Glenn Greenwald Strikes Fear Into the Heart of Washington

Moo ha ha
Weird • Views: 29,038

An interesting and revealing quote from the always effervescent Glenn Greenwald, in this New Yorker article about the larger issue of the Guardian’s efforts to stay afloat in the new media sea.

“I wanted people in Washington to have fear in their hearts over how this journalism was going to be done, over the unpredictability of it,” he said. “Of the fact that we were going to be completely unrestrained by the unwritten rules of American journalism.

The only reason we stopped after five days was that even our allies were saying, ‘Look, this is too much information. We can’t keep up with what you’re publishing.’ “

Jump to bottom

396 comments
1 Jayleia  Sat, Oct 5, 2013 6:10:45pm

Unrestrained by rules like “accuracy”?

2 darthstar  Sat, Oct 5, 2013 6:10:51pm

People don’t fear the creeper,
Not when Obama’s smiting Al Shabab
Don’t fear the creeper
He’s just a activist
Don’t fear the creeper
Just a fuckin’ blogger
Don’t fear the creeper
Not a real journalist
Don’t fear the creeper
He’s just Putin’s Biiiiiiiiitch..
Laaaa, la, la la, la la la daaaaa…

3 FemNaziBitch  Sat, Oct 5, 2013 6:12:18pm

Does anyone have any recommendations for a Unit Converter iPhone app?

Yes, I’m being a busy bee tonite.

4 A Mom Anon  Sat, Oct 5, 2013 6:15:18pm

For some reason, whenever I see “moo ha ha” written out I laugh.

Greenwald? Greenhorn? Who is that? I seem to sort of remember that name…Greenspan? No, Greenjeans, no that’s not it, Green Beans? Nah..and now I’m bored. (seriously though, for someone who is supposed to be so smart, he’s pretty much an idiot)

5 Charles Johnson  Sat, Oct 5, 2013 6:16:10pm

If you read the whole thing, Greenwald’s recent pissiness with the Guardian starts to make sense.

The Guardian did seek comment from government officials about the revelations. But Greenwald, outraged by the content of the material, pushed to publish quickly. “I was getting really frustrated,” he told me. “I was putting a lot of pressure on them and insinuating that I was going to go publish elsewhere.

6 FemNaziBitch  Sat, Oct 5, 2013 6:17:15pm

re: #5 Charles Johnson

If you read the whole thing, Greenwald’s recent pissiness with the Guardian starts to make sense.

ah!

7 Decatur Deb  Sat, Oct 5, 2013 6:17:55pm

re: #3 FemNaziBitch

Does anyone have any recommendations for a Unit Converter iPhone app?

Yes, I’m being a busy bee tonite.

Hey.. I’ve got one of those ‘app’ things now. It’s on Wife’s iPad—turns it into a $400 carpenter’s level.

8 darthstar  Sat, Oct 5, 2013 6:18:19pm

re: #5 Charles Johnson

If you read the whole thing, Greenwald’s recent pissiness with the Guardian starts to make sense.

By “elsewhere” I assume Greenwald meant Twitter and/or Breitbart. No other “respectable” organizations would publish him.

9 Charles Johnson  Sat, Oct 5, 2013 6:18:21pm

In other words he was being an asshole to his employers, because he thought he had the upper hand.

10 jaunte  Sat, Oct 5, 2013 6:18:25pm
Keller questioned the “lionizing tone” of the Guardian’s coverage. “When Snowden then threw himself into the arms of the Chinese, and then the Russians, and reportedly reached out to Ecuador—all these countries that are not exactly pillars of freedom—it compromised the Guardian a little bit,” Keller said.

Ya think?

Greenwald believes there was no way that Snowden could have stayed in the U.S. and taken his case to the public, as Ellsberg did. These days, he says, whistle-blowers are immediately incarcerated: “They have no opportunity to be heard from.”*

*Cite?

11 Kragar  Sat, Oct 5, 2013 6:21:34pm

Greenwald, the Boy who Cried Derp.

12 b.d.  Sat, Oct 5, 2013 6:22:27pm
“If one of our columnists had come up with a story of that magnitude—something that could not be contained in a column—we would have turned it over to the newsroom reporting staff,” Keller said [Former Executive Editor of the New York Times

And he would have been right.

13 jaunte  Sat, Oct 5, 2013 6:22:53pm

All the whistle-blowers are in prison, that’s why we haven’t heard from them.
— Hysteron Proteron.

14 b.d.  Sat, Oct 5, 2013 6:24:22pm

re: #9 Charles Johnson

In other words he was being an asshole to his employers, because he thought he had the upper hand.

Ready to throw the people who pay him money, The Guardian, under the bus because they wouldn’t do what he wanted right now!

15 bratwurst  Sat, Oct 5, 2013 6:26:10pm

Wow, even more evidence that this whole affair has been nothing but a vehicle for Greenwald’s self-aggrandizement. Who could have guessed he is not a team player? ///

16 Vicious Babushka  Sat, Oct 5, 2013 6:27:16pm

Is he still calling the shit he does “journalism”?

Youtube Video

17 darthstar  Sat, Oct 5, 2013 6:27:22pm

re: #9 Charles Johnson

In other words he was being an asshole to his employers, because he thought he had the upper hand.

Anybody who’s held a job for a while will tell you…don’t fucking think you own your employer…you don’t.

18 Killgore Trout  Sat, Oct 5, 2013 6:28:45pm

So much for the “you can keep your doctor” thing…
kff.org

If your current plan continues to offer coverage next year, you may be able to remain in that plan. However, you would not be eligible for tax credits for that coverage.

It seems that if you buy your own insurance you have to cancel your plan and sign up for a new one to get the low income tax credit. Seems like an odd rule. Pain in my ass.

19 darthstar  Sat, Oct 5, 2013 6:30:02pm

Stop! Stop! You’re publishing too much VALUABLE information for us to keep up with…you’re like an enormous organ spurting new information faster than our readers can digest it!!! You’re so awesome, Glenn…please, please, PLEASE, for the love of god don’t give us any more information until we’re ready and worthy of receiving it!!11ty!!!

Yeah….right.

20 goddamnedfrank  Sat, Oct 5, 2013 6:30:24pm

Real journalists aren’t at all motivated by how much fear they can generate.

21 darthstar  Sat, Oct 5, 2013 6:31:17pm

re: #18 Killgore Trout

So much for the “you can keep your doctor” thing…
kff.org

It seems that if you buy your own insurance you have to cancel your plan and sign up for a new one to get the low income tax credit. Seems like an odd rule. Pain in my ass.

Fuck it…you’d might as well eat some rancid beef with a bloated can of fruit cocktail and take your chances.

22 b.d.  Sat, Oct 5, 2013 6:32:03pm

re: #19 darthstar

Stop! Stop! You’re publishing too much VALUABLE information for us to keep up with…you’re like an enormous organ spurting new information faster than our readers can digest it!!! You’re so awesome, Glenn…please, please, PLEASE, for the love of god don’t give us any more information until we’re ready and worthy of receiving it!!11ty!!!

Yeah….right.

yep. Glenn churns out quality sh*t faster than Stephen King, people are begging him to slow down so they can catch up.
//

23 Jay in Oregon  Sat, Oct 5, 2013 6:32:06pm

re: #3 FemNaziBitch

The one I use is called Convert, and it just received an update after over a year. Fixed some glitches with iOS7, supports newer devices, and is only 99 cents.

itunes.apple.com

24 AlexRogan  Sat, Oct 5, 2013 6:34:02pm

re: #19 darthstar

Stop! Stop! You’re publishing too much VALUABLE information for us to keep up with…you’re like an enormous organ spurting new information faster than our readers can digest it!!! You’re so awesome, Glenn…please, please, PLEASE, for the love of god don’t give us any more information until we’re ready and worthy of receiving it!!11ty!!!

Yeah….right.

Glenn Greenwald: the money shot artist of modern journalism.

///

25 jaunte  Sat, Oct 5, 2013 6:34:29pm

Greenwald! What is best in life?

“To crush your enemies, see them driven with fear in their hearts before you, and to hear the lamentation of their women. “

26 Decatur Deb  Sat, Oct 5, 2013 6:35:13pm

re: #18 Killgore Trout

So much for the “you can keep your doctor” thing…
kff.org

It seems that if you buy your own insurance you have to cancel your plan and sign up for a new one to get the low income tax credit. Seems like an odd rule. Pain in my ass.

Makes no never-mind if your doc is approved by the new insurer. Many eligible for the Premium Tax Credit are not insured at all—that’s the target group. Daughter2 is balancing the change from her private plan to an ACA provider, but will not get much or any credit—too highly paid. Highly paid is better.

27 Killgore Trout  Sat, Oct 5, 2013 6:35:38pm

re: #21 darthstar

Fuck it…you’d might as well eat some rancid beef with a bloated can of fruit cocktail and take your chances.

This guy on the Dkos rec list has the same problem.
It’s official: I cannot keep my doctor with the ACA

28 b.d.  Sat, Oct 5, 2013 6:36:48pm

re: #19 darthstar

Greenwald’s stuff really should be published on stone tablets rather that in a manipulable newspaper.

Granite.

29 A Mom Anon  Sat, Oct 5, 2013 6:38:03pm

re: #18 Killgore Trout

Most doctors take more than one insurance company’s policies. You may have to change companies, but not doctors. We’ve been through 5, yes 5 different companies in the last 6 yrs and we still have the same family doc, my husband’s endocrinologist and cardiologist are the same. Call your doctor and ask them what insurance companies they’re in network with.

30 Charles Johnson  Sat, Oct 5, 2013 6:38:03pm
31 Decatur Deb  Sat, Oct 5, 2013 6:38:13pm

re: #27 Killgore Trout

This guy on the Dkos rec list has the same problem.
It’s official: I cannot keep my doctor with the ACA

If he has insurance and likes his doc that much, he can keep both. If he wants a cost reduction, that’s the free market.

32 Killgore Trout  Sat, Oct 5, 2013 6:40:53pm

re: #26 Decatur Deb

Makes no never-mind if your doc is approved by the new insurer. Many eligible for the Premium Tax Credit are not insured at all—that’s the target group. Daughter2 is balancing the change from her private plan to an ACA provider, but will not get much or any credit—too highly paid. Highly paid is better.

I thought about that. I think I’ll start off calling my insurance company and hope I can go through the formality of buying through the exchange while keeping my same coverage. Buying your own insurance is massively complicated, these plans are huge and mind boggling complicated. I wouldn’t mind having to change eventually, I don’t really like my insurer but I’d like the time to figure this out. I’ve had some health issues lately so I really can’t risk getting a new plan that may or may not be able to help me.

33 Killgore Trout  Sat, Oct 5, 2013 6:42:42pm

re: #29 A Mom Anon

Most doctors take more than one insurance company’s policies. You may have to change companies, but not doctors. We’ve been through 5, yes 5 different companies in the last 6 yrs and we still have the same family doc, my husband’s endocrinologist and cardiologist are the same. Call your doctor and ask them what insurance companies they’re in network with.

I have Kaiser which is an HMO, I don’t think they accept patients with other coverage.

34 Decatur Deb  Sat, Oct 5, 2013 6:43:24pm

re: #32 Killgore Trout

I thought about that. I think I’ll start off calling my insurance company and hope I can go through the formality of buying through the exchange while keeping my same coverage. Buying your own insurance is massively complicated, these plans are huge and mind boggling complicated. I wouldn’t mind having to change eventually, I don’t really like my insurer but I’d like the time to figure this out. I’ve had some health issues lately so I really can’t risk getting a new plan that may or may not be able to help me.

You’ll have till Mar to mull it over this year, and an open season of a few months each year to make a change. The whole of health insurance is very complicated, and I wondered about people with insurance who changed on the first day. Only massive savings could justify that.

35 goddamnedfrank  Sat, Oct 5, 2013 6:44:25pm

re: #18 Killgore Trout

So much for the “you can keep your doctor” thing…
kff.org

It seems that if you buy your own insurance you have to cancel your plan and sign up for a new one to get the low income tax credit. Seems like an odd rule. Pain in my ass.

That has nothing to do with your doctor. You may or may not be able to keep him depending on if he takes your now insurance plan. The old plans not getting tax credits is predicated on their not meeting the new higher standards, such as not having a yearly or lifetime benefit cap. If they did meet these new standards then they are what’s called “conforming” and you could have gotten the tax credit. Here’s why none of them meet that standard -> all previous private individual market plans excluded coverage for pre-existing conditions. So you can continue with them but they can and will still refuse to cover any pre-existing condition they rule you had at the time you signed up with them, and they can make this ruling retroactively.

Basically, if you really want to keep your shitty coverage it’s going to cost you down the road, in more ways than one.

36 Rev_Arthur_Belling  Sat, Oct 5, 2013 6:45:06pm

re: #24 AlexRogan

Glenn Greenwald: the money shot artist of modern journalism.

That was a mental image I could do without.

37 Vicious Babushka  Sat, Oct 5, 2013 6:45:55pm

Idiot wingnuts still spamming this meme across Teh Twitters

38 Decatur Deb  Sat, Oct 5, 2013 6:46:09pm

re: #35 goddamnedfrank

I’d have to check, but I think the whole ‘pre-existing condition’ thing is gone by 1 Jan.

39 PeterWolf  Sat, Oct 5, 2013 6:46:10pm

re: #30 Charles Johnson

[Embedded content]

Oh come on, you give Greenwald much credit for possibly knowing something about actual journalism.

He’s a weasel.

40 A Mom Anon  Sat, Oct 5, 2013 6:46:14pm

re: #32 Killgore Trout

You have until March to sign up. If you need coverage by Jan 1 you have until Dec to get on the exchange. Take your time and compare. Call your doc and see which insurance companies they take. It is complicated but you can also call the 800 number or talk with a navigator to help you. Some of the national pharmacy chains(CVS, Walgreens) were supposed to have people in store to help answer questions too. Don’t make this harder than it is, remember, pre-existing conditions are no longer a reason to deny benefits.

41 goddamnedfrank  Sat, Oct 5, 2013 6:46:52pm

re: #32 Killgore Trout

I thought about that. I think I’ll start off calling my insurance company and hope I can go through the formality of buying through the exchange while keeping my same coverage. Buying your own insurance is massively complicated, these plans are huge and mind boggling complicated. I wouldn’t mind having to change eventually, I don’t really like my insurer but I’d like the time to figure this out. I’ve had some health issues lately so I really can’t risk getting a new plan that may or may not be able to help me.

You really don’t understand how this works. Your old plan is the one that can continue discriminating against you. Any new plan you buy into with coverage starting in 2014 can’t consider your pre-exisiting conditions to determine either rates or coverage.

42 Absalom, Absalom, Obdicut  Sat, Oct 5, 2013 6:47:01pm

re: #18 Killgore Trout

So much for the “you can keep your doctor” thing…
kff.org

It seems that if you buy your own insurance you have to cancel your plan and sign up for a new one to get the low income tax credit. Seems like an odd rule. Pain in my ass.

How does that equate to ‘you can keep your doctor’ being untrue? You’re making absolutely no sense.

43 goddamnedfrank  Sat, Oct 5, 2013 6:50:07pm

re: #38 Decatur Deb

I’d have to check, but I think the whole ‘pre-existing condition’ thing is gone by 1 Jan.

No, it’s not. The only plans that are allowed to continue discriminating against people with pre-existing conditions are the one with grandfathered in contracts. If you have high blood pressure now and your health insurance company won’t cover any complications from that, it’s allowed to continue denying you coverage after 2014. Only new contracts are affected by the law.

That’s the reason that old plans, across the board, are non-conforming.

44 Decatur Deb  Sat, Oct 5, 2013 6:50:33pm

re: #33 Killgore Trout

I have Kaiser which is an HMO, I don’t think they accept patients with other coverage.

Yeah— the HMOs are the most restrictive way to go, usually it’s justified by very competitive rates, though. The whole notion of ‘continuity of care’ is fading in the face of the extreme mobility of Americans. ‘Continuity of records’ is becoming more important with computerization.

45 Killgore Trout  Sat, Oct 5, 2013 6:50:38pm

re: #38 Decatur Deb

I’d have to check, but I think the whole ‘pre-existing condition’ thing is gone by 1 Jan.

Yeah, it’s gone

46 Zamb  Sat, Oct 5, 2013 6:52:19pm

re: #37 Vicious Babushka

They have some really messed up views about oppression and what it actually is. Any small amount of government power = totalitarianism, any restriction on what they may do = banning their beliefs outright. They live in some weird world of absolutes where any government power will lead to the absolute worst possibilities, to many there appears to be no middle ground.

47 A Mom Anon  Sat, Oct 5, 2013 6:54:39pm

re: #33 Killgore Trout

Those doctors don’t just contract with one insurance company. I’ve never seen a doctor do that, and trust me, my spouse has been to the hospital and various doctors more times in the last 5-6 years than I care to count at the moment. 3 angioplasties, type 2 diabetes, high cholesterol, high blood pressure, and that’s just the short list. He’s never had to change doctors to stay in network, including with an HMO. We’ve been through several job losses and insurance changes and he’s never had to change doctors, just insurance carriers. United Health, Aetna, Blue Cross, Humana, no doctor changes.

48 Decatur Deb  Sat, Oct 5, 2013 6:54:40pm

re: #43 goddamnedfrank

No, it’s not. The only plans that are allowed to continue discriminating against people with pre-existing conditions are the one with grandfathered in contracts. If you have high blood pressure now and your health insurance company won’t cover any complications from that, it’s allowed to continue denying you coverage after 2014. Only new contracts are affected by the law.

That’s the reason that old plans, across the board, are non-conforming.

Here’s WebMD on it. Looks like it goes outlaw even for plans that are not ACA Qualified Health Plans. If old contracts are grandfathered, they will quickly disappear to market forces.

webmd.com

49 Internet Tough Guy  Sat, Oct 5, 2013 6:56:17pm

Yeah, I could have lasted much longer, but my lovers couldn’t handle my huge schlong.

/GG

50 Zamb  Sat, Oct 5, 2013 6:57:11pm

re: #37 Vicious Babushka

Also you know what else is the law of the land now? Women and minorities are now treated as equals under the law to white men. You could use that phrase about a great many things throughout history and many are also good things.

51 Charles Johnson  Sat, Oct 5, 2013 6:58:10pm

To be fair, Bill Keller’s comments in this article are also pretty damned insufferably elitist.

52 Vicious Babushka  Sat, Oct 5, 2013 6:59:07pm

re: #50 Zamb

Also you know what else is the law of the land now? Women and minorities are now treated as equals under the law to white men. You could use that phrase about a great many things throughout history and many are also good things.

Here’s what some wingnut Tweeted at me about the slavery meme:

53 Killgore Trout  Sat, Oct 5, 2013 7:01:26pm

Interesting. I also have to buy through an insurance agent, not from the insurance company itself. Also the Oregon site doesn’t have online enrolment yet.

54 A Mom Anon  Sat, Oct 5, 2013 7:02:10pm

Nitey nite lizards, we’re gonna watch some movies and chill out.

55 Rev_Arthur_Belling  Sat, Oct 5, 2013 7:02:25pm

re: #51 Charles Johnson

To be fair, Bill Keller’s comments in this article are also pretty damned insufferably elitist.

To be absolutely fair, Bill Keller is generally insufferably elitist, especially when he’s talking about journalism.

56 blueraven  Sat, Oct 5, 2013 7:03:18pm

My husband’s company has changed insurance carriers at least 3 times over the 25 yr period he has worked there.

We have been able to keep the same doctor the entire time. Once, our doctor was out of network but we called him and voila…he was in.

57 goddamnedfrank  Sat, Oct 5, 2013 7:03:52pm

re: #45 Killgore Trout

Yeah, it’s gone

Not for you if you keep your old, shitty plan.

Beginning Sept. 23, 2010, group health plans cannot exclude enrollees (employees, spouses or dependents) under age 19 based on pre-existing conditions. For other plans, all pre-existing condition exclusions must be removed beginning in 2014.

Grandfathered group health plans receive no special protection and must comply once the provision becomes effective with respect to the plan. These rules apply equally to collectively bargained and non-collectively bargained plans.

A special rule applies to individual health insurance coverage. The pre-existing condition rules only apply to non-grandfathered individual health insurance plans.

re: #48 Decatur Deb

Here’s WebMD on it. Looks like it goes outlaw even for plans that are not ACA Qulalified Health Plans. I old contracts are grandfathered, they will quickly disappear to market forces.

webmd.com

Right, like I was saying it only affects new contracts in the individual market. Group plans are automatically updated and must be in compliance. This is the exact reason that old individual market plans don’t qualify for the tax credit, because across the board they all sucked and the law doesn’t force them into compliance. It’s up to the customer to not be a fucking moron, read, understand the law and act in their own best interests.

58 Zamb  Sat, Oct 5, 2013 7:04:33pm

re: #52 Vicious Babushka

Pretty certain pointing out that slavery is different than mandated insurance is a serious point. Not entirely certain how to respond to crazy like that.

59 Rev_Arthur_Belling  Sat, Oct 5, 2013 7:05:37pm

re: #57 goddamnedfrank

It’s up to the customer to not be a fucking moron, read, understand the law and act in their own best interests.

That’s a big supposition, as we are witnessing with this stupid fucking shutdown.

60 Decatur Deb  Sat, Oct 5, 2013 7:06:28pm

re: #53 Killgore Trout

Interesting. I also have to buy through an insurance agent, not from the insurance company itself. Also the Oregon site doesn’t have online enrolment yet.

Some states were having problems letting you set your privacy security questions, don’t know about Oregon. Not the sort of change i would make hastily anyway. If you study the system, you can use a call-in number, mail-in, or in some areas, walk-in. The face-to-face gets you the most useful ‘Navigator’ help. Around here, they are even setting up in public libraries a couple times a week.

61 Decatur Deb  Sat, Oct 5, 2013 7:07:46pm

re: #59 Rev_Arthur_Belling

That’s a big supposition, as we are witnessing with this stupid fucking shutdown.

Brought to us by the Best and Brightest.

62 Killgore Trout  Sat, Oct 5, 2013 7:10:31pm

Ah, checking the Obamacare Oregon site. It seems I can probably buy my current Kaiser plan through the exchange if I want. I think the listed prices include subsidy but i’m not sure.

63 Decatur Deb  Sat, Oct 5, 2013 7:11:04pm

re: #53 Killgore Trout

Interesting. I also have to buy through an insurance agent, not from the insurance company itself. Also the Oregon site doesn’t have online enrolment yet.

Check to see if Kaiser is an Oregon QHP. They’ve actually been big supporters of reform through their foundation.

64 calochortus  Sat, Oct 5, 2013 7:11:15pm

re: #53 Killgore Trout

I don’t know about Oregon, but we use Kaiser in CA, and when they sent information on our rates for 2014, they also included a phone number to call to discuss the various plans available. If you want to stay with Kaiser, I’d suggest you give them a call in a week or two (just to give the call volume a chance to drop a bit.)

65 goddamnedfrank  Sat, Oct 5, 2013 7:12:19pm

I’ll point it out again:

A special rule applies to individual health insurance coverage. The pre-existing condition rules only apply to non-grandfathered individual health insurance plans.

Non-grandfathered, in case it needs to be mentioned, means new contracts. The only reason your old plan doesn’t get the tax credit is that it, by definition, sucked, and will continue to suck after 2014. If the plan administrator decides there’s evidence that your hospitalization / treatment is for a condition you had before the coverage began, they can and will deny you coverage.

66 Decatur Deb  Sat, Oct 5, 2013 7:13:43pm

re: #62 Killgore Trout

Ah, checking the Obamacare Oregon site. It seems I can probably buy my current Kaiser plan through the exchange if I want. I think the listed prices include subsidy but i’m not sure.

Heh—too late on #63. Don’t be surprised if the initial quote is without credits and cost reductions. One of the ACA marketing screwups has been to design the system to show tremendous ‘sticker shock’ quotes that are often radically reduced.

67 Eclectic Cyborg  Sat, Oct 5, 2013 7:16:14pm


Oh, don’t you wish.

68 compound_Idaho  Sat, Oct 5, 2013 7:17:51pm

re: #35 goddamnedfrank

That has nothing to do with your doctor. You may or may not be able to keep him depending on if he takes your now insurance plan. The old plans not getting tax credits is predicated on their not meeting the new higher standards, such as not having a yearly or lifetime benefit cap. If they did meet these new standards then they are what’s called “conforming” and you could have gotten the tax credit. Here’s why none of them meet that standard -> all previous private individual market plans excluded coverage for pre-existing conditions. So you can continue with them but they can and will still refuse to cover any pre-existing condition they rule you had at the time you signed up with them, and they can make this ruling retroactively.

Basically, if you really want to keep your shitty coverage it’s going to cost you down the road, in more ways than one.

I’ll keep my shitty coverage thank you. According to the Kaiser estimating tool, ACA policies have higher deductibles, much higher annual limits, and higher premiums. I’m staying with my grandfathered plan as long as I can. It is a much better policy. Exactly what I need and has served me and my family extremely well over the years. I have the HSA balance to prove it. My choices will be much more limited if I get forced into the current system. Health insurance is not as difficult as you suggest.

69 Varek Raith  Sat, Oct 5, 2013 7:18:36pm

re: #67 Eclectic Cyborg

[Embedded content]


Oh, don’t you wish.

Haha, no.

70 Decatur Deb  Sat, Oct 5, 2013 7:19:17pm

re: #68 compound_Idaho

I’ll keep my shitty coverage thank you. According to the Kaiser estimating tool, ACA policies have higher deductibles, much higher annual limits, and higher premiums. I’m staying with my grandfathered plan as long as I can. It is a much better policy. Exactly what I need and has served me and my family extremely well over the years. I have the HSA balance to prove it. My choices will be much more limited if I get forced into the current system. Health insurance is not as difficult as you suggest.

No one is being forced into Obamacare except by poverty and shitty 3rd world employers.

71 Killgore Trout  Sat, Oct 5, 2013 7:19:47pm

re: #63 Decatur Deb

Check to see if Kaiser is an Oregon QHP. They’ve actually been big supporters of reform through their foundation.

I think they are a qhp, I’m not sure how Kaiser is structured between the Foundation (that does the research) and the insurance wing. The Kaiser Insurance gets the highest “star” ratings on the Obamacare site. Kaiser insurance is technically a non-profit but it’s a big bureaucracy, lots of things they won’t cover and there are always extra charges whenever you use their services.

72 goddamnedfrank  Sat, Oct 5, 2013 7:20:37pm

re: #66 Decatur Deb

Heh—too late on #63. Don’t be surprised if the initial quote is without credits and cost reductions. One of the ACA marketing screwups has been to design the system to show tremendous ‘sticker shock’ quotes that are often radically reduced.

It’s worth mentioning that this problem is primarily being experienced by people who live in states that refused to set up their own exchanges. CoveredCA is well designed and is functioning smoothly, and is serving the most populous state in the Union. The Feds could probably have done better, but they’re trying to cudgel together a system that covers a ton of states, insurance companies, and commissions that have basically behaved in the most immature, recalcitrant manner imaginable.

Basically if you live in a red state right now you’re lucky to have any kind of access to an exchange. Also, if you’re poor and live in most red states, you’re fucked because most red states refused the Medicaid expansion.

73 Killgore Trout  Sat, Oct 5, 2013 7:21:03pm

re: #64 calochortus

I don’t know about Oregon, but we use Kaiser in CA, and when they sent information on our rates for 2014, they also included a phone number to call to discuss the various plans available. If you want to stay with Kaiser, I’d suggest you give them a call in a week or two (just to give the call volume a chance to drop a bit.)

Yeah, that’s probably what I’m going to do.

74 blueraven  Sat, Oct 5, 2013 7:21:32pm

re: #68 compound_Idaho

I’ll keep my shitty coverage thank you. According to the Kaiser estimating tool, ACA policies have higher deductibles, much higher annual limits, and higher premiums. I’m staying with my grandfathered plan as long as I can. It is a much better policy. Exactly what I need and has served me and my family extremely well over the years. I have the HSA balance to prove it. My choices will be much more limited if I get forced into the current system. Health insurance is not as difficult as you suggest.

Good, then keep your plan…Go in peace.

75 Decatur Deb  Sat, Oct 5, 2013 7:23:56pm

re: #72 goddamnedfrank

It’s worth mentioning that this problem is primarily being experienced by people who live in states that refused to set up their own exchanges. CoveredCA is well designed and is functioning smoothly, and is serving the most populous state in the Union. The Feds could probably have done better, but they’re trying to cudgel together a system that covers a ton states, insurance companies, and commissions that have basically behaved in the most immature, recalcitrant manner imaginable.

Basically if you live in a red state right now you’re lucky to have any kind of access to an exchange. Also, if you’re poor and live in most red states, you’re fucked because most red states refused the Medicaid expansion.

Why do you hate my state of residence? Governor Dipshit turned down the Medicaid expansion and we have only 1-2 vendors in our exchange.

76 AlexRogan  Sat, Oct 5, 2013 7:24:38pm

re: #74 blueraven

Good, then keep your plan…Go in peace.

Well, that came off a bit condescending, at least to me.

If compound_Idaho’s current plan works well for them, more power to them; at least there’s more of a choice now.

77 Absalom, Absalom, Obdicut  Sat, Oct 5, 2013 7:26:16pm

re: #76 AlexRogan

How on earth is that condescending?

78 William Barnett-Lewis  Sat, Oct 5, 2013 7:29:23pm

re: #67 Eclectic Cyborg

[Embedded content]


Oh, don’t you wish.

Keep dreaming you anti-christ Bryan. Your stoner buddy, John of Patmos, is rooting for you…

79 William Barnett-Lewis  Sat, Oct 5, 2013 7:30:01pm

re: #70 Decatur Deb

No one is being forced into Obamacare except by poverty and shitty 3rd world employers.

QFT.

80 goddamnedfrank  Sat, Oct 5, 2013 7:32:48pm

re: #68 compound_Idaho

I’ll keep my shitty coverage thank you. According to the Kaiser estimating tool, ACA policies have higher deductibles, much higher annual limits, and higher premiums. I’m staying with my grandfathered plan as long as I can. It is a much better policy. Exactly what I need and has served me and my family extremely well over the years. I have the HSA balance to prove it. My choices will be much more limited if I get forced into the current system. Health insurance is not as difficult as you suggest.

Tell us us the name and cost of the current plan, including inputs for family size, makeup and smoking status on ehealthinsurance.com and then corresponding for Kaiser (Silver or Bronze.) I’m not saying you’re full of shit, but you’re conveniently short on any verifiable details.

81 Dark_Falcon  Sat, Oct 5, 2013 7:34:45pm

re: #9 Charles Johnson

In other words he was being an asshole to his employers, because he thought he had the upper hand.

I think he’s just an asshole period.

82 Killgore Trout  Sat, Oct 5, 2013 7:35:17pm

re: #75 Decatur Deb

Why do you hate my state of residence? Governor Dipshit turned down the Medicaid expansion and we have only 1-2 vendors in our exchange.

Oergon seems to have 4-5 companies in their exchange. Only 2 are name brand companies, the rest are “Ted’s Discount Insurance Emporium”-type companies.

83 Dark_Falcon  Sat, Oct 5, 2013 7:37:30pm

And I see that our Letter Troll ‘francis’ has made a clean sweep of the bottom 10 comments, with all of his DERPs getting at least 7 downdings.

84 jaunte  Sat, Oct 5, 2013 7:37:55pm

Re that kos diary, If I thought my only choices were between risking cancer and moving one county south to be in a plan with my oncology team, I’d go ahead and move.

85 Gus  Sat, Oct 5, 2013 7:38:45pm
86 Varek Raith  Sat, Oct 5, 2013 7:39:09pm

re: #85 Gus

[Embedded content]

DERP

87 jaunte  Sat, Oct 5, 2013 7:39:39pm

re: #85 Gus

I see they’ve given up on trying for the female vote.

88 Decatur Deb  Sat, Oct 5, 2013 7:39:43pm

re: #82 Killgore Trout

Oergon seems to have 4-5 companies in their exchange. Only 2 are name brand companies, the rest are “Ted’s Discount Insurance Emporium”-type companies.

“Catastrophic Coverage, Title Loans and Fresh Bait In One Easy Stop.”

89 darthstar  Sat, Oct 5, 2013 7:40:35pm

Ocean Beach, San Francisco, today…flowers.

Image: 529142_10153304921830580_1400277228_n.jpg

90 calochortus  Sat, Oct 5, 2013 7:41:25pm

re: #80 goddamnedfrank

I have no idea what Compound Idaho is paying, but as far as I can see with our Kaiser, we’re better off sticking with our current plan than the new ones under the ACA. We wouldn’t get a subsidy and I therefore I think they might even cost a bit more (though it is hard to tell what with differences in co-pays and whatnot.)

91 darthstar  Sat, Oct 5, 2013 7:41:32pm

re: #85 Gus

92 Decatur Deb  Sat, Oct 5, 2013 7:42:00pm

re: #89 darthstar

Ocean Beach, San Francisco, today…flowers.

Image: 529142_10153304921830580_1400277228_n.jpg

“I tell ya, they was aliens, Martha.”

93 darthstar  Sat, Oct 5, 2013 7:43:45pm

re: #92 Decatur Deb

“I tell ya, they was aliens, Martha.”

Nah…we all dress like that here.

94 Gus  Sat, Oct 5, 2013 7:43:52pm

The reviews are in for the CA GOP and they’re looking bad.

95 Dark_Falcon  Sat, Oct 5, 2013 7:44:08pm

re: #85 Gus

96 bratwurst  Sat, Oct 5, 2013 7:44:38pm

re: #87 jaunte

I see they’ve given up on trying for the female vote.

You have got to admire their stick-to-it-iveness in a sense, though.

Ok, unbridling the racism couldn’t stop a black guy called Hussein from getting re-elected…but whipping up misogyny is SURE to work now!

97 darthstar  Sat, Oct 5, 2013 7:45:56pm

re: #94 Gus

The reviews are in for the CA GOP and they’re looking bad.

The GOP is on life support here in California…and that’s a good thing.

98 Gus  Sat, Oct 5, 2013 7:46:34pm

re: #97 darthstar

The GOP is on life support here in California…and that’s a good thing.

99 FemNaziBitch  Sat, Oct 5, 2013 7:47:20pm

re: #7 Decatur Deb

Hey.. I’ve got one of those ‘app’ things now. It’s on Wife’s iPad—turns it into a $400 carpenter’s level.

So tell me what app is is … . ;)

100 jaunte  Sat, Oct 5, 2013 7:47:22pm

“False flagbutton!”

101 calochortus  Sat, Oct 5, 2013 7:47:50pm

re: #95 Dark_Falcon

Carla Marinucci is a reporter for the SF Chronicle and isn’t usually particularly partisan. I think she is just commenting on the fact that the GOP is going after Clinton rather than approving of buttons.

102 elizajane  Sat, Oct 5, 2013 7:48:05pm

re: #85 Gus

This is just what I remember from the 2008 primaries — a level of misogyny that kind of floored me. At the time the Republicans were really much more civil about Obama, principally because they were so completely shocked by his, er skin color. They had not developed a socially acceptable vocabulary in which to articulate that horrible otherness. Blatant and vile misogyny was (and evidently still is) way more socially acceptable than blatant and vile racism.

On which topic, this study is totally worth a read:
democracycorps.com

103 calochortus  Sat, Oct 5, 2013 7:48:12pm

re: #97 darthstar

The GOP is on life support here in California…and that’s a good thing.

I hope they have good insurance.
/

104 Interesting Times  Sat, Oct 5, 2013 7:49:01pm

re: #84 jaunte

Re that kos diary, If I thought my only choices were between risking cancer and moving one county south to be in a plan with my oncology team, I’d go ahead and move.

Did anyone other than you actually click through and read the diary, though? For one, it was posted by a woman (breast cancer surviovor). And in the comments, she says, in response to this question:

Is it not possible that it is Indiana’s opposition to the exchanges that limits your choices? Fewer plans etc. because McDaniel’s et al sabotaged the ACA?

Diarist: Yes! That is correct. Most of the red-states have limited providers. I hope that will change with time.

Pence is being pretty squirrely about this. I believe that he’s going to figure out how to expand Medicaid without actually saying he’s expanding. I expect the landscape to look quite different in a year or two.

105 Decatur Deb  Sat, Oct 5, 2013 7:49:34pm

re: #90 calochortus

I have no idea what Compound Idaho is paying, but as far as I can see with our Kaiser, we’re better off sticking with our current plan than the new ones under the ACA. We wouldn’t get a subsidy and I therefore I think they might even cost a bit more (though it is hard to tell what with differences in co-pays and whatnot.)

Sure—the target is the underinsured, not everybody. One of my kids is likely exempt because of crap employment since his IT job vaporized, one needn’t play because his IT job didn’t vaporize, one might join though she’s right on the cusp of cost/benefit, and the self-employed writer won’t join because her husband is a libertarian dolt. Wife and I are preaching it, and we’re on Medicare with job backup.

106 FemNaziBitch  Sat, Oct 5, 2013 7:49:37pm

re: #27 Killgore Trout

This guy on the Dkos rec list has the same problem.
It’s official: I cannot keep my doctor with the ACA

It’s not a single-payor plan. It’s just another insurance plan you and your doctor both have to be signed with —yes?

107 Dark_Falcon  Sat, Oct 5, 2013 7:49:54pm

re: #101 calochortus

Carla Marinucci is a reporter for the SF Chronicle and isn’t usually particularly partisan. I think she is just commenting on the fact that the GOP is going after Clinton rather than approving of buttons.

I know, that’s why I said it the way I did.

108 goddamnedfrank  Sat, Oct 5, 2013 7:50:54pm

re: #90 calochortus

I have no idea what Compound Idaho is paying, but as far as I can see with our Kaiser, we’re better off sticking with our current plan than the new ones under the ACA. We wouldn’t get a subsidy and I therefore I think they might even cost a bit more (though it is hard to tell what with differences in co-pays and whatnot.)

If you don’t get a subsidy then what you see is what you get. I’m curious how you’re comparing benefits? The KFF tool doesn’t show you co-pays, coverage for hospitalization, x-rays, urgent care, lab testing, name brand and generic prescriptions, in/out of network coverage, free preemptive health check-up, etc.

109 sagehen  Sat, Oct 5, 2013 7:50:59pm

re: #68 compound_Idaho

I’ll keep my shitty coverage thank you. According to the Kaiser estimating tool, ACA policies have higher deductibles, much higher annual limits, and higher premiums. I’m staying with my grandfathered plan as long as I can. It is a much better policy. Exactly what I need and has served me and my family extremely well over the years. I have the HSA balance to prove it. My choices will be much more limited if I get forced into the current system. Health insurance is not as difficult as you suggest.

Your circumstances are not everyone’s circumstances. The fact that you even have an HSA account proves you to be better off (both financially and health-wise) than a great many of your fellow citizens.

110 Kragar  Sat, Oct 5, 2013 7:51:02pm

re: #67 Eclectic Cyborg

[Embedded content]


Oh, don’t you wish.

111 Decatur Deb  Sat, Oct 5, 2013 7:51:04pm

re: #99 FemNaziBitch

So tell me what app is is … . ;)

itunes.apple.com

112 FemNaziBitch  Sat, Oct 5, 2013 7:51:25pm

re: #50 Zamb

Also you know what else is the law of the land now? Women and minorities are now treated as equals under the law to white men. You could use that phrase about a great many things throughout history and many are also good things.

I like you.

113 calochortus  Sat, Oct 5, 2013 7:53:22pm

re: #105 Decatur Deb

Sure—the target is the underinsured, not everybody. One of my kids is likely exempt because of crap employment since his IT job vaporized, one needn’t play because his IT job didn’t vaporize, one might join though she’s right on the cusp of cost/benefit, and the self-employed writer won’t join because her husband is a libertarian dolt. Wife and I are preaching it, and we’re on Medicare with job backup.

Absolutely! I’m a big fan of getting people insured-I was just pointing out that compound_Idaho was quite possibly correct that the exchanges would only provide him more expensive insurance. goddamnedfrank seemed to think it was unlikely.

114 Killgore Trout  Sat, Oct 5, 2013 7:53:31pm

re: #88 Decatur Deb

“Catastrophic Coverage, Title Loans and Fresh Bait In One Easy Stop.”

The big chain of tire stores here has a big event every year when they give away steaks when you buy a set of tires. Nothing make me think of fresh beef more than new tires.

115 William Barnett-Lewis  Sat, Oct 5, 2013 7:54:09pm

re: #95 Dark_Falcon

Updinging about the buttons, but I think the reporter is ok.

116 jamesfirecat  Sat, Oct 5, 2013 7:54:45pm

re: #83 Dark_Falcon

And I see that our Letter Troll ‘francis’ has made a clean sweep of the bottom 10 comments, with all of his DERPs getting at least 7 downdings.

I’ve honestly got about one day of him left in me, telling me to “get off the data train” and then citing a physical letter that he had which I couldn’t confirm the existence of obviously.

////(Its not talking behind someone’s back if they really deserve it!)

117 goddamnedfrank  Sat, Oct 5, 2013 7:54:47pm

re: #108 goddamnedfrank

I’m also curious what value you place on being out from under the specter of denial for pre-existing conditions? If you’ve had your plan for a decade, probably none. For some of us it’s priceless, literally, because we couldn’t purchase insurance before on the individual market at any cost. It simply wasn’t available.

118 calochortus  Sat, Oct 5, 2013 7:55:57pm

re: #108 goddamnedfrank

The tool I was using was the booklet Kaiser sent about our rates and choices for 2014. We (fortunately) are in pretty good health, so co-pays and prescriptions are a rather small amount. But comparing all the possibilities is pretty mind numbing.

119 Gus  Sat, Oct 5, 2013 7:55:58pm

I didn’t see a need to opine on Carla Marinucci’s Tweet. It’s there for the pic.

120 FemNaziBitch  Sat, Oct 5, 2013 7:56:40pm

re: #102 elizajane

This is just what I remember from the 2008 primaries — a level of misogyny that kind of floored me. At the time the Republicans were really much more civil about Obama, principally because they were so completely shocked by his, er skin color. They had not developed a socially acceptable vocabulary in which to articulate that horrible otherness. Blatant and vile misogyny was (and evidently still is) way more socially acceptable than blatant and vile racism.

On which topic, this study is totally worth a read:
democracycorps.com

Do I have to read it? I feel I’ve been drowned in it already.

121 calochortus  Sat, Oct 5, 2013 7:57:16pm

re: #107 Dark_Falcon

I did see that you didn’t go after her, or anything. I just wanted to clarify.

122 William Barnett-Lewis  Sat, Oct 5, 2013 7:57:53pm

re: #102 elizajane

This is just what I remember from the 2008 primaries — a level of misogyny that kind of floored me. At the time the Republicans were really much more civil about Obama, principally because they were so completely shocked by his, er skin color. They had not developed a socially acceptable vocabulary in which to articulate that horrible otherness. Blatant and vile misogyny was (and evidently still is) way more socially acceptable than blatant and vile racism.

On which topic, this study is totally worth a read:
democracycorps.com

Of course they were nicer to him - He wasn’t going to win (oops) she was. She had to be stopped but he was just another darkie with delusions of grandeur to them, like Jessie.

There are so many lessons to be learned about the GOP in that couple of months of 2008 but no one did.

I do know that I watched Iowa happen and told my wife Obama would be the next president. Took a few months before she gave up on Hillary…

123 FemNaziBitch  Sat, Oct 5, 2013 7:58:26pm

re: #111 Decatur Deb

itunes.apple.com

danka

124 Killgore Trout  Sat, Oct 5, 2013 7:58:27pm

re: #90 calochortus

I have no idea what Compound Idaho is paying, but as far as I can see with our Kaiser, we’re better off sticking with our current plan than the new ones under the ACA. We wouldn’t get a subsidy and I therefore I think they might even cost a bit more (though it is hard to tell what with differences in co-pays and whatnot.)

A lot of people have a hard time understanding the issues involved in buying your own insurance, it’s one of the reasons most people never noticed the healthcare crisis. Most people never saw the complexities and costs because they have insurance through their employers. In the past insurers were very eager to look for any excuse to cancel plans and make people sign up for new plans which cost more and have fewer benefits. I really wish I still had the same coverage plan I had 10 years ago, I’m pretty sure I couldn’t even buy that plan today regardless of cost. It simply wouldn’t be offered.

125 Decatur Deb  Sat, Oct 5, 2013 7:58:38pm

re: #118 calochortus

The tool I was using was the booklet Kaiser sent about our rates and choices for 2014. We (fortunately) are in pretty good health, so co-pays and prescriptions are a rather small amount. But comparing all the possibilities is pretty mind numbing.

If the online is working properly, when you begin to compare plans there are ‘filters’ designed to show you those that meet your ‘immediate cost’ vs ‘out-of-pocket’ inputs.

126 AlexRogan  Sat, Oct 5, 2013 7:58:52pm

re: #77 Absalom, Absalom, Obdicut

How on earth is that condescending?

It just sounded a bit offputting to me when I read it; blueraven may not have meant anything by it, but it just sounded odd when I heard it in my head.

127 FemNaziBitch  Sat, Oct 5, 2013 8:00:09pm

re: #126 AlexRogan

It just sounded a bit offputting to me when I read it; blueraven may not have meant anything by it, but it just sounded odd when I heard it in my head.

Me too, but I’m just in that kind of mood. I tend to let these things pass unless I am already in the conversation or it is directed at me.

128 calochortus  Sat, Oct 5, 2013 8:00:45pm

re: #117 goddamnedfrank

I’m also curious what value you place on being out from under the specter of denial for pre-existing conditions? If you’ve had your plan for a decade, probably none. For some of us it’s priceless, literally, because we couldn’t purchase insurance before on the individual market at any cost. It simply wasn’t available.

For me personally it’s reassuring but not a big deal, but for me as a parent and as a citizen, it’s huge. I wish we could just go to single payer and be done with it. Medicare for all.

129 FemNaziBitch  Sat, Oct 5, 2013 8:01:41pm

Just right for everyone here.

130 Decatur Deb  Sat, Oct 5, 2013 8:03:36pm

re: #128 calochortus

For me personally it’s reassuring but not a big deal, but for me as a parent and as a citizen, it’s huge. I wish we could just go to single payer and be done with it. Medicare for all.

Yes. ACA is a bump forward for the country, but it leaves us with an irrational mix of public, job-related, and totally private payment systems. If the TPGOP climbs up on a pyre, we can do better in half a generation.

131 sagehen  Sat, Oct 5, 2013 8:04:09pm

re: #102 elizajane

This is just what I remember from the 2008 primaries — a level of misogyny that kind of floored me. At the time the Republicans were really much more civil about Obama, principally because they were so completely shocked by his, er skin color. They had not developed a socially acceptable vocabulary in which to articulate that horrible otherness. Blatant and vile misogyny was (and evidently still is) way more socially acceptable than blatant and vile racism.

On which topic, this study is totally worth a read:
democracycorps.com

The Republicans were more civil about Obama because it never occured to them he could be the nominee, they were just starting early trying to weaken Hillary before the general. Then when that didn’t work out for them… remember the PUMAs? That was their next bright idea, also didn’t work.

132 calochortus  Sat, Oct 5, 2013 8:05:00pm

re: #124 Killgore Trout

A lot of people have a hard time understanding the issues involved in buying your own insurance, it’s one of the reasons most people never noticed the healthcare crisis. Most people never saw the complexities and costs because they have insurance through their employers. In the past insurers were very eager to look for any excuse to cancel plans and make people sign up for new plans which cost more and have fewer benefits. I really wish I still had the same coverage plan I had 10 years ago, I’m pretty sure I couldn’t even buy that plan today regardless of cost. It simply wouldn’t be offered.

I only regret that I have but one upding to give that. So, so true. We had insurance some years ago that they just quit writing that policy and encouraged people to apply for a new policy. Fine if you’re healthy, but if you’re not, well, too bad for you.
I have been very happy with Kaiser, in part because they don’t fool around with that kind of stuff. At least they haven’t with us.

133 Decatur Deb  Sat, Oct 5, 2013 8:05:14pm

re: #129 FemNaziBitch

Just right for everyone here.

What does it do? Can you drive a nail with it?

134 Tigger2  Sat, Oct 5, 2013 8:05:54pm

re: #27 Killgore Trout

This guy on the Dkos rec list has the same problem.
It’s official: I cannot keep my doctor with the ACA

You know I had to change my DR when I was working a couple times when the company I worked for changed Insurance providers, not everyone get to keep the DR they like in every instant, it didn’t start with the ACA.

135 goddamnedfrank  Sat, Oct 5, 2013 8:07:46pm

If you live in California your benefits by metal tier can be found on page 6.

Connecticut, page 4.

If you can find a chart or official .pdf doc detailing your state’s benefit levels by ACA metal tier, please post it. It would help keep these comparisons on an apples to apples basis.

136 Decatur Deb  Sat, Oct 5, 2013 8:15:59pm

Night, all.

137 goddamnedfrank  Sat, Oct 5, 2013 8:17:58pm

re: #132 calochortus

I only regret that I have but one upding to give that. So, so true. We had insurance some years ago that they just quit writing that policy and encouraged people to apply for a new policy. Fine if you’re healthy, but if you’re not, well, too bad for you.
I have been very happy with Kaiser, in part because they don’t fool around with that kind of stuff. At least they haven’t with us.

Part of what keeps Kaiser Permanente in check is that the Kaiser Family Foundation is out there, with the same name, zero affiliation, and an entirely different mission. KP has to watch their step because KFF stands ready to gut their public image and destroy any legitimacy they might have to carry the Kaiser name if they get out of line. A lot of people conflate KP and KFF, they shouldn’t.

Along that line, I wouldn’t trust what KP says in their brochures about the specifics of your state’s ACA exchange plans. It is not in their best interest to give you the whole picture of their competitor’s offerings. You should research the exchange plans on your own, get the cost / benefit breakdown straight from the source.

138 simoom  Sat, Oct 5, 2013 8:18:17pm
139 FemNaziBitch  Sat, Oct 5, 2013 8:18:52pm

re: #133 Decatur Deb

What does it do? Can you drive a nail with it?

You can make the lady in your life very happy with it. If she is into reptile jewelry.

140 Gus  Sat, Oct 5, 2013 8:19:01pm
141 goddamnedfrank  Sat, Oct 5, 2013 8:19:48pm

Lastly, the penalty this year for not having a qualifying plan is pretty paltry. It’s going to go up, and the more you make the harder it’s going to hit you.

142 Rev_Arthur_Belling  Sat, Oct 5, 2013 8:20:21pm

re: #140 Gus

They’re always offended after they get caught.

143 FemNaziBitch  Sat, Oct 5, 2013 8:20:37pm

re: #27 Killgore Trout

This guy on the Dkos rec list has the same problem.
It’s official: I cannot keep my doctor with the ACA

I think what really get’s me about such statements is that they are absolute, blanket and not accurate. In a given situation, in a set time frame, for a specific person in a specific place, this may be true.

That doesn’t me it’s true for everyone in every situation (time, place date)… .

144 calochortus  Sat, Oct 5, 2013 8:21:11pm

re: #137 goddamnedfrank

KP didn’t say anything about other providers’ plans-I was referring only to their own plans. I have no intention of leaving Kaiser. I’m very happy with my doctors and the care I have gotten.

145 FemNaziBitch  Sat, Oct 5, 2013 8:21:53pm

re: #143 FemNaziBitch

I think what really get’s me about such statements is that they are absolute, blanket and not accurate. In a given situation, in a set time frame, for a specific person in a specific place, this may be true.

That doesn’t me it’s true for everyone in every situation (time, place date)… .

It’s the kind of statement used in shoddy journalism.

146 simoom  Sat, Oct 5, 2013 8:22:12pm

re: #138 simoom

147 blueraven  Sat, Oct 5, 2013 8:22:43pm

re: #138 simoom

But why cant they get the Benghazi terrorists!!!??

Seriously, that is one of the first things I heard on FOX after this news broke today

148 Zamb  Sat, Oct 5, 2013 8:23:43pm

re: #147 blueraven

The question is why are you getting your news from Fox?

149 Lidane  Sat, Oct 5, 2013 8:24:01pm

Goddamn the RWNJs in this country are getting stupid. Now they’re derping about “ZOMG Obummer iz trying to close teh oshun!!! Eleventy!” because the National Park Service closed the Florida Bay and is preventing people from taking their boats out past a certain distance.

It’s on Breitbart and LiveLeak. No links because there’s no need to drive traffic their way.

150 calochortus  Sat, Oct 5, 2013 8:24:31pm

re: #147 blueraven

But why cant they get the Benghazi terrorists!!!??

Seriously, that is one of the first things I heard on FOX after this news broke today

Sigh….

And on that note, I’m out for the night. Hasta mañana.

151 blueraven  Sat, Oct 5, 2013 8:25:37pm

re: #148 Zamb

The question is why are you getting your news from Fox?

I occasionally like to see how they report the news of the hour.

I do not “get my news” from them. I have many sources.

152 sagehen  Sat, Oct 5, 2013 8:26:34pm

re: #149 Lidane

Goddamn the RWNJs in this country are getting stupid. Now they’re derping about “ZOMG Obummer iz trying to close teh oshun!!! Eleventy!” because the National Park Service closed the Florida Bay and is preventing people from taking their boats out past a certain distance.

It’s on Breitbart and LiveLeak. No links because there’s no need to drive traffic their way.

Isn’t there a hurricane on the way??

153 AlexRogan  Sat, Oct 5, 2013 8:27:41pm

re: #147 blueraven

But why cant they get the Benghazi terrorists!!!??

Seriously, that is one of the first things I heard on FOX after this news broke today

The Benghazi twibboners just need to get over it their irrational hatred for the President; it may not be this year or next, but, as we’ve seen with al-Libi, while the wheels of justice turn slowly, they grind exceedingly fine.

154 jaunte  Sat, Oct 5, 2013 8:28:14pm

re: #149 Lidane

Isn’t Florida Bay a national marine sanctuary?

155 FemNaziBitch  Sat, Oct 5, 2013 8:28:34pm

re: #148 Zamb

The question is why are you getting your news from Fox?

Some of us have to listen to in OUR OWN HOMES because marital harmony is more important that TV channels.

“Keep your enemies close” —HA!

156 FemNaziBitch  Sat, Oct 5, 2013 8:28:56pm

Are either Mr or Mrs Ballard here tonite?

157 Lidane  Sat, Oct 5, 2013 8:29:19pm

re: #152 sagehen

Isn’t there a hurricane on the way??

Who cares? People can’t take their fishing boats out because Obama’s a meanie. Or something.

Honestly this level of stupid is just ridiculous. People are flipping their shit about monuments and parks being closed but not saying a peep about the CDC being unable to monitor disease outbreaks or WIC and Head Start being gone, or the VA being unable to send benefit checks or offer vets tuition aid for school. WTF.

158 b.d.  Sat, Oct 5, 2013 8:29:35pm

re: #149 Lidane

They’re trying to keep us from sailing to Cuba, where it’s freer!!!1!!

159 Lidane  Sat, Oct 5, 2013 8:29:45pm

re: #154 jaunte

Isn’t Florida Bay a national marine sanctuary?

It’s part of the National Park Service, so I guess so.

160 jaunte  Sat, Oct 5, 2013 8:30:39pm

re: #159 Lidane

We probably can’t get into Area 51, either. Dammit.

161 goddamnedfrank  Sat, Oct 5, 2013 8:31:05pm

re: #144 calochortus

KP didn’t say anything about other providers’ plans-I was referring only to their own plans. I have no intention of leaving Kaiser. I’m very happy with my doctors and the care I have gotten.

So then, I’ll ask again, where are you getting your comparison information?

re: #90 calochortus

I have no idea what Compound Idaho is paying, but as far as I can see with our Kaiser, we’re better off sticking with our current plan than the new ones under the ACA.

re: #118 calochortus

The tool I was using was the booklet Kaiser sent about our rates and choices for 2014.

Do you see the obvious disconnect here? How can you say you’re better off if the tool you’re using to determine that doesn’t say anything about other providers’ ACA exchange plans?

Maybe you’re not interested in actually researching the alternatives. That’s fine but if true you’re in no position to say that you’re better off one way or another.

162 Zamb  Sat, Oct 5, 2013 8:33:49pm

re: #160 jaunte

Clearly this shutdown is a plot to put all national parks under top secret authority to cover up the alien spacecraft that have landed there.

163 b.d.  Sat, Oct 5, 2013 8:35:12pm

re: #149 Lidane

Next Obummer is going to close down the Interstate Highways!!1!!

164 jaunte  Sat, Oct 5, 2013 8:36:02pm

Obama shut Florida Bay! Now I only get to use the Atlantic Ocean or the Gulf of Mexico. If I had a boat.

165 Zamb  Sat, Oct 5, 2013 8:36:45pm

re: #163 b.d.

No he’s not gonna shut them down, he’s gonna nationalize them as part of his socialist takeover.

166 b.d.  Sat, Oct 5, 2013 8:40:13pm

Obama is going to shut down Soldier Field!!11 The Bears will be playing the Saints in the parking lot!1!

167 FemNaziBitch  Sat, Oct 5, 2013 8:44:44pm

re: #165 Zamb

No he’s not gonna shut them down, he’s gonna nationalize them as part of his socialist takeover.

Everyone, by now, has pretty much realized that Single-Payer is the only way to go. GOP is terrified they won’t get credit for it when it goes down.

168 goddamnedfrank  Sat, Oct 5, 2013 8:45:02pm

re: #141 goddamnedfrank

Lastly, the penalty this year for not having a qualifying plan is pretty paltry. It’s going to go up, and the more you make the harder it’s going to hit you.

So let’s assume a hypothetical family income for 2014 is $100K. Their tax penalty for not having a qualifying plan will be 1% of $80K (family income is defined as the amount over the filing threshold, for individuals this is $10K, families $20K.) Or $800.

That equals $66.66 per month that I hope you guys are adding to your existing insurance payment costs when making these comparisons about whether or not to keep your old plan.

In tax year 2015 that penalty doubles to $133.33 per month.

In tax year 2016 this hypothetical family will be paying $166.66 per month just to keep their old plan with its pre-existing condition exclusions.

169 goddamnedfrank  Sat, Oct 5, 2013 8:48:28pm

re: #167 FemNaziBitch

Everyone, by now, has pretty much realized that Single-Payer is the only way to go. GOP is terrified they won’t get credit for it when it goes down.

Credit? The Teahadis go postal at the very thought of something so socialist. The GOP is fighting ACA in large part because they see it as paving the road to single payer. Nevermind that the individual mandate started out as their idea.

170 goddamnedfrank  Sat, Oct 5, 2013 8:49:54pm

re: #162 Zamb

Clearly this shutdown is a plot to put all national parks under top secret authority to cover up the alien spacecraft that have landed there.

So that’s why I just sculpted Devil’s Tower out of mashed potatoes.

171 b.d.  Sat, Oct 5, 2013 8:52:21pm

Obama is going to bring back odd/even gas rationing but he has secretly been giving republicans license plates that end in letters!1!

172 goddamnedfrank  Sat, Oct 5, 2013 8:54:36pm

Obamacare mandates that all toilet paper be single ply!!!

173 b.d.  Sat, Oct 5, 2013 8:55:41pm

re: #172 goddamnedfrank

Obamacare mandates that all toilet paper be single ply!!!

and that you have to use BOTH sides!!1!

174 FemNaziBitch  Sat, Oct 5, 2013 9:01:32pm

re: #169 goddamnedfrank

Credit? The Teahadis go postal at the very thought of something so socialist. The GOP is fighting ACA in large part because they see it as paving the road to single payer. Nevermind that the individual mandate started out as their idea.

yes, I think you understand.

GOP is so FUBAR

175 goddamnedfrank  Sat, Oct 5, 2013 9:23:09pm

re: #168 goddamnedfrank

You know, even though I feel I’m talking to a brick wall, I’m going to keep asking people like compoundidaho and calochortus if they’re factoring in the loss of this tax credit in their calculations when comparing health plans.

And for the record I’ve received zero in the way of specific, verifiable numbers from ci and calochortus has basically admitted that he hasn’t done a real comparison at all, just went with KP literature all the way.

If you want to be taken seriously in this debate you’re going to have to show your work.

176 FemNaziBitch  Sat, Oct 5, 2013 9:39:54pm

The last time I think I saw Tanya was probably about the time the images in the beginning of the video were taken. She was a beautiful China Doll.

Her brother was a typical little boy, scurrying around his aunt’s house, playing with the dog and generally trying to ignore what the women were doing.

The picture in this article is the first time I’ve seen her mother’s face in at least 10 years. I still can’t believe it’s true.

Eric doesn’t know me from Adam, yet I am so proud of him and his parents for the way they have dealt with this. They took their tragedy and made it a challenge. And met it head on.

Now, I’m off to find some kleenex.

177 Dark_Falcon  Sat, Oct 5, 2013 9:42:23pm

re: #115 William Barnett-Lewis

Updinging about the buttons, but I think the reporter is ok.

I agree, that why I used the term ‘someone’ instead of personalizing it further. I figured she wasn’t expressing approval.

178 Lidane  Sat, Oct 5, 2013 9:51:40pm
180 Lidane  Sat, Oct 5, 2013 9:54:33pm
181 FemNaziBitch  Sat, Oct 5, 2013 9:56:53pm
‘Symbolic violence is a form of power which is hammered directly on the body, and as if by magic, without any apparent physical constraint. But this magic works only because it activates the codes pounded in the deepest layers of the body.’

-

See more

Also Paged

182 Targetpractice  Sat, Oct 5, 2013 10:03:40pm

re: #178 Lidane

[Embedded content]

“If it has to happen for the American people to get what’s best, defunding Obamacare, so be it,” Mr. Ferguson said. “Our credit rating’s going to go down, but it went down before. Did the apocalypse come?”

And that’s the sentiment I keep hearing from wingnuts, “It wasn’t that bad last time, it won’t be any worse this time!” Except last time we didn’t default, we beat the deadline and raised the ceiling. A true default will not just see a single level downgrade of our credit, it’s going to spark off another recession, one that’s likely to be worse than the ‘08 one. But this is what happens in “Real ‘Murika,” they don’t see the effects of their suicidal tactics beyond what happens to them personally.

183 BusyMonster  Sat, Oct 5, 2013 10:06:08pm

re: #104 Interesting Times

Did anyone other than you actually click through and read the diary, though? For one, it was posted by a woman (breast cancer surviovor). And in the comments, she says, in response to this question:

I’m in Indiana too. I live right across the river from Louisville though, and I lived there for almost 20 years.

I might make next year’s project getting out of my house and back to a state that I can have decent healthcare in. Unless of course the governor gets a clue and realizes he’s going to have a brain-drain in his state and all the high-income jobs like mine will no longer be in his tax base.

I doubt he’s that smart, though. He’s a fucking Republican after all.

184 Stanley Sea  Sat, Oct 5, 2013 10:06:22pm

re: #176 FemNaziBitch

The last time I think I saw Tanya was probably about the time the images in the beginning of the video were taken. She was a beautiful China Doll.

Her brother was a typical little boy, scurrying around his aunt’s house, playing with the dog and generally trying to ignore what the women were doing.

The picture in this article is the first time I’ve seen her mother’s face in at least 10 years. I still can’t believe it’s true.

Eric doesn’t know me from Adam, yet I am so proud of him and his parents for the way they have dealt with this. They took their tragedy and made it a challenge. And met it head on.

Now, I’m off to find some kleenex.

That was really good. Really sad.

185 simoom  Sat, Oct 5, 2013 10:08:32pm

I was reading the NYT write-up on the Navy Seal raids and check this out:

nytimes.com

With President Obama locked in a standoff with Congressional Republicans and his leadership criticized for a policy reversal in Syria, the raids could fuel accusations among his critics that the administration was eager for a showy foreign policy victory.

Umm, thanks NYT for including a paragraph w/ the Fox & Friends version of events. /

186 FemNaziBitch  Sat, Oct 5, 2013 10:10:38pm

re: #184 Stanley Sea

That was really good. Really sad.

yeah ;(

187 Four More Tears  Sat, Oct 5, 2013 10:15:11pm

re: #178 Lidane

[Embedded content]

Just down the road from where Union troops suffered their worst defeat of the Civil War,

My god, that must be like a holy site to them.

188 Stanley Sea  Sat, Oct 5, 2013 10:15:57pm
189 simoom  Sat, Oct 5, 2013 10:16:15pm
190 The Mountain That Blogs  Sat, Oct 5, 2013 10:19:25pm

re: #188 Stanley Sea

hardballtalk.nbcsports.com

191 Targetpractice  Sat, Oct 5, 2013 10:23:00pm

re: #189 simoom

[Embedded content]

Yeah, there’s something absolutely hilarious about Republicans suddenly playing up all the good things that government does in people’s lives.

192 Zamb  Sat, Oct 5, 2013 10:23:36pm

re: #188 Stanley Sea

Fuck I just read some shit on Yahoo about Obama speaking out against the name, the comments were the most disgusting thing I’ve read in a while. The article quoted the owner of the Redskins who cited some survey saying 9 out of 10 natives surveyed didn’t find anything wrong. As a native myself I don’t know many who would agree, I just figured they surveyed anyone who claimed native ancestry which in my experience includes a shitload of white southerners who wait patiently for the south to rise again. Some people claim to have native ancestry the same way they claim to have black friends, as an excuse to be racist dickbags.

193 Varek Raith  Sat, Oct 5, 2013 10:23:41pm

re: #188 Stanley Sea

[Embedded content]

Alouette’s family team???
/Going to hell

194 Stanley Sea  Sat, Oct 5, 2013 10:29:03pm

re: #193 Varek Raith

Alouette’s family team???
/Going to hell

So going to hell.

Seriously, that showed more than anything that It’s offensive as shit.

195 Varek Raith  Sat, Oct 5, 2013 10:30:05pm

re: #194 Stanley Sea

So going to hell.

Seriously, that showed more than anything that It’s offensive as shit.

Indeed.

196 Stanley Sea  Sat, Oct 5, 2013 10:34:00pm

Good night now!

Varek, I definitely laughed so sleep well.

197 Targetpractice  Sat, Oct 5, 2013 10:35:03pm

Republicans on Monday: “We’re spending way too much! Government is too intrusive! Federal employees are overpaid, lazy good-for-nothings!”

Republicans on Friday: “We can’t afford to cut funding to these programs! Government does many great things for us! Federal employees are selfless, hardworking folks!”

It’s comedy that writes itself.

198 Varek Raith  Sat, Oct 5, 2013 10:35:11pm

re: #196 Stanley Sea

Good night now!

Varek, I definitely laughed so sleep well.

Ok.
Was feeling kind of bad for making that ‘joke’.
:/
Off to bed too.

199 freetoken  Sat, Oct 5, 2013 10:37:01pm

I have heard some young people griping about the ACA. Their hours apparently have been reduced at their jobs, and they are blaming ACA; whether that is the real cause or not I do not know.

I know this - If I were designing a health care “system” from scratch it wouldn’t look like this.

200 FemNaziBitch  Sat, Oct 5, 2013 10:38:57pm

re: #199 freetoken

I have heard some young people griping about the ACA. Their hours apparently have been reduced at their jobs, and they are blaming ACA; whether that is the real cause or not I do not know.

I know this - If I were designing a health care “system” from scratch it wouldn’t look like this.

Scapegoat of the week. Pick one:

1-ACA
2-Obama
3-Benghazi
4-Socialism
5-Obama

201 piratedan  Sat, Oct 5, 2013 10:45:02pm

re: #124 Killgore Trout

depending upon your age, check with the AARP, they’re very good at sorting government stuff for folks of a certain age, i.e. anyone above 50.

202 sagehen  Sat, Oct 5, 2013 10:48:51pm

re: #199 freetoken

I have heard some young people griping about the ACA. Their hours apparently have been reduced at their jobs, and they are blaming ACA; whether that is the real cause or not I do not know.

I know this - If I were designing a health care “system” from scratch it wouldn’t look like this.

That’s why the British are able to have National Health — because they *did* get to design their health care system from scratch. (post-war, bombed out buildings being rebuilt, most of the doctors and nurses were already working for the military either for combat wounds or blitz wounds…)

All our best public health endeavors — CDC and NIH and various regional socialisticky organizations also came out of “temporary” and “emergency” needs, and then allowed to remain and grow after the emergency — cholera epidemics, the 1918 flu, etc — but we’ve never been in dire enough straits to really be pushed to do a thorough job of it.

203 piratedan  Sat, Oct 5, 2013 10:59:11pm

re: #192 Zamb

I think this is the starting point for the pot being stirred again….

espn.go.com

being a middle class white guy who happens to be a fan for the professional team in DC, I’ve never thought that the logo in use was derogatory but I can understand that people can still be very sensitive about names and labels. As such, Reilly’s article is the first one that I’ve seen that actually speaks to local schools and towns where the nickname is in use and in use by kids that identify themselves as Native Americans. For me, I follow the team, regardless of the name but in a way, I can see both sides of the argument but also take the position of who am I to presume and tell someone if they should or should not be offended.

204 FemNaziBitch  Sat, Oct 5, 2013 11:12:16pm

night all!

205 goddamnedfrank  Sat, Oct 5, 2013 11:15:02pm

re: #203 piratedan

I think this is the starting point for the pot being stirred again….

espn.go.com

being a middle class white guy who happens to be a fan for the professional team in DC, I’ve never thought that the logo in use was derogatory but I can understand that people can still be very sensitive about names and labels. As such, Reilly’s article is the first one that I’ve seen that actually speaks to local schools and towns where the nickname is in use and in use by kids that identify themselves as Native Americans. For me, I follow the team, regardless of the name but in a way, I can see both sides of the argument but also take the position of who am I to presume and tell someone if they should or should not be offended.

I was going to ask why do you think it is that being a fan prevented you from thinking of the logo as derogatory, I think it clearly is but that really isn’t the issue. A better question is do you think the logo depicts a stereotype, and if so, doesn’t that alone make it unacceptable? Point being, whether a stereotype is derogatory or not is kind of a subjective dodge, even so called positive stereotypes are generally offensive. If someone came in here talking about how Jews are good with money and Asians good at math would you ignore it because these weren’t derogatory statements?

The logo is pretty unambiguously an unflattering caricature, it really has no place in post 1960’s America. Whether you’re a fan of the team or not really shouldn’t have any bearing on something so self evident.

206 simoom  Sat, Oct 5, 2013 11:44:53pm

SNL Government Shutdown Music video:
Youtube Video

207 sagehen  Sat, Oct 5, 2013 11:51:50pm

re: #206 simoom

SNL Government Shutdown Music video:
nbc.com

Am I just really old? ‘Cause none of the Miley Cyrus bits really did it for me. Her voice, her songs, her costumes and choreography, her acting, all hit me as mediocre. (and that little horned hairstyle is just plain stupid). And the writing on the sketches they had her in wasn’t very good either.

208 goddamnedfrank  Sat, Oct 5, 2013 11:53:28pm
“I don’t think that the government should be involved in health care or health insurance,” says Greg Collett, a 41-year-old software developer in Caldwell, Idaho, who would rather pay the fine for now — $95 the first year — than signup.

“I calculated it out and it is cheaper for me for the next four years to pay the fine rather than get coverage,” Collett said. “At some point where it would make financial sense to pay for insurance rather than pay fines, I will make the decision from a financial standpoint.”

Yes, a man’s early to mid forties are the best time to go without health insurance. Because you can actually schedule shit like having a stroke, brain tumor, heart attack, cancer or even a broken arm/leg. This asshole didn’t calculate shit, his entire argument is based on ideology and politics, which as we know wreck’s people ability to do math.

Intelligent people know that the question isn’t are you statistically likely to save money one way or another, the question is what is the worst case scenario and how much downside risk can you handle?

I guarantee you that after 2014 hospital ER workers are going to be really fucking irritated dealing with dumbshits like Mr. Collett.

Collett, who is married and has 10 children, says the kids are covered by Medicaid, the joint state-federal health insurance plan for people with low income and children who are not covered.

But it’s “absolutely not okay,” that they are, Collett says quickly. “There are a lot of people out there that’ll cry foul.”

Collett, whose children are home-schooled, likens taking Medicaid to sending children to public school. He also does not approve of government-funded public schools. “The government is taking your money. They are spending it on things they shouldn’t be,” he says. “Trying to get whatever you can back — I have nothing against that. You have to at some point try and get your tax dollars back.”

ಠ_ಠ

209 simoom  Sat, Oct 5, 2013 11:55:24pm

re: #207 sagehen

All I saw was the music video. I haven’t watched a whole ep of SNL in years so I wouldn’t be surprised if it’s still mostly unfunny.

210 Lidane  Sun, Oct 6, 2013 12:02:27am

re: #208 goddamnedfrank

Deliberately uninsured, married with 10 kids that are on Medicaid, willing to settle for ER bills instead of actually having insurance…

Yeah. That guy sounds like a winner.

//////

211 wheat-dogghazi  Sun, Oct 6, 2013 12:26:33am

Hello, all! I just came back from a week away for China’s National Holiday, battling kajillions of people all taking the same eight days for vacation travel.

Never again.

[I said that four years ago, though. This time friends invited me to Tianjin, and I got to travel with an attractive lady friend, so the kajillions of people weren’t so important.]

Next up, Charles, my IP is forbidden again. I thought being in Beijing was causing the blocking, but now that I am back home I find I still can’t get to LGF without using a VPN. My public IP is 218.76.65.98 now. Can you make an exception for me, please?

Thanks.

212 AlexRogan  Sun, Oct 6, 2013 12:39:25am

re: #211 wheat-dogghazi

Charles and Hosting Matters had to block China’s entire IP block Tuesday or Wednesday, because of some really bad bot action that took LGF down or made it really, really slow for a couple of days..

BTW, you might wanna edit your IP out, lest someone manning the Great Firewall takes an interest in you, and drop an email to Charles; he’s been waiting to see if you could get through.

213 wheat-dogghazi  Sun, Oct 6, 2013 1:10:51am

I think it’s OK. I get my ‘Net connection from the university and it only presents one IP to the outside Web.

214 prairiefire  Sun, Oct 6, 2013 1:57:30am

re: #201 piratedan

depending upon your age, check with the AARP, they’re very good at sorting government stuff for folks of a certain age, i.e. anyone above 50.

Wut, did you just call Kilgore old?

215 Kragar  Sun, Oct 6, 2013 2:23:10am

Republican Va. gubernatorial candidate Cuccinelli asks Sen. Ted Cruz to end shutdown

As Virginia attorney general, he was the first in the country to sue the federal government over the Affordable Care Act. But his anti-Obamacare credentials with the Tea Party have complicated his run for the governors chair in a swing state with 170,000 federal employees on furlough. Saturday night, the architect of that shutdown Sen. Ted Cruz (R-TX) appeared with Cuccinelli at a event with the socially conservative Family Foundation in Richmond.

During the speech, Cruz repeatedly referred to Cuccinelli as a friend, smart, principled and fierce, while Cuccinelli said nothing negative about Cruz’s efforts to block funding for the ACA — even at the cost of furloughing Virginia federal employees. In fact, he said nothing at all about Cruz, the local ABC affiliate reported.

But prior to his speech, Cuccinelli met briefly with Ted Cruz backstage and “urged him to find a solution” to the shutdown, an aide told CNN’s Peter Hamby.

216 goddamnedfrank  Sun, Oct 6, 2013 2:32:38am

So since compound_idaho has chosen not to provide any verifiable specifics I went to ehealthinsurance.com, pretended to be from Twin Falls, and started looking at HSA approved plans available now. There isn’t one with a deductible lower than the ACA Silver plan, which should be obvious since HSA are specifically designed for high deductibles. So claim number one is undermined. Every one I’ve seen that costs less than an equivalent age demographic ACA plan forces you to use up your deductible first before any hospitalization, x-ray, lab testing or urgent care costs will be covered at all, so the idea that he did an apples to apples comparison is debunked.

The HSA plan closest in cost per month to the ACA Silver Plan (BlueCare PPO 2000) has a $500 higher deductible, a lower out of pocket max which is nice at first glance, however it offers no hospital, ER, lab or x-ray copays or coinsurance benefit before that deductible is reached, it also costs an individual $7 more per month than the KFF estimator tool suggest an equivalent Silver ACA plan would. This is also the only HSA plan in the region that covers office visits at all before the full deductible is reached, and doesn’t offer a complimentary free preventative care visit (which all ACA exchange plans do.) BlueCare PPO 2000 also has a separate $5K deductible for name brand drugs, so if you need a drug that is still covered by a patent that’s what you’re going to pay upfront, the $30 copay only kicks in after you’ve shell out the full $5K.

Now, lastly, remember that starting next year all plans retained under old contracts won’t qualify for the ACA tax credit, because they all excluded coverage for pre-existing conditions and therefore all suck. That means that for a family making $100K per year that plan has to cost $66.66 per month less than the equivalent ACA plan in order for the family to just break even, $133.33/month in 2015, then $166.66 per month less in 2016 and thereafter.

217 freetoken  Sun, Oct 6, 2013 2:35:39am

MP3 Audio

218 Sol Berdinowitz  Sun, Oct 6, 2013 2:53:13am

The strategy is to convince enough people to opt out of ACA to further the assertion that ACA does not work.

Scary part is, they could succeed on this one: if they get enough young people to opt out of it, then the pool of insured will be skewered to the older and infirm and raise rates.

219 goddamnedfrank  Sun, Oct 6, 2013 3:12:20am

re: #218 Sol Berdinowitz

The strategy is to convince enough people to opt out of ACA to further the assertion that ACA does not work.

Scary part is, they could succeed on this one: if they get enough young people to opt out of it, then the pool of insured will be skewered to the older and infirm and raise rates.

Young people aren’t as stupid older generations. By and large they see right through the GOP bullshit. Having gotten my Masters degree at a professional photography school I had to do a year of undergrad work, mostly 4x5 fine art. Because of that I know and am friends with a lot of millennials and many of them work for themselves as sole proprietors of their own photography businesses. I see a lot of them talking on Facebook, and they’re stoked about shopping for insurance, often for the first time in their lives. Even after you correct for the disproportionate number of women and gays in my sample the overwhelming trend is to take whatever the GOP is selling and assume the exact opposite is the truth.

I’m not worried, the kids are alright.

220 Sol Berdinowitz  Sun, Oct 6, 2013 3:27:50am

re: #219 goddamnedfrank

Young people aren’t as stupid older generations. By and large they see right through the GOP bullshit. Having gotten my Masters degree at a professional photography school I had to do a year of undergrad work, mostly 4x5 fine art. Because of that I know and am friends with a lot of millennials and many of them work for themselves as sole proprietors of their own photography businesses. I see a lot of them talking on Facebook, and they’re stoked about shopping for insurance, often for the first time in their lives. Even after you correct for the disproportionate number of women and gays in my sample the overwhelming trend is to take whatever the GOP is selling and assume the exact opposite is the truth.

I’m not worried, the kids are alright.

I truly hope so, but never overestimate the power of stupidity and bad news reportintg…

221 goddamnedfrank  Sun, Oct 6, 2013 3:53:33am

Actually you can compare ACA metal tier plans right on ehealthinsurance. Just type in your zip code, check 2014, and fill out your gender, age, tobacco use, and whether you’re in college or not, then do the same for any spouse or children you wish to cover.

Then, when the plans are listed go to the left and click on “metal level.” Check the boxes you wish to filter for, Bronze through Platinum, then only ACA approved plans in your area in those categories will show up. The numbers for most Idaho zip codes are even cheaper than I thought. I found a Gold level plan that covers a 40 year old non smoker at $257.24 / month. It has 4 $10 office visit copays per year, then 15% coinsurance after $1K annual deductible. Same for specialist. Same for urgent care. $10 generic prescriptions, $30 brand name. Lots more coinsurance benefits for inpatient / outpatient care. Blue Cross of Idaho - Gold Choice is the plan.

222 Justanotherhuman  Sun, Oct 6, 2013 3:56:44am

Reading all the comments about ACA, think how simple it would have been just to extend something like Medicare to everyone, with a little tweaking here and there.

Instead, I think the idea of ACA was to not disrupt the insurance and health industries too much while trying to provide insurance coverage people would have to pay for, with concessions for income, pre-existing conditions, children, etc. After all, those industries are rife with employees and there will be a lot of shifting around within them to accommodate provisions of ACA while adhering to the law itself.

Even with Medicare, many corporations are involved in its administration; it’s a shifting of monies around, and ACA will no doubt add tens of millions of people to companies’ customer bases. So health care overall and the payments for it are a hybridization of private and public access, coverage, and administration.

Of course, considering the circumstances under which ACA was passed (a testament to Pres Obama’s keen politicking, even in its final form), there was no way single payer was ever going to fly, but I don’t think it’s an improbability that we’ll see it in the future, and health care will become a feature in our daily lives. That will only happen if there is some major shifting of income from those who have been profiting the most, avoiding the most in taxes, and shorting wages and hours of employees. In other words, the very things the Republicans are desperate to keep as the status quo and are holding up the functions of govt to achieve.

Now, unless we can actually get people interested in assuming some knowledge and responsibility for their own health, such as eating right, exercising, avoidance of unhealthy substances, etc, something Michelle Obama has tried to do, with varying success in reaching certain demographics, it won’t matter how much we invest in health care, nor how many “cures” science finds. And even that won’t help as long as there are people who think that “society” or whoever they want to name, doesn’t give a flying fig about the ordinary person, no matter from what angle they see it, and there is plenty of evidence to support their outlook, but blaming this administration is not just silly, it’s wrong-headed and racist. Despair and misery are deadly forces, and bread and circuses as covers for inaction and injustice just cause more of the same. Until people have a decent education, adequate housing, food and other necessities of life, including jobs that will provide those things and preserve human dignity, I don’t have much hope that things will change. OTOH, not knowing what you don’t know can be a panacea of sorts, I suppose.

But maybe I’m preaching to the choir here.

223 goddamnedfrank  Sun, Oct 6, 2013 4:00:47am

re: #222 Justanotherhuman

Reading all the comments about ACA, think how simple it would have been just to extend something like Medicare to everyone, with a little tweaking here and there.

I’m all for single payer but we shouldn’t pretend it would be a simple thing, at least not politically. Taxes would either have had to go way up or defense spending would have had to be slashed to the bone. Politically we got what we got both because of and in spite of the Republican Party.

They’ve been absolute dog shit throughout this entire process.

224 Varek Raith  Sun, Oct 6, 2013 4:13:34am

So…
Got no sleep.
What’s up?

225 Justanotherhuman  Sun, Oct 6, 2013 4:27:23am

re: #223 goddamnedfrank

I’m all for single payer but we shouldn’t pretend it would be a simple thing, at least not politically. Taxes would either have had to go way up or defense spending would have had to be slashed to the bone. Politically we got what we got both because of and in spite of the Republican Party.

They’ve been absolute dog shit throughout this entire process.

“Simple” in the relative sense. The infrastructure is there, it’s just a matter of will and details to add general population coverage.

But yes, the Rs, as long as they hold a majority in the House, will never raise taxes on their masters. Isn’t this what all their caterwauling is about, this push to keep everything by those who “own” the means of production, no matter how the law aids them in their endeavors? This push to make “property” the basis for all laws has always been part and parcel of the history of the US, it is the foundation of capitalism. Isn’t this what all the push among young people (mainly white males) for “libertarianism” is about? To really preserve the rights of those like the Kochs? To be as rich as you wish, no matter how it’s done, with no crisis of conscience or ethical considerations?

We are going through wrenching times, but if we are to survive as a country, people are going to have to be taken care of, people who have no say-so in how money is distributed, even those who follow the ideology that provokes them into voting against their own interests. Even the idea of capitalism is taking a beating as we realize that continued “growth” and consumerism isn’t the best idea and overpopulation without resources may be the crushing final blow to us as a species.

“What’s mine is mine and what’s yours is negotiable” is no way to run a country.

226 Flounder  Sun, Oct 6, 2013 4:30:19am
always effervescent Glenn Greenwald

but never refreshing, ha ha ha, I crack me up!
Good morning Lizards!

227 goddamnedfrank  Sun, Oct 6, 2013 4:53:20am

In Portland OR a 40 year old non smoker can get a Platinum plan with a $100 deductible and a $1K out of pocket max for $289.17 per month. $10 office copay, $10 generic $20 brand name copay. With that plan your absolute worst case scenario including premiums is $4470 per year. I’ve seen the cheap non ACA plans people are comparing these to with deductibles as high as $10K before any real benefit kicks in. Healthnet CommunityCare POS Platinum $10/$100/$1,000.

228 Absalom, Absalom, Obdicut  Sun, Oct 6, 2013 5:09:53am

re: #227 goddamnedfrank

My reaction to what I saw I could get under the ACA was “Wow, this is what insurance used to be like, twenty years ago.”

229 A Mom Anon  Sun, Oct 6, 2013 5:27:54am

re: #208 goddamnedfrank

Or he could be lying his ass off and ends up with an ACA policy. I would not be at all surprised to find that some of the loudest howlers about this also either have or will buy insurance on the exchanges.

230 Decatur Deb  Sun, Oct 6, 2013 5:42:37am

re: #218 Sol Berdinowitz

The strategy is to convince enough people to opt out of ACA to further the assertion that ACA does not work.

Scary part is, they could succeed on this one: if they get enough young people to opt out of it, then the pool of insured will be skewered to the older and infirm and raise rates.

Creepy Uncle Sam approves this message.

Image: creepy-uncle-sam1.jpg

231 A Mom Anon  Sun, Oct 6, 2013 5:48:01am

re: #207 sagehen

Nah, you’re not old, she’s just not that talented. If it weren’t for auto tune, a semi famous one hit wonder dad, or that she was a Disney (or Nickelodeon? I forget) creation via Hannah Montana, no one would have heard of her. I think when a kid gets robbed of any sort of childhood to be famous it fucks up their head. It doesn’t happen to every kid actor/singer/musician/model, but it seems to happen a lot. I think it goes back to not being allowed to be a kid and being seen as a money maker/meal ticket that’s the biggest issue. Not to mention the possibility of being abused and taken advantage of when lots of money is at stake.

232 A Mom Anon  Sun, Oct 6, 2013 5:50:10am

….and again No Dog Walk, No Peace. And then I have to prep the back deck for staining this week after the rain rolls through this afternoon and tomorrow, BBL today. Stay Scaly, my friends.

233 Vicious Babushka  Sun, Oct 6, 2013 6:06:38am

re: #193 Varek Raith

Alouette’s family team???
/Going to hell

My family team is the DETROIT TIGERS and don’t any of you forget it!

234 Absalom, Absalom, Obdicut  Sun, Oct 6, 2013 6:06:56am

Aw. This is cute.

Image: EAEhuQg.jpg

235 Decatur Deb  Sun, Oct 6, 2013 6:08:17am

re: #234 Absalom, Absalom, Obdicut

Aw. This is cute.

Image: EAEhuQg.jpg

Doesn’t come up readable—no embiggener.

236 Vicious Babushka  Sun, Oct 6, 2013 6:11:55am

The Washington Redskins can keep their team name, all they need to do is change their mascot.

Mash ‘em, Spuds!

237 Gus  Sun, Oct 6, 2013 6:27:43am

Pokes head in. Checks to see if accounting class is still going on…

238 Gus  Sun, Oct 6, 2013 6:37:39am

So basically the USG is going to subsidize health insurance companies by way of helping people pay monthly premiums that really aren’t being reduced by said companies.

239 Absalom, Absalom, Obdicut  Sun, Oct 6, 2013 6:39:35am

re: #235 Decatur Deb

Open it in a new tab and embiggen at your will.

240 Absalom, Absalom, Obdicut  Sun, Oct 6, 2013 6:40:31am

re: #238 Gus

So basically the USG is going to subsidize health insurance companies by way of helping people pay monthly premiums that really aren’t being reduced by said companies.

Except the ACA has the profit provision in it, which caps profits and mandates a certain amount that the insurance companies have to pay towards actual treatment.

I wish they’d do a similar thing with pharm companies, and mandate that their R&D expenditures had to be higher than their marketing.

241 Gus  Sun, Oct 6, 2013 6:55:51am

re: #240 Absalom, Absalom, Obdicut

Except the ACA has the profit provision in it, which caps profits and mandates a certain amount that the insurance companies have to pay towards actual treatment.

I wish they’d do a similar thing with pharm companies, and mandate that their R&D expenditures had to be higher than their marketing.

What about hospital profits?

242 sagehen  Sun, Oct 6, 2013 7:02:09am

re: #241 Gus

What about hospital profits?

Hospitals get a bonus if they vigorously pursue infection reduction procedures, the team treatment paradigm developed by Mayo, and any other means that any hospital or state board comes up with to reduce readmissions… which means less medicare claims, less insurance claims for the younger-than-medicare, etc… which will increase hospital profits while simultaneously reducing costs to the system and providing better outcomes .

243 Gus  Sun, Oct 6, 2013 7:03:52am

re: #242 sagehen

Hospitals get a bonus if they vigorously pursue infection reduction procedures, the team treatment paradigm developed by Mayo, and any other means that any hospital or state board comes up with to reduce readmissions… which means less medicare claims, less insurance claims for the younger-than-medicare, etc… which will increase hospital profits while simultaneously reducing costs to the system and providing better outcomes .

OK. Thanks.

244 Gus  Sun, Oct 6, 2013 7:04:03am

bbl

245 Sol Berdinowitz  Sun, Oct 6, 2013 7:06:54am

re: #228 Absalom, Absalom, Obdicut

My reaction to what I saw I could get under the ACA was “Wow, this is what insurance used to be like, twenty years ago.”

You see, Obama hates progress!

/

246 Absalom, Absalom, Obdicut  Sun, Oct 6, 2013 7:08:06am

re: #241 Gus

What about hospital profits?

The number of hospitals that are for-profit is actually pretty small. It’s smaller than the number of straight-up government hospitals, and is much smaller than the number of non-profit private hospitals (like the teaching hospitals associated with med schools). Most for-profit medical care takes place in the context of the doctor’s office rather than the hospital.

That said, the ACA has a very significant, and, to me, very welcome change. For for-profit hospitals that take medicare money, they’ve dispensed with the fee-for-service model and instead hospitals are paid per condition. This basically takes away the incentive to order unnecessary tests, and was a major source of medicare fraud or near-fraud. This is in place for non-profits too, but it has a more significant effect on for-profits.

Basically, the ACA now rewards outcomes more than efforts for for-profit hospitals.

247 Renaissance_Man  Sun, Oct 6, 2013 7:17:49am

re: #246 Absalom, Absalom, Obdicut

The number of hospitals that are for-profit is actually pretty small. It’s smaller than the number of straight-up government hospitals, and is much smaller than the number of non-profit private hospitals (like the teaching hospitals associated with med schools). Most for-profit medical care takes place in the context of the doctor’s office rather than the hospital.

Even the ‘non-profit’ teaching hospitals associated with med schools, however, have significant amounts of financial waste. The administrative costs of those hospitals remain unacceptably high, with millions of dollars funneled into executive pay, advertising and administration rather than to things that benefit patient care, or even to health care worker salaries.

And the teaching hospitals absolutely use chargemasters, which is simply repellent.

248 freetoken  Sun, Oct 6, 2013 7:25:00am

re: #237 Gus

Pokes head in. Checks to see if accounting class is still going on…

The class will now factor the following:


axn + baxyi + by-i

249 Semper Fi  Sun, Oct 6, 2013 7:27:12am

re: #248 freetoken

The class will now factor the following:

axn + baxyi + by-i

I was told there would be no math…

Good morning everyone.

250 darthstar  Sun, Oct 6, 2013 7:28:34am

re: #237 Gus

Pokes head in. Checks to see if accounting class is still going on…

If John gets three tax cuts and Susie gets two tax cuts, how much do we need to cut Enrique’s supplemental nutrition assistance benefit to be net positive?

251 darthstar  Sun, Oct 6, 2013 7:34:19am

Heh, I responded to the Hillary button tweet last night by saying it was how #Jesus would campaign if he were campaigning against Hillary, and I got retweeted by Jesus…and Jesus Loves Us. Jesus_verified_ only has 428 followers, by the way….and appears to be an autobot (as is bless2-bless, the other Jesus) that retweets anything that has the hashtag #jesus in it.

This could be fun.

252 Dr Lizardo  Sun, Oct 6, 2013 7:35:04am

re: #248 freetoken

The class will now factor the following:

axn + baxyi + by-i

Image: 15p4jf8.jpg

253 Carlos Danger  Sun, Oct 6, 2013 7:38:27am

It’s pretty much academic by this point, but if any clowns tell you in real life that Obama personally told the National Park Rangers to make people’s lives harder for them, the meme started with a uncorroborated quote from the Washington Fucking Times.

254 darthstar  Sun, Oct 6, 2013 7:39:17am


The result? Republicans have become incredibly lazy. After all, why bother constructing a coherent argument if you don’t need one.

So why is it a problem? Well, for one thing, it means that it’s easy for Republican politicians to fall deep within an information feedback loop, not even realizing that what everyone within that loop is excited about is unpopular, or perhaps just irrelevant, to the other 80 percent or so of the nation. Or to put it another way: Benghazi!

255 Carlos Danger  Sun, Oct 6, 2013 7:43:44am

re: #254 darthstar

Speaking of incoherency, suddenly Scott Walker looooooooves parks- after cutting funding for rail to trails to nil and various other statewide environmental protection agencies.

256 lawhawk  Sun, Oct 6, 2013 7:43:50am

re: #253 Carlos Danger

257 wheat-dogghazi  Sun, Oct 6, 2013 7:44:39am

re: #231 A Mom Anon

Nah, you’re not old, she’s just not that talented. If it weren’t for auto tune, a semi famous one hit wonder dad, or that she was a Disney (or Nickelodeon? I forget) creation via Hannah Montana, no one would have heard of her. I think when a kid gets robbed of any sort of childhood to be famous it fucks up their head. It doesn’t happen to every kid actor/singer/musician/model, but it seems to happen a lot. I think it goes back to not being allowed to be a kid and being seen as a money maker/meal ticket that’s the biggest issue. Not to mention the possibility of being abused and taken advantage of when lots of money is at stake.

Miley Cyrus is a manufactured and packaged product, following in the dubious footsteps of Britney Spears and Lindsay Lohan. Disney used her up while she was still young enough to be Hannah Montana, but once she got “too old” Disney dropped her like a hot potato. Her acting, singing and dancing chops are not all that great, kinda like Britney’s and Lindsay’s. On the other hand, Xtina Aguilera, another Disney kid, actually seems to have verifiable talent and she not a total train wreck now.

258 Killgore Trout  Sun, Oct 6, 2013 7:46:27am

re: #243 Gus

OK. Thanks.

Have you checked your exchange yet? Are you going to be able to get some insurance?

259 Carlos Danger  Sun, Oct 6, 2013 7:47:22am

These people are goddamn stupid if they think it’s a conspiracy with the marching orders coming from the president himself. It’s like the White House tours thing, except they can point at the whole government this time.

260 lawhawk  Sun, Oct 6, 2013 7:48:05am

re: #255 Carlos Danger

National Parks funding has been slashed, with GOP emphasis on reducing role of NPS. It means backlog of infrastructure repairs mounts, adding to the already high costs. Add natural disasters damaging facilities around the nation, whether it’s pier and electrical damage to the Statue of Liberty, washing away roads in Sandy Hook or Olympic National Park, or wildfires that damaged Yosemite and the adjacent national forests, the list keeps growing.

Aging infrastructure like visitors centers that were built in the early years of the parks, restrooms that waste water or strain local resources, all need to be fixed. The need is there, but not enough money.

261 piratedan  Sun, Oct 6, 2013 7:49:34am

re: #259 Carlos Danger

These people are goddamn stupid if they think it’s a conspiracy with the marching orders coming from the president himself. It’s like the White House tours thing, except they can point at the whole government this time.

they want to make him Nixon, you know, the spider sitting in the center of the web, manipulating government and people accordingly… pure projection again, it seems that if we could only harness this ability we could apply it in astronomy and astrophysics for the greater good.

262 wheat-dogghazi  Sun, Oct 6, 2013 7:52:57am

re: #261 piratedan

Obama is using his mind control powers to make the shutdown happen! He even has the Tea Party thinking they’re the ones who came up with the whole shutdown formula.

//

263 Eclectic Cyborg  Sun, Oct 6, 2013 7:55:36am

The system changeover at work is getting messy.

Completion of it is already delayed at least three or four days. We were supposed to be halfway finished by this weekend, we’re more like a third of the way right now.

Additionally, in order to pull this off, things need to be properly co-ordinated between about oh, four or five different departments. Well it just so happens one of those departments didn’t really have their shit together causing significant headaches for rest of us.

Three days ago, we went ahead and prepped a large segment of machines to be switched over only to a get a memo the NEXT DAY that, due to the delay in implementation, we would have to go in and change all those machines BACK because god forbid any of them not be working this weekend.

So thanks to that we had to spend several hours effectively “de-converting” machines thanks to that other department. Hours in which we could have been at home doing other things.

We still have at least another week of this. Oh boy.

(there have been a few positives about it. I picked up a ton of OT this week)

264 lawhawk  Sun, Oct 6, 2013 7:56:22am

GOP -

OMG the government socialist website for health care insurance exchanges is down this weekend for upgrades.

Me: Chase Bank regularly limits access on weekends to conduct upgrades. No online bill pay, limited access to accounts, mortgage information, etc.

Same with Amex and Capital One.

Every financial company regularly shuts at least a portion of their online sites for upgrades and maintenance.

It would be out of character for the govt exchange not to have upgrades, especially if there are problems discovered in the course of the first week of operation. No matter how much you plan on a rollout of a new product, there’s always glitches.

Heck, happens in manufacturing too. First generation of a new model car will have problems addressed in the following year model. Heck, Honda was slammed for a poor redesign of the Civic a few years back and the company rolled out a mid-year model revamp due to low ratings and to address problems in the new model rollout.

But that’s not what worried the GOP. It’s that the ACA exchanges will be successful - whether it’s taking 10 million and providing them insurance, or 40 million. That would completely undermine and eviscerate their opposition to the entire law.

It’s also why the GOP is trying to pivot away from the ACA/Obamacare argument, but the shutdown remains entirely tied to their opposition and placing poison pill provisions in the continuing resolutions.

265 darthstar  Sun, Oct 6, 2013 7:56:34am
266 sagehen  Sun, Oct 6, 2013 8:01:00am

re: #257 wheat-dogghazi

Miley Cyrus is a manufactured and packaged product, following in the dubious footsteps of Britney Spears and Lindsay Lohan. Disney used her up while she was still young enough to be Hannah Montana, but once she got “too old” Disney dropped her like a hot potato. Her acting, singing and dancing chops are not all that great, kinda like Britney’s and Lindsay’s. On the other hand, Xtina Aguilera, another Disney kid, actually seems to have verifiable talent and she not a total train wreck now.

Ima disagree; Britney’s a terrific dancer, and she’s made great producer/material choices, and Lindsay can really act — they’re not hacks. Being totally screwed up people who can’t run their own lives doesn’t alter that.

(btw, kudos to the Disney casting director who chose Britney, Xtina, Justin Timberlake and Ryan Gosling all for the same Mickey Mouse Club 93-95 cast. Somebody gets to call himself the most successful talent-spotter of his generation).

267 darthstar  Sun, Oct 6, 2013 8:02:25am

re: #257 wheat-dogghazi

Miley Cyrus is a manufactured and packaged product, following in the dubious footsteps of Britney Spears and Lindsay Lohan. Disney used her up while she was still young enough to be Hannah Montana, but once she got “too old” Disney dropped her like a hot potato. Her acting, singing and dancing chops are not all that great, kinda like Britney’s and Lindsay’s. On the other hand, Xtina Aguilera, another Disney kid, actually seems to have verifiable talent and she not a total train wreck now.

They’re all a bunch of Honey Boo Boos.

268 darthstar  Sun, Oct 6, 2013 8:03:36am

re: #266 sagehen

(btw, kudos to the Disney casting director who chose Britney, Xtina, Justin Timberlake and Ryan Gosling all for the same Mickey Mouse Club 93-95 cast. Somebody gets to call himself the most successful talent-spotter of his generation).

Well…that’s a coincidence.

269 Decatur Deb  Sun, Oct 6, 2013 8:03:57am

re: #263 Eclectic Cyborg

The system changeover at work is getting messy.

Completion of it is already delayed at least three or four days. We were supposed to be halfway finished by this weekend, we’re more like a third of the way right now.

Additionally, in order to pull this off, things need to be properly co-ordinated between about oh, four or five different departments. Well it just so happens one of those departments didn’t really have their shit together causing significant headaches for rest of us.

Three days ago, we went ahead and prepped a large segment of machines to be switched over only to a get a memo the NEXT DAY that, due to the delay in implementation, we would have to go in and change all those machines BACK because god forbid any of them not be working this weekend.

So thanks to that we had to spend several hours effectively “de-converting” machines thanks to that other department. Hours in which we could have been at home doing other things.

We still have at least another week of this. Oh boy.

(there have been a few positives about it. I picked up a ton of OT this week)

Best way to fix that is to declare 40% of your workforce ‘non-essential’ and lay them off.

270 darthstar  Sun, Oct 6, 2013 8:04:38am

Oh, for fuck’s sake…Chuck Todd…really?

271 freetoken  Sun, Oct 6, 2013 8:05:34am

Fox’s Megyn Kelly: Don’t expect a fire-breathing partisan when I move to prime time

“I’ve never wanted to be an opinion host, and Roger Ailes hasn’t wanted me to be an opinion host,” she said. “I don’t think I’d be very successful anyway. I’m not an ideologue, and I think you have to be successful in a prime-time opinion-based show. I think I’m too moderate and reasonable.”

Hmmm….

272 Eclectic Cyborg  Sun, Oct 6, 2013 8:09:41am

I know people here in the South that are quite upset about the shutdown and being furloughed but are STILL die hard TPers and STILL blaming Obama for the entire mess we’re in.

273 Joanne  Sun, Oct 6, 2013 8:09:59am

re: #3 FemNaziBitch

Does anyone have any recommendations for a Unit Converter iPhone app?

Units for everything. I like Exchange LE for money when I’m traveling.

274 wheat-dogghazi  Sun, Oct 6, 2013 8:10:55am

re: #266 sagehen

Ima disagree; Britney’s a terrific dancer, and she’s made great producer/material choices, and Lindsay can really act — they’re not hacks. Being totally screwed up people who can’t run their own lives doesn’t alter that.

(btw, kudos to the Disney casting director who chose Britney, Xtina, Justin Timberlake and Ryan Gosling all for the same Mickey Mouse Club 93-95 cast. Somebody gets to call himself the most successful talent-spotter of his generation).

Britney was a terrific dancer. From the recent reviews I’ve read, she’s lost her edge. Lohan can act, yes, but is also a handful on the set, when she bothered to arrive at all. For whatever reasons, those two peaked before they even hit 30. Aguilera may be able to pull off being a successful singer/dancer past 30, but not to the extent that Madonna has managed. Miley’s career might just peak out next year, unless she follows Sinead O’Connor’s advice and stops trying to shock, instead of entertain.

275 Decatur Deb  Sun, Oct 6, 2013 8:11:04am

re: #272 Eclectic Cyborg

I know people here in the South that are quite upset about the shutdown and being furloughed but are STILL die hard TPers and STILL blaming Obama for the entire mess we’re in.

The shutdown hasn’t made him any whiter.

276 Killgore Trout  Sun, Oct 6, 2013 8:11:36am

Another Obamacare consideration for those who buy their own insurance just occurred to me: Tax liability. Those who buy their own insurance are accustomed to offsetting the cost through tax write offs at the end of the year. In my case, I’m due to about $2,000 in subsidies whch is a nice chunk of change but that’s also $2,000 that I can’t write off at the end of the year. Technically there’s no real savings there but it also frees up $2,000 that I can invest in my business, take an extra business trip, fly business class instead of coach, invest in tools, etc. Something to consider to avoid sticker shock at tax time.

277 Sol Berdinowitz  Sun, Oct 6, 2013 8:13:08am

re: #265 darthstar

Paperwork for 49ers S Donte Whitner to change name to “Hitner” cannot be processed due to government shutdown. Hitner shut down for now.

He should change his first name to Adolf…

278 freetoken  Sun, Oct 6, 2013 8:14:22am

File this one under “What Theocracy?”:

Bible studies prevail over beer pong in new faith-based dorms at Alabama university

Tucked in rural southeast Alabama, Troy University has opened something that’s a rarity for a public college in the United States: A faith-based dorm community where daily Bible studies are common and beer drinking is strictly forbidden.

[…]

In one lobby, a wall is covered with fliers inviting students to Christian worship services and a daily prayer session, and slips of paper with Bible verses sit on the welcome desk.

Indeed, the Wisconsin-based Freedom From Religion Foundation has complained the dorms are an unconstitutional since religion is at the core. However, there have been few complaints aside from a column in the student newspaper and a handful of social media posts. No protests have been held on campus, which has had a nondenominational religious chapel for years.

University officials defend the arrangement as being more about promoting values and accommodating faithful students than proselytization, and they say a survey found that 75 percent of Troy students said faith was important to their college experience.

[…]

Coming up next is their dorm dedicated to having Koran versus on the walls… or maybe not.

279 Decatur Deb  Sun, Oct 6, 2013 8:15:35am

re: #276 Killgore Trout

Another Obamacare consideration for those who buy their own insurance just occurred to me: Tax liability. Those who buy their own insurance are accustomed to offsetting the cost through tax write offs at the end of the year. In my case, I’m due to about $2,000 in subsidies whch is a nice chunk of change but that’s also $2,000 that I can’t write off at the end of the year. Technically there’s no real savings there but it also frees up $2,000 that I can invest in my business, take an extra business trip, fly business class instead of coach, invest in tools, etc. Something to consider to avoid sticker shock at tax time.

If there were any advantage in not taking your Premium Tax Credit in monthly shots straight to the insurance comapany, you can do that. it’s recommended that most people not take the entire distribution, saving a little credit to avoid a jolt at tax time. (Someone who gets a substantial income increase early in the year might end up owing a repayment otherwise.)

280 Decatur Deb  Sun, Oct 6, 2013 8:21:49am

re: #278 freetoken

File this one under “What Theocracy?”:

Bible studies prevail over beer pong in new faith-based dorms at Alabama university

Coming up next is their dorm dedicated to having Koran versus on the walls… or maybe not.

The land leasing arrangement is questionable, but the construction money was raised by the (mostly Catholic) churches involved. Priest running it was assistant pastor at Wife’s church. I’m surprised any hardshell types would want their kids bunked with the idol-worshiping Catholics.

281 sattv4u2  Sun, Oct 6, 2013 8:22:32am

re: #276 Killgore Trout

it also frees up $2,000 that I can invest in my business, take an extra business trip, fly business class instead of coach, invest in tools, etc.

Whats a gross of tadpoles going for nowadays!?!?

282 Decatur Deb  Sun, Oct 6, 2013 8:24:08am

re: #281 sattv4u2


it also frees up $2,000 that I can invest in my business, take an extra business trip, fly business class instead of coach, invest in tools, etc.

Whats a gross of tadpoles going for nowadays!?!?

Can’t expect prize tadpoles to fly coach.

283 Carlos Danger  Sun, Oct 6, 2013 8:25:05am

re: #278 freetoken

Never trust a teetotaler…

284 freetoken  Sun, Oct 6, 2013 8:27:37am

Don’t know if it is the WaPo or the AP, but there is a feeling about a stream of articles that seem to be engineered with a certain end in mind, namely to be as anti-adversarial as possible. I’m wondering if the editors are trying to compensate for the Greenwald-factor. Anyway, those nasty environmentalists have apparently seen the gas light:

Some anti-drilling activists change tactics, sign leases and try to work with industry

For years, activists have warned that fracking can have disastrous consequences — ruined water and air, sickened people and animals, a ceaseless parade of truck traffic.

Now some critics are doing what was once unthinkable: working with the industry. Some are even signing lucrative gas leases and speaking about the environmental benefits of gas.

[…]

A few weeks ago, Victoria Switzer and other activists from Dimock endorsed a candidate for governor who supports natural gas production from gigantic [e.d., yeah, real objective here] reserves like the Marcellus Shale, albeit with more regulation and new taxes. Dimock was the centerpiece of “Gasland,” a documentary that galvanized opposition to fracking, and Switzer was also featured in this summer’s “Gasland Part II,” which aired on HBO.

“We had to work with the industry. There is no magic wand to make this go away,” said Switzer, who recently formed a group that seeks to work with drillers on improved air quality standards. “Tunnel vision isn’t good. Realism is good.”

[…]

285 Eclectic Cyborg  Sun, Oct 6, 2013 8:30:14am

Want to see ignorance at its finest?

I give you…the Facebook Page of the MS GOP.

286 freetoken  Sun, Oct 6, 2013 8:30:44am

The real lesson of that article is that the average person will bend to the rich and powerful (in this case cash-rich energy companies.)

287 Carlos Danger  Sun, Oct 6, 2013 8:31:42am

Saw this on poilitcalwire…

“Shortly after President Obama started his second term, a loose-knit coalition of conservative activists led by former Attorney General Edwin Meese III gathered in the capital to plot strategy. Their push to repeal Mr. Obama’s health care law was going nowhere, and they desperately needed a new plan,” the New York Times reports.

“Out of that session, held one morning in a location the members insist on keeping secret, came a little-noticed ‘blueprint to defunding Obamacare,’ signed by Mr. Meese and leaders of more than three dozen conservative groups.”

Meese! That goes back to Reagan.

288 Killgore Trout  Sun, Oct 6, 2013 8:32:08am

re: #281 sattv4u2


it also frees up $2,000 that I can invest in my business, take an extra business trip, fly business class instead of coach, invest in tools, etc.

Whats a gross of tadpoles going for nowadays!?!?

The tadpole market is booming and slug futures are plummeting!

289 freetoken  Sun, Oct 6, 2013 8:32:53am

You’ll never hear the moderate and reasonable Megyn Kelly ever saying the average American is “bowing” to energy giants, though.

290 Mattand  Sun, Oct 6, 2013 8:33:02am

re: #271 freetoken

Fox’s Megyn Kelly: Don’t expect a fire-breathing partisan when I move to prime time

“I’ve never wanted to be an opinion host, and Roger Ailes hasn’t wanted me to be an opinion host,” she said. “I don’t think I’d be very successful anyway. I’m not an ideologue, and I think you have to be successful in a prime-time opinion-based show. I think I’m too moderate and reasonable.”

Hmmm…

Sure, just like Bill O’Reilly is an “independent”.

What a load of bullshit.

291 Decatur Deb  Sun, Oct 6, 2013 8:38:16am

re: #285 Eclectic Cyborg

Want to see ignorance at its finest?

I give you…the Facebook Page of the MS GOP.

Some IT intern is in for it. Didn’t he know you’re supposed to include one African American face and one Spanish surname?

292 Killgore Trout  Sun, Oct 6, 2013 8:40:27am

Libyan Government Demands Explanation After U.S. Raid

A day after American commandos carried out raids in two African countries aimed at capturing fugitive terrorist suspects, Libya’s interim government on Sunday demanded an explanation from Washington for what it called the “kidnapping” of a Libyan suspect.

Sorry ‘bout that.

293 Lidane  Sun, Oct 6, 2013 8:41:29am
294 sattv4u2  Sun, Oct 6, 2013 8:41:54am

re: #292 Killgore Trout

Libyan Government Demands Explanation After U.S. Raid

Sorry ‘bout that.

“Ooopppsss!” always works

295 Killgore Trout  Sun, Oct 6, 2013 8:42:47am

re: #292 Killgore Trout

Libyan Government Demands Explanation After U.S. Raid

Sorry ‘bout that.

It will be interesting to learn what variety of rendition these guys go through but I guess it could be a year or more before they appear in court and have a lawyer to complain about it to the press.

296 Targetpractice  Sun, Oct 6, 2013 8:43:09am

re: #293 Lidane

[Embedded content]

The last default wasn’t that bad, this one won’t be so bad either! You gotta stop believing in Obama’s scaremongering! We have more to fear from Obamacare than a default!

297 Lidane  Sun, Oct 6, 2013 8:44:17am
298 Eclectic Cyborg  Sun, Oct 6, 2013 8:48:08am

We’re entering a worrisome time window here folks. Let’s say the GOP finally cracks and passes a CR tomorrow. We STILL have the debt ceiling coming in a mere 10 days and a high probability of more shenanigans over that.

The next two weeks will be very interesting.

299 freetoken  Sun, Oct 6, 2013 8:49:55am

Chinese media are pushing this story:


U.S. scientists boycott NASA meeting to protest China ban

Several prominent scientists in exoplanet research have decided to boycott a NASA conference after learning Chinese researchers are barred from attending by the space agency, which cited national security as its reason.

The meeting is scheduled to take place at the space agency’s Ames Research Center in California this November and will include both U.S. and international teams who work on NASA’s exoplanet-hunting Kepler space telescope program.

But Chinese researchers, including those who worked at U.S. universities and other institutions, were denied the opportunity to attend the meeting. NASA officials reportedly said the rejection is in accordance with a law passed first in March 2011 that prohibits government funds from being used to host Chinese nationals at NASA facilities.

Now, NASA is facing a backlash as several big names in exoplanet research, including Debra Fischer, who leads a research group at Yale University, and Geoff Marcy, an astronomy professor at the University of California, Berkeley, who has been tipped to win a Nobel prize for his pioneering work on exoplanets, announced that they will pull out of the meeting in protest.

[…]

The problem is because of the location, Ames Research Center.

While I can understand the astronomers’ frustrations, I think is it incredibly naive for Marcy and some of the rest to sound so surprised. Even if astronomers have their heads in above the clouds most of the time they’ve got to have had some knowledge of this now 2.5 year old law.

And frankly, if the gov’t closures continue, they’re going to have much bigger problems on their hands.

300 freetoken  Sun, Oct 6, 2013 8:51:04am

re: #298 Eclectic Cyborg

One of the many outdated things about our Constitution is the fund raising requirements. We really need to have multi-year money and move beyond a 12 month do or die schedule.

301 Eventual Carrion  Sun, Oct 6, 2013 8:52:09am

re: #288 Killgore Trout

The tadpole market is booming and slug futures are plummeting!

Headline:
Tadpole market swimming, Slug market drying up!

302 freetoken  Sun, Oct 6, 2013 8:52:11am

What everyone should discover in their safe deposit box:

Possible Leonardo da Vinci Artwork Found in Swiss Vault

303 Eclectic Cyborg  Sun, Oct 6, 2013 8:52:29am

re: #299 freetoken

I still don’t get it. Why are the Chinese such a threat and everyone else isn’t?

304 freetoken  Sun, Oct 6, 2013 8:53:58am

re: #303 Eclectic Cyborg

My guess is that the law came from a perfect storm of backlashes - from piracy to cyber-warfare to, well, just plain old paranoia.

305 Renaissance_Man  Sun, Oct 6, 2013 8:55:20am

re: #298 Eclectic Cyborg

We’re entering a worrisome time window here folks. Let’s say the GOP finally cracks and passes a CR tomorrow. We STILL have the debt ceiling coming in a mere 10 days and a high probability of more shenanigans over that.

The next two weeks will be very interesting.

I think it highly unlikely that the shutdown will end before Oct 17. It’s just not enough of a concern. A quick scan of this morning’s headlines shows me that not a single shutdown story of any significance is front page news. As long as college football and the NFL are going on, and as long as the political entertainment on CNN and FOX continues to titillate, America as a whole largely doesn’t care. Sure, hundreds of thousands of people aren’t being paid, and hundreds of thousands more are going without their services, but that’s not entertaining enough to make news.

306 Lidane  Sun, Oct 6, 2013 8:55:26am
307 freetoken  Sun, Oct 6, 2013 8:55:30am

IIRC, back around 2010 wasn’t there a big leak of classified weapons data that was taken out of the country by someone who was Chinese. Maybe it was in 2008 or 2009.

308 Eclectic Cyborg  Sun, Oct 6, 2013 8:57:59am

re: #307 freetoken

IIRC, back around 2010 wasn’t there a big leak of classified weapons data that was taken out of the country by someone who was Chinese. Maybe it was in 2008 or 2009.

Are you referring to the Los Alamos incident?

309 freetoken  Sun, Oct 6, 2013 8:58:41am

re: #308 Eclectic Cyborg

I think so.

310 piratedan  Sun, Oct 6, 2013 9:02:54am

re: #303 Eclectic Cyborg

well they are one of the last of the old school Communist regimes and they have no issue with allowing their citizens be subject to sweatshop working conditions and have a hellacious number of bodies assigned (allegedly) to blocking information from the web from influencing its citizens. Lets say their civil rights history isn’t exactly exemplary and they still have a fairly significant standing army. In the realm of cyber warfare, I think they’re the number one threat, certainly true for industrial espionage from what I’ve read.

311 SnowdenBaggerVance  Sun, Oct 6, 2013 9:04:19am

re: #285 Eclectic Cyborg

Want to see ignorance at its finest?

I give you…the Facebook Page of the MS GOP.

Hard to tell the difference between the GOP pages, pages for propaganda blogs like CNS News, and outright plain old nutter bloggers.

312 Lidane  Sun, Oct 6, 2013 9:04:52am
313 ObserverArt  Sun, Oct 6, 2013 9:06:10am

re: #274 wheat-dogghazi

Britney was a terrific dancer. From the recent reviews I’ve read, she’s lost her edge. Lohan can act, yes, but is also a handful on the set, when she bothered to arrive at all. For whatever reasons, those two peaked before they even hit 30. Aguilera may be able to pull off being a successful singer/dancer past 30, but not to the extent that Madonna has managed. Miley’s career might just peak out next year, unless she follows Sinead O’Connor’s advice and stops trying to shock, instead of entertain.

Britney can dance. Great occupation for a singer.

Miley can sing. She should try it sometime.

To me the problem still comes down to true artistry versus music pushed out by a corporation. Sure corporate labels can make big stars of Modanna and Timberlake, but are they really as talented as the way lesser known artists slaving away in small clubs or mid-size halls where they can’t hide behind video production and vocal manipulation?

I used to piss people off when back in the day everyone would argue over who was the best guitarist ever…Jimi, Eric, Jeff, Jimmy, on and on. I would always throw in some names like Gary Moore, Alvin Lee, Jim McCarty, and then say but even they might not be the best. Well then who? Well, the best guitarist in the world might live in a shack deep in the woods of upstate New York but doesn’t play in clubs. Just because we may not have heard of him doesn’t mean he wasn’t the best.

I keep that in mind about all the arts. And being in the arts that keeps me going.

I remember an interview with William S. Burroughs where a star struck interviewer asked what special insight Burroughs could give to upstart writers. Burroughs in his deep voice said he had only one suggestion. Write.

314 ObserverArt  Sun, Oct 6, 2013 9:10:30am

re: #287 Carlos Danger

Saw this on poilitcalwire…

Meese! That goes back to Reagan.

Old Republican never go away. They are made into the chassis of the GOP Clown Cars. It’s about the only recycling they believe in.

315 ObserverArt  Sun, Oct 6, 2013 9:11:28am

re: #290 Mattand

Hmmm…

Sure, just like Bill O’Reilly is an “independent”.

What a load of bullshit.

Lipstick. Now, where is that damn piggy?

316 Lidane  Sun, Oct 6, 2013 9:12:36am
317 Killgore Trout  Sun, Oct 6, 2013 9:13:25am

This could be interesting…
Egypt Turns Back Palestinian Pilgrims, Mulls Gaza Military Action

Egyptians might be able to deal with Hamas more effectively than the Israelis. Somebody has to do it eventually.

318 Lidane  Sun, Oct 6, 2013 9:15:15am

We’re being held hostage by economic terrorists:

319 sattv4u2  Sun, Oct 6, 2013 9:15:31am

re: #317 Killgore Trout

This could be interesting…
Egypt Turns Back Palestinian Pilgrims, Mulls Gaza Military Action

Egyptians might be able to deal with Hamas more effectively than the Israelis. Somebody has to do it eventually.

That would be interesting to see from the standpoint of when/if Israel tries they are vilified by just about the entire Arab world. I wonder what the reaction would be if Egypt were to crack down?

320 Decatur Deb  Sun, Oct 6, 2013 9:16:07am

re: #318 Lidane

We’re being held hostage by economic terrorists:

[Embedded content]

He stared into the derp, and the derp stared back.

321 PhillyPretzel  Sun, Oct 6, 2013 9:16:38am

re: #318 Lidane

Ah yes Mr Hissy Fit and now I am going to hold my breath. Oy Vey.

322 lawhawk  Sun, Oct 6, 2013 9:20:33am

re: #313 ObserverArt

Best guitarist ever? You mean not Joe Satriani, who helped everyone from Kirk Hammett to Steve Vai and everyone in between become virtuosos in their own right?

Yngwie Malmsteen? He can shred and soar with anyone - and play everything to speed metal to Mozart and Paganini.

For every Britney and Miley Cyrus, there’s a Black Keys or Mumford and Sons or Lumineers or FUN who catch on with success without the need to rely on autotune and computer wizardry to make their sound happen.

Heck, even though NIN is really a one man wrecking crew in Trent Reznor, he thinks about music classically and his arrangements are among the most complex in music today. Plays all instruments too. And uses new tech to supplement and expand the musical range, instead of relying on it as a crutch.

That’s the difference - a lot of corporate creations like Britney and Miley have come to rely on the tech to make their mark. And that doesn’t get into lip syncing.

323 sagehen  Sun, Oct 6, 2013 9:22:10am

re: #292 Killgore Trout

Libyan Government Demands Explanation After U.S. Raid

Sorry ‘bout that.

Our explanation? It’s that the last time we counted on you to take care of our security, it didn’t go so well for us. We thought we’d see what happens if we do it ourselves this time. And sorry to have to break it to you, but… we’re pretty happy with the results.

324 jaunte  Sun, Oct 6, 2013 9:27:41am

A Federal Budget Crisis Months in the Planning

freedomworks.org

“… The current budget brinkmanship is just the latest development in a well-financed, broad-based assault on the health law, Mr. Obama’s signature legislative initiative. Groups like Tea Party Patriots, Americans for Prosperity and FreedomWorks are all immersed in the fight, as is Club for Growth, a business-backed nonprofit organization. Some, like Generation Opportunity and Young Americans for Liberty, both aimed at young adults, are upstarts. Heritage Action is new, too, founded in 2010 to advance the policy prescriptions of its sister group, the Heritage Foundation.

The billionaire Koch brothers, Charles and David, have been deeply involved with financing the overall effort. A group linked to the Kochs, Freedom Partners Chamber of Commerce, disbursed more than $200 million last year to nonprofit organizations involved in the fight.”

325 freetoken  Sun, Oct 6, 2013 9:30:07am

Catching up on a couple of days old news:

Chuck Smith, 86, Dies After Cancer Battle

Chuck Smith, the evangelical pastor whose outreach to hippies in the 1960s helped transform worship styles in American Christianity and fueled the rise of the Calvary Chapel movement, died Thursday, Oct. 3, 2013, after a battle with lung cancer. He was 86.

[…]

Smith could be best be described as a fundamentalist with a surf board. The whole Jesus movement of the 60’s sort of splintered, one way going fundamentalist and the other new age. Several wacky to far-right preachers came out of Smith’s movement, as well as some who might be seen as more traditional though very-religious.

America has a God-problem, and that is because we are a society of apples that have fallen from very religious apple-trees.

This whole suicide-Representative thing going on with the gov’t shutdown is born out in large part from a religious motivation.

I don’t expect President Obama, or even any of the Democratic Party leaders, to openly address this problem. They know they can wag their tongues at the Bible-clingers behind closed doors, but Obama found out real quickly he can’t talk about it in public.

It’s a taboo I’m waiting for a top public official to cross.

326 ObserverArt  Sun, Oct 6, 2013 9:38:08am

re: #322 lawhawk

Best guitarist ever? You mean not Joe Satriani, who helped everyone from Kirk Hammett to Steve Vai and everyone in between become virtuosos in their own right?

Lawhawk…I did say back in the (my) day. Those you mention are younger and by the time they came around, I was already past judging who the best was. I enjoy guitar playing in general and some speak to me more than others. That’s the beauty of the instrument and to art in general.

But back to my point, which I will make with your examples. The guy in the shack you never heard of might be better than Joe, Kirk and Steve.

Charles has turned me onto many a fine guitarist with some of the videos he has put up since I’ve been checking this site in early ‘09. I sort of wish he posted more (hint…hint). And they have been of all styles and ages. And his videos proved my theory to me. Some of them I had never heard of, and they were plenty talented.

327 Lidane  Sun, Oct 6, 2013 9:38:19am
328 jaunte  Sun, Oct 6, 2013 9:42:30am

Nothing to see here.

“Do you think you’ve hurt the Republican party brand?” asked CNN “State of the Union” host Candy Crowley.

“Not remotely,” Cruz laughed. “But I also think far too many people are worried about politics.”
opposingviews.com

329 Feline Fearless Leader  Sun, Oct 6, 2013 9:43:01am

Good afternoon Lizards. In Pittsburgh and about to leave shortly for tail-gate and then going to the baseball game later this afternoon.

And along the political front a blog link about another reason Obama and the Dems cannot back down.

stonekettle.com

330 Killgore Trout  Sun, Oct 6, 2013 9:44:34am

re: #319 sattv4u2

That would be interesting to see from the standpoint of when/if Israel tries they are vilified by just about the entire Arab world. I wonder what the reaction would be if Egypt were to crack down?

I imagine there would be some general grumbling but not too much. This does remind me that the Israelis tried to get the Egyptians to take over security in Gaza when the Israelis pulled out. Egyptians at the time wanted nothing to do with it but now they’re realizing the flow of terrorism across the border makes the situation unmanageable. It’s not unthinkable that the Egytians could take control of Gaza. If the military rulers show they’re transforming to a democratic society domestically there might not be too much complaining about them taking over Gaza as a temporary (although indefinite) measure. It would probably benefit the region greatly.

331 sattv4u2  Sun, Oct 6, 2013 9:47:40am

re: #330 Killgore Trout

It would probably benefit the region greatly.

i pray daily that something does

332 EPR-radar  Sun, Oct 6, 2013 9:53:34am

re: #318 Lidane

If Boehner ever wishes to be considered as being anything better than an ambulatory pile of dogshit, he will pass a clean CR and debt ceiling increase with enough (D) votes to offset the Teabaggers.

333 jaunte  Sun, Oct 6, 2013 9:54:20am

I look forward to him staying on the Palin path and quitting.

334 jaunte  Sun, Oct 6, 2013 9:55:03am
335 Killgore Trout  Sun, Oct 6, 2013 9:56:09am

Iranian press coverage of today’s events in Egypt is interesting: Anti-Israeli rallies turn violent across Egypt

A large number of demonstrators gathered in the capital Cairo to mark the 40th anniversary of the 1973 Arab-Israeli war.

The angry protesters who gathered in Cairo’s iconic Liberation Square to denounce Israel, burned the Zionist regime’s flag and called for the suspension of ties between Cairo and Tel Aviv.

The demonstrators also demanded the expulsion of the Israeli ambassador to Cairo.

The pro-Morsi Islamic group led by the Muslim Brotherhood had urged its supporters to stage mass rallies on the occasion across the North African country.

“The Egypt Anti-Coup Alliance repeats its call to all Egyptians to continue their protests in every part of Egypt, and to gather in Tahrir Square on Sunday, October 6, to celebrate the army of that victory and its leaders,” the group said in a statement.

heh

336 Lidane  Sun, Oct 6, 2013 9:58:06am

re: #334 jaunte

If Cruz expects Obama to rescind the ACA in exchange for the debt limit increase, he’s delusional. POTUS would be more likely to invoke the 14th Amendment and bypass Congress altogether.

337 Stanley Sea  Sun, Oct 6, 2013 9:58:43am

re: #327 Lidane

[Embedded content]

The boy is confused. “They killed America because they didn’t care about keeping Americans alive?” he asks.

heh

338 Dark_Falcon  Sun, Oct 6, 2013 9:59:14am

re: #2 darthstar

People don’t fear the creeper,
Not when Obama’s smiting Al Shabab
Don’t fear the creeper
He’s just a activist
Don’t fear the creeper
Just a fuckin’ blogger
Don’t fear the creeper
Not a real journalist
Don’t fear the creeper
He’s just Putin’s Biiiiiiiiitch..
Laaaa, la, la la, la la la daaaaa…

I missed this post last night and just read it now. It’s good, but it needs more cowbell.

339 piratedan  Sun, Oct 6, 2013 10:00:56am

link from the NYT

nytimes.com

Our current politically engineered crisis, apparently all part of the plan… based on their statements to the public, I guess we should have known that the TP is a wholly owned subsidiary of the Koch Brothers/AFP outfit and take their marching orders accordingly.

340 Stanley Sea  Sun, Oct 6, 2013 10:01:03am

re: #329 Feline Fearless Leader

Good afternoon Lizards. In Pittsburgh and about to leave shortly for tail-gate and then going to the baseball game later this afternoon.

And along the political front a blog link about another reason Obama and the Dems cannot back down.

stonekettle.com

Stonekettle Station is goood!

341 ObserverArt  Sun, Oct 6, 2013 10:04:23am

So an expose article like the “A Federal Budget Crisis Months in the Planning” article in the NY Times comes out.

Camera and mics capture Randy Paul and Mitch The Turtle talking about winning.

Mike Murphy, GOP strategist on Meet The Press Admits GOP Strategy a big mistake and saying he saw a recent pole where the GOP Congress has a 6% approval rating in a poll with a 5% fudge factor meaning absolutely no one approves.

And still, all of America isn’t pissed off enough and it hasn’t led to the GOP to cower in shame and get real.

What the hell is wrong with this picture? Other than no one seems to be looking at it.

Un(F’n)precendented,

I don’t think Huxley, Orwell and other authors could have thought it would all come so true.

342 Dark_Falcon  Sun, Oct 6, 2013 10:08:47am

re: #335 Killgore Trout

Iranian press coverage of today’s events in Egypt is interesting: Anti-Israeli rallies turn violent across Egypt

heh

Egypt celebrates the successful storming of the Bar-Lev line as a major victory. In fact while it was a operational victory, the felt need to aid the floundering Syrians caused Egypt to send its armor beyond the SAM/ATGM defenses its army had erected to try to seize the Gidi and Mitla passes in the Sinai.

The battle that followed was calamitous for Egypt and Egyptians don’t like to talk about it. Both Egyptian thrusts ran into powerful Israeli armored formations in open country. The resulting long range tank gunnery fight was just the sort of engagement the M60A1 was built for and that the Israelis had trained for. Hundreds of Egyptian T-55s and T-62s were knocked out and the survivors were unable to refuel and reload due to the smashing of the supply echelons sent in behind the tanks by IAF airstrikes.

So the Suez crossing was an operational victory that was followed by a strategic defeat.

343 Lidane  Sun, Oct 6, 2013 10:12:12am

re: #341 ObserverArt

What the hell is wrong with this picture? Other than no one seems to be looking at it.

We have a shitty news media that tries hard to pretend that there’s any give and take to be had in the GOP’s economic terrorism and we have a percentage of the population that’s firmly entrenched in the RWNJ alternate reality bubble.

344 William Barnett-Lewis  Sun, Oct 6, 2013 10:12:32am

re: #327 Lidane

Heh. It’s not really all that good a bit of writing but if it PO’s certain people, all is forgiven.

345 Lidane  Sun, Oct 6, 2013 10:13:19am

re: #344 William Barnett-Lewis

Heh. It’s not really all that good a bit of writing but if it PO’s certain people, all is forgiven.

I’m not a Dowd fan, but if that piece has RWNJs squealing like stuck pigs, then good on her.

346 Dark_Falcon  Sun, Oct 6, 2013 10:15:29am

re: #345 Lidane

I’m not a Dowd fan, but if that piece has RWNJs squealing like stuck pigs, then good on her.

It won’t. Conservatives are far more likely to simply mock Maureen Dowd rather than be enraged by her. She makes liberals feel good, but she doesn’t really cause fear or anger on the right.

347 EPR-radar  Sun, Oct 6, 2013 10:15:59am

re: #344 William Barnett-Lewis

Heh. It’s not really all that good a bit of writing but if it PO’s certain people, all is forgiven.

Much can be forgiven for the first one in the MSM to clearly set forth the Teabagger vision.

348 piratedan  Sun, Oct 6, 2013 10:17:24am

re: #340 Stanley Sea

he’s a very good read, He doesn’t always post a boatload but when he does, it’s usually worth the time.

349 William Barnett-Lewis  Sun, Oct 6, 2013 10:17:32am

Hey DF! Ready to see NO spank Cutler & company? There’s a part of me hoping to see Detroit break their 21 game losing streak at Lambeau as they’ve been playing better than any other team in the division. I’d like to see that continue for a change.

350 EPR-radar  Sun, Oct 6, 2013 10:18:25am

re: #346 Dark_Falcon

It won’t. Conservatives are far more likely to simply mock Maureen Dowd rather than be enraged by her. She makes liberals feel good, but she doesn’t really cause fear or anger on the right.

Too true. The only things that cause fear and anger on the right are taxes on the rich, and the idea that government programs and regulation of business can be beneficial.

351 Lidane  Sun, Oct 6, 2013 10:20:52am

re: #346 Dark_Falcon

Well, true. The only things that cause fear and anger on the right are people getting affordable health care and taxes on billionaires. My bad.

352 Dark_Falcon  Sun, Oct 6, 2013 10:20:53am

re: #349 William Barnett-Lewis

Hey DF! Ready to see NO spank Cutler & company? There’s a part of me hoping to see Detroit break their 21 game losing streak at Lambeau as they’ve been playing better than any other team in the division. I’d like to see that continue for a change.

I’m not going to watch either game actually. I jump around when I get excited and my leg hurts today. So I’ll mostly just read the coverage later.

353 sagehen  Sun, Oct 6, 2013 10:22:05am

re: #342 Dark_Falcon

heh

Egypt celebrates the successful storming of the Bar-Lev line as a major victory. In fact while it was a operational victory, the felt need to aid the floundering Syrians caused Egypt to send its armor beyond the SAM/ATGM defenses its army had erected to try to seize the Gidi and Mitla passes in the Sinai.

So the Suez crossing was an operational victory that was followed by a strategic defeat.

Also a major tactical misjudgment in that the Egyptians thought “if we go on their holiest day they’ll all be in synagogue, there’s nobody to defend,” without realizing if we go on their holiest day when they’re all in synagogue, that’s the day that everybody can be located instantly and the roads are clear.

It took less than 3 hours to muster 1.5 million fully trained, fully equipped reservists and get them to the battle lines.

354 Killgore Trout  Sun, Oct 6, 2013 10:23:06am

re: #342 Dark_Falcon

heh

Egypt celebrates the successful storming of the Bar-Lev line as a major victory. In fact while it was a operational victory, the felt need to aid the floundering Syrians caused Egypt to send its armor beyond the SAM/ATGM defenses its army had erected to try to seize the Gidi and Mitla passes in the Sinai.

The battle that followed was calamitous for Egypt and Egyptians don’t like to talk about it. Both Egyptian thrusts ran into powerful Israeli armored formations in open country. The resulting long range tank gunnery fight was just the sort of engagement the M60A1 was built for and that the Israelis had trained for. Hundreds of Egyptian T-55s and T-62s were knocked out and the survivors were unable to refuel and reload due to the smashing of the supply echelons sent in behind the tanks by IAF airstrikes.

So the Suez crossing was an operational victory that was followed by a strategic defeat.

The Egyptians also fucked over their allies in Syria, Jordon and Lebanon by lying to them and tell then the war was going great and to join the fun. They all lost.

355 ObserverArt  Sun, Oct 6, 2013 10:23:22am

re: #346 Dark_Falcon

It won’t. Conservatives are far more likely to simply mock Maureen Dowd rather than be enraged by her. She makes liberals feel good, but she doesn’t really cause fear or anger on the right.

Yeah, it all comes down to which side you get your facts from doesn’t it?

I must be way too old. Even though I grew up in a Democratic Union family, I still listened to and read commentary from all sides. I have voted for Republican presidents, senators, reps and mayors. I will sometimes vote to help balance power. So, I do see myself as a right center.

I would never make a comment like Dark’s above. I think it is too simplistic, shows no actual thought process, and frankly dangerous and worthless to the whole good of this country.

Might as well be a sheep!

Baaaa.

356 Dark_Falcon  Sun, Oct 6, 2013 10:27:53am

Actually, it was Ann Coulter who perfected mocking Maureen Dowd, and for that reason I’m not fond of the mocking. But I must admit it is an effective tactic that helps keep Republicans focused on the goals and not on the sideshow of NYT columnists. Of course, most of the effectiveness is derived from the fact that Ann Coulter is a woman and therefore her attacks don’t come across as misogynistic the way they would if Fat Bastard AKA Rush Limbaugh had gone after Dowd.

But I still don’t like it, and I don’t like Ann Coulter at all.

357 Eclectic Cyborg  Sun, Oct 6, 2013 10:29:23am

re: #318 Lidane

We’re being held hostage by economic terrorists:

[Embedded content]

That sound you heard was a gun cocking.

358 Dark_Falcon  Sun, Oct 6, 2013 10:31:14am

re: #354 Killgore Trout

The Egyptians also fucked over their allies in Syria, Jordon and Lebanon by lying to them and tell then the war was going great and to join the fun. They all lost.

Actually Killgore, Lebanon’s army did not fight in the Yom Kipur War and Syria was in that war from the beginning. Jordan did indeed attempt to aid Syria with troops but the other nation that provided direct support was Iraq, not Lebanon.

359 Dark_Falcon  Sun, Oct 6, 2013 10:31:34am

re: #355 ObserverArt

Fling an insult, get a downding.

360 Killgore Trout  Sun, Oct 6, 2013 10:34:32am

re: #358 Dark_Falcon

Actually Killgore, Lebanon’s army did not fight in the Yom Kipur War and Syria was in that war from the beginning. Jordan did indeed attempt to aid Syria with troops but the other nation that provided direct support was Iraq, not Lebanon.

Ah, I stand corrected.

361 makeitstop  Sun, Oct 6, 2013 10:36:03am

re: #359 Dark_Falcon

Fling an insult, get a downding.

I will note that in your post, you did imply that all liberals are amused by Dowd, which is an implication of ‘sheep’ behavior.

I think now, and have thought for years, that Dowd is a hack. Where do I turn in my liberal card?
/

362 Dark_Falcon  Sun, Oct 6, 2013 10:43:47am

re: #361 makeitstop

I will note that in your post, you did imply that all liberals are amused by Dowd, which is an implication of ‘sheep’ behavior.

I think now, and have thought for years, that Dowd is a hack. Where do I turn in my liberal card?
/

I didn’t mean all liberals not more than others here mean all conservatives when they just say ‘conservatives’.

363 ObserverArt  Sun, Oct 6, 2013 10:45:38am

re: #359 Dark_Falcon

Fling an insult, get a downding.

What was the insult?

You are admitting that it depends on what political affiliation (real or perceived) gets one party motivated. And you endorse it.

And I did say “I” would never make a comment like Dark made. I didn’t say you shouldn’t did I?

Might as well be a sheep was in regards to the “I” would never. So, that is saying I would never be a sheep.

So downding that. It matters not to me. Why not debate the point I was actually making about the dangers of that type of thinking? Whether you engage in it or not is up to you, but the point still stands open for discussion.

364 EPR-radar  Sun, Oct 6, 2013 10:45:42am

There once was a Republican who had some thoughts on the subject of losers of elections making excessive demands:

What is our present condition? We have just carried an election on principles fairly stated to the people. Now we are told in advance, the government shall be broken up, unless we surrender to those we have beaten, before we take the offices. In this they are either attempting to play upon us, or they are in dead earnest. Either way, if we surrender, it is the end of us, and of the government. They will repeat the experiment upon us ad libitum.

365 Stanley Sea  Sun, Oct 6, 2013 10:48:05am

re: #348 piratedan

he’s a very good read, He doesn’t always post a boatload but when he does, it’s usually worth the time.

Update:

A note about commenting: This post is getting much wider than normal play. As usual when such things happen, Stonekettle Station begins attracting a certain frothy spittle-flecked yellow-eyed element.

Some additional guidelines:

- This site is not Yahoo! This site is not The Blaze. This site is not YouTube. Don’t act like it is. If you can’t help but behave like a nasty fifteen year old with a behavioral disorder, then bugger off back to 4-Chan and stop wasting my time.

- If you attempt to engage in any form of delusional booger-eating ala Birtherism, 911-Trutherism, Oh No Socialism with or without included Nazis, if you mention The New World Order, or something you heard from Glenn Beck, Rush Limbaugh, Ann Coulter, Michael Savage, Alex Jones, or any TV Preacher, your comment will not post. Period.

366 piratedan  Sun, Oct 6, 2013 10:50:44am

re: #365 Stanley Sea

yeah, I’ve never had an issue with his posting rules, tends to reduce the troll traffic.

367 Dark_Falcon  Sun, Oct 6, 2013 10:51:19am

re: #365 Stanley Sea

That man puts up a powerful anti-troll barrier. It’s needed though.

368 Lidane  Sun, Oct 6, 2013 10:51:22am

re: #356 Dark_Falcon

But I must admit it is an effective tactic that helps keep Republicans focused on the goals and not on the sideshow of NYT columnists.

Which goals, exactly? Destroying the American economy so they can whine about Americans getting healthcare? Or maybe their goal of destroying the world economy because they’re pissed that a black man got elected POTUS twice over their objections?

369 ObserverArt  Sun, Oct 6, 2013 10:52:04am

You know, when the Dems took over both the house and congress they should have impeached Bush and shut down the government to defund the unpopular wars.

The American public was against it and think of the deficit spending that would all have cut!

/ not really.

370 The Mountain That Blogs  Sun, Oct 6, 2013 10:52:22am

re: #364 EPR-radar

Lincoln was a RINO

371 ObserverArt  Sun, Oct 6, 2013 10:54:15am

re: #368 Lidane

Which goals, exactly? Destroying the American economy so they can whine about Americans getting healthcare? Or maybe their goal of destroying the world economy because they’re pissed that a black man got elected POTUS twice over their objections?

No, keep Republicans in power no matter how far off the rails they go and no matter how far away they actually go from actual real conservative ideals. The rest is just flotsam.

372 sattv4u2  Sun, Oct 6, 2013 10:54:23am

re: #370 The Mountain That Blogs

Lincoln was a RINO

I thought Lincoln was a Ford

373 William Barnett-Lewis  Sun, Oct 6, 2013 10:55:15am

re: #329 Feline Fearless Leader

Good afternoon Lizards. In Pittsburgh and about to leave shortly for tail-gate and then going to the baseball game later this afternoon.

And along the political front a blog link about another reason Obama and the Dems cannot back down.

stonekettle.com

That should be reposted on every blog in the nation & made required reading for every Senator & Representative.

374 Charles Johnson  Sun, Oct 6, 2013 10:56:12am

Was there really a time when this guy was funny, and not a raving lunatic like every other right winger, or did I dream that?

375 piratedan  Sun, Oct 6, 2013 10:57:45am

re: #374 Charles Johnson

looks like Full Metal Birther to me

376 Lidane  Sun, Oct 6, 2013 10:58:02am

re: #374 Charles Johnson

What the fuck is it with these raving right wingers and war monuments and national parks?

I guess they need some cheap, convenient way to distract the rubes and keep them pissed off.

377 ObserverArt  Sun, Oct 6, 2013 10:58:35am

re: #374 Charles Johnson

Was there really a time when this guy was funny, and not a raving lunatic like every other right winger, or did I dream that?

[Embedded content]

Who the hell is he? Should I care?

378 The Mountain That Blogs  Sun, Oct 6, 2013 11:01:08am

re: #376 Lidane

What the fuck is it with these raving right wingers and war monuments and national parks?

Because it’s highly visible but ultimately completely inconsequential. It’s an easy way to slam Obama for hating veterans when they are the ones literally taking food from their mouths.

379 Targetpractice  Sun, Oct 6, 2013 11:01:37am

re: #376 Lidane

What the fuck is it with these raving right wingers and war monuments and national parks?

I guess they need some cheap, convenient way to distract the rubes and keep them pissed off.

It’s like how they’re suddenly broken up about children with cancer or poor mothers who can’t afford to feed their kids. It’s an effort to lambast Obama for not approving the piecemeal bills that would have allowed the GOP to cover up the most visible signs of the shutdown while also establishing that you can just fund those portions of the government you like.

380 BeenHereAwhile  Sun, Oct 6, 2013 11:06:40am

Where are all the Snowdens of yesteryear?

@Amie_FR: #Russia to monitor ‘all communications’ at Winter #Olympics in Sochi incl business deals by @shaunwalker7 t.co

381 Targetpractice  Sun, Oct 6, 2013 11:08:45am

In fact, Son of Paul was on Meet the Press this morning to declare that he thinks piecemeal funding bills are how it should be, arguing that by doing so, you can debate funding this program or that in more detail. Left unsaid was that such a strategy also allows Rand and his fellow loons pick and choose which department or agency they’ll fund and which they won’t.

382 Vicious Babushka  Sun, Oct 6, 2013 11:09:36am

re: #318 Lidane

We’re being held hostage by economic terrorists:

[Embedded content]

The GOP will not rest until the U.S. has become a third world country and all the sweatshop factories in Bangladesh and Namibia relocate to Texas and Mississippi.

383 Eclectic Cyborg  Sun, Oct 6, 2013 11:09:59am

re: #376 Lidane

What the fuck is it with these raving right wingers and war monuments and national parks?

I guess they need some cheap, convenient way to distract the rubes and keep them pissed off.

That’s it exactly. They are trying every trick to get people pissed off at Obama over the shutdown.

384 EPR-radar  Sun, Oct 6, 2013 11:11:11am

re: #379 Targetpractice

It’s like how they’re suddenly broken up about children with cancer or poor mothers who can’t afford to feed their kids. It’s an effort to lambast Obama for not approving the piecemeal bills that would have allowed the GOP to cover up the most visible signs of the shutdown while also establishing that you can just fund those portions of the government you like.

People as props, part infinity. The only thing that get GOPers all misty-eyed is large amounts of money in their own bank accounts, preferably obtained by squeezing the poor and middle class. This message does not yet test well in polling, so smoke screens are important.

Their ‘concern’ for the life of the unborn is the canonical example of this.

385 Absalom, Absalom, Obdicut  Sun, Oct 6, 2013 11:12:23am

re: #356 Dark_Falcon

Actually, it was Ann Coulter who perfected mocking Maureen Dowd, and for that reason I’m not fond of the mocking. But I must admit it is an effective tactic that helps keep Republicans focused on the goals and not on the sideshow of NYT columnists.

Hey Dark, speaking of focusing on the goals, you’ve yet to provide any explanation of your defense of the outright lie by Kirk, that Obama is ‘shaking in his boots’ in fear of people actually experiencing “Obamacare”.

Since the shutdown is occurring because the GOP is attempting to stop people from experiencing the ACA (and failing, horribly), there is really no way to interpret this other than an outright and really bizarre lie. It’s not something I think even you can bring yourself to believe, that Obama is afraid of people experiencing the ACA, so how do you justify Kirk simply lying to the American people like that, both about Obama and about the reasons for the shutdown?

386 Eclectic Cyborg  Sun, Oct 6, 2013 11:13:06am

Looks like my health insurance will cost me about $65 more at work next year for the same coverage. As far as the ACA goes, there are only two companies offering coverage here in MS and in most counties those companies are not competing so there’s only a single option. Not to mention that this state refused to set up its own exchange so ours is being run by the feds and it hasn’t been running properly for awhile now.

387 Lidane  Sun, Oct 6, 2013 11:14:12am
388 Dark_Falcon  Sun, Oct 6, 2013 11:17:45am

re: #381 Targetpractice

In fact, Son of Paul was on Meet the Press this morning to declare that he thinks piecemeal funding bills are how it should be, arguing that by doing so, you can debate funding this program or that in more detail. Left unsaid was that such a strategy also allows Rand and his fellow loons pick and choose which department or agency they’ll fund and which they won’t.

It must also be said that Rand Paul was far less confrontational about the debt ceiling, so it is quite possible that Ted Cruz will find himself without support on that matter.

But I also need to need to point out that it is not unconstitutional for the Congress to simply refuse to fund a department whose actions Congress does not like. congress has the power of the purse and its ability to selectively fund the executive branch is one of its primary checks on executive power.

389 Decatur Deb  Sun, Oct 6, 2013 11:20:03am

re: #388 Dark_Falcon

It must also be said that Rand Paul was far less confrontational about the debt ceiling, so it is quite possible that Ted Cruz will find himself without support on that matter.

But I also need to need to point out that it is not unconstitutional for the Congress to simply refuse to fund a department whose actions Congress does not like. congress has the power of the purse and its ability to selectively fund the executive branch is one of its primary checks on executive power.

That’s going to work so well when a coalition of libertarians and anti-war Dems gut the Defense Department.

390 Absalom, Absalom, Obdicut  Sun, Oct 6, 2013 11:20:47am

re: #388 Dark_Falcon

But I also need to need to point out that it is not unconstitutional for the Congress to simply refuse to fund a department whose actions Congress does not like. congress has the power of the purse and its ability to selectively fund the executive branch is one of its primary checks on executive power.

Except this is a fundamentally dishonest way to present it, because ‘congress’ is composed of the senate and the house, and we’re not discussing not funding a department.

Again, if the GOP wants to negotiate about the budget, they could have appointed conferees in the Senate months ago. But they didn’t, they completely abandoned that responsibility, so it’s transparently stupid for them to pretend all of a sudden to be concerned about actual governance.

391 EPR-radar  Sun, Oct 6, 2013 11:22:40am

re: #388 Dark_Falcon

It must also be said that Rand Paul was far less confrontational about the debt ceiling, so it is quite possible that Ted Cruz will find himself without support on that matter.

But I also need to need to point out that it is not unconstitutional for the Congress to simply refuse to fund a department whose actions Congress does not like. congress has the power of the purse and its ability to selectively fund the executive branch is one of its primary checks on executive power.

This argument would be a lot more cogent if, in fact, defunding Obamacare could get through Congress to land on Obama’s desk.

It can’t (the Democrats control the Senate), so the GOP temper tantrum amounts to an attempt for one GOP faction in the House to rule all.

392 austin_blue  Sun, Oct 6, 2013 11:27:00am

re: #324 jaunte

A Federal Budget Crisis Months in the Planning

freedomworks.org

Remarkable, boundless cynicism.

Compare with:

washingtonpost.com

So Hot Wheels is lying through his teeth, isn’t he?

393 EPR-radar  Sun, Oct 6, 2013 11:42:41am

re: #392 austin_blue

Remarkable, boundless cynicism.

Compare with:

washingtonpost.com

So Hot Wheels is lying through his teeth, isn’t he?

The absolute reliance of US conservatism on lies piled on top of more lies, with lies sprinkled on top for more flavor, and the really big lies as foundations, is really a sight to behold.

Goebbels would be so proud.

394 Lidane  Sun, Oct 6, 2013 12:11:13pm

re: #388 Dark_Falcon

But I also need to need to point out that it is not unconstitutional for the Congress to simply refuse to fund a department whose actions Congress does not like.

They can’t do it in a vacuum:

Youtube Video

395 Teukka  Sun, Oct 6, 2013 12:11:49pm

re: #393 EPR-radar

The absolute reliance of US conservatism on lies piled on top of more lies, with lies sprinkled on top for more flavor, and the really big lies as foundations, is really a sight to behold.

Goebbels would be so proud.

The problem with lies piled on top of lies, sprinkled with seasoning lies on top is that eventually, the liars will loose the compass which tells them what they can get away with.

And once they try the big one, all of them go up in flames.

Fellow lizards, I would at this juncture recommend you check the condition and location of your fireproof clothing and firefighting gear, all those very combustible lies going up all at once may pose a hazard to bystanders.

396 BroncD  Sun, Oct 6, 2013 4:53:28pm

What a conceited prat he is.
“Oh please stop, Glenn! You’re giving us TOO MUCH INFORMATION!!!”

Yes, I’m sure that’s a real conversation that took place.


This article has been archived.
Comments are closed.

Jump to top

Create a PageThis is the LGF Pages posting bookmarklet. To use it, drag this button to your browser's bookmark bar, and title it 'LGF Pages' (or whatever you like). Then browse to a site you want to post, select some text on the page to use for a quote, click the bookmarklet, and the Pages posting window will appear with the title, text, and any embedded video or audio files already filled in, ready to go.
Or... you can just click this button to open the Pages posting window right away.
Last updated: 2023-04-04 11:11 am PDT LGF User's Guide RSS Feeds

Help support Little Green Footballs!

Subscribe now for ad-free access!Register and sign in to a free LGF account before subscribing, and your ad-free access will be automatically enabled.

Donate with
PayPal Cash.app
Recent PagesClick to refresh
The Pandemic Cost 7 Million Lives, but Talks to Prevent a Repeat Stall In late 2021, as the world reeled from the arrival of the highly contagious omicron variant of the coronavirus, representatives of almost 200 countries met - some online, some in-person in Geneva - hoping to forestall a future worldwide ...
Cheechako
6 days ago
Views: 158 • Comments: 0 • Rating: 1
Texas County at Center of Border Fight Is Overwhelmed by Migrant Deaths EAGLE PASS, Tex. - The undertaker lighted a cigarette and held it between his latex-gloved fingers as he stood over the bloated body bag lying in the bed of his battered pickup truck. The woman had been fished out ...
Cheechako
2 weeks ago
Views: 324 • Comments: 0 • Rating: 1