At LGF we’ve been connecting the dots between Glenn Beck’s raving freakazoid conspiracy theories and the crazed propaganda of the paleo-conservative John Birch Society for years, and it’s finally getting some mainstream notice on Chris Matthews’ show, after the Weekly Standard’s Bill Kristol delicately broached the dreaded subject.
1 |
_RememberTonyC Mon, Feb 7, 2011 6:10:20pm |
The adults may finally be ready to make a move to save the GOP from its fringe members.
| 2 |
Glenn Beck's Grand Unifying Theory of Obdicut Mon, Feb 7, 2011 6:10:44pm |
re: #1 _RememberTonyC
The adults may finally be ready to make a move to save the GOP from its fringe members.
Who? How?
| 3 |
Decatur Deb Mon, Feb 7, 2011 6:11:58pm |
Won’t work. Nothing Beck needs more than a martyr’s cross.
| 4 |
_RememberTonyC Mon, Feb 7, 2011 6:13:17pm |
| 5 |
Lidane Mon, Feb 7, 2011 6:13:34pm |
re: #1 _RememberTonyC
The adults may finally be ready to make a move to save the GOP from its fringe members.
Not as long as the fringe members are running the party.
It’s going to be a wile before the GOP gets saved from itself. They’ll have to lose to Obama again before the crazy finally gets addressed in house, and even then there’s no guarantee that anything will happen at all.
| 6 |
Political Atheist Mon, Feb 7, 2011 6:16:20pm |
Forecasting the real winds is science and art. Forecasting the political winds is bereft of science, not even an art, it’s just pure guesswork. Neither the GOP fans nor critics have an advantage in this guesswork.
| 7 |
austin_blue Mon, Feb 7, 2011 6:17:20pm |
The Birchers are so 1960. Nothing to see here! Move along, now. Mind the gap.
| 8 |
Killgore Trout Mon, Feb 7, 2011 6:18:20pm |
It’s nice to see this getting noticed. It’s a warning to all those wingnuts that these associations with Birchers, truthers, Alex Jones, Ron Paul, White Nationalists, etc is going to get noticed.
I can’t help but think of all those old lizards who flounced defending the Tea Party and Glenn Beck. Even they are someday going to realize that we were right and accepting these lunatics and adopting their ideas was a huge mistake. It’s only going to get worse.
| 9 |
Killgore Trout Mon, Feb 7, 2011 6:20:03pm |
This is where Beck is getting his ideas….
Egypt, Inflation and Chinese Weapons
[Link: www.libertynewsnetwork.tv…]
| 10 |
FemNaziBitch Mon, Feb 7, 2011 6:21:41pm |
If the Republicans don’t pull it together, I hope there are those that can form another strong party.
We don’t need to be a one-party country.
| 11 |
Glenn Beck's Grand Unifying Theory of Obdicut Mon, Feb 7, 2011 6:22:06pm |
re: #4 _RememberTonyC
It remains to be seen, but Kristol’s words are a start.
Kristol is a global warming denier on alternate thursdays, the rest of the time making the fatuous claim that warming won’t be necessarily harmful. He runs the incredibly stupid Weekly Standard magazine, objected to the building of Cordoba house, and has never given up on the Ayers/Obama connection.
How exactly is he one of the adults?
| 12 |
jamesfirecat Mon, Feb 7, 2011 6:24:25pm |
re: #4 _RememberTonyC
It remains to be seen, but Kristol’s words are a start.
Yeah, its the first time Kristol has ever been right about anything in my memory…
| 13 |
FemNaziBitch Mon, Feb 7, 2011 6:24:31pm |
re: #5 Lidane
Not as long as the fringe members are running the party.
It’s going to be a wile before the GOP gets saved from itself. They’ll have to lose to Obama again before the crazy finally gets addressed in house, and even then there’s no guarantee that anything will happen at all.
When Obama wins again, the Whackos won’t learn anything. They’ll decide they didn’t work hard enough and the rest of us aren’t (fill in the blank) enough.
The Religious Racists™ will just marginalize themselves even more.
MAYBE then the real conservatives (for lack of a better label) will wake-up and realize with whom they’ve been aligning themselves.
| 14 |
Lidane Mon, Feb 7, 2011 6:24:58pm |
re: #11 Obdicut
How exactly is he one of the adults?
He’s not. That he’s right about Beck being crazy doesn’t suddenly redeem all his other douchebaggery.
Stopped clocks and all that.
| 15 |
jamesfirecat Mon, Feb 7, 2011 6:26:36pm |
re: #10 ggt
If the Republicans don’t pull it together, I hope there are those that can form another strong party.
We don’t need to be a one-party country.
Republicans can still senate elections, but yeah, if things keep up the way they’re going we may see one democratic president elected right after another for the first time since FDR and Truman…
| 16 |
rwmofo Mon, Feb 7, 2011 6:27:43pm |
“…getting some mainstream notice on Chris Matthews’ show,…”
I don’t think “mainstream” is really an accurate characterization of Chris Matthews. Matthews is clearly a hard-line leftist who doesn’t have much tolerance for ideas that drift toward the center.
I’m not defending Beck. I don’t watch him. But it’s probably rooted in the same type of jealousy Matthews has for Beck as Olbermann did for O’Reilly. When they’re getting shellacked in the ratings night after night, they tend to target the top dog.
…and undoubtedly Matthews is just as pissed off at Centrist and Republican voters right now as well.
| 17 |
Killgore Trout Mon, Feb 7, 2011 6:28:27pm |
re: #13 ggt
When Obama wins again, the Whackos won’t learn anything. They’ll decide they didn’t work hard enough and the rest of us aren’t (fill in the blank) enough.
The Religious Racists™ will just marginalize themselves even more.
MAYBE then the real conservatives (for lack of a better label) will wake-up and realize with whom they’ve been aligning themselves.
That’s my guess too. They are going to have a very hard time wining presidential elections. They’ll probably take the senate sometime soon and misinterpret that as some sort of vindication of the Tea Party/Sarah Palin agenda. After about a decade of lost presidential elections they’ll wake up.
| 18 |
Glenn Beck's Grand Unifying Theory of Obdicut Mon, Feb 7, 2011 6:29:04pm |
re: #16 rwmofo
In what universe is Wallace a hard-line leftist?
Please name one issue he’s a hard-line leftist on.
| 19 |
HappyWarrior Mon, Feb 7, 2011 6:29:27pm |
Well it’s really up to the GOP electorate if you ask me. After all it has been they who have nominated the crazies (O’Donnell, Angle, Paladino, and others) I am a member of my campus’s College Dems and I was informed that the College Republicans booted their president out for “not being conservative enough” and that they’re leaning towards supporting Palin in the primaries.
| 20 |
jamesfirecat Mon, Feb 7, 2011 6:29:50pm |
re: #16 rwmofo
“…getting some mainstream notice on Chris Matthews’ show,…”
I don’t think “mainstream” is really an accurate characterization of Chris Matthews. Matthews is clearly a hard-line leftist who doesn’t have much tolerance for ideas that drift toward the center.
I’m not defending Beck. I don’t watch him. But it’s probably rooted in the same type of jealousy Matthews has for Beck as Olbermann did for O’Reilly. When they’re getting shellacked in the ratings night after night, they tend to target the top dog.
…and undoubtedly Matthews is just as pissed off at Centrist and Republican voters right now as well.
I think Charles was using “Mainstream” in the sense of a news show channel that your average person is aware of.
Fox news is also “Mainstream news” even though they tend to be one and all tilted toward the right by varying degrees…..
I think you’ve got the term rooted in where they stand in relation to the Overton window when its more well known use is in relation to public awareness….
| 21 |
SanFranciscoZionist Mon, Feb 7, 2011 6:30:05pm |
re: #16 rwmofo
Matthews is clearly a hard-line leftist who doesn’t have much tolerance for ideas that drift toward the center.
Yes, all the hard-line leftists I knew also responded to Bush’s flightsuit stunt by chattering about his ‘sunny nobility’.
I think Matthews is a lightweight, but that’s not a political orientation.
| 22 |
Jadespring Mon, Feb 7, 2011 6:30:15pm |
re: #16 rwmofo
Matthews may be a liberal and lean to the left but defining him as hard line leftist is…well…
Makes me what actual hard line lefties would be called. Super duper uber hard line lefties?
| 23 |
FemNaziBitch Mon, Feb 7, 2011 6:30:20pm |
re: #17 Killgore Trout
That’s my guess too. They are going to have a very hard time wining presidential elections. They’ll probably take the senate sometime soon and misinterpret that as some sort of vindication of the Tea Party/Sarah Palin agenda. After about a decade of lost presidential elections they’ll wake up.
We need a balance. It seems that is the way we work. We tilt left for a while, then we tilt right. However one wants to characterize it… .
Leaning one way too long is not good. The adversarial system is what we are and it works very well for us. We need a viable two-party system.
| 24 |
jamesfirecat Mon, Feb 7, 2011 6:30:33pm |
re: #19 HappyWarrior
Well it’s really up to the GOP electorate if you ask me. After all it has been they who have nominated the crazies (O’Donnell, Angle, Paladino, and others) I am a member of my campus’s College Dems and I was informed that the College Republicans booted their president out for “not being conservative enough” and that they’re leaning towards supporting Palin in the primaries.
Wow… and they say college leftists are radicals!
| 25 |
FemNaziBitch Mon, Feb 7, 2011 6:30:43pm |
re: #18 Obdicut
In what universe is Wallace a hard-line leftist?
Please name one issue he’s a hard-line leftist on.
he worked for Jimmy Carter????
/
| 26 |
HappyWarrior Mon, Feb 7, 2011 6:30:50pm |
re: #21 SanFranciscoZionist
Yes, all the hard-line leftists I knew also responded to Bush’s flightsuit stunt by chattering about his ‘sunny nobility’.
I think Matthews is a lightweight, but that’s not a political orientation.
Shit, it was from hard line lefties that I first heard him referred to as “Tweety.”
| 27 |
Killgore Trout Mon, Feb 7, 2011 6:30:53pm |
re: #16 rwmofo
Bill Kristol mentioned the JBs Beck connection a few days ago. People are starting to notice. It creates a lot of bad publicity and will scare off swing voters.
| 28 |
FemNaziBitch Mon, Feb 7, 2011 6:31:46pm |
re: #22 Jadespring
Matthews may be a liberal and lean to the left but defining him as hard line leftist is…well…
Makes me what actual hard line lefties would be called. Super duper uber hard line lefties?
Whackos
| 29 |
rwmofo Mon, Feb 7, 2011 6:32:35pm |
re: #18 Obdicut
In what universe is Wallace a hard-line leftist?
Please name one issue he’s a hard-line leftist on.
I assume you’re talking about Chris Wallace since Mike Wallace is retired. I can’t think of any off the top of my head. Chris Wallace seems like a good guy.
| 30 |
theheat Mon, Feb 7, 2011 6:32:50pm |
re: #17 Killgore Trout
I see them doubling up their efforts, quite frankly. You know, the “we weren’t conservative enough” thing they bawled last time.
We all know how that turned out. All Taliban-ish and such.
They’ll push extremism to new heights before it ever gets better. And I don’t count on them ever getting better, before the party implodes altogether.
And good riddance when it does.
| 31 |
FemNaziBitch Mon, Feb 7, 2011 6:32:56pm |
re: #27 Killgore Trout
Bill Kristol mentioned the JBs Beck connection a few days ago. People are starting to notice. It creates a lot of bad publicity and will scare off swing voters.
Might wake-up a few who still think they identify with the Republican Party as well.
| 32 |
Glenn Beck's Grand Unifying Theory of Obdicut Mon, Feb 7, 2011 6:33:10pm |
re: #29 rwmofo
So, you just decided to troll again?
| 33 |
HappyWarrior Mon, Feb 7, 2011 6:33:16pm |
re: #24 jamesfirecat
Wow… and they say college leftists are radicals!
Ha, I know right? But my school’s reputation is for having a nutso economics department and one of the best cinderella stories in March Madness history.
| 34 |
Jadespring Mon, Feb 7, 2011 6:33:25pm |
re: #22 Jadespring
Just to add and this is another example of how the spectrum in the US is scued to the right relative to most everywhere else. Matthews up here in Canada would be considered a centerist that leans to the right and from real hard lefties, a right winger.
| 35 |
rwmofo Mon, Feb 7, 2011 6:33:28pm |
re: #22 Jadespring
Matthews may be a liberal and lean to the left but defining him as hard line leftist is…well…
Makes me what actual hard line lefties would be called. Super duper uber hard line lefties?
Heh. I like that.
| 36 |
SanFranciscoZionist Mon, Feb 7, 2011 6:33:37pm |
re: #28 ggt
Whackos
Part of the problem is that many people are no longer making a distinction between ‘liberal’ and ‘leftist’—in much the same way some that people no longer make a distinction between ‘Democrat’ and ‘Marxist’—which means that people ranging from, well, my dad all the way through Medea Benjamin and beyond are being conveniently classified under one word.
| 37 |
jamesfirecat Mon, Feb 7, 2011 6:33:48pm |
re: #29 rwmofo
I assume you’re talking about Chris Wallace since Mike Wallace is retired. I can’t think of any off the top of my head. Chris Wallace seems like a good guy.
Wait… Chris Wallace?
I thought we were talking about Chris Matthews?
I iz confused….
| 38 |
sizzleRI Mon, Feb 7, 2011 6:33:56pm |
re: #26 HappyWarrior
Shit, it was from hard line lefties that I first heard him referred to as “Tweety.”
Heh, Tweety. Feminists blogs hate the man. I just find him odd and a bit annoying.
| 39 |
prairiefire Mon, Feb 7, 2011 6:34:34pm |
re: #3 Decatur Deb
Won’t work. Nothing Beck needs more than a martyr’s cross.
The commenters on Lowry’s NRO The Corner piece were defending Beck against Kristol.
| 40 |
HappyWarrior Mon, Feb 7, 2011 6:35:05pm |
re: #38 sizzleRI
Heh, Tweety. Feminists blogs hate the man. I just find him odd and a bit annoying.
I think he comes across as a pompous dick, in otherwords your run of the mill talking head.
| 41 |
Glenn Beck's Grand Unifying Theory of Obdicut Mon, Feb 7, 2011 6:35:31pm |
re: #37 jamesfirecat
My fault.
| 42 |
Glenn Beck's Grand Unifying Theory of Obdicut Mon, Feb 7, 2011 6:36:07pm |
re: #16 rwmofo
In what way is Chris Matthews a hard-line leftist?
| 43 |
jamesfirecat Mon, Feb 7, 2011 6:36:51pm |
re: #39 prairiefire
The commenters on Lowry’s NRO The Corner piece were defending Beck against Kristol.
Judiean Popular People’s Front Suicide Squad ATTACK!
(They all stab themselves)
Well… that…. showed emm….
| 44 |
FemNaziBitch Mon, Feb 7, 2011 6:37:05pm |
re: #36 SanFranciscoZionist
Part of the problem is that many people are no longer making a distinction between ‘liberal’ and ‘leftist’—in much the same way some that people no longer make a distinction between ‘Democrat’ and ‘Marxist’—which means that people ranging from, well, my dad all the way through Medea Benjamin and beyond are being conveniently classified under one word.
Yeah, that’s why I use the word Whackos. Labels no longer apply. There are those who live in this world with the rest of us and there are the Whackos.
I think both the John Birch Society and Code Pink belong in that category.
| 45 |
Jadespring Mon, Feb 7, 2011 6:37:07pm |
re: #42 Obdicut
In what way is Chris Matthews a hard-line leftist?
He says things that are not right.
| 46 |
engineer cat Mon, Feb 7, 2011 6:37:10pm |
re: #16 rwmofo
Matthews is clearly a hard-line leftist
since 50% of the country votes democratic, the idea that this is a ‘center right’ nation must be out the window then, since by your standards there must be 100 million bomb throwing bolsheviks in this country
| 47 |
BishopX Mon, Feb 7, 2011 6:37:49pm |
re: #46 engineer dog
since 50% of the country votes democratic, the idea that this is a ‘center right’ nation must be out the window then, since by your standards there must be 100 million bomb throwing bolsheviks in this country
We hide in all the washrooms.
//
| 48 |
prairiefire Mon, Feb 7, 2011 6:38:12pm |
| 49 |
prairiefire Mon, Feb 7, 2011 6:38:24pm |
| 50 |
Renaissance_Man Mon, Feb 7, 2011 6:38:45pm |
re: #36 SanFranciscoZionist
Part of the problem is that many people are no longer making a distinction between ‘liberal’ and ‘leftist’—in much the same way some that people no longer make a distinction between ‘Democrat’ and ‘Marxist’—which means that people ranging from, well, my dad all the way through Medea Benjamin and beyond are being conveniently classified under one word.
That’s because in the cartoony cultie universe, all of those liberals, Democrats, anarchists, journalists, foreigners, all of them, are all exactly the same. Socialists, communists, and Marxists. When you think that nuance and looking at things from multiple viewpoints is for nancy boys, women, and Communists, your worldview does not tend to be overly sophisticated.
| 51 |
bratwurst Mon, Feb 7, 2011 6:38:54pm |
re: #42 Obdicut
In what way is Chris Matthews a hard-line leftist?
He’s to the left of Joe Lieberman. End of story./
| 52 |
jamesfirecat Mon, Feb 7, 2011 6:39:06pm |
| 53 |
Decatur Deb Mon, Feb 7, 2011 6:39:23pm |
re: #42 Obdicut
In what way is Chris Matthews a hard-line leftist?
In the same universe that the Sierra Club is Hard Left.
| 54 |
Wozza Matter? Mon, Feb 7, 2011 6:39:24pm |
re: #46 engineer dog
since 50% of the country votes democratic, the idea that this is a ‘center right’ nation must be out the window then, since by your standards there must be 100 million bomb throwing bolsheviks in this country
Politically speaking -compared to the other western democracies and based on the platform positions of the Democratic Party (being your mainstream left of centre party) at the 2008 election……..the US is a centre right nation (at least economically).
| 55 |
HappyWarrior Mon, Feb 7, 2011 6:40:22pm |
re: #36 SanFranciscoZionist
Part of the problem is that many people are no longer making a distinction between ‘liberal’ and ‘leftist’—in much the same way some that people no longer make a distinction between ‘Democrat’ and ‘Marxist’—which means that people ranging from, well, my dad all the way through Medea Benjamin and beyond are being conveniently classified under one word.
It’s like they think we as liberals go around singing the Internationale and praising Marx when many of us would rather have Groucho and his brothers over Karl any day of the week.
| 56 |
Jadespring Mon, Feb 7, 2011 6:41:42pm |
Woo. Almost time for the cute guy Hawaii show.
| 57 |
Wozza Matter? Mon, Feb 7, 2011 6:41:42pm |
re: #55 HappyWarrior
It’s like they think we as liberals go around singing the Internationale and praising Marx when many of us would rather have Groucho and his brothers over Karl any day of the week.
You must never have seen Karl carrying an oversized timber on one shoulder……. while being disoriented in a room :p
| 58 |
Gus Mon, Feb 7, 2011 6:43:05pm |
re: #53 Decatur Deb
In the same universe that the Sierra Club is Hard Left.
He must have missed the part back when Matthews was gaga for George Bush and the Iraq war.
Odd how people think that whenever they criticize others it based on jealously. Well then. If Matthew is jealous of Beck then it’s clear that Beck is jealous of liberals, Alinsky, Soros, etc., etc., etc.
| 59 |
rwmofo Mon, Feb 7, 2011 6:43:17pm |
re: #55 HappyWarrior
It’s like they think we as liberals go around singing the Internationale and praising Marx when many of us would rather have Groucho and his brothers over Karl any day of the week.
You’ll definitely get more votes that way.
| 60 |
Decatur Deb Mon, Feb 7, 2011 6:43:52pm |
re: #57 wozzablog
You must never have seen Karl carrying an oversized timber on one shoulder… while being disoriented in a room :p
And tonight’s secret word is: “Reactionary”.
| 61 |
Wozza Matter? Mon, Feb 7, 2011 6:44:18pm |
re: #59 rwmofo
You’ll definitely get more votes that way.
Which is why there’s a hard left community organisin’ president?….
| 62 |
engineer cat Mon, Feb 7, 2011 6:44:55pm |
re: #54 wozzablog
Politically speaking -compared to the other western democracies and based on the platform positions of the Democratic Party (being your mainstream left of centre party) at the 2008 election…the US is a centre right nation (at least economically).
i’m used to living in a country where the new york times is either the house organ of the conservative establishment or a wild eyed radical marxist rag depending on who you’re talking to at the moment
| 63 |
freetoken Mon, Feb 7, 2011 6:45:42pm |
LGF we’ve been connecting the dots between Glenn Beck’s raving freakazoid conspiracy theories and the crazed propaganda of the paleo-conservative John Birch Society for years, and it’s finally getting some mainstream notice …
I’m afraid MSNBC, Matthews and those that run in that circle are rather timid when it comes to dealing with conspiracy theories - the “mainstream” seems to want to sit back and ignore loonies until something violent happens.
The SPLC has been point out Beck’s Bircherist tendencies for some time:
Beck Backs Birch: Conspiracy Theory ‘Makes Sense’
There used to be folks here at LGF that would post links to Beck before he went to Fox, and some would approve.
I guess I became aware of the connection when I was researching Ron Paul in 2008 and discovered the video of Paul explaining that his political mentor had been the president of the JBS. And, Beck had Paul as a guest on his show before Beck went to Fox!
| 64 |
jamesfirecat Mon, Feb 7, 2011 6:45:46pm |
re: #60 Decatur Deb
And tonight’s secret word is: “Reactionary”.
When I speak of the GOP I speak in past tense… of course we’re way past tents, we’re living in bungalows now.
| 65 |
Decatur Deb Mon, Feb 7, 2011 6:48:11pm |
re: #64 jamesfirecat
When I speak of the GOP I speak in past tense… of course we’re way past tents, we’re living in bungalows now.
Nice channeling.
| 66 |
Wozza Matter? Mon, Feb 7, 2011 6:49:12pm |
re: #62 engineer dog
i’m used to living in a country where the new york times is either the house organ of the conservative establishment or a wild eyed radical marxist rag depending on who you’re talking to at the moment
In Europe the NYT would not pass muster as a “left of center paper” - i’ll put it that way.
| 67 |
HappyWarrior Mon, Feb 7, 2011 6:51:08pm |
re: #62 engineer dog
i’m used to living in a country where the new york times is either the house organ of the conservative establishment or a wild eyed radical marxist rag depending on who you’re talking to at the moment
I know what you mean. It’s funny but I’ve noticed the same thing too. Talk to a partisan lefty and you get George W. Bush is a terrible president and the most right wing president we’ve ever had, talk to a partisan conservative, he’ll try to convince you that George W. Bush is in fact a liberal. All very amusing to me really being center-left.
| 68 |
moderatelyradicalliberal Mon, Feb 7, 2011 6:52:44pm |
re: #11 Obdicut
Kristol is a global warming denier on alternate thursdays, the rest of the time making the fatuous claim that warming won’t be necessarily harmful. He runs the incredibly stupid Weekly Standard magazine, objected to the building of Cordoba house, and has never given up on the Ayers/Obama connection.
How exactly is he one of the adults?
He was also the first person I heard suggest that McCain should pick Palin for his VP. He was a Palin cheerleader long before she made her national debut.
| 69 |
Wozza Matter? Mon, Feb 7, 2011 6:53:53pm |
re: #67 HappyWarrior
I know what you mean. It’s funny but I’ve noticed the same thing too. Talk to a partisan lefty and you get George W. Bush is a terrible president and the most right wing president we’ve ever had, talk to a partisan conservative, he’ll try to convince you that George W. Bush is in fact a liberal. All very amusing to me really being center-left.
Bush was probably a “Conservative” version Obama’s “Liberal”.
neither are particularly total package - the far righties are pissed Bush never sold them the farm lock stock and barrel, and the far left is pissed at Obama for not executing the guys from Goldman Sachs.
| 70 |
prairiefire Mon, Feb 7, 2011 6:54:49pm |
re: #68 moderatelyradicalliberal
He was also the first person I heard suggest that McCain should pick Palin for his VP. He was a Palin cheerleader long before she made her national debut.
I believe he met her on a conservative cruise to Juneau.
| 71 |
moderatelyradicalliberal Mon, Feb 7, 2011 6:54:50pm |
re: #15 jamesfirecat
Republicans can still senate elections, but yeah, if things keep up the way they’re going we may see one democratic president elected right after another for the first time since FDR and Truman…
Even without the crazy the electoral map looks bleak for the GOP because of changes in demographics. Obama won with a lot of states he really didn’t need to win.
| 72 |
Mostly sane, most of the time. Mon, Feb 7, 2011 6:55:48pm |
Ha! I’m on to you, you evil commie Germ Overlords! I see through your socialistic “spread the wealth of microscopic evil” ways. Sure, you’re extracting my bodily fluids by making me sneeze them out, but I will triumph yet! You will never overtake me!
America! Home of the healthy! Land of the Vitamin C! Bastion of Ziiiiii…
*Medicine kicks in. Head falls down on desk.*
| 73 |
jamesfirecat Mon, Feb 7, 2011 6:56:16pm |
re: #69 wozzablog
Bush was probably a “Conservative” version Obama’s “Liberal”.
neither are particularly total package - the far righties are pissed Bush never sold them the farm lock stock and barrel, and the far left is pissed at Obama for not executing the guys from Goldman Sachs.
The righties I know seem plenty pissed about the results of Bush’s term… but what did he actually do that they disagreed with?
| 74 |
Wozza Matter? Mon, Feb 7, 2011 6:56:36pm |
re: #68 moderatelyradicalliberal
He was also the first person I heard suggest that McCain should pick Palin for his VP. He was a Palin cheerleader long before she made her national debut.
That whole thing was a fix - the NeoCon cabal at the Weekly Standard and Jonah’s rag sold her to Mccains people, who took them at their word that she was ready.
| 75 |
Jadespring Mon, Feb 7, 2011 6:56:46pm |
re: #67 HappyWarrior
I know what you mean. It’s funny but I’ve noticed the same thing too. Talk to a partisan lefty and you get George W. Bush is a terrible president and the most right wing president we’ve ever had, talk to a partisan conservative, he’ll try to convince you that George W. Bush is in fact a liberal. All very amusing to me really being center-left.
I thought GWB was as right of President I had ever seen. That was then. Now with the way the current crop of Republicans he is not anymore. He moved left in comparison. I really did not like Bush. Truly did not like his politics and general political viewpoint. If I had to chose between him though and what seems to be the ways things are now I chose him in a heartbeat.
| 76 |
jamesfirecat Mon, Feb 7, 2011 6:57:47pm |
re: #71 moderatelyradicalliberal
Even without the crazy the electoral map looks bleak for the GOP because of changes in demographics. Obama won with a lot of states he really didn’t need to win.
Mainly the math looks so bleak because one of the biggest growing sections of our population is Hispanics, and the GOP seems to be doing everything short of showing up at their doorstep in a limo to take them to the polling place when it comes to making them vote democratic….
| 77 |
Wozza Matter? Mon, Feb 7, 2011 6:58:34pm |
re: #73 jamesfirecat
The righties I know seem plenty pissed about the results of Bush’s term… but what did he actually do that they disagreed with?
key issues -
Roe (still law of land when he left)
Prayer in School (still “outlawed” when he left)
etc
etc
The Right projected onto Bush the idea he would salve the wounds of Clinton’s permissive society, it didn’t happen.
| 78 |
prairiefire Mon, Feb 7, 2011 6:58:42pm |
re: #72 EmmmieG
Watch out for fevers. There is a lot of Strep going around.
| 79 |
Mostly sane, most of the time. Mon, Feb 7, 2011 6:59:29pm |
re: #78 prairiefire
Watch out for fevers. There is a lot of Strep going around.
We actually have strep tests here because we’re so prone to them.
This isn’t strep. Strep doesn’t make you sneeze for three minutes straight while your eyes swell shut.
| 80 |
Political Atheist Mon, Feb 7, 2011 7:00:08pm |
re: #75 Jadespring
GWB was not conservative on immigration or fiscal policy. I guess he is assumed to be conservative because he invaded a country that had not attacked us. By what other measure was GWB conservative? His African policy? Europe?
| 81 |
Gus Mon, Feb 7, 2011 7:00:26pm |
re: #77 wozzablog
key issues -
Roe (still law of land when he left)
Prayer in School (still “outlawed” when he left)
etc
etcThe Right projected onto Bush the idea he would salve the wounds of Clinton’s permissive society, it didn’t happen.
TARP (at least for those that actually have a memory)
Immigration Reform
Reasonably open to Islam and Islamic Americans
| 82 |
Dancing along the light of day Mon, Feb 7, 2011 7:01:13pm |
re: #72 EmmmieG
Hope you hit Ludwig’s Nerf desk with your head!
Feel better!
| 83 |
moderatelyradicalliberal Mon, Feb 7, 2011 7:01:46pm |
re: #58 Gus 802
He must have missed the part back when Matthews was gaga for George Bush and the Iraq war.
Odd how people think that whenever they criticize others it based on jealously. Well then. If Matthew is jealous of Beck then it’s clear that Beck is jealous of liberals, Alinsky, Soros, etc., etc., etc.
I actually remember Matthews being one of the few cable news guys showing skepticism about the Iraq war. I don’t think he was ever a cheerleader for it.
| 84 |
Wozza Matter? Mon, Feb 7, 2011 7:02:51pm |
re: #81 Gus 802
His treasury team would likely have bailed out Detroit - but he kicked that down the road to try and save Mccain some electoral votes/not be “that guy” (not for ideological reasons).
| 85 |
Gus Mon, Feb 7, 2011 7:03:02pm |
What they really wanted from GWB:
• Nuke Iran
• Nuke North Korea
• Reverse Roe v. Wade
• Interment camps for American muslims
• Gay marriage amendment
• Reverse most of the Civil Rights Act…
| 86 |
prairiefire Mon, Feb 7, 2011 7:04:02pm |
re: #80 Rightwingconspirator
GWB was not conservative on immigration or fiscal policy. I guess he is assumed to be conservative because he invaded a country that had not attacked us. By what other measure was GWB conservative? His African policy? Europe?
He nominated many conservative Federal judges. Also, two Supers.
| 87 |
engineer cat Mon, Feb 7, 2011 7:04:25pm |
re: #80 Rightwingconspirator
GWB was not conservative on immigration or fiscal policy. I guess he is assumed to be conservative because he invaded a country that had not attacked us. By what other measure was GWB conservative? His African policy? Europe?
um, i believe you’ll find that mr bush vehemently defended his conservative bona fides on numerous occasions
in addition, i’m pretty sure he was endorsed as a candidate by the republican party, which i believe is known for strongly backing conservative measures
| 88 |
FemNaziBitch Mon, Feb 7, 2011 7:04:41pm |
re: #77 wozzablog
key issues -
Roe (still law of land when he left)
Prayer in School (still “outlawed” when he left)
etc
etcThe Right projected onto Bush the idea he would salve the wounds of Clinton’s permissive society, it didn’t happen.
I think it is hard for the far side of any party to not be disappointed with a POTUS. In reality the POTUS has to serve the whole country. He gets a new and different perspective once he takes office. They’ll say he broke promises … .
The whackos think they are going to get their own way when THEIR MAN get’s into power. They would be happy with a dictator as long as he is their dictator.
| 89 |
rwmofo Mon, Feb 7, 2011 7:04:59pm |
re: #71 moderatelyradicalliberal
Even without the crazy the electoral map looks bleak for the GOP because of changes in demographics. Obama won with a lot of states he really didn’t need to win.
Ummm, what? Ya know, we just had an election here.
“The Democrat Party suffered major defeats in many national and state level elections, with many seats switching to Republican Party control. The Republican Party gained 63 seats in the U.S. House of Representatives, recapturing the majority, and making it the largest seat change since 1948 and the largest for any midterm election since the 1938 midterm elections. The Republicans gained six seats in the U.S. Senate, expanding its minority, and also gained 680 seats in state legislative races,[3][4][5] to break the previous majority record of 628 set by Democrats in the post-Watergate elections of 1974.[5] This left Republicans in control of 25 state legislatures, compared to the 15 still controlled by Democrats. After the election, Republicans took control of 29 of the 50 State Governorships.”
“The swaying views of self-declared independent voters, however, were largely responsible for the shift from Democratic to Republican gains.”
And for a bonus, all these electoral gains couldn’t have come at a better time. A new census was taken and guess who’s in the driver’s seat to re-draw congressional districts? That’s right. The good guys.
| 90 |
Dancing along the light of day Mon, Feb 7, 2011 7:05:03pm |
re: #85 Gus 802
What they really wanted from GWB:
What they’re never going to get from Obama
FTFY.• Nuke Iran
• Nuke North Korea
• Reverse Roe v. Wade
• Interment camps for American muslims
• Gay marriage amendment
• Reverse most of the Civil Rights Act…
| 91 |
Gus Mon, Feb 7, 2011 7:05:21pm |
re: #83 moderatelyradicalliberal
I actually remember Matthews being one of the few cable news guys showing skepticism about the Iraq war. I don’t think he was ever a cheerleader for it.
[Link: mediamatters.org…]
| 92 |
moderatelyradicalliberal Mon, Feb 7, 2011 7:05:38pm |
re: #76 jamesfirecat
Mainly the math looks so bleak because one of the biggest growing sections of our population is Hispanics, and the GOP seems to be doing everything short of showing up at their doorstep in a limo to take them to the polling place when it comes to making them vote democratic…
Yeah. Even as badly as the 2010 elections were for the Democrats, Obama’s western firewall held up in CA, NV, NM, and CO and Latinos were crucial to that.
| 93 |
Decatur Deb Mon, Feb 7, 2011 7:05:40pm |
President Bush did the one thing conservatives will not forgive: He created President Obama.
| 94 |
FemNaziBitch Mon, Feb 7, 2011 7:05:58pm |
re: #80 Rightwingconspirator
GWB was not conservative on immigration or fiscal policy. I guess he is assumed to be conservative because he invaded a country that had not attacked us. By what other measure was GWB conservative? His African policy? Europe?
He is overtly christian. Wanted to create a “culture of life”, Terry Shaivo etc. White House Christmas Tree … Judge Alito, Roberts … .
| 95 |
Gus Mon, Feb 7, 2011 7:06:03pm |
re: #85 Gus 802
What they really wanted from GWB:
• Nuke Iran
• Nuke North Korea
• Reverse Roe v. Wade
• Interment camps for American muslims
• Gay marriage amendment
• Reverse most of the Civil Rights Act…
How could I forget!
• Deport all illegal aliens
| 96 |
WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.] Mon, Feb 7, 2011 7:06:29pm |
re: #16 rwmofo
“…getting some mainstream notice on Chris Matthews’ show,…”
I don’t think “mainstream” is really an accurate characterization of Chris Matthews. Matthews is clearly a hard-line leftist who doesn’t have much tolerance for ideas that drift toward the center.
I’m not defending Beck. I don’t watch him. But it’s probably rooted in the same type of jealousy Matthews has for Beck as Olbermann did for O’Reilly. When they’re getting shellacked in the ratings night after night, they tend to target the top dog.
…and undoubtedly Matthews is just as pissed off at Centrist and Republican voters right now as well.
lol
| 98 |
Wozza Matter? Mon, Feb 7, 2011 7:06:41pm |
re: #85 Gus 802
What they really wanted from GWB:
• Nuke Iran
• Nuke North Korea
• Reverse Roe v. Wade
• Interment camps for American muslims
• Gay marriage amendment
• Reverse most of the Civil Rights Act…
What the Left Really wanted from Obama -
* Single Payer Health Insurance
* Gitmo closed on 20th January 2009
* Legalised Gay Marriage
* Whole sale dissolution of anti-union laws
* Goldman Sachs/Citi execs in leg irons and stocks with rotten veg, followed by life sentences
| 99 |
engineer cat Mon, Feb 7, 2011 7:06:50pm |
re: #89 rwmofo
Ummm, what? Ya know, we just had an election here.
we had elections in 2006 and 2008 too
there will be another election in 2012
| 100 |
jamesfirecat Mon, Feb 7, 2011 7:07:11pm |
re: #89 rwmofo
Ummm, what? Ya know, we just had an election here.
“The Democrat Party suffered major defeats in many national and state level elections, with many seats switching to Republican Party control. The Republican Party gained 63 seats in the U.S. House of Representatives, recapturing the majority, and making it the largest seat change since 1948 and the largest for any midterm election since the 1938 midterm elections. The Republicans gained six seats in the U.S. Senate, expanding its minority, and also gained 680 seats in state legislative races,[3][4][5] to break the previous majority record of 628 set by Democrats in the post-Watergate elections of 1974.[5] This left Republicans in control of 25 state legislatures, compared to the 15 still controlled by Democrats. After the election, Republicans took control of 29 of the 50 State Governorships.”
“The swaying views of self-declared independent voters, however, were largely responsible for the shift from Democratic to Republican gains.”
And for a bonus, all these electoral gains couldn’t have come at a better time. A new census was taken and guess who’s in the driver’s seat to re-draw congressional districts? That’s right. The good guys.
Hispanics are the largest growing population in the US.
Last time I checked they also voted disproportionately Democrat.
How long will it be until us Whites are in the minority in this nation?
Of course the above facts won’t matter if people don’t actually show up to vote, but enjoy your success now, because unless your party figures out how to do some impressive minority voter outreach, or impressive voter suppression, you’re doomed in the long run….
| 101 |
Dancing along the light of day Mon, Feb 7, 2011 7:07:23pm |
| 102 |
HappyWarrior Mon, Feb 7, 2011 7:07:49pm |
re: #76 jamesfirecat
Mainly the math looks so bleak because one of the biggest growing sections of our population is Hispanics, and the GOP seems to be doing everything short of showing up at their doorstep in a limo to take them to the polling place when it comes to making them vote democratic…
I can tell you this much, I think G.W Bush is really upset that the GOP has alienated Latinos so much. I didn’t think so at the time I admit but his efforts to court Latinos in to the GOP were genuine and he didn’t play the racial card. I’ve seen Republican officeholders since Bush left outright mock the Spanish language and Latino people. The Republicans need to become more moderate minded on issues like immigration, gay rights, and others if they want to survive IMO. You’re my age, James, you know that most of our peers even those who lean conservative on economics have no or little problems with gays, smoking pot, or any of the hot cultural issues. And the GOP remains focused on social conservatism. Heck, DeMint who has been a kingmaker for a lot of GOP candidates flat out said that you can’t be a fiscal cosnervative without being a social conservative. What he said was nonsense since there are many social liberals out there who are fiscal cons.
| 103 |
Gus Mon, Feb 7, 2011 7:08:05pm |
re: #101 Floral Giraffe
LOL!
You have to find them first!!
All eleventy-million of them!
I love the way they’re always using these inflated numbers for illegals.
| 104 |
engineer cat Mon, Feb 7, 2011 7:08:53pm |
re: #98 wozzablog
What the Left Really wanted from Obama -
* Single Payer Health Insurance
* Gitmo closed on 20th January 2009
* Legalised Gay Marriage
* Whole sale dissolution of anti-union laws
* Goldman Sachs/Citi execs in leg irons and stocks with rotten veg, followed by life sentences
repeal the stalinist “patriot” act and restore the 4th amendment to full force
| 105 |
jamesfirecat Mon, Feb 7, 2011 7:09:18pm |
re: #98 wozzablog
What the Left Really wanted from Obama -
* Single Payer Health Insurance
* Gitmo closed on 20th January 2009
* Legalised Gay Marriage
* Whole sale dissolution of anti-union laws
* Goldman Sachs/Citi execs in leg irons and stocks with rotten veg, followed by life sentences
I’d drop that last one personally, I’ve yet to hear many people asking for it, while the rest of the things on those list all seem like reasonable things to ask of the American Government…. (I say this not knowing the exact nature of the anti-union laws in question)
| 106 |
Political Atheist Mon, Feb 7, 2011 7:09:21pm |
re: #86 prairiefire
True, but that’s just one small facet of a Presidency. .
re: #87 engineer dog
Well why did he have to defend them so much? Because on at least two key issues, he was far from conservative. Fiscal and immigration policy. Was he the most conservative of the primary challengers he beat? Hardly…
| 107 |
Dancing along the light of day Mon, Feb 7, 2011 7:10:27pm |
re: #103 Gus 802
All eleventy-million of them!
I love the way they’re always using these inflated numbers for illegals.
Well, to be fair, they are kind of hard to count.
| 108 |
FemNaziBitch Mon, Feb 7, 2011 7:10:45pm |
re: #102 HappyWarrior
I can tell you this much, I think G.W Bush is really upset that the GOP has alienated Latinos so much. I didn’t think so at the time I admit but his efforts to court Latinos in to the GOP were genuine and he didn’t play the racial card. I’ve seen Republican officeholders since Bush left outright mock the Spanish language and Latino people. The Republicans need to become more moderate minded on issues like immigration, gay rights, and others if they want to survive IMO. You’re my age, James, you know that most of our peers even those who lean conservative on economics have no or little problems with gays, smoking pot, or any of the hot cultural issues. And the GOP remains focused on social conservatism. Heck, DeMint who has been a kingmaker for a lot of GOP candidates flat out said that you can’t be a fiscal cosnervative without being a social conservative. What he said was nonsense since there are many social liberals out there who are fiscal cons.
Republicans need to leave the social issues ALONE. Which is hard when you are really a group of theocrats.
Will someone form a party that focuses on fiscal issues? Please?
| 109 |
jaunte Mon, Feb 7, 2011 7:11:38pm |
A planned U.S./Afghan/Pakistani summit is in danger of being derailed:
U.S.-Pakistan relations strained further with case of jailed diplomat
The Obama administration has suspended all high-level dialogue with Pakistan, a key U.S. partner in the Afghanistan war, over the case of an American diplomat the Pakistanis have detained on possible murder charges, U.S. and Pakistani officials said.
| 110 |
jamesfirecat Mon, Feb 7, 2011 7:12:13pm |
re: #102 HappyWarrior
I can tell you this much, I think G.W Bush is really upset that the GOP has alienated Latinos so much. I didn’t think so at the time I admit but his efforts to court Latinos in to the GOP were genuine and he didn’t play the racial card. I’ve seen Republican officeholders since Bush left outright mock the Spanish language and Latino people. The Republicans need to become more moderate minded on issues like immigration, gay rights, and others if they want to survive IMO. You’re my age, James, you know that most of our peers even those who lean conservative on economics have no or little problems with gays, smoking pot, or any of the hot cultural issues. And the GOP remains focused on social conservatism. Heck, DeMint who has been a kingmaker for a lot of GOP candidates flat out said that you can’t be a fiscal cosnervative without being a social conservative. What he said was nonsense since there are many social liberals out there who are fiscal cons.
” or any of the hot cultural issues. “
Sadly I can’t quite agree with you on this.
Abortion still manages to draw a crowd even of relatively young conservatives the way that I don’t quite thing gay marraige can…
That said I did have a roommate for 2 and a half years in college who was a solid fiscal/small government republican who was more or less just as socially liberal as I was.
He was also an African American… I really should take some time to look up his email address and ask him who he plans to vote for in 2012….
| 111 |
HappyWarrior Mon, Feb 7, 2011 7:12:50pm |
re: #106 Rightwingconspirator
True, but that’s just one small facet of a Presidency. .
re: #87 engineer dog
Well why did he have to defend them so much? Because on at least two key issues, he was far from conservative. Fiscal and immigration policy. Was he the most conservative of the primary challengers he beat? Hardly…
Probably the most viable electorally conservative of those he ran against. I’ll easily give you that Alan Keyes and Pat Buchanan were more conservative than G.W Bush but no way in hell was the Republican Party going to nominate those two nutters for president.
| 113 |
jamesfirecat Mon, Feb 7, 2011 7:13:50pm |
re: #111 HappyWarrior
Probably the most viable electorally conservative of those he ran against. I’ll easily give you that Alan Keyes and Pat Buchanan were more conservative than G.W Bush but no way in hell was the Republican Party going to nominate those two nutters for president.
Back then… these days… if they’ll nominate Sarah Palin and or Newt Gingrich… they’ll nominate anyone…
| 114 |
prairiefire Mon, Feb 7, 2011 7:14:06pm |
re: #108 ggt
Republicans need to leave the social issues ALONE. Which is hard when you are really a group of theocrats.
Will someone form a party that focuses on fiscal issues? Please?
I think President Obama did a good job today with the C of C. He told them to start hiring and to start hiring now.
| 115 |
engineer cat Mon, Feb 7, 2011 7:15:11pm |
re: #106 Rightwingconspirator
True, but that’s just one small facet of a Presidency. .
re: #87 engineer dog
Well why did he have to defend them so much? Because on at least two key issues, he was far from conservative. Fiscal and immigration policy. Was he the most conservative of the primary challengers he beat? Hardly…
clearly then you could provide the authoritative conservative positions on fiscal and immigration policy
| 116 |
FemNaziBitch Mon, Feb 7, 2011 7:15:28pm |
Elections tend to boil down to two things for me. The 2nd Amendment and Reproductive Rights.
It’s been a long time since my vote was based on Reproductive Rights. But it is THE issue now.
I’ll never understand why the two seem be diametrically opposed politically.
| 117 |
Wozza Matter? Mon, Feb 7, 2011 7:15:48pm |
re: #102 HappyWarrior
I can tell you this much, I think G.W Bush is really upset that the GOP has alienated Latinos so much. I didn’t think so at the time I admit but his efforts to court Latinos in to the GOP were genuine and he didn’t play the racial card. I’ve seen Republican officeholders since Bush left outright mock the Spanish language and Latino people. The Republicans need to become more moderate minded on issues like immigration, gay rights, and others if they want to survive IMO.
Bush was a (relatively) decent friend to Latinos in Texas. If he had received an all encompassing immigration reform bill (enforcement and a pathto citizenship) he would have signed it in his second term.
| 119 |
HappyWarrior Mon, Feb 7, 2011 7:16:27pm |
re: #110 jamesfirecat
” or any of the hot cultural issues. “
Sadly I can’t quite agree with you on this.
Abortion still manages to draw a crowd even of relatively young conservatives the way that I don’t quite thing gay marraige can…
That said I did have a roommate for 2 and a half years in college who was a solid fiscal/small government republican who was more or less just as socially liberal as I was.
He was also an African American… I really should take some time to look up his email address and ask him who he plans to vote for in 2012…
Yeah abortion is still a big issue, I agree but things like gay marriage seem to be a smaller isssue is what I mean. You know that’s funny about your roommate since I had the same experience. We got along just fine and we agreed on just about every social issue. It was funny since he would watch Fox when we got trashed and he’d pass out with Fox on. I just remember being trashed myself one night and he had Beck on, I was just shaking my head since even drunk I could realize how full of shit Glenn Beck is.
| 120 |
Renaissance_Man Mon, Feb 7, 2011 7:16:37pm |
re: #116 ggt
I’ll never understand why the two seem be diametrically opposed politically.
Because the US binary, all-or-nothing, winner-take-all political system is primitive and does not reflect or serve its populace.
| 121 |
ProBosniaLiberal Mon, Feb 7, 2011 7:16:50pm |
re: #117 wozzablog
Immigration reform should also reform the legal immigration system. It is utterly broken.
| 122 |
HappyWarrior Mon, Feb 7, 2011 7:17:32pm |
re: #113 jamesfirecat
Back then… these days… if they’ll nominate Sarah Palin and or Newt Gingrich… they’ll nominate anyone…
Oh yeah for sure. The fact that Palin has a chance tells you that things have changed. Palin would have been seen like Keyes back in those days. I had a friend whose family were Keyes supporters. I was just in awe.
| 123 |
FemNaziBitch Mon, Feb 7, 2011 7:18:41pm |
re: #120 Renaissance_Man
Because the US binary, all-or-nothing, winner-take-all political system is primitive and does not reflect or serve its populace.
Winner take all for 4 years? in one office? While the senate, house and state government can be held for temporary period by other parties?
I don’t agree with your assessment.
| 124 |
HappyWarrior Mon, Feb 7, 2011 7:18:48pm |
re: #117 wozzablog
Bush was a (relatively) decent friend to Latinos in Texas. If he had received an all encompassing immigration reform bill (enforcement and a pathto citizenship) he would have signed it in his second term.
Yep, as I said, I didn’t believe his efforts were genuine at the time but looking back and with a less partisan eye, I give him credit. I was in some ways especially in his first term too hard on Bush. Still think he was wrong about Iraq but in hindsight I respect the man more.
| 125 |
moderatelyradicalliberal Mon, Feb 7, 2011 7:18:52pm |
re: #89 rwmofo
Ummm, what? Ya know, we just had an election here.
“The Democrat Party suffered major defeats in many national and state level elections, with many seats switching to Republican Party control. The Republican Party gained 63 seats in the U.S. House of Representatives, recapturing the majority, and making it the largest seat change since 1948 and the largest for any midterm election since the 1938 midterm elections. The Republicans gained six seats in the U.S. Senate, expanding its minority, and also gained 680 seats in state legislative races,[3][4][5] to break the previous majority record of 628 set by Democrats in the post-Watergate elections of 1974.[5] This left Republicans in control of 25 state legislatures, compared to the 15 still controlled by Democrats. After the election, Republicans took control of 29 of the 50 State Governorships.”
“The swaying views of self-declared independent voters, however, were largely responsible for the shift from Democratic to Republican gains.”
And for a bonus, all these electoral gains couldn’t have come at a better time. A new census was taken and guess who’s in the driver’s seat to re-draw congressional districts? That’s right. The good guys.
Um, you know what? Midterm election have a much lower turnout than national elections. Midterms are older and whiter than the general population. We were talking about presidential elections in which a much more broad segment of the population votes. The GOP won because of cultural resentment and a bad economy. Yes, angry old white people came out in mass to vote, whereas the Democrats base of the young and minorities stayed home. But the percentages that Democrats get from the groups pretty much held.
In other words the GOP base is dying and the Democrats base is comprised of the fastest growing segments of society. They will not be staying home in 2012. Even if they didn’t love Obama, they hate the GOP because as far as these groups are concerned they are not the “good guys” and never have been where their interests are concerned. The electorate will basically look like it did in 2008. Obama will basically win the same demographics he did in 2008 and as a result the same states.
Also, those states that gained from the new Census got most of those gains from demographics that tend to vote Democratic. I’m sure the GOP will do their best to gerrymander congressional seats, but the growth of those segments won’t allow for the kinds of gains they want. The GOP majority in the House will shrink in due time. Time is not on the GOP’s side.
Tick tock, tick tock. If demographics are destiny, time is still on the Democrats side. The 2010 midterms did not change that.
| 126 |
Decatur Deb Mon, Feb 7, 2011 7:19:03pm |
re: #116 ggt
Elections tend to boil down to two things for me. The 2nd Amendment and Reproductive Rights.
It’s been a long time since my vote was based on Reproductive Rights. But it is THE issue now.
I’ll never understand why the two seem be diametrically opposed politically.
It’s a manufactured bogeyman. Even after the Giffords shooting, no one is doing anything real-world about guns.
| 127 |
jamesfirecat Mon, Feb 7, 2011 7:19:06pm |
re: #119 HappyWarrior
Yeah abortion is still a big issue, I agree but things like gay marriage seem to be a smaller isssue is what I mean. You know that’s funny about your roommate since I had the same experience. We got along just fine and we agreed on just about every social issue. It was funny since he would watch Fox when we got trashed and he’d pass out with Fox on. I just remember being trashed myself one night and he had Beck on, I was just shaking my head since even drunk I could realize how full of shit Glenn Beck is.
If you want to understand Glenn Beck you need some LSD and a blacklight….
///and a lobotomy…
| 128 |
HappyWarrior Mon, Feb 7, 2011 7:19:28pm |
re: #127 jamesfirecat
If you want to understand Glenn Beck you need some LSD and a blacklight…
///and a lobotomy…
Yeah, you ain’t kidding.
| 129 |
FemNaziBitch Mon, Feb 7, 2011 7:19:34pm |
re: #124 HappyWarrior
Yep, as I said, I didn’t believe his efforts were genuine at the time but looking back and with a less partisan eye, I give him credit. I was in some ways especially in his first term too hard on Bush. Still think he was wrong about Iraq but in hindsight I respect the man more.
I respect that he has stayed in retirement.
| 130 |
prairiefire Mon, Feb 7, 2011 7:20:18pm |
re: #120 Renaissance_Man
Because the US binary, all-or-nothing, winner-take-all political system is primitive and does not reflect or serve its populace.
I will take it over a Parliamentary style government any day.
| 131 |
Wozza Matter? Mon, Feb 7, 2011 7:20:34pm |
re: #121 ProLifeLiberal
Immigration reform should also reform the legal immigration system. It is utterly broken.
I would love to be able to visit my girlfriend in San Antonio without feeling like a criminal for wanting to stay upto my alloted 3month tourist slot.
The hoops for UK citizens without criminal records and who want to work in the US are horrible.
A dear friend of mine wanted to move to New York for a year with his American GF who had been sent back by her company - he said the visa application process was singularly the most humiliating experience of his life - and at points officials were flat out dishonest.
| 132 |
Gus Mon, Feb 7, 2011 7:20:50pm |
re: #126 Decatur Deb
It’s a manufactured bogeyman. Even after the Giffords shooting, no one is doing anything real-world about guns.
That sells new memberships to the NRA. Mo’ hype. Mo’ money.
| 133 |
rwmofo Mon, Feb 7, 2011 7:20:51pm |
re: #102 HappyWarrior
I can tell you this much, I think G.W Bush is really upset that the GOP has alienated Latinos so much. I didn’t think so at the time I admit but his efforts to court Latinos in to the GOP were genuine and he didn’t play the racial card. I’ve seen Republican officeholders since Bush left outright mock the Spanish language and Latino people. The Republicans need to become more moderate minded on issues like immigration, gay rights, and others if they want to survive IMO. You’re my age, James, you know that most of our peers even those who lean conservative on economics have no or little problems with gays, smoking pot, or any of the hot cultural issues. And the GOP remains focused on social conservatism. Heck, DeMint who has been a kingmaker for a lot of GOP candidates flat out said that you can’t be a fiscal cosnervative without being a social conservative. What he said was nonsense since there are many social liberals out there who are fiscal cons.
I agree with all that except I’d tweak your characterization “issues like immigration” to “issues like illegal immigration.” I won’t sign up to the notion that no one has to follow the rules to get in. Most people who want to come here have good intentions, but letting anyone and everyone in without signing the guest-book is just asking for trouble. Is this an easy problem to sort out? No. But if you think we shouldn’t have rules, then go prop your front door open, then head to Hawaii for that long vacation you’ve been planning. Your house will be OK when you get back. Trust us.
| 134 |
prairiefire Mon, Feb 7, 2011 7:21:13pm |
re: #122 HappyWarrior
Oh yeah for sure. The fact that Palin has a chance tells you that things have changed. Palin would have been seen like Keyes back in those days. I had a friend whose family were Keyes supporters. I was just in awe.
I think she will be viewed as on the same level as Keyes by this summer.
| 135 |
dragonfire1981 Mon, Feb 7, 2011 7:21:37pm |
I am actually impressed how the right-wing media has successfully villainized anyone who isn’t far right. Anyone who doesn’t worship Rush Limbaugh is a liberal commie to destroy America.
To make matters worse these views are constantly echoed by Republican politicians, which I actually find a bit disturbing.
Todays GOP: Brought you by the number 316 and the letter T
| 136 |
Decatur Deb Mon, Feb 7, 2011 7:22:04pm |
re: #132 Gus 802
That sells new memberships to the NRA. Mo’ hype. Mo’ money.
And they’re under nutter attack from the GOA.
| 137 |
engineer cat Mon, Feb 7, 2011 7:22:40pm |
After the election, Republicans took control of 29 of the 50 State Governorships
if the party of the governor of a state made much difference, then both california and new york would have become red states with model republican policies long ago
| 138 |
ProBosniaLiberal Mon, Feb 7, 2011 7:23:52pm |
re: #131 wozzablog
Friend of mine has been in the US for 15 years. Still not a citizen. I am not amused. The length of immigration process must be the one of the contributing reasons for illegal immigration, along with NAFTA.
| 139 |
engineer cat Mon, Feb 7, 2011 7:24:23pm |
if george w bush was not a conservative, then conservatism is a fringe political movement in this country with no hope of electoral success or political power
| 140 |
HappyWarrior Mon, Feb 7, 2011 7:24:25pm |
re: #133 rwmofo
I agree with all that except I’d tweak your characterization “issues like immigration” to “issues like illegal immigration.” I won’t sign up to the notion that no one has to follow the rules to get in. Most people who want to come here have good intentions, but letting anyone and everyone in without signing the guest-book is just asking for trouble. Is this an easy problem to sort out? No. But if you think we shouldn’t have rules, then go prop your front door open, then head to Hawaii for that long vacation you’ve been planning. Your house will be OK when you get back. Trust us.
Well if you agree that most people who come here have good intentions then you probably would agree that we should make it easier to immigrate legally. Most of the anti illegal immigration people I encounter don’t want to hear that. Plus, I really resent the way many of them feel the need to badmouth Latinos and their language. There was one elected official and I am not saying this guy speaks for everyone but he said some crap like “Americans hate hearing the Spanish language.” Plus, the rise to support of people like that woman in Arizona who is on trial for murdering a nine year old girl is sick.
| 141 |
FemNaziBitch Mon, Feb 7, 2011 7:25:20pm |
re: #126 Decatur Deb
It’s a manufactured bogeyman. Even after the Giffords shooting, no one is doing anything real-world about guns.
They won’t, the Gifford’s shooting had little to do with gun issues —a lot to do with mental health issues.
There is a UN thingy coming up in 2012 about guns that could be a very big deal. (I have to get off-line in a minute otherwise I’d link IANSA). The Becks of the world will probably be griping about it soon enough—distracting and unproductive as it will be. . .
There are real bogeymen in regards to both issues, and I feel that both are equally important. I just have to vote on which issues I feel is most threatened at election time.
| 142 |
Renaissance_Man Mon, Feb 7, 2011 7:25:30pm |
re: #123 ggt
Winner take all for 4 years? in one office? While the senate, house and state government can be held for temporary period by other parties?
I don’t agree with your assessment.
Winner-take-all as opposed to a preferential voting system, where you can vote single-issue, or for a minor party, and your vote still counts. In the US system, you have two mega-parties, neither of which is likely to reflect all the views of any individual, and your vote thus counts towards many issues that you may not agree with, yet have to swallow regardless.
| 143 |
Wozza Matter? Mon, Feb 7, 2011 7:25:52pm |
re: #130 prairiefire
I will take it over a Parliamentary style government any day.
i have to say, i wouldn’t swap the English political system or it’s system of Governance for the American one.
There are 10 parties represented in the House of Commons and our debates are slightly better tempered than yours - with the words communist and marxist thrown around a lot less - mainly because of the fact that some of our Tory politicians are closer to being Marxists than most US Democrats.
| 144 |
Renaissance_Man Mon, Feb 7, 2011 7:25:59pm |
| 145 |
HappyWarrior Mon, Feb 7, 2011 7:26:55pm |
re: #138 ProLifeLiberal
Friend of mine has been in the US for 15 years. Still not a citizen. I am not amused. The length of immigration process must be the one of the contributing reasons for illegal immigration, along with NAFTA.
Yep, it’s cases like that of your friend are why I favor making legal immigration easier and the path to citizenship. The problem is many anti illegal immigration activists feel the need to compare these people to criminals. Like the crap Governor Brewer of Arizona pulled and the crap Tom Tancredo does on a daily basis.
| 146 |
FemNaziBitch Mon, Feb 7, 2011 7:28:07pm |
re: #143 wozzablog
i have to say, i wouldn’t swap the English political system or it’s system of Governance for the American one.
There are 10 parties represented in the House of Commons and our debates are slightly better tempered than yours - with the words communist and marxist thrown around a lot less - mainly because of the fact that some of our Tory politicians are closer to being Marxists than most US Democrats.
I thoroughly enjoy watching it on C-SPAN. :)
| 147 |
Killgore Trout Mon, Feb 7, 2011 7:28:11pm |
re: #137 engineer dog
After the election, Republicans took control of 29 of the 50 State Governorships
if the party of the governor of a state made much difference, then both california and new york would have become red states with model republican policies long ago
population density another big problem for the future of the Republican party . They are a rural party. Cutting social services, eliminating public transportation and all gun control restrictions will never appeal to urban voters. As cities grow and become larger and more dense the Republicans are going to lose ground. It’s inevitable.
| 148 |
Renaissance_Man Mon, Feb 7, 2011 7:28:50pm |
re: #135 dragonfire1981
I am actually impressed how the right-wing media has successfully villainized anyone who isn’t far right. Anyone who doesn’t worship Rush Limbaugh is a liberal commie to destroy America.
To make matters worse these views are constantly echoed by Republican politicians, which I actually find a bit disturbing.
Todays GOP: Brought you by the number 316 and the letter T
This media has created a cult based on hate. My only question is whether the cult is wholly created, or whether it is merely a response to some very dark attitudes lurking in small segments of the populace.
| 149 |
moderatelyradicalliberal Mon, Feb 7, 2011 7:29:05pm |
re: #133 rwmofo
I agree with all that except I’d tweak your characterization “issues like immigration” to “issues like illegal immigration.” I won’t sign up to the notion that no one has to follow the rules to get in. Most people who want to come here have good intentions, but letting anyone and everyone in without signing the guest-book is just asking for trouble. Is this an easy problem to sort out? No. But if you think we shouldn’t have rules, then go prop your front door open, then head to Hawaii for that long vacation you’ve been planning. Your house will be OK when you get back. Trust us.
Don’t worry. I’m sure the illegal immigration problem will be solved once your “good guy” alter the 14th Amendment.
| 150 |
Killgore Trout Mon, Feb 7, 2011 7:29:21pm |
re: #143 wozzablog
i have to say, i wouldn’t swap the English political system or it’s system of Governance for the American one.
There are 10 parties represented in the House of Commons and our debates are slightly better tempered than yours - with the words communist and marxist thrown around a lot less - mainly because of the fact that some of our Tory politicians are closer to being Marxists than most US Democrats.
I agree. Our system is far from perfect but I can’t really get very excited about the parliamentary system.
| 151 |
rwmofo Mon, Feb 7, 2011 7:29:39pm |
re: #137 engineer dog
After the election, Republicans took control of 29 of the 50 State Governorships
if the party of the governor of a state made much difference, then both california and new york would have become red states with model republican policies long ago
OTOH:
Governor Bush
Governor Clinton
Governor Reagan
Governor Roosevelt
Governor Wilson
There are probably more, but it’s a good prerequisite for higher office.
| 152 |
jamesfirecat Mon, Feb 7, 2011 7:29:59pm |
re: #137 engineer dog
After the election, Republicans took control of 29 of the 50 State Governorships
if the party of the governor of a state made much difference, then both california and new york would have become red states with model republican policies long ago
So you claim to be New York’s least liberal governor, big deal, do you know who their most liberal governor was? I’m pretty sure it was Jewington Q Analplay… I think they named a bridge after him…
| 154 |
Wozza Matter? Mon, Feb 7, 2011 7:32:09pm |
re: #138 ProLifeLiberal
Friend of mine has been in the US for 15 years. Still not a citizen. I am not amused. The length of immigration process must be the one of the contributing reasons for illegal immigration, along with NAFTA.
My GFs company are thinking of splitting her time between TX and either Chicago or Ottawa. Ottawa would be a dream for me - compared to the hoops for visiting the US i could pretty much up sticks and move & start working spit-spot.
(that is more due to the historic relationship between the UK and canada though)
| 155 |
jamesfirecat Mon, Feb 7, 2011 7:33:23pm |
re: #151 rwmofo
OTOH:
Governor Bush
Governor Clinton
Governor Reagan
Governor Roosevelt
Governor WilsonThere are probably more, but it’s a good prerequisite for higher office.
Actually I disagree.
I prefer Senators.
A Governor only has to deal with the issues of that particular state while a Senator by profession will end up meeting and talking with people coming from other states quite frequently giving them a more nuanced view of the many different threads that make up our nation….
| 156 |
prairiefire Mon, Feb 7, 2011 7:34:45pm |
re: #144 Renaissance_Man
Can I ask why?
From my observations, it seems a parliamentary style government is diluted in its strength. I think the US style can create greater gains, or set backs (the other side wins).
I’m open to reading more about it, but I don’t think American culture supports any more left leaning policies than what I can find in the Democratic party.
| 157 |
rwmofo Mon, Feb 7, 2011 7:35:12pm |
re: #140 HappyWarrior
Well if you agree that most people who come here have good intentions then you probably would agree that we should make it easier to immigrate legally. Most of the anti illegal immigration people I encounter don’t want to hear that. Plus, I really resent the way many of them feel the need to badmouth Latinos and their language. There was one elected official and I am not saying this guy speaks for everyone but he said some crap like “Americans hate hearing the Spanish language.” Plus, the rise to support of people like that woman in Arizona who is on trial for murdering a nine year old girl is sick.
I simply said that I agreed with pretty much everything you said. Then you mention the murder of a child? Huh?
| 158 |
Four More Tears Mon, Feb 7, 2011 7:36:05pm |
re: #138 ProLifeLiberal
Friend of mine has been in the US for 15 years. Still not a citizen. I am not amused. The length of immigration process must be the one of the contributing reasons for illegal immigration, along with NAFTA.
I think the real solution to putting a stop to illegal immigration is to stop making this a place people want to come to…
| 159 |
ProBosniaLiberal Mon, Feb 7, 2011 7:36:12pm |
re: #154 wozzablog
I would prefer a streamlined immigration system, so people like you could come on in, and when it comes to Canada, something like a Schengen Agreement. I think you know what I mean.
| 160 |
Dancing along the light of day Mon, Feb 7, 2011 7:37:19pm |
re: #147 Killgore Trout
population density another big problem for the future of the Republican party . They are a rural party. Cutting social services, eliminating public transportation and all gun control restrictions will never appeal to urban voters. As cities grow and become larger and more dense the Republicans are going to lose ground. It’s inevitable.
The statistics support those notions. However, the population in the rural areas need services too. The Republicans ( who supposedly represent farmers) need to find a way to address these issues.
| 161 |
HappyWarrior Mon, Feb 7, 2011 7:37:57pm |
re: #157 rwmofo
I simply said that I agreed with pretty much everything you said. Then you mention the murder of a child? Huh?
I know you did. I am just saying that the anti illegal immigration political movement has a lot of problems. My other problem is that they think that we could and should deport every single illegal without taking any account of the finanical cost.
| 162 |
Wozza Matter? Mon, Feb 7, 2011 7:39:09pm |
re: #156 prairiefire
From my observations, it seems a parliamentary style government is diluted in its strength. I think the US style can create greater gains, or set backs (the other side wins).
I’m open to reading more about it, but I don’t think American culture supports any more left leaning policies than what I can find in the Democratic party.
An executive with diluted power that wins only 30% of the total popular vote is no bad thing - as 70% of the poulation didn’t want them.
I would say though that the US system under Obama has hardly shined - a single national exchange with transparent co-pays and all sorts of simple common sense measures in an uncomplicated Bill is what he wanted before the Election - what emerged was a hodgepodge of hundred measures knitted together to achieve something that doesn’t measure up to what the President wanted, or what the Public wanted.
| 163 |
engineer cat Mon, Feb 7, 2011 7:40:33pm |
re: #151 rwmofo
OTOH:
Governor Bush
Governor Clinton
Governor Reagan
Governor Roosevelt
Governor WilsonThere are probably more, but it’s a good prerequisite for higher office.
if george w bush is not a conservative, who is the person who is conservative enough for you that has a chance of winning the presidency in 2012?
| 164 |
Wozza Matter? Mon, Feb 7, 2011 7:40:38pm |
re: #161 HappyWarrior
I know you did. I am just saying that the anti illegal immigration political movement has a lot of problems. My other problem is that they think that we could and should deport every single illegal without taking any account of the finanical cost.
Or practicallity - it would take a line of school buses nose to tail stretched from elpaso to anchorage to deport every illegal alien.
| 165 |
BongCrodny Mon, Feb 7, 2011 7:42:00pm |
re: #163 engineer dog
if george w bush is not a conservative, who is the person who is conservative enough for you that has a chance of winning the presidency in 2012?
I’m guessing her initials are S.P.
| 166 |
HappyWarrior Mon, Feb 7, 2011 7:42:11pm |
re: #164 wozzablog
Or practicallity - it would take a line of school buses nose to tail stretched from elpaso to anchorage to deport every illegal alien.
Yep that too. It amuses me to hear the same people who rail on liberals for being fiscally irresponsiblle act like we can deport all illegal immigrants.
| 167 |
rwmofo Mon, Feb 7, 2011 7:42:32pm |
re: #154 wozzablog
My GFs company are thinking of splitting her time between TX and either Chicago or Ottawa. Ottawa would be a dream for me - compared to the hoops for visiting the US i could pretty much up sticks and move & start working spit-spot.
(that is more due to the historic relationship between the UK and canada though)
“i could pretty much up sticks and move & start working spit-spot.”
Heh. I had to read that one twice.
| 168 |
Wozza Matter? Mon, Feb 7, 2011 7:43:39pm |
re: #159 ProLifeLiberal
I would prefer a streamlined immigration system, so people like you could come on in, and when it comes to Canada, something like a Schengen Agreement. I think you know what I mean.
With you.
| 169 |
ProBosniaLiberal Mon, Feb 7, 2011 7:44:16pm |
| 170 |
prairiefire Mon, Feb 7, 2011 7:44:23pm |
re: #162 wozzablog
It is an ongoing debate, to be sure. I think that there are some proposals from the right that are acceptable.
For example, I can’t remember the R Senator, but to secure his vote on DODT repeal, he sought greater access to college campuses for the ROTC. I think that military recruiting at liberal arts colleges is a good thing. I think it adds balance to recruit liberals as well as conservatives for our all volunteer army.
| 171 |
engineer cat Mon, Feb 7, 2011 7:44:47pm |
re: #165 BongCrodny
I’m guessing her initials are S.P.
my working theory of the republican nomination for 2012 is that the intersection of electable republicans and republicans acceptable to the “conservative” base is the empty set
| 172 |
Wozza Matter? Mon, Feb 7, 2011 7:46:06pm |
| 173 |
blueraven Mon, Feb 7, 2011 7:46:08pm |
re: #108 ggt
Republicans need to leave the social issues ALONE. Which is hard when you are really a group of theocrats.
Will someone form a party that focuses on fiscal issues? Please?
I thought that was what the tea party was all about. /
| 174 |
moderatelyradicalliberal Mon, Feb 7, 2011 7:46:52pm |
re: #163 engineer dog
if george w bush is not a conservative, who is the person who is conservative enough for you that has a chance of winning the presidency in 2012?
This made me think of a joke I heard.
The Easter Bunny, Santa Claus, President Obama and a sane, conservative GOP nominee for president in 2012 are running a race.
Question: Who makes it to the finish line first?
Answer: President Obama because the other three are imaginary.
| 175 |
moderatelyradicalliberal Mon, Feb 7, 2011 7:48:05pm |
| 176 |
jamesfirecat Mon, Feb 7, 2011 7:48:34pm |
re: #158 JasonA
I think the real solution to putting a stop to illegal immigration is to stop making this a place people want to come to…
Don’t worry Today’s GOP is hard at work to make sure that the USA soon has just a great wealth gap between the upper class and the “middle class” as Mexico does!
| 177 |
Prononymous, rogue demon hunter Mon, Feb 7, 2011 7:48:48pm |
re: #147 Killgore Trout
population density another big problem for the future of the Republican party . They are a rural party. Cutting social services, eliminating public transportation and all gun control restrictions will never appeal to urban voters. As cities grow and become larger and more dense the Republicans are going to lose ground. It’s inevitable.
I predict the GOP won’t be popular with arcology residents. Call me Nostradumass.
| 178 |
Decatur Deb Mon, Feb 7, 2011 7:49:12pm |
Politico reports a new Face in the Crowd, my ever-lovin ex-gov.
[Link: www.politico.com…]
| 179 |
SanFranciscoZionist Mon, Feb 7, 2011 7:49:23pm |
re: #174 moderatelyradicalliberal
This made me think of a joke I heard.
The Easter Bunny, Santa Claus, President Obama and a sane, conservative GOP nominee for president in 2012 are running a race.
Question: Who makes it to the finish line first?
Answer: President Obama because the other three are imaginary.
Ghhhah. Too true right now.
I said earlier, I finally saw Pawlenty’s appearance on The Daily Show, and I was really disappointed. This guy either truly doesn’t get it, or is way too smart to let on that he gets it. Lots of dodging and ducking and diving.
| 180 |
ProBosniaLiberal Mon, Feb 7, 2011 7:49:24pm |
re: #172 wozzablog
I think it would make things a little simpler between the US and Canada.
| 181 |
rwmofo Mon, Feb 7, 2011 7:49:26pm |
re: #161 HappyWarrior
I know you did. I am just saying that the anti illegal immigration political movement has a lot of problems. My other problem is that they think that we could and should deport every single illegal without taking any account of the finanical cost.
There are definitely those who shoot off their mouth without considering the consequences and this is clearly an untenable undertaking. Like I said above, “Is this an easy problem to sort out? No.” How do we address it? Hopefully there will be a bi-partisan approach in the future. One thing is certain. People in other countries are not going to stop wanting to come here. Sidebar: I work for a Chinese company. Trust me. The ones who are here LOVE IT.
| 182 |
jamesfirecat Mon, Feb 7, 2011 7:49:27pm |
re: #160 Floral Giraffe
The statistics support those notions. However, the population in the rural areas need services too. The Republicans ( who supposedly represent farmers) need to find a way to address these issues.
///But addressing problems is hard! Can’t we just keep telling those farmers that its all Hollywood’s fault instead?
| 183 |
Decatur Deb Mon, Feb 7, 2011 7:49:33pm |
re: #177 prononymous
I predict the GOP won’t be popular with arcology residents. Call me Nostradumass.
Solieri upding.
| 184 |
Wozza Matter? Mon, Feb 7, 2011 7:50:43pm |
re: #170 prairiefire
It is an ongoing debate, to be sure. I think that there are some proposals from the right that are acceptable.
For example, I can’t remember the R Senator, but to secure his vote on DODT repeal, he sought greater access to college campuses for the ROTC. I think that military recruiting at liberal arts colleges is a good thing. I think it adds balance to recruit liberals as well as conservatives for our all volunteer army.
Horse trading happens in all democracies. My main concern is that the US legislature (of the Presidents own party) managed to muff a fairly simple task of implementing the main policy goal he had - and not one which at the time was particularly unpopular in the polls - i linked a Kaiser survey at the time which gave the Public Option plan 65% approval.
I couldn’t see that sort of monumental failure happening in Britain.
| 185 |
Prononymous, rogue demon hunter Mon, Feb 7, 2011 7:51:17pm |
| 186 |
prairiefire Mon, Feb 7, 2011 7:53:00pm |
re: #184 wozzablog
I think we managed to muff quite a number of things. It all comes out in the wash./
| 187 |
Decatur Deb Mon, Feb 7, 2011 7:53:07pm |
| 188 |
HappyWarrior Mon, Feb 7, 2011 7:53:24pm |
re: #181 rwmofo
There are definitely those who shoot off their mouth without considering the consequences and this is clearly an untenable undertaking. Like I said above, “Is this an easy problem to sort out? No.” How do we address it? Hopefully there will be a bi-partisan approach in the future. One thing is certain. People in other countries are not going to stop wanting to come here. Sidebar: I work for a Chinese company. Trust me. The ones who are here LOVE IT.
Well you seem to understand the issue isn’t simple. And I agree with you, the desire to emigrate here is as strong as when my first ancestors emigrated here in the years leading up to the Civil War. I am of hte thought that we should be proud that people want to come here. People belive in the American Dream and it’s a wonderful thing.
| 189 |
ProBosniaLiberal Mon, Feb 7, 2011 7:54:06pm |
re: #181 rwmofo
No wonder your Conservative. Emulate China’s repressive actions against Muslims and other minority ethnicities? Or how about flagrant and massive abuse of the environment?
| 190 |
Prononymous, rogue demon hunter Mon, Feb 7, 2011 7:55:31pm |
re: #187 Decatur Deb
Soleri. Bell-maker and Arcology inventor:
[Link: www.arcosanti.org…]
Ah. Interesting.
| 192 |
Decatur Deb Mon, Feb 7, 2011 7:56:24pm |
| 193 |
jamesfirecat Mon, Feb 7, 2011 7:56:55pm |
re: #184 wozzablog
Horse trading happens in all democracies. My main concern is that the US legislature (of the Presidents own party) managed to muff a fairly simple task of implementing the main policy goal he had - and not one which at the time was particularly unpopular in the polls - i linked a Kaiser survey at the time which gave the Public Option plan 65% approval.
I couldn’t see that sort of monumental failure happening in Britain.
I bet its because in the UK you don’t need 60% vote in the upper house to get things done.
Am I right?
Seriously, we need to reform the filibuster, NOW!
| 194 |
rwmofo Mon, Feb 7, 2011 7:57:41pm |
re: #163 engineer dog
if george w bush is not a conservative, who is the person who is conservative enough for you that has a chance of winning the presidency in 2012?
I haven’t given it much thought yet, but John Kasich comes to mind. He was the Chairman of the Budget Committee in the House in the ’90s and was largely responsible for balancing the budget. …and he’s, like, the Governor of Ohio now.
I didn’t say George Bush wasn’t conservative. Not sure where you got that idea.
| 195 |
HappyWarrior Mon, Feb 7, 2011 7:58:49pm |
I am just trying to think of a viable Republican presidential candidate.
Romney: smart, moderate image but you just know his opponents will hammer him for havign a similiar health care plan to that of the Obama White House. P
Daniels: Little name recongization, I imagine the social conservatives will do anything they can to prevent him from being nominated, the social issue truce he proposed won’t be popular among people like Jim DeMint who is a kingmaker in an early and key Republican primary state.
Huckabee: He’s charimsatic enough, socially conservative, could be nominated but even he may be attacked from the left.
Pawlentley: On paper, he’s good, two term governor of a democratic leaning state, strongly conservative on all the right issues but he’s apparently a bore.
Palin: This will be the first term she’s really had to run for a high office, yes she was nominated as VP but she didn’t have to go through actually being criticized by fellow Republicans and the way she responds to criticism tells me it won’t end well.
Gingrich: Hard to sell yourselves as anti Washington by running a consumate insider plus a guy who has zero character.
Trying to think of other possible candidates.
| 196 |
Dancing along the light of day Mon, Feb 7, 2011 8:00:29pm |
re: #187 Decatur Deb
And a WONDERFUL PLACE TO VISIT, if you can.
| 197 |
HappyWarrior Mon, Feb 7, 2011 8:00:48pm |
re: #189 ProLifeLiberal
No wonder your Conservative. Emulate China’s repressive actions against Muslims and other minority ethnicities? Or how about flagrant and massive abuse of the environment?
To be fair, if I understood rwmofo correctly, he was saying that the Chinese people he works with love it here in America. That’s how I interpreted it at least.
| 198 |
blueraven Mon, Feb 7, 2011 8:00:54pm |
re: #89 rwmofo
recapturing the majority, and making it the largest seat change since 1948 and the largest for any midterm election since the 1938 midterm elections. .
Yes, and the republicans went on to win the presidency in 1940, such a sad day for the dems…oh wait, huh?
| 199 |
Wozza Matter? Mon, Feb 7, 2011 8:01:16pm |
re: #193 jamesfirecat
I bet its because in the UK you don’t need 60% vote in the upper house to get things done.
Am I right?
Seriously, we need to reform the filibuster, NOW!
It is exceptionally difficult for minority parties to “talk out” legislation - and there is generally quite slavish loyalty to the leaders of the majority party, so things seem to run a lot smoother.
Our system also seems more collegiate - the opposition tends to have more interest in meliorating bad bills than not engaging at all in the substantive aspects of the legislative process.
| 200 |
Jadespring Mon, Feb 7, 2011 8:01:20pm |
I’ve decided that if I’m ever forced to move to the US I will choose to live in Hawaii.
| 202 |
Wozza Matter? Mon, Feb 7, 2011 8:02:03pm |
re: #200 Jadespring
I’ve decided that if I’m ever forced to move to the US I will choose to live in Hawaii.
Worked for the President…..
/
| 203 |
Decatur Deb Mon, Feb 7, 2011 8:02:16pm |
re: #196 Floral Giraffe
And a WONDERFUL PLACE TO VISIT, if you can.
Yes—I can finally afford to be a freakn’ hippie.
| 204 |
ProBosniaLiberal Mon, Feb 7, 2011 8:02:25pm |
re: #194 rwmofo
I’m pretty sure Clinton played a big role in the stamping out of the deficit. Let’s not also forget how much of our current debt comes from the Reagan Administration, and the 2 Bush ones. That tax cut wasn’t fiscally conservative either. Republicans talk a big game, and end up doing worse than the other guys.
| 205 |
Killgore Trout Mon, Feb 7, 2011 8:02:33pm |
re: #200 Jadespring
I’ve decided that if I’m ever forced to move to the US I will choose to live in Hawaii.
It’s like Florida without the rednecks.
| 206 |
rwmofo Mon, Feb 7, 2011 8:03:07pm |
re: #189 ProLifeLiberal
No wonder your Conservative. Emulate China’s repressive actions against Muslims and other minority ethnicities? Or how about flagrant and massive abuse of the environment?
Feel free to find a single comment where I said anything remotely related to your claims.
| 207 |
Wozza Matter? Mon, Feb 7, 2011 8:03:08pm |
re: #200 Jadespring
I’ve decided that if I’m ever forced to move to the US I will choose to live in Hawaii.
I would move to Montana, marry a round American woman and raise rabbits………….
| 208 |
Renaissance_Man Mon, Feb 7, 2011 8:03:20pm |
re: #184 wozzablog
Horse trading happens in all democracies. My main concern is that the US legislature (of the Presidents own party) managed to muff a fairly simple task of implementing the main policy goal he had - and not one which at the time was particularly unpopular in the polls - i linked a Kaiser survey at the time which gave the Public Option plan 65% approval.
I couldn’t see that sort of monumental failure happening in Britain.
This occurs for several reasons, but partly because the US system is winner-take-all, or as it ends up becoming, zero-sum. Essentially, with only two possible choices, those in the party out of power have absolutely no incentive to compromise. There is no alternative choice to the other party save them, so they know that no matter how poorly they represent their constituents or assist in governance, they have roughly 50% of the votes tied up. A complicit media will push them over, as we saw recently, especially here in the US where the media is the most powerful entity in the system. Horse trading in preferential and parliamentary systems is more frequent because there are incentives to do so, measured directly in votes.
The other reason such a failure occurred, of course, is because Democrats represent both sides of the left-right divide that occurs across party lines in other systems. In the US, Democrats are both the left and the right. And this makes passing legislation hard in a system where anywhere from a third to half of the seats belong to something outside the traditional left-right axis, ie. a political activist group that represents only a small minority of the populace. It makes it doubly hard when you consider that the US federal system is designed for inertia - large-scale reform is not encouraged.
| 209 |
HappyWarrior Mon, Feb 7, 2011 8:03:22pm |
re: #201 Killgore Trout
Ron Paul!
/
How could I forget him. Plus there’s that former governor of New Mexico, Johnson. I don’t give either much of a shot really especially Johnson since I think he’s come out in favor of gay marriage.
| 210 |
Jadespring Mon, Feb 7, 2011 8:03:36pm |
| 211 |
Prononymous, rogue demon hunter Mon, Feb 7, 2011 8:03:57pm |
re: #192 Decatur Deb
Wanted to join in the 70s. Might yet.
I was acquainted with the idea of arcologies from scifi. But I never knew who originated the idea. It sounds like something I’d like.
Arcologies may be the only direction city planning can go in if the growth of the human population continues at its current rate.
| 212 |
ProBosniaLiberal Mon, Feb 7, 2011 8:04:05pm |
re: #197 HappyWarrior
Knew that to a point, but it proved a little to tempting a target.
| 213 |
HappyWarrior Mon, Feb 7, 2011 8:04:15pm |
re: #210 Jadespring
Plus it has the Hawaii Five O guys.
and it had my brother for the last ten days.
| 214 |
moderatelyradicalliberal Mon, Feb 7, 2011 8:04:24pm |
re: #184 wozzablog
Horse trading happens in all democracies. My main concern is that the US legislature (of the Presidents own party) managed to muff a fairly simple task of implementing the main policy goal he had - and not one which at the time was particularly unpopular in the polls - i linked a Kaiser survey at the time which gave the Public Option plan 65% approval.
I couldn’t see that sort of monumental failure happening in Britain.
Britain doesn’t have a major political party that rejects the notion of universal health care. Nor do they have a legislative chamber that allows for one person to have the power to prevent a public option from coming up for a vote via the filibuster even thought it would have passed.
Public approval doesn’t get you very far under those circumstances. Maybe if those of us who support the public option had shown up at townhalls and behaved like TPers things would have worked out differently.
| 215 |
Decatur Deb Mon, Feb 7, 2011 8:05:23pm |
re: #207 wozzablog
I would move to Montana, marry a round American woman and raise rabbits…
You have to come to Montana for rabbits? (Kid got his tickets to Australia today.)
| 217 |
moderatelyradicalliberal Mon, Feb 7, 2011 8:05:51pm |
re: #195 HappyWarrior
I am just trying to think of a viable Republican presidential candidate.
Romney: smart, moderate image but you just know his opponents will hammer him for havign a similiar health care plan to that of the Obama White House. P
Daniels: Little name recongization, I imagine the social conservatives will do anything they can to prevent him from being nominated, the social issue truce he proposed won’t be popular among people like Jim DeMint who is a kingmaker in an early and key Republican primary state.
Huckabee: He’s charimsatic enough, socially conservative, could be nominated but even he may be attacked from the left.
Pawlentley: On paper, he’s good, two term governor of a democratic leaning state, strongly conservative on all the right issues but he’s apparently a bore.
Palin: This will be the first term she’s really had to run for a high office, yes she was nominated as VP but she didn’t have to go through actually being criticized by fellow Republicans and the way she responds to criticism tells me it won’t end well.
Gingrich: Hard to sell yourselves as anti Washington by running a consumate insider plus a guy who has zero character.
Trying to think of other possible candidates.
That’s one tired list and it looks an awful lot like the line up they had in 2008.
Losers every one of them.
| 219 |
Dancing along the light of day Mon, Feb 7, 2011 8:05:58pm |
re: #215 Decatur Deb
You have to come to Montana for rabbits? (Kid got his tickets to Australia today.)
WOOT!
| 220 |
Decatur Deb Mon, Feb 7, 2011 8:06:33pm |
re: #211 prononymous
I was acquainted with the idea of arcologies from scifi. But I never knew who originated the idea. It sounds like something I’d like.
Arcologies may be the only direction city planning can go in if the growth of the human population continues at its current rate.
He’s quite a genius—the project has been vastly scaled back, but he actually built something.
| 222 |
SanFranciscoZionist Mon, Feb 7, 2011 8:07:01pm |
re: #207 wozzablog
I would move to Montana, marry a round American woman and raise rabbits…
That guy breaks my heart every time.
| 223 |
Wozza Matter? Mon, Feb 7, 2011 8:07:27pm |
re: #215 Decatur Deb
You have to come to Montana for rabbits? (Kid got his tickets to Australia today.)
You do if you are escaping a nuclear submarine.
Australia is an awesome place i was there 10 years ago - its like England if England were hot. Its pretty much the staging post between US culture/live and the British way.
| 224 |
moderatelyradicalliberal Mon, Feb 7, 2011 8:07:27pm |
re: #198 blueraven
Yes, and the republicans went on to win the presidency in 1940, such a sad day for the dems…oh wait, huh?
Exactly. Since when has the minority party winning midterm election unusual?
| 225 |
SanFranciscoZionist Mon, Feb 7, 2011 8:07:54pm |
re: #224 moderatelyradicalliberal
Exactly. Since when has the minority party winning midterm election unusual?
It’s pretty routine.
| 226 |
Prononymous, rogue demon hunter Mon, Feb 7, 2011 8:08:38pm |
re: #200 Jadespring
I’ve decided that if I’m ever forced to move to the US I will choose to live in Hawaii.
When (not if) I leave NM, it’s going to be for Colorado, Oregon, or Hawaii. Not settled on which yet…
| 227 |
moderatelyradicalliberal Mon, Feb 7, 2011 8:09:52pm |
re: #204 ProLifeLiberal
I’m pretty sure Clinton played a big role in the stamping out of the deficit. Let’s not also forget how much of our current debt comes from the Reagan Administration, and the 2 Bush ones. That tax cut wasn’t fiscally conservative either. Republicans talk a big game, and end up doing worse than the other guys.
One day somebody will provide me proof that Republicans are real fiscal conservatives when they have control of the executive and legislative branches of the federal government, but I won’t hold my breath.
| 228 |
jamesfirecat Mon, Feb 7, 2011 8:10:07pm |
re: #204 ProLifeLiberal
I’m pretty sure Clinton played a big role in the stamping out of the deficit. Let’s not also forget how much of our current debt comes from the Reagan Administration, and the 2 Bush ones. That tax cut wasn’t fiscally conservative either. Republicans talk a big game, and end up doing worse than the other guys.
Here’s a graph on the subject!
| 229 |
HappyWarrior Mon, Feb 7, 2011 8:10:17pm |
re: #225 SanFranciscoZionist
It’s pretty routine.
I think people with short term memories seem to think because Bush and the Republicans actually gained in 2002 that it was the norm when in fact it was an anamoly in political history. Heck even a certain guy whose 100th birthday it is today had his party lose a lot of seats in his 1st midterm.
| 230 |
Renaissance_Man Mon, Feb 7, 2011 8:11:10pm |
re: #223 wozzablog
You do if you are escaping a nuclear submarine.
Australia is an awesome place i was there 10 years ago - its like England if England were hot…
And the English were cooler people. And had better food. And played better versions of football.
| 231 |
prairiefire Mon, Feb 7, 2011 8:11:36pm |
| 232 |
Wozza Matter? Mon, Feb 7, 2011 8:12:17pm |
re: #230 Renaissance_Man
And the English were cooler people. And had better food. And played better versions of football.
One can quite quickly go off of somebody, you know ;-)
| 233 |
Wozza Matter? Mon, Feb 7, 2011 8:13:22pm |
re: #231 prairiefire
Wozza’s a charmer, that’s true.
I do have a round American woman.
And, oh, bless your heart.
xx
| 234 |
Lidane Mon, Feb 7, 2011 8:15:32pm |
re: #16 rwmofo
I don’t think “mainstream” is really an accurate characterization of Chris Matthews. Matthews is clearly a hard-line leftist who doesn’t have much tolerance for ideas that drift toward the center.
You’re delusional if you think that Chris Matthews is a hardline leftist. He’s nothing of the sort.
| 235 |
Four More Tears Mon, Feb 7, 2011 8:15:51pm |
re: #207 wozzablog
I would move to Montana, marry a round American woman and raise rabbits…
Red October will always get an upding from me.
| 236 |
SanFranciscoZionist Mon, Feb 7, 2011 8:16:35pm |
re: #229 HappyWarrior
I think people with short term memories seem to think because Bush and the Republicans actually gained in 2002 that it was the norm when in fact it was an anamoly in political history. Heck even a certain guy whose 100th birthday it is today had his party lose a lot of seats in his 1st midterm.
9/11 created a decidedly anomalous situation.
| 237 |
Kragar (Antichrist ) Mon, Feb 7, 2011 8:16:55pm |
| 238 |
Wozza Matter? Mon, Feb 7, 2011 8:17:44pm |
| 239 |
rwmofo Mon, Feb 7, 2011 8:18:44pm |
re: #204 ProLifeLiberal
I’m pretty sure Clinton played a big role in the stamping out of the deficit. Let’s not also forget how much of our current debt comes from the Reagan Administration, and the 2 Bush ones. That tax cut wasn’t fiscally conservative either. Republicans talk a big game, and end up doing worse than the other guys.
During Jimmy Carter’s last year in office (1980), inflation averaged 12.5%, compared to 4.4% during Reagan’s last year in office (1988). Over those eight years, the unemployment rate declined from 7.1% to 5.5%.
GDP almost doubled from 1981 to 1989. During Reagan’s presidency, federal income tax rates were lowered significantly with the signing of the bipartisan Economic Recovery Tax Act of 1981 which lowered the top marginal tax bracket from 70% to 50% and the lowest bracket from 14% to 11%. During the Reagan Administration, federal receipts grew at an average rate of 8.2%.
One little issue. The democrat party controlled the House of Representatives during the ’80s. So with all this extra revenue coming in, couldn’t they at least try to control spending? Yeah, right. Let’s see. Reagan asks the dems to cut back on anything and the media/democrat party yells, “War on the poor! War on the children! Tax cuts for the rich!” Old reliable.
| 240 |
Dancing along the light of day Mon, Feb 7, 2011 8:19:01pm |
I am really tired of the haters.
Seriously.
Take your hate and shove it.
Anywhere it will fit.
Love is all you need.
I hope this leads anyone to heal.
| 241 |
FemNaziBitch Mon, Feb 7, 2011 8:19:07pm |
re: #236 SanFranciscoZionist
9/11 created a decidedly anomalous situation.
Yeah, I have a hard time blaming Bush for the spending after 9/11. Any POTUS would have had to make big changes.
| 242 |
ProBosniaLiberal Mon, Feb 7, 2011 8:19:56pm |
re: #227 moderatelyradicalliberal
We saw how “Fiscal Conservative” Republicans are between 2004-2006, when they had control of Congress and Presidency. It wasn’t pretty for our debt.
| 243 |
prairiefire Mon, Feb 7, 2011 8:20:49pm |
Who gets to see the endodontist tomorrow? Me! Who’s jealous?
| 244 |
Lidane Mon, Feb 7, 2011 8:20:53pm |
re: #239 rwmofo
Downding for the idiotic and tiresome use of both “democrat party” and “media/democrat party”. Find some new cliches, please.
| 245 |
HappyWarrior Mon, Feb 7, 2011 8:21:40pm |
re: #236 SanFranciscoZionist
9/11 created a decidedly anomalous situation.
It did indeed. I am too lazy to check but I wonder if the Dems gained seats in Congress in 1942 after Pearl Harbor happened. Just curious here.
| 247 |
Dancing along the light of day Mon, Feb 7, 2011 8:23:16pm |
re: #243 prairiefire
Who gets to see the endodontist tomorrow? Me! Who’s jealous?
I hope he finds NOTHING to do!
Prayers for you.
| 248 |
Wozza Matter? Mon, Feb 7, 2011 8:24:08pm |
re: #239 rwmofo
During Jimmy Carter’s last year in office (1980), inflation averaged 12.5%, compared to 4.4% during Reagan’s last year in office (1988). Over those eight years, the unemployment rate declined from 7.1% to 5.5%.
GDP almost doubled from 1981 to 1989. During Reagan’s presidency, federal income tax rates were lowered significantly with the signing of the bipartisan Economic Recovery Tax Act of 1981 which lowered the top marginal tax bracket from 70% to 50% and the lowest bracket from 14% to 11%. During the Reagan Administration, federal receipts grew at an average rate of 8.2%.
One little issue. The democrat party controlled the House of Representatives during the ’80s. So with all this extra revenue coming in, couldn’t they at least try to control spending? Yeah, right. Let’s see. Reagan asks the dems to cut back on anything and the media/democrat party yells, “War on the poor! War on the children! Tax cuts for the rich!” Old reliable.
I refer you to the chart of Presidents and ask you to study who has shrunk the debt/increased it the least - and then look at Reagan and both Bushes.
| 250 |
Wozza Matter? Mon, Feb 7, 2011 8:24:39pm |
re: #248 wozzablog
[Link: en.wikipedia.org…]
| 251 |
prairiefire Mon, Feb 7, 2011 8:25:04pm |
re: #247 Floral Giraffe
Thank you, sweetie. I’m afraid he will. I have a 20 year old root canal that is acting up. Dental surgery ~ Woot!
| 252 |
ProBosniaLiberal Mon, Feb 7, 2011 8:25:06pm |
re: #239 rwmofo
And how have the Conservative ideas on the economy worked for the dude on the street? Wages have stagnated since Reagan, and the US has become more stratified. This must change. To be perfectly blunt, I detest Reagan, and my family has thought Reagan started the US down this road since 2004. He is vastly over-rated. If you want to find a good Republican, go to Eisenhower or even Nixon (I think Nixon would have been fine if he was taking some sort of Medicine for whatever disorder he had. His Presidency had a lot o good things come out of it, EPA being one good example).
| 253 |
Dancing along the light of day Mon, Feb 7, 2011 8:25:13pm |
| 254 |
Lidane Mon, Feb 7, 2011 8:26:47pm |
re: #243 prairiefire
Who gets to see the endodontist tomorrow? Me! Who’s jealous?
Not me. I get to go see my endocrinologist on Friday, complete with a thyroid ultrasound. Oh joy. And this after spending the last three days recovering from a kidney stone and all the aches and complications that come with that.
And I’m still not finished with one of the projects I have due today. Dammit.
| 255 |
Kragar (Antichrist ) Mon, Feb 7, 2011 8:26:52pm |
Well, the good thing about being home all day with a bad back was I finally finished my Bjorn the Fell-Handed conversion.
| 256 |
Dancing along the light of day Mon, Feb 7, 2011 8:27:10pm |
LOL!
“crunk”
is the “new” “cool” word for someone.
| 257 |
Fat Bastard Vegetarian Mon, Feb 7, 2011 8:27:11pm |
re: #251 prairiefire
I have TMJ… had a rootcanal once… the strain of holding my mouth open for so long was the only problem.
Of course, that part hurt so bad, the actual dentisting was not even relative.
| 258 |
Wozza Matter? Mon, Feb 7, 2011 8:27:25pm |
ok. again.
at 04:26 - i bid you all goodnight, pleasant dreams and a better tomorrow if required.
| 259 |
palomino Mon, Feb 7, 2011 8:28:58pm |
re: #100 jamesfirecat
Hispanics are the largest growing population in the US.
Last time I checked they also voted disproportionately Democrat.
How long will it be until us Whites are in the minority in this nation?
Of course the above facts won’t matter if people don’t actually show up to vote, but enjoy your success now, because unless your party figures out how to do some impressive minority voter outreach, or impressive voter suppression, you’re doomed in the long run…
Well, the tea partiers and their fellow travelers aren’t real big on the future. Stuck in the moment with a romanticized understanding of the past, they now fantasize about the same “permanent republican majority” Rove was supposed to be creating a decade ago. And that was before the GOP went all xenophobic and alienated most Hispanics, as well as even more blacks, Muslims, gays and other minorities. Their party is overwhelmingly white in Congress, and still overwhelmingly male; exclusively Christian except for Cantor. Ignorant fantasists see this as a winning formula. Realists know that what they’ve got isn’t America’s future, but a simulacrum of its past. Your days are numbered when you can only appeal to a quickly shrinking group.
They seem to have no comprehension of demographics and how their party will be impacted by demo changes. Whites will be the minority in about 30 years.
Think about these startling numbers: right now, there are about 5 white voters for each black voter and each Hispanic voter. By 2040, there will be only 3 whites for each black voter; and stunningly, only 1.5 whites for each Hispanic.
Which means that in the coming decades the GOP will do one of two things: become a white southern christian party usually in the minority, OR adapt to a changing nation. My guess is the latter, but the TP types won’t go along quietly.
| 260 |
Fat Bastard Vegetarian Mon, Feb 7, 2011 8:29:13pm |
re: #255 Kragar (Proud to be Kafir)
Don’t know what that means, but it made me think;
Has anybody every taken a picture of Bjorn Borg and made him look assimilated? I think that would be funny.
| 261 |
Kragar (Antichrist ) Mon, Feb 7, 2011 8:29:57pm |
re: #260 Fat Bastard Vegetarian
Don’t know what that means, but it made me think;
Has anybody every taken a picture of Bjorn Borg and made him look assimilated? I think that would be funny.
| 262 |
prairiefire Mon, Feb 7, 2011 8:30:03pm |
re: #254 Lidane
Good luck with the project. I remember that school anxiety. *shudder*
| 263 |
FemNaziBitch Mon, Feb 7, 2011 8:31:15pm |
re: #259 palomino
Well, the tea partiers and their fellow travelers aren’t real big on the future. Stuck in the moment with a romanticized understanding of the past, they now fantasize about the same “permanent republican majority” Rove was supposed to be creating a decade ago. And that was before the GOP went all xenophobic and alienated most Hispanics, as well as even more blacks, Muslims, gays and other minorities. Their party is overwhelmingly white in Congress, and still overwhelmingly male; exclusively Christian except for Cantor. Ignorant fantasists see this as a winning formula. Realists know that what they’ve got isn’t America’s future, but a simulacrum of its past. Your days are numbered when you can only appeal to a quickly shrinking group.
They seem to have no comprehension of demographics and how their party will be impacted by demo changes. Whites will be the minority in about 30 years.
Think about these startling numbers: right now, there are about 5 white voters for each black voter and each Hispanic voter. By 2040, there will be only 3 whites for each black voter; and stunningly, only 1.5 whites for each Hispanic.
Which means that in the coming decades the GOP will do one of two things: become a white southern christian party usually in the minority, OR adapt to a changing nation. My guess is the latter, but the TP types won’t go along quietly.
by 2040 there will be alot fewer people who identify as one ethnic group.
| 264 |
Kragar (Antichrist ) Mon, Feb 7, 2011 8:31:25pm |
Pff, doesn’t load, so try here
[Link: colshofer.blogspot.com…]
| 265 |
Lidane Mon, Feb 7, 2011 8:31:58pm |
re: #262 prairiefire
Good luck with the project. I remember that school anxiety. *shudder*
I’m lucky in that my prof said I could e-mail it to her today, but I don’t think she had turning it in around midnight in mind. She was understanding of me being sick, though, so there’s that.
| 266 |
HappyWarrior Mon, Feb 7, 2011 8:32:35pm |
well night people. Have an early class tomorrow morning.
| 267 |
palomino Mon, Feb 7, 2011 8:38:38pm |
re: #239 rwmofo
During Jimmy Carter’s last year in office (1980), inflation averaged 12.5%, compared to 4.4% during Reagan’s last year in office (1988). Over those eight years, the unemployment rate declined from 7.1% to 5.5%.
GDP almost doubled from 1981 to 1989. During Reagan’s presidency, federal income tax rates were lowered significantly with the signing of the bipartisan Economic Recovery Tax Act of 1981 which lowered the top marginal tax bracket from 70% to 50% and the lowest bracket from 14% to 11%. During the Reagan Administration, federal receipts grew at an average rate of 8.2%.
One little issue. The democrat party controlled the House of Representatives during the ’80s. So with all this extra revenue coming in, couldn’t they at least try to control spending? Yeah, right. Let’s see. Reagan asks the dems to cut back on anything and the media/democrat party yells, “War on the poor! War on the children! Tax cuts for the rich!” Old reliable.
But the surpluses disappeared once Clinton left, even though we had the same Congress. You conveniently left that part out.
Oh, and fuck your constant references to the “democrat party”. Nobody here uses petty nicknames for your party. Least you could do is pretend not to be a Limbaugh clone.
| 268 |
Interesting Times Mon, Feb 7, 2011 8:39:27pm |
re: #259 palomino
They seem to have no comprehension of demographics and how their party will be impacted by demo changes. Whites will be the minority in about 30 years.
Think about these startling numbers: right now, there are about 5 white voters for each black voter and each Hispanic voter. By 2040, there will be only 3 whites for each black voter; and stunningly, only 1.5 whites for each Hispanic.
Well, that explains the horrid GOP positions on AGW and other environmental issues. They’d like to do their best to ensure that, by the time demographic changes benefit Democrats, America will no longer be worth living in.
/I wish this was only sarc…
| 269 |
palomino Mon, Feb 7, 2011 8:40:52pm |
re: #263 ggt
by 2040 there will be alot fewer people who identify as one ethnic group.
We heard that 30 years ago, but it hasn’t really materialized. Interracial marriages still only account for about 5% of the total. So I don’t think the demo trends will be affected much one way or the other.
| 270 |
Fat Bastard Vegetarian Mon, Feb 7, 2011 8:46:37pm |
re: #264 Kragar (Proud to be Kafir)
So, the answer is no?
| 271 |
Killgore Trout Mon, Feb 7, 2011 8:54:11pm |
| 272 |
prairiefire Mon, Feb 7, 2011 8:56:43pm |
Obdi ~ Are you here? I heard back from my cousin. He said he had “a well connected” Democratic contact for you in NYC. I will try to catch you tomorrow.
| 273 |
Dancing along the light of day Mon, Feb 7, 2011 9:00:24pm |
Good night all.
Be well.
Hug your sweetie, if you have one,
You never know what tomorrow might bring.
Sleep tight!
| 274 |
SanFranciscoZionist Mon, Feb 7, 2011 9:01:00pm |
re: #271 Killgore Trout
Islamification!@Jury finds New York TV executive guilty of murder for wife’s beheading
Oh yes. That would be the case that NOW reported on, after the usual suspects had done their crickets routine.
| 276 |
sizzleRI Mon, Feb 7, 2011 9:09:17pm |
re: #274 SanFranciscoZionist
Oh yes. That would be the case that NOW reported on, after the usual suspects had done their crickets routine.
That is the first I read of the story. So sad. Their poor children.
| 277 |
Lidane Mon, Feb 7, 2011 9:09:52pm |
Uh, ok. This isn’t a good sign. I’ve got two exams on Wednesday, one in Accounting and one in MIS. The class rep just sent out a mass e-mail to everyone looking for concerns about the MIS exam to bring up to the professor and to the grad school program director.
I wasn’t in class today. I’ve been ill since Saturday. Now I’m worried. Ugh.
| 278 |
SanFranciscoZionist Mon, Feb 7, 2011 9:14:02pm |
re: #276 sizzleRI
That is the first I read of the story. So sad. Their poor children.
It’s a terrible case. I’m actually surprised they found it second-degree.
| 279 |
austin_blue Mon, Feb 7, 2011 9:28:00pm |
re: #278 SanFranciscoZionist
It’s a terrible case. I’m actually surprised they found it second-degree.
Given that it was an attack without any priors, horrible as it was, the 2nd degree conviction isn’t surprising. Disappointing? Absolutely.
| 280 |
Killgore Trout Mon, Feb 7, 2011 9:28:48pm |
Happy family, one hand clap, four went
by and none came back.
Brother Judas, ash and sack, swallowed
aphrodiciac
Rufus, Silas, Jonah too sang, “We’ll blow
our own canoes,”
Poked a finger in the zoo, punctured
all the ballyhoo.
Namaste,y’all
| 281 |
austin_blue Mon, Feb 7, 2011 9:30:33pm |
| 282 |
sizzleRI Mon, Feb 7, 2011 9:32:18pm |
re: #279 austin_blue
Given that it was an attack without any priors, horrible as it was, the 2nd degree conviction isn’t surprising. Disappointing? Absolutely.
1 hour deliberation and then 2nd degree murder is pretty weird. The jury was very certain he was guilty (1 hour is nothing, they probably didn’t even get lunch) but not not enough for pre-meditation. I’m curious about the state law on the distinction between the degrees.
| 283 |
Dark_Falcon Mon, Feb 7, 2011 9:45:33pm |
re: #8 Killgore Trout
It’s nice to see this getting noticed. It’s a warning to all those wingnuts that these associations with Birchers, truthers, Alex Jones, Ron Paul, White Nationalists, etc is going to get noticed.
I can’t help but think of all those old lizards who flounced defending the Tea Party and Glenn Beck. Even they are someday going to realize that we were right and accepting these lunatics and adopting their ideas was a huge mistake. It’s only going to get worse.
Quite Concur. I’m glad Beck has gotten internal pushback on this. It’s not needed with that pushback to force Beck to tack (he won’t, but just sticking to their guns by Kristol and Lowery will send the message that Glenn Beck does not speak for all conservatives when it comes to Egypt.
| 284 |
SanFranciscoZionist Mon, Feb 7, 2011 9:51:16pm |
I am experimenting with my husband’s newly blossoming lactose intolerance.
So far:
1. Milk and ice cream are totally out.
2. We tried Lactaid. Stomachache ensued.
3. Chocolate soy milk appears to agree with his stomach, and he says it did not taste bad, per se.
| 285 |
Lidane Mon, Feb 7, 2011 9:58:45pm |
re: #284 SanFranciscoZionist
Flavored soy milk is the shiznit. I love chocolate soy milk. Tasty!
One thing worth trying might be Coconut Bliss. It’s non-dairy and gluten-free, if that’s an issue too. I’ve tried a few flavors of it just because I’m trying to cut back on high fat dairy and I like it. It’s pretty good.
| 286 |
sizzleRI Mon, Feb 7, 2011 10:01:11pm |
re: #284 SanFranciscoZionist
I love Silk chocolate soy milk. And I don’t even like cow chocolate milk, so its a high compliment.
| 287 |
SanFranciscoZionist Mon, Feb 7, 2011 10:01:25pm |
re: #285 Lidane
Flavored soy milk is the shiznit. I love chocolate soy milk. Tasty!
One thing worth trying might be Coconut Bliss. It’s non-dairy and gluten-free, if that’s an issue too. I’ve tried a few flavors of it just because I’m trying to cut back on high fat dairy and I like it. It’s pretty good.
Thanks. Will check it out. As far as I can tell, gluten is not an issue, but…we’ll see how it goes.
| 288 |
Dark_Falcon Mon, Feb 7, 2011 10:01:34pm |
Goodnight all. Sorry I wasn’t here much tonight.
| 289 |
Kronocide Mon, Feb 7, 2011 10:02:59pm |
SFZ: sorbet or sherbert.
I’m partial to haupia too, if he likes coconut.
| 290 |
SanFranciscoZionist Mon, Feb 7, 2011 10:17:31pm |
re: #289 BigPapa
SFZ: sorbet or sherbert.
I’m partial to haupia too, if he likes coconut.
He loves haupia.
| 293 |
Winny Spencer Tue, Feb 8, 2011 1:25:39am |
Chris is emphatically not a lightweight. He is the most perspicacious talk show host/pundit on cable television, IMO.
Hardball is also the only watchable show on MSNBC.
| 294 |
Lord Baron Viscount Duke Earl Count Planckton Tue, Feb 8, 2011 5:27:41am |
re: #16 rwmofo
“…getting some mainstream notice on Chris Matthews’ show,…”
I don’t think “mainstream” is really an accurate characterization of Chris Matthews. Matthews is clearly a hard-line leftist who doesn’t have much tolerance for ideas that drift toward the center.
I’m not defending Beck. I don’t watch him. But it’s probably rooted in the same type of jealousy Matthews has for Beck as Olbermann did for O’Reilly. When they’re getting shellacked in the ratings night after night, they tend to target the top dog.
…and undoubtedly Matthews is just as pissed off at Centrist and Republican voters right now as well.
Yeah, that’s why MediaMatters called him Misinformer of the Year 2005, [Link: mediamatters.org…]
That’s why he said that only whackjobs dislike Bush and that Bush belongs on the Mount Rushmore. You’re a sad lil’ wingnut, aren’t you?
| 295 |
Winny Spencer Tue, Feb 8, 2011 6:18:47am |
re: #294 Sergey Romanov
Yeah, that’s why MediaMatters called him Misinformer of the Year 2005, [Link: mediamatters.org…]
That’s why he said that only whackjobs dislike Bush and that Bush belongs on the Mount Rushmore. You’re a sad lil’ wingnut, aren’t you?
2005….
Yes, Chris is a liberal. He worked as Tip O’Neill’s top aide for God sake.
Have you ever watched Hardball? He changed his tune completely around 2007 has been trashing Bush consistently since then. The man referred to the Bush administration “finally getting caught in their criminality” after Scooter Libby was indicted.
As much as I like him, he’s in the thrall of the left-wing for sure.
| 296 |
ernie1241 Tue, Feb 8, 2011 7:48:30am |
A segment of the American conservative movement has always preferred to believe the worst about our country and our leaders. Glenn Beck appeals to that segment.
Ultimately, The Beck Syndrome [TBS], is a primal scream against what is perceived as powerful villains who should be vanquished and rendered impotent but, instead, whom control everything that matters in our country.
The TBS is not dependent upon the accuracy of individual statements which comprise its narrative — which is why even when such statements are falsified it has no effect whatsoever upon the narrative…because TBS is a mentality that can never be overcome with words, facts, or logic.
| 297 |
leftynyc Tue, Feb 8, 2011 12:52:04pm |
re: #89 rwmofo
And what did the election get for you? Other than trying to force women to be slaves to their bodies, what have the teabaggers elected done for you, as a conservative?
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