Russian Ministry of Defense, Russia Today Use Debunked Internet Rumors to Lie About Ukraine

Means they don’t have much of a case.
Politics • Views: 37,453

Russia Today, the Goebbelsian Putinist propaganda channel well-known for its rank dishonesty, has published “10 questions” to Ukraine based on the recent Russian Ministry of Defense press conference.

Questions 8 and 9:

8. Where did the launcher - from the video circulated by Western media and showing a Buk system being moved allegedly from Ukraine to Russia - come from? As the video was made on the territory controlled by Kiev, where was the launcher being transported?
“I’d like to say that the information we have presented here is based on objective and reliable data from various technical systems - unlike the groundless accusations made against Russia,” said Kartopolov.

9. Where is it right now? Why are some of the missiles missing on the launcher? When was the last time a missile was launched from it?

These questions do indeed correspond to the claims made by the MoD officials during the press conference:

[Chief of Staff of the Main Operations Directorate - deputy chief of The General Staff Andrew Kartapolov:] To conclude it I would like to mention that all the concrete information is based on the objective and reliable dates of the different Russian equipment in contrast to the accusations of the US against us made without any evidence.The good example of such fact is that some mass media showed transportation of the Buk-M1 missile system from Ukrainian to Russian territory.We can clearly see that its frame-up.

These pictures were made in the city of Krasnoarmeisk that is confirmed by a banner situated close to the road. This banner has an address of the car shop situated at the Dnepropetrovskaya, 34.

Since May 11 the Krasnoarmeysk city is under control of the Ukrainian Armed Forces.

That is why we have some questions.

What kind of launching system is it? Where is it transported? Where is it now? Why is it unloaded completely? What was the last time it launched missiles?

To end my speech I would like to emphasize that the Russian Federation did not deliver to the militants any Buk-M1 missiles systems and other equipment.

There are 2 problems with this claim.

1. It’s not true.

2. It comes from an anonymous viral internet text, most probably distributed by the Kremlin trolls and bots.

Moreover, the claim had been debunked long before the press conference took place. For example, on July 20 an authoritative blogger Anatoly Vorobey analyzed the photo of the same Buk made on July 17, and proved beyond doubt (by way of comparison with other photos) that it was made in Torez, i.e. on the territory held by the “separatists”, and thus couldn’t have been on the Ukrainian-controlled territory the next day (when the video was made). Moreover, the claim that one can read the name of the street on the poster in the video is a direct lie, the text on the video is simply unreadable. But the same ad was found online, and the words are not “Dnepropetrovskaya 34”, but rather “natsionalnyj avtodiler” (“national autodealer”).

So the top Russian MoD experts either fell for an internet lie or knowingly repeated it. Either way, they have no credibility.

And RT’s questions can now be reversed: so what was a Buk (the existence of which the “separatists” and Russian officials now strenuously deny, despite the official “separatist” and Russian state news sources having gleefully reported about it at the end of June) was doing on the territory controlled by the “separatists”? Where is one of its missiles? Where was it heading?

Actually we do know the answers to these questions, but it would be interesting to see what new wild excuses the Putinist clowns can come up with.

Further reading:

interpretermag.com
stopfake.org

Update: it has now been confirmed that the video was shot in Lugansk, not Krasnoarmeisk. The Russian Ministry of Defense has some ‘splainin’ to do.

Basically, one can compare this and this with the video (look at the markings in the screenshots above for orientation).

Jump to bottom

215 comments
1 wheat-dogghazi  Jul 22, 2014 3:24:24am

The Russian ambassador to Malaysia held a press conference earlier today and denied (1) that the separatists were impeding the investigation in any way and (2) that Russia or the separatists had anything to do with launched a missile at the airliner. She implied only the Ukrainian military had the material and expertise to launch a SAM.

Let’s see now. It’s been five days since the airliner went down, and it’s taken that long for Russia to respond. To me, it suggests the Kremlin has been scrambling like hell to get everyone on the same page with the same story.

2 Islamo-Masonic Conspirator  Jul 22, 2014 3:44:19am

re: #1 wheat-dogghazi

The ambassador, Lyudmila Vorobyeva, is completely shameless.

thestar.com.my

“If you ask me, I am convinced that there is no way they could have done it. They don’t have the means to do it,” she told a packed press conference at the embassy here, Tuesday.

Vorobyeva said the rebels were only armed with a “small portable air defence system” (shoulder mounted) that can go up to 5km.

“I am not a military expert, but that BUK missile system is very sophisticated that you need special training to operate it.

“The rebels did not have the book or qualification to operate it, but the Ukrainian military have it,” she said.

No matter that the state news agency ITAR-TASS reported on June 29, that the “rebels” captured an Ukrainian Buk (which they probably didn’t btw, but such news items are usually needed to cover up the fact of weapons transfer from Russia to the “separatists”). And she doesn’t seem to understand that even if she is right about the rebels’ lack of qualifications, this only serves to further implicate Russia, not Ukraine.

3 Wendell Zurkowitz (slave to the waffle light)  Jul 22, 2014 3:51:10am

They can spin this all they want for domestic and foreign consumption, but the airline bosses are pissed off at Putin and will find ways to put pressure on him.

4 Teukka  Jul 22, 2014 4:15:50am

The way in which Russian media repeats these MH17 conspiracy theories with impunity strongly suggests it is either with the approval or on the behalf of the Russian administration in the Kremlin.

And it seems they do not stick with just one story, there are at least 80 different kinds of lies in circulation in Russian media about MH17 as we speak, if Julie Davis at The Examiner is to be belived:
The Examiner: Russia’s Top 10 Lies About Downed Malaysian Airliner

But the lies in Russian media don’t stop there, at the very least they go back to the beginning of the conflict in Ukraine, if not further. About a week before MH17, Russian media ran a horrific story of an alleged baby crucifixion in Ukraine:
The Examiner: Russia’s madman ideologue Dugin scripted fake baby crucifixion in Ukraine

Which, of course, turned out to be false. And it seems the man behind it is none other than Alexander Dugin, who is behind the late 90’s book Foundations of Geopolitics, which seems to form part of the Putin gameplan in Ukraine and elsewhere.

My concern is how far back does this pattern of inflammatory propaganda go? What Russian propaganda hasn’t been recognized as such by governments, non-governmental organizations and the public in United States and the West? How much of it is behind the recent surge in activism and social destabilization in the United States and Europe?

Sorry if my questions seem paranoid, but my gut tells me louder by the day that we are seeing the effects of a long-term plan of Kremlin power movers. And the crucified baby lie chills me because it has strong echoes of ancient Blood Libels and reminds me strongly of the propaganda of the Third Reich.

And it seems that at least a portion of these lies are being bought hook, line and sinker by the Russian public, I interact with Russians daily in an IRC channel, and they display strongly skewed notions of history and geographics which make my skin crawl.

And their reaction when cornered with undisputable facts is utterly terrifying, it can basically be summed up as “If you fucking US and EU imperialists assholes don’t back down and let us have what we want, we will start WWIII on your sorry asses! That will teach you a lesson you bastards!”.

A threat which becomes the stuff of nightmares considering that one of Putin’s emissaries, Sergey Alexandrovich Markov recently threatened Sweden and Finland with WWIII if they joined NATO and if they didn’t back off about the situation in Ukraine. And he did so on video on at least one of the two occasions he verbalized the threat.
Dagens Nyheter: Putins emmisary warns of WWII [Swedish]
Hufvudstadsbladed: Do you want to start WWIII [Swedish]

Neither of these major Swedish and Finnish newspapers are fringe publications, rather liberal, middle of the road politically. I’ve NEVER seen either one lie about stories of this magnitude without major-league voluntary groveling being involved both in terms it’s readers and those they told the lies about. And Markov’s accusations against Sweden and Finland regarding “Russophobia” in both countries is about as true as the lies about MH17 and baby crucifixions, if not less. I.e. not at all.

I mean, what the fuck have they been drinking and smoking in the Kremlin, and for how long have they been drinking and smoking such. When was the last time they got a psych eval?

This is the kind of situation which can lead to this:
Youtube Video

5 Islamo-Masonic Conspirator  Jul 22, 2014 4:25:17am

re: #4 Teukka

The examiner series are usually good, but here the following false information is repeated:

The Malaysian airliner was shot down at approximately 17:30 (Moscow time). The wave of coverage commenced with the posting on the social media page of a Russian terrorist Girkin (also known under his pseudonym “Strelkov”) at 17:50. Russia’s mainstream media routinely uses postings on this page as the primary source for their news stories. In his commentary, Girkin boasted that the terrorists managed to shoot down another Ukrainian plane, specifically mentioning what he believed at the time to be a Ukrainian AN-26 airplane, shot down in the area

The only place where Girkin posts is a certain forum. The VK page doesn’t belong to him, so no, he did not post the admission and it’s not his post. It’s bad that this misinformation is still repeated.

6 Teukka  Jul 22, 2014 4:30:41am

re: #5 Islamo-Masonic Conspirator

The examiner series are usually good, but here the following false information is repeated:

The only place where Girkin posts is a certain forum. The VK page doesn’t belong to him, so no, he did not post the admission and it’s not his post. It’s bad that this misinformation is still repeated.

Thank you for that clarification. Will pass it on to anyone on IRC I see using the “Girkin” VK page (as in vkontakte.ru?) as argument/source.

Nevertheless, Russian dick-waving in the Kremlin, UN and elsewhere is a cause for grave concern for the rest of the planet.

7 Islamo-Masonic Conspirator  Jul 22, 2014 4:45:52am

re: #6 Teukka

Just to be clear, the page is not fake and it doesn’t pretend to be Girkin. It’s simply someone who reposts his messages, as well as lots of other stuff from other sources. The post in question is clearly marked as coming from some unnamed “rebels”. Which is still meaningful, but not as much as if it came from Strelkov directly.

8 Wendell Zurkowitz (slave to the waffle light)  Jul 22, 2014 5:22:29am

I occasionally visit a blog site, moonofalabama.org, which buys fully into the Russian point of view: the Kiev government is a fascist junta and a western puppet, Putin is a force for stability and self-determination in the region, etc.

And they are tossing around the theories debunked here as the only possible acceptable variants.

So my theory - one that ought to be acceptable to both sides - is that the plane shot itself down. It was depressed and committed suicide. Overwork, metal fatigue and general systems failure led it to end its service life right there over the Eastern Ukraine.

See? Nobody has to shoulder the blame, each side can continue to be the heroes and their respective opponents can continue to be brutal liars and thugs.

9 Islamo-Masonic Conspirator  Jul 22, 2014 5:26:45am

re: #8 Wendell Zurkowitz (slave to the waffle light)

moonofalabama.org

‘Nuff said.

10 Dr Lizardo  Jul 22, 2014 6:31:07am

Someone out there needs to a serious exposé about Russian influence in Western media, and particularly, it’s online presence and influence.

I know that the Breitbrats got caught taking $$$ from Russia, so it’s probably not too great a stretch of the imagination to think that Russia’s influence on the debate - particularly on the fringe elements of both right and left (I’ve noticed there’s any number of Russian apologists on both Free Republic and Democratic Underground - wingnut and moonbat central, respectively) and that ultimately, that fringe debate gets picked up by everyone else and goes mainstream.

Plant the idea at the fringe and over time, it gravitates toward the center.

11 Dr Lizardo  Jul 22, 2014 6:36:44am

Oh, and it seems Putin is doubling down on his ethno-nationalisitic BS.

13:29: President Putin also said in his statement that: “Russia is being presented with what is almost an ultimatum: ‘Let us destroy this part of the population that is ethnically and historically close to Russia and we will not impose sanctions against you. This is a strange and unacceptable logic.”

13:28: In his statement, President Putin reiterated his belief that protests which toppled Ukraine’s former Russian-backed leader [President Viktor Yanukovych] were instigated and funded from abroad, Reuters says. Despite Western sanctions, he said Moscow would stand by separatists in eastern Ukraine whom he described as part of a popular rising against an illegal coup.

bbc.com

12 lawhawk  Jul 22, 2014 6:42:07am

Bordering on the bizarre? No, it strains credulity and doesn’t pass the smell test. The Russian “theory” behind Ukraine downing the jet would appear to disregard all the evidence presented thus far.

What we know so far comes from interested parties - Russian, Ukrainian, separatist. But there are incontrovertible facts.

MH17 was shot down.

All those on board were killed, and they were not a party to the conflict.

The mechanism for the crash appears to be the launch of a sophisticated SAM missile that would be beyond the capabilities of someone who just came across a random missile launcher. Training is required. This isn’t some MANPAD that is a point and shoot kind of deal.

The crash occurred within territory controlled by separatists loyal to Russia, and these separatists have thwarted investigators and rescuers from getting to the site for days. They have hindered the ability to gather evidence, including the black boxes and gathering the remains of those passengers on board. Days after the crash, bodies were on the side of the road or in the fields where they came down after crashing to earth. Moving the remains to the side of the road hinder investigators trying to piece together what happened.

Only yesterday were the black boxes handed over to those investigators.

Russia proffers a theory that Ukraine shot down the plane, which goes against the Ukrainian reports and tweets that indicated that the separatists were behind the shoot-down, and that was followed by a sanitizing of those twitter feeds of remarks that would have tied events back to the separatists.

It’s assumed that a Buk launcher was involved, and there were reports that launchers were moved into Russia from the area where the crash occurred. That’s circumstantial evidence that points to complicity by Russia in the shoot down. Even if the shoot down was a mistake, the optics point at Russia/separatists.

Ukraine may have similar weapons at its disposal, but thus far there’s no evidence that Ukraine fired the missile in question.

Add to that the Russian attempts to pin this on a Ukrainian fighter plane that is designed for air to ground combat and lacks the capability to fly to the same altitude and efforts to edit wikipedia to change facts and details on those related pages and you’ve got a misinformation campaign by Russia that again points the finger back at them or the separatists.

13 Islamo-Masonic Conspirator  Jul 22, 2014 11:37:24am
14 Dr Lizardo  Jul 22, 2014 11:38:11am

This is an interesting development:

Senior US senators are asking President Barack Obama to introduce tougher measures against Russia and to consider putting Ukrainian separatist group “Donetsk People’s Republic” on a US terror blacklist. In a letter, Bob Menendez, Dianne Feinstein and Carl Levin said Russia’s defence, energy and finance sectors should be targeted.

bbc.com

15 Kragar  Jul 22, 2014 11:39:35am

“Frankly, I’ve never heard of something like this,” said investigator Gene Debbaudt. “In recent memory, I can’t think of anything more horrific.”

Investigators collected more than 400 items from the home, including firearms, ammunition, and knives.

His Facebook page indicates a fascination with guns and violence, following such groups AR-15 Gun Owners of America, Oath Keepers, NRA’s American Rifleman, and Citizens Committee for the Right to Keep and Bear Arms, and American Militia.

Nearly all of the posts on his timeline were pro-gun and anti-Obama viral images, as well as posts about his occupation as a journeyman lineman.

Police said a former girlfriend who previously lived with Oestrike filed a domestic assault report when she moved out in June.

Obviously a dirty leftist commie

16 Islamo-Masonic Conspirator  Jul 22, 2014 11:40:58am

re: #13 Islamo-Masonic Conspirator

Yesterday the video was all the rage when they thought it was made on the govt-controlled territory and when it was used by the Ministry of Defense. Today it will probably become another “Ukronazi fake”.

17 Backwoods_Sleuth  Jul 22, 2014 11:43:40am

re: #15 Kragar

WTF!
This asshole apparently works for the same company as MrBWS.

yowser….

18 Pie-onist Overlord  Jul 22, 2014 11:43:50am

I’m surprised it took so long for this meme to show up:

20 Charles Johnson  Jul 22, 2014 11:48:26am

re: #15 Kragar

Yech. Ugly story.

Notice, though, that Raw Story simply rewrote the original article, which is here:

mlive.com

That’s pretty much all Raw Story does - recycle other people’s articles with a cursory rewrite. That wouldn’t be so bad — if they didn’t get upset when anyone links to them and quotes their version.

(Not fond of Raw Story, if you couldn’t tell.)

21 Islamo-Masonic Conspirator  Jul 22, 2014 11:49:09am

Wow.

This is the total “low level” surveillance age (meaning, we all have cameras). The old Soviet farts don’t get it.

22 Dr Lizardo  Jul 22, 2014 11:53:31am

re: #21 Islamo-Masonic Conspirator

Wow.

[Embedded content]

This is the total “low level” surveillance age (meaning, we all have cameras). The old Soviet farts don’t get it.

Not to mention speaking over mobile phones which can be easily intercepted. There’s a part of me that finds it hard to imagine that these insurrectionists are that utterly stupid; that right there is pretty mind-blowing.

23 Kragar  Jul 22, 2014 11:54:05am

re: #20 Charles Johnson

Yech. Ugly story.

Notice, though, that Raw Story simply rewrote the original article, which is here:

mlive.com

That’s pretty much all Raw Story does - recycle other people’s articles with a cursory rewrite. That wouldn’t be so bad — if they didn’t get upset if anyone links to them and quotes their version.

(Not fond of Raw Story, if you couldn’t tell.)

Yeah, they’re annoying like that.

24 lawhawk  Jul 22, 2014 11:57:57am

re: #21 Islamo-Masonic Conspirator

Yup, and with Google maps and street view, it’s even easier than ever to find locations in urban areas to identify them down to the square precise GPS coordinates. That’s some serious sleuthing though to identify the track of that vehicle.

25 Shiplord Kirel  Jul 22, 2014 11:58:10am

re: #10 Dr Lizardo

Someone out there needs to a serious exposé about Russian influence in Western media, and particularly, it’s online presence and influence.

I know that the Breitbrats got caught taking $$$ from Russia, so it’s probably not too great a stretch of the imagination to think that Russia’s influence on the debate - particularly on the fringe elements of both right and left (I’ve noticed there’s any number of Russian apologists on both Free Republic and Democratic Underground - wingnut and moonbat central, respectively) and that ultimately, that fringe debate gets picked up by everyone else and goes mainstream.

Plant the idea at the fringe and over time, it gravitates toward the center.

It isn’t just the media. A certain county libertarian chairman in Texas has repeated declared that Russia Today is the “only reliable and truthful media outlet in the world” (his words). This attitude is common among the glibertarians and among militia and tea party types as well. RT is quoted favorably on Free Republic every day.
They have also invaded academia, especially the lower tier diploma mills and half baked religious institutions. The faculty at a nearby Baptist college is crawling with Putin fanboys and conspiracy loons, including an honest-to-God 9-11 truther who serves as a professor of business.
Whatever else he has accomplished Putin has built up a massive and dangerous fifth column in this country, one the communists of old would have envied for its scope and magnitude.

26 Dr Lizardo  Jul 22, 2014 12:01:12pm

re: #25 Shiplord Kirel

It isn’t just the media. A certain county libertarian chairman in Texas has repeated declared that Russia Today is the “only reliable and truthful media outlet in the world” (his words). This attitude is common among the glibertarians and among militia and tea party types as well. RT is quoted favorably on Free Republic every day.
They have also invaded academia, especially the lower tier diploma mills and half baked religious institutions. The faculty at a nearby Baptist college is crawling with Putin fanboys and conspiracy loons, including an honest-to-God 9-11 truther who serves as a professor of business.
Whatever else he has accomplished Putin has built up a massive and dangerous fifth column in this country, one the communists of old would have envied for its scope and magnitude.

Anyone who thinks Russia Today is the “only reliable and truthful media outlet in the world” needs to be committed forthwith to the nearest lunatic asylum.

Honest-to-God mind-boggling how many ‘useful idiots’ there are out there in meatworld.

27 Backwoods_Sleuth  Jul 22, 2014 12:01:18pm

O/T:

28 EmmaAnne  Jul 22, 2014 12:04:50pm

Thanks for the link to stopfake.org. The page on how to spot fakes is really useful for all kinds of fakes. I already knew about image searching from here, but I doubt it is widely known, and the ideas for YouTube videos are really clever.

stopfake.org

29 Islamo-Masonic Conspirator  Jul 22, 2014 12:05:00pm

re: #24 lawhawk

That, and pure luck. Who knew that Google Earth would be updated with such fresh photos!

30 Shiplord Kirel  Jul 22, 2014 12:05:00pm

re: #26 Dr Lizardo

Anyone who thinks Russia Today is the “only reliable and truthful media outlet in the world” needs to be committed forthwith to the nearest lunatic asylum.

Honest-to-God mind-boggling how many ‘useful idiots’ there are out there in meatworld.

Like a striking number of these activists, this particular loon is a down on his luck trust fund baby, ie someone who comes from a wealthy and successful family but who has never accomplished anything himself. In his case, he is 60 and never finished college and has never held a real job. He bills himself as a “music producer” but lives mainly on the dwindling proceeds of his family’s former wealth.

31 Islamo-Masonic Conspirator  Jul 22, 2014 12:06:45pm

re: #25 Shiplord Kirel

In theory, libertarians are the last ppl I would expect to support Putin’s protofascist dictatorship. Oh well.

32 BadExampleMan  Jul 22, 2014 12:07:47pm

re: #20 Charles Johnson

(Not fond of Raw Story, if you couldn’t tell.)

But, but, but…TBogg!

33 Charles Johnson  Jul 22, 2014 12:08:15pm

re: #31 Islamo-Masonic Conspirator

In theory, libertarians are the last ppl I would expect to support Putin’s protofascist dictatorship. Oh well.

Libertarianism has turned into something very weird.

34 Dr Lizardo  Jul 22, 2014 12:08:16pm

re: #30 Shiplord Kirel

Like a striking number of these activists, this particular loon is a down on his luck trust fund baby, ie someone who comes from a wealthy and successful family but who has never accomplished anything himself. In his case, he is 60 and never finished college and has never held a real job. He bills himself as a “music producer” but lives mainly on the dwindling proceeds of his family’s former wealth.

Trust-fund babies (trustifarians) make me nuts. I’ve encountered a few over here, and conversation usually ceases the instant they open their pieholes about some subject upon which they know absolutely nothing.

It usually ceases when I give them the patented “Tommy Lee Jones Implied Facepalm”, which I’ve been assured, I do almost as well as Mr. Jones himself. :D

35 Charles Johnson  Jul 22, 2014 12:08:51pm

re: #32 BadExampleMan

Tbogg’s cool. That’s about the only reason I have to ever go there.

36 Feline Fearless Leader  Jul 22, 2014 12:11:39pm

re: #33 Charles Johnson

Libertarianism has turned into something very weird.

It seems to be a default sump or collecting ground for all sorts of odds and ends. For years I’d say mainly those who want to divorce themselves from the current political processes (and parties) for various reasons. It seems to have gone rotten over the last decade or two and become a seething ball of hatred.

37 Killgore Trout  Jul 22, 2014 12:11:46pm

re: #31 Islamo-Masonic Conspirator

In theory, libertarians are the last ppl I would expect to support Putin’s protofascist dictatorship. Oh well.

I think this comes from the anarchist/libertarian wing (such as Anon). They have the libertarian affinity for conspiracy theories but bring along some left wing baggage from folks like Oliver Stone etc.

38 Islamo-Masonic Conspirator  Jul 22, 2014 12:13:01pm

BTW, Russian libertarians are not exactly fond of Putin. Gotta check their reaction to Uncle Ron’s crazy rant.

39 Shiplord Kirel  Jul 22, 2014 12:16:29pm

re: #34 Dr Lizardo

Trust-fund babies (trustifarians) make me nuts. I’ve encountered a few over here, and conversation usually ceases the instant they open their pieholes about some subject upon which they know absolutely nothing.

It usually ceases when I give them the patented “Tommy Lee Jones Implied Facepalm”, which I’ve been assured, I do almost as well as Mr. Jones himself. :D

re: #30 Shiplord Kirel

Another example is the John Birch kook who served on the infamous Lubbock County GOP platform committee in 2012 and who was responsible for the more overtly fascist planks in that now repudiated document. His father was a famous surgeon but he himself ekes out a shabby living running health supplement MLM schemes and promoting various conspiracy flavored investments that will allegedly capitalize on the coming collapse of the Federal Reserve and its “internationalist” (ie Jewish) co-conspirators.

40 Kragar  Jul 22, 2014 12:17:11pm
41 Pie-onist Overlord  Jul 22, 2014 12:18:31pm

re: #30 Shiplord Kirel

Like a striking number of these activists, this particular loon is a down on his luck trust fund baby, ie someone who comes from a wealthy and successful family but who has never accomplished anything himself. In his case, he is 60 and never finished college and has never held a real job. He bills himself as a “music producer” but lives mainly on the dwindling proceeds of his family’s former wealth.

Probably while promoting himself as someone who pulled himself by his own bootstraps!

42 Feline Fearless Leader  Jul 22, 2014 12:18:57pm

re: #39 Shiplord Kirel

Another example is the John Birch kook who served on the infamous Lubbock County GOP platform committee in 2012 and who was responsible for the more overtly fascist planks in that now repudiated document. His father was a famous surgeon but he himself ekes out a shabby living running health supplement MLM schemes and promoting various conspiracy flavored investments that will allegedly capitalize on the coming collapse of the Federal Reserve and its “internationalist” (ie Jewish) co-conspirators.

Speaking of kook money. Now that the Mellon fortune has moved on to other hands with the elder Scaife dying are there nut groups suddenly having to scramble for new funding sources?

43 Lidane  Jul 22, 2014 12:19:26pm

re: #39 Shiplord Kirel

Speaking of weird, Dinesh D’Souza wants you to know he’s not a crybaby, but Google and Costco are persecuting him.

44 Islamo-Masonic Conspirator  Jul 22, 2014 12:19:28pm

Heh, Poklonskaya got an “order of merit” or smth from the “Russian Empress”.

So many freaks, so little time.

45 Feline Fearless Leader  Jul 22, 2014 12:19:39pm

re: #40 Kragar

Obviously a man who believes in principles.
/

46 Pie-onist Overlord  Jul 22, 2014 12:20:14pm

re: #44 Islamo-Masonic Conspirator

Heh, Poklonskaya got an “order of merit” or smth from the “Russian Empress”.

[Embedded image]

So many freaks, so little time.

Won’t somebody please buy that babushka a nice dress?

47 Lidane  Jul 22, 2014 12:21:24pm

re: #41 Pie-onist Overlord

Probably while promoting himself as someone who pulled himself by his own bootstraps!

Yep. Just like Gene Simmons.

NONE OF TEH POORZ EVER GAVE ME A JRRB! BE NICE TO THE RICH YOU PEASANT!

48 wrenchwench  Jul 22, 2014 12:21:32pm

re: #42 Feline Fearless Leader

Speaking of kook money. Now that the Mellon fortune has moved on to other hands with the elder Scaife dying are there nut groups suddenly having to scramble for new funding sources?

One would hope so. Scaife funded a lot of racists.

49 Islamo-Masonic Conspirator  Jul 22, 2014 12:21:40pm

re: #46 Pie-onist Overlord

Won’t somebody please buy that babushka a nice dress?

50 Kragar  Jul 22, 2014 12:23:50pm

re: #43 Lidane

Speaking of weird, Dinesh D’Souza wants you to know he’s not a crybaby, but Google and Costco are persecuting him.

I never thought he was a crybaby.

A verminous little shitweasel perhaps, but never a crybaby

51 Feline Fearless Leader  Jul 22, 2014 12:24:00pm

re: #48 wrenchwench

One would hope so. Scaife funded a lot of racists.

My presumption is that he probably left a trust of other funds for them in the will. And I have no idea what the politics are of his heir(s).

52 Shiplord Kirel  Jul 22, 2014 12:24:38pm

re: #42 Feline Fearless Leader

Speaking of kook money. Now that the Mellon fortune has moved on to other hands with the elder Scaife dying are there nut groups suddenly having to scramble for new funding sources?

Probably, but the Kremlin is even richer than Scaife was. Note that the old bastard died on the Fourth of July.

53 Islamo-Masonic Conspirator  Jul 22, 2014 12:24:46pm

Well… these “libertarians for Donbass” are thankful to Paul.

54 Decatur Deb  Jul 22, 2014 12:26:59pm

re: #53 Islamo-Masonic Conspirator

Well… these “libertarians for Donbass” are thankful to Paul.

Could make that “Libertarians for Dumbass”, but that would be too easy.

55 Shiplord Kirel  Jul 22, 2014 12:29:00pm

re: #53 Islamo-Masonic Conspirator

Well… these “libertarians for Donbass” are thankful to Paul.

Now we’re outsourcing our nutjobs.

56 Brother Holy Cruise Missile of Mild Acceptance  Jul 22, 2014 12:29:17pm

So I finished Sniper Elite 3, the final mission you have to do the sniper thing plus sabotage the construction of the Ratte. Overall a really, really good game. Really like that series.

Now moving on to Assassin’s Creed 3 then Assassin’s Creed: Black Flag. Kinda done with World of Tanks for a while.

57 Joanne  Jul 22, 2014 12:29:39pm

re: #50 Kragar

I never thought he was a crybaby.

A verminous little shitweasel perhaps, but never a crybaby

He’s just asking questions!

58 Islamo-Masonic Conspirator  Jul 22, 2014 12:30:46pm

Terrorists.

59 Lidane  Jul 22, 2014 12:31:00pm

re: #55 Shiplord Kirel

Now we’re outsourcing our nutjobs.

Might as well. We outsource everything else. :-P

60 Mattand  Jul 22, 2014 12:32:06pm

re: #20 Charles Johnson

Yech. Ugly story.

Notice, though, that Raw Story simply rewrote the original article, which is here:

mlive.com

That’s pretty much all Raw Story does - recycle other people’s articles with a cursory rewrite. That wouldn’t be so bad — if they didn’t get upset when anyone links to them and quotes their version.

(Not fond of Raw Story, if you couldn’t tell.)

Both the site’s writers and commenters are a little too cozy with conspiracy theories for my taste.

61 Islamo-Masonic Conspirator  Jul 22, 2014 12:32:08pm

re: #58 Islamo-Masonic Conspirator

The woman says: “We voted for you, but now all of us are against you.”

62 Charles Johnson  Jul 22, 2014 12:33:08pm
63 Feline Fearless Leader  Jul 22, 2014 12:33:51pm

re: #46 Pie-onist Overlord

Won’t somebody please buy that babushka a nice dress?

I looked at the Wikipedia page and am mildly amazed that the dethroned European nobility hasn’t yet inbred itself into oblivion or spent all their money. They must still have a lot invested away here and there.

64 Feline Fearless Leader  Jul 22, 2014 12:36:03pm

re: #56 Brother Holy Cruise Missile of Mild Acceptance

So I finished Sniper Elite 3, the final mission you have to do the sniper thing plus sabotage the construction of the Ratte. Overall a really, really good game. Really like that series.

Now moving on to Assassin’s Creed 3 then Assassin’s Creed: Black Flag. Kinda done with World of Tanks for a while.

Got tired of trying to take out a Maus with just a Hetzer, Type 98, and a Pz-IV?
;P

65 Lidane  Jul 22, 2014 12:36:05pm

Fiscal responsibility:

Republicans Launch 13-State Campaign Targeting Harry Reid

66 wrenchwench  Jul 22, 2014 12:36:43pm

re: #62 Charles Johnson

[Embedded content]

The last paragraph is the absolute truth.

At press time, abortion rights activists predicted that many Mississippi women seeking an abortion would travel to neighboring Louisiana to take advantage of that state’s more lenient laws, including mandatory face-to-face counseling to discourage them from having the procedure, a 24-hour waiting period, and a compulsory ultrasound, during which they will have the fetus verbally described to them, as well as have the option of viewing it on a nearby screen and listening to its heartbeat.

Which brings together truth, humor and fear. A great piece.

67 Dr Lizardo  Jul 22, 2014 12:39:23pm

re: #58 Islamo-Masonic Conspirator

[Embedded content]

Terrorists.

Sure the terrorists have somewhere to go.

It’s called Russia, and it’s just a little due East of where they are.

Of course, I’ve heard dark and apocryphal tales of Russian soldiers on that particular border shooting the pro-Russian separatists dead when they attempt to flee into Russia proper. Mind you, that could well be just your typical atrocity propaganda - all too typical in war.

68 William Barnett-Lewis  Jul 22, 2014 12:39:37pm

re: #29 Islamo-Masonic Conspirator

That, and pure luck. Who knew that Google Earth would be updated with such fresh photos!

I can see the CT’er’s now claiming that Google “made sure” that those altered photos would be there… :(

69 Brother Holy Cruise Missile of Mild Acceptance  Jul 22, 2014 12:40:24pm

re: #64 Feline Fearless Leader

Got tired of trying to take out a Maus with just a Hetzer, Type 98, and a Pz-IV?
;P

Actually they no longer have battles like that save for some of the historical ones. They re-did MM to have a 2 tier gap at most so if you are in a tier 8 tank you wind up possibly being at the top and having 7’s and 6’s below you or being at the bottom against 9’s and 10’s.

I am just taking a break from it in order to enjoy some of the other games I have yet to beat. I will be going back to it eventually.

70 Islamo-Masonic Conspirator  Jul 22, 2014 12:42:37pm

re: #68 William Barnett-Lewis

I can see the CT’er’s now claiming that Google “made sure” that those altered photos would be there… :(

CTers will claim anything. This is for normal ppl who don’t have time to analyze conflicting versions and don’t trust too much in govt-supplied evidence (Russian or Ukrainian), but will accept facts when they see them.

71 Islamo-Masonic Conspirator  Jul 22, 2014 12:44:01pm

Drip drip drip.

72 William Barnett-Lewis  Jul 22, 2014 12:44:07pm

re: #64 Feline Fearless Leader

Got tired of trying to take out a Maus with just a Hetzer, Type 98, and a Pz-IV?
;P

Ah, but that battle is so you can prove your sensha-dō, just as drifting a Pz-IV into position to kill a Pz-VI does… ;)

73 Lidane  Jul 22, 2014 12:48:24pm

re: #56 Brother Holy Cruise Missile of Mild Acceptance

Kinda done with World of Tanks for a while.

re: #64 Feline Fearless Leader

Got tired of trying to take out a Maus with just a Hetzer, Type 98, and a Pz-IV?
;P

re: #69 Brother Holy Cruise Missile of Mild Acceptance

Actually they no longer have battles like that save for some of the historical ones. They re-did MM to have a 2 tier gap at most so if you are in a tier 8 tank you wind up possibly being at the top and having 7’s and 6’s below you or being at the bottom against 9’s and 10’s.

I actually understand this conversation. The boyfriend plays World of Tanks on my Xbox Live gamertag.

I’ve gotten a whole lot of achievement points for game I’ve never played. It’s great. Haha.

74 Dr Lizardo  Jul 22, 2014 12:49:13pm

Heh.

In the Washington Post, the head of the US Air Force space command dismissed suggestions from Russia that the US government was bluffing or exaggerating when it said it had evidence that pro-Russian separatists shot down MH17. “I will say this about our satellites: They are very good satellites,” Gen William Shelton said. “They are very sensitive and they are very accurate.”

bbc.com

washingtonpost.com

75 Islamo-Masonic Conspirator  Jul 22, 2014 12:50:13pm

re: #74 Dr Lizardo

I don’t doubt the US has the evidence. Provide it already.

76 Islamo-Masonic Conspirator  Jul 22, 2014 12:51:44pm

re: #74 Dr Lizardo

From the first link:

20:46: Also in the Post, reporter Michael Birnbaum interviews a woman whose kitchen was destroyed on Thursday when a body fell through her roof from MH17. “We never expected people falling from the sky,” Inna Tipunova told him. “They were falling like rain.”

77 Dr Lizardo  Jul 22, 2014 12:52:07pm

re: #75 Islamo-Masonic Conspirator

I don’t doubt the US has the evidence. Provide it already.

I totally agree.

Put it out there for the whole word to see, and let the Kremlin and the Putinistas attempt to dismiss it.

78 Shiplord Kirel  Jul 22, 2014 12:52:51pm

Putin down to size.

6’6” King Felipe of Spain stoops as he shakes hands with Putin on June 22.

79 Brother Holy Cruise Missile of Mild Acceptance  Jul 22, 2014 12:53:35pm

Oh and Assassin’s Creed: Unity looks amazing.

80 Islamo-Masonic Conspirator  Jul 22, 2014 12:53:36pm

re: #77 Dr Lizardo

I totally agree.

Put it out there for the whole word to see, and let the Kremlin and the Putinistas attempt to dismiss it.

Waiting a bit so that they get entangled in their lies was a good step. IT’S CLOBBERING TIME! ;)

81 Feline Fearless Leader  Jul 22, 2014 12:55:38pm

re: #77 Dr Lizardo

I totally agree.

Put it out there for the whole word to see, and let the Kremlin and the Putinistas attempt to dismiss it.

There should be a Greenwald outburst about the NRO spying on everyone shortly.
//

82 Islamo-Masonic Conspirator  Jul 22, 2014 12:56:47pm
83 Jolo5309  Jul 22, 2014 12:57:03pm

re: #1 wheat-dogghazi

The Russian ambassador to Malaysia held a press conference earlier today and denied (1) that the separatists were impeding the investigation in any way and (2) that Russia or the separatists had anything to do with launched a missile at the airliner. She implied only the Ukrainian military had the material and expertise to launch a SAM.

Let’s see now. It’s been five days since the airliner went down, and it’s taken that long for Russia to respond. To me, it suggests the Kremlin has been scrambling like hell to get everyone on the same page with the same story.

They were at the Ranch and didn’t want to cut their vacations short

84 Dr Lizardo  Jul 22, 2014 12:58:02pm

re: #80 Islamo-Masonic Conspirator

Waiting a bit so that they get entangled in their lies was a good stop. IT’S CLOBBERING TIME! ;)

Yep. Letting them hang themselves, such as it were.

I though that vid you posted of the woman in Donetsk basically telling the insurgents to GTFO is quite telling - I’m very sure she’s not the only person in Donetsk to feel that way. And if enough people in Donetsk turn on the DPR, what are they going to do about it? Massacre them?

If a majority of Donetsk residents say, straight up and straight out, to the separatists, “We don’t want you here anymore” I wonder how the separatists (and more importantly, the Russian government itself) are going to react to being told to leave.

85 Pie-onist Overlord  Jul 22, 2014 1:03:30pm

Oh ick.

86 HappyWarrior  Jul 22, 2014 1:04:50pm

re: #85 Pie-onist Overlord

Oh ick.

[Embedded content]

Icky for Icke par the course.

87 Dr Lizardo  Jul 22, 2014 1:04:52pm

re: #85 Pie-onist Overlord

Oh ick.

[Embedded content]

If there was any doubt that Icke was an anti-Semite - in addition to be a stark raving lunatic - that little Tweet pretty much dispels such doubt once and for all.

88 Islamo-Masonic Conspirator  Jul 22, 2014 1:05:03pm

re: #85 Pie-onist Overlord

At least that was to be expected.

89 Shiplord Kirel  Jul 22, 2014 1:06:41pm

re: #87 Dr Lizardo

If there was any doubt that Icke was an anti-Semite - in addition to be a stark raving lunatic - that little Tweet pretty much dispels such doubt once and for all.

Scratch a conspira-liar, find an anti-Semite.

90 HappyWarrior  Jul 22, 2014 1:08:17pm

re: #89 Shiplord Kirel

Scratch a conspira-liar, find an anti-Semite.

Frankly, I’ve never encountered a CT nut that wasn’t also an anti-Semite.

91 Islamo-Masonic Conspirator  Jul 22, 2014 1:10:12pm

re: #90 HappyWarrior

Frankly, I’ve never encountered a CT nut that wasn’t also an anti-Semite.

Perhaps a Jewish conspiraloon :)

92 Islamo-Masonic Conspirator  Jul 22, 2014 1:11:12pm

Dugin says that the US now engages in direct warfare against Novorossiya:

vk.com

93 CuriousLurker  Jul 22, 2014 1:15:12pm

Speaking of conspiracy theories and Jews/Israel, this dead thread post made me twitch. I wonder if I’ll get a response…

94 dog philosopher  Jul 22, 2014 1:15:28pm

re: #78 Shiplord Kirel

Putin down to size.

6’6” King Felipe of Spain stoops as he shakes hands with Putin on June 22.
[Embedded image]

there are still bourbon kings but where are the scotch kings eh? eh?

95 Wendell Zurkowitz (slave to the waffle light)  Jul 22, 2014 1:15:48pm

re: #92 Islamo-Masonic Conspirator

Dugin says that the US now engages in direct warfare against Novorossiya:

vk.com

He forgot to mention that the orders are routed and approved through Tel Aviv…

96 Islamo-Masonic Conspirator  Jul 22, 2014 1:16:47pm

vk.com

You should believe in our Lord Jesus Christ and His Mother. It’s the final battle: the Russian People is on the side of the angelic army, against us are all the forces of hell. We’re partakers of the Michaelic sacrament. This what is called to be theophorous.

97 Backwoods_Sleuth  Jul 22, 2014 1:17:02pm

Big crowds at Rep Steve King’s anti-immigration rally yesterday.
He probably should have considered providing free food or sumthin…

98 Lidane  Jul 22, 2014 1:17:21pm

From the No Shit, Sherlock files—

H. Steven Blum, the head of the National Guard under Bush, told the Washington Post last week that troop deployment might not be the best response to the border crisis. He said he had yet to hear clear reasoning supporting the initiative.

“There may be many other organizations that might more appropriately be called upon,” he said. “If you’re talking about search and rescue, maintaining the rule of law or restoring conditions back to normal after a natural disaster or a catastrophe, the Guard is superbly suited to that. I’m not so sure that what we’re dealing with in scope and causation right now would make it the ideal choice.”

Blum said that the Guard might be of some help as part of a larger solution, but he emphasized that the situation at the border is complex.

“Merely sending the Guard to the border is not a panacea for the myriad complex problems of the current situation,” he said.

99 Randall Gross  Jul 22, 2014 1:18:22pm

FYI: Think Progress is hiring - it’s DC I think.

100 Wendell Zurkowitz (slave to the waffle light)  Jul 22, 2014 1:18:54pm

re: #98 Lidane

From the No Shit, Sherlock files—

There is one reason that Perry is posting troops to the border: the 2016 presidential primary and his need to profile himself as proactive on immigration.

101 Dr Lizardo  Jul 22, 2014 1:19:20pm

re: #96 Islamo-Masonic Conspirator

vk.com

They seem to have just as much a Messianic/Apocalyptic tone as the American wingnuts do.

No wonder the Russians have such a following among the RWNJ crowd.

102 CuriousLurker  Jul 22, 2014 1:19:52pm

re: #93 CuriousLurker

Speaking of conspiracy theories and Jews/Israel, this dead thread post made me twitch. I wonder if I’ll get a response…

Anyway, I’ve got work to do. I’d keep an eye on the dead threads if I were you guys—no telling what will be quietly slipped into them.

Later, lizards.

103 Kragar  Jul 22, 2014 1:20:15pm

re: #98 Lidane

From the No Shit, Sherlock files—

1000 men, presumably working in shifts, so say 3 8-hour shift a day, plus some men set aside for support, so lets say 300 men per shift in the field, covering 1200+ miles of border, with no authority to arrest or detain anyone.

Yeah, that is worth $12 Million a month.

104 Wendell Zurkowitz (slave to the waffle light)  Jul 22, 2014 1:20:17pm

re: #101 Dr Lizardo

They seem to have just as much a Messianic/Apocalyptic tone as the American wingnuts do.

No wonder the Russians have such a following among the RWNJ crowd.

And the Russian Orthodox Church is right up there with Bryan Fischer when it comes to homophobia and repressing women’s rights.

105 Dr Lizardo  Jul 22, 2014 1:21:22pm

re: #104 Wendell Zurkowitz (slave to the waffle light)

And the Russian Orthodox Church is right up there with Bryan Fischer when it comes to homophobia and repressing women’s rights.

Yes, indeed. They’re pretty hardcore - just as hardcore as the Protestant fundies back in the US.

106 Pie-onist Overlord  Jul 22, 2014 1:23:27pm

re: #102 CuriousLurker

Anyway, I’ve got work to do. I’d keep an eye on the dead threads if I were you guys—no telling what will be quietly slipped into them.

Later, lizards.

USS Liberty is the 1967 version of BENGHAZI!!!!!!!!

107 simoom  Jul 22, 2014 1:24:12pm

Malaysia Airlines MH17 crash: Pro-Russian rebel ‘admits to shooting down plane’

A pro-Russian militiaman has said his forces shot down Malaysia Airlines Flight MH17, according to a report in an Italian newspaper.

When the disaster happened the rebel was told by his superiors that they had hit a Ukrainian military craft. “‘We hit a plane from Kiev,’ our commanders told us. We thought we’d be fighting Ukrainian pilots landing in parachutes but instead we came across the corpses of civilians, the remains of bodies, along with suitcases and bags,” he told Corriere della Sera newspaper.

The paramilitary was from the Oplot fighting unit. He was speaking at the Torez railway station where the bodies were being kept in five refrigerated wagons. The militiaman would not reveal his name or rank, but the newspaper’s website published his photograph with the story.

Here’s the Corriere della Sera interview that’s being referenced:

corriere.it

108 Pie-onist Overlord  Jul 22, 2014 1:24:28pm
109 HappyWarrior  Jul 22, 2014 1:24:50pm

re: #97 Backwoods_Sleuth

Big crowds at Rep Steve King’s anti-immigration rally yesterday.
He probably should have considered providing free food or sumthin…

[Embedded content]

I don’t think you could have paid me to listen to Steve King blather xenophobic bullshit. If I wanted that, I’d just watch Daniel Day-Lewis in Gangs of New York.

110 Shiplord Kirel  Jul 22, 2014 1:26:39pm

If the Israelis intended to sink the Liberty, why were the attacking planes armed with 68mm antitank rockets, which are very feeble anti-ship weapons, rather than 1000 pound bombs which were a standard armament for the Mirage III and which would sink a ship in short order? The rocket armament is attested in official US Navy reports as well as eye-witness accounts from the survivors. The inappropriate weapons exactly support the Israeli version, which is that the planes were diverted on the spur of the moment in response to a garbled and erroneous report of an Egyptian ship off the coast.

111 Wendell Zurkowitz (slave to the waffle light)  Jul 22, 2014 1:26:46pm

Something I had almost forgotten about: when I first went to Russia in 1992, a friend of mine took me to see a production of Jean Genet’s The Maids, a lesbian murder drama…played by men in drag.

It was a big deal for the Russian theater to be able to present such a thing, I was amused and mildly condescending, as it was completely old hat by western theatrical standards.

But I now realize I was witnessing a brief window that is going to remain closed for some time…a bit like the early 1920’s before Stalin cracked down on Bulgakov, Meyerhold and the modern Russian theater of the day.

112 Stanley Sea  Jul 22, 2014 1:26:56pm

re: #100 Wendell Zurkowitz (slave to the waffle light)

There is one reason that Perry is posting troops to the border: the 2016 presidential primary and his need to profile himself as proactive on immigration.

And smaaart. See fake glasses.

113 Islamo-Masonic Conspirator  Jul 22, 2014 1:28:26pm

re: #111 Wendell Zurkowitz (slave to the waffle light)

Some of the things shown then on Russian TV would be actually quite risque even in today’s America.

114 Wendell Zurkowitz (slave to the waffle light)  Jul 22, 2014 1:28:38pm

re: #112 Stanley Sea

And smaaart. See fake glasses.

He is trying to distance himself from the image of the pilled-up goombah who blew a clear opportunity in 2012.

115 HappyWarrior  Jul 22, 2014 1:29:15pm

re: #112 Stanley Sea

And smaaart. See fake glasses.

Rick is so smart, s-m-r-t.

116 Wendell Zurkowitz (slave to the waffle light)  Jul 22, 2014 1:29:37pm

re: #113 Islamo-Masonic Conspirator

Some of the things shown then on Russian TV would be actually quite risky even in today’s America.

It was complete chaos: in 1992, Moscow Cable was showing bootleg current cinema releases, racy Australian soap operas and whatever else they could get their mitts on

117 HappyWarrior  Jul 22, 2014 1:30:10pm

But yes, Perry is running away from the guy who got out-wingnutted by Romney on immigration in 2012 primaries. Sad, it was his one small redeeming character quality that he wasn’t a total ass on immigration.

118 Backwoods_Sleuth  Jul 22, 2014 1:30:54pm

re: #109 HappyWarrior

119 Feline Fearless Leader  Jul 22, 2014 1:30:55pm

re: #115 HappyWarrior

Rick is so smart, s-m-r-t.

The glasses are hollow and hold a small supply of maple syrup for Rick’s emergency consumption.
//

120 Wendell Zurkowitz (slave to the waffle light)  Jul 22, 2014 1:32:02pm

re: #117 HappyWarrior

But yes, Perry is running away from the guy who got out-wingnutted by Romney on immigration in 2012 primaries. Sad, it was his one small redeeming character quality that he wasn’t a total ass on immigration.

I really thought Perry was gonna walk away with the GOP nomination in 2012, what with his mannish good looks, his basic message of lower taxes, cut regulations and jobs, jobs, jobs. But that turned out to be too much for him to remember.

121 wrenchwench  Jul 22, 2014 1:32:02pm

re: #98 Lidane

From the No Shit, Sherlock files—

Remember when the Marines were sent to the Texas border?

Evening, May 20, 1997, on a rocky ridge overlooking Polvo Crossing near tiny Redford, Texas, 215 miles southeast of El Paso: four Marines have been tasked to help the border patrol watch for drug smugglers along the Rio Grande. But they have absolutely no knowledge or training about the people who live in this region.

They spot a young man with a rifle. He spots them. He’s herding goats. The heavily camouflaged Marines don’t look like law enforcement agents. Perhaps he thinks they’re goat rustlers. He fires his .22 at them. The Marines take him out with a single shot from an M-16.

(Soundbite of a gunshot)

BURNETT: The events of that day have become a mythic tragedy in the borderlands. Ballads have been written about it, a movie, too. The Three Burials of Melquiades Estrada is loosely based on the murder of Ezekiel Hernandez Jr.

122 Islamo-Masonic Conspirator  Jul 22, 2014 1:32:09pm

1. Ukrainian intelligence services and military are without doubt full of both pro-Russian moles and people who aren’t all that enthused about the new govt.

2. Yet Russia insinuates an “inside job” conspiracy of quite modest proportions that, nevertheless, hasn’t been exposed by anyone.

123 HappyWarrior  Jul 22, 2014 1:33:14pm

re: #120 Wendell Zurkowitz (slave to the waffle light)

I really thought Perry was gonna walk away with the GOP nomination in 2012, what with his mannish good looks, his basic message of lower taxes, cut regulations and jobs, jobs, jobs. But that turned out to be too much for him to remember.

I thought so too. Thought he not Santorum would be Romney’s biggest challenge.

124 Islamo-Masonic Conspirator  Jul 22, 2014 1:34:56pm

re: #116 Wendell Zurkowitz (slave to the waffle light)

I’m thankful for the Russian bootleg cable TV. E.g. I didn’t know who the heck Peter Jackson was, but I sure enjoyed the badly translated “Braindead” and “Bad Taste”. Not to mention such classics as “Troll 2”, “Night of the Living Dead 3”, etc, etc., etc. Good times.

125 Backwoods_Sleuth  Jul 22, 2014 1:34:57pm

re: #115 HappyWarrior

Rick is so smart, s-m-r-t.

“I’m good enough, I’m smart enough, and doggone it…

oops…I forgot the third thing…”

///apologies to Al Franken/Stuart Smalley

126 sattv4u2  Jul 22, 2014 1:35:24pm

GOOD NEWS
My “good” cholesterol is good

BAD NEWS
my “bad” cholesterol is bad

BAD NEWS PART II
my overall number is bad

GOOD NEWS
no meds. just going to try a little dietary modification

127 Feline Fearless Leader  Jul 22, 2014 1:36:59pm

re: #126 sattv4u2

GOOD NEWS
My “good” cholesterol is good

BAD NEWS
my “bad” cholesterol is bad

BAD NEWS PART II
my overall number is bad

GOOD NEWS
no meds. just going to try a little dietary modification

So the long drive home beckons — without cheeseburgers.

128 sattv4u2  Jul 22, 2014 1:38:12pm

re: #127 Feline Fearless Leader

So the long drive home beckons — without cheeseburgers.

To the chagrin of all those fast food places I pass along the dusty trails

129 Shiplord Kirel  Jul 22, 2014 1:38:13pm

Another bit of real information about the Liberty incident: Two squadrons of the IDF/AF were specifically tasked with, and trained for, anti-shipping operations in addition to their usual close support mission. Neither of these participated in the attack. We know this because the antiship squadrons used the old Dassault Ouragan fighter bomber and the Liberty attackers were the much newer Mirage IIIs.
(The Fighting Israeli Air Force, Bill Gunston, 1982 and “Israel’s Air Force,” Air Progress magazine, October 1967)

130 Dr Lizardo  Jul 22, 2014 1:38:18pm

This should be interesting - I expect the Putinistas out there are gonna spin, deny and obfuscate to the Nth degree.

The United States will on Tuesday release intelligence backing its assertion that the Malaysian airliner that crashed in Ukraine was brought down by a missile fired from the separatist-controlled area, the State Department said.

Spokeswoman Marie Harf told reporters the intelligence community would later in the day “be further declassifying information and will be putting out additional information that supports what we have said.”

Harf repeated the U.S. belief that the plane, with nearly 300 people on board, was shot down by a Russian-made SA-11 ground-to-air missile fired from an area controlled by separatists close to the Russian border in eastern Ukraine.

reuters.com

131 Islamo-Masonic Conspirator  Jul 22, 2014 1:39:14pm

re: #130 Dr Lizardo

This should be interesting - I expect the Putinistas out there are gonna spin, deny and obfuscate to the Nth degree.

reuters.com

Youtube Video

132 Islamo-Masonic Conspirator  Jul 22, 2014 1:41:34pm

buzzfeed.com

Several locals near the StroiDom store in Torez, about 10 miles from where the plane crashed, said Tuesday that they had seen what appeared to be a missile launcher driving through their town a few hours before the plane was shot down last Thursday. Their story appears to corroborate Ukrainian claims that the separatist rebels had a sophisticated missile launcher and drove it to the site that Ukrainian and U.S. intelligence say was used to fire on the Boeing 777 jet, killing all 298 on board.
[…]
Several locals said that the launcher had driven down Gagarina street, one of the town’s main thoroughfares, towards the town of Snizhne, near where Ukraine and the U.S. say the missile was fired. Though convoys of heavy equipment have become a regular sight in Torez since the conflict between pro-Russian separatists and the government in Kiev started in April, workers in one store said that the one that passed through last Thursday was much louder than ones they had seen before.

133 sattv4u2  Jul 22, 2014 1:41:57pm

re: #130 Dr Lizardo

This should be interesting - I expect the Putinistas out there are gonna spin, deny and obfuscate to the Nth degree.

reuters.com

Sorry, but not really that “interseting”

While the whole world believes that the separatists downed the plane, the Putinistas will just say this is yet another western propaganda/ lie

134 Charles Johnson  Jul 22, 2014 1:42:18pm

Glenn Greenwald is the bravest, smartest, kindest journamalist who ever lived!

135 Wendell Zurkowitz (slave to the waffle light)  Jul 22, 2014 1:42:21pm

re: #124 Islamo-Masonic Conspirator

I’m thankful for the Russian bootleg cable TV. E.g. I didn’t know who the heck Peter Jackson was, but I sure enjoyed the badly translated “Braindead” and “Bad Taste”. Not to mention such classics as “Troll 2”, “Night of the Living Dead 3”, etc, etc., etc. Good times.

I was in the US in July of 1992 just as Jurassic Park came out. By the time I made it back to Moscow three weeks later, it was running on cable TV.

And I dug the Bugs Bunny cartoons, especially the one with the Big Bad Nazi wolf and the three little pigs, one of whom is not afraid of the Big Bad Nazi wolf because he has just signed a non-aggression pact…

136 Lidane  Jul 22, 2014 1:44:20pm

re: #103 Kragar

1000 men, presumably working in shifts, so say 3 8-hour shift a day, plus some men set aside for support, so lets say 300 men per shift in the field, covering 1200+ miles of border, with no authority to arrest or detain anyone.

Yeah, that is worth $12 Million a month.

And Rick Perry wants Obama to pay for it, too.

137 sattv4u2  Jul 22, 2014 1:44:48pm

Did Manhattan surrender to Brooklyn?!?!?!

Mysterious White Flags Fly on Brooklyn Bridge

abcnews.go.com

138 Backwoods_Sleuth  Jul 22, 2014 1:45:47pm

re: #134 Charles Johnson

Why should it be publicly funded? Has GG run through all of Pierre’s money already?

139 Aunty Entity Dragon  Jul 22, 2014 1:45:54pm

re: #18 Pie-onist Overlord

I’m surprised it took so long for this meme to show up:

[Embedded content]

I have never believed the Liberty incident was a mistake (and neither did an awful lot of peope in the military and the government at the time, including the US ambassador to Saudi Arabia as well as some of the US officers involved in the investigation who claim they were ordered to whitewash the report.)

Either the pilots and gunboat crews were incompetent and blind for a period of several hours…which I find difficult to credit, or the attack was deliberate for reasons the Israeli government does not want to share. Occams Razor.
articles.chicagotribune.com

That being said, what in the hell does an incident over 40 years ago have to do with anything today??!

There really is no reason to link something from the late 1960’s with anything happening today. It’s like trying to claim the Tonkin Gulf incident has something to do with US operations in Jalalabad, Afghanistan.

140 RealityBasedSteve  Jul 22, 2014 1:46:02pm

re: #134 Charles Johnson

Glenn Greenwald is the bravest, smartest, kindest journamalist who ever lived!

[Embedded content]

If you don’t count all those times he sold dope disguised as a Nun…

RBS

141 Islamo-Masonic Conspirator  Jul 22, 2014 1:47:36pm

ROFL

142 Aunty Entity Dragon  Jul 22, 2014 1:50:04pm

re: #121 wrenchwench

Remember when the Marines were sent to the Texas border?

Yep. I remember that quite well. I had friends involved in JTF 6 in Texas. I heard about Ranger squads being taken to the US/Mexican border with full combat loads and returning a couple weeks later with all their ammunition used up (A friend of mine drove them out on one of those missions)

143 CuriousLurker  Jul 22, 2014 1:50:19pm

re: #129 Shiplord Kirel

Another bit of real information about the Liberty incident: Two squadrons of the IDF/AF were specifically tasked with, and trained for, anti-shipping operations in addition to their usual close support mission. Neither of these participated in the attack. We know this because the antiship squadrons used the old Dassault Ouragan fighter bomber and the Liberty attackers were the much newer Mirage IIIs.

If you have the time & inclination maybe you should consider putting the above and your #110 into a comment in response to the OP in the dead thread.

I’ve never served in the military and was too young to remember the incident, so all I could do was challenge what felt like sneaky insinuation to me. Being older & having military knowledge might give your response more weight.

Or maybe this whole conflict has made me hypersensitive and I’m just imagining things. Hard to tell sometimes.

144 bratwurst  Jul 22, 2014 1:51:49pm
145 Wendell Zurkowitz (slave to the waffle light)  Jul 22, 2014 1:52:49pm

re: #144 bratwurst

We should also be on the lookout for undocumented corporations trying to sneak across the border.

146 RealityBasedSteve  Jul 22, 2014 1:53:59pm

re: #145 Wendell Zurkowitz (slave to the waffle light)

We should also be on the lookout for undocumented corporations trying to sneak across the border.

They are just looking for a place where they can exercise their religious beliefs in peace…

147 Lidane  Jul 22, 2014 1:56:20pm

Secretary of State in Kansas, y’all —

Kris Kobach: If People Have Trouble Registering To Vote, It’s Their Own Fault

148 Dr Lizardo  Jul 22, 2014 1:57:51pm

Regarding the release of US intel about the MH17 shootdown, I can already hear the question, “Then why can’t they find MH370?!”

Easy. The geography of the Ukrainian-Russian border right now is probably the intense focus of a good many US satellites; it likely has been since things starting heating up in that part of the world.

The area where MH370 likely went down? Not so much.

149 HappyWarrior  Jul 22, 2014 1:58:22pm

re: #147 Lidane

Secretary of State in Kansas, y’all —

Kris Kobach: If People Have Trouble Registering To Vote, It’s Their Own Fault

Mitt Romney must be so proud that he had this dipshit as his adviser. Mitt sure knew how to pick em.

150 Backwoods_Sleuth  Jul 22, 2014 1:59:41pm

re: #137 sattv4u2

Did Manhattan surrender to Brooklyn?!?!?!

Mysterious White Flags Fly on Brooklyn Bridge

abcnews.go.com

Discussed this a bit this morning downstairs.

Just saw this on my TL:

151 Pie-onist Overlord  Jul 22, 2014 1:59:53pm

STAY CLASSY, TCOT PATRIOTS

152 sattv4u2  Jul 22, 2014 1:59:58pm

re: #148 Dr Lizardo

The area where MH370 likely went down? Not so much.

{conspiracy theorist on}

“Yeah,, well ,,,, the gov’t isn’t saying where MH370 is so how do you know there weren’t satellites tracking it”

{ct off}

153 HappyWarrior  Jul 22, 2014 2:00:48pm

re: #151 Pie-onist Overlord

STAY CLASSY, TCOT PATRIOTS

[Embedded content]

Way to go wingnuts, siding with Putin over your nation’s president. You’re so patriotic.

154 Dr Lizardo  Jul 22, 2014 2:01:20pm

re: #152 sattv4u2

The area where MH370 likely went down? Not so much.

{conspiracy theorist on}

“Yeah,, well ,,,, the gov’t isn’t saying where MH370 is so how do you know there weren’t satellites tracking it”

{ct off}

Heh.

What do you suppose would be a good color for a CT’er font?

155 Jolo5309  Jul 22, 2014 2:01:40pm

re: #153 HappyWarrior

Way to go wingnuts, siding with Putin over your nation’s own president. You’re so patriotic.

It is treasonous to back a man so obstinately refusing to be white.

156 HappyWarrior  Jul 22, 2014 2:01:43pm

re: #154 Dr Lizardo

Heh.

What do you suppose would be a good color for a CT’er font?

red?

157 HappyWarrior  Jul 22, 2014 2:02:00pm

re: #155 Jolo5309

It is treasonous to back a man so obstinately refusing to be white.

and one who refuses to be a wingnut too.

158 Dr Lizardo  Jul 22, 2014 2:02:05pm

re: #156 HappyWarrior

red?

Yeah, I just thought the same thing.

159 sattv4u2  Jul 22, 2014 2:02:10pm

re: #154 Dr Lizardo

Heh.

What do you suppose would be a good color for a CT’er font?

I dunno

I would imagine in their minds any color is conspiratorial in one way or another

160 wrenchwench  Jul 22, 2014 2:02:59pm

re: #154 Dr Lizardo

Heh.

What do you suppose would be a good color for a CT’er font?

Clear.

161 sattv4u2  Jul 22, 2014 2:03:58pm

re: #160 wrenchwench

Clear.

Nuh uh

To the CT’s that’s a SURE sign of a conspiracy!!

“LOOK ,,, invisible INK!!”

162 Islamo-Masonic Conspirator  Jul 22, 2014 2:04:16pm

Here is the thing. Even Russian experts on the Russian TV don’t take the Su-25 version seriously.

Youtube Video

163 Lidane  Jul 22, 2014 2:04:49pm

re: #153 HappyWarrior

Way to go wingnuts, siding with Putin over your nation’s president. You’re so patriotic.

American “patriots” who side with the Russian president while retweeting Ayn Rand quotes and memes and ranting about commies.

164 Joanne  Jul 22, 2014 2:04:55pm

re: #147 Lidane

Secretary of State in Kansas, y’all —

Kris Kobach: If People Have Trouble Registering To Vote, It’s Their Own Fault

Sure, of course you can vote! It just doesn’t count.

165 Dr Lizardo  Jul 22, 2014 2:05:46pm

I’M TELLIN’ YA, IT’S A CONSPIRACY!!

166 HappyWarrior  Jul 22, 2014 2:06:45pm

re: #165 Dr Lizardo

I’M TELLIN’ YA, IT’S A CONSPIRACY!!

Lookin’ good.

167 sattv4u2  Jul 22, 2014 2:06:52pm

Meanwhile, while most of the world is now focused on the Malaysian plane tragedy and the crises on the Gaza/ Israel border

nbcnews.com

ISIS Forces Iraq Shopkeepers to Veil Mannequins

168 Rightwingconspirator  Jul 22, 2014 2:07:07pm

re: #143 CuriousLurker

IIRC the idea Israel attacked knowing it was an American vessel has been debunked. Thoroughly.

en.wikipedia.org

169 allegro  Jul 22, 2014 2:08:14pm

re: #154 Dr Lizardo

Heh.

What do you suppose would be a good color for a CT’er font?

Clear.

170 allegro  Jul 22, 2014 2:08:55pm

re: #169 allegro

Clear.

Damn, ww beat me to it.

171 Islamo-Masonic Conspirator  Jul 22, 2014 2:10:21pm

re: #162 Islamo-Masonic Conspirator

That guy is good. Pity there are no English subs. Poor clueless host.

172 Dr Lizardo  Jul 22, 2014 2:10:35pm

In any event, no matter what intel the US discloses today, the Kremlin and their toadies will reply, IT’S ALL LIES MADE UP BY THE CIA IN SUPPORT OF THE FASCISTS IN KIEV!! and there will be - unfortunately - far too many out there who’ll swallow that BS hook, line and sinker.

173 Gus  Jul 22, 2014 2:11:44pm

Twitter sucks. Later.

174 Islamo-Masonic Conspirator  Jul 22, 2014 2:11:50pm

re: #172 Dr Lizardo

There will be those even if Putin personally says “The noble rebels did it by mistake”.

175 Stanley Sea  Jul 22, 2014 2:12:09pm

re: #173 Gus

Twitter sucks. Later.

We’re not twitter!

176 Dr Lizardo  Jul 22, 2014 2:12:16pm

re: #174 Islamo-Masonic Conspirator

There will be those even if Putin personally says “The noble rebels did it by mistake”.

That’s all too true as well.

177 HappyWarrior  Jul 22, 2014 2:12:43pm

re: #174 Islamo-Masonic Conspirator

There will be those even if Putin personally says “The noble rebels did it by mistake”.

Of course, facts never stop em.

178 HappyWarrior  Jul 22, 2014 2:13:08pm

PUTIN IS PART OF THE ILLUMANTI’S PLAN TO KEEP OBAMA IN POWER.

179 Lidane  Jul 22, 2014 2:13:39pm

I’m at work for another hour or so. Somebody flip a few desks over for me. Setting them on fire is optional:

Richard Land Says Americans ‘Ended Slavery, We Didn’t Bring Slavery To North America’

180 Islamo-Masonic Conspirator  Jul 22, 2014 2:14:00pm

re: #178 HappyWarrior

PUTIN IS PART OF THE ILLUMANTI’S PLAN TO KEEP OBAMA IN POWER.

That’s about what some Russian nat-pats say.

181 Dr Lizardo  Jul 22, 2014 2:14:30pm

re: #180 Islamo-Masonic Conspirator

That’s about what some Russian nat-pats say.

lolwut? Seriously?!

182 Backwoods_Sleuth  Jul 22, 2014 2:14:43pm

re: #179 Lidane

And they keep coming!!!!

183 HappyWarrior  Jul 22, 2014 2:16:01pm

re: #179 Lidane

I’m at work for another hour or so. Somebody flip a few desks over for me. Setting them on fire is optional:

Richard Land Says Americans ‘Ended Slavery, We Didn’t Bring Slavery To North America’

[Embedded image]

We actually didn’t bring slavery to the Americas but Land of course ignores his very religion (Southern Baptist) was founded by people who wished to preserve slavery well after the Constitution was ratified.

184 Charles Johnson  Jul 22, 2014 2:16:30pm
185 Dr Lizardo  Jul 22, 2014 2:16:47pm

re: #182 Backwoods_Sleuth

And they keep coming!!!!

Or my 2001 riff on a similar theme:

186 Charles Johnson  Jul 22, 2014 2:17:34pm
187 Charles Johnson  Jul 22, 2014 2:17:47pm
188 Kragar  Jul 22, 2014 2:18:20pm

re: #147 Lidane

Secretary of State in Kansas, y’all —

Kris Kobach: If People Have Trouble Registering To Vote, It’s Their Own Fault

Kris Kobach Flirts With Obama ‘Secret Muslim’ Conspiracy Theory - See more at: rightwingwatch.org

189 Islamo-Masonic Conspirator  Jul 22, 2014 2:18:21pm

re: #181 Dr Lizardo

lolwut? Seriously?!

Well, not in those terms. Some see him as an American/oligarchy slave, etc.

190 wrenchwench  Jul 22, 2014 2:19:05pm

Kitteh named ‘NSA’

191 HappyWarrior  Jul 22, 2014 2:19:12pm

re: #188 Kragar

Kris Kobach Flirts With Obama ‘Secret Muslim’ Conspiracy Theory - See more at: rightwingwatch.org

Romney’s immigration adviser. Again bears repeated since you know that Mitt probably had some important spot reserved for Kris had his pandering ass actually got elected president.

192 wrenchwench  Jul 22, 2014 2:19:55pm

re: #191 HappyWarrior

Romney’s immigration adviser. Again bears repeated since you know that Mitt probably had some important spot reserved for Kris had his pandering ass actually got elected president.

Ministry of Self-Deportations.

193 Kragar  Jul 22, 2014 2:20:03pm

re: #187 Charles Johnson

[Embedded content]

“If you can’t prove Putin’s finger pushed the button which brought down the plane, there is no way to say Russia is involved!”

194 Dr Lizardo  Jul 22, 2014 2:20:44pm

re: #189 Islamo-Masonic Conspirator

Well, not in those terms. Some see him as an American/oligarchy slave, etc.

Have any of the nat-pats trotted out the old reliable PUTIN ANSWERS TO THE ROTHSCHILDS AND THE ILLUMINATI theme yet?

195 HappyWarrior  Jul 22, 2014 2:21:19pm

re: #192 wrenchwench

Ministry of Self-Deportations.

Ha! I had forgotten about that pathetic line by that asshole.

196 Wendell Zurkowitz (slave to the waffle light)  Jul 22, 2014 2:21:33pm
I’m at work for another hour or so. Somebody flip a few desks over for me. Setting them on fire is optional:

Richard Land Says Americans ‘Ended Slavery, We Didn’t Bring Slavery To North America’

a grain of truth in there, slavery existed in the colonies. But not the fugitive slave act…

197 Islamo-Masonic Conspirator  Jul 22, 2014 2:23:19pm

There was no direct link in the sense of an order. That much has already been clear. But the Buk being Russian, going back to Russia, having at least initially the Russian crew and being in control of Russian citizens (Strelkov et al.) who are sponsored by Russia is helluva link. Shame on AP.

198 Islamo-Masonic Conspirator  Jul 22, 2014 2:26:00pm

re: #194 Dr Lizardo

The Rotschild/Rockefeller stuff was used by Mikhail Khazin, but I’m too lazy to look it up now.

Among those that believe that Russia is literally an American colony, the more popular view is that Putin, although a part of the system, is sorta “our spy”/good guy. Or so it has been b4 now.

199 Charles Johnson  Jul 22, 2014 2:29:18pm

BEES

200 Dr Lizardo  Jul 22, 2014 2:31:41pm

re: #198 Islamo-Masonic Conspirator

The Rotschild/Rockefeller stuff was used by Mikhail Khazin, but I’m too lazy to look it up now.

Among those that believe that Russia is literally an American colony, the more popular view is that Putin, although a part of the system, is sorta a “our spy”/good guy. Or so it has been b4 now.

I have little doubt the nat-pats will turn on Putin if things start going badly for the Novorossiya separatists.

In the US, the question “Who lost China” was all the rage in 1949 in the wake of the successful Chinese Communist revolution there; I can’t help but wonder if some elements of Russian society will begin asking “Who lost Ukraine” should the separatists be defeated there.

The result in the US in the wake of the Chinese Communist Revolution was McCarthyism - I wonder what it would be in Russia? Because I’m pretty damned sure any number of people would be deeply unhappy to see Novorossiya fail.

201 Lidane  Jul 22, 2014 2:32:16pm

*headdesk*

Steve King’s Birtherism Resurfaces: Obama’s America ‘Isn’t Like Ours’

“Now I don’t assert where he was born, I will just tell you that we are all certain that he was not raised with an American experience,” King continued. “So these things that beat in our hearts when we hear the National Anthem and when we say the Pledge of Allegiance doesn’t beat the same for him.”

202 HappyWarrior  Jul 22, 2014 2:33:38pm

mediaite.com
Pretty rich complaint from Carolla considering that conservatives have done all they can to link liberalism with socialism or even Stalinism or Nazism. So cry me a river Adam and conservatism gets its bad image when it’s used to defend sexism, homophobia, classism, etc.

203 HappyWarrior  Jul 22, 2014 2:34:28pm

re: #201 Lidane

*headdesk*

Steve King’s Birtherism Resurfaces: Obama’s America ‘Isn’t Like Ours’

Well Steve, your America isn’t like ours either. By the way, 2008 called, it wants its stupid Obama hates America meme back.

204 wrenchwench  Jul 22, 2014 2:34:58pm

re: #201 Lidane

*headdesk*

Steve King’s Birtherism Resurfaces: Obama’s America ‘Isn’t Like Ours’

Ma’am, you’ll have to raise your head please. That desk is slated for defenestration. Please have Mr. King stand on the sidewalk below.

205 allegro  Jul 22, 2014 2:37:28pm

re: #201 Lidane

*headdesk*

Steve King’s Birtherism Resurfaces: Obama’s America ‘Isn’t Like Ours’

Because everyone knows that the “American experience” is exactly the same for black citizens as it is for privileged white guys like him.

206 HappyWarrior  Jul 22, 2014 2:38:47pm

King’s bitter that he knows if history remembers him at all, he’ll be remembered much like Preston Brooks (the guy who attacked Charles Sumner with a cane) than any sort of a statesman. Obama meanwhile will be remembered years after he’s gone. Steve King isn’t even the most famous Steve King alive.

207 Higgs Boson's Mate  Jul 22, 2014 2:50:28pm

According to Boeing, 20% of the 777 is aluminum. Take a sheet of aluminum foil, crumple it into a ball and then open your hands. Does it float up or does it fall to the ground? It was aluminum’s well-known tendency to be heavier than air was at fault. The presence of drunks armed with high-grade missile systems is a mere coincidence.

208 Backwoods_Sleuth  Jul 22, 2014 2:51:10pm
209 Aunty Entity Dragon  Jul 22, 2014 3:02:00pm

re: #168 Rightwingconspirator

IIRC the idea Israel attacked knowing it was an American vessel has been debunked. Thoroughly.

en.wikipedia.org

Sigh.

And then there is debunking of the debunking. I am not going to get into an argument in this thread on this topic, so I will make this one statement and leave it be.

From Haartz:
haaretz.com

The report stated that the U.S. National Security Agency - to which the intelligence gathering ship belonged - was able to intercept IAF communications according to which, at some stage, the pilots identified the ship as American but were nonetheless instructed to push ahead with the attack.

According to the report, some of the transcripts and intelligence information have disappeared, while the rest can be found in U.S. government archives.

Oliver Kirby, the NSA’s deputy director for operations at the time of the Liberty attack, is quoted by the Tribune as confirming the existence of the transcripts, saying he personally read them.

“They said, ‘We’ve got him in the zero,’” Kirby was quoted as saying, “whatever that meant - I guess the sights or something. And then one of them said, ‘Can you see the flag?’ They said ‘Yes, it’s U.S, it’s U.S.’ They said it several times, so there wasn’t any doubt in anybody’s mind that they knew it.”

Kirby told the newspaper that the transcripts were “something that’s bothered me all my life. I’m willing to swear on a stack of Bibles that we knew they knew.”

The report also states that then U.S. defense secretary Robert McNamara ordered jets that had been dispatched to assist the Liberty turned around.

The Tribune quotes J.Q. “Tony” Hart, then a chief petty officer assigned to a U.S. Navy relay station in Morocco that handled communications between Washington and the 6th Fleet, as saying that he listened in as McNamara said, “President [Lyndon] Johnson is not going to go to war or embarrass an American ally over a few sailors.”

You can find the reporting of the Chicago Tribune in 2007 on this easily enough. It makes for some compelling investigative journalism. That is the last I will say on it today.

Again, this has nothing to do with anything happening today, and anybody who tries to claim it does is peddling Jewish conspiracy idiocy (cough cough Alex Jones et al) For that matter, Judaism had nothing to do with the Liberty. We were spying in Israel. Israel knew it. This wasn’t a religious or ethnic “thing”.

210 De Kolta Chair  Jul 22, 2014 3:04:59pm

Russia has zero percent economic growth but they’ve got a million conspiracy theories. Go figure.

211 makeitstop  Jul 22, 2014 3:20:23pm

re: #202 HappyWarrior

mediaite.com
Pretty rich complaint from Carolla considering that conservatives have done all they can to link liberalism with socialism or even Stalinism or Nazism. So cry me a river Adam and conservatism gets its bad image when it’s used to defend sexism, homophobia, classism, etc.

Hey, Adam - nobody gives a fuck what you think.

212 Romantic Heretic  Jul 22, 2014 3:41:54pm

re: #31 Islamo-Masonic Conspirator

In theory, libertarians are the last ppl I would expect to support Putin’s protofascist dictatorship. Oh well.

I believe that is because ‘libertarian’ is a label rather than a description. It provides cover for their actual beliefs. In the way that rotten dog meat would be peddled as beef if there wasn’t an FDA.

213 Romantic Heretic  Jul 22, 2014 3:49:23pm

re: #43 Lidane

Speaking of weird, Dinesh D’Souza wants you to know he’s not a crybaby, but Google and Costco are persecuting him.

Why don’t you get a job, Dinesh? Ya know, like the regular people you, and all your allegedly conservative friends, are always yapping on about.

214 Romantic Heretic  Jul 22, 2014 3:50:57pm

re: #62 Charles Johnson

[Embedded content]

Damn it! Don’t give those people any ideas!

215 Aunty Entity Dragon  Jul 22, 2014 4:51:39pm

Pie-onist Overlord (Alouette)

Really?


This article has been archived.
Comments are closed.

Jump to top

Create a PageThis is the LGF Pages posting bookmarklet. To use it, drag this button to your browser's bookmark bar, and title it 'LGF Pages' (or whatever you like). Then browse to a site you want to post, select some text on the page to use for a quote, click the bookmarklet, and the Pages posting window will appear with the title, text, and any embedded video or audio files already filled in, ready to go.
Or... you can just click this button to open the Pages posting window right away.
Last updated: 2023-04-04 11:11 am PDT LGF User's Guide RSS Feeds

Help support Little Green Footballs!

Subscribe now for ad-free access!Register and sign in to a free LGF account before subscribing, and your ad-free access will be automatically enabled.

Donate with
PayPal Cash.app
Recent PagesClick to refresh
The Pandemic Cost 7 Million Lives, but Talks to Prevent a Repeat Stall In late 2021, as the world reeled from the arrival of the highly contagious omicron variant of the coronavirus, representatives of almost 200 countries met - some online, some in-person in Geneva - hoping to forestall a future worldwide ...
Cheechako
4 days ago
Views: 125 • Comments: 0 • Rating: 1
Texas County at Center of Border Fight Is Overwhelmed by Migrant Deaths EAGLE PASS, Tex. - The undertaker lighted a cigarette and held it between his latex-gloved fingers as he stood over the bloated body bag lying in the bed of his battered pickup truck. The woman had been fished out ...
Cheechako
2 weeks ago
Views: 287 • Comments: 0 • Rating: 1