I told you guys, that's true

LEADERSHEEP

Blow it out yer arse, ya flamin' idjit!

We're doomed, doomed I tell you.

Sigh.

Why am I not surprised?

So, State avoids any comment about the antisemitic cartoons published daily by the muslims all over the world but finds necessary to comment about mohammed cartoons.

True warriors, aren't they ?

State Dept,

Please kindly f*** right the hell off.

Thank you.

blah blah blah...

"Not acceptable" to whom? Conveniently passive voice. Hey, I find them more than acceptable. Whaddya gonna do about it?

After the WTC attacks, President Bush said you either with us, or you're with the terrorists.

Who would have thought that would become easy, with the US apparently joining the terrorists' side?

Sigh.

BUT when was the last time you expressed similar disgust at the DAILY anti-Semitic effluvia from our "allies" in the Mahometan world?

I just knew, Charles, that you would blame this on the State Department ("Foggy Bottom").

Guess what? The State Department is in the BUSH ADMINISTRATION. You know, beloved President Bush? I would be very surprised if this didn't go out without at least Condoleeza Rice's assent, if not Bush himself.

Maybe ol' George isn't so great after all. He's not a big fan of press freedom anyway.

Prester John

Doomed? I don't think so because the hammer will fall when we are pushed enough.

Then it's payback time - guaranteed.

Who is this Justin Higgins dhimmi anyway? This is the first I've heard of him.

The reason is you love money and promotions more than you love ethics and religion.

You want to see the money keep flowing.

Gits

Hopefully this was on the orders of some dhimmwit Deputy ASSistant Under-Secretary of State for Appeasement's idea of trying to calm the waters and not from Condi herself.

Why does a totalitarian religion dictate what anyone in a free country can print?

I didn't see anywhere near this with Piss Christ or Dung Mary.

I say keep printing and let 'em seeeeeethe away.

SOTG

Hey, Gordon - Condi may be Bush, but the majority of the shitstains at State are time-serving career bureaucrats bought and sold by the Arabist faction.

Bugger off, Justin Higgins, you don't speak for me. I shall never tolerate nor respect a religion that advocates AND PRACTICES decapitation, genital mutilation, ownership of women, etc.

Since when did the State Department have an official Bootlicker?

So too was the cartoon published the other day in the WaPo depicting a soldier as a blown up munchkin criticizing Rummy. I didn't read any State Dept. criticism of that one.

The response to these cartoons highlight two things: 1) How moronic and insane the [bigoted word] world is, 2) How weak and duplicitous the West really is.

All press on religious beliefs is equal. Just some press on religious beliefs is more equal than others.

Gah.

"Hold your ground, hold your ground. Sons of Gondor, of Rohan, my brothers. I see in your eyes the same fear that would take the heart of me. A day may come when the courage of men fails, when we forsake our friends and break all bonds of fellowship, but it is not this day. An hour of wolves and shattered shields, when the age of men comes crashing down, but it is not this day. This day we fight! By all that you hold dear on this good Earth, I bid you stand, Men of the West!"

Typical state department response. Filled with grads from Georgetown University, if I recall. Georgetown and state are locales for "arabists", those who unceasinlgly support arab and muslim objectives. I have no better solution, myself, other then to support whatever liberates us from attachments to muslim zones (oil, natural gas, anti-immigration for muslims, anything that could help. In fact, insulting them with cartoons seems efficacious. This path seems reasonable, as I view Islam and terrorism as synonamous, and claims to the contrary as unsupported.

Bubba Clinton And Carter agree with the foggy bottom of jihadists appeasement

so do the supposed provocative british tabloid press - very quiet in dhimmitude UK except for the islamist backed religious hatred bill

Tabloids are ven scared of the Holy Head Choppers - the pathetic Liberal Media Establishment

Liberals are cross between their hate of america and their love of Islamists

Dennis Prager devoted one memorable show to a discussion of the State Department and how its members were "on the other side." It was a scary show but now proving true!

This is an outrage.

I'm sorry, but I have to agree. Sure people are FREE to print what they wish, just as we are free to get angry if we don't like it, but we can still say that some things are over the line or offensive. We don't like it when Christ is portrayed badly why should we expect them to feel any differently?

Plus, you have to know that this is probably a way to keep some violence from occurring. Because that is the difference here. We show our anger by writing about it, they show it by blowing up things.

Sad.

Yeah...just a CRAZY idea to deport them now...ALL of them.

Apologies to me for all the hateful intolerance found in the Koran any be addressed to:
Little Boomer C/O LGF

PS. please don't behead my children.

It's all a lot simpler once you get it through your head that State is largely concerned with keeping oil spiggots flowing freely, especially those of Saudi Arabia. A high percentage of their public noises are diplo-prattle directed to that end. It's not complex.

STFU, Gordon. The State Dept is full of Jew-haters. With the civil service system, it's hard to get rid of all these people. I wish we could.

Gordon,

Haven't seen you around in a long time.

How on earth can you be so smug against the Bush administration when you know god damn well that a Kerry administration would take even more of a soft line?

The Foggy Bottom wobblers do not speak for me.
The hypocrisy of this stance is without peer in recent memory.

On 911, we lost 3500 brothers and sisters, and two magnificent structures.

Today, we lost free speech.

I keep waiting for the event that will push us over the top and teach us to have a backbone, but with every event in which we suffer a loss, we apologize. Now, we have apologized for freedom of speech. I hate to say it, but the muslims are winning.

I didn't realize my mouth could drop open as far as it did when I read that. But on second thought, what else could you expect from an administration that fully supports religious fundamentalism here at home in the US?

PIMF!

I thought that's why Powell left; he couldn't change the climate, and he couldn't be a front man for that kind of entrenched attitude either. Has anyone ever been successful as Secretary of State?

Will and Grace offends me.

Ban it.

WaPo offends me too.

Ban it.

...sound like a Fascist?

Bubba Clinton And Carter agree with the foggy bottom of jihadists appeasement

You mean, "Bubba Clinton and Carter agree with BUSH regarding jihadists appeasement.

This is the BUSH administration. Stop trying to claim otherwise. If "Foggy Bottom" had said this during the CLINTON administration, you wouldn't be making this distinction, and you know it!

Rightwingsparkle:

BUGGER CHRIST THE GAY COWBOY BUTTGOD!

And:

BUDDHA, YOU FAT FUCK! BUGGER YOU TOO!

There. Now:

BUGGER MOHAMHEAD THE GAY AYRAB ASSVAGINA!

Screw preventing violence if it means bowing and scraping like cowards to someone else's stinking sky buddy.

#23, the problem is that when Christ is portrayed in an offensive way, the same folks that are condemning these cartoons, are the first to holler “freedom of speech”. As was pointed out earlier. Don’t just condemn one side. Do you think the national endowment of the arts would display Mohammed in a vat of urine? That would be offensive, but it is okay to display Christ in a vat of urine. Why, because Christians don’t go around beheading folks, like those that follow the messenger of satan do.

I emailed the State Department and let them know that this is a ridiculous statement. As was mentioned on a previous post, the State Department is silent when rabidly anti-Semitic cartoons are regularly published in Muslim newspapers, yet they feel the need to step into this fray and come to the defense of radical Islam. Are we supposed to suspend certain freedoms to placate Muslims who, if these cartoons had never existed, would have found another excuse to riot, kill, and maim? I'm tired of this country bending over backwards to curry favor with a group that would hate us regardless of what we did, short of converting to Islam.

Again, STFU Gordon.

Funny how the State Department never has any criticism for the constant stream of vile Jew hatred displayed daily in the Arab media.

#10 Gordon

I am tired of you and your cowardly tactics. Rather than attack Charles, say what you have to say, in full, and then shut up and take it like a man when we all nut you.

#10 what a true moonbat moron you are. State and CIA are filled with career liberal, traitorous a$$wipes who are leaking national security intelligence with apparent impunity. We know the media and the State/CIA wanted Kerry as Prez, but fortunately the creep didn't make it.
methinks you should emulate liberal goddess mother sheehan or Jimmah Carter and go fellate Castro/Chavez/Hamas/mad mullahs.

Bush should have disbanded CIA and rebuilt with loyalists to America. Why isn't NY Times prosecuted for treason for being unelected arbiter of what are secrets should be?
now, gfy and bioya, mf'er.

I sent my pissed off email. I hope everyone else does the same.

#10 Gordon

You sure do use that selective reading thing don'tcha? You can't honestly say that you have never read critism of the state department on this site.

Both the State Dept and the CIA are at odds with the Bush administration.

Expecting them to be supportive of GW's policies is self defeating in that the outcome is already a given. What's good for them and against the administration's policies will be the line they will always take.

And you were supprised by this?

I heard Mort Kondracke (I think it was him) on Fox this morning talking about how he thought that the cartoons should not have been published because they are evidence of European anti-religiosity.

I agree with much of what he says but he completely missed the boat/point on this one.

And was LGF just down again?

We should remember how this whole cartoon affair began. A Danish author had written a scholarly book about Mohammed & Islam and the publisher sought an artist to illustrate the book. The Islamists heard about this and threatened to bomb the publishing house if they printied the book with picture of Mohammed. The publisher relented and printed it without the portrait of Mohammed.

In response to this incident, a Danish newspaper commissioned several cartoonists to draw cartoons of Mohammed and then published them. These cartoons were new & unrelated to the work of the original book.

One lesson to draw from this exercise is that if we give an inch they will take a mile. Appeasement invites only further demands.

Extremly Dissapointed.

While I never thought Bush was for the true Israeli state, I didnt they his administration would restrict something like this.

America allows for the Halocaust deniers to roam free, have KKK parades, and allow Neo-Nazi events.

But an Isareli group Kahane Chai is illegal deemed by the US but Code Pink can give money to terrorists.

So close but so very far away.

Dear Condi,

Blow me.

Signed,
Laurence Simon
Houston, TX

Fine, but when mentally atable people are insulted, they don't want to chop your head off and blow up your children.

Those that eith avocate or condone this are mentally unstable.

It doesn't matter that we came out and condemed this just as it doesn't matter that we helped millions of Muslims after hurricanes and earthquakes or in the Balkans.

One Burger King stylized ice cream art that looks like the word Mohammed in Arabic will get us killed.

Monsters.

Wow, visitors online at 3,657. LGF was down for a minute there.

Are you getting hammered today, Charles?

#37 Cato:

You friggin' Vishnu-lover!

Well I get highly offended by seeing beheadings. Sure, I understand how it feels when your religion or beliefs are mocked and ridiculed; it happens all the time to Christians. But, we don't go on a rampage over it.

However, maybe we are trying to keep things from getting out of hand because of what we are trying to do in Afghanistan and Iraq. It may be counterproductive to be stirring the pot (even though we know free expression is a right) while we have troops on the ground. I remember when people were really upset about that bogus Qur'an flushing story at Gitmo for that reason (I was too).

41 Alone in NY

Funny how the State Department never has any criticism for the constant stream of vile Jew hatred displayed daily in the Arab media.

AIN'T THAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAT THE TRUTH.

Gordon, what is your stance on this issue, I know you critisize the Bush Administration, and I too think that they are wrong here, but what is your stance?

Laurence Simon:

You know, most people use that phrase in some kind of insulting way but, given that she's kinda cute, I'm not sure how you meant it ...

Michelle Malkin's website has a link to contact the State Dept. to show support for Denmark.

#42 Brutus

#10 Gordon

I am tired of you and your cowardly tactics. Rather than attack Charles, say what you have to say, in full, and then shut up and take it like a man when we all nut you.

Gordon (or "Tordo", as tfk calls him - heheheh!) is nothing but a heckler, sniping from the peanut gallery. He doesn't even rise to the level of "troll".

Three Pillars of Wisdom
Finding our footing where lunacy looms large.

February 3, 2006

by Victor Davis Hanson
National Review Online

Public relations between the so-called West and the Islamic Middle East have reached a level of abject absurdity. Hamas, whose charter pledges the very destruction of Israel, comes to power only through American-inspired pressures to hold Western-style free elections on the West Bank. No one expected the elders of a New England township, but they were nevertheless somewhat amused that the result was right out of a Quentin Tarantino movie.

Almost immediately, Hamas's newly elected, self-proclaimed officials issued a series of demands: Israel should change its flag; the Europeans and the Americans must continue to give its terrorists hundreds of millions of dollars in aid; there will be no retraction of its promises to destroy Israel.

Apparently, the West and Israel are not only to give to Hamas some breathing space ("a truce"), but also to subsidize it while it gets its second wind to renew the struggle to annihilate the Jewish state.

All this lunacy is understood only in a larger surreal landscape. Tibet is swallowed by China. Much of Greek Cyprus is gobbled up by Turkish forces. Germany is 10% smaller today than in 1945. Yet only in the Middle East is there even a term "occupied land," one that derived from the military defeat of an aggressive power

excellent article read the whole thing...

#48 Avner.

Yes, we could do a lot better, Avner. A lot better.

Jheka, it's Friday, actually, so I'm a Kali-worshipper today! Love that skull business...

Head of the camel is in the tent, we should cut it off before we start smelling camel shit

Where was the DOS and this asshole when Andres Serrano’s Piss Christ or Chris Ofili’s dung- and pornography-encrusted Holy Virgin Mary were released as "art"?

Recommendation to the DOS: STFU.

Soooo .. since the Muslims have religion and politics sickly enmeshed .. I'm to understand that we have no right to say ANYTHING at all about these crazies? Got it ... but I'm not following that suggestion.

I'm a Conservative and I Vote.

Just when Europe may be thinking "yikes, maybe the US is right", the State dept has to go and say something like this. Farging idjits.

I don't like when people (in this case journos) use loaded phrases like "....blasts..."

It similar to, for example, someone speaking calmly saying that he is "outraged"...it is plain stupid. We can see that clearly he is not outraged, he is completely calm, so WTF?

I seem to be perpetually OT these days, can't get my schedule to jive with Charles Open Threads.

For the Sci-Fi fans, this may be on the horizon.

I also had a hard time keeping LGF today. I tried to open the comment section about the Mo Cartoon Photoshops a few posts down and it came back "page not found" then I couldnt' get back to LGF at all. I finally went to Bill Whittle's page (My secret back door to LGF when this happens) and found his new post. I got here linking from Bill's page.

Ed, if you are out there, it snowed a little this morning, big wet flakes that turned to big wet raindrops and coated the roads for rush hour traffic. Now it is all melted and very very wet.

Why can't the President reign in, or at least attempt a regime change within the State Department? What is it with the freaking State Department that has Arabist mind-control vibes all around it.

I am horrified that Gordon has a point! Can someone explain what would be required for President Bush to change the culture of State? I'm sure that the same Americans who voted Republican actually do not agree with State on this, and a lot of other matters.

I think I have to go to therapy now...

The good news is, at least one Muslim writer says the flap over the cartoons is stupid and negatively affects Islam:

Prez of Free Muslims Coalition is against the Cartoon Jihad.

The response by Muslims to the cartoons is absolutely pathetic and depressing but revealing. The reason Muslims are responding with anger and threats of violence is because most Muslims live in countries where democracy and freedom of speech are alien concepts.

It's a short column, and well worth reading the whole thing.

A bunch of mealy-mouth diplomatic doubletalk.

Doesn't stop me from laughing at and making fun of these savages.

Proceed apace, Photoshoppers!

P.S I'm sure State is very offended by Kanye West posing as Jesus on the cover of Rolling Stoned Magazine.

Um, I think we should deport all Muslims non-citizens who show signs of engaging in radical Islamic activity, and I'm all for zero immigration for Muslims, even if it hurts our institutions of higher learning.

But you can't deport American citizens. It isn't legal.

State Department missed a good chance to just keep their mouths shut.

48 Avner.
 
Extremly Dissapointed.

While I never thought Bush was for the true Israeli state, I didnt they his administration would restrict something like this

Overstated. There are no "restrictions" contemplated, just a "call" to exercise self-censorship, a call they know perfectly well will be ignored by those who have already ignored it. It's just typically hypocritical State Dept. noise to soothe the Saudis' feelings. Hardly worth reading.

#68

the elinmination of the Civil Service Act...

not likely to happen

Brit Hume did a piece on the cartoons last night and showed the cartoons. I loved it.
The Danish person he interviewed was solid free speech advocate --thought he could have been an American journalist.

I think I like these people.

I also got to see Rumsfeld's speech at the National Press Club on CSPAN. He talked about how the enemy has round-table discussions on how they can use the Western Press to their advantage. He got heckled and the moderator apologized to Rumsfeld, stating that he was sorry his first amendments rights weren't being honored. It was a refreshing speech.

COWARDS!

How can they expect us to follow them into the WOT when they are busy surrendering behind our backs?

#69 I_Invented_Al_Gore

Honestly, every time I see your nic I crack up. It's just perfect.

Does anyone know a site with a good roundup list of all the things the Muslim world has done in response to these cartoons?

I'm looking for a list with a brief description of each thing to show to people unfamiliar with the whole deal. What I have so far:

*Stormed EU headquarters in Gaza
*Tried to take hostages there
*Beat up two workers from a Danish food company
*Removed all Danish products from shelves (Nestle, e.g.)
*Bomb threat at Jyllands-Poston
*Iraq leaders stomping on Danish flag
*PA street protests
*London street protests

I'm trying to highlight the difference in outrage of Muslims to cartoons as opposed to lukewarm statements against mass murder done in the name of their religion.

I'm getting sick of these kiss ass spewings from our Government

jibe, not "jive"

rein in, not "reign in"

Friday = Trouble With Homonyms Day?

/editor mode off

#76 rayra

He's apparently black and blue from all that Satanic rock play.

#23 rightwingsparkle

We don't like it when Christ is portrayed badly why should we expect them to feel any differently?

It's not their feelings we care about. Frankly, I could give a flying pig fart what the jihadis felt about anything.

What most of us do care about, however, is how the jihadis (and virtually all of Islam based upon its noteworthy silence) respond.

Depiction of Christ in urine: we get ticked off and threaten boycotts.

Drawing of the Pedophile (spit be upon him) in any form or manner: beheadings, mass violence, calls for new 9/11's, declarations of war, etc.

The contrast between the West and the great cult is priceless.

I was going to leave a stinging rebuke at the State Department comments site, but then realized I'm waiting on my passport renewal, and you never know what kind of mischief some spiteful little shits working there might decide to do.

#81

Trouble With Homonyms Day

Maybe you're homonym-phobic?

#79

Little Green Footballs

I have my own little insulting drawing (calling it a "cartoon" stretches the definition too far):

Allah's Toes

Now here's a question for Foggy Bottomm:

What're you gonna do about it?

Saudi ocean liner sinks near Egypt, over 1000 dead.

Egyptians have refused Israeli navy offer of search/rescue.

Oh well. glug, blub, glug, pffffffttt....

#79 Silhouette

Michelle Malkin has a plethora of stories about this. Also, if you scroll far enough down the page, you'll see a piece about an "art" exhibit with a picture of Christ that resembles Bin Laden. And the resemblance is no accident.

Political correctness = the Trojan horse of our time.

"I and my Smith & Wesson have not lost MY freedom of speech. Muslims need to keep pushing and we'll see." --Angry American peasant with pitchfork.

Looks like Condi hasn't quite yet reigned in the Clintonistas in the SD.

Ed's right. The State Department's foray into the cartoon flap was unwarranted, unfortunate, and counterproductive.

I sure hope they're not exerting pressure on the Danish government to issue an apology.

#79 Silhouette:

Michelle Malkin

And every time she reports on it, she includes links to the Dirty Dozen gallery. Last I saw, there were 3 different posts on her front page with said links.

#62 el presidente'
Absolutely. Headchopping the camel would be so apropos.

#23 Rightwingsparkle

Respectfully, I couldn't possibly disagree with you more. Do you really want people who hate freedom (and the oftentimes wonderfully messy situations that freedom generates) to dictate (out of their fear and loathing of freedom ) the terms of freedom?

I don't. Here are the terms of freedom: It's free and it needs to be protected in order to stay that way. Simple. Beware of the terms of appeasement. Save appeasement for babies ready to stick a finger into a light socket. In such cases appeasement is responsible action .. but when used in order to prevent bullies from bullying ... it's irresponsible action.

Muslims have made a perfect out for themselves .. they have enmeshed religion and state .. so criticize their state and you get slammed for criticizing their (awful ... but that's another point) religion! I don't think so ...

What do you think?

This goes beyond shameful.

I’ve known for a long time that the incentives that operate on the State Department and the Foreign Service are perverse, but at this point, they’ve crossed the line. They’ve taken the side of a bunch of violent, intolerant, ignorant medieval barbarians who somehow found their way into the 21st Century against a functioning liberal democracy — and the only democracy in Europe to stand firmly against Muslim intimidation, at that.

Fire the lot of them. Prosecute the ones directly responsible for this outrage.

"“We all fully recognize and respect freedom of the press and expression BUT it must be coupled with press responsibility,” Higgins told AFP"

Yah, and commin at-ya' this GOOD FRIDAY, Britney Spears playin' a cook on a show called "Cruci-fixins" on Will & Grace. Now there's some media responsibility for ya'.

Sorry if someone else has already noted this.

Naiveté of Youth

#30:

The Foggy Bottom wobblers do not speak for me.

You mean BUSH ADMINISTRATION wobblers do not speak for me?

#23 Rightwingsparkle
I'm sorry, but I have to agree. Sure people are FREE to print what they wish, just as we are free to get angry if we don't like it, but we can still say that some things are over the line or offensive. We don't like it when Christ is portrayed badly why should we expect them to feel any differently?

Please don't make this mistake of equating Christianity with islam!

islam is a totalitarian ideology that has clear rules for how to subjugate and ultimately destroy anything that doesn't fit in islam.

This is just an excuse for them to expand their power over western culture and it's working, thanks in large part to gullible people like you.

I have one question for those who insist that the Foggy Bottom bureaucracy IS the Bush Administration: why do we have former State Department officials claiming that a "Cheney-Rumsfeld-Neocon cabal" has hijacked foreign policy?

#104 Spiny Norman

why do we have former State Department officials claiming that a "Cheney-Rumsfeld-Neocon cabal" has hijacked foreign policy?

Because it's not convenient for them at the moment.

I haven't watched Will & Grace since an episode about 2 years ago where Will runs into a guy he picked up in a bar and had sex with just a couple of weeks prior while at the gym. It is a laughing matter, you see, having one night stands with so many men you can't remember the name of someone from a week or two ago.

Now they will have their fun ridiculing Christians. Well, I don't like it, I won't watch it, enough others feel that way the rating will sink, and it will go the way of "West Wing", "Book of Daniel" and maybe "Commander in Chief".

No need to threaten, it is a free country, I can handle it.

Golly gee willickers, I'll ask this again, if Mohammad is Allah's Apostle, and Allah is all powerful, if Allah wants to, he just needs to wait for the next thunderstorm and blast any blasphemers with a lightning bolt. If that is too showy, the blasphemers can choke on a ham sandwich, or die in a massive earthquake, stampede at a religious festival, or die on an overloaded ferry that capsizes, Allah certainly doesn't need help, does he?

#89 rayra:

Are you warming up your Rayra-izing tools yet? I'll make the popcorn for the show.

"Inciting religious or ethnic hatreds in this manner is not acceptable. We call for tolerance and respect for all communities and for their religious beliefs and practices."

Gosh, what does the State Department have to say about people who insult Islam should be beheaded?

Higgins et al, you are simpletons.

#36 Gordon

Gordon, as a relatively new LGFer who still has his cherry, may I offer some advice:

1. Don’t lead with your chin
2. Say it with a smile.
3. Know what you are talking about
4. GWB is a great really great president.
5. Stop leading with your chin
6. There’s a reason we all hated that disagreeable tattle-tale snot in grade school.
7. Posting links to MSM bullshit propaganda is not a good idea.
8. Occasionally, the President has to mix with bad company. It comes with the job, so don’t yer knickers in a twist over the circumstance.
9. Keep leading with that chin & you’ll wind up mumbling like Mohammed Ali.
10. If you have to, use a stiletto.
11. Silence is golden
12. My president is an awesome president.
13. … have we talked about the chin thing yet?
14. Don’t hector. It only annoys us knuckle-draggers
15. STFD & STFU
16. Don’t mess with Texas

The State Department is part of the problem. They're not on America's side anymore.

#85 Jammie wearing Fool

Yes, be careful---we need you here, so don't jeopardize that passport!

Well, there's a story today on Michelle Malkin's site, and on Drudge Report, about a picture of Jesus as an upside-down-Osama displayed at a black art show; plenty of Christians are upset about it, but I don't hear lots of calls for respecting their sensitivities, or shutting down the show altogether or banning freedom of speech because of Christian sensitivities, or that the artist be beheaded, or stoned, or even have rotten tomatoes flung at his head.

And, if there were a Christian protest, even a very peaceful one, how long would it be before the L.A. times, the N.Y. Times and all the rest of the MSM were shrieking, "RIOTING RIGHT WING CHRISTIANS! CHRISTIANS AGAINST ART! CHRISTIANS WANT FREEDOM OF SPEECH OUTLAWED! CHRISTIANS ATTACKING THE STATE! CHRISTIAN CRUSADE AGAINST THE ARTS! CHRISTIANS THREATEN VIOLENCE!"

(And, of course, if Jews complain, say, about cartoons showing Ariel Sharon eating Palestinian babies they're told, "Oh, you Jews just complain that any criticism of Israel is anti-semetic. The world has gone nuts, the inmates are running the asylum and Americans can't rely on the State Department to stick up for them anymore.)

“These cartoons are indeed offensive to the beliefs of Muslims,”

Only to those beliefs of jihad, dhimmitude, misogeny, Jew-hatred, intolerance*, violence, ingratitude, victimhood, brutality,...

Absent the above everything's hunky-dorrey.

*Y'know, like in this incident.

Put on FOX NEWS right NOW.

Very anti-muslim content!

I posted my letter to the State Department, as well as a picture of Mohammad

So cartoons offend muslims..so what. So does a ham sandwich. What does State have to say about that.

Everyone seen the Osama as Christ painting?

[Link: wcbstv.com...]

I don't know Cato. I think jive is fluid enough to work. I was thinking of a musical jam session where someone is always off-beat. That person would be me.

Put on FOX NEWS right NOW.

Very consurvative/anti-gay content!

From an excellent Jerusalem Post commentary by Caroline Glick:

The lies we tell ourselves

At its base, the Muslim furor over the cartoons is part and parcel of their culture war against the West. The Muslims pushing the issue believe that non-Muslims ought to behave obsequiously towards all things Islamic, while the Muslims are free to demonize Jews as monkeys and pigs and accuse Christians of being idolaters. According to the rules of their culture war, if Western societies refuse to behave in accordance with their dictates, the Muslims have the right and duty to attack them.

Gordon, as a relatively new LGFer who still has his cherry, may I offer some advice:

As a seasoned LGF regular who has lurked here since February 2002 let me offer you a piece of advice:

Do not feed the trolls.

Any parent out there have two or more kids?

If one starts something, say he steals his brother's crayons, but the brother just goes off: hitting, screaming, tearing up things, and just basically pitching a fit, do you scold the first kid for inciting his brother?

Me? I doubt brother #1 would see any punishment at all as my focus would be on the fit-pitching brother for quite a while.

37 Cato.
Amen brother. These are amateur pencil drawings, in some smalltown paper in a small country, of some guy who may or may not have existed. Get over it already. Religion has got an awful lot to answer for.

Anyone care to write the State Department and remind them of "Piss Christ"?

Gordon, your point about the State Dept being part of the Bush administration is well taken and ultimately irrelevant. The people on this board don't speak for the Bush administration. Where do you stand on this issue? What should be done? Try formulating a coherent position not involving Bush for a change.

I look forward to the State Department condemning NBC for mocking Christians on Holy Week (see Will and Grace).

I was just on the State Dept site and couldn't find any references to the cartoons. Justin Higgins is listed as "PA/Press" in the directory. I don't see this as a statement of policy by Condi. In the article above, I don't see that he made anything other than a statement of fact.

Perhaps the press SHOULD be more respectful of ALL subjects related to the War on Terror --i.e. classified intelligence information.

Stewart Lee, the creator of "Jerry Springer - The Opera" has put in his two cents. Apparently "Jerry Springer - The Opera" was shown on British tv last year, resulting in a record number of complaints due to amongst other things the depiction of Jesus as a homosexual and as wearing a diaper (source).

Based on this "work of art" you would think Mr. Lee would support the cartoons now under attcked by Muslims. Think again, this is what Mr. Lee has to say:

When you satirise something, you need to at least give it the credit of understanding it. The cartoon in which the Prophet is trying to stop suicide bombers entering the afterlife because they have run out of virgins has a kind of political point behind it. But I don't think they really appreciated the massive taboo you cross by portraying the image of Muhammad. There is really no historical precedent for it.

They have tried to deal with a subject they don't know enough about, and this is one of the teething problems of the cross-over of cultures in the world. I'm sure the level of offence is far greater than would have been intended.

In Jerry Springer - The Opera, we were looking for a story that could be commonly understood in a Christian context. In the West, Christianity relinquished the right to be protective of its icons the day Virgin Mary snow globes were put up for sale at the Vatican.

But in the Islamic culture it is very different. To use a corporate image, Islam has always been a lot more conscientious about protecting its brand and as a satirist you need to engage with it on its own terms. That's what we did with Jerry Springer with the Christian religion.

From bbc.

I hate hypocrites!

#23 rightwingsparkle

You think the original 12 cartoons portrayed Mohammed badly? Did you even see them? (The real ones, I mean. And all of them, not just the one with the bomb turban.) Most of them are pretty tame.

And even if some of them did show Mohammed as violent... well, in fact, Mohammed did advocate and practice violence, conquest, enslavement of the infidel, and subjugation of women. It's right there in the Koran. Muslim religious leaders worldwide advocate the same things today. How can it be "portraying them badly" to point out their repeated public statements?

The cartoons in questions are not offensive to Muslims for portraying Mohammed badly. They are offensive to Muslims because they portray Mohammed at all, and Islam forbids any image of Mohammed. In other words, Islam is trying to impose its own religious restrictions on everyone else in the world. And you apparently are happy to submit.

No free country can allow a religious dictator, whether internal or external, to determine what speech is permissible.

"“We all fully recognize and respect freedom of the press and expression BUT it must be coupled with press responsibility,” Higgins told AFP"

This statement was made in regards to the press publishing pictures from Abu Gharib, publishing reports alleging the non existent desecration of the Koran, the publishing of secret gov't intelligence gathering programs and the exposing of other information related to the WoT, right. . well it was, . wasn't it?

102 Gordon

You know, your little rants would mean something if LGF was made up of wall-to-wall Bush worshippers. Fact is, most of the people here think Bush has got the main things right but is weak in some other areas (i.e. fiscal responsibility, Mexican border, rosy view of mainstream Islam, to name some of the more popular choices).

So Bush is carrying on the same basic State Dept. policies as previous administrations. SO WHAT? One must hold one's nose, but the policy can be defended on the grounds of (1) keeping world economies stable by keeping the oil suppliers happy; and (2) helping ensure the safety of Americans living abroad in those generally friendly Islamic countries where they do business.

So the current State Dept. operates with Bush's blessing. There, said it. I suspect that W's private sympathies are more Rumsfeldesque than the public noises of State, but I can see why things go the way they do. Bush is still a helluva lot better than the alternatives, and sometimes dead on.

The simpering pansies at State are crappin' in their panties that this (the cartoon debate) may be the straw that breaks the camel's back, if you will pardon the inevitable pun. Hello? WTF y'all been, for pete's sake? Hate to break it to you, friggin' pointy-headed, ivory-tower freaks, but if y'all thought it would take some cartoons to spark the inevitable showdown, you idiots aren't worth the office space you occupy.

I couldn't be a State Dept. spokesman.

This annoys me, but in essence, he's doing his job. His job is to do things like THANK Lybia for not shooting a bunch of Belgian nurses. Sure he's a wussy. But he's a pro wussy.

SURE, it offended Muslims. Christ in Urine offended me. The difference is, I didn't have the knee-jerk reaction of chopping off heads.

I can even understand why Muslims want to boycott. But boycotting is a serious thing to do, and two can play at that game. Me - I hardly ever fill of my gas tank. If everyone used as much gas as I do, the Saudi royals would be back in small, old, patched tents, with no more trips for the wives to Harrods.

#36 Gordon(s)

Hiya, guys! Been wondering where you've been keeping yourselves. I am pleased to inform you that his royal highness, Baldwin IV, the Leper King, Monarch of MuArae, former monarch of the Latin Kingdom of Jerusalem and Satrap of the New Holy Roman Empire is sending each and every one of you an autographed photo of himself. Feel free to be offended (and/or faint) when you see it.

He is also sending each and every one of you a copy of 10001 ARABIAN NIGHT FART JOKES. Feel free to be offended by that, too. His royal highness revels in being revolting and offensive. This is the real reason he was able to defeat Saladin; every time the latter came near Jerusalem, his royal highness would immediately scribble a cartoon of Mohammed performing erotic acts with chickens and hamsters, and jeer, "YAAAAH, YAAAAAAAH! THAT'S YOUR PROPHET, HAHAHAHAHAHA!" Saladin, being an exquisitely sensitive Moslem, always fainted, and had to be carried back to his castle.

(And if the cartoon didn't work, his majesty would then lift his face veil and threaten to give Saladin, "A great big sloppy kiss!" Drove him off every time!)

(And, now that the Gordons have shown up, and been given their gifts, I shall henceforth GAZE at them, and advise that others do the same, lest they derail another thread; this is an important subject, and we shouldn't go off-topic on it.)

Condi Rice just fell into the basement if she supports this bilge from State Department.

Say loud, Say it Proud...don't mess with freedom of speech...

The middle eastern wing in the State Dept. has shown their hand, like MSM here in States.

Witless, weak and vacillating.

If the other side wants a war over cartoons well it is time for more mockery, parody and sarcasm....we are getting under their skins thank you Lord...

This disappoints me, but I can see where they are coming from. The State Department is currently busy in Iraq, and it's politically convenient to score brownie points with Islam as Islam turns its attention to Europe.

I wouldn't worry too much.

#123 efuseakay
Anyone care to write the State Department and remind them of "Piss Christ"?

Please stop the comparisons with cases where Christians were offended! This is an entirely different beast! This holy outrage is not a spontaneous expression of hurt feelings, but part of the islamic agenda to demand respect for islam (cough, spit) from the infidels and gradually force them into submission.

#106 Ed of meteorological fame

Re: the Apostle part...well said!

#49 Laurence Simon 2/3/2006 10:14AM PST
Dear Condi,

Blow me.

Signed,
Laurence Simon
Houston, TX

Same for George.

Rag on Gordon if you want to folks, but, he's right about this being George Bush's State Department.

Yes, State is full of careerists and arabists and apologists for Islamofascism.

But, Condoleeza Rice reports directly to Bush. And Rice and Bush both have their own voices. They don't need to hide behind Mr. Higgins. If they want to reject his comments, they can do so. But, they haven't, so we can only conclude that he does speak for them.

This is chickenshit turned up to "11".

To those who posted links to my request at #79, Thank You.

I was looking for more of one list, but I can probably just do that myself then, using Malkin's posts.

not at all meant in defense of the DOS but a number a people have mentioned American artists who have done irreverent and despicable renderings in this country, asking why DOS did not comment on them....

put your thinking caps on, and you can figure this out for yourself, and most of the mentioned pieces were funded by the NEA...

you are just making your valid points of criticism look ridiculous, surely not your intent.....

just sayin'

#23 Rightwingsparkle

Plus, you have to know that this is probably a way to keep some violence from occurring.

I have to disagree. It seems you mischaracterize the root cause of the violence. The root is not 'urine on a Koran', or 'mean cartoons'; but rather a group of people so transfixed with religion that they will commit atrocious acts in the name of their god.

The best way of preventing violence is to punish those who are so eager to do violence. Walking on eggshells just postphones the confrontation.

Inciting religious or ethnic hatreds in this manner is not acceptable. We call for tolerance and respect for all communities and for their religious beliefs and practices.”

"Bin Laden our beloved. Denmark must be blown up." protestors in Ramallah chanted.
While waiting for the State Department condemnation of this incitement to ethnic hatred, I will have a cold Tuborg Gold (better than Carlsberg, but still Danish) and a ham sandwich with Lurpak butter, followed by a Danish pastry.

If the State Dept. can kiss their ass, then they can kiss my ass as well.

I hope the DOS and other Fed agencies are paying a little more attention to the Super Bowl than to Danish cartoons. This idea of equal opportunity SB sites has placed the game in a greater than normal security threat situation. The Detroit area is a major center of arab muslim population in the US. If there are al-Qaida sleeper cells in the US, my money is on the the southeast lower peninsula; not to mention dealing with the Canadien border.

I am again reminded of Rumsfeld's remarks about the ability of the enemy to use our free press against us.

Look at the article about the State Dept again. A very short article with NO author credit. Just a AFP tag. How reliable is that?

Was this a remark made to a reporter at a press conference? Were they having dinner together? Was this remark made to a reporter at all --did the AFP get it first hand? No real way to identify Justin Higgins, what is his title, why was he asked these questions? He could be a janitor for all the article tells us.

I think we'd be better able to determine the intent and meaning of the remarks if they linked to the source document or video (like the blogs do). My high school journalism teacher wouldn't have let that one go to print.

This isn't journalism, it is sensationalism, worse --propaganda that many of us, glance at, and swallow whole.

Gordon, don't be so disingenuous. You know perfectly well that the Bush Administration can't control everyting that goes on at State. And you also know that the administration includes staunch truth-tellers like Rummy, who was willing to stand up in public a few years back and say what everybody knows about the "occupied territories": they're spoils of war won in a defensive campaign against Arab aggression.

Yes, and there's such a thing as diplospeak. It's not to be confused with Bush's real opinion.

#124 Peter

Try formulating a coherent position not involving Bush for a change.

Logically impossible, for the "Gordons" out there. They have no other defensible position other than "Bush sucks", and that stance is based on childish and impish mud-slinging coupled with the frightening spectre of a wagging finger and a "nya, nya, na, nya, na" tongue protruding from ignorant lips. Time to take the cat's eye and the Barbies and slink on home, kiddies.

I have to disagree. It seems you mischaracterize the root cause of the violence. The root is not 'urine on a Koran', or 'mean cartoons'; but rather a group of people so transfixed with religion that they will commit atrocious acts in the name of their god.

It's a combinaion--not only are they WILLING to commit atrocious acts in the name of their god they are LOOKING for reasons to do so. So if someone does something "offensive", away they go.

Gordon,

Try and understand this:

If Condi approved this she's a jackass.
If Bush agrees with this, he's a jackass.

However, its hardly a revelation that the State Department is largely made up of career employees who lean left. Not the end of the world but a fact.

It isn't impossible that the careerists at State pushed this out and, once out, it would be hard for Condi or Bush to refute.

Who knows? As mentioned above, many of us here think Bush has managed the big things reasonably well. He, as well as everyone else, ain't perfect and isn't above criticism.

Maybe a leftist can't understand how one can be critical of someone without totally condemning them but most reasonable people can make these distinctions, event by event.

138 Peter Verkooijen

Good point. We must not lose track of the Islamist agenda.

We in the west absorb info from many sources and then make up our minds.

A large percentage of Muslims in the ME go to prayers and are told what to think by an imam. (I should say "men," because women aren't expected to think, unless their husbands/fathers/little brothers tell them to.)

The Muslim masses are basically brainwashed, and a large number (much larger than in other parts of the world) are illiterate or semi-literate. The Imams easily steer their possies in whatever direction they want, but the goal is not respect - it is power.

Doesn't anyone remember "give 'em an inch, they'll take a mile?" at the State Department?

Where is the statement from Condi? Lots of folks here seem to want a blow job from her, but I haven't been able to find the press release that has brought on this sudden influx of boners.

Sarah D --I am in awe of your writing abilities. You said much better than I.

Heh heh, Sarah is talking dirty again.

“We all fully recognize and respect freedom of the press and expression BUT it must be coupled with press responsibility,” Higgins told AFP. “Inciting religious or ethnic hatreds in this manner is not acceptable.

So, what Higgins is saying is that according to the U.S. State Dept. if Christians want to get a little tolerance they have to chop a few heads and/or blow up a couple of art galleries?

Do I have that parsed correctly?

Doesn't seem to be quite...American. But I realize that today's America is not the nation of my youth.

And I want to fit in. Well, maybe I don't. Haven't decided just yet.

My letter to Condi Rice (sent thru State Dept. site)

When Islam decides to separate state from religion then (and only then) will it be possible to make public commentary that is directed only to public policy. Meanwhile, it's Islam's problem to figure out. This lack of separation absolutely does not constitute a requirement for the rest of us to shut up about the disgraceful policies and actions enacted from Islam's followers. And you ought to know this and stand up for freedom above all else. Save the appeasement for babies ready to stick a finger in a light socket -- not for bullies. You empower bullies by appeasing .. and you know that .. so stop it. Additionally, the cartoons published in Denmark were, in the main, completely inoffensive. That's also true and you know it. I expect better of you.

OT: Lizard Recipe of the Week

One big steak, (any cut, Texas or Alberta beef)
black pepper
2 oz Danish blue cheese

Cover both sides of the steak with fresh ground black pepper. Grill steak to desired doneness. For the last minute, crumble the blue cheese on top, let it melt in.

Serve with a good Australian Shiraz

I have two quotes from Europeans that I happen to think are (or were) very smart people:

We are being challenged by Islam these years - globally as well as locally. It is a challenge we have to take seriously. We have let this issue float about for too long because we are tolerant and lazy.

We have to show our opposition to Islam and we have to, at times, run the risk of having unflattering labels placed on us because there are some things for which we should display no tolerance.

And when we are tolerant, we must know whether it is because of convenience or conviction.

Queen Margrethe II of Denmark

...this is the lesson: never give in, never give in, never, never, never, never - in nothing, great or small, large or petty - never give in except to convictions of honour and good sense.

Winston Churchill

#152 jjag

Maybe a leftist can't understand how one can be critical of someone without totally condemning them but most reasonable people can make these distinctions, event by event.

Well said.

It does make is harder to complete the greater goal of civilizing the Muslim world if we keep poking them in the eye with sticks.

Still, I'd prefer better than this.

#154 Sarah D.

Oh, lol. What a picture I now have in my head. My goodness. Heh.

Me? I doubt brother #1 would see any punishment at all as my focus would be on the fit-pitching brother for quite a while.

My strategy? Punish them both. They soon learn that such behavior benefits no one!

#144 Eagle

The root is not 'urine on a Koran', or 'mean cartoons'; but rather a group of people so transfixed with religion that they will commit atrocious acts in the name of their god.

Hear! Hear!

#160 Catttt

Queen Margrethe II of Denmark

God Save The Queen...wherever she might be. ;-)

"Inciting religious or ethnic hatreds in this manner is not acceptable. We call for tolerance and respect for all communities and for their religious beliefs and practices." - State Department spokesman Justin Higgins

Hey Justin, which group is inciting violence and religious hatred? A few danish cartoonists or the mobs of angry muslims chanting "Death!"?

Just sent this to Daryl Cagle at daryl@cagle.com (he operates a site for editorial cartoonists):

Dear Mr. Cagle,

You organized (or helped organize) the members of your profession to produce "Black Ink Monday" in support of one laid-off editorial cartoonist -- a worthy effort to show how corporate pursuit of profit threatens to reduce diversity of opinion on editorial pages.

I call on you now to organize a similar effort in support of the cartoonists who contributed images of the prophet Mohammed to the Danish newspaper Jyllands-Posten. The resulting firestorm of controversy is leading not to marginal erosion of freedom of speech for editorial cartoonists, but to wholesale repression and possibly even death for those who dare to touch on subjects declared "haram" by radical extremists.

I challenge you to organize a Day of the Prophet, on which members of your profession in the USA create cartoons depicting the prophet Mohammed in whatever way their conscience dictates in order to show that the free press in the United States of America cannot be controlled by religious dictates from any quarter.

Your Web site shows that you defend the right of every cartoonist of every political stripe to be read. I hope you will rise to this challenge.

Best regards,

Stuart Creque

Suggest you do the same, if you agree that it's a good idea.

Can any LGF'ers make up one of those webpages with a pre-prepared letter/statement/petition telling the State Department how we all feel about this terrible capitulation to radical Islam?

Then we could all just sign the petition and send it off to these hypocrites!

I'd do it myself if I knew how:)...

1) The Washington Post's Sunday book section featured a review of this book some time ago, illustrated by a close-up photo of a Torah scroll in which the Tetragrammaton was clearly visible. Tossing that page in the trash, as virtually every Post subscriber would do, constituted desecration of God's name. I know people who weren't happy about this, but I don't recall any boycotts, death threats, or the like.

2) This State Department response parallels the obscenity of the Roadmap. Growth of Israeli "settlements" in the West Bank and Gaza in the 1990s did not violate the Oslo Accords. However, the Palestinian Arabs deemed this a "provocation" that would make a two-state solution impossible (because of course their state was to be Judenrein), so the Mitchell Report advocated a freeze of "settlement activity" in order to avoid disrupting the "peace process." This recommendation was codified in the Roadmap, which essentially treats Israeli "settlement activity" as an incitement to violence, and thus a cause of Palestinian terrorism that must be eliminated.

Now this "mustn't get them stirred up" principle is being applied to freedom of speech and of the press in Europe. As far as I'm concerned, the Europeans, who were the driving force behind the Roadmap, are being hoisted on their own petard. IMO, they deserve it, and they will continue deserving it until they repudiate their Roadmap, endorse the right of Jews to "settle" everywhere between the river and the sea, and support Israel's right to defend its citizens by all means necessary.

#162 Pious Agnostic

It does make is harder to complete the greater goal of civilizing the Muslim world if we keep poking them in the eye with sticks.

No religion or belief system moves from this sort of violence and primitive acting out to a modern theology in less than centuries and tens of thousands of lives.

These cartoons were carefully constructed to meet the minimum offensive requirements for testing purposes. The Muslim hordes have responded as expected.

The shocking news is still the list of major institutions siding with those who choose to kill over cartoons: DoS, EU, UN, and every Arab/Muslim government on the planet. Any child born today will not die in freedom if our leaders continue to act like cowardly thieves.

#162

It does make is harder to complete the greater goal of civilizing the Muslim world if we keep poking them in the eye with sticks.

I see your point. However... If a child picks up a knife and waves it around threatening people, the first thing to do is to take away the knife; the second is to punish the child for threatening people (knife or no knife) so he/she thinks twice before doing it again at the next available opportunity. Only then do you think about civilizing the child so he/she can become a functioning adult human.

No on the strategy of being more respectful so they won't be provoked into violence.

This reaction of theirs is not within a lightyear of reasonable or proportional to the offense. Should we reward that behaviour by giving them what they want?

We can never be 'nice' enough to keep them from visiting violence on us. In one world, you show respect to get it in return. In the other, showing respect only convinces them you recognize their superiority. And the need for more respect on your part later and less on theirs.

#98 Daisy

#129 lurking faith

#144 eagle

I don't necessarily disagree with anything you guys said, but I'm not looking at it as "appeasement." I'm looking at it as common decency.

We do it all the time here. Someone says something that offends and there is an uproar and that person apologizes for offending. The person may not even regret what they wrote or said (as in the Tole cartoon, who btw will not apologize)but they are just trying to be civil.

Not to bring even more reiligon into it, but in my faith Christ teaches us to "not eat meat" around those who thought it unclean. He said it was better to not offend so that we can further the relationship and perhaps change them.

This is what it is about. If we are to change the Islamic way of thinking (I'm talking the people, not the fanatics)then we need to show respect for them. We will never win them over by offending what they hold sacred.

That is the only way we are going to win this thing...kill the fanatics and win over the people.

It's about kindness guys. It works.

Funny when did the State department start
taking sides over mere cartoons?

Watch for a new State statement from Condi or W to adjust the optics.

If not, well, we have a new ball game.

My preference is for W to set the position of the USA on this matter. It is not for the State Dept to call the shots here.

cn

#149 Cato the Elder 2/3/2006 11:01AM PST
..there's such a thing as diplospeak. It's not to be confused with Bush's real opinion.

No. "Diplospeak" is not what's called for here. What's called for is a direct, unambiguous and forceful affimation of Western freedom and unqualified rejection of the Islamists "demands".

Look at the signs these people are carrying right out in the open in Britain. "Behead/Slay those Who Insult Islam".

People are getting death threats, people are getting killed, by the same freaks for whose sensibilities Bush and Rice are so concerned.

And the reason they're using the threats is that they have been so successful up to now intimidating Westerners.

There cannot be any compromise; journalists and cartoonists have freedom in this country, and in most of the West. That's it. And Bush needs to be saying that right out in front of the White House with Rice standing right next to him.

And if that's not "Bush's real opinion" then he can choke on his "diplospeak".

#155 ggt

And not one link to a Condi press release yet. Interesting.

Wow.
At least before it was all Jews' fault.
Now it is all former free, former Christian
world who is at fault.

Hey guys, finally we are in the same boat!

And this boat is sinking.

#170 Ben F

Unfortunately, the EU doesn't connect their problems with the muslim reaction to the cartoons, or even muslim terrorism, to the Israeli-palestinian issues, unless it is to blame Israel for provoking these other situations.

Dutch semper fidelis;

Dutch Agree to Send Force to Afghanistan

The Dutch parliament decided Thursday to send up to 1,700 troops to Afghanistan as part of a NATO-led reconstruction mission, after months of intense pressure from U.S. and NATO officials.

Condi and Bush better haul Foggy Bottom's ass into the wood shed.

175 Rightwingsparkle

This is what it is about. If we are to change the Islamic way of thinking (I'm talking the people, not the fanatics)then we need to show respect for them. We will never win them over by offending what they hold sacred.

It's about kindness guys. It works.

Wrong. Appeasement rewards the fanatics.
Muslim males are encouraged to "act out". Their cultural honor/shame dynamic requires angry displays of chest-thumping and threats. If we give in to these threats, their "honor" is raised, and it gives the fanatics among them greater credibility.

The solution is to calmly and firmly state our conviction in freedom of expression. We must also point out the hypocrisy of a culture which daily prints racist & anti-semetic cartoons in its newspapers.

To the state department..You do not speak for me...this just shows me we can not co exist with these loonies..They still live in the 6th century..Time to dust off the bombers

i can see that muslims making death threats is dumb and much worse than any cartoons.

Hmm... I remember people on this website being grossly offended when art portrayed the Virgin Mary covered in shit (even tho they misinterpreted the art) and calling for that artist to be boycotted. Why can't we say that publishing these cartoons was irresponsible? It was just a PR stunt anyways. Sure they are FREE to publish these cartoons and i dont think any government or angry mob should forcibly stop them, but it still was a dumb idea to do so. It's funny how people can equivocate on this website tho.

@175 rightwingsparkle

Mebbe you can explain in clear terms exactly what it is they hold sacred? Life? Women? Children? Education? Freedom of speech? Tolerance? Grace? Joy? Celebration of beauty?
How long are we supposed to hold our breath, biting our tongues while they continue to abuse the freedoms, the laws and the cultures they move into from where they originated from.

I'm waiting to hear your cohesive answer to these questions.

Press responsibility?

Hacerse el tonto para comer a punos?

# 173 deleted? Now who's sackless?

rightwingsparkle

Maybe change your nic to WWII Neville.

Plus, you have to know that this is probably a way to keep some violence from occurring. Because that is the difference here. We show our anger by writing about it, they show it by blowing up things.

You are just wrong, wrong, wrong, moral equivalence idiot. They blow things up, we write words-same thing. WRONG!

It's cowardice.

And for State to have pulled it at the precise moment that there is some hope Europe might not be lost makes it real hard to keep a civil tongue in my head.

Anti-Christian and anti-Jew cartoons miles worse than the Danish cartoons are published daily and not a peep. But Christians and Jews don't suicide bomb.

I've let Bush and the party know -- my support directly correlates to my confidence that the Republicans aren't going to sell us into dhimmitude. This move by state effectively terminates my confidence.

When is Condi going to clean house at Foggy Bottom? She needs to reverse this Neville Chamberlain-like rhetoric coming from the entrenched career bureaucrats at State. These people--and their counterparts in the CIA (Valerie Plame, for example)--are unprincipled worms, without even enough backbone to quit an administration of which they disapprove.

# 186 quark2

"Mebbe you can explain in clear terms exactly what it is they hold sacred? Life? Women? Children? Education? Freedom of speech? Tolerance? Grace? Joy? Celebration of beauty?

Well we know they hold sacred the image of Mohammad. And the handling of the Koran. I'm not defending their way of life, far from it. I want to CHANGE them.

How long are we supposed to hold our breath, biting our tongues while they continue to abuse the freedoms, the laws and the cultures they move into from where they originated from.

Since they have believed this way for thousands of years I figure we could give them maybe more than 5 years?

189, i think he was saying that is the difference, i.e. you two actually agree. You're too blinded by the desire to be right that you can't even see ur own allies.

In retrospect, there's nothing wrong with the cartoons and they deserve to be published. I'm glad it's incited a bunch of religious idiot to behave so. All I'm saying is... while there aren't any death threats, christians in the west behave stupidly in response to some art as well.

A moronic LGFer once said:

"Anti-Christian and anti-Jew cartoons miles worse than the Danish cartoons are published daily and not a peep. But Christians and Jews don't suicide bomb."

Link me to a story where someone "suicide bombed" because of these cartoons.

#175 Rightwingsparkle

I wish you were right.

I know you are not.

You appear to be making the mistake of assuming that other people and other cultures are essentially the same as you and yours.

In the Arab culture, which underpins Islamic teachings, if the stranger gives you something he does not have to, it means he acknowledges your strength and fears you. Anything we give them will not be viewed by them as respect or kindness, but as a signal that they have power over us and can demand more. Mercy is considered a weakness.

This causes me immense problems as a Christian - I do not want to go around offending people - but in fact the only way to avoid offending Muslems is to be a good Muslem. My very existence, your very existence, as a Christian is an offense in their eyes.

I'm not going to commit suicide to make them happy.

And I'm not going to stand back and watch my religion and my civilization commit suicide, either, if I can help it.

#193

while there aren't any death threats

...Your moral equivalence nerve is twitching.

It will require an army of psychologists to sort through the intellectual damage done by whatever causes this insane knee-jerk reaction by people like you.

Rightwingsparkle @ #175: Not to bring even more reiligon into it, but in my faith Christ teaches us to "not eat meat" around those who thought it unclean. He said it was better to not offend so that we can further the relationship and perhaps change them.

No offense but that is pernicious nonsense! Christ never said anything of the sort.

Avoiding meat is a Pauline admonition. It was meant to illustrate the principle of being good examples to new Christians (who might misinterpret eating meat sacrificed to idols). Look it up.

You are standing the doctrine of Christian liberty on its head when you condemn what fundamentally empowers the Great Commandment.

All Christians are commanded to preach the Gospel. That good news includes "I am the way, the truth, and the life: no man cometh unto the Father, but by me." [John 14:16]

You can't preach the Gospel without offending Muslims.

So the message I am getting from the State department and from some of the posters here is that, if I as a Christian find something offensive, whether it be a T.V. show, a movie, a work of "art", a newspaper editorial, or statement by a politician, then I should start riots, call for cutting off the heads of those I deem responsible, burn flags and do everything within my power to cause an absolute shit-storm.

Then, and only then, the State department will condemn those who produced the T.V. Show, or showed the movie, or displayed the "art" or wrote the article because they have unacceptably "incited religious" hatreds!

Right?

Come on all you advocating appeasement, is this really the kind of behavior you want to encourage and reward? Heck, who knew that all I had to do to get my way was throw a temper tantrum? To heck with Freedom or representative democracy, to "win" all I have to do is throw a fit!

Idgits!

what more equivalence? I never said they were equal, ur ability to use buzz phrases is impressive though.

actually doing more research, the artist who made the virgin mary covered in shit did receive death threats so....

#194 cokane

You are a useless tool. Why don't you look at the Religion of Peace website ONCE? I've linked it for you when you made similar idiotic requests.

Give them time. Muslims kill for less than cartoons.

I simply can't be bothered to reply to a commenter that spells your as ur.

cokane

while there aren't any death threats, christians in the west behave stupidly in response to some art as well

That's moral equivalence, 101.11.

"Behaving stupidly" is the freedom you rely on for daily life. Don't disparage it.

Rightwingsparkle @ #192: Since they have believed this way for thousands of years I figure we could give them maybe more than 5 years?

Thousands? Just how old do you think Mohammed's cult is?

follow-up to my #195

It would be lovely if we could change them, civilize them, convince them that every human has individual dignity, and that people should be allowed to express differences of opinion openly. It's just that the more I learn and see, the less hope I have of this ever happening peacefully.

Historically, the only way to push back Islam (or just prevent it from bloody conquest) has been by sheer force. I see nothing that suggests this might change.

How do you convert or change people when their religion demands the death of anyone who converts away from it or adapts ("perverts") it?

i c so there are bombings almost every day in iraq but now, since its after the cartoon controversy, they must be connected.

plz, those ppl wanted to bomb before those cartoons came out

# 193 cokane

christians in the west behave stupidly in response to some art as well.

And by "behave stupidly" you mean they get upset at having to fund such art through their taxes and call for such funding to stop?

And that is equivalent to calling for deaths, beheadings, and jidhad?

You are engaging in nothing more than moral equivocation and comparing apples to handgrenades.

Foolishness like yours is what is going to lead our country straight into dhimmification!

And by "behave stupidly" you mean they get upset at having to fund such art through their taxes and call for such funding to stop?

Hell, I'm not Christian and it pisses ME off to have fund this trash!

#205 cokane

i c so there are bombings almost every day in iraq but now, since its after the cartoon controversy, they must be connected.

A frontal lobe is a terrible thing to waste. Here's a symple syllogism.

1. Muslims kill when they are offended.
2. Cartoons offended Muslims worldwide.
3. Christian churches were bombed just as the scandal was getting play in the Arab media.
4. Muslims bomb children after candy, hospitals, and schools. There is no rhyme or reason to senseless violence by definition.

Conclusion: it is a reasonable inference by the besieged Christians in Iraq the attacks were linked or timed with the cartoon controversy.

Second conclusion: you are incapable of higher logic functions and not worth my time.

cokane

Here is what the precious muslims, (who are just like angry Christians, right?), are saying:

'We will not accept less than severing the heads of those responsible,’

‘We will not be satisfied with protests. The solution is the slaughter of those who harmed Islam and the Prophet,’

Yep, we can work with this people if we just give them a little understanding.

/idiocy

#206 Fatal

And by "behave stupidly" you mean they get upset at having to fund such art through their taxes and call for such funding to stop?

And that is equivalent to calling for deaths, beheadings, and jidhad?

YES! That is EXACTLY the same!

/LLL apollylologists

#189 WriterMom

You are just wrong, wrong, wrong, moral equivalence idiot. They blow things up, we write words-same thing. WRONG!

I didn't read moral equivalence in Rightwingsparkle's mention of those two things; RWSparkle specified that we and they react differently. The point, if I read it correctly, was that they react with violence, and therefore mollifying words may be necessary to protect people who are in harm's way due to that reaction.

I don't like appeasement - but I do understand the desire to protect innocents who may be caught in the crossfire.

#45 Gmac

Both the State Dept and the CIA are at odds with the Bush administration.

The State Department and the CIA ARE the Bush Administration! This is the OFFICIAL POSITION OF THE BUSH ADMINISTRATION! The BUSH ADMINISTRATION agrees that European and American newspapers should censor these pictures!

@102 rightwingsparkle

Have you visited zombies website with all of the pictures of mohammed displayed? Many of them are oriental in origin. Now, you explain to me why it's okay for them to display pictures of him, but not the non moslims.
You are advocating appeasement. Your very existance as a christian is offensive to them. You planning of either doing away with yourself or converting to placate them?
There is nothing christian in your advocation of appeasement. You are advocating that we be weak, silent and bowing down to them, which encouages them to continue their abusive natures. When do you also plan to start paying jiyazah to them, since you're not a moslim? I mean after all, that would please them immensely.
I cannot believe that you would post such weak kneed advocation.

And why just another 5 years, why not give them another 1400 years to continue their violence against the rest of the world?
Apparently you did not, and do not take the
call of war in the attack of 9.11 seriously.
Whatever you advocate, and believe, we are at war with an aggressive, unloving, black hate filled ideology.

#212 Gordon

The State Department and the CIA ARE the Bush Administration!

Not so, Gord. The Bush administration is the President & his Cabinet a the few senior burocrats Bush has appointed. The CIA & State Dept. are huge buraucracies which persist through changes in administration. Bush, or any President, may attempt to control or reform a given department, but the dpartment has a mind of its own and a political establishment to go with it. The CIA's war with the Bush admin is well known by now, even by one so clueless as you.

@102 rightwingsparkle

Have you visited zombies website with all of the pictures of mohammed displayed? Many of them are oriental in origin. Now, you explain to me why it's okay for them to display pictures of him, but not the non moslims.
You are advocating appeasement. Your very existance as a christian is offensive to them. You planning of either doing away with yourself or converting to placate them?
There is nothing christian in your advocation of appeasement. You are advocating that we be weak, silent and bowing down to them, which encouages them to continue their abusive natures. When do you also plan to start paying jiyazah to them, since you're not a moslim? I mean after all, that would please them immensely.
I cannot believe that you would post such weak kneed advocation.

And why just another 5 years, why not give them another 1400 years to continue their violence against the rest of the world?
Apparently you did not, and do not take the
call of war in the attack of 9.11 seriously.
Whatever you advocate, and believe, we are at war with an aggressive, unloving, black hate filled ideology.

@211 lurking faith

Neither you nor rws seen to understand the principles of dealing with islam. You Are An Offense To Islam Through Your Very Existance.
It doesn NOT matter how YOU act in regards to their bliefs if you either do not die, pay a tax or convert.
They could care less about how respectful YOU act in regards to their ideology. They only care about your submitting to their koran or their swords.
If you cannot comprehend this, then you endanger yourselves and anyone associated with you through blind ignorance.

“We all fully recognize and respect freedom of the press and expression BUT it must be coupled with press responsibility,” Higgins told AFP.

This is an insult to every soldier and Vet that has ever fought for this country.

Inciting religious or ethnic hatreds in this manner is not acceptable. We call for tolerance and respect for all communities and for their religious beliefs and practices.”

Doesn't work when the religion is violent, intolerant and totalitarian--in other words, islam.

Go away, you dhimmy-nannies.

#216 quark2

You didn't read my other posts, did you? Certainly not #195. Go read it, and then come tell me I don't understand that Islam only respects power. I dare you.

As for #211... there I said I don't like appeasement, but do understand the impulse. That doesn't mean I agree with it.

Also, you apparently think that my statung that I don't think Rightwingsparkle was setting up a moral equivalency meant that I also agree with everything else RWSparkle said.

Read more carefully, and don't put words in my mouth. Thanks.

#211 lurking faith

I don't like appeasement - but I do understand the desire to protect innocents who may be caught in the crossfire.

But you won't protect them. That's the fallacy. You just save them for another day. The day when appeasement isn't enough.

Gordon! Haven't seen you in a while.

Now, go put your thumb in your ear and go bowling.

Okay, here's my email to State:

Justin Higgins' craven tut-tutting of the European (esp. Danish) exercise of free speech is a disgusting and unprincipled betrayal of the brave practitioners and defenders of free speech in Europe who are standing up to Muslim hypocrisy, brutality, arrogance, and vanity. I'm an outraged American. Where is the State Department's condemnation of far worse depictions of American and Jewish figures in the Arab media? Pathetic. Fire Justin Higgins.

And Gordon:

Bush is not an emperor. Unlike say Chinese Commie potentates, he cannot with a wave of his hand enlist vast ranks of civil servants in the latest campaign. We work differently in this country.

#220 ciaospirit

Dammitall, how many times do I have to say that understanding a position is not the same as agreeing with that position?

Didn't anyone here take debate classes? Logic?

I expect better on this blog...

#212 nodroG

Stomp your feet and hold your breath to make your rants true!

/We need smarter trolls.

#211 lurking faith

I don't like appeasement - but I do understand the desire to protect innocents who may be caught in the crossfire.

No amount of apologies is going to make Islam's latest excuse for homicidal rage go away. You can join dhimmis like Bill Clinton, the UN, EU, and State Department, or you can remain a free person.

Hey, everybody!

I've e-mailed this to Charles, but I don't know if he'll get to it, or care, so...

Who is Justin Higgins?
Who is Janelle Hironimus?
Who is Kurtis Cooper?

All three of these people have been quoted as presenting the State Department quotes Charles posted for this thread. Verbatim.
Janelle Hironimus linky
Kurtis Cooper linky

So the question is, did State give a bunch of people the exact same paper and send them all out to talk to reporters? Or is somebody faking this?

I'm betting they're all spouting the party line - in which case, those of you suggesting this isn't an official statement are (sadly) mistaken.

#226 lurking faith

If the CIA is rogue, which it is, what makes you think State Department careerists give a damn what the POTUS thinks?

If, on the other hand, Bush supports this position (unlike nodroG) I will adjust my thinking to reality.

#225 Beagle

Are you teasing me, or do I have to snap at you, too?

If the latter, see my #223.
See also my #219.
And then if you're still not convinced I'm not a dhimmi, see also my #195.

/Sheesh.

State is and has and will always been arabist, as is Condi:a speech made in Paris 8 Feb. 2005.

...Third, we are working to achieve new successes, particularly in the Arab-Israeli diplomacy. America and Europe both support a two-state solution: An independent and democratic Palestinian state living side by side in peace with the Jewish State of Israel.

And we all support the process of reform in the Palestinian Authority, because democratic reform will enlarge the basis for a genuine peace. That is why we were supportive of the Palestinian people in their historic election on January 9.

And Europe and America support the Israeli Government's determination to withdraw from Gaza and parts of the West Bank. We both see that withdrawal as an opportunity to move ahead -- first to the roadmap, and ultimately, to our own -- to our clear destination: a genuine and real peace.

We are acting to transform opportunity into achievement. I have just come from meetings with Prime Minister Sharon and President Abbas. I was impressed with the fact that they said the same thing: This is a time of opportunity and we must not lose it. I urged them to build on this momentum, to seize this chance. And today's meeting of the Palestinian and Egyptian Presidents, the Israeli Prime Minister, and Jordan's King was clearly an important step forward.

The United States and the parties have no illusions about the difficulties ahead. There are deep divisions to overcome. I emphasized to both sides the need to end terrorism; the need to build new and democratic Palestinian economic, political, and security institutions; the need for Israel to meet its own obligations and make the difficult choices before it; and, the need for all of us -- in America, in Europe, in the region -- to make clear to Iran and Syria that they must stop supporting the terrorists who would seek to destroy the peace that we seek.

Success is not assured, but America is resolute. This is the best chance for peace that we are likely to see for some years to come; and we are acting to help Israelis and Palestinians seize this chance. President Bush is committed. I am personally committed. We must all be committed to seizing this chance....

Read whole piece of crap. Israel's trouble started in the Rose Garden with Bubba,the arabs' best friend:Bill Clinton Praised by Iran, Arabs

Ex-president Bill Clinton is winning high praise throughout the Arab world for his recent comments condemning anti-Muslim bias and urging dialogue with Hamas - with even Iranian newspapers touting his go-slow approach to that country's nuclear threat.Citing Clinton's comments as a constructive alternative to President Bush's dire warnings, the state-run Iran News agency reported Thursday:

"Former U.S. President Bill Clinton recently opined that America had done injustice to the Iranian people by overthrowing the democratically elected government of nationalist prime minister Dr. Mohammad Mossadeq through a CIA-orchestrated coup in 1954. Furthermore, Clinton urged the U.S. government to engage Iran and added that the only way to resolve the nuclear dispute is through negotiations."

In the last few weeks, the ex-president has gone out of his way to try to downplay comments from Iranian President Mahmoud Ahmadinejad that Israel should be "wiped off the map."......

....Clinton warned Israel not to act unilaterally when reacting to terrorist threats, saying that "true peace and security can only come through principled compromise."

see all of it. And Shrillery the arab lover also wants to be President? G-d help us all.

Shabbat shalom.

No more cheese danish for the State Department! Let them eat croissant!

#228 lurking faith

Those who understand those who would surrender freedom of expression don't interest me right now. If you think you can bother me with some stupid insult, think again.

Quit defending stupid cowards. What you wrote is dhimmitude.

See also Dangerous Diplomacy : How the State Department Threatens America's Security
by Joel Mowbray

If the United States State Department wonks want to represent other countries, they should go and work for those countries.

For crying out loud, how long is a government supposed to last when its agencies act against it? It's a practical matter. You can't have groups like the CIA and State Department acting against your interests, especially when they're acting in the interests of your enemies.

Unless, of course, you're the kind of people who think that those who want to brutalize anyone who is "insensitive" to them are NOT our enemies.

In which cas eyou are lost, and I hope one day you find your way back.

The United States may be a flawed champion, but we're the only ones who can do the job. Make productive criticism if you like, but get behind us if you want to live with any sort of freedom.

P.S. Siding with the enemy every chance you get is not "productive criticism." Try, just once, suggesting some way to deal with the problem that 1) may be better than what we're doing, 2) isn't transparently based on vain hopes, and 3) isn't past-tense.

#76 Rayra: I guess you are the Bush Administration's "kept man."

Along with Charles, of course.

Beagle
I said I didn't think a particular poster was making a moral equivalency.
I said I understood a position, not that I supported it. Perhaps I should have made the not supporting it part clearer.

As for defending someone else's dhimmi statements, I wasn't. I was saying that a previous poster shouldn't be attacked for something they did not say, but in fact had said the opposite (though not clearly).

I just like clarity in my arguments.

And I wasn't insulting you. I may have been a bit snotty, since you were the second person in quick succession to misunderstand my post in the same way. But if I were trying to insult you, I'd either be a lot more clever or a lot more childish.

We all fully recognize and respect freedom of the press and expression but it must be coupled with press responsibility. Inciting religious or ethnic hatreds in this manner is not acceptable. We call for tolerance and respect for all communities and for their religious beliefs and practices.”

NO

D. Edgren

#232 TerpMole

I've read that book. Very scary.

By the way, I think the Mohammed cartoons should be published in EVERY newspaper in the United States.

I'm appalled that the BUSH ADMINISTRATION doesn't value the freedom of speech and the press that is a hallmark of Western Civilization. Muslim societies need to emulate us, not protest, riot, and God knows what else they will do.

And I'm happy to see that the LGF community also values freedom of speech and freedom of the press.

Oops, Rayra doesn't. He wants to jail a lot of citizens and journalists for sedition and treason. Along with much of the rest of the LGF community.

Hypocrites.

It's been such fun arguing with everybody - when will I ever learn not to clarify what someone else posted? - but I've gotta run.

Friday and all that.

Wow Rayra, I wrote my #234 before I read your Bush brown-nosing pile of typed doggy doo in #120. You really are either a fool or a knave.

#125 Rayra:

I'd bitchslap you into next week, for what you deliberately regularly attempt to do here, given the opportunity.

If I actually showed up at your door, you'd probably go hide on the potty with the bathroom door locked.

@238 Nodrogs

"And I'm happy to see that the LGF community also values freedom of speech and freedom of the press.

Oops, Rayra doesn't. He wants to jail a lot of citizens and journalists for sedition and treason. Along with much of the rest of the LGF community."

How many of you were posting this?

To those that are saying, "...not to worry, this is just the State Dept being pragmatic" I say:

You abandon your allies (and your principles), soon you will have neither.

#197 Terp mole,

You are quite right, it was Paul who actually said it. But being that the Bible is the inspired word of God, then God actually said it, didn't he?....;-)

But my point still stands. It was,as you say, an example of how Christians are to act.

#189 WriterMom,

I said that was the DIFFERENCE. I do not think at all it is the same thing. Good Grief.

I have to laugh at some of you saying that I want appeasement. If you read my blog you would know that I certainly do not. Which is why I said "kill the fanatics" that would include all those holding signs shown at Zombie's site.

I KNOW we must exterminate the fanatics. That is without question. But there are over a BILLION Muslims. Most of them are not terrorists. We must find a way to live on this earth with them and hopefully find a way for them to see how great freedom is.

I understand that their culture is nothing like ours. But we can hardly expect them to try and understand our culture if we don't try and understand theirs.

#244 quark 2

Actually, they had to call in a whole new team of "Gordons" to post that, since the first all fainted dead away when they saw the photos of the lovely visage of moi that I sent them!

/Channeling Baldwin IV, that highly offensive, but devious, Leper King.

Gordon:

And I'm happy to see that the LGF community also values freedom of speech and freedom of the press.

Oops, Rayra doesn't. He wants to jail a lot of citizens and journalists for sedition and treason. Along with much of the rest of the LGF community."

What kind of mealy-mouthed argument is that? Those two positions are NOT mutually exclusive.

It is entirely possible to value "freedom of speech and freedom of the press", while at the same time believing such freedoms have limitations (Just ask the U.S. Supreme Court , you are the pre-law Gordon, right?). You are aware, aren't you, that ALL of our so-called "Constitutional Rights" are LIMITED rights?

Such limitations could legitimately include speech that is seditionist or treasonist.

Wow, its so sad to see someone so bereft of the capacity to honestly apply logic. This is the same someone who believes they can actually make it into, let alone graduate from, law school.

@256 rightwingsparkle
That's not the way you came across in your previous post.
And just why is it all our responsibility to do all the understanding?
Have you ever read any of the Suras or hadiths that are the tenements of islam?
Mebbe we should also try to understand the school bully after he's beaten the crap out of us too.
Have you witnessed any tolerance or understanding on the part of these extremists?
And how are you going to ascertain who is the good guy and the bad guy? By word of mouth?
Your separate posts are ironical.

gordon still thinks the Swift boat vets were lying and he will prove it as soon as kerry reveils his military records ( you know , the ones kerry promised he was going to make public ) BUT DID'NT

visitorstay, you still supporting Bush & State? I'm so disappointed in our so called leadership.

253 spam spam spam spam

I'm so disappointed in our so called leadership.

Why?

#254 mich-again

Monty Python he ain't..take a look at the LGF..first post. Hmmm, I wonder it he is a previously banned one who managed to register under multiple nics, using different email addys.

Rightwingsparkle said...

I KNOW we must exterminate the fanatics. That is without question. But there are over a BILLION Muslims. Most of them are not terrorists.

Well if you mean by MOST as gretaer than 50%, that still might be a matter of debate about DEGREE of fanaticism. I'd wager there are at least 100+ million that are just plain deadly.

Oh, BTW, you can kill a billion+ people. But it's not going to be us making the first move and my coscience will be clear.

Toying With Genocide

#248 Rightwingsparkle
"I understand that their culture is nothing like ours. But we can hardly expect them to try and understand our culture if we don't try and understand theirs."

We do understand their culture. And that's after a lot of trying, head-scratching, denial tears, rage and finally - acceptance (and then more rage).

Do you happen to have grown up with adult alcoholics in charge of the household? If so, I guarantee you, there's help. ACOA meetings. Give them a try .. 6 to start are suggested ... I'm quite serious.

# 194 Cokane

I'll reply *once* despite your quoting me without the courtesy of addressing me and tossing in a gratuitous smear.

Your query:

"Link me to a story where someone "suicide bombed" because of these cartoons."

Simply go to the front page here, at Michelle Malkins, or countless other sites at this point to view the numerous threats of violence.

Or to make myself clear (as it appears that is necessary) you have managed to couple your projection of your own intellectual shortcomings AND confirm it though your lack of even the most basic knowlege all at one time!

Slick move.

I guess it is OK for the NYT to to print anti-American propaganda as a news story.