Romney Bans Media From Meeting With Money Men

Violating a pre-established media protocol
Politics • Views: 33,054

Mitt Romney doesn’t want the press around when he meets with his biggest donors in Jerusalem.

JERUSALEM — Republican presidential hopeful Mitt Romney, who touched down here Saturday night for a day of meetings with top Israeli and Palestinian leaders, plans to wrap up his visit to Israel by collecting money from some of his biggest benefactors behind closed doors.

Some of Romney’s Jewish donors are flying here from the United States to attend the Jerusalem fundraiser on Monday morning, including Las Vegas casino mogul Sheldon Adelson, who has pledged to personally give tens of millions of dollars to a pro-Romney super PAC.

But Romney’s campaign announced Saturday that it would block the news media from covering the event, which will be held at the King David Hotel. The campaign’s decision to close the fundraiser to the press violates the ground rules it negotiated with news organizations in April, when Romney wrapped up the Republican nomination and began opening some of his finance events to the news media.

Kinda obvious what Obvious Mitt is up to - he’s been really hurt by the “out of touch elitist” meme, and he’s trying to keep it from getting worse. He knows if the press sees what goes on at this gathering of the mega-rich, it’s going to turn into another feeding frenzy. And he doesn’t need that after Britain.

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324 comments

1 Kragar  Sat, Jul 28, 2012 5:16:42pm

Well, I'm sure no right wing extremists will think anything is up when Romney decides to have a secret meeting with rich Jewish backers.
///

2 Ben G. Hazi  Sat, Jul 28, 2012 5:18:18pm

re: #1 Kragar

Well, I'm sure no right wing extremists will think anything is up when Romney decides to have a secret meeting with rich Jewish backers.
///

I'm sure that Stormfront is all up on that, as we speak.

/no sarc

3 jaunte  Sat, Jul 28, 2012 5:18:58pm

Just a quiet evening romneyshambles with a few friends.

4 Killgore Trout  Sat, Jul 28, 2012 5:19:51pm

re: #1 Kragar

Well, I'm sure no right wing extremists will think anything is up when Romney decides to have a secret meeting with rich Jewish backers.
///

I was actually thinking something similar. Rich jews, American politics, money, Israel. There are plenty of people, not exclusively wingnuts, who make a big deal out of this stuff. Best keep this one private. Which is not at all outrageous, Obama has private fundraisers all the time.

5 b_Snark  Sat, Jul 28, 2012 5:22:34pm

Meh! They pulled the expected romney.

6 engineer cat  Sat, Jul 28, 2012 5:23:06pm
7 Killgore Trout  Sat, Jul 28, 2012 5:23:21pm

Heh, Obama is even outrageous enough to ban cell phones at his private fundraisers.
Obama Campaign Bans Cell Phones at Private Fundraisers

8 dragonfire1981  Sat, Jul 28, 2012 5:26:00pm
9 dragonfire1981  Sat, Jul 28, 2012 5:27:15pm

Now imagine all the right wing frothing at the mouth that would occur if Obama pulled something like this.

They'd be calling for his head on a stick by nightfall.

10 SanFranciscoZionist  Sat, Jul 28, 2012 5:27:53pm

re: #4 Killgore Trout

I was actually thinking something similar. Rich jews, American politics, money, Israel. There are plenty of people, not exclusively wingnuts, who make a big deal out of this stuff. Best keep this one private. Which is not at all outrageous, Obama has private fundraisers all the time.

Keeping out the press is hardly going to prevent anyone, wingnut or moonbat, from making a big deal out of this.

11 allegro  Sat, Jul 28, 2012 5:28:17pm

re: #4 Killgore Trout

I was actually thinking something similar. Rich jews, American politics, money, Israel. There are plenty of people, not exclusively wingnuts, who make a big deal out of this stuff. Best keep this one private. Which is not at all outrageous, Obama has private fundraisers all the time.

As a last-minute surprise? After negotiating with the press to allow them into exactly these types of public-place functions? After a string of embarrassing gaffes?

Jeez, does it hurt when you stretch like that?

12 Kragar  Sat, Jul 28, 2012 5:29:30pm
13 Varek Raith  Sat, Jul 28, 2012 5:31:08pm

re: #12 Kragar

German World War II sub discovered off Nantucket

There once was a man from Nantucket...

14 jaunte  Sat, Jul 28, 2012 5:31:19pm

Romney Camp Breaks Precedent, Bars Press From Israel Fundraiser

In a precedent-breaking move, the Romney campaign said today it will bar reporters from attending a high-dollar fundraiser in Israel Monday morning.

No reason was given by the campaign for the change in policy for this fundraiser, other than an aide telling reporters that it is “closed press,” but the presumptive Republican presidential nominee is looking to turn the page here in Israel on a foreign trip that has so far been marred by bad press.

I'm not sure that the press was totally responsible for the marring.

15 dragonfire1981  Sat, Jul 28, 2012 5:32:27pm

re: #13 Varek Raith

There once was a man from Nantucket...

Who told Adolf Hitler to suck it...

16 jaunte  Sat, Jul 28, 2012 5:33:36pm

re: #12 Kragar

Sounds like part of this Jack Finney novel:
[Link: en.wikipedia.org...]

17 b_Snark  Sat, Jul 28, 2012 5:33:37pm

Pulling a "romney" - promise one practice or action, then completely forget what it was.

18 engineer cat  Sat, Jul 28, 2012 5:34:07pm

Romney Camp Breaks Precedent

"oh man you broke de president!!"

19 Eventual Carrion  Sat, Jul 28, 2012 5:34:32pm

re: #7 Killgore Trout

Heh, Obama is even outrageous enough to ban cell phones at his private fundraisers.
Obama Campaign Bans Cell Phones at Private Fundraisers

After saying they were allowed?

20 Varek Raith  Sat, Jul 28, 2012 5:35:01pm

re: #7 Killgore Trout

Heh, Obama is even outrageous enough to ban cell phones at his private fundraisers.
Obama Campaign Bans Cell Phones at Private Fundraisers

The difference being is Romney did this as a surprise at the last moment.
Please stop with the stupid false equivalency.

21 Kragar  Sat, Jul 28, 2012 5:35:40pm

The GOP’s War Against Facts

Someday political scientists will try to date the decline of reasoned discourse in America to the moment when the left and the right began to invent their own facts. Climate change deniers, the purveyors of lies linking abortion to breast cancer, and creationists will all be blamed for the end of meaningful debate between liberals and conservatives. But that’s not quite right. The real end of civic discourse can be traced to the new conservative argument that facts themselves are dangerous.

It’s a dangerous contention not just for what it hides, but also for what it reveals: a lack of any other arguments.

22 Ben G. Hazi  Sat, Jul 28, 2012 5:38:15pm

re: #4 Killgore Trout

I was actually thinking something similar. Rich jews, American politics, money, Israel. There are plenty of people, not exclusively wingnuts, who make a big deal out of this stuff. Best keep this one private. Which is not at all outrageous, Obama has private fundraisers all the time.

Maybe so, but the fact that Mitt and his campaign laid out the rules for access to campaign events to the press months ago once Mitt had a lock on the nomination, then they yank access to this one fundraiser (which I have a hard time believing that the says a lot for how Mitt and his team keeps their word. To that effect, I have a very hard time believing that the campaign wasn't planning this trip/fundraiser back when they set up these media arrangements.

It stinks to high heaven, because it comes off looking shady as hell, IMO.

23 efuseakay  Sat, Jul 28, 2012 5:44:47pm

re: #7 Killgore Trout

Heh, Obama is even outrageous enough to ban cell phones at his private fundraisers.
Obama Campaign Bans Cell Phones at Private Fundraisers

Cell phones vs. a previous agreement with the media that Romney reneged on... You're actually trying to compare the two? Why is that not surprising.

24 sattv4u2  Sat, Jul 28, 2012 5:46:12pm

re: #21 Kragar

The real end of civic discourse can be traced to the new conservative argument that facts themselves are dangerous.

Actually, I think the "real end of civic discourse" happened in 1960 during the 1st televised presidential debates. Once the country saw Nixons sweaty upper lip and forehead, all bets were off. Up till then "we" had a romanticized view of presidential hopefuls!

// sorta

25 Charles Johnson  Sat, Jul 28, 2012 5:47:48pm

Kinda obvious what Obvious Mitt is up to - he's been really hurt by the elitist, out of touch meme, and he's trying to keep it from getting worse. He knows if the press sees what goes on at this gathering of the mega-rich, it's going to turn into another feeding frenzy. And he doesn't need that after Britain.

26 erik_t  Sat, Jul 28, 2012 5:52:19pm

re: #21 Kragar

The GOP’s War Against Facts

Someday political scientists will try to date the decline of reasoned discourse in America to the moment when the left and the right began to invent their own facts.

Curiously, they fail to name any "facts" that the left has invented.

27 efuseakay  Sat, Jul 28, 2012 5:53:51pm

Wait. Romney met with...PALESTINIANS?!?!?

//

28 wrenchwench  Sat, Jul 28, 2012 5:55:15pm
29 Gus  Sat, Jul 28, 2012 5:55:42pm

Here's how the AP is writing it up...

Romney closing Israeli fundraiser to reporters

TEL AVIV, Israel (AP) – U.S. presidential candidate Mitt Romney plans to raise campaign money in private while in Israel, so what he tells wealthy American supporters abroad will be kept quiet from voters at home.

30 dragonfire1981  Sat, Jul 28, 2012 5:56:45pm

re: #21 Kragar

Someday political scientists will try to date the decline of reasoned discourse in America to the moment when the left and the right began to invent their own facts. Climate change deniers, the purveyors of lies linking abortion to breast cancer, and creationists will all be blamed for the end of meaningful debate between liberals and conservatives. But that’s not quite right. The real end of civic discourse can be traced to the new conservative argument that facts NOT FOUND IN THE BIBLE themselves are dangerous.

It’s a dangerous contention not just for what it hides, but also for what it reveals: a lack of any other arguments.

Edited for accuracy

31 Ben G. Hazi  Sat, Jul 28, 2012 5:57:52pm

re: #25 Charles Johnson

Kinda obvious what Obvious Mitt is up to - he's been really hurt by the elitist, out of touch meme, and he's trying to keep it from getting worse. He knows if the press sees what goes on at this gathering of the mega-rich, it's going to turn into another feeding frenzy. And he doesn't need that after Britain.

Mitt's attempts to control the narrative just serves to reinforce the impression that he really is out-of-touch and elitist, rather than quell it.

32 Ben G. Hazi  Sat, Jul 28, 2012 5:58:22pm

re: #29 Gus

Here's how the AP is writing it up...

Romney closing Israeli fundraiser to reporters

That's pretty much it, in a nutshell.

33 darthstar  Sat, Jul 28, 2012 6:01:20pm

So did Romney mention that the hats every dude's wearing isn't going to be an effective shade from the sun because they don't have visors?

34 sattv4u2  Sat, Jul 28, 2012 6:02:12pm

re: #33 darthstar

So did Romney mention that the hats every dude's wearing isn't going to be an effective shade from the sun because they don't have visors?

If they place commercial content on them are they ADvisors?

35 wrenchwench  Sat, Jul 28, 2012 6:02:27pm

re: #33 darthstar

So did Romney mention that the hats every dude's wearing isn't going to be an effective shade from the sun because they don't have visors?

And free haircuts for those side curls?

36 Gus  Sat, Jul 28, 2012 6:03:19pm

re: #33 darthstar

So did Romney mention that the hats every dude's wearing isn't going to be an effective shade from the sun because they don't have visors?

Romney’s Gaffes Worsen in Israel

... Mr. Romney’s troubles began in a meeting with Israeli Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu, to whom he presented gifts of a HoneyBaked ham and a wheel of cheddar cheese.

After Mr. Netanyahu ordered both gifts removed from his residence and destroyed, Mr. Romney went on to address the Knesset, where he congratulated the Jewish people on building the pyramids....

37 Ben G. Hazi  Sat, Jul 28, 2012 6:03:43pm

re: #35 wrenchwench

And free haircuts for those side curls?

I'm sure that Mitt will take care of that personally...

38 Gretchen G.Tiger  Sat, Jul 28, 2012 6:06:57pm

Who's on first.

39 Killgore Trout  Sat, Jul 28, 2012 6:07:12pm

re: #27 efuseakay

Wait. Romney met with...PALESTINIANS?!?!?

//

They don't seem to be too fond of Mitt.
On Israel visit, Romney can expect warm Israeli embrace, chilly Palestinian reception

Palestinians fear Romney would be softer on Israel than Obama. Palestinian politician Hanan Ashrawi said that would doom any chance for resolving the Israeli-Palestinian conflict and establishing a Palestinian state on lands Israel captured in the 1967 war.

“American foreign policy in the region is shaped by Israel and determined by what’s good for Israel, and not even what’s good for the U.S.,” Ashrawi complained.

Romney “will probably try to take it a notch higher,” she said, and if the U.S. refuses to put any pressure on Israel, “then there’s no chance for peace.”

40 Stanghazi  Sat, Jul 28, 2012 6:10:03pm

He's basically fucking with our State Dept. I'm sure someone there will report. But it just seems so unseemly. Competing candidate tries to win, behind the back of his own country for foreign support.

41 darthstar  Sat, Jul 28, 2012 6:10:47pm

"Oh. My. God. This place is full of Jews!" --Mitt Romney after landing in Tel Aviv.

"Wait...I'm missing Rafalca for this?" --Ann Romney.

42 sattv4u2  Sat, Jul 28, 2012 6:14:06pm

re: #40 Stanley Sea

He's basically fucking with our State Dept

How so?

43 uncah91  Sat, Jul 28, 2012 6:15:10pm

re: #7 Killgore Trout

Heh, Obama is even outrageous enough to ban cell phones at his private fundraisers.
Obama Campaign Bans Cell Phones at Private Fundraisers

"The Obama campaign has reportedly banned cell phones at small fundraisers held in private homes"

Kilgore,

I know that you realize this, but Romney never agreed to allow reporters into private residence fundraisers, and the Israel fundraiser is not in a private home, and isn't small.

The Obama policy in question is not comparable to this change in policy.

I swear, it's like your a freaking PR flack.

44 sattv4u2  Sat, Jul 28, 2012 6:16:37pm

re: #7 Killgore Trout

re: #43 uncah91

I swear, it's like your a freaking PR flack

Is she related to Roberta Flack?

45 uncah91  Sat, Jul 28, 2012 6:18:50pm

re: #44 sattv4u2

re: #43 uncah91

I swear, it's like your a freaking PR flack

Is she related to Roberta Flack?

Nope. That actor in Tenacious D. Jack Flack.

46 sattv4u2  Sat, Jul 28, 2012 6:19:42pm

re: #45 uncah91

Nope. That actor in Tenacious D. Jack Flack.

Is he related to Jack Shit, who I happen to know!

47 darthstar  Sat, Jul 28, 2012 6:20:42pm

re: #46 sattv4u2

Is he related to Jack Shit, who I happen to know!

You don't know jack shit. Stop lying. :)

48 uncah91  Sat, Jul 28, 2012 6:22:12pm

re: #46 sattv4u2

Is he related to Jack Shit, who I happen to know!

No. Now that I think about it, maybe it was that 80s band, Flack of Seagulls.

49 sattv4u2  Sat, Jul 28, 2012 6:23:27pm

re: #48 uncah91

No. Now that I think about it, maybe it was that 80s band, Flack of Seagulls.

AH yes, the Seagulls. A fine Jewish family if there ever was one!!

50 sattv4u2  Sat, Jul 28, 2012 6:23:43pm

re: #49 sattv4u2

AH yes, the Seagulls. A fine Jewish family if there every was one!!

((see what I did there!!))

51 Interesting Times  Sat, Jul 28, 2012 6:24:27pm

re: #40 Stanley Sea

He's basically fucking with our State Dept. I'm sure someone there will report. But it just seems so unseemly. Competing candidate tries to win, behind the back of his own country for foreign support.

52 uncah91  Sat, Jul 28, 2012 6:26:21pm

re: #50 sattv4u2

((see what I did there!!))

Clever boy.

53 sattv4u2  Sat, Jul 28, 2012 6:27:50pm

re: #52 uncah91

Clever boy.

If by "boy" you mean grumpy old man, why yes,, yes I am!

54 sagehen  Sat, Jul 28, 2012 6:27:56pm

re: #51 Interesting Times

[Embedded content]

re: #51 Interesting Times

[Embedded content]

yes it's legal, provided the donors are American expats and not actual fur'ners... (that many old Jews in one place, what are the odds there's an actual furrier or two?)

55 Varek Raith  Sat, Jul 28, 2012 6:28:15pm

re: #52 uncah91

Clever boy.

Don't encourage him.
;P

56 Interesting Times  Sat, Jul 28, 2012 6:30:46pm
57 Varek Raith  Sat, Jul 28, 2012 6:33:27pm

British Press, meet Romney.
Romney, meet....Where'd he go?

58 Kragar  Sat, Jul 28, 2012 6:36:55pm

I hate Americanized version of British shows. I mean really, who thought Mitt Romney would be a good Mr. Bean?

59 researchok  Sat, Jul 28, 2012 6:38:29pm

Romney should have never negotiated an agreement which might be upended.

Worse than a rookie mistake.

60 Kragar  Sat, Jul 28, 2012 6:43:57pm

Koch-Funded Study Finds ‘Global Warming Is Real’, ‘On The High End’ And ‘Essentially All’ Due To Carbon Pollution

What makes this “man bites dog” is that Muller has been a skeptic of climate science, and the single biggest funder of this study is the “Charles G. Koch Charitable Foundation ($150,000).” The Kochs are the leading funder of climate disinformation in the world!

It gets better:

Our results show that the average temperature of the earth’s land has risen by two and a half degrees Fahrenheit over the past 250 years, including an increase of one and a half degrees over the most recent 50 years. Moreover, it appears likely that essentially all of this increase results from the human emission of greenhouse gases.

These findings are stronger than those of the Intergovernmental Panel on Climate Change, the United Nations group that defines the scientific and diplomatic consensus on global warming.

In short, a Koch-funded study has found that the IPCC “consensus” underestimated both the rate of surface warming and how much could be attributed to human emissions!

61 Ben G. Hazi  Sat, Jul 28, 2012 6:45:26pm

re: #58 Kragar

I hate Americanized version of British shows. I mean really, who thought Mitt Romney would be a good Mr. Bean?

The Office (with Steve Carell, not the episodes after he left) is fairly good...

62 Interesting Times  Sat, Jul 28, 2012 6:46:17pm
63 Dark_Falcon  Sat, Jul 28, 2012 6:49:48pm

re: #12 Kragar

German World War II sub discovered off Nantucket

The Battle of the Atlantic was brutal in its intensity at times and as this case shows, even when the U-Boat was sunk they sometimes still drew blood. Oil tankers were vital to the war effort but their slow size and lack of compartmentalization made them very vulnerable to torpedo attack.

Also of note is that U-550 was of the same class (Type IXC/40) as the U-505 that is an exhibit at Chicago's Museum of Science and Industry.

64 SanFranciscoZionist  Sat, Jul 28, 2012 6:52:38pm

re: #27 efuseakay

Wait. Romney met with...PALESTINIANS?!?!?

//

Let the screaming begin.

Or not, you know.

65 SanFranciscoZionist  Sat, Jul 28, 2012 6:53:54pm

re: #29 Gus

Here's how the AP is writing it up...

Romney closing Israeli fundraiser to reporters

Interestingly, it sounds from the article as though several of these people are going to be flying in from the States. Basically, Mitt's invited some people to join him for breakfast at the King David.

66 Dark_Falcon  Sat, Jul 28, 2012 6:54:08pm

re: #45 uncah91

Nope. That actor in Tenacious D. Jack Flack.

Tenacious D. is actually performing in Chicago early next month.

67 SanFranciscoZionist  Sat, Jul 28, 2012 6:54:29pm

re: #33 darthstar

So did Romney mention that the hats every dude's wearing isn't going to be an effective shade from the sun because they don't have visors?

Probably not, since his supporters largely don't wear those.

68 SanFranciscoZionist  Sat, Jul 28, 2012 6:54:36pm

re: #35 wrenchwench

And free haircuts for those side curls?

Ditto.

69 SanFranciscoZionist  Sat, Jul 28, 2012 6:56:26pm

re: #57 Varek Raith

British Press, meet Romney.
Romney, meet...Where'd he go?

There's a very long tradition of the British press trashing Americans who go to London expecting to be liked.

Poor Mitt fell victim.

70 SanFranciscoZionist  Sat, Jul 28, 2012 6:56:56pm

re: #66 Dark_Falcon

Tenacious D. is actually performing in Chicago early next month.

My husband loves them.

71 Bubblehead II  Sat, Jul 28, 2012 6:57:25pm

Night Lizard. Been a interesting day. I do ask one favorer. Don't lump all Idahoans into the same batch of the racists from Northern Idaho. Unlike Texas and Mississippi, we are actually trying to grow out of it

72 Dark_Falcon  Sat, Jul 28, 2012 6:58:30pm

re: #70 SanFranciscoZionist

My husband loves them.

Of course, those who truly want to see Tenacious D in Chicago must wait for the Bears home opener in September. Go Bears!

73 Dark_Falcon  Sat, Jul 28, 2012 6:59:58pm

re: #71 Bubblehead II

Night Lizard. Been a interesting day. I do ask one favorer. Don't lump all Idahoans into the same batch of the racists from Northern Idaho. Unlike Texas and Mississippi, we are actually trying to grow out of it

Idaho isn't Mississippi. It's Far West, not Deep South. Much more about "leave me alone" than "I don't like you because you aren't white".

74 Stanghazi  Sat, Jul 28, 2012 7:00:13pm

re: #42 sattv4u2


He's basically fucking with our State Dept

How so?

Whatever they have in progress, he will try to dismantle.

75 Stanghazi  Sat, Jul 28, 2012 7:01:53pm

re: #51 Interesting Times

[Embedded content]

Dog, remember the hand wringing here at LGF about the foreign credit card donations? IOKIYAR. So pitiful.

76 sattv4u2  Sat, Jul 28, 2012 7:02:51pm

re: #74 Stanley Sea

Whatever they have in progress, he will try to dismantle.

If it's "in progress" and beneficial to the Israelis they will let him know that (if the conversations even go there, which I highly doubt)

If it's "in progress" and NOT beneficial to the Israelis they will let him know what would be beneficial to them instead, again, if the conversations even go there.

77 Stanghazi  Sat, Jul 28, 2012 7:07:38pm

re: #76 sattv4u2

If it's "in progress" and beneficial to the Israelis they will let him know that (if the conversations even go there, which I highly doubt)

If it's "in progress" and NOT beneficial to the Israelis they will let him know what would be beneficial to them instead, again, if the conversations even go there.

He's campaigning there. Problem is he's the Mittster and will tell them whatever they want to hear. Then again, it will be same ol same ol. It just seems unseemly.

OT, I paid back my friends for helping me move by helping them move today. 10-5. Insane amount of shit. I'm fucked, cut on knee, bruise on arm from being the other side of a 100 lb chest of drawers. GOOD FUCKING GRIEF.

78 Killgore Trout  Sat, Jul 28, 2012 7:07:43pm

re: #43 uncah91

Sorry but if this is the most outrageous anti-Mitt outrage today he's having a pretty nice day. Mundane events are mundane.

79 SanFranciscoZionist  Sat, Jul 28, 2012 7:07:58pm

re: #76 sattv4u2

If it's "in progress" and beneficial to the Israelis they will let him know that (if the conversations even go there, which I highly doubt)

If it's "in progress" and NOT beneficial to the Israelis they will let him know what would be beneficial to them instead, again, if the conversations even go there.

Obama did all of these meetings in 2008. [Link: www.nytimes.com...]

Met with Olmert, Barak, Netanyahu and Abbas. Ran his mouth a little about Iran.

I think everyone knows exactly what the score is, and how close Mitt will be allowed to get, except, possibly, for Mitt.

80 sattv4u2  Sat, Jul 28, 2012 7:08:07pm

re: #74 Stanley Sea

Whatever they have in progress, he will try to dismantle.

AND ,,, if he's trying to gain favor with the Israelis and/ or their gov't he's not going to 'try to dismantle" anything that benefits them

Good gravy!

81 goddamnedfrank  Sat, Jul 28, 2012 7:09:46pm

re: #76 sattv4u2

If it's "in progress" and beneficial to the Israelis they will let him know that (if the conversations even go there, which I highly doubt)

If it's "in progress" and NOT beneficial to the Israelis they will let him know what would be beneficial to them instead, again, if the conversations even go there.

Too bad he's running for President of the US and not Israel.

82 sattv4u2  Sat, Jul 28, 2012 7:10:53pm

re: #81 goddamnedfrank

Too bad he's running for President of the US and not Israel.

Did you say the same re: Obama when he made the same trip prior to the 2008 elections?

83 SanFranciscoZionist  Sat, Jul 28, 2012 7:11:25pm

re: #77 Stanley Sea

He's campaigning there. Problem is he's the Mittster and will tell them whatever they want to hear. Then again, it will be same ol same ol. It just seems unseemly.

Given that Obama did the same exact thing in 2008--I got nothing here. It's apparently becoming a little tradition. Just because I like him more than Mitt isn't a reason why it's different.

Two other thoughts: it occurred to me after seeing that Sheldon Adelson is flying out for the fundraiser that that may explain Mitt's screw-up scheduling the fundraiser as a break-the-fast--Adelson may have been coming to spend Tisha b'Av in Jerusalem, and they might have scheduled around that without Mitt's people realizing what was going on at the same time.

Also: I wonder if he's hoping to do a big speech in Poland that's going to somehow balance Obama's famous German appearance. Is the point just to get a hundred thousand Europeans approving of him on camera?

84 sattv4u2  Sat, Jul 28, 2012 7:11:31pm

but,, But ,, BUT ,,

ROMNEY!! BAIN !!!

DOG ON ROOF !!!!

85 sattv4u2  Sat, Jul 28, 2012 7:11:54pm

{sigh}

86 sattv4u2  Sat, Jul 28, 2012 7:12:11pm

and on that note, the long quiet drive home beckons!

87 SanFranciscoZionist  Sat, Jul 28, 2012 7:12:31pm

re: #81 goddamnedfrank

Too bad he's running for President of the US and not Israel.

Or the U.K., or Poland...but he is simply following the pattern laid out in 2008.

88 goddamnedfrank  Sat, Jul 28, 2012 7:13:57pm
Mr. Romney’s trip to Israel provides an excellent opportunity for him to express clearly and unequivocally for the first time that he too supports a two-state solution to the Israeli-Palestinian conflict. In doing so, he would demonstrate that he stands with the vast majority of Americans and Israelis, as well as well as with every recent American and Israeli government.

Look for weasel words. Mitt's trip has far more to do with fundraising and evangelical votes than it does with supporting Jews or Israel. His Christian social conservative base here wants a single state solution, annexation of all the occupied territories and the ethnic expulsion of all Palestinians and Muslims.

89 uncah91  Sat, Jul 28, 2012 7:14:32pm

re: #78 Killgore Trout

Sorry but if this is the most outrageous anti-Mitt outrage today he's having a pretty nice day. Mundane events are mundane.

It's not an outrage. Nobody says it was.

It's a wanker move. Just another straw on the camel's back.

And MBF doesn't make it less of a wanker move.

90 goddamnedfrank  Sat, Jul 28, 2012 7:16:27pm

re: #87 SanFranciscoZionist

Or the U.K., or Poland...but he is simply following the pattern laid out in 2008.

Did that pattern include Obama statements that the Bush, McCain and the Republicans were undermining Israel?

91 Girth  Sat, Jul 28, 2012 7:16:47pm

Ryan Seacrest sharing twitter stats and tweets from last night's opening ceremonies on NBC's Olympic coverage just now.

Stop this planet. I want to get off.

92 sattv4u2  Sat, Jul 28, 2012 7:17:29pm

Last note
The early Olympic Medal Count


Rank Country G S B Total
1. China 4 0 2 6
2. Italy 2 2 1 5
3. U.S. 1 2 2 5
4. So. Korea 1 1 1 3
4=. Brazil 1 1 1 3

WE'RE #3,, WE'RE 3#,, WE'RE #3

93 Stanghazi  Sat, Jul 28, 2012 7:19:50pm

re: #90 goddamnedfrank

Did that pattern include Obama statements that the Bush, McCain and the Republicans were undermining Israel?

DING! fucking a.

94 SanFranciscoZionist  Sat, Jul 28, 2012 7:20:26pm

re: #90 goddamnedfrank

Did that pattern include Obama statements that the Bush, McCain and the Republicans were undermining Israel?

Not that I recall, although McCain did fire at Obama. I am not saying I like Mitt's crap. However, this business of going to Israel and flaunting your credentials for the folks at home--and it is the folks at home--is following precedent, and attempting to imitate something that benefited the victor in the last election.

He is not 'running for President of Israel'. He is running for President of the United States, and he thinks that his base wants to hear what he is saying.

95 Dark_Falcon  Sat, Jul 28, 2012 7:21:22pm

The loudly denounced UN Arms Trade Treaty (UN ATT) did not meet its deadline for action Friday. The NRA used this as an occasion for a victory lap:

U.N. ATT Conference Comes to an Impasse

The Conference on the United Nations Arms Trade Treaty (U.N. ATT) has broken down and will not report a draft treaty to the member nations.

This is a big victory for American gun owners, and the NRA is being widely credited for killing the U.N. ATT.

For nearly 20 years, the NRA has worked tirelessly to warn American gun owners about the United Nations’ efforts to undermine the constitutional rights of law-abiding American gun owners by putting in place international controls on small arms.

NRA became a recognized Non-Governmental Organization (NGO) and has monitored all U.N. activities that could impact on our Second Amendment rights. As a result, NRA Executive Vice President Wayne LaPierre testified before the U.N. (2012 remarks, 2011 remarks) making it clear that the NRA would fight any international treaty that included civilian arms.

So, the NRA stopped Obama's ambitions cold, right? Um no, not quite. For a wonder, Fox News actually has a decent story on what really happened:

UNITED NATIONS – U.N. member states have failed to reach agreement on a new treaty to regulate the multibillion-dollar global arms trade.

Some diplomats and treaty supporters blamed the United States for triggering the unraveling of the month-long negotiating conference.

Hopes had been raised that agreement could be reached on a revised treaty text that closed some key loopholes by Friday's deadline for action. But the United States announced Friday morning that it needed more time to consider the proposed treaty -- and Russia and China then also asked for more time.

A bipartisan group of 51 U.S. senators on Thursday had threatened to oppose the global treaty regulating international weapons trade if it falls short in protecting the constitutional right to bear arms.

In a letter to President Obama and Secretary of State Hillary Clinton, the senators expressed serious concerns with the draft treaty that has circulated at the United Nations, saying that it signals an expansion of gun control that would be unacceptable.

The Constitution's Second Amendment offers broad protection for weapons ownership by civilians. As recently as 2008, the Supreme Court affirmed it when it struck down a ban on handguns in the District of Columbia, ruling that individuals have a constitutional right to keep guns for self-defense and other purposes.

The court also has ruled separately that treaty obligations may not infringe on individual constitutional protections and rights within U.S. borders. This goes back at least to a 1920 ruling that a migratory bird treaty with Canada, which prohibited the hunting or capturing of certain birds, was an unconstitutional interference with states' rights under the 10th Amendment.

So, what actually happened was the treaty got pushed back to wrangle over it some more. And even if ratified, it still cannot contradict the 2nd Amendment. The NRA just got smacked down, and by FNC no less. That's gotta hurt.

And good on Fox News this one time: Unlike other times, their story actually was Fair and Balanced.

96 Killgore Trout  Sat, Jul 28, 2012 7:22:33pm

re: #84 sattv4u2

but,, But ,, BUT ,,

ROMNEY!! BAIN !!!

DOG ON ROOF !!!

Uniform fetish!
/MSNBC

97 uncah91  Sat, Jul 28, 2012 7:22:39pm

re: #94 SanFranciscoZionist

Not that I recall, although McCain did fire at Obama. I am not saying I like Mitt's crap. However, this business of going to Israel and flaunting your credentials for the folks at home--and it is the folks at home--is following precedent, and attempting to imitate something that benefited the victor in the last election.

He is not 'running for President of Israel'. He is running for President of the United States, and he thinks that his base wants to hear what he is saying.

Yeah. There is nothing wrong with Romney taking a foreign tour.

In fact, it would be sort of disturbing if he didn't take one.

98 SanFranciscoZionist  Sat, Jul 28, 2012 7:24:25pm

re: #97 uncah91

Yeah. There is nothing wrong with Romney taking a foreign tour.

In fact, it would be sort of disturbing if he didn't take one.

Honestly, I don't know how I feel about it. I'd sort of prefer that everyone stay home and fight on American soil. I assume anyone in London who will give Romney $50,000 will give him $50,000 whether he makes a personal appearance or not.

But it's the done thing, and I can see Romney thinking it might help him at this point.

99 Girth  Sat, Jul 28, 2012 7:25:55pm

re: #94 SanFranciscoZionist

He is not 'running for President of Israel'. He is running for President of the United States, and he thinks that his base wants to hear what he is saying.

He can't say what his base really wants to hear:

"Yes, I'm absolutely going to start a nice big war in the Middle East so that Jesus can come back."

100 SanFranciscoZionist  Sat, Jul 28, 2012 7:26:19pm

re: #94 SanFranciscoZionist

Not that I recall, although McCain did fire at Obama.

Actually, like to emphasize that as well. This is another pattern--the Republicans openly condemning Obama's foreign policy, especially in regards to the Middle East, and trying to make him seem more dangerous.

Everything Mitt's campaign is doing right now is extremely imitative. He's trying to crack the code.

101 SanFranciscoZionist  Sat, Jul 28, 2012 7:28:21pm

re: #99 Girth

He can't say what his base really wants to hear:

"Yes, I'm absolutely going to start a nice big war in the Middle East so that Jesus can come back."

No, he can't. But he's hoping that some of the base will hear him say that anyway. Meanwhile, he'll do the rounds. Is he planning to go to the Wall? Yad Vashem? I haven't seen much about his plans except who he's going to sit down with.

102 efuseakay  Sat, Jul 28, 2012 7:29:43pm

re: #78 Killgore Trout

Sorry but if this is the most outrageous anti-Mitt outrage today he's having a pretty nice day. Mundane events are mundane.

How do we know? He won't even allow reporters at a little foreign-soil fundraiser.

103 engineer cat  Sat, Jul 28, 2012 7:30:25pm

i'm off to a secret meeting with my big monkey donors

104 prairiefire  Sat, Jul 28, 2012 7:32:54pm

Honey Betty don't give a shit ~ Image: u_mad_lizzie.jpg

105 Varek Raith  Sat, Jul 28, 2012 7:40:37pm

re: #103 engineer cat

i'm off to a secret meeting with my big monkey donors

Mind the crap.

106 Kronocide  Sat, Jul 28, 2012 7:51:14pm

re: #105 Varek Raith

Mind the crap.

Hold the eat.

107 b_Snark  Sat, Jul 28, 2012 7:52:23pm

re: #103 engineer cat

i'm off to a secret meeting with my big monkey donors

Ook. Ook.

108 Ojoe  Sat, Jul 28, 2012 7:53:01pm
109 JAFO  Sat, Jul 28, 2012 7:57:50pm

From Politico

Romney officials may be uneasy about letting reporters listen to the candidate discuss sensitive foreign policy issues to what is expected to be a largely Jewish crowd given his pledge not to criticize President Obama on foreign soil. Romney has been harshly critical of the president on Israel policy.

Something else potentialy giving pause to Boston: casino magnate Sheldon Adelson, who has given millions to Republicans and pro-Romney SuperPACs but is notably media-shy, is also expected to attend the gathering here

110 Ojoe  Sat, Jul 28, 2012 7:58:28pm

re: #78 Killgore Trout

Sorry but if this is the most outrageous anti-Mitt outrage today he's having a pretty nice day. Mundane events are mundane.

It is good to have a boring president after an exciting one, I think.

111 jaunte  Sat, Jul 28, 2012 8:00:28pm

re: #110 Ojoe

Circumstances have a way of getting exciting around them, no matter how boring they are.

112 Ojoe  Sat, Jul 28, 2012 8:02:01pm

re: #111 jaunte

That is true.

113 Dark_Falcon  Sat, Jul 28, 2012 8:02:24pm

re: #109 Big Joe

From Politico

Analysis and discussion is not criticism, but the Obama campaign would say it was, even if it wasn't. The Romney campaign, would of course do the same thing if given the chance. That kind of claiming the other guy is dishonest is part of how the game is played, regardless of its truth.

114 Dark_Falcon  Sat, Jul 28, 2012 8:03:01pm

re: #111 jaunte

Circumstances have a way of getting exciting around them, no matter how boring they are.

The last boring presidency was that of Calvin Coolidge.

115 jaunte  Sat, Jul 28, 2012 8:04:14pm

re: #114 Dark_Falcon

And even then, we had the great 1927 Mississippi flood.

116 Mich-again  Sat, Jul 28, 2012 8:10:38pm
Some of Romney’s Jewish donors are flying here from the United States to attend the Jerusalem fundraiser on Monday morning, including Las Vegas casino mogul Sheldon Adelson, who has pledged to personally give tens of millions of dollars to a pro-Romney super PAC.

There is the reason this is event is closed to the media. And its not Sheldon Adelson's ties to Vegas casinos that have people wondering, its his casino within the People's Republic of China that clearly took some serious influence peddling by Adelson to obtain approvals from the party. Because casino profits are tied to gaming, there really is no way for US officials to know if those profits aren't simply laundered funds meant for foreigners to influence US elections through Adelson's political activism. Oh and BTW Adelson has already been found guilty of influence peddling regarding his Chinese operations so its no stretch to ask him questions on this subject.

Romney doesn't want any media near his star donor. I say that's why this event is off limits to journalists.

117 Dark_Falcon  Sat, Jul 28, 2012 8:12:55pm

re: #115 jaunte

And even then, we had the great 1927 Mississippi flood.

True, but Coolidge just kept catching fish in South Dakota, not even making a minor show of being in crisis mode for weeks.

Fun fact: One of the Prohibition Agents assigned to augment Coolidge's bodyguards was Richard James Hart. Not a household name to be sure, but you'll be able to guess something about him when you read the name he was born with: Vincenzo Capone. He was Al Capone's eldest brother, and like his younger brothers Al and Frank it is confirmed that he killed at least two people (though both were ruled justified in his case). I sometimes see that as proof that an aptitude for violence can run in families.

118 freetoken  Sat, Jul 28, 2012 8:28:45pm

Has anyone seen a good answer to the question of why is a US Presidential candidate raising money in foreign nations?

119 Kragar  Sat, Jul 28, 2012 8:30:59pm

re: #118 freetoken

Has anyone seen a good answer to the question of why is a US Presidential candidate raising money in foreign nations?

Because shut up.

120 William Barnett-Lewis  Sat, Jul 28, 2012 8:32:21pm

re: #117 Dark_Falcon

True, but Coolidge just kept catching fish in South Dakota, not even making a minor show of being in crisis mode for weeks.

Fun fact: One of the Prohibition Agents assigned to augment Coolidge's bodyguards was Richard James Hart. Not a household name to be sure, but you'll be able to guess something about him when you read the name he was born with: Vincenzo Capone. He was Al Capone's eldest brother, and like his younger brothers Al and Frank it is confirmed that he killed at least two people (though both were ruled justified in his case). I sometimes see that as proof that an aptitude for violence can run in families.

It's also a suitable reminder that often the only difference between a criminal and a law man is which one possesses the badge.

121 Gretchen G.Tiger  Sat, Jul 28, 2012 8:32:59pm

I just went thru two bins of paper and shredded 3 bags worth.

Exciting Saturday Night, huh?

Actually, I feel very relieved that it isn't on the floor anymore

122 Gretchen G.Tiger  Sat, Jul 28, 2012 8:33:35pm

re: #118 freetoken

Has anyone seen a good answer to the question of why is a US Presidential candidate raising money in foreign nations?

I think Obama was accused of the same thing last time around, no?

123 Targetpractice  Sat, Jul 28, 2012 8:33:59pm

re: #118 freetoken

Has anyone seen a good answer to the question of why is a US Presidential candidate raising money in foreign nations?

Personally, I'm giggling too much at watching people who were absolutely concerned with the possibility that Hillary's campaign was being bankrolled by the Chinese in '08 now see nothing wrong with a Republican fundraising on foreign soil. Apparently the idea of a presidency being for sale on the international market doesn't give them pause.

124 SanFranciscoZionist  Sat, Jul 28, 2012 8:38:42pm

re: #122 ggt

I think Obama was accused of the same thing last time around, no?

I think he still is:

[Link: www.hollywoodreporter.com...]

This appears to be one of those things that initially seems weird and counterintuitive, and turns out to be something that's been done for a bit.

Did Bush, Kerry, etc., or is this newer?

125 William Barnett-Lewis  Sat, Jul 28, 2012 8:38:48pm

re: #123 Targetpractice

IOKIYAAR.

126 Gretchen G.Tiger  Sat, Jul 28, 2012 8:39:51pm

re: #124 SanFranciscoZionist

I think he still is:

[Link: www.hollywoodreporter.com...]

This appears to be one of those things that initially seems weird and counterintuitive, and turns out to be something that's been done for a bit.

Did Bush, Kerry, etc., or is this newer?

I get so tired of the political dog and pony show. It hasn't changed since the beginning of people.

127 freetoken  Sat, Jul 28, 2012 8:41:17pm

re: #124 SanFranciscoZionist

re: #122 ggt

I'm sure other candidates have collected money from overseas before. However, I wonder why more people don't sit back and ponder the whole ordeal.

It's bad enough that organizations like corporations can now spend unlimited amounts on the campaign. That individual candidates then go abroad to raise money just shows what an "election" is really about.

129 Dark_Falcon  Sat, Jul 28, 2012 9:02:20pm

re: #120 William Barnett-Lewis

It's also a suitable reminder that often the only difference between a criminal and a law man is which one possesses the badge.

True that. It appears (at least to me) that Hart was sent after the second man he killed (a fugitive Sioux Indian) specifically because it was expected that the fugitive would violently resist apprehension and so the feds wanted to send someone would would not hesitate to kill if necessary. This illustrates a rule followed by any organization that must sometimes use violence (lawful or not): If you expect your target to get violent, make sure you send men who will be ready to respond in kind.

As it happened, though, the shooting itself was considered questionable and Hart was tried for murder. However, the jury in his trial ruled the shooting as self defense.

130 labman57  Sat, Jul 28, 2012 9:13:32pm

What else is new? This is the Republican Party that we're talking about.

131 Targetpractice  Sat, Jul 28, 2012 9:26:38pm

You know NBC, it's not bad enough that you've secured coverage of the Olympic games for the next million years, but time-delaying coverage and practicing almost 1:1 ratio of ads to coverage should be classified as crimes against humanity.

132 Dark_Falcon  Sat, Jul 28, 2012 9:30:18pm

How long before some "conservative" blogger calls City Journal's Nicole Gelinas a 'RINO'. I ask because this book review by her is a sane and rational look at the cloths we buy and I feel sadly certain someone's going to call her review "liberal". The first bit:

Overdressed: The Shockingly High Cost of Cheap Fashion, by Elizabeth L. Cline (Portfolio Hardcover, 256 pp., $25.95)

Earlier this month, the Ralph Lauren apparel house unveiled its designs for the U.S. Olympic team. Outrage soon erupted. The outfits—replete with berets—were made in China. House Speaker John Boehner said Lauren should have known better; Senate Majority Leader Harry Reid said that the clothes belonged in a bonfire.

On one level, it makes zero sense for American politicians to be surprised that our Olympic athletes wear clothing made by young Chinese women most likely living in dormitories (the labels don’t identify the particular factory). As Elizabeth Cline writes in Overdressed: The Shockingly High Cost of Cheap Fashion, “a staggering 41 percent of our [imported] clothes are now made” in China, a figure that has more than doubled in a half-decade. America manufactures only 2 percent of its own clothes these days, “down from about 50 percent in 1990.”

Chinese clothes—and, to a lesser extent, Bangladeshi, Indian, and Dominican clothes—are cheap. “We pay less for clothes, when measured as a share of our income, than ever in history,” she writes: 3 percent today, a fifth of the percentage we spent a century ago. “Clothing is a better bargain than ever,” so much so that buying clothes “often feels inconsequential.” Because buying a sundress can be cheaper than buying lunch, Americans now purchase 64 garments, annually, on average—more than one per week. Since 1950, world fiber use is up more than eightfold, while the population has less than tripled.

Terrific, right? Everyone has more variety and choice than ever before. Well into the 1980s, Americans spent their clothing dollars at boring stores like Sears—and only when the seasons changed. Now, they see cool emporiums, such as H&M and Forever 21, everywhere they look. The stores, open late, feature the latest designer knockoffs at low prices. “Where is the Zara?,” a tourist asked me breathlessly outside Lincoln Center last week. I had to calculate which of three that I walk by nearly daily was closest.

You get what you pay for, though. “Half our wardrobe is now made of plastic,” Cline writes, as Chinese-made polyester now dominates closets. Cotton and wool cost money. The plastic isn’t well-stitched, either. Massive factories use cheap, simple stitches to get the product out the door. One 67-year-old woman tells Cline that the hems on her childhood dolls’ clothes were better than hems on modern human clothes. Look around, and you’ll see people wearing ill-fitting or sleeveless garments, because tailoring takes work. “The more basic clothes are, the less it matters where they’re made,” Cline notes. “A tank top can be made anywhere in the world.” And if you ever wondered why today’s adult women often look as though they just came from hosting a child’s make-believe party, it’s because retailers hide bad fabrics and stitching with glued-on bows, sparkles, and trinkets.

Read the whole thing.

133 William Barnett-Lewis  Sat, Jul 28, 2012 10:10:10pm

re: #131 Targetpractice

You know NBC, it's not bad enough that you've secured coverage of the Olympic games for the next million years, but time-delaying coverage and practicing almost 1:1 ratio of ads to coverage should be classified as crimes against humanity.

NBC is why I stopped watching the Olympics several games ago. Especially since sailing and fencing and shooting (we won't even mention Modern Pentathlon :( ) never get any air time.

134 Kragar  Sat, Jul 28, 2012 10:17:14pm
135 goddamnedfrank  Sat, Jul 28, 2012 10:24:22pm

Nice. The French women's soccer team is putting on a clinic. Just scored twice on North Korea in the span of a minute, now up 3-0.

136 Kragar  Sat, Jul 28, 2012 10:29:34pm

re: #135 goddamnedfrank

Nice. The French women's soccer team is putting on a clinic. Just scored twice on North Korea in the span of a minute, now up 3-0.

Some worried families in NK about now.

137 Dark_Falcon  Sat, Jul 28, 2012 10:32:03pm

re: #135 goddamnedfrank

Nice. The French women's soccer team is putting on a clinic. Just scored twice on North Korea in the span of a minute, now up 3-0.

Honestly, should they think about letting the Norks score at least one goal? I doubt North Korea is kind to athletes who get humiliated at the Olympics.

I'm not sure how good I'd feel about winning when I know I'd have been in no danger had I lost, but the other person was going to be beaten badly for having lost to me.

138 goddamnedfrank  Sat, Jul 28, 2012 10:32:19pm

BAM! Perfect header goal off a corner kick. France up 4-0.

139 William Barnett-Lewis  Sat, Jul 28, 2012 10:35:13pm

re: #133 William Barnett-Lewis

August 11. Cramming it all into one day which makes it even harder.

140 William Barnett-Lewis  Sat, Jul 28, 2012 10:36:19pm

re: #138 goddamnedfrank

BAM! Perfect header goal off a corner kick. France up 4-0.

Gotta hope there's a good grass crop this year in NorK... :(

141 goddamnedfrank  Sat, Jul 28, 2012 10:37:10pm

BOOM-shaka! Two header goals in a row. France burying DPRK 5-0.

142 Dark_Falcon  Sat, Jul 28, 2012 10:39:01pm

re: #141 goddamnedfrank

BOOM-shaka! Two header goals in a row. France burying DPRK 5-0.

Though one must admit: It feels justly good to watch North Korea's time get piston-pounded. Few nations have leaders who more richly deserve humiliation than North Korea.

143 William Barnett-Lewis  Sat, Jul 28, 2012 10:43:39pm

And with that, have a good evening & please consider sending NBC an email asking that they show modern Pent on the 11th. I know they won't but it's worth the try anyway.

Good night!

144 Usually refered to as anyways  Sat, Jul 28, 2012 10:46:11pm

re: #142 Dark_Falcon

Though one must admit: It feels justly good to watch North Korea's time get piston-pounded. Few nations have leaders who more richly deserve humiliation than North Korea.

I feel it would be nice if we could put all that shit aside, and just appreciate the talent and their individual efforts.

So no, I would not like to see any countries athletes humiliated.

145 goddamnedfrank  Sat, Jul 28, 2012 10:50:17pm

It's over. I don't give a fuck about the politics. This is some hellaciously good soccer. I wish France had brought this level of play on Wednesday against us.

I'm kind of ambivalent about the IOC allowing the North Koreans to play at all if we're going to be so concerned about the consequences their athletes face for losing. Aug. 3rd has the two Koreas facing each other in the first round of men's team table tennis, and the South Koreans heavily favored to win. That should be some epically tense shit.

146 Dark_Falcon  Sat, Jul 28, 2012 10:51:17pm

re: #144 ozbloke

I feel it would be nice if we could put all that shit aside, and just appreciate the talent and their individual efforts.

So no, I would not like to see any countries athletes humiliated.

Sorry, but non-violently extending political rivalries and hostilities into the Olympics dates back to the ancient Greeks.

147 Dark_Falcon  Sat, Jul 28, 2012 10:53:29pm

re: #145 goddamnedfrank

It's over. I don't give a fuck about the politics. This is some hellaciously good soccer. I wish France had brought this level of play on Wednesday against us.

I'm kind of ambivalent about the IOC allowing the North Koreans to play at all if we're going to be so concerned about the consequences their athletes face for losing. Aug. 3rd has the two Koreas facing each other in the first round of men's team table tennis, and the South Koreans heavily favored to win, that should be some epically tense shit.

I agree with the bolded part. I really don't like allowing countries to compete in the Olympics that will brutalize their athletes if they do not perform. It seems a violation of the entire spirit of the games.

148 Usually refered to as anyways  Sat, Jul 28, 2012 10:58:29pm

re: #146 Dark_Falcon

Sorry, but non-violently extending political rivalries and hostilities into the Olympics dates back to the ancient Greeks.

That's not my fault, but I not am prepared to say nothing when I hear you delight in the humiliation of a bunch of athletes who having given years of their life to have an opportunity to compete and challenge or become the worlds best.

Its a shame, that you dismiss this and use it as a means to criticise the politics of the country they are from.

149 JamesWI  Sat, Jul 28, 2012 11:03:22pm

re: #133 William Barnett-Lewis

NBC is why I stopped watching the Olympics several games ago. Especially since sailing and fencing and shooting (we won't even mention Modern Pentathlon :( ) never get any air time.

Fencing was on this afternoon. Watched the whole thing while I was working out. Apparently, Italian women are scary with swords, since they swept the medals.

150 Dark_Falcon  Sat, Jul 28, 2012 11:03:30pm

re: #148 ozbloke

That's not my fault, but I not am prepared to say nothing when I hear you delight in the humiliation of a bunch of athletes who having given years of their life to have an opportunity to compete and challenge or become the worlds best.

Its a shame, that you dismiss this and use it as a means to criticise the politics of the country they are from.

I don't delight in their humiliation, I like the idea that it makes North Korea's leadership feel humiliated to have lost, a like mostly subsumed by concern for what may happen to the athletes.

151 Usually refered to as anyways  Sat, Jul 28, 2012 11:11:19pm

re: #150 Dark_Falcon

I don't delight in their humiliation, I like the idea that it makes North Korea's leadership feel humiliated to have lost, a like mostly subsumed by concern for what may happen to the athletes.

re: #142 Dark_Falcon

Sounded like you were having a fun time here.

Though one must admit: It feels justly good to watch North Korea's time get piston-pounded.

It's your right, I'm not telling you not to say it, I just wanted to leave you my thoughts.
I didn't down ding your post or anything.

Feel free to criticise NK whenever you like, heck most of the time I would probably join in.
Enjoy watching the games, I'm celebrating the triumphs of the athletes, and the effort it took for them to get there.

152 dragonath  Sat, Jul 28, 2012 11:25:53pm

re: #131 Targetpractice

You know NBC, it's not bad enough that you've secured coverage of the Olympic games for the next million years, but time-delaying coverage and practicing almost 1:1 ratio of ads to coverage should be classified as crimes against humanity.

What's extra sucky is that for people like me, who missed the opening ceremonies, there's no chance to see it on Youtube because NBC Universal is yanking every single video.

Gah!

153 Usually refered to as anyways  Sat, Jul 28, 2012 11:28:54pm

re: #152 Fred Galt

What's extra sucky is that for people like me, who missed the opening ceremonies, there's no chance to see it on Youtube because NBC Universal is yanking every single video.

Gah!

Agreed, I missed the opening ceremonies too.
There a bits I'd like to see.

154 boredtechindenver  Sat, Jul 28, 2012 11:32:13pm

Here are the bits that NBC/Universal have online.

155 freetoken  Sat, Jul 28, 2012 11:35:20pm

re: #152 Fred Galt

re: #153 ozbloke

There's always... ahem... Piratebay...

156 Usually refered to as anyways  Sat, Jul 28, 2012 11:39:19pm

re: #155 freetoken

re: #153 ozbloke

There's always... ahem... Piratebay...

AhHar my harties, there she be.

157 Usually refered to as anyways  Sat, Jul 28, 2012 11:41:11pm

re: #154 boredtechindenver

Here are the bits that NBC/Universal have online.

Thanks for teasing me...
Not for non US viewers.

/ Apparently, we not matter

158 Kragar  Sat, Jul 28, 2012 11:49:50pm

re: #157 ozbloke

Thanks for teasing me...
Not for non US viewers.

/ Apparently, we not matter

Think about those of us who could care less. We're stuck with being inundated with nonsense for the next few weeks.

No ones cares about the apathetic.

159 Usually refered to as anyways  Sat, Jul 28, 2012 11:56:06pm

re: #158 Kragar

Think about those of us who could care less. We're stuck with being inundated with nonsense for the next few weeks.

No ones cares about the apathetic.

What better entertainment is there, you heard of Mitt?
He's been popular.

160 freetoken  Sun, Jul 29, 2012 12:37:51am
161 freetoken  Sun, Jul 29, 2012 1:15:06am

I'm not much of a fan of "country" music, and that goes doubly regarding the last couple of decades' of product from that genre, but some of the older stuff has its charms, especially from this female singer:

162 researchok  Sun, Jul 29, 2012 1:29:54am

re: #161 freetoken

Absofreakinlutely timeless

163 freetoken  Sun, Jul 29, 2012 1:33:28am

re: #162 researchok

Yes... but this is more me:

164 researchok  Sun, Jul 29, 2012 1:40:56am

re: #163 freetoken

Outstanding.

Xavier Cugat?

165 freetoken  Sun, Jul 29, 2012 1:47:22am

re: #164 researchok

Um... Cab Calloway... as in the song's lyric "...Calloway Boogie... "

Two music demerits for you.

But, America is the land of second chances, so each of the following are worth 1 point:

Name the composer:

Name the movie:

Bonus point - for the first piece, name the contemporary cooking reality show which uses this music.

166 researchok  Sun, Jul 29, 2012 1:54:52am

John Williams, Harry Potter

Easy- Godfather

Cannot think of the cooking show.

167 freetoken  Sun, Jul 29, 2012 1:56:32am

re: #166 researchok

John Williams, Harry Potter

Easy- Godfather

Cannot think of the cooking show.

Second one - correct.

First one - nope. Though I've heard plenty of movie music which takes clues from the actual composer's work.

Bonus - ok, it's a tough one. It's used on Sweet Genius.

168 researchok  Sun, Jul 29, 2012 1:58:00am

OK, what is the first?

169 researchok  Sun, Jul 29, 2012 1:58:43am

Lord of the Rings?

170 researchok  Sun, Jul 29, 2012 2:00:07am

OK, now it's beginning to bug me...I just can't place it...

171 freetoken  Sun, Jul 29, 2012 2:00:33am

re: #168 researchok

I'll leave it up to the whole class as a take-home problem.

As for the bonus question, I think it's the funkiest of the Food Network shows:

172 researchok  Sun, Jul 29, 2012 2:01:33am

re: #171 freetoken

ARRRGH!!

I can't get it out of my mind now!

Alright, maybe the music will distract me...

173 researchok  Sun, Jul 29, 2012 2:03:37am

Aquarium, The Carnival Of The Animals by Saint Saens Camille

Redeemed by Google, I hope

174 researchok  Sun, Jul 29, 2012 2:13:07am

Where you need to be:

Montreal Jazz Festival

From Wiki:

The Festival International de Jazz de Montréal (English: Montreal International Jazz Festival) is an annual jazz festival held in Montreal, Quebec, Canada. The Montreal Jazz Fest holds the 2004 Guinness World Record as the world's largest jazz festival.[1] Every year it features roughly 3,000 artists from 30-odd countries, more than 650 concerts (including 450 free outdoor performances), and welcomes close to 2.5 million visitors (34% of whom are tourists) as well as 400 accredited journalists.[1] The festival takes place at 10 free outdoor stages and 10 indoor concert halls.[1]
A major part of the city's downtown core is closed to traffic for ten days, as free outdoor shows are open to the public and held on many stages at the same time, from noon until midnight. Attendance at some shows is over 100,000 people, and occasionally exceeds 200,000.[citation needed] Shows are held in a wide variety of venues, from relatively small jazz clubs to the large concert halls of Place des Arts. Some of the outdoor shows are held on the cordoned-off streets, while others are in terraced parks

175 Sol Berdinowitz  Sun, Jul 29, 2012 2:38:32am

re: #15 dragonfire1981

Who told Adolf Hitler to suck it...

There once was a man from Nantucket
who told Adolf Hitler to suck it
He dropped a depth charge on his undersea barge
and now from the seabed we'll pluck it!

176 Sol Berdinowitz  Sun, Jul 29, 2012 2:40:39am

re: #21 Kragar

The GOP’s War Against Facts

An ongoing theme: there are Higher Truths.

These include Obama's foreign birth and Muslim religion, America as a Christian Nation and God's Own Country, the ongoing threat to Free Enterprise and The Right To Bear Arms, etc...

Facts that do not support these Higher Truths are to be ignored or bent to fit. Barring that, new ones will be invented.

177 Kragar  Sun, Jul 29, 2012 3:42:10am

And now, I make the final preparations before my glorious Cadian mechanized infantry brigade engage the corrupted forces of the the traitor legions.

178 Rochi613  Sun, Jul 29, 2012 3:51:17am

Could we get back to Mr. Romney for a minute?

There are about 250,000-300,000 Americans living in Israel who have dual citizenship and are able to vote in the 2012 election (I'm one of them). We tend to vote. That's no doubt part of why Mr. Romney is here, just as Mr. Obama came before the last election in 2008. As for barring reporters from his meeting with donors, I don't think it's a big deal. He wants to share his future plans for the Middle East freely and take questions on what are existential issues for Israelis without being inhibited by or misquoted by the press. So what? The leadership in that room will pass on to their communities what Mr. Romney had to say. He will have dozens of other public meetings. Snarky comments here about "right wingers" and "Jewish money" belittle the stark, reality that surrounds and threatens America's most faithful ally in this crucial and dangerous neighborhood of the world. An American President's outlook (or that of an aspirant to that office) is listened to very carefully here by everyone, and does effect the choice of American-Israeli voters here. My fellow Lizards, I'm not a Romney fan nor am I an Obama fan (I voted for Mr. McCain in 2008), but I know I have a huge decision to make, one that deeply effects my beloved birthplace of America and the land of my destiny, Israel. Let's not turn it all into a joke. And it's Tisha BeAv, so I am extra-sensitive about the destructive power of mockery and scorn. Forgive me if I myself have gone too for.

179 Eventual Carrion  Sun, Jul 29, 2012 4:39:04am

re: #178 Rochi613

Could we get back to Mr. Romney for a minute?

There are about 250,000-300,000 Americans living in Israel who have dual citizenship and are able to vote in the 2012 election (I'm one of them). We tend to vote. That's no doubt part of why Mr. Romney is here, just as Mr. Obama came before the last election in 2008. As for barring reporters from his meeting with donors, I don't think it's a big deal. He wants to share his future plans for the Middle East freely and take questions on what are existential issues for Israelis without being inhibited by or misquoted by the press. So what? The leadership in that room will pass on to their communities what Mr. Romney had to say. He will have dozens of other public meetings. Snarky comments here about "right wingers" and "Jewish money" belittle the stark, reality that surrounds and threatens America's most faithful ally in this crucial and dangerous neighborhood of the world. An American President's outlook (or that of an aspirant to that office) is listened to very carefully here by everyone, and does effect the choice of American-Israeli voters here. My fellow Lizards, I'm not a Romney fan nor am I an Obama fan (I voted for Mr. McCain in 2008), but I know I have a huge decision to make, one that deeply effects my beloved birthplace of America and the land of my destiny, Israel. Let's not turn it all into a joke. And it's Tisha BeAv, so I am extra-sensitive about the destructive power of mockery and scorn. Forgive me if I myself have gone too for.

Not too far, just not in line with how I think a pres hopeful should act. "He wants to share his future plans for the Middle East freely" is BS. Those plans will be paid for by us (tax payers) and I want to know his plans before he is possibly elected and they are attempted to be implemented. If I don't agree with them I will not vote for him (which I won't anyway, but the point still stands). I don't want him promising shit to people that I don't want to pay for. If he can't speak of his plans to ALL of the American people he should not be making them, and if he thinks it will piss of the majority of people by being reported on then he is not what this country needs as a leader.

180 Obdicut  Sun, Jul 29, 2012 5:19:30am

re: #178 Rochi613

Snarky comments here about "right wingers" and "Jewish money" belittle the stark, reality that surrounds and threatens America's most faithful ally in this crucial and dangerous neighborhood of the world.

There haven't been any comments about "Jewish money". Please actually have a basis for such an accusation before throwing it around.

181 Dark_Falcon  Sun, Jul 29, 2012 5:37:13am

re: #175 Expand Your Ground

There once was a man from Nantucket
who told Adolf Hitler to suck it
He dropped a depth charge on his undersea barge
and now from the seabed we'll pluck it!

Bravo!

182 Ayeless in Ghazi  Sun, Jul 29, 2012 5:37:34am

Amid all the enjoyment and appreciation of the Olympic opening ceremony, a small pocket of butthurt, in the form of Conservative MP Aidan Burley:

The most leftie opening ceremony I have ever seen - more than Beijing, the capital of a communist state! Welfare tribute next?

183 Obdicut  Sun, Jul 29, 2012 5:38:51am

re: #182 Aye Pod

That's the guy who rented a Nazi uniform for his friend to dress up in during a stag party, right? And at the stag party there were speeches given where they (playfully or not) were talking about how awesome the Third Reich was?

What an asshole.

184 Obdicut  Sun, Jul 29, 2012 5:40:53am

re: #181 Dark_Falcon

By the way, Dark, yesterday you claimed that Jesus 'understood that sometimes you have to fight'. I challenged you to back that up with scripture. Can you do so?

185 Ayeless in Ghazi  Sun, Jul 29, 2012 5:43:14am

re: #183 Obdicut

He added:

Sounds like an EDL statement. Racist prick tries to walk it back of course, in totally unconvincing fashion:

Aidan Burley MP ‏@AidanBurleyMP
Seems my tweet has been misunderstood. I was talking about the way it was handled in the show, not multiculturalism itself

186 Dark_Falcon  Sun, Jul 29, 2012 5:45:44am

re: #184 Obdicut

By the way, Dark, yesterday you claimed that Jesus 'understood that sometimes you have to fight'. I challenged you to back that up with scripture. Can you do so?

Luke 22:36: Then said he unto them, But now, he that hath a purse, let him take it, and likewise his scrip: and he that hath no sword, let him sell his garment, and buy one.

I used the King James version since I'm not entirely sure what the best version to use is.

187 Obdicut  Sun, Jul 29, 2012 5:46:59am

re: #185 Aye Pod

I'm trying to figure out how Shakespeare isn't multicultural crap, given that most of his plots are from foreign sources and most of them occur in foreign lands, and many of them are about thinking about the roles of outsiders in society, or women challenging gender roles, etc.

Probably the odious shit has no actual knowledge of Shakespeare.

188 Obdicut  Sun, Jul 29, 2012 5:49:42am

re: #186 Dark_Falcon

Luke 22:36: Then said he unto them, But now, he that hath a purse, let him take it, and likewise his scrip: and he that hath no sword, let him sell his garment, and buy one.

I used the King James version since I'm not entirely sure what the best version to use is.

Did you just not read my post yesterday on that, or something?

Immediately following that, Jesus says the reason for that is that they must be counted among the outlaws, as it says in prophecy. The disciples tell Jesus, "Look, we have two swords, and he says "Enough, enough!". And then when one of the swords is actually used, he tells the disciple who used it to stop.

There is no command to violence in the disciples possessing two swords. It is not enough to fight the Romans with. The purpose of them is obviously other; most likely to fulfill the prophecy of being 'outlaws' by being in armed rebellion.

If you think otherwise, explain why two swords are enough, and what they were enough for, given the actual events described in the New Testament.

189 Dark_Falcon  Sun, Jul 29, 2012 5:50:57am

re: #187 Obdicut

I'm trying to figure out how Shakespeare isn't multicultural crap, given that most of his plots are from foreign sources and most of them occur in foreign lands, and many of them are about thinking about the roles of outsiders in society, or women challenging gender roles, etc.

Probably the odious shit has no actual knowledge of Shakespeare.

Maybe he just doesn't think deeply about those plays he has seen. It's not uncommon for people to never really take the time reflect on the plays and movies they see. Or he simply sees Shakespeare as "English" and thus good, while those things that are cultural imports are "Foreign" and thus bad.

190 Obdicut  Sun, Jul 29, 2012 5:52:34am

re: #189 Dark_Falcon

Yeah, he's probably just considering the source rather than what's being discussed, kind of like when the GOP plays "Born in the USA" and thinks it's a patriotic song about how great it is to be born in the USA.

191 Dark_Falcon  Sun, Jul 29, 2012 5:53:50am

re: #190 Obdicut

Yeah, he's probably just considering the source rather than what's being discussed, kind of like when the GOP plays "Born in the USA" and thinks it's a patriotic song about how great it is to be born in the USA.

Concur.

192 Dark_Falcon  Sun, Jul 29, 2012 5:57:16am

re: #188 Obdicut

Did you just not read my post yesterday on that, or something?

Immediately following that, Jesus says the reason for that is that they must be counted among the outlaws, as it says in prophecy. The disciples tell Jesus, "Look, we have two swords, and he says "Enough, enough!". And then when one of the swords is actually used, he tells the disciple who used it to stop.

There is no command to violence in the disciples possessing two swords. It is not enough to fight the Romans with. The purpose of them is obviously other; most likely to fulfill the prophecy of being 'outlaws' by being in armed rebellion.

If you think otherwise, explain why two sword are enough, and what they were enough for, given the actual events described in the New Testament.

You asked for support, I gave what I had. and if I can't justify that view, then I can't. It won't really change my favored policies, as my views on the necessity of armed defense are not based on the Bible.

193 Feline Emperor of the Conservative Tears  Sun, Jul 29, 2012 5:57:37am

re: #190 Obdicut

Yeah, he's probably just considering the source rather than what's being discussed, kind of like when the GOP plays "Born in the USA" and thinks it's a patriotic song about how great it is to be born in the USA.

Like those folks who think Colbert is a serious conservative pundit.

194 Obdicut  Sun, Jul 29, 2012 6:03:09am

re: #192 Dark_Falcon

You asked for support, I gave what I had. and if I can't justify that view, then I can't. It won't really change my favored policies, as my views on the necessity of armed defense are not based on the Bible.

I'm not challenging your views on the necessity of armed defense-- I certainly agree you sometimes have to fight-- I'm pointing out that there isn't any scriptural support for saying Jesus understood that sometimes you have to fight. The main thrust of what I was saying the other day is that if you read the New Testament, it's very clearly an apocalyptic religion-- that Jesus and his disciples believed that his coming heralded the quick end of the world-- and that's why Jesus's commandments of how to live are so extreme: giving up all your wealth, just following him, making no resistance to violence except to flee, etc.

195 Dark_Falcon  Sun, Jul 29, 2012 6:06:54am

re: #194 Obdicut

I'm not challenging your views on the necessity of armed defense-- I certainly agree you sometimes have to fight-- I'm pointing out that there isn't any scriptural support for saying Jesus understood that sometimes you have to fight. The main thrust of what I was saying the other day is that if you read the New Testament, it's very clearly an apocalyptic religion-- that Jesus and his disciples believed that his coming heralded the quick end of the world-- and that's why Jesus's commandments of how to live are so extreme: giving up all your wealth, just following him, making no resistance to violence except to flee, etc.

True. i guess the only reply to that that can be given would be to allow for that and then note that Jesus did say that he did not know when the end would come. Only God the Father knew that. Not really a counter, just a reply.

196 Obdicut  Sun, Jul 29, 2012 6:12:49am

re: #195 Dark_Falcon

True. i guess the only reply to that that can be given would be to allow for that and then note that Jesus did say that he did not know when the end would come. Only God the Father knew that. Not really a counter, just a reply.

And that starts to get into the mindbending polytheism of Christianity, where Jesus clearly is sometimes clearly entirely separate from God.

Hey, did you know in Mormonism, they believe that God was once a human being like us? Or at least a 'man' like us?

The more I read about it, the less relationship it has to the main Christian tradition. It's really a very radical departure, and I can understand why contemporaries of it compared it to Islam.

197 Hercules Grytpype-Thynne  Sun, Jul 29, 2012 6:14:29am

re: #195 Dark_Falcon

True. i guess the only reply to that that can be given would be to allow for that and then note that Jesus did say that he did not know when the end would come. Only God the Father knew that. Not really a counter, just a reply.

He didn't know the day or the hour. He clearly thought he knew the century.

Mt 16:28: Verily I say unto you, There be some standing here, which shall not taste of death, till they see the Son of man coming in his kingdom.

198 Dark_Falcon  Sun, Jul 29, 2012 6:16:07am

re: #196 Obdicut

And that starts to get into the mindbending polytheism of Christianity, where Jesus clearly is sometimes clearly entirely separate from God.

Hey, did you know in Mormonism, they believe that God was once a human being like us? Or at least a 'man' like us?

The more I read about it, the less relationship it has to the main Christian tradition. It's really a very radical departure, and I can understand why contemporaries of it compared it to Islam.

I'm going to just back off at this point. I'm not good at theology, and I normally stay out of these sorts of debates.

199 Obdicut  Sun, Jul 29, 2012 6:17:03am

re: #197 Hercules Grytpype-Thynne

That can be hand-waved aside by saying that there are some who had visions of Christ coming into his kingdom. That's how the Catholic church deals with that passage. There's a lot of hand-waving you have to do to think that Jesus wasn't teaching an apocalyptic religion.

200 Obdicut  Sun, Jul 29, 2012 6:18:32am

re: #198 Dark_Falcon

I'm going to just back off at this point. I'm not good at theology, and I normally stay out of these sorts of debates.

Well, being good at theology is like being good at imaginary boxing, so I wouldn't sweat it.

The 'god was once a man' thing struck me pretty strongly, though. I hadn't known that, and it explains part of the extreme suspicion that a lot of conservative Christians have for Mormonism.

201 Hercules Grytpype-Thynne  Sun, Jul 29, 2012 6:29:22am

re: #199 Obdicut

That can be hand-waved aside by saying that there are some who had visions of Christ coming into his kingdom. That's how the Catholic church deals with that passage. There's a lot of hand-waving you have to do to think that Jesus wasn't teaching an apocalyptic religion.

I don't know that there's anything in the Bible that can't be hand-waved away by the sufficiently well motivated. This is part of what makes discussing theology so generally pointless.

As far as this particular hand-wave goes, I hadn't heard of it before, and even as hand-waves go it's singularly unconvincing. What's the point of emphasizing that people who would have visions would have them while still alive?

202 Obdicut  Sun, Jul 29, 2012 6:30:37am

re: #201 Hercules Grytpype-Thynne

What's the point of emphasizing that people who would have visions would have them while still alive?

Heh. Good point. I hadn't really thought of it that way before.

203 Dark_Falcon  Sun, Jul 29, 2012 6:32:40am

Too often what we read from South Africa is depressing. But I'm going to avoid the most recent example of it* and the Gellerism/Stalker Racism it may engender in favor of something positive;

'Zambezia': 3D animation puts South Africa film in the picture

He's got blue wings, an adventurous spirit and is poised to be the latest film star to come out of South Africa.

A high-spirited young falcon, Kai is the main character in "Zambezia," a new South African 3D animation film featuring an all-star voice cast, including Hollywood A-listers Samuel L. Jackson, Abigail Breslin, Jeff Goldblum, Leonard Nimoy and Jeremy Suarez.

Set in the majestic Victoria Falls and inspired by southern Africa's startling artwork, "Zambezia" is hoping to put South African animation on the map while enthralling children around the world with its uplifting message of togetherness.

SNIP

The movie, which is targeted toward children aged five to 11, tells the story of Kai, an intrepid young falcon that's brought up by his strict father in an isolated outpost. His lonely life is turned upside down when a kooky bird crashes into his world and tells him of Zambezia -- a bustling bird city where "there's amazing food, music, sights and sounds."

A talented flier, Kai decides to leave his isolated upbringing behind him and explore life in Zambezia. He quickly realizes, however, that getting by in a city can be more difficult and demanding than living alone.

Yet, after joining Zambezia's air force and defending it from a band of marauding lizards, he also discovers the true values of teamwork and community sharing.

It sounds like a good kids movie, though I'm not keen to be seen as the bad guy. To my knowledge, the only places ravaged by the Lizard Army have been nests of trolls and Morlocks.

205 Dark_Falcon  Sun, Jul 29, 2012 6:34:37am

re: #203 Dark_Falcon

The nasty story I was referring to is here. I already know how it will be used by the various haters in the US, which is why I wanted to focus on the positive.

206 Gus  Sun, Jul 29, 2012 6:35:34am

re: #178 Rochi613

Heh.

Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof; or abridging the freedom of speech, or of the press; or the right of the people peaceably to assemble, and to petition the Government for a redress of grievances.

We will not be silenced.

207 Rochi613  Sun, Jul 29, 2012 6:37:13am

re: #180 Obdicut

Here are few :

#1 Well, I'm sure no right wing extremists will think anything is up when Romney decides to have a secret meeting with rich Jewish backers.

#4 Rich jews, American politics, money, Israel. There are plenty of people, not exclusively wingnuts, who make a big deal out of this stuff.

#25 this gathering of the mega-rich

#35 And free haircuts for those side curls?
It's not about money, but it is mocking.

#54 (that many old Jews in one place, what are the odds there's an actual furrier or two?)
Ditto

208 Gus  Sun, Jul 29, 2012 6:37:59am

O_o

209 Dark_Falcon  Sun, Jul 29, 2012 6:39:04am

re: #204 Gus

Stabbed in the back.

Netanyahu: Obama's Sanctions Haven't Stopped Iran By “One Iota”

Photo op:

Image: enhanced-buzz-14552-1343554125-10.jpg

Stabbed, but not in the back. Benjamin Netanyahu has been Mitt Romney's friend longer than I've been alive. He's not going to endorse Romney, for a number of political reasons, but if he gets a chance to kneecap Obama he's likely to take it. But Obama already knew all of this, and his team should have taken it into account. It's always been clear who Netanyahu favors between Obama and Romney and this should come as no surprise.

210 Obdicut  Sun, Jul 29, 2012 6:48:13am

re: #207 Rochi613

Here are few :

#1 Well, I'm sure no right wing extremists will think anything is up when Romney decides to have a secret meeting with rich Jewish backers.

#4 Rich jews, American politics, money, Israel. There are plenty of people, not exclusively wingnuts, who make a big deal out of this stuff.

#25 this gathering of the mega-rich

#35 And free haircuts for those side curls?
It's not about money, but it is mocking.

#54 (that many old Jews in one place, what are the odds there's an actual furrier or two?)
Ditto

None of those are examples of people talking about "Jewish money", which is a very particular accusation that people are worried about the donations because they are coming from Jews. That is not true, and is a very severe accusation of anti-semitism for you to walk in here with.

#1 and #2 are observational, not accusatorial-- they're saying there are people who are going to conspiracy-theory over this, and they're right.

#25 has nothing talking about Jewishness in it. It is based off the price of entry for the fund-raiser.

#35 Is mocking Romney's recent diplomatic fuckups, no clue why on earth you'd think it had anything to do with fearmongering about "Jewish money". That's a puzzler to me.

#54 Is saying that with a lot of old Jews around, since Jews historically were big in the furrier trade, you have good odds of finding a furrier there. That's perfectly true, and is entirely unrelated to "Jewish money".

Can you back up your statement any more robustly than that? Only a few of those were even related to the concept of "Jewish money".

211 Gus  Sun, Jul 29, 2012 6:48:25am
212 Gus  Sun, Jul 29, 2012 6:48:45am
213 Obdicut  Sun, Jul 29, 2012 6:51:00am

re: #212 Gus

It's probably only vulgar to Jews, I doubt most of Romney's base will find any offense in this. They'll probably mostly like it. In a way, that's something to prove the conspiracists who think he's there to court Israeli's favor wrong: he's doing something which will piss off a lot of Jews, but since Jews are already going to heavily vote against him he doesn't care; this is for the consumption of the Evangelical Christians.

214 Gus  Sun, Jul 29, 2012 7:09:49am

Romney cancels on Yacimovich after meeting with Netanyahu
Circles close to former opposition leader Yacimovich say meeting cancelled over disagreements surrounding the economic measures the Netanyahu government is about to adopt.

Looks to me like Bibi's in love. By now they should know what each others shoe leather tastes like.

215 Dark_Falcon  Sun, Jul 29, 2012 7:12:24am

re: #214 Gus

Romney cancels on Yacimovich after meeting with Netanyahu
Circles close to former opposition leader Yacimovich say meeting cancelled over disagreements surrounding the economic measures the Netanyahu government is about to adopt.

Looks to me like Bibi's in love. By now they should know what each others shoe leather tastes like.

Simple deal: You smackdown the lefty who is giving me a problem, I'll backhand your problem lefty. Everybody who should win, does (lefties shouldn't win, or course (says the conservative)).

216 simoom  Sun, Jul 29, 2012 7:17:31am

Romney partially reversed course and will now let the press in to witness a part of his King David Hotel fundraiser. Press will be allowed in to hear his opening speech but then be escorted out before the bundler/donor Q&A session:

[Link: content.usatoday.com...]

Mitt Romney's campaign has changed course and will now allow reporters inside a fundraising event in Jerusalem.

CNN reports the GOP presidential campaign reversed its decision to bar reporters from the money event at the King David Hotel. Now, reporters will be allowed to cover Romney's remarks to about 50 donors, but will be escorted out when he takes questions.

217 simoom  Sun, Jul 29, 2012 7:20:10am

re: #216 simoom

This seems to be excerpts from the speech they're allowing the press in to report on:

[Link: politicalticker.blogs.cnn.com...]

In a major foreign policy move scheduled for late Sunday in Israel, Romney will deliver an unmistakable warning to the leadership in Tehran that war is inevitable if Iran becomes a nuclear power.

"Make no mistake: the ayatollahs in Tehran are testing our moral defenses. They want to know who will object, and who will look the other way," Romney will say in his speech, according to excerpts of the address released by his campaign.

"My message to the people of Israel and the leaders of Iran is one and the same: I will not look away, and neither will my country," he is expected to add.

218 Dark_Falcon  Sun, Jul 29, 2012 7:23:13am

re: #217 simoom

This seems to be excerpts from the speech they're allowing the press in to report on:

[Link: politicalticker.blogs.cnn.com...]

Well, I agree with that: If Iran get s nukes or is about to do so, then war is unavoidable. We simply cannot tolerate that sort of threat to our oil supply.

219 allegro  Sun, Jul 29, 2012 7:25:25am

re: #217 simoom

This seems to be excerpts from the speech they're allowing the press in to report on:

[Link: politicalticker.blogs.cnn.com...]

I don't see how his "tough on Iran" can be taken at all seriously when he doesn't even have the cojones to face reporters and be honest (I know, haha) about his policy positions.

220 allegro  Sun, Jul 29, 2012 7:26:21am

re: #218 Dark_Falcon

Well, I agree with that: If Iran get s nukes or is about to do so, then war is unavoidable. We simply cannot tolerate that sort of threat to our oil supply.

Absolutely. Oil is always more important than tens of thousands of human lives.

//

221 Killgore Trout  Sun, Jul 29, 2012 7:33:40am

re: #218 Dark_Falcon

Well, I agree with that: If Iran get s nukes or is about to do so, then war is unavoidable. We simply cannot tolerate that sort of threat to our oil supply.

I don't think it's unavoidable. If Israel and the US think Iran will be a rational nuclear power they might just let it go.

222 simoom  Sun, Jul 29, 2012 7:36:26am

re: #218 Dark_Falcon

Those excerpts seem to have been released at Dan Senor's morning reporter press briefing:

[Link: thehill.com...]

“If Israel has to take action on its own, in order to stop Iran from developing that capability, the governor would respect that decision,” said Romney adviser on Middle East affairs Dan Senor in a briefing with reporters, according to media reports.

...

Senor previewed portions of the Romney speech to reporters on Sunday.

Also:

[Link: www.buzzfeed.com...]

Dan Senor, Romney's Special Adviser on Foreign Policy, laid out three principles that must be met by Palestinians before a peace deal can be reached.

"There should be no right of return, this is not a platform for new Palestinian refugees down the road to return to Israel," Senor told reporters. "If there is a Palestinian state, that should be the home for Palestinians wanting to return to this region."

That seems to preclude a symbolic return, of a select few, as part of a final peace deal, as has been proposed in the past.

223 Killgore Trout  Sun, Jul 29, 2012 7:45:18am

re: #222 simoom

Those excerpts seem to have been released at Dan Senor's morning reporter press briefing:

[Link: thehill.com...]

Also:

[Link: www.buzzfeed.com...]

That seems to preclude a symbolic return, of a select few, as part of a final peace deal, as has been proposed in the past.

I see no mention of the other usual sticking points: Capital in Jerusalem and ownership of Al Aqsa. Neither of which they are ever going to get. No chance of peace any time soon no matter who's in charge.

224 simoom  Sun, Jul 29, 2012 7:52:52am

Some photos, and a 360-degree panorama, of the venue for Romney's evening speech:

A beautiful spot really.

225 Girth  Sun, Jul 29, 2012 7:55:13am

re: #224 simoom

But I thought teleprompters were the crutch of the half-witted Kenyan usurper...so confused.

226 SanFranciscoZionist  Sun, Jul 29, 2012 8:02:10am

re: #148 ozbloke

That's not my fault, but I not am prepared to say nothing when I hear you delight in the humiliation of a bunch of athletes who having given years of their life to have an opportunity to compete and challenge or become the worlds best.

Its a shame, that you dismiss this and use it as a means to criticise the politics of the country they are from.

The odds are good that these athletes did not have a hell of a lot of say in whether they gave those years, or whether they attended these games.

I'm a shitload more disturbed by that than by whether someone wants to see Kim Jong-Un discomfited.

227 Mattand  Sun, Jul 29, 2012 8:02:41am

re: #178 Rochi613

Could we get back to Mr. Romney for a minute?

There are about 250,000-300,000 Americans living in Israel who have dual citizenship and are able to vote in the 2012 election (I'm one of them). We tend to vote. That's no doubt part of why Mr. Romney is here, just as Mr. Obama came before the last election in 2008. As for barring reporters from his meeting with donors, I don't think it's a big deal. He wants to share his future plans for the Middle East freely and take questions on what are existential issues for Israelis without being inhibited by or misquoted by the press. So what?

Here's so what: the guy wants to President and he has openly admitted he won't reveal what his policies would be, because the mean old press might not be nice to him.

Fuck that. That's part of the job of being President. The fact that he won't let the public know on how would handle the Middle East, a religion- and oil-drenched threat to world stability, is bullshit. It's one of the most important issues, foreign or domestic, a POTUS will ever handle.

You will be misquoted and mocked. That's part of the job. If Mitt's inability to take criticism is that much of a problem, he needs to get his ass back to Bain, where no one would question him.

228 Rochi613  Sun, Jul 29, 2012 8:03:10am

re: #224 simoom

Your 360 degree photo is labeled "Jerusalem, Palestine." As a resident of Jerusalem, I politely suggest you are sorely mistaken.

229 Vicious Babushka  Sun, Jul 29, 2012 8:04:49am

AP Photo fail:

An Ultra-orthodox Jewish man prays during the mourning ritual of Tisha B'Av at the Western Wall,

Any Jew in a prayer shawl is not "Ultra Orthodox" the fact that the man is wearing jewelry, rings and a watch, indicates that he is not ULTRA Orthodox.

At least it is better than last year when all the news services described the "festive celebrations of Tisha B'Av"

230 Sionainn  Sun, Jul 29, 2012 8:06:06am

re: #224 simoom

Some photos, and a 360-degree panorama, of the venue for Romney's evening speech:

[Embedded content]

A beautiful spot really.

Teleprompters?1!11

231 SanFranciscoZionist  Sun, Jul 29, 2012 8:06:50am

re: #214 Gus

Romney cancels on Yacimovich after meeting with Netanyahu
Circles close to former opposition leader Yacimovich say meeting cancelled over disagreements surrounding the economic measures the Netanyahu government is about to adopt.

Looks to me like Bibi's in love. By now they should know what each others shoe leather tastes like.

Yes, that's a really adoring expression. Or, possibly he's trying not to laugh. Or throw up.

232 sagehen  Sun, Jul 29, 2012 8:07:32am

re: #185 Aye Pod

He added:

[Embedded content]

Sounds like an EDL statement. Racist prick tries to walk it back of course, in totally unconvincing fashion:

When you invite 204 countries to all come to the same place at the same time for a 17-day event that people in all those countries are intended to watch and enjoy... isn't multi-culturalism sort of the whole point?

233 SanFranciscoZionist  Sun, Jul 29, 2012 8:08:25am

re: #229 Learned Mother of Zion

AP Photo fail:

An Ultra-orthodox Jewish man prays during the mourning ritual of Tisha B'Av at the Western Wall,

Any Jew in a prayer shawl is not "Ultra Orthodox" the fact that the man is wearing jewelry, rings and a watch, indicates that he is not ULTRA Orthodox.

At least it is better than last year when all the news services described the "festive celebrations of Tisha B'Av"

He's got a tallis on. Ergo=super ultra-Orthodox.

234 simoom  Sun, Jul 29, 2012 8:08:40am

re: #209 Dark_Falcon

Stabbed, but not in the back. Benjamin Netanyahu has been Mitt Romney's friend longer than I've been alive. He's not going to endorse Romney, for a number of political reasons, but if he gets a chance to kneecap Obama he's likely to take it. But Obama already knew all of this, and his team should have taken it into account. It's always been clear who Netanyahu favors between Obama and Romney and this should come as no surprise.

My impression is that Romney is allowing himself to be used, overseas, to put pressure on the current administration's foreign policy, back home. Which probably is as consequential a violation of his frequent "water's edge" mantra as is possible:

[Link: transcripts.cnn.com...]

M. ROMNEY: Well, first, I have to note that as tradition for our nation, I, being on foreign soil, avoid speaking about a new foreign policy or my foreign policy or doing that in a place that would in any way detract from the president's effort to pursue his own foreign policy. So I really can't -- I can't go down that path.

...

M. ROMNEY: Piers, again, I -- given the fact I'm on foreign soil, I really am not going to delve into foreign policy prescriptions that would interfere with the foreign policy of our current president.

He obviously adhere's to it rather selectively.

235 Vicious Babushka  Sun, Jul 29, 2012 8:10:03am

re: #222 simoom

That seems to preclude a symbolic return, of a select few, as part of a final peace deal, as has been proposed in the past.

I can't see a "symbolic return" of a handful of actual elderly '48's, because that would only be a wedge for demands to follow: How can you rip these helpless elderly refugees from their loving families, each one must be accompanied by children, grandchildren, great-grandchildren, nieces, nephews, a entourage of servants, goats, cattle, Twitter followers, Facebook friends, etc.

236 SanFranciscoZionist  Sun, Jul 29, 2012 8:10:43am

re: #209 Dark_Falcon

Stabbed, but not in the back. Benjamin Netanyahu has been Mitt Romney's friend longer than I've been alive. He's not going to endorse Romney, for a number of political reasons, but if he gets a chance to kneecap Obama he's likely to take it. But Obama already knew all of this, and his team should have taken it into account. It's always been clear who Netanyahu favors between Obama and Romney and this should come as no surprise.

Bibi, on that friendship: “I remember him [Romney] for sure, but I don’t think we had any particular connections, I knew him and he knew me, I suppose.”

One of them, or possibly both, is lying through their teeth about how close this friendship is.

237 simoom  Sun, Jul 29, 2012 8:11:13am

re: #228 Rochi613

Your 360 degree photo is labeled "Jerusalem, Palestine." As a resident of Jerusalem, I politely suggest you are sorely mistaken.

In case it isn't clear, I'm not Zeke Miller of Buzzfeed: Politics.

238 Vicious Babushka  Sun, Jul 29, 2012 8:11:18am

re: #233 SanFranciscoZionist

He's got a tallis on. Ergo=super ultra-Orthodox.

Conservative and Reform Jews wear tallis. Heck even Conservative and Reform WOMEN wear tallis. Does that not make them more ULTRA whatever?

239 Hercules Grytpype-Thynne  Sun, Jul 29, 2012 8:11:47am

re: #232 sagehen

When you invite 204 countries to all come to the same place at the same time for a 17-day event that people in all those countries are intended to watch and enjoy... isn't multi-culturalism sort of the whole point?

No, silly. You're taking advantage of the international spotlight to demonstrate the vast superiority of your own culture. (At least that's how Hitler looked at it.)

240 SanFranciscoZionist  Sun, Jul 29, 2012 8:12:06am

re: #238 Learned Mother of Zion

Conservative and Reform Jews wear tallis. Heck even Conservative and Reform WOMEN wear tallis. Does that not make them more ULTRA whatever?

Of course! (It would have been even better if it had been a woman.)

241 SanFranciscoZionist  Sun, Jul 29, 2012 8:12:28am

re: #239 Hercules Grytpype-Thynne

No, silly. You're taking advantage of the international spotlight to demonstrate the vast superiority of your own culture. (At least that's how Hitler looked at it.)

Jesse Owens, on the other hand, had different ideas...

242 dragonfire1981  Sun, Jul 29, 2012 8:18:28am

Wow, how's this for an interesting situation?

I just got finished a long discussion with a right wing friend of mine. She's a nurse at a hospital in a major city a couple of states west of here.

Now I don't have a ton of background information, but the basic fact is this: She has been disciplined and may well be fired because she refused to treat a patient.

She refused to treat them because of her "religious beliefs". And exactly what did this patient say or do that made my friend not want to treat him?

Nothing. She did not want to treat him or deal with her family because they were Muslim.

Yes, REALLY.

She flat out refused to treat them. Her boss assigned a different nurse to them and suspended my friend. She is currently awaiting the outcome of a hearing that will determine whether or not she keeps her job.

I tried to tell her that if she is going to work in certain places she will have to understand she may be dealing with things that may make her uncomfortable.

She believes her "religious rights" should be respected and protected at all times, no matter where she is working.

243 austin_blue  Sun, Jul 29, 2012 8:19:14am
244 Killgore Trout  Sun, Jul 29, 2012 8:20:14am

re: #236 SanFranciscoZionist

Bibi, on that friendship: “I remember him [Romney] for sure, but I don’t think we had any particular connections, I knew him and he knew me, I suppose.”

One of them, or possibly both, is lying through their teeth about how close this friendship is.

The level of actual personal affinity doesn't make any difference anyways. Most of these world leaders probably don't like each other much on a personal level but they have business to attend to. Israel will continue to keep bipartisan support.
One of the rare exceptions is Obama and Sarkozy. Both of them light up when they get together and start goofing around.

245 Sionainn  Sun, Jul 29, 2012 8:21:16am

re: #242 dragonfire1981

Wow, how's this for an interesting situation?

I just got finished a long discussion with a right wing friend of mine. She's a nurse at a hospital in a major city a couple of states west of here.

Now I don't have a ton of background information, but the basic fact is this: She has been disciplined and may well be fired because she refused to treat a patient.

She refused to treat them because of her "religious beliefs". And exactly what did this patient say or do that made my friend not want to treat him?

Nothing. She did not want to treat him or deal with her family because they were Muslim.

Yes, REALLY.

She flat out refused to treat them. Her boss assigned a different nurse to them and suspended my friend. She is currently awaiting the outcome of a hearing that will determine whether or not she keeps her job.

I tried to tell her that if she is going to work in certain places she will have to understand she may be dealing with things that may make her uncomfortable.

She believes her "religious rights" should be respected and protected at all times, no matter where she is working.

She deserves to be fired. That's just pathetic. People are people.

246 SanFranciscoZionist  Sun, Jul 29, 2012 8:21:48am

re: #242 dragonfire1981

Wow, how's this for an interesting situation?

I just got finished a long discussion with a right wing friend of mine. She's a nurse at a hospital in a major city a couple of states west of here.

Now I don't have a ton of background information, but the basic fact is this: She has been disciplined and may well be fired because she refused to treat a patient.

She refused to treat them because of her "religious beliefs". And exactly what did this patient say or do that made my friend not want to treat him?

Nothing. She did not want to treat him or deal with her family because they were Muslim.

Yes, REALLY.

She flat out refused to treat them. Her boss assigned a different nurse to them and suspended my friend. She is currently awaiting the outcome of a hearing that will determine whether or not she keeps her job.

I tried to tell her that if she is going to work in certain places she will have to understand she may be dealing with things that may make her uncomfortable.

She believes her "religious rights" should be respected and protected at all times, no matter where she is working.

You can take a lifetime religious vow against giving Muslims medical treatment, or you can be a nurse. You just can't do both. What religion is this, anyway?

247 Obdicut  Sun, Jul 29, 2012 8:22:33am

re: #241 SanFranciscoZionist

Jesse Owens, on the other hand, had different ideas...

Today's bummer in American History:

Jesse Owens wasn't actually snubbed by Hitler, but he was actually snubbed by FDR. Go us.

248 Obdicut  Sun, Jul 29, 2012 8:23:12am

re: #242 dragonfire1981

That's nuts.

249 SanFranciscoZionist  Sun, Jul 29, 2012 8:25:23am

re: #244 Killgore Trout

The level of actual personal affinity doesn't make any difference anyways. Most of these world leaders probably don't like each other much on a personal level but they have business to attend to. Israel will continue to keep bipartisan support.
One of the rare exceptions is Obama and Sarkozy. Both of them light up when they get together and start goofing around.

This, this, this. Seriously, say they were best buds. Say Romney wins the election. Say, a month later, Bibi's government falls apart. Now what? Israel is no longer an ally because Romney doesn't know the next PM from wayback?

No more than England doesn't 'like' us anymore because Mitt was rude about the Olympics.

It's a stupid, childish way of seeing international politics.

250 Gretchen G.Tiger  Sun, Jul 29, 2012 8:27:52am

Morning all!

Allergies are terrible in my part of the world right now.

You?

251 SanFranciscoZionist  Sun, Jul 29, 2012 8:28:26am

re: #247 Obdicut

Today's bummer in American History:

Jesse Owens wasn't actually snubbed by Hitler, but he was actually snubbed by FDR. Go us.

There's some odd controversy about what actually happened there, and too much of the 'Hitler really shook his hand' seems to be based on hearsay.

But he was treated badly in the States, no mistake.

252 Sionainn  Sun, Jul 29, 2012 8:28:38am

re: #250 ggt

Morning all!

Allergies are terrible in my part of the world right now.

You?

I'm on vacation, so my allergies are nil right now. Yeah, me!

253 Gretchen G.Tiger  Sun, Jul 29, 2012 8:29:15am

re: #252 Sionainn

I'm on vacation, so my allergies are nil right now. Yeah, me!

OMG, where are you?

254 austin_blue  Sun, Jul 29, 2012 8:30:09am

re: #246 SanFranciscoZionist

You can take a lifetime religious vow against giving Muslims medical treatment, or you can be a nurse. You just can't do both. What religion is this, anyway?

My money's on the Sweet Baby Jeebuz.

255 Sionainn  Sun, Jul 29, 2012 8:30:10am

re: #253 ggt

OMG, where are you?

I'm in Morro Bay, California. When I get back to Las Vegas on Wednesday, I'm sure my allergies will flare up again.

256 simoom  Sun, Jul 29, 2012 8:31:00am

re: #236 SanFranciscoZionist

Bibi, on that friendship: “I remember him [Romney] for sure, but I don’t think we had any particular connections, I knew him and he knew me, I suppose.”

One of them, or possibly both, is lying through their teeth about how close this friendship is.

PM Netanyahu definitely was warmer to Romney today:

"Governor Romney, Mitt, it's a pleasure to welcome you in Jerusalem. We've known each other for many decades. We were so young then, and for some reason you still look young, I don't know how you do it. You've been a personal friend of mine, and a strong friend of the State of Israel, and that's why it's a pleasure to welcome you here."

257 Mattand  Sun, Jul 29, 2012 8:31:34am

re: #242 dragonfire1981

Wow, how's this for an interesting situation?

I just got finished a long discussion with a right wing friend of mine. She's a nurse at a hospital in a major city a couple of states west of here.

Now I don't have a ton of background information, but the basic fact is this: She has been disciplined and may well be fired because she refused to treat a patient.

She refused to treat them because of her "religious beliefs". And exactly what did this patient say or do that made my friend not want to treat him?

Nothing. She did not want to treat him or deal with her family because they were Muslim.

Yes, REALLY.

She flat out refused to treat them. Her boss assigned a different nurse to them and suspended my friend. She is currently awaiting the outcome of a hearing that will determine whether or not she keeps her job.

I tried to tell her that if she is going to work in certain places she will have to understand she may be dealing with things that may make her uncomfortable.

She believes her "religious rights" should be respected and protected at all times, no matter where she is working.

Wow. Just wow. I hate to be harsh, seeing as she's your friend, but she has no business being a nurse with that mindset. Period.

It makes me wonder how many other times she interfered with someone's medical treatment due to religion.

258 austin_blue  Sun, Jul 29, 2012 8:32:14am

re: #253 ggt

OMG, where are you?

Antarctica. Summertime there!

259 Sionainn  Sun, Jul 29, 2012 8:33:04am

re: #258 austin_blue

Antarctica. Summertime there!

Smartass.

260 SanFranciscoZionist  Sun, Jul 29, 2012 8:33:53am

re: #254 austin_blue

My money's on the Sweet Baby Jeebuz.

What branch of Christianity forbids its followers to provide medical assistance to Muslims?

261 Mattand  Sun, Jul 29, 2012 8:34:28am

re: #260 SanFranciscoZionist

What branch of Christianity forbids its followers to provide medical assistance to Muslims?

Republicanism; at least, the current version.

262 SanFranciscoZionist  Sun, Jul 29, 2012 8:34:45am

re: #258 austin_blue

Antarctica. Summertime there!

Isn't it midwinter in Antarctica?

263 Gretchen G.Tiger  Sun, Jul 29, 2012 8:36:24am

re: #257 Mattand

Wow. Just wow. I hate to be harsh, seeing as she's your friend, but she has no business being a nurse with that mindset. Period.

It makes me wonder how many other times she interfered with someone's medical treatment due to religion.

So, I guess it's ok to let someone die or suffer because of some arbitrary hatred?

/gah

264 SanFranciscoZionist  Sun, Jul 29, 2012 8:39:15am

re: #256 simoom

PM Netanyahu definitely was warmer to Romney today:

[Embedded content]

Interesting. He's playing this one very carefully. Made it clear earlier he wasn't getting sucked into U.S. politics.

[Link: content.usatoday.com...]

265 Gretchen G.Tiger  Sun, Jul 29, 2012 8:40:41am

re: #264 SanFranciscoZionist

Interesting. He's playing this one very carefully. Made it clear earlier he wasn't getting sucked into U.S. politics.

[Link: content.usatoday.com...]

Love him or Hate him, Bibi is definitely a star player.

266 Sol Berdinowitz  Sun, Jul 29, 2012 8:42:18am

re: #246 SanFranciscoZionist

Does she happen to work at the Good Samaritan Hospital?

267 simoom  Sun, Jul 29, 2012 8:43:45am

From a description of Romney's visit to the Western Wall:

[Link: abcnews.go.com...]

One man started clapping. “Good luck to you,” he told Romney “God bless you.” Another shouted, “Here comes the next president!” “He is for Israel!” shouted another.

...

One man shouted, “Beat Obama, governor.! Beat Obama.” Another said, “Get rid of Obamacare.”

“Mr. Romney, say hello to Georgia!” one man said.

Romney looked over his shoulder and waved. “Hello, Georgia.”

Kind of an odd and inappropriate venue / occasion for supporters to be hitting "Obamacare".

268 Gretchen G.Tiger  Sun, Jul 29, 2012 8:43:48am

re: #266 Expand Your Ground

Does she happen to work at the Good Samaritan Hospital?

Probably wears one of those bracelets that says WWJD. . . .

269 Sol Berdinowitz  Sun, Jul 29, 2012 8:45:25am

re: #268 ggt

Probably wears one of those bracelets that says WWJD. . . .

WWJD: We Want Jihad Defeated!!!

270 SanFranciscoZionist  Sun, Jul 29, 2012 8:50:09am

re: #267 simoom

From a description of Romney's visit to the Western Wall:

[Link: abcnews.go.com...]

Kind of an odd and inappropriate venue / occasion for supporters to be hitting "Obamacare".

Obama went before dawn, but still got both hecklers and cheerers.

[Link: thecaucus.blogs.nytimes.com...]

271 SanFranciscoZionist  Sun, Jul 29, 2012 8:53:08am

Now, this is actual news: Romney cancelled on the Labour leader.

[Link: www.haaretz.com...]

Bad move.

272 simoom  Sun, Jul 29, 2012 8:58:44am

re: #270 SanFranciscoZionist

Obama went before dawn, but still got both hecklers and cheerers.

[Link: thecaucus.blogs.nytimes.com...]

Ah I'm remembering that a bit now. As I recall someone stole then Senator Obama's prayer from the wall and a paper published it (and was heavily criticized for doing so).

273 simoom  Sun, Jul 29, 2012 9:00:57am

I can hear the TV from the other room. Sounds like Romney's speech will be starting shortly. I'm going to go listen.

274 SanFranciscoZionist  Sun, Jul 29, 2012 9:01:00am

re: #272 simoom

Ah I'm remembering that a bit now. As I recall someone stole then Senator Obama's prayer from the wall and a paper published it (and was heavily criticized for doing so).

Yeah. Maariv got it. They got a lot of flack over it.

275 SanFranciscoZionist  Sun, Jul 29, 2012 9:03:46am

re: #274 SanFranciscoZionist

Yeah. Maariv got it. They got a lot of flack over it.

Rabbi Rabinowitz was not amused.

[Link: www.haaretz.com...]

276 Gretchen G.Tiger  Sun, Jul 29, 2012 9:03:52am

re: #273 simoom

I can hear the TV from the other room. Sounds like Romney's speech will be starting shortly. I'm going to go listen.

DON'T DO IT, SIMOOM! You don't have to, you can say NO!

277 simoom  Sun, Jul 29, 2012 9:05:54am

Wolf Blitzer just previewed a bit of his interview w/ Romney, said Romney recognized Jerusalem as the capital of Israel & said it would be a goal to move the US Embassy there, though he'd first consult with the Israeli gov't before doing it to see if they'd sign off. Heading back to the speech.

278 Hercules Grytpype-Thynne  Sun, Jul 29, 2012 9:06:02am

re: #267 simoom

From a description of Romney's visit to the Western Wall:

[Link: abcnews.go.com...]

Kind of an odd and inappropriate venue / occasion for supporters to be hitting "Obamacare".

Quoted without comment:

Wikipedia: "Health care in Israel is universal and participation in a medical insurance plan is compulsory."

279 simoom  Sun, Jul 29, 2012 9:08:03am

re: #277 simoom

Wolf Blitzer just previewed a bit of his interview w/ Romney, said Romney recognized Jerusalem as the capital of Israel & said it would be a goal to move the US Embassy there, though he'd first consult with the Israeli gov't before doing it to see if they'd sign off. Heading back to the speech.

Early in the speech something like, 'I'm here in the capital of Israel' to applause.

280 Gretchen G.Tiger  Sun, Jul 29, 2012 9:08:59am

re: #279 simoom

Early in the speech something like, 'I'm here in the capital of Israel' to applause.

Everyone want's Jerusalem. Forever and Always.

281 William Barnett-Lewis  Sun, Jul 29, 2012 9:09:42am

re: #238 Learned Mother of Zion

Conservative and Reform Jews wear tallis. Heck even Conservative and Reform WOMEN wear tallis. Does that not make them more ULTRA whatever?

I love how much I can learn by reading folks here. This exchange made me realize how little I knew about these and off to wiki I went. Great stuff.

282 Feline Emperor of the Conservative Tears  Sun, Jul 29, 2012 9:15:15am

re: #238 Learned Mother of Zion

Conservative and Reform Jews wear tallis. Heck even Conservative and Reform WOMEN wear tallis. Does that not make them more ULTRA whatever?

It's only ULTRA if they are using the fringe to decode German coded communications.
//

283 Sol Berdinowitz  Sun, Jul 29, 2012 9:19:34am

re: #280 ggt

Everyone want's Jerusalem. Forever and Always.

Not forever...just until Kingdom Come

284 SanFranciscoZionist  Sun, Jul 29, 2012 9:20:35am

re: #278 Hercules Grytpype-Thynne

Quoted without comment:

It's too late for them. Someone's got to save the Americans.

285 Gretchen G.Tiger  Sun, Jul 29, 2012 9:24:18am

re: #284 SanFranciscoZionist

It's too late for them. Someone's got to save the Americans.

From what?

286 JEA62  Sun, Jul 29, 2012 9:25:04am

I don't know if it's occurred to the Romney campaign, but the press doesn't generally write nice things about you if you freeze them out. So whatever's going on in that hotel has to be WORSE than not talking to them.

287 Amory Blaine  Sun, Jul 29, 2012 9:29:56am

Mitt Romneys Official Campaign Song

288 simoom  Sun, Jul 29, 2012 9:30:04am

re: #279 simoom

Wolf Blitzer just previewed another bit from his interview. Said he asked Romney flatly if he considered the Western Wall to be part of Israel and Romney said it absolutely was.

Sounds like the interview will air tomorrow.

289 Sol Berdinowitz  Sun, Jul 29, 2012 9:30:23am

re: #286 JEA62

I don't know if it's occurred to the Romney campaign, but the press doesn't generally write nice things about you if you freeze them out. So whatever's going on in that hotel has to be WORSE than not talking to them.

I assume that the spin will be that the press will just pick and choose things that happen there to attack him.

Nothing worse than being attacked based on quotes taken out of content and selective use of facts...

290 SanFranciscoZionist  Sun, Jul 29, 2012 9:32:51am

re: #285 ggt

From what?

HEALTHCARE.

291 wheat-dogghazi  Sun, Jul 29, 2012 9:33:05am

re: #242 dragonfire1981

Did she miss the point of Jesus' lessons about the Samaritan, the stoning of the woman for adultery, and the Roman centurion? Not to mention the duty of a nurse or a doctor to care for their patients. She fails as a human being on both counts. Sorry.

292 Gretchen G.Tiger  Sun, Jul 29, 2012 9:34:01am

re: #290 SanFranciscoZionist

HEALTHCARE.

ah! yes, the scurge of humanity.

293 Gretchen G.Tiger  Sun, Jul 29, 2012 9:34:38am

bbl

294 Killgore Trout  Sun, Jul 29, 2012 9:39:19am

Top of the Dkos rec list is worried that Mitt is an "Israel Firster"
Romney: I will Put Netanyahu First and America Second - No Kidding

Romney is letting the world know that he will take his orders from Netanyahu rather than from the people of the United States. That bothers me.

Romney accuses President Obama of having a "foreign" Foreign Policy as Romney admits he would actually take orders from a foreign leader, Bibi Netanyahu.
....
It is alarming enough that Romney has hired roughly 90% of Bush/Cheney Warmongering4Profit Foreign Policy Advisors who, along with Romney, ignorantly and falsely accusing Russia of still being the "Soviet Union" and also ignorantly think the world is still fighting the Cold War.

It should be absolutely chilling to all Americans that Mitt Romney admits he would let a foreigner, who "supposes" he knows Romney, dictate U.S. Foreign Policy.

It should also be chilling to all Americans that Mitt Romney admits he would put Netanyahu First, not Israel first but Netanyah first, and America Second -- unless -- Romney has another foreign BFF out there who would have priority over Americans like Netanyahu does.

295 Gus  Sun, Jul 29, 2012 9:41:10am

re: #294 Killgore Trout

Top of the Dkos rec list is worried that Mitt is an "Israel Firster"
Romney: I will Put Netanyahu First and America Second - No Kidding

LGF was on the recommended list at DKos last week.

296 Killgore Trout  Sun, Jul 29, 2012 9:41:21am

Also on the Dkos Rec list
Netanhayu Already Dictating to RomneyPuppet. Opposition Meeting Cancelled Suddenly.
Somewhere MJ Rosenberg is smiling.

297 Rochi613  Sun, Jul 29, 2012 9:43:52am

What Mr. Romney said about Jerusalem today:

Romney: Deeply moving to be in Jerusalem, Israel's capital
[Link: www.jpost.com...]

What Mr. Obama has said about Jerusalem:

298 Gus  Sun, Jul 29, 2012 9:45:25am

re: #297 Rochi613

What Mr. Romney said about Jerusalem today:

Romney: Deeply moving to be in Jerusalem, Israel's capital
[Link: www.jpost.com...]

What Mr. Obama has said about Jerusalem:

[Embedded content]

Take your ECI video and shove it up your ass.

299 Obdicut  Sun, Jul 29, 2012 9:46:47am

re: #297 Rochi613

ECI is a pretty shady and terrible source to use.

300 Renaissance_Man  Sun, Jul 29, 2012 9:49:21am

re: #242 dragonfire1981

Wow, how's this for an interesting situation?

I just got finished a long discussion with a right wing friend of mine. She's a nurse at a hospital in a major city a couple of states west of here.

Now I don't have a ton of background information, but the basic fact is this: She has been disciplined and may well be fired because she refused to treat a patient.

She refused to treat them because of her "religious beliefs". And exactly what did this patient say or do that made my friend not want to treat him?

Nothing. She did not want to treat him or deal with her family because they were Muslim.

Yes, REALLY.

She flat out refused to treat them. Her boss assigned a different nurse to them and suspended my friend. She is currently awaiting the outcome of a hearing that will determine whether or not she keeps her job.

I tried to tell her that if she is going to work in certain places she will have to understand she may be dealing with things that may make her uncomfortable.

She believes her "religious rights" should be respected and protected at all times, no matter where she is working.

Well, the truth is, it is her religion that requires her to treat Muslims as subhuman. Her religion is wingnuttery, or, as we now call it in America, 'Conservatism'.

301 Obdicut  Sun, Jul 29, 2012 9:54:15am

Bill Kristol is on the attack against Romney too.

[Link: www.politico.com...]

Given Kristol's track record of being wrong, I'm not convinced by his argument by incredulity alone, but it's true that it doesn't seem likely that Reagan actually held no national security meetings for a third of a year.

302 SanFranciscoZionist  Sun, Jul 29, 2012 9:56:13am

re: #297 Rochi613

What Mr. Romney said about Jerusalem today:

Romney: Deeply moving to be in Jerusalem, Israel's capital
[Link: www.jpost.com...]

What Mr. Obama has said about Jerusalem:

[Embedded content]

Clinton, Bush and Obama all opposed the Jerusalem Embassy Act.

I am not naive enough to believe that Romney is offering more than pretty words while campaigning, to folks at home. Sorry.

303 Killgore Trout  Sun, Jul 29, 2012 9:57:20am

re: #299 Obdicut

ECI is a pretty shady and terrible source to use.

Well, what I think it does illustrate is the difference between election year pandering with hollow rhetoric and real world policy decisions. Mitt's comments are no different. Depsite whatever comments made today he's probably not going to move the US embassy to Jerusalem. US policy towards Israel will probably change very litle, if at all, under a Mitt presidency. Same goes for Iran.

304 Vicious Babushka  Sun, Jul 29, 2012 9:58:07am

re: #242 dragonfire1981

Wow, how's this for an interesting situation?

I just got finished a long discussion with a right wing friend of mine. She's a nurse at a hospital in a major city a couple of states west of here.

Now I don't have a ton of background information, but the basic fact is this: She has been disciplined and may well be fired because she refused to treat a patient.

She refused to treat them because of her "religious beliefs". And exactly what did this patient say or do that made my friend not want to treat him?

Nothing. She did not want to treat him or deal with her family because they were Muslim.

Yes, REALLY.

She flat out refused to treat them. Her boss assigned a different nurse to them and suspended my friend. She is currently awaiting the outcome of a hearing that will determine whether or not she keeps her job.

I tried to tell her that if she is going to work in certain places she will have to understand she may be dealing with things that may make her uncomfortable.

She believes her "religious rights" should be respected and protected at all times, no matter where she is working.

21 Leaving that place, Jesus withdrew to the region of Tyre and Sidon.

22 A Canaanite woman from that vicinity came to him, crying out, “Lord, Son of David, have mercy on me! My daughter is demon-possessed and suffering terribly.”

23 Jesus did not answer a word. So his disciples came to him and urged him, “Send her away, for she keeps crying out after us.”

24 He answered, “I was sent only to the lost sheep of Israel.”

25 The woman came and knelt before him. “Lord, help me!” she said.

26 He replied, “It is not right to take the children’s bread and toss it to the dogs.”

(In the end Jesus changed his mind and healed the daughter anyway)

305 Kronocide  Sun, Jul 29, 2012 9:59:48am

Watched Act of Valor last night on VOD.

I was struck by the filmaking including first person shooter video game segments, and it sure seemed like a recruitment film for the military. Lots of noble concepts of 'warrior code' and 'warrior blood.'

The plot had Jihadi's coming across the border from Mexico.

306 SanFranciscoZionist  Sun, Jul 29, 2012 9:59:50am

re: #304 Learned Mother of Zion

21 Leaving that place, Jesus withdrew to the region of Tyre and Sidon.

22 A Canaanite woman from that vicinity came to him, crying out, “Lord, Son of David, have mercy on me! My daughter is demon-possessed and suffering terribly.”

23 Jesus did not answer a word. So his disciples came to him and urged him, “Send her away, for she keeps crying out after us.”

24 He answered, “I was sent only to the lost sheep of Israel.”

25 The woman came and knelt before him. “Lord, help me!” she said.

26 He replied, “It is not right to take the children’s bread and toss it to the dogs.”

He got schooled:

But she said, "Yes, Lord ; but even the dogs feed on the crumbs which fall from their masters' table." Then Jesus said to her, "O woman, your faith is great ; it shall be done for you as you wish." And her daughter was healed at once.

307 Vicious Babushka  Sun, Jul 29, 2012 10:00:50am

re: #306 SanFranciscoZionist

He got schooled:

But she said, "Yes, Lord ; but even the dogs feed on the crumbs which fall from their masters' table." Then Jesus said to her, "O woman, your faith is great ; it shall be done for you as you wish." And her daughter was healed at once.

She admitted she was inferior.

308 Obdicut  Sun, Jul 29, 2012 10:01:56am

re: #303 Killgore Trout

Yes. Romney's claims that he is massively different from Obama on Iran are bullshit-- hell, all he's really said is that if Israel attacked Iran that'd be pretty okay with him.

And yet tons of people-- including Jews who really ought to be better-informed on this than the average American-- have convinced themselves there's some vast gulf between Obama and typical US relations with Israel. I think it reflects the constant anti-Obama propagandizing on the subject and the effect that it has.

309 simoom  Sun, Jul 29, 2012 10:02:48am

re: #297 Rochi613

What Mr. Romney said about Jerusalem today:

Romney: Deeply moving to be in Jerusalem, Israel's capital
[Link: www.jpost.com...]

What Mr. Obama has said about Jerusalem:

[Embedded content]

Presidential candidates, running for their first term, have consistently stated support for an undivided Jerusalem as capital of Israel, but then when actually President they've all backed away and deferred the question to be decided through the peace process negotiations. Sure Romney has just one upped previous candidates by declaring Jerusalem the capital while actually in Jerusalem, by stating his desire to move the Embassy, and he's apparently also made a similar statement about the Western Wall, but I'm curious how confident you are that he'll be any different, once actually President, than any of the previous occupants of the Office (Reagan, Bush Sr., Clinton, W. Bush, and now Obama)?

310 SanFranciscoZionist  Sun, Jul 29, 2012 10:03:44am

re: #307 Learned Mother of Zion

She admitted she was inferior.

She won. He healed the kid.

I would also like to comment that Jesus does not try this sort of talk on the centurion with the sick servant. You might say that was because the man opens with both a highly deferential approach, and an attitude of enormous faith. You might also say it was because he was armed to the teeth, and with a considerably higher social status than some wandering healer.

311 SanFranciscoZionist  Sun, Jul 29, 2012 10:04:13am

re: #308 Obdicut

Yes. Romney's claims that he is massively different from Obama on Iran are bullshit-- hell, all he's really said is that if Israel attacked Iran that'd be pretty okay with him.

And yet tons of people-- including Jews who really ought to be better-informed on this than the average American-- have convinced themselves there's some vast gulf between Obama and typical US relations with Israel. I think it reflects the constant anti-Obama propagandizing on the subject and the effect that it has.

There's been a constant drumbeat on this since Bush's administration.

312 wheat-dogghazi  Sun, Jul 29, 2012 10:14:13am

re: #305 Kronocide

I saw it a couple of weeks ago with my daughter and future son-in-law. Reminded me of a first-person shooter game with more of a focus on plot than merely blowing up bad guys. One point against it is the predictable death of the guy who promises his wife he will come back. As soon as I saw the emotional separation between the two, I figured his number would come up by the end of the movie.

Yeah, jihadis coming up through Mexico -- two, two, two enemies in one! (terrorists and drug lords/weapons dealers).

313 Mattand  Sun, Jul 29, 2012 10:16:35am

re: #298 Gus

Take your ECI video and shove it up your ass.

Do I even want to know what ECI is?

314 SanFranciscoZionist  Sun, Jul 29, 2012 10:17:03am

re: #310 SanFranciscoZionist

She won. He healed the kid.

I would also like to comment that Jesus does not try this sort of talk on the centurion with the sick servant. You might say that was because the man opens with both a highly deferential approach, and an attitude of enormous faith. You might also say it was because he was armed to the teeth, and with a considerably higher social status than some wandering healer.

I'd add to this, as well, that post-Paul, this can hardly be this lady's justification for refusing to treat Gentile patients.

315 Charles Johnson  Sun, Jul 29, 2012 10:17:25am

re: #297 Rochi613

What Mr. Romney said about Jerusalem today:

Romney: Deeply moving to be in Jerusalem, Israel's capital
[Link: www.jpost.com...]

What Mr. Obama has said about Jerusalem:

[Embedded content]

The Emergency Committee for Israel is a far right American source that has been spreading lies about Obama's Israel positions for years. Their board consists of right wing propagandist Bill Kristol and religious fanatic Gary Bauer.

Their credibility is zero on this issue.

316 Mattand  Sun, Jul 29, 2012 10:18:47am

re: #315 Charles Johnson

You had me at Bill Kristol.

317 Gus  Sun, Jul 29, 2012 10:19:54am

re: #316 Mattand

You had me at Bill Kristol.

You can read all about them here.

318 Varek Raith  Sun, Jul 29, 2012 10:23:40am

Bill "I'm wrong about everything" Kristol.

319 Mattand  Sun, Jul 29, 2012 10:24:10am

re: #315 Charles Johnson

re: #317 Gus

You can read all about them here.

Appreciate the heads up. The stuff I learn from this blog never ceases to amaze me.

From the article:

William Kristol provided a similarly banal reason for the group’s raison d’etre in comments to Politico, saying, “We’re the pro-Israel wing of the pro-Israel community.

Good ol' Bill. Never fails to bring the derp.

320 Coracle  Sun, Jul 29, 2012 10:25:45am

The US doesn't recognize Jerusalem as Israel's capital, and while any serious percentage of our petroleum comes from Gulf nations, it never will. Romney can talk, but if he promises and wins the presidency, it will be a broken promise.

321 William of Orange  Sun, Jul 29, 2012 10:33:33am


Ouch....

322 dragonath  Sun, Jul 29, 2012 10:33:50am

re: #271 SanFranciscoZionist

Now, this is actual news: Romney cancelled on the Labour leader.

[Link: www.haaretz.com...]

Bad move.

On two hours notice. Talk about needlessly (and intentionally) insulting people.

323 Mattand  Sun, Jul 29, 2012 10:36:37am

re: #321 William of Orange

[Embedded content]


Ouch...

I will take the odd tact of defending Romney here. He's not a wimp.

He's clueless and entitled.

He thinks being President will just be like Bain, where ultimately he got his way on everything.

324 Hercules Grytpype-Thynne  Sun, Jul 29, 2012 10:50:24am

re: #323 Mattand

I will take the odd tact of defending Romney here. He's not a wimp.

Pet peeve alert: it's a tack, not a tact.


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