Birtherism Takes Center Stage at TeaBagCon - Update: Gets Standing Ovation

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Joseph Farah of World Net Daily gives us a preview of his speech to the First National Tea Party Convention: What I’ll say today at 1st Tea Party Convention.

Here’s a sneak peak at what I will be talking about in my keynote address to the first National Tea Party Convention in Nashville tonight. I wish you could all be there, but it’s a sellout. …

I have a dream.

My dream is that IF Barack Obama even seeks re-election as president in 2012, he won’t be able to go to any city, any town, any hamlet in America without seeing signs that ask, “Where’s the birth certificate?”

(Hat tip: Cato.)

UPDATE at 2/5/10 7:38:03 pm:

Dave Weigel is at the TeaBagCon, and just tweeted that Farah received a standing ovation for his Birther speech.

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635 comments
1 windsagio  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 6:42:31pm

MLK was a Republican!

/so its okay to make a travesty of his speech.

2 Cato the Elder  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 6:44:02pm

Yes. Well. Umm.

Base your whole campaign in ‘10 and ‘12 on that, dickweeds.

You got nothin’.

3 Charles Johnson  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 6:44:19pm

This is just astounding to me. The inmates are in charge of the asylum.

4 Cato the Elder  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 6:44:34pm

And where the hell in America can you still find a “hamlet”?

5 tradewind  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 6:46:07pm

Okay….
So for the right wingnuts: Obama’s not a real cityzin, and for the leftwing moonbats:
Bush was never legitimately elected prezidint.
Next!

6 tradewind  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 6:46:41pm

re: #4 Cato the Elder
If you ask them nicely at Honeybaked, they’ll sell you a miniature.

7 iceweasel  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 6:46:46pm

re: #4 Cato the Elder

And where the hell in America can you still find a “hamlet”?

The same place where Shirley Jackson’s Lottery still takes place. Yay for teh reel Ahmurka!

8 windsagio  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 6:47:13pm

re: #4 Cato the Elder

ask and you shall receive!
Hamlet, CA
Hamlet, IN
Hamlet, NB
Hamlet, NY
Hamlet, NC

I’m sure these 5 towns will be all-atwitter over the birth certificate >>

9 freetoken  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 6:47:23pm

re: #3 Charles

Lead article at Murdoch’s hate site, FoxNation: “Fox Nation Behind the Scenes at the Tea Party Convention”

Behind the Scenes … indeed.

Right now near the top of the comments to that article is a comment with a link to … the JBS home site!

10 jaunte  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 6:47:34pm

You can tell a lot about a man by the size of his dreams.

11 windsagio  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 6:47:57pm

re: #5 tradewind

loltuquoque.

12 TampaKnight  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 6:48:03pm

So I’ll never vote Democrat, but I don’t wanna vote for any GOP’er who supports these idiots.

What do I do?

13 cliffster  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 6:48:27pm

re: #5 tradewind

Actually, since the rightful man has yet to be confirmed as President from 2000, that would mean that Gore has 4 years, starting, well, whenever. Obama is not the rightful president, Gore is!

14 windsagio  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 6:48:45pm

re: #12 TampaKnight

theres always Buchanan and Nader…

no wait.

15 Lidane  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 6:49:02pm

*sigh*

They’re just never going to let this whole birther thing go, are they? God could show up on the White House lawn and show the entire world President Obama’s birth in a Hawaii hospital, and these idiots would swear it was CGI and a liberal Hollywood conspiracy.

Seriously— how do these people function in every day life? I can’t imagine going through life with that much ignorance weighing me down.

16 SteveC  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 6:49:27pm

I feel a great disturbance in the Farce…. as if millions of voices cried out at once, “Where is the Nirth Sertifikit?”, and were drowned out by howls of laughter.

17 Dark_Falcon  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 6:49:33pm

It’s Con season, all right. I guess since so many gaming conventions are held this time of year, these goofs figured “Why not a bullshit convention?”

18 Dark_Falcon  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 6:50:17pm

re: #16 SteveC

I feel a great disturbance in the Farce… as if millions of voices cried out at once, “Where is the Nirth Sertifikit?”, and were drowned out by howls of laughter.

Stay on Target!

19 Lidane  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 6:50:25pm

re: #12 TampaKnight

So I’ll never vote Democrat, but I don’t wanna vote for any GOP’er who supports these idiots.

What do I do?

Vote for whichever Republican that these idiots call a RINO and a traitor, provided you find enough agreement with that person on the issues.

20 darthstar  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 6:50:45pm

And I’d like to see President Obama say “I’ve got your birth certificate right here…” and grab his package. Of course, he has more class than that, but still it would be fun to see.

21 TampaKnight  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 6:51:00pm

re: #19 Lidane

Vote for whichever Republican that these idiots call a RINO and a traitor, provided you find enough agreement with that person on the issues.

In my state that’d be Crist…but I’m not convinced I like him.

22 Stanley Sea  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 6:51:09pm

What fun! A convention of extremely pissed off lunatics.

23 darthstar  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 6:51:50pm

re: #22 Stanley Sea

What fun! A convention of extremely pissed off lunatics.

It’ll be the first convention in history where nobody gets laid.

24 Cato the Elder  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 6:52:09pm

You can also find a Hamlet in every second tumbleweed town’s disgraceful high-school theater program. And I’m sure every single Hamlet has no more burning desire (outside of doing Ophelia doggystyle) than to know for sure whether or not our president was born in Kenya.

25 SteveC  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 6:52:18pm

re: #12 TampaKnight

So I’ll never vote Democrat, but I don’t wanna vote for any GOP’er who supports these idiots.

What do I do?

You could vote for me. I’m only running for the County Historical Society, but I’m sane!

26 Stanley Sea  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 6:52:24pm

re: #23 darthstar

It’ll be the first convention in history where nobody gets laid.

Well, you know what they say about angry sex.

27 Slumbering Behemoth Stinks  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 6:53:00pm

re: #16 SteveC

Stay on target!

28 windsagio  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 6:53:22pm

re: #24 Cato the Elder

bah, htat ones better than mine.

29 jamesfirecat  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 6:53:24pm

I have a dream that one day you people won’t be able to make use of the words of a great man to all but say the exact opposite of what he argued for.

I have a dream that one day we will be able to convince you people to move to an island in the middle of some ocean where you can have your own nation with guns and Bibles for all and wealfare, unions and abortions for non!

30 tradewind  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 6:53:29pm

re: #12 TampaKnight
Sit tight, because the Republicans won’t be voting for them anyway.
They get a lot of press…. not a lot of votes, in the end. Look at the primaries….. even where you see headlines proclaiming ’ tea parties booting mainstream Republicans’, the winners aren’t Tea Party candidates.
But the Democrats, (and therefore, the MSM), would love to have you think they’re remaking the GOP.
Not so much.

31 windsagio  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 6:54:31pm

re: #30 tradewind

Its about as unsurprising that you have such a rosy picture of the situation as it is that the left has a dire one ;)

The truth is probably somewhere in between.

32 What, me worry?  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 6:54:34pm

re: #26 Stanley Sea

Well, you know what they say about angry sex.

Angry sex with a menagerie of teabaggers! Ack!

33 tradewind  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 6:54:38pm

re: #21 TampaKnight
If you get past the hype, Rubio is not exactly a right-wingnut. And Crist is thinking about switching parties.

34 jamesfirecat  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 6:54:43pm

re: #5 tradewind

Okay…
So for the right wingnuts: Obama’s not a real cityzin, and for the leftwing moonbats:
Bush was never legitimately elected prezidint.
Next!

You’re gonna compare a crazy theory to a 5-4 supreme court vote to STOP counting ballots?

Not saying that the left shouldn’t have gotten over it already but at least they were grasping at a real straw rather than one that only exists in a dream.

35 Lidane  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 6:55:05pm

re: #21 TampaKnight

In my state that’d be Crist…but I’m not convinced I like him.

I can’t speak to his politics, but his hair is impeccable. Heh.

The guy could stand to back off on the spray tan, though. He’s almost venturing into Boehner territory he’s so damned orange.

36 What, me worry?  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 6:55:22pm

re: #33 tradewind

If you get past the hype, Rubio is not exactly a right-wingnut. And Crist is thinking about switching parties.

Crist is thinking of switching? Did you read that somewhere?

37 iceweasel  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 6:55:26pm

Joseph Farah has a dream.

A dream that MLK and the civil rights movement never happened, and Obama isn’t really the President.

Let us not wallow in the valley of despair, I say to you today, my friends.

And so even though we face the difficulties of today and tomorrow, he still has a dream. It is a dream deeply rooted in the American dream— the reel America, you know, not the one that includes foreign and exotic states like Hawaii.
A dream where we recognise Wasilla as the true cradle of our nation.

He has a dream that one day this nation will rise up and live out the true meaning of its creed: “We hold these truths to be self-evident, that all men are created equal— but some maybe not as equal, especially if they only have a certificate of live birth.”

Joseph Farah has a dream today.

38 jamesfirecat  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 6:55:32pm

re: #12 TampaKnight

So I’ll never vote Democrat, but I don’t wanna vote for any GOP’er who supports these idiots.

What do I do?

I say to you my good man, stay at home while I go vote for Obama!

39 Cato the Elder  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 6:55:34pm

re: #12 TampaKnight

So I’ll never vote Democrat, but I don’t wanna vote for any GOP’er who supports these idiots.

What do I do?

Buy a boat. Sail away. No matter how much the sea level rises, you will be on top.

40 tradewind  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 6:55:37pm

re: #31 windsagio
There’s no painting required.
VA.
MA.
NJ.
And it’s not over.

41 windsagio  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 6:55:49pm

re: #34 jamesfirecat

its just the old ‘divert and attack’ tactic, don’t let it get to you ;)

42 tradewind  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 6:56:09pm

re: #35 Lidane
Boehner’s about ten shades paler lately. The press must have finally filtered down to him.

43 What, me worry?  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 6:56:11pm

re: #35 Lidane

I can’t speak to his politics, but his hair is impeccable. Heh.

The guy could stand to back off on the spray tan, though. He’s almost venturing into Boehner territory he’s so damned orange.

I think that’s pretty much him, but what do I know…

Crist is a moderate Republican which means he’s not a popular fellow.

44 SteveC  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 6:56:47pm

re: #37 iceweasel

Joseph Farah has a dream.

A dream that MLK and the civil rights movement never happened, and Obama isn’t really the President.

Let us not wallow in the valley of despair, I say to you today, my friends.

And so even though we face the difficulties of today and tomorrow, he still has a dream. It is a dream deeply rooted in the American dream— the reel America, you know, not the one that includes foreign and exotic states like Hawaii.
A dream where we recognise Wasilla as the true cradle of our nation.

He has a dream that one day this nation will rise up and live out the true meaning of its creed: “We hold these truths to be self-evident, that all men are created equal— but some maybe not as equal, especially if they only have a certificate of live birth.”

Joseph Farah has a dream today.

Medicated very well be the way for you to go through life, Joseph.

45 cliffster  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 6:56:53pm

re: #40 tradewind

There’s no painting required.
VA.
MA.
NJ.
And it’s not over.

Nah, dude, you got it all wrong. O’Keefe! Tea Party! Racism! It’s over for the GOP!!

46 TampaKnight  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 6:56:56pm

Rubio isn’t a wing-nut, I know….but the young man got owned lately in debates….he’s simply inexperienced.

I still think Crist will win the Senate seat.

47 tradewind  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 6:57:18pm

re: #38 jamesfirecat
What’s he done for you lately? Really waiting to hear.
Because every one I know who voted for him is going ’ I wuz robbed’.

48 Dark_Falcon  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 6:57:39pm

re: #37 iceweasel

Joseph Farah has a dream.

A dream that MLK and the civil rights movement never happened, and Obama isn’t really the President.

Let us not wallow in the valley of despair, I say to you today, my friends.

And so even though we face the difficulties of today and tomorrow, he still has a dream. It is a dream deeply rooted in the American dream— the reel America, you know, not the one that includes foreign and exotic states like Hawaii.
A dream where we recognise Wasilla as the true cradle of our nation.

He has a dream that one day this nation will rise up and live out the true meaning of its creed: “We hold these truths to be self-evident, that all men are created equal— but some maybe not as equal, especially if they only have a certificate of live birth.”

Joseph Farah has a dream today.

Great work, ice.

49 windsagio  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 6:57:42pm

re: #45 cliffster

I’m not saying that :p

I am saying ‘ignore the movement at your peril’. Its tempting to just wish it away, but you’d better be damn sure you’re right about their powerlessness.

50 Cato the Elder  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 6:57:44pm

re: #40 tradewind

There’s no painting required.
VA.
MA.
NJ.
And it’s not over.

Perhaps.

And you’re happy at the prospect of these nutjobs taking over?

51 tradewind  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 6:58:15pm

re: #36 marjoriemoon
Yes. And heard it, as well, on that right wing news site, MSNBC.//

52 darthstar  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 6:58:22pm

re: #40 tradewind

There’s no painting required.
VA.
MA.
NJ.
And it’s not over.

You forgot NY-23…oh, wait…that was a pyrrhic victory. Never mind.

53 Cato the Elder  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 6:58:30pm

re: #45 cliffster

Nah, dude, you got it all wrong. O’Keefe! Tea Party! Racism! It’s over for the GOP!!

If it’s not over for the GOP, it may well be over for America.

54 windsagio  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 6:58:47pm

re: #50 Cato the Elder

in some cases its more about ‘sides’ (or even ‘tribes’, to steal someone elses meme) than it is about good governance.

55 What, me worry?  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 6:58:55pm

This was Crist about a year ago.

[Link: politicalticker.blogs.cnn.com…] (April 2009)

A Quinnipiac poll released Wednesday finds the Republican governor received an impressive 68 percent approval rating from members of his own party - the same numbers he drew in November, before he appeared with the president at an event plugging the stimulus plan. He draws roughly the same positive ratings from Democrats and Independents: 66 percent of Democrats and 68 percent of Independents approve of the job Crist is doing during his time in office.

Crist’s 25 percent disapproval rating among Republican voters is sightly higher than the 20 percent of Democrats who give him negative marks.

56 Political Atheist  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 6:59:24pm

re: #12 TampaKnight

Get drunk with us after the election.

57 cliffster  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 6:59:36pm

re: #53 Cato the Elder

If it’s not over for the GOP, it may well be over for America.

Here’s the nutjobs in control right now

58 keloyd  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 6:59:39pm

re: #34 jamesfirecat

The Birthers and the moonbats who think W stole the 2k election look about at the same level to me, not apples and oranges, well, maybe tangerines and oranges.

59 darthstar  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 7:00:57pm

re: #58 keloyd

The Birthers and the moonbats who think W stole the 2k election look about at the same level to me, not apples and oranges, well, maybe tangerines and oranges.

W didn’t steal the 2k election. The SCOTUS gave it to him.

60 windsagio  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 7:01:00pm

re: #58 keloyd

the problem is that its utterly irrelevant to criticism of the birther thing.

“But they did it too!” just isn’t a valid argument.

61 freetoken  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 7:01:02pm

re: #57 cliffster

Here’s the nutjobs in control right now

That is just outright erroneous.

The total Federal Debt is the accumulation of 4 decades of borrowing.

62 Cato the Elder  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 7:01:15pm

re: #57 cliffster

Here’s the nutjobs in control right now

Right. And that clock started running on 01/20/2009.

63 jamesfirecat  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 7:01:42pm

re: #47 tradewind

What’s he done for you lately? Really waiting to hear.
Because every one I know who voted for him is going ’ I wuz robbed’.

He passed a stimulus package that has kept our nation from going head first into the New Great Depression.

He’s gotten us to within a hairs breath of healthcare reform.

He’s trying to strengthen the EPA and similar agencies so that they’ll be able to do their jobs.

64 windsagio  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 7:01:44pm

re: #61 freetoken

Reagan and the 2 Bushes did nothing to feed the national debt/

65 tradewind  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 7:01:45pm

re: #50 Cato the Elder
I wouldn’t say that any of the above three candidates represents a threat to the nation, and really, I don’t see a nutjob among them.

66 Decatur Deb  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 7:01:48pm

re: #12 TampaKnight

So I’ll never vote Democrat, but I don’t wanna vote for any GOP’er who supports these idiots.

What do I do?

Ojoe has a deal for you.

67 What, me worry?  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 7:01:55pm

re: #51 tradewind

Yes. And heard it, as well, on that right wing news site, MSNBC.//

Democrats like him more than other Republicans, but that doesn’t mean he’s going to be a Democrat. People could be making inferences because of his popularity.

With the hard pull to the Right, I suspect Crist will lose popularity, but the question is, how much.

68 Our Precious Bodily Fluids  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 7:02:21pm

In other words, Joseph Farah dreams of Obama being a shoe-in in 2012?

69 cliffster  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 7:02:27pm

re: #54 windsagio

in some cases its more about ‘sides’ (or even ‘tribes’, to steal someone elses meme) than it is about good governance.

And a good propaganda technique is try and define your opponent by associating them with jackasses. Everyone on the left is falling over themselves to sum up the GOP as racist weirdos.

70 Decatur Deb  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 7:03:09pm

re: #20 darthstar

And I’d like to see President Obama say “I’ve got your birth certificate right here…” and grab his package. Of course, he has more class than that, but still it would be fun to see.

He’s saving that for the Hoboken town hall.

71 windsagio  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 7:03:25pm

re: #69 cliffster

I don’t really agree with your point (you don’t see people on here trying to lump you guys like that), but + for the charming term ‘racist weirdos’

72 tradewind  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 7:03:38pm

re: #63 jamesfirecat
The stimulus is a huge bust.
And hairs’ breadths don’t really count in health care, thank heavens. The last one… OMG, can’t quit laughing. ’ EPA, take me away’.

73 Cato the Elder  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 7:03:39pm

re: #65 tradewind

I wouldn’t say that any of the above three candidates represents a threat to the nation, and really, I don’t see a nutjob among them.

Then apparently you’ve skipped a lot of posts here.

74 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 7:03:46pm

I’m thinking of what the 2012 campaign will actually be like. Looking down the road. How much crazier will these people get? How many followers will they attract? if that Research2000 poll is to be believed, there are a lot of completely deluded and crazy people in the party. Are we seeing a schism? Rational Republicans versus these tribalist psychos, and the only endgame is a separate party?

John Cornyn was addressing some of this this, that they need to get the Tea Partiers in the party and involved more in primaries, lest they split off and take hunks of the activist base of the GOP with them.

Fascinating and freaky times. I honestly thought an Obama presidency would be sort of boring, that the campaign crazy would die down, he’d have opposition but it’d be sort of dull. How wrong I was! Oh how wrong.

75 William Barnett-Lewis  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 7:03:47pm

re: #12 TampaKnight

So I’ll never vote Democrat, but I don’t wanna vote for any GOP’er who supports these idiots.

What do I do?

Well, as a (real) socialist, I rarely find any politician I agree with. Occasionally I’ve voted for decent Republicans. Occasionally I’ve voted for decent Democrats. Far more often I hold my nose and vote for the person I believe will do the least damage to the constitution.

It isn’t much but it’s better than having no input in the process whatsoever.

It’s a little easier every six years since I have Russ Feingold for my senator.

William

76 tradewind  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 7:04:48pm

re: #70 Decatur Deb
Personally, I just don’t understand why he didn’t say ’ fine, idiots, here it is’. He’s obviously a US citizen. Why the coy act?
He’s supposed to be No Drama Obama, right? And yet……..

77 Cato the Elder  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 7:04:53pm

re: #69 cliffster

And a good propaganda technique is try and define your opponent by associating them with jackasses. Everyone on the left is falling over themselves to sum up the GOP as racist weirdos.

There is nothing “weird” about racism. It’s as American as cluster bombs.

78 cliffster  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 7:04:56pm

re: #61 freetoken

re: #62 Cato the Elder

Yep, it’s been going on awhile. Quite a big chunk of that has happened very recently though, yes?

79 iceweasel  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 7:04:59pm

re: #20 darthstar

And I’d like to see President Obama say “I’ve got your birth certificate right here…” and grab his package. Of course, he has more class than that, but still it would be fun to see.

I’d like to see it all on Youtube as a blazing saddles recreation.
The President is a-near!
What’d he say?
and
“Scuse me while I whip this out” before producing the birth certificate.

80 jamesfirecat  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 7:05:06pm

re: #58 keloyd

The Birthers and the moonbats who think W stole the 2k election look about at the same level to me, not apples and oranges, well, maybe tangerines and oranges.

The Supreme Court made a decission that they directly stated that SHOULD NEVER be used a precedent.

So in short “Don’t ever ask us about this again, but this one time… yeah we’re gonna let our guy in!”

Do I think that the Bush paid the supreme court to do this? No.

Do I think that the election was “stolen” not really. I think it was more like the election fell out of somebodies pocket and the Republicans picked it up and walked off with it….

81 What, me worry?  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 7:05:07pm

re: #67 marjoriemoon

Democrats like him more than other Republicans, but that doesn’t mean he’s going to be a Democrat. People could be making inferences because of his popularity.

With the hard pull to the Right, I suspect Crist will lose popularity, but the question is, how much.

I didn’t say that quite right…. I meant there seems to be a wider margin of Republicans that do NOT like him than there are Dems who do not like him.

82 tradewind  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 7:05:21pm

re: #73 Cato the Elder
Just the ones I don’t agree with.//

83 iceweasel  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 7:06:03pm

re: #76 tradewind

Personally, I just don’t understand why he didn’t say ’ fine, idiots, here it is’. He’s obviously a US citizen. Why the coy act?
He’s supposed to be No Drama Obama, right? And yet…

You’re kidding, right?

84 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 7:06:13pm

re: #45 cliffster

Nah, dude, you got it all wrong. O’Keefe! Tea Party! Racism! It’s over for the GOP!!

The GOP just needs to hibernate for a while, and FOLLOW THE LEAD OF WILLIAM BUCKLEY. and get rid of these psychos.

Or you can just get mad at people who point out the truth.

85 windsagio  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 7:06:32pm

re: #79 iceweasel

I have the feeling with him that he’s always about 1 step away from losing it and openly mocking them.

Our politics are the sadder for his good sense >>

86 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 7:06:42pm

re: #77 Cato the Elder

There is nothing “weird” about racism. It’s as American as cluster bombs.

And fried Oreos!

87 cliffster  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 7:07:25pm

re: #77 Cato the Elder

There is nothing “weird” about racism. It’s as American as cluster bombs.

And it’s about as GOP as New York City. I hope democrats keep trying to push the Republicans-are-racists strategy, though.

88 windsagio  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 7:07:36pm

re: #83 iceweasel

re: #84 WindUpBird

I think what you guys are butting up against here is that people take their role on this blog as ‘defend the right’, not ‘engage in discussion’.

Theres not really much give and take possible in that situation.

89 SteveC  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 7:07:45pm

re: #76 tradewind

Personally, I just don’t understand why he didn’t say ’ fine, idiots, here it is’. He’s obviously a US citizen. Why the coy act?
He’s supposed to be No Drama Obama, right? And yet…

… and yet, if the other side wants to take themselves out of the game by making themselves look like a bunch of fine tuned crazies, don’t do anything to discourage those thoughts!

90 jamesfirecat  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 7:07:47pm

re: #72 tradewind

The stimulus is a huge bust.
And hairs’ breadths don’t really count in health care, thank heavens. The last one… OMG, can’t quit laughing. ’ EPA, take me away’.

Also there’s the fact that he’s repealing the DADT, and I for one don’t consider the Stimulus a huge bust, the hair’s breath away thing I don’t blame on him, but our feckless foolish, and so on and so forth Senators and now in part our Congressmen who should just f**ing past the damn bill already!

Could things have gone better? Of course they could have, but you go to pass legislation with the politicians you have not the politicians you wish you had….

91 windsagio  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 7:07:49pm

re: #86 WindUpBird

- for gross :p

92 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 7:08:17pm

re: #76 tradewind

Personally, I just don’t understand why he didn’t say ’ fine, idiots, here it is’. He’s obviously a US citizen. Why the coy act?
He’s supposed to be No Drama Obama, right? And yet…

Because it’s bad politics for a President to dignify sociopathic racists.

If the TPers demanded Obama take a blood test to prove he’s fully human, would you suggest he did?

93 Lidane  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 7:08:51pm

re: #76 tradewind

Personally, I just don’t understand why he didn’t say ’ fine, idiots, here it is’.

Because it doesn’t matter what he says or doesn’t say. They produced his birth certificate and these imbeciles still found it lacking.

It’s not about the birth certificate. It’s about these idiots refusing to accept the fact that a black man with an African name won the last election. That’s all. There’s no “coy act” here. It’s just the overt racism of a few nutjobs who can’t let the 2008 election go.

94 jamesfirecat  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 7:09:14pm

re: #76 tradewind

Personally, I just don’t understand why he didn’t say ’ fine, idiots, here it is’. He’s obviously a US citizen. Why the coy act?
He’s supposed to be No Drama Obama, right? And yet…

Do you know the process involved? Obama can not legally ask to be given his “actual” long form birth certificit, it needs to stay in the hospital.

95 cliffster  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 7:10:08pm

re: #93 Lidane

Yep, this is the first time in history people have been pissed about the guy that got elected President and acted weird about it. It’s all racism.

96 Decatur Deb  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 7:10:47pm

re: #76 tradewind

I like messing with you, I’ll miss you if you go down the birther path.

97 tradewind  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 7:10:52pm

re: #89 SteveC
That was my thought for the first several months. But it’s been a year, and there’s really no mileage left in it. On the other hand, he really doesn’t have a deep bag of tricks left.
I am afraid that this administration is all campaign mode, all the time. Much like a dog chasing a car…. they caught it….now what do they do?

98 jamesfirecat  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 7:11:05pm

re: #81 marjoriemoon

I didn’t say that quite right… I meant there seems to be a wider margin of Republicans that do NOT like him than there are Dems who do not like him.

Not to mention lets see the last time a Republican Senator seemed to be getting the screws put to him by republicans who were even farther right and seemed to have no hope of winning a primary without loosing the general election, that’d be Arlan Specter wasn’t it?

99 tradewind  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 7:11:23pm

re: #94 jamesfirecat
Oh, stop.!

100 windsagio  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 7:11:24pm

re: #95 cliffster

you just did it again :p

Are you actually trying to argue that there’s no racism in the teaparty’s hate of Obama?

I wish you luck with that!

101 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 7:12:23pm

re: #88 windsagio

re: #84 WindUpBird

I think what you guys are butting up against here is that people take their role on this blog as ‘defend the right’, not ‘engage in discussion’.

Theres not really much give and take possible in that situation.

Bolded for the ugly truth!

I don’t understand it. I don’t defend the harsh and crazy left. Why would I defend quackery, Andrea Dworkin-style feminists, and revisionist historians?

I guess I just don’t feel like I need to belong to a movement. I don’t feel kinship with liberals because they’re liberals. I wildly, violently disagree with many liberal canards and liberal tribalism. (I’d rather walk than drive a Prius, for example!). I don’t implicitly trust politicians or identify with them as father figures. They’re bureaucrats. They’re machinery we select to run government. Or sabotage government, if you’re all ClubForGrowthy. ;-)

102 tradewind  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 7:12:35pm

re: #96 Decatur Deb
I was a C-section baby, no risk of that.
Birther path? That tramp steamer has sailed.
If no one had paid any attention to it in the first place, it would still be unheard of.

103 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 7:13:05pm

re: #95 cliffster

Yep, this is the first time in history people have been pissed about the guy that got elected President and acted weird about it. It’s all racism.

So I’m imagining all those people who say he’s Kenyan.

104 Lidane  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 7:13:33pm

re: #95 cliffster

Don’t put words in my mouth, thanks.

I never said that all of President Obama’s critics are racists. I never even implied it. I said that for these birther morons, it’s not about the birth certificate at all. It’s about their inability to let the 2008 election go, and about their overt racism.

105 jamesfirecat  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 7:13:46pm

re: #99 tradewind

Oh, stop.!

Hey you want to know why I like Obama, I’ve told you my answer.

106 wee fury  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 7:14:43pm

re: #94 jamesfirecat

Do you know the process involved? Obama can not legally ask to be given his “actual” long form birth certificit, it needs to stay in the hospital.

State.[Link: www.factcheck.org…]

107 windsagio  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 7:14:46pm

re: #103 WindUpBird

hey now thats a legit question!

Would you want a Kenyan Muslim to run our country?

/I love that because its combining multiple KINDS of prejudice with multiple kinds of lies >>

108 doubter4444  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 7:15:54pm

re: #70 Decatur Deb

He’s saving that for the Hoboken town hall.

Having lived in Hoboken, I’m getting a kick out of that comment
(Farkism)

109 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 7:16:02pm

Dignifying psychos by giving in to their demands encourages more psychos.

There’s just no other way around it.

110 Stanley Sea  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 7:16:12pm

re: #106 wee fury

State.[Link: www.factcheck.org…]

I upding you, but regret that on an intelligent blog such as LGF you had to post that link.

111 PT Barnum  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 7:16:13pm

re: #104 Lidane

Don’t put words in my mouth, thanks.

I never said that all of President Obama’s critics are racists. I never even implied it. I said that for these birther morons, it’s not about the birth certificate at all. It’s about their inability to let the 2008 election go, and about their overt racism.

I suspect that if Hillary had won they would have tried to resurrect Vince Foster and Whitewater

112 iceweasel  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 7:16:19pm

re: #88 windsagio

re: #84 WindUpBird

I think what you guys are butting up against here is that people take their role on this blog as ‘defend the right’, not ‘engage in discussion’.

Theres not really much give and take possible in that situation.

Believe me, I’ve noticed that. They’re not only the Party of No, they’re also the party of “My guy right or wrong—so long as he’s on the right, not the left”.
Doesn’t matter what kind of scumbag we’re talking about either. Automatic defense of him and then sideline chanting of Let’s talk about Ayers! Or Code Pink! Or Jeremiah Wright!

113 Jimmah  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 7:16:36pm

Tackhead, getting funky and presidential :

Youtube Video
114 cliffster  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 7:16:52pm

re: #104 Lidane

Don’t put words in my mouth, thanks.

I never said that all of President Obama’s critics are racists. I never even implied it. I said that for these birther morons, it’s not about the birth certificate at all. It’s about their inability to let the 2008 election go, and about their overt racism.

You’re right, they can’t let the 2008 election go.

115 tradewind  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 7:16:58pm

re: #105 jamesfirecat

Can’t you give me a more credible reason, like that he’s won the Nobel, or he has a knack for bringing people from different walks of life together over a beer?//

116 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 7:17:18pm

re: #112 iceweasel

Believe me, I’ve noticed that. They’re not only the Party of No, they’re also the party of “My guy right or wrong—so long as he’s on the right, not the left”.
Doesn’t matter what kind of scumbag we’re talking about either. Automatic defense of him and then sideline chanting of Let’s talk about Ayers! Or Code Pink! Or Jeremiah Wright!

AYERS AYERS AYERS

ROBBLE ROBBLE ROBBLE

117 goddamnedfrank  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 7:17:46pm

re: #76 tradewind

Personally, I just don’t understand why he didn’t say ’ fine, idiots, here it is’. He’s obviously a US citizen. Why the coy act?
He’s supposed to be No Drama Obama, right? And yet…

Personally, I couldn’t care less about what you are incapable of understanding.

118 windsagio  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 7:17:55pm

re: #115 tradewind

No reason someone gives to like Obama, because there’s simply no valid reason to like Obama!

119 jamesfirecat  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 7:18:16pm

re: #116 WindUpBird

AYERS AYERS AYERS

ROBBLE ROBBLE ROBBLE

That was two threads ago, contemperize man!

120 doubter4444  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 7:18:22pm

re: #76 tradewind

Personally, I just don’t understand why he didn’t say ’ fine, idiots, here it is’. He’s obviously a US citizen. Why the coy act?
He’s supposed to be No Drama Obama, right? And yet…

But that would not stop them, and why should he, when he DID.
If you don’t like the short form, fine, but it’s the legit thing, that’s honestly, the whole f#$%ing point.
HE DID PRODUCE IT.

121 windsagio  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 7:18:31pm

re: #118 windsagio

No reason someone gives to like Obama is valid, because there’s simply no valid reason to like Obama!

PIMF

122 jamesfirecat  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 7:18:38pm

re: #115 tradewind

Can’t you give me a more credible reason, like that he’s won the Nobel, or he has a knack for bringing people from different walks of life together over a beer?//

How about we agree that conservatives and liberals are likely to want different things out of our leaders?

123 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 7:18:52pm

re: #115 tradewind

Can’t you give me a more credible reason, like that he’s won the Nobel, or he has a knack for bringing people from different walks of life together over a beer?//

I like him because he’s trying to implement policies I approve of!

That’s why I vote for politicians. because I believe they will implement policies I want, and govern in ways I like. Simple, really.

124 Lidane  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 7:18:53pm

re: #111 PT Barnum

I suspect that if Hillary had won they would have tried to resurrect Vince Foster and Whitewater

Pfft. They would have done that during the election. It’s why Limbaugh and the other talking heads had such a hard-on for getting Hillary nominated. Lewinsky, Whitewater, Vince Foster, etc. — all of it would have been front and center if she’d been the nominee, and it would’ve gotten worse had she won.

125 windsagio  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 7:19:36pm

So is it a popular conservative meme that ‘everyone on the left hates Obama now too’?

I’ve been picking up alot of that lately.

126 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 7:19:49pm

re: #122 jamesfirecat

How about we agree that conservatives and liberals are likely to want different things out of our leaders?

seems pretty rational to me!

127 jamesfirecat  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 7:20:12pm

re: #124 Lidane

Pfft. They would have done that during the election. It’s why Limbaugh and the other talking heads had such a hard-on for getting Hillary nominated. Lewinsky, Whitewater, Vince Foster, etc. — all of it would have been front and center if she’d been the nominee, and it would’ve gotten worse had she won.

Damn it, how could they make “Lewinsky” front and center if it was Hilary who was running for president?

Are they going to suggest it was really a threesome?

128 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 7:20:18pm

re: #125 windsagio

So is it a popular conservative meme that ‘everyone on the left hates Obama now too’?

I’ve been picking up alot of that lately.

yeah.

It’s called a “lie”.

129 iceweasel  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 7:20:49pm

re: #116 WindUpBird

AYERS AYERS AYERS

ROBBLE ROBBLE ROBBLE

Haha— you’re cracking me up tonight!

CODE PINK BLARGH GAH HURRRRR AYERS AYERS GRAWR ROBBLE ROBBLE DWORKIN RHUBARB RHUBARB AL GORE GAAAAAAH

130 tradewind  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 7:21:15pm

re: #122 jamesfirecat
I don’t understand why we can’t just stick to the general job description as stated. It’s a big enough job as is.

131 PT Barnum  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 7:21:19pm

re: #124 Lidane

Pfft. They would have done that during the election. It’s why Limbaugh and the other talking heads had such a hard-on for getting Hillary nominated. Lewinsky, Whitewater, Vince Foster, etc. — all of it would have been front and center if she’d been the nominee, and it would’ve gotten worse had she won.

Bingo…it will never be about policy with these people, because they don’t understand policy, just fear.

132 Dark_Falcon  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 7:22:03pm

re: #116 WindUpBird

AYERS AYERS AYERS

ROBBLE ROBBLE ROBBLE

So Farah is the Hamburgler? That means that Pam Geller is Birdie and Obama himself is Mayor McCheese.

//

133 SteveC  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 7:22:10pm

re: #129 iceweasel

Haha— you’re cracking me up tonight!

CODE PINK BLARGH GAH HURRR AYERS AYERS GRAWR ROBBLE ROBBLE DWORKIN RHUBARB RHUBARB AL GORE GAAAH

*Passes iceweasel a cough drop*

134 windsagio  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 7:22:14pm

re: #128 WindUpBird

Hey now, in fairness the far left really doesn’t like him. Maybe they and the ‘baggers can get together and push for impeachment!

135 Political Atheist  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 7:22:28pm

re: #128 WindUpBird

Where could that impresiion have come from? Could it be? Really?

136 cliffster  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 7:22:28pm

re: #129 iceweasel

Haha— you’re cracking me up tonight!

CODE PINK BLARGH GAH HURRR AYERS AYERS GRAWR ROBBLE ROBBLE DWORKIN RHUBARB RHUBARB AL GORE GAAAH

$1.4 trillion annual deficit. grawr robble robble

137 iceweasel  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 7:22:36pm

re: #125 windsagio

So is it a popular conservative meme that ‘everyone on the left hates Obama now too’?

I’ve been picking up alot of that lately.

They been citing Rasmussen polls and reading their tea leaves bags and claiming everyone has regrets about voting for him and he’ll never win in 2012, never never precious, since the last week of January 2009.

138 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 7:22:37pm

re: #129 iceweasel

Haha— you’re cracking me up tonight!

CODE PINK BLARGH GAH HURRR AYERS AYERS GRAWR ROBBLE ROBBLE DWORKIN RHUBARB RHUBARB AL GORE GAAAH

I’m imagining that said in a voice that sorta sounds like the Tasmanian Devil, with like a dervish of dust being kicked up around it :D

139 jamesfirecat  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 7:22:50pm

re: #128 WindUpBird

yeah.

It’s called a “lie”.

Plus the two have different views of their parties.

I brought this up before but let me lay it out again.

For the most part the right seems to be about keeping things the way they are, conserving what we already have.

Liberals are about trying to change things, trying to move forward towards some destination.

The problem is that its a lot easier to agree on how to keep things the same then to “what destination” we as a country should be going, which is why liberals are inherently more fractious then conservatives.

Just my own personal theory…

140 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 7:23:05pm

re: #134 windsagio

Hey now, in fairness the far left really doesn’t like him. Maybe they and the ‘baggers can get together and push for impeachment!

yes! But the far left is different than ‘the left”. The far left doesn’t like anything :D

141 jamesfirecat  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 7:23:23pm

re: #130 tradewind

I don’t understand why we can’t just stick to the general job description as stated. It’s a big enough job as is.

Then what is that job description and how has Obama been screwing it up?

142 Political Atheist  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 7:23:36pm

re: #135 Rightwingconspirator

Where could that impresiion have come from? Could it be? Really?

It IS

Mr Paul Krugman himself…

Not a lie. Perhaps an exaggeration.

143 iceweasel  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 7:23:59pm

re: #136 cliffster

$1.4 trillion annual deficit. grawr robble robble

Yeah, freetoken already set you straight on that here.

144 tradewind  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 7:24:26pm

Why worry about how the president will handle the threat of a nuclear Iran, or radical Islamists who have promised another attack in the near future, when birther nuts and tea party extremists roam the nation unchecked?//

145 Dancing along the light of day  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 7:24:36pm

re: #37 iceweasel

LOL!
You’re GOOD, when you’re a tad crabby!

146 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 7:24:46pm

re: #142 Rightwingconspirator

It IS

Mr Paul Krugman himself…

Not a lie. Perhaps an exaggeration.

I like paul krugman! But I also like things like data and polls. And the data and polls don’t bear out the idea that “the left” hates Obama.

he ran as a moderate Dem. he governs…as a moderate Dem. He’s the politician I was sold, and he’s delivering as best he can.

147 cliffster  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 7:24:54pm

re: #143 iceweasel

Yeah, freetoken already set you straight on that here.

is “set you straight” what is meant by not answering followup questions?

148 windsagio  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 7:25:14pm

re: #144 tradewind

uh oh! The crowd’s unfriendly! Better roll out the threat of radical islam!

After all, it always worked for Bush!

149 PT Barnum  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 7:25:16pm

re: #144 tradewind

Why worry about how the president will handle the threat of a nuclear Iran, or radical Islamists who have promised another attack in the near future, when birther nuts and tea party extremists roam the nation unchecked// unmedicatd?

FTFY

150 Obdicut  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 7:25:24pm

re: #144 tradewind

Dude, if Charles posting about the birthers bothers you so much, maybe just don’t post in the threads about birthers?

151 windsagio  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 7:25:36pm

re: #148 windsagio

damn, I broke my own rules by mentioning Bush.

/flogs self.

152 Cato the Elder  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 7:25:38pm

re: #79 iceweasel

I’d like to see it all on Youtube as a blazing saddles recreation.
The President is a-near!
What’d he say?
and
“Scuse me while I whip this out” before producing the birth certificate.

I hope and pray he’s playin’ ‘em.

Convention 2012: “And for those who question my parentage and nationality, I have but one thing to say: Suck. On. This.”

[waves birth certificate, passes out notarized copies, and watches, laughing, as Pam Geller dies of an alcoholic aneurysm]

153 Dark_Falcon  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 7:25:39pm

re: #129 iceweasel

Haha— you’re cracking me up tonight!

CODE PINK BLARGH GAH HURRR AYERS AYERS GRAWR ROBBLE ROBBLE DWORKIN RHUBARB RHUBARB AL GORE GAAAH

OLIGHARY!!!!1111

154 doubter4444  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 7:26:00pm

re: #87 cliffster

And it’s about as GOP as New York City. I hope democrats keep trying to push the Republicans-are-racists strategy, though.

Wow. I’ve seen your posts, but that’s just not the case.
I’ll say it again, there is plenty of racism to go around from both sides, some overt, some more subtle.
To say that the GOP itself does not condone racism is TRUE.
The organization does not, but plenty of people in it do, including leaders.
So you claiming a rhetorical point, or are you really saying that the GOP is vastly less racist than the Dems?
Because that’s just not the case.

155 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 7:26:07pm

re: #144 tradewind

Why worry about how the president will handle the threat of a nuclear Iran, or radical Islamists who have promised another attack in the near future, when birther nuts and tea party extremists roam the nation unchecked?//

Don’t complain to us if you have a problem with the blog’s coverage. We just comment on the posts!

156 TedStriker  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 7:26:11pm

re: #44 SteveC

Medicated very well be the way for you to go through life, Joseph.

Nah, it should be:

“Fat, drunk, and stupid is no way to go through life, son.” - Dean Wormer

;-P

157 cliffster  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 7:26:15pm

re: #150 Obdicut

Dude, if Charles posting about the birthers bothers you so much, maybe just don’t post in the threads about birthers?

There you go again with your don’t disagree with Charles stuff.

158 tradewind  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 7:26:17pm

re: #146 WindUpBird

I like paul krugman!

….well, there’s no accounting for taste.//

159 SanFranciscoZionist  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 7:26:22pm

re: #12 TampaKnight

So I’ll never vote Democrat, but I don’t wanna vote for any GOP’er who supports these idiots.

What do I do?

Choose wisely.

160 PT Barnum  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 7:26:33pm

re: #149 PT Barnum

FTFY

unmedicated

PIMF

161 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 7:26:35pm

re: #151 windsagio

damn, I broke my own rules by mentioning Bush.

/flogs self.

EVERYTHING ZEN
EVERYTHING ZEN

I DON’T THINK SO

*feedback guitars*

162 What, me worry?  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 7:26:39pm

re: #139 jamesfirecat

Plus the two have different views of their parties.

I brought this up before but let me lay it out again.

For the most part the right seems to be about keeping things the way they are, conserving what we already have.

Liberals are about trying to change things, trying to move forward towards some destination.

The problem is that its a lot easier to agree on how to keep things the same then to “what destination” we as a country should be going, which is why liberals are inherently more fractious then conservatives.

Just my own personal theory…

I think most people want basically the same thing. Good jobs, place to live, good schools, less government spending and less government intrusion in our lives. Specifically there are things we argue about, but I think when we have more centrists/moderates in power, we have more contented people. Why Crist’s ratings were high.

163 Our Precious Bodily Fluids  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 7:26:39pm

re: #129 iceweasel

you forgot:

THEY TUK ‘R JERBS!

South Park Video
164 Stanley Sea  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 7:26:52pm

re: #142 Rightwingconspirator

It IS

Mr Paul Krugman himself…

Not a lie. Perhaps an exaggeration.

And from Paul Krugman again:

…the sudden outbreak of deficit hysteria brings back memories of the groupthink that took hold during the run-up to the Iraq war. Now, as then, dubious allegations, not backed by hard evidence, are being reported as if they have been established beyond a shadow of a doubt. Now, as then, much of the political and media establishments have bought into the notion that we must take drastic action quickly, even though there hasn’t been any new information to justify this sudden urgency. Now, as then, those who challenge the prevailing narrative, no matter how strong their case and no matter how solid their background, are being marginalized.

And fear-mongering on the deficit may end up doing as much harm as the fear-mongering on weapons of mass destruction.

Krugman today

165 cliffster  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 7:27:08pm

re: #154 doubter4444

Wow. I’ve seen your posts, but that’s just not the case.
I’ll say it again, there is plenty of racism to go around from both sides, some overt, some more subtle.
To say that the GOP itself does not condone racism is TRUE.
The organization does not, but plenty of people in it do, including leaders.
So you claiming a rhetorical point, or are you really saying that the GOP is vastly less racist than the Dems?
Because that’s just not the case.

Obama carried Missouri in 2008. Need I say more?

166 Cato the Elder  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 7:27:15pm

re: #87 cliffster

And it’s about as GOP as New York City. I hope democrats keep trying to push the Republicans-are-racists strategy, though.

Right. The golf-club set has never been racist.

Tell that to the Jews who founded my high school in 1910 because they couldn’t get into the tony GOP private schools.

Tard.

167 doubter4444  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 7:27:21pm

re: #99 tradewind

Oh, stop.!

LOL.
Kids

168 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 7:27:33pm

re: #158 tradewind

…well, there’s no accounting for taste.//

I’m a Keynesian! Don’t worry, we don’t carry disease.

169 SanFranciscoZionist  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 7:27:33pm

re: #20 darthstar

And I’d like to see President Obama say “I’ve got your birth certificate right here…” and grab his package. Of course, he has more class than that, but still it would be fun to see.

I imagine he’s thought of that once or twice.

170 Political Atheist  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 7:27:54pm

re: #146 WindUpBird

Well the point being (after getting my ear bent by a liberal friend of mine) that Obama truly sucks. So by my local impression, Obama is well reviled by thje fringe on both sides of the tribal equation. It would be easy to link lots of unhappy left of center articles.

171 windsagio  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 7:27:59pm

re: #165 cliffster

A dead mule could have beaten McCain/Palin, and would have done better than Obama in some states :p

172 Obdicut  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 7:28:02pm

re: #157 cliffster

I’m not saying don’t disagree with Charles, Cliffster. I’m saying that given that the topic of the thread is birthers, if that’s a subject that he thinks is uninteresting, maybe just not posting in the thread and driving it off course is the best course of action.

How do you interpret his comment about the President, Iran, and the birthers?

173 tradewind  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 7:29:06pm

re: #150 Obdicut
It’s not Charles’ posting about them at all that I am talking about… he usually has some interesting article attached, or there’s news involved. Besides, he runs the place, and doesn’t need any help.
It’s the amount of terror they strike in the hearts of some people here who predict they are Taking Over.
Just saying.

174 jamesfirecat  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 7:29:21pm

re: #162 marjoriemoon

I think most people want basically the same thing. Good jobs, place to live, good schools, less government spending and less government intrusion in our lives. Specifically there are things we argue about, but I think when we have more centrists/moderates in power, we have more contented people. Why Crist’s ratings were high.

Then why don’t we get rid of medicade and social security! Then we’d have less government spending and less government intrusion in our lives so people should love the idea, right?

/

175 MandyManners  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 7:30:10pm

Just listen.


Youtube Video
176 Cato the Elder  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 7:30:16pm

re: #157 cliffster

There you go again with your don’t disagree with Charles stuff.

There you go again with your fucking Reagan impressions.

177 Obdicut  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 7:30:49pm

re: #173 tradewind


It’s the amount of terror they strike in the hearts of some people here who predict they are Taking Over.
Just saying.


You mean like people who say, in response to this, “The inmates are taking over the asylum?”

178 Political Atheist  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 7:30:53pm

re: #164 Stanley Sea

And he wanted 3x the stimulus spending. With zero explanation of how to pay it. Or where to get it. The money supply has tripled since 2001. Instead of cutting spending or raising revenues, its all about the printing press.

179 PT Barnum  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 7:31:06pm

re: #176 Cato the Elder

There you go again with your fucking Reagan impressions.

Isn’t that interesting..we were talking about necrophilia earlier…

180 tradewind  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 7:31:08pm

re: #175 MandyManners
Dr King would not be a happy camper, seeing and hearing some of what is done in his name.

181 cliffster  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 7:31:11pm

re: #171 windsagio

A dead mule could have beaten McCain/Palin, and would have done better than Obama in some states :p

Are you saying that Obama got elected despite having no qualifications? Because the dead mule line really sounds like that..

182 tradewind  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 7:31:44pm

re: #177 Obdicut
Mandy….. what’s that expression?

183 cliffster  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 7:32:01pm

re: #172 Obdicut

I interpret it as “this is really not that important”. I don’t have a problem with that position. Do you?

184 Lidane  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 7:32:06pm

re: #171 windsagio

A dead mule could have beaten McCain/Palin, and would have done better than Obama in some states :p

And all that dead mule would’ve had to do is run two ads— one in the red states saying that he dropped dead trying to pay his taxes, and the other in the blue states saying that he died due to a lack of health care and Republican neglect.

Heh.

185 windsagio  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 7:32:11pm

re: #181 cliffster

No, I’m saying that there are alot of racists in the country, and not just in the south :p

Also, I’m saying everyone hated Bush so bad that it was hard for the Dems to lose.

186 Obdicut  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 7:33:03pm

re: #183 cliffster

Okay. Am I really off-base her to think that it’s rude to come into a thread to simply say that the subject matter of the post is really not a big deal?

187 Dark_Falcon  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 7:33:06pm

re: #165 cliffster

Obama carried Missouri in 2008. Need I say more?

No, he didn’t. John McCain won Missouri. It took several days for the state to be decided, and Obama had already secured the needed electoral votes elsewhere.

188 PT Barnum  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 7:33:33pm

re: #181 cliffster

Are you saying that Obama got elected despite having no qualifications? Because the dead mule line really sounds like that..

No not at all..it’s more like in some places voting for a black man is less preferable to having a dead mule in office.

189 jamesfirecat  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 7:34:08pm

re: #187 Dark_Falcon

No, he didn’t. John McCain won Missouri. It took several days for the state to be decided, and Obama had already secured the needed electoral votes elsewhere.

I’ll be deep in the cold cold ground before I recognize Missouri!

190 SanFranciscoZionist  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 7:34:14pm

re: #125 windsagio

So is it a popular conservative meme that ‘everyone on the left hates Obama now too’?

I’ve been picking up alot of that lately.

Yes. It is.

191 SanFranciscoZionist  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 7:34:37pm

re: #128 WindUpBird

yeah.

It’s called a “lie”.

Oh, I’d say ‘wishful thinking’.

192 PT Barnum  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 7:34:46pm

re: #189 jamesfirecat

I’ll be deep in the cold cold ground before I recognize Missouri!

It’s pronounced misery

194 cliffster  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 7:34:57pm

re: #187 Dark_Falcon

No, he didn’t. John McCain won Missouri. It took several days for the state to be decided, and Obama had already secured the needed electoral votes elsewhere.

Really? I saw the state chalked up as blue in the morning-after report.

195 Political Atheist  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 7:35:11pm

re: #190 SanFranciscoZionist

There was quite an outcry from the left when he backed off the public option.

196 jamesfirecat  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 7:35:39pm

re: #192 PT Barnum

It’s pronounced misery

Well it was “Mis-ur-ah” as Abe Simpson said it.

197 SanFranciscoZionist  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 7:36:00pm

re: #144 tradewind

Why worry about how the president will handle the threat of a nuclear Iran, or radical Islamists who have promised another attack in the near future, when birther nuts and tea party extremists roam the nation unchecked?//

I can manage to worry about the one and groan at the other simultaneously.

198 doubter4444  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 7:36:00pm

re: #165 cliffster

Obama carried Missouri in 2008. Need I say more?

I think so because I don’t get your point.
But I’m thick, particularly on a Friday evening

199 PT Barnum  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 7:36:18pm

re: #196 jamesfirecat

Well it was “Mis-ur-ah” as Abe Simpson said it.

My mom and both my sisters live there….believe me..it’s misery

200 jamesfirecat  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 7:36:21pm

re: #195 Rightwingconspirator

There was quite an outcry from the left when he backed off the public option.

I think there’s a difference between “don’t like what he’s doing” and “won’t vote for him again”

201 Decatur Deb  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 7:36:39pm

re: #170 Rightwingconspirator

Well the point being (after getting my ear bent by a liberal friend of mine) that Obama truly sucks. So by my local impression, Obama is well reviled by thje fringe on both sides of the tribal equation. It would be easy to link lots of unhappy left of center articles.

I’m left and somewhat unhappy. But I’ll always vote for someone who supports my intentions 60% of the time over someone who ticks me off 90% percent of the time. You know, like a sane person.

202 cliffster  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 7:36:40pm

re: #186 Obdicut

Okay. Am I really off-base her to think that it’s rude to come into a thread to simply say that the subject matter of the post is really not a big deal?

Off-base is your choice of words. I don’t see a problem saying that a big deal is being made of something that’s not a big deal.

203 MandyManners  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 7:36:47pm

re: #189 jamesfirecat

I’ll be deep in the cold cold ground before I recognize Missouri!

LALALALALALA

I CAN’T HEAAARRRE YOU.

204 Political Atheist  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 7:36:48pm

re: #190 SanFranciscoZionist

And backed up on Gitmo, and then numerous odious Bush policies.

205 Racer X  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 7:37:10pm

Cafferty on Pelosi

Youtube Video
206 Political Atheist  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 7:37:31pm

re: #201 Decatur Deb

Sure, Makes sense to me too.

207 Charles Johnson  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 7:37:37pm

Dave Weigel is at the TeaBagCon, and just tweeted that Farah received a standing ovation for his Birther speech.

208 cliffster  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 7:37:38pm

I will say that this Friday’s thread is a shitload more active than the last friday night thread I was on.

209 Cato the Elder  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 7:37:52pm

At this point I would vote for a blind, syphilitic, raddled, rickets-ridden, Jihadist Muslim camel over anyone waving the banner of Teabaggerdom.

210 Our Precious Bodily Fluids  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 7:37:55pm

re: #157 cliffster

There you go again with your don’t disagree with Charles stuff.

In this post, I disagree with Charles and in fact disagree with every single person who posts on LGF, and moreover I even more venomously disagree with those who merely lurk but don’t feel compelled to post. Just for the duration of this post, I hate everything that Charles Johnson likes. I hate Apple products, I hate bicycling, and most of all I hate rationality. Hate hate hate! In this post, I reveal that I have a tattoo of Ayman al Zawahiri on my left butt-cheek, and a tattoo of Adam Gadahn on the right. (In the middle, Lady GaGa is depicted mid-sentence yammering about her pOker-face).

But anyway, let me get back to saying that YES, right at this moment I think nearly all of Charles’ opinions (even those pertaining to such things as favorite foods and preferred style of underpants) are unconscionably WRONG.

Let the harsh consequences rain down upon me! I demand to suffer in proportion to this sin. Internet is serious business!

211 windsagio  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 7:37:56pm

re: #204 Rightwingconspirator

I call that ‘getting your ass kicked by Reality’. One of the problems with the left is the starry eyed idealism that doesn’t give a fig for reality :p

212 PT Barnum  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 7:38:11pm

re: #201 Decatur Deb

I’m left and somewhat unhappy. But I’ll always vote for someone who supports my intentions 60% of the time over someone who ticks me off 90% percent of the time. You know, like a sane person.

I just wanted someone pragmatic. Obama has proved to be as such. I’d like to see him show more fire, but I’m not sure that is in his temperament.

213 Racer X  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 7:38:58pm

re: #208 cliffster

I will say that this Friday’s thread is a shitload more active than the last friday night thread I was on.

It’s Friday?!?

Sonofabitch! I gotta stop start drinkin.

214 SanFranciscoZionist  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 7:39:16pm

re: #165 cliffster

Obama carried Missouri in 2008. Need I say more?

Probably.

215 jamesfirecat  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 7:39:39pm

re: #210 negativ

Is this a Flounce…. I can’t tell ….

216 cliffster  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 7:39:50pm

re: #210 negativ

How on earth can you disagree with everyone who posts on LGF when there are so many opposing opinions?

217 jamesfirecat  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 7:40:14pm

re: #212 PT Barnum

I just wanted someone pragmatic. Obama has proved to be as such. I’d like to see him show more fire, but I’m not sure that is in his temperament.

Yes, when will Barack become “The Rock”?

218 Decatur Deb  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 7:40:16pm

re: #209 Cato the Elder

At this point I would vote for a blind, syphilitic, raddled, rickets-ridden, Jihadist Muslim camel over anyone waving the banner of Teabaggerdom.

Especially if they run a good “Demon Camel” ad.

219 windsagio  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 7:40:38pm

re: #216 cliffster

oh c’mon, does he really need to tag it?

“The internet is serious business!” indeed!

220 palomino  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 7:40:42pm

Maybe there are some differences between the tea partiers and the bulk of the GOP. But neither group seems that interested in distancing itself from the other.

ALL of the tea party heroes are republicans—Bachmann, Palin, Demint, Armey, Joe Wilson, Tancredo—and no one’s suggesting these aren’t mainstream republicans.

Conversely ALL of the tea party villains are Dems (ObamaPelosiReid). Or RINOs, whose biggest sin is that they occasionally vote with Dems (eg, Snowe and Specter before his “conversion”)

221 PT Barnum  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 7:40:45pm

well the family is dragging me down to the pool at the hotel we’re staying in.

Have a great night folks

222 TedStriker  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 7:40:53pm

re: #213 Racer X

It’s Friday?!?

Sonofabitch! I gotta stop start drinkin.

Steve McCroskey: Looks like I picked the wrong week to quit sniffing glue.

223 Political Atheist  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 7:41:00pm

re: #200 jamesfirecat

Of course. Besides that’s 3 years away.
My point is that the “meme” even in its terribly overused context here has more than a kernel of truth. The concept that the left is quite unhappy with Obama now is hardly a right wing invention. As the Dems will exaggerate and or exploit far right wing racism, the right will exaggerate left wing dissatisfaction.

Its the MEME wars!

224 SanFranciscoZionist  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 7:41:11pm

re: #170 Rightwingconspirator

Well the point being (after getting my ear bent by a liberal friend of mine) that Obama truly sucks. So by my local impression, Obama is well reviled by thje fringe on both sides of the tribal equation. It would be easy to link lots of unhappy left of center articles.

We’re a year in.

The economy sucks.

Obama would have to actually BE Moshiach not to have people crabby at this point.

Not to mention the fact that the fringe-left discovered he wasn’t really going to end the wars overnight.

I don’t think the drop in his numbers, or crankiness by liberals you know personally means much more than that. Is it real? Sure. Is it Deeply Significant? No, not really.

225 Political Atheist  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 7:41:46pm

re: #210 negativ

Bait much?

226 SanFranciscoZionist  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 7:41:56pm

re: #174 jamesfirecat

Then why don’t we get rid of medicade and social security! Then we’d have less government spending and less government intrusion in our lives so people should love the idea, right?

/

There are some folks here who would go for that. Just warning you.

227 Our Precious Bodily Fluids  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 7:42:10pm

re: #175 MandyManners

I have a real hard time wrapping my mind around the fact that he constructed and delivered that speech when he was a few years younger than I am now. I couldn’t be that eloquent right now if my life depended on it.

228 cliffster  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 7:42:40pm

re: #214 SanFranciscoZionist

Probably.

Actually DF called me out - GOP in retrospect won Missouri.

229 Dark_Falcon  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 7:42:50pm

re: #194 cliffster

Really? I saw the state chalked up as blue in the morning-after report.

The final returns were for McCain. Like I said, it took several days to sort it out.

230 Kruk  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 7:42:54pm

re: #23 darthstar

It’ll be the first convention in history where nobody gets laidgot laid in their lives.

FTFY. There’s some serious frustration going on with these folks.

231 Decatur Deb  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 7:42:56pm

re: #210 negativ

In this post, I disagree with Charles and in fact disagree with every single person who posts on LGF, and moreover I even more venomously disagree with those who merely lurk but don’t feel compelled to post. Just for the duration of this post, I hate everything that Charles Johnson likes. I hate Apple products, I hate bicycling, and most of all I hate rationality. Hate hate hate! In this post, I reveal that I have a tattoo of Ayman al Zawahiri on my left butt-cheek, and a tattoo of Adam Gadahn on the right. (In the middle, Lady GaGa is depicted mid-sentence yammering about her pOker-face).

But anyway, let me get back to saying that YES, right at this moment I think nearly all of Charles’ opinions (even those pertaining to such things as favorite foods and preferred style of underpants) are unconscionably WRONG.

Let the harsh consequences rain down upon me! I demand to suffer in proportion to this sin. Internet is serious business!

Let me guess. You’re wearing a hood and black calf-length socks.

232 jamesfirecat  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 7:43:16pm

re: #223 Rightwingconspirator

Of course. Besides that’s 3 years away.
My point is that the “meme” even in its terribly overused context here has more than a kernel of truth. The concept that the left is quite unhappy with Obama now is hardly a right wing invention. As the Dems will exaggerate and or exploit far right wing racism, the right will exaggerate left wing dissatisfaction.

Its the MEME wars!

Well the question is, what can the right actually do with this meme?

The Democrats meme strategy goes “if we say they’re racists then moderates won’t vote for them.”

Does the Republican one go

“Maybe if we keep telling the democarts that they hate Obama enough they’ll actually start to hate him?”

The first one makes a lot more sense to me than the second, or is the Republican meme meant to be used as a moral booster among their own troops?

233 Cato the Elder  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 7:43:17pm

Fuck Farah and the faucet he leaked out of.

234 palomino  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 7:43:28pm

re: #144 tradewind

Why worry about how the president will handle the threat of a nuclear Iran, or radical Islamists who have promised another attack in the near future, when birther nuts and tea party extremists roam the nation unchecked?//

Uhh, because the nuts and extremists drive the discourse (and to some extent policy) that emanates from the GOP.

235 cliffster  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 7:43:45pm

re: #229 Dark_Falcon

The final returns were for McCain. Like I said, it took several days to sort it out.

I just went and checked. Not that I disbelieve anything you say, DF. Trust, but verify…

236 windsagio  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 7:44:18pm

re: #232 jamesfirecat

exactly, they keep at it because it makes them feel justified in disliking the guy.

237 cliffster  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 7:44:46pm

re: #233 Cato the Elder

Fuck Farah and the faucet he leaked out of.

Ronald Reagan loves you, and hopes that you are ok.

238 Dark_Falcon  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 7:44:55pm

re: #233 Cato the Elder

Fuck Farah and the faucet he leaked out of.

No thanks. I don’t like to stick my member in scum holes.

239 Cato the Elder  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 7:44:55pm

re: #235 cliffster

Trust, but verify…

A line that Reagan stole from Lenin.

Oh, the irony!

240 SanFranciscoZionist  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 7:45:03pm

re: #181 cliffster

Are you saying that Obama got elected despite having no qualifications? Because the dead mule line really sounds like that..

Answering for myself, I don’t think Obama was the best-qualified candidate the Democrats could have fielded. (OH GOD!!! HILLARRYYYY!!!)

But I think that given how Bush wrapped up his eight years, and given some of the issues with McCain’s campaign, we could have run a potted plant with a sex scandal in its past and a weak foreign policy background, and won.

No insult to McCain. He may not have run a perfect campaign, but he was up against the tide, and he ran with grace.

241 SanFranciscoZionist  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 7:46:05pm

re: #195 Rightwingconspirator

There was quite an outcry from the left when he backed off the public option.

Oh yeah. Not a popular compromise in some circles.

242 Cato the Elder  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 7:46:32pm

re: #240 SanFranciscoZionist

Answering for myself, I don’t think Obama was the best-qualified candidate the Democrats could have fielded. (OH GOD!!! HILLARRYYY!!!)

But I think that given how Bush wrapped up his eight years, and given some of the issues with McCain’s campaign, we could have run a potted plant with a sex scandal in its past and a weak foreign policy background, and won.

No insult to McCain. He may not have run a perfect campaign, but he was up against the tide, and he ran with grace.

No, he ran with Sarah. How do you spell downfall?

243 cliffster  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 7:46:32pm

re: #239 Cato the Elder

A line that Reagan stole from Lenin.

Oh, the irony!

Actually, I was quoting Horatio Crane.

244 windsagio  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 7:46:41pm

re: #239 Cato the Elder

Well, you know… maybe his ‘conversion’ to the right during the HUAC era really was a deep-cover plan…

*gasp*

Reagan was a Trotskyite, and thus didn’t feel bad sacrificing the USSR in order to take the US down in the long run!

245 Political Atheist  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 7:47:00pm

re: #232 jamesfirecat

I would retire the memes if I could. But I think you put rose colored lenses on the Dems strategy. How about this “If we frame them as racists we can cement our majority for a decade”. I’m not sure which is right. As for the right meme, well it could be as harsh as you say.

246 prairiefire  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 7:47:12pm

re: #192 PT Barnum

Hey! I resemble that comment!

247 The Sanity Inspector  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 7:47:55pm

re: #5 tradewind

Okay…
So for the right wingnuts: Obama’s not a real cityzin, and for the leftwing moonbats:
Bush was never legitimately elected prezidint.
Next!

Difference is, the right-wingers aren’t threatening to pursue the highest form of patriotism and move to Canada or the south of France.

248 Cato the Elder  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 7:48:08pm

re: #245 Rightwingconspirator

I would retire the memes if I could. But I think you put rose colored lenses on the Dems strategy. How about this “If we frame them as racists we can cement our majority for a decade”. I’m not sure which is right. As for the right meme, well it could be as harsh as you say.

What need to “frame” anyone when the O’Keefes and Tancredos keep on coming?

249 windsagio  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 7:48:26pm

re: #245 Rightwingconspirator

Theres a line between framing and reality.


Like it or not, the Obama Presidency has uncovered some really strong racist veins in our culture. I’m hoping its the last gasp, but we don’t really know yet.

250 Political Atheist  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 7:48:41pm

re: #248 Cato the Elder

All it takes is the broad brush.

251 Dark_Falcon  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 7:48:52pm

re: #243 cliffster

SMACK!

252 jamesfirecat  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 7:49:21pm

re: #245 Rightwingconspirator

I would retire the memes if I could. But I think you put rose colored lenses on the Dems strategy. How about this “If we frame them as racists we can cement our majority for a decade”. I’m not sure which is right. As for the right meme, well it could be as harsh as you say.

I’m just trying to figure out the inherent logic of why the Republicans would want to spend their time propagating the growth of a meme that wouldn’t seem to really benefit them….

253 iceweasel  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 7:49:31pm

re: #186 Obdicut

Okay. Am I really off-base her to think that it’s rude to come into a thread to simply say that the subject matter of the post is really not a big deal?

Nope. Nor is it offbase to notice that it happens every single time the subject of the post is the teabaggers, or indeed, almost any sign of the growing insanity of the wingnut right.
Every. Time.
I play a little game with myself betting how far we’ll get in before it happens. Sometimes we only make it to the 5th comment.

254 Cato the Elder  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 7:49:44pm

re: #248 Cato the Elder

What need to “frame” anyone when the O’Keefes and Tancredos keep on coming?

Who needs a brush when the GOP keeps spraying itself with a firehose?

255 Political Atheist  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 7:49:55pm

re: #249 windsagio

I hate it, you are correct as it has happened, yet I blame the economy at least as much as the fact of a black President for the severity.

256 cliffster  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 7:50:03pm

re: #251 Dark_Falcon

Ouch!

257 SanFranciscoZionist  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 7:50:11pm

re: #242 Cato the Elder

No, he ran with Sarah. How do you spell downfall?

At least it was entertaining.

And we were gonna end up with President Dendron anyway.

258 Political Atheist  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 7:50:38pm

re: #254 Cato the Elder

Was that the GOP convention or the Tea Bag convention?

259 Political Atheist  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 7:51:08pm

re: #252 jamesfirecat

I have no idea.

260 cliffster  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 7:51:22pm

re: #254 Cato the Elder

Who needs a brush when the GOP keeps spraying itself with a firehose?

Who needs reality when you can cherry-pick who you think represents the opposition?

261 SanFranciscoZionist  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 7:51:29pm

re: #247 The Sanity Inspector

Difference is, the right-wingers aren’t threatening to pursue the highest form of patriotism and move to Canada or the south of France.

Some of them are threatening to secede, though, which I personally think is even less classy.

Number of people I know who actually moved to Canada in eight years of Bush: 1.

He went because he left my college BFF for some woman in Toronto he met on the Internet.

262 Cato the Elder  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 7:51:37pm

re: #258 Rightwingconspirator

Was that the GOP convention or the Tea Bag convention?

The Tea Bag Convention is a preview of the next GOP convention.

They have nowhere else to turn.

263 Decatur Deb  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 7:52:12pm

re: #245 Rightwingconspirator

I would retire the memes if I could. But I think you put rose colored lenses on the Dems strategy. How about this “If we frame them as racists we can cement our majority for a decade”. I’m not sure which is right. As for the right meme, well it could be as harsh as you say.

The loud ones are framing themselves about as well as can be. The Dems problem is to decide how much of the platform to give up to cement a lock-in with Center Indies and the sane Center Repubs.

264 SanFranciscoZionist  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 7:52:21pm

re: #260 cliffster

Who needs reality when you can cherry-pick who you think represents the opposition?

Everyone does that.

265 windsagio  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 7:52:21pm

re: #255 Rightwingconspirator

If ever I say anything is from a single cause, I’m wrong or lying :P

The economy is an albatross around the neck of anyone in power right now. The racism coming up is something entirely different.

266 jamesfirecat  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 7:52:25pm

re: #259 Rightwingconspirator

I have no idea.

That’s the scary thing…. when one side plays dirty and slings mud, that’s politics, when one side starts acting irrationally and can’t even launch proper attack memes, you worry about the internal health of that side…

267 The Sanity Inspector  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 7:52:53pm

re: #144 tradewind

Why worry about how the president will handle the threat of a nuclear Iran, or radical Islamists who have promised another attack in the near future, when birther nuts and tea party extremists roam the nation unchecked?//

Do what a number of other commenters do: link & expound on those issues on the open threads. Or when the regular threads get talked out and meander. So long as you pick reputable sources, there’s no rule against it.

268 SanFranciscoZionist  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 7:53:23pm

re: #262 Cato the Elder

The Tea Bag Convention is a preview of the next GOP convention.

They have nowhere else to turn.

Surely a savior will come from somewhere!

269 windsagio  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 7:53:46pm

re: #261 SanFranciscoZionist

Hey, I talk about having Cascadia secede sometiems, are you saying I’m not classy?


/of course I’m not really serious…

270 tradewind  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 7:54:01pm

re: #247 The Sanity Inspector
Too bad they never followed through in any significant numbers.//

271 cliffster  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 7:54:04pm

re: #264 SanFranciscoZionist

Everyone does that.

Yep. And that’s why most political discussion is mindless drivel.

272 Cato the Elder  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 7:54:38pm

re: #260 cliffster

Who needs reality when you can cherry-pick who you think represents the opposition?

Who need a cherry-picker when the opposition shoves it in your face with a bulldozer?

[really, you gotta stop bein’ my bitch all the time]

273 prairiefire  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 7:55:09pm

re: #270 tradewind

Why keep putting sarc tags after things you really mean?

274 windsagio  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 7:55:10pm

re: #272 Cato the Elder

dude, do you know what it feels like to shoot diet pepsi out your nose?

275 MandyManners  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 7:55:28pm

re: #262 Cato the Elder

The Tea Bag Convention is a preview of the next GOP convention.

They have nowhere else to turn.

Well, we Republicans won’t be hanging on every word.

276 Kruk  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 7:55:28pm

The sheer stupidity of invoking MLK at a convention where another speaker bemoaned the fact Obama wouldn’t have been elected if “we still had literacy tests” does my head in.

277 jamesfirecat  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 7:55:35pm

re: #268 SanFranciscoZionist

Surely a savior will come from somewhere!

RUDY RUDY RUDY!


Youtube Video

Best clip I could find on such short notice…

278 cliffster  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 7:55:39pm

re: #272 Cato the Elder

really, you should set higher standards for yourself

279 Dark_Falcon  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 7:55:52pm

OK, everyong time to stop sniping. I’m not going name names, but there is sniping going on. I have Tempur-Pedic cushions for anyone who needs to ease their butthurt.

280 Dancing along the light of day  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 7:56:04pm

Fox is building an in home studio for Sarah.

[Link: www.nytimes.com…]

281 William Barnett-Lewis  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 7:56:44pm

re: #244 windsagio

Well, you know… maybe his ‘conversion’ to the right during the HUAC era really was a deep-cover plan…

*gasp*

Reagan was a Trotskyite, and thus didn’t feel bad sacrificing the USSR in order to take the US down in the long run!

Oh my…. that is too funny for words. They (Trotskyites that is) were teh weirdest lefties I’ve ever met. They _would_ think that way! Hoot!

William

282 windsagio  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 7:56:50pm

re: #279 Dark_Falcon

now now, don’t play forum-police :P

/I’d call it artillery, anyways. But what do you expect? People are holding indefensible positions >>

283 MandyManners  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 7:56:59pm

re: #277 jamesfirecat

RUDY RUDY RUDY!

[Video]

Best clip I could find on such short notice…

ASSHOLE.

284 [deleted]  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 7:57:02pm
285 windsagio  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 7:57:27pm

re: #284 jerk

good lord, what?

286 Dark_Falcon  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 7:57:31pm

re: #274 windsagio

dude, do you know what it feels like to shoot diet pepsi out your nose?

Yes, I’ve done that. It hurts like the dickens for several minutes.

287 SanFranciscoZionist  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 7:57:35pm

re: #281 wlewisiii

Oh my… that is too funny for words. They (Trotskyites that is) were teh weirdest lefties I’ve ever met. They _would_ think that way! Hoot!

William

The freaking Trots.

288 cliffster  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 7:57:56pm

re: #284 jerk

I would be glad to staple a copy to this guy’s face.

just what we needed - a good dose of wtf

289 The Sanity Inspector  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 7:58:46pm

re: #252 jamesfirecat

I’m just trying to figure out the inherent logic of why the Republicans would want to spend their time propagating the growth of a meme that wouldn’t seem to really benefit them…

There’s your stumbling block, right there. There are passions on the move now, invocations of deeply-revered principles, heightened awareness of shared struggles. Logic, not so much.

290 Summer Seale  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 7:59:15pm

I really don’t think it’s tea that these people have been drinking.

291 keloyd  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 7:59:48pm

I’ve seen pics of the Carter era Democratic convention. IIRC, it was disorganized, as one expects if you study the ways of the hippie. (For the record, I hate the hippie and all his works!) There were splinter groups making a ruckus and dropping huge banners (for teh gheys and feminists); speeches were interrupted with chants by the activists. When you’re out of power and without leadership and direction, it will get very ugly/entertaining.

how do you say it in lolcat “I’s making ruckus in yur convenshun, eating yer cheezburgerz”

292 Political Atheist  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 7:59:48pm

re: #266 jamesfirecat

re: #265 windsagio

Well a lot of this is why I’m indy. All I can say, broadly here, is the right will cast off the crazy. There is a legitimate place for the fiscal conservative. And for the small gov advocate. Geez, I am starting to have real sympathy for my liberal friends who have had the communist party for “allies” on the left. The tea baggers are to the right as the hard core commies are to the left. Symmetry is ugly.

293 Dark_Falcon  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 8:00:31pm

re: #280 Floral Giraffe

Fox is building an in home studio for Sarah.

[Link: www.nytimes.com…]

They’ll need soundproofing to make that work. There are two children under 3 in that house. It surely gets quite noisy at times.

294 jamesfirecat  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 8:00:46pm

re: #290 Summer

I really don’t think it’s tea that these people have been drinking.

Oh it could be ….

To Paraphrase Dave Barry

“What many people don’t realize is that back in those days, “tea” was slang for Marijuana.”

295 iceweasel  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 8:01:07pm

re: #280 Floral Giraffe

Fox is building an in home studio for Sarah.

[Link: www.nytimes.com…]

Cool. Beck has his Doom Room, the Grifter can have her Kitchen Bitchin’.

Cookin’ Meth and Moose with America’s Mom, you betcha.

296 windsagio  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 8:01:12pm

re: #292 Rightwingconspirator

the problem is the question of ‘symmetry’. The commies have essentially always been powerless fruitcakes.

The whole concern about the ‘baggers, is that they seem to have a ton of influence and potential power.

297 Dark_Falcon  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 8:01:17pm

re: #290 Summer

I really don’t think it’s tea that these people have been drinking.

Nope, I’d guess moonshine instead.

298 windsagio  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 8:01:41pm

re: #295 iceweasel

I”d listen to a show called that.

299 tradewind  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 8:02:51pm

re: #267 The Sanity Inspector
Until Obdicut explained what I really meant to say, I really didn’t understand how deep the feelings ran. //
Blessed are the interpreters, for they shall inherit the thread.

300 Cato the Elder  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 8:03:51pm

re: #275 MandyManners

Well, we Republicans won’t be hanging on every word.

You and the two other still-sane GOPers?

301 The Sanity Inspector  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 8:03:57pm

re: #281 wlewisiii

Oh my… that is too funny for words. They (Trotskyites that is) were teh weirdest lefties I’ve ever met. They _would_ think that way! Hoot!

William

I used to have a stack of mimeographed communist tracts T H I S thick in the early 80s, which I collected in D.C. at a U.S. Out Of El Salvador demonstration. (Not a whisper of the communist presence in the newspaper coverage of the event, of course) The nuttiest ones were the Spartacists and the Trotskyites. One of them, I forget which, was hatin’ on Pope John Paul The Great, and called him Wojtyła The Hun.

302 SanFranciscoZionist  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 8:04:11pm

re: #294 jamesfirecat

Oh it could be …

To Paraphrase Dave Barry

“What many people don’t realize is that back in those days, “tea” was slang for Marijuana.”

My father is a bastard,
My ma’s an S.O.B.
My grandpa’s always plastered,
My grandma pushes tea.
My sister wears a mustache,
My brother wears a dress.
Goodness gracious, that’s why I’m a mess!

303 cliffster  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 8:04:21pm

It’s peanut butter and jelly time!

Youtube Video
304 MandyManners  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 8:04:36pm

re: #300 Cato the Elder

You and the two other still-sane GOPers?

So say you.

305 Jerk  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 8:04:37pm

@cliffster perhaps I should have clarified; I would be glad to staple a copy of the birth certificate to this speaker’s forehead. I believe they dug one up a couple months back.

306 Political Atheist  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 8:04:40pm

re: #296 windsagio

We’ll see at the real right wing convention. The GOP convention. Not today. Not on the cruise ship. The echo is the commies once seemed to have more influence than they did. May we not repeat the error please.

307 Cato the Elder  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 8:04:42pm

re: #278 cliffster

really, you should set higher standards for yourself

Thank you. I’ll be here till I die.

Try the veal.

308 tradewind  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 8:04:46pm

re: #273 prairiefire
Because I really have no desire to see people leave the US en masse.
I’m sorry that there’s no audio for you.

309 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 8:04:55pm

re: #302 SanFranciscoZionist

Gee, Officer Krupke…

310 Racer X  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 8:05:21pm

Grilled Sea Bass with a spicy mustard / olive oil glaze. Black bean medley. Grilled tomatoes with vinegar and sea salt.

I am the luckiest man on earth because, DAYAM, my wife can cook!

311 Political Atheist  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 8:05:28pm

re: #300 Cato the Elder

Oh come on there are 6.
:)

312 cliffster  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 8:05:38pm

re: #307 Cato the Elder

Thank you. I’ll be here till I die.

Try the veal.

Now I know you’re lying - you wouldn’t eat veal.

313 Dark_Falcon  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 8:05:44pm

re: #300 Cato the Elder

Well, there’s also me, and my best friend, and my dad, and my uncles…

Oh wait, you meant that rhetorically.

314 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 8:05:56pm

re: #307 Cato the Elder

I serve at the pleasure of the Grand Lizard…

315 windsagio  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 8:05:57pm

re: #306 Rightwingconspirator

I suspect that the commies never had nearly the influence that the TP movement has now.

316 windsagio  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 8:06:33pm

re: #313 Dark_Falcon

well habitual republicans aren’t necessarily crazy :P

317 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 8:06:48pm

Still snowing like an mfer here…

318 Cato the Elder  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 8:07:02pm

re: #312 cliffster

Now I know you’re lying - you wouldn’t eat veal.

No, but I’d buy you a plate and blow my nose on it. ;^)

319 prairiefire  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 8:07:18pm

re: #310 Racer X

Tell your wife congrats on another great meal.
I am really enjoying the Stereogum link, btw.

320 Political Atheist  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 8:08:00pm

re: #262 Cato the Elder

No so sure, we’ll see.

321 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 8:08:12pm

re: #318 Cato the Elder

Veal is an abomination.

Just sayin’…

322 Decatur Deb  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 8:10:03pm

re: #305 Jerk

If you hit the reply or quote box, lizard magic will put the number or text of the comment you are answering in your comment box for you.

323 cliffster  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 8:10:08pm

re: #321 Fat Bastard Vegetarian

Veal is an abomination.

Just sayin’…

My guess - Cato would sooner contribute to Palin 2010 than buy veal.

324 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 8:10:17pm

BTW? Michelle Obama is on the frickin’ nose here…

325 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 8:10:44pm

re: #323 cliffster

One would hope…

326 Our Precious Bodily Fluids  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 8:10:59pm

re: #240 SanFranciscoZionist

I *really* liked McCain, prior to the 2008 campaign. I supported him in the 2000 election, and I thought it was appalling how he got treated like the only woman on a pirate ship by the GOP in general, and the Bush campaign in particular.

In 2008, my knee-jerk, gut-reaction, especially after Sarah Palin, was that he wasn’t actually in control of his campaign. I don’t know if that was right or wrong, but it certainly didn’t seem like the John McCain I thought I knew. In the best-case scenario, it looked like cynical pandering to the Republican “base”. In the worst-case scenario, it looked like McCain wasn’t actually in charge of his own campaign.

327 lostlakehiker  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 8:11:33pm

re: #139 jamesfirecat

Plus the two have different views of their parties.

I brought this up before but let me lay it out again.

For the most part the right seems to be about keeping things the way they are, conserving what we already have.

Liberals are about trying to change things, trying to move forward towards some destination.

The problem is that its a lot easier to agree on how to keep things the same then to “what destination” we as a country should be going, which is why liberals are inherently more fractious then conservatives.

Just my own personal theory…

Trouble is, today’s liberals are not willing to see improvements in education, if it impinges on their sacred teachers’ union. They oppose the exploration of space because it wastes money. They’re against nuclear power, against wind power (well, against the transmission lines, and against siting wind towers anywhere the wind blows, e.g. off Nantuckett.)

Liberals oppose free trade, a classic liberal position. Liberals work to keep qualified minorities [Asians] from entering universities in numbers that their accomplishments would merit.

They not only oppose progress itself, they oppose the means by which the next generation can be prepared to make progress.

328 keloyd  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 8:12:43pm

re: #300 Cato the Elder

You and the two other still-sane GOPers?

The 2012 republican convention will be a meltdown to match the chaos of the democrat conventions of the 70s, but when the time is right, we shall return. Like King Arthur from Avalon. Once the teabaggers and birthers get thumped good and proper, Giuliani will take the reins, and all the old Nixon Republicans will get called to the colors again, and 2024 will be a very interesting year.

329 TedStriker  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 8:12:51pm

re: #239 Cato the Elder

A line that Reagan stole from Lenin.

Oh, the irony!

I’m no fan of Stalin, but his “quantity has a quality all its own” quote made sense for the time and circumstances of when it was first said…postwar, it scared the West shitless throughout the Cold War (see NATO’s predictions of Russian tactics for the Fulda Gap).

“Trust, but verify” sort of falls in the same category of classic quotes.

330 Cato the Elder  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 8:14:26pm

re: #323 cliffster

My guess - Cato would sooner contribute to Palin 2010 than buy veal.

Wrong. I’m a sucker for a good Wiener Schnitzel.

331 Political Atheist  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 8:15:04pm

re: #315 windsagio

Are they well placed in the State Department?


Just kidding. This is officially a 3 beer thread for me.
*pop-hisss*

332 windsagio  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 8:15:34pm

re: #331 Rightwingconspirator

Lets go for it!


/actually lets not.

333 Decatur Deb  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 8:15:37pm

re: #326 negativ

Pretty much says it. I wish he had retired on top of his game rather than take the poor treatment. Respected his service, less so his recent politics.

334 Cato the Elder  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 8:16:23pm

re: #328 keloyd

The 2012 republican convention will be a meltdown to match the chaos of the democrat conventions of the 70s, but when the time is right, we shall return. Like King Arthur from Avalon. Once the teabaggers and birthers get thumped good and proper, Giuliani will take the reins, and all the old Nixon Republicans will get called to the colors again, and 2024 will be a very interesting year.

One can hope. (Though Giuliani couldn’t reach the stirrups to save his life.)

If Nixon hadn’t blown it with Watergate, this country would have had national health insurance since 1975.

335 MandyManners  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 8:16:56pm

UNCLE.

336 jamesfirecat  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 8:16:58pm

re: #327 lostlakehiker

Trouble is, today’s liberals are not willing to see improvements in education, if it impinges on their sacred teachers’ union. They oppose the exploration of space because it wastes money. They’re against nuclear power, against wind power (well, against the transmission lines, and against siting wind towers anywhere the wind blows, e.g. off Nantuckett.)

Liberals oppose free trade, a classic liberal position. Liberals work to keep qualified minorities [Asians] from entering universities in numbers that their accomplishments would merit.

They not only oppose progress itself, they oppose the means by which the next generation can be prepared to make progress.

Okay show me the Asians things because that I’ve never heard of before.

That said everything the Socons tend to stand for also tends to be against what conservatives are suppose to be about, how can they argue that they’re for smaller government if they want to be able to have the government police who does and who doesn’t get an abortion, who does and who doesn’t get married….

337 Political Atheist  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 8:17:08pm

re: #332 windsagio

Its a tough time/thread for a sensible right leaner. Ah well, mom said there would be days like this. :)

338 jamesfirecat  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 8:17:37pm

re: #328 keloyd

The 2012 republican convention will be a meltdown to match the chaos of the democrat conventions of the 70s, but when the time is right, we shall return. Like King Arthur from Avalon. Once the teabaggers and birthers get thumped good and proper, Giuliani will take the reins, and all the old Nixon Republicans will get called to the colors again, and 2024 will be a very interesting year.

There will be Nixon republicans alive in 2024?

339 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 8:17:43pm

re: #337 Rightwingconspirator

momma said, momma said…

340 Political Atheist  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 8:17:52pm

re: #332 windsagio

Time to roll one.

341 I Need A Bigger Gun  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 8:18:27pm

Damn, the birthers are boring…

342 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 8:18:56pm

re: #338 jamesfirecat

He’s tanned. He’s rested. He’s ready.
Nixon in 1996.

(saw that on a bumper sticker)

343 Decatur Deb  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 8:19:08pm

re: #327 lostlakehiker

Where are you finding these liberals? Your description is about 170 degrees out from me, and I’m left of Obama.

344 jamesfirecat  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 8:19:13pm

re: #341 I Need A Bigger Gun

Damn, the birthers are boring…

How can you find people who are this crazy boring? You never know what they’re gonna do next!

345 goddamnedfrank  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 8:19:27pm

re: #240 SanFranciscoZionist

Answering for myself, I don’t think Obama was the best-qualified candidate the Democrats could have fielded. (OH GOD!!! HILLARRYYY!!!)

But I think that given how Bush wrapped up his eight years, and given some of the issues with McCain’s campaign, we could have run a potted plant with a sex scandal in its past and a weak foreign policy background, and won.

No insult to McCain. He may not have run a perfect campaign, but he was up against the tide, and he ran with grace.

Up dinged because you rock, but I drew a distinction between “best-qualified” and the better of the two for the job. I always wanted Obama over Hillary if for no other reason than a lot of people had a deep, DEEP set negative impression of her going in. I also didn’t like the way she ran her campaign, in particular the courting of the super-delegates and dismissal of caucus states really annoyed me. She refused to run a 50 state strategy, and more than anything the perceived arrogance in that cost her the gig.

And she also lied about coming under sniper fire. That was pretty WTF, right? So that alone probably cost her the VP gig.

Post election she has gone a long way towards redemption, and has been an exemplary SOS so far.

346 jaunte  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 8:19:29pm

re: #327 lostlakehiker

Liberals oppose free trade, a classic liberal position.


This opposition to free trade is found on both sides. Here’s one example that ought to be fixed to allow businesses to create some more jobs:

Sugar protectionism costs American jobs. According to the USITC, there are some 61,000 full-time-equivalent sugar-production jobs in the United States. That figure includes all farm jobs involved in the growing and harvesting of sugarcane and sugar beets. This contrasts with the approximately 724,000 people counted by the Commerce Department as working in sugar-using industries. In other words, more than ten times as many Americans face possible job cuts and slower growth because of the U.S. sugar program than are helped by it.
[Link: www.freetrade.org…]
347 The Sanity Inspector  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 8:20:04pm

re: #333 Decatur Deb

Pretty much says it. I wish he had retired on top of his game rather than take the poor treatment. Respected his service, less so his recent politics.


Fortune rarely accompanies anyone to the door.
—Balthasar Gracian

348 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 8:20:11pm

re: #330 Cato the Elder

Wrong. I’m a sucker for a good Wiener Schnitzel.

Oh, crap. I always assumed Wiener Schnitzel had a wiener in it.

349 cliffster  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 8:21:00pm

re: #330 Cato the Elder

Wrong. I’m a sucker for a good Wiener Schnitzel.

Your colossal ignorance is matched only by your wretched stupidity, thou vile pseudo-intellectual.

350 windsagio  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 8:21:09pm

re: #337 Rightwingconspirator

I don’t envy you your position, I admit. The thing I have a problem with is the intentional blindness on the issue (not you, obviously). If these people gain much power, its bad for the entire nation, not just the Republicans.

351 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 8:21:57pm

re: #349 cliffster

Oh shit. Somebody got a sock.
/

352 cliffster  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 8:22:43pm

re: #351 Fat Bastard Vegetarian

Oh shit. Somebody got a sock.
/

roomie

353 Dark_Falcon  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 8:22:45pm

re: #330 Cato the Elder

Wrong. I’m a sucker for a good Wiener Schnitzel.

If you’re even in Chicago, try Edelweiss on Irving Park Road. It’s Bavarian-theme and their schnitzels are very good.

354 Cato the Elder  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 8:23:00pm

re: #349 cliffster

Your colossal ignorance is matched only by your wretched stupidity, thou vile pseudo-intellectual.

Excuse me?

Wiener Schnitzel (German pronunciation: [ˈviːnɐ ˈʃnɪtsl̩]) or alternatively, Vienna Schnitzel, is a traditional Austrian dish and is a popular part of Viennese and Austrian cuisine, consisting of a thin slice of veal coated in breadcrumbs and fried.

Now go suck a Bratwurst.

355 The Sanity Inspector  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 8:23:05pm

re: #336 jamesfirecat

Okay show me the Asians things because that I’ve never heard of before.

It’s been kicking around for a while.

Do Elite Private Colleges Discriminate Against Asian Students?
Students of different races have varying odds of admission to elite private colleges, a study finds

356 Ojoe  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 8:23:09pm

On the thread topic Mr. Farah need not worry & it won’t be concern about a certificate that will prevent a 2nd term for Mr. Obama.

The economy alone will insure a single term for him.

then there is the ballooning deficit

I would hazard a guess that Obama will even take a place alongside Buchannan if we get hit big-time by the jihadis, and we certainly are getting no strong action against the iranian a-bomb from the CIC.

Good night all.

357 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 8:24:14pm

re: #356 Ojoe

G’night, pal.

358 Killgore Trout  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 8:24:16pm

Nirther Uber Alles!

359 jamesfirecat  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 8:24:20pm

re: #342 Fat Bastard Vegetarian

He’s tanned. He’s rested. He’s ready.
Nixon in 1996.

(saw that on a bumper sticker)

Also, what exactly is a Nixon Republican? When I think of a Nixon Republican I think of the southern strategy and isn’t an overabundence of that what’s wrong with the current GOP?

360 Cato the Elder  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 8:24:45pm

re: #356 Ojoe

Solution? Vote Whig!

Sleep long and dream the impossible dream.

361 Racer X  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 8:25:10pm

re: #342 Fat Bastard Vegetarian

He’s tanned. He’s rested. He’s ready.
Nixon in 1996.

(saw that on a bumper sticker)

That was on Saturday Night Live.

362 Killgore Trout  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 8:26:18pm

Shall we squabble?

363 The Sanity Inspector  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 8:26:20pm

re: #359 jamesfirecat

Also, what exactly is a Nixon Republican? When I think of a Nixon Republican I think of the southern strategy and isn’t an overabundence of that what’s wrong with the current GOP?

I think of wage/price controls and Teh SuXXoR economy of the mid-70s.

364 cliffster  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 8:26:55pm

re: #362 Killgore Trout

Shall we squabble?

fuck off, you communist

365 Our Precious Bodily Fluids  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 8:27:05pm

re: #231 Decatur Deb
green tee-shirt and black jeans.

366 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 8:27:25pm

re: #355 The Sanity Inspector

heh… My niece is Amer-Asian.

Beautiful, charming, and frickin’ brilliant.

Heard she was accepted to Maryland on a full scholarship, then went to OTS in the Air Force.

My (dumb-ass) beautiful children told me, “Well, of course! She’s Asian!”

I said, “Do we need to go there?”

(They’ve watched her work ten times as hard as they ever dreamed of working their entire lives.)

367 Racer X  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 8:27:35pm

re: #362 Killgore Trout

Shall we squabble?

Fine.

Farm raised or wild salmon?

I say wild!

368 Killgore Trout  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 8:27:47pm

re: #364 cliffster

fuck off, you communist

I squabble you!

369 jamesfirecat  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 8:27:57pm

re: #356 Ojoe

On the thread topic Mr. Farah need not worry & it won’t be concern about a certificate that will prevent a 2nd term for Mr. Obama.

The economy alone will insure a single term for him.

then there is the ballooning deficit

I would hazard a guess that Obama will even take a place alongside Buchannan if we get hit big-time by the jihadis, and we certainly are getting no strong action against the iranian a-bomb from the CIC.

Good night all.

Well rember to be a one termer the GOP needs to find someone who can beat Obama, and their current presidential canadates ain’t looking too good…

370 Political Atheist  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 8:28:20pm

re: #350 windsagio

Thanks. Patience is my best play. That and discipline to the principles.

371 Killgore Trout  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 8:29:18pm

re: #367 Racer X

Definitely wild salmon. No doubt about it. Farmed trout on the other hand is affordable, sustainable and I bet you couldn’t tell the difference.

372 Cato the Elder  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 8:29:35pm

re: #366 Fat Bastard Vegetarian

heh… My niece is Amer-Asian.

Beautiful, charming, and frickin’ brilliant.

Heard she was accepted to Maryland on a full scholarship, then went to OTS in the Air Force.

My (dumb-ass) beautiful children told me, “Well, of course! She’s Asian!”

I said, “Do we need to go there?”

(They’ve watched her work ten times as hard as they ever dreamed of working their entire lives.)

The Asians invented the work ethic 25 centuries before the first Protestant was heretically baptized.

373 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 8:29:42pm

I’m exhausted. And a teeeny tiny bit lit.

So, G’night knuckleheads!

374 Political Atheist  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 8:30:08pm

re: #373 Fat Bastard Vegetarian

Sleep soundly.

375 prairiefire  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 8:30:28pm

re: #366 Fat Bastard Vegetarian

My kids are amer-asian. They say “Daddy is the secret weapon for math homework” and it is absolutely true.

376 Racer X  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 8:31:25pm

re: #371 Killgore Trout

Definitely wild salmon. No doubt about it. Farmed trout on the other hand is affordable, sustainable and I bet you couldn’t tell the difference.

Agreed.

We were at the Long Beach Aquarium recently and they made a big deal out of ‘don’t eat farmed salmon’. Wait, we were supposed to be squabbling.

377 keloyd  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 8:31:25pm

re: #355 The Sanity Inspector

It’s been kicking around for a while.

Do Elite Private Colleges Discriminate Against Asian Students?
Students of different races have varying odds of admission to elite private colleges, a study finds

I can second that, though I’m too tired and lazy to dig up a citation. IIRC, in the early 90s, a big court case in California pretty much ended the most brazen affirmative action that took disadvantaged minority kids out of the 2nd tier colleges where they could do well and let them into the top tear places where they were totally out gunned and dropped out in droves. Some white guy sued for not getting into Berkley(?) when less qualified minorities got in (minority = black or hispanic, never Asian, ever). He won his case. Result? More Asian kids, fewer black and hispanic kids, # white kids - exactly the same. He went to all that trouble for big fat nothin, for Team Whitey at least.

I will never understand how this is different from the old Jewish quotas. At one point Harvard let in 2 every year, if that movie about the game show and the actor from Northern Exposure is to be believed.

378 palomino  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 8:31:34pm

A standing fucking ovation?

So much for the idea that the birther lunatic fringe is only a tiny impotent portion of an otherwise respectable group. You can’t get much more mainstream teabag than the national fucking party convention.

379 SanFranciscoZionist  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 8:31:42pm

re: #355 The Sanity Inspector

It’s been kicking around for a while.

Do Elite Private Colleges Discriminate Against Asian Students?
Students of different races have varying odds of admission to elite private colleges, a study finds

Colleges=liberals?

380 Political Atheist  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 8:32:55pm

re: #379 SanFranciscoZionist

Shocka!

381 Decatur Deb  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 8:32:57pm

re: #355 The Sanity Inspector

There’s some problems in there. I’m crashing now, but there will be another thread. If no one runs with this, bring it up again. ‘Nite, all.

382 Lidane  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 8:33:47pm

re: #327 lostlakehiker

Trouble is, today’s liberals are not willing to see improvements in education, if it impinges on their sacred teachers’ union.

Some of us are from right to work states. I don’t consider a union any more sacred than a local PTA.

Personally? I’d kill every single standardized test that kids have to take in school. They make teachers lazy and the students mediocre, since most schools will only teach to the test, leaving any college professors to pick up the slack later. Of course, I’d also mandate real science (i.e., not that “intelligent design” garbage) in science class and require that both Richard Dawkins and Howard Zinn be read in class, so what the hell do I know?

They oppose the exploration of space because it wastes money.

Except growing up, my (now ex-)stepdad worked at NASA. I grew up around the space program. I like the space program. I think it’s valuable, even if others would love to see it dismantled.

They’re against nuclear power, against wind power (well, against the transmission lines, and against siting wind towers anywhere the wind blows, e.g. off Nantuckett.)

Nope. I’m not against nuclear power. Just badly managed nuclear power. If we’re going to use it, we have to find a way to responsibly dispose of any waste produced so that it won’t pollute the environment or the water supply.

Liberals oppose free trade, a classic liberal position.

Damn. I guess that means I’d better give back my degree in International Business and that I should also forget about that MBA I’m chasing, seeing as how I’m supposedly against free trade and against capitalism since I’m a liberal.

Liberals work to keep qualified minorities [Asians] from entering universities in numbers that their accomplishments would merit.

I’m in favor of anyone who has the desire and the grades getting into college. Race and gender don’t mean squat there.

They not only oppose progress itself, they oppose the means by which the next generation can be prepared to make progress.

That all depends on what you mean by progress. I’m all in favor of society advancing and evolving in a positive way. It’s why I support things like gay marriage and oppose most social conservative policies. The sooner we get over trying to tell people what they can and can’t do in the privacy of their own bedrooms and in their personal lives, the better. Then we can focus on the real issues, like the current clusterfuck that is our economy.

383 The Sanity Inspector  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 8:34:23pm

re: #372 Cato the Elder

The Asians invented the work ethic 25 centuries before the first Protestant was heretically baptized.

Unfortunately for them, they couldn’t get away from nomadic raiders which periodically destroyed their civilizations. Plus, originality was never their strong suit. Had they been given an isolated continent and a soupçon of Greek fire, they could have been…well, they could have been us!

384 The Shadow Do  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 8:34:23pm

re: #371 Killgore Trout

Definitely wild salmon. No doubt about it. Farmed trout on the other hand is affordable, sustainable and I bet you couldn’t tell the difference.

Farmed trout white, wild trout pink. Weak paste vs good taste.

Yes, I am a pinkist!

385 Killgore Trout  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 8:34:38pm

re: #376 Racer X

Wait, we were supposed to be squabbling.


Oh, yeah.
Tea Party! Fascism! Environmentalism stinks!

386 Political Atheist  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 8:35:52pm

re: #382 Lidane

One up for a truly crafted reply.

387 Dancing along the light of day  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 8:35:55pm

re: #362 Killgore Trout

Whack!
What shall we squabble about?

388 Cato the Elder  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 8:36:58pm

re: #383 The Sanity Inspector

Unfortunately for them, they couldn’t get away from nomadic raiders which periodically destroyed their civilizations. Plus, originality was never their strong suit. Had they been given an isolated continent and a soupçon of Greek fire, they could have been…well, they could have been us!

Right.

Paper, gunpowder, porcelain - they never invented shit.

389 SanFranciscoZionist  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 8:38:47pm

re: #380 Rightwingconspirator

Shocka!

Yes, if that means that I can now blame conservatives for racial inequities in the business world.

Come on.

390 keloyd  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 8:39:03pm

re: #359 jamesfirecat

Also, what exactly is a Nixon Republican? When I think of a Nixon Republican I think of the southern strategy and isn’t an overabundence of that what’s wrong with the current GOP?

Since I brought up Nixon, here’s my definition - pragmatic and centrist. While Nixon played footsie with Thurmond and the Southern Strategy (as Scott Brown did with the tea party crowd) he was unusually progressive in domestic policy for a Republican. He was openly pro choice, not just agreeing not to ever bring it up like Bush the Elder. He used price fixing to fight inflation. He took a stab at national health care. He commissioned a big study on teh war on drugs that would have advocated legalizing “marihuana,” but it got lost in the shuffle after Watergate. He was less racist than most old white guys of his demographic, and was the first ever to give buckets of money to the traditionally black colleges. Spock reminded us that only Nixon could go to China.

391 The Sanity Inspector  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 8:39:40pm

re: #384 The Shadow Do

Farmed trout white, wild trout pink. Weak paste vs good taste.

Yes, I am a pinkist!

Youtube Video
392 keloyd  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 8:41:05pm

re: #372 Cato the Elder

The Asians invented the work ethic 25 centuries before the first Protestant was heretically baptized.

and the last ironic relic of Protestant Work Ethic today is found with Mormons.

393 William Barnett-Lewis  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 8:41:17pm

re: #327 lostlakehiker

Trouble is, today’s liberals are not willing to see improvements in education, if it impinges on their sacred teachers’ union. They oppose the exploration of space because it wastes money. They’re against nuclear power, against wind power (well, against the transmission lines, and against siting wind towers anywhere the wind blows, e.g. off Nantuckett.)

Liberals oppose free trade, a classic liberal position. Liberals work to keep qualified minorities [Asians] from entering universities in numbers that their accomplishments would merit.

They not only oppose progress itself, they oppose the means by which the next generation can be prepared to make progress.

Meh, do not fall for the fantasy that all Liberals are the same. It is no more true than all conservatives are all the same.

I’m hard left/liberal. I am a member of the Democratic Socialists of America.

I want improvements in education that don’t require teaching to the test. While I have a gut level appreciation of unions - my FIL grew up in an Alabama textile company town - I also will not let them stand in the way when they really are the problem. The problem is usually with individuals who want money, power or both, rather than the actual institutions but that doesn’t fit the mythology that some would like to sell that Unions have “outlived” their time.

I have been pro space, nuclear energy & guns all my life. I voted for a Republican congressman in every election after he got in because he was good for our district. I might add that he was run out of office by His Own Party after he was outed… (Scott Gunderson, Rep, WI) We got lucky & got a good Democrat after him but that was luck of the draw

I’ll pause here as I need another beer.

Just remember - both sides are interesting individuals. My best friend is a good republican and his wife is a libertarian. My wife is a classic union/democrat. We still all party hard together.

William

394 Killgore Trout  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 8:42:03pm

re: #387 Floral Giraffe

Whack!
What shall we squabble about?

I have an epic inner squabble going on about to move or not to move. I almost have enough money to pay off my mortgage here in Portland. I might move to the coast. Maybe not. I’m going to crunch some numbers this weekend, meditate on it and squabble with myself about it.
/Squabble, squabble

395 The Sanity Inspector  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 8:42:10pm

re: #390 keloyd

Since I brought up Nixon, here’s my definition - pragmatic and centrist. While Nixon played footsie with Thurmond and the Southern Strategy (as Scott Brown did with the tea party crowd) he was unusually progressive in domestic policy for a Republican. He was openly pro choice, not just agreeing not to ever bring it up like Bush the Elder. He used price fixing to fight inflation. He took a stab at national health care. He commissioned a big study on teh war on drugs that would have advocated legalizing “marihuana,” but it got lost in the shuffle after Watergate. He was less racist than most old white guys of his demographic, and was the first ever to give buckets of money to the traditionally black colleges. Spock reminded us that only Nixon could go to China.

Plus, once he made a last, mighty effort to win in Vietnam, he managed to extricate us, though without honor. And, he saved Israel from extermination in the Yom Kippur War, right in the middle of him getting toppled from office.

396 SanFranciscoZionist  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 8:42:35pm

re: #392 keloyd

and the last ironic relic of Protestant Work Ethic today is found with Mormons.

And there there’s the Mexican Work Ethic, which was brought home to my poor father after the 1989 quake, when he discovered his janitorial crew busy cleaning his building by flashlight.

397 Dancing along the light of day  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 8:42:36pm

re: #371 Killgore Trout

Free range turkey meat is pinker than non free range turkey.
Having the room to move about, they grow bigger blood vessels & thus the meat is pinker.

398 Dancing along the light of day  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 8:43:46pm

re: #394 Killgore Trout

I hope Charles forwarded my friends contact info?

399 The Sanity Inspector  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 8:44:18pm

re: #394 Killgore Trout

I have an epic inner squabble going on about to move or not to move. I almost have enough money to pay off my mortgage here in Portland. I might move to the coast. Maybe not. I’m going to crunch some numbers this weekend, meditate on it and squabble with myself about it.
/Squabble, squabble

How much is your monthly payment? (Don’t tell me, just bring the number to mind.) Now, would you say No to getting a monthly raise of income in that amount?

400 webevintage  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 8:44:19pm

re: #262 Cato the Elder

The Tea Bag Convention is a preview of the next GOP convention.
They have nowhere else to turn.

If that is true then the GOP will truly be screwed. This is ugly stuff and the majority of Americans do not like it.

401 Political Atheist  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 8:45:27pm

re: #400 webevintage


Maybe the Tea Bag party siphons off the worst, leaving the GOP convention to the sane wing.

402 jamesfirecat  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 8:45:43pm

re: #390 keloyd

Since I brought up Nixon, here’s my definition - pragmatic and centrist. While Nixon played footsie with Thurmond and the Southern Strategy (as Scott Brown did with the tea party crowd) he was unusually progressive in domestic policy for a Republican. He was openly pro choice, not just agreeing not to ever bring it up like Bush the Elder. He used price fixing to fight inflation. He took a stab at national health care. He commissioned a big study on teh war on drugs that would have advocated legalizing “marihuana,” but it got lost in the shuffle after Watergate. He was less racist than most old white guys of his demographic, and was the first ever to give buckets of money to the traditionally black colleges. Spock reminded us that only Nixon could go to China.

Wow Nixon doesn’t sound like such a bad guy when you leave out the Watergate thing and all the crazy conspiracies!

403 cliffster  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 8:45:55pm

re: #397 Floral Giraffe

Free range turkey meat is pinker than non free range turkey.
Having the room to move about, they grow bigger blood vessels & thus the meat is pinker.

Free range livestock is something I can check out on. Good evening, yall. Peace and purpose to everyone here. Except for Cato.

404 Dancing along the light of day  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 8:46:11pm

re: #394 Killgore Trout

That’s a hard one.
I would not plan on increasing values in real estate for a few years, or longer. But, if you can afford a new place on the coast, and it improves your quality of life…go for it!

405 Killgore Trout  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 8:46:11pm

re: #398 Floral Giraffe

I hope Charles forwarded my friends contact info?

Yes, he did. Thank you very much. It might come in very handy.

406 jamesfirecat  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 8:46:29pm

re: #401 Rightwingconspirator

Maybe the Tea Bag party siphons off the worst, leaving the GOP convention to the sane wing.

What if the Sane Wing of the Republican party is no match for the Democrats without the crazies?

SPLITTER!

407 keloyd  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 8:48:57pm

re: #402 jamesfirecat

Wow Nixon doesn’t sound like such a bad guy when you leave out the Watergate thing and all the crazy conspiracies!

That’s Nixon! Historians will be digging on Nixon 100 years from now. Still, by “Nixon Republican” I can differentiate the party of that time from the man himself. I’m not running my mouth about conspiracies into a tape recorder and have any phlebitis under control.

I wonder if Caribou Barbie even knows the meaning of “a sensible Republican cloth coat.”

408 The Sanity Inspector  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 8:49:21pm

re: #402 jamesfirecat

Wow Nixon doesn’t sound like such a bad guy when you leave out the Watergate thing and all the crazy conspiracies!

Yes, his character was his fatal flaw. Fortunately, character stopped mattering once Bubba was elected, and we all lived happily ever after.

409 prairiefire  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 8:49:34pm

re: #394 Killgore Trout

Hey the Diner show on Food Network just featured a great looking Thai place in Portland. The Vietnamese wings look fantastic:[Link: www.foodnetwork.com…]

410 Dancing along the light of day  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 8:50:40pm

re: #405 Killgore Trout

Really nice man. Born & spent his whole life in Bandon/Coos Bay.
Generous to a fault, but not easy.
Wife died 2 years ago of brain cancer, she went the hard way.
He has at least 4 dogs.
DO NOT take your cats there.
You’ll never see them again.
Great guy, if you need help, wnat info, or just to meet a “local”
he’s your guy.

411 Political Atheist  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 8:52:37pm

re: #406 jamesfirecat

Yes indeed. Until you add the “vote no incumbent” or plenty of blame to go around economy factors. Now you got a real scamble. If the center of gravity for the right falls into the Democrats, the blue dogs will rule the day. Its 3d chess2

412 Dancing along the light of day  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 8:54:10pm

THREAD KILLER!

Youtube Video
413 jamesfirecat  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 8:54:52pm

re: #408 The Sanity Inspector

Yes, his character was his fatal flaw. Fortunately, character stopped mattering once Bubba was elected, and we all lived happily ever after.

I don’t follow you, are you saying that how badly Nixon messed up stopped mattering after Clinton was elected, if so why?

414 keloyd  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 8:55:07pm

re: #411 Rightwingconspirator

I agree, the next few elections will be fought among factions within the Democratic party, while Republicans have their meltdown - 2010 to 2016. After that is too far in the future to guess this late at night.

415 prairiefire  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 8:55:13pm

re: #411 Rightwingconspirator

Yes, it is. The 2014 Republican convention is going to be fascinating. There are plenty of Republicans who love the Teapartiers and their energy.

Anyone else looking forward to the Olympics?

416 The Sanity Inspector  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 8:56:36pm

I mentioned this way, way downstairs: Tony Woodlief is disgusted at the Haitian government.

417 jamesfirecat  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 8:56:58pm

re: #407 keloyd

That’s Nixon! Historians will be digging on Nixon 100 years from now. Still, by “Nixon Republican” I can differentiate the party of that time from the man himself. I’m not running my mouth about conspiracies into a tape recorder and have any phlebitis under control.

I wonder if Caribou Barbie even knows the meaning of “a sensible Republican cloth coat.”

I’d still prefer we call the sane republicans “Goldwater Republicans” since it seems like Barry Goldwater saw just about EVERYTHING that would go wrong with the current GOP in advance before it happened. Nixon arguably started them down that road with his southern strategy….

418 Political Atheist  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 8:58:13pm

re: #415 prairiefire

re: #414 keloyd

I guess I sit out all the primaries, and get what I get. Even if it means putting in a ballot with a lot left un done. If I can not support either one honestly, I’ll leave it blank. Perhaps The ultimate hanging chad is the withheld vote.

419 Lidane  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 8:58:40pm

re: #415 prairiefire

Anyone else looking forward to the Olympics?

Nah. It’s only the Winter games, and I never pay attention to those.

It’s killing me, however, that the World Cup doesn’t start until June. *sigh*

420 prairiefire  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 8:59:15pm

Lights out in KC. Night, Lizards.

421 The Sanity Inspector  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 8:59:16pm

re: #413 jamesfirecat

I don’t follow you, are you saying that how badly Nixon messed up stopped mattering after Clinton was elected, if so why?

No. I’m asserting with some deadpan snarkiness that many of the people/factions who anathematized Nixon were just fine with Clinton being “an unusually good liar.”

422 Killgore Trout  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 8:59:41pm

re: #399 The Sanity Inspector

How much is your monthly payment? (Don’t tell me, just bring the number to mind.) Now, would you say No to getting a monthly raise of income in that amount?

If I decide to downsize and move to the coast or stay here and pay off my mortgage it will essentially double my annual income. I’m 40 now and still have milk carton furniture and thrift store clothing. The starving artist thing isn’t nearly as romantic as an adult. I’ve never lived like a “normal” person as an adult with disposable income to buy an ipod or take a real vacation. I’m looking forward to seeing what it’s like.

423 Killgore Trout  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 9:00:56pm

re: #409 prairiefire

Hey the Diner show on Food Network just featured a great looking Thai place in Portland. The Vietnamese wings look fantastic:[Link: www.foodnetwork.com…]

Looks good.

424 jamesfirecat  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 9:01:02pm

re: #421 The Sanity Inspector

No. I’m asserting with some deadpan snarkiness that many of the people/factions who anathematized Nixon were just fine with Clinton being “an unusually good liar.”

To be fair, Nixon lied about tapping his opponents phone, Clinton lied about getting a blow job…. both of those are immoral but only one is illegal…

425 Gus  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 9:01:06pm

There it is. Was just about to listen to this crackpot before I got side tracked with some dumb cabling mistake I made.

They’re always saying that there are problems with both parties. While true, these lunatics are not even a realistic alternative. Yes, birds of the feather flock together and what we’ve seen last year at the Tea Parties, 912DC, Glenn Beck, and now Joseph Farah and his birth certificate conspiracy and Tom Tancredo’s “literacy tests” for voting.

To top it all off, Caribou Barbie has yet to speak.

426 The Sanity Inspector  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 9:02:21pm

re: #417 jamesfirecat

I’d still prefer we call the sane republicans “Goldwater Republicans” since it seems like Barry Goldwater saw just about EVERYTHING that would go wrong with the current GOP in advance before it happened. Nixon arguably started them down that road with his southern strategy…

There’s nothing liberals respect more than a sensible, cordial Republican who will lose by 30 states or more and give a gallant concession speech. Let’s check back after the mid-terms and, if Republicans have picked up many seats, see what kind of welcome the incoming class of ‘10 gets.

427 Lidane  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 9:03:25pm

re: #425 Gus 802

To top it all off, Caribou Barbie has yet to speak.

There should be an LGF betting pool for how much of a word salad she’s going to create, you betcha. Or a drinking game. Or both.

428 freetoken  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 9:04:02pm

re: #422 Killgore Trout

I’ve never lived like a “normal” person as an adult with disposable income to buy an ipod or take a real vacation. I’m looking forward to seeing what it’s like.

Having done both (the bohemian/student lifestyle, and the “normal” American lifestyle) I’ve concluded that one isn’t necessarily better than the other.

Oh, having a decent steady income is certainly more comfortable… but I never had “enough.” And I know of people worth millions of dollars and guess what… they don’t think they have “enough” either.

The most content people I’ve known in my life are those with children, lots of children. I guess it is such a basic, biologically immutable thing - our “emotions” are nothing more than bio-chemical activity in our brains to motivate us to reproduce and carry on the species.

429 Dancing along the light of day  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 9:04:10pm

re: #427 Lidane

Please, save my liver. No Sarah drinking games!

430 Political Atheist  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 9:04:30pm

re: #421 The Sanity Inspector

A good point. Or who loved certain GWB policies only to hate them under Obama? Back and forth. Its laughable really. The tit for tat combustion engine. Perpetual motion.

431 Gus  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 9:05:28pm

re: #427 Lidane

There should be an LGF betting pool for how much of a word salad she’s going to create, you betcha. Or a drinking game. Or both.

It’ll be the same old pablum. Or like you say, a salad. I’d add her words are picked from a limited menu.

432 jamesfirecat  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 9:05:35pm

re: #426 The Sanity Inspector

There’s nothing liberals respect more than a sensible, cordial Republican who will lose by 30 states or more and give a gallant concession speech. Let’s check back after the mid-terms and, if Republicans have picked up many seats, see what kind of welcome the incoming class of ‘10 gets.

Really? Because I haven’t found my respect for John McCain increasing much recently….

Granted he didn’t lose by 30 states, but near 200 states is in the same ballpark, right?

433 Political Atheist  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 9:05:40pm

re: #429 Floral Giraffe

I’m not drinking any more in this thread. Uh uh.

434 Political Atheist  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 9:06:51pm

re: #426 The Sanity Inspector

Oh damn. Ouch.

435 jamesfirecat  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 9:06:57pm

re: #430 Rightwingconspirator

A good point. Or who loved certain GWB policies only to hate them under Obama? Back and forth. Its laughable really. The tit for tat combustion engine. Perpetual motion.

I think you mean Perpetual Revulsion machine…

436 jaunte  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 9:07:08pm

I’ve got to get out more and see the other 150 states.

437 Dancing along the light of day  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 9:07:32pm

re: #428 freetoken

I thought I had “enough” to live a comfortable lifestyle, and not work.
Not any kind of luxury, just not working & enough to eat.
Then I got the 38% increase on my health insurance, this week.
I can’t keep up with 38% increases on something that’s already 23% of my budget.

438 The Sanity Inspector  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 9:09:11pm

re: #422 Killgore Trout

If I decide to downsize and move to the coast or stay here and pay off my mortgage it will essentially double my annual income. I’m 40 now and still have milk carton furniture and thrift store clothing. The starving artist thing isn’t nearly as romantic as an adult. I’ve never lived like a “normal” person as an adult with disposable income to buy an ipod or take a real vacation. I’m looking forward to seeing what it’s like.

Have you a family to consider? (No need to answer.) Even if you don’t, take some time to educate yourself on managing finances. You can pop over to the library and scan the 332s. Not saying you have to go for the middle class lifestyle, necessarily. But we’d all hate for this windfall to just dribble through your fingers and be gone before you got a proper handle on it.

Just something to think about. I live in a 60 year old brick ranch and own two vehicles w/ 100K+ miles on them. But I don’t owe a soul, & I’m loving it.

439 jamesfirecat  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 9:10:23pm

re: #436 jaunte

I’ve got to get out more and see the other 150 states.

Look on the bright side, originally I said 300 states…

440 Killgore Trout  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 9:11:26pm

re: #428 freetoken

The most content people I’ve known in my life are those with children, lots of children. I guess it is such a basic, biologically immutable thing - our “emotions” are nothing more than bio-chemical activity in our brains to motivate us to reproduce and carry on the species.


I’d shoot myself in the head. I’m just not a kid person. I don’t know how people live with those things in their houses.

441 The Sanity Inspector  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 9:11:27pm

re: #439 jamesfirecat

Look on the bright side, originally I said 300 states…

…of mind. In bed.

442 Political Atheist  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 9:12:03pm

re: #435 jamesfirecat

Perfect!

Perpetual Revulsion MachinePatent Pending.

443 jamesfirecat  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 9:12:26pm

re: #430 Rightwingconspirator

A good point. Or who loved certain GWB policies only to hate them under Obama? Back and forth. Its laughable really. The tit for tat combustion engine. Perpetual motion.

Also in the fine art of “but you do it to!” Notice all the Republicans who suddenly feel very dramatically about the budget deficit as opposed to Dick Cheney and his “I think Regan proved that deficits don’t matter”

444 Gus  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 9:12:58pm

For those of you that are suckers for punishment here it is at CSPAN. Tonight only I think:

[Link: www.c-span.org…]

Go to 10:00 to hear the announcer introduce Joseph Farah. He admits to it being his second most viewed site for himself in the mornings. The feeble crowd chants back his answer, “World Net Daily.”

Towards the end Farah goes as far to compare Obama’s birth certificate with Jesus’s “birth certificate”. Amongst other such lunacy he speaks about.

It’s pathetic. Oh, bring some brain bleach.

445 freetoken  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 9:13:11pm

re: #437 Floral Giraffe

I understand. In these past couple of years of supposedly no inflation my own costs (for living) have definitely gone up - the food I buy is easily up greater than 10%, the materials (paper, ink) for my printer is up more than that, I estimate my transportation costs have gone up about that same amount (10%), etc.

I call it the Great COLA Lie.

My health costs have not gone up as much as yours, but they have increased greatly over the past decade or so, especially dental costs.

One of the trickier aspects of inflation is when the real cost goes up but the nominal price of items do not. This happens because either the quantity/quality of the items decrease (e.g., replace wood for plastic in furniture), or the buyers eventually just don’t have the money to buy the equivalent items.

446 The Sanity Inspector  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 9:13:27pm

re: #440 Killgore Trout

I’d shoot myself in the head. I’m just not a kid person. I don’t know how people live with those things in their houses.

Now you sound like Florence King.

447 Dancing along the light of day  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 9:14:05pm

re: #440 Killgore Trout

LOL!
My friend Bill always called them “ankle biters”.

448 jaunte  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 9:14:26pm

re: #444 Gus 802

He did say that WND was “absolutely incredible.”

449 Lidane  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 9:14:52pm

re: #436 jaunte

I’ve got to get out more and see the other 150 states.

re: #439 jamesfirecat

Look on the bright side, originally I said 300 states…

Give it time. Once the Teabaggers start seceding, we might just end up with over 300 states. Heh.

450 Killgore Trout  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 9:14:54pm

re: #438 The Sanity Inspector

No wife, no kids, no alimony, no child support. I’ve been managing my own finances (personal investment and business) for a while now and I’m managing a decent job at it. Not having a family definitely helps. I can survive on peanut butter and pasta when need be but I’d feel like shit if I had to force a wife and kids to do the same.

451 jamesfirecat  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 9:15:49pm

re: #449 Lidane

Give it time. Once the Teabaggers start seceding, we might just end up with over 300 states. Heh.

Come on, can’t we just give them one state, or better yet an island somewhere?

452 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 9:16:10pm

re: #430 Rightwingconspirator

A good point. Or who loved certain GWB policies only to hate them under Obama? Back and forth. Its laughable really. The tit for tat combustion engine. Perpetual motion.

If only one could fill one’s car with that instead of petrol :D

453 The Sanity Inspector  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 9:16:50pm

re: #388 Cato the Elder

Right.

Paper, gunpowder, porcelain - they never invented shit.

Didn’t say that, now did I?

454 freetoken  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 9:17:04pm

re: #444 Gus 802

Oh… goody, you probably just ruined my night… if I go watch 10 minutes of this it’ll likely kill the few remaining brain cells I have, which were being reserved for understanding the ins-n-outs of AJAX…

455 Gus  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 9:18:38pm

re: #454 freetoken

Oh… goody, you probably just ruined my night… if I go watch 10 minutes of this it’ll likely kill the few remaining brain cells I have, which were being reserved for understanding the ins-n-outs of AJAX…

Ajax does have bleach in it. Oops, wrong Ajax. ;)

Yeah, these weirdos make Newt Gingrich look like a progressive. Corny to the max.

456 The Sanity Inspector  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 9:18:51pm

re: #450 Killgore Trout

No wife, no kids, no alimony, no child support. I’ve been managing my own finances (personal investment and business) for a while now and I’m managing a decent job at it. Not having a family definitely helps. I can survive on peanut butter and pasta when need be but I’d feel like shit if I had to force a wife and kids to do the same.

Well, you know your situation better than I do, obviously. I just hope this works out for you.

457 Charles Johnson  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 9:21:17pm

All you people who keep insisting that the Birthers are a “tiny minority” of tea partiers — please note.

Tonight’s keynote speech at the first Tea Party Convention was an outright, raving, batshit nuts Birther speech by one of the craziest right wingers in America, and he got a standing ovation for it.

Please don’t use that excuse any more.

458 Charles Johnson  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 9:21:49pm

The video of this crazy speech:

Youtube Video
459 Lidane  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 9:22:01pm

re: #451 jamesfirecat

Come on, can’t we just give them one state, or better yet an island somewhere?

I’d give them Alaska, but that would be unfair to the moose.

Besides, I think of the Teabagger states looking like the time that Peter seceded on Family Guy, and then I laugh.

460 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 9:23:29pm

re: #426 The Sanity Inspector

There’s nothing liberals respect more than a sensible, cordial Republican who will lose by 30 states or more and give a gallant concession speech. Let’s check back after the mid-terms and, if Republicans have picked up many seats, see what kind of welcome the incoming class of ‘10 gets.


My respect for Republicans tends to depend on their social conservative bonafides. If the Republican class of ‘10 is full of ranting Tom Tancredo types and Man-on-Dog Santorum clones, you’ll excuse me if I don’t jump for joy when they’re sworn in.

And if Romney wins in 2012, I’ll respect him, because he’s a decent guy and I think he’d make a good president.I don’t think he’ll get far past the primary, however. I think the climate for a Mormon candidate is worse than it was in 2008.

461 jamesfirecat  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 9:23:36pm

re: #459 Lidane

I’d give them Alaska, but that would be unfair to the moose.

Besides, I think of the Teabagger states looking like the time that Peter seceded on Family Guy, and then I laugh.

Ahh well played good sir….

462 Guanxi88  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 9:23:57pm

re: #394 Killgore Trout

I have an epic inner squabble going on about to move or not to move. I almost have enough money to pay off my mortgage here in Portland. I might move to the coast. Maybe not. I’m going to crunch some numbers this weekend, meditate on it and squabble with myself about it.
/Squabble, squabble

Synchronicity, perhaps, or the inevitable concatenation of circumstance:

SWMBO & I are selling our MONDO Austin home (in the VEDDY fashionable 78745) and moving to a house for 1/3rd the price. Sale of this property will pay off the mortgage entire, retire all consumer debt - including vehicle- leave enough for a 20% down on a fixed 30-year mortgage for the new house. Estimated monthly mortgage & taxes: about $400.00

Draw down the same income, and will be saving the equivalent of a THIRD part-time job in terms of cash-flow. It’s the thing to do, at least for us.

We’re down-sizing early and radically. The American Dream is not what we thought it to be - a large house and all the trappings. Nope, for us, it is to be a nice regular house, such as our grandparents owned; modest living is the way to go.

463 jamesfirecat  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 9:24:18pm

re: #460 WindUpBird

My respect for Republicans tends to depend on their social conservative bonafides. If the Republican class of ‘10 is full of ranting Tom Tancredo types and Man-on-Dog Santorum clones, you’ll excuse me if I don’t jump for joy when they’re sworn in.

And if Romney wins in 2012, I’ll respect him, because he’s a decent guy and I think he’d make a good president.I don’t think he’ll get far past the primary, however. I think the climate for a Mormon candidate is worse than it was in 2008.

Glenn Beck been darkening their good name?

464 The Sanity Inspector  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 9:24:39pm

Lights out for me.

Clarence Darrow vs. G. K. Chesterton, Jan 18th, 1931 Will the world return to religion?

Youtube Video
465 Lidane  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 9:24:53pm

re: #461 jamesfirecat

Ahh well played good sir…

Wrong gender, but thanks. :)

466 The Sanity Inspector  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 9:26:10pm

re: #460 WindUpBird

My respect for Republicans tends to depend on their social conservative bonafides. If the Republican class of ‘10 is full of ranting Tom Tancredo types and Man-on-Dog Santorum clones, you’ll excuse me if I don’t jump for joy when they’re sworn in.

And if Romney wins in 2012, I’ll respect him, because he’s a decent guy and I think he’d make a good president.I don’t think he’ll get far past the primary, however. I think the climate for a Mormon candidate is worse than it was in 2008.

Mind, anti-religion liberals hated on him for being a Mormon, too. His flip-flop on some so-con issues was mainly what cost him rightwing support.

467 Guanxi88  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 9:27:38pm

re: #466 The Sanity Inspector

Mind, anti-religion liberals hated on him for being a Mormon, too. His flip-flop on some so-con issues was mainly what cost him rightwing support.

match him up against BHO, and I guaran-damn-tee that the folk who sat out ‘08 because McCain wasn’t conservative enough will run to cast their ballots for Romney.

468 Cato the Elder  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 9:27:45pm

re: #453 The Sanity Inspector

Didn’t say that, now did I?

No. You said, “Plus, originality was never their strong suit.”

LOL.

469 jamesfirecat  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 9:27:48pm

re: #465 Lidane

Wrong gender, but thanks. :)

Sorry should have guessed from the icon, but you know how it is, on the internet you tend to assume everyone is male just to be on the safe side….

470 SpaceJesus  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 9:28:02pm

obama plays modern warfare 2 with a bunch of racist republicans


Youtube Video
471 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 9:28:14pm

re: #462 Guanxi88

Sounds prudent to me! I have an apartment, and I’m sticking with it for now. If I buy a house, it’ll be something small that I can afford easily. I will not be house-poor like some of my friends whose income seems to entirely disappear into their mortgage. My luxury items tend not to be stuff, they tend to be experiences: flying across the country to hang out with old friends, good food, concerts. I confess a love for cars, but I also drive them into the ground. If my Golf hadn’t been wrecked, it would have turned over 200K miles.

472 Political Atheist  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 9:28:36pm

re: #458 Charles

*jaw hangs*

I am reminded of Jon Stewarts look at his bagel hand puppet after watching a Hamas cartoon. That same abject sinking sensation.

473 Lidane  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 9:28:42pm

re: #469 jamesfirecat

Sorry should have guessed from the icon, but you know how it is, on the internet you tend to assume everyone is male just to be on the safe side…

Oh, no worries. I’m not mad or anything. :)

474 jamesfirecat  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 9:29:12pm

re: #467 Guanxi88

match him up against BHO, and I guaran-damn-tee that the folk who sat out ‘08 because McCain wasn’t conservative enough will run to cast their ballots for Romney.

A flip flopping patrician from Massachusetts

I’m sure it’ll work out as well for you as it did for us….

475 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 9:29:33pm

re: #466 The Sanity Inspector

Mind, anti-religion liberals hated on him for being a Mormon, too. His flip-flop on some so-con issues was mainly what cost him rightwing support.

Yeah, and I thought they were unfair. One of my best friends is a devout Mormon.

Whatever Romney campaigns as, I suspect he’d govern the way he did in massacussets, as a moderate.

476 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 9:30:02pm

re: #474 jamesfirecat

A flip flopping patrician from Massachusetts

I’m sure it’ll work out as well for you as it did for us…

OH SNAP. ;-)

477 Dark_Falcon  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 9:30:38pm

re: #464 The Sanity Inspector

Lights out for me.

Clarence Darrow vs. G. K. Chesterton, Jan 18th, 1931 Will the world return to religion?


[Video]

Me too. I’m very tired and I’m going to turn in now.

478 Guanxi88  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 9:31:02pm

re: #471 WindUpBird

Sounds prudent to me! I have an apartment, and I’m sticking with it for now. If I buy a house, it’ll be something small that I can afford easily. I will not be house-poor like some of my friends whose income seems to entirely disappear into their mortgage. My luxury items tend not to be stuff, they tend to be experiences: flying across the country to hang out with old friends, good food, concerts. I confess a love for cars, but I also drive them into the ground. If my Golf hadn’t been wrecked, it would have turned over 200K miles.

I’m telling ANYONE & EVERYONE who’ll listen that there’s a hell of a lot to be said for living well beneath one’s means. Prudence, of course, is a big part of it, but there’s the other side of it, too - the whole peace of mind thing. The bigger, better, more thing is a trick and a lie & a deception for most people - the folk who went through the Dperession and WWII worked to make a world that was safer and better for their children, and ended up divorcing them entirely from the fundamentals of reality.

479 Dancing along the light of day  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 9:31:13pm

re: #458 Charles

OMG.
Paraphrasing…
“We took a guy with no birth certificate, put him in the White House and now 1/2 the country is looking for work.”
Gets a hooting & a hollering standing ovation?
YUCK!

480 Gus  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 9:32:22pm

You know. I remember seeing Bush Derangement Syndrome during his 8 years. I have to say that Obama Derangement Syndrome is far more rampant already in his first year. This has become an almost daily event and organized at times such as the Tea Party protests and in this case the Tea Party Convention. I don’t recall seeing so much non-stop ragging about Bush as we see with Obama.

481 Guanxi88  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 9:32:38pm

re: #474 jamesfirecat

A flip flopping patrician from Massachusetts

I’m sure it’ll work out as well for you as it did for us…

Well, here’s the thing about that:

If he ends up being the nominee, all that’s necessary is to run a more or less anyone but BHO campaign.

Besides, I thought the country was crying out for a moderate.

482 Guanxi88  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 9:34:20pm

re: #480 Gus 802

You know. I remember seeing Bush Derangement Syndrome during his 8 years. I have to say that Obama Derangement Syndrome is far more rampant already in his first year. This has become an almost daily event and organized at times such as the Tea Party protests and in this case the Tea Party Convention. I don’t recall seeing so much non-stop ragging about Bush as we see with Obama.

The inter-tubes make it far easier to get this stuff started and to keep it going.

483 Political Atheist  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 9:34:47pm

That ideo is how you get from RHINO to Ronin.
Ronin is a Japanese word for a wandering Samurai….or a masterless Warrior. Not a master warrior mind you, but one that has no master

484 William Barnett-Lewis  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 9:35:11pm

G’night peeps. Have a good one.

William

485 Guanxi88  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 9:35:46pm

re: #483 Rightwingconspirator

That ideo is how you get from RHINO to Ronin.
Ronin is a Japanese word for a wandering Samurai…or a masterless Warrior. Not a master warrior mind you, but one that has no master

Had they the loyalty of Lord Asano’s retainers……

(47 Ronin reference)

486 jamesfirecat  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 9:36:58pm

re: #481 Guanxi88

Well, here’s the thing about that:

If he ends up being the nominee, all that’s necessary is to run a more or less anyone but BHO campaign.

Besides, I thought the country was crying out for a moderate.

Given how Barack has been upsetting the far left, I thought he was sort of a moderate.

Or do you mean Moderate Republican?

487 freetoken  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 9:37:15pm

Watching the Farrah video it should be clear, without a doubt, that the Tea Party crowd is really just the repackaging of the Religious Right under new wrappers.

Some of the talking points needed to be updated, of course, after 30 years. With the fall of the USSR, the old enemy - atheistic Communism - must now be working through a new agency (Barrack Obama). Web sites have replaced newsletters. Many items didn’t even need a layer of fresh paint (the evil liberal colleges are still the evil liberal colleges, etc.)

488 Gus  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 9:37:50pm

re: #482 Guanxi88

The inter-tubes make it far easier to get this stuff started and to keep it going.

Yeah, it’s partly my own fault for paying so much attention to it. I’m not a fan of the president but things have been over the top (nothing new I know) and we have another 3 years to go.

489 Guanxi88  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 9:39:38pm

re: #486 jamesfirecat

Given how Barack has been upsetting the far left, I thought he was sort of a moderate.

Or do you mean Moderate Republican?

moderate republican. I think of Obama as a left-hawk. He’s a leftist at home - hell, might even be one by temperament and attitude - but outside our borders, he makes soft noises and lets the drones do his talking.

I was REALLY freakin’ worried about the foreign affairs thing - those fears have thus far been unfounded. He might yet pull some foolishness with Israel, but he wouldn’t be the first president - irrespective of party - to drag out the inevitable and go through yet another diplomatic Kabuki play.

490 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 9:39:55pm

re: #327 lostlakehiker

Trouble is, today’s liberals are not willing to see improvements in education, if it impinges on their sacred teachers’ union. They oppose the exploration of space because it wastes money. They’re against nuclear power, against wind power (well, against the transmission lines, and against siting wind towers anywhere the wind blows, e.g. off Nantuckett.)

Liberals oppose free trade, a classic liberal position. Liberals work to keep qualified minorities [Asians] from entering universities in numbers that their accomplishments would merit.

They not only oppose progress itself, they oppose the means by which the next generation can be prepared to make progress.

Is your broad brush badger hair or sable? I favor a 1” flat for oil painting myself, if you work big enough you can get a great wrist action.

Anyway, let’s go down this relentless and silly litany:

I’m pro teacher’s union, but I would support a subsidized private school track, and I’d be okay with vouchers if they were structed in such a way that public money doe snot fund religious schools.

I am pro-space-exploration. I don’t support the ludicrous farce of going to Mars, but I ABSOLUTELY support the space station.

I am pro wind, even if it uglies up the landscape or the seascape. Progress is often ugly. Roads are ugly. Power lines are ugly. They make our lives better. I am pro nuclear, it’s just not a cure-all. we need diversified power.

I don’t know where you’re getting the asian thing, I hang out with a lot of liberals, and none of them would ever support such a thing. Especially since I’m on the west coast and we have a lot of Asian Americans here.

So yeah. I’m a liberal, and yet I don’t fit any of your ludicrous categories. What you’ve said here is really silly and foolish, and bespeaks much tribalism and unwarranted suspicion.

Open thine eyes and think critically. :)

491 Political Atheist  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 9:40:40pm

re: #485 Guanxi88

I changed my profile from right wing refugee to “Just a humble right wing Ronin.”

492 Gus  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 9:41:45pm

re: #487 freetoken

Watching the Farrah video it should be clear, without a doubt, that the Tea Party crowd is really just the repackaging of the Religious Right under new wrappers.

Some of the talking points needed to be updated, of course, after 30 years. With the fall of the USSR, the old enemy - atheistic Communism - must now be working through a new agency (Barrack Obama). Web sites have replaced newsletters. Many items didn’t even need a layer of fresh paint (the evil liberal colleges are still the evil liberal colleges, etc.)

I was thinking about that. My guess is that they’re going for the Dominionist angle. In many respects a lot of the Tea Party people are more religious than the traditional Religious Right. The only times you would see so much reference to religion with the RR would be in the company of James Dobson, Focus on the Family, etc. I think it’s a combination of revanchism and Dominionism promoted by a great deal of fear mongering.

493 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 9:42:18pm

re: #490 WindUpBird

If anyone wonders why I often snark… they need only read #327.

494 NJDhockeyfan  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 9:42:54pm

re: #480 Gus 802

I don’t recall seeing so much non-stop ragging about Bush as we see with Obama.

For 8 years, everyday I read or heard somewhere in which George Bush was called a baby killer, Hitler, warmonger, terrorist, etc… by either a blog, a TV commentator, celebrities, musicians, and the MSM constantly tried to demonize daily. I don’t recall George Bush whining about the negative press very much either.

495 Killgore Trout  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 9:43:04pm

re: #458 Charles

The video of this crazy speech:


[Video]

That’s a very important speech, I think that says it all.

496 Mich-again  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 9:43:04pm

The Tea Party movement is lousy with kooks. I’m sure there are some reasonable people sprinkled in there, but the typical profile is kook.

497 Political Atheist  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 9:43:43pm

re: #493 WindUpBird

We’ll be post racial before we get to post partisan I’m afraid.

498 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 9:45:05pm

re: #497 Rightwingconspirator

We’ll be post racial before we get to post partisan I’m afraid.

We’re never going to be post partisan. :D I just get tired of people making shit up. Lostlakehiker made a bunch of shit up.

499 Gus  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 9:45:41pm

re: #494 NJDhockeyfan

For 8 years, everyday I read or heard somewhere in which George Bush was called a baby killer, Hitler, warmonger, terrorist, etc… by either a blog, a TV commentator, celebrities, musicians, and the MSM constantly tried to demonize daily. I don’t recall George Bush whining about the negative press very much either.

For 8 years yes. Not in the first year. There was some noise but not like this. I would say after 2003 that changed.

I don’t know if it’s whining but frankly when Bush was taking the heat I actually wanted him to “strike back.” I used to get pretty frustrated that he was passive about the criticism. You know I did vote for him in 2004.

500 Guanxi88  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 9:46:41pm

On this subject, the populist uprising currently being acted out before our eyes, I think of the words of Confucius:

“The virtue of the great is as the wind; the virtue of the people is as grass. If the wind blows, will not the grass bend?”

There is no wind now, only grass.

501 What, me worry?  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 9:47:20pm

re: #496 Mich-again

The Tea Party movement is lousy with kooks. I’m sure there are some reasonable people sprinkled in there, but the typical profile is kook.

There’s the teabagger moniker. You’d think that dissuade most of them. Well the men anyway.

“I’m a what?”

502 Cato the Elder  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 9:48:42pm

Thing is, the Teabaggers could pull it off.

They always said “it can’t happen here”.

It could.

We are not made of any finer stuff than the Germans of the 1920s/30s.

503 Guanxi88  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 9:49:21pm

re: #501 marjoriemoon

There’s the teabagger moniker. You’d think that dissuade most of them. Well the men anyway.

“I’m a what?”

I’m amazed that a term used to refer to a heterodox sexual practice would be applied as a term of derision by so many on the left. Thought diversity of that sort was tolerated if not celebrated.

Just sayin’

504 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 9:50:15pm

re: #494 NJDhockeyfan

For 8 years, everyday I read or heard somewhere in which George Bush was called a baby killer, Hitler, warmonger, terrorist, etc… by either a blog, a TV commentator, celebrities, musicians, and the MSM constantly tried to demonize daily. I don’t recall George Bush whining about the negative press very much either.

Bush was called a baby killer by TV commentators? I’d like links to THAT. I mean, someone being interviewed can say whatever, but if you’re referring to professional television broadcasters…?

And musicians? Musicians say and do insane crap all the time. Of course they’ll call Bush Hitler. It would be strange of a punk musician NOT to call Bush Hitler. ;-)

Of course there was plenty of insane Bush talk during his terms. I don’t remember this level of vitriol over every step he made though. I remember it being focused on two things: the war in Iraq, and the perception that he stole the election in 2000. I don’t recall anything that comapres to the mainstreaming of extreme paranoid racist rhetoric that is infecting the GOP with this Tea Party stuff.

505 NJDhockeyfan  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 9:50:44pm

re: #499 Gus 802

For 8 years yes. Not in the first year. There was some noise but not like this. I would say after 2003 that changed.

I don’t know if it’s whining but frankly when Bush was taking the heat I actually wanted him to “strike back.” I used to get pretty frustrated that he was passive about the criticism. You know I did vote for him in 2004.

I agree Bush should have defended his policies. I think he could have had much better poll number if he did. However he didn’t attack the press, or the SCOTUS for that matter. I think it makes the president look bad by doing that. I think his first 4 years were awesome, the last 4 not so much.

BTW…I knew you voted for him.

506 Dancing along the light of day  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 9:50:47pm

re: #502 Cato the Elder

Thing is, the Teabaggers could pull it off.

They always said “it can’t happen here”.

It could.

We are not made of any finer stuff than the Germans of the 1920s/30s.

I hope and pray that you are wrong.
Still, this is truly batshit craziness.
Very angry & unhappy people, combined with a bad economic situation does not make a good equation.

507 Guanxi88  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 9:51:03pm

re: #502 Cato the Elder

Thing is, the Teabaggers could pull it off.

They always said “it can’t happen here”.

It could.

We are not made of any finer stuff than the Germans of the 1920s/30s.

Things get bad or crazy enough, and folk get sufficiently radicalized and hardened in their positions, yeah, things tend to get kinda hairy and pretty quickly at that.

And, no, we’re nothing like the Germans after the Great War; we have far more going for us, and far less to explain what we see.

508 jamesfirecat  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 9:52:18pm

re: #503 Guanxi88

I’m amazed that a term used to refer to a heterodox sexual practice would be applied as a term of derision by so many on the left. Thought diversity of that sort was tolerated if not celebrated.

Just sayin’

Well they picked it themselves, so it’s funny, we didn’t label them they did it to themselves.

It be like if the Anti immigration people came out and said “We’re against all these dam dirty sanchezes” .

509 freetoken  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 9:52:48pm

re: #492 Gus 802

Revanchism was always a strong element of the RR, which is one of the reasons Reagan resonated so well with them.

Dominionism isn’t new either, though the popularization of it through the charismatic/Pentacostal religious crowd was probably a new development. What was the backwater theological playground of the fundamentalist Calvinists became more popular with the much larger name-it-and-claim it religion.

America’s been through a couple of “great” religious movements, the first being back in the colonial days (pre-Revolution), the second during the Civil-War to early 20th century revivals (which saw the birth of dispensationalism and Pentacostalism.) In both of those cases one could conclude that the civil/social order was influenced by the religious movement that immediately preceded it. (E.g., Prohibition.)

The religiosity of the Tea Partiers is written blatantly in their writings and speeches. Note that Farrah refers back to “100 years” in his “taking back” cry. Farrah wants to pick up where the Prohibitionists failed. He wants to explicitly convert the social institutions of today.

Farrah explicitly mentions “culture war” in his speech. This is one reason I put some AGW-related spin-offs under “culture”. The “culture war” is nothing less than the rejection of modernism by those who feel threatened by change (in society, in human knowledge, etc.)

510 What, me worry?  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 9:53:12pm

re: #503 Guanxi88

I’m amazed that a term used to refer to a heterodox sexual practice would be applied as a term of derision by so many on the left. Thought diversity of that sort was tolerated if not celebrated.

Just sayin’

Well it’s quite comical and totally by happenstance. I think if the Tea Party folks thought they’d get stuck with such a name, they would have rethought the whole thing.

Gay folks usually have a pretty good sense of humor btw.

511 Cato the Elder  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 9:53:41pm

re: #507 Guanxi88

Things get bad or crazy enough, and folk get sufficiently radicalized and hardened in their positions, yeah, things tend to get kinda hairy and pretty quickly at that.

And, no, we’re nothing like the Germans after the Great War; we have far more going for us, and far less to explain what we see.

Which makes it even scarier.

512 jamesfirecat  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 9:53:59pm

re: #503 Guanxi88

I’m amazed that a term used to refer to a heterodox sexual practice would be applied as a term of derision by so many on the left. Thought diversity of that sort was tolerated if not celebrated.

Just sayin’

Oh and also Two Million For Marriage choosing to refer to themselves at 2M4M that was also their choice….

513 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 9:55:50pm

re: #503 Guanxi88

I’m amazed that a term used to refer to a heterodox sexual practice would be applied as a term of derision by so many on the left. Thought diversity of that sort was tolerated if not celebrated.

Just sayin’

I thought this had already been covered.

We think it’s funny that they associated themselves with the term. We use it with derision in the sense that it’s funny that ultra-conservative anti-gay types had the misfortune to refer to themselves by slang for a gay sexual practice.

Personally, I think it’s hilarious, and I will continue to call them “Teabaggers” with gusto. Your concern is noted, but it sort of bespeaks some humorlessness. We all know it’s funny that the Bircher weirdos are associated with the term, just like gay columnist Dan Savage made strides to associate bigot Rick Santorum’s name with..well, you know. We make fun because to make fun is to reduce the power of crazies, bigots and paranoids.

Just admit that it’s funny. ;-) “Teabagger” is funny.

514 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 9:57:44pm

re: #511 Cato the Elder

Which makes it even scarier.


I don’t know if we have more going for us intellectually than the Germans.

515 Dancing along the light of day  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 9:58:25pm

re: #509 freetoken

re: #511 Cato the Elder

re: #510 marjoriemoon

OK. So “we” need to fix this situation.
Where do “we” start.
How do “we” make “working together for a better America” something that can distance “us” from the Tea Partiers, and yet, have a strong message. And WHO will carry the message for “us”?.
I’m not seeing any strong message carriers on the horizon..

516 What, me worry?  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 9:59:36pm

re: #502 Cato the Elder

Thing is, the Teabaggers could pull it off.

They always said “it can’t happen here”.

It could.

We are not made of any finer stuff than the Germans of the 1920s/30s.

I don’t think so. I don’t think most people buy into nationalism as a party movement. Those who do have other cute little nicknames. Well maybe not so cute.

517 jamesfirecat  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 9:59:56pm

re: #514 WindUpBird

I don’t know if we have more going for us intellectually than the Germans.

He probably means economically, as bad as it is, at the moment if you’ve got a wheelbarrow full of dollars you place greater value in the dollars than the wheelbarrow.

518 SanFranciscoZionist  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 10:01:23pm

re: #503 Guanxi88

I’m amazed that a term used to refer to a heterodox sexual practice would be applied as a term of derision by so many on the left. Thought diversity of that sort was tolerated if not celebrated.

Just sayin’

It’s not the practice. It’s the fact that the name was adopted without anyone bothering to Google it.

519 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 10:01:24pm

re: #515 Floral Giraffe

re: #511 Cato the Elder

re: #510 marjoriemoon

OK. So “we” need to fix this situation.
Where do “we” start.
How do “we” make “working together for a better America” something that can distance “us” from the Tea Partiers, and yet, have a strong message. And WHO will carry the message for “us”?.
I’m not seeing any strong message carriers on the horizon..

If you have a local candidate that is reasonable, up against a Tea-Party type, make sure you support the reasonable one! In the Republican presidential primary, put as much weight (donations, campaigning) as you can behind the reasonable candidate. Because in the primary, you KNOW there’ll be some Tom Tancredo or some Duncan Hunter in the mix against Romney or whoever.

520 Dancing along the light of day  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 10:01:38pm

re: #515 Floral Giraffe

OK, it’s silly.

Youtube Video
521 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 10:02:31pm

re: #517 jamesfirecat

He probably means economically, as bad as it is, at the moment if you’ve got a wheelbarrow full of dollars you place greater value in the dollars than the wheelbarrow.

Oh i know, the Germans were destitute.

But I’m saying, our country is vulnerable in other areas.

522 Gus  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 10:02:48pm

re: #505 NJDhockeyfan

I agree Bush should have defended his policies. I think he could have had much better poll number if he did. However he didn’t attack the press, or the SCOTUS for that matter. I think it makes the president look bad by doing that. I think his first 4 years were awesome, the last 4 not so much.

BTW…I knew you voted for him.

I think the press is open for criticism regardless of who’s in the White House. Not so much the SCOTUS. One of the things I liked about Bush would be that you wouldn’t hear from him for weeks at at time. Obama on the other hand gets nearly daily coverage and he and his team seeks it. I think they’ve been trying to achieve too much.

523 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 10:03:09pm

re: #518 SanFranciscoZionist

It’s not the practice. It’s the fact that the name was adopted without anyone bothering to Google it.

YES

it’s goddamn comedy, and anyone who doesn’t giggle at it has to have their sense of humor examined. :D

524 Dancing along the light of day  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 10:03:34pm

re: #519 WindUpBird

I got nothing here, for candidates.

525 jamesfirecat  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 10:04:59pm

re: #523 WindUpBird

YES

it’s goddamn comedy, and anyone who doesn’t giggle at it has to have their sense of humor examined. :D

“They don’t want to tea bag alone.”

“Support showing up in dribs and drabs.”

“Of course if you’re going to Tea Bag what you really need is a Dick Armey…”

526 What, me worry?  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 10:05:29pm

re: #518 SanFranciscoZionist

It’s not the practice. It’s the fact that the name was adopted without anyone bothering to Google it.

They picked it? I thought it was how other people referred to them.

527 SanFranciscoZionist  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 10:05:53pm

re: #523 WindUpBird

YES

it’s goddamn comedy, and anyone who doesn’t giggle at it has to have their sense of humor examined. :D

I don’t much care what these folks call themselves, but I am getting bored with people acting as though there’s something hypocritical about calling them ‘teabaggers’.

528 Gus  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 10:06:11pm

re: #524 Floral Giraffe

I got nothing here, for candidates.

This is the age of Simon Cowell and Howard Stern.

529 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 10:06:21pm

re: #525 jamesfirecat

“They don’t want to tea bag alone.”

“Support showing up in dribs and drabs.”

“Of course if you’re going to Tea Bag what you really need is a Dick Armey…”

Man, Dick Armey is an even funnier name than Dick Butkus.

530 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 10:07:15pm

re: #527 SanFranciscoZionist

I don’t much care what these folks call themselves, but I am getting bored with people acting as though there’s something hypocritical about calling them ‘teabaggers’.

Oh I know! It’s all concern trolling. It’s silly.

THE POOR POOR INSANE BIRCHERS, WON’T SOMEONE DEFEND THEM

531 jamesfirecat  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 10:07:20pm

re: #526 marjoriemoon

They picked it? I thought it was how other people referred to them.

No, they picked it, it started with “we’re gonna teabag the White House” and then they naturally realized that if they were going to “teabag” the White House that in turn must make them the “tebaggers” and Jon Stewart said yet another “Thank You Jesus” at scads of easy comedy sent his way…

532 SanFranciscoZionist  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 10:07:28pm

re: #526 marjoriemoon

They picked it? I thought it was how other people referred to them.

My impression was that it was adopted by Tea Party folks before the colloquial meaning of the phrase was discovered.

533 What, me worry?  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 10:07:56pm

re: #519 WindUpBird

If you have a local candidate that is reasonable, up against a Tea-Party type, make sure you support the reasonable one! In the Republican presidential primary, put as much weight (donations, campaigning) as you can behind the reasonable candidate. Because in the primary, you KNOW there’ll be some Tom Tancredo or some Duncan Hunter in the mix against Romney or whoever.

I’ve been somewhat active in my local politics. When things crop up that concern me. I’m debating whether I should get more involved in Kendrick Meek’s senate campaign. I have the opportunity. I don’t know if I have the time.

534 freetoken  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 10:08:22pm

re: #515 Floral Giraffe

By their very nature, the Tea Partiers are reactionaries. They are reacting against the changes which they fear, in many cases probably because they don’t understand them.

As such, the question I would propose is this: how do we make sure that the reactionaries don’t cause harm to our country as we deal with the future as it comes?

I would further propose that the reactionaries are their own enemy. They are more detached from reality than others, at least when it comes to physical world. This puts them at a disadvantage. Thus, perhaps the best strategy is simply to box them in intellectually, and confront their erroneous beliefs when one comes across such people.

However, from dealing with creationists in the past (and make not mistake, Farrah and that crowd to whom he is speaking are creationists, literal creationists) I have learned that such deeply held world-views do not change easily, and that intentional self-blindness is an emotional trait that cannot be cured.

535 What, me worry?  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 10:10:03pm

re: #531 jamesfirecat

No, they picked it, it started with “we’re gonna teabag the White House” and then they naturally realized that if they were going to “teabag” the White House that in turn must make them the “tebaggers” and Jon Stewart said yet another “Thank You Jesus” at scads of easy comedy sent his way…

LOL Doh!

536 What, me worry?  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 10:10:48pm

re: #532 SanFranciscoZionist

My impression was that it was adopted by Tea Party folks before the colloquial meaning of the phrase was discovered.

Apparently so!

537 Varek Raith  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 10:11:08pm

re: #526 marjoriemoon

They picked it? I thought it was how other people referred to them.

Heh, nope, they called themselves that for a few weeks before they looked up what it meant….
:D

538 What, me worry?  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 10:11:09pm

It all starts to run together eventually.

539 jamesfirecat  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 10:11:28pm

re: #534 freetoken

By their very nature, the Tea Partiers are reactionaries. They are reacting against the changes which they fear, in many cases probably because they don’t understand them.

As such, the question I would propose is this: how do we make sure that the reactionaries don’t cause harm to our country as we deal with the future as it comes?

I would further propose that the reactionaries are their own enemy. They are more detached from reality than others, at least when it comes to physical world. This puts them at a disadvantage. Thus, perhaps the best strategy is simply to box them in intellectually, and confront their erroneous beliefs when one comes across such people.

However, from dealing with creationists in the past (and make not mistake, Farrah and that crowd to whom he is speaking are creationists, literal creationists) I have learned that such deeply held world-views do not change easily, and that intentional self-blindness is an emotional trait that cannot be cured.

Dietrich Bonhoffer said that there could be no internal liberation without external liberation.

Maybe the teabaggers can’t be brought around to thinking like intelligent people until they see that which they love and cherish crushed? Right now they’re ridding high, let them get slammed at the polls, let them get slammed at the poles, twice, let them get slammed at the polls three times, let every time they show up they split the conservative vote so Democrats walk away with the election.

Let them see that they can never be the party ruling the US….

540 windsagio  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 10:12:41pm

God, massive stroke of Deja Vu.

I am currently freaking.

541 Varek Raith  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 10:13:15pm

re: #540 windsagio

God, massive stroke of Deja Vu.

I am currently freaking.

Glitch in the Matrix, nothing to worry about…yet…
:P

542 What, me worry?  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 10:13:59pm

re: #534 freetoken

There’s nothing you can do, in the sense of them organizing. You’re allowed to do that in this country and I’m ok with that.

I’m also ok letting them be out in the open so we can all see who they are. I have faith in America, but I’m a liberal after all :)

543 jamesfirecat  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 10:14:52pm

re: #536 marjoriemoon

Apparently so!

Would you believe a conservative group against gay marriage would name themselves after an acronym previously established to mean two gay men looking for a third?

544 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 10:14:55pm

re: #540 windsagio

God, massive stroke of Deja Vu.

I am currently freaking.

THE WAVERIDER

545 Dancing along the light of day  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 10:15:03pm

re: #528 Gus 802

This is the age of Simon Cowell and Howard Stern.

And, I dislike them both, intensely.
For different reasons.

546 What, me worry?  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 10:16:26pm

re: #543 jamesfirecat

Would you believe a conservative group against gay marriage would name themselves after an acronym previously established to mean two gay men looking for a third?

I always think of John Waters. I’m so pissed at him as of late with the whole Manson women thing, but I still think Pecker was brilliant.

547 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 10:16:44pm

re: #534 freetoken


As such, the question I would propose is this: how do we make sure that the reactionaries don’t cause harm to our country as we deal with the future as it comes?

You spread the word and educate people about their associations!

548 Gus  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 10:16:48pm

re: #534 freetoken

The reality is that tea people represent an endangered species. By 2050 their main demographic will start dipping into minority status. They might get a few congressmen elected but nationally they’ll be just as popular as Mike Gravel or Ron Paul.

549 freetoken  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 10:17:05pm

re: #539 jamesfirecat

The RR/Tea Party crowd has been with us for over 30 years. They will still be here in 30 years, but fewer in number because they will die off, and fewer young people will take their place.

Bonhoffer was an optimist! He believed people can change. I believe people can change, but few do so, or do so very quickly.

What Farrah and crowd fear is that the young hispanic children who will be registered to vote (by ACORN) when they turn 18 don’t have a past of going to Sunday School and being taught exactly what he, Farrah, believes, so these new voters will have no cultural identity with which to share with him.

So he will “lose” his country.

This is what Farrah, and Brimelow, and Tancredo, that whole crowd of Tea Party True Believers fear. The next generation of Americans reject the old ways.

550 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 10:17:06pm

re: #546 marjoriemoon

I always think of John Waters. I’m so pissed at him as of late with the whole Manson women thing, but I still think Pecker was brilliant.

I love that movie :D

551 jamesfirecat  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 10:20:54pm

re: #549 freetoken

The RR/Tea Party crowd has been with us for over 30 years. They will still be here in 30 years, but fewer in number because they will die off, and fewer young people will take their place.

Bonhoffer was an optimist! He believed people can change. I believe people can change, but few do so, or do so very quickly.

What Farrah and crowd fear is that the young hispanic children who will be registered to vote (by ACORN) when they turn 18 don’t have a past of going to Sunday School and being taught exactly what he, Farrah, believes, so these new voters will have no cultural identity with which to share with him.

So he will “lose” his country.

This is what Farrah, and Brimelow, and Tancredo, that whole crowd of Tea Party True Believers fear. The next generation of Americans reject the old ways.

Then maybe these people won’t be able to relax until they have lost what they fear loosing, (how Buddhist of me I know) maybe at some point they’ll be able to relax and realize that things aren’t so bad.

Others I expect to go down kicking, screaming, and spewing obscenities all the way….

552 Cato the Elder  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 10:22:11pm

re: #515 Floral Giraffe

re: #511 Cato the Elder

re: #510 marjoriemoon

OK. So “we” need to fix this situation.
Where do “we” start.
How do “we” make “working together for a better America” something that can distance “us” from the Tea Partiers, and yet, have a strong message. And WHO will carry the message for “us”?.
I’m not seeing any strong message carriers on the horizon..

Not among Republicans, no.

I voted for Obama once and I will do it again unless the GOP pulls a magic unicorn out of their butts.

553 Gus  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 10:24:23pm

re: #549 freetoken

The RR/Tea Party crowd has been with us for over 30 years. They will still be here in 30 years, but fewer in number because they will die off, and fewer young people will take their place.

Bonhoffer was an optimist! He believed people can change. I believe people can change, but few do so, or do so very quickly.

What Farrah and crowd fear is that the young hispanic children who will be registered to vote (by ACORN) when they turn 18 don’t have a past of going to Sunday School and being taught exactly what he, Farrah, believes, so these new voters will have no cultural identity with which to share with him.

So he will “lose” his country.

This is what Farrah, and Brimelow, and Tancredo, that whole crowd of Tea Party True Believers fear. The next generation of Americans reject the old ways.

Religiously, the new demographics of Hispanics will be Catholic. Farrah, Brimelow, and Tancredo represent a Protestant demographic.

554 What, me worry?  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 10:25:17pm

re: #549 freetoken

The RR/Tea Party crowd has been with us for over 30 years. They will still be here in 30 years, but fewer in number because they will die off, and fewer young people will take their place.

Bonhoffer was an optimist! He believed people can change. I believe people can change, but few do so, or do so very quickly.

What Farrah and crowd fear is that the young hispanic children who will be registered to vote (by ACORN) when they turn 18 don’t have a past of going to Sunday School and being taught exactly what he, Farrah, believes, so these new voters will have no cultural identity with which to share with him.

So he will “lose” his country.

This is what Farrah, and Brimelow, and Tancredo, that whole crowd of Tea Party True Believers fear. The next generation of Americans reject the old ways.

Maybe. But Acorn isn’t all over the country gobbling up immigrant votes. I never heard of them until this election.

But take heart, my right wing-ed friends! Many of the Cubans my age (middle age) are still voting Republican like their parents. I was also surprised to learn that a young coworker who recently became a citizen (Nicaraguan/Costa Rican) is a registered Republican.

555 Varek Raith  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 10:25:56pm

re: #553 Gus 802

Religiously, the new demographics of Hispanics will be Catholic. Farrah, Brimelow, and Tancredo represent a Protestant demographic.


I’m sure they’re also just thrilled with the growing number of Americans who are atheist or identify their religion as ‘none’.

556 What, me worry?  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 10:26:09pm

re: #552 Cato the Elder

Not among Republicans, no.

I voted for Obama once and I will do it again unless the GOP pulls a magic unicorn out of their butts.

OOhhhhh that was funnyyy lol

557 Varek Raith  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 10:27:29pm

re: #556 marjoriemoon

OOhhh that was funnyyy lol

Hey now! Nothing funny about having a magical equine fly outta your butt!
/

558 Lidane  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 10:27:57pm

re: #549 freetoken

This is what Farrah, and Brimelow, and Tancredo, that whole crowd of Tea Party True Believers fear. The next generation of Americans reject the old ways.

What’s really mind-blowing about that is that every generation rejects some part of what’s come before it. They’re basically afraid of the inevitable.

I mean, just look at how much things have changed in just the last 20 years. I’ve tried to think back to what my life was like in high school (I graduated in ‘91) and I can’t go back to it. I just can’t. It’s like a whole other world that no longer exists, and not just because of the passage of time. Everything has simply changed that much.

I can’t wrap my head around the level of fear that people like Farrah, Tancredo and the rest of the Teabaggers live under. Just how insecure do you have to be to lash out so strongly at society evolving and changing around you? I don’t get it.

559 ryannon  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 10:30:06pm

re: #502 Cato the Elder

Thing is, the Teabaggers could pull it off.

They always said “it can’t happen here”.

It could.

We are not made of any finer stuff than the Germans of the 1920s/30s.

Or the Italians. I recently watched a month-by-month analysis of the rise of Mussolini, the Black Shirts, the March on Rome and the Italian Fascist Party and was struck by the repetition of themes, circumstances and in short, history. Not a 1:1 situation, obviously, but basically the idea of how the road to hell is paved with good intentions, the support of a lot of otherwise good people, and the manipulation of a handful of sociopaths.

560 freetoken  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 10:30:24pm

re: #553 Gus 802

Religiously, the new demographics of Hispanics will be Catholic.

And fairly nominal Catholics at that. What I gather as I wander around San Diego, which is (and has always been) greatly influenced by the nation just a few miles away, is that younger Latinos just aren’t very religious.

Oh, they will wear crucifixes, but that is about as deep as their belief structure seems to take them. Otherwise, they seem caught up in the daily American quest to make more money, get a better job, etc.

561 Gus  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 10:30:47pm

re: #555 Varek Raith

I’m sure they’re also just thrilled with the growing number of Americans who are atheist or identify their religion as ‘none’.

And Pastafarians.

Ironically many of the first Teabaggers were atheists. They’ve been co-opted by the Dominionists.

562 Varek Raith  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 10:30:49pm

Anyone else see this?
Challenger disaster home video found.

563 jamesfirecat  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 10:31:09pm

re: #558 Lidane

What’s really mind-blowing about that is that every generation rejects some part of what’s come before it. They’re basically afraid of the inevitable.

I mean, just look at how much things have changed in just the last 20 years. I’ve tried to think back to what my life was like in high school (I graduated in ‘91) and I can’t go back to it. I just can’t. It’s like a whole other world that no longer exists, and not just because of the passage of time. Everything has simply changed that much.

I can’t wrap my head around the level of fear that people like Farrah, Tancredo and the rest of the Teabaggers live under. Just how insecure do you have to be to lash out so strongly at society evolving and changing around you? I don’t get it.

Lets bring back that pick I say posted here of the seven signs of senliity and what it leads you to objecting to

“Modern books”
“Modern Art”
“Modern Clothing”
“Modern Gadets”
“Modern Movies”
“Modern Dancing”
“Modern Anything”

564 What, me worry?  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 10:32:13pm

re: #558 Lidane

What’s really mind-blowing about that is that every generation rejects some part of what’s come before it. They’re basically afraid of the inevitable.

I mean, just look at how much things have changed in just the last 20 years. I’ve tried to think back to what my life was like in high school (I graduated in ‘91) and I can’t go back to it. I just can’t. It’s like a whole other world that no longer exists, and not just because of the passage of time. Everything has simply changed that much.

I can’t wrap my head around the level of fear that people like Farrah, Tancredo and the rest of the Teabaggers live under. Just how insecure do you have to be to lash out so strongly at society evolving and changing around you? I don’t get it.

What is the age demographic of the tea party people? Middle aged, no? Or is it mixed?

565 Varek Raith  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 10:32:17pm

re: #561 Gus 802

And Pastafarians.

Ironically many of the first Teabaggers were atheists. They’ve been co-opted by the Dominionists.

Beer volcanoes and stripper factories! Wheee!
I quite like the idea of evolving from pirates. ;)

566 What, me worry?  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 10:33:54pm

re: #559 ryannon

Or the Italians. I recently watched a month-by-month analysis of the rise of Mussolini, the Black Shirts, the March on Rome and the Italian Fascist Party and was struck by the repetition of themes, circumstances and in short, history. Not a 1:1 situation, obviously, but basically the idea of how the road to hell is paved with good intentions, the support of a lot of otherwise good people, and the manipulation of a handful of sociopaths.

The one theme they didn’t have was our Constitution and founding documents. Maybe it’s cliche but I think says a lot.

567 Gus  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 10:34:17pm

re: #560 freetoken

And fairly nominal Catholics at that. What I gather as I wander around San Diego, which is (and has always been) greatly influenced by the nation just a few miles away, is that younger Latinos just aren’t very religious.

Oh, they will wear crucifixes, but that is about as deep as their belief structure seems to take them. Otherwise, they seem caught up in the daily American quest to make more money, get a better job, etc.

That’s how we grew up. Buenos Aires Catholic style. No Sunday school, no evangelism, no fire and brimstone. It was rather passive. “Yeah, we’re Catholic.” We never heard any Bible quotes or talked about Adam and Eve and Genesis (i.e. Creationism).

568 Dancing along the light of day  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 10:34:40pm

re: #561 Gus 802

You didn’t say ‘Pastafarians” did you?
[Link: www.venganza.org…]

You did!

569 laZardo  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 10:35:34pm

Wow…if this Birthercon isn’t conservative thought at its finest (per se), I don’t know what is.

570 Lidane  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 10:35:34pm

re: #564 marjoriemoon

What is the age demographic of the tea party people? Middle aged, no? Or is it mixed?

I’m not sure, to be honest. From the pictures I’ve seen, I’d say middle-aged on up to senior citizens, but that could also be a distorted image from a small sample of photos.

I’m curious about that now. I wonder how much of this Teabagger nonsense is as much a reaction to the rapid changes in technology and society in general as it is to any economic or political issues they claim.

571 Slumbering Behemoth Stinks  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 10:35:35pm

re: #549 freetoken

This is what Farrah, and Brimelow, and Tancredo, that whole crowd of Tea Party True Believers fear. The next generation of Americans reject the old ways.

They must, if this country is to remain a great nation.

572 What, me worry?  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 10:36:18pm

re: #561 Gus 802

And Pastafarians.

Ironically many of the first Teabaggers were atheists. They’ve been co-opted by the Dominionists.

I have to show my husband that site. He’s a heathen atheist. I’m just afraid I’ll be forced to hang the FSM every holiday. What to do… what to do….

573 Slumbering Behemoth Stinks  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 10:36:46pm

re: #569 laZardo

How many times do I have to tell you that these atavists are not even remotely the embodiment of conservative thought?

574 Killgore Trout  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 10:37:00pm

re: #568 Floral Giraffe

I really like the holiday decorations.

575 Gus  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 10:37:23pm

re: #568 Floral Giraffe

You didn’t say ‘Pastafarians” did you?
[Link: www.venganza.org…]

You did!

Yes. And Spaghetti was created by an even more complex intelligent being, the Tortellini. We’re still trying to figure out who designed the Tortellini.

/

576 What, me worry?  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 10:38:12pm

re: #570 Lidane

I’m not sure, to be honest. From the pictures I’ve seen, I’d say middle-aged on up to senior citizens, but that could also be a distorted image from a small sample of photos.

I’m curious about that now. I wonder how much of this Teabagger nonsense is as much a reaction to the rapid changes in technology and society in general as it is to any economic or political issues they claim.

That was my impression too. That’s why I don’t think it will have any long lasting teeth.

577 Soap_Man  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 10:39:31pm

Evening everyone. I love seeing that photo of the walrus. The birther shit is how I found this blog in the first place.

578 Dancing along the light of day  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 10:39:39pm

re: #574 Killgore Trout

I really like the holiday decorations.

I don’t know that I’d put one up on MY tree, but they were funny!

579 Cato the Elder  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 10:40:05pm

re: #563 jamesfirecat

Lets bring back that pick I say posted here of the seven signs of senliity and what it leads you to objecting to

“Modern books”
“Modern Art”
“Modern Clothing”
“Modern Gadets”
“Modern Movies”
“Modern Dancing”
“Modern Anything”

Which is funny, because anything done today under those headings was already done almost a century ago by the Dadaists and the Flappers, to mention but two groups.

580 Varek Raith  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 10:40:30pm

re: #569 laZardo

Hmm, broad brushing is bad, mmmkay? I can point to all manner of crazy on the left that don’t represent liberal thought.
;)

581 laZardo  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 10:41:08pm

re: #573 Slumbering Behemoth

How many times do I have to tell you that these atavists are not even remotely the embodiment of conservative thought?

How many times do I have to tell you that conservatism and libertarianism are like apples and oranges?

582 jamesfirecat  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 10:41:19pm

re: #573 Slumbering Behemoth

How many times do I have to tell you that these atavists are not even remotely the embodiment of conservative thought?

You know I didn’t really see the word “atavistic” and its various variations much until I came to LGF.

583 jamesfirecat  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 10:42:04pm

re: #579 Cato the Elder

Which is funny, because anything done today under those headings was already done almost a century ago by the Dadaists and the Flappers, to mention but two groups.

No what’s funny was that the pic was an old timey 40/20’s cartoon.

584 ryannon  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 10:42:27pm

re: #515 Floral Giraffe

re: #511 Cato the Elder

re: #510 marjoriemoon

OK. So “we” need to fix this situation.
Where do “we” start.
How do “we” make “working together for a better America” something that can distance “us” from the Tea Partiers, and yet, have a strong message. And WHO will carry the message for “us”?.
I’m not seeing any strong message carriers on the horizon..

It’s when the actions and people behind the slogans begin to permute and take on contrary meanings that it’s all over - and just beginning. re: #566 marjoriemoon

The one theme they didn’t have was our Constitution and founding documents. Maybe it’s cliche but I think says a lot.

They had a Parliament, laws, democratic elections and constitutional monarchy - in short, a viable government which morphed like play-dough under the repeated onslaughts of the ‘people’. They were getting Italy back on the rails, cleaning up its act and it all looked very good…at first.

585 What, me worry?  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 10:42:45pm

Ok, for you adventure geeks. Have you checked out Kingdom of Loathing?

[Link: www4.kingdomofloathing.com…]

You can make a Pastamancer among other Loathsome choices.

586 Slumbering Behemoth Stinks  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 10:42:49pm

re: #581 laZardo

How many times do I have to tell you that conservatism and libertarianism are like apples and oranges?

You’re constant confusion between what constitutes libertarian thought and conservative thought is losing it’s amusing quality.

587 freetoken  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 10:42:49pm

re: #567 Gus 802

Right. They go to church when their are baptisms, weddings, funerals, etc.

I don’t live very far from a large (and beautiful) Catholic church. There is traffic on Sundays, but not overwhelmingly so.

It’s an institutional identity, which may be cherished at a certain level, but is just one of many sources of information and interaction.

These young people are not part of Farrah’s normal customers. They’re not Tea Partiers. The young people I see everyday care more about having the latest type of cell phone than, say, fighting back Evolution in schools.

588 Varek Raith  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 10:43:58pm

re: #586 Slumbering Behemoth

You’re constant confusion between what constitutes libertarian thought and conservative thought is losing it’s amusing quality.

Indeed, considering that I’m a sane, small ‘l’ libertarian.
:)

589 laZardo  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 10:44:56pm

re: #588 Varek Raith

Indeed, considering that I’m a sane, small ‘l’ libertarian.
:)

Liberals can be libertarian too, e.g. protesting the PATRIOT act.

590 Slumbering Behemoth Stinks  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 10:45:08pm

re: #582 jamesfirecat

You know I didn’t really see the word “atavistic” and its various variations much until I came to LGF.

What’s really interesting is when some news/blog outlets misspell “atavist” as “activist”.
:)

591 laZardo  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 10:45:58pm

re: #580 Varek Raith

Hmm, broad brushing is bad, mmmkay? I can point to all manner of crazy on the left that don’t represent liberal thought.
;)

Considering that the American political spectrum is ‘centered’ to the right, it’d definitely be broad-brushing to paint everyone to the left as the same…of course, it also narrowly defines what’s to the right.

592 Slumbering Behemoth Stinks  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 10:48:11pm

re: #585 marjoriemoon

GET THEE BEHIND ME!

593 Soap_Man  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 10:48:29pm

re: #588 Varek Raith

Indeed, considering that I’m a sane, small ‘l’ libertarian.
:)

My girlfriend is a libertarian. Unfortunately, she gets lumped in with Ron Paul. It makes me sad.

594 jamesfirecat  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 10:49:35pm

re: #587 freetoken

Right. They go to church when their are baptisms, weddings, funerals, etc.

I don’t live very far from a large (and beautiful) Catholic church. There is traffic on Sundays, but not overwhelmingly so.

It’s an institutional identity, which may be cherished at a certain level, but is just one of many sources of information and interaction.

These young people are not part of Farrah’s normal customers. They’re not Tea Partiers. The young people I see everyday care more about having the latest type of cell phone than, say, fighting back Evolution in schools.

Thank “god” for materalisim!

595 Varek Raith  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 10:49:55pm

re: #593 Soap_Man

My girlfriend is a libertarian. Unfortunately, she gets lumped in with Ron Paul. It makes me sad.

Yep, I have to say the ‘sane’ and ‘small l’ part before the word libertarian… Otherwise, people assume I’m a Ronulan. :/

596 What, me worry?  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 10:50:02pm

re: #584 ryannon

They had a Parliament, laws, democratic elections and constitutional monarchy - in short, a viable government which morphed like play-dough under the repeated onslaughts of the ‘people’. They were getting Italy back on the rails, cleaning up its act and it all looked very good…at first.

I’m not a fan of a Parliaments, but as I also mentioned above, these governments created nationalist agendas. It’s one thing to be patriotic, love and respect your country, but nationalist movements tend to define who is suitable and who is not and then you have big problems.

597 Lidane  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 10:50:16pm

re: #567 Gus 802

That’s how we grew up. Buenos Aires Catholic style. No Sunday school, no evangelism, no fire and brimstone. It was rather passive. “Yeah, we’re Catholic.” We never heard any Bible quotes or talked about Adam and Eve and Genesis (i.e. Creationism).

That’s how I grew up. I’m Mexican-American. Catholicism is pretty much the default setting, but it was never really my setting, even if the accessories are nice.

Oh sure, my mother is an observant Catholic. She goes to Mass as often as she can, volunteers at her parish, keeps meatless Fridays, remembers the Holy Days of Obligation and all that. Some of my relatives are the same way. I went to Sunday school, got Confirmed in high school, etc. Hell, I just graduated from a Catholic university and am planning on going back to it for grad school. However, for me, Catholicism has always been more of a cultural thing than a religious one. I never grew up in a home that was about fire and brimstone, or evangelism. We were just Catholic, and that’s how it was.

Even now, despite my personal atheism, Catholicism is very much a cultural reference point in my life. It’s just not something I live by, if that makes sense.

598 What, me worry?  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 10:50:37pm

re: #592 Slumbering Behemoth

GET THEE BEHIND ME!

LOL You play??

599 jamesfirecat  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 10:51:10pm

re: #596 marjoriemoon

I’m not a fan of a Parliaments, but as I also mentioned above, these governments created nationalist agendas. It’s one thing to be patriotic, love and respect your country, but nationalist movements tend to define who is suitable and who is not and then you have big problems.

And there haven’t been attempts to do that?


“I’m so glad to be here in real America….”

600 Dancing along the light of day  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 10:51:12pm

It is time.
I must say “good night”.
May your dreams be sweet, and your real life be sweeter.
And your rock be sunwarmed, Lizardia!
And your typo’s be verry funny!

601 Soap_Man  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 10:52:40pm

re: #595 Varek Raith

Yep, I have to say the ‘sane’ and ‘small l’ part before the word libertarian… Otherwise, people assume I’m a Ronulan. :/

I always wonder how he became the default spokesman for liberatarianism for the general public…

602 What, me worry?  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 10:53:50pm

re: #599 jamesfirecat

And there haven’t been attempts to do that?

“I’m so glad to be here in real America…”

Here? I don’t think so. Overthrow of government? or government takeovers? Well not in a few 100 years anyway!

Ok now I’m totally confused if you’re snarky or not!

603 Slumbering Behemoth Stinks  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 10:54:01pm

re: #598 marjoriemoon

No, but I linked a few laughably, blatantly dishonest pieces last night about how “role playing games” were tools for satanic/demonic indoctrination.

604 What, me worry?  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 10:55:34pm

re: #603 Slumbering Behemoth

No, but I linked a few laughably, blatantly dishonest pieces last night about how “role playing games” were tools for satanic/demonic indoctrination.

Oh dear.

605 Slumbering Behemoth Stinks  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 10:56:18pm

re: #604 marjoriemoon

Thus the “GET THEE BEHIND ME!” bit.

606 Soap_Man  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 10:56:31pm

re: #603 Slumbering Behemoth

No, but I linked a few laughably, blatantly dishonest pieces last night about how “role playing games” were tools for satanic/demonic indoctrination.

And for gang activity, according to the Department of Corrections: Dungeons & Dragons Prison Ban Upheld

607 What, me worry?  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 10:56:45pm

re: #605 Slumbering Behemoth

Thus the “GET THEE BEHIND ME!” bit.

I sadly missed it. But I’ll find it!

608 Varek Raith  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 10:59:08pm

re: #607 marjoriemoon

I sadly missed it. But I’ll find it!

Here ya go!

[Link: littlegreenfootballs.com…]

[Link: littlegreenfootballs.com…]

609 What, me worry?  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 10:59:21pm

re: #606 Soap_Man

And for gang activity, according to the Department of Corrections: Dungeons & Dragons Prison Ban Upheld

I did see that. I think it’s probably a good idea. Certain games can be pretty intensive, particularly for murderous felons. Ya mean they’re not happy with golf?

610 jamesfirecat  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 10:59:22pm

re: #602 marjoriemoon

Here? I don’t think so. Overthrow of government? or government takeovers? Well not in a few 100 years anyway!

Ok now I’m totally confused if you’re snarky or not!

“but nationalist movements tend to define who is suitable and who is not and then you have big problems.”

I’m arguing that there have been attempts to do this here recently, weather its Sarah Palin’s “Real America” or the dicussion of only letting certain citizens vote previously brought up today….

611 Gus  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 10:59:52pm

re: #597 Lidane

That’s how I grew up. I’m Mexican-American. Catholicism is pretty much the default setting, but it was never really my setting, even if the accessories are nice.

Oh sure, my mother is an observant Catholic. She goes to Mass as often as she can, volunteers at her parish, keeps meatless Fridays, remembers the Holy Days of Obligation and all that. Some of my relatives are the same way. I went to Sunday school, got Confirmed in high school, etc. Hell, I just graduated from a Catholic university and am planning on going back to it for grad school. However, for me, Catholicism has always been more of a cultural thing than a religious one. I never grew up in a home that was about fire and brimstone, or evangelism. We were just Catholic, and that’s how it was.

Even now, despite my personal atheism, Catholicism is very much a cultural reference point in my life. It’s just not something I live by, if that makes sense.

That makes sense to me. I’m an atheist too and my Catholic heritage as a cultural reference point. It’s like when I hear people say “I’m a recovering Catholic” I never understood that because my experience wasn’t the kind of in your face religion we find in North America. I think that has something to do with it since it wasn’t as much as “keeping up with the Jones” or having to prove oneself as they do in the USA where we find a lot of people feeling the need to advertise their beliefs.

612 Slumbering Behemoth Stinks  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 11:00:01pm

This as scene(?) music on a tv show right now.

I may be loyal to the metal, but this aging hessian loves all kinds of music.

613 Gus  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 11:03:48pm

Night folks!

Bob Marley- Three Little Birds

Youtube Video
614 What, me worry?  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 11:03:56pm

re: #608 Varek Raith

Here ya go!

[Link: littlegreenfootballs.com…]

[Link: littlegreenfootballs.com…]

Well that certainly is some wild and crazy stuff!

615 ryannon  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 11:04:18pm

re: #596 marjoriemoon

I’m not a fan of a Parliaments, but as I also mentioned above, these governments created nationalist agendas. It’s one thing to be patriotic, love and respect your country, but nationalist movements tend to define who is suitable and who is not and then you have big problems.

Call it a nationalistic movement or anything you like. As for me, I’m struck by certain historical parallels. Example: “Mussolini and the fascists managed to be simultaneously revolutionary and traditionalist;[25][26] because this was vastly different to anything else in the political climate of the time, it is sometimes described as “The Third Way” Like I said, it’s not so much a question of looking for a hypothetical 1:1 correspondence as much as an oft-repeated repetition of circumstances which lead to a progressive transformation of something into something else. In the U.S., this could easily be accomplished using all the existing Constitutional and legislative structures.

616 Slumbering Behemoth Stinks  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 11:05:21pm

re: #601 Soap_Man

I always wonder how he became the default spokesman for liberatarianism for the general public…

The Libertarian party in America seems to be the catcher’s mitt for the kookiest of the kooks that all the other parties reject. Being a kook’s kook, he is their poster boy, of sorts.

Also, he ran for POTUS as a Libertarian.

617 Varek Raith  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 11:06:19pm

re: #616 Slumbering Behemoth

The Libertarian party in America seems to be the catcher’s mitt for the kookiest of the kooks that all the other parties reject. Being a kook’s kook, he is their poster boy, of sorts.

Also, he ran for POTUS as a Libertarian.

Yep, it’s also pretty damn near an anarchy party, as well.
Sigh…

618 What, me worry?  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 11:06:43pm

re: #610 jamesfirecat

“but nationalist movements tend to define who is suitable and who is not and then you have big problems.”

I’m arguing that there have been attempts to do this here recently, weather its Sarah Palin’s “Real America” or the dicussion of only letting certain citizens vote previously brought up today…

I don’t think those are real attempts. They certainly are pandering to a base, but in the grand scheme of things, I don’t give it much power. (I also pray not to eat my words…)

619 jamesfirecat  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 11:09:25pm

re: #618 marjoriemoon

I don’t think those are real attempts. They certainly are pandering to a base, but in the grand scheme of things, I don’t give it much power. (I also pray not to eat my words…)

I hope your right but still its hard not to get goosebumps when you think about someone arguing that there is a “real America” since that in turn must mean there’s a “fake America” and if that America is the “fake America” then what does that mean about the people living in it are they “fake Americans” like they’re actually Canadians or something?

620 What, me worry?  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 11:11:00pm

re: #615 ryannon

Call it a nationalistic movement or anything you like. As for me, I’m struck by certain historical parallels. Example: “Mussolini and the fascists managed to be simultaneously revolutionary and traditionalist;[25][26] because this was vastly different to anything else in the political climate of the time, it is sometimes described as “The Third Way” Like I said, it’s not so much a question of looking for a hypothetical 1:1 correspondence as much as an oft-repeated repetition of circumstances which lead to a progressive transformation of something into something else. In the U.S., this could easily be accomplished using all the existing Constitutional and legislative structures.

I think a lot of about what goes on in our government is at least as much about fixing what’s broken as to reinventing the wheel. There’s a lot of fright surrounding Obama that plain old isn’t there. This whole far left socialist thing is such bullshit. That’s not him, nor ever was him.

I don’t think he’s trying to reinvent the wheel as much as polish it back up again.

621 Slumbering Behemoth Stinks  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 11:12:01pm

re: #617 Varek Raith

Hey, at least I didn’t call it “libertarian thought at its finest”. Per se.

622 jamesfirecat  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 11:12:53pm

re: #621 Slumbering Behemoth

Hey, at least I didn’t call it “libertarian thought at its finest”. Per se.

Yeah, there’s nothing quite as libertarian as the government deciding who does and who doesn’t get to vote!

///

623 Slumbering Behemoth Stinks  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 11:14:30pm

re: #622 jamesfirecat

Yeah, that went over my head. Little help?

624 Lidane  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 11:14:53pm

re: #611 Gus 802

It’s like when I hear people say “I’m a recovering Catholic” I never understood that because my experience wasn’t the kind of in your face religion we find in North America.

Yeah, I don’t get the whole “Recovering Catholic” thing either. I guess because it was just part and parcel of my life and I never really thought about it. It was just normal. It wasn’t anything out of the ordinary.

Of course, I didn’t believe in it either. Not much, anyway. Hence my atheism.

The folks I’ve known that are “Recovering” anything grew up in the real hellfire and brimstone homes, or they were preacher’s kids, or they came from a Protestant background. I don’t think I’ve ever met a Recovering Catholic in my life. The only guy I knew who even came close was Irish-Catholic and had more baggage than O’Hare, but that was probably due more to his general home life as a kid (strict military dad, etc.) than his religious upbringing.

As far as Hispanic kids, though? Nope. Not a one. I think we just tend to absorb it all as just part of the culture, so there’s not as much getting bent out of shape over it. It just is what it is, you know?

625 jamesfirecat  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 11:16:04pm

re: #623 Slumbering Behemoth

Yeah, that went over my head. Little help?

Well Liberterians are suppose to be all about having as little government as possible rigth?

So I was showing why this particular view point that….. oh yeah we’re not in the Tan Credo an the citizenship test thread any more are we? I think I need to go to sleep

626 Slumbering Behemoth Stinks  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 11:19:46pm

re: #625 jamesfirecat

Hmm… I wasn’t aware that Tancredo was a Libertarian. I thought he was a Reactionary that had the gall to call himself a conservative.

I’m confused.

627 jamesfirecat  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 11:21:42pm

re: #626 Slumbering Behemoth

Hmm… I wasn’t aware that Tancredo was a Libertarian. I thought he was a Reactionary that had the gall to call himself a conservative.

I’m confused.

Well you mentioned in the previous post the one I responded to that there was a difference between conservative and liberterian thought and then….

You know what this thing is probably only funny because I should have been in bed 30 min ago….

628 What, me worry?  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 11:23:15pm

re: #624 Lidane

I think some atheists have a real feeling of betrayal when it comes to religion. Maybe a sense of being preyed on, being left vulnerable and feeling foolish. Humiliation is wrapped up in it. That could even be physical abuse (parochial schools and so on). So I get a lot of the anger and feeling the need to “recover” from it.

629 ryannon  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 11:23:27pm

re: #620 marjoriemoon

I think a lot of about what goes on in our government is at least as much about fixing what’s broken as to reinventing the wheel. There’s a lot of fright surrounding Obama that plain old isn’t there. This whole far left socialist thing is such bullshit. That’s not him, nor ever was him.

I don’t think he’s trying to reinvent the wheel as much as polish it back up again.

I’m not sure we’re talking about the same thing, but in my case, it’s definitely not Obama.

630 What, me worry?  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 11:24:41pm

re: #629 ryannon

I’m not sure we’re talking about the same thing, but in my case, it’s definitely not Obama.

It’s far too late to get into this discussion. I need to totter off to bed anyway.

631 simoom  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 11:25:06pm

From Glenn Beck’s Radio Show the other day:

Barack Obama, I believe, has done the same thing. He chose to use his name Barack for a reason — to identify, not with America — you don’t take the name Barack to identify with America. You take the name Barack to identify with what? Your heritage? The heritage, maybe, of your father in Kenya, who is a radical? Is — really?

Searching for something to give him any kind of meaning, just as he was searching later in life for religion.

Media Matters Video

I don’t know… maybe he wanted to be called Barack because it was the name he was born with?

632 Slumbering Behemoth Stinks  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 11:35:15pm

re: #627 jamesfirecat

Well you mentioned in the previous post the one I responded to that there was a difference between conservative and liberterian thought and then…

This is oddly interesting. You did not respond to my post about there being a difference between conservative thought and libertarian thought.

You know what this thing is probably only funny because I should have been in bed 30 min ago…

Probably for the best. Sleep well.

633 Lidane  Fri, Feb 5, 2010 11:44:20pm

re: #628 marjoriemoon

I think some atheists have a real feeling of betrayal when it comes to religion. Maybe a sense of being preyed on, being left vulnerable and feeling foolish. Humiliation is wrapped up in it. That could even be physical abuse (parochial schools and so on). So I get a lot of the anger and feeling the need to “recover” from it.

Oh, I can totally see that. I just don’t have any personal experience with it, so it’s not anything I can relate to, if that makes sense.

I’d imagine that if I grew up in an abusive or hellish environment where religion was a bludgeon, I’d have to recover from it. I just happened to grow up in a very culturally Catholic, but passively religious home. I did all the sacraments and rites of passage, but my mom coaxed me to church by saying it was just an hour a week, and the rest of it was a reason to hang out with my friends away from school.

634 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Sat, Feb 6, 2010 1:40:43am

re: #631 simoom

From Glenn Beck’s Radio Show the other day:

[Link: mediamatters.org…]

I don’t know… maybe he wanted to be called Barack because it was the name he was born with?

Glenn Beck is not credible in any way. The man wants watchers and listeners, and will tell any lie, savage anyone in order to get those listeners. I remember LISTENING to Glenn Beck back when his radio show was much more moderate-right-wing intelligent snark, and he goofed on conspiracy theorists and bircher types. He was the smart young dude that struck back at the beardy paranoid fucks. His show was good! And might have been a thing that LGFers might have liked, back in the late 90’s/early 2000’s, from what I heard of it.

Then he became the paranoid fuck because the checks cleared, and the paymasters wanted a nasty populist. Money can make a man evil.

635 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Sat, Feb 6, 2010 1:43:27am

re: #612 Slumbering Behemoth

This as scene(?) music on a tv show right now.

I may be loyal to the metal, but this aging hessian loves all kinds of music.

Upding for Portishead. We have even more music in common that I thought. I should probably jsut zip up my collection and mail it to you on a DVD :D


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