Was Scott Roeder Part of a Conspiracy?

US News • Views: 2,490

Federal investigators are reportedly looking into the possibility that the alleged murderer of Dr. George Tiller, Scott Roeder, may have had help.

WICHITA, Kan., Aug. 10 (UPI) — A federal investigation is underway to determine if more than one person was involved in abortion doctor George Tiller’s death, Kansas authorities said.

Scott Roeder, 51, of Kansas City, Kan., is charged with first-degree murder in the fatal shooting of Tiller May 31 at the church where Tiller served as an usher. Roeder pleaded innocent and is being held in a Wichita jail on $20 million bail with trial scheduled for Sept. 21.

Federal agents, who declined to comment on an investigation, have spoken with many who have visited Roeder since the shooting, including two convicted abortion clinic bombers and several people who signed a declaration defending the killing of abortion providers, the Kansas City (Mo.) Star reported Monday.

“This guy has been in the hard-core anti-abortion circle for a long time, and there has been a pattern of communication and encouragement among these people,” Eleanor Smeal, president of the Feminist Majority Foundation, said.

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176 comments
1 Cato the Elder  Tue, Aug 11, 2009 12:07:12pm

There are no right-wing conspiracies.

2 [deleted]  Tue, Aug 11, 2009 12:07:51pm
3 Wendya  Tue, Aug 11, 2009 12:08:23pm

It wouldn’t surprise me if he had help. Now whether it was a large conspiracy organized from the upper levels of the anti-abortion movement is another question.

4 Occasional Reader  Tue, Aug 11, 2009 12:09:58pm

I’d be quite surprised if there weren’t at least another nutjob or two in on the thing.

5 Kragar  Tue, Aug 11, 2009 12:10:09pm

How long before the groups start saying he never did it but it would be justified if he did?

6 [deleted]  Tue, Aug 11, 2009 12:10:34pm
7 MJ  Tue, Aug 11, 2009 12:10:58pm

Well, there isn’t much information in that article. He had visits from other extremists according to the article but that seems to be a mighty slim thread to hang a conspiracy from. Besides, you would think that anyone who would have been involved in a conspiracy would not risk visiting him in jail…

8 Wendya  Tue, Aug 11, 2009 12:11:15pm

re: #6 buzzsawmonkey

The question is, how many nut jobs have been created or saved?

I’m pretty sure Obama isn’t going to take credit for that job.

9 MandyManners  Tue, Aug 11, 2009 12:11:30pm

If so, I hope the feds root out every single co-conspirator and prosecutes them to the fullest extent of the law.

10 Occasional Reader  Tue, Aug 11, 2009 12:12:08pm

Apologies for the early OT, but the previous thread has gotten so kludgy that I’m running from it in horror.

White House Objects to Poster That Invokes Obama Children

The posters went up last week, 14 in Union Station. On each of the large displays, a thought bubble rises up from a picture of a beautiful 8-year-old: “President Obama’s daughters get healthy school lunches. Why don’t I?”

A Washington nonprofit that advocates nutrition-policy reform paid $20,000 to get its message across and carefully maneuvered Metro’s tangle of regulations to display its posters. Metro gave it a go — but the White House did not, according to the group. Within 24 hours of the signs’ appearance, the White House asked the Physicians Committee for Responsible Medicine to take down the ads, which feature Jasmine Messiah, a vegetarian who attends a Miami-Dade County public school that, she says, offers no vegetarian or vegan lunch options.

Discuss.

(Note that the poster does not show Sasha or Malia’s image, or mention them by name.)

11 MandyManners  Tue, Aug 11, 2009 12:12:11pm

Oops. Ignore that “s”.

12 quiet man  Tue, Aug 11, 2009 12:12:13pm

That reminds me that we have heard nothing about that gunman Abdulhakim Mujahid Muhammad who shot two soldiers in AR.

That has to be part of a conspiracy…

13 CIA Reject  Tue, Aug 11, 2009 12:12:16pm

Remember:

The complete lack of evidence is PROOF POSITIVE that the conspiracy is working!

/

14 tradewind  Tue, Aug 11, 2009 12:12:50pm

I’m still waiting to find out what really happened to that Mysterious Iraqi who met with Timothy McVeigh.

15 Occasional Reader  Tue, Aug 11, 2009 12:12:56pm

re: #6 buzzsawmonkey

The question is, how many nut jobs have been created or saved?

Sorry, those jobs were all outsourced to lower-cost providers. They are now Brazil nuts.

16 quiet man  Tue, Aug 11, 2009 12:13:07pm

re: #6 buzzsawmonkey

Obama has a different answer to that

17 Wendya  Tue, Aug 11, 2009 12:13:13pm

re: #10 Occasional Reader

Apologies for the early OT, but the previous thread has gotten so kludgy that I’m running from it in horror.

White House Objects to Poster That Invokes Obama Children

Discuss.

PCRM is a vile organization.

18 [deleted]  Tue, Aug 11, 2009 12:13:21pm
19 wrenchwench  Tue, Aug 11, 2009 12:13:39pm

re: #7 MJ

Well, there isn’t much information in that article. He had visits from other extremists according to the article but that seems to be a mighty slim thread to hang a conspiracy from. Besides, you would think that anyone who would have been involved in a conspiracy would not risk visiting him in jail…

That type is not known for their brains.

20 MandyManners  Tue, Aug 11, 2009 12:14:09pm

re: #7 MJ

Well, there isn’t much information in that article. He had visits from other extremists according to the article but that seems to be a mighty slim thread to hang a conspiracy from. Besides, you would think that anyone who would have been involved in a conspiracy would not risk visiting him in jail…

Sometimes people who think that they are not bound by law are brazen.

21 [deleted]  Tue, Aug 11, 2009 12:14:12pm
22 Charles Johnson  Tue, Aug 11, 2009 12:14:35pm

re: #7 MJ

Well, there isn’t much information in that article. He had visits from other extremists according to the article but that seems to be a mighty slim thread to hang a conspiracy from. Besides, you would think that anyone who would have been involved in a conspiracy would not risk visiting him in jail…

There’s more evidence than that; see my earlier posts about this. He was pretty closely connected with Operation Rescue.

23 quiet man  Tue, Aug 11, 2009 12:14:37pm

re: #18 buzzsawmonkey

Don’t make us open a can of nuts on your punk ass…

/SEIU

24 CIA Reject  Tue, Aug 11, 2009 12:14:39pm

re: #15 Occasional Reader

Sorry, those jobs were all outsourced to lower-cost providers. They are now Brazil nuts.

They wanted to give the contract to a bunch of Macadamia nuts but the State of Hawaii wouldn’t release their birth certificates…

25 Occasional Reader  Tue, Aug 11, 2009 12:14:54pm

re: #17 Wendya

PCRM is a vile organization.

I’m not familiar with them.

I was somewhat amused by the fact that they seem to be pushing a latte liberal agenda, and yet have still earned the ire of the White House.

26 Occasional Reader  Tue, Aug 11, 2009 12:15:39pm

re: #21 buzzsawmonkey

Anyone going by the name “Jasmine Messiah” starts with two strikes against her in the credibility/sanity department.

An unfortunate name, but give the kid a break: She’s 8 years old.

27 CIA Reject  Tue, Aug 11, 2009 12:16:01pm

BBL

28 [deleted]  Tue, Aug 11, 2009 12:16:22pm
29 tradewind  Tue, Aug 11, 2009 12:16:24pm

If Justice thinks they have any link to Operation Rescue in this, they should just file a RICO investigation.

30 quiet man  Tue, Aug 11, 2009 12:16:31pm

re: #24 CIA Reject
Cant you buy some at Walnuts??

31 opnion  Tue, Aug 11, 2009 12:16:37pm

re: #1 Cato the Elder

There are no right-wing conspiracies.

There really can’t be , right wingers are too stupid to even hatch a conspiracy, right?

32 MJ  Tue, Aug 11, 2009 12:17:01pm

It seems more probable that folks like Scott Roeder would be influenced by the KKK’s Louis Beam concept of “Leaderless resistance”:

Leaderless resistance (or phantom cell structure) is a political resistance strategy in which small, independent groups (covert cells) challenge an established adversary such as a government.

[Link: en.wikipedia.org…]

33 quiet man  Tue, Aug 11, 2009 12:17:07pm

re: #30 quiet man
He goes out to pinenut about things..

34 doppelganglander  Tue, Aug 11, 2009 12:17:30pm

re: #10 Occasional Reader

Apologies for the early OT, but the previous thread has gotten so kludgy that I’m running from it in horror.

White House Objects to Poster That Invokes Obama Children

Discuss.

(Note that the poster does not show Sasha or Malia’s image, or mention them by name.)

I don’t think it’s right to invoke the president’s children, even if not by name or image, to promote an agenda. I also think Jasmine Messiah should learn how to pack her lunch if she doesn’t like the selection, just as generations of children have always done.

35 MandyManners  Tue, Aug 11, 2009 12:17:30pm

re: #25 Occasional Reader

I’m not familiar with them.

I was somewhat amused by the fact that they seem to be pushing a latte liberal agenda, and yet have still earned the ire of the White House.

[Link: www.pcrm.org…]

36 Occasional Reader  Tue, Aug 11, 2009 12:17:30pm

re: #28 buzzsawmonkey

We got a latte liberal livin’
To do…

Not I. I’m livin’ la vida mocha.

37 Cannadian Club Akbar  Tue, Aug 11, 2009 12:17:35pm

If there are others, I doubt they will tun on Roeder.

38 [deleted]  Tue, Aug 11, 2009 12:17:42pm
39 fat bastard vegetarian  Tue, Aug 11, 2009 12:17:44pm

re: #1 Cato the Elder

Of course there are.

40 Charles Johnson  Tue, Aug 11, 2009 12:17:55pm

re: #5 Kragar (Proud to be Kafir)

How long before the groups start saying he never did it but it would be justified if he did?

They did that within minutes of the murder being reported. The more extreme anti-abortion groups had a very hard time suppressing their glee over the killing.

41 Ward Cleaver  Tue, Aug 11, 2009 12:18:03pm

re: #10 Occasional Reader

Apologies for the early OT, but the previous thread has gotten so kludgy that I’m running from it in horror.

White House Objects to Poster That Invokes Obama Children

Discuss.

(Note that the poster does not show Sasha or Malia’s image, or mention them by name.)

And, irony of ironies, the little girl on the poster has the last name “Messiah”.

42 Cannadian Club Akbar  Tue, Aug 11, 2009 12:18:15pm

re: #37 Cannadian Club Akbar

tun=turn, PIMF

43 MandyManners  Tue, Aug 11, 2009 12:18:25pm

re: #29 tradewind

If Justice thinks they have any link to Operation Rescue in this, they should just file a RICO investigation.

For all we know, there is an on-going investigation right now.

44 Walter L. Newton  Tue, Aug 11, 2009 12:18:48pm

Now, pay close attention. Roeder is an actual, far right wing terrorist, and his actions have nothing to do with freedom of speech, his freedom to practice his religion of choice or his right to protest.

Here is the point where progressives want will find agreement with the majority of conservatives on what is extreme versus what is true public protest, as in the protest at the town hall health care meeting.

This is the true an actual face of right wing extremism, not someone shouting down a thinned skinned, out of touch Democratic politician.

45 doppelganglander  Tue, Aug 11, 2009 12:18:53pm

And to return to the topic, I think Roeder isn’t smart enough to have pulled this off without a lot of help.

46 tradewind  Tue, Aug 11, 2009 12:18:56pm

re: #38 buzzsawmonkey

A pox on these parents who saddle their helpless infants with names that will subject them to ridicule and profiling for life, or until they change ‘em.

47 Ojoe  Tue, Aug 11, 2009 12:19:08pm

…One would think…

48 quiet man  Tue, Aug 11, 2009 12:19:17pm

re: #41 Ward Cleaver
What did David Letterman say about those awful posters??

49 [deleted]  Tue, Aug 11, 2009 12:19:40pm
50 Occasional Reader  Tue, Aug 11, 2009 12:19:53pm

re: #34 doppelganglander

I don’t think it’s right to invoke the president’s children… to promote an agenda.

That’s my default position, too, but this to me is a closer call because of the lack of name or image.

And whether it’s the right thing to do, and whether the White House is correct in trying to browbeat them into taking the posters down, are of course two different issues.

51 Kragar  Tue, Aug 11, 2009 12:20:28pm

Back to hitting the books, later Lizards

52 fat bastard vegetarian  Tue, Aug 11, 2009 12:20:53pm

At what time in a nut-job huddle does one person look up and say…

“Are you nucking futs? That is murder, you corksocker! I’ll have no part in it!”

53 Oh no...Sand People!  Tue, Aug 11, 2009 12:20:55pm

re: #45 doppelganglander

And to return to the topic, I think Roeder isn’t smart enough to have pulled this off without a lot of help.

I don’t think he needed as much help as he just needed encouragement / validation…

“It’ll be ok, right?”
“Sure..sure..yeah, the abortion doc has it coming…God said so in his ‘word’…”
“Ok, george, I can do it!”
/

54 MandyManners  Tue, Aug 11, 2009 12:21:05pm

re: #51 Kragar (Proud to be Kafir)

Back to hitting the books, later Lizards

It helps if you read them, too.

55 Jetpilot1101  Tue, Aug 11, 2009 12:21:39pm

re: #52 fat bastard vegetarian

At what time in a nut-job huddle does one person look up and say…

Apparently never if you use the Palestinians as an example.

56 opnion  Tue, Aug 11, 2009 12:21:40pm

re: #49 buzzsawmonkey

There’s an ugly similarity between that and the Holocaust denier/neo-Nazi groups who say Hitler didn’t kill the Jews, but he should have done a better job.

Lots of Imams say that. The Holocaust is a lie & in the next breath praise Hitler for doing it.

57 [deleted]  Tue, Aug 11, 2009 12:21:50pm
58 MandyManners  Tue, Aug 11, 2009 12:22:04pm

re: #45 doppelganglander

And to return to the topic, I think Roeder isn’t smart enough to have pulled this off without a lot of help.

How smart must one be to find the target and pull the trigger?

59 Cygnus  Tue, Aug 11, 2009 12:22:09pm

re: #15 Occasional Reader

Sorry, those jobs were all outsourced to lower-cost providers. They are now Brazil nuts.

Or they could create more jobs in Hawaii. Then they would be macadamia nuts.

60 quiet man  Tue, Aug 11, 2009 12:22:10pm

I am glad Roeder is in jail…and those in it with him will be caught and punished when they, too, break the law. It doesnt matter what his reasons were no more than it matters against any other group ordered murder.

61 NukeAtomrod  Tue, Aug 11, 2009 12:22:19pm
Was Scott Roeder Part of a Conspiracy?

I don’t know, but I doubt it. You don’t need a conspiracy for one guy to shoot another unarmed guy in a church. Scott Roeder alone was adequate manpower to commit the crime. What role would the conspirators have? Buying the bullets? Giving him a ride to the church? If he was a part of a group that encouraged his crime, wouldn’t they want to take credit once he achieved their goal?

62 Charles Johnson  Tue, Aug 11, 2009 12:22:41pm

re: #56 opnion

Lots of Imams say that. The Holocaust is a lie & in the next breath praise Hitler for doing it.

Right, and so do extreme anti-abortion groups.

63 Kragar  Tue, Aug 11, 2009 12:22:50pm

re: #54 MandyManners

It helps if you read them, too.

Did that, now I’m taking out my frustration on it.

64 MikeAlv77  Tue, Aug 11, 2009 12:23:14pm

re: #61 NukeAtomrod

I don’t know, but I doubt it. You don’t need a conspiracy for one guy to shoot another unarmed guy in a church. Scott Roeder alone was adequate manpower to commit the crime. What role would the conspirators have? Buying the bullets? Giving him a ride to the church? If he was a part of a group that encouraged his crime, wouldn’t they want to take credit once he achieved their goal?

Not if they wanted to stay free to encourge others to do it…

65 Occasional Reader  Tue, Aug 11, 2009 12:23:18pm

re: #46 tradewind

A pox on these parents who saddle their helpless infants with names that will subject them to ridicule and profiling for life, or until they change ‘em.

What, you think I’m wrong in my plan to name my firstborn son so as to honor the memory of Gaylord Perry?

/

66 sattv4u2  Tue, Aug 11, 2009 12:23:31pm

re: #40 Charles

They did that within minutes of the murder being reported. The more extreme anti-abortion groups had a very hard time suppressing their glee over the killing.

Wh should they surpress it? It’s was their nirvana, their holy grail. And they can also include deniability at the same time

“We didn’t condone that,,,(nudge nudge,, wink wink,,, He was a lone gunman”

SPIT!

67 quiet man  Tue, Aug 11, 2009 12:23:41pm

re: #61 NukeAtomrod
Maybe they are playing their “roles” right now

68 zombie  Tue, Aug 11, 2009 12:23:47pm

I really really don’t like tonsillectomies. I think I’m gonna go shoot me up some tonsillectomy surgeons!

69 MandyManners  Tue, Aug 11, 2009 12:23:48pm

re: #63 Kragar (Proud to be Kafir)

Did that, now I’m taking out my frustration on it.

Linus useta’ sleep with books beneath his pillow.

70 Dianna  Tue, Aug 11, 2009 12:23:52pm

re: #5 Kragar (Proud to be Kafir)

How long before the groups start saying he never did it but it would be justified if he did?

Hasn’t that already been said? Haven’t we all had to condemn that sort of statement, even made in veiled terms?

71 Cygnus  Tue, Aug 11, 2009 12:23:57pm

re: #36 Occasional Reader

Not I. I’m livin’ la vida mocha.

La vida vino!

72 Occasional Reader  Tue, Aug 11, 2009 12:24:01pm

re: #51 Kragar (Proud to be Kafir)

Back to hitting the books, later Lizards

See, that’s one disadvantage to the Kindle, right there. If you hit it, it’ll break, and you’re out three hunnert clams.

73 NukeAtomrod  Tue, Aug 11, 2009 12:24:35pm

re: #17 Wendya

PCRM is a vile organization.

They are the same people as PETA.

74 quiet man  Tue, Aug 11, 2009 12:24:38pm

re: #66 sattv4u2

re: #40 Charles


Wh should they surpress it? It’s was their nirvana, their holy grail. And they can also include deniability at the same time

“We didn’t condone that,,,(nudge nudge,, wink wink,,, He was a lone gunman”

SPIT!


Sounds like Saddam and 9-11

/laugh

75 doppelganglander  Tue, Aug 11, 2009 12:25:03pm

re: #50 Occasional Reader

That’s my default position, too, but this to me is a closer call because of the lack of name or image.

And whether it’s the right thing to do, and whether the White House is correct in trying to browbeat them into taking the posters down, are of course two different issues.

It also calls to mind the situation a few months ago when he cut off funding that allowed many D.C. schoolchildren to attend private schools, including the school his daughters go to. A lot of people (including me, on Facebook) wondered how he could so callously destroy the hopes of those children, while his own privileged kids got the finest education money can buy. I feel it’s okay to make the comparison in a discussion, blog post, or article, but I don’t think it would be ok to put it on posters all over town. Nevertheless, the White House is going overboard in harassing a very small organization.

76 Oh no...Sand People!  Tue, Aug 11, 2009 12:25:16pm

re: #68 zombie

I really really don’t like tonsillectomies. I think I’m gonna go shoot me up some tonsillectomy surgeons!

Obama agrees with you. Profit whores…

/

77 Occasional Reader  Tue, Aug 11, 2009 12:25:19pm

re: #71 Cygnus

La vida vino!

… se quedó un rato, y se fué.

78 quiet man  Tue, Aug 11, 2009 12:25:22pm

re: #68 zombie
You should..since they are the type of doctors who will do it just for the cash money!!

79 zombie  Tue, Aug 11, 2009 12:25:27pm

And fake boobs! Immoral. I’m locking and loading as a I prepare to take out some of them Hollywood plastic surgeons. it’s justified because fake boobs just aren’t human!

80 quiet man  Tue, Aug 11, 2009 12:25:55pm

re: #76 Oh no…Sand People!

re: #68 zombie


Obama agrees with you. Profit whores…

Beat me to the joke..damn the sand!
/

81 Cannadian Club Akbar  Tue, Aug 11, 2009 12:26:07pm

re: #79 zombie

And fake boobs! Immoral. I’m locking and loading as a I prepare to take out some of them Hollywood plastic surgeons. it’s justified because fake boobs just aren’t human!

DON’T YOU DARE!!

82 MJ  Tue, Aug 11, 2009 12:26:17pm

re: #53 Oh no…Sand People!

I don’t think he needed as much help as he just needed encouragement / validation…

“It’ll be ok, right?”
“Sure..sure..yeah, the abortion doc has it coming…God said so in his ‘word’…”
“Ok, george, I can do it!”
/

He got lot’s of encouragement from Bill O’Reilly: “Tiller the baby Killer”.

83 MandyManners  Tue, Aug 11, 2009 12:26:38pm

A boob thread on a Wednesday?

84 quiet man  Tue, Aug 11, 2009 12:26:42pm

re: #79 zombie
You will need a higher calibre for them..plastic slows brass..or so I have heard

85 Oh no...Sand People!  Tue, Aug 11, 2009 12:26:53pm

re: #79 zombie

And fake boobs! Immoral. I’m locking and loading as a I prepare to take out some of them Hollywood plastic surgeons. it’s justified because fake boobs just aren’t human!

Well, if you can get through me first…

86 Walter L. Newton  Tue, Aug 11, 2009 12:27:00pm

I’ll be back in a bit, I am going to peruse the Obama meeting thread, which I missed since I was out having a heart transplant. I can’t afford health insurance and the to vet was having a special for dogs and cats. He made an exception in my case.

87 MikeAlv77  Tue, Aug 11, 2009 12:27:09pm

re: #81 Cannadian Club Akbar

DON’T YOU DARE!!

I feel the same way when my wife points out…

Her - “Those are fake…”

Me - “And your point is?…”

88 Land Shark  Tue, Aug 11, 2009 12:27:34pm

If others conspired with Roeder I hope they are found and prosecuted. While I’m very strongly opposed to abortion, murder and terrorism are unacceptable ways of dealing with it. Given the fact we’ve had anti-abortionists in the past involved in this kind of crime, I would not be surprised if he did have some co-conspirators. The question is, can it be proven? Time will tell.

89 [deleted]  Tue, Aug 11, 2009 12:27:45pm
90 Cygnus  Tue, Aug 11, 2009 12:27:46pm

re: #83 MandyManners

A boob thread on a Wednesday?

With the current administration in Washington DC, every day is a boob day.

91 quiet man  Tue, Aug 11, 2009 12:27:53pm

re: #82 MJ

re: #53 Oh no…Sand People!


He got lot’s of encouragement from Bill O’Reilly: “Tiller the baby Killer”.


Thats not encouragement..if it were then our congress and senate is in real danger..

92 Kosh's Shadow  Tue, Aug 11, 2009 12:28:12pm

OT, but this is over 100 posts, and we’ve discussed Holocaust deniers so
UN Congratulates Ahmadinejad Over Disputed Win
United Nations Secretary-General Ban Ki-Moon has congratulated Iranian President Mahmoud Ahmadinejad on his reelection. Ahmadinejad’s victory was highly controversial, and sparked weeks of bloody protests and accusations that Iran’s ruling elite had rigged the vote.

Many world leaders refrained from congratulating Ahmadinejad due to the allegations of voting fraud surrounding his victory and the severe violence with which protests by the opposition were repressed, as well as his refusal to negotiate over Iran’s nuclear program. Ahmadinejad has also upset world leaders by supporting Middle East terrorism, particularly in Iraq and Gaza, and by denying the Holocaust and threatening to destroy Israel.

A UN spokesperson confirmed that Ban had sent a letter of congratulations to Ahmadinejad. The contents of the letter will not be made public.
Let’s see, a letter to Ahmadmanonjihad from the UN.
Think it says “Congratulations on your win; now show those pesky jooos a thing or two. Waiting for you to implement the final solution for mid-east peace.”

93 Spider Mensch  Tue, Aug 11, 2009 12:28:13pm

re: #79 zombie

And fake boobs! Immoral. I’m locking and loading as a I prepare to take out some of them Hollywood plastic surgeons. it’s justified because fake boobs just aren’t human!

and in related news to the above..Playboy stock today reached penny value…

94 tradewind  Tue, Aug 11, 2009 12:28:21pm

re: #43 MandyManners

If they file it, we’ll know. They’re public records and searchable.

95 NukeAtomrod  Tue, Aug 11, 2009 12:28:37pm

re: #10 Occasional Reader

Apologies for the early OT, but the previous thread has gotten so kludgy that I’m running from it in horror.

White House Objects to Poster That Invokes Obama Children

Discuss.

(Note that the poster does not show Sasha or Malia’s image, or mention them by name.)

President Obama’s daughters get healthy school lunches. Why don’t I?

Because they go to private school. Obama thinks public school is just fine for your kids, though. Including the lunches. So just STFU, okay? - Statement from the White house.

96 Oh no...Sand People!  Tue, Aug 11, 2009 12:28:55pm

re: #89 buzzsawmonkey

Worse, the cleavage one gets with fake breasts are silly cone valleys.

Best slopes this side of the Mississippi.

97 Occasional Reader  Tue, Aug 11, 2009 12:28:57pm

re: #75 doppelganglander

I may be wrong, but I think Obama has refrained from invoking his daughters (much, at least) in the name of plumping his agenda. So in that sense, he hasn’t “opened the door”. I would certainly strongly object to any publicity campaign that used his daughters’ names and/or images in a way that was insulting. But that’s not the case here.

(In this vein, I recall one of Rush Limbaugh’s lowest moments, when he referred to Chelsea Clinton as a “dog in the White House” when she was all of, what, 12 years old, I believe. Truly ignoble.)

98 MandyManners  Tue, Aug 11, 2009 12:29:08pm

re: #83 MandyManners

A boob thread on a Wednesday?

Tuesday.

99 BlueCanuck  Tue, Aug 11, 2009 12:29:12pm

re: #87 MikeAlv77

I feel the same way when my wife points out…

Her - “Those are fake…”

Me - “And your point is?…”

The difference between fake boobs and real ones? You can touch real ones.

/guy approach to things…

100 jill e  Tue, Aug 11, 2009 12:29:16pm

re: #83 MandyManners

A boob thread on a Wednesday?

Isn’t today Tuesday? If it’s Wednesday, I missed my dentist appointment.

101 Cygnus  Tue, Aug 11, 2009 12:29:21pm

re: #96 Oh no…Sand People!

Best slopes this side of the Mississippi.

Black diamond runs?

102 Mad Al-Jaffee  Tue, Aug 11, 2009 12:29:39pm

re: #38 buzzsawmonkey

Sorry—misread the insert; I thought it was an assumed-name spokesperson like Medea Benjamin.

Or a joke, like “Sillius Soddus” or…”Biggus Dickus.”

103 NukeAtomrod  Tue, Aug 11, 2009 12:29:49pm

re: #64 MikeAlv77

Not if they wanted to stay free to encourge others to do it…

You don’t think like a fanatic. (That is a compliment.)

104 MandyManners  Tue, Aug 11, 2009 12:30:03pm

re: #90 Cygnus

With the current administration in Washington DC, every day is a boob day.

I don’t think FCBBHO is a boob. He knows what he’s doing.

105 jill e  Tue, Aug 11, 2009 12:30:16pm

re: #98 MandyManners

Tuesday.

Whew! Off to see Dr. “Is it safe?” Jansen!

106 Cannadian Club Akbar  Tue, Aug 11, 2009 12:30:20pm

re: #99 BlueCanuck

The difference between fake boobs and real ones? You can touch real ones.

/guy approach to things…

But, girls with fake ones will show ‘em to ya for approval.

107 quiet man  Tue, Aug 11, 2009 12:30:23pm

re: #92 Kosh’s Shadow
The UN klissing Iranian ass?? Like this is news??

The Mullahs are safe now..from the UN and from the US…and they know it..the world doesnt care about a few fools in the street and it never, ever will.

108 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Tue, Aug 11, 2009 12:30:28pm

re: #86 Walter L. Newton

You could’ve gotten one from a red male deer. That way you’d have a Hart Heart.

109 MandyManners  Tue, Aug 11, 2009 12:30:43pm

re: #94 tradewind

If they file it, we’ll know. They’re public records and searchable.

Must the feds alert the target of an investigation?

110 quiet man  Tue, Aug 11, 2009 12:31:11pm

re: #106 Cannadian Club Akbar

They also look best riding on the front of a boat

check out the prow on that steamer!!

111 Oh no...Sand People!  Tue, Aug 11, 2009 12:31:15pm

re: #106 Cannadian Club Akbar

But, girls with fake ones will show ‘em to ya for approval.

Nature man will find a way…

112 MJ  Tue, Aug 11, 2009 12:31:20pm

re: #91 quiet man

Thats not encouragement..if it were then our congress and senate is in real danger..

The deliberate de-humanizing of individuals and peoples has proven to be an effective motivation for murder.

113 MandyManners  Tue, Aug 11, 2009 12:31:40pm

re: #100 jill e

Isn’t today Tuesday? If it’s Wednesday, I missed my dentist appointment.

You’re okay.

114 zombie  Tue, Aug 11, 2009 12:32:04pm

re: #108 Fat Bastard Vegetarian

You could’ve gotten one from a red male deer. That way you’d have a Hart Heart.

The surgeons during the operation coordinate things with a hart-heart-to-heart talk.

115 MandyManners  Tue, Aug 11, 2009 12:32:17pm

re: #105 jill e

Whew! Off to see Dr. “Is it safe?” Jansen!

Open wide!

116 jill e  Tue, Aug 11, 2009 12:32:25pm

re: #113 MandyManners

You’re okay.

You don’t know my dentist!

117 Kosh's Shadow  Tue, Aug 11, 2009 12:32:25pm

re: #102 Mad Al-Jaffee

Or a joke, like “Sillius Soddus” or…”Biggus Dickus.”

I have a vewy good fwiend in Wome called Biggus Dickus
/Pontius Piwate.

118 Cato the Elder  Tue, Aug 11, 2009 12:32:25pm

Are you having trouble recognizing sarcasm today, Dianna?

119 Racer X  Tue, Aug 11, 2009 12:32:27pm

re: #106 Cannadian Club Akbar

But, girls with fake ones will show ‘em to ya for approval.

I’ve had strangers ask me to give theirs a squeeze and tell them what I think. I’m a kind hearted soul so I obliged.

120 MikeAlv77  Tue, Aug 11, 2009 12:32:38pm

re: #112 MJ

The deliberate de-humanizing of individuals and peoples has proven to be an effective motivation for murder.

And genocide.

( I really have to stop reading bokks on the Holocuast and Japanese war crimes… where did I put that Calvin and Hobbes…?)

121 MandyManners  Tue, Aug 11, 2009 12:32:56pm

re: #116 jill e

You don’t know my dentist!

Bite ‘im.

122 Kosh's Shadow  Tue, Aug 11, 2009 12:33:00pm

re: #110 quiet man

They also look best riding on the front of a boat

check out the prow on that steamer!!

Well, let’s climb aboard her!
I’m first
I’m second, mate.

123 sattv4u2  Tue, Aug 11, 2009 12:33:05pm

re: #117 Kosh’s Shadow

I have a vewy good fwiend in Wome called Biggus Dickus
/Pontius Piwate Bwaney Fwank.

ftfy

124 quiet man  Tue, Aug 11, 2009 12:33:28pm

re: #112 MJ
So true..But how far do you go in that thinking??

I think the threshhold needs to be far higher than Oreillys words here

125 tradewind  Tue, Aug 11, 2009 12:33:38pm

re: #65 Occasional Reader

That doesn’t sound so off the wall to me, so no.
I’m thinking more locally, where there are female children named Listeria and Ecstasia, and little boys named Ja’Quester and DeNormal.
Those are not jokes, btw.
The kids are going to want to shed them as soon as they hit school, or if not then, when they fill out their first job application.

126 quiet man  Tue, Aug 11, 2009 12:34:11pm

re: #122 Kosh’s Shadow
Get in this barrel…

/laugh

127 Racer X  Tue, Aug 11, 2009 12:34:20pm

re: #118 Cato the Elder

Heh, I interpret all your posts as sarcasm.

;-)

128 Occasional Reader  Tue, Aug 11, 2009 12:34:28pm

These boob threads are highly offensive.

They’re a veritable Tit Offensive.

QUAGMIRE! THE WAR IS LOST!

129 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Tue, Aug 11, 2009 12:34:32pm

As I said, on that sad morning.

Bill O’Reilly? I am not blaming you. But words mean things.

Randall Terry? I am not saying that I do not blame you, words mean things.

130 Land Shark  Tue, Aug 11, 2009 12:34:33pm

re: #87 MikeAlv77

I feel the same way when my wife points out…

Her - “Those are fake…”

Me - “And your point is?…”

Exactly. We don’t care how they got that way, we’re just glad they did. Judgemental we’re not. ;-)

131 doppelganglander  Tue, Aug 11, 2009 12:35:09pm

re: #97 Occasional Reader

I may be wrong, but I think Obama has refrained from invoking his daughters (much, at least) in the name of plumping his agenda. So in that sense, he hasn’t “opened the door”. I would certainly strongly object to any publicity campaign that used his daughters’ names and/or images in a way that was insulting. But that’s not the case here.

(In this vein, I recall one of Rush Limbaugh’s lowest moments, when he referred to Chelsea Clinton as a “dog in the White House” when she was all of, what, 12 years old, I believe. Truly ignoble.)

Agreed, what Rush did to Chelsea was incredibly stupid and tacky. And no, I don’t think Obama has used his kids other than for the same wholesome photo ops that all politicians do. The one thing I’ll give the Obamas is that they seem to be good parents. I don’t think you’ll ever see one of those girls pull an Andrew Giuliani-style tantrum in public.

132 Mad Al-Jaffee  Tue, Aug 11, 2009 12:35:12pm

re: #125 tradewind

When my mother was an elementary school teacher, she once had a student named Norelco.

133 sattv4u2  Tue, Aug 11, 2009 12:35:28pm

OT

In about 12 minutes, I get to see something either fairly boring, or REAL exciting

Theres a new communications satellite being launched from the Baikonur Cosmodrome in Kazakhstan. We’re broadcasting it to the US and Europe

134 Oh no...Sand People!  Tue, Aug 11, 2009 12:35:47pm

re: #128 Occasional Reader

These boob threads are highly offensive.

They’re a veritable Tit Offensive.

QUAGMIRE! THE WAR IS LOST!

If that’s a ‘loss’ I surely don’t want to ‘win’.

135 quiet man  Tue, Aug 11, 2009 12:36:14pm

re: #133 sattv4u2
wow…lucky nut

136 MikeAlv77  Tue, Aug 11, 2009 12:36:22pm

re: #132 Mad Al-Jaffee

When my mother was an elementary school teacher, she once had a student named Norelco.

2 Best my wife saw in the hospital she worked at…

Placenta

Fe’Male - pronounced fe- Mal - e

137 Honorary Yooper  Tue, Aug 11, 2009 12:36:22pm

re: #83 MandyManners

A boob thread on a Wednesday?

Did we miss Tuesday somehow? Or did an entire day go by when I was in the last thread?

138 doppelganglander  Tue, Aug 11, 2009 12:36:26pm

re: #125 tradewind

That doesn’t sound so off the wall to me, so no.
I’m thinking more locally, where there are female children named Listeria and Ecstasia, and little boys named Ja’Quester and DeNormal.
Those are not jokes, btw.
The kids are going to want to shed them as soon as they hit school, or if not then, when they fill out their first job application.

I’m fascinated by odd names. Those are just…something.

139 NukeAtomrod  Tue, Aug 11, 2009 12:36:32pm

re: #67 quiet man

Maybe they are playing their “roles” right now

That’s a possibility. Like I said, I don’t know. I’m all for the FBI looking it to it. I think Vegas would give you good odds against the existence of a conspiracy, though.

140 Oh no...Sand People!  Tue, Aug 11, 2009 12:36:51pm

re: #131 doppelganglander

Agreed, what Rush did to Chelsea was incredibly stupid and tacky. And no, I don’t think Obama has used his kids other than for the same wholesome photo ops that all politicians do. The one thing I’ll give the Obamas is that they seem to be good parents. I don’t think you’ll ever see one of those girls pull an Andrew Giuliani-style tantrum in public.

I am glad Palin has been given the same respect.
/

141 Oh no...Sand People!  Tue, Aug 11, 2009 12:37:18pm

re: #138 doppelganglander

I’m fascinated by odd names. Those are just…something.

Thanks.

/hehehe

142 MandyManners  Tue, Aug 11, 2009 12:37:58pm

re: #133 sattv4u2

OT

In about 12 minutes, I get to see something either fairly boring, or REAL exciting

Theres a new communications satellite being launched from the Baikonur Cosmodrome in Kazakhstan. We’re broadcasting it to the US and Europe

Link to the footage?

143 quiet man  Tue, Aug 11, 2009 12:38:14pm

re: #139 NukeAtomrod

I bet there was a consensus or an agreement or a knowledge shared between like minded imbeciles at a BBQ somewhere and someone decided to “do it”

144 Kosh's Shadow  Tue, Aug 11, 2009 12:38:36pm

re: #126 quiet man

Get in this barrel…

/laugh

Come, have a pint of ale with Stinking Olaf
Well, I would fancy an ale.
One fancy ale coming up (barf)
He forgot the glass. Come, I can teach you a new disease I picked up in the Navy.

145 MandyManners  Tue, Aug 11, 2009 12:38:38pm

re: #137 Honorary Yooper

Did we miss Tuesday somehow? Or did an entire day go by when I was in the last thread?

You’re safe.

146 Occasional Reader  Tue, Aug 11, 2009 12:38:44pm

re: #133 sattv4u2

OT

In about 12 minutes, I get to see something either fairly boring, or REAL exciting

Theres a new communications satellite being launched from the Baikonur Cosmodrome in Kazakhstan. We’re broadcasting it to the US and Europe

Just remember:

Kazakhstan industry best in world.
We invented toffee and trouser belt.
Kazakhstan’s prostitutes cleanest in the region.
Except of course for Turkmenistan’s.

147 Oh no...Sand People!  Tue, Aug 11, 2009 12:38:58pm

re: #125 tradewind

That doesn’t sound so off the wall to me, so no.
I’m thinking more locally, where there are female children named Listeria and Ecstasia, and little boys named Ja’Quester and DeNormal.
Those are not jokes, btw.
The kids are going to want to shed them as soon as they hit school, or if not then, when they fill out their first job application.

My friend lived in Georgia for 2 years and he met a family with a set of twins.. Lemonjello and Oranjello. I wish I was lying…

148 Cato the Elder  Tue, Aug 11, 2009 12:39:16pm

re: #141 Oh no…Sand People!

Thanks.

/hehehe

My mother knew a woman who named her daughter “Vendetta”.

Another had a girl called “Fallopia”.

No joke.

149 MJ  Tue, Aug 11, 2009 12:39:27pm

re: #124 quiet man

So true..But how far do you go in that thinking??

I think the threshhold needs to be far higher than Oreillys words here

That’s a serious question which I cannot answer. O’Reilly, by calling Dr. Tiller a “baby killer” certainly dehumanized him. However, O’Reilly did not say, “go out and kill Dr. Tiller”.

150 Slumbering Behemoth Stinks  Tue, Aug 11, 2009 12:39:35pm

re: #89 buzzsawmonkey

Buzz, ya still here? I spotted this the other day, and immediately thought of you, and the way you caution people about revealing too much personal info on the web.

If you absolutely, positively, must have a Facebook/MySpace page, please have the common sense not to add your boss as a “Friend”.

151 quiet man  Tue, Aug 11, 2009 12:39:42pm

re: #140 Oh no…Sand People!

Palins kid got hit again on Comedy central joan rivers roast…
That as sunday..not 20 years ago either..

152 Mad Al-Jaffee  Tue, Aug 11, 2009 12:40:03pm

re: #136 MikeAlv77

2 Best my wife saw in the hospital she worked at…

Placenta

Fe’Male - pronounced fe- Mal - e

I’ve heard of those too, but I always thought they were urban legends.

153 Oh no...Sand People!  Tue, Aug 11, 2009 12:40:36pm

re: #151 quiet man

Palins kid got hit again on Comedy central joan rivers roast…
That as sunday..not 20 years ago either..

Completely disgusting and depraved…

154 zombie  Tue, Aug 11, 2009 12:40:56pm

re: #125 tradewind

That doesn’t sound so off the wall to me, so no.
I’m thinking more locally, where there are female children named Listeria and Ecstasia, and little boys named Ja’Quester and DeNormal.
Those are not jokes, btw.

A couple years ago I talked with a mother who had named her son D’Metrious. I asked her, in all honest curiousity, how she came up with the name. She said she hadn’t come up with it, that it was just a normal name — y’know, D’Metrious.

Turns out she wanted the name “Demetrius” and thought it was spelled “D’Metrious” because she had just sounded it out phonetically — or what she thought was phonoetically. Even after our conversation, she still insisted that D’Metrious was the correct normal spelling of the name.

Too late for the kid, in any event.

155 MikeAlv77  Tue, Aug 11, 2009 12:41:06pm

re: #152 Mad Al-Jaffee

I’ve heard of those too, but I always thought they were urban legends.

No urban legend. She saw the girls and heard the mother call them by the names. First name the mother learned in birth class - liked how it sounded it…

156 MrPaulRevere  Tue, Aug 11, 2009 12:41:53pm

re: #149 MJ

“However, O’Reilly did not say, “go out and kill Dr. Tiller”“. He didn’t have to.

157 doppelganglander  Tue, Aug 11, 2009 12:42:03pm

re: #148 Cato the Elder

My mother knew a woman who named her daughter “Vendetta”.

Another had a girl called “Fallopia”.

No joke.

Last year there was a rejected contestant on “American Idol” (I know, I know) named Temptress.

158 quiet man  Tue, Aug 11, 2009 12:42:08pm

re: #149 MJ
I think if you go after Oreilly for those words, you ignore daily speech of our elected officials, especially when the Iraq war was at full swing.

If someone is shot by an idiot because Nancy Pelosi suggested he among thousands was a nazi..is it her fault for dehumanizing him or his fault for being a whack.

159 Racer X  Tue, Aug 11, 2009 12:43:19pm

re: #150 Slumbering Behemoth

ROFLMAO!

160 kansas  Tue, Aug 11, 2009 12:43:31pm

Knowing people in law enforcement here, some that worked on some pretty evil cases, if there was a conspiracy, which looks likely, they’ll find out.

161 quiet man  Tue, Aug 11, 2009 12:43:47pm

re: #156 MrPaulRevere

re: #149 MJ

“However, O’Reilly did not say, “go out and kill Dr. Tiller”“. He didn’t have to.

right…He didnt say it because that wasnt his point nor his goal.

162 sattv4u2  Tue, Aug 11, 2009 12:44:51pm

re: #142 MandyManners

Link to the footage?

none that I know of.
Satellite all the way

163 quiet man  Tue, Aug 11, 2009 12:44:58pm

re: #160 kansas

Agreed…The police will do thjeir jobs and maybe we will hear of it, maybe not. Like I said before we have heard nothing about the killer of the soldier in AR last..June??

164 tradewind  Tue, Aug 11, 2009 12:46:34pm

re: #152 Mad Al-Jaffee

I think they have a basis in fact, along with Syphyllis and Gonorrhea. The moms checked into the hospital without a name in mind, saw their charts, and liked the names.
Seriously, what has happened is that there was a movement to use African names for African American children born in the sixties and seventies… nothing wrong with that, celebrating their heritage. The problem arose when the practice became distorted as American parents made up their own version of ’ African ‘sounding ‘names. It didn’t work out so well in many cases, and you got a kind of
Patois ( like in Jamaica) or Swahili -esque mix.

165 Lincolntf  Tue, Aug 11, 2009 12:50:35pm

re: #158 quiet man

Or when Obama says that we live in a “world in need, run by the white man’s greed”, can he be blamed for all crimes against the “greedy” whites?

All of the “guilt-by-association” crap that has become the rage with the advent of hyperlinks always distracts from the actions of the actual principals involved. I don’t really need to know that Obama loved Rev. Wright to hate Obama’s affection for Hugo Chavez. Same with Obama’s use of domestic Basji to silence opposition. It’s bad enough on it’s own, there’s no need for a referral.

166 Charles Johnson  Tue, Aug 11, 2009 12:55:30pm

re: #82 MJ

He got lot’s of encouragement from Bill O’Reilly: “Tiller the baby Killer”.

Absolutely correct. O’Reilly demonized Tiller in a way that went far beyond simply irresponsible, into plain maliciousness. He used the phrase “Tiller the baby killer” over and over, compared Tiller to Nazis, and worse.

Is O’Reilly responsible for the murder? Of course not. But did he contribute to and participate in the demonization that resulted in the murder? Absolutely.

167 quiet man  Tue, Aug 11, 2009 1:01:12pm

re: #165 Lincolntf

I’d say Guilt by association is more than a fad. That it takes from the criminal is pretty obvious..and in a way, an excusing of the person who did the crime.

Your example is perfect and covers all the bases…IMNSHO

168 flyovercountry  Tue, Aug 11, 2009 1:14:53pm

re: #5 Kragar (Proud to be Kafir)

How long before the groups start saying he never did it but it would be justified if he did?

Groups nothing, Ann Coulter went on T.V. and did this very thing that night. It was absolutely disgusting. I’ve heard rumblings that O’Reily, Hannity, et al also gave a quasi endorsement for murder in this circumstance. This and ID are two of the areas which make me queezy about being affiliated with my fellow conservatives.

169 zombie  Tue, Aug 11, 2009 1:15:07pm

Real name:

Tylenol Jones.

170 Dan G.  Tue, Aug 11, 2009 1:22:54pm

Wasn’t the phone number to one of these terrorist groups on his dash board when he was arrested?

171 Spare O'Lake  Tue, Aug 11, 2009 2:26:36pm

re: #1 Cato the Elder

There are no right-wing conspiracies.

May a vast grassy knoll grow between your legs.

172 Charles Johnson  Tue, Aug 11, 2009 2:27:38pm

re: #170 Dan G.

Wasn’t the phone number to one of these terrorist groups on his dash board when he was arrested?

Yes — but the number wasn’t just to the Operation Rescue switchboard, it was to a specific person there: Cheryl Sullenger, who was herself convicted and served time for a plot to bomb an abortion clinic … and is now the senior policy adviser for Operation Rescue.

[Link: littlegreenfootballs.com…]

173 Spare O'Lake  Tue, Aug 11, 2009 2:30:42pm

re: #166 Charles

Absolutely correct. O’Reilly demonized Tiller in a way that went far beyond simply irresponsible, into plain maliciousness. He used the phrase “Tiller the baby killer” over and over, compared Tiller to Nazis, and worse.

Is O’Reilly responsible for the murder? Of course not. But did he contribute to and participate in the demonization that resulted in the murder? Absolutely.

Where is the line between mere demonization and downright dehumanization?
On second thought, maybe the distinction is meaningless to a religious zealot.

174 Dan G.  Tue, Aug 11, 2009 2:32:19pm

re: #172 Charles

I’d be shocked…shocked… (yes that shocked), if this fact has gains no traction and leads to no consequences for O.R. or Cheryl Sullenger.

175 iceweasel  Wed, Aug 12, 2009 2:30:29am

Of course Roeder has ties to others in the extremist anti-abortion movement. And he can be expected to continue to encourage others.

There was a task force in the 90’s devoted to trying to convict these people. That failed as well.

A certain urgency surrounds the work of the task force; in the past two years, five clinic workers have been killed and nine attempted murders have been investigated. Arson attacks on clinics have risen sharply since 1992.

You’ll notice that the last spike in clinic violence also happened under a Democratic POTUS.

I’ve posted some of this before, but it’s worth repeating. I don’t think people realise that the ‘lone wolves’ who commit abortion-related violence always seem to have had contact with others.

Shelley Shannon, the women who shot Dr Tiller in 92, had conducted an extensive correspondence with Michael Griffin, the man who murdered Dr David Gunn.

At the time she attempted to murder Tiller, Shannon had been an anti-abortion activist for five years and had written letters of support to Michael Griffin, who murdered David Gunn.

Your text to link…

Shannon also was indicted by federal grand juries on 30 counts in connection with fires and acid attacks at nine clinics.

Shannon’s trial was attended by Paul Hill—who then corresponded with her in prison. Paul Hill was later executed for the murder of two clinic doctors.

This article outlines some information on Shannon, including a letter she sent to some of her other followers:

While in custody in Portland awaiting trial on arson, Ms. Shannon wrote a kind of “Christmas letter” to her supporters giving her assessment of events in 1994,

“Well, for the ARMY OF GOD 1994 was a pretty great year. Paul Hill performed a termination procedure on an abortionist and his accomplice, and may be put to death for his obedience to God, a most honorable way for a Christian to die. In Canada an abortionist was shot, and the culprits(s) are still free, as far as I know. There were quite a few fires and bombings at American death camps and no one was arrested in connection with them, that I know of.”

Yes, all these people have ties to the Army of God, which Charles has posted about before. I hope people watched the video he posted.

In any case, these people are not ‘lone wolves’; they are not acting alone; and they continue to act from inside prisons. All outgoing and incoming mail of a prisoner who is connected with anti-abortion violence must be monitored. Paul Hill communicated with others in the movement even from death row, sending messages about how he wasn’t afraid to die. These people need to be taken very seriously, and the rhetoric they use to describe themselves should not be discounted: they believe they are at war, and their actions indicate they have no compunction about committing murder or breaking any law, committing any violence, in the service of that war.

176 LC LaWedgie  Wed, Aug 12, 2009 7:23:42am

re: #165 Lincolntf

There’s enough daily “guilt-by-association” right here at LGF to make any sane person question associative behavior at all. :)


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