North Korean Cyber Assault

Technology • Views: 2,443

Since July 4th, major websites in the US and South Korea have been under attack by “a hostile group or government.”

SEOUL, South Korea — Cyberattacks that have crippled the Web sites of several major American and South Korean government agencies since the July 4th holiday weekend appear to have been launched by a hostile group or government, South Korea’s main government spy agency said on Wednesday.

Although the National Intelligence Service did not identify whom they believed responsible, the South Korean news agency Yonhap reported that the spy agency had implicated North Korea or pro-North Korea groups.

A spokesman at the intelligence agency said it could not confirm the Yonhap report, which said that the spy agency briefed lawmakers about their suspicions on Wednesday. The opposition Democratic Party accused the spy agency of spreading unsubstantiated rumors to whip up support for a new anti-terrorism bill that would give it more power.

Access to at least 11 major Web sites in South Korea — including those of the presidential Blue House, the Defense Ministry, the National Assembly, Shinhan Bank, the mass-circulation daily newspaper Chosun Ilbo and the top Internet portal Naver.com — have crashed or slowed down to a crawl since Tuesday evening, according to the government’s Korea Information Security Agency.

On Wednesday, some of the sites regained service, but others remained unstable or inaccessible.

In an attack linked with the one in South Korea, 14 major Web sites in the United States — including those of the White House, the State Department and the New York Stock Exchange — came under similar attacks, according to anti-cyberterrorism police officers in Seoul.

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236 comments
1 MrSilverDragon  Wed, Jul 8, 2009 10:19:24am

And here I thought it was all the streaming Michael Jackson coverage slowing everything down.

2 Baier  Wed, Jul 8, 2009 10:19:28am

Is this an act of war?

3 Creeping Eruption  Wed, Jul 8, 2009 10:20:10am

re: #1 MrSilverDragon

And here I thought it was all the streaming Michael Jackson coverage slowing everything down.

Maybe they off’d Jackson?

4 MandyManners  Wed, Jul 8, 2009 10:20:26am

Could this be the problem with Sharmuta’s, Kilgore’s and Walter’s computer connections?

5 LC LaWedgie  Wed, Jul 8, 2009 10:20:35am

All your bandwidth belong to us.

6 Kenneth  Wed, Jul 8, 2009 10:20:48am

Kim junior downloading too much porn?

7 MandyManners  Wed, Jul 8, 2009 10:20:59am

re: #3 Creeping Eruption

Maybe they off’d Jackson?

No. That was done by the Iranians to distract us from what they’re doing.

8 lawhawk  Wed, Jul 8, 2009 10:21:55am

I’d say that these would constitute acts of war, but wasn’t Obama supposed to be unleashing a new era of friendship and coprosperity avoiding such unpleasantries?

9 Creeping Eruption  Wed, Jul 8, 2009 10:22:13am

re: #7 MandyManners

No. That was done by the Iranians to distract us from what they’re doing.

PIMF. Got my dictatorships mixed up for a second.

10 Kosh's Shadow  Wed, Jul 8, 2009 10:22:32am

If you really want to get scared, consider that much of the networking hardware is made in China. If they wanted to put “back doors” in it, we might never know, until they shut down the equipment.

11 Baier  Wed, Jul 8, 2009 10:23:09am

re: #8 lawhawk

I’d say that these would constitute acts of war, but wasn’t Obama supposed to be unleashing a new era of friendship and coprosperity avoiding such unpleasantries?

I think we’re going to find out how far you can push until Obama considers something an act of war. I fear that line may involve mass casualties.

12 NJDhockeyfan  Wed, Jul 8, 2009 10:23:23am

Obama must be ‘deeply concerned.’

13 scottishbuzzsaw  Wed, Jul 8, 2009 10:23:44am

re: #10 Kosh’s Shadow

If you really want to get scared, consider that much of the networking hardware is made in China. If they wanted to put “back doors” in it, we might never know, until they shut down the equipment.

Well, that’s comforting.
/

14 Kronocide  Wed, Jul 8, 2009 10:23:49am

Maybe they should unclench that keyboard.

15 Shug  Wed, Jul 8, 2009 10:23:55am

Let me finish my pr0n

16 latingent  Wed, Jul 8, 2009 10:24:06am

re: #2 Baier

Is this an act of war?

Not to Obama. KJ is just a useless dictator kept in his box. And ignoring him seems to be our new Nork policy. Dangerous game Barry is playing here.

17 MandyManners  Wed, Jul 8, 2009 10:24:12am

re: #9 Creeping Eruption

PIMF. Got my dictatorships mixed up for a second.

It’s hard to keep them straight at times.

18 Shug  Wed, Jul 8, 2009 10:24:35am

is the TOTUS OK ?

19 ointmentfly  Wed, Jul 8, 2009 10:24:39am

Can’t we unleash a few thousand US hackers on them? So what if they still use the abacus and communicate with smoke signals….

20 MandyManners  Wed, Jul 8, 2009 10:25:01am

re: #18 Shug

is the TOTUS OK ?

I’d love to hack that thing.

21 Baier  Wed, Jul 8, 2009 10:25:06am

re: #12 NJDhockeyfan

Obama must be ‘deeply concerned.’

Oh boy, the strawman is giong to really get it this time.

22 Creeping Eruption  Wed, Jul 8, 2009 10:25:12am

re: #18 Shug

is the TOTUS OK ?

I heard a little image burn, but otherwise will make a full recovery/

23 WinterCat  Wed, Jul 8, 2009 10:25:14am

Great, now cyber attacks. And what has been done about the missile tests that were launched on the 4th? Anything? A UN resolution banning N Korea from testing more missiles to back up previous resolutions banning more missile tests?

24 calvin coolidge  Wed, Jul 8, 2009 10:25:57am

Hey Kim Jong, you can hack all the government websites you want but if you attack LGF then it’s personal.

25 LC LaWedgie  Wed, Jul 8, 2009 10:25:58am

re: #19 ointmentfly

I’ve always wondered what happened to all those VIC20s.

26 sattv4u2  Wed, Jul 8, 2009 10:26:06am

“North Korea , they’re just a tiny country , They don’t pose a serious threat to us the way the Soviet Union posed a threat to us,”


Got a PLAN “B” there, Barry ?

27 MrSilverDragon  Wed, Jul 8, 2009 10:26:23am

re: #10 Kosh’s Shadow

If you really want to get scared, consider that much of the networking hardware is made in China. If they wanted to put “back doors” in it, we might never know, until they shut down the equipment.

Speaking as someone who deals with networking hardware on a daily basis, the bigger worry is the counterfeit hardware that comes from China. For the most part, large vendors (Juniper, Cisco) are very vigilant about the hardware and code that goes into that equipment. As for knock-offs (I’ve seen plenty of them), you’re taking a big gamble putting that into your network, not only for back doors, but other factors like fire hazards.

Routers catching fire is a very, very bad thing.

28 Shug  Wed, Jul 8, 2009 10:26:35am

Good Evening Professor Falkin…….

29 scottishbuzzsaw  Wed, Jul 8, 2009 10:26:39am

re: #20 MandyManners

I’d love to hack that thing.

If we hear BHO say “Go piss up a rope!” we’ll know who to thank!

30 FurryOldGuyJeans  Wed, Jul 8, 2009 10:26:41am

re: #4 MandyManners

Could this be the problem with Sharmuta’s, Kilgore’s and Walter’s computer connections?

I know my DSL connection was extremely twitchy until late last night, and as soon as I saw reports about this cyber attack I suspected Qwest was getting ht and hit hard.

31 [deleted]  Wed, Jul 8, 2009 10:26:44am
32 VioletTiger  Wed, Jul 8, 2009 10:26:44am

I find it interesting that we always have a spokesperson who insists it was really nothing, no big deal.
I suppose they have to maintain that front, but I don’t find it trivial. It could be practice for some real damage some day.

33 latingent  Wed, Jul 8, 2009 10:26:53am

re: #26 sattv4u2

“North Korea , they’re just a tiny country , They don’t pose a serious threat to us the way the Soviet Union posed a threat to us,”

Got a PLAN “B” there, Barry ?

Never had a plan `A`.

34 sattv4u2  Wed, Jul 8, 2009 10:27:09am

re: #19 ointmentfly

Can’t we unleash a few thousand US hackers on them? So what if they still use the abacus and communicate with smoke signals….

try again. Some of the top students at places like MIT and Georgia Tech are North Koreans, Iranians and Chinese

35 LGoPs  Wed, Jul 8, 2009 10:27:22am

But, but…..but, I thought everyone in the world was nice and all we needed to do was stop being such big bullies and cowboys.
/

36 Creeping Eruption  Wed, Jul 8, 2009 10:27:27am

re: #28 Shug

Good Evening Professor Falkin…….

Would you like to play a game?

37 Walter L. Newton  Wed, Jul 8, 2009 10:27:55am

What the article doesn’t really tell me is hot “deep” into these agencies systems did this DOS really amount to?

When I worked for the DOE at NREL, or “public” web site was in no way associated with our “daily business” servers.

I suspect that this didn’t actually dig into the servers that actually contain sensitive data.

Many government agencies use public hosting companies to host their public pages.

I mean, it’s not good that anyone is fussing with anyones servers, but I question the threat here.

38 sattv4u2  Wed, Jul 8, 2009 10:28:04am

re: #33 latingent

Never had a plan `A`.

yes he did , Plan “A” was meet unconditionally!

39 Mad Al-Jaffee  Wed, Jul 8, 2009 10:28:05am

re: #12 NJDhockeyfan

Obama must be ‘deeply concerned.’

He might write a strongly worded letter to them. Or tell them they have a time out.

40 subsailor68  Wed, Jul 8, 2009 10:28:19am

re: #28 Shug

Good Evening Professor Falkin…….

LOL!

Hello, Joshua.
Strange game.
The only winning move is not to play.
How about a nice game of chess?

41 FurryOldGuyJeans  Wed, Jul 8, 2009 10:28:20am

re: #32 VioletTiger

I find it interesting that we always have a spokesperson who insists it was really nothing, no big deal.
I suppose they have to maintain that front, but I don’t find it trivial. It could be practice for some real damage some day.

I have noticed that the administration spokespeople seem to be emphasizing the things that are trivial, and trying to minimized that which could be critical and credible. Makes me think no one had a fucking clue about things.

42 Buster  Wed, Jul 8, 2009 10:28:22am

re: #28 Shug

Good Evening Professor Falkin…….

Too bad they are not just looking for “a nice game of Chess”…

43 [deleted]  Wed, Jul 8, 2009 10:28:47am
44 Gearhead  Wed, Jul 8, 2009 10:29:01am
45 JammieWearingFool  Wed, Jul 8, 2009 10:29:27am

Obama plans to go on primetime television tonight to congratulate the Norks for their technological advances while offering to disarm lest we offend their delicate sensibilities.

46 Gearhead  Wed, Jul 8, 2009 10:29:48am

re: #12 NJDhockeyfan

Obama must be ‘deeply concerned.’

Could defending ourselves be construed as “meddling”?

47 MandyManners  Wed, Jul 8, 2009 10:29:49am

re: #24 calvin coolidge

Hey Kim Jong, you can hack all the government websites you want but if you attack LGF then it’s personal.

I’d hafta’ give that sawed-off runt a piece of my mind.

48 Walter L. Newton  Wed, Jul 8, 2009 10:29:58am

re: #41 FurryOldGuyJeans

I have noticed that the administration spokespeople seem to be emphasizing the things that are trivial, and trying to minimized that which could be critical and credible. Makes me think no one had a fucking clue about things.

It could be trivial, see my re: #37 Walter L. Newton

49 laZardo  Wed, Jul 8, 2009 10:29:58am

That explains why I can’t access 4chan.

Wait.

Oh God. The “revenge” will be exciting.

50 albusteve  Wed, Jul 8, 2009 10:30:01am

re: #32 VioletTiger

I find it interesting that we always have a spokesperson who insists it was really nothing, no big deal.
I suppose they have to maintain that front, but I don’t find it trivial. It could be practice for some real damage some day.

not trivial at all….maybe it’s a dry run for something far worse

51 latingent  Wed, Jul 8, 2009 10:30:05am

re: #38 sattv4u2

yes he did , Plan “A” was meet unconditionally!

Well, its not working. Check out Rasmussen, the `O` is rolling downhill….fast!

52 MandyManners  Wed, Jul 8, 2009 10:30:24am

re: #29 scottishbuzzsaw

If we hear BHO say “Go piss up a rope!” we’ll know who to thank!

spew

53 FurryOldGuyJeans  Wed, Jul 8, 2009 10:30:27am

re: #44 Gearhead

Headline from a couple weeks ago:

North Korea Threatens Nuclear Fire Shower Against The United States

Add in the attention now being focused on li’l Kim’s failing health, and we really are living in “interesting” times.

54 sattv4u2  Wed, Jul 8, 2009 10:30:28am

re: #45 JammieWearingFool

Obama plans to go on primetime television tonight to congratulate the Norks for their technological advances while offering to disarm lest we offend their delicate sensibilities.

And offer the NorKs Japan as a show of the new America!

55 Cheesehead  Wed, Jul 8, 2009 10:30:38am

re: #34 sattv4u2

Are you sure? I didn’t think North Koreans were even allowed to study in the U.S. and then return to North Korea.

56 [deleted]  Wed, Jul 8, 2009 10:30:52am
57 debutaunt  Wed, Jul 8, 2009 10:30:56am

re: #8 lawhawk

I’d say that these would constitute acts of war, but wasn’t Obama supposed to be unleashing a new era of friendship and coprosperity avoiding such unpleasantries?

Our prosperity is being shipped elsewhere.

58 LGoPs  Wed, Jul 8, 2009 10:30:59am

I don’t care about any of this……unless they interrupt American Idol. That will make me fighting mad.
/// 52% voter mode off

59 MandyManners  Wed, Jul 8, 2009 10:31:24am

re: #30 FurryOldGuyJeans

I know my DSL connection was extremely twitchy until late last night, and as soon as I saw reports about this cyber attack I suspected Qwest was getting ht and hit hard.

I had a small problem yesterday but I figure it’s just a regular thing.

60 laZardo  Wed, Jul 8, 2009 10:31:25am

OT

Bodies from the plane that crashed in the Comoros last week have washed up on…and I’m not making this up:

Mafia Island.

61 Stuart Leviton  Wed, Jul 8, 2009 10:31:52am

re: #34 sattv4u2

try again. Some of the top students at places like MIT and Georgia Tech are North Koreans, Iranians and Chinese

North Koreans, Iranians and Chinese, oh my.
Let’s go find the lizard of oz.

62 MrSilverDragon  Wed, Jul 8, 2009 10:31:53am

re: #56 buzzsawmonkey

The “O” is, symbolically, the rock of Sisyphus.

You hit a Homer with that one, Buzz.

63 FurryOldGuyJeans  Wed, Jul 8, 2009 10:31:54am

re: #51 latingent

Well, its not working. Check out Rasmussen, the `O` is rolling downhill….fast!

I actually heard someone out loud say they are regretting their vote for the O back in November. Did add they would probably still vote for him again since “the Republican are such big crooks and liars”.

64 latingent  Wed, Jul 8, 2009 10:32:16am

re: #56 buzzsawmonkey

The “O” is, symbolically, the rock of Sisyphus.

That would make someone close to him a `Nymph`.

65 sattv4u2  Wed, Jul 8, 2009 10:32:19am

re: #55 Cheesehead

Are you sure? I didn’t think North Koreans were even allowed to study in the U.S. and then return to North Korea.

positive. About 5 years ago we (at work) hosted some interns from Georgia Tech who were from China, Iran and No. Korea amongst other places

66 Kenneth  Wed, Jul 8, 2009 10:32:27am

Jong Woon Songs Spread on July 8th Anniversary

North Korea Intellectuals Solidarity (NKIS) reported on the 7th that the North Korean authorities have begun spreading songs about Kim Jong Woon as part of an idolization campaign for the rumored future leader, songs like “Gallant Step” and “Swift Military-first Horse, Spread Your Wings!”

I wonder, is “Swift Military-first Horse, Spread Your Wings!” available on iTunes yet?

67 LGoPs  Wed, Jul 8, 2009 10:32:49am

re: #62 MrSilverDragon

You hit a Homer with that one, Buzz.

I think you mythspoke……..

68 sattv4u2  Wed, Jul 8, 2009 10:33:18am

re: #64 latingent

That would make someone close to him a `Nymph`.

Hillary !


GGAAAHHHH!

69 Mad Al-Jaffee  Wed, Jul 8, 2009 10:33:22am

re: #67 LGoPs

I think you mythspoke……..

That one really styx

70 Creeping Eruption  Wed, Jul 8, 2009 10:33:42am

re: #56 buzzsawmonkey

The “O” is, symbolically, the rock of Sisyphus.

Boy will he have a hard time explaining to Michelle where he picked that up.

Sisyphus? I thought you said Syphilis. May bad./

71 FurryOldGuyJeans  Wed, Jul 8, 2009 10:34:15am

re: #59 MandyManners

I had a small problem yesterday but I figure it’s just a regular thing.

I was being squashed starting Friday; having to manually go in and software reconnect to my ISP. Saturday, Sunday, and Monday I just gave up since it would take 15 minutes to connect for 12 seconds of surfing.

72 SixDegrees  Wed, Jul 8, 2009 10:34:38am

re: #2 Baier

Is this an act of war?

We’re already at war with North Korea.

73 subsailor68  Wed, Jul 8, 2009 10:34:52am

re: #66 Kenneth

Jong Woon Songs Spread on July 8th Anniversary

I wonder, is “Swift Military-first Horse, Spread Your Wings!” available on iTunes yet?

It’s kind of a catchy little number:

I went to the desert on a Swift Military-first Horse, Spread Your Wings with no name.

Yep, a real toe-tapper.

;-)

74 albusteve  Wed, Jul 8, 2009 10:36:05am

re: #72 SixDegrees

We’re already at war with North Korea.

a complaint will be sent to the UN…all’s well

75 JohnnyReb  Wed, Jul 8, 2009 10:36:41am

A year or so ago the Chinese launched a cyber attack of all places at the Navy War College. Took those guys over two weeks to recover from it. Basically they had to pull the plug and start over from what I heard.

These things are getting to be more frequent and more damaging all the time. Seems they are on an accelerating pace in the last year or so.

76 Shug  Wed, Jul 8, 2009 10:37:00am

I heard the Russians are demanding that Michelle Obama wear a shawl, as part of the Arms reduction package

77 Gearhead  Wed, Jul 8, 2009 10:37:07am

What is a “Military-first Horse”, and is there a Military-second Horse?

78 Stuart Leviton  Wed, Jul 8, 2009 10:37:07am

While we are not to wish death to a person - such as Kim Jong-II - no one ever said we can’t hope his computer crashes. I hope he uses Microsoft.

79 FurryOldGuyJeans  Wed, Jul 8, 2009 10:37:10am

re: #73 subsailor68

It’s kind of a catchy little number:

I went to the desert on a Swift Military-first Horse, Spread Your Wings with no name.

Yep, a real toe-tapper.

;-)

Considering the people that advance in American Idol (no, I don’t watch the retched show but I have acquaintances that keep me WELL informed about the “news”) and their blatant lack of talent, maybe this will be a hit with the culturally devoid people that obsess over such trash.

80 Mithrax  Wed, Jul 8, 2009 10:37:18am

re: #73 subsailor68

It’s kind of a catchy little number:

I went to the desert on a Swift Military-first Horse, Spread Your Wings with no name.

Yep, a real toe-tapper.

;-)

Probably still better than “Wildfire” :P

81 LGoPs  Wed, Jul 8, 2009 10:37:45am

re: #75 JohnnyReb

A year or so ago the Chinese launched a cyber attack of all places at the Navy War College. Took those guys over two weeks to recover from it. Basically they had to pull the plug and start over from what I heard.

These things are getting to be more frequent and more damaging all the time. Seems they are on an accelerating pace in the last year or so.

Reconnaissance probes

82 Gearhead  Wed, Jul 8, 2009 10:37:47am

re: #67 LGoPs

I think you mythspoke……..

You guys are making me Iliad.

83 sattv4u2  Wed, Jul 8, 2009 10:37:48am

re: #74 albusteve

a complaint will be sent to the UN…all’s well

And it was so urgent, the courier wasn;t sent to the UN building. He dropped the message off at Tavern At The Green to be sure a UN honcho would get it!

84 SixDegrees  Wed, Jul 8, 2009 10:37:59am

re: #10 Kosh’s Shadow

If you really want to get scared, consider that much of the networking hardware is made in China. If they wanted to put “back doors” in it, we might never know, until they shut down the equipment.

On the plus side, China and the US are now so intricately bound economically that things would already have to be really, really, really bad before China launched such an attack; they’d be slashing their own wrists from an economic standpoint.

North Korea, on the other hand, has no such problem.

85 FurryOldGuyJeans  Wed, Jul 8, 2009 10:38:19am

re: #75 JohnnyReb

A year or so ago the Chinese launched a cyber attack of all places at the Navy War College. Took those guys over two weeks to recover from it. Basically they had to pull the plug and start over from what I heard.

These things are getting to be more frequent and more damaging all the time. Seems they are on an accelerating pace in the last year or so.

And the people that are supposedly the best at fighting this are getting reamed by it all.

86 Mithrax  Wed, Jul 8, 2009 10:38:43am

re: #82 Gearhead

You guys are making me Iliad.

Pun threads are a great Oddessy.

But then again, we’re all just a bunch of argonauts on the great see of the internet :P

87 Shug  Wed, Jul 8, 2009 10:39:22am

Al Gorgon

88 laZardo  Wed, Jul 8, 2009 10:39:26am

re: #72 SixDegrees

We were always at war with North Korea.

/subtle jab at moonbatspeak

//also, aren’t we still technically at war?

89 realwest  Wed, Jul 8, 2009 10:39:49am

I wonder if some US intel agencies do the same sort of thing to China, Russia, Iran and Nork?
I know I’m a tech tard, but I know the folks at the NSA are most assuredly NOT.

90 MrSilverDragon  Wed, Jul 8, 2009 10:39:58am

re: #86 Mithrax

Pun threads are a great Oddessy.

But then again, we’re all just a bunch of argonauts on the great see of the internet :P

Persephone.

Not a pun, I just like the name. :)

91 Beach Lover  Wed, Jul 8, 2009 10:40:03am

good news…FNC just announced in OH, the One’s poll #’s have dropped from 62% to 49% since May! Of course, the dem talking head said its because he has inherited this mess and that message isnt getting out there!
really
I wouldnt kid you

92 laZardo  Wed, Jul 8, 2009 10:40:03am

re: #73 subsailor68

It felt good to be out of the nuclear firey rain, because out there, you can’t remember your name.

93 JohnnyReb  Wed, Jul 8, 2009 10:40:19am

re: #81 LGoPs

Reconnaissance probes


I am not convinced 100% of that yet, but it is possible. It seems that more and more attacks are for money or information. Just this week that county in Kentucky got hacked for a couple of hundred thousand bucks. That one traced back to Russia I think. There have been tons of those reports too. Data compromised, personal information stolen, stuff like that.

94 Kenneth  Wed, Jul 8, 2009 10:40:23am

Meanwhile, in that other part of the Axis of Evil:

Mousavi got a big boost over the weekend from an important group of senior clerics in the holy city of Qom. They branded the “elections” and the new government that will shortly be sworn in, as illegitimate. This is a serious matter, leading Stanford’s Professor Abbas Milani to say “This crack in the clerical establishment, and the fact they are siding with the people and Moussavi, in my view is the most historic crack in the 30 years of the Islamic republic.” They are also explicitly siding with Mousavi, who released a detailed critique/expose of the fraud that confirmed Ahmadinezhad in office.

So Khamenei is under pressure, and he is not well equipped to deal with it. He has a serious cancer, and takes opiates to mitigate the pain. People around him are whispering that his decisions are poorly reasoned and often impulsive, and some of those close to him, including his son, are apparently issuing orders in his name. This sort of rumor is devastating for the sort of personal rule upon which the Islamic Republic rests. We’ll see in the coming days if the Mousavi forces are able to maintain and increase the pressure, and how Khamenei and his henchmen respond.

At the moment, there is evidence of some panic, as Iranian leaders are exporting their wealth.

You know the ship is sinking when your own rats are jumping.

95 LGoPs  Wed, Jul 8, 2009 10:40:48am

re: #86 Mithrax

Pun threads are a great Oddessy.

But then again, we’re all just a bunch of argonauts on the great see of the internet :P

that’s a scylla thing to say…….

96 Gearhead  Wed, Jul 8, 2009 10:40:49am

re: #86 Mithrax

Pun threads are a great Oddessy.

But then again, we’re all just a bunch of argonauts on the great see of the internet :P

Don’t be Scylla…

97 VioletTiger  Wed, Jul 8, 2009 10:41:12am

re: #82 Gearhead

You guys are making me Iliad.

It’s Odyssey so many puns this early in the day.

98 doppelganglander  Wed, Jul 8, 2009 10:41:15am

re: #91 Beach Lover

good news…FNC just announced in OH, the One’s poll #’s have dropped from 62% to 49% since May! Of course, the dem talking head said its because he has inherited this mess and that message isnt getting out there!
really
I wouldnt kid you

Or, just maybe, people in Ohio aren’t as stupid as their 2008 voting habits would lead you to believe.

99 Mithrax  Wed, Jul 8, 2009 10:41:20am

re: #95 LGoPs

re: #96 Gearhead

One second apart, damn you guys are good.

100 debutaunt  Wed, Jul 8, 2009 10:41:34am

re: #91 Beach Lover

good news…FNC just announced in OH, the One’s poll #’s have dropped from 62% to 49% since May! Of course, the dem talking head said its because he has inherited this mess and that message isnt getting out there!
really
I wouldnt kid you

Well, it is funny!

101 Gearhead  Wed, Jul 8, 2009 10:41:39am

re: #95 LGoPs

that’s a scylla thing to say…….

It’s like we’re all wired in to the same pun uber-mind.

102 lawhawk  Wed, Jul 8, 2009 10:42:07am

re: #97 VioletTiger

So, the sirens are going off in your head ‘eh?

103 realwest  Wed, Jul 8, 2009 10:42:17am

re: #91 Beach Lover
Hey there {Beach Lover} - I don’t suppose it could have anything at all to do with Ohio’s economic situation, could it?
And with ABC giving him a “news conference” with……..ABC from the WH, and with ALL THE DAMN primetime news conferences he’s had, how could his message NOT get out there?

104 sattv4u2  Wed, Jul 8, 2009 10:42:19am

re: #84 SixDegrees

On the plus side, China and the US are now so intricately bound economically that things would already have to be really, really, really bad before China launched such an attack; they’d be slashing their own wrists from an economic standpoint.

North Korea, on the other hand, has no such problem.

welll , depends on how much China is willing to allow them to do. If these “attacks” ARE coming from North K and it starts impacting US commerce (which then will impact China commerce)

105 sattv4u2  Wed, Jul 8, 2009 10:42:28am

BBIAB

106 MrSilverDragon  Wed, Jul 8, 2009 10:42:31am

re: #97 VioletTiger

It’s Odyssey so many puns this early in the day.

It’s a shame some of the puns are Rex.

107 LGoPs  Wed, Jul 8, 2009 10:43:25am

re: #101 Gearhead

It’s like we’re all wired in to the same pun uber-mind.

Betcha can’t get charybdis into this thread? I sure as hell can’t.
:)

108 VioletTiger  Wed, Jul 8, 2009 10:43:35am

re: #91 Beach Lover

good news…FNC just announced in OH, the One’s poll #’s have dropped from 62% to 49% since May! Of course, the dem talking head said its because he has inherited this mess and that message isnt getting out there!really
I wouldnt kid you


Criminy, they tell us every day that he inherited this mess.
Perhaps the chickens are finally coming home to roost.

109 Beach Lover  Wed, Jul 8, 2009 10:43:52am

re: #98 doppelganglander

Or, just maybe, people in Ohio aren’t as stupid as their 2008 voting habits would lead you to believe.

may this be the start of the “enlightenment era”

110 JohnnyReb  Wed, Jul 8, 2009 10:43:55am

re: #94 Kenneth

Meanwhile, in that other part of the Axis of Evil:


You know the ship is sinking when your own rats are jumping.

Sounds pretty much like Germany in the last few months of the war. Eerily similar, the hiding of the wealth and making decisions in the dictators name.

111 Kragar  Wed, Jul 8, 2009 10:43:57am

re: #107 LGoPs

Betcha can’t get charybdis into this thread? I sure as hell can’t.
:)

Quit being so scylla

112 albusteve  Wed, Jul 8, 2009 10:44:31am

re: #91 Beach Lover

good news…FNC just announced in OH, the One’s poll #’s have dropped from 62% to 49% since May! Of course, the dem talking head said its because he has inherited this mess and that message isnt getting out there!
really
I wouldnt kid you

is there a message?….what does the message say? or didn’t he eblabberate?

113 Kenneth  Wed, Jul 8, 2009 10:44:40am

Tehran Jange Iran Election Video

114 Shug  Wed, Jul 8, 2009 10:44:43am

Obama’s fiscal policy is the golden fleece

115 LGoPs  Wed, Jul 8, 2009 10:45:01am

re: #111 Kragar (Proud to be Kafir)

Quit being so scylla

Stop being so agamemnontive

116 laZardo  Wed, Jul 8, 2009 10:45:01am

re: #91 Beach Lover

good news…FNC just announced in OH, the One’s poll #’s have dropped from 62% to 49% since May! Of course, the dem talking head said its because he has inherited this mess and that message isnt getting out there!

Or maybe it’s because some of the people they went to poll actually were dead. ;D

117 FurryOldGuyJeans  Wed, Jul 8, 2009 10:45:03am

re: #104 sattv4u2

welll , depends on how much China is willing to allow them to do. If these “attacks” ARE coming from North K and it starts impacting US commerce (which then will impact China commerce)

China is stuck because they are swamped with US debt bonds that are rapidly becoming worthless thanks to our government’s spending gluttony, and their desire to become a world economic power by denigrating the US dollar.

118 LatinGent  Wed, Jul 8, 2009 10:45:03am

re: #68 sattv4u2

Hillary !

GGAAAHHHH!

Brain bleach by the gallon, breakfast is boiling…need tums.

119 ~Fianna  Wed, Jul 8, 2009 10:45:08am

I do wonder where it would be coming from. If the Chinese are involved we have a serious issue.

I didn’t think that NORK could do it alone because I don’t think they have the resources.

120 Spare O'Lake  Wed, Jul 8, 2009 10:45:16am

re: #82 Gearhead

You guys are making me Iliad.

You Odysseus when we really get rolling.

121 lawhawk  Wed, Jul 8, 2009 10:45:20am

re: #111 Kragar (Proud to be Kafir)

Time to Circe the wagons…

122 realwest  Wed, Jul 8, 2009 10:45:29am

re: #108 VioletTiger

Criminy, they tell us every day that he inherited this mess.
Perhaps the chickens are finally coming home to roost.

Well with that noted statesman Al Franken now sworn in, the Democrats completly control the WH and both Houses of Congress. It’s gonna be difficult, even with the help of the MSM for them to keep blaming this on Bush.

123 albusteve  Wed, Jul 8, 2009 10:45:35am

re: #114 Shug

Obama’s fiscal policy is the golden fleece

or the Trojan Horse

124 NJDhockeyfan  Wed, Jul 8, 2009 10:45:36am

OT:

Today is Consecutive Integer Day.

125 FurryOldGuyJeans  Wed, Jul 8, 2009 10:45:46am

re: #114 Shug

Obama’s fiscal policy is the golden fleece

*DING-DING-DING*

126 Creeping Eruption  Wed, Jul 8, 2009 10:45:47am

re: #89 realwest

I wonder if some US intel agencies do the same sort of thing to China, Russia, Iran and Nork?
I know I’m a tech tard, but I know the folks at the NSA are most assuredly NOT.

Pentagon is opening a cyberwarfare department.

127 Gearhead  Wed, Jul 8, 2009 10:45:50am

re: #107 LGoPs

Betcha can’t get charybdis into this thread? I sure as hell can’t.
:)

I was going to, but I lost Minerva.

128 SixDegrees  Wed, Jul 8, 2009 10:45:56am

re: #91 Beach Lover

good news…FNC just announced in OH, the One’s poll #’s have dropped from 62% to 49% since May! Of course, the dem talking head said its because he has inherited this mess and that message isnt getting out there!
really
I wouldnt kid you

How can the “message” not be getting out there, when 0 makes a minimum of one public speech per day that are slavishly covered by every media outlet?

129 VioletTiger  Wed, Jul 8, 2009 10:45:56am

re: #102 lawhawk

So, the sirens are going off in your head ‘eh?

Yes, I can’t tell a lyre.

130 laZardo  Wed, Jul 8, 2009 10:46:22am

re: #113 Kenneth

Straight outta Qom-ton, dawg.

131 subsailor68  Wed, Jul 8, 2009 10:46:22am

Okay, you pun guys are hitting ‘em out of the park. Won’t even try to compete. But, I could toss in a Dorothy Parker classic.

She was asked to use the word “horticulture’” in a sentence. She thought about it for a minute, then said,

“You can lead a horticulture, but you can’t make her think.”

A martini or two with her would have been great fun!

132 Creeping Eruption  Wed, Jul 8, 2009 10:46:28am

re: #123 albusteve

or the Trojan Horse

First comes the Trojan. It is used as you are bent over and fleeced.

133 Beach Lover  Wed, Jul 8, 2009 10:46:50am

re: #103 realwest

Hey there {Beach Lover} - I don’t suppose it could have anything at all to do with Ohio’s economic situation, could it?
And with ABC giving him a “news conference” with……..ABC from the WH, and with ALL THE DAMN primetime news conferences he’s had, how could his message NOT get out there?

that’s my point…its dropping because it FINALLY IS getting out there. that dem was dim
{real} :-)

134 FurryOldGuyJeans  Wed, Jul 8, 2009 10:47:26am

re: #128 SixDegrees

How can the “message” not be getting out there, when 0 makes a minimum of one public speech per day that are slavishly covered by every media outlet?

The words are being heard, but the message is not being understood.

A quote from an acquaintance that is most likely bucking for First Prophet of Obama in Seattle.

135 Kragar  Wed, Jul 8, 2009 10:48:05am

re: #115 LGoPs

Stop being so agamemnontive

Only if you quit being so Odysseus

136 albusteve  Wed, Jul 8, 2009 10:48:14am

re: #128 SixDegrees

How can the “message” not be getting out there, when 0 makes a minimum of one public speech per day that are slavishly covered by every media outlet?

quite so…he’s admitting some sort of failure it seems to me

137 Eowyn2  Wed, Jul 8, 2009 10:48:19am

re: #26 sattv4u2

“North Korea , they’re just a tiny country , They don’t pose a serious threat to us the way the Soviet Union posed a threat to us,”


Got a PLAN “B” there, Barry ?


Evidently he has never heard of “Little Country Syndrome”

138 realwest  Wed, Jul 8, 2009 10:48:50am

re: #119 ~Fianna

I do wonder where it would be coming from. If the Chinese are involved we have a serious issue.

I didn’t think that NORK could do it alone because I don’t think they have the resources.


Precisely. But I still don’t see what the Chinese have to gain from any of this; their economy is so intertwined with ours that damaging us really HURTS the Chinese as well.
I STILL think it goes back to Russia.

139 LGoPs  Wed, Jul 8, 2009 10:49:06am

re: #135 Kragar (Proud to be Kafir)

Only if you quit being so Odysseus

There are Menelaus to these puns

140 Spare O'Lake  Wed, Jul 8, 2009 10:49:44am

re: #135 Kragar (Proud to be Kafir)

Only if you quit being so Odysseus

You’re Jason your own tail.

141 realwest  Wed, Jul 8, 2009 10:49:49am

re: #126 Creeping Eruption
The Pentagon is just starting to do this NOW!

142 MrSilverDragon  Wed, Jul 8, 2009 10:49:54am

re: #137 Eowyn2

Evidently he has never heard of “Little Country Syndrome”

Or perhaps the movie “The Mouse that Roared”.

143 doppelganglander  Wed, Jul 8, 2009 10:50:00am

re: #107 LGoPs

Betcha can’t get charybdis into this thread? I sure as hell can’t.
:)

I put the baby in the charybdis morning but she wouldn’t sleep.

144 LGoPs  Wed, Jul 8, 2009 10:50:09am

re: #135 Kragar (Proud to be Kafir)

Only if you quit being so Odysseus

Dont be croesus.

145 Eowyn2  Wed, Jul 8, 2009 10:50:28am

re: #91 Beach Lover

good news…FNC just announced in OH, the One’s poll #’s have dropped from 62% to 49% since May! Of course, the dem talking head said its because he has inherited this mess and that message isnt getting out there!
really
I wouldnt kid you

you can fool all of the people some of the time
you can fool some of the people all of the time
you cannot fool all of the the people all of the time

146 MrSilverDragon  Wed, Jul 8, 2009 10:50:56am

re: #145 Eowyn2

you can fool all of the people some of the time
you can fool some of the people all of the time
you cannot fool all of the the people all of the time

That’s what the fluoride in the water is for!

/

147 Creeping Eruption  Wed, Jul 8, 2009 10:51:04am

re: #141 realwest

The Pentagon is just starting to do this NOW!

Scary, huh?

148 LGoPs  Wed, Jul 8, 2009 10:51:11am

re: #140 Spare O’Lake

You’re Jason your own tail.

Stop Hectoring him

149 Buster  Wed, Jul 8, 2009 10:51:17am

re: #72 SixDegrees

We’re already at war with North Korea.

Aren’t we at Police Action with North Korea?

150 Beach Lover  Wed, Jul 8, 2009 10:51:24am

re: #112 albusteve

is there a message?….what does the message say? or didn’t he eblabberate?

I assume you are being funny….but just in case. He was implying (with a straight face, no less) the message that it was inherited from Bush wasnt getting out there!

151 subsailor68  Wed, Jul 8, 2009 10:51:26am

re: #144 LGoPs

Dont be croesus.

Still can’t think of any puns. Midas well give up I guess.

152 sattv4u2  Wed, Jul 8, 2009 10:51:29am

re: #138 realwest

Precisely. But I still don’t see what the Chinese have to gain from any of this; their economy is so intertwined with ours that damaging us really HURTS the Chinese as well.
I STILL think it goes back to Russia.

With all the other sabre rattling the North is doing, I beleive they are doing this alone, without the consent of the Chinese and without the help of the Russians. Yes, North Korea is an impovrished country EXCEPT for the upper echelon’s of political and military, including cyber space

153 realwest  Wed, Jul 8, 2009 10:51:36am

Well y’all it’s been grand but I gotta go do some chores now.
Hope you all have a great day and that I get the chance to see you all down the road.

154 debutaunt  Wed, Jul 8, 2009 10:51:59am

re: #131 subsailor68

Okay, you pun guys are hitting ‘em out of the park. Won’t even try to compete. But, I could toss in a Dorothy Parker classic.

She was asked to use the word “horticulture’” in a sentence. She thought about it for a minute, then said,

“You can lead a horticulture, but you can’t make her think.”

A martini or two with her would have been great fun!


“I’ve never been a millionaire, but I know I’d be darling at it.”

155 Kragar  Wed, Jul 8, 2009 10:52:11am

I dont get a lot of these puns. They’re all Greek to me.

156 Creeping Eruption  Wed, Jul 8, 2009 10:52:14am

re: #151 subsailor68

Still can’t think of any puns. Midas well give up I guess.

I won’t even touch that one.

157 BlueCanuck  Wed, Jul 8, 2009 10:52:18am

re: #148 LGoPs

Stop Hectoring him

Oh we will harpies away on this.

158 Eowyn2  Wed, Jul 8, 2009 10:52:46am

re: #135 Kragar (Proud to be Kafir)

Only if you quit being so Odysseus

Its all Greek to me.

159 FurryOldGuyJeans  Wed, Jul 8, 2009 10:52:49am

re: #136 albusteve

quite so…he’s admitting some sort of failure it seems to me

Six months in and all they have is failure to point to. The next 3+ years is going to be a roller coaster.

160 LGoPs  Wed, Jul 8, 2009 10:52:54am

re: #157 BlueCanuck

Oh we will harpies away on this.

I’ll be back in a minataur…….

161 laZardo  Wed, Jul 8, 2009 10:53:34am

re: #149 Buster

Aren’t we at Police Action with North Korea?

Fuck y-….well…not really.

/i imagine it gets pretty ronery up there

162 LGoPs  Wed, Jul 8, 2009 10:53:37am

re: #151 subsailor68

Still can’t think of any puns. Midas well give up I guess.

Put a muffler on it…..
:)

163 SixDegrees  Wed, Jul 8, 2009 10:53:47am

re: #134 FurryOldGuyJeans

The words are being heard, but the message is not being understood.

A quote from an acquaintance that is most likely bucking for First Prophet of Obama in Seattle.

I think the problem may be that the message is being heard - and understood - loud and clear. And the more people hear about it - and look around themselves and see the results of what has been done so far - the less favorably it’s received.

Ever wonder why everything this Administration attempts has to be done in such a hurry? Biden, today, said that it is “crucial” to pass health care reform “right away.” In other words, limit debate and shove it through for a vote before word gets out on what’s really contained in the proposal.

It was sort of interesting that Biden got stuck with this task. It’s as though 0 was passing the buck to his underling so he can start distancing himself from the work, and what may be it’s failure. Apparently, the kiddies at DK and DU are pissed at the slow progress one of their favorite Socialist causes is making, and they fired up the Web this week to light a fire under it.

164 Kenneth  Wed, Jul 8, 2009 10:53:58am

re: #141 realwest

They were working on cyberwarfare before, defensive & offensive, but now it is being put under a distinct Cyberwarfare Command.

165 ~Fianna  Wed, Jul 8, 2009 10:53:58am

re: #138 realwest

Precisely. But I still don’t see what the Chinese have to gain from any of this; their economy is so intertwined with ours that damaging us really HURTS the Chinese as well.
I STILL think it goes back to Russia.

If it does, Putin and his sock puppet are more dangerous than we’re currently giving them credit for.

The Georgia invasion was very, very disturbing. I thought then that it might signal a change in the tone of relations between the US and Russia, and not for the better.

/hi, the 80s called and wants its cold war back. Please respond immediately.

166 Creeping Eruption  Wed, Jul 8, 2009 10:53:58am

re: #160 LGoPs

I’ll be back in a minataur…….

I thought you would be bacus in a minataur, but maybe thats just me.

167 razorbacker  Wed, Jul 8, 2009 10:54:05am

This can’t be an act of war.

You can’t type code with a clenched fist, so it’s all good.

168 scottishbuzzsaw  Wed, Jul 8, 2009 10:54:27am

re: #154 debutaunt

“I’ve never been a millionaire, but I know I’d be darling at it.”

“If all the girls who attended the Yale prom were laid end to end, I wouldn’t be a bit surprised.”

169 Afrocity  Wed, Jul 8, 2009 10:54:28am

Hello lizards, just popping in to say hello. Chicago is a cold 62 degrees, not much of a summer.

I am also sick of seeing pictures of the Obama’s traveling across the globe with entourage and grandma wearing fashionable clothes and dining in best places while everyone back home are living hand to mouth.

170 doppelganglander  Wed, Jul 8, 2009 10:54:29am

re: #150 Beach Lover

I assume you are being funny….but just in case. He was implying (with a straight face, no less) the message that it was inherited from Bush wasnt getting out there!

I give it about another month before it dawns on a majority of people that blaming Bush is not a recovery plan. Six months in, they’ll start realizing things are getting worse, not better, and there’s only one person responsible for that.

171 Eowyn2  Wed, Jul 8, 2009 10:54:31am

re: #140 Spare O’Lake

You’re Jason your own tail.

Aaaarrrggggh oh not to be you.

172 Shug  Wed, Jul 8, 2009 10:54:46am

re: #145 Eowyn2

you can fool all of the people some of the time
you can fool some of the people all of the time
you cannot fool all of the the people all of the time

He’s hoping he can fool 50.1% of the people Nov 2012

173 Spare O'Lake  Wed, Jul 8, 2009 10:54:50am

re: #148 LGoPs

Stop Hectoring him

Fine, but then don’t complain when we all go to Helena hand basket.

174 MrSilverDragon  Wed, Jul 8, 2009 10:55:03am

re: #171 Eowyn2

Aaaarrrggggh oh not to be you.

Internet win!

175 lawhawk  Wed, Jul 8, 2009 10:55:04am

re: #135 Kragar (Proud to be Kafir)

That’s your Achilles Heel.

176 Shug  Wed, Jul 8, 2009 10:55:18am

re: #172 Shug

He’s hoping he can fool 50.1% of the people Nov 2012

actually, fool 48% of the people and have ACORN cheat his way to 50.1%

177 FurryOldGuyJeans  Wed, Jul 8, 2009 10:55:29am

re: #172 Shug

He’s hoping he can fool 50.1% of the people Nov 2012

Or at least steal enough votes to make that number.

178 LGoPs  Wed, Jul 8, 2009 10:55:32am

re: #166 Creeping Eruption

I thought you would be bacus in a minataur, but maybe thats just me.

Somebody needs to priam away from these puns……

179 doppelganglander  Wed, Jul 8, 2009 10:55:44am

re: #169 Afrocity

Hi, Afrocity! I will trade you 86 degrees with 48% humidity.

180 BlueCanuck  Wed, Jul 8, 2009 10:55:54am

re: #169 Afrocity

Afternoon Afrocity. Enjoying this lovely May weather?

181 laZardo  Wed, Jul 8, 2009 10:56:25am

Headin’ to bed. Cheers!

I leave you with this lovely little musical number related to this and the previous thread.

182 Gearhead  Wed, Jul 8, 2009 10:56:31am

We better stop these puns or Charles is gonna Remus.

183 ~Fianna  Wed, Jul 8, 2009 10:56:47am

re: #141 realwest

The Pentagon is just starting to do this NOW!

Here’s the big problem, and it’s happening throughout the economy: older people control the money and the business plans. Younger people control IT and cybersecurity. It’s really hard to explain why this is serious, why it needs to be done and what it all really means.

Working in IT means that people only pay any attention to what you’re doing when something goes wrong. Trying to make the pitch for spending to fix a problem that is very complex and hard to understand is not easy.

Mr. Fianna once worked for a telecom company where the CEO didn’t know how to use email. His secretary read his mail and printed out what was important. It’s still more common than you think.

184 Eowyn2  Wed, Jul 8, 2009 10:56:48am

re: #169 Afrocity

Hi Kid, haven’t seen you for awhile.
Glad to see you pop in now and again.

185 VioletTiger  Wed, Jul 8, 2009 10:56:59am

re: #169 Afrocity

Hello lizards, just popping in to say hello. Chicago is a cold 62 degrees, not much of a summer.

I am also sick of seeing pictures of the Obama’s traveling across the globe with entourage and grandma wearing fashionable clothes and dining in best places while everyone back home are living hand to mouth.


Hey Afrocity,

Great job with your blog. Haven’t had a chance to comment, but read it.

186 debutaunt  Wed, Jul 8, 2009 10:57:07am

re: #168 scottishbuzzsaw

“If all the girls who attended the Yale prom were laid end to end, I wouldn’t be a bit surprised.”

“I might repeat to myself slowly and soothingly, a list of quotations beautiful from minds profound - if I can remember any of the damn things.”
- Dorothy Parker

187 MandyManners  Wed, Jul 8, 2009 10:57:23am

re: #160 LGoPs

I’ll be back in a minataur…….

Hold your horse.

188 Mad Al-Jaffee  Wed, Jul 8, 2009 10:57:29am

re: #144 LGoPs

Dont be croesus.

What the hera’s going on with this thread? Medusay it’s an interesting one.

189 Creeping Eruption  Wed, Jul 8, 2009 10:57:34am

re: #178 LGoPs

Somebody needs to priam away from these puns……

I know, I am having a hard time not Troying with them.

190 FurryOldGuyJeans  Wed, Jul 8, 2009 10:57:37am

re: #169 Afrocity

Hello lizards, just popping in to say hello. Chicago is a cold 62 degrees, not much of a summer.

I am also sick of seeing pictures of the Obama’s traveling across the globe with entourage and grandma wearing fashionable clothes and dining in best places while everyone back home are living hand to mouth.

Morning, beautiful lady, long time no see. Keep your head down with the rain of lead happening in the city, please.

191 jvic  Wed, Jul 8, 2009 10:58:04am

re: #61 Ben Hur

Why do we publicize it?

In a perfect world, security issues would be kept secret. In the real world, secrecy is a golden opportunity for incompetence and waste.

There’s no perfect solution.

192 scottishbuzzsaw  Wed, Jul 8, 2009 10:58:26am

re: #186 debutaunt

“I might repeat to myself slowly and soothingly, a list of quotations beautiful from minds profound - if I can remember any of the damn things.”
- Dorothy Parker

“Brevity is the soul of lingerie.”

193 BlueCanuck  Wed, Jul 8, 2009 10:58:59am

re: #182 Gearhead

We better stop these puns or Charles is gonna Remus.

Well, it was finally enough greek. Aeneid-ed to go roman.

194 Kenneth  Wed, Jul 8, 2009 10:59:02am

Did the Toppling of Saddam Hussein Lead to Recent Events in Iran?

Given the connections between Iraq and Iran, it’s not as unlikely as it sounds.
By Christopher Hitchens

The most exciting and underreported news of the past few weeks in Iran has been that the emerging challenger to the increasingly frantic and isolated “Supreme Leader” Ayatollah Ali Khamenei is former President Ali Akbar Hashemi Rafsanjani. And Rafsanjani has recently made a visit to the city of Najaf in Iraq to confer with Ayatollah Ali Husaini Sistani, a long-standing opponent of the Khamenei doctrines, as well as meeting in the city of Qum with Jawad al-Shahristani, who is Sistani’s representative in Iran. It is this dialectic between Iraqi and Iranian Shiites that underlies the flabbergasting statement issued from Qum last weekend to the effect that the Ahmadinejad government has no claim to be the representative of the Iranian people.

It’s not unlikely Hitch, it’s a certainty. The Iranian people see a democratic plural society rising in Iraq, with Shia in a leading role. It’s no wonder they are now rising against the mullah’s dictatorship in Iran.

195 LGoPs  Wed, Jul 8, 2009 10:59:11am

BBIAW

196 Mad Al-Jaffee  Wed, Jul 8, 2009 10:59:42am

re: #193 BlueCanuck

Well, it was finally enough greek. Aeneid-ed to go roman.

These puns make me feel like I’ve been to Helen back. We’ll need Ajax to clean up here.

197 Mad Al-Jaffee  Wed, Jul 8, 2009 11:00:12am

re: #169 Afrocity

Good to see you!

198 debutaunt  Wed, Jul 8, 2009 11:00:32am

re: #192 scottishbuzzsaw

“Brevity is the soul of lingerie.”

“I’m never going to be famous. My name will never be writ large on the roster of Those Who Do Things. I don’t do any thing. Not one single thing. I used to bite my nails, but I don’t even do that any more. “

199 Buster  Wed, Jul 8, 2009 11:00:39am

re: #181 laZardo

He is a better singer than I remembered

200 SixDegrees  Wed, Jul 8, 2009 11:00:40am

re: #141 realwest

The Pentagon is just starting to do this NOW!

Well, they’re just starting to put all their efforts into the hands of a single entity. There have been all kinds of cyber-security initiatives over the years, both offensive and defensive, conducted by the different branches and by several different agencies. What’s being proposed currently is simply a reorganization into one source. But there’s a huge pool of expertise and existing techniques and hardware already in place.

201 Dahveed  Wed, Jul 8, 2009 11:01:09am

OT~

The UN High Commissioner for Human Rights (what a joke!) expects Israel to dismantle the barrier between Israel and the West Bank and pay reparations.

Apparently protecting one’s own citizens from people that mean to kill you is contradictory to human rights.

202 Creeping Eruption  Wed, Jul 8, 2009 11:02:37am

re: #201 Dahveed

OT~

The UN High Commissioner for Human Rights (what a joke!) expects Israel to dismantle the barrier between Israel and the West Bank and pay reparations.

Apparently protecting one’s own citizens from people that mean to kill you is contradictory to human rights.

Only if they are Jews …only if the are Jews. Sigh …

203 Gearhead  Wed, Jul 8, 2009 11:02:45am

re: #193 BlueCanuck

Well, it was finally enough greek. Aeneid-ed to go roman.

There is a noticeable Mediterranean bias. I hope the Northern Europeans aren’t Thor.

204 Mad Al-Jaffee  Wed, Jul 8, 2009 11:03:34am

re: #203 Gearhead

There is a noticeable Mediterranean bias. I hope the Northern Europeans aren’t Thor.

Loki here - this has gone far enough!

205 ~Fianna  Wed, Jul 8, 2009 11:03:34am

re: #152 sattv4u2

With all the other sabre rattling the North is doing, I beleive they are doing this alone, without the consent of the Chinese and without the help of the Russians. Yes, North Korea is an impovrished country EXCEPT for the upper echelon’s of political and military, including cyber space

I’m still not sure they have the tech. They don’t even appear to have an assigned IP range ([Link: www.dayomon.net…]

Wiki confirms that there is no internet per se in NORK ([Link: en.wikipedia.org…] - it looks like most of it runs through satellite and hard lines to China and other countries.

They’d need help to pull something like this off, I think. I doubt they have enough internet-enabled people in country to have developed the skillset to do this.

206 ~Fianna  Wed, Jul 8, 2009 11:04:23am

re: #27 MrSilverDragon

Speaking as someone who deals with networking hardware on a daily basis, the bigger worry is the counterfeit hardware that comes from China. For the most part, large vendors (Juniper, Cisco) are very vigilant about the hardware and code that goes into that equipment. As for knock-offs (I’ve seen plenty of them), you’re taking a big gamble putting that into your network, not only for back doors, but other factors like fire hazards.

Routers catching fire is a very, very bad thing.

My favorite error message is still “lp0 on fire”

207 Creeping Eruption  Wed, Jul 8, 2009 11:05:52am

re: #204 Mad Al-Jaffee

Loki here - this has gone far enough!

O, what a Din it would cause to cut off the punning.

208 ~Fianna  Wed, Jul 8, 2009 11:06:08am

re: #41 FurryOldGuyJeans

I have noticed that the administration spokespeople seem to be emphasizing the things that are trivial, and trying to minimized that which could be critical and credible. Makes me think no one had a fucking clue about things.

I’d rather they not broadcast the level of severity or penetration that happened.

Keep them guessing whether or not they got it right.

209 FurryOldGuyJeans  Wed, Jul 8, 2009 11:06:14am

Our friends, the Saudis, are at it again:

July 8, 2009 - 11:27 AM
Saudi religious squad beefs up anti-vice patrols

RIYADH (Reuters) - Saudi Arabia’s powerful religious police plan a summer anti-vice drive to enforce prayer-keeping and modesty in the conservative Gulf Arab state, its head said in remarks published Wednesday.

The Commission for the Promotion of Virtue and Prevention of Vice applies an austere interpretation of Islam in the kingdom, where clerics control the justice system.

With over 5,000 men, the force has wide powers to carry out raids in search of alcohol, ensure shops and restaurants are shut at prayer time, enforce the segregation of unrelated men and women in public and ban women from driving — an activity clerics say is un-Islamic.

Chief Abdul-Aziz Al-Humeen told Okaz newspaper that the religious police would step up patrols of outdoor gatherings for public entertainment, which are mainly held during the summer.

210 FurryOldGuyJeans  Wed, Jul 8, 2009 11:07:06am

re: #208 ~Fianna

I’d rather they not broadcast the level of severity or penetration that happened.

Keep them guessing whether or not they got it right.

I was not just talking about this cyber attack. I was speaking about things in general.

211 SixDegrees  Wed, Jul 8, 2009 11:07:11am

re: #205 ~Fianna

I’m still not sure they have the tech. They don’t even appear to have an assigned IP range ([Link: www.dayomon.net…]

Wiki confirms that there is no internet per se in NORK ([Link: en.wikipedia.org…] - it looks like most of it runs through satellite and hard lines to China and other countries.

They’d need help to pull something like this off, I think. I doubt they have enough internet-enabled people in country to have developed the skillset to do this.

The Chinese are likely helping them, using NK as a testbed for it’s own efforts without exposing themselves directly to scrutiny or criticism. There is an increasingly uneasy alliance between the two countries, although Kimmy has gone out of his way to piss off the Chinese in every way possible recently.

212 FurryOldGuyJeans  Wed, Jul 8, 2009 11:09:54am

The ship is deserting sinking rats

Democrats Split on Stimulus as Job Losses Mount, Deficit Soars
By Matthew Benjamin

July 8 (Bloomberg) — Democrats who control the levers of power in Washington are divided over whether to push for more deficit spending to end the recession and stem job losses, complicating the possibility of a second stimulus bill.

“We need to be open to whether or not we need further action,” House Majority Leader Steny Hoyer, a Maryland Democrat, told reporters yesterday. Senate Majority Leader Harry Reid of Nevada countered that “there is no showing to me that another stimulus is needed.”

213 ~Fianna  Wed, Jul 8, 2009 11:11:19am

re: #210 FurryOldGuyJeans

I was not just talking about this cyber attack. I was speaking about things in general.

I was not a fan of Bush, but I did my best to give him the benefit of the doubt because they can’t (and shouldn’t) tell us everything. Nothing annoyed me more than reporters asking for troop movements in press conferences. Hello! Bin Laden and Hussein got CNN too, ya know.

I’ll leave the second-guessing to history until I have a team of people who visit me first thing in the morning and tell me what the bad guys had for dinner last night.

Transparency is a good goal, but impractical. Some things need to be kept quiet until the danger is passed.

214 Kenneth  Wed, Jul 8, 2009 11:11:59am

re: #201 Dahveed

Let me see if I understand this… UN High Commissioner for Human Rights, Navanethem Pillay says the wall is a “land grab”… A citizen of South Africa, a country which was created in Africa by European colonialists and populated with immigrants from India like herself, accuses Israel of a “land grab” when they build a security wall on land that has been called Judea for 3000 years?

Is that what she is saying?

215 ~Fianna  Wed, Jul 8, 2009 11:12:33am

re: #211 SixDegrees

The Chinese are likely helping them, using NK as a testbed for it’s own efforts without exposing themselves directly to scrutiny or criticism. There is an increasingly uneasy alliance between the two countries, although Kimmy has gone out of his way to piss off the Chinese in every way possible recently.

That’s what I’m trying to figure out - what’s the benefit to China? F-up the US economy any more and all those debt notes will be valueless.

Iran - possibly. And there are ties there.

Russia - maybe. Depends on how Putin’s feeling today, I guess.

Who else?

216 Creeping Eruption  Wed, Jul 8, 2009 11:14:27am

re: #214 Kenneth

Yup. I didn’t realize getting so high was a requirement of the High commissioner’s job, but …

217 SixDegrees  Wed, Jul 8, 2009 11:16:31am

re: #212 FurryOldGuyJeans

The ship is deserting sinking rats

Democrats Split on Stimulus as Job Losses Mount, Deficit Soars
By Matthew Benjamin

Maybe they should try SPENDING THE GIGANTIC STIMULUS PACKAGE THEY ALREADY PASSED! So far, less than 10% of that package has been allocated, and only a fraction of what has been allocated has found it’s way into the economy. There’s still well over 90% of the original bill sitting around in a very non-stimulating way, being held back for use as a Democrat-controlled slush fund during the 2010 and 2012 election seasons.

Here’s a novel thought that would get that money - roughly enough to run the entire Federal government for about 9 months - into the public’s hands almost instantly: reduce Federal withholdings, effective immediately, to zero, and use the money to run the government in the meantime. Do that for 9 months, and the money brought in by the soaring economy generated by the surge in consumer spending would more than make up for it. Or, cut withholdings by half, and keep them there for 18 months. Whatever. Just don’t ask for any more money until you’ve actually spent what you got the first time around - and until you’ve actually accomplished something positive by spending it.

218 Kenneth  Wed, Jul 8, 2009 11:17:29am

re: #215 ~Fianna

There is a very serious conversation going on right now between the US and China over the future of North Korea. They both know the regime is collapsing, the problem is will it come down fast, hard and dangerous, or will it be a slow and careful slide. The object is who gets to deal with the mess. China does not want a reunified Korea dominated by the US. They would prefer a docile, tamed puppet state in North Korea. This is what the discussions are about and Beijing is right now emphasizing a point to Washington about how much pain & trouble North Korea could be if the US doesn’t cooperate with China.

219 SixDegrees  Wed, Jul 8, 2009 11:20:00am

re: #215 ~Fianna

That’s what I’m trying to figure out - what’s the benefit to China? F-up the US economy any more and all those debt notes will be valueless.

Iran - possibly. And there are ties there.

Russia - maybe. Depends on how Putin’s feeling today, I guess.

Who else?

For China, it’s just the development of a technique. At the moment, I doubt they intend to deploy it. The little exercise currently underway seems to be just that - a crude exercise, doing a little probing to see what we’ve got and how we react.

A real exercise - or attack - wouldn’t have been noticed until it was far too late.

220 Edward Halper  Wed, Jul 8, 2009 11:20:16am

N Korea has given new meaning to “cold war.”

This beats the expected missile attack. In the long run, they’ve done us a favor—if we can figure out how to block future attacks.

All things considered, this is not a time when a computer slowdown is such a big deal. Other times could be worse. Hopefully, our people will learn enough now do that it does not become a problem when it would do damage.

221 Dreader1962  Wed, Jul 8, 2009 11:21:26am

What I would like is a discussion on what the implications are of a nation-state engaging in these actions. I see no difference in this and the interdiction of sea-trade routes in earlier times. Also, if the government websites are targets, it is no different than a coordinated attack on the buildings themselves, in my mind.

As long as our response to this is defensive, the attacks will not stop. Indeed, they will increase until substantial damage is caused. There is already a financial cost incurred anytime this happens, if only the loss of productivity is measured.

I see nothing wrong with a response in the physical world for an attack that occurred in the ‘cyber’ world.

Someone in the White House needs to read Sun Tzu’s ‘The Art of War’ and Clausewitz’s ‘On War’.

222 itellu3times  Wed, Jul 8, 2009 11:23:29am

re: #218 Kenneth

Very interesting post.

But how about a unified Korea not dominated by the US, or even dominated by China?

(South) Korea seems a very pragmatic bunch, they may be happy to be dominated, as long as they keep up business as usual.

223 Kenneth  Wed, Jul 8, 2009 11:30:24am

re: #222 itellu3times

South Korea is a free democratic capitalist state with a population rapidly turning to Christianity. No way they would accept giving all that up to be a client state to China. If Korea reunifies, South Korea will dominate the new Korea, which means the US will be an ally. China will loose an important buffer state on a vulnerable frontier.

224 Dahveed  Wed, Jul 8, 2009 11:34:34am

re: #214 Kenneth

Let me see if I understand this… UN High Commissioner for Human Rights, Navanethem Pillay says the wall is a “land grab”… A citizen of South Africa, a country which was created in Africa by European colonialists and populated with immigrants from India like herself, accuses Israel of a “land grab” when they build a security wall on land that has been called Judea for 3000 years?

Is that what she is saying?

Ironic, huh?

Then again, logic was never formally included in the UN charter.

225 Spare O'Lake  Wed, Jul 8, 2009 11:40:29am

re: #224 Dahveed

Ironic, huh?

Then again, logic was never formally included in the UN charter.

UN kidding.

226 Kenneth  Wed, Jul 8, 2009 11:41:55am

re: #224 Dahveed

It’s not just logic that missing from the UN, decency and integrity are scarce as well.

227 razorbacker  Wed, Jul 8, 2009 11:58:36am

re: #201 Dahveed

OT~

The UN High Commissioner for Human Rights (what a joke!) expects Israel to dismantle the barrier between Israel and the West Bank and pay reparations.

Apparently protecting one’s own citizens from people that mean to kill you is contradictory to human rights.

Walls for me, but not for thee:

The Wonder Wall Around Arabia

July 6, 2009: Saudi Arabia is spending $2.5 billion to construct an electronic surveillance system along 7,000 kilometers of coastline and land borders. EADS, a European firm, won the contract. EADS already built and operates a similar system along Saudi Arabia’s Iraq border. The success of that system probably helped EADS win the new contract.

The security system (the Saudi Border Guard Development Program, or SBGDP) along the 900 kilometer Iraqi border is more elaborate. It consists of a double fence, 135 electronically controlled gates, day/night cameras, movement detection sensors on the fence, underground sensors, and barbed wire between the two fences. SBGDP is meant to stop anyone from sneaking into the kingdom from Iraq. The national system does that as well, but only if the local board guard base can catch whoever made one of the sensors go off. This Iraqi border fence is not yet complete. The new national project will not be complete until 2014-15.

Gosh. It’s almost like there was some kind of agenda, or something.

But not from the UN, of course. They have only peace in mind.

228 Achilles Tang  Wed, Jul 8, 2009 12:01:40pm

I’m not an expert on this, but as I understand the basics, a Denial of Service attack is not but a high level of internet connection attempts that don’t do anything except clog up the bandwidth so everything comes to a crawl.

The IPs of the calling system are known and the response is to block them when it is clear they are not legitimate. Those ISPs can also determine which PCs on their system are infected with the virus sending the messages and shut them down too, if there isn’t a holiday or weekend or nighttime break at the time.

What one can’t directly do is identify who infected the PCs to begin with, but what one could do is force all users to have anti virus protection current and licensed versions of Windows. Fat chance of that, but one could blacklist a lot of ISPs that are prone to piracy. Most Asian IPs could, for example, be automatically blocked 24/7. Who’s going to notice or care if they bitch?

What am I missing?

229 kansas  Wed, Jul 8, 2009 12:28:29pm

I’m wondering if something like this isn’t what got this whole crisis started. A cyber attack on the banks.

230 kansas  Wed, Jul 8, 2009 12:29:46pm

re: #212 FurryOldGuyJeans

The ship is deserting sinking rats

Democrats Split on Stimulus as Job Losses Mount, Deficit Soars
By Matthew Benjamin

Like the doctor says, try this medicine, and if it doesn’t work, take more.

231 AZDave  Wed, Jul 8, 2009 12:38:52pm

re: #33 latingent

Never had a plan `A`.

And he doesn’t have a Plan “B” either. Doubt if he has any plans except surrender.

232 ~Fianna  Wed, Jul 8, 2009 1:33:31pm

re: #228 Naso Tang

I’m not an expert on this, but as I understand the basics, a Denial of Service attack is not but a high level of internet connection attempts that don’t do anything except clog up the bandwidth so everything comes to a crawl.

The IPs of the calling system are known and the response is to block them when it is clear they are not legitimate. Those ISPs can also determine which PCs on their system are infected with the virus sending the messages and shut them down too, if there isn’t a holiday or weekend or nighttime break at the time.

What one can’t directly do is identify who infected the PCs to begin with, but what one could do is force all users to have anti virus protection current and licensed versions of Windows. Fat chance of that, but one could blacklist a lot of ISPs that are prone to piracy. Most Asian IPs could, for example, be automatically blocked 24/7. Who’s going to notice or care if they bitch?

What am I missing?

That’s called traffic snooping and it’s a huge violation of people’s privacy. I don’t want the goverment or my ISP reading my traffic.

233 itellu3times  Wed, Jul 8, 2009 1:54:07pm

re: #223 Kenneth

South Korea is a free democratic capitalist state with a population rapidly turning to Christianity. No way they would accept giving all that up to be a client state to China. If Korea reunifies, South Korea will dominate the new Korea, which means the US will be an ally. China will loose an important buffer state on a vulnerable frontier.

I appreciate your knowledge on this, and insight, but on the other hand I wonder if all the parties might be just a little more flexible than you suggest.

234 Right mind left  Wed, Jul 8, 2009 2:34:20pm

Arrived late but this makes me wonder. 0 is pushing for czars of all these areas and I’ve been watching the progress on getting this Internet Czar in place. The articles say they are interviewing convicted hackers to head this stuff, (who better?) who say they are reformed, of course…

Now, if he and the admin want to scare people enough to allow the power to go to the legislation for this oh-so-necessary centralized stopgate and control of all things running through the bandwidth (legislation says the power to control, limit, redirect or shut down parts of the internet and other cyber areas…), wouldn’t a series of carefully orchestrated ‘breaches’ and hacker storms help the cause?

Intel seems to know the capabilities of the Norks and the inability of them to launch any high level attack.

Sounds like a convenient tactic for the power grab to me. Just a thought…we just seem to be getting a lot more BIG stories of this nature out of the MSM (who are often directed by Rahm, et al). I would keep an eye on the legislation wording that should be coming soon!

235 jayzee  Wed, Jul 8, 2009 4:42:52pm

We need Madeline Albright and a basketball stat!

236 jackflash  Thu, Jul 9, 2009 2:30:45pm

There may be less here than meets the eye. These are attacks on the public websites of these agencies. I work for the Public Utilities Commission in CA and they’re welcome to close down that turkey of ours any time.


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