Where’s the Truther Beef?

Opinion • Views: 4,232

So as we begin the Labor Day weekend, I did a little search around the right wing blogs who are relentlessly shouting that Van Jones is a Truther (based on pages at hate sites and Truther sites), to see if any of them have found anything else that ties Jones to the Truther movement. Van Jones certainly had no inhibitions about speaking out on every other far left subject, so surely if he really were a Truther, there would be a statement from him somewhere … right?

When this “news” came out, I spent hours searching the web for any corroboration at all in Jones’ own words that he believes the 9/11 attacks were a conspiracy by the US government. If I had found something, I was prepared to start yelling as loud as anyone about it, because I utterly despise Truthers.

I found: nothing. Nothing at all.

So I looked around those right wing blogs this morning because I was curious to see if any of them had found real proof for this accusation, apart from the word of Truthers and hate sites, and found: nothing. Nothing at all.

The bottom line: there seems to be absolutely no evidence that Jones is a Truther, except his name on a Truther document. And in that case, we’ve shown that the Truthers lied to several of the “signatories” and told them they were signing a simple, legitimate call for further investigations, then added the conspiracy raving at a later date. In the case of author Rachel Ehrenfeld, they added her name to the document without her knowledge. Does that sound like a credible source of information to you?

For pointing this out, I’ve been viciously attacked and smeared all over the web, and have now received well over 100 hate mails calling me every foul name in the book.

As I wrote yesterday, I’m no fan of Van Jones, and won’t shed a tear if he’s forced to step down from his post.

But it’s sad and disgusting to see the same bloggers who spent years mocking and criticizing the Truthers and sites like rense.com, suddenly turn around and hold them up as valid sources of information — despite the fact that there is absolutely no corroboration anywhere else on the web.

The only conclusion I can reach is that they’re so overcome by hatred for Barack Obama that the judgment centers in their brains have been permanently switched off.

Jump to bottom

324 comments
1 Sharmuta  Sat, Sep 5, 2009 9:29:41am

Siding with troofers to claim someone else sided with troofers. Ironic.

2 Gang of One  Sat, Sep 5, 2009 9:34:23am

It's getting a bit, confusing? Or just plain messy?

3 jcm  Sat, Sep 5, 2009 9:36:37am

Van Jones is in charge (I take it) of creating "green jobs."

Has he ever created a real job of any kind before?

*I mean the kind where he made and sold products or services, hired people and made a profit*

4 BignJames  Sat, Sep 5, 2009 9:37:42am

For Charles it's a different day...same old bs. I wouldn't believe anything a troofer told me...they have to hire someone to call the dog. Jones is still a whck job...at least from my perspective...but he's far from alone in this admin.

5 SteveC  Sat, Sep 5, 2009 9:38:12am

If Truthers lie (and that's been established as a fact) then what happens when they try to Speak Truth to the Power? Does the Power even notice?

6 MandyManners  Sat, Sep 5, 2009 9:38:12am

re: #3 jcm

Van Jones is in charge (I take it) of creating "green jobs."

Has he ever created a real job of any kind before?

*I mean the kind where he made and sold products or services, hired people and made a profit*

Maybe he's hired a few people at the Institute of Noetic Sciences.

7 BignJames  Sat, Sep 5, 2009 9:39:15am

re: #5 SteveC

If Truthers lie (and that's been established as a fact) then what happens when they try to Speak Truth to the Power? Does the Power even notice?

Samantha Power?

8 cliffster  Sat, Sep 5, 2009 9:39:19am
The only conclusion I can reach is that they’re so overcome by hatred for Barack Obama that the judgment centers in their brains have been permanently switched off.

Obama Derangement Syndrome in full effect.

9 kansas  Sat, Sep 5, 2009 9:39:49am

The right got hysterical, but from the videos I have seen of Jones, that he could have been a truther is not that far fetched. Is it?

10 SteveC  Sat, Sep 5, 2009 9:39:57am

re: #3 jcm

Van Jones is in charge (I take it) of creating "green jobs."

Has he ever created a real job of any kind before?

*I mean the kind where he made and sold products or services, hired people and made a profit*

Green jobs, jcm! They're camouflaged! You can't see them!

11 Ojoe  Sat, Sep 5, 2009 9:40:23am

Many people want to switch off their brains.

Not Charles, though.

Go Charles!

12 MandyManners  Sat, Sep 5, 2009 9:41:02am

I cannot understand why a Lizard would even need to "go there" because Charles pointed out his nuttiness six weeks ago.

[Link: littlegreenfootballs.com...]

Had Beck or Rense even heard of him then?

13 jaunte  Sat, Sep 5, 2009 9:41:23am

re: #3 jcm

Van Jones is in charge (I take it) of creating "green jobs."

Has he ever created a real job of any kind before?

*I mean the kind where he made and sold products or services, hired people and made a profit*

I'm afraid that may mean he's a bit under-qualified.

Ella Baker Center boasts a staff of more than 20 world-class human rights activists and advocates.[Link: www.ellabakercenter.org...]
14 kansas  Sat, Sep 5, 2009 9:42:08am

re: #13 jaunte

How exactly do "human rights activists" make money?

15 jaunte  Sat, Sep 5, 2009 9:42:18am

"More than 20" jobs created!

16 Sharmuta  Sat, Sep 5, 2009 9:42:22am

I'm surprised to learn how few people care about their credibility.

17 The Optimist  Sat, Sep 5, 2009 9:42:32am

If Van Jones is a liar, it will show up in other places. Once a person starts to tell lies, they cannot stop.
Excellent post Charles.

18 Walter L. Newton  Sat, Sep 5, 2009 9:42:52am

As I posted yesterday, I was wrong. Now, as far as hating Obama. Yes, big time, I do. As week after week goes by, more and more of his soft-socialism is revealed and yes, I hate him for it.

19 jaunte  Sat, Sep 5, 2009 9:42:52am

re: #14 kansas

I think they just push it around from some to others.

20 debutaunt  Sat, Sep 5, 2009 9:42:55am

re: #14 kansas

How exactly do "human rights activists" make money?

Massive grants, I'd guess.

21 jcm  Sat, Sep 5, 2009 9:43:11am

re: #6 MandyManners

Maybe he's hired a few people at the Institute of Noetic Sciences.

... is a nonprofit membership organization that conducts and sponsors leading-edge research into the potentials and powers of consciousness.

Cool, I think my green job into existence?!

22 SteveC  Sat, Sep 5, 2009 9:43:16am

re: #11 Ojoe

Many people want to switch off their brains.

Especially on a fall Saturday afternoon. Give me football or give me death!

"You're speaking of Treason, Patrick."

If this be Treason then by God, let us make the most of it!

23 BignJames  Sat, Sep 5, 2009 9:43:24am

re: #13 jaunte

World class? Does that mean you've been arrested at a protest and got your name in the paper?

24 jorline  Sat, Sep 5, 2009 9:43:30am

re: #3 jcm

Van Jones is in charge (I take it) of creating "green jobs."

Has he ever created a real job of any kind before?

*I mean the kind where he made and sold products or services, hired people and made a profit*

Was always above his pay grade.

25 kansas  Sat, Sep 5, 2009 9:43:50am

re: #19 jaunte

re: #20 debutaunt

That's a green job then. Take government money and give to your friends.

26 MandyManners  Sat, Sep 5, 2009 9:43:52am

I was tempted to believe it for a while yesterday but, with Rense being the only source, I had to back away.

27 jaunte  Sat, Sep 5, 2009 9:44:01am

re: #23 BignJames

It's a meaningless bit of puffery, like "green."

28 kcladderman  Sat, Sep 5, 2009 9:44:31am

re: #9 kansas

The right got hysterical, but from the videos I have seen of Jones, that he could have been a truther is not that far fetched. Is it?

See thats just it,he is enough of a wack job to be one no doubt. There is no evidence that he is though. I think if there were any real truth to it someone would have been able to come up with real proof by now. I still hope he goes under the bus though.

29 Charles Johnson  Sat, Sep 5, 2009 9:44:46am

I'm getting the feeling Ace of Spades really wants me to link to him, since he's continuing the attacks today. He'll be waiting a long time.

30 kansas  Sat, Sep 5, 2009 9:44:47am

re: #26 MandyManners

I was tempted to believe it for a while yesterday but, with Rense being the only source, I had to back away.

I had never heard of rense. Sorry now that I have. Off work now. Bye.

31 SurferDoc  Sat, Sep 5, 2009 9:45:00am

Van Jones carries so much other baggage that if he was a Troofer that would at least be cause for sympathy for the guy on grounds of Severe Mental Illness.

32 MandyManners  Sat, Sep 5, 2009 9:45:15am

re: #14 kansas

How exactly do "human rights activists" make money?

IIRC, we are paying Jones $150,000.00.

33 SteveC  Sat, Sep 5, 2009 9:45:21am

Ohio State 10, Navy 7 early 2nd quarter.

34 MandyManners  Sat, Sep 5, 2009 9:45:55am

re: #30 kansas

I had never heard of rense. Sorry now that I have. Off work now. Bye.

I group him with Alex Jones and David Icke.

35 Killgore Trout  Sat, Sep 5, 2009 9:47:08am

If Glenn Beck and Michelle Malkin spent a tiny fraction of this energy denouncing 9-11 truthers and White Nationalists at Tea Parties they wouldn't have a problem.

36 MandyManners  Sat, Sep 5, 2009 9:47:40am

re: #21 jcm

... is a nonprofit membership organization that conducts and sponsors leading-edge research into the potentials and powers of consciousness.

Cool, I think my green job into existence?!

Maybe FCBBHO can include distance healing in his next run at socialized medicine.

37 Sharmuta  Sat, Sep 5, 2009 9:48:45am

re: #35 Killgore Trout

If Glenn Beck and Michelle Malkin spent a tiny fraction of this energy denouncing 9-11 truthers and White Nationalists at Tea Parties they wouldn't have a problem.

Why would a Bircher sympathizer and VDARE author do that?

38 brennant  Sat, Sep 5, 2009 9:48:55am

Very interesting Charles. I wish people would step back from the crazy pipe.

39 wahabicorridor  Sat, Sep 5, 2009 9:49:11am

re: #34 MandyManners

I group him with Alex Jones and David Icke.

Who is David Icke, please?

40 SteveC  Sat, Sep 5, 2009 9:49:53am

Advertisement for a video game on TV had a good quote:

"The problem is that when you take a crazy person to the asylum, you're really just taking them home."

41 Ringo the Gringo  Sat, Sep 5, 2009 9:50:06am

Many people who hate Bush were all too happy to play along with the "truthers". Truthers were welcome at virtually all leftist and anti-war events. I have no doubt that scores of people who did not really believe that Bush knew about, or was responsible for, 9/11 added their names to truther petitions that called for a "new inquiry into the events of 9/11" simply because they hoped that such an investigation would make President Bush look bad. Simply casting a negative shadow on Bush was good enough for these people, it made no difference if the accusations were true. And, of course, there are also those who hate Israel, and hoped that a new investigation would turn up something with which they could point a finger a the 'evil zionists". So, it would not surprise me in the least if Van Jones (and Howard Zinn) did in fact sign his name on to some of these petitions, especially in the first few years after 9/11, even if they really did not actually believe in the insinuation that "Bush Knew".

That's my take, for what it's worth.

42 LouisianaLightning  Sat, Sep 5, 2009 9:50:28am

Charles,

I did some quick searching and found Gateway Pudit has some credible info on this linking Jones to The War Times.

Do you think that is bogus also?

War Times article.

43 jcm  Sat, Sep 5, 2009 9:50:37am

re: #36 MandyManners

Maybe FCBBHO can include distance healing in his next run at socialized medicine.


Our Mission:

Advancing the science of consciousness and human experience to serve individual and collective transformation.


Transcendent beings don't need no stinkin' health care!

44 Killgore Trout  Sat, Sep 5, 2009 9:51:11am

Join We Are Change San Antonio 911 Truth

Glenn Beck @ San Antonio Tea Party @ the ALAMO

Mr. Beck's show will be live from in front of The Alamo, in Alamo Plaza, at 4PM Central. The tax day tea party is currently scheduled to start at 6PM to allow traffic to thin out (we are in downtown after all...) and for people to get off work and families to attend.

45 MandyManners  Sat, Sep 5, 2009 9:52:10am

re: #39 wahabicorridor

Who is David Icke, please?

DOANT POAK DA KRAYZEE

46 SteveC  Sat, Sep 5, 2009 9:52:24am

West Virgina 10, Liberty University 10

Jerry Falwell's ghost has been talking to Bear Bryant's ghost!

47 Charles Johnson  Sat, Sep 5, 2009 9:52:24am

re: #42 LouisianaLightning

Charles,

I did some quick searching and found Gateway Pudit has some credible info on this linking Jones to The War Times.

Do you think that is bogus also?

War Times article.

What does that have to do with this issue?

Answer: nothing.

48 MandyManners  Sat, Sep 5, 2009 9:52:44am

re: #39 wahabicorridor

Who is David Icke, please?

I'll not post a link to him. Google will help you find his site.

49 jorline  Sat, Sep 5, 2009 9:53:09am

I didn't weigh in on this subject because I wanted to apply the 72 hour rule.

He may not be a truther, but he packs plenty of other character baggage which is par for this administration. Don't pay your taxes, commie or create a larger government with lot of the citizens money...join the party...let me buy you a beer.

The vetting process has gone out the window.

50 MandyManners  Sat, Sep 5, 2009 9:53:35am

re: #43 jcm

Transcendent beings don't need no stinkin' health care!

Didn't FCBBHO talk about transformative politics during his campaign or something similar?

51 Sharmuta  Sat, Sep 5, 2009 9:53:53am

re: #41 Ringo the Gringo

Many people who hate Bush were all too happy to play along with the "truthers". Truthers were welcome at virtually all leftist and anti-war events. I have no doubt that scores of people who did not really believe that Bush knew about, or was responsible for, 9/11 added their names to truther petitions that called for a "new inquiry into the events of 9/11" simply because they hoped that such an investigation would make President Bush look bad. Simply casting a negative shadow on Bush was good enough for these people, it made no difference if the accusations were true. And, of course, there are also those who hate Israel, and hoped that a new investigation would turn up something with which they could point a finger a the 'evil zionists". So, it would not surprise me in the least if Van Jones (and Howard Zinn) did in fact sign his name on to some of these petitions, especially in the first few years after 9/11, even if they really did not actually believe in the insinuation that "Bush Knew".

That's my take, for what it's worth.

Some of these people are Paulians, and now show up at right-wing rallies.

52 haakondahl  Sat, Sep 5, 2009 9:54:00am

re: #33 SteveC

Ohio State 10, Navy 7 early 2nd quarter.

My serving of fruitcup says Navy pulls it out.

53 John Neverbend  Sat, Sep 5, 2009 9:54:07am

re: #48 MandyManners

I'll not post a link to him. Google will help you find his site.

Good. He's a complete loony, as you'll discover when you read his bio.

54 wahabicorridor  Sat, Sep 5, 2009 9:54:36am

re: #48 MandyManners

I'll not post a link to him. Google will help you find his site.

got it...thanks

55 SteveC  Sat, Sep 5, 2009 9:54:47am

re: #39 wahabicorridor

Who is David Icke, please?

When you read David Icke's website, take a N95 mask, gloves, and a 55 gallon drum of hand sanitizer. Use all that and you'll probably still feel ICK-EE!

56 haakondahl  Sat, Sep 5, 2009 9:55:10am

re: #35 Killgore Trout

If Glenn Beck and Michelle Malkin spent a tiny fraction of this energy denouncing 9-11 truthers and White Nationalists at Tea Parties they wouldn't have a problem.

Whole-heartedly agreed, my addle-pated friend!

57 jcm  Sat, Sep 5, 2009 9:55:47am

re: #49 jorline

I didn't weigh in on this subject because I wanted to apply the 72 hour rule.

He may not be a truther, but he packs plenty of other character baggage which is par for this administration. Don't pay your taxes, commie or create a larger government with lot of the citizens money...join the party...let me buy you a beer.

The vetting process has gone out the window.

Vetting process not in the traditional sense, but it's there.
Political philosophy is all that matters. Does the candidate "think right" is the only criteria.

58 SteveC  Sat, Sep 5, 2009 9:55:50am

re: #52 haakondahl

My serving of fruitcup says Navy pulls it out.

That would be beautiful, just beautiful!

59 [deleted]  Sat, Sep 5, 2009 9:56:14am
60 Digital Display  Sat, Sep 5, 2009 9:56:22am

re: #58 SteveC

That would be beautiful, just beautiful!

Go Navy!

61 Walter L. Newton  Sat, Sep 5, 2009 9:56:25am

re: #48 MandyManners

I'll not post a link to him. Google will help you find his site.

Or just channel David Ickes... Oooommm... that'll work.

62 jcm  Sat, Sep 5, 2009 9:56:33am

re: #55 SteveC

When you read David Icke's website, take a N95 mask, gloves, and a 55 gallon drum of hand sanitizer. Use all that and you'll probably still feel ICK-EE!

HAZMAT level 4.

And forget a safety line, if you go down, you're on your own.

63 Killgore Trout  Sat, Sep 5, 2009 9:56:35am
64 Charles Johnson  Sat, Sep 5, 2009 9:57:15am

re: #59 Meatsss

That's enough links to a story that has nothing to do with this.

65 haakondahl  Sat, Sep 5, 2009 9:57:22am

Aww, man, I missed another one.

66 jaunte  Sat, Sep 5, 2009 9:57:32am

From a 'War Times' article of 2002:

Rita Lasar's younger brother, Abe Zelmanowitz, called his family after the second plane crashed into the World Trade Center building where he worked on the 27th floor. He told them he was safe and that rather than leave his wheelchair-bound friend, he would wait until the firemen came to rescue them both.

But the building soon collapsed and Zelmanowitz and his friend died with 3,094 others on September 11.


Doesn't sound like a Truther publication. Of course they use the word Truth in their slogan, maybe that's the attempted connection.

67 MacDuff  Sat, Sep 5, 2009 9:57:35am

I fail to understand why anyone would be so adamant about this "Truther" allegation. Jones has an immense body of radical, racialist and general "hate whitey" statements and beliefs that are easily documented. His while life has been lived in the radical sphere and even a modicum of research can prove it.

The "Truther" thing is a classic red herring that everyone is chasing, while ignoring Jones actual past (and present, for that matter).

Damn, this is frustrating!!

68 wahabicorridor  Sat, Sep 5, 2009 9:57:40am

re: #55 SteveC

When you read David Icke's website, take a N95 mask, gloves, and a 55 gallon drum of hand sanitizer. Use all that and you'll probably still feel ICK-EE!

No need for me to hit his site - wiki was plenty...

69 Killgore Trout  Sat, Sep 5, 2009 9:58:20am

Uh oh, they're on to us!
"Expose the Reptilians!"

70 Charles Johnson  Sat, Sep 5, 2009 9:58:35am

re: #66 jaunte

From a 'War Times' article of 2002:


Doesn't sound like a Truther publication. Of course they use the word Truth in their slogan, maybe that's the attempted connection.

It's not a Truther publication. It's a far left antiwar publication. They've reached the point where they're just throwing anything against the wall to see if it sticks.

71 Sharmuta  Sat, Sep 5, 2009 9:58:52am

re: #49 jorline

I didn't weigh in on this subject because I wanted to apply the 72 hour rule.

He may not be a truther, but he packs plenty of other character baggage which is par for this administration. Don't pay your taxes, commie or create a larger government with lot of the citizens money...join the party...let me buy you a beer.

The vetting process has gone out the window.

I have to agree. I served on a nominations committee where we vetted our candidate and we covered quite a lot of turf on what might come out of the closet. Maybe it's because we're republicans and didn't expect the press to play nice that we did so, but for so many appointments to be withdrawn over issues like taxes tells me, there is a problem with their vetting process.

72 jcm  Sat, Sep 5, 2009 9:59:07am

re: #67 MacDuff

I fail to understand why anyone would be so adamant about this "Truther" allegation. Jones has an immense body of radical, racialist and general "hate whitey" statements and beliefs that are easily documented. His while life has been lived in the radical sphere and even a modicum of research can prove it.

The "Truther" thing is a classic red herring that everyone is chasing, while ignoring Jones actual past (and present, for that matter).

Damn, this is frustrating!!

DING!

73 Ojoe  Sat, Sep 5, 2009 9:59:48am

It is in some ways ironic that this controversy swirls around Jones because in his book there are passages where he more or less says that he used to be too confrontational himself but that he now realizes that we have to all work together.

74 Killgore Trout  Sat, Sep 5, 2009 10:00:09am

re: #67 MacDuff

I fail to understand why anyone would be so adamant about this "Truther" allegation. Jones has an immense body of radical, racialist and general "hate whitey" statements and beliefs that are easily documented. His while life has been lived in the radical sphere and even a modicum of research can prove it.


We've seen this before with things like the DHS memo. Too many people see crazy as a conservative value. Those who don't go along with the flow draw a lot of ire and venom.

75 McSpiff  Sat, Sep 5, 2009 10:00:19am
In 1999, he published The Biggest Secret, in which he wrote that the Illuminati are a race of reptilian humanoids known as the Babylonian Brotherhood, and that many prominent figures are reptilian, including George W. Bush, Queen Elizabeth II, Kris Kristofferson, and Boxcar Willie.[3][5]


...Thats a joke right?

76 MandyManners  Sat, Sep 5, 2009 10:01:19am

Queen Elizabeth is a shape-shifting alien reptillian, quoth the Icke.

77 CommonDefense  Sat, Sep 5, 2009 10:01:30am

IMO, the truther aspect is irrelevant. His self-proclamation of Communism, calls to wipe out the whole system to start over, wanting to redistribute wealth and the ability to call Republicans a$$holes in front of his adoring audience are enough to invalidate him as a servant of the public trust.

78 Killgore Trout  Sat, Sep 5, 2009 10:01:40am

re: #75 McSpiff

Nope.

79 MandyManners  Sat, Sep 5, 2009 10:01:49am

TOUCHDOWN TENNESSEE!

80 BignJames  Sat, Sep 5, 2009 10:01:51am

re: #75 McSpiff

...Thats a joke right?

Please...not Boxcar Willie!?!

81 Sharmuta  Sat, Sep 5, 2009 10:02:09am

re: #74 Killgore Trout

We've seen this before with things like the DHS memo. Too many people see crazy as a conservative value. Those who don't go along with the flow draw a lot of ire and venom.

It's a mainstreaming of radicalism in general.

82 Walter L. Newton  Sat, Sep 5, 2009 10:02:15am

re: #75 McSpiff

...Thats a joke right?

No, the gentleman really believes it, or at least, really understands that he is making money and gathering a following saying he believes it.

83 jorline  Sat, Sep 5, 2009 10:02:31am

re: #71 Sharmuta

I have to agree. I served on a nominations committee where we vetted our candidate and we covered quite a lot of turf on what might come out of the closet. Maybe it's because we're republicans and didn't expect the press to play nice that we did so, but for so many appointments to be withdrawn over issues like taxes tells me, there is a problem with their vetting process.

Right or Left...majority rules!

84 MandyManners  Sat, Sep 5, 2009 10:02:33am

re: #75 McSpiff

...Thats a joke right?

Don't rely on Wiki. Look at his site.

85 Charles Johnson  Sat, Sep 5, 2009 10:02:33am

re: #77 CommonDefense

IMO, the truther aspect is irrelevant. His self-proclamation of Communism, calls to wipe out the whole system to start over, wanting to redistribute wealth and the ability to call Republicans a$$holes in front of his adoring audience are enough to invalidate him as a servant of the public trust.

Of course, in that speech in which he called Republicans assholes, he also called himself an asshole.

86 Walter L. Newton  Sat, Sep 5, 2009 10:02:46am

re: #76 MandyManners

Queen Elizabeth is a shape-shifting alien reptillian, quoth the Icke.

I know Boy George certainly is!

87 SteveC  Sat, Sep 5, 2009 10:03:37am

re: #75 McSpiff


In 1999, he published The Biggest Secret, in which he wrote that the Illuminati are a race of reptilian humanoids known as the Babylonian Brotherhood, and that many prominent figures are reptilian, including George W. Bush, Queen Elizabeth II, Kris Kristofferson, and Boxcar Willie.[3][5]


...Thats a joke right?

Got to be. Boxcar Willie is way to classy to hang around with that bunch!

88 Ojoe  Sat, Sep 5, 2009 10:03:55am

re: #85 Charles

Great political discourse, we're all equal I guess, it brings us together on a certain level.

BBL

89 Cato  Sat, Sep 5, 2009 10:04:07am

re: #72 jcm

Personally it is clear to me Charles is right in the fact you cannot trust Truther sites. However, it is equally clear you can't trust Van Jones. He is clearly lying about his radicalism today for fear of losing a job where he could put into effect his policy ideas, so his denial is also untrustworthy.

That nothing truly establishes either position is not bothersome. Do you want someone with that constellatrion of views in a position of enormous power?

90 Walter L. Newton  Sat, Sep 5, 2009 10:04:23am

re: #85 Charles

Of course, in that speech in which he called Republicans assholes, he also called himself an asshole.

Correct, and that makes him even less suited for a public position overseeing 30 billion dollars.

91 Gang of One  Sat, Sep 5, 2009 10:04:23am

re: #14 kansas

How exactly do "human rights activists" make money?


I don't think they make it so mauch as they take it.

92 Picayune  Sat, Sep 5, 2009 10:04:28am

re: #38 brennant

You mean this crazy pipe?: [Link: www.breitbart.tv...]

(Jones does Bush on Crack)

Thanks for keeping it real, Charles. No need to lose our perspective.
As has been said, there are enough items created by Jones that are ridiculous, without dragging the Truthers into this deal.

Hell, Jones is so whacked, I hope he gets to stay around for the hilarity that will follow. Is Jones telling us an "Obama"? We'll know soon enough, even if the entire MSM (except CBS) is hiding under the covers.

93 jaunte  Sat, Sep 5, 2009 10:04:34am

Why is it tactically so important for some conservatives to paint Jones as a truther, in addition to his other (conservatively unacceptable) political ideas?

94 McSpiff  Sat, Sep 5, 2009 10:04:41am

Ha! I didn't even get as far as boxcar willie before my brain shut down. I cant decide if I want to visit his site, in the same day I was at Free Republic...

95 Pianobuff  Sat, Sep 5, 2009 10:04:46am

Charles - I'm noticing that there is a grey-scale contrast between alternating posts. Is this new, or have I just missed it this whole time?

96 haakondahl  Sat, Sep 5, 2009 10:04:57am

re: #85 Charles

Of course, in that speech in which he called Republicans assholes, he also called himself an asshole.

QED.

97 Ringo the Gringo  Sat, Sep 5, 2009 10:05:12am

re: #51 Sharmuta

Yes, from my observations, truthers fall into four categories:

1) Pacifists, for whom the events of 9/11 caused severe cognitive dissonance.

2) Libertarian-Isolationists, for who the events of 9/11 caused severe cognitive dissonance.

3) Anti-semites & Israel-haters, for whom the events of 9/11 must have been a Zionist plot.

4) Radical Leftists, who probably don't really believe that the Bush regime knew or was involved in the events of 9/11, but are willing to use any means to promote distrust and suspiscion in any conservative administration.

Group #2 and some from group #3 can now be found at "tea parties".

98 wahabicorridor  Sat, Sep 5, 2009 10:05:20am

re: #85 Charles

Of course, in that speech in which he called Republicans assholes, he also called himself an asshole.

Oh, so he was actually RIGHT about something?

;)

I really hope he did not sign it just for the entertainment value provided by the idea that he got punked by Medea B.

99 SurferDoc  Sat, Sep 5, 2009 10:05:42am

Jones was vetted.

The Obamians thought he was just fine.

100 SteveC  Sat, Sep 5, 2009 10:05:58am

re: #76 MandyManners

Queen Elizabeth is a shape-shifting alien reptillian, quoth the Icke.

He's just jealous that Liz, GWB, and Willie won't teach him how to do the Time Warp.

*sings* It's just a jump to the left...

101 Walter L. Newton  Sat, Sep 5, 2009 10:06:45am

re: #97 Ringo the Gringo

Yes, from my observations, truthers fall into four categories:

1) Pacifists, for whom the events of 9/11 caused severe cognitive dissonance.

2) Libertarian-Isolationists, for who the events of 9/11 caused severe cognitive dissonance.

3) Anti-semites & Israel-haters, for whom the events of 9/11 must have been a Zionist plot.

4) Radical Leftists, who probably don't really believe that the Bush regime knew or was involved in the events of 9/11, but are willing to use any means to promote distrust and suspiscion in any conservative administration.

Group #2 and some from group #3 can now be found at "tea parties".

5) Jerks

102 Sharmuta  Sat, Sep 5, 2009 10:07:10am

re: #92 jaunte

Why is it tactically so important for some conservatives to paint Jones as a truther, in addition to his other (conservatively unacceptable) political ideas?

And why isn't this stink sticking to Ron Paul?

103 MandyManners  Sat, Sep 5, 2009 10:07:18am

TOUCHDOWN TENNESSEE!

104 Charles Johnson  Sat, Sep 5, 2009 10:07:50am

re: #63 Killgore Trout

Glenn Beck @ San Antonio Tea Party @ the ALAMO (9-11 truth pic)

Wow, so Glenn Beck is a Truther??!

I might as well make that claim -- it has exactly as much evidence behind it as the claim that Van Jones is a Truther. Actually, more evidence.

105 SteveC  Sat, Sep 5, 2009 10:08:21am

"Fumble! Tennessee has it! And Western Kentucky dropped it!"

Where do they find these brilliant announcers?

106 SurferDoc  Sat, Sep 5, 2009 10:08:56am

re: #102 Sharmuta

And why isn't this stink sticking to Ron Paul?

Good question. I think that in spite of all the Paulian publicity seeking and notoriety on the web, out in the real world nobody notices him or cares.

107 esch  Sat, Sep 5, 2009 10:09:08am

re: #102 Sharmuta

And why isn't this stink sticking to Ron Paul?

TefRON.

108 pre-Boomer Marine brat  Sat, Sep 5, 2009 10:09:15am

re: #103 MandyManners

TOUCHDOWN TENNESSEE!

Did y' HAVE to Volunteer that info?

109 MandyManners  Sat, Sep 5, 2009 10:09:28am

re: #86 Walter L. Newton

I know Boy George certainly is!

You rang?

110 sattv4u2  Sat, Sep 5, 2009 10:09:52am

re: #103 MandyManners

TOUCHDOWN TENNESSEE!

I don't EVEN want to know how they celebrate with the pigskin!!

//

111 Walter L. Newton  Sat, Sep 5, 2009 10:10:00am

re: #109 MandyManners

You rang?


[Video]

Ewww...

112 lincolntf  Sat, Sep 5, 2009 10:10:13am

re: #57 jcm

It's kind of a running question with this Administration. Do they really "miss" things like tax cheating, bizarre affiliations, corrupt pasts, etc. while vetting appointees? Or does Obama simply prefer to surround himself with people who are crooked and crazy?

113 jcm  Sat, Sep 5, 2009 10:10:16am

re: #89 Cato

Personally it is clear to me Charles is right in the fact you cannot trust Truther sites. However, it is equally clear you can't trust Van Jones. He is clearly lying about his radicalism today for fear of losing a job where he could put into effect his policy ideas, so his denial is also untrustworthy.

That nothing truly establishes either position is not bothersome. Do you want someone with that constellatrion of views in a position of enormous power?

'zactly.

Some are using the "troofer" crap to excuse the rest...

If Obama Gives Up On Green Jobs Czar Van Jones, Then He's A Coward

Who is Van Jones? He's a committed activist who thinks Republicans are "assholes". (Van Jones also thinks Van Jones is an asshole, by the way.) Of course, now that he's part of the White House, he's not allowed to say that out loud. Nor is he allowed to say any number of things he feels out loud, because he wouldn't want to cause more fake problems like he has now.

Yet, that's all he did in his past life. He was full time cage-rattling orator who whipped his fans in to a frenzy with impassioned speeches that ripped George Bush, and the right. He also advocated for environmental causes and minorities, which is a big part of the reason Obama put him on his team.

Even links to LGF!

114 Reginald Perrin  Sat, Sep 5, 2009 10:10:27am

re: #102 Sharmuta

I owe you an apology, I accidentally down dinged your comment.

115 SteveC  Sat, Sep 5, 2009 10:10:43am

re: #108 pre-Boomer Marine brat

Did y' HAVE to Volunteer that info?

I'm keeping a buckeye on both Tenn. and Ohio State.

116 Sharmuta  Sat, Sep 5, 2009 10:10:46am

re: #114 Reginald Perrin

They're reversible.

117 sattv4u2  Sat, Sep 5, 2009 10:11:06am

re: #114 Reginald Perrin

I owe you an apology, I accidentally down dinged your comment.

You can go back and rectify that

118 MandyManners  Sat, Sep 5, 2009 10:11:18am

re: #108 pre-Boomer Marine brat

Did y' HAVE to Volunteer that info?

I bleed Orange.

119 SurferDoc  Sat, Sep 5, 2009 10:11:45am

re: #112 lincolntf

It's kind of a running question with this Administration. Do they really "miss" things like tax cheating, bizarre affiliations, corrupt pasts, etc. while vetting appointees? Or does Obama simply prefer to surround himself with people who are crooked and crazy?

Radical left is the only qualification.

120 John Neverbend  Sat, Sep 5, 2009 10:11:48am

re: #114 Reginald Perrin

I owe you an apology, I accidentally down dinged your comment.

Hello Reggie. I didn't get where I am today by responding to you on an LGF thread.

121 borgcube  Sat, Sep 5, 2009 10:11:50am

Many Troofers are simply the same people who grab on to all the conspiracy crap. They're just nuts.

The crowd that continually supports Mumia Abu Jamal are worse in just about any way imaginable. They're not nuts, they're rotten to the core.

Van Jones may or may not be a Troofer. I don't think it's worth all the fuss given the multitude of other things just as bad or worse that ARE on this creep's "resume" without any speculation whatsoever. In fact, I find it sad that it took him being accused of being a Troofer to get people to seriously look at him and his record when all of the easily demonstrable stuff was overwhelmingly damning enough.

Troofer or not, this guy should not be anywhere near a leadership position in this nation, let alone the one he holds. The fact that a man like him is this close to our President and is supposedly setting a course for one of the biggest challenges of modern humanity is more revolting than Jones himself.

122 SteveC  Sat, Sep 5, 2009 10:12:14am

re: #102 Sharmuta

And why isn't this stink sticking to Ron Paul?

FYI, Time Magazine's "!0 Questions with..." feature next week is the head Ronulan hisself!

123 jcm  Sat, Sep 5, 2009 10:12:26am

re: #112 lincolntf

It's kind of a running question with this Administration. Do they really "miss" things like tax cheating, bizarre affiliations, corrupt pasts, etc. while vetting appointees? Or does Obama simply prefer to surround himself with people who are crooked and crazy?

They don't care...
The ends justify the means.

124 sattv4u2  Sat, Sep 5, 2009 10:12:45am

re: #118 MandyManners

I bleed Orange.

You really have to cut down on the screwdrivers!

(thats why I drink my Vodka straight!)

125 Phocid  Sat, Sep 5, 2009 10:13:02am

Charles, I think you're forgetting that people like Van Jones live in a leftist postmodern bubble where 'facts' and 'truth' are whatever you want them to be. I don't doubt that Jones signed that petition and that in his disordered mind he never considered the factual implications of what he was signing, something I'm sure he's really not equipped to do. It's like you signing a confession to a serious crime and then claiming that you had no idea what you were signing. I've known enough lefties whose hatred of Bush and Chaney were so virulent they'd believe any kind of comic Hollywood conspiracy theory about them. I would say that considering Jones' lunacy on other matters it's a good bet he signed and believed it at the time. You don't have to choose between believing Jones and believing the troofers, they're all crazy and they're all liars.

126 Sharmuta  Sat, Sep 5, 2009 10:13:04am

re: #122 SteveC

FYI, Time Magazine's "!0 Questions with..." feature next week is the head Ronulan hisself!

Great. More mainstreaming of the kooky uncle.

127 jaunte  Sat, Sep 5, 2009 10:13:17am

re: #102 Sharmuta
Just in case someone doesn't read what you linked, here's Ron Paul conspicuously NOT saying that the Troof is a nutty conspiracy theory.

Troofer: OK and one more thing. Why don’t you come out about the truth about 9/11?

[Pause...]

Ron Paul: Because I can’t handle the controversy. I have the IIF, the Federal Reserve to deal with, and the IRS to deal with. Because, uh, no I just have work— too many things on my plate. Uh, because, uh, I just have too much to do.

Troofer: All right, thank you sir. Thank you very much.

Ron Paul: OK. OK.

128 avanti  Sat, Sep 5, 2009 10:13:48am

re: #90 Walter L. Newton

Correct, and that makes him even less suited for a public position overseeing 30 billion dollars.

Not sure if that would do it, I'm a asshole on occasion and I'm otherwise perfect. :)

129 Quilly Mammoth  Sat, Sep 5, 2009 10:14:35am

I'm going with a third alternative. The first is that he is a Troofer, the second is that he didn't know what he was signing. The third alternative is that he didn't care what he was signing.

If we take as fact the statements that others have made that the original statement called for:

1. An immediate investigation by New York Attorney General Eliot Spitzer
2. Immediate investigation in Congressional Hearings.
3. Media attention to scrutinize and investigate the evidence.
4. The formation of a truly independent citizens-based inquiry.

in the context that the Bush Administration was not doing it's job...otherwise why the demands...then the inescapable conclusion is that Van Jones didn't look into what he was signing. He turned off his judgment center.

It happens frequently in politics; that it occurs in someone advising the President, particularly one with so many other negatives, is very disturbing.

130 pre-Boomer Marine brat  Sat, Sep 5, 2009 10:14:46am

re: #118 MandyManners

I bleed Orange.

In that case, don't accidentally cut your finger in an Irish pub on St. Paddy's day.

:D

131 SteveC  Sat, Sep 5, 2009 10:14:52am

re: #126 Sharmuta

Great. More mainstreaming of the kooky uncle.

I was hoping that a few enterprising Lizards could go to time's website and email in a few questions designed to trip his trigger. As Regis Philbin might say "I'm just one guy!"

132 Reginald Perrin  Sat, Sep 5, 2009 10:15:27am

re: #120 John Neverbend

Isn't CJ the one whose supposed to make that comment?
/

133 altermite  Sat, Sep 5, 2009 10:15:37am

Van Jones truther smells like nirther.

134 rageman  Sat, Sep 5, 2009 10:15:59am

Van Jones = Rev Wright= Sharpton= D. Watson= H. Gates---race-baters.
He's pathetic.

135 sattv4u2  Sat, Sep 5, 2009 10:16:01am

re: #125 Phocid

I don't doubt that Jones signed that petition

Problem is, is doesn;'t appear that he (nor several other of the signatories) did!

Charles had a thread about this earlier

136 Charles Johnson  Sat, Sep 5, 2009 10:16:24am

re: #129 Quilly Mammoth

I'm going with a third alternative. The first is that he is a Troofer...

So show me one single piece of evidence or one statement from Van Jones that proves it. Go ahead, I'll wait.

137 sattv4u2  Sat, Sep 5, 2009 10:16:52am

re: #136 Charles

So show me one single piece of evidence or one statement from Van Jones that proves it. Go ahead, I'll wait.

you have that much time?!?!?!?!

//

138 sattv4u2  Sat, Sep 5, 2009 10:17:47am

Minnesota 14,,, Syracuse 13

139 sattv4u2  Sat, Sep 5, 2009 10:18:40am

re: #138 sattv4u2

Minnesota 14,,, Syracuse 13

(((Syracuse just kicked a feild goal, I forgot to add))

140 SteveC  Sat, Sep 5, 2009 10:19:05am

My back is to the TV, but they are playing Rocky Top again...

Northern Iowa 10, Iowa 3

141 Walter L. Newton  Sat, Sep 5, 2009 10:19:15am

re: #128 avanti

Not sure if that would do it, I'm a asshole on occasion and I'm otherwise perfect. :)

Avanti... why do you give me such an lead like that? :) Is it a present of some sort? It's not my birthday.
/

142 avanti  Sat, Sep 5, 2009 10:19:20am

re: #113 jcm

Even links to LGF!

And gets this comment:


gp said:
Sep 4, 4:34 PM
During the W administration, LGF was a strong anti-jihad, pro-Israel site, therefore reviled by mainstream press. Having moderated since BHO took over, now LGF gets linked all over the place defending BHO. Wild!

143 Sharmuta  Sat, Sep 5, 2009 10:19:34am

re: #127 jaunte

Just in case someone doesn't read what you linked, here's Ron Paul conspicuously NOT saying that the Troof is a nutty conspiracy theory.

There's more!

[Link: littlegreenfootballs.com...]
[Link: littlegreenfootballs.com...]

And that's not even touching on the nazis.

[Link: littlegreenfootballs.com...]
[Link: littlegreenfootballs.com...]
[Link: littlegreenfootballs.com...]

144 haakondahl  Sat, Sep 5, 2009 10:20:08am

re: #136 Charles

So show me one single piece of evidence or one statement from Van Jones that proves it. Go ahead, I'll wait.

He's rejecting that as the first alternative, if I'm reading him right.

145 SteveC  Sat, Sep 5, 2009 10:20:29am

re: #143 Sharmuta

There's more!

[Link: littlegreenfootballs.com...]
[Link: littlegreenfootballs.com...]

And that's not even touching on the nazis.

[Link: littlegreenfootballs.com...]
[Link: littlegreenfootballs.com...]
[Link: littlegreenfootballs.com...]

And I didn't even have to call in the next 10 minutes!

146 MandyManners  Sat, Sep 5, 2009 10:20:41am

TOUCHDOWN TENNESSEE!

147 avanti  Sat, Sep 5, 2009 10:20:53am

re: #141 Walter L. Newton

Avanti... why do you give me such an lead like that? :) Is it a present of some sort? It's not my birthday.
/

Because I secretly like your ribbing most of the time.

148 SteveC  Sat, Sep 5, 2009 10:21:25am

Florida 0, Charleston Southern 0

149 MandyManners  Sat, Sep 5, 2009 10:21:46am
150 LouisianaLightning  Sat, Sep 5, 2009 10:21:50am

re: #42 LouisianaLightning

Charles,

The reason I think this is related to this issue is that War Time is a Truther site. I searched it for articles and
found over 50 relating to 9/11. Attached are links to some of them.

Van Jones was a member of this organization. Doesn't this make his statement that he's not a Truther someone less believable?

War Times Truther 1

War Times Truther 2

Truther 3

151 Van Helsing  Sat, Sep 5, 2009 10:22:05am

re: #14 kansas

How exactly do "human rights activists" make money?

They set up as non-profit agencies, get some seed money to print shiny brochures and then beg or extort money from people and businesses so they can hire more human rights activists to print shiny brochures and then beg or extort money...

152 Quilly Mammoth  Sat, Sep 5, 2009 10:22:23am

Charles,
I didn't say he was a troofer. The lack of further evidence supports your point.

What I'm saying he didn't look closely at what he signing because it appeared to be a slam on the Bush Administration. That doesn't make him a troofer...it makes him a man who despised the Bush Administration so much he mae a stupid move.

153 sattv4u2  Sat, Sep 5, 2009 10:22:26am

re: #148 SteveC

Florida 0, Charleston Southern 0

Florida must still be on the bus!

154 haakondahl  Sat, Sep 5, 2009 10:22:37am

At a minimum, he's unquestionably anti-Israel and has a bunch of unquestionably anti-American friends. I don't know if he had anything to do with the promulgation of this album, or if his time and/or job description didn't overlap with whatever "War Times" outfit put this thing out.

155 sattv4u2  Sat, Sep 5, 2009 10:23:29am

HALFTIME

Ohio St 20 / Navy 7

156 haakondahl  Sat, Sep 5, 2009 10:23:56am

re: #150 LouisianaLightning

Charles,

The reason I think this is related to this issue is that War Time is a Truther site. I searched it for articles and
found over 50 relating to 9/11. Attached are links to some of them.

Van Jones was a member of this organization. Doesn't this make his statement that he's not a Truther someone less believable?

War Times Truther 1

In the current environment, without evidence, it's just reckless to keep trying to make this shoe fit.
War Times Truther 2

Truther 3

157 Charles Johnson  Sat, Sep 5, 2009 10:24:13am

re: #152 Quilly Mammoth

Charles,
I didn't say he was a troofer. The lack of further evidence supports your point.

What I'm saying he didn't look closely at what he signing because it appeared to be a slam on the Bush Administration. That doesn't make him a troofer...it makes him a man who despised the Bush Administration so much he mae a stupid move.

The Truthers lied about the document to several of the signatories. And they put Rachel Ehrenfeld's name on it without even asking.

Why are you taking their word that he signed a Truther document?

158 Linden Arden  Sat, Sep 5, 2009 10:24:18am

Van Jones appears to be a glorified Human Resources guy who will have very little policy influence so why all the blather from Fox News?

I suspect that Glenn Beck has mounted this campaign in retaliation for Jones' NGO effort to have advertisers boycott his show. As usual, the most simple explanation is the most likely - money and revenge.

159 sattv4u2  Sat, Sep 5, 2009 10:24:29am

re: #155 sattv4u2

HALFTIME

Ohio St 20 / Navy 7

I think I read that John Glenn is going to dot the "I" !

160 pre-Boomer Marine brat  Sat, Sep 5, 2009 10:24:46am

One of the more asinine parts of the ODS issue is when ODS-ers claim it's justified by the Left's BDS.

That's like a herd of lemmings running off a cliff on one side of a peninsula, screaming that the other herd did it on the opposite side just a little while ago.

161 Quilly Mammoth  Sat, Sep 5, 2009 10:24:56am

I was under the impression that Van Jones has said he didn't know what he was signing.

162 MacDuff  Sat, Sep 5, 2009 10:25:20am

re: #129 Quilly Mammoth

Please, PLEASE, set aside this "Truther" business!!!

Jones is as radical and racialist as the day is long, take 10 minutes to research the guy instead of engaging in this worthless and time consuming "Truther" debate. Let's chase Jones, instead of our tails!

No personal offense, but this is the very definition of "stuck on stupid".

163 Digital Display  Sat, Sep 5, 2009 10:25:25am

re: #155 sattv4u2

HALFTIME

Ohio St 20 / Navy 7

As long as Navy beats Army...I don't care...
Oh Mandy...Tenn is not only winning..They seem to have a really strong fast defense..Good Luck This year!

164 Charles Johnson  Sat, Sep 5, 2009 10:25:30am

re: #150 LouisianaLightning

Did you even read those articles? Are you aware that they're NOT Truther articles?

165 haakondahl  Sat, Sep 5, 2009 10:26:05am

re: #150 LouisianaLightning

In the current environment, without evidence, it's just reckless to keep trying to make this shoe fit.


(This is what my #156 should have looked like)

166 Sharmuta  Sat, Sep 5, 2009 10:26:13am

re: #150 LouisianaLightning

Is that the standard now? He believes everything published by his organization's magazine? That's pretty tenuous.

167 John Neverbend  Sat, Sep 5, 2009 10:26:48am

re: #121 borgcube

Van Jones may or may not be a Troofer.

The evidence of the 9/11 statement as set out in Ben Smith's article, together with the other piece of "evidence" in that same article is not sufficient to show that Van Jones is a truther, particularly when he said he doesn't hold the views contained in the statement (I am assuming for the moment that he is telling the truth). I have yet to see evidence which conclusively demonstrates that Jones does belong to that group of whack jobs.

My own verdict, by analogy with Scots law, is "not proven" (strictly, this is a verdict in criminal cases, so I'm importing it into a different context). This reflects my view that there is simply insufficient evidence to demonstrate that Jones is a truther. If you asked me whether I would be surprised to learn in the future that Jones really was a truther, because of new evidence, my answer would be "no".

168 Sharmuta  Sat, Sep 5, 2009 10:27:02am

re: #161 Quilly Mammoth

I was under the impression that Van Jones has said he didn't know what he was signing.

According to an unnamed source.

169 Walter L. Newton  Sat, Sep 5, 2009 10:27:04am

re: #154 haakondahl

At a minimum, he's unquestionably anti-Israel and has a bunch of unquestionably anti-American friends. I don't know if he had anything to do with the promulgation of this album, or if his time and/or job description didn't overlap with whatever "War Times" outfit put this thing out.

This is so interesting, he appears to be anti-Israel, an ex-communist, a proponent of junk science (Fellow at the Noetic Institute) and a number of other questionable mind-sets, and we are worried if he did or didn't support the 9/11 truthers, hell, we should be wondering who this guy could hold any position in government overseeing 30 billion dollars.

170 jaunte  Sat, Sep 5, 2009 10:27:16am

re: #164 Charles

"Didn't do all they could to prevent the attack" is a pretty low standard for "caused the attack." I don't see the Truther aspect in those articles.

171 pre-Boomer Marine brat  Sat, Sep 5, 2009 10:27:47am

re: #142 avanti

And gets this comment:

gp said:
Sep 4, 4:34 PM
During the W administration, LGF was a strong anti-jihad, pro-Israel site, therefore reviled by mainstream press. Having moderated since BHO took over, now LGF gets linked all over the place defending BHO. Wild!

"Having moderated since ..."

Heh
Oh really?

172 Miss Trixie  Sat, Sep 5, 2009 10:28:29am

Charles

The only conclusion I can reach is that they’re so overcome by hatred for Barack Obama that the judgment centers in their brains have been permanently switched off.

With all due respect, I would have to disagree with you on the hate. Certainly, there are probably some who hate The One but I think the majority have had enough and they're screaming to the rafters to be heard - in any forum.

Enough of being ignored by their elected officials, enough of the same smarmy libs shoving un-American, white-guilt talking points down their throats. They've had enough "we know what's good for you" patronizing mumbo-jumbo, enough false race cards pulled and viciously shouting folks down who disagree and these people are absolutely terrified that America will become a socialist nation.

People are angry and very upset because the very "leader" of the great United States of America is an empty suit and his advisors are hell-bent on destroying your nation "for the good of the people".

Hate? I don't think so. Anger? Oh HELL yeah.

My 2 cents.

173 Quilly Mammoth  Sat, Sep 5, 2009 10:28:29am

From ABC News

In a statement issued Thursday evening Jones said of "the petition that was circulated today, I do not agree with this statement and it certainly does not reflect my views now or ever."

He did not explain how his name came to be on the petition. An administration source said Jones says he did not carefully review the language in the petition before agreeing to add his name.*

Now that I found that I think it supports my position.

174 haakondahl  Sat, Sep 5, 2009 10:28:44am

re: #171 pre-Boomer Marine brat

"Having moderated since ..."

Heh
Oh really?

Well, with no more sinister red folder...

175 MacDuff  Sat, Sep 5, 2009 10:28:45am

re: #169 Walter L. Newton

This is so interesting, he appears to be anti-Israel, an ex-communist, a proponent of junk science (Fellow at the Noetic Institute) and a number of other questionable mind-sets, and we are worried if he did or didn't support the 9/11 truthers, hell, we should be wondering who this guy could hold any position in government overseeing 30 billion dollars.

Hell, we should be wondering how he can even get a security clearance!

176 Killgore Trout  Sat, Sep 5, 2009 10:28:59am

re: #127 jaunte

Yes, and Ron Paul's Campaign for Liberty is one of the main national sponsors of the Tea Parties.

177 Walter L. Newton  Sat, Sep 5, 2009 10:29:55am

re: #158 Linden Arden

Van Jones appears to be a glorified Human Resources guy who will have very little policy influence so why all the blather from Fox News?

I suspect that Glenn Beck has mounted this campaign in retaliation for Jones' NGO effort to have advertisers boycott his show. As usual, the most simple explanation is the most likely - money and revenge.

Because he has a 30 billion dollar budget to spend, of our money. In my opinion, the Truther thing is small potatoes compared tho the fact that this nut case is in charge of 30 billion dollars of our money, money that will be going to jobs based on what may be junk science and he is a Fellow at the Noetic Institute, a think thank that thinks about mind reading.

The simple answer, he's a nut case, and he has our money.

178 lincolntf  Sat, Sep 5, 2009 10:30:56am

re: #162 MacDuff

That's all well and good, but all of the facts we do know about Jones (excluding anything about 9/11) were not enough to get Obama to drop him.
If VJ's (apparent) affiliation with Troofers keeps him from "shaping economic policy for the 21st century" then that's Obama's problem. The country will be better off.
Barry should've known that the guy was a loon and that with a loon you get lots of baggage.

179 pat  Sat, Sep 5, 2009 10:31:21am

Here i8s statement:

In recent days some in the news media have reported on past statements I made before I joined the administration - some of which were made years ago. If I have offended anyone with statements I made in the past, I apologize. As for the petition that was circulated today, I do not agree with this statement and it certainly does not reflect my views now or ever.

My work at the Council on Environmental Quality is entirely focused on one goal: building clean energy incentives which create 21st century jobs that improve energy efficiency and use renewable resources.

180 Guanxi88  Sat, Sep 5, 2009 10:31:28am

Beck wigged out on a whack job tacking swipes at him through his pseudo-populist leftist noise machine, and stretched things a bit to make an already questionable character (a revolutionary Communist felon doesn't really need to be sheep-dipped, to my mind, but Beck decides to gild the lily) look slightly worse.

Anyone who claims that Barry isn't a low and despicable demagogue who is wholly out of his depth is certainly mistaken; he's got questionable (at best) associates, and seems to gravitate toward ersatz revolutionaries at least as much as they gravitate toward him. The guy's worrisome; he's no dictator, but he might well be the forerunner of one.

181 SurferDoc  Sat, Sep 5, 2009 10:31:29am

re: #177 Walter L. Newton

Because he has a 30 billion dollar budget to spend, of our money. In my opinion, the Truther thing is small potatoes compared tho the fact that this nut case is in charge of 30 billion dollars of our money, money that will be going to jobs based on what may be junk science and he is a Fellow at the Noetic Institute, a think thank that thinks about mind reading.

The simple answer, he's a nut case, and he has our money.

...and that's alright with Obama!

182 Walter L. Newton  Sat, Sep 5, 2009 10:31:33am

re: #175 MacDuff

Hell, we should be wondering how he can even get a security clearance!

I have SP85 clearance, he probably doesn't have much higher. That's not that hard. You just have to be breathing and never have kill anyone.

183 Charles Johnson  Sat, Sep 5, 2009 10:31:57am

re: #178 lincolntf

That's all well and good, but all of the facts we do know about Jones (excluding anything about 9/11) were not enough to get Obama to drop him.
If VJ's (apparent) affiliation with Troofers keeps him from "shaping economic policy for the 21st century" then that's Obama's problem. The country will be better off.
Barry should've known that the guy was a loon and that with a loon you get lots of baggage.

Yeah! Hooray for character assassination based on falsehoods! We need more of this.

/dripping

184 pre-Boomer Marine brat  Sat, Sep 5, 2009 10:32:27am

re: #174 haakondahl

Well, with no more sinister red folder...

I take it that you AraFishing for something?

:D

185 SteveC  Sat, Sep 5, 2009 10:32:53am

re: #141 Walter L. Newton

Is it a present of some sort? It's not my birthday.

But it is mine! #43, tomorrow!

My creaky old heart is still chuggin' along, and that's the best gift a guy could want. Hugs and kisses from the ladies will not be turned down, however! :)

186 jcm  Sat, Sep 5, 2009 10:34:00am

re: #184 pre-Boomer Marine brat

I take it that you AraFishing for something?

:D


Better that than getting Suha'd, and having to turn it over during discovery.

187 Sharmuta  Sat, Sep 5, 2009 10:34:06am

re: #173 Quilly Mammoth

And it's possibly true, but it's an unnamed source that hasn't been confirmed to my knowledge. Considering others have stepped forward claiming they were duped, it's also possible he signed it and the "did not carefully review the language" excuse is legitimate. But as of yet- it's not confirmed.

188 sattv4u2  Sat, Sep 5, 2009 10:34:10am

re: #185 SteveC

But it is mine! #43, tomorrow!

My creaky old heart is still chuggin' along, and that's the best gift a guy could want. Hugs and kisses from the ladies will not be turned down, however! :)

Youngin!

((happy early birthday! ))

189 haakondahl  Sat, Sep 5, 2009 10:34:30am

re: #184 pre-Boomer Marine brat

I take it that you AraFishing for something?

:D

You Mazen't joke of these things...

190 pre-Boomer Marine brat  Sat, Sep 5, 2009 10:35:01am

re: #186 jcm

Better that than getting Suha'd, and having to turn it over during discovery.

:D ... Good Morning! How is you today?

191 MandyManners  Sat, Sep 5, 2009 10:35:22am

WKU has a player named Jihad Morris.

192 pre-Boomer Marine brat  Sat, Sep 5, 2009 10:35:32am

re: #189 haakondahl

You Mazen't joke of these things...

Aw BOO!

193 sattv4u2  Sat, Sep 5, 2009 10:35:35am

Yup,,, John Glenn is about to dot the "I" in OHIO at halftime!

194 Guanxi88  Sat, Sep 5, 2009 10:35:57am

re: #189 haakondahl

You Mazen't joke of these things...

True, or Hard-Hearted Hannan comes for you.

195 sattv4u2  Sat, Sep 5, 2009 10:36:10am

re: #191 MandyManners

WKU has a player named Jihad Morris.

Is he blowing up Tennesees's defense?

196 fizzlogic  Sat, Sep 5, 2009 10:36:11am

re: #104 Charles

Then you'd probably like to link to this site for shits and grins. :)

197 haakondahl  Sat, Sep 5, 2009 10:36:19am

re: #187 Sharmuta

And it's possibly true, but it's an unnamed source that hasn't been confirmed to my knowledge. Considering others have stepped forward claiming they were duped, it's also possible he signed it and the "did not carefully review the language" excuse is legitimate. But as of yet- it's not confirmed.

Understanding that nothing is confirmed, to me the smell about this is one of many booths at a whacko fair, where people just keep signing whatever their fellow travellers shove at them, and the patter doesn't match the fine print.

198 Racer X  Sat, Sep 5, 2009 10:37:14am

I'm perplexed.

Troofers were anti-Bush. They claimed it was a government conspiracy BY BUSH to take over America. Now there are idiots out there who claim that 9/11 was a government conspiracy to allow OBAMA to take over America?

Or did I miss a dose of my meds?

199 jcm  Sat, Sep 5, 2009 10:37:29am

re: #190 pre-Boomer Marine brat

:D ... Good Morning! How is you today?

Doing well! Staring at a pile of laundry to be sorted and folded.

Ah, the domestic life for me!

200 MandyManners  Sat, Sep 5, 2009 10:37:40am

TOUCHDOWN TENNESSEE!

201 haakondahl  Sat, Sep 5, 2009 10:37:49am

re: #196 trendsurfer

Bye.

202 fizzlogic  Sat, Sep 5, 2009 10:38:26am

re: #201 haakondahl

It's pretty obvious it's a spoof site.

203 pre-Boomer Marine brat  Sat, Sep 5, 2009 10:38:38am

re: #195 sattv4u2

Is he blowing up Tennesees's defense?

Maybe he's playing for his 76 trombon ... uh ... oh, never mind

204 sattv4u2  Sat, Sep 5, 2009 10:38:39am

re: #200 MandyManners

TOUCHDOWN TENNESSEE!

They're SMOKEYin!

205 wrenchwench  Sat, Sep 5, 2009 10:38:44am

re: #185 SteveC

{SteveC} ...and many more!

206 MandyManners  Sat, Sep 5, 2009 10:38:55am

re: #195 sattv4u2

Is he blowing up Tennesees's defense?

Tennessee's offense is walking all over him.

207 subsailor68  Sat, Sep 5, 2009 10:39:03am

re: #196 trendsurfer

It's probably not a good idea to link to that site. A number of lizards discussed it the other day, and the consensus is that it's a pretty disgusting thing - satire or not.

208 Killgore Trout  Sat, Sep 5, 2009 10:39:08am

Stormfront Nazi sez...
Pro-White website ad appearing on Drudge Report

I was on Drudge Report and low and behold a banner ad came up for the Council of Conservative Citizens. It is running in a rotation and it seems like it only comes up at certain times of day. Still, pretty AWESOME!

First time I've ever seem a pro-white website advertised on a site that is listed as one of the top 1,000 sites in the world!

I refreshed a couple times and I don't see the ad. Am I missing it? Anyone else?

209 pre-Boomer Marine brat  Sat, Sep 5, 2009 10:39:35am

re: #199 jcm

Doing well! Staring at a pile of laundry to be sorted and folded.

Ah, the domestic life for me!

bbiab ... gonna call FedEx, then throw mine in a box

210 haakondahl  Sat, Sep 5, 2009 10:39:36am

re: #202 trendsurfer

Yeah, what part of 'this shit ain't funny, no matter who gets hit' doesn't make sense?

211 pat  Sat, Sep 5, 2009 10:39:50am

BTW, Van Jones is a terrible writer, with absolutely no expertise in economics, governance, energy production and distribution, and business. His Green Collar manifesto is absurd socialism.

212 SanFranciscoZionist  Sat, Sep 5, 2009 10:39:59am

re: #6 MandyManners

Maybe he's hired a few people at the Institute of Noetic Sciences.

I'll tell ya, I am more worried about that Noetic Sciences connection than whether he's a Commie, a Troofer, or, even a Loofah.

213 jaunte  Sat, Sep 5, 2009 10:40:27am

From an article on Van Jones, linked from him own website.

His organization, Green for All, advocates for green-worker training, counsels local governments on how to set and meet energy-saving goals, and mentors leaders in poor communities to become front-runners in this emerging economic field. He thinks the unemployed during this downturn could be paid by the government to put their communities' houses in ecological order. Green workers could turn roofs into solar fields and fix leaks in windows, doors, and poorly insulated walls.

"Our vision is that people will be able to be continually up-skilled: from laborer to installer to licensed electrician," says Jones, who believes, with his characteristic optimism, that as workers climb the job ladder, they might discover new applications for existing technology. "Tilt the panel this way or that way, and you could conceivably come up with a real breakthrough and start your own company," he explains. "Managers, then owners, then inventors."[Link: www.oprah.com...]

I understand now that his vision of the green economy is something that will be funded by the real economy, and of course there will be a 'Eureka' moment in which a magical breakthrough will happen and people will start their own companies. Thanks, taxpayers.

214 jaunte  Sat, Sep 5, 2009 10:40:49am

"his" own website!

215 Guanxi88  Sat, Sep 5, 2009 10:40:51am

re: #211 pat

BTW, Van Jones is a terrible writer, with absolutely no expertise in economics, governance, energy production and distribution, and business. His Green Collar manifesto is absurd socialism.

Which makes him the ideal pick for a Green Jobs czar. What's the problem, comrade?

216 sattv4u2  Sat, Sep 5, 2009 10:41:05am

re: #208 Killgore Trout

Stormfront Nazi sez...
Pro-White website ad appearing on Drudge Report


I refreshed a couple times and I don't see the ad. Am I missing it? Anyone else?

Nope ,, cigars ,, pet meds ,,, Lowes ,,, Ballys ,,, Equifax ,,,

217 fizzlogic  Sat, Sep 5, 2009 10:41:30am

re: #207 subsailor68

You are right. The accusation is way way over the top. But the listing of all the "evidence" (none at all) is pretty funny.

218 SteveC  Sat, Sep 5, 2009 10:41:34am

re: #174 haakondahl

Well, with no more sinister red folder...

*Thinks* Can this be the mysterious red folder? I wonder what's in it...

*opens folder*

CONFIDENTIAL

Dear Sir,

Good day and compliments. This letter will definitely come to you as a huge surprise, but I implore you to take the time to go through it carefully as the decision you make will go off a long way to determine the future and continued existence of the entire members of my family.

Arafish was being scammed! *Snort*

219 haakondahl  Sat, Sep 5, 2009 10:41:39am

re: #212 SanFranciscoZionist

I'll tell ya, I am more worried about that Noetic Sciences connection than whether he's a Commie, a Troofer, or, even a Loofah.

What concerns me more than his communism (and that's rare, for me!) is his Ward Churchill stance.

220 LouisianaLightning  Sat, Sep 5, 2009 10:41:50am

re: #164 Charles

With all due respect,

the First Article I linked:
Title:
Sept. 11 Families Seek the Truth
Bush Cover-up Suspected

In the article:
... "I have a lot of anger. Bush is engaged in a monumental cover up," said Bob McIlvaine, ...

Third Article:
Title: Bush Lies, People Die
Truth and Consequences

In the article:
... George W. Bush now stands exposed as the latest perpetrator of such fraud. He has fouled the air with half truths, exaggerations and dirty lies on countless issues--from the Sept. 11 intelligence failures, to his rationale for war against Iraq, ...

The 1st & 3rd links are troofer articles.

You are correct that the 2nd article I linked does NOT support my argument. But the 1st and 3rd do so. I did not read all 50 or so of the 9/11 articles, so am not sure what percentage are troofer.

221 MandyManners  Sat, Sep 5, 2009 10:41:53am

re: #212 SanFranciscoZionist

I'll tell ya, I am more worried about that Noetic Sciences connection than whether he's a Commie, a Troofer, or, even a Loofah.

His Noeticism and his (supposedly renounced) Communism together scare the snot outta' me.

222 jcm  Sat, Sep 5, 2009 10:41:58am

re: #213 jaunte

From an article on Van Jones, linked from him own website.

I understand now that his vision of the green economy is something that will be funded by the real economy, and of course there will be a 'Eureka' moment in which a magical breakthrough will happen and people will start their own companies. Thanks, taxpayers.

5 years, it's all in the plan!

223 Killgore Trout  Sat, Sep 5, 2009 10:42:10am

re: #216 sattv4u2

Yeah, I'm not getting it either.

224 Charles Johnson  Sat, Sep 5, 2009 10:42:21am

I'm about to put up one of the most sarcastic posts I've ever written. Cover me. I'm going in.

225 pat  Sat, Sep 5, 2009 10:42:45am

You guys made me read Green Collar. I blame all of you.

226 sattv4u2  Sat, Sep 5, 2009 10:42:49am

re: #224 Charles

I'm about to put up one of the most sarcastic posts I've ever written. Cover me. I'm going in.

I've got your right flank, Sarge!

227 rollwave87  Sat, Sep 5, 2009 10:43:05am

rock on charles. I totally agree with everything you said in this post. its refreshing to read something truly sensible/logical about politics these days.

228 MacDuff  Sat, Sep 5, 2009 10:43:16am

re: #178 lincolntf

With all due respect, and I mean that, the ONLY things we should be focusing on are those that are documented:

1) The man is clearly a radical and has a lifetime of quotes to prove it.

2) Are we to believe that President Obama had no idea of this man's clearly radical statements and beliefs? That is simply not credible; Van Jones' entire life has been that of a bitter radical who approaches every subject in terms of race and ethnicity. As I said before, the fact that this man could even get a security clearance gives me pause.

3) The fact that he was selected as President Obama's "Green Jobs Czar" seems more by design than by mistake.

The "Truther" thing has no traction, because there's no proof. It makes anyone who peddles it look foolish, thus nullifying any other argument we make in the process.

229 Charles Johnson  Sat, Sep 5, 2009 10:43:33am

re: #220 LouisianaLightning

No they don't. They're talking about a cover-up of evidence that Bush was warned about the attacks. They're NOT saying that Bush staged the attacks themselves.

Reading comprehension much?

230 MandyManners  Sat, Sep 5, 2009 10:43:52am

re: #224 Charles

I'm about to put up one of the most sarcastic posts I've ever written. Cover me. I'm going in.

I GOT YER SIX!

231 jaunte  Sat, Sep 5, 2009 10:44:02am

re: #222 jcm

More from that same article:

To date, Green for All has led to the training of only "several hundred" green workers, by Jones' count.


Wotta track record!

232 sattv4u2  Sat, Sep 5, 2009 10:44:03am

re: #223 Killgore Trout

Yeah, I'm not getting it either.

Well,, your quote said something about "certain times of day"

So maybe it's like zero dark thirty when only the loons lurk

I'll check then !!
]
ummm,, HUH !?!?!?!?

233 haakondahl  Sat, Sep 5, 2009 10:44:27am

re: #220 LouisianaLightning

Not from what you've shown so far. Trooferism is about foreknowledge ranging from complicity to full responsibility. From what I've seen so far, your articles sound more like poorly reasoned critiques of the ex post facto actions of the administration.

234 lincolntf  Sat, Sep 5, 2009 10:44:28am

re: #228 MacDuff

There has never been "proof" of anything until it's been sought out. People are seeking it out right now.

235 subsailor68  Sat, Sep 5, 2009 10:44:40am

Oh cool!! I think Charles' post just hit the front page. Gotta go look!

:-)

236 pre-Boomer Marine brat  Sat, Sep 5, 2009 10:44:43am

re: #224 Charles

I'm about to put up one of the most sarcastic posts I've ever written. Cover me. I'm going in.

Gimme a sec to put on my flak suit and helmet

237 Digital Display  Sat, Sep 5, 2009 10:44:57am

re: #230 MandyManners

I GOT YER SIX!

Bring those big fast guys from Tenn with you!

238 SteveC  Sat, Sep 5, 2009 10:45:21am

re: #230 MandyManners

I GOT YER SIX!

NOT a cheese eating surrender monkey!

239 haakondahl  Sat, Sep 5, 2009 10:45:22am

re: #224 Charles

I'm about to put up one of the most sarcastic posts I've ever written. Cover me. I'm going in.

Cringing, actually...

240 Van Helsing  Sat, Sep 5, 2009 10:45:36am

re: #222 jcm

5 years, it's all in the plan!

Plan, 5 years, where have I heard that before?

241 debutaunt  Sat, Sep 5, 2009 10:45:57am

re: #151 Van Helsing

They set up as non-profit agencies, get some seed money to print shiny brochures and then beg or extort money from people and businesses so they can hire more human rights activists to print shiny brochures and then beg or extort money...

Bonnie and Clyde had a similar business plan.

242 Walter L. Newton  Sat, Sep 5, 2009 10:46:02am

re: #212 SanFranciscoZionist

I'll tell ya, I am more worried about that Noetic Sciences connection than whether he's a Commie, a Troofer, or, even a Loofah.

FYI...

"The Institute of Noetic Sciences (IONS) was co-founded in 1973 by former astronaut Edgar Mitchell and industrialist Paul N. Temple[1][2] to encourage and conduct research on human potentials.[3] Institute programs include "extended human capacities," "integral health and healing," and "emerging worldviews." This includes research into topics such as spontaneous remission, meditation, consciousness, alternative healing practices, spirituality, human potential, psychic abilities and survival of consciousness after bodily death, among others.[4] The institute's name is derived from the Greek word nous, meaning direct or inner knowing, a reference to intuition."

[Link: en.wikipedia.org...]

Van Jones position as a Fellow with this organization, and the fact that he is overseeing 30 billion dollar slated to "green jobs" creation, jobs which evidently would have a lot of foundation in basic science, I see Van Jones as no different than a right-wing politician who promotes a creationist agenda.

But, that's just me.

243 SanFranciscoZionist  Sat, Sep 5, 2009 10:46:17am

re: #102 Sharmuta

And why isn't this stink sticking to Ron Paul?

Because Ron Paul's not a Commie, so we don't care what else he believes.

//? I have no idea. Ron Paul is another thing I never hear about except here.

244 Guanxi88  Sat, Sep 5, 2009 10:46:45am

re: #241 debutaunt

Bonnie and Clyde had a similar business plan.

It's a very successful business model, which accounts for its wide adoption.

245 sattv4u2  Sat, Sep 5, 2009 10:46:53am

re: #224 Charles

I'm about to put up one of the most sarcastic posts I've ever written. Cover me. I'm going in.

By golly, he did it! Charles really really did it !!!

246 Walter L. Newton  Sat, Sep 5, 2009 10:47:01am

re: #229 Charles

No they don't. They're talking about a cover-up of evidence that Bush was warned about the attacks. They're NOT saying that Bush staged the attacks themselves.

Reading comprehension much?

Was that it, the most sarcastic post, I almost missed it :)

247 sattv4u2  Sat, Sep 5, 2009 10:48:22am

re: #246 Walter L. Newton

Was that it, the most sarcastic post, I almost missed it :)

pppssst ,,, not here ,,, over there >>>

248 Dreader1962  Sat, Sep 5, 2009 10:48:37am

I was listening to the Mike McConnell radio show for a bit while driving (I'm not normally a listener). He was taking calls on the Obama school speech flap. He sees it as a non-issue and is slamming those on the right who are upset about it. The callers were repeating the usual garbage and looking like fools when McConnell tore apart their arguments.

Just so you know that you are not alone, Charles.

249 SGTTED  Sat, Sep 5, 2009 10:49:13am

Yes, because saying that Bush knew about the coming attacks and did nothing in order to justify the war is so much better.

250 sattv4u2  Sat, Sep 5, 2009 10:49:20am

re: #248 Dreader1962

I was listening to the Mike McConnell radio show for a bit while driving (I'm not normally a listener). He was taking calls on the Obama school speech flap. He sees it as a non-issue and is slamming those on the right who are upset about it. The callers were repeating the usual garbage and looking like fools when McConnell tore apart their arguments.

Just so you know that you are not alone, Charles.

McConnell is one of the most rational people on radio today, imho

251 haakondahl  Sat, Sep 5, 2009 10:50:08am

We should all flounce on the next thread. Charles, green light?

252 SanFranciscoZionist  Sat, Sep 5, 2009 10:51:25am

re: #121 borgcube


The crowd that continually supports Mumia Abu Jamal are worse in just about any way imaginable. They're not nuts, they're rotten to the core.

Weird. I had a dream last night where someone was talking about Mumia.

The Mumia people are just a goddamn pain. I have friends who are anti-death-penalty activists, and they hate the Mumia people with a passion, because the Mumia people grab the mike every time the press come around, and as far as my friends can tell, they actually don't care about the death penalty, they just want their man freed.

And of course, yours truly is an ex-cop's daughter, so I have some feelings...

253 haakondahl  Sat, Sep 5, 2009 10:51:29am

re: #251 haakondahl

If so, just delete my 251.

254 pat  Sat, Sep 5, 2009 10:51:41am

re: #242 Walter L. Newton

I am with you on this. I frankly did not see anything particularly offensive about this society. But nor is it particularly different than Creationism, which I find to be equally silly but ineffectual.

255 freedomplow  Sat, Sep 5, 2009 10:54:59am

I didn't find any substantial evidence he was a truther either Charles.

I'll stand by you on this.

Might not be much but it's all I got.

256 Pianobuff  Sat, Sep 5, 2009 10:55:52am

re: #198 Racer X

I'm perplexed.

Troofers were anti-Bush. They claimed it was a government conspiracy BY BUSH to take over America. Now there are idiots out there who claim that 9/11 was a government conspiracy to allow OBAMA to take over America?

Or did I miss a dose of my meds?

Special meds are needed to discern the "two sides of the same coin" crowd. They believe that (pick one or more from menu: Reptilians, Rothchilds, Illuminati, Trilateral Commission, Bilderbergers, Council on Foreign Relations, Other unnamed Jewish Bankers, European Royalty, Descendants of Sumerians, FreeMasons, Jesuits, Rosicrucians, or other Esotericists [of which I believe Charles was recently accused of being], The World Bank, The Federal Reserve, WTO, Clintons, Bushes, Other Bohemian Grovers, Nazis, Jews, Shape-shifters, Rupert Murdoch, George Soros, Karl Rove, New Agers, The Vatican, "Giants" spoken of in the Book of Enoch, "The Media" --- Collectively known as the New World Order) are really calling the shots.

They figure out who is going to be in political power to advance their agenda which is: reduction of the world population, enslavement of the world population, preparation of the planet for aliens, other exo-political misadventures.

The techniques they use are: Chemtrails, engineered viruses that will wipe out the population, engineered viruses that will not wipe out the population but manufactures a crisis that allows other more dastardly deeds to be done, vaccinations (one of the dastardly deeds), fluoridated water, mind control, global currency, regional currency, de-valued currency, The New York Times, The Washington Times, MSNBC, Fox News, genetic manipulation, false information (such as a faked moon landing), moon bases that were visited during moon landings, getting figureheads into power (Clinton, Bush, Obama) through any means (Ross Perot, Election Fraud, Fake Birth Certificate corresponding to the previous order of named leaders), false flag operations (9/11, economic crisis).

All of this is believed concurrently and with a straight face.

I hope this clears up your confusion.

257 NoWhereAlaska  Sat, Sep 5, 2009 10:56:36am

Van Jones is just a symptom. It is difficult to comprehend the Obama initiatives in totality. I believe many people grab at single items so they can say: “look, we are headed in the wrong direction and being led by ideologues into a disastrous future. You can argue all you want about whether Van Jones is a ‘truther.’ It misses the point. He is a radical, in an administration full of radicals, which is empowering a radical agenda that is going to destroy the fabric of American life as we know it.
The frustration of trying to alert a American populous that is often self-blinding, leads to ‘kookisms.’ The obvious charm of Glenn Beck is fueled by the alarming direction this administration is taking America.
We desperately need to stop this administration agenda. Unfortunately some of the measures being taken are counterproductive. But nonetheless, we need to stop this headlong plunge into socialism and bankruptcy.

258 [deleted]  Sat, Sep 5, 2009 10:58:42am
259 SanFranciscoZionist  Sat, Sep 5, 2009 10:59:19am

re: #234 lincolntf

There has never been "proof" of anything until it's been sought out. People are seeking it out right now.

There's some choice language for going looking for proof of something there's no proof of.

260 Ziggy  Sat, Sep 5, 2009 10:59:37am

As much as I think these troofers are loons (left and right), Jones' other radical affiliations and positions is enough to know he's got to go...and never should have been hired in the first place. The real question in my mind is, was this a lack of vetting or is it an endorsement of his beliefs.

261 sagehen  Sat, Sep 5, 2009 11:00:05am

re: #171 pre-Boomer Marine brat

"Having moderated since ..."

Heh
Oh really?

It's all a matter of perspective.

Since the crazy on the right has gotten so much crazier, and the crazy on the left has turned down the volume, LGF looks more centrist than it used to. Even though it's standing in exactly the same place it always did.

Overton window in action.

262 SanFranciscoZionist  Sat, Sep 5, 2009 11:01:57am

re: #258 abdominal_snowman

At least one of the people who you cite as being lied to about the contents of the documents, Michael Lerner, was apparently refered to in the past by Charles Johnson on Little Green Footballs as a truther.

Here's the link:

http://littlegreenfootballs.com/article/24364_Lern er_Dives_Off_Deep_End.

Either Lerner and/or you were lying about Lerner being a truther then, or he was lying about never or no longer being a truther now, in order to protect Van Jones.

I didn't have to look for this information; I found it at AoS. I followed the link, it went to lgf.

Lerner is, honestly, kind of confused about what Lerner is. I used to work for him. He's a special kind of guy. Please note, 'special' was carefully chosen to be a word lacking all connotation.

263 haakondahl  Sat, Sep 5, 2009 11:04:05am

re: #261 sagehen

It's all a matter of perspective.

Since the crazy on the right has gotten so much crazier, and the crazy on the left has turned down the volume, LGF looks more centrist than it used to. Even though it's standing in exactly the same place it always did.

Overton window in action.

Nothing remains the same.

264 haakondahl  Sat, Sep 5, 2009 11:04:32am

re: #260 Ziggy

As much as I think these troofers are loons (left and right), Jones' other radical affiliations and positions is enough to know he's got to go...and never should have been hired in the first place. The real question in my mind is, was this a lack of vetting or is it an endorsement of his beliefs.

Would you believe... both!

265 haakondahl  Sat, Sep 5, 2009 11:05:44am

re: #259 SanFranciscoZionist

There's some choice language for going looking for proof of something there's no proof of.

Believe me, they'll find it. Their time machine has a perpetual-motion powerplant.

266 Ziggy  Sat, Sep 5, 2009 11:06:47am

re: #264 haakondahl
I would. These days there's very little that is unbelievable.

267 Pingemi  Sat, Sep 5, 2009 11:07:57am

After some digging I have to give game set and match to Charles. Details are here.

I have to conclude that Jones is a vile bit of camel droppings, but not a truther.

You were right and I was wrong.

268 MacDuff  Sat, Sep 5, 2009 11:09:00am

re: #234 lincolntf

There has never been "proof" of anything until it's been sought out. People are seeking it out right now.

Well, call me crazy, but I'd rather concentrate on the verifiable body of evidence that stands before me, than chasing shadows - particularly when the body of evidence is far more incriminating than the shadows.

I can't put it any more succinctly than that.

I've made a number of posts on this subject, here and on my humble site, all unwaivering in my belief that this "Truther" business is a fool's errand. There's too much at stake for us to spend our time with this nonsense thus sullying our collective reputations in pursuit of this phantom.

With that, I'm done on this subject.

269 haakondahl  Sat, Sep 5, 2009 11:09:48am

The Hell of it is that there's an easy climbdown. "There's now so much mud being slung about his trooferism that I'm not sure what to think. So I'll retract that particular allegation. Let me show you wy it was so easy to believe--look at this quite well-documented legacy of hating America and not thinking things through. Very well. At all."

Anybody who has gotten in trouble with this sorry spectacle could get out just like that. But noo-OO-oo.

270 Dancing along the light of day  Sat, Sep 5, 2009 11:10:19am

re: #230 MandyManners

What a GREAT picture!

271 haakondahl  Sat, Sep 5, 2009 11:11:40am

Charles, in the spirit of the next post, I'll flounce in the thread. I'm kidding. Cover me.

272 Salamantis  Sat, Sep 5, 2009 11:12:00am

re: #85 Charles

Of course, in that speech in which he called Republicans assholes, he also called himself an asshole.

Well, at least he was half right...;~)

273 Picayune  Sat, Sep 5, 2009 11:14:30am

re: #112 lincolntf

It's
kind of a running question with this Administration. Do they really
"miss" things like tax cheating, bizarre affiliations, corrupt pasts,
etc. while vetting appointees? Or does Obama simply prefer to surround
himself with people who are crooked and crazy?

I've seen a video of Obama from some time ago in which he states that "If you want to know my policies, look at the people that I surround himself with. " He mentions Vann Jones in the statement These are O's hand picked folks, ask V. Jarret, she has boasted about Jones.

N. Over. Their. Heads! Tread, Baby Tread!

274 Victor Davis Manson  Sat, Sep 5, 2009 11:27:15am

Charles, I don't post much but this whole topic disturbs me. You are not wrong very often but here you clearly are. Please take a step back and reconsider your assertions...
Thank you

275 Charles Johnson  Sat, Sep 5, 2009 11:30:52am

re: #274 Victor Davis Manson

Charles, I don't post much but this whole topic disturbs me. You are not wrong very often but here you clearly are. Please take a step back and reconsider your assertions...
Thank you

Go ahead. Show me where I'm wrong. Find some proof that Van Jones is a Truther, and Truther sites and hate sites don't count.

276 Picayune  Sat, Sep 5, 2009 11:34:03am

re: #197 haakondahl

Could be right? Like the Penn/Teller vid Charles put up some time back that showed willing dupes signing the petition to oppose Hydrogen Di Oxide (water), with claims that it was found in baby food, etc.. Loony Birds of a feather.

277 MacDuff  Sat, Sep 5, 2009 11:34:43am

re: #273 Picayune

I've seen a video of Obama from some time ago in which he states that "If you want to know my policies, look at the people that I surround himself with" He mentions Vann Jones in the statement These are O's hand picked folks, ask V. Jarret, she has boasted about Jones.

N. Over. Their. Heads! Tread, Baby Tread!

PREEECISELY!! Why waste our time hanging "Trutherism" around Jones' neck, when we can hang Jones around Obama's neck?

278 RightMinded  Sat, Sep 5, 2009 11:36:34am

I don't know if you all saw this or not. I posted it yesterday. Jones, who wrote this article, doesn't admit to being a troofer, but he does list some interesting "heroes & she-roes". This was written right after Kerry lost the election in 2004.

[Link: www.yesmagazine.org...]

In it, Van Jones claims the new heroes are Michael Moore, Code Pink, Moveon and a few others. He might not be a troofer, but IMO he doesn't have very good judegment either. The list is down a bit in the article.

279 Charles Johnson  Sat, Sep 5, 2009 11:38:23am

re: #278 RightMinded

I don't know if you all saw this or not. I posted it yesterday. Jones, who wrote this article, doesn't admit to being a troofer, but he does list some interesting "heroes & she-roes". This was written right after Kerry lost the election in 2004.

[Link: www.yesmagazine.org...]

In it, Van Jones claims the new heroes are Michael Moore, Code Pink, Moveon and a few others. He might not be a troofer, but IMO he doesn't have very good judegment either. The list is down a bit in the article.

There's no doubt at all that Van Jones is a far leftist, and nobody has said otherwise -- especially not me.

280 Pingemi  Sat, Sep 5, 2009 11:38:41am

re: #275 Charles

I'm afraid Charles is right on this one. Let me copy the critical finding that from my post on the subject:

Gateway correctly shows that Jones was involved in the War Times but I decided to take a closer look at his link. It’s loaded with drivel and nonsense that would make Rosie O’Donnell and Michael Moore proud but right at the top I found this:

Prospectus

WAR TIMES
A New, Biweekly Newspaper Opposing the “War on Terrorism”

The terrorist attacks of September 11 marked the beginning of a new and
frightening period in our history. Thousands of people died that day, and
their families along with the country as a whole are still struggling to
recover. But President Bush’s response of “permanent war against terrorism
at home and abroad” has further endangered the lives and liberties of
millions of people everywhere. emphasis mine

This is a direct statement made in 2002 before even the founding of the paper saying that Terrorists are responsible for 9/11 and attacking President Bush’s response, not declaring him responsible. To quote Gateway Pundit:

Van Jones was instrumental in the creation of this publication and sat on its board for at least the first year and a half of its existence.

That being true we must conclude that although Jones is connected to vile opinions and has no business being in the White House in any capacity. He can not honestly be declared a truther.

Ironically the administration can't use that defense without showing he was involved with other unacceptable groups and who's non-truther public statements that have come out since are more than enough to cause trouble at 1600 and not just for him.

281 captdiggs  Sat, Sep 5, 2009 11:43:02am

Jones signature on the document is consistent with his far left positions on other issues (Mumia Jamal), etc.
Jones never tried to remove his name ( as has Ehrenfeld ).
Jones has not said he was deceived, only the he didn't review the document "carefully" enough.
He advocates for the "global struggle against a U.S.-led security apparatus and military agenda". He rants about the Israeli "occupation". ( You can listen to him for yourself, starting at 3:50

)
Is it really so far fetched to think that Jones would believe that Bush, et al, might have some nefarious connection to 9/11?
282 Charles Johnson  Sat, Sep 5, 2009 11:47:34am

re: #281 captdiggs

Yes, without proof it's totally unreasonable. I can hardly believe I need to say this, but it doesn't become true just because you really really want it to be.

283 Victor Davis Manson  Sat, Sep 5, 2009 11:48:27am

re: #275 Charles

Charles, I have no interest at all to make you look bad. I truly care about LGF. I merely remember past posts on this site that criticized Rabbi Lerner as being a truther nutjob. I hardly think he is the best character witness for Van Jones.

284 RightMinded  Sat, Sep 5, 2009 11:49:02am

re: #280 Pingemi


I guess that put them in a bit of a Catch-22.

285 BARACK THE VOTE  Sat, Sep 5, 2009 11:49:23am

re: #281 captdiggs

1) Being critical of Bush and the war, and supporting the 9-11 commission, is not the same as being a truther. I don't know how many times this point needs to be made.

2) there is no evidence that Jones was a truther. The guy isn't exactly reticent. If he had been a truther, we'd have video, pictures, transcripts by now.

3) Reread 1 and 2 until this sinks in.

286 Charles Johnson  Sat, Sep 5, 2009 11:51:46am

re: #283 Victor Davis Manson

Charles, I have no interest at all to make you look bad. I truly care about LGF. I merely remember past posts on this site that criticized Rabbi Lerner as being a truther nutjob. I hardly think he is the best character witness for Van Jones.

Uh huh. So you came over based on Ace's idiotic post, right?

Do you think Rachel Ehrenfeld was also lying about being misled by the Truthers?

287 Picayune  Sat, Sep 5, 2009 11:52:37am

re: #277 MacDuff

Now your cooking! And with Gas!

288 captdiggs  Sat, Sep 5, 2009 11:55:23am

re: #282 Charles

Yes, without proof it's totally unreasonable. I can hardly believe I need to say this, but it doesn't become true just because you really really want it to be.

I really don't care much about Jones. I think this has far more to do with Obama's vetting process, and there is a lot about Jones that should have been an earlier red flag in that process.
I'm just saying that the document he signed is consistent with his other equally wacky positions. The only proof available one way or the other is his signature.
We'll never know what he really thinks. But I am inclined to think that anyone who rails against the US "military" and "imperialist" agenda would not be adverse to signing that document. Just my opinion, since there can be no definitive proof one way or the other outside of that signature.

289 Picayune  Sat, Sep 5, 2009 11:56:32am

re: #287 Picayune

Make that: "you're".

290 Pingemi  Sat, Sep 5, 2009 11:57:10am

Well "not being a truther" is certainly not enough to put on a resume to justify his appointment. It's kind of a low standard it certainly doesn't make you Joan of Arc.

291 LouisianaLightning  Sat, Sep 5, 2009 12:00:21pm

re: #229 Charles

My reading comprehension is fine. My definition of Troofers is either:
1. They believe Bush planned and performed the attacks
or
2. Bush knew when and where the attacks would take place and did nothing to stop it or actually wanted it to occur.

I didn't realize you only consider the 1st definition to be the one of a troofer, so we are talking past one another. My apologies.

292 Mike Nargizian  Sat, Sep 5, 2009 12:00:52pm

re: #281 captdiggs

Jones signature on the document is consistent with his far left positions on other issues (Mumia Jamal), etc.
Jones never tried to remove his name ( as has Ehrenfeld ).
Jones has not said he was deceived, only the he didn't review the document "carefully" enough.

He advocates for the "global struggle against a U.S.-led security apparatus and military agenda". He rants about the Israeli "occupation". ( You can listen to him for yourself, starting at 3:50
[Video] )


RE YOU TUBE VIDEO -
QUESTIONS -

1) At the end it says this is Mumia Jamal? How does he host a radio show if he's a convicted murder in prison?
2) The whole summation by Jamal is sickening...
3) Jones calls for a Palestinian right of return...
4) He says we wouldn't sit 53 days let alone 54 years of Israeli occupation.

Your points about him not demanding his name removed is fair except that he may have signed someting different than what is shown now, Charles's point.

293 Pingemi  Sat, Sep 5, 2009 12:03:25pm

re: #281 captdiggs

I certainly agree a reasonable person could come to that conclusion. It was my initial conclusion on the first thread, but then this morning I tried searching explicitly to prove Charles Wrong on this one.

It's is certainly possible I missed something and it wouldn't surprise me if something new came up but I didn't find it.

So instead of a truther he is merely a person who has BDS , who doesn't support the troops or the US, who hates Israel and doesn't care much for White people in general and believes in outlandish conspiracy theories.

Just not this particular one.

That's not the same as being a truther, but it's bad enough.

294 tradewind  Sat, Sep 5, 2009 12:12:16pm

re: #195 sattv4u2

It wasn't meant that way... his Daddy was thrilled in the delivery room, and said Gee , I had a boy!
She kind of like the sound of that and went with it.

295 haakondahl  Sat, Sep 5, 2009 12:13:11pm

Going to bed.

296 captdiggs  Sat, Sep 5, 2009 12:13:46pm

re: #293 Pingemi

So instead of a truther he is merely a person who has BDS , who doesn't support the troops or the US, who hates Israel and doesn't care much for White people in general and believes in outlandish conspiracy theories.

Just not this particular one.


"Just not this particular one."

That's the part I don't buy from Jones.
Again, so far, there is no other definitive evidence aside from his signature. So all anyone can do is form their own opinion.
And I wholeheartedly agree with Charles on the use of such trash as Rense.com being the source of anything.

297 RightMinded  Sat, Sep 5, 2009 12:14:00pm

re: #291 LouisianaLightning

Actually, I guess I was under the same misunderstanding as well. I had always defined a truther to include both.

298 Victor Davis Manson  Sat, Sep 5, 2009 12:15:42pm

re: #286 Charles

Dr. Rachel Ehrenfeld never claimed that she was misled into signing the petition. She states that she never signed it at all. Zinn claims he was tricked into signing the truther petition, Van Jones claimed he too was tricked into signing it. These are educated, politically savvy men. I don't believe either was unable to read and understand the petition they signed. It is an old PR strategy to claim one did not do anything wrong but instead one was merely stupid.

299 Charles Johnson  Sat, Sep 5, 2009 12:18:57pm

re: #298 Victor Davis Manson

Dr. Rachel Ehrenfeld never claimed that she was misled into signing the petition. She states that she never signed it at all. Zinn claims he was tricked into signing the truther petition, Van Jones claimed he too was tricked into signing it. These are educated, politically savvy men. I don't believe either was unable to read and understand the petition they signed. It is an old PR strategy to claim one did not do anything wrong but instead one was merely stupid.

OK, so now we know that you're willing to accept the word of 9/11 Truthers over almost everything else.

Please see the final sentence in the post above.

300 Charles Johnson  Sat, Sep 5, 2009 12:23:06pm

re: #291 LouisianaLightning

My reading comprehension is fine. My definition of Troofers is either:
1. They believe Bush planned and performed the attacks
or
2. Bush knew when and where the attacks would take place and did nothing to stop it or actually wanted it to occur.

I didn't realize you only consider the 1st definition to be the one of a troofer, so we are talking past one another. My apologies.

The difference is that your option 1 involves an outright conspiracy, whereas option 2 involves nothing more than incompetence.

I've spent way more time looking at Truthers than I should have, and I have NEVER seen a Truther who believes your option 2.

9/11 Trutherism is a conspiracy theory. Believing the Bush adminstration failed to act on intelligence is a left-wing view, but it's not a conspiracy view.

301 Picayune  Sat, Sep 5, 2009 12:26:13pm

re: #291 LouisianaLightning

The only person that needs to apologize now is the One who is famous for apologizing to the rest of the world for America's exceptionalism/leadership - Obama.

He needs to apologize to the American people for appointing Van Jones, and all the other radical bazaar czars. If he and the DEMS don't correct the "free agent" czar issue quick, he and the DEMS will face major trouble over this issue.

If the DEMS don't correct this problem on their own, they will probably be replaced by those that will, next year.

302 carmen  Sat, Sep 5, 2009 12:28:31pm

the reason van jones is being targeted is because he is behind-the-scenes leading the charge to get beck kicked of tv. i don't care for beck's style but i believe 90% of what he says. at least he's doing something. jones has never held a job and has never created ANYTHING and he works in the WH. what a crock.

303 Charles Johnson  Sat, Sep 5, 2009 12:32:56pm

re: #291 LouisianaLightning

2. Bush knew when and where the attacks would take place and did nothing to stop it or actually wanted it to occur.

By the way, the articles you linked to do NOT say that Bush knew when and where the attacks would take place. I really wish you stop just making things up.

305 Mike Nargizian  Sat, Sep 5, 2009 12:37:06pm

re: #302 carmen

the reason van jones is being targeted is because he is behind-the-scenes leading the charge to get beck kicked of tv. i don't care for beck's style but i believe 90% of what he says. at least he's doing something. jones has never held a job and has never created ANYTHING and he works in the WH. what a crock.

Hey so you bought 90% of his crying Obamas Health care and Obama aren't but they really are Nazi?

306 tradewind  Sat, Sep 5, 2009 12:40:13pm

re: #300 Charles

Do the Troofers believe that thing about the Israelis being the ones who blew up the WTC? Or do they think it came strictly from our government?
I don't have the stomach to go on their sites to look it up.

307 Charles Johnson  Sat, Sep 5, 2009 12:50:54pm

re: #304 Victor Davis Manson

Charles, you are too smart to attack people on a personal level who disagree with you .

So go ahead. Prove to me that Van Jones is a Truther. Find one single statement from him in which he says the government plotted the 9/11 attacks.

You won't be able to.

308 tradewind  Sat, Sep 5, 2009 1:07:02pm

re: #307 Charles

Besides, he's said enough stupid stuff... if he really thinks that ' only suburban white kids shoot up other kids ', he's never been to the inner city of my town, where the opposite happens nightly.

309 Victor Davis Manson  Sat, Sep 5, 2009 1:11:57pm

re: #307 Charles

Charles, Van Jones is a hater of the United States. That statement cannot be disputed at all. Given his level of hatred towards the United States, and his signing of the truther petition, it is at least likely that he subscribed to the truther movement. I simply find it unbelievable that such an educated man would sign a petition without reading and understanding it. Charles do you believe that there is any chance that Van Jones would mistakenly sign a pro Bush petition? No, of course not. Zero chance. Period.
Charles I do agree with you that technically there is no indisputable proof that Van Jones is a truther. Technically you are correct but in this case, there is more smoke than an LA hill fire. Charles, please, at least agree that the circumstances suggest that Van Jones' hatred of the USA is so great, so overwhelming that truther conspiracy theories would appeal to him and it is very likely that he signed that petition knowing full well its content.
Thank you for discussing this with me.

310 Charles Johnson  Sat, Sep 5, 2009 1:17:58pm

re: #309 Victor Davis Manson

Got it. You really really want to believe this, and the fact that there's no evidence at all isn't going to deter you.

311 Victor Davis Manson  Sat, Sep 5, 2009 1:18:57pm

re: #310 Charles

Thanks Charles, I knew I could count on you...

312 irish rose  Sat, Sep 5, 2009 1:47:10pm

I'm thankful that that at least one blogger still understands that truth and intellectual honesty are important concepts.

Charles, I know I've said it many times but I'll say it again today.

It takes a person of great moral character to defend an ideological opponent like Jones, when he's being wrongly accused on an issue. You have a tremendous amount of integrity.

Having an inbox full of hate-mail because you choose to practice intellectual honesty instead of knee-jerk extremism, a badge of honor.

Wear it with pride.

313 Maui Girl  Sat, Sep 5, 2009 2:04:03pm

I could care less about "Truthers" and their ridiculous conspiracy theories. What concerns me is that Van Jones is a self-proclaimed communist.

314 tradewind  Sat, Sep 5, 2009 2:14:29pm

re: #313 Maui Girl

Oh, you haven't heard the latest?
He's sowwy. He's recanted that stuff from his long ago youth.
Oh wait... does a matter of months qualify as ' long ago ' ?

315 [deleted]  Sat, Sep 5, 2009 2:23:39pm
316 Charles Johnson  Sat, Sep 5, 2009 2:27:00pm

re: #315 Mauser

Bye now! Have fun stewing in your hatred!

317 Wendya  Sat, Sep 5, 2009 2:43:46pm

The truther movement started out as a political attack. It began with: "we were attacked because Bush was incompetent" and evolved into: "Bush knew about it and let it happen so that we could attack the middle east and seize their oil" and finally, "Bush engineered the attacks".

318 Dr. Shalit  Sat, Sep 5, 2009 3:49:39pm

re: #31 SurferDoc

Van Jones carries so much other baggage that if he was a Troofer that would at least be cause for sympathy for the guy on grounds of Severe Mental Illness.

Surfer Doc -

Got that right Surfer.

-S-

319 Hector1980  Sat, Sep 5, 2009 6:34:49pm

Of course you're getting attacked. You have principles, regardless of party politics.

And that's a rare thing these days.

320 LieSeeker  Sat, Sep 5, 2009 6:50:32pm
For pointing this out, I’ve been viciously attacked and smeared all over the web, and have now received well over 100 hate mails calling me every foul name in the book.

Let me offset that a little by calling you a clean name: Realist.

And thanks for paying attention to this Van Jones 9/11 Truther issue. Now everyone can point out all the other stupid things that seem to be wrong with him.

321 John Neverbend  Sat, Sep 5, 2009 8:07:27pm

re: #132 Reginald Perrin

Isn't CJ the one whose supposed to make that comment?
/


Yes, I'm acting the role of CJ today.

322 [deleted]  Tue, Sep 8, 2009 8:23:58pm
323 Charles Johnson  Tue, Sep 8, 2009 8:26:11pm

Bye now!

324 Spedvet  Tue, Sep 8, 2009 9:03:27pm

Believing Jones didn't sign the petition and was mislead into signing onto for what the petition actually stood for is like believing Obama sat in Jeremiah Wright's pew and didn't hear a word of Wright's racist stuff and/or didn't agree with it either. Sure, neither one is absolutely, beyond a shadow of a doubt provable, but common sense tell us a man doesn't sit in a pew and not hear things for 20 years he vehemently opposes, and common sense tells us a lawyer with Jones's mental acumen who reads and understands probably knew what the Truther movement stood for when approached by them and opted not to exercise caution or discretion in the very least. In both cases, the circumstantial evidence is substantial. In both cases, not a lot of exonerating evidence exists.


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