.

366 doubter4444  Tue, Nov 17, 2009 8:40:25pm

re: #365 Ian MacGregor

Sire is to father or beget not to copulate. I agree that use of the term, which is usually reserved for breeding stock is meant to imply Obama's father as less than human. I saw that as an attack on his father's nationality. But upon further reflection I agree it is racist.

I doubt the term would not be used if his father were a black man from Chicago or London, or Montreal. I doubt it would have been used if his father was a white man from Nairobi, or Addis Ababa, or Lagos. However as his father was both black and from Kenya the term got used. I concentrated too much on the foreign aspects to see the racism. I still believe the remarks in total have much more to do with where Obama's was raised than his race.

Thanks, and I am interested in the distinction you've made between a black man (American) and an African.
Earlier in the thread, I think it's a discussion many lizards would had liked, to wit: How much of the reaction again Obama is because he's black, as opposed to because he's African to boot.
I personally thing the author would have said the same things but in MUCH more couched language.
Interesting point, thanks.

367 suchislife  Wed, Nov 18, 2009 2:53:22am

re: #362 Ian MacGregor

I must be clueless

The idea of "Blood instinct" is racist all by itself because it implies that there are different kinds of "blood" (obviously of different races), and that which one you have determines your character. To assume that you are clueless is actually a pretty friendly explanation, one might also conclude that you must be (probably unknowingly) racist. Because fish don't have a word for water, and an unknowing racist will never recognice racism.

368 Ian MacGregor  Wed, Nov 18, 2009 7:27:22am

re: #367 suchislife

It is not so obvious that blood instinct in this case refers to race. One again the main point of the article is that Obama's upbringing gives him a non-American, non first-world perspective on things. It is saying that the president is a citizen of the world, and not an American at his core, that he does not bleed red, white, and blue. Once again such a charge would not be made if the president grew up in south-central LA.

My personal feelings is that the president is woefully mistaken in many aspects his foreign policy, and that he has rejected "American Exceptionalism", but that he is trying to do what he thinks is best for the country, that he does bleed red, white and blue.

I won't answer you ad-hominem attack except to say that you, who doesn't know me at all, but thinks he knows me better than I know myself, has decided that it is more appropriate to make a vile charge rather than address my arguments.

369 ArdentCapitalist  Wed, Nov 18, 2009 7:35:25am

Since when the hell did the Washington Times ever make its way into "conservative" media?

The author's words were poorly chosen. Obama has no desire to be American because he embraces philosophies contrary to the spirit of our nation's founding. Blood has nothing to do with it.

370 Hawaii69  Wed, Nov 18, 2009 3:25:24pm

Paradise?

Obviously, this clown has never been to Hawaii.

371 Hawaii69  Wed, Nov 18, 2009 3:32:25pm

re: #362 Ian MacGregor

and Hawaii does not really count as a part of the United States.

In some cultural ways, that it very true. Though, if you said this to Hawaii Senator Daniel Inouye, he'd probably crack you in the head with his remaining arm.

The other arm was blown off while he was earning himself the Medal of Honor fighting the Nazis in Italy.
In 1945...before Hawaii was even a State.

I wonder how American Ellison Onizuka felt just before he was killed in the Challeger Shuttle explosion?

372 [deleted]  Wed, Nov 18, 2009 7:28:24pm
373 lurking faith  Wed, Nov 18, 2009 8:18:54pm

re: #372 Royaloak

It looks and smells racist; that's what's wrong with it. Pointing three times to them funny-lookin' furriners.

Arguments about Obama's attitudes can be made without racially tinged language. And one could talk about his family's politics and his mentors in adolescence, instead of his mother's sex life. Have you forgotten that few sins are as bad in the eyes of a white supremacist as a white woman marrying a non-white man?

And - by the way - are you calling Hawaii un-American? Sheesh. It's probably more like traditional middle America than Harvard is.


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