Poll: Republicans Suddenly Realize Their Medicare is Getting Cut Too

Reality backlash
Politics • Views: 32,860

Interesting results in this new national McClatchy-Marist poll; apparently the Republican base isn’t so hot on cutting Medicare and Medicaid after all.

And a very sizeable percentage of Republicans also likes the idea of the wealthy paying higher taxes.

On tackling the deficit, voters by a margin of 2-to-1 support raising taxes on incomes above $250,000, with 64 percent in favor and 33 percent opposed.

Independents supported higher taxes on the wealthy by 63-34 percent; Democrats by 83-15 percent; and Republicans opposed by 43-54 percent.

Support for higher taxes rose by 5 percentage points after Obama called for that as one element of his deficit-reduction strategy last week. Opposition dropped by 6 points. The poll was conducted before and after the speech.

Americans clearly don’t want the government to cut Medicare, the government health program for the elderly, or Medicaid, the program for the poor. Republicans in the House of Representatives voted last week to drastically restructure and reduce those programs, while Obama calls for trimming their costs but leaving them essentially intact.

Voters oppose cuts to those programs by 80-18 percent. Even among conservatives, only 29 percent supported cuts, and 68 percent opposed them.

Looks like a little reality backlash going on. Republicans suddenly woke up and realized, “Hey! You mean MY Medicare is going away too?”

Jump to bottom

316 comments
1 Brother Holy Cruise Missile of Mild Acceptance  Tue, Apr 19, 2011 1:04:31pm

Is this the time to say “Told ya so” to them?

2 Gus  Tue, Apr 19, 2011 1:04:39pm

I’d be willing to die to keep the Bush tax cuts for the wealthy going.

//Sad-angry and confused middle class wingnut.

3 Glenn Beck's Grand Unifying Theory of Obdicut  Tue, Apr 19, 2011 1:04:52pm

I think we’re discovering the limits of propaganda. The GOP’s message has gotten incoherent; after decrying HCR for slashing Medicare, it’s awkward for them to suddenly be all about slashing Medicare.

4 Targetpractice  Tue, Apr 19, 2011 1:04:57pm

What’s that sound? Oh, it’s the Tea Party crumbling into the sea.

5 Gus  Tue, Apr 19, 2011 1:05:38pm

re: #4 Targetpractice, Worst of Both Worlds

What’s that sound? Oh, it’s the Tea Party crumbling into the sea.

How’s that Objectivism treatin’ ya’?

//

6 jaunte  Tue, Apr 19, 2011 1:05:57pm

Too bad so many are still in favor of economic suicide.

At the same time, they say that the government should not raise the legal debt ceiling, which the government must do soon to borrow more money, despite warnings that failing to do so would force the government into default, credit markets into turmoil and the economy into a tailspin.
7 Gus  Tue, Apr 19, 2011 1:06:38pm

It’s funny. The GOP gets working stiffs to vote for them by instilling fear of gays, Muslims, abortion, and taxes yet they rarely if ever vote on the side of the working stiff.

8 Brother Holy Cruise Missile of Mild Acceptance  Tue, Apr 19, 2011 1:07:28pm

re: #6 jaunte

The problem there is people don’t get the consequences of not raising the debt ceiling and no one has really done a good job in spelling those out, at least not on the TV etc.

9 Glenn Beck's Grand Unifying Theory of Obdicut  Tue, Apr 19, 2011 1:07:34pm

re: #6 jaunte

Too bad so many are still in favor of economic suicide.

I don’t think they really understand it. To them, it’s just ‘No more debt’. Not ‘therefore, economy collapses’.

10 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Tue, Apr 19, 2011 1:07:50pm

re: #8 Dreggas

The problem there is people don’t get the consequences of not raising the debt ceiling and no one has really done a good job in spelling those out, at least not on the TV etc.

agreed

11 HappyWarrior  Tue, Apr 19, 2011 1:08:04pm

They got for they voted for. I have no sympathy for them. Did they not hear their candidates who got elected?

12 Gus  Tue, Apr 19, 2011 1:08:56pm

Don’t you people worry about Medicare and Medicaid. We’re working hard on stopping gay marriage. — GOP

13 Killgore Trout  Tue, Apr 19, 2011 1:09:23pm

re: #6 jaunte

Too bad so many are still in favor of economic suicide.

I think that’s because most people don’t understand what’s involved with the debt ceiling.

14 Kragar (Antichrist )  Tue, Apr 19, 2011 1:09:35pm

re: #11 HappyWarrior

They got for they voted for. I have no sympathy for them. Did they not hear their candidates who got elected?

And Animal House comes to mind:

“You fucked up. You trusted us.”

15 Targetpractice  Tue, Apr 19, 2011 1:09:48pm

re: #9 Obdicut

I don’t think they really understand it. To them, it’s just ‘No more debt’. Not ‘therefore, economy collapses’.

A lot of that has to do with the fact that, in the past, it’s not been made a major deal. The GOP raised it several times during the course of the Bush years, but there was no big fanfare about it. The bill was drawn up, was voted upon, and signed without a blip.

16 engineer cat  Tue, Apr 19, 2011 1:10:05pm

i suggest that all of us progressives should take up a collection to finance paul ryan on a national tour or tv appearance to explain his plan in detail to as many americans as possible

17 Lidane  Tue, Apr 19, 2011 1:10:10pm

re: #11 HappyWarrior

Did they not hear their candidates who got elected?

Sure. They were going to cut Medicare and Medicaid for all those lazy brown people, sluts who can’t keep their legs closed, and and teh librulz and gays. It wasn’t supposed to affect Real Americans.

/wingnut

18 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Tue, Apr 19, 2011 1:10:19pm

re: #15 Targetpractice, Worst of Both Worlds

A lot of that has to do with the fact that, in the past, it’s not been made a major deal. The GOP raised it several times during the course of the Bush years, but there was no big fanfare about it. The bill was drawn up, was voted upon, and signed without a blip.


But now the inmates run the asylum

19 Kragar (Antichrist )  Tue, Apr 19, 2011 1:10:33pm

re: #12 Gus 802

Don’t you people worry about Medicare and Medicaid. We’re working hard on stopping gay marriage. — GOP

You’ll die younger and broker, but at least those 2 gay guys down the street won’t be legally married.

20 Lidane  Tue, Apr 19, 2011 1:11:35pm

re: #13 Killgore Trout

I think that’s because most people don’t understand what’s involved with the debt ceiling.

Because they’ve never had to understand it before. The debt ceiling has been raised with no fanfare in the past. Now they’re making a huge deal out of something that most people have never had to understand before.

21 Kragar (Antichrist )  Tue, Apr 19, 2011 1:12:43pm

re: #20 Lidane

Because they’ve never had to understand it before. The debt ceiling has been raised with no fanfare in the past. Now they’re making a huge deal out of something that most people have never had to understand before.

Its always fun to make something old sound new.
/

22 Targetpractice  Tue, Apr 19, 2011 1:12:50pm

re: #18 WindUpBird

But now the inmates run the asylum

Many of them hypocrites of the worst kind, who feel that raising the debt limit in order to afford paying for items like Medicare and Social Security to be against America’s best interests, but had no problem raising it for two major wars and an unfunded Medicare drug program.

And Paul Ryan, as the current GOP poster boy, is a perfect example of how they all suddenly “got religion” the same day: Jan 20th, 2009.

23 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Tue, Apr 19, 2011 1:12:53pm

re: #13 Killgore Trout

I think that’s because most people don’t understand what’s involved with the debt ceiling.

they don’t understand anything about how an economy functions, at all

most people just have no clue. The economy is about as understandable to them as the fusion reactions on the surface of the sun

All they know is “economy bad, economy good”

24 jaunte  Tue, Apr 19, 2011 1:13:36pm

Playing chicken:

GOP leaders ‘recognize’ that averting default through a vote to approve a higher debt limit is necessary, Treasury Secretary Timothy Geithner says, with or without a deal on budget cuts. But Republicans push back. latimes.com
25 Targetpractice  Tue, Apr 19, 2011 1:14:36pm

re: #24 jaunte

Playing chicken:

And if the debt limit does not go up and the economy crashes, the GOP as a political party is history.

26 Lidane  Tue, Apr 19, 2011 1:16:23pm

re: #25 Targetpractice, Worst of Both Worlds

And if the debt limit does not go up and the economy crashes, the GOP as a political party is history.

But…but… they’re out there protecting Real America! See?

Gov. Brewer Signs Law Giving Tea Party Flag Same Status As American Flag

27 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Tue, Apr 19, 2011 1:16:39pm

re: #25 Targetpractice, Worst of Both Worlds

And if the debt limit does not go up and the economy crashes, the GOP as a political party is history.

I wish I could be confident in that

Tribalism runs deep

28 Killgore Trout  Tue, Apr 19, 2011 1:16:50pm

re: #26 Lidane

But…but… they’re out there protecting Real America! See?

Gov. Brewer Signs Law Giving Tea Party Flag Same Status As American Flag

Ha!

29 Targetpractice  Tue, Apr 19, 2011 1:17:16pm

re: #26 Lidane

But…but… they’re out there protecting Real America! See?

Gov. Brewer Signs Law Giving Tea Party Flag Same Status As American Flag

*head desk*

30 jaunte  Tue, Apr 19, 2011 1:17:27pm

re: #25 Targetpractice, Worst of Both Worlds

Trump continues to burnish clown credentials:
Trump hits back at Rove, GOP critics,
Urges firm stand against debt-ceiling increase

31 zora  Tue, Apr 19, 2011 1:17:31pm

thinkprogress.org

VIDEO: The Truth About GOP Hero Ayn Rand

During her lifetime, Rand advocated “the virtue of selfishness,” declared altruism to be “evil,” opposed Medicare and all forms of government support for the middle-class and the poor, and condemned Christianity for advocating love and compassion for the less fortunate

32 Gus  Tue, Apr 19, 2011 1:17:42pm

re: #26 Lidane

But…but… they’re out there protecting Real America! See?

Gov. Brewer Signs Law Giving Tea Party Flag Same Status As American Flag

Crisis averted!

33 First As Tragedy, Then As Farce  Tue, Apr 19, 2011 1:17:58pm
34 Stanley Sea  Tue, Apr 19, 2011 1:18:08pm

re: #26 Lidane

But…but… they’re out there protecting Real America! See?

Gov. Brewer Signs Law Giving Tea Party Flag Same Status As American Flag

WOW

35 Targetpractice  Tue, Apr 19, 2011 1:18:43pm

re: #27 WindUpBird

I wish I could be confident in that

Tribalism runs deep

You’re right, I should rephrase that. The days of the GOP as a major political party will be over. It may survive as a regional party, but that’s about it.

36 Lidane  Tue, Apr 19, 2011 1:18:43pm
37 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Tue, Apr 19, 2011 1:18:46pm

re: #33 negativ

David Barton: The Bible opposes Net Neutrality

lol


the crazy comes so fast, my cup runneth over

38 Gus  Tue, Apr 19, 2011 1:19:05pm

re: #33 negativ

David Barton: The Bible opposes Net Neutrality

Jesus would have opposed Net Neutrality.
Jesus would have opposed Medicaid and Medicare.
Jesus would have opposed raising the debt limit.

//

39 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Tue, Apr 19, 2011 1:19:13pm

re: #35 Targetpractice, Worst of Both Worlds

You’re right, I should rephrase that. The days of the GOP as a major political party will be over. It may survive as a regional party, but that’s about it.

or it’ll survive as rioters

40 Kragar (Antichrist )  Tue, Apr 19, 2011 1:19:18pm

re: #31 zora

[Link: thinkprogress.org…]

Well, to be fair, the Evangelicals have been trying to cut out the whole love and compassion angle out of their churches.

41 Gus  Tue, Apr 19, 2011 1:19:29pm

Jesus would have supported a tax cap on luxury yachts.

42 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Tue, Apr 19, 2011 1:19:32pm

re: #38 Gus 802

Piss Christ would be all for Net Neutrality

43 Targetpractice  Tue, Apr 19, 2011 1:19:46pm

re: #33 negativ

David Barton: The Bible opposes Net Neutrality

When did I miss the right turn towards a 21st century America and end up in the Dark Ages?

44 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Tue, Apr 19, 2011 1:20:03pm

Piss Christ supports a tax cap on dragsters and dunebuggies

45 jaunte  Tue, Apr 19, 2011 1:20:15pm

re: #33 negativ

It’s Authentic Frontier Gibberish:

Barton: This is the Fairness Doctrine applied to the Internet, and I’ll go back to what I believed for a long time is: fair is a word no Christian should ever use in their vocabulary. Fair has nothing to do with anything. What you want is justice, you don’t want fairness. Fairness is subjective, what I think is fair, what you think, what happened to Jesus wasn’t fair. That’s right, but we needed justice so God did that for us.
46 HappyWarrior  Tue, Apr 19, 2011 1:20:44pm

Jesus also supports shooting wolves from a helicopter. How do I know this despite the fact that Christ lived in a time before guns of helicopters? Why, David Barton the great biblical scholar told me so.

47 Killgore Trout  Tue, Apr 19, 2011 1:20:51pm

There is a serious problem with medicare and social security. These programs need to be fixed and some very difficult and unpopular choices will have to be made. The problem is that Republicans are not serious about making these programs work, they want to eliminate them. It’s made even worse that they want to cut these programs for the poor and elderly while cutting taxes for the rich.

48 Kragar (Antichrist )  Tue, Apr 19, 2011 1:20:53pm

re: #33 negativ

David Barton: The Bible opposes Net Neutrality

Shepherds 2000 years ago did not have an opinion on IT networks.

49 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Tue, Apr 19, 2011 1:20:57pm

re: #45 jaunte

FAIR?? WHO’S THE NIHILIST HERE?!

50 HappyWarrior  Tue, Apr 19, 2011 1:22:20pm

re: #26 Lidane

But…but… they’re out there protecting Real America! See?

Gov. Brewer Signs Law Giving Tea Party Flag Same Status As American Flag

Whole hting sounds sketchy as hell to me. Somehow, I doubt Brewer would support signing a ban on burning the rainbow flag or any other flag that is associated with left wing politics. I would love to know why a flag the TP flies is getting pref treatment. I know the real reason which is that Brewer and many other Republicans are sucked to the tit of the Tea Party.

51 Lidane  Tue, Apr 19, 2011 1:22:52pm

re: #48 Kragar (Proud to be Kafir)

Shepherds 2000 years ago did not have an opinion on IT networks.

They also didn’t give a shit about unions or minimum wage laws, but apparently Jesus hates them too.

52 Targetpractice  Tue, Apr 19, 2011 1:25:37pm

re: #47 Killgore Trout

There is a serious problem with medicare and social security. These programs need to be fixed and some very difficult and unpopular choices will have to be made. The problem is that Republicans are not serious about making these programs work, they want to eliminate them. It’s made even worse that they want to cut these programs for the poor and elderly while cutting taxes for the rich.

The GOP’s not serious about getting our financial house in order, they’re simply looking for another excuse to further raid the treasury in the name of the rich and well-connected. Ryan’s even now trying to sell his Plan, which calls for lumping together the top six tax brackets and cutting them down from 35% to 25%, in addition to doing away with all forms of corporate taxes, as “tax reform.”

53 HappyWarrior  Tue, Apr 19, 2011 1:26:16pm

I can’t believe that this guy Barton is someone Mike Huckabee thinks we should listen to at gunpoint. Really not only was that a stupid statement but there’s also the fact htat David Barton doesn’t have a clue what he’s talking about. And also, who the hell made him God’s voice? I think if I were a religious person, I’d despise the guy even more for acting like he alone is God’s messenger.

54 Gus  Tue, Apr 19, 2011 1:26:49pm

OT: After another short exchange with someone on Twitter — with a case of Charles Johnson Derangement Syndrome — I just wanted to say that moonbats still drive me crazy.

55 Kragar (Antichrist )  Tue, Apr 19, 2011 1:26:56pm

re: #51 Lidane

They also didn’t give a shit about unions or minimum wage laws, but apparently Jesus hates them too.

What is Jesus’s position on the making of movies based on video games?

56 moderatelyradicalliberal  Tue, Apr 19, 2011 1:27:15pm

re: #6 jaunte

Too bad so many are still in favor of economic suicide.

I don’t think people really understand. Our political conversation constantly confuses micro and macro economics so most people probably think not raising the debt ceiling would be like if they stopped paying their credit cards. They are thinking about a bad credit score and harassing phone calls, not causing the next depression that we barely avoided having 2.5 years ago.

57 Lidane  Tue, Apr 19, 2011 1:27:15pm

GOP minority outreach, y’all:

Boehner Declines to Host Cinco de Mayo Event

58 Targetpractice  Tue, Apr 19, 2011 1:28:30pm

re: #57 Lidane

GOP minority outreach, y’all:

Boehner Declines to Host Cinco de Mayo Event

Why should we spend taxpayer dollars celebratin’ some kinda Mexican holiday? That’s money that could go towards defendin’ marriage!

///

59 HappyWarrior  Tue, Apr 19, 2011 1:28:38pm

re: #57 Lidane

GOP minority outreach, y’all:

Boehner Declines to Host Cinco de Mayo Event

He is however hosting a free tour of Wonka’s Chocolate factory. Unfortunately, the factory’s since been moved due to outsourcing.

60 Lidane  Tue, Apr 19, 2011 1:28:40pm

re: #55 Kragar (Proud to be Kafir)

What is Jesus’s position on the making of movies based on video games?

That depends. Is Uwe Boll directing?

61 Targetpractice  Tue, Apr 19, 2011 1:29:09pm

re: #60 Lidane

That depends. Is Uwe Boll directing?

If he is, then it’s a sin against God that is grounds for excommunication.

//

62 Killgore Trout  Tue, Apr 19, 2011 1:29:37pm

re: #57 Lidane

GOP minority outreach, y’all:

Boehner Declines to Host Cinco de Mayo Event

Hilarious….

Congressional Hispanic Caucus chairman Charlie Gonzalez, D-Texas, reportedly wrote a letter to Boehner urging him to reconsider. But Boehner rejected the request. The reception may not have looked good for the GOP at a time when it’s taking a tough stance on illegal immigration.
63 engineer cat  Tue, Apr 19, 2011 1:29:44pm

re: #53 HappyWarrior

And also, who the hell made him God’s voice?

i’ve never been able to get a straight answer as to who makes the decision as to which part of the old testament is still god’s law and which part has been ‘superceeded by the new covenant’. also, when is it necessary to take the word of the bible literally and when is it permissible to reinterpret it wildly?

64 Gus  Tue, Apr 19, 2011 1:30:48pm

Recession!

Executive Pay Skyrockets 23 Percent In 2010, Top 299 CEOs Get $3.4 Billion

WASHINGTON — CEOs at 299 U.S. companies earned a staggering $3.4 billion combined in executive compensation in 2010, a new study by the nation’s largest labor union found.

Nearly 190 of those chief executives got a pay raise compared to their 2009 levels, the AFL-CIO noted in a report presented to reporters on Tuesday. The total amount of compensation represented a 23 percent increase from the prior year. In all, the sum of the salaries earned by those 299 CEOs equalled the combined average earnings of more than 100,000 workers in their respective companies…

65 Targetpractice  Tue, Apr 19, 2011 1:32:06pm

re: #64 Gus 802

Recession!

Executive Pay Skyrockets 23 Percent In 2010, Top 299 CEOs Get $3.4 Billion

Thank God that we didn’t give into the temptation to use TARP funds as the basis for putting limits on executive pay. Can you imagine all that talent going unrewarded?

///

66 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Tue, Apr 19, 2011 1:32:12pm

Piss Christ says never cross your palm with a hot dog


hail eris

67 b_sharp  Tue, Apr 19, 2011 1:32:41pm

Whoever is spiking the US water supplies with mind bending euphorics has world domination through Socialism in mind. Don’t trust anybody displaying the tea party flag, they’ve been compromised.

68 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Tue, Apr 19, 2011 1:33:03pm

re: #57 Lidane

GOP minority outreach, y’all:

Boehner Declines to Host Cinco de Mayo Event

Oh he can’t be seen with brown people, that’s no good

69 b_sharp  Tue, Apr 19, 2011 1:33:49pm

re: #55 Kragar (Proud to be Kafir)

What is Jesus’s position on the making of movies based on video games?

I think Stan prefers they be made from comics his graphic novels.

70 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Tue, Apr 19, 2011 1:34:00pm

re: #67 b_sharp

so that’s why I’m drawing all this stuff


gonna go get me another glass of tap water!

71 moderatelyradicalliberal  Tue, Apr 19, 2011 1:34:05pm

re: #57 Lidane

GOP minority outreach, y’all:

Boehner Declines to Host Cinco de Mayo Event

Oh, fuck him. Down here in Texas everybody celebrates Cinco de Mayo. It’s awesome. You know you are a stone cold bigot or catering to them when you pass up on a good party.

There’s all kinds of fuckery going on down here in Texas, but we’ll be partying come May 5th. And then after that it’s Juneteenth time.

72 jaunte  Tue, Apr 19, 2011 1:34:17pm

re: #64 Gus 802

Hey, a poor man never hired me to build his newly-a-tax-bargain yacht!
(neither did a rich man, come to think of it…)

73 Kragar (Antichrist )  Tue, Apr 19, 2011 1:34:17pm

re: #68 WindUpBird

Oh he can’t be seen with brown people, that’s no good

Better skip sushi bars as well, just to make sure.

74 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Tue, Apr 19, 2011 1:34:27pm

re: #54 Gus 802

OT: After another short exchange with someone on Twitter — with a case of Charles Johnson Derangement Syndrome — I just wanted to say that moonbats still drive me crazy.

oh yeah!

it’s just that, they’re not a threat :D They’re just obnoxious

75 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Tue, Apr 19, 2011 1:34:41pm

re: #73 Kragar (Proud to be Kafir)

Taco bell is fine tho

76 Gus  Tue, Apr 19, 2011 1:35:02pm

re: #65 Targetpractice, Worst of Both Worlds

Thank God that we didn’t give into the temptation to use TARP funds as the basis for putting limits on executive pay. Can you imagine all that talent going unrewarded?

///

In these hard times I just thank the Lord Jesus that these corporations found the money to financially remunerate these hard working gentlemen for all they have done to keep the financial community upright. It must have been done with great sacrifice.

77 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Tue, Apr 19, 2011 1:35:30pm

re: #71 moderatelyradicalliberal

Oh, fuck him. Down here in Texas everybody celebrates Cinco de Mayo. It’s awesome. You know you are a stone cold bigot or catering to them when you pass up on a good party.

There’s all kinds of fuckery going on down here in Texas, but we’ll be partying come May 5th. And then after that it’s Juneteenth time.


Boehner speaking spanish words aloud, that’s political trouble!

78 HappyWarrior  Tue, Apr 19, 2011 1:36:28pm

re: #64 Gus 802

Recession!

Executive Pay Skyrockets 23 Percent In 2010, Top 299 CEOs Get $3.4 Billion

But they can’t be bothered with a tax increase.

79 jaunte  Tue, Apr 19, 2011 1:36:36pm

re: #77 WindUpBird

Oddly enough, Señor Boehner has a website: sites.google.com

80 b_sharp  Tue, Apr 19, 2011 1:36:44pm

re: #76 Gus 802

In these hard times I just thank the Lord Jesus that these corporations found the money to financially remunerate these hard working gentlemen for all they have done to keep the financial community upright. It must have been done with great sacrifice.

Just don’t cross the man.

81 Gus  Tue, Apr 19, 2011 1:36:56pm

re: #74 WindUpBird

oh yeah!

it’s just that, they’re not a threat :D They’re just obnoxious

Yeah. It’s like arguing with a bible thumper. They treat ideology like some kind of religion.

82 Kragar (Antichrist )  Tue, Apr 19, 2011 1:36:58pm

re: #75 WindUpBird

Taco bell is fine tho

Buddy of mine in the Marines last name was Martinez, came from Wisconsin and didn’t speak a word of Spanish. As he would say “Dude, I’m as Mexican as Taco Bell.”

83 Targetpractice  Tue, Apr 19, 2011 1:37:24pm

re: #76 Gus 802

In these hard times I just thank the Lord Jesus that these corporations found the money to financially remunerate these hard working gentlemen for all they have done to keep the financial community upright. It must have been done with great sacrifice.

Praise be to Adam Smith!

///

84 Gus  Tue, Apr 19, 2011 1:37:43pm

re: #78 HappyWarrior

But they can’t be bothered with a tax increase.

They’re creating jobs with those tax cuts!

//

85 moderatelyradicalliberal  Tue, Apr 19, 2011 1:38:29pm

re: #77 WindUpBird

Boehner speaking spanish words aloud, that’s political trouble!

He’s so damned orange he’s probably afraid that standing next to too many Mexicans would confuse the wingnuts. They seem to dislike him enough as it is after he got rolled by Reid and Obama during budget negotiations.

86 Gus  Tue, Apr 19, 2011 1:38:39pm

re: #83 Targetpractice, Worst of Both Worlds

Praise be to Adam Smith!

///

The meek rich shall inherit the Earth!

87 Targetpractice  Tue, Apr 19, 2011 1:39:00pm

re: #84 Gus 802

They’re creating jobs with those tax cuts!

//

And China and India thank us greatly for not raising taxes on the rich daily.

88 b_sharp  Tue, Apr 19, 2011 1:40:22pm

re: #85 moderatelyradicalliberal

He’s so damned orange he’s probably afraid that standing next to too many Mexicans would confuse the wingnuts. They seem to dislike him enough as it is after he got rolled by Reid and Obama during budget negotiations.

Wingnuts certainly aren’t colourblind.

89 Gus  Tue, Apr 19, 2011 1:41:45pm

It’s easier to get a camel yacht through the eye of a needle then it is to get a rich poor man into hell! — Ayn Rand Gospels

90 simoom  Tue, Apr 19, 2011 1:41:53pm

re: #8 Dreggas

The problem there is people don’t get the consequences of not raising the debt ceiling and no one has really done a good job in spelling those out, at least not on the TV etc.

Not just the consequences, but what it represents (paying for already incurred debts) and that even the most draconian deficit reduction plans currently being floated would require raising the debt ceiling additional times in the future.

91 The Yankee  Tue, Apr 19, 2011 1:42:25pm

The one thing that drives me nuts is that no one seems to be making a big enough deal about what Paul Ryan wants to do to Medicare. No sane insurance company wants an 60 something as a member no manner how big a voucher they get. Let alone a 70 something.

This alone proves just how childish and actually stupid The House Republicans are.

And the only way that can work is if you mandate the insurance companies to take these people. Which mean he wants ObamaCare for seniors but not young healthy.

I am shocked that no insurance companies or AARP hasn’t made a bigger deal about this yet.

92 Gus  Tue, Apr 19, 2011 1:42:48pm

Eat the rich poor! — Ayn Rand Punk

93 Lidane  Tue, Apr 19, 2011 1:43:34pm

Heh. Talk about perfect timing. This song just came up in my shuffle.

:)

94 b_sharp  Tue, Apr 19, 2011 1:44:09pm

I sense a pattern here.

Has anyone done a study on politicians with either Paul or Rand in their names?

95 Kragar (Antichrist )  Tue, Apr 19, 2011 1:44:25pm

re: #93 Lidane

Heh. Talk about perfect timing. This song just came up in my shuffle.

:)

I had this come up on Pandora

96 Glenn Beck's Grand Unifying Theory of Obdicut  Tue, Apr 19, 2011 1:44:42pm

re: #94 b_sharp

Don’t think so.

en.wikipedia.org

97 wrenchwench  Tue, Apr 19, 2011 1:46:12pm

re: #54 Gus 802

OT: After another short exchange with someone on Twitter — with a case of Charles Johnson Derangement Syndrome — I just wanted to say that moonbats still drive me crazy.

I like your new photo on Twitter. TWO pony tails, if I’m not mistaken.

98 Gus  Tue, Apr 19, 2011 1:46:47pm

re: #97 wrenchwench

I like your new photo on Twitter. TWO pony tails, if I’m not mistaken.

Yep. That’s Zappa of course.

99 b_sharp  Tue, Apr 19, 2011 1:47:14pm

re: #96 Obdicut

Don’t think so.

[Link: en.wikipedia.org…]

So, it looks like the name David can negate the name Paul when it comes to politicians.

Interesting.

100 Gus  Tue, Apr 19, 2011 1:47:20pm

re: #97 wrenchwench

I like your new photo on Twitter. TWO pony tails, if I’m not mistaken.

Pigtails. Should freak the dweebs with Ponytail Derangement Syndrome though. Dorks! ;)

101 moderatelyradicalliberal  Tue, Apr 19, 2011 1:48:02pm

Oh, this is good. Is our Democrats learning?

tpmdc.talkingpointsmemo.com


Democrats say Republicans showed their true colors when they voted to blow up Medicare as we know it last week. Now, as members return home for the holiday recess, the Democratic Congressional Campaign Committee (DCCC) is making sure people know about the vote, with a new ad campaign that targets 25 members across the country.

The TV ad imagines a future where Medicare recipients are left in the lurch once a proposed $15,000 annual health insurance voucher runs out. It shows seniors trying to make up the lost Medicare cash by mowing laws, selling lemonade and stripping at parties.

“How will you pay?” the spot asks.

The DCCC says it will run the ad in Speaker John Boehner’s Ohio district if they can raise $25,000 in the next 48 hours.

102 Gus  Tue, Apr 19, 2011 1:48:27pm

“He that has pity on the poor rich lends to the Lord.”

103 What, me worry?  Tue, Apr 19, 2011 1:48:47pm

re: #100 Gus 802

Pigtails. Should freak the dweebs with Ponytail Derangement Syndrome though. Dorks! ;)

They just wish they looked so damn good.

104 b_sharp  Tue, Apr 19, 2011 1:49:06pm

re: #99 b_sharp

So, it looks like the name David can negate the name Paul when it comes to politicians.

Interesting.

I wonder what effects a full moon has.

105 Gus  Tue, Apr 19, 2011 1:49:10pm

“Remember the poor rich, it costs nothing.”

106 Targetpractice  Tue, Apr 19, 2011 1:51:40pm

re: #101 moderatelyradicalliberal

Oh, this is good. Is our Democrats learning?

[Link: tpmdc.talkingpointsmemo.com…]

[Video]

Yeah, the Dems should be hitting the Repubs hard and often on this one, because it’s the perfect campaign issue. The Ryan Plan finances huge tax cuts for the wealthy by screwing over the poor and elderly, does nothing to address the elephant in the room that is our defense budget, and runs on imaginary numbers to justify it all due to the CBO’s inability to actually grade it thoroughly due to it being incomplete.

107 Killgore Trout  Tue, Apr 19, 2011 1:52:14pm
108 What, me worry?  Tue, Apr 19, 2011 1:52:52pm

re: #101 moderatelyradicalliberal

Oh, this is good. Is our Democrats learning?

[Link: tpmdc.talkingpointsmemo.com…]

[Video]

We have more material now than ever before. It’s going to be a problem of too many choices. (Think positive!)

Btw, I was hoping you could pop over to Celticdragon’s thread at the top of the Pages and enlighten us with either praise or derision. I’d be interested in your comments.

109 Targetpractice  Tue, Apr 19, 2011 1:53:00pm

re: #107 Killgore Trout

Trump Explains Shifts on Taxes, Healthcare, Abortion


Heh

“I’ve changed!”

110 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Tue, Apr 19, 2011 1:53:05pm

re: #107 Killgore Trout

President Trump


I just giggle when i say it out loud

111 Locker  Tue, Apr 19, 2011 1:53:05pm

Lolly lolly lolly get your adverbs here…

Stupidly
Blindly
Moronically
Fearfully

112 What, me worry?  Tue, Apr 19, 2011 1:55:22pm

re: #107 Killgore Trout

Trump Explains Shifts on Taxes, Healthcare, Abortion

Heh

I was for healthcare before I was against it.

Gawd, that works with just so many things!

113 moderatelyradicalliberal  Tue, Apr 19, 2011 1:56:46pm

re: #108 marjoriemoon

We have more material now than ever before. It’s going to be a problem of too many choices. (Think positive!)

Btw, I was hoping you could pop over to Celticdragon’s thread at the top of the Pages and enlighten us with either praise or derision. I’d be interested in your comments.

I’ll go check it out now.

114 Lidane  Tue, Apr 19, 2011 1:58:30pm

re: #107 Killgore Trout

Trump Explains Shifts on Taxes, Healthcare, Abortion

But can he explain his flip-flop about St. Ronald of Reagan?

thinkprogress.org

116 Targetpractice  Tue, Apr 19, 2011 2:00:39pm

I didn’t think it was possible for the GOP to find a candidate even less suited for the presidency than Sarah, but they managed it in Donald Trump.

“May you live in interesting times,” indeed.

117 Killgore Trout  Tue, Apr 19, 2011 2:01:23pm

re: #115 recusancy

I never thought I would say this, but Donald Trump is far more clueless when it comes to domestic and international issues than even Sarah Palin…

Agreed. He’s a complete joke. It’s almost like there was a deliberate effort to find a candidate less electable than Palin.

118 The Yankee  Tue, Apr 19, 2011 2:01:54pm

re: #116 Targetpractice, Worst of Both Worlds


“May you live in interesting times,” indeed.

I thought that saying was sly way of cursing someone?

119 Lidane  Tue, Apr 19, 2011 2:02:39pm

re: #117 Killgore Trout

Agreed. He’s a complete joke. It’s almost like there was a deliberate effort to find a candidate less electable than Palin.

God help us all if that’s the strategy— get everyone thinking that she’s better than Trump, so if she announces a run, people fall in line.

120 What, me worry?  Tue, Apr 19, 2011 2:03:21pm

re: #116 Targetpractice, Worst of Both Worlds

I didn’t think it was possible for the GOP to find a candidate even less suited for the presidency than Sarah, but they managed it in Donald Trump.

“May you live in interesting times,” indeed.

I wish I could figure a suitable bet, but he ain’t running for dog catcher. He’s going to “announce” on the Apprentice, but it’s a stunt for rating and $. I’m betting on him declining.

There’s no way he’d take the job. Was it KT or you? Too much work for too little money.

121 Lidane  Tue, Apr 19, 2011 2:03:24pm

re: #118 The Yankee

I thought that saying was sly way of cursing someone?

We’re talking about a Trump candidacy. How is that not a curse on people?

Heh.

122 The Yankee  Tue, Apr 19, 2011 2:04:07pm

re: #119 Lidane

God help us all if that’s the strategy— get everyone thinking that she’s better than Trump, so if she announces a run, people fall in line.

Don’t worry there is no strategy, I bet there is going to be more then 15 candidates during the GOP primaries

123 Targetpractice  Tue, Apr 19, 2011 2:04:42pm

re: #120 marjoriemoon

I wish I could figure a suitable bet, but he ain’t running for dog catcher. He’s going to “announce” on the Apprentice, but it’s a stunt for rating and $. I’m betting on him declining.

There’s no way he’d take the job. Was it KT or you? Too much work for too little money.

Probably KT, but I agree with the sentiment, he won’t actually run. Neither will Sarah, for the matter, because she’s making too much money right now as a “free agent.” She’ll hint at it, tempt the loonies, but she’ll never stain her brand by actually joining in for the long haul.

124 The Yankee  Tue, Apr 19, 2011 2:05:31pm

re: #120 marjoriemoon

I wish I could figure a suitable bet, but he ain’t running for dog catcher. He’s going to “announce” on the Apprentice, but it’s a stunt for rating and $. I’m betting on him declining.

There’s no way he’d take the job. Was it KT or you? Too much work for too little money.

Don’t you think, he thinks, that he would make more money by running and loosing. Thats my feelings.

125 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Tue, Apr 19, 2011 2:05:58pm

re: #117 Killgore Trout

Agreed. He’s a complete joke. It’s almost like there was a deliberate effort to find a candidate less electable than Palin.

I actually think Trump is a superior candidate to Palin


Trump is a vaudeville carny, but he’s not dumb. He’s a troll. Palin is unbelievably dumb and incurious. A candidate who is a functionally illiterate rube. You may as well elect Pat Buchanan president, because people of his ilk will be running the show, operating Palin like a Muppet

126 First As Tragedy, Then As Farce  Tue, Apr 19, 2011 2:07:32pm

Efficiency and progress is ours once more
Now that we have the neutron bomb
It’s nice and quick and clean and gets things done
Away with excess enemy
With no less value to property
No sense in war but perfect sense at home…

The sun beams down on a brand new day
No more welfare tax to pay
Unsightly slums gone up in a flashing light
Jobless millions whisked away
At last we have more room to play
All systems go to kill the poor tonight

Gonna
Kill Kill Kill Kill
Kill the poor…tonight

Behold the sparkle of champagne
The crime rate’s gone
Feel free again
Oh life’s a dream with you, Miss Lily White
Jane Fonda’s on the screen today
Convinced the liberals it’s okay
So let’s get dressed and dance away the night…

127 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Tue, Apr 19, 2011 2:07:36pm

re: #122 The Yankee

Don’t worry there is no strategy, I bet there is going to be more then 15 candidates during the GOP primaries

Let’s see, there’s mitch, there’s romney, there’s pawlenty, there’s Bachmann, there’s Huckabee, there’s Haley “dumptruck” barbour, there’s trump, palin, keyes, Gene Ray and I bet we’ll probably see Chuck “Anarchy before gay marriage Norris through his hat in the ring, heh

128 recusancy  Tue, Apr 19, 2011 2:07:47pm

re: #125 WindUpBird

I actually think Trump is a superior candidate to Palin

Trump is a vaudeville carny, but he’s not dumb. He’s a troll. Palin is unbelievably dumb and incurious. A candidate who is a functionally illiterate rube. You may as well elect Pat Buchanan president, because people of his ilk will be running the show, operating Palin like a Muppet

I don’t know man. Do you think he was just acting during this interview and he actually does know these things?

129 What, me worry?  Tue, Apr 19, 2011 2:09:25pm

re: #124 The Yankee

Don’t you think, he thinks, that he would make more money by running and loosing. Thats my feelings.

By stealing campaign contributions?

130 The Yankee  Tue, Apr 19, 2011 2:09:53pm

re: #127 WindUpBird

Let’s see, there’s mitch, there’s romney, there’s pawlenty, there’s Bachmann, there’s Huckabee, there’s Haley “dumptruck” barbour, there’s trump, palin, keyes, Gene Ray and I bet we’ll probably see Chuck “Anarchy before gay marriage Norris through his hat in the ring, heh

I thought the ex-UN guy Bolton had an interesting in running too? And Santorum (the man not that other stuff that happens after you know).

131 The Yankee  Tue, Apr 19, 2011 2:11:46pm

re: #129 marjoriemoon

By stealing campaign contributions?

Maybe the lady from Delware is accused of doing that. But I met by being able to be on a ton of news channels and having his face every where. And then maybe in some way being paid off by Fox News if he leaves. Or just gaining a cult following like Sarah had after she lost.

132 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Tue, Apr 19, 2011 2:12:18pm

re: #128 recusancy

I don’t know man. Do you think he was just acting during this interview and he actually does know these things? [Link: www.msnbc.msn.com…]

How’s this: I don’t think he’d allow the most hideous racists in the GOP to operate his presidency like a puppet

Palin will. Absolutely.


I honestly find Palin to be more repellent and disgusting than Pat Buchanan, and that is just my honest truth. Everything about my being just screams whenever I see her talk. it would be like having Screech from Saved By the Bell in the oval office

133 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Tue, Apr 19, 2011 2:13:19pm

re: #130 The Yankee

I thought the ex-UN guy Bolton had an interesting in running too? And Santorum (the man not that other stuff that happens after you know).

hahaha BOLTON!

Bolton/Wilford Brimley ‘12 Multi-stache!

134 recusancy  Tue, Apr 19, 2011 2:14:00pm

re: #132 WindUpBird

How’s this: I don’t think he’d allow the most hideous racists in the GOP to operate his presidency like a puppet

Palin will. Absolutely.

I honestly find Palin to be more repellent and disgusting than Pat Buchanan, and that is just my honest truth. Everything about my being just screams whenever I see her talk. it would be like having Screech from Saved By the Bell in the oval office

He’s currently running the most racist campaign of the bunch. What makes you think he won’t bring that with him to governance?

135 What, me worry?  Tue, Apr 19, 2011 2:14:11pm

re: #131 The Yankee

I don’t know, but all I can say is that the Republicans have allowed themselves to turn their only democratic right, the right that 100s of 1000s of fought and died for into a fucking circus and they should be deeply ashamed of themselves. I’m shaming them. They deserve it.

136 The Yankee  Tue, Apr 19, 2011 2:16:48pm

re: #135 marjoriemoon

I don’t blame the Reupublicans directly the super PACs are the ones causing this. But then again everybody thinks that Frankenstein was the monster, and in the way he was.

137 Lidane  Tue, Apr 19, 2011 2:16:52pm
138 moderatelyradicalliberal  Tue, Apr 19, 2011 2:18:13pm

re: #134 recusancy

He’s currently running the most racist campaign of the bunch. What makes you think he won’t bring that with him to governance?

Also too, who else would he attract to work for him? If you got to work for a politician the basic presumption is that you believe what they believe. Only birthers and racists would want to be associated with him.

139 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Tue, Apr 19, 2011 2:20:24pm

re: #134 recusancy

He’s currently running the most racist campaign of the bunch. What makes you think he won’t bring that with him to governance?

you have a point there ;-)

I go with motivation, and this is all my own hunches, my own reads as I understand these people

Trump: I believe he is running a racist campaign to be a troll. hes surfing the birther thing. He’s stealing it from the Tea Party because it’s a shiny thing that makes people crazy.

He’s more an Ann Coulter. A wink and a chuckle as he says hideous things. if by some bizarro chance he became president, i think he’d be terrible, but terrible like a bumbling jackass. I don’t think his racism is sincere, if that makes any sense :P

Palin is like an evil child, whose family are secessionist crazies. Nightmarish hillbillies. Might as well open a gate to hell underneath the Lincoln bedroom. I’m serious when i say electing her would be worse than electing pat buchanan. Guys worse than pat buchanan would be running her presidency.

it’s all really six and one-half-dozen of another. They’re both hideous. it’s like we’re discussing whether Sinestro is more evil than Charles Manson

140 Achilles Tang  Tue, Apr 19, 2011 2:22:29pm

What I was hoping someone would bring up when Republicans are smugly talking about dropping Medicare but not for anyone already on it (who presumably like the idea or they could have opted out), was whether they asked any of those seniors if they gave a damn what their children or grandchildren would be able to plan on.

141 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Tue, Apr 19, 2011 2:23:06pm

re: #138 moderatelyradicalliberal

Also too, who else would he attract to work for him? If you got to work for a politician the basic presumption is that you believe what they believe. Only birthers and racists would want to be associated with him.

and palin OTOH, has a much more solid cult of personality. She operates many GOP tribalist levers, she’s not vaudeville. She’s not wink and nudge.

142 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Tue, Apr 19, 2011 2:23:37pm

re: #140 Naso Tang

might as well ask a dog, they don’t think that far

144 engineer cat  Tue, Apr 19, 2011 2:25:01pm

Trump Explains Shifts on Taxes, Healthcare, Abortion

so he’s saying he’s just full of shift, i guess…

145 moderatelyradicalliberal  Tue, Apr 19, 2011 2:25:41pm

re: #128 recusancy

I don’t know man. Do you think he was just acting during this interview and he actually does know these things? [Link: www.msnbc.msn.com…]

Trump not knowing things will help him with the GOP base. The GOP base loves to not know shit and they love politicians who don’t know shit.

146 Varek Raith  Tue, Apr 19, 2011 2:25:45pm

Trump is punking the right.
And they are completely falling for it.

147 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Tue, Apr 19, 2011 2:25:57pm

re: #143 researchok

This air traffic controller shit is starting to make me not want to fly ever again

I’m not afraid to fly, but I’m warming up

148 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Tue, Apr 19, 2011 2:26:15pm

re: #146 Varek Raith

Trump is punking the right.
And they are completely falling for it.

*terroristfistbump*

149 moderatelyradicalliberal  Tue, Apr 19, 2011 2:27:26pm

re: #146 Varek Raith

Trump is punking the right.
And they are completely falling for it.

He’s gonna have Ashton Kutcher walk out during the season finale of the Apprentice and yell “Hey Republicans, you’ve been punked!”.

150 The Yankee  Tue, Apr 19, 2011 2:28:29pm

re: #146 Varek Raith

Trump is punking the right.
And they are completely falling for it.

Is there a difference between new “Punking people” and the old fashion “using people”?

151 zora  Tue, Apr 19, 2011 2:31:56pm

re: #107 Killgore Trout

even a reagan flip flop

Donald Trump: Reagan Was A Con Man Who Couldn’t ‘Deliver The Goods’

thinkprogress.org

152 engineer cat  Tue, Apr 19, 2011 2:34:00pm

re: #146 Varek Raith

Trump is punking the right.
And they are completely falling for it.

i have a fantasy that trump makes it all the way to being nominated by the gop, and in his acceptance speech tells ‘em all that he never believed a word of it and they’re all a bunch of suckers

153 Glenn Beck's Grand Unifying Theory of Obdicut  Tue, Apr 19, 2011 2:36:26pm

re: #152 engineer dog

Their butthurt would be epic

154 Kragar (Antichrist )  Tue, Apr 19, 2011 2:38:28pm

re: #152 engineer dog

i have a fantasy that trump makes it all the way to being nominated by the gop, and in his acceptance speech tells ‘em all that he never believed a word of it and they’re all a bunch of suckers

Or he could go Marvin the paranoid android on them.

“I’d like to say how proud I am to be your nominee, but now that I’ve gotten that deal sealed, I don’t see the need to lie anymore.”

155 Kragar (Antichrist )  Tue, Apr 19, 2011 2:38:56pm

re: #153 Obdicut

Their butthurt would be epic

Their tears taste so yummy.

156 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Tue, Apr 19, 2011 2:43:44pm

re: #150 The Yankee

Is there a difference between new “Punking people” and the old fashion “using people”?

yes

Everyone “uses” people sooner or later. Everyone does it.

Not everyone punks people. Punking someone is a specific thing. Ann Coulter and Yuri Geller punk people. Snake oil.

157 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Tue, Apr 19, 2011 2:45:37pm

re: #152 engineer dog

i have a fantasy that trump makes it all the way to being nominated by the gop, and in his acceptance speech tells ‘em all that he never believed a word of it and they’re all a bunch of suckers

I would cheer like I won the super bowl, if he sabotaged the GOP like that

I’d think he’d be better off accepting, and then doing an anti-campaign to smear the GOP, hit them from the inside all the way to election day

and then Obama DOES take Texas and Utah, because Trump could just design himself as the unelectable guy :D

158 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Tue, Apr 19, 2011 2:47:07pm

re: #154 Kragar (Proud to be Kafir)

Or he could go Marvin the paranoid android on them.

“I’d like to say how proud I am to be your nominee, but now that I’ve gotten that deal sealed, I don’t see the need to lie anymore.”

He just uses the GOP as a giant billboard for his latest Apprentice show


The new “Apprentice” could be the campaign itself! people could compete to be the campaign manager…

159 zora  Tue, Apr 19, 2011 2:49:46pm

donald trump’s first campaign video :)

160 wrenchwench  Tue, Apr 19, 2011 2:52:29pm

re: #159 zora

[Video]donald trump’s first campaign video :)

Won’t he look at home campaigning on the street corners!

Don’t forget the hat for donations!

161 Stanley Sea  Tue, Apr 19, 2011 2:56:12pm

I think Trump is serious, is an egomaniac and totally believes he can pull it off. It will complete his ego ride of life.

162 eneri  Tue, Apr 19, 2011 3:01:37pm

Wait until they have to bring aged parents home because the nursing home is closed or their wonderful vouchers leaves them owing a few thousand to pay for school. FOOLS

163 Wozza Matter?  Tue, Apr 19, 2011 3:15:43pm

The GOP have to keep losing national elections - and places like Nevada and Delaware and they have to keep putting up Paladinos to lose.

After 1997 the Tory party in Britain was all but wiped out and decided to go hard hard right - and they ket losing, time after time after time. They didn’;t even begin to claw their way back until the public saw someone who was a little more liberal, a little more pragmatic and a lot more peronally likable and generally “with it” than their three previous disasters of leaders.

In 1997 no one had even heard of David Cameron - and now he is the Prime Minister leading a reasonably liberal (socially) Government, sure, economically they will drive the country over a cliff - but socially they are not making whole important sections of society pariahs any more.

At some point they will get tired of losing and make a public figure of someone pragmatic and in tune with the mainstream who just want to be left alone in their own bedroom but who want supported in their hospital bedroom.

David Cameron and Nick Clegg, our PM and his Deputy are just clones of Tony Blair but more socially liberal, the GOP ned to start selling Freedom of the person and people as a total package - socially and economincally or they will keep losing.

164 Killgore Trout  Tue, Apr 19, 2011 3:22:08pm

AllahPundit responds to this poll….

If Republicans try to counter messaging like this with bar graphs, we’ll need caskets for their careers. The only chance we have is to frame it in the same terrifying terms, emphasizing that grandma’s going to end up under the bridge if we don’t act to reform entitlements before we face a Greece-style meltdown.

Well, Glenn Beck will be off the air by then so I suppose the rightwing blogs are going to keep predicting the end of the world as the economy continues to recover. Good luck with that.

165 Gus  Tue, Apr 19, 2011 3:25:39pm

re: #161 Stanley Sea

I think Trump is serious, is an egomaniac and totally believes he can pull it off. It will complete his ego ride of life.

Read this…

Beware: Twitter scam app claims to show who visits your profile. It can’t.

You need to:

If you have found you accidentally granted access to this application, you can remove it easily. Make sure you are logged into your Twitter account, click Settings and then Connections, making sure to revoke the application’s access.

166 Stanley Sea  Tue, Apr 19, 2011 3:26:48pm

re: #165 Gus 802

Read this…

Beware: Twitter scam app claims to show who visits your profile. It can’t.

You need to:

If you have found you accidentally granted access to this application, you can remove it easily. Make sure you are logged into your Twitter account, click Settings and then Connections, making sure to revoke the application’s access.

Done, thanks, and sucks.

167 Gus  Tue, Apr 19, 2011 3:27:27pm

re: #166 Stanley Sea

Done, thanks, and sucks.

Yeah. I fell for it too. No biggie. I gave them some fake address and phone number.

168 Stanley Sea  Tue, Apr 19, 2011 3:28:19pm

re: #167 Gus 802

Yeah. I fell for it too. No biggie. I gave them some fake address and phone number.

I saw the pepsi/coke survey and bailed. haha.

169 Stanley Sea  Tue, Apr 19, 2011 3:29:20pm

Time to leave “work” and drive to the homestead. Catch you on the flip side.

170 Targetpractice  Tue, Apr 19, 2011 3:29:46pm

re: #164 Killgore Trout

AllahPundit responds to this poll…

Well, Glenn Beck will be off the air by then so I suppose the rightwing blogs are going to keep predicting the end of the world as the economy continues to recover. Good luck with that.

Perhaps Allah should stop and consider that if Grandma is gonna end up under a bridge regardless, either due to no Medicare/Social Security or being unable to afford to pay for any medical care due to her voucher not coming close to covering her healthcare costs in her twilight years.

171 Killgore Trout  Tue, Apr 19, 2011 3:32:50pm

re: #170 Targetpractice, Worst of Both Worlds

Perhaps Allah should stop and consider that if Grandma is gonna end up under a bridge regardless, either due to no Medicare/Social Security or being unable to afford to pay for any medical care due to her voucher not coming close to covering her healthcare costs in her twilight years.

It’s frustrating that wingnuts can’t even see how bad the messaging is for them. If the meltdown of the system is inevitable then why are they increasing the deficit by giving tax breaks to the richest 1%? It just doesn’t make them look good no matter how they spin it.

172 Gus  Tue, Apr 19, 2011 3:36:01pm

My taste buds are saying feed me.

173 Targetpractice  Tue, Apr 19, 2011 3:37:19pm

re: #171 Killgore Trout

It’s frustrating that wingnuts can’t even see how bad the messaging is for them. If the meltdown of the system is inevitable then why are they increasing the deficit by giving tax breaks to the richest 1%? It just doesn’t make them look good no matter how they spin it.

Yeah, that’s why I think the Ryan Plan is going to be what gives the Dems back the House. They might have been able to see changes to Medicare and Medicaid, in absence of the tax cuts, as necessary to get spending under control. But tacking on tax cuts for the top 2%, under the ol’ chestnut of “It’ll stimulate economic growth and job creation!,” is gonna be political poison. No amount of scaremongering is going to erase that.

174 darthstar  Tue, Apr 19, 2011 3:43:19pm

Poor wingnuts…here they were all dressed up in red, white & blue having a picnic on the nation’s capitol, calling the black man a secret muslim, and calling for the rich white guys to take our country back, and little did they realize that the very government subsidies that they relied on for their medicine, rent, and food were being threatened…and chances are they still don’t see the irony…they probably think, “We only asked them to take shit away from the unworthy*!”

* code for “those who don’t look like us”

175 Renaissance_Man  Tue, Apr 19, 2011 3:44:02pm

re: #173 Targetpractice, Worst of Both Worlds

Yeah, that’s why I think the Ryan Plan is going to be what gives the Dems back the House. They might have been able to see changes to Medicare and Medicaid, in absence of the tax cuts, as necessary to get spending under control. But tacking on tax cuts for the top 2%, under the ol’ chestnut of “It’ll stimulate economic growth and job creation!,” is gonna be political poison. No amount of scaremongering is going to erase that.

Scaremongering has already convinced a significant minority of the country of things that are baldly, obviously false. I’m not sure why you think that scaremongering won’t continue to convince people that upwards wealth transfer, from the middle class to the super rich, is good and right. They’ve been convinced of that for nearly thirty years now.

176 darthstar  Tue, Apr 19, 2011 3:44:48pm

re: #165 Gus 802

Read this…

Beware: Twitter scam app claims to show who visits your profile. It can’t.

You need to:

If you have found you accidentally granted access to this application, you can remove it easily. Make sure you are logged into your Twitter account, click Settings and then Connections, making sure to revoke the application’s access.

There are a dozen apps like that on facebook. The only “victims” are those who are self-absorbed enough to care who is viewing their profile at any given time.

177 Wozza Matter?  Tue, Apr 19, 2011 3:49:24pm

re: #173 Targetpractice, Worst of Both Worlds

Yeah, that’s why I think the Ryan Plan is going to be what gives the Dems back the House. They might have been able to see changes to Medicare and Medicaid, in absence of the tax cuts, as necessary to get spending under control. But tacking on tax cuts for the top 2%, under the ol’ chestnut of “It’ll stimulate economic growth and job creation!,” is gonna be political poison. No amount of scaremongering is going to erase that.

Now is the time to cease all the third rails and just go for it under what should be a fairly nonepartisan agenda -

* Pentagon gets to close bases and programs.
* Taxes back to clinton levels for those indivudually over $250k
* Estate tax starting at $1,000,000
* Bottom up review of Medicare & Medicaid prescribing & treatment.
* Let medicare & medicaid negotiate drug prices
* Reduce overheads and startup costs on small businesses, including creating a federal fund for startups deprived of private capital.

178 Four More Tears  Tue, Apr 19, 2011 3:49:35pm

iamsamh2 Sam Murphy
by KeithOlbermann
@KeithOlbermann Trump/Palin 2012 “You’re Fired!/I Quit!”

179 Simply Sarah  Tue, Apr 19, 2011 3:50:01pm

re: #175 Renaissance_Man

Scaremongering has already convinced a significant minority of the country of things that are baldly, obviously false. I’m not sure why you think that scaremongering won’t continue to convince people that upwards wealth transfer, from the middle class to the super rich, is good and right. They’ve been convinced of that for nearly thirty years now.

More than that, the polices that used to be considered conservative 30, 40, 50, etc. years ago are now the evil, socialist policies of the Democratic Party today. People seem to be well conditioned to lurch to the right on economic policy regardless of the reasoning (Or lack thereof) behind it. That’s why they don’t change their tactics. In many ways, they’ve worked. And, honestly, even if they lose the battle on this today, they’ve long been winning the war and I’m not sure I see that stopping until it’s well past too late.

180 Gus  Tue, Apr 19, 2011 3:51:29pm

re: #176 darthstar

There are a dozen apps like that on facebook. The only “victims” are those who are self-absorbed enough to care who is viewing their profile at any given time.

Hey! Thwack!

//

181 Simply Sarah  Tue, Apr 19, 2011 3:52:53pm

re: #177 wozzablog

Now is the time to cease all the third rails and just go for it under what should be a fairly nonepartisan agenda -

* Pentagon gets to close bases and programs.
* Taxes back to clinton levels for those indivudually over $250k
* Estate tax starting at $1,000,000
* Bottom up review of Medicare & Medicaid prescribing & treatment.
* Let medicare & medicaid negotiate drug prices
* Reduce overheads and startup costs on small businesses, including creating a federal fund for startups deprived of private capital.

I’m going to be completely honest here. While it would probably be a political nonstarter, I think the rates for *everyone* need to go back to Clinton levels, at least as a start. If we start removing exemptions and credits from the tax code, then we can consider lowering rates some for the lower brackets. But right now, the country needs the money.

182 Wozza Matter?  Tue, Apr 19, 2011 3:54:01pm

re: #181 Simply Sarah

I’m going to be completely honest here. While it would probably be a political nonstarter, I think the rates for *everyone* need to go back to Clinton levels, at least as a start. If we start removing exemptions and credits from the tax code, then we can consider lowering rates some for the lower brackets. But right now, the country needs the money.

At the lower levels i see the argument - but there is no spare cash in the lower income brackets. What you top sloce for the feds the state will lose in sales taxes, and the states need the money more.

183 Killgore Trout  Tue, Apr 19, 2011 3:54:47pm

re: #177 wozzablog

Decent ideas. Although I no longer believe is social conservatism I haven’t completely given up on some sort of privatized social security. I don’t have much hope I’ll ever see a social security check and would much rather have invested that money for myself.

184 Targetpractice  Tue, Apr 19, 2011 3:55:00pm

re: #175 Renaissance_Man

Scaremongering has already convinced a significant minority of the country of things that are baldly, obviously false. I’m not sure why you think that scaremongering won’t continue to convince people that upwards wealth transfer, from the middle class to the super rich, is good and right. They’ve been convinced of that for nearly thirty years now.

Largely because we’re no longer talking hypotheticals, we’re talking a very real game plan on the part of the GOP. They have passed the Ryan Plan in the House, which spells out the end of Medicare as we know it. Done not in an effort to balance the budget or get the debt paid down, but to finance yet another giveaway to those who least need more money in their pockets.

185 Targetpractice  Tue, Apr 19, 2011 3:57:53pm

re: #177 wozzablog

Now is the time to cease all the third rails and just go for it under what should be a fairly nonepartisan agenda -

* Pentagon gets to close bases and programs.
* Taxes back to clinton levels for those indivudually over $250k
* Estate tax starting at $1,000,000
* Bottom up review of Medicare & Medicaid prescribing & treatment.
* Let medicare & medicaid negotiate drug prices
* Reduce overheads and startup costs on small businesses, including creating a federal fund for startups deprived of private capital.

I could go with all those, and I think you’ll find that polls show the majority of Americans would as well. Problem is, finding enough Democrats in Congress who would have the spine to see them through.

186 Four More Tears  Tue, Apr 19, 2011 3:59:46pm

re: #177 wozzablog

Can we raise the Capital Gains tax while we’re at it?

187 Killgore Trout  Tue, Apr 19, 2011 3:59:55pm

President Trump? ‘We think it’s a stunt,’ says an NBC exec

He has never seriously considered a run for the White House. It was all a gigantic ratings stunt, a negotiating ploy to get NBC to cut a bigger paycheck when the time comes to sign up for another season of his suddenly popular again TV show. At least, that’s the only theory that makes any sense to us — and we’re not alone.

“We at the network have no idea whether Trump is serious about [running for president] or not,” one NBC exec tells EW. “He won’t tell even us — and we haven’t pushed because we’ve just decided it is whatever it is. If he wants to spout off about things, we’re happy to let him. But our inclination is that he’s not serious about running for president. We think it’s a stunt.”

188 garhighway  Tue, Apr 19, 2011 4:00:28pm

re: #181 Simply Sarah

re: #177 wozzablog

Now is the time to cease all the third rails and just go for it under what should be a fairly nonepartisan agenda -

* Pentagon gets to close bases and programs.
* Taxes back to clinton levels for those indivudually over $250k
* Estate tax starting at $1,000,000
* Bottom up review of Medicare & Medicaid prescribing & treatment.
* Let medicare & medicaid negotiate drug prices
* Reduce overheads and startup costs on small businesses, including creating a federal fund for startups deprived of private capital.

I’m going to be completely honest here. While it would probably be a political nonstarter, I think the rates for *everyone* need to go back to Clinton levels, at least as a start. If we start removing exemptions and credits from the tax code, then we can consider lowering rates some for the lower brackets. But right now, the country needs the money.

I’d like to see the math on losing the Bush cuts for those over $250K plus eliminating the mortgage deduction.

189 wrenchwench  Tue, Apr 19, 2011 4:01:23pm

re: #187 Killgore Trout

President Trump? ‘We think it’s a stunt,’ says an NBC exec

Trump + Stunt = Stump

190 Simply Sarah  Tue, Apr 19, 2011 4:02:06pm

re: #182 wozzablog

At the lower levels i see the argument - but there is no spare cash in the lower income brackets. What you top sloce for the feds the state will lose in sales taxes, and the states need the money more.

Well, I look at it this way. My understanding is that about three quarters of the revenue lost from the tax cuts are/will be for the part on the

191 Killgore Trout  Tue, Apr 19, 2011 4:02:14pm

re: #189 wrenchwench

Trump + Stunt = Stump

Nice.

192 garhighway  Tue, Apr 19, 2011 4:03:19pm

re: #188 garhighway

I’d like to see the math on losing the Bush cuts for those over $250K plus eliminating the mortgage deduction.

I think the time has come for the US Government to get out of the business of picking favorites between owners and renters.

193 calochortus  Tue, Apr 19, 2011 4:04:40pm

I saw the fascinating argument from a conservative somewhere recently that we shouldn’t listen to the rich people who think they should pay more taxes because they have so much money that they wouldn’t notice the extra amount they had to pay out. Its the middle class that can’t bear more taxes.

Can someone please explain to me why this isn’t in fact the perfect argument for raising the taxes on the very wealthy?

194 allegro  Tue, Apr 19, 2011 4:05:24pm

re: #188 garhighway

I’d like to see the math on losing the Bush cuts for those over $250K plus eliminating the mortgage deduction.

I see idea for eliminating the mortgage deduction regularly now. Wow. I can’t think of anything that would more gut the housing market more or faster. With it already in the straights it’s in with so many millions underwater now, what a stupid idea.

Unless I’m missing something.

195 garhighway  Tue, Apr 19, 2011 4:05:40pm

re: #193 calochortus

I saw the fascinating argument from a conservative somewhere recently that we shouldn’t listen to the rich people who think they should pay more taxes because they have so much money that they wouldn’t notice the extra amount they had to pay out. Its the middle class that can’t bear more taxes.

Can someone please explain to me why this isn’t in fact the perfect argument for raising the taxes on the very wealthy?

Jobs!

Liberty!

Socialism!

Ayn Rand!

Or something like that…

/

196 Wozza Matter?  Tue, Apr 19, 2011 4:05:45pm

re: #183 Killgore Trout

Decent ideas. Although I no longer believe is social conservatism I haven’t completely given up on some sort of privatized social security. I don’t have much hope I’ll ever see a social security check and would much rather have invested that money for myself.

I do see where you are coming from - but nothing stops you taking higher risk gambles with your own cash money.

I am an intrinsically cautious person - i am a bear in a bull market. In reality most Americans wouldn’t cash out social security and manage it themselves - they would hand it to personal finance advisors, or pool together in their work places to create larger bundles and then hand them to fund managers.

Unions may start programmes to handle their members affairs - all of which dilutes the diea of perosnal choice in the market place that the idea is meant to provide.

197 Simply Sarah  Tue, Apr 19, 2011 4:05:57pm

re: #193 calochortus

I saw the fascinating argument from a conservative somewhere recently that we shouldn’t listen to the rich people who think they should pay more taxes because they have so much money that they wouldn’t notice the extra amount they had to pay out. Its the middle class that can’t bear more taxes.

Can someone please explain to me why this isn’t in fact the perfect argument for raising the taxes on the very wealthy?

I get the feeling they might have gotten a few wires crossed in their logic proof for that one.

198 jaunte  Tue, Apr 19, 2011 4:07:18pm

Some Texans still working on getting guns into school.

Kindergartner brings gun to Texas school, 3 hurt
HOUSTON (AP) - A kindergartner who brought a loaded gun Tuesday to his Houston elementary school was among three students injured by fragments when it fired after falling from his pocket as he sat down for lunch, officials said.

199 Wozza Matter?  Tue, Apr 19, 2011 4:07:25pm

re: #192 garhighway

I think the time has come for the US Government to get out of the business of picking favorites between owners and renters.

I agree, but, that would have to be phased. So many people are on the raggedy edge and clinging onto their homes by wafer thin margins at the moment - now is not the time to do that.

In a better economy - sure, but at the moment creating a raft more forclosures isn’t the way forward.

200 calochortus  Tue, Apr 19, 2011 4:07:52pm

re: #192 garhighway

I think the time has come for the US Government to get out of the business of picking favorites between owners and renters.

I agree with you (and I’m an owner) but it will never fly politically. Nor will axing deductions for children, or any of the other things that prevent us from having a flat tax. I took a very unscientific survey a couple years ago and the result was that even if the people I asked ended up paying a lower amount with a flat tax, they just didn’t want to give up their deductions. Possibly because a deduction made them feel like they were being rewarded for their good behavior or that they were special, but that is just conjecture on my part.

201 Simply Sarah  Tue, Apr 19, 2011 4:09:07pm

re: #194 allegro

I see idea for eliminating the mortgage deduction regularly now. Wow. I can’t think of anything that would more gut the housing market more or faster. With it already in the straights it’s in with so many millions underwater now, what a stupid idea.

Unless I’m missing something.

That’s a bit of the problem. Deductions of that type were part of what distorted (And continue to distort) the markets. That being said, most people that would actually be in serious risk of default are the ones that benefit from that kind of deduction the least. There may be some way to restructure things that would allow the removal of the deduction with minimal risk to those borrowers that are in trouble.

202 Four More Tears  Tue, Apr 19, 2011 4:09:34pm

re: #200 calochortus

Yeah, you really can’t get rid of that deduction. I say just add a renter’s deduction and be done with it. :)

203 calochortus  Tue, Apr 19, 2011 4:09:52pm

re: #197 Simply Sarah

I get the feeling they might have gotten a few wires crossed in their logic proof for that one.

Ya think so?

204 Wozza Matter?  Tue, Apr 19, 2011 4:10:50pm

re: #202 JasonA

Yeah, you really can’t get rid of that deduction. I say just add a renter’s deduction and be done with it. :)

Or cease all deductions and have the government use the money to buy up all the foreclosed homes at the steal prices and rent back dirt cheap.

205 Simply Sarah  Tue, Apr 19, 2011 4:11:06pm

re: #198 jaunte

Some Texans still working on getting guns into school.

Kindergartner brings gun to Texas school, 3 hurt
HOUSTON (AP) - A kindergartner who brought a loaded gun Tuesday to his Houston elementary school was among three students injured by fragments when it fired after falling from his pocket as he sat down for lunch, officials said.

See, this never would have happened if they let all grade schoolers pack heat in case a problem occurred during snack time.
/

206 garhighway  Tue, Apr 19, 2011 4:11:11pm

re: #194 allegro

I see idea for eliminating the mortgage deduction regularly now. Wow. I can’t think of anything that would more gut the housing market more or faster. With it already in the straights it’s in with so many millions underwater now, what a stupid idea.

Unless I’m missing something.

The lower your income, the less likely that the deduction gets you enough to be meaningful. The higher your income, the less likely it is that it was a meaningful part of your thought process when you bought.

With interest rates so low, the actual amount you get to deduct is fairly low right now, making this a good time to deal with the issue.

There are always winner and losers in the deduction game. But this is the third largest bleeder of tax revenue we have. Raise the standard deduction some to offset the impact if you want, but this thing is a sacred cow that ought to be killed. (Apologies to any Hindus in the audience.)

Housing is housing. There is no rational reason for the US government, via the tax code. to be picking winners and losers there.

207 garhighway  Tue, Apr 19, 2011 4:13:55pm

re: #205 Simply Sarah

See, this never would have happened if they let all grade schoolers pack heat in case a problem occurred during snack time.
/

An armed preschool is a polite preschool.

208 allegro  Tue, Apr 19, 2011 4:14:35pm

I guess I’m just thinking about from the middle class mindset - the only one I’ve got - and knowing how important that deduction was for us when we had a mortgage.

209 calochortus  Tue, Apr 19, 2011 4:15:30pm

re: #202 JasonA

Yeah, you really can’t get rid of that deduction. I say just add a renter’s deduction and be done with it. :)

It doesn’t strike me as a good solution. The idea was to encourage home ownership on the (I believe) unsubstantiated theory that homeowners make better citizens. The fact that the government will help pay your mortgage has probably just allowed housing prices to rise in much the same way that most families having 2 incomes did.

I’m sure there is a reasonable way to phase the deduction out, but not the political will to do it.

210 calochortus  Tue, Apr 19, 2011 4:16:25pm

re: #208 allegro

I guess I’m just thinking about from the middle class mindset - the only one I’ve got - and knowing how important that deduction was for us when we had a mortgage.

Obviously it couldn’t be done overnight. It would have to be gradual, and take sustained political will. Which isn’t there.

211 garhighway  Tue, Apr 19, 2011 4:16:47pm

re: #208 allegro

I guess I’m just thinking about from the middle class mindset - the only one I’ve got - and knowing how important that deduction was for us when we had a mortgage.

Like I said, maybe we increase the standard deduction some as an offset?

212 Mostly sane, most of the time.  Tue, Apr 19, 2011 4:16:47pm

re: #209 calochortus

It doesn’t strike me as a good solution. The idea was to encourage home ownership on the (I believe) unsubstantiated theory that homeowners make better citizens. The fact that the government will help pay your mortgage has probably just allowed housing prices to rise in much the same way that most families having 2 incomes did.

I’m sure there is a reasonable way to phase the deduction out, but not the political will to do it.

Remember the alpha queens from high school? Head cheerleaders, etc.

They become real estate agents. Go ahead, try to take away the deduction.

213 garhighway  Tue, Apr 19, 2011 4:17:55pm

re: #212 EmmmieG

Remember the alpha queens from high school? Head cheerleaders, etc.

They become real estate agents. Go ahead, try to take away the deduction.

Realtors + builders used to be the biggest single source of donations to Congress, just to protect the deduction.

214 Wozza Matter?  Tue, Apr 19, 2011 4:17:58pm

re: #208 allegro

I guess I’m just thinking about from the middle class mindset - the only one I’ve got - and knowing how important that deduction was for us when we had a mortgage.

The problem isn’t the value the deduction adds to the homeowners wealth, the problem is that people treated houses as assets ratyher than places to live and forced the prce higher and higher and higher.

If the housing market was in any way shape or form rational buyers wouldn’t need help - but as big a factor is that all arouind generally middle class incomes don’t have the bang for the buck they did 20/30/40 years ago in any aspect of the economy aside from plane travel.

215 Renaissance_Man  Tue, Apr 19, 2011 4:18:58pm

re: #184 Targetpractice, Worst of Both Worlds

Largely because we’re no longer talking hypotheticals, we’re talking a very real game plan on the part of the GOP. They have passed the Ryan Plan in the House, which spells out the end of Medicare as we know it. Done not in an effort to balance the budget or get the debt paid down, but to finance yet another giveaway to those who least need more money in their pockets.

That’s true, but I think you overestimate how many true believers will see the cause and effect between that fact and the suffering of themselves, their friends and neighbours. Basically, I think you underestimate how necessary hate-porn entertainment is on the hierarchy of needs - which is somewhere just above food and significantly below education, self-actualisation, and relationships outside the home.

Americans have already accepted the worst health care in the First World, and either don’t believe it, or blame it on big government interference in the free market. Americans already accept bankruptcy as a consequence of being sick, which exists nowhere else in the First World, and yet the cries to protect insurance and pharmaceutical companies are ever stronger. If Medicare were to end tomorrow, I think much less than a quarter of the cultists would leave the cult, probably less than ten percent. Some others might have reservations, particularly if they are personally affected, but in the end, they’ll look at the bill for thousands, or they’ll take their aged mother home after she was turned down for treatment, and then they’ll sit down in front of the TV, and Megyn Kelly and some radio host will be on mentioning the words ‘health care’ and talking about how wicked the Democrats have been in perverting the system. And then David Barton will come on their radio, telling them that God himself would not have supported Medicare, and that’ll really mean something, because it’s one thing if your friends and family hate Democrats. But man, God himself hates Democrats. They’re not just enemies, they’re sacrilegious.

In short, these people aren’t rational. They don’t believe in cause and effect. They are a cult. They believe - that’s what cults do. They already readily believe that all the evils of history are the fault of liberals. They will continue to readily believe anything, including that the pains they are personally suffering are the fault of liberals. They will believe, because belief is more important than almost anything else.

It used to be true that people were entitled to their opinions, but not their own facts. That’s no longer true. In a very real sense, opinions have become facts.

216 calochortus  Tue, Apr 19, 2011 4:19:35pm

Heck, even Rand Keep-the-government-out-of-my-life Paul said recently “Keep that deduction because I take it on my taxes” (or words to that effect)

217 allegro  Tue, Apr 19, 2011 4:21:19pm

re: #215 Renaissance_Man

Outstanding rant!

218 Simply Sarah  Tue, Apr 19, 2011 4:22:19pm

re: #216 calochortus

Heck, even Rand Keep-the-government-out-of-my-life Paul said recently “Keep that deduction because I take it on my taxes” (or words to that effect)

Deductions are a mess and we should probably get rid of most, if not all of them, as they tend to benefit the connected, the wealthy, and/or the lucky. There are better ways of enacting social policy. Ways that hopefully don’t involve a lot of kickbacks to supporters and their causes (Yeah, I know, I’m dreaming).

219 calochortus  Tue, Apr 19, 2011 4:22:32pm

re: #215 Renaissance_Man

Yes, but a lot of them don’t want to have that aged mother at home for one reason or another. That might throw them into a panic.

220 calochortus  Tue, Apr 19, 2011 4:23:23pm

re: #218 Simply Sarah

Deductions are a mess and we should probably get rid of most, if not all of them, as they tend to benefit the connected, the wealthy, and/or the lucky. There are better ways of enacting social policy. Ways that hopefully don’t involve a lot of kickbacks to supporters and their causes (Yeah, I know, I’m dreaming).

I know, but its a beautiful dream…

221 Cheechako  Tue, Apr 19, 2011 4:29:36pm

re: #177 wozzablog

Now is the time to cease all the third rails and just go for it under what should be a fairly nonepartisan agenda -

* Pentagon gets to close bases and programs.
* Taxes back to clinton levels for those indivudually over $250k
* Estate tax starting at $1,000,000
* Bottom up review of Medicare & Medicaid prescribing & treatment.
* Let medicare & medicaid negotiate drug prices
* Reduce overheads and startup costs on small businesses, including creating a federal fund for startups deprived of private capital.

I’ll add a couple more:
* Collect FICA (SSS) on ALL earned income. No caps.
* Have some type of Alternative Minimum Tax on all businesses to eliminate corporations not paying any tax.

222 Killgore Trout  Tue, Apr 19, 2011 4:31:50pm

re: #208 allegro

I guess I’m just thinking about from the middle class mindset - the only one I’ve got - and knowing how important that deduction was for us when we had a mortgage.

I also don’t think it would help the housing market to eliminate the interest deduction. This might be a bad time to do it. I think it would also be a problem for struggling families in a tough economy.

223 Wozza Matter?  Tue, Apr 19, 2011 4:32:21pm

re: #221 Cheechako

I’ll add a couple more:
* Collect FICA (SSS) on ALL earned income. No caps.
* Have some type of Alternative Minimum Tax on all businesses to eliminate corporations not paying any tax.

Good points and the first would pad tyhe SS fund considerably.

224 Mostly sane, most of the time.  Tue, Apr 19, 2011 4:34:35pm

re: #222 Killgore Trout

I also don’t think it would help the housing market to eliminate the interest deduction. This might be a bad time to do it. I think it would also be a problem for struggling families in a tough economy.

That’s a good question: How many people used their deduction to get a refund to make the next payment?

Also, how many underwaters would walk without at least some reason to stay?

225 engineer cat  Tue, Apr 19, 2011 4:37:30pm

forget about the mishegas for a second and think about Cats In Pots

226 Wozza Matter?  Tue, Apr 19, 2011 4:38:13pm

re: #221 Cheechako

Everyting contributed to the discussion so far falls under the banner of pragmatic centrism, and it’s a damn shame there is only one party fighting to that end.

I know some difference between parties is good - one to focus a little more on government intervention, and the other a little less - but only having one party any where near the centre ground leads to extremist fighst and inertia.

Small differences can be overcome and the public served - even if they then begin to believe politics is boring, but only having one party even vaguely close to governing with the situation we have in mind and of the believ that actions have consequences is mind blowingly numbing.

227 Mostly sane, most of the time.  Tue, Apr 19, 2011 4:39:56pm

Totally good with letting the Pentagon get more say in decisions.
Like the idea of lessening the burden on small businesses (full disclosure: my father owns a small business).

Not so much on the estate tax, and I’ll explain why.

Rich people get around the estate tax by putting their money in trusts. I feel that this acts much like entailed estates in England, creating a permanent aristocracy. I’m too American to like the idea of large numbers of Americans who get money for being born. Do away with trusts. They’ll spend it fast enough.

228 Simply Sarah  Tue, Apr 19, 2011 4:40:02pm

re: #226 wozzablog

Everyting contributed to the discussion so far falls under the banner of pragmatic centrism, and it’s a damn shame there is only one party fighting to that end.

I know some difference between parties is good - one to focus a little more on government intervention, and the other a little less - but only having one party any where near the centre ground reality leads to extremist fighst and inertia.

Small differences can be overcome and the public served - even if they then begin to believe politics is boring, but only having one party even vaguely close to governing with the situation we have in mind and of the believ that actions have consequences is mind blowingly numbing.

FTFY

229 Killgore Trout  Tue, Apr 19, 2011 4:40:03pm

I talked to my hippie neighbors the other day. One of them lost her job and they can’t afford their house and are going to put it up for sale. However, they are planning on moving into a high priced “sustainable” earth friendly condo development which is about half the size and almost the same price as their home now. The concept is “communal urban sustainability” which means 30-40 condos surround a courtyard with a novelty “farm” complete with chicken coop. They think they’re going to save on living expenses from the communal “farm”.
I thought it was best to not say anything about how it’s not a feasible idea.

230 Mostly sane, most of the time.  Tue, Apr 19, 2011 4:41:15pm

re: #229 Killgore Trout

I talked to my hippie neighbors the other day. One of them lost her job and they can’t afford their house and are going to put it up for sale. However, they are planning on moving into a high priced “sustainable” earth friendly condo development which is about half the size and almost the same price as their home now. The concept is “communal urban sustainability” which means 30-40 condos surround a courtyard with a novelty “farm” complete with chicken coop. They think they’re going to save on living expenses from the communal “farm”.
I thought it was best to not say anything about how it’s not a feasible idea.

They could plant some fruits and veggies in the backyard. I grew up making pies from the blueberries and cherries in the backyard. I didn’t know that cherry pie recipes don’t start with “Take a bowl and ladder into the backyard.”

231 Wozza Matter?  Tue, Apr 19, 2011 4:41:55pm

re: #227 EmmmieG

Totally good with letting the Pentagon get more say in decisions.
Like the idea of lessening the burden on small businesses (full disclosure: my father owns a small business).

Not so much on the estate tax, and I’ll explain why.

Rich people get around the estate tax by putting their money in trusts. I feel that this acts much like entailed estates in England, creating a permanent aristocracy. I’m too American to like the idea of large numbers of Americans who get money for being born. Do away with trusts. They’ll spend it fast enough.

Which is where somebody elses suggestion about reforming capital gains would come in.

232 Killgore Trout  Tue, Apr 19, 2011 4:42:25pm

The surveyors came today. It cost me $200 (we split the bill) for them to locate the property line exactly where I knew it was. What a waste of money.

233 Wozza Matter?  Tue, Apr 19, 2011 4:43:03pm

re: #228 Simply Sarah

FTFY

Conceded.

234 calochortus  Tue, Apr 19, 2011 4:43:38pm

re: #232 Killgore Trout

The $200 wasn’t so you would know where the line is, its so your neighbor knows too. ;-)

235 Usually refered to as anyways  Tue, Apr 19, 2011 4:44:10pm

re: #232 Killgore Trout

The surveyors came today. It cost me $200 (we split the bill) for them to locate the property line exactly where I knew it was. What a waste of money.

How did the neighbor take the news?

236 Simply Sarah  Tue, Apr 19, 2011 4:44:28pm

re: #229 Killgore Trout

I talked to my hippie neighbors the other day. One of them lost her job and they can’t afford their house and are going to put it up for sale. However, they are planning on moving into a high priced “sustainable” earth friendly condo development which is about half the size and almost the same price as their home now. The concept is “communal urban sustainability” which means 30-40 condos surround a courtyard with a novelty “farm” complete with chicken coop. They think they’re going to save on living expenses from the communal “farm”.
I thought it was best to not say anything about how it’s not a feasible idea.

Man, those aren’t hippies. Those are just wannabe posers. Real hippies would actually, uh, move to a real farm.

That said, at least they won’t be trying to steal your yard anymore, right?

237 Ming  Tue, Apr 19, 2011 4:44:36pm

John Galt never had to explain those complex medical insurance vouchers to his elderly parents. He left home at the age of 12.

I don’t seem to recall too many elderly people in Galt’s Gulch, either. Did they have a hospital there? No need; Dr. Hendricks, the inventor of the portable X-ray machine, will keep you in great health, as long as he’s paid in gold.

The question of how to pay for health care is very complicated, but somehow, I don’t think that the current Republican proposal (Senator Paul Ryan), giving medical insurance vouchers to all, including the very old, is going to fly. I’ve never understood my own medical insurance, ever, in my entire life. Because that’s the way the insurance companies write the policies! I doubt that I’ll be a master of insurance policy when I’m 80.

238 Cheechako  Tue, Apr 19, 2011 4:45:27pm

re: #226 wozzablog

Everyting contributed to the discussion so far falls under the banner of pragmatic centrism, and it’s a damn shame there is only one party fighting to that end.

I know some difference between parties is good - one to focus a little more on government intervention, and the other a little less - but only having one party any where near the centre ground leads to extremist fighst and inertia.

Small differences can be overcome and the public served - even if they then begin to believe politics is boring, but only having one party even vaguely close to governing with the situation we have in mind and of the believ that actions have consequences is mind blowingly numbing.


I’m not sure either party is anywhere near close to the center.

239 Wozza Matter?  Tue, Apr 19, 2011 4:45:42pm

re: #237 Ming

John Galt never had to explain those complex medical insurance vouchers to his elderly parents. He left home at the age of 12.

I don’t seem to recall too many elderly people in Galt’s Gulch, either. Did they have a hospital there? No need; Dr. Hendricks, the inventor of the portable X-ray machine, will keep you in great health, as long as he’s paid in gold.

The question of how to pay for health care is very complicated, but somehow, I don’t think that the current Republican proposal (Senator Paul Ryan), giving medical insurance vouchers to all, including the very old, is going to fly. I’ve never understood my own medical insurance, ever, in my entire life. Because that’s the way the insurance companies write the policies! I doubt that I’ll be a master of insurance policy when I’m 80.

Ayn Rand also wrote Logans Run, while rooting for the bad guys.

240 Mostly sane, most of the time.  Tue, Apr 19, 2011 4:45:45pm

re: #232 Killgore Trout

The surveyors came today. It cost me $200 (we split the bill) for them to locate the property line exactly where I knew it was. What a waste of money.

Silence is golden, golden, when your neighbors shut up.

241 Killgore Trout  Tue, Apr 19, 2011 4:46:09pm

re: #230 EmmmieG

They could plant some fruits and veggies in the backyard. I grew up making pies from the blueberries and cherries in the backyard. I didn’t know that cherry pie recipes don’t start with “Take a bowl and ladder into the backyard.”

They have a large yard too. I think they know how much of their own food they can grow because they talk to me about it all the time. I think the appeal is the communal aspect of the sales pitch. They are all going to be microwaving frozen organic meals purchased from Trader Joe’s while a couple dozen lettuce plants get overrun by weeds in the communal garden.

242 calochortus  Tue, Apr 19, 2011 4:47:02pm

re: #229 Killgore Trout

Who will be giving your neighbors a mortgage on another property they can’t afford?

243 Mostly sane, most of the time.  Tue, Apr 19, 2011 4:47:32pm

re: #241 Killgore Trout

They have a large yard too. I think they know how much of their own food they can grow because they talk to me about it all the time. I think the appeal is the communal aspect of the sales pitch. They are all going to be microwaving frozen organic meals purchased from Trader Joe’s while a couple dozen lettuce plants get overrun by weeds in the communal garden.

You mean everyone is thinking everyone else is going to weed?

Oh, this is precious.

(The best way to get the garden weeded is have a baby and wait ten years.)

244 Killgore Trout  Tue, Apr 19, 2011 4:47:32pm

re: #235 ozbloke

How did the neighbor take the news?

Fairly well but I’m sure he’s pretty disappointed. He wanted to move the property line about 10 feet in my direction.

245 Wozza Matter?  Tue, Apr 19, 2011 4:48:19pm

re: #238 Cheechako

I’m not sure either party is anywhere near close to the center.

Look at polling :

Democrats want to protect Medicare/Medicaid, so do the public.

Obama’s healthcare plan (pre-death panels) - 60%+

Democrats are trending towards gay rights and reproductive rights.

Obama’s Stimulus had majority support in the country.

246 calochortus  Tue, Apr 19, 2011 4:48:28pm

re: #237 Ming

I think anyone involved in making any sort of healthcare policy or law should be required to buy insurance on the individual market first. That ought to change a few perspectives.

247 Killgore Trout  Tue, Apr 19, 2011 4:49:21pm

re: #242 calochortus

Who will be giving your neighbors a mortgage on another property they can’t afford?

I thought about bringing that up too but I kept my mouth shut. Banks are not giving out mortgages like they used to. Especially for families with one part time employed adult and two young children.

248 calochortus  Tue, Apr 19, 2011 4:51:04pm

re: #247 Killgore Trout

Yeah, I don’t think you need to break it to them, the financial institutions will be happy to do it for you.

249 Killgore Trout  Tue, Apr 19, 2011 4:51:14pm

re: #243 EmmmieG

You mean everyone is thinking everyone else is going to weed?

Oh, this is precious.

(The best way to get the garden weeded is have a baby and wait ten years.)

I finally broke down and bought some garden knee pads. I can pull weeds all day and not have to worry about my back and knees. I really hurt myself last year and was laid up for a few months. This year is no problem.

250 Cheechako  Tue, Apr 19, 2011 4:51:58pm

re: #245 wozzablog

Look at polling :

Democrats want to protect Medicare/Medicaid, so do the public.

Obama’s healthcare plan (pre-death panels) - 60%+

Democrats are trending towards gay rights and reproductive rights.

Obama’s Stimulus had majority support in the country.


That is all true. But I don’t sense a commitment that would be required to implement many of the proposals listed above. The desire to be re-elected will win out.

251 Wozza Matter?  Tue, Apr 19, 2011 4:52:10pm

re: #249 Killgore Trout

I finally broke down and bought some garden knee pads. I can pull weeds all day and not have to worry about my back and knees. I really hurt myself last year and was laid up for a few months. This year is no problem.

stand up weeding

eng-uk.fiskars.com

252 Mostly sane, most of the time.  Tue, Apr 19, 2011 4:52:45pm

re: #249 Killgore Trout

I finally broke down and bought some garden knee pads. I can pull weeds all day and not have to worry about my back and knees. I really hurt myself last year and was laid up for a few months. This year is no problem.

I bought one of those foam pads years ago for two reasons: My knees are as old as the rest of me and the ground is stinking soggy.

Latest find? The Chinese garden down on Everett is selling purple bean seeds. I can’t wait to hand them to the kids. I can’t plant until, I think, June, but it will be a lot of fun.

253 Simply Sarah  Tue, Apr 19, 2011 4:54:06pm

re: #247 Killgore Trout

I thought about bringing that up too but I kept my mouth shut. Banks are not giving out mortgages like they used to. Especially for families with one part time employed adult and two young children.

People are often not very realistic about finances. I have a friend on disability who is talking about getting married. I brought up the point that should she get married to someone who actually had income, all those student loans she has that she currently can’t pay (Since bankruptcy doesn’t touch those), but which can’t collect from her fixed income, would suddenly have a source they could go after in the form of her girlfriend’s/potential wife’s income. They didn’t seem to have considered how to handle that possible hiccup in debt considerations.

254 b_sharp  Tue, Apr 19, 2011 4:54:09pm

re: #251 wozzablog

stand up weeding

[Link: eng-uk.fiskars.com…]

Here’s another stand up solution to weeds.

255 Wozza Matter?  Tue, Apr 19, 2011 4:54:47pm

re: #250 Cheechako

That is all true. But I don’t sense a commitment that would be required to implement many of the proposals listed above. The desire to be re-elected will win out.

Desire to be re-elected is neither right nor left, liberal nor conservative.

I will posit that the rump of the Democratic caucus would find more common ground with more Americans on matters of substance than their Republican counterparts.

256 Cheechako  Tue, Apr 19, 2011 4:56:27pm

re: #255 wozzablog


I will posit that the rump of the Democratic caucus would find more common ground with more Americans on matters of substance than their Republican counterparts.


I agree.

257 Glenn Beck's Grand Unifying Theory of Obdicut  Tue, Apr 19, 2011 4:57:14pm

re: #254 b_sharp

I like this solution:

Image: 3-ducks.jpg

Only works if you’re gardening somewhere semi-wet.

258 Wozza Matter?  Tue, Apr 19, 2011 4:58:10pm

re: #250 Cheechako

That is all true. But I don’t sense a commitment that would be required to implement many of the proposals listed above. The desire to be re-elected will win out.

The money, in politics, i would say is largely small *c* conservative - much more so than those individuals elected - in terms of maintaining the staus quo.

259 Stanley Sea  Tue, Apr 19, 2011 4:58:24pm

re: #254 b_sharp

Here’s another stand up solution to weeds.

I heard on the traffic report the other day the huge jam on the 8 due to the goats being used for vegetation control getting too close to traffic.

260 Killgore Trout  Tue, Apr 19, 2011 4:59:07pm

re: #251 wozzablog

stand up weeding

[Link: eng-uk.fiskars.com…]

That only really works for dandelions. I have one, it works ok but not great. My biggest challenge is pulling up grass. The shit is nearly indestructible and it’s pretty meticulous work.

261 zora  Tue, Apr 19, 2011 4:59:31pm

re: #245 wozzablog

Look at polling :

Democrats want to protect Medicare/Medicaid, so do the public.

Obama’s healthcare plan (pre-death panels) - 60%+

Democrats are trending towards gay rights and reproductive rights.

Obama’s Stimulus had majority support in the country.

politicalwire.com

Did Republicans Just Walk Off a Cliff?

A new McClatchy-Marist poll finds Americans heavily opposed to cuts in Medicare, the government health program for the elderly, or Medicaid, the program for the poor. Voters oppose cuts to those programs by 80% to 18%. Even among conservatives, just 29% supported cuts, and 68% opposed them.

262 Wozza Matter?  Tue, Apr 19, 2011 4:59:40pm

re: #259 Stanley Sea

I heard on the traffic report the other day the huge jam on the 8 due to the goats being used for vegetation control getting too close to traffic.

I heard about the fire brigade being called to deal with a Vampire on the hard shoulder a couple of weeks back - so i guess anythings possible.

263 Wozza Matter?  Tue, Apr 19, 2011 5:00:23pm

re: #260 Killgore Trout

That only really works for dandelions. I have one, it works ok but not great. My biggest challenge is pulling up grass. The shit is nearly indestructible and it’s pretty meticulous work.

Fairynuff.

264 Simply Sarah  Tue, Apr 19, 2011 5:01:39pm

re: #260 Killgore Trout

That only really works for dandelions. I have one, it works ok but not great. My biggest challenge is pulling up grass. The shit is nearly indestructible and it’s pretty meticulous work.

Grass: You can never grow the type you want where you want when you want, but it has no trouble otherwise.

265 engineer cat  Tue, Apr 19, 2011 5:01:55pm

Did Republicans Just Walk Off a Cliff?

the next stage is where republicans adamantly deny that everything that is in the ryan plan is actually in the ryan plan - “it’s all liberal lies!!”

266 Wozza Matter?  Tue, Apr 19, 2011 5:03:46pm

re: #265 engineer dog

Did Republicans Just Walk Off a Cliff?

the next stage is where republicans adamantly deny that everything that is in the ryan plan is actually in the ryan plan - “it’s all liberal lies!!”

The “co-writer” of the plan has already said they had nothing to do with it.

267 b_sharp  Tue, Apr 19, 2011 5:04:21pm

re: #265 engineer dog

Did Republicans Just Walk Off a Cliff?

the next stage is where republicans adamantly deny that everything that is in the ryan plan is actually in the ryan plan - “it’s all liberal lies!!”

Any death panels in the plan?

268 zora  Tue, Apr 19, 2011 5:04:56pm

same with gay marriage

politicalwire.com

269 Wozza Matter?  Tue, Apr 19, 2011 5:07:57pm

laters all.

270 Wozza Matter?  Tue, Apr 19, 2011 5:08:22pm

re: #267 b_sharp

Any death panels in the plan?

only for political careers.

271 prairiefire  Tue, Apr 19, 2011 5:14:00pm

It is crazy to me that one of our political parties can live in such a vacuum, free from reality. And I mean the R’s.

272 Linden Arden  Tue, Apr 19, 2011 5:15:43pm

I’m 50 and my knees are in great shape after a sports life of tennis and golf only.

My hip is going out though - THR candidate here in 1-2 years.

273 engineer cat  Tue, Apr 19, 2011 5:16:10pm

PRESNIT OBAMA PLEZ SUPPORT TEH DEUTCH BILL PLZ!!1!

On the House side of the Capitol, U.S. Rep. Ted Deutch on Wednesday promoted his bill to shore up Social Security’s finances by removing the cap on individual income that is subjected to Social Security taxes. That would mean more taxes paid — and ultimately more benefits received — by the top 5 percent of earners who make more than the cap, which amounts to $106,800 this year.

“There is this conventional wisdom that in order for us to save Social Security we need to eviscerate it, we need to slash benefits,” said Deutch, D-Boca Raton. “That’s not where the American people are.”

Deutch’s bill would both preserve promised benefits and adjust the way Social Security’s yearly cost-of-living raise is determined by taking into account high medical costs faced by senior citizens.

Under present law, a slight increase in inflation is expected to lead to a small raise next year. For this year and last year, a low overall inflation rate has resulted in no COLA increases.

A host of senior-citizen advocates and some House Democrats — including Corrine Brown of Jacksonville, Alcee Hastings of Miramar and Frederica Wilson of Miami — are rallying around Deutch’s bill, hoping to fend off future benefit cuts. Deutch testified on behalf of his bill before the House Budget Committee on Wednesday.

latimes.com

will boner let it come to the floor for a vote??

i think not

274 Linden Arden  Tue, Apr 19, 2011 5:17:42pm

re: #273 engineer dog

Where is Deutch from?

(don’t know that guy)

275 b_sharp  Tue, Apr 19, 2011 5:18:21pm

re: #274 Linden Arden

Where is Deutch from?

(don’t know that guy)

Deutch land?

276 Linden Arden  Tue, Apr 19, 2011 5:18:33pm

re: #273 engineer dog

Boca Raton! Duuhhh - read it, self.

277 engineer cat  Tue, Apr 19, 2011 5:19:09pm

re: #274 Linden Arden

Where is Deutch from?

(don’t know that guy)

D-Boca Raton

mouse mouth

278 wrenchwench  Tue, Apr 19, 2011 5:20:25pm

re: #272 Linden Arden

I’m 50 and my knees are in great shape after a sports life of tennis and golf only.

My hip is going out though - THR candidate here in 1-2 years.

Why is your hip going out? Was it the golf? I keep telling people it’s bad for them….

279 darthstar  Tue, Apr 19, 2011 5:21:11pm

Did someone call the fire department? Because it’s about to get hot in here!

280 Linden Arden  Tue, Apr 19, 2011 5:23:49pm

re: #278 wrenchwench

Why is your hip going out? Was it the golf? I keep telling people it’s bad for them…

No. I have Avascular Necrosis - aka Bo Jackson’s disease. Remember when he had to retire on the spot at like, — 28 years old? While he was a superstar?

You can break your hip like a dry twig - I can feel it.

281 Stanley Sea  Tue, Apr 19, 2011 5:23:53pm

re: #279 darthstar

Did someone call the fire department? Because it’s about to get hot in here!

[Video]

Brilliant. The walker/mower.

282 allegro  Tue, Apr 19, 2011 5:23:57pm

re: #279 darthstar

That is WONDERFUL!!

283 jamesfirecat  Tue, Apr 19, 2011 5:24:41pm

re: #279 darthstar

Did someone call the fire department? Because it’s about to get hot in here!

[Video]

Holy crap, democrats delivering a functional and effective political message? Will wonders never cease?

284 Simply Sarah  Tue, Apr 19, 2011 5:25:25pm

re: #279 darthstar

Did someone call the fire department? Because it’s about to get hot in here!

[Video]

Oh wow. I’d heard about the spot, but I hadn’t actually seen it. It’s a start, at least.

285 Stanley Sea  Tue, Apr 19, 2011 5:27:47pm

re: #283 jamesfirecat

Holy crap, democrats delivering a functional and effective political message? Will wonders never cease?

#TeamFuckYeah

286 Killgore Trout  Tue, Apr 19, 2011 5:27:49pm

re: #279 darthstar

Did someone call the fire department? Because it’s about to get hot in here!

[Video]

I’m pretty meh on that one. I appreciate that they are trying to make an entertaining commercial but I think it would play better as a serious factual ad.

287 allegro  Tue, Apr 19, 2011 5:27:55pm

re: #279 darthstar

The ad is brilliant in taking a humorous approach from the beginning. If they had tried to be serious it could have backfired into unintentional humor, as in “Help! I’ve fallen and I can’t get up!” I love this ad!

288 Renaissance_Man  Tue, Apr 19, 2011 5:28:46pm

re: #283 jamesfirecat

Holy crap, democrats delivering a functional and effective political message? Will wonders never cease?

I think you mean, ‘crazy and offensive’. Man, these Democrats are so hostile. Why do they hate America?

289 wrenchwench  Tue, Apr 19, 2011 5:29:17pm

re: #280 Linden Arden

No. I have Avascular Necrosis - aka Bo Jackson’s disease. Remember when he had to retire on the spot at like, — 28 years old? While he was a superstar?

You can break your hip like a dry twig - I can feel it.

Bad news. I don’t know Bo, but Floyd Landis had that or something similar. His came after a fracture of the hip that didn’t heal right.

290 Stanley Sea  Tue, Apr 19, 2011 5:30:33pm

re: #289 wrenchwench

Bad news. I don’t know Bo, but Floyd Landis had that or something similar. His came after a fracture of the hip that didn’t heal right.

You walked right into that one. I know Bo.

291 wrenchwench  Tue, Apr 19, 2011 5:31:49pm

re: #290 Stanley Sea

You walked right into that one. I know Bo.

I did know the slogan. Heehee.

He played multiple pro sports, right?

292 Linden Arden  Tue, Apr 19, 2011 5:32:19pm

re: #289 wrenchwench

Yes, steroids are one cause. Not saying that Floyd or Bo doped though. But its possible.

293 Glenn Beck's Grand Unifying Theory of Obdicut  Tue, Apr 19, 2011 5:33:04pm

re: #286 Killgore Trout

I’m pretty meh on that one. I appreciate that they are trying to make an entertaining commercial but I think it would play better as a serious factual ad.

I agree. It ends on an up note. What’s going to be the future? Old men partying with sorority chicks? And this is a crisis because..?

294 b_sharp  Tue, Apr 19, 2011 5:33:27pm

It’s snowing here.

Snow.

In late April.

295 Targetpractice  Tue, Apr 19, 2011 5:33:46pm

re: #294 b_sharp

It’s snowing here.

Snow.

In late April.

See, see, global warming is a hoax!

///

296 wrenchwench  Tue, Apr 19, 2011 5:34:01pm

re: #292 Linden Arden

Yes, steroids are one cause. Not saying that Floyd or Bo doped though. But its possible.

Well, Floyd said he doped, so that one’s pretty sure. Even though he said it after writing a book saying he didn’t dope.

297 b_sharp  Tue, Apr 19, 2011 5:34:43pm

re: #295 Targetpractice, Worst of Both Worlds

See, see, global warming is a hoax!

///

I knew it.

It’s a global punk.

298 wrenchwench  Tue, Apr 19, 2011 5:35:35pm

I’m heading home. Here’s my plan for tomorrow:

Image: 47de0a19-0d0e-4e40-af8d-14485d8448b1.jpg

299 BishopX  Tue, Apr 19, 2011 5:35:47pm

re: #279 darthstar

Did someone call the fire department? Because it’s about to get hot in here!

[Video]

That made me think of this:

300 Stanley Sea  Tue, Apr 19, 2011 5:36:08pm

re: #291 wrenchwench

I did know the slogan. Heehee.

He played multiple pro sports, right?

Football then Baseball. Gators beat his ass on my birthday. He’s a good guy though.

301 b_sharp  Tue, Apr 19, 2011 5:36:39pm

re: #298 wrenchwench

I’m heading home. Here’s my plan for tomorrow:

Image: 47de0a19-0d0e-4e40-af8d-14485d8448b1.jpg

Does your significant other know about this?

302 Decatur Deb  Tue, Apr 19, 2011 5:36:52pm

re: #294 b_sharp

It’s snowing here.

Snow.

In late April.

What’s your latitude/altitude? Northern New Jersey has a meme: The
‘Frozen Days’ of May.

303 Stanley Sea  Tue, Apr 19, 2011 5:36:58pm

re: #293 Obdicut

I agree. It ends on an up note. What’s going to be the future? Old men partying with sorority chicks? And this is a crisis because..?

Definitely gains the wife vote.

304 wrenchwench  Tue, Apr 19, 2011 5:37:36pm

re: #301 b_sharp

Does your significant other know about this?

His concern should be the other days….

305 b_sharp  Tue, Apr 19, 2011 5:38:34pm

re: #302 Decatur Deb

What’s your latitude/altitude? Northern New Jersey has a meme: The
‘Frozen Days’ of May.

51
550m

306 Walter L. Newton  Tue, Apr 19, 2011 5:39:43pm

re: #294 b_sharp

It’s snowing here.

Snow.

In late April.

It’s snowing here… snowed last night too… about 2 inches last night of heavy wet snow… all gone… more now…

307 b_sharp  Tue, Apr 19, 2011 5:39:48pm

re: #304 wrenchwench

His concern should be the other days…

Shouldn’t he know before hand he ain’t gettin’ any?

308 b_sharp  Tue, Apr 19, 2011 5:41:31pm

re: #306 Walter L. Newton

It’s snowing here… snowed last night too… about 2 inches last night of heavy wet snow… all gone… more now…

Yah, but you’re scraping the sky. I’m not much above sea level.

Now it’s coming down heavy.

Floods all over the province, and we’re getting more precip. Great.

309 Decatur Deb  Tue, Apr 19, 2011 5:41:39pm

re: #305 b_sharp

51
550m


31
100m
85f
Let me introduce you to the concept “Snow Bird”.

310 b_sharp  Tue, Apr 19, 2011 5:52:30pm

re: #309 Decatur Deb

31
100m
85f
Let me introduce you to the concept “Snow Bird”.

When we retire, we’ll be swiping my sisters house in Arizona.

311 Stanley Sea  Tue, Apr 19, 2011 5:53:30pm

Ah, so the racist Davenport of OC, is now an “imperfect Christian”

lovely cover asshole.

312 Walter L. Newton  Tue, Apr 19, 2011 5:54:10pm

re: #308 b_sharp

Yah, but you’re scraping the sky. I’m not much above sea level.

Now it’s coming down heavy.

Floods all over the province, and we’re getting more precip. Great.

excuse me while I kiss the sky… supper.

313 Stanley Sea  Tue, Apr 19, 2011 6:07:51pm

Check out this story about Inhofe’s plane landing vs. a long time ago event with Najeeb Halaby (father of Queen Noor, and the FAA Administrator under JFK.)

theatlantic.com

Person on the ground during Inhofe’s crazy landing:

One of the recordings was of an airport official saying, “I’ve got over 50 years flying, three tours of Vietnam, and I can assure you I have never seen such a reckless disregard for human life in my life.”

Inofe was one of 6 people the whole year who got remedial training as a punishment.

Halaby, who fucked up said to his person on the ground:

Halaby simply told him: forget about who I am, do your job.

Read it.

314 Stanley Sea  Tue, Apr 19, 2011 6:09:50pm

re: #313 Stanley Sea

We like to think we’re a society of the Halaby quote. But more and more the stories we tell about “how things work” resemble Inhofe’s.

315 reidr  Tue, Apr 19, 2011 8:00:54pm

re: #7 Gus 802

It’s funny. The GOP gets working stiffs to vote for them by instilling fear of gays, Muslims, abortion, and taxes yet they rarely if ever vote on the side of the working stiff.

And that’s why I think the propaganda is finally faltering, much moreso than Obdicut’s correct point that they’re against Medicare after being for it. At its core, the R’s policies are counter to the vast majority of the people’s best interests. Without the propaganda, they’d never get into office.

316 Ming  Thu, Apr 21, 2011 9:35:19am

re: #246 calochortus

I totally agree with the comment from Calochortus. I’ve heard that a few of the new, incoming Republican Congresspeople were making inquiries all over the place about what government health benefits they’d be getting, personally. (Might have even read that on LGF; I don’t remember.) I think there are some things, like police protection or fire protection, or serious health expenses (obviously nothing like cosmetic surgery) that don’t quite fit that well into the free market. An 80 year old person shouldn’t have to deal with vouchers for police, fire, and cancer.


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Texas County at Center of Border Fight Is Overwhelmed by Migrant Deaths EAGLE PASS, Tex. - The undertaker lighted a cigarette and held it between his latex-gloved fingers as he stood over the bloated body bag lying in the bed of his battered pickup truck. The woman had been fished out ...
Cheechako
4 weeks ago
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