NY Landmark Committee Expected to Approve Park51

US NewsAugust 2010 • Views: 2,677

The bigots who oppose the construction of the Park51 community center in lower Manhattan have been hoping to get the existing building, a former Burlington coat factory, designated a “landmark” — the only legal way they could stop the construction, since hatred and bigotry aren’t considered valid exceptions to the US Constitution.

Well, it’s not going to happen.

The Mosque�planned for Ground Zero is expected to pass a major hurdle Tuesday.

Board members at the Landmarks Preservation Commission intend to vote unanimously against granting protected status to the 152-year-old building that would be knocked down to make way for the project, the Daily News has learned.

The Italianate building on Park Place, two blocks north of Ground Zero, simply does not meet architectural criteria for protection from the city, sources with knowledge of the issue said.

“The building is not worthy,” a source said. “It does not rise to the level of an individual landmark.”

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64 comments

Glenn Beck's Grand Unifying Theory of Obdicut Mon, Aug 2, 2010 10:36:20am

Man. The news reports still say shit like “The mosque planned for Ground Zero”, even though that’s a totally fucking inaccurate description.

DaddyG Mon, Aug 2, 2010 10:36:22am

What if the protestors found dinosaur turds on the building site? But I’m being redundant.

Soap_Man Mon, Aug 2, 2010 10:37:22am

I hate to be the one to bring this up, but how long will it be before this place gets vandalized? (Assuming it eventually gets built, of course.)

You talk to some people and you would think its an AQ training center. Stir up emotions enough, and people take shit into their own hands.

Kragar (Antichrist ) Mon, Aug 2, 2010 10:37:27am

How dare a commitee of New Yorkers tell the rest of the country how to run New York!

///

Alaska Kim Mon, Aug 2, 2010 10:37:40am

Howdy Y’all!

DaddyG Mon, Aug 2, 2010 10:39:19am

Hey Kim. How’s the tundra?

Political Atheist Mon, Aug 2, 2010 10:39:40am

re: #1 Obdicut

Of course they do. The real story is there is no story. But their version of the story has legs, and legs means ratings. Rating Rabbits Run!!

lawhawk Mon, Aug 2, 2010 10:39:46am

The LPC isn’t going to merely reject the landmark application but to reject it unanimously. The building was previously up for landmarking and it was rejected in the 1990s (could have been the 1980s) and the LPC rejected it then too.

The building itself is unremarkable as according to the architects and members of the LPC. So, that’s the right decision to make.

And even if the Daily News got this all wrong - landmarking would not kill the proposal. It would merely require the Cordoba House proponents to go back and revisit and redesign the facade and other features that the LPC deems necessary to save the integrity of the building’s historical features.

It’s that latter part that the opponents who are likely to go into their outrageous outrage turned to 11 never quite understood (well that and their geographically challenged hyperbole).

With the LPC a pretty much done deal, the next step is approval by the City Council, which will likely mirror the CB1 vote and authorize the project to go forward. At that point, it will be up to the project to get its financing together to start construction.

lawhawk Mon, Aug 2, 2010 10:42:00am

re: #1 Obdicut

Man. The news reports still say shit like “The mosque planned for Ground Zero”, even though that’s a totally fucking inaccurate description.

Well, you expect accuracy in the media?

It’s a mosque/community center 2 blocks from Ground Zero. And the hilarious thing is that the headline got it right, but the lede got it wrong. Usually, the headlines cut critical information for the sake of brevity but here, the report cut the key information from the first paragraph. That’s odd.

Alaska Kim Mon, Aug 2, 2010 10:44:23am

re: #6 DaddyG

Hey Kim. How’s the tundra?

beautiful as usual. too many tour ships in town tho.

DaddyG Mon, Aug 2, 2010 10:45:05am

re: #10 Alaska Kim

beautiful as usual. too many tour ships in town tho.

Send ‘em to Atlanta. We can use the tourist dollars. ;-D

AntonSirius Mon, Aug 2, 2010 10:45:20am

What a travesty! Every building you can almost kinda see from Ground Zero should be a landmark - to freedom!

Kragar (Antichrist ) Mon, Aug 2, 2010 10:46:55am

re: #12 AntonSirius

What a travesty! Every building you can almost kinda see from Ground Zero should be a landmark - to freedom!

Have you been to north Jersey?

Alaska Kim Mon, Aug 2, 2010 10:47:51am

re: #11 DaddyG

Send ‘em to Atlanta. We can use the tourist dollars. ;-D

must be hot down there! nice and cool here, in the 60’s.

Cato the Elder Mon, Aug 2, 2010 10:48:34am

A “coat factory” in which the coats were all made in China by sweatshop labor?

Some landmark.

AntonSirius Mon, Aug 2, 2010 10:48:45am

re: #3 Soap_Man

I hate to be the one to bring this up, but how long will it be before this place gets vandalized? (Assuming it eventually gets built, of course.)

It’ll be a stop on the 9/11 Memorial Walking Tour. Visit Ground Zero, buy some red white & blue spray paint at the gift shop…

wrenchwench Mon, Aug 2, 2010 10:49:34am

re: #15 Cato the Elder

A “coat factory” in which the coats were all made in China by sweatshop labor?

Some landmark.

But! The Corinthian columns! The steel roll-up doors!

What, me worry? Mon, Aug 2, 2010 10:49:37am

re: #8 lawhawk

The LPC isn’t going to merely reject the landmark application but to reject it unanimously. The building was previously up for landmarking and it was rejected in the 1990s (could have been the 1980s) and the LPC rejected it then too.

The building itself is unremarkable as according to the architects and members of the LPC. So, that’s the right decision to make.

And even if the Daily News got this all wrong - landmarking would not kill the proposal. It would merely require the Cordoba House proponents to go back and revisit and redesign the facade and other features that the LPC deems necessary to save the integrity of the building’s historical features.

It’s that latter part that the opponents who are likely to go into their outrageous outrage turned to 11 never quite understood (well that and their geographically challenged hyperbole).

With the LPC a pretty much done deal, the next step is approval by the City Council, which will likely mirror the CB1 vote and authorize the project to go forward. At that point, it will be up to the project to get its financing together to start construction.

Thanks for the explanation. I was going to ask if the building just isn’t architectural appealing, why it didn’t get the status. It doesn’t look like it from the pic, but hard to tell.

Appealing or no, we’ve lost almost all of our landmarks in Miami. There’s a couple surviving deco hotels in north beach, but they’re slated for demolition. I think it’s awful really, but they weren’t practical anymore.

One of our few historically preserved landmarks is Miami’s Freedom Tower.

My grandad built storefronts in NY in the 30s. I wonder if any are still standing.

AntonSirius Mon, Aug 2, 2010 10:50:03am

re: #13 Kragar (Proud to be Kafir)

Have you been to north Jersey?

I’ve heard the freedom is so thick in the air you can almost smell it.

SpaceJesus Mon, Aug 2, 2010 10:50:42am

oh no! is there no one who can stop, MEGA MOSQUE????

DaddyG Mon, Aug 2, 2010 10:50:50am

I loathe the bold faced hostility towards religion (or others religions) that the people leading these efforts exhibit. My own religion has faced opposition when wanting to raise buildings and it usually gets started by a small dedicated group of opponents who follow us around the world watching for us to buy another parcel of land. In some cases they poisoned the well with the local community and government so badly we gave up trying.

There is no end to the additional cost and grief a small dedicated group of harassment minded bigots can add to an innocent building project. This will in no way improve relations between moderate Muslims and the rest of the US poplulation. If anything it will add another flavor of martyr cookie to the more radical factions playbooks.

What, me worry? Mon, Aug 2, 2010 10:51:50am

re: #20 SpaceJesus

oh no! is there no one who can stop, MEGA MOSQUE???

Shouldn’t that be followed by… Da Da Da Daaaaaaaaaaa…..

AntonSirius Mon, Aug 2, 2010 10:52:06am

Speaking of North Jersey, when will we get an official statement from Robert Gibbs about Snooki-Gate? This could bring down the White House, y’know.

Kragar (Antichrist ) Mon, Aug 2, 2010 10:53:04am

re: #20 SpaceJesus

oh no! is there no one who can stop, MEGA MOSQUE???

Mega-Weapon?

Probably not though, Mega-Weapon is a laid back kind of dude.

garhighway Mon, Aug 2, 2010 10:53:24am

re: #20 SpaceJesus

oh no! is there no one who can stop, MEGA MOSQUE???

Rodan.

DaddyG Mon, Aug 2, 2010 10:53:31am

re: #14 Alaska Kim

must be hot down there! nice and cool here, in the 60’s.

We’re doing our high 90s and thunderstorms in the afternoon thing. Quite typical for July/August. The South may have been built on cotton but it grew up on central air.

Gus Mon, Aug 2, 2010 10:54:02am

re: #17 wrenchwench

But! The Corinthian columns! The steel roll-up doors!

Corinthian! Like the optional leather seats on the Chrysler Cordoba! What does it all mean?

ShaunP Mon, Aug 2, 2010 10:54:11am

re: #22 marjoriemoon

Shouldn’t that be followed by… Da Da Da Daaa…

And probably one of these:

Youtube Video

SpaceJesus Mon, Aug 2, 2010 10:54:40am

re: #25 garhighway

MEGA RETARD BIGOT vs. MEGA MOSQUE? an epic battle for the ages

sffilk Mon, Aug 2, 2010 10:54:52am

re: #14 Alaska Kim

must be hot down there! nice and cool here, in the 60’s.

30+ days with highs in the 90’s.

wrenchwench Mon, Aug 2, 2010 10:55:08am

re: #20 SpaceJesus

oh no! is there no one who can stop, MEGA MOSQUE???

Sadly, that gave me an image of Bobby Spencer in a cape and leotards.

Kragar (Antichrist ) Mon, Aug 2, 2010 10:55:52am

re: #29 SpaceJesus

MEGA RETARD BIGOT vs. MEGA MOSQUE? an epic battle for the ages

Will there be nitro burning funny cars and Truckasaurus?

Will we be required to pay for the whole seat if we only use the edge?

lawhawk Mon, Aug 2, 2010 10:55:54am

re: #15 Cato the Elder

The buildings themselves date back about 100 years or so. Their exteriors are unremarkable and are not in the same class as buildings in Tribeca or SoHo, such as these.

Gus Mon, Aug 2, 2010 10:58:18am

re: #33 lawhawk

The buildings themselves date back about 100 years or so. Their exteriors are unremarkable and are not in the same class as buildings in Tribeca or SoHo, such as these.

Amish Market is right on the corner.

Cato the Elder Mon, Aug 2, 2010 10:59:07am

re: #33 lawhawk

The buildings themselves date back about 100 years or so. Their exteriors are unremarkable and are not in the same class as buildings in Tribeca or SoHo, such as these.

Well, those rondels to either side of the arch are kinda nice. Maybe we can stipulate that those get saved.

Amory Blaine Mon, Aug 2, 2010 11:02:25am

Boy 9/11 sure brought out the best in America didn’t it?

tradewind Mon, Aug 2, 2010 11:02:58am

re: #23 AntonSirius
Just proves the thing my Mama used to tell me is true: no one has a good enough memory to be a successful fibber.

What, me worry? Mon, Aug 2, 2010 11:03:03am

re: #34 Gus 802

Amish Market is right on the corner.

Stupid question, but are there Amish folks in downtown NY? Or is that just a campy name.

Gus Mon, Aug 2, 2010 11:03:32am

re: #38 marjoriemoon

Stupid question, but are there Amish folks in downtown NY? Or is that just a campy name.

My guess would be it’s just a name.

tradewind Mon, Aug 2, 2010 11:03:55am

re: #36 Amory Blaine

In many ways, it did. The heroism displayed on that day by the FDNY and NYPD, among others, was inspiring.

What, me worry? Mon, Aug 2, 2010 11:05:39am

re: #39 Gus 802

My guess would be it’s just a name.

Well after I’m busy being indoctrinated by the Muslims, I’ll head down the street for some strawberry pie and a funny hat.

tradewind Mon, Aug 2, 2010 11:06:51am

re: #11 DaddyG
POTUS is visiting ATL today, so that should draw a crowd and stimulate the local economy.
And, it’ll give the people a chance to get a glimpse at all the local democrats running for office as they gather ‘round.

Gus Mon, Aug 2, 2010 11:07:34am

re: #41 marjoriemoon

Well after I’m busy being indoctrinated by the Muslims, I’ll head down the street for some strawberry pie and a funny hat.

Website…

amishtribeca.com

Don’t look if you’re hungry.

Lidane Mon, Aug 2, 2010 11:10:01am

re: #36 Amory Blaine

Boy 9/11 sure brought out the best in America didn’t it?

For the most part, yes. It did. There were many great examples of America’s best, especially from the FDNY and NYPD that day. The problem is, it also brought out a real ugly, racist, religiously bigoted undercurrent that has only gotten worse since 2008.

However, in spite of all the best efforts of the bigots and crazy people to poison the well for everyone else, we can’t let them define who we are as a country, or as a people. They don’t speak for everyone. They only speak for their own prejudices and their own fears.

What, me worry? Mon, Aug 2, 2010 11:11:17am

re: #43 Gus 802

Website…

[Link: www.amishtribeca.com…]

Don’t look if you’re hungry.

They come to Miami every year and set up near Homestead and the Redlands (way south). I haven’t been in many years, but they have these gigantic sticky buns and the pies are not to be believed. Super duper yummy.

DaddyG Mon, Aug 2, 2010 11:17:17am

re: #42 tradewind

POTUS is visiting ATL today, so that should draw a crowd and stimulate the local economy.
And, it’ll give the people a chance to get a glimpse at all the local democrats running for office as they gather ‘round.

Barnes is running away. He will be downstate campaigning.

Governor Perdue (R) greeted the President at the airbase when he arrived. Which is how it should be regardless of party affiliation.

Looking down the street at the hotel where POTUS is speaking there doesn’t seem to be any undue commotion.

tradewind Mon, Aug 2, 2010 11:21:56am

re: #46 DaddyG
He’s not the only one….
11alive.com

SanFranciscoZionist Mon, Aug 2, 2010 11:34:36am

re: #1 Obdicut

Man. The news reports still say shit like “The mosque planned for Ground Zero”, even though that’s a totally fucking inaccurate description.

Avanti posted a piece by Nate Silver last night. He went down there and actually took a look at the neighborhood and the building, and says that he’s gone from being just OK with the project to feeling that it will improve the neighborhood.

SanFranciscoZionist Mon, Aug 2, 2010 11:36:57am

re: #12 AntonSirius

What a travesty! Every building you can almost kinda see from Ground Zero should be a landmark - to freedom!

A bustling, building, thriving New York, open to people of every faith and no faith, and an experimental mixture of faiths, is our landmark to freedom, and always has been.

SanFranciscoZionist Mon, Aug 2, 2010 11:40:20am

re: #36 Amory Blaine

Boy 9/11 sure brought out the best in America didn’t it?

Actually, given the dark warnings flying around at the time, after 9/11 we did OK. I was disappointed by the commercial nature of our bounceback, but in terms of violence and bigotry, I was awful proud of how non-ugly our reaction was.

I actually don’t think this current situation is even mostly about 9/11, although that is part of it.

lawhawk Mon, Aug 2, 2010 11:50:28am

re: #48 SanFranciscoZionist

I hadn’t seen that piece, but I work a block from Ground Zero and a few blocks south of Park Place, and I’d concur with Silver’s assessment. Park Place is currently a drab block with a lack of street life and what limited pedestrian traffic there is during the day disappears altogether after 5pm. A community center would vastly improve pedestrian traffic in the area and give a boost to local restaurants and businesses - and potentially increase values of neighboring properties. The building across the street is an office building that primarily exits onto either Church or Greenwich so this would be a draw for the block and area.

Charles,
Your assessment that there isn’t anything else that can be legally done to stop the project technically isn’t correct. The City or state could begin eminent domain to condemn the building - citing a public purpose but the state hasn’t entered the fray and Mayor Bloomberg has been for the project. Odds of a condemnation process being started is close to nil, but that isn’t stopping the former Tea Party candidate Carl Paladino from proposing doing just that to turn the site into a war memorial.

ProBosniaLiberal Mon, Aug 2, 2010 11:51:16am

re: #35 Cato the Elder

I like the way the former Burlington Coat Factory store looks. I think they should just demolish the building next to it, and extend the Burlington Coat Factory building and facade into where (Apartment?) building is now. Then they build up the 10 stories in whatever style works with the bottom 3 or so stories. But, then again, I want to mosque built in the Art Deco style, so I might be a little eccentric.

yasharki Mon, Aug 2, 2010 1:38:35pm

Can someone please point out exact address where this mosque is going to be built? I’ve just spent some time googling for the answer but can’t find anything specific, everyone’s obsessed with “Ground Zero Mosque” with no specific address. I was actually working at 1 Liberty plaza when 9/11 happened, but can’t remember where the Burlington Coat Factory old building was.

Thanks in advance!

Charles Johnson Mon, Aug 2, 2010 1:42:26pm

re: #53 yasharki

This post has the address and an embedded Google Map:

littlegreenfootballs.com

yasharki Mon, Aug 2, 2010 2:05:45pm

re: #54 Charles

Thanks Charles!

This place is indeed further away from what used to be WTC than the mosque that’s been there before and since 9/11. One of my coworkers, a practicing muslim went there to pray at lunchtime before and after the tragedy. I had no problem with this, he lost some muslim friends in WTC, as I’ve lost my friends of various faiths. In fact we were both braking our backs saving Goldman Sach’s servers the rest of that week, if anything we only put our Jew vs. Muslim arguments aside.

William of Orange Mon, Aug 2, 2010 4:11:06pm

As much as I hate to see in initiative like this to be blocked, knocking down a 152 year old building to be also sounds like blaspheme. A building that old should have been granted a landmark distinction simply due to it’s age. So much from the past has been lost. I mean, this building was already around in the civil war.

Don’t get me wrong. I don’t want this project to be blocked but being the architectural buff that I am, I think it’s sad a building this old has to go…

bklynkid Mon, Aug 2, 2010 4:12:59pm

More pointedly, throughout Islam’s history, whenever a region was conquered, one of the first signs of consolidation was/is the erection of a mosque atop the sacred sites of the vanquished: the pagan Ka’ba temple in Arabia was converted into Islam’s holiest site, the mosque of Mecca; the al-Aqsa mosque, Islam’s third holiest site, was built atop Solomon’s temple in Jerusalem; the Umayyad mosque was built atop the Church of St. John the Baptist; and the Hagia Sophia was converted into a mosque upon the conquest of Constantinople.
Do you think that this was the only bldg. in NYC that they could purchase for a mosque???

William of Orange Mon, Aug 2, 2010 4:16:46pm

And I think this building is beautiful… The neon signs of the coat factory are still in place in this picture.

William of Orange Mon, Aug 2, 2010 4:22:49pm

re: #57 bklynkid

More pointedly, throughout Islam’s history, whenever a region was conquered, one of the first signs of consolidation was/is the erection of a mosque atop the sacred sites of the vanquished: the pagan Ka’ba temple in Arabia was converted into Islam’s holiest site, the mosque of Mecca; the al-Aqsa mosque, Islam’s third holiest site, was built atop Solomon’s temple in Jerusalem; the Umayyad mosque was built atop the Church of St. John the Baptist; and the Hagia Sophia was converted into a mosque upon the conquest of Constantinople.
Do you think that this was the only bldg. in NYC that they could purchase for a mosque???

And the same doesn’t apply to other faiths? The Catholic church “conquered” South America that way, in your anology.

And do you really think anyone would consider the USA as conquered??

Solomon2 Mon, Aug 2, 2010 4:39:31pm

The Park51 mosque may be approved, but it still may not happen. From talking to others on the Web, the project seems quite controversial among U.S. Muslims and may falter for lack of their support.

theye1 Mon, Aug 2, 2010 6:21:14pm

re: #57 bklynkid

That’s pretty much every civilization ever. From the Chinese to the Romans, they all knocked down and built their stuff on top of it. To be honest, the Christians are were more prolific for doing this then then Muslims.

theye1 Mon, Aug 2, 2010 6:23:02pm

Sorry to double post, but the famous St. Peter’s Basilica was built on top of a Roman Temple.

kamala Mon, Aug 2, 2010 8:41:34pm

re: #60 Solomon2

The Park51 mosque may be approved, but it still may not happen. From talking to others on the Web, the project seems quite controversial among U.S. Muslims and may falter for lack of their support.

Are those U.S. Muslims who don’t support it bigots?

Amory Blaine Tue, Aug 3, 2010 10:58:17am

re: #63 kamala

Are those U.S. Muslims who don’t support it bigots?

The only reason I can think why US Muslims might oppose this is that rabid bigots might raise their targeting of Muslims as victims.

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