2010: Year of the Craven Candidates

Politics • Views: 4,968

Jonathan Martin at Politico has a piece on the weird behavior of many candidates (mostly Republicans) in this election — who seem to believe it’s a winning strategy to hide from the press and the public.

It’s mostly, but not entirely, a Republican phenomenon. In some cases, a tea-party-oriented candidate has made a plain calculation that�a one-day, process story about an absence from the campaign trail or a refusal to debate is less damaging than the captured-on-tape gaffe the candidate could make when facing reporters.

As of Friday, Colorado Republican Senate hopeful Ken Buck had gone nine consecutive days without holding a public event and acknowledged to The Denver Post that he’s more mindful now that he’s constantly being recorded by the ubiquitous ‘trackers’ being used by both sides. (With the fundraising quarter now done, however, he’s planning a more robust schedule for October.)�

Tea party darlings Rand Paul of Kentucky and Christine O’Donnell of Delaware both surged to primary victories thanks, in part, to national media exposure, but after their own comments got them into trouble, they abruptly canceled post-primary Sunday show appearances and have largely avoided doing non-Fox national TV.

The cynicism of this ploy is remarkable; they know that if their extreme views were challenged by the media and the public, they’d stand a good chance of losing the support of the vast middle. So they just hide, and count on the voters’ ignorance to get them elected.

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294 comments
1 WaveriderCA  Tue, Oct 5, 2010 10:12:10am

Voter's ignorance seems to be a bipartisan tactic these days. Toss in some 1000 page legislative bills that get rammed through or just hide all the candidates from the truth. It's really funny isn't it how it's the information age yet things seem more opaque than ever.

2 Kragar  Tue, Oct 5, 2010 10:13:43am

re: #1 WaveriderCA

Voter's ignorance seems to be a bipartisan tactic these days. Toss in some 1000 page legislative bills that get rammed through or just hide all the candidates from the truth. It's really funny isn't it how it's the information age yet things seem more opaque than ever.

The information age means its even easier to throw up a smokescreen of bullshit which the average person quickly decides is too much to deal with.

3 recusancy  Tue, Oct 5, 2010 10:16:04am

re: #1 WaveriderCA

Voter's ignorance seems to be a bipartisan tactic these days. Toss in some 1000 page legislative bills that get rammed through or just hide all the candidates from the truth. It's really funny isn't it how it's the information age yet things seem more opaque than ever.

Gets rammed through? Do you guys really just read verbatim from the talking points. At least get out a thesaurus.

4 WaveriderCA  Tue, Oct 5, 2010 10:20:44am
Gets rammed through? Do you guys really just read verbatim from the talking points. At least get out a thesaurus.

Who cares it'll happen when the repubs get some clear running room too. Theres going to be shit sandwiches for the public to eat. This time the little toothpick flags holding the pieces of bread together will have an elephant and not a donkey.

5 BishopX  Tue, Oct 5, 2010 10:22:02am

re: #3 recusancy

No that's the thesaurus version!

The talking point version is "000 page legislative bills that get rammed down our throats"
/

6 BishopX  Tue, Oct 5, 2010 10:23:02am

re: #5 BishopX

No that's the thesaurus version!

The talking point version is "1000 page legislative bills that get rammed down our throats"
/

PIMF

7 recusancy  Tue, Oct 5, 2010 10:23:15am

re: #4 WaveriderCA

Who cares it'll happen when the repubs get some clear running room too. Theres going to be shit sandwiches for the public to eat. This time the little toothpick flags holding the pieces of bread together will have an elephant and not a donkey.

The health care bill was not a shit sandwhich. It was debated on for a year. It's already helping many people in significant ways and it is paid for.

8 recusancy  Tue, Oct 5, 2010 10:25:02am

re: #4 WaveriderCA

Who cares it'll happen when the repubs get some clear running room too. Theres going to be shit sandwiches for the public to eat. This time the little toothpick flags holding the pieces of bread together will have an elephant and not a donkey.

Or perhaps you didn't like the stimulus bill. You and Herbert Hoover both.

9 garhighway  Tue, Oct 5, 2010 10:26:13am

re: #8 recusancy

Or perhaps you didn't like the stimulus bill. You and Herbert Hoover both.

He's against ramming in general.

He's a non-rammer.

10 Walter L. Newton  Tue, Oct 5, 2010 10:26:16am

Interesting... Ken Buck (mentioned in the article above) is currently on KOA radio for a hour debate... Michael Bennett, his Democrat opponent is not at the debate... he refused to show up.

Who's hiding?

11 sattv4u2  Tue, Oct 5, 2010 10:27:43am

re: #10 Walter L. Newton


get you glasses taken care of?

12 McSpiff  Tue, Oct 5, 2010 10:28:08am

re: #10 Walter L. Newton

Interesting... Ken Buck (mentioned in the article above) is currently on KOA radio for a hour debate... Michael Bennett, his Democrat opponent is not at the debate... he refused to show up.

Who's hiding?

Any info on the station or moderator? Any particular bias there?

13 Walter L. Newton  Tue, Oct 5, 2010 10:28:40am

re: #11 sattv4u2

get you glasses taken care of?

Yes... no... doctor says there was nothing wrong with prescription... but it will take two weeks to order the right lenses... figure that out... I can't.

14 sattv4u2  Tue, Oct 5, 2010 10:29:30am

re: #3 recusancy

Gets rammed through? Do you guys really just read verbatim from the talking points. At least get out a thesaurus.

C'mon

You know those have been extinct for 6,00 years

Them, an T Rex,, and Stegosaurus ,, and ,,,

15 Charles Johnson  Tue, Oct 5, 2010 10:29:39am

re: #12 McSpiff

Any info on the station or moderator? Any particular bias there?

KOA is an extreme right wing radio station. Ken Buck will not be challenged there, he'll be celebrated.

16 Fozzie Bear  Tue, Oct 5, 2010 10:30:15am

re: #13 Walter L. Newton

Yes... no... doctor says there was nothing wrong with prescription... but it will take two weeks to order the right lenses... figure that out... I can't.

Thats... odd. "Everything is just as it should be so lets get them replaced!"

17 sattv4u2  Tue, Oct 5, 2010 10:30:26am

re: #13 Walter L. Newton

Yes... no... doctor says there was nothing wrong with prescription... but it will take two weeks to order the right lenses... figure that out... I can't.

I used to date a girl whose father was a lens crafter. Used to go to his shop and watch

Interesting work

18 Charles Johnson  Tue, Oct 5, 2010 10:31:03am

re: #10 Walter L. Newton

Interesting... Ken Buck (mentioned in the article above) is currently on KOA radio for a hour debate... Michael Bennett, his Democrat opponent is not at the debate... he refused to show up.

Who's hiding?

I know it's very important to you to pretend the Democrats are every bit as bad as the Republicans in every respect, but this running away phenomenon is overwhelmingly happening on the right wing. Thats just a simple fact.

19 McSpiff  Tue, Oct 5, 2010 10:31:30am

re: #15 Charles

KOA is an extreme right wing radio station. Ken Buck will not be challenged there, he'll be celebrated.

Thanks, I think that somewhat explains the situation... Why play a rigged game?

20 Walter L. Newton  Tue, Oct 5, 2010 10:31:55am

re: #12 McSpiff

Any info on the station or moderator? Any particular bias there?

Station KOA, moderator, Mike Rosen, almost every politician of every party shows up on Mike Rosen's show, he's had the same morning show for over 20 years, the Mayor of Denver (democrat) comes on the show once a month, the Governor of Colorado (democrat) comes on once a month, everybody wants voice time on KOA, it's a 50 thousand watt station, Rosen is conservative... and he is fair.

21 WaveriderCA  Tue, Oct 5, 2010 10:32:02am

Why would I like the stimulus bill? Why would I like the government just spending money and just doing so inefficiently? Big companies do bad business and then they get money from everyone in the US. Why do enjoy having people in government at all that just print money to people.

22 recusancy  Tue, Oct 5, 2010 10:32:32am

re: #10 Walter L. Newton

Interesting... Ken Buck (mentioned in the article above) is currently on KOA radio for a hour debate... Michael Bennett, his Democrat opponent is not at the debate... he refused to show up.

Who's hiding?

Isn't KOA basically Fox News radio?

23 wrenchwench  Tue, Oct 5, 2010 10:33:00am

I thought the article was going to leave out Brewer of AZ, but she's there at the end. Her opponent tweeted this:

Jan Brewer said "let’s put pen to pencil." We’ll make sure we have did that!

...so I guess she gaffed again.

24 Walter L. Newton  Tue, Oct 5, 2010 10:33:22am

re: #18 Charles

I know it's very important to you to pretend the Democrats are every bit as bad as the Republicans in every respect, but this running away phenomenon is overwhelmingly happening on the right wing. Thats just a simple fact.

And it's a simple fact that Bennett is not at the debate this morning.

25 Brother Holy Cruise Missile of Mild Acceptance  Tue, Oct 5, 2010 10:33:32am

re: #21 WaveriderCA

funny the stimulus bill has worked quite well, TARP has been paid off and was passed and setup by the Bush admin (how soon you forget). These talking points are tiresome, time for the right to find new ones.

26 McSpiff  Tue, Oct 5, 2010 10:33:34am

re: #13 Walter L. Newton

Yes... no... doctor says there was nothing wrong with prescription... but it will take two weeks to order the right lenses... figure that out... I can't.

Walter, I'll be emailing you shortly. Short preview... I've been sitting in a cubicle looking cute. I'm sure you can guess who's been paying me.

27 Walter L. Newton  Tue, Oct 5, 2010 10:33:47am

re: #22 recusancy

Isn't KOA basically Fox News radio?

No.

28 McSpiff  Tue, Oct 5, 2010 10:34:39am

re: #27 Walter L. Newton

No.

Is there a live stream or anything we can tune into?

29 Fozzie Bear  Tue, Oct 5, 2010 10:34:47am

re: #24 Walter L. Newton

And it's a simple fact that Bennett is not at the debate this morning.

Did he say he would, or was he just invited to do so and declined?

30 Walter L. Newton  Tue, Oct 5, 2010 10:35:41am

re: #29 Fozzie Bear

Did he say he would, or was he just invited to do so and declined?

He was invited, declined.

31 Charles Johnson  Tue, Oct 5, 2010 10:36:05am

KOA host Mike Rosen is a frequent substitute for Rush Limbaugh.

32 Walter L. Newton  Tue, Oct 5, 2010 10:36:10am

re: #28 McSpiff

Is there a live stream or anything we can tune into?

[Link: www.850koa.com...]

33 Walter L. Newton  Tue, Oct 5, 2010 10:36:23am

re: #31 Charles

KOA host Mike Rosen is a frequent substitute for Rush Limbaugh.

Really?

34 Fozzie Bear  Tue, Oct 5, 2010 10:37:28am

[Link: www.denverpost.com...]

lol nevermind. Rosen is a wingnut. I wouldn't go on his show either.

35 Walter L. Newton  Tue, Oct 5, 2010 10:38:12am

re: #31 Charles

KOA host Mike Rosen is a frequent substitute for Rush Limbaugh.

When has Mike Rosen substituted for Rush?

36 Killgore Trout  Tue, Oct 5, 2010 10:39:25am

KAO is a far right radio station. It took a 30 second google to figure that out.

37 Walter L. Newton  Tue, Oct 5, 2010 10:39:45am

re: #36 Killgore Trout

KAO is a far right radio station. It took a 30 second google to figure that out.

KOA

38 McSpiff  Tue, Oct 5, 2010 10:39:59am

re: #34 Fozzie Bear

[Link: www.denverpost.com...]

lol nevermind. Rosen is a wingnut. I wouldn't go on his show either.

Yeah, I don't think I'd trust someone who says things like this to moderate fairly:

Even though I'm a partisan Republican, I don't care for ads that go overboard in demonizing Democrats, who are bad enough if you simply tell the truth. But I'm especially irritated by ads during a GOP primary campaign that unfairly attack fellow Republicans.

Read more: Rosen: Honor the 11th commandment - The Denver Post [Link: www.denverpost.com...]

Not exactly high-brow stuff.

39 Charles Johnson  Tue, Oct 5, 2010 10:40:14am

Correction: "frequent" may not be the right word; I don't listen to Rush enough to know how frequently he subs for Rush. But he's done it several times.

40 Walter L. Newton  Tue, Oct 5, 2010 10:40:45am

re: #39 Charles

Correction: "frequent" may not be the right word; I don't listen to Rush enough to know how frequently he subs for Rush. But he's done it several times.

He's never substituted for Rush, not once.

41 lawhawk  Tue, Oct 5, 2010 10:41:03am

re: #25 Dreggas

The portion of the TARP that dealt with the banks has worked, and may turn a profit. However, the portions that were allocated to homeowner assistance (HAMP) and the automakers has turned out to be a loser.

TARP stabilized the credit markets when they were teetering on the brink - and that portion may cost less than previously anticipated.

Bailing out the banks was necessary, but not liked (including by myself). I was wrong on that count.

However, the bailouts for individuals with HAMP and the automakers was throwing good money after bad and the government will take a loss on those. Moreover, the money allocated for those purposes did not stop the bankruptcies of GM or Chrysler, and homeowner delinquencies and foreclosures continue to run above historical averages.

The NYT had a lengthy article on the subject earlier this week.

TARP was promoted by President Bush and Obama and McCain were both consulted on the program with none other than Geithner and Paulson leading the way. Geithner is now Obama's Treasury Secretary.

So it would stand to reason that President Bush should get credit for saving the economy with TARP.

The stimulus package was separate from TARP. Stimulus (ARRA of 2009) was passed Feb 2009, 4 months before the end of the recession as noted by the NBER, which sets the start and end dates of recessions.

42 Gus  Tue, Oct 5, 2010 10:41:14am

Heh. Well what do you know. Looks like Michael Bennet had already made plans for today:

Bennet continues outreach to female voters

DENVER—Democratic Sen. Michael Bennet is promoting his work for female voters as he tries to fend off a challenge from a Republican who opposes abortion rights.

Bennet is meeting with several prominent Democratic women on Tuesday. Bennet is trying to defend his seat against Republican Ken Buck, who opposes abortion, even in cases of rape and incest. Bennet says he plans to propose new efforts to protect women from domestic violence and pay discrimination.

Bennet and Buck meet for their third debate later this week in Pueblo.

Looks like the real debate will be in Pueblo later this week. As opposed to the Mike Rosen stunt.

43 McSpiff  Tue, Oct 5, 2010 10:42:10am

re: #40 Walter L. Newton

He's never substituted for Rush, not once.

Wikipedia disagrees:

Former Rocky Mountain News columnist Mike Rosen is the long running host of the 9 to 11:59 a.m. morning show. Mike is a fiscal conservative/social libertarian who occasionally has been substitute host for Rush Limbaugh.

[Link: en.wikipedia.org...]

45 McSpiff  Tue, Oct 5, 2010 10:43:17am

re: #43 McSpiff

Cant find a source for this claim though. still looking

46 sattv4u2  Tue, Oct 5, 2010 10:43:29am

re: #36 Killgore Trout

KAO is a far right radio station. It took a 30 second google to figure that out.

They carry the Broncos, games, the Rockies games and Colorado U games

those BASTARDS!!

47 Walter L. Newton  Tue, Oct 5, 2010 10:43:49am

re: #43 McSpiff

Wikipedia disagrees:

[Link: en.wikipedia.org...]

As far as I know, that entry is wrong. There is a Mike "someone" from Dallas/Fort Worth who has filled in for Rush.

48 AK-47%  Tue, Oct 5, 2010 10:44:40am

The idea is to keep your mouth shut and let yourself be a blank canvas on which voters can project their idea of what an honest, hard-working, conservative Washington-outsider candidate should look like.

It would've worked for Sarah Palin if she had played along, filling in the rather large gap between McCain and the right-wing base.

Problem is folks like Sarah and Christine O'D cannot keep quiet long enough, and wind up sullying the canvas with splotches their own bigotry and ignorance.

49 funky chicken  Tue, Oct 5, 2010 10:44:51am

re: #40 Walter L. Newton

He's never substituted for Rush, not once.

False. I know he did at least once when I lived in CO Springs. I used to listen to Rosen from time to time, and I remember once when he subbed for Rush. Rosen is an improvement over Limbaugh, but he's still quite outspoken in his partisanship.

That said, Bennett should have done the show. Rosen's sharp, but I'd expect him to be fair. And how hard would it be to make Ken Buck look like an idiot, even with Rosen doing everything he can to help the guy?

50 McSpiff  Tue, Oct 5, 2010 10:44:55am

re: #47 Walter L. Newton

As far as I know, that entry is wrong. There is a Mike "someone" from Dallas/Fort Worth who has filled in for Rush.

Rush's Page says the same thing at: [Link: en.wikipedia.org...]

Mike Rosen
Host of a radio show on KOA in Denver during the University of Colorado at Boulder controversy with former professor Ward Churchill.

Sounds like the same guy to me...

51 Gus  Tue, Oct 5, 2010 10:45:10am

Ken Buck. Against abortion even in cases of rape and incest.

Ken Buck, wrong for women and wrong for Colorado.

This November, vote for Michael Bennett for U.S. Senate.

52 wrenchwench  Tue, Oct 5, 2010 10:45:32am

re: #47 Walter L. Newton

As far as I know, that entry is wrong. There is a Mike "someone" from Dallas/Fort Worth who has filled in for Rush.

That's a "Mark" someone, I believe.

53 Walter L. Newton  Tue, Oct 5, 2010 10:46:02am

re: #45 McSpiff

Cant find a source for this claim though. still looking

I find this on a Facebook page...

Rosen has filled in for Rush Limbaugh on The Rush Limbaugh Show on February 24 and 25, 2005

It claims to be a Mike Rosen page, but I have never heard Mike mention a facebook page.

This is a bit of a mystery.

54 Walter L. Newton  Tue, Oct 5, 2010 10:47:13am

re: #49 funky chicken

False. I know he did at least once when I lived in CO Springs. I used to listen to Rosen from time to time, and I remember once when he subbed for Rush. Rosen is an improvement over Limbaugh, but he's still quite outspoken in his partisanship.

That said, Bennett should have done the show. Rosen's sharp, but I'd expect him to be fair. And how hard would it be to make Ken Buck look like an idiot, even with Rosen doing everything he can to help the guy?

I'm finding this...

"Rosen has filled in for Rush Limbaugh on The Rush Limbaugh Show on February 24 and 25, 2005"

If that's so, I'm wrong, but this is not something that happens on any regular basis...

55 Fozzie Bear  Tue, Oct 5, 2010 10:48:05am

re: #47 Walter L. Newton

As far as I know, that entry is wrong. There is a Mike "someone" from Dallas/Fort Worth who has filled in for Rush.

[Link: www.rushlimbaugh.com...]


We've got Hedgecock in here on Monday and Tuesday. Tom Sullivan -- he'll be in L.A., right, that day? -- from Sacramento. He'll be in L.A. He'll be on Wednesday. Who is...? Oh, yeah. Oh, that's right! Mike Rosen from KOA in Denver. Yeah, he'll be here Thursday and Friday. He's on our 50,000-watt blowtorch affiliate out in the Rocky Mountains, in Denver. So that's just to confirm what many of you were asking me about in the media today about the trip.

From Limbaugh's own transcripts.

56 Kragar  Tue, Oct 5, 2010 10:48:16am

Perhaps a disguntled ex-staffer made a fake facebook page claiming he had subbed for Rush in the past.
/

57 Walter L. Newton  Tue, Oct 5, 2010 10:48:43am

re: #55 Fozzie Bear

[Link: www.rushlimbaugh.com...]

From Limbaugh's own transcripts.

See above... I did find this "Rosen has filled in for Rush Limbaugh on The Rush Limbaugh Show on February 24 and 25, 2005" Looks like I was wrong...

58 Gus  Tue, Oct 5, 2010 10:49:20am

re: #55 Fozzie Bear

[Link: www.rushlimbaugh.com...]

From Limbaugh's own transcripts.

KOA, blowtorch affiliate to Rush Limbaugh. Classic.

59 Walter L. Newton  Tue, Oct 5, 2010 10:49:21am

re: #56 Kragar (Proud to be Kafir)

Perhaps a disguntled ex-staffer made a fake facebook page claiming he had subbed for Rush in the past.
/

I never suggested a fake Facebook page... I just said I've never heard him mention a Facebook page.

60 McSpiff  Tue, Oct 5, 2010 10:49:33am

re: #55 Fozzie Bear

[Link: www.rushlimbaugh.com...]

From Limbaugh's own transcripts.

For the record, the 24th was a thursday, and the 25th a friday, so it looks like you and Walter found the same dates.

61 funky chicken  Tue, Oct 5, 2010 10:49:42am

re: #44 Killgore Trout

Beck compares health care reform to "sponging off" neighbor's fire protection fee

And there you have it. Down with government! No representation without taxation! Er, wait....

////

62 Walter L. Newton  Tue, Oct 5, 2010 10:50:58am

re: #60 McSpiff

For the record, the 24th was a thursday, and the 25th a friday, so it looks like you and Walter found the same dates.

I suspect it's correct.

63 Kragar  Tue, Oct 5, 2010 10:51:27am

re: #59 Walter L. Newton

I never suggested a fake Facebook page... I just said I've never heard him mention a Facebook page.

I never suggested that you suggested.

64 McSpiff  Tue, Oct 5, 2010 10:51:49am

So while I may not believe that "my enemy's enemy is my friend"... I certainly know any friend of Rush isn't a friend of mine. Can't say I would have accepted the invitation to this 'debate' either.

65 ClaudeMonet  Tue, Oct 5, 2010 10:54:18am

Speaking of people who won't face the media unless it's their hand-picked lapdog--

"Hi. This is Sarah Palin. Is Senator Lieberman in?"
"No, governor. This is Yom Kippur."
"Well, can I leave a message, Mr. Kippur?"

66 goddamnedfrank  Tue, Oct 5, 2010 10:54:53am

re: #54 Walter L. Newton

If that's so, I'm wrong, but this is not something that happens on any regular basis...

Don't be silly, you're quite frequently wrong.

67 Killgore Trout  Tue, Oct 5, 2010 10:55:26am

re: #61 funky chicken

And there you have it. Down with government! No representation without taxation! Er, wait...

///

It's amazingly heartless the way they mock the guy who lost his house. Painful.

68 iossarian  Tue, Oct 5, 2010 10:55:35am

re: #66 goddamnedfrank

Don't be silly, you're quite frequently wrong.

GDF wins the internet!

69 sattv4u2  Tue, Oct 5, 2010 10:58:32am

re: #68 iossarian

GDF wins the internet!

Good

I'll send him my bill!

70 Walter L. Newton  Tue, Oct 5, 2010 11:01:10am

re: #64 McSpiff

So while I may not believe that "my enemy's enemy is my friend"... I certainly know any friend of Rush isn't a friend of mine. Can't say I would have accepted the invitation to this 'debate' either.

Like I said above, Rosen has open invitations to most all politicians during races, the Governor of Colorado and Mayor of Denver appear once a month, and Rosen is very capable of being fair and letting the candidates lay out their issues. If Bennett wanted to appear with Buck on Rosen's show, Rosen would have made sure that it would be a day that was accessible to both candidates.

71 funky chicken  Tue, Oct 5, 2010 11:02:01am

re: #67 Killgore Trout

I see the same kinds of comments over at MSNBC any time there's an article about food safety--calls for more "individual responsibility" instead of increased testing/recall power for the FDA.

shaking head....

72 McSpiff  Tue, Oct 5, 2010 11:02:34am

re: #70 Walter L. Newton

Like I said above, Rosen has open invitations to most all politicians during races, the Governor of Colorado and Mayor of Denver appear once a month, and Rosen is very capable of being fair and letting the candidates lay out their issues. If Bennett wanted to appear with Buck on Rosen's show, Rosen would have made sure that it would be a day that was accessible to both candidates.

Fair enough, the limited amount I've read of him didn't lead me to that particular conclusion, but I'll defer to someone who's actually heard him host a debate.

73 Killgore Trout  Tue, Oct 5, 2010 11:03:30am

re: #71 funky chicken

Nice to see you posting regularly again. Hope all is well.

74 darthstar  Tue, Oct 5, 2010 11:05:31am

re: #40 Walter L. Newton

He's never substituted for Rush, not once.

[Link: en.wikipedia.org...]

75 Walter L. Newton  Tue, Oct 5, 2010 11:06:27am

re: #72 McSpiff

Fair enough, the limited amount I've read of him didn't lead me to that particular conclusion, but I'll defer to someone who's actually heard him host a debate.

Rosen would be the first person to proudly admit to being hyper partisan, he is fully a vote "party over person" partisan. But, he hasn't lasted over 20 years in the Denver talk radio market by being unfair on the air to people with other opinions. And yes, his weekly local column is extremely partisan too.

But all that said, he quite capable of hosting a fair debate.

76 Walter L. Newton  Tue, Oct 5, 2010 11:07:02am

re: #74 darthstar

[Link: en.wikipedia.org...]

Late to the party?

77 darthstar  Tue, Oct 5, 2010 11:08:11am

re: #76 Walter L. Newton

Late to the party?

Rosen's your playmate...I'll let you defend him.

78 Walter L. Newton  Tue, Oct 5, 2010 11:08:42am

re: #77 darthstar

Rosen's your playmate...I'll let you defend him.

?

79 Fozzie Bear  Tue, Oct 5, 2010 11:10:13am

The guy is a wingnut, Walter. To say this guy is merely hyper-partisan is sort of understating the point. A guy who repeatedly calls the president "Osama" isn't the kind of dude who is going to give a democrat a fair shake during a debate. Bennett would be naive in the extreme to assume otherwise.

80 Walter L. Newton  Tue, Oct 5, 2010 11:11:11am

re: #79 Fozzie Bear

The guy is a wingnut, Walter. To say this guy is merely hyper-partisan is sort of understating the point. A guy who repeatedly calls the president "Osama" isn't the kind of dude who is going to give a democrat a fair shake during a debate. Bennett would be naive in the extreme to assume otherwise.

Now what are you talking about? "Osama" please explain.

81 funky chicken  Tue, Oct 5, 2010 11:11:21am

re: #73 Killgore Trout

Thanks :-). I've had some minor health problems and been really busy. My son may have some odd blood disorder (waiting weeks for results to come back as it's probably some weird mutation or something) but he feels perfectly fine ... it's not leukemia or lymphoma, and the irregularities were discovered initially by routine blood tests.

I don't think his health is at serious risk, but he may not be able to purchase commercial health insurance easily.

/Down with Obamacare!//////

82 Brother Holy Cruise Missile of Mild Acceptance  Tue, Oct 5, 2010 11:13:02am

re: #80 Walter L. Newton

[Link: colorado.mediamatters.org...]

83 Killgore Trout  Tue, Oct 5, 2010 11:13:53am

re: #81 funky chicken

Thanks :-). I've had some minor health problems and been really busy. My son may have some odd blood disorder (waiting weeks for results to come back as it's probably some weird mutation or something) but he feels perfectly fine ... it's not leukemia or lymphoma, and the irregularities were discovered initially by routine blood tests.

I don't think his health is at serious risk, but he may not be able to purchase commercial health insurance easily.

/Down with Obamacare!///

Bummer. I hope things work out. Hang in there.

84 Walter L. Newton  Tue, Oct 5, 2010 11:14:38am

re: #82 Dreggas

[Link: colorado.mediamatters.org...]

I just found that myself. I'm not going to defend that.

85 Fozzie Bear  Tue, Oct 5, 2010 11:15:21am

re: #80 Walter L. Newton

Now what are you talking about? "Osama" please explain.

Upon searching "mike rosen koa" with google, I found this. The whole "oops silly me I keep accidentally calling the senator with the funny name Osama, what an innocent mistake, teehee" bit shouldn't fool anyone. He's a bomb thrower, not merely a partisan. Some of the other things that showed up raised eyebrows as well, but I think that little "gaffe" (as if it weren't intentional) reveals much.

Partisans advocate for a particular point of view. Wingnuts use cheap verbal association tactics to demonize opponents. Rosen is a wingnut.

86 Walter L. Newton  Tue, Oct 5, 2010 11:18:06am

re: #85 Fozzie Bear

Upon searching "mike rosen koa" with google, I found this. The whole "oops silly me I keep accidentally calling the senator with the funny name Osama, what an innocent mistake, teehee" bit shouldn't fool anyone. He's a bomb thrower, not merely a partisan. Some of the other things that showed up raised eyebrows as well, but I think that little "gaffe" (as if it weren't intentional) reveals much.

Partisans advocate for a particular point of view. Wingnuts use cheap verbal association tactics to demonize opponents. Rosen is a wingnut.

I found that myself. I'm not going to defend that. But he's not anything like Rush or Beck or any of those talking heads who are looking to make outrageous statements.

87 NJDhockeyfan  Tue, Oct 5, 2010 11:20:49am

re: #84 Walter L. Newton

I just found that myself. I'm not going to defend that.

Funny how all the lefties on here never heard of or listened to Mike Rosen but all of a sudden they are experts telling you all about who the man is and how much of a wingnut he is.

I bet not one of them were this upset about any of the nasty comments given by the Air America radio hosts.

88 Fozzie Bear  Tue, Oct 5, 2010 11:21:55am

re: #86 Walter L. Newton

I found that myself. I'm not going to defend that. But he's not anything like Rush or Beck or any of those talking heads who are looking to make outrageous statements.

I can't comment on how often he makes outrageous statements, as I have never heard his show, but he definitely has a tendency to craft incendiary rhetoric designed to create nefarious associations between unrelated people. That's enough for me. There's certainly more than the whole "Osama" thing that turns up in a google search that raises eyebrows.

89 Charles Johnson  Tue, Oct 5, 2010 11:21:57am

re: #85 Fozzie Bear

Upon searching "mike rosen koa" with google, I found this. The whole "oops silly me I keep accidentally calling the senator with the funny name Osama, what an innocent mistake, teehee" bit shouldn't fool anyone. He's a bomb thrower, not merely a partisan. Some of the other things that showed up raised eyebrows as well, but I think that little "gaffe" (as if it weren't intentional) reveals much.

Partisans advocate for a particular point of view. Wingnuts use cheap verbal association tactics to demonize opponents. Rosen is a wingnut.

Featuring a bonus photo of Rosen with one of his idols, Pat Buchanan.

90 Brother Holy Cruise Missile of Mild Acceptance  Tue, Oct 5, 2010 11:22:56am

re: #87 NJDhockeyfan

I couldn't care less about Air America, never listened to it either.

91 Fozzie Bear  Tue, Oct 5, 2010 11:23:00am

re: #87 NJDhockeyfan

Funny how all the lefties on here never heard of or listened to Mike Rosen but all of a sudden they are experts telling you all about who the man is and how much of a wingnut he is.

I bet not one of them were this upset about any of the nasty comments given by the Air America radio hosts.

Who listens to Air America?

Nobody's upset, NJ, at least not me. I just think Bennett is justified in not appearing on a wingnut's radio show, that's all.

92 Brother Holy Cruise Missile of Mild Acceptance  Tue, Oct 5, 2010 11:24:14am

re: #91 Fozzie Bear

it's another "See someone else does it too!" situation. We're talking about one individual and since what he has said is indefensible the fallback is to say the other side does it too. Two wrongs don't make a right.

93 Interesting Times  Tue, Oct 5, 2010 11:25:48am

re: #91 Fozzie Bear

Who listens to Air America?

And what DNC chair ever did a Michael Steele-style apology to one of its hosts?

94 NJDhockeyfan  Tue, Oct 5, 2010 11:26:09am

re: #91 Fozzie Bear

Who listens to Air America?

Nobody, it died a few years ago.

Nobody's upset, NJ, at least not me. I just think Bennett is justified in not appearing on a wingnut's radio show, that's all.

Fair enough. From what Walter says Mike Rosen sounds like a fair interviewer, not a far righty like Rush. Beck, or Hannity.

95 Fozzie Bear  Tue, Oct 5, 2010 11:26:12am

I guess my point is that I wouldn't hold it against a conservative to not agree to a "debate" on Keith Olbermann's show.

96 SanFranciscoZionist  Tue, Oct 5, 2010 11:26:56am

re: #94 NJDhockeyfan

Nobody, it died a few years ago.

Fair enough. From what Walter says Mike Rosen sounds like a fair interviewer, not a far righty like Rush. Beck, or Hannity.

He may be. Don't know if this means that not going on his show in favor of doing something else counts as deliberately staying away from the press.

97 goddamnedfrank  Tue, Oct 5, 2010 11:27:16am

Via the SPLC:

A new DVD is a hit among white supremacists looking for a smart-sounding defense of their beliefs.

Contrary to its title, A Conversation about Race isn’t really a conversation about race at all, but a slick 58-minute documentary devoted to proving the thesis that racism is a bogus concept invented to oppress whites. Debut filmmaker Craig Bodeker — who appears in his documentary with a surfer-style blond ’do, collared shirt and jeans — is upfront about his project:

“I … can’t think of another issue that is more artificial, manufactured and manipulated than this whole construct called racism,” he says in a voice-over as the documentary begins.

Later, on camera, he continues: “This construct of racism is not an objective term. It has no concise definition. In fact, it’s used too often as a tool of intimidation, like a hammer, against Caucasian whites.”

What did Walter's favorite lil' radio buddy have to say about it?

“Very, Very Good!”
-Mike Rosen, “The Mike Rosen Show”
850 KOA Radio Denver

98 CarleeCork  Tue, Oct 5, 2010 11:27:29am

re: #52 wrenchwench

That's a "Mark" someone, I believe.


Would that be Mark Davis?

99 wrenchwench  Tue, Oct 5, 2010 11:29:00am

re: #98 CarleeCork

Would that be Mark Davis?

Yes. He's also had Mark Steyn sub recently, and one other Mark--Levin, maybe. Makes it easier for him to use just one first name.

100 Fozzie Bear  Tue, Oct 5, 2010 11:29:08am

re: #94 NJDhockeyfan

Nobody, it died a few years ago.

It did? Somehow I missed that.

Fair enough. From what Walter says Mike Rosen sounds like a fair interviewer, not a far righty like Rush. Beck, or Hannity.

Yeah. Except for the fact that he has hosted Rush's show at least twice, referred to Obama as "Osama", idolized Pat Buchanan, and endorses white supremicist DVD's, sure. Totally fair. /

101 pharmmajor  Tue, Oct 5, 2010 11:29:31am

I think it's a shame that these cowards are deliberately avoiding the press so they don't have to own up to their bad ideas, while independents and third party candidates with good ideas can't even get press coverage.

102 darthstar  Tue, Oct 5, 2010 11:30:05am

re: #96 SanFranciscoZionist

He may be. Don't know if this means that not going on his show in favor of doing something else counts as deliberately staying away from the press.

Oh, is that what all this bullshit is about? Looking for a Democrat who is "hiding from the press" like Miller, Angle, O'Donnell, Paul, etc.? They're not hiding either...they just choose to talk exclusively to Fox News or someone like Mike Rosen...

I didn't realize it was equivalency fairy time...that's what I get for not paying attention.

103 SanFranciscoZionist  Tue, Oct 5, 2010 11:31:01am

re: #102 darthstar

Oh, is that what all this bullshit is about? Looking for a Democrat who is "hiding from the press" like Miller, Angle, O'Donnell, Paul, etc.? They're not hiding either...they just choose to talk exclusively to Fox News or someone like Mike Rosen...

I didn't realize it was equivalency fairy time...that's what I get for not paying attention.

Isn't that where we came in?

104 funky chicken  Tue, Oct 5, 2010 11:32:37am

WOW:

HIV-positive airman faces hearing on assault
He's charged with having unprotected sex with at least 11 people

The good news is that this guy will be punished more harshly and will serve more time under the UCMJ than he would under the civilian justice system.

105 Brother Holy Cruise Missile of Mild Acceptance  Tue, Oct 5, 2010 11:34:00am
106 Daniel Ballard  Tue, Oct 5, 2010 11:36:07am

re: #105 Dreggas

You should page that. Very nice.

107 iossarian  Tue, Oct 5, 2010 11:36:14am

I am glad to see that attempts to find a Democrat who is "running from the press" have resulted in us discovering a right-wing radio host who hangs out with white supremacists and Pat Buchanan*.

* This post has not been edited to remove redundancy.

108 Page 3 in the Binder of Women  Tue, Oct 5, 2010 11:36:16am

re: #105 Dreggas

Heart warming story, settler rabbis bring Korans to burned Mosque

I needed to read that, thanks!!

109 darthstar  Tue, Oct 5, 2010 11:36:17am

re: #103 SanFranciscoZionist

Isn't that where we came in?

I guess I was confused by Walter's defending Rosen...completely lost the context of the thread.

But I do think it's an interesting strategy...campaigning without appearing in public. They should get all of these candidates together and send them off on a pre-election retreat to wait out the results...or make them a tribe on Survivor's next season. I can see Miller, Paul, and O'Donnell working together to create a fish trap so they can eat:
Miller: "Fish are slimy!"
Paul: "They're not entering our trap...it's a conspiracy!"
O'Donnell: "Is that a pizza the camera crew is eating?"

110 ArchangelMichael  Tue, Oct 5, 2010 11:37:05am

re: #87 NJDhockeyfan

I bet not one of them were this upset about any of the nasty comments given by the Air America radio hosts.

Not that this has shit to do with the price of tea in China but, none of them knew who Ed Schultz was when he came up here a few days ago either. So things he said on Air America wouldn't have been on their radar at all. Next to batshit crazy Randi, he was the 2nd worst moonbat on the network who said some of the most crazy vile shit I've ever heard until the recent batch of Tea Party candidates opened their mouths.

111 garhighway  Tue, Oct 5, 2010 11:37:55am

re: #107 iossarian

I am glad to see that attempts to find a Democrat who is "running from the press" have resulted in us discovering a right-wing radio host who hangs out with white supremacists and Pat Buchanan*.

* This post has not been edited to remove redundancy.

You are being unfair to Buchanan. If you read his speeches in their original German, you will find he is very reasonable.

Or else.

112 SanFranciscoZionist  Tue, Oct 5, 2010 11:38:06am

re: #110 ArchangelMichael

Not that this has shit to do with the price of tea in China but, none of them knew who Ed Schultz was when he came up here a few days ago either. So things he said on Air America wouldn't have been on their radar at all. Next to batshit crazy Randi, he was the 2nd worst moonbat on the network who said some of the most crazy vile shit I've ever heard until the recent batch of Tea Party candidates opened their mouths.

I sure didn't know who he was. Air America wasn't exactly a hit...

113 funky chicken  Tue, Oct 5, 2010 11:39:44am

More military news, and something that Bush/Cheney could have done:

U.S. military orders less dependence on fossil fuels
As Congress struggles unsuccessfully to pass energy bill, Pentagon pushes on
114 ArchangelMichael  Tue, Oct 5, 2010 11:40:32am

re: #112 SanFranciscoZionist

I think I listened to it more than most lefties I knew at the time. It was more for entertainment though as in:"What asinine thing is Randi Rhodes going to say today?"

115 Obdicut  Tue, Oct 5, 2010 11:41:30am

re: #113 funky chicken

I think the only serious action on energy independence is going to come from the military.

Those who deny AGW and otherwise keep us dependent on oil are perpetuating a system that keeps our troops in harms way.

The GOP cannot call itself the party of national security while it is also the party of AGW-denial.

116 Obdicut  Tue, Oct 5, 2010 11:42:29am

re: #105 Dreggas

This is a nice part, too:


Several hundred Palestinians cheered as the rabbis arrived in two armoured Land Rovers accompanied by Israeli soldiers.

Palestinians cheering at Jews. It's a good thing.

117 Mr. Crankypants  Tue, Oct 5, 2010 11:42:30am

re: #115 Obdicut

I think the only serious action on energy independence is going to come from the military.

Those who deny AGW and otherwise keep us dependent on oil are perpetuating a system that keeps our troops in harms way.

The GOP cannot call itself the party of national security while it is also the party of AGW-denial.

We'll call ourselves anything we want! We have ambidextrous lips.

118 funky chicken  Tue, Oct 5, 2010 11:43:00am

re: #110 ArchangelMichael

Ed Schultz is a lunatic. I'm still shocked that MSNBC hired him. But hey, MSNBC features Pat Buchanan sometimes too, right?

Unfair and unbalanced, the both of them. I guess the news execs think that makes their network, um, centrist?

119 AK-47%  Tue, Oct 5, 2010 11:43:15am

re: #97 goddamnedfrank


"Later, on camera, he continues: “This construct of racism is not an objective term. It has no concise definition...."

He sort of has a point. To an extent we are all racist, in that we all make judgements about people based on appearances.

But what makes real racism is decideing we are going to deny someone their basic rights or even basic respect based on their race.

120 Obdicut  Tue, Oct 5, 2010 11:43:27am

re: #94 NJDhockeyfan

Why do you suppose he endorsed the white supremacist DVD?

121 sattv4u2  Tue, Oct 5, 2010 11:44:14am

re: #118 funky chicken

Ed Schultz is a lunatic. I'm still shocked that MSNBC hired him. But hey, MSNBC features Pat Buchanan sometimes too, right?

Unfair and unbalanced, the both of them. I guess the news execs think that makes their network, um, centrist?

Simple math

+1 minus -1 equals 0

right in the middle!!

122 jaunte  Tue, Oct 5, 2010 11:44:38am

Stephen Colbert twitters:

Republicans want to block Obama's plan for high speed rail. How dare he try to take away hobos for the rich to shake canes at?!
[Link: www.thetransportpolitic.com...]

123 Daniel Ballard  Tue, Oct 5, 2010 11:46:07am

Oh man. Just had this conversation with a Beck fan. Who now points out Beck was "right about gold". Sheesh.

The fall cometh.

124 shutdown  Tue, Oct 5, 2010 11:48:35am

re: #123 Rightwingconspirator

Oh man. Just had this conversation with a Beck fan. Who now points out Beck was "right about gold". Sheesh.

The fall cometh.

There is absolutely no way to have a rational conversation with that type of person. I speak from experience.

125 Sheila Broflovski  Tue, Oct 5, 2010 11:48:38am

re: #106 Rightwingconspirator

You should page that. Very nice.

Already paged.

126 lawhawk  Tue, Oct 5, 2010 11:49:01am

re: #115 Obdicut

That jibes with the fact that the military is the single largest consumer of petroleum in the country and a study commissioned by the Pentagon in 2007 to look at reduction techniques had noted the importance of reducing reliance on petroleum products.

The USAF has been testing biofuels to operate aircraft.

Under the Air Force’s current energy plan, the goal is to acquire 50 percent of the domestic aviation fuel from an alternative blend by 2016. Terry Yonkers, the assistant secretary of the Air Force for installations, environment and logistics, said in a statement the goal was to encourage a major shift in the way the service powers its aircraft. “Our goal is to reduce demand, increase supply and change the culture and mindset of our fuel consumption,” he said.

The Air Force is the largest user of jet fuel within the Department of Defense, and plans to have all of the aircraft in its inventory certified to fly using alternative fuels by the end of 2012. The current fleet of aircraft consumes 2.4 billion gallons of jet fuel per year. The A-10 test flight went well with “no problems whatsoever” according to the pilot.

Moving to more efficient airframes will help as well (supercruise modes on the new F-22 and F35 will reduce fuel consumption to go at high mach speeds for instance) that also can increase range.

The Army has been working on fuel cell technologies to replace various generator plants.

Faster, please.

127 Daniel Ballard  Tue, Oct 5, 2010 11:49:30am

re: #125 Alouette

Whoops. Nicely done. More stories like this could really help.

128 SanFranciscoZionist  Tue, Oct 5, 2010 11:50:14am

re: #127 Rightwingconspirator

Whoops. Nicely done. More stories like this could really help.

Doubt it. But they're still good.

129 Mostly sane, most of the time.  Tue, Oct 5, 2010 11:50:32am

Once again, we bring you a message from History itself:

The idea of self-promoting campaigning is fairly recent. Formerly, candidates would send out surrogates to campaign for them.

I believe the closest that George Washington ever came to campaigning for an office was wearing his old French & Indian war uniform around town while they were putting together the leadership of the army.*

However, he left the room when Adams started to make his nominating speech.

Debates were more common as time went on. To illustrate the difference: the Lincoln-Douglas debates were held face to face, while the debate on the Constitution, after it was presented, happened entirely through the newspapers, usually with pseudonyms. (Debate during the Constitutional convention wasn't made public until 1840, when almost everyone was dead.)

The first candidate to go on a nationwide speaking tour was Douglas. Lincoln did not campaign, although other Republicans certainly did.

Harding stayed home in Marion and made everyone come to him. (Nice.)

With the rise of the electronic media, it was possible to do an interview and have the nation hear it. It was possible for the entire nation to hear a debate.**

*When you consider that some of his second-in-commands would actively campaign behind his back to replace him, you see this wasn't much.

**It makes me sad to realize that Abraham Lincoln would be pretty much unelectable nowadays. Not, uh, photogenic enough.

130 shutdown  Tue, Oct 5, 2010 11:50:47am

re: #125 Alouette

Already paged.

It's a nice article; NB Efrat's Chief Rabbi is Riskin, not Rifkin.

131 Feline Emperor of the Conservative Waste  Tue, Oct 5, 2010 11:51:43am

re: #126 lawhawk

That jibes with the fact that the military is the single largest consumer of petroleum in the country and a study commissioned by the Pentagon in 2007 to look at reduction techniques had noted the importance of reducing reliance on petroleum products.

The USAF has been testing biofuels to operate aircraft.

Moving to more efficient airframes will help as well (supercruise modes on the new F-22 and F35 will reduce fuel consumption to go at high mach speeds for instance) that also can increase range.

The Army has been working on fuel cell technologies to replace various generator plants.

Faster, please.

How about going back to mule-pulled freight wagons!111!!

Would be a good basis for a farm subsidy for Monsanto to GM oats so that they have steroids for building muscular mules already included.

I want to see an tank transporter that can handle an M-1 based on that tech. ;)

/

132 AK-47%  Tue, Oct 5, 2010 11:52:04am

re: #126 lawhawk

There is the tactical side to the argument: reducing the size of the supply tail makes the teeth more efficient, but I think there is a strategic argument as well - the military is getting tired of being sent to maintain a presence in unstable parts of the world just to ensure access to petroleum.

133 sattv4u2  Tue, Oct 5, 2010 11:52:48am

HOOSIER

Are you on here ?!?!?

Need a favor, please

134 steve_davis  Tue, Oct 5, 2010 11:55:00am

re: #40 Walter L. Newton

He's never substituted for Rush, not once.

That would come as news to Wikipedia, which lists Rosen as a former substitute host on Rush's show.

135 Mostly sane, most of the time.  Tue, Oct 5, 2010 11:55:05am

re: #129 EmmmieG

Side note 1) The L-D debates were published in the newspapers, most of which were openly partisan. The book I have of them deliberately uses pro-Lincoln papers for his half, and pro-Douglas papers for his half, just to be fair.

2) We could even explore how the internet is changing the face of campaigning, if anyone needs a term paper any time soon.

136 funky chicken  Tue, Oct 5, 2010 11:55:26am

re: #129 EmmmieG

We just visited the Clinton library in Arkansas, and there was a display that said that the first "modern" campaign was this one:
[Link: en.wikipedia.org...]

I guess it was the first where candidates went around campaigning and making speeches.

137 Feline Emperor of the Conservative Waste  Tue, Oct 5, 2010 11:55:48am

re: #132 ralphieboy

There is the tactical side to the argument: reducing the size of the supply tail makes the teeth more efficient, but I think there is a strategic argument as well - the military is getting tired of being sent to maintain a presence in unstable parts of the world just to ensure access to petroleum.

Needing access to oil in order to support an on-going war effort, military expansion, and industrial expansion is part of how Imperial Japan backed itself into a corner in the late-30s and early 40's.

Though I explicitly do not draw direct parallels between Imperial Japan and the US government. We might have myopic leadership, but our set-up does not allow the military tail to wag the dog like the Japanese government did.

138 sattv4u2  Tue, Oct 5, 2010 11:56:31am

re: #134 steve_davis

That would come as news to Wikipedia, which lists Rosen as a former substitute host on Rush's show.

I think it's been established that he did in fact sub for Rush ,, two days in a row ,, in 2005

139 AK-47%  Tue, Oct 5, 2010 11:57:49am

re: #137 oaktree

Remember that the only thing that really stopped the Wehrmacht in WWII was that it ran out of fuel.

140 darthstar  Tue, Oct 5, 2010 11:59:24am

re: #139 ralphieboy

Remember that the only thing that really stopped the Wehrmacht in WWII was that it ran out of fuel.

I'm more worried about stopping WalMart today.

141 Mostly sane, most of the time.  Tue, Oct 5, 2010 12:03:25pm

re: #136 funky chicken

We just visited the Clinton library in Arkansas, and there was a display that said that the first "modern" campaign was this one:
[Link: en.wikipedia.org...]

I guess it was the first where candidates went around campaigning and making speeches.

Don't forget about the hard cider and log cabin symbols. Of course, William Henry Harrison was the wealthy son of a signer of the Declaration of Independence, so he wasn't exactly backwoods material, but that didn't matter in the campaign.

Using a carefully crafted public image that might or might not match the actual candidate is also now standard, I fear.

142 AK-47%  Tue, Oct 5, 2010 12:04:35pm

re: #140 darthstar

I'm more worried about stopping WalMart today.


Wal-Mart has the populace on its side, unlike the Wehrmacht in France or Russia...

143 Kragar  Tue, Oct 5, 2010 12:05:47pm

re: #139 ralphieboy

Remember that the only thing that really stopped the Wehrmacht in WWII was that it ran out of fuel.

Having your leader's starting wars on every front will do that to you.

144 funky chicken  Tue, Oct 5, 2010 12:07:13pm

re: #123 Rightwingconspirator

Oh man. Just had this conversation with a Beck fan. Who now points out Beck was "right about gold". Sheesh.

The fall cometh.

Wow--if you create mass panic, the masses will panic. Whatta shock!

145 goddamnedfrank  Tue, Oct 5, 2010 12:08:07pm

Mike Rosen discusses A Conversation About Race.

Rosen: "11:20, Craig Bodeker our guest put together a documentary called A Conversation About Race. In which you'll see a variety of people; a pretty white blond female, 20 years old or so, a college student, and a young black woman, and some young black gang-bangers, and a businessman, and some older black people, and an aging female hippie - was she from Boulder by the way?"

Bodeker: "Lakewood actually."

Rosen: "Lakewood, of course [laughs]. Anyway, it's interesting, and he puts a series of questions to them, and as the questions progress, they get trapped in the logic, and they're snared logically and can't carry through some of the things they had agreed to earlier in any consistent patter of treating races equally. It's obvious that they're playing favorites in this case, and they favorite that they're playing in this case is black. So the definition of racism is elusive for just about all of these people, and then when they finally try to come up with one it's a very self serving, inconsistent, irrational definition."

146 Kragar  Tue, Oct 5, 2010 12:08:48pm

re: #123 Rightwingconspirator

Oh man. Just had this conversation with a Beck fan. Who now points out Beck was "right about gold". Sheesh.

The fall cometh.

I hope you pointed out anyone who bought coins from Beck's advertisers lost 50% of their investment right off the bat.

147 AK-47%  Tue, Oct 5, 2010 12:12:15pm

re: #143 Kragar (Proud to be Kafir)

Having your leader's starting wars on every front will do that to you.


Hitler tried to get at the oil in the Caucasus but pulled up short at Stalingrad.

148 Stormageddon, Dark Lord of All  Tue, Oct 5, 2010 12:12:22pm

re: #87 NJDhockeyfan

Funny how all the lefties on here never heard of or listened to Mike Rosen but all of a sudden they are experts telling you all about who the man is and how much of a wingnut he is.

I bet not one of them were this upset about any of the nasty comments given by the Air America radio hosts.

Air America? are you saying that there is an equivalence between Air America and Right Wing Radio? Come on... you can do better than that!

You could fit the number of listeners of Air America into a phone booth.

149 dragonfire1981  Tue, Oct 5, 2010 12:13:21pm

I would argue they don't have any support at all from the middle/moderates because those people don't attend Tea Party Rallies and don't watch Fox News.

What truly astounds me though is they will NEED some of those people to vote for them if they want to stand a chance of winning, I think the Republican base alone is not strong enough.

I'm no expert political strategist, but I know a thing or two about PR and if you are running for public office, then hiding AWAY from the media is about the dumbest and most counterproductive thing you can do.

150 jaunte  Tue, Oct 5, 2010 12:13:23pm

re: #145 goddamnedfrank


Bodeker: "Lakewood actually."

Rosen: "Lakewood, of course [laughs].


Not being from around there, I can't guess what prejudice about Lakewood he's expressing in that exchange.

151 Darth Vader Gargoyle  Tue, Oct 5, 2010 12:15:22pm

re: #150 jaunte

Not being from around there, I can't guess what prejudice about Lakewood he's expressing in that exchange.

Sounds like Lakewood has hippies, like Boulder.

152 Kragar  Tue, Oct 5, 2010 12:16:05pm

re: #147 ralphieboy

Hitler tried to get at the oil in the Caucasus but pulled up short at Stalingrad.

A million Russians will do that to you.

153 AK-47%  Tue, Oct 5, 2010 12:16:53pm

re: #152 Kragar (Proud to be Kafir)

A million Russians will do that to you.

Leaving Rumanians and Italians to hold your flanks will do that, too...

154 goddamnedfrank  Tue, Oct 5, 2010 12:17:31pm

re: #150 jaunte

Not being from around there, I can't guess what prejudice about Lakewood he's expressing in that exchange.

I'm guessing it's this one.

155 RogueOne  Tue, Oct 5, 2010 12:18:04pm

re: #51 Gus 802

Ken Buck. Against abortion even in cases of rape and incest.

Ken Buck, wrong for women and wrong for Colorado.

This November, vote for Michael Bennett for U.S. Senate.

Too bad this year the election isn't a focus on anything other than the economy. Buck wins by 7. It would be a double digit win but your next governor is going to be a Hickenlooper which will down grade a buck win.

I hope you guys are keeping track of these predictions. If you were smart you could put some money on them.

156 jaunte  Tue, Oct 5, 2010 12:18:05pm

re: #151 rwdflynavy

I remember some of them from 1968 or so, but conditions have changed so much I don't think the definition would hold true today.

157 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Tue, Oct 5, 2010 12:18:45pm

re: #143 Kragar (Proud to be Kafir)

Thank goodness Ritalin wasn't available.

158 Gus  Tue, Oct 5, 2010 12:19:03pm

re: #151 rwdflynavy

Sounds like Lakewood has hippies, like Boulder.

Nah. Lakewood is like the the first burbs outside of Denver. It's mostly working or middle class.

159 SanFranciscoZionist  Tue, Oct 5, 2010 12:19:11pm

re: #148 bloodstar

Air America? are you saying that there is an equivalence between Air America and Right Wing Radio? Come on... you can do better than that!

You could fit the number of listeners of Air America into a phone booth.

Well, it may be unsuccessful, but damnit, they're trying to be just as awful as anybody!

(I guess. I don't listen.)

160 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Tue, Oct 5, 2010 12:20:30pm

re: #159 SanFranciscoZionist

I was trying to be open minded. I listened to Al Franken's show. It was just terrible.

161 Darth Vader Gargoyle  Tue, Oct 5, 2010 12:21:35pm

re: #152 Kragar (Proud to be Kafir)

A million Russians will do that to you.


Highly recommend Dan Carlin's Hardcore History, especially shows 27-30, Ghosts of the Ostfront I-IV, a great gritty recap of the Soviet fight against the Germans.

[Link: www.dancarlin.com...]

162 Kragar  Tue, Oct 5, 2010 12:21:39pm

re: #158 Gus 802

Nah. Lakewood is like the the first burbs outside of Denver. It's mostly working or middle class.

Oh, the plebians and hoi palloi. Why didn't you say so?

163 reloadingisnotahobby  Tue, Oct 5, 2010 12:21:41pm

re: #160 Fat Bastard Vegetarian
As bad as Alec Baldwins try at it??
Impossible!

164 Kragar  Tue, Oct 5, 2010 12:22:56pm

re: #161 rwdflynavy

Highly recommend Dan Carlin's Hardcore History, especially shows 27-30, Ghosts of the Ostfront I-IV, a great gritty recap of the Soviet fight against the Germans.

[Link: www.dancarlin.com...]

Allow me to reccomend;

Ivan's War: Life and Death in the Red Army, 1939-1945

165 goddamnedfrank  Tue, Oct 5, 2010 12:23:56pm

re: #154 goddamnedfrank

I'm guessing it's this one.

Or this one.

Lakewood currently elects Democrats to represent them at the State and Federal level, so of course Rosen thinks they're a bunch of n-word lovin' hippies.

166 sattv4u2  Tue, Oct 5, 2010 12:24:59pm

re: #165 goddamnedfrank

Or this one.

Lakewood currently elects Democrats to represent them at the State and Federal level, so of course Rosen thinks they're a bunch of n-word lovin' hippies.

{sigh}
Did you play a lot of football without a helmet when you were a kid?

167 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Tue, Oct 5, 2010 12:25:01pm

re: #163 reloadingisnotahobby

Only Alec Baldwin Radio I've ever heard was Schwetty Balls on NPR.

168 Gus  Tue, Oct 5, 2010 12:25:06pm

re: #155 RogueOne

Too bad this year the election isn't a focus on anything other than the economy. Buck wins by 7. It would be a double digit win but your next governor is going to be a Hickenlooper which will down grade a buck win.

I hope you guys are keeping track of these predictions. If you were smart you could put some money on them.

Actually, I do keep track. It's kind of hard to keep focus on the economy though given that many Republicans are once again intent on shoving their take on social issues in our faces. And that includes Ken Buck.

Colorado slipping into the red zone isn't anything new either. It's happened many times before. Frankly, Buck will just be another "no vote" in the Senate if he wins. I'm not exactly sitting here drooling over Bennett either but I'd like to see as few Republicans win this year because of their decision to join hands with the Tea Party, The JBS, and other far-right factions.

That being said the biggest concern is to keep Tom Tancredo out of the the governor's mansion.

169 RogueOne  Tue, Oct 5, 2010 12:27:53pm

re: #168 Gus 802

CO is a good bellwether state but this year the fix is already in. We'll see how things are shaping up in CO in a couple years.

170 funky chicken  Tue, Oct 5, 2010 12:28:29pm

Oh, funny video that was at the Clinton presidential library: apparently in the Jefferson/Burr election, Burr said that if Jefferson was elected, America would be filled with incest, rape, and murder. LOL. I guess politicians have been saying crazy sh*t about each other forever.

Off to get the kids and drive them around for the rest of the night.

171 RogueOne  Tue, Oct 5, 2010 12:28:45pm

re: #168 Gus 802

Plus, how can you not vote for a guy with a name like "Hickenlooper"

172 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Tue, Oct 5, 2010 12:29:29pm

re: #164 Kragar (Proud to be Kafir)

Or you could just watch "The Princess Bride".

You fool! You fell victim to one of the classic blunders - The most famous of which is "never get involved in a land war in Asia" - but only slightly less well-known is this: "Never go against a Sicilian when death is on the line"! Ha ha ha ha ha ha

173 RogueOne  Tue, Oct 5, 2010 12:30:14pm

re: #170 funky chicken

Oh, funny video that was at the Clinton presidential library: apparently in the Jefferson/Burr election, Burr said that if Jefferson was elected, America would be filled with incest, rape, and murder. LOL. I guess politicians have been saying crazy sh*t about each other forever.

No way. Politicians have always behaved civilized until the advent of FoxNews. It's never been this bad© ® ™.

174 Gus  Tue, Oct 5, 2010 12:31:38pm

re: #171 RogueOne

Plus, how can you not vote for a guy with a name like "Hickenlooper"

I hope people vote that way. The governors race turned into a real mess on the GOP side. Dan Maes, the lunatic, has sunk so fast that now Tancredo is ahead of him on the "GOP" side. Hickenlooper is still ahead. That can change though if Maes drops out and we get Maes voters voting for Tancredo.

175 Gus  Tue, Oct 5, 2010 12:33:25pm

re: #174 Gus 802

43% Hickenlooper (D), 35% Tancredo (C), 16% Maes (R)

35 + 16 = 51 > 43

176 Obdicut  Tue, Oct 5, 2010 12:33:28pm

re: #173 RogueOne

Well, Burr was a historically incredibly awful figure. A real creep. Beck has reminded me of Burr in a lot of ways, except that he's not as smart as Burr.

177 RogueOne  Tue, Oct 5, 2010 12:33:37pm

re: #174 Gus 802

Maes should have dropped out when they asked him nicely. My guess is he has to stay in the race now just to save face. Tancredo would have given Hickenlooper a good run but he would have still lost, I think. It's hard to tell this year. When betting football I rarely bet on an away team and this year I'm getting the same feeling about betting on any Dem, other than one from CA/WA, to win.

178 Kragar  Tue, Oct 5, 2010 12:33:53pm

I just read a comment from a Tea Party advocate on another site which said "If our taxes weren't so high, we wouldn't need to figure out ways not to pay them."

179 Gus  Tue, Oct 5, 2010 12:34:53pm

re: #177 RogueOne

Maes should have dropped out when they asked him nicely. My guess is he has to stay in the race now just to save face. Tancredo would have given Hickenlooper a good run but he would have still lost, I think. It's hard to tell this year. When betting football I rarely bet on an away team and this year I'm getting the same feeling about betting on any Dem, other than one from CA/WA, to win.

As I noted, I don't think the Hickenlooper camp would want to see Maes drop out. Tancredo does keep calling for him to do so for obvious reasons.

180 sattv4u2  Tue, Oct 5, 2010 12:35:50pm

re: #174 Gus 802

re: #175 Gus 802

43% Hickenlooper (D), 35% Tancredo (C), 16% Maes (R)

35 + 16 = 51 > 43

If "a" candidate drops out it's not automatic that all or even a large portion of their supporters vote for the next "closest" person

Most backers just end up sitting it out

181 Stormageddon, Dark Lord of All  Tue, Oct 5, 2010 12:36:02pm

re: #160 Fat Bastard Vegetarian

I was trying to be open minded. I listened to Al Franken's show. It was just terrible.

I think there are two factors that really kill the concept of left wing radio.

First, you have a personality problem. Comedy is great when you have a prepared skit, but it's much more difficult to talk for 3 or 4 hours a day, keep it conversational, not resort to a lecturing, and to manage to talk about issues that engage your target audience.

Second, you have a demographics problem. The people who listen to AM and talk radio tend to be much older and much more conservative. And there is a correlation v causation going on here, do older people listen to talk radio because of the conservative programs, or are conservative programs more successful because of the demographics? If it's the former, then good advertising could make a difference, if it's the latter then it won't matter what you do.

Finally, you likely have a disconnect with your audience. (which is related to the first point) You can't educate your audience on most topics because it's boring to listen to someone talk on and on. Most people who want that listen to NPR already.

(and I know, I'm so far off the original topic that it's below the horizon now... oh well... heh)

182 AK-47%  Tue, Oct 5, 2010 12:37:26pm

re: #178 Kragar (Proud to be Kafir)

I just read a comment from a Tea Party advocate on another site which said "If our taxes weren't so high, we wouldn't need to figure out ways not to pay them."


The Swiss pretty much solved that by maintaining a low tax rate with a minimum of deductions/exemptions. People are more encouraged to increase their earnings than to hide their taxable income.

183 Varek Raith  Tue, Oct 5, 2010 12:39:04pm

re: #182 ralphieboy

The Swiss pretty much solved that by maintaining a low tax rate with a minimum of deductions/exemptions. People are more encouraged to increase their earnings than to hide their taxable income.

Under a Democratic admin, any taxes over 0 are too much.

184 palomino  Tue, Oct 5, 2010 12:39:13pm

re: #1 WaveriderCA

Voter's ignorance seems to be a bipartisan tactic these days. Toss in some 1000 page legislative bills that get rammed through or just hide all the candidates from the truth. It's really funny isn't it how it's the information age yet things seem more opaque than ever.

What a crock. Everything that doesn't have bipartisan support in Congress gets "rammed through". It's only when it's the other party doing the ramming that you guys feel the pain.

185 Gus  Tue, Oct 5, 2010 12:39:15pm

re: #180 sattv4u2

re: #175 Gus 802

If "a" candidate drops out it's not automatic that all or even a large portion of their supporters vote for the next "closest" person

Most backers just end up sitting it out

Right. Only a portion of that 16 percent would go over to Tancredo. But if Maes drops out early (would have to be within a week or two) that percentage has the potential to increase.

186 AK-47%  Tue, Oct 5, 2010 12:40:13pm

re: #183 Varek Raith

Under a Democratic admin, any taxes over 0 are too much.


I remember when Clinton was running a surplus and Rush was railling against it. After all, how dare the government take more money from us than they need to run things?

187 sattv4u2  Tue, Oct 5, 2010 12:41:19pm

re: #178 Kragar (Proud to be Kafir)

re: #182 ralphieboy

The Swiss pretty much solved that by maintaining a low tax rate with a minimum of deductions/exemptions. People are more encouraged to increase their earnings than to hide their taxable income.

BINGO

Our tax code(s) now are so cumbersome it provides many LEGAL loopholes

188 lawhawk  Tue, Oct 5, 2010 12:41:26pm

re: #182 ralphieboy

That would go to tax simplification - you can maintain the same tax rates, but by eliminating multiple credits, deductions, exemptions, adjustments, you make it easier to comply with the tax code, increase transparency, and reduce tax avoidance.

The problem with that is no one wants to give up their particular tax credit, deduction, or adjustment. So, over time, the tax code becomes even more bloated.

189 goddamnedfrank  Tue, Oct 5, 2010 12:41:32pm

re: #166 sattv4u2

{sigh}
Did you play a lot of football without a helmet when you were a kid?

Another poor oppressed Rosen / Bodeker supporter heard from, or don't you agree with their theory that racism was invented to oppress whites? I think the real reason that black people shouldn't say the n-word anymore because it makes right wing radio listeners nostalgic for the good old days.

190 Radicchio ad Absurdum  Tue, Oct 5, 2010 12:41:49pm

re: #176 Obdicut

Well, Burr was a historically incredibly awful figure. A real creep.

I thought he was great as Perry Mason, but what do I know?

/

191 sattv4u2  Tue, Oct 5, 2010 12:42:12pm

re: #185 Gus 802

Right. Only a portion of that 16 percent would go over to Tancredo. But if Maes drops out early (would have to be within a week or two) that percentage has the potential to increase.

Correct,,, the closer to THE day, the less likely someone who drops outs supporters are likely to even go to the polls

They feel betrayed and hurt by the "system'

192 iossarian  Tue, Oct 5, 2010 12:42:57pm

re: #182 ralphieboy

The Swiss pretty much solved that by maintaining a low tax rate with a minimum of deductions/exemptions. People are more encouraged to increase their earnings than to hide their taxable income.

I've lived in Switzerland, and while it's a great place, its rather unique economy (shady banks in Zurich and big-spending international organizations in Geneva, with some rather fetching tourism in between) would caution me against reading too much into the benefits of its personal tax system.

That said, the Swiss do have fantastic public education (essentially free, all the way through graduate school in many disciplines) and a fairly reasonable health coverage system (mandatory insurance with generous subsidies for the less well-off).

193 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Tue, Oct 5, 2010 12:43:01pm

re: #79 Fozzie Bear

The guy is a wingnut, Walter. To say this guy is merely hyper-partisan is sort of understating the point. A guy who repeatedly calls the president "Osama" isn't the kind of dude who is going to give a democrat a fair shake during a debate. Bennett would be naive in the extreme to assume otherwise.

Talk radio! Fuck talk radio, real debates on a real medium, plz

194 sattv4u2  Tue, Oct 5, 2010 12:43:29pm

re: #189 goddamnedfrank

Another poor oppressed Rosen / Bodeker supporter heard from, or don't you agree with their theory that racism was invented to oppress whites? I think the real reason that black people shouldn't say the n-word anymore because it makes right wing radio listeners nostalgic for the good old days.


LOL I don't care for either of them,, don't KNOW either of them,, aren't affected by either of them
I don't live there!

But nice try

195 AK-47%  Tue, Oct 5, 2010 12:43:44pm

re: #187 sattv4u2


Another odd thing about the Swiss system. Although your income statements are private and confidential, the amount that you actually pay in taxes is publicly posted.

This has actually lead to cases of people overpaying their taxes to create the impression that their income was higher.

Where else on earth would that ever happen?

196 RogueOne  Tue, Oct 5, 2010 12:44:12pm

re: #191 sattv4u2

Correct,,, the closer to THE day, the less likely someone who drops outs supporters are likely to even go to the polls

They feel betrayed and hurt by the "system'

In this case I think it might be too late. Tancredo/Maes is right wing/right wing-ier.

197 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Tue, Oct 5, 2010 12:44:42pm

re: #145 goddamnedfrank

Mike Rosen discusses A Conversation About Race.

Rosen: "11:20, Craig Bodeker our guest put together a documentary called A Conversation About Race. In which you'll see a variety of people; a pretty white blond female, 20 years old or so, a college student, and a young black woman, and some young black gang-bangers, and a businessman, and some older black people, and an aging female hippie - was she from Boulder by the way?"

Bodeker: "Lakewood actually."

Rosen: "Lakewood, of course [laughs]. Anyway, it's interesting, and he puts a series of questions to them, and as the questions progress, they get trapped in the logic, and they're snared logically and can't carry through some of the things they had agreed to earlier in any consistent patter of treating races equally. It's obvious that they're playing favorites in this case, and they favorite that they're playing in this case is black. So the definition of racism is elusive for just about all of these people, and then when they finally try to come up with one it's a very self serving, inconsistent, irrational definition."

wow

198 sattv4u2  Tue, Oct 5, 2010 12:44:58pm

re: #195 ralphieboy

Another odd thing about the Swiss system. Although your income statements are private and confidential, the amount that you actually pay in taxes is publicly posted.

This has actually lead to cases of people overpaying their taxes to create the impression that their income was higher.

Where else on earth would that ever happen?

LOL

Didn't know that

Thanks

"yes Gertrude ,, we ARE piss poor ,, but if "they" see how much we pay,,,,,,,"

199 palomino  Tue, Oct 5, 2010 12:47:13pm

re: #40 Walter L. Newton

He's never substituted for Rush, not once.


re: #43 McSpiff

Wikipedia disagrees:

[Link: en.wikipedia.org...]

re: #54 Walter L. Newton

Do you even bother to do any research before posting your increasingly predictable equivalency fails?

Or do you just pull this stuff out of your, uhh, back pocket?

I'm finding this...

"Rosen has filled in for Rush Limbaugh on The Rush Limbaugh Show on February 24 and 25, 2005"

If that's so, I'm wrong, but this is not something that happens on any regular basis...

200 darthstar  Tue, Oct 5, 2010 12:47:43pm

Back to running away from the press...I can't believe the magical balance fairies missed this one (a gift! a gift!)


Press Frustrated Over Obama's Lack of News Conferences

Reporters asked White House Press Secretary Robert Gibbs about the situation at Gibbs's regular briefings both Friday and Monday, and Gibbs said Obama has many ways of explaining his views to the American people, including speeches, interviews, his weekly radio and video addresses, and brief q-and-a sessions with reporters every few days. Gibbs also said such press corps complaints are ironic because until recently, pundits and some White House reporters have been raising questions about whether Obama was "overexposed" and showing up in the media too much.

I bolded the juicy part...smack!

201 goddamnedfrank  Tue, Oct 5, 2010 12:49:36pm

re: #194 sattv4u2

LOL I don't care for either of them,, don't KNOW either of them,, aren't affected by either of them
I don't live there!

But nice try

Right, you just got all pissed off when I called him out specifically for his overt race baiting of blacks and their "hippie" suporters, because you don't care.

202 AK-47%  Tue, Oct 5, 2010 12:50:26pm

re: #198 sattv4u2

LOL

Didn't know that

Thanks

"yes Gertrude ,, we ARE piss poor ,, but if "they" see how much we pay,,,"

It was more of the case of businesspeople wanting to create the impression that their business was doing better than it actually was and that they were fluid.

203 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Tue, Oct 5, 2010 12:50:53pm

re: #160 Fat Bastard Vegetarian

I was trying to be open minded. I listened to Al Franken's show. It was just terrible.

The good left wing show is the Stephanie Miller show, that's really the only partisan show I can listen to. Because they were actual radio professionals and comedians!

Other than that, the only talk radio I listen to is satirical talk radio that makes fun of the medium itself, and the only guy doing that are Phil Hendrie and Rick Emerson.

The proof that it's mostly rubes and ancient people with oxygen tanks who listen to right wing talk radio is that guys with zero talent and zero show like G Gordon Liddy and Mark Levin still have a show, just totally worthless and skill-less as broadcasters but the ideology matches the fools who listen, so hey, game on. That's the 65 to dead demo, they simply will listen to anything that reflects their prejudices

The reason liberal talk radio doesn't "work" like right wing radio is liberals en masse would not listen to such a shoddy product. Some do of course, Ring Of Fire is still a show, but you could never get one liberal host for everyone to rally around like Limbaugh, you simply cannot get the common demoninator that low

204 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Tue, Oct 5, 2010 12:51:31pm

re: #200 darthstar

I think Gibbs makes a good point there.

The current prez appears to be the most "Damned either way" guys in history.

205 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Tue, Oct 5, 2010 12:51:42pm

re: #201 goddamnedfrank

Right, you just got all pissed off when I called him out specifically for his overt race baiting of blacks and their "hippie" suporters, because you don't care.

Oh man, I love this game, people on the internet play it all the time, the whole "oh man I totally don't care about this argument" game

206 darthstar  Tue, Oct 5, 2010 12:52:39pm

re: #160 Fat Bastard Vegetarian

I was trying to be open minded. I listened to Al Franken's show. It was just terrible.

Al Franken always played bits of Grateful Dead jams (his favorite, it seemed, was the jam from Terrapin Station) as lead-in/lead-out music for his show. And it was a pretty good show as far as Air America goes...but he's a senator now, and a damn good one who takes his job seriously.

207 AK-47%  Tue, Oct 5, 2010 12:53:35pm

re: #206 darthstar

Al Franken always played bits of Grateful Dead jams (his favorite, it seemed, was the jam from Terrapin Station) as lead-in/lead-out music for his show. And it was a pretty good show as far as Air America goes...but he's a senator now, and a damn good one who takes his job seriously.


Best part about Rush Limbaugh's show is the musical interludes...

208 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Tue, Oct 5, 2010 12:54:11pm

re: #206 darthstar

Al Franken always played bits of Grateful Dead jams (his favorite, it seemed, was the jam from Terrapin Station) as lead-in/lead-out music for his show. And it was a pretty good show as far as Air America goes...but he's a senator now, and a damn good one who takes his job seriously.

Smart guy, good senator!

Hideous broadcaster, though. :( I couldn't deal with it. I need virtuoso shows, Don and Mike (or now just Mike) , Stern, people who know what they're doing.

209 Darth Vader Gargoyle  Tue, Oct 5, 2010 12:54:26pm

re: #199 palomino

re: #43 McSpiff


re: #54 Walter L. Newton

Do you even bother to do any research before posting your increasingly predictable equivalency fails?

Or do you just pull this stuff out of your, uhh, back pocket?

speaking of reading.... this has been covered like 6 times....

210 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Tue, Oct 5, 2010 12:54:34pm

re: #207 ralphieboy

Best part about Rush Limbaugh's show is the musical interludes...

I'm trying not to let that Pretenders song be ruined for me

211 MinisterO  Tue, Oct 5, 2010 12:56:29pm

re: #173 RogueOne

No way. Politicians have always behaved civilized until the advent of FoxNews. It's never been this bad© ® ™.

The new feature is the 24-hour nonstop fawning endorsement of brand R nincompoopery by a huge propaganda network. Fox has really raised the bar.

212 sattv4u2  Tue, Oct 5, 2010 12:56:49pm

re: #205 WindUpBird

Oh man, I love this game, people on the internet play it all the time, the whole "oh man I totally don't care about this argument" game

Oh man,, I love this game

Make up something someone said then act as if they DId say it!

213 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Tue, Oct 5, 2010 12:57:18pm

re: #208 WindUpBird

I LOVED DON AND MIKE!

214 palomino  Tue, Oct 5, 2010 12:57:24pm

re: #206 darthstar

Al Franken always played bits of Grateful Dead jams (his favorite, it seemed, was the jam from Terrapin Station) as lead-in/lead-out music for his show. And it was a pretty good show as far as Air America goes...but he's a senator now, and a damn good one who takes his job seriously.

Franken is just another of those east coast (OK, Minnesota) bigots like Jon Stewart, with his fancy pants poli sci degree from Harvard.

215 sattv4u2  Tue, Oct 5, 2010 12:57:49pm

re: #202 ralphieboy

It was more of the case of businesspeople wanting to create the impression that their business was doing better than it actually was and that they were fluid.

I can see that

I also see the original idea (their tax code) has having a LOT of merit

216 palomino  Tue, Oct 5, 2010 12:58:54pm

re: #209 rwdflynavy

speaking of reading... this has been covered like 6 times...

So what? Are you the official timekeeper for LGF? If it pains you to hear how stupid his comments were, again, then just ignore it.

217 RogueOne  Tue, Oct 5, 2010 12:59:50pm

I know most of you won't find this funny but I'm LOVING this race:

[Link: www.realclearpolitics.com...]

Both CNN and Fox have Angle leading. LOLOLOL. This could end up being the best race EVER.

218 AK-47%  Tue, Oct 5, 2010 12:59:59pm

re: #215 sattv4u2

I can see that

I also see the original idea (their tax code) has having a LOT of merit


The argument is, tax rates are already so low that you don't need a lot in the way of exemptions and deductions. Makes sense.

And - here is the catch - tax evasion is a misdemeanor, not a criminal offense. Which is why they do not feel compelled to cooperate with foreign governments in tax evasion cases, only on cases for things that are criminal in their own country, like child molestation...

219 goddamnedfrank  Tue, Oct 5, 2010 1:00:20pm

re: #209 rwdflynavy

speaking of reading... this has been covered like 6 times...

Yeah, but it's pretty funny. Seriously, who makes a categorical assertion like that in the complete and utter failure to do even the most basic, wiki level research.

Walter, that's who.

220 Darth Vader Gargoyle  Tue, Oct 5, 2010 1:00:34pm

re: #216 palomino

So what? Are you the official timekeeper for LGF? If it pains you to hear how stupid his comments were, again, then just ignore it.

or you could read a couple posts past Walter's before you dig it up again.

The (un)official timekeeper has spoken!

221 palomino  Tue, Oct 5, 2010 1:01:05pm

re: #217 RogueOne

I know most of you won't find this funny but I'm LOVING this race:

[Link: www.realclearpolitics.com...]

Both CNN and Fox have Angle leading. LOLOLOL. This could end up being the best race EVER.

Yes, isn't it great to have another fucking lunatic in the Senate? Go teabag morons!

222 RogueOne  Tue, Oct 5, 2010 1:01:54pm

re: #221 palomino

Yes, isn't it great to have another fucking lunatic in the Senate? Go teabag morons!

We have about 60 of them, what's one more? You sound a little hurt about this one though, Reid a relative of yours?

223 palomino  Tue, Oct 5, 2010 1:02:52pm

re: #220 rwdflynavy

or you could read a couple posts past Walter's before you dig it up again.

The (un)official timekeeper has spoken!

Sorry, not gonna read every post just to make sure there aren't any redundancies. And so what if there are repeat posts? Happens all the time.

And sometimes the stupid burns so much it deserves multiple calling out.

224 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Tue, Oct 5, 2010 1:03:31pm

That thread about the fire being allowed to burn, was very interesting in the people who just would not back off their ideology in the face of the absolute failure of their ideology

226 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Tue, Oct 5, 2010 1:04:46pm

re: #213 Fat Bastard Vegetarian

I LOVED DON AND MIKE!

Don and Mike was one of the greatest things, it was like talk radio being broadcasted from talk radio hell :D

I loved how the show would start with just an avalanche of bizarre drops and sound effects, like they're in a bar and they're loaded and just hitting everything at once, what a funny show that was :D

227 RogueOne  Tue, Oct 5, 2010 1:05:27pm

re: #224 WindUpBird

That thread about the fire being allowed to burn, was very interesting in the people who just would not back off their ideology in the face of the absolute failure of their ideology

Tell me about it. Some guy refuses the insurance and then sets fire to his own house out of negligence and people still won't accept the fact that the rest of the county should pay for his stupidity. What is wrong with people? Where's the compassion for the lazy and the stupid? If they're cut, do they not bleed?

228 Page 3 in the Binder of Women  Tue, Oct 5, 2010 1:06:21pm

re: #225 Killgore Trout

Internal Emails Suggest Palin to Run for President

Here's the email - Todd Palin blasts Joe Miller
Way to go Mudflats!

[Link: mudflats.files.wordpress.com...]

229 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Tue, Oct 5, 2010 1:06:24pm

re: #217 RogueOne

I know most of you won't find this funny but I'm LOVING this race:

[Link: www.realclearpolitics.com...]

Both CNN and Fox have Angle leading. LOLOLOL. This could end up being the best race EVER.


I wonder if it would be as funny to you if Sharron Angle opposed adoption by Jewish people, just wondering

OH OH HO IT'S HILARIOUS WHEEEE

230 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Tue, Oct 5, 2010 1:06:42pm

re: #226 WindUpBird

Do you by any chance remember the name of the "Civil War Surgeon"? No matter what the illness or injury was... he sawed off body parts?

231 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Tue, Oct 5, 2010 1:07:59pm

re: #225 Killgore Trout

Not gonna happen. They can suggest it all they want.

I'm pretty hard right, but I'd vote for Obama.

232 iossarian  Tue, Oct 5, 2010 1:08:09pm

re: #229 WindUpBird

I wonder if it would be as funny to you if Sharron Angle opposed adoption by Jewish people, just wondering

OH OH HO IT'S HILARIOUS WHEEE

Gay people are evil. Jewish people are nice. Black people are OK. Black people who marry white people are sort of OK.

Please try to keep up.

233 palomino  Tue, Oct 5, 2010 1:08:35pm

re: #222 RogueOne

We have about 60 of them, what's one more? You sound a little hurt about this one though, Reid a relative of yours?

A relative of mine? No, what a dumbass question to ask.

The problem is that Reid, despite all his flaws, is sane. Angle, as documented pretty much everywhere, is certifiable. She opposes abortion even in rape/incest cases. Wants a federal amendment to ban same sex marriage everywhere (apparently her beloved states' rights and individual freedom have limits). The list of her insane and extreme positions go on. And now she will represent the gop in the Senate. Over time, that won't help the gop. She's the new Santorum.

234 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Tue, Oct 5, 2010 1:09:25pm

re: #230 Fat Bastard Vegetarian

Do you by any chance remember the name of the "Civil War Surgeon"? No matter what the illness or injury was... he sawed off body parts?

that was just Don, right?

235 RogueOne  Tue, Oct 5, 2010 1:09:45pm

re: #229 WindUpBird

I wonder if it would be as funny to you if Sharron Angle opposed adoption by Jewish people, just wondering

OH OH HO IT'S HILARIOUS WHEEE

Yeah, it's much better to have Reid in there to continue to use gay rights as a prop. I'd rather have someone tell me what they honestly believe, right or wrong, than have someone who lies to my face and then uses my issues to garner sympathy votes. Reid is a putz. We're no better off with Angle than we have been with Reid.

236 Artist  Tue, Oct 5, 2010 1:10:00pm

re: #232 iossarian

I thought the meme for blacks was that they were lazy.

237 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Tue, Oct 5, 2010 1:10:27pm

re: #230 Fat Bastard Vegetarian

Oops. It was Don...

Here's a clip...

238 Locker  Tue, Oct 5, 2010 1:11:06pm

re: #227 RogueOne

Tell me about it. Some guy refuses the insurance and then sets fire to his own house out of negligence and people still won't accept the fact that the rest of the county should pay for his stupidity. What is wrong with people? Where's the compassion for the lazy and the stupid? If they're cut, do they not bleed?

Yes this the typical right wing opinion. Change the example to something unrelated then argue against it. In fact I believe this mirror's a quote from an article earlier today...

[Link: thinkprogress.org...]

The world is full of jerks, freeloaders, and ingrates — and the problems they create for themselves are their own. These free-riders have no more right to South Fulton’s firefighting services than people in Muleshoe, Texas, have to those of NYPD detectives.

Anyone who can't pay is a jerk, freeloader and/or ingrate rather than a fellow human being and citizen. If you can't pay you don't deserve fire protection, health care, education, roads. These things are luxury items for the well off... Right Rogue?

239 RogueOne  Tue, Oct 5, 2010 1:11:45pm

re: #233 palomino

A relative of mine? No, what a dumbass question to ask.

The problem is that Reid, despite all his flaws, is sane. Angle, as documented pretty much everywhere, is certifiable. She opposes abortion even in rape/incest cases. Wants a federal amendment to ban same sex marriage everywhere (apparently her beloved states' rights and individual freedom have limits). The list of her insane and extreme positions go on. And now she will represent the gop in the Senate. Over time, that won't help the gop. She's the new Santorum.

Huh. I've read that. Too bad this election is about issues like the economy or you might have a point. Sane and incompetent is still incompetent. At least with Angle we get the crazy as a minor distraction to the incompetent.

240 iossarian  Tue, Oct 5, 2010 1:12:12pm

re: #235 RogueOne

Yeah, it's much better to have Reid in there to continue to use gay rights as a prop. I'd rather have someone tell me what they honestly believe, right or wrong, than have someone who lies to my face and then uses my issues to garner sympathy votes. Reid is a putz. We're no better off with Angle than we have been with Reid.

Seriously? If Sharon Angle said that Jewish people should be barred from adopting, you would still be saying "that's OK, it's all the same as Reid and his using Jewish rights as a prop"?

241 MinisterO  Tue, Oct 5, 2010 1:12:22pm

I'm in NV. The senate race might be funny if it weren't such a tragic failure of reason. Angle is a sociopath. If elected I expect she will do as much damage as possible before being ousted.

242 palomino  Tue, Oct 5, 2010 1:13:24pm

re: #224 WindUpBird

That thread about the fire being allowed to burn, was very interesting in the people who just would not back off their ideology in the face of the absolute failure of their ideology

Even when presented with the fact that the county will probably have well over $75 in cleanup costs and destruction to things like power and phone lines, as well as electric and gas meters.

But hey we proved a point: public servants serve us best when they robotically follow rules rather than using some basic creativity to solve a problem. Putting out the fire and then sending the family a bill would have been so tragic for the cause of libertarianism.

243 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Tue, Oct 5, 2010 1:14:08pm

re: #222 RogueOne

We have about 60 of them, what's one more? You sound a little hurt about this one though, Reid a relative of yours?

Hey, just wondering at what point we're allowed to be pissed that an obvious bigot might become a senator

I'm guessing when it's not just gay people, because I know we really don't matter that much, you're probably pretty used to your party slamming gay people

Again, if Sharron Angle were outright calling Jewish people brazen perverts and comparing them to murders, instead of gays...

maybe...

just maybe...

the laughs wouldn't be so loud

just a thought


But ejnoy the laughs while they last :)

244 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Tue, Oct 5, 2010 1:14:19pm

re: #235 RogueOne

Yeah, it's much better to have Reid in there to continue to use gay rights as a prop. I'd rather have someone tell me what they honestly believe, right or wrong, than have someone who lies to my face and then uses my issues to garner sympathy votes. Reid is a putz. We're no better off with Angle than we have been with Reid.

ahahaha wow

245 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Tue, Oct 5, 2010 1:15:32pm

re: #242 palomino

Even when presented with the fact that the county will probably have well over $75 in cleanup costs and destruction to things like power and phone lines, as well as electric and gas meters.

But hey we proved a point: public servants serve us best when they robotically follow rules rather than using some basic creativity to solve a problem. Putting out the fire and then sending the family a bill would have been so tragic for the cause of libertarianism.

Libertarians don't seem to understand that fires spread :D I guess they're all flush with the liberty of ignoring physics or something


When I have a dim view of libertarians, that's why, that thread is a perfect example of just the rank stupidity, just the mindlessness

246 palomino  Tue, Oct 5, 2010 1:16:15pm

re: #225 Killgore Trout

Internal Emails Suggest Palin to Run for President

I can't imagine her not running. Her trips to IA, SC, NH aren't an accident. And do you really think she'd miss out on all the action and attention? If she doesn't run, she's no longer the bright shining spokesmodel star of the gop.

247 RogueOne  Tue, Oct 5, 2010 1:16:50pm

re: #238 Locker

Yes this the typical right wing opinion. Change the example to something unrelated then argue against it. In fact I believe this mirror's a quote from an article earlier today...

[Link: thinkprogress.org...]

Anyone who can't pay is a jerk, freeloader and/or ingrate rather than a fellow human being and citizen. If you can't pay you don't deserve fire protection, health care, education, roads. These things are luxury items for the well off... Right Rogue?

Did the homeowner neglect to pay for the fire protection after being repeatedly reminded? Yes.

Did the homeowner set fire to his own property out of negligence? Yes.

Last year I paid almost $1500/mo in insurance because welding sometimes causes fires. This guy wasn't poor, He could afford the $75/yr, he was lazy. He didn't refuse to pay it or couldn't pay, according to him he just forgot even though he received reminders. He just assumed he'd get covered even if he hadn't paid.

Show me where I've stated anything that was unrelated to this issue. Someone mentions the word "privatize" (even though the word isn't relevant to this issue) and the left goes nuts.

248 MinisterO  Tue, Oct 5, 2010 1:16:53pm

re: #242 palomino

Good point. Letting the house burn is ultimately going to cost taxpayers a helluva lot more than putting out the fire would have.

Of course, delivering a FUCK YOU to freeloader is PRICELESS. Right?

249 Feline Emperor of the Conservative Waste  Tue, Oct 5, 2010 1:17:43pm

You wouldn't like one of your tanks to get BROKEN now would you?

250 RogueOne  Tue, Oct 5, 2010 1:18:00pm

re: #240 iossarian

Seriously? If Sharon Angle said that Jewish people should be barred from adopting, you would still be saying "that's OK, it's all the same as Reid and his using Jewish rights as a prop"?

I didn't say she was right, or her opinions were even valid, but WUB is the one who brought up gay adoptions. Reid has used gay rights issues as a prop and people are still willing to give him a pass because he "says the right things". I call bullshit.

251 palomino  Tue, Oct 5, 2010 1:19:35pm

re: #239 RogueOne

Huh. I've read that. Too bad this election is about issues like the economy or you might have a point. Sane and incompetent is still incompetent. At least with Angle we get the crazy as a minor distraction to the incompetent.

What makes you think Angle is competent? The mentally ill aren't usually competent (not even to stand trial, much less govern the country).

I'll take sane and incompetent over nuts and incompetent every time.

252 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Tue, Oct 5, 2010 1:20:41pm

I wonder if it's better to have an honest white supremacist in office rather than Harry Reid

because that seems to be where this is heading.


"Well, I don't like Reid's policy, let's give this extremist whose views are not unlike fundamentalist muslims, let's give her a try!"

"I know we profess to be vigilant against the menace of fundamentalist religious crazies, I know it's a very important thing here to be suspicous of radical islam, but I'm just going to turn my brain off when those same views come out of a white Christian woman. Because then, it's better! She's a republican! When republicans are extremists, it doesn't matter! It's cool!"

"I mean..Reid! He's like...he sucks or something! He's worse than a bigot! He's a democrat Rush Limbaugh instructed me to hate!"

253 RogueOne  Tue, Oct 5, 2010 1:21:23pm

re: #251 palomino

I didn't say she was competent, I said she was crazy and incompetent (or at least that was my meaning).

254 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Tue, Oct 5, 2010 1:21:55pm

re: #250 RogueOne

I didn't say she was right, or her opinions were even valid, but WUB is the one who brought up gay adoptions. Reid has used gay rights issues as a prop and people are still willing to give him a pass because he "says the right things". I call bullshit.

You wouldn't tolerate blood libel talk from a Republican and you know it


But when it comes to gays, eh, it's fine. Doesn't matter then, you'll still vote for her

255 palomino  Tue, Oct 5, 2010 1:22:54pm

re: #238 Locker

Yes this the typical right wing opinion. Change the example to something unrelated then argue against it. In fact I believe this mirror's a quote from an article earlier today...

[Link: thinkprogress.org...]

Anyone who can't pay is a jerk, freeloader and/or ingrate rather than a fellow human being and citizen. If you can't pay you don't deserve fire protection, health care, education, roads. These things are luxury items for the well off... Right Rogue?


What's wrong with you, bleeding heart lib?

Jesus, the compassionate stuff you're saying about fellow human beings sounds like Jesus.

256 prairiefire  Tue, Oct 5, 2010 1:23:37pm

Stocks end with big gains, Dow up nearly 200.

257 RogueOne  Tue, Oct 5, 2010 1:23:47pm

re: #252 WindUpBird

I wonder if it's better to have an honest white supremacist in office rather than Harry Reid

because that seems to be where this is heading.

"Well, I don't like Reid's policy, let's give this extremist whose views are not unlike fundamentalist muslims, let's give her a try!"

"I know we profess to be vigilant against the menace of fundamentalist religious crazies, I know it's a very important thing here to be suspicous of radical islam, but I'm just going to turn my brain off when those same views come out of a white Christian woman. Because then, it's better! She's a republican! When republicans are extremists, it doesn't matter! It's cool!"

"I mean..Reid! He's like...he sucks or something! He's worse than a bigot! He's a democrat Rush Limbaugh instructed me to hate!"

Reid uses groups as a prop. Toss them a bone once in awhile with flowery speech but doing nothing. Not only doing nothing but sending up a bill he KNOWS is important and KNOWS it doesn't stand a chance of passing because he'd rather use people for campaign ads. If that's all it takes to get you to vote for him that's fine, I think he's a two-faced dirtbag and he deserves to lose. Not only does he deserve to lose but he deserves to lose to possibly the worst candidate ever.

258 prairiefire  Tue, Oct 5, 2010 1:24:40pm

re: #257 RogueOne

No, he doesn't deserve to lose.

259 bratwurst  Tue, Oct 5, 2010 1:24:49pm

re: #46 sattv4u2

They carry the Broncos, games, the Rockies games and Colorado U games

those BASTARDS!!

Well that PROVES that KOA's other programming doesn't have a right wing slant.

*rolls eyes*

260 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Tue, Oct 5, 2010 1:25:02pm

At what point are our elected officials responsible for elevating the discourse

If someone in office nakedly hates a group of people

At what point can we actually say "under no circumstances will we vote for you, you're just a vile person and if we elect you, we're allowing that into Senate"

I guess for some people, that point is never

I'm trying to figure out what planet RougeOne is on that he believes a politician pandering to a group is the same as advocating stripping them of their rights and supporting a party (her independent party she was part of before the GOP welcomed her in) which just outright calls gay people murderers and brazen perverts

261 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Tue, Oct 5, 2010 1:25:42pm

re: #237 Fat Bastard Vegetarian

rad :D :D

262 RogueOne  Tue, Oct 5, 2010 1:25:53pm

re: #252 WindUpBird

I wonder if it's better to have an honest white supremacist in office rather than Harry Reid

because that seems to be where this is heading.

"Well, I don't like Reid's policy, let's give this extremist whose views are not unlike fundamentalist muslims, let's give her a try!"

"I know we profess to be vigilant against the menace of fundamentalist religious crazies, I know it's a very important thing here to be suspicous of radical islam, but I'm just going to turn my brain off when those same views come out of a white Christian woman. Because then, it's better! She's a republican! When republicans are extremists, it doesn't matter! It's cool!"

"I mean..Reid! He's like...he sucks or something! He's worse than a bigot! He's a democrat Rush Limbaugh instructed me to hate!"

And I seem to recall multiple instances of you standing up for "fundamentalist muslims". I've called you out on it more than once.

263 goddamnedfrank  Tue, Oct 5, 2010 1:27:51pm

re: #227 RogueOne

Tell me about it. Some guy refuses the insurance and then sets fire to his own house out of negligence and people still won't accept the fact that the rest of the county should pay for his stupidity. What is wrong with people? Where's the compassion for the lazy and the stupid? If they're cut, do they not bleed?

You're wrong on several key points:

1.) He had insurance, and his insurance company has agreed to pay him the full amount of his policy. He claims to have forgotten to pay the $75 city's service fee, so the fire department let his house burn, let his pets die, and let his neighbor's property become threatened before acting, even though he offered at the scene to pay whatever amount was deemed necessary.

2.) You are now accusing him of committing arson, a felony, with absolutely no evidence, he did not "set" the fire by any definition. Your attempts to blame the victim are extraordinary, repulsive, and antithetical to reality.

You are just brazenly lying, with no sense of personal dignity or integrity. Somebody has to say it, you are acting like trash.

264 RogueOne  Tue, Oct 5, 2010 1:28:26pm

re: #258 prairiefire

No, he doesn't deserve to lose.

Why? What has he done in the last 4 years as majority leader that has been effective? He's been a disaster, he's dragging down the entire dem party, and for all of that he deserves to be re-elected?

265 palomino  Tue, Oct 5, 2010 1:29:38pm

re: #245 WindUpBird

Libertarians don't seem to understand that fires spread :D I guess they're all flush with the liberty of ignoring physics or something

When I have a dim view of libertarians, that's why, that thread is a perfect example of just the rank stupidity, just the mindlessness

Libertarianism is a great intellectual exercise for college students who like philosophy/poli sci seminars. I can remember discussing it in several classes.

It has a certain seductive simplicity: "I leave you alone, you leave me alone. We thus maximize liberty." But then real life--with its oil spills and Wall St. meltdowns and contaminated eggs, etc.--intrudes and exposes the folly of libertarianism.

266 RogueOne  Tue, Oct 5, 2010 1:30:45pm

re: #263 goddamnedfrank

You're wrong on several key points:

1.) He had insurance, and his insurance company has agreed to pay him the full amount of his policy. He claims to have forgotten to pay the $75 city's service fee, so the fire department let his house burn, let his pets die, and let his neighbor's property become threatened before acting, even though he offered at the scene to pay whatever amount was deemed necessary.

2.) You are now accusing him of committing arson, a felony, with absolutely no evidence, he did not "set" the fire by any definition. Your attempts to blame the victim are extraordinary, repulsive, and antithetical to reality.

You are just brazenly lying, with no sense of personal dignity or integrity. Somebody has to say it, you are acting like trash.

1. I didn't accuse him of arson, I accused him of negligence. He was burning trash and started a fire, that's negligence not arson.

2. He neglected to pay for the added insurance of fire protection. He isn't poor or destitute, it wasn't legally required, he just failed. (BTW, I mentioned this morning that his insurance company would be forced to pay)

So tell me again, this time slowly, how this is a failure of "privatization".

267 prairiefire  Tue, Oct 5, 2010 1:31:37pm

re: #264 RogueOne

Why? What has he done in the last 4 years as majority leader that has been effective? He's been a disaster, he's dragging down the entire dem party, and for all of that he deserves to be re-elected?

He's helped lead this senate to accomplish much of President Obama's legislative agenda.[Link: globaleconomy.foreignpolicyblogs.com...]

268 RogueOne  Tue, Oct 5, 2010 1:31:45pm

re: #266 RogueOne

keep that thought in mind, I have to run.

269 RogueOne  Tue, Oct 5, 2010 1:32:16pm

re: #267 prairiefire

He's helped lead this senate to accomplish much of President Obama's legislative agenda.[Link: globaleconomy.foreignpolicyblogs.com...]

Which has caused the dems to sink in the polls so badly they're looking at '94 as "the good ol' days".

270 jaunte  Tue, Oct 5, 2010 1:33:01pm

re: #228 Stanley Sea

Here's the email - Todd Palin blasts Joe Miller
Way to go Mudflats!

[Link: mudflats.files.wordpress.com...]

According to that email, Todd Palin writes: "Sarah spent all morning working on a Face book post for Joe, she won't use it, not now."

If she spent all morning working on a single Facebook post, the Presidency of the U.S. is going to be way too complicated.

271 palomino  Tue, Oct 5, 2010 1:33:35pm

re: #248 MinisterO

Good point. Letting the house burn is ultimately going to cost taxpayers a helluva lot more than putting out the fire would have.

Of course, delivering a FUCK YOU to freeloader is PRICELESS. Right?

Another thing that's left out is the danger of letting a house fire just burn itself out. Toxic chemicals, propane tanks and all kinds of other shit can get released into the air or just blow up. Regardless, the taxpayers, as you said, will be on the hook for more than 75 clams. Ahh, the irony of dogmatic libertarianism.

272 allegro  Tue, Oct 5, 2010 1:35:33pm

re: #269 RogueOne

Which has caused the dems to sink in the polls so badly they're looking at '94 as "the good ol' days".

What polls are you looking at??

273 palomino  Tue, Oct 5, 2010 1:36:09pm

re: #250 RogueOne

I didn't say she was right, or her opinions were even valid, but WUB is the one who brought up gay adoptions. Reid has used gay rights issues as a prop and people are still willing to give him a pass because he "says the right things". I call bullshit.

But here's the thing. Reid won't lead the charge for a const. amendment to ban all same sex marriages. Angle will.

Who's on the wrong side of history there? Angle, and just as much as if she opposed interracial marriage in the 60s.

And many of the rest of her ideas are just as deranged.

274 palomino  Tue, Oct 5, 2010 1:37:07pm

re: #253 RogueOne

I didn't say she was competent, I said she was crazy and incompetent (or at least that was my meaning).

Well, how is that any better than Reid, unless you're a tea partier? And I don't get the sense you are.

275 MinisterO  Tue, Oct 5, 2010 1:37:16pm

re: #257 RogueOne

Not only does he deserve to lose but he deserves to lose to possibly the worst candidate ever.

Elections are about choosing people to run the country. Those who would elect "possibly the worst candidate ever," "insane" and "incompetent" Sharon Angle, just to see Harry Reid get what "he deserves," are not patriots but hate-filled zealots.

276 allegro  Tue, Oct 5, 2010 1:39:56pm

re: #275 MinisterO

Elections are about choosing people to run the country. Those who would elect "possibly the worst candidate ever," "insane" and "incompetent" Sharon Angle, just to see Harry Reid get what "he deserves," are not patriots but hate-filled zealots.

This. If only I had more dings to give...

277 palomino  Tue, Oct 5, 2010 1:40:18pm

re: #257 RogueOne

Reid uses groups as a prop. Toss them a bone once in awhile with flowery speech but doing nothing. Not only doing nothing but sending up a bill he KNOWS is important and KNOWS it doesn't stand a chance of passing because he'd rather use people for campaign ads. If that's all it takes to get you to vote for him that's fine, I think he's a two-faced dirtbag and he deserves to lose. Not only does he deserve to lose but he deserves to lose to possibly the worst candidate ever.

Yes, that was a shitty thing. But let's be clear: the Dems play gays this way, and the (old) gop plays socons this way. An extremist retard like Angle is a step backward, unless ideology is the only criteria for voting.

278 goddamnedfrank  Tue, Oct 5, 2010 1:42:18pm

re: #266 RogueOne

1. I didn't accuse him of arson, I accused him of negligence. He was burning trash and started a fire, that's negligence not arson.

His grandson was burning the trash, not him. Burning shit happens, fire departments are tasked with putting it out.

2. He neglected to pay for the added insurance subscription of fire protection. He isn't poor or destitute, it wasn't legally required, he just failed. (BTW, I mentioned this morning that his insurance company would be forced to pay)

So tell me again, this time slowly, how this is a failure of "privatization".

It's a failure of the subscription model in an officious, callous, myopic bureaucracy, which you somehow find necessary to defend tooth and nail.

279 palomino  Tue, Oct 5, 2010 1:43:41pm

re: #264 RogueOne

Why? What has he done in the last 4 years as majority leader that has been effective? He's been a disaster, he's dragging down the entire dem party, and for all of that he deserves to be re-elected?

That's a good rationale for re-electing him and then replacing him as the Dem leader in the Senate with some other Dem. Not a good rationale for replacing him with a mentally challenged tea partier.

280 palomino  Tue, Oct 5, 2010 1:48:04pm

re: #269 RogueOne

Which has caused the dems to sink in the polls so badly they're looking at '94 as "the good ol' days".

You're buying into Fox spin. The drop in the polls was due to the manner in which the legislation was passed. Not because it's too liberal for the US. Check out the new Pew research. Nearly 40% of HCR opponents oppose it from the left.

The big drop in polls is due to the crappy economy. Obama and Congress promised to fix it, so they will get hammered as it still sucks.

281 palomino  Tue, Oct 5, 2010 1:50:44pm

re: #275 MinisterO

Elections are about choosing people to run the country. Those who would elect "possibly the worst candidate ever," "insane" and "incompetent" Sharon Angle, just to see Harry Reid get what "he deserves," are not patriots but hate-filled zealots.

Kinda ties in with the "let it burn" perspective: it's more important to prove a point than to do something rational or, God forbid, compassionate.

282 Fozzie Bear  Tue, Oct 5, 2010 1:53:58pm

It takes a truly shitty human being to defend racists, homophobic, theocratic zealots because you are angry. It takes a complete failure of a human being to advocate for fire departments refusing to put out fires, even if the man is willing to pay for the service.

Wingnuts: like real people, but without a soul.

283 Obdicut  Tue, Oct 5, 2010 2:07:18pm

re: #266 RogueOne


So tell me again, this time slowly, how this is a failure of "privatization".

Try asking someone who did.

284 Obdicut  Tue, Oct 5, 2010 2:09:50pm

re: #247 RogueOne

Did the homeowner neglect to pay for the fire protection after being repeatedly reminded? Yes.

How repeatedly?

He didn't refuse to pay it or couldn't pay, according to him he just forgot even though he received reminders. He just assumed he'd get covered even if he hadn't paid.

These two sentences are actually contradictory. If he forgot to pay, he forgot about the issue, he didn't assume anything.

285 webevintage  Tue, Oct 5, 2010 2:16:53pm

It really does not matter if the guy forgot to pay or did not pay on purpose.

You don't let a someones house burn the ground.
You.Just.Don't.

(I can't even comment on what kind of a monster you have to be to let a house burn down with pets inside if you had the equipment to put the fire out....)

286 What, me worry?  Tue, Oct 5, 2010 2:18:47pm

re: #266 RogueOne

1. I didn't accuse him of arson, I accused him of negligence. He was burning trash and started a fire, that's negligence not arson.

2. He neglected to pay for the added insurance of fire protection. He isn't poor or destitute, it wasn't legally required, he just failed. (BTW, I mentioned this morning that his insurance company would be forced to pay)

So tell me again, this time slowly, how this is a failure of "privatization".

You say he purposefully set fire to his house "out of negligence." So what you're saying is he purposefully set fire to his house accidentally. You make no sense.

Was the man an arsonist? Did he douse his house in gasoline and light a match? No, he didn't. All fires except those set by arsonists ARE OUT OF NEGLIGENCE. You knock over a candle, accident. You don't fix faulty wiring, accident. Fall asleep with a cig, accident. You don't understand this?

When has the fire dept ever been concerned how a fire was started when determining whether they should put it out? Oh sorry buddy, cigarette smoking is bad for you. We can't put that fire out. ??

Btw, that's why you have taxes to pay for public services. So no one forgets or the payment gets lost or they don't send it to you or a million of other reasons why that payment may not get to the city.

287 What, me worry?  Tue, Oct 5, 2010 2:22:01pm

Btw, I didn't follow up on the article, but how did it come to be that they had to pay for fire (and police, too?) by direct billing? Did they vote on this? Was it one of those funny worded votes where you vote NO and it really means YES? I don't get how anybody can be this freakin ignorant.

288 Mentis Fugit  Tue, Oct 5, 2010 2:46:23pm

re: #257 RogueOne

Not only does he deserve to lose but he deserves to lose to possibly the worst candidate ever.

Are you familiar with the expression "cutting off your nose to spite your face"?

If I have to choose between a raw onion and a turd, I'm not going to eat the turd just because the onion will make me cry.

289 ClaudeMonet  Tue, Oct 5, 2010 7:22:59pm

re: #104 funky chicken

WOW:

The good news is that this guy will be punished more harshly and will serve more time under the UCMJ than he would under the civilian justice system.

[Link: www.msnbc.msn.com...]

Doing something like that is sick. Defying a written order from your CO is stupid.

290 ClaudeMonet  Tue, Oct 5, 2010 7:32:27pm

re: #175 Gus 802

43% Hickenlooper (D), 35% Tancredo (C), 16% Maes (R)

35 + 16 = 51 > 43

You are assuming that all of Maes' support would go to Tancredo. It ain't necessarily so.

291 ClaudeMonet  Tue, Oct 5, 2010 7:40:51pm

re: #190 Radicchio ad Absurdum

I thought he was great as Perry Mason, but what do I know?

/

But that Burr was gay (OH NOOOO!).

re: #203 WindUpBird


The proof that it's mostly rubes and ancient people with oxygen tanks who listen to right wing talk radio is that guys with zero talent and zero show like G Gordon Liddy and Mark Levin still have a show, just totally worthless and skill-less as broadcasters but the ideology matches the fools who listen, so hey, game on. That's the 65 to dead demo, they simply will listen to anything that reflects their prejudices

Hey, when Liddy was on in my area, I listened to him and enjoyed it. I didn't believe his opinions, but he was entertaining.

re: #217 RogueOne

I know most of you won't find this funny but I'm LOVING this race:

[Link: www.realclearpolitics.com...]

Both CNN and Fox have Angle leading. LOLOLOL. This could end up being the best race EVER.

RCP's consensus has it too close to call, really, but the numbers say Reid is on top.

Which is how it should be, according to wingnut authorities on sex.

292 Vambo  Tue, Oct 5, 2010 7:49:33pm

re: #288 Mentis Fugit

Are you familiar with the expression "cutting off your nose to spite your face"?

If I have to choose between a raw onion and a turd, I'm not going to eat the turd just because the onion will make me cry.

good one.

I can't believe some of the fatalistic old bastards here -- they say they hate the Dems so much, they'd cheer for the "worst candidate ever". Hey idiots, you're not just fucking with the "dems" and "libs", everyone in the country will be affected by whoever takes office.

Why Do You Hate America?

293 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Tue, Oct 5, 2010 8:09:14pm

re: #291 ClaudeMonet

Liddy? Blugh. Liddy reads the newspaper on the air and has the flattest affect, no show prep, just farts his way down whatever his producer prepped for him, he got the show because he was already a name and had cred from all the crusty old republicans who thought Nixon was awesome (Tom leykis' bit about convicted felon in his own show intro, that was referring to liddy)

I think after listening to Phil hendrie, I cannot go back to normal radio shows, it's like driving a supercar and then going back to a Nissan Stanza

294 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Tue, Oct 5, 2010 8:10:09pm

re: #286 marjoriemoon

You say he purposefully set fire to his house "out of negligence." So what you're saying is he purposefully set fire to his house accidentally. You make no sense.

Was the man an arsonist? Did he douse his house in gasoline and light a match? No, he didn't. All fires except those set by arsonists ARE OUT OF NEGLIGENCE. You knock over a candle, accident. You don't fix faulty wiring, accident. Fall asleep with a cig, accident. You don't understand this?

When has the fire dept ever been concerned how a fire was started when determining whether they should put it out? Oh sorry buddy, cigarette smoking is bad for you. We can't put that fire out. ??

Btw, that's why you have taxes to pay for public services. So no one forgets or the payment gets lost or they don't send it to you or a million of other reasons why that payment may not get to the city.

this really should be self evident to everyone, oh well


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