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Rebuttal: Bobby Jindal’s Risible Op-Ed for CNN

Creationist governor says everyone else is stupid
Politics • Views: 29,561

It’s almost comical to see Louisiana Governor Bobby Jindal’s efforts to position himself as the voice of reasonable conservatism. Remember, this is the Republican governor who’s had more success than any other in sneaking creationism into public school science classes; make no mistake, Bobby Jindal is 100% in line with the most extreme right wing religious fanatics on this.

So here he is again with an op-ed at CNN, sharing his view on How Republicans Can Win Future Elections.

Let’s go through this point by point, shall we?

1. Stop looking backward. We have to boldly show what the future can look like with the free market policies that we believe in. Conservative ideals are aspirational, and our country is aspirational.

Nothing to refute or even argue here — these are just empty feel-good words lacking anything concrete.

2. Compete for every single vote. The 47% and the 53%. And any other combination of numbers that adds up to 100 percent. President Barack Obama and the Democrats can continue trying to divide America into groups of warring communities with competing interests, but we will have none of it. We are going after every vote as we try to unite all Americans.

Completely opposite to reality. We just went through an election in which the Republican Party’s entire strategy consisted of dividing the country into the good productive wealthy people, and the ignorant unwashed masses who just want “free stuff.”

But apart from Jindal’s denial of his own party’s blazingly obvious strategy of fear mongering and race-baiting, again there’s nothing here besides empty words. “Compete for every vote?” Well, duh.

3. Reject identity politics. The old notion that ours should be a colorblind society is the right one, and we should pursue that with vigor. Identity politics is corrosive to the great American melting pot and we reject it. We will treat all people as individuals rather than as members of special interest groups.

This is another risible statement, coming from a representative of a party whose entire appeal is based on identity politics. Jindal can say “we reject it” all he likes, but is there anyone naive enough to believe this will ever happen?

4. Stop being the stupid party. It’s time for a new Republican party that talks like adults. It’s time for us to articulate our plans and visions for America in real terms. We had a number of Republicans damage the brand this year with offensive and bizarre comments. Enough of that.

Again we see Bobby Jindal calling others stupid, while he himself promotes creationism and religious charter schools that teach anti-science mind rot to children. If he wants to stop being the “stupid party” he needs to start right there where he lives.

5. Stop insulting the intelligence of voters. We need to trust the smarts of the American people. We have to stop dumbing down our ideas and stop reducing everything to mindless slogans and tag lines for 30-second ads. We must be willing to provide details in describing our views.

Sorry, but I just can’t help laughing. A creationist lecturing others on “insulting the intelligence of voters?” Jindal’s lack of self-awareness is breathtaking. And “mindless slogans,” coming from the guy who became a laughing stock for his ignorant criticism of volcano monitoring programs?

6. Quit “big.” We are not the party of big business, big banks, big Wall Street bailouts, big corporate loopholes, or big anything. We must not be the party that simply protects the well off so they can keep their toys. We have to be the party that shows all Americans how they can thrive. We are the party whose ideas will help the middle class, and help more folks join the middle class. We are a populist party and need to make that clear.

Again, where’s the beef? Lots of nice sounding words, but how exactly does Bobby Jindal think the GOP is going to be the “populist” party when they’re totally in the pocket of big business, with elections bankrolled by billionaires?

7. Focus on people, not government. We must stop competing with Democrats for the job of “Government Manager,” and come up with ideas that can unleash the dynamic abilities of the American people. We need to lead the way with policies that can create prosperity. We believe in organic solutions, not big government solutions. We need a bottom-up government that fits the digital age. Right now we have an outdated centralized government trying to manage a decentralized economy.

OK, that’s his final point. We got all the way to the end without a single concrete suggestion about changing the Republican Party in any real or meaningful way, just empty platitudes.

One last quote from Jindal’s ridiculous piece:

There are many challenges facing our country. For example, our education system seems to be in the Stone Age and miserably outdated.

Said the creationist, who signed into law a bill sponsored by the creationist think tank called the Discovery Institute. Jindal’s idea of “updating” education is to inject more religion into it.

Bottom line: just another deceptive, non-specific bunch of happy talk, from a Republican who is guilty of everything he’s criticizing.

Jindal’s function right now: he’s a right wing band-aid. He’s trying to stop the bleeding. Any reasonable conservatives who remain in the GOP are probably looking at their fellow travelers like Todd Akin and thinking, “Good grief. Who ARE these people?”

Bobby Jindal is trying to reassure them, to give them a reason not to bail out on the Republican Party. The scent of desperation is unmistakable.

Jump to bottom

311 comments

1 HappyWarrior  Thu, Nov 15, 2012 11:44:27am

Jindal's another full of shit right wing nutjob. More so than Romney actually because he actually believes a lot of the crazy socon bullshit.

2 Targetpractice  Thu, Nov 15, 2012 11:45:52am

In short, Jindal just announced his candidacy for the GOP nomination in 2016.

3 dragonath  Thu, Nov 15, 2012 11:46:58am

We must unite!

Communist Kenyan Muslims need not apply.

4 Dark_Falcon  Thu, Nov 15, 2012 11:47:31am

Bobby Jindal gets attacked by liberal = dog bites man. Too ordinary to be worthy of notice.

5 jaunte  Thu, Nov 15, 2012 11:48:35am

Bronze Age Education FTW!

6 engineer cat  Thu, Nov 15, 2012 11:48:51am

We are the party whose ideas will help the middle class

uh-huh

//

7 dragonfire1981  Thu, Nov 15, 2012 11:48:51am

I see it. That way he can later on reference those vague, ambiguous statements and say "Hey, this is what I meant when I said X!"

8 HappyWarrior  Thu, Nov 15, 2012 11:49:48am

re: #4 Dark_Falcon

Bobby Jindal gets attacked by liberal = dog bites man. Too ordinary to be worthy of notice.

What was it Charles said about Jindal and the Republican Party that was inaccurate?

9 dragonfire1981  Thu, Nov 15, 2012 11:49:51am

Interestingly, the Amazon ad that popped up when I loaded this page was for Kid Rock's new album. Hmmm...

10 Big Steve  Thu, Nov 15, 2012 11:50:00am
There are many challenges facing our country. For example, our education system seems to be in the Stone Age and miserably outdated.

So says the Governor of the state with the worst public education system in the nation.

11 Skip Intro  Thu, Nov 15, 2012 11:50:20am

According to well established Birther Theory, since neither of his parents were US citizens at the time of his birth, he's ineligible for the office of president.

12 HappyWarrior  Thu, Nov 15, 2012 11:52:23am

re: #11 Skip Intro

According to well established Birther Theory, since neither of his parents were US citizens at the time of his birth, he's ineligible for the office of president.

Shit there are Rubio birthers why not Jindal ones?

13 Kragar  Thu, Nov 15, 2012 11:52:35am

Doesn't Bobby have a snake dance he needs to get to?

14 Obdicut  Thu, Nov 15, 2012 11:52:47am

re: #4 Dark_Falcon

Bobby Jindal gets attacked by liberal = dog bites man. Too ordinary to be worthy of notice.

What is your opinion of Jindal's turning public education in Louisiana into creationism-okay education? Funding religious teaching with public money?

15 Obdicut  Thu, Nov 15, 2012 11:53:29am

re: #12 HappyWarrior

Shit there are Rubio birthers why not Jindal ones?

Because ever since he Kenneth-the-Paged his rebuttal, no one takes him seriously as a presidential contender, he just doesn't know that.

16 Big Steve  Thu, Nov 15, 2012 11:53:29am

re: #13 Kragar

Doesn't Bobby have a snake dance he needs to get to?

sorry but is that a reference to his heritage from India??

17 dragonath  Thu, Nov 15, 2012 11:53:46am

re: #4 Dark_Falcon

Bobby Jindal gets attacked by liberal = dog bites man. Too ordinary to be worthy of notice.

Do you have anything substantive to say about the points raised?

18 HappyWarrior  Thu, Nov 15, 2012 11:53:48am

re: #10 Big Steve

So says the Governor of the state with the worst public education system in the nation.

No kidding and he's done nothing to solve the problem. In fact he's made it worse.

19 Obdicut  Thu, Nov 15, 2012 11:53:52am

re: #16 Big Steve

sorry but is that a reference to his heritage from India??

I'd assume it's from his crazy level of religiosity.

20 dragonfire1981  Thu, Nov 15, 2012 11:54:00am

OT, but I need a bit of help.

I'm an aspiring writer who would very much like to get into blogging, but I don't know how to start doing it. I have several topics in mind, but of more concern to me is the where. Do I acquire my own website or use one of the free blogging ones instead?

All advice appreciated.

21 Skip Intro  Thu, Nov 15, 2012 11:54:23am

re: #12 HappyWarrior

Shit there are Rubio birthers why not Jindal ones?

You expect Birthers to be consistent?

22 Obdicut  Thu, Nov 15, 2012 11:54:34am

re: #20 dragonfire1981

Use a free one. If you're also a visual person, Tumblr is good. Wordpress is good for pure text.

23 Vicious Babushka  Thu, Nov 15, 2012 11:54:45am

re: #20 dragonfire1981

OT, but I need a bit of help.

I'm an aspiring writer who would very much like to get into blogging, but I don't know how to start doing it. I have several topics in mind, but of more concern to me is the where. Do I acquire my own website or use one of the free blogging ones instead?

All advice appreciated.

Wordpress and Typepad.

24 Kragar  Thu, Nov 15, 2012 11:54:47am

re: #16 Big Steve

sorry but is that a reference to his heritage from India??

No, its a southern thing were they tempt snakes to bite them so they can reject satan or some other bullshit.

25 HappyWarrior  Thu, Nov 15, 2012 11:55:00am

re: #21 Skip Intro

You expect Birthers to be consistent?

Nah.

26 dragonfire1981  Thu, Nov 15, 2012 11:55:17am

re: #19 Obdicut

I'd assume it's from his crazy level of religiosity.

Actually it's a reference to the New Orleans/Lousiana Voodoo culture.

27 HappyWarrior  Thu, Nov 15, 2012 11:55:46am

We used wordpress when I had to have a blog for my required IT course. Worked out pretty well.

28 dragonfire1981  Thu, Nov 15, 2012 11:55:56am

Re: Tumblr, Wordpress and Typepad

Will any or all of these allow me to add pictures and/or video to postings?

29 jaunte  Thu, Nov 15, 2012 11:56:00am

John Derbyshire:

"As a Republican living in a liberal neighborhood, I spend a lot of time defending the GOP against sneers about us being (as one of my friends puts it) “the snake-handling party.” Bobby Jindal sure isn’t making it any easier."

[Link: littlegreenfootballs.com...]

30 Ghost of Tom Joad  Thu, Nov 15, 2012 11:56:13am

re: #20 dragonfire1981

Start free so you can see if you like doing it and can put in the time for it. If your readership grows, and then it feels like something your heart is in, then you can get your own site and invest money towards it.

.02$

31 Targetpractice  Thu, Nov 15, 2012 11:56:23am

Really, all Jindal does with this editorial is jump on the same train most of his party has, declaring that their message was not at fault last week, but merely the presentation. And that, if they can somehow convince voters that being batshit crazy is a good thing, they can win them back.

32 HappyWarrior  Thu, Nov 15, 2012 11:56:51am

re: #29 jaunte

John Derbyshire:

[Link: littlegreenfootballs.com...]

Well Derbyshire you're not exactly part of the solution with your white nationalist crap either so you're right Jindal doesn't help but you don't help either.

33 dragonfire1981  Thu, Nov 15, 2012 11:56:54am

re: #30 Ghost of Tom Joad

Start free so you can see if you like doing it and can put in the time for it. If your readership grows, and then it feels like something your heart is in, then you can get your own site and invest money towards it.

.02$

That's the approach I was going for. The building readership thing will be a challenge for me but I guess I'll just have to work at marketing myself.

34 Destro  Thu, Nov 15, 2012 11:57:26am

You mean Governor Jindal, creationist AND exorcist .....

35 Skip Intro  Thu, Nov 15, 2012 11:57:35am

re: #25 HappyWarrior

Nah.

I'm sure that some of the serious birthers (and I can't believe I just used serious and birther next to each other) will voice a complaint, but as with all things Republican, all that will matter is "can he win".

36 Dark_Falcon  Thu, Nov 15, 2012 11:57:53am

re: #26 dragonfire1981

Actually it's a reference to the New Orleans/Lousiana Voodoo culture.

Bobby Jindal is Catholic, not some sort of 'snake-handler' evangelical.

37 aagcobb  Thu, Nov 15, 2012 11:58:33am

Bobby, to release the dynamic abilities of the American people, the country needs a sound, modern infrastructure and a first class public education system. Starving the public sector of funds and introducing mind rotting theology into science classes is how to steer the U.S. towards third world status.

38 HappyWarrior  Thu, Nov 15, 2012 11:58:44am

re: #35 Skip Intro

I'm sure that some of the serious birthers (and I can't believe I just used serious and birther next to each other) will voice a complaint, but as with all things Republican, all that will matter is "can he win".

Well the reason why I brought up Rubio is because he has some birthers from WND against him. Seems to me there are two different schools in the conservative blogsphere- win at all costs and the true believers.

39 Bulworth  Thu, Nov 15, 2012 11:58:45am

#7 is some serious word salad. We don't want to be government managers but we want policies that make magical things happen, even though there really shouldn't be any need for these policies because the free market will make everything wonderful.

40 Dark_Falcon  Thu, Nov 15, 2012 11:59:55am

re: #32 HappyWarrior

Well Derbyshire you're not exactly part of the solution with your white nationalist crap either so you're right Jindal doesn't help but you don't help either.

But Jindal isn't a racist, and he at least speaks the language of inclusion, even if others in the GOP do not.

John Derbyshire's only edge on Jindal is that he isn't a creationist. But Jindal still has him beat, since Jindal isn't an asshole.

41 Bulworth  Thu, Nov 15, 2012 12:00:01pm

to release the dynamic abilities of the American people I propose to release the dynamic abilities of the American people. /

42 engineer cat  Thu, Nov 15, 2012 12:00:02pm

We are the party whose ideas will help the middle class

i have two requests for the republican party before continuing this debate any farther

1) define 'middle class'

2) define 'small' business


and while you're at it, please come up with a definition of 'socialism' that wouldn't apply to every government since ancient egypt circa 2700 bc...

43 Obdicut  Thu, Nov 15, 2012 12:00:18pm

re: #36 Dark_Falcon

Bobby Jindal is Catholic, not some sort of 'snake-handler' evangelical.

Are you going to answer my question as to your opinion of what he's done with religion and education in Louisiana?

44 Kragar  Thu, Nov 15, 2012 12:00:21pm

re: #36 Dark_Falcon

Bobby Jindal is Catholic, not some sort of 'snake-handler' evangelical.

Belief in creationism, demons and participation in an exorcism = crazy evangelical

45 HappyWarrior  Thu, Nov 15, 2012 12:00:34pm

re: #40 Dark_Falcon

But Jindal isn't a racist, and he at least speaks the language of inclusion, even if others in the GOP do not.

John Derbyshire's only edge on Jindal is that he isn't a creationist. But Jindal still has him beat, since Jindal isn't an asshole.

You can have two different problems, you know. Jindal's problems are well documented. Besides this is like asking me if I want to be punched in the nose or the nads frankly.

46 Skip Intro  Thu, Nov 15, 2012 12:01:15pm

re: #38 HappyWarrior

Seems to me there are two different schools in the conservative blogsphere- win at all costs and the true believers.

I agree, but I'd put the ratio of "principled" birthers to win-at-any-cost birthers at around 1:100.

47 dragonfire1981  Thu, Nov 15, 2012 12:01:21pm

One more question re: a blog

Starting off, how frequently should I make entries on it? Twice a day perhaps?

48 engineer cat  Thu, Nov 15, 2012 12:01:28pm

For example, our education system seems to be in the Stone Age

stone age, bronze age, so many choices...

49 HappyWarrior  Thu, Nov 15, 2012 12:01:39pm

re: #46 Skip Intro

I agree, but I'd put the ratio of "principled" birthers to win-at-any-cost birthers at around 1:100.

True that, no disagreement there.

50 Obdicut  Thu, Nov 15, 2012 12:02:07pm

re: #44 Kragar

Belief in creationism, demons and participation in an exorcism = crazy evangelical

Well, he's literally not an "Evangelical" as in not part of the protestant bunch of churches that are called that. However, he is an evangelical Catholic.

51 Dark_Falcon  Thu, Nov 15, 2012 12:02:17pm

re: #38 HappyWarrior

Well the reason why I brought up Rubio is because he has some birthers from WND against him. Seems to me there are two different schools in the conservative blogsphere- win at all costs and the true believers.

They don't like Marco Rubio because he's Cuban. So when Rubio says "My coalition for Florida includes Cubans Puerto Ricans, and Dominicans" what some racists think is "Oh, noes! BROWN PEOPLE!!1"

52 engineer cat  Thu, Nov 15, 2012 12:02:19pm

re: #47 dragonfire1981

One more question re: a blog

Starting off, how frequently should I make entries on it? Twice a day perhaps?

if you have a blog entry lasting more than 4 hours, please consult an experienced blogmaster

53 funky chicken  Thu, Nov 15, 2012 12:02:23pm
1. Stop looking backward. We have to boldly show what the future can look like with the free market policies that we believe in. Conservative ideals are aspirational, and our country is aspirational.

OK, how about this?

[Link: vitals.nbcnews.com...]

Put a leash on federal government, return regulation to the state, and keep those "job creators" moving along. Hey, it's only meningitis.

54 Obdicut  Thu, Nov 15, 2012 12:02:47pm

re: #47 dragonfire1981

One more question re: a blog

Starting off, how frequently should I make entries on it? Twice a day perhaps?

As often as you have something genuinely interesting to say.

55 A Man for all Seasons  Thu, Nov 15, 2012 12:02:48pm

re: #15 Obdicut

Because ever since he Kenneth-the-Paged his rebuttal, no one takes him seriously as a presidential contender, he just doesn't know that.

What is Bobby's problem? There is already classes on creationism everywhere in our nation.
It's called Sunday School

56 Sophist is the VillageGreen Preservation Society  Thu, Nov 15, 2012 12:03:09pm

re: #40 Dark_Falcon

But Jindal still has him beat, since Jindal isn't an asshole.

In my book, having your friends hold someone down while you perform a non-consensual exorcism on them is distinctly assholish.

57 Interesting Times  Thu, Nov 15, 2012 12:03:51pm

re: #4 Dark_Falcon

Bobby Jindal gets attacked by liberal = dog bites man. Too ordinary to be worthy of notice.

You calling reine.de.tout a liberal?

58 HappyWarrior  Thu, Nov 15, 2012 12:04:57pm

re: #56 Sophist is the VillageGreen Preservation Society

In my book, having your friends hold someone down while you perform a non-consensual exorcism on them is distinctly assholish.

Not to mention fuckin' creepy.

59 Achilles Tang  Thu, Nov 15, 2012 12:05:26pm

Is he setting himself up for 1216?

60 HappyWarrior  Thu, Nov 15, 2012 12:05:34pm

re: #55 Digital Display

What is Bobby's problem? There is already classes on creationism everywhere in our nation.
It's called Sunday School

He wants that to be taxpayer funded.

61 HappyWarrior  Thu, Nov 15, 2012 12:06:03pm

re: #59 Achilles Tang

Is he setting himself up for 1216?

King John-Rubio 1216!

62 Feline Emperor of the Conservative Tears  Thu, Nov 15, 2012 12:06:38pm

re: #61 HappyWarrior

King John-Rubio 1216!

Vote NO on Magna Carta!

63 dragonfire1981  Thu, Nov 15, 2012 12:06:52pm

re: #54 Obdicut

As often as you have something genuinely interesting to say.

Hey now that's a great way to look at it.

Anyone here have experience running multiple blogs at once?

64 Obdicut  Thu, Nov 15, 2012 12:07:12pm

The people of Louisiana deserve better than Jindal.

65 dragonath  Thu, Nov 15, 2012 12:07:20pm

re: #40 Dark_Falcon

But Jindal isn't a racist, and he at least speaks the language of inclusion, even if others in the GOP do not.

John Derbyshire's only edge on Jindal is that he isn't a creationist. But Jindal still has him beat, since Jindal isn't an asshole.

Methods so inclusive that public monies go to explicitly Christian schools. His actions are the opposite of inclusiveness.

66 Kragar  Thu, Nov 15, 2012 12:07:46pm

Private Prison Company Allegedly Partnered With Violent Gangs To Save Money

A new lawsuit brought by eight inmates of the Idaho Correctional Center alleges that the company is cutting back on personnel costs by partnering with violent prison gangs to help control the facility. Court documents and an investigative report issued by the state’s Department of Corrections show how guards routinely looked the other way when gang members violated basic facility rules, negotiated with gang leaders on the cell placement of new inmates, and in one instance may have even helped one group of inmates plan a violent attack on members of a rival gang.

Rather than working with corporate headquarters or local authorities to combat the growing threat of gangs, CCA officials at the prison — the state’s largest, with more than 2,000 beds — used those same gangs as a way to control the rest of the inmates and save money:

67 Ghost of Tom Joad  Thu, Nov 15, 2012 12:07:50pm

re: #47 dragonfire1981

Depends what you're going for. Some blogs post short blurbs at high rates and let their commentariat have at it (Eschaton, B-Juice). Look at what Charles does, it's usually what, 4 or so major posts per day? With a little mix of his writing and letting the commentariat discuss it.

Are you looking at blogging about a specific thing, or group of things? Or anything that comes across your eyes? If you're looking to generate readership, you're obviously going to want to post detailed analysis/opinions etc., not just a quick link/blurb, so I'd start off with a few posts per day with some heavy writing/analysis for people to read. There's already 5 million places that people can discuss things, so you'll want to do something to draw folks in to read what you write.

68 Achilles Tang  Thu, Nov 15, 2012 12:08:24pm

And, maybe he thinks most voters are really closet creationists, after all at least 47% supposedly are, and none of them would mind a president who looks like this guy:

What, me worry?

69 Feline Emperor of the Conservative Tears  Thu, Nov 15, 2012 12:08:55pm

re: #63 dragonfire1981

Hey now that's a great way to look at it.

Anyone here have experience running multiple blogs at once?

A friend of mine blogs on the side about comic books and geek stuff. But he only updates on a weekly basis (and not at all recently due to a job change and Hurricane Sandy). He also set up a second blog - he does comic book stuff on the one and puts anything he considers political or religious discussion on the other.

70 Ghost of Tom Joad  Thu, Nov 15, 2012 12:09:07pm

re: #58 HappyWarrior

Not to mention fuckin' creepy.

Not to mention somebody should have gotten fucking arrested.

71 wrenchwench  Thu, Nov 15, 2012 12:10:53pm
4. Stop being the stupid party. It’s time for a new Republican party that talks like adults. It’s time for us to articulate our plans and visions for America in real terms.

They plan to pass a Personhood Amendment. Let's look at that one in real terms:

Woman Dies after Galway Hospital Refuses Abortion

72 Dark_Falcon  Thu, Nov 15, 2012 12:11:41pm

re: #57 Interesting Times

You calling reine.de.tout a liberal?

No, I'm calling Charles a liberal.

73 makeitstop  Thu, Nov 15, 2012 12:11:42pm

re: #47 dragonfire1981

One more question re: a blog

Starting off, how frequently should I make entries on it? Twice a day perhaps?

As often as you can. Remember the old adage, Publish or perish.' People like fresh content.

When I was running my own blog, I'd post up to 10-12 times a day if there was a lot going on.

74 Ghost of Tom Joad  Thu, Nov 15, 2012 12:12:59pm

re: #72 Dark_Falcon

No, I'm calling Charles a liberal.

Just so we have some clarity, what is your definition of "liberal."

I'm curious.

75 HappyWarrior  Thu, Nov 15, 2012 12:15:51pm

Honestly, aside from his age and child of immigrants backgrounds, there's nothing about Bobby Jindal that is different or new. He's as much part of the problem with the party as Romney and the others are. Of course the media will use the above mentioned to sell him as a new and fresh face but he really offers nothing really of substance. And as mentioned his education policy is a total flop. He's a religious fanatic. His problem with the crazy statements on abortion seems to stem more from the fact that they were said than the madness behind them. Remember Jindal is against abortion with no exceptions.

76 bratwurst  Thu, Nov 15, 2012 12:15:53pm

re: #4 Dark_Falcon

Bobby Jindal gets attacked by liberal = dog bites man. Too ordinary to be worthy of notice.

This is what we used to call "pushback" around here.

77 aagcobb  Thu, Nov 15, 2012 12:16:50pm
78 Charles Johnson  Thu, Nov 15, 2012 12:17:02pm

Jindal's function right now: a conservative band-aid; he's trying to stop the bleeding. Any reasonable conservatives who remain in the GOP are probably looking at their fellow travelers like Todd Akin and thinking, "Good grief. Who ARE these people?"

Bobby Jindal is trying to reassure them, to give them a reason not to bail out on the GOP. The scent of desperation is unmistakable.

79 wrenchwench  Thu, Nov 15, 2012 12:17:41pm

re: #66 Kragar

Private Prison Company Allegedly Partnered With Violent Gangs To Save Money

There are many reasons that private prisons are a bad idea, but I hadn't thought of that one.

80 Obdicut  Thu, Nov 15, 2012 12:17:47pm

re: #72 Dark_Falcon

No, I'm calling Charles a liberal.

What you are also doing is dodging a substantive question about Jindal's policies, I suspect because you don't have any answer. I've asked you three times now what you think of Jindal allowing state money to go to religious education, and you've refused to answer.

This is a repeated theme with you. You rarely will actually defend a position or action taken by someone in the GOP, and you seem to think not acknowledging the problem will make it go away. It won't. That sort of thinking is something the GOP has engaged in for far too long. It's time to actually get the religious right out of the GOP, Dark, or your party will remain something that you can't defend.

81 Mich-again  Thu, Nov 15, 2012 12:18:08pm

re: #47 dragonfire1981

One more question re: a blog

Starting off, how frequently should I make entries on it? Twice a day perhaps?

My take on that, skip the quantity and go for quality, especially if you are just starting. Its nice to go back a year or two later and read thoughtful original entries. And you'll be surprised at how many people will find those entries months and years later when they search for what you wrote about. If you try to keep up with 10 posts a day, you'll burn out. And you can't compete with people who do it all day every day by posting on every new story that comes along. Pick your spots and crush it once in a while instead.

82 Targetpractice  Thu, Nov 15, 2012 12:18:23pm

re: #78 Charles Johnson

Jindal's function right now: a conservative band-aid; he's trying to stop the bleeding. Any reasonable conservatives who remain in the GOP are probably looking at their fellow travelers like Todd Akin and thinking, "Good grief. Who ARE these people?"

Bobby Jindal is trying to reassure them, to give them a reason not to bail out on the GOP. The scent of desperation is unmistakable.

"We're not all crazy! Pay no attention to the wingnuts! We 'moderates' are still in control of the party!!"

83 Kragar  Thu, Nov 15, 2012 12:18:52pm

If you're running your prison like a Ray Liotta movie, you might have a problem.

84 Interesting Times  Thu, Nov 15, 2012 12:20:22pm

re: #72 Dark_Falcon

No, I'm calling Charles a liberal.

Then how do you explain the fact Reine also believes Jindal is a terrible governor? Don't you think she, as a resident of Louisiana, is in a far, far, far better position to describe the impact of his policies than you?

85 dragonath  Thu, Nov 15, 2012 12:21:05pm

I just remembered this

Jindal wrote a open letter to Obama and the Secretary of Interior calling for the end to the temporary deep water drilling moratorium even as the Deepwater Horizon oil spill was taking place.

86 Ghost of Tom Joad  Thu, Nov 15, 2012 12:21:42pm

re: #84 Interesting Times

Don't dump on the poor guy. Jindal is the Republicans great non-white hope for 2016.

87 HappyWarrior  Thu, Nov 15, 2012 12:22:03pm

re: #86 Ghost of Tom Joad

Don't dump on the poor guy. Jindal is the Republicans great non-white hope for 2016.

I thought that was Rubio.

88 Mich-again  Thu, Nov 15, 2012 12:23:09pm

I am OK with Bobby Jindall trying to sound rational. The wingnuts were never going to change from outside influence, but from an insider, it might resonate. Of course it could all be a ruse intended to mask the stink of the GOP brand, but even so, its preferable to the Benghaz! crappola the other 99% of his party is consumed with.

Oh and I proudly wear the liberal label. That has to be the stupidest attempt at an insult ever. Hey Look at that weirdo .. He has an open mind! and considers all sides of an argument before making up his mind!! ewww. /

89 Ghost of Tom Joad  Thu, Nov 15, 2012 12:23:17pm

re: #87 HappyWarrior

They're loading up the quiver. Double-minority ticket 2016!

90 Mich-again  Thu, Nov 15, 2012 12:24:31pm

re: #89 Ghost of Tom Joad

They're loading up the quiver. Double-minority ticket 2016!

And when that happens, Rand Paul plays the pied piper and all the Tea Party rats follow him off into 3rd party land.

91 HappyWarrior  Thu, Nov 15, 2012 12:24:37pm

re: #88 Mich-again

I am OK with Bobby Jindall trying to sound rational. The wingnuts were never going to change from outside influence, but from an insider, it might resonate. Of course it could all be a ruse intended to mask the stink of the GOP brand, but even so, its preferable to the Benghaz! crappola the other 99% of his party is consumed with.

Oh and I proudly wear the liberal label. That has to be the stupidest attempt at an insult ever. Hey Look at that weirdo .. He has an open mind! and considers all sides of an argument before making up his mind!! ewww. /

"A conservative is a man with two perfectly good legs, who, however, has never learned to walk.... A liberal is a man who uses his legs and his hands at the behest of his head." FDR

92 Ghost of Tom Joad  Thu, Nov 15, 2012 12:25:33pm

re: #88 Mich-again

The whole liberal/conservative thing, for me, is just worthless. These terms have lost so much meaning over the years. That's why any time I hear one of them blurted out, I have to ask for that person's specific definition, otherwise it's meaningless.

93 Feline Emperor of the Conservative Tears  Thu, Nov 15, 2012 12:25:58pm

re: #88 Mich-again

I am OK with Bobby Jindall trying to sound rational. The wingnuts were never going to change from outside influence, but from an insider, it might resonate. Of course it could all be a ruse intended to mask the stink of the GOP brand, but even so, its preferable to the Benghaz! crappola the other 99% of his party is consumed with.

I thought Trump's new fragrance was intended to do that.
//

94 aagcobb  Thu, Nov 15, 2012 12:26:56pm

re: #90 Mich-again

And when that happens, Rand Paul plays the pied piper and all the Tea Party rats follow him off into 3rd party land.

Yes, I'm sure there will be one milquetoast candidate on the ticket to reassure the Base. But I bet Romney/Ryan is the last major party ticket we ever see with two white men.

95 Skip Intro  Thu, Nov 15, 2012 12:27:09pm

re: #89 Ghost of Tom Joad

They're loading up the quiver. Double-minority ticket 2016!

Except one of them is going to be George P. Bush.

96 dragonath  Thu, Nov 15, 2012 12:27:17pm

I might have had a little bit more respect for Jindal if he had said something against the "repeal the 14th Amendment" whackos inside the Romney campaign.

97 researchok  Thu, Nov 15, 2012 12:28:07pm

re: #78 Charles Johnson

Eau de Woe

98 Kragar  Thu, Nov 15, 2012 12:28:32pm

re: #89 Ghost of Tom Joad

They're loading up the quiver. Double-minority ticket 2016!

Sulfur/Brimstone 2016!

99 Targetpractice  Thu, Nov 15, 2012 12:28:51pm

re: #86 Ghost of Tom Joad

Don't dump on the poor guy. Jindal is the Republicans great non-white hope for 2016.

Considering some of Dark's past comments, it seems more a fascination with the idea that the party's "moderates" still run things and that Jindal is an indication of that, thus he should be supported in the hopes that increased support will make his job bringing order to the party easier. And if that means accepting the argument that creationism is either "not that important" or that it should be taught in science classes as a means of "critical thinking" or what have you, well so be it.

100 Mich-again  Thu, Nov 15, 2012 12:28:52pm

re: #93 Feline Emperor of the Conservative Tears

I thought Trump's new fragrance was intended to do that.
//

I thought his fragrance was Aqua Net Hair Spray.

101 HappyWarrior  Thu, Nov 15, 2012 12:28:55pm

It doesn't mean a lot but I look at the fact that Rubio endorsed Perry in the primaries for president. Rick Perry, a man who thinks homosexuality should be a crime is the man Bobby Jindal thought was the best fit for president.

102 Mich-again  Thu, Nov 15, 2012 12:30:57pm

re: #101 HappyWarrior

It doesn't mean a lot but I look at the fact that Rubio endorsed Perry in the primaries for president. Rick Perry, a man who thinks homosexuality should be a crime is the man Bobby Jindal thought was the best fit for president.

Rick Perry, the guy who slashed the state budget for fire fighting efforts and then asked everyone to pray for rain to stop the wildfires.

103 HappyWarrior  Thu, Nov 15, 2012 12:32:13pm

re: #102 Mich-again

Rick Perry, the guy who slashed the state budget for fire fighting efforts and then asked everyone to pray for rain to stop the wildfires.

Rick Perry who once said secession should be at least considered.

104 Sol Berdinowitz  Thu, Nov 15, 2012 12:32:21pm

Remember we had Ann Coulter here last week sounding like the voice of reason on the issue of rape.

They need to seriously distance themselves from the rapey guys, the voters have managed to do most of that for them.

But when are they going to make the hard choice of distancing themselves from the racists, birthers, anti-sciencers and budding secessionists among the party? They still need them at a local level.

105 Ghost of Tom Joad  Thu, Nov 15, 2012 12:32:26pm

re: #99 Targetpractice

I think you make a prudent point, and it does seem to fall into the whole idea of "tribalism" and party before pragmatism.

Trying to equate it, it's like Eagle fans and Vick (when he first started out there). He's a piece of shit, but he might win us a super bowl, so all is forgiven. (Sorry, I know some won't get the reference)

106 Charles Johnson  Thu, Nov 15, 2012 12:34:13pm

re: #72 Dark_Falcon

No, I'm calling Charles a liberal.

What was your first clue?

107 Big Steve  Thu, Nov 15, 2012 12:34:28pm

Hey KG....did you notice I accidentally made the top 10 the other day....I am so ashamed!

108 Ghost of Tom Joad  Thu, Nov 15, 2012 12:34:55pm

re: #106 Charles Johnson

What was your first clue?

Wild guess: belief in reality.

109 Mich-again  Thu, Nov 15, 2012 12:34:57pm

re: #104 Sol Berdinowitz

But when are they going to make the hard choice of distancing themselves from the racists, birthers, anti-sciencers and budding secessionists among the party? They still need them at a local level.

That would decimate the party. One or more of those descriptors applies to about what.. 50% at least.

110 Kragar  Thu, Nov 15, 2012 12:35:45pm

re: #103 HappyWarrior

Rick Perry who once said secession should be at least considered.

Rick Perry, who just announced he wants to piss away money drug testing all applicants for unemployment benefits, including benefits set aside to assist children.

111 HappyWarrior  Thu, Nov 15, 2012 12:36:48pm

re: #110 Kragar

Rick Perry, who just announced he wants to piss away money drug testing all applicants for unemployment benefits, including benefits set aside to assist children.

Yep and I am sure if you asked Jindal he would probably agree with this and much of Perry's policies. There's nothing moderate or reasonable about Bobby Jindal.

112 wrenchwench  Thu, Nov 15, 2012 12:37:11pm

re: #96 dragonath

I might have had a little bit more respect for Jindal if he had said something against the "repeal the 14th Amendment" whackos inside the Romney campaign.

Or anything substantive.

113 Killgore Trout  Thu, Nov 15, 2012 12:38:07pm

re: #107 Big Steve

Hey KG....did you notice I accidentally made the top 10 the other day....I am so ashamed!

Just don't let it happen again./

114 Mich-again  Thu, Nov 15, 2012 12:38:17pm

Bobby Jindall's target base are folks like Mama from the movie Waterboy.

115 Dark_Falcon  Thu, Nov 15, 2012 12:38:28pm

re: #105 Ghost of Tom Joad

I think you make a prudent point, and it does seem to fall into the whole idea of "tribalism" and party before pragmatism.

Trying to equate it, it's like Eagle fans and Vick (when he first started out there). He's a piece of shit, but he might win us a super bowl, so all is forgiven. (Sorry, I know some won't get the reference)

If he comes back healthy. I do hope he fully recovers, concussions are nasty business.

116 Charles Johnson  Thu, Nov 15, 2012 12:38:55pm

re: #112 wrenchwench

Or anything substantive.

It's kind of amazing, when you actually read this. He really doesn't make a single concrete suggestion. It's pure bullshit.

117 RadicalModerate  Thu, Nov 15, 2012 12:40:48pm

I have to address this statement by Jindal:

There are many challenges facing our country. For example, our education system seems to be in the Stone Age and miserably outdated.

Let us take a quick look at how Gov. Jindal is dealing with the failings of education:

Image: Louisiana_University_Cumulative_Reductions_to_Date_12-16-10_web.jpg
Source:
[Link: www.ulsystem.net...]

Note: this does not include Louisiana State University, which is the state's largest university, who had an even bigger budgetary reduction than the rest of the university system - combined.

[Link: www.lsu.edu...]

118 Ghost of Tom Joad  Thu, Nov 15, 2012 12:40:54pm

re: #116 Charles Johnson

It's kind of amazing, when you actually read this. He really doesn't make a single concrete suggestion. It's pure bullshit.

It's the same shit in a new wrapper.

119 Kragar  Thu, Nov 15, 2012 12:41:54pm

Beck: Obama's Re-Election is the 'Worst Choice in the History of Our Planet'

The re-election of President Obama has hastened Glenn Beck's full-blown transformation from one-time "rodeo clown" to borderline doomsday cult leader who now seems to spend the bulk of his time warning his listeners that the entire "system" is on the verge of collapse, so they need to take all necessary steps to be prepared ... which, of course, include subscribing to Beck's "The Blaze" network.

And Beck desperately needs subscribers to his network so that it can expand and get the truth out "to anybody who is possibly willing to wake up" because preaching to the choir is just not going to cut it, as was amply demonstrated by the recent election in which "62 million Americans ... made the worst choice in the history of our planet":

Worse than that time I decided to keep making out with the girl whose jaw kept clicking? Worse than the decisions which led to me waking up in a strangers apartment with a cat litter box to one side of me and a Navy MP passed out on the other? I find that hard to believe.

120 elektramourns  Thu, Nov 15, 2012 12:42:25pm

He invites comparison with Nikki Haley, the Indian-American governor of South Carolina, who just escaped from a hacking scandal whereby someone stole the identify, from the Dept. of Revenues files, of millions fo South Carolina. If you want to read all about this "rising" GOP star, who isn't worth the toliet paper she wipes her ass on, go to [Link: www.fitsnews.com,...] and imbibe the daily drama surrounding her ethical challenges, how she pisses off solons in the state legislature, her failing leadership, and whatnot. Anyone with a "R" behind his or her name can win a spot in politics here. It is that dumb and that corrupt in this sweet little old pocket of the Old South. It is tragic to see how the GOP has fucked South Carolina over.

Haley is a a fucking trainwreck yet the national GOP just loves the bitch.

121 Mich-again  Thu, Nov 15, 2012 12:42:40pm

re: #117 RadicalModerate

There are many challenges facing our country. For example, our education system seems to be in the Stone Age and miserably outdated.

In the creationist history, there was no stone age.

122 efuseakay  Thu, Nov 15, 2012 12:42:44pm

Jindal/Huckabee 2016!!!

123 engineer cat  Thu, Nov 15, 2012 12:42:54pm

re: #62 Feline Emperor of the Conservative Tears

Vote NO on Magna Carta!

GOP Leaders Declare Magna Carta Big Government Intrusion That Will Kill Business

restraint of royal privileges contrary to free royal market principles, caters to crony baron interests

124 Bulworth  Thu, Nov 15, 2012 12:43:24pm

re: #119 Kragar

Well, no, it wasn't worse than those two episodes you mentioned, but other than those two, yes. //

125 Sol Berdinowitz  Thu, Nov 15, 2012 12:44:01pm

re: #120 elektramourns

Haley is a a fucking trainwreck yet the national GOP just loves the bitch.

They need someone they can put up there to demonstrate that they are not just the party of white males.

126 HappyWarrior  Thu, Nov 15, 2012 12:44:05pm

re: #119 Kragar

Beck: Obama's Re-Election is the 'Worst Choice in the History of Our Planet'

Worse than that time I decided to keep making out with the girl whose jaw kept clicking? Worse than the decisions which led to me waking up in a strangers apartment with a cat litter box to one side of me and a Navy MP passed out on the other? I find that hard to believe.

The worst choice in the history of our planet? Hell it probably wasn't even the worst choice made that day. I mean look at the 59 million people who voted for Romney. I jest but seriously the worst decision in the history of planet? For someone who loves to invoke Hitler like he does, he ignores the decision by Hindenburg and Von Papen to make Hitler chancellor in 1933.

127 allegro  Thu, Nov 15, 2012 12:44:19pm

re: #110 Kragar

Rick Perry, who just announced he wants to piss away money drug testing all applicants for unemployment benefits, including benefits set aside to assist children.

Rick Perry, who has decimated health care for women by denying funds to Planned Parenthood. Unfortunately, just held up by the Texas courts.

I really hate that guy.

128 A Mom Anon  Thu, Nov 15, 2012 12:44:47pm

Again with the damned "damaging the brand" horseshit. They haven't learned a fucking thing. And they won't. Which sucks because we need sane leadership ON BOTH SIDES. Fuck I am sick of this. And then he says they need to stop treating us like we're stupid. Jesus H Christ. You aren't selling crappy pizza or laundry detergent Gov Jindal. Go away.

129 HappyWarrior  Thu, Nov 15, 2012 12:44:57pm

re: #127 allegro

Rick Perry, who has decimated health care for women by denying funds to Planned Parenthood. Unfortunately, just held up by the Texas courts.

I really hate that guy.

I really can't believe that guy is the longest tenured governor in the country.

130 Ghost of Tom Joad  Thu, Nov 15, 2012 12:45:57pm

re: #129 HappyWarrior

I really can't believe that guy is the longest tenured governor in the country.

It's Texas.....

131 engineer cat  Thu, Nov 15, 2012 12:46:11pm

Beck: Obama's Re-Election is the 'Worst Choice in the History of Our Planet'

californians put mustard on their hamburgers

top that

132 wrenchwench  Thu, Nov 15, 2012 12:46:15pm

re: #116 Charles Johnson

It's kind of amazing, when you actually read this. He really doesn't make a single concrete suggestion. It's pure bullshit.

I keep seeing the assertion that they just need to articulate their ideas better, that it's a matter of communication.

No, Republicans. Your problem is that you have been heard. Most importantly, we heard what you say when you thought we weren't listening.

133 Sol Berdinowitz  Thu, Nov 15, 2012 12:46:57pm

re: #129 HappyWarrior

I really can't believe that guy is the longest tenured governor in the country.

I was worried when he eneterd the GOP primary race, I assumed he would be the man to walk away with the nomination, but he seemed incapable of playing outside Texas.

134 HappyWarrior  Thu, Nov 15, 2012 12:47:15pm

re: #130 Ghost of Tom Joad

It's Texas.....

Yeah I know though Arizona's been giving them a competition lately.

135 Feline Emperor of the Conservative Tears  Thu, Nov 15, 2012 12:48:19pm

re: #123 engineer cat

GOP Leaders Declare Magna Carta Big Government Intrusion That Will Kill Business

restraint of royal privileges contrary to free royal market principles, caters to crony baron interests

Both parties declare peasants revolting.
/

136 Sophist is the VillageGreen Preservation Society  Thu, Nov 15, 2012 12:48:56pm

re: #130 Ghost of Tom Joad

It's Texas.....

I think you mean "Forget it Happy, it's Texas".

137 Feline Emperor of the Conservative Tears  Thu, Nov 15, 2012 12:50:03pm

re: #131 engineer cat

Beck: Obama's Re-Election is the 'Worst Choice in the History of Our Planet'

californians put mustard on their hamburgers

top that

pineapple on pizza?!?

;P

138 HappyWarrior  Thu, Nov 15, 2012 12:50:51pm

re: #132 wrenchwench

I keep seeing the assertion that they just need to articulate their ideas better, that it's a matter of communication.

No, Republicans. Your problem is that you have been heard. Most importantly, we heard what you say when you thought we weren't listening.

Yes, pretty much. And I know no Republican official will ever say it but a large part of the problem is their base. Their base is replacing people like Lugar with Mourdock. They're the ones nominating them for important positions. Of course, the politicians are equally responsible for pandering to far right wing bullshit to get nominated. They need to re-examine their ideas big time.

139 elektramourns  Thu, Nov 15, 2012 12:51:01pm

someone should do a detailed analysis of all the federal disaster aid he has taken from the federal government after all the weather events affecting his state while he was (is) in office, and then rebut him with those cold hard facts whenever he slams the federal government.

He is just another conservative dickhead.

140 wrenchwench  Thu, Nov 15, 2012 12:51:05pm

re: #120 elektramourns

That's a little harsh in places, but the only criticism I can make is that your link doesn't work.

141 Kragar  Thu, Nov 15, 2012 12:51:49pm

re: #136 Sophist is the VillageGreen Preservation Society

I think you mean "Forget it Tom, it's Texas".

HE'S MY GOVERNOR! HE'S A MORON! MY GOVERNOR! A MORON! MY GOVERNOR AND A MORON!

142 Dark_Falcon  Thu, Nov 15, 2012 12:52:00pm

re: #117 RadicalModerate

I have to address this statement by Jindal:

Let us take a quick look at how Gov. Jindal is dealing with the failings of education:

Image: Louisiana_University_Cumulative_Reductions_to_Date_12-16-10_web.jpg
Source:
[Link: www.ulsystem.net...]

Note: this does not include Louisiana State University, which is the state's largest university, who had an even bigger budgetary reduction than the rest of the university system - combined.

[Link: www.lsu.edu...]

Are those outright reductions or just where the university got less than they wanted?

143 Obdicut  Thu, Nov 15, 2012 12:53:06pm

re: #142 Dark_Falcon

Oh, so suddenly you do want to talk about Jindal and education? Cool.

Can you explain your opinion of Jindal's allowing public funding to go to religious education in Louisiana?

144 aagcobb  Thu, Nov 15, 2012 12:53:11pm

re: #119 Kragar

Beck: Obama's Re-Election is the 'Worst Choice in the History of Our Planet'

Worse than that time I decided to keep making out with the girl whose jaw kept clicking? Worse than the decisions which led to me waking up in a strangers apartment with a cat litter box to one side of me and a Navy MP passed out on the other? I find that hard to believe.

In my personal opinion, Hindenburg's selection of Hitler as Chancellor of Germany was the worst choice in the history of the planet. But that's just me.

145 allegro  Thu, Nov 15, 2012 12:53:13pm

re: #129 HappyWarrior

I really can't believe that guy is the longest tenured governor in the country.

Me too neither. I'm still in shock that Dubya beat Ann Richards way back when. That was the beginning of the great Texas decline.

It's damn depressing. Texas is truly one of the greatest states in the nation, leading in medicine and technology. Our natural resources rock. It has been my home for almost 40 years now and I love this state that has given me a fine career and great life. Seeing what has happened to it at the hands of these assholes just breaks my heart.

146 HappyWarrior  Thu, Nov 15, 2012 12:55:22pm

re: #145 allegro

Me too neither. I'm still in shock that Dubya beat Ann Richards way back when. That was the beginning of the great Texas decline.

It's damn depressing. Texas is truly one of the greatest states in the nation, leading in medicine and technology. Our natural resources rock. It has been my home for almost 40 years now and I love this state that has given me a fine career and great life. Seeing what has happened to it at the hands of these assholes just breaks my heart.

I'm really hoping after seeing him speak at the DNC that Julian Castro runs. I'm very impressed with him.

147 Big Steve  Thu, Nov 15, 2012 12:55:28pm

re: #120 elektramourns

Haley is a a fucking trainwreck yet the national GOP just loves the bitch.

Was that comment necessary?

148 HappyWarrior  Thu, Nov 15, 2012 12:56:03pm

re: #144 aagcobb

In my personal opinion, Hindenburg's selection of Hitler as Chancellor of Germany was the worst choice in the history of the planet. But that's just me.

Nah, it was Obama. Glenn Beck didn't cry when Hindenberg appointed Hitler, he did when Obama got re-elected so it's Obama.

149 Obdicut  Thu, Nov 15, 2012 12:56:09pm

re: #120 elektramourns

Calling women 'bitches' is stupid as shit. Stop that idiotic assholery.

150 Kragar  Thu, Nov 15, 2012 12:56:14pm

re: #144 aagcobb

In my personal opinion, Hindenburg's selection of Hitler as Chancellor of Germany was the worst choice in the history of the planet. But that's just me.

"Guys, I'd like to introduce to our newest member. Let us all welcome Judas."

151 aagcobb  Thu, Nov 15, 2012 12:56:18pm

re: #133 Sol Berdinowitz

I was worried when he eneterd the GOP primary race, I assumed he would be the man to walk away with the nomination, but he seemed incapable of playing outside Texas.

In Texas he never debates because he doesn't have to. A wise choice, as we saw. "Oops."

152 Mich-again  Thu, Nov 15, 2012 12:57:02pm

The worst choice in the history of the planet?

Easy. Noah. He could have killed those two mosquitoes.

153 elektramourns  Thu, Nov 15, 2012 12:57:36pm

see [Link: www.fitsnews.com...] for all the dirt on Bobby's Evil Twin Sister, Governor Nikki Haley of South Carolina.

154 Obdicut  Thu, Nov 15, 2012 12:57:36pm

re: #150 Kragar

"Guys, I'd like to introduce to our newest member. Let us all welcome Judas."

If you don't like Judas, you don't like salvation. Judas was key.*

*This is according to modern Christian interpretation. There's not a ton of direct evidence in the New Testament that Jesus's death was actually a necessary part of salvation.

155 HappyWarrior  Thu, Nov 15, 2012 12:57:56pm

"Hmmm finance my next play or keep this Ruth fella who draws big crowds and is changing the game of baseball as we know it. Oh hell, I can always get new players. I mean it's not like we'll go without a World Series title for eighty six years."

156 Dark_Falcon  Thu, Nov 15, 2012 12:57:59pm

re: #143 Obdicut

Oh, so suddenly you do want to talk about Jindal and education? Cool.

Can you explain your opinion of Jindal's allowing public funding to go to religious education in Louisiana?

Simple: I think Jindal can improve the party nationally, and for that I'm prepared to ignore a great deal.

157 dragonath  Thu, Nov 15, 2012 12:58:29pm

re: #156 Dark_Falcon

Image: angry-cat.jpg

158 HappyWarrior  Thu, Nov 15, 2012 12:58:36pm

re: #152 Mich-again

The worst choice in the history of the planet?

Easy. Noah. He could have killed those two mosquitoes.

Or cut down the damn thorn bushes.

159 Mich-again  Thu, Nov 15, 2012 12:58:44pm

re: #156 Dark_Falcon

Simple: I think Jindal can improve the party nationally, and for that I'm prepared to ignore a great deal.

4 years is a long time to keep a clothespin on your nostrils.

160 Kragar  Thu, Nov 15, 2012 12:59:23pm

re: #154 Obdicut

If you don't like Judas, you don't like salvation. Judas was key.*

*This is according to modern Christian interpretation. There's not a ton of direct evidence in the New Testament that Jesus's death was actually a necessary part of salvation.

Everyone knows Jesus was taken down off the cross, got married, had kids and lived another couple years until he was run over by a runaway cart.

161 erik_t  Thu, Nov 15, 2012 12:59:53pm

re: #156 Dark_Falcon

Simple: I think Jindal can improve the party nationally, and for that I'm prepared to ignore a great deal.

You trust that the man will make everything better, despite the fact that everything he's had a chance to affect he has made worse.

I'm beginning to see a pattern here.

162 aagcobb  Thu, Nov 15, 2012 12:59:56pm

re: #145 allegro

Me too neither. I'm still in shock that Dubya beat Ann Richards way back when. That was the beginning of the great Texas decline.

It's damn depressing. Texas is truly one of the greatest states in the nation, leading in medicine and technology. Our natural resources rock. It has been my home for almost 40 years now and I love this state that has given me a fine career and great life. Seeing what has happened to it at the hands of these assholes just breaks my heart.

Their day is coming to an end, and soon, as rapidly as the hispanic population of Texas is growing. Of course, if SCOTUS guts the Voting Rights Act as expected, then they can get more serious about vote suppression and extend their time in power before the demographics finally overwhelms them.

163 allegro  Thu, Nov 15, 2012 1:00:40pm

re: #146 HappyWarrior

I'm really hoping after seeing him speak at the DNC that Julian Castro runs. I'm very impressed with him.

I am too. I fell in love with him during the convention and would support his run for governor with everything I have. What a change that would be! I have hopes. The gerrymandering (that caused congressional Dems to actually leave the country to prevent a quorum - that was so cool) has been shot down by the courts. I don't know where it stands now but if we can get control of that, it could go far in releasing the Republican stranglehold on the state. So much of Texas is dark blue - all of the major cities and most of SW Texas up to El Paso.

164 Feline Emperor of the Conservative Tears  Thu, Nov 15, 2012 1:01:01pm

re: #162 aagcobb

Their day is coming to an end, and soon, as rapidly as the hispanic population of Texas is growing. Of course, if SCOTUS guts the Voting Rights Act as expected, then they can get more serious about vote suppression and extend their time in power before the demographics finally overwhelms them.

They fear the day when "Vote for Pedro" means more than a jokey reference to an eccentric movie.

165 Obdicut  Thu, Nov 15, 2012 1:01:07pm

re: #156 Dark_Falcon

Simple: I think Jindal can improve the party nationally, and for that I'm prepared to ignore a great deal.

No, Dark. That's not your opinion. That's you giving no opinion, just ignoring it.

How will Jindal help the party? Will he help them drop the anti-science plank that's making them actively harmful to America through denial of AGW?

166 reine.de.tout  Thu, Nov 15, 2012 1:01:25pm

re: #4 Dark_Falcon

Bobby Jindal gets attacked by liberal = dog bites man. Too ordinary to be worthy of notice.

I had to log in to respond, DF. This post is right on target re: Jindal. This is Jindal beginning his campaign for president.

Everything Charles posted about Jindal is spot on. I know a ton of conservatives here (including myself) who rue the day we ever felt supportive of Bobby Jindal. He is a huge disappointment, in every way. In addition to what Charles posted... Jindal is secretive, not accountable, pays no attention to anyone, and if he wants something done and the legislature (and the public) don't go along? He will find another way, the legislative process be damned.

167 HappyWarrior  Thu, Nov 15, 2012 1:01:34pm

re: #156 Dark_Falcon

Simple: I think Jindal can improve the party nationally, and for that I'm prepared to ignore a great deal.

So, you'd ignore policy and only care about the fact that you think he can improve your party nationally. If you want to know why your party's going to have long term struggles, this is why. You can't realistically expect people to ignore Jindal's actual record.

168 Obdicut  Thu, Nov 15, 2012 1:02:26pm

re: #161 erik_t

You trust that the man will make everything better, despite the fact that everything he's had a chance to affect he has made worse.

I'm beginning to see a pattern here.

The idea that Jindal-- Kenneth the page, closed-door-office, no-national-presence Jindal is being sold as national savior for the GOP is mindboggling. He can get elected in Louisiana with a very religious population and very socially conservative population. How likely is that to sell in Ohio?

169 erik_t  Thu, Nov 15, 2012 1:02:29pm

re: #156 Dark_Falcon

Simple: I think Jindal can improve the party nationally, and for that I'm prepared to ignore a great deal.

"Improve the party", not "improve the country".

Sigh.

170 Sol Berdinowitz  Thu, Nov 15, 2012 1:02:43pm

re: #156 Dark_Falcon

Simple: I think Jindal can improve the party nationally, and for that I'm prepared to ignore a great deal.

He could do a lot to improve their image, but I don't think anybody has the power to silence or distance themselves from the rapey, creationist, birther neo-secessionists who are taking over the party in the power vacuuum created by the fall of Karl Rove.

They will continue to talk about Obamaphones and busloads of black voters in Maine and whatever themes they can come up with to draw attention to themselves and their pathetic little local campaigns.
And all the "Obama-loving mainstream meda" has to do "suppress voter turnout" is call attention to them and remind us all what a fundamental(ist) part of the GOP they truly are.

171 Mich-again  Thu, Nov 15, 2012 1:03:09pm

When Jindall runs in the 2016 primaries, the other GOP candidates are going to have to invest in new dog whistles with a slightly higher pitch.

172 Big Steve  Thu, Nov 15, 2012 1:03:27pm

re: #163 allegro

So much of Texas is dark blue

huh....Election Results Texas

173 makeitstop  Thu, Nov 15, 2012 1:03:40pm

I'm still try to work my way past Kragar's girl with the clicking jaw.

174 Feline Emperor of the Conservative Tears  Thu, Nov 15, 2012 1:03:48pm

re: #169 erik_t

"Improve the party", not "improve the country".

Sigh.

Get with the program. What is Good for the GOP is obviously what is Good for America. Are you some kind of commie!?!
:p ///

175 erik_t  Thu, Nov 15, 2012 1:04:26pm

re: #168 Obdicut

The idea that Jindal-- Kenneth the page, closed-door-office, no-national-presence Jindal is being sold as national savior for the GOP is mindboggling. He can get elected in Louisiana with a very religious population and very socially conservative population. How likely is that to sell in Ohio?

Eh. Yesterday it was Ryan, today it's Jindal, tomorrow it'll be Martinez from New Mexico. It's the flailing shotgun solution and has no particular relation to Jindal himself; it's as clear to you as it is to me that little actual thought is going on.

176 Obdicut  Thu, Nov 15, 2012 1:04:32pm

re: #172 Big Steve

huh....Election Results Texas

Look at the actual populations of the counties.

177 aagcobb  Thu, Nov 15, 2012 1:04:58pm

re: #172 Big Steve

huh....Election Results Texas

But a lot of that red is mostly empty space.

178 RadicalModerate  Thu, Nov 15, 2012 1:05:09pm

re: #142 Dark_Falcon

Are those outright reductions or just where the university got less than they wanted?

Those are across-the-board reductions in the number of dollars received by each of the schools in the state university system.

179 erik_t  Thu, Nov 15, 2012 1:05:30pm

re: #176 Obdicut

Look at the actual populations of the counties.

Do you mean to tell me, sirrah, that dirt doesn't vote!?

180 Interesting Times  Thu, Nov 15, 2012 1:05:55pm

re: #177 aagcobb

But a lot of that red is mostly empty space.

Much like the content of Perry's head? ;)

181 Killgore Trout  Thu, Nov 15, 2012 1:06:22pm

The latest anti-Israel conspiracy theory makes the DKos rec list.
Why I'm Rejecting Rabbi Yoffie's Call for Progressive Jews to Support Israel's Bombing of Gaza

The truth is this: Israel has engaged in its current, escalating military campaign not to protect Israelis from a militant Hamas, but in order to ensure that Hamas in Gaza remains militant. See, while Jaabari was a known terrorist who had his hand in the Gilad Shalit kidnapping, he was also the Hamas leader both willing and capable of enforcing ceasefire agreements. In fact, as Gershon Baskin writes in "Assassinating the Chance for Calm," Jaabari was considering a ceasefire proposal the moment he was assassinated. And Baskin should know, for he was working closely with Hamas officials on the proposal itself.

So why would Israel assassinate a Hamas official, a move guaranteed to provoke extreme outrage and revenge, at a time when Hamas leaders were working on a ceasefire? The answer is simple and twofold: a) Netanyahu's government wants a militant Hamas in Gaza; it wants a situation in which Gaza becomes isolated from the West Bank, hoping eventually Greater Israel will be obtained with Gaza becoming a separate entity, and b) with Israeli elections set for January, electoral motivations are undeniably in play with regard to this sudden military barrage.

182 Ghost of Tom Joad  Thu, Nov 15, 2012 1:06:54pm

re: #181 Killgore Trout

SQUIRREL!

183 Mich-again  Thu, Nov 15, 2012 1:07:00pm

re: #178 RadicalModerate

Those are across-the-board reductions in the number of dollars received by each of the schools in the state university system.

Mitt had an answer for that problem. He was going to fast track green cards for foreigners with technical degrees. We can't grow enough of our own engineers and scientists so we need to import them from the developing Nations. Which shows he really did want to bring his business acumen to the WH.

184 Kragar  Thu, Nov 15, 2012 1:07:08pm

re: #173 makeitstop

I'm still try to work my way past Kragar's girl with the clicking jaw.

So am I.

185 gwangung  Thu, Nov 15, 2012 1:07:47pm

A sort of rebuttal to Jindal's call from another Indian American:

[Link: www.thedailybeast.com...]

186 Mich-again  Thu, Nov 15, 2012 1:07:56pm

re: #184 Kragar

So am I.

I dated a midget once...

I was nuts over her.

187 dragonath  Thu, Nov 15, 2012 1:08:22pm

okay, that didn't work

188 Ghost of Tom Joad  Thu, Nov 15, 2012 1:08:24pm

re: #179 erik_t

Do you mean to tell me, sirrah, that dirt doesn't vote!?

With the way the empty space seems to vote Republican, I'm surprised they haven't tried to give dirt at least 3/5ths of a vote.

189 allegro  Thu, Nov 15, 2012 1:08:35pm

re: #172 Big Steve

huh....Election Results Texas

As I said, the major cities and SW Texas. The blue counties on that map include Dallas, Austin, San Antonio, Houston, and El Paso. I'm actually kinda surprised that according to the map also includes Beaumont/Pt. Arthur.

190 Obdicut  Thu, Nov 15, 2012 1:09:30pm

re: #166 reine.de.tout

Conservatives in Louisiana deserve a better voice than Jindal to represent them. Sadly, I don't see the GOP primary process producing anyone better in the near future. We can but hope.

191 Our Precious Bodily Fluids  Thu, Nov 15, 2012 1:10:33pm

re: #129 HappyWarrior

I really can't believe that guy is the longest tenured governor in the country.

Why not? 90% of his track record consists of doling out sweet deals to his campaign contributors. Even that well-known far-left rag, the Wall Street Journal thinks he's bent.

192 Big Steve  Thu, Nov 15, 2012 1:10:48pm

re: #176 Obdicut

Look at the actual populations of the counties.

Sure Bexar and Harris and Tarrant counties are blue but in Texas most of the big cities have gigantic suburbs that are the surrounding counties. If you look at Houston (Harris County) surrounding counties of Galveston, Brazoria, Ft Bend, Walker.....all strongly red.

193 HappyWarrior  Thu, Nov 15, 2012 1:11:17pm

re: #185 gwangung

A sort of rebuttal to Jindal's call from another Indian American:

[Link: www.thedailybeast.com...]

That's a much better piece. If I didn't know any better, I'd think the writer of that piece was the two term governor and the writer of the front piece was the college student.

194 Interesting Times  Thu, Nov 15, 2012 1:11:40pm

re: #189 allegro

As I said, the major cities and SW Texas. The blue counties on that map include Dallas, Austin, San Antonio, Houston, and El Paso. I'm actually kinda surprised that according to the map also includes Beaumont/Pt. Arthur.

Someone needs to do a map like this for Texas, where regions are sized not according to area, but population (the image shows 2012 election results).

195 Obdicut  Thu, Nov 15, 2012 1:12:33pm

re: #192 Big Steve

Okay, man. There's lots of Democrats in Texas. Lots of Republicans in Massachusetts. We shouldn't forget that. There are pockets and towns and counties that, for whatever reason, go strongly one way or the other, all over the country. It's a good thing, really.

196 Sol Berdinowitz  Thu, Nov 15, 2012 1:12:36pm

re: #194 Interesting Times

Someone needs to do a map like this for Texas, where regions are sized not according to area, but population.

dude, those 'shrooms are finally kicking in!

197 elektramourns  Thu, Nov 15, 2012 1:12:53pm

now if all of you anti-Jindal people don't apologize and offer the hand of friendship, I am going to get his Evil Twin Sister, Guvner Nikki Haley of South Carolina, to flash her Lee Neocon nails at you and scratch your eyeballs out !!

198 Ghost of Tom Joad  Thu, Nov 15, 2012 1:13:38pm

re: #156 Dark_Falcon

Simple: I think Jindal can improve the party nationally, and for that I'm prepared to ignore a great deal.

I happen to think that's pathetic. Guy's record doesn't matter, as long as he helps my team win. Which probably means you'll forgive "your party" for a host of transgressions as long as they win.

I try my damnedest to be subjective and give folks the benefit of the doubt, but, hey, whatever makes you happy in your world.

199 Our Precious Bodily Fluids  Thu, Nov 15, 2012 1:14:06pm

re: #144 aagcobb

In my personal opinion, Hindenburg's selection of Hitler as Chancellor of Germany was the worst choice in the history of the planet. But that's just me.

Well, it's right up there with the Random Item On A Stick that they serve at the Texas State Fair every year. Usually it's something like a pound of mac & cheese wrapped in a pan pizza, rolled in powdered sugar, then battered and deep fried. People eat it voluntarily.

200 A Mom Anon  Thu, Nov 15, 2012 1:14:09pm

re: #165 Obdicut

Good luck with that. I'm still waiting for DF to tell me why I should vote for Republicans,I think I tried initiating that conversation sometime in Sept or Oct. Put on some coffee and get comfy,it's going to be awhile.....

And DF,I am not ragging on you,I'd just like to know WHY you vote Republican and what the hell is so awful about being a liberal. That's all.
(also,I hope your job search yields a good result for you soon. BTDT and it pretty much sucks)

201 reine.de.tout  Thu, Nov 15, 2012 1:14:54pm

re: #190 Obdicut

Conservatives in Louisiana deserve a better voice than Jindal to represent them. Sadly, I don't see the GOP primary process producing anyone better in the near future. We can but hope.

I know several people who worked for him in the various state agencies where he held positions. Not a single one of them has any respect for him at all. Not.A.One. And that includes several extremely conservative folks ...

202 Sol Berdinowitz  Thu, Nov 15, 2012 1:15:08pm

This is a good one, it shows density in the shading and the voting not in red or blue but in the various gradations of purple.

2012 election map

203 Obdicut  Thu, Nov 15, 2012 1:15:49pm

re: #197 elektramourns

now if all of you anti-Jindal people don't apologize and offer the hand of friendship, I am going to get his Evil Twin Sister, Guvner Nikki Haley of South Carolina, to flash her Lee Neocon nails at you and scratch your eyeballs out !!

You're kind of weird, dude.

204 wrenchwench  Thu, Nov 15, 2012 1:16:13pm
205 RadicalModerate  Thu, Nov 15, 2012 1:16:47pm

re: #172 Big Steve

huh....Election Results Texas

Texas is one of the most-gerrymandered states when it comes to congressional districting in the entire country. It was so bad along racial lines that almost EVERY redrawn district after the 2010 Census was found in violation of the 1965 Voting Rights Act.
Texas Republcans response? They just called for repeal of the act in their state platform.

And keep in mind this was after the blatant power-grab done by the Republican Party (spearheaded, and financed by Tom DeLay via a money-laundering scheme that he was convicted in 2010 for) in a now-infamous redistricting case:

[Link: en.wikipedia.org...]

206 Interesting Times  Thu, Nov 15, 2012 1:17:26pm

re: #201 reine.de.tout

Thanks for commenting on this thread. I linked your prior Pages on this subject, but didn't want it to seem like I was trying to speak for you, because I wasn't - only paraphrasing what you said re Jindal to the best of my recollection.

207 Sol Berdinowitz  Thu, Nov 15, 2012 1:18:16pm

re: #204 wrenchwench

HEY WHICH ONE OF YOU MOOCHERS TAPED ME TALKING MIERDA TO MY DONORS?

I see this as a sort of sweet irony. By outsourcing all those jobs to China, Mitt made it possible for even a catering worker to be able to afford an imported camera phone which he was then inspired to turn on to tape Mitt...

208 Dark_Falcon  Thu, Nov 15, 2012 1:18:25pm

Why I like Bobby Jindal: Because he is a Republican with energy whom I do not think is a hater. I like him because he's not some clueless old white guy, and as such might be able to avoid some of the party's negatives. He
also understands the need for outreach and that the party must grow to survive.

209 dragonath  Thu, Nov 15, 2012 1:18:50pm

re: #197 elektramourns

now if all of you anti-Jindal people don't apologize and offer the hand of friendship, I am going to get his Evil Twin Sister, Guvner Nikki Haley of South Carolina, to flash her Lee Neocon nails at you and scratch your eyeballs out !!

She's an evil twin sister, because she too is an Indian? Is Obama's twin brother Alan Keyes or something?

I don't like his politics. Keep the ethnicity out of it.

210 Dark_Falcon  Thu, Nov 15, 2012 1:19:13pm

re: #201 reine.de.tout

I know several people who worked for him in the various state agencies where he held positions. Not a single one of them has any respect for him at all. Not.A.One. And that includes several extremely conservative folks ...

What do they think is wrong with him?

211 reine.de.tout  Thu, Nov 15, 2012 1:19:44pm

re: #206 Interesting Times

Thanks for commenting on this thread. I linked your prior Pages on this subject, but didn't want it to seem like I was trying to speak for you, because I wasn't - only paraphrasing what you said re Jindal to the best of my recollection.

:-)

212 Interesting Times  Thu, Nov 15, 2012 1:20:24pm

re: #192 Big Steve

Sure Bexar and Harris and Tarrant counties are blue but in Texas most of the big cities have gigantic suburbs that are the surrounding counties. If you look at Houston (Harris County) surrounding counties of Galveston, Brazoria, Ft Bend, Walker.....all strongly red.

Take a gander at this - election results 2012 population cartogram per country. How strong is that Texas red after all?

213 Big Steve  Thu, Nov 15, 2012 1:20:44pm

re: #197 elektramourns

who is this guy? strong troll odor.

214 Kragar  Thu, Nov 15, 2012 1:21:50pm

re: #208 Dark_Falcon

Why I like Bobby Jindal: Because he is a Republican with energy whom I do not think is a hater. I like him because he's not some clueless old white guy, and as such might be able to avoid some of the party's negatives. He
also understands the need for outreach and that the party must grow to survive.

The problem being he wants to reach out and grow so he can pass along the same garbage as the rest of the GOP.

215 Obdicut  Thu, Nov 15, 2012 1:21:54pm

re: #208 Dark_Falcon

Why I like Bobby Jindal: Because he is a Republican with energy whom I do not think is a hater. I like him because he's not some clueless old white guy, and as such might be able to avoid some of the party's negatives. He
also understands the need for outreach and that the party must grow to survive.

Do you have anything to say in response to Reine's points?

Honestly, the GOP could be like 500% more effective if they just admitted which of their candidates were massively flawed and didn't promote them. Instead, you get stuck into this Stepford rut where you have to pretend over and over. I mean, we all know that you said that Romney couldn't be trusted before you slipped over to supporting him.

How well did that work out?

It's time to stop approaching politics to win the game, and to try to actually turn the GOP into a modern party. Minorities aren't going to be fooled by having Jindal or another non-white on the ticket. It is the actual policies of the GOP that makes them voted against by those groups. You've gotta understand that.

216 Feline Emperor of the Conservative Tears  Thu, Nov 15, 2012 1:21:59pm

re: #194 Interesting Times

Someone needs to do a map like this for Texas, where regions are sized not according to area, but population (the image shows 2012 election results).

That shows you how distorted the liberal view of the United States is!
;)

217 Big Steve  Thu, Nov 15, 2012 1:22:12pm

re: #212 Interesting Times

Take a gander at this - election results 2012 population cartogram per country. How strong is that Texas red after all?

I sorry but the last LSD I took was in 1974 so I couldn't get a thing out of that map.

218 Sol Berdinowitz  Thu, Nov 15, 2012 1:22:29pm

re: #208 Dark_Falcon

Why I like Bobby Jindal: Because he is a Republican with energy whom I do not think is a hater. I like him because he's not some clueless old white guy, and as such might be able to avoid some of the party's negatives. He
also understands the need for outreach and that the party must grow to survive.

He gives lip service to the need for outreach, but what is going to happen with all the other mouth-breathers in the party when they try to implement any such ideas?

That is the major problem they have to face. They need the birthers, the creationists, the rape-babies-are-god's-will types to maintain their position in local and state elections in the states they continue to hold until demgraphics catch up with them.

Who will have the strength of will and the ability to tell these idiots that they are wrecking the party? They refuse to see the damage they have done already and do not seem capable of learning. For many, the only option is secession, if not from the nation then from the party.

219 wrenchwench  Thu, Nov 15, 2012 1:23:14pm

re: #208 Dark_Falcon

Why I like Bobby Jindal: Because he is a Republican with energy whom I do not think is a hater. I like him because he's not some clueless old white guy, and as such might be able to avoid some of the party's negatives. He
also understands the need for outreach and that the party must grow to survive.

You have set the bar so low, it's time to Limbo!

220 A Mom Anon  Thu, Nov 15, 2012 1:23:20pm

re: #208 Dark_Falcon

That says not one damned thing about how he has made his state a better place to live in his time as governor. Which translates into how good of a public servant he is. Which is kind of his JOB. Would you please go read up on some of the nonsense he's been pulling in LA before supporting him? You cannot possibly be this superficial Dark,or at least I hope not. Again,this is not about "rebranding". The policies and practices are horrible,THAT'S the problem and the only way to fix it is to stop acting like this is a damned football game or a way to piss off liberals. That doesn't help the country progress and grow.

221 Sol Berdinowitz  Thu, Nov 15, 2012 1:23:31pm

re: #212 Interesting Times

Take a gander at this - election results 2012 population cartogram per country. How strong is that Texas red after all?

WHOAAA, ey, now those 'shrooms are really kickin'!

222 Interesting Times  Thu, Nov 15, 2012 1:24:48pm

re: #217 Big Steve

I sorry but the last LSD I took was in 1974 so I couldn't get a thing out of that map.

Okay, try reading the page where it's from. It's a population cartogram, where the areas of the map are sized according to population rather than physical area. You have a PhD, and thus no excuse for failing to comprehend the concept :P

223 Dark_Falcon  Thu, Nov 15, 2012 1:25:04pm

re: #215 Obdicut

Do you have anything to say in response to Reine's points?

Honestly, the GOP could be like 500% more effective if they just admitted which of their candidates were massively flawed and didn't promote them. Instead, you get stuck into this Stepford rut where you have to pretend over and over. I mean, we all know that you said that Romney couldn't be trusted before you slipped over to supporting him.

How well did that work out?

It's time to stop approaching politics to win the game, and to try to actually turn the GOP into a modern party. Minorities aren't going to be fooled by having Jindal or another non-white on the ticket. It is the actual policies of the GOP that makes them voted against by those groups. You've gotta understand that.

but if you can't win in the short and mid-term, you won't have a party in the longer term.

224 Mich-again  Thu, Nov 15, 2012 1:25:06pm

re: #208 Dark_Falcon

I don't agree but I still gave you a plus for that..

225 makeitstop  Thu, Nov 15, 2012 1:25:19pm

re: #208 Dark_Falcon

Why I like Bobby Jindal: Because he is a Republican with energy whom I do not think is a hater. I like him because he's not some clueless old white guy, and as such might be able to avoid some of the party's negatives. He
also understands the need for outreach and that the party must grow to survive.

Shorter Dark: I bought his word salad by the pound.

You're falling for the con again, Dark. Somebody sounds reasonable for the time it takes to read an op-ed, and you conclude he's sane.

226 wrenchwench  Thu, Nov 15, 2012 1:25:50pm

re: #219 wrenchwench

You have set the bar so low, it's time to Limbo!

[Embedded content]

227 erik_t  Thu, Nov 15, 2012 1:27:04pm

re: #223 Dark_Falcon

but if you can't win in the short and mid-term, you won't have a party in the longer term.

Missing. The. Point.

228 A Mom Anon  Thu, Nov 15, 2012 1:27:21pm

re: #223 Dark_Falcon

And if your party is nothing but window dressing and hair spray the party isn't going to last anyway. Better to lose some now while admitting your mistakes and working to make the party better by making policy that's not stingy and mean spirited.

229 reine.de.tout  Thu, Nov 15, 2012 1:28:27pm

re: #210 Dark_Falcon

What do they think is wrong with him?

He thinks he knows best, even when it's obvious to EVERYBODY that he doesn't. He pays zero attention to any experts on any matter- he relies on whatever "expertise" is in his head, which more often than not is way off base. He does not engage anybody else in his decision making, with the result his decisions are often faulty, and in a big way. On that particular topic, I can't say more than that right now.

He is good at putting on a show during a crisis. But for the everyday things that have to be dealt with in running a state government.... Not. Will not answer questions. Keeps important matters secret and tries to accomplish them under the radar if he thinks there will be opposition. He does not know how to work WITH people...he only knows how to steamroll over them.

230 Ghost of Tom Joad  Thu, Nov 15, 2012 1:28:43pm

re: #228 A Mom Anon

And if your party is nothing but window dressing and hair spray the party isn't going to last anyway. Better to lose some now while admitting your mistakes and working to make the party better by making policy that's not stingy and mean spirited.

At this point, to borrow a war term, they need to blow up the party in order to save it.

231 dragonath  Thu, Nov 15, 2012 1:29:30pm

re: #226 wrenchwench

Wow, you'd have to be Plastic Man to beat that record.

232 Achilles Tang  Thu, Nov 15, 2012 1:29:58pm

re: #208 Dark_Falcon

Why I like Bobby Jindal: Because he is a Republican with energy whom I do not think is a hater. I like him because he's not some clueless old white guy, and as such might be able to avoid some of the party's negatives. He
also understands the need for outreach and that the party must grow to survive.

So why is he such a panderer to the religious right then? Is that what you call outreach?

233 Obdicut  Thu, Nov 15, 2012 1:30:14pm

re: #223 Dark_Falcon

but if you can't win in the short and mid-term, you won't have a party in the longer term.

That doesn't make any sense. It's the long-term I'm talking about. The GOP is basically the party of the south and west now. That isn't going to change. It's going to shrink and shrink and shrink until it actually changes policies.

The GOP may have to lose more and more for a couple of decades before it finally reforms or gives up the ghost. That is what these reactionary, rearguard actions achieve. It is not tenable.

In order to have a party in the long-term-- or to have a conservative party, whether it's named GOP or not-- there has to be real, substantive change.

Jindal isn't change.

234 Feline Emperor of the Conservative Tears  Thu, Nov 15, 2012 1:30:30pm

re: #229 reine.de.tout

He thinks he knows best, even when it's obvious to EVERYBODY that he doesn't. He pays zero attention to any experts on any matter- he relies on whatever "expertise" is in his head, which more often than not is way off base. He does not engage anybody else in his decision making, with the result his decisions are often faulty, and in a big way. On that particular topic, I can't say more than that right now.

He is good at putting on a show during a crisis. But for the everyday things that have to be dealt with in running a state government.... Not. Will not answer questions. Keeps important matters secret and tries to accomplish them under the radar if he thinks there will be opposition. He does not know how to work WITH people...he only knows how to steamroll over them.

Sounds like he believes in the Divine Right of kings (and governors).

235 Mich-again  Thu, Nov 15, 2012 1:30:40pm

re: #229 reine.de.tout

He thinks he knows best, even when it's obvious to EVERYBODY that he doesn't. He pays zero attention to any experts on any matter- he relies on whatever "expertise" is in his head, which more often than not is way off base. He does not engage anybody else in his decision making, with the result his decisions are often faulty, and in a big way. On that particular topic, I can't say more than that right now.

He is good at putting on a show during a crisis. But for the everyday things that have to be dealt with in running a state government.... Not. Will not answer questions. Keeps important matters secret and tries to accomplish them under the radar if he thinks there will be opposition. He does not know how to work WITH people...he only knows how to steamroll over them.

Don't hold back, tell us how you really feel about him?

236 Dark_Falcon  Thu, Nov 15, 2012 1:31:45pm

re: #229 reine.de.tout

He thinks he knows best, even when it's obvious to EVERYBODY that he doesn't. He pays zero attention to any experts on any matter- he relies on whatever "expertise" is in his head, which more often than not is way off base. He does not engage anybody else in his decision making, with the result his decisions are often faulty, and in a big way. On that particular topic, I can't say more than that right now.

He is good at putting on a show during a crisis. But for the everyday things that have to be dealt with in running a state government.... Not. Will not answer questions. Keeps important matters secret and tries to accomplish them under the radar if he thinks there will be opposition. He does not know how to work WITH people...he only knows how to steamroll over them.

OK, that is indeed a serious problem and I'll need to think about that one.

May I ask, though, if you'll be around a little or if you'll be back to watching from afar? I did enjoy you being here.

237 Feline Emperor of the Conservative Tears  Thu, Nov 15, 2012 1:32:11pm

re: #228 A Mom Anon

And if your party is nothing but window dressing and hair spray the party isn't going to last anyway. Better to lose some now while admitting your mistakes and working to make the party better by making policy that's not stingy and mean spirited.

But, but, they have a mannequin dressed as Ronald Reagan in their window!
//

238 erik_t  Thu, Nov 15, 2012 1:32:15pm

Sarah Palin is also not a "clueless old white guy". I wonder if DF thinks that helps her avoid some of her party's negatives.

SMFH.

239 wrenchwench  Thu, Nov 15, 2012 1:33:09pm

re: #231 dragonath

Wow, you'd have to be Plastic Man to beat that record.

I think that is Plastic Man!

240 Sol Berdinowitz  Thu, Nov 15, 2012 1:35:22pm

re: #215 Obdicut

Honestly, the GOP could be like 500% more effective if they just admitted which of their candidates were massively flawed and didn't promote them.

I saw them fall off that cliff when Karl Rove came out and said that Christine O'Donnell was unelectable and they should not nominate unelectable candidates and then had to walk it back.

She went on to prove his point.

But yes, it was an indefensible position, had he stuck to it, they would've blamed her loss on his lack of enthusiasm and not her imbecility.

And they could not even rid themselves of Todd Akin after he committed political hairi-kiri

241 erik_t  Thu, Nov 15, 2012 1:35:53pm

re: #225 makeitstop

Shorter Dark: I bought his word salad by the pound.

You're falling for the con again, Dark. Somebody sounds reasonable for the time it takes to read an op-ed, and you conclude he's sane.

Curiously, no discussion of policy changes from Jindal. Only messaging.

Now where have I seen this before......

242 reine.de.tout  Thu, Nov 15, 2012 1:37:18pm

re: #236 Dark_Falcon

OK, that is indeed a serious problem and I'll need to think about that one.

May I ask, though, if you'll be around a little or if you'll be back to watching from afar? I did enjoy you being here.

I peek in every day. I have no interest in getting into arguments or rudeness...I have no time for that, or to deal with anybody looking for bait rather than conversation. When I see a thread or comments where I feel I can add something of interest to the general conversation, I'll pop in! You also have my email, DF.

243 freetoken  Thu, Nov 15, 2012 1:37:21pm

Hypocrisy - thy initials are G.O.P.?

PRO-LIFE TENNESSEE CONGRESSMAN JUST HAVING ALL THE ABORTIONS SO NO ONE ELSE HAS TO

Remember Scott DesJarlais? Of course you do. He is the “pro-life congressman” who whined at (one of) his (many) mistress(es) to have an abortion — while recording the telephone call in which he pressured her (with his whining)? Well, now it appears the “consistently pro-life congressman” — who just won re-election — supported his wife in having two of them! It sounds to us like maybe Tennessee could fund Planned Parenthood a little better, so as poor, uneducated people like the doctor and his wife could get on birth control instead of murdering precious babies for fun!

[...]

DesJarlais must be a graduate from the Jindal School of Irony.

244 Dark_Falcon  Thu, Nov 15, 2012 1:40:18pm

re: #242 reine.de.tout

I peek in every day. I have no interest in getting into arguments or rudeness...I have no time for that, or to deal with anybody looking for bait rather than conversation. When I see a thread or comments where I feel I can add something of interest to the general conversation, I'll pop in! You also have my email, DF.

OK. Thanks.

BBL

245 Lidane  Thu, Nov 15, 2012 1:41:05pm

re: #31 Targetpractice

Really, all Jindal does with this editorial is jump on the same train most of his party has, declaring that their message was not at fault last week, but merely the presentation. And that, if they can somehow convince voters that being batshit crazy is a good thing, they can win them back.

THIS.

Jindal is just as blind and stupid as the rest of the GOP. The problem isn't in the messaging. It's the message itself.

You can't go around calling voting by black people potential fraud, or sneering about how you lost the election because the POTUS supposedly gave gifts and bribes to the lazy and shiftless (read: the non-white) parts of the country and expect to win those voters back just by re-framing your message.

At the rate they're going, the GOP is in very real danger of becoming a marginal party for disgruntled white guys. They either need to face reality or face irrelevance and nothing Jindal says here does a damn thing about addressing their problems.

246 freetoken  Thu, Nov 15, 2012 1:41:32pm

Today, in Jindal's America:


LETTER: Pursue the truth about Darwin's evolution

[...]

A recently completed, nine-year, multi-national project called Encyclopedia of DNA Elements (ENCODE) found that what was previously thought (by Darwinists) to be “junk” DNA is actually a very complex switching system, Upon hearing the results of the research, Larry Moran, a biochemist at the University of Toronto, stated, “The creationists are going to love this. This is going to make my life very complicated,” Why? Would not a true scientist pursue the truth no matter where it leads?

[...]

"JUNK" DNA!!!!!!

247 darthstar  Thu, Nov 15, 2012 1:43:47pm

John McCain's now losing his shit in public on a regular basis.

From linked CNN article within tweeted link:

When CNN approached McCain in a Capitol hallway Thursday morning, the senator refused to comment about why he missed the briefing, which was conducted by top diplomatic, military and counter-terrorism officials. Instead, McCain got testy when pressed to say why he wasn't there.

"I have no comment about my schedule and I'm not going to comment on how I spend my time to the media," McCain said.

Asked why he wouldn't comment, McCain grew agitated: "Because I have the right as a senator to have no comment and who the hell are you to tell me I can or not?

When CNN noted that McCain had missed a key meeting on a subject the senator has been intensely upset about, McCain said, "I'm upset that you keep badgering me."

248 A Mom Anon  Thu, Nov 15, 2012 1:45:35pm

re: #247 darthstar

I'd suggest Sen McCain stock up on big boy pants and stop the freaking whining.

249 erik_t  Thu, Nov 15, 2012 1:46:00pm

re: #247 darthstar

John McCain's now losing his shit in public on a regular basis.

old-man-yells-at-cloud.jpg

250 dragonath  Thu, Nov 15, 2012 1:46:10pm

re: #247 darthstar

This is rich, considering he's on all the Sunday talk shows.

251 dragonath  Thu, Nov 15, 2012 1:48:43pm

Anyway, I don't know what's worse, that Louisiana voted in the "Family Research Council" endorsed David Vitter, or that the Democrat in the last governor's election only got 17.8% of the vote.

It's going to take more than that for the GOP to clean house.

252 Sol Berdinowitz  Thu, Nov 15, 2012 1:50:29pm

re: #251 dragonath

Anyway, I don't know what's worse, that Louisiana voted in the "Family Research Council" endorsed David Vitter, or that the Democrat in the last governor's election only got 17.8% of the vote.

It's going to take more than that for the GOP to clean house.

And that is the point: these sort of knuckle-draggers are the very bedrock that the GOP rests on at state level, but they have just demonstrated that they cannot win an election on a national level even against a president in the midst of a foundering economy.

253 Lidane  Thu, Nov 15, 2012 1:51:49pm

re: #247 darthstar

John McCain's now losing his shit in public on a regular basis.

This is excellent news for John McCain!

///

254 EPR-radar  Thu, Nov 15, 2012 1:51:53pm

re: #245 Lidane

THIS.

Jindal is just as blind and stupid as the rest of the GOP. The problem isn't in the messaging. It's the message itself.

You can't go around calling voting by black people potential fraud, or sneering about how you lost the election because the POTUS supposedly gave gifts and bribes to the lazy and shiftless (read: the non-white) parts of the country and expect to win those voters back just by re-framing your message.

At the rate they're going, the GOP is in very real danger of becoming a marginal party for disgruntled white guys. They either need to face reality or face irrelevance and nothing Jindal says here does a damn thing about addressing their problems.

The problem is that no matter how bad the Republicans get, there a floor below which they cannot possibly fall (perhaps 45% or so of the electorate nation wide). Thus, they could make no policy changes at all and still have dangerously good chances of the presidency and/or congressional control.

All it would take is a mis-step by the Democrats and reduced self-inflicted wounds by the Republicans. If I were a nutball Republican, that would look like good odds to me.

255 goddamnedfrank  Thu, Nov 15, 2012 1:54:23pm

re: #40 Dark_Falcon

But Jindal isn't a racist, and he at least speaks the language of inclusion, even if others in the GOP do not.

John Derbyshire's only edge on Jindal is that he isn't a creationist. But Jindal still has him beat, since Jindal isn't an asshole.

Jindal is just another anti-gay bigoted piece of trash in your party.

re: #208 Dark_Falcon

Why I like Bobby Jindal: Because he is a Republican with energy whom I do not think is a hater. I like him because he's not some clueless old white guy, and as such might be able to avoid some of the party's negatives. He
also understands the need for outreach and that the party must grow to survive.

He is a hater, he just hates the same people you do. You're willing to overlook, dismiss and ignore his rampant anti-gay bigotry because gays don't register to you as real human beings, fellow citizens deserving of equal rights and freedom.

256 Sol Berdinowitz  Thu, Nov 15, 2012 1:55:11pm

re: #254 EPR-radar

The problem is that no matter how bad the Republicans get, there a floor below which they cannot possibly fall (perhaps 45% or so of the electorate nation wide). Thus, they could make no policy changes at all and still have dangerously good chances of the presidency and/or congressional control.

they can go lower than that if the economy recovers. the dems will have to go a long way to raise the same sort of hackles they raised by nominating Obama:

257 GunstarGreen  Thu, Nov 15, 2012 1:55:35pm

Yawn. Another day, another right-wing mouthpuppet flapping about "divisive politics" while openly supporting a candidate that was caught red-handed saying "47% of the country are worthless moochers that we shouldn't even bother with".

Wake me up when something interesting happens.

258 Kragar  Thu, Nov 15, 2012 1:55:35pm

Florida man threatens to ‘hunt down’ and kill President Obama

Well, let us know how that works out for you.
/

259 engineer cat  Thu, Nov 15, 2012 1:56:18pm

the gop keeps trying to figure out how to change without changing its principles

but it's problem is its principles

260 freetoken  Thu, Nov 15, 2012 1:56:54pm

In one sense I can't totally blame creationists for their ignorance, as much of the information industry obfuscates or just inaccurately reports what goes on in science, and many scientists themselves are piss poor at communicating what they are really doing.

For example, this, from a mainstream news outlet:

What made us human: 'unique' evolution gene found

Researchers have discovered a new gene they say helps explain how humans evolved from apes.

[...]

The team believe it emerged between six and one million years ago, after humans evolved from apes.

[...]

Both statements are misleading, harkening back to the idea of "if humans descended from chimps why are there still chimps around?" mindset of the creationists.

We know that the best way to understand our development is that we and "apes" come from a common ancestor.

Secondly, those statements ignore that we and the chimps/bonobos split off long after our common ancestor split off from the orangutans. So the word "apes" is too generic.

Indeed, in the opening line of the article doesn't really say anything accurate at all. One could replace "apes" with anything.

The spirit of the article is an attempt to make us humans "special", and that is at heart what creationists are trying to do.

Presumptions run deep.

261 Sol Berdinowitz  Thu, Nov 15, 2012 1:58:23pm

re: #258 Kragar

Florida man threatens to ‘hunt down’ and kill President Obama

Well, let us know how that works out for you.
/

His son:

“He barely has enough money to get back and forth to work,” he said, “how’s he going to do anything to the president?”

262 Sol Berdinowitz  Thu, Nov 15, 2012 2:00:16pm

re: #260 freetoken

It shows that we fail massively at teaching basic concepts of science.

To that extent, I have to agree with Bobby J, we are stuck in the Stone Age.

If of course, you believe that the Stone Age ever existed...

263 Decatur Deb  Thu, Nov 15, 2012 2:00:25pm

re: #242 reine.de.tout

I peek in every day. I have no interest in getting into arguments or rudeness...I have no time for that, or to deal with anybody looking for bait rather than conversation. When I see a thread or comments where I feel I can add something of interest to the general conversation, I'll pop in! You also have my email, DF.

Be sure to hang in for the next oil spill. BP was chided severely for the last one.

264 Lidane  Thu, Nov 15, 2012 2:02:08pm

re: #254 EPR-radar

The problem is that no matter how bad the Republicans get, there a floor below which they cannot possibly fall (perhaps 45% or so of the electorate nation wide). Thus, they could make no policy changes at all and still have dangerously good chances of the presidency and/or congressional control.

All it would take is a mis-step by the Democrats and reduced self-inflicted wounds by the Republicans. If I were a nutball Republican, that would look like good odds to me.

There's just one problem -- their electorate is increasingly made up solely from white people. Mitt Romney lost every minority demographic last week. Every single one. He even lost the Cuban vote in Florida, which hasn't happened to a Republican since the 60's.

The GOP either needs to accept reality or accept irrelevance. It's as simple as that.

265 freetoken  Thu, Nov 15, 2012 2:02:16pm

re: #262 Sol Berdinowitz

If of course, you believe that the Stone Age ever existed...

Early humans used stone-tipped spears 500,000 years ago

Early humans were already using stone tips to enhance the killing power of spears at least 500,000 years ago, some 200,000 years earlier than previously thought, anthropologists said Thursday.

[...]

Yeah, yeah, maybe we should have called it the "spear" age?

266 Kragar  Thu, Nov 15, 2012 2:03:39pm

Some scientists believe early humans were using stone spears as far back as the beginning of time, 6,000 years ago.

267 Decatur Deb  Thu, Nov 15, 2012 2:05:09pm

re: #264 Lidane

There's just one problem -- their electorate is increasingly made up solely from white people. Mitt Romney lost every minority demographic last week. Every single one. He even lost the Cuban vote in Florida, which hasn't happened to a Republican since the 60's.

The GOP either needs to accept reality or accept irrelevance. It's as simple as that.

If they accept reality, they're Blue-dog Democrats.

268 Lidane  Thu, Nov 15, 2012 2:05:42pm

re: #266 Kragar

Some scientists believe early humans were using stone spears as far back as the beginning of time, 6,000 years ago.

Yep. We were using stone spears to prod the woolly mammoth dishwashers to do their damn jobs.

///

269 EPR-radar  Thu, Nov 15, 2012 2:06:04pm

re: #264 Lidane

There's just one problem -- their electorate is increasingly made up solely from white people. Mitt Romney lost every minority demographic last week. Every single one. He even lost the Cuban vote in Florida, which hasn't happened to a Republican since the 60's.

The GOP either needs to accept reality or accept irrelevance. It's as simple as that.

I agree that they are in deep trouble long term, unless major changes are made. However, a nutbag (R) would have a finite change of winning the presidency in 2016 (and possibly even 2020). If the crazies in the party see it the same way I do, they will be highly motivated to keep a death grip on control of the party in the next few election cycles.

270 reine.de.tout  Thu, Nov 15, 2012 2:06:25pm

re: #263 Decatur Deb

Be sure to hang in for the next oil spill. BP was chided severely for the last one.

Two BP employees charged with manslaughter; another charged with lying to federal investigators.

271 HappyWarrior  Thu, Nov 15, 2012 2:06:43pm

I think part of the problem may be the way they nominate their candidates. It's pretty much always "next in line" or at least it's been that way since Bush I succeeded Reagan and one could even argue Reagan in 1980 too since Reagan had been the runner up in '76.

272 Political Atheist  Thu, Nov 15, 2012 2:07:47pm

re: #229 reine.de.tout

He thinks he knows best, even when it's obvious to EVERYBODY that he doesn't. He pays zero attention to any experts on any matter- he relies on whatever "expertise" is in his head, which more often than not is way off base. He does not engage anybody else in his decision making, with the result his decisions are often faulty, and in a big way. On that particular topic, I can't say more than that right now.

He is good at putting on a show during a crisis. But for the everyday things that have to be dealt with in running a state government.... Not. Will not answer questions. Keeps important matters secret and tries to accomplish them under the radar if he thinks there will be opposition. He does not know how to work WITH people...he only knows how to steamroll over them.

Hi There!
*waves*

273 freetoken  Thu, Nov 15, 2012 2:08:22pm

re: #266 Kragar

Some scientists believe early humans were using stone spears as far back as the beginning of time, 6,000 years ago.

Well, the word "stone" first shows up in the story about Babel:

Now the whole world had one language and a common speech. 2 As people moved eastward,[a] they found a plain in Shinar and settled there.

3 They said to each other, “Come, let’s make bricks and bake them thoroughly.” They used brick instead of stone, and tar for mortar. 4 Then they said, “Come, let us build ourselves a city, with a tower that reaches to the heavens, so that we may make a name for ourselves; otherwise we will be scattered over the face of the whole earth.”

So we can't say humans used stones 6000 years ago, but sometime after the Flood and before the building of the Tower of Bable humans became familiar with stones.

So there.

274 Decatur Deb  Thu, Nov 15, 2012 2:08:28pm

re: #270 reine.de.tout

Two BP employees charged with manslaughter; another charged with lying to federal investigators.

Does le Roi think the systemic source of the problem was on the platform?

275 reine.de.tout  Thu, Nov 15, 2012 2:08:40pm

re: #272 Daniel Ballard

Hi There!
*waves*

Hey!!!

276 EPR-radar  Thu, Nov 15, 2012 2:09:06pm

re: #271 HappyWarrior

I think part of the problem may be the way they nominate their candidates. It's pretty much always "next in line" or at least it's been that way since Bush I succeeded Reagan and one could even argue Reagan in 1980 too since Reagan had been the runner up in '76.

That rule would give us Santorum in 2016. He might get 10 or 20 less electoral votes than Romney did...

277 Lidane  Thu, Nov 15, 2012 2:09:20pm

re: #271 HappyWarrior

I think part of the problem may be the way they nominate their candidates. It's pretty much always "next in line" or at least it's been that way since Bush I succeeded Reagan and one could even argue Reagan in 1980 too since Reagan had been the runner up in '76.

If they keep going in that direction, they'll end up running Santorum in 2016.

What fun.

278 HappyWarrior  Thu, Nov 15, 2012 2:11:56pm

re: #277 Lidane

If they keep going in that direction, they'll end up running Santorum in 2016.

What fun.

Yeah, yikes. I think it will be fairly open but who knows. I never thought McCain would get in 2008 because I thought the base despised him for campaign finance, working with Ted Kennedy on immigration, taxes, etc but he ended up being it. After Santourm, I believe Huckabee is technically next in line.

279 reine.de.tout  Thu, Nov 15, 2012 2:12:50pm

re: #274 Decatur Deb

Does le Roi think the systemic source of the problem was on the platform?

He is convinced the source of the problem was BP paying no attention to the experts on the rig and ignoring the test results that were pointing to a big problem. He tells me it is not unusual to have a cement job that isn't what it should be. There are ways of dealing with it that are safe and effective. Unless you purposely ignore the test results to try to make up time on a job that was behind schedule.

280 Decatur Deb  Thu, Nov 15, 2012 2:13:19pm

re: #277 Lidane

If they keep going in that direction, they'll end up running Santorum in 2016.

What fun.

Allan West will be available for the primaries.

281 Kragar  Thu, Nov 15, 2012 2:13:47pm

'From Gingrich to Santorum to Perry to Bachmann, I Think Any of Them Could Have Won'

Deace: Do you think that any of the Republicans, any of the other alternatives to Romney in this primary, do you believe that any of them would have won this election, and if so—whom and why?

Baldwin: Oh yeah, I actually think every major candidate, from Gingrich to Santorum to Perry to Bachmann, I think any of them could have won. All they had to was tell the truth about Obama’s economy, his foreign policy, his attack on our culture, just tell the truth. Romney never told anyone anything about this guy.

Baldwin: I had a long discussion with a number of conservative leaders on a conference call today and there was some agreement here that there needs to be some high level discussions that go on between the three major conservative branches of the Republican party, and they may not even like that term ‘Republican party.’ I’m talking about the Christian Right—the social conservatives—, the Tea Party conservatives, and of course there’s overlap here, and the Ron Paul conservatives, and all three groups have overlaps. But there are people respected as leaders within all three of those entities that I feel need to get together and have some discussion about how we can sing the same song sheet in the future and try to unite because there was a problem here, we conservatives were split up so many ways that Romney took advantage of that and strode right on in and clinched the primary, we can’t do that anymore.

282 reine.de.tout  Thu, Nov 15, 2012 2:14:25pm

re: #279 reine.de.tout

He is convinced the source of the problem was BP paying no attention to the experts on the rig and ignoring the test results that were pointing to a big problem. He tells me it is not unusual to have a cement job that isn't what it should be. There are ways of dealing with it that are safe and effective. Unless you purposely ignore the test results to try to make up time on a job that was behind schedule.

In other words, the systemic problem was BP and how they run their business. Not the rig equipment or contractors.

283 HappyWarrior  Thu, Nov 15, 2012 2:15:04pm

re: #281 Kragar

'From Gingrich to Santorum to Perry to Bachmann, I Think Any of Them Could Have Won'

They're delusional. Romney was a shitty candidate but he was a shitty candidate with a lot of wealthy friends.

284 Decatur Deb  Thu, Nov 15, 2012 2:15:59pm

re: #279 reine.de.tout

He is convinced the source of the problem was BP paying no attention to the experts on the rig and ignoring the test results that were pointing to a big problem. He tells me it is not unusual to have a cement job that isn't what it should be. There are ways of dealing with it that are safe and effective. Unless you purposely ignore the test results to try to make up time on a job that was behind schedule.

A systems guy would ask if the on-site supervision was incentivized to make schedule rather than to operate safely.

285 gwangung  Thu, Nov 15, 2012 2:17:09pm

re: #283 HappyWarrior

They're delusional. Romney was a shitty candidate but he was a shitty candidate with a lot of wealthy friends.

And whose shitty attitudes didn't show up until the end of the campaign.

Santorum and Bachman? Hell, it would have been up front and center from day one.

287 HappyWarrior  Thu, Nov 15, 2012 2:17:33pm

If they were actually smart, they'd start dropping to slowly drop the social issues crap but instead you have many who insist the problem was that Romney wasn't socially conservative enough or he didn't emphasize it. The social issues are a big reason why they're losing young people. The idea that many of them have that young voters are leftists is just delusional at the core.

288 freetoken  Thu, Nov 15, 2012 2:18:14pm

re: #281 Kragar

"Delusional" is too easy a term to apply to these people.

289 Mich-again  Thu, Nov 15, 2012 2:18:18pm

re: #275 reine.de.tout

I still keep contact with a mutual friend from the land of 10,000 Lakes. Miss her around here..

290 reine.de.tout  Thu, Nov 15, 2012 2:18:50pm

re: #284 Decatur Deb

A systems guy would ask if the on-site supervision was incentivized to make schedule rather than to operate safely.

There were som BP bigwigs visiting the rig that day. It's my personal speculation that the BP company man was trying to score points by showing how hard-nosed and decisive he was.

291 Political Atheist  Thu, Nov 15, 2012 2:19:34pm

re: #259 engineer cat

the gop keeps trying to figure out how to change without changing its principles

but it's problem is its principles

I don't think so. They have to get back to them. Now if we let the critics define them, it's over becuse the critics will not admit anything positive about them at all.

But let's take a look at a few examples of the STATED principles, which they have strayed terribly far from. If they ran and ruled by the following, I would still be a Republican.

[Link: public.wsu.edu...]
Basic Republican Principles

From its inception in 1854 and from its earliest stands against the oppressive institution of slavery, the Republican Party has defined itself as the protector of individual freedom. Today, 140 years later, we, of the WSU College Republicans, reaffirm our commitment as Republicans in the cause of freedom and liberty. And we redirect our course back to the basic tenets of our common Republican philosophy--a philosophy which includes among its components:

A Belief in Smaller Government: To preserve the sanctity of liberty of the individual, it is our belief that government must necessarily be limited. Otherwise, the paternalism of the few would restrict the freedom of the many to decide what is best for themselves.
Support of the Federalist System of Government: To bring power closer to the people, it is imperative we restrict the growth of a centralized federal government....States ought to have the power to determine which programs and measures would be most appropriate and fitting for them.
Fiscal Conservatism: In keeping with our desires for the greatest individual liberty, we support policies of limited taxation and government spending.
Strong National Defense: We believe the best way to preserve the peace and protect our national interests abroad comes through a strong national defense.
Individual Liberties and Responsibilities: Along with individual liberties come individual responsibilities and duties. Government must act to preserve freedom, while individuals must exercise their responsibilities to preserve order.
Tolerance, Inclusiveness, and Optimism: We believe in the right of fellow Republicans to disagree on certain matters of principle and policy. We believe in being an open and inclusive party respectful of different points of view. We are indeed a "big-tent" party that offers no "litmus tests" or barriers to entry.

[Link: www.nfrw.org...]

The Republican Party
Republican Principles

The Republican Party


I am a Republican because:

I believe the strength of our nation lies with the individual and that each person's dignity, freedom, ability and responsibility must be honored.

I believe in equal rights, equal justice and equal opportunity for all, regardless of race, creed, sex, age or disability.

I believe that free enterprise and the encouragement of individual initiative have brought this nation opportunity, economic growth and prosperity.

I believe government must practice fiscal responsibility and allow individuals to keep more of the money they earn.

I believe the proper role of government is to provide for the people only those critical functions that cannot be performed by individuals or private organizations and that the best government is that which governs least.

I believe the most effective, responsible and responsive government is government closest to the people.

I believe Americans must retain the principles that have made us strong while developing new and innovative ideas to meet the challenges of changing times.

I believe Americans value and should preserve our national strength and pride while working to extend peace, freedom and human rights throughout the world.

Finally, I believe the Republican Party is the best vehicle for translating these ideals into positive and successful principles of government.

Source: The Republican National Committee

292 reine.de.tout  Thu, Nov 15, 2012 2:19:45pm

re: #289 Mich-again

I still keep contact with a mutual friend from the land of 10,000 Lakes. Miss her around here..

Ha! I haven't heard from said friend in awhile! I should get in touch...

293 freetoken  Thu, Nov 15, 2012 2:20:27pm

Who says plants don't have power? Here's one that is flexing its political will:

Uruguay lawmakers consider creating “Cannabis Institute” with goal of outselling pot dealers

Uruguay is one step closer to turning the government into the country’s leading pot dealer.

The proposal formally introduced to Congress on Thursday would create a National Cannabis Institute with the power to license people and companies to produce marijuana for recreational, medical or industrial uses.

[...]

294 HappyWarrior  Thu, Nov 15, 2012 2:20:36pm

re: #285 gwangung

And whose shitty attitudes didn't show up until the end of the campaign.

Santorum and Bachman? Hell, it would have been up front and center from day one.

Yep. It does make me wonder though who Santorum would have as his running mate. I always wonder about who the more far out candidates would have on their teams really.

295 Decatur Deb  Thu, Nov 15, 2012 2:20:46pm

Evening dogwalk, and it's cold and wet in Alabama. Perhaps the heavens have withdrawn their favor. Or it's November.

296 freetoken  Thu, Nov 15, 2012 2:22:51pm

We still have room on our credit card:

Putting a price on war with Iran

An all-out U.S. war with Iran, including an invasion by American troops, would cost the global economy close to $2 trillion in the first three months and could go as high as $3 trillion, according to a Washington think tank.

[...]

297 BongCrodny  Thu, Nov 15, 2012 2:23:02pm

Jindal:

We have to stop dumbing down our ideas

Owwww!! Guv'nah, please stop! You're 'urtin' me brain wi' all these complicated ideas n stuff!

298 Mich-again  Thu, Nov 15, 2012 2:26:11pm

re: #296 freetoken

We still have room on our credit card:

Putting a price on war with Iran

Dick Cheney told Tim Russert that the war in Iraq would cost $80-100 billion. He was off by a factor of oh about 30.

299 engineer cat  Thu, Nov 15, 2012 2:26:46pm

re: #291 Daniel Ballard

the devil here is not in the details, but in how you define the terms

I believe government must practice fiscal responsibility

but in practice this really means social services must be cut but taxes cannot be raised on anybody making over $250k/yr

it's like biblical exegesis: jesus means what i want him to mean, no matter what he actually said

300 JABaker  Thu, Nov 15, 2012 2:26:52pm

re: #40 Dark_Falcon

Oh?

"We must stop competing with Democrats for the job of “Government Manager,” "

And just who does Jindal think should manage FEMA? Republicans?

301 freetoken  Thu, Nov 15, 2012 2:28:23pm

Just a reminder - civilizations come, and they go:

A lost civilisation: 3,000-year-old cemetery discovered in Swat

302 Kragar  Thu, Nov 15, 2012 2:29:16pm

re: #300 JABaker

Oh?

"We must stop competing with Democrats for the job of “Government Manager,” "

And just who does Jindal think should manage FEMA? Republicans?

Privatize it, so the companies can work with local gangs to keep their profits up.

Oh, thats the private prison system. My bad.

303 Mich-again  Thu, Nov 15, 2012 2:29:53pm

Tomorrow night at this time I will be settled into my cocoon on a 16 hour business class flight with Foo Fighters Wasting Light blasting in the headphones interrupted only by the flight attendant asking me every so often if she can get me anything. I can't wait.

304 Political Atheist  Thu, Nov 15, 2012 2:33:01pm

re: #299 engineer cat

the devil here is not in the details, but in how you define the terms

I believe government must practice fiscal responsibility

but in practice this really means social services must be cut but taxes cannot be raised on anybody making over $250k/yr

it's like biblical exegesis: jesus means what i want him to mean, no matter what he actually said

In practice it need not mean that at all. Unless you ask that fool Norquist. Which points where I'm going with this. Fiscal responsibility includes safety nets. It does not exclude them by any rational definition. For decades we had a sane republican party. look at the older platforms. It's hard to imagine them being from the same party we see today.

305 Lidane  Thu, Nov 15, 2012 2:33:26pm

re: #291 Daniel Ballard

The GOP doesn't even live up to their own stated principles.

I believe the strength of our nation lies with the individual and that each person's dignity, freedom, ability and responsibility must be honored.

Unless you're a woman, in which case we'll force an ultrasound wand up your vagina against your will, then deny you any sort of assistance carrying or raising that child after we deny you an abortion.

Oh and forget about equal pay for equal work. Real women stay home, so you should be fine earning less.

I believe in equal rights, equal justice and equal opportunity for all, regardless of race, creed, sex, age or disability.

But if your're gay, fuck you. All bets are off.

I believe government must practice fiscal responsibility and allow individuals to keep more of the money they earn.

Which is why Republican economics relies on deficit spending, which they then turn around and complain about.

I believe Americans must retain the principles that have made us strong while developing new and innovative ideas to meet the challenges of changing times

.

Which is why Republicans push for anti-intellectual, anti-reason ideals such as creationism and intelligent design in schools and why they buy into the bullshit being sold by David Barton.

306 Political Atheist  Thu, Nov 15, 2012 2:37:20pm

re: #305 Lidane

The GOP doesn't even live up to their own stated principles.

Unless you're a woman, in which case we'll force an ultrasound wand up your vagina against your will, then deny you any sort of assistance carrying or raising that child after we deny you an abortion.

Oh and forget about equal pay for equal work. Real women stay home, so you should be fine earning less.

But if your're gay, fuck you. All bets are off.

Which is why Republican economics relies on deficit spending, which they then turn around and complain about.

.

Which is why Republicans push for anti-intellectual, anti-reason ideals such as creationism and intelligent design in schools and why they buy into the bullshit being sold by David Barton.

I'm glad you agree that they have departed the principles we might agree on as worthwhile. I'm a Republican exile. So I understand them as in where they were vs where they are. The TP people are toxic. If they stay in it's over for the GOP in any majority sense. Fiscal conservatives who run will have to become Democrats or Indy to have any influence on policy.

307 Ben G. Hazi  Thu, Nov 15, 2012 2:41:12pm

re: #156 Dark_Falcon

Simple: I think Jindal can improve the party nationally, and for that I'm prepared to ignore a great deal.

So you've basically given up on any pretense that the GOP hasn't gone full-on batshit crazy and will support Jindal, no matter how much he panders to the RWNJs or lies to everyone else, because you think he has a shot for 2016 (presumably because he's young and not white), huh?

I'm sorry, Dark, but that makes you a cynical party hack.

/Party Uber Alles!

308 allegro  Thu, Nov 15, 2012 2:51:23pm

re: #306 Daniel Ballard

I'm glad you agree that they have departed the principles we might agree on as worthwhile. I'm a Republican exile. So I understand them as in where they were vs where they are. The TP people are toxic. If they stay in it's over for the GOP in any majority sense. Fiscal conservatives who run will have to become Democrats or Indy to have any influence on policy.

This did not start with the teabaggers. It began in earnest with Reagan back in the 80s - the teabaggers just took it all to its inevitable end (one hopes) that we see today.

309 Lidane  Thu, Nov 15, 2012 2:57:43pm

re: #306 Daniel Ballard

I'm glad you agree that they have departed the principles we might agree on as worthwhile. I'm a Republican exile. So I understand them as in where they were vs where they are. The TP people are toxic. If they stay in it's over for the GOP in any majority sense. Fiscal conservatives who run will have to become Democrats or Indy to have any influence on policy.

The problem is, their stated principles are just flowery words. They don't govern by them at all. And it goes beyond the Tea Party. It's been part of the GOP for decades -- say one thing, govern in the complete opposite way.

If you want fiscal conservatism, vote Democratic. At least Clinton managed a balanced budget.

310 funky chicken  Thu, Nov 15, 2012 3:15:47pm

re: #146 HappyWarrior

I'm really hoping after seeing him speak at the DNC that Julian Castro runs. I'm very impressed with him.

I like Corey Booker more. Castro is still a bit young. If they're the same age Booker just seems ... more solid right now.

311 BARACK THE VOTE  Fri, Nov 16, 2012 10:36:41am

great post. I like seeing Charles rip into a piece like this, bit by bit.


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