Religious Family Abandons US Because Gays and Abortion, Gets Lost at Sea, Has to Be Rescued

Apparently God doesn’t have a functioning GPS system.
Wingnuts • Views: 16,797

PHOENIX — A northern Arizona family that was lost at sea for weeks in an ill-fated attempt to leave the U.S. over what they consider government interference in religion will fly back home Sunday.

Hannah Gastonguay, 26, said Saturday that she and her husband “decided to take a leap of faith and see where God led us” when they took their two small children and her father-in-law and set sail from San Diego for the tiny island nation of Kiribati in May.

But just weeks into their journey, the Gastonguays hit a series of storms that damaged their small boat, leaving them adrift for weeks, unable to make progress. They were eventually picked up by a Venezuelan fishing vessel, transferred to a Japanese cargo ship and taken to Chile where they are resting in a hotel in the port city of San Antonio.

Their flights home were arranged by U.S. Embassy officials, Gastonguay said. The U.S. State Department was not immediately available for comment.

The months-long journey has been “pretty exciting” and “little scary at certain points,” Gastonguay told The Associated Press by telephone.

She said they wanted to go to Kiribati because “we didn’t want to go anywhere big.” She said they understood the island to be “one of the least developed countries in the world.”

Kiribati is a group of islands just off the equator and the international date line about halfway between Hawaii and Australia. The total population is just over 100,000 people of primarily Micronesian descent.

Hannah Gastonguay said her family was fed up with government control in the U.S. As Christians they don’t believe in “abortion, homosexuality, in the state-controlled church,” she said.

U.S. “churches aren’t their own,” Gastonguay said, suggesting that government regulation interfered with religious independence.

More: Religious Family Abandons US, Gets Lost at Sea - Wire Election News - the Sacramento Bee

Jump to bottom

77 comments
1 Skip Intro  Sun, Aug 11, 2013 8:49:47am

The most likely reason these wingnuts chose the welfare state paradise of Kiribati.

The law in Kiribati prohibits consensual sex between male same-sex couples and appears to be silent with regard to sex between female same-sex couples [R1.1].

Laws of the Gilbert Islands, Penal Code [Cap 67] Revised Edition 1977

Unnatural Offences

Section 153. Any person who-

(a) commits buggery with another person or with an animal; or
(b) permits a male person to commit buggery with him or her,

shall be guilty of a felony, and shall be liable to imprisonment for 14 years.

Attempts to commit unnatural offences and indecent assaults

Section 154. Any person who attempts to commit any of the offences it specified in the last preceding section, or who is guilty of any assault with intent to commit the same, or any indecent assault upon any male person shall be guilty of a felony, and shall be liable to imprisonment for 7 years.

Indecent practices between males

Section 155. Any male person who, whether in public or private, commits any act of gross indecency with another male person, or procures another male person to commit any act of gross indecency with him, or attempts to procure the commission of any such act by any male person with himself or with another male person, whether in public or private, shall be guilty of a felony, and shall be liable to imprisonment for 5 years.

2 Jayleia  Sun, Aug 11, 2013 9:11:39am

Dear Wingnuts,

This was your warning.

Love, God

3 HappyWarrior  Sun, Aug 11, 2013 9:56:38am

I feel bad for their kids.

4 Raw Satanic Sewage Recipes  Sun, Aug 11, 2013 10:32:08am

I say we take up a collection to help these poor oppressed people finally get to another country!

5 No Country For Old Haters  Sun, Aug 11, 2013 10:33:12am

re: #3 HappyWarrior

I feel bad for their kids.

So do I, and I wish these were the only kids being warped by religious fanatics, but unfortunately it’s a widespread problem.

6 Lidane  Sun, Aug 11, 2013 10:50:50am
7 krypto  Sun, Aug 11, 2013 10:50:53am

They were headed in the wrong direction before they even started on the trip.

8 Charles Johnson  Sun, Aug 11, 2013 10:54:08am
9 PhillyPretzel  Sun, Aug 11, 2013 10:59:00am

re: #8 Charles Johnson

GG- Graduate Gemologist or a Glen Greenwald fan?

10 HappyWarrior  Sun, Aug 11, 2013 11:01:26am

re: #5 No Country For Old Haters

So do I, and I wish these were the only kids being warped by religious fanatics, but unfortunately it’s a widespread problem.

Totally.

11 Justanotherhuman  Sun, Aug 11, 2013 11:01:45am

Why would anyone want to go to a country that is one of the world’s poorest, with 100K population? The average life expectancy is 60 (57 for men, 63 for women).

Did they think they’d get their own little atoll? Little did they understand that almost everything they need would have to be imported from other countries. Or were they planning to live on coconuts and rats?

Wow, talk about delusional…

12 Carlos Diggler  Sun, Aug 11, 2013 11:01:46am

Ick-snay on the bugger-aye in the Kiribat-ee?

Who knew?

13 Political Atheist  Sun, Aug 11, 2013 11:02:28am

re: #9 PhillyPretzel

Hah! GG=Graduate Gemologists=Good Guessers=Gods Gift etc . If I put that on my FB I would so catch some heat.

14 Decatur Deb  Sun, Aug 11, 2013 11:03:20am

re: #11 Justanotherhuman

Why would anyone want to go to a country that is one of the world’s poorest, with 100K population? The average life expectancy is 60 (57 for men, 63 for women).

Did they think they’d get their own little atoll? Little did they understand that almost everything they need would have to be imported from other countries. Or were they planning to live on coconuts and rats?

Wow, talk about delusional…

Mosquito Coast

imdb.com

15 HappyWarrior  Sun, Aug 11, 2013 11:03:28am

re: #11 Justanotherhuman

Why would anyone want to go to a country that is one of the world’s poorest, with 100K population? The average life expectancy is 60 (57 for men, 63 for women).

Did they think they’d get their own little atoll? Little did they understand that almost everything they need would have to be imported from other countries. Or were they planning to live on coconuts and rats?

Wow, talk about delusional…

Yeah but somehow that would be better than living under the tyranny of Obama Hitler Bin Stalin.//

16 PhillyPretzel  Sun, Aug 11, 2013 11:04:25am

re: #13 Political Atheist

Yes. I have a GIA Diamond Certificate but I do not mention it on my resume. Too many questions.

17 Justanotherhuman  Sun, Aug 11, 2013 11:04:58am

Then, there’s this:

Kiribati: A Nation Going Under

theglobalmail.org

18 Kragar  Sun, Aug 11, 2013 11:06:01am
19 Decatur Deb  Sun, Aug 11, 2013 11:06:48am

re: #17 Justanotherhuman

Then, there’s this:

Kiribati: A Nation Going Under

theglobalmail.org

Shit. It’s Tarawa. Nice name change by the Ministry of Tourism.

20 Justanotherhuman  Sun, Aug 11, 2013 11:08:12am

re: #19 Decatur Deb

Shit. It’s Tarawa. Nice name change by the Ministry of Tourism.

Yeah, that hit me, too. Along with the global warming sinking to come.

21 Decatur Deb  Sun, Aug 11, 2013 11:14:41am

re: #20 Justanotherhuman

Yeah, that hit me, too. Along with the global warming sinking to come.

NOAA should subsidize an expat compound for GW deniers. Then they’d be the first to know.

22 Shiplord Kirel  Sun, Aug 11, 2013 11:16:28am

re: #19 Decatur Deb

Shit. It’s Tarawa. Nice name change by the Ministry of Tourism.

The article fails to mention it, but more than 4000 Japanese soldiers also perished on Tarawa. Only 17 soldiers and 129 Korean laborers survived to be taken prisoner. The godforsaken sandspit ranks with Verdun in bloodshed per square meter.

23 Political Atheist  Sun, Aug 11, 2013 11:16:30am

re: #16 PhillyPretzel

Yeah outside the trade it has little respect. Which is too bad as it’s a pretty thorough program. Not easy at all. I think it shows one can work subjectively (eyes) and bring that to objective standards consistently. That’s IMO a skill that carries over.

24 Ming  Sun, Aug 11, 2013 11:25:46am

The couple took their two small children on the sea voyage! Wow.

I generally expect that parents love their children so much, that no way would they put their own kids in physical danger.

Even in the face of particular beliefs, like “God will protect my children on the boat”, I would expect almost every parent to somehow find a way to NOT endanger their own kids. They may have to twist their thinking into quite a complex pretzel, but they’ll somehow end up protecting the little ones. That what parents do!

But there are exceptions. This couple from Arizona is really scraping the bottom of the barrel.

25 Dr Lizardo  Sun, Aug 11, 2013 11:26:46am

re: #4 Raw Satanic Sewage Recipes

I say we take up a collection to help these poor oppressed people finally get to another country!

Fine, but they need to stay the hell out of the Czech Republic. We’re pretty much wingnut-free, and we’d like to keep it that way, thanks.

26 ProTARDISLiberal  Sun, Aug 11, 2013 11:27:04am

re: #24 Ming

When they are back in the US, Social Services need to look at taking the Children. The parents are quite clearly a danger to them.

27 bubba zanetti  Sun, Aug 11, 2013 11:27:32am

re: #14 Decatur Deb

Mosquito Coast

imdb.com

It would be a great service to swap out book covers between Mosquito Coast and Atlas Shrugs at your local library.

28 Decatur Deb  Sun, Aug 11, 2013 11:29:39am

OT, but classic:

GOP Strategist demonstrates ‘nut punch’ on Rep Steve King.

thinkprogress.org

29 Kragar  Sun, Aug 11, 2013 11:29:58am

re: #22 Shiplord Kirel

The article fails to mention it, but more than 4000 Japanese soldiers also perished on Tarawa. Only 17 soldiers and 129 Korean laborers survived to be taken prisoner. The godforsaken sandspit ranks with Verdun in bloodshed per square meter.

To deal with dug in bunkers, Marines would bury doors and hatches with sand, then locate the air vents and pour in fuel to burn the Japanese soldiers out.

I was a member of 3/2 when I was in the Marines. We were called the Betio Battalion.

30 Justanotherhuman  Sun, Aug 11, 2013 11:31:03am

Underground with the sharks: buzzfeed.com

31 HappyWarrior  Sun, Aug 11, 2013 11:31:49am

re: #30 Justanotherhuman

Underground with the sharks: buzzfeed.com

Whoa.

32 Justanotherhuman  Sun, Aug 11, 2013 11:32:30am

re: #26 ProTARDISLiberal

When they are back in the US, Social Services need to look at taking the Children. The parents are quite clearly a danger to them.

It’s gotta be equivalent to driving drunk with your kids in the car.

33 HappyWarrior  Sun, Aug 11, 2013 11:33:29am

re: #28 Decatur Deb

OT, but classic:

GOP Strategist demonstrates ‘nut punch’ on Rep Steve King.

thinkprogress.org

Good on Navarro. King needs to be smacked down but it’s even better when it’s someone from his own party. I do think she was being kind when she described him as mediocre- which implies he’s at least average. He’s probably in the bottom tier.

34 HappyWarrior  Sun, Aug 11, 2013 11:34:00am

re: #32 Justanotherhuman

It’s gotta be equivalent to driving drunk with your kids in the car.

Yep child endangerment.

35 ProTARDISLiberal  Sun, Aug 11, 2013 11:34:32am

re: #32 Justanotherhuman

Worse, in a way actually.

Because they consciously made the decision every morning to keep with this delusional quest for whatever the hell they were doing, in spite of risk to their children.

There needs to be a child custody hearing the moment they touch foot in Arizona.

36 Shiplord Kirel  Sun, Aug 11, 2013 11:35:20am

Speaking of Verdun, the thing that made it so hellish, and an icon of horror and inhumanity, is the small size of the battle area, only about 6.2 square kilometers. You can easily see the whole thing from the small rise where the Ossuary of Douamont was built to hold the remains of the dead after the war. Something over half a million German and French soldiers were killed in that tiny area in the space of a few months. The vast majority were never identified. Since the area was a giant cemetery, and useless for any other purpose, the French government planted it with trees and allowed it to return to nature. The French Forest Service manages it. To this day its rangers find human bones in the forest literally every couple of days on average. They are taken to the ossuary, examined, and placed in one of its numerous crypts.

37 HappyWarrior  Sun, Aug 11, 2013 11:39:21am

re: #36 Shiplord Kirel

Speaking of Verdun, the thing that made it so hellish, and an icon of horror and inhumanity, is the small size of the battle area, only about 6.2 square kilometers. You can easily see the whole thing from the small rise where the Ossuary of Douamont was built to hold the remains of the dead after the war. Something over half a million German and French soldiers were killed in that tiny area in the space of a few months. The vast majority were never identified. Since the area was a giant cemetery, and useless for any other purpose, the French government planted it with trees and allowed it to return to nature. The French Forest Service manages it. To this day its rangers find human bones in the forest literally every couple of days on average. They are taken to the ossuary, examined, and placed in one of its numerous crypts.

What’s always struck me about the first world war is how many people could witness warfare and some would come out of it like Remarque and write perhaps the best anti-war novel ever and yet others like Hitler would come out of it with a thirst for more war. I’m not surprised that they still find bones. WWI feels more and more like a distant memory every day but I was actually thinking about it recently since a mother of my grandmother’s good friend is turning 99 today. She would have been only three weeks when the war began in late July of 1914. And my other set of grandparents were toddlers when the war started. We’ve sadly seen the last of the doughboys and others though. That generation was just as brave and admirable as the WWII one but they really don’t get enough talk.

38 Political Atheist  Sun, Aug 11, 2013 11:40:57am

Ohhhh *facepalm*

39 Targetpractice  Sun, Aug 11, 2013 11:43:14am

re: #18 Kragar

A Texan Tragedy: Plenty of Oil, but No Water

The Southwest is going to be one massive ghost town within my lifetime, and it’s because of the fucking oil companies. Let me show you my surprise.

40 jamesfirecat  Sun, Aug 11, 2013 11:44:18am

re: #36 Shiplord Kirel

Speaking of Verdun, the thing that made it so hellish, and an icon of horror and inhumanity, is the small size of the battle area, only about 6.2 square kilometers. You can easily see the whole thing from the small rise where the Ossuary of Douamont was built to hold the remains of the dead after the war. Something over half a million German and French soldiers were killed in that tiny area in the space of a few months. The vast majority were never identified. Since the area was a giant cemetery, and useless for any other purpose, the French government planted it with trees and allowed it to return to nature. The French Forest Service manages it. To this day its rangers find human bones in the forest literally every couple of days on average. They are taken to the ossuary, examined, and placed in one of its numerous crypts.

I did not spend much time in France but I have to say over the last summer I was shockingly impressed by what a great job they have done preserving some of the war related history sites (Utah and Omaha beach) granted the fact that Normandy is also one of the poorest regions in France may have played a part of it, wich I guess makes it an unhappy coincidence.


Either way, the place was well enough preserved that I shit you not I could recognize some of it just from having played Company of Heroes.

41 Dr Lizardo  Sun, Aug 11, 2013 11:45:25am

re: #36 Shiplord Kirel

Speaking of Verdun, the thing that made it so hellish, and an icon of horror and inhumanity, is the small size of the battle area, only about 6.2 square kilometers. You can easily see the whole thing from the small rise where the Ossuary of Douamont was built to hold the remains of the dead after the war. Something over half a million German and French soldiers were killed in that tiny area in the space of a few months. The vast majority were never identified. Since the area was a giant cemetery, and useless for any other purpose, the French government planted it with trees and allowed it to return to nature. The French Forest Service manages it. To this day its rangers find human bones in the forest literally every couple of days on average. They are taken to the ossuary, examined, and placed in one of its numerous crypts.

There’s still something like 100,000 officially listed as missing; no doubt that accounts for the skeletal remains that turn up so frequently. A grim contemporary reminder of one of the bloodiest battlefields in European history.

42 Randall Gross  Sun, Aug 11, 2013 11:46:16am

RIP Eydie Gorme

Youtube Video

kmbz.com

43 Justanotherhuman  Sun, Aug 11, 2013 11:50:35am

re: #37 HappyWarrior

What’s always struck me about the first world war is how many people could witness warfare and some would come out of it like Remarque and write perhaps the best anti-war novel ever and yet others like Hitler would come out of it with a thirst for more war. I’m not surprised that they still find bones. WWI feels more and more like a distant memory every day but I was actually thinking about it recently since a mother of my grandmother’s good friend is turning 99 today. She would have been only three weeks when the war began in late July of 1914. And my other set of grandparents were toddlers when the war started. We’ve sadly seen the last of the doughboys and others though. That generation was just as brave and admirable as the WWII one but they really don’t get enough talk.

My maternal grandfather (who I never knew) was a soldier in WWI and never recovered from it. He spent the rest of his life in and out of VA hospitals (leaving my grandmother w/6 kids to raise during the Depression), and the only proof I had he ever existed was a small 2x3 hooked wool rug he had made in a VA hospital that he gave to my g-mother. She never talked about him much, but I think he had severe PTSD, or shell-shock, as they called it then, and he drank to excess. He died in 1948; he’d been a mere boy when he enlisted, and they married very young when he got back to the US—he was 18, she was 16.

44 HappyWarrior  Sun, Aug 11, 2013 11:53:18am

re: #43 Justanotherhuman

My maternal grandfather (who I never knew) was a soldier in WWI and never recovered from it. He spent the rest of his life in and out of VA hospitals (leaving my grandmother w/6 kids to raise during the Depression), and the only proof I had he ever existed was a small 2x3 hooked wool rug he had made in a VA hospital that he gave to my g-mother. She never talked about him much, but I think he had severe PTSD, or shell-shock, as they called it then, and he drank to excess. He died in 1948; he’d been a mere boy when he enlisted, and they married very young when he got back to the US—he was 18, she was 16.

I can’t imagine what he must have went through. I remember hearing a historian say that in many a way the 20th century really began the day WWI started.

45 Decatur Deb  Sun, Aug 11, 2013 11:57:27am

re: #40 jamesfirecat

I did not spend much time in France but I have to say over the last summer I was shockingly impressed by what a great job they have done preserving some of the war related history sites (Utah and Omaha beach) granted the fact that Normandy is also one of the poorest regions in France may have played a part of it, wich I guess makes it an unhappy coincidence.

Either way, the place was well enough preserved that I shit you not I could recognize some of it just from having played Company of Heroes.

This is the US Battle Monument at Lorraine, FR, another war. My dad is in the right background. As originally buried near Magdeburg, his crew was placed two to a coffin, because they had shrivelled so on the trip down from 20,000 ft.

Image: stacks_image_454.jpg

46 ObserverArt  Sun, Aug 11, 2013 12:00:16pm

re: #26 ProTARDISLiberal

When they are back in the US, Social Services need to look at taking the Children. The parents are quite clearly a danger to them.

And then they and those of similar thinking following their story will cry “see, the big bad government wants to take our kids and prevent us from practicing our religion.” The proper response feeds the paranoia. Others see it and turn it into gospel truth, the government is out to take your kids if you do not follow their dictates.

It can be a vicious cycle. It’s like the axiom about not getting into an argument with an idiot.

47 Dr Lizardo  Sun, Aug 11, 2013 12:00:35pm

re: #44 HappyWarrior

I can’t imagine what he must have went through. I remember hearing a historian say that in many a way the 20th century really began the day WWI started.

In many ways, that’s true. There was a Czech lecturer making the circuit here a few years ago - whose name eludes me - who was talking about the “Long War” theory, basically, that both WWI and WWII were the same war, with a 21-year ceasefire in between. So in that reckoning, the Great European War lasted from 1914 to 1945. As he pointed out, it technically didn’t really end until Germany regained her sovereignty in 1991 and was no longer an occupied nation.

An interesting lecture, with a different view of history; I found it quite fascinating.

48 Vicious Babushka  Sun, Aug 11, 2013 12:10:27pm

re: #18 Kragar

A Texan Tragedy: Plenty of Oil, but No Water

What’s next, are the Texans planning to invade Michigan and steal all our waters WITH THERE GUNZ!!11!!

49 First As Tragedy, Then As Farce  Sun, Aug 11, 2013 12:11:02pm

re: #41 Dr Lizardo

WWI was a particularly barbaric war (not that there’s ever been a pleasant one) for a number of reasons. This was the first war in history where cavalry — frickin cavalry, fer cryin out loud — was finally and completely rendered obsolete, and the generals did not adapt well. They were still sending cavalry out to be massacred by machine gun fire even by the time the war ended.

WWI was the war for artillery, dominated by the big guns, with tanks and functioning bombers still in the future. The industrial countries blow through millions of tons of artillery shells, cratering and re-cratering the landscape, first indiscriminately and then in creeping waves as they learn how to use
them; the entire peace-time reservoirs of shells are expended in months at the start of the war, and they churn out more, the later battles often using in a matter of days as many shells as even existed in the world in 1912. Being on the front lines usually meant being surrounded by the constant shock and roar of the big guns, always meant living in fear that you could be snuffed out in an instant by them; and besides the pure psychological terror, meant exposure to literal shockwaves that were constantly fucking with your brain in ways we’re only just coming to grips with today as we deal with combat veterans who’ve been exposed to IEDs.

If you’re a soldier in WWI, you’re spending your time in a squalid trench with severe shortages of pretty much everything, so that almost everything you ate or wore was a shitty substitute made from something else; The Germans had paper shoes and acorn coffee. Most of the time is a constant tedium and the fear that at any second a massive offensive
could be launched, or even just a random burst of artillery fire, that reduces you to aerosol without you ever hearing or seeing a warning of it. This is your best case scenario.

Some of the battles themselves drag on for months of near-constant murder. Maybe if you have a good general you get rotated through so you’re not constantly living under the guillotine, but more likely your commander has you or a bunch of your buddies killed for a few worthless square miles that will just be given up again when he realizes he can’t defend them at all.

The “Stabbed in the Back” myth that Hitler would use so effectively later to help rise to power held that the German army was never defeated in the field, that it lost to politicians at home. The first part is actually kind of true though. Even on the run at the end, the Germans inflicted about as many casualties as they took. The thing is they were never really victorious in the field, because battles during WWI just weren’t winnable, at all, by either side. The technology meant that both sides were just slowly grinding away at each other until someone gave up. To the soldiers this meant there was never any hope of victory on the horizon, but also no hope even of defeat. Just sitting there, waiting to die.

If you’re interested in WWI, you might want to read A World Undone by GJ Meyer.

50 Shiplord Kirel  Sun, Aug 11, 2013 12:11:20pm

re: #37 HappyWarrior

What’s always struck me about the first world war is how many people could witness warfare and some would come out of it like Remarque and write perhaps the best anti-war novel ever and yet others like Hitler would come out of it with a thirst for more war.

It is that way with every war. The contrasting responses are probably more extreme for World War I veterans because the experience of battle was so extreme. This was made worse by the complete lack of preparation and awareness in the generation that fought the war. In 1914, war was still touted as a romantic and heroic endeavor. Believe it or not, French curraisiers still rode into battle in 1914 wearing polished breastplates and plumed helmets (though not for long).
Vietnam veterans also vary a great deal in the lessons they draw from what the media call “the experience.” Some are total pacifists, some are gun-crazed survivalists. I fall between the extremes. It sets my teeth on edge, though, when I hear civilians with no military or combat experience making bloodthirsty calls for war whenever some real or imaginary provocation arises. I react like this even when I think war is justified, as after 9-11. I am not a religious man, but hearing these ignorantly violent rants makes me want to quote the words of Christ from the cross: “Forgive them, Father, for they know not what they do.”

51 darthstar  Sun, Aug 11, 2013 12:11:55pm

Arizona family lost at sea. God does work in weird ways.

My initial comment when I first read this story:

52 Vicious Babushka  Sun, Aug 11, 2013 12:12:28pm
53 darthstar  Sun, Aug 11, 2013 12:13:06pm

re: #52 Vicious Babushka

[Embedded content]

A LIST!

54 Vicious Babushka  Sun, Aug 11, 2013 12:14:54pm
55 Dr Lizardo  Sun, Aug 11, 2013 12:15:05pm

re: #52 Vicious Babushka

[Embedded content]

ZOMG WE’RE ON A LIST! ITZ OFF TO TEH FEMA CAMPS!

56 Decatur Deb  Sun, Aug 11, 2013 12:15:30pm

re: #26 ProTARDISLiberal

When they are back in the US, Social Services need to look at taking the Children. The parents are quite clearly a danger to them.

Modern eyes. What of a farmer who loaded five kids into a wagon in St. Louis, 1850, and headed out to Cheyenne country? We cut parents a lot of slack until we see the outcome.

57 Vicious Babushka  Sun, Aug 11, 2013 12:15:57pm

I’ve got a little list!
Youtube Video

58 Dr Lizardo  Sun, Aug 11, 2013 12:17:05pm

re: #49 First As Tragedy, Then As Farce

WWI was a particularly barbaric war (not that there’s ever been a pleasant one) for a number of reasons. This was the first war in history where cavalry — frickin cavalry, fer cryin out loud — was finally and completely rendered obsolete, and the generals did not adapt well. They were still sending cavalry out to be massacred by machine gun fire even by the time the war ended.

WWI was the war for artillery, dominated by the big guns, with tanks and functioning bombers still in the future. The industrial countries blow through millions of tons of artillery shells, cratering and re-cratering the landscape, first indiscriminately and then in creeping waves as they learn how to use
them; the entire peace-time reservoirs of shells are expended in months at the start of the war, and they churn out more, the later battles often using in a matter of days as many shells as even existed in the world in 1912. Being on the front lines usually meant being surrounded by the constant shock and roar of the big guns, always meant living in fear that you could be snuffed out in an instant by them; and besides the pure psychological terror, meant exposure to literal shockwaves that were constantly fucking with your brain in ways we’re only just coming to grips with today as we deal with combat veterans who’ve been exposed to IEDs.

If you’re a soldier in WWI, you’re spending your time in a squalid trench with severe shortages of pretty much everything, so that almost everything you ate or wore was a shitty substitute made from something else; The Germans had paper shoes and acorn coffee. Most of the time is a constant tedium and the fear that at any second a massive offensive
could be launched, or even just a random burst of artillery fire, that reduces you to aerosol without you ever hearing or seeing a warning of it. This is your best case scenario.

Some of the battles themselves drag on for months of near-constant murder. Maybe if you have a good general you get rotated through so you’re not constantly living under the guillotine, but more likely your commander has you or a bunch of your buddies killed for a few worthless square miles that will just be given up again when he realizes he can’t defend them at all.

The “Stabbed in the Back” myth that Hitler would use so effectively later to help rise to power held that the German army was never defeated in the field, that it lost to politicians at home. The first part is actually kind of true though. Even on the run at the end, the Germans inflicted about as many casualties as they took. The thing is they were never really victorious in the field, because battles during WWI just weren’t winnable, at all, by either side. The technology meant that both sides were just slowly grinding away at each other until someone gave up. To the soldiers this meant there was never any hope of victory on the horizon, but also no hope even of defeat. Just sitting there, waiting to die.

If you’re interested in WWI, you might want to read A World Undone by GJ Meyer.

I’ll have to check that out. I’ve read “The Guns of August” by Barbara Tuchman, which I found to be a very good book indeed.

59 darthstar  Sun, Aug 11, 2013 12:17:50pm
60 Justanotherhuman  Sun, Aug 11, 2013 12:18:07pm

re: #47 Dr Lizardo

Some scholars call that another “Thirty Years War”.

61 darthstar  Sun, Aug 11, 2013 12:18:35pm

Okay, folks…time to go see a ballgame, eat some good food, and have a few beers (and my good-luck shot of Jameson).

62 Vicious Babushka  Sun, Aug 11, 2013 12:18:45pm

Hmmm the lyrics are somewhat Modernized from the original G&S.

63 Romantic Heretic  Sun, Aug 11, 2013 12:20:30pm

re: #49 First As Tragedy, Then As Farce

Youtube Video

64 Dr Lizardo  Sun, Aug 11, 2013 12:24:27pm

re: #60 Justanotherhuman

Some scholars call that another “Thirty Years War”.

I’ve heard that phrase as well; “The Second Thirty Years War”. I believe it was Churchill who coined that phrase in his book, “The Gathering Storm”. It’s also been attributed to Marshal Ferdinand Foch of France, who, with eerie prescience, once dismissed the Treaty of Versailles as “…nothing but a 20-year ceasefire in a second Thirty Years’ War.”

65 First As Tragedy, Then As Farce  Sun, Aug 11, 2013 12:24:37pm

re: #47 Dr Lizardo

WWI and WWII were the same war, with a 21-year ceasefire in between. So in that reckoning, the Great European War lasted from 1914 to 1945. As he pointed out, it technically didn’t really end until Germany regained her sovereignty in 1991 and was no longer an occupied nation.

I agree with that, and I’ve also always thought (without anything “scholarly” backing me up, just my own opinion) that to this very day we’re still feeling the effects of WWII. Tons of technology and modern political situations are direct ripples of that huge global upheaval (see North Korea for only one example).

66 Romantic Heretic  Sun, Aug 11, 2013 12:24:46pm

On topic: We’ll be hearing from these people again. Most likely the whole family in a murder/suicide. Or worse, kids dead and the parents bragging about how they ‘saved their kids.’

Sigh.

67 sizzzzlerz  Sun, Aug 11, 2013 12:27:16pm

Good on the Polynesian gods for keeping those heathen xtians away from their islands. xtians have been god-bothering those poor natives for too long now. Finally, the gods have learned to be proactive and keep the fuckers away before they make shore.

68 Political Atheist  Sun, Aug 11, 2013 12:27:36pm

re: #26 ProTARDISLiberal
re: #56 Decatur Deb

Modern eyes. What of a farmer who loaded five kids into a wagon in St. Louis, 1850, and headed out to Cheyenne country? We cut parents a lot of slack until we see the outcome.

We happily allow parents to take kids on adventures. Camping where bears roam. Whitewater rafting. Deep water sailing. Scuba diving. Hiking in back country. Flying in small planes. What should make the difference IMHO is the responsible parties competence and the circumstance, not the religion and motivation.

69 Romantic Heretic  Sun, Aug 11, 2013 12:29:44pm

re: #64 Dr Lizardo

I’ve heard that phrase as well; “The Second Thirty Years War”. I believe it was Churchill who coined that phrase in his book, “The Gathering Storm”. It’s also been attributed to Marshal Ferdinand Foch of France, who, with eerie prescience, once dismissed the Treaty of Versailles as “…nothing but a 20-year ceasefire in a second Thirty Years’ War.”

One good thing came of it: The United Nations.

The people who lead the victor nations of WWII realized that such a thing could not happen again. Next time would be the last time, the very last time.

So they created the United Nations which was meant to handle the changes in the world’s power structure without a war happening.

Yeah, the organization has problems, but there hasn’t been a WWIII. I don’t think that a coincidence and I’m pleased there hasn’t been another world war in my life time.

70 Dr Lizardo  Sun, Aug 11, 2013 12:31:26pm

re: #65 First As Tragedy, Then As Farce

I agree with that, and I’ve also always thought (without anything “scholarly” backing me up, just my own opinion) that to this very day we’re still feeling the effects of WWII. Tons of technology and modern political situations are direct ripples of that huge global upheaval (see North Korea for only one example).

The 20th century could be defined as an “epochal war”, one that has broad ramifications for the world order, international relations, etc. We’re still dealing with the fallout from the era, and we will be for quite some time to come. The balance of power in the world is still readjusting from that period.

71 Decatur Deb  Sun, Aug 11, 2013 12:31:52pm

re: #68 Political Atheist

We happily allow parents to take kids on adventures. Camping where bears roam. Whitewater rafting. Deep water sailing. Scuba diving. Hiking in back country. Flying in small planes. What should make the difference IMHO is the responsible competence and circumstance, not the religion and motivation.

Three of my kids went through the Korean DMZ before they were in highschool. The youngest had stay in Seoul—she would have started something.

72 A Man for all Seasons  Sun, Aug 11, 2013 12:50:39pm

re: #50 Shiplord Kirel

Thank you for your service to our great country..The other day I was hanging at the Lodge having a beer with a few old Vietnam Vets..Great guys that I enjoy talking with.
I have mad respect for those that have fought on the battlefield for our freedoms.
It has been my great fortune to have know so many Veterans. All you Men and Woman of the Armed Services make me proud.
I am raptured by the stories told to me over the years. Some have that moved me to tears or to howling laughter..
The ones that make your blood boil in anger at mankind and his politic..The Ironic twists of fate.. all the stories of victory and tales of defeat..Of great fortunes achieved and devastating loss of friends and family suffered..

73 Decatur Deb  Sun, Aug 11, 2013 12:56:44pm

re: #72 A Man for all Seasons

Thank you for your service to our great country..The other day I was hanging at the Lodge having a beer with a few old Vietnam Vets..Great guys that I enjoy talking with.
I have mad respect for those that have fought on the battlefield for our freedoms.
It has been my great fortune to have know so many Veterans. All you Men and Woman of the Armed Services make me proud.
I am raptured by the stories told to me over the years. Some have that moved me to tears or to howling laughter..
The ones that make your blood boil in anger at mankind and his politic..The Ironic twists of fate.. all the stories of victory and tales of defeat..Of great fortunes achieved and devastating loss of friends and family suffered..

Caught a Military Channel story of D-Day this morning. It followed a 19-yr old from The Bronx from the transport to the dune line. Apparently Army policy allowed Jewish troops to have a ‘cover’ religion on their dog tags. Instead, he painted a honkn’ big yellow Star of David on the back of his carrying vest.

74 A Man for all Seasons  Sun, Aug 11, 2013 1:01:47pm

re: #66 Romantic Heretic

On topic: We’ll be hearing from these people again. Most likely the whole family in a murder/suicide. Or worse, kids dead and the parents bragging about how they ‘saved their kids.’

Sigh.

I see a Bravo reality show in their future..Like Breaking Amish..
Escape from America…Every week they could try a different way to escape to ’ the land of religious freedom ‘..With proper product placement Ford could donate an SUV for a road trip to Canada..Jenny McCarthy could do the Anti-Vaxx week and the Doomsday Preppers could show up one week…Personally I’d like to see the Kids pray with Honey Bo Bo and go on a Wal-Mart shopping trip together..

75 kerFuFFler  Sun, Aug 11, 2013 2:14:27pm

re: #66 Romantic Heretic

On topic: We’ll be hearing from these people again. Most likely the whole family in a murder/suicide. Or worse, kids dead and the parents bragging about how they ‘saved their kids.’

Sigh.

No doubt we’ll hear all about how G*d tested their faith ——-just like Job——-and then “miraculously” saved them because they kept their faith. Blehhhhh.

76 William of Orange  Sun, Aug 11, 2013 4:34:37pm

Guess they packed a heavy dose of Karma in their luggage by accident. Also shows God does have a sense of humor.

77 SchadenBoner  Mon, Aug 12, 2013 1:22:44pm

re: #37 HappyWarrior

WWI feels more and more like a distant memory every day

This is a dead thread but what the hell.

No one remembers WW1 (in the US) because you can’t (honestly) draw an “America, fuck yeah!” conclusion from it.

So we forgot it.

We should bring back Armistice Day.


This article has been archived.
Comments are closed.

Jump to top

Create a PageThis is the LGF Pages posting bookmarklet. To use it, drag this button to your browser's bookmark bar, and title it 'LGF Pages' (or whatever you like). Then browse to a site you want to post, select some text on the page to use for a quote, click the bookmarklet, and the Pages posting window will appear with the title, text, and any embedded video or audio files already filled in, ready to go.
Or... you can just click this button to open the Pages posting window right away.
Last updated: 2023-04-04 11:11 am PDT
LGF User's Guide RSS Feeds

Help support Little Green Footballs!

Subscribe now for ad-free access!Register and sign in to a free LGF account before subscribing, and your ad-free access will be automatically enabled.

Donate with
PayPal
Cash.app
Recent PagesClick to refresh
Texas County at Center of Border Fight Is Overwhelmed by Migrant Deaths EAGLE PASS, Tex. - The undertaker lighted a cigarette and held it between his latex-gloved fingers as he stood over the bloated body bag lying in the bed of his battered pickup truck. The woman had been fished out ...
Cheechako
3 weeks ago
Views: 438 • Comments: 0 • Rating: 1