Army Birther Charged with Dereliction of Duty

Wingnuts • Views: 2,241

A lieutenant colonel in the Army has been charged with dereliction of duty and other crimes, after refusing to deploy because he believes President Obama is a sekrit Muslim alien.

Lt. Col. Terrence Lakin is charged with one specification under Article 87, missing movement, and four specifications under Article 92, three specifications of failure to obey a lawful order and one dereliction of duty.

Walter Reed Army Medical Center, where Lakin is assigned, detailed the charges brought on April 22 in a statement.

Lakin, a decorated Army flight surgeon, recently posted a YouTube video in which he said he would not deploy until Obama had released his birth certificate.

“Any reasonable person looking at the evidence in the public domain would have questions about President Obama’s claim to be a natural-born citizen,” Lakin said.

Lakin, 45, if convicted faces forfeiture of pay and benefits, reduction in rank, prison time and a dishonorable discharge.

Jump to bottom

258 comments
1 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Mon, Apr 26, 2010 9:47:29am

HOT DOG!

Deserved.

2 lawhawk  Mon, Apr 26, 2010 9:48:11am

The charges are warranted and he deserves to be prosecuted to the fullest extent of the law under the UCMJ.

Here’s hoping he gets to ponder his choice in the course of pounding big rocks into smaller rocks although I figure he’ll probably end up with a loss of rank, benefits, and a dishonorable discharge (and I figure with the way the birthers are - a nice speaking gig pushing this ongoing nonsense all the way through 2012).

3 Cannadian Club Akbar  Mon, Apr 26, 2010 9:48:39am

He will end up a poster boy for the kooks.

4 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Mon, Apr 26, 2010 9:49:51am

Look! Three righties against a wing-nut! Yay!

5 Cannadian Club Akbar  Mon, Apr 26, 2010 9:51:27am

re: #2 lawhawk

Add to your post a weekly column over at WND.

6 Lidane  Mon, Apr 26, 2010 9:52:18am

Good. Last time I checked, orders aren’t optional. Sometimes, there’s a good reason to refuse an order, like the single mom who wouldn’t deploy because it would mean abandoning her child. This guy? Not so much.

7 tradewind  Mon, Apr 26, 2010 9:52:31am

Maybe he’s going for a medical discharge.//

8 freetoken  Mon, Apr 26, 2010 9:52:35am

re: #3 Cannadian Club Akbar

re: #5 Cannadian Club Akbar

Of course WND is featuring him in stories already…

9 [deleted]  Mon, Apr 26, 2010 9:54:38am
10 Kruk  Mon, Apr 26, 2010 9:55:46am

re: #7 tradewind

Maybe he’s going for a medical discharge.//

Actually, that’s another good reason to step on this sort of thing hard. If he avoided deployment *and* any serious consequences, any would-be Corporal Klinger would take an interest in Birtherism.

11 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Mon, Apr 26, 2010 9:56:23am

re: #6 Lidane

There are a lot of reasons to dislike orders. Not to refuse them.

The single mom didn’t plan properly. Not the Armed Forces fault.

I know it’s harsh… but it is what it is.

12 drcordell  Mon, Apr 26, 2010 9:56:40am

In all seriousness, I really am wondering how exactly this is going to play out. Suppose during his court martial, he actually manages to successfully subpoena proof of Obama’s citizenship. Not sure if that could actually happen, but suppose it does. So Hawaii provides a copy, which is then officially recognized by the U.S. Military as legitimate. Where can the wingnuts possibly take it from there?

13 The Curmudgeon  Mon, Apr 26, 2010 9:58:24am

re: #12 drcordell

In all seriousness, I really am wondering how exactly this is going to play out. Suppose during his court martial, he actually manages to successfully subpoena proof of Obama’s citizenship. Not sure if that could actually happen, but suppose it does.


That’s obviously the plan. It’ll be interesting to watch it play out.

14 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Mon, Apr 26, 2010 9:58:39am

re: #12 drcordell

As long as the President can continue to make these ass-hat psychos look like ass-hat psychos, he’s going to.

The President probably googles birther related articles things at night just for the giggles.

15 Lidane  Mon, Apr 26, 2010 9:59:02am

re: #11 Fat Bastard Vegetarian

Fair enough.

I just felt more sympathetic towards her because her situation centered on a small child. This guy, OTOH, is just as ass.

16 [deleted]  Mon, Apr 26, 2010 9:59:03am
17 Mark Pennington  Mon, Apr 26, 2010 9:59:09am

re: #12 drcordell

Where can the wingnuts possibly take it from there?

They would ignore it. Nothing and I mean nothing will ever convince them.

18 drcordell  Mon, Apr 26, 2010 9:59:56am

re: #14 Fat Bastard Vegetarian

As long as the President can continue to make these ass-hat psychos look like ass-hat psychos, he’s going to.

The President probably googles birther related articles things at night just for the giggles.

I definitely agree with you on that one. I wondered for a while why the Obama administration didn’t ever quash this one more directly. But it’s clear now that they don’t mind the nutjubs making life miserable for Republicans who have to kow-tow to the birther base.

19 Aceofwhat?  Mon, Apr 26, 2010 9:59:59am

re: #4 Fat Bastard Vegetarian

Look! Three righties against a wing-nut! Yay!

make that four…

20 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Mon, Apr 26, 2010 10:00:17am

re: #15 Lidane

Proving, you can be an educated idiot.

21 Feline Fearless Leader  Mon, Apr 26, 2010 10:00:36am

re: #17 beekiller

They would ignore it. Nothing and I mean nothing will ever convince them.

Concur. All data will be interpreted so that it fits into the proper worldview. Anything that does not fit is either a lie, or otherwise not to be trusted. This is not science.

22 HoosierHoops  Mon, Apr 26, 2010 10:00:48am

re: #9 drcordell

well at least you aren’t advocating Violence….

23 [deleted]  Mon, Apr 26, 2010 10:01:00am
24 drcordell  Mon, Apr 26, 2010 10:01:34am

re: #17 beekiller

They would ignore it. Nothing and I mean nothing will ever convince them.

I suppose. It does seem that the military is the one government institution that wingnuts still trust and revere almost without hesitation. But I suppose once you’ve invested this much in “teh konspirasee” there’s no turning back.

25 tradewind  Mon, Apr 26, 2010 10:01:47am

re: #9 drcordell
I hope you are speaking figuratively.
There’s a no-advocating-violence thingy here I think…

26 Kruk  Mon, Apr 26, 2010 10:02:21am

re: #13 The Curmudgeon

That’s obviously the plan. It’ll be interesting to watch it play out.

As I understand it, the only body that can decide if the President is fit to be President (once he/she has been sworn in) is Congress. So even if this guy has sworn testimony from God (withnessed by an Archangel and one of the Founding Fathers) that Obama was born in Kenya, he doesn’t have a leg to stand on.

27 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Mon, Apr 26, 2010 10:02:46am

re: #25 tradewind

I personally do not think that saying “Hang A Traitorous Deserter” is advocating violence.

28 Mostly sane, most of the time.  Mon, Apr 26, 2010 10:02:58am

I would ask whether his commanding officer tried showing him a copy of the Certificate of Live Birth, which is freely available to everyone to see, but I think I know the answer to that.

29 drcordell  Mon, Apr 26, 2010 10:02:58am

re: #23 Aceofwhat?

really?


trea·son
   /ˈtrizən/ Show Spelled[tree-zuhn] Show IPA
–noun
1.
the offense of acting to overthrow one’s government or to harm or kill its sovereign.
2.
a violation of allegiance to one’s sovereign or to one’s state.
3.
the betrayal of a trust or confidence; breach of faith; treachery.

30 Aceofwhat?  Mon, Apr 26, 2010 10:03:06am

re: #25 tradewind

I hope you are speaking figuratively.
There’s a no-advocating-violence thingy here I think…

drcordell rarely allows propriety to get in the way of a bad post.

31 tradewind  Mon, Apr 26, 2010 10:03:10am

re: #19 Aceofwhat?
I don’t think he’s going to find any supporters here. Or almost anywhere, even among Obama’s non-fans.

32 Glenn Beck's Grand Unifying Theory of Obdicut  Mon, Apr 26, 2010 10:04:10am

re: #24 drcordell

There’s a lot of anti-military sentiment amongst the Paulian wingnuts, and of course the white supremacists don’t like it much.

33 drcordell  Mon, Apr 26, 2010 10:04:24am

re: #22 HoosierHoops

well at least you aren’t advocating Violence…

Capital punishment isn’t violence as far as I’m concerned.

34 Cato the Elder  Mon, Apr 26, 2010 10:04:41am

Hmm.

My AP history teacher in high school was Mr. Lakin.

There’s no telling about offspring, but if this is one of his, or remotely related to him, he’s spinning in his history-teachin’ grave.

35 Aceofwhat?  Mon, Apr 26, 2010 10:04:56am

re: #29 drcordell

i know what treason is. should we execute him for murder, too, as long as we’re pulling charges out of your ass? i’m in no way defending this asshat, but maybe we could just stick to the ACTUAL charges being levied?

36 tradewind  Mon, Apr 26, 2010 10:05:19am

re: #11 Fat Bastard Vegetarian
You can’t even get out of freaking jury duty for lack of a baby sitter…
without some pull. I doubt that the armed services are any different.

37 Cato the Elder  Mon, Apr 26, 2010 10:05:39am

re: #33 drcordell

Capital punishment isn’t violence as far as I’m concerned.

Unless you’re falsely convicted and your sentence is carried out before the DNA evidence comes in.

Are you absolutely mad today?

38 jamesfirecat  Mon, Apr 26, 2010 10:05:44am

re: #27 Fat Bastard Vegetarian

I personally do not think that saying “Hang A Traitorous Deserter” is advocating violence.

I’m with you on that one, it sounded more to me like he was advocating a punishment the court might hand down (a needlessly harsh punishment in my opinion) but not suggesting that we needed form up a lynching group and go to the guys house…

39 [deleted]  Mon, Apr 26, 2010 10:06:21am
40 tradewind  Mon, Apr 26, 2010 10:07:09am

re: #33 drcordell
The soldier is dead wrong, but….
If you’re going treason-hunting, maybe the first stop should be the editorial offices of the NYT, for printing locations and maneuvers of our troops in battle.
Just saying.

41 Glenn Beck's Grand Unifying Theory of Obdicut  Mon, Apr 26, 2010 10:07:13am

re: #33 drcordell

Captial punishment is violence done by the state, and often done in error, to innocents. It’s no better when it’s aimed at people you don’t like.

I think at the very least there will be a dishonorable discharge. That does have actual real effects. I do think that he deserves prison time as well, though I doubt it’ll do him much good; just increase his sense of martyrdom.

Or he’s just a coward who’d do anything to get out of deploying.

42 [deleted]  Mon, Apr 26, 2010 10:07:35am
43 The Curmudgeon  Mon, Apr 26, 2010 10:08:05am

re: #26 Kruk

As I understand it, the only body that can decide if the President is fit to be President (once he/she has been sworn in) is Congress. So even if this guy has sworn testimony from God (withnessed by an Archangel and one of the Founding Fathers) that Obama was born in Kenya, he doesn’t have a leg to stand on.

I’m not sure of that. Congress can remove a President, but if it were ever determined that he wasn’t qualified to hold the office, then … what? He was never President in the first place. No need to impeach him. There’s really no precedent for such a situation, and I doubt that will will become one.

44 [deleted]  Mon, Apr 26, 2010 10:08:14am
45 [deleted]  Mon, Apr 26, 2010 10:09:12am
46 [deleted]  Mon, Apr 26, 2010 10:09:20am
47 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Mon, Apr 26, 2010 10:09:32am

re: #30 Aceofwhat?

I just noticed the new avatar.

“I meet such innnteresting people at LGF”

48 jamesfirecat  Mon, Apr 26, 2010 10:09:32am

re: #40 tradewind

The soldier is dead wrong, but…
If you’re going treason-hunting, maybe the first stop should be the editorial offices of the NYT, for printing locations and maneuvers of our troops in battle.
Just saying.

We’d also have to stop by Fox News for that stuff they aired of Geraldo Rivera doing more or less the same thing as I recall…

49 drcordell  Mon, Apr 26, 2010 10:09:53am

re: #41 Obdicut

Captial punishment is violence done by the state, and often done in error, to innocents. It’s no better when it’s aimed at people you don’t like.

I think at the very least there will be a dishonorable discharge. That does have actual real effects. I do think that he deserves prison time as well, though I doubt it’ll do him much good; just increase his sense of martyrdom.

Or he’s just a coward who’d do anything to get out of deploying.

In this day and age I can’t discount the fact that he might be doing this purely for monetary gain. The conservative-industrial complex is one of the most lucrative business sectors to be in these days, just ask Sarah Palin. By getting himself a court martial and dishonorable discharge, he’s minted himself a book deal and speaking fees for the next 2 years, if not 6.

50 Glenn Beck's Grand Unifying Theory of Obdicut  Mon, Apr 26, 2010 10:10:01am

Whoops, sorry, Charles, feel free to delete my #46 if you want that phrase gone.

51 Aceofwhat?  Mon, Apr 26, 2010 10:10:55am

re: #44 Aceofwhat?

it would be more fun if you were skilled enough to get me worked up, but casual deprecation will have to suffice for now.

and if it was “clearly” tongue-in-cheek, we wouldn’t have needed to ask.

Apparently Monseigneur Beaumont didn’t find it to be clearly tongue-in-cheek either.

Like i said…don’t ever let me accuse you of allowing propriety to get in the way of a terrible post…

52 Glenn Beck's Grand Unifying Theory of Obdicut  Mon, Apr 26, 2010 10:11:02am

re: #49 drcordell

Conservative-industrial complex is a really stupid and awkward phrase. However:

By getting himself a court martial and dishonorable discharge, he’s minted himself a book deal and speaking fees for the next 2 years, if not 6.

Sadly, you’re probably right about that.

53 Aceofwhat?  Mon, Apr 26, 2010 10:11:38am

re: #50 Obdicut

Whoops, sorry, Charles, feel free to delete my #46 if you want that phrase gone.

Yep, i was collaterally damaged too. I should have known better…

54 Glenn Beck's Grand Unifying Theory of Obdicut  Mon, Apr 26, 2010 10:12:02am

This thread is off to a great start.

Can any ex-military person here let us know what the actual effects of a dishonorable discharge are?

55 William Barnett-Lewis  Mon, Apr 26, 2010 10:12:08am

YES!

Give that idiot a dishonorable after a decade in the stockade as an E1.

William

56 Aceofwhat?  Mon, Apr 26, 2010 10:12:26am

re: #47 Fat Bastard Vegetarian

I just noticed the new avatar.

“I meet such innnteresting people at LGF”

Thanks - just trying to represent the classics!

57 Lidane  Mon, Apr 26, 2010 10:13:11am

re: #47 Fat Bastard Vegetarian

I just noticed the new avatar.

“I meet such innnteresting people at LGF”

Ha! I hadn’t noticed that. I always liked Gossamer.

58 sagehen  Mon, Apr 26, 2010 10:13:25am

wow, 8 deleted comments before we even get to 50.

They’re starting early today.

59 tradewind  Mon, Apr 26, 2010 10:13:36am

re: #48 jamesfirecat
Jerry Rivers is an ass, but unlike the NYT, I don’t believe he would revel in endangering the safe movement of our troops.

60 drcordell  Mon, Apr 26, 2010 10:13:37am

re: #52 Obdicut

Conservative-industrial complex is a really stupid and awkward phrase. However:

Sadly, you’re probably right about that.

I think conservative-industrial complex is a perfectly apt phrase. How else would you describe the Fox News, WND, Beckian nexus that has formed over the past 8 years? These loons are minting millions upon millions of dollars feeding tripe to their rabid fanbases. I mean, look at how many books Beck, Hannity and O’Reilly have each written. They practically drop 2 a year each.

61 Aceofwhat?  Mon, Apr 26, 2010 10:13:51am

re: #57 Lidane

Ha! I hadn’t noticed that. I always liked Gossamer.

come…back…here…you…rab…bit…

62 Mad Al-Jaffee  Mon, Apr 26, 2010 10:14:16am

Wow, with all of these deleted posts, I feel like I’m watching South Park today!

63 subsailor68  Mon, Apr 26, 2010 10:14:23am

re: #54 Obdicut

This thread is off to a great start.

Can any ex-military person here let us know what the actual effects of a dishonorable discharge are?

Hi Obdicut! Here’s a Wiki article on the types of discharge and what they mean:

Military Discharges

64 tradewind  Mon, Apr 26, 2010 10:14:51am

Out like the Dems in ‘10….
later.

65 Glenn Beck's Grand Unifying Theory of Obdicut  Mon, Apr 26, 2010 10:15:34am

re: #60 drcordell

I think conservative-industrial complex is a perfectly apt phrase. How else would you describe the Fox News, WND, Beckian nexus that has formed over the past 8 years?

Not as industrial. It’s an industry. It’s not industrial.

66 Randall Gross  Mon, Apr 26, 2010 10:16:15am

I swear… lizards used to be smarter than this. That was stinky bait if I ever saw it and it just kept getting repeated… thread looks like Swiss cheese now. Paraprhrasing furthers the comment just as much as quoting does.

67 drcordell  Mon, Apr 26, 2010 10:16:27am

re: #62 Mad Al-Jaffee

Wow, with all of these deleted posts, I feel like I’m watching South Park today!

So pissed off at Viacom for that. Completely unbelievable. What I’m still wondering is what happened with the massive censorship bleeps at the end of the episode. Was everything they said bleeped by Viacom, or was that self-imposed and meant to be statement on Matt and Trey’s part?

68 sagehen  Mon, Apr 26, 2010 10:16:48am

re: #59 tradewind

Jerry Rivers is an ass, but unlike the NYT, I don’t believe he would revel in endangering the safe movement of our troops.

The army thought he’d done enough damage they plucked him out of his embedded position and shipped him back to the states. He’ll never get another press pass into any area the military controls.

69 Cato the Elder  Mon, Apr 26, 2010 10:16:50am

I’d like very much to see Dr. Cordell’s comments about an Army guy who refused to serve under Bush.

Somehow, I don’t think capital punishment would be part of the picture.

70 William Barnett-Lewis  Mon, Apr 26, 2010 10:17:02am

re: #63 subsailor68

Beat me to it. Basically if you have a dishonorable you really aren’t a citizen anymore, just a resident. And that’s what he deserves.

William

71 Aceofwhat?  Mon, Apr 26, 2010 10:17:25am

re: #66 Thanos

I swear… lizards used to be smarter than this. That was stinky bait if I ever saw it and it just kept getting repeated… thread looks like Swiss cheese now. Paraprhrasing furthers the comment just as much as quoting does.

oh, no question. i totally ate the chum on a hook. i’m an idiot.

72 Mad Al-Jaffee  Mon, Apr 26, 2010 10:17:53am

re: #67 drcordell

So pissed off at Viacom for that. Completely unbelievable. What I’m still wondering is what happened with the massive censorship bleeps at the end of the episode. Was everything they said bleeped by Viacom, or was that self-imposed and meant to be statement on Matt and Trey’s part?

That was all done by Comedy Central.

There’s a statement about it by Matt and Trey at southparkstudios.com.

73 Lidane  Mon, Apr 26, 2010 10:17:54am

re: #61 Aceofwhat?

Heh. There’s supposed to be a Looney Tunes revival on Cartoon Network. I’ll end up watching the first couple of episodes to see if I like it, but nothing will ever come close to the originals.

74 Mostly sane, most of the time.  Mon, Apr 26, 2010 10:18:01am

re: #66 Thanos

I swear… lizards used to be smarter than this. That was stinky bait if I ever saw it and it just kept getting repeated… thread looks like Swiss cheese now. Paraprhrasing furthers the comment just as much as quoting does.

Are you suggesting we ought to actually discuss this instead of throwing out verbal stink bombs?

///Hmmm. I’ll think about it.

75 abbyadams  Mon, Apr 26, 2010 10:18:04am

re: #17 beekiller

Just had this discussion over the weekend with a friend of mine who was trying to convince another friend of theirs that Obama wasn’t a sekrit commie Muslim fascist. There is nothing you can do, really. When you are trying to argue with someone who solely gets their news from Fox, WND, Beck, Hannity, et al., and is convinced that “EVERY OTHER MEDIA SOURCE IS OWNED BY SOROS AND THE LIBTARDS,” and won’t even listen to facts…

Well, what you gonna do?

76 Glenn Beck's Grand Unifying Theory of Obdicut  Mon, Apr 26, 2010 10:18:21am

re: #63 subsailor68

Thanks, Sub! From that page, though:

Commissioned officers cannot be reduced in rank by a court-martial, nor can they be given a bad conduct discharge or a dishonorable discharge. If an officer is convicted by a General Court-Martial, then that officer’s sentence can include a “dismissal.” This is considered to be the same as a dishonorable discharge. An officer convicted at court-martial, but not sentenced to a dismissal, can be dropped from the rolls, by the service Secretary. That is an administrative separation, not punitive. See Goldsmith v. Clinton, 48 M.J. 84 (C.A.A.F. 1998) [1], reversed Clinton v. Goldsmith, 526 U.S. 529, 119 S. Ct. 1538, 143 L. Ed. 2d 720,(1999)[2].


Isn’t this guy a commissioned officer?

77 Kruk  Mon, Apr 26, 2010 10:18:30am

re: #43 The Curmudgeon

I’m not sure of that. Congress can remove a President, but if it were ever determined that he wasn’t qualified to hold the office, then … what? He was never President in the first place. No need to impeach him. There’s really no precedent for such a situation, and I doubt that will will become one.

I agree, it’ll never happen. Still, I think the only authority that has the power to decide such an issue is Congress. If for no other reason than to avoid the nightmare scenario where half the country (including the military) recognises the authority of the president, and half doesn’t. It would make the Civil War look like the good old days.

78 pingjockey  Mon, Apr 26, 2010 10:18:35am

Mornin’ all. A DD can be considered a felony. You can’t own a firearm, but I don’t know if you lose your voting rights. A DD is worse than a BCD. BTW, what is up with all the deleted posts? Without getting yourselves deleted by posting said contents, what was the gist of them? Did some asshat birthers show up? Enquiring minds want to know!

79 jamesfirecat  Mon, Apr 26, 2010 10:19:08am

re: #59 tradewind

Jerry Rivers is an ass, but unlike the NYT, I don’t believe he would revel in endangering the safe movement of our troops.

Well then I guess in the words of George Bluth Sr. he only committed “a little light treason”

80 philosophus invidius  Mon, Apr 26, 2010 10:19:28am

re: #43 The Curmudgeon

I’m not sure of that. Congress can remove a President, but if it were ever determined that he wasn’t qualified to hold the office, then … what? He was never President in the first place. No need to impeach him. There’s really no precedent for such a situation, and I doubt that will will become one.

That can’t be right. The laws of the country aren’t suddenly invalidated just because the President turns out to not meet necessary qualifications. He is President until the necessary legal steps to replace him are put into effect. A citizen can’t just decide for himself when the laws are being properly implemented. That’s why we have a court system and a Supreme Court.

81 Aceofwhat?  Mon, Apr 26, 2010 10:19:35am

re: #66 Thanos

I swear… lizards used to be smarter than this. That was stinky bait if I ever saw it and it just kept getting repeated… thread looks like Swiss cheese now. Paraprhrasing furthers the comment just as much as quoting does.

heh. note, of course, that the tangential players are all kicking themselves but the progenitor is skipping merrily along with a bluebird on their shoulder…self-reflection is a precious commodity…

82 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Mon, Apr 26, 2010 10:20:24am

re: #69 Cato the Elder

Same circumstances, different President? Doesn’t change my opinion.

83 Cato the Elder  Mon, Apr 26, 2010 10:20:47am

The usual pointless car alarms (ZOMG! a car alarm just went off! better grab my shotgun and make sure no vehicle is being violated! And Annie, get yer gun and call the police!) just went off here in the neighborhood.

Time for an early-afternoon Lizard siesta, before things really get going.

84 drcordell  Mon, Apr 26, 2010 10:20:54am

re: #69 Cato the Elder

I’d like very much to see Dr. Cordell’s comments about an Army guy who refused to serve under Bush.

Somehow, I don’t think capital punishment would be part of the picture.

I had some choice words for the idiots who enlisted into the Army and then tried to cop-out of their deployments on ethical grounds as well. Doesn’t matter that you don’t like the war, you signed up for the military, tough titties.

In my mind there’s still a major difference between the two though. Objecting to deploying to Iraq because you don’t feel the war was justified is a bit different than alleging that the sitting President of the United States isn’t a valid Commander-In-Chief. If I recall the guys who didn’t want to go to Iraq were trying to claim they were conscientious objectors, not that Bush was a Kenyan Muslim.

85 pingjockey  Mon, Apr 26, 2010 10:20:57am

re: #80 philosophus invidius
That is especially true where the CinC is concerned.

86 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Mon, Apr 26, 2010 10:22:06am

re: #76 Obdicut

Dismissed!

87 Aceofwhat?  Mon, Apr 26, 2010 10:22:18am

re: #73 Lidane

Heh. There’s supposed to be a Looney Tunes revival on Cartoon Network. I’ll end up watching the first couple of episodes to see if I like it, but nothing will ever come close to the originals.

To me, Mel Blanc WAS Looney Tunes. Some people were too special to be remade.

88 subsailor68  Mon, Apr 26, 2010 10:22:26am

re: #76 Obdicut

Thanks, Sub! From that page, though:

Isn’t this guy a commissioned officer?

Great catch! Yep, he’s (IIRC) a Lt. Colonel - so that paragraph probably describes what will happen to him - but you raise an interesting question, considering the paragraph considers a dismissal the same as a dishonorable. I wonder if the prohibition on owning firearms, for example, would apply. (Have to do a little research on that one.)

89 Sol Berdinowitz  Mon, Apr 26, 2010 10:22:51am

To paraphrase the great Donald Rumsfeld: You go to war with the President you have, not the President you want.

The fellow is free to resign his commission in the Armed Forces if he is in disagreement with his C-in-C.

But he has won a small victory for Nirthers everywhere, he has kept the issue alive and in the press. They will find other poster childz to perform the same function.

90 pingjockey  Mon, Apr 26, 2010 10:22:54am

re: #84 drcordell
The COs still piss me off. We don’t have a draft, you don’t have to enlist or have the ROTC pay for your school. You do not have to join the military.

91 Cato the Elder  Mon, Apr 26, 2010 10:23:04am

re: #84 drcordell

Well, then. That explains your deleted comment.

92 Randall Gross  Mon, Apr 26, 2010 10:23:43am

What I like about this is that it will wake up some of the “I’m playing along with the birthers because it’s politically expedient” types. This will bring the issue to a head and some of the nirther simps will peel off due to that.

93 Aceofwhat?  Mon, Apr 26, 2010 10:23:54am

re: #75 abbyadams

Just had this discussion over the weekend with a friend of mine who was trying to convince another friend of theirs that Obama wasn’t a sekrit commie Muslim fascist. There is nothing you can do, really. When you are trying to argue with someone who solely gets their news from Fox, WND, Beck, Hannity, et al., and is convinced that “EVERY OTHER MEDIA SOURCE IS OWNED BY SOROS AND THE LIBTARDS,” and won’t even listen to facts…

Well, what you gonna do?

talk about sports?

(hi abby!)

94 Cato the Elder  Mon, Apr 26, 2010 10:24:15am

re: #89 ralphieboy

To paraphrase the great Donald Rumsfeld: You go to war with the President you have, not the President you want.

The fellow is free to resign his commission in the Armed Forces if he is in disagreement with his C-in-C.

But he has won a small victory for Nirthers everywhere, he has kept the issue alive and in the press. They will find other poster childz childrenz to perform the same function.

FTFY.

95 Aceofwhat?  Mon, Apr 26, 2010 10:24:21am

re: #78 pingjockey

Mornin’ all. A DD can be considered a felony. You can’t own a firearm, but I don’t know if you lose your voting rights. A DD is worse than a BCD. BTW, what is up with all the deleted posts? Without getting yourselves deleted by posting said contents, what was the gist of them? Did some asshat birthers show up? Enquiring minds want to know!

drcordell. ‘nuff said.

96 jamesfirecat  Mon, Apr 26, 2010 10:24:25am

re: #78 pingjockey

Mornin’ all. A DD can be considered a felony. You can’t own a firearm, but I don’t know if you lose your voting rights. A DD is worse than a BCD. BTW, what is up with all the deleted posts? Without getting yourselves deleted by posting said contents, what was the gist of them? Did some asshat birthers show up? Enquiring minds want to know!

Nothing so dramatic. Certain comments were made concerning the punishment of this jackass that could have ended up being taken as a call to violence so Charles deleted them.

97 pingjockey  Mon, Apr 26, 2010 10:24:54am

re: #88 subsailor68
I don’t know how the hell that works. The dismissal thing. It sounds different from what us enlisted pukes would’ve got, but maybe it’s just wordrd different. I would have to think getting a DD as a commisioned officer has got to be worse than for an E-5.

98 drcordell  Mon, Apr 26, 2010 10:25:21am

re: #90 pingjockey

The COs still piss me off. We don’t have a draft, you don’t have to enlist or have the ROTC pay for your school. You do not have to join the military.

Exactly, which is why I fully support treating them like the idiots they are. Especially considering one of the guys was in the National Guard if I recall. He didn’t mind getting paid to be a soldier, it was just the soldiering he objected to.

99 Sol Berdinowitz  Mon, Apr 26, 2010 10:25:38am

re: #94 Cato the Elder

FTFY.


I Owe you FTFY Centz

100 HoosierHoops  Mon, Apr 26, 2010 10:25:43am

re: #71 Aceofwhat?

oh, no question. i totally ate the chum on a hook. i’m an idiot.

I did to…I should not have quoted him..I think of over 23000 posts I’ve been deleted maybe 5 times… Kindof of pissed off right now..
1) Last year drcordell was 5 minutes away from losing his account..And apologized just in time…Dang it..I had a stop watch running
2) He always is over the top with his posts
3) When I found out he wasn’t a real doctor..I was relieved…I was worried there for a while..
4) If he keeps this crap up he isn’t long for this board…
5) I have never down dinged him.. I prefer this forum…

101 Mad Al-Jaffee  Mon, Apr 26, 2010 10:25:49am

re: #73 Lidane

Now I have the Looney Tunes music stuck in my head, and for that I’m grateful.

102 pingjockey  Mon, Apr 26, 2010 10:26:19am

re: #95 Aceofwhat?
Okay. It just struck me as odd. A whole boat load of deletions at the start of a fairly (IMO) non-controversial topic.

103 Glenn Beck's Grand Unifying Theory of Obdicut  Mon, Apr 26, 2010 10:26:31am

re: #88 subsailor68

So can they strip his rank through some other proceeding, or is it a moot point because he’ll be dismissed?

I’ve got to admit, the vindictive side of me likes the idea of him being busted down in rank.

104 subsailor68  Mon, Apr 26, 2010 10:26:55am

re: #97 pingjockey

I don’t know how the hell that works. The dismissal thing. It sounds different from what us enlisted pukes would’ve got, but maybe it’s just wordrd different. I would have to think getting a DD as a commisioned officer has got to be worse than for an E-5.

Hi ping! I know, I need to check that as well. It’d be interesting to see if there are any differences between an officer’s dismissal and what we’d face with a dishonorable discharge. If I find anything, I’ll link to it.

105 Lidane  Mon, Apr 26, 2010 10:26:56am

re: #87 Aceofwhat?

To me, Mel Blanc WAS Looney Tunes. Some people were too special to be remade.

I’ve been meaning to buy this for ages. I figure once I get out of the duplex I’m in and get settled in a better place, I’ll get it and hang it in my computer room/office.

106 drcordell  Mon, Apr 26, 2010 10:26:57am

re: #95 Aceofwhat?

drcordell. ‘nuff said.

Not really sure why the posts got nuked. Clearly should have included the sarc tag, but I didn’t think it was anything too off-color.

107 pingjockey  Mon, Apr 26, 2010 10:27:25am

re: #98 drcordell
Yah. We had that fool out here at FT. Lewis who decided he was a CO and managed a mistrial at his court martial.

108 Kruk  Mon, Apr 26, 2010 10:28:02am

re: #106 drcordell

Hole. Digging. Stop.

109 Aceofwhat?  Mon, Apr 26, 2010 10:28:12am

re: #100 HoosierHoops

I did to…I should not have quoted him..I think of over 23000 posts I’ve been deleted maybe 5 times… Kindof of pissed off right now..
1) Last year drcordell was 5 minutes away from losing his account..And apologized just in time…Dang it..I had a stop watch running
2) He always is over the top with his posts
3) When I found out he wasn’t a real doctor..I was relieved…I was worried there for a while..
4) If he keeps this crap up he isn’t long for this board…
5) I have never down dinged him.. I prefer this forum…

i think that sums it up quite nicely.

110 pingjockey  Mon, Apr 26, 2010 10:28:26am

re: #104 subsailor68
This is way beyond my military law experience. Had to be a witness at a court martial once and that was it.

111 drcordell  Mon, Apr 26, 2010 10:29:01am

re: #108 Kruk

Hole. Digging. Stop.

*drops shovel*

112 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Mon, Apr 26, 2010 10:29:27am

re: #87 Aceofwhat?

To me, Mel Blanc WAS Looney Tunes. Some people were too special to be remade.

Looney Tunes were a perfect storm of un-natural talent. Writers, Voice, Animation, and Direction.

113 subsailor68  Mon, Apr 26, 2010 10:29:52am

re: #103 Obdicut

So can they strip his rank through some other proceeding, or is it a moot point because he’ll be dismissed?

I’ve got to admit, the vindictive side of me likes the idea of him being busted down in rank.

LOL! Another good question! I’ve never heard of a Naval officer (my branch obviously) being reduced in rank, but I honestly don’t know if anyone has. I’ll look for that as well.

114 Feline Fearless Leader  Mon, Apr 26, 2010 10:29:56am

re: #102 pingjockey

Okay. It just struck me as odd. A whole boat load of deletions at the start of a fairly (IMO) non-controversial topic.

A post with an inappropriate statement was quoted multiple times. Mea culpa since I quoted it too in a response and thus am one of the deleted posts.

Pingjockey, I talked to my former sub-service friend. He was reactor/engine crew on the USS Will Rogers (SSBN 659) in 90-92 or so. Did at least one trip out of Holy Loch, and also did reactor watches while the boat sat in Bremerton waiting to be turned into razor blades.

115 SteveMcGazi  Mon, Apr 26, 2010 10:30:09am

Is there a mechanism for establishing the “legitimacy” of the President? I don’t remember any other President filing a birth certificate with the DOD, or anywhere else, for that matter. Basically, this guy is abandoning his comrades on the basis of a rumor.

116 Aceofwhat?  Mon, Apr 26, 2010 10:30:21am

re: #105 Lidane

I’ve been meaning to buy this for ages. I figure once I get out of the duplex I’m in and get settled in a better place, I’ll get it and hang it in my computer room/office.

Love it. There are still a lot of original cells for sale, too. We bought one for my mother for Christmas a while back…now displayed prominently in my folks’ hallway.

My aunts and uncles were raised on it, and we’ll put the classics on in the background during holidays because we still laugh harder than the kids…

117 pingjockey  Mon, Apr 26, 2010 10:30:39am

re: #112 Fat Bastard Vegetarian
No doubt. Got the 10 yr old a 4 set Looney Tunes dvd a few years ago. He asked me why they didn’t make cartoons like that anymore!

118 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Mon, Apr 26, 2010 10:31:04am

re: #101 Mad Al-Jaffee

We’re the boys of the chorus,
We hope you’ve liked our show!
We know you’re rooting for us;
But, now we have to goooo!

You. Are. Welcome.

119 jamesfirecat  Mon, Apr 26, 2010 10:31:07am

re: #116 Aceofwhat?

Love it. There are still a lot of original cells for sale, too. We bought one for my mother for Christmas a while back…now displayed prominently in my folks’ hallway.

My aunts and uncles were raised on it, and we’ll put the classics on in the background during holidays because we still laugh harder than the kids…

Welcome to my shot,
let me cut your mop,
daintily…
daintliy….

120 Mad Al-Jaffee  Mon, Apr 26, 2010 10:31:27am

re: #112 Fat Bastard Vegetarian

It’s rabbit season!

121 simoom  Mon, Apr 26, 2010 10:31:31am

re: #12 drcordell

In all seriousness, I really am wondering how exactly this is going to play out. Suppose during his court martial, he actually manages to successfully subpoena proof of Obama’s citizenship. Not sure if that could actually happen, but suppose it does. So Hawaii provides a copy, which is then officially recognized by the U.S. Military as legitimate. Where can the wingnuts possibly take it from there?

Some of the RW blog interest in this case seems to extend well beyond the birth certificate with fantasies of trial discovery allowing for trolling through reams of private and presidential documents (which many seem to believe will expose all sorts of embarrassing facts and criminality that the President has barely kept from sight :P).

Fox’s article from a few days back on Lt. Col Lakin came at it from that angle — the chances of a discovery fishing expedition — and they seemed to pour cold water on the idea:

… legal experts say he apparently made his decision to proceed to a court-martial without the advice of experienced counsel.

One military attorney said Lakin had advice from a lawyer, Paul Rolf Jensen, but that Jensen had “only three months’ experience in military law as a clerk in the 1980s” and was not an expert in military law. Jensen did not return a phone call seeking comment, but military experts called Lakin’s effort a tragedy and waste.

“He is likely to lose everything and accomplish nothing,” one attorney lamented. “No military judge will say that (obtaining documents) of the president is necessary to prove the charges,” said Philip D. Cave, a Washington attorney and director of the National Institute of Military Justice.

Cave said that the validity of Lakin’s orders, under military law, does not depend on the president but on the chain of command. “He will be convicted and is in jeopardy of dismissal,” he said.

Dismissal, for a military officer, is the same as a dishonorable discharge for an enlisted servicemember.

“We all feel saddened,” said David Price, a former captain and 25-year veteran of the Navy Judge Advocate General’s office, now in private practice.

“He was issued an order to deploy and didn’t. End of issue,” he said. He said the military has dealt with these types of cases since Vietnam, when soldiers tried to make larger political issues the basis of their trials, and is experienced at keeping the proceedings free of politics.

Price also said that if the case does finally get to a general court-martial and a judge is asked to approve discovery requests by the defense, it is unlikely that it would be allowed to encompass the presidency. He said this wasn’t because of a conspiracy, but because the case is relatively simple and doesn’t require it.

Gary Myers, a former military lawyer who now heads a Washington firm specializing in military law, says he “just shook my head” when he heard about the case “I think [Lakin] is out of his mind” for thinking he could challenge the president this way, he said.

122 Feline Fearless Leader  Mon, Apr 26, 2010 10:31:39am

You’re next. You’re so next…

123 philosophus invidius  Mon, Apr 26, 2010 10:31:49am

Suppose a historian discovers that that LBJ was actually born in Mexico. Does that mean that I can stop paying my taxes since all the laws he signed are instantaneously invalid?

Suppose that some of the senators who voted for the Iraq war turn out not to be have been qualified for their seats. Does that mean that soldiers in Iraq can can now just leave their units and come home?

124 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Mon, Apr 26, 2010 10:32:06am

re: #120 Mad Al-Jaffee

It’s rabbit season!

DUCK SEASON!

125 pingjockey  Mon, Apr 26, 2010 10:32:14am

re: #114 oaktree
Aha, that explains it. Never was on subs. Chased roosian subs, took a couple of tours through a couple of our boats, that’s it.

126 drcordell  Mon, Apr 26, 2010 10:32:24am

re: #115 stevemcg

Is there a mechanism for establishing the “legitimacy” of the President? I don’t remember any other President filing a birth certificate with the DOD, or anywhere else, for that matter. Basically, this guy is abandoning his comrades on the basis of a rumor.

The issue has never really come up, with the recent exception of John McCain. Congress went through the trouble of explicitly certifying that children born overseas to parents who were U.S. servicemembers are “natural born citizens” to alleviate any potential challenges to a McCain Presidency. Seems that it’s one of those issues that’s self-resolving. Anyone who isn’t natural born wouldn’t win the election.

127 pingjockey  Mon, Apr 26, 2010 10:32:42am

re: #120 Mad Al-Jaffee
Wabbit!

128 Lidane  Mon, Apr 26, 2010 10:32:59am

re: #112 Fat Bastard Vegetarian

Looney Tunes were a perfect storm of un-natural talent. Writers, Voice, Animation, and Direction.

Including Dr. Seuss. He wrote some of the Private Snafu cartoons during WW2.

129 abbyadams  Mon, Apr 26, 2010 10:33:14am

re: #93 Aceofwhat?

Back atcha, Ace! :-)

Depends, hockey or hoops? Hockey I’m good on - hoops, not so much.

130 Kragar  Mon, Apr 26, 2010 10:33:20am

Willing to bet Lt Col Dumbass had a secondary rank of Major Asshole

131 Aceofwhat?  Mon, Apr 26, 2010 10:33:30am

re: #124 Fat Bastard Vegetarian

DUCK SEASON!

would you like to shoot him now or shoot him later?

132 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Mon, Apr 26, 2010 10:33:41am

re: #127 pingjockey

(For the purposes of that particular episode; Elmer didn’t say that! It was Bugs!)

133 Feline Fearless Leader  Mon, Apr 26, 2010 10:34:18am

uh-oh. Pronoun trouble is sure to occur shortly…

134 HoosierHoops  Mon, Apr 26, 2010 10:34:25am

re: #114 oaktree

A post with an inappropriate statement was quoted multiple times. Mea culpa since I quoted it too in a response and thus am one of the deleted posts.

Pingjockey, I talked to my former sub-service friend. He was reactor/engine crew on the USS Will Rogers (SSBN 659) in 90-92 or so. Did at least one trip out of Holy Loch, and also did reactor watches while the boat sat in Bremerton waiting to be turned into razor blades.

I wished we had not shut down our Nuclear sub base in Scotland..Never understood that…

135 Aceofwhat?  Mon, Apr 26, 2010 10:34:26am

re: #129 abbyadams

Back atcha, Ace! :-)

Depends, hockey or hoops? Hockey I’m good on - hoops, not so much.

I like the Blackhawks, but Hassa should have been thrown out for that hit.

136 pingjockey  Mon, Apr 26, 2010 10:34:29am

re: #132 Fat Bastard Vegetarian
Okay!

137 jamesfirecat  Mon, Apr 26, 2010 10:34:34am

re: #128 Lidane

Including Dr. Seuss. He wrote some of the Private Snafu cartoons during WW2.

One of my favorite Dr. Seuss comics…

Image: seuss2.jpg

138 Mad Al-Jaffee  Mon, Apr 26, 2010 10:34:42am

re: #124 Fat Bastard Vegetarian

DUCK SEASON!

It’s duck season!

139 subsailor68  Mon, Apr 26, 2010 10:34:58am

For Obdicut and pingjockey:

Oops! It appears that officers can be reduced in rank - although it is known as “reverting”. I forgot about these three as examples:

Admiral Husband E. Kimmel (1882 – 1968) was reverted to rear admiral upon retirement due to his role in the Attack on Pearl Harbor.
Admiral Richard C. Macke was reverted to rear admiral and forced into early retirement due to his statements about the 1995 Okinawan rape incident.
Brigadier general Janis Karpinski was reverted to colonel due to her role in the Abu Ghraib torture and prisoner abuse.

140 drcordell  Mon, Apr 26, 2010 10:35:20am

re: #121 simoom

This makes me even more suspicious that this guy is simply looking to make a quick buck selling himself to the teabagger minions. How can someone who is ostensibly so educated not realize that his course of action has absolutely no chance at succeeding?

141 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Mon, Apr 26, 2010 10:35:29am

re: #138 Mad Al-Jaffee

It’s duck season!

Rabbit season!

142 MrSilverDragon  Mon, Apr 26, 2010 10:35:43am

re: #124 Fat Bastard Vegetarian

DUCK SEASON!

“Consequences Schmonsequences, as long as I’m rich.”

followed closely by

“I’m rich! I’m a happy miser!”

They don’t make cartoons like they used to. Heck, I’m still disappointed that they took out all smoking references from “Tom and Jerry” cartoons.

143 Virginia Plain  Mon, Apr 26, 2010 10:35:53am

Duck season

144 mikeyes  Mon, Apr 26, 2010 10:35:59am

“Can any ex-military person here let us know what the actual effects of a dishonorable discharge are?”

In the first place I don’t think that officers are subject to a DD but if he serves time, he will be subject to the same penalties that a felon gets. For example, many states will not issue a license to practice medicine to a felon and felons cannot own a firearm. Here is a similar case in which Yolanda Huet-Vaughn, MD was cited by the KS state board of medical examiners (I want to point out that she was in my reserve unit and I opposed taking her license away.)

BTW, there is not way that the Article 32 officer will allow the birther defense as it is not germane to the charges even if true. This has been tried in several other military cases. Evidentally getting a lawyer whose expertise is in animal law and medical malpractice is not the best way to fight these charges.

145 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Mon, Apr 26, 2010 10:35:59am

re: #140 drcordell

He’ll tell you when he’s on the speaker’s tour with Sarah Palin.

146 Mad Al-Jaffee  Mon, Apr 26, 2010 10:36:22am

re: #137 jamesfirecat

Quick, Henry, The Flit!Your text to link…

147 Kruk  Mon, Apr 26, 2010 10:36:41am

re: #123 philosophus invidius

Suppose that some of the senators who voted for the Iraq war turn out not to be have been qualified for their seats. Does that mean that soldiers in Iraq can can now just leave their units and come home?

And would they face war crimes trials on their return, since the war was never legal? This would open up such a can of worms.

Seriously, people. He won. Get over it. (Something I also said to people who whined about GWB.)

148 pingjockey  Mon, Apr 26, 2010 10:37:01am

re: #121 simoom
Correct. The fool is bypassing his chain of command. His CO, his COs CO, etc..all the way up to the Sec. Defense is his immediate chain of command, not the Pres. The CinC is at the apex, but he disobeyed lawful orders from further down the chain. The man is a fool.

149 avanti  Mon, Apr 26, 2010 10:37:02am

More good news, the US will sell some Citibank stock at a large profit to repay some of the Bush/Obama tarp.

Tarp.

Assume the worst for the GOP and we keep making money on the loans and GM goes public and we make money on our share of the company. Maybe the stock market keeps going up, Obama’s approval keeps slowly climbing back and there are no tax increases in the near future. How will that party of doom and gloom reply ?

150 jamesfirecat  Mon, Apr 26, 2010 10:37:03am

re: #142 MrSilverDragon

“Consequences Schmonsequences, as long as I’m rich.”

followed closely by

“I’m rich! I’m a happy miser!”

They don’t make cartoons like they used to. Heck, I’m still disappointed that they took out all smoking references from “Tom and Jerry” cartoons.

I may be a craven coward… BUT I’M A GREEDY CRAVEN COWARD!

151 Aceofwhat?  Mon, Apr 26, 2010 10:37:06am

re: #143 Virginia Plain

Duck season

you’rrre despicable;)

152 darthstar  Mon, Apr 26, 2010 10:37:27am

My only problem with this is that he gets to work at Walter Reed while this process takes place, instead of someplace like 29 Palms where it’ll be over 100 degrees outside in a couple of weeks. Put him someplace where the fucks at Fox won’t have as much access to him…and where he can be as miserable as possible.

153 pingjockey  Mon, Apr 26, 2010 10:37:33am

re: #139 subsailor68
Nice research!

154 abbyadams  Mon, Apr 26, 2010 10:38:32am

Okay, I am so enjoying the Looney Tunes, but I GTG. Work and all.

Happy afternoon Lizards!

155 Aceofwhat?  Mon, Apr 26, 2010 10:38:47am

re: #149 avanti

More good news, the US will sell some Citibank stock at a large profit to repay some of the Bush/Obama tarp.

Tarp.

Assume the worst for the GOP and we keep making money on the loans and GM goes public and we make money on our share of the company. Maybe the stock market keeps going up, Obama’s approval keeps slowly climbing back and there are no tax increases in the near future. How will that party of doom and gloom reply ?

hopefully, by praising the part of the stimulus that worked and canceling the majority of what remains to be spent!

156 HoosierHoops  Mon, Apr 26, 2010 10:38:59am

re: #152 darthstar

My only problem with this is that he gets to work at Walter Reed while this process takes place, instead of someplace like 29 Palms where it’ll be over 100 degrees outside in a couple of weeks. Put him someplace where the fucks at Fox won’t have as much access to him…and where he can be as miserable as possible.

Cough!
The Marines don’t allow the Army to visit 29 Palms…That’s Devil dog ground

157 lostlakehiker  Mon, Apr 26, 2010 10:39:15am

re: #6 Lidane

Good. Last time I checked, orders aren’t optional. Sometimes, there’s a good reason to refuse an order, like the single mom who wouldn’t deploy because it would mean abandoning her child. This guy? Not so much.

Even that’s not a “good reason”. It’s a reason to wish you hadn’t sworn an oath that is binding unto death, to obey all lawful orders etc.

You might request a dishonorable discharge with loss of rank, and undertake to repay the wages you took during training, so that you can tend to your child. But if the Army finds itself in the desperate position that it cannot grant this request [normally it would], it just has to have you in the line, then you don’t really have the right to quit just when you’re most needed. Your son won’t die if you leave him in another’s care. But your fellow soldiers, if you leave them in the lurch, that’s another story.

158 SteveMcGazi  Mon, Apr 26, 2010 10:39:26am

Duck Season, FIRE!!!

159 darthstar  Mon, Apr 26, 2010 10:39:48am

re: #156 HoosierHoops

Cough!
The Marines don’t allow the Army to visit 29 Palms…That’s Devil dog ground

I’m sure they’d make him feel quite welcome for dissing their CiC.

160 philosophus invidius  Mon, Apr 26, 2010 10:40:18am

re: #147 Kruk

And would they face war crimes trials on their return, since the war was never legal? This would open up such a can of worms.

Seriously, people. He won. Get over it. (Something I also said to people who whined about GWB.)

Yes. Suppose you think GWB “stole” the election. That doesn’t mean people can just do whatever they want or, in particular, disobey military orders if they are soldiers.

161 Lidane  Mon, Apr 26, 2010 10:41:02am

“Would it be too much to ask if we could make up our minds?”

Youtube Video
162 pingjockey  Mon, Apr 26, 2010 10:41:35am

re: #157 lostlakehiker
Back in the early 80s, the Navy quit giving general discharges to women who’d got pregnant while single. We were losing folks who’d had a ton of money and training invested in them.

163 Locker  Mon, Apr 26, 2010 10:41:45am

This pussy was just scared to deploy and used this bullshit as an excuse. Go and serve you nutless wonder.

164 lawhawk  Mon, Apr 26, 2010 10:41:47am

re: #149 avanti

So wait a moment. Bush authorized the TARP (and for the record, I opposed TARP for reasons that are well worn here). So, Bush made the nation money by pushing for TARP now that Citi is repaying now?

As for the tax issue, unless Congress acts this year - the tax rates are going to rise starting next year as the 2001 and 2003 tax acts expire (reverting the rates to those in effect before 2001 act took effect - a significant tax hike across the board). That doesn’t address the AMT fix needed or the need to raise taxes further to fund HCR going forward, particularly if the costs prove to be far higher than anticipated (which is inevitable).

165 HoosierHoops  Mon, Apr 26, 2010 10:42:10am

re: #159 darthstar

I’m sure they’d make him feel quite welcome for dissing their CiC.

When Jordan was there training we were all pissed off.. They have no Cell service! Dang Marines!
*wink*

166 Mad Al-Jaffee  Mon, Apr 26, 2010 10:44:07am

Getting back to Looney Tunes (and I don’t mean birthers) I’m kind of disappointed that there hasn’t been a Roger Rabbit sequel.

167 Cato the Elder  Mon, Apr 26, 2010 10:45:11am

Speaking of the mentally challenged, look what the Borgmocrazy has just figured out:

“Greek Thought: “Socrates, Plato, and Aristotle laid the foundation of Western intellectual thought.”

My God, all the Texas textbooks shall have to be rewritten!

Snork, Rodan, Speranza, WrathOfG-D: Apply to me for suggestions! My nick is blue.

168 jamesfirecat  Mon, Apr 26, 2010 10:46:44am

re: #166 Mad Al-Jaffee

Getting back to Looney Tunes (and I don’t mean birthers) I’m kind of disappointed that there hasn’t been a Roger Rabbit sequel.

Dude it’s coming, its coming.

en.wikipedia.org

169 SanFranciscoZionist  Mon, Apr 26, 2010 10:47:24am

This guy is forty-five years old and had enough intelligence and integrity to become a Lt. Col.

What is WRONG with these people?

170 avanti  Mon, Apr 26, 2010 10:47:57am

re: #164 lawhawk

So wait a moment. Bush authorized the TARP (and for the record, I opposed TARP for reasons that are well worn here). So, Bush made the nation money by pushing for TARP now that Citi is repaying now?

As for the tax issue, unless Congress acts this year - the tax rates are going to rise starting next year as the 2001 and 2003 tax acts expire (reverting the rates to those in effect before 2001 act took effect - a significant tax hike across the board). That doesn’t address the AMT fix needed or the need to raise taxes further to fund HCR going forward, particularly if the costs prove to be far higher than anticipated (which is inevitable).

I gave Bush credit for the TARP, but the right is attacking anyone that supported it regardless of party. As to the possible tax rate change, it will only hit the highest brackets if it’s allowed to expire.
The HCR costs will not be in play until 2012 at the earliness . I’m talking near term, who knows what will happen 10-20 years out.

171 subsailor68  Mon, Apr 26, 2010 10:48:32am

re: #167 Cato the Elder

Speaking of the mentally challenged, look what the Borgmocrazy has just figured out:

“Greek Thought: “Socrates, Plato, and Aristotle laid the foundation of Western intellectual thought.”

My God, all the Texas textbooks shall have to be rewritten!

Snork, Rodan, Speranza, WrathOfG-D: Apply to me for suggestions! My nick is blue.

LOL!

How can you look at the Texas legislature and still believe in intelligent design?
Kinky Friedman

172 pingjockey  Mon, Apr 26, 2010 10:48:52am

re: #169 SanFranciscoZionist
Just my opinion, I don’t think he wanted to deploy and this was a “good” excuse. What an ass.

173 Randall Gross  Mon, Apr 26, 2010 10:48:58am

re: #169 SanFranciscoZionist

This guy is forty-five years old and had enough intelligence and integrity to become a Lt. Col.

What is WRONG with these people?

In the military promotions for Medical personnel come quickly, same reason the Ft. Hood shooter was a Major, it’s the only way they can hang on the skills they need for awhile.

174 Sol Berdinowitz  Mon, Apr 26, 2010 10:48:59am

re: #169 SanFranciscoZionist

This guy is forty-five years old and had enough intelligence and integrity to become a Lt. Col.

What is WRONG with these people?

Let us just supose that he figured out that he could make a great deal of money on the speaker’s circuit if he pulled off a stunt like this: Tea partiers all over America will be paying money to hear him get up and confirm their paranoid delusions.

175 Mark Pennington  Mon, Apr 26, 2010 10:50:27am

Throwing away a very nice retirement with health insurance for life, over bullshit. Maybe this was just his plan to avoid the deathpanel when he retired.

176 pingjockey  Mon, Apr 26, 2010 10:50:38am

BBIAB

177 Kruk  Mon, Apr 26, 2010 10:50:53am

re: #169 SanFranciscoZionist

This guy is forty-five years old and had enough intelligence and integrity to become a Lt. Col.

What is WRONG with these people?

A small, but not insignificant portion of the population lost their collective marbles when a Black guy became president.

178 Glenn Beck's Grand Unifying Theory of Obdicut  Mon, Apr 26, 2010 10:51:22am

re: #167 Cato the Elder

Also, why no love for Heraclitus, Pythagoras, Democritus, Diogenes, Archimedes, Leucippus, Zeno, etc. etc.?

Socrates, Plato, and Aristotle are very important; but so are the others.

179 Feline Fearless Leader  Mon, Apr 26, 2010 10:52:56am

Elmer Fudd: Zillions and twillions of wabbits! Where are they all coming from?

Bugs Bunny: [at an adding machine] From me, Doc. I’m multiplying, see? I’m multiplying!

180 Cato the Elder  Mon, Apr 26, 2010 10:53:35am

Poem before siesta time.

Mad women
And mad men
Either fall silent or take up the pen.

If the former
All is hale,
Except for the cousins who have to make bail.

If the latter
The damage is done.
No word can unmake mad talk but a pun.

Copyright © 2010 Cato the Elder

181 celticdragon  Mon, Apr 26, 2010 10:53:42am

re: #11 Fat Bastard Vegetarian

There are a lot of reasons to dislike orders. Not to refuse them.

The single mom didn’t plan properly. Not the Armed Forces fault.

I know it’s harsh… but it is what it is.

As I recall, she had no options and no other family to leave the child with. Back in the 90’s, there was furious criticism of one army mother who left her son with complete strangers under a contract while she deployed overseas (the usual “what kind of a mother is she??” stuff).

Our cultural expectations of motherhood do not always work well with military needs…and the Army is still the servant of the people.

If the Army just had to have her over there and her chain of command could verify that there was practicable option for placing the child elsewhere, then they should be able to allow a hardship based exception for her to take the kid. It isn’t like there is no historical precedent for it…

182 Spare O'Lake  Mon, Apr 26, 2010 10:54:28am

re: #169 SanFranciscoZionist

This guy is forty-five years old and had enough intelligence and integrity to become a Lt. Col.

What is WRONG with these people?

Either he is a racist or he honestly doubts that Obama was born in the USA and thinks that somehow gives him the right to disobey orders. I’m not sure which is worse.

183 lawhawk  Mon, Apr 26, 2010 10:55:40am

re: #170 avanti

Like I said, unless Congress acts - all the rates increase, not just the high income brackets. It would realign the tax brackets from the following (using single filer as guide):
10% (to $8,375 in 2010); 15%; 25%; 28%; 33% and 35%

to the following:
15% (to $26,250); 28%; 31%; 36%; and 39.6%.

That’s the state of the law in place today, and what would happen if there’s no action by Congress. Now, we can expect some kind of adjustment by Congress because allowing the Bush cuts to lapse would mean a significant tax hike for most Americans. What it will look like is anyone’s guess.

184 HoosierHoops  Mon, Apr 26, 2010 10:55:46am

re: #167 Cato the Elder

Speaking of the mentally challenged, look what the Borgmocrazy has just figured out:

“Greek Thought: “Socrates, Plato, and Aristotle laid the foundation of Western intellectual thought.”

My God, all the Texas textbooks shall have to be rewritten!

Snork, Rodan, Speranza, WrathOfG-D: Apply to me for suggestions! My nick is blue.

Why are you dragging them over here? Esp. WrathofG-d.. Poor guy got his email spammed and sent out Vigra ads to Charles and I.. He sent a note out to us apologizing and showed real grace in an embarrassing moment.
Let’s not drag that blog over here

185 MrSilverDragon  Mon, Apr 26, 2010 10:55:56am

re: #168 jamesfirecat

Dude it’s coming, its coming.

[Link: en.wikipedia.org…]

It’s going to be hard to capture the feel of the original movie, but I’d be willing to see it if it ever gets made.

186 Varek Raith  Mon, Apr 26, 2010 10:56:55am

re: #168 jamesfirecat

Dude it’s coming, its coming.

[Link: en.wikipedia.org…]

Before or after Duke Nukem Forever comes out???
;)

187 Cato the Elder  Mon, Apr 26, 2010 10:56:57am

re: #184 HoosierHoops

Oh, but my dear friend, sometimes mockery is the irresistible force!

188 MrSilverDragon  Mon, Apr 26, 2010 10:58:05am

re: #186 Varek Raith

Before or after Duke Nukem Forever comes out???
;)

They’re going to be released on the same day, I’m sure. Probably around… never.

189 jamesfirecat  Mon, Apr 26, 2010 10:58:05am

re: #185 MrSilverDragon

It’s going to be hard to capture the feel of the original movie, but I’d be willing to see it if it ever gets made.

That’s sort of the eternal question is it better that it gets made even if its horrible given that there is a chance it could be could, or should we just let sleeping franchise’s lay?

190 Kruk  Mon, Apr 26, 2010 10:58:43am

Going to log now, all. Cya all later.

191 ExCamelJockey  Mon, Apr 26, 2010 10:58:57am

This officer should be dealt with the same way as any other officer who refuses to honor his commitment to deploy with his troops. He should be court martialed … and then Obama’s Justice department should step in and ask the court to drop the charges. This precedent was set with Ehren Watada, the first officer to refuse to be deployed to Iraq. He was going through a lengthy court battle but all charges were dropped by the Justice department shortly after Obama’s new Solicitor General Kagan took over.

Watada publicly denounced President Bush and claimed that the war was illegal. Deja vu eh?

192 Varek Raith  Mon, Apr 26, 2010 10:59:46am

re: #188 MrSilverDragon

They’re going to be released on the same day, I’m sure. Probably around… never.

With Elite IV the day after!
:)

193 MrSilverDragon  Mon, Apr 26, 2010 11:00:12am

re: #189 jamesfirecat

That’s sort of the eternal question is it better that it gets made even if its horrible given that there is a chance it could be could, or should we just let sleeping franchise’s lay?

If there’s ever any proof for that, it would be “Fritz the Cat”.

Sometimes just one film is enough.

194 Randall Gross  Mon, Apr 26, 2010 11:00:51am

re: #191 ExCamelJockey

Thanks for bringing that up… the Watada courts martial is different in the reason for declaring the orders Illegal, but it is a precedent of sorts.

195 Lidane  Mon, Apr 26, 2010 11:01:06am

re: #182 Spare O’Lake

Either he is a racist or he honestly doubts that Obama was born in the USA and thinks that somehow gives him the right to disobey orders. I’m not sure which is worse.

IMO, the second one is worse. There are racists everywhere, including the military. A guy objecting to the President being black would be pathetic, but not that bad in the overall scheme of things.

Someone who believes the President is a dirty foreigner, and that means that he can disobey orders at will because of it? That person would be a risk to others, I think. What if he’d been deployed to Iraq or Afghanistan and had decided to disobey or refuse all his orders until his birther delusions were answered?

196 Mad Al-Jaffee  Mon, Apr 26, 2010 11:01:09am

re: #186 Varek Raith

Before or after Duke Nukem Forever comes out???
;)

And the Arrested Development movie.

197 celticdragon  Mon, Apr 26, 2010 11:01:13am

re: #157 lostlakehiker

Even that’s not a “good reason”. It’s a reason to wish you hadn’t sworn an oath that is binding unto death, to obey all lawful orders etc.

You might request a dishonorable discharge with loss of rank, and undertake to repay the wages you took during training, so that you can tend to your child. But if the Army finds itself in the desperate position that it cannot grant this request [normally it would], it just has to have you in the line, then you don’t really have the right to quit just when you’re most needed. Your son won’t die if you leave him in another’s care. But your fellow soldiers, if you leave them in the lurch, that’s another story.

A dishonorable discharge?? What the frak? Do you know that a dishonorable discharge is a federal felony conviction?? What the hell are you doing conflating the normal human activity of childbirth with felonious behavior??

I knew single mothers in the army and they were generally good soldiers. Attitudes like yours deserve something along the lines of “Fuck off!”.

Of course, male soldiers get to party on after notching the bed post.

Your son won’t die if you leave him in another’s care.

Are you a parent? Do you have any fucking clue what it is like to abdicate your most important role you will ever play and leave that to another person?

I am actually dumbfounded with the preposterous, smug and patronizing bullshit you just shoveled.

198 Glenn Beck's Grand Unifying Theory of Obdicut  Mon, Apr 26, 2010 11:02:14am

re: #191 ExCamelJockey

Funny how you leave out how the case had already progressed:

Watada’s February 2007 court-martial ended in a mistrial when he argued that his orders were unlawful, because Military Judge John Head ruled that the question can not be resolved within the military justice system, saying Watada’s argument was thus reduced to an admission of guilt. A second court-martial was scheduled but was stayed in October 2007 by U.S. District Judge Benjamin Settle, who issued an order stating that Watada’s “double jeopardy claim is meritorious” and no evidence that it lacks merit was presented.[4] The Army challenged the injunction, and Judge Settle ruled on October 21, 2008, that Watada cannot be retried on three of the five counts, but abstained from deciding whether the remaining two charges of conduct unbecoming an officer may go forward.[5]

199 MrSilverDragon  Mon, Apr 26, 2010 11:02:20am

re: #196 Mad Al-Jaffee

And the Arrested Development movie.

Now that I would love to see. There was a show that was too intelligent for its time, with an amazing cast and incredible writing. Fox dropped the ball on that one big time, in my opinion.

200 Aceofwhat?  Mon, Apr 26, 2010 11:02:34am

re: #186 Varek Raith

Before or after Duke Nukem Forever comes out???
;)

Nuke ‘em ‘till they glow, then shoot ‘em in the dark!

201 Mad Al-Jaffee  Mon, Apr 26, 2010 11:03:10am

re: #199 MrSilverDragon

Now that I would love to see. There was a show that was too intelligent for its time, with an amazing cast and incredible writing. Fox dropped the ball on that one big time, in my opinion.

They made a huge mistake.

202 SanFranciscoZionist  Mon, Apr 26, 2010 11:03:29am

re: #11 Fat Bastard Vegetarian

There are a lot of reasons to dislike orders. Not to refuse them.

The single mom didn’t plan properly. Not the Armed Forces fault.

I know it’s harsh… but it is what it is.

I don’t think it’s completely insane to expect that the army would have something in place to help out a soldier in that situation.

203 darthstar  Mon, Apr 26, 2010 11:03:50am

re: #183 lawhawk

Like I said, unless Congress acts - all the rates increase, not just the high income brackets. It would realign the tax brackets from the following (using single filer as guide):
10% (to $8,375 in 2010); 15%; 25%; 28%; 33% and 35%

to the following:
15% (to $26,250); 28%; 31%; 36%; and 39.6%.

That’s the state of the law in place today, and what would happen if there’s no action by Congress. Now, we can expect some kind of adjustment by Congress because allowing the Bush cuts to lapse would mean a significant tax hike for most Americans. What it will look like is anyone’s guess.

That works for me. Yeah…it’ll suck (a little) to pay an extra 3-5% in Federal Taxes, but hey, I get to live in the United States of America.

204 freetoken  Mon, Apr 26, 2010 11:05:03am

Breaking: SEC Porn Story is Several Months Old

It was one of the biggest stories of last week, an irresistible metaphor-made-real. While Wall Street was having its way with the US economy, employees of the Securities and Exchange Commission were literally playing with themselves. What wasn’t widely reported, though, was that the story was several months old, and was revived by opponents of financial reform, who thought it would be an effective counter to news of the SEC’s fraud complaint against Goldman Sachs.

Gov’t employees doing anything that isn’t totally on the up-and-up is pretty standard fare; any political interest group ought to keep a story in their back pocket for just the right moment, no?

205 Kragar  Mon, Apr 26, 2010 11:05:28am

re: #199 MrSilverDragon

Now that I would love to see. There was a show that was too intelligent for its time, with an amazing cast and incredible writing. Fox dropped the ball on that one big time, in my opinion.

Just because it fits here, and rags on Fox’s programming skills, I will quote Family Guy.

Peter Griffin: [after “Family Guy” returns to Fox with new episodes, after a few years off the air] Everybody, I got bad news. We’ve been canceled.
Lois Griffin: Oh, no! Peter, how could they do that?
Peter Griffin: Well, unfortunately, Lois, there’s just no more room on the schedule. We’ve just got to accept the fact that Fox has to make room for terrific shows, like “Dark Angel”, “Titus”, “Undeclared”, “Action”, “That ’80s Show”, “Wonder Falls”, “Fastlane”, “Andy Richter Controls the Universe”, “Skin”, “Girls Club”, “Cracking Up”, “The Pitts”, “Firefly”, “Get Real”, “Freaky Links”, “Wanda at Large”, “Costello”, “The Lone Gunmen”, “A Minute with Stan Hooper”, “Normal, Ohio”, “Pasadena”, “Harsh Realm”, “Keen Eddie”, “The Street”, “American Embassy”, “Cedric the Entertainer”, “The Tick”, “Louie”, and “Greg the Bunny”.
Lois Griffin: Is there no hope?
Peter Griffin: Well, I suppose if all those shows go down the tubes, we might have a shot.

206 Locker  Mon, Apr 26, 2010 11:05:44am

re: #179 oaktree

Elmer Fudd: Zillions and twillions of wabbits! Where are they all coming from?

Bugs Bunny: [at an adding machine] From me, Doc. I’m multiplying, see? I’m multiplying!

Bugs Bunny as Elmer: My name is Elmer J Fudd, Millionare. I own a mansion and a yacht.
Elmer J Fudd as Bugs Bunny: I might be a screwy rabbit but I’m not going to Alcatraz!

207 SanFranciscoZionist  Mon, Apr 26, 2010 11:05:59am

re: #28 EmmmieG

I would ask whether his commanding officer tried showing him a copy of the Certificate of Live Birth, which is freely available to everyone to see, but I think I know the answer to that.

I just think that his commanding officer probably has more pressing things to do with his or her time than Google copies of the president’s birth certificate for this idiot.

A crossword puzzle, for instance, I would consider more pressing.

208 sergeant major  Mon, Apr 26, 2010 11:06:38am

re: #6 Lidane

There is never a good time to disobey an order “unless” it’s immoral. As a single parent you are required to have a Family Care Plan in place if you do not then you get Chaptered it’s that simple. This LTC. is an absolute idiot and the Army is better off with out him!!!!!!

209 Varek Raith  Mon, Apr 26, 2010 11:06:42am

re: #205 Kragar (Proud to be Kafir)

Firefly was good. Stupid Fox.
:(

210 Aceofwhat?  Mon, Apr 26, 2010 11:07:37am

re: #209 Varek Raith

Firefly was good. Stupid Fox.
:(

So was the Tick…

211 jamesfirecat  Mon, Apr 26, 2010 11:07:49am

re: #196 Mad Al-Jaffee

And the Arrested Development movie.

But Ron Jeremy told Maybe Bluth it would make a great movie himself!

212 Varek Raith  Mon, Apr 26, 2010 11:08:09am

re: #210 Aceofwhat?

So was the Tick…

Aye.

213 MrSilverDragon  Mon, Apr 26, 2010 11:09:07am

re: #205 Kragar (Proud to be Kafir)

I really liked “Titus”, “Greg the Bunny”, “Firefly”, and “The Tick”. The rest of them, well, I can’t fault Fox for canceling them.

At least we got “Serenity” out of the “Firefly” cancellation. That, and “Dr. Horrible’s Sing-along Blog”, which I thoroughly enjoyed for the sheer ridiculousness of it.

214 Glenn Beck's Grand Unifying Theory of Obdicut  Mon, Apr 26, 2010 11:09:31am

re: #210 Aceofwhat?

Even horses?

215 Lidane  Mon, Apr 26, 2010 11:10:11am

re: #208 sergeant major

I’m not in the military. Never have been. I’m just looking at things from the outside. I know that’s probably not the right filter for these things, but it’s the only one I have.

I just know I felt more sympathy for the single mom than I do for the birther. That’s all.

216 jamesfirecat  Mon, Apr 26, 2010 11:10:25am

re: #213 MrSilverDragon

I really liked “Titus”, “Greg the Bunny”, “Firefly”, and “The Tick”. The rest of them, well, I can’t fault Fox for canceling them.

At least we got “Serenity” out of the “Firefly” cancellation. That, and “Dr. Horrible’s Sing-along Blog”, which I thoroughly enjoyed for the sheer ridiculousness of it.

And without Doctor Horrible’s Sing-Along Blog we probably wouldn’t have had the musical episode of Batman Brave and the Bold…..


Batman, always batman,
Always driving villains bats!

217 celticdragon  Mon, Apr 26, 2010 11:10:45am

re: #208 sergeant major

There is never a good time to disobey an order “unless” it’s immoral. As a single parent you are required to have a Family Care Plan in place if you do not then you get Chaptered it’s that simple. This LTC. is an absolute idiot and the Army is better off with out him!!!

True, although we all know of times when the family care plan fell through for whatever reason and deployments still had to be made. Society expects different things from moms with kids then dads with kids…and it is usually the moms with the kids. Chaptering out can often take a year or more.

And yes, this LTC is an embarrassment to the Army and a disgrace to his uniform. I would make a point of refusing to salute him were I still in.

218 Eclectic Infidel  Mon, Apr 26, 2010 11:11:00am

re: #187 Cato the Elder

Oh, but my dear friend, sometimes mockery is the irresistible force!

Ridicule may be lawfully employed where reason has no chance of success.

219 Kragar  Mon, Apr 26, 2010 11:11:12am

re: #213 MrSilverDragon

I really liked “Titus”, “Greg the Bunny”, “Firefly”, and “The Tick”. The rest of them, well, I can’t fault Fox for canceling them.

At least we got “Serenity” out of the “Firefly” cancellation. That, and “Dr. Horrible’s Sing-along Blog”, which I thoroughly enjoyed for the sheer ridiculousness of it.

I liked the Andy Richter show

220 Aceofwhat?  Mon, Apr 26, 2010 11:11:44am

re: #214 Obdicut

Even horses?

Spooon!

221 Kragar  Mon, Apr 26, 2010 11:12:17am

re: #220 Aceofwhat?

Spooon!

Look! Its Batmanuel!

222 Locker  Mon, Apr 26, 2010 11:12:31am

re: #210 Aceofwhat?

So was the Tick…

Especially him.

You’ll never prove a thing, copper, I’m just a part time electrician. I’m… I’m… BAD IS GOOD, BABY! DOWN WITH GOVERNMENT!

223 Aceofwhat?  Mon, Apr 26, 2010 11:12:57am

re: #215 Lidane

I’m not in the military. Never have been. I’m just looking at things from the outside. I know that’s probably not the right filter for these things, but it’s the only one I have.

I just know I felt more sympathy for the single mom than I do for the birther. That’s all.

likewise. one is an unfortunate situation. the other is an asshat. very, very different IMHO.

224 MrSilverDragon  Mon, Apr 26, 2010 11:13:53am

re: #219 Kragar (Proud to be Kafir)

I liked the Andy Richter show

I tried, because I like Andy Richter, but I just couldn’t get into it. I loved his vocal stylings as the wide-eyed lemur in “Madagascar”.

225 SanFranciscoZionist  Mon, Apr 26, 2010 11:14:11am

re: #167 Cato the Elder

Speaking of the mentally challenged, look what the Borgmocrazy has just figured out:

“Greek Thought: “Socrates, Plato, and Aristotle laid the foundation of Western intellectual thought.”

My God, all the Texas textbooks shall have to be rewritten!

Snork, Rodan, Speranza, WrathOfG-D: Apply to me for suggestions! My nick is blue.

Wait, they just figured this out, or they’re objecting to it?

226 Aceofwhat?  Mon, Apr 26, 2010 11:14:15am

re: #222 Locker


“And, isn’t sanity really just a one-trick pony anyway? I mean all you get is one trick, rational thinking, but when you’re good and crazy, oooh, oooh, oooh, the sky is the limit.”

227 ryannon  Mon, Apr 26, 2010 11:14:30am

re: #101 Mad Al-Jaffee

Now I have the Looney Tunes music stuck in my head, and for that I’m grateful.

That’s All Folks!

228 celticdragon  Mon, Apr 26, 2010 11:14:48am

Gotta run in a moment, fellow scaly ones.

Today’s highlight in paleontology lab: My powerpoint on

Correlations and Causation of the End Permian, End Triassic and K-T Boundary mass Extinctions.

Free pizza and caffeinated beverages also, which should help keep my classmates awake…!

229 Aceofwhat?  Mon, Apr 26, 2010 11:15:54am

re: #228 celticdragon

Gotta run in a moment, fellow scaly ones.

Today’s highlight in paleontology lab: My powerpoint on

Correlations and Causation of the End Permian, End Triassic and K-T Boundary mass Extinctions.

Free pizza and caffeinated beverages also, which should help keep my classmates awake…!

that’s just good clean fun right there!

230 subsailor68  Mon, Apr 26, 2010 11:17:31am

re: #228 celticdragon

Gotta run in a moment, fellow scaly ones.

Today’s highlight in paleontology lab: My powerpoint on

Correlations and Causation of the End Permian, End Triassic and K-T Boundary mass Extinctions.

Free pizza and caffeinated beverages also, which should help keep my classmates awake…!

You intellectual you! Typical long-ass title! How about something like:

Dead Dinosaurs and How They Got That Way

(Just kidding. Good luck and knock ‘em dead. And good call on the free pizza too!)

;-)

231 celticdragon  Mon, Apr 26, 2010 11:19:02am

One of my actual lines from the powerpoint:


“Nine out of ten scientists with white lab coats agree that big rocks falling from space are probably bad for you neighborhood!”

232 celticdragon  Mon, Apr 26, 2010 11:19:28am

your neighborhood, actually. meh!

233 Sergeant Major  Mon, Apr 26, 2010 11:19:34am

re: #217 celticdragon

OT: your last sentence reminds me of the story of the brand new 2 Lt. who’s walking down the street and a Sergeant Major walks by him and doesn’t salute the 2 Lt, not because he was being disrespectful but because he was engaged in the 10,000 things Sergeants Majors are engaged in and the Lt. stops the Sergeant Major and asks; Sergeant Major don’t you know how to salute? which the sergeant Major replied with “Yes sir I do but I don’t have time to teach you right now”…

234 celticdragon  Mon, Apr 26, 2010 11:20:04am

re: #233 Sergeant Major

OT: your last sentence reminds me of the story of the brand new 2 Lt. who’s walking down the street and a Sergeant Major walks by him and doesn’t salute the 2 Lt, not because he was being disrespectful but because he was engaged in the 10,000 things Sergeants Majors are engaged in and the Lt. stops the Sergeant Major and asks; Sergeant Major don’t you know how to salute? which the sergeant Major replied with “Yes sir I do but I don’t have time to teach you right now”…

LMAO!!! heh!

235 subsailor68  Mon, Apr 26, 2010 11:21:24am

re: #233 Sergeant Major

OT: your last sentence reminds me of the story of the brand new 2 Lt. who’s walking down the street and a Sergeant Major walks by him and doesn’t salute the 2 Lt, not because he was being disrespectful but because he was engaged in the 10,000 things Sergeants Majors are engaged in and the Lt. stops the Sergeant Major and asks; Sergeant Major don’t you know how to salute? which the sergeant Major replied with “Yes sir I do but I don’t have time to teach you right now”…

Love it! It does remind me of Sam Elliott in “We Were Soldiers”!

236 freetoken  Mon, Apr 26, 2010 11:22:22am

re: #228 celticdragon

Gotta run in a moment, fellow scaly ones.

Today’s highlight in paleontology lab: My powerpoint on

Correlations and Causation of the End Permian, End Triassic and K-T Boundary mass Extinctions.

Free pizza and caffeinated beverages also, which should help keep my classmates awake…!

Speaking of which, the AGW-denial-o-sphere (e.g, Telegraph, NRO) are beating the drums about global warming causing cooling causing the dinos to perish, based on a totally idiotic interpretation of this paper and comments by the researchers on related work:
Valanginian isotope variation in glendonites and belemnites from Arctic Svalbard: Transient glacial temperatures during the Cretaceous greenhouse

237 celticdragon  Mon, Apr 26, 2010 11:23:24am

re: #236 freetoken

Speaking of which, the AGW-denial-o-sphere (e.g, Telegraph, NRO) are beating the drums about global warming causing cooling causing the dinos to perish, based on a totally idiotic interpretation of this paper and comments by the researchers on related work:
Valanginian isotope variation in glendonites and belemnites from Arctic Svalbard: Transient glacial temperatures during the Cretaceous greenhouse

You have got to be kidding.

Face/palm!

238 celticdragon  Mon, Apr 26, 2010 11:23:39am

Chat later…

239 webevintage  Mon, Apr 26, 2010 11:25:17am

re: #49 drcordell

In this day and age I can’t discount the fact that he might be doing this purely for monetary gain. The conservative-industrial complex is one of the most lucrative business sectors to be in these days, just ask Sarah Palin. By getting himself a court martial and dishonorable discharge, he’s minted himself a book deal and speaking fees for the next 2 years, if not 6.

Yep.
This dude is gonna join the wack-o gray train and probably live off of it for the next few years.
Depends though…I thought Carrie Prejen was gonna ride for life, but then those videos came out.

240 Tiny alien kittens are watching you  Mon, Apr 26, 2010 11:27:12am

re: #164 lawhawk

Well don’t count your chickens yet, sure a lot of the loans have been repaid, with interest, so far we have made a profit. But AIG still has over $180 billion outstanding and some of the other loans are also non-performing to date. All it is going to take is a couple of defaults (or an AIG default) to wipe out any profits made to date and put us back into the hole.

241 webevintage  Mon, Apr 26, 2010 11:29:46am

re: #204 freetoken

Breaking: SEC Porn Story is Several Months Old

Gov’t employees doing anything that isn’t totally on the up-and-up is pretty standard fare; any political interest group ought to keep a story in their back pocket for just the right moment, no?

I love this part:
This story didn’t just happen to drift by at the opportune moment. That memo was requested, and released, by Senator Chuck Grassley (R-IA). While initial reports on this story mention that Grassley requested the memo, it’s only as an afterthought, and none of them mention the prior reporting on this story. What, did Grassley have some kind of Spidey-sense that told him to take a shot in the darkthat there might be some perverts working at the SEC?

And of course the story actually was reported in 2008 by Propublica.

242 Tiny alien kittens are watching you  Mon, Apr 26, 2010 11:34:11am

re: #241 webevintage

I love this part:
This story didn’t just happen to drift by at the opportune moment. That memo was requested, and released, by Senator Chuck Grassley (R-IA). While initial reports on this story mention that Grassley requested the memo, it’s only as an afterthought, and none of them mention the prior reporting on this story. What, did Grassley have some kind of Spidey-sense that told him to take a shot in the darkthat there might be some perverts working at the SEC?

And of course the story actually was reported in 2008 by Propublica.

And in Oct. of 2009, and in Feb. of this year, only no one really paid any attention then. Now that it is being pushed as a “Obama wants more regulation but our regulators are an inattentitive bunch of porn addicts” meme, it has gained some traction finally.

243 bklynkid  Mon, Apr 26, 2010 12:41:45pm

I’m not contesting that OB is a citizen but he is not a “NATURAL BORN CITIZEN”. All you brainy guys do some research and learn how Natural Born” is defined, Then check if OB meets the definition.

244 jamesfirecat  Mon, Apr 26, 2010 12:43:07pm

re: #243 bklynkid

I’m not contesting that OB is a citizen but he is not a “NATURAL BORN CITIZEN”. All you brainy guys do some research and learn how Natural Born” is defined, Then check if OB meets the definition.

Why don’t you explain it to us poor simple brain dead guys? I’m banging my head against the keybaord to type this up so research may be a bit above my mental facilities….

245 Glenn Beck's Grand Unifying Theory of Obdicut  Mon, Apr 26, 2010 12:43:11pm

re: #243 bklynkid

He was born a US citizen. So, he was a natural-born US citizen.

I do not understand why you guys are so eager for President Biden. Is he better just because he’s white, or what?

246 jamesfirecat  Mon, Apr 26, 2010 12:48:23pm

re: #245 Obdicut

He was born a US citizen. So, he was a natural-born US citizen.

I do not understand why you guys are so eager for President Biden. Is he better just because he’s white, or what?

Don’t forget Vice President Nancy Pelosi….

247 Slumbering Behemoth Stinks  Mon, Apr 26, 2010 12:54:17pm

re: #246 jamesfirecat

Don’t forget Vice President Nancy Pelosi…

That’s not necessarily a given. Should Biden become President, it would be up to him to appoint someone to the VP seat. Could be Reid, could be Pelosi, could be anyone under the sun.

248 HappyWarrior  Mon, Apr 26, 2010 1:10:58pm

Another nut desperate for attention.

249 Slumbering Behemoth Stinks  Mon, Apr 26, 2010 1:11:45pm

re: #243 bklynkid

I agree with Mr. Firecat. Why don’t you give us your definition of “NATURAL BORN CITIZEN” and illustrate for us how our current POTUS fails to meet the requirement(s).

250 Jack Burton  Mon, Apr 26, 2010 1:37:27pm

re: #243 bklynkid

Go away douche-nozzle. This crap of yours is so old and worn out we cant even fertilize a lawn with it.

251 Jack Burton  Mon, Apr 26, 2010 1:39:37pm

re: #245 Obdicut

He was born a US citizen. So, he was a natural-born US citizen.

I do not understand why you guys are so eager for President Biden. Is he better just because he’s white, or what?

I’m positive they aren’t thinking that far in advance. Like all the damn people who were pushing for the impeachment of Clinton. The whole time I though, why are they so determined to make Gore president?

252 celticdragon  Mon, Apr 26, 2010 2:37:48pm

re: #243 bklynkid

I’m not contesting that OB is a citizen but he is not a “NATURAL BORN CITIZEN”. All you brainy guys do some research and learn how Natural Born” is defined, Then check if OB meets the definition.

Another one of the Class (less) of 2004 suddenly surfacing.

253 SpikeEvans  Mon, Apr 26, 2010 5:28:48pm

I really don’t understand this entire ‘Birther’ BS. It’s really just so totally pointless.

254 ClaudeMonet  Tue, Apr 27, 2010 12:20:44am

re: #29 drcordell

trea·son
   /ˈtrizən/ Show Spelled[tree-zuhn] Show IPA
–noun
1.
the offense of acting to overthrow one’s government or to harm or kill its sovereign.
2.
a violation of allegiance to one’s sovereign or to one’s state.
3.
the betrayal of a trust or confidence; breach of faith; treachery.

My understanding is that treason in American jurisprudence (and possibly in federal law) consists only of active armed combat against American forces, witnessed by reputable persons.

255 mikeyes  Tue, Apr 27, 2010 5:08:10am

Section 3.
Treason against the United States, shall consist only in levying war against them, or in adhering to their enemies, giving them aid and comfort. No person shall be convicted of treason unless on the testimony of two witnesses to the same overt act, or on confession in open court.

The Congress shall have power to declare the punishment of treason, but no attainder of treason shall work corruption of blood, or forfeiture except during the life of the person attainted.

256 advocatusdiaboli  Tue, Apr 27, 2010 11:32:02am

re: #25 tradewind

I hope you are speaking figuratively.
There’s a no-advocating-violence thingy here I think…

Quash does mean violence at all, judges quash motions in court—it means forcefully not physically. Definition: to suppress or extinguish summarily and completely. Nothing about violence in there. If you don’t know a word, look up its’s meaning instead of guessing and posting innuendo about another poster. It reflects badly on all of us.

257 advocatusdiaboli  Tue, Apr 27, 2010 11:37:02am

re: #243 bklynkid

I’m not contesting that OB is a citizen but he is not a “NATURAL BORN CITIZEN”. All you brainy guys do some research and learn how Natural Born” is defined, Then check if OB meets the definition.

Okay, I’ll se you bet and raise you because I have a straight-flush Aces high. Obama meets the criterion (from Wkikpedia):

The Oxford English Dictionary defines “natural born” as “[h]aving a specified position or character by birth.” 7 OXFORD ENGLISH DICTIONARY 38 (1961) so in English the phrase refers to anyone who is a citizen from birth. There is no record of a debate on the requirements to meet the “natural born Citizen” qualification during the Constitutional Convention. This clause was introduced by the drafting Committee of Eleven, and then adopted without discussion by the Convention as a whole. One possible source of the clause can be traced to Alexander Hamilton, a delegate to the Convention. On June 18, 1787, Hamilton submitted to the Convention a sketch of a plan of government. Article IX, section 1 of Hamilton’s plan provided:
No person shall be eligible to the office of President of the United States unless he be now a Citizen of one of the States, or hereafter be born a Citizen of the United States.”

258 advocatusdiaboli  Tue, Apr 27, 2010 11:40:51am

re: #253 SpikeEvans

I really don’t understand this entire ‘Birther’ BS. It’s really just so totally pointless.

My take on the phenomenon is that when uneducated, ignorant, and superstitious people are frightened, they develop myths to make themselves feel more secure from what frightens them. History is full of such mythologies. This is just a modern one we can watch being born before the evidence is history and lost and it’s harder to de-bunk.


This article has been archived.
Comments are closed.

Jump to top

Create a PageThis is the LGF Pages posting bookmarklet. To use it, drag this button to your browser's bookmark bar, and title it 'LGF Pages' (or whatever you like). Then browse to a site you want to post, select some text on the page to use for a quote, click the bookmarklet, and the Pages posting window will appear with the title, text, and any embedded video or audio files already filled in, ready to go.
Or... you can just click this button to open the Pages posting window right away.
Last updated: 2023-04-04 11:11 am PDT LGF User's Guide RSS Feeds

Help support Little Green Footballs!

Subscribe now for ad-free access!Register and sign in to a free LGF account before subscribing, and your ad-free access will be automatically enabled.

Donate with
PayPal Cash.app
Recent PagesClick to refresh
The Pandemic Cost 7 Million Lives, but Talks to Prevent a Repeat Stall In late 2021, as the world reeled from the arrival of the highly contagious omicron variant of the coronavirus, representatives of almost 200 countries met - some online, some in-person in Geneva - hoping to forestall a future worldwide ...
Cheechako
6 days ago
Views: 162 • Comments: 0 • Rating: 1
Texas County at Center of Border Fight Is Overwhelmed by Migrant Deaths EAGLE PASS, Tex. - The undertaker lighted a cigarette and held it between his latex-gloved fingers as he stood over the bloated body bag lying in the bed of his battered pickup truck. The woman had been fished out ...
Cheechako
2 weeks ago
Views: 327 • Comments: 0 • Rating: 1