85,000 Historical Films From British Pathé on YouTube

An incredible resource
History • Views: 23,711

British Pathé has posted 85,000 (!) short historical films at YouTube. A fascinating look at the history of the 20th century through the eyes of British media, before it was called “media.”

For a relatively recent example: “Arnold Schwarzenegger Wins Mr Universe (1969),” with casually sexist narration.

YouTube

This video is two archive reels in [HD]. Mr Universe 1969 + “Show of Strength”, International Bodybuilding Contest in Cologne, Germany 1966

Arnold Schwarzenegger flexes his extraordinary muscles for the judges in these two bodybuilding tournaments, one in Cologne in 1966, and the other (the first piece of footage) in London at the Mr Universe contest in 1969.

Mr. Schwarzenegger was a completely unknown figure then. Coe Boyer can also be seen in this footage.

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348 comments

1 Charles Johnson  Apr 19, 2014 6:08:51pm

The narrator in this Schwarzenegger video is so casually sexist it’s jaw-dropping.

2 freetoken  Apr 19, 2014 6:10:49pm

re: #1 Charles Johnson

The narrator in this Schwarzenegger video is so casually sexist it’s jaw-dropping.

Yeah, the “… wasted on a girl” caught my ear.

3 Romantic Heretic  Apr 19, 2014 6:17:03pm

I was just watching one from their about the kamikazes.

Interesting footage but the bullshit about them at the beginning of the film made me want to barf.

How things have changed.

4 Killgore Trout  Apr 19, 2014 6:18:19pm

When I saw the first rumors on this story a few days ago I thought it was a hoax.
State schools isolate non-Muslims

Schools in Birmingham are illegally segregating pupils, discriminating against non-Muslim students and restricting the GCSE syllabus to “comply with conservative Islamic teaching”, an official report leaked to The Telegraph discloses.
….

The report, into three schools in the city, follows weeks of controversy over the alleged plot to “Islamise” secular schools in Birmingham and will lead to calls for intervention. The report focuses on Park View School and its sister schools, Golden Hillock and Nansen, the only primary of the three. Inspectors found that Park View practised forced and discriminatory sex segregation and has “restricted” GCSE subjects “to comply with conservative Islamic teaching”.

Core elements of the GCSE syllabus were missed out as “un-Islamic” and an extremist preacher with known al-Qaeda sympathies and anti-Semitic views was invited to speak with children. At Golden Hillock, there was discrimination against non-Muslims, the report found. Its handful of Christian students “have to teach themselves” in one GCSE subject after the teacher “concentrated on the students who were doing the Islamic course”.

5 wheat-doggha -- oo bird outside my window  Apr 19, 2014 6:25:24pm

re: #4 Killgore Trout

In the UK, and the article is a “Comment” in the Telegraph, not a news story, so I am doubtful it’s completely reliable. My bad. I am in a hurry to go out, and didn’t read the page carefully. It IS a news story.

6 freetoken  Apr 19, 2014 6:26:20pm

re: #4 Killgore Trout

This illustrates a problem when schools are run by local or private organizations without elected officials:

[…]

All three are supposedly non-faith schools run by the Park View Educational Trust.

[…]

The report makes clear that Park View’s most senior female leader, the non-Muslim executive headteacher, Lindsey Clark, had been reduced to a figurehead, marginalised to the extent that she “was unaware of the names of some of the more recent appointments to the senior leadership team” at her own school. Last week, Mrs Clark retired.

All three schools were in reality run by Mr Alam, who had an “inappropriate day-to-day role in the running of the schools” and who received undeclared four-figure payments from them as a “consultant”, the report states.

It’s just another example why I think the pushing of vouchers and private schools here is a bad idea.

7 freetoken  Apr 19, 2014 6:28:00pm

re: #5 wheat-doggha — oo bird outside my window

Yeah, and the opening line:

Schools in Birmingham are illegally segregating pupils, discriminating against non-Muslim students and restricting the GCSE syllabus to “comply with conservative Islamic teaching”, an official report leaked to The Telegraph discloses.

… makes it sound like all schools in Birmingham are like this.

As near as I can tell from the article, it appears as if one man has made these three schools his little empire.

8 wheat-doggha -- oo bird outside my window  Apr 19, 2014 6:29:02pm

re: #6 freetoken

It’s just another example why I think the pushing of vouchers and private schools here is a bad idea.

The proponents of vouchers and private schools see lack of public accountability as a feature, not a bug.

9 goddamnedfrank  Apr 19, 2014 6:31:13pm

One way to identify someone who has never actually read the entire US Constitution is the following:

1. They will often be the first to bring it up. Passionately.
2. They will claim, again without prompting, to have read it many times.
3. They will claim to own many copies of it.

These are progressively bigger and bigger tells. I’m sure plenty of people have read it several times, but only those with something to prove would mention it. And who owns several copies of the Constitution outside of say, actual historians? I might own one copy, in an old boxed up set of Encyclopedias. All the other copies I could possibly ever need are on the internet. In any event it’s another obvious bluff, nobody brings up the number of Constitutions they have unless they’re subconsciously trying to overcompensate for something.

10 Killgore Trout  Apr 19, 2014 6:31:48pm

re: #5 wheat-doggha — oo bird outside my window

In the UK, and the article is a “Comment” in the Telegraph, not a news story, so I am doubtful it’s completely reliable.

It’s starting to look plausible but I can’t wrap my head around how this would have happened without getting noticed.

11 freetoken  Apr 19, 2014 6:32:37pm

IKE BOWED!!!

Youtube Video

12 Pie-onist Overlord  Apr 19, 2014 6:33:16pm

re: #9 goddamnedfrank

One way to identify someone who has never actually read the entire US Constitution is the following:

1. They will often be the first to bring it up. Passionately.
2. They will claim, again without prompting, to have read it many times.
3. They will claim to own many copies of it.

These are progressively bigger and bigger tells. I’m sure plenty of people have read it several times, but only those with something to prove would mention it. And who owns several copies of the Constitution outside of say, actual historians. I might own one copy, in an old boxed up set of Encyclopedias. All the other copies I could possibly ever need are on the internet. In any event it’s another obvious bluff, nobody brings up the number of Constitutions they have unless they’re subconsciously trying to overcompensate for something.

THEIR IS ONLY TEH SECOND AMENDMENT!!!!! THAT IS ALL TEH CONSTITUTION YOU WILL EVER NEED!!!!!!!

13 Pie-onist Overlord  Apr 19, 2014 6:35:34pm

This stupid meme again:

14 Killgore Trout  Apr 19, 2014 6:37:17pm

re: #7 freetoken

Yeah, and the opening line:

… makes it sound like all schools in Birmingham are like this.

As near as I can tell from the article, it appears as if one man has made these three schools his little empire.

Looks like at least 6 schools
Islamist plot: six schools face Ofsted special measures

Six schools implicated in the so-called ‘Trojan Horse’ plot by extremists to ‘Islamise’ secular state education face being placed in special measures

15 Pie-onist Overlord  Apr 19, 2014 6:37:23pm
16 Killgore Trout  Apr 19, 2014 6:38:48pm
Ofsted will also take action, although less drastic, at a further nine schools in the city where the attempted Islamic takeover is less advanced, or where secular head teachers are resisting it. Only one of the 17 schools inspected by Ofsted so far in connection with the alleged plot has received a clean bill of health, although one report is yet to be completed.
17 Targetpractice  Apr 19, 2014 6:40:29pm

re: #15 Pie-onist Overlord

[Embedded content]

Because you want a better quality of life for yourself than your great-grandparents lived under.

18 freetoken  Apr 19, 2014 6:41:00pm

re: #16 Killgore Trout

Your author’s attraction to the phrase “Islamic takeover” is suspicious.

This could just be what happens all over the place - a particular religion wants to replicate itself.

19 William Barnett-Lewis  Apr 19, 2014 6:41:03pm

re: #9 goddamnedfrank

One way to identify someone who has never actually read the entire US Constitution is the following:

1. They will often be the first to bring it up. Passionately.
2. They will claim, again without prompting, to have read it many times.
3. They will claim to own many copies of it.

These are progressively bigger and bigger tells. I’m sure plenty of people have read it several times, but only those with something to prove would mention it. And who owns several copies of the Constitution outside of say, actual historians? I might own one copy, in an old boxed up set of Encyclopedias. All the other copies I could possibly ever need are on the internet. In any event it’s another obvious bluff, nobody brings up the number of Constitutions they have unless they’re subconsciously trying to overcompensate for something.

Well, I actually do have a copy of the constitution (one of the little ones given out by CATO) that I’ve carried ever since I worked for the Census in 2010. It was very useful in dealing with the anti-census mythology that existed on the right. It’s entertaining to be a self-avowed leftist who knows the document far better than the supposed “patriots”.

20 Gus  Apr 19, 2014 6:42:04pm

21 William Barnett-Lewis  Apr 19, 2014 6:42:17pm

re: #15 Pie-onist Overlord

[Embedded content]

Because she likes living in a first world country not a third world hell-hole like Somalia?

22 wheat-doggha -- oo bird outside my window  Apr 19, 2014 6:42:49pm

re: #17 Targetpractice

Because you want a better quality of life for yourself than your great-grandparents lived under.

That’s what you libturds want! Not us!

23 freetoken  Apr 19, 2014 6:43:00pm

IKE BOWED TWICE!!!!!!!

24 William Barnett-Lewis  Apr 19, 2014 6:43:21pm

re: #20 Gus

The 70’s called - you need to return the TARDIS to the Doctor.

25 Decatur Deb  Apr 19, 2014 6:44:48pm

re: #20 Gus

[Embedded image]

Stunt doubles from Buckaroo Banzai?

26 Pie-onist Overlord  Apr 19, 2014 6:47:08pm
27 Killgore Trout  Apr 19, 2014 6:47:13pm

re: #18 freetoken

Your author’s attraction to the phrase “Islamic takeover” is suspicious.

This could just be what happens all over the place - a particular religion wants to replicate itself.

Islamist is a real word with a specific meaning, which in this case may be appropriate. Not to be used interchangeably with Islamic, they are not the same thing.

28 goddamnedfrank  Apr 19, 2014 6:49:24pm

re: #19 William Barnett-Lewis

Well, I actually do have a copy of the constitution (one of the little ones given out by CATO) that I’ve carried ever since I worked for the Census in 2010. It was very useful in dealing with the anti-census mythology that existed on the right. It’s entertaining to be a self-avowed leftist who knows the document far better than the supposed “patriots”.

That’s because the sovereign citizens aren’t actually interested in what it says. They’re only interested in what parts can be twisted in isolation to seemingly support their preformed mindset. Cognitive biases play havoc on reading comprehension.

29 Skip Intro  Apr 19, 2014 6:52:26pm

re: #20 Gus

Just how stoned did you have to be to think any of that looked good?

30 Stanley Sea  Apr 19, 2014 6:53:04pm

re: #18 freetoken

Your author’s attraction to the phrase “Islamic takeover” is suspicious.

This could just be what happens all over the place - a particular religion wants to replicate itself.

Fear the mooslims trolling. Nothing else.

Great thread otherwise!

31 Charles Johnson  Apr 19, 2014 6:53:07pm
32 bratwurst  Apr 19, 2014 6:53:38pm
33 palmerskiss  Apr 19, 2014 6:55:02pm

british pathe` has to be one of the greatest archives of “how we lived” of the 20th century

there is a recurring program we used to watch called just that that was nothing more than readings over those pathe` videos.

34 Charles Johnson  Apr 19, 2014 6:55:16pm
35 wheat-doggha -- oo bird outside my window  Apr 19, 2014 6:56:38pm

re: #27 Killgore Trout

Islamist is a real word with a specific meaning, which in this case may be appropriate. Not to be used interchangeably with Islamic, they are not the same thing.

Before we get all caught up in a debate about this issue, can we refer to sources other than the Telegraph? This is from a BBC news report”

Why has it become known as the Trojan horse plot?

The letter - which has not been authenticated and which could be a provocative hoax - refers to “Operation Trojan Horse”. This classical allusion refers to using a device to get past the defences and to take over the school system from within.

The city council said it was “hugely difficult to investigate” - when it was not clear whether the letter was from a whistleblower revealing important information about extremism or a hoaxer trying to harm community relations.

A chair of governors at one of the schools involved described the reaction to this letter as a “witch hunt”.

bbc.com

I am falling back on my original reaction to this story. One writer at one publication is not necessarily authoritative. There are more UK media than The Telegraph.

36 Gus  Apr 19, 2014 6:56:39pm

re: #29 Skip Intro

Just how stoned did you have to be to think any of that looked good?

Spandex Beach

37 thedopefishlives  Apr 19, 2014 6:58:23pm

LET MY PEOPLE GO.

38 freetoken  Apr 19, 2014 6:58:36pm

Ike bowed.

Ike bowed twice.

How did that not become a national scandal?

39 freetoken  Apr 19, 2014 6:59:23pm

Were there no patriots back in 1959?

40 palmerskiss  Apr 19, 2014 6:59:32pm

re: #38 freetoken

Ike bowed.

Ike bowed twice.

How did that not become a national scandal?

he had not given his ‘Military industrial complex’ speech yet.

41 wheat-doggha -- oo bird outside my window  Apr 19, 2014 7:01:20pm

re: #38 freetoken

Ike bowed.

Ike bowed twice.

How did that not become a national scandal?

No Twitter. No Clear Channel Radio. No Rushbo. No Intertubes.

42 Killgore Trout  Apr 19, 2014 7:12:49pm

re: #35 wheat-doggha — oo bird outside my window

Before we get all caught up in a debate about this issue, can we refer to sources other than the Telegraph? This is from a BBC news report”

bbc.com

I am falling back on my original reaction to this story. One writer at one publication is not necessarily authoritative. There are more UK media than The Telegraph.

Well, so far the Telegraph is the only paper to get the leaked copy of the report. It’s due to be released next month so we’ll see if the Telegraph’s reporting is accurate. But even from your BBC link…

Khalid Mahmood, MP for Perry Barr, believes there are reasons to be concerned. “All the information I’m getting… is there has been a serious bid to take over most of the schools in the east and south of the city,” he said.

43 William of Orange  Apr 19, 2014 7:29:37pm

This one made quite an impression in the Netherlands. A daylight bombing raid on the Dutch city of Eindhoven during the second worldwar. Media on board in a daylight bombing raid!! That’s balls!!

Youtube Video

44 Timothy Watson  Apr 19, 2014 7:33:53pm

re: #13 Pie-onist Overlord

This stupid meme again:

[Embedded content]

There were no taxes before 1913, or is he saying there was no income tax before 1913? The first federal income tax was created in 1861 by the Republican Party and signed into law by President Abraham Lincoln.

It wasn’t until 1895 that Supreme Court found the income tax to be unconstitutional, hence the passage and ratification of the Sixteenth Amendment by 1913.

45 CuriousLurker  Apr 19, 2014 7:36:58pm

re: #42 Killgore Trout

You might find it interesting to note that Andrew Gilligan presented a bi-weekly program for Iran’s Press TV. Odd choice for an anti-Islamist.

Here’s a list of his shows: youtube.com

46 Killgore Trout  Apr 19, 2014 7:43:18pm

re: #45 CuriousLurker

You might find it interesting to note that Andrew Gilligan presented a bi-weekly program for Iran’s Press TV. Odd choice for an anti-Islamist.

Here’s a list of his shows: youtube.com

Interesting. He also has a radical cycling agenda too…

In 2013 he became London’s Cycling Commissioner.

47 William of Orange  Apr 19, 2014 7:46:57pm
48 Killgore Trout  Apr 19, 2014 7:47:48pm

He also worked on Dispatches, good show.

49 Timothy Watson  Apr 19, 2014 7:49:06pm

*clears throat*
WHERE’S OBUMMER’S EASTER PROCLAMATION?!!?!!!?!?!??!

50 CuriousLurker  Apr 19, 2014 7:49:44pm

re: #46 Killgore Trout

Interesting. He also has a radical cycling agenda too…

In 2013 he became London’s Cycling Commissioner.

Indeed. I wasn’t going to bring up anything that wasn’t related to concerns about Islamism, but since you’ve mentioned it, it seems like there was a bit of controversy around that as well.

In January 2013 Gilligan was appointed as the Cycling Commissioner for London by the Mayor, Boris Johnson. Accusations of “cronyism” were made following the appointment as Gilligan was considered instrumental in toppling the Mayor’s main rival Ken Livingstone.

Interesting guy.

51 wheat-doggha -- oo bird outside my window  Apr 19, 2014 7:54:03pm

re: #50 CuriousLurker

Showing that politics can even intrude on something as apparently mundane as cycling.

Or is it the other way around? Hmmm.

52 ObserverArt  Apr 19, 2014 7:55:35pm

Sorry to be way off topic…the Columbus Blue Jackets just won their very first SCup playoff game in double overtime 4-3 over Pittsburgh in Pittsburgh.

Oh yeah!!!

Thank you for the indulgence. Happy Easter.

53 Romantic Heretic  Apr 19, 2014 8:01:17pm

re: #43 William of Orange

This one made quite an impression in the Netherlands. A daylight bombing raid on the Dutch city of Eindhoven during the second worldwar. >Media on board in a daylight bombing raid!! That’s balls!!

[Embedded content]

Larger

Love the Mosquito. One of the prettiest aircraft to see combat, and one of the most effective.

54 Political Atheist  Apr 19, 2014 8:09:55pm

Saturday Night Pyromania break

55 Gus  Apr 19, 2014 8:11:34pm
56 CuriousLurker  Apr 19, 2014 8:12:30pm

re: #51 wheat-doggha — oo bird outside my window

Yes, politics seems to intrude on many things, and vice versa.

I’ve gotta admit though that the idea of a staunch anti-Islamist presenting a show for one of the propaganda arms of the Islamic Republic of Iran strikes me as seriously strange.

It would sort of be like a stanch defender of democracy, free speech, and freedom of the press doing a show for RT.

It causes more than a little cognitive dissonance.

57 CuriousLurker  Apr 19, 2014 8:14:47pm

re: #53 Romantic Heretic

Oh good, I finally caught you. Regarding the Oz article about fanatics the other day, I agree as well—they rarely have a sense of humor. ;)

58 jaunte  Apr 19, 2014 8:15:50pm

re: #44 Timothy Watson

There were no taxes before 1913, or is he saying there was no income tax before 1913? The first federal income tax was created in 1861 by the Republican Party and signed into law by President Abraham Lincoln.
It wasn’t until 1895 that Supreme Court found the income tax to be unconstitutional, hence the passage and ratification of the Sixteenth Amendment by 1913.

Strangely, I haven’t seen any conservatives tweeting graphics about how the Republicans invented the income tax.

59 wheat-doggha -- oo bird outside my window  Apr 19, 2014 8:16:06pm

re: #56 CuriousLurker

Yes, politics seems to intrude on many things, and vice versa.

I’ve gotta admit though that the idea of a staunch anti-Islamist presenting a show for one of the propaganda arms of the Islamic Republic of Iran strikes me as seriously strange.

It would sort of be like a stanch defender of democracy, free speech, and freedom of the press doing a show for RT.

It causes more than a little cognitive dissonance.

There are some journalists who would do anything for a paycheck, or career advancement, or some name recognition.

60 jaunte  Apr 19, 2014 8:18:16pm

Goldie Cleaves Clive’s Jive

Clive thinks he can work without paying his dues. Goldie ain’t having that.

Storified.

61 Gus  Apr 19, 2014 8:20:59pm

Looking through their Twitter account. Don’t see anyone being held hostage. Lots of smiling people. Maybe there were some incidents. What schools don’t have incidents like this? Several incidents were raised and the authorities are looking into those. It was a leaked report and you know that’s subject to interpretation and interpretation by the infamously inept UK press.

62 CuriousLurker  Apr 19, 2014 8:21:03pm

re: #59 wheat-doggha — oo bird outside my window

There are some journalists who would do anything for a paycheck, or career advancement, or some name recognition.

Yep, and they’re the last ones whose word I’d take on anything without another source to back them up.

63 Killgore Trout  Apr 19, 2014 8:23:14pm

re: #55 Gus

@ParkView_school

Looked through their pics. A few headscarves but no outward signs of radical Islamification. The whole story seems like a hoax but the early indications look like the story may pan out.

64 Fairly Sure I'm Still Obdicut  Apr 19, 2014 8:25:02pm

re: #63 Killgore Trout

Looked through their pics. A few headscarves but no outward signs of radical Islamification. The whole story seems like a hoax but the early indications look like the story may pan out.

So what you’re saying is it might, and it might not.

Booking you on CNN now.

65 jaunte  Apr 19, 2014 8:26:10pm
66 Charles Johnson  Apr 19, 2014 8:26:27pm

Just discovered another stalker trying to go through as many LGF user profiles as it could. Account is now history.

67 Gus  Apr 19, 2014 8:26:38pm

It’s like when some teachers are found to be sleeping with their students suddenly becomes, PEDOPHILE TEACHERS ALL ACROSS AMERICA!! //

68 Gus  Apr 19, 2014 8:27:52pm

re: #63 Killgore Trout

Looked through their pics. A few headscarves but no outward signs of radical Islamification. The whole story seems like a hoax but the early indications look like the story may pan out.

Like I said. There were probably some incidents. The UK press and politicians are probably blowing this out of proportion. I saw that Geller and Gatestone were on this already. So, you know.

69 Killgore Trout  Apr 19, 2014 8:28:14pm

re: #61 Gus

Looking through their Twitter account. Don’t see anyone being held hostage. Lots of smiling people. Maybe there were some incidents. What schools don’t have incidents like this? Several incidents were raised and the authorities are looking into those. It was a leaked report and you know that’s subject to interpretation and interpretation by the infamously inept UK press.

[Embedded content]

I was also expecting to see a more “ethnic” student base and that maybe the school was teaching lots of Muslim immigrant students. I still find it implausible that the problem could have gotten so bad for so long without people raising the alarm.

70 Jocko's Rocket Ship  Apr 19, 2014 8:28:41pm

re: #52 ObserverArt

The BJs are not that talented, more of an effort-type team that is usually an easy out when every team ratchets up their effort.

But this Penguin team is a mess and they don’t have (a healthy) Vokoun to save the day when MAF gets in his funks.

NHL Playoffs. So much effort, so much luck.

71 Fairly Sure I'm Still Obdicut  Apr 19, 2014 8:28:50pm

re: #67 Gus

It’s like when some teachers are found to be sleeping with their students suddenly becomes, PEDOPHILE TEACHERS ALL ACROSS AMERICA!! //

My parents got caught up in that whole “D&D is driving kids to kill” thing when I was kid and threw out all my Dragonlance novels, thus improving the quality of my library enormously.

72 Gus  Apr 19, 2014 8:29:38pm

Same is true when some Christian teacher does something weird in science class suddenly become, CHRISTIANIST YOUNG EARTH CREATIONISTS TAKING OVER THE SCIENCE CLASS!*

*Louisiana notwithstanding.

73 goddamnedfrank  Apr 19, 2014 8:32:21pm

Ha!

74 Gus  Apr 19, 2014 8:34:18pm

re: #69 Killgore Trout

I was also expecting to see a more “ethnic” student base and that maybe the school was teaching lots of Muslim immigrant students. I still find it implausible that the problem could have gotten so bad for so long without people raising the alarm.

I was thinking along the same lines. Again, it’s a leaked report being interpreted by a whole bunch of people. There were likely incidents and they’re being looked into. I doubt it’s anything that drastic.

75 Gus  Apr 19, 2014 8:35:16pm

I think it’s also a Faith school.

76 Gus  Apr 19, 2014 8:35:32pm

Not exactly an easy task I would imagine.

77 Gus  Apr 19, 2014 8:37:04pm

England

Religious Education (RE) is a compulsory subject in the state education system in England. Schools are required to teach a programme of religious studies according to local and national guidelines.

Religious Education in England is mandated by the Education Act 1944 as amended by the Education Reform Act 1988 and the School Standards and Framework Act 1998. It is compulsory in all state-funded schools. The subject consists of the study of different religions, religious leaders, and other religious and moral themes. However, the curriculum is required to reflect the predominant place of Christianity in religious life and hence Christianity forms the majority of the content of the subject. All parents have the right to withdraw a child from religious education, which schools must approve.[1]

Additionally, all schools are required by law to provide a daily act of collective worship, of which at least 51% must be Christian in basis over the course of the academic year.[2] However, this activity even if multifaith in nature is often meaningless to non Christians, particularly Muslims, who have specific protocols for prayer. Teachers’ organizations have criticized school prayer and called for a government review of the practice.[3] Partly due to the lack of support from the teachers and partly due to the government’s unwillingness to attract controversy, only a quarter of secondary schools actually comply, according to education inspectorate Ofsted.[4]

England has a Local Agreed Syllabus which mandate subject teaching for each Key Stage and possibly for each school year. The Qualifications and Curriculum Authority has also produced the non-statutory National Framework for Religious Education, which provides guidelines for the provision of RE at all key stages, and models the eight-levels as applied in National Curriculum subjects.[5]

The National Union of Teachers suggested in 2008 that parents should have a right to have specific schooling in their own faith and that imams, rabbis and priests should be invited to offer religious instruction to pupils in all state schools.[6]

78 Killgore Trout  Apr 19, 2014 8:38:34pm

re: #75 Gus

I think it’s also a Faith school.

At least according to the Telegraph articles these are explicitly designated secular schools. The loophole (allegedly) is that they are semi-private academies so local authorities didn’t have direct authority over them.

79 CuriousLurker  Apr 19, 2014 8:39:48pm

re: #77 Gus

I’ll be darned. I didn’t know they have faith schools, and had no idea religious education was a compulsory subject there. Learn something new everyday. Thanks.

80 brennant  Apr 19, 2014 8:40:00pm

re: #20 Gus

The 80s were a confusing time for everyone. It’s best we don’t talk about it.

81 Gus  Apr 19, 2014 8:40:58pm

re: #79 CuriousLurker

I’ll be darned. I didn’t know they have faith schools, and had no idea religious education was a compulsory subject there. Learn something new everyday. Thanks.

Same here.

82 Killgore Trout  Apr 19, 2014 8:41:20pm

re: #77 Gus

Additionally, all schools are required by law to provide a daily act of collective worship, of which at least 51% must be Christian in basis over the course of the academic year.[

What a creepy rule, especially since so many Brits are atheists anyways. Thank god we have separation of church and state.

83 jaunte  Apr 19, 2014 8:41:56pm

re: #77 Gus

Additionally, all schools are required by law to provide a daily act of collective worship

I went to one of those for a couple of years. Every morning the students went to “hall,” where we sang All Things Bright and Beautiful and Jerusalem, then listened to Mr. Jones the headmaster tell us the news of the day. However I failed to become an Anglican.

84 Gus  Apr 19, 2014 8:42:30pm

re: #83 jaunte

I went to one of those for a couple of years. Every morning the students went to “hall,” where we sang All Things Bright and Beautiful and Jerusalem, then listened to Mr. Jones the headmaster tell us the news of the day. However I failed to become an Anglican.

That’s funny.

85 blueraven  Apr 19, 2014 8:43:05pm

Today, as I was going to my MIL birthday party just north of Austin, I saw a whole group of men, women and children marching down the side of the highway, in the grassy area, with rifles, assault style weapons and huge flags reading Come and Get It

There must have been about 30 - 40 adults.
I assume they were marching with a purpose. Maybe to meet with other groups.

87 Charles Johnson  Apr 19, 2014 8:43:51pm

The stalkers are all excited today so I thought I’d better check the logs, and sure enough there’s one of these obsessed fuckheads trying to download as many user profiles as he could.

88 Gus  Apr 19, 2014 8:45:06pm

re: #87 Charles Johnson

The stalkers are all excited today so I thought I’d better check the logs, and sure enough there’s one of these obsessed fuckheads trying to download as many user profiles as he could.

What in hell?

89 NJDhockeyfan  Apr 19, 2014 8:45:51pm

Evening lizards!

Update on my daughters new pet rabbit she got last weekend…

I
After I got home this evening after working all day I cleaned up the kitchen then sat down to eat my dinner. About 5 minutes later my daughter come in and says ” Dad, come look in the rabbit cage. There is a surprise for you! “

I walked down stairs and looked inside…a baby rabbit is in there. A few hours later we are now up to 7 baby rabbits. I’ll post the baby bunny total in the morning.

90 jaunte  Apr 19, 2014 8:46:56pm

re: #87 Charles Johnson

Of all the available hobbies to choose, stalking’s a damn peculiar one.

91 Charles Johnson  Apr 19, 2014 8:48:07pm

re: #88 Gus

What in hell?

It never stops.

92 teleskiguy  Apr 19, 2014 8:49:06pm

I typed “Grateful Dead” into the search field for the British Pathé YouTube account and two videos came up. I watched this one from 1930.
Youtube Video

93 Gus  Apr 19, 2014 8:50:12pm

re: #91 Charles Johnson

It never stops.

True. Someone is probably typing my name out as we speak. O.o :D

94 Killgore Trout  Apr 19, 2014 8:50:41pm

re: #89 NJDhockeyfan

Evening lizards!

Update on my daughters new pet rabbit she got last weekend…

I
After I got home this evening after working all day I cleaned up the kitchen then sat down to eat my dinner. About 5 minutes later my daughter come in and says ” Dad, come look in the rabbit cage. There is a surprise for you! “

I walked down stairs and looked inside…a baby rabbit is in there. A few hours later we are now up to 7 baby rabbits. I’ll post the baby bunny total in the morning.

Tribbles!

95 William Barnett-Lewis  Apr 19, 2014 8:51:32pm

re: #54 Political Atheist

Saturday Night Pyromania break

[Embedded image]

Nice to see on the night when the new fire is kindled… :) Thank you.

96 blueraven  Apr 19, 2014 8:51:37pm

re: #91 Charles Johnson

It never stops.

They are truly pathetic.
Small, bitter people.

97 Gus  Apr 19, 2014 8:51:45pm

re: #90 jaunte

Of all the available hobbies to choose, stalking’s a damn peculiar one.

#AlternativesToLGFStalking

98 Gus  Apr 19, 2014 8:52:25pm
99 CuriousLurker  Apr 19, 2014 8:52:54pm

re: #78 Killgore Trout

At least according to the Telegraph articles these are explicitly designated secular schools. The loophole (allegedly) is that they are semi-private academies so local authorities didn’t have direct authority over them.

And the Islamists are slithering through the loopholes with their creeping Sharia. Eurabia! The Global Caliphate is nigh!!11!

Seriously, I get that they have concerns given things like the gruesome beheading of Lee Rigby and other high-profiles incidents, not to mention the other class issues and whatever else may contribute to sociological problems, but people can get downright hysterical at the mere mention of Islamists.

Also, it probably sells plenty of newspapers and generates lots of clicks.

100 Gus  Apr 19, 2014 8:55:10pm
101 CuriousLurker  Apr 19, 2014 8:57:01pm

re: #87 Charles Johnson

The stalkers are all excited today so I thought I’d better check the logs, and sure enough there’s one of these obsessed fuckheads trying to download as many user profiles as he could.

To what end? It’s not as if there’s top secret info on them.

Weird.

102 TedStriker  Apr 19, 2014 8:57:04pm

re: #87 Charles Johnson

The stalkers are all excited today so I thought I’d better check the logs, and sure enough there’s one of these obsessed fuckheads trying to download as many user profiles as he could.

Download user profiles? What in the hell were they going after, comments?

103 NJDhockeyfan  Apr 19, 2014 8:57:15pm

re: #94 Killgore Trout

Tribbles!

No shit. We didn’t know the rabbit she got was preg. Anyone know anything about rabbits? There is no room for 8 rabbits in that hutch. How old do they need to be before I can get rid of them?

104 blueraven  Apr 19, 2014 8:58:32pm

re: #103 NJDhockeyfan

No shit. We didn’t know the rabbit she got was preg. Anyone know anything about rabbits? There is no room for 8 rabbits in that hutch. How old do they need to be before I can get rid of them?

You are so fucked…but your girls are going to have the best Easter ever!

105 Gus  Apr 19, 2014 9:00:26pm
106 Gus  Apr 19, 2014 9:01:27pm
107 Gus  Apr 19, 2014 9:02:34pm
108 NJDhockeyfan  Apr 19, 2014 9:04:42pm

re: #104 blueraven

You are so fucked…but your girls are going to have the best Easter ever!

They clean that hutch twice a day. I wonder how long it will take before the rabbits become more of a pain in the ass then fun pets. Also this afternoon my dog killed a wild rabbit in the yard. I hope that not some sort of omen. What if one day the dog sneaks into the garage?

109 Gus  Apr 19, 2014 9:06:17pm
110 Gus  Apr 19, 2014 9:09:27pm
111 Targetpractice  Apr 19, 2014 9:10:23pm

re: #110 Gus

[Embedded content]

Rogue wave?

112 Ming  Apr 19, 2014 9:11:11pm

re: #108 NJDhockeyfan

They clean that hutch twice a day. I wonder how long it will take before the rabbits become more of a pain in the ass then fun pets. Also this afternoon my dog killed a wild rabbit in the yard. I hope that not some sort of omen. What if one day the dog sneaks into the garage?

Make sure the dog can’t get into the garage. Care for those baby rabbits, and your daughter will learn a great lesson about love.

I often resent the time I put into pets, but I don’t truly regret it. Occasional resentment, yes.

113 Gus  Apr 19, 2014 9:11:12pm

re: #111 Targetpractice

Rogue wave?

Probably. During a storm.

114 blueraven  Apr 19, 2014 9:13:21pm

re: #108 NJDhockeyfan

They clean that hutch twice a day. I wonder how long it will take before the rabbits become more of a pain in the ass then fun pets. Also this afternoon my dog killed a wild rabbit in the yard. I hope that not some sort of omen. What if one day the dog sneaks into the garage?

When we were little kids we got dyed chicks every year for Easter. One year while Mom was cooking the ham she accidentally backed up and stepped on mine and killed it. It was blue.

Oh well, after the dye wore off, they went in with the other chickens and we ate them eventually.

115 Killgore Trout  Apr 19, 2014 9:14:43pm

The Danger of Wet Floors
Youtube Video

116 abolitionist  Apr 19, 2014 9:15:59pm

re: #89 NJDhockeyfan

Evening lizards!

Update on my daughters new pet rabbit she got last weekend…

I
After I got home this evening after working all day I cleaned up the kitchen then sat down to eat my dinner. About 5 minutes later my daughter come in and says ” Dad, come look in the rabbit cage. There is a surprise for you! “

I walked down stairs and looked inside…a baby rabbit is in there. A few hours later we are now up to 7 baby rabbits. I’ll post the baby bunny total in the morning.

A few years ago, I got my daughters a pair of white hamsters. My mistake was neglecting checks for gender or pregnancy. A few months later, I released over 2 dozen of these white furballs into a rural public park.

117 Killgore Trout  Apr 19, 2014 9:17:40pm

Going to School
Youtube Video

118 Gus  Apr 19, 2014 9:17:54pm

re: #111 Targetpractice

Rogue wave?

Ekofisk oil field

119 Gus  Apr 19, 2014 9:19:40pm

re: #111 Targetpractice

Rogue wave?

Forum here say it was during hurricane Bawbag.

120 Gus  Apr 19, 2014 9:20:48pm

$50/hour?

121 CuriousLurker  Apr 19, 2014 9:21:16pm

Okay, I’m gonna bounce. Later, lizards.

122 Gus  Apr 19, 2014 9:24:36pm
123 Gus  Apr 19, 2014 9:25:55pm
124 NJDhockeyfan  Apr 19, 2014 9:27:02pm

re: #112 Ming

Make sure the dog can’t get into the garage. Care for those baby rabbits, and your daughter will learn a great lesson about love.

I often resent the time I put into pets, but I don’t truly regret it. Occasional resentment, yes.

We’ve always had pets. Dogs, cats, fish…rabbits are something new. My other daughter wants chickens. That dream is on the back burner (no pun intended).

125 NJDhockeyfan  Apr 19, 2014 9:29:26pm
126 wheat-doggha -- oo bird outside my window  Apr 19, 2014 9:36:06pm

re: #124 NJDhockeyfan

We’ve always had pets. Dogs, cats, fish…rabbits are something new. My other daughter wants chickens. That dream is on the back burner (no pun intended).

It would be best to separate those bunnies once they are weaned, or your rabbit population will quickly explode. My stepson learned this about hamsters, much too late.

127 Gus  Apr 19, 2014 9:39:08pm
128 freetoken  Apr 19, 2014 9:39:17pm

Conservative heavyweights have solar industry in their sights

The Koch brothers and large utilities have allied to reverse state policies that favor renewable energy. Environmentalists are pushing back, but the fight is spreading and intensifying.

The political attack ad that ran recently in Arizona had some familiar hallmarks of the genre, including a greedy villain who hogged sweets for himself and made children cry.

But the bad guy, in this case, wasn’t a fat-cat lobbyist or someone’s political opponent.

He was a solar-energy consumer.

Solar, once almost universally regarded as a virtuous, if perhaps over-hyped, energy alternative, has now grown big enough to have enemies.

The Koch brothers, anti-tax activist Grover Norquist and some of the nation’s largest power companies have backed efforts in recent months to roll back state policies that favor green energy. The conservative luminaries have pushed campaigns in Kansas, North Carolina and Arizona, with the battle rapidly spreading to other states.

[…]

What’s good for business Kochs is good for America.

129 NJDhockeyfan  Apr 19, 2014 9:41:53pm

re: #114 blueraven

When we were little kids we got dyed chicks every year for Easter. One year while Mom was cooking the ham she accidentally backed up and stepped on mine and killed it. It was blue.

Oh well, after the dye wore off, they went in with the other chickens and we ate them eventually.

Ha ha! When I was 10 my grandparents flew in from NJ and spent the summer here in Tennessee. (I lived here for 3 years in the early 70s) My aunt & uncle had a farm in Cottontown and among other things had chickens. I helped my uncle bring the little chicks to the barn in the spring and my grandfather spent the whole summer taking care of them. He fed them every day and got the eggs every morning. At the end of the summer my uncle took me out the the barn and we spent the day killing and cleaning all the chickens. My grandfather was devistated. These were his pets all summer. That afternoon we had the freshest chicken cooked on the grill and it was the absolute best tasting chicken I ever had in my whole life. Needless to say my grandfather will never know how good it was, he wouldn’t eat any of it.

130 NJDhockeyfan  Apr 19, 2014 9:44:03pm

re: #126 wheat-doggha — oo bird outside my window

It would be best to separate those bunnies once they are weaned, or your rabbit population will quickly explode. My stepson learned this about hamsters, much too late.

They will be sold or given away as soon as they are ready. Any Nashville area lizards up for some rabbits this summer?

131 Targetpractice  Apr 19, 2014 9:44:18pm

re: #128 freetoken

Conservative heavyweights have solar industry in their sights

What’s good for business Kochs is good for America.

The days of the robber-barons are here again.

132 Fineday  Apr 19, 2014 9:47:12pm

re: #89 NJDhockeyfan

Evening lizards!

Update on my daughters new pet rabbit she got last weekend…

I
After I got home this evening after working all day I cleaned up the kitchen then sat down to eat my dinner. About 5 minutes later my daughter come in and says ” Dad, come look in the rabbit cage. There is a surprise for you! “

I walked down stairs and looked inside…a baby rabbit is in there. A few hours later we are now up to 7 baby rabbits. I’ll post the baby bunny total in the morning.

Congratulations!
Baby bunnies are the cutest things. They have to be at least 6 weeks old, before they can be seperated from their mom.

When I was a kid, my three older siblings got a guinea pig each. When we moved shortly afterwards, the people who moved for us put the male in one cage with the two females, and a few weeks after, both of the females gave birth to 5 tiny guinea pigs. We kept a few of them, and soon our friends added to the growing guinea pig family by dropping their pets off with us when they were going on vacation and forgetting to retrieve them when they got home. My mom also brought two guinea pigs home once that she found in a dumpster. Pretty soon we were up to our necks in guinea pigs, and we had to devote an entire room in our basement just for them. Moving them to our summer house in the spring, where they had outdoor cages, and back again in the fall was a circus. I remember that my mom and I tried to do a guinea pig count once. It was a difficult task, because the little critters won’t sit still for long, but we are pretty certain that there were 47 guinea pigs when we counted them.

My advice to you, if you don’t want to end up with a LOT of bunnies, is to sell or give all the baby bunnies away before they grow old enough to have babies themselves.

This is only my second post on LGF. I found this forum last year, when I went looking for someone who refused to join the “Glenn Greenwald is god, Ed Snowden is Jesus, and we are their loyal disciples choir”, and boy am I happy that I found you!
LGF has become my sanctuary. I come here daily for my politics fix, for my entertainment and for sheer inspiration. Thank you so much, Charlie, for setting this thing up and for maintaining it so well, and thank you lizards of all colors for providing me with endless fodder for thought. You have made yourself indispensible.

133 Gus  Apr 19, 2014 9:48:26pm

re: #128 freetoken

Conservative heavyweights have solar industry in their sights

What’s good for business Kochs is good for America.

So weird.

134 wheat-doggha -- oo bird outside my window  Apr 19, 2014 9:49:47pm

re: #128 freetoken

If scientists finally develop fusion energy, the Kochs and the energy companies would do everything in their power to prevent fusion from being commercially viable, unless they co-opted the technology for themselves and made everyone else pay exorbitantly high prices for the electricity generated.

135 blueraven  Apr 19, 2014 9:51:08pm

re: #130 NJDhockeyfan

They will be sold or given away as soon as they are ready. Any Nashville area lizards up for some rabbits this summer?

If they like reading, you should get the book Watership Down for your girls.

Best rabbit story ever!

136 Gus  Apr 19, 2014 9:52:01pm

re: #134 wheat-doggha — oo bird outside my window

If scientists finally develop fusion energy, the Kochs and the energy companies would do everything in their power to prevent fusion from being commercially viable, unless they co-opted the technology for themselves and made everyone else pay exorbitantly high prices for the electricity generated.

Windmills. Bad. //

137 freetoken  Apr 19, 2014 9:52:43pm

My local Cox internet is slowing down again.

Which is strange given the bandwidth they’ve installed over the past few years.

I gather that many people are jumping on the streaming bandwagon.

138 blueraven  Apr 19, 2014 9:54:46pm

re: #132 Fineday

Welcome, and Happy Easter hatchling.

and to all Lizards!

139 Gus  Apr 19, 2014 9:54:49pm

We must put an end to this madness called solar power!

140 freetoken  Apr 19, 2014 9:56:16pm

re: #133 Gus

So weird.

Here’s weird:

Fox executive fired over MH370 fundraising email

Fox has fired a veteran executive who used her company email account to plan aid for loved ones of passengers on the missing Malaysia Airlines plane.

Darlene Tipton says she emailed a woman whose boyfriend was aboard the plane to propose a fundraising effort.

Fox spokesman Scott Grogin said Ms Tipton’s “conduct and communications” violated company policy. He confirmed Ms Tipton had left the company.

Ms Tipton said she hopes to continue her drive, soliciting contributions through a fundraising website.
She was vice-president of standards and practices for the Fox Cable Networks Group.

141 Gus  Apr 19, 2014 9:56:28pm

Stop tree farms and forestry management!

142 Fineday  Apr 19, 2014 9:57:15pm

re: #125 NJDhockeyfan

[Embedded content]

Wonderful shot!

143 freetoken  Apr 19, 2014 9:58:45pm

Who knew that Fox Cable Networks had a “standards and practices” VP?

Would this be the same “standards and practices” office that is ok with Hannity entertaining his guest encouraging sedition against the US by declaring local sheriffs should interfere and stop federal law enforcement?

But fundraising for dead people is career ending?

144 Fineday  Apr 19, 2014 9:59:48pm

re: #138 blueraven

Welcome, and Happy Easter hatchling.

and to all Lizards!

Thank you, and likewise!

Posting from Denmark, where I was born and raised, and where the sun has just risen to what promises to be a glorious spring day here.

145 NJDhockeyfan  Apr 19, 2014 10:01:29pm
146 Kragar  Apr 19, 2014 10:06:00pm

40k fans will get this.

DEATH TO THE FALSE EMPEROR!

147 Gus  Apr 19, 2014 10:08:27pm

re: #146 Kragar

40k fans will get this.

DEATH TO THE FALSE EMPEROR!

[Embedded image]

Got one for ya if you’re interested.

148 NJDhockeyfan  Apr 19, 2014 10:09:39pm

In a few days I will be able to do this.

149 Fineday  Apr 19, 2014 10:11:23pm

re: #148 NJDhockeyfan

In a few days I will be able to do this.

[Embedded content]

Awwww!
I think I need an antidote to cuteness after that…

150 Kragar  Apr 19, 2014 10:11:54pm

re: #147 Gus

Nah, got some stuff going on and not in the mood for that stupid shit

151 Gus  Apr 19, 2014 10:13:31pm
152 NJDhockeyfan  Apr 19, 2014 10:13:44pm

re: #149 Fineday

Awwww!
I think I need an antidote to cuteness after that…

Snoopy!

153 NJDhockeyfan  Apr 19, 2014 10:17:56pm
154 Fineday  Apr 19, 2014 10:20:44pm

I went looking for an antidote to cuteness, and instead I found this story:
Ohio couple married for 70 years die 15 hours apart

Life can be amazing sometimes!

155 NJDhockeyfan  Apr 19, 2014 10:20:48pm
156 Targetpractice  Apr 19, 2014 10:21:59pm

My source of amusement for the past half-hour: Going through six month old predictions from wingnut pundits about how Obamacare was headed for failure. Enrollment would fall way short of expectations, “death spiral” rate increases, Democrats would join Republicans to demand the law’s repeal, etc.

157 Kragar  Apr 19, 2014 10:22:24pm
158 NJDhockeyfan  Apr 19, 2014 10:23:08pm
159 blueraven  Apr 19, 2014 10:23:44pm

re: #149 Fineday

Awwww!
I think I need an antidote to cuteness after that…

See Gus’ 151

Yeah rite, Obama is just like old George Z. DS is a sick bastard.

and with that I am out. G’night all.

160 freetoken  Apr 19, 2014 10:26:12pm

Back in those good ol’ days for which the atavists yearn:

Spotlighting a law that stripped U.S.-born women of citizenship

161 Fineday  Apr 19, 2014 10:36:21pm

re: #151 Gus

[Embedded content]

Now THAT is the antidote I was looking for!

Ugh!

162 NJDhockeyfan  Apr 19, 2014 10:40:55pm
163 wheat-doggha -- oo bird outside my window  Apr 19, 2014 10:41:26pm

re: #148 NJDhockeyfan

In a few days I will be able to do this.

If a group of bunnies is a fluffle, then what is a kerfluffle?

164 NJDhockeyfan  Apr 19, 2014 10:54:12pm

re: #163 wheat-doggha — oo bird outside my window

If a group of bunnies is a fluffle, then what is a kerfluffle?

A group of bunnies at the Kerman, Iran airport?

165 Ming  Apr 19, 2014 10:54:18pm

re: #124 NJDhockeyfan

We’ve always had pets. Dogs, cats, fish…rabbits are something new. My other daughter wants chickens. That dream is on the back burner (no pun intended).

Most excellent!

166 TedStriker  Apr 19, 2014 10:55:38pm

re: #163 wheat-doggha — oo bird outside my window

If a group of bunnies is a fluffle, then what is a kerfluffle?

Bunnies from Kerbal.

///

167 NJDhockeyfan  Apr 19, 2014 10:57:15pm

Holy fuck that’s a big rabbit!

168 TedStriker  Apr 19, 2014 10:57:52pm

re: #167 NJDhockeyfan

Holy fuck that’s a big rabbit!

[Embedded content]

Shit, that’s not a rabbit, that’s a freaking Shetland pony!

169 NJDhockeyfan  Apr 19, 2014 11:00:55pm
170 Gus  Apr 19, 2014 11:07:53pm

re: #167 NJDhockeyfan

Holy fuck that’s a big rabbit!

[Embedded content]

That’s not Ralph. That’s “Robert” owned by Karl Szmolinsky. Don’t know what happened to him.

spiegel.de

171 Gus  Apr 19, 2014 11:12:38pm

Think that was Robert I. There’s a Robert II. Robert I ended up going to North Korea and, well, eaten.

172 Gus  Apr 19, 2014 11:14:19pm

The delivery to North Korea included Germany’s largest rabbit Robert I, the father of Robert II. Officials from North Korea had told him they wanted to use the rabbits to set up a breeding farm to provide food for the population. The country has had problems with famine in recent years.

spiegel.de

173 NJDhockeyfan  Apr 19, 2014 11:14:55pm

re: #170 Gus

That’s not Ralph. That’s “Robert” owned by Karl Szmolinsky. Don’t know what happened to him.

spiegel.de

So Robert is an imposter! What did he do with Ralph?

174 Gus  Apr 19, 2014 11:15:46pm

re: #173 NJDhockeyfan

So Robert is an imposter! What did he do with Ralph?

Ralph is safe in America.

huffingtonpost.com

Robert I is gone.

175 Lancelot Link  Apr 19, 2014 11:17:27pm
176 Gus  Apr 19, 2014 11:20:00pm

Oops. Ralph is in the UK not USA.

177 NJDhockeyfan  Apr 19, 2014 11:21:04pm

re: #176 Gus

Oops. Ralph is in the UK not USA.

On tour?

178 Ming  Apr 19, 2014 11:23:20pm

re: #157 Kragar

News flash: the Confederate States of America is not part of my “roots” as a white person.

The defeat of the Confederate States of America is part of my roots as an American.

179 NJDhockeyfan  Apr 19, 2014 11:24:05pm

I think I’ll go to bed now. Enjoy some pretty eggs…

180 Targetpractice  Apr 19, 2014 11:24:17pm

re: #175 Lancelot Link

[Embedded content]

It’ll never happen. These are people who, to this day, spit and cross themselves anytime they speak the name “Jimmy Carter,” and he’s been out of office for 35 years now.

181 NJDhockeyfan  Apr 19, 2014 11:27:56pm

Oh, and smile. Things aren’t so bad…

182 Gus  Apr 19, 2014 11:31:40pm

RIP Robert I.

183 Gus  Apr 20, 2014 12:10:35am
184 Gus  Apr 20, 2014 12:10:45am
185 Gus  Apr 20, 2014 12:13:38am
186 goddamnedfrank  Apr 20, 2014 12:35:43am

Frankly amazing that there are idiots who can even make this argument with a straight face:

187 Gus  Apr 20, 2014 12:42:45am

re: #186 goddamnedfrank

Frankly amazing that there are idiots who can even make this argument with a straight face:

[Embedded content]

Derp.

188 Wendell Zurkowitz (slave to the waffle light)  Apr 20, 2014 1:03:31am

re: #77 Gus

England

Recall that England also has an established church, the Anglican Church, of which the King or Queen is the titular head.

There is also religious education in German schools: parents can opt for Lutheran, Catholic or “Ethics”. There is some discussion of instituting Islamic instruction, but it hangs up on the fact that there is no single Islamic Diocese in Germany as there is with the two Christian denominations.

So we tried to enroll my daughter in Ethics at her school, but since there were not enough students to make up a class, they duped her in the Lutheran class. I did not mind, as it was pretty neutral and concentrated mostly on teaching ethics and values as well.

But imagine a German child in an inner-city school in Berlin being placed in the Islamic course for the same reason…

189 Wendell Zurkowitz (slave to the waffle light)  Apr 20, 2014 1:10:01am

re: #155 NJDhockeyfan

[Embedded content]

Putin wants to make omelettes out of that…

190 Targetpractice  Apr 20, 2014 1:24:01am

re: #186 goddamnedfrank

Frankly amazing that there are idiots who can even make this argument with a straight face:

[Embedded content]

At least he’s not one of those mouthbreathers declaring that if an illegal immigrant can get into the country, then Bundy should be allowed to break the law with impunity.

191 Shiplord Kirel  Apr 20, 2014 1:27:14am

Odds and ends

This might be the toughest and most multiply skilled military force in the world, and is certainly one of the most unusual. Slædepatruljen Sirius (Sirius Sledge Patrol). This is the 14 man Danish navy unit that provides police and military presence in the wilds of northeastern Greenland. Patrolmen work in pairs and travel by dog sled, often for months at a time with no other human contact. Training involves the usual; shooting, demolition, etc. and such esoterica as sewing.
It is one of the few military units in the world that still uses bolt action rifles (M-1917 Enfield) on the grounds that only manual action rifles are reliable enough under the extreme conditions. They also carry a sidearm, a 10mm Glock semi-auto pistol. This was recently upgraded from a 9mm because the latter did not have adequate stopping power against rogue polar bears. Semi-auto is apparently acceptable for hand guns because they are not as exposed to the elements as the rifles.
The Sirius Patrol saw combat during World War II, locating and rooting out various clandestine weather stations the Germans had set up in Greenland. In the days before weather satellites, this was crucial intelligence activity and its denial had a real effect on the German war effort.

192 Wendell Zurkowitz (slave to the waffle light)  Apr 20, 2014 1:31:20am

re: #191 Shiplord Kirel

that is some Sirius shit…

193 goddamnedfrank  Apr 20, 2014 1:36:36am

re: #191 Shiplord Kirel

Odds and ends

This might be the toughest and most multiply skilled military force in the world, and is certainly one of the most unusual. Slædepatruljen Sirius (Sirius Sledge Patrol). This is the 14 man Danish navy unit that provides police and military presence in the wilds of northeastern Greenland. Patrolmen work in pairs and travel by dog sled, often for months at a time with no other human contact. Training involves the usual; shooting, demolition, etc. and such esoterica as sewing.
It is one of the few military units in the world that still uses bolt action rifles (M-1917 Enfield) on the grounds that only manual action rifles are reliable enough under the extreme conditions. They also carry a sidearm, a 10mm Glock semi-auto pistol. This was recently upgraded from a 9mm because the latter did not have adequate stopping power against rogue polar bears. Semi-auto is apparently acceptable for hand guns because they are not as exposed to the elements as the rifles.
The Sirius Patrol saw combat during World War II, locating and rooting out various clandestine weather stations the Germans had set up in Greenland. In the days before weather satellites, this was crucial intelligence activity and its denial had a real effect on the German war effort.

National Geographic had an article on those guys a couple years ago. Psychologically that might be the toughest military duty there is. The environment there is just massively unforgiving.

194 freetoken  Apr 20, 2014 1:38:13am

Sirius Deception:

MP3 Audio

195 freetoken  Apr 20, 2014 3:41:00am
196 Wendell Zurkowitz (slave to the waffle light)  Apr 20, 2014 3:54:15am

freetoken, good to the last drop…

197 Flounder  Apr 20, 2014 4:03:37am

Happy Easter! Easter is probably my least favorite holiday. As a kid always managed to barf on this day. Ah, childhood memories!

198 Wendell Zurkowitz (slave to the waffle light)  Apr 20, 2014 4:05:57am

re: #197 Flounder

Happy Easter! Easter is probably my least favorite holiday. As a kid always managed to barf on this day. Ah, childhood memories!

I could write a sonnet/about your Easter vomit…

(that line came to me one Easter as I was cleaning up my daughter’s chocolate puke)

199 NJDhockeyfan  Apr 20, 2014 4:53:26am
200 Dr Lizardo  Apr 20, 2014 4:58:51am

re: #199 NJDhockeyfan

[Embedded content]

Apparently, bunnies weren’t such gentle creatures in medieval times.

201 Wendell Zurkowitz (slave to the waffle light)  Apr 20, 2014 4:59:21am

re: #200 Dr Lizardo

Apparently, bunnies weren’t such gentle creatures in medieval times.

wonder if Monty Python were aware of that…

202 Backwoods_Sleuth  Apr 20, 2014 5:16:23am

re: #55 Gus

@ParkView_school

That’s Park View School in Tottenham, London.

This is the Park View School in Birmingham:
twitter.com
parkview.bham.sch.uk

203 NJDhockeyfan  Apr 20, 2014 5:20:41am
204 NJDhockeyfan  Apr 20, 2014 5:22:06am
205 Dark_Falcon  Apr 20, 2014 5:22:12am

re: #203 NJDhockeyfan

[Embedded content]

Just keep it away from Dan Brown. I don’t want him getting any ideas.

206 Wendell Zurkowitz (slave to the waffle light)  Apr 20, 2014 5:29:24am

Surely Templars?

207 wheat-doggha -- oo bird outside my window  Apr 20, 2014 5:30:44am

re: #206 Wendell Zurkowitz (slave to the waffle light)

Surely Templars?

Don’t call them Shirley.

[Sorry, stepping on your pun.]

208 NJDhockeyfan  Apr 20, 2014 5:38:53am
209 FemNaziBitch  Apr 20, 2014 5:55:40am

re: #91 Charles Johnson

It never stops.

Thank you for your efforts!

210 Pie-onist Overlord  Apr 20, 2014 5:56:00am

Fleecing Of The Rubes, Part 19467838078
What’s the over/under that there will be NO MOVIE and the “producer” just absconds with all the cash?

211 FemNaziBitch  Apr 20, 2014 5:57:52am

re: #125 NJDhockeyfan

[Embedded content]

OMEN!

212 Dark_Falcon  Apr 20, 2014 6:02:41am

re: #210 Pie-onist Overlord

Fleecing Of The Rubes, Part 19467838078
What’s the over/under that there will be NO MOVIE and the “producer” just absconds with all the cash?

[Embedded content]

I think they’ll turn out a script and try casting the movie, but I think they’ll have a hard time finding a black actor willing to take the role.

213 wheat-doggha -- oo bird outside my window  Apr 20, 2014 6:04:51am

re: #212 Dark_Falcon

What’s the movie about?

214 steve_davis  Apr 20, 2014 6:06:44am

re: #3 Romantic Heretic

I was just watching one from their about the kamikazes.

Interesting footage but the bullshit about them at the beginning of the film made me want to barf.

How things have changed.

Even listening to Top of the Pops commentary on some of BBC’s archival CD’s is irritating. “And now, here’s another swinging number by that cat Eric Clapton, called ‘Steppin’ Out,’ ” all with that pseudo British Broadcast/late 1960’s psychedelic hipster accent that is grating after about 10 seconds.

215 William Barnett-Lewis  Apr 20, 2014 6:07:29am

re: #213 wheat-doggha — oo bird outside my window

What’s the movie about?

About a guy who took advantage of desperate women after the far right left them unable to get decent health care, to include abortion.

216 Pie-onist Overlord  Apr 20, 2014 6:08:16am

re: #213 wheat-doggha — oo bird outside my window

What’s the movie about?

Gosnell, in Philadelphia who ran an Oxy mill & unsafe abortion clinic.

217 wheat-doggha -- oo bird outside my window  Apr 20, 2014 6:09:44am

re: #215 William Barnett-Lewis

re: #216 Pie-onist Overlord

Sounds positively heartwarming. /

218 FemNaziBitch  Apr 20, 2014 6:10:46am

Missouri, Kansas, Nebraska —what is it with these middle states?

219 wheat-doggha -- oo bird outside my window  Apr 20, 2014 6:13:23am

re: #218 FemNaziBitch

How would that even be a legal restriction on employment? Federal agents are required by law to enforce federal laws, because that’s kinda their job, you know. So, using GOP pretzel logic, that disqualifies them from public service jobs in the state.

My head is spinning.

220 Killgore Trout  Apr 20, 2014 6:13:59am

re: #202 Backwoods_Sleuth

That’s Park View School in Tottenham, London.

This is the Park View School in Birmingham:
twitter.com
parkview.bham.sch.uk

Ah, nice catch. Here’s one of the school news letters which addresses some of the allegations. (PDF)

Lots of pics, students look a bit more what what I expected than the other school

221 Killgore Trout  Apr 20, 2014 6:18:05am

Assad is still a very naughty boy
Hollande: Indications that Assad still using chemical weapons

French President Francois Hollande said on Sunday that France has indications that the Syrian regime of President Bashar Assad is still using chemical weapons, though it still lacks proof.

In an interview with the Europe 1 radio station, Hollande said that France has “some elements of information” regarding the use of chemical weapons by Syria, but “I do not have proof so I cannot give it here.”

Foreign Minister Laurent Fabius also spoke of new “information, that needs to be verified, that there have been chemical attacks recently.”

The suspected attacks, which took place in the northwest of the country near Lebanon, Fabius said, were “much smaller” than those in Damascus in August 2013, but nevertheless “very deadly.”

222 Wendell Zurkowitz (slave to the waffle light)  Apr 20, 2014 6:18:29am

re: #219 wheat-doggha — oo bird outside my window

How would that even be a legal restriction on employment? Federal agents are required by law to enforce federal laws, because that’s kinda their job, you know. So, using GOP pretzel logic, that disqualifies them from public service jobs in the state.

My head is spinning.

Because guns and Second Amendment, you liberal patsy…

/

223 FemNaziBitch  Apr 20, 2014 6:19:37am
224 FemNaziBitch  Apr 20, 2014 6:20:22am

It’s morning.

I really don’t like holidays.

Sorry.

225 FemNaziBitch  Apr 20, 2014 6:22:36am
226 FemNaziBitch  Apr 20, 2014 6:23:51am
227 FemNaziBitch  Apr 20, 2014 6:25:11am

BAPS Temple in the Chicago area has this kinda of Mandir. It’s so incredibly beautiful.

If you are ever in the area, they welcome visitors.

228 wheat-doggha -- oo bird outside my window  Apr 20, 2014 6:27:19am

re: #222 Wendell Zurkowitz (slave to the waffle light)

Because guns and Second Amendment, you liberal patsy…

/

Oh, I forgot the Tea Party Constitution strips out all the non-essential folderol and leaves only the most important clause.

Like the RR Bible skips over the Sermon on the Mount and gets right to fire, brimstone and eternal damnation.

229 FemNaziBitch  Apr 20, 2014 6:28:30am

IS IT Too early for cuteness?

230 FemNaziBitch  Apr 20, 2014 6:30:48am
231 darthstar  Apr 20, 2014 6:40:32am

It’s okay…this one doesn’t eat brains…only souls. Happy Easter everyone.

232 Dark_Falcon  Apr 20, 2014 6:40:54am

re: #219 wheat-doggha — oo bird outside my window

How would that even be a legal restriction on employment? Federal agents are required by law to enforce federal laws, because that’s kinda their job, you know. So, using GOP pretzel logic, that disqualifies them from public service jobs in the state.

My head is spinning.

It’s called “Demonstrating Purity and Staying Ahead of the Competition”. The problem with passing pro or anti gun laws at the state level is that at some point you run out of major laws you can pass without violating federal law. When that happens, state legislators sometimes turn to mostly symbolic laws like this one to make clear how pure their position is and how they are “moving forward”.

It also helps prevent primary challenges, which might occur if a state legislature simply passed a set of gun laws and then left things alone. OUTRAGEOUS OUTRAGES!!1 would happen elsewhere and when the legislators refused to respond to the fake threat they’d be pilloried as “weak, corrupt, and it the other side’s pocket”.

The reason I say “pro and anti gun” is that in places like California and Illinois you do have lawmakers who have this mindset from an anti-gun perspective,

233 FemNaziBitch  Apr 20, 2014 6:43:28am

caption this:

234 Killgore Trout  Apr 20, 2014 6:46:07am

My mom is Ukrainian and as a kid she used to make Ukrainian Easter eggs
google.com

235 Decatur Deb  Apr 20, 2014 6:46:36am

re: #233 FemNaziBitch

“I told you to wait 30 minutes after eating a hunter.”

236 FemNaziBitch  Apr 20, 2014 6:50:12am
237 FemNaziBitch  Apr 20, 2014 6:51:04am
238 FemNaziBitch  Apr 20, 2014 6:53:33am
239 Wendell Zurkowitz (slave to the waffle light)  Apr 20, 2014 6:55:25am

re: #236 FemNaziBitch

This is stuff I was well aware of before Dan Brown popularized it in The Da Vinci Code. But it explains the way that so many people found it such an eye-opener: the Church was willing and able to co-opt whatever aspects of paganism it could not stamp out.

240 Wendell Zurkowitz (slave to the waffle light)  Apr 20, 2014 6:56:35am

A well-regulated militia being bla bla bla we dispense with, the right of crackers to point guns at federal agents they find pesky shall not be abridged…

241 Dark_Falcon  Apr 20, 2014 7:12:48am

re: #238 FemNaziBitch

[Embedded content]

242 Feline Fearless Leader  Apr 20, 2014 7:15:14am

re: #106 Gus

[Embedded content]

I hear his name is Stew.

243 Feline Fearless Leader  Apr 20, 2014 7:22:25am

re: #155 NJDhockeyfan

Putin sees an omelet in the making there.
/

244 austin_blue  Apr 20, 2014 7:22:43am

The inherent homo-erotica in these clips always remind me of this:

Youtube Video

You just couldn’t do that anymore, IMO. Too politically incorrect.

245 Feline Fearless Leader  Apr 20, 2014 7:24:31am

re: #163 wheat-doggha — oo bird outside my window

If a group of bunnies is a fluffle, then what is a kerfluffle?

A fluffle after a wandering cat or fox has found it.

246 FemNaziBitch  Apr 20, 2014 7:25:24am

More books you may or may not be interested in reading.

247 FemNaziBitch  Apr 20, 2014 7:26:50am

re: #241 Dark_Falcon

[Embedded content]

I think you are missing the point.

Change the scene to the inner city and brown citizens.

248 wheat-doggha -- oo bird outside my window  Apr 20, 2014 7:29:01am

re: #245 Feline Fearless Leader

A fluffle after a wandering cat or fox has found it.

Fair enough

249 Dark_Falcon  Apr 20, 2014 7:32:08am

re: #247 FemNaziBitch

I think you are missing the point.

Change the scene to the inner city and brown citizens.

If it were an inner city setting, the FBI and local SWAT would have simply executed a surprise raid and hauled out the lawbreaker in cuffs and leg irons. But those sorts of raids are easier in a city in some ways, since there are normally more angles of approach and your can disperse your raid vehicles so as to avoid tipping the target off.

BBL

250 Killgore Trout  Apr 20, 2014 7:47:47am

Meanwhile in Chicago…
5 killed, 22 wounded in Chicago shootings

Five people have been killed and at least 22 others have been wounded in shootings across Chicago since Friday evening.

The Chicago Sun-Times is reporting (bit.ly) that two teens were shot around 10:30 a.m. Saturday at an apartment on the city’s South Side. A 43-year-old man was found with multiple gunshot wounds in an alley on the West Side earlier Saturday. And another man died after being shot following a car chase, also on the city’s West Side.

A fifth man was shot to death Friday night in the South Austin neighborhood.

No one was in custody for any of the shootings as area detectives continue to investigate.

251 Wendell Zurkowitz (slave to the waffle light)  Apr 20, 2014 7:48:36am

re: #250 Killgore Trout

The Long Good Friday…

252 Killgore Trout  Apr 20, 2014 7:49:41am
253 FemNaziBitch  Apr 20, 2014 7:52:17am
254 Killgore Trout  Apr 20, 2014 7:53:11am

Nigeria gunmen raze teachers residence at girls school

Gunmen in northern Nigeria set fire to staff residential building at a girls’ secondary school on Sunday but the 195 students sleeping in their nearby dormitories were unharmed, police and a teacher said.

255 sattv4u2  Apr 20, 2014 8:08:49am

re: #254 Killgore Trout

Nigeria gunmen raze teachers residence at girls school

Just some guys, out for a walk,, had nothing else to do no doubt

256 sattv4u2  Apr 20, 2014 8:12:41am

re: #233 FemNaziBitch

caption this:

[Embedded content]

“Why can’t that goddam seal stay on the beach where I have the advantage!”

257 Killgore Trout  Apr 20, 2014 8:17:11am

re: #255 sattv4u2

Just some guys, out for a walk,, had nothing else to do no doubt

Must have been an accident of some kind.
/

258 Killgore Trout  Apr 20, 2014 8:20:47am

Outrage!
Head of Egypt’s censorship board resigns after dispute over showing bombshell’s steamy film

The head of Egypt’s censorship board says he has resigned after the country’s prime minister overruled his decision to allow a film starring a sultry Lebanese singer be shown.

Ahmed Awad, undersecretary to the culture minister and head of the censorship authority, told The Associated Press on Saturday that he had submitted his resignation Thursday morning in response to Prime Minister Ibrahim Mahlab’s decision to stop the film from being shown.

Awad says: “I did this out of respect for myself.”

Mahlab said he stopped the film from being shown in response to calls from the National Council for Motherhood and Childhood and “to preserve the morals of our children.” In the film, Lebanese sex symbol Haifa Wehbe has a young boy infatuated with her character.

Too much censorship for the head of censorship? lol

259 sattv4u2  Apr 20, 2014 8:20:48am

re: #257 Killgore Trout

Must have been an accident of some kind.
/

“I really didn’t know that flamethrower was loaded, officer”

OR

“Hey ,,,, who put gas and a rag in my water bottle!! I just wanted to warm up my water for some tea!!”

260 Killgore Trout  Apr 20, 2014 8:26:00am

re: #259 sattv4u2

“I really didn’t know that flamethrower was loaded, officer”

OR

“Hey ,,,, who put gas and a rag in my water bottle!! I just wanted to warm up my water for some tea!!”

Maybe “We were just celebrating Easter/420 while listening to Bob Marley and the lava lamp must have overheated”

261 Wendell Zurkowitz (slave to the waffle light)  Apr 20, 2014 8:34:08am

re: #254 Killgore Trout

Nigeria gunmen raze teachers residence at girls school

Just trying to save these girls from the damages inflicted by a secular education.

/

262 Killgore Trout  Apr 20, 2014 8:36:26am

Syria: Bashar al-Assad ‘launching chemical weapons attacks with chlorine’

American and British officials are thought to be currently examining video footage of Chinese manufactured chlorine gas canisters rigged with explosive detonators hitting the town of Kafr Zita near Hama.

While chlorine is not listed as a banned chemical agent in recognition of its wide range of industrial uses, its use as a weapon of war is prohibited under the 1925 Chemical Weapons Convention.

263 sattv4u2  Apr 20, 2014 8:37:42am

re: #254 Killgore Trout

re: #261 Wendell Zurkowitz (slave to the waffle light)

They burnt “several buildings including a staff quarters of a girls’ secondary school, an eight-block police quarters, a sharia (Islamic law) court and the local government secretariat,

oooopps

Lucy ,,, you got some splainin to doooooo!!!!!

264 Timothy Watson  Apr 20, 2014 8:42:05am

I mentioned a couple posts back that April 20th is the 15th anniversary of the Columbine High School shooting. If anyone is looking for an informative book on the shooting, check out Dave Cullen’s “Columbine”.

265 Wendell Zurkowitz (slave to the waffle light)  Apr 20, 2014 8:50:35am

re: #263 sattv4u2

>They burnt “several buildings including a staff quarters of a girls’ secondary school, an eight-block police quarters, >a sharia (Islamic law) court and the local government secretariat,

oooopps

Their passion for their country drove them to excessive behavior: the Newt Gingrich defense.

266 sattv4u2  Apr 20, 2014 8:51:41am

re: #265 Wendell Zurkowitz (slave to the waffle light)

Their passion for their country drove them to excessive behavior: the Newt Gingrich defense.

Cept, in these cases,,,, tain’t about “country”

267 Killgore Trout  Apr 20, 2014 8:54:40am

re: #266 sattv4u2

Cept, in these cases,,,, tain’t about “country”

Mullah Newt does have a nice ring to it but it’s a strained analogy.

268 sattv4u2  Apr 20, 2014 9:07:18am

re: #267 Killgore Trout

Mullah Newt does have a nice ring to it but it’s a strained analogy.

Plus, as squat as he is, he keeps tripping on the dishdasha!!

269 FemNaziBitch  Apr 20, 2014 9:23:10am

re: #256 sattv4u2

“Why can’t that goddam seal stay on the beach where I have the advantage!”

I was thinking more on the line of:

“OMG! What do you think you are doing?”

Or

“Remember to kick your legs straight out!”

270 William Barnett-Lewis  Apr 20, 2014 9:27:24am

Happy Easter!

To our Christian Lizards, alleluia!

To our Jewish Lizards, I hope your holy days were wonderful and that today is always a blessing rather than what it has all too often been, alas.

To our Pagan Lizards, be fertile & have an egg!

To our Atheist Lizards, may it be as beautiful a spring day for you as it is here today so you can have a glorious day with family.

Amen.

271 blueraven  Apr 20, 2014 9:28:53am

re: #241 Dark_Falcon

Where is your evidence that the BLM had snipers?

272 palomino  Apr 20, 2014 9:35:40am

re: #250 Killgore Trout

Meanwhile in Chicago…
5 killed, 22 wounded in Chicago shootings

Are you just posting the local police blotter for every city?

Or do you have a point?

273 Killgore Trout  Apr 20, 2014 9:37:13am

re: #272 palomino

Are you just posting the local police blotter for every city?

Or do you have a point?

Gun violence is a problem.

274 Mattand  Apr 20, 2014 9:38:45am

re: #225 FemNaziBitch

Target is closed today?

Holy Christ, did that raise an uproar here this morning. The better half was piisssssed, mainly because she wasted half the shopping trip this morning.

She had several good points though:

1) Open on Xmas, but not Easter?
2) No signs posted on the doors
3) All printed/e-mail notices that do exist were in tiny 1.5 pt mouse copy.

I don’t begrudge anyone a day off, particularly in retail. But they could have made it more well known. With all of the frigging e-mails we get from them, I’m not sure why “Happy Easter, we’re closed Sunday” couldn’t have been one of them.

275 Lidane  Apr 20, 2014 9:38:46am

276 sagehen  Apr 20, 2014 9:40:07am

Passover. Les Mis. the Maccabeats.

Youtube Video

277 Wendell Zurkowitz (slave to the waffle light)  Apr 20, 2014 9:40:54am

re: #271 blueraven

Where is your evidence that the BLM had snipers?

because federal government. now shut up and reload

278 Gus  Apr 20, 2014 9:41:21am

And Cheri Jacobus links to Jim Hoft!

279 Wendell Zurkowitz (slave to the waffle light)  Apr 20, 2014 9:41:34am

re: #273 Killgore Trout

Gun violence is a problem.

The right to bear arms is god given, now shut up and reload

280 Mattand  Apr 20, 2014 9:41:48am

re: #273 Killgore Trout

Gun violence is a problem.

It will be for a long time until Americans stop venerating firearms as sacred holy relics that are more essential to life than food, air and water.

281 Wendell Zurkowitz (slave to the waffle light)  Apr 20, 2014 9:42:51am

re: #280 Mattand

It will be for a long time until Americans stop venerating firearms as sacred holy relics that are more essential to life than food, air and water.

without guns we have no freedoms, and without freedoms food, air and water are of no use to anyone. now shut up and pass me that clip.

/

282 palomino  Apr 20, 2014 9:43:27am

re: #241 Dark_Falcon

[Embedded content]

No offense, but you just don’t get it. You’re missing the forest for the trees.

She asks a valid and important question: since when do citizens get to point AR-15s at federal agents and then just walk away? When did that become an acceptable form of discourse or dissent? Why are so many Republicans (the party of “law and order”) openly endorsing such lawlessness?

Many on the right, including some at your beloved reactionary rag NRO, suddenly see such actions as laudable. If mobs of blacks in Mississippi or Hispanics in Arizona were pointing assault rifles at federal agents, the white conservative response would almost certainly be much different.

This is just another bullshit example of IOKIYAR. Nothing more.

283 Decatur Deb  Apr 20, 2014 9:47:32am

re: #281 Wendell Zurkowitz (slave to the waffle light)

without guns we have no freedoms, and without freedoms food, air and water are of no use to anyone. now shut up and pass me that clip.

/

IT’S NOT A CLIP, IT’S A MAGAZINE !!!

284 palomino  Apr 20, 2014 9:47:54am

re: #273 Killgore Trout

Gun violence is a problem.

So then why not give us updates for the rest of the country?

Chicago’s not the only place where gun violence is a problem.

And what are your solutions?

285 Lidane  Apr 20, 2014 9:49:45am

re: #282 palomino

This is just another bullshit example of IOKIYAR. Nothing more.

The Bundy Ranch yahoos embody IOKIYAR. We all know damn well that if Bundy was named Benitez and he’d neglected to pay his grazing fees for decades and claimed sovereignty and dared the government to come and take his cows, the American right wing would be calling for drone strikes and deportation of everyone involved.

It’s such an obvious sign of white privilege that all of these assholes feel entitled to fire on federal law enforcement when if their skin was darker, they would’ve been shot and arrested ages ago.

286 Killgore Trout  Apr 20, 2014 9:50:04am

Guardian: Teachers complaining about the school investigators

Teachers complain about behaviour of Ofsted inspectors investigating ‘plot’

“The Ofsted team were going to the staff of the school and saying: ‘We’re going to fail you.’ And some of the staff were saying: ‘Why are you failing us?’ And [Ofsted] were saying: ‘You’re not teaching anti-terrorism and therefore there’s a safeguarding issue in this school,” King said.

287 Killgore Trout  Apr 20, 2014 9:53:09am

re: #284 palomino

So then why not give us updates for the rest of the country?

Chicago’s not the only place where gun violence is a problem.

And what are your solutions?

I’m pretty sure Chicago is at the top of the list of gun violence in the US. 30 people shot in a weekend should be a newsworthy story especially for people interested in gun violence. Solutions? I’m not sure but I’d seriously consider mimicking New York’s remedies, they done a nice job at reducing gun violence in a much larger city.

288 Political Atheist  Apr 20, 2014 9:53:58am

re: #273 Killgore Trout

Gun violence is a problem.

Let’s be far more specific. For every school shooting there are many, many gang shooting incidents.

They poison our streets with drugs, violence, and all manner of crime.
Some 33,000 violent street gangs, motorcycle gangs, and prison gangs with about 1.4 million members are criminally active in the U.S. today. Many are sophisticated and well organized; all use violence to control neighborhoods and boost their illegal money-making activities, which include robbery, drug and gun trafficking, fraud, extortion, and prostitution rings. According to the 2011 National Gang Threat Assessment report, gangs are responsible for an average of 48 percent of violent crime in most jurisdictions, and up to 90 percent in others. We’re redoubling our efforts to disrupt and dismantle gangs through intelligence-driven investigations and new initiatives and partnerships.</blockquote>

289 Killgore Trout  Apr 20, 2014 9:54:47am

re: #288 Political Atheist

Let’s be far more specific. For every school shooting there are many, many gang shooting incidents.

Very true.

290 palomino  Apr 20, 2014 9:55:39am

re: #287 Killgore Trout

I’m pretty sure Chicago is at the top of the list of gun violence in the US. 30 people shot in a weekend should be a newsworthy story especially for people interested in gun violence. Solutions? I’m not sure but I’d seriously consider mimicking New York’s remedies, they done a nice job at reducing gun violence in a much larger city.

Just as I suspected: You’ve really got nothing to say.

291 bubba zanetti  Apr 20, 2014 9:56:00am

re: #282 palomino

Contrast with the New Black Panthers outrage.

292 sattv4u2  Apr 20, 2014 9:56:20am

re: #284 palomino

re: #287 Killgore Trout

I’m pretty sure Chicago is at the top of the list of gun violence in the US

Overall number of gun murders:

Here is how the nation’s metropolitan areas ranked for gun homicides in 2009-2010:

1. Los Angeles…………………..1,141

2. Chicago…………………………1,139

3. New York………………………..1,101

4. Philadelphia………………………729

5. Houston…………………………….701

6. Detroit……………………………….686

7. Miami…………………………………594

8. Dallas………………………………..469

9. Washington………………………..440

10. San Francisco………………….439

293 andres  Apr 20, 2014 9:57:35am

re: #103 NJDhockeyfan

I don’t remember much, but keep an eye on the mother rabbit.

I think the baby rabbits will be independent enough when they are 3-4 months old.

Sorry I’m of not much use.

294 Lidane  Apr 20, 2014 9:57:37am

re: #292 sattv4u2

So basically guns kill a lot of people.

295 Mattand  Apr 20, 2014 9:57:59am

re: #284 palomino

So then why not give us updates for the rest of the country?

Chicago’s not the only place where gun violence is a problem.

And what are your solutions?

I’m sure if Obama were from Des Moines, we’d be hearing about the out-of-control gun violence there.

296 sattv4u2  Apr 20, 2014 9:58:41am

re: #292 sattv4u2

POPULATION

2012 estimate

L.A. ,,, 3,857,799
Chicago,, 2,714,856
New York City ,,8,336,697

297 Killgore Trout  Apr 20, 2014 9:58:52am

re: #292 sattv4u2

I’m pretty sure Chicago is at the top of the list of gun violence in the US

Overall number of gun murders:

Here is how the nation’s metropolitan areas ranked for gun homicides in 2009-2010:

1. Los Angeles…………………..1,141

2. Chicago…………………………1,139

3. New York………………………..1,101

4. Philadelphia………………………729

5. Houston…………………………….701

6. Detroit……………………………….686

7. Miami…………………………………594

8. Dallas………………………………..469

9. Washington………………………..440

10. San Francisco………………….439

Interesting, I thought NY was a bit lower down on the list but it’s still not bad if you break it down per capita. I’m also Surprised to see Dallas beating Washington.

298 sattv4u2  Apr 20, 2014 9:59:44am

re: #297 Killgore Trout

Interesting, I thought NY was a bit lower down on the list but it’s still not bad if you break it down per capita. I’m also Surprised to see Dallas beating Washington.

Yup

See #296

299 sattv4u2  Apr 20, 2014 9:59:53am

re: #294 Lidane

So basically guns kill a lot of people.

SHOCKA!!!

300 Mattand  Apr 20, 2014 10:02:05am

re: #285 Lidane

The Bundy Ranch yahoos embody IOKIYAR. We all know damn well that if Bundy was named Benitez and he’d neglected to pay his grazing fees for decades and claimed sovereignty and dared the government to come and take his cows, the American right wing would be calling for drone strikes and deportation of everyone involved.

It’s such an obvious sign of white privilege that all of these assholes feel entitled to fire on federal law enforcement when if their skin was darker, they would’ve been shot and arrested ages ago.

A lot of Tea Baggers and conservatives really want the Bundy Ranch to be their Bunker/Breed’s Hill. Fox News is practically begging them to kill federal law enforcement.

I knew that many of my fellow Americans would lose their shit when a black person got elected President. I just didn’t think it would push them to rabies-level derangement.

301 Fairly Sure I'm Still Obdicut  Apr 20, 2014 10:04:34am

re: #287 Killgore Trout

I’m pretty sure Chicago is at the top of the list of gun violence in the US.

Why are you pretty sure? have you done, like, fifteen seconds of research on the topic?

politicususa.com

Chicago doesn’t crack the top 10.

theatlanticcities.com

Why don’t you spend ten seconds googling this so you don’t look like quite such an idiot?

302 Fairly Sure I'm Still Obdicut  Apr 20, 2014 10:05:19am

re: #299 sattv4u2

SHOCKA!!!

But only when there are a lot of guns around.

303 Political Atheist  Apr 20, 2014 10:06:30am

re: #294 Lidane

So basically guns kill a lot of people.

Just a slight oversimplification, no?

304 blueraven  Apr 20, 2014 10:06:30am

re: #292 sattv4u2

Gun deaths per capita by state

#1, Mississippi
Gun deaths per 100,000: 18.3
Permissive gun laws: 4th out of 50

#2, Arizona
Gun deaths per 100,000: 15
Permissive gun laws: 1st out of 50

#3, Alaska
Gun deaths per 100,000: 17.6
Permissive gun laws: 11th out of 50

#4, Arkansas
Gun deaths per 100,000: 15.1
Permissive gun laws: 7th out of 50

#5, Louisiana
Gun deaths per 100,000: 19.9
Permissive gun laws: 23rd out of 50

#6, New Mexico
Gun deaths per 100,000: 15
Permissive gun laws: 6th out of 50

#7, Alabama
Gun deaths per 100,000: 17.6
Permissive gun laws: 27th out of 50

#8, Nevada
Gun deaths per 100,000: 16.2
Permissive gun laws: 22nd out of 50

#9, Montana
Gun deaths per 100,000: 14.5
Permissive gun laws: 10th out of 50

#10, Wyoming
Gun deaths per 100,000: 14.5
Permissive gun laws: 8th out of 50

#11, Kentucky
Gun deaths per 100,000: 14.4
Permissive gun laws: 5th out of 50

#12, West Virginia
Gun deaths per 100,000: 14.8
Permissive gun laws: 25th out of 50

#13, Tennessee
Gun deaths per 100,000: 15
Permissive gun laws: 31st out of 50

#14, Oklahoma
Gun deaths per 100,000: 13.4
Permissive gun laws: 17th out of 50

#15, Idaho
Gun deaths per 100,000: 12.5
Permissive gun laws: 2nd out of 50

#16, Georgia
Gun deaths per 100,000: 13.1
Permissive gun laws: 13th out of 50

#17, Missouri
Gun deaths per 100,000: 12.9
Permissive gun laws: 12th out of 50

#18, South Carolina
Gun deaths per 100,000: 13.4
Permissive gun laws: 20th out of 50

#19, North Carolina
Gun deaths per 100,000: 12.3
Permissive gun laws: 28th out of 50

#20, Florida
Gun deaths per 100,000: 12.5
Permissive gun laws: 41st out of 50

#21, Kansas
Gun deaths per 100,000: 10.5
Permissive gun laws: 14th out of 50

#22, Indiana
Gun deaths per 100,000: 10.6
Permissive gun laws: 21st out of 50

#23, Texas
Gun deaths per 100,000: 10.7
Permissive gun laws: 32nd out of 50

#24, Michigan
Gun deaths per 100,000: 10.9
Permissive gun laws: 39th out of 50

#25, Maryland
Gun deaths per 100,000: 12.1
Permissive gun laws: 44th out of 50

#26, Colorado
Gun deaths per 100,000: 10.4
Permissive gun laws: 24rd out of 50

#27, Pennsylvania
Gun deaths per 100,000: 10.7
Permissive gun laws: 40th out of 50

#28, Virginia
Gun deaths per 100,000: 10.7
Permissive gun laws: 35th out of 50

#29, Utah
Gun deaths per 100,000: 9.5
Permissive gun laws: 18th out of 50

#30, Vermont
Gun deaths per 100,000: 8.4
Permissive gun laws: 3rd out of 50

#31, Oregon
Gun deaths per 100,000: 10.4
Permissive gun laws: 30th out of 50

#32, North Dakota
Gun deaths per 100,000: 8.9
Permissive gun laws: 15th out of 50

#33, Ohio
Gun deaths per 100,000: 9.6
Permissive gun laws: 29th out of 50

#34, Maine
Gun deaths per 100,000: 8.1
Permissive gun laws: 9th out of 50

#35, Delaware
Gun deaths per 100,000: 9.2
Permissive gun laws: 33rd out of 50

#36, Wisconsin
Gun deaths per 100,000: 8.7
Permissive gun laws: 34th out of 50

#37, Nebraska
Gun deaths per 100,000: 8
Permissive gun laws: 19th out of 50

#38, South Dakota
Gun deaths per 100,000: 6.5
Permissive gun laws: 16th out of 50

#39, Washington
Gun deaths per 100,000: 8.5
Permissive gun laws: 37th out of 50

#40, California
Gun deaths per 100,000: 9
Permissive gun laws: 50th out of 50

#41, New Hampshire
Gun deaths per 100,000: 5.9
Permissive gun laws: 26th out of 50

#42, Minnesota
Gun deaths per 100,000: 6.6
Permissive gun laws: 36th out of 50

#43, Illinois
Gun deaths per 100,000: 8
Permissive gun laws: 45th out of 50

#44, Iowa
Gun deaths per 100,000: 5.3
Permissive gun laws: 38th out of 50

#45, New York
Gun deaths per 100,000: 5.1
Permissive gun laws: 43rd out of 50

#46, New Jersey
Gun deaths per 100,000: 5.2
Permissive gun laws: 49th out of 50

#47, Connecticut
Gun deaths per 100,000: 4.3
Permissive gun laws: 46th out of 50

#48, Rhode Island
Gun deaths per 100,000: 3.5
Permissive gun laws: 42nd out of 50

#49, Massachusetts
Gun deaths per 100,000: 3.6
Permissive gun laws: 48th out of 50

#50, Hawaii
Gun deaths per 100,000: 2.8
Permissive gun laws: 47th out of 50

305 palomino  Apr 20, 2014 10:07:22am

re: #295 Mattand

I’m sure if Obama were from Des Moines, we’d be hearing about the out-of-control gun violence there.

Oh, but he’s “pretty sure” that Chicago has the highest murder rate in the US.

And he’s right. Except for the 12 cities that rank ahead of it.

306 Fairly Sure I'm Still Obdicut  Apr 20, 2014 10:09:01am

re: #305 palomino

Oh, but he’s “pretty sure” that Chicago has the highest murder rate in the US.

And he’s right. Except for the 12 cities that rank ahead of it.

And then Satt using the raw numbers rather than per-capita is a classic way of misrepresenting statistics. I talked about that like a month ago.

I really really will do another statistics post today, that’s a good jumping off point for another examination of how people lie about statistics, and how people going off their gut and impressions from the media, like Killgore, are almost always wrong.

307 palomino  Apr 20, 2014 10:09:26am

re: #297 Killgore Trout

Interesting, I thought NY was a bit lower down on the list but it’s still not bad if you break it down per capita. I’m also Surprised to see Dallas beating Washington.

Why? Dallas has over twice as many people as DC.

Or is your erroneous assumption based on something else?

308 Political Atheist  Apr 20, 2014 10:10:11am

Perhaps we should review the gun death stats that were not in human hands at the time. The re read the FBI Gang Threat assessment.

The best start to reducing violence (guns or not) is start by getting after the most violent people, particularly those violent people who use guns.

309 sattv4u2  Apr 20, 2014 10:15:04am

re: #302 Fairly Sure I’m Still Obdicut

But only when there are a lot of guns around.

Nahh

You don’t need “a lot of guns around” to do a lot of killings

I’d wager that out of the 7 Dead, 24 Wounded in Weekend Chicago Violence wasn’t caused by “a lot of guns around”.

310 Fairly Sure I'm Still Obdicut  Apr 20, 2014 10:15:11am

re: #308 Political Atheist

The best start to reducing violence (guns or not) is start by getting after the most violent people, particularly those violent people who use guns.

It’s really not. If you lock up those people, they will be replaced by other people. You have to look at why those gangs exist in the first place. It is not because of an evil conspiracy of gang members, it is for actual structural sociological reasons. If gangs are the problem, the solution is not arresting gang members: if you do, they will simply be replaced.

311 sattv4u2  Apr 20, 2014 10:18:36am

Ah well

Time to prep the ham and taters

312 palomino  Apr 20, 2014 10:18:38am

re: #304 blueraven

Weird. The 12 states with the lowest gun homicide rates all have strict state gun laws. Hmmm?

313 sattv4u2  Apr 20, 2014 10:22:23am

...

314 Political Atheist  Apr 20, 2014 10:23:03am

re: #310 Fairly Sure I’m Still Obdicut

It’s really not. If you lock up those people, they will be replaced by other people. You have to look at why those gangs exist in the first place. It is not because of an evil conspiracy of gang members, it is for actual structural sociological reasons. If gangs are the problem, the solution is not arresting gang members: if you do, they will simply be replaced.

I don’t agree. You are minimizing the reason we have law enforcement. Put the violent away. keep them away. A couple killers out with GPS monitors just killed a few women in Orange County. Those women would likely be alive if those killers had remained behind bars. No immediate word if they used guns or not.

315 sattv4u2  Apr 20, 2014 10:23:55am

re: #308 Political Atheist

Perhaps we should review the gun death stats that were not in human hands at the time. The re read the FBI Gang Threat assessment.

The best start to reducing violence (guns or not) is start by getting after the most violent people, particularly those violent people who use guns.

Gun murders per 100,000 persons 10-19 years of age:

1. New Orleans…………………………………………………….25.6

2. Kansas City………………………………………………………11.3

3. Memphis………………………………………………………….10.7

4. St. Louis…………………………………………………………..10.6

5. San Francisco…………………………………………………….9.9

6. Detroit………………………………………………………………..9.5

7. Chicago……………………………………………………………..7.9

8. Philadelphia………………………………………………………..7.5

9. Jacksonville………………………………………………………..7.1

10. Los Angeles……………………………………………………..6.7

(3rd times a charm)

316 Political Atheist  Apr 20, 2014 10:24:24am

Let’s please back up a bit. I logged in this morning to read through and express some Easter greetings.

In that spirit let’s take it easy on one another as we disagree.

317 Fairly Sure I'm Still Obdicut  Apr 20, 2014 10:24:55am

re: #314 Political Atheist

I don’t agree. You are minimizing the reason we have law enforcement. Put the violent away. keep them away.

This is so simplistic it’s hard to take seriously. How did the violent get to be ‘the violent’? If you don’t remove the conditions that create a violent underclass, how on earth do you think this is a solution?

A couple killers out with GPS monitors just killed a few women in Orange County. Those women would likely be alive if those killers had remained behind bars. No immediate word if they used guns or not.

What on earth does this have to do with whether you can eradicate gangs by arresting people in the gangs?

Do you understand why people join gangs in the first place?

318 palomino  Apr 20, 2014 10:25:33am

re: #308 Political Atheist

Perhaps we should review the gun death stats that were not in human hands at the time. The re read the FBI Gang Threat assessment.

The best start to reducing violence (guns or not) is start by getting after the most violent people, particularly those violent people who use guns.

We’ve already got the world’s highest incarceration rate. At a certain point we should probably pursue something IN ADDITION to just locking people away for life and throwing out the key.

319 Fairly Sure I'm Still Obdicut  Apr 20, 2014 10:26:05am

re: #315 sattv4u2

Thank you for providing yet another weird way people misrepresent statistics.

10-19 years of age:

320 sattv4u2  Apr 20, 2014 10:27:06am

re: #319 Fairly Sure I’m Still Obdicut

Thank you for providing yet another weird way people misrepresent statistics.

You’re welcome

And for the record, I didn’t “provide” them

The CDC did

321 sattv4u2  Apr 20, 2014 10:27:21am

Kitchen time!!

322 Stanley Sea  Apr 20, 2014 10:28:36am
323 palomino  Apr 20, 2014 10:28:45am

re: #319 Fairly Sure I’m Still Obdicut

Thank you for providing yet another weird way people misrepresent statistics.

Apparently the 3rd time still wasn’t the “charm” he thought it was.

And Chicago still has a lot of cities in front of it. But, since Obama never lived in those cities, they don’t count.

324 Political Atheist  Apr 20, 2014 10:30:23am

re: #317 Fairly Sure I’m Still Obdicut

This is so simplistic it’s hard to take seriously. How did the violent get to be ‘the violent’? If you don’t remove the conditions that create a violent underclass, how on earth do you think this is a solution?

What on earth does this have to do with whether you can eradicate gangs by arresting people in the gangs?

Do you understand why people join gangs in the first place?

Perhaps you confuse my brevity with simplicity. From that perspective it’s not at all hard to take seriously.

I’d love to see very broad & long term efforts to deal with that complex issue. But not as a distraction from how to reduce gang violence today by way of understanding from the FBI stats where a huge chunk of the problem resides.

325 Fairly Sure I'm Still Obdicut  Apr 20, 2014 10:34:18am

re: #324 Political Atheist

Perhaps you confuse my brevity with simplicity. From that perspective it’s not at all hard to take seriously.

I’d love to see very broad & long term efforts to deal with that complex issue. But not as a distraction from how to reduce gang violence today by way of understanding from the FBI stats where a huge chunk of the problem resides.

Where does ‘a huge chunk of the problem’ reside?

And am I to understand that what you’re saying is that you’re not actually proposing that ‘lock up the violent’ would be a long-terms solution, that you’re acknowledging it would be short-term and fail in the long run?

326 Political Atheist  Apr 20, 2014 10:35:59am

Obdi, how proper a use of statistics is palomino making with re: #312 palomino

Weird. The 12 states with the lowest gun homicide rates all have strict state gun laws. Hmmm?

I’m thinking it’s not really that simple.

327 Killgore Trout  Apr 20, 2014 10:36:51am

re: #324 Political Atheist

Perhaps you confuse my brevity with simplicity. From that perspective it’s not at all hard to take seriously.

I’d love to see very broad & long term efforts to deal with that complex issue. But not as a distraction from how to reduce gang violence today by way of understanding from the FBI stats where a huge chunk of the problem resides.

I also think it’s important to reduce the overall gun deaths. Per capita numbers are interesting but don’t address the full scope of the problem. Also the likely solutions are different. Reducing gun deaths in Alaska might involve more hunting safety issues while reducing gun deaths in Chicago might involve more crime and gang related issues.
It should be obvious but sadly the discourse has become so politicized it’s almost impossible to have a serious discussion.

328 Fairly Sure I'm Still Obdicut  Apr 20, 2014 10:39:45am

re: #326 Political Atheist

Obdi, how proper a use of statistics is palomino making with

I’m thinking it’s not really that simple.

It’s a true statement. It’s a correlation, which doesn’t necessarily imply causation. “Strict gun laws” is not a well-operationalized statement. But in general, you’d expect areas that have stricter gun control laws to have lower gun violence: this is something that’s statistically true worldwide, when controlled for other factors, so the correlation is a very commonly-occurring one.

329 Political Atheist  Apr 20, 2014 10:41:35am

re: #327 Killgore Trout

Somehow it also has become about who makes a point, rather than a points merit. That is unfortunate by way of blog dynamics.

Accidents are a tiny number as compared to criminal use. My point is start with the most violent that are armed. Seems a very practical approach, but seems fairly unwelcome. By a boat analogy, fix the big leak first. The little ones can wait a bit.

I think too many have decided already that gun controls are the only way to go. Well those folks need to review that Harvard law link William put up. Laws aimed at criminal use of guns need not reduce or eliminate my rights under the 2nd.

330 Fairly Sure I'm Still Obdicut  Apr 20, 2014 10:42:02am

re: #327 Killgore Trout

Per capita numbers are interesting but don’t address the full scope of the problem.

Per capita numbers are exactly about the scope of the problem. That’s what per capita defines.

Is there any subject you talk about where you’re actually knowledgable? You’ve been talking about Muslims on this blog for how many years, and you didn’t know that both Sunni and Shi’ite could be Sufi? Your mother is Ukrainian, but a few months ago you thought Ukrainians were Russian? Now you’re flailing around in statistics, where you very definitely know fuck-all.

Why not spend some of the immense amount of time you devote to posting CNN-style updates on actually learning shit? Learning shit is fun!

331 Fairly Sure I'm Still Obdicut  Apr 20, 2014 10:42:24am

re: #329 Political Atheist

I don’t think gun control is ‘the way to go’.

332 Lidane  Apr 20, 2014 10:43:33am

re: #303 Political Atheist

Just a slight oversimplification, no?

Of course it is. But we both know that there will never be any sort of serious examination of gun violence in this country, or any real effort to do anything about it. Every time someone even floats the idea, the gun fetishists squeal like stuck pigs and nothing happens.

I’ve given up any pretense of freaking out over gun violence anymore. It’s going to happen and we’re never going to take it seriously as a nation.

333 Fairly Sure I'm Still Obdicut  Apr 20, 2014 10:46:33am

re: #332 Lidane

The culture has to change long before the laws do. To change the culture, we need better education, especially better education about statistics so that people understand, for example, that crime has dropped precipitously in this country, and that owning a gun is not going to increase your safety in any significant way for most people, and will actually reduce it for a large number.

But beyond that, beyond the stupid problems of guys like Zimmerman, there’s the systemic problems of professional criminals, gangs, etc. Those problems aren’t fixed by a reduction in guns or gun control, or rather, gun control would at best make mainstream society safer, it wouldn’t fix the problems that drive people to join gangs in the first place. To address that, we need to address the systemic problems in our justice system and economic system.

334 Pie-onist Overlord  Apr 20, 2014 10:47:59am

re: #292 sattv4u2

I’m pretty sure Chicago is at the top of the list of gun violence in the US

Overall number of gun murders:

Here is how the nation’s metropolitan areas ranked for gun homicides in 2009-2010:

1. Los Angeles…………………..1,141

2. Chicago…………………………1,139

3. New York………………………..1,101

4. Philadelphia………………………729

5. Houston…………………………….701

6. Detroit……………………………….686

7. Miami…………………………………594

8. Dallas………………………………..469

9. Washington………………………..440

10. San Francisco………………….439

HURR HURR THEIR ALL DEMOCRATZ!!!!!!

335 Political Atheist  Apr 20, 2014 10:53:05am

re: #331 Fairly Sure I’m Still Obdicut

I don’t think gun control is ‘the way to go’.

Cool. One less, many, many to go.

Note to DC local lawmakers
Criminalizing to felony status harmless bits from guns shows us your continuing defiance & deliberate disrespect of our rights. Your belief that you know better than our justice system does.

When localities defy Supreme Court rulings they flirt with lawlessness themselves and show a very poor example of how to comply with laws you don’t like. or the removal of those you do like.

336 Fairly Sure I'm Still Obdicut  Apr 20, 2014 10:57:23am

re: #335 Political Atheist

Cool. One less, many, many to go.

Oh for fuck’s sake.

Gun control would be a positive thing, but the political resistance against it is far too strong for it to be a viable strategy, and those proposing it focus on long arms rather than on handguns, where it should be. It’d be great, awesome, if we could get incredibly strict gun control, but we can’t, because of the fetishization of gun culture and the lack of gun control proponents focusing on actually important shit like handguns. It’s too bad, but I completely accept that this is our political reality.

Now, do you understand why ‘locking up the violent ones’ is not going to work as a solution to gang violence, with or without the involvement of guns?

337 Political Atheist  Apr 20, 2014 11:11:34am

re: #336 Fairly Sure I’m Still Obdicut

Oh for fuck’s sake.

Gun control would be a positive thing, but the political resistance against it is far too strong for it to be a viable strategy, and those proposing it focus on long arms rather than on handguns, where it should be. It’d be great, awesome, if we could get incredibly strict gun control, but we can’t, because of the fetishization of gun culture. It’s too bad, but I completely accept that this is our political reality.

Now, do you understand why ‘locking up the violent ones’ is not going to work as a solution to gang violence, with or without the involvement of guns?

California defies your first point. we do have strict laws here, and in quantity. So does DC right? How would you define “incredibly strict gun control” and not violate the 2nd as defined by recent rulings?

I simply disagree with your premise that jailing the violent does not reduce violence on the street. Each of those people are where they can not possibly get a gun or commit mayhem outside the jail. Of course that’s not the best or a complete solution.

But think about trying to argue jail for the violent offender as a bad idea for public safety? I don’t see it. Jail is one part, an essential part to maintain public order and safety.

338 Fairly Sure I'm Still Obdicut  Apr 20, 2014 11:17:33am

re: #337 Political Atheist

California defies your first point. we do have strict laws here, and in quantity. So does DC right? How would you define “incredibly strict gun control” and not violate the 2nd as defined by recent rulings?

You keep consistently missing what I’m saying. I’m saying in my ideal world, we’d have very strict gun control laws. I’m not saying that we should do this now, or move towards it—in fact, I said the exact goddamn opposite.

I simply disagree with your premise that jailing the violent does not reduce violence on the street. Each of those people are where they can not possibly get a gun or commit mayhem outside the jail. Of course that’s not the best or a complete solution.

It doesn’t matter if you disagree with me, it matters if you can answer why you disagree. I am saying that if you lock up a violent gang member, then that creates a ‘job opening’ for another violent gang member. That guy served a purpose, a role, in the gang economy. Real-world observation shows us that when we arrest members of a gang, violence does not drop in an area, and indeed that those roles simply get filled, either from the local population or from an external gang moving in.

But think about trying to argue jail for the violent offender as a bad idea for public safety? I don’t see it. Jail is one part, an essential part to maintain public order and safety.

Good thing you just made that up and I didn’t do that, then. Seriously, what the fuck, dude? Why make up shit like this?

339 palomino  Apr 20, 2014 11:17:53am

re: #326 Political Atheist

Obdi, how proper a use of statistics is palomino making with

I’m thinking it’s not really that simple.

I didn’t say anything was simple.

I merely noticed that the states with the lowest murder rates all have strict gun laws, something the NRA/TPGOP ignores entirely as they repeat their slogans about the alleged futility of gun laws and the 2nd Amendment’s paramount importance.

And those states include big and small states, located in the northeast, midwest and west coast, so it’s not a purely regional dynamic. There just might be some correlation, but we’ll never hear that from the right since it would challenge their notion that only with more guns will we actually be more safe.

340 Fairly Sure I'm Still Obdicut  Apr 20, 2014 11:18:58am

re: #339 palomino

And those states include big and small states, located in the northeast, midwest and west coast, so it’s not a purely regional dynamic. There just might be some correlation, but we’ll never hear that from the right since it would challenge their notion that only with more guns will we actually be more safe.

Language correction. There is a correlation, there may be a causation.

341 palomino  Apr 20, 2014 11:23:24am

re: #340 Fairly Sure I’m Still Obdicut

Language correction. There is a correlation, there may be a causation.

Now you’re just resorting to logic and precise word definitions. Everyone knows those things are irrelevant.

342 Political Atheist  Apr 20, 2014 11:26:50am

re: #338 Fairly Sure I’m Still Obdicut

I’m saying in my ideal world, we’d have very strict gun control laws. I’m not saying that we should do this now, or move towards it—in fact, I said the exact goddamn opposite.

It doesn’t matter if you disagree with me, it matters if you can answer why you disagree. I am saying that if you lock up a violent gang member, then that creates a ‘job opening’ for another violent gang member. That guy served a purpose, a role, in the gang economy. Real-world observation shows us that when we arrest members of a gang, violence does not drop in an area, and indeed that those roles simply get filled, either from the local population or from an external gang moving in.

Good thing you just made that up and I didn’t do that, then. Seriously, what the fuck, dude? Why make up shit like this?

“In your ideal word”. Does that world have a 2nd amendment?

What I did was turn over your coin, that is to say your statement is locking them up won’t help. okay, by that logic, don’t lock them up. Waste of resources then. But then that young kid comes up and then you have the older and the younger killers in action. The gang economy does not lay off or hiring freeze to cut excess labor.

I disagree for reasons I gave. Gang violence can be reduced by good law enforcement. I followed your logic. Did you really mean it won’t solve the problem rather than it won’t help at all? I could see that. I would wholeheartedly agree. Each aspect plays it’s part. Economy, density, police actions or priorities…

343 Political Atheist  Apr 20, 2014 11:27:53am

re: #341 palomino

Now you’re just resorting to logic and precise word definitions. Everyone knows those things are irrelevant.

Who here said that?

344 Political Atheist  Apr 20, 2014 11:34:19am

re: #339 palomino

I didn’t say anything was simple.

I merely noticed that the states with the lowest murder rates all have strict gun laws, something the NRA/TPGOP ignores entirely as they repeat their slogans about the alleged futility of gun laws and the 2nd Amendment’s paramount importance.

And those states include big and small states, located in the northeast, midwest and west coast, so it’s not a purely regional dynamic. There just might be some correlation, but we’ll never hear that from the right since it would challenge their notion that only with more guns will we actually be more safe.

Please keep in mind I don’t speak in support of those kinds of points made by the NRA etc. To the degree they might or might not overlap with the points i make is not my problem. They are dead to me.

Do you have a link to a study or two that took in economics, density, gun laws, gang prevalence etc ? I’d really like to read it.

345 Fairly Sure I'm Still Obdicut  Apr 20, 2014 11:37:02am

re: #342 Political Atheist

“In your ideal word”. Does that world have a 2nd amendment?

No. Why would it?

What I did was turn over your coin, that is to say your statement is locking them up won’t help. okay, by that logic, don’t lock them up. Waste of resources then. But then that young kid comes up and then you have the older and the younger killers in action. The gang economy does not lay off or hiring freeze to cut excess labor.

I said locking them up won’t solve the problem long-term. You didn’t ‘turn the coin’, you made up something I didn’t say. This is something you often do, it is shitty of you, and you should really stop doing it. This marks the umpteenth time I’ve typed this out to you.

And actually, yes, gangs do have ‘hiring freezes’ when there aren’t enough jobs. I don’t know why you think otherwise; gangs operate under the same economic conditions that govern any economic activity.

I disagree for reasons I gave. Gang violence can be reduced by good law enforcement

This is an assertion, without even an attempt at any sort of proof or evidence to it. It is not an argument. It is just saying ‘nuh-uh’. The amount of effect law enforcement can have on gang activity is very small, because gang members are not joining gangs and engaging in those activities because they’re forgoing abundant other opportunities, but in general because those are the opportunities open to them. All law enforcement can do is imprison them, but they’re already choosing a lifestyle that can wind up with them murdered on a daily basis. The economic and sociological conditions that produce gang culture aren’t going to be affected because you arrest a percentage of the gang population, and i have no idea why you think it will. Law enforcement can have, at best, a very temporary effect on gang violence.

Did you really mean it won’t solve the problem rather than it won’t help at all? I could see that. I would wholeheartedly agree. Each aspect plays it’s part. Economy, density, police actions or priorities…

What causes gangs to exist, what causes criminal activity, is a systemic problem that is not ‘helped’ by locking up individual criminals. This would only be true if those criminals were the only ones that could fill those roles, but the truth is that when you lock them up, they are replaced by others stepping into those roles. This is observably true. Are you arguing that this is not the case?

346 Political Atheist  Apr 20, 2014 11:42:43am

re: #345 Fairly Sure I’m Still Obdicut

No. Why would it?

I said locking them up won’t solve the problem long-term. You didn’t ‘turn the coin’, you made up something I didn’t say. This is something you often do, it is shitty of you, and you should really stop doing it. This marks the umpteenth time I’ve typed this out to you.

And actually, yes, gangs do have ‘hiring freezes’ when there aren’t enough jobs. I don’t know why you think otherwise; gangs operate under the same economic conditions that govern any economic activity.

This is an assertion, without even an attempt at any sort of proof or evidence to it. It is not an argument. It is just saying ‘nuh-uh’. The amount of effect law enforcement can have on gang activity is very small, because gang members are not joining gangs and engaging in those activities because they’re forgoing abundant other opportunities, but in general because those are the opportunities open to them. All law enforcement can do is imprison them, but they’re already choosing a lifestyle that can wind up with them murdered on a daily basis. The economic and sociological conditions that produce gang culture aren’t going to be affected because you arrest a percentage of the gang population, and i have no idea why you think it will. Law enforcement can have, at best, a very temporary effect on gang violence.

What causes gangs to exist, what causes criminal activity, is a systemic problem that is not ‘helped’ by locking up individual criminals. This would only be true if those criminals were the only ones that could fill those roles, but the truth is that when you lock them up, they are replaced by others stepping into those roles. This is observably true. Are you arguing that this is not the case?

I deny making anything up at all. And I continue to maintain jailing violent gang members has a net public safety benefit. Law enforcement makes this argument well, and i agree with the professionals doing the job in this instance.

Anyway now that I’m falsely accused of making things up I will be on with my day. Plenty to do and an afternoon to take in. ‘Till next time then.

347 Fairly Sure I'm Still Obdicut  Apr 20, 2014 11:44:26am

re: #346 Political Atheist

I deny making anything up at all.

But you did. you claimed that I was “trying to argue jail for the violent offender as a bad idea for public safety”. I wasn’t. This is something you made up. You shouldn’t have done it. You should at least acknowledge you did it. It’s disappointing that you don’t. I also bolded something above that I never claimed, that ‘it won’t help at all’. So this isn’t just a one-off, this is a pattern with you.

And I continue to maintain jailing violent gang members has a net public safety benefit. Law enforcement makes this argument well, and i agree with the professionals doing the job in this instance.

You are not even engaging with my argument in the least at this point. You might as well go on your way.

348 RealityBasedSteve  Apr 20, 2014 2:48:40pm

re: #236 FemNaziBitch

[Embedded content]

NO!!! Because well…Sex ICKY????

RBS


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