Breitbart.com Commenters Spew Racial Slurs at Democratic Strategist

Yet another deluge of racism, with copious whining that they’re being accused of racism
Wingnuts • Views: 36,786

You can always tell when Andrew Breitbart’s fans are about to let loose with another torrent of bigotry and hatred — it happens whenever breitbart.tv posts another race-baiting video clip of an African American talking about racism: Breitbart.tv » Dem Strategist Calls Cain ‘Bigoted,’ ‘Racist’.

These clips are guaranteed to provoke:

  1. A host of comments whining that they’re being falsely accused of racism.
  2. Dozens of openly racist comments, often from the very same people.

The whining:

AN ANGRY LIBERAL ACCUSING OF RACISM!

When liberals yell “rascism!” all day every day, it becomes just background noise for the intelligent conversation.

[…]

Race card and Bigot card has been so overspent, it is now further in debt than the US Government having ZERO Value!

[…]

etc., etc., etc.

…accompanied by the openly racist comments:

Now that really is the pot calling the kettle black…

[…]

blacks don’t want to be free and get angry

IT’S EASIER TO BE ANGRY THAN IT IS TO BE PRODUCTIVE.

[…]

Yes, because you actually have to work then….

[…]

Correct, but a lot of negroes are to stupid to realize. Or just to damn lazy!!

[…]

Go walk around the hood and see how many brothers are blaming their problems on us. ALL OF THEM!

[…]

Now isn’t that the pot calling the kettle..

I am beginning to think they, most of them - 93%, have a mental disorder. Why do we even care?

[…]

What happened to the old negro racist idea that negros can’t be racist because they have no power? Hmm hmm hmm?

This is a perfect case of the Pot Head calling the kettle black.
The real dark characters here are the white idiots. The content of their characters is ebony.

I hope America sees this for what it is. Satan rising up because he is throwing a hissy fit of biblical proportions.

[…]

Well…this coming from an inner city plantation slave.

[…]

Can someone explain to me why blacks in this country allow the Democrat party to treat them like political lawn jockeys?

[…]

Because lawn jockeys stand around doing nothing….

[…]

Is that Don King’s boy? Needs to work on that there hair!

[…]

Love dat do man…..

[…]

Ahhh shucks, here comes another little-dick race-baiting whinin’ boy singing the most pitiful and wornout meme on the media. Go on, run along boy and find something useful to do with yourself.

[…]

So that’s where Don King’s hairpiece went.

[…]

Well, that’s the Pot calling the kettle, “black”

[…]

Hey Buckwheat, the race card NO LONGER works.

[…]

Even after the Emancipation Proclamation many slaves would not leave the plantations because they wanted to be looked after. So why should the civil rights movement have been any different.

They never get tired of that “pot calling the kettle black” slur. It’s a real knee-slapper.

All of the bigoted comments have high positive ratings from other readers.

Related
Breitbart.com Commenters Respond to Obama Speech with Deluge of Overt Racism Breitbart.com Commenters Spew Racial Slurs at Sheila Jackson Lee

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550 comments
1 prairiefire  Fri, Sep 30, 2011 4:30:19pm

"Even after the Emancipation Proclamation many slaves would not leave the plantations because they wanted to be looked after. So why should the civil rights movement have been any different."

Passive aggressive projection.

2 makeitstop  Fri, Sep 30, 2011 4:34:39pm
When liberals yell “rascism!” all day every day, it becomes just background noise for the intelligent conversation.

And intelligent spelling is completely drowned out.

3 Ming  Fri, Sep 30, 2011 4:34:52pm

I happened to see that exchange on CNN last night, between Cornell Belcher and Ari Fleischer. Honestly, it seemed like a battle of semantics: Belcher thought that the term "brainwashed" was so pejorative that it was in effect racist, and Fleischer thought that Herman Cain was the term "brainwashed" in a much less pejorative way, and therefore wasn't being a racist. So they were both arguing over a particular usage by Herman Cain of that one word, brainwashed. The whole segment wasn't that interesting. I sometimes like to relax and watch Anderson Cooper's show, but that wasn't one of my favorite segments.

It's just plain silly for Breitbart to make a big deal out of that verbal exchange, since my impression was that the original verbal exchange was much ado about nothing. But obviously, making mountains out of molehills is something that hatemongers like Andrew Breitbart do very well.

4 OhCrapIHaveACrushOnSarahPalin  Fri, Sep 30, 2011 4:35:49pm

re: #1 prairiefire

"Even after the Emancipation Proclamation many slaves would not leave the plantations because they wanted to be looked after. So why should the civil rights movement have been any different."

Passive aggressive projection.

e_e

Only in Conservatopia: the Civil Rights movement that demanded independence from white conservative bigots is now the plantation-dweller looking for a handout.

So say all the Confederate flagwaving states-righters, who think we're idiots for not mashing the "R" button for the return to Jim Crow sharecropping, 2.0

So say we all.

5 tnguitarist  Fri, Sep 30, 2011 4:37:18pm

Any second, that asshat Breitbart will start with his 'jazzy' jokes on twitter.

6 OhCrapIHaveACrushOnSarahPalin  Fri, Sep 30, 2011 4:48:28pm

Meanwhile, Andrew's fellow and honorary GOProud board member Ann Coulter has this to say about Don't Ask Don't Tell:

It is beyond absurd to demand that Republican candidates pledge not to consider altering a recent rule change overturning a military policy that had been in effect from the beginning of warfare until the last few weeks of the 111th Congress.

Of course there was booing for that!

At the time of the vote -- five minutes ago -- only eight Republicans in the entire U.S. Senate supported eliminating Don't Ask, Don't Tell. It's safe to assume that no one on the stage supported this sexualization of the military, except maybe one of the nut candidates polling at 3 percent.

This is not an anti-gay position; it's a pro-military position. The basic idea is that sexual bonds are disruptive to the military bond.

Soldiers, sailors and Marines living in close quarters who are having sex with one another, used to have sex with one another or would like to have sex with one another simply cannot function as a well-oiled fighting machine. A battalion of married couples facing a small unit of heterosexual men would be slaughtered.

Conservative self-loathing is doubling and tripling over on itself, these days.

7 Obdicut  Fri, Sep 30, 2011 4:50:28pm

re: #6 OhCrapIHaveACrushOnSarahPalin

A battalion of married couples facing a small unit of heterosexual men would be slaughtered.

Que? I mean, things like the Sacred Band aside, what on earth is her rationale in general?

8 OhCrapIHaveACrushOnSarahPalin  Fri, Sep 30, 2011 4:56:20pm

re: #7 Obdicut

Que? I mean, things like the Sacred Band aside, what on earth is her rationale in general?

Hafta admit, on a couple of occasions I've wondered if perpetual bachelorette Ann Coulter isn't taking the white right on a big huge ride, like I think this character actor might be.

Probably just wishful thinking on my part.

Either way, she will just say anything. And they'll pay her to keep doing so. Lol so weird.

9 dragonfire1981  Fri, Sep 30, 2011 5:05:52pm

Image: crapcat.jpg

10 Dark_Falcon  Fri, Sep 30, 2011 5:06:41pm

re: #7 Obdicut

Que? I mean, things like the Sacred Band aside, what on earth is her rationale in general?

I don't think she has a rationale, nor does she think she needs one. She thinks all she has to do is slam gay people in incendiary language and her fan base will applaud and throw money. The Hell of the thing is that she's right.

11 Charles Johnson  Fri, Sep 30, 2011 5:12:51pm

The usernames picked by these people are pretty telling, too:

TheSouthWasRght

12 Dark_Falcon  Fri, Sep 30, 2011 5:18:52pm

re: #11 Charles

The usernames picked by these people are pretty telling, too:

TheSouthWasRght

My Standing Answer to Neo-Confederates:

Youtube Video
13 Obdicut  Fri, Sep 30, 2011 5:20:54pm

re: #12 Dark_Falcon

Does that include Rick Perry, who lied and claimed that Texas could leave the union whenever it wanted?

14 Dark_Falcon  Fri, Sep 30, 2011 5:21:23pm

I got the big sale I needed today and surpassed my quota by 50%. Management was very pleased and I'm quite happy with my best sales month in a year. /winning

15 Dark_Falcon  Fri, Sep 30, 2011 5:22:14pm

re: #13 Obdicut

Does that include Rick Perry, who lied and claimed that Texas could leave the union whenever it wanted?

I'm not sure I'd call him a Neo-Confederate, but if he is then it would apply to him.

16 Obdicut  Fri, Sep 30, 2011 5:24:20pm

re: #15 Dark_Falcon

How do you interpret his statement, and his other pandering to secessionist and 'states rights' types? Just pandering, with no actual conviction behind it?

It's hard for me to accept that that specific lie-- which is basically a denial that the civil war and the court judgments that came settled the issue of secession-- isn't a purposeful one. Do you actually think he's that ignorant, that he really believes Texas could secede whenever it wanted?

17 OhCrapIHaveACrushOnSarahPalin  Fri, Sep 30, 2011 5:24:51pm

re: #10 Dark_Falcon

I don't think she has a rationale, nor does she think she needs one. She thinks all she has to do is slam gay people in incendiary language and her fan base will applaud and throw money. The Hell of the thing is that she's right.

Although...it's made somewhat more complex because she's the honorary chair of the board of GOProud.

So this brings up a few questions:

1- why is GOProud putting professional con bigots like her and Breitbart on their board,

2- if she's so committed to lgbt equality, as GOProud ever-so loudly proclaims it is, why is she always spewing GOTP party-line heteros-first supremacist views,

and

3- are there ANY gay people in GOProud??

Bonus points: why does GOProud never utter a peep against the legions of socially-enraged conservative bigots who populate the GOTP? Who do they think they are kidding?

18 Mostly sane, most of the time.  Fri, Sep 30, 2011 5:24:57pm

re: #14 Dark_Falcon

I got the big sale I needed today and surpassed my quota by 50%. Management was very pleased and I'm quite happy with my best sales month in a year. /winning

Yes, but please be winning in a non-Sheen kind of way, 'kay?

19 darthstar  Fri, Sep 30, 2011 5:26:18pm

You want to surprise me Charles? Find an example where Breitbart and his followers DON'T spew racial slurs at Democrats.

20 Dark_Falcon  Fri, Sep 30, 2011 5:27:20pm

re: #18 EmmmieG

Yes, but please be winning in a non-Sheen kind of way, 'kay?

I won't emulate Charlie. But it seems like his replacement on 2 And a Half Men is emulating him quite convincingly.

21 Mostly sane, most of the time.  Fri, Sep 30, 2011 5:27:33pm

Racist and boring. Only the comments on youtube are less worth reading.

22 Dark_Falcon  Fri, Sep 30, 2011 5:29:17pm

re: #16 Obdicut

How do you interpret his statement, and his other pandering to secessionist and 'states rights' types? Just pandering, with no actual conviction behind it?

It's hard for me to accept that that specific lie-- which is basically a denial that the civil war and the court judgments that came settled the issue of secession-- isn't a purposeful one. Do you actually think he's that ignorant, that he really believes Texas could secede whenever it wanted?

I think he knows that Texas cannot do that, but he lied to pump up his support base. Texas often feels a desire to flip Washington DC the bird, and Rick Perry has used that sentiment to his advantage many times.

23 OhCrapIHaveACrushOnSarahPalin  Fri, Sep 30, 2011 5:30:54pm

re: #15 Dark_Falcon

I'm not sure I'd call him a Neo-Confederate, but if he is then it would apply to him.

Forget "Neo-Confederate", he's just a flat out confederate, like the bulk of today's GOTP.

They resent federal government for kicking their states rights asses from hither to yon for 150 years, they resent all minorities whether social, numerical, or both; whom they see as the prime beneficiary of their ass-kicking. Their main gripe is that they feel government should be for them and them alone, and hold everyone else back so they can thrive.

Just like the old Confederacy, just like post-Reconstruction, just like Jim Crow, just like sharecropping, all of which we crammed right back down their seething, gun-clutching throats.

/Schadenfreude

24 laZardo  Fri, Sep 30, 2011 5:32:26pm

Back from job applyin'. What'd I miss?

25 darthstar  Fri, Sep 30, 2011 5:32:40pm

Holy fuck...they're making Legos for adults now? I don't have to grow up after all.

26 Obdicut  Fri, Sep 30, 2011 5:33:22pm

re: #22 Dark_Falcon

Well, you're probably right. It's a shockingly awful lie, which not only dangerously inflames secessionist types but basically spits on the graves of those that died in the Civil War. One step beyond forgetting history is denying it.

I'd love to hear Romney asked if he thinks states have any right to secede. Or to have all the GOP hopefuls answer that one.

27 darthstar  Fri, Sep 30, 2011 5:33:42pm

re: #24 laZardo

Back from job applyin'. What'd I miss?

A Breitbart supporter apparently almost wrote something non-racist before dissolving into a foaming pile of hate.

28 OhCrapIHaveACrushOnSarahPalin  Fri, Sep 30, 2011 5:34:27pm

re: #21 EmmmieG

Racist and boring. Only the comments on youtube are less worth reading.

Difference is, nobody on youtube is considered part of some conservative "movement".

Breitbart has an impact youtube doesn't. If one is in doubt, ask Shirley Sherrod's employment lawyers. /

29 Dark_Falcon  Fri, Sep 30, 2011 5:38:40pm

re: #25 darthstar

Holy fuck...they're making Legos for adults now? I don't have to grow up after all.

At one time, they actually used Lego actually have advanced sets that could be built into Battlemechs (of the Battletech game line that I play). Sometimes these are still seen assembled at GenCon or other game conventions for larger-sized Battletech games.

30 laZardo  Fri, Sep 30, 2011 5:39:06pm

re: #27 darthstar

A Breitbart supporter apparently almost wrote something non-racist before dissolving into a foaming pile of hate.

Nothing much then.

q;

31 Dark_Falcon  Fri, Sep 30, 2011 5:39:37pm

I'm going to head to dinner.

BBL

32 laZardo  Fri, Sep 30, 2011 5:40:02pm

re: #25 darthstar

Holy fuck...they're making Legos for adults now? I don't have to grow up after all.

They've been trying to find lines for "grownups." Over at B&N they have small "famous architecture" sets.

33 Charles Johnson  Fri, Sep 30, 2011 5:43:56pm

Wow. Now Andrew Breitbart is calling out his lunatic fans to dig up the personal info on someone who heckled him:

[Link: biggovernment.com...]

34 OhCrapIHaveACrushOnSarahPalin  Fri, Sep 30, 2011 5:47:02pm

re: #26 Obdicut

Well, you're probably right. It's a shockingly awful lie, which not only dangerously inflames secessionist types but basically spits on the graves of those that died in the Civil War. One step beyond forgetting history is denying it.

I'd love to hear Romney asked if he thinks states have any right to secede. Or to have all the GOP hopefuls answer that one.

I agree. Take the onus off of just stupid Perry, as if he's the only one in the GOP who thinks that way.

Let them all apply some of that infamous, legendary personal responsibility to their ideas on that question.

(Oh yeah and if that ever happens in a million years, and someone thinks to get cute and single out Herman Cain on it, I will kick their butt :D )

35 OhCrapIHaveACrushOnSarahPalin  Fri, Sep 30, 2011 5:48:46pm

re: #19 darthstar

You want to surprise me Charles? Find an example where Breitbart and his followers DON'T spew racial slurs at Democrats.

Would that it were only Breitbart & co.

36 jaunte  Fri, Sep 30, 2011 5:49:44pm
"...it dawned on me that maiming and shaming is the only means to put rabid leftists in their place..."

Cute.

37 OhCrapIHaveACrushOnSarahPalin  Fri, Sep 30, 2011 5:52:54pm

re: #36 jaunte

Cute.

Let them try it, from behind their desktops in their locked down gated communities.

They are afraid of their own shadows. This is why they need states rights government to suppress the competition for them.

Conservative cowards.

38 Atlas Fails  Fri, Sep 30, 2011 5:53:18pm

re: #33 Charles

Wow. Now Andrew Breitbart is calling out his lunatic fans to dig up the personal info on someone who heckled him:

[Link: biggovernment.com...]

What a fucking clown. How many penis pics does a guy have to own before being disavowed by the right?

39 darthstar  Fri, Sep 30, 2011 5:55:42pm

re: #38 Atlas Fails

What a fucking clown. How many penis pics does a guy have to own before being disavowed by the right?

All of them.

40 laZardo  Fri, Sep 30, 2011 5:57:41pm

re: #39 darthstar

All of them.

That explains why there are so many neo-Nazi survivalists on 4chan.

/partial

41 albusteve  Fri, Sep 30, 2011 5:59:43pm

re: #33 Charles

Wow. Now Andrew Breitbart is calling out his lunatic fans to dig up the personal info on someone who heckled him:

[Link: biggovernment.com...]

gawd, what a stupid post...but
"Andrew, your restraint was admirable"!
what a champion

42 Gus  Fri, Sep 30, 2011 6:02:41pm

The fish rots from the head down. Breitbart -- being the head of this fish -- has the mentality of a deranged and academically challenged 8th grader that spent a year in juvie hall.

43 Lidane  Fri, Sep 30, 2011 6:03:43pm

re: #25 darthstar

Holy fuck...they're making Legos for adults now? I don't have to grow up after all.

This $400 Lego set definitely isn't designed with kids in mind:

[Link: shop.lego.com...]

44 goddamnedfrank  Fri, Sep 30, 2011 6:05:28pm

re: #6 OhCrapIHaveACrushOnSarahPalin

Soldiers, sailors and Marines living in close quarters who are having sex with one another, used to have sex with one another or would like to have sex with one another simply cannot function as a well-oiled fighting machine.

LOL, she's thought long and hard about this, you can tell.

45 laZardo  Fri, Sep 30, 2011 6:07:00pm

re: #44 goddamnedfrank

LOL, she's thought long and hard about this, you can tell.

I agree, she's really managed to beat off the run-on effect of that sentence.

46 darthstar  Fri, Sep 30, 2011 6:13:22pm

re: #45 laZardo

I agree, she's really managed to beat off the run-on effect of that sentence.

It was a stroke of genius on her part.

47 darthstar  Fri, Sep 30, 2011 6:14:24pm

re: #43 Lidane

This $400 Lego set definitely isn't designed with kids in mind:

[Link: shop.lego.com...]

For $400 it had better actually be capable of blowing up a fucking planet.

48 Charles Johnson  Fri, Sep 30, 2011 6:20:52pm

If I had ever called out LGF readers to attack and dig up personal information on someone who criticized me, I would have been mercilessly attacked by the right wing.

Andrew Breitbart blatantly calls on his users to stalk a personal enemy and try to ruin him, and the right wing obediently starts digging.

Yeah.

49 albusteve  Fri, Sep 30, 2011 6:21:31pm

re: #47 darthstar

For $400 it had better actually be capable of blowing up a fucking planet.

re: #47 darthstar

For $400 it had better actually be capable of blowing up a fucking planet.

give me a model plane anyday...I used to build model planes and cars by the dozen, right up until just a few years ago...still have have a very rare, out of production B26 to make up

50 Digital Display  Fri, Sep 30, 2011 6:23:45pm

Ah heck.. I'm not going out tonight but have OU Tickets Saturday.. It is going to be a blast

Let us bow our heads...
Dear Lord The United States of America delivered into your arms Anwar Al-Awlaki today...
We did our part to bring about justice for people on this Earth
We pray you do with him what you will.. Cause we're glad to be rid of him
Amen..

51 albusteve  Fri, Sep 30, 2011 6:25:02pm

re: #48 Charles

If I had ever called out LGF readers to attack and dig up personal information on someone who criticized me, I would have been mercilessly attacked by the right wing.

Andrew Breitbart blatantly calls on his users to stalk a personal enemy and try to ruin him, and the right wing obediently starts digging.

Yeah.

like a feudal lord, he calls his peasants to duty to do his dirty work...and they must obey

52 jaunte  Fri, Sep 30, 2011 6:29:48pm

We may find out how much Andrew Breitbart paid James O'Keefe for one of his ACORN videos

A federal judge handling a federal lawsuit filed by a former ACORN employee against James O'Keefe has ordered the conservative provocateur and filmmaker to disclose video footage and payments he received from Andrew Breitbart in relation to one of his sting operations.

53 albusteve  Fri, Sep 30, 2011 6:29:59pm

re: #50 HoosierHoops

Ah heck.. I'm not going out tonight but have OU Tickets Saturday.. It is going to be a blast

Let us bow our heads...
Dear Lord The United States of America delivered into your arms Anwar Al-Awlaki today...
We did our part to bring about justice for people on this Earth
We pray you do with him what you will.. Cause we're glad to be rid of him
Amen..

I propose a toast!
Al-Awlaki
(slightly burnt)

54 Killgore Trout  Fri, Sep 30, 2011 6:30:11pm

I've been watching the recent wave of radical left protests and I'm thinking Obama might be in trouble. Until now I was assured that the fractured and radical right would scare away any moderates from voting Republican but now the divisions on the left might counter the the Tea Party insanity. The Protests in NY are sponsored by the World Worker's Party, Annon, Wikileaks, Bradley Manning supporters. Protests now popping up in Boston supported by Socialist Alternative. Mikey Moore, Susan Sarandon, MSNBC, DKos and the lefty blogs are all a flutter with the prospects of a Marxist revolution. All the groups innitiating these protests are very anti-Obama and as they grow more mainstream they're coopting the Dem Base. If this trend continues it could be big trouble for Obama in the next election by alienating the base and scaring away moderates, It's a very bad time for the radical left to rear its ugly head.

55 laZardo  Fri, Sep 30, 2011 6:31:20pm

re: #54 Killgore Trout

I've been watching the recent wave of radical left protests and I'm thinking Obama might be in trouble. Until now I was assured that the fractured and radical right would scare away any moderates from voting Republican but now the divisions on the left might counter the the Tea Party insanity. The Protests in NY are sponsored by the World Worker's Party, Annon, Wikileaks, Bradley Manning supporters. Protests now popping up in Boston supported by Socialist Alternative. Mikey Moore, Susan Sarandon, MSNBC, DKos and the lefty blogs are all a flutter with the prospects of a Marxist revolution. All the groups innitiating these protests are very anti-Obama and as they grow more mainstream they're coopting the Dem Base. If this trend continues it could be big trouble for Obama in the next election by alienating the base and scaring away moderates, It's a very bad time for the radical left to rear its ugly head.

Considering that what passes for "center-left" in America is really "center-right" elsewhere, this might not be such a bad thing unless it actually does result in a TPGOP victory.

56 Kragar  Fri, Sep 30, 2011 6:31:26pm

re: #48 Charles

If I had ever called out LGF readers to attack and dig up personal information on someone who criticized me, I would have been mercilessly attacked by the right wing.

Andrew Breitbart blatantly calls on his users to stalk a personal enemy and try to ruin him, and the right wing obediently starts digging.

Yeah.

But they're doing it because they're patriots, not a bunch of rabid dogs who have been conditioned to a degree that would impress Pavlov

57 OhCrapIHaveACrushOnSarahPalin  Fri, Sep 30, 2011 6:31:53pm

re: #44 goddamnedfrank

LOL, she's thought long and hard about this, you can tell.

She's very good at tossing 'em off

58 Mostly sane, most of the time.  Fri, Sep 30, 2011 6:32:06pm

re: #47 darthstar

For $400 it had better actually be capable of blowing up a fucking planet.

This will grace many a basement.

59 Gus  Fri, Sep 30, 2011 6:33:25pm

re: #54 Killgore Trout

I've been watching the recent wave of radical left protests and I'm thinking Obama might be in trouble. Until now I was assured that the fractured and radical right would scare away any moderates from voting Republican but now the divisions on the left might counter the the Tea Party insanity. The Protests in NY are sponsored by the World Worker's Party, Annon, Wikileaks, Bradley Manning supporters. Protests now popping up in Boston supported by Socialist Alternative. Mikey Moore, Susan Sarandon, MSNBC, DKos and the lefty blogs are all a flutter with the prospects of a Marxist revolution. All the groups innitiating these protests are very anti-Obama and as they grow more mainstream they're coopting the Dem Base. If this trend continues it could be big trouble for Obama in the next election by alienating the base and scaring away moderates, It's a very bad time for the radical left to rear its ugly head.

Radical man. Yeah, democracy sucks doesn't it? So when would be a good time to protest?

60 Digital Display  Fri, Sep 30, 2011 6:34:53pm

re: #53 albusteve

I propose a toast!
Al-Awlaki
(slightly burnt)

Hi Steve! Hope you are well.. I've been..Believe it or not been getting into 3 doors down lately...I was checking out my music.. John Mayall.. Can you believe it..I'd almost forgotten about him... One of the first songs I learned on Guitar in Junior High was my pretty girl..

61 albusteve  Fri, Sep 30, 2011 6:35:15pm

re: #54 Killgore Trout

I've been watching the recent wave of radical left protests and I'm thinking Obama might be in trouble. Until now I was assured that the fractured and radical right would scare away any moderates from voting Republican but now the divisions on the left might counter the the Tea Party insanity. The Protests in NY are sponsored by the World Worker's Party, Annon, Wikileaks, Bradley Manning supporters. Protests now popping up in Boston supported by Socialist Alternative. Mikey Moore, Susan Sarandon, MSNBC, DKos and the lefty blogs are all a flutter with the prospects of a Marxist revolution. All the groups innitiating these protests are very anti-Obama and as they grow more mainstream they're coopting the Dem Base. If this trend continues it could be big trouble for Obama in the next election by alienating the base and scaring away moderates, It's a very bad time for the radical left to rear its ugly head.

astute observation...BO is already in trouble...grumblings of another candidate, tanking poll numbers, his health care repairs in court, losing traction in the Senate etc...it all adds up and if goes one and done, I won't be surprised...people can't believe he could lose, but I do

62 Wozza Matter?  Fri, Sep 30, 2011 6:36:55pm

re: #54 Killgore Trout

The left has needed to get off it's ass for a long time seeing as it's the poorest being continually screwed over.

These people would love to be the base of the Democratic party, but i don't think that's going to happen anytime soon.

63 albusteve  Fri, Sep 30, 2011 6:38:20pm

re: #60 HoosierHoops

Hi Steve! Hope you are well.. I've been..Believe it or not been getting into 3 doors down lately...I was checking out my music.. John Mayall.. Can you believe it..I'd almost forgotten about him... One of the first songs I learned on Guitar in Junior High was my pretty girl..

as far as I know, Mayall has been touring all these years and making good music...I don't remember ever seeing him live, but I might have...he's one of the old godfathers...and thanks for the reminder

64 Wozza Matter?  Fri, Sep 30, 2011 6:39:23pm

re: #61 albusteve

grumblings of another candidate,

From the usual suspects who would want a more left wing candidate to run against Denis Kucinich.

65 Gus  Fri, Sep 30, 2011 6:39:57pm

Yeah. If Obama loses it will be because of these Wall Street protests!!11ty

Uh huh.

66 OhCrapIHaveACrushOnSarahPalin  Fri, Sep 30, 2011 6:40:24pm

re: #55 laZardo

Considering that what passes for "center-left" in America is really "center-right" elsewhere, this might not be such a bad thing unless it actually does result in a TPGOP victory.

There are plenty of things that could result in such a victory - the race is always the incumbent's to lose.

I'm just not seeing this growing glee at some impending marxist revolution KT is concern trolling about, not in my circles. I'm seeing a lot of ho-hum.

This OWS is not Tea Party 2.0, either. Anybody who really thinks there will be OWS equivalents of the tea party two years from now, like the OWS Sharron Angle, or Christine O'Donnell, or Palin, Bachmann, Nikki Haley, Allen West, Joe Miller, etc., has not been paying attention to left history of the past 80 years.

Tempest/tea pot.

67 albusteve  Fri, Sep 30, 2011 6:40:53pm

re: #59 Gus 802

Radical man. Yeah, democracy sucks doesn't it? So when would be a good time to protest?

it's not about democracy, it's about politics and KT has a valid, reasonable point....if right wing lunatics hurt the GOP, isn't the same true for democrats?....yes

68 Gus  Fri, Sep 30, 2011 6:41:35pm

re: #67 albusteve

it's not about democracy, it's about politics and KT has a valid, reasonable point...if right wing lunatics hurt the GOP, isn't the same true for democrats?...yes

No.

69 OhCrapIHaveACrushOnSarahPalin  Fri, Sep 30, 2011 6:41:46pm

re: #61 albusteve

grumblings of another candidate,

Nonsense - people talking like that don't even have a viable name, let alone an actual candidate than can win the D nomination in a year.

70 albusteve  Fri, Sep 30, 2011 6:42:13pm

re: #64 wozzablog

From the usual suspects who would want a more left wing candidate to run against Denis Kucinich.

the source doesn't matter...the fact that this stuff is in the air does

71 Wozza Matter?  Fri, Sep 30, 2011 6:42:40pm

re: #66 OhCrapIHaveACrushOnSarahPalin

There are plenty of things that could result in such a victory - the race is always the incumbent's to lose.

I'm just not seeing this growing glee at some impending marxist revolution KT is concern trolling about, not in my circles. I'm seeing a lot of ho-hum.

This OWS is not Tea Party 2.0, either. Anybody who really thinks there will be OWS equivalents of the tea party two years from now, like the OWS Sharron Angle, or Christine O'Donnell, or Palin, Bachmann, Nikki Haley, Allen West, Joe Miller, etc., has not been paying attention to left history of the past 80 years.

Tempest/tea pot.

Code Pink and Cindy Sheehan never rose above curios for the majority of registered democrats.

Same panic about descent into socialism, different day.

72 jaunte  Fri, Sep 30, 2011 6:43:07pm

re: #54 Killgore Trout

I don't know if it's really big on the radar yet. Mostly I hear that people who would have swelled the crowd down there are disappointed that Radiohead isn't going to play.

73 OhCrapIHaveACrushOnSarahPalin  Fri, Sep 30, 2011 6:43:27pm

re: #67 albusteve

it's not about democracy, it's about politics and KT has a valid, reasonable point...if right wing lunatics hurt the GOP, isn't the same true for democrats?...yes

In MBF world, yes.

OWS is not another tea party. They will never have that level of financial backing or political legitimacy.

74 albusteve  Fri, Sep 30, 2011 6:44:57pm

re: #65 Gus 802

Yeah. If Obama loses it will be because of these Wall Street protests!!11ty

Uh huh.

nobody said that...if he loses it will the accumulative effect of disgruntled indies and progs, hardly one protest gig

75 Wozza Matter?  Fri, Sep 30, 2011 6:45:01pm

re: #70 albusteve

the source doesn't matter...the fact that this stuff is in the air does

It really doesn't. No-one considering voting democratic has taken a blind bit of notice.

76 Gus  Fri, Sep 30, 2011 6:45:40pm

re: #74 albusteve

nobody said that...if he loses it will the accumulative effect of disgruntled indies and progs, hardly one protest gig

Oh brother.

No.

77 OhCrapIHaveACrushOnSarahPalin  Fri, Sep 30, 2011 6:46:27pm

re: #71 wozzablog

Code Pink and Cindy Sheehan never rose above curios for the majority of registered democrats.

Same panic about descent into socialism, different day.

It's really true. I'm getting a kick out of this ridiculous little mini-anxiety about them. It's as if everyone has forgotten about what happened to the antiwar protests of barely even a decade ago, which went absolutely nowhere, nationally.

Total lack of perspective, though that could be predicted.

78 albusteve  Fri, Sep 30, 2011 6:47:12pm

lose!
unpossible!!!
lol!

79 OhCrapIHaveACrushOnSarahPalin  Fri, Sep 30, 2011 6:47:36pm

re: #74 albusteve

nobody said that...

Well, not in this thread, not yet, anyway. Other threads, yes. It will be equally hilarious when introduced into this one.

80 wee fury  Fri, Sep 30, 2011 6:47:44pm

I am a disgruntled Independent.

81 Gus  Fri, Sep 30, 2011 6:48:28pm

Yeesh. Back later.

82 Mostly sane, most of the time.  Fri, Sep 30, 2011 6:49:29pm

re: #80 wee fury

I am a disgruntled Independent.

What the heck is that? You're mad at nobody in particular?

83 OhCrapIHaveACrushOnSarahPalin  Fri, Sep 30, 2011 6:50:03pm

re: #70 albusteve

the source doesn't matter...

Yes, it does. Do you have one?

84 Killgore Trout  Fri, Sep 30, 2011 6:50:27pm

re: #59 Gus 802

Radical man. Yeah, democracy sucks doesn't it? So when would be a good time to protest?

I would say a good idea would be a prerequisite before launching a protest.

85 jaunte  Fri, Sep 30, 2011 6:50:36pm

re: #80 wee fury

I am a disgruntled Independent.

Who are the gruntle creators?

86 Wozza Matter?  Fri, Sep 30, 2011 6:51:00pm

re: #77 OhCrapIHaveACrushOnSarahPalin

It's really true. I'm getting a kick out of this ridiculous little mini-anxiety about them. It's as if everyone has forgotten about what happened to the antiwar protests of barely even a decade ago, which went absolutely nowhere, nationally.

Total lack of perspective, though that could be predicted.

The anti-war protests were bigger and had relatively small covereage too.

Seems those in the media ignore mass protest when the Military Industrial Complex or Wall Street are threatened by protests, but half a dozen gun nuts show up to tea bag each other and suddenly its world news. Fuck that shit.

87 Wozza Matter?  Fri, Sep 30, 2011 6:51:42pm

re: #85 jaunte

Who are the gruntle creators?

The same people can whelm you.

88 albusteve  Fri, Sep 30, 2011 6:52:02pm

re: #83 OhCrapIHaveACrushOnSarahPalin

Yes, it does. Do you have one?

God and I were doing lunch...the topic just popped up

89 Killgore Trout  Fri, Sep 30, 2011 6:52:27pm

Socialist Alternative

90 Linden Arden  Fri, Sep 30, 2011 6:53:42pm

The GOP wants a John Wayne shitkicker while the Dems prefer a Bill Gates type wonk.

Colbert says "Go with your gut!" so brains won't be important in 2012.

JMHO.

91 Digital Display  Fri, Sep 30, 2011 6:53:43pm

re: #88 albusteve

God and I were doing lunch...the topic just popped up

I thought it quite disrespectful of you to be Tweeting during Dessert....
/

92 wee fury  Fri, Sep 30, 2011 6:54:36pm

re: #85 jaunte

lol.

93 albusteve  Fri, Sep 30, 2011 6:54:50pm

re: #87 wozzablog

The same people can whelm you.

heh...true
we are all getting whelmed everyday with this stuff

94 OhCrapIHaveACrushOnSarahPalin  Fri, Sep 30, 2011 6:55:23pm

re: #86 wozzablog

The anti-war protests were bigger and had relatively small covereage too.

Seems those in the media ignore mass protest when the Military Industrial Complex or Wall Street are threatened by protests, but half a dozen gun nuts show up to tea bag each other and suddenly its world news. Fuck that shit.

Stated better than I did. By "nationally" I meant national msm. Those rallies were huge - didn't make the news.

Cut to 7-8 years later, a few dumb conservative bigots in stockings and buckled shoes from the 1770s show up for a photo-op...hey look, it's a movement, complete with candidates, darlings, and deep pockets.

This week, they're focused on the drum circles and a couple police macings. Next week, it will be back to Chaz Bono's scores on DWTS.

Showbiz...

95 albusteve  Fri, Sep 30, 2011 6:56:04pm

re: #91 HoosierHoops

I thought it quite disrespectful of you to be Tweeting during Dessert...
/

I'm a hayseed...I farted several times too, as I recall

96 OhCrapIHaveACrushOnSarahPalin  Fri, Sep 30, 2011 6:56:10pm

re: #87 wozzablog

The same people can whelm you.

Are those the people who are couth? I've always wanted to meet somebody who is couth.

97 wee fury  Fri, Sep 30, 2011 6:56:34pm

Zumba helps :D

98 laZardo  Fri, Sep 30, 2011 6:57:43pm

re: #89 Killgore Trout

Socialist Alternative

...I'm tempted to ask wlewisiii what he thinks.

99 Wozza Matter?  Fri, Sep 30, 2011 6:57:53pm

re: #96 OhCrapIHaveACrushOnSarahPalin

Are those the people who are couth? I've always wanted to meet somebody who is couth.

Couth, but louche at the same time.

100 bratwurst  Fri, Sep 30, 2011 6:58:48pm

Anyone who is saying Obama can't lose at this point is deranged. Nobody around here has, in reality, been saying anything like that for months. Even so, I do think Obama will have more than a fighting chance when he is running against one person and not Gene Eric Republican...Wall Street protests or no.

101 Jimmi the Grey  Fri, Sep 30, 2011 6:58:59pm

re: #70 albusteve

the source doesn't matter...the fact that this stuff is in the air does

So Rush and Glenn sayin so will have the stated effect?

Or did you mean 'Any source respected by Democratic voters'?

102 Killgore Trout  Fri, Sep 30, 2011 7:01:10pm

re: #98 laZardo

...I'm tempted to ask wlewisiii what he thinks.

Don't ask questions you don't want answers to.

103 OhCrapIHaveACrushOnSarahPalin  Fri, Sep 30, 2011 7:01:24pm

re: #100 bratwurst

Anyone who is saying Obama can't lose at this point is deranged. Nobody around here has, in reality, been saying anything like that for months.

I know. It's totally invented and ridiculous.

104 albusteve  Fri, Sep 30, 2011 7:01:37pm

re: #101 Jimmi the Grey

So Rush and Glenn sayin so will have the stated effect?

Or did you mean 'Any source respected by Democratic voters'?

it's like a fog, it comes out of nowhere and eventually you cannot find the down markers

105 Wozza Matter?  Fri, Sep 30, 2011 7:03:46pm

re: #103 OhCrapIHaveACrushOnSarahPalin

I know. It's totally invented and ridiculous.

He loses to Gene Eric at the moment.

106 Jimmi the Grey  Fri, Sep 30, 2011 7:04:17pm

re: #104 albusteve

it's like a fog, it comes out of nowhere and eventually you cannot find the down markers

Then the winner will be whomever the newsroom exec's anoint. They control 'the fog'.

107 jaunte  Fri, Sep 30, 2011 7:05:12pm

Nebel/Generic 2012

108 ThomasLite  Fri, Sep 30, 2011 7:05:12pm

re: #17 OhCrapIHaveACrushOnSarahPalin

Although...it's made somewhat more complex because she's the honorary chair of the board of GOProud.

So this brings up a few questions:

1- why is GOProud putting professional con bigots like her and Breitbart on their board,

2- if she's so committed to lgbt equality, as GOProud ever-so loudly proclaims it is, why is she always spewing GOTP party-line heteros-first supremacist views,

and

3- are there ANY gay people in GOProud??

Bonus points: why does GOProud never utter a peep against the legions of socially-enraged conservative bigots who populate the GOTP? Who do they think they are kidding?

3: [Link: www.goproud.org...]
Chris lives in Washington, D.C. with his partner Shawn.

Bruce currently resides in Charlotte, NC and lives with his partner of 10 years, John, and their two dogs Saxby and Shadow.

Jessica left the Republican party due to its catering to the anti-gay religious right. She found a home with GOProud, which has no party affiliation and supports her conservative views.

so yes, there are a few on that board.
that also happens, by the way, to be a link you have posted several times before. just sayin' ;)

109 albusteve  Fri, Sep 30, 2011 7:05:24pm

re: #106 Jimmi the Grey

Then the winner will be whomever the newsroom exec's anoint. They control 'the fog'.

man, I just knew it was the special effects...nobody believed me

110 Wozza Matter?  Fri, Sep 30, 2011 7:06:00pm

re: #107 jaunte

Nebel/Generic 2012

Gene Eric/Fetus Inajar '12

111 albusteve  Fri, Sep 30, 2011 7:06:39pm

re: #103 OhCrapIHaveACrushOnSarahPalin

I know. It's totally invented and ridiculous.

true, that should be edited to weeks or even days to be more accurate

112 laZardo  Fri, Sep 30, 2011 7:07:57pm

re: #110 wozzablog

Gene Eric/Fetus Inajar '12

Gene Eric/Coss Pleier '12

113 Obdicut  Fri, Sep 30, 2011 7:09:18pm

re: #108 ThomasLite

GOProud has no party affiliation?

114 OhCrapIHaveACrushOnSarahPalin  Fri, Sep 30, 2011 7:09:28pm

re: #108 ThomasLite

so yes, there are a few on that board.
that also happens, by the way, to be a link you have posted several times before. just sayin' ;)

Glad you've noticed and thought to look, as it was more than just a rhetorical question.

Care to answer some of the others?

You could start with why someone on the board of a supposed equality organization is advocating for the reinstatement of DADT.

Or, alternatively, why we never hear a peep out of all those noted gays on the board of GOProud like Grover Norquist, when politician after politician after conservative leader spews antigay political positions on a daily basis.

Just some ideas for starters.

115 OhCrapIHaveACrushOnSarahPalin  Fri, Sep 30, 2011 7:10:39pm

re: #111 albusteve

true, that should be edited to weeks or even days to be more accurate

Well from my end it's been months, but hey who's counting.

116 prairiefire  Fri, Sep 30, 2011 7:12:19pm

re: #50 HoosierHoops

Amen!

117 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Fri, Sep 30, 2011 7:15:44pm

Heh...

118 Jimmi the Grey  Fri, Sep 30, 2011 7:16:34pm

re: #109 albusteve

man, I just knew it was the special effects...nobody believed me

Dude, it's totally about the fx. If a tree falls in the woods and they don't report it, it never happened. If they do report it it's deforestation/clear cut.

119 albusteve  Fri, Sep 30, 2011 7:17:56pm

re: #118 Jimmi the Grey

Dude, it's totally about the fx. If a tree falls in the woods and they don't report it, it never happened. If they do report it it's deforestation/clear cut.

that makes perfect sense...I see the light

120 ThomasLite  Fri, Sep 30, 2011 7:19:57pm

re: #113 Obdicut

GOProud has no party affiliation?

their words. I laughed a little at that, too.

re: #114 OhCrapIHaveACrushOnSarahPalin

Glad you've noticed and thought to look, as it was more than just a rhetorical question.

Care to answer some of the others?

You could start with why someone on the board of a supposed equality organization is advocating for the reinstatement of DADT.

Or, alternatively, why we never hear a peep out of all those noted gays on the board of GOProud like Grover Norquist, when politician after politician after conservative leader spews antigay political positions on a daily basis.

Just some ideas for starters.

hey, I'm not arguing. I think GOProud is in an awkward position for them, to say the least. anyone who sees himself as conservative who's gay is not in a real good place in the USA, as far as I can tell.

still, I've seen you argue that there's no LGBT people on the GOProud board before; I've checked, it's not true. just an FYI. honestly, I'm not defending any of the bigots here, just fact-checking what, to me, seemed a bit of a peculiar claim.

121 Jimmi the Grey  Fri, Sep 30, 2011 7:22:03pm

re: #119 albusteve

I have this eerie feeling you're forgetting to use sarc tags...

122 Wozza Matter?  Fri, Sep 30, 2011 7:23:08pm

re: #121 Jimmi the Grey

You must be new here.......

123 Killgore Trout  Fri, Sep 30, 2011 7:23:54pm

Since I got gazed earlier for posting this......
Pink Floyd - Us and Them (Richard Wright Demo)
www.youtube.com/watch?v=oFKR0ECaMY4

124 albusteve  Fri, Sep 30, 2011 7:25:10pm

re: #121 Jimmi the Grey

I have this eerie feeling you're forgetting to use sarc tags...

my memory is excellent....

anyway, here's Tommy...
wanna dance?

Youtube Video
125 Wozza Matter?  Fri, Sep 30, 2011 7:25:31pm

re: #123 Killgore Trout

GAZE

126 laZardo  Fri, Sep 30, 2011 7:26:06pm

re: #123 Killgore Trout

GAZE

/what

127 Killgore Trout  Fri, Sep 30, 2011 7:26:33pm

re: #125 wozzablog

GAZE

Anti-floydist extremism!

128 Atlas Fails  Fri, Sep 30, 2011 7:26:51pm

Well well well. Remember the gay German teacher who allegedly tried to indoctrinate his class with HomoFag propoganda and got a student suspended for meekly volunteering that he, as a Christian, felt homosexuality was wrong?

***SPOILER ALERT!***

I hope you're all sitting down, because it turns out that heart-wrenching tale of (white male Christian) persecution was, in fact, bullshit. As one of the commenters in the article I linked to said, I wouldn't be surprised if the little brat and his bigoted parents set the guy up. Here's hoping those assholes have to pay up for dragging this man's name through the mud. I'm usually a pretty laid back guy, but this one really makes my blood boil.

129 albusteve  Fri, Sep 30, 2011 7:27:31pm

re: #123 Killgore Trout

Since I got gazed earlier for posting this...
Pink Floyd - Us and Them (Richard Wright Demo)
www.youtube.com/watch?v=oFKR0ECaMY4

I checked them out and have been the following gig...it's gonna make those guys millions again...as for the outakes, I love that stuff....as the years go by my respect for Floyd grows...at the time I just wasn't into that stuff

130 Wozza Matter?  Fri, Sep 30, 2011 7:30:57pm

re: #127 Killgore Trout

Anti-floydist extremism!

I like the Flloyd as much as the next guy with a ponytail, bad beard and awkward AV setup....... but the majority of the demos and unreleased stuff does nothing for me.

131 OhCrapIHaveACrushOnSarahPalin  Fri, Sep 30, 2011 7:31:01pm

re: #120 ThomasLite

still, I've seen you argue that there's no LGBT people on the GOProud board before;

No, you have not seen me make that argument.

What you have seen is me asking, are there ANY gay people on the board of GOProud, and the like.

Those are two very different things. Had I wished to simply make the baldfaced claim there are no lgbts in GOProud, I would simply do so, but I haven't for a reason.

In fact, if I wanted to push it even further, I would also ask, are the ANY nonwhites in or on the board of GOProud, and let anyone who wishes go peruse their pages for the answer.

But I've chosen to spare them that much, for their sake.

132 Wozza Matter?  Fri, Sep 30, 2011 7:32:48pm

re: #128 Atlas Fails

You shock me.

133 albusteve  Fri, Sep 30, 2011 7:33:51pm

re: #130 wozzablog

I like the Flloyd as much as the next guy with a poneytail, bad beard and awkward AV setup... but the majority of the demos and unreleased stuff does nothing for me.

yeah, it wasn't on the radio

134 albusteve  Fri, Sep 30, 2011 7:34:43pm

re: #128 Atlas Fails

Well well well. Remember the gay German teacher who allegedly tried to indoctrinate his class with HomoFag propoganda and suspended a student for meekly volunteering that he, as a Christian, felt homosexuality was wrong?

***SPOILER ALERT!***

I hope you're all sitting down, because it turns out that heart-wrenching tale of (white male Christian) persecution was, in fact, bullshit. As one of the commenters in the article I linked to said, I wouldn't be surprised if the little brat and his bigoted parents set the guy up. Here's hoping those assholes have to pay up for dragging this man's name through the mud. I'm usually a pretty laid back guy, but this one really makes my blood boil.

like Winston, I blog standing up

135 Atlas Fails  Fri, Sep 30, 2011 7:34:51pm

re: #132 wozzablog

You shock me.

I might do a page on this. This lying for Jesus crap is starting to piss me off.

136 OhCrapIHaveACrushOnSarahPalin  Fri, Sep 30, 2011 7:36:13pm

re: #128 Atlas Fails

Well well well. Remember the gay German teacher who allegedly tried to indoctrinate his class with HomoFag propoganda and got a student suspended for meekly volunteering that he, as a Christian, felt homosexuality was wrong?

***SPOILER ALERT!***

I hope you're all sitting down, because it turns out that heart-wrenching tale of (white male Christian) persecution was, in fact, bullshit. As one of the commenters in the article I linked to said, I wouldn't be surprised if the little brat and his bigoted parents set the guy up. Here's hoping those assholes have to pay up for dragging this man's name through the mud. I'm usually a pretty laid back guy, but this one really makes my blood boil.

Ugh. That's how I felt about the parents in this story.

Well, nothing like ending your week with a story about yet another gaggle of poor-little-me-isn't-allowed-to-rule, conservative bully/victims heaping more damage on others.

Vicious.

137 Wozza Matter?  Fri, Sep 30, 2011 7:39:33pm

re: #133 albusteve


I'm generally a fan of b-sides and rarities, fyi. But the Floyd stuff, just hasn't grabbed me.
Conversely i'll listen to live Floyd tracks and albums all day long whereas I wouldn't for the vast majority of other bands.

138 albusteve  Fri, Sep 30, 2011 7:40:15pm

re: #137 wozzablog

I'm generally a fan of b-sides and rarities, fyi. But the Floyd stuff, just hasn't grabbed me.
Conversely i'll listen to live Floyd tracks and albums all day long whereas I wouldn't for the vast majority of other bands.

GAZE

139 bratwurst  Fri, Sep 30, 2011 7:40:20pm

re: #123 Killgore Trout

Since I got gazed earlier for posting this...
Pink Floyd - Us and Them (Richard Wright Demo)
www.youtube.com/watch?v=oFKR0ECaMY4

I am digging this! I was wondering what "bonus material" would be included in the new reissues.

140 Wozza Matter?  Fri, Sep 30, 2011 7:41:26pm

re: #138 albusteve

GAZE

You cut me to the quick.

141 prairiefire  Fri, Sep 30, 2011 7:43:50pm

Floyd, meh. Borders on Boomer navel gazing.

142 albusteve  Fri, Sep 30, 2011 7:44:20pm

re: #139 bratwurst

I am digging this! I was wondering what "bonus material" would be included in the new reissues.

working in the studio, making the music, then getting it down for the best take is very cool stuff....some of the very best vids on the net are studio sessions

143 Wozza Matter?  Fri, Sep 30, 2011 7:49:16pm

G'night everybody.

Tomorrow i go mano'a'mano with the garden. I may not survive.

144 Wozza Matter?  Fri, Sep 30, 2011 7:49:47pm

re: #141 prairiefire

Floyd, meh. Borders on Boomer navel gazing.

Ageist.

145 Mostly sane, most of the time.  Fri, Sep 30, 2011 7:50:01pm

re: #143 wozzablog

G'night everybody.

Tomorrow i go mano'a'mano with the garden. I may not survive.

That would be mano-a-weedo

146 Mostly sane, most of the time.  Fri, Sep 30, 2011 7:50:25pm

re: #145 EmmmieG

That would be mano-a-weedo

Unless you do really odd gardening.

147 Wozza Matter?  Fri, Sep 30, 2011 7:50:51pm

re: #145 EmmmieG

That would be mano-a-weedo

I have no idea what's hiding out there......i won't undersell the potential.

148 SanFranciscoZionist  Fri, Sep 30, 2011 7:51:15pm

re: #18 EmmmieG

Yes, but please be winning in a non-Sheen kind of way, 'kay?

I'm pretty sure Dark is not bipolar. We'd have noticed by now.

149 Wozza Matter?  Fri, Sep 30, 2011 7:51:48pm

re: #146 EmmmieG

Unless you do really odd gardening.

Never heard of manscaping then?............

150 SanFranciscoZionist  Fri, Sep 30, 2011 7:52:18pm

re: #32 laZardo

They've been trying to find lines for "grownups." Over at B&N they have small "famous architecture" sets.

So you can, like, make the Taj Mahal, or Notre Dame, with Legos?

151 laZardo  Fri, Sep 30, 2011 7:53:53pm

re: #150 SanFranciscoZionist

So you can, like, make the Taj Mahal, or Notre Dame, with Legos?

They don't have those specifically, but they did have Frank Lloyd Wright's "Waterfall" house, the Space Needle and the Sears Tower.

Edit Addendum: The thing is the blocks are mostly in a beige-ish color and there's very little glass/transparent piece detail, probably to give it a more abstract feel than souvenir style.

152 Mostly sane, most of the time.  Fri, Sep 30, 2011 7:53:59pm

re: #150 SanFranciscoZionist

So you can, like, make the Taj Mahal, or Notre Dame, with Legos?

Something like that. Too lazy to go and see which ones.

Expensive, if I recall.

153 albusteve  Fri, Sep 30, 2011 7:54:08pm

another rousing Friday night...

here's a guy playing an impossible guitar

Youtube Video
154 Mostly sane, most of the time.  Fri, Sep 30, 2011 7:57:01pm

re: #153 albusteve

Dude playing an impossible mandolin...

Youtube Video
155 SanFranciscoZionist  Fri, Sep 30, 2011 7:57:51pm

re: #6 OhCrapIHaveACrushOnSarahPalin

Meanwhile, Andrew's fellow and honorary GOProud board member Ann Coulter has this to say about Don't Ask Don't Tell:

Conservative self-loathing is doubling and tripling over on itself, these days.

Soldiers, sailors and Marines living in close quarters who are having sex with one another, used to have sex with one another or would like to have sex with one another simply cannot function as a well-oiled fighting machine. A battalion of married couples facing a small unit of heterosexual men would be slaughtered.

Obdi already mentioned the Sacred Band of Thebes, which would seem to indicate otherwise...but did anyone else, when they read that last sentence visualize a bunch of worried-looking suburbanites clutching rakes and wondering why they were taking on the 101st Airborne?

156 albusteve  Fri, Sep 30, 2011 8:00:04pm

re: #154 EmmmieG

Dude playing an impossible mandolin...

[Video]

one of the sweetest sounds ever...Little Feat used alot of mandolin, Ry Cooder plays an electric bass mandolin...love it

157 prairiefire  Fri, Sep 30, 2011 8:00:06pm

re: #150 SanFranciscoZionist

So you can, like, make the Taj Mahal, or Notre Dame, with Legos?

Lego shop:[Link: shop.lego.com...]
Over 1000 hours of enjoyment courtesy of Lego at our house.

158 Killgore Trout  Fri, Sep 30, 2011 8:01:32pm

re: #154 EmmmieG

Dude playing an impossible mandolin...

[Video]

Impossible Ukelele
The Ukulele Orchestra of Great Britain

Youtube Video

Namaste, y'all
159 jaunte  Fri, Sep 30, 2011 8:02:34pm

re: #141 prairiefire

Floyd, meh. Borders on Boomer navel gazing.

Us....

160 albusteve  Fri, Sep 30, 2011 8:02:41pm

Cooder playing his mandolin...
while wearing herringbone pants

Youtube Video
161 jaunte  Fri, Sep 30, 2011 8:02:46pm

...and them...

162 prairiefire  Fri, Sep 30, 2011 8:02:47pm

Oh, good. "Mandolin Wind"

Youtube Video
163 albusteve  Fri, Sep 30, 2011 8:04:34pm

re: #162 prairiefire

Oh, good. "Mandolin Wind"

[Video]

time travel...I almost posted that
Ron Wood on mando

164 albusteve  Fri, Sep 30, 2011 8:06:40pm

re: #163 albusteve

time travel...I almost posted that
Ron Wood on mando

and all the other guitars

165 lostlakehiker  Fri, Sep 30, 2011 8:14:27pm

re: #7 Obdicut

Que? I mean, things like the Sacred Band aside, what on earth is her rationale in general?

The rationale is that if sentiment within a unit is fractured, and loyalty to specific individuals conflicts with loyalty to the "band of brothers" as a whole, that unit will not fight well.

This isn't entirely ridiculous. Patton once made a sizable military blunder, blinded by his personal desire to save his son in law. He put family ahead of military duty. If family ties could sway Patton from his duty, can we be confident that most men would not be so swayed?

On the other hand, during WW2, many Soviet officers had "front wives" on their staff. It didn't seem to prevent them from beating the Germans. But on the other other hand, the "front wives" were in staff positions, not at the pointy end of the spear.

We don't really know, as empirical fact or by a near perfect match to events from history, how this will play out. From the perspective of the left, we know what the answer ought to be, and therefore we know what it is. But that logic is suspect.

From the perspective of the right, we know what the answer ought to be, and therefore we know what it is. But that logic, too, is suspect.

We'll just see.

166 Jimmi the Grey  Fri, Sep 30, 2011 8:16:10pm

re: #124 albusteve

um, sure, I like to dance. Just a little busy/distracted. Salsa is being made and canned in the house, and as the resident expert I am in RL demand...odd as that is, even to me.

Nice stuff to critique salsa to though. Now back to diceing cilantro.

167 Iwouldprefernotto  Fri, Sep 30, 2011 8:17:07pm

We know exactly how this is going to work out. The military will be fine with gays and the right wing will complain. And then complain some more.

168 SanFranciscoZionist  Fri, Sep 30, 2011 8:23:31pm

re: #165 lostlakehiker

We don't really know, as empirical fact or by a near perfect match to events from history, how this will play out. From the perspective of the left, we know what the answer ought to be, and therefore we know what it is. But that logic is suspect.

From the perspective of the right, we know what the answer ought to be, and therefore we know what it is. But that logic, too, is suspect.

We'll just see.

Gay men have been serving in the U.S. military since it began. What's changed, except that now no one has to run around keeping it hush hush?

And where does this idea come from that guys will date inside combat units, and that this is MORE likely to cause fragmentation than a close nonsexual friendship, or for that matter, a feud over beer money not paid back?

I just see people looking for trouble at someone else's expense.

169 SanFranciscoZionist  Fri, Sep 30, 2011 8:26:42pm

re: #168 SanFranciscoZionist

Gay men have been serving in the U.S. military since it began. What's changed, except that now no one has to run around keeping it hush hush?

And where does this idea come from that guys will date inside combat units, and that this is MORE likely to cause fragmentation than a close nonsexual friendship, or for that matter, a feud over beer money not paid back?

I just see people looking for trouble at someone else's expense.

What we DO know is that none of the times we've changed who can serve have played out the way doomsayers predicted. We integrated black soldiers. It was fine. We put women in a variety of new roles. Contrary to confident predictions from concerned pundits, gallant men did not put whole divisions at risk running to save the girls when they broke a NAAA-il.

170 Obdicut  Fri, Sep 30, 2011 8:31:07pm

re: #165 lostlakehiker

How the fuck can you claim we won't know how this will work out when there are plenty of militaries where gay men serve openly?

171 SanFranciscoZionist  Fri, Sep 30, 2011 8:33:22pm

And am I the only person for whom Coulter's use of the term 'well-oiled' briefly brought an entirely nonmilitary image to mind?

172 Targetpractice  Fri, Sep 30, 2011 8:36:36pm

If the worry is that having sex with fellow service members will adversely affect morale and fighting ability, then why do we still have women in the ranks? Seriously, how many women on deployment, whether at sea or on land, get sent home early because of unplanned pregnancies?

173 laZardo  Fri, Sep 30, 2011 8:39:22pm

re: #171 SanFranciscoZionist

And am I the only person for whom Coulter's use of the term 'well-oiled' briefly brought an entirely nonmilitary image to mind?

Well, there was an abortive attempt at creating a pun thread some time ago...

174 SanFranciscoZionist  Fri, Sep 30, 2011 8:43:56pm

re: #172 Targetpractice, Worst of Both Worlds

If the worry is that having sex with fellow service members will adversely affect morale and fighting ability, then why do we still have women in the ranks? Seriously, how many women on deployment, whether at sea or on land, get sent home early because of unplanned pregnancies?

I remember that there were a LOT during Gulf War I--and that the powers that be seemed oddly unconcerned about it. It wasn't brought up later as a reason for women not to serve. It didn't seem to faze them.

175 prairiefire  Fri, Sep 30, 2011 8:57:00pm

re: #168 SanFranciscoZionist

At the pointy end of a spear.

176 prairiefire  Fri, Sep 30, 2011 9:03:03pm

re: #175 prairiefire

At the pointy end of a spear.

*wink* wink*

177 OhCrapIHaveACrushOnSarahPalin  Fri, Sep 30, 2011 9:04:41pm

re: #153 albusteve

Reminds me of Michael

Youtube Video

[ sniff ] I miss him.

178 Targetpractice  Fri, Sep 30, 2011 9:05:00pm

But let's be honest, it's not about sex amongst soldiers, it's about the "wrong" soldiers having sex. It's about protecting the delicate sensibilities of the bigots who won't be able to handle giving orders or taking them from "queers." About the homophobes who won't be able to go into the showers without being deathly afraid that the guy next to them looking at their wedding tackle is doing so for any other reason than being impressed/envious.

Personally, I say if the reason you signed up (college money, guaranteed pay, 3 hots and cot, to "see the world," or just the ability to kill people and break stuff legally) is less important than knowing the guy next to you isn't gay, then I think you need to leave. Finish your hitch, pack your shit, and get out.

179 OhCrapIHaveACrushOnSarahPalin  Fri, Sep 30, 2011 9:09:45pm

re: #165 lostlakehiker

From the perspective of the right, we know what the answer ought to be, and therefore we know what it is. But that logic, too, is suspect.

We'll just see.

Sorry, but that's just stupid.

The time for excuses for institutionalized bigotry is over. "The right" had its turn with that for centuries. Those days are gone.

180 Dark_Falcon  Fri, Sep 30, 2011 9:16:47pm

Well, I did go to dinner with my parents. Dinner itself was fine, but when I tried to walk my mother to the car she fell and cut her head. She had to go to the hospital to get stitches. No broken bones or anything, but in one minute today turned from a good day to a bad day.

Please don't ask for details, I can't give them out of respect for her privacy.

181 Targetpractice  Fri, Sep 30, 2011 9:17:36pm

re: #180 Dark_Falcon

Well, I did go to dinner with my parents. Dinner itself was fine, but when I tried to walk my mother to the car she fell and cut her head. She had to go to the hospital to get stitches. No broken bones or anything, but in one minute today turned from a good day to a bad day.

Please don't ask for details, I can't give them out of respect for her privacy.

Hope she'll be alright. Damned shame for something like that to happen on a good night.

182 Atlas Fails  Fri, Sep 30, 2011 9:19:28pm

re: #180 Dark_Falcon

Well, I did go to dinner with my parents. Dinner itself was fine, but when I tried to walk my mother to the car she fell and cut her head. She had to go to the hospital to get stitches. No broken bones or anything, but in one minute today turned from a good day to a bad day.

Please don't ask for details, I can't give them out of respect for her privacy.

Sorry to hear. I hope she gets well soon.

183 Mostly sane, most of the time.  Fri, Sep 30, 2011 9:20:43pm

re: #180 Dark_Falcon

Well, I did go to dinner with my parents. Dinner itself was fine, but when I tried to walk my mother to the car she fell and cut her head. She had to go to the hospital to get stitches. No broken bones or anything, but in one minute today turned from a good day to a bad day.

Please don't ask for details, I can't give them out of respect for her privacy.

Sorry about that.

184 OhCrapIHaveACrushOnSarahPalin  Fri, Sep 30, 2011 9:25:56pm

re: #180 Dark_Falcon

Well, I did go to dinner with my parents. Dinner itself was fine, but when I tried to walk my mother to the car she fell and cut her head. She had to go to the hospital to get stitches. No broken bones or anything, but in one minute today turned from a good day to a bad day.

Please don't ask for details, I can't give them out of respect for her privacy.

Sounds scary. Glad she's ok, but it's never fun when a parent falls and/or has to go to the hospital.

185 Dark_Falcon  Fri, Sep 30, 2011 9:26:31pm

re: #181 Targetpractice, Worst of Both Worlds

re: #182 Atlas Fails

re: #183 EmmmieG

Thanks, guys. Sorry to have to put up that dismal post.

186 prairiefire  Fri, Sep 30, 2011 9:27:12pm

re: #185 Dark_Falcon

re: #182 Atlas Fails

re: #183 EmmmieG

Thanks, guys. Sorry to have to put up that dismal post.

Sorry about the bad news. I hope she can get some rest.

187 SanFranciscoZionist  Fri, Sep 30, 2011 9:28:49pm

re: #180 Dark_Falcon

Well, I did go to dinner with my parents. Dinner itself was fine, but when I tried to walk my mother to the car she fell and cut her head. She had to go to the hospital to get stitches. No broken bones or anything, but in one minute today turned from a good day to a bad day.

Please don't ask for details, I can't give them out of respect for her privacy.

Ah, jeez. I'm sorry.

188 OhCrapIHaveACrushOnSarahPalin  Fri, Sep 30, 2011 9:35:54pm
You can always tell when Andrew Breitbart’s fans are about to let loose with another torrent of bigotry and hatred — it happens whenever Breitbart.tv posts another race-baiting video clip of an African American talking about racism:

fixed

lol

189 Dark_Falcon  Fri, Sep 30, 2011 9:36:19pm

re: #184 OhCrapIHaveACrushOnSarahPalin

Sounds scary. Glad she's ok, but it's never fun when a parent falls and/or has to go to the hospital.

She'll be OK, but she may spend the night there. My dad is with her. I didn't go because he's mad that she fell while I was with her (he was starting the car). I'm going to call the hospital tomorrow morning to see if she's still there. If she is, I'll go visit her, if she's gone home I'll call to make sure she's OK. But until then I'm going to stay clear so I don't make things worse. I won't blame myself much, but I'm going to worry for a good while over this.

190 OhCrapIHaveACrushOnSarahPalin  Fri, Sep 30, 2011 9:42:31pm

re: #189 Dark_Falcon

She'll be OK, but she may spend the night there. My dad is with her. I didn't go because he's mad that she fell while I was with her (he was starting the car). I'm going to call the hospital tomorrow morning to see if she's still there. If she is, I'll go visit her, if she's gone home I'll call to make sure she's OK. But until then I'm going to stay clear so I don't make things worse. I won't blame myself much, but I'm going to worry for a good while over this.

Yeah, you can't blame yourself for that. It's hard, though, when you're caring for a parent (she has some difficulties, iirc.), it's hard not to feel personally responsible for every little thing. Been there.

191 Dark_Falcon  Fri, Sep 30, 2011 9:51:13pm

re: #190 OhCrapIHaveACrushOnSarahPalin

Yeah, you can't blame yourself for that. It's hard, though, when you're caring for a parent (she has some difficulties, iirc.), it's hard not to feel personally responsible for every little thing. Been there.

Again, thank you. It helps, it really does.

192 laZardo  Fri, Sep 30, 2011 9:55:52pm

re: #180 Dark_Falcon

We disagree violently on politics, but for family well-wishes I give an upding of solidarity. O:

193 Dark_Falcon  Fri, Sep 30, 2011 9:58:21pm

re: #192 laZardo

We disagree violently on politics, but for family well-wishes I give an upding of solidarity. O:

Thank you.

194 Mostly sane, most of the time.  Fri, Sep 30, 2011 9:59:17pm

re: #189 Dark_Falcon

She'll be OK, but she may spend the night there. My dad is with her. I didn't go because he's mad that she fell while I was with her (he was starting the car). I'm going to call the hospital tomorrow morning to see if she's still there. If she is, I'll go visit her, if she's gone home I'll call to make sure she's OK. But until then I'm going to stay clear so I don't make things worse. I won't blame myself much, but I'm going to worry for a good while over this.

I once stepped off a curb and did something to my ankle. I still don't know what. My ankle hurt for about a month, but I didn't want to go in because it was my right foot, and a mother of five can NOT lose her ability to drive to some stupid big foot thing. It didn't swell and wasn't broken, so I just lived with it.

My point is just this...stepped off a curb...my husband would have had to be holding my arm at that exact second to prevent it. Of course, he had brought the other car, and I think he was still cleaning up from the pack meeting.

Don't blame yourself.

195 Mostly sane, most of the time.  Fri, Sep 30, 2011 10:09:12pm

Currently looking at my nephew's FB post from college...a good college... which is missing one apostrophe and has the wrong "you're."

Refraining from saying anything. It wouldn't be appreciated.

His mother is an English major. I'll let her do it.

196 laZardo  Fri, Sep 30, 2011 10:10:18pm

re: #195 EmmmieG

Currently looking at my nephew's FB post from college...a good college... which is missing one apostrophe and has the wrong "you're."

Refraining from saying anything. It wouldn't be appreciated.

His mother is an English major. I'll let her do it.

"Should of."

/all of my hate

197 Dark_Falcon  Fri, Sep 30, 2011 10:12:21pm

And now, to take my mind off my worries, back to politics:

Pajamas Media just posted a article on the "occupy" protests written by Banned-From-LGF Sock Puppeteer "Zombie". As is his wont, he has taken a number of photos of the protestors in San Francisco, who seem like a bunch of mostly-harmless hippies. Zombie has, however, gone into the mire of ugly words and snark since the revelation of his/her perfidy caused Charles to drop the Ban Hammer. The captions are all hostile snark with little of his former wit. It's sad to watch someone to turn into a liar and then a hater.

To be clear, I still do not like these protests or agree with their aims. But "Zombie's" coverage of the one in SanFran was biased and ugly.

198 laZardo  Fri, Sep 30, 2011 10:14:33pm

re: #197 Dark_Falcon

And now, to take my mind off my worries, back to politics:

Pajamas Media just posted a article on the "occupy" protests written by Banned-From-LGF Sock Puppeteer "Zombie". As is his wont, he has taken a number of photos of the protestors in San Francisco, who seem like a bunch of mostly-harmless hippies. Zombie has, however, gone into the mire of ugly words and snark since the revelation of his/her perfidy caused Charles to drop the Ban Hammer. The captions are all hostile snark with little of his former wit. It's sad to watch someone to turn into a liar and then a hater.

To be clear, I still do not like these protests or agree with their aims. But "Zombie's" coverage of the one in SanFran was biased and ugly.

There's a planning/attention-gathering event for the Seattle version a couple blocks from my place of residence tomorrow and I'm planning on going.

I'M SO EXCITEDand kinda shitscared. D8

Maybe I could try replacing him or something.

199 Mostly sane, most of the time.  Fri, Sep 30, 2011 10:15:15pm

Did we ever decide that Zombie is actually male?

200 SanFranciscoZionist  Fri, Sep 30, 2011 10:19:27pm

re: #197 Dark_Falcon

And now, to take my mind off my worries, back to politics:

Pajamas Media just posted a article on the "occupy" protests written by Banned-From-LGF Sock Puppeteer "Zombie". As is his wont, he has taken a number of photos of the protestors in San Francisco, who seem like a bunch of mostly-harmless hippies. Zombie has, however, gone into the mire of ugly words and snark since the revelation of his/her perfidy caused Charles to drop the Ban Hammer. The captions are all hostile snark with little of his former wit. It's sad to watch someone to turn into a liar and then a hater.

To be clear, I still do not like these protests or agree with their aims. But "Zombie's" coverage of the one in SanFran was biased and ugly.

Well, it was certainly biased--it's Zombie. I didn't think it was that bad. I guess I like it better when he's dismissive, rather than when people like this are built up into a monstrous threat.

Now, the one I liked was the bazillion pictures of naked men protesting San Francisco's new anti-nude-butts-on-public-fixtures rules. Seriously, Zomb? You needed to have THAT many pictures to point out that there were some naked men walking around?

201 SanFranciscoZionist  Fri, Sep 30, 2011 10:20:39pm

re: #199 EmmmieG

Did we ever decide that Zombie is actually male?

I don't think anyone knows.

202 Mostly sane, most of the time.  Fri, Sep 30, 2011 10:23:13pm

re: #201 SanFranciscoZionist

I don't think anyone knows.

'Kay. Still, public nudity is unhygienic. There are reasons beyond aesthetics to cover your tush.

203 Mostly sane, most of the time.  Fri, Sep 30, 2011 10:26:16pm

Good night.

204 lostlakehiker  Fri, Sep 30, 2011 10:27:11pm

re: #168 SanFranciscoZionist

Gay men have been serving in the U.S. military since it began. What's changed, except that now no one has to run around keeping it hush hush?

And where does this idea come from that guys will date inside combat units, and that this is MORE likely to cause fragmentation than a close nonsexual friendship, or for that matter, a feud over beer money not paid back?

I just see people looking for trouble at someone else's expense.

I don't think that we have a priori answers to this. It seems to me more likely than not that everything will go smoothly, but the science isn't in on the question. We don't flat know.

And feuding over beer money does contribute to a lack of unit cohesion. Small unit cohesion is precious, and has to be forged, and there's many things that can erode it.

205 lostlakehiker  Fri, Sep 30, 2011 10:30:31pm

re: #180 Dark_Falcon

Well, I did go to dinner with my parents. Dinner itself was fine, but when I tried to walk my mother to the car she fell and cut her head. She had to go to the hospital to get stitches. No broken bones or anything, but in one minute today turned from a good day to a bad day.

Please don't ask for details, I can't give them out of respect for her privacy.

Trust me on this: a fall with no broken bones is a good fall. All around can be glad that the bones are strong enough that it didn't come to that. Lacerations are a mere nuisance.

It wasn't the best of days, but it wasn't a for-real bad day.

206 Dark_Falcon  Fri, Sep 30, 2011 10:34:52pm

re: #205 lostlakehiker

Trust me on this: a fall with no broken bones is a good fall. All around can be glad that the bones are strong enough that it didn't come to that. Lacerations are a mere nuisance.

It wasn't the best of days, but it wasn't a for-real bad day.

True that.

207 SanFranciscoZionist  Fri, Sep 30, 2011 10:36:47pm

re: #200 SanFranciscoZionist

Well, it was certainly biased--it's Zombie. I didn't think it was that bad. I guess I like it better when he's dismissive, rather than when people like this are built up into a monstrous threat.

Now, the one I liked was the bazillion pictures of naked men protesting San Francisco's new anti-nude-butts-on-public-fixtures rules. Seriously, Zomb? You needed to have THAT many pictures to point out that there were some naked men walking around?

I see s/he also did a very detailed one of World Naked Bike Day.

I saw them in action once. They attracted the attention of a street preacher who went fairly thoroughly ape on them.

208 goddamnedfrank  Fri, Sep 30, 2011 10:38:03pm

re: #204 lostlakehiker

I don't think that we have a priori answers to this. It seems to me more likely than not that everything will go smoothly, but the science isn't in on the question. We don't flat know.

And feuding over beer money does contribute to a lack of unit cohesion. Small unit cohesion is precious, and has to be forged, and there's many things that can erode it.

Nothing erodes trust within a unit like a need to maintain secrets and dishonesty.

209 SanFranciscoZionist  Fri, Sep 30, 2011 10:39:22pm

re: #202 EmmmieG

'Kay. Still, public nudity is unhygienic. There are reasons beyond aesthetics to cover your tush.

In general, San Franciscans have responses with enthusiasm to the idea that anyone planning to be nude in public should have to put down a towel, or some newspaper when seated. This strikes everyone as fair, except the Bay Guardian and some overenthused nudists who don't want to have to sit on towels.

(Why, I could not tell you. It does not seem like a sanitary idea to have one's naked bee-hind on a city bench or sidewalk, from the point of view of the nudist as well as those who may sit after him or her.)

210 SanFranciscoZionist  Fri, Sep 30, 2011 10:40:50pm

re: #209 SanFranciscoZionist

In general, San Franciscans have responses with enthusiasm to the idea that anyone planning to be nude in public should have to put down a towel, or some newspaper when seated. This strikes everyone as fair, except the Bay Guardian and some overenthused nudists who don't want to have to sit on towels.

(Why, I could not tell you. It does not seem like a sanitary idea to have one's naked bee-hind on a city bench or sidewalk, from the point of view of the nudist as well as those who may sit after him or her.)

Actually, I didn't know until this flap that it was legal to be nude in SF. If you'd asked, I would have assumed there was some sort of ordinance against it. Live and learn.

211 Dark_Falcon  Fri, Sep 30, 2011 11:03:05pm

Just talked to my dad. My mother doesn't have any sort of brain injury, she just needed stitches. Thank God for that, and that does reduce my fears.

212 Lidane  Fri, Sep 30, 2011 11:04:37pm

Happy weekend, Lizards! Here's some cooking tips from the Swedish Chef:

Youtube Video

Enjoy! :D

213 OhCrapIHaveACrushOnSarahPalin  Fri, Sep 30, 2011 11:15:10pm

re: #197 Dark_Falcon

I don't know why the bigots detest San Francisco so much, anyway. There's some of everybody here, plenty to keep them busy in their hate till kingdom come.

214 laZardo  Fri, Sep 30, 2011 11:18:24pm

re: #212 Lidane

That's not Swedish cooking, this is Swedish cooking.

Youtube Video
215 freetoken  Fri, Sep 30, 2011 11:50:56pm

Continuing on with our review of Cesária Évora:

MP3 Audio
216 Dark_Falcon  Fri, Sep 30, 2011 11:53:56pm

Goodnight, all. Thank you for your kind words tonight.

217 windsagio  Sat, Oct 1, 2011 12:14:27am

re: #213 OhCrapIHaveACrushOnSarahPalin

I don't know why the bigots detest San Francisco so much, anyway. There's some of everybody here, plenty to keep them busy in their hate till kingdom come.

Because many of them are still stuck in the fights of the '60s, and are still mad about 'Flower Power'

218 Dancing along the light of day  Sat, Oct 1, 2011 12:18:42am

re: #180 Dark_Falcon

Sorry to hear of your worries.
It's so very hard when your folks get old.
Be well, my friend!

219 laZardo  Sat, Oct 1, 2011 12:18:50am

Bedtiem. Nighty!

220 freetoken  Sat, Oct 1, 2011 12:52:10am

Etta:

MP3 Audio
221 BaronHaynes  Sat, Oct 1, 2011 1:11:57am

The irony is utterly lost on them, of course.

Sadly, I'm seeing a similar pattern on The Huffington Post lately, on stories about Ann Coulter defending the GOP debate audience that booed a gay US soldier. Lots of people attacking her for demeaning gays in the same breath as calling her "he", or "it", or making any number of transsexual slurs. It's frankly amazing the extent to which cognitive dissonance has become the norm for people. When the only metric is "defend your tribe, attack theirs", pesky details like whether you're being demonstrably racist or homophobic/transphobic miraculously don't matter anymore.

222 OhCrapIHaveACrushOnSarahPalin  Sat, Oct 1, 2011 1:17:36am

re: #221 BaronHaynes

I detest that stupid "Mann Coulter" shyt. Well, I just detest HP, but that's also a different issue lol

Every time I hear it, it gets the smackdown. She deserves every criticism she gets but that one, plus it detracts from the heinous, vile bullshit that comes out of her mouth and keyboard.

223 boxhead  Sat, Oct 1, 2011 1:22:16am

re: #222 OhCrapIHaveACrushOnSarahPalin

Well she does have an Adam's Apple...

//

224 boxhead  Sat, Oct 1, 2011 1:27:12am

re: #197 Dark_Falcon

And now, to take my mind off my worries, back to politics:

To be clear, I still do not like these protests or agree with their aims.

Why? Calling on the companies that hold most of USA's money to be more pro American is a bad thing?

225 researchok  Sat, Oct 1, 2011 1:59:29am

Morning, all

226 OhCrapIHaveACrushOnSarahPalin  Sat, Oct 1, 2011 2:06:38am

re: #223 boxhead

Well she does have an Adam's Apple...

//

[shrug]

227 boxhead  Sat, Oct 1, 2011 2:09:59am

re: #225 researchok

Morning, all

morning to you....

228 researchok  Sat, Oct 1, 2011 2:11:57am

Quiet this AM...

Not necessarily a bad thing, I suppose.

229 boxhead  Sat, Oct 1, 2011 2:13:04am

re: #228 researchok

Quiet this AM...

Not necessarily a bad thing, I suppose.

I seem to have that effect here.... Or it is because I post at 2AM PDT. heheh

230 researchok  Sat, Oct 1, 2011 2:14:21am

re: #229 boxhead

I seem to have that effect here... Or it is because I post at 2AM PDT. heheh

LOL

I'd bet on the latter.

231 boxhead  Sat, Oct 1, 2011 2:21:04am

re: #230 researchok

LOL

I'd bet on the latter.

heh.... I wonder.... I like to believe it is a mix of my late, alcohol inspired heartfelt rants that scare sleepy folks away. Hell, even me rereading my posts tend to do that... lol

232 researchok  Sat, Oct 1, 2011 2:24:12am

I'm on the east coast.

I have to get up at the crack of dawn to work (only the last 3-4 months). That wears me down.

Alcohol inspired rants help to wake me up.

233 boxhead  Sat, Oct 1, 2011 2:27:27am

re: #232 researchok

heh... well... I guess you will have to rely on caffeine cause I am shutting down.... nice talking with you.... nite

234 Cannadian Club Akbar  Sat, Oct 1, 2011 2:45:25am

Morning Honcos.

235 Digital Display  Sat, Oct 1, 2011 2:48:06am

re: #234 Cannadian Club Akbar

Morning Honcos.

Hi Bro.. Seems like I wake up early every Saturday morning and watch Cops for a few hours and go back to bed.. Human Tragedy + Stupidity = Comic Gold...
How are you this fine day? I'm going to the OU game tonight..Should be a blast

236 Cannadian Club Akbar  Sat, Oct 1, 2011 2:52:28am

re: #235 HoosierHoops

MY favorite people on "Cops" or any other police show are the ones who remind the cops that they "know their rights". If they actually knew their rights, they would STFU.:)

237 RogueOne  Sat, Oct 1, 2011 2:55:54am

re: #236 Cannadian Club Akbar

My dog loves that show (He loves sirens) but we don't watch anymore. It irritates me too much and my wife gets tired of me yelling "STFU!" at the tv.

238 RogueOne  Sat, Oct 1, 2011 2:59:33am

re: #235 HoosierHoops

How ya been hoops? Still any plans on shipping you out to Singapore?

239 BaronHaynes  Sat, Oct 1, 2011 2:59:48am

re: #222 OhCrapIHaveACrushOnSarahPalin

Agreed. Unfortunately, the "Mann Coulter" stuff doesn't get smacked down very often on a lot of liberal blogs. It seems to me that if you attack someone for doing it to Rachel Maddow, you have to be willing to stand up to it against Ann Coulter too. You don't get a pass on using slurs because you have gay-friendly politics. Bugs the hell out of me.

240 Digital Display  Sat, Oct 1, 2011 3:00:11am

re: #236 Cannadian Club Akbar

MY favorite people on "Cops" or any other police show are the ones who remind the cops that they "know their rights". If they actually knew their rights, they would STFU.:)

5 more minutes of Cops this morning..Started in N.O.. Funny as heck Today.. I'm getting sleepy again.. Am I the only guy in America that mixes what's left of all his cereal in one big bowl?
Rice crispies..Corn Flakes, Shredded wheat with a dash of raisin brand sprinkled on top..a few nanners cut up and a quart of milk..

241 Cannadian Club Akbar  Sat, Oct 1, 2011 3:01:58am

So the big football game between local rivals was last night. I saw some comments online from the losing teams fans. "We all knew who really won". And parts of the marching band saying "We played as a team" (they included the band with the team) Oh, the score was 48-6. Wonder why no one said, "Well, WE suck". Heh.

242 RogueOne  Sat, Oct 1, 2011 3:03:01am

re: #241 Cannadian Club Akbar

Good news for Tampa:

Painter gets his start
After 3 years as backup, QB must show he can run offense
[Link: www.indystar.com...]

243 Digital Display  Sat, Oct 1, 2011 3:06:00am

re: #238 RogueOne

How ya been hoops? Still any plans on shipping you out to Singapore?

Good Morning! I wish! Generally each slot is a 3 year gig.. I've got 2 more yrs in Oklahoma..Hopefully Singapore will be open...I have a buddy in Sydney that just married a local girl.. Can you believe that? He told me when his time is up there he is resigning and staying in Aussie land.. He is very happy...
I AM NOT GETTING MARRIED TO A COWGIRL IN OK.. :)

244 Cannadian Club Akbar  Sat, Oct 1, 2011 3:06:32am

re: #242 RogueOne

Good news for Tampa:

Painter gets his start
After 3 years as backup, QB must show he can run offense
[Link: www.indystar.com...]

Fresh QB's always scare me.

245 RogueOne  Sat, Oct 1, 2011 3:08:32am

re: #243 HoosierHoops

I can see staying in Australia. OK? Not so much.

246 RogueOne  Sat, Oct 1, 2011 3:09:19am

re: #244 Cannadian Club Akbar

Fresh QB's always scare me.

Well, I wouldn't worry too much about Painter. Loved him as a college player at Purdue but he's been really bad as a pro.

247 Digital Display  Sat, Oct 1, 2011 3:10:38am

re: #245 RogueOne

I can see staying in Australia. OK? Not so much.

I really loved my time in Indiana.. I love you Hoosiers! I'm going back for SuperBowl Week.. I think I have made life long friends there

248 Cannadian Club Akbar  Sat, Oct 1, 2011 3:11:29am

brb

249 RogueOne  Sat, Oct 1, 2011 3:15:43am

re: #247 HoosierHoops

I really loved my time in Indiana.. I love you Hoosiers! I'm going back for SuperBowl Week.. I think I have made life long friends there

I'm looking forward to the Super Bowl Festivities. It should be a lot of fun downtown.

Although, the city is looking to squash the capitalist opportunities//:

Indy Hopes To Curb Super Bowl Prostitution
[Link: www.theindychannel.com...]

250 Cannadian Club Akbar  Sat, Oct 1, 2011 3:18:22am

re: #249 RogueOne

That sucks. Here's how Tampa is preparing for the RNC convention in 2012.:)
[Link: www.huffingtonpost.com...]

251 RogueOne  Sat, Oct 1, 2011 3:23:08am

re: #250 Cannadian Club Akbar

That sucks. Here's how Tampa is preparing for the RNC convention in 2012.:)
[Link: www.huffingtonpost.com...]

There are only a couple of strip clubs in downtown indy (one of which you don't want to go into unarmed) but at one point Indy used to be the escort capital of the country. We had more escorts per capita than anywhere else. Once people realized how many there were they started putting the clamps down on it. Not sure why they felt the need to ruin everyone else's fun.

252 Cannadian Club Akbar  Sat, Oct 1, 2011 3:29:46am

re: #251 RogueOne

"Indiana: Amber waves of grain and underage Central American hookers."
Doesn't quite fit on a license plate.
/

253 Digital Display  Sat, Oct 1, 2011 3:32:37am

re: #250 Cannadian Club Akbar

That sucks. Here's how Tampa is preparing for the RNC convention in 2012.:)
[Link: www.huffingtonpost.com...]

Ah Just for the fun of it.. Don't ding me Bro!
My top 5 list for places that have the most beautiful Woman in the World
1. Hawaii...Every 5 minutes a plane lands with jaw dropping beauty on board...I saw Paula Abdul on the beach there in 1990..
2. Amsterdam .. I really don't need to say much about this.. There are more tall healthy Country girls there than anywhere in the World.. Except for North Dakota..
3. Montreal.. I absolutely love this City...And this isn't my fault.. Girls in the local office told me they had the most beautiful women in the world.. I believe them.. Take a walk on Saint Catherines some evening
4. San Diego.. Any City that encourages girls to skate around town in Bikinis has my vote.. Love the beach and the vibe..
5. Napa...excuse me? Didn't the Beach Boys sing about West Coast Girls?

254 RogueOne  Sat, Oct 1, 2011 3:36:21am

re: #252 Cannadian Club Akbar

"Indiana: Amber waves of grain and underage Central American hookers."
Doesn't quite fit on a license plate.
/

Hey now, our hookers are made in the good ol' US of A. A lot of hoosiers aren't real fond of "fereigners".

255 Cannadian Club Akbar  Sat, Oct 1, 2011 3:39:16am

Alrighty. Gotta get to work. See ya'll this afternoon. Hoops, have a good time at the game!!

256 sattv4u2  Sat, Oct 1, 2011 3:46:52am

re: #253 HoosierHoops

6. Atlanta,,, stand on Peachtree Road in the Buckhead Village district any night of the week and you'll be dizzy within minutes

257 RogueOne  Sat, Oct 1, 2011 3:51:42am

re: #256 sattv4u2

7. Dallas/Ft. Worth.

The company I used to work for tried to get me to relocate. The VP took me out for the night to show off all the attractive women.

258 Digital Display  Sat, Oct 1, 2011 3:54:45am

re: #257 RogueOne

7. Dallas/Ft. Worth.

The company I used to work for tried to get me to relocate. The VP took me out for the night to show off all the attractive women.

8. Salt Lake City.. I went there for a weekend once...All the girls were blonde and beautiful.. In a Stepford wives kind of way
They really need a reality show there..
The young Stepford wives of Salt lake City..

259 sattv4u2  Sat, Oct 1, 2011 3:56:46am

re: #258 HoosierHoops

I totally agree with you about Montreal and San Diego

260 sattv4u2  Sat, Oct 1, 2011 3:57:06am

re: #257 RogueOne

And you re: DFW

261 RogueOne  Sat, Oct 1, 2011 4:01:02am

re: #258 HoosierHoops

9. My house.

My beautiful wife is currently crashed out on the couch with two very good looking dobermans wrapped around her. My female dobe loves to spoon, She's a cutie.

262 Decatur Deb  Sat, Oct 1, 2011 4:01:09am

re: #236 Cannadian Club Akbar

MY favorite people on "Cops" or any other police show are the ones who remind the cops that they "know their rights". If they actually knew their rights, they would STFU.:)

An episode of 'Cops' really ticked me off the other day. By accident it contrasted a very professional set of cops in Louisville with a bunch of dipshit sheriffs deputies in NC. They were running an undercover hooker sting, and couldn't keep their procedure straight. Wound up with a string of old fat white confused bubbas face-down in the dirt with five or six young, fat, white heroes kneeling on them.

263 sattv4u2  Sat, Oct 1, 2011 4:02:37am

re: #261 RogueOne

9. My house.

My beautiful wife is currently crashed out on the couch with two very good looking dobermans wrapped around her. My female dobe loves to spoon, She's a cutie.

Someones looking for brownie points

You printing that post out and giving it to your wife later!?!?
/

264 RogueOne  Sat, Oct 1, 2011 4:03:52am

re: #263 sattv4u2

Someones looking for brownie points

You printing that post out and giving it to your wife later!?!?
/

The way to get away with murder is to have a large accumulation of brownie points. A mans gotta do what a mans gotta do and all that.

265 RogueOne  Sat, Oct 1, 2011 5:01:24am

Glenn Greenwald:

The due-process-free assassination of U.S. citizens is now reality
[Link: politics.salon.com...]

What’s most striking about this is not that the U.S. Government has seized and exercised exactly the power the Fifth Amendment was designed to bar (“No person shall be deprived of life without due process of law”), and did so in a way that almost certainly violates core First Amendment protections (questions that will now never be decided in a court of law). What’s most amazing is that its citizens will not merely refrain from objecting, but will stand and cheer the U.S. Government’s new power to assassinate their fellow citizens, far from any battlefield, literally without a shred of due process from the U.S. Government.
.....
What amazes me most whenever I write about this topic is recalling how terribly upset so many Democrats pretended to be when Bush claimed the power merely to detain or even just eavesdrop on American citizens without due process. Remember all that? Yet now, here’s Obama claiming the power not to detain or eavesdrop on citizens without due process, but to kill them; marvel at how the hardest-core White House loyalists now celebrate this and uncritically accept the same justifying rationale used by Bush/Cheney (this is war! the President says he was a Terrorist!) without even a moment of acknowledgment of the profound inconsistency or the deeply troubling implications of having a President — even Barack Obama — vested with the power to target U.S. citizens for murder with no due process.

Also, during the Bush years, civil libertarians who tried to convince conservatives to oppose that administration’s radical excesses would often ask things like this: would you be comfortable having Hillary Clinton wield the power to spy on your calls or imprison you with no judicial reivew or oversight? So for you good progressives out there justifying this, I would ask this: how would the power to assassinate U.S. citizens without due process look to you in the hands of, say, Rick Perry or Michele Bachmann?

While I do have some sympathy for the argument that it's wrong for our government to assassinate US citizens, even overseas, I also believe Awlaki gave up his rights as a citizen the moment he took up arms with a foreign terrorist organization against the US. Therefore, I think we can "stand up and cheer" with some minor qualifications.

266 RogueOne  Sat, Oct 1, 2011 5:04:35am

Alabama, wtf:

Serve Time In Jail...Or In Church?
[Link: www2.wkrg.com...]

BAY MINETTE, Alabama --

Non-violent offenders in Bay Minette now have a choice some would call simple: do time behind bars or work off the sentence in church.

Operation Restore Our Community or "ROC"...begins next week. The city judge will either let misdemenor offenders work off their sentences in jail and pay a fine or go to church every Sunday for a year.

If offenders elect church, they're allowed to pick the place of worship, but must check in weekly with the pastor and the police department. If the one-year church attendance program is completed successfully, the offender's case will be dismissed.

I wonder if this will apply to illegal immigrants?

267 RogueOne  Sat, Oct 1, 2011 5:09:40am

Time to hit the road. Enjoy the day people!

268 Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton  Sat, Oct 1, 2011 5:23:05am

re: #265 RogueOne

I have little sympathy for the "but he was a citizen" argument. American citizens aren't supposed to be some sort of Uebermenschen, immune from the potential abuses of the US govt abroad. If anyone is target-killed, why not US citizens? It's only fair enough.

269 Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton  Sat, Oct 1, 2011 5:31:23am

re: #268 Sergey Romanov

I see that the 5th amdt applies to "persons", not "citizens". I.e. if there is to be a due process, it should apply to anyone, not only citizens. And if it is not applied to non-citizens, why should it apply to citizens? Hypocrisy bordering on chauvinism.

270 Shropshire_Slasher  Sat, Oct 1, 2011 5:34:56am

So the today is the wifes and I 17th wedding aniversary. I almost forgot! Got her a card, will make her some buttermilk waffles. Told her she could get that new lens she's been wanting for her D90, she says "I don't want that camera anymore, the blinking light of death drains the battery" ugh, I guess its got a bad card reader. Morning all!

271 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Sat, Oct 1, 2011 5:56:59am

re: #270 Shropshire_Slasher

Happy anniversary. Congrats for not murdering each other.

272 Shropshire_Slasher  Sat, Oct 1, 2011 5:59:41am

re: #271 Fat Bastard Vegetarian

We'll wait till the kids are grown.

273 simoom  Sat, Oct 1, 2011 6:21:51am

[Link: www.bbc.co.uk...]

A senior leader of the militant Haqqani network, Haji Mali Khan, has been captured in Afghanistan, the Nato-led international force Isaf has said.

He was detained during an operation by Afghan and coalition forces in Paktia province on Tuesday, Isaf said.

He was heavily armed but did not resist, it added.

Haji Mali Khan is the senior commander in Afghanistan for the Haqqani network, blamed for some recent Afghan attacks and accused of links to Pakistan.

...

The BBC's Paul Wood in Kabul says Afghan officials describe him as the brain of the network.

Isaf said the capture was a "significant milestone in the disruption of the Haqqani network", adding that the network remained a top priority for Afghan and coalition forces.

...

A large number of other insurgents were captured in the operation, in Jani Khel district, including Mali Khan's deputy and bodyguard.

274 Achilles Tang  Sat, Oct 1, 2011 6:38:53am

re: #237 RogueOne

My dog loves that show (He loves sirens) but we don't watch anymore. It irritates me too much and my wife gets tired of me yelling "STFU!" at the tv.

Funny thing about dogs. Some don't even seem to know the TV exists. Ours watches all the time. Likes to see kids playing, and above all animals of any kind. Even cartoon monsters, but best of all dogs and cats..

275 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Sat, Oct 1, 2011 6:40:36am

re: #273 simoom

A pox upon him.

276 NJDhockeyfan  Sat, Oct 1, 2011 7:02:46am

re: #270 Shropshire_Slasher

So the today is the wifes and I 17th wedding aniversary. I almost forgot! Got her a card, will make her some buttermilk waffles. Told her she could get that new lens she's been wanting for her D90, she says "I don't want that camera anymore, the blinking light of death drains the battery" ugh, I guess its got a bad card reader. Morning all!

Congrats! We just celebrated our 18th last month.

277 kirkspencer  Sat, Oct 1, 2011 7:03:27am

I have two major problems with assassination as a tool, and let's be honest that the precision strikes on homes and vehicles have been assassinations. Neither is the ethics of killing someone. Instead, they're more concrete.

First and in most ways secondary, using it removes the moral high ground. Any objections to assassinations of OUR people become mooted. If we do it, why can't they? The historic problem of "eye for an eye" is that inevitably someone takes or is perceived as taking interest. It tends to be destructive to both parties on several fronts, with the end result being that a third party -- or several third parties -- dominate both the contestants merely by not suffering the constant drain.

The second problem is the bundle of issues carried by shadow wars, of which assassinations are the most obvious indicator. Actually it's not so much a bundle as it is shards of the same central problem. Shadow wars hide too much. If you've got a permitted secret hole it is almost a law that it will be used to hide many things that probably shouldn't be there. Because it's an "open secret", it can further be used as leverage. Some things which would otherwise not be permitted are allowed because they're necessary for the shadows. How? We're not permitted to know because that would put light in the shadow. If everyone involved were honorable and trustworthy people there would be less concern. Shadows, however, have a habit of attracting people who like the shadows, who are not honorable and trustworthy. To return this to the specific of assassination, sooner or later it gets used to deal with someone who may not have been such an enemy as assassination was needed, but merely a nuisance to a faction. Perhaps the investigative reporter about to expose corruption in an ally, or a politician who would put up a bulwark against some of the shadows. The critical thing is that we the people would not know. We would be told merely that the target was an enemy of the state and that should be enough.

Enough is known of al Alawki that he is, clearly, an enemy of the state and deserved a wartime death. And yet... Miranda was a scumbag, too.

278 NJDhockeyfan  Sat, Oct 1, 2011 7:08:36am

Secret U.S. memo sanctioned killing of Aulaqi

The Justice Department wrote a secret memorandum authorizing the lethal targeting of Anwar al-Aulaqi, the American-born radical cleric who was killed by a U.S. drone strike Friday, according to administration officials.

The document was produced following a review of the legal issues raised by striking a U.S. citizen and involved senior lawyers from across the administration. There was no dissent about the legality of killing Aulaqi, the officials said.

“What constitutes due process in this case is a due process in war,” said one of the officials, who spoke on the condition of anonymity to discuss closely held deliberations within the administration.

The administration has faced a legal challenge and public criticism for targeting Aulaqi, who was born in New Mexico, because of constitutional protections afforded U.S. citizens. The memorandum may represent an attempt to resolve, at least internally, a legal debate over whether a president can order the killing of U.S. citizens overseas as a counterterrorism measure.

The operation to kill Aulaqi involved CIA and military assets under CIA control. A former senior intelligence official said that the CIA would not have killed an American without such a written opinion.

279 Killgore Trout  Sat, Oct 1, 2011 7:16:49am

re: #277 kirkspencer

We tried capturing them and trials at Gitmo but that didn't work out too well. Civilian courts aren't a good alternative either since much of the evidence ahainst them come from military intel, CIA, NSA, none of which are obtaining the proper warrants for civilian courts. I'm fine with the assassinations and secret military prisons. It seems to work just fine and Obama's making a lot of progress creating job vacancies in Al Qaeda leadership.

280 sattv4u2  Sat, Oct 1, 2011 7:17:04am

re: #275 Fat Bastard Vegetarian

A pox upon him.

Small or chicken?

281 Achilles Tang  Sat, Oct 1, 2011 7:18:17am

re: #277 kirkspencer

Any objections to assassinations of OUR people become mooted.

While I understand your theoretical points (slippery slope etc.) in reality it is impossible to have laws that technically cover every eventuality.

In this case it seems obvious that:

a) This guy was NOT one of OUR people (your term) any more, by his own statements and acts, and with will we could have also done the paperwork to make that technically legal.

b) He was not on American soil.

c) He was not able to be apprehended by police action.

282 Lidane  Sat, Oct 1, 2011 7:19:14am

Minority outreach, y'all!

Youtube Video

I despise Goodhair, but this really doesn't hurt him at all. It's also incredibly stupid.

283 sattv4u2  Sat, Oct 1, 2011 7:19:15am

re: #279 Killgore Trout

Obama's making a lot of progress creating job vacancies in Al Qaeda leadership.

I said yesterday and in the past

Seems as if we've killed LOTS of Al Q's "#2" guys

I wouldn't want to be known as the #3 guy

The result of the promotion sucks!

284 Shiplord Kirel  Sat, Oct 1, 2011 7:20:15am

Once again, in US law there is no distinction between citizens and non-citizens in terms of due process. If Osama bin Laden, a non-citizen, had been captured and brought before a US court, he would have had the same due process rights as anyone else. The distinction made by politicians and commentators in the Awlaki case is an indication of their desire to exploit his death in furtherance of an agenda.

285 Killgore Trout  Sat, Oct 1, 2011 7:22:30am

Haqqani network senior commander captured

The senior Haqqani network leader in Afghanistan, Haji Mali Khan, was captured during a joint NATO-Afghan forces operation, the International Security Assistance Force said Saturday.

Khan was captured Tuesday in Jani Khel district, in Paktiya province, ISAF said.

No mention of who has custody of him but I'd guess we're going to let the Afghans and Pakistanis interrogate and prosecute him.

286 Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton  Sat, Oct 1, 2011 7:23:16am

re: #284 Shiplord Kirel

Once again, in US law there is no distinction between citizens and non-citizens in terms of due process. If Osama bin Laden, a non-citizen, had been captured and brought before a US court, he would have had the same due process rights as anyone else.

Exactly. See #268-269.

287 sattv4u2  Sat, Oct 1, 2011 7:24:25am

re: #270 Shropshire_Slasher

So the today is the wifes and I 17th wedding aniversary. I almost forgot! Got her a card, will make her some buttermilk waffles. Told her she could get that new lens she's been wanting for her D90, she says "I don't want that camera anymore, the blinking light of death drains the battery" ugh, I guess its got a bad card reader. Morning all!

So you get out of it with a $2 Hallmark card and $0.50 cents worth of waffle mix

Sweet!!

288 Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton  Sat, Oct 1, 2011 7:25:52am

Either the targeted killings are problematic, or they are not, or anything in between, but citizenship doesn't enter the argument.

289 Achilles Tang  Sat, Oct 1, 2011 7:26:12am

re: #285 Killgore Trout

Haqqani network senior commander captured

No mention of who has custody of him but I'd guess we're going to let the Afghans and Pakistanis interrogate and prosecute him.

Yes, that would be appropriate, since we no longer do waterboarding./

290 Lidane  Sat, Oct 1, 2011 7:26:22am
House Republicans yesterday released their draft budget proposal for labor, health, and human service, which in one fell swoop revives the assault on all their favorite bugaboos, including Planned Parenthood, National Public Radio, the National Labor Relations Board, and President Obama’s health care reform law. The GOP also targeted heat subsidies that prevent low-income families from freezing in the winter, and slashed education funding by $2.4 billion. The bill also eliminates the Administration’s “Race to the Top” education reform program and reduces eligibility for Pell Grants for low-income college students.

Perhaps most surprisingly for a party that claims to be focused on job creation, the GOP budget reduces funding for job training programs that give the unemployed the skills they need to find work in an ailing economy.

[Link: thinkprogress.org...]

291 sattv4u2  Sat, Oct 1, 2011 7:26:38am

re: #285 Killgore Trout

Haqqani network senior commander captured

No mention of who has custody of him but I'd guess we're going to let the Afghans and Pakistanis interrogate and prosecute bury him.

May as well get right to the ending of the story

292 Decatur Deb  Sat, Oct 1, 2011 7:26:53am

re: #277 kirkspencer

I have two major problems with assassination as a tool, and let's be honest that the precision strikes on homes and vehicles have been assassinations. Neither is the ethics of killing someone. Instead, they're more concrete.

First and in most ways secondary, using it removes the moral high ground. Any objections to assassinations of OUR people become mooted. If we do it, why can't they? The historic problem of "eye for an eye" is that inevitably someone takes or is perceived as taking interest. It tends to be destructive to both parties on several fronts, with the end result being that a third party -- or several third parties -- dominate both the contestants merely by not suffering the constant drain.

The second problem is the bundle of issues carried by shadow wars, of which assassinations are the most obvious indicator. Actually it's not so much a bundle as it is shards of the same central problem. Shadow wars hide too much. If you've got a permitted secret hole it is almost a law that it will be used to hide many things that probably shouldn't be there. Because it's an "open secret", it can further be used as leverage. Some things which would otherwise not be permitted are allowed because they're necessary for the shadows. How? We're not permitted to know because that would put light in the shadow. If everyone involved were honorable and trustworthy people there would be less concern. Shadows, however, have a habit of attracting people who like the shadows, who are not honorable and trustworthy. To return this to the specific of assassination, sooner or later it gets used to deal with someone who may not have been such an enemy as assassination was needed, but merely a nuisance to a faction. Perhaps the investigative reporter about to expose corruption in an ally, or a politician who would put up a bulwark against some of the shadows. The critical thing is that we the people would not know. We would be told merely that the target was an enemy of the state and that should be enough.

Enough is known of al Alawki that he is, clearly, an enemy of the state and deserved a wartime death. And yet... Miranda was a scumbag, too.

Admitting a few (slight) reservations about this use of power I still offer some questions that will clarify the use of the new ability to reach out and touch someone 10,000 miles away:

1) Is this killing an act of retribution for crime or the disruption of an ongoing combatant/criminal activity? You don't offer a Miranda statement while a guy is still holding a gun.

2) Is the use of the word 'assassination' even appropriate in the case of declared, real-world hostile leadership? The killing of Yamamoto in a carefully planned ambush is an example. (Would the RAF be fairly chided for a targeted 500 lb bomb on Goebbels outhouse in 1943?)

3) the key falls back on the argument about response to 9/11 and the GWOT. Is this a real war, a crime counter-operation, or something entirely novel? Clearly the action is ongoing, and the coffins have real bodies, but has our language caught up with our technology?

293 Shropshire_Slasher  Sat, Oct 1, 2011 7:28:14am

re: #287 sattv4u2
She was always a cheap date!

294 Shiplord Kirel  Sat, Oct 1, 2011 7:28:15am

A captured enemy combatant, ie a prisoner of war, is not necessarily an alleged criminal and no allegation of criminality is necessary to justify the detention.
This is why the Gitmo detainees are not necessarily entitled to due process. The Bush administration muddied the waters by creating the category of "enemy combatant" and pretending that it was fundamentally different from "prisoner of war." It isn't. This becomes more complicated when the enemy combatant is an American citizen, since being both an enemy combatant and a citizen is most assuredly a crime, namely treason by the strict definition.

295 Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton  Sat, Oct 1, 2011 7:30:39am

re: #294 Shiplord Kirel

True, but there should be safety mechanisms against abuse in such cases. So the more rights they do get - the better.

297 Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton  Sat, Oct 1, 2011 7:34:18am

re: #294 Shiplord Kirel

Especially since one can't be sure that any captured is a real prisoner of war, and not someone captured by mistake in the heat of the moment.

298 Shiplord Kirel  Sat, Oct 1, 2011 7:35:30am

Ron Paul in particular has tried to conflate the tactical killing of an enemy leader (the administration's rationale for killing Awlaki) with punishment for crime. The latter of course is unjustifiable and unlawful without due process. Was Awlaki a Yamamoto or the victim of a lynching?
Many of our people seem hopelessly confused about this. The most immediate response would probably be "but Yamamoto was not a citizen!" This would not be relevant in terms of due process, however since A. due process applies to non-citizens and b. Yamamoto was not even alleged to be a criminal.

299 Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton  Sat, Oct 1, 2011 7:39:30am

Dishonest cretinist Michael Behe has been whipped again:

[Link: blogs.discovermagazine.com...]

300 Shiplord Kirel  Sat, Oct 1, 2011 7:41:37am

re: #295 Sergey Romanov

True, but there should be safety mechanisms against abuse in such cases. So the more rights they do get - the better.

PoWs come under the protection of various international agreements, commonly known as the "Geneva Conventions" though some of them are known under other titles. In many ways, these are more restrictive than the due process provisions of the criminal law.
For example, a PoW may not be extradited to a third country. This came up during the Falklands Conflict of 1982 when British forces captured an Argentine naval officer who had been indicted in Spain for torture and human rights abuses during the "dirty war" period a few years earlier. Even though there was a valid international warrant, the British could not hand him over to the Spanish and he was released with other Argentine prisoners at the end of the conflict.

301 Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton  Sat, Oct 1, 2011 7:44:24am

Watch this:

Youtube Video
302 Killgore Trout  Sat, Oct 1, 2011 7:46:01am

I wonder what's going to happen to bin laden's wives and kids. I assume they're still in Pakistani custody since they have spoken to the press. They might be held indefinitely.

303 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Sat, Oct 1, 2011 7:46:20am

re: #280 sattv4u2

Small or chicken?

yes

304 (I Stand By What I Said Whatever It Was)  Sat, Oct 1, 2011 7:47:33am

re: #288 Sergey Romanov

Either the targeted killings are problematic, or they are not, or anything in between, but citizenship doesn't enter the argument.

Several people have drawn analogies to wartime engagement. During wars, one government kills citizens of another government, a lot of times individually. International law provides some rules (of course that analogy is slightly flawed because international relations are largely essentially anarchic), but apparently they do not apply when it's not the governments that are at war. Bringing the argument to the whole notion of transnational asymetric warfare in the age of "War on Terror" in which the involved parties seem to be so antagonistic to each other that there is hardly even a conceivable notion of common ground for a set of rules to be followed. Again, an anarchic situation.

Then there is the notion of domestic powers. US Presidents usually are supposed to be strong internationally (Commander in Chief) but weak domestically. SCOTUS (judicidial review of what is constitutional) > Congress (laws) > President (executive order). It seems a little weird to take the notion of a domestic realm of government to just have spatial meaning (e.g. U.S. laws applying to U.S. citizens still apply on them when they go on vacation abroard), but some people do. For instance, some have argued the killing was okay since Al-Awlaki moved to a foreign country and operated from there. But if he had operated from New Mexico and then killed in New Mexico, would it have been equally or more or less controversia?

Bringing the argument to the citizenship question. I believe this important because for an individual to have protected rights he or she needs to be the citizen of some government. If the individual in question is the citizen of a foreign government, international law applies (and then we have more of a Guantanamo context), but if he's the citizen of the government targeting him, he or she should and would have the rights to appeal being on that list to that government somehow.

Blah. Brainstorming. Morning, Americanos!

305 (I Stand By What I Said Whatever It Was)  Sat, Oct 1, 2011 7:49:28am

re: #300 Shiplord Kirel

PoWs come under the protection of various international agreements, commonly known as the "Geneva Conventions" though some of them are known under other titles. In many ways, these are more restrictive than the due process provisions of the criminal law.
For example, a PoW may not be extradited to a third country. This came up during the Falklands Conflict of 1982 when British forces captured an Argentine naval officer who had been indicted in Spain for torture and human rights abuses during the "dirty war" period a few years earlier. Even though there was a valid international warrant, the British could not hand him over to the Spanish and he was released with other Argentine prisoners at the end of the conflict.

But Geneva Conventions are international law -- they only apply between (hence: "inter") governments, no?

306 Decatur Deb  Sat, Oct 1, 2011 7:50:14am

re: #301 Sergey Romanov

Watch this:

[Video]

Don't give Arpaio any more ideas.

308 sagehen  Sat, Oct 1, 2011 7:53:23am

re: #304 000G

For instance, some have argued the killing was okay since Al-Awlaki moved to a foreign country and operated from there. But if he had operated from New Mexico and then killed in New Mexico, would it have been equally or more or less controversial?

If he'd been in New Mexico, we'd have had the means to send a squad to pick him up and drag him into a courtroom. And what we did to him in Yemen is far less squishy under international law than what we did to Bin Laden in Pakistan, because Yemen gave us permission (they had their own reasons for wanting him dead).

309 Decatur Deb  Sat, Oct 1, 2011 7:56:31am

Daytime stuff--BBL

310 Shiplord Kirel  Sat, Oct 1, 2011 7:56:48am

re: #305 000G

But Geneva Conventions are international law -- they only apply between (hence: "inter") governments, no?

That is not the case. They apply in international conflicts whether or not the opposing sides are recognized governments. Most of the agreements include fairly elaborate definitions to cover this. In any case, the Taliban was a recognized government and it is a defacto government to this day.

311 Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton  Sat, Oct 1, 2011 7:58:16am

re: #310 Shiplord Kirel

I think 000G meant al-Qaeda.

312 (I Stand By What I Said Whatever It Was)  Sat, Oct 1, 2011 7:58:47am

re: #310 Shiplord Kirel

That is not the case. They apply in international conflicts whether or not the opposing sides are recognized governments. Most of the agreements include fairly elaborate definitions to cover this. In any case, the Taliban was a recognized government and it is a defacto government to this day.

My point was not about de facto versus de iure governments, but about the difference between governments relating to other governments (whether those are de factor or de iure) on the one hand and individuals relating to governments on the other hand.

313 Gus  Sat, Oct 1, 2011 8:02:19am

Yeah. Law enforcement in the USA hasn't been militarized. Especially post 9/11.

//

314 Shropshire_Slasher  Sat, Oct 1, 2011 8:02:59am

Well that was an easy anniv. gift, one Nikon D7000 is on its way!

315 (I Stand By What I Said Whatever It Was)  Sat, Oct 1, 2011 8:04:10am

Some good educational material on domestic rules:

Youtube Video
316 (I Stand By What I Said Whatever It Was)  Sat, Oct 1, 2011 8:06:08am

re: #313 Gus 802

Yeah. Law enforcement in the USA hasn't been militarized. Especially post 9/11.

//

When you say "militarized", what do you mean? Technological progress in police armory? Synergenetic effects being amped up between law enforcement agencies?

317 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Sat, Oct 1, 2011 8:10:58am

re: #302 Killgore Trout

I wonder what's going to happen to bin laden's wives and kids. I assume they're still in Pakistani custody since they have spoken to the press. They might be held indefinitely.

I'm guessing that they are living through a hell on earth, too.

318 NJDhockeyfan  Sat, Oct 1, 2011 8:13:18am

Here is where al-Awlaki/Gadahn/terrorist/skid mark rips up his passport.

Youtube Video
319 Gus  Sat, Oct 1, 2011 8:15:12am

re: #316 000G

When you say "militarized", what do you mean? Technological progress in police armory? Synergenetic effects being amped up between law enforcement agencies?

Yes, that. Although the military doesn't have police powers. It includes the creation of SWAT teams in almost every police department across the country. Sharp shooters, armored vehicles, snipers, electronic warfare devices, surveillance, M-16s, body armor, etc. In some instances it includes the privatization of police departments much as we saw with the creation of quasi military activity with Blackwater.

320 Gus  Sat, Oct 1, 2011 8:16:47am

What If Occupy Wall Street Had A Cable News Sponsor?
September 29, 2011 9:08 am ET by Eric Boehlert

Closing in on its second week of ongoing protests, Occupy Wall Street continues to raise hackles in downtown Manhattan as street-bound activists rally to end joblessness, stop political corruption, curb health profiteering and to bring an end to wars.

Despite a successful and persistent vigil, the absence of mainstream news coverage over the last ten days has been striking, particularly since the protest are unfolding in the media capital of the world. And particularly since a grassroots uprising on the political right in 2009 was instantly rewarded with endless new coverage. Indeed, Fox News virtually sponsored the entire Tea Party movement.

So far, Occupy Wall Street has had no such luck.

A quick check of Nexis indicates that between September 17-27, Occupy Wall Street was reported on just two dozen times by the cable news channels. That averages out to less than one report each day by each of the 24-hour news outlets. (Note: Nexis does not track MSNBC or Fox News daytime programming.)

Continues.

321 Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton  Sat, Oct 1, 2011 8:16:48am

re: #318 NJDhockeyfan

Here is where al-Awlaki/Gadahn/terrorist/skid mark rips up his passport.

[Video]

He should have eaten it too. (It's not Awlaki, BTW).

322 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Sat, Oct 1, 2011 8:17:36am

re: #318 NJDhockeyfan

Here is where "the former" al-Awlaki/ "once upon on a" Gadahn/ "ex-"terrorist/ "current" skid mark rips up his passport.

323 Gus  Sat, Oct 1, 2011 8:17:36am

re: #320 Gus 802

What If Occupy Wall Street Had A Cable News Sponsor?
September 29, 2011 9:08 am ET by Eric Boehlert

More...

Yet NPR’s not-impressed editorial outlook seemed to mirror much of the media’s reaction. That, despite the fact there’s deep supports for cracking down on Wall Street.

As blogger Michael Zackman pointed out:

After all, polls show that many Americans would be interested in the marchers’ arguments. A Pew Research Center poll shows that “nearly half of Americans — 47 percent — say Wall Street hurts the nation’s economy more than it helps.” According to a Bloomberg poll, a whopping “70 percent of Americans say big bonuses should be banned this year at Wall Street firms that took taxpayer bailouts.” In another poll conducted by Lake Research Partners, 77 percent of respondents approved of tougher rules for Wall Street.

So it’s not as if Wall Street protesters represent the radical fringe of American politics. In fact, you could argue the protests are tapping into populist rage simmering nationwide.

324 NJDhockeyfan  Sat, Oct 1, 2011 8:17:47am

re: #321 Sergey Romanov

He should have eaten it too. (It's not Awlaki, BTW).

He's worm food now.

325 (I Stand By What I Said Whatever It Was)  Sat, Oct 1, 2011 8:18:55am

re: #321 Sergey Romanov

He should have eaten it too. (It's now Awlaki, BTW).

Only once it's eaten, digested and fully processed is it legally binding: [Link: travel.state.gov...]

326 Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton  Sat, Oct 1, 2011 8:19:21am

re: #324 NJDhockeyfan

He's worm food now.

Or BBQ.

327 (I Stand By What I Said Whatever It Was)  Sat, Oct 1, 2011 8:20:00am

re: #319 Gus 802

Yes, that. Although the military doesn't have police powers. It includes the creation of SWAT teams in almost every police department across the country. Sharp shooters, armored vehicles, snipers, electronic warfare devices, surveillance, M-16s, body armor, etc. In some instances it includes the privatization of police departments much as we saw with the creation of quasi military activity with Blackwater.

Apropos: [Link: littlegreenfootballs.com...]

328 Gus  Sat, Oct 1, 2011 8:24:22am

re: #327 000G

Apropos: [Link: littlegreenfootballs.com...]

Amazing isn't it? Yeah, "it will only be used for terrorism." I know that in Northern California they were using Homeland Security assets for destroying marijuana crops. Their powers will continue to expand and most Americans won't give a shit as usual. All of this was brought to you by both political parties as well.

329 (I Stand By What I Said Whatever It Was)  Sat, Oct 1, 2011 8:24:38am

re: #323 Gus 802

Heh:

In fact, you could argue the protests are tapping into populist rage simmering nationwide.

Surprisingly frank words. And I agree.

330 NJDhockeyfan  Sat, Oct 1, 2011 8:25:27am

re: #325 000G

Only once it's eaten, digested and fully processed is it legally binding: [Link: travel.state.gov...]

TITLE 8 > CHAPTER 12 > SUBCHAPTER III > Part III > § 1481

§ 1481. LOSS OF NATIONALITY BY NATIVE-BORN OR NATURALIZED CITIZEN; VOLUNTARY ACTION; BURDEN OF PROOF; PRESUMPTIONS

331 (I Stand By What I Said Whatever It Was)  Sat, Oct 1, 2011 8:26:51am

re: #328 Gus 802

Amazing isn't it? Yeah, "it will only be used for terrorism." I know that in Northern California they were using Homeland Security assets for destroying marijuana crops. Their powers will continue to expand and most Americans won't give a shit as usual. All of this was brought to you by both political parties as well.

It makes somewhat sense from an economical point of view. Waging multiple wars on several fronts is costly. Why not merge the "war powers" and cut costs? It's only rational for the government to let the same entities fight both the War on Terror and the War on Drugs.

332 Gus  Sat, Oct 1, 2011 8:27:11am

@DangerMindsBlog Dangerous Minds
George Carlin on why we should Occupy Wall Street [Link: t.co...]

333 (I Stand By What I Said Whatever It Was)  Sat, Oct 1, 2011 8:27:40am

re: #330 NJDhockeyfan

American nationality is not the same as U.S. citizenship, right?

334 Gus  Sat, Oct 1, 2011 8:28:58am

re: #331 000G

It makes somewhat sense from an economical point of view. Waging multiple wars on several fronts is costly. Why not merge the "war powers" and cut costs? It's only rational for the government to let the same entities fight both the War on Terror and the War on Drugs.

The only way they do that now, for the most part, is through the national guard. However, they use Pentagon assets in countries like Columbia in this farce called "War on Drugs."

335 Gus  Sat, Oct 1, 2011 8:29:13am

BRB

336 NJDhockeyfan  Sat, Oct 1, 2011 8:32:44am

re: #333 000G

American nationality is not the same as U.S. citizenship, right?

Not sure. Here is a State Dept explanation:

US State Department Services Dual Nationality

The concept of dual nationality means that a person is a citizen of two countries at the same time. Each country has its own citizenship laws based on its own policy.Persons may have dual nationality by automatic operation of different laws rather than by choice. For example, a child born in a foreign country to U.S. citizen parents may be both a U.S. citizen and a citizen of the country of birth.

A U.S. citizen may acquire foreign citizenship by marriage, or a person naturalized as a U.S. citizen may not lose the citizenship of the country of birth.U.S. law does not mention dual nationality or require a person to choose one citizenship or another. Also, a person who is automatically granted another citizenship does not risk losing U.S. citizenship. However, a person who acquires a foreign citizenship by applying for it may lose U.S. citizenship. In order to lose U.S. citizenship, the law requires that the person must apply for the foreign citizenship voluntarily, by free choice, and with the intention to give up U.S. citizenship.

Intent can be shown by the person's statements or conduct.The U.S. Government recognizes that dual nationality exists but does not encourage it as a matter of policy because of the problems it may cause. Claims of other countries on dual national U.S. citizens may conflict with U.S. law, and dual nationality may limit U.S. Government efforts to assist citizens abroad. The country where a dual national is located generally has a stronger claim to that person's allegiance.

However, dual nationals owe allegiance to both the United States and the foreign country. They are required to obey the laws of both countries. Either country has the right to enforce its laws, particularly if the person later travels there.Most U.S. citizens, including dual nationals, must use a U.S. passport to enter and leave the United States. Dual nationals may also be required by the foreign country to use its passport to enter and leave that country. Use of the foreign passport does not endanger U.S. citizenship.Most countries permit a person to renounce or otherwise lose citizenship.

Information on losing foreign citizenship can be obtained from the foreign country's embassy and consulates in the United States. Americans can renounce U.S. citizenship in the proper form at U.S. embassies and consulates abroad.

337 Daniel Ballard  Sat, Oct 1, 2011 8:35:23am

re: #328 Gus 802

Liberties are removed an inch at a time. Unfortunately, history has few examples of liberties being returned that way. All at once is far more common. But it's ugly. How do we Americans break that record? How do we fix this without major disruptions or worse?

338 (I Stand By What I Said Whatever It Was)  Sat, Oct 1, 2011 8:36:20am

re: #332 Gus 802

George Carlin may not be the best advocate:

Youtube Video
Youtube Video
Google Video
339 (I Stand By What I Said Whatever It Was)  Sat, Oct 1, 2011 8:38:00am

re: #336 NJDhockeyfan

Not sure. Here is a State Dept explanation:

US State Department Services Dual Nationality

See [Link: en.wikipedia.org...] especially [Link: en.wikipedia.org...]

340 Gus  Sat, Oct 1, 2011 8:38:41am

re: #337 Rightwingconspirator

Liberties are removed an inch at a time. Unfortunately, history has few examples of liberties being returned that way. All at once is far more common. But it's ugly. How do we Americans break that record? How do we fix this without major disruptions or worse?

Through lawsuits and court hearings. Which of course means a very long and slow process. The Patriot Act does have a "sunset provision" but at this time it continues to be extended and in reinforced in other ways through other codes and legislation. But yeah. Once the Feds create laws, rules, etc., they rarely if ever are reversed so we'll be living with this for a very long time.

341 Gus  Sat, Oct 1, 2011 8:40:38am

re: #338 000G

George Carlin may not be the best advocate:

[Video]

Oh I know. But Frank Zappa was like that too in many respects. What's his face, Bill Hicks, was big on the Oswald conspiracy. Nobody's perfect and when you're talking comedians or musicians I don't expect perfection at all.

342 (I Stand By What I Said Whatever It Was)  Sat, Oct 1, 2011 8:40:49am

re: #340 Gus 802

The Patriot Act does have a "sunset provision"

I really hate to go Godwin here, but so did the Enabling Act of 1933.

343 NJDhockeyfan  Sat, Oct 1, 2011 8:42:47am

Our VP has taken away blaming GWB for the current economy problems.

Joe Biden: The economy belongs to us, not Bush

Vice President Joe Biden said in a live interview with Miami public radio station WLRN Thursday that the Obama administration - not the Bush administration - now has ownership of the struggling U.S. economy.

Biden said Americans have "good reason to be upset" because they lost jobs because of the recession, "something they didn't have a thing to do with creating."

..."Even though 50-some percent of the American people think the economy tanked because of the last administration, that's not relevant," said the vice president. "What's relevant is we're in charge."

That's the best thing Joe Biden has said in a long time. It's like Truman's sign on his desk "The Buck Stops Here".

344 Gus  Sat, Oct 1, 2011 8:44:06am

If everyone we cited, admired, or referenced had to pass a personal litmus test and score 100 percent on that test we'd be sitting at home unable to move, speak, see or hear. I can't think of anyone where I've thought to myself "now this person is ALWAYS right."

345 (I Stand By What I Said Whatever It Was)  Sat, Oct 1, 2011 8:45:38am

re: #344 Gus 802

If everyone we cited, admired, or referenced had to pass a personal litmus test and score 100 percent on that test we'd be sitting at home unable to move, speak, see or hear. I can't think of anyone where I've thought to myself "now this person is ALWAYS right."

Well, you want to at least agree on the principles lest you are only in it for the action.

346 wrenchwench  Sat, Oct 1, 2011 8:48:58am

Aptly named Unhatchling:

unassimilated

(Logged in)
Registered since: Oct 11, 2010 at 5:17 pm
No. of comments posted: 0
No. of Pages posted: 0

347 Lidane  Sat, Oct 1, 2011 8:49:21am

I'm the first one to say that Bill Maher is a self-righteous douchebag, but he's got a point here:

Youtube Video
348 Obdicut  Sat, Oct 1, 2011 8:49:53am

re: #344 Gus 802

Betty White is ideal in every regard.

349 Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton  Sat, Oct 1, 2011 8:50:35am

re: #346 wrenchwench

Aptly named Unhatchling:

But maybe it is integrated.

350 Gus  Sat, Oct 1, 2011 8:51:21am

re: #345 000G

Well, you want to at least agree on the principles lest you are only in it for the action.

Sometimes you have to go with "close enough" when you're creating political allies. I mean try getting any ideological group in one room together agreeing on every single issue. Won't happen. So a general foundation or set of principles might work. But in this case it's not a matter of politics or a movement as much as the celebrity curiosity of George Carlin. Or is that the cult of celebrity? Some would say something like "he may be crazy but at least he's our crazy."

351 Obdicut  Sat, Oct 1, 2011 8:52:20am

re: #350 Gus 802

Check this out. You might like it, or it might enrage you further:


[Link: secure.americanselect.org...]

352 Killgore Trout  Sat, Oct 1, 2011 8:53:33am

re: #341 Gus 802

Oh I know. But Frank Zappa was like that too in many respects. What's his face, Bill Hicks, was big on the Oswald conspiracy. Nobody's perfect and when you're talking comedians or musicians I don't expect perfection at all.

I was thinking the same thing. There's something strange with the oddballs and skeptics. I'm fascinated with Penn Gillette. He's amazingly smart and can do some very serious debunking of popular myths but he falls into the same trap as Carlin, et al. Penn was even an early Tea Part supporter. I'd love to spend an hour of two picking his brain to see where this comes from.

353 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Sat, Oct 1, 2011 8:53:47am

re: #348 Obdicut

I love Betty. She's a good egg.

354 NJDhockeyfan  Sat, Oct 1, 2011 8:54:53am

Alabama company turns gun lovers' ashes into ammunition

(Reuters) - There's something to be said for going out with a bang.

Two Alabama game wardens have devised a smoking send-off for avid hunters and gun enthusiasts: For a small fee, the pair will turn cremated ashes into ammunition that the deceased's loved ones can fire at will.

...Parnell and Holmes dreamed up a company that would fill shotgun shells and rifle or pistol cartridges with ashes, allowing gun enthusiasts to spend eternity the way they lived their lives.

"People take ashes and spread them across lakes or forests or throw them in rivers, and nobody thinks twice about that. This is no different," said Holmes, who noted that a pound of ash fills about 250 shotgun shells.

LOL!

355 Renaissance_Man  Sat, Oct 1, 2011 8:55:31am

re: #344 Gus 802

If everyone we cited, admired, or referenced had to pass a personal litmus test and score 100 percent on that test we'd be sitting at home unable to move, speak, see or hear. I can't think of anyone where I've thought to myself "now this person is ALWAYS right."

I refer you to my posting history.

:)

356 Gus  Sat, Oct 1, 2011 8:56:06am

re: #351 Obdicut

Check this out. You might like it, or it might enrage you further:

[Link: secure.americanselect.org...]

I'm not enraged! ;)

What's that like a counter to the impending Citizens United world we're about to face?

357 Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton  Sat, Oct 1, 2011 8:56:18am

re: #352 Killgore Trout

Penn was even an early Tea Part supporter. I'd love to spend an hour of two picking his brain to see where this comes from.

Libertarianism.

358 Killgore Trout  Sat, Oct 1, 2011 8:56:43am

I'm listening to Joe Rogan's podcast now. Very entertaining but he's infuriating when he starts talking politics or stugg about how the aliens built the pyramids while doing mushrooms and writing the bible.

359 Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton  Sat, Oct 1, 2011 8:57:06am

re: #354 NJDhockeyfan

Like they didn't have enough problems with the Gun Nut stereotype.

360 Kronocide  Sat, Oct 1, 2011 8:57:37am

Racist Breitbart posters: find a racist comment, follow their account, they seem to make a lot of racist statements. Some have good Reputation too (Karma).

Death2PC

This spook looks like one of Buckweat's offspring. O'Tay!

Correction....... Get the joke right, please.............
So............, a bisexual, a negro, a white guy, a Muslim, an Indonesian, an illegal African immigrant, an identity forger, a Communist and a subversive walk into a bar.
The bartender says..........., "What can I get for you, Mr. "President"?"

No, a mind full of kneegrow.

Ebonics squared...........
Welcome to the United States, the NEW SOUTH AFRICA. The kneegrowfication of what was once a great nation. Oh, by the way, be sure to nominate Herman Cain.

That's just from his first page of comments. He has 683 of them and a positive account rating. Why does he have an account at all?

361 (I Stand By What I Said Whatever It Was)  Sat, Oct 1, 2011 8:58:37am

re: #357 Sergey Romanov

Libertarianism.

Penn Gilette was a glibertarian wingnut before there was a Tea Party:

Youtube Video
362 Killgore Trout  Sat, Oct 1, 2011 8:58:50am

re: #357 Sergey Romanov

Libertarianism.

I think that's a big factor. American Libertarianism has been a dumping ground for conspiracy theories and bad ideas for a very long time. I suspect there's some other factor, some sort of base instinct at work beyond libertarian thought.

363 Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton  Sat, Oct 1, 2011 8:58:55am

re: #360 BigPapa

Racist Breitbart posters: find a racist comment, follow their account, they seem to make a lot of racist statements. Some have good Reputation too (Karma).

Death2PC

This spook looks like one of Buckweat's offspring. O'Tay!

Correction... Get the joke right, please...
So..., a bisexual, a negro, a white guy, a Muslim, an Indonesian, an illegal African immigrant, an identity forger, a Communist and a subversive walk into a bar.
The bartender says..., "What can I get for you, Mr. "President"?"

No, a mind full of kneegrow.

Ebonics squared...
Welcome to the United States, the NEW SOUTH AFRICA. The kneegrowfication of what was once a great nation. Oh, by the way, be sure to nominate Herman Cain.

That's just from his first page of comments. He has 683 of them and a positive account rating. Why does he have an account at all?

Somebody should really take a screenshot tool (and I know screenshots aren't evidence, but still) and make some preliminary analysis of those commenters.

364 Gus  Sat, Oct 1, 2011 8:58:56am

re: #358 Killgore Trout

I'm listening to Joe Rogan's podcast now. Very entertaining but he's infuriating when he starts talking politics or stugg about how the aliens built the pyramids while doing mushrooms and writing the bible.

That's like when I was listening to Bill Hicks. Suddenly he got to the Oswald/JFK stuff and I was like, "what?" Seems counter intuitive since believing in those conspiracies requires a certain amount of... faith.

365 Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton  Sat, Oct 1, 2011 8:59:40am

re: #361 000G

Penn Gilette was a glibertarian wingnut before there was a Tea Party:

[Video]

I know. Sad. Michael Shermer is into that direction too, although he is very sane.

366 Gretchen G.Tiger  Sat, Oct 1, 2011 9:00:43am

The HORROR!

I don't understand why this isn't on the Front Page of every newspaper. It is clearly a the most serious issue facing us today.

/partly.

How is everyone this morning?

367 Obdicut  Sat, Oct 1, 2011 9:01:06am

re: #356 Gus 802

Yes, I guess. I dunno. I think it's mainly emphasizing how many people are similarly on board with many things, like raising taxes on the rich, regulating industries, spending a lot on renewable energy. It's obviously a work in progress.

The one thing that annoys me is that in its goal of being non-partisan, it's also information-free, basically. It won't tell you you're wrong at any point. But I guess most people don't like that.

368 Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton  Sat, Oct 1, 2011 9:01:25am

re: #366 ggt

Chocolate? Not really. They'll make something out of plastic.

369 jaunte  Sat, Oct 1, 2011 9:01:53am

re: #360 BigPapa

Why does he have an account at all?

Breitbart approves his message, and can also deny responsibility for it.

370 Obdicut  Sat, Oct 1, 2011 9:02:02am

re: #368 Sergey Romanov

Ersatz World, coming right up.

371 (I Stand By What I Said Whatever It Was)  Sat, Oct 1, 2011 9:02:23am

re: #362 Killgore Trout

I think that's a big factor. American Libertarianism has been a dumping ground for conspiracy theories and bad ideas for a very long time. I suspect there's some other factor, some sort of base instinct at work beyond libertarian thought.

I think conspiracy theories are a symptom of a megalomania complex in connection with a huge dose of resentment. The explanations you come up with naturally outgrow your actual capabilities to affect things for the good.

A control mechanism for the psyche when external, social shit gets out of control.

Almost like religions.

372 Gus  Sat, Oct 1, 2011 9:02:47am

I'm having to deal with a homophobic libertarian now. I'm biting my tongue though since he's letting me hang my hat here for now. I called him a homophobe the other day and he was like "I'm not a homophobe, I'm not afraid of gays. I just don't like them..." Some other BS about having a right to hate them. Anyway. Libertarianism and hating gays just doesn't make sense.

373 Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton  Sat, Oct 1, 2011 9:04:03am

E.g. Shermer was an AGW denier (tho now he debunks them, last time I checked).

[Link: www.michaelshermer.com...]

374 wrenchwench  Sat, Oct 1, 2011 9:04:13am

re: #365 Sergey Romanov

I know. Sad. Michael Shermer is into that direction too, although he is very sane.

He's gone both directions. Started out believing in woo woo stuff training for cycling, figured out it was bunk, started finding bunk everywhere, but I think has some of that libertarian disease.

375 Gretchen G.Tiger  Sat, Oct 1, 2011 9:04:32am

re: #368 Sergey Romanov

Chocolate? Not really. They'll make something out of plastic.

HERETIC!!!!!

:0

376 Targetpractice  Sat, Oct 1, 2011 9:04:55am

re: #372 Gus 802

I'm having to deal with a homophobic libertarian now. I'm biting my tongue though since he's letting me hang my hat here for now. I called him a homophobe the other day and he was like "I'm not a homophobe, I'm not afraid of gays. I just don't like them..." Some other BS about having a right to hate them. Anyway. Libertarianism and hating gays just doesn't make sense.

"Yes, you have a right to hate them. Just as I have a right to call you a homophobic bigot."

377 Obdicut  Sat, Oct 1, 2011 9:05:29am

re: #372 Gus 802

Nor does hating a group of people as if they all share any qualities whatsoever.*

Plus, gay dudes can be a lot of fun. I probably had a nicer time living in the Castro than anywhere else in SF.

*other than the obvious one.

378 Gretchen G.Tiger  Sat, Oct 1, 2011 9:06:44am

re: #376 Targetpractice, Worst of Both Worlds

"Yes, you have a right to hate them. Just as I have a right to call you a homophobic bigot."

I don't think there is a law that says you can't hate --you just can't act on that hate. You have to accept that everyone has equal rights under the law and act accordingly.

379 sagehen  Sat, Oct 1, 2011 9:07:01am

re: #343 NJDhockeyfan

Our VP has taken away blaming GWB for the current economy problems.

Joe Biden: The economy belongs to us, not Bush

That's the best thing Joe Biden has said in a long time. It's like Truman's sign on his desk "The Buck Stops Here".

He's got a point... for the first year (if I'm feeling generous maybe 2 years) it's fair to be thoroughly pissed off at the guy who made the mess. But we're three years in now, it's fair to be getting increasingly irritated at the guy who's not moving fast enough on cleaning it up.

380 Gretchen G.Tiger  Sat, Oct 1, 2011 9:07:52am

re: #379 sagehen

He's got a point... for the first year (if I'm feeling generous maybe 2 years) it's fair to be thoroughly pissed off at the guy who made the mess. But we're three years in now, it's fair to be getting increasingly irritated at the guy who's not moving fast enough on cleaning it up.

I still don't understand what any POTUS can do about the economy.

381 Gus  Sat, Oct 1, 2011 9:08:31am

re: #377 Obdicut

Nor does hating a group of people as if they all share any qualities whatsoever.*

Plus, gay dudes can be a lot of fun. I probably had a nicer time living in the Castro than anywhere else in SF.

*other than the obvious one.

Yeah. When I try to calm these haters down I always try to tell them that gays are just like everyone else. Some are bad, some are good. They just can't go beyond seeing their own rage or hatred. Right now I guess it's the rolled up pants which is freaking them out -- you know like that capri pants look.

382 Daniel Ballard  Sat, Oct 1, 2011 9:08:48am

re: #351 Obdicut

Check this out. You might like it, or it might enrage you further:

[Link: secure.americanselect.org...]

Looks like something for those of us who have tried partisanship, found it's dramatic failings and might move on in a non partisan, more policy based manner.

383 Targetpractice  Sat, Oct 1, 2011 9:08:58am

re: #378 ggt

I don't think there is a law that says you can't hate --you just can't act on that hate. You have to accept that everyone has equal rights under the law and act accordingly.

Which is what always amuses me about bigots who claim to be libertarians. Why? Because they're always the first to start screaming "There oughta be a law!" when they see a gay couple so much as holding hands.

384 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Sat, Oct 1, 2011 9:09:05am

re: #376 Targetpractice, Worst of Both Worlds

ho·mo·phobe [hoh-muh-fohb]
noun
a person who fears or hates homosexuals and homosexuality.

385 Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton  Sat, Oct 1, 2011 9:09:13am

re: #374 wrenchwench

I see he is a Latter Lomborg fan.

386 Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton  Sat, Oct 1, 2011 9:10:23am

re: #385 Sergey Romanov

I see he is a Latter Lomborg fan.

[Link: www.skepticblog.org...]

387 darthstar  Sat, Oct 1, 2011 9:10:56am

Mornin' all...this dude's got a model airplane.

Youtube Video

Happy Saturday...got to sleep in...now it's time to take the boys to the beach.

388 Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton  Sat, Oct 1, 2011 9:12:54am

Heh. Reading about Palahniuk's work makes me not to want to read Palahniuk's work:

"Guts"

The book is best known for the short story "Guts", which had been published previous to the book in the March 2004 issue of Playboy magazine as well as on Palahniuk's website (Palahniuk offered to let them publish another story along with it, but the publishers found the second work too disturbing). It is a tale of violent accidents involving masturbation where the reader is told "to hold his breath" in the very first line.

While on his 2003 tour to promote his novel Diary, Palahniuk read "Guts" to his audiences. It was reported that over 35 people fainted while listening to the readings. On his tour to promote Stranger Than Fiction: True Stories in the summer of 2004, he read the story to audiences again, bringing the total amount of fainters up to 53, and later up to 60, while on tour to promote the softcover edition of Diary. The last fainting occurred on May 28, 2007, in Victoria, British Columbia, Canada, where five people fainted, one of which occurred when a man was trying to leave the auditorium, which resulting in him falling and hitting his head on the door. Palahniuk is apparently not bothered by these incidents, which have not stopped fans from reading "Guts" or his other works.

A New York City public school 11th grade teacher was suspended for letting his English class read "Guts".[1]

389 NJDhockeyfan  Sat, Oct 1, 2011 9:13:13am

re: #387 darthstar

Mornin' all...this dude's got a model airplane.

[Video]Happy Saturday...got to sleep in...now it's time to take the boys to the beach.

Awesome SR-71!

Check this out...a B-52.

Youtube Video
390 jaunte  Sat, Oct 1, 2011 9:13:43am

re: #332 Gus 802

@DangerMindsBlog Dangerous Minds
George Carlin on why we should Occupy Wall Street [Link: t.co...]

Here's an alternative form of protest that sounds interesting:

...We take some of our money out of ever-more-complex and volatile global financial markets and put it to work in things that we understand and that contribute to our communities.

If we get over a little of our fear and frustration and look around our hometowns, we will find plenty of entrepreneurial opportunities to begin fixing our economy and our civil society, from the ground up.

I'm talking about the prospect of a million Americans taking 1 percent of their money and investing in small food enterprises, near where they live.[Link: www.grist.org...]

391 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Sat, Oct 1, 2011 9:13:54am

re: #383 Targetpractice, Worst of Both Worlds

I was out of town the other night and stopped in at a bar.

After looking around I noticed that two guys in the corner were holding hands. Then I looked at a booth and two guys were snuggling. Then... yeah. I saw two guys kissing.

I said, "Let's get the hell out of here." to the guy I was slow dancing with.

392 Killgore Trout  Sat, Oct 1, 2011 9:15:34am

re: #388 Sergey Romanov

Heh. Reading about Palahniuk's work makes me not to want to read Palahniuk's work:

He's very worthwhile. Palahniuk is the only living fiction author I have any interesting in reading. Choke and Lululby are my favorites.

393 Gus  Sat, Oct 1, 2011 9:16:36am

re: #387 darthstar

Mornin' all...this dude's got a model airplane.

[Video]Happy Saturday...got to sleep in...now it's time to take the boys to the beach.

How much C4 can that carry?

//

394 (I Stand By What I Said Whatever It Was)  Sat, Oct 1, 2011 9:16:46am

re: #371 000G

I think conspiracy theories are a symptom of a megalomania complex in connection with a huge dose of resentment. The explanations you come up with naturally outgrow your actual capabilities to affect things for the good.

A control mechanism for the psyche when external, social shit gets out of control.

Almost like religions.

Expanding on this: I think a lot of libertarian impulse comes from the attitude of wanting to be left the fuck alone. And I can understand that, especially when society around you becomes more and more demanding, unjust, ugly.

But then a lot of libertarianism seems to spin this into a fundamental principle in which individuals make up the ultimative reality, any collectives (except for one, this is important: the people, the nation) are evil abstractions, and only minarchism and hyper-individualism can provide solutions to the social mess. And that's just plain wrong.

But this wrong interpretation of the world provides fertile grounds for conspiracy theories because it easily assumes social problems to be rooted in evil individuals that secretly plot in small, clandestine collectives against the people, the one good collective that the good individual libertarians are part of. So it's the illuminati, the New World Order, etc. as evil mirror versions of the libertarian conspiracy theorist instead of the actual bad policies, popular misunderstandings, unhinged bigotry, etc.

395 Gretchen G.Tiger  Sat, Oct 1, 2011 9:19:47am

re: #394 000G

Expanding on this: I think a lot of libertarian impulse comes from the attitude of wanting to be left the fuck alone. And I can understand that, especially when society around you becomes more and more demanding, unjust, ugly.

But then a lot of libertarianism seems to spin this into a fundamental principle in which individuals make up the ultimative reality, any collectives (except for one, this is important: the people, the nation) are evil abstractions, and only minarchism and hyper-individualism can provide solutions to the social mess. And that's just plain wrong.

But this wrong interpretation of the world provides fertile grounds for conspiracy theories because it easily assumes social problems to be rooted in evil individuals that secretly plot in small, clandestine collectives against the people. So it's the illuminati, the New World Order, etc. instead of bad policies, popular misunderstandings, unhinged bigotry, etc.

Liberatarians are the only party I've found that fits my values as a far as 2nd Amendment Rights and Women's Rights.

Why gun rights and abortion are otherwise viewed as diametrically opposed is beyond me.

I end-up partyless.

Oh well.

396 Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton  Sat, Oct 1, 2011 9:19:48am

re: #392 Killgore Trout

He's very worthwhile. Palahniuk is the only living fiction author I have any interesting in reading. Choke and Lululby are my favorites.

You didn't faint reading "Guts"? *eyes KT suspiciously* /

397 Gus  Sat, Oct 1, 2011 9:20:32am

Libertarianism for me but no libertarianism for thee!

//

398 Gretchen G.Tiger  Sat, Oct 1, 2011 9:20:44am

re: #388 Sergey Romanov

Heh. Reading about Palahniuk's work makes me not to want to read Palahniuk's work:

When I first read that, my brain saw Gus.

I thought, WOW, a book about Gus.

hahahaha

399 darthstar  Sat, Oct 1, 2011 9:21:15am

re: #393 Gus 802

How much C4 can that carry?

//

Not as much as this one.

Youtube Video
400 (I Stand By What I Said Whatever It Was)  Sat, Oct 1, 2011 9:22:26am

re: #395 ggt

Of course, Ron Paul is vehemently "pro-life", and a lot of rwnj libertarians seem to share his view.

401 kirkspencer  Sat, Oct 1, 2011 9:23:28am

re: #281 Naso Tang

While I understand your theoretical points (slippery slope etc.) in reality it is impossible to have laws that technically cover every eventuality.

In this case it seems obvious that:

a) This guy was NOT one of OUR people (your term) any more, by his own statements and acts, and with will we could have also done the paperwork to make that technically legal.

b) He was not on American soil.

c) He was not able to be apprehended by police action.

Not one point of which was in my objection.

402 wrenchwench  Sat, Oct 1, 2011 9:23:52am

re: #386 Sergey Romanov

[Link: www.skepticblog.org...]

Looks like a combination of wishful thinking and a libertarian application of "cost/benefit analysis".

403 (I Stand By What I Said Whatever It Was)  Sat, Oct 1, 2011 9:23:58am

re: #397 Gus 802

Libertarianism for me but no libertarianism for thee!

//

A communist columnist I read once snarked that anarchism is an attitude conservatives develop when taxes are due.

404 Gus  Sat, Oct 1, 2011 9:24:26am

re: #398 ggt

When I first read that, my brain saw Gus.

I thought, WOW, a book about Gus.

hahahaha

Oh! Guts...Gus. For a minute there. Hmm, I think I did that for a second too.

405 Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton  Sat, Oct 1, 2011 9:25:18am

re: #400 000G

Of course, Ron Paul is vehemently "pro-life", and a lot of rwnj libertarians seem to share his view.

Yeah, a lot of anti-abortion libertarians. Basing their opposition on religion. Which shows to me that the label is rather useless to gauge support for civil liberties.

406 Gus  Sat, Oct 1, 2011 9:25:29am

re: #399 darthstar

Not as much as this one.

[Video]

Holy cow. Yeah, super scale is all the rage now. It's really big towards Russia too and in Europe. Really massive RC planes.

407 Obdicut  Sat, Oct 1, 2011 9:25:38am

re: #400 000G

A lot of the wackier 'libertarians' either are fine with restriction of rights as long as it's at the local or state level-- which makes no sense, since those are arbitrary limits-- or support the tyranny of the majority, like those fools who support the idea of people being able to ban black people from stores, hotels, restaurants, etc.

408 Killgore Trout  Sat, Oct 1, 2011 9:26:04am

re: #396 Sergey Romanov

You didn't faint reading "Guts"? *eyes KT suspiciously* /

It definitely made me cringe. Some of the stuff in Stranger Than Fiction really disturbed me because some of the stories took place here in Portland at locations i'm familiar with.

409 Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton  Sat, Oct 1, 2011 9:26:34am

re: #402 wrenchwench

Looks like a combination of wishful thinking and a libertarian application of "cost/benefit analysis".

Well, you know, as long as people don't deny the proven facts of the past and present, I tend to go easy on them. Future is, after all, less certain and predictable than the past.

410 Kronocide  Sat, Oct 1, 2011 9:27:03am

Drunk and gay is no way to go through life buddy.

Wow, Breitbart's comment blogs are a cesspool. Not just bad members, but nasty comments getting voted up.

411 (I Stand By What I Said Whatever It Was)  Sat, Oct 1, 2011 9:27:12am

re: #407 Obdicut

Neoconfederates, basically.

412 Gus  Sat, Oct 1, 2011 9:28:00am

re: #410 BigPapa

Drunk and gay is no way to go through life buddy.

Wow, Breitbart's comment blogs are a cesspool. Not just bad members, but nasty comments getting voted up.

Always were. I remember commenting there back in the day and thinking to myself "who are these assholes?"

413 Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton  Sat, Oct 1, 2011 9:29:11am

re: #409 Sergey Romanov

Well, you know, as long as people don't deny the proven facts of the past and present, I tend to go easy on them. Future is, after all, less certain and predictable than the past.

And I don't mean that they're not wrong. But yeah, about future one can have debates. If one denies the present/past facts, what is there to debate?

414 (I Stand By What I Said Whatever It Was)  Sat, Oct 1, 2011 9:29:47am

What's cringeworthy about Palahniuk?

Is he more cringeworthy than Gaspar Noé?

415 Gretchen G.Tiger  Sat, Oct 1, 2011 9:30:12am

Libertarian Party 2010 Platform

As usual, people can be ignorant of the source. They go with with whatever people tell them (like some female politicans of which we've heard).

It's kinda like: Will the real Libertarian Party, please STAND UP.

416 Gretchen G.Tiger  Sat, Oct 1, 2011 9:30:46am

re: #412 Gus 802

Always were. I remember commenting there back in the day and thinking to myself "who are these assholes?"

Drunk and willfully stupid is no way to go thru life.

417 Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton  Sat, Oct 1, 2011 9:31:14am

re: #414 000G

What's cringeworthy about Palahniuk?

Is he more cringeworthy than Gaspar Noé?

Hmm.

Next, the narrator describes a young boy inserting a thin stick of candle wax into his urethra to stimulate it while masturbating. The wax slips back into the boy's bladder, requiring expensive surgery to remove it, which the parents pay for using all the money from the boy's college savings. The narrator then refers, in passing, to numerous boys of about the same age accidentally asphyxiating themselves while masturbating, a fad to which a spike in teenage suicide rates is attributed. Finally, the narrator describes an incident in which he sat on the water intake at the bottom of a swimming pool while masturbating. The suction caused his rectum and lower intestines to prolapse and become tangled in the filter, forcing the narrator to gnaw through his own innards in order to free himself and avoid drowning. The narrator's sister later becomes impregnated by semen deposited by the narrator in the pool, which results in her having an abortion.

I can easily read de Sade and Sorokin, but I don't want to read this ;)

418 (I Stand By What I Said Whatever It Was)  Sat, Oct 1, 2011 9:32:18am

re: #413 Sergey Romanov

And I don't mean that they're not wrong. But yeah, about future one can have debates. If one denies the present/past facts, what is there to debate?

Very good point about cognitive aspects about the philosophy of time playing into discourse ethics.

419 Obdicut  Sat, Oct 1, 2011 9:32:34am

re: #415 ggt

Their statement of principles is like watching someone go through a dodgeball game. They torture themselves to avoid saying that AGW is real, for example.

And you can find total theocrats running as Libertarians quite frequently, since the libertarian party has a strong, strong confederate presence these days.

420 Gretchen G.Tiger  Sat, Oct 1, 2011 9:32:44am

re: #417 Sergey Romanov

I don't understand why one would want to read this.

421 Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton  Sat, Oct 1, 2011 9:33:07am

re: #418 000G

Very good point about cognitive aspects about the philosophy of time playing into discourse ethics.

MONGO DID GOOD
MONGO GLAD

422 (I Stand By What I Said Whatever It Was)  Sat, Oct 1, 2011 9:33:31am

re: #417 Sergey Romanov

lol, sounds a little too whacky to be cringeworthy, for me.

423 Gus  Sat, Oct 1, 2011 9:34:03am

re: #421 Sergey Romanov

MONGO DID GOOD
MONGO GLAD

Mongo only pawn in game of life.

//

424 sagehen  Sat, Oct 1, 2011 9:34:07am

There's a show called "Homeland" starting tomorrow on Showtime that looks interesting -- about a CIA analyst (Claire Danes) who suspects that a freed American POW is an enemy agent. She's crazy, but she's not wrong.

Here's Alyssa Rosenberg's review, and the first episode.

[Link: thinkprogress.org...]

I really liked it.

425 Gretchen G.Tiger  Sat, Oct 1, 2011 9:34:32am

re: #417 Sergey Romanov

I don't buy the getting impregnated by semen in the pool water. WTF?

426 Targetpractice  Sat, Oct 1, 2011 9:34:36am

re: #415 ggt

Libertarian Party 2010 Platform

As usual, people can be ignorant of the source. They go with with whatever people tell them (like some female politicans of which we've heard).

It's kinda like: Will the real Libertarian Party, please STAND UP.

One can claim to be libertarian, then make an excuse for why they don't adhere to said principles. Like believing in personal liberty, but then call for a ban on abortion because it's "immoral."

427 kirkspencer  Sat, Oct 1, 2011 9:35:28am

re: #292 Decatur Deb

Admitting a few (slight) reservations about this use of power I still offer some questions that will clarify the use of the new ability to reach out and touch someone 10,000 miles away:

1) Is this killing an act of retribution for crime or the disruption of an ongoing combatant/criminal activity? You don't offer a Miranda statement while a guy is still holding a gun.

2) Is the use of the word 'assassination' even appropriate in the case of declared, real-world hostile leadership? The killing of Yamamoto in a carefully planned ambush is an example. (Would the RAF be fairly chided for a targeted 500 lb bomb on Goebbels outhouse in 1943?)

3) the key falls back on the argument about response to 9/11 and the GWOT. Is this a real war, a crime counter-operation, or something entirely novel? Clearly the action is ongoing, and the coffins have real bodies, but has our language caught up with our technology?

Valid questions. A perhaps simplistic response is to force the mirror. If an Al Qaeda franchise were to blow up our president, or perhaps as a better example General Patraeus, while he was attending a staff meeting, would it be an assassination?

428 Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton  Sat, Oct 1, 2011 9:35:31am

re: #425 ggt

I don't buy the getting impregnated by semen in the pool water. WTF?

It's a well-known urban legend.

429 Gus  Sat, Oct 1, 2011 9:37:06am

re: #428 Sergey Romanov

It's a well-known urban legend.

Nothing that can't be taken care of by eating some toast with spermicidal jelly.

//

430 Gretchen G.Tiger  Sat, Oct 1, 2011 9:37:18am

re: #426 Targetpractice, Worst of Both Worlds

One can claim to be libertarian, then make an excuse for why they don't adhere to said principles. Like believing in personal liberty, but then call for a ban on abortion because it's "immoral."

This is why the Libertarian Party has little traction in this country. People think it is a one size fit's all Party.

431 Gretchen G.Tiger  Sat, Oct 1, 2011 9:39:13am

re: #428 Sergey Romanov

It's a well-known urban legend.

Like vaccinations causing autism?

432 (I Stand By What I Said Whatever It Was)  Sat, Oct 1, 2011 9:39:23am

re: #426 Targetpractice, Worst of Both Worlds

One can claim to be libertarian, then make an excuse for why they don't adhere to said principles. Like believing in personal liberty, but then call for a ban on abortion because it's "immoral."

I think the argument is not to immorality but to declare embryos and fetuses persons.

433 Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton  Sat, Oct 1, 2011 9:39:31am

re: #430 ggt

Like the Whigs. (Sorry, Ojoe.)

434 Gretchen G.Tiger  Sat, Oct 1, 2011 9:40:20am

re: #432 000G

I think the argument is not to immorality but to declare embryos and fetuses persons.

deny contracteption to women and make them chattel?

435 Gretchen G.Tiger  Sat, Oct 1, 2011 9:40:50am

Bother Puppy is gone for the weekend. The house is soooooo quiet.

436 Kronocide  Sat, Oct 1, 2011 9:41:58am

I'm really disappointed in Shermer giving credence to Lomborg.

437 Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton  Sat, Oct 1, 2011 9:42:01am

re: #431 ggt

Like vaccinations causing autism?

No, your example is more of an incorrect scientific claim, like creationism.

Altho admittedly the line between those categories is blurry.

438 Gus  Sat, Oct 1, 2011 9:42:32am

re: #431 ggt

Like vaccinations causing autism?

Like a gluten free diet.

//

439 (I Stand By What I Said Whatever It Was)  Sat, Oct 1, 2011 9:42:33am

re: #434 ggt

deny contracteption to women and make them chattel?

Never claimed that the argument is consistent and/or defensible, I was just interested in clarifying what it actually is.

440 Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton  Sat, Oct 1, 2011 9:42:45am

re: #435 ggt

Bother Puppy is gone for the weekend. The house is sooo quiet.

When will it become Unicorn-pooping-rainbows Puppy? :)

441 Gus  Sat, Oct 1, 2011 9:42:45am

The latest dumb trend.

442 Gretchen G.Tiger  Sat, Oct 1, 2011 9:42:54am

re: #437 Sergey Romanov

No, your example is more of an incorrect scientific claim, like creationism.

Altho admittedly the line between those categories is blurry.

and getting pregnant by semen exposed to chlorinated pool water isn't an incorrect scientific claim?

443 sagehen  Sat, Oct 1, 2011 9:44:04am

re: #380 ggt

I still don't understand what any POTUS can do about the economy.

This jobs act he's trying to sell is 2-1/2 years late, and still too small. The stimulus when he first took office should have been two million construction workers sent to repair bridges, replace 130-year-old water mains, upgrade the power-grid, dig big trenches and fill them in, and in between lay some fiber-optic cable. As an experimental program, maybe a million unemployed office workers could spend a summer tutoring, get 5-10 million kids up a couple of grade levels. The money we wouldn't have had to spend on extended unemployment benefits would have paid for at least 1/3 of it, the recession wouldn't be nearly as deep or wide, and we'd have something to show for it at the end.

Also, I want a high-speed rail line to parallel Interstate 10.

444 Gretchen G.Tiger  Sat, Oct 1, 2011 9:44:13am

re: #440 Sergey Romanov

When will it become Unicorn-pooping-rainbows Puppy? :)

When hell (small h, not Hell MI) freezes over or he wins Westminster.

(which won't happen because I won't pay the cost of Westminster --and he is not that pretty)

445 Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton  Sat, Oct 1, 2011 9:44:26am

re: #442 ggt

and getting pregnant by semen exposed to chlorinated pool water isn't an incorrect scientific claim?

It is, but unlike your assertion, it's also an urban legend.

446 Gus  Sat, Oct 1, 2011 9:45:21am

re: #445 Sergey Romanov

It is, but unlike your assertion, it's also an urban legend.

Gluten free semen. It's good for you.

//

447 Gretchen G.Tiger  Sat, Oct 1, 2011 9:45:31am

re: #439 000G

Never claimed that the argument is consistent and/or defensible, I was just interested in clarifying what it actually is.

True, boiling them down to the basic denominator makes thinks crystal clear.

448 Gretchen G.Tiger  Sat, Oct 1, 2011 9:46:00am

re: #446 Gus 802

Gluten free semen. It's good for you.

//

I prefer the trans-fat hydrogenated kind.

/

449 Gus  Sat, Oct 1, 2011 9:46:30am

One dose of semen in a swimming pool. Isn't that like homeopathic insemination?

//

450 sagehen  Sat, Oct 1, 2011 9:46:48am

re: #397 Gus 802

Libertarianism for me but no libertarianism for thee!

//

"A Libertarian is a Republican who smokes pot."

451 Gretchen G.Tiger  Sat, Oct 1, 2011 9:46:54am

re: #429 Gus 802

Nothing that can't be taken care of by eating some toast with spermicidal jelly.

//

There is no end to stupid.

452 Daniel Ballard  Sat, Oct 1, 2011 9:47:12am

Well it's a "film school" day for me. I'm trying to get steady shots off of a tripod. Ans I really detest that shaky hand held look ala Cloverfield/Battle LA. So, I rented this "handheld" package of hardware for my SLR, setting it up just like a Redcam or Sony pro video camera for TV production. An external video monitor, a very steady shoulder rig, follow focusing gears and a battery that would last a week I think.

453 Gretchen G.Tiger  Sat, Oct 1, 2011 9:47:43am

re: #449 Gus 802

One dose of semen in a swimming pool. Isn't that like homeopathic insemination?

//

I don't know if the body of water is large enough. I think it would have to be one dose in an ocean (Atlantic or Pacific, not Indian--too small)

454 Targetpractice  Sat, Oct 1, 2011 9:48:02am

re: #430 ggt

This is why the Libertarian Party has little traction in this country. People think it is a one size fit's all Party.

Oh, the Libertarian Party's gaining traction these days. Or, rather, it just rebranded itself as the Republican Party.

455 Gretchen G.Tiger  Sat, Oct 1, 2011 9:48:47am

re: #454 Targetpractice, Worst of Both Worlds

Oh, the Libertarian Party's gaining traction these days. Or, rather, it just rebranded itself as the Republican Party.

As long as we have at least 2 viable parties, I'll be happy.

456 Targetpractice  Sat, Oct 1, 2011 9:48:57am

re: #432 000G

I think the argument is not to immorality but to declare embryos and fetuses persons.

Yeah, that's the other angle. "We believe in personal liberty, so that clump of cells is legally a person now!"

457 Gus  Sat, Oct 1, 2011 9:49:12am

re: #451 ggt

There is no end to stupid.

Coming up next!

"You really should put "synthetic oil" in your car."

458 Lidane  Sat, Oct 1, 2011 9:50:31am

re: #455 ggt

As long as we have at least 2 viable parties, I'll be happy.

I'd rather have at least two SANE, viable parties. Right now, we've only got one of those. The GOP needs to purge the crazies and send them all to the Constitution Party where they belong.

459 Gretchen G.Tiger  Sat, Oct 1, 2011 9:50:40am

re: #456 Targetpractice, Worst of Both Worlds

Yeah, that's the other angle. "We believe in personal liberty, so that clump of cells is legally a person now!"

I'd just love to see the legal gymnastics of the death of a pregnant undocumented person. Her fetus would have status as a US Person, but she wouldn't.

LOL

460 Gus  Sat, Oct 1, 2011 9:50:44am

re: #453 ggt

I don't know if the body of water is large enough. I think it would have to be one dose in an ocean (Atlantic or Pacific, not Indian--too small)

Hmm. I should start selling homeopathic birth control pills.

Wonder how good those would work.

//

461 Kronocide  Sat, Oct 1, 2011 9:51:11am

Proof of Global Warming

462 Daniel Ballard  Sat, Oct 1, 2011 9:51:24am

re: #412 Gus 802

Always were. I remember commenting there back in the day and thinking to myself "who are these assholes?"

It's a veritable hamper full of dirty socks. Too bad it's not laundry day.

463 Gretchen G.Tiger  Sat, Oct 1, 2011 9:51:29am

re: #458 Lidane

I'd rather have at least two SANE, viable parties. Right now, we've only got one of those. The GOP needs to purge the crazies and send them all to the Constitution Party where they belong.

Well, sane isn't a psychiatric term. It's a legal term and as it stands, such things are in the eyes of the beholder.

:0

464 Gus  Sat, Oct 1, 2011 9:51:38am

Texas will start using homeopathetic lethal injections for their executions.

//

465 Gretchen G.Tiger  Sat, Oct 1, 2011 9:52:12am

re: #460 Gus 802

Hmm. I should start selling homeopathic birth control pill.

Wonder how good those would work.

//

You'd probably get enough placebo effect to maintain a profitable market.

466 Killgore Trout  Sat, Oct 1, 2011 9:52:49am

re: #452 Rightwingconspirator

Well it's a "film school" day for me. I'm trying to get steady shots off of a tripod. Ans I really detest that shaky hand held look ala Cloverfield/Battle LA. So, I rented this "handheld" package of hardware for my SLR, setting it up just like a Redcam or Sony pro video camera for TV production. An external video monitor, a very steady shoulder rig, follow focusing gears and a battery that would last a week I think.

Good luck. Sounds like a lot of fun.

467 Gretchen G.Tiger  Sat, Oct 1, 2011 9:52:55am

re: #464 Gus 802

You are on a roll this morning. Get a good night's sleep?

468 Gus  Sat, Oct 1, 2011 9:53:56am

re: #467 ggt

You are on a roll this morning. Get a good night's sleep?

Sort of. Napped almost all of yesterday afternoon. Then went back to sleep later and tried to stay in bed. Gotta work on that.

469 Gretchen G.Tiger  Sat, Oct 1, 2011 9:54:41am

re: #468 Gus 802

Sort of. Napped almost all of yesterday afternoon. Then went back to sleep later and tried to stay in bed. Gotta work on that.

Helps if you have company.

470 Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton  Sat, Oct 1, 2011 9:55:44am

re: #436 BigPapa

I'm really disappointed in Shermer giving credence to Lomborg.

An illustration of what Gus wrote above. Nobody's perfect. I have my own gripes with some of what, say, Randi wrote, but I will always appreciate his overall work.

471 Gus  Sat, Oct 1, 2011 9:56:02am

re: #452 Rightwingconspirator

Well it's a "film school" day for me. I'm trying to get steady shots off of a tripod. Ans I really detest that shaky hand held look ala Cloverfield/Battle LA. So, I rented this "handheld" package of hardware for my SLR, setting it up just like a Redcam or Sony pro video camera for TV production. An external video monitor, a very steady shoulder rig, follow focusing gears and a battery that would last a week I think.

And remember! If you don't use a Nikon lens...

//

472 Targetpractice  Sat, Oct 1, 2011 9:57:06am

re: #459 ggt

I'd just love to see the legal gymnastics of the death of a pregnant undocumented person. Her fetus would have status as a US Person, but she wouldn't.

LOL

Nah, such legal gymnastics would be eclipsed by trying to ban abortion totally. Even if you ended legal abortion, writing the law in such a way as to stamp out illegal abortion would read like something out of The Handmaid's Tale.

473 jaunte  Sat, Oct 1, 2011 9:58:22am

re: #459 ggt

I'd just love to see the legal gymnastics of the death of a pregnant undocumented person. Her fetus would have status as a US Person, but she wouldn't.

LOL

Anchor blastocysts!

474 wrenchwench  Sat, Oct 1, 2011 9:59:03am

My favorite sister-in-law, the [otherwise] most reasonable person in the world, believes in homeopathy.

Arg.

475 jaunte  Sat, Oct 1, 2011 9:59:20am

Commentary: No place for science in GOP presidential field

“Why do we still have apes if we came from them?”

476 Daniel Ballard  Sat, Oct 1, 2011 9:59:29am

re: #456 Targetpractice, Worst of Both Worlds

Yeah, that's the other angle. "We believe in personal liberty, so that clump of cells is legally a person now!"

Did you see the story about the pregnant woman that contested a ticket for solo driving in the HOV lane? She lost the case but the Judge loved her. She had adroitly pointed out that in California if you murder a pregnant woman, it's a double murder.

Now my opinion happens to be it is a living human being at conception, but that has no impact on a woman's right to choose. She has the ultimate right to continue or terminate.

I really upset the right to lifers with that. But I do point out we give life and death decision rights in our culture where apropriate.

477 Kronocide  Sat, Oct 1, 2011 10:00:54am

re: #470 Sergey Romanov

An illustration of what Gus wrote above. Nobody's perfect. I have my own gripes with some of what, say, Randi wrote, but I will always appreciate his overall work.

True. I'm listening to the Podcast and am well past Mooney bringing up the 'what do we do about it' question. He has what he thinks is a reasonable position (wait and see), and stated that from what he recently read, Greenland's ice will take a 1000 years to melt.

The issue with this is (and to a greater degree, with Lomborg), where did you read this? My take on Lomborg was his questionable data and cherry picking in coming to his assessment of wait and see, it's not worth the effort/$.

Not to mention, if they are wrong, waiting too long can screw us.

478 Gus  Sat, Oct 1, 2011 10:01:22am

re: #475 jaunte

Commentary: No place for science in GOP presidential field

“Why do we still have apes if we came from them?”

Fascinating.

479 Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton  Sat, Oct 1, 2011 10:01:46am

re: #474 wrenchwench

My favorite sister-in-law, the [otherwise] most reasonable person in the world, believes in homeopathy.

Arg.

Does she use the "placebo doesn't work on animals" argument?

480 (I Stand By What I Said Whatever It Was)  Sat, Oct 1, 2011 10:01:57am

re: #474 wrenchwench

My favorite sister-in-law, the [otherwise] most reasonable person in the world, believes in homeopathy.

Arg.

Speaking from personal experience: Doesn't matter much as long as she also believes in medicine.

481 wrenchwench  Sat, Oct 1, 2011 10:03:50am

re: #476 Rightwingconspirator

Did you see the story about the pregnant woman that contested a ticket for solo driving in the HOV lane? She lost the case but the Judge loved her. She had adroitly pointed out that in California if you murder a pregnant woman, it's a double murder.

Now my opinion happens to be it is a living human being at conception, but that has no impact on a woman's right to choose. She has the ultimate right to continue or terminate.

I really upset the right to lifers with that. But I do point out we give life and death decision rights in our culture where apropriate.

I don't believe it is a person, but it is a potential person (after implantation only), and I agree that the woman has the right to do away with it, no matter what you call it. Self-defense, and control of one's own body.

Calling it a human being before implantation is too far. 50% of fertilized eggs become part of a period. It's crazy (IMHO) to even think of them as human beings.

482 Kronocide  Sat, Oct 1, 2011 10:04:59am

re: #475 jaunte

Commentary: No place for science in GOP presidential field

“Why do we still have apes if we came from them?”

Why do you still have a mother if you came from her?

483 Gus  Sat, Oct 1, 2011 10:05:17am

Fascinating.

484 wrenchwench  Sat, Oct 1, 2011 10:05:48am

re: #479 Sergey Romanov

Does she use the "placebo doesn't work on animals" argument?

Her daughter told me she says homeopathy works best on animals and children. That's pretty close, I guess. She's in Germany, so I don't get many heart-to-hearts with her, and wouldn't use one to discuss something we aren't going to agree on.

485 Gus  Sat, Oct 1, 2011 10:06:01am

Ugh. Laptop. Getting. Bogged. Down. Must. Find. Way. To stop. Bogged down. Feeling.

486 Gretchen G.Tiger  Sat, Oct 1, 2011 10:06:08am

Just heard from breeder/handler via txt. Bother Puppy earned 3 points in today's show. Which means he'll probably get his title before I go broke.

487 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Sat, Oct 1, 2011 10:06:41am

re: #485 Gus 802

"He's dead Jim. You get his laptop; I'll get his wallet."

488 Gretchen G.Tiger  Sat, Oct 1, 2011 10:07:05am

re: #473 jaunte

Anchor blastocysts!

Perfect --nomination for Rotating Title!

489 OhCrapIHaveACrushOnSarahPalin  Sat, Oct 1, 2011 10:07:05am

Unless it survived and became an actually-born person. At which point it would be as subhuman and subject to abuse as she.

States rights mentality.
-re: #459 ggt

I'd just love to see the legal gymnastics of the death of a pregnant undocumented person. Her fetus would have status as a US Person, but she wouldn't.

LOL

490 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Sat, Oct 1, 2011 10:07:22am

"And that’s what the purpose of government is, to do the things that we have to do together that we can’t do on our own.”

“If we can make that choice credible,” he added, “then our candidates — starting with the president — and our principles will be fine.”

-William Jefferson Clinton

491 Gus  Sat, Oct 1, 2011 10:07:40am

re: #487 Fat Bastard Vegetarian

"He's dead Jim. You get his laptop; I'll get his wallet."

I'll take the alien lady with the yellow dress, gold skin, and go-go boots.

//

492 Daniel Ballard  Sat, Oct 1, 2011 10:07:56am

re: #471 Gus 802

And remember! If you don't use a Nikon lens...

//

LOL
Camera Support usually mounts PL (huge money, huge diameter movie camera) lenses on DSLRs. They had to hunt for some parts to fit my best lens into the setup. I was looking around their shop and I felt like such a poser. These folks have the big cranes and motorized camera dollies that filled a small warehouse. Lots to learn in making a short SciFi film. Fun and a healthy brain strain.

493 wrenchwench  Sat, Oct 1, 2011 10:07:57am

re: #480 000G

Speaking from personal experience: Doesn't matter much as long as she also believes in medicine.

That she does. She just got out of the hospital. She's healing rapidly, which she said "might have been aided by the homeopathic remedies I've been taking".

494 Targetpractice  Sat, Oct 1, 2011 10:09:01am

re: #476 Rightwingconspirator

Did you see the story about the pregnant woman that contested a ticket for solo driving in the HOV lane? She lost the case but the Judge loved her. She had adroitly pointed out that in California if you murder a pregnant woman, it's a double murder.

Now my opinion happens to be it is a living human being at conception, but that has no impact on a woman's right to choose. She has the ultimate right to continue or terminate.

I really upset the right to lifers with that. But I do point out we give life and death decision rights in our culture where apropriate.

And that's why I ultimately walked away from libertarianism, as too many of those who profess to believe in it and in "personal freedom" do so conditionally.

495 Gretchen G.Tiger  Sat, Oct 1, 2011 10:09:20am

re: #493 wrenchwench

That she does. She just got out of the hospital. She's healing rapidly, which she said "might have been aided by the homeopathic remedies I've been taking".

Self-fulfilling prophecy is a powerful tool!

496 Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton  Sat, Oct 1, 2011 10:10:19am

Another urban legend + unscientific nonsense is the widespread belief among professional breeders (at least in Russia) in telegony.

497 OhCrapIHaveACrushOnSarahPalin  Sat, Oct 1, 2011 10:10:27am

Eh, it never takes much to upset that bunch. Usually, simply existing outside their narrow, myopic way of life can do the trick.

re: #476 Rightwingconspirator

Did you see the story about the pregnant woman that contested a ticket for solo driving in the HOV lane? She lost the case but the Judge loved her. She had adroitly pointed out that in California if you murder a pregnant woman, it's a double murder.

Now my opinion happens to be it is a living human being at conception, but that has no impact on a woman's right to choose. She has the ultimate right to continue or terminate.

I really upset the right to lifers with that. But I do point out we give life and death decision rights in our culture where apropriate.

498 wrenchwench  Sat, Oct 1, 2011 10:10:50am

I should retract the "favorite" part.

1.) it's not particularly nice to play favorites.

2.) my newest sister-in-law is going to provide me a niece or nephew in a couple of months!

499 Gretchen G.Tiger  Sat, Oct 1, 2011 10:11:17am

re: #498 wrenchwench

I should retract the "favorite" part.

1.) it's not particularly nice to play favorites.

2.) my newest sister-in-law is going to provide me a niece or nephew in a couple of months!

Very cool!

Are you going to spoil it rotten?

500 Killgore Trout  Sat, Oct 1, 2011 10:12:13am

Glenn Beck's wet dream....

[Link: www.daylife.com...]

League for the Fourth International

The League for the Fourth International (LFI) is a Trotskyist international organisation, whose most noteworthy section is the Internationalist Group/Grupo Internacionalista in the United States. It has other affiliates in Mexico, Brazil and France. All of these are very small and based in at most one or two cities.[1][2] Like other international Trotskyist groups, it fights for "international socialist revolution, the conquest of power by the working class, led by its Leninist party."

501 Gus  Sat, Oct 1, 2011 10:12:24am

re: #496 Sergey Romanov

Another urban legend + unscientific nonsense is the widespread belief among professional breeders (at least in Russia) in telegony.

Nothing that can't be cured with a good regime of touch therapy.

//

502 wrenchwench  Sat, Oct 1, 2011 10:12:53am

re: #499 ggt

Very cool!

Are you going to spoil it rotten?

From a distance. :(

They're in Colombia.

503 Daniel Ballard  Sat, Oct 1, 2011 10:13:26am

re: #481 wrenchwench

I don't believe it is a person, but it is a potential person (after implantation only), and I agree that the woman has the right to do away with it, no matter what you call it. Self-defense, and control of one's own body.

Calling it a human being before implantation is too far. 50% of fertilized eggs become part of a period. It's crazy (IMHO) to even think of them as human beings.

I can easily agree with that.

504 Gus  Sat, Oct 1, 2011 10:13:29am

Clearly you're coming down with polio so I'm going to prescribe you a magnetic bracelet.

//

505 jaunte  Sat, Oct 1, 2011 10:13:56am

Political pastors plan to taunt the IRS this Sunday...

This weekend, hundreds of pastors, including some of the nation’s evangelical leaders, will climb into their pulpits to preach about American politics, flouting a decades-old law that prohibits tax-exempt churches and other charities from campaigning on election issues.
.....snip.....
Participating ministers plan to send tapes of their sermons to the I.R.S., effectively providing the agency with evidence it could use to take them [Link: www.nytimes.com...]

506 wrenchwench  Sat, Oct 1, 2011 10:15:18am

Gotta fix a bike. Then comment on ggt's Page from yesterday. (You should put your Pages link in your nic for ease of access!)

507 b_sharp  Sat, Oct 1, 2011 10:15:38am

re: #496 Sergey Romanov

Another urban legend + unscientific nonsense is the widespread belief among professional breeders (at least in Russia) in telegony.

What the hell is telegony?

508 Gus  Sat, Oct 1, 2011 10:16:15am

re: #507 b_sharp

What the hell is telegony?

[Link: en.wikipedia.org...]

509 Killgore Trout  Sat, Oct 1, 2011 10:16:36am

Andrew Breitbart gives talk at Nixon Library

Youtube Video

It's about an hour long, I skimmed through some of it, just the usual stupid nonsense. Nothing terribly interesting but I only made it about half way through.

510 Targetpractice  Sat, Oct 1, 2011 10:16:51am

re: #504 Gus 802

Clearly you're coming down with polio so I'm going to prescribe you a magnetic bracelet.

//

Here, keep this packet of potpourri under your nose at all times, and that shall keep foul agents from inflicting you with the plague. But, should you contract it, we shall drain it from you via leeches.

//

511 (I Stand By What I Said Whatever It Was)  Sat, Oct 1, 2011 10:17:37am

re: #484 wrenchwench

Her daughter told me she says homeopathy works best on animals and children. That's pretty close, I guess. She's in Germany, so I don't get many heart-to-hearts with her, and wouldn't use one to discuss something we aren't going to agree on.

Ah, Germany. I believe homoeopathic remedies are covered by some public health insurance companies here. The skeptics hate it. "Tax dollars for magic sugar pills!"

Anyhow, 's kinda like religion. Why argue about people's personal faith when it doesn't interfer with other stuff?

512 allegro  Sat, Oct 1, 2011 10:18:09am

re: #505 jaunte

Political pastors plan to taunt the IRS this Sunday...

I cannot count the many ways I hope this bites them in their evangelical asses. Not holding my breath though.

513 Gretchen G.Tiger  Sat, Oct 1, 2011 10:18:14am
"People close to the campaign, who spoke on condition of anonymity, said Mrs. Bachmann is often influenced by the last person she speaks with on an issue rather than maintaining discipline in communicating a message."

ahahahahahahaha!

514 Gus  Sat, Oct 1, 2011 10:19:12am

re: #510 Targetpractice, Worst of Both Worlds

Here, keep this packet of potpourri under your nose at all times, and that shall keep foul agents from inflicting you with the plague. But, should you contract it, we shall drain it from you via leeches.

//

And if that doesn't work there's always trepanning. We can do that as an outpatient procedure.

//Image: black-and-decker1.jpg

515 Gretchen G.Tiger  Sat, Oct 1, 2011 10:19:23am

re: #506 wrenchwench

Gotta fix a bike. Then comment on ggt's Page from yesterday. (You should put your Pages link in your nic for ease of access!)

So, HOW do I do that?

516 Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton  Sat, Oct 1, 2011 10:20:07am

re: #511 000G

When they use homeopathy on their kids instead of medicine, it interferes with other stuff.

517 Daniel Ballard  Sat, Oct 1, 2011 10:20:27am

re: #513 ggt

ahahahahahahaha!

""BTW, all of my Bachmann Pages are now filed under “Wierd”, not “Poltiics”"

LOL. That or humor.

518 Gretchen G.Tiger  Sat, Oct 1, 2011 10:21:04am

re: #517 Rightwingconspirator

""BTW, all of my Bachmann Pages are now filed under “Wierd”, not “Poltiics”"

LOL. That or humor.

WEll, Charles doesn't offer a "Bat-Shit Crazy" category . . .

519 Gus  Sat, Oct 1, 2011 10:21:12am

re: #516 Sergey Romanov

When they use homeopathy on their kids instead of medicine, it interferes with other stuff.

Like breathing. Organ function. Etc.

//

520 Targetpractice  Sat, Oct 1, 2011 10:22:23am

re: #514 Gus 802

And if that doesn't work there's always trepanning. We can do that as an outpatient procedure.

//Image: black-and-decker1.jpg

Hey, I hear lobotomies are making a comeback. Seems they're a requirement of joining the Tea Party.

//

521 Gus  Sat, Oct 1, 2011 10:23:31am

re: #520 Targetpractice, Worst of Both Worlds

Hey, I hear lobotomies are making a comeback. Seems they're a requirement of joining the Tea Party.

//

Plus you can have it done at your local tattoo and piercing shop.

//

522 bratwurst  Sat, Oct 1, 2011 10:23:48am

re: #508 Gus 802

[Link: en.wikipedia.org...]

Good grief! That is one of the dumbest theories I have ever encountered.

523 Gus  Sat, Oct 1, 2011 10:24:35am

Yes. I'll take this tattoo pattern and a 3/8ths inch diameter trepanning hole right below my left temple.

To go please.

//

524 Gretchen G.Tiger  Sat, Oct 1, 2011 10:25:20am

re: #521 Gus 802

Plus you can have it done at your local tattoo and piercing shop.

//

They can do it by going up thru the nose --no messy surgery, or anesthesia --just a large dose of demerol.

Obviously much safer that way.

/gross

525 Gus  Sat, Oct 1, 2011 10:26:34am

Gluten free ink.

//

526 b_sharp  Sat, Oct 1, 2011 10:27:30am

Talk about hot conversations on LGF - last conversation I had with Obdicut caused some interesting changes in my computing environment.

My last comment took almost forever, not because I had to think about it,that's something I just don't do, but because each keystroke took minutes just to show up on the screen. Immediately after I pushed the 'Post This Comment' button my laptop decided to get really stubborn and shut down on me.

I flipped the damned thing over, popped off the back cover and cooked my supper on the hard drive. Great meal, but the steak was unevenly done, and I hate that.

Since then I've been trying to cobble up a heatpipe heatsink for the back of the drive. No success yet, but I can smell the millions of dollars I'll make from the idea just around the corner.

527 Gus  Sat, Oct 1, 2011 10:28:05am

re: #524 ggt

They can do it by going up thru the nose --no messy surgery, or anesthesia --just a large dose of demerol.

Obviously much safer that way.

/gross

What!? No homeopathic Demerol™ substitute?

528 b_sharp  Sat, Oct 1, 2011 10:29:22am

re: #508 Gus 802

[Link: en.wikipedia.org...]

Oh, my banana shaped brainpan, how silly can they get?

529 Gus  Sat, Oct 1, 2011 10:30:08am

re: #528 b_sharp

Oh, my banana shaped brainpan, how silly can they get?

Is that a urethra coming out of the side of your head?

//

530 (I Stand By What I Said Whatever It Was)  Sat, Oct 1, 2011 10:30:14am

re: #516 Sergey Romanov

When they use homeopathy on their kids instead of medicine, it interferes with other stuff.

That's why I said: "Doesn't matter much as long as she also believes in medicine." further up.

People can believe in super-crazy, atavistic shit and still make rational use of high-end technology. Case in point: Nuclear Iran.

531 Gretchen G.Tiger  Sat, Oct 1, 2011 10:31:24am

re: #527 Gus 802

What!? No homeopathic Demerol™ substitute?

No, there is NO SUBSITUTE!

532 b_sharp  Sat, Oct 1, 2011 10:31:32am

re: #514 Gus 802

And if that doesn't work there's always trepanning. We can do that as an outpatient procedure.

//Image: black-and-decker1.jpg

I'm working on a DIY home kit for that. It'll make me rich.

Everyone needs another hole in his head.

533 Gretchen G.Tiger  Sat, Oct 1, 2011 10:32:13am

re: #532 b_sharp

I'm working on a DIY home kit for that. It'll make me rich.

Everyone needs another hole in his head.

Well, maybe Gus.

:0

534 Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton  Sat, Oct 1, 2011 10:32:55am

re: #530 000G

That's why I said: "Doesn't matter much as long as she also believes in medicine." further up.

Sure. But she may also infect others with belief in homeopathy, without guarantee of belief in medicine. So I doubt the non-interference approach.

535 Gus  Sat, Oct 1, 2011 10:33:12am

re: #533 ggt

Well, maybe Gus.

:0

Just for that I'm going to run around screaming like Richard Simmons.

//

536 Gretchen G.Tiger  Sat, Oct 1, 2011 10:33:22am

Hubby wants the family to work together to clean the house today.

I don't see the point, we worked independently to make it messy. It will just get messy again.

537 Gretchen G.Tiger  Sat, Oct 1, 2011 10:35:02am

As I understand it, homeopathic remedies just aren't water. They put some other shit in them --read the labels at your local drug store.

What can that other shit do?

Immaginit.

Snake Oil without the benefits of the oil.

538 Gus  Sat, Oct 1, 2011 10:35:36am

re: #532 b_sharp

I'm working on a DIY home kit for that. It'll make me rich.

Everyone needs another hole in his head.

Order now and get this free astrological chart.

Yours free just for ordering now!

//

539 Gretchen G.Tiger  Sat, Oct 1, 2011 10:36:36am

Is wrenchwrench the only one who tried to read my menapause Page?

Really, it should be required reading. IMHO.

I'm disappointed in you Lizards!

/

540 (I Stand By What I Said Whatever It Was)  Sat, Oct 1, 2011 10:36:45am

re: #534 Sergey Romanov

Sure. But she may also infect others with belief in homeopathy, without guarantee of belief in medicine. So I doubt the non-interference approach.

Again with the biologistic use of metaphors.

*sigh*

Yes, and skeptics being scientismic jerks about science may deter otherwise interested people.

///

541 Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton  Sat, Oct 1, 2011 10:37:23am

re: #540 000G

A non-response. *shrug*

542 Gretchen G.Tiger  Sat, Oct 1, 2011 10:37:30am

This is my new mental image of Michelle Bachmann.

543 (I Stand By What I Said Whatever It Was)  Sat, Oct 1, 2011 10:37:53am

re: #541 Sergey Romanov

A non-response. *shrug*

It's a perfect response to your completely hypothetical scenario.

544 Gus  Sat, Oct 1, 2011 10:39:21am

BIAB or so. Gotta clear up the pipes on this connection.

545 b_sharp  Sat, Oct 1, 2011 10:46:20am

re: #538 Gus 802

Order now and get this free astrological chart.

Yours free just for ordering now!

//

I'm having trouble finding a source for rubber plugs of the right size. Maybe I should just include drainage pans to collect the grey matter as it leaks out.

546 b_sharp  Sat, Oct 1, 2011 10:48:26am

Time to shut down the laptop so it can cool off.
I'll be back tomorrow.

547 Gretchen G.Tiger  Sat, Oct 1, 2011 10:50:01am

re: #546 b_sharp

Time to shut down the laptop so it can cool off.
I'll be back tomorrow.

How are you going to cook if it cools off?

548 wrenchwench  Sat, Oct 1, 2011 11:07:33am

re: #515 ggt

So, HOW do I do that?

Find the URL for your Pages (all of 'em, not just one).

Go to your Account settings (link is in the "logged in" box)

Put the URL in the "Home page" box.

Save changes.

Thanks!

549 makeitstop  Sat, Oct 1, 2011 12:39:07pm

re: #542 ggt

This is my new mental image of Michelle Bachmann.

Aw, Heidi died? That makes me sad. Her FB posts were hilarious - the 'Hey guys' bit never failed to crack me up.

And, how is every little thing in Lizard Kingdom today?

550 (I Stand By What I Said Whatever It Was)  Sun, Oct 2, 2011 7:28:03am

re: #543 000G

It's a perfect response to your completely hypothetical scenario.

Expanding on this: The fear expressed in 534 is as irrational as people fearing that teaching about evolution might lead to eugenics.


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