Video: AP Executive Editor Refuses to Delete Deceptive Tweet About Clinton Foundation

Maddening media malfeasance
Media • Views: 49,913

Media Matters

The Associated Press has been coming for some justifiable criticism over their distorted reporting on the Clinton Foundation, and one of the most egregious examples was this tweet:

This headline is simply wrong, because it’s describing people who met with Clinton specifically to talk about the Clinton Foundation, not about all of the people who had meetings with Clinton. It’s wrong, period. And Donald Trump used it to viciously, dishonestly attack Hillary Clinton, of course.

So why is it still posted on Twitter?

Here’s AP executive editor Kathleen Carroll saying the tweet was “clumsy” and “sloppy,” but refusing to delete it.

BRIAN STELTER (HOST): Now the story was scrutinized, but this tweet was especially scrutinized. Really widely criticized. It said: “Breaking, AP analysis: More than half of those who met Clinton as Cabinet secretary gave money to Clinton Foundation.” There’s no link to a story there. And the tweet, I would say, is inaccurate. The Clinton campaign and several other media outlets have scrutinized the tweet, they’ve said it was wrong, and then there’s wider questions about why the AP published the story at all. They conducted a long investigation, did they just want to show they had done the work? Did they just want to show that they had found something, even if it didn’t amount to much?

[..]

STELTER: Really one of the things that was scrutinized the most was that tweet, let’s put it back on screen if we can. It suggested that half of the people Clinton met, overall during her State Department time were donors to the Clinton Foundation. Would you agree that tweet was inaccurate?

KATHLEEN CARROLL, EXECUTIVE EDITOR, ASSOCIATED PRESS: I would say that we’re a lot better at breaking stories and covering news and gathering video and taking photographs than we are on tweets on some day and this one could have used some more precision.

STELTER: Does that mean regret?

CARROLL: No. If we felt it was wrong we would have taken it down right away.

STELTER: But it was wrong. It says that half of the people she met with were donors.

CARROLL: Yeah. I think it was sloppy.

STELTER: Sloppy?

CARROLL: Yeah.

STELTER: Why not delete it? Why not take it down and correct it?

CARROLL: Well, you know maybe going forward we would need to work more on our precision on the tweets.

This is just part of a wider pattern of incredibly bad media coverage of this election, in which the “both sides do it” nonsense has become a non-stop media mantra — even with a Republican candidate who is a blatant racist and conspiracy theorist.

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182 comments

1
nines09  Aug 28, 2016 • 1:24:21pm

Food for the goldfish. Journalism. Where did they hide the body?

2
jaunte  Aug 28, 2016 • 1:28:45pm

She thinks the important aspect of conflict of interest is not whether there is an actual quid-pro-quo, but the “impression that people have.”
Good grief.

3
petesh  Aug 28, 2016 • 1:29:24pm

re: #1 nines09

Food for the goldfish. Journalism. Where did they hide the body?

Who wants to know?

4
lawhawk  Aug 28, 2016 • 1:29:56pm

Trump inspires bigots, white supremacists, racists and anti-Semites.
Clinton calls Trump out for his dog whistling and overt statements of bigotry.

Media: BOTH SIDES!

The media is complicit in trying to horse race this campaign season. But we’ve been seeing this for ages now.

Media complains about how Clinton doesn’t give press conferences. Like the media would do anything except ask - how come everyone hates you or thinks you’re shady or evasive. Or asks about what she’s wearing or that her medical condition is under a cloud of questions because “some” have raised suspicions.

They’ll ignore that Trump doesn’t answer questions, only sputtering platitudes. They’ll ignore that Trump gives speeches directed to minorities in front of crowds that are overwhelmingly white. Trump’s going to do another one of those speeches this week, as though it’ll be any different.

5
Timothy Watson  Aug 28, 2016 • 1:33:31pm

re: #4 lawhawk

Has Trump ever held a press conference?

6
jaunte  Aug 28, 2016 • 1:37:24pm

She first says the important aspect of conflict of interest is not whether there is an actual quid-pro-quo, but the “impression that people have.”

Then at 6:11 “…but y’ know all of us cannot be held responsible for how everybody thinks about and responds to and talks about the coverage…”

7
lawhawk  Aug 28, 2016 • 1:40:28pm

First major hurricane of the 2016 season. It’ll churn up the Atlantic something fierce, but doesn’t appear to be a threat to the continental US. More concerning is the low pressure system over Cuba right now - Invest 99L, which could turn into a tropical system once it clears Cuba and heads into open warm waters of the Gulf.

8
wrenchwench  Aug 28, 2016 • 1:42:53pm
CARROLL: Well, you know maybe going forward we would need to work more on our precision on the tweets.

And maybe going forward you should get a job sweeping up after parades.

9
PhillyPretzel  Aug 28, 2016 • 1:45:31pm

re: #7 lawhawk

This is what the local NWS has on Gaston and the developing storms.
weather.gov

10
lawhawk  Aug 28, 2016 • 1:45:38pm

Trump’s been doing these dog whistles since day 1. He’s only getting more bold by the day, and his bigot brigade gets more brazen. But remember, if you’re pointing this out, it must mean you’re the bigot and both sides.

11
nines09  Aug 28, 2016 • 1:46:50pm

re: #3 petesh

Who wants to know?

I’ve thought for quite a while that true journalism was double tapped, jammed into the trunk of a car, and has never been found, reported, or verified. No body. No evidence. When I see Ace Reporting articles like this, I think my conviction is valid. And I see a lot of this. Just tune in Chuck Todd. or CNN, or as I like to call them, THIS JUST IN….That is supposed to be the foil to Fox. Yeah. Right. AP? That legacy is fading fast.
Pathetic, and no excuse can hide that.

12
Interesting Times  Aug 28, 2016 • 1:52:42pm

This article is over a year old, but if anything, it’s only become more relevant:

Confessions of a Clinton reporter: The media’s 5 unspoken rules for covering Hillary

Strongly recommend reading the whole thing, but to sum up, here are the rules:

1) Everything, no matter how ludicrous-sounding, is worthy of a full investigation by federal agencies, Congress, the “vast right-wing conspiracy,” and mainstream media outlets

2) Every allegation, no matter how ludicrous, is believable until it can be proven completely and utterly false. And even then, it keeps a life of its own in the conservative media world.

3) The media assumes that Clinton is acting in bad faith until there’s hard evidence otherwise.

4) Everything is newsworthy because the Clintons are the equivalent of America’s royal family

5) Everything she does is fake and calculated for maximum political benefit

Congrats, AP, on checking all the boxes /

13
Schweppes7  Aug 28, 2016 • 2:00:32pm

I just do not understand why they won’t delete the obviously false tweet. They know it is not true, is highly misleading, and that some people will read it and accept it as fact without bothering to click through and see that the article disproves the headline (even though the article itself is also highly misleading). There should not be a reduced standard for accuracy on social media. It disgusts me that AP is willing to sacrifice their journalistic integrity for the sake of click bait bullshit.

14
ObserverArt  Aug 28, 2016 • 2:01:04pm

I’m busy doing some scans and I see Sergey/Nyet is calling me out and posted this toward the end of the last thread.

Which exactly means you accused them of falsifying the speech. It’s weird that you deny and confirm this in one paragraph.
Since she did call him a bigot - it’s there in black and white, as quoted above - and you are now denying this plain fact, you really have no standing to call “the media” out for anything.

Whatever Sergey…see it anyway you want. I don’t care. I have no standing.

This is a discussion board. I didn’t enter the classroom of Professor Sergey Romanov. I’m not trying to get a diploma from your school of Highly Advanced Semantics.

I stated a simple opinion. I have no problem you didn’t like it. But how about some perspective? Sometimes you take stuff to the nth degree and for what? Is it to show superiority? Well, you got me there. You are superior to me.

What is your reward? What is my punishment? You will no longer take anything I say seriously. How can I go on? Someone is wrong on the internet!

But you will never see anyone produce a video where Hillary called Trump a bigot directly IN THOSE WORDS.

And there are videos and tweets and articles of Trump calling Hillary a bigot…IN THOSE WORDS.

There is the difference if you want to see it and admit it.

See you all later. I’m going to go beat myself and finish the scans. And enjoy my own thoughts no matter how wrong they are. You know, keep ‘em to myself.

I am the one who was wrong on the internet!

15
Eclectic Cyborg  Aug 28, 2016 • 2:02:18pm

re: #7 lawhawk

[Embedded content]

[Embedded content]

First major hurricane of the 2016 season. It’ll churn up the Atlantic something fierce, but doesn’t appear to be a threat to the continental US. More concerning is the low pressure system over Cuba right now - Invest 99L, which could turn into a tropical system once it clears Cuba and heads into open warm waters of the Gulf.

I live in the hurricane zone on the Gulf Coast. Typically these storms only mean serious business if they get past Category 1. Tropical depressions and Tropical storms are seldom more than extended wind and rain. I remember when Isaac came through a couple of years ago as a Cat 1, it wasn’t much of anything.

At this point, being just an invest, it’s not a big risk.

The major problem this year is that Louisiana has already been deluged and a tropical storm or hurricane on top of that would just add to the misery.

16
vgranucci  Aug 28, 2016 • 2:02:59pm

re: #2 jaunte

She thinks the important aspect of conflict of interest is not whether there is an actual quid-pro-quo, but the “impression that people have.”
Good grief.

And does everything possible to provide that impression.

17
Eclectic Cyborg  Aug 28, 2016 • 2:03:36pm

IF Trump gets elected he needs to send “Thank You” Baskets to most of the so-called “mainstream media”.

18
TedStriker  Aug 28, 2016 • 2:04:39pm

re: #13 Schweppes7

I just do not understand why they won’t delete the obviously false tweet. They know it is not true, is highly misleading, and that some people will read it and accept it as fact without bothering to click through and see that the article disproves the headline (even though the article itself is also highly misleading). There should not be a reduced standard for accuracy on social media. REGXFERX

Ever since news departments were absorbed into the entertainment arms of their respective outlets, integrity and truth hasn’t been enough to pay the bills.

19
petesh  Aug 28, 2016 • 2:09:59pm

re: #11 nines09

My original “who wants to know?” was admittedly frivolous, but (as Trumpy would say) not all that frivolous, believe me. Even though I am not a babe in the woods, the reporting on Clinton’s big-reveal speech about Trump’s bigotry has, shall we say politely, disappointed me. They managed to turn even that into a Both Sides Do It?! There are exceptions, and the best headline I saw came from (believe it or not) even-the-liberal Jon Chait:

Trump: Only Desperate Liars Call Their Opponent Racist. Also Hillary Is Racist.

Otherwise, it’s all “We’ll tell you what our bosses want you to know, whether it’s accurate or not.” OK, not all. But. Grrr.

20
(alpuz)  Aug 28, 2016 • 2:11:48pm

re: #14 ObserverArt

Dude, let it go.

21
Shiplord Kirel  Aug 28, 2016 • 2:12:18pm

New in pages:
Drug Users Aren’t Human, Says Philippines’ Duterte
Vigilantes and rogue police have killed 2000 people just since Duterte’s election in May.
Is this a template for an RWNJ uprising in this country, with either President Trump inciting crazed ammosexuals to do his dirty work or sore loser Trump and his fascist media refusing to accept the verdict of the people?

22
Nyet  Aug 28, 2016 • 2:15:55pm

re: #14 ObserverArt

Nice moving of goalposts. There was no “in those words” in the comment I was responding to.
She called him a bigot, period. She did not use the noun “bigot”, however she did mention “his bigotry”, which can be factually summarized as her calling him a bigot, just as me saying “Trump’s antisemitism is terrible” can be factually summarized as me calling Trump an antisemite. It is extremely ridiculous to split hairs about this just to save your little narrative.

23
Stanley Sea  Aug 28, 2016 • 2:19:10pm

Y’ALL

24
Charles Johnson  Aug 28, 2016 • 2:20:52pm
25
Backwoods_Sleuth  Aug 28, 2016 • 2:21:37pm
26
BlueGrl21  Aug 28, 2016 • 2:21:44pm

My pet Conservative Republicans have started coming to me when stories come out about the Clintons and asking me to explain the issue. They will send me some right-wing article and ask me for the facts. I am scrupulously honest, positive or negative, and they know that. I give them the facts and they can make up their minds from there.

This Clinton Foundation red herring has been good for a LOT of explanation and patience on my part with them. I am proud to say none of them are Trump voters but damn they make me tired sometimes.

Thanks for nothing, AP. I get tired of doing your job as a civilian.

27
Joe Bacon  Aug 28, 2016 • 2:22:33pm

re: #17 Eclectic Cyborg

IF Trump gets elected he needs to send “Thank You” Baskets to most of the so-called “mainstream media”.

Yes and those stenographers will have their hearts set on a box of Royal Riviera Pears from Harry & David.

Instead, they will just wind up with a box of Trump Steaks! 😈

28
Nyet  Aug 28, 2016 • 2:23:15pm

re: #23 Stanley Sea

Yo! ;)

29
The Vicious Babushka  Aug 28, 2016 • 2:25:57pm

Here is a Rich Person who is even more insufferable than Eric & Donny Jr.

30
Stanley Sea  Aug 28, 2016 • 2:32:57pm

re: #29 The Vicious Babushka

I just read that.

Oh my.

31
Eclectic Cyborg  Aug 28, 2016 • 2:33:51pm

re: #29 The Vicious Babushka

Meanwhile here’s my dumb ass actually enjoying the independence that comes with doing things for myself.

:P

32
PhillyPretzel  Aug 28, 2016 • 2:36:55pm

re: #29 The Vicious Babushka

re: #30 Stanley Sea

re: #31 Eclectic Cyborg

amazon.com

And this is how some other people handle fame and fortune.

33
wrenchwench  Aug 28, 2016 • 2:43:18pm

re: #14 ObserverArt

I didn’t enter the classroom of Professor Sergey Romanov.

I guess I should start including the location with my ‘Welcome, hatchling’ s

/?

34
BigPapa  Aug 28, 2016 • 2:47:47pm

re: #33 wrenchwench

I guess I should start including the location with my ‘Welcome, hatchling’ s

this.is.SPARTA!

35
The Dude Abides  Aug 28, 2016 • 2:52:44pm

re: #30 Stanley Sea

If that’s the worst of it, Getty is pretty harmless. Some rich people use their money to perpetuate the socioeconomic class divide.

36
Nyet  Aug 28, 2016 • 2:56:33pm

re: #34 BigPapa

Abandon all hope, ye who enter here.

37
PhillyPretzel  Aug 28, 2016 • 3:02:59pm

re: #36 Nyet

Dante Alighieri’s Divine Comedy: Inferno

38
Eclectic Cyborg  Aug 28, 2016 • 3:07:17pm

I don’t fancy myself much of a nature photographer but damn if I didn’t get a good shot of this bug sitting on my car the other day.

39
Stanley Sea  Aug 28, 2016 • 3:10:08pm
40
Ming5000  Aug 28, 2016 • 3:10:36pm

Apparently Ann Coulter drew a lot of heat on the Robe Lowe CC Celebrity Roast.
Hollywood Reporter

“I’m not the only athlete up here. As you know earlier this year, Ann Coulter won the Kentucky Derby,” Peyton Manning quipped.

41
Backwoods_Sleuth  Aug 28, 2016 • 3:12:58pm

I’m sure Trump will be offering a significant discount on the venue rent…
bwahahahaaaa…jk…

42
Eclectic Cyborg  Aug 28, 2016 • 3:13:05pm

re: #40 Ming5000

Ms. Coulter had to have known that was bound to happen. At least I certainly hope she did.

43
Eclectic Cyborg  Aug 28, 2016 • 3:14:06pm

What’s the over/under on Trump either snapping at Hillary to shut up or saying something really misogynistic at the debates?

44
sagehen  Aug 28, 2016 • 3:15:30pm

re: #10 lawhawk

[Embedded content]

[Embedded content]

Trump’s been doing these dog whistles since day 1. He’s only getting more bold by the day, and his bigot brigade gets more brazen. But remember, if you’re pointing this out, it must mean you’re the bigot and both sides.

If Trump had any actual interest in speaking to actual real live Black voters… might I point out that he can see Harlem out his window, it’s the other end of the park. And he drives right past Abyssinian Baptist Church on his way to or from the airport, every time he ever goes anywhere.

45
wrenchwench  Aug 28, 2016 • 3:18:07pm

re: #43 Eclectic Cyborg

What’s the over/under on Trump either snapping at Hillary to shut up or saying something really misogynistic at the debates?

This is Giuliani, pretty much saying it’s guaranteed:

“The real risk is when a guy tries to be something other than what he is.”

46
Nyet  Aug 28, 2016 • 3:18:09pm

re: #38 Eclectic Cyborg

It’s not a bug, it’s a feature!

47
Ming5000  Aug 28, 2016 • 3:18:27pm

re: #41 Backwoods_Sleuth

I was going to LOL at his weekend retreat being named “Bedminster”, like his Florida home is named Mar Largo or something. But Bedminster is a town in NJ.
I am disappoint.
I was going to name my condo estate “Lounge-atee”

48
Nyet  Aug 28, 2016 • 3:21:15pm

re: #40 Ming5000

I sorta cringed at some of those jokes, but if anyone deserves them, it’s Coulter.

49
Eclectic Cyborg  Aug 28, 2016 • 3:22:28pm

Something else interesting I saw on my recent trip to Canada. In some of the Supermarkets they have a “soft” limit on certain items.

For example, a pack of a certain baked good I was buying cost $4.99, but if I bought more than 3, The price would go up to $5.39. Meaning if I bought 6 I’d get the first 3 at $4.99 and the next 3 at $5.39.

I am not entirely sure what the rationale is behind this. My guess is its either a subtle way to get people to eat healthier (most of the limited products were junk food) or a way to ensure that customers don’t hoard any one item so no one else can get their hands on it.

50
calochortus  Aug 28, 2016 • 3:24:42pm

re: #48 Nyet

Is sorta cringed at some of those jokes, but if anyone deserves them, it’s Coulter.

I cringed at almost all the ones I read. I realize it’s giving Coulter just what she has been dishing out, but I am never amused by cruelty regardless of the target.

51
PhillyPretzel  Aug 28, 2016 • 3:24:43pm

re: #49 Eclectic Cyborg

It might be a way to suggest healthier options.

52
The Very Reverend Battleaxe of Knowledge  Aug 28, 2016 • 3:24:43pm

re: #49 Eclectic Cyborg

Something else interesting I saw on my recent trip to Canada. In some of the Supermarkets they have a “soft” limit on certain items.

For example, a pack of a certain baked good I was buying cost $4.99, but if I bought more than 3, The price would go up to $5.39. Meaning if I bought 6 I’d get the first 3 at $4.99 and the next 3 at $5.39.

I am not entirely sure what the rationale is behind this. My guess is its either a subtle way to get people to eat healthier (most of the limited products were junk food) or a way to ensure that customers don’t hoard any one item so no one else can get their hands on it.

Sounds like a coupon deal without going to the trouble of printing a coupon.

53
Ming5000  Aug 28, 2016 • 3:25:43pm

re: #48 Nyet

Those things can be brutal. I have a brad time watching them.

54
calochortus  Aug 28, 2016 • 3:25:54pm

re: #49 Eclectic Cyborg

Something else interesting I saw on my recent trip to Canada. In some of the Supermarkets they have a “soft” limit on certain items.

For example, a pack of a certain baked good I was buying cost $4.99, but if I bought more than 3, The price would go up to $5.39. Meaning if I bought 6 I’d get the first 3 at $4.99 and the next 3 at $5.39.

I am not entirely sure what the rationale is behind this. My guess is its either a subtle way to get people to eat healthier (most of the limited products were junk food) or a way to ensure that customers don’t hoard any one item so no one else can get their hands on it.

Might also be a way to get people to buy 3 rather than 1 or 2. “This is so good we have to strictly limit it to more than you’d buy normally.”

55
Nyet  Aug 28, 2016 • 3:26:24pm

re: #50 calochortus

It was more, the “looks” jokes are a dangerous territory. Of course it’s Coulter, who judges everyone, so I guess it’s fair.

56
wrenchwench  Aug 28, 2016 • 3:26:37pm

re: #49 Eclectic Cyborg

Something else interesting I saw on my recent trip to Canada. In some of the Supermarkets they have a “soft” limit on certain items.

For example, a pack of a certain baked good I was buying cost $4.99, but if I bought more than 3, The price would go up to $5.39. Meaning if I bought 6 I’d get the first 3 at $4.99 and the next 3 at $5.39.

I am not entirely sure what the rationale is behind this. My guess is its either a subtle way to get people to eat healthier (most of the limited products were junk food) or a way to ensure that customers don’t hoard any one item so no one else can get their hands on it.

Some places are pricing water that way. The first x-hundred gallons cost less than the next x-hundred gallons. Encourages conservation without costing too much to get any.

57
sagehen  Aug 28, 2016 • 3:27:20pm

re: #50 calochortus

I cringed at almost all the ones I read. I realize it’s giving Coulter just what she has been dishing out, but I am never amused by cruelty regardless of the target.

In fairness… it was a roast. Everyone knew it was a roast. She was looking forward to going to a roast. Every one of these jokes would be entirely inappropriate in any other setting, but c’mon, it’s a roast.

58
The Vicious Babushka  Aug 28, 2016 • 3:30:03pm

Trump totally did not Tweet this, it’s from one of his campaign staffers==>

59
BigPapa  Aug 28, 2016 • 3:33:02pm

re: #58 The Vicious Babushka

He didn’t tweet that? Sad!

60
calochortus  Aug 28, 2016 • 3:34:23pm

re: #57 sagehen

In fairness… it was a roast. Everyone knew it was a roast. She was looking forward to going to a roast. Every one of these jokes would be entirely inappropriate in any other setting, but c’mon, it’s a roast.

Seems to me roasts used have gentler humor-yes making fun of the honoree, but with affection. This? Not so much. I have no interest in either banning them or watching/attending them. Nor will I think less of those who enjoy them.

61
Interesting Times  Aug 28, 2016 • 3:36:04pm

Oooh…I never thought of this, but it goes miles toward explaining the MSM’s disgusting, noxious “herp derp, both sides” coverage of HRC’s alt-right speech:

(I would highly recommend following Sarah Kendzior and reading her previous tweets on this subject - you can find a succinct collection thereof in this dKos comment)

62
BigPapa  Aug 28, 2016 • 3:38:46pm

re: #61 Interesting Times

Sarah is a good Follow.

63
Nyet  Aug 28, 2016 • 3:42:48pm
64
calochortus  Aug 28, 2016 • 3:43:03pm

In local news, I have finally finished this year’s Pruning of the Hedge. It’s long, it’s tall, and it can’t just be sheared, I have to use a saw and clippers. But it is done. If only I didn’t have other shrubbery that needed hacking at-much of it on a rather steep hill.
But, Progress!

65
bratwurst  Aug 28, 2016 • 3:43:35pm

Everybody knows that “roasts” always feature nasty and cruel jokes. Furthermore, we have also learned that Comedy Central allows individuals to declare certain types of jokes “off limits”.

Coulter chose to get on that dais in order to promote her book. If she had no idea what she was in for, shame on her.

I give not a single fuck if she had her feelings hurt, sorry.

66
wrenchwench  Aug 28, 2016 • 3:44:27pm

Mark Trahant is the Charles R. Johnson Endowed Professor of Journalism at the University of North Dakota. He is an independent journalist and a member of the Shoshone-Bannock Tribes. To read more of his regular #NativeVote16 updates, follow trahantreports.com On Facebook: TrahantReports On Twitter: @TrahantReports

67
Charles Johnson  Aug 28, 2016 • 3:45:04pm

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68
Nyet  Aug 28, 2016 • 3:45:37pm

re: #65 bratwurst

Coulter has feelings? That’s news! ;)

69
The Very Reverend Battleaxe of Knowledge  Aug 28, 2016 • 3:47:46pm
70
Nyet  Aug 28, 2016 • 3:49:04pm

re: #69 The Very Reverend Battleaxe of Knowledge

They should eat some, uh, distressed food.

71
Eclectic Cyborg  Aug 28, 2016 • 3:49:37pm

re: #69 The Very Reverend Battleaxe of Knowledge

Holy shit, that’s just…BAD.

It amazes me what some people would rather have than money.

72
BigPapa  Aug 28, 2016 • 3:51:17pm

re: #67 Charles Johnson

Who does his art? Lots going on there.

73
Dave In Austin  Aug 28, 2016 • 3:51:33pm
74
Nyet  Aug 28, 2016 • 3:53:14pm

re: #70 Nyet

gq.com

75
EmmaAnne  Aug 28, 2016 • 3:53:26pm

re: #22 Nyet

Nice moving of goalposts. There was no “in those words” in the comment I was responding to.
She called him a bigot, period. She did not use the noun “bigot”, however she did mention “his bigotry”, which can be factually summarized as her calling him a bigot, just as me saying “Trump’s antisemitism is terrible” can be factually summarized as me calling Trump an antisemite. It is extremely ridiculous to split hairs about this just to save your little narrative.

Had to downding this, because in my view it is wrong in an important way. Consider telling someone that what they just said is racist, rather than saying “you are a racist.” Big, big difference. To me this is the same, and it is putting a “both sides do it” where it definitely does not belong.

76
The Very Reverend Battleaxe of Knowledge  Aug 28, 2016 • 3:54:36pm

re: #69 The Very Reverend Battleaxe of Knowledge

Now I personally have never had any shoes last long enough for the uppers to need duct tape—my left big toe digs a hole through the sole in pretty short order. That’s why I wear zoris 99% of the time.

77
Decatur Deb  Aug 28, 2016 • 3:55:27pm

re: #74 Nyet

gq.com

The point is, while these sneakers come dirty, their sleek shape, top-quality leather, and vibrant (but tasteful) pop of red color mean you’ll come off as more nonchalant than unkempt.

I’m totally chalant and even occasionally kempt. And I’ll dirty my own fuckn’ sneakers if they need it.

78
Nyet  Aug 28, 2016 • 3:56:32pm

re: #75 EmmaAnne

Had to downding this, because in my view it is wrong in an important way. Consider telling someone that what they just said is racist, rather than saying “you are a racist.” Big, big difference. To me this is the same, and it is putting a “both sides do it” where it definitely does not belong.

If you downding so easily, then so will I ;)

And of course your analogy is wrong. There is no difference between telling someone “your racism is showing” and “you are a racist”. So your downding is based on a distortion of what I’m saying.

79
EmmaAnne  Aug 28, 2016 • 3:57:49pm

re: #40 Ming5000

Apparently Ann Coulter drew a lot of heat on the Robe Lowe CC Celebrity Roast.
Hollywood Reporter

[Embedded content]

Can’t stand her, but I don’t much like that sort of sexist insult. To me it isn’t just saying that she is worthless because she isn’t sufficiently pretty - it is saying women’s worth lies in their prettiness.

80
Nyet  Aug 28, 2016 • 3:58:06pm

It’s funny how people will twist and turn to justify that 2+2=5.

81
Blind Frog Belly White  Aug 28, 2016 • 4:00:56pm

On today’s ride, I was passing the Filoli Estate, when I noticed something in the middle of that big field.

Doesn’t look very wily to me!
82
Belafon  Aug 28, 2016 • 4:01:01pm
83
EmmaAnne  Aug 28, 2016 • 4:02:18pm

re: #78 Nyet

If you downding so easily, so so will I ;)

And of course your analogy is wrong. There is no difference between telling someone “your racism is showing” and “you are a racist”. So your downding is based on a distortion of what I’m saying.

No, it really, really is different. One is something you said or did. The other is who you are.

How To Tell Someone They Sound Racist

84
Joe Bacon  Aug 28, 2016 • 4:04:17pm

Well, I think it’s time to post a recipe that will cheer everyone up, especially Coconut lovers!

surlatable.com

Looks soooooooo yummy!!!!!!!
85
Nyet  Aug 28, 2016 • 4:04:56pm

re: #83 EmmaAnne

No, it really, really is different. One is something you said or did. The other is who you are.

[Embedded content]

No, if you have racism, you’re a racist. If the bigotry is yours, you’re a bigot.

It’s not at all analogous to saying “you said something racist”. A non-racist can say something racist. But saying “you said something racist” is not analogous to “his racism is terrible”.

Which is why you had to construct this silly strawman to knock it down in the first place. And of course your distortion is getting updings.

86
Belafon  Aug 28, 2016 • 4:05:54pm

re: #83 EmmaAnne

You are never going to win an argument on semantics with Nyet because he can split quarks.

87
Nyet  Aug 28, 2016 • 4:07:55pm

re: #86 Belafon

You are never going to win an argument on semantics with Nyet because he can split quarks.

Interestingly enough it’s my opponents here that try to split hairs, quarks and everything in view. Because arguing that when Clinton mentioned “his bigotry”, she didn’t call Trump a bigot is ridiculous.

88
The Very Reverend Battleaxe of Knowledge  Aug 28, 2016 • 4:09:02pm

Fuck.

Two dead, 41 hurt in bus crash involving Louisiana flood-relief volunteers

Two people died and 41 more were injured when a bus carrying volunteers to help with Louisiana flood relief spun out of control near New Orleans, local media reported Sunday.

St. John the Baptist Fire District Chief Spencer Chauvin died Sunday morning after the charter bus slammed into him as he tried to help victims of another accident, television station WWLTV of New Orleans reported, citing police and parish President Natalie Robottom.

Two other firefighters were injured in the crash and a second person, who has not yet been identified, also died, the television station said.

89
wrenchwench  Aug 28, 2016 • 4:09:49pm
90
Eclectic Cyborg  Aug 28, 2016 • 4:09:56pm

re: #88 The Very Reverend Battleaxe of Knowledge

And on top of all that, the bus driver was, you guessed it, an illegal immigrant.

Expect incoming RWNJ rage…

91
Kragar  Aug 28, 2016 • 4:11:38pm
92
Nyet  Aug 28, 2016 • 4:12:28pm

- And besides I should mention Mr. Peters’ Holocaust denial. It’s horrible!

- Wait, did you just call him a Holocaust denier? Why?

- No, you silly thing. I never said he was a Holocaust denier. I only said his Holocaust denial was horrible.

- But…

- Stop that vacuous hairsplitting exercise.

93
BigPapa  Aug 28, 2016 • 4:13:18pm

re: #91 Kragar

That’s dank bruh.

94
wrenchwench  Aug 28, 2016 • 4:18:50pm
95
Nyet  Aug 28, 2016 • 4:19:19pm

If you have bigotry, you’re a bigot. It’s not rocket surgery.

96
Eclectic Cyborg  Aug 28, 2016 • 4:20:33pm

re: #88 The Very Reverend Battleaxe of Knowledge

It’s sad, I really doubt Mr. Chauvin woke up thinking: “today is the day I die.”

Life is precious. SO precious. No one is ever guaranteed tomorrow. I can’t help but be reminded of something a guest speaker at my church said awhile back:

“Treasure every day you get, because the flowers that line your grave may be in bloom right now.”

Not exactly an uplifting message, but one that really hits you where it’s important.

97
Backwoods_Sleuth  Aug 28, 2016 • 4:23:23pm

There is a rather large eastern black rat snake in the back yard.
It is passed out, apparently drunk, in a pile of fermenting windfall under one of the apple trees.

This is what passes for hot news in the Backwoods.
You’re welcome.

98
Eclectic Cyborg  Aug 28, 2016 • 4:25:45pm

re: #97 Backwoods_Sleuth

The Drunken Snake would be a great name for a bar!

99
Blind Frog Belly White  Aug 28, 2016 • 4:28:02pm

re: #87 Nyet

Interestingly enough it’s my opponents here that try to split hairs, quarks and everything in view. Because arguing that when Clinton mentioned “his bigotry”, she didn’t call Trump a bigot is ridiculous.

Right. It’s never you. It’s always us. Uh-huh.

100
The Very Reverend Battleaxe of Knowledge  Aug 28, 2016 • 4:28:06pm

re: #97 Backwoods_Sleuth

There is a rather large eastern black rat snake in the back yard.
It is passed out, apparently drunk, in a pile of fermenting windfall under one of the apple trees.

This is what passes for hot news in the Backwoods.
You’re welcome.

At least he’s quiet. We used to have hundreds of birds eating fermenting mountain ash berries off the trees and then flying drunk into our windows.

101
Backwoods_Sleuth  Aug 28, 2016 • 4:29:08pm

welp, don’t see this very often:

102
Charles Johnson  Aug 28, 2016 • 4:29:14pm
103
bratwurst  Aug 28, 2016 • 4:29:17pm

104
Kragar  Aug 28, 2016 • 4:29:20pm
105
gwangung  Aug 28, 2016 • 4:29:58pm

re: #85 Nyet

No, if you have racism, you’re a racist. .

No, that’s just not so. You’re treating racism as an aberration and a binary condition, when it is an inherent part of the human makeup.

Everyone has racist tendencies, but what you do about those tendencies is what makes the difference. And that’s where you can’t treat the two as identical.

106
Blind Frog Belly White  Aug 28, 2016 • 4:30:27pm

re: #95 Nyet

If you have bigotry, you’re a bigot. It’s not rocket surgery.

Nonsense. I find myself having racist emotional reactions to people, names, situations. I acknowledge the reaction, and understand that it’s not reality.

So, I have racism. Am I a racist?

107
jaunte  Aug 28, 2016 • 4:30:46pm
108
Great White Snark  Aug 28, 2016 • 4:30:50pm

Damn haven’t seen a wrangle like this since Obdicut got hurt poor guy.

109
Backwoods_Sleuth  Aug 28, 2016 • 4:31:12pm

re: #102 Charles Johnson

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[Embedded content]

110
The Very Reverend Battleaxe of Knowledge  Aug 28, 2016 • 4:31:33pm

re: #99 Blind Frog Belly White

Right. It’s never you. It’s always us. Uh-huh.

Just a failure to realize that logic and rhetoric are two different things.

111
Nyet  Aug 28, 2016 • 4:31:35pm

re: #99 Blind Frog Belly White

Right. It’s never you. It’s always us. Uh-huh.

It’s not a matter of opinion. One side is splitting hairs, the other is not.

PS: And of course, you, being the usual suspect for demagoguery and logical fallacies, had to leave your “trace” here.

112
Blind Frog Belly White  Aug 28, 2016 • 4:32:19pm

re: #104 Kragar

[Embedded content]

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An unrepentant serial adulterer who hasn’t attended church in decades. Pretty clear that it was never about Faith, or Christianity, or Jesus for them.

113
Nyet  Aug 28, 2016 • 4:32:34pm

re: #106 Blind Frog Belly White

Nonsense. I find myself having racist emotional reactions to people, names, situations. I acknowledge the reaction, and understand that it’s not reality.

So, I have racism. Am I a racist?

If you have racism, you’re a racist.

114
Backwoods_Sleuth  Aug 28, 2016 • 4:34:20pm
115
gwangung  Aug 28, 2016 • 4:34:24pm

re: #113 Nyet

If you have racism, you’re a racist.

No, you’re human.

Your attitude is what makes it so hard for a lot of white people to change their behavior. “I’m not a racist.” they say to themselves…and they’ll excuse their own racist behavior as being logical or anything as other than racist.

116
Nyet  Aug 28, 2016 • 4:35:01pm

re: #105 gwangung

No, that’s just not so. You’re treating racism as an aberration and a binary condition, when it is an inherent part of the human makeup.

Everyone has racist tendencies, but what you do about those tendencies is what makes the difference. And that’s where you can’t treat the two as identical.

Arguably, racist tendencies do not necessarily constitute racism. But if they have reached the level of racism, well, one is a racist.

117
Backwoods_Sleuth  Aug 28, 2016 • 4:35:50pm

re: #107 jaunte

[Embedded content]

[Embedded content]

118
Joe Bacon  Aug 28, 2016 • 4:36:17pm
119
Blind Frog Belly White  Aug 28, 2016 • 4:36:27pm

re: #111 Nyet

It’s not a matter of opinion. One side is splitting hairs, the other is not.

PS: And of course, you, being the usual suspect for demagoguery and logical fallacies, had to leave your “trace” here.

Demagoguery? HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAAAAAA!!!!!!!! What a load of crap!

You know, Sergey, you’re the only one I get into this sort of tussle with. But you get into this sort of tussle with quite a few people, who themselves only get into this kind of tussle with you.

You’re the constant. The rest of us are variables.

120
Blind Frog Belly White  Aug 28, 2016 • 4:36:49pm

re: #114 Backwoods_Sleuth

[Embedded content]

[Embedded content]

They all are. This one is just too young to hide it.

121
Nyet  Aug 28, 2016 • 4:37:21pm

re: #115 gwangung

No, you’re human.

Your attitude is what makes it so hard for a lot of white people to change their behavior. “I’m not a racist.” they say to themselves…and they’ll excuse their own racist behavior as being logical or anything as other than racist.

The problem is that you mix racism and racist tendencies together.

As I have already written above, one can utter something racist without being racist. But when we’re already talking about someone’s racism, their tendencies are strong enough to call them a racist.

122
Stanley Sea  Aug 28, 2016 • 4:37:36pm

re: #107 jaunte

[Embedded content]

[Embedded content]

This is what he got out of his meeting with Ailes, Ingram & the kids.

123
gwangung  Aug 28, 2016 • 4:37:59pm

re: #116 Nyet

Arguably, racist tendencies do not necessarily constitute racism. But if they have reached the level of racism, well, one is a racist.

Still treating this as a binary condition. And one without recourse to repentance. It’s a sloppy way to think about it.

Was Senator Byrd a racist?

124
Nyet  Aug 28, 2016 • 4:39:40pm

re: #119 Blind Frog Belly White

Demagoguery? HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAAAAAA!!!!!!!! What a load of crap!

You know, Sergey, you’re the only one I get into this sort of tussle with. But you get into this sort of tussle with quite a few people, who themselves only get into this kind of tussle with you.

You’re the constant. The rest of us are variables.

Meh. Ad populum and ad hominem are not very convincing arguments.

125
Targetpractice  Aug 28, 2016 • 4:39:45pm

re: #104 Kragar

[Embedded content]

[Embedded content]

Trump big among people who think the world’s doomed and any day now they’ll ascend to Heaven while the rest of us will be doomed to 10 years of torment and then a final judgment.

126
gwangung  Aug 28, 2016 • 4:39:55pm

re: #121 Nyet

The problem is that you mix racism and racist tendencies together.

As I have already written above, one can utter something racist without being racist. But when we’re already talking about someone’s racism, their tendencies are strong enough to call them a racist.

The problem is that you think they’re separate things.

From my perspective, I can’t. All I can see is racist behavior. I can’t look inside of people; all I can look at is their behavior.

127
TedStriker  Aug 28, 2016 • 4:41:48pm

re: #106 Blind Frog Belly White

Nonsense. I find myself having racist emotional reactions to people, names, situations. I acknowledge the reaction, and understand that it’s not reality.

So, I have racism. Am I a racist?

re: #113 Nyet

If you have racism, you’re a racist.

re: #115 gwangung

No, you’re human.

Your attitude is what makes it so hard for a lot of white people to change their behavior. “I’m not a racist.” they say to themselves…and they’ll excuse their own racist behavior as being logical or anything as other than racist.

From birth, even when we try to raise kids colorblind, people since the dawn of time see those like them as “friendly” and those different from them as “possibly not friendly/not friendly”; suppressing that urge, while easier for some, is still hard for many people. We are still, as a society, in our infancy when it comes to treating everyone equally under the law and elsewhere; it’s going to take a long time to undo thousands of years of social inertia.

The main difference between the unrepentant racists and bigots and most people is that most people are self-aware enough to realize when they have those tendencies and and actually give a shit enough to actively try to mitigate them.

As George Carlin said about mortal sins, you have to wanna.

128
Nyet  Aug 28, 2016 • 4:45:47pm

re: #123 gwangung

Still treating this as a binary condition. And one without recourse to repentance. It’s a sloppy way to think about it.

Was Senator Byrd a racist?

No, I’m not treating it as a binary condition, because I never denied that someone can be a weaker racist and someone a stronger racist. Once we say about someone “his racism is such and such” though, we’re calling them a racist. A weaker one, a stronger one, but a racist nevertheless, above mere tendencies or slips of tongue.

As for Byrd, I can’t get into his head, but I suspect he died a racist.

129
Pawn of the Oppressor  Aug 28, 2016 • 4:47:10pm

re: #107 jaunte

[Embedded content]

[Embedded content]

I was skim-reading and read that as “releasing DENTAL records”…

130
Nyet  Aug 28, 2016 • 4:48:05pm

re: #126 gwangung

The problem is that you think they’re separate things.

From my perspective, I can’t. All I can see is racist behavior. I can’t look inside of people; all I can look at is their behavior.

It’s OK, but I don’t understand the problem you have with what I wrote. If you all you see is a spectrum from weaker racism to stronger racism, no problem, but then you can also accept that this means that all people are weaker or stronger racists. What is the objection to “his racism”=”he’s racist” then?

131
The Vicious Babushka  Aug 28, 2016 • 4:53:04pm

re: #118 Joe Bacon

[Embedded content]

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Donald Trump worships himself. I don’t believe he has ever read anything by Ayn Rand or even heard of her.

132
The Very Reverend Battleaxe of Knowledge  Aug 28, 2016 • 4:54:57pm

re: #131 The Vicious Babushka

Donald Trump worships himself. I don’t believe he has ever read anything by Ayn Rand or even heard of her.

He ain’t never going Galt, that’s for sure.

133
The Vicious Babushka  Aug 28, 2016 • 4:55:04pm

re: #121 Nyet

The problem is that you mix racism and racist tendencies together.

As I have already written above, one can utter something racist without being racist. But when we’re already talking about someone’s racism, their tendencies are strong enough to call them a racist.

A non-racist can have racist thoughts, even say something racist, and then say “I have to work on my thoughts and attitudes so that I don’t judge other people in a racist manner”

134
austin_blue  Aug 28, 2016 • 4:55:47pm

re: #131 The Vicious Babushka

Donald Trump worships himself. I don’t believe he has ever read anything by Ayn Rand or even heard of her.

You are probably right. He doesn’t need her words. He already has his, which I assure are The Best.

135
Joe Bacon  Aug 28, 2016 • 4:56:08pm

re: #131 The Vicious Babushka

Tribblehead admitted that he loved The Fountainhead!

“Trump described himself as an Ayn Rand fan. He said of her novel The Fountainhead, “It relates to business (and) beauty (and) life and inner emotions. That book relates to … everything.” He identified with Howard Roark, the novel’s idealistic protagonist who designs skyscrapers and rages against the establishment.”

nymag.com

136
Nyet  Aug 28, 2016 • 4:56:23pm

re: #133 The Vicious Babushka

A non-racist can have racist thoughts, even say something racist, and then say “I have to work on my thoughts and attitudes so that I don’t judge other people in a racist manner”

Exactly. And we will not speak of that person’s “racism”, because that person is not racist (assuming non-racists exist).

137
gwangung  Aug 28, 2016 • 5:00:19pm

re: #136 Nyet

Exactly. And we will not speak of that person’s “racism”, because that person is not racist (assuming non-racists exist).

And there you were going that you weren’t treating this as a binary condition….

138
Nyet  Aug 28, 2016 • 5:05:30pm

re: #137 gwangung

And there you were going that you weren’t treating this as a binary condition….

A binary condition is “racist”/”non-racist” only. Since I don’t deny that once a person is a racist, they can be a weaker racist or a stronger racist, I’m not treating this as a binary condition. I believe I’ve already written this above. Nothing has changed.

Once a person is not on the racist spectrum though (and one can argue whether such a person exists), that means there is no racism to talk of in relation to them. Maybe racist tendencies/thoughts. But not “his racism is such and such”.

139
geosherman  Aug 28, 2016 • 5:09:37pm

re: #104 Kragar

jEGCHM06zBWQwFDkPEFi+yXPCr0lFbAI/GB/Pg+EkktfjawQyCj5t5hl4G/IsyKcb8HjAnEnYd4AWTQJLtm7Jattf6IdQsyGn6XqsoCWZtrpY2iXND2oWNqrnRQ76aEKmrs7dAynpcFnlVRoT1IVgh06oyQksDB+XGThl1bSiVjxcnToIU3pXTrz2gEWuQxFSdTF/gRserycK2XcJZHbaeTNdyhT/rxjM5pKdKdqZg6R+t+/bZCSDrIjJFcOKUwF18mJ46mwo25e2sHwabwSoYS7KPa++kynKnyZu3OWlvt7byOnqjFfGA==

140
gwangung  Aug 28, 2016 • 5:12:57pm

re: #138 Nyet

A binary condition is “racist”/”non-racist” only. Since I don’t deny that once a person is a racist, they can be a weaker racist or a stronger racist, I’m not treating this as a binary condition. I believe I’ve already written this above. Nothing has changed.

Once a person is not on the racist spectrum though (and one can argue whether such a person exists), that means there is no racism to talk of in relation to them. Maybe racist tendencies/thoughts. But not “his racism is such and such”.

Sorry, but you keep on making that racist/non-racist distinction. That’s binary. “Once a person is a racist” is, implicitly, accepting a binary condition.

141
Stanley Sea  Aug 28, 2016 • 5:15:16pm

re: #136 Nyet

Exactly. And we will not speak of that person’s “racism”, because that person is not racist (assuming non-racists exist).

Wait, what?

Nah, forget it y’all.

142
Nyet  Aug 28, 2016 • 5:15:38pm

re: #140 gwangung

Sorry, but you keep on making that racist/non-racist distinction. That’s binary. “Once a person is a racist” is, implicitly, accepting a binary condition.

Being a racist is not binary.
Being or not being on the racist spectrum is binary.
You’re free to deny that there are people who are not on the spectrum, in which case we are all racists to some degree, fine. Your objection to “his racism”=”he’s racist” is still not clear.

143
Stanley Sea  Aug 28, 2016 • 5:16:30pm
144
The Vicious Babushka  Aug 28, 2016 • 5:16:36pm

re: #142 Nyet

Being a racist is not binary.
Being or not being on the racist spectrum is binary.
You’re free to deny that there are people who are not on the spectrum, in which case we are all racists to some degree, fine. Your objection to “his racism”=”he’s racist” is still not clear.

If you touch the hair before splitting it, is that racist?

145
Nyet  Aug 28, 2016 • 5:16:45pm

re: #141 Stanley Sea

Wait, what?

Nah, forget it y’all.

Trying to be fair to all theories offered at once. E.g. some think everybody is a racist to some degree. Others think non-racists exist (despite some racist thoughts/acts).

146
Nyet  Aug 28, 2016 • 5:17:51pm

re: #144 The Vicious Babushka

If you touch the hair before splitting it, is that racist?

Dunno, ask the hairsplitters who insist that “his racism” doesn’t imply “he’s racist”.

147
jaunte  Aug 28, 2016 • 5:18:06pm
148
Black d20  Aug 28, 2016 • 5:18:30pm

re: #142 Nyet

I believe we are all, in varying ways, given to the occasional bigoted thought. The key is whether or not we let those thoughts take the wheel of our lives and mash down on the gas.

149
jaunte  Aug 28, 2016 • 5:18:38pm

Trump is apparently bringing back trains.

150
Nyet  Aug 28, 2016 • 5:18:58pm

re: #148 Black d20

I believe we are all, in varying ways, given to the occasional bigoted thought. The key is whether or not we let those thoughts take the wheel of our lives and mash down on the gas.

Agreed.

151
Great White Snark  Aug 28, 2016 • 5:20:18pm
152
The Vicious Babushka  Aug 28, 2016 • 5:20:28pm
153
jaunte  Aug 28, 2016 • 5:21:12pm
154
Decatur Deb  Aug 28, 2016 • 5:21:59pm

At one time or another, each of my very bright kids has done something abysmally stupid. I can say: “That was abysmally stupid.” or I can say: “You are abysmally stupid.”

Both statements are the same and utterly different.

155
Nyet  Aug 28, 2016 • 5:24:01pm

re: #154 Decatur Deb

If you however say “His stupidity knows no bounds” you’re saying they’re stupid.

156
Nyet  Aug 28, 2016 • 5:24:48pm

re: #155 Nyet

If you however say “His stupidity knows no bounds” you’re saying they’re stupid.

(Not according to the hairsplitters here, of course.)

157
Decatur Deb  Aug 28, 2016 • 5:25:45pm

re: #155 Nyet

If you however say “His stupidity knows no bounds” you’re saying they’re stupid.

Yes, but I usually say “We’ll both laugh about this in a few years.”

158
Charles Johnson  Aug 28, 2016 • 5:25:48pm

The Rage Furby is announcing his Twitter sock puppets at his Facebook page. Currently planning to open another one tomorrow.

159
Stanley Sea  Aug 28, 2016 • 5:25:53pm

re: #152 The Vicious Babushka

[Embedded content]

[Embedded content]

Cheadle is bringing it.

160
Nyet  Aug 28, 2016 • 5:26:38pm

re: #157 Decatur Deb

Yes

Thank you.

161
ObserverArt  Aug 28, 2016 • 5:28:19pm

Got my scans finished for now.

You know what is funny? I never said Sergey was wrong. I understood him from the get-go. I know he is correct on a technical understanding of language. I admitted it right off.

I thought he would not need me to say “In those exact words” to catch the point…which I do believe he did from the beginning. He is very intelligent so I figured he would understand. And I bet he did.

It really is as simple as Hillary did not directly call him a bigot. My hope was we could talk about how she framed the speech to call him a bigot without using the words in a way that would have drawn your typical Fox news watcher into a rage.

“Look Stella…Hillary just called Trump a bigot.” Instead they need the media to let them know Hillary called him a bigot. The punch is gone out of that.

That there will be no video of her calling him a bigot is important in my estimation.

No commercials will be aired with that in it, and is that not important?

They can’t make a commercial from what she said in the speech because the average American might miss it and it would take too much of her speech with a voice over saying: “See right there, she wants to you to know he is a bigot.” They need those direct attack words.

And to carry it out a bit more, I am wondering if she isn’t already in debate test mode to get him drawn into the simple name-calling exchanges that show his ass while she stays above it all with no direct attacks but draws him into those types of exchanges.

Where the 16 failed Republican primary candidates went wrong is they got into the name flinging too. I am thinking Hillary won’t, but she knows if you get into Trump’s head he will hit low. He cannot help it.

Trump is smart enough to know he was called a bigot. He is not crafty enough to prevent himself from just blurting it out directly. She won that round.

Slueth…if you are still around…I am surprised there are not flash flood warnings up for Columbus. We have had some pretty strong downpours since around 5:00 PM. There has been a cluster over my section of Columbus the whole time it seems. And my TV is out…wind or lightening must have blowed it up.

Carry on.

162
Decatur Deb  Aug 28, 2016 • 5:29:10pm

re: #158 Charles Johnson

The Rage Furby is announcing his Twitter sock puppets at his Facebook page. Currently planning to open another one tomorrow.

[Embedded content]

Everyone needs a hobby.

163
Ziggy_TARDIS  Aug 28, 2016 • 5:30:04pm

re: #98 Eclectic Cyborg

Yes it would.

164
TedStriker  Aug 28, 2016 • 5:31:35pm

re: #162 Decatur Deb

Everyone needs a hobby.

Chuck needs a Fleshlight…

165
Decatur Deb  Aug 28, 2016 • 5:32:19pm

re: #164 TedStriker

Chuck needs a Fleshlight…

With the mousetrap app.

166
jaunte  Aug 28, 2016 • 5:34:06pm

Jon Favreau:
“I have no idea why this has become such a nasty, race-to-the-bottom campaign. It’s mystifying.”

167
Great White Snark  Aug 28, 2016 • 5:34:54pm

re: #165 Decatur Deb

Maybe this will help.

No No No
168
Feline Fearless Leader  Aug 28, 2016 • 5:34:55pm

re: #149 jaunte

Trump is apparently bringing back trains.

Need something to burn the coal in that all the new miners dig up - to haul the steel from all the new steel mills.

169
Nyet  Aug 28, 2016 • 5:35:51pm

re: #161 ObserverArt

I thought he would not need me to say “In those exact words” to catch the point…

Thing is, this doesn’t save your point, because if anyone in the media did say that she called Trump a bigot (and you never provided examples), that would be a correct, factual reporting. So what’s the problem? Why point that out in the first place? I mean, a complaint in the form of “but she did not use the noun” would be just pathetic.

The only thing worth discussing here would have been how this or that media outlet framed her calling Trump a bigot (with examples and citations, rather than the too usual generalizations and impressions). Did this or that author mention that she not merely called him a bigot but made her case? Etc., etc.

Of course that’s in the past now, because you insisted that complaining about using a noun is somehow useful.

170
Stanley Sea  Aug 28, 2016 • 5:40:19pm

re: #167 Great White Snark

Maybe this will help.

[Embedded content]

Who is that?

171
Decatur Deb  Aug 28, 2016 • 5:40:24pm

re: #167 Great White Snark

Maybe this will help.

[Embedded content]

Hey! Can you get that cane on Amazon?

172
Backwoods_Sleuth  Aug 28, 2016 • 5:40:55pm

re: #161 ObserverArt

Slueth…if you are still around…I am surprised there are not flash flood warnings up for Columbus. We have had some pretty strong downpours since around 5:00 PM. There has been a cluster over my section of Columbus the whole time it seems. And my TV is out…wind or lightening must have blowed it up.

The night is still young. Flash flood watches are popping up all over the place.
I’m just gonna head to bed and get a very early start on work in the morning. It’s just too miserably hot and humid for me right now.

173
Great White Snark  Aug 28, 2016 • 5:41:29pm

re: #170 Stanley Sea

Baddie Winkle. More nerve or sense of humor than any other ten people possess. Not sure which

174
Nyet  Aug 28, 2016 • 5:41:48pm

OK, this thread is in its last throes, so I’m off to bed.

175
Great White Snark  Aug 28, 2016 • 5:42:40pm

re: #174 Nyet

OK, this thread is in its last throes, so I’m off to bed.

Sorry I killed it.

176
Stanley Sea  Aug 28, 2016 • 5:43:49pm

re: #173 Great White Snark

Baddie Winkle. More nerve or sense of humor than any other ten people possess. Not sure which

I want to be her! Fuck em.

177
Stanley Sea  Aug 28, 2016 • 5:44:19pm

re: #174 Nyet

OK, this thread is in its last throes, so I’m off to bed.

Peace, love & sweet dreams.

178
Great White Snark  Aug 28, 2016 • 5:44:56pm
179
Eclectic Cyborg  Aug 28, 2016 • 5:45:31pm

re: #158 Charles Johnson

He’s going to need a long fucking list to keep this up.

180
Blind Frog Belly White  Aug 28, 2016 • 6:30:20pm

re: #124 Nyet

Meh. Ad populum and ad hominem are not very convincing arguments.

And of course, this is neither. It’s a mathematical argument.

181
Blind Frog Belly White  Aug 28, 2016 • 6:33:38pm

re: #149 jaunte

Trump is apparently bringing back trains.

Needs something to use all that coal he’s also bringing back.

182
Blind Frog Belly White  Aug 28, 2016 • 6:35:22pm

re: #157 Decatur Deb

Yes, but I usually say “We’ll both laugh about this in a few years.”

But for now, it’ll just be me.


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