Pakistan Surrendering

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This is really, really bad news, as Pakistan capitulates to Taliban terrorists.

PESHAWAR, Pakistan – Pakistan agreed Monday to suspend military offensives and impose Islamic law in part of the restive northwest, making a gesture it hopes will help calm the Taliban insurgency while rejecting Washington’s call for tougher measures against militants.

A U.S. defense official called the deal “a negative development,” and some Pakistani experts expressed skepticism the truce would decrease violence. One human rights activist said the accord was “a great surrender” to militants.

This didn’t happen during the Bush administration.

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741 comments
1 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 6:03:36pm

Aw, shit.

2 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 6:04:12pm

Completely freaked out this morning when I heard this.

3 code red 21  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 6:04:55pm

Are you trying to say that the capitulated because of BO?

4 Mich-again  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 6:04:57pm

The Tollybon operate in Pokkyston? Who knew?

5 mean Gene  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 6:05:22pm

When are we going admit that non-Muslims and even non-fundamentalist Muslims have already run out of places to run away to?
There's definitely a Muslim immigrant fatigue in the Western world.
But, even more troubling is the problem non-Muslims under brand new Sharia provinces are facing.

6 Dark_Falcon  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 6:05:27pm

I'm starting to think we may not be able to mount a surge in Afghanistan. If the Talibs keep taking ground in Pakistan, we may lose our main supply line. This is Bad, Bad, Sick.

7 Charles Johnson  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 6:05:36pm

re: #3 code red 21

Are you trying to say that the capitulated because of BO?

Indeed. They think there won't be any consequences for it.

8 Nevergiveup  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 6:05:59pm

re: #2 Fat Bastard Vegetarian

Completely freaked out this morning when I heard this.

Obama has been in Office less than a month. Are you stocking up on Hallucinogenics or booze?

9 Randall Gross  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 6:06:06pm
This didn’t happen during the Bush administration

This particular cave in did not, but this follows the previous pattern of submission by both the Musharraf gov't and the new one.
Big anti terror campaign, they launch a punitive expedition, fire from helicopters and artillery without going after the leadership, and then sue for peace.

The same thing happened in both Waziristans, Baujaur, and at least once before in Swat.

10 code red 21  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 6:06:25pm

re: #7 Charles

Indeed. They think there won't be any consequences for it.

You are so right.

11 Desert Dog  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 6:06:47pm

Fear not, Obama will send Hillary over to straighten those Taliban guys out

12 LynnfromNZ  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 6:06:53pm

You're right. Very, very bad news.

13 grahamski  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 6:07:00pm

I hope the launch codes are safe...

14 Nevergiveup  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 6:07:06pm

re: #7 Charles

Indeed. They think there won't be any consequences for it.

Makes you wonder what Holbrook has been spewing over there ha?

15 rwmofo  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 6:07:36pm

They're imposing Islamic law? Oh, yeah. That should calm things down. The kind of change they can believe in.

16 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 6:07:38pm

re: #8 Nevergiveup

Obama has been in Office less than a month. Are you stocking up on Hallucinogenics or booze?

I'm thinking.... both.

17 Jetpilot1101  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 6:07:42pm

Dear Mr. President,
How does reality feel when it smacks you in the face? The ball is in your court, what are you planning on doing?
v/r
JP1101

18 jwb7605  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 6:08:06pm

re: #7 Charles

Indeed. They think there won't be any consequences for it.

It will be quite interesting to see Hillary spin this.

19 noshariaincanada  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 6:08:16pm

"Bah-ghee-stan"

"Dal-eeh-ban"

Learn the pronounciation like BHO does it.

20 Nevergiveup  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 6:08:29pm

re: #18 jwb7605

It will be quite interesting to see Hillary spin this.

Hilliary has been cut out of this

21 jwb7605  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 6:09:17pm

re: #20 Nevergiveup

Hilliary has been cut out of this

Say what?
She's on a trip over to that area, isn't she?

22 pre-Boomer Marine brat  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 6:09:18pm

Mr. 10 Percent is a fop.

That's my last for this evening.
Good night, all.

23 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 6:09:22pm

re: #19 noshariaincanada

"Bah-ghee-stahn"

"Dal-eeh-bahn"

Learn the pronounciation like BHO does it.

24 Nevergiveup  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 6:09:49pm

re: #21 jwb7605

Say what?
She's on a trip over to that area, isn't she?

Nope Japan, China, Korea

25 UberInfidel67  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 6:09:59pm

This is why diplomacy will NOT work with these people! They have ONE goal...all they need to do is continue to kill and oppress. They are tenacious bastards. Some serious ass kicking needs to be done. That is all they understand.

26 Sharmuta  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 6:10:01pm

It's a pretty sad, sorry state of affairs when we have to hope™ that 0bama meant it when he called for raids into Pokkystaaahnwhile campaigning.

27 phillygirl  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 6:10:11pm

Gosh - I'd better take my burka to the cleaners. It won't be long before I'll be forced to wear it.

28 FrogMarch  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 6:10:18pm

Perception is reality. The US is now just another failed euro-fascist socialist state. with a weak limp-wristed rhetorically flourished teleprompter at the helm.

29 Noam Sayin'  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 6:10:29pm
This didn’t happen during the Bush administration.

Bears repeating.

30 Henchman Ghazi-808  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 6:10:36pm

DiFi's slip probably helped this along.

31 Desert Dog  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 6:10:36pm

They made this deal with the same guy that basically killed Bhutto. Those "semi-autonomous" regions will have to be dealt with one day. They are a festering sore and will make a stable Afghanistan impossible. They will make a stable Pakistan impossible too. The Pakistani government does not want to deal with it. I am not sure if the current administration is up to the task either. So, let's all start building bomb shelters and learn the "duck and cover" routine.

32 MarineGrunt  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 6:10:37pm

Dominos

33 Catttt  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 6:10:50pm

But I thought talking with them would unclench that fist, and then everyone would have chocolate and unicorns.

34 Racer X  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 6:11:04pm

Ask the woman in New York - who was recently beheaded by her husband - how she feels about Islamic law.

35 rwmofo  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 6:11:28pm

Man. Every time I use cayenne pepper, I sneeze.

36 Nevergiveup  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 6:11:28pm

re: #26 Sharmuta

It's a pretty sad, sorry state of affairs when we have to hope™ that 0bama meant it when he called for raids into Pokkystaaahnwhile campaigning.

He doesn't know what he means. He has no convictions until someone tells him what they are.

37 [deleted]  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 6:11:34pm
38 Boondock St. Bender  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 6:11:39pm

Is stuff like this "change i can believe in"?
cause i can't....

39 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 6:12:07pm

Fuckin' big chair's scary, ain't it, Barry.

40 Nevergiveup  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 6:12:18pm

re: #37 ploome hineni

..wasn;t this inevitable once elections were forced on Mushareaf?

Yup

41 Desert Dog  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 6:12:20pm

re: #23 Fat Bastard Vegetarian

"Bah-ghee-stahn"

"Dal-eeh-bahn"

Learn the pronounciation like BHO does it.

"Shh-it Ho-le"

42 mean Gene  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 6:12:49pm

re: #24 Nevergiveup

Nope Japan, China, Korea

Indonesia, too.
Here's how they greeted her:
Image: r3785729048.jpg

43 [deleted]  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 6:12:51pm
44 MandyManners  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 6:13:03pm

re: #33 Catttt

But I thought talking with them would unclench that fist, and then everyone would have chocolate and unicorns.

Can I have a chocolate unicorn?

45 Dark_Falcon  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 6:13:06pm

re: #17 Jetpilot1101

Dear Mr. President,
How does reality feel when it smacks you in the face? The ball is in your court, what are you planning on doing?
v/r
JP1101

He'll stand up and proudly vote "Present".

46 [deleted]  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 6:13:20pm
47 Henchman Ghazi-808  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 6:13:22pm

re: #39 Fat Bastard Vegetarian

Eggcellent wordsmithing!

48 Nevergiveup  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 6:13:25pm

re: #42 mean Gene

Indonesia, too.
Here's how they greeted her:
[Link: news.yahoo.com...]

Can we borrow those signs i wonder?

49 Desert Dog  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 6:13:27pm

re: #42 mean Gene

Indonesia, too.
Here's how they greeted her:
[Link: news.yahoo.com...]

We should borrow those signs and meet her at the airport when she gets back

50 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 6:13:29pm

re: #41 Desert Dog

stahn...sounds so much more...urbane.

Fuckstick

.

(not you, Dog.)

51 Boondock St. Bender  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 6:13:37pm

re: #33 Catttt

CHOCOLATE WAS BEFORE THE TIME OF DA'BIG MO.....benighted infidel....

52 [deleted]  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 6:13:42pm
53 Desert Dog  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 6:13:48pm

re: #48 Nevergiveup

ahh, too slow! GMTA

54 MandyManners  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 6:14:14pm

re: #43 Buster Bunny

Fuck that, Bunny.

55 mean Gene  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 6:14:36pm

re: #48 Nevergiveup

LOL!

56 FrogMarch  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 6:14:42pm

btw - I've been noticing signs that the bloom is off the Obama rose here in Boulder. (at least a tad)

57 Desert Dog  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 6:15:14pm

re: #54 MandyManners

Fuck that, Bunny.

I would rather ask the husband what he thinks after they stake him to an ant hill and pour honey in his "groinal area"

58 spirochete  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 6:15:29pm

re: #47 BigPapa

Eggcellent wordsmithing!

Oh no!

59 Randall Gross  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 6:15:30pm

Seriously Charles, Shariah has been part of the deal in past peace Jirgas, both Roggio and I have reported on it.

Here's one of the previous deals breaking down, shariah was part of the package, as it was in the 2006 deals:

[Link: noblesseoblige.org...]

60 Nevergiveup  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 6:15:56pm

re: #57 Desert Dog

I would rather ask the husband what he thinks after they stake him to an ant hill and pour honey in his "groinal area"


That's ok with me, but is that in the NY State penal code?

61 AMER1CAN  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 6:16:16pm

CHANGE!

62 Buster Bunny  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 6:16:18pm

re: #54 MandyManners

Fuck that, Bunny.

Beheading is nasty, and Islamists are nastier than that. Just wait till these societies plumbing for Sharia get to a Dhimmi status. THEN they'll know how much fun it can all be.

Thank you Mandy for the insight .. but no flirting .. i'm taken.

63 albusteve  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 6:16:27pm

re: #28 FrogMarch

Perception is reality. The US is now just another failed euro-fascist socialist state. with a weak limp-wristed rhetorically flourished teleprompter at the helm.

you may be right...I have never had the confidence to turn these countries to benefit the west...it just isn't gonna happen...too much time and effort and insanity over there...India may have to 'step in' and move things around....

64 Boondock St. Bender  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 6:16:29pm

re: #56 FrogMarch

The hang-over always comes after the party.

65 MandyManners  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 6:16:34pm

re: #57 Desert Dog

I would rather ask the husband what he thinks after they stake him to an ant hill and pour honey in his "groinal area"

Nice fantasy.

66 [deleted]  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 6:16:51pm
67 HelloDare  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 6:17:08pm

They'll blame this on Bush. The failed policies of the past. Something like that.

68 Dark_Falcon  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 6:17:10pm

re: #44 MandyManners

Can I have a chocolate unicorn?

Sure, if you can grab it before I get the last one. I love big pieces of chocolate, though I really shouldn't. I need to lose weight and they're bad for me.

69 MandyManners  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 6:17:19pm

re: #62 Buster Bunny

Beheading is nasty, and Islamists are nastier than that. Just wait till these societies plumbing for Sharia get to a Dhimmi status. THEN they'll know how much fun it can all be.

Thank you Mandy for the insight .. but no flirting .. i'm taken.

I don't like joking about DV and murder.

70 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 6:17:32pm

I'm generally a pretty friendly person.

Can you tell I am not feeling so friendly tonight?

Was going to give him a chance.

Stand for what is right.


GAH!

71 [deleted]  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 6:17:34pm
72 BigDana  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 6:17:43pm

You don't suppose this decision had anything to do with Sen. Feinstein's "outing" of our Predator bases in Pakistan, do you?

Help America, get stabbed in the back!

73 mrcaniac  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 6:17:47pm

WEEEEEEEEEEEEE!

This is like a rollercoaster. Wait, is the track missing from that section up ahe

74 phillygirl  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 6:17:49pm

re: #49 Desert Dog

We should borrow those signs and meet her at the airport when she gets back

A few Indonesians who are not yet drinking The One's Kool-aid. They were probably forced to be there by their husbands - with the usual threat of beheading if they didn't comply.

75 [deleted]  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 6:18:08pm
76 USBeast  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 6:18:11pm

Okay, so maybe this is just a ploy to bring them out into the open so that our Predators can have an easier shot at them.

Yeah, I know...damn.

77 quickjustice  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 6:18:18pm

American foreign policy is imploding before our eyes, presided over by Obama and Clinton. We can't win in Afghanistan without Pakistan's cooperation. If Pakistan is providing safe haven for Taliban, as they are, we go to war with them, or we retreat.

I bet Obama announces a pullout from Afghanistan before year's end.

78 rightwinger3  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 6:18:22pm

I thought the world loved us now?

79 solomonpanting  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 6:18:24pm
The Obama administration has signaled it will continue such attacks, which U.S. officials say have killed several top al-Qaida leaders. Pakistani leaders have voiced strong objections, saying the strikes undercut support for their own war against militants.

By surrendering, it sounds as though Pakistan is Pakin'itin.

80 code red 21  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 6:18:34pm

re: #39 Fat Bastard Vegetarian

Fuckin' big chair's scary, ain't it, Barry.

The only thing BO wants open are the secrets that keep us safe.

81 [deleted]  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 6:18:47pm
82 Killian Bundy  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 6:18:48pm

Back In D.C., Obama's Afghan Plan Looms

Lt. Gen. David McKiernan wants more fighting forces and support troops such as helicopter crews to push back against the Taliban in Afghanistan's increasingly dangerous southern and eastern regions.

An opponent of the "surge" of U.S. forces that is now credited with turning around the Iraq war, Obama has taken a cautious approach to the addition of forces in Afghanistan. He is expected to initially approve only part of a military request for as many as 30,000 forces this year, while military and civilian advisers revamp U.S. war goals.

Revamp U.S. war goals. I guess winning is out of the question, after all, no one ever wins in Afghanistan.

/code for where's the exit door?

83 spirochete  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 6:18:49pm

re: #71 ploome hineni

Divide and conquer. Lots of targets in the OIC.

84 Buster Bunny  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 6:18:50pm

I am well aware of the Egyptian situation where people have been GUTTED because they walked on the wrong side of a muslim and he was 'offended' by that.

They dont need an excuse to treat dhimmis like crap. They are muslims and as far as they are concerned thats enough.

And worst of all .. some nutcases really do think its just the Jews .....

85 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 6:19:11pm

re: #73 mrcaniac

Where in the hell have you been? That was perfect!

86 Dark_Falcon  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 6:19:24pm

re: #66 buzzsawmonkey

Waitin' for the Nuclear Blow
--with apologies to "Shuffle Off to Buffalo"

Let's just watch the Pakistanis
Give in to the Talibanis
Down the chutes we go
Oh-oh-oh
We can watch them tussle
While we wait for the nuclear blow

A.Q. Khan is walking free now
That's why you can plainly see now
How Iran will go
Oh-oh-oh
Watching while they hustle
While we wait for the nuclear blow

Some day there'll be a big explosion
Here or maybe Israel
To stop confidence erosion
Barack will say, "How could we tell?"

"Nobody could have foreseen it
How could we have known they mean it?
Sorry for the glow."
Oh-oh-oh
He'll give us the hustle
While we absorb the nuclear blow

Can we get BHO to "Shuffle Off to Buffalo" right now?

87 brookly red  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 6:19:53pm

re: #10 code red 21

You are so right.

Well I doubt that there will be any consequences from Washington, that is all too true. But India may take exception. Don't forget about India.

88 A Man for all Seasons  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 6:19:58pm

re: #66 buzzsawmonkey

Buzzsaw..How about a parody on troll meltdowns..
Done to the Beatles 'Maxwells Hammer'
..you know showthing like..
Bang Bang
That's when stinkys hammer
came down upon their head
Bang Bang
That's Stinky's hammer
made sure they were dead..
........

89 albusteve  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 6:20:08pm

re: #82 Killian Bundy

Back In D.C., Obama's Afghan Plan Looms

Revamp U.S. war goals. I guess winning is out of the question, after all, no one ever wins in Afghanistan.

/code for where's the exit door?


heads will roll eh?

90 Nevergiveup  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 6:20:30pm

re: #77 quickjustice

American foreign policy is imploding before our eyes, presided over by Obama and Clinton. We can't win in Afghanistan without Pakistan's cooperation. If Pakistan is providing safe haven for Taliban, as they are, we go to war with them, or we retreat.

I bet Obama announces a pullout from Afghanistan before year's end.

No he'll declare victory first

91 [deleted]  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 6:20:54pm
92 Dark_Falcon  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 6:21:47pm

re: #73 mrcaniac

WEEEEEEEEEEEEE!

This is like a rollercoaster. Wait, is the track missing from that section up ahe

Then we need to accelerate! Haven't you ever seen Speed?

93 Killian Bundy  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 6:21:49pm

re: #89 albusteve

heads will roll eh?

/sucks to be Karzai

94 spirochete  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 6:21:52pm

re: #91 ploome hineni

The article talks much about unity among the 56 states. I don't see a heck of a lot of unity there, except for voting at the UN.

95 [deleted]  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 6:22:29pm
96 Buster Bunny  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 6:22:35pm

re: #94 spirochete

The article talks much about unity among the 56 states. I don't see a heck of a lot of unity there, except for voting at the UN.

56 states? There were 57 this morning .. has one seceeded since breakfast?

97 Nevergiveup  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 6:23:01pm

re: #93 Killian Bundy

/sucks to be Karzai

I hope he has a condo in Bethesda?

98 Abu Lahab  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 6:23:15pm

When a country with nukes and thousands of Maddrassas capitulates to some dark-ages murderous gang, I start having nightmares, and I don't think I am the only one.

99 kansas  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 6:23:27pm

Another test Biden warned us about. Good thing Obama's got a "spine of steel". Ha.

100 code red 21  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 6:23:44pm

re: #87 brookly red

Well I doubt that there will be any consequences from Washington, that is all too true. But India may take exception. Don't forget about India.

India might be the only hope we have because we certainly can't depend on the BO administration.

101 spirochete  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 6:23:49pm

re: #96 Buster Bunny

56 states? There were 57 this morning .. has one seceeded since breakfast?

102 Buster Bunny  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 6:23:56pm

re: #99 kansas

Another test Biden warned us about. Good thing Obama's got a "spine of steel". Ha.

And an ass of pure lard.

103 [deleted]  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 6:23:58pm
104 Elcid  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 6:24:00pm

Let's see here...So now there IS a Nation/State sponsor of terror, Pakistan.

Ball's in your court Obama...Shoot some hoops. 'They' say you're good at shooting hoops. Just don't double dribble.

105 Nevergiveup  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 6:24:18pm

re: #98 Abu Lahab

When a country with nukes and thousands of Maddrassas capitulates to some dark-ages murderous gang, I start having nightmares, and I don't think I am the only one.

I don't have nightmares, but then I'm not sleeping much at night.

106 Achilles Tang  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 6:24:35pm

I've been waiting for this to be a thread; not that I have anything great to say except that it may be the beginning of the end of Pakistan as we've known it .

107 code red 21  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 6:25:02pm

re: #102 Buster Bunny

And an ass of pure lard.


That made me LOL

108 MandyManners  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 6:25:15pm

re: #98 Abu Lahab

When a country with nukes and thousands of Maddrassas capitulates to some dark-ages murderous gang, I start having nightmares, and I don't think I am the only one.

Not by far.

109 HelloDare  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 6:25:37pm

re: #99 kansas

Biden? Where is Mr. Irrelevant?

110 [deleted]  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 6:25:47pm
111 Dark_Falcon  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 6:25:48pm

re: #104 Elcid

Let's see here...So now there IS a Nation/State sponsor of terror, Pakistan.

Ball's in your court Obama...Shoot some hoops. 'They' say you're good at shooting hoops. Just don't double dribble.

He's double dribbling his pants right now, I'd suspect.

112 Buster Bunny  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 6:26:01pm

re: #106 Naso Tang

I've been waiting for this to be a thread; not that I have anything great to say except that it may be the beginning of the end of Pakistan as we've known it .

Ever since the Maharajas were sidelined and the Brits driven out in Pakistan its been a slow decline into irrlevence for Pakistan.

This just speeds things up.

113 Nevergiveup  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 6:26:20pm

re: #100 code red 21

India might be the only hope we have because we certainly can't depend on the BO administration.

But we are going to be "politically correct" you see. We can't overtly use India for some of the same reasons we can't overtly use Israel. We can't seem to be using an "Enemy" of Islam? Screwed up ain't it?

114 spirochete  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 6:26:20pm

re: #103 ploome hineni

they are unified in getting the islamic agenda and sharia accepted......and the WESTERN courts to enforce this agenda

here they are all united...against the non muslim

/am I missing your point?

Not really. I am just sceptical about lumping them all into a large body like that. There are so many criss crossing loyalties and agendas that it seems it shouldn't be that difficult to divide them against each other and impede their goals.

115 MandyManners  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 6:26:34pm

re: #105 Nevergiveup

I don't have nightmares, but then I'm not sleeping much at night.

I have a trick to help me sleep. I build my dream mansion in my mind when I get ready to sleep.

116 code red 21  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 6:26:46pm

re: #109 HelloDare

Biden? Where is Mr. Irrelevant?

he's probably out plagiarizing a speech...

117 Henchman Ghazi-808  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 6:26:47pm

So the bastards that pulled off Mubai won. Nothing like positive reinforcement. This is very serious shit.

118 stevieray  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 6:27:00pm

I wonder if the Pakistani government is caving because:

a. they were never keen for the fight from the beginning -- Bush kept their feet to the fire... or

b. they want to fight, but fear Obama will leave them high and dry if things get tough.

Hmmm...

119 solomonpanting  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 6:27:02pm

re: #99 kansas

Another test Biden warned us about. Good thing Obama's got a "spine of steel". Ha.

I hear the UN Secretary was involved in these negotiations and they're being called the test-Ban Treaties.

120 kansas  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 6:27:06pm

re: #109 HelloDare

Biden? Where is Mr. Irrelevant?

In an undisclosed location waiting for another opportunity to put his foot in his mouth.

121 Mostly sane, most of the time.  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 6:27:17pm

One last comment, then I gotta go:

I am sick to my stomach thinking of what will happen to women and children in those provinces. Pakistan had been making at least token gestures towards decent human rights; no more.

122 Nevergiveup  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 6:27:19pm

re: #112 Buster Bunny

Ever since the Maharajas were sidelined and the Brits driven out in Pakistan its been a slow decline into irrlevence for Pakistan.

This just speeds things up.

No country with Nukes is irrelevant!

123 Mad Prophet Ludwig  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 6:27:22pm

Things are going to get very hot over there in the near future. It is interesting that India told the US to essentially go to hell when we tried to downplay evidence that Pakistan was involved in Mumbai.

Obama is not the first man I would want handling this, but he at least is not a Carter. What the president does in the next several weeks will very much set the tone for years to come. The bad guys are getting bolder. I pray that the president sees the writing on the wall and takes proper action.

The only spot of light I see in all of this is that President Obama has been talking about taking Pakistan seriously since the election. I hope he does.

124 MandyManners  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 6:27:26pm

re: #116 code red 21

he's probably out plagiarizing a speech...

LOL!

125 lrsshadow  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 6:27:38pm

I can't help, but think about how the pressure is coming down on Obama now. I mean the guy really has not had any real pressure in his life in regards to executive experience. The kind where life is at stake. Now he has been placed in the center of the storm.

The change and hope are not getting as much millage as they did in the campaign.

126 jwb7605  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 6:27:45pm

re: #112 Buster Bunny

Ever since the Maharajas were sidelined and the Brits driven out in Pakistan its been a slow decline into irrlevence for Pakistan.

This just speeds things up.

Irrelevance is not the word I would have chosen for a country with nukes.

127 Nevergiveup  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 6:28:16pm

re: #115 MandyManners

I have a trick to help me sleep. I build my dream mansion in my mind when I get ready to sleep.

I've tried that but on $13 a week, I ain't getting far!

128 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 6:28:17pm

Afore I esplode....

G'night John-Boy!

129 Randall Gross  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 6:28:31pm

The way things are going I expect the frontier states to try a breakaway from Pakistan sometime in the next ten years. That's the other reason the Taliban are working strenuously on the Khyber and other near moderate agencies.

130 Henchman Ghazi-808  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 6:28:40pm

re: #118 stevieray

Yes.

131 MandyManners  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 6:28:49pm
part of the restive northwest

There's that word again.

132 JHW  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 6:29:10pm

re: #6 Dark_Falcon

I'm starting to think we may not be able to mount a surge in Afghanistan. If the Talibs keep taking ground in Pakistan, we may lose our main supply line. This is Bad, Bad, Sick.

In reference to the supply line, this is truly troubling and for more than one reason. A few months ago, when Russia and Georgia collided, we had people here advocating an immediate attack on Russia to aid Georgia. I tried to inject in the conversation a little "wait and see" before playing Field Marshall, see if Georgia survives, see how far the Russians were going to take it, but there were many many who wanted to send carriers and troops immediately. Not one, that I can remember, mentioned or gave a thought to a land-locked NATO force heavily dependent on supply lines through Pakistan and Russia. I don't trust Putin as far as I can throw him, and I expect the untrustworthy Russian regime to use this politically against the West.

133 code red 21  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 6:29:12pm

re: #113 Nevergiveup

But we are going to be "politically correct" you see. We can't overtly use India for some of the same reasons we can't overtly use Israel. We can't seem to be using an "Enemy" of Islam? Screwed up ain't it?


I don't even like thinking about it...as of today I've gained fifteen pounds since the great one was elected. I actually tuned my XM radio to 70's music to try and keep from stress eating.

134 [deleted]  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 6:29:15pm
135 Abu Lahab  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 6:29:21pm

re: #115 MandyManners

Beautifully said. I will try that tonight )

136 MandyManners  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 6:29:22pm

re: #127 Nevergiveup

I've tried that but on $13 a week, I ain't getting far!

It's a dream! Go as wild as you want.

137 stevieray  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 6:29:29pm

re: #130 BigPapa

Yes.

Thanks for clearing that up!

138 spirochete  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 6:29:37pm

re: #125 lrsshadow

I can't help, but think about how the pressure is coming down on Obama now. I mean the guy really has not had any real pressure in his life in regards to executive experience. The kind where life is at stake. Now he has been placed in the center of the storm.

The change and hope are not getting as much millage as they did in the campaign.


Well, but now is the time for Iran to signal it wants to change its behavior!
/

139 lrsshadow  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 6:29:59pm

yah, nukes.... ugh the pressure mounts on the man whole holds the most powerful office in the world.

140 Nevergiveup  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 6:30:07pm

re: #133 code red 21

I don't even like thinking about it...as of today I've gained fifteen pounds since the great one was elected. I actually tuned my XM radio to 70's music to try and keep from stress eating.

And more good news, they may be in bankruptcy court soon?

141 Killian Bundy  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 6:30:11pm

UAE refuses visa to Israeli tennis player Peer

Organizers gave the 21-year-old player no reason for the rejection, but it appeared to be tied to anti-Israel sentiments in the Gulf state, particularly after last month's three-week war between Israel and Islamic militants in Gaza.

/ya think?

142 Danny  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 6:30:22pm

Don't worry, Barack said he's going to redeploy our troops where they ought to be and invade Pakistan and crush the Taliban and capture Bin Laden and make us safer. I'm sure he'll do it, just as soon as he finishes fixing the economy.

143 Buster Bunny  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 6:30:24pm

re: #121 EmmmieG

One last comment, then I gotta go:

I am sick to my stomach thinking of what will happen to women and children in those provinces. Pakistan had been making at least token gestures towards decent human rights; no more.

Its a point to have human rights, and human rights are not a luxury .. they are an expectation. But when you are facing a group of people that is so idealogically driven that they are prepared to use children as part of the war machine, then you must have contempt for them. I dont like saying it because often Israel is demonised through the MSM on roughly the same accounts, but its true .. if you are prepared to create a war machine .. expect it to be turned against you when the time comes.

Men, women, children, dogs and cats.

144 brookly red  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 6:30:26pm

re: #123 LudwigVanQuixote

Yup. India. Keep your eye on India, they are the power in the region.

145 albusteve  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 6:30:29pm

the Paki/Afghani problem is beyond our reach to solve...the Taliban are relentless and there are too many of them...they do not seem to want to project power outside of their region...they will destroy Afghaistan as we know it and make their haven there....they do not recognize the Paki border and will ultimately rule that area as well....Pakistan does not have the resolve to resist...imo both are a lost cause period...it's all about the nukes..what will become of the nukes?...India must be shitting their pants....militant Islam cannot be eradicated by any humane force known to man...they will persist and it might just as well be right over there...how much American blood will we spend this time....

146 Racer X  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 6:30:32pm

[deleted]

147 [deleted]  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 6:30:33pm
148 MandyManners  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 6:30:34pm

re: #135 Abu Lahab

Beautifully said. I will try that tonight )

I do it from the floor up. I even get into the landscaping.

149 Achilles Tang  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 6:30:39pm

re: #129 Thanos

The way things are going I expect the frontier states to try a breakaway from Pakistan sometime in the next ten years. That's the other reason the Taliban are working strenuously on the Khyber and other near moderate agencies.

Breakaway? Why bother? That wouldn't give them anything they have now, would it, and they don't yet have where the nukes are.

150 Cato the Elder  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 6:30:50pm

No, this didn't happen under Bush.

But it's been brewing for years.

What would Bush have done to stop it? Sent a sternly-worded letter? Commissioned Condee to deliver it? Offered the Pakistanis some shiny new hardware?

You can blame this on Obama if you like. The provinces in question along with the whole picture in Afghano spun out of control a long time ago.

151 Nevergiveup  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 6:31:18pm

re: #136 MandyManners

It's a dream! Go as wild as you want.

Well I do in my dreams, but it is not about a house. Her name ....

152 Killgore Trout  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 6:31:22pm

re: #118 stevieray

Pakistan hasn't had control of the tribal areas for quite some time. Their military or police can't operate there and probably never could. Sharia law has been enforced locally since probably at least 1980 if not long before. This isn't really anything new. Pakistan has been cutting deals with the Taliban and tribal leaders for the past 4 years or so. I really don't think this is anything new.

153 Render  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 6:31:24pm

Two words.

Dianne FeinStein (D).

This is one of those times where I wish I hadn't been right...

KNOWING IS
ONLY HALF,
R

154 Abu Lahab  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 6:32:26pm

re: #132 JHW

This is an Article from the LA Times (yes, the LA Times) about this political use of the issue you mentioned.

155 jwb7605  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 6:32:29pm

re: #137 stevieray

Thanks for clearing that up!

from your two hypotheses:

a. they were never keen for the fight from the beginning -- Bush kept their feet to the fire... or

b. they want to fight, but fear Obama will leave them high and dry if things get tough.


I think he meant:
They were never keen for the fight from the beginning, and now that Bush is no longer around to keep their feet to the fire, they fear Obama will leave them high and dry under any circumstances.

156 [deleted]  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 6:32:32pm
157 Killgore Trout  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 6:32:42pm

re: #123 LudwigVanQuixote

Obama might be tougher on Pakistan than Bush was. We'll have to wait and see what happens.

158 Killgore Trout  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 6:33:09pm

re: #150 Cato the Elder

Agreed.

159 code red 21  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 6:33:13pm

re: #140 Nevergiveup

And more good news, they may be in bankruptcy court soon?

Thanks allot I needed that. I'm going to buy more polyester expand-allot clothes at this rate.

160 kansas  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 6:33:15pm

re: #150 Cato the Elder

No, this didn't happen under Bush.

But it's been brewing for years.

What would Bush have done to stop it? Sent a sternly-worded letter? Commissioned Condee to deliver it? Offered the Pakistanis some shiny new hardware?

You can blame this on Obama if you like. The provinces in question along with the whole picture in Afghano spun out of control a long time ago.

I think about the Iranian hostages who were released after Reagan was elected. I read on blogs about how Carter did all the work, but the fact is they didn't get released until after Carter was gone. Same with Bush. Who knows what he would have done? And therein is the deterrent.

161 Henchman Ghazi-808  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 6:33:18pm

re: #137 stevieray

hey, sometimes I'm a lizard of few words. Sometimes not!

162 lawhawk  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 6:33:19pm

re: #129 Thanos

The way things are going I expect the frontier states to try a breakaway from Pakistan sometime in the next ten years. That's the other reason the Taliban are working strenuously on the Khyber and other near moderate agencies.

I think it's going to happen much faster than that. They've already been considered semi-autonomous for years, and now that they're implementing their own law separate from the central law in Islamabad, they're showing that they have no intention of paying heed to Islamabad at all. In fact, it's a very ominous warning that Islamabad may soon see still more regions of the country fall to the Islamists and the Taliban.

The Taliban continue setting up these shadow councils where they have sufficient numbers - and with Mehsud showing that he can thwart the Pakistani military efforts in Swat, the Taliban have little to fear from Zardari's government. They still have to watch the skies for UAVs, but if the Pakistani government cans the UAV access from Pakistani airfields, that capability goes away or is severely diminished (thanks Sen. Feinstein!).

Throw in the way that the Russians have been dicking around with our logistics deals with Central Asia as an alternative to Pakistan and the problems with our ongoing efforts in Afghanistan are only going to get worse no matter what Obama says.

In sum, bad jobu and it's going to get worse.

163 Nevergiveup  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 6:33:27pm

re: #157 Killgore Trout

Obama might be tougher on Pakistan than Bush was. We'll have to wait and see what happens.

Never. Holbrooke is over there.

164 Sheepdogess  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 6:33:27pm

I hope the MSM and the Hollyweird left are happy.

Bastards.

165 HelloDare  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 6:33:34pm

Bill Clinton: She (Hillary) thinks that Joe Biden has got one of the best foreign policy minds and certainly some of the most important foreign policy experience we've had.

166 The Shadow Do  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 6:33:34pm

This is the result of the new 'smart diplomacy' at work. While Hillory has tea and photo shoots expressing America's good will, The President will appoint a high level panel chaired by Feinstein to smartly examine and then smartly solve the problem with a new, smarter way forward. In the meantime we can certainly hope for positive change in the hearts and minds of the new, reformed and now liberated Taliban.

/This is like being a passenger in the bus from the movie "Speed".

167 Buster Bunny  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 6:33:40pm

re: #150 Cato the Elder

No, this didn't happen under Bush.

You can blame this on Obama if you like. The provinces in question along with the whole picture in Afghano spun out of control a long time ago.

Thats the real issue. Afghanistan never was in control. Because of the fact its a series of mountains and plateus its a group of villages run by warlords .. and thats the way its been for centuries.

Afghanistan is just a way of grouping things on a map.

168 Dark_Falcon  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 6:33:41pm

re: #132 JHW

In reference to the supply line, this is truly troubling and for more than one reason. A few months ago, when Russia and Georgia collided, we had people here advocating an immediate attack on Russia to aid Georgia. I tried to inject in the conversation a little "wait and see" before playing Field Marshall, see if Georgia survives, see how far the Russians were going to take it, but there were many many who wanted to send carriers and troops immediately. Not one, that I can remember, mentioned or gave a thought to a land-locked NATO force heavily dependent on supply lines through Pakistan and Russia. I don't trust Putin as far as I can throw him, and I expect the untrustworthy Russian regime to use this politically against the West.

rec1c4 was one of those who thought it through. He wante dto attack Russia's supply lines into Georgia, which is the same trick the Taliban is using against us. And it's a good tactic that makes good military sense. What I'm wondering is if we have a counter move we can use.

169 Render  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 6:33:59pm

re: #152 Killgore Trout

There are some new and very disturbing aspects to this particular deal.

I gotta bolt, but Bill Roggio has the dealio.

CHECK
IT,
R

170 Mad Prophet Ludwig  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 6:34:02pm

re: #144 brookly red

Yup. India. Keep your eye on India, they are the power in the region.

In the physics dept where I am, there is a grim bet. It goes: will it be N. Korea vs. S. Korea, India vs. Pakistan or Iran v.s Israel in the next atomic exchange.

171 wiffersnapper  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 6:34:07pm

Queef LOLbermann must be enjoying himself right now.

172 Randall Gross  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 6:34:15pm

re: #149 Naso Tang

Breakaway? Why bother? That wouldn't give them anything they have now, would it, and they don't yet have where the nukes are.

Actually one of the nuke sites at least is in the frontiers. The Taliban are also marshalling a great deal of tribal nationalism to gain recruits, Pahktunkwa or whatever the Pashtun call it has been a dream of the more radical tribes like Baitullah Mehsud's for a long time. In the end it's all about temporal power for petty tribal warlords.

173 MandyManners  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 6:34:16pm

The area in question.

174 wiffersnapper  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 6:34:24pm

Thanks for keeping us safe, hussein!

175 nyc redneck  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 6:34:26pm

re: #95 Iron Fist

Bad news isn't a sufficient description. Potentially apocalyptic news is more like it. And Obama has been President for what? Is it a month yet?

Jackals sense weakness. They will be drawn to it, exploit it, and feed on the carcases. Two-legged jackals no less than their four-legged counterparts.

And Obama projects weakness. As does America by electing such a candidate to office.

and he is such an out of it imbecile, so confident that he is loved and respected around the world, he is oblivious to the dangers circling.
and if he ever does notice, he is so infected w/ the messianic hype of being a deity,
he will just blabber his platitudes, confident that they will work on headchoppers,

176 code red 21  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 6:34:33pm

re: #141 Killian Bundy

UAE refuses visa to Israeli tennis player Peer


/ya think?


Bastards

177 solomonpanting  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 6:34:58pm

re: #156 buzzsawmonkey

Tribal ahead
Tribal behind
And you know that notion just crossed my mind

--the Ungrateful Dead

Work it, man!

178 [deleted]  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 6:34:59pm
179 JHW  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 6:35:04pm

re: #154 Abu Lahab

Thanks I'll check it out, I fully expect Vlad to milk it for all its worth. IIRC , at the exact time of the Georgian war, a NATO delegation was in Moscow negotiating increased transit of supplies through Russia.

180 Nevergiveup  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 6:35:10pm

re: #166 The Shadow Do

This is the result of the new 'smart diplomacy' at work. While Hillory has tea and photo shoots expressing America's good will, The President will appoint a high level panel chaired by Feinstein to smartly examine and then smartly solve the problem with a new, smarter way forward. In the meantime we can certainly hope for positive change in the hearts and minds of the new, reformed and now liberated Taliban.

/This is like being a passenger in the bus from the movie "Speed".

Ain't no panel here folks. It's Richard Holbrook's baby.

181 [deleted]  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 6:35:18pm
182 Mad Prophet Ludwig  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 6:35:28pm

re: #150 Cato the Elder

No, this didn't happen under Bush.

But it's been brewing for years.

What would Bush have done to stop it? Sent a sternly-worded letter? Commissioned Condee to deliver it? Offered the Pakistanis some shiny new hardware?

You can blame this on Obama if you like. The provinces in question along with the whole picture in Afghano spun out of control a long time ago.

I really have to agree with you on this.

183 Killgore Trout  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 6:36:13pm

re: #162 lawhawk

Maybe this could work out. If Pakistan gives up on the tribal areas we will be free to sweep in and clean things up. Major military operation would only take a couple weeks.

184 Buster Bunny  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 6:36:19pm

re: #126 jwb7605

Irrelevance is not the word I would have chosen for a country with nukes.

Nukes are yesterdays technology. Effective at doing heaps of damage but there is better stuff out there now.

185 [deleted]  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 6:36:24pm
186 jwb7605  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 6:36:30pm

re: #170 LudwigVanQuixote

In the physics dept where I am, there is a grim bet. It goes: will it be N. Korea vs. S. Korea, India vs. Pakistan or Iran v.s Israel in the next atomic exchange.

I would bet on the order, rather than the singular event. You just described the chain of events for WWIII.
I would bet
(a) India vs. Pakistan
(b) Iran vs. Israel
(c) N. Korea vs. S. Korea

... in that order, about two weeks apart.

187 MandyManners  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 6:36:35pm

Nuclear-related areas.

188 Killian Bundy  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 6:36:50pm

US House Speaker Pelosi to meet pope: Vatican

Visiting US House of Representatives Speaker Nancy Pelosi will have an audience with Pope Benedict XVI during her weeklong visit to Italy, a Vatican official said Monday.

The meeting will take place on Wednesday, the official told AFP, saying it would likely occur after the pope's weekly general audience.

Pelosi, who describes herself as an "ardent" Catholic while advocating reproductive rights, will be the highest-ranking US official to see the pope since President Barack Obama took office last month.

She really is delusional.

/matter meets anti matter

189 Nevergiveup  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 6:36:57pm

re: #182 LudwigVanQuixote

I really have to agree with you on this.

I am not going to back everything Bush did or didn't do, but when the Democrats were cutting your legs out from under ya?

190 Racer X  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 6:37:06pm

Lo Fidelity Allstars- Battleflag

Is it time?

191 Dark_Falcon  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 6:38:06pm

re: #168 Dark_Falcon

red1c4 was one of those who thought it through. He wante dto attack Russia's supply lines into Georgia, which is the same trick the Taliban is using against us. And it's a good tactic that makes good military sense. What I'm wondering is if we have a counter move we can use.

PIMF

192 jwb7605  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 6:38:13pm

re: #184 Buster Bunny

Nukes are yesterdays technology. Effective at doing heaps of damage but there is better stuff out there now.

I'm not sure what your point is.

193 spirochete  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 6:38:36pm

re: #184 Buster Bunny

Nukes are yesterdays technology. Effective at doing heaps of damage but there is better stuff out there now.

I'm all ears..

194 Randall Gross  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 6:38:38pm

re: #162 lawhawk

The PPP and ANP got into power instead of MMA in the Frontiers partly by campaigning on getting rid of the FCR's in the frontiers, but that left a vacuum, and took power from the tribal elders. (along with a lot of responsibility) The Taliban filled the gap when the Pakistan gov't only made weak gestures towards implementing civil law to replace the FCR's.

(FCR's were draconian but effective regs leftover from British colonial times that basically amounted to the Tribal head being responsible for all bad things that happened in his area)

195 jaunte  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 6:38:53pm

The Aggies better get busy developing an opium poppy devouring locust.

196 Charles Johnson  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 6:38:53pm

re: #150 Cato the Elder

No, this didn't happen under Bush.

But it's been brewing for years.

What would Bush have done to stop it? Sent a sternly-worded letter? Commissioned Condee to deliver it? Offered the Pakistanis some shiny new hardware?

You can blame this on Obama if you like. The provinces in question along with the whole picture in Afghano spun out of control a long time ago.

Sadly true. The Bush administration had a temporary edge after 9/11 - they shocked the Muslim world, including Pakistan, with America's unexpectedly strong response. But in the years since then, that sharp line got increasingly blurry.

And now we have a President who seems very weak to the Muslim world, a President who goes on Arab television and says, "We've made mistakes. Won't you forgive us?"

I think we're going to see this kind of stuff accelerating in the near future. I'm not very confident that Obama will be able to handle it.

197 Achilles Tang  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 6:38:57pm

re: #150 Cato the Elder

No, this didn't happen under Bush.

But it's been brewing for years.

What would Bush have done to stop it? Sent a sternly-worded letter? Commissioned Condee to deliver it? Offered the Pakistanis some shiny new hardware?

You can blame this on Obama if you like. The provinces in question along with the whole picture in Afghano spun out of control a long time ago.

What the US did was help oust Musharaff by encouraging that solution to all political problems; aka democracy. /

So instead of a strong leader there is now a weak leader of a fractured country, or countries.

198 Curt  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 6:39:06pm

re: #111 Dark_Falcon

He's double dribbling his pants right now, I'd suspect.

I doubt it. He, Axelrod and "Dead Fish" are in the back room making the strategy of how to not let another horrific (well, a worse) catastrophe go to waste. Michelle and the girls are probably being fitted for a designer burkas.

199 Nevergiveup  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 6:39:11pm

re: #184 Buster Bunny

Nukes are yesterdays technology. Effective at doing heaps of damage but there is better stuff out there now.

Sorry, but one nuke in the hand of terrorists could start a nuclear conflagration that engulfs the entire planet.

200 [deleted]  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 6:39:20pm
201 nyc redneck  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 6:39:28pm

re: #110 ploome hineni

perfect storm

..cost of Iraq and Afgan war

..economic AND political

economic meltdown in USA

and

the big zero and the wab in the Oval office........

without Churchill's bust

he couldn't suffer the presence of the churchill bust.
he wouldn't feel inspired by great man like churchill.
o would be threatened by him.

202 [deleted]  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 6:39:36pm
203 jwb7605  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 6:39:41pm

re: #188 Killian Bundy

US House Speaker Pelosi to meet pope: Vatican

She really is delusional.

/matter meets anti matter

What are the odds she makes the return flight as a Protestant or agnostic?

204 deWildcats  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 6:40:18pm

The end ... and it begins!

205 Buster Bunny  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 6:40:32pm

re: #192 jwb7605

I'm not sure what your point is.

The point is at this time and age I can think of two to three things that can outperform any nuke that Pakistan would throw into the picture.

Nukes only act as a deterrent, anyone who dares use them can expect a bucketload of trouble.

Pakistan just doesnt have the air intercepts to be able to contain the outrage following a nuclear strike.

206 Randall Gross  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 6:40:44pm

Charles, I'm still going to disagree with you on the didn't happen under Bush, see my link upthread.

207 UberInfidel67  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 6:41:20pm

I swear I see a dismantling of civilization here. First, as in the Phillipines...you get one group that wants a chunk of land and autonomy. Are they happy with that and creating a way of life for their "citizens"? Hell no! They always want more, or to break into even smaller groups...with a chunk of land and autonomy....and so on and so forth. Pretty soon, the whole area will look like the villages from the 7th century. Viola! Mission accomplished!

**gag**

208 [deleted]  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 6:41:24pm
209 [deleted]  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 6:41:29pm
210 brookly red  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 6:41:32pm

re: #170 LudwigVanQuixote

In the physics dept where I am, there is a grim bet. It goes: will it be N. Korea vs. S. Korea, India vs. Pakistan or Iran v.s Israel in the next atomic exchange.

Well, the way the powers that be are lining up I would cover the table & say all of the above. But more likely India will just use sheer weight.

211 FightingBack  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 6:41:33pm

re: #141 Killian Bundy

UAE refuses visa to Israeli tennis player Peer

/ya think?

Nah. Just standard Anti-Semitism, rearing its ugly head.

212 Colonel Panik  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 6:41:34pm

re: #113 Nevergiveup

But we are going to be "politically correct" you see. We can't overtly use India for some of the same reasons we can't overtly use Israel. We can't seem to be using an "Enemy" of Islam? Screwed up ain't it?

India and Israel may act together on their own.

213 Dark_Falcon  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 6:41:54pm

re: #198 Curt

I doubt it. He, Axelrod and "Dead Fish" are in the back room making the strategy of how to not let another horrific (well, a worse) catastrophe go to waste. Michelle and the girls are probably being fitted for a designer burkas.

I am quite certain that Michelle Obama would never accept being in a burka. The problem is that her husbands policies may condemn millions of women to life in those body bags for the living.

214 jwb7605  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 6:41:54pm

re: #205 Buster Bunny

The point is at this time and age I can think of two to three things that can outperform any nuke that Pakistan would throw into the picture.

Nukes only act as a deterrent, anyone who dares use them can expect a bucketload of trouble.

Pakistan just doesnt have the air intercepts to be able to contain the outrage following a nuclear strike.

I suspect Pakistan is completely capable of launching the first deterrent.

215 lawhawk  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 6:41:56pm

re: #183 Killgore Trout

Maybe this could work out. If Pakistan gives up on the tribal areas we will be free to sweep in and clean things up. Major military operation would only take a couple weeks.

Sweep in from where? If we don't have the supply lines and logistics in place, that's going to be a tough nut to crack even under good circumstances. We can't rely on Pakistan for supply lines because our supplies are under near constant harassment from the time they're offloaded in Karachi. The Khyber Pass is a mess, and alternative routes are a problem (courtesy of Russia).

My concern is that the problems in the frontier provinces will spread to the rest of Pakistan and Zardari is incapable of stopping it before it is too late.

216 Abu Lahab  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 6:41:58pm

I think the French and the British are using too much "stealth' on their submarines that they collided today. Both were nuclear submarines.

217 aaron  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 6:42:05pm

I'll admit I have some trouble differentiating between

* the Islamic Republic of Pakistan, which was founded upon the notion of jihad as something other than a course in self-improvement, and which developed nuclear weapons for the express purpose of killing hundreds of millions of Hindus, and

* the Taliban.

The former claim to still control the nukes, while the latter are a bit more honest in explaining their ambitions. I suppose on some level both those things matter, but in the end I expect it will all turn out the same, and badly.

218 Nevergiveup  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 6:42:16pm

re: #205 Buster Bunny

The point is at this time and age I can think of two to three things that can outperform any nuke that Pakistan would throw into the picture.

Nukes only act as a deterrent, anyone who dares use them can expect a bucketload of trouble.

Pakistan just doesnt have the air intercepts to be able to contain the outrage following a nuclear strike.

The treat from Pakistan is not only a local nuclear war with India, but the potential threat of the spread of their nuclear arsenal.

220 spirochete  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 6:42:59pm

re: #202 Iron Fist

I always thought it was a much stronger message from Bush, but just a guess, I don't know.

221 Racer X  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 6:43:22pm

re: #206 Thanos

Charles, I'm still going to disagree with you on the didn't happen under Bush, see my link upthread.

Echo chamber!

/

223 Curt  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 6:43:41pm

And remember, The One said he'd bomb Pakistan...if they didn't help us. Looks like we'll see if he breaks of keeps a campaign promise, huh?

224 code red 21  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 6:43:41pm

re: #181 ploome hineni

I watch HGTV and Law and Order

the news makes me sick

and NObama induces vomiting

I need to vomit then

225 MandyManners  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 6:43:52pm

re: #205 Buster Bunny

The point is at this time and age I can think of two to three things that can outperform any nuke that Pakistan would throw into the picture.

Nukes only act as a deterrent, anyone who dares use them can expect a bucketload of trouble.

Pakistan just doesnt have the air intercepts to be able to contain the outrage following a nuclear strike.

What if someone takes a nuke away from a facility and sends it here in a cargo container that slips past inspection? How will we know whom to nuke in response?

226 Achilles Tang  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 6:44:06pm

re: #172 Thanos

Actually one of the nuke sites at least is in the frontiers. The Taliban are also marshalling a great deal of tribal nationalism to gain recruits, Pahktunkwa or whatever the Pashtun call it has been a dream of the more radical tribes like Baitullah Mehsud's for a long time. In the end it's all about temporal power for petty tribal warlords.

Perhaps you are right in principle, but it is hard to imagine those tribes really coming together in any way that involves serious "national" coordination and I suspect that everything that they could call infrastructure now comes from Islamabad.

On the other hand, that would make it easier to bomb the shit out of them.

228 Sheepdogess  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 6:44:16pm

Oscars are coming up, so if you want to see a good film...

Ship of Fools

[Link: www.netflix.com...]

You'll thank me......

229 MartinLeaf  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 6:44:16pm

Thank Carter for Pakistan Nukes. Although actual nuclear detonations were during Reagan, enrichment began under the demonic Carter. Carter will end up causing far more deaths than Hitler.

230 lawhawk  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 6:44:18pm

re: #9 Thanos

This kind of appeasement is far worse than the other instances where Musharraf would alternate between crackdown and appeasement. By opening up these regions to sharia, the Islamists are laying the groundwork for still more concessions on which Islamabad will have to cave.

It's the slouching towards sharia that has me most concerned, and it is going to pick up steam as it rushes towards Islamabad.

231 Buster Bunny  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 6:44:52pm

re: #209 Iron Fist

It's kind of like a double-barreled sawed-off 12. Sometimes old and reliable will beat the newer, more slickly packaged latest technology.

I have a great video on youtube somewhere that shows off the latest in automated shotgun tech. It fires up to 300 12 gage shells a min .. and thats just one of the freakish new weapons that you'd be contending with.

Be realistic. First of all, the amount of flak a nuke brings down on a country is enough to sterilise it.

Second, the first country to use them in war will expect them to be used against them.

The costs, REGARDLESS of religion and expected outcome, are just too high.

232 Nevergiveup  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 6:44:53pm

re: #225 MandyManners

What if someone takes a nuke away from a facility and sends it here in a cargo container that slips past inspection? How will we know whom to nuke in response?

Actually we could probably figure that out, but still.

233 Achilles Tang  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 6:44:59pm

re: #208 ploome hineni

BUsh forced elections on Musharraf

what I said.

234 albusteve  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 6:44:59pm

re: #214 jwb7605

I suspect Pakistan is completely capable of launching the first deterrent.

I do to...the question is what are we gonna do about it or is it worth it for us to do anything at all...wtf?....how long can we hang out with these critters before we are stunned into the reality that there is nothing in it for us...except the nukes

235 Randall Gross  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 6:45:17pm

re: #215 lawhawk

It's not going to spread much further into Pakistan than it has. They are butted right up against the Sindh and Punjab now with the fall of Swat and NWFP. Sindh and Punjab are much too populous, much too moderate. It would be like the Apache saying they were going to take Kansas City in the early 1900's, just wouldn't happen unless they had a military ally (if Iran jumped in)

236 Sunlight  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 6:45:40pm

re: #34 Racer X

Ask the woman in New York - who was recently beheaded by her husband - how she feels about Islamic law.

Need to ask Michele...

237 HelloDare  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 6:45:48pm

re: #227 Vet_Missing_Parts (1LT, Ret)

Another promise he'll soon break.

Give him a chance. As soon as he picks a puppy, he'll invade Pakistan.

238 Nevergiveup  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 6:46:16pm

re: #233 Naso Tang

what I said.

Under great pressure from our Senate and Congress. And with a War to fight in Iraq, something had to give.

239 Charles Johnson  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 6:46:18pm

re: #206 Thanos

Charles, I'm still going to disagree with you on the didn't happen under Bush, see my link upthread.

OK, I slightly overstated the point; some of this did happen under the Bush administration, as Bush's focus slowly went away, and the Islamists in Pakistan got over the shock-and-awe factor. The center cannot hold.

But it's going to accelerate now, because Obama has telegraphed weakness in a big way.

240 spirochete  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 6:46:19pm

re: #225 MandyManners

What if someone takes a nuke away from a facility and sends it here in a cargo container that slips past inspection? How will we know whom to nuke in response?

The fallout has signatures.

241 Curt  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 6:46:27pm

re: #216 Abu Lahab

I think the French and the British are using too much "stealth' on their submarines that they collided today. Both were nuclear submarines.

Dude: Boomers were like the original stealth vessels...their entire purpose is to stay hidden from everyone, especially attack subs, until the National Command Authority (who ever's) tells them to push the button...

242 Killian Bundy  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 6:46:33pm

re: #225 MandyManners

How will we know whom to nuke in response?

The radiation will have a unique signature.

/we'll know

243 FrogMarch  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 6:46:55pm

re: #223 Curt

And remember, The One said he'd bomb Pakistan...if they didn't help us. Looks like we'll see if he breaks of keeps a campaign promise, huh?

Obama is breaking campaign promises. left and right. What's one more when you have a fawning drooling press as cover?

244 Cato the Elder  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 6:47:00pm

re: #160 kansas

Who knows what [Bush] would have done? And therein is the deterrent.

OK, name something he could have done.

Take away Pakistan's nukes?

Tell the ISI not to play footsie with Jamaat-e-Islami anymore?

Bomb Karachi?

C'mon, pony up. What are the options?

245 Buster Bunny  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 6:47:24pm

re: #225 MandyManners

What if someone takes a nuke away from a facility and sends it here in a cargo container that slips past inspection? How will we know whom to nuke in response?

I'm aware that at this stage in the US .. there are satellites that do nothing but check for radioactive sources and movements in radiological schemes across the US.

There are safety measures in place for that sort of stuff.

246 Randall Gross  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 6:47:31pm

re: #226 Naso Tang

Perhaps you are right in principle, but it is hard to imagine those tribes really coming together in any way that involves serious "national" coordination and I suspect that everything that they could call infrastructure now comes from Islamabad.

On the other hand, that would make it easier to bomb the shit out of them.

I agree on the easier part, however they are operating collectively now, e.g. they will all drop what they are doing and run to Zawahiri if he calls. The only nut not cracked yet are the Barelvis in the Khyber.

247 Colonel Panik  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 6:47:32pm

re: #237 HelloDare

Give him a chance. As soon as he picks a puppy, he'll invade Pakistan.

He's already picked out a puppy, his lap dog, Media.

248 albusteve  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 6:47:33pm

re: #231 Buster Bunny

I have a great video on youtube somewhere that shows off the latest in automated shotgun tech. It fires up to 300 12 gage shells a min .. and thats just one of the freakish new weapons that you'd be contending with.

Be realistic. First of all, the amount of flak a nuke brings down on a country is enough to sterilise it.

Second, the first country to use them in war will expect them to be used against them.

The costs, REGARDLESS of religion and expected outcome, are just too high.

not for someone with a death wish...it's just a bomb vest on a bigger scale

249 NJDhockeyfan  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 6:47:57pm

Peace through weakness?

Fresh from reworking the domestic economic order via the "stimulus" bill in favor of vastly expanded U.S. government influence and power, President Barack Obama proposes a set of changes with respect to American security policies and programs that will have the opposite effect. If equally successful, he stands to transform the "world's only superpower" into a nuclear impotent, with possibly catastrophic consequences.

Such a transformation would be the more extraordinary for it coming against the backdrop of others' buildups of their nuclear arsenals. Every other declared nuclear weapon state is modernizing its stockpile and the most dangerous wannabees - North Korea and Iran - are building up their offensive missile capabilities and acquiring as quickly as possible the arms to go atop them.

The American people are largely clueless about this state of affairs. Doubtless, they would be horrified by the affront to common sense and hard experience entailed, especially under these circumstances, by the sort of U.S. disarmament Mr. Obama has underway.

250 [deleted]  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 6:48:01pm
251 MandyManners  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 6:48:07pm

I'm sure the millions of dead will be comforted knowing that.

252 Achilles Tang  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 6:48:25pm

re: #225 MandyManners

I believe that I have read that even radioactive materials in bombs have composition signatures that can be picked up from test fallout or even air samples near plants and that those can give a fingerprint of sorts to the source.

253 Mad Prophet Ludwig  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 6:48:30pm

re: #196 Charles

Sadly true. The Bush administration had a temporary edge after 9/11 - they shocked the Muslim world, including Pakistan, with America's unexpectedly strong response. But in the years since then, that sharp line got increasingly blurry.

And now we have a President who seems very weak to the Muslim world, a President who goes on Arab television and says, "We've made mistakes. Won't you forgive us?"

I think we're going to see this kind of stuff accelerating in the near future. I'm not very confident that Obama will be able to handle it.

I am not completely disagreeing with you. However, I think it is more complex than that. Honestly, the bad guy leadership is not blind. We are stretched a little thin right now both economically and militarily. Even a very TR type of president would need to pick his battles carefully.

The bad guys know this and they are trying really hard to see how far they can push. Further there is the issue that we put all of our eggs in the Musarrif basket and then pushed for elections when he had alienated his the hardliners in his nation - he was guaranteed to loose at that point and those hardliners have no love of America. There is also the assassination of Bhuto and the rising tensions with India to take into account.

All of this is coming together as a very tough situation. The general Pakistani may not hate America, but they are not our friends either. The Islamicists are on the rise and the government in Pakistan sees dealing with the Islamacists as holding a tiger by the tail.

I am actually encouraged that Obama has been willing to hit them at all.

254 MandyManners  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 6:48:32pm

I'm cranky right now. bbl

255 Sunlight  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 6:48:37pm

re: #77 quickjustice

American foreign policy is imploding before our eyes, presided over by Obama and Clinton. We can't win in Afghanistan without Pakistan's cooperation. If Pakistan is providing safe haven for Taliban, as they are, we go to war with them, or we retreat.

I bet Obama announces a pullout from Afghanistan before year's end.

But how can he? Afghanistan is where the REAL war on terror is... he told us!
/

256 Randall Gross  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 6:48:49pm

re: #239 Charles

OK, I slightly overstated the point; some of this did happen under the Bush administration, as Bush's focus slowly went away, and the Islamists in Pakistan got over the shock-and-awe factor. The center cannot hold.

But it's going to accelerate now, because Obama has telegraphed weakness in a big way.

On your behalf, nobody, including the MSM reported it much back then. It might have made them look Islamophobic or something to say Shariah law in the frontiers was a bad thing.

257 kansas  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 6:48:56pm

re: #244 Cato the Elder

OK, name something he could have done.

Take away Pakistan's nukes?

Tell the ISI not to play footsie with Jamaat-e-Islami anymore?

Bomb Karachi?

C'mon, pony up. What are the options?

I'm saying that not knowing what he might have done would be a deterrent. He did not exude weakness.

258 [deleted]  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 6:48:58pm
259 MandyManners  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 6:49:01pm

re: #245 Buster Bunny

I apologize for sniping at you earlier.

260 [deleted]  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 6:49:03pm
261 Mad Prophet Ludwig  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 6:49:04pm

re: #208 ploome hineni

BUsh forced elections on Musharraf

yes he did. I actually just wrote about that and saw your comment.

262 Racer X  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 6:49:30pm

Thanks for deleting #250.

263 Ziggy Standard  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 6:49:33pm

Well, this is pretty f*cked up.

264 [deleted]  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 6:49:43pm
265 jwb7605  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 6:50:00pm

re: #234 albusteve

I do to...the question is what are we gonna do about it or is it worth it for us to do anything at all...wtf?....how long can we hang out with these critters before we are stunned into the reality that there is nothing in it for us...except the nukes

I see no satisfactory move in the chess game on our (USA) part.
What happens given the current situation (including our "State Department" and the "skills" they possess) is what happens.

It would appear that Bush had some under-the-table deals going on, but Barbara Boxer seems to have done that in.

266 Curt  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 6:50:03pm

re: #243 FrogMarch

Obama is breaking campaign promises. left and right. What's one more when you have a fawning drooling press as cover?

Roger, ball, FM.

Track his record at Politifact Obama Meter.

267 Boondock St. Bender  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 6:50:20pm

re: #225 MandyManners

actually i believe that there is a method to determine where a nuke originated from(trace residue or some such)small consolation to those attcked though.

268 HelloDare  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 6:50:25pm

We are going to be pushed and challenged on all fronts. Middle-East, South America, Russian, China, North Korea, Berkeley. It ain't gonna be pretty.

269 spirochete  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 6:50:41pm

re: #245 Buster Bunny

I'm aware that at this stage in the US .. there are satellites that do nothing but check for radioactive sources and movements in radiological schemes across the US.

There are safety measures in place for that sort of stuff.

Can we talk about something else now...

270 Buster Bunny  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 6:50:43pm

re: #259 MandyManners

I apologize for sniping at you earlier.

Is ok. It seems its the first bad comment I've had in a while, you werent the only person who slammed me for makin it.

271 Adrenalyn  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 6:51:06pm

well, 3 Republican Senators surrendered to 0bama and the left
but on the bright side

perhaps the rest of the republican party will find their balls again
just because we lost the election does not mean we have to roll over and play dead

we just have to be the spirited, but civil, opposition

272 Killgore Trout  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 6:51:37pm

re: #215 lawhawk

Sweep in from where?


Afghanistan.

273 Randall Gross  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 6:51:47pm

The Frontier provinces have basically been falling like dominoes the past three years, the MSM reports the peace deals as peace deals, not hudnas, and most of the articles never mentioned Shariah law being effected.

274 Nevergiveup  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 6:51:47pm

re: #261 LudwigVanQuixote

yes he did. I actually just wrote about that and saw your comment.

These elections were forced on Musharaf by the Dems in the US Senate and Congress, and specifically they encouraged Bhuto to go back and stir up trouble.

275 albusteve  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 6:51:53pm

Pakistan and Afghanistan can all go to Hell and I'm goin to Texas

276 Desert Dog  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 6:52:05pm

Pakistan is a festering cancer....question is what is the "treatment"? Chemo or RADIATION? Or, we can cut out the infected area and hope it does not come back. Or, we can sit here and do nothing and HOPE it gets better....

277 Mad Prophet Ludwig  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 6:52:07pm

re: #184 Buster Bunny

Nukes are yesterdays technology. Effective at doing heaps of damage but there is better stuff out there now.

I don't know about that... Nothing says "never have to say your sorry" like an atomic.

278 Buster Bunny  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 6:52:28pm

re: #269 spirochete

Can we talk about something else now...

Pakistan produces some of the finest peridots in existance. Beautiful green rocks, that when polished range from a beautiful yellow, to a yellow green .. to a wonderful grassy green color.

Fact for the day.

279 [deleted]  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 6:52:36pm
280 code red 21  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 6:52:36pm

re: #255 Sunlight

But how can he? Afghanistan is where the REAL war on terror is... he told us!
/


For some strange reason I can see Bo going into Pakistan. I don't know why, I don't really have any evidence other that what he said, but there is something about it that has the ring of truth about it. And believe me when I say there isn't allot about BO I take seriously, but this one thing I do.

281 Achilles Tang  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 6:52:39pm

re: #238 Nevergiveup

Under great pressure from our Senate and Congress. And with a War to fight in Iraq, something had to give.

I don't know if that is a good excuse. In fact I don't know that anyone needs be accused in the sense that as a nation we hold such things as elections in high esteem. But that doesn't change the fact that, IMHO, Pakistan is too primitive and fractured for true democracy and Musharraf is the type of leader that they need.

Our principles said no, so we help shoot ourselves in the foot.

282 Mich-again  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 6:52:42pm

So whats the long term plan for a supply line into Afghanistan? Buy a vowel and pick a Stan.

283 mfarmer1  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 6:52:44pm

I really don't see the big deal here. It wasn't as if Pahk-eee-stahn was doing anything in all the north/south *.stans anyway. Now it has just made it official. Maybe this is a green light for around the clock Predator missions in the area. The Pakistan government can then say it has no influence there anymore and suggest that the new Taliban UN representative for the restive region address the proper authorities. Afghanistan can claim it no longer has to respect the sovereignty of the region as belonging to Pakistan anymore and can do what it wants there too.

Oh, I'm such a dreamer.

284 Curt  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 6:52:44pm

re: #249 NJDhockeyfan

Peace through weakness?

Well, if you hafta wreck the economy, you gotta take out the military to make sure the incoming rulers are spared the bloodshed. You know, Michelle told us we were a "mean" country...like ti was a bad thing, or sumthin'

285 NJDhockeyfan  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 6:52:51pm

Hannity is talking about homegrown terrorism right now.

286 Afrocity  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 6:52:57pm

re: #271 Adrenalyn

Obama is working for one world government. I can feel it.

287 Mich-again  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 6:53:42pm

Don't quote a deleted comment. That is all. KTHNXBYE!

288 [deleted]  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 6:53:42pm
289 gregg  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 6:53:56pm

re: #110 ploome hineni


the big zero and the wab in the Oval office........

without Churchill's bust

No problems, mate. Word is Obama has requested a Ward Churchill bust to replace the Winston Churchill bust.

290 notutopia  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 6:53:58pm

This is recent...
Pakistan's Swat region a threat for all of us, U.S envoy tells India
*snip*
"I do want to underscore the fact that what happened to Swat demonstrates the keypoint and that is India, the U.S. and Pakistan all have a common threat now," Holbrooke said.

"I talked to people from Swat and they were frankly quite terrified.

"I attempted to discuss Swat a lot, Swat has really deeply affected the people of Pakistan not just in Peshawar but in Lahore and Islamabad."

India is seen as crucial to any U.S. effort to stabilise Afghanistan where it has built roads, power lines and is among its top aid givers.

But Pakistan fears growing Indian influence there, suspecting an attempt by New Delhi to encircle it.

Those fears are said to be a reason why Pakistan has been reluctant to completely cut ties with the Taliban, seeing them as a tool to maintain its influence in Afghanistan by proxy.


[Link: www3.signonsandiego.com...]

291 Afrocity  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 6:54:00pm

re: #285 NJDhockeyfan

heh heh

292 albusteve  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 6:54:00pm

re: #272 Killgore Trout

Afghanistan.

they might know were coming eh?...can't be done, the logistics are beyond our means...let the Taliban have it....the alternatives are not worth it...we tried

293 Adrenalyn  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 6:54:00pm

re: #268 HelloDare

We are going to be pushed and challenged on all fronts. Middle-East, South America, Russian, China, North Korea, Berkeley. It ain't gonna be pretty.

not to mention the Jihadis still want to bring down planes
everything leaving overseas bound for America has to be accounted for and our DHS be notified before it ever leaves "there"

and even though foreign governments "may" inspect cargo and passengers, we still have a look-see at as much as possible to get what slipped thru the sieve they use to keep planes flying

294 Dark_Falcon  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 6:54:35pm

Well, form what I'm seeing, it looks like Jennine Garafalo is one of the baddies on 24. Art imitates life...

295 Achilles Tang  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 6:54:39pm

re: #260 ploome hineni

what I said

I respectfully concede the point.

296 Curt  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 6:54:44pm

re: #286 Afrocity

Obama is working for one world government. I can feel it.

No..GET IT RIGHT! IT's THE BUSH DYNASTY!

Geez...haven't been reading your DailyKos per your minder's prescription, I see. Bad, bad citizen.

297 Adrenalyn  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 6:54:59pm

re: #286 Afrocity

Obama is working for one world government. I can feel it.

indeed and agreed
which is why we must remain the opposition

298 Nevergiveup  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 6:55:12pm

re: #281 Naso Tang

I don't know if that is a good excuse. In fact I don't know that anyone needs be accused in the sense that as a nation we hold such things as elections in high esteem. But that doesn't change the fact that, IMHO, Pakistan is too primitive and fractured for true democracy and Musharraf is the type of leader that they need.

Our principles said no, so we help shoot ourselves in the foot.

You forget how the Dems, who were the majority in the congress, and the MSM were all over the Bush Administration like flys on shit. Don't forget what that was like.

299 spirochete  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 6:55:20pm

re: #278 Buster Bunny

Pakistan produces some of the finest peridots in existance. Beautiful green rocks, that when polished range from a beautiful yellow, to a yellow green .. to a wonderful grassy green color.

Fact for the day.

Nicw. Cleared for public consumption. And I didn't know that, either.

300 mfarmer1  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 6:55:38pm

re: #294 Dark_Falcon

Well, form what I'm seeing, it looks like Jennine Garafalo is one of the baddies on 24. Art imitates life...

Hey, some of us are on the west coast! How about a spoiler alert?

301 Buster Bunny  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 6:56:25pm

What got deleted? Did i quote something bad or something?

302 Mich-again  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 6:56:35pm

re: #286 Afrocity

Obama is working for one world government.

Look for teh one world currency first. Oooga booga.

303 Mad Prophet Ludwig  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 6:56:48pm

re: #194 Thanos

The PPP and ANP got into power instead of MMA in the Frontiers partly by campaigning on getting rid of the FCR's in the frontiers, but that left a vacuum, and took power from the tribal elders. (along with a lot of responsibility) The Taliban filled the gap when the Pakistan gov't only made weak gestures towards implementing civil law to replace the FCR's.

(FCR's were draconian but effective regs leftover from British colonial times that basically amounted to the Tribal head being responsible for all bad things that happened in his area)

That's a good analysis

304 lawhawk  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 6:56:54pm

re: #272 Killgore Trout

Afghanistan.

And our forces in Afghanistan are getting supplies from where? They were coming from Pakistan, but that's a problem and Russia is playing games with alternative routings of even non-military supplies.

305 solomonpanting  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 6:56:55pm

re: #286 Afrocity

Obama is working for one world government. I can feel it.

Didn't he give a speech in Berlin as a world citizen?

306 Nevergiveup  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 6:56:58pm

re: #301 Buster Bunny

What got deleted? Did i quote something bad or something?

where?

307 HelloDare  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 6:57:00pm

Heard this over the weekend.

"Ever since 9-11, extremists have gotten a bad name. It's weird. "

308 nyc redneck  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 6:57:06pm

re: #286 Afrocity

Obama is working for one world government. I can feel it.

and if that ever happens he won't be at the top of the pyramid scheme.
imagine him squaring off w/ putin to share power. lol
o will lucky if they just chain him up in the dungeon and throw away the key.

309 rwmofo  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 6:57:07pm

Looks like some of the marginally imbalanced have been flushed from the bushes today. At least it hasn't been boring.

310 Randall Gross  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 6:57:30pm

I've speculated as well that it might be part of a grander strategy. Basically Al Qaida means "the base" and the original "base" was a training camp in the Frontiers of Pakistan. Now they are forced into fighting on their home turf, and... their jihadi chickens have come home to roost.
Their strategy changed to defense and taking over the frontiers in Pakistan in 2006 when they saw the surge coming in Iraq.

This has certainly allowed us to win in Iraq, and it's taken a great deal of pressure off the lightly manned Afghanistan. Hell on the Pakistanis, but an effective strategy for us.

311 Vicious Babushka  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 6:57:40pm

re: #278 Buster Bunny

Pakistan produces some of the finest peridots in existance. Beautiful green rocks, that when polished range from a beautiful yellow, to a yellow green .. to a wonderful grassy green color.

Fact for the day.

Peridot is my daughter's birthstone. She claims it's the ugliest birthstone of the year.

312 Charles Johnson  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 6:57:44pm

I am extremely leery of these reports. The people promoting this 'homegrown jihad' stuff have serious credibility problems.

Martin Mawyer is the leader of the "Christian Action Network."

And this is a cause that was heavily promoted by Gates of Vienna and the fascist network of "anti-jihad" sites.

I'm smelling something really bad here.

313 Buster Bunny  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 6:58:05pm

Dont know .. I think my #264 is missing.

314 [deleted]  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 6:58:13pm
315 Killgore Trout  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 6:58:14pm

re: #292 albusteve

...can't be done, the logistics are beyond our means...let the Taliban have it....the alternatives are not worth it...we tried


Heh, you're awfully pessimistic. We could easily do it with no problem.

316 Racer X  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 6:58:24pm

re: #286 Afrocity

Obama is working for one world government. I can feel it.

I'm watching you.

317 UberInfidel67  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 6:58:26pm

We thought you'd like to know that your Lulu order has shipped. (You can check out all the details below.)

Remember, you can always track the status of an order at our website: [Link: www.lulu.com...]

From my Inbox Woo hoo!

318 Achilles Tang  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 6:58:34pm

re: #300 mfarmer1

Hey, some of us are on the west coast! How about a spoiler alert?

My wife is watching it in the other room. I got tired of all the conspiracy crap. Layer upon layer upon layer. I'm going back to reading about how we never landed on the moon.

319 Afrocity  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 6:58:41pm

re: #297 Adrenalyn

I have been saying all along that he has a bigger agenda, hence the whole never ending campaign. That is dangerous and populist. Now he is going to Denver. Everything has to be a big production.

320 Boondock St. Bender  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 6:58:52pm

Damn!I missed 24 !sitting here commenting to yous knuckleheads.....grrrr.

321 spirochete  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 6:58:54pm

re: #313 Buster Bunny

Dont know .. I think my #264 is missing.

Yeah, you quoted a post that had been deleted.

322 jwb7605  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 6:59:03pm

re: #301 Buster Bunny

What got deleted? Did i quote something bad or something?

#250 and #254 got deleted.
I don't remember what the posts were about or who posted them.

323 TheMatrix31  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 6:59:05pm

I say Charles uses this GIF every time he sends someone to the showers...

GTFO

324 OldLineTexan  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 6:59:12pm

re: #308 nyc redneck

and if that ever happens he won't be at the top of the pyramid scheme.
imagine him squaring off w/ putin to share power. lol
o will lucky if they just chain him up in the dungeon and throw away the key.

Obama's boss Soros will pull the plug out of Putin's bathtub.

325 Charles Johnson  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 6:59:18pm

Martin Mawyer was the editor of Jerry Falwell's "Majority Report."

The stink is getting worse.

326 code red 21  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 6:59:34pm

re: #278 Buster Bunny

Pakistan produces some of the finest peridots in existence. Beautiful green rocks, that when polished range from a beautiful yellow, to a yellow green .. to a wonderful grassy green color.

Fact for the day.

Dammit now I know why BO will invade Pakistan...it's the peridot.

327 Adrenalyn  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 6:59:52pm

0bama is working to put an organization in power that is extremely powerful

they are the:
Brotherhood Of Organized Greedy International Evil-doers, Malcontents Egomaniacs and Nutters


Boogie Men for short


and we're all in great danger

328 _RememberTonyC  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 7:00:04pm

how will the MSM spin this into a victory for Obama? Probably by ignoring it

329 Cato the Elder  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 7:00:11pm

re: #257 kansas

I'm saying that not knowing what he might have done would be a deterrent. He did not exude weakness.

And I'm saying you're living in a fantasy world. What could he have done?

"Ooh, Bush is crazy, he might poison all the wells if we do this. Better not."

Right.

330 Randall Gross  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 7:00:23pm

re: #303 LudwigVanQuixote

Thanks, I wrote a post on it back when they did it, predicting this outcome but nobody really reads my blog because I post sporadically.

331 jwb7605  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 7:00:48pm

re: #326 code red 21

Dammit now I know why BO will invade Pakistan...it's the peridot.

NO WAR FOR PERIDOT!
I like that word better than oil ...

332 [deleted]  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 7:00:53pm
333 Afrocity  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 7:00:55pm

re: #302 Mich-again

I dont know about the currency, though I have friend who keeps pushing gold on me. I can't afford it anyway. If a Depression comes I am toast.

334 Randall Gross  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 7:01:14pm

re: #312 Charles

There is that teddy bear report from CNN, I'm following it but ... 48 hr rule.

335 albusteve  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 7:01:19pm

re: #315 Killgore Trout

Heh, you're awfully pessimistic. We could easily do it with no problem.

I'm very pessimistic yes...look at a map...that area is very difficult to even get to...the Taliban will vanish...there will be no targets...we will have to hunt them down, a game they are indeed very good at...it would take years...then what?...stay there forever?...why?...what's the point?

336 lawhawk  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 7:01:24pm

Meanwhile, the Taliban are threatening Pakistanis left and right, which fits into Thanos' view on this possibly being part of a larger strategy to push sentiment against the Taliban and al Qaeda because of their overwhelming brutality and nihilistic tendencies to kill and cause mayhem wherever they go.

It certainly is hell on Pakistanis - and also follows that the overwhelming majority of those killed by the Islamic terrorists are also Muslims.

337 Buster Bunny  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 7:01:35pm

Aha .. I know what I said.

My bad .. Charles .. keep it blocked.

338 Nevergiveup  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 7:01:58pm

re: #326 code red 21

Dammit now I know why BO will invade Pakistan...it's the peridot.

Obama and the Dems don't give a rat's ass about Afghanistan. They were just all over Bush's ass about Iraq being the "wrong" war, so they had to have "A" war to push so not to look like a weak sister. It was just a ploy, a ruse, to fool the gullible American middle ground.

339 spirochete  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 7:01:59pm

Charles,
music question. When you were doing your guitar work in the 70's, was there much talk/emphasis on the modes of the major or did that come later?

340 kansas  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 7:02:14pm

re: #329 Cato the Elder

And I'm saying you're living in a fantasy world. What could he have done?

"Ooh, Bush is crazy, he might poison all the wells if we do this. Better not."

Right.

So the timing is a coincidence?

341 rwmofo  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 7:02:28pm

I haven't had the TV on, but admit that my tolerance for Hannity has lowered lately. I like to be informed and entertained, but at times I need smaller doses. Maybe I got a kick out of watching him smack Colmes around.

342 Charles Johnson  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 7:02:37pm

re: #339 spirochete

Charles,
music question. When you were doing your guitar work in the 70's, was there much talk/emphasis on the modes of the major or did that come later?

What do you mean by "modes of the major?"

343 Randall Gross  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 7:03:18pm

re: #336 lawhawk

Yep, they just uncovered another mass grave in Iraq yesterday leftover by AQ. Eventually AQ shits any bed they sleep in.

344 rwmofo  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 7:03:22pm

re: #323 TheMatrix31

I say Charles uses this GIF every time he sends someone to the showers...

GTFO

Heh. That totally guy carries that show.

345 NJDhockeyfan  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 7:03:31pm

re: #334 Thanos

There is that teddy bear report from CNN, I'm following it but ... 48 hr rule.

Teddy bear report?

346 albusteve  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 7:03:36pm

re: #336 lawhawk

Meanwhile, the Taliban are threatening Pakistanis left and right, which fits into Thanos' view on this possibly being part of a larger strategy to push sentiment against the Taliban and al Qaeda because of their overwhelming brutality and nihilistic tendencies to kill and cause mayhem wherever they go.

It certainly is hell on Pakistanis - and also follows that the overwhelming majority of those killed by the Islamic terrorists are also Muslims.

of course...the alternative is some of full blow civil war which is probably already booked...if so what of the nukes?

347 HelloDare  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 7:03:51pm

re: #341 rwmofo

I haven't had the TV on, but admit that my tolerance for Hannity has lowered lately.

You are not a great American.

348 Mich-again  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 7:04:21pm

re: #333 Afrocity

We have been blessed to have the opportunity to live through some very interesting times. You'll be alright.

349 [deleted]  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 7:04:32pm
350 Elcid  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 7:04:33pm

re: #111 Dark_Falcon

He's double dribbling his pants right now, I'd suspect.

You are no doubt, spot on.

351 Randall Gross  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 7:04:55pm

Also please note that I'm in full agreement with Charles on the salient point he was making:

All the petite tyrants of the world see the O as "Opportunity".

352 Buster Bunny  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 7:04:58pm

re: #348 Mich-again

We have been blessed to have the opportunity to live through some very interesting times. You'll be alright.

You DO know thats also an old Chinese curse.

353 rwmofo  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 7:05:01pm

re: #344 rwmofo

Heh. That totally guy carries that show.

Or that guy totally carries the show?

Dyslexic sometimes, I am.

354 TheMatrix31  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 7:05:04pm

re: #344 rwmofo

Heh. That totally guy carries that show.

One of the worst shows ever. But one of the funniest characters ever.

355 Charles Johnson  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 7:05:07pm

Yes, it's the Southern Poverty Law Center again, but nobody else seems to be watching these groups:

[Link: www.splcenter.org...]

Martin Mawyer, who just appeared on Sean Hannity's show, is a serious kook.

356 Afrocity  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 7:05:14pm

re: #338 Nevergiveup

Obama and the Dems don't give a rat's ass about Afghanistan. They were just all over Bush's ass about Iraq being the "wrong" war, so they had to have "A" war to push so not to look like a weak sister. It was just a ploy, a ruse, to fool the gullible American middle ground.

You see that much is not being said about getting the troops out of Iraq. It was another one of Obama's phony issues.

357 Nevergiveup  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 7:05:16pm

re: #349 buzzsawmonkey

Not only is that unnecessarily coarse, it ignores the fact that Hillary Clinton, for all her faults, is one of the saner members of the current administration, and one who might conceivably be aware that we are facing some very nasty people.

I have more faith in her than I have in her boss.

And she is involved in Pakistan and Afghanistan how?

358 Dark_Falcon  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 7:05:40pm

re: #300 mfarmer1

Hey, some of us are on the west coast! How about a spoiler alert?

Sorry, I forgot.

359 spirochete  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 7:06:00pm

re: #342 Charles

I meant "modes of the major scale"

360 rwmofo  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 7:06:03pm

re: #347 HelloDare

You are not a great American.

I'll settle for above average.

361 OldLineTexan  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 7:06:06pm

re: #345 NJDhockeyfan

Teddy bear report?

Yes, mink teddy bears with peridot eyes.

Full of hopium.

362 code red 21  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 7:06:07pm

re: #338 Nevergiveup

Obama and the Dems don't give a rat's ass about Afghanistan. They were just all over Bush's ass about Iraq being the "wrong" war, so they had to have "A" war to push so not to look like a weak sister. It was just a ploy, a ruse, to fool the gullible American middle ground.

BO needs his own war to get his "props"

363 Boondock St. Bender  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 7:06:21pm

re: #342 Charles

mode scales?mixalydian mode and such

364 Randall Gross  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 7:06:31pm

re: #355 Charles

Yes, it's the Southern Poverty Law Center again, but nobody else seems to be watching these groups:

[Link: www.splcenter.org...]

Martin Mawyer, who just appeared on Sean Hannity's show, is a serious kook.

It's because the only other source is the group's sites, and people go "IcK" and run away when they see them.

365 Achilles Tang  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 7:06:32pm

re: #360 rwmofo

I'll settle for above average.

You must be in Minnesota then.

366 Afrocity  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 7:06:42pm

Bristol Palin is on Fox. I hope this turns out okay. Sarah needs no more bad press.

367 OldLineTexan  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 7:06:47pm

re: #349 buzzsawmonkey

Not only is that unnecessarily coarse, it ignores the fact that Hillary Clinton, for all her faults, is one of the saner members of the current administration, and one who might conceivably be aware that we are facing some very nasty people.

I have more faith in her than I have in her boss.

Damned straight. Having had Hillary as an enemy, I have respect for her. She is her own man.

368 tradewind  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 7:06:51pm

Asked for comment, BHO said ' We still Hope they'll Change'

His Vice President Biden said ' well, there's about a forty percent chance the Taliban will get their hands on the nukes'.

369 [deleted]  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 7:06:52pm
370 Sheepdogess  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 7:07:05pm
This didn’t happen during the Bush administration.


But they will be blamed for it.

371 Buster Bunny  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 7:07:15pm

re: #361 OldLineTexan

Yes, mink teddy bears with peridot eyes.

Full of hopium.

Hopium carries Obama's picture on the side?

They are already selling that stuff.

372 A Man for all Seasons  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 7:07:16pm

re: #339 spirochete

Charles,
music question. When you were doing your guitar work in the 70's, was there much talk/emphasis on the modes of the major or did that come later?

Plus..what effect of Fusion style jazz play an influence with your playing?
I heard one jazz band that blew my mind once..Heard em at the great American Music Hall in SF. Their name was Oregon..
Plus I think Billy Cobham is the greatest drummer of all time..Heard him at the Greek in Berkeley..

373 Spare O'Lake  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 7:07:33pm

re: #272 Killgore Trout

Afghanistan.

That would be nice. Because Pakistan has never been a reliable ally of the West. It is an Islamic State with an Islamic bomb ruled by a bunch of Islamofascists.

The assassination of Benazir Bhutto marked the beginning of the surrender to Islamism, and with the ouster of the backstabbing fascist puppet Musharraff the write-off is now all but complete. Just the other day they released their Chief Islamic Atomic Bomber from house arrest, and now they are ceding large swaths of land to the Taliban.

The popular resurgence of the Taliban in the Pashtun regions of Pakistan mirrors Afghan leader Karzai's recently stated willingness to accommodate the Sharia-loving Taliban in Afghanistan, while showing no willingness to eradicate the family heroin farms. Unfortunately it appears that under the weak American leadership of President Obama, Afghanistan will also be lost to the Ummah, and I doubt Obama will have the balls to undertake a meaningful military operation in Afghanistan or Pakistan (or anywhere else).

India is a much more important economic partner and a more natural ally against Islamofascism, and it remains to be seen whether the US will get its head out of the sand before it is too late, and work with India to neutralize the Paki-Afghani threat.

374 Mich-again  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 7:07:36pm

re: #351 Thanos

All the petite tyrants of the world see the O as "Opportunity".

That reminds me of Amir Taheri's story about Ali Golabi.

On that score, Ahmadinejad should get high marks. But he may owe all that to the Tehrani folk tale we mentioned above. That tale is woven around its hero Ali Golabi (Pear-shaped Ali) who is a small chap with big ambitions.

The bigger chaps in the neighborhood dismiss him as a midget, bully him whenever they can, and never offer him a seat at the table in the teahouse which is their haunt. So what does Ali Golabi do? He goes around waving a big knife, making a big noise, breaking a window here and there, and, occasionally, even strangling a street cat to show his strength. His agitations annoy the big chaps who want to sip their tea, puff their hookahs and play a game of backgammon in peace.

Nevertheless, Ali knows where and when to stop. As soon as the big chaps come out of the teahouse to confront him, he declares that he has already done whatever he had wanted to do and is now ready not to do it again. This helps ease the tension and gets Ali off the hook- until the next showdown.

So, if our analysis is right the next step for the Islamic Republic would be to announce that, having done what it wanted to do, it has now decided to stop doing it for a while as a gesture of goodwill.

375 Sunlight  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 7:07:54pm

re: #279 Iron Fist

Remember Dick Durbin (D-al Qaeda)? And who was it, anyway, who ratted out our wiretapping terrorists when they were on the phone to their al Qaeda Den-Mothers back in Pakistan? I figure if Scooter Libby deserved jail time for disclosing the not so undercover CIA "agent" and the spy who loved her, the dude did the rat on wiretapping deserves to be burned alive.

But I'd settle for life without parole in Ft. Levenworth.

It wasn't even Scooter (Armitage!) re Plame. They got him by asking him circular questions until his answers didn't match. These other "leaks" are national security issues.

376 Taqyia2Me  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 7:07:58pm

re: #355 Charles

Yes, it's the Southern Poverty Law Center again, but nobody else seems to be watching these groups:

[Link: www.splcenter.org...]

Martin Mawyer, who just appeared on Sean Hannity's show, is a serious kook.

The mfmsm is so gonna bludgeon conservatives with all this in 2010, then again in 2012.

377 BigMoo  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 7:08:06pm

Meh, all reports coming out of that area have to be considered 'suspect' pending multiple levels of verification. In the past few weeks, we've seen reports that Al Qaeda has been decimated by US drone attacks, reports of a resurgent Al Qaeda, Taliban advances, Taliban defeats and a new, timid American President, indecisive on what to do with Afghanistan and ignoring the 'war on terror'.

So far, I only believe the last report...

378 Nevergiveup  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 7:08:21pm

re: #362 code red 21

BO needs his own war to get his "props"

He doesn't have the moral convictions to "wage" a real war. Especially one of "todays' wars. You have to be willing to lay your whole administration on the line like President Bush did. Ultimately Obama will declare victory both in Iraq and Afghanistan and withdraw.

379 Desert Dog  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 7:08:27pm

re: #335 albusteve

I'm very pessimistic yes...look at a map...that area is very difficult to even get to...the Taliban will vanish...there will be no targets...we will have to hunt them down, a game they are indeed very good at...it would take years...then what?...stay there forever?...why?...what's the point?

The only way to get rid of those bastards is make it VERY UNCOMFORTABLE for the people that aide them and help them hide. On both sides of the border. These Taliban assholes do not exist in a vacuum. They have a safe haven in the border area because there is little consequence to the warlords and chieftains that help them out now. Let's make it clear that siding with them will be very painful in several ways. Strength and power is what they understand in that part of the world. Talking to them and asking them nicely to be a good sport and point out the bad guys does not work. Drones, proxies or actual boots on the ground is the only way. Show them what happens when you play with fire - you get burnt.

Not that I think Obama will do anything....

380 rwmofo  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 7:08:50pm

re: #365 Naso Tang

You must be in Minnesota then.

Trying to think of something witty without throwing rocks at Minnesota. Oh, some of my best friends are from Minnesota (true, actually).

381 HelloDare  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 7:09:11pm

People relax. We have Joe Biden. According to Bill Clinton, Joe is one of the best foreign policy minds out there. And I do mean out there.

382 notutopia  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 7:09:11pm

re: #366 Afrocity

Why is Bristol on Fox?

383 Charles Johnson  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 7:09:12pm

re: #359 spirochete

I meant "modes of the major scale"

I'm still not clear what you're asking. Which modes?

384 Curt  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 7:09:30pm

re: #336 lawhawk

Meanwhile, the Taliban are threatening Pakistanis left and right, which fits into Thanos' view on this possibly being part of a larger strategy to push sentiment against the Taliban and al Qaeda because of their overwhelming brutality and nihilistic tendencies to kill and cause mayhem wherever they go.

It certainly is hell on Pakistanis - and also follows that the overwhelming majority of those killed by the Islamic terrorists are also Muslims.

You know...when there was a chance for democracies in other places, it became a thing to demonize, that American blood and treasure was assisting in bringing better things to life.

Now, the practical application of that derided policy wil be ther death/misery to millions.

Will the "Current Administration" lose even a wink of sleep over this, or even manage to develop serious, bleeding ulcers?

/dreaming

385 Nevergiveup  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 7:09:46pm

re: #369 buzzsawmonkey

She is the Secretary of State, you know. I would hazard that she has at least some input as to what we do over there. It's not all up to the Secretary of Defense.

Obama appointed Richard Holbrook his "special " envoy to both Pakistan and Afghanistan. He is the one that has been over there. NOT Hilliary.

386 Mich-again  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 7:10:02pm

re: #279 Iron Fist

Remember Dick Durbin (D-al Qaeda)? And who was it, anyway, who ratted out our wiretapping terrorists when they were on the phone to their al Qaeda Den-Mothers back in Pakistan?

Yer killing me!

387 Randall Gross  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 7:10:12pm

Here's a list of their recent articles:

RECENT ARTICLES
Slavery Today and Setting the Captives Free
Faith and Firearms
Reforming Our Families - Reforming Our Nation
Practical Steps to Reclaiming Africa for Christ
Biblical Principles for using your Vote
The Evolution vs Creation Debate
Robben Island Rabbits to be Killed
Abortion is Murder
How Abortionists Lie to a Woman
Two Stage Abortions Overload Hospitals and Kill Mothers
Confronting Crisis with Christian Confidence
Changing Lives - Transforming Nations
Reforming Our Families - Reforming Our Nation

388 kansas  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 7:10:16pm

re: #376 Taqyia2Me

The mfmsm is so gonna bludgeon conservatives with all this in 2010, then again in 2012.

Maybe the Fairness Doctrine would actually help us? Just kidding. Sort of.

389 Buster Bunny  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 7:10:39pm

re: #381 HelloDare

People relax. We have Joe Biden. According to Bill Clinton, Joe is one of the best foreign policy minds out there. And I do mean out there.

Pluto doesnt count as previous diplomatic experience ... does it?

390 itellu3times  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 7:10:46pm

re: #283 mfarmer1

I really don't see the big deal here. It wasn't as if Pahk-eee-stahn was doing anything in all the north/south *.stans anyway. Now it has just made it official. Maybe this is a green light for around the clock Predator missions in the area. The Pakistan government can then say it has no influence there anymore and suggest that the new Taliban UN representative for the restive region address the proper authorities. Afghanistan can claim it no longer has to respect the sovereignty of the region as belonging to Pakistan anymore and can do what it wants there too.

Oh, I'm such a dreamer.

... but you're not the only one.
/imagine!

My thin hope is that the statement means nothing at all.

391 Afrocity  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 7:11:21pm

re: #382 notutopia

Why is Bristol on Fox?

Greta is in Alaska interviewing her as a teen mom. So far so good.

392 Curt  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 7:11:21pm

re: #389 Buster Bunny

Pluto doesnt count as previous diplomatic experience ... does it?

No...but "planet X" does...

393 rwmofo  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 7:11:25pm

re: #370 Sheepdogess

But they will be blamed for it.

Bush will be blamed for everything until the next prominent conservative steps up to the plate. See Reagan, Bush Sr, Gingrich, Starr, Cheney, Rove...

394 code red 21  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 7:11:25pm

re: #378 Nevergiveup

He doesn't have the moral convictions to "wage" a real war. Especially one of "todays' wars. You have to be willing to lay your whole administration on the line like President Bush did. Ultimately Obama will declare victory both in Iraq and Afghanistan and withdraw.

He doesn't need moral convictions because he doesn't give a rat's ass about that and that's what makes him dangerous to our troops, country and the world at large.

395 Mich-again  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 7:11:34pm

re: #383 Charles

I'm still not clear what you're asking. Which modes?

Lydian mode, Phrygian mode, all those scales I can't remember?

396 Cato the Elder  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 7:12:01pm

re: #340 kansas

So the timing is a coincidence?

Hmm. Let me see.

From the same article Charles linked to:

Monday's peace agreement applies to the Malakand region, which includes the former tourist destination of the Swat Valley, where extremists have gained sway by beheading people, burning girls schools and attacking security forces since a similar agreement broke down in August.

U.S. officials complained the earlier accord allowed militants to regroup and rearm and urged Pakistan's government to concentrate on military solutions to the insurgency in the rugged frontier region, where al-Qaida leader Osama bin Laden is believed to be hiding.

August...August. Who was President then? I seem to remember his name.

So after the earlier accord, which we didn't like either, broke down, these guys were beheading people, burning school girls and attacking security forces for...hmm...August, September, October, November, December, January...five to six months. What did Bush do about it? Fume?

Oh, yeah, he urged Pakistan to focus on military solutions.

There's a deterrent for you.

397 Randall Gross  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 7:12:07pm

re: #373 Spare O'Lake

It all started with Zia al Haq and the Saudis. Before Zia, Pakistan International Air stewardess' wore mini-skirts.

398 itellu3times  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 7:12:10pm

re: #349 buzzsawmonkey

Not only is that unnecessarily coarse, it ignores the fact that Hillary Clinton, for all her faults, is one of the saner members of the current administration, and one who might conceivably be aware that we are facing some very nasty people.

I have more faith in her than I have in her boss.

Would you care to quantify that, on a scale of z = (0,0) to (10,10)?

399 [deleted]  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 7:12:33pm
400 Maximu§  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 7:12:36pm

Perhaps now President Obama can unleash the forces needed to finish this war off.

His reaching out to Islam also gives him some ammunition to use to justify strong military actions in the near future...he can easily say "I tried to make peace and now I bring War" He approached it the wrong way, but I think this is part of his strategy to reach out with one hand and while getting the other ready to fight.

I hope I'm right, because my son's Brigade ships out to Afghanistan later this year.

401 NJDhockeyfan  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 7:12:55pm

re: #355 Charles

Here is a story about a screening of his movie...

Washington D.C.: 150 Attend Anti-Jihad Movie Event

On Wednesday night, February 11th, over 150 Washington D.C. area residents attended the premiere screening of the film Homegrown Jihad: The Terrorist Camps Around U.S. at a Washington D.C. theater. The film screening was sponsored by the Christian Action Network that co-produced the film along with PRB films, directed by Christian Action Network president Martin Mawyer. The film documents the activities of the Jamaat ul-Fuqra organization and its front organization "Muslims of America," led by Pakistani Islamic cleric Sheikh Mubarak Ali Gilani, and their 35 camps around the United States. The documentary references a 2006 Regional Organized Crime Information Center report that states that Ali Gilani is "known as an international terrorist" and that Jamaat ul-Fuqra has "more than 3,000 members spread across the United States, all in support of one goal: the purification of Islam through violence."

The film shows segments from an internal terrorist training video by Sheikh Mubarak Ali Gilani, entitled "Soldiers of Allah." As the Christian Action Network documentary explains, the "Soldiers of Allah" "Islamic military warfare" training video "teaches American students how to operate AK-47 rifles, rocket launchers, and machine guns; how to kidnap Americans and then kill them; how to conduct sabotage and subversive operations; and how to use mortars and explosives." As shown in the documentary, Ali Gilani tells his members "We are fighting to destroy the enemy. We are dealing with evil at its roots and its roots are America."

...

The Washington D.C. audience was invited to attend the premiere screening by the Christian Action Network through e-mails, promotion of the event by anti-jihad web sites and organizations, and local radio promotion by Washington D.C. area's WAVA-FM radio host Don Kroah. Local activist groups also promoted the anti-jihad event, with attendance by DC area activist leaders Catherine Martin (ACT!For America – Northern Virginia & DC Metro Chapter), John Cosgrove (United American Committee, Virginia Chapter), and Jeffrey Imm (Anti-Jihad League of America), among others. A number in the audience expressed interest in further follow-on activities to bring the war of ideas to the America public.

402 notutopia  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 7:13:04pm

re: #391 Afrocity

Thank goodness it's Greta. I don't think she'll be purposefully setting her up for criticism.

403 Afrocity  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 7:13:09pm

Geeze she just asked her about what BC method she used. (or didn't use)

404 spirochete  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 7:13:14pm

re: #383 Charles

I'm still not clear what you're asking. Which modes?

The seven modes of the major scale, dorina, lydian, mixolydian, etc. I don't remember exactly when I first started reading about them, but I think it was in the mid-late 90's. Listening to one of your recordings I heard what sounded like you were playing with some of those ideas. i was just wondering if they were common knowledge for the pros back then or what the thought process was.

405 MandyManners  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 7:13:25pm

re: #355 Charles

Yes, it's the Southern Poverty Law Center again, but nobody else seems to be watching these groups:

[Link: www.splcenter.org...]

Martin Mawyer, who just appeared on Sean Hannity's show, is a serious kook.

The last two articles mention Rushdoony and CCC. Interesting circles.

406 SFGoth  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 7:13:47pm

Oooh, if we're talking modes, I like natural & harmonic minors and phrygian mode.

407 Sunlight  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 7:14:14pm

re: #355 Charles

Yes, it's the Southern Poverty Law Center again, but nobody else seems to be watching these groups:

[Link: www.splcenter.org...]

Martin Mawyer, who just appeared on Sean Hannity's show, is a serious kook.

Charles, have you heard of the Heartland Institute?
www.heartland.org

408 Charles Johnson  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 7:14:22pm

What is Sean Hannity doing promoting these people and their alarmist crap?

Good grief. This is who Sean Hannity just had on his show to rave about secret Muslim terror cells in the US.

Martin Mawyer, longtime editor of Jerry Falwell's Moral Majority Report, founded the Christian Action Network (CAN) in 1990, a year after Falwell folded the original Moral Majority.

In his "dirty and dangerous" battle against "militant homosexual groups," Mawyer has not held back. In 1997, after Ellen Degeneres came out as a lesbian on her TV sitcom, Mawyer accused her of "DUMPING HER FILTHY LESBIAN LIFESTYLE RIGHT IN THE CENTER OF YOUR LIVING ROOM! ... If we allow the tidal wave of gay and lesbian smut to continue to pour into our homes, it will utterly consume us in no time at all!"

In 1999, he asked the Federal Communications Commission to put an "HC [homosexual conduct] warning label" on TV programs with gay characters. The following year, CAN caused a national stir when TV stations refused to air its inflammatory ad attacking Hillary Clinton, who was then running for U.S. Senate.

Over ominous drumbeats, the narrator intoned: "It is rumored that Hillary Clinton is a lesbian. It is rumored that Hillary Clinton supported homosexual marriage. It is rumored that Hillary Clinton will leave her husband upon taking office. ... Sometimes, rumors are true. Shouldn't you know the truth? For more information on traditional family values, please contact the Christian Action Network."

More recently, CAN protested "Gay Days" at Disney World and other theme parks — events that Mawyer's wife and CAN partner, Bonnie, says demonstrate "the true intent of these homosexuals: they are after our children!"

A 2000 Mawyer mailing incorporated militia-like paranoia: "I am not ready to give this great nation over to one-world government extremists ... radical, disease-carrying homosexuals ... anti-family lesbian feminists ... or anti-American U.N. globalists!"

CAN activists today are familiar faces at Gay Days, videotaping "bad behavior." In 2003, CAN turned its footage of "homosexual kissing, hugging and fondling" into a video tour of the Southeast, warning parents about the perils of Gay Days and warning that "homosexuals live in a pattern of sin and debauchery."

409 Nevergiveup  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 7:14:43pm

05:04 Obama offers support for Turkey-Iraq relationship (Reuters)

Well i guess that screws the Kurds big time?

410 Killgore Trout  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 7:14:47pm

re: #373 Spare O'Lake

I think most of our supplies are coming in from Kyrgyzstan anyways. Despite the Gloomy Gus' we could take care of this if we need to.

411 Sheepdogess  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 7:14:57pm

re: #366 Afrocity

re: #375 Sunlight

Scooter Libby got screwed.

412 HelloDare  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 7:15:03pm

Pakistan releases 'father' of nuclear bomb from house arrest
Friday 6 February 2009

Khan was detained in early 2004 after making a televised confession to nuclear proliferation, following intense international pressure on Pakistan. His nuclear trading network had been discovered by western intelligence agents.

...Khan's lawyer said the high court had declared him a free citizen. "The court has said as he was not involved in nuclear proliferation or criminal activity, there is no case against him, therefore he is a free citizen," Ali Zafar said.

413 notutopia  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 7:15:16pm

re: #403 Afrocity

I don't watch TV. Questions like that. This is why.
I hope she told her that it's private and none of her business!

414 Barry the Baptist  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 7:15:19pm

Surrender? One wonders if they were ever really in the fight on our side in the first place.

415 Nevergiveup  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 7:15:27pm

re: #410 Killgore Trout

I think most of our supplies are coming in from Kyrgyzstan anyways. Despite the Gloomy Gus' we could take care of this if we need to.

But I think the Russians are trying to stop that

416 SFGoth  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 7:15:52pm

re: #408 Charles

What is Sean Hannity doing promoting these people and their alarmist crap?

Good grief. This is who Sean Hannity just had on his show to rave about secret Muslim terror cells in the US.

Wow! Oh my god. It's like Invasion of the Body Snatchers.

417 [deleted]  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 7:16:03pm
418 Charles Johnson  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 7:16:05pm

re: #404 spirochete

The seven modes of the major scale, dorina, lydian, mixolydian, etc. I don't remember exactly when I first started reading about them, but I think it was in the mid-late 90's. Listening to one of your recordings I heard what sounded like you were playing with some of those ideas. i was just wondering if they were common knowledge for the pros back then or what the thought process was.

Oh yeah, absolutely. I was heavy into modes and scales. mixolydian was very useful, because it combined diminished and augmented, and worked with some altered chords where other scales had sour notes.

419 spirochete  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 7:16:13pm

re: #399 Iron Fist

I love the strategy of quietly releasing new technologies. They don't even have to be accurate. Like announcing new bunker busting technologies. As long as they think they won't be safe, that's what matters.

420 Killgore Trout  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 7:16:48pm

re: #408 Charles

His extensive knowledge of buttsex must make him an expert on Islamic terrorism.
/

421 Taqyia2Me  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 7:16:49pm

re: #388 kansas

Maybe the Fairness Doctrine would actually help us? Just kidding. Sort of.

But then, they have Keith O at MSLSD telling us all the news that's part of his latest fit.....

422 MandyManners  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 7:16:55pm

re: #401 NJDhockeyfan

Here is a story about a screening of his movie...

Washington D.C.: 150 Attend Anti-Jihad Movie Event

There are camps in America. I know of two off the top of my head. One's in NY and another is in Dover, TN.

423 A Man for all Seasons  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 7:17:02pm

re: #404 spirochete

The seven modes of the major scale, dorina, lydian, mixolydian, etc. I don't remember exactly when I first started reading about them, but I think it was in the mid-late 90's. Listening to one of your recordings I heard what sounded like you were playing with some of those ideas. i was just wondering if they were common knowledge for the pros back then or what the thought process was.

The beauty of jazz is that it isn't made up of scales..It is made of soul and emotion.. The precise skill of a jazz master only uses a scale to take us somewhere we have never been before..

424 Colonel Panik  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 7:17:14pm

re: #371 Buster Bunny

Hopium carries Obama's picture on the side?

They are already selling that stuff.

Hopium sounds radioactive. What's the half-life on that stuff?

425 Randall Gross  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 7:17:28pm

re: #401 NJDhockeyfan

That's probably the Baron's Jamaat al Fuqra stuff

426 Killgore Trout  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 7:17:31pm

re: #415 Nevergiveup

I'm sure they are but we can kick their asses too.

427 Nevergiveup  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 7:17:37pm

re: #417 buzzsawmonkey

Even a "special envoy" must make reports; those reports are analyzed by others, including the Secretary of State. Sending a "special envoy" merely means that the top person is not sent gallivanting around the globe; it doesn't mean she doesn't have input into the analysis and deliberations.

Obama has basically cut her out of the Middle East, with his appointment of Mitchell to the Israeli-Palestinian area. And they report to HIM, not to Hilliary.

428 Afrocity  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 7:17:42pm

Oh God. I love Sarah Palin she is so genuine.

429 rwmofo  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 7:17:51pm

NY Senator Willfully Stops Defending Herself

PC gone just a little too far. Why am I not surprised?

430 NJDhockeyfan  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 7:18:06pm

re: #422 MandyManners

There are camps in America. I know of two off the top of my head. One's in NY and another is in Dover, TN.

There are also camps in Virginia. It very scary shit.

431 Achilles Tang  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 7:18:09pm

re: #380 rwmofo

Trying to think of something witty without throwing rocks at Minnesota. Oh, some of my best friends are from Minnesota (true, actually).

I guess you don't listen to Garrison Keillor. It's an in joke...where all the children are above average....

432 Mich-again  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 7:18:15pm

re: #408 Charles

"It is rumored that Hillary Clinton is a lesbian. It is rumored that Hillary Clinton supported homosexual marriage. It is rumored that Hillary Clinton will leave her husband upon taking office. ... Sometimes, rumors are true. Shouldn't you know the truth? For more information on traditional family values, please contact the Christian Action Network."

Stay Classy!

433 FightingBack  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 7:18:24pm

Glorification of Teen Mothers. Yeah, it's going well. Her Mom's the Gov.

434 Walter L. Newton  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 7:18:33pm

re: #423 HoosierHoops

The beauty of jazz is that it isn't made up of scales..It is made of soul and emotion.. The precise skill of a jazz master only uses a scale to take us somewhere we have never been before..

"Sometimes you may think I'm making mistakes on the piano, but that's jazz."

435 Cato the Elder  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 7:18:45pm

re: #406 SFGoth

Oooh, if we're talking modes, I like natural & harmonic minors and phrygian mode.

I always liked hypomixolydian myself. But then I'm geeky that way.

436 kansas  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 7:18:47pm

re: #396 Cato the Elder

August...August. Who was President then? I seem to remember his name.

So after the earlier accord, which we didn't like either, broke down, these guys were beheading people, burning school girls and attacking security forces for...hmm...August, September, October, November, December, January...five to six months. What did Bush do about it? Fume?

Oh, yeah, he urged Pakistan to focus on military solutions.

There's a deterrent for you.


Excuse me, but here is the topic for this thread:

This is really, really bad news, as Pakistan capitulates to Taliban terrorists.

PESHAWAR, Pakistan – Pakistan agreed Monday to suspend military offensives and impose Islamic law in part of the restive northwest, making a gesture it hopes will help calm the Taliban insurgency while rejecting Washington’s call for tougher measures against militants.

A U.S. defense official called the deal “a negative development,” and some Pakistani experts expressed skepticism the truce would decrease violence. One human rights activist said the accord was “a great surrender” to militants.

This didn’t happen during the Bush administration.

And I didn't write this and it got 25 up dings. I'm pretty sure Charles wrote it, and I will defer to him for knowledge of the issue.

437 BigMoo  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 7:18:57pm

re: #408 Charles

Sadly, it sounds like he's 'cultivating an audience profile'. If he's trying to become the 'Keith Olberman' of the right, he should look at Olby's viewership numbers before following him down the sewer.

438 Buster Bunny  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 7:19:20pm

re: #424 Colonel Panik

Hopium sounds radioactive. What's the half-life on that stuff?

Its a rendered product of Poppy distillates. White and powdery.

Expensive and Illegal and .. a worthwhile medical product.

439 Achilles Tang  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 7:19:22pm

re: #424 Colonel Panik

Hopium sounds radioactive. What's the half-life on that stuff?

4 years

440 Afrocity  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 7:19:25pm

re: #413 notutopia

She said she did not want to discuss the details.

Sarah is on now and she is so real. She is not sugar coating the situation, she is approaching it realistically and I like that Bristol said it was HER CHOICE to keep the baby.

441 Killgore Trout  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 7:19:27pm

re: #418 Charles

My only real gimmick that I can impress people with is octatonic noodling (diminished scale). To a novice listening I do a decent Robert Fripp impression.

442 JHW  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 7:19:28pm

re: #410 Killgore Trout

That might be right, but I can't see any way in the world such a large force as NATO there can be solely supplied by air if that's what you mean (and I'm not suggesting it is). Even earlier a lot of the supply transit other than Pakistan was dependent on Russian agreement, via ground and air both.

443 Afrocity  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 7:19:56pm

re: #432 Mich-again

LOL

444 Walter L. Newton  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 7:19:57pm

re: #423 HoosierHoops

The beauty of jazz is that it isn't made up of scales..It is made of soul and emotion.. The precise skill of a jazz master only uses a scale to take us somewhere we have never been before..

Jazz... the final frontier...

445 Buster Bunny  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 7:20:02pm

re: #408 Charles

Charles .. thats enough info there to start a whole new thread on.

446 Charles Johnson  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 7:20:15pm

Looks like the homophobia thing didn't work out for Mawyer, so he's now pitching Islamophobia.

The "anti-jihad" movement has completed its meltdown into a stinky puddle of extremism.

447 Spare O'Lake  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 7:20:21pm

re: #400 Maximu§

Perhaps now President Obama can unleash the forces needed to finish this war off.

His reaching out to Islam also gives him some ammunition to use to justify strong military actions in the near future...he can easily say "I tried to make peace and now I bring War" He approached it the wrong way, but I think this is part of his strategy to reach out with one hand and while getting the other ready to fight.

I hope I'm right, because my son's Brigade ships out to Afghanistan later this year.

If you are right (and I hope you are), that will be one helluva sucker punch./

448 Randall Gross  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 7:20:26pm

re: #420 Killgore Trout

His extensive knowledge of buttsex must make him an expert on Islamic terrorism.
/

Righto, and on evolution too, here's the lede from their current article on Evolution and Creation:

The importance of this subject can hardly be overestimated. Since evolution has been introduced in our schools, the confrontation with our Christian beliefs has multiplied dramatically, because now no child in anyGrade (I was informed at the Reformation Conference by a school principal) can escape this satanic and atheistic religion of materialism

It runs downhill from there

449 rwmofo  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 7:20:43pm

re: #431 Naso Tang

I guess you don't listen to Garrison Keillor. It's an in joke...where all the children are above average....

Yeah. The landing gear didn't even drop when that one flew by.

450 OldLineTexan  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 7:20:43pm

re: #424 Colonel Panik

Hopium sounds radioactive. What's the half-life on that stuff?

Four LOOOOONG HARD years.

451 Barry the Baptist  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 7:20:48pm

re: #415 Nevergiveup


I believe they did last week. Seems that I remember reading how the govt in Kyrgyzstan accepted a Russian military offer over our own. In essence, if I am remembering right, the Russians will just move onto the militaty base that we had occupied.

Uzbekistan anyone?

452 Afrocity  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 7:21:16pm

re: #437 BigMoo

Sadly, it sounds like he's 'cultivating an audience profile'. If he's trying to become the 'Keith Olberman' of the right, he should look at Olby's viewership numbers before following him down the sewer.

You talking about Hannity? I think Glenn Beck is acting more like Olberman than Hannity is.

453 Nevergiveup  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 7:21:31pm

re: #447 Spare O'Lake

If you are right (and I hope you are), that will be one helluva sucker punch./

There is nothing in Obama's history ( I know that's a hot one ) or the Democrats history to suggest they would do that.

454 spirochete  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 7:21:41pm

re: #418 Charles

Cool.

455 Dark_Falcon  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 7:21:45pm

re: #424 Colonel Panik

Hopium sounds radioactive. What's the half-life on that stuff?

4 years, unfortunately.

456 rwmofo  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 7:21:48pm

re: #446 Charles

Looks like the homophobia thing didn't work out for Mawyer, so he's now pitching Islamophobia.

The "anti-jihad" movement has completed its meltdown into a stinky puddle of extremism.

My dog and I both have vacuum-cleaner-phobia.

457 Nevergiveup  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 7:21:53pm

re: #451 Barry the Baptist

I believe they did last week. Seems that I remember reading how the govt in Kyrgyzstan accepted a Russian military offer over our own. In essence, if I am remembering right, the Russians will just move onto the militaty base that we had occupied.

Uzbekistan anyone?

Yup

458 arkroyal  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 7:21:54pm

Charles,
Are you picking up something happening in the Asian currency markets?
[Link: market-ticker.denninger.net...]

459 Boondock St. Bender  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 7:22:13pm

re: #408 Charles

As i have said before the conservative movement has got to cull the reactionaries/cultural warriors.Conservatives exist in all kinds of people,the last thing the movement needs is jack asses slamming the door in others faces because they don't like some aspect of their lives.

460 jaunte  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 7:22:25pm

I wonder if Mawyer will try to videotape the Jamaat Al Fuqra people.
They might be tougher to get on camera than gays at Disneyland.

461 notutopia  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 7:22:26pm

re: #440 Afrocity

Good for her! Someone up thread said this was not good because it was glorifying teen pregnancy and her mom is the governor.
Does this interview sound like it's a spin on glorifying teen pregnancy to you? Or to get Sarah to buy into glorifying it?

462 Buster Bunny  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 7:22:40pm

re: #451 Barry the Baptist


Uzbekistan anyone?

Frosty snow covered beaches ... Polluted mountains .. Hot babes in burkas .. Corrupt policemen and government officials ...

Does it have any five star hotels?

463 Afrocity  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 7:22:45pm

re: #433 FightingBack

Glorification of Teen Mothers. Yeah, it's going well. Her Mom's the Gov.

But Sarah at least came out and said that Bristol's situation is an anomaly and that she has a huge network that is not available to most teen moms.

464 OldLineTexan  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 7:23:27pm

re: #429 rwmofo

NY Senator Willfully Stops Defending Herself

PC gone just a little too far. Why am I not surprised?

AAAAAAAARRRRRRRRRRRGGGGGGGGGGGHHHHHHHHHHH!

465 BigMoo  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 7:23:33pm

re: #452 Afrocity

Very good point, forgot about him. He's entertaining-but also a 'wee bit dark' at times...

466 Killgore Trout  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 7:23:48pm

OT: For the foodies.....
Cold Smoked Salmon

Their solution for a cheap cold smoker is brilliant. Estimated cost about $10. I think I'm going to try it later this week.

467 Charles Johnson  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 7:23:51pm

re: #454 spirochete

Cool.

Mixolydian is the only scale that really works with an augmented 7th, raised 5th chord, for example, because a straight diminished scale contains a natural sixth that clashes.

468 [deleted]  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 7:23:56pm
469 [deleted]  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 7:23:56pm
470 FightingBack  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 7:24:02pm

re: #461 notutopia

Good for her! Someone up thread said this was not good because it was glorifying teen pregnancy and her mom is the governor.
Does this interview sound like it's a spin on glorifying teen pregnancy to you? Or to get Sarah to buy into glorifying it?

Yeah, it sounds like glory to me. And where's Papa?

471 Noam Sayin'  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 7:24:05pm

Boondock:

Modality in Rock music:


Rock "Functional Modality," then, refers to the use of a particular mode as a type of key--in other words, as a pitch collection source for melodic materials and harmonic underpinnings, or chords. Four modes and the scale referred to as the Rhythm and Blues scale function in this fashion in rock music and are developed as such in SECTION TWO. The system may be properly identified as functional modality because not only can any one of the common rock modes (i.e., Dorian, Aeolian, Mixolydian, Ionian, and the R&B scale) be used to generate chords, but it may be established, again through common practice, that certain chords occur at certain times in systematic fashion. Hence, functional modality has pre-tonic and pre-dominant (more properly, pre-pre-tonic) chords. What is more, the various modes often pool their collective chord resources creating bimodal and trimodal conditions in many pieces. Tonal progressions occur, as well, so the theoretical implications in rock music can be very broad (and, therefore, difficult to teach!), although actual conditions are generally not particularly complex in practice. This, then, is the ambitious scope of SECTION TWO, the full extent of which is seldom, if ever, fully understood by the practicing rock musician because specific styles and idioms are more narrow in their focus.

Did a google search, and the first thing I see is a guitar instruction book from my college guitar teacher.

472 Cato the Elder  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 7:24:28pm

re: #436 kansas

Excuse me, but here is the topic for this thread:

This is really, really bad news, as Pakistan capitulates to Taliban terrorists.

PESHAWAR, Pakistan – Pakistan agreed Monday to suspend military offensives and impose Islamic law in part of the restive northwest, making a gesture it hopes will help calm the Taliban insurgency while rejecting Washington’s call for tougher measures against militants.

A U.S. defense official called the deal “a negative development,” and some Pakistani experts expressed skepticism the truce would decrease violence. One human rights activist said the accord was “a great surrender” to militants.

This didn’t happen during the Bush administration.

And I didn't write this and it got 25 up dings. I'm pretty sure Charles wrote it, and I will defer to him for knowledge of the issue.

The two paragraphs in the middle are a quote, friend. From the article Charles linked to. So are the two I quoted - from the same article.

You can pick up your brain at the hat check on the way out.

473 Barry the Baptist  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 7:24:35pm

re: #462 Buster Bunny

I'm not sure the Uzbekistani hotel system goes past 1 or 2. But, I hear that you can rent one hell of a tent!

474 Noam Sayin'  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 7:24:53pm

re: #408 Charles

What is Sean Hannity doing promoting these people and their alarmist crap?

Good grief. This is who Sean Hannity just had on his show to rave about secret Muslim terror cells in the US.

He need to go back to lifting his material from your site.

And maybe this time give you credit.

475 OldLineTexan  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 7:25:11pm

re: #462 Buster Bunny

Frosty snow covered beaches ... Polluted mountains .. Hot babes in burkas .. Corrupt policemen and government officials ...

Does it have any five star hotels?

Onest Okshuls' One-star Ole. Your camel stays free. And all of our wild dogs have had rabies vaccinations.

476 Bob Dillon  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 7:25:16pm

re: #400 Maximu§

Perhaps now President Obama can unleash the forces needed to finish this war off.

His reaching out to Islam also gives him some ammunition to use to justify strong military actions in the near future...he can easily say "I tried to make peace and now I bring War" He approached it the wrong way, but I think this is part of his strategy to reach out with one hand and while getting the other ready to fight.

I hope I'm right, because my son's Brigade ships out to Afghanistan later this year.

Either way - this would be good to be aware of.

[Link: littlegreenfootballs.com...]

or

[Link: www.vbs.tv...]

477 A Man for all Seasons  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 7:25:29pm

re: #444 Walter L. Newton

Jazz... the final frontier...

LOL
Well Music has evolved..from the crude singlair modes of mozart hundreds of years ago..to the complex high tech music we hear today...It's a wonder really..
/

478 Afrocity  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 7:25:34pm

re: #461 notutopia

Good for her! Someone up thread said this was not good because it was glorifying teen pregnancy and her mom is the governor.
Does this interview sound like it's a spin on glorifying teen pregnancy to you? Or to get Sarah to buy into glorifying it?

I don't think that at all. Granted I can see how that can be perceived by someone. The Palin's are very hmmmm how can I say this in a PC way-- they are very domestic--yet career women at the same time. They take things in stride. Bristol told how she told Sarah she was pregnant. It was moving. These people are so transparent and I like that about Sarah.

479 Achilles Tang  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 7:25:42pm

re: #466 Killgore Trout

OT: For the foodies.....
Cold Smoked Salmon

Their solution for a cheap cold smoker is brilliant. Estimated cost about $10. I think I'm going to try it later this week.

Check out my recipe in the cookbook too. Almost the same.

480 Killgore Trout  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 7:26:01pm

re: #467 Charles

I gotta have a tritone.

481 Mich-again  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 7:26:37pm

re: #446 Charles

The "anti-jihad" movement has completed its meltdown into a stinky puddle of extremism.

Its kinda like my backyard when all the snow finally melts and there are 8 weeks worth of * to clean up from the 2 dogs.

482 Killgore Trout  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 7:26:39pm

re: #479 Naso Tang

Ah, thanks, I'll check it out.

483 Cato the Elder  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 7:27:03pm

re: #478 Afrocity

...These people are so transparent and I like that about Sarah.

She's transparent and opaque at the same time. Neat trick.

484 Afrocity  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 7:27:06pm

re: #468 Iron Fist

Someone needs to tell Obama to stop campaigning for King Of The World.

485 FightingBack  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 7:27:30pm

re: #478 Afrocity

There's a Grandmama and a great Grandmama. But does the Baby has a Daddy?

486 Buster Bunny  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 7:27:31pm

re: #458 arkroyal

Charles,
Are you picking up something happening in the Asian currency markets?
[Link: market-ticker.denninger.net...]

Ark .. whats an FX dislocation when its around?

Sounds really bad.

487 kansas  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 7:27:41pm

re: #472 Cato the Elder

The two paragraphs in the middle are a quote, friend. From the article Charles linked to. So are the two I quoted - from the same article.

You can pick up your brain at the hat check on the way out.

So when Charles said "It didn't happen under the Bush Administration", that was what? Go ahead insult me.

488 Nevergiveup  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 7:27:46pm

re: #484 Afrocity

Someone needs to tell Obama to stop campaigning for King Of The World.

Why if they take him, we can get rid of him?

489 spirochete  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 7:27:55pm

re: #467 Charles

Mixolydian is the only scale that really works with an augmented 7th, raised 5th chord, for example, because a straight diminished scale contains a natural sixth that clashes.

When I first was introduced to the concepts of the modes, i experimented extensively with all the different voicings you could get out of them. This was before I really had ever studied jazz, so I came up with many chords and sounds i had no names for, no background for their use and not enough music theory to even begin trying to name them. It's been a fun trip so far. Listening to you, I heard that same aura of experimentation, albeit much, much farther along than I ever got to. It felt really good hearing it.

490 [deleted]  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 7:28:28pm
491 Dark_Falcon  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 7:28:28pm

re: #429 rwmofo

NY Senator Willfully Stops Defending Herself

PC gone just a little too far. Why am I not surprised?

To be fair, she didn't disarm. She just moved her weapons to a new location in her home. It was some lefties who were saying she should disarm. If she's smart, she'll tell them to get lost. And if she gets a primary challenge from Carolyn McCarthy , she should just point out that McCarthy's idea for disarmament just mean sending lambs to the slaughter. Stay strong, Christine! By being strong we avoid violence, because the evil people know that if they attack us they will pay a steep price.

492 Marvo76  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 7:28:58pm

re: #186 jwb7605

I would be willing to bet at least one of our allies also either britain or france lobbing at least one as well...

493 Holidays are Family Fun Time  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 7:29:01pm

Hello Night Lizards! It's not worth mentioning tonite in Near Iowa.

So, surrendering is the new radical thing to do?

How are you-all and what are we talking about?

494 Afrocity  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 7:29:10pm

re: #485 FightingBack

? Levi is there too.

Personally I don't think Bristol should marry him and I am glad she is waiting.

495 BigMoo  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 7:29:20pm

re: #484 Afrocity

Someone needs to tell Obama to stop campaigning for King Of The World.

He continues to campaign because he's realized very quickly that campaigning is his strong suit-actually running a nation is like...well, real work.

496 [deleted]  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 7:29:25pm
497 Nevergiveup  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 7:29:45pm

Trump Entertainment may file bankruptcy: report

[Link: www.reuters.com...]

Such a filing would mark the third appearance in bankruptcy court for Trump Entertainment, which most recently emerged from bankruptcy proceedings in 2005, the newspaper said.

Why do I pay my bills? Remind me?

498 songbird  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 7:30:04pm

re: #439 Naso Tang

4 years

We can only hope!

499 kansas  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 7:30:11pm

re: #495 BigMoo

He continues to campaign because he's realized very quickly that campaigning is his strong suit-actually running a nation is like...well, real work.

What do you expect from the guy? I mean, he showed up, didn't he? Like, present.

500 Afrocity  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 7:30:18pm

re: #490 buzzsawmonkey

stimulus = iceberg

501 Dark_Falcon  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 7:30:43pm

re: #490 buzzsawmonkey

That worked out real well for Leonardo DiCaprio in Titanic, as I recall.

He ended up left kind of sunk as I remember it.

502 FightingBack  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 7:31:00pm

re: #494 Afrocity

? Levi is there too.

Personally I don't think Bristol should marry him and I am glad she is waiting.

Who supports this baby? Great Gramma got the money?

503 Buster Bunny  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 7:31:04pm

re: #497 Nevergiveup

Trump Entertainment may file bankruptcy: report

[Link: www.reuters.com...]

Such a filing would mark the third appearance in bankruptcy court for Trump Entertainment, which most recently emerged from bankruptcy proceedings in 2005, the newspaper said.

Why do I pay my bills? Remind me?

Dont worry .. he's fired.

504 Boondock St. Bender  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 7:31:09pm

re: #471 Noam Sayin'
That is cool.the article looks very good.(always looking for good music theory literiture)

505 SFGoth  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 7:31:14pm

re: #467 Charles

Mixolydian is the only scale that really works with an augmented 7th, raised 5th chord, for example, because a straight diminished scale contains a natural sixth that clashes.

A minor is the saddest chord.

506 MandyManners  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 7:31:15pm

re: #430 NJDhockeyfan

There are also camps in Virginia. It very scary shit.

Northern Georgia and Colorado, too, IIRC. I hope someone's watching them.

507 NJDhockeyfan  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 7:31:19pm

re: #422 MandyManners

There are camps in America. I know of two off the top of my head. One's in NY and another is in Dover, TN.


Here is the one on NY...

Islamberg

508 BigMoo  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 7:31:26pm

re: #499 kansas

LOL-exactly.

509 Noam Sayin'  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 7:31:26pm

re: #458 arkroyal

What's happening in the asian currency markets?

510 Dark_Falcon  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 7:31:26pm

re: #494 Afrocity

? Levi is there too.

Personally I don't think Bristol should marry him and I am glad she is waiting.

She is planning to marry him in June of this year.

511 kynna  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 7:32:17pm

re: #429 rwmofo

NY Senator Willfully Stops Defending Herself

PC gone just a little too far. Why am I not surprised?

I might be misunderstanding, but it looks to me like she just moved them from the location that had been publicized in the media. They just aren't under the bed anymore. They're still there.

Maybe I missed something. But it looks like she's still defending herself -- and in a smart way since the media decided every burglar and kook needed to know where they could find the guns hidden in her home.

512 FightingBack  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 7:32:28pm

re: #510 Dark_Falcon

She is planning to marry him in June of this year.

Is he employed? The baby can't wait for June to eat.

513 songbird  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 7:32:40pm

re: #480 Killgore Trout

I gotta have a tritone.

You'll have a devil of a time with that interval!

514 jwb7605  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 7:32:45pm

re: #492 Marvo76

I would be willing to bet at least one of our allies also either britain or france lobbing at least one as well...

I hope not.
Once the party starts (if it starts), most nations will be busy hunkering down and keeping their own (Muslim) population under control. Lobbing a nuke back at the "offending" party would invite internal civil war and disaster.

Russia excepted.

515 JHW  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 7:32:51pm

More on the Russian equation on this.

MOSCOW: Russia is open to the possibility of letting the United States and NATO ship weaponry across its territory to Afghanistan if the broader relationship between Moscow and the West improves, Foreign Minister Sergey Lavrov said Wednesday.

Lavrov spoke after a meeting at which U.S. and Russian diplomats discussed logistical details of possible U.S. shipments of nonlethal supplies to Afghanistan via Russia. Moscow has allowed nonlethal cargo from European nations to cross its territory and said last week that it would let the United States do the same.

The U.S. Embassy said Wednesday that Washington hoped to finalize details of the proposal, but that it had not yet been cemented.

Asked at a news conference whether Russia could also agree to transit of weapons, Lavrov said "additional steps are also possible."

"Last April and May we discussed the possibility of using Russian military cargo planes to deliver supplies to coalition forces with our NATO colleagues," he said. "Any other agreements are also possible."
He added that broader cooperation on Afghanistan would be contingent on the improvement of Moscow-NATO ties, which were frozen after Russia's war with Georgia last summer.

Russia-NATO Relations Feb. 10

516 Nevergiveup  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 7:32:58pm

re: #496 Maximu§

I know, I know, but I can only hope once President Obama see's what needs to be done to wipe out these cockroaches, his administration will step up, because they want this War over with...Its in their way, in the way of their social agenda and I have a feeling they may unleash several Trident II D-5's into Northwestern Pakistan if this region becomes another Taliban-R-Us.

My problem with them, is that they have no convictions. No moral compass. I know your son is being deployed, so I don't know what to say. I got a feeling I might even get called up before this is all over. We'll see.

517 tommygum  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 7:33:13pm

Greta just interviewed Sarah Palin. No teleprompter, no stuttering, no uh-uh-uh bullshit. Sarah just rattled it off: stimulus plan, energy independence, "fairness" doctrine. She GETS it. Sarah 2012.

518 Cato the Elder  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 7:33:18pm

re: #487 kansas

So when Charles said "It didn't happen under the Bush Administration", that was what? Go ahead insult me.

That was a statement and an implication. Both of which I disagree with. The first is a factual error - there was a similar agreement between the Pakistani government and the "militants" when Bush was president. The second conveys the impression that this wouldn't have happened if Bush were still president. Since that's an untestable hypothesis, I'll go with the fact that it already did happen under Bush, and allow myself to presume it could have happened again.

Bush deterred what, exactly?

519 notutopia  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 7:33:30pm

re: #478 Afrocity

Teen age pregnancy is a huge undertaking without support from others. Sarah, as a mother, has been unconditionally supportive.
Those that are critical of her, are trying to separate her role as mother, from the Governor, if it does not fit their
restrictive "professional mold". They still have a hard time accepting that she is capable of simultaneously orchestrating many responsibilities and roles, as herself, mother, wife, and governor, all quite successfully, at the same time.

520 ConservativeAtheist  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 7:33:32pm

re: #497 Nevergiveup

Trump Entertainment may file bankruptcy: report
Why do I pay my bills? Remind me?

Because, like most decent, hard-working people, you don't want to feel disgusted when you look at yourself in the mirror in the morning.

521 songbird  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 7:33:48pm

re: #505 SFGoth

A minor is the saddest chord.

A Minor could also be the youngest chord.

/ducks and runs

522 Marvo76  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 7:34:04pm

re: #196 Charles

I wonder if we actually have someone in his administration who can understand the mindset of the Islamic diplomacy. I don't think they realize just how deep they are in the soup and unless they can "posture" In a way understandable to the insurgents, all they are gonna do is get good kids killed and still loose, babbling all the while

523 Killgore Trout  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 7:34:07pm

re: #513 songbird

;)

524 Mich-again  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 7:34:17pm

re: #484 Afrocity

Someone needs to tell Obama to stop campaigning for King Of The World.

If there were really a king of the world election right now who would win?

Ha, GWB is my dark horse.

525 Afrocity  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 7:34:40pm

re: #495 BigMoo

He continues to campaign because he's realized very quickly that campaigning is his strong suit-actually running a nation is like...well, real work.

It is sad and embarrasing. How his handlers can let him do this is beyond me. If he pulls out those Greek columns in Denver I will get sick to my stomach. Sam Donaldson was saying that Obama is in danger of over exposure....DUH
In Chicago, I can't walk ten steps without seeing his face.

I was in a taxi today and the driver was playing a black radio station. The DJ comes on and says:

"HAPPY PRESIDENTS DAY BARACK OBAMA"

He goes on to say that this day is for Obama.

WTF? NO the way I see it, this day is to remember all presidents.
Obamabots are so stranded on kool aid island.

526 Colonel Panik  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 7:34:57pm

Stratfor on Jamaat Al-Fuqra


The U.S. government claims that al-Fuqra members were involved in 13 bombings and arsons during the 1980s and 1990s and were responsible for at least 17 homicides. Many of these attacks targeted Indian groups such as the Hare Krishnas, or heterodox Muslim groups such as the Ahmadiyya sect. In 1991, five al-Fuqra members were arrested at a border crossing in Niagara Falls, N.Y., after authorities found their plans to attack an Indian cinema and a Hindu temple in Toronto, Canada. Three of the five later were convicted on charges stemming from the plot.

According to sources, many al-Fuqra members have fought in Afghanistan, Kashmir, Lebanon, Bosnia and Chechnya. Several members also have been affiliated with the al-Kifah Refugee Center -- popularly known as the Brooklyn Jihad Office. Group member Clement Hampton-el, for example, provided weapons training to several people associated with the Brooklyn Jihad Office. One of those men, El Sayyid Nosair later would use that training to assassinate the Rabbi Meir Kahane in Manhattan. Hampton-el was convicted along with several other men, including Nosair's cousin, Ibrahim Elgabrowny and Sheikh Omar Abdel Rahman, also known as The Blind Sheikh, in the 1993 New York Bomb Plot Case, and sentenced to serve 35 years.

More recently, police investigators working on the D.C. sniper case tied convicted killer John Allen Muhammed to al-Fuqra. Rumors also surfaced that "Shoe Bomber" Richard Reid was connected to the group. Wall Street Journal reporter Daniel Pearl, in fact, was investigating the Reid/al-Fuqra connection and was in the process of attempting to interview Gilani when he was abducted and killed.

527 OldLineTexan  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 7:34:57pm

re: #497 Nevergiveup

Trump Entertainment may file bankruptcy: report

[Link: www.reuters.com...]

Such a filing would mark the third appearance in bankruptcy court for Trump Entertainment, which most recently emerged from bankruptcy proceedings in 2005, the newspaper said.

Why do I pay my bills? Remind me?

Mama raised you right?

You have an ounce of self-respect?

Habit?

528 Afrocity  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 7:35:15pm

re: #502 FightingBack

At least it is not tax payers.

529 BigMoo  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 7:35:30pm

re: #515 JHW

At which point, Putin has Obama by the 'short and curlys'. Just like the flow of gas to western Europe, he'd control he flow of logistical support to our troops.
Not an encouraging development, plus Poland and the Baltics are then "on the clock"...

530 Mich-again  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 7:35:30pm

re: #505 SFGoth

A minor is the saddest chord.

The B7 chord like in "Someday You'll Call My Name" is the very saddest of them all.

531 kansas  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 7:35:40pm

re: #518 Cato the Elder

That was a statement and an implication. Both of which I disagree with. The first is a factual error - there was a similar agreement between the Pakistani government and the "militants" when Bush was president. The second conveys the impression that this wouldn't have happened if Bush were still president. Since that's an untestable hypothesis, I'll go with the fact that it already did happen under Bush, and allow myself to presume it could have happened again.

Bush deterred what, exactly?

Here's the deal. I'm tired. I agreed with Charles. This didn't happen under Bush. Or it did. Whatever. Going to bed.

532 albusteve  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 7:35:53pm

re: #379 Desert Dog

The only way to get rid of those bastards is make it VERY UNCOMFORTABLE for the people that aide them and help them hide. On both sides of the border. These Taliban assholes do not exist in a vacuum. They have a safe haven in the border area because there is little consequence to the warlords and chieftains that help them out now. Let's make it clear that siding with them will be very painful in several ways. Strength and power is what they understand in that part of the world. Talking to them and asking them nicely to be a good sport and point out the bad guys does not work. Drones, proxies or actual boots on the ground is the only way. Show them what happens when you play with fire - you get burnt.

Not that I think Obama will do anything....

then we need to eradicate the poppies...people will starve...there will be no substitute because that ground will be contested...free fire zone...we will have to ruin their safe villages which will cause an enormous refugee problem...boots and 24/7 airstrikes...so we do all this and wipe out the Taliban and the very people we went to save will hate us forever...it can be done but for what?...what good does it do us?

533 Holidays are Family Fun Time  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 7:35:54pm

re: #525 Afrocity


Even way out in Aurora, we see his face everywhere. The trinket and collectibles manufacturers are making a mint off his face.

534 Afrocity  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 7:36:04pm

re: #517 tommygum

Greta just interviewed Sarah Palin. No teleprompter, no stuttering, no uh-uh-uh bullshit. Sarah just rattled it off: stimulus plan, energy independence, "fairness" doctrine. She GETS it. Sarah 2012.

God I like the sound of that. Please let it be truth. Can we conquer the MSM this time?

535 geata  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 7:36:14pm

A trained fighting dog will have no mercy. When an ordinary dog senses that it has lost a a fight, it will roll over, leaving its soft belly exposed. There have been instances where bulldogs disemboweled their opponent who rolled over.

When we roll over for fanatical Islam, they aren't going to be satisfied with their modest gains and settle down. They believe that they are commanded to subjugate the world, and they will not stop. Giving the Taliban Northern Pakistan and expecting them to be happy is like giving the cockroaches half the kitchen to roam free and expecting them to leave the other side alone. It ain't happening.

536 Bloodnok  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 7:36:17pm

re: #509 Noam Sayin'

What's happening in the asian currency markets?

The Nikkei is down 125. Looks like the Yen/dollar has jumped up about 0.73 (started day at 91.60, now at 92.3). No idea what the significance is, if any. "3 Wooood!"

537 Cato the Elder  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 7:36:17pm

re: #531 kansas

Here's the deal. I'm tired. I agreed with Charles. This didn't happen under Bush. Or it did. Whatever. Going to bed.

Night.

538 FightingBack  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 7:36:18pm

re: #519 notutopia

Why should I care what a Governor does in her spare time?
But glorifying Teen pregnancy, for other kids without the Gov's mansion to come home to, isn't good public policy.

539 rwmofo  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 7:36:32pm

re: #511 kynna

I might be misunderstanding, but it looks to me like she just moved them from the location that had been publicized in the media. They just aren't under the bed anymore. They're still there.

Maybe I missed something. But it looks like she's still defending herself -- and in a smart way since the media decided every burglar and kook needed to know where they could find the guns hidden in her home.

"He also said Gillibrand, mother of a 5-year-old and an infant, kept the ammunition separate from the empty guns, and then later called to add that the rifles were locked in a case while stored under the bed."

Hopefully she's still defending herself somehow. The length that some people feel they need to go to get their PC card frustrates me.

540 reine.de.tout  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 7:36:48pm

re: #428 Afrocity

Oh God. I love Sarah Palin she is so genuine.

I'm with you.
Not sure she's the right person for Pres nomination, but I love her.

541 Buster Bunny  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 7:36:54pm

re: #497 Nevergiveup

Trump Entertainment may file bankruptcy: report

[Link: www.reuters.com...]


Why do I pay my bills? Remind me?

When you get to the stage that your hairpiece has its own talent show, you can worry about the bill situation. Till then I'll leave big bill problems to the Trumps.

542 FightingBack  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 7:36:56pm

re: #528 Afrocity

At least it is not tax payers.

In this case. But most others?

543 Maximu§  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 7:37:15pm

re: #515 JHW

More on the Russian equation on this.


Russia-NATO Relations Feb. 10

I see this as good news...

544 Marvo76  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 7:37:29pm

re: #219 HelloDare

wonder if he still feels the same way?

545 songbird  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 7:37:33pm

Nite, Lizards. I've got work to do before I sleep.

546 Cato the Elder  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 7:37:37pm

re: #530 Mich-again

The B7 chord like in "Someday You'll Call My Name" is the very saddest of them all.

No, the saddest of all is when you lose a chord altogether. Ask the Moody Blues.

547 UberInfidel67  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 7:37:44pm

LMAO @ "stranded on koolaid island" hahahahahahaha I'm gonna use that one if you don't mind.

548 A Man for all Seasons  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 7:38:01pm

re: #530 Mich-again

The B7 chord like in "Someday You'll Call My Name" is the very saddest of them all.

agreed..any 7th minor played right is haunting...That's why i like the blues..

549 Nevergiveup  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 7:38:13pm

re: #543 Maximu§

I see this as good news...

But that means no missile shield in Poland and a whole host of other concessions to the Russians.

550 rwmofo  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 7:38:20pm

re: #517 tommygum

Greta just interviewed Sarah Palin. No teleprompter, no stuttering, no uh-uh-uh bullshit. Sarah just rattled it off: stimulus plan, energy independence, "fairness" doctrine. She GETS it. Sarah 2012.

I think Governor Palin always got it. The MSM saw that and immediately set out to destroy her.

551 Afrocity  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 7:38:22pm

re: #519 notutopia

Teen age pregnancy is a huge undertaking without support from others. Sarah, as a mother, has been unconditionally supportive.
Those that are critical of her, are trying to separate her role as mother, from the Governor, if it does not fit their
restrictive "professional mold". They still have a hard time accepting that she is capable of simultaneously orchestrating many responsibilities and roles, as herself, mother, wife, and governor, all quite successfully, at the same time.

Sarah is the best and such a great role model for women and feminism. I don't buy that shit that feminism is only for liberals. I think the left was awful towards Sarah.

552 [deleted]  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 7:38:24pm
553 JHW  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 7:38:31pm

re: #529 BigMoo

Yes and I'm afraid we're in for more unpleasant surprises out of Moscow, the Ukrainian situation is looking ripe for nastiness right now, and they're also close to bankruptcy.

554 Randall Gross  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 7:38:50pm

re: #515 JHW

There's another card to play here, and that's the ancient Silk road. Everyone forgets about that.

555 Maximu§  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 7:39:10pm

re: #532 albusteve

then we need to eradicate the poppies...people will starve...there will be no substitute because that ground will be contested...free fire zone...we will have to ruin their safe villages which will cause an enormous refugee problem...boots and 24/7 airstrikes...so we do all this and wipe out the Taliban and the very people we went to save will hate us forever...it can be done but for what?...what good does it do us?

Perhaps these Idiots can actually start growing FOOD to feed people with.

556 albusteve  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 7:39:13pm

re: #535 geata

A trained fighting dog will have no mercy. When an ordinary dog senses that it has lost a a fight, it will roll over, leaving its soft belly exposed. There have been instances where bulldogs disemboweled their opponent who rolled over.

When we roll over for fanatical Islam, they aren't going to be satisfied with their modest gains and settle down. They believe that they are commanded to subjugate the world, and they will not stop. Giving the Taliban Northern Pakistan and expecting them to be happy is like giving the cockroaches half the kitchen to roam free and expecting them to leave the other side alone. It ain't happening.

are you prepared for total war in the ME to protect yourself here in north America?

557 HelloDare  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 7:39:14pm

re: #484 Afrocity

Someone needs to tell Obama to stop campaigning for King Of The World.

Democratic Congressman José Serrano of New York proposes the President For Life Barack Obama amendment.

So in Venezuela, voters gave Chavez the go-ahead to become the next Castro by lifting the limits on his term.

Serrano wants to do the same here.

He quietly introduced House Joint Resolution 8 on Jan. 4 to repeal the 22nd Amendment, which limits a president to two terms.

Change. Hope. Repeat.

558 Code Red 21  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 7:39:34pm

re: #485 FightingBack

There's a Grandmama and a great Grandmama. But does the Baby has a Daddy?

He has a Daddy but does he have something more important? A Father perhaps. Personally I no longer attend or send gifts to baby showers given for expectant mothers who aren't married. We have swallowed the BS that we shouldn't call a child born out of wedlock a bastard, after all, it's not their fault. While it is true that the child is not at fault for the circumstances of their birth we have made illegitimacy acceptable and have thousands of children without a stable family life that live in poverty. We are paying for this through increased taxes, crime, and innocent children being murdered by the new boyfriend in the child's life. We have our money taken from us by the government to fund programs for "single mothers" and hear constantly about the trials and tribulations of the single mother. Where in the hell are the fathers?

559 notutopia  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 7:39:39pm

re: #538 FightingBack

You are entitled to your opinion.
This family has the needs of this child well taken care of.
No public assistance is required. I think that is great example for public policy!

560 Dark_Falcon  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 7:39:48pm

re: #512 FightingBack

Is he employed? The baby can't wait for June to eat.

Yes, he's an electrician's apprentice out in the oil fields. In a way, if this had to happen, Alaska is the best state for to happen. Levi can still get a good job there without a college education. That said, I do think that Bristol Palin demonstrated displayed candor and a good moral compass in the interview. She didn't have any rhetorical flourishes, but she came across as sane and honest. On the whole, Bristol Palin is a better interviewee than BHO.

561 A Kiwi Infidel  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 7:40:09pm

Back on deck.

I read about this capitulation from the pakistanis. If they think this will slow the Jihad then are entirely mistaken.

"One small step for mujahadeen.............one..........giant leap.......for global jihad"

Apologies to Neil.

The area is known as SWAT, and if you google images (Swat Pakistan) , well, there goes the neighbourhood.

562 albusteve  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 7:40:10pm

re: #555 Maximu§

Perhaps these Idiots can actually start growing FOOD to feed people with.

hemp...but nobody here takes me seriously...and food of course

563 MandyManners  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 7:40:25pm

re: #507 NJDhockeyfan

Here is the one on NY...

Islamberg

That article mentions that the camp is near a large reservoire. IIRC, the one in Dover, TN, is near an important TVA facility.

564 Bloodnok  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 7:40:34pm

re: #557 HelloDare

Democratic Congressman José Serrano of New York proposes the President For Life Barack Obama amendment.

So in Venezuela, voters gave Chavez the go-ahead to become the next Castro by lifting the limits on his term.

Serrano wants to do the same here.

He quietly introduced House Joint Resolution 8 on Jan. 4 to repeal the 22nd Amendment, which limits a president to two terms.

Change. Hope. Repeat.

He has done this before and not when 0bama was President. It's nothing serious.

565 Nevergiveup  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 7:40:54pm

re: #564 Bloodnok

He has done this before and not when 0bama was President. It's nothing serious.

He is nothing serious.

566 Irenike  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 7:40:58pm

The developments in Pakistan are bad. I lay part of the blame at the feet of Dianne F*cking Feinstein, who blabbed this week about the unmanned drones spying on Al Qaeda. No doubt the Taliban put massive pressure on the already tenuous Paki government after hearing about Dianne's bit of news.

Either way, the Dems are royally f*cking it all up again on the world stage because they are spineless wimps who will talk and talk, and won't do shit about the bad guys who are trying to kill everyone who stands in their way.

567 Randall Gross  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 7:41:01pm

re: #555 Maximu§

Perhaps these Idiots can actually start growing FOOD to feed people with.

They are working on that, Pomegranates, bananas.

568 Crux Australis  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 7:41:12pm

Do the Pakistani nukes have a range to reach Australia? In case things go pear shaped.

I really don't like this.

The MSM, Hollywood and the Democrats are destroying America and bringing down the rest of the world with it.

569 Buster Bunny  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 7:41:35pm

re: #556 albusteve

are you prepared for total war in the ME to protect yourself here in north America?

Why .. you dont think its happened before?

What do you think the shores of Tripoli were about?

They WILL back down, but you have to be aggressive enough to make an effective point.

Like wiping out their entire navy in three days (thank you Pres Reagan for that one)

570 Randall Gross  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 7:41:47pm

re: #568 Crux Australis

Do the Pakistani nukes have a range to reach Australia? In case things go pear shaped.

I really don't like this.

The MSM, Hollywood and the Democrats are destroying America and bringing down the rest of the world with it.

Don't believe so, lemme check.

571 Sifty  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 7:41:54pm

Jeez Louise. My soul hurts.

572 reine.de.tout  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 7:42:01pm

re: #538 FightingBack

Why should I care what a Governor does in her spare time?
But glorifying Teen pregnancy, for other kids without the Gov's mansion to come home to, isn't good public policy.

I don't see it as glorifying teen pregnancy.

I see it as this family staying true to its pro-life principles, regardless of how difficult it is and regardless of the nasty things "people" will say.

573 Bloodnok  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 7:42:15pm

re: #565 Nevergiveup

He is nothing serious.

Just a Rep with a very strange obsession with a particular cause.

574 Marvo76  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 7:42:29pm

re: #310 Thanos

Thanos I have also heard it refered to as "the list" is this one of those deals where it can mean several things?

575 Nevergiveup  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 7:42:36pm

re: #568 Crux Australis

Do the Pakistani nukes have a range to reach Australia? In case things go pear shaped.

I really don't like this.

The MSM, Hollywood and the Democrats are destroying America and bringing down the rest of the world with it.

I'd bet no, but remember that movie "The Beach"?

576 Cato the Elder  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 7:42:42pm

re: #557 HelloDare

Democratic Congressman José Serrano of New York proposes the President For Life Barack Obama amendment.

So in Venezuela, voters gave Chavez the go-ahead to become the next Castro by lifting the limits on his term.

Serrano wants to do the same here.

He quietly introduced House Joint Resolution 8 on Jan. 4 to repeal the 22nd Amendment, which limits a president to two terms.

Change. Hope. Repeat.

Bullshit. Serrano has been pushing that repeal bill for years and years, long before anyone knew Obama's name.

And it has about as much chance of getting out of committee as I do of getting out of a speeding ticket.

577 Dark_Falcon  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 7:42:51pm

re: #557 HelloDare

We've been over this before: That bill got nowhere in committee. It is a non-story.

578 UberInfidel67  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 7:43:04pm

re: #558 Code Red 21
Yeah...we should send them off to their "Aunt" until the baby is born. Or if you don't have an "Aunt", they can abort these babies. Brilliant

///oozing

579 Noam Sayin'  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 7:43:19pm

re: #504 Boondock St. Bender

That is cool.the article looks very good.(always looking for good music theory literiture)

I have the original version of his instruction book from my college days (credits for guitar lessons - cool). He's a very meticulous guitar player and instructor, having transcribed thousands of songs and pulling out their commonalities to create his curriculum around them. I'm almost thinking of buying a new version, as I have only the original audio tapes that went with that book. Two problems exist for those tapes. My cassette player sped up the tape to nearly a half-step out of pitch; and I no longer have that cassette player - or any cassette player.

580 Dark_Falcon  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 7:43:53pm

re: #575 Nevergiveup

I'd bet no, but remember that movie "The Beach"?

Didn't see it, but I did see the remake a few years back.

581 BigMoo  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 7:44:02pm

re: #553 JHW

Supposedly, Russia is in desperate financial straights also, thanks to $40 oil. Plus, their national demographics stink-low birth rate, high, early death for male population...but testosterone enough to take Ukraine and terrorize Poland and western Europe for a while.

582 JHW  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 7:44:07pm

re: #543 Maximu§

I'm afraid they're preparing some kind of mischief in Ukraine and they will use the supply issue as an instrument of some of our none too resolute NATO allies, who are already getting a bit shaky over the Russian natural gas transit (especially via Ukraine) situation. The financial news today was really,really grim for Eastern Europe, and Russian rhetoric against Ukraine has been heating up in the last few weeks.

583 Afrocity  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 7:44:10pm

re: #542 FightingBack

In this case. But most others?

Touche. I guess you mean people like my mom. I am illegitimate and my mom had my brother at 15, and me at 31. She was on welfare mostly with me.
I work and try to be a good American. I don't expect handouts. i did get Pell Grants to go to college with student loans. Thank you America for paying for my education. I would not have done it without you. I am now paying those loans back.

584 albusteve  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 7:44:31pm

re: #569 Buster Bunny

Why .. you dont think its happened before?

What do you think the shores of Tripoli were about?

They WILL back down, but you have to be aggressive enough to make an effective point.

Like wiping out their entire navy in three days (thank you Pres Reagan for that one)

if that's the case and it may be...I'm sort of a monger myself...then it's the wrong fight and we should directly confront Iran right now...not a year from today...now...Iran and the Straights is where we take down Jihad next...not Afghanistan

585 [deleted]  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 7:44:42pm
586 Colonel Panik  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 7:44:43pm

re: #568 Crux Australis

Do the Pakistani nukes have a range to reach Australia? In case things go pear shaped.

I really don't like this.

The MSM, Hollywood and the Democrats are destroying America and bringing down the rest of the world with it.

By missile, no. Not yet. Their present missiles do not have the range. I'd be more worried about something coming in a shipping container.

587 Randall Gross  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 7:44:45pm

re: #574 Marvo76

I'm not sure, but I read that way back in a PDF from the 90's and it was corrobated by some of the reports that came out right after 9/11

588 Noam Sayin'  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 7:44:47pm

re: #536 Bloodnok

(arkroyal was just looking for traffic on his blog)

589 A Kiwi Infidel  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 7:44:56pm

re: #568 Crux Australis

Do the Pakistani nukes have a range to reach Australia? In case things go pear shaped.

I really don't like this.

The MSM, Hollywood and the Democrats are destroying America and bringing down the rest of the world with it.


Hey, Aus, its not the Pakistanis you need to worry about, its the 100,000,000 indonesions you have at your front door.

590 FightingBack  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 7:45:00pm

re: #558 Code Red 21

I agree. I am opposed to the glorification of unwed teen pregnancy, because of the victim, an infant. And pretty Bristol, with her stellar support system, and plenty of money, is a bad example to show the little girls watching her at home. It won't go so well for most of them.
There's no need for Gov Palin to trot out her kid; her political actions are what we should be judging.

591 Mich-again  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 7:45:01pm

re: #576 Cato the Elder

Bullshit. Serrano has been pushing that repeal bill for years and years, long before anyone knew Obama's name.

And it has about as much chance of getting out of committee as I do of getting out of a speeding ticket.

Why doesn't one of the other Congressmen there just interrupt him and tell him to quit wasting all their time with his stupid bullshit.

I wouldn't make a good Congressman.

592 Marvo76  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 7:45:25pm

re: #336 lawhawk
If the regime were to fall, who would be the one to "handle" the nukes, either by claiming them or removing them? I would think our predators would be real useful at that point...

593 Bloodnok  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 7:45:51pm

re: #588 Noam Sayin'

(arkroyal was just looking for traffic on his blog)

say no more...

594 Dark_Falcon  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 7:46:14pm

re: #571 Sifty

Jeez Louise. My soul hurts.

Go see The One, He will heal it and then give you a unicorn.

/sarc

595 Henchman Ghazi-808  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 7:46:42pm

re: #557 HelloDare

That was in 2007. It's BS anyways, but it's BS to say it was specifically for Obama. However... did I say it was BS? What a jagoff.....

596 Achilles Tang  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 7:46:48pm

re: #540 reine.de.tout

I'm with you.
Not sure she's the right person for Pres nomination, but I love her.

In that case, I guess I'll have to listen to her again. Can't say I've wanted to for a while.

597 MandyManners  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 7:47:12pm

When I signed into AOL today, the search box had a drawing of CBBHO on it. Were they really saying that today is the day to honor not Washington and Lincoln but, CBBHO?

598 Randall Gross  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 7:47:19pm

re: #592 Marvo76

If the regime were to fall, who would be the one to "handle" the nukes, either by claiming them or removing them? I would think our predators would be real useful at that point...

It's not a regime, it's a democratically elected coalition / parliamentary gov't. Kayani has the nukes covered if fecal matter hits the fan.

599 SpartanWoman  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 7:47:19pm

re: #578 UberInfidel67

Yeah...we should send them off to their "Aunt" until the baby is born. Or if you don't have an "Aunt", they can abort these babies. Brilliant

///oozing

When girls got pregnant when I was in high school they went to live with "an aunt", except the aunt was really a group of Sisters, and the baby was adopted.......or the young parents married. At the school I went to the girls came back and nothing dared be said. One of the moms was actually voted homecoming queen the following year.

600 BigMoo  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 7:47:32pm

re: #591 Mich-again

Actually, you and 434 other new folks would be a HUGE improvement.

601 A Kiwi Infidel  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 7:47:32pm

re: #592 Marvo76

If the regime were to fall, who would be the one to "handle" the nukes, either by claiming them or removing them? I would think our predators would be real useful at that point...


India will not tolerate an Al quaeda/Taliban controlled nuclear Pakistan.

602 albusteve  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 7:47:47pm

re: #592 Marvo76

If the regime were to fall, who would be the one to "handle" the nukes, either by claiming them or removing them? I would think our predators would be real useful at that point...

I continuously ask that question but nobody addresses it...I should think we would have to deal with it maybe allied with India...somebody has to do it if it all goes south...get the Israelis to chip in

603 spirochete  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 7:48:21pm

re: #568 Crux Australis

Do the Pakistani nukes have a range to reach Australia? In case things go pear shaped.

I really don't like this.

The MSM, Hollywood and the Democrats are destroying America and bringing down the rest of the world with it.


I'm not sure they can even mount them on missiles yet. And I remember reading that there were serious questions about the quality of the weapons, too.

604 BigMoo  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 7:48:22pm

re: #601 A Kiwi Infidel

Bingo

605 SpartanWoman  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 7:48:22pm

re: #575 Nevergiveup

I'd bet no, but remember that movie "The Beach"?

On the Beach. Based on the Neville Chute novel

606 Holidays are Family Fun Time  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 7:48:31pm

re: #585 buzzsawmonkey

Mint chocolates in the shape of an Obama face?

haven't seen those yet. . .

:0

607 Achilles Tang  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 7:48:34pm

re: #598 Thanos

Kayani has the nukes covered if fecal matter hits the fan.

You can assure us of that?

608 Walter L. Newton  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 7:48:38pm

re: #597 MandyManners

When I signed into AOL today, the search box had a drawing of CBBHO on it. Were they really saying that today is the day to honor not Washington and Lincoln but, CBBHO?

That was because of Executive Order 20091502-012 "I Want to Be on OAL."

609 A Kiwi Infidel  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 7:48:50pm

re: #602 albusteve

I continuously ask that question but nobody addresses it...I should think we would have to deal with it maybe allied with India...somebody has to do it if it all goes south...get the Israelis to chip in


The Israelis have their hands full, and especially so if Iran goes Nuke.

610 Nevergiveup  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 7:48:52pm

re: #603 spirochete

I'm not sure they can even mount them on missiles yet. And I remember reading that there were serious questions about the quality of the weapons, too.

They have the ability to mount them on missiles

611 Henchman Ghazi-808  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 7:48:58pm

re: #601 A Kiwi Infidel

Nor should it. I'm sure they would support a nuke Iran, who would support a nuke Korea, and so on, and so on....

612 Afrocity  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 7:48:59pm

re: #558 Code Red 21

I don't think that every pregnant woman should have to be married. My mom was raped and got pregant with her 2nd child- a boy. She put him up for adoption. Being black and this was 1959, there were no options except that he go to an orphanage. Guess who adopted him? The guy who raped my mom. She was 17 and a minor therefore had no say. Women had no rights then.

613 Spare O'Lake  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 7:49:07pm

re: #568 Crux Australis

The MSM, Hollywood and the Democrats are destroying America and bringing down the rest of the world with it.

Death to Hollywood.
/LOL/

614 FightingBack  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 7:49:09pm

re: #583 Afrocity

Brava! You are here on LGF, aren't you? That says a lot right there; I admire your posts.
And your Mom suffered plenty to bring you up right. It's other little girls I'd like to see reject this same course. Showing them an unrealistic situation just plays into their unrealistic dreams. They don't know what's involved.

615 Code Red 21  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 7:49:14pm

re: #578 UberInfidel67

Yeah...we should send them off to their "Aunt" until the baby is born. Or if you don't have an "Aunt", they can abort these babies. Brilliant

///oozing

Where did I say anything about aborting babies? I am just damn sick and tired of people like you who throw this kind of argument out when there is a very serious problem we have because their isn't an ounce of shame in women having a child that they can't care for without public assistance and for the most part damming their child to a very harsh life. I absolutely hate abortion but what I hate more are stupid fools like you who make illegitimacy acceptable while the innocent victims suffer.

616 Dark_Falcon  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 7:49:15pm

re: #590 FightingBack

I agree. I am opposed to the glorification of unwed teen pregnancy, because of the victim, an infant. And pretty Bristol, with her stellar support system, and plenty of money, is a bad example to show the little girls watching her at home. It won't go so well for most of them.
There's no need for Gov Palin to trot out her kid; her political actions are what we should be judging.

Actually, it is a good idea. It's the kind of "motherhood and apple pie" story that makes Sarah Palin look good. She comes across very well in this interview.

617 Achilles Tang  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 7:49:24pm

re: #605 SpartanWoman

On the Beach. Based on the Neville Chute novel

They don't make them like that anymore.

618 reine.de.tout  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 7:49:46pm

re: #596 Naso Tang

In that case, I guess I'll have to listen to her again. Can't say I've wanted to for a while.

Her down-hominess turns some people off.
I like it. She's just plain folks with no sense of "entitlement" to what she's accomplished in her life, and no need to try to impress anyone (which is where the McCain campaign went wrong with her, imo, in trying to micro-manage her natural enthusiasm).

619 albusteve  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 7:49:46pm

re: #598 Thanos

It's not a regime, it's a democratically elected coalition / parliamentary gov't. Kayani has the nukes covered if fecal matter hits the fan.

and if you yourself were president would that be good enough for you?

620 JHW  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 7:50:05pm
If mishandled by the world policy establishment, this debacle is big enough to shatter the fragile banking systems of Western Europe and set off round two of our financial Götterdämmerung.
The unfolding debt drama in Russia, Ukraine, and the EU states of Eastern Europe has reached acute danger point.


Failure to Save Eastern Europe can lead to Worldwide Financial Meltdown

Not sure how much I agree, but worth a read, from the Telegraph, U.K.

621 Boondock St. Bender  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 7:50:07pm

re: #579 Noam Sayin'

lol remember when that was state of the art?(feeling old)

622 Mich-again  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 7:50:18pm

re: #600 BigMoo

Actually, you and 434 other new folks would be a HUGE improvement.

I think just about anyone is qualified to be the boss. But it takes a special employee to be a good worker.

623 spirochete  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 7:50:40pm

re: #602 albusteve

I continuously ask that question but nobody addresses it...I should think we would have to deal with it maybe allied with India...somebody has to do it if it all goes south...get the Israelis to chip in

I would bet we have plans in place for this eventuality already. Remember, to disable a nuke, all you really need is a hammer.

624 Walter L. Newton  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 7:50:40pm

"President Barack Obama will tour a solar panel installation atop the Denver Museum of Nature and Science tomorrow before signing his landmark $787 billion economic stimulus bill in front of a crowd of 250 Colorado renewable energy and political leaders. "

[Link: www.denverpost.com...]

He's going to come all the way to Denver, Colorado to visit a roof. Way to go Barry.

625 albusteve  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 7:50:55pm

re: #609 A Kiwi Infidel

The Israelis have their hands full, and especially so if Iran goes Nuke.

right...geopolitically it seems to me this is where the party is...not Afghanistan

626 A Kiwi Infidel  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 7:50:57pm

Why did I have this image of BHO letting go of a very small snowball from on top of a very high hill of very deep snow, saying "but its only a small snowball"

627 Noam Sayin'  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 7:51:01pm

re: #466 Killgore Trout

I'm going to have to try that.

Do you think that little contraption could smoke a whole salmon filet?

628 UberInfidel67  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 7:51:41pm

re: #599 SpartanWoman Pretending it didn't happen isn't healthy. And what of all the children out there who were adopted? At least their mothers chose life, but it is still hard to not know who you are or where you came from.

I don't like teen pregnancy. But, if my daughter were to have a baby, I wouldn't ship her off somewhere and pretend it didn't happen. I would do everything I could to help take care of the new life. I know quite a few of her friends that have babies. It happens. It is NOT a good idea. Many are still with the daddy and a few have married. I wouldn't want someone to get married just because they were having a baby though.

629 Crux Australis  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 7:51:42pm

re: #589 A Kiwi Infidel

Hey, Aus, its not the Pakistanis you need to worry about, its the 100,000,000 indonesions you have at your front door.

I know, but the indonesians don't have nukes. And it's 240 million Indonesians compared to 21 million Australians.

630 jwb7605  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 7:51:43pm

re: #615 Code Red 21

Where did I say anything about aborting babies? I am just damn sick and tired of people like you who throw this kind of argument out when there is a very serious problem we have because their isn't an ounce of shame in women having a child that they can't care for without public assistance and for the most part damming their child to a very harsh life. I absolutely hate abortion but what I hate more are stupid fools like you who make illegitimacy acceptable while the innocent victims suffer.

What I get sick of is twits like you lumping all unwed pregnancies into the same basket.

631 Achilles Tang  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 7:51:44pm

re: #618 reine.de.tout

Her down-hominess turns some people off.
I like it. She's just plain folks with no sense of "entitlement" to what she's accomplished in her life, and no need to try to impress anyone (which is where the McCain campaign went wrong with her, imo, in trying to micro-manage her natural enthusiasm).

That may be good for getting votes, but personally I want to be impressed off my feet, so to speak.

/Not that that will ever happen.

632 Holidays are Family Fun Time  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 7:52:08pm

Ok, with Northern Pakistan now going total Dark Ages does that mean we/the Afghanistani's will have to have a major military presence (permanent base) on the border between Afghanistan and Pakistan?

633 BigMoo  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 7:52:20pm

By the way...ain't the world a much better, safer, loving place since the inauguration ? The world likes us again, Jihads have been revoked and in general, peace has broken out around the world.

I mean, I'm ready to turn my m-4 carbine into a floor lamp.

634 theblakester  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 7:52:50pm

What is the term the Muslim use for a tactical truce to rearm and regroup their forces? Maybe this is all part of a grand scheme to fool the enemy.

635 Randall Gross  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 7:52:57pm

re: #586 Colonel Panik

By missile, no. Not yet. Their present missiles do not have the range. I'd be more worried about something coming in a shipping container.

I concur, I just measured in Google earth to verify. The "tanker nuke" scenario is the most worrisome to me.

636 Vet_Missing_Parts (1LT, Ret)  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 7:53:25pm

re: #633 BigMoo

By the way...ain't the world a much better, safer, loving place since the inauguration ? The world likes us again, Jihads have been revoked and in general, peace has broken out around the world.

I mean, I'm ready to turn my m-4 carbine into a floor lamp.

And so much cooler, too... don't forget cooler.

637 Sharmuta  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 7:53:27pm

re: #634 theblakester

What is the term the Muslim use for a tactical truce to rearm and regroup their forces? Maybe this is all part of a grand scheme to fool the enemy.

The term is "hudna".

638 albusteve  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 7:53:42pm

re: #623 spirochete

I would bet we have plans in place for this eventuality already. Remember, to disable a nuke, all you really need is a hammer.

maybe an inside job?....a denutted Pakistan would sure simplify things

639 razorbacker  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 7:53:45pm

re: #582 JHW

The financial news today was really,really grim for Eastern Europe, and Russian rhetoric against Ukraine has been heating up in the last few weeks.

You think that the news is grim for the Eastern Europeans? How about the folks that have loaned them enormous amounts of Euros?

It's going to bring some perspective to this so-called 'housing bubble' kerfluffle. To take a nice Frenchman's saying and use it out of turn, going to be 'bad hoo doos'.

640 Walter L. Newton  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 7:53:48pm

re: #634 theblakester

What is the term the Muslim use for a tactical truce to rearm and regroup their forces? Maybe this is all part of a grand scheme to fool the enemy.

Hunda.

641 jaunte  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 7:53:51pm

re: #633 BigMoo


I mean, I'm ready to turn my m-4 carbine into a floor lamp.

I'll trade you a really nice floor lamp for it.

642 A Kiwi Infidel  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 7:54:00pm

re: #629 Crux Australis

I know, but the indonesians don't have nukes. And it's 240 million Indonesians compared to 21 million Australians.


My stats are old, but crikey, I didnt think they were that old. They must be breeding real fast......

The other problem is that their army, based on thoses stats, probably outnumbers yours by 10 to 1.

643 Bloodnok  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 7:54:24pm

Bonnes nuit mes amis.

644 Colonel Panik  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 7:54:25pm

re: #620 JHW

Failure to Save Eastern Europe can lead to Worldwide Financial Meltdown

Not sure how much I agree, but worth a read, from the Telegraph, U.K.

I've been doing my part to save free market economics in Eastern Europe. I've bought several CZ firearms, Sellier & Bellot ammunition, Pilsner Urquell beer, and I've got a nice bottle of Polish Luksusowa potato vodka chilling in the icebox.

645 UberInfidel67  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 7:54:36pm

re: #615 Code Red 21
Every illigitimate child doesn't end up being a burden on society. I happen to have 2 of them myself. I took care of my children...not you. And I was equating abortion with just another way to make the little problem go away.

646 Achilles Tang  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 7:54:47pm

re: #634 theblakester

What is the term the Muslim use for a tactical truce to rearm and regroup their forces? Maybe this is all part of a grand scheme to fool the enemy.


Taqiyya

647 SpartanWoman  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 7:54:55pm

re: #628 UberInfidel67

Pretending it didn't happen isn't healthy. And what of all the children out there who were adopted? At least their mothers chose life, but it is still hard to not know who you are or where you came from.

I don't like teen pregnancy. But, if my daughter were to have a baby, I wouldn't ship her off somewhere and pretend it didn't happen. I would do everything I could to help take care of the new life. I know quite a few of her friends that have babies. It happens. It is NOT a good idea. Many are still with the daddy and a few have married. I wouldn't want someone to get married just because they were having a baby though.

We didn't pretend it didn't happen, we knew, we just were not allowed to talk about it at school and you could be disciplined for making remarks against the girl. As for the adopted babies, I suspect they were very loved. One of the "girls", now in her mid 50s was found by her son. He did very well and they have a pleasant relationship. His parents encouraged him to look for her. She's as proud as can be!

648 Mich-again  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 7:55:02pm

So I wonder this. Will GWB be credited for doing so much to eliminate global warming? I mean, when they wrote Kyoto, it seemed crazy to think that the US could ever reduce CO2 emissions to the levels proposed in that timeframe.

But I think we are there or close anyway.

649 [deleted]  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 7:55:06pm
650 spirochete  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 7:55:09pm

re: #638 albusteve

maybe an inside job?....a denutted Pakistan would sure simplify things

Yup.

651 theblakester  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 7:55:39pm

Why thank re: #637 Sharmuta

Why thank you, I knew I could count on someone in the community to help me with this. I just remember how the IDF fooled Hamas just before Op Cast Lead.

652 Cato the Elder  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 7:55:44pm

re: #591 Mich-again

Why doesn't one of the other Congressmen there just interrupt him and tell him to quit wasting all their time with his stupid bullshit.

I wouldn't make a good Congressman.

Nor would I.

But as the Senator in "Religulous" proudly said, "There's no IQ test to be in the U.S. Congress."

653 Marvo76  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 7:55:44pm

re: #529 BigMoo

which begs the question if they have a contingency plan to get them all out by air and how much supplies and hardware we would loose?

654 A Kiwi Infidel  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 7:55:49pm

Time to go and muster the troops.

Back tomorrow.

'nite lizards, find a warm rock.

655 Holidays are Family Fun Time  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 7:56:00pm

re: #612 Afrocity

I don't think that every pregnant woman should have to be married. My mom was raped and got pregant with her 2nd child- a boy. She put him up for adoption. Being black and this was 1959, there were no options except that he go to an orphanage. Guess who adopted him? The guy who raped my mom. She was 17 and a minor therefore had no say. Women had no rights then.

exactly, Afrocity. There seems to be a mindset that if a child was created it was because two people were so "in love" they just couldn't wait 'til their wedding night. Alcohol plays a role in a lot of unplanned/unwanted pregnancies.

We seem to forget the horrible situation many people endured because they were forced to get married and create a family when they weren't "in love".

The answer, IMHO, is pretty simple but use of contraception isn't the issue the MSM and others want to talk about.

656 Randall Gross  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 7:56:05pm

re: #607 Naso Tang

You can assure us of that?

He trained at West point, is very western, and they instituted our failsafe controls on the nukes in Pakistan. That's as much info as I am willing to give out, but they are reasonably safe. Again I will state that the scenario of the Taliban defeating the Sindh and the Punjab is just not going to happen. The mighty dragon sometimes fails on the local snake's ground, but the snake gets eaten in the dragon's lair.

657 sattv4u2  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 7:56:08pm

re: #632 ggt

Ok, with Northern Pakistan now going total Dark Ages does that mean we/the Afghanistani's will have to have a major military presence (permanent base) on the border between Afghanistan and Pakistan?

We're not welcome to have a "base" either place. We may need to throw our lot in with India. Geographically, it's as close as we can get in a "freindly' country

658 Afrocity  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 7:56:25pm

re: #628 UberInfidel67

Pretending it didn't happen isn't healthy. And what of all the children out there who were adopted? At least their mothers chose life, but it is still hard to not know who you are or where you came from.

I don't like teen pregnancy. But, if my daughter were to have a baby, I wouldn't ship her off somewhere and pretend it didn't happen. I would do everything I could to help take care of the new life. I know quite a few of her friends that have babies. It happens. It is NOT a good idea. Many are still with the daddy and a few have married. I wouldn't want someone to get married just because they were having a baby though.

On that note please if you adopt .. Adopt in the USA. Many sibling sets and yes not many new borns but a child needs a chance...Many pics with stories.adopt

659 BigMoo  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 7:56:34pm

re: #622 Mich-again

I suggest we're finding out since the inauguration that not just 'anyone' can be the 'boss' either. But 435 Americans who have spent their lives working, building businesses, teaching kids, enforcing our laws (instead of writing them), meeting payrolls, treating patients (instead of suing doctors) would be a step in the right direction for a new legislature...

660 JHW  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 7:56:42pm

re: #639 razorbacker

Yes, that was in the article, they've went absolutely crazy in their lending, which puts their financial systems in jeopardy. And, they can't blame this on the USA, their own greed and silly lending policies have put them in a very dangerous position.

661 A Kiwi Infidel  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 7:56:46pm

re: #649 Iron Fist


Pssssttttttt, wakey wakey

662 Buster Bunny  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 7:57:17pm

re: #640 Walter L. Newton

Hunda.

I knew that car company was up to no good !

663 NJDhockeyfan  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 7:57:18pm

re: #563 MandyManners

That article mentions that the camp is near a large reservoire. IIRC, the one in Dover, TN, is near an important TVA facility.


I'm sure that's no coincidence either. The one in Virginia is in Red House, Va. I don't know if that's near any large bodies of water but it's not far from where I live.

Jamaat ul-Fuqra Compound at Red House Va.

664 Achilles Tang  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 7:57:18pm

re: #637 Sharmuta

The term is "hudna".

That too.

665 BigMoo  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 7:57:48pm

re: #636 Vet_Missing_Parts (1LT, Ret)

Yes, VERY cool. Cool is good.
LOL

666 Marvo76  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 7:57:56pm

re: #556 albusteve

If it comes to that, it will be here as well, they are already here, just biding their time...

667 BigMoo  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 7:58:28pm

re: #641 jaunte

Not just yet...

668 geata  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 7:58:32pm

Tech question: I've got 70+ comments on the site, but no matter what I do I can't seem to see more than the last three or so. Is there any way to see a list of all the comments I've made?

669 albusteve  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 7:58:32pm

re: #649 Iron Fist

Now you are getting with the program! you've got to break some eggs to nuke an omlette! Peace Out, man! It'll be just like the days of the Weather Underground, except we'll have qll the kcool big-kidz toys like Carrier Battle Groups and ballistic missile submariens. What could possibly go wrong with the One, the Lightworker, King of Kings and Lord of Lords Obama (peace be unto Him) the Messiah in charge. Now, it'd be different if we had a skinney black dude with Jughead ears and narcisistic levels of self-importance and self-worth who had gotten nearly everything in his life from fancy prep schools to a gig at Harvard, and even intros to the right (by which we mean Left) power-players to help him secure political office and rise in the ranks at a sobering speed.

If that were the man in charge, I'd say that we're all fucked. Well and truly fucked.

we havin fun yet?

670 UberInfidel67  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 7:58:39pm

re: #647 SpartanWoman
I am happy for her son. But I am sure there are many more who never have that. I would agree to not talking bad about the mother thgough. It had to be so hard for her to move on like it never happened.

671 tommygum  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 7:58:58pm

re: #583 Afrocity

Touche. I guess you mean people like my mom. I am illegitimate and my mom had my brother at 15, and me at 31. She was on welfare mostly with me.
I work and try to be a good American. I don't expect handouts. i did get Pell Grants to go to college with student loans. Thank you America for paying for my education. I would not have done it without you. I am now paying those loans back.

G*d bless you!

672 Syrah  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 7:58:58pm

This is only day 27 of Obama's First One Hundred Days.

73 to go.

673 jaunte  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 7:59:03pm

re: #658 Afrocity

On that note please if you adopt .. Adopt in the USA. Many sibling sets and yes not many new borns but a child needs a chance...Many pics with stories.adopt

As an adoptive father of four, (only one an infant at adoption) I say hear, hear.
Many updings.

674 Marvo76  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 7:59:15pm

re: #557 HelloDare

good lord let us hope for some sanity on this...and if they do another Ronald regan

675 reine.de.tout  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 7:59:44pm

re: #628 UberInfidel67

Pretending it didn't happen isn't healthy. And what of all the children out there who were adopted? At least their mothers chose life, but it is still hard to not know who you are or where you came from.
. . .

Many, if not most, of today's adoptions are "open" or "semi-open" adoptions, allowing for some level of contact between mother and adoptive family.

676 mfarmer1  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 7:59:51pm

re: #318 Naso Tang

My wife is watching it in the other room. I got tired of all the conspiracy crap. Layer upon layer upon layer. I'm going back to reading about how we never landed on the moon.

Good one! Yeah, I hate to say it, but 24 seems pretty tired now. I don't sit on the edge of my chair anymore as now I fully expect the good guys to be the bad guys, somebody in the President's inner circle to be compromised, and moles galore at CTU and now the FBI.

It's still entertaining, but it has definitely lost its edge. After nuclear bombs have been detonated on US soil by terrorists, it's a bit difficult to get worked up over a military coup in Sengala or whatever it's called.

677 Holidays are Family Fun Time  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 8:00:26pm

re: #615 Code Red 21

Where did I say anything about aborting babies? I am just damn sick and tired of people like you who throw this kind of argument out when there is a very serious problem we have because their isn't an ounce of shame in women having a child that they can't care for without public assistance and for the most part damming their child to a very harsh life. I absolutely hate abortion but what I hate more are stupid fools like you who make illegitimacy acceptable while the innocent victims suffer.

Like it or not Code Red, unmarried people are going to have sex and sometimes they are going to create babies. We either talk about it and take care of the babies, or they die. They die before they are born due to lack of funding for proper pre-natal care or abortion or they die after they are born because their isn't proper funding to feed them.

Until, we as as society are willing to cope with the concept of sex in a mature fashion, people are going to continue to not use contraception and they are going to make babies.

The theocrat whacko's have their own ideas on how to solve the problem. While I don't particularly like paying for the babies, I prefer it to the theocrat method.

678 albusteve  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 8:01:00pm

re: #656 Thanos

He trained at West point, is very western, and they instituted our failsafe controls on the nukes in Pakistan. That's as much info as I am willing to give out, but they are reasonably safe. Again I will state that the scenario of the Taliban defeating the Sindh and the Punjab is just not going to happen. The mighty dragon sometimes fails on the local snake's ground, but the snake gets eaten in the dragon's lair.

I wish I had your confidence but I submit to your stuff here...I depend alot on you to help me out with this shit!

679 sattv4u2  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 8:01:04pm

GEOGRAPHY PEOPLE,,,, GEOGRAPHY
Look at a map. Our key and door to the region is India on one side and Oman/ Dubai on the other. Thats as close as we're getting for the forseeable future
We'll be able to up the troop count IN Afghanastan, but we won't be able to put any big new bases in the mountains there

680 theblakester  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 8:01:55pm

re: #673 jaunte

Though I have four of my own children, I always wanted to, and still might adopt. Though I would want an older child that may have thought the system has maybe forgotten him/her.

681 reine.de.tout  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 8:02:08pm

re: #673 jaunte

As an adoptive father of four, (only one an infant at adoption) I say hear, hear.
Many updings.

Many updings for Afrocity, and many for you too, Jaunte!

682 Marvo76  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 8:02:48pm

re: #601 A Kiwi Infidel

I wouldn't think so, Nor with all are troops next door, I think would we...

683 BigMoo  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 8:02:58pm

re: #653 Marvo76

which begs the question if they have a contingency plan to get them all out by air and how much supplies and hardware we would loose?

Not much heavy armor, LOTS of MRAPS, up-armored HUMVEES and some field artillery. I've got a son operating out there now between a FOB and a COB asking me what the sentiment is in the US right now for pushing forward and supporting the surge that has been predicted, but held up...

684 UberInfidel67  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 8:04:03pm

REINE! I got my cookbook receipt in my email today...they have shipped my book!

685 Afrocity  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 8:04:29pm

re: #677 ggt

Not to mention that a lot of abuse and neglect goes on in married couples w/ kids too. Like that Hedda Nesbaum from the 80's. What if the father is abusive? Two wrongs don't make a right.

686 albusteve  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 8:04:58pm

re: #666 Marvo76

If it comes to that, it will be here as well, they are already here, just biding their time...

one reason I live in NM...I go back east and can't stand it...N Va for example gives me the fucking creeps...I can't help it

687 Crux Australis  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 8:05:32pm

re: #642 A Kiwi Infidel

My stats are old, but crikey, I didnt think they were that old. They must be breeding real fast......

The other problem is that their army, based on thoses stats, probably outnumbers yours by 10 to 1.

But the Indonesian Army is being used to quell their own separatists (West Papua being an example). I'm not sure whether they could stage a successful invasion. And Australia is a huge landmass to invade and occupy.

There is only one nation on Earth that could stage a successful invasion of Australia and occupy it. Any guesses who that may be?

688 UberInfidel67  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 8:05:36pm

Time to go chill in the tub.....see ya'll later...play nice

Peace

689 SpartanWoman  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 8:05:40pm

re: #670 UberInfidel67

I am happy for her son. But I am sure there are many more who never have that. I would agree to not talking bad about the mother thgough. It had to be so hard for her to move on like it never happened.

None of the ones I knew moved on as if it never happened, but they did move on. And they were more thoughtful and wiser people after their pregnancies. They finished school, went to college and so on, things they probably would not have done as young single moms. Some of the young marrieds stayed married others didn't just like the rest of us. Either way, we, the classmates, were bound to a code of good behavior.

690 Marvo76  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 8:06:03pm

re: #603 spirochete

With the series of missle launches done in the last 5 years,,( I can't remember how many for sure) but globalsecurity had several articles on the tit for tat launches of both long rrange and cruise from both india and Pakistan. I would think they have had time to come up with some ype of delivery system but then again they do have jets...though it would be a one way ride...Homicide bomber/Kamakazi

691 jaunte  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 8:06:08pm

re: #680 theblakester

It's a very rich experience.

692 Code Red 21  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 8:06:18pm

re: #612 Afrocity

I don't think that every pregnant woman should have to be married. My mom was raped and got pregant with her 2nd child- a boy. She put him up for adoption. Being black and this was 1959, there were no options except that he go to an orphanage. Guess who adopted him? The guy who raped my mom. She was 17 and a minor therefore had no say. Women had no rights then.

My sister had a child that was the result of a date rape. This argument is not about womens rights this is about children being born into a home without a father. There are exceptions to every rule but we have gone way beyond exceptions. We are at the point now where over 80% of black children are born to unwed mothers without a stable family life and the white community is not far behind. Bill Cosby was soundly excoriated by the black community for bringing that message in a speech he made, to I think the NAACP or another back group, about children needing a father. All you have to do is look around and see who are committing the crimes in the area of the country where you live. If you are honest about it most of them criminals are young people who are the product of a single mother. The kids deserve better than to be made fodder of the criminal Justice system or being killed in the act of committing a crime. All I am trying to say is things are way out of control in our society and I think a big part of the breakdown is in the loss of intact families.

693 Elcid  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 8:06:34pm
Youtube Video

Believe the IS Charles Johnson...Guitar...With Al Jarreau High Crime London 1984...His Solo riff comes at about 3:53...

694 Cato the Elder  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 8:06:55pm

Don't worry, folks, Palin will save us in 2012.

/

695 albusteve  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 8:07:05pm

re: #687 Crux Australis

But the Indonesian Army is being used to quell their own separatists (West Papua being an example). I'm not sure whether they could stage a successful invasion. And Australia is a huge landmass to invade and occupy.

There is only one nation on Earth that could stage a successful invasion of Australia and occupy it. Any guesses who that may be?

why the dauntless Kiwis

696 Holidays are Family Fun Time  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 8:07:30pm

re: #685 Afrocity

Not to mention that a lot of abuse and neglect goes on in married couples w/ kids too. Like that Hedda Nesbaum from the 80's. What if the father is abusive? Two wrongs don't make a right.

absolutely!

697 SanFranciscoZionist  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 8:08:00pm

re: #391 Afrocity

Greta is in Alaska interviewing her as a teen mom. So far so good.

They should have said no.

698 FightingBack  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 8:08:07pm

re: #685 Afrocity

Not to mention that a lot of abuse and neglect goes on in married couples w/ kids too. Like that Hedda Nesbaum from the 80's. What if the father is abusive? Two wrongs don't make a right.

All the statistics, re education, crime, etc., run against the child of the single parent. Although there are exceptions to every rule, good and bad, the family is still the best place to raise kids. Not the state, the family.

699 reine.de.tout  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 8:08:15pm

re: #684 UberInfidel67

REINE! I got my cookbook receipt in my email today...they have shipped my book!

Great!
I think you're really going to enjoy it.
Specially the ROFLMAO section at the end.

Jaunte as generously agreed to allow the artwork to be used as an upload, so anyone who wants can upload it and print it as a poster. Cost for that is $5, at the same "purchase" link.

700 jaunte  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 8:09:03pm

re: #699 reine.de.tout

For a cartoon drawer, I'm a lousy businessman.

701 reine.de.tout  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 8:09:25pm

re: #700 jaunte

For a cartoon drawer, I'm a lousy businessman.

LOL!
Yes, you are.
But a great artist!

702 Holidays are Family Fun Time  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 8:09:41pm

re: #698 FightingBack

All the statistics, re education, crime, etc., run against the child of the single parent. Although there are exceptions to every rule, good and bad, the family is still the best place to raise kids. Not the state, the family.

i AGREE, How would you like to change the present situation?

703 Code Red 21  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 8:10:10pm

re: #630 jwb7605

What I get sick of is twits like you lumping all unwed pregnancies into the same basket.

Where did I lump all unwed pregnancies in the same basket? Instead of name calling why don't you dig up the stats on the success in our society of children born into poverty because of being born to a single mom.

704 Afrocity  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 8:11:32pm

re: #692 Code Red 21

I see and agree with points of your argument. The only thing I am saying is that IMHO pregancy is not a reason for a woman to get married. My dad, I love him and did not meet him until I was 32. He is a dead beat and I was better off w/o him, as a child. Now he borrows money from me and has 5 other illegitimate kids. I practiced abstinence and was a virgin til I was 27. I am 38 and childless.

705 [deleted]  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 8:12:29pm
706 Elcid  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 8:12:30pm

the=unnecessary word...Damn it

707 Marvo76  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 8:13:07pm

re: #683 BigMoo

I just have that reoccuring vision of pushing a chopper off the deck of the iwo Jima during the final days of Viet nam,a nd thinking what might happen with no Navy to carry them away, wold they be like the soviets? I don't think they will be that nice to us all things considere...

708 FightingBack  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 8:13:54pm

re: #702 ggt

Well, Step One is to stop the glorification of single teen pregnancy, like we saw tonight, and show a more realistic picture of the outcome of the situation. Few are going to wind up in the Gov's mansion with their Grammas.
Step Two is to make fathers responsible for their kids. The parents of the 13 year old father in the UK today are fighting for his being acknowledged as the one. What's the downside to them/him? None.

709 [deleted]  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 8:14:46pm
710 Afrocity  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 8:15:56pm

re: #705 Iron Fist
Welfare people do not want people off welfare. Then the caseworkers would not have a job. I hated welfare. Every striking year of it. I vowed to never be that powerless ever, ever again. I worked at 14 when I legally could.

711 Afrocity  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 8:17:19pm

re: #708 FightingBack

Well, Step One is to stop the glorification of single teen pregnancy, like we saw tonight, and show a more realistic picture of the outcome of the situation. Few are going to wind up in the Gov's mansion with their Grammas.
Step Two is to make fathers responsible for their kids. The parents of the 13 year old father in the UK today are fighting for his being acknowledged as the one. What's the downside to them/him? None.

So Sarah Palin can never be seen on TV interview with Bristol?

712 formercorpsman  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 8:17:26pm

re: #645 UberInfidel67

I was born the text book excuse. I am a bastard.

I have served this country, taken care of terminally ill children, offer much of my time & ability to numerous charities, some specifically dealing with this problem itself.

Not every story is a success.

Not every child is a failure.

713 Afrocity  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 8:18:03pm

re: #712 formercorpsman

You are a patriot.

714 FightingBack  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 8:18:37pm

re: #710 Afrocity

I want them off welfare. Welfare is bad for the soul. Teen mothers perpetuate welfare. The statistics are clear.

715 formercorpsman  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 8:21:57pm

re: #713 Afrocity

I only try to do my best. We have 3 little ones.

They are me, and I them. They have my mark.

I would never deny them. I am trying to raise them to become great contributors.

716 Code Red 21  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 8:23:31pm

re: #704 Afrocity

I see and agree with points of your argument. The only thing I am saying is that IMHO pregancy is not a reason for a woman to get married. My dad, I love him and did not meet him until I was 32. He is a dead beat and I was better off w/o him, as a child. Now he borrows money from me and has 5 other illegitimate kids. I practiced abstinence and was a virgin til I was 27. I am 38 and childless.

I've said it before, and I'll say it again, there are exceptions to everything. Yes there are terrible people like Hedda Nussbaum and her sadistic husband in the world but we as a society know, that children do better in an intact family. That is the point I am trying to make. It is not about looking down at someone who has a child out of wedlock but it is looking at the child who has the shit kicked out of him by mommies new boyfriend or the children who are left to fend for themselves. Watch the news, read the local rag, who are the victims here? They are innocent children who did not ask to be brought into the world only to be abused. Nothing breaks my heart more than hearing about a child being thrown up against a wall by the boyfriend mom just moved in last week who leaves her baby alone with a guy she barely knows. The whole situation is just incredibly sad.

717 Dark_Falcon  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 8:24:17pm

re: #708 FightingBack

Well, Step One is to stop the glorification of single teen pregnancy, like we saw tonight, and show a more realistic picture of the outcome of the situation. Few are going to wind up in the Gov's mansion with their Grammas.
Step Two is to make fathers responsible for their kids. The parents of the 13 year old father in the UK today are fighting for his being acknowledged as the one. What's the downside to them/him? None.

Bristol did not glorify teen pregnancy in that interview. She warned against it repeatedly.

718 razorbacker  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 8:24:21pm

re: #685 Afrocity

Not to mention that a lot of abuse and neglect goes on in married couples w/ kids too.

You ain't said the half of it, Sister

Perpetrators of Maltreatment

Nearly 84 percent (83.4%) of victims were abused by a parent acting alone or with another person. Approximately, forty percent (40.4%) of child victims were maltreated by their mothers acting alone; another 18.3 percent were maltreated by their fathers acting alone; and 17.3 percent were abused by both parents.18 Victims abused by nonparental perpetrators accounted for 10.7 percent (figure 3-5). A nonparental perpetrator is defined as a caregiver who is not a parent and can include foster parent, child daycare staff, unmarried partner of parent, legal guardian, and residential facility staff.

The data for victims of specific maltreatment types were analyzed in terms of perpetrator relationship to the victim. Of the victims who experienced neglect, 86.6 percent were neglected by a parent. Of the victims who were sexually abused, 28.7 percent were abused by a relative other than a parent.19

The thing about raising kids is, you just don't know. All you can do is your best, and strive to raise a kid who'll do their best. Society will have to be satisfied with that, because there has been proven no better way.

719 Dr. Shalit  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 8:25:57pm

Charles -

PAKISTAN SURRENDERS! has a GOOD RING to me. Would that "surrender" be to INDIA rather than the TALIBAN. One more time for the "cheap seats" Pakistan IS potentially THE Most Dangerous Nation on the Face of the Earth for the following reasons:

1. It HAS "The Bomb"

2. It Has Means to deploy/deliver them

3. It has a WEAK Central Government

4. It's ISLAMIC and mainly ISLAMIST population

IF I am wrong, please Correct Me. That is all.

-S-

720 formercorpsman  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 8:26:06pm

re: #713 Afrocity

I do want to mention, before I head off to bed.

I have enjoyed reading your posts since you have come here.

721 Achilles Tang  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 8:29:59pm

re: #710 Afrocity

Welfare people do not want people off welfare. Then the caseworkers would not have a job. I hated welfare. Every striking year of it. I vowed to never be that powerless ever, ever again. I worked at 14 when I legally could.

I'm been a landlord, not a big time one, for some time. Some properties have been on "section8" housing. It's been an education, but I see two main categories of people. One is older, possibly with some disability, or simply working hard at minimum wage, and part of their rent is paid.

The other, more common, is a single mother with 2,3,4 kids, and typically all of their rent plus utility help is paid. Mind you, not everyone can get that assistance.

However I know from experience that all those mothers have extended family, which begs the question, what are all the others who can't get on the program doing? Obviously they are surviving.

I'm not advocating not helping, but as far as I can see there is nothing of significance done to try to prevent a 20 something year old girl (not woman) from having a kid per year, even while they are on assistance. In fact the more you have the bigger a subsidy and the bigger a house you can rent.

Seems to me that free birth control would be a hell of a lot more cost effective, but somehow that is considered immoral by many, not to mention BTW, the last administration.

I don't get it.

722 [deleted]  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 8:33:21pm
723 tommygum  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 8:35:25pm

re: #694 Cato the Elder

Don't worry, folks, Palin will save us in 2012.

/

Sarc not necessary.

Unless it was snark.

724 SanFranciscoZionist  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 8:38:49pm

re: #711 Afrocity

So Sarah Palin can never be seen on TV interview with Bristol?

As long as it's about Governor Palin's career, I have no problem with Bristol being around to talk about her mom.

I don't think she should be interviewing. I don't think she should be in the public eye as a story. Her family is private.

And I still want to kick Bill O'Reilly about this whole thing.

725 Alberta Oil Peon  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 8:39:35pm

re: #231 Buster Bunny

I have a great video on youtube somewhere that shows off the latest in automated shotgun tech. It fires up to 300 12 gage shells a min .. and thats just one of the freakish new weapons that you'd be contending with.

Be realistic. First of all, the amount of flak a nuke brings down on a country is enough to sterilise it.

Second, the first country to use them in war will expect them to be used against them.

The costs, REGARDLESS of religion and expected outcome, are just too high.

Deterrence only works against rational actors.

726 Achilles Tang  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 8:42:36pm

re: #725 Alberta Oil Peon

Deterrence only works against rational actors.

But fear does work against anyone.

727 Alberta Oil Peon  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 9:14:34pm

re: #590 FightingBack

I agree. I am opposed to the glorification of unwed teen pregnancy, because of the victim, an infant. And pretty Bristol, with her stellar support system, and plenty of money, is a bad example to show the little girls watching her at home. It won't go so well for most of them.
There's no need for Gov Palin to trot out her kid; her political actions are what we should be judging.

How the Hell is it "glorifying" teen pregnancy to show how a responsible and close-knit family deals with it?

Whata maroon.

728 astronmr20  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 9:18:41pm

re: #478 Afrocity

I don't think that at all. Granted I can see how that can be perceived by someone. The Palin's are very hmmmm how can I say this in a PC way-- they are very domestic--yet career women at the same time. They take things in stride. Bristol told how she told Sarah she was pregnant. It was moving. These people are so transparent and I like that about Sarah.

Perhaps, but she doesn't belong on Fox. What's the point?

729 funky chicken  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 9:21:38pm

re: #727 Alberta Oil Peon

Well, she didn't make her daughter wear a scarlet letter on her dress at all public appearances, did she?

/

730 Scion9  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 9:28:33pm

[Link: www.csmonitor.com...]

Coalition forces are not in danger of running out of supplies, a NATO spokesman in Afghanistan said. But with 80 percent of all supplies flowing through this largely lawless region of Pakistan and with attacks on convoys increasing, Washington has been moving fast to repair relations with Afghanistan's neighbors.

To clarify up thread for someone that believed most of our supplies went through Central Asia.

731 ProUSA  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 9:28:51pm

re: #17 Jetpilot1101

Dear Mr. President,
How does reality feel when it smacks you in the face? The ball is in your court, what are you planning on doing?
v/r
JP1101

Maybe another nice dinner date in Chicago, or another vacation to Hawaii. Michelle and I are tired of being in the White House. Can I get a fist bump?-- Obama

732 Scion9  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 9:30:25pm

re: #730 Scion9

That was the first link on google, but here is the same 80% stat from the NYTimes.
[Link: www.nytimes.com...]

733 cato the elder  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 9:47:08pm

re: #723 tommygum

Sarc not necessary.

Unless it was snark.

It was both.

734 Wendya  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 9:53:55pm

re: #7 Charles

Indeed. They think there won't be any consequences for it.

They also know The Obama will throw their asses under the bus in a heartbeat if he thinks it suits his agenda. That little screw up with Feinstein didn't help Pakistan either.

Everyone is going to position themselves to act as if they were going to have to go it alone. No one expects the USA to honor previous agreements now.

735 funky chicken  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 10:23:06pm

re: #408 Charles

What is Sean Hannity doing promoting these people and their alarmist crap?

Good grief. This is who Sean Hannity just had on his show to rave about secret Muslim terror cells in the US.

Hannity's friends with a bunch of weirdos. G Gordon Liddy? Ted Nugent hurts gun rights every time he goes on a bizarre rant, IMHO. You should hear my father in law talk about Ollie North...they worked together at the Pentagon in the time leading up to the Iran Contra deal. Let's just say the FIL was in a perfect position to know a whole lot about Central America, and knows exactly what part of his testimony was BS...and the BS was all created to save Ollie's ass, not protect Reagan or Weinburger or anybody else.

736 funky chicken  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 10:27:44pm

re: #728 astronmr20

Perhaps, but she doesn't belong on Fox. What's the point?

Fox News is a business, and they produce shows in an effort to get high ratings. I'm not a fan, but I'd rather sit through Sarah and Bristol Palin than another show about Anna Nicole Smith or Natalee Holloway or that poor toddler girl who was killed by her psycho mother.

737 [deleted]  Mon, Feb 16, 2009 10:40:44pm
738 Øyvind Strømmen  Tue, Feb 17, 2009 3:13:58am

Re Charles:

"This didn’t happen during the Bush administration."

Isn't this quite similar to the Waziristan Accord, which could easily be seen as a de facto recognition of the Islamic Emirate of Waziristan, back in 2006?

739 marsl  Tue, Feb 17, 2009 5:26:30am

Next time, the Talibans will be in Islamabad, in a victory parade. And where all those refugees wanting to flee from Pakistan are going? USA, UK and India.

And then the Talibans will demand the return of Kashmir and the withdraw of NATO from Afghanistan... with nuclear weapons....

Perhaps it's time to remove all nuclear weapons from Pakistan control and destroy them. The world would be safer.

740 Randall Gross  Tue, Feb 17, 2009 5:59:23am

Once last note on the Malakand Cave-in, this from Bill Roggio's article:

The Movement for the Implementation of Mohammad's Sharia Law (Tehrik-e-Nifaz-e-Shariat-e-Mohammad or TNSM) is known as the "Pakistani Taliban." This group is behind the ideological inspiration for the Afghan Taliban. The TNSM sent more than 10,000 fighters into Afghanistan to fight US forces during Operation Enduring Freedom in October 2001. Sufi's forces were decimated in US airstrikes and he was arrested after returning to Pakistan. His group was later banned.

The numbers of "soldiers" that were sent was amazing, but they were mostly untrained madrassa students and children at that time, hardened with some of the older mujahadeen from the Soviet invasion days. They went north and west as cannon fodder, and basically were the distraction that allowed Osama Bin Laden to escape from Tora Bora. So Sufi, who Zardari just made peace with, directly aided UBL's escape.

741 Amer-I-Can  Tue, Feb 17, 2009 6:12:03am

re: #3 code red 21

Are you trying to say that the capitulated because of BO?

Or maybe this is a backlash of Feinstein opening her big mouth


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