Where are all these Nirthers coming from? Is there a factory somewhere?
Here’s video of White House Press Secretary Robert Gibbs answering the question, “Is there anything you can say to make the Birthers go away?”
The answer, of course, is “No.”
Near the end he has a little verbal joust with “Lester” — that’s Lester Kinsolving, White House correspondent for Nirther World Headquarters, World Nut Daily.
3 |
vxbush Mon, Jul 27, 2009 1:17:14pm |
Normally Gibbs does not impress me, but he did a better job talking on this topic than on many.
| 5 |
Targetpractice Mon, Jul 27, 2009 1:17:56pm |
Well, of course you're never going to get them to go away. Did the Bush Admin ever successfully get the Troofers to disappear? But have you noticed they've gotten quieter since he left?
| 6 |
Sharmuta Mon, Jul 27, 2009 1:18:04pm |
When can we get a Lizard correspondent in there? I nominate Mandy.
| 7 |
Kragar Mon, Jul 27, 2009 1:18:22pm |
re: #3 vxbush
Normally Gibbs does not impress me, but he did a better job talking on this topic than on many.
Got to take his opponent in the account.
| 8 |
poteen Mon, Jul 27, 2009 1:19:36pm |
| 9 |
vxbush Mon, Jul 27, 2009 1:19:54pm |
re: #7 Kragar (Proud to be Kafir)
Got to take his opponent in the account.
True. Nirthers aren't going to put up a respectable analysis of the situation that Gibbs then has to try to defend against.
| 10 |
Cato the Elder Mon, Jul 27, 2009 1:20:09pm |
re: #6 Sharmuta
When can we get a Lizard correspondent in there? I nominate Mandy.
Yeah, because tossing out f-bombs when you're at a loss for a real argument always makes for exciting press conferences.
| 11 |
Walter L. Newton Mon, Jul 27, 2009 1:20:11pm |
re: #6 Sharmuta
When can we get a Lizard correspondent in there? I nominate Mandy.
I nominate Killgore.
| 13 |
Walter L. Newton Mon, Jul 27, 2009 1:21:34pm |
re: #10 Cato the Elder
Yeah, because tossing out f-bombs when you're at a loss for a real argument always makes for exciting press conferences.
Cato, lighten up a little.
| 14 |
Charles Johnson Mon, Jul 27, 2009 1:21:37pm |
Someone just forwarded this email:
THE NEW WORLD ORDER
with BARON BODISSEY OF "GATES OF VIENNA"
TONIGHT on THE ANDREA SHEA KING SHOW
@ 9 p.m. ET
*
BARON BODISSEY of GATES OF VIENNA
*
[Link: www.blogtalkradio.com...]
*** THE NEW WORLD ORDER ***
Join the highly read and brilliant Baron Bodissey of Gates of Vienna blogsite and me as we discuss "global governance", the EU and how the Bilderburg/Davos crowd is working towards the same goals on both sides of the Atlantic, and how the EU is spearheading the European effort towards world government.
| 15 |
Cato the Elder Mon, Jul 27, 2009 1:21:57pm |
Les Kinsolving is doing it for the ratings. He's a Baltimore home-boy with a contrarian streak a mile wide.
Anyone know how he behaved when Bush was Prez?
| 17 |
Walter L. Newton Mon, Jul 27, 2009 1:22:51pm |
re: #14 Charles
Someone just forwarded this email:
THE NEW WORLD ORDER
with BARON BODISSEY OF "GATES OF VIENNA"TONIGHT on THE ANDREA SHEA KING SHOW
@ 9 p.m. ET
*
BARON BODISSEY of GATES OF VIENNA
*
[Link: www.blogtalkradio.com...]*** THE NEW WORLD ORDER ***
Join the highly read and brilliant Baron Bodissey of Gates of Vienna blogsite and me as we discuss "global governance", the EU and how the Bilderburg/Davos crowd is working towards the same goals on both sides of the Atlantic, and how the EU is spearheading the European effort towards world government.
I have ta work. Start the new world without me.
| 18 |
Eowyn2 Mon, Jul 27, 2009 1:23:12pm |
re: #10 Cato the Elder
Yeah, because tossing out f-bombs when you're at a loss for a real argument always makes for exciting press conferences.
at least we would know the questions are not rehearsed.
| 19 |
Cato the Elder Mon, Jul 27, 2009 1:23:53pm |
| 20 |
DaddyG Mon, Jul 27, 2009 1:24:17pm |
re: #14 Charles My new world overlords are monitoring my blogging. Sorry I can't risk the exposure.
| 21 |
Kosh's Shadow Mon, Jul 27, 2009 1:24:38pm |
re: #14 Charles
Someone just forwarded this email:
THE NEW WORLD ORDER
with BARON BODISSEY OF "GATES OF VIENNA"TONIGHT on THE ANDREA SHEA KING SHOW
@ 9 p.m. ET
*
BARON BODISSEY of GATES OF VIENNA
*
[Link: www.blogtalkradio.com...]*** THE NEW WORLD ORDER ***
Join the highly read and brilliant Baron Bodissey of Gates of Vienna blogsite and me as we discuss "global governance", the EU and how the Bilderburg/Davos crowd is working towards the same goals on both sides of the Atlantic, and how the EU is spearheading the European effort towards world government.
Brave new world odor, there.
Where is Andrea ShrieKing on so I can avoid it?
| 22 |
Targetpractice Mon, Jul 27, 2009 1:24:40pm |
re: #19 Cato the Elder
Meh.
I've heard of widely read and deeply read, but "highly"? What is he smoking?
And why isn't he sharing?
| 23 |
Eowyn2 Mon, Jul 27, 2009 1:24:40pm |
re: #3 vxbush
Normally Gibbs does not impress me, but he did a better job talking on this topic than on many.
kinda like he was expecting it?
| 24 |
sharkjumper Mon, Jul 27, 2009 1:24:43pm |
“Is there anything you can say to make the Birthers go away?”
Yes. Obama's long form, vault copy birth certificate.
As a Nirther who otherwise loves LGF, I assure you that there is nothing we'd love more than to be proven WRONG.
My apologies to Charles for infesting the GOP, but please understand, we Nirthers infest the Demonrat party too.
| 25 |
Fat Bastard Vegetarian Mon, Jul 27, 2009 1:24:49pm |
They obviously exist in large numbers, but I've never met one.
| 28 |
vxbush Mon, Jul 27, 2009 1:25:43pm |
re: #23 Eowyn2
kinda like he was expecting it?
Oh, I wouldn't say that, necessarily. I think it was something he was very comfortable talking about, unlike most of his pressers.
| 29 |
Neutral President Mon, Jul 27, 2009 1:26:00pm |
re: #14 Charles
Kookvergence... or as iDub said, The Wingularity.
| 31 |
CyanSnowHawk Mon, Jul 27, 2009 1:26:43pm |
re: #19 Cato the Elder
Meh.
I've heard of widely read and deeply read, but "highly"? What is he smoking?
Perhaps they have to hold the screen up high so as not to get the effluent they wallow in all over it.
| 32 |
FrogMarch Mon, Jul 27, 2009 1:27:20pm |
While some in the GOP waste time with the nonsense - -Obama and his media are still attempting to cram Government Run Health Insurance down our throats.
Yahoo has this deceptive headline up:
Analysis: Gov't health plan can coexist with private insurers
Bullshit.
| 33 |
Eowyn2 Mon, Jul 27, 2009 1:27:22pm |
Early OT but I have lots of work to do today.
I just caught up on some of the weekend stuff.
I LOVE the temporary time out. Most of us are passionate about our beliefs and thats a good thing, however, oft times, once we are in an escalating verbal exchange, we can get out of hand.
thank you Charles, it really was an inspired idea.
| 34 |
Sharmuta Mon, Jul 27, 2009 1:27:42pm |
"There are 10,000 more important issues for people in this country to discuss..."
I couldn't agree more. Focusing on fantasies paints the gop in the worst light possible. Keep it up, nirthers. You're digging our grave.
| 36 |
MandyManners Mon, Jul 27, 2009 1:28:49pm |
Thanks, you fucking idiots. I am pained to admit that I agree with Gibbs. GO AWAY!
| 37 |
callahan23 Mon, Jul 27, 2009 1:28:53pm |
re: #14 Charles
... Bilderburg/Davos ...
Now that's a new one to me.
How crazy is the fringe gonna get before it reaches boiling point?
Wait, wait I'll answer it myself, their heads have boiled already a loong time ago. They are beyond dumb, they are completely INSANE.
| 38 |
doppelganglander Mon, Jul 27, 2009 1:28:55pm |
re: #14 Charles
Someone just forwarded this email:
THE NEW WORLD ORDER
with BARON BODISSEY OF "GATES OF VIENNA"TONIGHT on THE ANDREA SHEA KING SHOW
@ 9 p.m. ET
*
BARON BODISSEY of GATES OF VIENNA
*
[Link: www.blogtalkradio.com...]*** THE NEW WORLD ORDER ***
Join the highly read and brilliant Baron Bodissey of Gates of Vienna blogsite and me as we discuss "global governance", the EU and how the Bilderburg/Davos crowd is working towards the same goals on both sides of the Atlantic, and how the EU is spearheading the European effort towards world government.
I'm always disappointed in these NWO theories. Nobody ever invites me to join an organization intent on world domination. I suppose it's because I didn't go to an Ivy League school.
| 39 |
calcajun Mon, Jul 27, 2009 1:29:12pm |
re: #14 Charles
I've got some old LP's. Maybe I should start playing them backward for hidden lyrics?
| 40 |
callahan23 Mon, Jul 27, 2009 1:29:26pm |
re: #25 Fat Bastard Vegetarian
They obviously exist in large numbers, but I've never met one.
Count yourself lucky.
| 41 |
subsailor68 Mon, Jul 27, 2009 1:29:27pm |
re: #24 sharkjumper
Over two years to post your first comment and that's it? sharkjumper indeed.
| 42 |
Fat Bastard Vegetarian Mon, Jul 27, 2009 1:29:27pm |
| 43 |
Targetpractice Mon, Jul 27, 2009 1:29:31pm |
re: #24 sharkjumper
“Is there anything you can say to make the Birthers go away?”
Yes. Obama's long form, vault copy birth certificate.
As a Nirther who otherwise loves LGF, I assure you that there is nothing we'd love more than to be proven WRONG.
My apologies to Charles for infesting the GOP, but please understand, we Nirthers infest the Demonrat party too.
And if you were, you'd...what? Say "Sorry for looking like a bunch of loons"? Seriously, why would you all pursue this if not out of some hope that, like the Troofers, it would lead to Obama's downfall and removal from office?
| 44 |
quiet man Mon, Jul 27, 2009 1:29:42pm |
re: #38 doppelganglander
You need a certain cut of the jibe for world domination
| 45 |
MandyManners Mon, Jul 27, 2009 1:29:45pm |
re: #6 Sharmuta
When can we get a Lizard correspondent in there? I nominate Mandy.
Oh, that would be fun.
| 46 |
Spider Mensch Mon, Jul 27, 2009 1:29:50pm |
re: #14 Charles
Someone just forwarded this email:
THE NEW WORLD ORDER
with BARON BODISSEY OF "GATES OF VIENNA"TONIGHT on THE ANDREA SHEA KING SHOW
@ 9 p.m. ET
*
BARON BODISSEY of GATES OF VIENNA
*
[Link: www.blogtalkradio.com...]*** THE NEW WORLD ORDER ***
Join the highly read and brilliant Baron Bodissey of Gates of Vienna blogsite and me as we discuss "global governance", the EU and how the Bilderburg/Davos crowd is working towards the same goals on both sides of the Atlantic, and how the EU is spearheading the European effort towards world government.
didn't they rip that off of wcw wrestling from years ago?? NWO..the new world order!!..had bad guy hulk, and a bunch of other morons? maybe it's the same people? nah... the wrestlers are probably more intelligent...lol
| 47 |
DaddyG Mon, Jul 27, 2009 1:30:11pm |
re: #32 FrogMarch
While some in the GOP waste time with the nonsense - -Obama and his media are still attempting to cram Government Run Health Insurance down our throats.
Yahoo has this deceptive headline up:
Analysis: Gov't health plan can coexist with private insurers
Bullshit.
Coexist like Ticks and Dogs.
| 48 |
Mad Al-Jaffee Mon, Jul 27, 2009 1:30:11pm |
re: #35 ArchangelMichael
They call it nirther Monday,
And Tuesday's just as bad
| 49 |
debutaunt Mon, Jul 27, 2009 1:30:33pm |
re: #38 doppelganglander
I'm always disappointed in these NWO theories. Nobody ever invites me to join an organization intent on world domination. I suppose it's because I didn't go to an Ivy League school.
Yeah, but do you have an approved certificate of proof that you didn't go to an Ivy League school? Do YA?
| 50 |
MandyManners Mon, Jul 27, 2009 1:30:46pm |
re: #14 Charles
Someone just forwarded this email:
THE NEW WORLD ORDER
with BARON BODISSEY OF "GATES OF VIENNA"TONIGHT on THE ANDREA SHEA KING SHOW
@ 9 p.m. ET
*
BARON BODISSEY of GATES OF VIENNA
*
[Link: www.blogtalkradio.com...]*** THE NEW WORLD ORDER ***
Join the highly read and brilliant Baron Bodissey of Gates of Vienna blogsite and me as we discuss "global governance", the EU and how the Bilderburg/Davos crowd is working towards the same goals on both sides of the Atlantic, and how the EU is spearheading the European effort towards world government.
The aliens! They're shape-shifting!1!!!eleventy!
| 51 |
Cato the Elder Mon, Jul 27, 2009 1:31:04pm |
re: #24 sharkjumper
“Is there anything you can say to make the Birthers go away?”
Yes. Obama's long form, vault copy birth certificate.
As a Nirther who otherwise loves LGF, I assure you that there is nothing we'd love more than to be proven WRONG.
My apologies to Charles for infesting the GOP, but please understand, we Nirthers infest the Demonrat party too.
Hmmph.
His first post since joining in 2007.
Anyone wanna bet he doesn't make it to a dozen?
| 52 |
debutaunt Mon, Jul 27, 2009 1:31:28pm |
re: #44 quiet man
You need a certain cut of the jibe for world domination
HAAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHHAAA
| 53 |
DaddyG Mon, Jul 27, 2009 1:32:02pm |
re: #44 quiet man
You need a certain cut of the jibe for world domination
What? Circumcision is required? /
| 54 |
96RoadKing Mon, Jul 27, 2009 1:32:12pm |
Nirthers of the world UNITE!
You have nothing to lose but your dignity!
Oh, wait...too late!
| 55 |
HelloDare Mon, Jul 27, 2009 1:32:15pm |
| 56 |
Sharmuta Mon, Jul 27, 2009 1:32:17pm |
re: #10 Cato the Elder
I highly doubt we'll get an LGF correspondent placed in the White House, so I was just trying to have a little fun.
| 59 |
96RoadKing Mon, Jul 27, 2009 1:32:50pm |
| 60 |
calcajun Mon, Jul 27, 2009 1:33:04pm |
| 61 |
Creeping Eruption Mon, Jul 27, 2009 1:33:05pm |
| 62 |
debutaunt Mon, Jul 27, 2009 1:33:21pm |
| 63 |
quiet man Mon, Jul 27, 2009 1:33:22pm |
re: #53 DaddyG
I think it was Magellean who first circumsized the earth..
and used the remains as a sail or tarp or some such
| 64 |
callahan23 Mon, Jul 27, 2009 1:33:25pm |
re: #24 sharkjumper
Friggin' hell ...
EXCUSE not me , excuse the whole world for your intellect. Or lack thereof.
| 65 |
FrogMarch Mon, Jul 27, 2009 1:33:36pm |
re: #47 DaddyG
Coexist like Ticks and Dogs.
Coexist at first - but stealth single payer is the real game plan. The lies that are flying around are just too much.
Obama’s Misleading Medicine. “If you listen to President Obama, his ‘reform’ will satisfy almost everyone. It will insure the uninsured, control runaway health spending, subdue future budget deficits, preserve choice for patients and improve quality of care. These claims are self-serving exaggerations and political fantasies. They have destroyed what should be a serious national discussion of health care.”
| 66 |
doppelganglander Mon, Jul 27, 2009 1:33:38pm |
re: #49 debutaunt
Yeah, but do you have an approved certificate of proof that you didn't go to an Ivy League school? Do YA?
I've got a certificate that I went to a decidedly non-Ivy school - a diploma, actually.
As a matter of fact, I cannot produce an original birth certificate either. I was adopted, and when the adoption was finalized my original birth certificate was sealed and I got a brand spankin' new one with my new name and the names of my adoptive parents. The date is more than 15 months after my actual birth. Orly Taitz could have a good time with that, I'm sure.
| 67 |
MandyManners Mon, Jul 27, 2009 1:33:39pm |
re: #24 sharkjumper
“Is there anything you can say to make the Birthers go away?”
Yes. Obama's long form, vault copy birth certificate.
As a Nirther who otherwise loves LGF, I assure you that there is nothing we'd love more than to be proven WRONG.
My apologies to Charles for infesting the GOP, but please understand, we Nirthers infest the Demonrat party too.
Infest? Do you know what I do to infestations around here?
*WHACK*
| 68 |
Erik The Red Mon, Jul 27, 2009 1:33:43pm |
re: #24 sharkjumper
“Is there anything you can say to make the Birthers go away?”
Yes. Obama's long form, vault copy birth certificate.
As a Nirther who otherwise loves LGF, I assure you that there is nothing we'd love more than to be proven WRONG.
My apologies to Charles for infesting the GOP, but please understand, we Nirthers infest the Demonrat party too.
Welcome to LGF. Great first post. Carry on we need a new chew toy.
| 70 |
Mad Al-Jaffee Mon, Jul 27, 2009 1:33:56pm |
| 71 |
Sharmuta Mon, Jul 27, 2009 1:34:12pm |
re: #24 sharkjumper
“Is there anything you can say to make the Birthers go away?”
Yes. Obama's long form, vault copy birth certificate.
As a Nirther who otherwise loves LGF, I assure you that there is nothing we'd love more than to be proven WRONG.
My apologies to Charles for infesting the GOP, but please understand, we Nirthers infest the Demonrat party too.
The burden of proof is on you. What evidence do you have to present that calls into question the veracity of the certified short form?
| 72 |
Eowyn2 Mon, Jul 27, 2009 1:34:18pm |
re: #24 sharkjumper
“Is there anything you can say to make the Birthers go away?”
Yes. Obama's long form, vault copy birth certificate.
As a Nirther who otherwise loves LGF, I assure you that there is nothing we'd love more than to be proven WRONG.
My apologies to Charles for infesting the GOP, but please understand, we Nirthers infest the Demonrat party too.
Having seen Obama's 'fake' copy of certification of live birth and my 'really from the State' copy of certification of live birth, I have to say that they are eerily similar and are not even from the same state.
IF this were a fake birth certificate, I would guess the following would have occured by now:
Every Hawaiin Republican would produce 'real' birth certificates which show the difference.
Hillary would have been the Dem nominee - she would never allow herself to be relegated to Sec of State and she would have dug until she found the proof needed - I'm sure she dug until all channels were lost. Think of the lawyers that landed on AK.
Even if you would prefer to believe that Obama isn't a citizen of the USA, you have to admit that his oposition in the primaries would have skewered him if it were true.
| 73 |
Neutral President Mon, Jul 27, 2009 1:34:19pm |
| 74 |
calcajun Mon, Jul 27, 2009 1:34:22pm |
re: #63 quiet man
I think it was Magellean who first circumsized the earth..
and used the remains as a sail or tarp or some such
And his crew made it home by the skin of their teeth.
Ew.
| 75 |
Kenneth Mon, Jul 27, 2009 1:34:29pm |
re: #14 Charles
Just curious, but what the heck is he the "Baron" of? It's hard to take seriously somebody who refers to himself as "Baron".
| 76 |
Cato the Elder Mon, Jul 27, 2009 1:34:31pm |
| 77 |
Creeping Eruption Mon, Jul 27, 2009 1:34:40pm |
re: #57 ArchangelMichael
Friday will be Hawaiian Cert Day...
Mmmm . . .I thought the Rop'ers got Friday for Seethe Day, celebrated in some locales with car-b-q's, no?
| 78 |
Charles Johnson Mon, Jul 27, 2009 1:34:49pm |
re: #24 sharkjumper
Wow, waited 2 years to post its first comment. Our sleeper of the day.
| 79 |
J.S. Mon, Jul 27, 2009 1:35:00pm |
hmm...I'm wondering if this is not the consequence of CNN's Lou Dobbs? If it were confined to the WorldNutDaily, well, that's one thing...but, now, this sheer idiocy has gone mainstream (and that's thanks to Dobbs?)
| 80 |
debutaunt Mon, Jul 27, 2009 1:35:22pm |
re: #66 doppelganglander
I've got a certificate that I went to a decidedly non-Ivy school - a diploma, actually.
As a matter of fact, I cannot produce an original birth certificate either. I was adopted, and when the adoption was finalized my original birth certificate was sealed and I got a brand spankin' new one with my new name and the names of my adoptive parents. The date is more than 15 months after my actual birth. Orly Taitz could have a good time with that, I'm sure.
I think we all are casting a glance of suspicion and unease over this frightening information. Who are you?
| 81 |
Fat Bastard Vegetarian Mon, Jul 27, 2009 1:35:39pm |
re: #78 Charles
The patience of Job.
Or the patience of someone who is really patient.
I'm actually impressed that someone could wait that long.
| 82 |
doppelganglander Mon, Jul 27, 2009 1:35:44pm |
| 83 |
nikis-knight Mon, Jul 27, 2009 1:35:58pm |
re: #75 Kenneth
Just curious, but what the heck is he the "Baron" of? It's hard to take seriously somebody who refers to himself as "Baron".
Really? Okay, I'll stop suggesting we name our firstborn Baron Von.
| 84 |
Eowyn2 Mon, Jul 27, 2009 1:36:02pm |
re: #37 callahan23
Now that's a new one to me.
How crazy is the fringe gonna get before it reaches boiling point?
Wait, wait I'll answer it myself, their heads have boiled already a loong time ago. They are beyond dumb, they are completely INSANE.
There is a line between obsession and insanity.
Obsessed people can still deal sanely with everything but their obsession.
| 85 |
Targetpractice Mon, Jul 27, 2009 1:36:05pm |
re: #78 Charles
Wow, waited 2 years to post its first comment. Our sleeper of the day.
"The sleeper has awakened!"
| 86 |
Walter L. Newton Mon, Jul 27, 2009 1:36:26pm |
re: #75 Kenneth
Just curious, but what the heck is he the "Baron" of? It's hard to take seriously somebody who refers to himself as "Baron".
It's a legitimate first name, so, maybe that's his first name. Such as Sascha Baron Cohen.
| 87 |
Creeping Eruption Mon, Jul 27, 2009 1:36:28pm |
re: #70 Mad Al-Jaffee
I guess that would make more sense.
No Prob. I'm sure T-Bone would forgive the pun.
| 88 |
calcajun Mon, Jul 27, 2009 1:36:29pm |
re: #69 buzzsawmonkey
If anyone can find Peter Cook's brilliant routine about the World Domination League that he has formed, please, please post it.
If there's one thing I can't bear, it's when hundreds of old men come creeping in through the window in the middle of the night and throw all manner of garbage all over me. I can't bear that. I think that's unbearable. Ghastly old men, with great pails of garbage, throwing it all over me. I don't think it should be allowed, I think there should be a place for those people to go. And I don't think it should be my room. I'd vote for any party that would say, "I won't allow people to throw garbage all over me". But none of the parties seem to be particularly interested. That's why I formed the World Domination League. It's a wonderful league, the World Domination League. The aims, as published in the manifesto, are total domination of the world by 1958. That's what we're planning to do. We've had to revise it - we're hoping to bring a new manifesto out with a more realistic target. How we aim to go about it is as follows: we shall move about into people's rooms and say, "Excuse me, we are the World Domination League - may we dominate you?" Then, if they say "Get out", of course we give up.
There's been some wonderful dominators in history, you know. Attila was one. He was a wonderful dominator. Attila the Nun. He had a Gothic Horde, you know. A wonderful Gothic Horde, and he used to move about entire countries and strangle people completely to death. And then, when everybody woke up, they'd see a little note pinned to their chest, saying: "You've been dominated. Ha, ha. Attila the Nun."
Hitler was a very peculiar person, wasn't he. He was another dominator, you know, Hitler. And he was a wonderful ballroom dancer. Not many people know that, he was a wonderful little dancer, he used to waltz around with a number "8" on his back. The only trouble was, he was very short, and people used to shout out to him when he was dancing, and say, "Wie kurz du bist - how short you are!" And this of course enraged Hitler. He flew into a tantrum, and he gave up ballroom dancing, and took up wholesale raping and pillaging instead.
Of course, Mrs Hitler was a charming woman, wasn't she - Mrs Hitler, a lovely woman - she's still alive, you know. I saw her down the Edgware Road only the other day. She'd just popped into the chemist's to buy something, and I saw her sign the cheque, "Mrs Hitler". So I knew it was she. I tried to go up and talk to her, but she slipped away into the crowd. I was hoping she'd be able to come to the next meeting of the World Domination League.
Peter Cook
| 89 |
Sharmuta Mon, Jul 27, 2009 1:36:33pm |
re: #14 Charles
I wasn't sure who that lady was so I looked it up. Her eyes kind of say it all for me. Yikes.
| 91 |
quiet man Mon, Jul 27, 2009 1:36:38pm |
The woods are lovely dark and deep, but I have promises to keep and miles to go before I sleep
Miles to go before you sleep
| 92 |
Fat Bastard Vegetarian Mon, Jul 27, 2009 1:37:12pm |
He might have jumped the shark, but obviously landed right in the tank.
One post.
A disposable nic.
| 93 |
96RoadKing Mon, Jul 27, 2009 1:37:31pm |
re: #66 doppelganglander
The date is more than 15 months after my actual birth. Orly Taitz could have a good time with that, I'm sure.
How does that affect your Social Security Activation Date? Will you have to wait an additional 15 months to hit retirement? Bummer.
| 94 |
Kenneth Mon, Jul 27, 2009 1:37:36pm |
re: #69 buzzsawmonkey
[Link: www.geocities.com...]
| 95 |
HelloDare Mon, Jul 27, 2009 1:37:40pm |
Andrea Shea King writes for Andrew Breitbart at Big Hollywood, unfortunately.
Don't stare too long at her picture. Those eyes ... those eyes ... soon you will believe in the New World Order, too.
| 97 |
CyanSnowHawk Mon, Jul 27, 2009 1:38:03pm |
re: #30 quiet man
So long!!
I don't think that simply admitting Nirtherness is enough to get banned. Try defending it and it's a different story.
Myself, I think there was a different reason to withhold it during the campaign. It was not uncommon for the parents religion to be included on such a document. What do you think would have happened to his nomination if it said Muslim? The rumors about that were rampant enough without that kind of circumstantial corroboration.
Withholding it, if it is still in existence, has provided an unexpected bonanza of distraction for some of his most vociferous opponents.
| 98 |
Charles Johnson Mon, Jul 27, 2009 1:38:14pm |
Andrea Shea King was featured here last week for promoting revolution at her blog:
[Link: littlegreenfootballs.com...]
| 99 |
Charpete67 Mon, Jul 27, 2009 1:38:16pm |
re: #24 sharkjumper
“Is there anything you can say to make the Birthers go away?”
Yes. Obama's long form, vault copy birth certificate.
As a Nirther who otherwise loves LGF, I assure you that there is nothing we'd love more than to be proven WRONG.
My apologies to Charles for infesting the GOP, but please understand, we Nirthers infest the Demonrat party too.
Hillary Clinton...if she can't find it, nobody can.
| 100 |
MandyManners Mon, Jul 27, 2009 1:38:16pm |
re: #75 Kenneth
Just curious, but what the heck is he the "Baron" of? It's hard to take seriously somebody who refers to himself as "Baron".
Well, I'm the Duchess of Earl.
| 101 |
doppelganglander Mon, Jul 27, 2009 1:38:22pm |
re: #80 debutaunt
I think we all are casting a glance of suspicion and unease over this frightening information. Who are you?
Why, I'm - well, er, I'm actually - you see, I - let me be clear...
WHERE'S MY TELEPROMPTER!?!
| 102 |
Sharmuta Mon, Jul 27, 2009 1:38:40pm |
re: #98 Charles
Andrea Shea King was featured here last week for promoting revolution at her blog:
[Link: littlegreenfootballs.com...]
Thanks- I thought it sounded familiar.
| 103 |
Alaska Kim Mon, Jul 27, 2009 1:38:47pm |
re: #68 Erik The Red
Welcome to LGF. Great first post. Carry on we need a new chew toy.
"chew toy?"
that was funny!
| 104 |
servo cicero Mon, Jul 27, 2009 1:38:47pm |
Usually a lurker, but this is getting out of hand. With all of the ammunition Conservatives, Independents, and others have to use against this administration, why do they have to go and make sh*t up? It may be that if the Nirther's conspiracy is true (which in their minds, I truly think they believe it), then he's out without a fight.
But, the problem is, this is made up crap, and we can't "beat" this current trend with a quick fix made up in someone's basement. It's going to take effort to battle back against this administrations agenda. And we need to fight back on the issues that count, and that we actually disagree with. What we don't need to be doing is going around, making things up, and screaming like a 3 year old.
It makes all the valid disagreements harder to take seriously.
| 105 |
Kosh's Shadow Mon, Jul 27, 2009 1:39:04pm |
| 106 |
Digital Display Mon, Jul 27, 2009 1:39:10pm |
re: #78 Charles
Wow, waited 2 years to post its first comment. Our sleeper of the day.
That is close to a record isn't it?
| 107 |
DaddyG Mon, Jul 27, 2009 1:39:16pm |
re: #65 FrogMarch
I was pondering this earlier...
As a community organizer and a state senator Obama could address the grievences of his constituents using the largesse of more affluent government and non-government agencies. He never had to deal with limited resources or a balanced budget. Now that he represents the largest charitable organization of all (The USA) there is no longer a big sugar daddy waiting to pay for all of the largesse he is doling out.
He's never had to compromise on spending other peoples money. Now his old habits are coming up against the reality that there is no one else to bail his plans out except our children's children. And they aren't organized enough (physically or politically) to put up a protest.
| 108 |
Kenneth Mon, Jul 27, 2009 1:39:25pm |
re: #86 Walter L. Newton
Not in this case. It's a nic, and his side-kick goes by the name "the Baroness"
| 109 |
sharkjumper Mon, Jul 27, 2009 1:39:53pm |
re: #92 Fat Bastard Vegetarian
Make that two.
Sorry for being late to the party. I've never needed to post because you guys had been doing such a great job until now.
| 110 |
Neutral President Mon, Jul 27, 2009 1:39:53pm |
re: #95 HelloDare
Her nom de keyboard is a play on a nirthquake fault.
| 111 |
Cato the Elder Mon, Jul 27, 2009 1:39:56pm |
Sleepers, awaken!
The night has gone and taken
Your darkest fears and left you here.
And the sun it shines so clear.
Awake, for the world looks wonderful.
For XLVIII Cato Points, name that band!
| 112 |
Digital Display Mon, Jul 27, 2009 1:40:02pm |
re: #103 Alaska Kim
"chew toy?"
that was funny!
Hiya Kim! Heard it's warm up there...Hope you are well
| 114 |
sharkjumper Mon, Jul 27, 2009 1:40:42pm |
re: #112 HoosierHoops
Oh and yeah, feel free to chew THIS, biotch.
| 115 |
Sharmuta Mon, Jul 27, 2009 1:41:02pm |
re: #86 Walter L. Newton
It's a legitimate first name, so, maybe that's his first name. Such as Sascha Baron Cohen.
No- he got outed about a week ago or so. It's not his name.
| 116 |
Cato the Elder Mon, Jul 27, 2009 1:41:02pm |
re: #75 Kenneth
Just curious, but what the heck is he the "Baron" of? It's hard to take seriously somebody who refers to himself as "Baron".
He used to go by The Duck of Death, but he got promoted.
| 117 |
doppelganglander Mon, Jul 27, 2009 1:41:07pm |
re: #93 96RoadKing
How does that affect your Social Security Activation Date? Will you have to wait an additional 15 months to hit retirement? Bummer.
Nope, I use my real birthdate. It's just the date of issue that's much later (compared to the usual 3-4 days). Believe me, if I could shave a year or two off my age, I'd do it.
| 118 |
sharkjumper Mon, Jul 27, 2009 1:41:16pm |
re: #114 sharkjumper
Oh and yeah, feel free to chew THIS, biotch.
Oops sorry not meant for you, not used to this forum.
| 119 |
BARACK THE VOTE Mon, Jul 27, 2009 1:41:22pm |
re: #29 ArchangelMichael
Kookvergence... or as iDub said, The Wingularity.
Dang... Kookvergence is way better!
with admiration, iDub
| 121 |
VegasRick Mon, Jul 27, 2009 1:41:43pm |
| 122 |
Honorary Yooper Mon, Jul 27, 2009 1:41:44pm |
re: #14 Charles
Someone just forwarded this email:
THE NEW WORLD ORDER
with BARON BODISSEY OF "GATES OF VIENNA"TONIGHT on THE ANDREA SHEA KING SHOW
@ 9 p.m. ET
*
BARON BODISSEY of GATES OF VIENNA
*
[Link: www.blogtalkradio.com...]*** THE NEW WORLD ORDER ***
Join the highly read and brilliant Baron Bodissey of Gates of Vienna blogsite and me as we discuss "global governance", the EU and how the Bilderburg/Davos crowd is working towards the same goals on both sides of the Atlantic, and how the EU is spearheading the European effort towards world government.
Holy crap. I see Bodissey and Dymphna are getting deeper and deeper into the conspiracy shit. Seeing their post made me do this.
| 123 |
Alaska Kim Mon, Jul 27, 2009 1:41:53pm |
re: #112 HoosierHoops
Hiya Kim! Heard it's warm up there...Hope you are well
Good Gawd, it's been in the 80's here. I'm pretty sure I'm going to DIE!
Kind of a sad day too without Sarah around anymore.
| 124 |
debutaunt Mon, Jul 27, 2009 1:42:35pm |
| 126 |
callahan23 Mon, Jul 27, 2009 1:42:45pm |
re: #75 Kenneth
Just curious, but what the heck is he the "Baron" of? It's hard to take seriously somebody who refers to himself as "Baron".
I distrust anyone born with a perceived birthright that puts him above the rest of us.
If those rights where emplaced I'd hate them. And I despise anyone who thinks it an honor to use a name of nobility especially if she/he bought or stole that title.
There is nothing honorable in nobility, period.
| 127 |
doppelganglander Mon, Jul 27, 2009 1:42:46pm |
re: #104 servo cicero
You should de-lurk more often.
| 128 |
calcajun Mon, Jul 27, 2009 1:43:10pm |
re: #108 Kenneth
Not in this case. It's a nic, and his side-kick goes by the name "the Baroness"
I thought she wasn't into those kinds of games anymore?/
Jimmy James:
"Beth you've got to be careful investing. The Market can be a harsh mistress."
Beth:
So can I, but I don't want earn money that way anymore.
| 129 |
Sabba Hillel Mon, Jul 27, 2009 1:43:24pm |
Looking at the arguments and fulminating on all sides, it seems as if the Obama side is doing all that they can to continue the Nirther "dispute". I have no idea what is going on or what can or can not be proven, however, it was very easy to get a photostat of my official birth certificate. From the way things are going, it is as if he just wants people to concentrate on this and that way avoid being hit by all the other problems that he is causing.
| 130 |
Cato the Elder Mon, Jul 27, 2009 1:43:48pm |
re: #115 Sharmuta
No- he got outed about a week ago or so. It's not his name.
Who got outed? Cohen or Bodissey?
| 132 |
Digital Display Mon, Jul 27, 2009 1:44:07pm |
re: #114 sharkjumper
Was I talking to you? Do we have an issue here little boy?
| 134 |
Honorary Yooper Mon, Jul 27, 2009 1:44:28pm |
re: #114 sharkjumper
Damn, you fit your nic well.
| 136 |
Alaska Kim Mon, Jul 27, 2009 1:44:33pm |
| 137 |
Walter L. Newton Mon, Jul 27, 2009 1:44:58pm |
re: #115 Sharmuta
No- he got outed about a week ago or so. It's not his name.
Didn't know that. Then yes, it's certainly a bit pretentious, or very juvenile.
| 138 |
Fat Bastard Vegetarian Mon, Jul 27, 2009 1:45:05pm |
re: #109 sharkjumper
Ugh... and he/she responded to me.
"Sell crazy someplace else, we're all stocked up here."
| 139 |
MandyManners Mon, Jul 27, 2009 1:45:24pm |
re: #132 HoosierHoops
Was I talking to you? Do we have an issue here little boy?
Issue? Hell, he seems to have the whole subscription.
| 140 |
Charles Johnson Mon, Jul 27, 2009 1:45:31pm |
The name "Baron Bodissey" comes from a character in the science fiction novels of Jack Vance.
| 142 |
debutaunt Mon, Jul 27, 2009 1:45:44pm |
re: #132 HoosierHoops
Was I talking to you? Do we have an issue here little boy?
S.J. Who else have those initials?
| 143 |
BARACK THE VOTE Mon, Jul 27, 2009 1:45:44pm |
re: #76 Cato the Elder
Adjust upwards in volume by about thirty sizes and add a cutout in the collar to accommodate a goiter, and I suspect you may be right.
Oh god, this is killing! me with laughter...
Welcome back Cato, I hope you had a great holiday.
(still laughing btw)
| 144 |
calcajun Mon, Jul 27, 2009 1:45:51pm |
re: #118 sharkjumper
Howls of derisive laughter be heaped upon you.
Though our ways may seem strange at first...
| 145 |
Sharmuta Mon, Jul 27, 2009 1:46:06pm |
re: #130 Cato the Elder
Who got outed? Cohen or Bodissey?
Baron. I'm not sure if it's cool for me to post his name here, but needless to say- he works with Paul Belien. I'm sure that's a shock to you. ;)
| 146 |
jill e Mon, Jul 27, 2009 1:46:08pm |
You say you want a revolution
Well, you know
We all want to change the world
You tell me that it's evolution
Well, you know
We all want to change the world
But when you talk about destruction
Don't you know that you can count me out
Don't you know it's gonna be all right
all right, all right
You say you got a real solution
Well, you know
We'd all love to see the plan
You ask me for a contribution
Well, you know
We're doing what we can
But when you want money
for people with minds that hate
All I can tell is brother you have to wait
Don't you know it's gonna be all right
all right, all right
Ah
You say you'll change the constitution
Well, you know
We all want to change your head
You tell me it's the institution
Well, you know
You better free you mind instead
But if you go carrying pictures of chairman Mao
You ain't going to make it with anyone anyhow
Don't you know it's gonna be all right
all right, all right
all right, all right, all right
all right, all right, all right
| 147 |
MandyManners Mon, Jul 27, 2009 1:46:32pm |
re: #118 sharkjumper
Oops sorry not meant for you, not used to this forum.
Do you need instructions to get out of the bed in the morning? A note to tell you which way is down?
| 148 |
Targetpractice Mon, Jul 27, 2009 1:47:09pm |
re: #118 sharkjumper
Oops sorry not meant for you, not used to this forum.
So, you wait two years to first come out as a nirther, then start barking at anything that looks at your strange.
Oh yeah, you've got a long, bright future here.
///
| 150 |
theuglydougling Mon, Jul 27, 2009 1:47:35pm |
The moment Obama authorizes the release of his long form, the Nirthers will only get worse. They will say, "Why is he suddenly so agreeable to this?" "Why the sudden change of heart?" "It must be because he finally has a credible forgery on hand!" etc, etc.
Just as with Troofers no amount of evidence in the world is enough.
| 152 |
Fat Bastard Vegetarian Mon, Jul 27, 2009 1:47:49pm |
re: #146 jill e
My pastor wants me to sing that song in church... Beatles' version... and blow the place out.
I askeered!
| 153 |
Eowyn2 Mon, Jul 27, 2009 1:47:53pm |
re: #100 MandyManners
Well, I'm the Duchess of Earl.
You'll be the Dowager Duchess of Earl when the Duke kicks the bucket and the Viscount moves his viscontess into the earldom.
| 154 |
Ward Cleaver Mon, Jul 27, 2009 1:48:02pm |
re: #4 taxfreekiller
Big ass misdirection head fake to cover up the Obama mishandling of
the health care deal and to hide the upcoming amnesty he and Pelosi
are cooking up in the back yard out of sight.
Sadly with the help of WND.
| 155 |
Honorary Yooper Mon, Jul 27, 2009 1:48:04pm |
re: #130 Cato the Elder
Who got outed? Cohen or Bodissey?
Bodissey. Baron Bodissey is none other than Edward S. "Ned" May of the International Free Press Society, a group which has Paul Belien of the Bussels Journal as Vice President. Mr. May is the Outreach Coordinator for the IFPS.
| 156 |
Creeping Eruption Mon, Jul 27, 2009 1:48:21pm |
re: #149 zombie
The dhimmification proceeds:
Check out the pictures.
I was so hoping that you were linking to the Onion.
| 157 |
Cato the Elder Mon, Jul 27, 2009 1:48:22pm |
re: #145 Sharmuta
Baron. I'm not sure if it's cool for me to post his name here, but needless to say- he works with Paul Belien. I'm sure that's a shock to you. ;)
I'm staggered. Must take a tranquillizer! Here I thought he was an aristocrat, because being an aristocrat gives real weight to your pontifications.
Just ask Prince Charles.
| 158 |
Digital Display Mon, Jul 27, 2009 1:48:27pm |
re: #136 Alaska Kim
**snort!**
so anywoo..I heard it was hot up there...I hope your family is well...
kind Regards Kim
| 159 |
Targetpractice Mon, Jul 27, 2009 1:48:47pm |
re: #149 zombie
The dhimmification proceeds:
Check out the pictures.
What are they more worried about: That a Muslim man might be offended by a woman in a position of authority talking down to him or that Muslim men are stupid enough to strike an authority figure simply for the crime of being a woman?
| 160 |
DaddyG Mon, Jul 27, 2009 1:49:12pm |
What are they required to show sensitivity to strippers in nudie bars? /
re: #149 zombie
The dhimmification proceeds:
Check out the pictures.
| 161 |
VegasRick Mon, Jul 27, 2009 1:49:19pm |
re: #149 zombie
The dhimmification proceeds:
Check out the pictures.
I am going to invest in bulletproof burqua stocks.
| 162 |
BARACK THE VOTE Mon, Jul 27, 2009 1:49:24pm |
re: #150 theuglydougling
The moment Obama authorizes the release of his long form, the Nirthers will only get worse. They will say, "Why is he suddenly so agreeable to this?" "Why the sudden change of heart?" "It must be because he finally has a credible forgery on hand!" etc, etc.
Just as with Troofers no amount of evidence in the world is enough.
It will never, ever end. Nothing he could release could ever be enough.
BTW, shamelessly poaching this, best comment I've seen about this:
I have two predictions:
1) Someone like Ross Douthat will say that birferism is somehow liberals’ fault, the same way it was liberals’ fault for killing the George Tiller by supporting reproductive rights.
2) Birther opposition will be used as a sign of credibility by wingnuts when the next whacky rumor crops up, e.g. “I’m not a conspiracy theorist, I speak as someone who strongly opposed the birthers when I say that the footage of Obama fathering an alien baby looks very real to me.”
| 163 |
Alaska Kim Mon, Jul 27, 2009 1:49:31pm |
re: #158 HoosierHoops
so anywoo..I heard it was hot up there...I hope your family is well...
kind Regards Kim
yep. in the 80's.
| 164 |
MandyManners Mon, Jul 27, 2009 1:49:41pm |
| 165 |
jaunte Mon, Jul 27, 2009 1:49:45pm |
A couple of Baron Bodissey (Jack Vance) quotes:
"[On religious wars] of all wars, these are the most detestable, since they are waged for no tangible gain, but only to impose a set of arbitrary credos on another."
"The malefactor becomes the creature of his own deeds."
| 166 |
Honorary Yooper Mon, Jul 27, 2009 1:50:00pm |
re: #145 Sharmuta
Baron. I'm not sure if it's cool for me to post his name here, but needless to say- he works with Paul Belien. I'm sure that's a shock to you. ;)
It's a tangled web from the GoV to the IFPS to the VB.
| 167 |
opnion Mon, Jul 27, 2009 1:50:01pm |
re: #129 Sabba Hillel
Looking at the arguments and fulminating on all sides, it seems as if the Obama side is doing all that they can to continue the Nirther "dispute". I have no idea what is going on or what can or can not be proven, however, it was very easy to get a photostat of my official birth certificate. From the way things are going, it is as if he just wants people to concentrate on this and that way avoid being hit by all the other problems that he is causing.
The Republican Party should really distance themselves from all of this.
Nothing good can come from it. They do not need to go all slobering about it, like McCain did at his rally during the campaign, but they need to get some distance.
| 168 |
doppelganglander Mon, Jul 27, 2009 1:50:12pm |
re: #149 zombie
The dhimmification proceeds:
Check out the pictures.
I would resign before I would be made a second-class citizen in my own country.
| 169 |
zombie Mon, Jul 27, 2009 1:50:20pm |
re: #156 Creeping Eruption
I was so hoping that you were linking to the Onion.
Sorry -- it's a real news article in a real newspaper.
Do the cops go nude when they investigate a crime at a nudist colony?
Do the cops wear yarmulkes when entering an Orthodox Jewish home?
Do the cops dress like fetish cops at the Folsom Street Fair? (Oh wait -- they do. Retract that one.)
| 170 |
CynicalConservative Mon, Jul 27, 2009 1:50:23pm |
| 171 |
CyanSnowHawk Mon, Jul 27, 2009 1:50:23pm |
re: #113 quiet man
the down dings show otherwise.
Unpopularity will not get you the stick. (ie. Spacejesus) It is not a classic indicator of longevity around here, however.
| 172 |
HelloDare Mon, Jul 27, 2009 1:50:29pm |
Anagrams for Baron Bodissey:
Rabid Bossy OneAbsorbed Noisy
| 173 |
MandyManners Mon, Jul 27, 2009 1:50:30pm |
re: #149 zombie
The dhimmification proceeds:
Check out the pictures.
I can see her bangs.
STONE HER!
| 174 |
Creeping Eruption Mon, Jul 27, 2009 1:50:33pm |
re: #160 DaddyG
What are they required to show sensitivity to strippers in nudie bars? /
Mrs Roberts said: 'It recognises and respects the cultural and religious practices of our communities.
If that is the case . . .
| 175 |
quiet man Mon, Jul 27, 2009 1:50:35pm |
Dept issued Hibabs...
Now here is an opportunity!!
| 176 |
Walter L. Newton Mon, Jul 27, 2009 1:50:38pm |
re: #157 Cato the Elder
I'm staggered. Must take a tranquillizer! Here I thought he was an aristocrat, because being an aristocrat gives real weight to your pontifications.
Just ask Prince Charles.
I've never heard Charles refer to himself as "Prince?"
| 177 |
experiencedtraveller Mon, Jul 27, 2009 1:51:08pm |
re: #149 zombie
The dhimmification proceeds:
Check out the pictures.
The next time I'm arrested by a female police officer I'll insist she wears a bikini.
| 178 |
Cato the Elder Mon, Jul 27, 2009 1:51:13pm |
re: #155 Honorary Yooper
Bodissey. Baron Bodissey is none other than Edward S. "Ned" May of the International Free Press Society, a group which has Paul Belien of the Bussels Journal as Vice President. Mr. May is the Outreach Coordinator for the IFPS.
And let me guess - Dymphna is his online girlfriend but they've never met in person?
| 179 |
MandyManners Mon, Jul 27, 2009 1:51:16pm |
re: #153 Eowyn2
You'll be the Dowager Duchess of Earl when the Duke kicks the bucket and the Viscount moves his viscontess into the earldom.
*head spins*
| 180 |
Honorary Yooper Mon, Jul 27, 2009 1:51:21pm |
re: #171 CyanSnowHawk
Unpopularity will not get you the stick. (ie. Spacejesus) It is not a classic indicator of longevity around here, however.
How he hangs on is a mystery somedays, but he's merely unpopular at times. He has yet to insult the host nor to act like a complete jerk troll.
| 181 |
calcajun Mon, Jul 27, 2009 1:51:37pm |
re: #120 buzzsawmonkey
Dudley Moore: Y-e-s-s, indeed. Do you feel you've learnt by your mistakes here?
Peter Cook: I think I have, yes, and I think I can probably repeat them almost
perfectly. I know my mistakes inside out.
| 182 |
Cato the Elder Mon, Jul 27, 2009 1:51:47pm |
re: #176 Walter L. Newton
I've never heard Charles refer to himself as "Prince?"
We do it behind his back for Lizard Points...
| 184 |
BARACK THE VOTE Mon, Jul 27, 2009 1:51:51pm |
re: #176 Walter L. Newton
I've never heard Charles refer to himself as "Prince?"
Well, he used to, but now he prefers an unpronouncable symbol instead.
| 185 |
Sharmuta Mon, Jul 27, 2009 1:51:53pm |
re: #157 Cato the Elder
I'm staggered. Must take a tranquillizer! Here I thought he was an aristocrat, because being an aristocrat gives real weight to your pontifications.
Just ask Prince Charles.
I just emailed the info on our little fascist friend to you and medaura, so check your email. You can go to the International Free Press Society web site to verify the connection to Belien.
| 187 |
Fat Bastard Vegetarian Mon, Jul 27, 2009 1:52:32pm |
re: #153 Eowyn2
You'll be the Dowager Duchess of Earl when the Duke kicks the bucket and the Viscount moves his viscontess into the earldom.
Is that during the rectification of the Vuldrinai, or after?...
| 188 |
DaddyG Mon, Jul 27, 2009 1:52:37pm |
re: #176 Walter L. Newton
I've never heard Charles refer to himself as "Prince?"
For a while he went as "The regent formerly known as Prince" then as a weird symbol that looked a bit like the royal crest. He's finally gone back to his original title and started selling albums out of Herrods department store. /
| 190 |
Sharmuta Mon, Jul 27, 2009 1:52:47pm |
re: #184 iceweasel
Well, he used to, but now he prefers an unpronouncable symbol instead.
The blogger formerly know as...?
| 191 |
Targetpractice Mon, Jul 27, 2009 1:53:00pm |
re: #176 Walter L. Newton
I've never heard Charles refer to himself as "Prince?"
I thought we addressed him as "Overlord"?
| 192 |
NelsFree Mon, Jul 27, 2009 1:53:11pm |
re: #24 sharkjumper
Karma: -31
Registered since: Jul 5, 2007 at 5:43 pm
(Logged in)
No. of comments posted: 5
No. of links posted: 0
Welcome to...to the Machine!
It's raining here, I've lost power twice, and the paramedic SUV just sped by, lights and siren displaying legal assertiveness for all to see. Still, I'll go light the grille. Who's got popcorn?
| 194 |
Creeping Eruption Mon, Jul 27, 2009 1:53:16pm |
| 195 |
Kragar Mon, Jul 27, 2009 1:53:23pm |
re: #187 Fat Bastard Vegetarian
Is that during the rectification of the Vuldrinai, or after?...
After, it'll be easier to cut thru the red tape and get permits then.
| 196 |
MandyManners Mon, Jul 27, 2009 1:53:27pm |
| 197 |
Charpete67 Mon, Jul 27, 2009 1:54:01pm |
| 198 |
callahan23 Mon, Jul 27, 2009 1:54:04pm |
re: #149 zombie
The dhimmification proceeds:
Check out the pictures.
Couldn't you have warned us? Instead I just vomited a little in my mouth. Retch, goin' for a mouth wash BBIAB
| 199 |
BARACK THE VOTE Mon, Jul 27, 2009 1:54:07pm |
re: #190 Sharmuta
The blogger formerly know as...?
heh, i meant "the regent formerly (and formally) known as..." but this works too.
| 200 |
Creeping Eruption Mon, Jul 27, 2009 1:54:23pm |
re: #177 experiencedtraveller
The next time I'm arrested by a female police officer I'll insist she wears a bikini.
Just wondering what it feels like to be on the business end of a taser?/
| 201 |
MandyManners Mon, Jul 27, 2009 1:54:27pm |
| 203 |
calcajun Mon, Jul 27, 2009 1:54:29pm |
re: #191 Targetpractice, Worst of Both Worlds
I thought we addressed him as "Overlord"?
That reminds me. I've been getting these odd Paypal charges to LGF for things called "tribute" and "homage". Any idea what's that about?
| 204 |
Ward Cleaver Mon, Jul 27, 2009 1:54:31pm |
re: #149 zombie
The dhimmification proceeds:
Check out the pictures.
They don't look too excited about wearing those things.
| 205 |
Honorary Yooper Mon, Jul 27, 2009 1:54:41pm |
re: #178 Cato the Elder
And let me guess - Dymphna is his online girlfriend but they've never met in person?
Nope. Dymphna is his wife. She actually runs her own indepenent blog.
| 206 |
calcajun Mon, Jul 27, 2009 1:54:49pm |
| 207 |
Alaska Kim Mon, Jul 27, 2009 1:54:52pm |
re: #196 MandyManners
Are the polar bears drowning?
No. Lots of other weird shit going on around here though.
| 208 |
Cato the Elder Mon, Jul 27, 2009 1:54:54pm |
re: #118 sharkjumper
Oops sorry not meant for you, not used to this forum.
Your boot is full of piss. The instructions for getting rid of the piss are on the heel.
Yet after two years of lurking around here, your boot is still full of piss.
I'd pass the hat to get you some remedial schooling, but I'm afraid you'd just piss in it.
| 209 |
Killgore Trout Mon, Jul 27, 2009 1:54:55pm |
| 210 |
Charles Johnson Mon, Jul 27, 2009 1:54:56pm |
re: #129 Sabba Hillel
Looking at the arguments and fulminating on all sides, it seems as if the Obama side is doing all that they can to continue the Nirther "dispute". I have no idea what is going on or what can or can not be proven, however, it was very easy to get a photostat of my official birth certificate. From the way things are going, it is as if he just wants people to concentrate on this and that way avoid being hit by all the other problems that he is causing.
***Heavy sigh.***
When a person who was born in the state of Hawaii requests their birth certificate, the document that Barack Obama released on the web is the ONLY kind of document they send out. It's sent out with the official seal of the state of Hawaii on it, to certify that it's a genuine, legal document proving that the person was born in Hawaii. That's it. End of story. Game over, man.
Barack Obama has done everything he needs to do to prove he's a citizen. It's not HIS fault that people are going off the deep end over this non-issue.
| 211 |
MandyManners Mon, Jul 27, 2009 1:55:18pm |
| 212 |
doppelganglander Mon, Jul 27, 2009 1:55:22pm |
re: #186 MikeySDCA
These ladies have children to feed, so they have to take this shit.
Sure, but some of them must be looking at an exit strategy. I doubt this could ever happen in the U.S., but if it did an officer could file a lawsuit. Do officers in Britain have any legal recourse?
| 213 |
DaddyG Mon, Jul 27, 2009 1:55:36pm |
re: #202 buzzsawmonkey
It would be fun to send up global warming silliness by staging a "Water Wings for Polar Bears" event.
Donate them to an extremist environmental group and insist they film them being distributed to the bears.
| 215 |
VegasRick Mon, Jul 27, 2009 1:55:54pm |
| 216 |
JustABill Mon, Jul 27, 2009 1:55:58pm |
Ok, so there are a lot of folks out there who don't believe Obama is a US Citizen and/or want to see more proof of it.
The more press these folks get, the more Conservatives in general look like idiots. The MSM does plenty to expose Nirthers to the world.
Do we really need 3 threads out of the last 4 dedicated to Nirhters. Must not be a whole lot more going on in the country, except of course...
1. ObamaCare
2. Crap and Trade
3. Obama insulting our nations policemen.
4. NJ corrupt democrat politicians.
| 217 |
Ward Cleaver Mon, Jul 27, 2009 1:55:58pm |
re: #175 quiet man
Dept issued Hibabs...
Now here is an opportunity!!
Department issued kebabs! Yum!
| 219 |
eschew_obfuscation Mon, Jul 27, 2009 1:56:24pm |
re: #149 zombie
The dhimmification proceeds:
Check out the pictures.
I think that's when I'd find a new line of work and tell someone to ...
"Go Piss Up a Rope" &trade MM
| 220 |
Creeping Eruption Mon, Jul 27, 2009 1:56:29pm |
re: #187 Fat Bastard Vegetarian
Is that during the rectification of the Vuldrinai, or after?...
Pre or Post Torg?
| 221 |
calcajun Mon, Jul 27, 2009 1:56:38pm |
re: #207 Alaska Kim
No. Lots of other weird shit going on around here though.
Like inexplicable resignation of good-looking (though arguably dim) governor?/
| 222 |
MandyManners Mon, Jul 27, 2009 1:56:46pm |
re: #202 buzzsawmonkey
It would be fun to send up global warming silliness by staging a "Water Wings for Polar Bears" event.
Their claws will just puncture them.
| 223 |
HelloDare Mon, Jul 27, 2009 1:56:49pm |
re: #149 zombie
The dhimmification proceeds:
Check out the pictures.
If you're really ugly, can you forgo with the hijab when talking to a Muslim man? /
| 225 |
CynicalConservative Mon, Jul 27, 2009 1:57:01pm |
re: #216 JustABill
Tread lightly my friend, not your blog.
| 226 |
Targetpractice Mon, Jul 27, 2009 1:57:02pm |
re: #203 calcajun
That reminds me. I've been getting these odd Paypal charges to LGF for things called "tribute" and "homage". Any idea what's that about?
I'll let you know once I figure out why my checking account has a charge for "Gamey Buttocks."
| 227 |
Charles Johnson Mon, Jul 27, 2009 1:57:10pm |
re: #216 JustABill
If you think there's something better to write about, you can always start your own blog. Takes 5 minutes on Blogspot. Then I can come over and tell you what to write about.
| 228 |
MandyManners Mon, Jul 27, 2009 1:57:12pm |
| 229 |
MandyManners Mon, Jul 27, 2009 1:57:32pm |
| 230 |
Killgore Trout Mon, Jul 27, 2009 1:57:34pm |
Rashad Azami, Imam and director of the Bath Islamic Society, said: 'It is highly pleasing to see that Avon and Somerset Constabulary is introducing specially designed head coverings for female officers.'This will go a long way in encouraging a trustful relationship between the police and the Muslim community. The police have been working closely with the Muslim community for the last few years.
'We hope this step will further strengthen the mutual relationship.'
Ugh!
| 231 |
Alaska Kim Mon, Jul 27, 2009 1:57:51pm |
re: #213 DaddyG
Donate them to an extremist environmental group and insist they film them being distributed to the bears.
There will be lots of red snow after that.
| 233 |
Sharmuta Mon, Jul 27, 2009 1:58:13pm |
re: #129 Sabba Hillel
Looking at the arguments and fulminating on all sides, it seems as if the Obama side is doing all that they can to continue the Nirther "dispute". I have no idea what is going on or what can or can not be proven, however, it was very easy to get a photostat of my official birth certificate. From the way things are going, it is as if he just wants people to concentrate on this and that way avoid being hit by all the other problems that he is causing.
You have no idea what's going on, but you're sure this is a machination of Obama's. Not very logical of you.
| 234 |
Kragar Mon, Jul 27, 2009 1:58:16pm |
re: #149 zombie
The dhimmification proceeds:
Check out the pictures.
Horseshit, pure and simple. And the comments approving this crap are down right depressing.
| 235 |
DaddyG Mon, Jul 27, 2009 1:58:48pm |
re: #216 JustABill
Do we really need 3 threads out of the last 4 dedicated to Nirhters.
Charles is cleaning out his troll cache so he can test the new timeout function.
| 236 |
zombie Mon, Jul 27, 2009 1:58:53pm |
re: #210 Charles
***Heavy sigh.***
When a person who was born in the state of Hawaii requests their birth certificate, the document that Barack Obama released on the web is the ONLY kind of document they send out. It's sent out with the official seal of the state of Hawaii on it, to certify that it's a genuine, legal document proving that the person was born in Hawaii. That's it. End of story. Game over, man.
Barack Obama has done everything he needs to do to prove he's a citizen. It's not HIS fault that people are going off the deep end over this non-issue.
As I've said before, what really permanently convinced me was went I went deep into [major library's] archives and found and then held in my hand an actual copy of the Honolulu Star-Bulletin from August of 1961, with a birth notice for Barack Obama Jr. in it. Couldn't be faked. Wasn't faked.
End of story.
| 237 |
Alaska Kim Mon, Jul 27, 2009 1:59:01pm |
re: #221 calcajun
Like inexplicable resignation of good-looking (though arguably dim) governor?/
"dim"??
| 238 |
calcajun Mon, Jul 27, 2009 1:59:14pm |
re: #216 JustABill
To shut them up, yes.
Now, given the intelligence of these nirthers, I'd suggest we find something shiny to grab their attention and that we do it real soon.
| 239 |
eschew_obfuscation Mon, Jul 27, 2009 1:59:29pm |
re: #184 iceweasel
Well, he used to, but now he prefers an unpronouncable symbol instead.
Heh... "The Blogger"
| 240 |
razorbacker Mon, Jul 27, 2009 1:59:43pm |
Well, back from my excursion into the dreaded maw of the uncaring health care machine.
Naturally, since I had no appointment, that money-grubbing doctor kept me waiting for almost twenty minutes *wail. tooth-gnashing*
The nurse insisted on weighing me, even though I assured her that once the doctor pulled that thing out of my knee I'd weigh pounds less. Drat her. Insisted on taking my blood pressure even though I assured her that it was highly elevated from the excruciating pain I was in (126/72. I may live, yet)
Doc came in and had me hop onto the table on my stomach (bit of a perv, that sawbones, don't you think?) He said, "Yah, you couldn't reach this yourself, could you?" and took one of those thingys that you use to get a hook from a deeply-hooked fish and pulled out the offending stitch. Slathered on a bit of antibacterial cream and gave me my choice of a Transformers band-aid or the plain kind. I was feeling pretty stylish so I went with the Transformers. The kids at Wal-Mart were green with envy. Made it worthwhile.
I'll bet that it'll go much better once single-payer health care comes into effect.
| 241 |
Ward Cleaver Mon, Jul 27, 2009 1:59:45pm |
re: #236 zombie
As I've said before, what really permanently convinced me was went I went deep into [major library's] archives and found and then held in my hand an actual copy of the Honolulu Star-Bulletin from August of 1961, with a birth notice for Barack Obama Jr. in it. Couldn't be faked. Wasn't faked.
End of story.
That's what sealed it for me.
| 242 |
Kragar Mon, Jul 27, 2009 2:00:05pm |
| 243 |
quiet man Mon, Jul 27, 2009 2:00:09pm |
re: #235 DaddyG
And it's working!! We caught a couple trying to slip in under cover...
| 244 |
Eowyn2 Mon, Jul 27, 2009 2:00:24pm |
re: #109 sharkjumper
Make that two.
Sorry for being late to the party. I've never needed to post because you guys had been doing such a great job until now.
Ignore the downdings and read the posts regarding the birth cert.
Also see Zombietime for full coverage of real investigation into the birth certificate. Be willing to look at the evidence with an open mind rather than some of the rants we have seen regarding the birth certificate.
I, too, was skeptical, Damn It Anyway. I really really wanted him to be ineligible to be president but still faced the reality that there is nothing wrong with his 'certificate of live birth'
| 245 |
Fat Bastard Vegetarian Mon, Jul 27, 2009 2:00:25pm |
I'm a Leo too, Mr. President! We've got a birthday coming! Can I come over for a beer. I'd like a chance to chat with you for a bit.
| 246 |
calcajun Mon, Jul 27, 2009 2:00:29pm |
re: #237 Alaska Kim
Emphasis on the word "arguably". Her "exit stage left" still had me scratching my head in puzzlement.
| 247 |
Charles Johnson Mon, Jul 27, 2009 2:00:35pm |
re: #149 zombie
The dhimmification proceeds:
Check out the pictures.
Actually -- it's not for interacting with all Muslims, it's for when they enter a mosque.
| 248 |
Creeping Eruption Mon, Jul 27, 2009 2:00:37pm |
re: #215 VegasRick
Well, I got a little turned on.
/
/I'd down-ding you out of sheer horror, but then again, there is no accounting for taste, so . . .
| 250 |
Alaska Kim Mon, Jul 27, 2009 2:00:57pm |
re: #229 MandyManners
Big skeeters?
Lots of kids dying this year. And a woman flung herself 6 stories off of a bldg the other day. Unfortunately I saw it.
| 251 |
SecondComing Mon, Jul 27, 2009 2:01:04pm |
What do they logically expect to happen?
WND: Where is teh birfh cerficikate?
Gibbs:Okay, Obama admits that he really doesn't have one. And will be stepping down effective immediately. Biden will be taking over.
| 252 |
Kragar Mon, Jul 27, 2009 2:01:10pm |
re: #236 zombie
As I've said before, what really permanently convinced me was went I went deep into [major library's] archives and found and then held in my hand an actual copy of the Honolulu Star-Bulletin from August of 1961, with a birth notice for Barack Obama Jr. in it. Couldn't be faked. Wasn't faked.
End of story.
So you're saying they've been planning this for a long time? The sneaky bastards!
///
| 255 |
Targetpractice Mon, Jul 27, 2009 2:01:49pm |
re: #251 SecondComing
What do they logically expect to happen?
WND: Where is teh birfh cerficikate?
Gibbs:Okay, Obama admits that he really doesn't have one. And will be stepping down effective immediately. Biden will be taking over.
Fuck that, I'm defecting to Australia. I'll take my chances with the beasties.
| 256 |
zombie Mon, Jul 27, 2009 2:02:08pm |
re: #247 Charles
Actually -- it's not for interacting with all Muslims, it's for when they enter a mosque.
Amend that then to say "interacting with Muslims in a mosque."
But my criticism remains:
Do the cops go nude when they investigate a crime at a nudist colony?
Do the cops wear yarmulkes when entering an Orthodox Jewish home?
(etc.)
No.
| 257 |
yochanan Mon, Jul 27, 2009 2:02:16pm |
re: #240 razorbacker
is that anything like the MAW OF DEATH in Durer 4 horsemen?
| 258 |
VegasRick Mon, Jul 27, 2009 2:02:17pm |
re: #248 Creeping Eruption
/I'd down-ding you out of sheer horror, but then again, there is no accounting for taste, so . . .
At least I remembered my sarcy tag this time.
| 259 |
CyanSnowHawk Mon, Jul 27, 2009 2:02:22pm |
The decline of a sleeper lizard. Can the fall be far behind.
re: #24 sharkjumper
Unsavory, but acceptable.
re: #114 sharkjumper
Didn't take long to step in it, did it?
re: #118 sharkjumper
Almost but not quite entirely unlike an apology.
re: #151 sharkjumper
Let's step in with the other foot in while we're at it.
re: #216 JustABill
And coming from out of nowhere we have a new leader!
| 260 |
vxbush Mon, Jul 27, 2009 2:03:02pm |
re: #240 razorbacker
Well, back from my excursion into the dreaded maw of the uncaring health care machine.
Naturally, since I had no appointment, that money-grubbing doctor kept me waiting for almost twenty minutes *wail. tooth-gnashing*
The nurse insisted on weighing me, even though I assured her that once the doctor pulled that thing out of my knee I'd weigh pounds less. Drat her. Insisted on taking my blood pressure even though I assured her that it was highly elevated from the excruciating pain I was in (126/72. I may live, yet)
Doc came in and had me hop onto the table on my stomach (bit of a perv, that sawbones, don't you think?) He said, "Yah, you couldn't reach this yourself, could you?" and took one of those thingys that you use to get a hook from a deeply-hooked fish and pulled out the offending stitch. Slathered on a bit of antibacterial cream and gave me my choice of a Transformers band-aid or the plain kind. I was feeling pretty stylish so I went with the Transformers. The kids at Wal-Mart were green with envy. Made it worthwhile.
I'll bet that it'll go much better once single-payer health care comes into effect.
Maybe I should have done that last Thursday. I had a bad reaction to my allergy shot from Wednesday, and I tried to be polite and handle it over the phone. They never once asked me to come in, nor did they offer any drugs for me to take. I was all in all not pleased with the reaction.
| 261 |
calcajun Mon, Jul 27, 2009 2:03:03pm |
| 262 |
Eowyn2 Mon, Jul 27, 2009 2:03:20pm |
re: #149 zombie
The dhimmification proceeds:
Check out the pictures.
Excuse me sir (madam) I'm from the police, before I bust down your door, could you please tell me whether I need to put on a Hijab so my deadly hair rays dont hurt you?
| 263 |
VegasRick Mon, Jul 27, 2009 2:03:24pm |
re: #250 Alaska Kim
Lots of kids dying this year. And a woman flung herself 6 stories off of a bldg the other day. Unfortunately I saw it.
Whoa! Why is that?
| 264 |
KingKenrod Mon, Jul 27, 2009 2:03:32pm |
re: #149 zombie
The dhimmification proceeds:
Check out the pictures.
Don't the police already wear headcoverings?
And why do police have to visit mosques so often that they need a policy like this anyway?
I'm sure some women will not stand for this and seek employment elsewhere. Their positions will be filled by women who are either muslim, or agree with the policy, or don't care. Thus the police dept will move further and further towards appeasement and compromise while the civilians get angrier and more radical. It's not a good situation.
| 265 |
doppelganglander Mon, Jul 27, 2009 2:03:34pm |
re: #250 Alaska Kim
Lots of kids dying this year. And a woman flung herself 6 stories off of a bldg the other day. Unfortunately I saw it.
That's awful. I hope you're doing okay.
| 266 |
MandyManners Mon, Jul 27, 2009 2:03:38pm |
re: #250 Alaska Kim
Lots of kids dying this year. And a woman flung herself 6 stories off of a bldg the other day. Unfortunately I saw it.
What's going on?
| 267 |
Fat Bastard Vegetarian Mon, Jul 27, 2009 2:03:46pm |
re: #255 Targetpractice, Worst of Both Worlds
Fuck that, I'm defecting to Australia. I'll take my chances with the beasties.
Adam Yauch has cancer. He might not be up for it.
| 268 |
DaddyG Mon, Jul 27, 2009 2:03:50pm |
re: #256 zombie
Do the cops go nude when they investigate a crime at a nudist colony?
Rubber gloves if its a shoplifting case. /
| 269 |
Eowyn2 Mon, Jul 27, 2009 2:03:56pm |
re: #247 Charles
Actually -- it's not for interacting with all Muslims, it's for when they enter a mosque.
Can women enter a mosque when men are praying?
Legit question.
| 270 |
MandyManners Mon, Jul 27, 2009 2:03:56pm |
re: #250 Alaska Kim
Lots of kids dying this year. And a woman flung herself 6 stories off of a bldg the other day. Unfortunately I saw it.
(((AlaskaKim)))
| 271 |
JustABill Mon, Jul 27, 2009 2:04:14pm |
re: #238 calcajun
To shut them up, yes.
Now, given the intelligence of these nirthers, I'd suggest we find something shiny to grab their attention and that we do it real soon.
If attention(positive or negative) would shut them up, then by all means, shine the light on them. My personal opinion is that attention of any kind just encourages them. Just my opinion...
| 272 |
BARACK THE VOTE Mon, Jul 27, 2009 2:04:19pm |
re: #149 zombie
The dhimmification proceeds:
Check out the pictures.
I did check the pictures and the article. Here's what it says:
Women police officers are being issued with headscarves to wear when they visit a mosque. They are expected to put the scarfs on shortly before they enter the mosque, in keeping with Islamic custom.
There are two versions - one matches the black of a police officer's uniform, while another goes with the blue uniforms worn by community support officers.
The headscarves are being given out by Avon and Somerset Police, and have the force's emblem sewn on.
That's very different from what you named your link. And I wonder where you got that title, since the title of the article itself is "Very PC police force issues its WPCs with Muslim headscarves complete with badge for mosque visits".
I don't find this "PC" or "weird". I cover my head when I visit a mosque. Men of all religions wear a yarmulke in a synagogue. This is just good manners.
| 273 |
lawhawk Mon, Jul 27, 2009 2:04:26pm |
Will Nirtherism go away? Not ever; it's the same kind of crazy that keeps the JFK conspiracy alive; the Roswell alien coverup alive; the 9/11 trooferism; etc.
So on and so forth.
No amount of facts can eliminate the crazy. And that's the saddest part of all.
| 274 |
Targetpractice Mon, Jul 27, 2009 2:04:34pm |
re: #267 Fat Bastard Vegetarian
Adam Yauch has cancer. He might not be up for it.
Sounds like a case of sabotage.
| 275 |
Shiplord Kirel Mon, Jul 27, 2009 2:04:38pm |
re: #140 Charles
The name "Baron Bodissey" comes from a character in the science fiction novels of Jack Vance.
Sheesh! Why do all these weirdos hijack the names of sci-fi characters? Do they like to admit they go to Trek cons and can't find a girlfriend or play softball drunk or enjoy a good NASCAR race? Yeah, that's it, weird, and they live in Mom's basement too and...
Oh.
Never mind.
| 276 |
calcajun Mon, Jul 27, 2009 2:04:44pm |
re: #256 zombie
Do the cops go nude when they investigate a crime at a nudist colony?
Gives new meaning to the term, "weapons drawn", eh.
| 277 |
experiencedtraveller Mon, Jul 27, 2009 2:04:47pm |
re: #250 Alaska Kim
Lots of kids dying this year. And a woman flung herself 6 stories off of a bldg the other day. Unfortunately I saw it.
Regrets about all that. IIRC a 6 story building would be one of Alaska's tallest.
| 278 |
Kragar Mon, Jul 27, 2009 2:04:51pm |
re: #247 Charles
Actually -- it's not for interacting with all Muslims, it's for when they enter a mosque.
Are there police issued yarmulke or Buddhist robes for if they have to make visits to a synagogue or temple?
| 279 |
razorbacker Mon, Jul 27, 2009 2:04:58pm |
re: #257 yochanan
is that anything like the MAW OF DEATH in Durer 4 horsemen?
I'm pretty sure that that is the gaping maw of death. Not positive, but pretty sure.
| 280 |
MandyManners Mon, Jul 27, 2009 2:05:17pm |
| 281 |
Killgore Trout Mon, Jul 27, 2009 2:05:19pm |
re: #256 zombie
Amend that then to say "interacting with Muslims in a mosque."
But my criticism remains:
Do the cops go nude when they investigate a crime at a nudist colony?
Do the cops wear yarmulkes when entering an Orthodox Jewish home?
(etc.)
No.
Agreed. Even the article states...
Islamic custom expects women to cover their head inside a place of worship. During an official visit last year, the Queen wore a headscarf to tour the crypt and caverns of an historic Islamic shrine in Turkey.
Yes, In Turkey not in the UK.
| 282 |
lawhawk Mon, Jul 27, 2009 2:05:31pm |
re: #274 Targetpractice, Worst of Both Worlds
Don't worry. He's going to fight... for his right... to par-tay.
| 283 |
Alaska Kim Mon, Jul 27, 2009 2:05:38pm |
re: #263 VegasRick
Whoa! Why is that?
one died the day after his graduation. drinking and driving.
one was hiking with his brother, sat down on top of the mountain to eat lunch, his backpack slid and he went after it and accidentally slipped 500 feet down an avalanche chute.
one died while hiking in AZ in 110 degrees.
sad stuff!
| 284 |
Render Mon, Jul 27, 2009 2:06:16pm |
re: #227 Charles
You will? Or you could? You know you've got a cot with your name on it in the bunker, even has a built-in bike rack. What do I have to do, put up a bike post?
FUNNIN,
R
| 285 |
Targetpractice Mon, Jul 27, 2009 2:06:19pm |
re: #275 Shiplord Kirel
Sheesh! Why do all these weirdos hijack the names of sci-fi characters? Do they like to admit they go to Trek cons and can't find a girlfriend or play softball drunk or enjoy a good NASCAR race? Yeah, that's it, weird, and they live in Mom's basement too and...
Oh.
Never mind.
Says the guy with a Turtledove character for a name.
| 286 |
vxbush Mon, Jul 27, 2009 2:06:20pm |
re: #275 Shiplord Kirel
Sheesh! Why do all these weirdos hijack the names of sci-fi characters? Do they like to admit they go to Trek cons and can't find a girlfriend or play softball drunk or enjoy a good NASCAR race? Yeah, that's it, weird, and they live in Mom's basement too and...
Oh.
Never mind.
But this raises an interesting question:
Did the creators of DS9 steal from Ursula Le Guin when they created a character named Odo?
/obscure Trek question
| 287 |
Randall Gross Mon, Jul 27, 2009 2:06:23pm |
Milking these kooks and cranks is big money for world nut, big trouble for Republicans.
| 288 |
opnion Mon, Jul 27, 2009 2:06:27pm |
re: #245 Fat Bastard Vegetarian
I'm a Leo too, Mr. President! We've got a birthday coming! Can I come over for a beer. I'd like a chance to chat with you for a bit.
Have Jimmy & Skip come over too.
| 289 |
Creeping Eruption Mon, Jul 27, 2009 2:06:43pm |
| 290 |
doppelganglander Mon, Jul 27, 2009 2:06:45pm |
re: #272 iceweasel
That's very different from what you named your link. And I wonder where you got that title, since the title of the article itself is "Very PC police force issues its WPCs with Muslim headscarves complete with badge for mosque visits".
I don't find this "PC" or "weird". I cover my head when I visit a mosque. Men of all religions wear a yarmulke in a synagogue. This is just good manners.
I think if you are visiting as a guest at another faith's house of worship, it's a courtesy to observe those customs. However, when a policewoman is on official business, she should not be required to adopt the outward form of a religion she does not belong to.
| 291 |
Alaska Kim Mon, Jul 27, 2009 2:07:17pm |
re: #265 doppelganglander
That's awful. I hope you're doing okay.
Thanks. I didn't know her, but seeing someone so distraught over who-knows-what and then jumping to their death makes me sick to my stomach.
I just can't imagine anything being so bad that I'd do that. But I guess I never walked in her shoes.
| 292 |
yochanan Mon, Jul 27, 2009 2:07:23pm |
re: #250 Alaska Kim
ouch
i have had bouts of depression but I would not want to inflict my pain on others.
| 293 |
keithgabryelski Mon, Jul 27, 2009 2:07:24pm |
re: #114 sharkjumper
Oh and yeah, feel free to chew THIS, biotch.
wow, you went non-linear pretty quickly.
As to your "long form" question. Here is the Hawaiian Department of Health website. In particular the vital records page:
[Link: hawaii.gov...]
Please explain HOW one retrieves a copy of their long-form birth certificate.
Note: if you'd like to get a hint, read this page:
[Link: www.factcheck.org...]
You can start with just the italics words on that page.
| 294 |
MandyManners Mon, Jul 27, 2009 2:07:51pm |
re: #290 doppelganglander
I think if you are visiting as a guest at another faith's house of worship, it's a courtesy to observe those customs. However, when a policewoman is on official business, she should not be required to adopt the outward form of a religion she does not belong to.
Especially one that subjugates women.
| 295 |
Killgore Trout Mon, Jul 27, 2009 2:08:18pm |
re: #272 iceweasel
I
don't find this "PC" or "weird". I cover my head when I visit a mosque. Men of all religions wear a yarmulke in a synagogue. This is just good manners.
There's also a big difference between a social visit and a police investigation. Should female police not pursue a robbery suspect into a mosque because they don't have the proper head covering?
| 296 |
Targetpractice Mon, Jul 27, 2009 2:08:21pm |
re: #282 lawhawk
Don't worry. He's going to fight... for his right... to par-tay.
And there will be no sleep til Brooklyn!
| 297 |
Alaska Kim Mon, Jul 27, 2009 2:08:22pm |
re: #277 experiencedtraveller
Regrets about all that. IIRC a 6 story building would be one of Alaska's tallest.
it's our State Office Building.
| 298 |
BARACK THE VOTE Mon, Jul 27, 2009 2:09:08pm |
re: #290 doppelganglander
I think if you are visiting as a guest at another faith's house of worship, it's a courtesy to observe those customs. However, when a policewoman is on official business, she should not be required to adopt the outward form of a religion she does not belong to.
If she's in a house of worship-- and a mosque is a house of worship-- even if she's on official business she should observes the custom. It's about showing respect and being polite.
| 299 |
Lee Coller Mon, Jul 27, 2009 2:09:14pm |
re: #24 sharkjumper
“Is there anything you can say to make the Birthers go away?”
Yes. Obama's long form, vault copy birth certificate.
As a Nirther who otherwise loves LGF, I assure you that there is nothing we'd love more than to be proven WRONG.
My apologies to Charles for infesting the GOP, but please understand, we Nirthers infest the Demonrat party too.
sharkjumper
(Logged in)
Registered since: Jul 5, 2007 at 5:43 pm
No. of comments posted: 5
No. of links posted: 0
Registered 2007, five comments posted, all of them today. What other names do we know you by?
| 300 |
CyanSnowHawk Mon, Jul 27, 2009 2:09:19pm |
re: #247 Charles
Actually -- it's not for interacting with all Muslims, it's for when they enter a mosque.
Oh, and I was going to suggest something a little better, but this kind of negates that.
| 301 |
DaddyG Mon, Jul 27, 2009 2:09:31pm |
re: #295 Killgore Trout
I
There's also a big difference between a social visit and a police investigation. Should female police not pursue a robbery suspect into a mosque because they don't have the proper head covering?
On the bright side at least this shows a willingness for the police in the UK to persue a suspect into a mosque. Do we even pretend they exist here in the US?
| 302 |
callahan23 Mon, Jul 27, 2009 2:09:51pm |
re: #291 Alaska Kim
I am sorry for you to have watched something like that is awful, horrific and shocking. { { Alaska Kim } } }
| 303 |
JustABill Mon, Jul 27, 2009 2:09:57pm |
re: #227 Charles
If you think there's something better to write about, you can always start your own blog. Takes 5 minutes on Blogspot. Then I can come over and tell you what to write about.
True enough. While I have not been in our shoes, I suspect I would welcome your feedback.
| 304 |
razorbacker Mon, Jul 27, 2009 2:10:22pm |
re: #260 vxbush
The only real issue that I've ever had regarding doctor-delivered pain medications is that I've asked him not to bother prescribing them unless they are better and cheaper than what I can get on the streets.
It's a running joke. He maintains that he has more overhead, and can't compete on price. But if one of his pills give me a bad trip, he'll see me to take care of it. If one of the street-drugs give me a bad trip, I have to go to the hospital. I don't want to do that. Sick people hang out at hospitals, and I don't want to catch anything.
| 306 |
Eowyn2 Mon, Jul 27, 2009 2:10:57pm |
re: #230 Killgore Trout
Ugh!
Ah, Bath,
How're the Waters
"I do wish we could be in Bath this winter"
| 307 |
Creeping Eruption Mon, Jul 27, 2009 2:10:58pm |
re: #300 CyanSnowHawk
Oh, and I was going to suggest something a little better, but this kind of negates that.
Why is that? Honestly. What if she were chasing someone? Does she need to cover herself before she enters a mosque?
| 308 |
Alaska Kim Mon, Jul 27, 2009 2:11:07pm |
re: #302 callahan23
I am sorry for you to have watched something like that is awful, horrific and shocking. { { Alaska Kim } } }
yeah, and there were 5 tour ships in that day. Tourists by the hundreds got to watch that.
| 309 |
Kragar Mon, Jul 27, 2009 2:11:14pm |
Oh, you silly silly lizards, with all your "facts", "documentation" and "common sense". Dont you see that the Left has been correct all this time? Its all about FEELINGS, and so long as it feels like Obama isn't a citizen, then it must be the right answer.
Reasoning is dead. Long live the new logic.
/
| 310 |
calcajun Mon, Jul 27, 2009 2:11:51pm |
re: #303 JustABill
"nor been in our shoes"? You don't empathize with your other multiple personalities? Shame on you.///
| 311 |
Charpete67 Mon, Jul 27, 2009 2:12:17pm |
re: #298 iceweasel
If she's in a house of worship-- and a mosque is a house of worship-- even if she's on official business she should observes the custom. It's about showing respect and being polite.
...the same way they show everyone else that same level of respect...I guess we're the bigger ones...
| 312 |
doppelganglander Mon, Jul 27, 2009 2:12:18pm |
re: #298 iceweasel
If she's in a house of worship-- and a mosque is a house of worship-- even if she's on official business she should observes the custom. It's about showing respect and being polite.
It should be about doing her job. Putting on hijab immediately places a woman in a subservient position. A policewoman is in a position of authority and adopting the misogynistic role of a woman in Islam impedes her ability to do her job. Sorry, her normal police hat should be good enough.
| 313 |
calcajun Mon, Jul 27, 2009 2:12:39pm |
re: #305 taxfreekiller
Good thing Nancy Pelosi is starting to come around and support drilling for oil, in California and off shoure, to help with the gas prices her constituents have to pay.
Please, tell me how to get to your universe. I want out of this dimension.
| 314 |
vxbush Mon, Jul 27, 2009 2:12:54pm |
re: #304 razorbacker
The only real issue that I've ever had regarding doctor-delivered pain medications is that I've asked him not to bother prescribing them unless they are better and cheaper than what I can get on the streets.
It's a running joke. He maintains that he has more overhead, and can't compete on price. But if one of his pills give me a bad trip, he'll see me to take care of it. If one of the street-drugs give me a bad trip, I have to go to the hospital. I don't want to do that. Sick people hang out at hospitals, and I don't want to catch anything.
My frustration was that I was having a bad reaction to an allergy injection that the doctor prescribed and that she has made special at her clinic. This is the first time I've had a serious problem, and I thought they would want to at least look at it, so I tried to be nice and call first. And I was not treated as a serious case at all, when I thought there was a nonzero chance that it might turn into one.
But I'm jealous of that Transformer bandaid. I can usually only get Snoopy when I go.
| 315 |
Eowyn2 Mon, Jul 27, 2009 2:12:55pm |
| 316 |
JustABill Mon, Jul 27, 2009 2:13:01pm |
re: #310 calcajun
"nor been in our shoes"? You don't empathize with your other multiple personalities? Shame on you.///
our = your, somedays, I need more than spell check.
| 317 |
sharkjumper Mon, Jul 27, 2009 2:13:05pm |
re: #299 Lee Coller
Hey, just because I'm a Nirther doesn't mean I'm a troll.
Sheesh.
| 318 |
BARACK THE VOTE Mon, Jul 27, 2009 2:13:13pm |
re: #295 Killgore Trout
I
There's also a big difference between a social visit and a police investigation. Should female police not pursue a robbery suspect into a mosque because they don't have the proper head covering?
Interestingly, the article is all about covering your head when you visit a mosque in the course of an investigation.
Not about forbidding women to chase subjects into a mosque unless they cover their head, etc.
| 319 |
yochanan Mon, Jul 27, 2009 2:13:23pm |
re: #297 Alaska Kim
kim what is the tallest building up there?
| 320 |
MandyManners Mon, Jul 27, 2009 2:14:24pm |
re: #317 sharkjumper
Hey, just because I'm a Nirther doesn't mean I'm a troll.
Sheesh.
Calling one of us a "biotch" is trollish. And, juvenile.
| 321 |
Kragar Mon, Jul 27, 2009 2:14:26pm |
Chalk up another reason for why I'm glad I skipped college and decided to get an education instead.
From academia, an outpouring for Gates
One week after the arrest of Harvard University professor Henry Louis Gates caused an international firestorm, the noted African-American scholar is receiving an outpouring of support from academia.
The leaders of Harvard's Association of Black Faculty, Administrators, and Fellows released a strongly worded letter this morning expressing outrage at Gates's arrest by a white Cambridge police sergeant for disorderly conduct, a charge that was dropped last week.
The letter, jointly written by the co-chairmen of the association -- law professor Ronald S. Sullivan, who directs the Criminal Justice Institute of Harvard Law School, and Robert Mitchell, assistant dean and communications director in the Faculty of Arts and Sciences -- said they "would like to add our voices to the chorus of outraged people responding to the unjustified, illegal, and unwarranted arrest that you were forced to endure.
"As black men, we know what racial profiling and stereotyping is all about,'' Sullivan and Mitchell wrote. "Moreover, we regret the serious affront to your dignity in respect of the booking process. . . Regrettably, your arrest demonstrates how vulnerable some in our community still are to police abuse of power.''
| 323 |
Fat Bastard Vegetarian Mon, Jul 27, 2009 2:14:48pm |
| 324 |
opnion Mon, Jul 27, 2009 2:14:49pm |
re: #298 iceweasel
If she's in a house of worship-- and a mosque is a house of worship-- even if she's on official business she should observes the custom. It's about showing respect and being polite.
Ice the Hajib is widely considered a symbvol of subjugation, not universally but widely. I don't think that it is a good idea for female cops looking subjugated on police business.
You know that many muslim men insist on the female head covering in any situation.
| 325 |
Neutral President Mon, Jul 27, 2009 2:14:51pm |
| 326 |
Alaska Kim Mon, Jul 27, 2009 2:14:55pm |
re: #319 yochanan
kim what is the tallest building up there?
Probably the Atwood Building or the ConocoPhillips Building in Anchorage. Maybe 30 stories. Maybe a little more.
| 327 |
CyanSnowHawk Mon, Jul 27, 2009 2:14:57pm |
re: #305 taxfreekiller
Good thing Nancy Pelosi is starting to come around and support drilling for oil, in California and off shoure, to help with the gas prices her constituents have to pay.
Surely, you jest.
| 328 |
Randall Gross Mon, Jul 27, 2009 2:15:05pm |
re: #319 yochanan
kim what is the tallest building up there?
Might not be the tallest, but is one of the taller...
[Link: www.captaincook.com...]
| 329 |
Shug Mon, Jul 27, 2009 2:15:10pm |
PIGS FLY MOMENT
I agree with Robert Gibbs
I need to sit down and collect myself
| 330 |
razorbacker Mon, Jul 27, 2009 2:15:22pm |
re: #314 vxbush
But I'm jealous of that Transformer bandaid. I can usually only get Snoopy when I go.
You should check into getting a younger doctor; one more up-to-date.
Does yours still bleed you, or does she use the modern leeches?
| 331 |
Fat Bastard Vegetarian Mon, Jul 27, 2009 2:15:24pm |
re: #317 sharkjumper
Hey, just because I'm a Nirther doesn't mean I'm a troll.
Sheesh.
Doesn't make you smart either.
| 332 |
nikis-knight Mon, Jul 27, 2009 2:15:31pm |
re: #281 Killgore Trout
Yes, In Turkey not in the UK.
I would expect authorities in culturally muslim countries to wear professional dress for their culture when they had need to enter a mosque--or other sacred/honored place.
I would expect likewise in western countries--conforming to western standards of professionalism.
I certainly don't think it is good to have pockets of foreign cultures, not ones given official deference, and not starting with one frequently hostile to the host culture.
Though, if the religious group had some sacred area and there wasn't a warrant or evidence of a pending crime, I'd expect the police to acceed to their wishes of meeting outside, for instance. But still, they don't need to show the respect that a member of the religion is expected to show, especially not in countries without an official relgion--or even with a different official religion.
| 334 |
calcajun Mon, Jul 27, 2009 2:15:49pm |
re: #317 sharkjumper
No-- you're rude. You have to earn the right to say things like that to others here.
| 335 |
harpsicon Mon, Jul 27, 2009 2:15:57pm |
re: #236 zombie
As I've said before, what really permanently convinced me was went I went deep into [major library's] archives and found and then held in my hand an actual copy of the Honolulu Star-Bulletin from August of 1961, with a birth notice for Barack Obama Jr. in it. Couldn't be faked. Wasn't faked.
End of story.
This was actually published (photo) in a Dallas Morning News editorial today, which started me thinking about it.
How many days later did it appear? My understanding of his dad, and especially his mom, makes it seem overwhelmingly likely that this was put in the paper by grandma the bank officer. She might have phoned Kenya even back in the day (doubt the parents would have spent the money to call her), and then phoned up the paper. That her counter-cultural daughter would have put a birth notice in the Honolulu Star-Bulletin is just cosmically (to use the period phrase) unlikely.
When you consider the general social attitudes of the people involved, I'd say the odds on the above scenario are pretty darn good. Which means that this birth notice wouldn't really mean anything.
I don't care much about this, and think that Obama probably is toying with people in some fashion, hoping to make them look as foolish as possible. It is obviously very bad for GOP and other politicians, and yes, Hillary would have used it if she had it. There's even a republican governor in Hawaii.
Still, proof is proof, and much as I respect Zombie and all the work he/she has done, this birth notice is still open to at least one other explanation.
| 336 |
BARACK THE VOTE Mon, Jul 27, 2009 2:16:16pm |
re: #312 doppelganglander
It should be about doing her job. Putting on hijab immediately places a woman in a subservient position.
Bullshit. It's mere politeness and it facilitates good relations with the community. No one is making them wear a burka.
You cover your head if you're a female visiting a mosque, no matter the reason-- just like men cover their heads when visiting a synagogue, and women visiting Catholic churches used to have to cover their heads.
| 337 |
vxbush Mon, Jul 27, 2009 2:16:17pm |
re: #330 razorbacker
You should check into getting a younger doctor; one more up-to-date.
Does yours still bleed you, or does she use the modern leeches?
She's waiting for me to die so she can use my organs to predict the future.
/
| 338 |
Render Mon, Jul 27, 2009 2:16:18pm |
re: #278 Kragar (Proud to be Kafir)
I'm not sure about England, but very last time I was in synagogue, the police arrived shortly afterward to check out a suspicious car (not mine!). When they entered the building they both took off their hats. A younger Rabbi went over to them and spoke some quiet words, both officers smiled and put their hats back on. No big deal...
I've had two *very* different Rabbis tell me that it was ok to wear my Oakland Raiders baseball hat in place of a yamulke, as long as my head was covered the Big Man wouldn't mind.
WORK
AROUNDS,
R
| 339 |
Shug Mon, Jul 27, 2009 2:16:24pm |
re: #317 sharkjumper
Hey, just because I'm a Nirther doesn't mean I'm a troll.
Sheesh.
No, It makes you a dipshit
| 340 |
calcajun Mon, Jul 27, 2009 2:16:32pm |
re: #329 Shug
Why is the sky going dark and the Earth shaking?
| 341 |
princetrumpet Mon, Jul 27, 2009 2:16:37pm |
This is really embarrassing and there's no talking to these folks. They have a nonsensical retort to everything that has a shred of logic attached to it. We have, at best, a year to get this sorted out before the next election.
| 342 |
callahan23 Mon, Jul 27, 2009 2:17:09pm |
re: #322 buzzsawmonkey
Most police wear hats--so their heads are covered. That they are not covered in accordance with Islamic law is immaterial.
Police are neutral beings; they are where they are for police business, not to hold hands and assuage multiculti sensibilities.
Fully support you on that. Abso-correcta-mundo.
| 343 |
Killgore Trout Mon, Jul 27, 2009 2:17:14pm |
Crazy conservative demand apology for being labeled as crazy...
Peterson: I don’t talk to my constituents because they’re nuts
Collin Peterson must immediately apologize for the outrageous and offensive comments he made about his own constituents. By stating that ‘twenty-five percent of my people believe the Pentagon and Rumsfeld were responsible for taking the twin towers down’ and that’s ‘why I don’t do town meetings,’ Peterson revealed just how out of touch and disconnected he has become in Washington. Given his liberal voting record, the real reason Peterson doesn’t hold town hall meetings is because he is afraid to face the residents of his district.
| 344 |
Sharmuta Mon, Jul 27, 2009 2:17:15pm |
re: #295 Killgore Trout
There's also a big difference between a social visit and a police investigation. Should female police not pursue a robbery suspect into a mosque because they don't have the proper head covering?
The article doesn't say anything other than "visit" and that's pretty vague. These might be intended for community outreach visits. I doubt a police woman chasing a suspect into a mosque will need to put on a hijab.
| 345 |
Buster Mon, Jul 27, 2009 2:17:40pm |
re: #72 Eowyn2
Having seen Obama's 'fake' copy of certification of live birth and my 'really from the State' copy of certification of live birth, I have to say that they are eerily similar and are not even from the same state.
IF this were a fake birth certificate, I would guess the following would have occured by now:
Every Hawaiin Republican would produce 'real' birth certificates which show the difference.
Hillary would have been the Dem nominee - she would never allow herself to be relegated to Sec of State and she would have dug until she found the proof needed - I'm sure she dug until all channels were lost. Think of the lawyers that landed on AK.
Even if you would prefer to believe that Obama isn't a citizen of the USA, you have to admit that his oposition in the primaries would have skewered him if it were true.
Turns out Hillary had the proof that, not only was Obama not born in Hawaii, but he was not even born on this Earth!
Unfortunately, she put it on a stack of Billing records from some Law Firm in Arkansas, and it went missing. Damn her luck!
| 346 |
CyanSnowHawk Mon, Jul 27, 2009 2:17:51pm |
re: #307 Creeping Eruption
Why is that? Honestly. What if she were chasing someone? Does she need to cover herself before she enters a mosque?
Oh yeah, I forgot how common an occurrence that is.
/
| 347 |
callahan23 Mon, Jul 27, 2009 2:18:13pm |
re: #329 Shug
PIGS FLY MOMENT
I agree with Robert Gibbs
I need to sit down and collect myself
What you are standing upright while blogging? ;-)
| 348 |
Kragar Mon, Jul 27, 2009 2:18:22pm |
| 350 |
Alaska Kim Mon, Jul 27, 2009 2:18:54pm |
| 351 |
razorbacker Mon, Jul 27, 2009 2:19:00pm |
re: #337 vxbush
She's waiting for me to die so she can use my organs to predict the future.
/
I'd take a chicken with me next time, were I you. I hear that chicken entrails have worked for thousands of years.
Maybe a turkey, if you're feeling extra sick.
Size matters, you know.
| 352 |
Shug Mon, Jul 27, 2009 2:19:19pm |
re: #347 callahan23
What you are standing upright while blogging? ;-)
I'm standing up for Chuck, just like Biden Said to do
| 353 |
vxbush Mon, Jul 27, 2009 2:19:36pm |
re: #351 razorbacker
I'd take a chicken with me next time, were I you. I hear that chicken entrails have worked for thousands of years.
Maybe a turkey, if you're feeling extra sick.
Size matters, you know.
Well, in that case, I should probably take a bull with me. But I don't exactly have room for one in my purse.
| 354 |
Kragar Mon, Jul 27, 2009 2:19:42pm |
re: #350 Alaska Kim
with beans?
Of course with beans. What kind of sick bastard makes chili without beans?
| 355 |
Kosh's Shadow Mon, Jul 27, 2009 2:20:01pm |
re: #286 vxbush
But this raises an interesting question:
Did the creators of DS9 steal from Ursula Le Guin when they created a character named Odo?
/obscure Trek question
They probably both took Odo from one of the actual medieval Odo's
[Link: en.wikipedia.org...]
| 358 |
calcajun Mon, Jul 27, 2009 2:21:13pm |
re: #354 Kragar (Proud to be Kafir)
I do. Beans ain't natural in chili.
| 359 |
vxbush Mon, Jul 27, 2009 2:21:19pm |
re: #355 Kosh's Shadow
They probably both took Odo from one of the actual medieval Odo's
[Link: en.wikipedia.org...]
Odo de St Amand, grandmaster of the Knights Templar, 12th century
Egads! A templar connection! I KNEW IT!
/
| 360 |
Alaska Kim Mon, Jul 27, 2009 2:21:27pm |
re: #354 Kragar (Proud to be Kafir)
Of course with beans. What kind of sick bastard makes chili without beans?
I don't put beans in my venison or moose chili!!
We are a little bass-ackwards up here though.
| 361 |
Ward Cleaver Mon, Jul 27, 2009 2:21:27pm |
Meanwhile, Sacha Baron Cohen has pissed off the al Aqsa Martyrs' Brigades:
Terrorists Threaten Sacha Baron Cohen Over 'Bruno' Depiction
| 362 |
DEZes Mon, Jul 27, 2009 2:21:32pm |
re: #317 sharkjumper
For hundreds of years, humans have known the Earth is round, We have pictures from space to prove it, yet idiots still loin the Flat Earth Society.
And no amount of proof will derail their delusions.
Sound familiar?
| 363 |
yochanan Mon, Jul 27, 2009 2:21:40pm |
[Link: en.wikipedia.org...]
they say it is 22 floors but you got a lot of space up there and not a lot of people so no real need to go way up.
| 364 |
Vicious Babushka Mon, Jul 27, 2009 2:21:44pm |
re: #272 iceweasel
That's very different from what you named your link. And I wonder where you got that title, since the title of the article itself is "Very PC police force issues its WPCs with Muslim headscarves complete with badge for mosque visits".
I don't find this "PC" or "weird". I cover my head when I visit a mosque. Men of all religions wear a yarmulke in a synagogue. This is just good manners.
Do the police also have special department-issued yarmulkas (or shaitels for women officers) if they must visit a synagogue on official business?
If mosques are being singled out for extra-special stepping on eggshells politeness, then there is some PC bowing and scraping going on.
| 365 |
razorbacker Mon, Jul 27, 2009 2:21:53pm |
re: #357 buzzsawmonkey
PIMF "tail" = "tale"
No. I'm pretty sure that you had it right the first time.
That one may have well come from your tail.
| 366 |
DEZes Mon, Jul 27, 2009 2:22:10pm |
re: #362 DEZes
For hundreds of years, humans have known the Earth is round, We have pictures from space to prove it, yet idiots still join the Flat Earth Society.
And no amount of proof will derail their delusions.
Sound familiar?
pimf.
| 367 |
KansasMom Mon, Jul 27, 2009 2:22:20pm |
re: #336 iceweasel
Bullshit. It's mere politeness and it facilitates good relations with the community. No one is making them wear a burka.
You cover your head if you're a female visiting a mosque, no matter the reason-- just like men cover their heads when visiting a synagogue, and women visiting Catholic churches used to have to cover their heads.
But they aren't asking it out of courtesy, they are requiring it, correct?
Do they have a similar policy for men who enter Sikh temples?
| 368 |
zombie Mon, Jul 27, 2009 2:22:23pm |
re: #272 iceweasel
That's very different from what you named your link. And I wonder where you got that title, since the title of the article itself is "Very PC police force issues its WPCs with Muslim headscarves complete with badge for mosque visits".
I don't find this "PC" or "weird". I cover my head when I visit a mosque. Men of all religions wear a yarmulke in a synagogue. This is just good manners.
Good manners?
GOOD MANNERS?!?!?
Police work is not about good manners or "respecting other people's cultural norms." It's about enforcing the freakin' law.
Cops have the right to be, and frequently are, the rudest people imaginable.
"Assume the positon! Spread your legs and grab the wall!"
"Drop the weapon or I will shoot."
"GET ON THE GROUND NOW!"
I don't want my police force to exhibit good manners. I want them to be forceful and make criminals tremble.
| 370 |
Alaska Kim Mon, Jul 27, 2009 2:22:41pm |
re: #363 yochanan
[Link: en.wikipedia.org...]
they say it is 22 floors but you got a lot of space up there and not a lot of people so no real need to go way up.
yep.
| 371 |
Sharmuta Mon, Jul 27, 2009 2:22:43pm |
re: #318 iceweasel
Interestingly, the article is all about covering your head when you visit a mosque in the course of an investigation.
Not about forbidding women to chase subjects into a mosque unless they cover their head, etc.
My guess is these hijabs are for outreach visits, and not intended for criminal pursuits.
| 372 |
Shug Mon, Jul 27, 2009 2:22:50pm |
re: #361 Ward Cleaver
Meanwhile, Sacha Baron Cohen has pissed off the al Aqsa Martyrs' Brigades:
Terrorists Threaten Sacha Baron Cohen Over 'Bruno' Depiction
that's serious.
He can make fun of rednecks, Jews, Frat boys, republicans, southerners, Americans, etc etc
but he's messed with the wrong people. they don't f*uck around
| 373 |
Kragar Mon, Jul 27, 2009 2:23:27pm |
| 375 |
Ward Cleaver Mon, Jul 27, 2009 2:23:31pm |
re: #358 calcajun
I do. Beans ain't natural in chili.
Damn right. Chilihead Frank X. Tolbert knew that.
| 376 |
lobo91 Mon, Jul 27, 2009 2:23:41pm |
re: #364 Alouette
Do the police also have special department-issued yarmulkas (or shaitels for women officers) if they must visit a synagogue on official business?
If mosques are being singled out for extra-special stepping on eggshells politeness, then there is some PC bowing and scraping going on.
Are there still synagogues in England?
| 377 |
BARACK THE VOTE Mon, Jul 27, 2009 2:23:54pm |
re: #324 opnion
Ice the Hajib is widely considered a symbvol of subjugation, not universally but widely. I don't think that it is a good idea for female cops looking subjugated on police business.
You know that many muslim men insist on the female head covering in any situation.
Look, that just isn't true, despite the significance the hijab has within the Muslim community. We're talking about tying a scarf over your hair for a few minutes when inside the mosque.
This isn't a big deal. It's a sign of respect. If you're a non-Muslim female and you visit any mosque-- say the Blue Mosque in istanbul, and you're there just to take pictures-- it's a sign of respect to cover your hair. And everyone takes off their shoes. It's not 'submission'.
And it's no different from the way men are supposed to behave in synagogues, or all women were supposed to behave when visiting cathedrals until recently (and in some places, are still expected to).
| 378 |
Fat Bastard Vegetarian Mon, Jul 27, 2009 2:24:27pm |
re: #354 Kragar (Proud to be Kafir)
Of course with beans. What kind of sick bastard makes chili without beans?
I've made it with peanuts.
| 379 |
Alaska Kim Mon, Jul 27, 2009 2:24:34pm |
re: #374 yochanan
is moose the alaskan national dish?
never heard of an Alaskan National Dish. But if there was one i'm sure it'd be salmon.
| 381 |
zombie Mon, Jul 27, 2009 2:24:47pm |
re: #336 iceweasel
Bullshit. It's mere politeness and it facilitates good relations with the community. No one is making them wear a burka.
You cover your head if you're a female visiting a mosque, no matter the reason-- just like men cover their heads when visiting a synagogue, and women visiting Catholic churches used to have to cover their heads.
I will retract everything I said when you can provide me with a link showing that British cops are required to wear yarmulkes in synagogues or that female cops cover their heads in Catholic churches.
You have ten minutes. After which, I will presume you can't provide the link, and I will consider that you have lost this round.
| 383 |
Shug Mon, Jul 27, 2009 2:25:05pm |
| 384 |
MandyManners Mon, Jul 27, 2009 2:25:14pm |
re: #377 iceweasel
Look, that just isn't true, despite the significance the hijab has within the Muslim community. We're talking about tying a scarf over your hair for a few minutes when inside the mosque.
This isn't a big deal. It's a sign of respect. If you're a non-Muslim female and you visit any mosque-- say the Blue Mosque in istanbul, and you're there just to take pictures-- it's a sign of respect to cover your hair. And everyone takes off their shoes. It's not 'submission'.
And it's no different from the way men are supposed to behave in synagogues, or all women were supposed to behave when visiting cathedrals until recently (and in some places, are still expected to).
They're not visiting. They're conducting police business.
| 385 |
Alaska Kim Mon, Jul 27, 2009 2:25:41pm |
| 386 |
yochanan Mon, Jul 27, 2009 2:25:43pm |
re: #368 zombie
i agree but there are times when 'officer friendly' has a use too.
| 387 |
Kragar Mon, Jul 27, 2009 2:25:46pm |
re: #378 Fat Bastard Vegetarian
I've made it with peanuts.
What you do alone at home is your own business.
///
| 389 |
Mad Prophet Ludwig Mon, Jul 27, 2009 2:26:21pm |
There is only one thing in Charles commentaries here on the nirther fools that I have to disagree with.
Charles asks "how any GOP brains have been infected with the Nirther virus..." or something very close to that.
I disagree because those congressmen we saw behaving badly and Rush and Ann Coulter are not infected with this. They don't really believe it at all. What they would like to do, particularly the congressmen - our elected leaders - is just sow doubt without actually having to say it themselves.
It is nothing more than the most crass and callow politics. It is also utterly chickenshit. No, they don't get up there and say, "I think he was born somewhere else..." they play the "some people say" game. It is nothing more than a sophistry to spread a rumor while hoping to appear like a concerned and reasonable fellow.
If they truly believed it, they would just say so and scream bloody murder. If there were a shred of truth to it, it would be a GOP panacea. However, they know it isn't true and that honestly pushing it to a court would get them slammed.
They know that they are not actually responsible caring and reasonable fellow who took their duties as legislators seriously. If they did, and thank G-d, for the one to actually act like someone with some sense of duty, they would look into it and announce that there is nothing to this story and move on to real issues.
BUt the GOP isn't interested in winning on the issues. So instead they simply hope that they can undermine the president on false pretenses enough that the rumor mill will help them in the next round of votes.
It is utterly chickenshit. It is utterly dishonest, and it is yet another reason why, when I see the GOP elected "leadership" running away (that congresscritter literally ran away! What courage of conviction!) pretending to look at pens and obfuscating with bizarre double speak, that I am again saddened by my need to be an independent.
We have real problems to deal with. The Dems are doing all sorts of things that aren't so good. But then again the GOP ain't worth shit either.
| 390 |
lobo91 Mon, Jul 27, 2009 2:26:28pm |
re: #368 zombie
Good manners?
GOOD MANNERS?!?!?
Police work is not about good manners or "respecting other people's cultural norms." It's about enforcing the freakin' law.Cops have the right to be, and frequently are, the rudest people imaginable.
"Assume the positon! Spread your legs and grab the wall!"
"Drop the weapon or I will shoot."
"GET ON THE GROUND NOW!"
I don't want my police force to exhibit good manners. I want them to be forceful and make criminals tremble.
Remember, we're talking about British police here.
| 391 |
Kosh's Shadow Mon, Jul 27, 2009 2:26:30pm |
re: #361 Ward Cleaver
Meanwhile, Sacha Baron Cohen has pissed off the al Aqsa Martyrs' Brigades:
Terrorists Threaten Sacha Baron Cohen Over 'Bruno' Depiction
You mean he didn't piss them off enough by being Jewish?
| 392 |
MandyManners Mon, Jul 27, 2009 2:26:32pm |
re: #387 Kragar (Proud to be Kafir)
What you do alone at home is your own business.
///
I just spat out my cigarette again.
| 393 |
Fat Bastard Vegetarian Mon, Jul 27, 2009 2:27:00pm |
| 394 |
calcajun Mon, Jul 27, 2009 2:27:09pm |
re: #373 Kragar (Proud to be Kafir)
Of course you know, this means war.//
| 395 |
BARACK THE VOTE Mon, Jul 27, 2009 2:27:19pm |
re: #368 zombie
Good manners?
GOOD MANNERS?!?!?
Police work is not about good manners or "respecting other people's cultural norms." It's about enforcing the freakin' law..
Wrong. Talk to some beat cops. Talk to actual officers who work within a community.
It's not some Rambo fantasy of busting in and enforcing law.
It's about being part of a community and helping them. You see them every day. You work there.
That's how you get frightened people to confide in cops, and get people to call them, capiche?
| 397 |
doppelganglander Mon, Jul 27, 2009 2:27:30pm |
re: #336 iceweasel
Bullshit. It's mere politeness and it facilitates good relations with the community. No one is making them wear a burka.
You cover your head if you're a female visiting a mosque, no matter the reason-- just like men cover their heads when visiting a synagogue, and women visiting Catholic churches used to have to cover their heads.
Hence the hat, which is part of the normal uniform. When I was a child, covering your head in a Catholic church could be something as simple as a barrette and applied only in the sanctuary, not the offices, school or elsewhere on church property. Likewise, I believe the yarmulke is only worn in worship, not for visiting the rabbi in his office. (I'd appreciate confirmation or correction from one of our Jewish lizards.) In this case, Muslims are demanding special concessions from the police, particularly the female officers, in a way that diminishes the officers' authority. I stand by what I said.
| 398 |
Digital Display Mon, Jul 27, 2009 2:27:54pm |
OT...
So I just TIVO'd the Doors movie...Ok I have always made fun of Val Kilmer..
I can't believe how great he was in this movie... Just outstanding...I usually judge the roles of falling into drugs and insanity to like Sharron Stone in Casino...a slow digression into hell on film... But this is the best ever for an actor...I am blown away...They give the film 3 stars.. They are nuts..5 stars for the acting..IMO
| 399 |
calcajun Mon, Jul 27, 2009 2:27:58pm |
re: #390 lobo91
Remember, we're talking about British police here.
I love robbing the English. They're so polite.-- Kevin Kline.
| 400 |
Alaska Kim Mon, Jul 27, 2009 2:28:00pm |
You folks on the east coast do some weird shit with peanuts!! heh
| 401 |
Ayeless in Ghazi Mon, Jul 27, 2009 2:28:18pm |
re: #149 zombie
The dhimmification proceeds:
Check out the pictures.
Bit of an exaggeration there, zombie. They are only talking about putting on the hijab before going into a mosque.
Women police officers are being issued with headscarves to wear when they visit a mosque. They are expected to put the scarfs on shortly before they enter the mosque, in keeping with Islamic custom.
| 402 |
Sharmuta Mon, Jul 27, 2009 2:28:23pm |
re: #368 zombie
I think you're blowing this a bit out of proportion. This says "visits". And the imams said they've been working with the police the last few years. I thought that's what we wanted- for the muslim community to start policing their own and going to law enforcement with potential problems. I do not think a woman office chasing a suspect into a mosque is going to be a problem if she doesn't have on her hijab.
| 403 |
KansasMom Mon, Jul 27, 2009 2:28:24pm |
re: #377 iceweasel
Look, that just isn't true, despite the significance the hijab has within the Muslim community. We're talking about tying a scarf over your hair for a few minutes when inside the mosque.
This isn't a big deal. It's a sign of respect. If you're a non-Muslim female and you visit any mosque-- say the Blue Mosque in istanbul, and you're there just to take pictures-- it's a sign of respect to cover your hair. And everyone takes off their shoes. It's not 'submission'.
And it's no different from the way men are supposed to behave in synagogues, or all women were supposed to behave when visiting cathedrals until recently (and in some places, are still expected to).
There's a big difference in covering your head out of courtesy because you WANT to visit a mosque, and covering it because you HAVE to visit a mosque as part of your job and departmental policy requires it. Its especially bad because the job happens to be that of police officer.
If I was required by my employer to wear a headscarf I'd be gone before they could explain why.
| 404 |
calcajun Mon, Jul 27, 2009 2:28:31pm |
| 405 |
Kragar Mon, Jul 27, 2009 2:28:34pm |
| 406 |
Kosh's Shadow Mon, Jul 27, 2009 2:29:20pm |
| 407 |
calcajun Mon, Jul 27, 2009 2:29:22pm |
re: #400 Alaska Kim
You folks on the east coast do some weird shit with peanuts!! heh
When you move to Georgia, they give you a free 5-gal. can of peanut oil as a housewarming gift.
| 409 |
calcajun Mon, Jul 27, 2009 2:30:03pm |
re: #405 Kragar (Proud to be Kafir)
I could be undead, ever thought of that? There, I run rings round you logically./
| 410 |
wiffersnapper Mon, Jul 27, 2009 2:30:08pm |
I was a dollardite (patdollard.com) before becoming a lizard. I've tried my darndest to brush off the extremist rhetoric going on that site, and it's really quite frustrating. I'm still a member, but I hardly comment anymore, and rarely read any of the birth certificate/glenn beck/pro-huckabee nutjob posts.
Maybe someday they'll see that light. They're so close...
That's my story.
| 412 |
nikis-knight Mon, Jul 27, 2009 2:30:44pm |
I think this distinction matters--do the mosques want the officiers to cover because it is respectful to the mosque and the people praying there, or do they want them covered because otherwise they won't interact with a female, anywhere, if they can help it?
Is is respect when visiting Muslims, or Muslims exerting control over the larger society? (See riots over what non-muslims print in newspapers or have swirled around their ice cream cones, for example of the latter.)
| 413 |
Sharmuta Mon, Jul 27, 2009 2:30:44pm |
re: #381 zombie
Are the UK police doing outreach programs with the Jewish community due to violent extremists?
| 414 |
CyanSnowHawk Mon, Jul 27, 2009 2:30:48pm |
re: #368 zombie
"Assume the positon! Spread your legs and grab the wall!"
WTF is a positon?
I googled (images) it, and got a few NSFW results.
| 415 |
Alaska Kim Mon, Jul 27, 2009 2:30:55pm |
So that's what hick-billies use rather than KY?...just kidding!!
| 416 |
lobo91 Mon, Jul 27, 2009 2:31:22pm |
re: #397 doppelganglander
In this case, Muslims are demanding special concessions from the police, particularly the female officers, in a way that diminishes the officers' authority. I stand by what I said.
Of course they are. It's what they do as soon as they become a significantly large portion of the population.
| 417 |
FrogMarch Mon, Jul 27, 2009 2:31:24pm |
| 418 |
BARACK THE VOTE Mon, Jul 27, 2009 2:31:29pm |
re: #381 zombie
I will retract everything I said when you can provide me with a link showing that British cops are required to wear yarmulkes in synagogues or that female cops cover their heads in Catholic churches.
You have ten minutes. After which, I will presume you can't provide the link, and I will consider that you have lost this round.
I already consider you lost the round when Charles busted you, when you claimed female cops covering their heads was "dhimmitude" and you provided a misleading headline for that article. Why did you do that, I wonder?
We're done, and I'm not impressed by your dictat that I "have ten minutes". You have all the time you want to explain why you called this dhimmitude and gave a false headline.
| 421 |
Kragar Mon, Jul 27, 2009 2:32:37pm |
re: #409 calcajun
I could be undead, ever thought of that? There, I run rings round you logically./
I'm sorry, but I can't read you post. I'll have to bust out the ouija board to talk to you in the future. NEENER NEENER!
| 422 |
Mad Prophet Ludwig Mon, Jul 27, 2009 2:32:38pm |
re: #408 buzzsawmonkey
"Who was that mosqued ma'am? I wanted to thank her."
I was sipping my beer and burked when I read that.
| 423 |
KenJen Mon, Jul 27, 2009 2:32:44pm |
Senator Jim Bunning just announced he will not seek another term. I am praying that we dont end up with Rand Paul as senator. I really like Kentucky and don't want to move.
| 424 |
CyanSnowHawk Mon, Jul 27, 2009 2:33:35pm |
re: #400 Alaska Kim
You folks on the east coast do some weird shit with peanuts!! heh
They all got new 'Slap Chops' and wanted to love Vince's nuts.
| 425 |
KansasMom Mon, Jul 27, 2009 2:34:05pm |
re: #422 LudwigVanQuixote
I was sipping my beer and burked when I read that.
Its so depressing, I just want to scarf down a beer.
| 426 |
BARACK THE VOTE Mon, Jul 27, 2009 2:34:32pm |
re: #420 buzzsawmonkey
I'm sure that policewomen wearing something that can be used to throttle them in the event of an altercation is something looked on with favor by malefactors seeking sanctuary in the setting of a mosque.
How do you know those police women can't whip that off and use it to subdue a subject? :)
| 427 |
Mad Prophet Ludwig Mon, Jul 27, 2009 2:34:32pm |
re: #420 buzzsawmonkey
I'm sure that policewomen wearing something that can be used to throttle them in the event of an altercation is something looked on with favor by malefactors seeking sanctuary in the setting of a mosque.
Well said. Someone like ironfist can back me up on this, in terms of all the nasty ways that your clothing can be used against you in a fight. As a blackbelt, I went through a phase where the thought of wearing a tie freaked me out.
| 428 |
Mad Prophet Ludwig Mon, Jul 27, 2009 2:34:49pm |
| 429 |
NelsFree Mon, Jul 27, 2009 2:34:52pm |
re: #362 DEZes
For hundreds of years, humans have known the Earth is round, We have pictures from space to prove it, yet idiots still loin the Flat Earth Society.
The F.E.S. organizers loin their pockets with the dues money.
/h
| 430 |
doppelganglander Mon, Jul 27, 2009 2:35:24pm |
re: #403 KansasMom
If I was required by my employer to wear a headscarf I'd be gone before they could explain why.
Unless you're working in food prep, in a clean room, or around machinery, I can't think of a good reason.
| 431 |
Ayeless in Ghazi Mon, Jul 27, 2009 2:35:30pm |
| 432 |
Alaska Kim Mon, Jul 27, 2009 2:35:34pm |
re: #427 LudwigVanQuixote
Well
said. Someone like ironfist can back me up on this, in terms of all the
nasty ways that your clothing can be used against you in a fight. As a
blackbelt, I went through a phase where the thought of wearing a tie
freaked me out.
... interesting...
| 433 |
yochanan Mon, Jul 27, 2009 2:35:38pm |
re: #397 doppelganglander
ortho jewish males were a head covering all the time but we don't expect non jews to do it. some might wear it if they are invited to a bar mitvah or marriage but it isn't required.
| 434 |
CynicalConservative Mon, Jul 27, 2009 2:35:44pm |
re: #427 LudwigVanQuixote
Well said. Someone like ironfist can back me up on this, in terms of all the nasty ways that your clothing can be used against you in a fight. As a blackbelt, I went through a phase where the thought of wearing a tie freaked me out.
Is no more.
| 435 |
nikis-knight Mon, Jul 27, 2009 2:36:02pm |
re: #426 iceweasel
How do you know those police women can't whip that off and use it to subdue a subject? :)
We're getting way too close to NSFW here.
/
| 436 |
lobo91 Mon, Jul 27, 2009 2:36:40pm |
re: #427 LudwigVanQuixote
Well said. Someone like ironfist can back me up on this, in terms of all the nasty ways that your clothing can be used against you in a fight. As a blackbelt, I went through a phase where the thought of wearing a tie freaked me out.
Precisely why cops and security guards wear clip-on ties.
| 438 |
Sharmuta Mon, Jul 27, 2009 2:37:41pm |
re: #420 buzzsawmonkey
I'm sure that policewomen wearing something that can be used to throttle them in the event of an altercation is something looked on with favor by malefactors seeking sanctuary in the setting of a mosque.
I think that's a little insulting to the police women in the UK that they're somehow incapable of protecting themselves. I don't think they'll be attacked on community outreach visits.
| 440 |
Shug Mon, Jul 27, 2009 2:38:19pm |
re: #426 iceweasel
How do you know those police women can't whip that off and use it to subdue a subject? :)
Let me tell ya the story of a lady called Biddy McGrath
| 441 |
BARACK THE VOTE Mon, Jul 27, 2009 2:38:32pm |
re: #437 buzzsawmonkey
You are either joking in extremely poor taste, or off your nut.
As someone with a former officer in the family, I can tell you that clothing can be used against someone very easily. Furthermore, a scarf secured around the head puts the wearer at risk if someone chooses to use it against them.
As someone who also has former officers in the family, lighten up Francis.
The officers are damn well trained and I'll put my money on them every time.
| 442 |
zombie Mon, Jul 27, 2009 2:38:33pm |
re: #413 Sharmuta
Are the UK police doing outreach programs with the Jewish community due to violent extremists?
So, Muslims get extra-special deference because some are violent extremists? Other groups' customs can be casually violated because they haven't done anything wrong and don't pose a threat? Oooo-kayyy.
| 443 |
razorbacker Mon, Jul 27, 2009 2:38:50pm |
I know that it is not the same in the city, but out here in the rural areas the cops have to rely on citizen assistance to do their job.
Case in point: a few Sundays ago I went to the store to get some lawn-mower gas and noticed two deputy sheriffs parked on the side of the road. On my way back home I pulled up behind them and walked up and ask 'Who y'all waiting for?'
They told me and I said, 'He ain't home. He stays with his girlfriend on the weekends. Y'all oughta go over to her house if you want him.'
They got directions, thanked me, and went over and arrested the guy.
| 444 |
Vicious Babushka Mon, Jul 27, 2009 2:38:55pm |
re: #377 iceweasel
Look, that just isn't true, despite the significance the hijab has within the Muslim community. We're talking about tying a scarf over your hair for a few minutes when inside the mosque.
This isn't a big deal. It's a sign of respect. If you're a non-Muslim female and you visit any mosque-- say the Blue Mosque in istanbul, and you're there just to take pictures-- it's a sign of respect to cover your hair. And everyone takes off their shoes. It's not 'submission'.
And it's no different from the way men are supposed to behave in synagogues, or all women were supposed to behave when visiting cathedrals until recently (and in some places, are still expected to).
No, it's not just about respecting customs and tying a babushka over your head. It's the designing and issuing special Police Department babushkas and then giving classes on how to tie them, etc.
If they don't also have special Police issue yarmulkas, Sikh turbans, with appropriate classes, then THIS IS PC SPECIAL PROTECTION.
| 446 |
Mad Prophet Ludwig Mon, Jul 27, 2009 2:39:28pm |
| 447 |
doppelganglander Mon, Jul 27, 2009 2:39:38pm |
re: #433 yochanan
Thank you. I think the key phrase there is "we don't expect non-Jews to do it." I do agree it is a courteous and proper thing to do if you are a guest.
| 448 |
nikis-knight Mon, Jul 27, 2009 2:39:41pm |
re: #442 zombie
So, Muslims get extra-special deference because some are violent extremists? Other groups' customs can be casually violated because they haven't done anything wrong and don't pose a threat? Oooo-kayyy.
And the sun rose in the east today.
| 449 |
lobo91 Mon, Jul 27, 2009 2:39:56pm |
re: #442 zombie
So, Muslims get extra-special deference because some are violent extremists? Other groups' customs can be casually violated because they haven't done anything wrong and don't pose a threat? Oooo-kayyy.
That's about the size of it.
| 450 |
Sharmuta Mon, Jul 27, 2009 2:39:59pm |
re: #442 zombie
Render already said a hat was enough according to his rabbi, so no customs would be violated if the offices have hats on.
| 451 |
Russkilitlover Mon, Jul 27, 2009 2:40:06pm |
re: #402 Sharmuta
I think you're blowing this a bit out of proportion. This says "visits". And the imams said they've been working with the police the last few years. I thought that's what we wanted- for the muslim community to start policing their own and going to law enforcement with potential problems. I do not think a woman office chasing a suspect into a mosque is going to be a problem if she doesn't have on her hijab.
What's wrong with her police hat? Why the special accommodation just for the Muslim community. Dhimmitude on display. It starts small.
| 452 |
Charles Johnson Mon, Jul 27, 2009 2:40:07pm |
Well, I've been to the Blue Mosque in Istanbul on two different tours, and both times we had females with us when we went -- and they were indeed required to put on a veil before entering. We men, of course, being lords of the world, only had to take off our shoes.
We had a female drummer who wore a baseball cap, and that wasn't good enough. She had to replace it with the veil. (She hated it, too.)
| 454 |
Ayeless in Ghazi Mon, Jul 27, 2009 2:40:30pm |
re: #395 iceweasel
Wrong. Talk to some beat cops. Talk to actual officers who work within a community.
It's not some Rambo fantasy of busting in and enforcing law.It's about being part of a community and helping them. You see them every day. You work there.
That's how you get frightened people to confide in cops, and get people to call them, capiche?
I'm sure Al Mujaharoun etc would absolutely love it if the police were to start a policy of 'no manners'.
"We're here to investigate your stinking mosque. Don't expect any pleasantries. And someone get me an ashtray - on the double."
| 455 |
BARACK THE VOTE Mon, Jul 27, 2009 2:40:30pm |
re: #433 yochanan
ortho jewish males were a head covering all the time but we don't expect non jews to do it. some might wear it if they are invited to a bar mitvah or marriage but it isn't required.
Similarly, it is not required that a woman cover her head in a mosque-- it's a sign of good manners and politeness.
| 456 |
Killgore Trout Mon, Jul 27, 2009 2:40:51pm |
re: #418 iceweasel
No need to be a dick about it. I'll also object to the policy on the grounds that it's discriminatory. Only women have to wear a special outfit to comply with their custom/phobia. Ismal does not have the best track record when it comes to women's rights and I think it's a bad idea to coddle to it. Imagine if I had a religion that required special outfits for black people. Do you think the police would cater to that?
| 457 |
CynicalConservative Mon, Jul 27, 2009 2:41:31pm |
| 458 |
Shug Mon, Jul 27, 2009 2:42:14pm |
| 459 |
zombie Mon, Jul 27, 2009 2:42:15pm |
re: #418 iceweasel
I already consider you lost the round when Charles busted you, when you claimed female cops covering their heads was "dhimmitude" and you provided a misleading headline for that article. Why did you do that, I wonder?
We're done, and I'm not impressed by your dictat that I "have ten minutes". You have all the time you want to explain why you called this dhimmitude and gave a false headline.
It is dhimmitude, plain and simple.
And I said in comment #256 that I amend the headline to add the phrase "in mosques."
Meanwhile, I'm still waiting on that link. Oops, sorry there is no such link because there is no such policy.
Only one religion or social group gets its customs honored by the police. That is dhimmitude.
| 461 |
doppelganglander Mon, Jul 27, 2009 2:43:07pm |
re: #455 iceweasel
Similarly, it is not required that a woman cover her head in a mosque-- it's a sign of good manners and politeness.
Please, grab your video camera, and head over to your local mosque and try to enter without a headcovering. I will be waiting for you to post the video on You Tube. It's bound to be enlightening.
| 462 |
Truck Monkey Mon, Jul 27, 2009 2:43:36pm |
re: #452 Charles
Well, I've been to the Blue Mosque in Istanbul on two different tours, and both times we had females with us when we went -- and they were indeed required to put on a veil before entering. We men, of course, being lords of the world, only had to take off our shoes.
We had a female drummer who wore a baseball cap, and that wasn't good enough. She had to replace it with the veil. (She hated it, too.)
True dat. Was there a couple times myself and found this to be true. They let us in, regardless of our religious affiliation, if we followed their rules. I'll always remember the smell. High School gym sweatsocks that hadn't been washed for a month mixed with very ripe cheese. Beautiful mosque IMO.
| 463 |
LGoPs Mon, Jul 27, 2009 2:43:39pm |
re: #298 iceweasel
If she's in a house of worship-- and a mosque is a house of worship-- even if she's on official business she should observes the custom. It's about showing respect and being polite.
Couldn't disagree more. Official business is the operant phrase here. I wouldn't expect a protestant cop to genuflect inside a Catholic Church either. I lived in Saudi Arabia and went into mosques and still didn't wear whatever they call the headgear that men wear.
I was respectful of the place but I was not a Muslim and didn't feel compelled or pressured to wear it.
| 464 |
sattv4u2 Mon, Jul 27, 2009 2:43:42pm |
re: #452 Charles
We had a female drummer who wore a baseball cap, and that wasn't good enough. She had to replace it with the veil. (She hated it, too.)
I also have toured there. We too had a female who objected. Her answer was to not go in!
| 466 |
Killgore Trout Mon, Jul 27, 2009 2:43:56pm |
re: #452 Charles
I have no problem with that in Turkey but shouldn't Muslims in the UK be tolerant enough to accept an unveiled woman? I've been in mosques in India and China where everyone had to take off shoes but no veil was required for women. It's not really a universal law.
| 468 |
Sharmuta Mon, Jul 27, 2009 2:44:10pm |
re: #456 Killgore Trout
Others are not being very polite either.
| 469 |
NelsFree Mon, Jul 27, 2009 2:44:43pm |
re: #427 LudwigVanQuixote
Well said. Someone like ironfist can back me up on this, in terms of all the nasty ways that your clothing can be used against you in a fight.
Ironfist will not be backing you or anyone else on this blog up for the forseeable future.As a blackbelt, I went through a phase where the thought of wearing a tie freaked me out.
So now you have something in common with Achmedinnerjacket. Ouch.
| 471 |
_RememberTonyC Mon, Jul 27, 2009 2:45:57pm |
re: #149 zombie
The dhimmification proceeds:
Check out the pictures.
what's even more messed up? the comments from readers SUPPORTING this lunacy. Goodbye Britain, we're going to miss you very much.
| 473 |
sattv4u2 Mon, Jul 27, 2009 2:46:12pm |
re: #466 Killgore Trout
I have no problem with that in Turkey but shouldn't Muslims in the UK be tolerant enough to accept an unveiled woman? I've been in mosques in India and China where everyone had to take off shoes but no veil was required for women. It's not really a universal law.
Fine line you've drawn there. It's okay to follow the custom of taking off ones shoes, but as you stated in the previous post you OBJECT to the custom of a woman being veiled!
| 474 |
Shug Mon, Jul 27, 2009 2:46:45pm |
re: #471 _RememberTonyC
what's even more messed up? the comments from readers SUPPORTING this lunacy. Goodbye Britain, we're going to miss you very much.
Forrest Gump would say : dhimmi is as dhimmi does
| 475 |
Charpete67 Mon, Jul 27, 2009 2:46:54pm |
re: #381 zombie
I will retract everything I said when you can provide me with a link showing that British cops are required to wear yarmulkes in synagogues or that female cops cover their heads in Catholic churches.
You have ten minutes. After which, I will presume you can't provide the link, and I will consider that you have lost this round.
I was going to make the point that muslims don't respect other houses of worship...so, I googled "muslims bomb church" and without much effort, I found hundreds of hits. The first hit I came across was this recent bombing in the Philippines. - [Link: www.timesonline.co.uk...]
I wanted to take this one quote out...I gotta meet this group...
"This is the handiwork of the rogue members of the Moro Islamic Liberation Front (MILF)," Colonel Ponce told reporters, referring to the Muslim organisation which has waged a decades long battle for self rule in the southern island of Mindanao."
| 476 |
FrogMarch Mon, Jul 27, 2009 2:47:27pm |
re: #368 zombie
For that post - there are not enough up-dings in the world.
| 477 |
nikis-knight Mon, Jul 27, 2009 2:47:30pm |
re: #473 sattv4u2
Fine line you've drawn there. It's okay to follow the custom of taking off ones shoes, but as you stated in the previous post you OBJECT to the custom of a woman being veiled!
That wasn't the line he drew. The line was in what culture was it being asked, and was it being applied equally, if I follow.
| 478 |
callahan23 Mon, Jul 27, 2009 2:47:56pm |
re: #471 _RememberTonyC
what's even more messed up? the comments from readers SUPPORTING this lunacy. Goodbye Britain, we're going to miss you very much.
And I lived and studied there. Loved that place up to a point ...
| 479 |
Ayeless in Ghazi Mon, Jul 27, 2009 2:48:18pm |
re: #456 Killgore Trout
I'm not a fan of Islamic headwear either, but I'm also not a fan of ridiculously exagerrated headlines/distortions. What disturbs me is that some people seem to want to believe the worst,(especially when it pertains to the UK) and are disappointed when you point out that in reality things aren't quite as bad as they are being made out to be.
| 480 |
sattv4u2 Mon, Jul 27, 2009 2:48:31pm |
re: #477 nikis-knight
That wasn't the line he drew. The line was in what culture was it being asked, and was it being applied equally, if I follow.
Same religion, same more's. Does it matter in WHAT country it's being practiced?
| 481 |
Vicious Babushka Mon, Jul 27, 2009 2:48:58pm |
re: #426 iceweasel
How do you know those police women can't whip that off and use it to subdue a subject? :)
If a female officer whipped off the department-issued hijab and used it to subdue a male subject in a mosque, she would be instantly sacked and have to go into hiding for the rest of her life, and the shrieks of "Islamophobia!" and "police brutality!" would be so loud you could hear them in San Francisco from the UK.
| 482 |
BARACK THE VOTE Mon, Jul 27, 2009 2:49:00pm |
re: #452 Charles
Charles-- was it a veil, or just the head covering? i was there last in 2002 and it was just a request that you wear a headscarf. They were also letting in women who weren't dressed modestly at all by any standards for any religious building-- as in, very short shorts, halters, etc. They were willing to let women in without the headscarf-- it wasn't a demand, or anything-- but it was a suggestion (and clear that it would make people unhappy if you didn't wear it; it would be rude)
To be honest, the Blue Mosque in istanbul was a lot more tolerant of me than all the mosques I've visited in the US-- maybe because the Blue Mosque is such a massive tourist destination.
| 483 |
NelsFree Mon, Jul 27, 2009 2:49:27pm |
re: #452 Charles
Well, I've been to the Blue Mosque in Istanbul on two different tours,
If you visit the hagia sophia, a church converted to a mosque, and are Christian, you are forbidden to pray inside. H'mph.
| 484 |
zombie Mon, Jul 27, 2009 2:49:36pm |
re: #452 Charles
Well, I've been to the Blue Mosque in Istanbul on two different tours, and both times we had females with us when we went -- and they were indeed required to put on a veil before entering. We men, of course, being lords of the world, only had to take off our shoes.
We had a female drummer who wore a baseball cap, and that wasn't good enough. She had to replace it with the veil. (She hated it, too.)
That's Turkey, a Muslim nation. It is to be expected there.
We're talking about Britain, a theoretically secular society. (For now, at least.) Big big difference.
I'm sure that in Turkey and any other Muslim nation they have all sorts of rules about deference to or adherence to islamic laws or customs. I have no problem with that. But where my jaw hits the floor is when non-Muslim countries like Britain enforce the same rules.
| 485 |
Charles Johnson Mon, Jul 27, 2009 2:49:40pm |
I think I need more info before deciding whether the veils are really an example of dhimmitude. If the policewomen are part of community outreach programs, I don't really see too much wrong with being polite. There's not much point in reaching out if you offend people just by walking in.
I doubt they expect policewomen to stop and put on the veil if they're chasing a terrorist into a mosque.
| 486 |
Sharmuta Mon, Jul 27, 2009 2:49:53pm |
re: #466 Killgore Trout
I have no problem with that in Turkey but shouldn't Muslims in the UK be tolerant enough to accept an unveiled woman? I've been in mosques in India and China where everyone had to take off shoes but no veil was required for women. It's not really a universal law.
I think police work involving community outreach is about manners and establishing trust. If we want UK muslims policing their own- they need to trust the cops. Do I like this- not really. But I would like to see more scenes like we did a few weeks ago with muslims protesting the against the radicals in their own community.
To hell with it- let the next great euro-war begin. Some want it.
| 487 |
calcajun Mon, Jul 27, 2009 2:49:55pm |
re: #468 Sharmuta
You are required to be better and rise above it.
| 488 |
Shug Mon, Jul 27, 2009 2:50:13pm |
re: #481 Alouette
If a female officer whipped off the department-issued hijab and used it to subdue a male subject in a mosque, she would be instantly sacked and have to go into hiding for the rest of her life, and the shrieks of "Islamophobia!" and "police brutality!" would be so loud you could hear them in San Francisco from the UK.
She would be charged with a Hate Crime for the humiliation she inflicted on the perp.
the perp would get 10 million pounds and an apology from Gordon Brown
| 489 |
Russkilitlover Mon, Jul 27, 2009 2:50:14pm |
re: #456 Killgore Trout
No need to be a dick about it. I'll also object to the policy on the grounds that it's discriminatory. Only women have to wear a special outfit to comply with their custom/phobia. Ismal does not have the best track record when it comes to women's rights and I think it's a bad idea to coddle to it. Imagine if I had a religion that required special outfits for black people. Do you think the police would cater to that?
Do male police officers have to remove their shoes?
| 491 |
Mad Prophet Ludwig Mon, Jul 27, 2009 2:50:35pm |
re: #442 zombie
So, Muslims get extra-special deference because some are violent extremists? Other groups' customs can be casually violated because they haven't done anything wrong and don't pose a threat? Oooo-kayyy.
There was some black humor at the synagogue the other day.
It went something like, why don't we convince the world that if they mess with us, deface a synagogue, desecrate a cemetery or shout evil anti Jewish slogans, there will be consequences.
The speaker actually got into his rant a little. He brought up how the Muslims have the whole world so scared of them that the West cowers.
I sopke up. I said,
Unnecessary violence is evil and it is no not the Torah way. But aside from that, there is the fact that if we tried it, it would be different. If we did 1/10 of the things that the Muslims do, the average Westerner would come to kill us. Seriously, if Jews were regularly threatening to blow things up if we didn't get this or that other concession to our Judaism, and we shouted death to America and we made decapitation videos, we would be slaughtered in the streets.
| 492 |
BARACK THE VOTE Mon, Jul 27, 2009 2:50:48pm |
re: #479 Jimmah
I'm not a fan of Islamic headwear either, but I'm also not a fan of ridiculously exagerrated headlines/distortions. What disturbs me is that some people seem to want to believe the worst,(especially when it pertains to the UK) and are disappointed when you point out that in reality things aren't quite as bad as they are being made out to be.
Exactly. Not just disappointed, but angry.
| 494 |
capitalist piglet Mon, Jul 27, 2009 2:51:05pm |
re: #456 Killgore Trout
No need to be a dick about it. I'll also object to the policy on the grounds that it's discriminatory. Only women have to wear a special outfit to comply with their custom/phobia. Ismal does not have the best track record when it comes to women's rights and I think it's a bad idea to coddle to it. Imagine if I had a religion that required special outfits for black people. Do you think the police would cater to that?
Right on, Killgore. Very well said.
| 495 |
lobo91 Mon, Jul 27, 2009 2:51:12pm |
re: #466 Killgore Trout
I have no problem with that in Turkey but shouldn't Muslims in the UK be tolerant enough to accept an unveiled woman?
Shoud they be? Of course.
And then there's reality. The "Muslim community" in Britain won't take this as a sign of respect. They'll take it as a victory over the stupid infidels.
| 496 |
KansasMom Mon, Jul 27, 2009 2:51:20pm |
re: #452 Charles
Well, I've been to the Blue Mosque in Istanbul on two different tours, and both times we had females with us when we went -- and they were indeed required to put on a veil before entering. We men, of course, being lords of the world, only had to take off our shoes.
We had a female drummer who wore a baseball cap, and that wasn't good enough. She had to replace it with the veil. (She hated it, too.)
I went to a mosque once with some friends in college. While I was there, in the women's section of course, an Asian woman with a loose fitting cloth over her head was fumbling around with her baby and diaper bag, and her head covering slipped a little. An Arab woman grabbed one of the extra head scarfs they keep in a bin by the door and shoved it over the other woman's head roughly. It was rude and meant to be rude. I understand how seriously the headscarf rule in a mosque is taken by muslims. (And yes, a scarf is absolutely required for women to enter.) I also understand how important it is to show respect when you are entering as a guest.
But I have to object to policewomen being required to wear religious garb (which many consider denegrading) as part of their job. If it is so important, rather than sabotage the authority the policewomen have, perhaps they should meet in another community center.
| 497 |
FrogMarch Mon, Jul 27, 2009 2:51:20pm |
re: #395 iceweasel
Wrong. Talk to some beat cops. Talk to actual officers who work within a community.
It's not some Rambo fantasy of busting in and enforcing law.It's about being part of a community and helping them. You see them every day. You work there.
That's how you get frightened people to confide in cops, and get people to call them, capiche?
Police officers in civilized western nations typically enforce the law- they are not community organizers.
| 498 |
Catttt Mon, Jul 27, 2009 2:51:21pm |
re: #24 sharkjumper
“Is there anything you can say to make the Birthers go away?”
Yes. Obama's long form, vault copy birth certificate.
As a Nirther who otherwise loves LGF, I assure you that there is nothing we'd love more than to be proven WRONG.
My apologies to Charles for infesting the GOP, but please understand, we Nirthers infest the Demonrat party too.
I think you are full of shit. Go back to your chew toy forum.
| 499 |
razorbacker Mon, Jul 27, 2009 2:51:30pm |
I see that I need to go put that which I wish to remain dry under roof.
Y'all have a nice day, or what is left of it.
| 500 |
Mich-again Mon, Jul 27, 2009 2:51:38pm |
Is the policewoman allowed to drive the police car in the parking lot at the Mosque?
| 501 |
Killgore Trout Mon, Jul 27, 2009 2:51:43pm |
re: #468 Sharmuta
Ok, I haven't been reading all the posts.
| 502 |
Kragar Mon, Jul 27, 2009 2:52:45pm |
re: #500 Mich-again
Is the policewoman allowed to drive the police car in the parking lot at the Mosque?
Of course they are, assuming their husband or a male family member over the age of 13 is in the car with them.
/
| 503 |
Shug Mon, Jul 27, 2009 2:52:45pm |
re: #500 Mich-again
Is the policewoman allowed to drive the police car in the parking lot at the Mosque?
London today
Dearborn Tomorrow
| 505 |
sattv4u2 Mon, Jul 27, 2009 2:52:55pm |
re: #497 FrogMarch
Police officers in civilized western nations typically enforce the law- they are not community organizers.
Sorry, but you're just wrong. I site the DARE program as example one!
[Link: www.dare.com...]
| 506 |
lawhawk Mon, Jul 27, 2009 2:52:55pm |
So, Drudge is headlining that Congress is contemplating an excise tax on cosmetic surgery. They might want to look at New Jersey. NJ passed a cosmetic medical surgical procedure excise tax a few years back. It's a 6% tax on cosmetic medical procedures but the kicker is that those procedures that serve to prevent or treat illness or disease or promote proper functioning of the body are exempt from the tax.
A nose job could be considered necessary to improve the proper functioning of the body. Ditto gastric bypass or some other common types of plastic surgery.
Tummy tucks and facelifts? Not so much, though I'm sure someone would be creative and get those exempted from the tax.
New Jersey doesn't exactly get a whole lot of money from that tax. Just under $30 million since it was adopted in 2004. Yeah, that'll really work.
| 507 |
michaelasher Mon, Jul 27, 2009 2:53:19pm |
This reason he hasn't released his original birth certificate is obviously not because he was born outside this country. So what's the reason?
1) Stanley Ann never gave it to him.
2) He lost it.
3) It lists him as Caucasian.
4) It lists a father other than Barack Obama, Sr.
5) Alinskyesque move to make conservatives look ridiculous.
6) Immaculate conception.
| 508 |
doppelganglander Mon, Jul 27, 2009 2:53:26pm |
re: #452 Charles
Well, I've been to the Blue Mosque in Istanbul on two different tours, and both times we had females with us when we went -- and they were indeed required to put on a veil before entering. We men, of course, being lords of the world, only had to take off our shoes.
We had a female drummer who wore a baseball cap, and that wasn't good enough. She had to replace it with the veil. (She hated it, too.)
If I were visiting the Blue Mosque, and I wanted to see it badly enough, I would put on a veil to do it. It's their house, their rules, especially if you are in the area where services are conducted. However, while performing official law enforcement business in a non-Islamic country, I think a normal policewoman's hat ought to suffice.
| 510 |
Mad Prophet Ludwig Mon, Jul 27, 2009 2:53:48pm |
re: #457 CynicalConservative
Saturday I believe, was a bloody day.
I'm never on on Saturdays... oh well...
| 511 |
FrogMarch Mon, Jul 27, 2009 2:54:38pm |
re: #505 sattv4u2
Sorry, but you're just wrong. I site the DARE program as example one!
[Link: www.dare.com...]
Oh fer crying out loud I forgot, we're all community organizers now.
/Be nice - there are delicate sensibilities knocking about.
| 512 |
Neutral President Mon, Jul 27, 2009 2:54:40pm |
re: #501 Killgore Trout
Ok, I haven't been reading all the posts.
Still being reluctant or resistant to coddling Islamic misogyny does not sound like an unreasonable position in a secular society.
| 513 |
Charpete67 Mon, Jul 27, 2009 2:55:03pm |
Moro Islamic Liberation Front (MILF)re: #507 michaelasher
This reason he hasn't released his original birth certificate is obviously not because he was born outside this country. So what's the reason?
1) Stanley Ann never gave it to him.
2) He lost it.
3) It lists him as Caucasian.
4) It lists a father other than Barack Obama, Sr.
5) Alinskyesque move to make conservatives look ridiculous.
6) Immaculate conception.
I'm going with #6
| 515 |
nikis-knight Mon, Jul 27, 2009 2:56:06pm |
re: #480 sattv4u2
Same religion, same more's. Does it matter in WHAT country it's being practiced?
Yes; in western culture, a police in uniform is a sign of respect, and so muslims should not be offended by a woman in uniform entering the mosque, she is not being disrespectful. Immigrants should not expect teh host country/society to conform to their old mores, even if they choose to retain them voluntarily.
Contra, it isn't out of bounds for Turkey to expect visitors to show respect in the manner that is culturally appropriate for turkey/Islam.
| 516 |
sattv4u2 Mon, Jul 27, 2009 2:57:01pm |
re: #511 FrogMarch
Oh fer crying out loud I forgot, we're all community organizers now.
/Be nice - there are delicate sensibilities knocking about.
No. The DARE program has been around for decades. It is run by and administerd by police. It has nothing to do with delicate sensibilities . It has EVERYTHING to do with police trying to educate kids
| 517 |
BARACK THE VOTE Mon, Jul 27, 2009 2:57:01pm |
re: #504 buzzsawmonkey
I'd like to suggest that if an effort at community outreach is being made, part of that community outreach effort must of necessity be to pierce the shell which creates an insular, unassimilated enclave within the larger society.
In other words, precisely for reasons of community outreach it is necessary to be polite without knuckling under to the mores of the insular, unassimilated enclave.
Having a woman in a position of authority (e.g, investigating and asking questions) is a pretty big piercing of that insular shell when we're talking about a society in which women aren't ever authorities.
I see wearing a scarf on your hair when in the religious building as a very mild concession to their beliefs in that context. It is quite literally the least one can do-- and no one is suggesting that one do any more than the least.
| 518 |
lawhawk Mon, Jul 27, 2009 2:57:03pm |
re: #513 Charpete67
Hey, that OB-GYN didn't make the immaculate reception; there's only one of those.
| 519 |
zombie Mon, Jul 27, 2009 2:57:05pm |
re: #507 michaelasher
This reason he hasn't released his original birth certificate is obviously not because he was born outside this country. So what's the reason?
1) Stanley Ann never gave it to him.
2) He lost it.
3) It lists him as Caucasian.
4) It lists a father other than Barack Obama, Sr.
5) Alinskyesque move to make conservatives look ridiculous.
6) Immaculate conception.
I'm almost positive that it's your reason #3: That he is listed as being "white."
| 520 |
Catttt Mon, Jul 27, 2009 2:57:06pm |
I think that in the USA, assimilation R us. By far the majority of immigrants WANT to assimilate. Even when I see Muslim women in, say, Target, we talk about girl things or woman things or business things (I tend to strike up conversations with strangers a lot). They don't feel weird - they're Americans!
I'm no expert, but my impression of Europe is they've tended to freeze out immigrants or isolate them. This makes immigrant communities more insular and attracts immigrants who want that.
| 521 |
Vicious Babushka Mon, Jul 27, 2009 2:57:12pm |
re: #483 NelsFree
If you visit the hagia sophia, a church converted to a mosque, and are Christian, you are forbidden to pray inside. H'mph.
If you visit the Temple Mount, you will be escorted off the premises if you move your lips.
| 522 |
Killgore Trout Mon, Jul 27, 2009 2:57:23pm |
re: #485 Charles
I doubt they expect policewomen to stop and put on the veil if they're chasing a terrorist into a mosque.
Here's another article...
Muslims welcome coverings for female police
The force's women police officers and police community support officers are being given uniform-issue head coverings to be worn when they are on duty and entering places of worship.
| 523 |
Russkilitlover Mon, Jul 27, 2009 2:57:44pm |
re: #492 iceweasel
Exactly. Not just disappointed, but angry.
Try to make me wear that nasty symbol of misogyny and I'll show you angry, too!
| 524 |
VegasRick Mon, Jul 27, 2009 2:57:44pm |
re: #514 buzzsawmonkey
Iron Fist got the stick shortly before last Shabbos.
I always liked IronFist but the 7 sockpuppets is pretty wierd.
| 525 |
michaelasher Mon, Jul 27, 2009 2:58:03pm |
re: #513 Charpete67
| 526 |
Catttt Mon, Jul 27, 2009 2:58:06pm |
re: #507 michaelasher
This reason he hasn't released his original birth certificate is obviously not because he was born outside this country. So what's the reason?
1) Stanley Ann never gave it to him.
2) He lost it.
3) It lists him as Caucasian.
4) It lists a father other than Barack Obama, Sr.
5) Alinskyesque move to make conservatives look ridiculous.
6) Immaculate conception.
Immaculate conception does not mean what you think it means.
| 527 |
Kragar Mon, Jul 27, 2009 2:58:28pm |
| 528 |
LGoPs Mon, Jul 27, 2009 2:58:41pm |
re: #515 nikis-knight
Yes; in western culture, a police in uniform is a sign of respect, and so muslims should not be offended by a woman in uniform entering the mosque, she is not being disrespectful. Immigrants should not expect teh host country/society to conform to their old mores, even if they choose to retain them voluntarily.
Contra, it isn't out of bounds for Turkey to expect visitors to show respect in the manner that is culturally appropriate for turkey/Islam.
Bingo!. When I lived in Saudi I adhered to their customs and sensibilities. When I lived in Germany, same. I expect the same courtesy in return in my country. Nothing more.
| 529 |
Ayeless in Ghazi Mon, Jul 27, 2009 2:59:01pm |
re: #485 Charles
I think I need more info before deciding whether the veils are really an example of dhimmitude. If the policewomen are part of community outreach programs, I don't really see too much wrong with being polite. There's not much point in reaching out if you offend people just by walking in.
Yep - "we don't respect your customs" seems like a poor idea of how to win trust/build bridges to me as well.
| 530 |
Vicious Babushka Mon, Jul 27, 2009 2:59:37pm |
| 531 |
BARACK THE VOTE Mon, Jul 27, 2009 3:00:31pm |
re: #523 Russkilitlover
Try to make me wear that nasty symbol of misogyny and I'll show you angry, too!
It's a scarf. Not a burka.
| 532 |
VegasRick Mon, Jul 27, 2009 3:00:31pm |
re: #523 Russkilitlover
Try to make me wear that nasty symbol of misogyny and I'll show you angry, too!
We have misogyny parlors all over the place here in Vegas
/
| 533 |
Shug Mon, Jul 27, 2009 3:00:36pm |
re: #522 Killgore Trout
"This will go a long way in encouraging a trustful relationship between the police and the Muslim community."
yeaaah. riiight.
///
| 534 |
Digital Display Mon, Jul 27, 2009 3:00:36pm |
re: #527 Kragar (Proud to be Kafir)
He had 7 socks?
That is messed up...There are only 5 basic rules here..Is it that frigging hard?
| 537 |
yochanan Mon, Jul 27, 2009 3:01:53pm |
re: #473 sattv4u2
a hajib and a vail are two different things.
| 538 |
VegasRick Mon, Jul 27, 2009 3:01:56pm |
| 539 |
zombie Mon, Jul 27, 2009 3:02:15pm |
I think I'm going to start a religion which requires all adherents to dress like circus clowns, including bright pink wig, red nose, and big floppy clown shoes -- especially when entering our temples, where clown costumes are universally required.
Then I'll send out a few clowns to commit a few crimes.
When the police come round, I will insist that they all dress like clowns before stepping onto my sacred temple grounds.
Yeah, that'll work.
| 540 |
sattv4u2 Mon, Jul 27, 2009 3:02:17pm |
re: #515 nikis-knight
re: #528 LGoPs
Bingo!. When I lived in Saudi I adhered to their customs and sensibilities. When I lived in Germany, same. I expect the same courtesy in return in my country. Nothing more.
But we're not adhereing to "A" countries customs, we're talking about "A" Religious one, whose customs are the same no matter WHAT country it's being practiced in!
| 541 |
doppelganglander Mon, Jul 27, 2009 3:02:18pm |
re: #527 Kragar (Proud to be Kafir)
He had 7 socks?
I need to go back to that thread and see what happened. I was out having a life on Friday evening.
| 542 |
Catttt Mon, Jul 27, 2009 3:02:22pm |
Cops should not have to wear costumes.
If cops needed to go into a circus tent, would you issue them clown noses?
| 543 |
Charpete67 Mon, Jul 27, 2009 3:02:42pm |
re: #518 lawhawk
If not #6, then why the "aura" and tingle up my leg?
| 544 |
Charles Johnson Mon, Jul 27, 2009 3:02:46pm |
re: #522 Killgore Trout
It has the stench of left-wing political correctness, true -- but note: only 15 policewomen in special jobs are being given these veils.
They have already been issued to eight PCSOs and seven police officers, including Assistant Chief Constable Jackie Roberts.
Ms Roberts said: "Producing head coverings for our officers and staff to wear in places of worship is part of our commitment to engage with all our communities. It recognises and respects the cultural and religious practices of our communities. This is a very positive addition to the Avon and Somerset uniform and one which I'm sure will be a welcome item for many of our officers."
This article strongly suggests that the veils aren't intended to be worn during criminal investigations or that kind of thing, but in community programs and events.
| 545 |
Catttt Mon, Jul 27, 2009 3:03:07pm |
re: #539 zombie
I think I'm going to start a religion which requires all adherents to dress like circus clowns, including bright pink wig, red nose, and big floppy clown shoes -- especially when entering our temples, where clown costumes are universally required.
Then I'll send out a few clowns to commit a few crimes.
When the police come round, I will insist that they all dress like clowns before stepping onto my sacred temple grounds.
Yeah, that'll work.
Wow. Jinx. I must have picked up your brain waves when I typed my clown comment. GMTA
| 546 |
lurking faith Mon, Jul 27, 2009 3:03:39pm |
re: #426 iceweasel
How do you know those police women can't whip that off and use it to subdue a subject? :)
No capes!
| 547 |
Vicious Babushka Mon, Jul 27, 2009 3:03:48pm |
re: #537 yochanan
a hajib and a vail are two different things.
A hijab is a scarf worn over the head and fastened under the chin (commonly called a "babushka")
A niqab is a mask with eye slits, worn over the face.
A burqa is a full body covering, with a mesh over the eyes.
| 548 |
BARACK THE VOTE Mon, Jul 27, 2009 3:03:59pm |
re: #535 buzzsawmonkey
Nice to see that you admit the subservient position of women in Islamic society.
Having done so, you will surely see that having a symbol of the larger society--a policewoman--assuming the garb of subservience for a foray into the ghetto.
The ghetto?
What are you talking about?
It's about covering your head, if you're female, if you are entering a mosque. Voluntarily.
Try to calm down.
| 549 |
Sharmuta Mon, Jul 27, 2009 3:04:12pm |
re: #529 Jimmah
Yep - "we don't respect your customs" seems like a poor idea of how to win trust/build bridges to me as well.
I don't know how we expect them to police themselves if they have no allies in that effort.
| 550 |
sattv4u2 Mon, Jul 27, 2009 3:04:32pm |
re: #537 yochanan
a hajib and a vail are two different things.
I've been there skiing ,,, in Colorado!
| 551 |
96RoadKing Mon, Jul 27, 2009 3:04:33pm |
re: #539 zombie
I think I'm going to start a religion which requires all adherents to dress like circus clowns, including bright pink wig, red nose, and big floppy clown shoes -- especially when entering our temples, where clown costumes are universally required.
Then I'll send out a few clowns to commit a few crimes.
When the police come round, I will insist that they all dress like clowns before stepping onto my sacred temple grounds.
Yeah, that'll work.
I was going to say Congress beat you to it, but they don't wear pink wigs.
| 552 |
zombie Mon, Jul 27, 2009 3:04:38pm |
re: #545 Cattt
Wow. Jinx. I must have picked up your brain waves when I typed my clown comment. GMTA
The Cosmic Clown Mind has us in its grip!
| 553 |
Mad Prophet Ludwig Mon, Jul 27, 2009 3:04:45pm |
On the subject of veils in mosques, I have to say something a little surprising.
A mosque really is their turf. Unless you have a good reason to violate their morays, and I am not keen on head coverings or veils for women, like you are a female law enforcement person, and you are in hot pursuit of someone, you should be respectful, of their rules, or not go in.
I'll say this from my own culture. Amongst observant Jewish women, it is tradition for a married woman to cover her hair. I hate it personally. To my fellow observant Jewish Lizards, I am not trying to open a debate on Tsniut, however, even though I do not like the idea, and I would not want my wife to cover her hair, it's not really the point.
My mother put it really well. She is obviously a married Jewish woman. If she is going to go to schul, even though she hates the idea, she will still cover her hair out of respect, because making a scene and a political statement is less important to her than praying.
| 554 |
yochanan Mon, Jul 27, 2009 3:04:56pm |
it would be interesting to know if british police let jewish men wear kipahs and jewish married women cover there hair on the job.
| 555 |
nikis-knight Mon, Jul 27, 2009 3:05:53pm |
re: #540 sattv4u2
re: #528 LGoPs
But we're not adhereing to "A" countries customs, we're talking about "A" Religious one, whose customs are the same no matter WHAT country it's being practiced in!
Not quite; we're talking about a religion that dominates a culture and shaped the nation in question (Turkey). And is still rather foreign here.
Islam is incredibly prickly about percieved slights, and this sensitivity earns them a certain reflexive defence. In countries/societies not shaped by Islam they need to recognize what gestures are intended as respect and not expect non-adherants to adhere to Islam's strictures for their sake.
| 556 |
LGoPs Mon, Jul 27, 2009 3:06:09pm |
re: #540 sattv4u2
re: #528 LGoPs
But we're not adhereing to "A" countries customs, we're talking about "A" Religious one, whose customs are the same no matter WHAT country it's being practiced in!
The state, and in this case the police authroities who represent it, should be neutral when it comes to religion. Not hostile and certainly not subservient. Just neutral.
| 557 |
Charles Johnson Mon, Jul 27, 2009 3:06:23pm |
re: #507 michaelasher
This reason he hasn't released his original birth certificate is obviously not because he was born outside this country. So what's the reason?
1) Stanley Ann never gave it to him.
2) He lost it.
3) It lists him as Caucasian.
4) It lists a father other than Barack Obama, Sr.
5) Alinskyesque move to make conservatives look ridiculous.
6) Immaculate conception.
7) The state of Hawaii does not release the "original birth certificate." The document released by Barack Obama is the only kind of document they give to people who request proof of Hawaii birth. It has the seal of the state of Hawaii on it. And it's been verified by the Republican governor, and by the head of the Hawaii Department of Health. Obama has already proved his birth.
8) Conservatives are making themselves look ridiculous -- no need for Alinsky tactics. Why stop them?
| 558 |
lobo91 Mon, Jul 27, 2009 3:06:59pm |
re: #491 LudwigVanQuixote
Muslims in the west tend to use the Chewbacca strategy:
Chewbacca: Aaaarrrgh
C-3PO: He made a fair move. Screaming about it can't help you.
Han Solo: Let him have it. It's not wise to upset a Wookiee.
C-3PO: But sir, nobody worries about upsetting a droid.
Han Solo: That's 'cause droids don't pull people's arms out of their sockets when they lose. Wookiees are known to do that.
Chewbacca: Grr
C-3PO: I see your point, sir. I suggest a new strategy, R2: let the Wookiee win.
| 559 |
michaelasher Mon, Jul 27, 2009 3:07:57pm |
re: #519 zombie
Agreed. Most plausible. And wouldn't that make for a teachable moment.
| 560 |
yochanan Mon, Jul 27, 2009 3:08:28pm |
re: #547 Alouette
i know i see all three in my hood the hair covering isn't all that different from what my wife does. the other two give me the creeps.' they give me the impression that the woman does what ever her OWNER LETS HER DO.
| 561 |
Kragar Mon, Jul 27, 2009 3:08:30pm |
re: #541 doppelganglander
I need to go back to that thread and see what happened. I was out having a life on Friday evening.
Was that the Friday night lounge thread?
| 562 |
FrogMarch Mon, Jul 27, 2009 3:08:34pm |
re: #516 sattv4u2
No. The DARE program has been around for decades. It is run by and administerd by police. It has nothing to do with delicate sensibilities . It has EVERYTHING to do with police trying to educate kids
Ok. What does this have to do with wearing a head scarf?
| 563 |
zombie Mon, Jul 27, 2009 3:09:02pm |
re: #553 LudwigVanQuixote
But will you insist that non-Jewish married women police officers wear a wig or cover their hair when they are investigating a crime in a synagogue or Orthodox home?
I'm not talking about whether or not religious adherents themselves have the right to follow their own customs -- they obviously do.
I'm not talking about religious buildings having dress codes for tourists or worshippers -- they obviously can and do.
I'm talking about the police. It's a whole different ball of wax.
| 564 |
Lee Coller Mon, Jul 27, 2009 3:09:10pm |
re: #507 michaelasher
This reason he hasn't released his original birth certificate is obviously not because he was born outside this country. So what's the reason?
1) Stanley Ann never gave it to him.
2) He lost it.
3) It lists him as Caucasian.
4) It lists a father other than Barack Obama, Sr.
5) Alinskyesque move to make conservatives look ridiculous.
6) Immaculate conception.
The answer is 5). It's worked pretty well too.
| 565 |
Mad Prophet Ludwig Mon, Jul 27, 2009 3:09:21pm |
re: #558 lobo91
Muslims in the west tend to use the Chewbacca strategy:
Yeah, but if Luke tried that, Han would have blasted him.
| 566 |
Russkilitlover Mon, Jul 27, 2009 3:09:29pm |
Tried to see if there is anything about policemen having to remove their shoes. There was a quote from a Sun article, but I couldn't get to the article. There were blogs and commentaries though that acknowledged that, yes, apparently, British male police officers remove their shoes before going into Mosque.
So I guess if a crime happens to break out - whether in the Mosque or if they get an emergency call, the British police have hamstrung themselves in the name of PC. Nice.
And shocking that there are so many here who support it.
| 567 |
sattv4u2 Mon, Jul 27, 2009 3:09:42pm |
re: #556 LGoPs
The state, and in this case the police authroities who represent it, should be neutral when it comes to religion. Not hostile and certainly not subservient. Just neutral.
And as someone stated upthread, an outreach program would have little chance to begin if those that you were trying to reach were offended on moment one.
As many have stated, I see no problem with this. As Charles eloquently put it, the police aren't stopping to put on the veil while chasing a perp!
| 568 |
Randall Gross Mon, Jul 27, 2009 3:10:23pm |
My "reality test" on questions like this has always been is it something we would do out of religious consideration in the US? E.g. would a female police group visiting an Amish church for community outreach wear bonnets out of consideration? Does anyone know?
| 569 |
experiencedtraveller Mon, Jul 27, 2009 3:10:39pm |
Thankfully we are a melting pot. Not a stinkin' quilt.
| 570 |
sattv4u2 Mon, Jul 27, 2009 3:11:07pm |
re: #562 FrogMarch
Ok. What does this have to do with wearing a head scarf?
Your incorrect post that police do NOt do community organizing
| 572 |
FrogMarch Mon, Jul 27, 2009 3:11:41pm |
| 573 |
KronoGhazi Mon, Jul 27, 2009 3:12:00pm |
Has Obama invited Achmadinejad over for a beer yet?
I'd invite Kim Il Jong over for a snifter of Hennesey.
| 574 |
Catttt Mon, Jul 27, 2009 3:13:00pm |
re: #485 Charles
I think I need more info before deciding whether the veils are really an example of dhimmitude. If the policewomen are part of community outreach programs, I don't really see too much wrong with being polite. There's not much point in reaching out if you offend people just by walking in.
I doubt they expect policewomen to stop and put on the veil if they're chasing a terrorist into a mosque.
So, in other words, if the imam holds up a bank and then holes up in the mosque, the women on the swat team won't need to put a hijab on over their helmet? / :D
| 575 |
Randall Gross Mon, Jul 27, 2009 3:13:12pm |
re: #572 FrogMarch
There's a neighborhood watch sign on my street, is there one on yours?
| 576 |
Ayeless in Ghazi Mon, Jul 27, 2009 3:13:19pm |
re: #535 buzzsawmonkey
undercuts the very authority of the larger society she is there to project, and totally destroys that "piercing of the insular shell," for it makes truckling to the insular shell paramount over the assertion of the authority of the larger society.
Are we really that insecure?
| 577 |
opnion Mon, Jul 27, 2009 3:13:50pm |
I see that the battle still rages over female police being required to wear a hijab in a mosque in the UK.
I really had to think it through, you know showing respect and all.
Two things make me opposed to it.
1. the hajib is a symbol of subjugation, it is that straight up. There was a discussion about misogeny this morning & this qualifies. Men who would insist on the covered head often value live stock above women.
2. the interpretation will be one of Islamic supremacy. This is the UK not Syria & female officers should not be humiliated in their official duties.
| 578 |
_RememberTonyC Mon, Jul 27, 2009 3:13:54pm |
re: #522 Killgore Trout
of course they welcome the coverings for female police officers. think about it ... in islam, women are veiled as a sign of their subjugation. so when a non-muslim woman, even one in a position of authority like a cop is REQUIRED to wear a veil, it plays right into the muslim sense of male superiority over women and UNDERMINES the authority of the policewoman. it is BEYOND f'd up
| 579 |
FrogMarch Mon, Jul 27, 2009 3:14:02pm |
re: #575 Thanos
There's a neighborhood watch sign on my street, is there one on yours?
I said, typically. Very sorry to have offended. and to answer your question, no.
| 580 |
Eowyn2 Mon, Jul 27, 2009 3:14:10pm |
re: #553 LudwigVanQuixote
the only qualm I have is this phrase
like you are a female law enforcement person, and you are in hot pursuit of someone, you should be respectful, of their rules, or not go in.
I say
If you are in hot pursuit of someone who has broken the law, you run them to ground without stopping to tie a scarf around your hair or cover your arms or legs if they run into a Mosque. However, for simply asking questions, that is fine but should not be part of uniform for anyone other than those who actually have to go into a mosque
| 581 |
Charles Johnson Mon, Jul 27, 2009 3:14:15pm |
If you missed that, by the way -- these veils for policewomen are being given to fifteen officers. This is a tiny plan for a very limited group of policewomen, not a system in place for all police.
| 582 |
sattv4u2 Mon, Jul 27, 2009 3:14:30pm |
re: #572 FrogMarch
I said typically.
Well then, TYPICALLY you're wrong, as most police depts have a DARE (or similar) program. Most police depts also go into schools from elementary to high school all the time doing outreach work. And when I say MOST, I mean 90%+
| 583 |
Randall Gross Mon, Jul 27, 2009 3:14:59pm |
re: #579 FrogMarch
Maybe you could help Gruff the crime dog while you are out looking for that neighborhood watch sign...
| 584 |
lurking faith Mon, Jul 27, 2009 3:15:20pm |
re: #551 96RoadKing
I was going to say Congress beat you to it, but they don't wear pink wigs.
Hey, if Congress wore clown costumes, maybe more people would watch CSpan.
| 585 |
Ayeless in Ghazi Mon, Jul 27, 2009 3:15:22pm |
re: #581 Charles
This story just keeps getting smaller.
| 587 |
Russkilitlover Mon, Jul 27, 2009 3:15:31pm |
Amazing how so many defend this with the self-righteous usage of "respectful," yet are quite rude to fellow posters.
| 588 |
yochanan Mon, Jul 27, 2009 3:16:06pm |
re: #573 BigPapa
OFFERING a beer to the iranian short shit would be fun
the commie more than likely drinks the best that the capitalist has to offer.
| 589 |
sattv4u2 Mon, Jul 27, 2009 3:16:08pm |
re: #575 Thanos
There's a neighborhood watch sign on my street, is there one on yours?
Thank you. Yet another example (besides D.A.R.E.) where police are communtiy organizers
| 590 |
nikis-knight Mon, Jul 27, 2009 3:16:28pm |
re: #581 Charles
If you missed that, by the way -- these veils for policewomen are being given to fifteen officers. This is a tiny plan for a very limited group of policewomen, not a system in place for all police.
Well, in any case, it will be interesting to see if it helps British Muslims feel connected to Britian, or dominant in it.
| 591 |
Russkilitlover Mon, Jul 27, 2009 3:16:31pm |
re: #581 Charles
If you missed that, by the way -- these veils for policewomen are being given to fifteen officers. This is a tiny plan for a very limited group of policewomen, not a system in place for all police.
From the posted pics, that female captain sure didn't look happy about it.
| 592 |
lobo91 Mon, Jul 27, 2009 3:16:54pm |
re: #583 Thanos
Maybe you could help Gruff the crime dog while you are out looking for that neighborhood watch sign...
But make sure you don't send McGruff into a mosque, because that will upset them even more than seeing an uncovered woman.
| 593 |
DEZes Mon, Jul 27, 2009 3:17:35pm |
Somehow, the outreaching always seems lopsided.
| 594 |
Mad Prophet Ludwig Mon, Jul 27, 2009 3:17:47pm |
re: #563 zombie
But will you insist that non-Jewish married women police officers wear a wig or cover their hair when they are investigating a crime in a synagogue or Orthodox home?
I'm not talking about whether or not religious adherents themselves have the right to follow their own customs -- they obviously do.
I'm not talking about religious buildings having dress codes for tourists or worshippers -- they obviously can and do.
I'm talking about the police. It's a whole different ball of wax.
Oh no I am right with you. I was talking more for civilians. There also needs to be a separation of religion and state within the bounds of reason. Even in Mea Sharim they wouldn't make a male police officer put on a keepah or a female police officer cover her hair, if (s)he needed to investigate something in a schul. Of course, Judaism is radically different than Islam in that if you aren't a Jew, you are actually not expected to dress Jewish in a schul. You can put on a keepah if it makes you feel more comfortable, but it is not required - and no one would say anything to a female non Jewish guest at all about her covering her head.
The question is more of, what if you just want to visit and they seriously believe that the rule applies to you? Good manners is either put it on or don't go in.
| 595 |
BARACK THE VOTE Mon, Jul 27, 2009 3:17:53pm |
re: #585 Jimmah
This story just keeps getting smaller.
Yet the faux-outrage will grow. It's the inverse law of proportional poutrage: the slighter the slight, the screechier the scream.
| 596 |
Pianobuff Mon, Jul 27, 2009 3:17:56pm |
Have you heard about the House Resolution that includes language establishing Hawaii as Obama's birthplace?
| 597 |
_RememberTonyC Mon, Jul 27, 2009 3:18:00pm |
re: #581 Charles
If you missed that, by the way -- these veils for policewomen are being given to fifteen officers. This is a tiny plan for a very limited group of policewomen, not a system in place for all police.
is it a special accomodation for one specific segment of the British community? if it is, then I see it as potentially a slippery slope.
| 598 |
Randall Gross Mon, Jul 27, 2009 3:18:15pm |
re: #592 lobo91
But make sure you don't send McGruff into a mosque, because that will upset them even more than seeing an uncovered woman.
:)
| 599 |
yochanan Mon, Jul 27, 2009 3:18:18pm |
re: #581 Charles
is this just the camel nose in the tent door or is it the limite and what about jewish married women or muslima do they get offical hair coverings?
| 600 |
Kragar Mon, Jul 27, 2009 3:18:20pm |
Secret testimony leaked: Sens. Conrad, Dodd lied
The senators' story from previous public statements: Both senators have said that at the time the mortgages were being written they didn't know they were getting unique deals from Countrywide Financial Corp.
A little more from the Dodd archives:
"As the Dodds have said from the beginning, they did not seek or expect any special rates or terms on their loans and they never received any. They were never offered special or sweetheart deals and if anyone had made such an offer, they would have severed that relationship immediately."
One does not deny getting deals unless one realizes the public stench would be repugnant.Countrywide's story - now delivered under oath:
Asked by a House investigator if Conrad, the North Dakota senator, "was aware that he was getting preferential treatment?" Feinberg answered: "Yes, he was aware."
Referring to Dodd, the investigator asked:"And do you know if during the course of your communications" with the senator or his wife "that you ever had an opportunity to share with them if they were getting special VIP treatment?"
"Yes, yes," Feinberg replied.
Indications are that the matter is going forward to the Ethics Committee.
| 601 |
lobo91 Mon, Jul 27, 2009 3:18:33pm |
re: #588 yochanan
OFFERING a beer to the iranian short shit would be fun
the commie more than likely drinks the best that the capitalist has to offer.
From what I've seen of the private behavior of leaders in the Islamic world, it wouldn't surprise me if the Iranian president does, as well.
| 602 |
Mad Prophet Ludwig Mon, Jul 27, 2009 3:19:25pm |
re: #568 Thanos
My "reality test" on questions like this has always been is it something we would do out of religious consideration in the US? E.g. would a female police group visiting an Amish church for community outreach wear bonnets out of consideration? Does anyone know?
In Lancaster, where I grew up, they have. Sometimes though they have not as well. The Amish are rather peaceful and they rarely need the police. To the best of my knowledge, when the female police did do that, the kindness of the gesture was noticed, and when they didn't, the Amish didn't complain.
| 603 |
FrogMarch Mon, Jul 27, 2009 3:19:50pm |
re: #582 sattv4u2
Well then, TYPICALLY you're wrong, as most police depts have a DARE (or similar) program. Most police depts also go into schools from elementary to high school all the time doing outreach work. And when I say MOST, I mean 90%+
I wasn't thinking in terms of DARE. (which is great - I love DARE!) I was thinking in terms of the traditional role of a police officer - (law enforcement) which in reference to Zombies post regarding female police officers wearing head scarves In Brittan and IceWeasels response about not offending the community.
But yes - I am totally wrong. You caught me. I forgot about DARE.
| 604 |
Catttt Mon, Jul 27, 2009 3:19:52pm |
re: #583 Thanos
Maybe you could help Gruff the crime dog while you are out looking for that neighborhood watch sign...
McGruff. One day in college, in computer lab, two of us were looking out the window at the 7-Eleven across the street. I say, "Um, do you see a big dog in a trenchcoat?" He says, "That's McGruff, The Crime Dog." Gave me a turn.
| 605 |
Catttt Mon, Jul 27, 2009 3:20:25pm |
re: #591 Russkilitlover
From the posted pics, that female captain sure didn't look happy about it.
Police captains aren't supposed to look happy.
| 606 |
zombie Mon, Jul 27, 2009 3:20:48pm |
re: #485 Charles
I think I need more info before deciding whether the veils are really an example of dhimmitude.
The reason for the veil in Islamic society is so that women do not excite the men sexually. This is stated explicitly in the Koran itself, and is cited by Muslim scholars and laymen alike as the actual original intent and purpose of the veil.
Only later did it acquire the reputation as the "Muslim uniform" indicating membership in the Islamic faith.
But its original purpose is deeply rooted in what (to me at least) is a deeply disturbing and deeply sexist attitude: That it is the woman's responsibility to not entice the man. And that, consequently, if a man sexually assaults a woman, it's her fault for egging him on with her beauty.
This attitude is reflected very strongly in Islamic law and social custims whereby rape victims are either shunned, jailed, or killed in honor killings.
The veil is now the symbol of this anachronistic and (to me) hateful worldview.
(This is totally aside from the police/UK issue -- just my speculations on the veil.)
| 607 |
zombie Mon, Jul 27, 2009 3:21:31pm |
re: #577 opnion
I see that the battle still rages over female police being required to wear a hijab in a mosque in the UK.
I really had to think it through, you know showing respect and all.
Two things make me opposed to it.
1. the hajib is a symbol of subjugation, it is that straight up. There was a discussion about misogeny this morning & this qualifies. Men who would insist on the covered head often value live stock above women.
2. the interpretation will be one of Islamic supremacy. This is the UK not Syria & female officers should not be humiliated in their official duties.
I agree.
| 608 |
Lee Coller Mon, Jul 27, 2009 3:21:34pm |
re: #596 Pianobuff
Have you heard about the House Resolution that includes language establishing Hawaii as Obama's birthplace?
That confronts House GOPers with a choice: They can vote for the measure, and endorse the idea that Obama was born in Hawaii, which could earn the wrath of birthers. Or they can vote against commemorating the 50th state’s joining of our blessed Union. Or GOPers can skip the vote, but that could look nutty.
If the GOP is smart this will pass unanimously with no discussion. That's a big if.
I'd rather tell the truth than be counted with the nirthers (and troofers).
| 609 |
Ayeless in Ghazi Mon, Jul 27, 2009 3:21:34pm |
re: #586 buzzsawmonkey
I don't know how "secure" you are, or think you are. But if you support the needless undercutting of ordinary police authority in the service of some PC fantasy, you will be more insecure than you currently are, in short order.
Sure buzzsaw. Let me take a moment to think about the terrible consequences that might ensue when a few female police officers put on a scarf before entering a mosque.
Oh I can see it now- society is crumbling/
On the other hand - the matter of the benefits that a little manners, and avoiding needless offence might bring in terms of greater trust and cooperation is something you don't seem to be interested in.
| 610 |
Charles Johnson Mon, Jul 27, 2009 3:21:42pm |
re: #605 Cattt
Police captains aren't supposed to look happy.
I don't think I've ever seen a happy-looking police captain.
| 611 |
callahan23 Mon, Jul 27, 2009 3:21:46pm |
re: #567 sattv4u2
And as someone stated upthread, an outreach program would have little chance to begin if those that you were trying to reach were offended on moment one.
An outreach program is a two way road the immigrant community also needs to learn things of its host country. One of the very important lessons is that women are the equals of men and the second that the police force has to be respected. There is no getting around it.
The police garb and its hat that comes with it is a uniform and a respect the police also shows to the citizens, all alike. Everyone is equal under the rule of law and no one is special and/or deserves special treatment, not even differing cultures or religions. In a western country that is, of course.
| 613 |
Eowyn2 Mon, Jul 27, 2009 3:22:01pm |
re: #562 FrogMarch
Ok. What does this have to do with wearing a head scarf?
hypothetically.
If McGruff has a female officer inside the costume and they are at a Muslim or Jewish house of worship talking to the kids, does the female officer have to adhere to the normal restrictions regarding headwear?
| 614 |
Stormageddon, Dark Lord of All Mon, Jul 27, 2009 3:22:03pm |
re: #335 harpsicon
This was actually published (photo) in a Dallas Morning News editorial today, which started me thinking about it.
How many days later did it appear? My understanding of his dad, and especially his mom, makes it seem overwhelmingly likely that this was put in the paper by grandma the bank officer. She might have phoned Kenya even back in the day (doubt the parents would have spent the money to call her), and then phoned up the paper. That her counter-cultural daughter would have put a birth notice in the Honolulu Star-Bulletin is just cosmically (to use the period phrase) unlikely.
When you consider the general social attitudes of the people involved, I'd say the odds on the above scenario are pretty darn good. Which means that this birth notice wouldn't really mean anything.
I don't care much about this, and think that Obama probably is toying with people in some fashion, hoping to make them look as foolish as possible. It is obviously very bad for GOP and other politicians, and yes, Hillary would have used it if she had it. There's even a republican governor in Hawaii.
Still, proof is proof, and much as I respect Zombie and all the work he/she has done, this birth notice is still open to at least one other explanation.
Dude, WTF? What's the other explanation? that somehow however many years ago, some US citizen gave birth to a child in another country. Then decided that her child of mixed racial heritage born in 1961 had a real shot at becoming President of the United States. (Context sidenote: Guess Who's Coming to Dinner wasn't released until 1967, which had a quote about how one of the black characters would settle for their son being Secretary of State IIRC, I can't find the quote, so if someone else knows it, I'd be grateful) So she had her grandmother place a fake birth announcement and then manage to get people to forge the documents at Kapi'olani Medical Center for Women & Children in Honolulu, Hawaii.
Note: Children born to a single US parent can and are typically US citizens under most circumstances. And the only office/job/position Obama wouldn't be permitted to hold would be.. President of the United States. Link to the information on Citizenship for a child born outside the US to one citizen and one alien parent who are married.)
Birth Abroad to One Citizen and One Alien Parent in Wedlock: A child born abroad to one U.S. citizen parent and one alien parent acquires U.S. citizenship at birth under Section 301(g) INA provided the citizen parent was physically present in the U.S. for the time period required by the law applicable at the time of the child's birth. (For birth on or after November 14, 1986, a period of five years physical presence, two after the age of fourteen is required. For birth between December 24, 1952 and November 13, 1986, a period of ten years, five after the age of fourteen are required for physical presence in the U.S. to transmit U.S. citizenship to the child.
So the only reason to fake this stuff is so Obama could be President some 45 years later. Orly?
The only other thing I can imagine you think is that Obama is even cooler than Chuck Norris and capable of time travel. :)
| 615 |
Randall Gross Mon, Jul 27, 2009 3:22:27pm |
re: #604 Cattt
McGruff. One day in college, in computer lab, two of us were looking out the window at the 7-Eleven across the street. I say, "Um, do you see a big dog in a trenchcoat?" He says, "That's McGruff, The Crime Dog." Gave me a turn.
You are correct, "Help McGruff take a bite out of Crime"...
| 616 |
yochanan Mon, Jul 27, 2009 3:22:54pm |
| 617 |
unrealizedviewpoint Mon, Jul 27, 2009 3:22:55pm |
re: #581 Charles
If you missed that, by the way -- these veils for policewomen are being given to fifteen officers. This is a tiny plan for a very limited group of policewomen, not a system in place for all police.
Start with 15, slowly inculcate.
| 618 |
Shug Mon, Jul 27, 2009 3:23:10pm |
re: #557 Charles
7) The state of Hawaii does not release the "original birth certificate." The document released by Barack Obama is the only kind of document they give to people who request proof of Hawaii birth. It has the seal of the state of Hawaii on it. And it's been verified by the Republican governor, and by the head of the Hawaii Department of Health. Obama has already proved his birth.
8) Conservatives are making themselves look ridiculous. Why stop them?
many are. No doubt about that
but wasn't the chief Nirther , Phillip Berg , who brought the first lawsuit a Democrat?
I will stipulate the majority of Nirther freaks are politically right leaning
| 619 |
zombie Mon, Jul 27, 2009 3:23:12pm |
re: #581 Charles
If you missed that, by the way -- these veils for policewomen are being given to fifteen officers. This is a tiny plan for a very limited group of policewomen, not a system in place for all police.
Even if it was just for one single policewomen, I would disagree with the policy.
It singles out and humiliates women officers, but not male officers. It is sexist on the face of it.
| 621 |
Pianobuff Mon, Jul 27, 2009 3:23:41pm |
re: #608 Lee Coller
If the GOP is smart this will pass unanimously with no discussion. That's a big if.
I'd rather tell the truth than be counted with the nirthers (and troofers).
Couldn't agree more. Best case scenario plays out just like you stated and it comes to some sort of closure (from the standpoint of mainstreaming the view, not that the true believers won't continue to complain).
Let's hope the GOP plays it that way.
| 623 |
LGoPs Mon, Jul 27, 2009 3:24:31pm |
re: #600 Kragar (Proud to be Kafir)
Just what the hell are you trying to do here? You are messing up an almost spotless record of unveiling exclusively Republican scandals.
/
| 624 |
sattv4u2 Mon, Jul 27, 2009 3:26:02pm |
re: #611 callahan23
. Everyone is equal under the rule of law and no one is special and/or deserves special treatment, not even differing cultures or religions. In a western country that is, of course.
You don't think a preist, nun or rabbi is treated differently than you or I? I'm not talking about one that has broken a law, but lets say in an investigation where you and a rabbi (could be an opening line for e joke, but it's not) witness something. Lets say your 2 accounts are diamettrically opposite. Which version do you think the cop would tend to lean towards?
| 625 |
lobo91 Mon, Jul 27, 2009 3:26:06pm |
re: #613 Eowyn2
hypothetically.
If McGruff has a female officer inside the costume and they are at a Muslim or Jewish house of worship talking to the kids, does the female officer have to adhere to the normal restrictions regarding headwear?
Hypothetically, they wouldn't send McGruff to a Muslim venue in the first place, because dogs are haram.
| 626 |
Kragar Mon, Jul 27, 2009 3:26:12pm |
re: #623 LGoPs
Just what the hell are you trying to do here? You are messing up an almost spotless record of unveiling exclusively Republican scandals.
/
I should be flogged. I should be purged. I do not deserve to live amongst such fine people.
/
| 627 |
LGoPs Mon, Jul 27, 2009 3:26:47pm |
re: #626 Kragar (Proud to be Kafir)
I should be flogged. I should be purged. I do not deserve to live amongst such fine people.
/
Heh. BTW...keep it up.
:)
| 628 |
FrogMarch Mon, Jul 27, 2009 3:26:57pm |
re: #613 Eowyn2
hypothetically.
If McGruff has a female officer inside the costume and they are at a Muslim or Jewish house of worship talking to the kids, does the female officer have to adhere to the normal restrictions regarding headwear?
Is McGruff a dog? If so - it doesn't matter. By Islamic standards, the dog isn't allowed inside.
| 630 |
Sharmuta Mon, Jul 27, 2009 3:27:22pm |
Do we want muslims in the UK to police themselves and turn in potential killers to the police or not?
How do we foster trust between muslims and law enforcement?
| 632 |
BARACK THE VOTE Mon, Jul 27, 2009 3:27:34pm |
re: #619 zombie
Even if it was just for one single policewomen, I would disagree with the policy.
It singles out and humiliates women officers, but not male officers. It is sexist on the face of it.
Bull. If you're a female officer there on official business, covering your hair doesn't 'humiliate' you. You're still the one with all the power.
It's not humiliating when synagogues ask men, but not women, to wear a yarmulke.
| 633 |
Last Mohican Mon, Jul 27, 2009 3:27:37pm |
Quick poll: how many of you have possession of your original birth certificate, the one that was issued when you were born?
I don't have mine. I don't know where it is.
| 634 |
Randall Gross Mon, Jul 27, 2009 3:28:19pm |
re: #619 zombie
Even if it was just for one single policewomen, I would disagree with the policy.
It singles out and humiliates women officers, but not male officers. It is sexist on the face of it.
See my question about Amish police outreach above, and Ludwig's response, do you object to that?
| 636 |
DEZes Mon, Jul 27, 2009 3:28:39pm |
re: #633 Last Mohican
Quick poll: how many of you have possession of your original birth certificate, the one that was issued when you were born?
I don't have mine. I don't know where it is.
I have mine in my safe.
I had cute feet. ;)
| 637 |
unrealizedviewpoint Mon, Jul 27, 2009 3:28:44pm |
re: #596 Pianobuff
Have you heard about the House Resolution that includes language establishing Hawaii as Obama's birthplace?
It passes, then then we discover he really was born in Kenya? Then what? A new bill?
///
| 638 |
Charles Johnson Mon, Jul 27, 2009 3:28:46pm |
re: #619 zombie
Even if it was just for one single policewomen, I would disagree with the policy.
It singles out and humiliates women officers, but not male officers. It is sexist on the face of it.
It's pretty clear that Islam is a sexist religion in many ways, I don't disagree. But the officers that will be wearing these veils are:
... community support officers who work with Muslim groups in the area.
Yeah, I think it goes a little too far in the accomodationist direction, and it's undoubtedly influenced by the pushy British Muslim lobbies, but if it makes it easier to do their community support jobs to put on a veil when they enter a mosque then I see why they'd decide to do it. If you're supposed to be facilitating relations with the Muslim community, it's not your job to piss people off and teach them cultural lessons.
| 639 |
Pianobuff Mon, Jul 27, 2009 3:28:48pm |
re: #632 iceweasel
Bull. If you're a female officer there on official business, covering your hair doesn't 'humiliate' you. You're still the one with all the power.
It's not humiliating when synagogues ask men, but not women, to wear a yarmulke.
Is it customary for male cops on official business to a synagogue to wear a yarmulke?
| 640 |
Shug Mon, Jul 27, 2009 3:29:07pm |
re: #633 Last Mohican
I have Mine.
It says here clearly in black and White that I was born in ... ... ...KENYA!!
Holy Shit !!!
BRB
| 641 |
sattv4u2 Mon, Jul 27, 2009 3:29:08pm |
re: #633 Last Mohican
Quick poll: how many of you have possession of your original birth certificate, the one that was issued when you were born?
I don't have mine. I don't know where it is.
My mother has mine. I have 2 copies of it from the city hall in the town I was born in. They all have a raised imprint
| 642 |
moonflower Mon, Jul 27, 2009 3:29:15pm |
I went to the Blue Mosque and Hagia Sophia in 1989 and did not have to wear a veil and I actually went inside the Temple Mount in 1991 and did not have to wear one there either. But that was before the world went really bonkers.
| 643 |
WestTexas Mon, Jul 27, 2009 3:29:21pm |
Hey guys and gals, I hate to do a drive by post, but I'm at my grandparents and my granddad was trying to find a good website for researching A.C.O.R.N and their misdeeds. I know of [Link: www.rottenacorn.com...] and [Link: www.acornwatch.org,...] but if any of you have another suggestion I would greatly appreciate it.
| 644 |
Lee Coller Mon, Jul 27, 2009 3:29:26pm |
re: #633 Last Mohican
Quick poll: how many of you have possession of your original birth certificate, the one that was issued when you were born?
I don't have mine. I don't know where it is.
I have a certified copy (and it is a copy of the original, made on one of those old fashion copiers with the icky paper). I bet I couldn't get one like it today though, it would be a modern form that was a certification of the record of the original.
| 645 |
Last Mohican Mon, Jul 27, 2009 3:29:31pm |
re: #596 Pianobuff
Have you heard about the House Resolution that includes language establishing Hawaii as Obama's birthplace?
Is this for real? A birther litmus test?
| 646 |
Mad Prophet Ludwig Mon, Jul 27, 2009 3:29:39pm |
re: #580 Eowyn2
the only qualm I have is this phrase
like you are a female law enforcement person, and you are in hot pursuit of someone, you should be respectful, of their rules, or not go in.
I say
If you are in hot pursuit of someone who has broken the law, you run them to ground without stopping to tie a scarf around your hair or cover your arms or legs if they run into a Mosque. However, for simply asking questions, that is fine but should not be part of uniform for anyone other than those who actually have to go into a mosque
Then you misread me, and we agree completely. I said, unless you have a good reason not to, as in the pressing needs of law enforcement.
| 647 |
SixDegrees Mon, Jul 27, 2009 3:29:54pm |
For what it's worth - there was a small Orthodox Jewish community where I grew up. As I understand it (not well at all, to be honest) Orthodox Jewish males are forbidden to touch women who are not their wives. Whether this is correct or not, or only applies to certain sects, I have no idea. But a family friend who was a police officer said that all officers - male and female - were formally briefed on this prohibition and the woman were advised to honor it whenever practical. This mainly involved not sticking out your hand for a shake, a strong habit in our culture that would set off alarm bells on the Jewish side of the interaction. Even in cases where an arrest needed to be made, they were advised to let a male officer conduct any physical contact if that was practical.
It wasn't an edict or official policy. It was just a way for the police to be good neighbors. And of course, it was expected it would go straight out the window the moment it became impractical.
As far as I know, it was one of those things that just never really came up. It might have been a different story a half century earlier, when the Purple Gang was active, had there been any significant numbers of policewomen at the time. And if the Gang had Orthodox members. But I digress.
The point is, it doesn't hurt to show respect for other cultures and customs as a matter of course. It's just a matter of common courtesy.
| 648 |
lobo91 Mon, Jul 27, 2009 3:30:03pm |
re: #628 FrogMarch
Is McGruff a dog? If so - it doesn't matter. By Islamic standards, the dog isn't allowed inside.
Technically, of course, McGruff isn't actually a dog. It's a person inside of a dog costume.
That detail wouldn't matter to the British Muslim community, however. They've been known to go ballistic over things like piggy banks.
| 649 |
Sharmuta Mon, Jul 27, 2009 3:30:35pm |
re: #633 Last Mohican
Quick poll: how many of you have possession of your original birth certificate, the one that was issued when you were born?
I don't have mine. I don't know where it is.
I don't have mine- the government does.
| 650 |
Charles Johnson Mon, Jul 27, 2009 3:30:44pm |
P.S. If this were a system-wide requirement for all policewomen, I'd have a problem with that.
| 651 |
opnion Mon, Jul 27, 2009 3:30:47pm |
re: #632 iceweasel
Bull. If you're a female officer there on official business, covering your hair doesn't 'humiliate' you. You're still the one with all the power.
It's not humiliating when synagogues ask men, but not women, to wear a yarmulke.
Would a synagouge require a policeman on official buiness to wear a yarmaluke? Don't think so.
| 652 |
DEZes Mon, Jul 27, 2009 3:31:32pm |
| 653 |
Shug Mon, Jul 27, 2009 3:32:05pm |
re: #652 DEZes
Why would the Government have it?
Sharm " The Fish" Sharmuta is in the witness protection program
| 654 |
Pianobuff Mon, Jul 27, 2009 3:32:47pm |
re: #633 Last Mohican
Quick poll: how many of you have possession of your original birth certificate, the one that was issued when you were born?
I don't have mine. I don't know where it is.
Actually I do. It's about the only thing I've somehow not lost. It's a negative copy of the microfiched certificate. So it's not exactly the original, but its more or less an authentic facsimile of the image of the original - so I count it as such.
I suspect I'm in the minority though.
| 655 |
sattv4u2 Mon, Jul 27, 2009 3:32:48pm |
re: #649 Sharmuta
I don't have mine- the government does.
Why? I mean, technically the gov't still has mine, but my mother has the original and I have 2 copies of it both with the raised seal
| 656 |
Randall Gross Mon, Jul 27, 2009 3:32:59pm |
re: #650 Charles
P.S. If this were a system-wide requirement for all policewomen, I'd have a problem with that.
As would I.
| 657 |
Sharmuta Mon, Jul 27, 2009 3:33:13pm |
re: #652 DEZes
Why would the Government have it?
Why would they have the original? Because that's what it's for- it's a government record.
| 658 |
BlueRoses Mon, Jul 27, 2009 3:33:17pm |
I don't care about the birthers. What I do care about is World Net Daily and it's decline because it used to be a place to find some good articles. Not anymore.
| 659 |
lobo91 Mon, Jul 27, 2009 3:33:46pm |
re: #649 Sharmuta
I don't have mine- the government does.
I don't have mine, either. A large elephant seal ate it.
| 660 |
Shug Mon, Jul 27, 2009 3:34:08pm |
| 661 |
DEZes Mon, Jul 27, 2009 3:34:18pm |
re: #657 Sharmuta
Why would they have the original? Because that's what it's for- it's a government record.
I have the original, and a copy is on record.
Must vary from state to state, or from decades past.
| 662 |
FrogMarch Mon, Jul 27, 2009 3:34:22pm |
re: #633 Last Mohican
Quick poll: how many of you have possession of your original birth certificate, the one that was issued when you were born?
I don't have mine. I don't know where it is.
I have a photo-copy of mine folded in with my passport.
no original.
| 663 |
Lee Coller Mon, Jul 27, 2009 3:34:31pm |
| 664 |
sattv4u2 Mon, Jul 27, 2009 3:34:33pm |
re: #650 Charles
P.S. If this were a system-wide requirement for all policewomen, I'd have a problem with that.
ditto
| 665 |
BlueRoses Mon, Jul 27, 2009 3:34:35pm |
Me neither. I was never born. Dad insists I was hatched.
| 667 |
Sharmuta Mon, Jul 27, 2009 3:35:06pm |
re: #659 lobo91
I don't have mine, either. A large elephant seal ate it.
That has been known to happen.
| 668 |
FrogMarch Mon, Jul 27, 2009 3:35:21pm |
re: #648 lobo91
Technically, of course, McGruff isn't actually a dog. It's a person inside of a dog costume.
That detail wouldn't matter to the British Muslim community, however. They've been known to go ballistic over things like piggy banks.
Which brings us back to those delicate sensibilities.
| 669 |
callahan23 Mon, Jul 27, 2009 3:35:34pm |
re: #624 sattv4u2
. re: #611 callahan23 Everyone is equal under the rule of law and no one is special and/or deserves special treatment, not even differing cultures or religions. In a western country that is, of course.You don't think a preist, nun or rabbi is treated differently than you or I? I'm not talking about one that has broken a law, but lets say in an investigation where you and a rabbi (could be an opening line for e joke, but it's not) witness something. Lets say your 2 accounts are diamettrically opposite. Which version do you think the cop would tend to lean towards?
Surely they are being treated differently to me. Because the police officer is a human being and judges according to her/his value system.
But that is not the point here, the important issue is that western democratic societies make it a rule that we are all equal as a basic tenet.
The police forces and their training are evolving through time to accommodate and alleviate those very biases I mentioned above.
Thus immigrants that are new to these concepts need to learn these principles that are ofttimes vastly different to their original cultures.
| 670 |
Pvt Bin Jammin Mon, Jul 27, 2009 3:35:35pm |
re: #643 WestTexas
[Link: www.discoverthenetworks.org...]
ACORN has changed their name recently, however. You should still be able to find it.
| 671 |
Shug Mon, Jul 27, 2009 3:35:40pm |
| 673 |
Kragar Mon, Jul 27, 2009 3:36:14pm |
re: #665 BlueRoses
Me neither. I was never born. Dad insists I was hatched.
I sprung fully formed from the head of my sire on the Mount of the Gods!
OK, not really, but the peasants love that kind of shit.
| 674 |
sattv4u2 Mon, Jul 27, 2009 3:36:19pm |
re: #661 DEZes
I have the original, and a copy is on record.
Must vary from state to state, or from decades past.
I went to the city hall in the town I was born in. For $2 (at the time) I got a copy of mine with the raised seal. They did it right there in the office. Years later I lost that one and went and got another. I then found the 1st one I got so now I have 2
| 675 |
unrealizedviewpoint Mon, Jul 27, 2009 3:36:54pm |
re: #665 BlueRoses
Me neither. I was never born. Dad insists I was hatched.
Charles must have our Birth/Hatch Certificates, right?
| 676 |
Last Mohican Mon, Jul 27, 2009 3:37:05pm |
I read Zombie's headscarf article. The second paragraph seems to imply that the policewomen will be expected to cover their hair whenever entering a mosque for any reason, whether they're off-duty and attending prayers as a form of community outreach, or reporting to the mosque while on duty in order to investigate a crime in progress. And to me, that's just plain wrong. As it would be wrong for a rabbi to stop a male policeman at the door of a synagogue and say "you can't continue chasing that mugger in here unless you put on this yarmulke."
| 677 |
calcajun Mon, Jul 27, 2009 3:37:23pm |
re: #581 Charles
You assume people actually read the article. Dangerous assumption.
| 678 |
BlueRoses Mon, Jul 27, 2009 3:37:53pm |
re: #672 buzzsawmonkey
re: #672 buzzsawmonkey
Of course not; because synagogues don't ask police to wear yarmulkes.
Men who come to a synagogue to worship do wear yarmulkes, if they are Jews; if they are non-Jews who are there as guests, they may conform to the custom but they are not required to.
In Orthodox synogogues, married women cover their hair with hats, scarves, or sheitels (wigs); women in more traditional Conservative synagogues do this also, though it is not customary for them to wear yarmulkes, since those are male attire. Again, non-Jews are not expected to comply with these things, and police certainly are not expected, let alone required, to do so.
re: #672 buzzsawmonkey
Of course not; because synagogues don't ask police to wear yarmulkes.
Men who come to a synagogue to worship do wear yarmulkes, if they are Jews; if they are non-Jews who are there as guests, they may conform to the custom but they are not required to.
In Orthodox synogogues, married women cover their hair with hats, scarves, or sheitels (wigs); women in more traditional Conservative synagogues do this also, though it is not customary for them to wear yarmulkes, since those are male attire. Again, non-Jews are not expected to comply with these things, and police certainly are not expected, let alone required, to do so.
Women NEVER wear kippot. Kippot are for men.
| 679 |
Pianobuff Mon, Jul 27, 2009 3:38:09pm |
The Dems are strategizing to counter the CBO's less than rosy estimate on Obamacare. From reading the article, it sounds like Elmendorf, head of the CBO better watch his back.
| 680 |
Sharmuta Mon, Jul 27, 2009 3:38:13pm |
re: #661 DEZes
I have the original, and a copy is on record.
Must vary from state to state, or from decades past.
Or there were two originals made, possibly? BCs are for the Vital Records departments. I think some of you that think you have an original might have a duplicate original- the state gets an original BC from the hospital.
| 681 |
opnion Mon, Jul 27, 2009 3:38:14pm |
Correct me if I'm wrong, but nowhere in the Koran are women required to wear head coverings.
Misogenist males in the Middle East & elsewhere instituted requirement.
why in the world would British police officers be required to pander to that?
Humiliating women should not be the price to pay for a Community Outreach Program. The host culture considers the genders equal & should imo act accordingly.
| 682 |
WestTexas Mon, Jul 27, 2009 3:38:22pm |
re: #670 Pvt Bin Jammin
Thank you very much. I will pass it on to him. You guys are the greatest. Gonna go spend some time with them now. :-)
| 683 |
DEZes Mon, Jul 27, 2009 3:38:26pm |
re: #674 sattv4u2
I went to the city hall in the town I was born in. For $2 (at the time) I got a copy of mine with the raised seal. They did it right there in the office. Years later I lost that one and went and got another. I then found the 1st one I got so now I have 2
Sometimes its hard to believe those were my feet that made those purple prints. ;)
| 684 |
BlueRoses Mon, Jul 27, 2009 3:38:46pm |
re: #675 unrealizedviewpoint
Charles must have our Birth/Hatch Certificates, right?
Unless he lost them? :(
| 685 |
lurking faith Mon, Jul 27, 2009 3:38:47pm |
re: #665 BlueRoses
Me neither. I was never born. Dad insists I was hatched.
Well, yeah. That's what lizards do.
| 686 |
Kragar Mon, Jul 27, 2009 3:39:02pm |
re: #677 calcajun
You assume people actually read the article. Dangerous assumption.
I won't read anything without being allowed 2 days and 2 lawyers to help me decipher it. You can learn a lot from Congressmen.
/
| 688 |
Pvt Bin Jammin Mon, Jul 27, 2009 3:39:27pm |
re: #682 WestTexas
Lots of other good stuff on that site.
| 689 |
DEZes Mon, Jul 27, 2009 3:39:48pm |
re: #680 Sharmuta
Or there were two originals made, possibly? BCs are for the Vital Records departments. I think some of you that think you have an original might have a duplicate original- the state gets an original BC from the hospital.
You could be right, but its most likely a duplicate, it has the gold seal and my footprints.
| 690 |
calcajun Mon, Jul 27, 2009 3:39:54pm |
re: #673 Kragar (Proud to be Kafir)
Evil: What sort of Supreme Being created such riffraff? Is this not the workings of a complete incompetent?
Baxi Brazilia III: But He created you, Evil One.
Evil: What did you say?
Baxi Brazilia III: Well He created you, so He can't be entirely...
Evil: [Blows Baxi to bits] Never talk to me like that again! No one created me! I am Evil. Evil existed long before good. I made myself. I cannot be unmade. *I* am all powerful!
Time Bandits
| 691 |
Charles Johnson Mon, Jul 27, 2009 3:39:57pm |
re: #676 Last Mohican
I read Zombie's headscarf article. The second paragraph seems to imply that the policewomen will be expected to cover their hair whenever entering a mosque for any reason, whether they're off-duty and attending prayers as a form of community outreach, or reporting to the mosque while on duty in order to investigate a crime in progress. And to me, that's just plain wrong. As it would be wrong for a rabbi to stop a male policeman at the door of a synagogue and say "you can't continue chasing that mugger in here unless you put on this yarmulke."
No, that's not correct-- it's only for fifteen officers who are involved in Muslim community support programs.
| 692 |
sattv4u2 Mon, Jul 27, 2009 3:39:58pm |
re: #669 callahan23
But that is not the point here
Sorry, but from what I'm reading, that IS the point here. The British police establishing an outreach program going INTO a mosque with female officers! Respecting the religion's customs
| 693 |
doppelganglander Mon, Jul 27, 2009 3:40:23pm |
re: #561 Kragar (Proud to be Kafir)
Was that the Friday night lounge thread?
Tea Party Leader Backs Racist Doc.
| 694 |
sattv4u2 Mon, Jul 27, 2009 3:40:26pm |
re: #683 DEZes
Sometimes its hard to believe those were my feet that made those purple prints. ;)
Why do you have purple feet!?!?!
| 695 |
lurking faith Mon, Jul 27, 2009 3:40:43pm |
re: #674 sattv4u2
I went to the city hall in the town I was born in. For $2 (at the time) I got a copy of mine with the raised seal. They did it right there in the office. Years later I lost that one and went and got another. I then found the 1st one I got so now I have 2
You're twins!
| 696 |
midwestgak Mon, Jul 27, 2009 3:40:47pm |
Just watched the video. I miss Tony Snow and the administration he served under.
| 697 |
BlueRoses Mon, Jul 27, 2009 3:41:09pm |
| 699 |
Sharmuta Mon, Jul 27, 2009 3:41:17pm |
re: #689 DEZes
You could be right, but its most likely a duplicate, it has the gold seal and my footprints.
Some hospitals offer souvenir BCs- that might be what you have.
| 700 |
Randall Gross Mon, Jul 27, 2009 3:41:35pm |
re: #654 Pianobuff
Actually I do. It's about the only thing I've somehow not lost. It's a negative copy of the microfiched certificate. So it's not exactly the original, but its more or less an authentic facsimile of the image of the original - so I count it as such.
I suspect I'm in the minority though.
I have my copy, but only because my mother is wise. I was born in Germany, so she made a trip and got the official copy because I was born abroad. When I went to get my passport I proffered two docs, one the official birth cert in German, and the other a standard form "report of citizen born abroad" or something like that - when I turned them in they handled it with extreme care; ooohinng and ahhhing over the antique docs created with typewriter and carbon paper, they went into some weird bureaucratic glee over them. Except for the supervisor they hadn't seen anything of the like before . If mom hadn't made a special trip to get it then I would have something akin to what you see for Obama.
| 701 |
DEZes Mon, Jul 27, 2009 3:41:37pm |
| 702 |
BlueRoses Mon, Jul 27, 2009 3:41:53pm |
re: #696 midwestgak
Just watched the video. I miss Tony Snow and the administration he served under.
Me too. Obama is turning this country upside down.
| 703 |
sattv4u2 Mon, Jul 27, 2009 3:41:58pm |
| 704 |
Mad Prophet Ludwig Mon, Jul 27, 2009 3:42:01pm |
re: #647 SixDegrees
For what it's worth - there was a small Orthodox Jewish community where I grew up. As I understand it (not well at all, to be honest) Orthodox Jewish males are forbidden to touch women who are not their wives. Whether this is correct or not, or only applies to certain sects, I have no idea. But a family friend who was a police officer said that all officers - male and female - were formally briefed on this prohibition and the woman were advised to honor it whenever practical. This mainly involved not sticking out your hand for a shake, a strong habit in our culture that would set off alarm bells on the Jewish side of the interaction. Even in cases where an arrest needed to be made, they were advised to let a male officer conduct any physical contact if that was practical.
It wasn't an edict or official policy. It was just a way for the police to be good neighbors. And of course, it was expected it would go straight out the window the moment it became impractical.
As far as I know, it was one of those things that just never really came up. It might have been a different story a half century earlier, when the Purple Gang was active, had there been any significant numbers of policewomen at the time. And if the Gang had Orthodox members. But I digress.
The point is, it doesn't hurt to show respect for other cultures and customs as a matter of course. It's just a matter of common courtesy.
You are referring to shomer neghia. The rule is that grown men and women do not touch members of the opposite sex that they are not married to or closely related to. You can hug your mother or father or brothers or sisters etc... Little children are not subject to this. In other words you could hand your little son or daughter to a friend to hold for a minute.
This is true of all observant streams of Judaism though some are much more strict about it and others are less more so.
As with all Jewish laws, there are caveats. If a woman were to slip and fall, you would still catch her. If she needed CPR, you would still give it to her. In essence, any of the reasonable reasons where you might need to touch her are permitted. IF she is a criminal who needs to be restrained, then certainly the police are permitted to do that under Jewish law as well - and the same would apply to a female officer arresting a male.
Also there is the flip side to it. Many observant Jewish women in America will assume that you don't know about Shomer Neghia and will shake your hand rather than embarrass you. The principle behind it is make touching your spouse all the more amazing because you are in essence always saving yourself for them and they are for you.
| 705 |
lobo91 Mon, Jul 27, 2009 3:42:02pm |
re: #681 opnion
Correct me if I'm wrong, but nowhere in the Koran are women required to wear head coverings.
Misogenist males in the Middle East & elsewhere instituted requirement.
Absolutely true.
That's why you see such a variety of coverings, depending on what country you're in.
| 706 |
BARACK THE VOTE Mon, Jul 27, 2009 3:42:07pm |
re: #672 buzzsawmonkey
Of course not; because synagogues don't ask police to wear yarmulkes.
Men who come to a synagogue to worship do wear yarmulkes, if they are Jews; if they are non-Jews who are there as guests, they may conform to the custom but they are not required to. Again, non-Jews are not expected to comply with these things, and police certainly are not expected, let alone required, to do so.
And neither are these British police expected, or required, by mosques to conform. It's a community outreach situation. It's a matter of respect and politeness. And it helps a lot to get the community to trust and like you.
| 707 |
calcajun Mon, Jul 27, 2009 3:42:14pm |
re: #698 buzzsawmonkey
"Synagouge?" You must have been at our last fundraising drive.
You need a sedagive.
| 708 |
Fat Bastard Vegetarian Mon, Jul 27, 2009 3:42:21pm |
| 709 |
Fat Bastard Vegetarian Mon, Jul 27, 2009 3:42:44pm |
re: #707 calcajun
I thought it was seg-a-give...
| 710 |
BARACK THE VOTE Mon, Jul 27, 2009 3:42:52pm |
| 711 |
BlueRoses Mon, Jul 27, 2009 3:42:55pm |
re: #698 buzzsawmonkey
"Synagouge?" You must have been at our last fundraising drive.
Boy ain't that the truth. The only way to escape it is never go :))
| 712 |
opnion Mon, Jul 27, 2009 3:43:05pm |
re: #698 buzzsawmonkey
"Synagouge?" You must have been at our last fundraising drive.
If I could spell I would have a better nic
| 713 |
debutaunt Mon, Jul 27, 2009 3:43:07pm |
| 714 |
sattv4u2 Mon, Jul 27, 2009 3:43:07pm |
re: #699 Sharmuta
Some hospitals offer souvenir BCs- that might be what you have.
I have one (2 actually ,, I lost one, got another, then found the 1st) from the city hall office in the town I was born in. It has the raised official city seal
| 715 |
Kragar Mon, Jul 27, 2009 3:43:18pm |
| 716 |
Ayeless in Ghazi Mon, Jul 27, 2009 3:43:50pm |
re: #635 buzzsawmonkey
You're way, way past that point in the UK if half--make that a quarter--of the stories coming out of there are true.
British police have two choices; either don't send women into Misogynoland at all, or send them in in a way that will aid, not hinder, their being perceived as "men" on the grounds that they are police. Anything--anything--else is an abdication by the police of the power they need to perform their job. And anything else is a reaffirmation, to the women of Misogynoland, of their subservient position.
Everyone knows that there have been some outrageously pee cee decisions in public life in the UK, just as there have been in the US too.
However, I don't see this as one of them. This scares me no more than if I were to hear that police were being asked to take their shoes off while on community policing visits to Buddhist temples. You could argue of course that this too would represent an abdication of the police's power etc, but I think that would be a bit of a stretch, as it is in this case with the scarves.
| 717 |
callahan23 Mon, Jul 27, 2009 3:44:00pm |
| 718 |
sattv4u2 Mon, Jul 27, 2009 3:44:01pm |
| 719 |
DEZes Mon, Jul 27, 2009 3:44:02pm |
re: #699 Sharmuta
Some hospitals offer souvenir BCs- that might be what you have.
I might research a bit and find out, or since I am not sure I care at the moment, I may just uncap a beer.
Join me?
| 720 |
Lee Coller Mon, Jul 27, 2009 3:44:49pm |
re: #712 opnion
If I could spell I would have a better nic
You've just confirmed what I've long suspected. Just my opinion.
| 721 |
calcajun Mon, Jul 27, 2009 3:44:52pm |
re: #715 Kragar (Proud to be Kafir)
Quite you, you're stone dead.
But, I don't want to go on the cart! I feel happy!
| 722 |
DEZes Mon, Jul 27, 2009 3:45:01pm |
| 723 |
sattv4u2 Mon, Jul 27, 2009 3:45:12pm |
re: #719 DEZes
I might research a bit and find out, or since I am not sure I care at the moment, I may just uncap a beer.
Join me?
you need help uncapping a beer? No WONDER your feet are purple!
| 725 |
Fat Bastard Vegetarian Mon, Jul 27, 2009 3:45:20pm |
re: #718 sattv4u2
Barney The Dinosaur Wanna Be !?!?!
One eyed, one horned, flying purple people feeter?...
| 726 |
opnion Mon, Jul 27, 2009 3:45:31pm |
re: #720 Lee Coller
You've just confirmed what I've long suspected. Just my opinion.
No it's opynyon
| 727 |
sattv4u2 Mon, Jul 27, 2009 3:45:55pm |
re: #725 Fat Bastard Vegetarian
One eyed, one horned, flying purple people feeter?...
An ex Minnesota Viking!
| 728 |
Pianobuff Mon, Jul 27, 2009 3:46:12pm |
re: #700 Thanos
I have my copy, but only because my mother is wise. I was born in Germany, so she made a trip and got the official copy because I was born abroad. When I went to get my passport I proffered two docs, one the official birth cert in German, and the other a standard form "report of citizen born abroad" or something like that - when I turned them in they handled it with extreme care; ooohinng and ahhhing over the antique docs created with typewriter and carbon paper, they went into some weird bureaucratic glee over them. Except for the supervisor they hadn't seen anything of the like before . If mom hadn't made a special trip to get it then I would have something akin to what you see for Obama.
It's nothing short of a miracle that I still have mine, given my tendency to misplace items of importance on a regular basis. I even lost my passport once and didn't realize it until the day before I was supposed to go on a vacation to France (from the US) with my spouse. I was in a little trouble over that.
| 729 |
DEZes Mon, Jul 27, 2009 3:46:20pm |
re: #723 sattv4u2
you need help uncapping a beer? No WONDER your feet are purple!
The proper response is, why are you falling apart. ;)
| 730 |
FrogMarch Mon, Jul 27, 2009 3:46:22pm |
re: #643 WestTexas
Hey guys and gals, I hate to do a drive by post, but I'm at my grandparents and my granddad was trying to find a good website for researching A.C.O.R.N and their misdeeds. I know of [Link: www.rottenacorn.com...] and [Link: www.acornwatch.org,...] but if any of you have another suggestion I would greatly appreciate it.
Here's a good over-view of Acorn fraud from Gay Patriot:
[Link: www.gaypatriot.net...]
| 731 |
Kragar Mon, Jul 27, 2009 3:46:52pm |
| 732 |
unrealizedviewpoint Mon, Jul 27, 2009 3:46:55pm |
Why such difficulty spelling opnion?
| 733 |
Last Mohican Mon, Jul 27, 2009 3:47:03pm |
re: #691 Charles
Well, it says they've been given to seven police officers, and eight "community support officers who work with Muslim groups in the area." The "police officers" have different colored uniforms than the "community support officers," so I guess they're different people, with different jobs and different training.
Clearly the department must have more than seven women police officers, so it must not be their policy that every woman officer has to wear a headscarf when entering a mosque, all of the time. And that's good. On the other hand, the fact that they have "community support officers," and that those aren't the only women who are being issued scarves, I think sort of implies that the other officers are supposed to wear the scarves when entering mosques even on non-community-support business. And, if true, I think that would be bad.
But, from the article, I don't know exactly how they're going to handle this.
| 734 |
DEZes Mon, Jul 27, 2009 3:47:05pm |
| 736 |
Mad Prophet Ludwig Mon, Jul 27, 2009 3:47:57pm |
Guys, don't be harsh on typos... I know that if I were, the force of my own hypocrisy would likely damage the orbit of the Earth.
| 737 |
midwestgak Mon, Jul 27, 2009 3:48:05pm |
re: #702 BlueRoses
Me too. Obama is turning this country upside down.
shh. Don't tell anyone, but my boss, head of sales told me that they downsized (eight of us) because of the outcome of the election. Every business owner, big or small, have done, are doing everything they can to keep afloat.
| 738 |
Ayeless in Ghazi Mon, Jul 27, 2009 3:48:06pm |
re: #650 Charles
P.S. If this were a system-wide requirement for all policewomen, I'd have a problem with that.
Yes, if zombies headline had been accurate, it would have been an occasion for a degree of outrage, and some ridicule. But fortunately it was anything but that.
| 739 |
SixDegrees Mon, Jul 27, 2009 3:48:17pm |
re: #681 opnion
Correct me if I'm wrong, but nowhere in the Koran are women required to wear head coverings.
Misogenist males in the Middle East & elsewhere instituted requirement.
why in the world would British police officers be required to pander to that?
Humiliating women should not be the price to pay for a Community Outreach Program. The host culture considers the genders equal & should imo act accordingly.
As far as I know, there isn't any explicit directive that women and men should be segregated in an Orthodox Jewish synagogue, either. It's a requirement derived from scripture in what many would consider a rather convoluted argument.
A man, going to sit with the women under such circumstances - even as a guest - would be considered insufferably rude. As would a woman going to sit with the men.
| 740 |
sattv4u2 Mon, Jul 27, 2009 3:48:25pm |
re: #732 unrealizedviewpoint
Why such difficulty spelling opnion?
kno reeson. sumtym peepull just hav difikulty with speling
| 741 |
Fat Bastard Vegetarian Mon, Jul 27, 2009 3:48:28pm |
re: #732 unrealizedviewpoint
More than one lizard has a typo in their nic.
| 742 |
Kragar Mon, Jul 27, 2009 3:48:31pm |
re: #734 DEZes
*Passes beer to the blue chick.*
Be careful on what you might be getting yourself into. You know about the great debate about blue chicks.
| 743 |
callahan23 Mon, Jul 27, 2009 3:48:38pm |
re: #736 LudwigVanQuixote
Guys, don't be harsh on typos... I know that if I were, the force of my own hypocrisy would likely damage the orbit of the Earth.
ROTFLOL
| 744 |
DEZes Mon, Jul 27, 2009 3:48:44pm |
re: #736 LudwigVanQuixote
Guys, don't be harsh on typos... I know that if I were, the force of my own hypocrisy would likely damage the orbit of the Earth.
Yeah, chit happens.
| 745 |
Sharmuta Mon, Jul 27, 2009 3:49:12pm |
re: #714 sattv4u2
I have one (2 actually ,, I lost one, got another, then found the 1st) from the city hall office in the town I was born in. It has the raised official city seal
I went down to the county office and got two BCs- one long form and one short. The short form is the certified, legal copy. My long form was not certified as the county will only certify short forms, and it therefore not a legal documnet. So, while I do have a copy of my long form BC- it's worthless (except to me- it has my mum's signature on, rest her soul).
| 747 |
DEZes Mon, Jul 27, 2009 3:49:31pm |
re: #742 Kragar (Proud to be Kafir)
Be careful on what you might be getting yourself into. You know about the great debate about blue chicks.
They seemed to work out okay for Captain Kirk.
| 748 |
unrealizedviewpoint Mon, Jul 27, 2009 3:49:34pm |
| 749 |
opnion Mon, Jul 27, 2009 3:49:47pm |
White Sox perfect game pitcher Mark Buerle is doing the top 10 list on Letterman tonight.
It is taped, but if it were live I would like him to say,
"And the number One reason that I pitched a perfect game is so that I could come on here & insult the gap toothed jerk that slimed Sarah Palin & her daughter."
| 750 |
Fat Bastard Vegetarian Mon, Jul 27, 2009 3:50:19pm |
| 751 |
sattv4u2 Mon, Jul 27, 2009 3:50:20pm |
BBL
The locusts (my son and several buddies) are swarming arounf the kitchen!
Yup ,,, look at the time. It's been almost an entire hour since last they ate!
| 752 |
Kragar Mon, Jul 27, 2009 3:50:47pm |
re: #747 DEZes
They seemed to work out okay for Captain Kirk.
Those were green chicks. Are you color blind?
For those who don't know about the perils of blue chicks:
Henchman 24: Come on! They have one female servicing a large group of males. That implies a species that lays eggs.
Henchman 21: Oh my God, you're crazy! They're so obviously mammals!
Henchman 24: Please! She'd be in estrus 24/7 if she didn't lay eggs.
Henchman 21: Smurfs don't lay eggs! I won't tell you this again! Papa Smurf has a fucking beard! They're mammals!
| 753 |
lurking faith Mon, Jul 27, 2009 3:51:04pm |
re: #701 DEZes
Better be careful, then...
I said Mr. Purple People Eater what's your line
He said It's eating purple people and that sure is fine
| 754 |
SixDegrees Mon, Jul 27, 2009 3:51:11pm |
re: #704 LudwigVanQuixote
You are referring to shomer neghia. The rule is that grown men and women do not touch members of the opposite sex that they are not married to or closely related to. You can hug your mother or father or brothers or sisters etc... Little children are not subject to this. In other words you could hand your little son or daughter to a friend to hold for a minute.
This is true of all observant streams of Judaism though some are much more strict about it and others are less more so.
As with all Jewish laws, there are caveats. If a woman were to slip and fall, you would still catch her. If she needed CPR, you would still give it to her. In essence, any of the reasonable reasons where you might need to touch her are permitted. IF she is a criminal who needs to be restrained, then certainly the police are permitted to do that under Jewish law as well - and the same would apply to a female officer arresting a male.
Also there is the flip side to it. Many observant Jewish women in America will assume that you don't know about Shomer Neghia and will shake your hand rather than embarrass you. The principle behind it is make touching your spouse all the more amazing because you are in essence always saving yourself for them and they are for you.
Thanks for the more detailed explanation.
| 755 |
Randall Gross Mon, Jul 27, 2009 3:52:10pm |
re: #746 buzzsawmonkey
Nobody has yet explained why the police have to take the community as it comes, but the community is not expected to take the police as they come.
The whole point of the police is that you have to take them as they come. Or are the police now going to start observing the quaint cultural taboos of the Chav Community?
Because the police are ultimately servants of the community?
| 756 |
calcajun Mon, Jul 27, 2009 3:53:21pm |
re: #747 DEZes
They seemed to work out okay for Captain Kirk.
Something was wrong with the color on your Zenith-- she was green.
| 757 |
sattv4u2 Mon, Jul 27, 2009 3:53:29pm |
re: #745 Sharmuta
Well. Everett Massachusetts has no "forms", long or short. My birth cert. is a single piece of paper, very good bond with the official City of Everett seal on it with names/ dates on it. All I had to do to get it was show up with 2 forms of ID and $2
| 758 |
DEZes Mon, Jul 27, 2009 3:53:37pm |
re: #752 Kragar (Proud to be Kafir)
"Those were green chicks. Are you color blind?"
as a matter of fact... yes.
| 759 |
Last Mohican Mon, Jul 27, 2009 3:54:22pm |
re: #704 LudwigVanQuixote
I have encountered an orthodox rabbi or two who objected to being touched by female doctors. I think they usually considered it okay if the doctor was wearing gloves, although they weren't especially pleased about it.
I have also heard of Muslim men who won't allow their wives to be treated by male doctors. Somewhere I read about a growing problem in France, in which Muslims men are murdering their wives' male gynecologists.
| 760 |
Sharmuta Mon, Jul 27, 2009 3:55:13pm |
re: #757 sattv4u2
No no- "form" is just the name for the type of BC. They come in two styles called long form and short form. The long forms have more information on them. The short forms have just the essential basics.
| 761 |
DEZes Mon, Jul 27, 2009 3:55:22pm |
re: #756 calcajun
Something was wrong with the color on your Zenith-- she was green.
So much for me being a Star Trek geek.
| 762 |
unrealizedviewpoint Mon, Jul 27, 2009 3:55:31pm |
Never really understood the birth certificate significance. Seems to me I could make one up in minutes on my PC. Yet, one needs one to get a license, passport... makes no sense.
| 763 |
BlueRoses Mon, Jul 27, 2009 3:55:43pm |
re: #737 midwestgak
shh. Don't tell anyone, but my boss, head of sales told me that they downsized (eight of us) because of the outcome of the election. Every business owner, big or small, have done, are doing everything they can to keep afloat.
I know. There are businesses closing where I live. Good businesses I will miss. But we shouldn't complain because 'The One' will lead us out of the wilderness and into liberal utopia. Where when I get up in the morning and crawl out of my cardboard box under the bridge I will be happy to know I have 'free heath care'. :)
| 764 |
rightymouse Mon, Jul 27, 2009 3:55:53pm |
re: #680 Sharmuta
Or there were two originals made, possibly? BCs are for the Vital Records departments. I think some of you that think you have an original might have a duplicate original- the state gets an original BC from the hospital.
My husband needed to get a passport. He's never had one. His BC was a copy of the original Certificate of Live Birth, so he just ordered certified copies (2) from the state. The website service Vitalchek may be used by anyone who was born or married here who wants a certified copy of their birth or marriage certificate. Or check to see if you can order directly from the issuing state.
| 766 |
calcajun Mon, Jul 27, 2009 3:56:14pm |
re: #744 DEZes
Yeah, chit happens.
wel feck yu. Ill bee typng betr wonce mi spel chekr is warking agan.//
| 767 |
unrealizedviewpoint Mon, Jul 27, 2009 3:56:41pm |
re: #759 Last Mohican
I have encountered an orthodox rabbi or two who objected to being touched by female doctors. I think they usually considered it okay if the doctor was wearing gloves, although they weren't especially pleased about it.
How do they feel about prostate exams?
| 768 |
calcajun Mon, Jul 27, 2009 3:56:45pm |
re: #761 DEZes
So much for me being a Star Trek geek.
You failed the test. Be gone and let us speak no more of this.
| 770 |
Sharmuta Mon, Jul 27, 2009 3:57:18pm |
re: #764 rightymouse
My husband needed to get a passport. He's never had one. His BC was a copy of the original Certificate of Live Birth, so he just ordered certified copies (2) from the state. The website service Vitalchek may be used by anyone who was born or married here who wants a certified copy of their birth or marriage certificate. Or check to see if you can order directly from the issuing state.
It's important the BC is certified or it's worthless.
| 771 |
sattv4u2 Mon, Jul 27, 2009 3:57:27pm |
re: #760 Sharmuta
No no- "form" is just the name for the type of BC. They come in two styles called long form and short form. The long forms have more information on them. The short forms have just the essential basics.
and as stated, there is but one "form" of cirtificate in Everett Mass. I have seen the original. I have two identical copies of it complete with the raised seal.
It has all the pertinent info (moms/dads names,,, time/date/ place of birth,, and of course my name)
| 772 |
midwestgak Mon, Jul 27, 2009 3:57:29pm |
| 773 |
Russkilitlover Mon, Jul 27, 2009 3:57:34pm |
Could our foreign policy BE anymore inept?
| 774 |
DEZes Mon, Jul 27, 2009 3:57:58pm |
re: #766 calcajun
wel feck yu. Ill bee typng betr wonce mi spel chekr is warking agan.//
Yu fargon bastages butter quit knit piken me, bunhe iceholes.
| 775 |
BlueRoses Mon, Jul 27, 2009 3:58:22pm |
re: #766 calcajun
wel feck yu. Ill bee typng betr wonce mi spel chekr is warking agan.//
I figure I will put a whole mess of letters in my posts and y'all can arrange them anyway you like :) Try it !
| 776 |
FrogMarch Mon, Jul 27, 2009 3:58:28pm |
re: #769 buzzsawmonkey
The police serve the community by protecting it, which involves suppressing illegal activity within it. That suppression is not looked on with favor by those who engage in illegal activity, and it requires the police to be viewed with respect and, to some degree, fear.
Removing an element of respect by making the police visually subservient is not the way to get the police to serve the community effectively.
Thank you!
| 778 |
Shug Mon, Jul 27, 2009 3:58:29pm |
I think the best way to solve this whole female police officer headscarf controvercy is to just go ahead and ban Women from Mosques entirely. This will make everybody happy
problem solved
/
| 779 |
Sharmuta Mon, Jul 27, 2009 3:58:37pm |
re: #771 sattv4u2
and as stated, there is but one "form" of cirtificate in Everett Mass. I have seen the original. I have two identical copies of it complete with the raised seal.
It has all the pertinent info (moms/dads names,,, time/date/ place of birth,, and of course my name)
And that's quite possible because different states have different standards.
| 780 |
lurking faith Mon, Jul 27, 2009 3:58:49pm |
re: #763 BlueRoses
I know. There are businesses closing where I live. Good businesses I will miss. But we shouldn't complain because 'The One' will lead us out of the wilderness and into liberal utopia. Where when I get up in the morning and crawl out of my cardboard box under the bridge I will be happy to know I have 'free heath care'. :)
Except that if you're not a "productive citizen," you go to the end of the rationing line.
| 781 |
Mad Prophet Ludwig Mon, Jul 27, 2009 3:58:51pm |
re: #759 Last Mohican
I have encountered an orthodox rabbi or two who objected to being touched by female doctors. I think they usually considered it okay if the doctor was wearing gloves, although they weren't especially pleased about it.
I have also heard of Muslim men who won't allow their wives to be treated by male doctors. Somewhere I read about a growing problem in France, in which Muslims men are murdering their wives' male gynecologists.
Well like I said, some are much more strict than others. The best possible spin is that they are so very used to never touching women but their wives that having a female doctor examine them is frankly uncomfortable. On the other hand, unfortunately, we have our sexists too. Those rabbis would have no problem with allowing a male doctor to examine a female for medical reasons.
Either way, it would be permissible for a doctor to examine them.
| 783 |
unrealizedviewpoint Mon, Jul 27, 2009 3:59:11pm |
re: #769 buzzsawmonkey
The police serve the community by protecting it, which involves suppressing illegal activity within it. That suppression is not looked on with favor by those who engage in illegal activity, and it requires the police to be viewed with respect and, to some degree, fear.
Removing an element of respect by making the police visually subservient is not the way to get the police to serve the community effectively.
Uniforms go a long way in gaining the needed respect, err... fear. Big guns and tasers work too.
| 784 |
sattv4u2 Mon, Jul 27, 2009 3:59:19pm |
re: #762 unrealizedviewpoint
Never really understood the birth certificate significance. Seems to me I could make one up in minutes on my PC. Yet, one needs one to get a license, passport... makes no sense.
Unless you can "make" up an official raised city seal on your PC ,,, nuh uh!
| 785 |
Kragar Mon, Jul 27, 2009 3:59:29pm |
re: #773 Russkilitlover
Could our foreign policy BE anymore inept?
Biden is the crazy uncle character on a sitcom, who shows up, misunderstands the situation, messes up and is clueless the whole time.
| 786 |
BlueRoses Mon, Jul 27, 2009 4:00:16pm |
| 787 |
Fat Bastard Vegetarian Mon, Jul 27, 2009 4:00:18pm |
re: #772 midwestgak
You're one of my favorite lizards who I am responding to with this post.
| 789 |
debutaunt Mon, Jul 27, 2009 4:00:58pm |
re: #771 sattv4u2
and as stated, there is but one "form" of cirtificate in Everett Mass. I have seen the original. I have two identical copies of it complete with the raised seal.
It has all the pertinent info (moms/dads names,,, time/date/ place of birth,, and of course my name)
How did they know about sat tv at that time?
| 790 |
Kragar Mon, Jul 27, 2009 4:01:45pm |
| 791 |
Last Mohican Mon, Jul 27, 2009 4:01:59pm |
re: #767 unrealizedviewpoint
How do they feel about prostate exams?
Less than enthusiastic. Like everyone else. I don't know if they were any more upset about it when the examiner was female, though, because I'm male, so I wasn't there.
That brings up another interesting point though. A male doctor performing a pelvic exam on a female patient, even a gynecologist who does it all day long, is required to have a female nurse or other female staff member present. However, a female doctor who's doing a prostate exam, scrotal exam, or any kind of exam on a male patient is not required to have any sort of chaperone present.
| 792 |
unrealizedviewpoint Mon, Jul 27, 2009 4:02:04pm |
re: #784 sattv4u2
Unless you can "make" up an official raised city seal on your PC ,,, nuh uh!
I'll order a seal on the interweb.
| 793 |
SasquatchOnSteroids Mon, Jul 27, 2009 4:02:59pm |
I have my original Nirth certificate.
I even signed it with my piggies.
It's in a safe deposit box, along with some other valuables.
| 794 |
debutaunt Mon, Jul 27, 2009 4:03:19pm |
re: #784 sattv4u2
Unless you can "make" up an official raised city seal on your PC ,,, nuh uh!
Microsoft embosser software.
| 795 |
Randall Gross Mon, Jul 27, 2009 4:03:42pm |
re: #769 buzzsawmonkey
The police serve the community by protecting it, which involves suppressing illegal activity within it. That suppression is not looked on with favor by those who engage in illegal activity, and it requires the police to be viewed with respect and, to some degree, fear.
Removing an element of respect by making the police visually subservient is not the way to get the police to serve the community effectively.
"People respect the badge, if they don't they always respect the gun..."
DeNiro or Pacino from a movie.
Seriously however.
The average community member should not fear the police, and as long as the badge, the uniform, and the gun is there then a scarf is not going to diminish a criminal's respect.
| 796 |
rightymouse Mon, Jul 27, 2009 4:03:47pm |
re: #770 Sharmuta
It's important the BC is certified or it's worthless.
Exactly.
In the absence of a certified BC, other documents may be used, though.
I know that my Passport is ok to use only because my official birth record is in Thai (from the local police dept.) and my registration of birth from the U.S. Embassy is a copy, not the original - never had a problem with using the Passport.
| 797 |
callahan23 Mon, Jul 27, 2009 4:04:24pm |
re: #794 debutaunt
Microsoft embosser software.
Particularly important to people with an ego problem. ;-)
| 798 |
lurking faith Mon, Jul 27, 2009 4:04:32pm |
re: #786 BlueRoses
Gotta admit I am a bit long in the tooth. Soluent green for me I guess.
I was thinking we'd all be unemployed, but you can take your pick.
How does the 0ne's team declare you surplus population? Let me count the ways...
| 799 |
Ayeless in Ghazi Mon, Jul 27, 2009 4:04:40pm |
re: #746 buzzsawmonkey
Nobody has yet explained why the police have to take the community as it comes, but the community is not expected to take the police as they come.
The whole point of the police is that you have to take them as they come. Or are the police now going to start observing the quaint cultural taboos of the Chav Community?
Because it might help us get results. This is a pragmatic approach, not a pee cee one as it has been painted. We don't want to alienate more muslims than necessary, in contrast we want them to be more at ease talking to the police, to help us to isolate and catch terrorists and their cheerleaders/mentors.
PS The only taboo the 'chav community' has is good dress sense.
| 800 |
Last Mohican Mon, Jul 27, 2009 4:05:15pm |
My conclusion from our little poll is that a surprising number of us actually do have our original birth certificates. But many don't. And I'd like to think that those people could still get a passport, or run for president, without causing people to freak out, create angry billboard advertisements, and start spontaneously reciting the pledge of allegiance at a politician's town meeting.
| 801 |
lurking faith Mon, Jul 27, 2009 4:05:57pm |
re: #792 unrealizedviewpoint
I'll order a seal on the interweb.
But I thought seals eated birth certificates.
| 802 |
Render Mon, Jul 27, 2009 4:06:14pm |
re: #755 Thanos
Better answer: Because the police are members of the community, they live here. They don't operate in a vacuum.
"Good cop" method always gets better results then "bad cop" method, but they are still a two part team.
If in attempting to report a crime I run into one of Zombies "bad cop method all the time" officers, I'm likely to be lot less then helpful to him.
MEAN
PEOPLE
SUCK,
R
| 803 |
BlackFedora Mon, Jul 27, 2009 4:07:10pm |
New lizard here. Its great to be here. :)
This birther religion really needs to go the way of the dodo bird.
| 804 |
Mostly sane, most of the time. Mon, Jul 27, 2009 4:07:32pm |
re: #800 Last Mohican
My conclusion from our little poll is that a surprising number of us actually do have our original birth certificates. But many don't. And I'd like to think that those people could still get a passport, or run for president, without causing people to freak out, create angry billboard advertisements, and start spontaneously reciting the pledge of allegiance at a politician's town meeting.
Does it count if your original is glued into your baby book? I honestly had to take the book with me to get my license. Thanks, Mom.
| 806 |
Fat Bastard Vegetarian Mon, Jul 27, 2009 4:08:11pm |
Ten mother fucking percent surtax on plastic surgery.
These people are the worst human beings on earth. The very worst people on earth.
| 808 |
debutaunt Mon, Jul 27, 2009 4:08:27pm |
re: #801 lurking faith
But I thought seals eated birth certificates.
It might have taken an elephant seal to swallow the whole thing.
| 809 |
DEZes Mon, Jul 27, 2009 4:08:47pm |
re: #803 BlackFedora
New lizard here. Its great to be here. :)
This birther religion really needs to go the way of the dodo bird.
Welcome to the jungle.
And watch some of the older Lizards, they eat hatchlings. ;)
| 811 |
legalpad Mon, Jul 27, 2009 4:09:02pm |
re: #795 Thanos
"People respect the badge, if they don't they always respect the gun..."
Oddly enough, that's not always true.
| 812 |
albusteve Mon, Jul 27, 2009 4:09:20pm |
re: #806 Fat Bastard Vegetarian
Ten mother fucking percent surtax on plastic surgery.
These people are the worst human beings on earth. The very worst people on earth.
that type of rhetoric will not help reach across for compromise...squabbler
| 813 |
Last Mohican Mon, Jul 27, 2009 4:09:58pm |
re: #804 emmmieG
Does it count if your original is glued into your baby book? I honestly had to take the book with me to get my license. Thanks, Mom.
Did everyone at the DMV say "aw" when they looked at your baby pictures and everything? Or had their souls been sucked out of them as a result of working at the DMV?
| 815 |
Fat Bastard Vegetarian Mon, Jul 27, 2009 4:10:06pm |
re: #812 albusteve
that type of rhetoric will not help reach across for compromise...squabbler
Why not. They're not even give me a reach "around"...
Of course, who can...
| 816 |
SixDegrees Mon, Jul 27, 2009 4:10:52pm |
re: #806 Fat Bastard Vegetarian
Ten mother fucking percent surtax on plastic surgery.
These people are the worst human beings on earth. The very worst people on earth.
Any word yet on whether this will apply to woman who have had mastectomies and are seeking reconstructive surgery? Or burn victims? Or victims of other disfiguring accident or disease?
| 817 |
Mostly sane, most of the time. Mon, Jul 27, 2009 4:11:14pm |
re: #813 Last Mohican
Did everyone at the DMV say "aw" when they looked at your baby pictures and everything? Or had their souls been sucked out of them as a result of working at the DMV?
I don't remember. I was too busy being an embarrassed 16 year-old.
| 818 |
Fat Bastard Vegetarian Mon, Jul 27, 2009 4:11:16pm |
re: #816 SixDegrees
No. Elective and stuff...
| 819 |
Shug Mon, Jul 27, 2009 4:12:07pm |
re: #816 SixDegrees
Any word yet on whether this will apply to woman who have had mastectomies and are seeking reconstructive surgery? Or burn victims? Or victims of other disfiguring accident or disease?
Simple: Those won't even be covered
| 820 |
Fat Bastard Vegetarian Mon, Jul 27, 2009 4:12:23pm |
re: #816 SixDegrees
Any word yet on whether this will apply to woman who have had mastectomies and are seeking reconstructive surgery? Or burn victims? Or victims of other disfiguring accident or disease?
Stories on Drudge... big ole headline thingy.
| 821 |
DEZes Mon, Jul 27, 2009 4:12:38pm |
| 822 |
unrealizedviewpoint Mon, Jul 27, 2009 4:13:07pm |
re: #816 SixDegrees
Any word yet on whether this will apply to woman who have had mastectomies and are seeking reconstructive surgery? Or burn victims? Or victims of other disfiguring accident or disease?
Just read up top that NJ raised only 30 million with a 6% tax. What will that figure nationally? 300 million?
| 823 |
SasquatchOnSteroids Mon, Jul 27, 2009 4:13:39pm |
re: #806 Fat Bastard Vegetarian
Ten mother fucking percent surtax on plastic surgery.
These people are the worst human beings on earth. The very worst people on earth.
I'm sold on plastic.
That's all I'm sayin'
| 824 |
BlueRoses Mon, Jul 27, 2009 4:13:48pm |
re: #798 lurking faith
I was thinking we'd all be unemployed, but you can take your pick.
How does the 0ne's team declare you surplus population? Let me count the ways...
Gotta tell you I am a bit suspicious :)
| 825 |
SixDegrees Mon, Jul 27, 2009 4:14:00pm |
re: #818 Fat Bastard Vegetarian
No. Elective and stuff...
I'm pretty sure all such surgery is elective; none of it, or very little of it, is strictly medically necessary.
And given our current crop of representatives, I don't believe for a minute they're going to attempt to hamper boob enhancement.
| 826 |
Randall Gross Mon, Jul 27, 2009 4:14:30pm |
re: #810 buzzsawmonkey
Once again: a scarf is a weapon needlessly given to a malefactor. On those grounds alone it should be rejected, because police attire is chosen with the idea that it should provide the officer with as much protection and authority as possible while offering potential adversaries as little as possible.
The scarf diminishes authority and increases vulnerability. On two counts, therefore, it fails, on grounds which far outweigh any conceivable benefit which may attach to "community outreach."
A scarf doesn't diminish authority. It doesn't extend Islam either. People getting their panties in a twist over this need to go back to Ludwig's answer to my question about the Amish.
If we get overly worried about non essentials then eventually we become like the nirthers. We see a mullah under every bed when the real problem is not stealth jihad. The real problem is specific groups, clerics, and countries. Scarves don't bother me.
| 828 |
Randall Gross Mon, Jul 27, 2009 4:15:04pm |
re: #811 legalpad
Oddly enough, that's not always true.
Well there are those who choose "suicide by police officer".
| 829 |
J.S. Mon, Jul 27, 2009 4:15:25pm |
hmmm...I wonder if the British cops have to take off their shoes when they enter the mosque...(?)
| 830 |
Ayeless in Ghazi Mon, Jul 27, 2009 4:15:40pm |
re: #810 buzzsawmonkey
Once again: a scarf is a weapon needlessly given to a malefactor.
We are talking about community policing visits to mosques. You are saying that mosques are such seething hotbeds of unbound violent criminality that the risk of being strangled outweighs the benefits of greater trust and cooperation from the community?
| 831 |
horse Mon, Jul 27, 2009 4:15:48pm |
The systematic bubbling up of nirther activity in recent weeks appears to be a semi organized effort. By whom and for what ultimate purpose is uncertain. Even though the nirthers come across as crazy, that might be ok for the purposes of whoever may be behind the scenes pushing this dead story.
| 832 |
BlueRoses Mon, Jul 27, 2009 4:17:02pm |
re: #831 horse
The systematic bubbling up of nirther activity in recent weeks appears to be a semi organized effort. By whom and for what ultimate purpose is uncertain. Even though the nirthers come across as crazy, that might be ok for the purposes of whoever may be behind the scenes pushing this dead story.
How about for the purposes of making the GOP look more nutty than the Demos think they are already?
| 833 |
Ayeless in Ghazi Mon, Jul 27, 2009 4:17:53pm |
re: #830 Jimmah
Perhaps some sort of kevlar neck brace to be worn in conjunction with the scarf would be in order? ///
| 834 |
SixDegrees Mon, Jul 27, 2009 4:18:19pm |
re: #820 Fat Bastard Vegetarian
Stories on Drudge... big ole headline thingy.
So they're proposing a laundry list approach, penalizing particular procedures. Without regard for why they're being performed.
Just my view, but this doesn't strike me as a recipe for quality medical care.
It strikes me as putting an initial framework for rationing in place. It's always easy to add to the list.
| 835 |
jvic Mon, Jul 27, 2009 4:18:23pm |
In the abstract I can't see a problem with the police headscarf thing. At face value it is limited, innocuous and benign.
And yet...and yet...I am perplexed and troubled. By the time the policy is widespread (if that happens), will opposing it be a hate crime? I wish I could consult a wise person like the Archbishop of Canterbury.
| 836 |
Vicious Babushka Mon, Jul 27, 2009 4:19:00pm |
re: #678 BlueRoses
re: #672 buzzsawmonkey
Women NEVER wear kippot. Kippot are for men.
Well, there are kippot made for women, but Zionist Mall doesn't sell them.
| 837 |
callahan23 Mon, Jul 27, 2009 4:20:04pm |
Concerning the issue of the headscarf for the police officers in the UK I am all on Pat Condell: Apologists for evil
| 838 |
lurking faith Mon, Jul 27, 2009 4:20:32pm |
re: #824 BlueRoses
I'm thinking about looking for a job with a cardboard box factory. If we're all broke and homeless, demand is gonna skyrocket.
/
| 839 |
Killgore Trout Mon, Jul 27, 2009 4:21:05pm |
Here's a weird one...
The renegade MI5 officer who blew the whistle on his former colleagues is now living in a squat, dressing as a woman, and railing against the 'Zionist empire'.
I assume that's him in the black dress.
| 840 |
SixDegrees Mon, Jul 27, 2009 4:21:24pm |
re: #832 BlueRoses
How about for the purposes of making the GOP look more nutty than the Demos think they are already?
If I were George Soros, I would be actively encouraging the nirthers and funneling gobs of money to them. The opposition can never have too many goofballs, the louder the better.
| 841 |
BARACK THE VOTE Mon, Jul 27, 2009 4:22:04pm |
re: #830 Jimmah
We are talking about community policing visits to mosques. You are saying that mosques are such seething hotbeds of unbound violent criminality that the risk of being strangled outweighs the benefits of greater trust and cooperation from the community?
Jimmah--
That comment is a thing of beauty and a joy forever. :)
| 843 |
Mich-again Mon, Jul 27, 2009 4:22:46pm |
Here's a solution. No veil when they are visiting the Mosque investigating a crime or pursuing a criminal. But if its a bake sale with the community outreach police women, then fine. They should wear the little costume. I wonder if they dare put the Crest of Avon and Somerset Constabulary on the police issue veils. Or would that be too ethnocentric?
| 844 |
Randall Gross Mon, Jul 27, 2009 4:23:31pm |
re: #839 Killgore Trout
Blew out the apache server, too many incoming requests :)
| 845 |
Last Mohican Mon, Jul 27, 2009 4:23:57pm |
re: #830 Jimmah
We are talking about community policing visits to mosques.
Again, I'm not sure that's clear. The eight "community support officers" are presumably going be doing only friendly visits, but probably not the other seven.
I don't think it's clear exactly how they're going to play this. Maybe, if a woman calls for help from within the mosque, the dispatcher will direct the male officers and the non-covered female officers to handle traffic inside, and only allow suitably covered-up police women inside. I don't know.
Personally, I think it's great that police women would wear scarves while making friendly visits, but wrong to require that they do so while on patrol, investigating crimes, etc.
| 846 |
Killgore Trout Mon, Jul 27, 2009 4:24:05pm |
re: #837 callahan23
That's definitely an epic rant, one of his best. However, I don't think an all out ban is the right thing to do. Shop keepers should have the right to refuse service, they probably shouldn't be allowed in banks or any other area that involves security but if someone walks to walk a round in a burka they should be allowed to do it.
| 847 |
Shug Mon, Jul 27, 2009 4:24:07pm |
re: #839 Killgore Trout
Here's a weird one...
The renegade MI5 officer who blew the whistle on his former colleagues is now living in a squat, dressing as a woman, and railing against the 'Zionist empire'.
I assume that's him in the black dress.
Their Server : We eated it
| 848 |
lobo91 Mon, Jul 27, 2009 4:24:14pm |
re: #795 Thanos
"People respect the badge, if they don't they always respect the gun..."
DeNiro or Pacino from a movie.
Seriously however.
The average community member should not fear the police, and as long as the badge, the uniform, and the gun is there then a scarf is not going to diminish a criminal's respect.
Of course, we're talking about British cops, so most of them don't carry guns.
Two out of three, I guess...
| 849 |
zombie Mon, Jul 27, 2009 4:24:29pm |
re: #837 callahan23
Concerning the issue of the headscarf for the police officers in the UK I am all on Pat Condell: Apologists for evil
[Video]
Muy Excelente!
Best Condell rant in a long time. Everybody: Watch it!
| 850 |
SasquatchOnSteroids Mon, Jul 27, 2009 4:24:39pm |
I really doubt the ability of a Muslim male, taught in the women are lesser religion, to "respect" a female police officer who wears a veil while doing community outreach, investigations, etc.
YOU INFIDEL WHORE !
Oh, you're wearing a headscarf ? Ok, its cool now, guys.
| 851 |
Randall Gross Mon, Jul 27, 2009 4:25:03pm |
re: #848 lobo91
Of course, we're talking about British cops, so most of them don't carry guns.
Two out of three, I guess...
then they respect the billy.
| 853 |
Ayeless in Ghazi Mon, Jul 27, 2009 4:26:35pm |
re: #841 iceweasel
Jimmah--
That comment is a thing of beauty and a joy forever. :)
Thank you i-Dub:) A tune for you -
| 854 |
Last Mohican Mon, Jul 27, 2009 4:26:45pm |
re: #843 Mich-again
I wonder if they dare put the Crest of Avon and Somerset Constabulary on the police issue veils.
The article did say that the scarves have the police insignia on them.
Now that you post a picture, I see that the insignia has a dragon on it. And paintings or drawings of animals or people are forbidden by Islamic law. Do you think they'll be forced to remove the insignia?
| 855 |
ShanghaiEd Mon, Jul 27, 2009 4:26:47pm |
re: #834 SixDegrees
So they're proposing a laundry list approach, penalizing particular procedures. Without regard for why they're being performed.
Just my view, but this doesn't strike me as a recipe for quality medical care.
It strikes me as putting an initial framework for rationing in place. It's always easy to add to the list.
Six: I've always been bothered by the term "rationing" in the health care debate, just as I'm bothered by hearing that "government bureaucrats" will decide whether certain services are covered by insurance or not.
Those words were carefully chosen, from expensive focus groups, to drive the debate in the way that the lobbyists wanted it to go. They're "hot-button" terms that don't mean anything.
Health care is "rationed" now, as in everybody who needs it doesn't get it. And "corporate bureaucrats" decide which services are covered by insurance and which are not. Right? I mean, I don't get a warm and fuzzy vibe from talking with the folks at Blue Cross, do you?
| 856 |
Killgore Trout Mon, Jul 27, 2009 4:26:54pm |
re: #844 Thanos
Heh. I still have it open so I'll post some excerpts...
Recently, this jewel of the Surrey stockbroker belt has added a more unconventional element to its list of attractions – a 6ft transvestite squatter called Delores Kane who believes he is the Messiah and happens to be Britain's best-known renegade former spy.A short distance from the home of the novelist E M Forster, David Shayler and his miniskirt-clad alter ego have taken up residence in a 17th-century National Trust farmhouse after a decade of spiritual contemplation which has led the one-time MI5 officer to the conclusion that he is the reincarnation of Jesus Christ and that all of humanity's ills can be cured by a four-year programme of hemp cultivation.
For the man who came to public attention in spectacular fashion 12 years ago by lifting the lid on a catalogue of dark deeds allegedly carried out in the name of Queen and Country by the intelligence services, it is a reinvention every bit as dramatic as his claims that MI6 funded Islamist fighters to assassinate Libya's Colonel Gaddafi and that MI5 failed to keep track of an IRA bombing cell – revelations that ultimately forced him into exile and earned him two spells in prison.
But as he came to the door of the salubrious squat close to Guildford dressed as Delores in a blonde wig, sheer black tights, a leopard skin skirt and a cropped top with prosthetic breasts, before explaining that the world as it is known will end of 23 December 2012, it is perhaps clear why some of his former friends are concerned that he has suffered some form of mental collapse.
Sat on a floor cushion in a fug of joss stick smoke in the sitting room of Hackhurst Farm, a 400-year-old rural idyll at the end of a country lane which he has occupied since last month with a group of eco-campaigners, the 43-year-old former spy outlined his journey from an atheist in charge of MI5's Libya desk to the stiletto-heeled messianic proclaimer of a crusade to dismantle a "Zionist empire", whose control is apparently exerted over the planet by nefarious means from vaccines to mortgages.
| 858 |
Sharmuta Mon, Jul 27, 2009 4:28:24pm |
I guess I'll ask again since no one answered:
Do we want muslims in the UK to police themselves and turn in potential killers to the police or not?
How do we foster trust between muslims and law enforcement?
| 859 |
Render Mon, Jul 27, 2009 4:29:37pm |
I'm positive beyond any shadow of a doubt that current events in Afghanistan are a far more pressing, urgent, and decisive issue then scarves, plastic boob taxes, or Obama the Unready's reverse racist friends (Gates) and birth certificate.
I know what will remain in the history books long after the petty squabbles are forgotten, erased from memory by the sands of time. Who won the war?
===
Are the nirthers really wanting Biden or Pelosi instead of the great Unready Zero?
ACME
TOWING,
R
| 860 |
Lincolntf Mon, Jul 27, 2009 4:29:45pm |
re: #856 Killgore Trout
"...and that all of humanity's ills can be cured by a four-year programme of hemp cultivation..."
Finally, someone who gets it...
| 862 |
DEZes Mon, Jul 27, 2009 4:30:39pm |
| 863 |
Killgore Trout Mon, Jul 27, 2009 4:31:04pm |
re: #856 Killgore Trout
More...
He is also complimentary about David Icke, the former BBC sports presenter who has gone before him in revealing himself as Jesus's reincarnation before suggesting the world is controlled by shape-shifting lizards. Mr Shayler said: "David has done some enormously important work. I see him as the John the Baptist to my Christ. I have spoken to him on the phone and suggested we meet."
Heh.
| 864 |
callahan23 Mon, Jul 27, 2009 4:31:22pm |
re: #846 Killgore Trout
That's definitely an epic rant, one of his best. However, I don't think an all out ban is the right thing to do. Shop keepers should have the right to refuse service, they probably shouldn't be allowed in banks or any other area that involves security but if someone walks to walk a round in a burka they should be allowed to do it.
'twas his video before that where he says: 'ban the burka'.
I am with him on feeling disgusted at this ugly 'mobile tarpaulin' that is a utter, complete denigration of women. Incredibly misogynistic.
On the other hand I am with you on not needing to ban it or even worse to outlaw it.
I just look down on such practices and their practitioners. That's all.
| 865 |
Mich-again Mon, Jul 27, 2009 4:31:54pm |
re: #854 Last Mohican
The article did say that the scarves have the police insignia on them.
Now that you post a picture, I see that the insignia has a dragon on it. And paintings or drawings of animals or people are forbidden by Islamic law. Do you think they'll be forced to remove the insignia?
Actually I think the article stopped short of saying the insignia would be on the scarves. Only the name Avon and Somerset.
And by the way Avon and Somerset Constabulary has a website where they posted several examples of inappropriate 999 calls they have received. Worth a few yucks, especially the chap who complains to the the operator that his wife left him nothing to eat but a leftover fish sandwich.
| 866 |
ShanghaiEd Mon, Jul 27, 2009 4:31:57pm |
re: #858 Sharmuta
I guess I'll ask again since no one answered:
Do we want muslims in the UK to police themselves and turn in potential killers to the police or not?
How do we foster trust between muslims and law enforcement?
None of this wishy-washy pandering and socialist warm-and-fuzzies, Sharm! We need big, mean cops who'll be tough-minded, tough-talking, and scare the crap out of every Muslim they encounter. Because that's the only way to get results: fear. Right? It's worked great, so far.
///
| 867 |
Shug Mon, Jul 27, 2009 4:32:01pm |
re: #858 Sharmuta
How do we foster trust between muslims and law enforcement?
Muslim male only cops allowed in the mosques.
| 868 |
Randall Gross Mon, Jul 27, 2009 4:32:24pm |
re: #852 buzzsawmonkey
Bleh. There are much worse things to worry about than scarves, I will focus on them for now. You can maybe hook up with VB who are encouraging their members to rat out schoolgirls wearing scarves. There are real fights going on, choosing that one is just plain stupid.
| 869 |
ryannon Mon, Jul 27, 2009 4:32:26pm |
re: #111 Cato the Elder
Sleepers, awaken!
The night has gone and taken
Your darkest fears and left you here.
And the sun it shines so clear.
Awake, for the world looks wonderful.For XLVIII Cato Points, name that band!
The Incredible String Band.
Haven't thought about them in a looong time.
I once interviewed them for a music magazine article.
We all sat around using the word 'incredible!' about everything. It was as if we were stoneed, but we hadn't smoked at thing.
The interview never appeared: there wasn't much to publish except a bunch of disjointed ideas and dozens of 'incredible!'
| 870 |
Killgore Trout Mon, Jul 27, 2009 4:32:27pm |
re: #858 Sharmuta
I guess I'll ask again since no one answered:
Do we want muslims in the UK to police themselves and turn in potential killers to the police or not?
How do we foster trust between muslims and law enforcement?
I don't think sharia compliant dress code for women will do anything top help community relations one way or the other.
| 871 |
legalpad Mon, Jul 27, 2009 4:32:38pm |
re: #828 Thanos
Well there are those who choose "suicide by police officer".
I had a bum come up and threaten me and my son while I was stuck in a Jack-in-the-Box drive-thru. He dives in his bulging pocket for something and I level the 9 on him. He pulls out some cracker-jax pocket knife out of his pocket. While the gun is on him he yells, "So, you're gonna pull a gun on me? Go ahead and shoot!" I roll my eyes, put the 9 on the console and call the cops. When he sees that I'm calling the cops, he walks away, yelling at me. The cops got him, I IDed him, that was it. The cop explained it: "Some people are just crazy."
| 872 |
Ayeless in Ghazi Mon, Jul 27, 2009 4:32:47pm |
re: #845 Last Mohican
Whether every one of them is on community policing or not, it's clear from they article they are only to be worn by police on entering a mosque. I am faitly sure that in an emergency situation, the police would not let this be an issue that got in the way of their work.
| 873 |
Lincolntf Mon, Jul 27, 2009 4:32:53pm |
re: #863 Killgore Trout
"...before suggesting the world is controlled by shape-shifting lizards..."
It's this kind of honesty that's missing from American politics.
| 874 |
horse Mon, Jul 27, 2009 4:33:33pm |
re: #832 BlueRoses
How about for the purposes of making the GOP look more nutty than the Demos think they are already?
Maybe something like that. If it looks like a reemerging issue, they might get a potential leader in the 2012 GOP field to bite on the idea, and then reel them and drop them in the bucket of political stupidity. There might be at least a couple in the GOP field that would fall for that trick. Maybe the same ones pushing ID?
| 875 |
Noam Sayin' Mon, Jul 27, 2009 4:33:39pm |
Long thread. Did Buzzsawmonkey do a work-up on Manic Monday somewhere?
| 876 |
formercorpsman Mon, Jul 27, 2009 4:34:06pm |
re: #826 Thanos
I will admit upfront, I am on the way out the door right now, and just skimming through this thread before going home.
From little I read of it, you don't see that article as a problem?
| 877 |
CyanSnowHawk Mon, Jul 27, 2009 4:34:16pm |
re: #863 Killgore Trout
More...
Heh.
So, kind of a Chameleon squared then. We could shorten it to c2. Maybe play around with the speed of light connection in the slogan.
| 878 |
Sharmuta Mon, Jul 27, 2009 4:34:17pm |
re: #861 buzzsawmonkey
Neither of those really answer my questions. The first was a yes or no.
The police will probably have to rely on informants, as it does when dealing with any criminal community.
Are you calling the entire muslim community in the UK criminal?
| 879 |
BARACK THE VOTE Mon, Jul 27, 2009 4:34:22pm |
re: #858 Sharmuta
I guess I'll ask again since no one answered:
Do we want muslims in the UK to police themselves and turn in potential killers to the police or not?
How do we foster trust between muslims and law enforcement?
Obviously by booting the door of a mosque in whilst gnawing a pork chop and bawling, "Oi!"
All interviews are to be conducted in a pub. Anything less is submission.
| 880 |
unrealizedviewpoint Mon, Jul 27, 2009 4:34:38pm |
re: #850 SasquatchOnSteroids
I really doubt the ability of a Muslim male, taught in the women are lesser religion, to "respect" a female police officer who wears a veil while doing community outreach, investigations, etc.
YOU INFIDEL WHORE !
Oh, you're wearing a headscarf ? Ok, its cool now, guys.
I suspect the Muslim male may respect the infidel woman more without the scarf. Wearing the scarf IMO sends the signal surrender.
| 881 |
Pianobuff Mon, Jul 27, 2009 4:34:46pm |
re: #855 ShanghaiEd
Six: I've always been bothered by the term "rationing" in the health care debate, just as I'm bothered by hearing that "government bureaucrats" will decide whether certain services are covered by insurance or not.
Those words were carefully chosen, from expensive focus groups, to drive the debate in the way that the lobbyists wanted it to go. They're "hot-button" terms that don't mean anything.
Health care is "rationed" now, as in everybody who needs it doesn't get it. And "corporate bureaucrats" decide which services are covered by insurance and which are not. Right? I mean, I don't get a warm and fuzzy vibe from talking with the folks at Blue Cross, do you?
There are much cheaper alternatives to deal with the uninsured who truly can't afford healthcare insurance than the legislation being formulated if that truly is the intent of the legislation.
| 882 |
Killgore Trout Mon, Jul 27, 2009 4:34:54pm |
re: #873 Lincolntf
He's crazier than a shit house rat. I'm surprised he ever passed the psychiatric screening to get into MI5.
| 883 |
albusteve Mon, Jul 27, 2009 4:35:53pm |
re: #875 Noam Sayin'
Long thread. Did Buzzsawmonkey do a work-up on Manic Monday somewhere?
they won't let me roger it...
pink
black
yellow
blue...
| 884 |
tradewind Mon, Jul 27, 2009 4:36:30pm |
Arafish, Carter, and Gore (Oh my)... you're thinking ' it can't get any less prestigious '?
Oh wait...
[Link: news.sky.com...]
| 885 |
Randall Gross Mon, Jul 27, 2009 4:36:34pm |
re: #871 legalpad
You are much nicer than I am considering he was holding a knife.
| 886 |
BlueRoses Mon, Jul 27, 2009 4:36:50pm |
re: #881 Pianobuff
There are much cheaper alternatives to deal with the uninsured who truly can't afford healthcare insurance than the legislation being formulated if that truly is the intent of the legislation.
You got that right. Why turn those of us who are happy upside down to take care of the 15% who don't have permanent health care?
| 888 |
callahan23 Mon, Jul 27, 2009 4:37:24pm |
re: #868 Thanos
Bleh. There are much worse things to worry about than scarves, I will focus on them for now. You can maybe hook up with VB who are encouraging their members to rat out schoolgirls wearing scarves. There are real fights going on, choosing that one is just plain stupid.
That was completely out of line. And it doesn't diminish its cut by putting the word 'maybe' in the middle.
An apology should be warranted. IMO
| 889 |
rightymouse Mon, Jul 27, 2009 4:37:37pm |
re: #858 Sharmuta
I guess I'll ask again since no one answered:
Do we want muslims in the UK to police themselves and turn in potential killers to the police or not?
How do we foster trust between muslims and law enforcement?
I expect any immigrant from any country to assimilate and understand/respect the laws, just as we should expect our citizens to behave accordingly. Religion should not be an exception. Yes, I understand that we have communities like the Amish, but they are law-abiding citizens and certainly don't expect female cops to dress like them in order to barter for cooperation.
| 890 |
philip Mon, Jul 27, 2009 4:37:38pm |
Haha. GOP is so scared of its base right now. Who could blame them?
| 891 |
ArmyWife Mon, Jul 27, 2009 4:38:22pm |
Good evening, honcos! Les Kinsolving really takes his job as a "correspondent" seriously. I'm surprised about the birther thing, honestly, as well as the fact that he has a column at the Kook Network Association dba WND. He is actually trends liberal. He is about 800 years old now, I think, so maybe dementia has set in.
Y'all have probably moved on by now, so I will too!
| 892 |
doppelganglander Mon, Jul 27, 2009 4:38:29pm |
re: #856 Killgore Trout
I was just reading that! How about this gem:
He is also complimentary about David Icke, the former BBC sports presenter who has gone before him in revealing himself as Jesus's reincarnation before suggesting the world is controlled by shape-shifting lizards. Mr Shayler said: "David has done some enormously important work. I see him as the John the Baptist to my Christ. I have spoken to him on the phone and suggested we meet."
| 893 |
Randall Gross Mon, Jul 27, 2009 4:38:41pm |
re: #876 formercorpsman
I will admit upfront, I am on the way out the door right now, and just skimming through this thread before going home.
From little I read of it, you don't see that article as a problem?
Well it's the continual debate over what westerners should be offended by, what's a dhimmi, who's a dhimmi, there's a dhimmi... I'm sick of it because it's a large distraction from the real fight.
| 894 |
Ayeless in Ghazi Mon, Jul 27, 2009 4:39:00pm |
re: #879 iceweasel
Obviously by booting the door of a mosque in whilst gnawing a pork chop and bawling, "Oi!"
All interviews are to be conducted in a pub. Anything less is submission.
ROLF!
| 895 |
albusteve Mon, Jul 27, 2009 4:39:14pm |
| 896 |
J.S. Mon, Jul 27, 2009 4:39:30pm |
LOL...Sooo, we're going from "I don't think female British police should be required to wear a hijab when going inside a mosque"; to screaming: "WHY DO YOU THINK ALL MUSLIMS ARE CRIMINALS!? and no doubt hyperventilating...wow...how does one get from A to B...lol...
| 897 |
VegasRick Mon, Jul 27, 2009 4:39:51pm |
re: #870 Killgore Trout
I don't think sharia compliant dress code for women will do anything top help community relations one way or the other.
Hate...to...agree... bit... you...are...correct.
*whew
| 898 |
lobo91 Mon, Jul 27, 2009 4:40:01pm |
re: #886 BlueRoses
You got that right. Why turn those of us who are happy upside down to take care of the 15% who don't have permanent health care?
Especially since 1/3 of that 15% are illegal aliens.
| 899 |
BlueRoses Mon, Jul 27, 2009 4:41:11pm |
re: #889 rightymouse
re: #889 rightymouse
I expect any immigrant from any country to assimilate and understand/respect the laws, just as we should expect our citizens to behave accordingly. Religion should not be an exception. Yes, I understand that we have communities like the Amish, but they are law-abiding citizens and certainly don't expect female cops to dress like them in order to barter for cooperation.
The government in the UK is so pc it wouldn't occur to them to encorage the type of integration we are used to here in the states. The situation is radicalizing many Brits I am afraid.
| 900 |
Killgore Trout Mon, Jul 27, 2009 4:41:22pm |
Uk Healthcare workers find sanitation at odds with sharia...
Muslims refuse to use alcohol-based hand gels over religious beliefs
Some Muslims have refused to use alcohol-based hand gels to combat the spread of swine flu because they claim it is against their religion.Some of those employed by St Albans Council in Hertfordshire have complained about the antibacterial lotion, which is considered a key strategy in containing the virus.
Officials were concerned because the Koran bans Muslims from consuming alcohol, so council chiefs issued them with non-alcohol hand gels, which studies have shown to be less effective in killing bugs.
| 901 |
BlueRoses Mon, Jul 27, 2009 4:41:41pm |
| 902 |
legalpad Mon, Jul 27, 2009 4:41:48pm |
re: #885 Thanos
You are much nicer than I am considering he was holding a knife.
If he had been by my son's window that would have been it. On my side I would have just broken his arm had he not walked away. Lower lawyer fees.
| 903 |
Sharmuta Mon, Jul 27, 2009 4:42:08pm |
re: #887 buzzsawmonkey
No more than you were by referring to "potential killers" in that community. Were you referring to the Muslim community of the UK as a community of potential killers?
I most certainly didn't demonize the entire community like you did. I asked if they should police themselves and turn in potential killers. That's hardly the broad brush you used.
| 904 |
Killgore Trout Mon, Jul 27, 2009 4:42:14pm |
re: #892 doppelganglander
It's a wacky article. I can't remember ever hearing of the guy before but I guess he's quite famous.
| 905 |
albusteve Mon, Jul 27, 2009 4:42:21pm |
pink
black
yellow
blue
green
brown...
| 906 |
ShanghaiEd Mon, Jul 27, 2009 4:42:36pm |
re: #881 Pianobuff
There are much cheaper alternatives to deal with the uninsured who truly can't afford healthcare insurance than the legislation being formulated if that truly is the intent of the legislation.
I'm not enamored of the current legislation, myself. I'm just saying that the language being used to argue it in the public sphere is dishonest and misleading.
What is a cheaper alternative that you feel would be effective?
| 907 |
Pianobuff Mon, Jul 27, 2009 4:42:47pm |
re: #886 BlueRoses
You got that right. Why turn those of us who are happy upside down to take care of the 15% who don't have permanent health care?
That's the game though. One needs only to examine some of Ezekiel Emanuel's positions to understand that what is being sought is a one-size-fits-all approach to healthcare. A google of his name along with the term "comparative effectiveness" yields interesting results.
| 909 |
ArmyWife Mon, Jul 27, 2009 4:43:01pm |
re: #900 Killgore Trout
Didn't that happen here? And an Imam called those who wouldn't use the hand sanitizers twits because it wasn't drinking alcohol involved? Ok, maybe not twits, but that was the gist.
| 910 |
SasquatchOnSteroids Mon, Jul 27, 2009 4:43:05pm |
re: #879 iceweasel
Obviously by booting the door of a mosque in whilst gnawing a pork chop and bawling, "Oi!"
All interviews are to be conducted in a pub. Anything less is submission.
Yes, it's all or none, huh.
| 911 |
BlueRoses Mon, Jul 27, 2009 4:43:23pm |
re: #905 albusteve
pink
black
yellow
blue
green
brown...[Video]
Ok I give up whose flag are these colors on? :/
| 912 |
formercorpsman Mon, Jul 27, 2009 4:43:33pm |
re: #893 Thanos
I understand where you are coming from, and some of that is true.
I'm just curious, do we know of any other concessions for any other cultures the police must make?
Listen, I am for trying to work amicably with the public. But good lord, law enforcement is supposed to THE symbol of authority.
Something such as this provides nothing more than the subtle undertone of noncompliance of their stature as enforcers of the law among the population.
I'm sorry, I think it is wrong.
| 913 |
BARACK THE VOTE Mon, Jul 27, 2009 4:43:56pm |
re: #896 J.S.
LOL...Sooo, we're going from "I don't think female British police should be required to wear a hijab when going inside a mosque"; to screaming: "WHY DO YOU THINK ALL MUSLIMS ARE CRIMINALS!? and no doubt hyperventilating...wow...how does one get from A to B...lol...
How did we get from, "15 police women, assigned to community service, willl wear a headcarf on entering mosques", to OMG DHIMMITUDE NEVER SURRENDER!!! WOLVERINES!!11!
That's a better question. First causes and all.
| 914 |
Vicious Babushka Mon, Jul 27, 2009 4:44:42pm |
re: #791 Last Mohican
Less than enthusiastic. Like everyone else. I don't know if they were any more upset about it when the examiner was female, though, because I'm male, so I wasn't there.
That brings up another interesting point though. A male doctor performing a pelvic exam on a female patient, even a gynecologist who does it all day long, is required to have a female nurse or other female staff member present. However, a female doctor who's doing a prostate exam, scrotal exam, or any kind of exam on a male patient is not required to have any sort of chaperone present.
When I was having all my babies, I preferred to see a male ob/gyn, because all the female doctors of that time (in my experience) were rabid, frothing feminists, who were always eager to shove birth control up my (not throat, a different body part), even though I said I wanted a large family.
Now I prefer to see a female doctor.
| 915 |
BlueRoses Mon, Jul 27, 2009 4:44:49pm |
re: #913 iceweasel
How did we get from, "15 police women, assigned to community service, willl wear a headcarf on entering mosques", to OMG DHIMMITUDE NEVER SURRENDER!!! WOLVERINES!!11!
That's a better question. First causes and all.
I think it is stupid end of story.
| 916 |
formercorpsman Mon, Jul 27, 2009 4:44:59pm |
re: #903 Sharmuta
You are not saying the threshold for that scenario is as flimsy as a headscarf?
| 918 |
doppelganglander Mon, Jul 27, 2009 4:45:20pm |
re: #882 Killgore Trout
He's crazier than a shit house rat. I'm surprised he ever passed the psychiatric screening to get into MI5.
Did you see what the "experts" said?
Psychologists warned that the espousal of unusual beliefs should not be interpreted as proof of mental illness. Simon Gelsthorpe, a clinical psychologist based in Bradford, said: "A lot of research over the last decade has looked into the occurrence in the normal population of traits that society has traditionally seen as a mental illness. Hearing voices is way more common than we had thought, as is the holding of unusual beliefs. A lot of these so-called indicators of mental illness are in fact relatively common and part of normal life."
If that's not mental illness, I'm even more worried about the state of the world.
| 919 |
ArmyWife Mon, Jul 27, 2009 4:45:31pm |
re: #912 formercorpsman
A bigger question is what other community asks for such accommodation? That is a serious question, not meant to be snarky.
| 920 |
Sharmuta Mon, Jul 27, 2009 4:45:31pm |
re: #908 buzzsawmonkey
No- you've twice referred to mosques as "ghettos" and then said the UK police would have to use informants like with any other criminal community.
Nice rhetoric.
| 921 |
Pianobuff Mon, Jul 27, 2009 4:45:43pm |
re: #906 ShanghaiEd
I'm not enamored of the current legislation, myself. I'm just saying that the language being used to argue it in the public sphere is dishonest and misleading.
What is a cheaper alternative that you feel would be effective?
Deal with it as a one-off and simply set up a basic program to deal with the remainder of those who truly can't afford insurance. I believe there has already been some estimating in this area and the cost would be 40-60 Billion depending on whether illegal aliens would be included.
| 922 |
freetoken Mon, Jul 27, 2009 4:45:47pm |
re: #831 horse
The systematic bubbling up of nirther activity in recent weeks appears to be a semi organized effort. By whom and for what ultimate purpose is uncertain.
A: Who is Joseph Farah?
A: How can I, J. Farah, further line my pockets?
♫
I'll take "Wingnuts" for $800, Alex...
| 923 |
Randall Gross Mon, Jul 27, 2009 4:45:53pm |
re: #888 callahan23
That was completely out of line. And it doesn't diminish its cut by putting the word 'maybe' in the middle.
An apology should be warranted. IMO
I can point you to the articles where Rose Marie Morel and Filip DeWinter are encouraging their party members and their children to become the scarf gestapo just in case muslim schoolgirls wear scarves to school.
Buzz seems to be of like mind, more concerned about appearances and accommodations rather than the real deal. Also please note that Buzz is a big kid who can more than take care of himself, he doesn't need you asking for apologies for him.
| 924 |
SasquatchOnSteroids Mon, Jul 27, 2009 4:46:21pm |
TIMEOUT YOU BASTARDS !
i can't find my keys...
| 925 |
lobo91 Mon, Jul 27, 2009 4:46:51pm |
re: #889 rightymouse
I expect any immigrant from any country to assimilate and understand/respect the laws, just as we should expect our citizens to behave accordingly. Religion should not be an exception.
Of course, that's one of the big differences between the US and other countries.
You can come here from any other country, work hard, play by the rules, and others will just see you as an American.
The same is not true in most other countries. Immigrants stay in their own little enclaves, and even their children who are born in the host country don't consider themselves British (or French, or whatever).
| 926 |
zombie Mon, Jul 27, 2009 4:47:13pm |
re: #900 Killgore Trout
Uk Healthcare workers find sanitation at odds with sharia...
Muslims refuse to use alcohol-based hand gels over religious beliefs
Which is especially ironic considering that Muslim experimenters in the Middle Ages were the first people to successfully distill hard liquor and realize it was a distinct chemical substance -- hence why the very word "alcohol" is an Arabic word.
Now, they (literally) "won't touch the stuff."
| 927 |
Randall Gross Mon, Jul 27, 2009 4:47:32pm |
re: #912 formercorpsman
I understand where you are coming from, and some of that is true.
I'm just curious, do we know of any other concessions for any other cultures the police must make?
Listen, I am for trying to work amicably with the public. But good lord, law enforcement is supposed to THE symbol of authority.
Something such as this provides nothing more than the subtle undertone of noncompliance of their stature as enforcers of the law among the population.
I'm sorry, I think it is wrong.
They have their badge and their uniform, and their brethren. A scarf's not going to diminish that.
| 928 |
Salamantis Mon, Jul 27, 2009 4:47:45pm |
I'm with Buzz on this one. Make the police hijab optional rather than mandatory, and let the policewomen choose. Those who feel comfortable wearing it would be free to do so, and those who don't feel comfortable wearing it would be free not to.
In fact, I am in favor of this policy being applied to all Muslim women; in fact, to all women, period.
| 929 |
Shug Mon, Jul 27, 2009 4:47:48pm |
re: #900 Killgore Trout
Uk Healthcare workers find sanitation at odds with sharia...
Muslims refuse to use alcohol-based hand gels over religious beliefs
Are you saying all Muslims are Germy?
/
| 930 |
BlueRoses Mon, Jul 27, 2009 4:47:53pm |
re: #924 SasquatchOnSteroids
TIMEOUT YOU BASTARDS !
i can't find my keys...
Well! I never! Charles let's anybody on these boards doesn't he?! hehehe
| 931 |
ArmyWife Mon, Jul 27, 2009 4:48:59pm |
re: #924 SasquatchOnSteroids
Did you look in the front door?
| 932 |
DEZes Mon, Jul 27, 2009 4:49:06pm |
re: #924 SasquatchOnSteroids
TIMEOUT YOU BASTARDS !
i can't find my keys...
Sasquatches drive?
I gotta see this.
| 934 |
formercorpsman Mon, Jul 27, 2009 4:49:25pm |
re: #919 ArmyWife
I agree totally. Listen, it is one thing to respect community differences. But good lord, for the dearth of information we have gone through on this site for years now as it pertains to this subject, anyone in their right mind would know in that community it is a symbol of subjugation. Pure and simple.
It might soft under some circumstances, but some girls have been the victims of honor killings because of it.
Sorry, it has no place as part of the uniform requirement in a law enforcement position.
| 935 |
rightymouse Mon, Jul 27, 2009 4:49:45pm |
| 936 |
Altermite Mon, Jul 27, 2009 4:50:18pm |
re: #434 CynicalConservative
Is no more.
Judo, ju jitsu with a gi or anything else that incorporates jacket wrestling, will also teach you how to use your clothing.
| 937 |
Randall Gross Mon, Jul 27, 2009 4:50:18pm |
re: #908 buzzsawmonkey
No, that would be me, and you have my apology for the VB comment. Some of these Spencer driven "who's the dhimmi" discussions drive me to the last nth of patience however.
| 938 |
BARACK THE VOTE Mon, Jul 27, 2009 4:50:27pm |
| 940 |
CynicalConservative Mon, Jul 27, 2009 4:51:00pm |
re: #936 Altermite
Judo, ju jitsu with a gi or anything else that incorporates jacket wrestling, will also teach you how to use your clothing.
So true.
| 941 |
SasquatchOnSteroids Mon, Jul 27, 2009 4:51:04pm |
| 943 |
SixDegrees Mon, Jul 27, 2009 4:51:19pm |
re: #855 ShanghaiEd
Six: I've always been bothered by the term "rationing" in the health care debate, just as I'm bothered by hearing that "government bureaucrats" will decide whether certain services are covered by insurance or not.
Those words were carefully chosen, from expensive focus groups, to drive the debate in the way that the lobbyists wanted it to go. They're "hot-button" terms that don't mean anything.
Health care is "rationed" now, as in everybody who needs it doesn't get it. And "corporate bureaucrats" decide which services are covered by insurance and which are not. Right? I mean, I don't get a warm and fuzzy vibe from talking with the folks at Blue Cross, do you?
True to a point. But I'd suggest that the constraints placed on payments in the current system are at least subject to market forces, and are also subject to appeal by both doctors and patients. In the end, all parties involved have some input. Under the proposed government plans, the market is completely eliminated, and decisions are made by a central authority with little incentive to weigh patient concerns, or even provider's concerns - the decision on what services are provided becomes a political decision, removed from the marketplace.
And in this case we have a perfect example of where this will lead. Sure, it's easy - politically - to announce you'll be charging extra for hair transplants. Only rich, vain people get hair transplants, right? So they ought to pay a surcharge for them. The problem with such laundry lists of "approved" or "disapproved" procedures is it assumes patients don't really exist; someone who's been in a fire and had their scalp burned off has a very different perception of their need for a hair transplant. The failure to take patient needs and outcomes into account is unpleasant to contemplate. Yes, such things can also occur in the private sector. But the potential for remediation is much higher than it is in the public sector.
| 944 |
SasquatchOnSteroids Mon, Jul 27, 2009 4:51:44pm |
| 945 |
BlueRoses Mon, Jul 27, 2009 4:51:55pm |
re: #921 Pianobuff
Deal with it as a one-off and simply set up a basic program to deal with the remainder of those who truly can't afford insurance. I believe there has already been some estimating in this area and the cost would be 40-60 Billion depending on whether illegal aliens would be included.
Exactly and leave the rest of us alone.
Tort reform and internet medical records are a good idea. Letting insurance companies sell across state lines and allow small employers to join common insurance pools.
There done and dusted.
| 946 |
Digital Display Mon, Jul 27, 2009 4:52:02pm |
| 947 |
DEZes Mon, Jul 27, 2009 4:52:45pm |
re: #944 SasquatchOnSteroids
Go-karts, my friend, Go-karts.
I had the scene from Harry and the Hendersons flash though my mind. ;)
| 948 |
lobo91 Mon, Jul 27, 2009 4:52:50pm |
re: #920 Sharmuta
No- you've twice referred to mosques as "ghettos" and then said the UK police would have to use informants like with any other criminal community.
Nice rhetoric.
The mosque themselves aren't ghettos, but in many cases, the Muslim communities in the UK are just that, just as they are in France.
| 949 |
freetoken Mon, Jul 27, 2009 4:53:20pm |
Has everyone seen the video Keith put in the spin-offs, of Bachmann blocking the non-binding resolution, on the basis of there not being a quorum present?
| 950 |
VegasRick Mon, Jul 27, 2009 4:53:22pm |
re: #910 SasquatchOnSteroids
Yes, it's all or none, huh.
C'mon SOS, doncha think the police in Watts would get a lot more cooperation from the citizens if they would just start wearing do-rags?
/
| 951 |
SasquatchOnSteroids Mon, Jul 27, 2009 4:53:44pm |
re: #947 DEZes
I had the scene from Harry and the Hendersons flash though my mind. ;)
I had that until he pulled the old Ex-Lax in the iced tea thing.
| 952 |
albusteve Mon, Jul 27, 2009 4:54:03pm |
pink
black
yellow
blue
green
brown
white...
| 954 |
Randall Gross Mon, Jul 27, 2009 4:54:18pm |
re: #900 Killgore Trout
Uk Healthcare workers find sanitation at odds with sharia...
Muslims refuse to use alcohol-based hand gels over religious beliefs
From the article:
But Muslim leaders criticised the council’s decision to change the gel, pointing out that Islamic teachings allow Muslims to use alcohol for medicinal purposes.
The Muslim Council of Britain said: ‘We would advise people to follow the medical advice so we would, of course, encourage people to use hand gel. ‘People need to find ways to accommodate their beliefs.’
So it would be handy to know who exactly is calling for this and what group or person they are getting the advice from... that's addressing the specific, not the symptom.
| 955 |
DEZes Mon, Jul 27, 2009 4:54:34pm |
re: #951 SasquatchOnSteroids
I had that until he pulled the old Ex-Lax in the iced tea thing.
Ah crap.
| 956 |
SasquatchOnSteroids Mon, Jul 27, 2009 4:54:47pm |
re: #950 VegasRick
C'mon SOS, doncha think the police in Watts would get a lot more cooperation from the citizens if they would just start wearing do-rags?
/
heh.
| 957 |
ArmyWife Mon, Jul 27, 2009 4:54:50pm |
re: #946 HoosierHoops
Thank you, and you as well! So far it's been uneventful. I cheated with dinner making spaghetti with jarred sauce and a bit of ground venison. It was quick, the girls were fed. Mandy would be disappointed in me!
My parents are coming to see the new house this weekend. I should be in panic mode by oh..Wednesday. ;)
| 958 |
callahan23 Mon, Jul 27, 2009 4:55:31pm |
re: #923 Thanos
I can point you to the articles where Rose Marie Morel and Filip DeWinter are encouraging their party members and their children to become the scarf gestapo just in case muslim schoolgirls wear scarves to school.
Buzz seems to be of like mind, more concerned about appearances and accommodations rather than the real deal.
That was not called for nor did Buzz make any reference that he would ban or outlaw the scarf. So he is in no way, shape or form comparable to the vile VB folks.
Also please note that Buzz is a big kid who can more than take care of himself, he doesn't need you asking for apologies for him.
Surely he can easily defend himself. But I don't like to let something like your comment eventually slip past. I call that out when I see something bad happening.
| 959 |
BlueRoses Mon, Jul 27, 2009 4:55:33pm |
re: #935 rightymouse
Wasn't always this way in England. Such a shame.
No and people are alarmed about the rise of the BNP. Many of my British friends have told me they are voting for BNP candidates because they insist no one else will listen to them.
A horrible choice to have to make.
| 960 |
capitalist piglet Mon, Jul 27, 2009 4:55:40pm |
re: #852 buzzsawmonkey
OK, the scarf doesn't diminish authority. That still doesn't deal with the fact that it's something to grab onto and that can be used to choke the officer--but let's forget that, too.
It doesn't extend Islam? Really? Then why is it necessary for "community outreach"--other than the fact that it makes the police seem more "Islam friendly", i.e., extending Islam to non-Muslims?
But let's forget even that, shall we? The scarf does its job, and makes little Aisha and old lady Fatima, and yes, even angry young Tariq and cranky old Abdul, feel more at home with Officer Sheila.
What happens when the policewoman who responds to something is not carefully-hijabed Officer Sheila, but normally-attired Officer Gwyneth? Does the carefully-crafted "community outreach" collapse into fragments, because Officer Gwyneth, unlike Officer Sheila, is "not properly attired?" Why would it not, since the police have created an expectation which almost certainly will not be fulfilled?
I find this entire issue to be incredibly dysfunctional.
In a western society, if a piece of fabric on my head is required to make me trustworthy, there is a problem, and it isn't with me. But somehow, it is incumbent on me - by virtue of the fact that I'm female and not a Muslim - to bend.
Truly odd.
| 961 |
ArmyWife Mon, Jul 27, 2009 4:55:54pm |
A call from Randy Forbes? Teletownhall? Anyone getting a call like this? (VA lizards)
| 962 |
doppelganglander Mon, Jul 27, 2009 4:55:59pm |
re: #945 BlueRoses
Exactly and leave the rest of us alone.
Tort reform and internet medical records are a good idea. Letting insurance companies sell across state lines and allow small employers to join common insurance pools.
There done and dusted.
You forgot allowing people to choose limited coverage. In most states, there is mandatory minimum coverage whether you want it or not. In Connecticut, for example, the mandatory minimum includes hair transplants and in vitro fertilization. People should have the freedom to chose more or less coverage and take their own chances.
| 963 |
Killgore Trout Mon, Jul 27, 2009 4:56:23pm |
re: #926 zombie
I found an old Islamic poet (I forget the name) who wrote poetry about sex with men and drinking wine. I think we was about 10th century living in Turkey or northern Iraq. We was pretty famous in his day.
| 964 |
WindHorse Mon, Jul 27, 2009 4:57:26pm |
re: #963 Killgore Trout
...was he the one who wore the Freudian slip?
| 966 |
Ayeless in Ghazi Mon, Jul 27, 2009 4:58:45pm |
re: #900 Killgore Trout
Uk Healthcare workers find sanitation at odds with sharia...
Muslims refuse to use alcohol-based hand gels over religious beliefs
Except on reading the article one finds that it's not actually at odds with sharia at all. Been that kind of day here!
Turns out to be another case of silly council officials pandering to what they imagine to be muslim taboos. There certainly has been too much of that in Britain, though still, I suspect, not quite as much as reading the Daily Mail would suggest.
| 967 |
albusteve Mon, Jul 27, 2009 4:58:59pm |
pink
black
yellow
blue
green
brown
white
red...finally...drink!
| 968 |
BlueRoses Mon, Jul 27, 2009 4:59:35pm |
re: #962 doppelganglander
You forgot allowing people to choose limited coverage. In most states, there is mandatory minimum coverage whether you want it or not. In Connecticut, for example, the mandatory minimum includes hair transplants and in vitro fertilization. People should have the freedom to chose more or less coverage and take their own chances.
I KNOW Call the Lizard from Geico! Is he one of us Charles? Just asking...
| 969 |
DEZes Mon, Jul 27, 2009 4:59:40pm |
re: #937 Thanos
No, that would be me, and you have my apology for the VB comment. Some of these Spencer driven "who's the dhimmi" discussions drive me to the last nth of patience however.
Upding for the apology.
| 970 |
J.S. Mon, Jul 27, 2009 5:00:14pm |
re: #963 Killgore Trout
Sounds like one of those Deverish guys (I picked up a CD once -- and the notes about the album, very, very revealing -- it was about how the founder was accused of being homosexual and persecuted...but, they couldn't use that language or come out and say it -- just hinted at -- Turkish Deverish music is fantastic music, btw...but, the Islamists go after them, etc., during certain times..whenever fundamentalism is on the rise...)
| 971 |
SixDegrees Mon, Jul 27, 2009 5:00:27pm |
re: #900 Killgore Trout
Uk Healthcare workers find sanitation at odds with sharia...
Muslims refuse to use alcohol-based hand gels over religious beliefs
This has cropped up before. Medical workers need to balance their religious beliefs against the demands of their chosen career. In most cases, contact with alcohol is a rigid requirement for medical workers. If you can't deal with that, you'll just have to find another line of work.
Two additional points, however. The alcohol typically used for disinfecting is NOT the alcohol you drink. Isopropyl versus ethanol - two completely different chemicals. The Islamic prohibition against alcohol consumption derives from it's bad effects on behavior; this simply isn't a concern with isopropyl alcohol, which is quite poisonous if consumed and which has no intoxicating effects when used as a disinfectant. So this point is at least potentially resolvable if whoever makes such religious decisions gives this one a bit of thought.
Second, I'm not certain alcohol is particularly effective against viruses. Bringing this up in light of the swine flu panic currently gripping England seems like a red herring.
| 972 |
rightymouse Mon, Jul 27, 2009 5:00:37pm |
re: #925 lobo91
The same is not true in most other countries. Immigrants stay in their own little enclaves, and even their children who are born in the host country don't consider themselves British (or French, or whatever).
Then I have to wonder what in the world they expect when the laws of their adopted lands are violated and they believe there should be special dispensation?
| 973 |
Sharmuta Mon, Jul 27, 2009 5:01:25pm |
re: #953 buzzsawmonkey
Right- because the point of outreach programs with muslims is to... what? Go running into the arms of submission or to stop jihadis? Give me a break.
You can't have it both ways people. Do not demonize all muslims and turn around and wonder why they don't assimilate.
You want them to assimilate? You want them to police themselves? What's your solution then?
| 974 |
wrenchwench Mon, Jul 27, 2009 5:01:42pm |
re: #963 Killgore Trout
I found an old Islamic poet (I forget the name) who wrote poetry about sex with men and drinking wine. I think we was about 10th century living in Turkey or northern Iraq. We was pretty famous in his day.
Is it the dreaded stuff AI used to post so often?
| 976 |
BARACK THE VOTE Mon, Jul 27, 2009 5:02:24pm |
re: #966 Jimmah
Except on reading the article one finds that it's not actually at odds with sharia at all. Been that kind of day here!
Turns out to be another case of silly council officials pandering to what they imagine to be muslim taboos. There certainly has been too much of that in Britain, though still, I suspect, not quite as much as reading the Daily Mail would suggest.
Anything involving the Daily Mail is always suspect.
| 977 |
albusteve Mon, Jul 27, 2009 5:02:31pm |
re: #973 Sharmuta
Right- because the point of outreach programs with muslims is to... what? Go running into the arms of submission or to stop jihadis? Give me a break.
You can't have it both ways people. Do not demonize all muslims and turn around and wonder why they don't assimilate.
You want them to assimilate? You want them to police themselves? What's your solution then?
beer of course...
| 978 |
Digital Display Mon, Jul 27, 2009 5:02:33pm |
re: #951 SasquatchOnSteroids
I had that until he pulled the old Ex-Lax in the iced tea thing.
Well.Finally a producer for the history channel called..I've been telling them for years I've had Bigfoot in the basement and feeding him 3 live goats a week..
I thought a nice Bigfoot reality show where we Threaten to feed him Obama's Birth Certificate would fly...Harry is understandably going crazy...Big rating bonanza...
/
| 979 |
Ayeless in Ghazi Mon, Jul 27, 2009 5:02:44pm |
re: #938 iceweasel
hey Jimmah-cakes! i liked your vid. :)
Here's one for you:
Love them.
They are new to me - thanks - loved it :)
| 980 |
Randall Gross Mon, Jul 27, 2009 5:02:57pm |
| 981 |
Killgore Trout Mon, Jul 27, 2009 5:03:02pm |
re: #974 wrenchwench
Is it the dreaded stuff AI used to post so often?
Nah, this was some other guy. It was actually pretty interesting to learn that wine drinking was once widely accepted in Islam.
| 982 |
formercorpsman Mon, Jul 27, 2009 5:03:18pm |
re: #973 Sharmuta
The same solution for everyone assimilating into the host country.
This is ass backwards.
| 983 |
Last Mohican Mon, Jul 27, 2009 5:04:04pm |
re: #913 iceweasel
How did we get from, "15 police women, assigned to community service, willl wear a headcarf on entering mosques", to OMG DHIMMITUDE NEVER SURRENDER!!! WOLVERINES!!11!
I'm just going to nudge the goal posts back toward their original position a little.
It's eight community support officers, and seven police women.
| 984 |
rightymouse Mon, Jul 27, 2009 5:04:13pm |
re: #959 BlueRoses
No and people are alarmed about the rise of the BNP. Many of my British friends have told me they are voting for BNP candidates because they insist no one else will listen to them.
A horrible choice to have to make.
Europeans have always been binary in their politics. Too bad not ONE of them thought to adopt a constitution like we did, especially since we proved over and over that our ideology actually worked.
| 985 |
set it in Mon, Jul 27, 2009 5:04:33pm |
After what the leftoids, with BDS, did to the last administration during a time of war: I consider anything fair game to take the tires off this communist, anti -American bus that fearless leader barry obama is driving Americans over a cliff with... Don't Tread On Me.
| 986 |
Randall Gross Mon, Jul 27, 2009 5:04:46pm |
re: #963 Killgore Trout
I found an old Islamic poet (I forget the name) who wrote poetry about sex with men and drinking wine. I think we was about 10th century living in Turkey or northern Iraq. We was pretty famous in his day.
[Link: en.wikipedia.org...]
Blashphemy now of course.
| 987 |
Ayeless in Ghazi Mon, Jul 27, 2009 5:04:54pm |
re: #976 iceweasel
Anything involving the Daily Mail is always suspect.
Yes, a lot of their stories turn out to be a load of rubbish. It's definitely not regarded as a particularly reliable newspaper. I think most people here are unaware of that.
| 988 |
lobo91 Mon, Jul 27, 2009 5:04:56pm |
re: #966 Jimmah
Except on reading the article one finds that it's not actually at odds with sharia at all. Been that kind of day here!
Turns out to be another case of silly council officials pandering to what they imagine to be muslim taboos. There certainly has been too much of that in Britain, though still, I suspect, not quite as much as reading the Daily Mail would suggest.
There's been way too much of this sort of nonsense. Muslims don't eat pork. Fine. Don't offer your Muslim employees ham sandwiches. Seems simple enough.
Letting them refuse to ring up a customer's plastic-wrapped package of bacon, however, is ridiculous. So is banning piggy banks, or pictures of Porky Pig (all of which have actually happened).
| 989 |
erraticsphinx Mon, Jul 27, 2009 5:04:57pm |
re: #981 Killgore Trout
Islam has gone backwards on a lot of issues, homosexuality and wine being two from a long list.
| 991 |
Digital Display Mon, Jul 27, 2009 5:06:07pm |
re: #976 iceweasel
Anything involving the Daily Mail is always suspect.
I always thought the Sun was always over the top by a million miles...
" 3 year old becomes Grandpa in Ireland"
Not true..But damn close for journalism
| 992 |
CyanSnowHawk Mon, Jul 27, 2009 5:06:18pm |
| 993 |
BlueRoses Mon, Jul 27, 2009 5:06:41pm |
re: #925 lobo91
Of course, that's one of the big differences between the US and other countries.
You can come here from any other country, work hard, play by the rules, and others will just see you as an American.
The same is not true in most other countries. Immigrants stay in their own little enclaves, and even their children who are born in the host country don't consider themselves British (or French, or whatever).
Yep we do it right. How we managed to do it who knows? But we do.
| 994 |
DEZes Mon, Jul 27, 2009 5:07:29pm |
re: #980 Thanos
I owe you a beer, you were right after I took a breather.
This has been a heated thread, Its not the 1st one in LGF history.
Callahan took some downdings for his comment, sadly.
I see perspectives on both sides, but my opinion matters not.
Thanks Taking a fresh breath.
| 995 |
freetoken Mon, Jul 27, 2009 5:07:29pm |
| 996 |
SasquatchOnSteroids Mon, Jul 27, 2009 5:07:37pm |
re: #990 taxfreekiller
So, what is an acceptable word for the Henry Wackman/Nancy Pelosi/Chuck Schummer/ John Murtha/ John Kerry,,, Democrats?
suggestions for a word that will not make liberal Democrats feel bad...
thanks in advance
Quantity Control Agents ?
ok that's 3 words. sue me.
| 997 |
Erik The Red Mon, Jul 27, 2009 5:07:46pm |
I don't think that Muslims can/want to assimilate into our society. It is so foreign and against everything that they are taught from a young age. Every country I have been to and in S. Africa the Muslims community makes no effort to fit in. What they do try and do is force the country to bend to them.
If they want to live according to Islamic law there are plenty of countries that they can do that in.
| 998 |
1SG(ret) Mon, Jul 27, 2009 5:07:54pm |
re: #973 Sharmuta
They need to be treated the same as any other citizen, no more...no less assimilating doesn't mean adopting their customs, assimilating is on them. Kind of ass backward approach!
| 999 |
albusteve Mon, Jul 27, 2009 5:08:56pm |
re: #998 1SG(ret)
They need to be treated the same as any other citizen, no more...no less assimilating doesn't mean adopting their customs, assimilating is on them. Kind of ass backward approach!
tough love...it works
| 1000 |
jvic Mon, Jul 27, 2009 5:09:02pm |
I'd have fewer qualms about culturally sensitive police headscarfs if there were also visible, culturally sensitive efforts to support Muslim women who are victims of misogyny.
| 1001 |
Killgore Trout Mon, Jul 27, 2009 5:09:11pm |
re: #986 Thanos
Ah, thanks. That's probably him. I was close on the date but wrong about his origin. Seems he's Persian.
| 1002 |
ArmyWife Mon, Jul 27, 2009 5:09:45pm |
re: #973 Sharmuta
I'm not replying for Buzz, but it seems you've opened this to the floor, so ready or not, here is my opinion:
I do not want them to police themselves any more than any other segment of the population. I would like Muslims to assimilate into society and be respectful of other religions and members of society. It also means accepting that equal rights applies to women. That isn't specific, but I hope the point is understood.
| 1003 |
Shug Mon, Jul 27, 2009 5:10:23pm |
re: #990 taxfreekiller
So, what is an acceptable word for the Henry Wackman/Nancy Pelosi/Chuck Schummer/ John Murtha/ John Kerry,,, Democrats?
suggestions for a word that will not make liberal Democrats feel bad...
thanks in advance
The Eloi
| 1004 |
Sharmuta Mon, Jul 27, 2009 5:10:56pm |
re: #998 1SG(ret)
Maybe you missed an earlier comment concerning women police officers being trained to be sensitive to the religious sensibilities of a Jewish community where the men couldn't touch women.
| 1005 |
Last Mohican Mon, Jul 27, 2009 5:11:38pm |
re: #988 lobo91
There's been way too much of this sort of nonsense. Muslims don't eat pork. Fine. Don't offer your Muslim employees ham sandwiches. Seems simple enough.
Letting them refuse to ring up a customer's plastic-wrapped package of bacon, however, is ridiculous. So is banning piggy banks, or pictures of Porky Pig (all of which have actually happened).
Right. Or firing someone because she brought a slice of pepperoni pizza to work. Or demanding that a school cafeteria stop serving non-halal food (even to non-Muslims). Or requiring little non-Muslim girls to wear hijabs to school. Or allowing taxi drivers to refuse passengers with seeing-eye dogs. Or insisting that secular courts recognize bigamy, and allow men to beat their wives. Or telling the British home secretary that he shouldn't enter certain areas of London because they're Muslim land.
Frankly, the police scarf thing isn't such a big deal, and I suspect we'd all be less suspicious of it if it weren't for all that other stuff.
| 1006 |
Digital Display Mon, Jul 27, 2009 5:11:43pm |
re: #997 Erik The Red
Good evening Erik...Hope you are well
| 1007 |
ArmyWife Mon, Jul 27, 2009 5:11:54pm |
re: #990 taxfreekiller
Well you had to go and put a qualifier on feelings ruining my shot a coming up with a word. Thanks. ;)
| 1008 |
Randall Gross Mon, Jul 27, 2009 5:11:57pm |
re: #1001 Killgore Trout
Ah, thanks. That's probably him. I was close on the date but wrong about his origin. Seems he's Persian.
Yep, nowadays he'd be Shia and probably rotting in that prison with the other demonstrators.
| 1009 |
BlueRoses Mon, Jul 27, 2009 5:12:02pm |
reply quoteShug7/27/09 5:10:23 pm
re: #990 taxfreekiller
So, what is an acceptable word for the Henry Wackman/Nancy Pelosi/Chuck Schummer/ John Murtha/ John Kerry,,, Democrats?
suggestions for a word that will not make liberal Democrats feel bad...
thanks in advance
The Eloi
Why don't us Repubs not want Demos to feel bad???
| 1011 |
SasquatchOnSteroids Mon, Jul 27, 2009 5:12:54pm |
re: #1002 ArmyWife
BTW, my keys were really in the front door. Doh !
heh.
| 1012 |
Randall Gross Mon, Jul 27, 2009 5:13:07pm |
For a diversion:
| 1013 |
lobo91 Mon, Jul 27, 2009 5:13:11pm |
re: #972 rightymouse
Then I have to wonder what in the world they expect when the laws of their adopted lands are violated and they believe there should be special dispensation?
Personally, I've always wondered why someone would go to the trouble of traveling halfway around the world to escape some third world hellhole, so that you can then try to turn the new country into the very same hellhole you just left.
| 1014 |
callahan23 Mon, Jul 27, 2009 5:13:26pm |
re: #980 Thanos
You are good people, everyone is, that can apologized after having run into a route that she/he wouldn't have with a cooler head.
Beer is accepted. :-)
| 1015 |
DEZes Mon, Jul 27, 2009 5:13:31pm |
re: #1011 SasquatchOnSteroids
BTW, my keys were really in the front door. Doh !
heh.
Do you have Bigfoot tires on your SUV?
| 1017 |
Randall Gross Mon, Jul 27, 2009 5:14:17pm |
ut oh. another contentious thread upstairs
| 1018 |
ArmyWife Mon, Jul 27, 2009 5:14:18pm |
re: #1011 SasquatchOnSteroids
I knew that. Which is why I told you to look there. I didn't get the moniker armyWIFE for nothin'! Glad you found them.
| 1019 |
1SG(ret) Mon, Jul 27, 2009 5:14:41pm |
re: #1004 Sharmuta
Be sensitive to and adopting seem to be really different, or are you just moving the goal posts.
| 1020 |
BlueRoses Mon, Jul 27, 2009 5:14:52pm |
re: #1013 lobo91
Personally, I've always wondered why someone would go to the trouble of traveling halfway around the world to escape some third world hellhole, so that you can then try to turn the new country into the very same hellhole you just left.
Boredom? :)
Oh God I think I'll go lay down:(
| 1021 |
SasquatchOnSteroids Mon, Jul 27, 2009 5:15:19pm |
| 1022 |
DEZes Mon, Jul 27, 2009 5:15:25pm |
re: #1016 Render
A little something on my bloglet you might enjoy...
OLD
SCHOOL,
R
Visited your sever, your right cod4 was dead.
Someday I will let you murderize me.
| 1023 |
BlueRoses Mon, Jul 27, 2009 5:15:54pm |
re: #1017 Thanos
ut oh. another contentious thread upstairs
I know. I saw it. Too lazy to click over to it.
| 1024 |
rightymouse Mon, Jul 27, 2009 5:15:57pm |
re: #1013 lobo91
Personally, I've always wondered why someone would go to the trouble of traveling halfway around the world to escape some third world hellhole, so that you can then try to turn the new country into the very same hellhole you just left.
Often wondered about that myself.
| 1025 |
SasquatchOnSteroids Mon, Jul 27, 2009 5:16:09pm |
re: #1018 ArmyWife
I knew that. Which is why I told you to look there. I didn't get the moniker armyWIFE for nothin'! Glad you found them.
Now, about that remote control...
| 1026 |
BARACK THE VOTE Mon, Jul 27, 2009 5:16:12pm |
re: #1000 jvic
I'd have fewer qualms about culturally sensitive police headscarfs if there were also visible, culturally sensitive efforts to support Muslim women who are victims of misogyny.
Who says there aren't such efforts?
Britain has Domestic Violence shelters and outreach-- and honestly, the best way to help women within an oppressive, religious, insular subculture is to have women present who are 'friendly' and approachable. In a religious subculture it helps that they observe the outward forms of respect. They're role models for the scared young women who have known no other from of life and the hijab actually makes them less intimidating and more approachable.
| 1027 |
albusteve Mon, Jul 27, 2009 5:16:26pm |
in America LE touches women...
in America a burka is shed for security and identificatin...
in America you submit to the rule of law...
you do not stone girls or behead your wife
in America woman are equal to men in every aspect of legal life
what's the problem?
| 1028 |
DEZes Mon, Jul 27, 2009 5:17:05pm |
| 1029 |
BlueRoses Mon, Jul 27, 2009 5:17:17pm |
re: #1026 iceweasel
Who says there aren't such efforts?
Britain has Domestic Violence shelters and outreach-- and honestly, the best way to help women within an oppressive, religious, insular subculture is to have women present who are 'friendly' and approachable. In a religious subculture it helps that they observe the outward forms of respect. They're role models for the scared young women who have known no other from of life and the hijab actually makes them less intimidating and more approachable.
So we are talking about social workers?
| 1030 |
rightymouse Mon, Jul 27, 2009 5:17:23pm |
And it's the witching hour where I turn into a teletubby on the couch.
Later!
| 1031 |
Erik The Red Mon, Jul 27, 2009 5:17:28pm |
re: #1006 HoosierHoops
Hey 2H. I am well. Did you go to the racing yesterday. JPM was very unlucky.
| 1032 |
Dancing along the light of day Mon, Jul 27, 2009 5:17:30pm |
re: #1011 SasquatchOnSteroids
BTW, my keys were really in the front door. Doh !
heh.
Hooray, you found the keys! Good job, Armywife!
| 1033 |
Sharmuta Mon, Jul 27, 2009 5:17:36pm |
re: #1002 ArmyWife
I'm not replying for Buzz, but it seems you've opened this to the floor, so ready or not, here is my opinion:
I do not want them to police themselves any more than any other segment of the population. I would like Muslims to assimilate into society and be respectful of other religions and members of society. It also means accepting that equal rights applies to women. That isn't specific, but I hope the point is understood.
I don't disagree with you.
The problem is- you can't get worked up about dhimmitude on one hand and then not want muslim communities to help stop jihadis. Or maybe you can- I don't know. This makes no sense to me. I want muslims to deal with their extremists. We're always saying that. Maybe some mean it and others don't? This makes no sense. The logical inconsistencies I'm seeing here are wild. You can't expect muslims to root out their own violent extremists if they don't trust law enforcement.
| 1035 |
wrenchwench Mon, Jul 27, 2009 5:18:03pm |
re: #1016 Render
A little something on my bloglet you might enjoy...
OLD
SCHOOL,
R
Beauties, thanks!
| 1036 |
tradewind Mon, Jul 27, 2009 5:18:04pm |
Souther Poverty Law Center's Richard Cohen making an absolute ass out of himself, as many at the SLPC are wont to do, calling for Lou Dobbs to be fired.
Dobbs is a little out there, but he is not a nirther ... he said on the air that he believes Obama is a US citizen. Cohen is demagoging the issue and attempting to stifle speech.
| 1037 |
BARACK THE VOTE Mon, Jul 27, 2009 5:18:55pm |
re: #1027 albusteve
in America you submit to the rule of law...
In Soviet russia, law submit to YOU!
Teasing. But America is the opposite of 'citizens submit to law'. The law exists only insofar as citizens continue to support it and mandate it.
| 1038 |
BlueRoses Mon, Jul 27, 2009 5:18:59pm |
re: #1036 tradewind
Souther Poverty Law Center's Richard Cohen making an absolute ass out of himself, as many at the SLPC are wont to do, calling for Lou Dobbs to be fired.
Dobbs is a little out there, but he is not a nirther ... he said on the air that he believes Obama is a US citizen. Cohen is demagoging the issue and attempting to stifle speech.
Yeah he is on O'Reilly right now.
| 1039 |
albusteve Mon, Jul 27, 2009 5:19:00pm |
re: #1026 iceweasel
Who says there aren't such efforts?
Britain has Domestic Violence shelters and outreach-- and honestly, the best way to help women within an oppressive, religious, insular subculture is to have women present who are 'friendly' and approachable. In a religious subculture it helps that they observe the outward forms of respect. They're role models for the scared young women who have known no other from of life and the hijab actually makes them less intimidating and more approachable.
they should not have immigrated to Britain...conform to the rule of law or leave
| 1040 |
Dancing along the light of day Mon, Jul 27, 2009 5:19:22pm |
| 1041 |
DEZes Mon, Jul 27, 2009 5:19:48pm |
| 1042 |
SasquatchOnSteroids Mon, Jul 27, 2009 5:19:51pm |
re: #1028 DEZes
Seat cushion or refrigerator.
Well, we bought a new couch last month and I've eaten everything in the refrigera...
AHA ! No wonder the TV changes channels everytime I fart !
//
| 1043 |
ArmyWife Mon, Jul 27, 2009 5:20:06pm |
re: #1033 Sharmuta
How about if the publicly denounce extremism on a regular basis? To me that is a much more effective, productive and more reasonable expectation than "snitching", especially if violence is a very real outcome.
| 1044 |
Salamantis Mon, Jul 27, 2009 5:20:23pm |
Why should those who are not Muslim be forced to submit to Muslim dress requirements in order not to demonize Muslims? Especially when such requirements are sexist and oppressive? Do we turn blind eyes to clitoridectomies and honor killings next? How about the stoning of homosexuals? Or the conversion at swordpoint of infidels, and the execution of those who forsake the faith?
Should the British have ignored ritual strangulation in order not to offend the religious sensibilities of the Thuggees?
In India, the British Raj banned suttees, where the widow is forcibly thrown onto the burning funeral pyre of her deceased husband, so she could continue to serve him in the afterlife. Hindi clerics objected that it was one of their religious traditions. To which the British governor answered that it was a British tradition to summarily execute murderers, and if Hindus felt constrained to follow their traditions, the British felt no less constrained to follow theirs.
Such British backbone in the service of righteouus causes seems to regrettably be a rare thing these days.
The rainments of religion should never be allowed to cloak the perpetration of oppression. If we cannot stand for these cherished values, what values worth our allegiance do we have left?
| 1046 |
Render Mon, Jul 27, 2009 5:20:31pm |
re: #1022 DEZes
Try the 502nd or 2ID WAW tactical rules servers instead.
I was on both last night.
STAT
HO,
R
| 1047 |
Digital Display Mon, Jul 27, 2009 5:20:48pm |
re: #1031 Erik The Red
Hey 2H. I am well. Did you go to the racing yesterday. JPM was very unlucky.
he messed up on pit road..I was so rooting for him
| 1048 |
DEZes Mon, Jul 27, 2009 5:21:18pm |
re: #1046 Render
Try the 502nd or 2ID WAW tactical rules servers instead.
I was on both last night.
STAT
HO,
R
Werent they both Cod waw?
| 1049 |
BlueRoses Mon, Jul 27, 2009 5:21:43pm |
re: #1040 Floral Giraffe
Refrigerator???
I lost my car and house keys for a month. After exhaustive searching through every drawer in the house plus under the furniture I finally found them...in my purse.
| 1050 |
SasquatchOnSteroids Mon, Jul 27, 2009 5:22:14pm |
re: #1032 Floral Giraffe
Hooray, you found the keys! Good job, Armywife!
I feel like an ijit. Someone who lives who knows how many miles away found my keys...
| 1051 |
BARACK THE VOTE Mon, Jul 27, 2009 5:22:19pm |
re: #987 Jimmah
Yes, a lot of their stories turn out to be a load of rubbish. It's definitely not regarded as a particularly reliable newspaper. I think most people here are unaware of that.
I agree. And think you're right. I should say 'correct'.
| 1052 |
albusteve Mon, Jul 27, 2009 5:22:46pm |
re: #1037 iceweasel
In Soviet russia, law submit to YOU!
Teasing. But America is the opposite of 'citizens submit to law'. The law exists only insofar as citizens continue to support it and mandate it.
the law can be changes in America...how cool is that?...in the meantime we owe Islam little of our time and wealth to help them assimilate to our society...they should be prepared when they move here...as usual, I have little patience for this bull shit
| 1054 |
Sharmuta Mon, Jul 27, 2009 5:24:18pm |
re: #1044 Salamantis
What do you suggest Sal- not work with mosques to root out extremists?
| 1055 |
Ayeless in Ghazi Mon, Jul 27, 2009 5:24:27pm |
re: #953 buzzsawmonkey
And, as far as the informant thing is concerned, it was you, not I, who suggested that UK Muslim neighborhoods were a-bristle with "potential killers."
Let's see Sharmuta's comment:
"Do we want muslims in the UK to police themselves and turn in potential killers to the police or not?"
This is not saying the muslim community is 'a bristle' with anything; this is merely acknowledging the fact that muslim terrorists exist and that ordinary muslims can help!
Your response:
"If the Muslim community considers potential killers to be laudable, a few shmattas aren't going to change that.
The police will probably have to rely on informants, as it does when dealing with any criminal community."
You painted the muslim community with a very broad brush, suggesting that they are all basically behind the 'potential killers' and topped it off by implying that collectively muslims are just another criminal community.
| 1056 |
1SG(ret) Mon, Jul 27, 2009 5:24:35pm |
Some seem to have a problem understanding the Muslim communities are male controlled. Putting a scarf on a female policewoman and sending her in to do community outreach does little to nothing in solving the jihad problem. They don't respect their own women, a scarf won't bring respect to a British police woman.
| 1057 |
Last Mohican Mon, Jul 27, 2009 5:25:07pm |
re: #1033 Sharmuta
]You can't expect muslims to root out their own violent extremists if they don't trust law enforcement.
But I do expect Muslims to root our their own violent extremists, no matter what costumes police women wear or don't wear for their benefit.
| 1058 |
albusteve Mon, Jul 27, 2009 5:26:41pm |
re: #1046 Render
Try the 502nd or 2ID WAW tactical rules servers instead.
I was on both last night.
STAT
HO,
R
heavily armed with WWD 40 Tac Armoral I lubed and shined the bad guys into submission...Sponge 408s and Ragbusters for backup...dood!
| 1059 |
BlueRoses Mon, Jul 27, 2009 5:27:17pm |
re: #1058 albusteve
heavily armed with WWD 40 Tac Armoral I lubed and shined the bad guys into submission...Sponge 408s and Ragbusters for backup...dood!
Err. Are you guys speaking in English?
| 1060 |
Sharmuta Mon, Jul 27, 2009 5:27:42pm |
re: #1056 1SG(ret)
I most certainly do not have that problem if you are referring to me. And frankly- all societies are male controlled, so shove it.
| 1063 |
BARACK THE VOTE Mon, Jul 27, 2009 5:29:02pm |
re: #979 Jimmah
They are new to me - thanks - loved it :)
Really? Wow, for some reason I assumed you'd know these guys. I only heard about them a couple of months ago. So glad you liked that song!
Here's their site and upcoming gigs:
[Link: www.myspace.com...]
| 1064 |
albusteve Mon, Jul 27, 2009 5:29:49pm |
re: #1059 BlueRoses
Err. Are you guys speaking in English?
Render needs to fear my gloss...gloss is boss...I will kick is dull butt back to the wash...fear the Turtle!
| 1066 |
DEZes Mon, Jul 27, 2009 5:29:57pm |
| 1067 |
BlueRoses Mon, Jul 27, 2009 5:30:35pm |
re: #1064 albusteve
Render needs to fear my gloss...gloss is boss...I will kick is dull butt back to the wash...fear the Turtle!
Ok so you aren't speaking English...
| 1068 |
Salamantis Mon, Jul 27, 2009 5:30:57pm |
re: #1054 Sharmuta
What do you suggest Sal- not work with mosques to root out extremists?
No, but I do NOT suggest adopting a supine, subservient position in order to do so. That's giving the jihadists on a silver platter the very things that they are committing their terror crimes to get.
Religion is religion, and law enforcement is law enforcement. The two should not be intermingled. Separation of church (temple, synagogue, mosque) and state.
| 1070 |
DEZes Mon, Jul 27, 2009 5:31:26pm |
re: #1067 BlueRoses
Ok so you aren't speaking English...
I understood it, but I am on my second beer.
| 1071 |
1SG(ret) Mon, Jul 27, 2009 5:31:36pm |
re: #1060 Sharmuta
The victimhood response. Good one, I give...Not!
Spend a little time in one of their countries and then tell me how bad it is here or the UK!
| 1072 |
BlueRoses Mon, Jul 27, 2009 5:31:42pm |
re: #1068 Salamantis
No, but I do NOT suggest adopting a supine, subservient position in order to do so. That's giving the jihadists on a silver platter the very things that they are committing their terror crimes to get.
Religion is religion, and law enforcement is law enforcement. The two should not be intermingled. Separation of church (temple, synagogue, mosque) and state.
Absolutely down right spot on right!
| 1073 |
BlueRoses Mon, Jul 27, 2009 5:32:10pm |
| 1074 |
Ayeless in Ghazi Mon, Jul 27, 2009 5:32:18pm |
re: #1061 buzzsawmonkey
You are laboriously spinning to such an extent that you will soon puke from the vertigo.
I am way ahead of you, having puked merely after reading your spin.
I just posted what you said and then briefly summarised it. I hardly even typed. You on the other hand - lots of typing, lots of spin.
| 1075 |
DEZes Mon, Jul 27, 2009 5:32:46pm |
| 1076 |
BlueRoses Mon, Jul 27, 2009 5:33:39pm |
| 1078 |
Ayeless in Ghazi Mon, Jul 27, 2009 5:34:26pm |
re: #1063 iceweasel
Really? Wow, for some reason I assumed you'd know these guys. I only heard about them a couple of months ago. So glad you liked that song!
Here's their site and upcoming gigs:
[Link: www.myspace.com...]
Thanks - page is bookmarked, and listening to some more now:)
| 1079 |
SasquatchOnSteroids Mon, Jul 27, 2009 5:34:28pm |
re: #1076 BlueRoses
Nah just inhaling the vapors coming from my screen :)) lol
That's not beer vapor. *cough*
| 1080 |
albusteve Mon, Jul 27, 2009 5:34:35pm |
re: #1068 Salamantis
No, but I do NOT suggest adopting a supine, subservient position in order to do so. That's giving the jihadists on a silver platter the very things that they are committing their terror crimes to get.
Religion is religion, and law enforcement is law enforcement. The two should not be intermingled. Separation of church (temple, synagogue, mosque) and state.
that's all there is to it...the tools are here, Islam is on it's own in America but we will be happy to accommodate them otherwise
| 1081 |
DEZes Mon, Jul 27, 2009 5:34:47pm |
re: #1076 BlueRoses
Nah just inhaling the vapors coming from my screen :)) lol
We can be a tad strange, it keeps us sane.
| 1084 |
DEZes Mon, Jul 27, 2009 5:35:25pm |
| 1085 |
SasquatchOnSteroids Mon, Jul 27, 2009 5:36:08pm |
| 1086 |
_RememberTonyC Mon, Jul 27, 2009 5:36:17pm |
re: #633 Last Mohican
Quick poll: how many of you have possession of your original birth certificate, the one that was issued when you were born?
I don't have mine. I don't know where it is.
I have the original and the forgery that helped me get a fake ID when I was 15
| 1087 |
DEZes Mon, Jul 27, 2009 5:36:57pm |
re: #1085 SasquatchOnSteroids
We're gonna need a bigger bong.
/
Bigfoot bongs...
There just might be a market.
| 1088 |
DEZes Mon, Jul 27, 2009 5:38:01pm |
| 1089 |
SasquatchOnSteroids Mon, Jul 27, 2009 5:38:46pm |
re: #1087 DEZes
Bigfoot bongs...
There just might be a market.
Full disclosure, a bigfoot bong is just a coke can with holes punched in it.
We're not that inventive.
| 1090 |
jvic Mon, Jul 27, 2009 5:39:32pm |
re: #1026 iceweasel
Who says there aren't such efforts?
I said 'visible' efforts. I'm sure that efforts exist but they're not terribly evident in the limited sample of UK media that I see.
Britain has Domestic Violence shelters and outreach-- and honestly, the best way to help women within an oppressive, religious, insular subculture is to have women present who are 'friendly' and approachable. In a religious subculture it helps that they observe the outward forms of respect. They're role models for the scared young women who have known no other from of life and the hijab actually makes them less intimidating and more approachable.
Ah. So the police headscarfs aren't symbols of dhimmitude: no, they indicate that a cunning plan is underway?
In principle, that's possible. GEN Petraeus demonstrated that counterinsurgency tactics can be counterintuitive. (You do not necessarily use maximum force.) I'm willing to believe that that can be the case with immigrant community relations. I'm just skeptical that it's the case with this police dept:
Avon and Somerset Police caused a race row two years ago when it rejected 186 white job applicants at the first stage of selection.The force received 800 applications for 180 jobs and 'deselected' white males to increase ethnic diversity. Chief Constable Colin Port apologised.
But I endorse your acknowledgment of the potential dilemma of immigrant Muslim women.
| 1091 |
DEZes Mon, Jul 27, 2009 5:39:55pm |
re: #1089 SasquatchOnSteroids
Full disclosure, a bigfoot bong is just a coke can with holes punched in it.
We're not that inventive.
Pssst, use the 2 liter bottles. ;)
| 1092 |
Digital Display Mon, Jul 27, 2009 5:41:02pm |
re: #1089 SasquatchOnSteroids
Full disclosure, a bigfoot bong is just a coke can with holes punched in it.
We're not that inventive.
there has been a funny smell is the basement...Bigfoot! don't make me kick your ass!
/The door is locked
| 1093 |
SasquatchOnSteroids Mon, Jul 27, 2009 5:41:28pm |
| 1094 |
callahan23 Mon, Jul 27, 2009 5:42:05pm |
People, gals 'n guys, Lizards and 'menschen'
It has been an 'interesting' ride tonight, yet the hour is advanced.
See y'all down the road.
I love you (Lizardim} - mostly. Really!
| 1095 |
SasquatchOnSteroids Mon, Jul 27, 2009 5:43:16pm |
re: #1092 HoosierHoops
there has been a funny smell is the basement...Bigfoot! don't make me kick your ass!
/The door is locked
Dude, your water heater is making some funny noises.
And you're out of Cheetohs.
| 1096 |
DEZes Mon, Jul 27, 2009 5:43:34pm |
re: #1092 HoosierHoops
there has been a funny smell is the basement...Bigfoot! don't make me kick your ass!
/The door is locked
And Hoops was never seen alive again.
*Bigfoot seen using a toothpick made from human bone... and smoking from a 2 liter bong.*
| 1097 |
DEZes Mon, Jul 27, 2009 5:44:19pm |
re: #1094 callahan23
People, gals 'n guys, Lizards and 'menschen'
It has been an 'interesting' ride tonight, yet the hour is advanced.
See y'all down the road.
I love you (Lizardim} - mostly. Really!
Take good care my friend.
| 1099 |
SasquatchOnSteroids Mon, Jul 27, 2009 5:44:47pm |
re: #1096 DEZes
And Hoops was never seen alive again.
*Bigfoot seen using a toothpick made from human bone... and smoking from a 2 liter bong.*
Not Hoops.
Not yet.
Free room and board, ya know.
| 1100 |
Digital Display Mon, Jul 27, 2009 5:46:13pm |
| 1101 |
DEZes Mon, Jul 27, 2009 5:46:19pm |
| 1102 |
Ayeless in Ghazi Mon, Jul 27, 2009 5:47:18pm |
re: #1082 buzzsawmonkey
Fixed that for you.
It always takes longer to correct a lie than it takes to lie, as you have demonstrated.
You have yet to show how or where I have lied.
Here's an example of dishonest spin for you, buzz:
Sharmuta said: "Do we want muslims in the UK to police themselves and turn in potential killers to the police or not?"
From which you somehow got:
"And, as far as the informant thing is concerned, it was you, not I, who suggested that UK Muslim neighborhoods were a-bristle with "potential killers"
| 1103 |
DEZes Mon, Jul 27, 2009 5:47:22pm |
Lizards, work calls.
I hope tomorrow is a better day.
Take care all.
| 1104 |
Digital Display Mon, Jul 27, 2009 5:47:51pm |
re: #1096 DEZes
And Hoops was never seen alive again.
*Bigfoot seen using a toothpick made from human bone... and smoking from a 2 liter bong.*
I was warned that keeping bigfoot in the basement was dangerous..Did I listen? Hell no! 3 live goats a week is all I need...
| 1105 |
SasquatchOnSteroids Mon, Jul 27, 2009 5:48:13pm |
| 1106 |
SasquatchOnSteroids Mon, Jul 27, 2009 5:49:21pm |
re: #1104 HoosierHoops
I was warned that keeping bigfoot in the basement was dangerous..Did I listen? Hell no! 3 live goats a week is all I need...
I will vacuum the hell out of your carpets for an extra one.
| 1107 |
Cato the Elder Mon, Jul 27, 2009 5:50:03pm |
re: #869 ryannon
Not only do you get the Cato Points, but a big hippie hug for that story. Made my day!
| 1108 |
Salamantis Mon, Jul 27, 2009 5:50:30pm |
re: #1104 HoosierHoops
I was warned that keeping bigfoot in the basement was dangerous..Did I listen? Hell no! 3 live goats a week is all I need...
To paraphrase George C. Wallace:
"Ya just gotta put the goats down where the bigfoot can get to them."
| 1110 |
SasquatchOnSteroids Mon, Jul 27, 2009 5:52:02pm |
I just like my Bud Lights and On Demand.
That's all I can ask for.
| 1111 |
Digital Display Mon, Jul 27, 2009 5:53:40pm |
re: #1108 Salamantis
To paraphrase George C. Wallace:
"Ya just gotta put the goats down where the bigfoot can get to them."
LOL
that was great.. I have no idea how to bring all these posts together...
Opens basement Door..
Harry..What the hell is going on here?
/usually works
| 1112 |
_RememberTonyC Mon, Jul 27, 2009 5:54:14pm |
here's an insightful piece from VDH's blog, written by Raymond Ibrahim.
[Link: www.victorhanson.com...]
it's about how the POTUS and his rhetoric re: the muslim world is sending exactly the wrong message.
PS ... LGF is running REALLY slow for me
| 1113 |
SasquatchOnSteroids Mon, Jul 27, 2009 5:56:17pm |
re: #1111 HoosierHoops
LOL
that was great.. I have no idea how to bring all these posts together...
Opens basement Door..
Harry..What the hell is going on here?
/usually works
*burp
| 1114 |
medaura18586 Mon, Jul 27, 2009 5:57:38pm |
re: #452 Charles
Well, I've been to the Blue Mosque in Istanbul on two different tours, and both times we had females with us when we went -- and they were indeed required to put on a veil before entering. We men, of course, being lords of the world, only had to take off our shoes.
We had a female drummer who wore a baseball cap, and that wasn't good enough. She had to replace it with the veil. (She hated it, too.)
My only practicing Muslim friend in Albania used to frequent the Et'hem Bey mosque in Tirana. It's a pretty seventeenth century mosque right in the center of the town I was born and raised in, and having been inside all the Catholic and Orthodox churches in town, I wanted to visit that mosque too. I had no intention of covering my head though, so I asked her if it was a requirement. She said it's good form to, but no one will say anything if I don't cover my head. Shoes though must go off.
That was my last summer in Albania, in 2003, and I forgot to even go.
But I did go to a mosque in Instambul -- forgot the name -- and did not have to cover my hair.
| 1115 |
medaura18586 Mon, Jul 27, 2009 5:58:50pm |
re: #452 Charles
So how long ago was this? Perhaps things have changes since.
| 1116 |
jvic Mon, Jul 27, 2009 5:59:43pm |
re: #928 Salamantis
I'm with Buzz on this one. Make the police hijab optional rather than mandatory, and let the policewomen choose. Those who feel comfortable wearing it would be free to do so, and those who don't feel comfortable wearing it would be free not to.In fact, I am in favor of this policy being applied to all Muslim women; in fact, to all women, period.
Well, uniforms are uniform for a reason, but I tend to agree with you if the department fully backs a policewoman's choice pro or con in mosques. My concern is that the powers that be wouldn't have the spine to give such backing.
| 1119 |
JacksonTn Mon, Jul 27, 2009 6:12:55pm |
re: #1118 BlueRoses
Some good stuff to listen to...
[Link: www.silverlakemusic.com...]
BR ... who is singing that? ...
| 1120 |
FamHistoryGuy Mon, Jul 27, 2009 6:16:59pm |
re: #633 Last Mohican
I have three in two different names from two different states. Take a wild guess.
| 1121 |
placeholder Mon, Jul 27, 2009 6:18:10pm |
There really isn't much debate that most religions (outside of buddhism) are profoundly misogynistic is there? At least at their core. In fact... society has historically been pretty much brutally misogynistic (and still is in many parts of the world) as well. That's what evolution is for...both biological, and social. We're getting better...
-PH
| 1123 |
BlueRoses Mon, Jul 27, 2009 6:31:30pm |
re: #1119 JacksonTn
BR ... who is singing that? ...
It is Robert Mirabal form his album. From A Painted Cave. Here is another piece called Drum Battle. Turn on the woofer :)
[Link: www.rhapsody.com...]
| 1124 |
FamHistoryGuy Mon, Jul 27, 2009 6:31:37pm |
re: #900 Killgore Trout
To me, washing your hands in alcohol is different than drinking (consuming) it.
Different thing altogether.
| 1125 |
capitalist piglet Mon, Jul 27, 2009 6:33:10pm |
re: #1123 BlueRoses
It is Robert Mirabal form his album. From A Painted Cave. Here is another piece called Drum Battle. Turn on the woofer :)
[Link: www.rhapsody.com...]
I love him. I've got a picture of the two of us together...he is so cool.
| 1126 |
BlueRoses Mon, Jul 27, 2009 6:35:39pm |
re: #1125 capitalist piglet
re: #1123 BlueRoses
It is Robert Mirabal form his album. From A Painted Cave. Here is another piece called Drum Battle. Turn on the woofer :)
[Link: [Link: www.rhapsody.com...]...]
I love him. I've got a picture of the two of us together...he is so cool.
He is something else isn't he. Love his stuff. Wanted to say that link I gave to Jackson Tn scroll down the play list to Drum Battle. It is worth your time :))
| 1127 |
BlueRoses Mon, Jul 27, 2009 6:40:26pm |
This old guy is the best singer I have ever heard. Course some may not like authentic native American music if so pass it by. His name is Bullhead.
| 1128 |
BlueRoses Mon, Jul 27, 2009 6:42:10pm |
Robert Mirabal has brought native American sounds mainstream
| 1129 |
BlueRoses Mon, Jul 27, 2009 6:59:24pm |
I don't think anyone is around...Hello?...Hello?...
| 1130 |
placeholder Mon, Jul 27, 2009 7:29:45pm |
re: #1122 buzzsawmonkey
Not among people dumb enough to believe that, no.
And your point is...that no, they aren't misogynistic? History is not on your side on this one.
| 1131 |
Buck Mon, Jul 27, 2009 7:51:50pm |
re: #24 sharkjumper
“Is there anything you can say to make the Birthers go away?”
Yes. Obama's long form, vault copy birth certificate.
As a Nirther who otherwise loves LGF, I assure you that there is nothing we'd love more than to be proven WRONG.
My apologies to Charles for infesting the GOP, but please understand, we Nirthers infest the Demonrat party too.
You have to understand... he can't PRODUCE a form his mother must have lost years ago. This loss, probably when he was very young cannot stand in the way of his presidency.
If your mother lost her copy of the original, that she was given all those years ago...what would you do?
You would apply for a copy. You would apply for a certified copy, and when you got it... EVERYONE would accept it as bone fide.
I know I don't have my original...It was huge, and made out of paper... and like lots of things in my life... I misplaced it.
BUT I have a certified copy. It is good enough for me to get a passport, or anything I might need to prove that I was nborn where I say I was.
The other copy of the original is in a vault in Hawaii. They verified that they have it. He was born in Hawaii. The State of Hawaii does not hold the original birth certificates of people born in Kenya. The State, or Province in Kenya would hold that. The verified document states clearly where he was born, in the county of Honolulu. (I have verified that there is no County of Honolulu in Kenya.)
Hawaii has never handed out birth certificates, amended, or otherwise that state the person being born in Honolulu when they were not really born there. If they did, then every illegal alien would show up and get one. As this document meets all of the requirements from the State Department for proving U.S. birth and citizenship.
There is NO REQUIREMENT other than presenting this document to confirm the citizen requirements of qualifying for POTUS.
This document is official, and has been verified, and has been presented.
| 1132 |
widmanb Mon, Jul 27, 2009 7:54:12pm |
I am not a birther or a nirther, and have no reason to believe that BHO is not a citizen. However, it does seem odd that the one person who could end all this nonsense is BHO himself. Charles has stated that the short form certificate is the only one issued by Hawaii, but it does not seem credible that a request by he president of the USA to release a copy of the long form original certificate would not be honored. So it begs the question, why won't he do this? John McCain had a similar controversy and quickly released all relevant documents to quickly resolve the matter.
| 1134 |
Buck Mon, Jul 27, 2009 8:27:34pm |
re: #1132 widmanb
I am not a birther or a nirther, and have no reason to believe that BHO is not a citizen. However, it does seem odd that the one person who could end all this nonsense is BHO himself. Charles has stated that the short form certificate is the only one issued by Hawaii, but it does not seem credible that a request by he president of the USA to release a copy of the long form original certificate would not be honored. So it begs the question, why won't he do this? John McCain had a similar controversy and quickly released all relevant documents to quickly resolve the matter.
Do you see? A copy of the long form original certificate would not satisfy. It would just bring on all the "forgery" nonsense...The certified short form was called a forgery on the first day.
Only the original original would do, but once it is out of the secured office of the Health Department in Hawaii, it would then lose it's chain of custody, and then the original would be called a forgery...
The head of the Health Department in Hawaii has confirmed that the original certificate is the same as the copy, and therefore Obama was born when and where his American family says he was, Kapiolani Hospital, Honolulu.
It has been verified by the state government official who is responsible for the document and it's authenticity.
| 1136 |
harpsicon Mon, Jul 27, 2009 8:56:52pm |
re: #614 bloodstar
So the only reason to fake this stuff is so Obama could be President some 45 years later. Orly?
The only other thing I can imagine you think is that Obama is even cooler than Chuck Norris and capable of time travel. :)
I think you can believe the Dallas Morning News, which I have in front of me, which shows the complete entry in the Honolulu paper.
It says " Mr. and Mrs. Barack H. Obama, 6085 Kalanianaole Hwy., son, Aug. 4."
That's it.
Just like all the other announcements.
It doesn't say where he was born, or his weight, or anything else.
This is stupid, but yes it is totally possible that grandma called this in (and I'm convinced that she did, given the cultural attitudes of the parents). Could she have done that in pride after her daughter gave birth in Kenya? Sure. But not necessarily either - could have been down the street.
The question was whether this entry in the paper was definitive proof of anything. It doesn't imply time travel, conspiracy 45 years before the fact, or anything else, to maintain that this two-line entry indeed doesn't prove anything, logically or legally, which is all I was saying.
I myself don't know anything about this, and am not making a statement.
Sheesh...
| 1137 |
SpaceJesus Mon, Jul 27, 2009 9:20:29pm |
re: #1132 widmanb
Charles has stated that the short form certificate is the only one issued by Hawaii,
it does not seem credible that a request by he president of the USA to release a copy of the long form original certificate would not be honored.
Charles has stated that the short form certificate is the only one issued by Hawaii,
the short form certificate is the only one issued by Hawaii,
what part of only don't you understand
| 1138 |
Gus Mon, Jul 27, 2009 10:10:27pm |
re: #298 iceweasel
If she's in a house of worship-- and a mosque is a house of worship-- even if she's on official business she should observes the custom. It's about showing respect and being polite.
The needs of the greater community that law enforcement officials provides far outweigh the particular customs such as those of wearing headscarves in a mosque. When a law enforcement officer arrives at a mosque they are not their as diplomats but engaging in their official duties. In a more practical sense, the wearing of a headscarf by women police officers would have the effect of:
1. Hindering the aural (hearing) capability of the officer.
2. Hindering the visual capability and reducing the field of vision for said officer.
At this rate are we to expect that law enforcement remove their shoes before entering a mosque? This is a non issue and one that would never find acceptance by American law enforcement. Female police officers are their to do their job and not prostrate themselves for a religious custom -- they are not civilians.
| 1139 |
William Mon, Jul 27, 2009 11:03:57pm |
1) One can make the case the "birth certificate" issue is goofy. Fair enough.
2) But can one make the case "it has been proven ad nauseum," as Gibbs claims, that Obama is a natural born citizen? I know my birth certificate, and that of my children, lists the doctor who performed the delivery, and the hospital.
I think these two points are getting intertwined -- the first point is a fair position, but the second point has simply not been "proven ad nauseum."
This June 6, 2009 article from the Honolulu Star Bulletin states all Hawaii birth certificates from 1908 onwards were stored electronically, so perhaps a few dozen journalists could have been pulled from Palin duty in Alaska to vet candidate Obama in 2008.
Okubo explained that the Health Department went paperless in 2001.
"At that time, all information for births from 1908 (on) was put into electronic files for consistent reporting," she said.
[Link: www.starbulletin.com...]
And a 1961 newspaper classified ad announcing Obama's birth listed an address of "6085 Kalanianaole Highway" -- a house which appears to have an unusual history, being owned by Orland Scott Lefforge (a very liberal Democrat political activist) in 1961, and not Stanley Ann Dunham (Obama's mother), and long-time neighbors not recalling Stanley Ann or Obama living there. Again, perhaps a few dozen journalists could have been pulled from Palin duty in Alaska to vet candidate Obama in 2008.
Am I wrong here? Has it "been proven ad nauseum" or is the issue just too offbeat to take seriously? From what I can tell, there are many basic questions left unanswered, and the deeper one looks on this issue, the worse things appear for Obama.
| 1140 |
William Mon, Jul 27, 2009 11:37:54pm |
To add to my post above, this Honolulu Advertiser article from today would be the only "proof" of natural born status I've seen to date:
Updated at 2:57 p.m., Monday, July 27, 2009
Obama Hawaii born, insist Isle officials
By Dan Nakaso
Advertiser Staff WriterIn an attempt to quash persistent rumors that President Obama was not born in Honolulu on Aug. 4, 1961, Hawai'i's health director reiterated this afternoon that she has personally seen Obama's birth certificate in the Health Department's archives.
"I, Dr. Chiyome Fukino, director of the Hawai'i State Department of Health, have seen the original vital records maintained on file by the Hawai'i State Department of Health verifying Barrack Hussein Obama was born in Hawai'i and is a natural-born American citizen. I have nothing further to add to this statement or my original statement issued in October 2008 over eight months ago..."
[Link: www.honoluluadvertiser.com...]
Objectively speaking, the best evidence to date rests on the word of this one woman. That evidence came out only today -- July 27, 2009.
| 1141 |
Salamantis Mon, Jul 27, 2009 11:46:21pm |
re: #1139 William
1) One can make the case the "birth certificate" issue is goofy. Fair enough.
2) But can one make the case "it has been proven ad nauseum," as Gibbs claims, that Obama is a natural born citizen? I know my birth certificate, and that of my children, lists the doctor who performed the delivery, and the hospital.
I think these two points are getting intertwined -- the first point is a fair position, but the second point has simply not been "proven ad nauseum."
This June 6, 2009 article from the Honolulu Star Bulletin states all Hawaii birth certificates from 1908 onwards were stored electronically, so perhaps a few dozen journalists could have been pulled from Palin duty in Alaska to vet candidate Obama in 2008.
And a 1961 newspaper classified ad announcing Obama's birth listed an address of "6085 Kalanianaole Highway" -- a house which appears to have an unusual history, being owned by Orland Scott Lefforge (a very liberal Democrat political activist) in 1961, and not Stanley Ann Dunham (Obama's mother), and long-time neighbors not recalling Stanley Ann or Obama living there. Again, perhaps a few dozen journalists could have been pulled from Palin duty in Alaska to vet candidate Obama in 2008.Am I wrong here? Has it "been proven ad nauseum" or is the issue just too offbeat to take seriously? From what I can tell, there are many basic questions left unanswered, and the deeper one looks on this issue, the worse things appear for Obama.
Obama was born in the Kapiolani Maternity & Gynecological Hospital in Honolulu on Aug. 4, 1961:
[Link: www.usatoday.com...]
| 1142 |
Salamantis Mon, Jul 27, 2009 11:49:13pm |
re: #1140 William
To add to my post above, this Honolulu Advertiser article from today would be the only "proof" of natural born status I've seen to date:
Objectively speaking, the best evidence to date rests on the word of this one woman. That evidence came out only today -- July 27, 2009.
Wrongo. Her original statement to this effect was in October of last year, just like the article you quoted states. Didn't you even read it?
| 1143 |
Syrah Mon, Jul 27, 2009 11:57:48pm |
re: #1139 William
1) From what I can tell, there are many basic questions left unanswered, and the deeper one looks on this issue, the worse things appear for Obama.
The only people for whom "the deeper one looks on this issue, the worse things appear" are the poor unfortunates who cannot accept that Obama is a natural born citizen of the USA.
| 1144 |
Syrah Tue, Jul 28, 2009 12:26:54am |
| 1145 |
jvic Tue, Jul 28, 2009 3:28:58am |
re: #638 Charles
Yeah, I think it goes a little too far in the accomodationist direction, and it's undoubtedly influenced by the pushy British Muslim lobbies, but if it makes it easier to do their community support jobs to put on a veil when they enter a mosque then I see why they'd decide to do it. If you're supposed to be facilitating relations with the Muslim community, it's not your job to piss people off and teach them cultural lessons.
re: #835 jvic
In the abstract I can't see a problem with the police headscarf thing. At face value it is limited, innocuous and benign.And yet...and yet...
From Daniel Pipes:
A special UK police force for Muslims? Today Shar'i courts, tomorrow a separate police force. According to London's Daily Express, Muslim victims may be able to request their cases investigated by police from their own religion, particularly in cases of "honor killings," forced marriages, and other culturally sensitive matters.In fact, in London, Sikh victims already have the right to ask for a Sikh officer to be involved in an investigation. As Palbinder Singh, chairman of the Metropolitan Police Sikh Association, explains: "I don't believe a white officer is ever going to be fully conversant with a Sikh." Chief Superintendant Joanna Young of the Metropolitan Police Criminal Justice Policy Unit, hopes this pattern will expand...
Whew! Thank goodness they're not being culturally insensitive about honor killings and forced marriages!
| 1148 |
SixDegrees Tue, Jul 28, 2009 5:01:17am |
re: #1147 marccom98
I can fully understand why there is an extreme and intense perception on both sides of the table. 1: John McCain had to show his proof of US citizenship during the election cycle, Obama did not do so, nor was he asked to. 2: He has traveled to Pakistan during some part of his life, at the time when US Citizens were NOT allowed to travel there. 3. All access to his records, academic, non-academic, public, etc has been sealed, which leads to individuals asking the age-old question: "What does he have to hide?" On the other side of the issue, the individuals that see this as some type of "truther" situation have the right to call this a nut job kind of work, because the level of obsession is very high. A certificate of live birth does not mean he is has been born in Hawaii, it just means that a birth took place and was recorded in Hawaii, not as the actual birthplace. If you try to discredit a situation, it will only gather more curiosity. All this can be put to rest if he came forth with the actual birth certificate when and where he was born. It was the people who elected him for the job, so he must respect the wishes of the people.
The wishes of the people are that the nirthers are a bunch of knuckle-dragging, spittle spraying morons.
Rather than demand that someone who is innocent respond to the fantasies of a handful of mentally challenged misanthropes, it is incumbent on the accusers to produce evidentiary proof of foreign citizenship - like a Kenyan birth certificate, for example. They can't, so instead they bleat about ephemera and make demands for a negative proof.
The burden is on the nirthers to make their case, not the other way 'round. So far, they've failed miserably.
| 1149 |
haavamaal Tue, Jul 28, 2009 5:20:07am |
Maybe this will just put and end to this nonsense.
[Link: news.yahoo.com...]
| 1150 |
SixDegrees Tue, Jul 28, 2009 5:21:50am |
re: #1149 haavamaal
Maybe this will just put and end to this nonsense.
[Link: news.yahoo.com...]
"Yahoo! is part of the conspiracy!"
Next stop on the nirther nut wagon.
| 1151 |
Gus Tue, Jul 28, 2009 5:24:13am |
As Press Secretary Gibbs has said "nothing will satisfy them." In a rare moment I find myself in agreement with Mr. Gibbs. However, with all conspiracy theories this is a very common behavior. Not unlike trying to convince a 911 Truther or a Moon Hoaxer.
Regarding Obama's birth certificate I see the following scenarios as played by the birth certificate conspiracy theorists:
1. They not only demand to "see" the birth certificate but now demand witnesses.
2. One witness is insufficient and even so they will claim those witnesses are co-conspirators.
3. A conspiracy is built upon the differences with certificates of live birth and a birth certificate.
4. The birth certificate is "shown" however they will declare it a forgery.
5. A certificate of live birth is "shown" however they will declare it a forgery.
6. If settled once again in court they will declare the judge a co-conspirator.
7. The birth announcement in the "Honolulu Advertiser" is fraudulent and part of a wider conspiracy.
8. If any of the above fails argue the "Indonesian/Passport" scenario.
Ad infinitum.
| 1152 |
notutopia Tue, Jul 28, 2009 7:18:40am |
"I ... have seen the original vital records maintained on file by the Hawaii State Department of Health verifying Barack Hussein Obama was born in Hawaii and is a natural-born American citizen," Health Director Dr. Chiyome Fukino said in a brief statement. "I have nothing further to add to this statement or my original statement issued in October 2008 over eight months ago."
[Link: www.foxnews.com...]
Stop the Lunacy!
| 1153 |
Land Shark Tue, Jul 28, 2009 8:24:40am |
It's amazing to me to see this birth certificate conspiracy theory continue to grow. Especially since all the real evidence points to it not being true. The nirthers have been unable to prove the state of Hawaii is lying or hiding anything. They have not been able to produce any documentation showing Obama was born anywhere but Hawaii. Yet it seems more and more people are buying it. WTF?
It just proves what I've known about conspiracy theorists, since it's all a conspiracy, don'tcha now, they aren't persuaded by things like facts. And they don't seem inclined to investigate and produce facts supporting their theories for the most part.
| 1154 |
Green Helmet Guy Tue, Jul 28, 2009 1:51:19pm |
Quote from the video:
"There are ten thousand more important issues for people in this country to discuss, Rather than, whether or not the President is a citizen when its been proven Ad nauseam"
Right on the nose Mr Gibbs.
| 1155 |
William Tue, Jul 28, 2009 8:19:44pm |
re: #1141 Salamantis
Obama was born in the Kapiolani Maternity & Gynecological Hospital in Honolulu on Aug. 4, 1961:
[Link: www.usatoday.com...]
FYI, the USA Today link you provided isn't evidence supporting your statement.
| 1156 |
William Tue, Jul 28, 2009 8:24:24pm |
re: #1142 Salamantis
Wrongo. Her original statement to this effect was in October of last year, just like the article you quoted states. Didn't you even read it?
Her statement from last year:
"I as Director of Health for the State of Hawai‘i, along with the Registrar of Vital Statistics who has statutory authority to oversee and maintain these type of vital records, have personally seen and verified that the Hawai‘i State Department of Health has Sen. Obama’s original birth certificate on record in accordance with state policies and procedures."
Her statement from yesterday:
"I, Dr. Chiyome Fukino, director of the Hawai'i State Department of Health, have seen the original vital records maintained on file by the Hawai'i State Department of Health verifying Barrack Hussein Obama was born in Hawai'i and is a natural-born American citizen."
Her two statements are quite different.
| 1157 |
Salamantis Tue, Jul 28, 2009 9:49:54pm |
re: #1155 William
FYI, the USA Today link you provided isn't evidence supporting your statement.
You wouldn't accept evidence that what comes out of the south end of a north bound canine is dogshit even if you tasted a turd in transit.
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