arrrgherfic

219-212 Who were the R's, and were they coal state R's?

Here's to hoping the Senate has enough sense that if the bill contains the name "Waxman" They should run far, far away.

Bastards!

I don't believe it will get through the Senate.

This gives Nancy Pelosi her beauty pageant win- no more than that.

Republicans who voted for Cap & Tax:
Bono Mack, Castle, McHugh, LoBiondo, Lance, Kirk, Reichert, Smith (NJ)

Here's the R's who voted for this :

Bono Mack
Castle
Kirk
Lance
LoBiondo
McHugh
Reichert
Smith (NJ)

h/t hot air

I went with the Cab for those interested.

The beginning of the end...

Fail!. Fail!. Fail!.

These idiots have no idea what they have just done, let alone just read the bill.

Just got a Tweet that says

' Dear Congress: You Cap Us, We Trade U'.

re: #6 cronus

Republicans who voted for Cap & Tax:
Bono Mack, Castle, McHugh, LoBiondo, Lance, Kirk, Reichert, Smith (NJ)

re: #7 Thanos

Here's the R's who voted for this :

Bono Mack
Castle
Kirk
Lance
LoBiondo
McHugh
Reichert
Smith (NJ)

h/t hot air

They should be facing challengers for their seats within the party next year.

It's the end of the world as we know it!

that last para about the Senate version gives me some hope.

Thought your power bill wasn't high enough? This will fix that problem for you.

Charles,

I'm honestly interested in your opinion on this.

Is Mandy Here? We need her catchphrase.

re: #13 Sharmuta

Never heard of any of 'em. and I bet they're all from some NE liberal district.
Or some SW liberal district.
Not from anywhere rational.
The scary thing is how few of 'em it took to push it over, dammit.

So much for representing the people.....Boehner was great to watch, but the preview was way better than the main attraction (-:

re: #17 CynicalConservative

Charles,

I'm honestly interested in your opinion on this.

I obviously have my own opinion based on comment history.

Frist we have Regina Spektor, a wonderful representative of the Jewish people. And then we have Henry Waxman, an embarrassment.

re: #2 Thanos

219-212 Who were the R's, and were they coal state R's?

Bono Mack
Castle
Kirk
Lance
LoBiondo
McHugh
Smith (NJ)

[Link: clerk.house.gov...]

re: #13 Sharmuta

They should be facing challengers for their seats within the party next year.

I'm going to bet they aren't up for re election in 2010 for the most part

re: #23 McJenny50

Maybe we should send kudos to the Dems who voted no.......

Cap-and-Trade
Crap-and-Fail

You M*&%$#er F*#$@ing Asswipes!
Why do they hate America?

I work in a business that REQUIRES a certain amount of electricity. Broadcasting. Have put a good deal of my life into it, and am now vested in the company I work for.

We cannot turn our transmitters down, as it would simply mean decreased coverage area.

We cannot pass the cost on to consumers, as our clients are advertisers who are already strapped for cash. Media and advertising is already eviscerated-- not by "new media," but by this recession.

We are done if this becomes law-- our margin is paper-thin as it is, and we're doing better than most, as we cater to niche markets.

re: #7 Thanos

Here's the R's who voted for this :

Bono Mack
Castle
Kirk
Lance
LoBiondo
McHugh
Reichert
Smith (NJ)

h/t hot air

Where can I see the entire list?

I am having a hard time coming up with something to say that won't get me banned from lizarddom for eternity.

re: #25 tradewind

Think I will

John Boehner did as good a job of summing up as he could possibly do and I can't believe that after that people STILL voted for it

re: #28 astronmr20

I work in a business that REQUIRES a certain amount of electricity. Broadcasting. Have put a good deal of my life into it, and am now vested in the company I work for.

We cannot turn our transmitters down, as it would simply mean decreased coverage area.

We cannot pass the cost on to consumers, as our clients are advertisers who are already strapped for cash. Media and advertising is already eviscerated-- not by "new media," but by this recession.

We are done if this becomes law-- our margin is paper-thin as it is, and we're doing better than most, as we cater to niche markets.

Don't worry. The fairness doctrine will insure a swift end to any suffering your industry may experience as a result of this bill.

re: #30 astronmr20

Here, have a glass of wine. It's helping me.

I normally dont like Glen Beck very much with his fake Hillary tears and all, but he seems to be saying things I agree with on this one. Follow the money....where's it going?

I listened to a good portion of the "debate" this afternoon. There were times when I thought blood would shoot out of my eyes!

For example, I heard one Dem saying that this legislation would reduce the frequency, duration, and intensity of hurricanes. No, really!

Another Dem said this would prevent us from "shedding any more blood" trying to take oil away from another country in the Middle East.

Finally, a Republican offered a lame amendment calling for a new Manhattan Project. Every time I hear that term tossed out, it makes me want to laugh (or cry).

Real Manhattan Project: the luminaries of nuclear physics approached our Gov't and said, "Here's the science. Please give us the money to develop it or some other country will develop it first."

"New Manhattan Project": throw a bunch of money at the scientists and hope for the best. Ugh!

Here are the Republicans who could have turned the vote the other way:

Bono Mack, Castle, Kirk, Lance, LoBiondo, McHugh, Reichert, Smith(NJ)

Two Republicans didn't vote: Flake and Sullivan.

On to the Senate...

If it passes more business will fail or wont be able to compete with countries like China. Business will go there. They don't care at all about pollution. China is the largest user of coal in the world.

Can we hope they fail yet?

Passage of waxman-like legislation in the Senate virtually guarantees a further reduction in production from coal and will result in a commodity price spike (ala what we've seen in oil) when we finally see a turn in the economy.

The Democrats will choke off any recovery with sharply higher energy costs. They now own the $4/$5 gallon gas and higher electric rates that we'll see in the next year or so.

re: #34 shifty

I normally dont like Glen Beck very much with his fake Hillary tears and all, but he seems to be saying things I agree with on this one. Follow the money....where's it going?

Always follow the money!

I'm getting pretty discouraged about the direction our country is going.

Are you seeing this, too?

re: #24 Thanos

I'm going to bet they aren't up for re election in 2010 for the most part

I think we should vote all the bums out, but that's just me.

re: #36 HelloDare

India is another viable option. Very viable.

still has to go to the Senate

300 hundred pages added at three in the morning and they still vote yeah. Never read it and don't care. Our forefathers must be rolling in their graves. We're leading alright, leading the world into a depression.

The kicker for me is THEY HAVEN'T EVEN READ THE BILL.

re: #13 Sharmuta

They should be facing challengers for their seats within the party next year.

Primary out these prix.

I keep imagining that living in America will soon be like living in Russia. Except we won't be able to afford to run the space heaters.

You do not have thermostats in the apartments, you control heating and cooling by opening or closing a window. I bought a small space heater that heated my apartment very well.

Living in Russia

re: #44 oronpam

300 hundred pages added at three in the morning and they still vote yeah. Never read it and don't care. Our forefathers must be rolling in their graves. We're leading alright, leading the world into a depression.

Yeah, but it's for the kiiiiiiiiiiiidddddddddddddssssssssssssssss...!1

////// are there really enough...

We don't have the ability to completely clean the slate in the Senate, but we can do it in the House every two years. Maybe it's time we did vote every incumbent out.

re: #43 Cannadian Club Akbar

still has to go to the Senate

Where it will inevitably be amended before a vote in order to pay off members of the Senate so they'll pass it.

Fuck you, John McCain for supporting this legislation.

re: #44 oronpam

300 hundred pages added at three in the morning and they still vote yeah. Never read it and don't care. Our forefathers must be rolling in their graves. We're leading alright, leading the world into a depression.

What happened to Obama's promise to give America 3 days to review every piece of legislation? Or was that Nancy who promised that? How many other promises will they break?

re: #45 Floral Giraffe

The kicker for me is THEY HAVEN'T EVEN READ THE BILL.

Because they don't give an shit about this country.

re: #45 Floral Giraffe

The kicker for me is THEY HAVEN'T EVEN READ THE BILL.

It's like deja vu.

re: #18 DaddyG

Is Mandy Here? We need her catchphrase.

What Mandy said......

Flake and Sullivan.

Sounds like a traveling road show. How ironic is it that Flake flaked out.....

There's a long lecture I posted last night about how the demand for Low sulfur diesel in Europe helped to drive us into the recession we are coming out of. Its' well worth watching because there are a lot of arcane facts that they pundits don't tell you in this hour long lecture and q / a session, I recommend watching.

We now have this as well as the shipping diesel mandate coming up...

They are just warming up, next up is socialized health care, and amnesty for illegal aliens...the twin daggers through the heart.

I read somewhere that the bill has a provision for increasing unemployment benefits for the expected unemployment the bill will cause. Brilliant

Maybe I picked the wrong turn of the century to stop drinking. //

re: #51 Racer X

What happened to Obama's promise to give America 3 days to review every piece of legislation? Or was that Nancy who promised that? How many other promises will they break?

He won.

re: #45 Floral Giraffe

They have interns, it's all good......
/sarc/

re: #51 Racer X

I lost count on how many times that promise was broken....media silent.

After some recent travel through the Left Coast I believe all of our problems will be resolved if corporations would just start calling themselves cooperatives.

I'm hoping for failure

Hope and change aint gonna pay my bills.

re: #62 oronpam

I lost count on how many times that promise was broken....media silent.

See my #60

re: #47 WinterCat

I keep imagining that living in America will soon be like living in Russia. Except we won't be able to afford to run the space heaters.

Living in Russia

“We can’t drive our SUVs and eat as much as we want and keep our homes on 72 degrees at all times … and then just expect that other countries are going to say OK,” Obama said.

“That’s not leadership. That’s not going to happen,” he added.

re: #64 Spartacus50

I'm hoping for failure

I'm doing a voo-doo dance for failure.

re: #51 Racer X

It's a chess game, you see.
///////////// (like I needed it)

re: #57 grahamski

They are just warming up, next up is socialized health care, and amnesty for illegal aliens...the twin daggers through the heart.

And an exodus of any one who can leave hauling anchor

Our refining capacity is already razor thin.

/hey, I've got an idea, let's make refining ridiculously expensive in the U.S., I wonder what will happen?

I turned on Fox news for coverage of the vote: it's still Michael Jackson coverage.

re: #32 DaddyG

Don't worry. The fairness doctrine will insure a swift end to any suffering your industry may experience as a result of this bill.

Yeah, because you won't hear about it.

Who stands to gain from such legislation? It's 5:49 PM my time and I'm thinking whiskey and beer.

Unchecked liberalism run amok. Thus begins Endgame

re: #71 Killian Bundy

Our refining capacity is already razor thin.

/hey, I've got an idea, let's make refining ridiculously expensive in the U.S., I wonder what will happen?

Gee, maybe someone should see about building more refineries?

Wait, what am I thinking? Sorry about that.

re: #72 BatGuano

I turned on Fox news for coverage of the vote: it's still Michael Jackson coverage.

Pedophile worship trumps America's future.

re: #34 shifty

Glen Beck is a dangerous individual, a fascist in the making. He is a hater of Israel. When the nation tires of Obama's false hopes, I fear it will turn to a kook like Beck for guidance.

As an advocate of doing something sensible about global warming, and taking it seriously, I oppose this bill. Cap and trade is an open invitation to massive corruption.

Who gets an initial allowance? On what terms are trades conducted? Does one man's promise to plant a forest in the Sahara count as an offset, while another's is indignantly rejected for the transparent fraud that it is?

If we are to do something about rising CO2 levels, we might start by developing the technology to substitute solar for coal. In the meantime, we could seize such straws as are available: build more wind power, emphasize efficiency in the use of energy, make our buildings so they capture the sun in winter and reflect it in summer, etc.

If desperate measures are called for, we might do them honestly and just enact a carbon tax. Burning any fossil fuel would cost, in direct proportion to the carbon content of that fuel. Importing anything made abroad would cost, in direct proportion to the carbon content implicit in the thing made.

(Failure to include this second provision would just outsource all energy-intensive industry, forcing it offshore to where things are less efficient, energywise, but more efficient, economically, because they escape taxation.)

But then we get into the weeds---what about things made with hydropower? But what about things made with hydropower, or so they say, when every other part of the exporting nation's economy runs on coal? Energy is fungible. Who can say what fraction of the electricity used to make this or that ton of steel came from hydro?

The current bill has not even attempted to think through these complexities, which are multiplied in a cap and trade regime. What is to prevent the construction of factories right on the Canadian border, drawing their electricity from Quebec Hydro, while Quebec supplies its own industry from newly built coal-fired plants? The electricity would technically be "clean", so there would be no carbon emissions. Riiiiggghhhtt.

What is to prevent an outsourcing of almost every energy-intensive activity to Brazil, China, etc.? These economies are not as efficient as our own, and world CO2 emissions will soar as a result of the perverse incentives built into our cap-and-trade law, but we will be able to preen. WE don't emit as much CO2 as we used to.

re: #72 BatGuano

I turned on Fox news for coverage of the vote: it's still Michael Jackson coverage.

Of course it is. They're no better than any other msm outlet.

the pressure on taxpayers will become too much...tea parties will seem so innocent....inflation, rising unemployment and a vanishing American dream will piss off a hell of alot of people...and it's all contrived and premeditated

re: #77 Racer X

Pedophile worship trumps America's future.

Very sadly, it's true.

re: #26 HelloDare

Cap-and-Trade
Crap-and-Fail

Crap-and-trade......ers.

it’s weak legislation that won’t fix anything

/enacting any cap and trade scheme that doesn't at least include China and India is just so much pointless economic suicide on our part

re: #74 Idle Drifter

Who stands to gain from such legislation? It's 5:49 PM my time and I'm thinking whiskey and beer.

7:00 and I'm hitting the vodka.

re: #58 beens21

I read somewhere that the bill has a provision for increasing unemployment benefits for the expected unemployment the bill will cause. Brilliant

Please tell me you forgot the sarc tag... nuts.

re: #80 Sharmuta

Of course it is. They're no better than any other msm outlet.

"Look at the silly monkey!"

/mfmsm chewbacca defense

re: #72 BatGuano

I turned on Fox news for coverage of the vote: it's still Michael Jackson coverage.

We'll hear more about the frickin autopsy than we will this bill.

re: #83 VegasRick

Crap-and-trade......ers traitors.

re: #50 astronmr20

Where it will inevitably be amended before a vote in order to pay off members of the Senate so they'll pass it.

Fuck you, John McCain for supporting this legislation.

We have a Senator in Florida who is retiring, so I don't trust him. Then we have Bill Nelson who was an astronaut, which is cool, but he doesn't want to drill. Nelson said the military needs the Gulf of Mexico as a bombing range, so national security is at risk. Funny, going green will take many years and more money goes to our enemies friends. Get a GOD DAMNED CLUE!

re: #47 WinterCat

I keep imagining that living in America will soon be like living in Russia. Except we won't be able to afford to run the space heaters.

Living in Russia

3 dog nights might be the norm come winter time. Best start investing in dogs and getting use to them sleeping on or under your covers.

re: #85 Cathypop

7:00 and I'm hitting the vodka.

Anybody have any Valliums?

re: #72 BatGuano

I turned on Fox news for coverage of the vote: it's still Michael Jackson coverage.

The good stuff like the custody battle of his 'whiter than I am' children hasnt even started yet.

re: #24 Thanos

If they;re just Reps, don't they have to run every two years?
Good old Congress. Our mayor is resigning next week one step ahead of the Fibbies, and says he thinks he'll run for Congress.
It's a time honored tradition down here... that's how we got rid of Marion Barry and Al Gore.
Sent them to DC.

re: #58 beens21

I read somewhere that the bill has a provision for increasing unemployment benefits for the expected unemployment the bill will cause. Brilliant

But queen pelosi says it will create jobs....

rolls eyes...

re: #80 Sharmuta

Of course it is. They're no better than any other msm outlet.

agreed...is this news to anyone here?....talk about not paying attention

re: #79 lostlakehiker

Dont worry. I hear we plan to borrow money from China to pay South American companies not to cut down trees to offset our carbon output. What could go wrong?

/

The economic impact of the new draft varies from that of the original draft in several major ways:

• Compared to no cap and trade, real GDP losses increase an additional $2 trillion, from $7.4 trillion under the original draft to $9.6 trillion under the new draft;

• Compared to no cap and trade, average unemployment increases an additional 261,000 jobs, from 844,000 lost jobs under the original draft to 1,105,000 lost jobs under the new draft; and

• Peak-year unemployment losses rise by 500,000 jobs, from 2 million under the original draft to 2.5 million under the new draft.

When there is no economy, we'll have very little pollution.

BRILLIANT!

re: #45 Floral Giraffe

The kicker for me is THEY HAVEN'T EVEN READ THE BILL.

they never read o's bills.
it is disgraceful how they are so bamboozled by this nobody.
we need to fight this commie.
he will keep grabbing until we are a 3rd world de-developed nation.
think hand to mouth living in huts eating dirt for a snack.

re: #80 Sharmuta

I become more disappointed each time I watch it. It used to be the place for serious news that others would not cover. Now it is inconsequential fluff.

re: #92 DEZes

Don't do it..... you could end up like Michael.

I just need to find out if and how Vern Buchanon voted. Went to redstate.com and politico. So far nothing.

Taking the chihuahuas for a walk. They have a much keener insight into the economy than our Congress, so I might feel better upon my return.

If Chewbacca does not live in Neverland Ranch you must vote for this bill.

re: #85 Cathypop

7:00 and I'm hitting the vodka.

Immediately following the election, some LGF wag said, "I hope He can turn water into wine 'cause I plan to stay drunk for the next four years."

Budweiser long necks for me tonight: Bottoms up!

re: #85 Cathypop

7:00 and I'm hitting the vodka.

I'm drinking mojitos. They're tasty and we're all going to be drinking them soon enough anyway.

re: #51 Racer X

What happened to Obama's promise to give America 3 days to review every piece of legislation? Or was that Nancy who promised that? How many other promises will they break?

Heh, transparency in government.

//////////////

re: #91 Idle Drifter

Not a bad idea.

re: #94 tradewind

If they;re just Reps, don't they have to run every two years?
Good old Congress. Our mayor is resigning next week one step ahead of the Fibbies, and says he thinks he'll run for Congress.
It's a time honored tradition down here... that's how we got rid of Marion Barry and Al Gore.
Sent them to DC.

Yep, you are right, for some reason I thought they staggered them.

re: #51 Racer X

What happened to Obama's promise to give America 3 days to review every piece of legislation? Or was that Nancy who promised that? How many other promises will they break?

He read it. F**k, he basically wrote it.

And He Is America.

Therefore.......

///sarc + Obamabat pretzelogic

/I'll be more coherent next post

cheers

eon

It's for damn sure that his corpse got a more thorough examination.....

re: #99 nyc redneck

they never read o's bills.
it is disgraceful how they are so bamboozled by this nobody.
we need to fight this commie.
he will keep grabbing until we are a 3rd world de-developed nation.
think hand to mouth living in huts eating dirt for a snack.

I got me a nitrous injector for car and a hockey mask. Working on my "Just walk away" speech, so I figure I'm all set.

re: #95 grahamski

But queen pelosi says it will create jobs....

rolls eyes...

It will create jobs, in China.

It will die in the Senate-- a slow, lonely death. Move along citizens. Nuthin to see here.

re: #78 garden18

Glen Beck is a dangerous individual, a fascist in the making. He is a hater of Israel.

I think Beck is a nut too,

But where in the hell did you get that notion?

re: #86 DaddyG

Please tell me you forgot the sarc tag... nuts.

Also increasing Earned Income Credit refunds ....for those with no children.

re: #103 ArmyWife

Taking the chihuahuas for a walk. They have a much keener insight into the economy than our Congress, so I might feel better upon my return.

How do you take a chihuahua for a walk? Seriously! And why?

re: #106 shifty

Carta Blanca, since that's what we've just given those dipsticks.

re: #92 DEZes

Anybody have any Valliums?

Kennedy does!
And they even rallied a few lawmakers to come to Washington who hadn't appeared here in weeks.

Rep. Patrick Kennedy (D-R.I.) came in to vote for the plan after committing himself to rehab a few weeks ago. He's struggled with alcohol and medication addiction.

[Link: www.foxnews.com...]

re: #106 shifty

I'm drinking mojitos. They're tasty and we're all going to be drinking them soon enough anyway.

No--I will never surrender my Scotch! Single-malt Rules!

re: #93 shifty

The good stuff like the custody battle of his 'whiter than I am' children hasnt even started yet.

He died $400 million in the hole. Who wants that inheritance?

I mean, other than us taxpayers...

Is there anyone left on the planet who doubts that MJ was a pedophile? Why does he get a pass? Was he a "good" pedophile?

I don't get it.

re: #114 calcajun

From your keyboard......

Drinkers ready your glasses!

re: #86 DaddyG

thought it was obvious.

re: #117 Cathypop

How do you take a chihuahua for a walk? Seriously! And why?

To feed the alligators, of course.

re: #87 ArchangelMichael

"Look at the silly monkey!"

/mfmsm chewbacca defense

Look! Over there! Something shiny!

My favorite:

I can make a firm pledge, under my plan, no family making less than $250,000 a year will see any form of tax increase. Not your income tax, not your payroll tax, not your capital gains taxes, not any of your taxes.

Cap and trade? I firmly pledge that it is not a tax. Really. Where does that say tax? I pledge it is not. Really. It is, uh, cap! And, uh, trade!

re: #78 garden18

Glen Beck is a dangerous individual, a fascist in the making. He is a hater of Israel. When the nation tires of Obama's false hopes, I fear it will turn to a kook like Beck for guidance.

and who would you suggest?

re: #114 calcajun

It will die in the Senate-- a slow, lonely death. Move along citizens. Nuthin to see here.

maybe and probably, but there is a higher principle here and people should be very upset at the way the govt is treating us....we pay them for this abuse, are you okay with that?

re: #126 calcajun

To feed the alligators, of course.

Obviously!

"Cap and Trade"
by
Crippling Traitors

It IS time to vote out the Incumbents. Make them...outcumbents!

re: #127 Sharmuta

Look! Over there! Something shiny!

Squirrel!

Hello, my name is Dug.

A very simple tactic would be for a reporter to ask Waxman specific questions about his own bill. Waxman wouldn't know the answer. No way anybody understands this thousand page monster and the 300 supplemental pages that were just added.

re: #115 astronmr20

I think Beck is a nut too,

But where in the hell did you get that notion?

Glenn Beck does not hate Israel. You have no clue what you are talking about.

re: #129 apachegunner

and who would you suggest?

Someone who isn't a paranoid kook waiting for the mothership.

I will not forgive them for they know what they did. They just crucified life as we know it.

re: #121 Zimriel

Five hundred mil.
The thing is, now he can't run up any more debt. (He was only broke because he modeled his life on the US Congress' spending patterns.... don't balance, don't worry).
So with some careful managing of the rights to his music, after his debts are paid, his three kids should be left wealthy again in short order. The trick will be to make sure there's no Col. Parker hanging over his family, swindling them out of what is theirs.

re: #103 ArmyWife

Taking the chihuahuas for a walk. They have a much keener insight into the economy than our Congress, so I might feel better upon my return.

I betcha they will produce something better than our House of Representatives while you are out.

-note the lack of sarc tags-

re: #136 ArchangelMichael

Someone who isn't a paranoid kook waiting for the mothership.

...say the man with the Reynolds-wrap chapeau.///

Names of the 8 House Republican's who voted to permit this farce of a bill to pass. Once again, the government is going to try to 'fix' a marketplace and end up doing nothing but severely damaging and crippling the country.

8 more reasons to ensure that the RNC doesn't see another penny from me.

Bono Mack
Castle
Kirk
Lance
LoBiondo
McHugh
Reichert
Smith (NJ)

re: #135 Cannadian Club Akbar

Glenn Beck does not hate Israel. You have no clue what you are talking about.

he will when it pays off for him....Beck is a useless whore and his fans are just as bad

re: #136 ArchangelMichael

Someone who isn't a paranoid kook waiting for the mothership.

RON PAUL!

/oh, you said "isn't", never mind.

re: #126 calcajun

To feed the alligators, of course.

Send more chihuahua's.

re: #114 calcajun

It will die in the Senate-- a slow, lonely death. Move along citizens. Nuthin to see here.

If Al Franken is confirmed, the GOP won't be able to filibuster, and the Dems will have up to 10 "no" votes to give red state Dem senators like Ben Nelson and Mary Landrieu for final passage. The only hopes of stopping it is to get 1 Dem to join a filibuster, or keep Franken out of the Senate until more public sentiment turns against the bill. And we have to keep Snowe and Collins from voting for it too.

re: #44 oronpam
Kind of like the stimulus package?

re: #115 astronmr20

I think Beck is a nut too,

But where in the hell did you get that notion?

Listen to him talk about foreign policy. He's one of those libertarian isolationists who doesn't care if the Palestinians and Israelis kill each other. He claims it's none of our business.

re: #135 Cannadian Club Akbar

Glenn Beck does not hate Israel. You have no clue what you are talking about.

Sorry! should have been #78....clueless

I'm going to go outside and grill some beef. Maybe pretend that the cow was a democrat in a previous life. Yeah! Sweet!

re: #145 KingKenrod

If Al Franken is confirmed, the GOP won't be able to filibuster, and the Dems will have up to 10 "no" votes to give red state Dem senators like Ben Nelson and Mary Landrieu for final passage. The only hopes of stopping it is to get 1 Dem to join a filibuster, or keep Franken out of the Senate until more public sentiment turns against the bill. And we have to keep Snowe and Collins from voting for it too.

Landrieu plans on voting no from what I am hearing locally. (Although that was a week ago or so.)

re: #114 calcajun

It will die in the Senate-- a slow, lonely death. Move along citizens. Nuthin to see here.

AL FRANKEN US Senator.......

Betting that it will die in the Senate may not be the safe bet. This farce of a bill never should have gotten this far....and once again it wasn't the Dems that made the difference, it was weakwilled Republicans that signed off on this crap and tax bill.

If it is OK to like Michael Jackson for his music and ignore his pedohilia, is it OK to agree with Glenn Beck when he makes a valid point?

re: #127 Sharmuta

Look! Over there! Something shiny!

For those who have seen the movie, "UP"...
SQUIRREL!

re: #135 Cannadian Club Akbar

Glenn Beck does not hate Israel. You have no clue what you are talking about.

You quoted the wrong person. That's what I was saying.

re: #149 Cathypop

I'm going to go outside and grill some beef. Maybe pretend that the cow was a democrat in a previous life. Yeah! Sweet!

They always come back as an ass.

re: #145 KingKenrod

It was too close in the House and there is not that much love for it. You're assuming it will get out of committee in the Senate. If it does not get a sponsorship there, it dies in the Senate without ever going to a vote.

re: #150 pink freud

Landrieu plans on voting no from what I am hearing locally. (Although that was a week ago or so.)

She better join the filibuster then, if she's serious about stopping it. Voting no isn't good enough.

re: #153 NelsFree

For those who have seen the movie, "UP"...
SQUIRREL!

Great film!

re: #155 DEZes

Too bad I can only give you 1 up-ding for that one.

This kind of shit makes me want to get drunk.

re: #133 calcajun

Quick! Pinky wish!
/h

re: #156 calcajun

It was too close in the House and there is not that much love for it. You're assuming it will get out of committee in the Senate. If it does not get a sponsorship there, it dies in the Senate without ever going to a vote.

It will make it out of committee - that is a given.

re: #152 Racer X

If it is OK to like Michael Jackson for his music and ignore his pedohilia, is it OK to agree with Glenn Beck when he makes a valid point?

MJ is over...his contribution to our culture is minimal...he was a ghastly freak and nobody to look up to or emulate...good riddance

re: #147 Killgore Trout

Listen to him talk about foreign policy. He's one of those libertarian isolationists who doesn't care if the Palestinians and Israelis kill each other. He claims it's none of our business.

No, wrong again. He wants the UN to get the fuck out of the way and stop blaming Israel for everything. But everyone knows everything listening to sound bites.

re: #7 Thanos

Here's the R's who voted for this :

Bono Mack
Castle
Kirk
Lance
LoBiondo
McHugh
Reichert
Smith (NJ)

h/t hot air

Sonny is spinning right now...

re: #160 Noam Sayin'

This kind of shit makes me want to get drunk.

I'm buyin' Noam. What are we having?

re: #159 SlartyBartfast

Too bad I can only give you 1 up-ding for that one.

One was good enough, thanks.

Didnt read the comments yet, but it appears that these so called representatives didnt even read the damn bill! This is a bill that could wreck the US economy (even worse than it is now) and the Dems dont give them the real bill until 3:00 am. It is an outrage.

Any thoughts on if it will make it through the senate?

re: #154 astronmr20

You quoted the wrong person. That's what I was saying.

see my 148

re: #166 Racer X

I'm buyin' Noam. What are we having?

Better be 180 proof.

I opened a beer.

And took immense pleasure in the sound of CO2 escaping unregulated (for now) into the atmosphere.

re: #110 eon

/I'll be more coherent next post

Can I borrow this to append to some of my posts?

re: #152 Racer X

Before I ever really knew a thing about Glenn Beck... and I don't watch him on television now, so I may not know a lot more... someone took me to a live stage show he did as part of a tour, and I have to say... I laughed until I thought I would die. The guy is an unbelievably funny standup comedian, at least live. He had the audience rolling.
I don't really remember him being all that politically focused ... it was sort of a general, Dave Barry-esque commentary on society today. Wish I had taped it.

It doesn't matter that the news is covering Michael Jackson. They didn't cover this bill enough for people to call or write to stop it before yesterday, so I don't see what one news cycle cost. No one will care about this until they get the bill.

re: #38 cronus

Passage of waxman-like legislation in the Senate virtually guarantees a further reduction in production from coal and will result in a commodity price spike (ala what we've seen in oil) when we finally see a turn in the economy.

The Democrats will choke off any recovery with sharply higher energy costs. They now own the $4/$5 gallon gas and higher electric rates that we'll see in the next year or so.

Don't forget, they want $8/gallon gas. That's how they intend to force us onto public transportation, so they can watch where we go, and make sure we're perusing the Utne Reader as opposed to The Weekly Standard.

To get some idea if what kind of world they want to make us live in, you might want to read Fallen Angels by Jerry Pournelle, Larry Niven, & Michael Flynn.

cheers

eon

re: #168 mad_scientist

Any thoughts on if it will make it through the senate?

Yes it will pass. Obama wants it to.

We are done.

re: #134 HelloDare

A very simple tactic would be for a reporter to ask Waxman specific questions about his own bill. Waxman wouldn't know the answer. No way anybody understands this thousand page monster and the 300 supplemental pages that were just added.

We are not even in July yet and it seems that they have been ramming away with legislation after legislation at breakneck speed. Is it because these bills might fail initially that they'll be re-hatched under a different bill with new language in order to beat the election cycle? Or is congress trying to much done before summer vacation? What gives?

re: #114 calcajun

It will die in the Senate-- a slow, lonely death. Move along citizens. Nuthin to see here.

Snowe
Collins
Graham

re: #171 jcm

I opened a beer.

And took immense pleasure in the sound of CO2 escaping unregulated (for now) into the atmosphere.

I hope they don't start regulating methane emissions. That could put me in some serious debt.

"Pull my finger"

"Cha-ching!"

re: #174 Sharmuta

It doesn't matter that the news is covering Michael Jackson. They didn't cover this bill enough for people to call or write to stop it before yesterday, so I don't see what one news cycle cost. No one will care about this until they get the bill.

And then be surprised, shocked even.
Of course they will never blame themselves.

re: #172 wrenchwench

Can I borrow this to append to some of my posts?

Be my guest. :-)

cheers

eon

Another aspect of this may be is of the "Placeholders" placed in the bill, which by my understanding, allow for actual bill language to be placed in that section, AFTER the vote.

That's very, very troubling.....it doesn't seem very constitutional to begin with

Republican speakers on C-SPAN are kicking the shit out of this bill. Good for them.

WE all have to get involved in the local political parties and help to identify true Conservatives for nomination.
/Darn, now I've got to do it, too.

re: #179 DaddyG

I hope they don't start regulating methane emissions. That could put me in some serious debt.

"Pull my finger"

"Cha-ching!"

Stock up on Lima beans. ;)

re: #179 DaddyG

I hope they don't start regulating methane emissions. That could put me in some serious debt.

"Pull my finger"

"Cha-ching!"

When it's a crime to fart.
Only criminals will fart.

Is it really an uncertain fate in the Senate? I don't think so. If the GOP can't filibuster, Democrats retain the numbers to get it done. And this President will sign it.

And no one will have read the damned thing.

Cap and trade tax is coming; the only question is how much damage will be done before saner politicians prevail and reverse this?

I have an even worse feeling over the health care plan, since once it's enacted, it will be far more difficult to reverse.

BREAKING NEWS!

Michael Jackson is still dead

re: #186 jcm

When it's a crime to fart.
Only criminals will fart.

LMAO!

I am so stealing that!

re: #166 Racer X

I'm buyin' Noam. What are we having?

I am having a whiskey without the fizz and no ice.
We've been co2'ed enough and that bill is gonna rock the economic boat way too much.

re: #183 Racer X
Not so much..they should be kicking the shiite out of their R colleagues who voted for it.

re: #177 Idle Drifter

We are not even in July yet and it seems that they have been ramming away with legislation after legislation at breakneck speed. Is it because these bills might fail initially that they'll be re-hatched under a different bill with new language in order to beat the election cycle? Or is congress trying to much done before summer vacation? What gives?

why wait around til people get smart, if they ever do...BO knows the public is stupid and he has Congress and the media in his pocket...he won...pretty simple

re: #175 eon

Don't forget, they want $8/gallon gas.

I almost hate to say it, but that would be really good for my business. (Little bicycle shop.) $4.00/gallon increased my traffic a lot.

/I'll be more coherent next post

re: #155 DEZes

They always come back as an ass.

No change, huh?

re: #186 jcm

I'll be public enemy #1.

Just skim the table of contents of this travesty.

/it screams boondoggle

can we sue our congressmen for malpractice?

re: #195 BatGuano

I'll be public enemy #1.

A million fart march on Washington!

re: #160 Noam Sayin'

Cheers Naom!

re: #182 Osama Bin PorkChop

Another aspect of this may be is of the "Placeholders" placed in the bill, which by my understanding, allow for actual bill language to be placed in that section, AFTER the vote.

That's very, very troubling.....it doesn't seem very constitutional to begin with

But I'm sure a Hispanic woman can make a better decision about whether it is constitutional or not than a green lizard.
////

re: #191 tradewind

Not so much..they should be kicking the shiite out of their R colleagues who voted for it.

At least some in congress are not just bending over and taking it up the ass. I applaud them speaking out on record against this travesty.

Tomorrow I am heading to the printers to get a stack of bumper stickers that read
You Cap Us,
We Trade U.
Guess I should try to get permssion first from the Twitterer who sent it.....
Meanwhile, you all might consider firing off one to your senators. It's a short and succinct warning to them.

re: #198 jcm

A million fart march on Washington!

And a mexican food stall every 100 yards.

re: #198 jcm

A million fart march on Washington!

I am selling gass masks at that event for 100 bucks a pop.

re: #197 kawfytawk

can we sue our congressmen for malpractice?

No but in 2010 you can
FIRE THEIR GODDAMN MOTHERFUCKING ASSES!

re: #205 jcm

No but in 2010 you can
FIRE THEIR GODDAMN MOTHERFUCKING ASSES!

you know I will

From teh Twitter:
@samishamieh: Congress is not monogamous, it screws everyone. #CapAndTrade

blowback...maybe the illegals in this country will flock south and out of here...in hard times they will become the target of discontent

re: #177 Idle Drifter

We are not even in July yet and it seems that they have been ramming away with legislation after legislation at breakneck speed. Is it because these bills might fail initially that they'll be re-hatched under a different bill with new language in order to beat the election cycle? Or is congress trying to much done before summer vacation? What gives?

The last time a Democrat President had a majority in both House and Senate was LBJ. What resulted was the War on Poverty, Medicaid/Medicare, Public Housing complexes filling with Welfare mothers, and the President personally identifying targets for airstrikes in Viet Nam.
Clinton had a chance to sign more Liberal legislation until Newt and Rush got involved in 1994. It is my opinion that Obama knows he has an 18 month window, and he's pushing as fast as he can.

re: #198 jcm

A million fart march on Washington!

Cap and trade my ass!

The funny part is they the congress proberly don't know what they passed

re: #196 Killian Bundy

Just skim the table of contents of this travesty.

/it screams boondoggle

It's only 1.94MB, how bad can it be?

////////////

re: #205 jcm

No but in 2010 you can
FIRE THEIR GODDAMN MOTHERFUCKING ASSES!

Like I said on another thread.
Congress, you STUPID SPOILED SOCIALIST TREE HUGGING APPEASEMENT MONKEYS.

Yeah!

That last response on CSPAN was awesome!

re: #205 jcm

No but in 2010 you can
FIRE THEIR GODDAMN MOTHERFUCKING ASSES!

If someone actually runs against them! Remember, I live in moonbattachusetts.

So, when do the corporations start trading energy?

re: #204 DEZes

I am selling gass masks at that event for 100 bucks a pop.

1 too many s's and 1 too few o's.

re: #211 tblot

The funny part is they the congress proberly don't know what they passed

unfortunately I don't find that funny

re: #203 callahan23

And a mexican food stall every 100 yards.

the silver lining!...good one

re: #217 VegasRick

1 too many s's and 1 too few o's.

LOL.

re: #215 Kosh's Shadow

If someone actually runs against them! Remember, I live in moonbattachusetts.

write in...none of the above

Is it 2010 yet?

re: #208 albusteve

blowback...maybe the illegals in this country will flock south and out of here...in hard times they will become the target of discontent

They will, since they'll be able to get jobs in Mexico (not considered developed enough to have emissions standards), but not in the US.
We'll be joining them.

So my question is.....should I start trapping the family "methane" to trade for credits...../

re: #7 Thanos

Here's the R's who voted for this :

Bono Mack
Castle
Kirk
Lance
LoBiondo
McHugh
Reichert
Smith (NJ)

h/t hot air

Thanos -

Back in "the Day" I thought Chris Smith was dangerous, from a "Progressive" Standpoint. Apparently, I have changed more than HE.
Bad Vote Chris. "Runny Eggs" started doing it for me in this Bankrupt State back in 1993. You should KNOW Better. That is all.

-S-

re: #223 Kosh's Shadow

They will, since they'll be able to get jobs in Mexico (not considered developed enough to have emissions standards), but not in the US.
We'll be joining them.

good point

re: #198 jcm

A million fart march on Washington!

jcm -

Send In The Cows!

-S-

re: #213 DEZes

Like I said on another thread.
Congress, you STUPID SPOILED SOCIALIST TREE HUGGING APPEASEMENT MONKEYS.

Groundskeeper Willie couldn't have said it better. ;)

So.....How many of you folks feel like going out for a peaceful protest? Tea Party anybody? Killgore? Bueller? Anybody?

The U.S. Senate, standing between you and the 18th century.

/I hear the health care was pretty good back then too

re: #190 callahan23

I am having a whiskey without the fizz and no ice.
We've been co2'ed enough and that bill is gonna rock the economic boat way too much.

I'm having a Klondike bar and a non-diet Mountain Dew right now.

Trust me- this is my equivalent of tying one on, going back thirty-plus years.

/much more of this s**t, and it's non-decaf black coffee until 2012!

cheers

eon

I wonder if I am reading these things wrong.

Is carbon = carbon dioxide? Or are they referring to carbon (C)? This is the one area I am an element chart nazi. I just think they are trying to fool me out of money by referring to soot as the problem.

All new government agencies and acts really do is remove money from the pockets of the taxpayers and give it to the legislators friends. That is government beyond market rules and defense in a nutshell. The common good here is poorly identified.

The best way to work over AGW is to raise the gas tax and to offer to help China green up. For every green kindergartner here learning to conserve there are two in China smoking cigarettes. let people self regulate.

Liberal nitwits decide that they need to 'fix' the mortgage industry in order to get more minorities that can't afford houses into houses. Result: Housing and Mortgage Industry collapses, collateral damage takes out Credit / Financial Industry - guarantee's Obama win in 11/08 and 2 trillion deficit in 2009 - with no real repair to economy other than massive expansion of government power.

Liberal nitwits combined with junk science decide that carbon based fuels have to be priced out of the marketplace in order to make inefficient renewable fuel sources economically viable. Result: Massive energy price increases, massive energy shortages, collapsed businesses and industries, more government spending, more government takeovers of businesses, and a rapidly shrinking middle class.

Liberal ideologues decide that nationalized health care is needed in order to further their agenda. Result: $2-4 Trillion in additional spending over next decade, lessened health care, fewer doctors and medical personnel to treat the need and ultimately, only 10 million more people have 'insurance'. Mortality rate in US increases and median life expectency drops 5 years in the 1st 3 years of the program.

And all of this shit is done in less than 9 months of Obama being inaugurated......marvelous.

re: #216 Mr. In get Mr. Out

So, when do the corporations start trading energy?

Wrong question. Correct question is when do these energy companies pass on the costs to the end users - which will be everyone since no business is going to eat these costs.

Politicians fail economics 101 yet again - and this time they're doing it on purpose because they've bought into the vaporware of cap and trade as though it will actually save the environment. It will do no such thing; it only will act as a brake on the economy and destroy whatever jobs are created or saved by the trillion dollar porkfest (and we're already seen the fail of the porkfest since the jobs aren't being created or saved).

re: #193 wrenchwench
I almost hate to say it, but that would be really good for my business. (Little bicycle shop.) $4.00/gallon increased my traffic a lot.
Oil is used to make bicycle tires.
Bwahahahhaha!
Little Bicycle Shop of HORRORS!
/h

re: #229 VegasRick

So.....How many of you folks feel like going out for a peaceful protest? Tea Party anybody? Killgore? Bueller? Anybody?

killgore likes what's happening...count him out

re: #225 Dr. Shalit

Thanos -

Back in "the Day" I thought Chris Smith was dangerous, from a "Progressive" Standpoint. Apparently, I have changed more than HE.
Bad Vote Chris. "Runny Eggs" started doing it for me in this Bankrupt State back in 1993. You should KNOW Better. That is all.

-S-

wonder if there were drug deals made or were they willing partners to his sham...either way it sickens me

re: #211 tblot

The funny part is they the congress proberly don't know what they passed

We can smell what they passed.

"I have been greatly abused, have been obliged to do more than my part in the war; been loaded with class rates, town rates, province rates, Continental rates and all rates...been pulled and hauled by sheriffs, constables and collectors, and had my cattle sold for less than they were worth...The great men are going to get all we have and I think it is time for us to rise and put a stop to it, and have no more courts, nor sheriffs, nor collectors nor lawyers." - Plough Jogger, Farmer, 1786

re: #47 WinterCat

Thank you, read the whole thing.

Very informative.

Not that I'm going to Russia anytime soon......

I am LIVID. This is such a unabashed, naked tax increase, intendd to squeeze regular folks and force guidelines upon us that will do NOTHING to change the climate. For an example of what the fuck our leaders let pass without reading, take a look at this:

SEC. 789. CLIMATE CHANGE REBATE CONSUMER REFUNDS.

‘(a) Rebate- Not later than October 31 of each calendar year, the President, or such Federal agency or department as the President may designate, shall distribute the funds in the Consumer Climate Change Rebate Fundfund- In each year after deposits are made to the Climate Change Consumer Refund Account, the Secretary of the Treasury shall provide tax refunds on a per capita basis to each household in the United States.‘(b) Limitations- The President, or such Federal agency or department as the President may designate, that shall collectively equal the amount deposited into the Climate Change Consumer Refund Account

That's just a random excerpt. I'm just waiting for the government to regulate me out of the car hobby-something I love. What do you all love that this might affect?

What a fucking travesty.

re: #36 HelloDare

If it passes more business will fail or wont be able to compete with countries like China. Business will go there. They don't care at all about pollution. China is the largest user of coal in the world.

China is opening one new coal burning plant daily.

re: #230 Killian Bundy

The U.S. Senate, standing between you and the 18th century.

/I hear the health care was pretty good back then too

Killian Bundy -

Ask George Washington about that. From what we know now, He Died from BAD TEETH, in the 1790's

-S-

re: #233 Athos

Well said.

re: #227 Dr. Shalit

jcm -

Send In The Cows!

-S-

Send in the cows!

re: #166 Racer X

I'm buyin' Noam. What are we having?

Gotta go for a scooter ride, first.

BBL

re: #190 callahan23

I am having a whiskey without the fizz and no ice.
We've been co2'ed enough and that bill is gonna rock the economic boat way too much.

Just wait until the congress critters start tax charred oak barrels and distilleries in general for producing CO_{2 then they'll have a Whiskey Rebellion Part Duex.}

re: #216 Mr. In get Mr. Out

So, when do the corporations start trading energy?

Remind me again how that worked out for Enron?

re: #239 Kragar (Proud to be Kafir)

"I have been greatly abused, have been obliged to do more than my part in the war; been loaded with class rates, town rates, province rates, Continental rates and all rates...been pulled and hauled by sheriffs, constables and collectors, and had my cattle sold for less than they were worth...The great men are going to get all we have and I think it is time for us to rise and put a stop to it, and have no more courts, nor sheriffs, nor collectors nor lawyers." - Plough Jogger, Farmer, 1786

very nice in an old fashioned way....I dig that guy...my kind of American

re: #238 jcm

We can smell what they passed.

jcm -

POOP is POOP. Go from there.

-S-

re: #234 lawhawk

Wrong question. Correct question is when do these energy companies pass on the costs to the end users - which will be everyone since no business is going to eat these costs.

Politicians fail economics 101 yet again - and this time they're doing it on purpose because they've bought into the vaporware of cap and trade as though it will actually save the environment. It will do no such thing; it only will act as a brake on the economy and destroy whatever jobs are created or saved by the trillion dollar porkfest (and we're already seen the fail of the porkfest since the jobs aren't being created or saved).

Companies will probably raise prices as soon as they can to match projected costs estimates in the future. My opinion

re: #232 hazzyday

I wonder if I am reading these things wrong.

You are. Clearly, you are.

re: #218 kawfytawk

I dont' either but congress has a way to make me laugh at them when they don't even listen. And for some reason they just get voted in again and again. Maybe american is listening

re: #234 lawhawk

Wrong question. Correct question is when do these energy companies pass on the costs to the end users - which will be everyone since no business is going to eat these costs.

Politicians fail economics 101 yet again - and this time they're doing it on purpose because they've bought into the vaporware of cap and trade as though it will actually save the environment. It will do no such thing; it only will act as a brake on the economy and destroy whatever jobs are created or saved by the trillion dollar porkfest (and we're already seen the fail of the porkfest since the jobs aren't being created or saved).

No, in this case they aren't failing econ 101. They understand econ 101 quite well. Their preference for energy use and sources are not economically viable in a free market system. They have decided to kill the free market system in order to make those renewable sources now 'viable'.

re: #225 Dr. Shalit

Reichert in a district that is rapidly yuppifying with urban green democrats. He can't win the election without being very pro environment. My nephew came home from school a month ago with a lot of worries about climate disasters.

re: #223 Kosh's Shadow

They will, since they'll be able to get jobs in Mexico (not considered developed enough to have emissions standards), but not in the US.
We'll be joining them.

Not so fast! The Mexicans actually protect their country from illegal immigrants.

Of course it won't fix anything. There is nothing to fix. There has been no significant warming in 10 years. As for the Bill, it is a tax bill that will relegate the American economy to that of Mexico. We will be exporting jibs at a rate the world has never seen. There will be no reason to manufacture in America. None. Our cheap energy and highway system has been the sole manufacturing asset that American manufacturers have. With bot gone, so will go American Industry if this passes the Senate...

re: #117 Cathypop

Back - on a leash. They like it! They trot the whole time, head and tail up. They are dogs. Really.

'Tis odd.

I can find the Republicans that voted for it, but not the Democrats who voted against it.

I wonder why.

re: #248 DaddyG

Enron was partially my point.