LGF

RoP Moles in the Navy?

Sat, Aug 7, 2004 at 8:00:57 am PDT

A San Diego sailor is suspected of having passed Navy secrets about ship movements and security weaknesses to one of the jihadis arrested in Britain last Wednesday: Ex-S.D. sailor allegedly linked to terror suspect. (Hat tip: Jihad Watch.)

E-mail messages from the unnamed sailor, sent in late 2000 and 2001 before the Sept. 11 terrorist attacks, were found in December in computer files belonging to Babar Ahmad, who was detained Wednesday in London, according to the 31-page arrest affidavit.

The computer files contained details about security arrangements and movements of the San Diego-based Constellation carrier battle group, which included the destroyer Benfold, on which the sailor was serving at the time.

Investigators say the messages were sent from a Benfold e-mail account, including one in which the sailor wrote that he was on active duty in the Middle East.

The sailor, who left the Navy several years ago after a four-year enlistment, has been identified, but military and law enforcement officials would not comment on whether he has been located, detained, questioned or charged. ...

The e-mail messages extolled the bombing of the destroyer Cole in October 2000 and the actions of Muslim fighters in Afghanistan, Bosnia and Chechnya, according to the affidavit documents.

A return message from Ahmad’s computer account “praised the enlistee’s comments and encouraged the enlistee to ‘keep up with the dawah (an Arabic term for missionary work) and the psychological warefare (sic),’” the documents stated.

The sailor, in another e-mail, discussed an on-board briefing about protecting the ship from terrorist attacks like the Cole bombing, according to the documents. In that attack, an explosives-laden boat was brought alongside the destroyer while it was anchored in Aden, Yemen, and blown up. The explosion killed 17 sailors, including one from San Diego.

The same floppy disk contained a separate file describing the composition of the Constellation battle group, the ships’ planned movements and a drawing of the group’s formation for the transit of the Strait of Hormuz, the narrow passage between the Indian Ocean and the Persian Gulf, court documents said.

Under a heading of “weakness,” the computer file stated, “They have nothing to stop a small craft with (rocket-propelled grenade) etc., except their SEALs’ Stinger missiles.”

It also noted the expected date for the battle group’s transit through the strait.

UPDATE at 8/7/04 8:17:14 am:

After reading this, many people will be left with the question, “Why would a US serviceman cooperate with a jihadi in Britain?”

Of course, the answer is that the suspect is a Muslim; the line about “keep up with the dawah” makes that clear, but only if you know that dawah means proselytizing for Islam. Once again mainstream media withholds one of the most important pieces of information in the story, the detail that would answer the question, “WHY?”

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533 comments

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1 [Engineer]  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 6:05:56am

They also didn't report if the guy was a Muslim or not. PC is going to kill us.

2 Bensmom  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 6:07:31am

Gee, too bad we don't keel-haul bad guys anymore.

3 Bob with one O  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 6:08:20am

Mark my words: They're going to hit us again, and again, until we get fed up with with the cockroaches of humanity. At that point, finally, they will see the wrath of a sleeping giant awakened. God Save Us until then.

4 Bensmom  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 6:08:35am

Silly [Engineer], you have to know that it's those pesky Norwegian Lutheran Blondes from Minnesota!

5 Mr Pol  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 6:10:27am

#1 [Engineer]

They also didn't report if the guy was a Muslim or not.

Do they really need to?

PC is going to kill us.

It's also going to kill a lot of Muslims: now each time something happens, and whatever the MMMF report, everybody assumes it's just another death cultist...

6 Ackomanyuki  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 6:12:22am

#1 engineer

Could be just another ibn stinkyblanketandlovebeads like that asshat "American Taliban" John (his surname escapes me) at the beginning of the Afgani war of liberation. Probably is a [bigoted word] though.

7 Mr Pol  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 6:13:55am
8 csva  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 6:16:43am

PC = peace casualty
PC sucks!

9 Barbara Skolaut  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 6:18:40am

Get the facts straight, recall him to active duty if possible, charge him with TREASON in time of war, try him (court martial if possible, civilian court if necessary), and HANG THE BASTARD.

Leftist whining and hand-wringing be damned.

10 abu_garcia  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 6:20:04am

Find him and hang him from the mast of the Benfold.

11 Jakester  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 6:20:59am

of course, it was the brutal racism in the Navy that caused the poor Muslim sailor to reach out for support from the ummah! He is a victim, not a traitor.
/SF-Mode off

12 [Engineer]  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 6:22:56am

#5 Mr Pol

Do they really need to?

You are right in most cases, but, as #6 Ackomanyuki comments, it could be an American asshole.

13 Model4  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 6:24:07am

Think about all those "poor" kamikaze pilots who flew their fragile planes through storms of machine-gun fire and flak. They should have just signed on to work in our ships' powder magazines or bomb storage.

However, we don't know if this sailor was oppressed by not having the prayer call blaring from the ships' PAs while its bow was made to point toward Mecca at the proper intervals.

So there's always two sides to the story. Some here blindly put a higher value on the safety and security of our ships, sailors and nation. If you think troops like this shouldn't have the opportunity to betray and murder their fellow servicemen, then you've become as bad as the Taliban.

14 Mr Pol  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 6:24:51am

#12 [Engineer]

No way. If the bastard wasn't a [bigoted word] they would have said so. I expect the MMM to start lying about religious affiliations after the next terrorist attack in the U.S., BTW.

15 ibu guru  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 6:24:58am

#1 Engineer --

PC is killing us. We've already had Islamo-spies in Guantanamo, [bigoted word]s blowing up their officers in Kuwait... We also have illegal aliens with fake IDs, and assorted non-citizens (since we accept LPRs).

There are several thousand throughout the military. Given the ideology they adhere to, suspicions must be raised far higher.

Zero tolerance for illegal immigration. Zero tolerance for phony ID passers. Zero tolerance for spies. Zero tolerance for ideologies demanding world domination and subugation/slaughter for "non-believers." Naziism has been discredited; so must Islamofascism.

16 Ed Moran: Abu GOMEX aoa 28C  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 6:26:44am

As Tiburon was pointing out yesterday, Jonathan Pollard, who was passing secrets on to an ally, is now in the 19th year of his sentence.

AFAIK, the potential any of Pollard's espionage could have resulted in American deaths were extremely low to non-existent.

17 [Engineer]  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 6:28:14am

The story doesn't say, but it sounds like the email was sent from the ship. That is not good. I am sure that having email is great for morale, but maybe they need to start reading all the mail that goes out like they did in WWII.

18 Bob with one O  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 6:29:22am

Mr Pol,

While this is not an incitement to violence, my prediction is we'll see the slims hanging from light poles after the next attack. Their lies aren't going to mean squat to the great unwashed hordes.

19 [Engineer]  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 6:30:28am

#14 Mr Pol

No way. If the bastard wasn't a [bigoted word] they would have said so.

Good point.

20 Bob with one O  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 6:32:02am

(engineer),

The email is already a problem according to a friend just returned from Baghdad. The military is at wits end trying to curtail it. They have managed to slow the digital photos but it is a problem.

21 [Engineer]  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 6:35:10am

#15 ibu guru

Naziism has been discredited; so must Islamofascism.

Yes. The question in my mind is it Islamofascism or all of Islam the problem. A few months ago I would have been very opposed to condemning all Muslims, but now I am at the point that they are going to have to prove that all Islam is not the problem.

22 John B  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 6:37:11am

"WHY"?

The question should also be why are they (i.e. Muslims) allowed into the armed forces. To hell with PC.

23 Titus Quinctius Cincinnatus  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 6:39:23am

OT - Check out Protest Warrior's Halliburton Defence Force!

24 Poitiers-Lepanto  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 6:39:24am

I see this thread only now.

I AM SICK AND TIRED OF THE CONSPIRACIES OF THE BUDDHISTS !!!
LET'S DEPORT ALL THE ZEN MONKS !!!

And let's ask the UN to do something to keep these terrorists away from our Country !!!

/Been drinking too much BLOODY TERESA, same as Bloody Mary but with Ketchup instead of tomato juice.
YIKES !!!

25 [Engineer]  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 6:40:57am

#18 Bob with one O

...my prediction is we'll see the slims hanging from light poles after the next attack.

I have been saying the same thing. The problem is that not all Arabs are Mulsims and non Arabs, like Indians, have been put in the same group.

26 John Schneider  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 6:44:33am
#18 Bob with one O
While this is not an incitement to violence, my prediction is we'll see the slims hanging from light poles after the next attack. Their lies aren't going to mean squat to the great unwashed hordes.

I'd just be satisfied with covering them with pork chops and putting them in a pit full of rottweillers.

27 Praxeus  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 6:44:44am

PW rules !

28 jinnderella  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 6:45:01am

#15 ibu guru:

PC is killing us. We've already had Islamo-spies in Guantanamo, [bigoted word]s blowing up their officers in Kuwait... We also have illegal aliens with fake IDs, and assorted non-citizens (since we accept LPRs).

It is not just that PC is killing us, but it horrifies me that muslims are so adept at exploiting our sensitivities, diversity, PC, freedom of speech and religion-- things that have no analogs in Islamic culture, and that muslims have no experience of! And also how Big Media is insane with PC-- do they fear the jihaadiis will sue them for slander if they speak the truth?

29 Jimmy The Clam  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 6:45:20am

Has anybody ever done any surveys or studies to determine how disloyal your average [bigoted word] is to their new homeland?

I'm very curious if anybody has really looked into that question?

30 [Engineer]  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 6:45:45am

#23 Titus Quinctius Cincinnatus

Well, they finally got it up. Some of those pictures are mine and I haven't had more fun in a long time.

31 Bob with one O  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 6:49:08am

[engineer]

Yet we're not hearing from any of those groups.

Do they believe they'll be singled out in their own community or do they want to be on the winning side if either group wins this?

I would like to think that at some point they must stand up to be counted. Unless they're trying to mimic the French where after the war every Frog that ever over charged a German for lunch was part of the resistance.

32 John Schneider  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 6:49:52am

OT (sorry, I don't usually do this)

Sistani to undergo treatment in London...

[Link: news.bbc.co.uk...]

...wonder if the patient will ever live down having to be treated by Western Infidels...

33 genard  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 6:57:08am

Correct me if I am wrong, but I do not think a Muslim can swear allegiance to a nation state. Submission to Allah and Allah's community, the umma, are the only possible allegiances; for a muslim to swear to anything else is to deny Allah.

I my mind that makes any Muslim ineligible to serve in any military service or in any governmental capacity that involves law enforcement or espionage.

34 andrew2  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 6:59:36am

As can be read on [Link: www.jihadwatch.com,...] Reverend Alan Clifford is being targeted by the British “Diversity Officers” for statements made regarding Islam. Perhaps after reading his story others may want to contact him to offer support at his e-mail address: cliffordNRC@compuserve.com . It’s Orwellian, it’s fascist and explain how 2 critics of Islam (Will Cummings as well) can be so thoroughly vilified and shunned for speaking the truth. Democracy in fortress Europe is crumbling folks…coming to a neighborhood near you!

August 7, 2004

Reverend Alan Clifford,

Dear Reverend,

I am an American who initially came to Europe to escape all of the political correctness and race hysterics of those many misguided and deceptive pawns in my country. I was actually made much more aware of differences in people by being force fed "Diversity” and “Multi-Culturism”, than I had most of my life noticed, before these insane policies were fully embraced by the public and forced by the cultural and political elites years ago. European problems with respect to these issues seem more potentially dangerous in the near term, than I had imagined and more insidious than in America for the moment.

The resulting discord and disharmony of our societies is a product of these failed policies (Enoch Powell?) and your maligning is a serious sign of the new tyranny which is resulting in Orwellian "Thought Police" and “Hate Crimes" Laws. It seems clear, that hundreds of years of enlightenment thinking and reason, is falling to the alter of these most perverse, opportunistic and nation destroying cults, Political Correctness and Multi-Culturism.

Islam, of course, is using these self imposed, totalitarian and racial ideologies to their advantage in advancing their own fascist objective--the Islamification of the West.

Now, Islam is and remains what it has been for 1400 years and both the historical record and modern experience clearly documents its propensity for conquest and intolerance. Additional scrutiny clearly shows the undeniable truth of Islamic inspired violence world wide, which is in seemingly endless supply. Why continue to placate, deny, divert and distort this most obvious fact, and to what end--appeasement and eventual conquest?

If people such as you and others i.e., “Will” Cummings is censored, how can we alter the impending doom which awaits us? The most gullible of people in the West as well as those who hide behind the good and noble ideals of equality and fairness have already prepared the table for the manipulation and transformation of Western Civilization to an Islamic one in Europe. One may ask, were their intentions benevolent?

This does not just include the Islamists, who as Bat Yeór, Robert Spencer, Daniel Pipes and others have indicated wish nothing less than a world wide Islamic Caliphate. It also includes those enablers and apologists who, for some unfathomable reason, perhaps appeasement, perhaps fear or hatred for their culture, have willingly joined the very forces which seek their very own extinction—its crystal insanity.

35 Ackomanyuki  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 7:00:02am

I am preparing to leave my room at the Atlanta Westin for lunch at Emiril's. Hope Y'all have as wonderful an afternoon as I am planning on having. I have been at the ABA convention with my wife for the last three days and LGF has been my lifeline to a sanity that is not present here among the Bar. The ABA seems to tilt hard to the left on most of the issues we as Lizardoids are concerned about. My wife has dug her fingernails into my arm constantly during conversations about the WOT during dinner here at the convention. Damn shame for a conservative like her to have to kowtow to the rest of these sheeple just to gain a position and have a positive effect on their Tortes, Trial and Insurance Practice Section committee. Politics suck! Later on oh scaley bretheren, I am going to engorge myself on some spicy (Bam) food.

36 Ed Moran: Abu GOMEX aoa 28C  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 7:00:15am

32 John Schneider

Sistani, is sort of, kind of, not exactly, on our side compared to the other Ayatollahs.


Of course, how do you screen for some American person, non-Muslim by birth, who converts after high school.


But I would guess is any forward deployed unit should have a file size limit on e-mails sent, and random e-mails should be read. Sucks to infringe on the soldiers/sailors/airmans privacy that way, but military personnel don't really enjoy the same privacy civilians do anyway, and it just might save some lives

37 [Engineer]  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 7:00:53am

#31 Bob with one O

Do they believe they'll be singled out in their own community or do they want to be on the winning side if either group wins this?

I work with an Arab Christian from Lebanon. She and her husband moved to the US for their own safety years ago and she hates Islam, but is not vocal about it. My guess is that, as Christians in the Mideast, they grew up believing that being noticed was dangerous.

38 andrew2  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 7:00:53am

CONTINUED

Bat Yeór, as you may know, wrote an article entitled "Eurabia" (Please see attachment). It was through her scholarship and my own research that I was made aware that the resulting strength that Islam exhibits in European society and politics is no mere coincidence and political correctness and multi-culturism are intentional devices used to forward their agenda while silencing and intimidating people like you and me into submission--dhimmitude. That does not mean that these tools was created for or by them, just exploited by the jihadists who undoubtedly can not believe their luck and our reckless stupidity.

Please know that you reflect the opinion of many people in Europe and abroad. If you are silenced, it will be another victory against human rights and Democracy as we have come to understand the terms, as well as another of the many nails in the coffin of Western Civilization.

I support you and your quite sober assessment of the situation in Europe and please let me know if there is anything I could do to be of help to your efforts.

39 RickZ  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 7:01:05am
Another defense analyst wondered whether the military is able to prevent people from supplying information to terrorists.

"During the Cold War, they were set up to sniff out Communists, but I don't know if they've come up with a program to address (terrorists)," said John Pike, director of the think tank GlobelSecurity.org. "There have been enough of these instances where service members have tried to help the (Islamic) jihad that you wonder how many that we haven't caught."

A valid point. Now what will the military do? Will it suffer the slings and arrows of the PC police and do the right thing to protect the country or cave in to the propaganda that Islam is the RoP?

40 thinkingmom  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 7:01:08am

Imagine if Rumsfeld held a press conference and announced that, until further notice, no muslims would be permitted in the armed forces, given the *problems* the religion is experiencing...Aside from the LLL outrage, I s'pose we'd see an overwhelming demand from loyal muslim-Americans to enlist in their own fighting units to battle the jihadis, like the Japanese-American unit in WWII...

Right?

41 mkanderson  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 7:02:50am

I'm a long-time (two years) lurker, first time poster. I'm former Air Force with a TS clearance. In the late 80s when I got in, I signed all kinds of papers for my clearance. Some of the requirements I remember about that was I was stating I had no affiliation with Russia or any soviet country. In addition, I was forbidden from travelling to those countries. There was a country watch list. They even wanted to know if I had any assocation with anybody from one of those countries. In fact, I had to verify that I was not a communist in any way nor did I sympathize with any communist ideals. Since I'm not in, I can't say for sure, but I bet political correctness is not filtering our current military based on links to our current enemy. An email to Russia in the cold war would be considered treason in the highest order. Why is this not even being called treason?

42 [Engineer]  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 7:05:35am

#33 genard

Correct me if I am wrong, but I do not think a Muslim can swear allegiance to a nation state.

They can't swear truthfully to any secular nation, but they are permitted to lie under oath to advance the cause of Islam.

43 jinnderella  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 7:05:52am
Investigators say the messages were sent from a Benfold e-mail account, including one in which the sailor wrote that he was on active duty in the Middle East

I for one am cheered that someone screens active duty email! However, the perp was violating some sort of clearance or need-to-know policy. This is my question-- can an American soldier of muslim faith ever take an oath to protect his country or honour clearances in honesty?

44 Geepers  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 7:10:28am

Now Sir, I'll ask you again, and let me remind you that you are under oath: Are you or are you not a pathological liar?


Creates a bit of a problem, no?

45 Model4  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 7:10:44am

#34 andrew2:

If people such as you and others i.e., “Will” Cummings is censored, how can we alter the impending doom which awaits us?

When Islam starts heavily impacting the liberals who have been defending it, we'll not only be allowed to act, but they'll pretend it was they who were insisting something be done all along and we who were dragging our feet.

Especially if we're saddled with a Democrat president who feels compelled to act. Dems can invade and bomb the shit out of anyone unilaterally without the pre-requisite of "immenent threat" and not face howls of protest.

46 ploome hineni[deleted]  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 7:11:10am
47 jinnderella  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 7:12:17am

#33 Genard: Sorry, didn't see your post-- but you are exactly right-- the oath you take for compartment access could not be sworn by a muslim.

But that's the problem-- because of freedom of religion, Americans believe that oath can be taken in good faith. Perhaps Islam should be classified as an allegiance to another country, the Dar al Islam, and muslims should be treated as 'foreign nationals'.

48 ploome hineni[deleted]  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 7:15:10am
49 Craig Abu Al-Boo-Boo  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 7:17:22am

How many more guys like this one are doing "missionary work?"

That's the scary question.

50 CGW  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 7:17:28am

Here's what Reza (she identifies herself as "rezareza666" in her e-mail address, which you can no longer access at JW; puts her comments in perspective, doesn't it?) posted on the thread for this article at Jihad Watch:

"Are you people so blinded by your fear and hatred of Islam that you cannot accept reality? There are already 8 million "documented" Muslims in the United States, along with an estimated 10 million additional "undocumented" Muslims. Every one of these Muslims prays and works every day for the establishment of the Islamic Caliphate and the replacing of the corrupt and unjust system of man-made laws and government by Allah's (swt) divine Sharia.

The long struggle is nearly over, and its outcome has been preordained according to the promise of Allah (swt) to the believers. As far as the American military is concerned, consider this statement by the well known Saudi Professor Nasser bin Suleiman al-Omar:

"Islam is advancing according to a steady plan, to the point that tens of thousands of Muslims have joined the American army and Islam is the second largest religion in America. America will be destroyed. But we must be patient."

Do you really want more war and bloodshed? Do you really want your children to perish in a futile and foredoomed effort to hold back the inevitable triumph of Islam?

Stop warring against Almighty Allah (swt). Stop abusing and oppressing Muslims. Embrace Islam now and live in peace according to the commands of Allah (swt) and following the perfect example of his Holy Prophet (saw). Be part of the bright, shining future of an Islamic America, not a forgotten part of a dim, dying past.

Your grandchildren will be Muslim.

Allahu akbar


Posted by: Reza at August 7, 2004 11:51 AM"

51 thinkingmom  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 7:18:30am

#47 Jinnderella:

Perhaps Islam should be classified as an allegiance to another country, the Dar al Islam, and muslims should be treated as 'foreign nationals'.

I think you've got it! Until the "moderate muslims" demonstrate otherwise...

52 Titus Quinctius Cincinnatus  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 7:19:45am

#46 ploome

Yes they are, yes they are :)

#30 [Engineer]

You were involved in the Halliburton Defence operation? Whoa, cool!

I've emailed PW about the Duke PSM conference to see if they're interested/can provide some assistance or advice

53 Sean II  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 7:20:12am

Update on the Hatchets are Out thread:

Vet denies retraction

55 Reza  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 7:21:52am

Are you people so blinded by your fear and hatred of Islam that you cannot accept reality? There are already 8 million "documented" Muslims in the United States, along with an estimated 10 million additional "undocumented" Muslims. Every one of these 18 million people prays and works every day for the establishment of the Islamic Caliphate and the replacement of the corrupt and unjust system of man-made laws and government by Allah's (swt) divine Sharia.

The long struggle is nearly over, and its outcome has been preordained according to the promise of Allah (swt) to His (swt) believers. As far as the American military is concerned, consider this statement by the well known Saudi Professor Nasser bin Suleiman al-Omar:

"Islam is advancing according to a steady plan, to the point that tens of thousands of Muslims have joined the American army and Islam is the second largest religion in America. America will be destroyed. But we must be patient."

Do you really desire more war and bloodshed? Do you really want your children to perish in a futile and foredoomed effort to hold back the inevitable triumph of Islam?

Stop warring against Almighty Allah (swt). Stop abusing and oppressing Muslims. Embrace Islam now and live in peace according to the commands of Allah (swt) and following the perfect example of his Prophet (saw). Be part of the bright, shining future of an Islamic America, not a forgotten part of a dim, dying past.

Your grandchildren will be Muslim.

Allahu akbar

56 lobo91  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 7:22:34am

#43 Jinnderella:

the perp was violating some sort of clearance or need-to-know policy. This is my question-- can an American soldier of muslim faith ever take an oath to protect his country or honour clearances in honesty?

As I see it, the answer is "no."

One of the questions on the security screening questionaire asks whether the applicant has ever been a member of an organization devoted to the overthrow of the US government through extra-legal means.

If Islam doesn't qualify as such, then I don't know what does.

57 Titus Quinctius Cincinnatus  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 7:24:11am

Also OT - Front Page Magazine report on the junior jihadists

58 reaganite  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 7:24:40am

#54 Titus Quinctius Cincinnatus
Pssst!

59 CGW  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 7:25:01am

I invite you all over to Jihad Watch to answer Reza's post ( I beat her to it here) personally there as well.

60 reaganite  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 7:25:20am

#55 Reza
FOAD

61 zulubaby  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 7:25:54am

CGW, Reza is right here.

62 odin  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 7:26:08am

Now is a good time to state that Islam must be treated as a political party rather than a religion due to the total regulation of its followers lives.

63 freedomsound  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 7:26:24am

OT Fallaci's book drawing predictable heat

Guardian: Anti-Islamic books' success fuel fears of racism in Italy

"We are very worried. Fallaci and others like her are using their popularity to create hatred. She is effectively telling thousands of people they must chase the Arabs out of Europe.

"It's a kind of racism that was unacceptable in Europe until a few years ago. Now, with this kind of publication, it is becoming acceptable. The more these books are published the more people even feel urged, encouraged and justified in wanting to chase the 'enemy' out of Europe.

"It's exactly the same thing we saw in Italy when the laws were brought in against the Jews in 1938."

64 Ann  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 7:26:32am

Do you cut and paste often, Reza?

No, it is not going to happen. Your allah (satan) lied to you, fool.

Good always wins over evil.

65 zulubaby  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 7:28:42am

freedomsound (#63)

"It's exactly the same thing we saw in Italy when the laws were brought in against the Jews in 1938."

We come in so handy for them when they're not denying the Holocaust.

66 John Schneider  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 7:29:45am

#36 Ed Moran

Yeah, I know about his status, but regardless of his current loyalty, he still ain't someone I would trust.

67 Titus Quinctius Cincinnatus  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 7:31:11am

Clean up on aisle #55...

There are already 8 million "documented" Muslims in the United States, along with an estimated 10 million additional "undocumented" Muslims.

Source please?

All the REAL reports I've seen about the Muslim population in the US places the TOTAL number at around 1.8 million or so.

As for the "undocumented" ones, that's why we have an INS and should be using it.

Every one of these 18 million people prays and works every day for the establishment of the Islamic Caliphate and the replacement of the corrupt and unjust system of man-made laws and government by Allah's (swt) divine Sharia.

Oddly enough, I used to work with a guy from Morocco. Nice guy, worked hard, and totally didn't pay the least bit of attention to all that Islamic "shar'ia" nonsense. He ate pork, drank beer, was married to a Catholic girl, etc. I seriously doubt he's "praying for the establishment of the Caliphate".

Your grandchildren will be Muslim.

Your grandchildren will be faithful members of the First Baptist Church (Independent, Fundamental) of Teheran.

BTW, Reza, you never did actually get around to dealing with my challenge to you to answer the lies of Islam. Until you do, I think I'll consider you discredited.

68 Bob with one O  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 7:31:46am

Reza (french for Tokyo Rose)

My grandchildren will wear muslim the fabric without ever being aware there was another definition.

ESABATMoon

Have a nice day..

69 Titus Quinctius Cincinnatus  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 7:32:20am

#58 reaganite

Oh, heh heh, yeah...;)

70 zulubaby  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 7:32:23am

torog quoted Fallaci's response to the charges of "racism":

We can talk for centuries about the word 'racist,'" she said. "'Racist' has to do with race and not with religion. Yes, I am against that religion, a religion that controls the life of people in every minute of their day, that puts the burqa on women, that treats women as camels, that preaches polygamy, that cuts the hands of the poor thieves ... I am not religious-all religions are difficult to accept for me-but the Islamic one is not even a religion, in my opinion. It is a tyranny, a dictatorship-the only religion on earth that has never committed a work of self-criticism ... It is immovable. It becomes worse and worse ... It is 1,400 years and these people never review themselves, and now they want to come impose it on me, on us?
71 Geepers  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 7:33:03am

The Reza never responds, but I am curious about "undocumented" Muslims.

What the hell is that Reza? Like your imaginary friends? All those people you know would support Allah if they were just a bit more dumb? Like all the trolls who post under a different name saying "You are so right"?

When the time comes, you better hope your imaginary friends can shoulder the burden.

72 freedomsound  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 7:33:13am
We come in so handy for them when they're not denying the Holocaust.

So true, Zulubaby.

73 zulubaby  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 7:33:50am

Reza, your grandchildren will be strippers.

74 CGW  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 7:34:15am

#61 zulubaby

As you can see, I re-posted her post just before she pasted her post here. :-)

The invitation still stands! Things can get a litlle slow over at JW, we always love fresh troops.

75 LibraryGryffon  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 7:34:59am

I think Reza's estimates are just a wee bit off? Though if you lump all christians together as one monolithic group, I suppose Islam might still be the next largest group.

When my husband was active duty on the subs I seem to recall being told that anything I wrote him, whether by paper or e-mail might be read by someone else and to write accordingly. I also recall being told that all incoming e-mail was vetted by the CO or a designated officer before being destributed. My husband was under the impression that anything outgoing was also vetted. I can only assume that nothing like this was being done on the Benfold back in 2000/1, but then security has always been rather tighter in the silent service.

76 [Engineer]  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 7:35:56am

#70 zulubaby

torog quoted Fallaci's response to the charges of "racism":

That is a very good answer. I am going to keep that bookmarked to use the next time somebody calls us racist.

77 zulubaby  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 7:36:02am

CGW, got it :-)

78 Craig Abu Al-Boo-Boo  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 7:36:49am

#65 zulubaby

We come in so handy for them when they're not denying the Holocaust.


Yeah. I love how they try to have it both ways. Kind of reminds me of Kerry trying to be the hero of a war he says was a crime.

79 zulubaby  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 7:37:34am

Engineer, yes, she's just fabulous. It seems so simple and clear, the way she writes it.

80 RickZ  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 7:39:40am

Ah, the trollbot appears!

Are you people so blinded by your fear and hatred of Islam

Yes.

81 Nekama  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 7:40:05am

55 Reza

Stop warring against Almighty Allah (***SPIT***).

Drop your fantasies about defeating America. You've got a better chance of getting 72 virgins.

Your grandchildren will be Muslim.

YOUR grandchildren will never be born. Their grandparents will reside under a shiny glass parking lot.

82 zulubaby  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 7:40:25am

Craig Abu Al-Boo-Boo, that's what liars and hypocrites do.

Kind of reminds me of Kerry trying to be the hero of a war he says was a crime.

Exactly!

83 DQUICKLY  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 7:41:51am

GOD WILLING We will catch and KEEL HAUL the Bastard.

84 Sean II  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 7:42:15am
85 Ed Moran: Abu GOMEX aoa 28C  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 7:44:36am

73

Zulubaby:


LOL

86 Reza  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 7:44:41am

I must appologize for the duplication of my comment on this thread. Please note that I myself did not spam the thread. Rather, the notorious hatemonger and bigot CGW took it upon himself to copy my post from another site with the goal of attacking me without my knowledge.

87 reaganite  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 7:46:10am

#86 Reza
I repeat myself, FOAD.

88 Model4  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 7:47:29am

#73 zulubaby: LMAO!

89 Bob with one O  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 7:47:47am

geepers,

Stories keep filtering in about the increasing numbers of ME illegals coming across the southern border. 10 mil? I think not. Probably an adjustment in strategy since 9/11

90 Ann  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 7:48:00am

#86 Reza:

goal of attacking me without my knowledge.


Good for him. Get used to it.

91 zulubaby  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 7:49:05am
the notorious hatemonger and bigot CGW

I like him already. Tell me more ...

92 Ed Moran: Abu GOMEX aoa 28C  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 7:49:17am

Reza


Are you Shia or Sunni? Was Ali "a friend of Allah"?

93 Poitiers-Lepanto  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 7:49:42am

#86 Reza

I think that I will agree with Reaganite. FOAD

And I have already explained to you one time where your grandchildren will be (yes, you remember, the disco in Mecca, the esotic dancers, the orgies with the then old P-L). Don't make me give you further details.

94 Bob with one O  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 7:50:55am

Reza,

What does it take to become a

notorious hatemonger and bigot

Is there like a school or special training program I can sign up for. Geez, now I feel like such an underachiever.

95 Geepers  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 7:52:08am
the notorious hatemonger and bigot CGW

On his accomplishment of becoming "notorious" for using Reza's own words as an appalling display of hatemongering and bigotry.

All hale CGW!

96 Poitiers-Lepanto  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 7:52:33am

Oh Reza, don't forget my stories, lived experiences, with all the muslim hookers in the French Riviera.
Those are your mothers and sisters, I presume.

We should meet for a long long night of drinks and laughs, I have stories to tell you.

97 Sean II  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 7:53:53am

This is scary: CNN

Slowdown in 'chatter' worries officials

Same thing happened just prior to 9/11

98 Bob with one O  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 7:54:05am

Poitiers- Lepanto,

Now you're just being a suck-up

:)

99 Poitiers-Lepanto  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 7:56:01am

#98 Bob with one O

(Nice nic BTW)

My defect is that I get angry and I forget to sign

/Pagans against islamofascism

100 Ed Moran: Abu GOMEX aoa 28C  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 7:56:30am

Allah was the name given an idol to HaBa'al, brought from Assyria, and may indeed be the same false god Ba'al from the Bible.

Mohammad raided camel caravans, broke treaties, tortured and killed prisoners of war, and got hard-ons for six year old girls.


Any questions?

101 Ann  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 7:56:32am

Hatemonger and bigot = taqiyya translation for having an understanding of islam.

102 Darleen  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 7:57:05am

Slightly OT, update on the Religion of Wife-Beaters

Ranya Al-Baz, a Saudi TV host of a women's issues talk show, was severely beaten by her husband, Muhammad Bakr Yunis. On April 4, 2004, Yunis left her in a hospital in a state of unconsciousness. The story received extensive media coverage in the Arab world, and the abusive husband was arrested. He was first accused of attempting to kill his wife, but the charges were subsequently reduced to the use of severe violence. Yunis was sentenced to six months imprisonment and 300 lashes. However, Ranya decided to pardon her husband – a measure allowed by Saudi law. Yunis was spared the lashes and was released in early July after three months imprisonment.

On April 29, with bruises still on her face, Ranya gave a rare televised interview to journalist Mahmoud Sa'd of the Saudi TV station MBC.

Yunis: 'Prophet Muhammad Forbade Beating a Wife on Her Face. But at the Same Time, One May Beat a Wife as Punishment'

On August 1, almost a month after his release, the abusive husband was also interviewed on the same show. In the interview, Yunis was shown excerpts from his wife's April interview and was asked to comment. He said he regretted the physical damage he caused his wife, but he justified the beating itself with religious reasons. He said that Islam forbids beating a woman on her face, but allows beating as a means of punishment.

aside to Reza

Of course, I certainly want my grand daughters to live under such a grand and woman-cherishing "religion"

/off tag for the sarcasm impaired

103 Poitiers-Lepanto  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 7:59:32am

In a word, this is my platform:


MAKE LOVE, NOT ISLAM

104 Darleen  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 7:59:38am

#95 Geepers

Wow... it's now "the Notorious CGW"

I eagerly await his first rap CD.

105 Ed Moran: Abu GOMEX aoa 28C  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 8:00:02am

97 Sean Deuce

U.S. government officials describe al-Hindi as a "major player who moved operational information between key components of al Qaeda" in Britain, the United States and Pakistan.

Born of Indian parents, al-Hindi converted to Islam at 20 and fought in Kashmir, a disputed border region between India and Pakistan.

Now in his mid-30s, al-Hindi wrote a book called "The Army of Medina and Kashmir," in which he advocated attacking the economies of Western powers as the best way to get them to disengage from the Muslim world.


Interesting, I had wondered if his name al-Hindi had something to do with his ethnicity. So his jihadi buds call him "The Hindu".


Of course, if one wants to be optimistic, chatter might be dropping because the [bigoted word]s figure their communications have been compromised after all the recent arrests.

106 John F'ing Kerry  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 8:00:17am

but once again mainstream media withholds one of the most important pieces of information in the story

At least they are consistent.

No big story on the fact that the person leaking the name of the Pakistani 'double agent' thereby curtailing his use and screwing up a parallel British operation, was an administration official bent on covering presidential ass in the crass use of terror warnings for political advantage.

107 John Schneider  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 8:01:30am

reza:

What a nasty shock it's gonna be when the likes of your kind, the Islamofascists, are dead, their fanatiscm dead, their ideology dead.

Your bones will fall to dust under the soles of our feet.

In other words, you ain't sh*t to us. We haven't even begun to start messin' around with you yet.

108 freedomsound  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 8:01:32am

Ok, last couple of OTs, I promise:

Nearly 200 Iranian women wearing head coverings considered insufficient under the country's Islamic code have been arrested, newspapers reported on Saturday.

Police have been seen taking scores of teenaged girls from commercial centres, while both police and Islamic militiamen have also reportedly stepped up raids on private parties where they suspect the presence of alcohol or mixed-sex dancing.

Thailand ready to arrest 27 Islamic teachers

Meanwhile, in the latest of daily hit-and-run attacks in southern Thailand, a suspected insurgent dressed in the long white robe of a Muslim missionary fatally shot an army sergeant yesterday, police said...

And in separate incidents on Wednesday, a retired policeman was shot dead and a bomb exploded near a captain's house...

Lieutenant-General Manote Kraiwong said he believed the assailants were likely to be teachers in Islamic schools and part of the same group that set off bombs on Wednesday.

109 Ann  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 8:01:49am

#41 mkanderson:

I'm a long-time (two years) lurker, first time poster. I'm former Air Force


Welcome, and thank you for your service!
My heavens... two years! Please don't wait another two years to post again-:)

110 Radian  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 8:02:10am

reza

Islam, isn't that a social virus you pick up in prison?

As for the muz handing out information, whats to stop him from being declared an enemy combatant, tried by court martial and sentenced to death by firing squad or hanging?

111 CGW  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 8:03:33am

#94 Bob with one O LMAO

#95 Geepers Thanks!

#101 Ann EXACTLY !!!

112 The Bruce  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 8:05:29am

MK Anderson: "An email to Russia in the cold war would be considered treason in the highest order. Why is this not even being called treason? "

Because W didn't declare war on any country or political ideology--he didn't name the enemy. The enemy is still offiically anonymous, so we can't officially watch for their adherents formally but informally.

Since the public has not demanded a formal declaration of any kind, our political leadership is not compelled to risk it.

When our political leadership acquires the necessary courage to wage war without tying our hands, we will do whatever is necessary to win the war. Until then, we're neutering ourselves.

113 genard  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 8:05:35am

#55 Reza,

Over your stone cold body...

114 Radian  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 8:05:36am

106

you are posting from mi6, right? FBI, CIA nope, you don't know what the fuck you are takling about.

Feel free to post some proof of your allegation.

115 Darleen  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 8:07:48am

#106 Effing

You should want the public not be informed of threats?

116 Ann  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 8:09:26am

#111 CGW:
Please come back this evening after a respectable-time-of-day-to-start drinking, and I will buy you a beer!

117 Brenda  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 8:12:48am

OT

Ben Stein is now on C-span2 talking about his new book Can America Survive. He's pretty wound up.

[Link: inside.c-spanarchives.org:8080...]


Watch online

[Link: www.c-span.org...]

118 Darleen  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 8:13:11am

114 Radian

Effing is spinning from UK Reuters article

Near the very end of the article:

"If it's true that the Americans have unintentionally revealed the identity of another nation's intelligence agent, who appears to be working in the good of all of us, that is not only a fundamental intelligence flaw, it's also a monumental foreign relations blunder," security expert Paul Beaver, a former publisher of Jane's Defence Weekly, told Reuters.

Kevin Rosser, security expert at the London-based consultancy Control Risks Group, said such a disclosure was a risk that came with staging public alerts, but that authorities were meant to take special care not to ruin ongoing operations.

However, for Effing, it means that Bushie deliberately screwed a double agent for political purposes.

:::rolls eyes:::

119 'Nam Grunt  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 8:15:08am

This sailor should be tried for treason, and put before a firing squad at Ft. Leavenworth, I speak as a true soldier that fought in 'Nam for over two years in an actual combat situation and earned my medals honestly, although I am proud to have received them, I don't wave them around or like someone I know that only stopped in to visit for 4 months to further his political career and then come back and shame the true soldiers that served, and I will mention again stop giving your money to muslim businesses, it is being used to kill our brave young men, wake up America.

120 Ann  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 8:15:17am

#117 Brenda:
Got it. Thanks.

121 John F'ing Kerry  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 8:16:24am

#114 Feel free to post some proof of your allegation.

It's all over the net.

[Link: billmon.org...]

[Link: www.washingtonmonthly.com...]

[Link: www.juancole.com...]

[Link: obsidianwings.blogs.com...]

[Link: yglesias.typepad.com...]

122 Jeeves  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 8:16:24am

#23 Jimmy the Clam

How loyal are U.S. [bigoted word]s? S. Huntington:

Muslims, particularly Arab Muslims, also seem slow to assimilate compared with earlier groups. Elsewhere in the world, Muslim minorities have often proved to be "indigestible" by non-Muslim societies. A study of Los Angeles Muslims found ambivalent attitudes toward America: "A significant number of Muslims, particularly immigrant Muslims, do not have close ties or loyalty to the United States." When asked whether they had "closer ties or loyalty to Islamic countries (perhaps your country of birth) or the United States," 45 percent of the immigrants said Islamic countries, 10 percent the United States, and 32 percent "about the same." Among American-born Muslims, 19 percent chose Islamic countries, 38 percent the United States, and 28 percent about the same. Fifty-seven percent of the immigrants and 32 percent of the American-born Muslims said that "if given the choice, [they] would leave the United States to live in an Islamic country." Fifty-two percent of the interviewees said it was very important and 24 percent said it was quite important to replace public schools with Islamic schools.

[Link: www.taemag.com...]

123 Radian  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 8:17:26am

118

Ah. Someone should inform mr beaver and effing that if a bullfrog had wings he wouldn't have a bruised ass.

124 ploome hineni[deleted]  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 8:19:25am
125 Geepers  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 8:19:44am

Ann (#116),

Please come back this evening after a respectable-time-of-day-to-start drinking, and I will buy you a beer!

You're weird. ;-Þ

126 the Jashiriyya  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 8:20:04am

Ed Moran, John Schnieder:
I admire Ali Al-Sistani, as you can see from my comment here.

BTW, there are Rza comments on that same thread-- quelle ennui incroyable! He always says the same thing! :)

Al-Sistani is trying in a subtle and conversativee way to change the literal interpretation of the qu'ran, in a way that will benefit the Iraqi people. I hope he will be ok, we really need him!

127 Sean II  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 8:20:31am

105 Ed Moran

That is what I personally thought, all the arrests in the last couple of days is causing some major "clamming up"...

128 ploome hineni[deleted]  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 8:21:08am
129 Darleen  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 8:21:56am

Effing

Pay attention now! I know you love linking to the moonbatty sites, but here's some hard questions fer ya... you wrote:

crass use of terror warnings for political advantage


What political advantage can you document? When the government received hard evidence, should the public be informed, or not? If you believe the latter, and despite prior info being shared privately amongst agencies, an attack happens, do you think the public would be justified/unjustified in anger that they were NOT informed?

Your OWN words, please.

130 Radian  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 8:22:45am

121

Since you didn't link an original source if news I will take the reuters information.

The article SPECULATES about disclosures. It does not cite any intelligence agency as complaining.

I ask again are your a field agent or member of goverment with security clearance or just spewing speculative shit?

131 Bob with one O  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 8:23:02am

Ploome,

You left out France.

132 Ben B  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 8:25:57am

#55 Reza

I must admit that you paint a wonderful picture of an Islamic planet, where the rule of man-made laws are put aside, and all is for Allah. It sounds delightful. You make it sound so wonderful. You must have remarkable faith to be so certain.

Perhaps, though, you could tell me why Allah, who is the creator and the sustainer of all things, seems so keen on a monopoly of human worship? So keen that He pleads for worship? Please tell me why, having made everything in the Universe, He should dote so much on worship that he seems to exercise executive power solely through His Ummah. Maybe you could tell me why He finds it necessary to use the stick-and-carrot of heaven and hell to get this worship. Maybe you could tell me why he contradicts himself sometimes. And maybe you could tell me why he seems sometimes to speak as though he and the Holy Prophet (pbuh) had somehow got their separate identities confused. And perhaps you could (without resorting to the 'because it says so in the Koran' argument, prove to me that the Koran is the final, perfect, complete divine instruction to man?

Please try to help me, Reza. If you can convince me, then I'll struggle in Allah's way to bring about the Caliphate, and you'll go straight to Al-Jannah, so it'll be a good deal for both of us. Looking forward to it.

Ben B

133 John F'ing Kerry  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 8:25:58am

#119 'namgrunt

So in your opinion someone that only stopped in to visit for 4 months to further his political career is more contemptable than someone who sat on their ass in a safe stateside billet ? Because that same someone who earned the right to critisize the way the Vietnam war was fought may have brought shame to the true soldiers that served ? While the draft dodger in chief cheered from the sidelines ?

134 ploome hineni[deleted]  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 8:26:43am
135 Ann  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 8:27:04am

#125 Geepers:
Well, it is almost 1:30 here...

136 zorkmidden  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 8:28:19am

This is kind of OT:

The term "[bigoted word]s" bothers me when I see it on LGF. I don't like derogatory terms used for any religion. Not to mention that it gives LGF the appearance of being a "hate" site.

I love LGF and I want it to be the best blog in the web.
JMOHO.

137 ploome hineni[deleted]  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 8:28:54am
138 John F'ing Kerry  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 8:29:01am

#129 Darleen

Your own words do indeed convince me this was nothing more than an ass covering operation which led to worse when they got called on it.

139 John Schneider  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 8:31:12am
128 ploome hineni
Fifty-seven percent of the immigrants and 32 percent of the American-born Muslims said that "if given the choice, [they] would leave the United States to live in an Islamic country."

how can we make this easier for them?

I'd like to not give them the choice. Find 'em, get rid of em. If they are born here, get rid of em. If they immigrated here, get rid of em. They whine about rights? Get rid of em. Inhale oxygen within our borders? That's right. Get rid of em.

I'ts a disease. Kill it before it kills us.

140 Radian  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 8:31:29am

133

Put down the crack pipe. None of what you wrote made sense.

Kerry served 4 months and then came back and accused vets of being war criminals in front of congress.

Bush served in the National Guard and flew jets.

Kerry choose the vietnam issue to cover the fact that he has spent twenty years as a liberal senator from Mass. who regularly voted against millitary programs.

Kerry is a worthless slime. He could have spent 4 years in vietnam and won the CMH and then done what he has done with his life and he would still be a worthless slug.

141 Bob with one O  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 8:32:00am

effing,

Same old tired and previously refuted arguments. Kerry's shipmates seem to like him though not the rest of the squadron.

I was headed down to my local gunstore but I'll wait if you want to try again?

142 'Nam Grunt  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 8:32:40am

# Ploome

Easy, stop giving them money! Spend it in a place that will benifit Americans, and just give them a ride to the airport!!!

143 John F'ing Kerry  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 8:34:06am

Mainstream media are on it now, well cable anyway.

[Link: www.msnbc.msn.com...]

144 Model4  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 8:35:23am

#133 John F'ing Kerry: Care to tell the class what the National Guard's century-series fighter pilots' primary mission was during Vietnam? You know, that "safe stateside billet." I doubt you know, but even if you did you wouldn't say.

But how about you and I take a trip to visit some of the Guardsmen and Reservists who have enlisted over the last few years? It'll be fun seeing you tell them what unpatrioic pussies you think they are.

145 Geepers  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 8:38:03am

ploome,

now, why would anyone who has any brains, want to become islamic, like them?

Are you kidding?!

Afghanistan | Known for their rugs.

Albania | Are they're still a country?

Algeria | Wasn't Algeria the setting for some old movie?

Azerbaijan | ?

Bahrain | Home of Al-Jazeera.

Bangladesh | Cat Stevens! Need I say more?

Benin | WTF? Isn't that a new breed of dog?

Brunei | Know through out the world for their fine nu ahg graihk alawagi.

Burkina Faso | That's not a country.

Cameroon | Birthplace of the cameroon cookie.

Chad | Don't get Al Gore started with your partisan politics.

Comoros | People from Comoros are known as Comas.

Côte d'Ivoire | Ivory Coats.

Djibouti | Inspiration for several funny nics and silly song lyrics.

Egypt | Hello? Obelisk technology.

Gabon | I did a report on Gabon in the forth grade.

146 RickZ  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 8:39:00am

# 133 Effin:

While the draft dodger in chief cheered from the sidelines ?

National Guard duty is not "draft-dodging." For draft dodging, see Billy Jeff Clinton.

Kerry didn't bother to cheer from the sidelines, or at least keep his pie hole shut. No, better to make future political hay out of lies that all soldiers who served in Viet Nam, including himself, were guilty of atrocities equating to war crimes.

Yeah, I can tell you gotta a clue.

/sarc

147 Ed Moran: Abu GOMEX aoa 28C  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 8:39:15am

I suppose our troll, John Effin Kerry, as well as his namesake (Piss Be Upon Him), would have preferred the Bush Administration, despite knowing that as recently as January of this year, that certain high profile targets in this country were being recconnoitered, would say nothing, as a truck bomb at the CitiBank building with a couple of thousand dead would be worth it to help further unravel the al Qaeda net. Hell, if GWB had info that al Qaeda had a nuclear weapon in lower Manhattan, better to lose a couple of hundred thousand citizens rather than reveal sources, right?


Douchebag.

148 Radian  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 8:39:34am

143

More speculation, no names, no official release.

And if nothing was done and something did happen you would be here saying Bush knew and did nothing. Sometimes decisions have to be made.

This is all speculation, at best like trying to make sense of one side of a phone call. Answer me one question.

Do you have security clearance that would allow you to see the whole picture of british, american and pakastani operations?? Yes or No.

Everything Bush does up to the election will be called political,right wrong thats the way it is.

149 Model4  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 8:39:44am

#133 John F'ing Kerry: Bonus question - Can you name for me one veteran who has whored his medals more, or more shamelessly? Out of thousands upon thousands of veterans over all those decades, just one. Please.

/starts Final Jeopardy music

150 Bob with one O  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 8:39:49am

Have a good afternoon all. Enjoyable as always.

151 'Nam Grunt  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 8:41:23am

ummm effing,

Did you actually serve in the Armed forces, if you did STFU, and if you didn't STFU!

152 Cornholio  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 8:45:31am

Reza

Your grandchildren will be Muslim

Or WHAT? What are you going to do Reza, since my grandchildren are not Muslim? Are you going to try to blow up the office building they work in? Will you try to slice their heads off? Will you carry out a cowardly attack on their morning commute?

I want to know.

153 scaramouche  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 8:45:42am

#145 Geepers

Great summary. LOL!

154 Ed Moran: Abu GOMEX aoa 28C  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 8:45:48am

Model4


I whore my Good Conduct medal all the time.

What do you mean I've had enough to drink and you won't serve me. I'll have you know I earned a Good Conduct Medal!

155 John F'ing Kerry  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 8:46:43am

#144

I'll take a crack at it.

They were meant to be the last line of defence against soviet bombers attacking the US mainland an event about as likely to happen then as the North Koreans invading the south or the Chinese invading Taiwan today. In other words he was an integral part of a defence against a threat that didn't really exist but that we still had to make some provision against. His aircraft would have used standoff missiles launched from a safe distance whilst being entirely under the control of ground based radar operators, hardly Topgun stuff.

156 Darleen  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 8:50:47am

#138 Effing

Nice dodge ... buy the mini cooper next time...

Answer the questions, what documented "political advantage" do the terror alerts have? Do you want to be warned when hard evidence comes to light, or not?

Or is it that you believe that GW has no business doing ANY government business while Kedwards whistlestop across the country while their lawyers are threatening tv stations about running anti-Kerry ads and Dem congress people are threatening legislation against FoxNews?

Now, how did that meme go about Republicans being "fascists"?

157 Geepers  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 8:50:52am

scaramouche (#153)

Great summary. LOL!

Thanks. :-) I was going to do them all, but there's a freaking boatload of them.

GW better get busy.

158 Ann  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 8:52:43am

#152 Cornholio:

Are you going to try to blow up the office building they work in? Will you try to slice their heads off?


Of course. This "religion" does not send missionaries. It sends murderers. It is not valid. I know of no other "faith" that converts by force and intimidation.

Hug the Morman missionaries when they get off of their bicycles :)

159 John F'ing Kerry  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 8:55:11am

#146 RickZ

National Guard duty is not "draft-dodging." For draft dodging, see Billy Jeff Clinton.

To be more specific (accounting for the limited number of Guard that went to Vietnam) those serving in the TANG of draft age and cheering from the sidelines, were indeed draft dodgers, as was Clinton.

And please don't try to compare the fate of the Guard today under Bush with that of the Vietnam era Guard that were not deployed in any great numbers to the combat zone, unless you are counting Kent State as such.

160 John Schneider  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 8:55:26am

#155 John F'ing Kerry

Care to enlighten us as to your military service?

161 [Engineer]  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 8:56:39am

#116 Ann

Please come back this evening after a respectable-time-of-day-to-start drinking, and I will buy you a beer!

It is after 6 UTC, late enough?

162 Ed Moran: Abu GOMEX aoa 28C  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 8:56:43am

I think 155 is my Moonbat brother in Kansas City.

BTW, did you know GWB volunteered for a program called "Palace Guard", where ANG pilots would fly a year in Vietnam, but the USAF was phasing out his aircraft at the time?


Of course, if we assume GWB knew 35 years ago he wanted to POTUS, maybe he knew his type aircraft was going to be phased out when he volunteered. Just like someone else, who requested a deferrment to study in Paris (where else), and when this was rejected by his draft board, volunteered for the Navy, maybe figuring it was safer than taking his chances in maybe being a 2nd Lieutenant leading an Army or Marine platoon in country, and then, seeing a chance to be like the other JFK, volunteered for Swift Boats, when they were still used for relatively safe coastal patrol duty. Then, according to his fellow boat skippers, when the Navy decided to use the boats for river warfare, where they would actually see hostile fire, he bitched and moaned and complained, got 3 Purple Hearts in four months for injuries so minor he missed no time, and got himself sent home. Of course, maybe JFnK really did deserve his medals, but since, unlike GWB, he won't unseal his service records, we'll never know.

163 Ann  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 8:57:09am

#155 Effing:
What/who poses the greatest threat to your well-being today? And why?

164 struan al kufr  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 8:57:12am

Seconding #139, John Schneider, as strongly as can be imagined!

As to the posted subject RoP Moles in the Navy? - it would be the heighth of naievete to suppose otherwise and finally, John Kerry -

Let's save everybody time and trouble and vote today.

Whoever is undecided at this point is brain dead uninformed and will never be otherwise.

I'm exhausted with seeing this DemoTrash parade and charade as Americans.

Time to take the garbage out.

165 John F'ing Kerry  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 9:01:17am

#156 Darleen

Answer the questions, what documented "political advantage" do the terror alerts have? Do you want to be warned when hard evidence comes to light, or not?

Not if it compromises national security by outing a potential source or multiple sources.

[Link: www.msnbc.msn.com...]

Bush is fighting for re-election, that's the only war he and his cronies really care about.

166 Ann  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 9:01:31am

#161 [Engineer]:
UTC? 6 am or pm?

Ah, it doesn't matter!

What are you having?:)

167 Darleen  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 9:01:38am

#163 Ann

I'm beginning to think Effing is Ted Kennedy just before tippling time. And you know what Uncle Teddy thinks is America's greatest threat ...

168 John F'ing Kerry  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 9:01:54am

#160

No

169 Cornholio  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 9:01:59am

#158 Ann

Yes, I'd really like an answer from "Reza" to my question. Not expecting one though.

 

170 Geepers  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 9:02:05am

Ed Moran (#154),

I whore my Good Conduct medal all the time.

What do you mean I've had enough to drink and you won't serve me. I'll have you know I earned a Good Conduct Medal!

LOL!!

Next time you see geezer around ask him about the CMH winner he used to serve with who kept a baby bottle full of scotch in his flight jacket.


And, "forth" sheez. Ann's probably already figured out I'm on my second one. ;-)

171 Ed Moran: Abu GOMEX aoa 28C  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 9:02:12am

It does seem awfully curious that Kerry is so proud of his Vietnam service, yet won't make his military records public. Why wouldn't he want the official records of his exploits made public?

Our JFnK wannabe, and his fellow DUmmies, would probably be delighted if another terror attack in this country killed 3,000 people, as long as he didn't personally know any of them, as long as it helped beat Bush.


BTW, yes, I am questioning your patriotism.

172 Ann  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 9:05:28am

Darleen, are you still listening to Ben Stein? He's great.
Thanks again!

173 schroedinger's cat  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 9:05:33am

#155
Oh that's right, there was absoluteley no threat from the Soviets whatsoever. And there is currently no threat from the North Koreans. Have you ever been to South Korea? I had two fun filled years there flying Army AH-1f attack helicopters in the late 1980s and early 1990s and have flown along the entire DMZ on numrous occasions. I guess what I saw was all bullshit. I also spent 4 years in the mid 1980s in the 2nd ACR flying the East German/Czech border. And I thought all those tanks and Hind attack helicopters were real. But thats right, you (like your nic) will wait until the attack begins to verify that it is real and do something.
Wanker!

174 John F'ing Kerry  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 9:05:51am

#163 Ann

What/who poses the greatest threat to your well-being today? And why?

The administation of GWB.

His continued efforts to portray himself as a commander in chief at war with roughly 50% of his own nations population.

175 Darleen  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 9:06:24am

#165 Effing

Again, you are assuming that when the name of the man arrested was revealed, the revealer knew Khan was a "double agent."

If the Brits had told told the US of the arrest, but held back that Khan was now "turned" then this is not what you are wishing it to be.

As if competing intelligence agencies always share complete information at all times!!

So, I do take it then, if a truck bomb goes off at Disneyworld and it comes out that the admin knew but didn't warn, you aren't going to hold them responsible, right?

176 [Engineer]  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 9:07:50am

#166 Ann

UTC? 6 am or pm?

PM of course (I have a program that displays time from places all over the world. It is always after 5 somewhere:-)

Haven't yet, but there is a bottle of Crown Royal on the bar that is calling my name.

177 Ed Moran: Abu GOMEX aoa 28C  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 9:09:45am

Mini-Kerry


Either you were in the service or you weren't.


BTW, I don't think one has to have served to have informed and valuable opinions, although it doesn't hurt.

BTW,

Bush is fighting for re-election, that's the only war he and his cronies really care about.


I love that revolutionary language, like "crony". Long live the Glorious Worker's Revolution!

178 John F'ing Kerry  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 9:09:48am

#155

Oh that's right, there was absoluteley no threat from the Soviets whatsoever.

Didn't say that.

Just that there was no real threat from Soviet intercontinental bombers carrying nuclear bombs. As a second wave possibly once the ICBM's had done their job but not a 1st wave attack.

179 Darleen  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 9:11:23am

#174 Effing

Jaysus on a Pony, you are Uncle Teddy*!

*(Mass.'s elected equivilent of a pity-f*ck)

180 Athos  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 9:11:44am

#171 Ed Moran

Even more interesting beyond the basic fact that serving 4 months of a 12 month combat tour as a Lt. jg apparently instantly qualifies one as a national security expert, or offsets 240 months of a Senatorial voting record, are 2 other observations. One, the way the DUmmies and JFnK are embracing a war that they have comdemned since 1968, and secondly, the interesting examination of someone touting themselves as a hero.

Sorry, but, from WW2, Korea, Vietnam, and other recent conflicts, the "real" heroes are remarkable for their humility. Watch any of the interviews of the WW2 vets, for example, the 101st Airborne "Band of Brothers" survivors, and all of them, including the most decorated, deny in interviews that they were heroes, that the real heroes were others - in particular the ones who didn't come hom.

181 [Engineer]  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 9:11:44am

#174 John F'ing Kerry

The administation of GWB.

His continued efforts to portray himself as a commander in chief at war with roughly 50% of his own nations population.

Bush is fighting the terrorists that attacked the U.S. If some Americans have joined the enemy, then so be it, we can deal with them. (by the way, your side is far, far less than 50% as you will see in the election)

182 John Schneider  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 9:12:15am

#168 John F'ing Kerry

No

Figures.

Cause you didn't spend any time in the military, have spent your whole miserable existence trashing the military, and now are faced with a choice of someone who (hypocritically) touts his Vietnam Navy service, which is SOOO against your ideals, and a man who served his time in the Air National Guard, which in your terms is "dodging" military service.

So you have a horrible problem here. The man you support did something you HATE and is running his campaign on promoting that service. The candidate you hate served his military time in a way YOU would if you had to serve.

Must really suck to be you. You might need a shrink by November.

183 Ed Moran: Abu GOMEX aoa 28C  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 9:15:37am

Darleen, our troll JFnK, along with the real JFnK, would probably (secretly) love it if the Administration knew terrorists were targetting Disneyworld, but didn't release the info, because all those dead children would help get BusHitler out of office.

GWB is making war on 50% of the American population? I guess that explains the MOAB dropped in Hollywood last week.

184 Ann  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 9:16:28am

#174 Effing:

His continued efforts to portray himself as a commander in chief at war with roughly 50% of his own nations population


Huh? He is the CIC. Sorry to break it to you, but he really is.
I'm so confused about the 50% thing, so I won't even ask for an explanation...

So the real threat is our government. Is that conclusion more comfortable for you than facing the goal of the islamists who are sweeping the globe with death and destruction?

Are you too afraid to examine the repeatedly and openly stated goal of the Khilafah movement?

Is fearing your President preventing your heart from pounding?

185 Darleen  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 9:16:29am

#174 Effing

Is this where you really want to say that you believe 9/11 was "really" engineered by CIA/Mossad at the orders of GW's Xtian/Zionist masters?

186 steve miller  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 9:17:47am

Reza is a FROLL, people - a fake troll. Please stop responding.

187 Darleen  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 9:20:01am

#183 Ed

As was discussed yesterday in reviewing VDH's column and also mentioned by Dennis Prager, JFnK is a great illustration of the childishness that has gripped Democrats and left-libs. His puerile magical thinking is pretty breathtaking.

188 Sparkmechanic  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 9:20:39am

#154

I also have my GCM, I really did earn it. It only took me 11 and a half YEARS to get my first and only one. Stupid rules kept getting in the way of doing the job.

189 'Nam Grunt  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 9:21:20am

effing,

My fellow 'Nam Vet's and I are having a little BBQ here in this little small Texas town, what maybe 25 of us, as we do every chance we get on weekends, ohhh we all sit around and drink beer and tell war stories and read LGF (Hand Salute to you Charles), and we would like to take this occasion of your stupidity in downgrading our President to invite you down here for a little Texas 'fun", we all are willing to pay for your plane ticket.

190 Registered Troll  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 9:21:29am

"Under pressure to justify the alerts in three Northeastern cities, U.S. officials confirmed a report by The New York Times that the man, Mohammad Naeem Noor Khan, was the source of the intelligence that led to the decision."

The Newy ork Times was the ONLY paper to tell the truth. THAT is fascism!!!

191 Ed Moran: Abu GOMEX aoa 28C  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 9:21:42am

Steve Miller


I've seen Reza posting here for a long time, and I suspect he is really who he says he is, although someone says he has "666" in his email address., which makes me wonder.

For a froll, he is awfully darned persistent.

192 piglet  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 9:21:49am

One of the never asked questions about JFK is, how does a small fast and highly manuverable PT boat get run over and cut in half by a much larger ship?

[Link: www.history.navy.mil...]

DIVISION B. As hereinbefore set out, PTs 162 and 109 of Division B with PT 169 of Division A were in Blackett Strait off Vanga Vanga, as was PT 157, which however, was not in contact with them. Around 0215 the three were due East of Gizo Island headed South, in right echelon formation with PT 109 leading, PT 162 second and PT 169 last. PT 162 saw on a collision course, a warship headed Northward about 700 yards away. The PT 162 turned to fire its torpedoes, but they did not fire. The PT 162 finally turned to the Southwest upon getting within 100 yards of the warship, to avoid collision. Personnel aboard the PT 162 saw 2 raked stacks, and at least 2 turrets aft, and possibly a third turret. At the time of turning, PT 109 was seen to collide with the warship, followed by an explosion and a large flame which died down a little, but continued to burn for 10 or 15 minutes. The warship when it was about 3000 yards away headed toward them at high speed. The PT 169 stopped just before the warship hit PT 109, turned toward it and fired two torpedoes when abeam at 150 yards range. The destroyer straddled the PT 169 with shell fire, just after it a collision with PT 109, and then circled left toward Gizo Island at increased speed and disappeared.


The PT 169 laid smoke screen and zigzaged to the Southeast along the reefs off Gizo Island. About 0245 a wake was seen coming up from the near Northwest and on a parallel course. The PT 169 swung around to the left toward the ship (a destroyer) and fired port and starboard forward torpedoes at 2000 yards. The destroyer turned to its port just in time for the starboard torpedo to hit its bow and explode. The PT 169 continued its swing and retired South thru Ferguson Passage going at high speed for 1/2 mile laying smoke and zigzaging and headed for base. All its torpedoes gone.



[Link: news.nationalgeographic.com...]


When Kennedy took charge of PT-109, on April 25, 1943, he was already a millionaire heir, society figure, and ambassador's son (see photo). But fame and fortune were scarce comfort to him on August 2, 1943.

That night at about 2 a.m., the Japanese destroyer Amagiri (see photo), by accident or by design, bisected the much smaller PT-109 (see size comparison), killing two of Kennedy's crew.

Kennedy spent the rest of the night helping rescue injured and wave-tossed crew members (see photo). By dawn the survivors were all clinging to the still-floating bow.

By afternoon they were making a several-hour swim—the strong towing the injured—to a deserted island (see photo). Despite a back injury, Kennedy himself pulled the worst case, tugging the sailor's life vest with his teeth.

The following days (see detailed time line at right) saw several fearless attempts to be rescued. The men were weary with starvation and thirst, when they were eventually rescued by Solomon Islanders loyal to the Allies.

The islanders could operate in daylight without arousing Japanese suspicion, and many served as scouts for Allied coastwatchers operating behind enemy lines. Two of them helped deliver to a coastwatcher a coconut Kennedy famously carved with a rescue message.

193 JohninLondon  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 9:23:01am

John effing Kerry

Bush may not be a hero in your book, but he seems like a straight guy to me, and I don't mind him being leader of the western world.

I know I haven't got a vote in your elections, but I simply hate the idea of a FRAUD like Kerry being the Dem candidate. Any serious and sensible party would have chosen someone straight like Joe Lieberman, not a twisting self-serving weasel like Kerry.

The Dems are not the reasonably pragmatic party I used to remember. Read the monumental Lyndon Johnson biography being published, cast y0our mind back to Roosevelt or Truman or even the original Kennedy brothers. Kerry isn't anywhere near their league.

And his blatant lies about his time in Vietnam will sink him.

Oh - and i saw his wife speaking at the convention. Words fail me - God help us.

194 mkanderson  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 9:24:19am

#109 Ann
Thanks. I will try to post more often. Sometimes I can't contribute anything new so I don't.

#112 The Bruce

You said:

Because W didn't declare war on any country or political ideology--he didn't name the enemy. The enemy is still offiically anonymous, so we can't officially watch for their adherents formally but informally.

That was my point. I can't image how the DoD is prosecuting espionage cases without a clearly defined enemy. I haven't been keeping up with espionage cases, but I would be willing to bet there's a dip in prosecutions since the cold war. I'm also willing to bet that enemy sympathizers exist in greater numbers now.

195 [Engineer]  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 9:24:21am

#186 steve miller

Reza is a FROLL, people - a fake troll. Please stop responding.

In my view, there is no difference. They both have the same effect of taking the thread off topic and of pissing people off.

FROLLS ARE NOT FUNNY - STOP IT.

196 struan al kufr  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 9:24:52am

Geeze - when I was in a GCM was called The Undetected Crime Medal.

197 torog  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 9:25:38am

#178

Please lay out what you feel Kerry will do to:

-acknowledge that Islam is an ideology of facism masked as a religion.

-take concrete steps to win the worldwide war against Islam we are in now.

I don't feel Bush has done all he should at this point but I am curious as to whether Kerry supporters feel he even identifies the threat. Do you think Islam is a threat? Why or why not?

198 gymnast  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 9:30:33am

J f'n Kerry, Lafayette, Siamese Girl, all part of the "one a day plan" to troll LGF with leftist nonsense and fifth column bullshit. By the way, has anyone asked Reza about that passage from the Koran about" Mohammeds miracle"? The one where he comes to life by pulling himself out of his own asshole. Or has that passage been deleted from the Arabic version of the Koran?

199 Ed Moran: Abu GOMEX aoa 28C  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 9:32:32am

I have no reason to doubt the original JFK's heroism. Unlike modern day Democrats, the ideological descendants of the pro-Soviet "Progressive Party", which split with the Democrats in 1948 to run Henry Wallace (who as FDR's Ag Secty had gone to the USSR, and have fallen in love with Stalinism, despite having actually been to a gulag) because the Truman Democrats were perceived to be too hostile to the USSR.

The Progressives rejoined the Democrat party, and had their revenge against the anti-Soviet Democrats, when changes in the nominating rules allowed the nomination of Geroge McGovern, who, as a young WW2 veteran, had been a Wallace for President volunteer, in 1972.

The "moderate" Democrats, strong on defense, anti-communist but liberal on economic policy, are few and far between. Although many older people, like my Dad, still see them as the party of Truman and Humphrey and "Scoop" Jackson, that party is long dead. In 1992, the final ties to the moderates were broken, when the Irish-Catholic governor of Pennsylvania was shunned at the convention because of his views on abortion.


Of course, rumor has it JFK #1 was sent to the Pacific because of an affair he had with a Nazi spy back in DC. But, since JFK #1 was semi-famous for letting his little head think for his big head, it is unlikely he was ever disloyal.

200 JHW  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 9:34:57am

#165 Ask a real veteran(not a fake, they`re a dime a dozen) who infuriates them more, someone who served with them and then took the side of the enemy and made sweeping false accusations about his"Band of Brothers" OR someone who served in the National Guard and has never bad-mouthed the military or veterans. If you can`t figure it out you`re not as smart as you think you are.The left in this country is beneath contempt with it`s mealy-mouthed sophistry, and unless you are a combat veteran yourself don`t even presume to tell any how much we should admire JEffin K

201 Ed Moran: Abu GOMEX aoa 28C  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 9:37:36am

JFnK (the troll) never did answer how many potential dead it required to risk disclosing a source by making the threat public.


(BTW, in previous alerts, when the FBI or Homeland Security "privately" let local law enforcement know about a terror threat, it quickly became public knowledge anyway, so there was really no way to beef up security at the targets effectively without making them public).


Of course, just the fact that the jihadis knew we knew what targets they were after may have discouraged attacks on those targets.

But I guess a few thousand dead from a series of truck bombings is worth it to preserve a source.

202 JohninLondon  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 9:38:53am

Ed Moran

Thanks for that snippet of Dem history.

You breally need to have a beer in London sometime ! Aa bit like Bermuda, only no sea and not usually much sun.

203 Ann  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 9:41:28am

#176 [Engineer]:

there is a bottle of Crown Royal on the bar that is calling my name.

Amstel Light is my siren song:)

Sigh. Looks like Effing may be face down on his/her bed crying right now. Are there any LGF psychology experts that can explain this deflection of evil defense mechanism? It amazes me.

Ugh. I need to get some housework done.(:

And when it is, I can come back! With my Amstel.

204 Pennies for Patriots  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 9:42:51am

Re: 55


Sure reza,

You are dreaming in technicolor.

We're just quaking in our boots. The ones we will use to stove in your head when it pops out of its' skanky rat hole. I think your minaret is calling, time to bend over again for allah. Run along now...

205 Cornholio  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 9:44:52am

#186 steve miller

Reza is a FROLL, people - a fake troll. Please stop responding.

This "fake troll" thing is getting REALLY OLD. It was funny the first time. Funny the second time. But after the 48th time, it's old. (Same reason why I finally stopped telling "Michael Moore's so fat" jokes.)

There are so many fake trolls now, I can't keep track of which ones are fake. I almost responded to Reza with a truly irate comment - the kind of Bigel-option comment that LLL's love to quote out of context to cast LGF as a hate site.

So, to the fake trolls I say: If your comment derails the thread and pisses off the regulars, what is the difference between you and a real troll?

206 John Schneider  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 9:45:14am

John Kerry misspeaks and only blogs catch it. Imagine that...

207 Frank IBC  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 9:47:17am

#190 -

A stopped clock shows the correct time twice a day, every day.

208 Lady of Shalott (ylreveb)  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 9:49:21am

Even better than keel-hauling: flog him through the fleet.

Royal Navy Articles of War, 1757.

If any officer, mariner, soldier, or other person of the fleet, shall give, hold, or entertain intelligence to or with any enemy or rebel, without leave from the king's majesty, or the lord high admiral, or the commissioners for executing the office of lord high admiral, commander in chief, or his commanding officer, every such person so offending, and being thereof convicted by the sentence of a court martial, shall be punished with death.

If any letter of message from any enemy or rebel, be conveyed to any officer, mariner, or soldier or other in the fleet, and the said officer, mariner, or soldier, or other as aforesaid, shall not, within twelve hours, having opportunity so to do, acquaint his superior or a commanding officer, or if any superior officer being acquainted therewith, shall not in convenient time reveal the same to the commander in chief of the squadron, every such person so offending, and being convicted thereof by the sentence of the court martial, shall be punished with death, or such other punishment as the nature and degree of the offense shall deserve, and the court martial shall impose.

All spies, and all persons whatsoever, who shall come, or be found, in the nature of spies, to bring or deliver any seducing letters or messages from any enemy or rebel, or endeavor to corrupt any captain, officer, mariner, or other in the fleet, to betray his trust, being convicted of any such offense by the sentence of the court martial, shall be punished with death, or such other punishment, as the nature and degree of the offence shall deserve, and the court martial shall impose.

209 Ed Moran: Abu GOMEX aoa 28C  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 9:51:14am

I like the title "Newy ork Times", somehow describes the NYT pretty well.

210 RickZ  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 9:52:47am

# 159 Effin:

To be more specific (accounting for the limited number of Guard that went to Vietnam) those serving in the TANG of draft age and cheering from the sidelines, were indeed draft dodgers, as was Clinton.

Read the deaths by status on the bottom on The Wall.

Reserve and Guard deaths = 5,855.

Guard Deaths = 97.

Reserves were those who had already served their time, but were recalled/went back in. May not mean anything of value to you, but that reserve status speaks volumes to me.

Deaths occur in military training exercises regularly, whether regular or guard; these deaths do not appear on any Wall. To equate the dangers of skipping over to Merrie Olde England for college with the inherently dangerous job of flying jets in a Guard unit is reprehensible. But then, leftist bullshit is reprehensible, and the two cannot be separated.

211 Lady of Shalott (ylreveb)  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 9:54:07am

Jinnderella--"And also how Big Media is insane with PC-- do they fear the jihaadiis will sue them for slander if they speak the truth? "

No, they're scared to death of the social ostracism from their fellow Lefties. Worse than the Pilgrims' shunning custom.

212 torog  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 9:54:14am

#206

One thing I've been wondering about Kerry's "doubling special forces" comment is where he thinks the people will come from. i gues he will wave a magic wand, lower the standards for Seals, Rangers etc.. and instantaneously our special forces will deploy throughout the world to fight terror...oh, wait, I have to investigate, contemplate...zzz


We are in a global war against a facist ideology coated in religion. Mealy mouthed mollusk like Kerry and Ambulance chaser Edwards are part of the proble, not the solution.

213 Reza  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 9:57:45am

I see that I am now being accused of being a false/fake/faux troll (froll). I know what a troll is - one who takes the thread off topic - but I really don't understand the term "froll". In any case, my comment (#55) specifically addressed the topic of Muslims serving in the US military, which is the topic of the main posting. I deny being a "troll".

Almost all of the responses to my single comment consisted of scurillous and irrelevant personal attacks. As for the apparently crucial importance of the string "666" in my e-mail address, it happened quite innocently. When I was trying to establish a user name for my e-mail, I found that "Reza", "Rezareza", and other variations were already taken. After several attempts, in frustration I simply added some numbers. The first string that was accepted was "666".

Apparently the number 666 has great importance to certain fundamentalist (not to say primitive) Christians. As numerology is haram (forbidden) in Islam, I did not realise that using that numeric string as part of my e-mail address would be seen by these fools as some sort of Satanic sign.

I shall not be intimidated by the racism and religious bigotry that is evidenced by so many of the commenters here. On the contrary, I feel that the many Muslims and non-Muslim people of good will who peruse these comment threads will recognize those characteristics of a "hate site" and form their opinions accordingly.

I normally make only a single comment in any thread, so I don't believe that I can be accused of "spamming" or "trolling". Neither do I believe that any of my comments are abusive or disrespectful in any way. At any rate, I intend no disrespect to anyone beliefs.

Allahu akbar

214 rang1995  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 9:58:48am

read her new book..i know iknow the PC crowd goes nuts...but.

[Link: michellemalkin.com...]

215 'Nam Grunt  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 10:03:03am

Hey folks,

Trolls like this come in here to LGF and piss everyone off so that they cannot have a decent discussion and then STFU, and sit back and watch, to see how far the thread will go bashing them, they aren't worth it, I respect all of you regulars for your knowledge and I come here to learn as much as possible, just zero them out and carry on with what you do best.

216 gymnast  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 10:04:00am

#213, Reza. Gosh, does that mean Calypso Louie is guilty of blasphemy? Do the world a service and cut off an arm and a leg for Islam. It's the "modern thing" to do after all.

217 lobo91  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 10:10:34am

#212 Torog:

One thing I've been wondering about Kerry's "doubling special forces" comment is where he thinks the people will come from. i gues he will wave a magic wand, lower the standards for Seals, Rangers etc.. and instantaneously our special forces will deploy throughout the world to fight terror

You know, I've been wondering the same thing ever since he made that idiotic speech.

218 Ides of March  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 10:11:07am

#213 Reza

Although I disagree with what you think, or at least claim to think, I am totally with you when it comes to being able to voice your opinion without receiving a barrage of ignorant abuse.

Too often do we drown out opposing opinions with infantile insults and the like.Logical arguement can uncover whether Reza is a fake (which I am inclined to think he is) or just one of the many brainwashed (yet strangely articulate)people that subscribe to this desert code of 'ethics'.

I for one am intrigued why you think Islam is going to take over the US? Through mass conversion, immigration and high fetility rates i.e.demographically and democratically?Or is it by violent revolution?

And do you believe that there is any country in the world that subscribes to a truly Islamic way of life?Iran? Saudi?Taliban Afghanistan?

219 JHW  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 10:11:39am

Nah, the d00d just went back to Everquest to see if he could find a +2 Club of Holy Lizard Smiting.

220 M. Simon  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 10:12:37am

Speaking of Sailors:

Kerry is "Unfit for Command" is #1 at Amazon. Now. Not yet released.

It was #2 during the Demmentedocrat convention.

221 RickZ  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 10:12:53am
I deny being a "troll".

You lie. Like a good little tool of the Ummah.

222 Ides of March  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 10:17:24am

215 'Nam Grunt

So don't you think engaging in convesation with trolls is worth it? Sometimes it can be most enlightening to see the deluded world views they possess. This knowledge can prove invaluable to interpreting/predicting their actions.

Fake trolls however are a different story entirely.

223 Ilan Toren  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 10:22:59am

Is Islam a religion with more of a past than a future? I think that since Christianity has fallen in disfavor in the West Islam is certainly more attractive than it would be otherwise. To take that to the next step and say that Islam will expand without limit is a bit stupid (or naive). Islam is attractive in poor countries with masses of illiterates but doesn't stand up too well against an educated publc. It's increase in the West has been among the lower economic classes and immigrant communities.

224 The Bruce  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 10:24:41am

Italy, Denmark and El Salvador have been threatened. The fruits of surrender by Spain and the Phillipines.

DUBAI (Reuters) - A militant group claiming links to al Qaeda said on Saturday its cells in Italy were ready to strike if the country did not withdraw troops from Iraq before an Aug. 15 deadline it set a week ago.

"The truce we had offered you ... to withdraw your troops has almost ended. Our cells in Rome and in all other Italian cities are prepared and ready to carry out their mission after the end of the truce on the 15th of this month," said a statement signed by Abu Hafs al-Masri Brigades -- al Qaeda Organization.

Abu Hafs al-Masri Brigades sent a statement last weekend to the London-based al-Quds al-Arabi newspaper giving Italy 15 days to withdraw its forces from Iraq or face attacks.

Another group saying it had ties to al Qaeda and calling itself Abu Bakr al-Seddiq Brigades threatened to attack Denmark and El Salvador if they did not pull out of Iraq.

An Internet statement by the hitherto unheard of group threatened Denmark "attacks by mujahideen and rigged cars" if it did not withdraw and said El Salvador would hear "the language of blood."

Denmark has about 500 troops in Iraq. El Salvador will send 380 new troops this month to replace its current contingent.

Italy's Interior Ministry Undersecretary Alfredo Mantovano urged Italians to keep a "maximum level of vigilance."

"There is no specific or concrete threat but the possibility of an attack cannot be categorically excluded," he told ANSA news agency. "This is because Islamic terrorism is not a vertical structure but divided into a network of cells, any of which could strike autonomously."

Italy has stepped up security in recent weeks, identifying 13,600 targets at risk, including the Vatican. About 4,000 soldiers have been drafted in to help police protect sites.

225 Barbara Skolaut  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 10:26:17am

124 ploome hineni:

what has islam done to elevate and make these people prosperous and educated ?

What on earth makes you think islam wants people to be prosperous and educated?

It's the religion of the 7th Century, after all, where even the rich weren't rich, and the educated rarely educated.

226 RickZ  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 10:26:40am

# 233 Ilan Toren:

It's increase in the West has been among the lower economic classes and immigrant communities.

And the college educated, as taught by useful idiots paid for by terror sponsoring states, like Saudi Arabia.

227 Ides of March  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 10:28:08am

223 Ilan Toren

True.Islma has a very high presence in many prisons and ghettos across the West.
But when you write.

Islam is attractive in poor countries with masses of illiterates but doesn't stand up too well against an educated publc.

Couldn't this be said of any of the Abrahamic faiths and/or organised religion?

228 'Nam Grunt  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 10:28:09am

#222,

Sometimes when it's a drinking thread in the evening I do like to contribute to the trolls bullshit, but as a whole I think there are some very educated individuals that come to this website and I'm always starving for information as to what is going on in the world, that is the best education in the world IMHO, listening to people that honestly know what they are talking about!

229 torog  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 10:28:42am

OT:

-Just rode by a buch of "no-nukes" protesters at the local base. Based on the signs thier logic is that if all our bad evil nuclear weapons went away to magic butterflyland the whole world would come together and sing songs of peace and harmony.

230 ploome hineni[deleted]  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 10:29:47am
231 norar  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 10:31:01am

#7 Mr Pol

I guess it happend because Sharon does not have peace plan.

/LLL

#37 [Engineer]

My guess is that, as Christians in the Mideast, they grew up believing that being noticed was dangerous.

You might by right but only partly, because there are Christian Arab that are active politically, but the pones I came across of when making some reading on the internet about Arab-Americans (~85% of them are Christians, btw) were not exactly speaking out against Islam, but working minority activism, or pro-Paleos activism, like Eduard Said, for example. The only ones who were on Israels side, who I can think of, were Free Lebanon people, because PLO&Co were and are their enemy too and they are familiar with what Israel is dealing. Of course, even among the Lebanese Christians there are some who blaiming PLO barbarism on creation of Israel, being unaware that Lebanon was created by the same mechanism, League of nations Mandate system, that Israel too was supposed to be created in early 20 sentury. The only difference is that French fulfiled thei Mandate, while Brits put in maximum effort to avoid their obligations toward the mandate.

#55

Dream on, and do your grandchildren a favor and sell your daughters to be whores for the highest bidder. Putz.

171 Ed Moran:

It does seem awfully curious that Kerry is so proud of his Vietnam service, yet won't make his military records public. Why wouldn't he want the official records of his exploits made public?


Exactly, if Kerry insists the SBVets are lying the best way to prove it is to release his records. I want him to do good on his lawyers' threats and sue the stations for SBVets ad, so they can demand his records made public. I really hope the vets will continue their action beyond the election so Kerry has to make his records public.

232 [Engineer]  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 10:35:41am

#222 Ides of March

So don't you think engaging in convesation with trolls is worth it?

Nope, just makes you a troll enabler. Also make us think that the trolls are two-timing us with a good cop, bad cap show.

233 john5z  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 10:35:46am

#230 P H:

They will become enriched by making us pay a poll tax.
Get it Dhimmi?

234 Ides of March  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 10:36:17am

230 ploome hineni

I would prefer the word 'deluded'.
Yet, at the same time to subject them [trolls] to a barrage of abuse is lowering oneself to the level of the Koran: that is, to denigrate any belief system other than your own.
Part of the problem is that we don't realise how deluded many Muslims are.Imams and Mullahs are to blame, as are the many leftwing idiots that believe Islam to be the RoP. Yet, if a Muslim enters this website writing the most ludicrous posts (which you must remember he honestly believes are true) then by not replying to him in a coherent, rational way, we are also contributing to the perpetuation of his delusion and thsu are as guilty as the LLL and MM (mad mullahs).

235 gymnast  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 10:36:23am

#226,Rick Z. In the US The recruiting has been most successful in prisons and urban underclass neighborhoods. It is the religon which is most successful with people with no future. That and universities, where it is about as successful as any other cult and a far distant second to chemical -physiological experimentation.

236 peace be upon me  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 10:38:45am

OT
The upcoming Olympic Games isn't causing much of a buzz. If you think anti-Americanism is strong in France, be advised that French hate has no comparison to that of most Greeks for Americans. Low ticket sales at the games has opened a window of opportunity for protesters to attend. There is a high probability that some will either vilify American athletes or disrupt some contests. Forewarned is forearmed. The following leftist hate tract illustrates majority Greek beliefs concerning alleged US involvement in Greece:
[Link: coat.ncf.ca...]

During the time of the "Colonels" (the 1967 coup was initiated by low ranking officers) US-Greek relations were cold. The US had no interest whatsoever in promoting the type of regime that ruled during that period. Unfortunately, you can't tell that to the average Greek.

How will US athletes react if they are constantly jeered prior to events, or at medal ceremonies? What if actual events are disrupted? This isn't a shiny happy world, folks.

237 Lady of Shalott (ylreveb)  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 10:40:36am

Reza: ibn sharmuta

"Wisdom and goodness to the vile seem vile:
Filths savour but themselves."

Wm. Shakespeare
and it still is true.

238 Ides of March  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 10:41:11am

235 gymnast

I think the lure of Islam at university is not the same as in prison.Prison Islam attracts mainly African-American convicts who have had no belief system to speak of.Yet Islam on the campus is more aimed at making already Muslim students re-identify with their religion to a much greater extent.

239 norar  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 10:41:51am

230 ploome hineni

WTF! Like Americans need Koran waving mullahs to promote equalty, human dignity, freedom and justice.

People in Muslim world are much more in want of these values, so send CAIR to SaudiA, I say.

240 Luigi  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 10:46:14am

More major media on this now.

Fox TV has just covered the story. Excellent.

People have a right to know. People have to know. That's how the Democratic process works. And its just too g.d. bad if it turns out to be politically incorrect.

241 Bob with one o  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 10:48:17am

Reza,

Blasphemy is when you conflict with G*d. Allah is not G*d so...

Effin,

You have no clue. If you think the articles you're reading about a double agent being outed are the whole story, well...try thinking 5 steps further. BTW do you play poker?

242 peace be upon me  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 10:51:29am

OT
Iranian leader says that a US attack on Najaf is unacceptable to Iran. However, harborage of terrorists in Najaf is acceptable.
[Link: www.tehrantimes.com...]

Dubious source, but good information on UK cyberterrorist:
[Link: www.intelwire.com...]

243 gymnast  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 10:52:48am

#238, Ides of March. Just go into the Student Center at any university and you can see how the various groups isolate themselves from each other. I have watched the transition of Muslim students in the US and in the Middle east for over 40 years. My guess is that today they behave about the same as German students did in 1941. If a Muslim student is not part of the "in group" he is a dangerous person to the members of the group and pressure is brought to bear. The Iranian students the late stages of the Shaws rule were a most interestin group to observe.

244 Titus Quinctius Cincinnatus  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 10:52:58am

#213 Reza

Give an even half-way decent response to the lies of Islam and then we'll talk. Until then, stuff it.

245 RickZ  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 10:56:33am

# 238 ides of march:

Yet Islam on the campus is more aimed at making already Muslim students re-identify with their religion to a much greater extent.

What BS. The indoctrination by the multi-culti professors, who brook no dissension by students in their classrooms of the peaceful nature of Islam, is a crime. It is not an exaggeration, but a prevelent attitude on too many PC campuses today. It is an incremental step in the accepting of Islam through monetary influence, not truth; it is by such increments that the war can be lost.

246 torog  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 10:56:42am

Blasphemy
Blasphemy

good for you
good for me

gimme some

Blasphemy

In order for me to blaspheme don't I acually have to belive in the entity i'm making fun of?

247 Mashiki  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 10:59:15am

I'm not really sure if Reza is a troll...or simply a misguided individual so totaly brainwashed in their ways that they'll eat whatever the local imam tosses in front of them. I'm quite sure that this particular individual believes that all other religions other then 'islam'*spit* are false, and will take over the world, ushering in a 'wonderous' golden age.

No...not really any different then the Nazi's(Godwin's law does not apply) are they? The total belief in supremacy, you will be one of us, your children will be one of us. Stop resisting. Etc, etc, etc.

248 lobo91  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 10:59:42am

SECRETARY OF DEFENSE MESSAGE TO TROOPS ON WHY WE FIGHT IN IRAQ

More than 15 months ago, a global coalition ended the brutal regime of Saddam Hussein and liberated the people of Iraq.

As in all conflicts, this has come at a cost in lives. Some of your comrades made the ultimate sacrifice. For your sacrifices, our Country and the President are deeply grateful.

In a free, democratic country we have vigorous debates over important public policy issues - none more heated than a decision to go to war. But this should not distract us from the mission at hand or lessen the magnitude of your accomplishments.

The threat we face must be confronted. And you are doing so exceedingly well. Indeed it has been an historic demonstration of skill and military power.

On September 11, 3,000 citizens were killed by extremists determined to frighten and intimidate our people and civilized societies. The future anger is that, if the extremists gain the potential, the number of casualties would be far higher. Terrorists are continuing to plot attacks against the American people and against other civilized societies. This is a different kind of enemy and a different kind of world. And we must think and act differently in this new century.

These extremists think nothing of cutting off innocent people's heads to try to intimidate great nations. They have murdered citizens from many countries - South Korea, Japan, Spain, the United Kingdom and others - hoping to strike fear in the hearts of free people.

Theirs is an ideology of oppression and subjugation of women. They seek to create radical systems that impose their views on others. And they will accept no armistice with those who choose free systems.

They see the governments of the Middle East, the United States and our stalwart allies all as targets.

Consider the background. In the span of 20 years, Hussein's Iraq invaded two neighbors, Iran and Kuwait, and launched ballistic missiles at two more. He employed poison gas against soldiers in Iran and against Kurdish villagers in his own country.

The United Nations and the U.S. Congress shared the view that Saddam's regime was a threat to the region and the world. Indeed, in 1998, our Congress passed a resolution calling for the removal of the regime. And over the years the U.N. passed 17 resolutions condemning Saddam's regime and calling on him to tell the UN about his weapons programs. He ignored every one.

Information gathered since the defeat of Saddam's regime last year confirms that his last declaration to the United Nations about his weapons programs was falsified. The U.N. resolutions had called for "serious consequences" should Saddam not comply. He did not.

The president issued a final ultimatum to Saddam to relinquish power to avoid war. Saddam chose war instead.

By your skill and courage, you have put a brutal dictator in the dock to be tried by the Iraqi people and restored freedom to 25 million people. By helping to repair infrastructure, rebuild schools, encourage democratic institutions and delivering educational and medical supplies, you have shown America's true character and given Iraq a chance at a new start. But most importantly, your fight - and ultimate victory - against the forces of terror and extremism in Iraq and the Middle East will have made America safer and more secure.

You are accomplishing something noble and historic - and future generations of Americans will remember and thank you for it.


Donald H. Rumsfeld
Secretary of Defense

249 Lady of Shalott (ylreveb)  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 11:00:01am
What/who poses the greatest threat to your well-being today? And why?

The administation of GWB.

CLANG! Our Dim visitor is the official winner of this month's Darwin Award!

ROTFLMAO!

Seriously, folks, this one has imbibed the Koolaid. He'll wet his pants when he sees the Jihadis in his neighborhood, and blame Daddy Bush for not protecting his sorry ass.

An Old Lefty with wet dreams of reliving his glory days as an antiwar agitator (note the Kent State ref.).

I have a question for You, sirrah: How can you root for an ideology that is racist, misogynist in the extreme, homophobic, authoritarian, religiously fanatical, and bent on the destruction of our entire civilization? Some liberal ideals, hunh? You fucking hypocrite. Read their fatwas, then come back to us trailing your clouds of self-righteous glory.

Never mind! Georgie is the real problem!

250 TalkinKamel  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 11:00:45am

#55 Reza

Using some unclean, numerology magic, I checked the magic numbers, and found out this;

Your grandchildren will be surfer dudes. They will hang out on California beaches clad in nothing but baggy swim shorts and thong bikinis. They will throw frisbis for (unclean) dogs to catch, eat (non-halal) hot dogs and hamburgers, and say things like, "Kewl!" and "Duuude!" The boys will get funny looking tattoos. The girls will all change their names to "Kristie" and "Mystie" and "Boris." They'll get funny tattoos too.

251 zorkmidden  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 11:05:06am

#236 peace be upon me

The US had no interest whatsoever in promoting the type of regime that ruled during that period. Unfortunately, you can't tell that to the average Greek.

Well, it didn't help that Clinton, while in office, apologised to the Greeks for the junta. He made it sound like the U.S. helped with it. And a well-respected Greek journalist, Papahelas, published research in a major Greek leftist newspaper about the involvement of the CIA in bringing about the dictatorship.

Also, I don't believe that the US had no interest at that time. We were in the middle of the cold war, Greece was surrounded by communist nations, and there was a civil war between Greek communists and royalists right after WWII.

So I doubt that the U.S. was blind to that.

Other than that, I agree with the rest of your post.

252 gymnast  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 11:12:59am

#248, lobo91. Good post. It seems that Hollywood is as dead as Frank Capra when it comes to the subject of "Why We Fight". The series of seven films in the Why We Fight" series were a bit more explicit in naming the enemy than Sec. Rumsfeld's missive however. Maybe it's a start.

253 genard  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 11:13:35am

#213 Reza,

Fairly said. And I regret saying that I would see your body stone cold before I would say "Allah Akbar."

Unfortunately that may be literally true whether I am an agent in fulfilling the prophecy or not. Many people in the West will resist Islam to the last Muslim. It is odious to many of us.

I do disrespect Islam as a doctrine and belief. I am an atheist and belief in anything supernatural is difficult for me to comprehend, but mostly I despise Islam for its unacceptance of alternate beliefs and points of view.

Of course other religions are equally certain of their exclusive truth but I know of none which make it a matter of faith to conquer the others. I understand the logic, if there is one truth then it is the only truth.

So what?

Get a sense of humor.

Live and let live.

254 Darleen  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 11:13:47am

#230 Ploome

The phrase that comes to mind reading that mission statement

"Moslem, heal thyself"

The 'equality for all' line is hoot.

255 scaramouche  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 11:39:34am

Unquestioned faith in totalitarianism and religious triumphalism results in brainwashed Muslims--anticipating the delights of paradise--killing and being killed. In other words, in the Imam Mahdi army.

256 Ides of March  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 11:41:08am

#245 RickZ

I have to disagree.
The so-called multi-culti professors etc are not influenced by the Islamic Society on the Campus but either the petro-dollars into his/her department or some misplaced ideology that supports the under-dog etc. To say that Islamic University Societies have influence is ridiculous and plays into their hands.I was at Manchester University/UMIST in the mid-1990s (home to visiting scholars such a Einstein and Engels) and saw first hand the ludicrous state of student Islam when they tried desperately to have the J-SOC banned...and failed time and time again. The rise of the International Solidarity Front etc is a direct rsult of teh lack of influence the Islamic societies had at Campus levels, and the reluctance of the Socialist Workers Party etc to engage with them.

257 Professor Kaos  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 11:45:06am

Speaking of San Diego:

If your in the San Diego area we need your help for a Protest Warrior counterprotest against Code Pink (women for pacifism, appeasement and socialism) Sunday 8/8 1130 am, 6th and Laurel. Bring flags and patriotic signs and wear blue.

Thanks!

258 ploome hineni[deleted]  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 11:45:22am
259 ploome hineni[deleted]  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 11:46:36am
260 dennisw-matamoros  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 11:46:44am

Black Muslim sailor. Same as the POS who rolled the hang grenade into the tent.

This is my blind guess, I am posting without having read any of the above comments.

261 Ides of March  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 11:47:54am

At university.

Why do you ask?

262 ploome hineni[deleted]  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 11:49:54am
263 LizardAbroad  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 11:52:19am

Would everyone quit calling them Moslems!! That is so PC. The proper term is Mohammendan.

264 Ides of March  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 11:53:46am

262 ploome hineni

You are slightly dim, right?

Why do I ask?

Because your texts are superficial and boarding on infantile. I may not be the smartest person here, but I am sure as hell smarter than you.

PS. Don't know about universities where you come from, or if there are any, but here in the UK university students are considered adults.


PPS. Glad you have such healthy respect for education.

265 LizardAbroad  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 11:54:32am

Sorry typo...Mohammedan, an adherent to a cult known as Mohammedism.

266 Ides of March  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 11:54:56am

And to make you feel at home I include a number of mistakes for you to grab in every posting.Have fun.

267 ploome hineni[deleted]  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 11:55:34am
268 Ides of March  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 11:56:47am

267 ploome hineni

Thanks for confirming it.

269 Mr Pol  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 11:57:53am

#268 Ides of March

FOAD.

270 Ides of March  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 11:59:37am

#269 Mr Pol

Ah, the smell of democracy in America.Why is it that even decent blogs get taken over by loud mouthed fools with an outlook on the world as broad and tolerant as the Mullahs they denounce.

271 Mr Pol  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 12:01:57pm

#270 Ides of March

Why is it that even decent blogs get taken over by loud mouthed fools with an outlook on the world as broad and tolerant as the Mullahs they denounce.

Yes, indeed, why the hell are you posting here...

272 Banagor  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 12:02:06pm

OT: I am absolutely horrified at the state of the Democratic party today.

Instances like this don't surprise me at all, but what does surprise me is that a mainstream party which used to pride itself on important national issues now will find itself supported by people who defend these Islamonazis wholeheartedly (if they have any hearts at all).

What is stunning is how the ACLU and all the other liberal organizations out there have caved in to Leftist pressure groups whose sole purpose is to defend terrorists and the rest of these traitors aiding them in our time of war.

Had this occurred in World War II, we would have had half of these Leftist groups shot. Today, however, we not only resist the temptation of shooting traitors by firing squad, we also resist the temptation of actually charging them with treason. This is the result of Leftist Politically Correct pressures which have demoralized and started to destroy this country as a whole.

What really pisses me off is that the Democrats, and John Kerry in particular, are supporting these things for their goal of sitting in the highest office. It shouldn't be tolerated - ever.

Anyway, I had to blow off some steam. It just pisses me off and sickens me completely to see this sort of thing happening today.

273 Gruen  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 12:05:07pm

Remember in 2002 when the Saudi religious police, (sorry, the "Commission for the Promotion of Virtue and Prevention of Vice") allowed 15 schoolgirls to burn to death in their school in Mecca? They forbad firemen to rescue them because the girls were not wearing appropriate islamic dress...

These people in these Muslim countries are trapped by this fascist movement.

274 struan al kufr  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 12:05:55pm

#237 Lady of Shalott

Kindness to the cruel is cruelty to the kind.

Talmud

(But you knew that -:)

#253 genard

"Get a sense of humor."

"Live and let live."

Words and concepts to live by - so simple, so true.

gracias, amigo - my cynicism levels were just about topped out.

Viva vida!

275 Ides of March  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 12:06:47pm

271 Mr Pol

Although I am loathe to get involved in this infantile tete-a-tete (apologies for using French, I know how much you despise France and all others that do not see exactly eye to eye with you) I have to point out that all my postings have refrained from the 'FOAD' or 'BS' statements that seem to be part of your regular vocabulary.

My advice to you would be to actually read my postings and get back to me.Or, like the Muslims you so despise, do you not read what you don't understand/believe in?

276 ploome hineni[deleted]  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 12:07:14pm
277 Mr Pol  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 12:09:14pm

#275 Ides of March

Your attitude is the reason you are now in scroll-down territory.

278 Darleen  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 12:10:47pm

Funny thing, Ides

weren't you the one saying earlier to the idea that Islam being attractive to the illiterate and poor masses

Couldn't this be said of any of the Abrahamic faiths and/or organised religion?

I didn't challenge you then, because, well, I figured maybe you just had some sort of personal issue with people of religious faiths. And some of your posts seemed reasonable.

But, WTF is your problem?

279 Ides of March  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 12:10:56pm

276 ploome hineni

And what is your job Plum Hymen?

And do you really want to get into an arguement over education standards on either side of the Atlantic?
If so, let me know.I could hazard a guess that the US has lower literacy and numeracy rates than the UK.

280 ploome hineni[deleted]  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 12:11:04pm
281 Mr Pol  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 12:11:42pm

#276 ploome hineni

Ignoring it is the best course. Until Charles does something about Gordon, that is.

282 zorkmidden  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 12:14:07pm

#279

Cute. Not.

283 ploome hineni[deleted]  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 12:14:30pm
284 Ides of March  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 12:15:01pm

#278 Darleen

Actually, what you refer to was a question rather than a statement.It was a question I was hoping someone, may be yourself, could answer. Blogs I feel are an excellent means for knowledge transfer.But I am not going be silent when I get insulted for simply airing my views and asking questions.Apologies if anyone other than Mr Pol and Hymen Plumb feel that what I have said is some how out of order.

285 Sean II  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 12:15:15pm
286 ploome hineni[deleted]  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 12:15:28pm
287 Mr Pol  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 12:17:06pm

#286 ploome hineni

If only he buttoned his collar... his circumcision scars are showing.

288 Powderfinger  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 12:17:33pm

#266 Ides

Cupcake, we are at home. You shouldn't make mistakes on purpose when you're making so many inadvertantly.

289 Rayra[deleted]  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 12:19:39pm
290 PostalWorker  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 12:19:40pm

#279 Ides of March

[And what is your job Plum Hymen?]

Didn't take you long to dive off your moral high horse did it? Be careful there are rocks in the water below.

291 FormerMuslim  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 12:19:50pm

OT: (Sent it to Charles already but I can't wait)

Turning waste in to oil!!!

It's not every person that stops to think about sewage sludge - where it goes and how it is disposed of. The average citizen flushes the toilet and that's the end of that.

However, conventional methods of sewage sludge disposal - landfilling, ocean dumping, compost and incineration - are causing irrevocable environmental damage. This is seen in the contamination of underground water reservoirs and fertile land, the pollution of our oceans and the killing of marine life, and the emission of hazardous gases into the air.

Stricter global legislation for municipal wastewater treatment plants (WTP) on sludge disposal has created an urgent need for more sophisticated, environmentally friendly treatment sytems.

BioPetrol Ltd.'s new technology is a breakthrough process for producing usable synthetic crude oil from sewage sludge. The company will provide WTPs, for the first time, with an environmentally sound and cost-effective on-site sludge conversion system.

The technology will solve worldwide environmental sludge disposal problems, turn sludge into revenue producing oil, and save municipalities around the world the tremendous cost of transporting the sludge to be disposed of.

If you're not excited by this then you're not thinking strategically.

292 ploome hineni[deleted]  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 12:21:25pm
293 Mr Pol  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 12:22:08pm

#291 FormerMuslim

I've seen this kind of announcement for two decades now... and the world still depend on fossil oil. Don't be too excited.

294 struan al kufr  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 12:22:13pm

ploome -

Shalom, chaver.

Ignore March, 15th - he/it comes from a Socialist nation without the courage to eject those parasites that will kill them, their historyand their future.

With respect to you I won't launch on this POS.

How have you been?

I hope all is well with you and yours.

295 Ides of March  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 12:22:35pm

290 PostalWorker

True, and I am in the process of self-flagellation for my descent.Apologies.

296 JohninLondon  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 12:22:44pm

Ides

You are behaving like a clown

297 Mr Pol  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 12:23:15pm

#292 ploome hineni

Do you have a video of his beheading?

298 PostalWorker  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 12:24:11pm

[But I am not going be silent when I get insulted for simply airing my views and asking questions.]

What about being a condescending dick? A popmous ass?

That's what you are getting called on, not neccessarily your views. If you can't tell the difference I feel sorry for your students. What hedge did you teach near anyway?

299 Darleen  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 12:24:53pm

#279 Ides

I could hazard a guess that the US has lower literacy and numeracy rates than the UK.


You'd probably guess right. But you know, let's compare the rates of legal and illegal immigration in to the respective countries AND add into it the the US is obligated to educate for free ALL comers regardless of status and the "huddled oppressed masses" don't usually show up on the US steps with a bachelor's degree.

You seem to need a bit of education yourself, eh?

300 Beagle  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 12:25:04pm

Reza,

Deism is the fastest growing religion in the United States
It, at least, makes some sense. Islam is not even the fifth fastest growing religion in this country.

As of 2001 Islam was .5% of the U.S. population. I know you breed like bacteria, but you still are way behind. So shut up.

301 ploome hineni[deleted]  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 12:25:18pm
302 Darleen  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 12:29:15pm

#284 Ides

Sometimes people duck the responsiblity of making a statement by phrasing it as a question.

"Don't all Brit men wear women's underwear?"

Somehow I don't think you are unaware of the tradition of education even amongst the most religious of Jews.

Want to try again?

303 ploome hineni[deleted]  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 12:29:34pm
304 Rayra[deleted]  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 12:30:14pm
305 Gruen  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 12:30:30pm

#299 Darleen, sorry, but many immigrants do show up with degrees. Look at all the Indians who come here, the wealthy and educated Mexican and other Latin American kids. The fact is we gain by getting these well educated kids who's education we didn't pay for thus getting a huge benefit. It's the countries where these kids have come from that are the big losers.

306 Ides of March  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 12:31:24pm

299 Darleen

That's right. blame it on those darn immigrants.I suggest you start reading up on the UK and immigration. Whereas the US manages to attract many of the best and brightest from across the world through its (admittedly) world-class psotgraduate education and retain them, the UK has been left with millions of disenfranchised Muslims from Pakistan and Bangladesh with no respect for eduation outside of the Madrassah and no respect for the English language.Its not as clear cut as some of you believe.

296 JohninLondon

Its Saturday night,its a British tradition.

307 Lively  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 12:31:57pm

OT. I think Drudge is on a bike ride with Charles or something. His website hasn't changed all day.

308 DP111  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 12:32:14pm

13 model4

Think about all those "poor" kamikaze pilots who flew their fragile planes through storms of machine-gun fire and flak. They should have just signed on to work in our ships' powder magazines or bomb storage.

Despite everything, atleast the Japs were honourable in that sense. With Muslims though, dishonourable deeds are perfectly acceptable when done in the cause of their demonic and satanic god allah.

Reza
You and Muslims should know, that Islam is never going to be part of the West. Islam is like a pet that we have taken on, feeding it from our table and tolerating it, even when it soils the carpet and occasionally bites us. Sooner or later though, if this pet does not behave itself, we will have no alternative but to put it down; needless to say, humanely.

309 quark2  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 12:33:31pm

@155 John F'ing Kerry

Good grief! A threat that really never existed? What year were you born, 1992? You use that as a justification for your vilification of Bush's service?
You know, it would be real nice if some lgfer who just lurks knows who you really are, was a veteran of military service to this country, looked you up and put a real big can of whoop ass on you.
Not if but when we get attacked again, it's your voice that will be silenced out of moral cowardice. I would advise you to now find yourself a deserted septic tank similar to Saddam's to crawl into.

310 Ides of March  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 12:34:19pm

#303 ploome hineni

You seem to have a problem with education. Statement, not question, but phrased so it sounds like a question.
You also, and this maybe a causal link, don't like responding to questions.

311 greenmamba  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 12:35:55pm

#275 Ides of March

Although I am loathe to get involved in this infantile tete-a-tete

I suggest you look up the meaning of tête-à-tête because you used it incorrectly. So much for your savoir faire.

312 struan al kufr  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 12:36:10pm

ploome -

We live in interesting times so, that is good.

But, it really grinds my gears when people hide behind a keyboard and say chickenshit things that would get ther candyass's kicked bloody, instantly, in any respectable pub in the land by honorable men with sense of chivalry and decency.

I beg the Lady's pardon for the mini-launch..

-:)

313 'Nam Grunt  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 12:38:01pm

Ides.

Please get off of Ploomes case she is a smart lady and I for one enjoy her posts, if you are really an educated man as you say then post that way and teach individuals!

314 Darleen  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 12:39:12pm

#305 Gruen

I'm coming from a California POV...we had a significant influx of LEGAL immigrants w/o education (ie Camodian boat people) and we continually suffer from huge influxes of ILLEGAL immigrants from Mexico. Hell, it's estimated that 10% of Mexico's population is in the US!!

Yes, many legal immigrants come to this country with education. Many more illegals do not. And we are obliged to educate them all. However, you just cannot say a huge influx of undereducated illegals is not going to have an effect on the overall measurement of literacy. You have elementary schools doing backflips trying to teach kids that may only be in their school for a semester or so to read when they may have gotten to age 8 or 10 without ever stepping foot in a school before.

Sheesh!

315 Ides of March  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 12:40:31pm

311 greenmamba

Actually I used it correctly. Tete-a-tete means a two-way conversation away or disjointed from the masses...I hope you didnt refer to an English dictionary for an interpretation of a French word.

316 greenmamba  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 12:42:15pm

#315 Ides of March

Well you're hardly away from the masses. You're in bleedin' public mate.

317 Ides of March  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 12:42:50pm

#314 Darleen

How did the Jews that you spoke of in

302 Darleen

arrive in the US?

Were they all well-educated?

318 Darleen  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 12:42:54pm

#306 Ides

Get a clue, I wasn't blaming anyone, I was pointing out a fact. The US, especially the southern border states, absorb a hell of a lot more undereducated thirdworlders than Britain does. Just how many of those undereducated refugees in Britain got there illegally?

Lord luv a duck.

319 Sean II  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 12:44:11pm

Oboy, the UN is offering to come in and broker a cease fire in Iraq, better not pass up this golden opportunity.

U.N. Offers to Help Broker Cease-Fire in Iraq
UNITED NATIONS (Reuters) - The United Nations offered its help on Saturday to try to stop some of the worst fighting seen in Iraq in about four months between Shi'ite militiamen and coalition forces.

320 Ann  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 12:44:59pm

#308 DP111:

Islam is like a pet that we have taken on, feeding it from our table and tolerating it, even when it soils the carpet and occasionally bites us. Sooner or later though, if this pet does not behave itself, we will have no alternative but to put it down; needless to say, humanely.

Grin:)

My, you seem to be in a happy, optimistic mood today!
Cheers!

321 Mr Pol  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 12:45:02pm

#315 Dated Prick

Wrong.

Tête-à-tête, n.m. inv. Situation ou entretien de deux personnes qui se retrouvent seule à seule.
Le Petit Larousse, 1996

322 Gruen  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 12:45:05pm

#314

Fair enough Darleen, I can certainly appreciate what it must be like in California. I also have noticed that Jewish communities are concerned with the high levels of anti-semitism these new poorer immigrants bring with them. Jewish leaders have raised it with the Vatican such is the concern.

323 Ides of March  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 12:47:12pm

#313 'Nam Grunt

Please get off of Ploomes case she is a smart lady and I for one enjoy her posts

I suggest you re-read the scroll.

Apologies to Ploome.

Can we just end this moronic (and I accept its two-way) TETE-A-TETE and get back to public scrolling.

324 Mr Pol  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 12:48:11pm

#316 greenmamba

Doesn't apply anyway - tête-à-tête means two people being together, without anybody around.

325 Ides of March  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 12:49:31pm

#321 Mr Pol

Well, that depends on the percpetion of qui se retrouvent seule à seule.

Have you always been one for such literalisms?

I also suggest you refrain from such vulgarities as Prick and FOAD.

Man, you are one frustrated Pol.

326 Darleen  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 12:50:11pm

#317 Ides

What? You're posing a non-sequitur to your previous question.

327 Mr Pol  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 12:51:34pm

#325 Dated Prick

No, it doesn't depend on any perception. Seul à seul only applies to physical meetings. You obviously don't know French - stop trying to fake it.

328 Rayra[deleted]  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 12:52:05pm
329 Cornholio  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 12:53:47pm

Just in case anyone is fooled by Reza's apology in 213

Neither do I believe that any of my comments are abusive or disrespectful in any way. At any rate, I intend no disrespect to anyone beliefs.

look at what he said in 55:

The long struggle is nearly over . . . 'Islam is advancing according to a steady plan, to the point that tens of thousands of Muslims have joined the American army . . . America will be destroyed' . . . Do you really want your children to perish in a futile and foredoomed effort to hold back the inevitable triumph of Islam?

Your grandchildren will be Muslim.

Reza says Muslims will violenty destroy America and kill members of my family if they do not convert to Islam. Gee, that's not disrespectful to my religious beliefs.

I'd also note this is exactly what Muslims are doing in the Sudan right now.

330 Ides of March  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 12:54:43pm

#318 Darleen

Are we talking absolute or relative. Because relatively I think the UK attracts far more than the US.And whereas the US attracts mainly Mexican immigrants, the UK attracts far more Muslims. Its a greater problem in the UK in both qualitative and quantitative terms.
In addition, the US has the benefit of attracting the aforementioned world class immigrants such as the Indians in Silicon Valley, whereas the UK doesnt even have a Silicon field.

So, back to the point: you cannot blame the poor US showings in world numeracy and literacy tests vis-avis teh UK on its immigration. Thus, I would say it is the education system itself that is flawed.

Agreed?

331 Darleen  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 12:55:47pm

#322 Gruen

Heck, there are so many illegals they can't hardly find anymore work here, so the coyotes are sticking groups of them on red-eye flights out of LAX to points east!

Hispanic "activists" go ballistic any time anyone tries to enforce the law. It's pretty bizzarro world.

My daughter works as a paramedic out in the San Bernardino area. The company considers it a great month if they can collect on 40% of their billings.

332 Ides of March  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 1:00:04pm

#327 Mr Pol

I spent three years in Montreal...I speak fluent French.Shall we have a conversation in French.That will also be a tete-a-tete as Im not sure how many people could understand it.
I am getting really irritated with this literalism you are displaying.I suspect that it is simply to attack me for having beliefs different from your own (thank God). Tete-a-tete was invented before the internet. We could not have had this tete-a-tete back in the 19th century, ir the 1980s for that matter.So if conversation can be virtual, surely Seul à seul can be virtual too.
Talk about dogmatic.This is truly ridiculous.

333 Mr Pol  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 1:02:10pm

#332 Tête de noeud

Aucun problème en ce qui me concerne. Mais ce n'est pas trois ans au Québec qui font d'une tête de noeud un francophone.

334 Rayra[deleted]  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 1:03:10pm
335 greenmamba  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 1:04:04pm

Ides of Charm

Are you here five minutes or the full half hour?

336 Mr Pol  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 1:04:34pm

#332 Dated Prick

By the way, on the Internet, it would be conversation privée - if nobody else was reading/hearing it.

337 Darleen  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 1:05:31pm

#330 Ides

Raw comparison is just not going to work UK v US. Most education in the US is local controlled, especially K-12. And I believe immigration (legal and illegal) have a significant impact on such things as literacy rates, as they do on infant mortality rates and rates of thirdworld diseases. When So. Cal goes through a particulary notorious spike of illegal immigration, we also go through a spike in the reporting of such things as TB.

Also, UK/US education is structurally different. IIRC in the UK you still have a parallel structure for vocation training if students reach a certain age and no longer demonstrate the aptitude for academic education. That just doesn't exist in the US, though many localities have tried to introduce ROP training in high school to ameliorate the dropout numbers.

Of course, the US has many instances of problems with areas in its education system, but we are faced with several unique circumstances. Fact remains that especially in the college/university system, the US holds a vaulted position.

338 Mr Pol  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 1:06:27pm

#319 Sean II

If the Iraqi provisional government accepts, they'll be in deep shit - each time the U.N. brokered a cease-fire agreement, the democratic side got screwed.

339 evariste  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 1:07:56pm

Darleen

many localities have tried to introduce ROP training

??!

340 Mr Pol  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 1:08:23pm

#337 Darleen

I suggest a raw comparison on the three following criteria:
- number of books published/sold by thousand inhabitants
- number of patents by thousand inhabitants

341 'Nam Grunt  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 1:08:41pm

ummm I served honorably in the armed forces and I received two bronze stars for valor and an army commendation medal for valor and some more, but as I said earlier I don't wave them around in conversation, and Mr. Ides of march if a British soldier heard you talking this way to YOUR Allies he would immediately beat you down in your favorite pub.

342 Rayra[deleted]  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 1:09:21pm
343 Darleen  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 1:09:36pm

ah sheesh, typo

vaulted = vaunted

argh

344 Darleen  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 1:15:10pm

#339 evariste

Oops...sorry ROP = Regional Occupational Program

HS students usually attend morning academic classes then attend occupational classes in the afternoon (held at centralized campuses).

I just got #4 daughter's fall packet for high school which includes about a 15 sheets of paperwork to read and fill out..also the ROP schedule. Such classes as Automotive classes (repair, etc), child care, airconditioning & heating, computer tech classes, dental assistant, drafting, cosmetology, medical assistant, nursing, etc.

345 Rayra[deleted]  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 1:15:42pm
346 ploome hineni[deleted]  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 1:18:18pm
347 Ides of March  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 1:19:40pm

337 Darleen

Raw comparison is just not going to work UK v US


Agreed!

Fact remains that especially in the college/university system, the US holds a vaulted position.


I think Cambridge, Oxford, the University of London (including Imperial, LSE, SOAS, Kings, UCL) can hold their own with Harvard, Stanford, Yale etc. Both countries have good, solid tertiary sectors.Its just a real shame when people with or without access to such eduational facilities decide to insult people repeatedly.
Speaking of which,

336 Mr Pol

Pourquoi ne vous baisez-vous pas ? Tete-a-Tete n'a pas la signification spécifique. Vous parlez la merde.

348 Mr Pol  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 1:21:10pm

#342 Rayra

No, he's the one lying. From the USAF Museum


Armament: 24 unguided 2.75 inch rockets and six guided missiles

Standoff missiles, my ass. Especially with AIM-26B missiles.

349 ploome hineni[deleted]  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 1:21:52pm
350 Smug Monkey  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 1:23:14pm

I personally blame le frogs.

351 evariste  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 1:23:53pm

Darleen, LOL! I was starting to wonder...helluva acronym ;-)

352 Darleen  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 1:24:03pm

ah sheesh... and me with only 2 years of high school french **years ago...

Lotta good it did/does me in So. Cal anyway!

;-)

353 Mr Pol  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 1:25:13pm

#347 Dated Prick

Pourquoi ne vous baisez-vous pas ? Tete-a-Tete n'a pas la signification spécifique. Vous parlez la merde.

Three years in Quebec, and you still use Google to translate?

Pourquoi tu ne vas pas te faire mettre? Tête-à-tête a deux sens tout à fait spécifiques - le premier étant un ensemble pour petit-déjeuner pour deux.

(Tête-à-tête has two meanings, the first one being a breakfast set for two persons.)

354 Rayra[deleted]  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 1:25:38pm
355 NY Nana  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 1:25:49pm

Just scrolling less that half the comments ,what really strikes me is the nearly identical pattern of the posts of a troll. There is a commonality that cannot be a coincidence. Soon there will be the tantrum declaring that they are leaving the unworthy lot of us...only to return.

They thrive on attention, and on derailing the thread. ah, at first they try to appear to be here to learn..then attacks on Ploome and Mr. Pol, of all people???

Their spelling sucks, also, and they never can answer a question, nor provide a link to the crap they post.

In this age of the internet, I wonder how many theses are being written on the phenomenon if the troll?

It certainly must of interest in many psychiatric venues.

Please *gaze* cutting off their food supply, which will cause them to flail, and reach out, in desperation, to call trollsrus.com for an emergency referral to another site.

356 Mr Pol  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 1:26:10pm

#346 ploome hineni

Apparently, he only learned how to use the Google translation feature. Talk about failed education systems!

357 Ides of March  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 1:26:46pm

#341 'Nam Grunt

What are you talking about?
Just because we are allies doesn't mean we are somehow disallowed from criticising each other's education/immigration systems!
Or is it just that the US can diss whoever they want, but no one can criticise the US? Bit like the friendly fire where you killed more of us than the damn Iraqis.Because the proud dyslexic soldiers of the US couldn't work their Soviet-designed machines.

Je suis une personne polie

358 'Nam Grunt  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 1:27:10pm

Night, night friends, off on the town and Ides I hope you feel better tomorrow, I will.

359 Mr Pol  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 1:27:35pm

#355 NY Nana

To be fair, I'm the one who attacked the prick - for being a prick and attacking Ploome.

360 J.D.  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 1:28:48pm

Ides
So who are you really trying to insult; dyslexics of our military? Or both?

361 Darleen  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 1:29:26pm

LOL evariste...

Didn't even think of that at first...

Sounds like an opening for a good riff --

RoP training classes

Burqa designing
Female Cliterodectomy Assistant
Imman trainee
Caligraphy for the Koran
Bombmaking
Infidel identification and infiltration

;-)

362 evariste  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 1:29:28pm

Mr Pol:

Apparently, he only learned how to use the Google translation feature. Talk about failed education systems!

ROFL!

363 J.D.  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 1:29:30pm

or, not of

364 Titus Quinctius Cincinnatus  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 1:29:48pm

#347 Ides of March

You strike me as uninformed and unintelligent. Bad traits for someone who wants to be taken seriously.

Comprenez-vous? (Pardon my French)

365 Space Pirate  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 1:30:23pm

#2 Bensmom
Gee, too bad we don't keel-haul bad guys anymore.

Why keel haul him that's to good for him. Lash him to the figurehead and give him a jug of wine a loaf of bread and a knife. Then the Capt. can list him as dead in the logbook. This is the best way to take care (KILL) a bad sailor because hanging is to fast.

Up in space put him in the air lock and let the air leak out slowly.

366 Thom  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 1:32:20pm

Soviet-designed machines ...?

Anybody know what it's talking about?

367 Ides of March  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 1:32:25pm

364 Titus Quinctius Cincinnatus

Yeah, I like to fit in.

368 Titus Quinctius Cincinnatus  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 1:33:54pm

#357 Ides of March

Je suis une personne polie

Vous êtes une personne polonaise?

J'ai fait un drôle...

369 NY Nana  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 1:34:46pm

#359 Mr Pol

You are doing a great job of it, too!

It is so easy to play brain games with the unarmed, but you show a style...tov meod!

As for Ploome...you are from PQ??? Oy!

370 Titus Quinctius Cincinnatus  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 1:34:48pm

#367 Ides of March

Yeah, but this isn't Democratic Underground.

371 Ann  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 1:34:55pm

Oh, gee, here's another one. Why don't these wackos have dates on a Saturday night?

Oh.

372 Thom  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 1:35:11pm

Key difference between a leftie and a normal human being:

A normal human being mourns friendly-fire deaths.

A leftie uses them to "score" political "points".

373 zulubaby  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 1:35:35pm

Titus Quinctius Cincinnatus, LOL!

Is this a new troll?

374 Ides of March  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 1:35:59pm

368 Titus Quinctius Cincinnatus

All for a bit of tete-a-tete.

irony does lie.

375 Mr Pol  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 1:36:36pm

#373 zulubaby

Is this a new troll?

Nah. Just a prick.

376 Ides of March  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 1:37:33pm

375 Mr Pol

If only your English was as good as your French.

377 ploome hineni[deleted]  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 1:37:40pm
378 Mr Pol  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 1:37:52pm

#369 NY Nana

You're right, it's way too easy... OK, where's the drinking thread? Half past midnight and I'm still not drunk.

379 ploome hineni[deleted]  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 1:38:58pm
380 Mr Pol  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 1:39:20pm

#376 Dated Prick

I never pretended I spoke English fluently. I do speak French fluently, though. But tell me - is there any language you speak fluently?

381 Ides of March  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 1:39:44pm

378 Mr Pol

WEll, its good to see someone here has a life.

382 zulubaby  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 1:41:02pm

Mr Pol, your English is brilliant, don't you worry.

ploome, don't tell me he's one of our "friends".

383 Frank IBC  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 1:41:29pm

Why don't you kiss yourselves? Tete-a-Tete does not have the specific significance. You speak the shit.

Apparently, it learned only how to employ the device of translation of Google. Speak about the failed systems about education!

/Google Mistranslation Services

384 Titus Quinctius Cincinnatus  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 1:41:30pm

#373 Zulubaby

Is this a new troll?

I don't know, might be. Or nodroG might have figured out how to use an online translator.

#374 Ides of March

All for a bit of tete-a-tete.

Well, dude, I think you're in the wrong place for that. You're gonna have to go down to the the Sunset strip for some of that.

Oh wait. You meant conversation. My bad.

385 billphx  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 1:41:36pm

I just called my daughter and emailed her the article. Both her and her husband were serving on the Benfold when this happened. She was stunned. She said she only new of one muslim in the crew.

386 Mr Pol  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 1:43:22pm

#382 zulubaby


Mr Pol, your English is brilliant, don't you worry.

Thank you, but it's not true. My English is far from being good enough to pass for a native speaker - the only valid criteria for fluency.

387 Ides of March  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 1:43:29pm

379 ploome hineni

he is an UK 'educator'

Yeah, thats it. An UK educator.Master the ENGLISH grammar first, then talk shite.Man, you guys don't even have you own language.

But please tell me what your jobs involve?Does it involve soap?

388 Frank IBC  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 1:43:57pm

#380 Mr. Pol -

is there any language you speak fluently?

Er, I think you mean "flatulently". :)

389 Titus Quinctius Cincinnatus  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 1:44:10pm

#386 Mr Pol

Don't worry about it, with my English, I can't pass for a native speaker either.

390 Rang1995  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 1:44:21pm

Not for the PC's
In Defense of Internment: The Case for Racial Profiling in World War II and the War on Terror
by Michelle Malkin
a NEW BOOK,that get's it right

From the Publisher
Everything you've been taught about the World War II "internment camps" in America is wrong: - They were not created primarily because of racism or wartime hysteria
- They did not target only those of Japanese descent
- They were not Nazi-style death camps In her latest investigative tour-de-force, New York Times best-selling author Michelle Malkin sets the historical record straight-and debunks radical ethnic alarmists who distort history to undermine common-sense, national security profiling. The need for this myth-shattering book is vital. President Bush's opponents have attacked every homeland defense policy as tantamount to the "racist" and "unjustified" World War II internment. Bush's own transportation secretary, Norm Mineta, continues to milk his childhood experience at a relocation camp as an excuse to ban profiling at airports. Misguided guilt about the past continues to hamper our ability to prevent future terrorist attacks. In Defense of Internment shows that the detention of enemy aliens, and the mass evacuation and relocation of ethnic Japanese from the West Coast were not the result of irrational hatred or conspiratorial bigotry. This document-packed book highlights the vast amount of intelligence, including top-secret "MAGIC" messages, which revealed the Japanese espionage threat on the West Coast. Malkin also tells the truth about:
- who resided in enemy alien internment camps (nearly half were of European ancestry)
- what the West Coast relocation centers were really like (tens of thousands of ethnic Japanese were allowed to leave; hundreds voluntarily chose to move in)
- why the $1.65 billion federal reparations law for Japanese internees and evacuees
was a bipartisan disaster
- and how both Japanese American and Arab/Muslim American leaders have united

to undermine America's safety. With trademark fearlessness, Malkin adds desperately needed perspective to the ongoing debate about the balance between civil liberties and national security. In Defense of Internment will outrage, enlighten, and radically change the way you view the past-and the present.

About the Author
Michelle Malkin is author of the New York Times best-seller, Invasion, which ignited debate on immigration and national security in the wake of the September 11 terrorist attacks on America. Her nationally syndicated newspaper column, celebrating its fifth year with Creators Syndicate, is published in nearly 200 newspapers across the country. Malkin is a FOX News Channel contributor and former editorial writer and columnist for the Seattle Times and the Los Angeles Daily News

391 Mr Pol  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 1:45:16pm

#389 Titus Quinctius Cincinnatus

Oh, I don't worry. I'm actually very happy nobody will mistake me for a UK 'educator'.

392 zulubaby  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 1:46:19pm

Mr Pol

My English is far from being good enough to pass for a native speaker

Only 'cos of your cute accent :-)

393 Ides of March  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 1:47:04pm

388 Frank IBC

Ah, you have managed to refrain yourself this evening.
Congratulations.
Ah, the LGF fraternity in all their glory.Anyway, Im sorry to have to go and ruin your Saturday night, but I'm off.
Take care.

394 Thom  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 1:47:24pm
Master the ENGLISH grammar first, then talk shite.Man, you guys don't even have you own language.

But please tell me what your jobs involve?Does it involve soap?

I stand humbled in the presence of greatness.

395 cba  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 1:47:27pm
If only your English was as good as your French.

OOO, I'm dying to correct the grammar, but that would be rude so I won't. Kinda like something I noticed earlier today (if one is demonstrating one's mental prowess, one really ought to get the Latin correct).

#348 TQC:

All for a bit of tete-a-tete.

Well, dude, I think you're in the wrong place for that. You're gonna have to go down to the the Sunset strip for some of that.

{snigger}

396 Mr Pol  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 1:47:35pm

#393

Who's got the stopwatch?

397 zulubaby  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 1:47:58pm
Master the ENGLISH grammar first, then talk shite.Man, you guys don't even have you own language.

Judging by your punctuation, it doesn't look like you've mastered English either so pipe down.

398 Rayra[deleted]  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 1:48:21pm
399 Frank IBC  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 1:48:36pm

If only your English was as good as your French.

Actually, since you are making (what is, in your mind), a contrary-to-fact statement, the past subjunctive tense of the verb "to be" should be used here.

It should be:

If only your English were as good as your French.

400 Titus Quinctius Cincinnatus  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 1:48:46pm

tout votre poteau de commande sont appartiennent à nous

401 Sean II  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 1:48:47pm

Ummm...

then talk shite.Man

402 Mr Pol  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 1:48:56pm

#398 Rayra

I'm Israeli, actually...

403 Mr Pol  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 1:50:08pm

#399 Frank IBC

Ah, I didn't know that. Anybody can point me to a good English grammar course on the net?

404 Thom  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 1:50:36pm

#393 Ides of March

Ah, you have managed to refrain yourself this evening.

Let us master the English grammar together ...

---

re·frain

v. re·frained, re·frain·ing, re·frains
v. intr.

To hold oneself back; forbear: refrained from swearing.

405 Thom  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 1:51:09pm

Woo hoo! 404!

Is this thing on ...?

406 cba  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 1:51:18pm
Ah, you have managed to refrain yourself this evening.

Do you think our educator meant "restrain yourself"?

407 Frank IBC  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 1:51:42pm

Im sorry to have to go and ruin your Saturday night, but I'm off.

TIMESTAMP: 8/7/2004 03:47PM PST

408 Titus Quinctius Cincinnatus  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 1:53:43pm

#399 Frank IBC

I apologise for my insolence, old bean, but I find myself forced to take exception with your failure to properly expound the rules of grammar in the English idiom.

It should be:

If only your English were as good as your French.

Rather, should it not be:

If only yo' English be as good as yo' French...?

409 big L  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 1:53:44pm

#23--titus-- thanks, it was a great group of photos
brave folks...

410 Rayra[deleted]  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 1:54:34pm
411 evariste  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 1:54:44pm
Yeah, thats it. An UK educator.Master the ENGLISH grammar first, then talk shite.Man, you guys don't even have you own language.

But please tell me what your jobs involve?Does it involve soap?

ROFL.

that's it.

...

educator. Master

space inserted

...

shite. Man

ditto

...

have your own language.

...

involve?. Does itthey

ditto

Wanker.

412 Titus Quinctius Cincinnatus  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 1:55:55pm

Well all, I'm going to have to go refrain myself for a couple of hours and change the oil and mow the lawn. You know, all those things that UK educators wouldn't have a clue about how to do...

413 cba  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 1:57:19pm
Wanker

Learning British English, are you ev? I hope it wasn't I who corrupted you ;-)

414 evariste  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 1:57:31pm

#395 cba, LOL!

415 cba  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 1:58:42pm

#396 Mr Pol
#407 Frank IBC

LOL, that was my reaction too.

416 evariste  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 1:59:25pm

cba-hey, I took my GCEs :-)

417 cba  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 2:00:38pm

#416 evariste:
I'd call you a liar but that would be rude ;-)

418 Frank IBC  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 2:00:55pm

Although I the one which can be reached the hate suggested in this infantilen tete A tete would be (apologies for the use of Frenchmen, white I, how much you despise France and all different one, which do not see exactly the eye with the eye with you), which I must specify that all contained my postings on the occasion of with reports/ratios of the ' FOAD ' or ' BS, which seemed, to belong to your regular vocabulary.

419 Delta Burka  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 2:03:59pm

#405, Thom

Hey - love your URL. Such research!

Hi cba ;-)

420 zorkmidden  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 2:04:06pm

Is this a grammar thread?

I'm outta here...

421 Frank IBC  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 2:04:15pm

Damn, this Google "translation" service would be great for sabotaging someone's PowerPoint presentation.

Wish I knew how to hack Tom Brokaw's telepromtper...

422 DP111  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 2:05:28pm

300, Beagle

To Reza: I know you breed like bacteria, but you still are way behind

Bacteria multiples with great speed, only and only when conditions are right. Before the early twentieth century, Muslims were dying out. They could not breed faster then their infant mortality rates, mortality due to famine and pestilence in the Muslim world.

In the last century, Western science, technology and medicine has all but banished famine and pestilence, while greatly reducing infant mortality. All this has significantly helped the ummah, which has not responded by reducing its fertility rates.

In the last fifty years, our use of oil and allowing Muslim immigration to the West, has yet again bettered the conditions for expansion of Muslims, both in numbers and geographic span.

Therefore, the fault for all this aggravation with large hordes of Muslims, both here and and in the Islamic world, must lie at our own doorstep.

320 Ann

I'm very angry today because a good and decent pastor, Dr Rev Alan Clifford, is being harried for simply stating that Islam is evil. Whether that is true or not, is neither here nor there. He has the freedom to criticise an ideology. Rev Clifford, despite harrassment, continues in his love for Muslims.

All this trouble we are having in Britain and the West, is being caused, when we have a mere 2% of muslims in the West. Can anyone imagine what will happen when the Muslims are 10% or even 50%.

It is not a pet that we have let in to our house. It seems to me, we took pity on a mongrel dog, that was in need of a sustenance and shelter. It is now beginning to be apparant that this dog, is really quite rabid.
---
Reza
Remember you are in our house. You were not invited. We took you in - from Somalia, Afghanistan, and all the flea-ridden Islamic pest holes, as we took pity on you. But do not forget that you are in our house, at our sufferance, our charity and above all, as our pet. Islam will never be anything in the West but a passing diversionary fad. This is apparant from the fact that some idiotic celebrities have taken up Islam. The West though, has a habit of grilling and chewing philosophies which are of importance to it. The fact that it gives Islam the miss, nay even protects it, is indication enough, that Islam is regarded, even by the Liberal media, as of no importance. The reason that Islam is in the news, is not because of its importance to the West but because of its nuisance. So I advise you - Take care.

You may think that people on this forum are loathsome to you. But trust me, they are treating you with respect. As for the Liberals, who you think are on your side. Forget it. They are the ones who regard you as house pets; as instruments in their own powerplay.

Take my advice. Leave and go back to dar al Islam. That is the advice of OBL as well. He should know.

423 evariste  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 2:06:04pm

cba-Hey! I really did! LOL! I took my O levels and A levels, ULEAC's syllabus (cambridge gcse is for pussies), January session '94 for my O levels and May-June '95 for my A levels. British Council, Amman. All As. Honest to god! I still have my tattered transcript somewhere :-)

424 Beagle  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 2:06:05pm

JFingK

Read this

January 25, 2000

By Stephan Archer
LOS ANGELES – Stanislav Lunev, the highest-ranking Soviet spy ever to defect, warned members of Congress Monday a pre-emptive nuclear strike by Russia on American soil is a real possibility.

At a House Committee on Government Reform hearing here, the one-time colonel in Soviet and then Russian Federation military intelligence, gave a chilling presentation of his country’s Cold War plans to defeat the United States.


Anyone who thinks the threat was not real during the Cold War is just using "it didn't happen, so it couldn't have happened" reasoning. That's foolish.

425 Frank IBC  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 2:07:57pm

TCQ -

I speax English real gud, I duz. :P

In case anyone was wondering, my #418 was derived by translating #275 into French, then back into English, then back into French, then from French to German, then back to English. "Infantilen" is of course a remnant that didn't get translated from the German iteration.

426 Frank IBC  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 2:10:49pm

O levels

Why does phrase that sound like something X-Rated?

Maybe I've just watched Office Space one time too many...

427 Mr Pol  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 2:12:09pm

#425 Frank IBC

Oh. I though you were channeling a UK 'educator'.

428 Rayra[deleted]  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 2:12:59pm
429 Frank IBC  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 2:16:12pm

#424 Beagle -

Some historians have argued that just before he died, Stalin was about to launch a nuclear war on the USA. They further argue that his death was not from a stroke but was actually an assassination, done by Nikita Khrushchev and other members of the Politburo who were horrified by his course of action.

If it's true, it's like what would have happened had Gen von Stauffenburg succeded in assasinating Hitler in July 1944.

430 cba  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 2:16:19pm

#423 evariste:
You took A levels when you were only 15?!!! Damn, you are a fucking genius! (My parents are impressed because I have 10 O levels--all but 2 As--and 4 A levels--2 As and 2 Bs. And I took them at the normal age.)

Delta Burka, hi right back at you. Would you email me? Let me know when you do, because I only check my LGF account when I'm expecting something.

431 jinnderella  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 2:16:32pm

#353 Monsieur Pol: Bien merci pour le sourire-- c'est le troll drole, n'est pas?

432 gymnast  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 2:16:45pm

Ides, You Know LaFayette, or any Siamese hookers?

433 evariste  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 2:18:49pm

#430 cba-

You took A levels when you were only 15?!!! Damn, you are a fucking genius! (My parents are impressed because I have 10 O levels--all but 2 As--and 4 A levels--2 As and 2 Bs. And I took them at the normal age.)

You're goddamn right I'm a genius ;-) I took 8 O levels and 3 A levels, so you outdid me on quantity :-)

434 Rayra[deleted]  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 2:19:04pm
435 Ann  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 2:21:18pm

#422 DP111:
I understand now.

Dr. Clifford states facts. Bad.

Imams can preach death, the overthrow of the government, and the need for world domination. Okay.

436 Thom  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 2:21:52pm

#428 Rayra

Ah. Talkin' out its ass.

(It was news to me that the US uses Soviet-designed arms ... just wanted a reality check.)

437 Geepers  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 2:22:45pm

Ides of March says:

Talk about dogmatic.This is truly ridiculous.

LOL. You're new here aren't you?

Hi cba! How is/was your vacation?

438 Delta Burka  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 2:23:01pm

#430, cba

The deed is done ;-)

439 Thom  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 2:24:12pm

#419 Delta Burka

All your 404 are belong to me!!

440 DP111  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 2:26:30pm

320 Ann

When I made the analogy of Islam and a rabid dog, I thought I was being original.

Well here is Winston Churchill

"How dreadful are the curses which Mohammedanism lays on its votaries! Besides the fanatical frenzy, which is as dangerous in a man as hydrophobia in a dog, there is this fearful fatalistic apathy
441 Frank IBC  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 2:27:31pm

{{{CBA}}}

Welcome back!!!

442 Stormi  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 2:28:34pm

This thread is killing me.

443 Frank IBC  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 2:28:50pm

"hydrophobia" = rabies, in case anyone didn't know...

444 Rayra[deleted]  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 2:28:57pm
445 Mr Pol  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 2:30:32pm

#444 Rayra

Except for one brother living in Italy, my family is all in Israel.

446 Stormi  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 2:33:43pm

423 Evariste

(You still suck for not sending postcards, but I'm getting over it)

How'd you do on your O.W.L.s and N.E.W.T.s?

447 jinnderella  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 2:35:09pm

#440 DP111: Have you read Al Qaeda's Fantasy Ideology? I liked the Islam-as-disease metaphor. Sorry if you have read it already-- I am still such a newbie here. :(

448 cba  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 2:35:10pm

#437 Geepers:
Vacation was FAN-TAS-TIC. Absolutely wonderful, everything we'd hoped it would be. We did lots of walking in old Quebec City, including various guided tours, ate some very nice meals (and one or two less successful ones), and kept up our running regimen on the Plains of Abraham (we're coming to the end of a Learn to Run clinic and we're very proud of ourselves).

By coincidence on the weekend there was a big re-enactment of a couple of battles from 1779. OK, re-enactment's not quite the word, because they never actually happened. But they MIGHT have happened. There were several hundred people in period outfits (including some kids). Lots of people came from the States. They set up camp on the Plains of Abraham--the American (and French) camp, and the British camp. Everyone was very happy to talk about it.

We got back late Sunday night, then Monday morning I headed out to San Antonio for a client and got back late last night. I would have contacted RIP Ford while I was down there, but I knew I was going to be madly busy and that's how it turned out--11 hour days, and I tried to keep up with the running. Although not outside--98 degrees and 95% humidity are more than I can handle. Luckily the hotel had a treadmill.

Now I have to catch up on my sleep...

449 ploome hineni[deleted]  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 2:35:23pm
450 Mr Pol  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 2:37:34pm

#449 ploome hineni

I might be in NYC for a week in September. Not sure yet.

451 Ann  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 2:38:09pm

There is no cure for rabies, once it sets in.
The only hope is early inoculation when exposure is suspected...

452 Frank IBC  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 2:42:50pm

Cba -

I saw Quebec when I was 7 going on 8. I don't remember too much, except that the Chateau Frontenac was beautiful.

I guess you've seen that all Quebec license plates say Je Me Souviens. "I remember", referring to their loss to the British on the Plains of Abraham on September 1, 1759. Just wondering, how do you say "Move On", in French? :)

453 cba  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 2:43:57pm

#441 Frank IBC:
Thanks, that's so sweet. And here I thought no-one noticed I was gone.

Delta Burka, I returned your email.

454 Frank IBC  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 2:44:25pm

Ann -

And to properly diagnose Rabies, the animal must be killed first. :)

455 cba  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 2:44:40pm

Delta, I mean I replied.

Did I mention I'm tired?

456 Iron Fist[deleted]  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 2:45:52pm
457 Rayra[deleted]  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 2:47:41pm
458 cba  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 2:49:10pm

#452 Frank IBC:
Well, according to the guide who showed us around the Citadel, for the province it means they remember their French heritage, but for the 2 RR 22ieme (regiment), which is based in the Citadel, it means they remember their fallen comrades.

All the buildings were named for battles in which the 2RR22ieme had distinguished themselves in WWI and WWII (plus a building named for Korea). There were a lot of buildings.

We were also pleasantly surprised at how friendly the locals were. Not what we were expecting!

459 Mr Pol  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 2:49:55pm

#457 Rayra

You're confusing me with Caton, whose sister married my brother...

460 Mr Pol  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 2:51:41pm

#457 Rayra

BTW, the discussion is moot: Israel wouldn't be spending so much to develop and deploy THEL/MTHEL systems if taking out the Iranian nuclear program was possible.

461 evariste  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 2:53:02pm

Stormi, I never heard of those but I looked it up, LOL! I really ought to read the Harry Potter books but they're so popular that I can't stand to. I should get over it :-) Also, I'm not sending you a postcard any more since I'm not traveling, but I will send you a nice letter. It will be in an unorthodox format (ie not on paper). That is all I am at liberty to reveal because I don't want to spoil the surprise.

462 Geepers  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 2:53:27pm

cba, Sounds like a great time.

463 Stormi  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 2:54:47pm

Hello, Iron Fist!

MWAH!

464 evariste  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 2:58:11pm

Why does it spoil my pleasure in a book to know that millions of others have read it? I'm not a snob in most other ways. For instance, it doesn't bother me if other people like 'my' bands and make them popular.
Maybe I have too intimate a relationship with books. I don't want to read a slutty book that got around. I like to pretend I'm the book's only one...
;-) indulge my retardation please

465 Stormi  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 2:59:21pm

461 Evariste

Also, I'm not sending you a postcard any more since I'm not traveling, but I will send you a nice letter. It will be in an unorthodox format (ie not on paper). That is all I am at liberty to reveal because I don't want to spoil the surprise.

I'm having visions of The Godfather and a horse's head in my bed. I know it's just sick and wrong, but I cannot help it.

466 Gruen  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 3:01:00pm

#429

Frank, that sounds very plausible, I mean who knows what mad things went on isdie the politburo back then?

And Khrushchev sure went out of his way to condemn Stalin and his policies in the 50's.

I wonder did Khrushchev himself come near to being knocked off during the Cuban missile crisis by hardliners looking for war?

467 cba  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 3:02:57pm

#464 evariste:

Maybe I have too intimate a relationship with books. I don't want to read a slutty book that got around. I like to pretend I'm the book's only one...

That's interesting. Whenever I enjoy a book I want all my friends to read it too.

I'm not that way about my husband at all.

468 evariste  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 3:04:22pm

cba, Stormi, LOL!

469 evariste  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 3:09:08pm

cba-

Whenever I enjoy a book I want all my friends to read it too.

yeah totally, I always try to palm my books off on my friends. Actually, no I don't. What I do is leave the good ones that I want other people to read laying around so that people will run into them and ask to borrow them. This is because I've discovered that a surefire way to get someone not to read a book I want them to read is to press it on them and tell them how great it was and how they ought to read it :-)
I think it's more the abstract tens of millions of people reading a book that turns me off a bit, like the Potter books. For instance I didn't mind reading Eats, Shoots and Leaves, but maybe that's because I imagined that all the people reading it were after my own kind :-) Whereas I can't figure out who else is reading Harry Potter except that it's everyone on earth and I'll be damned if I share a book with all those people.

470 Frank IBC  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 3:11:55pm

Maybe I have too intimate a relationship with books. I don't want to read a slutty book that got around. I like to pretend I'm the book's only one...

I'm kind of like that with TV shows. I used to watch The Simpsons way back when it was just a blurb on The Tracey Ullman Show. When it got so that everyone was watching it, several years later, I lost interest in it.

471 Connecticut Yankee  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 3:12:38pm

Lizardoids who are still interested in the issue of moles in the Navy-- Roger L. Simon linked to this thread-- he also has links to Belmont Club's new post. Charles is raking in the hat tips!

[Link: www.rogerlsimon.com...]

I have never been much for proselytizing, whether by Scientology or Amway. The cult-like quality of this behavior is all too evident, if sometimes comic. But this morning it wasn't so funny when I read on LGF that the US Navy sailor whose email turned up on the computer of a terrorist in Britain told his British compatriot he wanted to "keep up the dawah."

What is dawa? For those who don't know, it's proselytizing for Islam, "an obligatory duty (fard) for Muslims." This is the kind of obligatory duty, of course, that encourages a fanatic to write email to homicidal lunatics with the locations and counter-terror strategies of naval vessels (or anything else, for that matter... like where you go to work). I am tired of the War on Terror euphemism. This is mind-cult enemy which must named. This is a War on Islamofascism. You wouldn't fight AIDS by calling it a War on Sickness.

472 Stormi  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 3:13:11pm

It's killing me wondering what kind of unorthodox format Evariste is going to come up with.

473 Gruen  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 3:14:59pm

LOL!

that a surefire way to get someone not to read a book I want them to read is to press it on them and tell them how great it was and how they ought to read it

That is just so damn true! If anyone try's to tell me how brilliant such and such book is or lectures me that I "must" read it, it goes down on my list behind even the koran!

It's the same with movies, if I hear people raving about an "awesome" movie and everybody is urging everybody else to go see it...you can be damn sure if I do decide to watch it, I'll be getting ot on DVD and watching it in my own good time!!

474 vickie  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 3:22:11pm

Read Reza..#55. This person is NOT proceeding according to the Islamic PR..PLAN. The PR Plan is dont stampede the animals..keep your mouth SHUT until the right time... This person, Reza, is saying it like ALOT of Muslims in America and around the world actually feel. AND they are WORKING for this outcome one way or the other..As they say: By ANY MEANS NECESSARY. HELLOOO...

Compare and contrast with Jews..another NON Majority Religion in America..and Hindus ..A NEW NON Majority Religion in America. Do either of these NON MAJORITY religions have ANY SUCH PLANS as Reza talks about? NOOO...they never have and dont now and I suspect-- not ever.

Peeps at LGFs...People say what they mean..and MEAN what they say. You heard it here folks..when Reza lost it for a minute and said EXACTLEEEH what he/or she meant. Those are the "plans" of Islam in the West.

I dont like to be Missionized to..I really REALLY dont like it...but then there is Missionizing and CAP M...Mizzionizing..ie either be what WE want or we kill ya. A whole NUTHER kettle of fish in the Missionizing World...Geeze.

I dont know what the F...else people need to hear anymore..Stuff coming out of Rezas mouth comes out of Mullahs mouths REGULARLY. They arent even shy about saying what Reza says... I suggest STRONGLY...that Americans start paying ALOT of attention to what Islam is DOING and doing all over the world. just mah...opinion folks...

475 Stormi  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 3:23:39pm

Come on, Evariste... Can I have a couple more clues? Just two or three? Pleeease? I'll be your friend forever.

476 evariste  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 3:25:37pm

Stormi-

It's killing me wondering what kind of unorthodox format Evariste is going to come up with.

I promise it will not be in horse-body-parts format ;-)

477 evariste  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 3:27:00pm

Stormi, hell no I'm not giving you any clues, I'm terrible at giving clues :-) My clues always either give it completely away or they are utterly inscrutable and annoying, I'm not even gonna try.

478 Stormi  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 3:28:00pm

That's not a clue. Gimme something good.

Oooh, is it a pr0n video?

479 Iron Fist[deleted]  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 3:28:35pm
480 evariste  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 3:29:58pm

Stormi, ok, I lied. It will be in several unorthodox formats. Howzat. I told you my clues will be infuriating.

481 Gruen  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 3:30:45pm

Its true there are well over 800 million Hindu's in the world, 200 million + Sikhs. People who are members of these religions have deep beliefs, they are very loyal and their religious beliefs are very important to them. Yet they never cause trouble, why?

Because their religions are not openly aggressive, they do not seek to "convert" the human race to their way of thinking. They are happy with their status and with the size of their flocks and do not greedily lust for more innocent people to corrupt.

482 evariste  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 3:31:16pm

It will not be porn, LOL! :-) Good idea though.

483 Rayra[deleted]  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 3:31:42pm
484 Stormi  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 3:36:00pm

482 evariste

It will not be porn, LOL! :-) Good idea though.

DAMMIT BEAVIS

485 ploome hineni[deleted]  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 3:37:52pm
486 Stormi  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 3:40:27pm

Several unorthodox formats. Hm. let me wrap my brain around this...

Flowers. A singing telegram. A non porn video.

Hopefully not a flaming bag of excrement...

487 Smith Space Technologies  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 3:43:34pm

#385 billphx
I just called my daughter and emailed her the article. Both her and her husband were serving on the Benfold when this happened. She was stunned. She said she only new of one muslim in the crew.
***

I like this Ideal below it's best for those guilty of high treason while serving in the US Navy. We need to change the laws for "This Man's Navy"
***
365 Space Pirate
#2 Bensmom
Gee, too bad we don't keel-haul bad guys anymore.

Why keel haul him that's to good for him. Lash him to the figurehead and give him a jug of wine a loaf of bread and a knife. Then the Capt. can list him as dead in the logbook...

488 evariste  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 3:44:26pm

No video, no singing anything, no living beings :-)

489 vickie  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 3:45:30pm

OT: Best of 50s Pop on my PBS. (before Rock came in) Rosemary Clooney up now..Come On to My House..(gonna give you EVERYthing..hey) Mombo Italiano...Fabulous. Some guy was just on..singing his damn behind off. Dont know who he was but..He still has it. Joe Stafford..Hope she comes on. Gogi Grant...Wayward Wind...Patti Page too. Whole bunch of guy groups as well. Four Coins..Shangila..(that was a pretty song) Alta cockers... doing a nice job of it right now..

I loved what came next. after the 50s music, but it WAS a damn shame that all these people and this music got whiped out by Rock ...Wished BOTH could have survived ...in the same way.

490 Stormi  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 3:48:38pm

Oh crap. He's going to cut a tv-movie-of-the-week stalker letter out of pages of The Enquirer. Or more likely, National Review and The Economist.

But is it coming soon? I'm all aflutter with anticipation.

491 cba  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 3:49:15pm

#481 Gruen:
In 1985 Sikh militants bombed Air India flight 182, killing 329 people.

But Sikh terrorism is certainly not nearly as widespread as Islamist terrorism.

492 Rayra[deleted]  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 3:50:43pm
493 vickie  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 3:53:00pm

Youalll...this PBS Program is GOOOD. Four Lads singing their TUSHES off..and they are sounding GREAT. (Standing on the Corner) If you have it playing in your area...tune in and enjoy. Im having a grand time listening here. Just plain ole..white bread..staight up,,, POP. McGuire Sisters will be on. Listen younger people..if you aint heard the McGuire Sisters before..turn in cause they were terrific. Dont hear that stuff anymore. Really REALLY good harmonizing.

494 evariste  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 3:59:53pm

LOL. Nope :-) Nothing creepy or stalkery. Also nothing inappropriate, I'm not sending you like edible panties made out of twizzlers or anything. Definitely not that.

495 vickie  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 4:01:05pm

OT: LAST on this..Would like to mention..JOHNNY RAY. (Cry) Before Elvis..and DAMN GOOD!!! If there hadnt have been a Johnny Ray (he was hugely different from anyone else at the time)..then there wouldnt likely have been an Elvis. (not that I dont love Elivis to death.) Props to Johnny tho..he needs to be mentioned much MUCH more than he is.

496 Stormi  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 4:05:59pm

I don't know from Johnny Ray, but I sure do like me some Jonny Lang.

497 vickie  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 4:08:09pm

Johnny Lang..that little blonde boy who sings the Blues? Cause if it IS..I loves me that child. G-d hes good.

498 Stormi  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 4:16:53pm

Why, yes, he IS that little blond boy that sings the blues. I loves me that child too, and back off, because he's legal now and I saw him first :o)

Do you have his new record, Long Time Coming?

Track 5 is a get-your-schwerve-on kinda song, ain't it?

499 vickie  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 4:26:20pm

Stormi: Hes what I call a "Magic Singer" Transports ya to wherever if you arent careful..HE goes somewhere else when he is singing and you can go right along with him as easy as pie.

PLUS...hes beautiful as well. Im too old for him...but...

Why isnt he this HUGE deal? Sings like a dream..gorgeous as hell...and why isnt he this tremendous star? I dont get it.

Just heard him on TV..was on Austin City Limits the first I saw him..Caught him here and there thru the years..watching him sing his behind off..and grow up.

LOVE that child.

If you like him..Youd appreciate Johnny Ray too. Very very unusal for the time...Not white bread type of singer when everyone else was. (Cept for the Italian boys that is...lolol) Seriously Johnny Ray was great. Ushered in Elvis.

500 mika.  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 4:48:50pm

#117 Brenda

Ben Stein is now on C-span2 talking about his new book Can America Survive. He's pretty wound up.



Was this broadcasted live? I can't seem to find any trace of it now.

501 Stormi  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 4:49:23pm
HE goes somewhere else when he is singing and you can go right along with him as easy as pie.

I will go anywhere he asks me to.

Why isnt he this HUGE deal? Sings like a dream..gorgeous as hell...and why isnt he this tremendous star? I dont get it.

I don't get it either. Instead, there is rubbish like the Backstreet Boys and all their clones. All is not right with the world.

502 vickie  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 5:05:30pm

Between you and me..Can you just IMAGINE? Next life..I want a boy like that. AND Id have liked to know what to do EARLIER in life... (just an aside there) We BOTH know whats good...LOLOL

I dont actually get it. You canNOT get better than that boy...and what you get is just what you said and Justin? Hes a nothin singer. Not all that good looking either. And HES? a star? And Johnny isnt? Go figure.

Diamonds..on now.."Little Darlin"...Damn that was a good song. McGuire Sisters...Goodnight Sweetheart...Another good song.

503 johnCV  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 5:17:57pm

A Mighty Thread, this. No more posting till I catch up. Now on #455. Give me a few minutes... ;-)

504 Lady of Shalott (ylreveb)  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 5:19:11pm

"U.N. Offers to Help Broker Cease-Fire in Iraq
UNITED NATIONS (Reuters) - The United Nations offered its help on Saturday to try to stop some of the worst fighting seen in Iraq in about four months between Shi'ite militiamen and coalition forces. "

Now that we're winning, that is.

Note to Ides:
loathe is the verb. Loath is the adjective.
You may sit down.

505 Lady of Shalott (ylreveb)  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 5:28:32pm

#383 Frank IBC

Why don't you kiss yourselves? Tete-a-Tete does not have the specific significance. You speak the shit.

Apparently, it learned only how to employ the device of translation of Google. Speak about the failed systems about education!

/Google Mistranslation Services

SPIT-TAKE!

506 Fuad Al'Razi  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 5:43:14pm

Good Evening:

There are several comments I would like to make concerning the propagandistic diatribe of this individual named Reza:

1. Islam is not a religion, it is a false ideology of totalitarian Fascism, whose main goal is the complete domination of other civilizations through military/political conquest.

2. It is totally obvious and imminent that Islam is on the path of self-annihilation due to its absolutely false and illogical foundations. It is a nonfunctional belief system using propaganda as its primary means of propagation.

3. Nearly all Islamic countries, with the possible exception of Turkey, is a complete failure in social, political, economic, religious, psychological, and a multitude of other levels. Islamic political ideology cannot be a basis for the governmental institutions of a country. IT JUST DOESN’T WORK, in a modern civilized context.

Best Regards,
Fuad Al’Razi
(ex-Muslim)

507 Fuad Al'Razi  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 5:49:21pm

One additional comment:

Islam does not represent any valid majority opinion in the United States. It is a very small minority, but a minority that nonetheless needs to be monitored as an enemy population.

I know this sounds rash, as I will probably fall under the scrutiny of this, but there exists individuals and groups whose goal is the destruction of Western civilized ideals on which this country is based.

Regards,
Fuad Al'Razi

508 Ann  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 5:52:27pm

Hi Five Fuad!
You are a Foundation Day registered person. Please find the time to post more often-:)

509 Ann  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 5:59:55pm

Fuad... and the "leaders" of Islam knows that it cannot survive today, in its current form. Which is why they must destoy the other civilization now.

510 Fuad Al'Razi  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 6:02:40pm

Ann:

Agreed.

They recognize that over 1400 years, no real accomplishments have occurred for Islamic civilization. But, they do recognize the continuous failures, but refuse to take responsibility. Just like immature children blaming everyone but themselves.

Fuad.

511 Ann  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 6:24:15pm

Fuad,

We will be okay. By "we" I mean the ideal that people have the right to choice, self-rule, self-determination, freedom of faith, open education and the pursuit of happiness.

I have spoken to people who have lived in Nigeria, Saudi, Iraq, Afghanistan, Sierra Leone, Iran, Bosnia, and Communist Slovak. There are more, but I cannot remember right now...

These people have told me that they cannot go back to what they left. I have never experienced anything but options in my life, at every turn. I know that I will never live otherwise.

Thanks again for your thoughts.

512 Fuad Al'Razi  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 6:42:13pm

Ann:

Thanks for your posts. They are very interesting and very refreshing.

I believe that we will be OK.

Best Regards,
Fuad Al'Razi

513 Ann  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 6:48:49pm

Good Night Fuaz. Sleep well.

514 Ann  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 6:52:05pm

Um, Fuad. Not Fuaz. Sorry. Very sleepy-:)

515 TalkinKamel  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 6:52:15pm

Fuad Al'Razi:

Many thanks for your reasoned and intelligent comments, Fuad.

516 Fuad Al'Razi  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 6:57:24pm

Good Night.

I need a good night's sleep.

Best Regards,
Fuad.

517 cba  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 7:04:52pm

Goodnight, Fuad. Sleep well, and come back soon.

518 evariste  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 7:06:01pm

Fuad, sorry I missed you, apparently you rock. I quit Islam too. I hope to see you around.

519 evariste  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 7:08:21pm

Hi cba, you weren't there when I was typing that :-) I just almost had a reason to use the word lehavdil but I realized even lehavdil wouldn't save me from the fact that I was bringing x up in relation to a y to which it was egregiously unrelated. Some things are good comparisons, some are good as long as you say lehavdil, and it looks like some just shouldn't be made, lehavdil disclaimer or no ;-)

520 cba  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 7:21:12pm

#519 evariste:
For some reason your post made me think of severe intoxication.

I'd say "lehavdil" but I wouldn't mean it ;-)

521 evariste  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 7:22:54pm

cba, LOL! Touché :-)

522 cba  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 7:26:11pm

'Night, ev!

523 Frank IBC  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 7:29:49pm

What's Lehavdil? Sounds like one o' them newfangled medications.

524 Pamela  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 7:30:50pm

Fuad, Evariste, thank-God for you, and I hope there are hundreds of millions of people just like you two.


I hope people like reza will see the falseness of Islam.

I have a copy of ther Koran in english, and have read it. There is no feeling of love or peace or soul, it is full of rules on how to live. No joy or happiness.

525 evariste  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 7:43:16pm

Frank IBC, LOL!

cba explains it as such:
literally "to distinguish [between]" or "to differentiate" (the noun Havdallah is the name of the short ceremony at the end of Shabbat to mark the differentiation between Shabbat and the "everyday." In this context it means "although I'm saying X reminds me in some way of Y, I in no way mean to attribute the characteristics of Y to X--in fact, I am strongly differentiating the two."

IOW "not to compare this and that, but they do remind me of each other."

526 evariste  Sat, Aug 7, 2004 7:50:07pm

Pamela-I don't know if there's hundreds of millions, but I would probably agree that there's about one or two million apostate muslims, 99% of them secretly.
I agree, there's no hint of joy in the Koran, just fear and threats mixed with promises of bribes of a celestial bordello. Allah is a creep.
I think the biggest hope for muslims is evangelicals converting them to Christianity. I don't think the leap to atheism like I've made is for most, really. I hope they're up to it. It doesn't seem like nearly enough missionary work is going on. I know it's hard and dangerous but I wish there was more of it. At least Christianity offers the concept of Grace, which is fundamentally a wholly alien concept to a muslim. Muslims do good works because they fear Allah's wrath. Grace is a huge difference.

527 Apache  Sun, Aug 8, 2004 5:27:57am

Greetings,
I am totally new to this site but going through this site I found it very very excellent Keep up the good work.

Read most of the comments but I found none pointing to the real TERRORIST STATE called PAKISTAN.

Take all the arrests and terrorisim it is in some way or the other connected to this Sucking nation (Pakis).

I regret that the media is not telling that the 12 fundamentalists arrested in Britain are pakistanis instead it harps that they are asians.

US act now deal with Pakistan sternly or the Pukis will not wait to give another chance.

528 Geepers  Sun, Aug 8, 2004 5:58:52am

Apache (#527),

While Pakistan may be filled with madrassa educated robots that screech a lot and a secret service that tacitly approves and is complicit at times, it would seem that Musharraf and the military are increasingly strong on the issue and are the target of the Islamists aggression.

And for good reason. They just brought in an al Qaeda big wheel from UAE.

Three years ago no one would have even dreamed Musharraf would be fighting on our side.

529 RickZ  Sun, Aug 8, 2004 6:54:22am

# 528 Geepers:

Three years ago no one would have even dreamed Musharraf would be fighting on our side.

Self-preservation tends to stiffen one's spine.

530 Apache  Sun, Aug 8, 2004 7:08:18am

Greetings geepers,

Talking about Musharaf and Pakis joining the Fight Against Terrorism or joining with US, LOL geepers,

It was not that he hated Jihadis or Terrorists BUT coz of COLIN POWEL's Tel call in Which he asked "YOU ARE WITH US OR WITH THEM" the pakis were frightened to the core that they started to shiver and offered USA the support.
Also India was ready to offer ANY help If pakistan was not helping, this also scared Pakis coz they wanted to Keep the Kashmir issue burning and if they did not offer USA the support they were sure that US would have taught a lesson to the Paki Dictator.

Also Mushraff supported USA not coz of the Love of USA but coz the love for US$ (3 billion of US$ debts of Pakistan was written OFF).

Al-Qaeda and Taliban were the brain child of this very Pakistani Army to bleed India and make afghanistan a Client State. But OBL had different Idea he thought of Islamic paradise and to bring down USA.

Any bets that OBL is in the custody of Paki Army.:)

531 Geepers  Sun, Aug 8, 2004 7:37:12am

Greetings Apache.

Also Musharraf supported USA not coz of the Love of USA but coz the love for US$ (3 billion of US$ debts of Pakistan was written OFF).

Maybe, but Turkey blew us off for $20 billion.

But, regardless of how the pressure/incentive worked, Musharraf picked the strong horse, and has stuck with it. It isthree years later. Military operations continue and even you can speculate they may have already captured OBL.

In the grand scheme who's done more to stop islam, Musharraf or Chirac?

532 Ides of March  Sun, Aug 8, 2004 9:33:39am

Hey guys,

Well I have to say I am somewhat overcome by the vigour of the defence of Ploome...and..needless to say.. the vitriolic attack on MOI.Big round of applause for you guys..you are great!

But hate to remind you that

266 Ides of March 8/7/2004 01:54PM PST

And to make you feel at home I include a number of mistakes for you to grab in every posting.Have fun.

Seems that in your group scroll rage you forgot about this little posting.

And as for ascertaining my occupation, which seemed to really grab your attention, may I remind you of the question and answer.

258 ploome hineni 8/7/2004 01:45PM PST

And here is the response:

#261 Ides of March 8/7/2004 01:47PM PST

But, despite the answer, which is neither negative nor positive, you assumed I was a teacher.

Still, thanks for brightening up my evening.And no, I have never been to Montreal.And am not a Brit Paki Prof or a Prof of any sort.Heaven forbid they let me near independent-minded people...I much prefer intolerant rage-merhcants like yourself.

Lets do it again some time.

Another RENDEZVOUS AVEC MOI C'EST SOIR?

533 DP111  Sun, Aug 8, 2004 11:33:20am

Rev Alan Clifford, the pastor who is in hot water because he said Islam is evil, has no doubts of his love for Muslims, as he feels that Muslims are merely misguided. He believes that the antidote to Islam is the love of Jesus. Note the use of the word 'antidote'.

His is the right position, rather then the Archbishop of Canterbury, the Pope and Church hierachy in general. I cannot understand how the Church can adopt the position that Islam is equivalent to Christianity. As Christians, they have no alternative but to try and show Muslims that only Jesus is the right way. To adopt a PC position, is to deny their own faith. They should not call themselves Christians.


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