The emerging media narrative on Glenn Beck’s rally is that it was a “religious” event, not a “political” event: Glenn Beck Leads Religious Rally at Lincoln Memorial.
But they’re completely missing the point. In this context, there’s no distinction between “religion” and “politics.” The extreme right wing religious views promoted by Beck, David Barton, and Sarah Palin are their politics.
1 |
HappyBenghazi Sat, Aug 28, 2010 8:23:21pm |
The signs you and others posted beg to differ with the "religious" label.
| 2 |
Max Sat, Aug 28, 2010 8:23:51pm |
Theocracy, hypocrisy!
Down with big government, up with bigger government, with crosses and commandments everywhere!
//
| 3 |
Stanghazi Sat, Aug 28, 2010 8:24:53pm |
So Fox is going to change their tag line to Beck's show to "Religion by Fox" ???
Same shit different day.
| 4 |
HappyBenghazi Sat, Aug 28, 2010 8:26:19pm |
By the way does that niece of Dr. King know that Glenn referred to her uncle as a radical socialist? These people don't really believe in small government. They're mad because Obama hasn't expanded the government where they want it expanded. I'm sorry but I am skeptical of most self described small government conservatives.
| 5 |
darthstar Sat, Aug 28, 2010 8:28:34pm |
Hey Glenn Beck...Jesus thinks you're an asshole too.
| 7 |
Our Precious Bodily Fluids Sat, Aug 28, 2010 8:30:45pm |
Religion and Politics
| 8 |
palomino Sat, Aug 28, 2010 8:30:52pm |
I give you your new GOP--the White Christian Party. Reagan and even Bush Sr. wouldn't recognize what it's become.
This religious populism will pay dividends in the short run. But it's a long term loser because it's tied to alienating Hispanics, blacks, Muslims and gays, groups that are all growing. As opposed to the white base, which is shrinking. Numbers don't lie--there's an expiration date on this stuff in the not too distant future.
| 9 |
darthstar Sat, Aug 28, 2010 8:32:11pm |
Fuck it...it's another Glenn Beck thread.
Your text to link...
| 10 |
Cato the Elder Sat, Aug 28, 2010 8:32:36pm |
Am I just weird for preferring my religion to be inside a church instead of this open-air kinda revival shite?
And another question: When did we all lose our honor, and why does Becky think he's called to restore it?
Cindy Sheehan makes more sense than Glenn.
| 11 |
Kragar Sat, Aug 28, 2010 8:33:33pm |
When your arguement is you want to have a Christian nation, tear down the separation between Church and State and most of your political positions are based of religious teaching, then you're already at the point where your politics are your religion and vice versa.
| 12 |
Stanghazi Sat, Aug 28, 2010 8:34:29pm |
re: #9 darthstar
Fuck it...it's another Glenn Beck thread.
Your text to link...
ahahaha. I haven't seen that one before.
| 13 |
SanFranciscoZionist Sat, Aug 28, 2010 8:34:33pm |
re: #4 HappyWarrior
By the way does that niece of Dr. King know that Glenn referred to her uncle as a radical socialist? These people don't really believe in small government. They're mad because Obama hasn't expanded the government where they want it expanded. I'm sorry but I am skeptical of most self described small government conservatives.
Dr. King's niece seems like a nice lady, and she has said that she feels that the point of this rally was to bring black and white people together. How the hell she came to that conclusion totally escapes me, but I'm going to assume she's sincere, if not entirely plugged in.
Beck is a political figure, and what religion he seems to have is solely directed toward political goals.
| 14 |
Dancing along the light of day Sat, Aug 28, 2010 8:34:47pm |
Good night all.
Be well.
Help Charles catch the ichabods.
| 15 |
jaunte Sat, Aug 28, 2010 8:35:13pm |
'Tithes not taxes' is a political message, and so is describing the government as playing the role of Lucifer.
From Glenn Beck's radio program, May 5, 2009:
"...the secret is nowhere in the Bible does the ‑‑ do any of the apostles or Jesus say give all of your money to the government. They gave it to their church, and the church, nowhere did the apostles say we're going to take it from members of the church. They, keyword, shared everything they had."( and later in the same program )...
"...did Jesus say when a man asks for your shirt, you give the government your coat, also, and have the government give that coat to the man? No. The government is a middleman. The government is acting in the role of Lucifer. They are taking stuff from you. They are forcing you ‑‑ yes, I did, I did just say, yes, the government is the devil. They are taking your choices from you."
| 16 |
palomino Sat, Aug 28, 2010 8:35:35pm |
re: #10 Cato the Elder
Am I just weird for preferring my religion to be inside a church instead of this open-air kinda revival shite?
And another question: When did we all lose our honor, and why does Becky think he's called to restore it?
Cindy Sheehan makes more sense than Glenn.
You're not weird, just 21st century.
I think the implication is that Obama made us lose our honor. BS of course, but it plays to the GOP base.
| 17 |
swamprat Sat, Aug 28, 2010 8:36:01pm |
re: #7 negativ
Demagoguery from conservatives followed by violence from liberals.
| 18 |
Killgore Trout Sat, Aug 28, 2010 8:36:13pm |
| 19 |
Virginia Plain Sat, Aug 28, 2010 8:36:42pm |
re: #16 palomino
You're not weird, just 21st century.
I think the implication is that Obama made us lose our honor. BS of course, but it plays to the GOP base.
GW Bush and the Republican bastards did more to tarnish our honor than Barack Obama will ever do even if he just serves one term.
| 20 |
Targetpractice Sat, Aug 28, 2010 8:36:51pm |
I wonder if these idiots ever stop and consider for a second that they are, in function if not form, the Christian equivalent of the nutbars they supposedly are trying to prevent from taking over this country? They're "fighting" radical Islam by promoting radical Christianity.
| 21 |
SanFranciscoZionist Sat, Aug 28, 2010 8:36:58pm |
re: #11 Kragar (Proud to be Kafir)
When your arguement is you want to have a Christian nation, tear down the separation between Church and State and most of your political positions are based of religious teaching, then you're already at the point where your politics are your religion and vice versa.
You're also at the point where you've given me fair notice what I should expect from you, being a non-Christian and all.
| 22 |
jaunte Sat, Aug 28, 2010 8:37:19pm |
re: #10 Cato the Elder
Am I just weird for preferring my religion to be inside a church instead of this open-air kinda revival shite?
That's some more of that Unitarian Jihadi talk!
| 23 |
SanFranciscoZionist Sat, Aug 28, 2010 8:37:36pm |
| 24 |
Virginia Plain Sat, Aug 28, 2010 8:37:41pm |
re: #20 Targetpractice, Worst of Both Worlds
I wonder if these idiots ever stop and consider for a second that they are, in function if not form, the Christian equivalent of the nutbars they supposedly are trying to prevent from taking over this country? They're "fighting" radical Islam by promoting radical Christianity.
Some are idiots who blindly follow. Others are well aware of it, and don't care. They're the new crusaders.
| 25 |
SanFranciscoZionist Sat, Aug 28, 2010 8:38:38pm |
re: #15 jaunte
'Tithes not taxes' is a political message, and so is describing the government as playing the role of Lucifer.
From Glenn Beck's radio program, May 5, 2009:
"...the secret is nowhere in the Bible does the ‑‑ do any of the apostles or Jesus say give all of your money to the government. They gave it to their church, and the church, nowhere did the apostles say we're going to take it from members of the church. They, keyword, shared everything they had."
Render unto Caesar, Glenn. Render unto Caesar. And if you don't, don't be too surprised when he can't pay the army, and the Visigoths run us over.
| 26 |
Targetpractice Sat, Aug 28, 2010 8:38:50pm |
re: #16 palomino
You're not weird, just 21st century.
I think the implication is that Obama made us lose our honor. BS of course, but it plays to the GOP base.
Supposedly we Obama has caused us to "lose our honor" by "apologizing" to the world for our past actions. Or, for those of us who stayed awake after 1st grade, admitting that America has done some stupid shit in the past and needs to be better if it wants to strengthen old alliances and foster new ones.
| 27 |
SanFranciscoZionist Sat, Aug 28, 2010 8:39:31pm |
re: #20 Targetpractice, Worst of Both Worlds
I wonder if these idiots ever stop and consider for a second that they are, in function if not form, the Christian equivalent of the nutbars they supposedly are trying to prevent from taking over this country? They're "fighting" radical Islam by promoting radical Christianity.
That's fine with them. Their issue with radical Islam is far more the 'Islam' part than the 'radical' part.
| 28 |
Virginia Plain Sat, Aug 28, 2010 8:39:44pm |
re: #25 SanFranciscoZionist
"...the secret is nowhere in the Bible does the ‑‑ do any of the apostles or Jesus say give all of your money to the government. They gave it to their church, and the church, nowhere did the apostles say we're going to take it from members of the church. They, keyword, shared everything they had."
Render unto Caesar, Glenn. Render unto Caesar. And if you don't, don't be too surprised when he can't pay the army, and the Visigoths run us over.
New Rome is in free fall, and has been for some time.
| 29 |
Kragar Sat, Aug 28, 2010 8:39:52pm |
re: #20 Targetpractice, Worst of Both Worlds
I wonder if these idiots ever stop and consider for a second that they are, in function if not form, the Christian equivalent of the nutbars they supposedly are trying to prevent from taking over this country? They're "fighting" radical Islam by promoting radical Christianity.
Just being the enemy of my enemy does not stop someone from being just as bad as my enemy
| 30 |
webevintage Sat, Aug 28, 2010 8:41:07pm |
re: #26 Targetpractice, Worst of Both Worlds
Supposedly we Obama has caused us to "lose our honor" by "apologizing" to the world for our past actions. Or, for those of us who stayed awake after 1st grade, admitting that America has done some stupid shit in the past and needs to be better if it wants to strengthen old alliances and foster new ones.
I wonder when apologizing stopped being the honorable thing to do....
| 32 |
swamprat Sat, Aug 28, 2010 8:41:27pm |
re: #10 Cato the Elder
Am I just weird for preferring my religion to be inside a church instead of this open-air kinda revival shite?
No, but you're definitely not pagan.
And another question: When did we all lose our honor, and why does Becky think he's called to restore it?
Some in the back seat of a '73 pinto, but that bulb can't be unscrewed.
Cindy Sheehan makes more sense than Glenn.
She resides in a rather large boat, if that is the criteria.
How ya doin' this fine evening?
| 33 |
HappyBenghazi Sat, Aug 28, 2010 8:42:23pm |
These people see Obama as not merely being wrong but as an enemy of this country. That is the problem with the Beck/Palin mindset where if you have a different mindset than they do then by god you must hate this country. And I hate that twisted view with a passion.
| 34 |
Stanghazi Sat, Aug 28, 2010 8:46:09pm |
re: #27 SanFranciscoZionist
That's fine with them. Their issue with radical Islam is far more the 'Islam' part than the 'radical' part.
Ding ding ding!
| 35 |
Dark_Falcon Sat, Aug 28, 2010 8:47:59pm |
re: #19 Virginia Plain
GW Bush and the Republican bastards did more to tarnish our honor than Barack Obama will ever do even if he just serves one term.
I do not agree. George W. Bush is a tolerant, decent man. Glenn Beck's idea of the GOP is no more Bush's idea of the party than it is mine.
| 36 |
Spare O'Lake Sat, Aug 28, 2010 8:49:24pm |
re: #30 webevintage
I wonder when apologizing stopped being the honorable thing to do...
When it's a one way street and all you get in return is spit in your eye?
| 37 |
simoom Sat, Aug 28, 2010 8:49:30pm |
I wonder if we'll be seeing any video from Beck's three hour "Divine Destiny" show which was held last night at the Kennedy Center. David Barton was co-hosting and I think it was supposed to be the even-more-religious preamble to his rally today.
| 38 |
Dark_Falcon Sat, Aug 28, 2010 8:50:21pm |
re: #25 SanFranciscoZionist
"...the secret is nowhere in the Bible does the ‑‑ do any of the apostles or Jesus say give all of your money to the government. They gave it to their church, and the church, nowhere did the apostles say we're going to take it from members of the church. They, keyword, shared everything they had."
Render unto Caesar, Glenn. Render unto Caesar. And if you don't, don't be too surprised when he can't pay the army, and the Visigoths run us over.
But then the Visigoths were them selves overthrown by the Arabs in 711. So they should really be seen as victims of Islam, by wingnut logic.
| 39 |
Velvet Elvis Sat, Aug 28, 2010 8:50:34pm |
re: #35 Dark_Falcon
I do not agree. George W. Bush is a tolerant, decent man. Glenn Beck's idea of the GOP is no more Bush's idea of the party than it is mine.
Cheney, on the other hand . . .
| 40 |
Targetpractice Sat, Aug 28, 2010 8:50:46pm |
re: #30 webevintage
I wonder when apologizing stopped being the honorable thing to do...
It's because it goes against the idea of American exceptionalism, that America is so special that its past actions cannot be held against it, and so America has nothing to apologize for. That to acknowledge that America's past actions were wrong and that we must atone for them is to show weakness, something that cannot be shown if we don't want our enemies to win. And that apologizing is pointless anyway, because people are going to hate us regardless, so why waste the time?
| 41 |
webevintage Sat, Aug 28, 2010 8:53:48pm |
re: #36 Spare O'Lake
When it's a one way street and all you get in return is spit in your eye?
Oh really?
I kinda figured that it had more to do with who (Obama) is doing the apologizing with the Beck crowd.
| 42 |
Dark_Falcon Sat, Aug 28, 2010 8:54:30pm |
re: #39 Conservative Moonbat
Cheney, on the other hand . . .
Cheney is ruthless but sane, and he his life has taught him the value of tolerance. Dominionists would undoubtedly find fault in his refusing to "cure" his gay daughter. Don't put these loons on him either. These nuts didn't really become visible until Bush and Cheney left office.
| 43 |
Stanghazi Sat, Aug 28, 2010 8:54:57pm |
re: #37 simoom
I wonder if we'll be seeing any video from Beck's three hour "Divine Destiny" show which was held last night at the Kennedy Center. David Barton was co-hosting and I think it was supposed to be the even-more-religious preamble to his rally today.
[Link: www.washingtonmonthly.com...]
Update: Oh, and don't forget that the radical Rev. John Hagee was also on hand to help Beck "restore honor." He's the end-times preacher who said Hurricane Katrina should be blamed on gay people.
Here's one article. No video that I saw, quick search.
| 44 |
swamprat Sat, Aug 28, 2010 8:55:33pm |
re: #27 SanFranciscoZionist
That's fine with them. Their issue with radical Islam is far more the 'Islam' part than the 'radical' part.
Like those who say they don't want "illegal" immigration- if you ask, they often don't want any immigration to be legal, or allowed. They simply don't want immigration at all. The modifier "illegal" is a smokescreen for the real intention. If immigration was legal, they would wish it to be otherwise.
It is a dishonest argument from people hiding their true agenda.
| 45 |
What, me worry? Sat, Aug 28, 2010 8:56:58pm |
I find the religious rebirth tone offensive and I say that as person with a strong belief in God.
Dr. King spoke of God in his I Have A Dream speech, but that wasn't what the speech was about.
Mr. Beck’s themes were ones he returns to on his radio and television shows, and people in the crowd echoed his ideas, saying that “progressives” were moving the country toward socialism and that the country must get back to a strict interpretation of the Constitution, which would limit the role of the federal government and do away with entitlement programs.
Meanwhile, Dr. King's message was unifying. It was about freedom for all people, particularly Black people. He spoke of the strength of the nation through good people and did not try to divide the country on party lines.
And I may mention, it is our Black population, the poverty population who often utilizes those "entitlement programs."
| 46 |
SanFranciscoZionist Sat, Aug 28, 2010 8:57:48pm |
I went to a funeral today.
Can I just say, for the record, that being a pallbearer at his mother's funeral is a service no fifteen-year-old boy should ever have to do for a classmate?
| 47 |
HappyBenghazi Sat, Aug 28, 2010 8:57:54pm |
re: #43 Stanley Sea
[Link: www.washingtonmonthly.com...]
Here's one article. No video that I saw, quick search.
Surprised they didn't also mention how Hagee thinks the Jews of Europe "deserved" the Holocaust for not accepting Christ. Seriously, where was the right's anger towards him or towards Falwell/Robertson who flat out said we deserved 9-11. I lost a lot of respect for John McCain after he started kissing Falwell and his ironically named Liberty University's ass in the 2008 primaries.
| 48 |
freetoken Sat, Aug 28, 2010 8:58:56pm |
re: #37 simoom
I wonder if we'll be seeing any video from Beck's three hour "Divine Destiny" show which was held last night at the Kennedy Center. David Barton was co-hosting and I think it was supposed to be the even-more-religious preamble to his rally today.
I've got to believe that it was taped, and if so then someday it will air.
Speaking of Beck and religion, here he was last week delving deep into Mormon interpretation of Native Americans:
| 49 |
Kreuzueber Halbmond Sat, Aug 28, 2010 8:59:05pm |
I saw this thing on CSPAN and from the looks on a lot of the people's faces, they were turned off. To the extent your religion makes you a better person, and therefore a better politician for all the people, it is good. But when your religion becomes your politics, then it is no longer in the best interest of America. Beck, through all of his proselytizing today, drove this point home to his audience - not intending to do so.
| 50 |
swamprat Sat, Aug 28, 2010 8:59:28pm |
re: #46 SanFranciscoZionist
Not a good situation to place him in.
| 51 |
freetoken Sat, Aug 28, 2010 8:59:51pm |
Beck would have made a good guest on the old Art Bell show.
| 52 |
Stanghazi Sat, Aug 28, 2010 9:00:12pm |
re: #47 HappyWarrior
Surprised they didn't also mention how Hagee thinks the Jews of Europe "deserved" the Holocaust for not accepting Christ. Seriously, where was the right's anger towards him or towards Falwell/Robertson who flat out said we deserved 9-11. I lost a lot of respect for John McCain after he started kissing Falwell and his ironically named Liberty University's ass in the 2008 primaries.
I know, the Hagee comment used was a 9 on a scale of 1 - 10. He's had many more 11's. AND he is involved with so many bad things.
| 53 |
SanFranciscoZionist Sat, Aug 28, 2010 9:00:13pm |
re: #47 HappyWarrior
Seriously, where was the right's anger towards him or towards Falwell/Robertson who flat out said we deserved 9-11.
There was disapproval, but it certainly wasn't enough to derail the career of either.
Then, Rev. Wright said "God damn America", and I will be hearing about that sermon until I am old and gray.
| 54 |
SanFranciscoZionist Sat, Aug 28, 2010 9:00:55pm |
re: #50 swamprat
Not a good situation to place him in.
Several of the boys from the high school did it, and I know they did it out of love. It was hard for me to see.
| 55 |
Spare O'Lake Sat, Aug 28, 2010 9:01:32pm |
re: #41 webevintage
Oh really?
I kinda figured that it had more to do with who (Obama) is doing the apologizing with the Beck crowd.
Were Carter, Reagan, Bush1, Clinton or Bush2 sekrit apologists?
| 56 |
simoom Sat, Aug 28, 2010 9:02:25pm |
re: #43 Stanley Sea
[Link: www.washingtonmonthly.com...]
Here's one article. No video that I saw, quick search.
Thanks. Here's another write-up -- the first that Google spit out for me:
Glenn Beck Goes Messianic at America's Divine Destiny Event Before 2,500 Screaming Fans
About 2,500 screaming, adoring Glenn Beck fans packed the concert hall of Washington's Kennedy Center on Friday night to shower affection on their hero. Beck used the event, dubbed “America’s Divine Destiny,” to portray himself as an instrument of God prepared to lead America out of its spiritual darkness.Beck, who seems to view himself in increasingly messianic terms, says he is helping to launch another religious “Great Awakening” that will shape American history and promised attendees that on Saturday they would be “fundamentally transforming the United States of America.”
...
Rep. Randy Forbes, head of the Congressional Prayer Caucus, gave the opening prayer. Forbes, who represents Virginia’s 4th congressional district, has repeatedly introduced resolutions filled with assertions about the religious nature of America’s founding. Forbes reeled off a list of supposed attacks on faith in America that he and his colleagues had withstood.
...
Barton did what he does, which is to show off his collection of old speeches and sermons that in his telling prove America was based on Christian principles and was never meant to be a secular nation.
...
Action film star Chuck Norris read long passages from writings by George Washington, Ben Franklin and Samuel Adams, intended to show their piety and their belief that America’s future depended on Americans acknowledging the country’s dependence on God. Norris was an energetic supporter of Mike Huckabee’s presidential bid and later endorsed “Ten Commandments” Judge Roy Moore’s gubernatorial bid in Alabama. “What does it take to get Gina and I off our ranch in Texas?” Norris asked. “An act of Congress? No way. What it takes is God or Glenn Beck.”
...
John Hagee is the pastor whose endorsement proved too controversial for John McCain’s presidential campaign when his remarks about Catholics, among other things, came under fire. Hagee also promised great things from Saturday’s event. “We’re not here to curse the darkness, we’re here to turn on the light and that happens tomorrow.” His prayer decried pluralism, moral compromise and political correctness, and urged God to lead the nation back to its righteous roots by putting godly leaders into office and exposing the ungodly ones: “Let every secret sin be shouted from the housetops.”
| 57 |
elbruce Sat, Aug 28, 2010 9:02:34pm |
re: #42 Dark_Falcon
Cheney is ruthless but sane, and he his life has taught him the value of tolerance.
Cheney's only ever been concerned about one thing his entire career: increasing the power of the Executive Branch. From his early career working for Nixon to the incredible powers he accumulated for Bush, that's been his entire raison d'etre. By the end of Bush's term, if it had come out that he had hired people to place bugs in the DNC's headquarters, the nation would have collectively shrugged. So, mission accomplished for Dick.
| 58 |
Stanghazi Sat, Aug 28, 2010 9:03:27pm |
re: #48 freetoken
I've got to believe that it was taped, and if so then someday it will air.
Speaking of Beck and religion, here he was last week delving deep into Mormon interpretation of Native Americans:
[Video]
Please, I tried. Give us the recap?
He's an Evangelist on Fox News. WTF? That's as far as I got. And, these are the Friday knowledge sessions all the folks are talking about, where they are learning all the history they somehow missed in the liberal schools they attended.
| 59 |
SanFranciscoZionist Sat, Aug 28, 2010 9:04:26pm |
re: #58 Stanley Sea
Please, I tried. Give us the recap?
He's an Evangelist on Fox News. WTF? That's as far as I got. And, these are the Friday knowledge sessions all the folks are talking about, where they are learning all the history they somehow missed in the liberal schools they attended.
Except that, theoretically, he's not an Evangelist. I wonder if he's about to pull a Dr. Laura on the Mormons?
| 60 |
Vicious Babushka Sat, Aug 28, 2010 9:04:43pm |
You knew it was bound to happen:
Some idiot has composed "The Protocols of the Learned Sheikhs of Jihad" based on the infamous "Protocols of the Elders of Zion" and is now spamming it all over Twitter.
| 61 |
freetoken Sat, Aug 28, 2010 9:04:51pm |
Really, that video demonstrates just what a quack Beck truly is.
In discussing supposedly two different discovered-in-Ohion stones with ancient Hebrew he shows the same picture.
Then, he equates Phoenician with ancient Hebrew.
re: #58 Stanley Sea
Please, I tried. Give us the recap?
He's an Evangelist on Fox News. WTF? That's as far as I got. And, these are the Friday knowledge sessions all the folks are talking about, where they are learning all the history they somehow missed in the liberal schools they attended.
re: #58 Stanley Sea
Please, I tried. Give us the recap?
Mormon indoctrination of the Fox audience.
| 62 |
SanFranciscoZionist Sat, Aug 28, 2010 9:04:52pm |
re: #59 SanFranciscoZionist
Except that, theoretically, he's not an Evangelist. I wonder if he's about to pull a Dr. Laura on the Mormons?
Evangelical. I suppose he can be an Evangelist of anything.
| 63 |
Cato the Elder Sat, Aug 28, 2010 9:05:16pm |
Telegram to Glenn Beck: ""The sentimentalist is he who would enjoy without incurring the immense debtorship for a thing done."
| 64 |
lostlakehiker Sat, Aug 28, 2010 9:05:20pm |
re: #8 palomino
I give you your new GOP--the White Christian Party. Reagan and even Bush Sr. wouldn't recognize what it's become.
This religious populism will pay dividends in the short run. But it's a long term loser because it's tied to alienating Hispanics, blacks, Muslims and gays, groups that are all growing. As opposed to the white base, which is shrinking. Numbers don't lie--there's an expiration date on this stuff in the not too distant future.
The Democrats have a permanent majority no matter what the GOP does. So why do the disgraceful thing? Why not just stand on the brakes when we're headed for a cliff, and otherwise acquiesce gracefully in most things?
| 65 |
SanFranciscoZionist Sat, Aug 28, 2010 9:05:20pm |
re: #60 Alouette
You knew it was bound to happen:
Some idiot has composed "The Protocols of the Learned Sheikhs of Jihad" based on the infamous "Protocols of the Elders of Zion" and is now spamming it all over Twitter.
Holeeeeee...
Seriously? It's not meant to be parody?
| 66 |
goddamnedfrank Sat, Aug 28, 2010 9:05:42pm |
re: #36 Spare O'Lake
When it's a one way street and all you get in return is spit in your eye?
There's your problem, you're judging personal honor and integrity in terms of short term expediency, mixed with some kind of fear that admitting past mistakes constitutes weakness, somehow creates an opening for attack. That's not what honor is about, it's about doing the right thing even when there is no advantage, even when it costs a price. Your version of honor seems more like pure expedience, gutless cowardice masquerading as rational self-interest.
| 67 |
SanFranciscoZionist Sat, Aug 28, 2010 9:06:05pm |
| 68 |
SanFranciscoZionist Sat, Aug 28, 2010 9:06:46pm |
Hey! Were you all aware of [Link: www.muslimrepublicans.net?...]
| 69 |
Stanghazi Sat, Aug 28, 2010 9:07:18pm |
re: #56 simoom
Save this one for Walter:
Alveda has dismissed her late aunt Coretta Scott King’s position that MLK would have supported marriage equality by saying, “I’ve got his DNA. She doesn’t.”
| 70 |
prairiefire Sat, Aug 28, 2010 9:07:26pm |
re: #65 SanFranciscoZionist
Holeee...
Seriously? It's not meant to be parody?
So the idiot is twinning the two together? Double power xenophobe bullshit?
| 71 |
SanFranciscoZionist Sat, Aug 28, 2010 9:07:34pm |
re: #68 SanFranciscoZionist
Hey! Were you all aware of [Link:
| 72 |
Vicious Babushka Sat, Aug 28, 2010 9:07:46pm |
| 73 |
SanFranciscoZionist Sat, Aug 28, 2010 9:08:29pm |
re: #69 Stanley Sea
Save this one for Walter:
So, she can channel her uncle via genetic satellite, and knows him better than the woman who married him?
| 74 |
SanFranciscoZionist Sat, Aug 28, 2010 9:09:03pm |
re: #71 SanFranciscoZionist
Also, I am now convinced that Bush was a sekrit Muslim himself.
| 75 |
lostlakehiker Sat, Aug 28, 2010 9:09:22pm |
re: #57 elbruce
Cheney's only ever been concerned about one thing his entire career: increasing the power of the Executive Branch. From his early career working for Nixon to the incredible powers he accumulated for Bush, that's been his entire raison d'etre. By the end of Bush's term, if it had come out that he had hired people to place bugs in the DNC's headquarters, the nation would have collectively shrugged. So, mission accomplished for Dick.
What??!! It would have been Watergate all over. Impeachment on the spot. And rightly so.
| 76 |
Dark_Falcon Sat, Aug 28, 2010 9:10:04pm |
re: #60 Alouette
You knew it was bound to happen:
Some idiot has composed "The Protocols of the Learned Sheikhs of Jihad" based on the infamous "Protocols of the Elders of Zion" and is now spamming it all over Twitter.
Now the idiots are taking measures that can only hurt the effort against Radical Islam.
Absolutely stupid.
| 78 |
freetoken Sat, Aug 28, 2010 9:10:45pm |
This is from where Beck has been getting his "history" information:
[Link: lostcivilizationdvd.com...]
[Link: www.familyfirstfoundation.org...]
| 79 |
HappyBenghazi Sat, Aug 28, 2010 9:10:58pm |
re: #69 Stanley Sea
Save this one for Walter:
Didn't his children also come out in favor of gay marriage too?
| 80 |
prairiefire Sat, Aug 28, 2010 9:11:40pm |
re: #74 SanFranciscoZionist
Also, I am now convinced that Bush was a sekrit Muslim himself.
So, Bush is now the anchor back to the sanity days of the GOP. I had thought he was the lowest level for the GOP. I guess I was wrong.
| 81 |
Spare O'Lake Sat, Aug 28, 2010 9:12:19pm |
re: #53 SanFranciscoZionist
There was disapproval, but it certainly wasn't enough to derail the career of either.
Then, Rev. Wright said "God damn America", and I will be hearing about that sermon until I am old and gray.
I'm sure you're not intentionally defending Wright's racist claptrap (which Obama himself has repudiated in no uncertain terms).
Also, I'm not so certain that Falwell's career wasn't seriously affected.
| 82 |
HappyBenghazi Sat, Aug 28, 2010 9:12:47pm |
re: #68 SanFranciscoZionist
Hey! Were you all aware of [Link: www.muslimrepublicans.net?...]
It's funny. The year of the 2000 election was the year I took Civics in middle school. We all had opinions on the election obviously since we had to do projects on it and it was in the news. Guy I grew up with was a Syrian Muslim and a big supporter of Bush. I think I was the only white dude in my whole civics class to support Gore during our mock election.
| 83 |
What, me worry? Sat, Aug 28, 2010 9:13:02pm |
re: #74 SanFranciscoZionist
Also, I am now convinced that Bush was a sekrit Muslim himself.
I was reading an article the other day (I'll have to find it again), that said that Muslims are largely Republican because they liked Bush. Specifically that he often spoke of a clear distinction between peaceful Muslims and the extremists. That's what's so perplexing about him keeping so quiet about the mosque. I guess no one but the Muslims were really paying attention.
| 84 |
Stanghazi Sat, Aug 28, 2010 9:13:21pm |
re: #73 SanFranciscoZionist
So, she can channel her uncle via genetic satellite, and knows him better than the woman who married him?
And spent the whole journey with him.
[Link: www.artnet.com...]
[Link: www.jofreeman.com...]
| 85 |
freetoken Sat, Aug 28, 2010 9:13:33pm |
Really folks, try to watch that video.
Beck truly is on the edge. I expect him someday to start talking about UFOs.
| 86 |
Cato the Elder Sat, Aug 28, 2010 9:14:51pm |
re: #75 lostlakehiker
What??!! It would have been Watergate all over. Impeachment on the spot. And rightly so.
Not so much. As long as you can pronounce the word "God", you get a free pass these days.
| 87 |
HappyBenghazi Sat, Aug 28, 2010 9:15:30pm |
re: #83 marjoriemoon
I was reading an article the other day (I'll have to find it again), that said that Muslims are largely Republican because they liked Bush. Specifically that he often spoke of a clear distinction between peaceful Muslims and the extremists. That's what's so perplexing about him keeping so quiet about the mosque. I guess no one but the Muslims were really paying attention.
I think it was even before Bush that many Muslims were Republican. I think I read somewhere that Muslims were attracted to the Republican party's conservatism interesting enough on both social and fiscal issues. I remember the father in the Kite Runner being a Republican because he liked Reagan's fiscal and foreign policy views.
| 88 |
Stanghazi Sat, Aug 28, 2010 9:16:07pm |
re: #86 Cato the Elder
Not so much. As long as you can pronounce the word "God", you get a free pass these days.
Yeah, diaper guy just won his primary I guess.
Oh the old days when that would destroy a reputation.
| 89 |
webevintage Sat, Aug 28, 2010 9:16:07pm |
You know what?
Today was just offensive.
Fuck Glen Beck.
| 90 |
What, me worry? Sat, Aug 28, 2010 9:17:21pm |
re: #85 freetoken
Really folks, try to watch that video.
Beck truly is on the edge. I expect him someday to start talking about UFOs.
Which video now?
| 91 |
Dark_Falcon Sat, Aug 28, 2010 9:17:24pm |
re: #83 marjoriemoon
I was reading an article the other day (I'll have to find it again), that said that Muslims are largely Republican because they liked Bush. Specifically that he often spoke of a clear distinction between peaceful Muslims and the extremists. That's what's so perplexing about him keeping so quiet about the mosque. I guess no one but the Muslims were really paying attention.
Bush would burn what little influence he has left were he to speak out in favor of Park 51. The smart play, IMO, is to wait for till he can act with a chance to make a real difference.
| 92 |
SanFranciscoZionist Sat, Aug 28, 2010 9:17:46pm |
re: #81 Spare O'Lake
I'm sure you're not intentionally defending Wright's racist claptrap (which Obama himself has repudiated in no uncertain terms).
Also, I'm not so certain that Falwell's career wasn't seriously affected.
1. I absolutely refuse to get involved in the stupid hand-wringing over Jeremiah Wright. So no, I will not be defending myself from your surety that I am not 'unintentially defending' him. Also, I could give a good goddamn what Barack Obama has to say on the subject.
2. Take a gander. If Wright dropped dead tomorrow, and Obama said he had lived a life of 'faith, family and freedom' what would the reaction be?
Falwell said the 9/11 attacks were 'probably deserved', and he got away with it.
| 93 |
freetoken Sat, Aug 28, 2010 9:17:55pm |
| 94 |
Cato the Elder Sat, Aug 28, 2010 9:18:22pm |
| 96 |
prairiefire Sat, Aug 28, 2010 9:18:41pm |
re: #81 Spare O'Lake
I'm sure you're not intentionally defending Wright's racist claptrap (which Obama himself has repudiated in no uncertain terms).
Also, I'm not so certain that Falwell's career wasn't seriously affected.
I'm sure you are not up to the task of judging a decorated veteran who treated LBJ. he led a congregation of 8,500 African American Christians.
This is a photo of him when as a Marine, he assorted in treating President L.B. Johnson.Image: File:Jeremiah_Wright_as_a_Marine_Medic_Tending_to_Pres_Lyndon_Johnson.jpg
I think Rev. Wright is a well respected community activist.
| 98 |
Daniel Ballard Sat, Aug 28, 2010 9:18:53pm |
I feel like an epidemic refugee after all this today. An epidemic of hate and scapegoating instead of the plague. Affecting family friends and co workers. It's just flat out creepy.
| 99 |
Spare O'Lake Sat, Aug 28, 2010 9:18:58pm |
re: #66 goddamnedfrank
There's your problem, you're judging personal honor and integrity in terms of short term expediency, mixed with some kind of fear that admitting past mistakes constitutes weakness, somehow creates an opening for attack. That's not what honor is about, it's about doing the right thing even when there is no advantage, even when it costs a price. Your version of honor seems more like pure expedience, gutless cowardice masquerading as rational self-interest.
Not at all. He tried it, it didn't work, he learned from it, so should you.
| 100 |
What, me worry? Sat, Aug 28, 2010 9:19:05pm |
re: #91 Dark_Falcon
Bush would burn what little influence he has left were he to speak out in favor of Park 51. The smart play, IMO, is to wait for till he can act with a chance to make a real difference.
I don't agree. He's not speaking out because it would be against the majority thoughts of his party. If he hasn't said anything at this point, I don't suspect he ever will.
| 101 |
SanFranciscoZionist Sat, Aug 28, 2010 9:19:16pm |
re: #87 HappyWarrior
I think it was even before Bush that many Muslims were Republican. I think I read somewhere that Muslims were attracted to the Republican party's conservatism interesting enough on both social and fiscal issues. I remember the father in the Kite Runner being a Republican because he liked Reagan's fiscal and foreign policy views.
Remember, though, that character is Afghani, and probably would love anyone who was giving the Sovs nightmares.
;)
| 102 |
HappyBenghazi Sat, Aug 28, 2010 9:20:20pm |
re: #101 SanFranciscoZionist
Remember, though, that character is Afghani, and probably would love anyone who was giving the Sovs nightmares.
;)
Heh true. Loved that book and character this said. Especially loved the quote about the mullahs and the communists he has: "The mullahs want to control our souls and the Communists say we have no souls."
| 104 |
goddamnedfrank Sat, Aug 28, 2010 9:20:33pm |
re: #92 SanFranciscoZionist
Falwell said the 9/11 attacks were 'probably deserved', and he got away with it.
Because he was blaming US domestic policy, namely a growing acceptance of gays, not US foreign policy.
I don't get it either.
| 105 |
elbruce Sat, Aug 28, 2010 9:20:45pm |
re: #44 swamprat
Like those who say they don't want "illegal" immigration- if you ask, they often don't want any immigration to be legal, or allowed. They simply don't want immigration at all. The modifier "illegal" is a smokescreen for the real intention. If immigration was legal, they would wish it to be otherwise.
It is a dishonest argument from people hiding their true agenda.
If there's a problem, then enact another amnesty. Standing on principle - "they're breaking the law, we shouldn't encourage that!" - puts you in opposition to Reagan, who did the same thing. Now, it's a valid comeback to point out that Reagan's amnesty didn't do anything in the long run, since we're right back at the point that led him to do it. Which simply proves that we need amnesty in combination with relaxed immigration requirements at the same time.
The "get to the back of the line" argument doesn't work because under current U.S. law, anybody who has ever been in the U.S. illegally can never apply for U.S. citizenship.
All of this "we aren't doing enough illegal immigration enforcement" BS is a complete and utter lie. The Department of Immigration and Naturalization Services does an excellent job of preventing and catching illegal immigrants in our country. They stop, catch and return hundreds or thousands every day. Saying that just because there are illegal immigrants it means that the federal government isn't doing their jobs is like saying that because there's crime it means the police aren't doing their jobs.
The pro-business, economic-conservative wing of the right wing is well aware that without migrant labor from Mexico, economic production throughout the central and southwestern United States just doesn't add up. When push comes to shove, we simple cannot keep many industries above water without them. So making them all instantly disappear is out of the question even if it were practically possible.
That leaves two alternatives: 1) keep everything the way it is, allowing substandard pay and working conditions since the whole industry is illegal, or 2) grant citizenship and make future citizenship easier so we don't have to do an amnesty grant again 20 years from now. The number-crunching pro-business conservatives would prefer option 1. Since that's a horiffic thing to say out loud, they're going to continue to let the screaming teabagger wingnuts howl about option 0 ("get every last one of them out right now!") knowing that it is impossible, both in terms of practicality and economic desireability.
| 106 |
Stanghazi Sat, Aug 28, 2010 9:21:01pm |
re: #91 Dark_Falcon
Bush would burn what little influence he has left were he to speak out in favor of Park 51. The smart play, IMO, is to wait for till he can act with a chance to make a real difference.
"Every man must decide whether he will walk in the light of creative altruism or in the darkness of destructive selfishness. "
Martin Luther King, Jr.
| 107 |
simoom Sat, Aug 28, 2010 9:21:09pm |
re: #69 Stanley Sea
Save this one for Walter:
I posted some more on Alveda (just some excerpts from wiki articles), when she was on stage earlier today. I'll just cut and paste it here since it's on topic:
She is the director of African-American Outreach at the Roman Catholic pro-life group Priests for Life. She is currently a Senior Fellow at the Alexis de Tocqueville Institution, a conservative Washington, D.C. think-tank
...
Regarding Martin Luther King Jr. and family, Alveda King claimed that "Mrs. Coretta Scott King knew that her husband, Dr. Martin Luther King Jr., was pro-life" regarding Martin Luther King Jr. winning the Margaret Sanger Award from Planned Parenthood in 1966. In 1994, Alveda King wrote a letter condemning Coretta Scott King's support for abortion and gay rights. According to Fox News, Alveda King has "long argued" that Martin Luther King Jr. was a Republican. University of Cambridge historian David Garrow stated in a Salon profile of Alveda King: "King was not only not a Republican, he was well to the left of the Democratic Party of the 1960s."The Advocate magazine has quoted King speaking out against gay rights. At a 1997 rally in Sacramento protesting proposed state legislation to extend civil rights to gays and lesbians, King said: "To equate homosexuality with race is to give a death sentence to civil rights. No one is enslaving homosexuals...or making them sit in the back of the bus." In a 1998 speech at the University of North Carolina at Chapel Hill: "Homosexuality cannot be elevated to the civil rights issue. The civil rights movement was born from the Bible. God hates homosexuality." King had been making public appearances throughout 1997 criticizing gay rights.
King is a pro-life speaker and often speaks on college campuses about abortion issues. She joined the pro-Life movement, crusading to offer women alternatives to abortion. King is also noted for her opposition to same-sex marriage. Angela D. Dillard classifies King as among "prominent black members of the Religious Right." King is currently a board member of the organization Georgia Right to Life.
---
The Priests for Life organization provides an extensive collection of photos of live fetuses as well as aborted fetuses, via the internet. Its photos have also appeared in print. According to Pavone: "There is no single thing that I have seen more powerful to change people on abortion than simply showing them the pictures...When people see what abortion does to a baby, they are stung to the heart and their consciences are awakened."
---
As part of the 1998 Tobacco Settlement Agreement, the Philip Morris corporation released millions of pages of documents concerning their operations. These detail how, after the Environmental Protection Agency moved in 1993 to have second-hand tobacco smoke declared a carcinogen, Philip Morris hired the AdTI to campaign against the move.
...
AdTI was a member organization of the Cooler Heads Coalition which asserts that "the science of global warming is uncertain" and is focused on "dispelling the myths of global warming by exposing flawed economic, scientific, and risk analysis."
[Link: en.wikipedia.org...]
[Link: en.wikipedia.org...]
[Link: en.wikipedia.org...]
(I'd never heard of the Alexis de Tocqueville Institution before reading that article :o)
| 108 |
SanFranciscoZionist Sat, Aug 28, 2010 9:21:17pm |
re: #99 Spare O'Lake
Not at all. He tried it, it didn't work, he learned from it, so should you.
I think that's the issue. "It didn't work".
When one admits to a mistake from honor, it doesn't matter what the response is.
When one admits to a mistake strategically, it's more relevent.
In either scenario, you still haven't lost any honor, so Glenn is still barking up the wrong tree.
| 109 |
swamprat Sat, Aug 28, 2010 9:24:52pm |
re: #48 freetoken
I've held an ogham in my hands. In New Mexico. It was a rock with "desert varnish" patina, indicating great age.
Ogham was pre-rune celtic, but I am no schlolar.
| 110 |
simoom Sat, Aug 28, 2010 9:25:13pm |
re: #91 Dark_Falcon
Bush would burn what little influence he has left were he to speak out in favor of Park 51. The smart play, IMO, is to wait for till he can act with a chance to make a real difference.
He has his fall book tour coming up, so I doubt he'll be willing to alienate the Republican base when they're likely who its target market. Though I'll be the first to give him credit if he does speak out.
| 111 |
freetoken Sat, Aug 28, 2010 9:25:26pm |
The guest Beck had on in that segment is Peter Lillback, author of a couple of books, including Wall of Misconception, which is an attack on the separation of church and state.
So when Charles writes:
In this context, there’s no distinction between “religion” and “politics.” The extreme right wing religious views promoted by Beck, David Barton, and Sarah Palin are their politics.
he is quite accurate.
See, that video of Beck really is on topic.
| 112 |
Spare O'Lake Sat, Aug 28, 2010 9:26:49pm |
re: #92 SanFranciscoZionist
1. I absolutely refuse to get involved in the stupid hand-wringing over Jeremiah Wright. So no, I will not be defending myself from your surety that I am not 'unintentially defending' him. Also, I could give a good goddamn what Barack Obama has to say on the subject.
2. Take a gander. If Wright dropped dead tomorrow, and Obama said he had lived a life of 'faith, family and freedom' what would the reaction be?
Falwell said the 9/11 attacks were 'probably deserved', and he got away with it.
I love it when folks concede that they don't give a shit what Obama has said on a subject with which he is intimately familiar.
| 113 |
CarleeCork Sat, Aug 28, 2010 9:27:17pm |
Frum: "Republicans originally thought that Fox worked for us, and now we are discovering we work for Fox."
| 114 |
Spare O'Lake Sat, Aug 28, 2010 9:28:47pm |
re: #96 prairiefire
I'm sure you are not up to the task of judging a decorated veteran who treated LBJ. he led a congregation of 8,500 African American Christians.
This is a photo of him when as a Marine, he assorted in treating President L.B. Johnson.Image: File:Jeremiah_Wright_as_a_Marine_Medic_Tending_to_ Pres_Lyndon_Johnson.jpg
I think Rev. Wright is a well respected community activist.
He went bad...very bad.
| 115 |
SanFranciscoZionist Sat, Aug 28, 2010 9:29:16pm |
re: #112 Spare O'Lake
I love it when folks concede that they don't give a shit what Obama has said on a subject with which he is intimately familiar.
Why? Is there some reason my judgment about what Wright said should be dependent on an ex-parishioner's politically expedient opinion?
Would you expect me to take Obama's opinion seriously if he had defended Wright to the bitter end?
| 116 |
lostlakehiker Sat, Aug 28, 2010 9:29:26pm |
re: #44 swamprat
Like those who say they don't want "illegal" immigration- if you ask, they often don't want any immigration to be legal, or allowed. They simply don't want immigration at all. The modifier "illegal" is a smokescreen for the real intention. If immigration was legal, they would wish it to be otherwise.
It is a dishonest argument from people hiding their true agenda.
Not from me. I favor more immigration by people who, one by one and as individuals, can contribute skills we're short on. The more of those, the better. Our illegal immigrants include folk like that, but mixed in with others who contribute more to the crime rate than anything else, and a silent majority who neither have exceptional skills nor any criminal tendencies. We're not so underpopulated that we gain anything from that mix.
| 117 |
Cato the Elder Sat, Aug 28, 2010 9:30:12pm |
Fuck Bush, the dickless, spineless, pussy-assed piece of dog meat.
And his whole "me first" crime family, too.
| 118 |
Stanghazi Sat, Aug 28, 2010 9:30:26pm |
SFZ, Prairie et al, check out this photo of Coretta Scott King
[Link: www.now.org...]
| 119 |
Stanghazi Sat, Aug 28, 2010 9:31:41pm |
re: #114 Spare O'Lake
He went bad...very bad.
GOD DAMN America. The Canadian is soooo offended.
I'm sorry Spare, you and everyone else so blinded by Fox and the media bombardment. UGH.
| 120 |
SanFranciscoZionist Sat, Aug 28, 2010 9:31:55pm |
re: #118 Stanley Sea
SFZ, Prairie et al, check out this photo of Coretta Scott King
[Link: www.now.org...]
Ah, that's lovely.
| 121 |
Spare O'Lake Sat, Aug 28, 2010 9:32:28pm |
re: #115 SanFranciscoZionist
Why? Is there some reason my judgment about what Wright said should be dependent on an ex-parishioner's politically expedient opinion?
Would you expect me to take Obama's opinion seriously if he had defended Wright to the bitter end?
I agree wholeheartedly with President Obama's repudiation of Wright and his racist views.
| 122 |
SanFranciscoZionist Sat, Aug 28, 2010 9:33:02pm |
re: #121 Spare O'Lake
I agree wholeheartedly with President Obama's repudiation of Wright and his racist views.
Because Obama's an expert?
| 124 |
lostlakehiker Sat, Aug 28, 2010 9:34:22pm |
re: #105 elbruce
If there's a problem, then enact another amnesty. Standing on principle - "they're breaking the law, we shouldn't encourage that!" - puts you in opposition to Reagan, who did the same thing. Now, it's a valid comeback to point out that Reagan's amnesty didn't do anything in the long run, since we're right back at the point that led him to do it. Which simply proves that we need amnesty in combination with relaxed immigration requirements at the same time.
The "get to the back of the line" argument doesn't work because under current U.S. law, anybody who has ever been in the U.S. illegally can never apply for U.S. citizenship.
All of this "we aren't doing enough illegal immigration enforcement" BS is a complete and utter lie. The Department of Immigration and Naturalization Services does an excellent job of preventing and catching illegal immigrants in our country. They stop, catch and return hundreds or thousands every day. Saying that just because there are illegal immigrants it means that the federal government isn't doing their jobs is like saying that because there's crime it means the police aren't doing their jobs.
The pro-business, economic-conservative wing of the right wing is well aware that without migrant labor from Mexico, economic production throughout the central and southwestern United States just doesn't add up. When push comes to shove, we simple cannot keep many industries above water without them. So making them all instantly disappear is out of the question even if it were practically possible.
That leaves two alternatives: 1) keep everything the way it is, allowing substandard pay and working conditions since the whole industry is illegal, or 2) grant citizenship and make future citizenship easier so we don't have to do an amnesty grant again 20 years from now. The number-crunching pro-business conservatives would prefer option 1. Since that's a horiffic thing to say out loud, they're going to continue to let the screaming teabagger wingnuts howl about option 0 ("get every last one of them out right now!") knowing that it is impossible, both in terms of practicality and economic desireability.
Wouldn't it be simpler to have a "law of return" that says that anyone, anywhere, who doesn't have a criminal record, may come to the U.S. and be granted citizenship? Why mess around with any sort of brakes on immigration? This policy cuts to the chase.
| 125 |
Cato the Elder Sat, Aug 28, 2010 9:35:21pm |
Glenn Beck: "Get down on your knees and pray to God. Right now! And let your children watch you doing it. And then call Goldline, and let your children hear you!"
| 126 |
prairiefire Sat, Aug 28, 2010 9:36:48pm |
re: #111 freetoken
The guest Beck had on in that segment is Peter Lillback, author of a couple of books, including Wall of Misconception, which is an attack on the separation of church and state.
So when Charles writes:
he is quite accurate.See, that video of Beck really is on topic.
Yes, but it is pretty thin gruel. Skating away on the thin ice of phony platitudes. How will he persuade the masses?
| 127 |
Spare O'Lake Sat, Aug 28, 2010 9:37:18pm |
re: #119 Stanley Sea
GOD DAMN America. The Canadian is sooo offended.
I'm sorry Spare, you and everyone else so blinded by Fox and the media bombardment. UGH.
Wow, Stunley, I didn't realize that Wright the racist scumbucket enjoyed such popularity here. Was President Obama also swayed by the Fox News coverage?
| 128 |
Spare O'Lake Sat, Aug 28, 2010 9:38:24pm |
re: #122 SanFranciscoZionist
Because Obama's an expert?
Go ahead, tell me what you really think of Obama.
| 129 |
Lidane Sat, Aug 28, 2010 9:39:27pm |
re: #30 webevintage
I wonder when apologizing stopped being the honorable thing to do...
When Obama became President, of course. =P
| 130 |
b_snark Sat, Aug 28, 2010 9:39:56pm |
re: #122 SanFranciscoZionist
Because Obama's an expert?
Perhaps we should ask Spare what she knows about Wright beyond the right-wing PR of the election.
| 131 |
freetoken Sat, Aug 28, 2010 9:40:08pm |
re: #126 prairiefire
Yes, but it is pretty thin gruel. Skating away on the thin ice of phony platitudes. How will he persuade the masses?
"He" meaning Beck or Lillback.
Anyway, I failed to realize that Lillback is President of Westminster Theological Seminary in PA
, probably the most erudite of the fundamentalist seminaries in the country.
| 132 |
swamprat Sat, Aug 28, 2010 9:40:10pm |
re: #105 elbruce
I am for closing the borders. Complete wall. Then allowing all to enter, but have them documented, fingerprinted, whatever. And I believe we should have a rational plan for legalization, both for those who come, and for those who are here. I don't even care what the plan is; or if it is to be draconian, or easy. It makes no difference to me, as long as we control our borders and enforce a real immigration policy with actual laws, instead of the hodge-podge of loosely and capriciously prosecuted statutes we currently are under.
With actual borders, we can allow or shut off, immigration as the countrie's needs fluctuate. With no real borders, we are caught with our pants down.
| 133 |
Daniel Ballard Sat, Aug 28, 2010 9:40:35pm |
re: #119 Stanley Sea
GOD DAMN America. The Canadian is sooo offended.
I'm sorry Spare, you and everyone else so blinded by Fox and the media bombardment. UGH.
My father, both D_L's folks are all caught up in this anti mosque/Obama is a Muslim garbage. This is hitting right at home. GAH! I'm starting to argue the point at chosen moments. Seriously lots of red faces before its done.
| 134 |
prairiefire Sat, Aug 28, 2010 9:41:04pm |
re: #118 Stanley Sea
SFZ, Prairie et al, check out this photo of Coretta Scott King
[Link: www.now.org...]
Thanks!
I saw Mrs. King twice in one day. She was on campus to dedicate a new piece of sculpture on campus. She was amazing. More to post on that later.
| 135 |
Stanghazi Sat, Aug 28, 2010 9:41:06pm |
re: #127 Spare O'Lake
I love when I see my name as the response to @ the bottom comments. Happens lately.
This one, probably not. Keep on keeping on.
Other than that, I disagree with your paranoia feel that you are misguided, and haven't learned one thing since 2008.
| 136 |
SanFranciscoZionist Sat, Aug 28, 2010 9:41:33pm |
re: #128 Spare O'Lake
Go ahead, tell me what you really think of Obama.
He's a fairly centrist Democrat, presently the President of the United States of America. I wanted Hillary, but I voted for him after some consideration. His foreign policy record has so far been very good. I had hopes he might be able to come up with some brilliant plan to rescue the economy, but no dice. He's a pretty good politician.
I've said this all here many times before.
| 137 |
Cato the Elder Sat, Aug 28, 2010 9:41:57pm |
re: #132 swamprat
I am for closing the borders. Complete wall. Then allowing all to enter, but have them documented, fingerprinted, whatever. And I believe we should have a rational plan for legalization, both for those who come, and for those who are here. I don't even care what the plan is; or if it is to be draconian, or easy. It makes no difference to me, as long as we control our borders and enforce a real immigration policy with actual laws, instead of the hodge-podge of loosely and capriciously prosecuted statutes we currently are under.
With actual borders, we can allow or shut off, immigration as the countrie's needs fluctuate. With no real borders, we are caught with our pants down.
You are illiterate, so why should I care what you're for?
| 138 |
Stanghazi Sat, Aug 28, 2010 9:43:19pm |
re: #133 Rightwingconspirator
My father, both D_L's folks are all caught up in this anti mosque/Obama is a Muslim garbage. This is hitting right at home. GAH! I'm starting to argue the point at chosen moments. Seriously lots of red faces before its done.
I'm on the family avoidance lately. Cheers to you and D_F. Good people. I'll dig up another MLK quote, there's one that fits I'm positive.
| 139 |
Mostly sane, most of the time. Sat, Aug 28, 2010 9:43:41pm |
Totally off topic, but very interesting--
Did you know one of the signers of the Declaration of Independence was named Button Gwinnett. Seriously. His mother should have been fined for cruelty to an infant.
He was a little bit of a twit, though, for a signer.
| 140 |
prairiefire Sat, Aug 28, 2010 9:43:50pm |
re: #136 SanFranciscoZionist
He's a fairly centrist Democrat, presently the President of the United States of America. I wanted Hillary, but I voted for him after some consideration. His foreign policy record has so far been very good. I had hopes he might be able to come up with some brilliant plan to rescue the economy, but no dice. He's a pretty good politician.
I've said this all here many times before.
90,000 troops are home.
| 141 |
b_snark Sat, Aug 28, 2010 9:44:03pm |
re: #127 Spare O'Lake
Wow, Stunley, I didn't realize that Wright the racist scumbucket enjoyed such popularity here. Was President Obama also swayed by the Fox News coverage?
There you go again, using up your most powerful weapon, calling names like an 8 year old, when the debate isn't even half over. A bit premature isn't it?
| 142 |
jaunte Sat, Aug 28, 2010 9:44:21pm |
re: #111 freetoken
The guest Beck had on in that segment is Peter Lillback, author of a couple of books, including Wall of Misconception, which is an attack on the separation of church and state.
So when Charles writes:
he is quite accurate.See, that video of Beck really is on topic.
Here's an archeologist's rebuttal of Beck's dabbling:
...in fact, it was institutional science (and especially the Smithsonian) that showed that these people weren't savages, and there was no cover-up. As to Beck's question "The ancient artifacts prove otherwise. Why aren’t we looking into those?" I can only say - buddy, I've got a room full of those artifacts in the back of my office building, and I have spent years studying them. If you have to ask "why aren't we looking into those?" then you are so astoundingly ignorant that I don't even know where to start explaining your problems.[Link: anthroslug.blogspot.com...]
| 143 |
Stanghazi Sat, Aug 28, 2010 9:45:05pm |
re: #133 Rightwingconspirator
Man must evolve for all human conflict a method which rejects revenge, aggression and retaliation. The foundation of such a method is love.
Martin Luther King, Jr.
| 144 |
Dark_Falcon Sat, Aug 28, 2010 9:45:14pm |
re: #100 marjoriemoon
I don't agree. He's not speaking out because it would be against the majority thoughts of his party. If he hasn't said anything at this point, I don't suspect he ever will.
That's my point. He should wait for a more opportune time to speak out. If he does so right now, he gets branded a RINO for no return.
| 145 |
Spare O'Lake Sat, Aug 28, 2010 9:45:30pm |
re: #136 SanFranciscoZionist
He's a fairly centrist Democrat, presently the President of the United States of America. I wanted Hillary, but I voted for him after some consideration. His foreign policy record has so far been very good. I had hopes he might be able to come up with some brilliant plan to rescue the economy, but no dice. He's a pretty good politician.
I've said this all here many times before.
No, I mean tell me what you really think of Obama's utter repudiation of his long-time pastor Rev. Wright.
| 146 |
Targetpractice Sat, Aug 28, 2010 9:45:41pm |
re: #139 EmmmieG
Totally off topic, but very interesting--
Did you know one of the signers of the Declaration of Independence was named Button Gwinnett. Seriously. His mother should have been fined for cruelty to an infant.
He was a little bit of a twit, though, for a signer.
Yep. Learned that little fact by playing Fallout 3.
| 148 |
Mostly sane, most of the time. Sat, Aug 28, 2010 9:46:20pm |
re: #146 Targetpractice, Worst of Both Worlds
Yep. Learned that little fact by playing Fallout 3.
My son could place Madagascar on a map at 9 because of Risk.
| 149 |
swamprat Sat, Aug 28, 2010 9:47:15pm |
re: #137 Cato the Elder
Only semi-illiterate. But literacy is not a test of worthiness. The intellect is the tool of the ego, which we are taught to suppress.
| 150 |
SanFranciscoZionist Sat, Aug 28, 2010 9:49:08pm |
re: #145 Spare O'Lake
No, I mean tell me what you really think of Obama's utter repudiation of his long-time pastor Rev. Wright.
What do I really think OF it? Explain. Do you mean, do I think Obama should have backed away from Wright?
| 151 |
Daniel Ballard Sat, Aug 28, 2010 9:49:25pm |
re: #143 Stanley Sea
Somehow this country just has to move on. Trouble is near anything is going to be embraced to get away from the economy public attention wise
| 152 |
Spare O'Lake Sat, Aug 28, 2010 9:49:26pm |
How the fuck did that scumbucket Wright get into this thread anyways? It sure as heck wasn't me who invoked his name.
| 153 |
simoom Sat, Aug 28, 2010 9:49:40pm |
From BBC's Beck rally write-up:
[Link: www.bbc.co.uk...]
While there was no partisan politics on stage, there was plenty of it out in the crowd. And much of that was anti-Obama."We don't like the way things are going," said Ron Kilmer, of Springfield, Missouri. "It is being shoved in our face since Obama took office."
He alluded to the "birthers", those who believe Obama was not born in the US and therefore not eligible to be president, and also questioned the president's religion. President Obama is a Christian.
"Where was he born and what religion is he? I believe he is a Muslim," said Mr Kilmer.
Charles Rush came with friends from Tennessee for the rally and thought there was no problem that the event coinciding with the anniversary of King's famous speech.
He said he respected Martin Luther King, adding: "Who is to say Glenn Beck is not as good as Martin Luther King, or better?"
To which I can just picture Glenn Beck saying, "Mission Accomplished."
| 154 |
Stanghazi Sat, Aug 28, 2010 9:50:30pm |
re: #145 Spare O'Lake
No, I mean tell me what you really think of Obama's utter repudiation of his long-time pastor Rev. Wright.
Can win for losing. You (and you fellow travelers) would disagree with his stance (hate him) either way.
Great question!!!
| 155 |
Mostly sane, most of the time. Sat, Aug 28, 2010 9:51:06pm |
re: #152 Spare O'Lake
How the did that scumbucket Wright get into this thread anyways? It sure as heck wasn't me who invoked his name.
Beetlejuice, Beetlejuice, Beetlejuice...
| 156 |
Cato the Elder Sat, Aug 28, 2010 9:51:13pm |
I find myself wondering how many swamp-dwellers who think Pamz Geller is a formidable fighter for Western identity and Glenn Beck is the major intellect of the age - I wonder how many of them called up Goldline and got sold on overpriced French gold?
Because knowing that number would make me laugh myself to sleep for at least three weeks.
| 157 |
Spare O'Lake Sat, Aug 28, 2010 9:51:20pm |
re: #150 SanFranciscoZionist
What do I really think OF it? Explain. Do you mean, do I think Obama should have backed away from Wright?
Now don't go all Obdicute on me.
It's OK, let's drop it...I gotta hit the sack anyways.
Goodnight.
| 158 |
SanFranciscoZionist Sat, Aug 28, 2010 9:51:32pm |
re: #152 Spare O'Lake
How the fuck did that scumbucket Wright get into this thread anyways? It sure as heck wasn't me who invoked his name.
No, I brought him up, in response to HappyWarrior's bringing up Falwell's disgusting comments on 9/11, for which Falwell was rewarded with the POTUS calling his a life of 'faith, family and freedom'.
| 159 |
Daniel Ballard Sat, Aug 28, 2010 9:51:36pm |
re: #143 Stanley Sea
Man must evolve for all human conflict a method which rejects revenge, aggression and retaliation. The foundation of such a method is love.
Martin Luther King, Jr.
Has a certain Buddhist feeling to it. Nice.
| 160 |
HappyBenghazi Sat, Aug 28, 2010 9:51:40pm |
re: #153 simoom
From BBC's Beck rally write-up:
[Link: www.bbc.co.uk...]
To which I can just picture Glenn Beck saying, "Mission Accomplished."
Jeez, are these people nuts, Beck better or the same as one of the people singlehandly responsible for changing perceptions of race in this country. Sometimes I wonder about people, I really do.
| 161 |
Stanghazi Sat, Aug 28, 2010 9:52:47pm |
re: #154 Stanley Sea
I hate pimf. hope you could figure out the old saying.
| 162 |
swamprat Sat, Aug 28, 2010 9:53:22pm |
re: #153 simoom
Charles Rush came with friends from Tennessee for the rally and thought there was no problem that the event coinciding with the anniversary of King's famous speech.
He said he respected Martin Luther King, adding: "Who is to say Glenn Beck is not as good as Martin Luther King, or better?"
Count me as one who says that Glenn Beck is not as good as Dr. Martin Luther King.
I thought moral relativism was a "liberal" tool.
| 163 |
SanFranciscoZionist Sat, Aug 28, 2010 9:53:33pm |
re: #157 Spare O'Lake
Now don't go all Obdicute on me.
It's OK, let's drop it...I gotta hit the sack anyways.
Goodnight.
I'll tell you what I think of Obama dropping Wright when you tell me what you think of George Bush praising a man who called 9/11 'probably deserved'.
(Hint, I have similar feelings about both actions.)
| 164 |
Daniel Ballard Sat, Aug 28, 2010 9:54:01pm |
re: #143 Stanley Sea
Man must evolve for all human conflict a method which rejects revenge, aggression and retaliation. The foundation of such a method is love.
Martin Luther King, Jr.
If you want others to be happy, practice compassion. If you want to be happy, practice compassion.
The Dalai Lama
| 165 |
SanFranciscoZionist Sat, Aug 28, 2010 9:54:19pm |
re: #162 swamprat
Charles Rush came with friends from Tennessee for the rally and thought there was no problem that the event coinciding with the anniversary of King's famous speech.
He said he respected Martin Luther King, adding: "Who is to say Glenn Beck is not as good as Martin Luther King, or better?"
Count me as one who says that Glenn Beck is not as good as Dr. Martin Luther King.
I thought moral relativism was a "liberal" tool.
Glenn Beck < Dr. King
| 166 |
elbruce Sat, Aug 28, 2010 9:54:55pm |
re: #132 swamprat
I am for closing the borders. Complete wall. Then allowing all to enter, but have them documented, fingerprinted, whatever.
My point is that we already do that to the point that we're willing to pay for it and to restrict our own rights. I know that I don't carry my birth certificate with me when I leave the house. If that were a requirement everywhere, then every American would have given up their own liberties to a significant degree, and so forth.
Xenophobes want us to believe that there is little or no border enforcement. The fact is, there is plenty of it already. We need to stop falling for the meme that our borders aren't already closed. They are. Not perfectly of course, but that's like complaining that because crime exists there is no police enforcement.
re: #132 swamprat
And I believe we should have a rational plan for legalization, both for those who come, and for those who are here. I don't even care what the plan is; or if it is to be draconian, or easy.
Amnesty. And as it stands, there are a ridiculous amount of requirements put on people who are seeking citizenship. For example, a 6-month tourist Visa doesn't require the same health checks that permanent citizenship does, even though you can spread whatever diseases you have in 6 months that you could if you moved here for good. The laws involved are just stoopid.
| 167 |
Daniel Ballard Sat, Aug 28, 2010 9:55:34pm |
One more...
Inner Disarmament
Robert Thurman: How does one counteract violence without hatred or anger?
Dalai Lama: The antidote to hatred in the heart, the source of violence, is tolerance. Tolerance is an important virtue of bodhisattvas [enlightened heroes and heroines] -- it enables you to refrain from reacting angrily to the harm inflicted on you by others. You could call this practice "inner disarmament," in that a well-developed tolerance makes you free from the compulsion to counterattack. For the same reason, we also call tolerance the "best armor," since it protects you from being conquered by hatred itself.
| 168 |
swamprat Sat, Aug 28, 2010 9:55:51pm |
re: #163 SanFranciscoZionist
OOOH!
Nicely done!
(golf clap)
| 169 |
SanFranciscoZionist Sat, Aug 28, 2010 9:56:48pm |
re: #168 swamprat
OOOH!
Nicely done!
(golf clap)
I think I probably shouldn't have brought up Wright.
I just hate Jerry Falwell very, very much.
| 170 |
Stanghazi Sat, Aug 28, 2010 9:57:00pm |
Glenn Beck is pining for Pat Robertson's place on the 700 club. But it won't be the 700 club - it will be the "Evangelical portion" of Fox News.
Like the commentary portion, and the news portion. Just a press release away.
| 171 |
Lidane Sat, Aug 28, 2010 9:57:09pm |
| 172 |
Walter L. Newton Sat, Aug 28, 2010 9:58:21pm |
re: #162 swamprat
Charles Rush came with friends from Tennessee for the rally and thought there was no problem that the event coinciding with the anniversary of King's famous speech.
He said he respected Martin Luther King, adding: "Who is to say Glenn Beck is not as good as Martin Luther King, or better?"
Count me as one who says that Glenn Beck is not as good as Dr. Martin Luther King.
I thought moral relativism was a "liberal" tool.
Interesting, Ms. Alveda King (MLK's niece) was at the rally, and spoke from the stage, and she seemed quite happy with the whole event.
| 173 |
swamprat Sat, Aug 28, 2010 9:58:49pm |
re: #166 elbruce
I just want a rational, standardized policy. I am against law-by-whim or law-by-current-fad.
| 174 |
Stanghazi Sat, Aug 28, 2010 9:58:55pm |
re: #172 Walter L. Newton
Interesting, Ms. Alveda King (MLK's niece) was at the rally, and spoke from the stage, and she seemed quite happy with the whole event.
LOL, you are here!
| 175 |
spikester Sat, Aug 28, 2010 9:59:04pm |
re: #164 Rightwingconspirator
if evolution is good enough for MLK then buy Gawd it's good enough for me!
| 176 |
Walter L. Newton Sat, Aug 28, 2010 9:59:55pm |
re: #174 Stanley Sea
LOL, you are here!
What? Was I suppose to be some where else? I just got home from work.
| 177 |
Stanghazi Sat, Aug 28, 2010 10:00:40pm |
re: #172 Walter L. Newton
Alveda has dismissed her late aunt Coretta Scott King’s position that MLK would have supported marriage equality by saying, “I’ve got his DNA. She doesn’t.”
carry on.
| 178 |
Daniel Ballard Sat, Aug 28, 2010 10:00:55pm |
re: #175 spikester
if evolution is good enough for MLK then buy Gawd it's good enough for me!
Add inspiration to natural selection. and you have a powerful combination.
| 179 |
Dark_Falcon Sat, Aug 28, 2010 10:01:17pm |
re: #162 swamprat
Charles Rush came with friends from Tennessee for the rally and thought there was no problem that the event coinciding with the anniversary of King's famous speech.
He said he respected Martin Luther King, adding: "Who is to say Glenn Beck is not as good as Martin Luther King, or better?"
Count me as one who says that Glenn Beck is not as good as Dr. Martin Luther King.
I thought moral relativism was a "liberal" tool.
It's a tool used by those who are morally confused, which is most of those who attended Beck's rally.
| 180 |
Cato the Elder Sat, Aug 28, 2010 10:01:35pm |
re: #172 Walter L. Newton
Interesting, Ms. Alveda King (MLK's niece) was at the rally, and spoke from the stage, and she seemed quite happy with the whole event.
Being the niece of someone doesn't mean squat, or do you think that Kennedys deserve deference for the name?
| 182 |
elbruce Sat, Aug 28, 2010 10:02:22pm |
re: #145 Spare O'Lake
No, I mean tell me what you really think of Obama's utter repudiation of his long-time pastor Rev. Wright.
Democrat makes what he considers to be a judicious retreat. Democrats rolling over and playing dead at wingnuts' barking slander attacks is hardly news, before or after that incident. It's merely one of many.
| 183 |
HappyBenghazi Sat, Aug 28, 2010 10:02:49pm |
re: #169 SanFranciscoZionist
I think I probably shouldn't have brought up Wright.
I just hate Jerry Falwell very, very much.
Who can blame ya? I seriously gained a ton of respect for John Warner when I learned that he pissed Falwell and Robertson both off.
| 184 |
elbruce Sat, Aug 28, 2010 10:03:20pm |
re: #177 Stanley Sea
Alveda has dismissed her late aunt Coretta Scott King’s position that MLK would have supported marriage equality by saying, “I’ve got his DNA. She doesn’t.”
Wasn't MLK's whole point that who a person is isn't encoded in their DNA?
| 185 |
Daniel Ballard Sat, Aug 28, 2010 10:04:30pm |
re: #181 spikester
Yes, I stand in admiration of the sentiment and the man.
I'm not expressing myself real well today.
| 186 |
HappyBenghazi Sat, Aug 28, 2010 10:04:59pm |
re: #184 elbruce
Wasn't MLK's whole point that who a person is isn't encoded in their DNA?
"not by their race but by the content of their character." I know she's his niece but I want to know where she got from her uncle's message that it's okay to discriminate against gay people.
| 187 |
Cato the Elder Sat, Aug 28, 2010 10:05:10pm |
re: #184 elbruce
Wasn't MLK's whole point that who a person is isn't encoded in their DNA?
And how does a niece have her uncle's DNA.
Racist bitch.
| 188 |
Walter L. Newton Sat, Aug 28, 2010 10:06:44pm |
re: #177 Stanley Sea
Alveda has dismissed her late aunt Coretta Scott King’s position that MLK would have supported marriage equality by saying, “I’ve got his DNA. She doesn’t.”
carry on.
What I find interesting, is some of the mockery of Ms. King's spiritual language that I have been seeing. Sort of making fun of some of her choice of words and phrases. That bothers me, considering that the sort of evangelical liturgical rhetoric that Ms. King was using (and probably uses regularly) is very much the language of millions of black in their churches every Sunday. I know if I were to make fun of a African-American in regards to their manor of worship, all hell would break loose.
Just because Ms. King opted to stand on the platform at this rally and speak, suddenly she is open season for mocking her spirituality.
| 189 |
SanFranciscoZionist Sat, Aug 28, 2010 10:07:07pm |
re: #187 Cato the Elder
And how does a niece have her uncle's DNA.
Racist bitch.
Shares DNA from their common ancestor, she clearly means, but whatever.
Figuring out what the dead would have wanted is always a bit of a crapshoot, but I have faith in Coretta's understanding of her husband's heart.
| 190 |
SanFranciscoZionist Sat, Aug 28, 2010 10:08:48pm |
re: #188 Walter L. Newton
What I find interesting, is some of the mockery of Ms. King's spiritual language that I have been seeing. Sort of making fun of some of her choice of words and phrases. That bothers me, considering that the sort of evangelical liturgical rhetoric that Ms. King was using (and probably uses regularly) is very much the language of millions of black in their churches every Sunday. I know if I were to make fun of a African-American in regards to their manor of worship, all hell would break loose.
Just because Ms. King opted to stand on the platform at this rally and speak, suddenly she is open season for mocking her spirituality.
Who's been making fun of her spirituality? I assume she's religiously quite sincere, I just think her decision to lend herself and her uncle's name to Glenn Beck is a terrible one.
| 191 |
Stanghazi Sat, Aug 28, 2010 10:09:47pm |
re: #84 Stanley Sea
Forgive me for quoting myself. But on this day, the 47th Anniversary of MLK's speech, and Glenn Beck's hijacking of same, I must respond to any disparagement of Coretta Scott King, even if 9 degrees seperated.
Please click.
[Link: www.artnet.com...]
[Link: www.jofreeman.com...]
| 192 |
Cato the Elder Sat, Aug 28, 2010 10:10:01pm |
re: #188 Walter L. Newton
What I find interesting, is some of the mockery of Ms. King's spiritual language that I have been seeing. Sort of making fun of some of her choice of words and phrases. That bothers me, considering that the sort of evangelical liturgical rhetoric that Ms. King was using (and probably uses regularly) is very much the language of millions of black in their churches every Sunday. I know if I were to make fun of a African-American in regards to their manor of worship, all hell would break loose.
Just because Ms. King opted to stand on the platform at this rally and speak, suddenly she is open season for mocking her spirituality.
And suddenly you're all about not mocking spirituality?
Hmm.
| 193 |
SanFranciscoZionist Sat, Aug 28, 2010 10:10:19pm |
re: #191 Stanley Sea
Forgive me for quoting myself. But on this day, the 47th Anniversary of MLK's speech, and Glenn Beck's hijacking of same, I must respond to any disparagement of Coretta Scott King, even if 9 degrees seperated.
Please click.
[Link: www.artnet.com...]
[Link: www.jofreeman.com...]
They're so young in that first picture.
| 194 |
swamprat Sat, Aug 28, 2010 10:10:22pm |
re: #172 Walter L. Newton
No matter how polite Ms. Alveda King, the much vaunted Glenn Beck will always stand in Martin Luther King's shadow. Always. And I do not dislike Glenn Beck. He is an entertainer who speaks for three solid hours a day. If anybody talks that long every day, he will say someting stupid. Glenn says much. It is not all hate and rhetoric, some of it is good.
| 195 |
b_snark Sat, Aug 28, 2010 10:10:48pm |
re: #184 elbruce
Wasn't MLK's whole point that who a person is isn't encoded in their DNA?
I guess the 25% of Alveda's DNA she shares with her uncle contains the genetic memory that gives her special knowledge of MLK.
| 196 |
Stanghazi Sat, Aug 28, 2010 10:10:56pm |
re: #188 Walter L. Newton
What I find interesting, is some of the mockery of Ms. King's spiritual language that I have been seeing. Sort of making fun of some of her choice of words and phrases. That bothers me, considering that the sort of evangelical liturgical rhetoric that Ms. King was using (and probably uses regularly) is very much the language of millions of black in their churches every Sunday. I know if I were to make fun of a African-American in regards to their manor of worship, all hell would break loose.
Just because Ms. King opted to stand on the platform at this rally and speak, suddenly she is open season for mocking her spirituality.
Walter, YOU are the one who keeps bringing her up. Uh, to stir up conversation?
| 197 |
b_snark Sat, Aug 28, 2010 10:11:52pm |
re: #187 Cato the Elder
And how does a niece have her uncle's DNA.
Racist bitch.
She'll have roughly 25% shared DNA.
| 198 |
boredtechindenver Sat, Aug 28, 2010 10:12:02pm |
re: #196 Stanley Sea
Walter, YOU are the one who keeps bringing her up. Uh, to stir up conversation?
He's just sharing his concerns.
| 199 |
Daniel Ballard Sat, Aug 28, 2010 10:12:49pm |
re: #194 swamprat
The guy is all but calling for a straight Christian theocracy for the US. Anathema to our principles, and gets a freaking pass from the MSM.
| 200 |
spikester Sat, Aug 28, 2010 10:12:58pm |
hash oil on my e-cig's kicking in
knight lizards
| 201 |
Cato the Elder Sat, Aug 28, 2010 10:13:03pm |
re: #194 swamprat
No matter how polite Ms. Alveda King, the much vaunted Glenn Beck will always stand in Martin Luther King's shadow. Always. And I do not dislike Glenn Beck. He is an entertainer who speaks for three solid hours a day. If anybody talks that long every day, he will say someting stupid. Glenn says much. It is not all hate and rhetoric, some of it is good.
He is not an entertainer anymore. He is a bought-and-paid-for shill for the fascist Murdoch empire.
Get your facts straight.
| 202 |
sagehen Sat, Aug 28, 2010 10:13:19pm |
re: #99 Spare O'Lake
Not at all. He tried it, it didn't work, he learned from it, so should you.
Didn't work? Excuse me?
Foreigners' views of America -- across the board, every single country in the world -- are way up over the last two years. When our president travels, he's greeted with cheers and people waving American flags.
Pakistan is being more helpful in fighting Taliban than it has been for years. (not as much as we'd like, certainly -- but more than they had been). Yemen's being helpful. In Nigeria, a would-be terrorist's own *father* came to us to turn him in.
Russia and China are backing our play on Iranian sanctions, which they hadn't been willing to do for years and years under the previous administration.
Netanyahu and Abbas are sitting down for peace talks.
That's not "spit in his eye."
| 203 |
swamprat Sat, Aug 28, 2010 10:14:33pm |
re: #195 b_sharp
re: #184 elbruce
Wasn't MLK's whole point that who a person is isn't encoded in their DNA?
I guess the 25% of Alveda's DNA she shares with her uncle contains the genetic memory that gives her special knowledge of MLK.
King's ENTIRE point was that PEOPLE are more important than their DNA!
| 204 |
blueraven Sat, Aug 28, 2010 10:14:52pm |
re: #5 darthstar
Hey Glenn Beck...Jesus thinks you're an asshole too.
Heh...Austin Lounge Lizards: Jesus loves me, but he cant stand you
| 205 |
Stanghazi Sat, Aug 28, 2010 10:14:59pm |
re: #200 spikester
hash oil on my e-cig's kicking in
knight lizards
funny, the lengths we go to. !!!
| 206 |
elbruce Sat, Aug 28, 2010 10:15:00pm |
re: #116 lostlakehiker
Not from me. I favor more immigration by people who, one by one and as individuals, can contribute skills we're short on. The more of those, the better.
It's not just a question of skills. You pick a hundred-yard row of lettuce in an hour. Or clean 100 hotel rooms in a 3 hour shift. The work ethic of immigrants today is in line with the work ethic of historical immigrants, which is to say, through the roof from the perspective of natural-born Americans.
re: #116 lostlakehiker
Our illegal immigrants include folk like that, but mixed in with others who contribute more to the crime rate than anything...
That's a red herring. The crime rate among illegal immigrants is lower than for the legal population. That's a really obvious fact, if you think about it for just a moment. And aren't a racist bigot...
re: #173 swamprat
I just want a rational, standardized policy. I am against law-by-whim or law-by-current-fad.
You need to hit the big "reset" button to deal with the people who have already painted themselves into an untenable corner.
But unlike Reagan's amnesty, you also at the same time need to make a significant change in policy or else you're going to find yourself right back in the same situation that made amnesty necessary in another generation.
To just have an immigration amnesty without also changing immigration policy going fowards just punts the problem to the next generation, as Reagan's action proved.
| 207 |
prairiefire Sat, Aug 28, 2010 10:16:19pm |
| 208 |
jaunte Sat, Aug 28, 2010 10:16:27pm |
re: #203 swamprat
re: #184 elbruce
Wasn't MLK's whole point that who a person is isn't encoded in their DNA?
King's ENTIRE point was that PEOPLE are more important than their DNA!
His niece may have a political point of view that prevents her from accepting that.
“Supporting gay marriage will lead to genocide and the extinction of the human race”
[Link: cherrygrrl.com...]
| 209 |
Daniel Ballard Sat, Aug 28, 2010 10:17:06pm |
re: #205 Stanley Sea
Dark Side Of The Moon and good headphones here...
| 210 |
b_snark Sat, Aug 28, 2010 10:17:53pm |
re: #189 SanFranciscoZionist
Shares DNA from their common ancestor, she clearly means, but whatever.
Figuring out what the dead would have wanted is always a bit of a crapshoot, but I have faith in Coretta's understanding of her husband's heart.
MLK and his sibling shares 50%. Alveda shares 50% of that sibling's (mother or father) DNA. 50% of 50% is 25%.
I think biologists are still looking for the allele that gives us our civil rights attitude. //
| 211 |
simoom Sat, Aug 28, 2010 10:18:13pm |
re: #172 Walter L. Newton
Interesting, Ms. Alveda King (MLK's niece) was at the rally, and spoke from the stage, and she seemed quite happy with the whole event.
While I imagine Glenn Beck was happy to have his event receive the implicit endorsement and legitimacy that Alveda's last name brings, her presence makes sense even ignoring that. Alveda is a Senior Fellow at a conservative DC think tank, a member of religious right anti-abortion activist groups, and is an anti-gay rights campaigner. Her presence makes sense even just as a fellow traveler to Beck's Christian nationalist politics.
[Link: littlegreenfootballs.com...]
| 212 |
Walter L. Newton Sat, Aug 28, 2010 10:18:25pm |
re: #190 SanFranciscoZionist
Who's been making fun of her spirituality? I assume she's religiously quite sincere, I just think her decision to lend herself and her uncle's name to Glenn Beck is a terrible one.
re: #183 elbruce
"ALVEDA KING: Somebody called me, I don't know if it was yesterday or today, and they said put on the full armor and that's the helmet of salvation, sword of the spirit, breastplate of righteousness, girdle of truth, sandals of the gospel of peace and the shield of faith.
"Sandals of the gospel of truth?" Is there an outlet mall for this stuff?
| 213 |
elbruce Sat, Aug 28, 2010 10:18:34pm |
re: #195 b_sharp
I guess the 25% of Alveda's DNA she shares with her uncle contains the genetic memory that gives her special knowledge of MLK.
| 214 |
prairiefire Sat, Aug 28, 2010 10:18:35pm |
| 215 |
CarleeCork Sat, Aug 28, 2010 10:18:40pm |
(Santa) God DAMN this country!!!!!
(Santa) God DAMN a country that would intentionally infect a man with syphilis. (Santa) God DAMN a country that would treat a man/woman like a second class citizen for having dark skin. (Santa) God DAMN a country that would murder others and steal their land because (Santa) God told them to.
Glen Beck is a PIG.
| 216 |
Cato the Elder Sat, Aug 28, 2010 10:19:19pm |
re: #208 jaunte
His niece may have a political point of view that prevents her from accepting that.
“Supporting gay marriage will lead to genocide and the extinction of the human race”
And on that note of pure crazee, I'm going to bed to read a sane book.
| 217 |
Stanghazi Sat, Aug 28, 2010 10:19:23pm |
Oh, MLK III penned this today:
Although he was a profoundly religious man, my father did not claim to have an exclusionary "plan" that laid out God's word for only one group or ideology. He marched side by side with members of every religious faith. Like Abraham Lincoln, my father did not claim that God was on his side; he prayed humbly that he was on God's side.
I picked one paragraph. Here's the whole thing
[Link: www.timesunion.com...]
| 218 |
Ben G. Hazi Sat, Aug 28, 2010 10:20:01pm |
re: #89 webevintage
You know what?
Today was just offensive.
Fuck Glen Beck.
I wouldn't fuck Glenn Beck with a stolen dick...
/George Carlin
| 219 |
Stanghazi Sat, Aug 28, 2010 10:20:20pm |
re: #209 Rightwingconspirator
Dark Side Of The Moon and good headphones here...
heaven, or whatever is close. yeah!
| 220 |
swamprat Sat, Aug 28, 2010 10:20:43pm |
re: #201 Cato the Elder
But we still agree that Dr. Martin Luther King was of greater stature that the stooge of R. Murdoch.
Glad to see that you're still crustier than a loaf of French bread.
| 221 |
sagehen Sat, Aug 28, 2010 10:24:31pm |
re: #124 lostlakehiker
Wouldn't it be simpler to have a "law of return" that says that anyone, anywhere, who doesn't have a criminal record, may come to the U.S. and be granted citizenship? Why mess around with any sort of brakes on immigration? This policy cuts to the chase.
They're paying %10-15k apiece to the coyotes, might as well have them pay us instead.
But this "back of the line" crap is just that, crap. The country of origin immigration quotas are, if not deliberately racist, then just geographically absurd. Mexico gets 25000 a year. There's a 15 year backlog, they're just now starting to process the 1996 applications. NAFTA should earn them much looser standards (and larger numbers by a couple degrees of magnitude) than we give to EU persons.
| 222 |
prairiefire Sat, Aug 28, 2010 10:25:30pm |
re: #193 SanFranciscoZionist
They're so young in that first picture.
Not a line on their faces, God bless them.
| 223 |
SanFranciscoZionist Sat, Aug 28, 2010 10:26:06pm |
| 224 |
Daniel Ballard Sat, Aug 28, 2010 10:27:12pm |
re: #221 sagehen
Any nation must have the ability to scale immigration to the economy among other factors. Given the vast number of illegal immigrants, quotas like you refer to are impossible to sustain. Catch 22.
| 225 |
Dark_Falcon Sat, Aug 28, 2010 10:27:33pm |
I'm gonna sign off. I don't have anything original left to say on this topic. Goodnight, all.
| 226 |
yasharki Sat, Aug 28, 2010 10:27:37pm |
re: #194 swamprat
"Glenn says much. It is not all hate and rhetoric, some of it is good."
Can you quote some of that good stuff please?
| 227 |
Velvet Elvis Sat, Aug 28, 2010 10:28:10pm |
Big priorities need to be keeping families together and letting kids who graduate from high school here go to college, a la the "Dream Act."
You need to hit the big "reset" button to deal with the people who have already painted themselves into an untenable corner.
But unlike Reagan's amnesty, you also at the same time need to make a significant change in policy or else you're going to find yourself right back in the same situation that made amnesty necessary in another generation.
To just have an immigration amnesty without also changing immigration policy going fowards just punts the problem to the next generation, as Reagan's action proved.
| 228 |
Walter L. Newton Sat, Aug 28, 2010 10:28:39pm |
re: #226 yasharki
"Glenn says much. It is not all hate and rhetoric, some of it is good."
Can you quote some of that good stuff please?
"Thank you for watching... and goodnight."
| 229 |
sagehen Sat, Aug 28, 2010 10:28:39pm |
re: #134 prairiefire
Thanks!
I saw Mrs. King twice in one day. She was on campus to dedicate a new piece of sculpture on campus. She was amazing. More to post on that later.
She was the commencement speaker at my college graduation, and I found her incredibly disappointing. It was 1984, and she said almost nothing about her husband, or what she's done to carry on his work since his death -- it was a Jesse Jackson campaign speech. To add insult to injury, Bishop Tutu was sitting right there on the podium, got an honorary degree, and he *didn't* make a speech.
| 230 |
Cato the Elder Sat, Aug 28, 2010 10:29:05pm |
re: #217 Stanley Sea
Like Abraham Lincoln, my father did not claim that God was on his side; he prayed humbly that he was on God's side.
And that is the difference, right there.
Good night, Lizards, and never stop laughing at fools.
| 231 |
Daniel Ballard Sat, Aug 28, 2010 10:34:11pm |
re: #230 Cato the Elder
And that is the difference, right there.
Good night, Lizards, and never stop laughing at fools.
And with that excellent advice, I'm out for the night. Be well all...
| 232 |
swamprat Sat, Aug 28, 2010 10:34:38pm |
re: #226 yasharki
There is a clip on this very thread where he talks of pre-historic cities of large size found in Ohio. And of William Penn forging a peace with Pennsylvanian Indians based on equality. The link is on post 48 by freetoken.
| 233 |
Stanghazi Sat, Aug 28, 2010 10:34:53pm |
OT, but interesting to me. Twitter and your "followers"
I'm a huge Florida Gator. Percy Harvin, currently playing for the Vikings has debilitating migraines. He's an awesome player, but it's bad.
Harvin was a controversial draft pick after he tested positive for marijuana use at the February scouting combine. But as it turned out, the biggest problem he encountered was an intensification of migraine headaches that has plagued him for much of his life. Migraines caused him to miss the Vikings’ rookie mini camp, the NFL’s rookie symposium and a game against Cincinnati last month.
I follow the NFL on twitter. They tweeted that recently Percy had to be carted off the practice field due to a seizure from a migraine. I tweeted back: Let him smoke the dope!! Now I have as a follower, United Marijuana.
Interesting.
| 234 |
sagehen Sat, Aug 28, 2010 10:35:29pm |
re: #163 SanFranciscoZionist
I'll tell you what I think of Obama dropping Wright when you tell me what you think of George Bush praising a man who called 9/11 'probably deserved'.
(Hint, I have similar feelings about both actions.)
Bush did a heck of a lot more than just "praise" that man -- he let him nominate federal judges and choose staff for the DoJ.
| 235 |
simoom Sat, Aug 28, 2010 10:38:26pm |
National monument history Fail:
Glenn Beck puts on his tin-foil art critic's hat -- again
Pointing to the place about 150 feet up the Egyptian-style obelisk, where the color of the stone suddenly changes, Beck gravely exhorted the crowd to note the "scar" on the founding president's memorial. It happened, he said, when construction was halted for the national trauma of the Civil War -- the apparent implication being that Saturday's rally would perform some necessary plastic surgery on race-related social divisions splitting the country.Well, close but no cigar. In fact the "scar" predates the Civil War.
Work on the long-planned Washington memorial was finally launched during the presidency of James K. Polk, a Democrat, in 1848. Costs for building blocks were being sponsored by citizens, states, territories, foreign dignitaries and others. But after six years of work, and long before completion (almost 30 years later), funds largely dried up. Construction didn't take place during the War Between the States, but it had already long-since stopped -- in 1854, six years before South Carolina seceded from the Union and nearly seven years before Confederates opened fire on Fort Sumter.
When building ceased, a private group of political activists grabbed the project's reins -- but they promptly made a huge mess of things. Among other problems, they were rabid anti-Catholic nativists, religious fanatics who believed only native-born Americans should hold any public office. They stoked popular fears that waves of Irish and German immigrants were overwhelming the United States.
When Pope Pius IX donated a building stone from the Temple of Concord in Rome for the restarted Washington Monument project, the activists had it destroyed. Through in-fighting, ideological division and bursts of election-related violence, the group fell apart after two years The shoddy work they had done on the monument had to be removed. Hence the "scar" we see today.
| 236 |
Cato the Elder Sat, Aug 28, 2010 10:40:19pm |
Rupert Murdoch is a fascist.
That fact stands beyond refute.
All who work for him are fascists,
or else they do it for the loot.
Copyright © 2010 Cato the Elder
| 237 |
sagehen Sat, Aug 28, 2010 10:40:54pm |
re: #194 swamprat
Glenn says much. It is not all hate and rhetoric, some of it is good.
"So other than that, Mrs Lincoln, how was the play?"
| 239 |
swamprat Sat, Aug 28, 2010 10:52:08pm |
re: #232 swamprat
Of course, this is all part of a coverup conspiracy, but that's just Beck.
| 240 |
Stanghazi Sat, Aug 28, 2010 10:55:57pm |
The Beck sermon, "Two Flights Down", is just beginning to be analyzed. It was that difficult...
Fact check! Religious phraseology!
| 242 |
Stanghazi Sat, Aug 28, 2010 11:06:03pm |
| 244 |
sagehen Sat, Aug 28, 2010 11:20:00pm |
| 245 |
(I Stand By What I Said Whatever It Was) Sat, Aug 28, 2010 11:32:09pm |
Islam doesn't factor in -- if you're a good Muslim, you'll kill Christians
Several times throughout the report, poor Nick Gillespie desperately tries to spin this as a "fundamentally non-political rally" but concedes attendants are "somewhat inarticulate".
| 246 |
(I Stand By What I Said Whatever It Was) Sat, Aug 28, 2010 11:32:57pm |
Errrm. First quote is at 2:02, second at 3:25. Damn timestamping didn't work.
| 247 |
elbruce Sat, Aug 28, 2010 11:58:20pm |
re: #224 Rightwingconspirator
Any nation must have the ability to scale immigration to the economy among other factors. Given the vast number of illegal immigrants, quotas like you refer to are impossible to sustain. Catch 22.
Beyond the very short term, immigrants add far more to the GDP than they take from it. America is what it is because of past waves of open immigration. The plaque on the Statue of Liberty doesn't say what it says for no reason. We're well due for another such wave, and need to stop fighting it.
| 250 |
bratwurst Sun, Aug 29, 2010 12:09:49am |
re: #249 simoom
The most idiotic t-shirt from the Restoring Honor rally?
[Link: gawker.com...]
He's really making a point there, isn't he?
| 252 |
elbruce Sun, Aug 29, 2010 12:35:48am |
re: #249 simoom
The most idiotic t-shirt from the Restoring Honor rally?
[Link: gawker.com...]
Dude can't even spell "Mauritania." I'm not going to check out his claims if he can't spell them.
| 253 |
(I Stand By What I Said Whatever It Was) Sun, Aug 29, 2010 12:37:42am |
Media Matters for America: Who's the Real Glenn Beck? Faux Civil Rights Icon or Fox Shock Jock?
| 254 |
elbruce Sun, Aug 29, 2010 12:40:41am |
Off topic, here are two comparative recessionary job curves I foind:
[Link: www.economicpopulist.org...]
Image: jobchg.jpg
Each of these consider the current recession to have started at the beginning of 2007. As such, Obama came on the scene in month 25 of the current recession. Looks like he's doing a pretty good job so far.
| 255 |
(I Stand By What I Said Whatever It Was) Sun, Aug 29, 2010 12:44:33am |
re: #37 simoom
I wonder if we'll be seeing any video from Beck's three hour "Divine Destiny" show which was held last night at the Kennedy Center. David Barton was co-hosting and I think it was supposed to be the even-more-religious preamble to his rally today.
Media Matters has some video:
| 256 |
tnguitarist Sun, Aug 29, 2010 12:55:34am |
The stuff about Alveda King pisses me off. Did she even know MLK?
There is nothing stronger than a bond between a husband and wife.
You choose your partner. You do not choose your genes.
| 257 |
elbruce Sun, Aug 29, 2010 12:57:43am |
Ned Beatty recruits Howard Beale Glenn Beck:
| 258 |
elbruce Sun, Aug 29, 2010 12:58:55am |
re: #256 tnguitarist
The stuff about Alveda King pisses me off. Did she even know MLK?
If she restricted her comments to personal impressions she had of him as a child that would be one thing. But to pretend that her opinions have more weight because of her family connections is nothing more than pure nepotism.
| 259 |
(I Stand By What I Said Whatever It Was) Sun, Aug 29, 2010 1:07:39am |
re: #257 elbruce
Ned Beatty recruits
Howard BealeGlenn Beck:
[Video]
But that's right before he becomes boring and then gets assasinated by the Terrorists for fun and profit! Before that NWO speech he is the Beck-man.
| 260 |
boxhead Sun, Aug 29, 2010 1:44:02am |
The sheer volume of madness that is going on and reported as real news is wearing on me. Glen Beck is about as genuine as Hulk Hogan. Why can't people see that? arrrrrrg
| 262 |
EdDantes Sun, Aug 29, 2010 3:29:38am |
re: #261 freetoken
Very good. I remember the Petula Clark version form my yout'. I have never heard of Judith Durham but she has a very nice voice.
| 263 |
freetoken Sun, Aug 29, 2010 3:32:08am |
re: #262 EdDantes
Ms. Durham was the lead singer for The Seekers:
One of the best musical groups to come from down under.
| 264 |
EdDantes Sun, Aug 29, 2010 3:32:17am |
re: #262 EdDantes
Very good. I remember the Petula Clark version form my yout'. I have never heard of Judith Durham but she has a very nice voice.
From.
PIMP
| 265 |
Cannadian Club Akbar Sun, Aug 29, 2010 3:33:36am |
Love him or hate him, Beck packed the mall. I personally don't care because:
1. I was at home.
2. My bathroom was always open.
3. See number 2
4. I watched the second million man march on Cspan. I waited 4 hours for Farrakan to speak. At that point I realized I was an idiot for waiting for 4 hours to listen to an idiot speak.
And good morning.
| 266 |
EdDantes Sun, Aug 29, 2010 3:34:58am |
re: #263 freetoken
I also grew up on the Seekers. I didn't know her name. My favorite Seekers song was," I'll never find another you".
| 268 |
Cannadian Club Akbar Sun, Aug 29, 2010 3:43:41am |
I'm running to the store before the hordes wake up. BBIAB.
| 269 |
EdDantes Sun, Aug 29, 2010 3:44:25am |
re: #265 Cannadian Club Akbar
Good morning. I didn't watch the Beck thing, nor did I follow this thread closely.
Many hate Beck. Fine. No problem. But you waited four hours to hear Farrakan?
Duuude.!
| 270 |
EdDantes Sun, Aug 29, 2010 3:51:28am |
re: #267 freetoken
Thanks. You're making me nostalgic for a great era in popular music. There was a variety back then that will never repeat in my lifetime. Brand new genres of Pop/Rock/soul/R&B/Country that blended with each other and were not mutually exclusive. The tolerance and appreciation in those days were unprecedented. We could use it today.
| 273 |
Fat Bastard Vegetarian Sun, Aug 29, 2010 4:24:12am |
re: #272 EdDantes
Ed? Who dat in your picture? Should I know? Am I going to be embarrassed that I asked?
| 274 |
EdDantes Sun, Aug 29, 2010 4:29:59am |
re: #273 Fat Bastard Vegetarian
Hey, young feller. You probably shouldn't know. When I was I was a toddler there was a TV show called The Count of Monte Cristo. The actor in my picture was the star, George Dolenz. His son was more famous. He is Mickey Dolenz: drummer and singer for The Monkees.
| 275 |
Fat Bastard Vegetarian Sun, Aug 29, 2010 4:32:32am |
re: #274 EdDantes
His son looked NOTHING! like him.
| 276 |
Darth Vader Gargoyle Sun, Aug 29, 2010 4:33:35am |
re: #265 Cannadian Club Akbar
Love him or hate him, Beck packed the mall. I personally don't care because:
1. I was at home.
2. My bathroom was always open.
3. See number 2
4. I watched the second million man march on Cspan. I waited 4 hours for Farrakan to speak. At that point I realized I was an crazy racist idiot for waiting for 4 hours to listen to an idiot speak.And good morning.
Fixd it for ya.
Good Morning Lizards!
| 278 |
EdDantes Sun, Aug 29, 2010 4:34:11am |
re: #275 Fat Bastard Vegetarian
His son looked NOTHING! like him.
True. I can only conclude that his mother was a pit bull.
| 279 |
Darth Vader Gargoyle Sun, Aug 29, 2010 4:34:47am |
re: #276 rwdflynavy
Fixd it for ya.
Good Morning Lizards!
PIMF, Farrakan is the crazy racist, not Cannadian, he just can't spell Canadian ; )
| 280 |
EdDantes Sun, Aug 29, 2010 4:35:37am |
| 281 |
Fat Bastard Vegetarian Sun, Aug 29, 2010 4:37:00am |
re: #280 EdDantes
Born in 55? Dang. You are old.
| 282 |
EdDantes Sun, Aug 29, 2010 4:38:20am |
| 283 |
Cannadian Club Akbar Sun, Aug 29, 2010 4:40:53am |
re: #279 rwdflynavy
PIMF, Farrakan is the crazy racist, not Cannadian, he just can't spell Canadian ; )
Oh shut it!!
//
I just walked a mile and a half. Got be a Big Breakfast from McDonalds, but I figure it even's out. And a coffee. My first cuppa in like 3 weeks!!
| 284 |
Cannadian Club Akbar Sun, Aug 29, 2010 4:43:19am |
re: #283 Cannadian Club Akbar
Oh shut it!!
//
I just walked a mile and a half. Got be a Big Breakfast from McDonalds, but I figure it even's out. And a coffee. My first cuppa in like 3 weeks!!
Got me= Got be, PIMF. I need to start drinking coffee again.
| 285 |
Cannadian Club Akbar Sun, Aug 29, 2010 4:48:17am |
Ya know, you can make a batch of pancakes ahead of time, let them cool and freeze them. Then nuke them as you need them. Add sausage to make it really good. Food for thought.
//lookie!! I made a funny!!
| 286 |
EdDantes Sun, Aug 29, 2010 4:55:06am |
re: #285 Cannadian Club Akbar
Ya know, you can make a batch of pancakes ahead of time, let them cool and freeze them. Then nuke them as you need them. Add sausage to make it really good. Food for thought.
//lookie!! I made a funny!!
A fine funny!
| 287 |
Fat Bastard Vegetarian Sun, Aug 29, 2010 4:57:03am |
re: #284 Cannadian Club Akbar
Got me= Got be, PIMF. I need to start drinking coffee again.
"Looks like I quit the wrong week to quit drinking coffee."
| 288 |
Fat Bastard Vegetarian Sun, Aug 29, 2010 4:58:32am |
re: #287 Fat Bastard Vegetarian
"Looks like I quit the wrong week to quit drinking coffee."
oh crap... how do you screw that up? really. I've had coffee...
| 289 |
Varek Raith Sun, Aug 29, 2010 4:58:52am |
re: #287 Fat Bastard Vegetarian
"Looks like I quit the wrong week to quit drinking coffee."
Hurricane Earl's gonna git us.
/
| 290 |
Cannadian Club Akbar Sun, Aug 29, 2010 4:59:57am |
re: #289 Varek Raith
Hurricane Earl's gonna git us.
/
Everything will be fine. I switched to a lower tar cigarette.
/Wait. What?
| 291 |
EdDantes Sun, Aug 29, 2010 5:00:34am |
re: #285 Cannadian Club Akbar
My favorite Canadian is Gordon Lightfoot. I know no one asked.
| 293 |
Cannadian Club Akbar Sun, Aug 29, 2010 5:02:22am |
re: #291 EdDantes
My favorite Canadian is Gordon Lightfoot. I know no one asked.
Nice Sunday morning tune..
| 294 |
Cannadian Club Akbar Sun, Aug 29, 2010 5:03:13am |
re: #291 EdDantes
My favorite Canadian is Gordon Lightfoot. I know no one asked.
And I am a Floridian. In case you didn't know.
| 295 |
Digital Display Sun, Aug 29, 2010 5:04:17am |
Good Morning Lizards! It's Moto GP out at the track today
| 296 |
Spare O'Lake Sun, Aug 29, 2010 5:04:25am |
re: #291 EdDantes
My favorite Canadian is Gordon Lightfoot. I know no one asked.
Pussywillows, cattails, soft winds and roses,
Rainpools in the woodland,
Water to my name,
| 297 |
Shiplord Kirel Sun, Aug 29, 2010 5:05:01am |
The detestable Phelper gang was hosed down with pepper spray as they attempted to desecrate a Marine's funeral in Omaha yesterday. My sympathy meter is registering zero, must be broken.
Man fires pepper spray on protesters outside Marine's funeral
The miscreant motorist who committed this outrage was arrested and charged with various contrived offenses. I suggest a jury trial.
| 298 |
Spare O'Lake Sun, Aug 29, 2010 5:05:09am |
re: #294 Cannadian Club Akbar
And I am a Floridian. In case you didn't know.
Isn't that part of Canada?
| 299 |
EdDantes Sun, Aug 29, 2010 5:05:27am |
re: #292 Spare O'Lake
Good morning America, how are ya?
Say, don't you know me I'm you're native son.
I'm the train they call the City of New Orleans,
Ill be gone five hundred miles when the day is done.
| 300 |
Cannadian Club Akbar Sun, Aug 29, 2010 5:05:48am |
| 301 |
Cannadian Club Akbar Sun, Aug 29, 2010 5:06:55am |
More Gordon. Love this drunk. Wait, what?
| 302 |
Varek Raith Sun, Aug 29, 2010 5:07:21am |
Man fires pepper spray on protesters outside Marine's funeral
(CNN) -- A motorist fired pepper spray Saturday at a group of demonstrators and counter-protesters outside a funeral for a U.S. Marine in Omaha, Nebraska, police said.The incident occurred shortly before 10 a.m. (11 a.m. ET) as members of a small Kansas church that protests at military funerals and counter-protesters stood nearly a block away from First United Methodist Church during services for Staff Sgt. Michael Bock, 26, who died August 13 in Afghanistan's Helmand province.
A man in a Ford-150 pickup truck drove by, extended his arm and sprayed with a large can, police said. His vehicle was stopped a few minutes later.
"Initial indications are he was probably targeting the Westboro Baptist Church" protesters, said officer Michael Pecha, a spokesman for Omaha police.
George Vogel, 62, who lives just north of Omaha, was booked for 16 counts of misdemeanor assault and one count of felony assault on a police officer for the pepper-spray exposure, police said. Vogel also faces one count of child neglect because his child was in the truck, Pecha told CNN.
| 303 |
EdDantes Sun, Aug 29, 2010 5:08:20am |
re: #294 Cannadian Club Akbar
And I am a Floridian. In case you didn't know.
I didn't know. But Gordon is still my favorite Canadian.
| 304 |
Cannadian Club Akbar Sun, Aug 29, 2010 5:08:37am |
re: #302 Varek Raith
Man fires pepper spray on protesters outside Marine's funeral
I say we raise bail for him.
| 305 |
Varek Raith Sun, Aug 29, 2010 5:09:01am |
re: #303 EdDantes
I didn't know. But Gordon is still my favorite Canadian.
Don't be fooled by CCA's PolishFloridaianCanuck tricks.
| 306 |
RogueOne Sun, Aug 29, 2010 5:09:02am |
re: #297 Shiplord Kirel
I'm going to a marines funeral in Knoxville tomorrow. Leaving in a couple hours.
| 307 |
Cannadian Club Akbar Sun, Aug 29, 2010 5:09:12am |
| 308 |
Cannadian Club Akbar Sun, Aug 29, 2010 5:09:55am |
re: #305 Varek Raith
Don't be fooled by CCA's PolishFloridaianCanuck tricks.
Why do you hate the Polish?
/
| 309 |
Spare O'Lake Sun, Aug 29, 2010 5:10:32am |
re: #301 Cannadian Club Akbar
More Gordon. Love this drunk. Wait, what?
[Video]
The way I feel is like a robin,
Whose babes have flown,
To come no more.
| 310 |
EdDantes Sun, Aug 29, 2010 5:10:33am |
re: #296 Spare O'Lake
Slanted rays and colored days stark blue horizons
Naked limbs and wheat bins hazy afternoons
| 311 |
Cannadian Club Akbar Sun, Aug 29, 2010 5:11:11am |
One more song. Then I'll stop. Josie.
| 312 |
Darth Vader Gargoyle Sun, Aug 29, 2010 5:11:17am |
re: #306 RogueOne
I'm going to a marines funeral in Knoxville tomorrow. Leaving in a couple hours.
I hope the Phelps idiots aren't there, for their sake!
| 313 |
Cannadian Club Akbar Sun, Aug 29, 2010 5:12:06am |
re: #312 rwdflynavy
I hope the Phelps idiots aren't there, for their sake!
Down here, bikers keep those douches at bay.
| 314 |
Varek Raith Sun, Aug 29, 2010 5:12:15am |
re: #312 rwdflynavy
I hope the Phelps idiots aren't there, for their sake!
Brink a paintball gun.
With paintballs filled with pepper spray.
Yeah, I'm a jerk.
:evilgrin:
| 315 |
Fat Bastard Vegetarian Sun, Aug 29, 2010 5:12:54am |
re: #297 Shiplord Kirel
GUILTY! I SENTENCE HIM TO FREE BLOWJOBS FOR LIFE!
| 316 |
Varek Raith Sun, Aug 29, 2010 5:13:41am |
re: #297 Shiplord Kirel
The detestable Phelper gang was hosed down with pepper spray as they attempted to desecrate a Marine's funeral in Omaha yesterday. My sympathy meter is registering zero, must be broken.
Man fires pepper spray on protesters outside Marine's funeral
The miscreant motorist who committed this outrage was arrested and charged with various contrived offenses. I suggest a jury trial.
Heh, how'd I miss this post???
XD
| 317 |
Cannadian Club Akbar Sun, Aug 29, 2010 5:14:04am |
re: #315 Fat Bastard Vegetarian
GUILTY! I SENTENCE HIM TO FREE BLOWJOBS FOR LIFE!
Don't you have something better to do with your time?
//now THAT'S funny.
| 318 |
EdDantes Sun, Aug 29, 2010 5:15:17am |
re: #293 Cannadian Club Akbar
I saw Gordon Lightfoot on his Sundown tour in May 1974, In Palo Alto, Ca. I will always remember it.
| 319 |
Cannadian Club Akbar Sun, Aug 29, 2010 5:16:09am |
Let's stick with Steeley Dan..
| 320 |
EdDantes Sun, Aug 29, 2010 5:17:14am |
| 321 |
RogueOne Sun, Aug 29, 2010 5:17:37am |
re: #312 rwdflynavy
I hope the Phelps idiots aren't there, for their sake!
It will be full of marines who would not be taking the peaceful route in expressing their displeasure. I'm certain they'll explain how they respect the phelps 1st amendment rights while stomping the hell out of them./
| 322 |
Cannadian Club Akbar Sun, Aug 29, 2010 5:17:46am |
re: #318 EdDantes
I saw Gordon Lightfoot on his Sundown tour in May 1974, In Palo Alto, Ca. I will always remember it.
I was gonna go. But I was only 6 and my dad wouldn't let me borrow the car. That and 3400 miles. Sucks to be me.
/
| 323 |
MandyManners Sun, Aug 29, 2010 5:18:17am |
Tax cuts are better given to people "who are going to go out and spend it," Biden said during a meeting with small business owners Wednesday at a Washington pizza restaurant.
"They're going to come in and buy a pizza, they're going to go buy a car, they're going to pay their electric bill, they’re going to make a payment to send their kid to school, they're going to buy school clothes…They're the people who need the money."
By contrast, he said, it’s wrong to give tax cuts to "people making over a million bucks a year. …They're spending all they’re going to spend anyway. Giving somebody in that top percentage bracket, giving them another $250,000 tax cut, they’re not going to spend that. They're not going to stimulate the economy."
SNIP
So, now the federal government gets to decide who needs their own money?
How does Biden know what the "wealthy" will do with their money? Does he have a crystal ball? The "wealthy" buy cars. The "wealthy" pay their electric bills. The "wealthy" eat pizza. The "wealthy" buy clothing for their kids. The "wealthy" send their kids to school. In fact, they probably spend more money than others on cars, clothes, electricity, pizza and tuition.
BTW, during the campaign, "rich" was defined as those making $250,000.00, then it was down-sized repeatedly, and bottomed out at around $79,000.000. I reckon Biden had to pump it up to $1,000,000.00 because either lower figure is easily attainable by small business owners.
| 324 |
EdDantes Sun, Aug 29, 2010 5:18:42am |
re: #305 Varek Raith
Don't be fooled by CCA's PolishFloridaianCanuck tricks.
Is that like the Jedi mind trick?
| 325 |
Varek Raith Sun, Aug 29, 2010 5:19:15am |
re: #322 Cannadian Club Akbar
I was gonna go. But I was only 6 and my dad wouldn't let me borrow the car. That and 3400 miles. Sucks to be me.
/
My excuse?
I was -9.
:P
| 326 |
Fat Bastard Vegetarian Sun, Aug 29, 2010 5:19:18am |
re: #317 Cannadian Club Akbar
Free mouthwash for FBV!
| 327 |
Spare O'Lake Sun, Aug 29, 2010 5:20:23am |
re: #318 EdDantes
I saw Gordon Lightfoot on his Sundown tour in May 1974, In Palo Alto, Ca. I will always remember it.
I got my mail late last night,
A letter from a girl who took the time to write,
To a lonesome boy somewhere in the night,
She sent me a railroad ticket too,
To take me to her lovin' arms,
And the big steel rail gonna carry me home
To the one I love.
| 328 |
Cannadian Club Akbar Sun, Aug 29, 2010 5:20:45am |
re: #326 Fat Bastard Vegetarian
Free mouthwash for FBV!
I gave you an upding because that is FUCKING FUNNY. Gross? Sure. BUT FUNNY!!
| 329 |
Cannadian Club Akbar Sun, Aug 29, 2010 5:21:12am |
| 330 |
MandyManners Sun, Aug 29, 2010 5:22:17am |
re: #323 MandyManners
I'm reminded of the "spread the wealth" comment from BHO. He seems to think that only the government is qualified to spread the wealth. Never mind that the government does not create wealth.
| 331 |
Fat Bastard Vegetarian Sun, Aug 29, 2010 5:22:27am |
re: #317 Cannadian Club Akbar
Guy walks into a bar. Says, "Bartender? Give me six shots of whiskey! I'm celebrating my first blowjob!"
Bartender says, "Here are seven shots then, the extra one's on the house!"
Guy says, "No thanks... I'm hoping six'll get the taste out."
| 332 |
Darth Vader Gargoyle Sun, Aug 29, 2010 5:22:37am |
Gotta jet, time to get the kids ready for church.
You all stay classy...too late.//
| 333 |
Varek Raith Sun, Aug 29, 2010 5:23:09am |
re: #332 rwdflynavy
Gotta jet, time to get the kids ready for church.
You all stay classy...too late.//
You take a jet to church?!?!
:)
| 335 |
Fat Bastard Vegetarian Sun, Aug 29, 2010 5:23:22am |
re: #330 MandyManners
(mandy? you didn't get the memo... it became about joe the plumber)...
| 336 |
MandyManners Sun, Aug 29, 2010 5:24:34am |
re: #335 Fat Bastard Vegetarian
(mandy? you didn't get the memo... it became about joe the plumber)...
To some, maybe. But, to others, the point was that BHO thinks government is more qualified to "spread the wealth" than those who make it.
| 337 |
EdDantes Sun, Aug 29, 2010 5:24:57am |
re: #327 Spare O'Lake
Well I've been out here many a long days I havent found a place that I could call my ownNot a two bit bed to lay my body on
I been stood up I been stood down
I been dragged into the sand
| 338 |
Spare O'Lake Sun, Aug 29, 2010 5:26:29am |
re: #330 MandyManners
I'm reminded of the "spread the wealth" comment from BHO. He seems to think that only the government is qualified to spread the wealth. Never mind that the government does not create wealth.
I don't know bout the wealth, but he's pretty good at spreading the manure.
| 339 |
Cannadian Club Akbar Sun, Aug 29, 2010 5:27:49am |
re: #331 Fat Bastard Vegetarian
Guy walks into a bar. Says, "Bartender? Give me six shots of whiskey! I'm celebrating my first blowjob!"
Bartender says, "Here are seven shots then, the extra one's on the house!"
Guy says, "No thanks... I'm hoping six'll get the taste out."
Guy goes into a bar and says, "Give me 3 shots and 3 beers". Bartender asked what the problem was. "I just found out my brother is gay".
A week later the guy goes in and ask for 6 beer and 6 shots. Bartender ask what is the problem. Guy says, "My other brother is gay".
A week later, the guy goes in and ask for 10 shots and 10 beers. The bartender says "Doesn't anyone in your family eay pussy"? The guy says, "Yes, my sister"!!
Charles, please delete this.
| 340 |
MandyManners Sun, Aug 29, 2010 5:28:07am |
re: #338 Spare O'Lake
I don't know bout the wealth, but he's pretty good at spreading the manure.
Aren't they the same when it comes to growing stuff?
| 341 |
MandyManners Sun, Aug 29, 2010 5:28:49am |
| 342 |
EdDantes Sun, Aug 29, 2010 5:29:08am |
re: #322 Cannadian Club Akbar
That is why I wasn't at Woodstock. Although I was in Ohio and 14 at the time. I could have dug myself driving there, smoking dope and wallowing in the rain and the piss and the sh*t.
That would have been epic.
| 343 |
Fat Bastard Vegetarian Sun, Aug 29, 2010 5:30:18am |
re: #342 EdDantes
Funny. I've seen the footage.
One of those historical moments where I'm glad I wasn't there.
Kind of like Hiroshima.
| 344 |
Spare O'Lake Sun, Aug 29, 2010 5:31:29am |
re: #337 EdDantes
Here I am with my hat in my hand,
Standin' on the broad highway...can you spare a dime
For a lonesome boy who missed the train last night?
I went into town
For one last round
And I gambled my ticket away
So the big steel rail won't carry me home
To the one I love.
| 345 |
Cannadian Club Akbar Sun, Aug 29, 2010 5:31:35am |
re: #342 EdDantes
That is why I wasn't at Woodstock. Although I was in Ohio and 14 at the time. I could have dug myself driving there, smoking dope and wallowing in the rain and the piss and the sh*t.
That would have been epic.
I'm actually glad when I was born. I would have been a hippie all my life if I were born earlier. Woodstock would have either killed me or worse, got me married!!
/
| 346 |
EdDantes Sun, Aug 29, 2010 5:31:51am |
re: #343 Fat Bastard Vegetarian
Funny. I've seen the footage.
One of those historical moments where I'm glad I wasn't there.
Kind of like Hiroshima.
Yeah. Better to wait for the album.
| 347 |
PhillyPretzel Sun, Aug 29, 2010 5:32:15am |
For SFV:
Ichabod [Link: encyclopedia.thefreedictionary.com...]
| 348 |
Cannadian Club Akbar Sun, Aug 29, 2010 5:32:42am |
| 349 |
Cannadian Club Akbar Sun, Aug 29, 2010 5:35:56am |
I am only 879 post from 18,000. I'd better get crackin'!!!
| 350 |
EdDantes Sun, Aug 29, 2010 5:36:43am |
re: #344 Spare O'Lake
I think it's "head in the sand" but you are taxing my memory! :)
| 351 |
Spare O'Lake Sun, Aug 29, 2010 5:37:08am |
re: #345 Cannadian Club Akbar
I'm actually glad when I was born. I would have been a hippie all my life if I were born earlier. Woodstock would have either killed me or worse, got me married!!
/
By the time we got to Woodstock we were half a million strong
And everywhere there was song and celebration.
| 353 |
Cannadian Club Akbar Sun, Aug 29, 2010 5:38:13am |
One more Steely Dan song
| 354 |
MandyManners Sun, Aug 29, 2010 5:38:17am |
re: #351 Spare O'Lake
By the time we got to Woodstock we were half a million strong
And everywhere there was song and celebration.
You're golden?
| 355 |
Cannadian Club Akbar Sun, Aug 29, 2010 5:39:28am |
re: #352 MandyManners
127,135
Oh, shut up. I didn't post for me first 2 or 3 years. Damn you woman!!
//
| 356 |
Spare O'Lake Sun, Aug 29, 2010 5:39:46am |
re: #350 EdDantes
I think it's "head in the sand" but you are taxing my memory! :)
Could be. I learned these old Lightfoot songs by ear, and I could've had it wrong all these years.
| 357 |
EdDantes Sun, Aug 29, 2010 5:40:17am |
| 358 |
EdDantes Sun, Aug 29, 2010 5:41:24am |
re: #356 Spare O'Lake
Could be. I learned these old Lightfoot songs by ear, and I could've had it wrong all these years.
That's what you get for loving me. :)
| 359 |
Spare O'Lake Sun, Aug 29, 2010 5:41:28am |
| 360 |
MandyManners Sun, Aug 29, 2010 5:41:51am |
re: #355 Cannadian Club Akbar
Oh, shut up. I didn't post for me first 2 or 3 years. Damn you woman!!
//
I can't help it if boys don't talk as early as girls.
| 361 |
Cannadian Club Akbar Sun, Aug 29, 2010 5:43:07am |
re: #360 MandyManners
I can't help it if boys don't talk as early as girls.
I don't mind that women talk, I just hate it when they don't shut up!!
/ducks
| 362 |
MandyManners Sun, Aug 29, 2010 5:43:07am |
| 363 |
PhillyPretzel Sun, Aug 29, 2010 5:45:06am |
re: #361 Cannadian Club Akbar
::: firing one at CCA center of mass :::
| 364 |
Fat Bastard Vegetarian Sun, Aug 29, 2010 5:45:13am |
re: #339 Cannadian Club Akbar
Funnier and cleaner?
"Doesn't anybody like women? "
"Yeah. My mom and my sister."
| 365 |
MandyManners Sun, Aug 29, 2010 5:45:25am |
re: #359 Spare O'Lake
If you're stardust, I'm golden.
Reminds me that I heard "Magnet and Steel" on the radio the other day.
| 366 |
MandyManners Sun, Aug 29, 2010 5:46:05am |
re: #361 Cannadian Club Akbar
I don't mind that women talk, I just hate it when they don't shut up!!
/ducks
*launches Stinger*
| 367 |
Cannadian Club Akbar Sun, Aug 29, 2010 5:48:20am |
| 368 |
MandyManners Sun, Aug 29, 2010 5:48:39am |
| 369 |
EdDantes Sun, Aug 29, 2010 5:48:54am |
re: #356 Spare O'Lake
Could be. I learned these old Lightfoot songs by ear, and I could've had it wrong all these years.
For years since I was 13 I thought Hendrix was saying, Excuse me while I kiss this guy!.
| 371 |
Fat Bastard Vegetarian Sun, Aug 29, 2010 5:49:30am |
re: #361 Cannadian Club Akbar
Careful man... saw a bumper sticker the other day...
I have PMS and a GPS; that means I’m a b***h who will find you.
| 372 |
Fat Bastard Vegetarian Sun, Aug 29, 2010 5:50:21am |
Well, I've told my dirty jokes... need to get ready for Church.
Bye kiddies.
| 373 |
MandyManners Sun, Aug 29, 2010 5:50:49am |
| 375 |
EdDantes Sun, Aug 29, 2010 5:52:30am |
| 376 |
Spare O'Lake Sun, Aug 29, 2010 5:53:44am |
re: #369 EdDantes
For years since I was 13 I thought Hendrix was saying, Excuse me while I kiss this guy!.
Yeah, but did you also think he was saying with a french accent "Fuck ze lady"?
| 377 |
MandyManners Sun, Aug 29, 2010 5:58:31am |
re: #375 EdDantes
Ziggy should be as cool! :)
Is it true that Bowie and Jagger were an item at one point?
| 378 |
Cannadian Club Akbar Sun, Aug 29, 2010 5:58:56am |
re: #374 Winny Spencer
Very nice choice. But I am sorry, I must ask. Are you a Sir of a Ma'am. For future reference. I am from the South and I have manners. (not sure where I got them!!)
| 379 |
MandyManners Sun, Aug 29, 2010 6:00:32am |
re: #378 Cannadian Club Akbar
Very nice choice. But I am sorry, I must ask. Are you a Sir of a Ma'am. For future reference. I am from the South and I have manners. (not sure where I got them!!)
*swoon*
Oh, wait. You mean the little "m" kind. Never mind.
| 380 |
Cannadian Club Akbar Sun, Aug 29, 2010 6:00:58am |
re: #377 MandyManners
Is it true that Bowie and Jagger were an item at one point?
[Video]
Mick Jagger could never have gotten a blow job from David Bowie if we wasn't a rock star. Wait. What?
/this is funny
| 381 |
EdDantes Sun, Aug 29, 2010 6:01:17am |
re: #376 Spare O'Lake
Yeah, but did you also think he was saying with a french accent "Fuck ze lady"?
Non! I knew of no zuch thingz.
| 382 |
PhillyPretzel Sun, Aug 29, 2010 6:01:18am |
re: #378 Cannadian Club Akbar
From a famous movie: Sir you are no gentleman and Madam you are no lady. :)
| 383 |
MandyManners Sun, Aug 29, 2010 6:02:32am |
re: #380 Cannadian Club Akbar
Mick Jagger could never have gotten a blow job from David Bowie if we wasn't a rock star. Wait. What?
/this is funny
Fame has its perks.
| 385 |
Cannadian Club Akbar Sun, Aug 29, 2010 6:03:39am |
| 386 |
Spare O'Lake Sun, Aug 29, 2010 6:06:05am |
re: #380 Cannadian Club Akbar
Mick Jagger could never have gotten a blow job from David Bowie if we wasn't a rock star. Wait. What?
/this is funny
Hey Joe, where you goin' with that gun in your hand?
| 387 |
pharmmajor Sun, Aug 29, 2010 6:08:27am |
re: #4 HappyWarrior
These people don't really believe in small government. They're mad because Obama hasn't expanded the government where they want it expanded. I'm sorry but I am skeptical of most self described small government conservatives.
There are no small government conservatives. Both conservatives and liberals want, as you said, government expanded to suit their own wants.
| 388 |
Digital Display Sun, Aug 29, 2010 6:08:56am |
re: #386 Spare O'Lake
Hey Joe, where you goin' with that gun in your hand?
They tried to make me go to rehab but I said 'no, no, no'
Yes I've been black but when I come back you'll know know know
I ain't got the time and if my daddy thinks I'm fine
He's tried to make me go to rehab but I won't go go go
I'd rather be at home with ray
I ain't got seventy days
Cause there's nothing
There's nothing you can teach me
That I can't learn from Mr Hathaway
I didn't get a lot in class
But I know it don't come in a shot glass
They tried to make me go to rehab but I said 'no, no, no
-Amy Winehouse
| 389 |
EdDantes Sun, Aug 29, 2010 6:09:19am |
re: #386 Spare O'Lake
I'm goin' down to shoot my ol' lady
(not really)
| 390 |
Cannadian Club Akbar Sun, Aug 29, 2010 6:11:07am |
re: #388 HoosierHoops
If anyone need rehab, it's her.
(already did my time there. My BP was 90/65)
| 391 |
EdDantes Sun, Aug 29, 2010 6:12:50am |
re: #382 PhillyPretzel
From a famous movie: Sir you are no gentleman and Madam you are no lady. :)
GWTW?
| 393 |
Spare O'Lake Sun, Aug 29, 2010 6:13:52am |
UNCLENCH!
Report: Iran demands change in attitude from the US
By JPOST.COM STAFF
08/29/2010 15:05
Iran on Sunday demanded that the US drop its aggressive attitude towards Teheran if it would like an improvement in relations between the two countries.
"If the US seriously seeks to revive relations with Iran, it should make changes in its attitude. Washington should prove that it will never repeat previous mistakes and will not pursue misguided and hostile policies towards the Iranian nations," said Iranian foreign ministry spokesperson Ramin Mehmanparast in comments to the Fars News Agency cited by Press TV.
He continued, "However, there is no reason to prepare the grounds for establishing relations at the time the US attacks other countries, violates rights of nations and sees its interest in war and massacre."
[Link: www.jpost.com...]
| 394 |
MandyManners Sun, Aug 29, 2010 6:14:45am |
re: #387 pharmmajor
There are no small government conservatives. Both conservatives and liberals want, as you said, government expanded to suit their own wants.
I don't exist?
| 395 |
RogueOne Sun, Aug 29, 2010 6:15:47am |
re: #387 pharmmajor
There are no small government conservatives. Both conservatives and liberals want, as you said, government expanded to suit their own wants.
just like there are very few, if any, politicians in either party who give a crap about individual liberties. They both are trying to save us from ourselves, one side of the aisle is worried about our souls while the other is worried about our health.
| 396 |
Cannadian Club Akbar Sun, Aug 29, 2010 6:16:55am |
re: #395 RogueOne
just like there are very few, if any, politicians in either party who give a crap about individual liberties. They both are trying to save us from ourselves, one side of the aisle is worried about our souls while the other is worried about our health.
Well said.
| 397 |
Cannadian Club Akbar Sun, Aug 29, 2010 6:18:04am |
re: #395 RogueOne
just like there are very few, if any, politicians in either party who give a crap about individual liberties. They both are trying to save us from ourselves, one side of the aisle is worried about our souls while the other is worried about our health.
And they can both go fuck themselves.
| 398 |
Spare O'Lake Sun, Aug 29, 2010 6:18:08am |
| 399 |
EdDantes Sun, Aug 29, 2010 6:21:26am |
re: #394 MandyManners
I don't exist?
You and I both exist. There are small government conservatives: they are just more difficult to find.Both parties have been corrupted by the power of big government. All parties must be wary of the reach of the federal power.
| 400 |
Cannadian Club Akbar Sun, Aug 29, 2010 6:24:12am |
re: #399 EdDantes
You and I both exist. There are small government conservatives: they are just more difficult to find.Both parties have been corrupted by the power of big government. All parties must be wary of the reach of the federal power.
The Bush White House surely didn't care about small gubment and the Obama one cares even less. Fucking damnit.
| 401 |
MandyManners Sun, Aug 29, 2010 6:25:32am |
Syria, Iran and North Korea: the tale of the bombing of the al-Kilbar reactor.
The "love affair" between Syria and North Korea started with the Korean prime minister's visit to Syria before the Gulf War, on then-President Hafez Assad's invitation. The two countries signed a military and technological cooperation agreement. Although the nuclear issue was brought up, Assad decided to put it aside and make do with developing chemical and biological weapons. During his father's funeral in June 2000, Bashar Assad met with members of the North Korean delegation. At that time, they started to secretly push forward the construction of the Syrian reactor. In July 2002, a three-way deal was finalized, with an Iranian representative pledging to finance the reactor's construction (roughly $2 billion.) As it turns out, for five years Israel's and America's intelligence agencies were in the dark.
SNIP
The "smoking gun" was found in August 2007. The clear-cut evidence was acquired by the elite Sayeret Matkal reconnaissance unit, which headed to the site under cover of darkness on board two helicopters. Nobody spotted the troops as they landed near Dir al-Zur. Using specialized equipment, they took several soil samples that contained radioactive materials. The findings were urgently relayed to US National Security Advisor Stephen Hadley, who was stunned by the revelations. He quickly summoned top experts to draw conclusions and report to President Bush during their morning meeting.
SNIP
The reactor was wiped out the next month.
| 402 |
MandyManners Sun, Aug 29, 2010 6:26:02am |
| 403 |
RogueOne Sun, Aug 29, 2010 6:26:20am |
I need to get ready to leave. See you folks in a couple days.
| 405 |
MandyManners Sun, Aug 29, 2010 6:27:41am |
re: #399 EdDantes
You and I both exist. There are small government conservatives: they are just more difficult to find.Both parties have been corrupted by the power of big government. All parties must be wary of the reach of the federal power.
Damn Skippy!
There are some who would paint that attitude with such an extreme brush to make us look like gap-toothed bigots who want to re-instate Jim Crow laws, and even slavery.
| 406 |
MandyManners Sun, Aug 29, 2010 6:28:04am |
| 407 |
MandyManners Sun, Aug 29, 2010 6:30:21am |
| 408 |
Cannadian Club Akbar Sun, Aug 29, 2010 6:32:17am |
I am gonna go for a while. Not mad at anyone here. Just need a nap.
| 409 |
Spare O'Lake Sun, Aug 29, 2010 6:33:54am |
re: #403 RogueOne
I need to get ready to leave. See you folks in a couple days.
Out on runway number nine,
Big 707 set to go
But I'm stuck here on the ground,
Where the pavement never grows
Well the liquor tasted good,
And the women all worked fast
Now there she goes my friend,
She's rollin' now at last.
BBL
| 410 |
EdDantes Sun, Aug 29, 2010 6:34:46am |
re: #400 Cannadian Club Akbar
The Bush White House surely didn't care about small gubment and the Obama one cares even less. Fucking damnit.
GW was a progressive (like his dad) . He didn't understand the limits of the federal gubment. Hoover was flawed in the same way. They all thought the government could solve our economic problems by spending. It has never worked.
In a downturn cut taxes. Do not increase taxes and government spending.
| 411 |
pharmmajor Sun, Aug 29, 2010 6:37:32am |
re: #394 MandyManners
I don't exist?
I apologize, I over-simplified. Let me rephrase my statement to say that the conservatives and liberals who get all this media attention don't want small government.
| 412 |
EdDantes Sun, Aug 29, 2010 6:38:22am |
re: #409 Spare O'Lake
You can't jump a jet plane,
like you can a freight train.
| 413 |
WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.] Sun, Aug 29, 2010 6:43:40am |
re: #92 SanFranciscoZionist
Falwell said the 9/11 attacks were 'probably deserved', and he got away with it.
Angry white guys = mainstream
angry black guys = dangerous radicals
| 414 |
MandyManners Sun, Aug 29, 2010 6:43:47am |
re: #408 Cannadian Club Akbar
I am gonna go for a while. Not mad at anyone here. Just need a nap.
I tried to get one yesterday but failed. Last night, I got about four hours of sleep.
| 415 |
EdDantes Sun, Aug 29, 2010 6:46:00am |
re: #405 MandyManners
Damn Skippy!
There are some who would paint that attitude with such an extreme brush to make us look like gap-toothed bigots who want to re-instate Jim Crow laws, and even slavery.
That is the price we must pay but I hope we can articulate this position in a way that is easily understood.It is in the best interests of everyone.This conservatives as bigots meme is old and untrue.
| 416 |
MandyManners Sun, Aug 29, 2010 6:46:04am |
re: #411 pharmmajor
I apologize, I over-simplified. Let me rephrase my statement to say that the conservatives and liberals who get all this media attention don't want small government.
And, the MFM attention people like Paul Ryan get from the likes of Krugman is infuriating.
| 417 |
(I Stand By What I Said Whatever It Was) Sun, Aug 29, 2010 6:47:06am |
Not only did I wonder, while watching some of the broadcast, how Muslims would feel with this monotheistic theocratic vision of America, ranging from the weird to the bizarre -- I also wondered how Buddhists, Polytheists and Atheists would feel.
| 418 |
MandyManners Sun, Aug 29, 2010 6:47:27am |
re: #415 EdDantes
That is the price we must pay but I hope we can articulate this position in a way that is easily understood.It is in the best interests of everyone.This conservatives as bigots meme is old and untrue.
Some bigots are Republicans. Some bigots are Democrats. Some bigots are Libertarians. Some bigots are apolitical.
| 419 |
Nervous Norvous Sun, Aug 29, 2010 6:48:40am |
Morning
| 421 |
Nervous Norvous Sun, Aug 29, 2010 6:53:25am |
re: #410 EdDantes
GW was a progressive (like his dad) . He didn't understand the limits of the federal gubment. Hoover was flawed in the same way. They all thought the government could solve our economic problems by spending. It has never worked.
In a downturn cut taxes. Do not increase taxes and government spending.
When the majority of our economy is based on consumer spending, who's going to spend any money with out having a job? Nobody's going to bloody hire without demand for labor no matter how cheap it is to hire them or how much money they have.
Supply side economics. To reality what Olive Garden is to real Italian food.
| 422 |
Digital Display Sun, Aug 29, 2010 6:56:21am |
The Little green football prayer list
On this day in History..
On Aug. 29, 1991, the Supreme Soviet, the parliament of the U.S.S.R., suspended all activities of the Communist Party, bringing an end to the institution.
Hurricane Katrina of the 2005 Atlantic hurricane season was the costliest natural disaster, as well as one of the five deadliest hurricanes, in the history of the United States.
Let us pray
AlbuSteve: Lord give Speedy healing and strength to Steve.
Buck: Father has a tumor and has little time left.. Comfort his family and welcome him in your arms.
Thanos: Grant healing and strength to our dear friend
Obdicut: My friend Pam, who's ovarian cancer has returned. She's going into chemo again. And she believes in the power of prayer.
Dark_Falcon: His Mother had a stroke..She is getting better.. Please heal her Lord
Jadespring: Dear Lord bring healing to a Sister.. Bring grace and strength to the Family.
We pray for your tender mercies
Wlewisiii: If you would pray as appropriate to your beliefs for John Freuh, his step-mother, my sister Elisabeth & his father Rick, I'd appreciate it.
Dear Lord..We ask you this day you bring healing and grace to SFZ’s Father and Mother-in-law..
Help her in the Job search and finding her a new Career. .
We know your love brings healing and life.
Ausador: Parents
Irenicum: Lord heal this family and bring comfort to them..
Guanxi88: Best wishes and lizard mojo to my wife's best friend. her father committed suicide not two weeks after her mother succumbed to cancer.
Reine: Health and Family.. Lord we ask you grant Reine’s Daughter a Special blessing..Look after her and grant grace.
gregb - 4 year old son who suffered a head injury last Friday and spent the
weekend in the ICU with some lingering effects all week.Jadespring: Our prayers go out to your sister…May she be healed
Baseballmom57: My God grant grace and healing to her son…
lurking faith… prayers for an aunt
Beekiller: Sister has been diagnosed with Cancer…We pray for a speedy recovery
FBV: Add my friend Jeff. Recently diagnosed with ALS. His family will watch him fade and die over the next three to five years. Wife and two kids (kids are young adults).
Veggie Update: For the prayer list, my daughter's boyfriend is going to be moved out of intensive care and into rehab (we hope!) next week... beginning of a long journey.
I want to add thanksgiving that they will be able to do his rehab locally. There was talk that he was going to be moved three to five hours away from his family.
Update: He moved his feet! This will be a long journey for the boy..Walk with him Lord
Prairiefire: Health for Family and friends
Mcspiff: if you could add my uncle to the list. He went in for surgery today and it didn't go so well. Extra organs had to come out, etc. Still just hearing bits and pieces now. But any prayers would be greatly appreciated.
Alouette’ Dear Father..His name in Hebrew is Pinhas ben Rivka. , and he is in congestive heart failure. He is 91 years old, and a WW2 Pacific vet.
Reloadingisnotahobby: Could add my parents?
They're in their 80's and slipping in to ALZ...Simultaneously
HoosierHoops: Bring peace and strength to Joe and his family
Thank you Lord..
Amen
| 423 |
EdDantes Sun, Aug 29, 2010 6:57:12am |
re: #418 MandyManners
Some bigots are Republicans. Some bigots are Democrats. Some bigots are Libertarians. Some bigots are apolitical.
Bigotry is all-inclusive! There are very shallow persons who want to paint their political adversaries with that brush.As a conservative I recognize (as do you) that no political movement has a monopoly on virtue. As a nation we should be able to debate these issues without resorting to labeling dissenter as "haters" and such.
| 424 |
Nervous Norvous Sun, Aug 29, 2010 7:01:33am |
re: #423 EdDantes
Bigotry is all-inclusive! There are very shallow persons who want to paint their political adversaries with that brush.As a conservative I recognize (as do you) that no political movement has a monopoly on virtue. As a nation we should be able to debate these issues without resorting to labeling dissenter as "haters" and such.
I think the styles of bigotry are different between groups though. The folks we saw at the Beck thing yesterday bigotry comes from feeling like their rightful place in society is being taken away from them. Liberal bigotry comes from the sense of "We must help those poor people, they can't help themselves".
One is from resentment, the other from condescension.
| 425 |
Nervous Norvous Sun, Aug 29, 2010 7:05:01am |
re: #423 EdDantes
Bigotry is all-inclusive! There are very shallow persons who want to paint their political adversaries with that brush.As a conservative I recognize (as do you) that no political movement has a monopoly on virtue. As a nation we should be able to debate these issues without resorting to labeling dissenter as "haters" and such.
It does strike me, however, that the vitriol coming from the right is generally much more vitriolic than that coming from the left in both quantity and quality.
| 426 |
Varek Raith Sun, Aug 29, 2010 7:08:07am |
Glenn Beck's America: Non-Christians need not apply.
| 427 |
MandyManners Sun, Aug 29, 2010 7:10:54am |
re: #421 PT Barnum
When the majority of our economy is based on consumer spending, who's going to spend any money with out having a job? Nobody's going to bloody hire without demand for labor no matter how cheap it is to hire them or how much money they have.
Supply side economics. To reality what Olive Garden is to real Italian food.
Well, Joe Biden says "wealthy" people don't spend money.
| 428 |
Nervous Norvous Sun, Aug 29, 2010 7:11:16am |
re: #426 Varek Raith
Glenn Beck's America: Non-Christians need not apply.
Except many of his constituents wouldn't recognize Glenn Beck as a Christian either.
| 429 |
MandyManners Sun, Aug 29, 2010 7:12:24am |
re: #423 EdDantes
Bigotry is all-inclusive! There are very shallow persons who want to paint their political adversaries with that brush.As a conservative I recognize (as do you) that no political movement has a monopoly on virtue. As a nation we should be able to debate these issues without resorting to labeling dissenter as "haters" and such.
I remember a time during the campaign when some professors (I think from Kansas or Missouri) claimed that to discuss whether BHO was a socialist was "racist".
| 430 |
EdDantes Sun, Aug 29, 2010 7:13:10am |
re: #421 PT Barnum
In an economic downturn what government should do is get out of the way. A tax holiday would give a major impetus to production that no amount of government spending can. Instead of the government spending money it doesn't
have, how about allowing business and consumers the cash to right itself and allow the capital to flow where it is needed?
| 431 |
Nervous Norvous Sun, Aug 29, 2010 7:13:50am |
re: #427 MandyManners
Well, Joe Biden says "wealthy" people don't spend money.
It's not that they don't spend money Mandy, but you have to look at volume as well. There are a lot more people without money than with right now. It's a matter of quantity as well as quality of demand.
| 432 |
Nervous Norvous Sun, Aug 29, 2010 7:15:35am |
re: #430 EdDantes
In an economic downturn what government should do is get out of the way. A tax holiday would give a major impetus to production that no amount of government spending can. Instead of the government spending money it doesn't
have, how about allowing business and consumers the cash to right itself and allow the capital to flow where it is needed?
If nobody has a job, how are they going to spend tax money they don't have to pay in the first place because they have no income? If nobody is buying the product, why would a company spend money on new equipment and employees?
| 433 |
Varek Raith Sun, Aug 29, 2010 7:15:43am |
Americans need to save money, not spend it.
| 434 |
MandyManners Sun, Aug 29, 2010 7:16:12am |
re: #431 PT Barnum
It's not that they don't spend money Mandy, but you have to look at volume as well. There are a lot more people without money than with right now. It's a matter of quantity as well as quality of demand.
That is true of EVERY era throughout history.
| 435 |
Nervous Norvous Sun, Aug 29, 2010 7:16:21am |
re: #433 Varek Raith
Americans need to save money, not spend it.
If you got no money in the first place, it's hard to save any.
| 436 |
MandyManners Sun, Aug 29, 2010 7:16:37am |
Speaking of spending. gotta' go give some to the evil tobacco companies.
| 437 |
Nervous Norvous Sun, Aug 29, 2010 7:16:48am |
re: #434 MandyManners
That is true of EVERY era throughout history.
and has led to some very messy revolutions at various times.
| 438 |
Varek Raith Sun, Aug 29, 2010 7:17:18am |
| 439 |
PhillyPretzel Sun, Aug 29, 2010 7:17:51am |
re: #433 Varek Raith
Saving money is good but do not go overboard. The Japanese learned the hard way about saving too much.
| 440 |
Nervous Norvous Sun, Aug 29, 2010 7:18:13am |
Let's say everyone starts saving instead of spending.
If no one is spending, how many companies go out of business for lack of revenue, leading to more people without jobs, and so on and so on.
| 441 |
Varek Raith Sun, Aug 29, 2010 7:19:34am |
| 442 |
EdDantes Sun, Aug 29, 2010 7:20:10am |
re: #425 PT Barnum
It does strike me, however, that the vitriol coming from the right is generally much more vitriolic than that coming from the left in both quantity and quality.
There is no way I can debate you on that. Both of those measures are beyond my ability to accurately quantify. You would have to be more specific in the right wing vitriol so I can compare to the left wing comparables.
| 444 |
Varek Raith Sun, Aug 29, 2010 7:21:10am |
| 445 |
PhillyPretzel Sun, Aug 29, 2010 7:22:10am |
re: #444 Varek Raith
No argument here. I am just saying moderation is the key.
| 446 |
Nervous Norvous Sun, Aug 29, 2010 7:24:41am |
re: #442 EdDantes
There is no way I can debate you on that. Both of those measures are beyond my ability to accurately quantify. You would have to be more specific in the right wing vitriol so I can compare to the left wing comparables.
The right wing tends to resort to more eliminationist rhetoric.
"I tell people don't kill all the liberals. Leave enough so we can have two on every campus -- living fossils -- so we will never forget what these people stood for." -- Rush Limbaugh
"I would have no problem with [New York Times editor Bill Keller] being sent to the gas chamber." -- Melanie Morgan
""[T]he day will come when unpleasant things are going to happen to a bunch of stupid liberals and it's going to be very amusing to watch." -- Lee Rogers
"And if Al Qaeda comes in here and blows you up, we're not going to do anything about it. We're going to say, look, every other place in America is off limits to you, except San Francisco. You want to blow up the Coit Tower? Go ahead." -- Bill O'Reilly
"Howard Dean should be arrested and hung for treason or put in a hole until the end of the Iraq war!"-- Michael Reagan
While you will find those on the extreme left saying similar things, they are not at the same level of volume or vitriol as the examples above, nor is there as avid an audience for this kind of rhetoric as there is on the right.
| 447 |
Digital Display Sun, Aug 29, 2010 7:24:45am |
Brad Pitt is on MTP in two minutes...
This ought to be good...
| 448 |
EdDantes Sun, Aug 29, 2010 7:25:00am |
re: #429 MandyManners
I remember a time during the campaign when some professors (I think from Kansas or Missouri) claimed that to discuss whether BHO was a socialist was "racist".
That is one of the dampers on free discussion we are faced with. Even though I voted for MCcain, I thought the election was an example of America at its greatest: we will elect a black man. I just disagree with him.
| 449 |
Varek Raith Sun, Aug 29, 2010 7:25:45am |
re: #446 PT Barnum
The right wing tends to resort to more eliminationist rhetoric.
"I tell people don't kill all the liberals. Leave enough so we can have two on every campus -- living fossils -- so we will never forget what these people stood for." -- Rush Limbaugh
"I would have no problem with [New York Times editor Bill Keller] being sent to the gas chamber." -- Melanie Morgan
""[T]he day will come when unpleasant things are going to happen to a bunch of stupid liberals and it's going to be very amusing to watch." -- Lee Rogers
"And if Al Qaeda comes in here and blows you up, we're not going to do anything about it. We're going to say, look, every other place in America is off limits to you, except San Francisco. You want to blow up the Coit Tower? Go ahead." -- Bill O'Reilly
"Howard Dean should be arrested and hung for treason or put in a hole until the end of the Iraq war!"-- Michael Reagan
While you will find those on the extreme left saying similar things, they are not at the same level of volume or vitriol as the examples above, nor is there as avid an audience for this kind of rhetoric as there is on the right.
O_o
Yeesh.
| 450 |
cronus Sun, Aug 29, 2010 7:26:34am |
re: #440 PT Barnum
Let's say everyone starts saving instead of spending.
If no one is spending, how many companies go out of business for lack of revenue, leading to more people without jobs, and so on and so on.
The problem is that consumers were also spending money they didn't have. Leveraging up through credit card debt and home refinancing. Because the savings rate for most households was anemic at best, consumer had little to no reserves to fall back on in a recession. The consumer has been deleveraging throughout the recession and along with unemployment it is the key factor that will prolong the recession. But you can hardly blame them, they just learned the hard way about living beyond your means.
| 451 |
EdDantes Sun, Aug 29, 2010 7:29:18am |
re: #446 PT Barnum
That is very damning stuff and I do not subscribe to it. Please post the links.
| 452 |
Nervous Norvous Sun, Aug 29, 2010 7:30:43am |
re: #429 MandyManners
I remember a time during the campaign when some professors (I think from Kansas or Missouri) claimed that to discuss whether BHO was a socialist was "racist".
To the extent that calling BHO a socialist was dog whistling, it was racist. The problem for many is that it's no longer acceptable to be overtly racist, so they must resort to pointing out other, obviously disengenuous things as a substitute for saying "But he's a {insert offensive racial epithet here}"
| 453 |
Digital Display Sun, Aug 29, 2010 7:34:44am |
Boy..Did Brad Pitt came off great in his MTP interview..That is so rare for a Star to that.. His make it right foundation is really world class....
Kudo's Brad
| 455 |
Vambo Sun, Aug 29, 2010 7:36:18am |
re: #4 HappyWarrior
I'm sorry but I am skeptical of most self described small government conservatives.
You should be. Those bitter old white people have more delusions of entitlement than Reagan's "Welfare Queens".
| 456 |
Digital Display Sun, Aug 29, 2010 7:36:32am |
| 458 |
EdDantes Sun, Aug 29, 2010 7:42:42am |
re: #432 PT Barnum
If nobody has a job, how are they going to spend tax money they don't have to pay in the first place because they have no income? If nobody is buying the product, why would a company spend money on new equipment and employees?
If the government would keep its hands out of everyone's pocket there would be more money in the market place. Also, capital markets like a little stability. They would like to know whether to invest in capital equipment and to hire more
employees or hang on to their capital.
" If nobody has a job?" They would have a job if the federal government would allow the capital markets to adjust . When the federal government "creates jobs" it is paid for by the diminishing taxpayers.
| 459 |
EdDantes Sun, Aug 29, 2010 7:46:31am |
re: #452 PT Barnum
Great movie! Irrelevant to you point, though.
| 460 |
Nervous Norvous Sun, Aug 29, 2010 7:48:50am |
re: #459 EdDantes
Great movie! Irrelevant to you point, though.
I'm not sure. I think that, not being allowed to say n- they had to resort to saying "socialist", "Muslim", "elitist"
It's the Southern Strategy refined.
| 461 |
Nervous Norvous Sun, Aug 29, 2010 7:49:49am |
re: #458 EdDantes
If the government would keep its hands out of everyone's pocket there would be more money in the market place. Also, capital markets like a little stability. They would like to know whether to invest in capital equipment and to hire more
employees or hang on to their capital.
" If nobody has a job?" They would have a job if the federal government would allow the capital markets to adjust . When the federal government "creates jobs" it is paid for by the diminishing taxpayers.
Except people that have government jobs still pay taxes and buy things and spend money. With no demand for product, what company is going to invest?
| 462 |
kirghazi Sun, Aug 29, 2010 7:54:09am |
re: #81 Spare O'Lake
Just as a point of interest, have you ever listened to the forty minute sermon from which this quote comes? Or have you read the transcript? If you had, you'd have realized that Sherrod (remember her?) was a repeat, but in her case people got the whole thing out in time to counter the out-of-context attack by quote.
The sermon's theme was that governments lie and fail, but God never does. I've heard similar sermons in many churches of several denominations. In a couple (Baptist and Methodist) a similar statement was made; that if America tried to supplant God, God would and should damn her. "God Damn America as long as she keeps trying to act like she is God and she is supreme!" he says.
Since so much of what he's accused of is more of the same sort of attack - attack by quoting out of context - I find myself defending him by default. He might be racist. But there are a lot of claims that fail in the light of day, and it makes me doubt those on which light cannot shine.
| 463 |
Nervous Norvous Sun, Aug 29, 2010 7:59:04am |
More right wing vitriol: Sourced
"I tell people don't kill all the liberals. Leave enough so we can have two on every campus - living fossils - so we will never forget what these people stood for."
- Rush Limbaugh, Denver Post, 12-29-95
"If the Supreme Court says that you have the right to consensual gay sex within your home, then you have the right to bigamy, you have the right to polygamy, you have the right to incest, you have the right to adultery. You have the right to anything. All of those things are antithetical to a healthy, stable, traditional family and that's sort of where we are in today's world, unfortunately. It all comes from, I would argue, the right to privacy that doesn't exist, in my opinion, in the United States Constitution."
- Senator Rick Santorum (R-PA), Associated Press, 04-22-03
"I would warn Orlando that you're right in the way of some serious hurricanes, and I don't think I'd be waving those flags in God's face if I were you. This is not a message of hate; this is a message of redemption. But a condition like this will bring about the destruction of your nation. It'll bring about terrorist bombs; it'll bring earthquakes, tornadoes and possibly a meteor."
- Pat Robertson, speaking of organizers putting rainbow flags up around Orlando to support sexual diversity, Washington Post, 06-10-98. For the record, Orlando remains undestroyed by meteors.
"Environmentalists are a socialist group of individuals that are the tool of the Democrat Party. I'm proud to say that they are my enemy. They are not Americans, never have been Americans, never will be Americans."
- Rep. Don Young (R-AK), Alaska Public Radio, 08-19-96
"When you strip it all away, Jerry Garcia destroyed his life on drugs. And yet he's being honored, like some godlike figure. Our priorities are out of whack, folks."
- Rush (currently under investigation for drug use) Limbaugh, on the death of Jerry Garcia, 08-20-95.
"I don't understand how poor people think."
- George W. Bush, confiding in the Rev. Jim Wallis, New York Times, 08-26-03
"Get rid of the guy. Impeach him, censure him, assassinate him."
- Rep. James Hansen (R-UT), talking about President Clinton, as reported by journalist Steve Miner of KSUB radio who overheard his conversation, 11-01-98
"We're going to keep building the party until we're hunting Democrats with dogs."
- Senator Phil Gramm (R-TX), Mother Jones, 08-95
"My only regret with Timothy McVeigh is he did not go to the New York Times building."
- Ann Coulter, New York Observer, 08-26-02
"Homosexuals want to come into churches and disrupt church services and throw blood all around and try to give people AIDS and spit in the face of ministers."
- Pat Robertson again, The 700 Club, 01-18-95
"And there is, I am certain, among the Iraqi people a respect for the care and the precision that went into the bombing campaign."
- Donald Rumsfeld, defenselink.mil, 04-09-03
"Emotional appeals about working families trying to get by on $4.25 an hour are hard to resist. Fortunately, such families do not exist."
- Rep. Tom DeLay (R-TX), House Majority Whip, during a debate on increasing the minimum wage, Congressional Record, H3706, 04-23-96
| 464 |
Nervous Norvous Sun, Aug 29, 2010 8:00:20am |
and more:
"Chelsea is a Clinton. She bears the taint; and though not prosecutable in law, in custom and nature the taint cannot be ignored. All the great despotisms of the past - I'm not arguing for despotism as a principle, but they sure knew how to deal with potential trouble - recognized that the families of objectionable citizens were a continuing threat. In Stalin's penal code it was a crime to be the wife or child of an 'enemy of the people.' The Nazis used the same principle, which they called Sippenhaft, 'clan liability.' In Imperial China, enemies of the state were punished 'to the ninth degree': that is, everyone in the offender's own generation would be killed and everyone related via four generations up, to the great-great-grandparents, and four generations down, to the great-great-grandchildren, would also be killed."
- John Derbyshire, National Review, 02-15-01
"I know this is painful for the ladies to hear, but if you get married, you have accepted the headship of a man, your husband. Christ is the head of the household and the husband is the head of the wife, and that's the way it is, period."
- Pat Robertson again, The 700 Club, 01-08-92
"Probably nothing."
- Jeb Bush, during his losing 1994 bid for Florida Governor, when asked what he would do for black people, quoted by Salon on 10-05-02
"The homosexual blitzkrieg has been better planned and executed than Hitler's."
- Rep. William Dannemeyer (R-CA), The New Republic, 08-01-94
"When lawlessness is abroad in the land, the same thing will happen here that happened in Nazi Germany. Many of those people involved in Adolph Hitler were Satanists. Many of them were homosexuals. The two things seem to go together."
- Pat Robertson again, The 700 Club, 01-21-93
"Why is this man in the White House? The majority of Americans did not vote for him. Why is he there? And I tell you this morning that he's in the White House because God put him there for a time such as this."
- Lt. General William G. Boykin, Deputy Undersecretary of Defense, New York Times, 10-17-03
"We need to execute people like John Walker in order to physically intimidate liberals, by making them realize that they can be killed, too. Otherwise, they will turn out to be outright traitors."
- Ann Coulter, at the Conservative Political Action Conference, 02-26-02
"I don't want to abolish government. I simply want to reduce it to the size where I can drag it into the bathroom and drown it in the bathtub."
- Grover Norquist, President of Americans for Tax Reform, NPR Morning Edition, 05-25-01
| 465 |
researchok Sun, Aug 29, 2010 8:02:04am |
re: #463 PT Barnum
You do realize that stupidity and vitriol is not limited to one side or the other, right?
| 466 |
Nervous Norvous Sun, Aug 29, 2010 8:02:40am |
"Two things made this country great: White men & Christianity. The degree these two have diminished is in direct proportion to the corruption and fall of the nation. Every problem that has arisen (sic) can be directly traced back to our departure from God's Law and the disenfranchisement of White men."
- State Rep. Don Davis (R-NC), emailed to every member of the North Carolina House and Senate, reported by the Fayetteville Observer, 08-22-01
"NOW is saying that in order to be a woman, you've got to be a lesbian."
- Pat Robertson again, The 700 Club, 12-03-97
"My biggest fear is going to be going to the funeral of some young Iowa man or woman who dies in this conflict and having their mother or father come up to me and ask whether or not their son or daughter died for America, or died to save Bill Clinton's presidency. I don't know what I would say to those grieving parents. For that reason I believe the President must resign immediately."
- Rep. Jim Nussle (R-IA), Congressional Record, H11963, 12-18-98
"Why should we hear about body bags and deaths and how many, what day it's gonna happen? It's not relevant. So why should I waste my beautiful mind on something like that?"
- Barbara Bush, said on 'Good Morning America' the day before the Iraq war started, New York Times, 01-13-03
"I'm the commander - see, I don't need to explain - I don't need to explain why I say things. That's the interesting thing about being the President. Maybe somebody needs to explain to me why they say something, but I don't feel like I owe anybody an explanation."
- George W. Bush, Washington Post, 11-19-02
While not all of the above are as vitriolic as others, I think it's a sufficient sample of some of the vitriol being mainstreamed by the right.
I don't see the same level from the left.
| 467 |
researchok Sun, Aug 29, 2010 8:03:27am |
| 468 |
Nervous Norvous Sun, Aug 29, 2010 8:03:45am |
re: #465 researchok
You do realize that stupidity and vitriol is not limited to one side or the other, right?
I didn't say that it was, merely that it is louder, more vitriolic, and more prevelant on the right hand side than it is on the left.
| 469 |
Nervous Norvous Sun, Aug 29, 2010 8:04:39am |
re: #467 researchok
You're kidding, right?
Bring it if you got it. But I challenge you to find quotes from any mainstream democratic politician calling for the killing of all conservatives.
| 470 |
EdDantes Sun, Aug 29, 2010 8:04:43am |
re: #461 PT Barnum
Except people that have government jobs still pay taxes and buy things and spend money. With no demand for product, what company is going to invest?
People with government jobs are funded by taxpayers. There is always *demand for products but it decreases with available cash or credit.
* I define demand by the classical method: demand equals a willingness and ability to pay.
| 471 |
researchok Sun, Aug 29, 2010 8:07:19am |
re: #468 PT Barnum
I didn't say that it was, merely that it is louder, more vitriolic, and more prevelant on the right hand side than it is on the left.
The opposition is always louder.
Recall the vitriol when George Bush was in office.
You don't have to go far to find equally insane commentary emanating from the opposition at the time.
When all is said and done, this kind of 'politicking' is least productive. No good governance will emerge.
| 472 |
Vambo Sun, Aug 29, 2010 8:07:31am |
re: #114 Spare O'Lake
He went bad...very bad.
He used a profanity! Oh, my virgin ears! I will never be pure, chaste and innocent again. *weeps*
| 473 |
Nervous Norvous Sun, Aug 29, 2010 8:09:57am |
re: #470 EdDantes
People with government jobs are funded by taxpayers. There is always *demand for products but it decreases with available cash or credit.
* I define demand by the classical method: demand equals a willingness and ability to pay.
re: #471 researchok
The opposition is always louder.
Recall the vitriol when George Bush was in office.
You don't have to go far to find equally insane commentary emanating from the opposition at the time.
When all is said and done, this kind of 'politicking' is least productive. No good governance will emerge.
If you've got it quote it from a mainstream democrat when Bush was in office.
| 474 |
Nervous Norvous Sun, Aug 29, 2010 8:11:10am |
| 475 |
researchok Sun, Aug 29, 2010 8:12:48am |
re: #469 PT Barnum
Bring it if you got it. But I challenge you to find quotes from any mainstream democratic politician calling for the killing of all conservatives.
How about calling for the assassination of George Bush? How about saying that Republicans want sick old people to die? How about the anti religious sentiment? How about the excoriation of middle Americans for their 'stupidity'?
I don't have to get into a pissing contest. As long as you insist that the fools of one side or the other are 'better' or less offensive than the other, you will have made my point.
Everyone reading this knows that to be the truth.
Especially people who vote.
| 476 |
(I Stand By What I Said Whatever It Was) Sun, Aug 29, 2010 8:13:03am |
| 477 |
kirghazi Sun, Aug 29, 2010 8:13:20am |
re: #471 researchok
The opposition is always louder.
Recall the vitriol when George Bush was in office.
You don't have to go far to find equally insane commentary emanating from the opposition at the time.
When all is said and done, this kind of 'politicking' is least productive. No good governance will emerge.
Show me. You've now said three times it is as bad or worse from the left. You've quibbled to say it happened during Bush's tenure. Show, please, the statements from people on the left of the same level of public recognition (as opposed to random sign carriers). Congressmen, national news and media figures, etc.
Show me, don't tell me. I think you're mistaken and request proof otherwise.
| 478 |
researchok Sun, Aug 29, 2010 8:14:46am |
re: #477 kirkspencer
Show me. You've now said three times it is as bad or worse from the left. You've quibbled to say it happened during Bush's tenure. Show, please, the statements from people on the left of the same level of public recognition (as opposed to random sign carriers). Congressmen, national news and media figures, etc.
Show me, don't tell me. I think you're mistaken and request proof otherwise.
Start here (photos)
I'll post more.
| 479 |
Walter L. Newton Sun, Aug 29, 2010 8:14:54am |
re: #475 researchok
How about calling for the assassination of George Bush? How about saying that Republicans want sick old people to die? How about the anti religious sentiment? How about the excoriation of middle Americans for their 'stupidity'?
I don't have to get into a pissing contest. As long as you insist that the fools of one side or the other are 'better' or less offensive than the other, you will have made my point.
Everyone reading this knows that to be the truth.
Especially people who vote.
Especially adults, with intellect, and an honest moral compass.
| 480 |
kirghazi Sun, Aug 29, 2010 8:17:30am |
re: #478 researchok
Start here (photos)
I'll post more.
try again, bad link. And if those are random sign carriers, you need to try again. PTBarnum was challenged to provide specific quotes and cite their sources. Quotes not from voices in the crowd but elected congressmen, party officials, and national media representatives. He did so.
Your turn. Congressmen, party officials, national media representatives on the left who made equally offensive statements, all cited.
| 481 |
Nervous Norvous Sun, Aug 29, 2010 8:18:07am |
| 482 |
Semper Fi Sun, Aug 29, 2010 8:18:39am |
Happy sunday everyone.
I returned home last night from my visit to SoCal. It was hot there last week with inland temps slightly above 100F in some places. The coast was nice after the morning fog burned off. Fog was heavy in some places.
Hope everyone is having a great day wherever you are.
| 483 |
Walter L. Newton Sun, Aug 29, 2010 8:20:03am |
re: #477 kirkspencer
Show me. You've now said three times it is as bad or worse from the left. You've quibbled to say it happened during Bush's tenure. Show, please, the statements from people on the left of the same level of public recognition (as opposed to random sign carriers). Congressmen, national news and media figures, etc.
Show me, don't tell me. I think you're mistaken and request proof otherwise.
America's first Muslim congressman has provoked outrage by apparently comparing President George W Bush to Adolf Hitler and hinting that he might have been responsible for the September 11 attacks.
Addressing a gathering of atheists in his home state of Minnesota, Keith Ellison, a Democrat, compared the 9/11 atrocities to the destruction of the Reichstag, the German parliament, in 1933.
| 484 |
researchok Sun, Aug 29, 2010 8:20:08am |
| 485 |
Nervous Norvous Sun, Aug 29, 2010 8:20:19am |
brb gotta run to the store for the greatest wife in the world (she bought me a Nook for our anniversary)
| 486 |
researchok Sun, Aug 29, 2010 8:21:16am |
More quotes
Democrats Go Off the Cliff
| 487 |
Dark_Falcon Sun, Aug 29, 2010 8:22:26am |
re: #483 Walter L. Newton
America's first Muslim congressman has provoked outrage by apparently comparing President George W Bush to Adolf Hitler and hinting that he might have been responsible for the September 11 attacks.
Addressing a gathering of atheists in his home state of Minnesota, Keith Ellison, a Democrat, compared the 9/11 atrocities to the destruction of the Reichstag, the German parliament, in 1933.
[Video]
When did that shithead do this?
| 488 |
researchok Sun, Aug 29, 2010 8:22:46am |
| 489 |
Walter L. Newton Sun, Aug 29, 2010 8:23:21am |
re: #477 kirkspencer
Show me. You've now said three times it is as bad or worse from the left. You've quibbled to say it happened during Bush's tenure. Show, please, the statements from people on the left of the same level of public recognition (as opposed to random sign carriers). Congressmen, national news and media figures, etc.
Show me, don't tell me. I think you're mistaken and request proof otherwise.
Pelosi said one of her favorite moments from Inauguration Day was when Marine One lifted off the Capitol grounds, signifying former President George W. Bush's exit from Washington. "It felt like a 10-pound anvil was lifted off my head," she said.
[Link: www.sfgate.com...]
| 490 |
Jeff In Ohio Sun, Aug 29, 2010 8:24:22am |
re: #447 HoosierHoops
Brad Pitt is on MTP in two minutes...
This ought to be good...
Pitt has been involved in affordable green housing construction in NO since Katrina. There's was a good article in the Atlantic a few months back. I'll see if I can dig it out.
| 491 |
Jeff In Ohio Sun, Aug 29, 2010 8:24:58am |
| 492 |
Walter L. Newton Sun, Aug 29, 2010 8:24:59am |
re: #477 kirkspencer
Show me. You've now said three times it is as bad or worse from the left. You've quibbled to say it happened during Bush's tenure. Show, please, the statements from people on the left of the same level of public recognition (as opposed to random sign carriers). Congressmen, national news and media figures, etc.
Show me, don't tell me. I think you're mistaken and request proof otherwise.
WASHINGTON — Sen. Dick Durbin (search) went to the Senate floor late Tuesday to offer his apologies to anyone who may have been offended by his comparison of treatment of detainees at the U.S. military base at Guantanamo Bay, Cuba, to Nazis, Soviet gulags and Cambodia's Pol Pot.
[Link: www.foxnews.com...]
| 493 |
Walter L. Newton Sun, Aug 29, 2010 8:25:29am |
re: #480 kirkspencer
try again, bad link. And if those are random sign carriers, you need to try again. PTBarnum was challenged to provide specific quotes and cite their sources. Quotes not from voices in the crowd but elected congressmen, party officials, and national media representatives. He did so.
Your turn. Congressmen, party officials, national media representatives on the left who made equally offensive statements, all cited.
I can keep this up all morning if you like... LOL.
| 494 |
researchok Sun, Aug 29, 2010 8:26:06am |
Stupidity and vitriol are not the exclusive purview of one party or another.
To believe or say otherwise is absurd.
Show me better ideas and better governance. Excoriating the other side does make for credibility.
| 495 |
Dark_Falcon Sun, Aug 29, 2010 8:26:10am |
re: #486 researchok
More quotes
Democrats Go Off the Cliff
Good point. It is important to remember that the party out of power is often over-the-top, and most of the attacks on Obama are nothing we haven't seen before. However, some of them are way over the line.
| 496 |
researchok Sun, Aug 29, 2010 8:27:57am |
re: #495 Dark_Falcon
Good point. It is important to remember that the party out of power is often over-the-top, and most of the attacks on Obama are nothing we haven't seen before. However, some of them are way over the line.
I did want to get into a pissing contest. Stupidity and vitriol are not 'owned' by one side or the other.
| 497 |
Dark_Falcon Sun, Aug 29, 2010 8:28:30am |
re: #496 researchok
I did want to get into a pissing contest. Stupidity and vitriol are not 'owned' by one side or the other.
Quite Concur.
| 498 |
Walter L. Newton Sun, Aug 29, 2010 8:29:32am |
re: #480 kirkspencer
try again, bad link. And if those are random sign carriers, you need to try again. PTBarnum was challenged to provide specific quotes and cite their sources. Quotes not from voices in the crowd but elected congressmen, party officials, and national media representatives. He did so.
Your turn. Congressmen, party officials, national media representatives on the left who made equally offensive statements, all cited.
Chris Matthews Compares Bush/Cheney To
Menendez Brothers
La... la... la... la... la... (I can't hear you)...
| 499 |
researchok Sun, Aug 29, 2010 8:29:54am |
re: #479 Walter L. Newton
Especially adults, with intellect, and an honest moral compass.
You set the bar awfully high, Walter.
/
| 500 |
PhillyPretzel Sun, Aug 29, 2010 8:30:26am |
re: #496 researchok
re: #497 Dark_Falcon
Just image what the left said when this gentleman died.
[Link: littlegreenfootballs.com...]
| 502 |
Walter L. Newton Sun, Aug 29, 2010 8:32:33am |
re: #480 kirkspencer
try again, bad link. And if those are random sign carriers, you need to try again. PTBarnum was challenged to provide specific quotes and cite their sources. Quotes not from voices in the crowd but elected congressmen, party officials, and national media representatives. He did so.
Your turn. Congressmen, party officials, national media representatives on the left who made equally offensive statements, all cited.
"Being a suicide bomber is the new political role model," Chris Matthews told his Friday "Hardball" audience. "Just kill everything, destroy everything, blow it up, nothing gets done. You're dead, but who cares?" he added, referring to conservative Republicans running against Democrats in the 2010 midterms.
(text link on News Busters - for what that's worth - video is available all over the place)
[Link: newsbusters.org...]
| 503 |
Stonemason Sun, Aug 29, 2010 8:32:38am |
The proof that there is partisanship by those who ignore the equivalence of the rhetoric is in the labeling of Democrats who are opposed to the location of the Park 51 center as 'cowards' or 'political hacks' while labeling republicans as bigots.
It happened, right here.
The rhetoric of the party out of power is over the top, no matter what party it is, and it is only 'worse now' because it is now.
| 504 |
kirghazi Sun, Aug 29, 2010 8:33:43am |
re: #483 Walter L. Newton
re: #484 researchok
re: #486 researchok
re: #489 Walter L. Newton
re: #492 Walter L. Newton
Much better, thank you.
Note my point, however. If one side is required to provide specific demonstration and citation, it is wrong to allow those on the other side to then get away with a handwave claim. PT Barnum still has posted more cites than those above, but at least we're past the "because I said so" phase.
| 505 |
Walter L. Newton Sun, Aug 29, 2010 8:35:11am |
re: #480 kirkspencer
try again, bad link. And if those are random sign carriers, you need to try again. PTBarnum was challenged to provide specific quotes and cite their sources. Quotes not from voices in the crowd but elected congressmen, party officials, and national media representatives. He did so.
Your turn. Congressmen, party officials, national media representatives on the left who made equally offensive statements, all cited.
Sen. Reid Compares Obamacare Opponents to Supporters of Slavery
(This one is particularly fun)
| 506 |
researchok Sun, Aug 29, 2010 8:36:16am |
More:
Again, my point is that vitriol and stupidity are cesspools of both sides.
Consistently pointing out that out does not make for good or credible governance or credible critique.
| 507 |
Walter L. Newton Sun, Aug 29, 2010 8:37:05am |
re: #504 kirkspencer
re: #484 researchok
re: #486 researchok
re: #489 Walter L. Newton
re: #492 Walter L. Newton
Much better, thank you.
Note my point, however. If one side is required to provide specific demonstration and citation, it is wrong to allow those on the other side to then get away with a handwave claim. PT Barnum still has posted more cites than those above, but at least we're past the "because I said so" phase.
Note... you have no point... I proved that. Your point and implication was it didn't happen from the left... well it did... that was my point.
Thanks for playing.
| 508 |
Varek Raith Sun, Aug 29, 2010 8:38:01am |
re: #503 Stonemason
Right.
Left.
I don't care.
A bigot is a bigot is a bigot.
| 509 |
Dark_Falcon Sun, Aug 29, 2010 8:38:05am |
re: #504 kirkspencer
We are indeed. The best thing to do is criticize hateful attacks when they are made, whoever makes them. Because both sides do it. And because a fact based attack is ultimately stronger and more effective than screaming hater invective.
| 510 |
darthstar Sun, Aug 29, 2010 8:38:51am |
re: #500 PhillyPretzel
Just image what the left said when this gentleman died.
[Link: littlegreenfootballs.com...]
I wished peace to his family. What did you imagine I'd do?
| 511 |
_RememberTonyC Sun, Aug 29, 2010 8:38:53am |
re: #465 researchok
don't stop him now .... he's on a roll
| 512 |
darthstar Sun, Aug 29, 2010 8:39:58am |
re: #511 _RememberTonyC
don't stop him now ... he's on a roll
If he does this for more than four hours should we call a doctor?
| 513 |
PhillyPretzel Sun, Aug 29, 2010 8:40:09am |
re: #510 darthstar
I was refering to the update that Charles posted about Huffington Post.
That is all.
| 514 |
researchok Sun, Aug 29, 2010 8:40:09am |
re: #504 kirkspencer
re: #484 researchok
re: #486 researchok
re: #489 Walter L. Newton
re: #492 Walter L. Newton
Much better, thank you.
Note my point, however. If one side is required to provide specific demonstration and citation, it is wrong to allow those on the other side to then get away with a handwave claim. PT Barnum still has posted more cites than those above, but at least we're past the "because I said so" phase.
Do you think the numbers matter?
Give Walter 20 minutes and that will even out.
This is about extremist political expression. I can assure you there are enough examples on both sides to fill the Library of Congress.
Politics is a dirty and corrupt game, played by dirty and corrupt people, for the most part. Defend one side or the other and the stench will envelope you.
| 515 |
researchok Sun, Aug 29, 2010 8:40:43am |
| 516 |
MandyManners Sun, Aug 29, 2010 8:40:51am |
re: #509 Dark_Falcon
I left two messages for you in that Page.
| 517 |
Walter L. Newton Sun, Aug 29, 2010 8:42:11am |
re: #514 researchok
Do you think the numbers matter?
Give Walter 20 minutes and that will even out.
This is about extremist political expression. I can assure you there are enough examples on both sides to fill the Library of Congress.
Politics is a dirty and corrupt game, played by dirty and corrupt people, for the most part. Defend one side or the other and the stench will envelope you.
Hell... Chis Matthews alone can fill the Library of Congress with his vitriolic remarks against conservatives.
| 518 |
kirghazi Sun, Aug 29, 2010 8:43:11am |
re: #507 Walter L. Newton
No, you're incorrect.
PT Barnum made the statement that the right had made these statements. He was challenged to provide proof. He did so. He was challenged to do so better, this time with links. He did so.
He was then confronted with blanket statements that the left had done so, but when he asked for proofs equivalent to his just got more "every body knows." No, let's give the specific quote, shall we?
[researchok] "Everyone reading this knows that to be the truth.
Especially people who vote."
[Walter L. Newton] "Especially adults, with intellect, and an honest moral compass."
This is not an honest moral compass, to insist the other side jump through hoops and to then declaim that your side's truth is 'just so.' I insisted the same standards be applied. You and researchok did so, and for that I thank you. That I had to ask, to insist, means I do not praise you.
| 519 |
researchok Sun, Aug 29, 2010 8:43:39am |
re: #517 Walter L. Newton
Hell... Chis Matthews alone can fill the Library of Congress with his vitriolic remarks against conservatives.
Ain't that the truth.
If there is divine justice, He and Rush will be roommates for ever- across the hall from Hannity and Olbermann.
| 520 |
_RememberTonyC Sun, Aug 29, 2010 8:43:45am |
re: #512 darthstar
If he does this for more than four hours should we call a doctor?
blood flow to the little head frequently means blood LOSS in the big head ...
| 521 |
Charles Johnson Sun, Aug 29, 2010 8:43:49am |
re: #502 Walter L. Newton
"Being a suicide bomber is the new political role model," Chris Matthews told his Friday "Hardball" audience. "Just kill everything, destroy everything, blow it up, nothing gets done. You're dead, but who cares?" he added, referring to conservative Republicans running against Democrats in the 2010 midterms.
(text link on News Busters - for what that's worth - video is available all over the place)
[Link: newsbusters.org...]
Why is that supposed to be offensive? I think Matthews's point is exactly right. That IS what's going on on the GOP side.
| 522 |
Walter L. Newton Sun, Aug 29, 2010 8:45:05am |
re: #518 kirkspencer
No, you're incorrect.
PT Barnum made the statement that the right had made these statements. He was challenged to provide proof. He did so. He was challenged to do so better, this time with links. He did so.
He was then confronted with blanket statements that the left had done so, but when he asked for proofs equivalent to his just got more "every body knows." No, let's give the specific quote, shall we?
[researchok] "Everyone reading this knows that to be the truth.
Especially people who vote."
[Walter L. Newton] "Especially adults, with intellect, and an honest moral compass."
This is not an honest moral compass, to insist the other side jump through hoops and to then declaim that your side's truth is 'just so.' I insisted the same standards be applied. You and researchok did so, and for that I thank you. That I had to ask, to insist, means I do not praise you.
First off, I wasn't part of the original comments, second I did your work for you and thirdly I didn't ask for any praise.... I got all the "warm fuzzy feelings" just by proving you wrong. So, get off your soapbox... I didn't start this... but I certainly ended it.
| 523 |
Charles Johnson Sun, Aug 29, 2010 8:45:59am |
And I completely agree that the vitriol coming out of the right wing these days is FAR worse than anything I've seen from the left.
| 524 |
Walter L. Newton Sun, Aug 29, 2010 8:46:12am |
re: #521 Charles
Why is that supposed to be offensive? I think Matthews's point is exactly right. That IS what's going on on the GOP side.
Fine... that's your opinion. And really Charles, I could fill a whole thread with Matthews silly remarks... shall we argue over each one?
| 525 |
Vambo Sun, Aug 29, 2010 8:46:43am |
re: #489 Walter L. Newton
Pelosi said one of her favorite moments from Inauguration Day was when Marine One lifted off the Capitol grounds, signifying former President George W. Bush's exit from Washington. "It felt like a 10-pound anvil was lifted off my head," she said.
[Link: www.sfgate.com...]
Wow, she made a joke.
What a hateful, violent bitch.
| 526 |
Charles Johnson Sun, Aug 29, 2010 8:47:07am |
re: #522 Walter L. Newton
First off, I wasn't part of the original comments, second I did your work for you and thirdly I didn't ask for any praise... I got all the "warm fuzzy feelings" just by proving you wrong. So, get off your soapbox... I didn't start this... but I certainly ended it.
Except, you didn't prove anybody wrong. Your few examples of Chris Mattthews are pretty weak compared to the hatred that's standard fare on the modern right wing.
| 527 |
Dark_Falcon Sun, Aug 29, 2010 8:47:40am |
re: #516 MandyManners
I left two messages for you in that Page.
I went and read them. Also good finds. Park 51 does seem to have some malfactors in its funding apparatus. If that information holds up, they are a non-bigoted avenue of attack against Imam Rauf and the whole Park 51 idea.
| 528 |
Walter L. Newton Sun, Aug 29, 2010 8:47:45am |
And by the way... has anyone come up with an "official" count of the people who showed up on the Mall for Beck's rally?
| 529 |
Charles Johnson Sun, Aug 29, 2010 8:48:04am |
re: #528 Walter L. Newton
And by the way... has anyone come up with an "official" count of the people who showed up on the Mall for Beck's rally?
Yes. I posted it yesterday.
| 531 |
researchok Sun, Aug 29, 2010 8:49:13am |
re: #521 Charles
Why is that supposed to be offensive? I think Matthews point is exactly right. That IS what's going on on the GOP side.
I submit it's more nuanced than that. Cable/net realities demand the escalation of the attacks, etc.
Somehow, emotions have become as important as substance in political debate. That is a dangerous turn of events.
As I have said before, I do believe the Right has gone off the deep end, out a sense of desperation and pandering to voter bases. To the Dems credit, they have resisted that, somewhat.
I do believe the party out of power does tend to be more aggressive/desperate. We see it now with GOP and Obama and we saw it with the Dems and Bush.
| 532 |
Vambo Sun, Aug 29, 2010 8:49:19am |
So basically the worst that the left has to offer are Godwinisms.
Meanwhile, Rush Limbaugh thinks we shouldn't kill all the liberals, because we need some to keep in museums.
yeah.
| 533 |
darthstar Sun, Aug 29, 2010 8:50:12am |
re: #521 Charles
Why is that supposed to be offensive? I think Matthews's point is exactly right. That IS what's going on on the GOP side.
Matthews was using a metphor. Walter doesn't do metaphor.
| 534 |
Dark_Falcon Sun, Aug 29, 2010 8:50:46am |
re: #525 Vambo
Wow, she made a joke.
What a hateful, violent bitch.
It was a nasty, hostile, joke and it does show how Pelosi can be a hater.
| 535 |
harlequinade Sun, Aug 29, 2010 8:50:48am |
| 536 |
Walter L. Newton Sun, Aug 29, 2010 8:50:52am |
re: #530 Charles
Guess you missed that.
I imagine I missed that, since I asked. I ask because even CNN, at this point, mentions that "Wildly conflicting reports filed about Beck rally crowd size" I've seen nothing official.
[Link: politicalticker.blogs.cnn.com...]
Can you give me the figure you posted, and the source.
| 537 |
Charles Johnson Sun, Aug 29, 2010 8:51:55am |
re: #536 Walter L. Newton
I imagine I missed that, since I asked. I ask because even CNN, at this point, mentions that "Wildly conflicting reports filed about Beck rally crowd size" I've seen nothing official.
[Link: politicalticker.blogs.cnn.com...]
Can you give me the figure you posted, and the source.
You could also read what I already wrote, instead of asking me to write it again.
| 538 |
Vambo Sun, Aug 29, 2010 8:52:33am |
re: #534 Dark_Falcon
It was a nasty, hostile, joke and it does show how Pelosi can be a hater.
Paraphrased... "my favorite moment was when GWB left the White House".
So NASTY!
and HOSTILE!
No one, not even LGF readers, would say such a thing on the last day of Obama's final term./
| 539 |
Walter L. Newton Sun, Aug 29, 2010 8:52:37am |
re: #536 Walter L. Newton
I imagine I missed that, since I asked. I ask because even CNN, at this point, mentions that "Wildly conflicting reports filed about Beck rally crowd size" I've seen nothing official.
[Link: politicalticker.blogs.cnn.com...]
Can you give me the figure you posted, and the source.
Some wildly varying figures...
CBS News took a scientific approach, commissioning a crowd estimate by the company AirPhotosLive.com. The network reported that AirPhotosLive estimated the crowd at 87,000 people. But they noted that with a margin of error of 9,000, “between 78,000 and 96,000 attended the rally.”
The NBC Nightly News estimated the number of people in attendance as “tens, perhaps hundreds of thousands.”
ABCNews.com reported “the rally has attracted more than 100,000 people.”
Fox News, citing organizers, aired a banner characterizing it this way: “CROWD ATTENDING BECK RALLY ESTIMATED AT OVER 500,000.”
The Washington Post noted that Beck told the crowd that he had heard “it was between 300,000 and 500,000."
And the Post quoted Rep. Michele Bachmann (R-Minnesota), speaking soon after the rally ended as saying, "We're not going to let anyone get away with saying there were less than a million here today – because we were witnesses."
On the morning after the rally, Beck himself told Fox News Sunday that he believed the crowd was as low as 300,000 and as big as 650,000.
| 540 |
Dark_Falcon Sun, Aug 29, 2010 8:52:42am |
re: #531 researchok
I submit it's more nuanced than that. Cable/net realities demand the escalation of the attacks, etc.
Somehow, emotions have become as important as substance in political debate. That is a dangerous turn of events.
As I have said before, I do believe the Right has gone off the deep end, out a sense of desperation and pandering to voter bases. To the Dems credit, they have resisted that, somewhat.
I do believe the party out of power does tend to be more aggressive/desperate. We see it now with GOP and Obama and we saw it with the Dems and Bush.
And that is a fair and balanced analysis. Fox News, please take note.
| 541 |
researchok Sun, Aug 29, 2010 8:53:08am |
re: #535 harlequinade
re: #523 Charles
Cos Charles says it so much clearer than I would
CJ has a valid point- the vitriol on the right is off the rails.
That said, when the left will be in opposition, I submit there will be elements within their ranks that will set the bar for new lows.
That is a pattern that has repeated itself time after time.
| 542 |
harlequinade Sun, Aug 29, 2010 8:53:28am |
re: #534 Dark_Falcon
Clearly. Pelosi is a hater, and Rush is the very model of modern satire.
| 543 |
kirghazi Sun, Aug 29, 2010 8:53:33am |
re: #522 Walter L. Newton
First off, I wasn't part of the original comments, second I did your work for you and thirdly I didn't ask for any praise... I got all the "warm fuzzy feelings" just by proving you wrong. So, get off your soapbox... I didn't start this... but I certainly ended it.
First, no you weren't. But you, like I, jumped into the discussion. Second and third, what amazing heights of revisionism you reach.
If one side demands a set of standards of the other, then if this is truly not an echo chamber that side must be held to the same standards. That you then provided what was needed to make the standards is not "doing the work for me." It is, instead, meeting the standards demanded of the other side.
I despise the sloppy debate technique technique you just tried to slip in there. Side one provides arguments and proof. Side two provides arguments, and "all you have to do is look it up yourself." It's laziness at best, and intentional overload of the other position by making them do twice the effort.
All I asked was that proof be provided, proof to the standard demanded of PT Barnum. After prodding, that proof was provided. Finally.
| 544 |
darthstar Sun, Aug 29, 2010 8:53:35am |
re: #534 Dark_Falcon
It was a nasty, hostile, joke and it does show how Pelosi can be a hater.
You're not so simple as to actually believe that.
| 545 |
_RememberTonyC Sun, Aug 29, 2010 8:55:45am |
I hope eventually the grown ups on both sides regain control of things. Right now I think Obama will be re-elected regardless of the job he does. The reason? The other side has to regain some semblence of reality in order to get the independent voters they need in a general election. If Sarah Palin passes for a quality leader on the right, I can assure the GOP that she does NOT pass that test among moderates who might consider a GOP candidate. I think only a northern Republican can be electable in a general election.
| 546 |
darthstar Sun, Aug 29, 2010 8:55:47am |
re: #539 Walter L. Newton
Translation: He drew more than Obama. I think you should go with Bachman's figure, Walter. It just seems appropriate.
| 547 |
Walter L. Newton Sun, Aug 29, 2010 8:55:48am |
re: #540 Dark_Falcon
And that is a fair and balanced analysis. Fox News, please take note.
Beck please take notice.
| 548 |
Dark_Falcon Sun, Aug 29, 2010 8:56:01am |
re: #539 Walter L. Newton
Some wildly varying figures...
CBS News took a scientific approach, commissioning a crowd estimate by the company AirPhotosLive.com. The network reported that AirPhotosLive estimated the crowd at 87,000 people. But they noted that with a margin of error of 9,000, “between 78,000 and 96,000 attended the rally.”
The NBC Nightly News estimated the number of people in attendance as “tens, perhaps hundreds of thousands.”
ABCNews.com reported “the rally has attracted more than 100,000 people.”
Fox News, citing organizers, aired a banner characterizing it this way: “CROWD ATTENDING BECK RALLY ESTIMATED AT OVER 500,000.”
The Washington Post noted that Beck told the crowd that he had heard “it was between 300,000 and 500,000."
And the Post quoted Rep. Michele Bachmann (R-Minnesota), speaking soon after the rally ended as saying, "We're not going to let anyone get away with saying there were less than a million here today – because we were witnesses."
On the morning after the rally, Beck himself told Fox News Sunday that he believed the crowd was as low as 300,000 and as big as 650,000.
Well, most of those seem plausible, except for Michelle Bachmann's. But she's a known lunatic so we can safely dismiss her words as a nutcase rant that not even Glenn Beck will subscribe to.
| 549 |
darthstar Sun, Aug 29, 2010 8:57:05am |
re: #542 harlequinade
Clearly. Pelosi is a hater, and Rush is the very model of modern satire.
She's not just a hater, she's a GRANNY!
| 550 |
MandyManners Sun, Aug 29, 2010 8:57:23am |
Time to go feed The Kid. I wonder if he's gonna' eat a brunch as big as yesterday's. I had no idea he could put away that much food!
| 551 |
Varek Raith Sun, Aug 29, 2010 8:57:25am |
re: #542 harlequinade
Clearly. Pelosi is a hater, and Rush is the very model of modern satire.
DF didn't say that.
9_9
| 553 |
Walter L. Newton Sun, Aug 29, 2010 8:58:08am |
re: #546 darthstar
Translation: He drew more than Obama. I think you should go with Bachman's figure, Walter. It just seems appropriate.
I don't see why I should go with anyones figure, since all of the figures mentioned seems at a largely apart. That's why I asked if anyone had something more "official."
With this kind of reporting, the "facts" will turn out to be what ever side can yell their count louder, and more often.
No a really good way to gauge truth.
| 554 |
Charles Johnson Sun, Aug 29, 2010 8:58:24am |
re: #539 Walter L. Newton
Only one of those figures is based on an actual study using, you know, actual math and stuff. The CBS one. The lowest estimate.
| 555 |
_RememberTonyC Sun, Aug 29, 2010 8:58:59am |
re: #550 MandyManners
Time to go feed The Kid. I wonder if he's gonna' eat a brunch as big as yesterday's. I had no idea he could put away that much food!
football players .......
| 556 |
Charles Johnson Sun, Aug 29, 2010 8:59:13am |
re: #553 Walter L. Newton
I don't see why I should go with anyones figure, since all of the figures mentioned seems at a largely apart. That's why I asked if anyone had something more "official."
With this kind of reporting, the "facts" will turn out to be what ever side can yell their count louder, and more often.
No a really good way to gauge truth.
You should go with the CBS estimate, because it's the only one based on something more than a wild guess. This seems dead obvious.
| 557 |
jaunte Sun, Aug 29, 2010 8:59:27am |
re: #532 Vambo
So basically the worst that the left has to offer are Godwinisms.
Meanwhile, Rush Limbaugh thinks we shouldn't kill all the liberals, because we need some to keep in museums.
yeah.
Is there a term similar to 'Godwin' that will extend all the way to the 'government are Satan worshippers' rhetoric that Glenn Beck is using?
| 558 |
Walter L. Newton Sun, Aug 29, 2010 9:00:19am |
re: #556 Charles
You should go with the CBS estimate, because it's the only one based on something more than a wild guess. This seems dead obvious.
I consider the sources, as much as anyone would... as much as you would. I would prefer a unbiased scientific source... wouldn't you?
| 559 |
Charles Johnson Sun, Aug 29, 2010 9:00:59am |
re: #558 Walter L. Newton
I consider the sources, as much as anyone would... as much as you would. I would prefer a unbiased scientific source... wouldn't you?
What part of "they commissioned an outside firm" is unclear?
| 560 |
researchok Sun, Aug 29, 2010 9:01:34am |
re: #540 Dark_Falcon
And that is a fair and balanced analysis. Fox News, please take note.
The problem with FOX is that they have co-mingled news, entertainment and opinion so much it has become hard to discern what is what.
Chris Wallace and Wendall Golar for example are well respected journalists.
They just get lumped in with the others and it is hard to discern at times who does what at FOX.
| 561 |
harlequinade Sun, Aug 29, 2010 9:01:38am |
re: #551 Varek Raith
I know. I said it. I extrapolated and applied perceived wisdom.
To whit: When Rush says something outrageous - clearly it is a joke, because he is an entertainer.
When Nance, she won't mind if we call her Nance, says something ... well, quite timid actually, it's hateful and vicious.
| 562 |
What, me worry? Sun, Aug 29, 2010 9:01:42am |
re: #453 HoosierHoops
re: #490 Jeff In Ohio
Sorry so late to comment on this, but what a wonderful segment. I wasn't pleased with all of Brian Williams' questions, but Brad Pitt is truly a saint. With all his money and fame, he's decided to dedicate his life to this noble cause. What a selfless human being.
| 563 |
(I Stand By What I Said Whatever It Was) Sun, Aug 29, 2010 9:02:49am |
Charles, can you please explain why my comment in this thread was deleted?
| 564 |
_RememberTonyC Sun, Aug 29, 2010 9:03:10am |
I'm more than a bit annoyed at those who are trying to claim MLK as their own. Dr King is one of the greatest men this country has ever produced. glenn beck and al sharpton are unworthy to carry Dr King's briefcase. And I'm guessing MLK would consider both beck and sharpton to be second rate snake oil salesmen.
| 565 |
Vambo Sun, Aug 29, 2010 9:03:12am |
re: #557 jaunte
Is there a term similar to 'Godwin' that will extend all the way to the 'government are Satan worshippers' rhetoric that Glenn Beck is using?
[Link: mediamatters.org...]
There was a post here in the last couple months or so, where it was reported that Beck did indeed claim Obama to be the Dark Prince. How does the left outdo the right on that one?
| 566 |
darthstar Sun, Aug 29, 2010 9:03:31am |
re: #560 researchok
Chris Wallace makes his father roll in his grave. He's respected for his family's name, but he can spew the same bullshit "Obama is destroying America" crap with a straight face better than anyone.
| 567 |
Walter L. Newton Sun, Aug 29, 2010 9:03:37am |
re: #559 Charles
What part of "they commissioned an outside firm" is unclear?
I'll go with this...
AirPhotosLive.com gave its estimate a margin of error of 9,000, meaning between 78,000 and 96,000 people attended the rally. The photos used to make the estimate were taken at noon Saturday, which is when the company estimated was the rally's high point.
[Link: www.cbsnews.com...]
| 568 |
Charles Johnson Sun, Aug 29, 2010 9:04:14am |
re: #563 000G
Charles, can you please explain why my comment in this thread was deleted?
That was deleted by one of the monitors, probably because it had a link to Reason magazine, which employs both raving antisemite Justin Raimondo and white supremacist Robert Stacy McCain.
| 569 |
harlequinade Sun, Aug 29, 2010 9:04:36am |
re: #551 Varek Raith
though - if I upset DF by that observation then of course he'll turn the other cheek// I apologise. Outside the sarc tags.
| 570 |
_RememberTonyC Sun, Aug 29, 2010 9:05:00am |
re: #566 darthstar
Chris Wallace makes his father roll in his grave. He's respected for his family's name, but he can spew the same bullshit "Obama is destroying America" crap with a straight face better than anyone.
Mike Wallace died? Did I miss something here?
| 571 |
darthstar Sun, Aug 29, 2010 9:05:03am |
re: #565 Vambo
There was a post here in the last couple months or so, where it was reported that Beck did indeed claim Obama to be the Dark Prince. How does the left outdo the right on that one?
First, we have to stop laughing. I just wonder who Beck can think of that will be more evil than Hitler or Satan for his next Obama= comparison.
| 572 |
Nervous Norvous Sun, Aug 29, 2010 9:05:06am |
re: #489 Walter L. Newton
Pelosi said one of her favorite moments from Inauguration Day was when Marine One lifted off the Capitol grounds, signifying former President George W. Bush's exit from Washington. "It felt like a 10-pound anvil was lifted off my head," she said.
re: #507 Walter L. Newton
Note... you have no point... I proved that. Your point and implication was it didn't happen from the left... well it did... that was my point.
I never claimed once it didn't happen on the left, just that the degree and amount of vitriol tilted right
Although I do have to say that comparing people to Hitler is a lot different than suggesting that they need to be killed.
I would question whether a lot of what you posted is truly hate speech. Saying George bush leaving was like lifting a 10 pound weight isn't particularly hateful, in my book. Saying you hoped his helicopter crashed would be a different story.
| 573 |
Walter L. Newton Sun, Aug 29, 2010 9:06:11am |
re: #565 Vambo
There was a post here in the last couple months or so, where it was reported that Beck did indeed claim Obama to be the Dark Prince. How does the left outdo the right on that one?
(Another round)... How about comparing Bush to...
America's first Muslim congressman has provoked outrage by apparently comparing President George W Bush to Adolf Hitler and hinting that he might have been responsible for the September 11 attacks.
Addressing a gathering of atheists in his home state of Minnesota, Keith Ellison, a Democrat, compared the 9/11 atrocities to the destruction of the Reichstag, the German parliament, in 1933
... instead of a mythical figure like Satan.
| 574 |
researchok Sun, Aug 29, 2010 9:07:29am |
re: #566 darthstar
Chris Wallace makes his father roll in his grave. He's respected for his family's name, but he can spew the same bullshit "Obama is destroying America" crap with a straight face better than anyone.
I never saw or heard that. If accurate that is most disappointing.
| 575 |
darthstar Sun, Aug 29, 2010 9:07:48am |
re: #570 _RememberTonyC
Mike Wallace died? Did I miss something here?
Oh, shit...he just retired...my bad. Sorry, Mike. I do miss you on 60 Minutes.
| 576 |
darthstar Sun, Aug 29, 2010 9:08:45am |
re: #574 researchok
I never saw or heard that. If accurate that is most disappointing.
Hell, Jon Stewart and Stephen Colbert use him all the time.
| 577 |
researchok Sun, Aug 29, 2010 9:09:10am |
re: #575 darthstar
Oh, shit...he just retired...my bad. Sorry, Mike. I do miss you on 60 Minutes.
You must have been thinking about Don Hewitt, the producer of 60 mins.
He died in the last year.
| 578 |
Vambo Sun, Aug 29, 2010 9:09:18am |
re: #573 Walter L. Newton
(Another round)... How about comparing Bush to...
America's first Muslim congressman has provoked outrage by apparently comparing President George W Bush to Adolf Hitler and hinting that he might have been responsible for the September 11 attacks.
Addressing a gathering of atheists in his home state of Minnesota, Keith Ellison, a Democrat, compared the 9/11 atrocities to the destruction of the Reichstag, the German parliament, in 1933
... instead of a mythical figure like Satan.
[Video]
lolwhut?
I think Satan >> Hitler.
And I didn't I just mention the Godwin hysteria of the left? How does that compare to "kill all liberals"??? IT DOESN'T.
ALL OF YOU CAN STFU NOW. You're done.
| 579 |
sagehen Sun, Aug 29, 2010 9:09:40am |
re: #427 MandyManners
Well, Joe Biden says "wealthy" people don't spend money.
They don't spend *as high a percentage* of their available money. And what they do spend, isn't always spent here.
If people just scraping by get some extra cash, they'll pour every last penny back into the economy. They'll get their kid that new pair of shoes they'd been putting off, from a shoestore whose proprieter will now buy a dress from a seamstress who spends half the money on fabric and the other half at a local restaurant where the server uses her tip to get her hair done by a beautician who'll pick up some produce from the local farmers' market on her way home. That money counts 5 times towards GDP because it keeps moving.
If upper middle-class people get some extra cash maybe they'll put it in their 401k, or make an extra mortgage payment, or take that trip to Paris and buy things in some other country's economy.
If the awesomely wealthy get some extra cash, maybe they'll bid up the price of a Rembrandt, which adds only the auction house's commission to anybody's economy.
The biggest stimulative effect of tax cuts is at the bottom.
| 580 |
(I Stand By What I Said Whatever It Was) Sun, Aug 29, 2010 9:09:56am |
re: #568 Charles
That was deleted by one of the monitors, probably because it had a link to Reason magazine, which employs both raving antisemite Justin Raimondo and white supremacist Robert Stacy McCain.
I don't see Justin Raimondo anywhere on their contributors page and apparently the last contributions from RSM have been from 2006, furthermore the article I linked was from today and by Matt Welch and very much on-topic without being controversial in any regard. O-kay....?
Apart from me not agreeing with the decision: I wish these kind of monitor decisions would be explained by the monitoring party in cases where any lgf policy abuse was not obvious. I sure would have appreciated an explanation right there and then as opposed to me having to wreck my brain over the question.
| 581 |
Charles Johnson Sun, Aug 29, 2010 9:10:06am |
I was just thinking, "You know it's about time for Tim Blair to post another lame attack on me." And sure enough, there he goes.
According to Blair, Glenn Beck has "changed his mind" about Martin Luther King, and I'm supposed to applaud that.
Seriously. This is what passes for deep thought in the loony right blogosphere these days.
| 582 |
(I Stand By What I Said Whatever It Was) Sun, Aug 29, 2010 9:10:15am |
Oh, and: thanks for answering.
| 583 |
Killgore Trout Sun, Aug 29, 2010 9:10:45am |
| 584 |
researchok Sun, Aug 29, 2010 9:10:50am |
re: #576 darthstar
Hell, Jon Stewart and Stephen Colbert use him all the time.
Honestly, I haven't seen it.
Anyone else besides Colbert and Stewart?
| 585 |
jamesfirecat Sun, Aug 29, 2010 9:11:17am |
re: #579 sagehen
They don't spend *as high a percentage* of their available money. And what they do spend, isn't always spent here.
If people just scraping by get some extra cash, they'll pour every last penny back into the economy. They'll get their kid that new pair of shoes they'd been putting off, from a shoestore whose proprieter will now buy a dress from a seamstress who spends half the money on fabric and the other half at a local restaurant where the server uses her tip to get her hair done by a beautician who'll pick up some produce from the local farmers' market on her way home. That money counts 5 times towards GDP because it keeps moving.
If upper middle-class people get some extra cash maybe they'll put it in their 401k, or make an extra mortgage payment, or take that trip to Paris and buy things in some other country's economy.
If the awesomely wealthy get some extra cash, maybe they'll bid up the price of a Rembrandt, which adds only the auction house's commission to anybody's economy.
The biggest stimulative effect of tax cuts is at the bottom.
Freaking motto.
Primer Push, (give money to the people at the bottom) just makes more economic sense than trickle down.
| 586 |
Nervous Norvous Sun, Aug 29, 2010 9:12:01am |
re: #573 Walter L. Newton
(Another round)... How about comparing Bush to...
America's first Muslim congressman has provoked outrage by apparently comparing President George W Bush to Adolf Hitler and hinting that he might have been responsible for the September 11 attacks.
Addressing a gathering of atheists in his home state of Minnesota, Keith Ellison, a Democrat, compared the 9/11 atrocities to the destruction of the Reichstag, the German parliament, in 1933
... instead of a mythical figure like Satan.
[Video]
There's not a lot of people in the mainstream left promoting the 9/11 truther position.
as compared to the number of people on the right still flogging the birther nonsense.
| 587 |
researchok Sun, Aug 29, 2010 9:12:41am |
re: #581 Charles
I was just thinking, "You know it's about time for Tim Blair to post another lame attack on me." And sure enough, there he goes.
According to Blair, Glenn Beck has "changed his mind" about Martin Luther king, and I'm supposed to applaud that.
Seriously. This is what passes for deep thought in the loony right blogosphere these days.
Tim Blair must have tenure.
The only journalism job he'd qualify for nowadays would be as an editor at Craigslist.
| 588 |
Killgore Trout Sun, Aug 29, 2010 9:12:47am |
re: #581 Charles
According to Blair, Glenn Beck has "changed his mind" about Martin Luther king, and I'm supposed to applaud that.
I don't think he really changed his mind. I just think he's using King's legacy to justify a "white rights" movement.
| 589 |
Dark_Falcon Sun, Aug 29, 2010 9:13:19am |
re: #569 harlequinade
though - if I upset DF by that observation then
of course he'll turn the other cheek// I apologise. Outside the sarc tags.
Apology accepted. Please do note that have been a defender of Rush Limbaugh's vile rants. If you want to say I'm wrong on Nancy Pelosi, fine, make your case or joke. But please don't make a joke that accuses me of doing something I did not do.
| 590 |
prairiefire Sun, Aug 29, 2010 9:13:21am |
re: #489 Walter L. Newton
Pelosi said one of her favorite moments from Inauguration Day was when Marine One lifted off the Capitol grounds, signifying former President George W. Bush's exit from Washington. "It felt like a 10-pound anvil was lifted off my head," she said.
[Link: www.sfgate.com...]
I agree with her. I felt the same way.
| 591 |
Stanghazi Sun, Aug 29, 2010 9:13:38am |
LGF's catch of Beck calling MLK a socialist was mentioned in this John Avlon's Daily Beast column today.
[Link: www.thedailybeast.com...]
| 592 |
What, me worry? Sun, Aug 29, 2010 9:14:14am |
re: #579 sagehen
They don't spend *as high a percentage* of their available money. And what they do spend, isn't always spent here.
If people just scraping by get some extra cash, they'll pour every last penny back into the economy. They'll get their kid that new pair of shoes they'd been putting off, from a shoestore whose proprieter will now buy a dress from a seamstress who spends half the money on fabric and the other half at a local restaurant where the server uses her tip to get her hair done by a beautician who'll pick up some produce from the local farmers' market on her way home. That money counts 5 times towards GDP because it keeps moving.
If upper middle-class people get some extra cash maybe they'll put it in their 401k, or make an extra mortgage payment, or take that trip to Paris and buy things in some other country's economy.
If the awesomely wealthy get some extra cash, maybe they'll bid up the price of a Rembrandt, which adds only the auction house's commission to anybody's economy.
The biggest stimulative effect of tax cuts is at the bottom.
Right on.
Meanwhile, Glenn Beck has the audacity to stand in the footsteps of one of this country's greatest minds, Dr. King, and talk about how the poor and elderly (for those are the ones who greatly benefit from "entitlement programs") are leaching off society and the backwoods sheeple lap it up like dogs. It's sickening.
Let's take away their Medicare and see how fast they run from Beck.
| 593 |
Walter L. Newton Sun, Aug 29, 2010 9:14:35am |
re: #578 Vambo
lolwhut?
I think Satan >> Hitler.
And I didn't I just mention the Godwin hysteria of the left? How does that compare to "kill all liberals"??? IT DOESN'T.
ALL OF YOU CAN STFU NOW. You're done.
I didn't see you link to something about "killing all liberal." Honest question... What did I miss? I was responding to you comment. If I missed something about "killing all liberal" help me out here.
And no, I don't think "all of you" (whoever that is) is going to shut the fuck up... unless you like debating in an echo chamber.
| 594 |
HappyBenghazi Sun, Aug 29, 2010 9:14:44am |
"Changed his mind" Yeah after he figured he could use MLK's legacy to push his movement. How he uses MLK's name to push a movement that disdains social justice and race baits all the time I don't know. Seriously this is a guy who used Martin Nimholler's famous poem to claim persecution by the Obama administration.
| 595 |
Lidane Sun, Aug 29, 2010 9:15:00am |
re: #586 PT Barnum
There's not a lot of people in the mainstream left promoting the 9/11 truther position.
as compared to the number of people on the right still flogging the birther nonsense.
What's hilarious about the 9/11 troofer idiocy is that the same guy who was justifiably crucified by the right for promoting that garbage -- i.e., Alex Jones -- is now a hero to them since Obama got elected.
Oh, and Jones is a nirther too. Gotta love that convergence of stupid.
| 596 |
Dark_Falcon Sun, Aug 29, 2010 9:15:17am |
re: #589 Dark_Falcon
Apology accepted. Please do note that I have not been a defender of Rush Limbaugh's vile rants. If you want to say I'm wrong on Nancy Pelosi, fine, make your case or joke. But please don't make a joke that accuses me of doing something I did not do.
PIMF
| 597 |
SanFranciscoZionist Sun, Aug 29, 2010 9:15:52am |
re: #297 Shiplord Kirel
The detestable Phelper gang was hosed down with pepper spray as they attempted to desecrate a Marine's funeral in Omaha yesterday. My sympathy meter is registering zero, must be broken.
Man fires pepper spray on protesters outside Marine's funeral
The miscreant motorist who committed this outrage was arrested and charged with various contrived offenses. I suggest a jury trial.
I suggest a medal, and perhaps a ticker-tape parade.
| 598 |
Nervous Norvous Sun, Aug 29, 2010 9:15:56am |
re: #593 Walter L. Newton
I didn't see you link to something about "killing all liberal." Honest question... What did I miss? I was responding to you comment. If I missed something about "killing all liberal" help me out here.
And no, I don't think "all of you" (whoever that is) is going to shut the fuck up... unless you like debating in an echo chamber.
He didn't but I sure did. See 463.
| 599 |
harlequinade Sun, Aug 29, 2010 9:16:25am |
re: #589 Dark_Falcon
Indeed. It was meant more as a general comment about the situation as opposed to suggesting that you said it.
| 600 |
Stanghazi Sun, Aug 29, 2010 9:16:46am |
You must see this tee-shirt they had at the revival yesterday
PALIN babies-guns-Jesus
| 601 |
Walter L. Newton Sun, Aug 29, 2010 9:17:06am |
re: #586 PT Barnum
There's not a lot of people in the mainstream left promoting the 9/11 truther position.
as compared to the number of people on the right still flogging the birther nonsense.
Kirkspencer asked to be shown "Congressmen, party officials, national media representatives on the left who made equally offensive statements, all cited." Not a lot, not 2, not 20, his statement was as stated. I did that.
In case you missed it. Ellison is a Congressman last time I checked.
| 602 |
prairiefire Sun, Aug 29, 2010 9:17:45am |
re: #583 Killgore Trout
I went through the flkr photos. That was a hell of a lot of old, white people.
| 603 |
swamprat Sun, Aug 29, 2010 9:18:09am |
re: #523 Charles
The left's vitriol during the Bush administration was inexcusable.
But the right's embrace of bigotry as a political tool and their return to 1950's Lester Maddox politics trumps it easily.
I say this without any strings; both parties disgust me.
| 604 |
Dark_Falcon Sun, Aug 29, 2010 9:18:32am |
re: #600 Stanley Sea
You must see this tee-shirt they had at the revival yesterday
PALIN babies-guns-Jesus
AAAUUGGH! THE STUPID! IT BURNS!!
| 605 |
Nervous Norvous Sun, Aug 29, 2010 9:18:47am |
re: #601 Walter L. Newton
Kirkspencer asked to be shown "Congressmen, party officials, national media representatives on the left who made equally offensive statements, all cited." Not a lot, not 2, not 20, his statement was as stated. I did that.
In case you missed it. Ellison is a Congressman last time I checked.
But the point I was making was one of quantity as well as quality. I've never said that the left didn't have it's share of nuts, only that they seem to be kept down a little better while the right seems determined to let its freak flag fly.
| 606 |
Stanghazi Sun, Aug 29, 2010 9:19:03am |
| 607 |
Walter L. Newton Sun, Aug 29, 2010 9:19:46am |
re: #598 PT Barnum
He didn't but I sure did. See 463.
And Vambo didn't, I I was ONLY responding to his comment. If he was "thinking" about something that he read up thread, 150 comment ago, and doesn't quote it or mention it, I'm sorry, I can't read his mind from here.
Moot point on your part.
(P.S. The Rush remark was horrible).
| 608 |
darthstar Sun, Aug 29, 2010 9:20:15am |
re: #600 Stanley Sea
You must see this tee-shirt they had at the revival yesterday
PALIN babies-guns-Jesus
I want that one!
| 609 |
jamesfirecat Sun, Aug 29, 2010 9:20:56am |
re: #600 Stanley Sea
You must see this tee-shirt they had at the revival yesterday
PALIN babies-guns-Jesus
Wow, they couldn't even be bothered to put Jesus in between babies and guns.... or maybe go Jesus, Babies, Guns....
This is like that stupid fox, chicken, seed problem where you can't have guns next to babies, but you can't have it next to Jesus either...
| 610 |
Nervous Norvous Sun, Aug 29, 2010 9:21:02am |
re: #603 swamprat
The left's vitriol during the Bush administration was inexcusable.
But the right's embrace of bigotry as a political tool and their return to 1950's Lester Maddox politics trumps it easily.I say this without any strings; both parties disgust me.
The left went overboard during the Bush administration, but the taste on the left for that kind of rhetoric is pretty low. (See Air America, demise of, for a perfect example).
Meanwhile the number of right wing talkshows and talk show hosts have exploded.
| 611 |
Charles Johnson Sun, Aug 29, 2010 9:21:27am |
re: #527 Dark_Falcon
I went and read them. Also good finds. Park 51 does seem to have some malfactors in its funding apparatus. If that information holds up, they are a non-bigoted avenue of attack against Imam Rauf and the whole Park 51 idea.
There's absolutely nothing new in that Steve Emerson post, but there are several factual distortions. There's no evidence at all of "malfactors."
I think it's sad that you're still hoping to find that link to terrorism, after everything I've posted about this story.
| 612 |
HappyBenghazi Sun, Aug 29, 2010 9:21:36am |
re: #600 Stanley Sea
You must see this tee-shirt they had at the revival yesterday
PALIN babies-guns-Jesus
I can't for the life of me figure out what Jesus and Babies have to do with guns.
| 613 |
Nervous Norvous Sun, Aug 29, 2010 9:22:01am |
re: #609 jamesfirecat
Wow, they couldn't even be bothered to put Jesus in between babies and guns... or maybe go Jesus, Babies, Guns...
This is like that stupid fox, chicken, seed problem where you can't have guns next to babies, but you can't have it next to Jesus either...
You owe me a new monitor, as mine is now covered in Sun Drop (wish I could get it without driving down to Missouri)
| 614 |
Walter L. Newton Sun, Aug 29, 2010 9:22:23am |
re: #605 PT Barnum
But the point I was making was one of quantity as well as quality. I've never said that the left didn't have it's share of nuts, only that they seem to be kept down a little better while the right seems determined to let its freak flag fly.
Point is... shit is shit... I'm so glad that you have varying degrees of moral equivalencies in which you gauge hate speech.
| 615 |
Nervous Norvous Sun, Aug 29, 2010 9:22:25am |
re: #612 HappyWarrior
I can't for the life of me figure out what Jesus and Babies have to do with guns.
Shot gun weddings.
| 616 |
Nervous Norvous Sun, Aug 29, 2010 9:23:32am |
re: #614 Walter L. Newton
Point is... shit is shit... I'm so glad that you have varying degrees of moral equivalencies in which you gauge hate speech.
Walter, we're going to have to disagree on this one, as we both seem to think the other guilty of false equivaancies.
| 617 |
_RememberTonyC Sun, Aug 29, 2010 9:24:04am |
re: #610 PT Barnum
The left went overboard during the Bush administration, but the taste on the left for that kind of rhetoric is pretty low. (See Air America, demise of, for a perfect example).
Meanwhile the number of right wing talkshows and talk show hosts have exploded.
the right has been doing talk radio better than the left for a long time. air america died because it was a shitty product. and nobody wanted to buy advertising time on the "network."
| 618 |
Walter L. Newton Sun, Aug 29, 2010 9:24:15am |
re: #616 PT Barnum
Walter, we're going to have to disagree on this one, as we both seem to think the other guilty of false equivaancies.
I'm talking about "equivalencies."
| 619 |
HappyBenghazi Sun, Aug 29, 2010 9:24:26am |
| 620 |
Dark_Falcon Sun, Aug 29, 2010 9:24:32am |
re: #611 Charles
There's absolutely nothing new in that Steve Emerson post, but there are several factual distortions. There's no evidence at all of "malfactors."
I think it's sad that you're still hoping to find that link to terrorism, after everything I've posted about this story.
Not a link to actual terrorist, but I'd call Mathir Mohammad a bigot (at least regarding Jews).
| 621 |
darthstar Sun, Aug 29, 2010 9:25:11am |
re: #612 HappyWarrior
I can't for the life of me figure out what Jesus and Babies have to do with guns.
Give babies guns so they can sooner get to see Jesus.
| 622 |
Nervous Norvous Sun, Aug 29, 2010 9:25:12am |
re: #618 Walter L. Newton
I'm talking about "equivalencies."
Sorry..tried to correct my spelling and missed it.
| 623 |
Walter L. Newton Sun, Aug 29, 2010 9:25:16am |
re: #618 Walter L. Newton
I'm talking about "equivalencies."
Ha... ha... I spelt something right for once :)
| 624 |
Charles Johnson Sun, Aug 29, 2010 9:25:42am |
re: #620 Dark_Falcon
Not a link to actual terrorist, but I'd call Mathir Mohammad a bigot (at least regarding Jews).
And there's no link to Mahathir Mohamad.
| 625 |
Stanghazi Sun, Aug 29, 2010 9:26:06am |
re: #612 HappyWarrior
I can't for the life of me figure out what Jesus and Babies have to do with guns.
Palin provides them all. To you America!
| 626 |
HappyBenghazi Sun, Aug 29, 2010 9:26:08am |
| 627 |
Nervous Norvous Sun, Aug 29, 2010 9:26:16am |
re: #616 PT Barnum
Walter, we're going to have to disagree on this one, as we both seem to think the other guilty of false equivalencies.
SCIMF (spell check is my friend)
| 628 |
Gus Sun, Aug 29, 2010 9:26:29am |
re: #583 Killgore Trout
That's the same idiot I linked to here:
[Link: littlegreenfootballs.com...]
You can see the black shirt is over the red shirt in that photo. Here you can see him with the shirt you linked:
[Link: www.flickr.com...]
| 629 |
Charles Johnson Sun, Aug 29, 2010 9:27:42am |
Another shirt from the Beck rally: "Palin - Babies, Guns, Jesus"
[Link: picasaweb.google.com...]
| 630 |
What, me worry? Sun, Aug 29, 2010 9:27:55am |
re: #603 swamprat
The left's vitriol during the Bush administration was inexcusable.
But the right's embrace of bigotry as a political tool and their return to 1950's Lester Maddox politics trumps it easily.I say this without any strings; both parties disgust me.
I would argue that it was not inexcusable. The Left didn't want faith based initiatives. Since when do "God-fearing" people get preference over the non-believer? He was called a fascist because people were terrified that his one-sided policies would turn this country into a dictatorship. That was very real in a way that doesn't compare in any way to Obama's administration.
He did not support once single piece of gay rights legislation.
He did not support stem cell research.
He chipped away at affirmative action.
He was horrible at environmental protections, including stripping funding for the shoring up of the levees in New Orleans.
No child left behind was underfunded and useless.
Sex education was reduced to abstinence only.
Crap, need I go on.
| 631 |
Stonemason Sun, Aug 29, 2010 9:27:55am |
re: #565 Vambo
There was a post here in the last couple months or so, where it was reported that Beck did indeed claim Obama to be the Dark Prince. How does the left outdo the right on that one?
hmmm, Hugo Chavez, while not American, is celebrated on the left in America. He 'smelled the sulpher'.
See, it can go on all day.
| 632 |
swamprat Sun, Aug 29, 2010 9:28:06am |
re: #610 PT Barnum
Beck lost me with me when he said that the commie artist doing sculpture for Roosevelt was proof the Roosevelt was a commie too. Hell, in that era, it would have been difficult to find an artist who wasn't.
| 633 |
jamesfirecat Sun, Aug 29, 2010 9:28:29am |
re: #628 Gus 802
That's the same idiot I linked to here:
[Link: littlegreenfootballs.com...]
You can see the black shirt is over the red shirt in that photo. Here you can see him with the shirt you linked:
[Link: www.flickr.com...]
You know that's some determined racism right there where you decide to put on a racist black shirt because its a little chilly outside, but you also make sure to have a racist red shirt on underneath in case it starts to get warm...
Like a Russian Nesting doll of racism....
| 634 |
Lidane Sun, Aug 29, 2010 9:28:50am |
re: #617 _RememberTonyC
air america died because it was a shitty product. and nobody wanted to buy advertising time on the "network."
On the upside, Air America's death gave us Rachel Maddow on TV every night. I consider that a win.
| 635 |
jaunte Sun, Aug 29, 2010 9:29:43am |
re: #633 jamesfirecat
You know that's some determined racism right there where you decide to put on a racist black shirt because its a little chilly outside, but you also make sure to have a racist red shirt on underneath in case it starts to get warm...
Like a Russian Nesting doll of racism...
I wonder what his tattoos say.
| 636 |
SanFranciscoZionist Sun, Aug 29, 2010 9:29:50am |
re: #532 Vambo
So basically the worst that the left has to offer are Godwinisms.
Meanwhile, Rush Limbaugh thinks we shouldn't kill all the liberals, because we need some to keep in museums.
yeah.
So, basically, Democrats say that George Bush acts like a Nazi.
Meanwhile, Rush talks like a Nazi.
Hmmm. I suppose it will all come out in the wash.
| 637 |
_RememberTonyC Sun, Aug 29, 2010 9:30:29am |
guns first started to appear in the 1100s, so Jesus would not have known what a gun even was.
| 638 |
Stanghazi Sun, Aug 29, 2010 9:30:29am |
re: #633 jamesfirecat
You know that's some determined racism right there where you decide to put on a racist black shirt because its a little chilly outside, but you also make sure to have a racist red shirt on underneath in case it starts to get warm...
Like a Russian Nesting doll of racism...
Thanks. Now I'm imagining his tattoos.
| 639 |
Nervous Norvous Sun, Aug 29, 2010 9:30:31am |
re: #634 Lidane
On the upside, Air America's death gave us Rachel Maddow on TV every night. I consider that a win.
Me too.
| 640 |
Gus Sun, Aug 29, 2010 9:30:43am |
re: #629 Charles
Another shirt from the Beck rally: "Palin - Babies, Guns, Jesus"
[Link: picasaweb.google.com...]
Here's another one modeled by Celtus:
[Link: www.flickr.com...]
| 642 |
Nervous Norvous Sun, Aug 29, 2010 9:31:45am |
| 643 |
HappyBenghazi Sun, Aug 29, 2010 9:31:55am |
Yahoo story I'm reading has Beck apparently "regretting" calling Obama a racist yet he continues to call him the anti-christ and level other crazy allegations at the administration and you can see from the pictures people have posted that his rally attenders yesterday bought the Obama is a racist line hook and nail.
| 644 |
jamesfirecat Sun, Aug 29, 2010 9:32:10am |
re: #640 Gus 802
Here's another one modeled by Celtus:
[Link: www.flickr.com...]
Some folk'll never loose a toe
But then again some folk'll
Like Cletus the slack jawed yokel
(Sorry instant Simpson's reference ran through my brain...)
| 645 |
SanFranciscoZionist Sun, Aug 29, 2010 9:32:36am |
re: #557 jaunte
Is there a term similar to 'Godwin' that will extend all the way to the 'government are Satan worshippers' rhetoric that Glenn Beck is using?
[Link: mediamatters.org...]
I think the Satan references should be called "Dantes".
| 646 |
Vambo Sun, Aug 29, 2010 9:32:37am |
re: #602 prairiefire
I went through the flkr photos. That was a hell of a lot of old, white people.
I have never seen so many white victims of racism in my life.
| 647 |
Lidane Sun, Aug 29, 2010 9:32:41am |
re: #637 _RememberTonyC
guns first started to appear in the 1100s, so Jesus would not have known what a gun even was.
Pfft. Facts don't matter to the True Believers. As far as they're concerned, Jesus was all about babies, guns, and money.
| 648 |
Nervous Norvous Sun, Aug 29, 2010 9:32:48am |
re: #643 HappyWarrior
Yahoo story I'm reading has Beck apparently "regretting" calling Obama a racist yet he continues to call him the anti-christ and level other crazy allegations at the administration and you can see from the pictures people have posted that his rally attenders yesterday bought the Obama is a racist line hook and nail.
The problem isn't Beck, it's the people who he caters to.
| 649 |
Nervous Norvous Sun, Aug 29, 2010 9:33:19am |
| 650 |
Nervous Norvous Sun, Aug 29, 2010 9:33:56am |
re: #647 Lidane
Pfft. Facts don't matter to the True Believers. As far as they're concerned, Jesus was all about babies, guns, and money.
They never do. That's why creationism and Intelligent Design are such crocks of effluvia, at least as science.
| 651 |
HappyBenghazi Sun, Aug 29, 2010 9:34:09am |
re: #648 PT Barnum
The problem isn't Beck, it's the people who he caters to.
I don't know man. It's kinda like the chicken and egg question to me. These people need a guy like Beck to tell them how awful Obama is. If not, many of them would move on with their lives and realize that Obama isn't this evil racist socialist muslim who is destroying the country.
| 652 |
jaunte Sun, Aug 29, 2010 9:34:15am |
re: #645 SanFranciscoZionist
Beck and Chavez have Dante'd the thread...
| 653 |
What, me worry? Sun, Aug 29, 2010 9:34:18am |
| 654 |
Charles Johnson Sun, Aug 29, 2010 9:34:37am |
re: #643 HappyWarrior
Yahoo story I'm reading has Beck apparently "regretting" calling Obama a racist yet he continues to call him the anti-christ and level other crazy allegations at the administration and you can see from the pictures people have posted that his rally attenders yesterday bought the Obama is a racist line hook and nail.
He's "regretting" it because he was confronted by an angry black radio host and asked to justify it. Beck is a coward.
He'll be back saying the same thing before very long.
| 655 |
Nervous Norvous Sun, Aug 29, 2010 9:35:00am |
re: #650 PT Barnum
They never do. That's why creationism and Intelligent Design are such crocks of effluvia, at least as science.
of course, there are some that think we're all in some sort of highly sophisticated SIMs game, although my player has gotta be bored out of his skull by now.
| 656 |
Walter L. Newton Sun, Aug 29, 2010 9:35:22am |
re: #643 HappyWarrior
Yahoo story I'm reading has Beck apparently "regretting" calling Obama a racist yet he continues to call him the anti-christ and level other crazy allegations at the administration and you can see from the pictures people have posted that his rally attenders yesterday bought the Obama is a racist line hook and nail.
I wish people in general, Beck, who ever, would at least stop comparing others to mythical characters. There are plenty of real evil people, dead or alive that would make a better comparison.
| 657 |
HappyBenghazi Sun, Aug 29, 2010 9:35:25am |
re: #654 Charles
He's "regretting" it because he was confronted by an angry black radio host and asked to justify it. Beck is a coward.
He'll be back saying the same thing before very long.
Didn't know about that part and yep I'm sure he will be soon.
| 658 |
_RememberTonyC Sun, Aug 29, 2010 9:35:33am |
re: #634 Lidane
On the upside, Air America's death gave us Rachel Maddow on TV every night. I consider that a win.
but that win is balanced by al franken in the senate ... and I'm not a big fan of his ...
| 659 |
Nervous Norvous Sun, Aug 29, 2010 9:36:14am |
re: #651 HappyWarrior
I don't know man. It's kinda like the chicken and egg question to me. These people need a guy like Beck to tell them how awful Obama is. If not, many of them would move on with their lives and realize that Obama isn't this evil racist socialist muslim who is destroying the country.
But they'd still have those fears and bigotries whether or not Beck was there to exploit them, don't you think?
| 660 |
Dark_Falcon Sun, Aug 29, 2010 9:36:27am |
re: #644 jamesfirecat
Some folk'll never loose a toe
But then again some folk'll
Like Cletus the slack jawed yokel(Sorry instant Simpson's reference ran through my brain...)
Good quote from a great episode.
| 661 |
Vambo Sun, Aug 29, 2010 9:36:42am |
re: #631 Stonemason
hmmm, Hugo Chavez, while not American, is celebrated on the left in America. He 'smelled the sulpher'.
See, it can go on all day.
Bwahaha. You could also quote Osama Bin Laden as an example of leftist extremism, and it would carry as much weight.
| 662 |
jamesfirecat Sun, Aug 29, 2010 9:36:46am |
re: #658 _RememberTonyC
but that win is balanced by al franken in the senate ... and I'm not a big fan of his ...
What don't you like about him/his work in the senate?
| 663 |
What, me worry? Sun, Aug 29, 2010 9:37:16am |
re: #658 _RememberTonyC
but that win is balanced by al franken in the senate ... and I'm not a big fan of his ...
What was wrong with Air America? We have dozens of right wing radio talk. Maybe one left wing talk show would be ok?
Al Franken is an awesome public servant.
| 664 |
Lidane Sun, Aug 29, 2010 9:37:35am |
re: #658 _RememberTonyC
I'll agree that Franken can be a pompous douche, but Rachel > Al, so it's still a win. :D
| 665 |
Nervous Norvous Sun, Aug 29, 2010 9:38:01am |
re: #658 _RememberTonyC
but that win is balanced by al franken in the senate ... and I'm not a big fan of his ...
So far Franken has been exceptionally wonkish. I think a lot of conservatives were expecting him to be writing comedy instead of actually doing the grunt work.
| 666 |
SanFranciscoZionist Sun, Aug 29, 2010 9:38:02am |
re: #626 HappyWarrior
Baby want pistol
Remember when Maggie Simpson shot Mr. Burns because he tried to take her lollipop?
| 667 |
HappyBenghazi Sun, Aug 29, 2010 9:38:10am |
re: #659 PT Barnum
But they'd still have those fears and bigotries whether or not Beck was there to exploit them, don't you think?
Oh for sure.
| 668 |
_RememberTonyC Sun, Aug 29, 2010 9:38:12am |
re: #662 jamesfirecat
What don't you like about him/his work in the senate?
his smarmy attitude .... he is annoying to me ...
| 669 |
Walter L. Newton Sun, Aug 29, 2010 9:38:44am |
re: #664 Lidane
I'll agree that Franken can be a pompous douche, but Rachel > Al, so it's still a win. :D
And Ed Schultz is my favorite liberal talk show host.
| 670 |
jamesfirecat Sun, Aug 29, 2010 9:39:20am |
re: #660 Dark_Falcon
Good quote from a great episode.
Hell I remember more or less the entire segment if you'll excuse the paraphrase...
Cletus: Hey Brandine, I found some new shoes your mamma could wear to work.
Brandine: And scruff up the topless dancing runway? You best bring em back where you got em from...
Cletus: (Hnaging from a telephone pole) There you go (tosses shoes with laces tied together over the telephone lines) to wait for a woman of less discriminating taste. (Pause) You know I could call my mah while I'm up here.... HEY MAH! GET OFF THE DANG ROOF!
Some folk'll never eat a skunk
But then a gain some folk'll
Like Cletus the slack jawed yokel.....
| 671 |
SanFranciscoZionist Sun, Aug 29, 2010 9:39:20am |
re: #647 Lidane
Pfft. Facts don't matter to the True Believers. As far as they're concerned, Jesus was all about babies, guns, and money.
Babies are the only item on that list I ever recall him saying anything good about.
| 672 |
What, me worry? Sun, Aug 29, 2010 9:39:38am |
re: #661 Vambo
Bwahaha. You could also quote Osama Bin Laden as an example of leftist extremism, and it would carry as much weight.
For real. I guess to some people on the right Noam Chomsky is the hero of the left. Good freakin grief.
| 673 |
Lidane Sun, Aug 29, 2010 9:39:39am |
re: #665 PT Barnum
So far Franken has been exceptionally wonkish. I think a lot of conservatives were expecting him to be writing comedy instead of actually doing the grunt work.
They didn't pay attention to his radio show. The guy was a total wonk, which made his show so dull my eyes would glaze over. The fact that anyone expected him to run for office then just go to work every day dressed as Stuart Smalley showed they had underestimated him.
| 674 |
Stonemason Sun, Aug 29, 2010 9:40:02am |
re: #661 Vambo
Bwahaha. You could also quote Osama Bin Laden as an example of leftist extremism, and it would carry as much weight.
no, in the grand scheme of things, OBL would be 'right', though he is not celebrated by the left or the right in this country. Hugo Chavez is celebrated by the left media (remember, you asked to compare a media figure (beck) to a left figure).
My comparison stands, though you may not like it.
| 675 |
SanFranciscoZionist Sun, Aug 29, 2010 9:40:19am |
re: #656 Walter L. Newton
I wish people in general, Beck, who ever, would at least stop comparing others to mythical characters. There are plenty of real evil people, dead or alive that would make a better comparison.
Aren't you being a little dismissive of Dr, King's niece, Walter? I'm sure they talk about Satan all the time at her church.
// ;)
| 676 |
Nervous Norvous Sun, Aug 29, 2010 9:40:21am |
re: #669 Walter L. Newton
And Ed Schultz is my favorite liberal talk show host.
I can't stand Schultz or Olbermann. They could toss both of them before I'd want them to get rid of Maddow. The only purpose Olbermann has now is that he put Maddow on a lot before she got her own show.
| 677 |
_RememberTonyC Sun, Aug 29, 2010 9:40:22am |
re: #663 marjoriemoon
What was wrong with Air America? We have dozens of right wing radio talk. Maybe one left wing talk show would be ok?
Al Franken is an awesome public servant.
AA was not a good product. had it been a good product, the public would have embraced it. the marketplace was at work here. there are some succesful liberal talkers in local markets, but not nationally.
| 678 |
jamesfirecat Sun, Aug 29, 2010 9:41:40am |
re: #668 _RememberTonyC
his smarmy attitude ... he is annoying to me ...
I find many elected conservatives ignorance/refusal to admit to the obvious (like Bobby Jindal saying the stimulus is bad then going around his state handing out giant checks like a gameshow host) much more irritating/offsetting than a smarmy attitude as long as it is backed up by a logical and well researched opinion personally.
| 679 |
Obdicut Sun, Aug 29, 2010 9:41:47am |
re: #674 Stonemason
no, in the grand scheme of things, OBL would be 'right', though he is not celebrated by the left or the right in this country. Hugo Chavez is celebrated by the left media (remember, you asked to compare a media figure (beck) to a left figure).
My comparison stands, though you may not like it.
He's really not, though.
Sean Penn celebrates him.
Nobody else really does.
Nobody in the Democratic establishment does.
Magical Balance Fairy does not exist.
| 680 |
What, me worry? Sun, Aug 29, 2010 9:42:22am |
re: #674 Stonemason
no, in the grand scheme of things, OBL would be 'right', though he is not celebrated by the left or the right in this country. Hugo Chavez is celebrated by the left media (remember, you asked to compare a media figure (beck) to a left figure).
My comparison stands, though you may not like it.
Chavez is celebrated by the Left? By whom? Chomsky and Sheehan? You really know nothing about the Left.
| 681 |
Vambo Sun, Aug 29, 2010 9:42:34am |
re: #674 Stonemason
no, in the grand scheme of things, OBL would be 'right', though he is not celebrated by the left or the right in this country. Hugo Chavez is celebrated by the left media (remember, you asked to compare a media figure (beck) to a left figure).
My comparison stands, though you may not like it.
You'll have to give a recent example of that. I have not heard any praise for Chavez that wasn't from a college student circa 2006.
| 682 |
Nervous Norvous Sun, Aug 29, 2010 9:42:35am |
re: #677 _RememberTonyC
AA was not a good product. had it been a good product, the public would have embraced it. the marketplace was at work here. there are some succesful liberal talkers in local markets, but not nationally.
The problem with Air America is that you either had looney bat shit insane (Gerafalo) or dull sensible pedantic (Franken)
On the other hand Franken's books are hysterical.
| 683 |
Walter L. Newton Sun, Aug 29, 2010 9:42:44am |
re: #675 SanFranciscoZionist
Aren't you being a little dismissive of Dr, King's niece, Walter? I'm sure they talk about Satan all the time at her church.
// ;)
I don't cater to mystical fairy tale telling from anyone. I QUESTION the concepts, but I don't mock the language or the person. Please note the difference.
| 684 |
Stonemason Sun, Aug 29, 2010 9:43:11am |
re: #672 marjoriemoon
For real. I guess to some people on the right Noam Chomsky is the hero of the left. Good freakin grief.
No...no...no...
It was this:
There was no left wing version of "President Obama is the devil".
I linked to one.
Get over it, the left is as bad as the right, the right is as bad as the left.
When ever one side say's "We are not as bad as all that," you are being lied to.
| 685 |
Dark_Falcon Sun, Aug 29, 2010 9:43:14am |
re: #670 jamesfirecat
Hell I remember more or less the entire segment if you'll excuse the paraphrase...
Cletus: Hey Brandine, I found some new shoes your mamma could wear to work.
Brandine: And scruff up the topless dancing runway? You best bring em back where you got em from...
Cletus: (Hnaging from a telephone pole) There you go (tosses shoes with laces tied together over the telephone lines) to wait for a woman of less discriminating taste. (Pause) You know I could call my mah while I'm up here... HEY MAH! GET OFF THE DANG ROOF!
Some folk'll never eat a skunk
But then a gain some folk'll
Like Cletus the slack jawed yokel...
Yeah, it was good. And it ended on an even better note when Nelson got mocked by the entire town.
| 686 |
Nervous Norvous Sun, Aug 29, 2010 9:43:35am |
re: #681 Vambo
You'll have to give a recent example of that. I have not heard any praise for Chavez that wasn't from a college student circa 2006.
The difference between right and left..
In the left we marginalize our loonies.
On the right, we nominate them for Vice President.
| 687 |
_RememberTonyC Sun, Aug 29, 2010 9:43:56am |
re: #678 jamesfirecat
I find many elected conservatives ignorance/refusal to admit to the obvious (like Bobby Jindal saying the stimulus is bad then going around his state handing out giant checks like a gameshow host) much more irritating/offsetting than a smarmy attitude as long as it is backed up by a logical and well researched opinion personally.
most of them suck, I agree. But I told you why I don't like franken. but since I don't live in Minnesota, his future is not up to me, unless he runs for national office.
| 688 |
Lidane Sun, Aug 29, 2010 9:44:01am |
re: #680 marjoriemoon
Chavez is celebrated by the Left? By whom? Chomsky and Sheehan? You really know nothing about the Left.
Seriously. I'd consider myself on the left, and I'd be damned before I'd ever give any credence to Chavez. I'm with the King of Spain on that one-- Chavez can STFU.
Just because Sean Penn and Cindy Sheehan might like him doesn't mean that everyone on the left does.
| 689 |
_RememberTonyC Sun, Aug 29, 2010 9:44:59am |
re: #682 PT Barnum
The problem with Air America is that you either had looney bat shit insane (Gerafalo) or dull sensible pedantic (Franken)
On the other hand Franken's books are hysterical.
randi rhodes too
| 690 |
Vambo Sun, Aug 29, 2010 9:45:04am |
I think Sheehan was heavily promoted by GOP personalities anyway, because she was so easy to hate. I felt sorry for her.
| 691 |
Varek Raith Sun, Aug 29, 2010 9:45:56am |
The equivalency is strong with this thread.
| 692 |
What, me worry? Sun, Aug 29, 2010 9:46:09am |
re: #677 _RememberTonyC
AA was not a good product. had it been a good product, the public would have embraced it. the marketplace was at work here. there are some succesful liberal talkers in local markets, but not nationally.
And to me that's a huge problem. We need a counterbalance to the total bullshit, fear-mongering pundits on the Right. I happened to like Air America.
I'm not sure what that says about Rush Limbaugh and Glenn Beck, that they have "good" products. The fact that the public, or a certain segment of the public embraces them speaks volumes about who they are.
Btw, where does Rush and Beck get their funding? GOP? Fox?
| 693 |
swamprat Sun, Aug 29, 2010 9:46:54am |
re: #680 marjoriemoon
Is Castro going to fit under that bus?
| 694 |
Stonemason Sun, Aug 29, 2010 9:47:03am |
re: #680 marjoriemoon
Chavez is celebrated by the Left? By whom? Chomsky and Sheehan? You really know nothing about the Left.
This from the poster who said that the first president to allow federal funds to be used to study fetal stem cells was against stem cell research.
Talking points suck.
The left is as bad as the right, the right is as bad as the left.
and on that I need to back away from the echo.
| 695 |
Charles Johnson Sun, Aug 29, 2010 9:47:04am |
re: #684 Stonemason
No...no...no...
It was this:
There was no left wing version of "President Obama is the devil".
I linked to one.
Get over it, the left is as bad as the right, the right is as bad as the left.
When ever one side say's "We are not as bad as all that," you are being lied to.
Well, that's your opinion, but in my opinion, you're completely wrong.
I've seen the left at their worst, and criticized them heavily for it. But the sheer hatred and racial animus that's pouring out of the unleashed right wing id is so far beyond the left's worst craziness that there's no comparison at all.
I've also been a target for smear attacks from both sides, and the ugliness and sick hatred that has come out of the right wing towards me for criticizing them has absolutely no parallel on the left.
| 696 |
Nervous Norvous Sun, Aug 29, 2010 9:47:32am |
re: #692 marjoriemoon
And to me that's a huge problem. We need a counterbalance to the total bullshit, fear-mongering pundits on the Right. I happened to like Air America.
I'm not sure what that says about Rush Limbaugh and Glenn Beck, that they have "good" products. The fact that the public, or a certain segment of the public embraces them speaks volumes about who they are.
Btw, where does Rush and Beck get their funding? GOP? Fox?
Actually I would like to see a radio show that pointed out the crap on both sides. Although the right seems to be hell bent on providing more ammunition at this point.
| 697 |
Nervous Norvous Sun, Aug 29, 2010 9:48:31am |
re: #695 Charles
Well, that's your opinion, but in my opinion, you're completely wrong.
I've seen the left at their worst, and criticized them heavily for it. But the sheer hatred and racial animus that's pouring out of the unleashed right wing id is so far beyond the left's worst craziness that there's no comparison at all.
I've also been a target for smear attacks from both sides, and the ugliness and sick hatred that has come out of the right wing towards me for criticizing them has absolutely no parallel on the left.
The left likes to argue with itself a lot. The right abhors deviation from its preconceived notions.
| 698 |
HappyBenghazi Sun, Aug 29, 2010 9:49:08am |
I can't get in to political talk radio for the life of me. Could be my age, could be how I view most political talk radio hosts as a whole, etc. I'd rather watch something like the Daily Show where I can see why such and such is absurd and if I'm lucky I get an interview with an author or actor whose work I want to see. I didn't get in to Air America honestly. Listened a couple times but I found it boring.
| 699 |
jamesfirecat Sun, Aug 29, 2010 9:49:31am |
re: #694 Stonemason
This from the poster who said that the first president to allow federal funds to be used to study fetal stem cells was against stem cell research.
Talking points suck.
The left is as bad as the right, the right is as bad as the left.
and on that I need to back away from the echo.
Magical Equivalence fairy says: Both sides are equally bad thus I can argue for Nihilism in the name of patriotism rather than having to support the left!
| 700 |
What, me worry? Sun, Aug 29, 2010 9:49:38am |
re: #684 Stonemason
No...no...no...
It was this:
There was no left wing version of "President Obama is the devil".
I linked to one.
Get over it, the left is as bad as the right, the right is as bad as the left.
When ever one side say's "We are not as bad as all that," you are being lied to.
I like my Democratic representatives. They are dedicated public servants who have done good things for the people who elected them. I don't like to think I'm alone in that.
| 701 |
Obdicut Sun, Aug 29, 2010 9:50:59am |
re: #694 Stonemason
The left is as bad as the right, the right is as bad as the left.
.
I never get why people believe in the Magical Balance Fairy.
Why do you think a mystical force exists, keeping two totally arbitrary camps in check?
I think you're making the mistake of the thinking that because potential for 'bad' on both the left and the right is infinite, that their actual iterations at any particular time are equal.
It makes no sense. At all.
| 702 |
What, me worry? Sun, Aug 29, 2010 9:52:33am |
re: #696 PT Barnum
Actually I would like to see a radio show that pointed out the crap on both sides. Although the right seems to be hell bent on providing more ammunition at this point.
A show for Independents then? Unfortunately, vitriol sells.
| 704 |
prairiefire Sun, Aug 29, 2010 9:52:46am |
re: #695 Charles
Thanks for stating that so well. I'm sick of the left being called out as bad as the current right wing crazies.
| 705 |
SanFranciscoZionist Sun, Aug 29, 2010 9:53:02am |
re: #679 Obdicut
He's really not, though.
Sean Penn celebrates him.
Nobody else really does.
Nobody in the Democratic establishment does.
Magical Balance Fairy does not exist.
I would say that part of the conversation we're having is that there is more of a divide on the left between the farther-left activists and celebrities, and the mainstream Democratic politicians, whereas the mainstream Republicans are somewhat more beholden to their farther-right (although very far from farthest right) wing. It's not universal, but it's a general trend.
This is actually an important distinction to make. I often find groups like Code Pink thrown up to me as examples of 'the Left' behaving badly, but they have very little mainstream access, which is why it worries me when groups that seems similarly kooky on the right appear to be getting it.
Similarly, I find that people here sometimes expect Obama to do extreme things to pander to his 'base'. The radical left is not a base for the Democrats in the same way the radical right is for the Republicans. They are a far more inconsistent source of votes, and far less likely to rally their followers to turn out the vote for a mainstream politician. Obama probably benefited from the bounce he got from a portion of this group losing their heads over him, but his strategy can't involve extensive courting of them for 2012, because in order to do that he would alienate too many mainstream Democratic voters and lose a majority of the independents. He's going to need to win reelection without the left fringe, or not at all.
Meanwhile, the GOP seems to be in a situation where the 'base' is moving farther and farther right, and getting more unruly by the day.
My analysis. It's difficult, because we tend to try to imagine U.S. politics as having some kind of bilateral symmetry, but except for the fact that about half of the voters will vote THIS way, and about half will vote THAT way, it doesn't.
| 706 |
Varek Raith Sun, Aug 29, 2010 9:54:15am |
re: #705 SanFranciscoZionist
I would say that part of the conversation we're having is that there is more of a divide on the left between the farther-left activists and celebrities, and the mainstream Democratic politicians, whereas the mainstream Republicans are somewhat more beholden to their farther-right (although very far from farthest right) wing. It's not universal, but it's a general trend.
This is actually an important distinction to make. I often find groups like Code Pink thrown up to me as examples of 'the Left' behaving badly, but they have very little mainstream access, which is why it worries me when groups that seems similarly kooky on the right appear to be getting it.
Similarly, I find that people here sometimes expect Obama to do extreme things to pander to his 'base'. The radical left is not a base for the Democrats in the same way the radical right is for the Republicans. They are a far more inconsistent source of votes, and far less likely to rally their followers to turn out the vote for a mainstream politician. Obama probably benefited from the bounce he got from a portion of this group losing their heads over him, but his strategy can't involve extensive courting of them for 2012, because in order to do that he would alienate too many mainstream Democratic voters and lose a majority of the independents. He's going to need to win reelection without the left fringe, or not at all.
Meanwhile, the GOP seems to be in a situation where the 'base' is moving farther and farther right, and getting more unruly by the day.
My analysis. It's difficult, because we tend to try to imagine U.S. politics as having some kind of bilateral symmetry, but except for the fact that about half of the voters will vote THIS way, and about half will vote THAT way, it doesn't.
This post is all scholarly and shit.
I'm offended.
///
| 707 |
Vambo Sun, Aug 29, 2010 9:54:23am |
re: #684 Stonemason
There was no left wing version of "President Obama is the devil".
I linked to one.
Get over it, the left is as bad as the right, the right is as bad as the left.
When ever one side say's "We are not as bad as all that," you are being lied to.
Let me get this straight, once and for all.
- Glenn Beck, hugely successful American pundit, on his American cable news show, calls President Obama "the devil".
- Hugo Chavez, not-so-loved foreign dictator, calls GWB "the devil".
And we are supposed to believe there is an equivalency here?
YOU get over it. All of the Sean Penns, Cindy Sheehans and annoying flower children of the last 30 years do not compare to the current right wing. If you can't see that by now, there's really no hope for you.
| 708 |
What, me worry? Sun, Aug 29, 2010 9:55:17am |
re: #697 PT Barnum
The left likes to argue with itself a lot. The right abhors deviation from its preconceived notions.
Better to point out the problems in your own party and figure out how to fix them, then to ignore them and let them run roughshod over everyone else. Moderate Republicans have sat on their hands while their most wacky have taken over. The moment Mike Steele apologized to Rush Limbaugh, I realized how much trouble the Republican party was facing.
| 709 |
ProGunLiberal Sun, Aug 29, 2010 9:55:59am |
Good soon to be noon everyone. If any one lives in North Carolina or New England, you might want to have a look at this.
[Link: www.nhc.noaa.gov...]
re: #705 SanFranciscoZionist
It does seem that the Republican Party has been taken by the wingnut activists in most case. The Democrats have prevented their moonbats from doing the same thus far.
| 710 |
Vambo Sun, Aug 29, 2010 9:57:16am |
BTW, we are seriously in danger of an Overton Window effect if we keep telling ourselves that a bunch of wimpy war protesters singing kumbaya, with very little establishment support, are "just as bad" as throat-slashing Islamophobes, people who think the Civil Rights movement is the cause of all our problems, Oathkeepers and the John Birch Society - all of which currently have political and heavy mainstream media representation.
| 711 |
SanFranciscoZionist Sun, Aug 29, 2010 9:58:24am |
re: #707 Vambo
Let me get this straight, once and for all.
- Glenn Beck, hugely successful American pundit, on his American cable news show, calls President Obama "the devil".
- Hugo Chavez, not-so-loved foreign dictator, calls GWB "the devil".And we are supposed to believe there is an equivalency here?
YOU get over it. All of the Sean Penns, Cindy Sheehans and annoying flower children of the last 30 years do not compare to the current right wing. If you can't see that by now, there's really no hope for you.
Between the two men, sure, equivalency.
It's just that very, very few Americans watch Hugo Chavez on TV every day, and get all their political information from him.
(Thank God, but the point here is that Beck is a tad more influential in these parts.)
| 712 |
prairiefire Sun, Aug 29, 2010 9:58:44am |
My grey haired mum in her sensible shoes, standing with her "No More War" sign, is considered far left by many. She is as non-threatening as a school bus driver.
What she is, is very persistent. Protesting, knocking on doors, signing petitions, donating, fund raising for candidates, writing letters to the editor.
All the right leaning folks talk about how they are just now waking up to the process of governing and now they are soooooooooo concerned. They are about 30 years late to the game.
| 713 |
HappyBenghazi Sun, Aug 29, 2010 9:58:47am |
re: #708 marjoriemoon
Better to point out the problems in your own party and figure out how to fix them, then to ignore them and let them run roughshod over everyone else. Moderate Republicans have sat on their hands while their most wacky have taken over. The moment Mike Steele apologized to Rush Limbaugh, I realized how much trouble the Republican party was facing.
Wasn't just Mike Steele. A Congressman from Georgia also apologized to Limbaugh after calling out Limbaugh. I mean it's just pathetic how they kiss Limbaugh's ass. The guy is scum pure and simple.
| 714 |
Nervous Norvous Sun, Aug 29, 2010 9:59:39am |
well it's been fun, but I gotta get some programming done today so I can get paid tomorrow.
| 715 |
Obdicut Sun, Aug 29, 2010 10:01:51am |
re: #705 SanFranciscoZionist
Well-said.
And, in the end, the only people who benefit from this delusion of left and right even existing as defineable areas, much less being in balance, are politicians. We are asked by them to define ourselves as 'left' or 'right' and vote for the politicians based on that. Independents swing elections, but even those independents have a narrative of going with the 'left' or 'right'.
They are conceptually nearly bankrupt terms.
I want to have universal health insurance, provided by single-payer, because of my libertarian economic beliefs. I think that it's absolutely obvious that sickness and injury are not only common threats to everyone, like crime and outside aggressors, but that any member of the population who is sick or incapacitated brings down the wealth of our nation. I want the poor dude with TB to get fully treated, not just to have his symptoms treated. I want him to go to work and make money to spend on things and to pay his taxes.
I want a guy who gets into a car accident to not have to sell his house to pay for the operations he needs. I don't want to see him drop out of the middle class, and lessen the opportunities for him to pay for his kids education due to medical expenses. Injury and sickness are only marginally predictable, and the most governing fact is genetics. All the idiocy about making people smart consumers of health care ignores human nature far more than Ayn Rand ever did.
So is my position on the 'left' or the 'right'? I don't want people to have health care because I care about them. I've never really been able to care about abstract, faceless people. I want people to get health care because I know we Americans will never tolerate turning critically ill people away from emergency wards-- they're not faceless then-- and because I think by paying a small amount in tax I can get a huge benefit in terms of having a healthy workforce not randomly devastated by the onslaught of medical bills, and not slowly sapped by insurance bills which go to companies that produce nothing, add no efficiency, and exist parasitically.
The ability to boil that stance of mine down to 'left' or 'right' is only useful to politicians. Not to we, the people.
| 716 |
SanFranciscoZionist Sun, Aug 29, 2010 10:04:38am |
re: #712 prairiefire
My grey haired mum in her sensible shoes, standing with her "No More War" sign, is considered far left by many. She is as non-threatening as a school bus driver.
What she is, is very persistent. Protesting, knocking on doors, signing petitions, donating, fund raising for candidates, writing letters to the editor.
All the right leaning folks talk about how they are just now waking up to the process of governing and now they are sooo concerned. They are about 30 years late to the game.
Except they aren't. Or the right isn't. Republicans in sensible shoes have been holding town meetings, working for various right-wing causes, often through churches, and phone-banking and fundraising for ages. They are largely getting ignored in this rush of crazy people who think they've invented something.
Minds me of when Zombie went phone-banking for Obama and freeked out. It took a couple of long-time Republican activists to post on the site and explain that McCain's people did exactly the same thing, and so did Bush's before them, and so on.
| 718 |
sattv4u2 Sun, Aug 29, 2010 10:07:18am |
re: #717 SanFranciscoZionist
OK, gotta et some work done!
You're gonna "et" your work??
Bon Apetite!
//
| 719 |
prairiefire Sun, Aug 29, 2010 10:08:08am |
re: #716 SanFranciscoZionist
Except they aren't. Or the right isn't. Republicans in sensible shoes have been holding town meetings, working for various right-wing causes, often through churches, and phone-banking and fundraising for ages. They are largely getting ignored in this rush of crazy people who think they've invented something.
Minds me of when Zombie went phone-banking for Obama and freeked out. It took a couple of long-time Republican activists to post on the site and explain that McCain's people did exactly the same thing, and so did Bush's before them, and so on.
Yes, the Religious Right. Sigh
| 720 |
(I Stand By What I Said Whatever It Was) Sun, Aug 29, 2010 10:12:48am |
re: #654 Charles
He's "regretting" it because he was confronted by an angry black radio host and asked to justify it. Beck is a coward.
He'll be back saying the same thing before very long.
Just for clarity's sake, so I can diminish my own ignorance: Who was this "angry black radio host"?
| 721 |
sagehen Sun, Aug 29, 2010 10:13:34am |
re: #669 Walter L. Newton
And Ed Schultz is my favorite liberal talk show host.
Ed Schultz irritates the hell out of me. I agree with him more than 2/3 of the time, but the way he leans in to yell at the camera, and that barking laugh instead of factual reasoning when he's discussing somebody who's said something "obviously" stupid, sometimes makes me wish I didn't. Same for Keith Olbermann.
| 722 |
sagehen Sun, Aug 29, 2010 10:17:38am |
re: #677 _RememberTonyC
AA was not a good product. had it been a good product, the public would have embraced it. the marketplace was at work here. there are some succesful liberal talkers in local markets, but not nationally.
The problem is that liberals live in more densely populated places, we commute by public transit and listen to our i-Pods. There's a lot more conservatives in the places where everybody's in their half the day.
| 723 |
ClaudeMonet Sun, Aug 29, 2010 10:18:51am |
re: #252 elbruce
Dude can't even spell "Mauritania." I'm not going to check out his claims if he can't spell them.
I doubt that he can find it on a world map, either.
"Don't write naughty words on walls if you can't spell"--Tom Lehrer, "Be Prepared"
| 724 |
What, me worry? Sun, Aug 29, 2010 10:19:01am |
re: #694 Stonemason
This from the poster who said that the first president to allow federal funds to be used to study fetal stem cells was against stem cell research.
Talking points suck.
The left is as bad as the right, the right is as bad as the left.
and on that I need to back away from the echo.
While Bush supported adult stem cell research and umbilical cord blood stem cell research, he opposed new embryonic stem cell research, and limited the federal funding of existing research which was first approved under Clinton.
[Link: www.nytimes.com...]
The veto, only the third of Mr. Bush’s presidency, puts him at odds not only with the majority of voters, according to polls, but also with many members of his own political party. Republicans sent him a similar measure last year when they controlled Congress. But even with considerable support from the Republican minority this year, Democrats concede they do not have enough votes for a veto override.
| 726 |
ClaudeMonet Sun, Aug 29, 2010 10:22:04am |
re: #281 Fat Bastard Vegetarian
Born in 55? Dang. You are old.
Hey! HEY! I resemble that remark!
(Doesn't bother me to be called old at age 54. My mother turns 80 next Saturday--now that's old.)
| 727 |
Killgore Trout Sun, Aug 29, 2010 10:22:10am |
| 728 |
darthstar Sun, Aug 29, 2010 10:26:28am |
re: #727 Killgore Trout
What Beck's Restoring Honor Looks Like
[Video]"Fuck you socialist monkeys!"
Looks like he got the message.
/
| 729 |
Walter L. Newton Sun, Aug 29, 2010 10:27:08am |
re: #719 prairiefire
Yes, the Religious Right. Sigh
I don't like to think about the religious right as some monolithic group, all spouting the exact same rhetoric, with the same meaning. I think what defines the Religious Right is when you find conservative Christians trying to use that message for divisive purposes, such as we see coming from people like Beck or Robertson etal:
An example...
"But American Christians, I must say to you as I said to the Roman Christians years ago, "Be not conformed to this world, but be ye transformed by the renewing of your mind." Or, as I said to the Phillipian Christians, "Ye are a colony of heaven." This means that although you live in the colony of time, your ultimate allegiance is to the empire of eternity. You have a dual citizenry. You live both in time and eternity; both in heaven and earth. Therefore, your ultimate allegiance is not to the government, not to the state, not to nation, not to any man-made institution. The Christian owes his ultimate allegiance to God, and if any earthly institution conflicts with God's will it is your Christian duty to take a stand against it. You must never allow the transitory evanescent demands of man-made institutions to take precedence over the eternal demands of the Almighty God."
That rhetoric, that liturgical language above, sounds "Beckian" in nature, and could certainly have been used, in the mouth of a fiery right wing preacher, at the Beck rally yesterday.
But the fact of the matter, that excerpt is from one of the many sermons of MLK. Certainly he was not using this rhetoric to tear anything down, as we see of certain right wing preachers.
You can find religious conservatives attending churches and staffed by preachers who do not follow the sort of crap we hear from Beck and his like. Unfortunately, they are smaller in number, and short on influence.
It would be nice if all preachers, on any side of the political spectrum, could have the heart of the sort message that MLK was preaching.
| 730 |
Interesting Times in Benghazi Sun, Aug 29, 2010 10:27:16am |
| 731 |
Charles Johnson Sun, Aug 29, 2010 10:27:58am |
re: #720 000G
Just for clarity's sake, so I can diminish my own ignorance: Who was this "angry black radio host"?
| 732 |
ClaudeMonet Sun, Aug 29, 2010 10:29:46am |
re: #327 Spare O'Lake
I got my mail late last night,
A letter from a girl who took the time to write,
To a lonesome boy somewhere in the night,
She sent me a railroad ticket too,
To take me to her lovin' arms,
And the big steel rail gonna carry me home
To the one I love.
Steel Rail Blues, one of my favorites.
| 733 |
Gus Sun, Aug 29, 2010 10:30:42am |
re: #727 Killgore Trout
What Beck's Restoring Honor Looks Like
[Video]"Fuck you socialist monkeys!"
Why do I get the feeling that he spends a lot of time in front of the mirror?
| 734 |
darthstar Sun, Aug 29, 2010 10:31:39am |
re: #727 Killgore Trout
Here's a good diary on dKos from "a liberal black man" who went to Beck's rally yesterday...mostly basic musings and observations but with some funny interactions he had with people.
[Link: www.dailykos.com...]
One quote as teaser:
So, I'm waiting in one of the very long lines for the Port A Potties when this woman comes up to me and grabs my wrist. I'd dug up my old Obama "Yes We Did!" rubber band for the event, but didn't think anyone would notice it. This lady, apparently did, and asked me (nicely. At first.), "What's this all about?" I told her "This is all about me using the bathroom". She looked flustered, then asked me "Why are you here today?" I said "I'm here to take a leak." Now, I could tell she was getting agitated, and she proceeded to tell me about how Glenn Beck's event was all about redeeming Dr. King's dream, and bringing people together, how Beck's tears alone could cure juvenile diabetes, blah, blah, blah. This goes on for about a full minute, as she's apparently clueless that I'm paying her zero attention. The Port A Potty door finally opens. "I'm using the bathroom now, please don't follow me," I tell her, as I walk past. When I came out she was gone. Weird, weird exchange.
| 735 |
(I Stand By What I Said Whatever It Was) Sun, Aug 29, 2010 10:32:36am |
re: #731 Charles
Excellent, thanks for clearing that up.
(I still maintain my stance on the whole reason thing, though, grumblegrumble)
| 736 |
Vicious Babushka Sun, Aug 29, 2010 10:33:15am |
re: #731 Charles
Joe Madison is cool. He used to broadcast in the Detroit area 20 years ago. He had a special feature where kids could call in to his show. My son loved his show and called in whenever he had "Kid's Hour"
| 737 |
ClaudeMonet Sun, Aug 29, 2010 10:33:30am |
re: #351 Spare O'Lake
By the time we got to Woodstock we were half a million strong
And everywhere there was song and celebration.
"Three days of mud, acid, and B.O."--Billy Joel
anyone who says they were there is lying, as anyone who was there wouldn't remember.
| 738 |
Digital Display Sun, Aug 29, 2010 10:35:32am |
I think Prince is a genius..Just a great writer and never got credit for being one bad ass lead guitarist...Just like Zappa never got his dues...
Dearly beloved
We are gathered here today
2 get through this thing called life
Electric word life
It means forever and that's a mighty long time
But I'm here 2 tell u
There's something else
The afterworld
A world of never ending happiness
U can always see the sun, day or night
So when u call up that shrink in Beverly Hills
U know the one - Dr Everything'll Be Alright
Instead of asking him how much of your time is left
Ask him how much of your mind, baby
'Cuz in this life
Things are much harder than in the afterworld
In this life
You're on your own
And if de-elevator tries 2 bring u down
Go crazy - punch a higher floor
If u don't like the world you're living in
Take a look around u
At least u got friends
Let's go Crazy by Prince.. Genius guitar lead also
| 739 |
Obdicut Sun, Aug 29, 2010 10:35:42am |
re: #729 Walter L. Newton
MLK was a preacher, giving a sermon.
Beck isn't a preacher. Calling him a preacher doesn't make him one.
Furthermore, you're blowing up a couple of offhanding comments about the liturgical language into a big deal, for no apparent reason. Liturgical language isn't Beckian. Beckian is one month excorciating MLK as a commie, and the next one celebrating him. It's having Lincoln posters at your event after you railed against Lincoln. It's making no fucking sense at all, at any time.
Your fixation on the liturgical language bit is surpassing strange.
| 740 |
What, me worry? Sun, Aug 29, 2010 10:35:50am |
re: #727 Killgore Trout
Wow. Just like Woodstock. Feel the love, baby.
| 741 |
Walter L. Newton Sun, Aug 29, 2010 10:36:24am |
What I find most interesting about the Beck rally yesterday, is that here we have a Mormon who is sounding more and more like a Billy Graham or an evangelical preacher. This has been noticed by a lot of non-Mormon preachers. It should be interesting to see how that all melds in the future.
| 742 |
Walter L. Newton Sun, Aug 29, 2010 10:37:28am |
re: #739 Obdicut
MLK was a preacher, giving a sermon.
Beck isn't a preacher. Calling him a preacher doesn't make him one.
Furthermore, you're blowing up a couple of offhanding comments about the liturgical language into a big deal, for no apparent reason. Liturgical language isn't Beckian. Beckian is one month excorciating MLK as a commie, and the next one celebrating him. It's having Lincoln posters at your event after you railed against Lincoln. It's making no fucking sense at all, at any time.
Your fixation on the liturgical language bit is surpassing strange.
Whatever.
| 744 |
sattv4u2 Sun, Aug 29, 2010 10:39:52am |
re: #743 Racer X
Fetch me a beer, woman!
Well,, one things for sure
She's not from West Virginia! (she has shoes on!!)
| 745 |
Obdicut Sun, Aug 29, 2010 10:40:36am |
re: #742 Walter L. Newton
Whatever.
Heh. Can you try to explain why you think liturgical language is what defines 'Beckian', rather than the actual content of what he says? Because I'm really at a loss as to why you think MLK sounds 'Beckian'. Apparently every religious figure in the world is Beckian, to you. So I'm wondering why you've perceived the criticism of Beck in such a very, very narrow way.
Or is that going to make you sleepy?
| 746 |
What, me worry? Sun, Aug 29, 2010 10:41:08am |
re: #734 darthstar
Here's a good diary on dKos from "a liberal black man" who went to Beck's rally yesterday...mostly basic musings and observations but with some funny interactions he had with people.
[Link: www.dailykos.com...]
One quote as teaser:
LOL Very cute!
As to "Yes We Did!" Reminds me of my grandad. I remember when I bought a "Datsun." They had a tagline at the time "Do it in a Datsun." My grandpa used to say to me, "What are you doing in there?" (He thought it was a poddy joke.)
| 747 |
harlequinade Sun, Aug 29, 2010 10:43:05am |
re: #738 HoosierHoops
I just saw him play the Roskilde festival. He's amazing.
And has a smile to _die_ for
| 748 |
William Barnett-Lewis Sun, Aug 29, 2010 10:43:09am |
re: #700 marjoriemoon
I like my Democratic representatives. They are dedicated public servants who have done good things for the people who elected them. I don't like to think I'm alone in that.
I live in the 2nd Congressional District of Wisconsin. There is utterly no reason for me to vote against either Senator Feingold or Representative Baldwin. They are two of the finest politicians I have ever had the pleasure of meeting.
| 749 |
prairiefire Sun, Aug 29, 2010 10:44:12am |
re: #738 HoosierHoops
He is ranked among the guitar gods, absolutely. And one sexy dude too boot. I was in downtown KC after his concert in 1983. We were leaving the restaurant, the concert was over, and these two African American ladies were leaving Prince's concert. They were giggling and laughing, saying "oh my god, he's crazy, oh my god." Then they stated hollaring "Prince" at one of the hotels that was by the arena where performers sometimes stayed. I thought "well, he sure made an impression."
If I am going to have a really sexy dream, Prince will usually make an appearance somewhere.
| 750 |
_RememberTonyC Sun, Aug 29, 2010 10:44:21am |
re: #692 marjoriemoon
And to me that's a huge problem. We need a counterbalance to the total bullshit, fear-mongering pundits on the Right. I happened to like Air America.
I'm not sure what that says about Rush Limbaugh and Glenn Beck, that they have "good" products. The fact that the public, or a certain segment of the public embraces them speaks volumes about who they are.
Btw, where does Rush and Beck get their funding? GOP? Fox?
advertising ... in other words ... the marketplace.
| 751 |
ClaudeMonet Sun, Aug 29, 2010 10:47:50am |
re: #488 researchok
John Wilkes Booth, Lee Harvey Oswald, John Hinckley Jr - where are you now that we need you?
Oh, it's to be excused because it was "irony". That's the same as Rush Limbaugh claiming his racist rants are "satire".
| 752 |
swamprat Sun, Aug 29, 2010 10:48:33am |
re: #730 publicityStunted
Well, you got your assassinated presidents in 1901 and 1963, your 60's radical bombers, your 30's and 40's bombs and murders, assassination attempts
lotta stuff
you sure you want to go there?
| 753 |
Digital Display Sun, Aug 29, 2010 10:49:06am |
re: #747 harlequinade
I just saw him play the Roskilde festival. He's amazing.
And has a smile to _die_ for
He is just one of the best song writers of all time.. Top 20 I'd say..He shreds a guitar..He writes great songs...I've danced to many of his songs back in the day...That was fun...I still want a red Corvette!
I had a mullet..Blond hair with a gold chain..LOL Fun times.. I liked Prince
| 754 |
What, me worry? Sun, Aug 29, 2010 10:49:07am |
re: #748 wlewisiii
I live in the 2nd Congressional District of Wisconsin. There is utterly no reason for me to vote against either Senator Feingold or Representative Baldwin. They are two of the finest politicians I have ever had the pleasure of meeting.
Feingold I know, but not Baldwin. Good to hear that. I love my Florida representatives. They're all fine Americans.
The Republicans are disappointed, disillusioned and cynical because they get so little from their elected officials. Maybe that's why they've glommed on to non-politician types like Beck and Rush. I guess there are some holes in that theory, too! But when I look at OUR non-politicians, like Penn, Chomsky and Sheehan, I see they get very little support from the rest of the Left. The Right tries to equate it, because they know nothing about liberal politics.
| 755 |
Walter L. Newton Sun, Aug 29, 2010 10:50:15am |
re: #745 Obdicut
Heh. Can you try to explain why you think liturgical language is what defines 'Beckian', rather than the actual content of what he says? Because I'm really at a loss as to why you think MLK sounds 'Beckian'. Apparently every religious figure in the world is Beckian, to you. So I'm wondering why you've perceived the criticism of Beck in such a very, very narrow way.
Or is that going to make you sleepy?
I am saying the the content does not have as much to do as the intent does. Beck's language yesterday, his rhetoric, was very much in the mold of the sort of preaching you hear/have heard from many preachers through history, including MLK.
My simple point was I don't think you can define "Religious Right" by the words that come out of their mouth, so much as how they use those words, and their intent behind them.
I've sat in many churches, with conservative right leaning congregants and heard similar liturgical language (it's a group speak, a way to recognize other believers) and these were not the kind of people who would think of attending a Beck rally, or watching Pat Robertson.
That's all my point was.
| 756 |
Interesting Times in Benghazi Sun, Aug 29, 2010 10:50:54am |
re: #752 swamprat
Sure - what have you got from the past 20 years to now?
| 757 |
What, me worry? Sun, Aug 29, 2010 10:51:24am |
re: #738 HoosierHoops
I saw him in Miami in the 80s with Appolonia (before she found religion). It among the top 3 performances I've ever seen. Another was Robert Palmer. Prince is a true showman.
| 758 |
Varek Raith Sun, Aug 29, 2010 10:53:07am |
re: #756 publicityStunted
Sure - what have you got from the past 20 years to now?
AAACCCOORRRNNN!!!!
| 759 |
sattv4u2 Sun, Aug 29, 2010 10:54:26am |
re: #756 publicityStunted
Sure - what have you got from the past 20 years to now?
What does the time frame have to do with the relevancy (in that you asked find me a domestic, American "left-wing" terrorist who did something equivalent to,,,)
| 760 |
Obdicut Sun, Aug 29, 2010 10:56:11am |
re: #755 Walter L. Newton
I am saying the the content does not have as much to do as the intent does.
Why, though? Obivously, content is the most important part of the speech, and what Beck is criticized for, and what MLK is celebrated for, is the content of their message, not the format of them.
Beck's language yesterday, his rhetoric, was very much in the mold of the sort of preaching you hear/have heard from many preachers through history, including MLK.
Language and rhetoric are actually very different things, and you're very wrongly conflating them. He used religious language, yes. So does Pat Robertson. So does the Dali Llama. If your point is only "Religious language is religoius language", um, yeah.
My simple point was I don't think you can define "Religious Right" by the words that come out of their mouth, so much as how they use those words, and their intent behind them.
I agree. That's why content matters. I'm not sure how you think you can determine intent, of course.
That's all my point was.
I think that you wrongly think that people are calling liturgical language Beckian, or that people have the impression that only those on the Religious right use religious language. I'm not sure where you got the idea from, but it's rather patently untrue.
| 761 |
sattv4u2 Sun, Aug 29, 2010 10:56:52am |
re: #757 marjoriemoon
I saw him in Miami in the 80s with Appolonia (before she found religion). It among the top 3 performances I've ever seen. Another was Robert Palmer. Prince is a true showman.
I remember the 1st time I saw her
I know I found religion that day
I recall saying, right out loud,, OH MY GOD!!!
| 762 |
ClaudeMonet Sun, Aug 29, 2010 10:57:40am |
re: #534 Dark_Falcon
It was a nasty, hostile, joke and it does show how Pelosi can be a hater.
She couldn't possibly be a hater. It is Known Fact that Democrats cannot be haters. No "real" democrat has ever hated anything (ignore all those southern Democrats up through the Sixties, they weren't "real" Democrats) or even said anything that could be called untrue. They love everything and everyone, and the world would be full of frolic, happiness, rainbows (without rain, of course) and unicorns if not for the evil that is the Republican party.///
Well, it's kind of hard to argue with the idea that the Repubs have been taken over by evil people.
| 763 |
Walter L. Newton Sun, Aug 29, 2010 10:58:34am |
re: #760 Obdicut
Why, though? Obivously, content is the most important part of the speech, and what Beck is criticized for, and what MLK is celebrated for, is the content of their message, not the format of them.
Language and rhetoric are actually very different things, and you're very wrongly conflating them. He used religious language, yes. So does Pat Robertson. So does the Dali Llama. If your point is only "Religious language is religoius language", um, yeah.
I agree. That's why content matters. I'm not sure how you think you can determine intent, of course.
I think that you wrongly think that people are calling liturgical language Beckian, or that people have the impression that only those on the Religious right use religious language. I'm not sure where you got the idea from, but it's rather patently untrue.
What's patently untrue?
| 764 |
swamprat Sun, Aug 29, 2010 10:58:58am |
re: #756 publicityStunted
Sure - what have you got from the past 20 years to now?
Oh, so those don't count. Hasta be in the last 20 years, eh?
I'm too lazy to play.
forfeit; take the board
| 765 |
sattv4u2 Sun, Aug 29, 2010 10:59:50am |
re: #764 swamprat
Oh, so those don't count. Hasta be in the last 20 years, eh?
I'm too lazy to play.
forfeit; take the board
Not so fast!!
See #759
There was no time limit asociated with his find me a domestic, American "left-wing" terrorist who did something equivalent to
| 766 |
Obdicut Sun, Aug 29, 2010 11:01:40am |
re: #763 Walter L. Newton
What's patently untrue?
Your definition of what "Beckian" is-- the usage of liturgical, religious language. That is a definition so broad as to be absolutely meaningless.
I'd also note that it's wrong to say MLK wasn't using that sermon to tear something down; he was attempting to tear down segregation.
| 767 |
Walter L. Newton Sun, Aug 29, 2010 11:01:50am |
re: #764 swamprat
Oh, so those don't count. Hasta be in the last 20 years, eh? I'm too lazy to play. forfeit; take the board
You noticed the technique? Throw out a proposal, when the proposal is answered, change the parameters, then use redefined politically correct words to nullify the common sense intent of the rebuttal, then pinpoint that you never heard this or that, and it wasn't said, on Sunday evening of the last full moon... ha... gotcha.
| 768 |
swamprat Sun, Aug 29, 2010 11:02:31am |
re: #765 sattv4u2
I saw the goalposts move, that told me everything.
| 769 |
(I Stand By What I Said Whatever It Was) Sun, Aug 29, 2010 11:02:41am |
Going back through LGF archives to find mentionings of Raimondo, I stumbled upon this page in which the guy was mentioned by NY Nana. I was surprised to see that her account was blocked but could not (conveniently anyhow) find out why because her latest comments were too long ago. Anyone kind enough to clue me in about why she was blocked?
| 770 |
Walter L. Newton Sun, Aug 29, 2010 11:02:44am |
re: #766 Obdicut
Your definition of what "Beckian" is-- the usage of liturgical, religious language. That is a definition so broad as to be absolutely meaningless.
I'd also note that it's wrong to say MLK wasn't using that sermon to tear something down; he was attempting to tear down segregation.
What is your definition of Beckian?
| 771 |
ClaudeMonet Sun, Aug 29, 2010 11:04:40am |
re: #590 prairiefire
I agree with her. I felt the same way.
Feeling it is one thing. Saying it is another. The Speaker of the House saying it is yet another.
Just because you're a prominent person and are thinking something doesn't mean you have to piss people off by actually saying it.
| 772 |
Obdicut Sun, Aug 29, 2010 11:05:12am |
re: #767 Walter L. Newton
So we can say that over the past twenty years, there's been no domestic 'left-wing' terrorism on the scale that there has been domestic 'right-wing' terrorism?
| 773 |
Obdicut Sun, Aug 29, 2010 11:05:30am |
re: #770 Walter L. Newton
What is your definition of Beckian?
You could try reading my comments where I already defined it. That'd be nice.
| 774 |
sattv4u2 Sun, Aug 29, 2010 11:08:09am |
| 775 |
Walter L. Newton Sun, Aug 29, 2010 11:08:40am |
re: #773 Obdicut
You could try reading my comments where I already defined it. That'd be nice.
You didn't define it. You said "That is a definition so broad as to be absolutely meaningless." If you can't give it a definition, then how can you say mine is so broad to be meaningless. You have to be able to compare my meaning with your meaning. I haven't seen you meaning yet.
I'll wait.
| 776 |
Obdicut Sun, Aug 29, 2010 11:09:04am |
re: #768 swamprat
Do you not think it's reasonable to actually focus on the current time period when talking about the 'left' and the 'right', given how much they change over time?
I mean, we can call the entire French Revolution a bunch of 'left-wing' terrorism, if we want to go back that far.
| 777 |
Obdicut Sun, Aug 29, 2010 11:09:27am |
re: #775 Walter L. Newton
You didn't define it. You said "That is a definition so broad as to be absolutely meaningless." If you can't give it a definition, then how can you say mine is so broad to be meaningless. You have to be able to compare my meaning with your meaning. I haven't seen you meaning yet.
I'll wait.
I did, actually, define it above. At length. Feel free to read it.
I'll wait.
| 778 |
ClaudeMonet Sun, Aug 29, 2010 11:11:05am |
re: #648 PT Barnum
The problem isn't Beck, it's the people who he caters to.
Both are problems. There's someone who provides this kind of sh**, and an audience for it. It brings up a question--Which came first, crap product, or those who buy it?
| 779 |
Digital Display Sun, Aug 29, 2010 11:11:27am |
re: #769 000G
Going back through LGF archives to find mentionings of Raimondo, I stumbled upon this page in which the guy was mentioned by NY Nana. I was surprised to see that her account was blocked but could not (conveniently anyhow) find out why because her latest comments were too long ago. Anyone kind enough to clue me in about why she was blocked?
I know exactly why and what went down..I was here..And watched it in live time.A long time ago. The most important question is why do you care?
Research? Interesting...
| 780 |
Walter L. Newton Sun, Aug 29, 2010 11:13:40am |
re: #777 Obdicut
I did, actually, define it above. At length. Feel free to read it.
I'll wait.
Nope... I don't consider that a definition. You need to clarify or better make your point.
| 781 |
sattv4u2 Sun, Aug 29, 2010 11:14:09am |
re: #773 Obdicut
You could try reading my comments where I already defined it. That'd be nice.
Where? Here ???
He used religious language, yes.
Nope!
Here??
Beckian is one month excorciating MLK as a commie, and the next one celebrating him.
Hardly (you don't define "beckian", you just point out that Beck plays to a crowd)
| 782 |
(I Stand By What I Said Whatever It Was) Sun, Aug 29, 2010 11:14:27am |
re: #779 HoosierHoops
The most important question is why do you care?
Research? Interesting...
If you read this thread, you would know. Just search for my user name herein. There's your explanation for the research: exploring LGF's history with that guy. As for NY Nana: I genuinely liked her posts way back when, think I updinged quite a few. So, no reason to insinuate bad faith on my part. Why do you make it sound like I should defend myself? Do you care to explain your interesting motives for questioning mine? I think that's a question of equal import.
| 784 |
Obdicut Sun, Aug 29, 2010 11:17:23am |
re: #780 Walter L. Newton
Nope... I don't consider that a definition. You need to clarify or better make your point.
No, I don't. You could tell me what's lacking in my definition, if you want. Like I did with your definition.
| 785 |
prairiefire Sun, Aug 29, 2010 11:19:35am |
re: #771 ClaudeMonet
Feeling it is one thing. Saying it is another. The Speaker of the House saying it is yet another.
Just because you're a prominent person and are thinking something doesn't mean you have to piss people off by actually saying it.
"Shut up and Sing!'
| 786 |
sattv4u2 Sun, Aug 29, 2010 11:21:11am |
re: #784 Obdicut
No, I don't. You could tell me what's lacking in my definition, if you want. Like I did with your definition.
I suggest you never go into (or have to) teach someone something
I learned a long time ago that if someone didn't understand something I was saying, saying it again the same way was not helpful, so yes, "No, I don't" you should!
To that point, what is "lacking" in your definition is,, welll ,, as definition (see [Link: littlegreenfootballs.com...]
| 788 |
ClaudeMonet Sun, Aug 29, 2010 11:24:25am |
re: #663 marjoriemoon
What was wrong with Air America? We have dozens of right wing radio talk. Maybe one left wing talk show would be ok?
Al Franken is an awesome public servant.
Air America failed as entertainment, as propaganda, and as information. It failed as information because it provided little or none. It failed as propaganda because it was so relentlessly one-sided and took the same attitude toward GWB that Beck takes toward President Obama. It failed as entertainment because it was equal parts grim, humorless, unfunny (even the supposed comedians such as Franken), and unwilling to even take calls from anyone who dissented with the Known Truth.
The public didn't like it. Potential advertisers didn't like it. It was a product few wanted except those who were employed by it or the few who bankrolled it (inadequately).
Does that make what is said on right wing talk radio correct? No.
| 789 |
sattv4u2 Sun, Aug 29, 2010 11:24:42am |
re: #776 Obdicut
Do you not think it's reasonable to actually focus on the current time period when talking about the 'left' and the 'right', given how much they change over time?
I mean, we can call the entire French Revolution a bunch of 'left-wing' terrorism, if we want to go back that far.
In that the original question didn't state "find me a domestic, American "left-wing" terrorist who did something equivalent to,WITHIN RECENT HISTORY", no, it's not "reasonabale"
IF the original stated that, then yes, NO ??
| 791 |
Walter L. Newton Sun, Aug 29, 2010 11:25:16am |
re: #784 Obdicut
No, I don't. You could tell me what's lacking in my definition, if you want. Like I did with your definition.
Yes... you think it's perfectly acceptable to plop down and define something by whatever strikes your fancy. But an explanation is a set of statements constructed to describe a set of facts which clarifies the causes, context, and consequences of those facts, and that was totally lacking in your definition. It's like using a single instance of Occam's razor to pick the wrong definition and then claiming your definition rectifies your mistake.
That's what was wrong.
| 792 |
ClaudeMonet Sun, Aug 29, 2010 11:28:20am |
re: #690 Vambo
I think Sheehan was heavily promoted by GOP personalities anyway, because she was so easy to hate. I felt sorry for her.
I didn't. Regardless of her personal tragedies, she brought the "hate" down on herself.
| 793 |
Nervous Norvous Sun, Aug 29, 2010 11:28:49am |
re: #788 ClaudeMonet
unwilling to even take calls from anyone who dissented with the Known Truth.
I'm not sure that's much different than shouting people down when they dispute your talking points, ala Hannity or O'Reilly or not having anyone on other than your adoring fans (Limbaugh)
The difference is that bullshit sells much better than reasoned discussion.
| 794 |
sattv4u2 Sun, Aug 29, 2010 11:29:15am |
re: #787 Obdicut
That's nice.
Was that the "definition" we've been awaiting?
I'm still not sure thats good enough!
| 795 |
Obdicut Sun, Aug 29, 2010 11:30:33am |
re: #789 sattv4u2
No, the original didn't state that.
So we can say that over the past twenty years, there's been no domestic 'left-wing' terrorism on the scale that there has been domestic 'right-wing' terrorism?
| 796 |
Digital Display Sun, Aug 29, 2010 11:32:06am |
re: #794 sattv4u2
Was that the "definition" we've been awaiting?
I'm still not sure thats good enough!
Great F-1 race today! I really like the Winner! Not giving it away for our West Coast viewers..Great race...
| 797 |
sattv4u2 Sun, Aug 29, 2010 11:32:22am |
re: #795 Obdicut
No, the original didn't state that.
So we can say that over the past twenty years, there's been no domestic 'left-wing' terrorism on the scale that there has been domestic 'right-wing' terrorism?
So you're alright with the answer that the original question asked?
If so, don't know why you made an issue out of it!
| 798 |
sattv4u2 Sun, Aug 29, 2010 11:33:30am |
re: #796 HoosierHoops
Great F-1 race today! I really like the Winner! Not giving it away for our West Coast viewers..Great race...
ssssshhhhhh(hamilton)hhhhhhh
| 799 |
Obdicut Sun, Aug 29, 2010 11:35:18am |
re: #791 Walter L. Newton
Yes... you think it's perfectly acceptable to plop down and define something by whatever strikes your fancy. But an explanation is a set of statements constructed to describe a set of facts which clarifies the causes, context, and consequences of those facts, and that was totally lacking in your definition. It's like using a single instance of Occam's razor to pick the wrong definition and then claiming your definition rectifies your mistake.
That's what was wrong.
So you can't actually point out anything wrong with how I defined it?
Beckian is, well, behaving like Beck. It is, as I said, and as Charles has demonstrated, excorciating MLK at one point and then celebrating him moments after. Hell, Beck contradicted himself in his own speech. Beckian is acting like Beck, and the liturgical language is actually not the most common vein of his presentation-- as can be seen by how deeply confused some of the audience was what they were hearing. He's been getting to be more and more of a god-botherer over time, but it's really not what he's become famous for.
You are still wrong to have said the MLK sermon was 'Beckian'. Your point about divisiveness was a very good one, but unfortunately you hopelessly muddled it with the point about liturgical language, which was nonsense.
| 800 |
(I Stand By What I Said Whatever It Was) Sun, Aug 29, 2010 11:36:21am |
This whole argument about "Beckian" must be the stupidest thing I have seen on lgf in quite a while. No offense to any present parties.
| 801 |
Digital Display Sun, Aug 29, 2010 11:36:53am |
re: #798 sattv4u2
ssshhh(hamilton)hhh
The young gun on the F-1 Circuit that kicks every bodies butt..I love it..
| 802 |
Obdicut Sun, Aug 29, 2010 11:37:20am |
re: #797 sattv4u2
So you're alright with the answer that the original question asked?
If so, don't know why you made an issue out of it!
In terms of looking at the left and the right wing, which are ever-moving, abstract, ill-defined groups, doesn't it make more sense to look at the present and recent past, when comparing them?
So, isn't it meaningful to ask:
So we can say that over the past twenty years, there's been no domestic 'left-wing' terrorism on the scale that there has been domestic 'right-wing' terrorism?
| 803 |
sattv4u2 Sun, Aug 29, 2010 11:37:33am |
re: #800 000G
This whole argument about "Beckian" must be the stupidest thing I have seen on lgf in quite a while. No offense to any present parties.
There's a party,, and I get PRESENTS!!!
COOL!!
| 804 |
(I Stand By What I Said Whatever It Was) Sun, Aug 29, 2010 11:38:21am |
re: #803 sattv4u2
There's a party,, and I get PRESENTS!!!
COOL!!
Do you know what it was like in Soviet Russia?
It was one big party!
| 805 |
What, me worry? Sun, Aug 29, 2010 11:38:22am |
re: #782 000G
If you read this thread, you would know. Just search for my user name herein. There's your explanation for the research: exploring LGF's history with that guy. As for NY Nana: I genuinely liked her posts way back when, think I updinged quite a few. So, no reason to insinuate bad faith on my part. Why do you make it sound like I should defend myself? Do you care to explain your interesting motives for questioning mine? I think that's a question of equal import.
It's hard to comment about these things. Obviously, no one really wants to because it involves dredging up some old painful scenarios where others were involved. For me, I don't like to talk about it in an open forum.
I took a break from LGF for about a year myself and a lot of folks went to the wayside at that time. I can count maybe a handful that I was sorry to see go, but most deserved it IMO.
| 806 |
Obdicut Sun, Aug 29, 2010 11:38:50am |
re: #800 000G
This whole argument about "Beckian" must be the stupidest thing I have seen on lgf in quite a while. No offense to any present parties.
I really hate people who call something stupid, and then say 'no offense'.
Man up, dude. If you think it's dumb, that's fine. Don't be a coward about it and say 'no offense' at the end.
I think it's kind of dumb as well, given that Beckian is rather obviously defined by the behavior of Glen Beck, and not by liturgical language, but I'm weird like that.
| 807 |
sattv4u2 Sun, Aug 29, 2010 11:38:52am |
re: #802 Obdicut
In terms of looking at the left and the right wing, which are ever-moving, abstract, ill-defined groups, doesn't it make more sense to look at the present and recent past, when comparing them?
So, isn't it meaningful to ask:
So we can say that over the past twenty years, there's been no domestic 'left-wing' terrorism on the scale that there has been domestic 'right-wing' terrorism?
Then your gripe is with the poster that ASKED the question, not with those that answered the question that WAS asked
Yet you jumped on the answerer, not the questioner
Why?
| 808 |
Obdicut Sun, Aug 29, 2010 11:39:42am |
re: #807 sattv4u2
I don't actually have a gripe, and I'm not sure why you think you do.
I would, however, love it if you answered this question:
So we can say that over the past twenty years, there's been no domestic 'left-wing' terrorism on the scale that there has been domestic 'right-wing' terrorism?
| 809 |
Walter L. Newton Sun, Aug 29, 2010 11:41:10am |
re: #800 000G
This whole argument about "Beckian" must be the stupidest thing I have seen on lgf in quite a while. No offense to any present parties.
Pavlovian.
| 810 |
Interesting Times in Benghazi Sun, Aug 29, 2010 11:41:49am |
re: #797 sattv4u2
So you're alright with the answer that the original question asked?!
All of the examples I cited were from the past 20 years to present, so I figured the time period in question was obvious. And the last time I brought the issue up, I made the word "recent" quite clear - no one could come up with an equivalent then, and no one can come up with an equivalent now.
Charles isn't talking about the left from the 70s, 60s, or earlier - he's comparing the left from the Bush years to the right wing now. And no one's succeeded in providing an example to prove him wrong.
| 811 |
Walter L. Newton Sun, Aug 29, 2010 11:42:01am |
re: #808 Obdicut
I don't actually have a gripe, and I'm not sure why you think you do.
I would, however, love it if you answered this question:
So we can say that over the past twenty years, there's been no domestic 'left-wing' terrorism on the scale that there has been domestic 'right-wing' terrorism?
No.
| 812 |
Vambo Sun, Aug 29, 2010 11:42:52am |
re: #762 ClaudeMonet
She couldn't possibly be a hater. It is Known Fact that Democrats cannot be haters. No "real" democrat has ever hated anything (ignore all those southern Democrats up through the Sixties, they weren't "real" Democrats) or even said anything that could be called untrue. They love everything and everyone, and the world would be full of frolic, happiness, rainbows (without rain, of course) and unicorns if not for the evil that is the Republican party.///
| 813 |
(I Stand By What I Said Whatever It Was) Sun, Aug 29, 2010 11:43:00am |
re: #806 Obdicut
I really hate people who call something stupid, and then say 'no offense'.
Man up, dude. If you think it's dumb, that's fine. Don't be a coward about it and say 'no offense' at the end.
Hey, I just threw in that "no offense" so that people who did not want to feel offended did not have to think they should have to by my words. If you want to feel offended, as you obviously do, go ahead. I am fine with you feeling offended.
I think it's kind of dumb as well, given that Beckian is rather obviously defined by the behavior of Glen Beck, and not by liturgical language, but I'm weird like that.
Well, I "hate" people who knowingly engage in stupid arguments without it being a grand trolling mission for teh lulz.
| 814 |
sattv4u2 Sun, Aug 29, 2010 11:43:00am |
re: #808 Obdicut
I don't actually have a gripe, and I'm not sure why you think you do.
I would, however, love it if you answered this question:
So we can say that over the past twenty years, there's been no domestic 'left-wing' terrorism on the scale that there has been domestic 'right-wing' terrorism?
I would, however, love it if you answered mine! Saying that you had no "gripe" about how it went is all well and fine, but why respond to the answerers when in fact you had an issue with the questioner (why he didn't limit it, as you did, to the past 2 decades)
| 815 |
Walter L. Newton Sun, Aug 29, 2010 11:43:19am |
re: #810 publicityStunted
All of the examples I cited were from the past 20 years to present, so I figured the time period in question was obvious. And the last time I brought the issue up, I made the word "recent" quite clear - no one could come up with an equivalent then, and no one can come up with an equivalent now.
Charles isn't talking about the left from the 70s, 60s, or earlier - he's comparing the left from the Bush years to the right wing now. And no one's succeeded in providing an example to prove him wrong.
Well, you figured wrong, didn't you. You weren't clear. And "last time" bears nothing on this time.
| 816 |
sattv4u2 Sun, Aug 29, 2010 11:43:26am |
| 817 |
Obdicut Sun, Aug 29, 2010 11:44:54am |
re: #809 Walter L. Newton
Pavlovian.
You almost definitely mean "Skinnerian", by the way.
Pavlov dealt with reflexive behavior, like salivation, flinching, and other things of that nature.
Skinner dealt with more cognitive stuff, behavior that could be mediated through conscious behaviors, etc.
| 818 |
ClaudeMonet Sun, Aug 29, 2010 11:45:10am |
re: #793 PT Barnum
I'm not sure that's much different than shouting people down when they dispute your talking points, ala Hannity or O'Reilly or not having anyone on other than your adoring fans (Limbaugh)
The difference is that bullshit sells much better than reasoned discussion.
I didn't say it was any different. However, it didn't play with the audience, such as it was. Liberalism is supposed to encourage discussion, and discussion is supposed to include opposing viewpoints. Air America was supposed to be more inclusive than its right-wing counterparts, and yet in this respect followed their playbook in not allowing opposing viewpoints to get on the air. It brooked no dissent and allowed no interchange of ideas.
It should have been, "Talk with us. We think we have better ideas, but we're open-minded. Perhaps those who don't like our ideas are right and can persuade us. Perhaps we can persuade them."
In this respect, Air America was an echo, not a choice.
| 819 |
Obdicut Sun, Aug 29, 2010 11:45:26am |
| 820 |
sattv4u2 Sun, Aug 29, 2010 11:45:52am |
re: #810 publicityStunted
he's comparing the left from the Bush years to the right wing now
OH ,well,, the "Bush Years" go back 10 years. Thats hardly "now"!
:)
| 821 |
(I Stand By What I Said Whatever It Was) Sun, Aug 29, 2010 11:46:05am |
re: #805 marjoriemoon
It's hard to comment about these things. Obviously, no one really wants to because it involves dredging up some old painful scenarios where others were involved. For me, I don't like to talk about it in an open forum.
I took a break from LGF for about a year myself and a lot of folks went to the wayside at that time. I can count maybe a handful that I was sorry to see go, but most deserved it IMO.
I really appreciate your honesty and opennes regarding your and the community's emotions. I don't think my question has been answered, though. And I think a factual, short recount of the gist of the timeline of events would not give anybody weird, traumatic flashbacks. At least I hope so.
| 822 |
Obdicut Sun, Aug 29, 2010 11:46:18am |
re: #814 sattv4u2
I would, however, love it if you answered mine! Saying that you had no "gripe" about how it went is all well and fine, but why respond to the answerers when in fact you had an issue with the questioner (why he didn't limit it, as you did, to the past 2 decades)
I don't have an issue with the questioner. He phrased the question slightly poorly. Very slightly poorly.
I'm not sure why you think that's 'an issue'. It's been clarified now, and we're past it. Well, most of us. You're still there, apparently.
| 823 |
Walter L. Newton Sun, Aug 29, 2010 11:46:47am |
| 824 |
Walter L. Newton Sun, Aug 29, 2010 11:47:47am |
re: #822 Obdicut
I don't have an issue with the questioner. He phrased the question slightly poorly. Very slightly poorly.
I'm not sure why you think that's 'an issue'. It's been clarified now, and we're past it. Well, most of us. You're still there, apparently.
What's you definition of "Very slightly poorly" versus "slightly poorly"?
| 825 |
sattv4u2 Sun, Aug 29, 2010 11:48:15am |
re: #822 Obdicut
slightly poorly. Very slightly poorly.
Can you define the difference between "poorly", "slightly poorly" and "very slightly poorly"?
I just want to see where this falls!
(and btw,, welcome to 'most of us", as you're still posting about it"!)
| 827 |
Obdicut Sun, Aug 29, 2010 11:48:35am |
re: #823 Walter L. Newton
I was agreeing with you. And you misunderstood me. Skinnerian.
Oh. You see, I asked "So we can say..." and you answered "No". You see, that'd actually be disagreeing with me. I'm glad to know you agree with me.
It was more 'grammar' than any actual psychological theory of conditioning.
| 828 |
Obdicut Sun, Aug 29, 2010 11:49:44am |
re: #824 Walter L. Newton
re: #825 sattv4u2
Hee hee. That's hilarious.
I'm not sure what you actually need defined. He didn't state a time period. As he's clarified, he assumed a time period was, well, assumed, because the question doesn't actually make any sense otherwise-- as I pointed out as well, with the bit about the French Revolution.
| 829 |
Walter L. Newton Sun, Aug 29, 2010 11:50:28am |
re: #827 Obdicut
Oh. You see, I asked "So we can say..." and you answered "No". You see, that'd actually be disagreeing with me. I'm glad to know you agree with me.
It was more 'grammar' than any actual psychological theory of conditioning.
Of course I was agreeing with you... but considering the possible multiple definitions of "agree" as in the context of Walterian blog language, that could be up for debate.
| 830 |
sattv4u2 Sun, Aug 29, 2010 11:50:31am |
| 831 |
sattv4u2 Sun, Aug 29, 2010 11:50:51am |
re: #829 Walter L. Newton
Of course I was agreeing with you... but considering the possible multiple definitions of "agree" as in the context of Walterian blog language, that could be up for debate.
I agree (or not)!
| 832 |
Obdicut Sun, Aug 29, 2010 11:51:28am |
re: #829 Walter L. Newton
Of course I was agreeing with you... but considering the possible multiple definitions of "agree" as in the context of Walterian blog language, that could be up for debate.
That's nice.
| 833 |
Walter L. Newton Sun, Aug 29, 2010 11:53:35am |
re: #832 Obdicut
That's nice.
Thank you. Of course, if you meant that as an actual compliment, I will thank you. But I have found that language has tone and tenor, which is hard to convey over the intertubes, that as it may, and even then, you are hindered by the actual definition someone may be giving to a group of words, or a whole detailed comment, so, it begins to become as it once was and before you know it, nothing is as it seems to be.
| 834 |
sattv4u2 Sun, Aug 29, 2010 11:54:11am |
re: #828 Obdicut
re: #825 sattv4u2
Hee hee. That's hilarious.
I'm not sure what you actually need defined. He didn't state a time period. As he's clarified, he assumed a time period was, well, assumed, because the question doesn't actually make any sense otherwise-- as I pointed out as well, with the bit about the French Revolution.
So see? It can be answered very well (as opposed to very very well) with NO time period as you demonstrated
SO ,, as time period should NOT have been "assumed"!
Thanks for agreeing with the answereres!
| 836 |
sattv4u2 Sun, Aug 29, 2010 11:54:52am |
re: #833 Walter L. Newton
Thank you. Of course, if you meant that as an actual compliment, I will thank you. But I have found that language has tone and tenor, which is hard to convey over the intertubes, that as it may, and even then, you are hindered by the actual definition someone may be giving to a group of words, or a whole detailed comment, so, it begins to become as it once was and before you know it, nothing is as it seems to be.
Obductian speak?
/
| 837 |
Walter L. Newton Sun, Aug 29, 2010 11:55:29am |
| 838 |
Obdicut Sun, Aug 29, 2010 11:55:41am |
re: #834 sattv4u2
I didn't. I disagreed with you. The question has no sense, or value, if you don't include a time period. When the questioner doesn't include one, one still assumes it. When Charles says, above, that the right is behaving worse than the left did, he obviously means within a recent history.
Do you really not understand that point?
| 839 |
sattv4u2 Sun, Aug 29, 2010 11:55:50am |
| 840 |
Obdicut Sun, Aug 29, 2010 11:56:23am |
re: #836 sattv4u2
How come nobody can accurately spell my login when making up cutesy nicknames?
| 841 |
sattv4u2 Sun, Aug 29, 2010 11:57:17am |
re: #838 Obdicut
I didn't. I disagreed with you. The question has no sense, or value, if you don't include a time period. When the questioner doesn't include one, one still assumes it. When Charles says, above, that the right is behaving worse than the left did, he obviously means within a recent history.
Do you really not understand that point?
Define "that point"!
SO ,, you're disagreeing that you agreed with me even though you agreed that you CAN come up with examples with no time period!
| 842 |
sattv4u2 Sun, Aug 29, 2010 11:58:43am |
re: #840 Obdicut
How come nobody can accurately spell my login when making up cutesy nicknames?
my 1st day with these new thumbs
(also, I suck at typing)
((also,, I don't pimf often enough))
((( also, no malice intended)))
| 843 |
sagehen Sun, Aug 29, 2010 11:59:38am |
re: #802 Obdicut
In terms of looking at the left and the right wing, which are ever-moving, abstract, ill-defined groups, doesn't it make more sense to look at the present and recent past, when comparing them?
So, isn't it meaningful to ask:
So we can say that over the past twenty years, there's been no domestic 'left-wing' terrorism on the scale that there has been domestic 'right-wing' terrorism?
On any time scale in which the endpoint is today, domestic left-wing terrorism is smaller than right-wing domestic terrorism. If you measure back far enough to include all the 60's leftist radicals, collectively they don't add up to one Timothy McVeigh. If you go back far enough to include the Haymarket-era anarchists and communists and union organizers, you also have to include the anti-union Pinkerton actions, plus many decades' worth of Klan activities.
If you go all the way back to the American Revolution (which yes, I'm calling left-wing, and from the Brit POV it was terrorism) -- then you have to include the entire Confederacy.
| 844 |
Obdicut Sun, Aug 29, 2010 11:59:46am |
re: #841 sattv4u2
No, what I said was that examples over infinite time periods are meaningless. That would be disagreeing with you.
When Charles said this:
But the sheer hatred and racial animus that's pouring out of the unleashed right wing id is so far beyond the left's worst craziness that there's no comparison at all.
Did you get similarly puzzled by the fact that he didn't include a time period?
If not, why not?
| 845 |
Obdicut Sun, Aug 29, 2010 12:00:57pm |
re: #843 sagehen
I don't think that it's useful to make those comparisons, though. And I don't think you can call the Confederacy 'terrorism'. The Klan, definitely.
But that's a moot point.
| 846 |
(I Stand By What I Said Whatever It Was) Sun, Aug 29, 2010 12:02:07pm |
re: #843 sagehen
If you go all the way back to the American Revolution (which yes, I'm calling left-wing, and from the Brit POV it was terrorism) -- then you have to include the entire Confederacy.
I don't think even the terms "left and right" as we understand them today were even coined before the French Revolution took place.
| 847 |
(I Stand By What I Said Whatever It Was) Sun, Aug 29, 2010 12:03:02pm |
[Link: en.wikipedia.org...]
| 848 |
sattv4u2 Sun, Aug 29, 2010 12:04:24pm |
re: #844 Obdicut
No, what I said was that examples over infinite time periods are meaningless. That would be disagreeing with you.
When Charles said this:
Did you get similarly puzzled by the fact that he didn't include a time period?
If not, why not?
I was talking to you, not to Charles (I wasn't here when Charles was talking about whatever it is you're pointing too, and THAT has nothing to do with what we're discussing as that was then, this is "now")((It wasn't "implied" by me that we were talking about now,, I specifically stated we are talking about the original question from above. Why didn't you understand that?))
SO ,, if you can bring up past instances to prove a point about "then" and "now", why can't I?
| 849 |
sattv4u2 Sun, Aug 29, 2010 12:05:08pm |
re: #846 000G
I don't think even the terms "left and right" as we understand them today were even coined before the French Revolution took place.
Nobody told me there was going to be math!
| 850 |
Obdicut Sun, Aug 29, 2010 12:05:50pm |
re: #846 000G
Well, it was defined against a monarchical scale, so it's severely different, yes. But 'right' and 'left' are basically self-identified terms, anyway. If we define 'right' as being on the conservative side, then the 'right' were the ones who wanted to keep the King and monarchy, but reform the system in general. If we define 'right' in terms of authoritarianism, then Robespierre's group was probably the farthest on the 'right'.
| 851 |
Obdicut Sun, Aug 29, 2010 12:09:51pm |
re: #848 sattv4u2
I'm sorry, but could you answer the simple and straightforward question I asked, or are you simply going to continue to obviously dodge it?
Charles stated something very similar to what PublicityStunted did. He made a point about the left and the right without defining it on any sort of time scale-- this is, rather obviously, because a timescale is assumed. However, nobody seems to want to criticize him for that, though if the criticism holds for PublicityStunted, it should likewise hold for Charles.
So, do you feel that it was obvious what time period Charles was talking about, or not? If so, do you feel it was obvious what time period PublicityStunted was talking about, or not?
Nice parentheses, by the way. Makes a good break from commas.
| 852 |
sattv4u2 Sun, Aug 29, 2010 12:14:53pm |
re: #851 Obdicut
What part of I was talking to you, not to Charles (I wasn't here when Charles was talking about whatever it is you're pointing too, didn't you understand?
I don't know the content
I don't know the context
I don't know the subject matter
Why are you bringing it up?
AND ,,, I noticed no answer too TO ,, if you can bring up past instances to prove a point about "then" and "now", why can't I?
And just for you ,,,,
,,, there!
| 853 |
Obdicut Sun, Aug 29, 2010 12:16:24pm |
re: #852 sattv4u2
You could go read Charles's comment, and then you'd understand what you don't.
It's rather directly relevant, since it's nearly exactly the same: Charles stated something about the left and the right without specifying a timeline. I-- and most others-- assumed that time period, because it was obvious. As it was with PublicityStunted's statement.
This is really not a difficult point to grasp.
| 854 |
sattv4u2 Sun, Aug 29, 2010 12:18:23pm |
re: #853 Obdicut
I-- and most others-- assumed that time period, because it was obvious. As it was with PublicityStunted's statement.
Obviously not
I didn't
Walter didn't
Sage didn't
000G didn't
You did!
(hardly "most" others)
| 855 |
(I Stand By What I Said Whatever It Was) Sun, Aug 29, 2010 12:20:21pm |
re: #850 Obdicut
Well, it was defined against a monarchical scale, so it's severely different, yes. But 'right' and 'left' are basically self-identified terms, anyway. If we define 'right' as being on the conservative side, then the 'right' were the ones who wanted to keep the King and monarchy, but reform the system in general. If we define 'right' in terms of authoritarianism, then Robespierre's group was probably the farthest on the 'right'.
I don't think anyone of relevance defines "'right' in terms of authoritarianism". There is and has been authoritarian on the right as well as on the left. I think the Wikipedia article definitions of left and right are rather accurate, saying that left-wing politics implies "support for social change with a view towards creating a more egalitarian society" and that right-wing politics implies "support for social stratification with the preservation of traditional social orders and values."
Both the French and the American revolutions were driven by civilians -- but in the case of the French against an absolute monarchy while the American against a parliamentary democracy and constitutional monarchy. I think it is this background of "traditional social orders and values" and also taking into account the "stratification" question against which the two Revolutions should be classified into left or right.
| 856 |
Benghazzy Ben Ross Sun, Aug 29, 2010 12:23:15pm |
re: #840 Obdicut
How come nobody can accurately spell my login when making up cutesy nicknames?
I would pronounce "Obdicutian" like "Lilliputian." Nice ring to it.
| 857 |
elbruce Sun, Aug 29, 2010 12:24:08pm |
re: #483 Walter L. Newton
America's first Muslim congressman has provoked outrage by apparently comparing President George W Bush to Adolf Hitler and hinting that he might have been responsible for the September 11 attacks.
Addressing a gathering of atheists in his home state of Minnesota, Keith Ellison, a Democrat, compared the 9/11 atrocities to the destruction of the Reichstag, the German parliament, in 1933.
I actually clicked your video link and listened to the whole thing. He didn't compare Bush to Hitler, nor did he suggest that Bush might be responsible for 9/11. What he said was that 9/11 was like the Reichstag fire in that it led the populace to tolerate more abuses from the government (torture, preventive war) than we otherwise would have. That's it. That's what the the words being said by the person in the video link you posted said.
I don't understand how you could post the video and say it said something else unless you were hoping we wouldn't listen to it.
| 858 |
sattv4u2 Sun, Aug 29, 2010 12:27:30pm |
re: #856 JasonA
I would pronounce "Obdicutian" like "Lilliputian." Nice ring to it.
I didn't know they made rings small enough for the Lilliputians! !
| 859 |
Obdicut Sun, Aug 29, 2010 12:31:14pm |
re: #855 000G
I'm not sure what criteria you're using for 'relevance'. There is no good definition of 'left' and 'right', but one way they are defined is definitely right-wing being more authoritarian and left-wing being more anarchic. It is a false definition-- as are all definitions of 'left' and 'right'.
Both the French and the American revolutions were driven by civilians
Actually, no. The French Revolution had a lot, a lot a lot, of aristocrats as its main adherents and leaders. In addition, the minor clergy were some of the most important supporters, at least during the early time period.
The book "Citizens" gives a very good overview of the French Revolution.
I think the Wikipedia article definitions of left and right are rather accurate, saying that left-wing politics implies "support for social change with a view towards creating a more egalitarian society" and that right-wing politics implies "support for social stratification with the preservation of traditional social orders and values."
Well, you're very deeply wrong, as can be seen by the current state of the 'right' in the US, which is pushing heavy change of traditional social orders or values. That is basically a definition of 'right-wing' through the medium of 'conservative', which only works if you're already starting out in a system with 'traditional social orders and values' in place. The desire to turn the US more theocratic is not in any way a preservation of anything, but a revolutionary, radical idea-- and it's one of the main aspects of the 'right' in the US at the moment.
There is no good definition of 'left' or 'right' beyond self-identification of individuals.
| 860 |
Obdicut Sun, Aug 29, 2010 12:32:50pm |
re: #854 sattv4u2
So, in reading Charles's comment, which I posted, do you suffer the same confusion? If not, why not?
I predict you dodge this question yet again, since you have about ten times so far.
| 861 |
elbruce Sun, Aug 29, 2010 12:33:55pm |
re: #484 researchok
Let's review the article you're citing...
But when Jesse Jackson explicitly likened the proposals of the new majority to Nazism and apartheid -- "If this were Germany, we would call it fascism. If this were South Africa, we would call it racism" -- there wasn't even a ripple of disapproval.
What was he referring to? Maybe it was fascist or racist. This article doesn't say. Pointing out that there is racism =/= racism. I don't know how many times I'm going to have to say that.
Julianne Malveaux, a radio host and USA Today columnist, caught no flak when she prayed aloud for the death of Supreme Court Justice Clarence Thomas. "I hope his wife feeds him lots of eggs and butter and he dies early like many black men do, of heart disease," she snarled on PBS.The liberal Nina Totenberg, on the other hand, suffered no ill effects for saying, during the flap over General Jerry Boykin's views of Islam and the war on terrorism, "I hope he's not long for this world." When the startled host asked if she were "putting a hit out on this guy," Totenberg backtracked and said she only wanted to see him expire "in his job."
"I think he ought to be worried about what's going on in the Good Lord's mind," she said of Senator Jesse Helms in 1995, "because if there is retributive justice, he'll get AIDS from a transfusion, or one of his grandchildren will."
Three points to you. These are beyond the pale, and definitely qualify as eliminationist rhetoric.
"What you have now" -- this is left-wing activist and actress Janeane Garofalo, analyzing the Republican Party during an appearance at the 92d Street Y in New York this year -- "is people that are closet racists, misogynists, homophobes, and people who love . . . the politics of exclusion identifying as conservative."
Again, pointing out that racism exists is not being a racist.
The president "is not the orator that Hitler was," acknowledges leftist commentator Dave Lindorff at Counterpunch.org. "But comparisons of the Bush administration's fearmongering tactics to those practiced so successfully and with such terrible results by Hitler and Goebbels . . . are not at all out of line."
I don't have a problem with this statement. The Bush administration routinely used the politics of fear to manipulate the electorate.
Final score? Three points from your link, from two radio shock jocks. Who count, but aren't very high on the media authority chain. That's still against 31 posted by PT Barnum.
| 862 |
elbruce Sun, Aug 29, 2010 12:37:05pm |
re: #486 researchok
More quotes
Democrats Go Off the Cliff
I'm not even going to pull out the quotes, because frankly they're nothing worse than some reductio ad Hitler. It's worth pointing out that in most of these, they are talking about very specific policies and approaches of the Bush administration, rather than Bush in general. Also, most of these are pulled completely out of context. What policy specifically are they talking about? None of this is nearly as bad as what the wingnuts have been saying. Zero points.
| 863 |
sattv4u2 Sun, Aug 29, 2010 12:37:55pm |
re: #860 Obdicut
So, in reading Charles's comment, which I posted, do you suffer the same confusion? If not, why not?
I predict you dodge this question yet again, since you have about ten times so far.
Let me see if I have this right
"do go on"
"That's nice"
How did I do!?!?
| 864 |
elbruce Sun, Aug 29, 2010 12:39:41pm |
re: #489 Walter L. Newton
re: #489 Walter L. Newton
Pelosi said one of her favorite moments from Inauguration Day was when Marine One lifted off the Capitol grounds, signifying former President George W. Bush's exit from Washington. "It felt like a 10-pound anvil was lifted off my head," she said.
What's wrong with that? I'm sorry, but it seems at this point that if a Democrat even furrows their brow in the direction of a Republican, you count it as equal to a right-winger saying that all liberals should be gassed in concentration camps.
| 865 |
Obdicut Sun, Aug 29, 2010 12:40:05pm |
re: #863 sattv4u2
You dodged the straightforward question yet again. Even though you think that PublicityStunted's statement was answerable with an incident from long ago, you're totally unwilling to answer whether that same logic would apply to Charle's statement. You have no answer for this, and will simply continue to dodge forever.
| 867 |
elbruce Sun, Aug 29, 2010 12:42:48pm |
re: #492 Walter L. Newton
WASHINGTON — Sen. Dick Durbin (search) went to the Senate floor late Tuesday to offer his apologies to anyone who may have been offended by his comparison of treatment of detainees at the U.S. military base at Guantanamo Bay, Cuba, to Nazis, Soviet gulags and Cambodia's Pol Pot.
Right, because being captured by the U.S. military, disappeared off to a remote concentration camp, tortured and detained without trial for many years is nothing like being captured by any of those other groups, disappeared off to a remote concentration camp, tortured and detained without trial for many years... /
| 868 |
Stanghazi Sun, Aug 29, 2010 12:43:53pm |
re: #857 elbruce
I actually clicked your video link and listened to the whole thing. He didn't compare Bush to Hitler, nor did he suggest that Bush might be responsible for 9/11. What he said was that 9/11 was like the Reichstag fire in that it led the populace to tolerate more abuses from the government (torture, preventive war) than we otherwise would have. That's it. That's what the the words being said by the person in the video link you posted said.
I don't understand how you could post the video and say it said something else unless you were hoping we wouldn't listen to it.
THANK YOU!
| 869 |
sattv4u2 Sun, Aug 29, 2010 12:43:54pm |
re: #865 Obdicut
You dodged the straightforward question yet again
I've learned well from ,, well,,, YOU!
Thanks !
| 870 |
elbruce Sun, Aug 29, 2010 12:45:07pm |
re: #502 Walter L. Newton
"Being a suicide bomber is the new political role model," Chris Matthews told his Friday "Hardball" audience. "Just kill everything, destroy everything, blow it up, nothing gets done. You're dead, but who cares?" he added, referring to conservative Republicans running against Democrats in the 2010 midterms.
(text link on News Busters - for what that's worth - video is available all over the place)
[Link: newsbusters.org...]
And...? The analogy makes sense. The GOP has been engaging in "slash and burn" politics for some years now. If the choice is between building bipartisan relationships and going for the Dems' throats, they'll go for the throat every time. Even if it makes it impossible to effectively legislate.
| 872 |
(I Stand By What I Said Whatever It Was) Sun, Aug 29, 2010 12:48:15pm |
re: #859 Obdicut
I'm not sure what criteria you're using for 'relevance'. There is no good definition of 'left' and 'right', but one way they are defined is definitely right-wing being more authoritarian and left-wing being more anarchic. It is a false definition-- as are all definitions of 'left' and 'right'.
I disagree with all definitions of right and left being "wrong" and I disagree with there being a relevant "authoritarian" paradigm by which to define them.
Actually, no. The French Revolution had a lot, a lot a lot, of aristocrats as its main adherents and leaders. In addition, the minor clergy were some of the most important supporters, at least during the early time period.
Actually, yes. The French Revolution was driven by civilians (the "bourgeoisie") and had a signifanct influx of detractors from the aristocrats and the clergy (the other "estates"). There would not have been any French Revolution if it had just been for the aristocrats and the clergy.
Well, you're very deeply wrong, as can be seen by the current state of the 'right' in the US, which is pushing heavy change of traditional social orders or values.
Well, you're "very deeply wrong", as can be seen by the current state of the Right in the US being mostly reactionaries and when they are not reactionaries pushing for a restauration instead of a revolution.
That is basically a definition of 'right-wing' through the medium of 'conservative', which only works if you're already starting out in a system with 'traditional social orders and values' in place.
Bullshit. Any state at any time in human history already has some "traditional social orders and values" in place.
The desire to turn the US more theocratic is not in any way a preservation of anything, but a revolutionary, radical idea-- and it's one of the main aspects of the 'right' in the US at the moment.
Never said it was "preservation". It is restauration (but going even back further past the American Revolution to the assumed ideal, which should be clear when you hear peeps like David Barton propagandizing the idea of a particular kind of Christianity having brought about the American Revolution). And that is only "revolutionary" if you concede the Iranian Revolution of 1979 was also a revolution first and foremost and not a restauration. The National Socialists also cheered 1933 as their National Revolution.
And don't get me started on "radical". It doesn't have anything to do with either left or right but always both.
There is no good definition of 'left' or 'right' beyond self-identification of individuals.
Again, I call bullshit. That's denying the usefulness of history of thought, cultural sciences, political sciences, etc. I agree that there is no good way of objectively identifying left and right. But identification and definition on the one side and objective and subjective on the other side are completely different concepts.
| 873 |
sattv4u2 Sun, Aug 29, 2010 12:49:06pm |
re: #871 Obdicut
How clever and convincing.
Doesn't rise to the level of your "do go on" and "that's nice". I'm working on my own though. I'll keep you posted!
| 874 |
elbruce Sun, Aug 29, 2010 12:50:45pm |
re: #505 Walter L. Newton
Sen. Reid Compares Obamacare Opponents to Supporters of Slavery
(This one is particularly fun)
[Video]
So, I watched the video you provided... again. He's comparing the tactic of "slow down, stop everything, start over" to its attempted use to delay or prevent previous historic legislation, including slavery, votes for women, and civil rights. Now whether you think health care reform is historically comparable to those past debates is one thing. But he wasn't calling HCR opponents slavers, which seems to be what you were implying. If he were, that would count. He's not, so it doesn't.
| 875 |
elbruce Sun, Aug 29, 2010 12:54:48pm |
re: #506 researchok
More:
Again, my point is that vitriol and stupidity are cesspools of both sides.
Consistently pointing out that out does not make for good or credible governance or credible critique.
Checking...
"The insults most often come from the left: 'racist,' 'homophobe,' 'sexist.'. . . It has become a habit of left-liberal political argument to . . . redefine mainstream conservative arguments as extremism and bigotry.
You know what? If every time somebody points at someone being a racist, homophobe or sexist and says what they are, then it results in a chorus from the right wing complaining that everyone's being unfairly maligned, I've got to start to wonder if your intent isn't to provide cover for actual racists, homophobes, and sexists. This article doesn't even demonstrate that the accusations are misapplied. It just complains about people calling out racists homophobes and sexists for being racists homophobes and sexists.
Pointing out that someone is engaging in extremism and bigotry, is not itself extremism and bigotry.
Am I a racist for accusing the EDL of being racist? I think not. But according to this approach of yours, I am.
| 876 |
Spare O'Lake Sun, Aug 29, 2010 1:01:22pm |
re: #808 Obdicut
I don't actually have a gripe, and I'm not sure why you think you do.
I would, however, love it if you answered this question:
So we can say that over the past twenty years, there's been no domestic 'left-wing' terrorism on the scale that there has been domestic 'right-wing' terrorism?
Ya think any of these folks ever voted Republican?
Nidal Malik Hasan, the homegrown Ft. Hood Islamofascist mass murderer
Michael Finton, American convert to Islam, attempted 2009 bombing of U.S. target with FBI agent he thought was al-Qaeda member
Sharif Mobley, American suspected al-Qaeda member, arrested in Yemen in 2010 and suspected of killing guard in escape attempt
Aafia Siddiqui, female alleged al-Qaeda member, former U.S. resident, convicted in 2010 of attempting to kill U.S. personnel
Bryant Neal Vinas, American convert to Islam, convicted in 2009 of participating in/supporting al-Qaeda plots in Afghanistan and the U.S.
Najibullah Zazi, al-Qaeda member, U.S. resident, pleaded guilty in 2010 of planning suicide bombings on New York City subway system
| 877 |
Interesting Times in Benghazi Sun, Aug 29, 2010 1:04:57pm |
re: #876 Spare O'Lake
Al-Qaeda != domestic American left
| 878 |
ClaudeMonet Sun, Aug 29, 2010 1:05:22pm |
re: #876 Spare O'Lake
Ya think any of these folks ever voted Republican?
Nidal Malik Hasan, the homegrown Ft. Hood Islamofascist mass murderer
Michael Finton, American convert to Islam, attempted 2009 bombing of U.S. target with FBI agent he thought was al-Qaeda member
Sharif Mobley, American suspected al-Qaeda member, arrested in Yemen in 2010 and suspected of killing guard in escape attempt
Aafia Siddiqui, female alleged al-Qaeda member, former U.S. resident, convicted in 2010 of attempting to kill U.S. personnel
Bryant Neal Vinas, American convert to Islam, convicted in 2009 of participating in/supporting al-Qaeda plots in Afghanistan and the U.S.
Najibullah Zazi, al-Qaeda member, U.S. resident, pleaded guilty in 2010 of planning suicide bombings on New York City subway system
Ya got any proof of any voting pattern for any of them? Any voter registration?
| 879 |
prairiefire Sun, Aug 29, 2010 1:06:15pm |
re: #876 Spare O'Lake
Ya think any of these folks ever voted Republican?
Nidal Malik Hasan, the homegrown Ft. Hood Islamofascist mass murderer
Michael Finton, American convert to Islam, attempted 2009 bombing of U.S. target with FBI agent he thought was al-Qaeda member
Sharif Mobley, American suspected al-Qaeda member, arrested in Yemen in 2010 and suspected of killing guard in escape attempt
Aafia Siddiqui, female alleged al-Qaeda member, former U.S. resident, convicted in 2010 of attempting to kill U.S. personnel
Bryant Neal Vinas, American convert to Islam, convicted in 2009 of participating in/supporting al-Qaeda plots in Afghanistan and the U.S.
Najibullah Zazi, al-Qaeda member, U.S. resident, pleaded guilty in 2010 of planning suicide bombings on New York City subway system
What would lead you to believe those people ever voted Democratic?
| 880 |
Obdicut Sun, Aug 29, 2010 1:09:24pm |
re: #872 000G
I disagree with all definitions of right and left being "wrong" and I disagree with there being a relevant "authoritarian" paradigm by which to define them.
That's a totally unnecessary use of the word 'paradigm.' And yes, every definition of left and right is wrong, or insufficient. If you don't accept that, then I'm sorry, but I think you have a massively over-simplistic view of politics.
Actually, yes. The French Revolution was driven by civilians (the "bourgeoisie") and had a signifanct influx of detractors from the aristocrats and the clergy (the other "estates"). There would not have been any French Revolution if it had just been for the aristocrats and the clergy.
You really should read "Citizens". There would have been no French Revolution without the clergy and the aristocrats, as well
Bullshit. Any state at any time in human history already has some "traditional social orders and values" in place.
You misunderstood me. My point is that what 'traditional' is changes, and is not coherent, anyway. Some would say that religious freedom is a traditional value of the US-- others, on the 'right' in the current moment, would say being a Christian nation is. We certainly did used to have a larger and more homogeneous Christian population, but we also have had religious freedom from the start. So which is the real 'traditional value'?
Never said it was "preservation".
You provided this definition:
I think the Wikipedia article definitions of left and right are rather accurate, saying that left-wing politics implies "support for social change with a view towards creating a more egalitarian society" and that right-wing politics implies "support for social stratification with the preservation of traditional social orders and values."
So yes, you did. Or rather, you said that was 'rather accurate'.
Again, I call bullshit. That's denying the usefulness of history of thought, cultural sciences, political sciences, etc.
No, it's just saying those two terms are inadequate descriptors. Which they are. They describe an axis that doesn't exist, in any way, and they even do that badly, since they simultaneously refer to multiple axises.
Why do you think they are useful?
| 881 |
Obdicut Sun, Aug 29, 2010 1:10:15pm |
| 882 |
elbruce Sun, Aug 29, 2010 1:33:49pm |
re: #881 Obdicut
You think Al-Queda is 'left-wing'?
How totally bizarre.
Let's see, religious nationalists who believe in traditional family values, second-class status for women and minorities, enforcing their holy book in courts and schools, and think their countries should be at war with ours... who does that sound like?
| 883 |
elbruce Sun, Aug 29, 2010 1:34:50pm |
re: #879 prairiefire
What would lead you to believe those people ever voted Democratic?
I doubt if they would vote for either Democrats or Republicans.
| 884 |
Lidane Sun, Aug 29, 2010 1:54:21pm |
re: #879 prairiefire
What would lead you to believe those people ever voted Democratic?
They're terrorists, don'tcha know. Obviously they're neatly categorized into leftists and/or Democrats.
///
| 885 |
Lidane Sun, Aug 29, 2010 1:56:52pm |
re: #881 Obdicut
You think Al-Queda is 'left-wing'?
How totally bizarre.
Al Qaeda are a bunch of liberal pinko commies like Obama. And like the domestic terrorists on that list. Clearly, a fundamentalist, radical Islamist who wants to either force people to convert or die has everything in common with the modern American left. I mean, they're practically identical. =P
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