Wow...great kudos to all who did the tech stuff on this one. Not that it will matter much as the MSM won't pick up on it.

But, prove me wrong Dan Rather. Prove me wrong.

Pack of note cards? Can't quite tell.

Guess what the MSM is gonna label this one...

Authentic but inaccurate...

*LOL*

Second? not bad, eh?

Wow. Looks like he's unfolding paper.

If W broke the rules by doing this, it would be above-the-fold front page headline news.

But the media won't cover this at all.

Slick move, smiling at the audience, knowing they'd be looking at his face.

If you look real close you can see the unfolding and
even straightening out of folded papers he took out
of his jacket. No doubt!

What else would anyone expect from a traitorous self confessed war criminal?

Silly Republicans. Rules aren't for liberals!

It won't play. What program do I need.

The other mystery of the debate is why was Kerry furiously writing? I bet Kerry was outlining his agenda for the week:

Monday - have deck on yacht polished.
Tuesday - have lawns mowed at my eight mansions
Wednesday AM - flip
Wednesday PM - flop
Thursday - receive more intense coaching in how to catch a football
Friday - windsurf!

Any chance of encoding this video as an MPG?
 

Duh. Quicktime. I don't have that one.

JFK brought crib notes to the global test.

Everyone saw him taking notes during the debate. Could it be as simple as a blank notepad?

#12

Sure. Where to you want it sent?

Why am I suddenly reminded of Chevy Chase in "Spies Like Us"

And as such, what is this the diversion for? My bullshit detector is screaming that this guy is being deliberately set up to take a fall that someone else deserves much more. First off, look at who he ran against in the Primaries. All completely un-electable. There has to be a Democrat out there that could have at least made

How old is Rather? He's on his way out almost anyway, maybe this is just someone's way of putting him out to pasture before he goes completely senile (probably too late) and is in a position to damage a candidate that could actually win. This looks to me like it's just a changing of the guard.

Call me a conspiracy theorist if you will, and I'm not pointing fingers just yet, but something here smells really fishy to me on a bigger scale.

#13 Lawrence Schmerel

#12 William 

Apple's Quicktime is a free download, and it also works on Windows.

#11--

Saturday--whip servants

I don't like Kerry on bit, but it could possibly be blank paper to take notes on.

Don't want to seem hysterical. Let's leave that to the DU.

#15 breadfan

Could it be as simple as a blank notepad?

What part of this are you failing to understand? Neither party was allowed to bring anything to the podium, period.

If it turns out that Johnny Nuance brought crib notes, which is clearly against the rules, I hope Bush nails him at the beginning of the next debate.

How long before:
A) the MSM goes on ignore-cover-Kerry's-ass-mode?
or
B) the MSM starts whining about the lowly internet Jihad?

That's "one" bit.

PIMF

It's white and has a square corner ---that's all I can see. (Of course, the compression artifacts don't help too much.)

Quick explanation:
It didn't happen, but if it did happen I was only taking out blank paper, or
if you detect writing on it, it was a note of encouragement from Theresa,
or I just didn't know the rules,
or the rules just don't apply to morally superior people with higher SATs.

#20 Techie 

The debate rules state nothing is allowed to be brought to the podium. They already have paper and pens on the podium to take notes.

Of course I'm also inclined to just let this slide because it will come off as whining. If Bush had won the debate we could get away with it, but as it is it's probably best if we just let it drop.

Look at Drudge site--they list rules. Not even blank paper allowed to be carried by candidate--anything they wanted at podium was to be given to the commission and THEY were to put it on the podium.

The rules were clear.

oops #17

There has to be a Democrat out there that could have at least made

...a decent run at battling bush on foreign policy... Someone like Lieberman, except not Jewish.

After seeing this clip, I can say that there is ABSOLUTELY NO DOUBT he actually pulled out a paper from his jacket pocket and unfolded it in front of him. Viewing this clip, no one could ever deny it!

"The left can only take power through deception."

sex, lies and videotape... perfect recipe for scandal.

The last 2 are present in this one, what abt the first??

Oops, sorry, u need to have a pair for that one...

Don't misunderestimate the power of the Internet.
Cal Thomas keeps on plugging it.

...Competition promotes media and information diversity as never before. Cable, especially Fox News Channel (for which I toil and which is regarded in the two polls, along with The Wall Street Journal, as biased toward President Bush), has started to even the playing field. Internet blogs are now major information players.

The big networks and establishment newspapers are no longer the news gatekeepers. The journalistic equivalent of the Berlin Wall has fallen, and millions are enjoying a new birth of informational freedom they had not previously known. This may not be good for the elite press, but it is great for the people, who feel empowered beyond letters to the editor. ...

[Link: www.jewishworldreview.com...]

Can I ask question?

I'm concerned that this may have just been blank paper of some sort for taking notes - everyone saw him take notes during the debate, even though outside material was verboten. I'm concerned for this reason: although Kerry was the big note-taker, I don't think I'm imagining the fact that I remember seeing Bush ALSO take notes at least once during the debate. Does any one else remember the President taking notes at all?

Has anyone asked the Kerry campaign for comment?

#34 Smapty

Can I ask question?

You just did! :-Þ

I don't know, this just doesn't seem like a scandal to me. Drawing attention to this seems more like sour grapes.

Whining and crying about this only makes Bush and his suppoters look childish.

Yes, it was against the rules to bring notes in this way, but to most people that will just illustrate how stupid the rules are; nothing else.

#33

Well, FYI I saw it with Windows Media Player 10, its the super duper version that looks like a Mac

As is fitting. It was assembled on a MAC.

I wuv my MAC.

Semi OT to CHARLES - where does designation as an LGF operative rank on the hat tip scale? (linear or logrithmic?)

If Bush took notes too, then there's nothing here - no way to show it wasn't blank. So did he?

#35 the_spectator
Please read the thread. Neither party was allowed to bring anything to the podium.

What's Kerry's M.O. from previous debates?

Someone ought to spend time looking at what he did during the primary debates.

My theory: He had a sheet of talking points. As he heard the question, and Bush's answer...he checked off the points he wanted to make in response.

I think the "Committee on Debates" owes the American
people an explination of this incident. It also owes us
an explination of how Kerry knew at the time of the
first question (about Homeland Security) that the
subject would come up later in the debate. I for
one plan on contacting the committee tomorrow to
try to get some answers.

Is the town hall meeting going to cover foreign policy?

I'm under the impression only the third debate is strictly domestic policy.

^^^
???

35 the_spectator

I'm concerned that this may have just been blank paper of some sort for taking notes

The rules plainly said that blank paper would be provided for them. They were to bring NOTHING.

TenRing: "LGF Operative" is a rare accolade. Only a few have reached this stage.

Some of them were taking potshots at each other last night. <grin />

OT: It freaking figures. Even though they milk her "Dutch"ness to the hilt-Anne Frank not worthy of posthumous Dutch citizenship.

Probably a compliment anyway. Sickening though. Considering how her house has become a shrine to supposed Dutch righteousness and they now pay tribute there to all human rights with special attention to the Palestinians.

FEH!!!

furiousxgeorge

Yes, it was against the rules to bring notes in this way, but to most people that will just illustrate how stupid the rules are; nothing else.

I question whether most will see it that way.
Nobody really likes a liar, do they?

Bottom line for the Kerry apologists:

Neither candidate was permitted to bring ANYTHING to the debate.

Kerry DID.

Bush DIDN'T.

Both candidates were allowed to take notes on the paper & pens *provided* during the debate.

So, stop spinning.

Yes yes, but I may be crazy but I remember Bush taking notes at LEAST once. Do you remember him doing so? If he did also, they both cheated at least on note-paper, and there's nothing here.

#31 voletti

Oops, sorry, u need to have a pair for that one...

Not if you're a pussy!

#48 Charles

Some of them were taking potshots at each other last night.

You must have be surprised that I stayed out of it:-)

#52 the brain dead spectator

Yes yes, but I may be crazy but I remember Bush taking notes at LEAST once. Do you remember him doing so? If he did also, they both cheated at least on note-paper, and there's nothing here.

Yo idiot Bush was taking notes ON THE PAPER PROVIDED.

#52 the_spectator
Are you being deliberately dense?

#51:

"Both candidates were allowed to take notes on the paper & pens *provided* during the debate"

Thanks there - now I understand. It probably did have writing on then, or he wouldn't have brought it in, and Bush was taking "legal" notes. Sorry!

Rules are for the little people.

#35 The_Spectator
Actually, given his extensive note-taking, that rather small piece of paper would definitely have been insufficient blank space. It can be argued that he then used the paper already on the lectern, but how did he expect to do any kind of note-taking on such a small piece of "blank" paper he brought with him ?

"Yes yes, but I may be crazy"

Yes yes, you may well be.

#58 johnkerry
Thank you so very much for reminding us. We do tend to get uppity from time to time.

#30 said it right!

What's the big deal. Democrats are always cheating. Aren't they the party of signing up the dead and illegal to vote in our elections. Aren't they already preparing a legal plan if they lose. This is part of the DNC SOP. And we shouldn't expect any fairness from the MainStreamMorons of the press either. When they don't go begging (welfare), fear mongering (draft) or lying (A better plan for Iraq) for a vote that will be the first time.

To all questioning if Bush took notes:

I clearly remember him jotting notes down

Answer my questions.

#52 the_spectator

Yes yes, but I may be crazy but I remember Bush taking notes at LEAST once. Do you remember him doing so? If he did also, they both cheated at least on note-paper, and there's nothing here.

Read the thread!! Paper was provided for them to take notes on.

#48 Charles

TenRing: "LGF Operative" is a rare accolade. Only a few have reached this stage.

Shift-Cmd-4 that one. Thanks.

Shucks, I think I'll have it bronzed.

At the end of the debate...

Did Kerry take the notes away with him? Or leave them behind?

#63 placebo

I clearly remember him jotting notes down

Somebody is on the real pills, not the placebos.

I suggest you actually read the thread before you make an even bigger fool of yourself.

#67 Smapty

Did Kerry take the notes away with him? Or leave them behind?

Zombie said that he took them away, I didn't see it myself.

#68

I meant Bush - people were wondering if he was taking notes or not..

jeez, kinda overreacted?

#50:

It's all a matter of spin. The meme that the rules are ridiculous is already out there, and everyone saw the networks break them when they used the split screen for reaction shots.

I really doubt most people would be offended about someone using notes in this situation, everyone uses them when they speak in public; and the rules are already believed to be generaly dumb.

Someone will eventually do a detailed post mortem on these debates. My guess is that many bits of such evidence will surface strongly supporting suspicions that "The fix was in."

(I can almost smell the sour breath of a BDS sufferer reading the above & nodding smugly.)

#67 Smapty

At the end of the debate...

Did Kerry take the notes away with him? Or leave them behind?

RTFT!

It was mentioned earlier - he appeared to take the notes with him. However my video feed didn't have that shot.

OK, J Forbes K brought something in violation of the rules -- what next? 40 lashes with a wet noodle? Lock him in a room for a lecture on the VA from Bill Burkett?

Seriously, is there any practical recourse or remedy?

My "add a comment" section at the bottom of the thread looks different.

As mentioned, Drudge is on it, although Kerry Kampaign Kid when confronted with evidence of cheating seemed to know that this story will never get beyond pajamahadeen. Maybe if Rush Limbaugh hits it hard enough, but radio isn't the best forum to show videotapes.

A top Kerry campaign source explained to the DRUDGE REPORT late Sunday how Bush supporters were once again trying to distract.

"Kerry did not cheat," said the Kerry insider. "This is more lies from Republicans, who are hoping for a quick change of subject away from the president's performance, and the new polls."

When pressed on the fact that even brandishing a pen from his jacket would have violated debate rules, the Kerry staffer laughed, adding, "See you at the inauguration, Drudge".

Developing...

#70 placebo

I meant Bush - people were wondering if he was taking notes or not..

Of course he was taking notes! Look, this is simple yet you keep missing the point. Paper and pens were provided. Neither party was allowed to bring anything to the podium. Get it?

jeez, kinda overreacted?

No, you just keep spouting that Bush was taking notes and ignoring what is posted.

You are being either ignorant, or dishonest.

#74 Buckaroo

Seriously, is there any practical recourse or remedy?

Yup. Outing him. Blogging him. Exposing one more chink in his rusty armor. Adding one more straw to the camel's burden.

Kinda like now.

By the way, since I seem to have your attention inadvertently, I guess Bush's only big error in the debate other than the reaction shots was the fact he never went after Kerry's Cold War record right? You notice that Kerry a number of times made unprompted Cold War references, not just Treblinka Square, almost like he was prepared to fight on the issue because he knew he was weak there. The only way Bush ever came close whas when he simply said Kerry had a record in the Senate, though he might not agree with it.

Flip-flop wasn't enough exactly. Kerry the Veteran stands up there straight and tall and speaks in his big voice, he looks manly enough. Since the issue of Kerry's committment and resoluteness to fight the War on Terror was so central to Bush's point, he needed to point out that Kerry was far from committed and resolute in the Cold War. I fear that huge numbers, if not the majority of undecideds don't realy know about that. Hey, he sounds like JFK, JFK was solid against the Soviets, etc.

Charles! LOL@"Jacketgate"

# 77 TR

OK, but beyond an embarrassment to a campaign (that lets te-raise-a in public regularly fer cryin' out loud!) I'm not sure how much of an effect it will have.
:-)

I have made screenshots of scenes from TenRing's video and posted them at my Web site:

View them here.

This is helpful for those who have problems viewing videos online, or who have slow connections (it's a small, efficient download this time -- about 110k), or who want to inspect the object close up without it moving.

G*D D**N IT.

HOW MANY TIMES DO I HAVE TO SAY IT?.

I GET TO CHEAT, YOU DON'T.

Signed

A liberal Democrat.

What would he have brought up with him though? I know that not everyone here has debate experience, but for those who do, think of what he would have brought? What notes would he have needed? I am wondering if the Notes might have included a list of the questions to be asked, and their order. Or something else that would provide a substantial help. Can anyone else think of something he would have brought up, and why?

Too bad we don't have a source with the broadcast video who could pull some frames out. With that we should be able to tell what the object is.

furiousxgeorge

...the rules are already believed to be generaly dumb.

Believed by the Kerry campaign and the media to be dumb, granted. I still believe that most people believe the rules should be followed.

#76

holy shit man, i think you're not understanding what i'm saying

i didn't read all the goddamn comments, i simply saw a few people who were wondering if bush was taking notes or not.

i am aware that you aren't allowed to take in anything, holy crap man, dishonest or ignorant? i was simply replying to a few who couldn't remember if bush took notes

my god

In his place, I would only bring something up if it gave me a distinct advantage, something worth the possible trouble it would bring.

#71 furiousxgeorge

The media didn't negotiate the rules, or agree to them. The Kerry campaign did.

OT: That cumrag Kofi Annan "condemns Gaza offensive"

[Link: www.cnn.com...]

Here are the rules:

(c) No props, notes, charts, diagrams, or other writings or other tangible things may be brought into the debate by either candidate.
(d) Notwithstanding subparagraph 5(c), the candidates may take notes during the debate on the size, color and type of paper each side prefers. Each candidate must submit to the staff of the Commission prior to the debate all such paper and any pens or pencils with which a candidate may wish to take notes during the debate, and the staff or commission will place such paper, pens and pencils on the podium, table or other structure to be used by the candidate in that debate.

Memo of Understanding

#86 placebo
Every response was to me. You were quoting my posts.

i didn't read all the goddamn comments, i simply saw a few people who were wondering if bush was taking notes or not.

Right, there were at least 3 other posters saying exactly the same thing. Your responses were to me. Ignorant and dishonest was correct.

The item brought by Kerry to the lectern has a flap cover. You can see the cover snapping open in the last few seconds of the video.

Guys, what he probably removed from his jacket was a handkerchief, (square shaped and folded). He's a heavy sweater, and bringing something to blot his palms is a perfectly reasonable thing to do, nor would it violate the agreement, underwear and ties are also tangible things and no one would suggest that wearing either violated the agreement.
You have to choose your battles wisely, and I think that if we see "gotcha" scoops a la Dan Rather every time someone does something we don't immediately understand, we just gonna make ourselves look the Birchers screaming about flouride that they claim we are. So calm done, remember all the really stupid things he really said, and keep pounding away at them.

#92 GrassyKnoll_1963

The item brought by Kerry to the lectern has a flap cover. You can see the cover snapping open in the last few seconds of the video.

Could it have been an email device so he could be fed answers?

The fact is, put the phrase 'debate rules' into google news and you see a lot of articles talking about the networks ignoring them and discussions of how elaborate they are.

Regardless of the rules, no one will care about Kerry using notes except partisans.

reagnite-

how exactly does this make me ignorant and dishonest?

man i am really not following you here

the CPD provided pen and paper - on the lecterns

jesus christ, by calling me ignorant and dishonest, i have no clue what i'm being ignorant or dishonest about

your snap reactions have made me consider ever posting comments again, you've just simply misunderstood what i was saying

#22: My money's on both A and B.

#93 Canadian Refugee

Read the rules "other tangible things"

Anyone know if the the questions wre supplied aheasd of time to both camps?

#20 Techie 10/3/2004 05:01PM PST
I don't like Kerry on bit, but it could possibly be blank paper to take notes on.

---

O.K., let's TRY to give Kerry a huge amount of rationalization here.

BUT, he turned his back INORDER TO remove the object from his suit coat, and then turned back to face the audience (and cameras) AFTER he'd removed the object.

With podium before him, covering from audience (and camera) view, he could and then did access the object, whatever it was.

Ever see someone engaged in theft? Particularly shoplifting? They engage in the same sort of concealment efforts while they do their deed, same thing Kerry did.

So, no, I don't think it was a hapless, harmless "act" that Kerry did and his actions reveal that he was attempting to conceal whatever he was doing. Otherwise, why the turning of his back to the audience/cameras? Why not just yank out the object in full view, smile, wave it around? Because it was against the rules.

#94

It could have been a PDA, pager device, or something electronic.

If you look closely toward the end of the video, you can see something like a cover snapping really quick.

#93 Canadian Refugee

He's a heavy sweater, and bringing something to blot his palms is a perfectly reasonable thing to do, nor would it violate the agreement, underwear and ties are also tangible things and no one would suggest that wearing either violated the agreement.

Nice "apples and oranges". Have you actually read the rules of the debate? Anything either of them needed would be provided before hand. They were allowed to bring nothing with them.

OTOH, are you suggesting they had to go to the podium naked?

#95 furiousxgeorge

he fact is, put the phrase 'debate rules' into google news and you see a lot of articles talking about the networks ignoring them and discussions of how elaborate they are.

The Memo of Understanding was between Bush and Kerry, not the networks.

Why not just yank out the object in full view, smile, wave it around? Because it was against the rules.

Because that would look stupid, even with a legal item?

#19 JohnAnnArbor  10/3/2004 05:00PM PST

Saturday--whip servant

Sunday - get whipped by Teresa

#95 furiousxgeorge

Regardless of the rules, no one will care about Kerry using notes except partisans.

Are we so tarnished by the LLL example that it's no big deal to violate an agreement?

And this is they guy who wants to sign treaties on behalf of the United States of America?

There's an old saying, "If you cannot trust my handshake, of what value is my signature?". In JF'nK's case, we can trust neither.

More shifting sands of moral relativism.

Peddle it somewhere else.

I pray that Cheney flat-out busts the blowdried vampire and that GWB finds his bearings for Friday - Hewitt is correct, if it isn't close, they can't cheat (again).

The Memo of Understanding was between Bush and Kerry, not the networks.

You and I know this, but go ahead and look at google news.

Example headline: Networks not playing by debate rules

Now if you go ahead and read the article in detail you note they are under no obligation to follow the rules, but this is a soundbite media culture.

 #103 [Engineer]  10/3/2004 05:48PM PST

The Memo of Understanding was between Bush and Kerry, not the networks.

At the beginning of the next debate, W should mention this episode . . . announce that he W brought his own item for the second debate . . . W reaches into his jacket pocket . . . and pulls out a flip-flop sandal and places it on top of the podium :-}

#104 furiousxgeorge

Because that would look stupid, even with a legal item?

Again, there were no legal items. none, not any, zip.

Can someone send my a copy? I can't geet the quicktime to work.

bonddad2000@yahoo.com

Thanks

#96 placebo

your snap reactions have made me consider ever posting comments again, you've just simply misunderstood what i was saying

Snap? Hardly, how many times did you post the same thing? It's simple, you chose to avoid the facts and tried to deflect that Lurch brought something to the podium in violation of the rules he agreed to. I don't care if it was a candy bar. He violated the rules he agreed to. So tell me, how am I supposed to trust someone like that?

#109 Cornholio

...the least you could do is post a spew alert!

Now where are those dang Kleenex tissues and Q-tips!

Bottom line: Kerry broke the rules. He should apologize.

Also note that Kerry left the item on the podium until the debate was over.

98 Engineer,

Reread my post,
ties, socks and underwear are also "tangible things". Whatever we may think of Kerry, no one would dispute that he knows how to dress. He carried a handkerchief in the inside breast pocket of his suit, which is where you carry the one you use. He may also have worn garters, judging from the colourful photo posted last night, I'm sure of it. No one is going to claim that any or those item violated the rules. sorry.

#116

Being deliberately obtuse is hardly a way to get anything other than a GAZE

Common' people. That's clearly a hankie! He's just unfolding it to grasp the nuance of his last nose blowing. Sheesh.

#35 the_spectator

There was no rule against either person "taking notes," and yes, I did see Bush taking notes and on several occasions, as I also saw Kerry doing. Again, no rule against that.

I've read that there was paper and pen on the podiums before either candidate arrived -- that these materials were provided for the candidates at both podiums, such that since there was a rule against either of them bringing any object with them to the podium, notepaper and pens would be and were provided for their use during the debate.

So, since they both already knew this, no one would need any "extra" paper, notes, whatever, including the fact that that was AGAINST THE RULES for either to bring anything tangible with them.

Meaning, there was a clear rule about this issue: neither/no candidate to bring any tangible material/item with them to the podium.

So, that means, nothing. No extras. No papers, no reference books, no magic hats. Nothing, just walk up there and find notepaper and a pen for use and then start the debate.

Because Kerry removed some object from his coat, placed it on the podium before him making it available to him during the debate (something that was not already there on the podium when he arrived, but something he brought with him to the podium concealed in his coat when he walked on stage), and then also removed that object from the podium after the debate and placed it back in his suit coat when he left the stage, HE VIOLATED THE DEBATE RULES.

It's pretty clear. But, again, nothing wrong with taking notes during the campaign, after either candidate arrived at their respective podium and found notepaper and a pen to use there, at the podium.

reaganite -

lol i dont know how you got out of it that i'm supporting kerry

im just utterly confused on how you have interpreted everything i've said

The 840K video rules out the possibility of a hankerchief.

Kerry brought a device with a flip cover to the debates.

#116 Canadian Refugee

You don't "bring" your underware and put it on the speaker's stand. That is what the rules forbid. If it was a hanky, he still broke the agreement that he agreed to.

Whether JK used notes may seem like a ridiculous thing to make an issue of. But remember: GW could have been much better off with a list of talking ponts, if that in fact is what Kerry had.

Note to skeptics: He ain't unfolding no damn pen.

Good job, TenRing!

#95 Canadian Refugee, a handkerchief would most definitely be a violation of the rules. It is a tangible object, one that you have have notes on, no less. i do not recall him using any handkerchief during the debates, anyways.

If it was indeed a hanky, and he simply took it out, used it, and put it away when needed, we wouldn't have a leg to stand on. Unless of course he started sutdying it intently, in which case he would either be reading notes or performing booger augury.

We do need to pick our battles wisely. I think anyone who would care about this at all will hear of it, and that the MSM will ignore it.

And Placebo, don't worry about it, miscommunications are inavoidable and enough of us realize what you were addressing others' questions.

#119 -s-

Thanks. Someone else explained that to me earlier, more abruptly. :)

#124 Barbara Skolaut

De nada, Chiquita.

While it doesn't rank with Charles' exposé of the RatherGate memos, it still feels good to pitch in when I'm able.

Oops, I meant that the hanky is an item you *can* have notes on, not that you "have have" notes on.

Whatever Kerry brought, he removed it from his pocket effortlessly and smoothly. That means he'd practiced that move. Unless it was a hanky (don't think so), it's clear it was an act of deception.

#113 TenRing ;) Thanks for the post btw, the video is cool.

#116 Canadian Refugee 

ties, socks and underwear are also "tangible things".

That would depend on what is the meaning of is.

I still say it's paper. If it was a handkerchief, how come he never used it to wipe his brow during the entire debate?

#94 [Engineer]  

Could it have been an email device so he could be fed answers?

Oohh . . . I like! Now that has scandal potential!

The LLL at DU say Bush brought notes with him! "Cheat Sheet Gate"! Bush had prepared notes...

I bet you that it was a miniature PDA like a Palm Zire / Tungstent or a Blackberry.

Whatever it was, it was not just one sheet of paper.

The bottom line is this, in any US military school if there is even a perception of cheating you're gone. Lurch plays fast and loose with any and every rule and he wants to be CinC?

122,

He also put his (expensive) cuflinks on the speaker's stand. I just don't think that this is going to make us look like anthing other than raving loons. "The man wore a full suit... he broke the rules" is just providing the MSM ammunition to use against us. If he brought notes then yes he cheated and it looks very bad for him, I just think that there is probably another explanation considering he's the manicured man that he is.

There is a serious flaw in the on-line polls which ask: who won the debate, Bush or Kerry? Now that we see how Kerry brought out a cheat-sheet for the debate, contrary to the rules of the debate, the question should be phrased differently. It should be: Who won the debate:
(1) Bush
(2) Kerry
(3) Kerry's cheat-sheet.
Those who have voted that Kerry won the debate are mistaken, considering the discovery of this cheating. Kerry showed a character flaw by cheating. So whatever votes Kerry got in any on-line poll should really have gone to his cheat-sheet.

The whole argument over who won the debate has to do with form, not substance. The DNC circulated a video showing Bush, with his face dislpaying annoyance or impatience during the time that Kerry had the floor (we don't get to hear the lies and false accusations and false promises that Kerry was making, only some music and Bush's expression).

Well that is trumped by Kerry's display of a lack of character by cheating during the debate.

I think that it is important that this be widely known and reported in the media. Kerry's bounce in the polls was as much the result of theft, by violating the rules of the debate, as the Watergate burglary would have been a theft had it succeeded.

#59
His note that was written on the paper PRIOR to the debate, reads "Don't LIE again you DUMBA$$)

130,

Because wiping his brow would look bad, jeesh

Smirky claims it is a handkerchief.

LOL!
QM

I believe the rules are both dumb and should be followed. The rules grant an advantage to people with a trait that has no direct benefit to the position being applied for. I'd rather have a president who can work from several live datafeeds than one who has a perfect memory thank you very much.

(c) No props, notes, charts, diagrams, or other writings or other tangible things may be brought into the debate by either candidate.

Darn! I just realized what this means. W can't close the third debate by doing a Steve-Jobs "Oh, and one last thing . . . [pulls open curtain] with me tonight is the recently captured Bin Laden!"

#132 [Engineer]

Projection is such a common disorder there it may as well be a prerequisite.

139,

actually Smirky seems to be suggesting that is was a doily, but ... see what I mean

oh those damn bloggers!!!

Or Lehrer could have slipped him the questions beforehand. I have no proof this is the case, but we can't rule it out. Would that be a more serious violation than making up a news story based on forged documents?

Grassy knoll: interesting theory about it being an electronic device rather than a simple piece of paper or notecard...certainly, an electronic device would hold far more data, although then one would have to look for signs of Kerry operating it throughout the debate...

I still think it was paper...he seems to be unfolding it in the videotape...

#145 jackal  

Or Lehrer could have slipped him the questions beforehand

Speaking of which, the MOU requires audience members at the "town hall" debate to submit their questions in advance to the moderator. Gee, no potential for abuse there. :(

The town hall debates are a frickin set-up.

#93 Canadian Refugee 10/3/2004 05:43PM PST
Guys, what he probably removed from his jacket was a handkerchief,

I can't imagine ANYone, even Kerry, "opening" a handkerchief and then standing there looking at it after a few other motions with it on the podium before him. This would mean that he was seriously obsessive compulsive or maybe even autistic, if he performed these several acts of removal with concealing motions, unfolding, etc. of a simple handerchief.

Crazy even for Kerry. I think it was some sort of device that he opened and then accessed from the podium, disdaining the rules as does his campaign today when asked about the object and Kerry's cheating of the rules.

A notebook, or set of cards in some container, but more than likely, some sort of memo device. I still think an iPod or BlackBerry is a very good guess.

Yea, but you guys are missing the important question:
Did Bush take notes...?

Just kidding...

I couldn't care less that J f'n K brought a crib sheet to the lecturn. I would expect no less. The billionaire everyman doesn't fall when skiing, has never, EVER changed positions on anything and would not stoop to cheating.

Remember, it was Bush and the SCOTUS who stole the election. It wasn't the Florida State Supremes who were trying to change rules mid-stream. Rules are for suckers. They should not, will not and can not apply to the man who would be king.

#146

In the last second of the video, it clearly shows that the device Kerry had in his hand had a cover that snapped open or closed.

W's debate prep team must have been beside themselves at the way the 1st debate went down.
I'm betting that a lot of midnight oil is being consumed in order to prevent a re-occurence.
This time they'll have a better feel for what can go wrong.
They can't do anything about W's unfortunate dysarticulation but they can make damn sure he's properly rested, relaxed & ready to rumble.
And, for gahdsakes, George, keep your hands off the lectern and stand up STRAIGHT! And NO smirking or sighing.
You're the gahddam President; ACT like it!

Then, there's Dick Cheney (who I am positive is the object of my wife's fantasies) vs Squire John (I'm so pretty) Edwards. The keelhauling may be too violent for a G rating.

From the video, we see that as Kerry approached the podium, with his back still to the audience, he reached into his inside jacket pocket, and withdrew something, he turned to the podium, and he put this item in front of him right on the podium. Now look carefully at the gesture that rules out the possibility that this something was a hanky, as some have claimed. It seems to me that he then turned over the first page of it. This looks to me like the behavior of someone who regularly speaks from some notes, or who is used to debating from notes, who placed his notes in front of him on the podium, and then arranged his notes for the debate.

A test of "character".

Your going to participate in a debate.The rules are agreed on ahead of time. Both you and the other candidate have been given the rules. One of the rules are that you can take notes with the pen and paper provided you already in place at the podium. You are NOT to bring anything to the podium. You:

A. Abide by the rules, you will NOT bring anything to the podium. The rules are the rules.

B. You bring whatever you think is ok, no matter what the rules are.

Or...your kid is participing in a debate. You overhear your child talking with another. One advises your kid "don't worry about the rules, nobody will notice, just act natural and slip them out real quick.

You tell your child ___?

Senator Kerry tells his child___ ?

No, I wouldn't trust MY kid with Senator Kerry in a Motel 6 overnight.

148,

Obsessive Compulsive... Check

Crazy... Check

Simplest explanation... Check

I wuldn't trust my kids in a McDonald's with Clinton.

No doubt this was just a copy of his Silver Star with a combat “V” award.

:-)

Perhaps it was quotations of Ho Chi Minh.

Could Kerry have accidently brought his cell phone with him, and realized he forgot to turn it off? That would explain his cover-up, he wouldn't want to look like an idiot turning his cell phone off in front of everyone, but most especially wouldn't want it to go off during the debate.

Just one thought that comes to mind.

Kerry left the device on the podium in clear violation of the rules.

#139 Quilly Mammoth

As if it matters what it was.

5. Rules Applicable to All Debates

...

(c) No props, notes, charts, diagrams or other writings or other tangible things may be brought into the debate by any candidate. (...) (emphasis mine)

It could be argued that that only refers to visual aids for the audience,

I tend to agree with 121 Grassy Knoll that it was a device of some sort not paper. If you step through the critical part very slowly it appears much less like unfolding paper than flipping open a device.
The earlier posts about Kerry writing non-stop when Bush was talking could have been easily faked ..one hand moving as though writing and other hand scrolling to pregrammed responses on the device
If you buy the fact that he knew the questions in advance (which is a stretch I admit but possible with Rathergate as an example) he could have been refreshing himself for the next question.
We'll probably never know any of this unless some super-sleuth can discover some more evidence than is now available...but we know he was cheating for sure.

does anyone remember Rush saying on Wednesday that the only way Kerry could score points during the debate was to CHEAT? Hmmm...Rush may have been right.

#159 Final Historian

Could Kerry have accidently brought his cell phone with him, and realized he forgot to turn it off? That would explain his cover-up, he wouldn't want to look like an idiot turning his cell phone off in front of everyone, but most especially wouldn't want it to go off during the debate.

You know, I fly around once a week. I remember to turn my cell phone off most of the time. You think someone running for POTUS not being able to remember to turn it off for such an event is really POTUS material?

Think about it this way. He wasn't even carrying one, his staff carries it for him.

The more I look at it, the more I think he hits a button right before "closing" whatever he took out.

The device has a fairly large screen like a PDA.

#161 Spiny Norman

It could be argued that that only refers to visual aids for the audience,

You mean the Ross Perot rule?

#166

But Kerry left the device on the podium until the end of the debate.

#162,

You've got something there. Everyone was commenting on what a scribblin' maniac Kerry was during the debate.

Does Kerry have a stage magician hanging around his entourage to teach him some misdirection?

#125 Tim in PA
"i do not recall him using any handkerchief during the debates, anyways."

Of what use is a handkerchief to someone wearing heavy TVLand make-up?
Unless they have some new fangled stuff, any wiping or even blotting would smear.
No need to wipe sweaty hands; nobody sees them.

Watch the extraction of the object several times & you'll see a smooth, well practiced sleight of hand maneuver that was not visible to anybody in the room unless there were elevated seats. Oh, this guy is good. I mean REALLY good!

A PDA with a wireless connection like my Sony Clie would have been very handy.

Sure is weird. Why does the video kinda jerk when he's in motion; taking it out and putting it down?

Maybe it's a GPS device so he knows where he is.

Man he's so irratating.
I get all nuts if I see a Skerry sticker on the car next to me or near me somewhere. I hate feeling that way. I cant' wait until the election is over. Gawd I hope they don't whine for another four years when they lose again.

#165 Rayra

#132 [Engineer] 10/3/2004 06:05PM PST
The LLL at DU say Bush brought notes with him! "Cheat Sheet Gate"! Bush had prepared notes...

Clear enough proof for me - if the little DU Projection-ists are claiming Bush cribbed, then John F'in Kerry definitely did.
Simple Turnspeak on their parts, at the first whiff of a negative scandal on their candidate, they IMMEDIATELY make the same charge in return.

I can supply split frame blowups of Mr. Bush handling papers in the segment he mentions. Don't look like anything other than handwritten notes (taken on the spot) - but the resolution just isn't there to be sure. One thing, though, he didn't hide them.

#168 TenRing

The Little General? No pie (charts) for me, thanks.

LOL!

#169

True. But he couldn't have put it back until the debate was over, otherwise the audience would see.

#171 Zeldah

Oh, this guy is good. I mean REALLY good!

Not a chance. I *am* qualified to speak on this aspect and his misdirection - if that's what he was trying - is nonexistent.

He is behaving more like a high school student cheating on an exam, knowing the teacher isn't paying attention. Notice the smirk?

Zaideh
Zaideh
Zaideh
Zaideh
Zaideh

PIMF

We need to have the other angles synced up with this one. I'd be interested to see what his face and eyes are doing as he steps up to the podium...

Maybe Kerry was just setting out an emergency peanut butter & jelly sandwich, in case he got hungry. I think he mentioned in an interview that he got in the habit of snacking on those back in Vietnam. You guys did realize that Kerry served in Vietnam, didn't you? Cut the guy some slack! He's a war hero!

#177 Ten Ring
"#171 Zeldah"

Zeldah?
I yam ZAIDEH, demmit!

No, not a pro, certainly, but good enough to fool most of the audience for awhile.
And if the pajamista catch him at it, he knows his media schills will move in & say "Go away, kid, you're bothering the man.".

#161
Hey, I just passed along what Smirky is saying. I think Kerry broke the rules.

QM

Zaideh
Zaideh
Zaideh
Zaideh
Zaideh

ROFL

Sounds like the lyrics to Tzena tzena

I watched it again. Looks like there is something in his left hand already to me before he reaches in his suit?

You know, I don't need any more info on what a shadey character this guy is and represents, but it sure is curious.

Even the handerchief doesn't fly. Anything they needed at the podium they were supposed to hand over and have it PLACED there.

It doesn't even matter WHAT he took out of his pocket --whether it was extra paper or hanky --he was not supposed to take anything out of his pocket.

Which he clearly did. He took something from his pocket and placed it on the podium and whatever it was --was NOT allowed.

But remember, he had a hissy fit over the time moniter --after he agreed to (of course he changed his mind) and I wonder if he brought something to cover it. Even that would be a violation.

It may be something petty but it still shows that he has no regard for the rules --even those he agreed to.

#183 Zeidah (demmit) ;-)

No, not a pro, certainly, but good enough to fool most of the audience for awhile.

Actually, he has the audacity and, as we say in the magic biz, the 'angles' (sightlines) in his favor. One of the things that trips up wannabe magicians is what we call 'magician's guilt' - it usually shows up as an incongruency in body language that tells the audience he's doin' something sneaky.

With a practiced (or pathological) liar, no guilt and thus no dissonant body language.

But he turned too soon and might have done better to lower his hand a tad, using the 'shade' of the lectern to further hide his move.

That he, and therefore his lectern, are taller, it's a virtual guarantee that no one on stage could see the notes in the deep well at the top of that lectern.

Shame he didn't remember the backstage camera. ;-)

Hi, Ploome!

Hugs back to you.

We had a very nice, albeit quiet New Year.
So far, things are going swimmingly for me & the fambly.
New granddaughter at the supper table.
Calls herself Amanda.
Well, that is, she can't talk yet; only 9 weeks old.
But she types very well.
Looks like Meema may have a redheaded girl to complement her own crimson locks.

#177,

I agree, he's not trying to hide it very well. He's almost facing forward by the time he's got the object out of his jacket, and then he looks down at it as he grabs it with both hands. It's a rectangular object, and he has to spin it around to have the short side at the top before doing the little "flip" or unfolding or whatever and placing it on the podium. The fact that he's holding it with both hands may indicate it has some weight to it, unlike just a piece of paper, or he may just need both hands to unfold it, if it is some kind of paper cheat sheet, rather than a device.

This is like trying to figure out what's going on in the frickin' Zapruder film!

Where are the overhead cameras when you need them? How precious would it be to see a shot of Kerry using a PDA during the dabate?

QM

After he gets to the podium you can almost hear him unfold something near the mic.

On the subject of a device - Surely there was a cell phone jammer in the hall to prevent someone using a blackberry or SMS device.

There was a camera flash at the time when Kerry faced forward towards the audience.

I wonder what would show up on that picture.

This was touched on in a previous comment, but I think the big thing here was his comments at the opening:

KERRY: I know I can do a better job in Iraq. I have a plan to have a summit with all of the allies, something this president has not yet achieved, not yet been able to do to bring people to the table.

We can do a better job of training the Iraqi forces to defend themselves, and I know that we can do a better job of preparing for elections.

All of these, and especially homeland security, which we'll talk about a little bit later.

How does he know what is coming up later in the debate unless he had a list of questions prior to the event???!!!

This snake (JFK) would do anything to win this race. He's been running for this opportunity ever since Vietnam. i.e. His home movies playing war hero. :-)

Has anyone thought of sending this info into Fox or Rush? They would be the only ones who would break something like this. We know they will deny it, but at least it would be fun to watch them spin it for a few days. LOL No one whinnes like a yellow belly liberal when they get caught playing one of there dirty tricks.

Why is anyone suprised? Dems always cheat. Look at all the voter fraud. 90% of it is from democrats. If you want to say republicans cheat too then they must be a heck of a lot smarter to not get caught all the time like the dems. Yes, Kerry looked a lot better at the debate than Bush. But Kerry is a fake. All you need to do is look at his voting record. What he says is meaningless when he has a consistent record voting against defense and for higher taxes all the time. Come on, it is hard to be more liberal than Ted Kennedy and his voting record is! When we need to do some serious terrorist butt kicking I'll vote for the stupid looking guy that I know will get the job done.

#1- skippy
Wow...great kudos to all who did the tech stuff on this one. Not that it will matter much as the MSM won't pick up on it.

Drudge just said (on his radio show) that the NYT will have this story on their front page tomorrow. I'll believe it when I see it. The Kerry campaign is saying it was his "favorite pen". Since when do you unfold a pen? Plus, even his fav pen would be breaking the rules. I guess debating rules don't pass the global test!

#196 Texas Lady

Has anyone thought of sending this info into Fox or Rush? They would be the only ones who would break something like this. We know they will deny it, but at least it would be fun to watch them spin it for a few days

I'm guessing both FOX and Rush have their eye on LGF.

And I'd like it to be a big deal for a few days. When I think of spin I recall those old variety show jugglers who would spin plates atop long flexible sticks. They'd have fifteen or twenty plates all spinning at once, darting from stick to stick to add more centripetal inertia to a slowing and tipping plate.

It makes me feel good to imagine Terry McAwful rushing like a madman to keep all the various spins going. Let's give him more.

#162
Good observations.

You should also link to media player classic. A great way to play a few other formats without having to bother with Apple or Windows Media Player.

Cox & Forkum are you lurking?

Could they be forged memos???

NEED HELP FROM SOMEONE WHO CAN TAKE QUALITY STILLS FROM STREAMING VIDEO OF DEBATE ...

(Of course, the broadcast vid would be higher res.)

Here is the streamer.

A friend of mine swears she saw a hearing aid, but AFAIK Kerry is not hard of hearing (not in that sense, anyway).

At 2:43 he turns his head toward the president and there is SOMETHING in his right ear.

This suggests a radio link to his handlers, does it not?

I stopped the stream and made a full-size screen cap and then cropped his head and blew it up nearly 3x. There is definitely something in his right ear.

If someone can post it at LGF I'll email it to you. Let me know.

~~LS

#195 RightofLeft may be on to something. I thought JFK was mighty quick to answer "Nuclear Proliferation" - especially since he was asked first (Bush got that one second). If you listen to the audio he answers even before the question is over. Hmmm..

I don't know if anyone else has mentioned this already, but it might be good to watch Kerry's eyes during his opening statement - to see if they look down towards where the crib sheet would be.

Since he would be allowed to take notes during the course of the debate, he would have a legitimate reason for looking down during his subsequent statements, but not during his opening statement.

#199 Ten Ring
"I'm guessing both FOX and Rush have their eye on LGF."

Heh heh. Oh yeah.
And some folks in much higher places, too.
A while back, we had a guest poster whose address was at STATE.
Not a big fan of the the lizard lounge as I recall.
Anybody remember where those posts might be found in the archives?
(My money's on Zulubaby to find it first.)

The Bride of Monster says we're a bunch of whiny babies.

That means we'll get no traction from this out of the non-partisan voters.

"The Bride of Monster says we're a bunch of whiny babies."

Zaidette agrees with her.
"Now, you guys are getting paranoid!"
Maybe so, sez I, but that don't mean they're not out to get us.

#193 Gadfly

On the subject of a device - Surely there was a cell phone jammer in the hall to prevent someone using a blackberry or SMS device.

It's a university auditorium -- probably the U would leave it clear so that students can email each other. And such a high-tech cheat might not have occurred to the organizers of the debate.

~LS

I tried to bring up the parallel of Nixon, who was winning bigtime, but some of his operatives decided to cheat anyway. That ultimately brought him down.

No traction.

Zaideh, anything for you but I don't understand what you're looking for.

IF it was a handkerchief, well, he broke the rules, but he didn't violate the spirit of the rules.

But if Kerry brought a handkerchief, why would he bother to unfold it? To cover the maximum note-taking area possible?

#204 LS, while you're at it--

Pretty close to the end (I'd guess at about 77 minutes) Kerry's makes a statement about "bush changed his mind, they have a word for that, and he went to the United Nations."

Shortly after that, there is a view from the back where you can see through to the lectern a couple of times when he raises his arms talking about "continuing the inspections." THE COLOR ON THE LECTERN IS A LOT MORE WHITE than it should be.

Now of course this could be the piece of paper provided but someone with great technical stuff might be able to blow it up and find that it's a piece of paper OTHER than the one provided. Long shot, perhaps, but it could be the smoking gun.

#210 Lee Shore

I was thinking they would have set up jammers to reduce bomb risks like was reportedly done at the Dem and Rep conventions. (sidebar - What are the rules nowadays in a U to prevent using SMS to cheat on say an exam?)

So a question is: Can anyone confirm if cell phones were working in there at the time?

Personally I can't believe anyone would try anything so obvious. Think of the bruhah if discovered. Then again one could claim it was an "honest mistake" if discovered with it(i.e. it was in my pocket and I was trying to turn it off) and an electronic device could be more easily erased than a list of questions.

During the Edwards debated we'll need a paranormal investigator to make sure JE isn't channeling in to some braintrust - sorry but I couldn't resist;)

#215 litany_of_lies

The streamng vid is too low-res for that sort of analysis, I'm afraid. Professional image enhancement might show something but it's probably all washed out at the pixel level.

What we need is a broadcast video cassette of the debate -- that would be much better res.

~LS

#216 Gadfly

At the conventions? I thought that Blackberries were absolutely essential for the gofers.

In any event, the auditorium would have been thoroughly swept for bombs before the debate and all of the attendees had to pass through security screening, so there would be no way of getting explosives into the hall to be set off later by cell phone.

I don't know how the U would prevent PDA cheating -- maybe they force the students to park them at the door. It's way out of my experience -- we had to pass notes. :-)

[Lee hastens to note that he never cheated this way]

~LS

I didn't see anything in his ear...

I've obtained Kerry's cheat sheet.

Congratulations! The story is now being picked up by some sites on Google News. Of course, indymedia is also on google news...

Still, this is exciting!

Guys, this is unimportant. GET OVER IT. It's a non-issue. There are life and death issues at stake, this is a colosal waste of time, effort, and credability.

Digital paper

[Link: news.bbc.co.uk...]

Only the INSIDERS really know what Kerry pulled out of his coat.

Remember when he went to CAMBODIA, and ferried the "CIA" guy there and received a special "lucky hat"?

It was the "LUCKY HAT", gentlemen, that he took to the podium.

Or his "Lucky NOTE CARDS".

Or his lucky "Text messaging device."

Or his "LUCKY LIES" about virtually EVERYTHING he said.

FAUX, FUAX, FAUX homme.

Guys, this is unimportant. GET OVER IT. It's a non-issue. There are life and death issues at stake, this is a colosal waste of time, effort, and credability.

This sounds like talking points from the former Clinton's damage control team.

Kerry's Podium Medal Toss:

I reached up into my jacket pocket and pulled out the medals, which were symbols of my military service and I tossed them on the podium.

Sorry Charles, but Quicktime for Windows is slow as molasses.

I'd recommend Media Player Classic to anyone who wants a lightweight, multi-codec video player for Windows.

Lee Shore: NEED HELP FROM SOMEONE WHO CAN TAKE QUALITY STILLS FROM STREAMING VIDEO OF DEBATE ...

Streaming video is too low-res to get quality stills. We need the source, from the cable broadcast, via a TIVO recording or a VHS tape.

#224 scotsilv

The device is 13mm thick and its screen measures 15cm diagonally.

wild. I want one.

I don't need one, but I want one...in case...I have to debate...or something like that...

This is the first I've heard of Jacketgate.

Unbelieveable. No, wait... totally believeable.

after watching it again, it still looks like he is unfolding a piece of paper. Even if the paper was blank, he broke the rules. This gigolo POS thinks the rules don't apply to him.
And the odds that the piece of paper is a love note from Ter-ay-za is very low. He was CHEATING!!! It appears you cannot be a Democratic political candidate unless you are a smooth-talking liar and a cheat. What happened to the Democrat Party? They really went to hell.

...remembering my grandfather in Massachusetts, he ALWAYS carried an ironed, folded white cloth hankerchief. ( another possibility )

I'm late to the thread, but...

Isn't using video from any of the debates a no-no for any participant, by the rules?

I seem to recall Fox News saying a couple of days ago that the Dems had created a montage of "unflattering" shots of President Bush from the debate video to use.

I believe that is clearly a violation of the rules. But then again, since when did rules mean anything to the LLL?

Perhaps he had diarrhoea and brought clean underwear?

Update: We are standing by our story.

Wow. There are some incredibly sharp eyes here ... or really good imaginations.

I have no idea what he pulled out of his pocket. If it's anything but a hankie, he should be roasted alive for cheating.

Regarding the "tangible thing" argument, the context is clearly "any tangible thing that could aid memory" etc. If we're getting worked up over a hankie, I'm afraid we'll end up looking rather foolish.

The New York Post says it is a black pen.

QM

Also in the Post story, the Kerry campaign admits to violating the rules:

Kerry campaign spokesman David Wade remained angry at the bloggers' guilt-by-insinuation

"The right-wing attack machine will say anything to steal a debate do-over," he said.

"We plead guilty to having a pen.".

So yes, they broke the rules by bringing something into the debate that was prohibited. Of course, the good liar, when caught, will admit to a lesser infraction to try and get away with it ...

For some reason, i had the debate saved on Tivo. It was a pen for chrissakes. What a waste of energy.

The one thing it did not look like to me was a black pen! WTH?

DocDubIU: For some reason, i had the debate saved on Tivo. It was a pen for chrissakes. What a waste of energy.

Thanks. Having a VHS or Tivo recording is the clincher. The streamed video was way to low-res. Any chance you can send this to Charles so we can all have a look?

I'm sure it was a pen. A white, flat, square pen.

Tivo users here - I just got a Tivo and noticed that "live tv" as well as the recordings are brighter and grainy than watching directly from tv. I use best quality for recording.

Is this normal? Or do I have a defective Tivo player?

I can't find an answer in Tivo or Tivo Community.

tia,
JG

I'm sure it was a pen. A white, flat, square pen.

Exactly.

Also, in the subsequent scene (I have the debate taped), Kerry can be seen unfolding a piece of paper.

(The paper is not visible in that subsequent shot, but you can see Kerry's hands unfolding something.)
 

What happened to the marketplace of ideas?

Does anyone remember what Kerry said?

For future debates I would simply offer a videotape of Zell Miller at the RNC Convention to rebut Kerry or maybe John O'Neil.

There are countless questions Senator Kerry has been unwilling to answer, but President Bush simply refused to ask.

So what if its a cheat sheet? This game is for keeps, and if you don't have a dress with a stain, you don't have the right to complain.

What kind of wireless device is white? Blackberry, no ipaq, no. Sony Clie? no ipod?

Just a thought

Despite polls, support for Kerry is a mile wide and an inch deep. So keep hammering on every flip, on every flop, on every lie, and every cheat. The Republican approach should be as the Dems: ABB; ABK. Kerry sucks!
The real threat to this country isn't terror, but mindless
voters. Unfortunately, those folks are told how and do vote
Democratic.

Al

Odd, all my posts have disappeared. Guess you guys don't like friendly discussion.

Obviously, it was a globular cluster.

#50 JD

Yes JD nobody likes a liar. That's why Kerry's stock went up after the debate. He exposed W for the liar that he has been.

You make a very good point.

BTW. This page is a hoot. Mysterious pens, paper, pdas, blackberries... I was having fun reading all the whining yesterday about how polls don't mean anything and debates are overrated but this takes the cake. I should have to pay to view this stuff.

#204 Lee Shore

If he was wearing a hearing aid don't you think he would have put it IN his eardrum where he would be able to hear it instead of at the top of his ear? It couldn't have been the light could it?